October 8, 2025 • 61 mins
In this week's episode, Paul and Kate head to 1971 Yuba City, California where a body is found in an orchard. After another body is found nearby, a larger search is initiated and yields enough results for a two-part episode.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
I'm Kate Winkler Dawson. I'm a journalist who's spent the
last twenty five years writing about true crime.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
And I'm Paul Hols, a retired cold case investigator who's
worked some of America's most complicated cases and solve them.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Each week, I present Paul with one of history's most
compelling true crimes.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
And I weigh in using modern forensic techniques to bring
new insights to old mysteries.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Together, using our individual expertise, we're examining historical true crime
cases through a twenty first century lens.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Some are solved and some are cold, very cold.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
This is buried bones.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Hey, Kate, how are you doing?
Speaker 1 (01:02):
I'm great? How about you? Is it getting colder there?
It's the October.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Ish, it's starting to turn. You know. Colorado is always
up and down when it comes to the weather, but
usually right around Halloween is when we can expect our
first snow.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
So is the big weather. It has to be blizzards, right,
those are the big weather events. I mean, are there anything?
Is there anything that's so unusual? You go, it's never
going to happen here, And it happens because we get
that a lot in Texas.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Frankly, sure, well, I would say when we first moved
here in twenty and eighteen, that's when we had this
massive hailstorm which totalled my wife's minivan. We literally had
the insurance company totally and buy her a new car.
We had hail the size of oranges that were coming down,
(01:48):
so it I mean, crazy roofs were, you know, crushed it.
All the tile roofs in the neighborhood looked like they
were in a war zone. And we're like, is this
what we're going to be experiencing all the time? And
it turns out with no mean we get hail here routinely.
You see a lot of cars that have a lot
of dents and a lot of repair shops, but not
hail the size of oranges. That was unusual.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
When I was a kid, and I think we've probably
talked about this, we had tornado drills all the time.
We didn't have active shooter like they do today. We
had pretty much tornado drills and that was it. So,
you know, I always thought we're gonna get hit by
a tornado, And where I am in Austin, we've had
small ones, but we've never had what you would think
about like in a twister or Kansas. Not as long
(02:31):
as I've been around here.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
In Colorado. I had to go pick up my oldest son,
he flew in this like three years ago. I had
to go up to the Denver Airport and we just
happened to have massive windstorms with over one hundred mile
an hour gusts and driving on the freeway, you see
all these big rigs literally overturned. The wind is, you know,
tipping them over, and it was, you know, I'm in
(02:54):
a higher vehicle. I'm in a jeep, you know, which
has a high center of gravity, and it gets a
little bit gary, like am I going to end up
on my side?
Speaker 1 (03:02):
What about California?
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Well, I lived there and I lived there since what
about nineteen eighty one up until I retired. The California
weather is it's kind of wimpy, you know. It just drizzles,
it really is. I don't know. I get bored with
California weather.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Oh my gosh. Move to La. You see what happens
to them in l Alexis is going to give you
an earpolone a little bit. But I definitely understand what
you're saying North, especially in northern California, Central California. Definitely.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Yeah, that's where you know here in Colorado. I just
I enjoy the the you know, the storms, they're fun.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
Well, I meant this to be a transition to our
story today, which is set in California. And we've done
some California stories. I think you'll think this is an
interesting one. So this is nineteen seventy one, and you
weren't You weren't even born yet, right, Paul, You weren't
born in I was.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Three years old? Are you kidding me? You were the
one that wasn't born.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
I'm trying to be complementerible. So nineteen seventy one, and
this is in Yuba City, so forty miles north of Sacramento.
Have you been to Uba?
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (04:09):
I have never been to Ubis. Have you really? For
crime stuff?
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Or for what my ex wife had some family that
lived up in Uba, and believe it or not, for
a case that I've just stopped working this past year.
I went up and met with the Yuba County sheriff.
I was recently there.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
Describe it now and then we'll get into the story.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
Well, it's, you know, like you said, forty miles north
of Sacramento. It's in you know, kind of Central Valley California,
so massive heat. That's that's one of the things that
really stands out about anything within the Central Valley is
the summertime is just miserable. It's probably you know, I
don't know how about Austin, but you know, it's not
(04:53):
unusual for Yuba to be up in the one hundred
and ten, one hundred.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
And fifteen, Okay, so that it's normal for you.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
But yeah, that's it's very hot. Of course, the geologic
feature there is the Buttes, these just two plateaued call
of mountains, you know that you can see from forever,
you know, so that's kind of cool. And then UBA's
got a very small town feel. It's not very populated,
and there's a lot of little towns directly surrounding Yuba,
(05:24):
like Marysville, Linden, and you know, just I would say,
I guess I would say it's mostly agricultural.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Yeah, well, let's go ahead and set the scene. So
we talked about Yuba City. I spent some time I've
mentioned this before in Modesto, California, on the Gary condit
the Chandra Levy case, which was Almond Country, and I'm
assuming still is. So this is orchard country, and I'm
assuming it's still the case. In Yuba City there were
(05:56):
in the spring of seventy one, so this is almost
fifty five years ago, eighteen thousand acres of orchards, mostly peaches,
but also prunes and plums and pears. So that is
a vast amount of land. And of course, you know
with orchards come the workers, you know, who come in.
And so we're talking about stories. I think here of
(06:19):
victims who are forgotten and we talk about this all
the time with killers. How you know, they find the
people who, in their minds nobody loves or nobody will miss,
and so they prey on those people. And I know
that that's something that you've certainly dealt with before. Is
there another case, and I mean, I know we know
about sex workers and how they're preyed upon, but is
(06:40):
there another case that you could think of where you
just know somebody is, you know, attacking these people because
they think nobody's going to look for them.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Well, this is where anytime you have a transient population,
you know you're talking about you, but you know, this
is an agricultural area. This is very much like the
east end of my county, and this is where you
get a lot lot of the Hispanics coming up from Mexico.
They're separated from their family and they can be victimized.
You see this also with people that ride the trains,
(07:12):
another transient population. And there's several serial killers that took
advantage of these transients on trains, victimized them, killed them.
And you know, the family has no idea that anything
bad has happened to their loved one.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Yeah, runaway kids, of course would be another one. And sure,
so we're looking at that a little bit here. You know,
one thing to mention that this is incredible. This area
of Ubi City, with all of these orchards, eighteen thousand
acres worth of orchards, produced forty percent of the world's
canned fruit. So huge into forty percent huge industry, I
(07:49):
mean amazing.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
Yeah, you know, I didn't realize that Vacaville actually had
a big dry fruit industry there, and it was one company,
but it was you know, a significant employer and back
of it. And I just think this is where you
get to the you know, the weather, you know how dry,
how hot it is, it's probably easy for them to
be able to produce this fruit.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
Well, this is spring of seventy one, so let's go
ahead and get into the story. You know, again, sometimes
we start with the killers, sometimes we start with the
main victim. So we're going to start with the mystery
part of it. So this is May nineteenth, nineteen seventy one,
and there's a farmer named go Ro Kayiho who owns
the orchard. He is walking around and he notices that
(08:37):
there is a very large, but shallow hole in between
some rows of peach trees. You know, he thinks maybe
one of his workers did it. He's not sure, but
he's not alarmed. So large, shallow. When he comes back
later in the day, and I don't know how long,
but long enough for this to happen, it's mysteriously filled in.
(09:00):
And because this is our show, we know what it
is covering up. Okay, So you know, he calls the police.
He thinks somebody's burying trash in his orchard. But when
investigators show up, they dig into the soil between the
sixth and the seventh rows of these peach trees in
this orchard, and they find a rubber boot and a
(09:21):
human foot. So this is a grave that measures six
feet long and is only three and a half feet deep.
We have not gotten into the I don't know if
it's the physics or the geometry of digging a grave,
But six feet long, I mean I would presume that
would mean the body could lay long ways, you know,
(09:44):
or be legs straight out. But three and a half
feet deep seems really shallow.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
What do you think now that's actually impressively deep for
a typical grave. Okay, I will tell you, you know, both
just having experience doing a lot of lef scaping in
my backyard. You know, generally you get down through how
maybe twelve to eighteen inches of top soil, and you're
(10:11):
hitting you know, really hard pan dirt. And you know,
with the cases that I have worked where bodies have
attempted to be buried, many of them they don't get
past eighteen inches, and these shallow graves often have body
parts sticking up out of gosh, you know, so three
and a half feet this is a I mean, that's
a lot of work, you know. I don't know in
(10:33):
this crop type area, how you know how much they
till up the dirt in between the trees. Maybe it's
looser soil than than in other areas. Yeah, so I'm
kind of impressed. But it was just a boot and
a foot. There wasn't the rest of the body.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
So they see that sticking up first, okay, and then
they find the body of their first victim, and there
are multiple victims here. He is aged white man. He
is wearing a calf length gray overcoat. At first, when
I sell calf, I thought like a baby, like a
(11:10):
baby cap, and I thought that's unusual, and then I
thought some more so the sheriff, who is a guy
named he's a deputy sheriff. His name is Steve size Love.
He says that, you know, he thought this guy would
be hot because the temperature in Sutter County was peeking
at a little over seventy five degrees, which is winter
(11:30):
for me, and I would wear a coat in that time,
but I understand how he wouldn't. So that's what he's wearing.
So he's you know, he's clothed, and then he's buried
in this grave and they start looking for clues after that.
So if you are the investigator, if your size Love
on the scene, then you find this body in this orchard.
(11:51):
It's relatively secluded. You know, what is kind of the
first thing that you're doing, is it to id or
or what you.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
Know, there's a whole process in terms of doing you know,
a dig, and you need to do that that process
step by step in order to maximize recovery of the evidence.
You know, fundamentally, you're documenting. You know, then you're starting
to unearth the body, but the dirt that you're pulling
out of the grave itself could potentially have smaller items
(12:20):
of evidence, and so you need to have somebody that
is sifting that dirt as well as just paying attention to, well,
how was this grave dug? Do you have shovel marks
on the side? Is there anything unique that you can document,
you know, some striated aspects that could possibly be tied
back to the tool used to dig the grave. And
then of course there's a body and you process this
(12:42):
body as you would if the body were in you know,
dead inside a house in terms of trace evidence and
you know, documenting injuries and blood flows and insect activity.
You know, there's so much aspect that you have to
take into consideration. But identifying the body as quick as
possible is idea because you can't really start an investigation
(13:02):
until you know who your victim is. But the other
aspect of this is you have the owner of the
property who saw this pre dug grave, yeah, and then
later on saw it filled in with a body in it. Okay,
So now you have a narrow time window in which
somebody came into this location, was able to you know,
(13:24):
has access to the location to dig a grave, and
then had again gained access in order to be able
to put the body in there. So, now do you
have any witnesses? Do you have any farm hands, anybody
that's working in the in the orchard area that could
be witnesses? Seeing how I saw so and so coming
in and you know they had a tractor with them
(13:45):
dragging something behind it or whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
Go to Paul, Go to page page fourteen. Paul, this
is a scene and you know you can see in
the caption what they're saying, and this might give you
a good example of a good explanation for how soft
the dirt is. Tell me what you see they end
up having to do this several more times. How are
they trying to locate these bodies according to this photo
(14:10):
or this body or any more bodies?
Speaker 2 (14:12):
I'm looking at the photograph which is taken looks down
a dirt road that is lined on both sides with
I'm assuming our fruit trees. I can see what appears
to be a car, possibly a law enforcement vehicle from
that era, down in the backdrop, and then along sort
(14:34):
of the road itself, where you know, a typical thing
where you see two tire tracks, you know, and then
you have some vegetation in the middle, and then there's
two men in essence dressed in white T shirts, you know,
jeans are similar, and shoes and each one of them
is holding I'm gonna just describe it as a rod
(14:56):
like object. Well, I know exactly what that is. That
is a probe. And so one of the ways that
we would use to find a body is you'd have
a metal rod that's pointed at the thing so you
can actually push it down into the ground. And oftentimes
you would have it'd be like t shaped up up
(15:16):
at top where you could grab it and put your
weight behind it to press this down into the ground. Well,
if there is a grave in the area, you get
a feel for how hard the ground is the deeper
you go. But if you find an area where it
seems hard, and all of a sudden, the probe just
goes poomp. You found an area in which the dirt
(15:39):
the ground underneath is less dense, and this could indicate
a grave location, or you know, you could potentially have
just gone into a body, you know, but that's what
these probe devices are used, or how they are used.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
Let me give you another example. A lot of the
photos that we have are wonderful, but they're kind of described.
I think they're conflating a lot of these orchards together, okay,
what I'm used to with, and people might correct me
here with modesto or these sort of beautiful, really kind
of clean looking smallish almond trees, and they're perfectly lined,
(16:20):
and I could never see somebody bearying a body there
or keeping a body anyway. You know, it's not they're
not secluded. So why don't you take a look at
page thirteen, And I think that this is kind of
an example not only of a grave but also the
seclusion of it. I guess these are not as clean,
(16:40):
you know, it looks pretty secluded. And this is a
peach orchard.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
Yeah, you know, I'm actually very familiar you know, with
like the almond orchards. You drive down, you know, from
northern California, southern California, and you see all these almond orchards.
You know, familiar with modesto. I know exactly what you're
talking about. In this photo. It is a photo which
is showing a group of individuals. I'm not entirely sure
(17:07):
they don't all look law enforcement. But there is a
grave in the dirt. You see pile, you know, dirt
that has been piled up on one side of this
I at this point I can't tell you if they
dug this grave as part of searching for victims, or
this was another one of these pre dug graves that
(17:27):
the offender had dug and now they're looking at that.
But to your point, the backdrop, you see the vegetation
behind the individuals in this photograph, and it appears that
this location is visibility of this location is probably quite restricted,
you know. And so now that could potentially explain how
(17:50):
an offender could get into maybe an operating peach orchard
and be able to dig a grave and then come
back with a body and fill that, you know, basically
bury the body.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
Let's look at one more photo, because we talked about
evidence that would be important, maybe buried with the body.
So I don't know if this photo is connected directly
with who will turn out to be, you know, our
first victim. But I thought you would be interested in
looking how at looking at I guess at how they're
collecting evidence. So look Paul on page eleven. It technically
(18:24):
is a different spot, but I'm a look at the
method is what I'm getting at.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Right, So what I'm looking at is a photograph of
three men. One appears to be just standing off to
the side. He's the supervisor. And then you see you.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
See saff.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
You see the the two men that drew the short
straw with screens and this is where the dirt is
being sifted for evidence. So as dirt is being brought
up out of the grave, that dirt needs to go
through this sifting process. And oftentimes you're using different size
(19:05):
screens from large to smaller ones, which allow you to
be able to find larger items, and then of course
you may have to find smaller items. And this sifting
process is great for just general physical evidence. Let's say
you know the killer threw a cigarette butt into the gravesite,
(19:26):
and this is how you can find a cigarette, But
right now I don't know what the condition of these
bodies are. So sometimes if you have skeletal remains, the
sifting process is necessary to find the small bones, the
victim's teeth, depending if there's dismemberment or there's been, you know,
some sort of trauma to the body. So it's truly
(19:47):
an archaeological dig. It takes a lot of effort and
a lot of time to competently and adequately dig up
a body and process that crime scene for evidence.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
What do you think about the space in between? I
was looking at the mash the screen that they were using,
and I was saying, that seems kind of big, but
maybe it will catch what they needed to catch if
there's anything in there.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
So you're asking about the size of the screen size itself.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Yeah, like of the holes in between, like, wouldn't teeth
fall through those? I'm sort of thing, what are they
really looking for?
Speaker 2 (20:23):
At least with what I can see in this photograph,
it looks like they are dealing with a screen that
has about I would say a quarter inch opening, And
so this would be good for recovering just general physical evidence,
recovering bone fragments, and it does allow the passage of
(20:45):
the smaller particles of dirt and stuff. So now you
can start to visualize. You know, not only do you
have rocks or clumps of dirt that don't pass through,
but this is where you can see the evidence that
gets caught up with this size screen. Now, if you
are finding things which appears, let's say this was a
situation where a body's been burned basically almost cremated, and
(21:08):
now the body's been crushed up, and you really really
want those teeth in addition to recovering whatever bone fragments
are there. Then you need to follow up which you
screen with at this size screen with a smaller size screen.
But you can only go so small because at a
certain point the dirt doesn't pass through, it just clumps
(21:30):
into the screen. And then I ran into a situation
where we're finding skeletal remains out in the two leys
out off of the Sacramento River delta, and so we
had mud that we had to screen, and so now
we had to have running water. So when we put
the mud into the screen, and now you have water,
you know, to get the small particle to clay and
(21:52):
crap through the screen so you can see do I
have any bone in this massive mud.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
Yeah, well this seems like a nightmare scene to me.
They find a tire track, a wide truck tire track,
and they make a plaster cast. Is that something that
we do today? Is it useful in any way? Well?
Speaker 2 (22:13):
Yeah, you know, there's of course when you're dealing with
impression evidence out at a crime scene. It could be shoes,
it could be tires. There's there's steps that you take
in terms of documenting it, and photography with oblique lighting
from multiple angles is really really good. But then we
would use a dental stone, which is really this fine
(22:36):
particulate powder that you mix with water and then you
pour into the impression like the tire impression, allow that
to harden, and so in essence you are walking away
with an exact replication of that impression evidence. And so
this is what your tire. We had a guy that
was an expert in shoes and tires, and so he
(22:58):
has the photographs with the lighting from different angles, and
he actually has the tire impression in the dental stone
to be able to compare to any suspect vehicle tires
that are submitted.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
Hmm. Well, I mean I was thinking this is an orchard.
Doesn't everybody have a truck around here, But well, we'll see.
This is helpful.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
Yeah, but that's important though. You know, you need to
know what is you know, commonly operating in this area
and then what potentially kind of doesn't look like it belongs.
If something like that is there and it's right by
the grave, then you'd probably focus in on that evidence. Yep.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
Okay. So the deputy sheriff is helpful in many ways,
including he is able to identify our victim. His name
is Kenneth Kenney white Acre. The deputy sheriff knows him
because he's a wanderer. He calls him a wanderer transient.
Kenny was just somebody who was passing through town. I
don't think he broke the law, and that's how the
(23:55):
deputy sheriff knows. I just think the deputy sheriff's job
is to know when strain come through town. So Kenny
came through. He had only recently come into the area
from Palo Alto. He did have multiple arrests from public
intoxication and robbery, and he had kind of gone back
and forth between Washington State and California because he had
(24:17):
some family there and he also had been a truck
driver at one point. So there's the victim. I have
a description of the injuries that happened to him. I'm
assuming you'd like to know that next. Absolutely, Kenny had
been stabbed on the left side of his chest, piercing
(24:40):
his lung and severing the aorta. And so this was
about eight to ten inches through the chest. There's a
cut behind the fifth finger on his right hand, described
as a chop style, a chopped type wound. There's a
knife slice on the right wrist that penetrates to the bone,
slash on his left cheek, multiple head wounds, largest of
(25:04):
which was four inches long and deep, cutting to the
skull and into the cranial vault. And in this report,
the physician estimated that the weapon was a eight to
ten inch long blade. Let me stop there and then
we'll talk about stuff that was found on the body,
like just evidence from the body.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
Sure, well, at least the injuries to his hands, that
sounds consistent with defensive wounds. So the victim is aware
he's being attacked, he's trying to ward off this offender
who's armed with a knife. This four inch long sounds
like an incisive injury, but it also penetrates through the skull.
(25:47):
You know. That's a significant amount of force, you know.
And I've got one poor victim. The knife was embedded
inside his head and it was left by the offender there.
So knives will go through skull, you know. But this
is indicating that the offender is attacking this victim. The
victim is aware. And then ultimately, you know, the fatal
(26:08):
stab wound going into I think you said the chest
into the aorta, you know. And so now once the
aorta is penetrated like that, it's possible the victim bleeds
out internally, very very quickly.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
Well, they are searching his body and in the pocket,
the deputy sheriff finds what he says is homosexual literature.
For the audio audience, I'm using quotes homosexual literature. We
don't hear about this again. You know, we're wondering. We
have a new researcher, Allison, and she's wondering if this
(26:43):
even really if the size love The deputy sheriff didn't
really know what he was talking about because it's not
wrought up later on, but that's what they say is
on him. And then you know, I have a little
bit of a timeline, but that's basically it. You know,
he's just somebody who wants It doesn't seem like he
(27:03):
was somebody who worked on the orchard. But I asked
Alison to look a little bit deeper into access because
I know you're going to ask about access, and the
orchard essentially is accessible to anybody. There are multiple roads.
It's not hard to get into. We can see how
isolated it is. He might or he might not have
worked on the orchard, but it wouldn't have been difficult
(27:25):
for somebody to get there. And maybe he was eating peaches.
It's a peach orchard, you know.
Speaker 2 (27:30):
Sure, you know if he's if he's a wanderer and
you know, needing some food. But okay, so this homosexual literature,
this is nineteen seventy one. Things that are popping into
my head. Is this a you know, something that had
limited distribution. Can this be traced back to a particular
location in town or to maybe some other location outside
(27:53):
of Yuba. Is it consistent with what is known about
the victim? You know, part of my concern is there
there's a possibility that this is staged, that the offender
planted this this homosexual literature in a way to at
that point in time, disparage who the victim was, you know,
(28:16):
to throw and throw law enforcement off of you know,
whatever leads. The timeline I think is also going to
be important because we know we have a predug grave.
So when was this grave doug relative to the last
time the victim was seen alive. You know, it was
this particular victim targeted, and you know, the grave is dug,
(28:41):
then the victim is is lured to a location. I'm
assuming there's no evidence that the victim was killed at
the grave.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
Site, no evidence of that from what I can.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
See, so he killed elsewhere. And then the offender already
has the grave ready to go so he can dump
the body, push the dirt in, and get out of
there pretty quick. You know. So that would indicate that
the offender had pre selected the victim. You know, is
a relationship between the two. So there's there's sort of questions,
and I think that's the next thing I'd want to
(29:11):
know is, you know, what timeline do we have about
this victim? And I know with a wandering type of victim,
it's probably scant.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
Here's the timeline for what happened with Kenny the day before.
So there were a lot of interviews with community members
and this is what they say. Now, remember this is
a guy who hasn't been in Ubi City very long.
It's like he has family there. The day before they
discover his grave, Kenny was seen at one o'clock in
(29:41):
the afternoon in Tierra Bueno, which is between Uba City
and Sutter. Then six and a half hours to seven
and a half hours later people see him walking back
toward Ubas City. So that's at night, seven thirty, eight
thirty at night. On the day of the murder, he
was seen at nine o'clock in the morning and he
(30:02):
seemed to be heading back to the Bay area where
his siblings lived. So the last time people saw him
was nine am when his body was discovered later in
the day by the farmer.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Is he hitchhiking?
Speaker 1 (30:16):
You know, he must have been hitchhiking. It doesn't say,
but how else how would he have gotten back to
the bay area. Would he be walking?
Speaker 2 (30:24):
I mean, that's that's a long walk.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
That's a maybe the train, maybe hopped a train or something.
I don't know what he was doing.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
Potentially hitchhiking nineteen seventy one. Hitchhiking, of course, was a big,
big thing that was just common. Now this is interesting
because at least with his timeline so nine am on
the morning that he's literally found in a grave later
on that day, Yep, he's trying to get down to
(30:50):
the Bay area. And I'm gonna say he's hitch hiking
or something, but he's a victim of opportunity. How would
an offender have known, you know, with Kenneth his move
movement pattern like this, I have to consider the possibility
that we've got an offender that is out there literally
trolling for victims. Just just like you have an offender
(31:13):
that is going into a stroll area where sex workers
are just trying to find somebody. This could potentially be
an offender that is going, Okay, here's a guy that
needs a ride and I've got and this offender wants
to do something to this man. Maybe it's of sexual nature,
that's part. He's a fantasy motivated offender and he's already
(31:35):
dug the grave and he's going to try to get
this you know, victim isolated to do whatever and kill
him and dump him in the grave. And you know
this this comes into you know, even though Kenneth is clothed,
you know, is there a possibility that there was sexual
interaction between this offender and Kenneth? And did they actually
(31:58):
consider that? Chances are eineteen seventy one with a fully
closed mail victim, probably not. But you know that's just
something that's now. You know that that packet, that homosexual
literature packet or flyer or whatever it is, that might
be really significant to the offender himself, Like this could
(32:20):
be something that the offender either planted or maybe the
victim is somebody that exchanges you know, sexual acts with
men for money or for drugs, whatever, you know, whatever
his payment aspect is.
Speaker 1 (32:37):
This book or whatever it was a pamphlet doesn't come
up later on in the story at all, but the
media does talk about it. So there's there's some churn there.
But it's also the media. You know, how we work
in the media. We pick up on the most salacious
things sometimes and amplify it. Sure, but I do think
it's important to keep that in mind. So two days later,
(32:59):
as investigating Kenny's case, the Cutter County Sheriff's Department gets
a tip from an officer in nearby Marysville, and so
two days later there is an assault that happened. There's
a survivor, but there's an assault that happens. The vicious
nature of this assault in Marysville reminds the sheriff there
(33:22):
of the vicious nature of what happened with Kenny. So
I'll tell you what happened. The folks investigating Kenny's murder
get a tip two days later because this was such
a vicious murder, it reminded somebody in a different area,
not far from ubis city, of an assault that happened
(33:43):
the year before. What happens is is February twenty fifth
of nineteen seventy and at one o'clock in the morning,
there's a man named Jose Romero Rea, and someone at
a bar slash restaurant had beaten him and cut him
with a meat cleaver at the restaurants called Guadalajara Restaurant
(34:03):
and Cafe. Police describe the injuries with the meat cleavers
so severe that they said, quote, the brain was leaking
from one cut to the top of the head. And
he survives this This guy, I mean, that just seems
unsurvivable to me, But maybe not.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
Yeah, it all depends on what was what damage was done. Yeah,
you know, we have people shot in the head and
they survive and are able to live a decent life afterwards.
So is there any indication in terms of I mean,
was Rea just attacked randomly while at this restaurant or
did he get into some sort of argument with another male?
(34:40):
You know, is this like a bar fight gone bad.
Speaker 1 (34:42):
There's not a lot of information on that assault and
what the motive was. But they did clear the owner,
Natividad Corona, who had been there, and there was a
patron who did the attack in the bathroom and then left.
I doubt he brought a meat cleaver with him, but
I assume that, you know, this was something that the
(35:03):
offender got at the restaurant, but this tip came in
and this is something that happened a year earlier. I
think it was the meat cleaver aspect of it that
tipped everybody off. And so you know, they just keep
that in mind for right now what happened in Marysville. Sure, Okay,
now we're five days after Kinney's body has been found.
(35:25):
We're at a different orchard. We've gone from peaches to prunes,
I'm not a big fan of prunes. Do you like prunes?
Speaker 2 (35:31):
I think I've had them once in my life. Maybe
I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (35:35):
Don't give me any hate, you guys if you love prunes.
I've never gotten into prunes, which is weird because I
love plums. I love grapes, hate raisins. So explain all.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
That, you know, kind of kind of the same, I
guess really, I can't remember the last time I ate raisins.
Speaker 1 (35:55):
I'm a raisin fan. But anyway, so now we're on
a prune orchard and we're to talk about a picture
in a second, So get your hand ready for the
picture section here, because I want you to see the vastness.
I've seen big orchards, but these are massive. So this
is a different place. It's called Sullivan Ranch, and this
(36:15):
is where we have a lot of activity happening. There
is a tractor driver named Ernesto Garcia, and he's on
the ranch. He works for the ranch. This is five
miles north of Yuba City and it's May twenty fourth.
He's breaking there's another piece of info for you. He's
breaking up the soil on the prune orchard and he
sees a large indentation in the ground between the seventh
(36:36):
and eighth rows. He thinks that the farm hand responsible
for irrigating the area skipped a row, and so you know,
somebody wasn't doing their job, and there's an indentation, but
the ground is soft and there's a shallow depression which
is about six feet by two or three feet deep.
So I think there's no doubt that we've got a
(36:58):
connection here. Next day, Garcia alerts his foreman, who is
a guy named Ray Deron. I thought the next day,
why did he not alert somebody sooner? But Garcia actually
waited because it was late in the day when he
saw this indentation, and he had hoped that the foreman
might say, oh, yeah, this is you know, this was
(37:19):
a new game plan. Don't worry about it, and he
didn't want to look like he was being paranoid, even
though word had gotten around about what happened at the
previous orchard. So he sees this thing and he goes,
they can't be connected. There's no way. So then Deran,
the foreman, contact detectives. They show up and in less
(37:41):
than ten minutes, than coover a decomposed body. The person
is wearing mismatched clothing, two pairs of pants, a plaid shirt,
a sweater, a suit coat, and one shoe. He is
in his sixties, he's a white man. And then I've
got the injuries, but you can imagine they're probably pretty consistent.
(38:02):
So you know, what do you think about this so
far different?
Speaker 2 (38:05):
Orchard? Well, it's interesting. So, you know, first addressing the
indentation and the body is decomposed, I'm wondering if that
body had been buried there for a significant period of
time and as the body decomposed, now what you have
is the dirt that's on top of the body ends
up kind of compressing the body as the body is decomposing,
(38:28):
and so what may have been level land before as
that body decomposed, in essence, the dirt sunk down and
now revealed the location of this grave site. That's one possibility.
The mismatched clothing on the victim, you know. The two
thoughts on that is, again, are you dealing with a
(38:50):
transient victim who you know, is just wearing clothing wherever
he could find articles of clothing, and is just that's
what he's got on? But I think there's all so
the possibility of this victim is being redressed by the offender,
and the offender has access, for whatever reason, to these
articles of clothing. Two pants, a suit coat, one what
(39:13):
was it, one shoe or one boot. You know, that
is odd, So at least that's what you know I
can kind of discern from now. But obviously there's got
to be strong suspicion that this case is connected to
the previous case, even though it's in a different orchard.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
So the person who did the autopsy is a guy
named doctor Clement. He says there is a stab to
this man's chest that is so powerful it shatters the
fifth rib and cuts into the left lung. His face
is slashed on both sides, and there is a third
cut at the nape of the neck. At the morgue
(39:54):
they find matches and a couple of Safeway receipts dated
May eighth. This is May twenty fifth, so you know,
a couple of weeks ago, a box of snuff and
two bars of soap, and a razor. So this man
seems to be definitely a transient somebody who's kind of
come in, a worker who's come in and come out
(40:14):
of town. Doctor Clement says that the cause of death
is strangulation. The extent to which his bronchial tubes are
filled with blood, however, make it impossible to determine whether
the chest or the head wounds were more lethal. Okay,
And the decomposition of the body places the time of
death at one or two weeks earlier. And the victim's
(40:37):
name turns out to be Charles Fleming. So if they're right,
and you need to tell me first if you think
that they could be right. If they're right, this man,
Charles Fleming is killed before Kenney was killed. And remember
this is seventy five degree, whether that's kind of it.
Speaker 2 (40:54):
Well as far as the injuries, you know, if the
pathologist is saying cause of death is strained, then he
is seeing evidence and evaluating the neck that there's either
hemorrhaging and the strap muscles of the neck and there's
you know, hyoid bone has been broken. There's a furrow
(41:14):
around his neck. You know, if there's a ligature that
had been employed at some point, maybe there's petikias still
present within the eyes, but the state of decomposition might
prevent him from seeing that. I'm a little bit concerned
with the emphasis on the amount of blood in these victims'
lungs and that he basically drowned in his own blood.
I don't think a pathologist would misinterpret, you know, but
(41:37):
is there is it asphyxial, you know, versus strangulation. But
I'm I'm just going to assume this pathologist knows what
they're doing, and so he's seeing evidence that, yes, this
victim is strangled. But then the stab wound into the
left lung, the one that fractured the fifth rib. Now
you've got the bleeding internally, and you see this where
(41:57):
now victims are literally they're struggling to breathe, they're coughing
up blood, and you start to see this what we
call expiratory patterns of blood as they are just struggling
to get air in. It's miserable. I can't imagine going
through something like that. However, from a sequence standpoint, it
(42:18):
seems more logical that this victim is being attacked with
the knife first, and then once the victim is starting
to succumb to those injuries, the offender is finishing the
victim off with the strangulation. That is what I would
guess is the sequence of how that happened. Kind of
the finding of the matches. The receipts. Those receipts are huge.
(42:43):
You know. It sounds like Fleming is alive on May
eighth and is somehow is contacted by the offender after
that date. State of decomposition would probably suggest relatively soon,
in a few days after that May eighth the date,
But it also tends to suggest he is more of
(43:03):
a transient type with the razor, so, you know, kind
of similar victimology to the first victim.
Speaker 1 (43:12):
Yep, why don't you go to your photos real quick
and look on page two. I want you to see
this flipping ranch. It's four hundred to six hundred acres.
I just if I were a deputy, I would look
at this and say, because now they feel like this
is obviously a multiple murderer at this point. So I mean,
can you imagine trying to do a grid search or
(43:34):
anything on this land?
Speaker 2 (43:37):
Well, you know, obviously, yes, this I'm looking at it
appears to be an aero photograph showing sort of the
primary structures on the ranch, maybe a residence, maybe some
barns for housing tractors and stuff. But on either side
of where the structures are located, you can just see
the sprawl of a very organized orchard, kind of like
(43:58):
how you're describing the Medesta so almond orchards, that's what
this looks like. And so yes, you know, if now
the thought is, okay, we've got another buried body, how
many more bodies are out here? The size of this
this orchard, if we're going to restrict ourselves to just
this orchard, yes, that would take a very very long
(44:20):
time to search. However, it's because of the spacing of
the trees. There's sort of a convenience aspect. You can utilize,
you know, the row and column aspect of the trees
to organize your search pattern. If you find something, you're
able to very quickly designate, you know where that whatever
(44:43):
you found, where that's located on this orchard, and you
can easily walk through these trees. You know, when I've
had to do some searching, oftentimes I'm having to push through.
I can think one case where I'm pushing through poison
oak on the side of a hill. I'd much rather
search this orchard then go, you know, hunt, you know,
for other bodies in poison oak.
Speaker 1 (45:04):
This is such a large space. But you're right, I mean,
you could be a lot more organized on this kind
of land.
Speaker 2 (45:11):
It's easy for dogs to run through this.
Speaker 1 (45:13):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely, and different than the Peach Orchard. Seemed
like a huge mess, but let's continue on. So they
stay and look around because of course they fear that
there are more bodies out there, and I'm assuming that
there are people at the Peach Orchard who are also
looking for more bodies there. Around six o'clock on the
(45:33):
twenty fifth, same day, they discover a clearing near the
Feather River on the Sullivan Ranch and I have a
photo of that if you want to see that. And
the clearing is another grave. There is also something we
haven't seen yet, which is a fifteen to sixteen yard
blood trail that leads across a road to a red,
(45:55):
blood soaked patch of dry grass in the Prune Orchard.
And there's dirt that's been sprinkled on the grass and
attempt to cover the blood, and there are shovel marks
on the access road. And I had wondered if that's
what happened with the first two, that those are actually
the murder scenes, but he managed to cover up with
loose dirt and stuff.
Speaker 2 (46:16):
Well, yeah, this third grave, you know, with the blood
trail and then what sounds like, you know, blood pooled blood.
That would suggest, yes, you have a victim that's been killed,
was laying at that location for some period of time
and has then moved, leaving that blood trail over to
where the grave is. And if you are seeing that,
(46:40):
this sounds very recent. You know, we think about the
dirt that's out there. You know, that blood is sticky.
You know, as the dirt gets blown, you know a
lot of the blood is going to just get covered
up by that dirt is going to you know, that
dirt's going to stick to it. I'm somewhat surprised, but
maybe not totally that the offender is isolating the victims
(47:04):
out in his orchards and this is where he's killing
them and burying them. But with the first one though,
that that grave. You know, unless unless the offender and
the victim, you know, the offender's got a knife to
the victim's throat telling him to shut up as the
witness you know, goes by, you know, it would suggest
that he's pre planning the location and where he's going
(47:26):
to bring the victims, at least for body disposal. But
it sounds like in this case he brought the victim
to the location where he's disposing the body, but the
victim is alive, and then he kills the victim. Here,
why is he killing the victim? Is this is this robbery?
But I think you potentially are looking at a fantasy
motivated offender. There may be a sexual aspect to what
(47:46):
this offender is getting from his interactions with these males.
Speaker 1 (47:51):
Well, let's keep going. You know, they find a shoe print,
they make a plaster cast in the grave with this
latest person. They find a cigarette, but a small dark
feather and two folded receipts, and you know, of course
when we say resipts, so that's that's you know, maybe
it'll be part of this timeline. They don't think it's
something that's going to be key because they look at
(48:14):
the body and it's very clear to the pathologist that
these are wounds that had been inflicted in the last
twenty four hours. Okay, he said that is very clear.
Is that based on the blood clotting or.
Speaker 2 (48:26):
What well, it's going to be based off of his
assessment of the condition of the body, Like you said,
you know, we're talking about you know, seventy five degree
temperatures during the day, it's going to drop to cooler
temperatures at night. You're putting a body into a ground
that is going to be cool, you know, So the
body is being preserved somewhat. Now, twenty four hours later,
(48:50):
the pathologist is going to be taking a look at well,
is there any rigor present? You know, do I have
full rigor do I have partial rigor. He's assessing the temperatures,
the location, you know, the body in essences in a
I wouldn't call it a refrigerated state, but is in
a somewhat of a cooled state. But when he's looking
at these wounds, he's not necessarily able to gauge, oh,
(49:11):
you know, this wound was inflicted five hours ago versus
twenty four hours ago. He's taken in the totality of
what he is seeing and saying, this is a fresh kill.
Speaker 1 (49:20):
Okay, Well, let me tell you about the victim. They
identify him. He's a white male, he's fifty nine. His
name is Milford Sample, and he has nine fingers, which
I don't think comes into play, but there you go.
He has been stabbed in the left chest, has a large,
deep cut in the back of the head. The wounds
appear to have been inflicted within the last twenty four hours.
(49:41):
As I said, cause of death according to this physician
is a skull fracture, massive compound right temporal parietal bone.
Does this fit in with the same pattern, you know.
Speaker 2 (49:52):
To a lesser or a greater extent, But fundamentally the
offender is using sharp edged weapon, maybe a meat cleaver,
you know something where you've got this what sounds like
a deep cut to the back of the head. Then
you also have the skull fractures, which at least there's
not enough in what you provided to say. Is there
(50:12):
is that a result of some sort of bludgeoning, you know,
so maybe or it could be a stomping. It almost
sounds like this victim, you know, was this somewhat of
a surprise attack. You know where the victims, you know,
the standing out there in the orchard, and now you
have the offender says, you know, hey, what's that over there,
and then pulls out a meat cleaver and brings it
(50:36):
down into the back of his head. Fully clothed. It
says it, yes, okay, all the victims are white males.
This victim, do we know is he also transient he is.
And so I think, you know, going back to when
you first started talking about this case and talking about
(50:56):
offenders targeting victims that when be noticed if they go missing. Right,
So this offender is praying on a certain population, purposely
praying on a certain population, and this is a population
that doesn't have financial resources. Robbery does not seem to
be this offender's motive. And now I'm thinking, Okay, we
(51:18):
do have a serial predator that's either he's sexually motivated,
fantasy induced, or maybe he's I'll use this term missionary.
He's got a mission. He has maybe a personal philosophy
that somehow these men are representative of being opposed to
(51:39):
what this offender's philosophy is.
Speaker 1 (51:42):
We've talked about this kind of case before, where you
have people who kind of had a vendetta essentially, and
they're seeking revenge. So we'll have to see where we
land on this one. Okay, So now we have as
far as victims, we have Kenny, then we have an
assault on Jose, who doesn't die but has massive facial
and brain injuries from the attack. We've got Charles Fleming,
(52:07):
and then we go to when we go to Feather river.
We have Milford sample, and now they're going to continue
to spread out because they feel like this is a
hot spot. And they are right in five hundred yards.
The surrounding five hundred yards, they find four more graves.
There's one that's one hundred yards north and a cluster
(52:28):
of three victims less than four hundred yards south of
the first grave. And some of these are John Doe's
I can tell you about you know some of these.
I mean, we be here all day talking about this,
but everything is very similar. So we've got four more graves.
There is a white John Doe number one. He's been
(52:49):
bludgeoned to death. His shirt and sweatshirt are pulled up
over his face. In his arm, he's not wearing pants,
and his penis is exposed. It appears that he had
been dragged to his grave. And then I can tell
you about the three other that were You have three
other victims that were kind of in a cluster a
little south of where this initial grave was. We've got
(53:11):
three middle aged white men, Donald Smith, John Haluca, and
another John Doe, John Doe number two. So Smith, the
first guy has his shirt and sweatshirt pulled up over
his face. And arm, and nothing on John than the
man in the center. But the third body was extremely decomposed.
(53:32):
They've all been stabbed in the chest and cleaved in
the back of their heads. And John Doe too is
naked from the waist down. Everybody is a is a
you know, a worker, transient.
Speaker 2 (53:43):
Worker, sure, you know. And I think that that kind
of answers the question. There's there's a sexual component to
what the offender is doing to these victims. So he's
he's a serial predator, fantasy motivated.
Speaker 1 (53:57):
Well, let's talk about where these guys are from real quick.
So Smith and Heluca are you know, workers that have
been on orchards. But they're pretty different. Smith was from Kansas.
He was on his own on the road for a
very long time. He had ninety seven arrests for drunkenness
and misdemeanors. Haluca had kept himself, He didn't drink, He
(54:18):
kept his money in his pocket. But you know, they're
on orchards and that's the common denominator, right. He said
he kept money in his pocket to avoid being arrested
for vagrancy, to be able to prove he had money.
Speaker 2 (54:29):
It sounds like, yeah, well, obviously the offender is comfortable
around these orchards. There's a reason why the offender is
choosing orchards versus maybe more remote locations. You've got these
these four additional victims being found, and one of the
victims is severely decomposed. So now that might provide some
(54:52):
sequence information in terms of the order in which you know,
these various cases occurred, you know, and then we go
back to the Marysville bar that happened a year prior
to the start of these bodies being found, and that
may be related. You know, I think it is significant
that in that case, that's the only non white male
(55:16):
that is being attacked, and that was a Hispanic mail
I'm assuming just based off of the name. You know,
it comes down to, you know, who is that patron
that attacked that guy in that restaurant, you know, and
can you investigate whether or not he has any role
in these homicides that are occurring on the orchards.
Speaker 1 (55:37):
Well, let me give you a couple of more victims here.
It just keeps going. It's seven forty five pm that night,
it's starting to rain, but the detectives just found two
more graves, different states of decomposition and they're laid foot
to foot near a fork in the road that leads
back to the main part of this Sullivan ranch. There
(55:58):
are two sixty two old men and one of them
had his pants pulled down. They've both been stabbed and
cleaved like the other ones, both white.
Speaker 2 (56:07):
And then they're buried right next to each other.
Speaker 1 (56:10):
Yeah, their foot to foot is what it said, near
a road that leads back to the main road of
the ranch. What does that mean? And it sounds like
very decomposed.
Speaker 2 (56:19):
So but they're saying two different states of decomposition. Sounds
like they're killed at different times versus both of them
are killed at the same time and buried. So this,
you know, there's a certain I think because there's a
cluster of three bodies that were near each other that
you said before. You know, this is interesting just because
I go to the Green River killer case where Gary
(56:41):
Ridgeway purposefully put women's bodies in clusters, and when he
was interviewed, the reason he did that is so he
could remember where he had put them and he would
go back and visit these women's bodies. And I'm not
going to go into any details what he was doing
with some of these women's bodies. But this is where
(57:01):
you know, I'm starting to wonder in this case. You know,
are these gray sites so near each other because these
are good body disposal areas and the offenders taking advantage
of that, or is the offender got a personal reason
to put these bodies together like that?
Speaker 1 (57:17):
You know, these men are all the consistency is they
sort of belong on orchards, They've been on orchards, they've
worked on orchards before. But one of the men is
not somebody who was a worker, transit worker. He had
lived in Marysville for twenty years, and he'd been working
on orchards and he answered security checks that he was cashing.
(57:38):
He was last seen getting into a yellow looking Chevy
panel van and he picked up his last one on
my first and his friend alerted the police that there
was a missing person.
Speaker 2 (57:53):
It was a Chevy van, a yellow Chevy van that
had had panels on it. Yep, it seems quite distinctive.
This is a clue that I'm sure the investigators started
marching down on Yep.
Speaker 1 (58:07):
Yeah. So now we're at twelve ten am and after
multiple hours of unearthing victims in the rain, they find
three more but they're exhausted, and they said, we have
to be done for tonight, and so you know, they
end up leaving the three graves for the next day.
So this is all happening in one day, and I
(58:30):
lost count of how many they discovered. I mean maybe
six or seven I think in one day.
Speaker 2 (58:37):
In one day. Yeah, No, that's you know, they made
the right call trying to you know, first, I think
with this type of crime scene, once it starts to rain,
I think you're done. I think you have to call
it a day and just wait. The worst for evidence,
the worst for documentation, et cetera, is trying to process.
(59:00):
I'm seen in the rain, and then when you now
get into where it's now nighttime. I don't care how
good your lights are. You know that you erect out there,
it's not as good as sunshine. Yeah. So in essence,
you know, they probably worked longer than they should have,
but there's no reason to continue. They're making the right calls.
(59:21):
Let's do this right when we can see and hopefully
the rain has stopped in the morning.
Speaker 1 (59:26):
Yeah, because they're not going to become suddenly more decomposed
or lose anything there if they're buried on that land,
they're safely buried for twelve hours.
Speaker 2 (59:36):
Yeah. I, in fact, I had a case I at
least started digging up a woman's body on Hell's Angels property.
This is within a year of me retiring, and I
remember arguing with the homicide investigator because I said, no,
we're done. This is a this is a body, and
we're going to get the crime lab out here to
do a proper dig in the morning. And this guy
(59:58):
was lighting me up. We're going to lose evidence. This
sounds like, no, you're not. Nothing is going to change
between now and in the morning, and all we're going
to do is screw things up if we keep doing
this in the middle of the night.
Speaker 1 (01:00:11):
Well, that's obviously smart. And it seems like we have
investigators who have it together because we do have a suspect.
You're right, it is connected to the assault that happened
the year before, and you know, we will talk about
that and we will talk about sort of the ending
(01:00:31):
and how many bodies they end up discovering next week.
Speaker 2 (01:00:34):
Okay, well, I look forward to it. This is a
fascinating case.
Speaker 1 (01:00:38):
Good, I know, a good serial killer case. You love them.
I'm spoiling you need to I need to pace myself
a little bit better.
Speaker 2 (01:00:44):
Wow, this is great.
Speaker 1 (01:00:45):
Thanks Kate, Okay bye. This has been an exactly right
production for.
Speaker 2 (01:00:53):
Our sources and show notes go to exactly Rightmedia dot
com slash Buried Bones sources.
Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
Our senior producer is Alexis Emirosi.
Speaker 2 (01:01:01):
Research by Alison Trumble and Kate Winkler Dawson.
Speaker 1 (01:01:04):
Our mixing engineer is Ben Tolliday.
Speaker 2 (01:01:07):
Our theme song is by Tom Bryfogel.
Speaker 1 (01:01:09):
Our artwork is by Vanessa Lilac.
Speaker 2 (01:01:12):
Executive produced by Karen Kilgarriff, Georgia hard Stark, and Danielle Kramer.
Speaker 1 (01:01:16):
You can follow Buried Bones on Instagram and Facebook at
Buried Bones pod.
Speaker 2 (01:01:21):
Kate's most recent book, All That Is Wicked, a Gilded
Age story of murder and the race to decode the
criminal mind, is available now.
Speaker 1 (01:01:28):
And Paul's best selling memoir Unmasked, My life Solving America's
Cold Cases is also available now.
Speaker 2 (01:01:35):
Listen to Baried Bones on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
I'm Kate Winkler Dawson. I'm a journalist who's spent the
last twenty five years writing about true crime.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
And I'm Paul Hols, a retired cold case investigator who's
worked some of America's most complicated cases and solve them.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Each week, I present Paul with one of history's most
compelling true crimes.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
And I weigh in using modern forensic techniques to bring
new insights to old mysteries.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Together, using our individual expertise, we're examining historical true crime
cases through a twenty first century lens.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Some are solved and some are cold, very cold.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
This is buried bones.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Hey, Kate, how are you doing?
Speaker 1 (01:02):
I'm great? How about you? Is it getting colder there?
It's the October.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Ish, it's starting to turn. You know. Colorado is always
up and down when it comes to the weather, but
usually right around Halloween is when we can expect our
first snow.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
So is the big weather. It has to be blizzards, right,
those are the big weather events. I mean, are there anything?
Is there anything that's so unusual? You go, it's never
going to happen here, And it happens because we get
that a lot in Texas.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Frankly, sure, well, I would say when we first moved
here in twenty and eighteen, that's when we had this
massive hailstorm which totalled my wife's minivan. We literally had
the insurance company totally and buy her a new car.
We had hail the size of oranges that were coming down,
(01:48):
so it I mean, crazy roofs were, you know, crushed it.
All the tile roofs in the neighborhood looked like they
were in a war zone. And we're like, is this
what we're going to be experiencing all the time? And
it turns out with no mean we get hail here routinely.
You see a lot of cars that have a lot
of dents and a lot of repair shops, but not
hail the size of oranges. That was unusual.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
When I was a kid, and I think we've probably
talked about this, we had tornado drills all the time.
We didn't have active shooter like they do today. We
had pretty much tornado drills and that was it. So,
you know, I always thought we're gonna get hit by
a tornado, And where I am in Austin, we've had
small ones, but we've never had what you would think
about like in a twister or Kansas. Not as long
(02:31):
as I've been around here.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
In Colorado. I had to go pick up my oldest son,
he flew in this like three years ago. I had
to go up to the Denver Airport and we just
happened to have massive windstorms with over one hundred mile
an hour gusts and driving on the freeway, you see
all these big rigs literally overturned. The wind is, you know,
tipping them over, and it was, you know, I'm in
(02:54):
a higher vehicle. I'm in a jeep, you know, which
has a high center of gravity, and it gets a
little bit gary, like am I going to end up
on my side?
Speaker 1 (03:02):
What about California?
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Well, I lived there and I lived there since what
about nineteen eighty one up until I retired. The California
weather is it's kind of wimpy, you know. It just drizzles,
it really is. I don't know. I get bored with
California weather.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Oh my gosh. Move to La. You see what happens
to them in l Alexis is going to give you
an earpolone a little bit. But I definitely understand what
you're saying North, especially in northern California, Central California. Definitely.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Yeah, that's where you know here in Colorado. I just
I enjoy the the you know, the storms, they're fun.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
Well, I meant this to be a transition to our
story today, which is set in California. And we've done
some California stories. I think you'll think this is an
interesting one. So this is nineteen seventy one, and you
weren't You weren't even born yet, right, Paul, You weren't
born in I was.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Three years old? Are you kidding me? You were the
one that wasn't born.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
I'm trying to be complementerible. So nineteen seventy one, and
this is in Yuba City, so forty miles north of Sacramento.
Have you been to Uba?
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (04:09):
I have never been to Ubis. Have you really? For
crime stuff?
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Or for what my ex wife had some family that
lived up in Uba, and believe it or not, for
a case that I've just stopped working this past year.
I went up and met with the Yuba County sheriff.
I was recently there.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
Describe it now and then we'll get into the story.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
Well, it's, you know, like you said, forty miles north
of Sacramento. It's in you know, kind of Central Valley California,
so massive heat. That's that's one of the things that
really stands out about anything within the Central Valley is
the summertime is just miserable. It's probably you know, I
don't know how about Austin, but you know, it's not
(04:53):
unusual for Yuba to be up in the one hundred
and ten, one hundred.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
And fifteen, Okay, so that it's normal for you.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
But yeah, that's it's very hot. Of course, the geologic
feature there is the Buttes, these just two plateaued call
of mountains, you know that you can see from forever,
you know, so that's kind of cool. And then UBA's
got a very small town feel. It's not very populated,
and there's a lot of little towns directly surrounding Yuba,
(05:24):
like Marysville, Linden, and you know, just I would say,
I guess I would say it's mostly agricultural.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Yeah, well, let's go ahead and set the scene. So
we talked about Yuba City. I spent some time I've
mentioned this before in Modesto, California, on the Gary condit
the Chandra Levy case, which was Almond Country, and I'm
assuming still is. So this is orchard country, and I'm
assuming it's still the case. In Yuba City there were
(05:56):
in the spring of seventy one, so this is almost
fifty five years ago, eighteen thousand acres of orchards, mostly peaches,
but also prunes and plums and pears. So that is
a vast amount of land. And of course, you know
with orchards come the workers, you know, who come in.
And so we're talking about stories. I think here of
(06:19):
victims who are forgotten and we talk about this all
the time with killers. How you know, they find the
people who, in their minds nobody loves or nobody will miss,
and so they prey on those people. And I know
that that's something that you've certainly dealt with before. Is
there another case, and I mean, I know we know
about sex workers and how they're preyed upon, but is
(06:40):
there another case that you could think of where you
just know somebody is, you know, attacking these people because
they think nobody's going to look for them.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Well, this is where anytime you have a transient population,
you know you're talking about you, but you know, this
is an agricultural area. This is very much like the
east end of my county, and this is where you
get a lot lot of the Hispanics coming up from Mexico.
They're separated from their family and they can be victimized.
You see this also with people that ride the trains,
(07:12):
another transient population. And there's several serial killers that took
advantage of these transients on trains, victimized them, killed them.
And you know, the family has no idea that anything
bad has happened to their loved one.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Yeah, runaway kids, of course would be another one. And sure,
so we're looking at that a little bit here. You know,
one thing to mention that this is incredible. This area
of Ubi City, with all of these orchards, eighteen thousand
acres worth of orchards, produced forty percent of the world's
canned fruit. So huge into forty percent huge industry, I
(07:49):
mean amazing.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
Yeah, you know, I didn't realize that Vacaville actually had
a big dry fruit industry there, and it was one company,
but it was you know, a significant employer and back
of it. And I just think this is where you
get to the you know, the weather, you know how dry,
how hot it is, it's probably easy for them to
be able to produce this fruit.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
Well, this is spring of seventy one, so let's go
ahead and get into the story. You know, again, sometimes
we start with the killers, sometimes we start with the
main victim. So we're going to start with the mystery
part of it. So this is May nineteenth, nineteen seventy one,
and there's a farmer named go Ro Kayiho who owns
the orchard. He is walking around and he notices that
(08:37):
there is a very large, but shallow hole in between
some rows of peach trees. You know, he thinks maybe
one of his workers did it. He's not sure, but
he's not alarmed. So large, shallow. When he comes back
later in the day, and I don't know how long,
but long enough for this to happen, it's mysteriously filled in.
(09:00):
And because this is our show, we know what it
is covering up. Okay, So you know, he calls the police.
He thinks somebody's burying trash in his orchard. But when
investigators show up, they dig into the soil between the
sixth and the seventh rows of these peach trees in
this orchard, and they find a rubber boot and a
(09:21):
human foot. So this is a grave that measures six
feet long and is only three and a half feet deep.
We have not gotten into the I don't know if
it's the physics or the geometry of digging a grave,
But six feet long, I mean I would presume that
would mean the body could lay long ways, you know,
(09:44):
or be legs straight out. But three and a half
feet deep seems really shallow.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
What do you think now that's actually impressively deep for
a typical grave. Okay, I will tell you, you know, both
just having experience doing a lot of lef scaping in
my backyard. You know, generally you get down through how
maybe twelve to eighteen inches of top soil, and you're
(10:11):
hitting you know, really hard pan dirt. And you know,
with the cases that I have worked where bodies have
attempted to be buried, many of them they don't get
past eighteen inches, and these shallow graves often have body
parts sticking up out of gosh, you know, so three
and a half feet this is a I mean, that's
a lot of work, you know. I don't know in
(10:33):
this crop type area, how you know how much they
till up the dirt in between the trees. Maybe it's
looser soil than than in other areas. Yeah, so I'm
kind of impressed. But it was just a boot and
a foot. There wasn't the rest of the body.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
So they see that sticking up first, okay, and then
they find the body of their first victim, and there
are multiple victims here. He is aged white man. He
is wearing a calf length gray overcoat. At first, when
I sell calf, I thought like a baby, like a
(11:10):
baby cap, and I thought that's unusual, and then I
thought some more so the sheriff, who is a guy
named he's a deputy sheriff. His name is Steve size Love.
He says that, you know, he thought this guy would
be hot because the temperature in Sutter County was peeking
at a little over seventy five degrees, which is winter
(11:30):
for me, and I would wear a coat in that time,
but I understand how he wouldn't. So that's what he's wearing.
So he's you know, he's clothed, and then he's buried
in this grave and they start looking for clues after that.
So if you are the investigator, if your size Love
on the scene, then you find this body in this orchard.
(11:51):
It's relatively secluded. You know, what is kind of the
first thing that you're doing, is it to id or
or what you.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
Know, there's a whole process in terms of doing you know,
a dig, and you need to do that that process
step by step in order to maximize recovery of the evidence.
You know, fundamentally, you're documenting. You know, then you're starting
to unearth the body, but the dirt that you're pulling
out of the grave itself could potentially have smaller items
(12:20):
of evidence, and so you need to have somebody that
is sifting that dirt as well as just paying attention to, well,
how was this grave dug? Do you have shovel marks
on the side? Is there anything unique that you can document,
you know, some striated aspects that could possibly be tied
back to the tool used to dig the grave. And
then of course there's a body and you process this
(12:42):
body as you would if the body were in you know,
dead inside a house in terms of trace evidence and
you know, documenting injuries and blood flows and insect activity.
You know, there's so much aspect that you have to
take into consideration. But identifying the body as quick as
possible is idea because you can't really start an investigation
(13:02):
until you know who your victim is. But the other
aspect of this is you have the owner of the
property who saw this pre dug grave, yeah, and then
later on saw it filled in with a body in it. Okay,
So now you have a narrow time window in which
somebody came into this location, was able to you know,
(13:24):
has access to the location to dig a grave, and
then had again gained access in order to be able
to put the body in there. So, now do you
have any witnesses? Do you have any farm hands, anybody
that's working in the in the orchard area that could
be witnesses? Seeing how I saw so and so coming
in and you know they had a tractor with them
(13:45):
dragging something behind it or whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
Go to Paul, Go to page page fourteen. Paul, this
is a scene and you know you can see in
the caption what they're saying, and this might give you
a good example of a good explanation for how soft
the dirt is. Tell me what you see they end
up having to do this several more times. How are
they trying to locate these bodies according to this photo
(14:10):
or this body or any more bodies?
Speaker 2 (14:12):
I'm looking at the photograph which is taken looks down
a dirt road that is lined on both sides with
I'm assuming our fruit trees. I can see what appears
to be a car, possibly a law enforcement vehicle from
that era, down in the backdrop, and then along sort
(14:34):
of the road itself, where you know, a typical thing
where you see two tire tracks, you know, and then
you have some vegetation in the middle, and then there's
two men in essence dressed in white T shirts, you know,
jeans are similar, and shoes and each one of them
is holding I'm gonna just describe it as a rod
(14:56):
like object. Well, I know exactly what that is. That
is a probe. And so one of the ways that
we would use to find a body is you'd have
a metal rod that's pointed at the thing so you
can actually push it down into the ground. And oftentimes
you would have it'd be like t shaped up up
(15:16):
at top where you could grab it and put your
weight behind it to press this down into the ground. Well,
if there is a grave in the area, you get
a feel for how hard the ground is the deeper
you go. But if you find an area where it
seems hard, and all of a sudden, the probe just
goes poomp. You found an area in which the dirt
(15:39):
the ground underneath is less dense, and this could indicate
a grave location, or you know, you could potentially have
just gone into a body, you know, but that's what
these probe devices are used, or how they are used.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
Let me give you another example. A lot of the
photos that we have are wonderful, but they're kind of described.
I think they're conflating a lot of these orchards together, okay,
what I'm used to with, and people might correct me
here with modesto or these sort of beautiful, really kind
of clean looking smallish almond trees, and they're perfectly lined,
(16:20):
and I could never see somebody bearying a body there
or keeping a body anyway. You know, it's not they're
not secluded. So why don't you take a look at
page thirteen, And I think that this is kind of
an example not only of a grave but also the
seclusion of it. I guess these are not as clean,
(16:40):
you know, it looks pretty secluded. And this is a
peach orchard.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
Yeah, you know, I'm actually very familiar you know, with
like the almond orchards. You drive down, you know, from
northern California, southern California, and you see all these almond orchards.
You know, familiar with modesto. I know exactly what you're
talking about. In this photo. It is a photo which
is showing a group of individuals. I'm not entirely sure
(17:07):
they don't all look law enforcement. But there is a
grave in the dirt. You see pile, you know, dirt
that has been piled up on one side of this
I at this point I can't tell you if they
dug this grave as part of searching for victims, or
this was another one of these pre dug graves that
(17:27):
the offender had dug and now they're looking at that.
But to your point, the backdrop, you see the vegetation
behind the individuals in this photograph, and it appears that
this location is visibility of this location is probably quite restricted,
you know. And so now that could potentially explain how
(17:50):
an offender could get into maybe an operating peach orchard
and be able to dig a grave and then come
back with a body and fill that, you know, basically
bury the body.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
Let's look at one more photo, because we talked about
evidence that would be important, maybe buried with the body.
So I don't know if this photo is connected directly
with who will turn out to be, you know, our
first victim. But I thought you would be interested in
looking how at looking at I guess at how they're
collecting evidence. So look Paul on page eleven. It technically
(18:24):
is a different spot, but I'm a look at the
method is what I'm getting at.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Right, So what I'm looking at is a photograph of
three men. One appears to be just standing off to
the side. He's the supervisor. And then you see you.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
See saff.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
You see the the two men that drew the short
straw with screens and this is where the dirt is
being sifted for evidence. So as dirt is being brought
up out of the grave, that dirt needs to go
through this sifting process. And oftentimes you're using different size
(19:05):
screens from large to smaller ones, which allow you to
be able to find larger items, and then of course
you may have to find smaller items. And this sifting
process is great for just general physical evidence. Let's say
you know the killer threw a cigarette butt into the gravesite,
(19:26):
and this is how you can find a cigarette, But
right now I don't know what the condition of these
bodies are. So sometimes if you have skeletal remains, the
sifting process is necessary to find the small bones, the
victim's teeth, depending if there's dismemberment or there's been, you know,
some sort of trauma to the body. So it's truly
(19:47):
an archaeological dig. It takes a lot of effort and
a lot of time to competently and adequately dig up
a body and process that crime scene for evidence.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
What do you think about the space in between? I
was looking at the mash the screen that they were using,
and I was saying, that seems kind of big, but
maybe it will catch what they needed to catch if
there's anything in there.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
So you're asking about the size of the screen size itself.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Yeah, like of the holes in between, like, wouldn't teeth
fall through those? I'm sort of thing, what are they
really looking for?
Speaker 2 (20:23):
At least with what I can see in this photograph,
it looks like they are dealing with a screen that
has about I would say a quarter inch opening, And
so this would be good for recovering just general physical evidence,
recovering bone fragments, and it does allow the passage of
(20:45):
the smaller particles of dirt and stuff. So now you
can start to visualize. You know, not only do you
have rocks or clumps of dirt that don't pass through,
but this is where you can see the evidence that
gets caught up with this size screen. Now, if you
are finding things which appears, let's say this was a
situation where a body's been burned basically almost cremated, and
(21:08):
now the body's been crushed up, and you really really
want those teeth in addition to recovering whatever bone fragments
are there. Then you need to follow up which you
screen with at this size screen with a smaller size screen.
But you can only go so small because at a
certain point the dirt doesn't pass through, it just clumps
(21:30):
into the screen. And then I ran into a situation
where we're finding skeletal remains out in the two leys
out off of the Sacramento River delta, and so we
had mud that we had to screen, and so now
we had to have running water. So when we put
the mud into the screen, and now you have water,
you know, to get the small particle to clay and
(21:52):
crap through the screen so you can see do I
have any bone in this massive mud.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
Yeah, well this seems like a nightmare scene to me.
They find a tire track, a wide truck tire track,
and they make a plaster cast. Is that something that
we do today? Is it useful in any way? Well?
Speaker 2 (22:13):
Yeah, you know, there's of course when you're dealing with
impression evidence out at a crime scene. It could be shoes,
it could be tires. There's there's steps that you take
in terms of documenting it, and photography with oblique lighting
from multiple angles is really really good. But then we
would use a dental stone, which is really this fine
(22:36):
particulate powder that you mix with water and then you
pour into the impression like the tire impression, allow that
to harden, and so in essence you are walking away
with an exact replication of that impression evidence. And so
this is what your tire. We had a guy that
was an expert in shoes and tires, and so he
(22:58):
has the photographs with the lighting from different angles, and
he actually has the tire impression in the dental stone
to be able to compare to any suspect vehicle tires
that are submitted.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
Hmm. Well, I mean I was thinking this is an orchard.
Doesn't everybody have a truck around here, But well, we'll see.
This is helpful.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
Yeah, but that's important though. You know, you need to
know what is you know, commonly operating in this area
and then what potentially kind of doesn't look like it belongs.
If something like that is there and it's right by
the grave, then you'd probably focus in on that evidence. Yep.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
Okay. So the deputy sheriff is helpful in many ways,
including he is able to identify our victim. His name
is Kenneth Kenney white Acre. The deputy sheriff knows him
because he's a wanderer. He calls him a wanderer transient.
Kenny was just somebody who was passing through town. I
don't think he broke the law, and that's how the
(23:55):
deputy sheriff knows. I just think the deputy sheriff's job
is to know when strain come through town. So Kenny
came through. He had only recently come into the area
from Palo Alto. He did have multiple arrests from public
intoxication and robbery, and he had kind of gone back
and forth between Washington State and California because he had
(24:17):
some family there and he also had been a truck
driver at one point. So there's the victim. I have
a description of the injuries that happened to him. I'm
assuming you'd like to know that next. Absolutely, Kenny had
been stabbed on the left side of his chest, piercing
(24:40):
his lung and severing the aorta. And so this was
about eight to ten inches through the chest. There's a
cut behind the fifth finger on his right hand, described
as a chop style, a chopped type wound. There's a
knife slice on the right wrist that penetrates to the bone,
slash on his left cheek, multiple head wounds, largest of
(25:04):
which was four inches long and deep, cutting to the
skull and into the cranial vault. And in this report,
the physician estimated that the weapon was a eight to
ten inch long blade. Let me stop there and then
we'll talk about stuff that was found on the body,
like just evidence from the body.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
Sure, well, at least the injuries to his hands, that
sounds consistent with defensive wounds. So the victim is aware
he's being attacked, he's trying to ward off this offender
who's armed with a knife. This four inch long sounds
like an incisive injury, but it also penetrates through the skull.
(25:47):
You know. That's a significant amount of force, you know.
And I've got one poor victim. The knife was embedded
inside his head and it was left by the offender there.
So knives will go through skull, you know. But this
is indicating that the offender is attacking this victim. The
victim is aware. And then ultimately, you know, the fatal
(26:08):
stab wound going into I think you said the chest
into the aorta, you know. And so now once the
aorta is penetrated like that, it's possible the victim bleeds
out internally, very very quickly.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
Well, they are searching his body and in the pocket,
the deputy sheriff finds what he says is homosexual literature.
For the audio audience, I'm using quotes homosexual literature. We
don't hear about this again. You know, we're wondering. We
have a new researcher, Allison, and she's wondering if this
(26:43):
even really if the size love The deputy sheriff didn't
really know what he was talking about because it's not
wrought up later on, but that's what they say is
on him. And then you know, I have a little
bit of a timeline, but that's basically it. You know,
he's just somebody who wants It doesn't seem like he
(27:03):
was somebody who worked on the orchard. But I asked
Alison to look a little bit deeper into access because
I know you're going to ask about access, and the
orchard essentially is accessible to anybody. There are multiple roads.
It's not hard to get into. We can see how
isolated it is. He might or he might not have
worked on the orchard, but it wouldn't have been difficult
(27:25):
for somebody to get there. And maybe he was eating peaches.
It's a peach orchard, you know.
Speaker 2 (27:30):
Sure, you know if he's if he's a wanderer and
you know, needing some food. But okay, so this homosexual literature,
this is nineteen seventy one. Things that are popping into
my head. Is this a you know, something that had
limited distribution. Can this be traced back to a particular
location in town or to maybe some other location outside
(27:53):
of Yuba. Is it consistent with what is known about
the victim? You know, part of my concern is there
there's a possibility that this is staged, that the offender
planted this this homosexual literature in a way to at
that point in time, disparage who the victim was, you know,
(28:16):
to throw and throw law enforcement off of you know,
whatever leads. The timeline I think is also going to
be important because we know we have a predug grave.
So when was this grave doug relative to the last
time the victim was seen alive. You know, it was
this particular victim targeted, and you know, the grave is dug,
(28:41):
then the victim is is lured to a location. I'm
assuming there's no evidence that the victim was killed at
the grave.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
Site, no evidence of that from what I can.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
See, so he killed elsewhere. And then the offender already
has the grave ready to go so he can dump
the body, push the dirt in, and get out of
there pretty quick. You know. So that would indicate that
the offender had pre selected the victim. You know, is
a relationship between the two. So there's there's sort of questions,
and I think that's the next thing I'd want to
(29:11):
know is, you know, what timeline do we have about
this victim? And I know with a wandering type of victim,
it's probably scant.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
Here's the timeline for what happened with Kenny the day before.
So there were a lot of interviews with community members
and this is what they say. Now, remember this is
a guy who hasn't been in Ubi City very long.
It's like he has family there. The day before they
discover his grave, Kenny was seen at one o'clock in
(29:41):
the afternoon in Tierra Bueno, which is between Uba City
and Sutter. Then six and a half hours to seven
and a half hours later people see him walking back
toward Ubas City. So that's at night, seven thirty, eight
thirty at night. On the day of the murder, he
was seen at nine o'clock in the morning and he
(30:02):
seemed to be heading back to the Bay area where
his siblings lived. So the last time people saw him
was nine am when his body was discovered later in
the day by the farmer.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Is he hitchhiking?
Speaker 1 (30:16):
You know, he must have been hitchhiking. It doesn't say,
but how else how would he have gotten back to
the bay area. Would he be walking?
Speaker 2 (30:24):
I mean, that's that's a long walk.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
That's a maybe the train, maybe hopped a train or something.
I don't know what he was doing.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
Potentially hitchhiking nineteen seventy one. Hitchhiking, of course, was a big,
big thing that was just common. Now this is interesting
because at least with his timeline so nine am on
the morning that he's literally found in a grave later
on that day, Yep, he's trying to get down to
(30:50):
the Bay area. And I'm gonna say he's hitch hiking
or something, but he's a victim of opportunity. How would
an offender have known, you know, with Kenneth his move
movement pattern like this, I have to consider the possibility
that we've got an offender that is out there literally
trolling for victims. Just just like you have an offender
(31:13):
that is going into a stroll area where sex workers
are just trying to find somebody. This could potentially be
an offender that is going, Okay, here's a guy that
needs a ride and I've got and this offender wants
to do something to this man. Maybe it's of sexual nature,
that's part. He's a fantasy motivated offender and he's already
(31:35):
dug the grave and he's going to try to get
this you know, victim isolated to do whatever and kill
him and dump him in the grave. And you know
this this comes into you know, even though Kenneth is clothed,
you know, is there a possibility that there was sexual
interaction between this offender and Kenneth? And did they actually
(31:58):
consider that? Chances are eineteen seventy one with a fully
closed mail victim, probably not. But you know that's just
something that's now. You know that that packet, that homosexual
literature packet or flyer or whatever it is, that might
be really significant to the offender himself, Like this could
(32:20):
be something that the offender either planted or maybe the
victim is somebody that exchanges you know, sexual acts with
men for money or for drugs, whatever, you know, whatever
his payment aspect is.
Speaker 1 (32:37):
This book or whatever it was a pamphlet doesn't come
up later on in the story at all, but the
media does talk about it. So there's there's some churn there.
But it's also the media. You know, how we work
in the media. We pick up on the most salacious
things sometimes and amplify it. Sure, but I do think
it's important to keep that in mind. So two days later,
(32:59):
as investigating Kenny's case, the Cutter County Sheriff's Department gets
a tip from an officer in nearby Marysville, and so
two days later there is an assault that happened. There's
a survivor, but there's an assault that happens. The vicious
nature of this assault in Marysville reminds the sheriff there
(33:22):
of the vicious nature of what happened with Kenny. So
I'll tell you what happened. The folks investigating Kenny's murder
get a tip two days later because this was such
a vicious murder, it reminded somebody in a different area,
not far from ubis city, of an assault that happened
(33:43):
the year before. What happens is is February twenty fifth
of nineteen seventy and at one o'clock in the morning,
there's a man named Jose Romero Rea, and someone at
a bar slash restaurant had beaten him and cut him
with a meat cleaver at the restaurants called Guadalajara Restaurant
(34:03):
and Cafe. Police describe the injuries with the meat cleavers
so severe that they said, quote, the brain was leaking
from one cut to the top of the head. And
he survives this This guy, I mean, that just seems
unsurvivable to me, But maybe not.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
Yeah, it all depends on what was what damage was done. Yeah,
you know, we have people shot in the head and
they survive and are able to live a decent life afterwards.
So is there any indication in terms of I mean,
was Rea just attacked randomly while at this restaurant or
did he get into some sort of argument with another male?
(34:40):
You know, is this like a bar fight gone bad.
Speaker 1 (34:42):
There's not a lot of information on that assault and
what the motive was. But they did clear the owner,
Natividad Corona, who had been there, and there was a
patron who did the attack in the bathroom and then left.
I doubt he brought a meat cleaver with him, but
I assume that, you know, this was something that the
(35:03):
offender got at the restaurant, but this tip came in
and this is something that happened a year earlier. I
think it was the meat cleaver aspect of it that
tipped everybody off. And so you know, they just keep
that in mind for right now what happened in Marysville. Sure, Okay,
now we're five days after Kinney's body has been found.
(35:25):
We're at a different orchard. We've gone from peaches to prunes,
I'm not a big fan of prunes. Do you like prunes?
Speaker 2 (35:31):
I think I've had them once in my life. Maybe
I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (35:35):
Don't give me any hate, you guys if you love prunes.
I've never gotten into prunes, which is weird because I
love plums. I love grapes, hate raisins. So explain all.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
That, you know, kind of kind of the same, I
guess really, I can't remember the last time I ate raisins.
Speaker 1 (35:55):
I'm a raisin fan. But anyway, so now we're on
a prune orchard and we're to talk about a picture
in a second, So get your hand ready for the
picture section here, because I want you to see the vastness.
I've seen big orchards, but these are massive. So this
is a different place. It's called Sullivan Ranch, and this
(36:15):
is where we have a lot of activity happening. There
is a tractor driver named Ernesto Garcia, and he's on
the ranch. He works for the ranch. This is five
miles north of Yuba City and it's May twenty fourth.
He's breaking there's another piece of info for you. He's
breaking up the soil on the prune orchard and he
sees a large indentation in the ground between the seventh
(36:36):
and eighth rows. He thinks that the farm hand responsible
for irrigating the area skipped a row, and so you know,
somebody wasn't doing their job, and there's an indentation, but
the ground is soft and there's a shallow depression which
is about six feet by two or three feet deep.
So I think there's no doubt that we've got a
(36:58):
connection here. Next day, Garcia alerts his foreman, who is
a guy named Ray Deron. I thought the next day,
why did he not alert somebody sooner? But Garcia actually
waited because it was late in the day when he
saw this indentation, and he had hoped that the foreman
might say, oh, yeah, this is you know, this was
(37:19):
a new game plan. Don't worry about it, and he
didn't want to look like he was being paranoid, even
though word had gotten around about what happened at the
previous orchard. So he sees this thing and he goes,
they can't be connected. There's no way. So then Deran,
the foreman, contact detectives. They show up and in less
(37:41):
than ten minutes, than coover a decomposed body. The person
is wearing mismatched clothing, two pairs of pants, a plaid shirt,
a sweater, a suit coat, and one shoe. He is
in his sixties, he's a white man. And then I've
got the injuries, but you can imagine they're probably pretty consistent.
(38:02):
So you know, what do you think about this so
far different?
Speaker 2 (38:05):
Orchard? Well, it's interesting. So, you know, first addressing the
indentation and the body is decomposed, I'm wondering if that
body had been buried there for a significant period of
time and as the body decomposed, now what you have
is the dirt that's on top of the body ends
up kind of compressing the body as the body is decomposing,
(38:28):
and so what may have been level land before as
that body decomposed, in essence, the dirt sunk down and
now revealed the location of this grave site. That's one possibility.
The mismatched clothing on the victim, you know. The two
thoughts on that is, again, are you dealing with a
(38:50):
transient victim who you know, is just wearing clothing wherever
he could find articles of clothing, and is just that's
what he's got on? But I think there's all so
the possibility of this victim is being redressed by the offender,
and the offender has access, for whatever reason, to these
articles of clothing. Two pants, a suit coat, one what
(39:13):
was it, one shoe or one boot. You know, that
is odd, So at least that's what you know I
can kind of discern from now. But obviously there's got
to be strong suspicion that this case is connected to
the previous case, even though it's in a different orchard.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
So the person who did the autopsy is a guy
named doctor Clement. He says there is a stab to
this man's chest that is so powerful it shatters the
fifth rib and cuts into the left lung. His face
is slashed on both sides, and there is a third
cut at the nape of the neck. At the morgue
(39:54):
they find matches and a couple of Safeway receipts dated
May eighth. This is May twenty fifth, so you know,
a couple of weeks ago, a box of snuff and
two bars of soap, and a razor. So this man
seems to be definitely a transient somebody who's kind of
come in, a worker who's come in and come out
(40:14):
of town. Doctor Clement says that the cause of death
is strangulation. The extent to which his bronchial tubes are
filled with blood, however, make it impossible to determine whether
the chest or the head wounds were more lethal. Okay,
And the decomposition of the body places the time of
death at one or two weeks earlier. And the victim's
(40:37):
name turns out to be Charles Fleming. So if they're right,
and you need to tell me first if you think
that they could be right. If they're right, this man,
Charles Fleming is killed before Kenney was killed. And remember
this is seventy five degree, whether that's kind of it.
Speaker 2 (40:54):
Well as far as the injuries, you know, if the
pathologist is saying cause of death is strained, then he
is seeing evidence and evaluating the neck that there's either
hemorrhaging and the strap muscles of the neck and there's
you know, hyoid bone has been broken. There's a furrow
(41:14):
around his neck. You know, if there's a ligature that
had been employed at some point, maybe there's petikias still
present within the eyes, but the state of decomposition might
prevent him from seeing that. I'm a little bit concerned
with the emphasis on the amount of blood in these victims'
lungs and that he basically drowned in his own blood.
I don't think a pathologist would misinterpret, you know, but
(41:37):
is there is it asphyxial, you know, versus strangulation. But
I'm I'm just going to assume this pathologist knows what
they're doing, and so he's seeing evidence that, yes, this
victim is strangled. But then the stab wound into the
left lung, the one that fractured the fifth rib. Now
you've got the bleeding internally, and you see this where
(41:57):
now victims are literally they're struggling to breathe, they're coughing
up blood, and you start to see this what we
call expiratory patterns of blood as they are just struggling
to get air in. It's miserable. I can't imagine going
through something like that. However, from a sequence standpoint, it
(42:18):
seems more logical that this victim is being attacked with
the knife first, and then once the victim is starting
to succumb to those injuries, the offender is finishing the
victim off with the strangulation. That is what I would
guess is the sequence of how that happened. Kind of
the finding of the matches. The receipts. Those receipts are huge.
(42:43):
You know. It sounds like Fleming is alive on May
eighth and is somehow is contacted by the offender after
that date. State of decomposition would probably suggest relatively soon,
in a few days after that May eighth the date,
But it also tends to suggest he is more of
(43:03):
a transient type with the razor, so, you know, kind
of similar victimology to the first victim.
Speaker 1 (43:12):
Yep, why don't you go to your photos real quick
and look on page two. I want you to see
this flipping ranch. It's four hundred to six hundred acres.
I just if I were a deputy, I would look
at this and say, because now they feel like this
is obviously a multiple murderer at this point. So I mean,
can you imagine trying to do a grid search or
(43:34):
anything on this land?
Speaker 2 (43:37):
Well, you know, obviously, yes, this I'm looking at it
appears to be an aero photograph showing sort of the
primary structures on the ranch, maybe a residence, maybe some
barns for housing tractors and stuff. But on either side
of where the structures are located, you can just see
the sprawl of a very organized orchard, kind of like
(43:58):
how you're describing the Medesta so almond orchards, that's what
this looks like. And so yes, you know, if now
the thought is, okay, we've got another buried body, how
many more bodies are out here? The size of this
this orchard, if we're going to restrict ourselves to just
this orchard, yes, that would take a very very long
(44:20):
time to search. However, it's because of the spacing of
the trees. There's sort of a convenience aspect. You can utilize,
you know, the row and column aspect of the trees
to organize your search pattern. If you find something, you're
able to very quickly designate, you know where that whatever
(44:43):
you found, where that's located on this orchard, and you
can easily walk through these trees. You know, when I've
had to do some searching, oftentimes I'm having to push through.
I can think one case where I'm pushing through poison
oak on the side of a hill. I'd much rather
search this orchard then go, you know, hunt, you know,
for other bodies in poison oak.
Speaker 1 (45:04):
This is such a large space. But you're right, I mean,
you could be a lot more organized on this kind
of land.
Speaker 2 (45:11):
It's easy for dogs to run through this.
Speaker 1 (45:13):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely, and different than the Peach Orchard. Seemed
like a huge mess, but let's continue on. So they
stay and look around because of course they fear that
there are more bodies out there, and I'm assuming that
there are people at the Peach Orchard who are also
looking for more bodies there. Around six o'clock on the
(45:33):
twenty fifth, same day, they discover a clearing near the
Feather River on the Sullivan Ranch and I have a
photo of that if you want to see that. And
the clearing is another grave. There is also something we
haven't seen yet, which is a fifteen to sixteen yard
blood trail that leads across a road to a red,
(45:55):
blood soaked patch of dry grass in the Prune Orchard.
And there's dirt that's been sprinkled on the grass and
attempt to cover the blood, and there are shovel marks
on the access road. And I had wondered if that's
what happened with the first two, that those are actually
the murder scenes, but he managed to cover up with
loose dirt and stuff.
Speaker 2 (46:16):
Well, yeah, this third grave, you know, with the blood
trail and then what sounds like, you know, blood pooled blood.
That would suggest, yes, you have a victim that's been killed,
was laying at that location for some period of time
and has then moved, leaving that blood trail over to
where the grave is. And if you are seeing that,
(46:40):
this sounds very recent. You know, we think about the
dirt that's out there. You know, that blood is sticky.
You know, as the dirt gets blown, you know a
lot of the blood is going to just get covered
up by that dirt is going to you know, that
dirt's going to stick to it. I'm somewhat surprised, but
maybe not totally that the offender is isolating the victims
(47:04):
out in his orchards and this is where he's killing
them and burying them. But with the first one though,
that that grave. You know, unless unless the offender and
the victim, you know, the offender's got a knife to
the victim's throat telling him to shut up as the
witness you know, goes by, you know, it would suggest
that he's pre planning the location and where he's going
(47:26):
to bring the victims, at least for body disposal. But
it sounds like in this case he brought the victim
to the location where he's disposing the body, but the
victim is alive, and then he kills the victim. Here,
why is he killing the victim? Is this is this robbery?
But I think you potentially are looking at a fantasy
motivated offender. There may be a sexual aspect to what
(47:46):
this offender is getting from his interactions with these males.
Speaker 1 (47:51):
Well, let's keep going. You know, they find a shoe print,
they make a plaster cast in the grave with this
latest person. They find a cigarette, but a small dark
feather and two folded receipts, and you know, of course
when we say resipts, so that's that's you know, maybe
it'll be part of this timeline. They don't think it's
something that's going to be key because they look at
(48:14):
the body and it's very clear to the pathologist that
these are wounds that had been inflicted in the last
twenty four hours. Okay, he said that is very clear.
Is that based on the blood clotting or.
Speaker 2 (48:26):
What well, it's going to be based off of his
assessment of the condition of the body, Like you said,
you know, we're talking about you know, seventy five degree
temperatures during the day, it's going to drop to cooler
temperatures at night. You're putting a body into a ground
that is going to be cool, you know, So the
body is being preserved somewhat. Now, twenty four hours later,
(48:50):
the pathologist is going to be taking a look at well,
is there any rigor present? You know, do I have
full rigor do I have partial rigor. He's assessing the temperatures,
the location, you know, the body in essences in a
I wouldn't call it a refrigerated state, but is in
a somewhat of a cooled state. But when he's looking
at these wounds, he's not necessarily able to gauge, oh,
(49:11):
you know, this wound was inflicted five hours ago versus
twenty four hours ago. He's taken in the totality of
what he is seeing and saying, this is a fresh kill.
Speaker 1 (49:20):
Okay, Well, let me tell you about the victim. They
identify him. He's a white male, he's fifty nine. His
name is Milford Sample, and he has nine fingers, which
I don't think comes into play, but there you go.
He has been stabbed in the left chest, has a large,
deep cut in the back of the head. The wounds
appear to have been inflicted within the last twenty four hours.
(49:41):
As I said, cause of death according to this physician
is a skull fracture, massive compound right temporal parietal bone.
Does this fit in with the same pattern, you know.
Speaker 2 (49:52):
To a lesser or a greater extent, But fundamentally the
offender is using sharp edged weapon, maybe a meat cleaver,
you know something where you've got this what sounds like
a deep cut to the back of the head. Then
you also have the skull fractures, which at least there's
not enough in what you provided to say. Is there
(50:12):
is that a result of some sort of bludgeoning, you know,
so maybe or it could be a stomping. It almost
sounds like this victim, you know, was this somewhat of
a surprise attack. You know where the victims, you know,
the standing out there in the orchard, and now you
have the offender says, you know, hey, what's that over there,
and then pulls out a meat cleaver and brings it
(50:36):
down into the back of his head. Fully clothed. It
says it, yes, okay, all the victims are white males.
This victim, do we know is he also transient he is.
And so I think, you know, going back to when
you first started talking about this case and talking about
(50:56):
offenders targeting victims that when be noticed if they go missing. Right,
So this offender is praying on a certain population, purposely
praying on a certain population, and this is a population
that doesn't have financial resources. Robbery does not seem to
be this offender's motive. And now I'm thinking, Okay, we
(51:18):
do have a serial predator that's either he's sexually motivated,
fantasy induced, or maybe he's I'll use this term missionary.
He's got a mission. He has maybe a personal philosophy
that somehow these men are representative of being opposed to
(51:39):
what this offender's philosophy is.
Speaker 1 (51:42):
We've talked about this kind of case before, where you
have people who kind of had a vendetta essentially, and
they're seeking revenge. So we'll have to see where we
land on this one. Okay, So now we have as
far as victims, we have Kenny, then we have an
assault on Jose, who doesn't die but has massive facial
and brain injuries from the attack. We've got Charles Fleming,
(52:07):
and then we go to when we go to Feather river.
We have Milford sample, and now they're going to continue
to spread out because they feel like this is a
hot spot. And they are right in five hundred yards.
The surrounding five hundred yards, they find four more graves.
There's one that's one hundred yards north and a cluster
(52:28):
of three victims less than four hundred yards south of
the first grave. And some of these are John Doe's
I can tell you about you know some of these.
I mean, we be here all day talking about this,
but everything is very similar. So we've got four more graves.
There is a white John Doe number one. He's been
(52:49):
bludgeoned to death. His shirt and sweatshirt are pulled up
over his face. In his arm, he's not wearing pants,
and his penis is exposed. It appears that he had
been dragged to his grave. And then I can tell
you about the three other that were You have three
other victims that were kind of in a cluster a
little south of where this initial grave was. We've got
(53:11):
three middle aged white men, Donald Smith, John Haluca, and
another John Doe, John Doe number two. So Smith, the
first guy has his shirt and sweatshirt pulled up over
his face. And arm, and nothing on John than the
man in the center. But the third body was extremely decomposed.
(53:32):
They've all been stabbed in the chest and cleaved in
the back of their heads. And John Doe too is
naked from the waist down. Everybody is a is a
you know, a worker, transient.
Speaker 2 (53:43):
Worker, sure, you know. And I think that that kind
of answers the question. There's there's a sexual component to
what the offender is doing to these victims. So he's
he's a serial predator, fantasy motivated.
Speaker 1 (53:57):
Well, let's talk about where these guys are from real quick.
So Smith and Heluca are you know, workers that have
been on orchards. But they're pretty different. Smith was from Kansas.
He was on his own on the road for a
very long time. He had ninety seven arrests for drunkenness
and misdemeanors. Haluca had kept himself, He didn't drink, He
(54:18):
kept his money in his pocket. But you know, they're
on orchards and that's the common denominator, right. He said
he kept money in his pocket to avoid being arrested
for vagrancy, to be able to prove he had money.
Speaker 2 (54:29):
It sounds like, yeah, well, obviously the offender is comfortable
around these orchards. There's a reason why the offender is
choosing orchards versus maybe more remote locations. You've got these
these four additional victims being found, and one of the
victims is severely decomposed. So now that might provide some
(54:52):
sequence information in terms of the order in which you know,
these various cases occurred, you know, and then we go
back to the Marysville bar that happened a year prior
to the start of these bodies being found, and that
may be related. You know, I think it is significant
that in that case, that's the only non white male
(55:16):
that is being attacked, and that was a Hispanic mail
I'm assuming just based off of the name. You know,
it comes down to, you know, who is that patron
that attacked that guy in that restaurant, you know, and
can you investigate whether or not he has any role
in these homicides that are occurring on the orchards.
Speaker 1 (55:37):
Well, let me give you a couple of more victims here.
It just keeps going. It's seven forty five pm that night,
it's starting to rain, but the detectives just found two
more graves, different states of decomposition and they're laid foot
to foot near a fork in the road that leads
back to the main part of this Sullivan ranch. There
(55:58):
are two sixty two old men and one of them
had his pants pulled down. They've both been stabbed and
cleaved like the other ones, both white.
Speaker 2 (56:07):
And then they're buried right next to each other.
Speaker 1 (56:10):
Yeah, their foot to foot is what it said, near
a road that leads back to the main road of
the ranch. What does that mean? And it sounds like
very decomposed.
Speaker 2 (56:19):
So but they're saying two different states of decomposition. Sounds
like they're killed at different times versus both of them
are killed at the same time and buried. So this,
you know, there's a certain I think because there's a
cluster of three bodies that were near each other that
you said before. You know, this is interesting just because
I go to the Green River killer case where Gary
(56:41):
Ridgeway purposefully put women's bodies in clusters, and when he
was interviewed, the reason he did that is so he
could remember where he had put them and he would
go back and visit these women's bodies. And I'm not
going to go into any details what he was doing
with some of these women's bodies. But this is where
(57:01):
you know, I'm starting to wonder in this case. You know,
are these gray sites so near each other because these
are good body disposal areas and the offenders taking advantage
of that, or is the offender got a personal reason
to put these bodies together like that?
Speaker 1 (57:17):
You know, these men are all the consistency is they
sort of belong on orchards, They've been on orchards, they've
worked on orchards before. But one of the men is
not somebody who was a worker, transit worker. He had
lived in Marysville for twenty years, and he'd been working
on orchards and he answered security checks that he was cashing.
(57:38):
He was last seen getting into a yellow looking Chevy
panel van and he picked up his last one on
my first and his friend alerted the police that there
was a missing person.
Speaker 2 (57:53):
It was a Chevy van, a yellow Chevy van that
had had panels on it. Yep, it seems quite distinctive.
This is a clue that I'm sure the investigators started
marching down on Yep.
Speaker 1 (58:07):
Yeah. So now we're at twelve ten am and after
multiple hours of unearthing victims in the rain, they find
three more but they're exhausted, and they said, we have
to be done for tonight, and so you know, they
end up leaving the three graves for the next day.
So this is all happening in one day, and I
(58:30):
lost count of how many they discovered. I mean maybe
six or seven I think in one day.
Speaker 2 (58:37):
In one day. Yeah, No, that's you know, they made
the right call trying to you know, first, I think
with this type of crime scene, once it starts to rain,
I think you're done. I think you have to call
it a day and just wait. The worst for evidence,
the worst for documentation, et cetera, is trying to process.
(59:00):
I'm seen in the rain, and then when you now
get into where it's now nighttime. I don't care how
good your lights are. You know that you erect out there,
it's not as good as sunshine. Yeah. So in essence,
you know, they probably worked longer than they should have,
but there's no reason to continue. They're making the right calls.
(59:21):
Let's do this right when we can see and hopefully
the rain has stopped in the morning.
Speaker 1 (59:26):
Yeah, because they're not going to become suddenly more decomposed
or lose anything there if they're buried on that land,
they're safely buried for twelve hours.
Speaker 2 (59:36):
Yeah. I, in fact, I had a case I at
least started digging up a woman's body on Hell's Angels property.
This is within a year of me retiring, and I
remember arguing with the homicide investigator because I said, no,
we're done. This is a this is a body, and
we're going to get the crime lab out here to
do a proper dig in the morning. And this guy
(59:58):
was lighting me up. We're going to lose evidence. This
sounds like, no, you're not. Nothing is going to change
between now and in the morning, and all we're going
to do is screw things up if we keep doing
this in the middle of the night.
Speaker 1 (01:00:11):
Well, that's obviously smart. And it seems like we have
investigators who have it together because we do have a suspect.
You're right, it is connected to the assault that happened
the year before, and you know, we will talk about
that and we will talk about sort of the ending
(01:00:31):
and how many bodies they end up discovering next week.
Speaker 2 (01:00:34):
Okay, well, I look forward to it. This is a
fascinating case.
Speaker 1 (01:00:38):
Good, I know, a good serial killer case. You love them.
I'm spoiling you need to I need to pace myself
a little bit better.
Speaker 2 (01:00:44):
Wow, this is great.
Speaker 1 (01:00:45):
Thanks Kate, Okay bye. This has been an exactly right
production for.
Speaker 2 (01:00:53):
Our sources and show notes go to exactly Rightmedia dot
com slash Buried Bones sources.
Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
Our senior producer is Alexis Emirosi.
Speaker 2 (01:01:01):
Research by Alison Trumble and Kate Winkler Dawson.
Speaker 1 (01:01:04):
Our mixing engineer is Ben Tolliday.
Speaker 2 (01:01:07):
Our theme song is by Tom Bryfogel.
Speaker 1 (01:01:09):
Our artwork is by Vanessa Lilac.
Speaker 2 (01:01:12):
Executive produced by Karen Kilgarriff, Georgia hard Stark, and Danielle Kramer.
Speaker 1 (01:01:16):
You can follow Buried Bones on Instagram and Facebook at
Buried Bones pod.
Speaker 2 (01:01:21):
Kate's most recent book, All That Is Wicked, a Gilded
Age story of murder and the race to decode the
criminal mind, is available now.
Speaker 1 (01:01:28):
And Paul's best selling memoir Unmasked, My life Solving America's
Cold Cases is also available now.
Speaker 2 (01:01:35):
Listen to Baried Bones on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hosts And Creators
Kate Winkler Dawson
Paul Holes
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