All Episodes

September 29, 2025 46 mins

Paging Doctor Teddy! The episode you’ve been asking for is finally here! Grey’s Anatomy fan favorite Kim Raver “calls it what it is” with Camilla and Jessica, revealing secrets from our favorite fictional hospital, including which castmates bonded on screen and off.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Mark as Played
Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Call It What It Is with Jessica Capshaw and Camille Luddington,
an iHeartRadio podcast.

Speaker 2 (00:18):
Well, Hello, Hello, Hello, Hello.

Speaker 3 (00:21):
Holly crew, and welcome to another episode of Call It.

Speaker 1 (00:25):
Call It. It's a very special one.

Speaker 2 (00:28):
It's a super dubler.

Speaker 3 (00:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:31):
Yeah, I feel like, I mean, I don't want to
jink stuff, but you know, I feel like it's just
one of those ones where you're like slam dunk at
the start.

Speaker 2 (00:38):
Absolutely.

Speaker 3 (00:39):
Well, also, we should preface us as ask and we
shall deliver. And this guest has been asked for since
we since the beginning of the podcast.

Speaker 1 (00:50):
Really, so we should start it with You're welcome.

Speaker 2 (00:52):
You're welcome everybody.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
You're welcome everyone. This is You're Welcome. Today on the podcast,
we have none other than Kim Kim.

Speaker 4 (01:03):
Ki.

Speaker 2 (01:04):
I can rave about you for this. Oh my god,
I'm so happy to be here. You guys, you're fucking
rock stars. Am I allowed to first of all swear
all the time.

Speaker 1 (01:13):
Yeah, it's so.

Speaker 2 (01:14):
Impressive what you guys are doing. And I'm so excited
to be here with the two of you. I mean,
it's a great, it's a it's a great it's just
really it's a hard thing to do to sort of
get yourself going with a second job while you're doing
a full time job. And I think it's just a
huge sort of advocation for women, which is very much
who the two of you are. So I love you.

(01:36):
I love you.

Speaker 1 (01:37):
Oh my gosh, I have a pride, have a permanent
smile on my face right now. My face kind of
hurts from smiling and goosebumps from you saying that, And
that is so exactly what I think that you would say.
And who if I know you to be and who
I believe you to be. And I just you started
talking and I got immediately transported to something I didn't
know that was coming in my brain, which was that

(01:57):
when you came to Grace, I was so excited, Like
I was so excited to have you as a friend.
And you know, when you start to work with people,
you know you're gonna work so you have that first
layer of like, oh my gosh, we're gonna work together
and is that gonna be good? And then you have
this total bonus layer, which is that you enjoy the person.

(02:18):
And I just so immediately enjoyed you, and I just
remember truly us finding ways to like could we go
to an exercise class. Could we go on a walk together?
Could we? And then we had kids around the same age,
and I just remember having so many other parts of
our lives that we would share with each other, which
was so great outside of work, but then also at

(02:39):
work and having a shorthand about when one of us
speaking of you being women and advocating for each other,
is that no matter what we do, whether we're whether
we're outside of work, we're partners, or we're parents or whatever,
we have other responsibilities while we're at work. So we're
actually we're wearing so many different hats. And it was
so great to be in conversation and relationship with someone

(03:01):
who was, you know, similarly going through things, so that
when you would be like, I don't even have words
to say, why I'm leaving this conversation for a second,
it was like you immediately give grace. You're like you go,
go go, and it would be you.

Speaker 2 (03:14):
Were you were amazing. I mean that's also another you
were so welcoming and so just like, let's dive in together.
And to be able to come to a huge show,
you know, it was really it was it was I
mean now too, but at that time, it was this,
you know, it was sort of like this new phenomenon.

(03:35):
And it's funny because I had come from twenty four
which was just sort of so male dominated, and so
to kind of walk on the set and be embraced
by so many amazing women and you were so just
effusive and inclusive and straightforward and and such an amazing

(03:56):
again like advocate. I'm just I love the two of
you so much because to be on set and to
be in this business and know that there's there's women
who have your back and who also what I love
is you guys are just so like, here it is,
here is what's happening, Let's do this, let's be friends,
let's and we And it's true. We were juggling our kids,

(04:19):
I mean, things from like swim lessons, and you're such
an amazing knowledgeable We always talk about we're like, oh,
if we don't know the answer to something, we're like, oh, well, Jessica,
We're like, Jessica, I don't know. You know, it sounds
like a simple thing, but when you're juggling full time, uh,
you know, working mom, and then you have another mom

(04:40):
who is reaching out and saying, come, I've got you
let's you know, let's be friends on set. And I
think that that's also a really beautiful thing because it's
it's it's teaching. We are teaching, and I hope and
this is what I'm I've been trying to sort of like,
you know, learn because you see sort of how women

(05:01):
interact with one another and to be able to have,
you know, I hear a lot of my friends who
have you know, younger women there's like maybe like fourteen
and sort of the culture of that. And I have
two boys, so it's a different culture, different, different sort
of scenario, and you two are really great examples of supportive,

(05:25):
inclusive and how to sort of let the shot, let
the light shine on others around you, because you know
that by lifting up others, it only brings light to
just sort of the whole group. So when when I
first came on you, I remember specific You're like, okay,
we're in let's go, which was also really great because
I felt like that also informed a really fun thing

(05:46):
for us on set, which also like what's so great
about I think our thing is we have like some
really opposite stuff. Like just now, when we were setting
up and they handed me like the earbuds, and I
was like, oh, thank you, because to switch place. I
was like, and I didn't want to say are these
someone else?

Speaker 3 (06:04):
Is?

Speaker 2 (06:04):
Am I putting them in my ears? And she's like, yeah,
that's fun, I'm putting them. And then luckily one of
the producers was like, oh no, we cleaned them, and
I was like, oh okay. But I didn't want to
like say anything. I didn't want to be a problem
where she's like, I'm so Type B and I'm like,
I'm so Type A. Show those. I get my little
leg and put them in.

Speaker 4 (06:21):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:22):
Yeah, of course she didn't.

Speaker 1 (06:23):
Well, now you're reminding me that also, the listeners always
no more than I do, Kim, I don't remember all
the things. I just don't. I can't I make room
for what I wait?

Speaker 3 (06:32):
Can I just interrupt real quick before you get into this,
because I've been sitting here listening to how welcoming Jessica was.

Speaker 2 (06:40):
I knew you were going to do this started instantly.
I just loved you and I but I just all
I'm saying is is that would have been nice? You
know what?

Speaker 1 (06:53):
Look at where we ended up.

Speaker 2 (06:55):
I'm just saying, are you if am our story or
are you pulling up like, what's your what's our our
story or our story? I don't even know how we
make friends forever? How can you me too? Well, maybe
it was through this one that one. No, it's not
because she had left. I think you guys have told

(07:17):
me this story we didn't like to. Yeah, but isn't
that what's so incredible?

Speaker 1 (07:21):
Like that's no, but I'm not.

Speaker 2 (07:23):
I'm just laughing because it just no. But I feel
like that also speaks volumes to who you guys are
and that I've learned from you guys when I talk
about like women culture and like seeing it with my
my kids friends, you know, in sixth, seventh, eighth grade
or whatever that is, and then how that expands out

(07:45):
into adult female culture. You guys have this incredible capacity
to two if you hit a roadblock, to then address
it and say I want to be better. I want
that to be better. I want And I don't know

(08:06):
what you're reasoning for getting through the Mortal Kombat or
whatever the media you said it was, but like, I mean,
I think that that is really interesting for me, you
know what I mean? For me, sometimes it's like I
get so it's like a glitch happens, and it's hard

(08:27):
to voice the problem. And that's been another thing I
think as I'm getting older, which I think is so
I'm so grateful for that. I'm like gifts, I'm not like, oh,
it's out right. It used to be kind of like
out just for a safety like what's the pull the ripcord?
Now I feel like, oh there's a glitch. I respect you,

(08:47):
I admire I might not see or do business the
way you do, but let's talk about it.

Speaker 3 (08:54):
So that also is like kudos to you, know, But
this is this is actually why I have this friendship
with both of you that I value so much. Is
that I think why this happened between Jess and I,
why we are where we're at, where we're at, is
because we're always so honest with each other. Like if
I piss her off or she pissed me off, it
hasn't really happened. I mean we've been I don't think

(09:15):
it's happened really honestly.

Speaker 1 (09:17):
It's really also, she would say, but I know she
feel like that's why we headed off. We're like if
we see it coming, yeah, I just.

Speaker 2 (09:24):
Think that we would, you'd be like, shut up, you're
making annoying.

Speaker 3 (09:27):
I just we're walking over here, and I have the
same relationship with you, and it makes friendship so much easier.

Speaker 2 (09:34):
Yes, because I don't have to seck.

Speaker 1 (09:35):
I I don't have to.

Speaker 2 (09:36):
Second guess, like what you're thinking. If you're mad at me,
I know you're gonna be like Camilla, you're driving me
right now? Shut up. I love that we have this
deep friendship and we can be totally different in moments,
and I learn from I learned from that, and I
think that that's also really cool that I I don't

(09:56):
have to either see the world or I don't know,
and you're just so unbelievably like unabashedly straightforward. And sometimes
I'm a little bit more private. And I love that
you're like, ah, it's this or that?

Speaker 1 (10:11):
Or are you also are recovering people?

Speaker 2 (10:14):
Please, sir, I just talked about this.

Speaker 1 (10:17):
Oh yeah, sorry. I mean I could also said, are
you still in people?

Speaker 3 (10:21):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (10:22):
No, I'm better at it. I'm much better at it.

Speaker 1 (10:24):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (10:26):
Yeah, I'm much better at because I remember.

Speaker 1 (10:27):
I'm thinking about moments. I don't want to be obtuse,
because I actually think that when we have these conversations,
it's almost better if we're specific. I remember a couple
of times on set, you know, like, like I said earlier,
we became fast friends. And then I remember there would
be moments on set where I mean, everyone, you have
to understand, we're working these jobs, we're raising these kids,
We've got responsibilities much like all of you, right, it's

(10:50):
we're all just doing all the best that we can.
And I remember there would be times were because became
we became fast friends, that we were in a world
that was the perceived us. And on some level, even
though I had been I got I was there before you,
I like sort of and I've talked about this before,
I kind of so I always felt new, Like even
until I I felt new on some level because I

(11:12):
wasn't the original cast, right. And I remember having a
shorthand with you where I would give you an eye
and you would give me an eye, or one of
our eyes would water up and the other one would
see it and be like we would find ways to
minister to each other in the covering of the people
pleasing like yeah, yeah, of course I can do it right, Yeah,

(11:33):
I can take that forced call, or I can do
that scene that I am having a hard time with
me or that person that that actor can act like that,
you know, in the middle of a scene, and we're
just gonna keep going and keep swimming, keep swimming because
we're like can do people. And I remember having that
being a big piece of our friendship was that I

(11:54):
could I could look at you and sort of see
a do north and be like this right, this is right,
and you would look at me and be like, yeah,
it's okay, We're gonna keep going right, Or I'd look
at you and you'd be like, I don't think this
is right?

Speaker 2 (12:08):
Right?

Speaker 3 (12:09):
What do we need to do?

Speaker 1 (12:10):
Are we taking a hard left? Are we taking a
hard right? Are we talking? Are there any parents in
the room?

Speaker 2 (12:16):
No? Completely, But I also think it's interesting also even
in the moments that you're sort of talking about, you know,
you're under stress and there's a lot going on, and
we don't know whether you've been up all night with
the kids because one is the flu or you know,
and then you're coming in and you've got like, you know,
two page monologue and the stress of that, and just
also where we've given one another and I think, you know,

(12:40):
grace and communicated through it, like, oh, we just had
a moment. That was a really hard moment. If I
am like wanting to people please, then I would keep
my mouth shut. But like I think, I think we
need to work through this in order to deepen a
friend and chip and I think that that's also okay,

(13:02):
Like I I don't think growing up, I felt that
that was sort of an option. I mean, and I know,
also you know what I mean, it's not it's not allowed. Also,
you know, just also speaking up, I mean, there's it's
interesting because right, I feel like there's a combination of
like people pleaser, but then also like I have my

(13:24):
ideas and I'm like gonna, you know, I'm taking I'm
going with them, and you know, stubborn and type A.
And I don't even it's funny. I've never even said
I'm Type A, but I guess I am, right, am.

Speaker 1 (13:36):
I I feel like your type A.

Speaker 2 (13:37):
I think, yeah, she's someone's there laughing because I was like,
can we clean these earbus? Whose ears have these been in? Right?
I think type A? Yeah, I don't think your type B. No,
your type B.

Speaker 3 (13:51):
You're kidding?

Speaker 1 (13:52):
Are you kidding? She's a slot?

Speaker 2 (13:54):
When do you pack for a flight? That's how I
know it all depends because I'm a super multitasker, like I,
if I have to, I can. It's also my boarding
school days where I could literally you could tell me
what is your preference? Oh beforehand? Oh no, I I
pack an hour before a flight.

Speaker 1 (14:12):
She's literally in the car.

Speaker 2 (14:15):
Yeah, yeah, I'm packing. I love when she when we
had to go do breass or something somewhere and I
had like a carry on and you had literally it
was like Kim, it was yes, it was like you
were wheeling behind you, like because that when you when
you do pack last minute, you pack everything just in case, right,
Just yeah, that's.

Speaker 1 (14:34):
Because you know. I like to I like Kim. I
was with her one time and when I went into
her room, I was like, did you bring your house
on this three day trip? She was like, yeah, everything
your house slippers? Interesting?

Speaker 2 (14:48):
Okay, first of all, who had wait house slippers? What
are you guys from the nineteen fifties? There were yes,
well they look like.

Speaker 3 (14:59):
I have co slippers that I like to wear. And
then but I did bring and they look like to me,
just you're winding me up. Did you know when you

(15:22):
were cast the character you were cast as? Like what
what you were what you were being cast for and
the love interest, all of it all and the complication.

Speaker 2 (15:31):
I remember meeting Shanda and Betsy. Uh. You know, it's
interesting because when I was doing twenty four and uh,
Gray's this is this is going to sound like like
I'm I'm dropping stuff, but it's it's just part of
both shows. Were like for two years were nominated for

(15:54):
Emmy's Golden Globes, SAG and so our Table we were
always sitting next to Grace so and it was always
kind of like this flip flop. So so one day
we crossed paths and we had a whole conversation and
you and Shonda and Betsy, Yes, okay. It was like
an amazing you know. I was like, you guys, you know,
I hope you win. They were like it was sort

(16:16):
of like this wonderful, incredible and I was just such
a huge fan of the show. I just thought it
was such an incredible show. But at the time I
had a job, and so I didn't imagine what that
would be, but I just know that they called me in.
There was this amazing role, uh to be with you

(16:36):
know again with Owen Hunt, with Kevin McKidd and I
kind of came in for a meeting with Kevin and
Betsy and Shonda, and I remember sort of talking it
through and so Kevin was there. Yeah, no, not not
at the awards, in this meeting, and it was sort

(16:58):
of like, how that's how. So I knew that I
knew that it had to just sort of do with that.
I knew that my notoriously do not have chemistry reads
on our show.

Speaker 3 (17:06):
Yeah, I was gonna say, they kind of just sit
and watch usually and see like if it's there or not.

Speaker 2 (17:12):
So this is this was like, this was a meeting
and we were just sort of talking and sort of
I guess it was a chemistry meeting.

Speaker 1 (17:21):
So did you like him right away? I mean, because
we've been honest about the fact that obviously you like
him now, but like did you did you like him
right away?

Speaker 2 (17:27):
Yeah, there was a real ease. It was just the
whole room with the whole room was it was. I
just thought, oh, wow, this is really special. And and
then I knew because at the time, Sandra Oh and
Kevin mckid's characters were together, so I knew that I
was kind of coming in that we had, you know,

(17:49):
been in Iraq together, so I didn't know the complication
of it. And then there was that hilarious storyline of
the brilliant you know sean to rhymes of where Teddy
was coming in it as a gift because she was
like cardiothoracic, you know Christina No, no, uh Owen brings

(18:13):
I am the gime of Christina. But in my job, right, Yeah.
So yeah, and my first scene was with Soda, Eric
Dane and Kevin. Yeah. I think that was it in
the in the cafeteria.

Speaker 3 (18:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (18:32):
I just remember being in one of the earlier scenes
with you, and I do remember that you and I
and Eric Dane and thought I were together.

Speaker 2 (18:39):
That was another scene.

Speaker 1 (18:40):
I think in the beginning.

Speaker 2 (18:41):
I think that was another scene.

Speaker 1 (18:42):
Yeah, they put it, but they put our characters together
a bit because I my character instantly was like I
think she was probably just like really really I mean
really really really excited that you were there, and she
was like, you're gonna be my friend, You're gonna be
my person, We're gonna be people.

Speaker 2 (18:55):
Which was so great. That was great. That was such
a great fun thing and it and what's funny about
ours we've talked about our relationship on gras is it's
such like the odd couple. Oh she's talking about me,
Me and Kim for listeners right now? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
it is so, which is a really yes, which is

(19:17):
just a really fun dynamic because I don't think you
usually see that on do you? I mean, I guess
you do. What I was trying to think of what
other friends.

Speaker 3 (19:26):
I wish we could tease what we're we're thinking specifically
of some of the stuff we've done this season that
we can't tease right now. But you see more of
like the odd couple dynamic of Joe and Kim, and
it just like works. We're always The truth is is
you guys, We're always We're always texting Meg saying we
have a new pitch for like a storyline. It's always

(19:48):
Joe and Teddy together for something. Listen, it is happening
this year.

Speaker 2 (19:54):
It's really well. I wonder whether it's because we had
this really great scene in Joe's bar and we oh
my god, stop laughing. We couldn't stop. It happened, We
got flattering, we got flags. They were like, no, never
put these two together, because we'll never get that. And
then we promise them. We're like we swear we will

(20:14):
get through this scene. Yeah, yeah, we did. We did
a little bit, but I was good.

Speaker 1 (20:22):
I remember that while you came in as a gift
for well, you came in because you were friends with
my kids. You had your chemistry read with my kid.
That makes sense to me, But I actually remember you
having a very strong I remember loving the story between
you and Christina.

Speaker 2 (20:39):
Oh yeah, I loved that. It was almost like they
had written it to.

Speaker 1 (20:42):
Talk about bad assory. I mean, that was next level
Show Me, Don't Tell Me.

Speaker 2 (20:50):
Which which also is incredible because a lot of times
it's about sort of the sexual relationship, right, Like that's
that in a lot of show and our show. What
was so incredible about this relationship and this dynamic was
this amazing mentorship between two women. Yeah, and uh, Christina's

(21:15):
absolute commitment and passion towards being the most incredible surgeon
at any expense, which I think is such a great storyline.
And again, you know, Shonda Rhymes and Betsy Beers and
Shondalin what what a beautiful way to again like show

(21:37):
and not tell the story of women's absolute passion for
what they do and to be able to be at
the top of their game and want to be the
top of their game and and be.

Speaker 1 (21:49):
And challenge each other. And you would you I remember
you too, like you would be each other's red team.
You were always the one who kind of knew more so,
but she could take it from you, and you could.
I mean, that's the thing I think we keep going
back to you, right, whether we're talking about our personal
relationships or we're talking about these characters, is that it's
really it's a great recipe for success to understand. We

(22:14):
were talking about this a couple of episodes which we
were talking it visa v radical acceptance, but we were saying,
pain is inevitable. The suffering part is optional. So you're
going to be in friendship, you're gonna get in arguments
and it's going to be painful, but like suffering in
it is optional. You can go to the person and say,
I fickd up. You know what I did this thing
I actually didn't mean to, or you know what I

(22:35):
did this thing I actually really meant to. I don't
know what happened. I saw something I saw red, I
didn't I my my my thinking brain went offline. I
don't know what to tell you, but it was a
mistake and I'm so sorry and I'm sorry that it
affected you and I'm just sorry. Can we like start
over or can we reset or can you please forgive me?
Or and the accountability and then and then that's real relationship.

(22:59):
And I saw that very much in the I saw
that in the Teddy and Christina friendship. I mean it
definitely was. I mean, you were I always remember being
senior in it. But I loved that friction.

Speaker 2 (23:10):
I love to think I was senior because of just
the dynamic I was in attendee where she was.

Speaker 1 (23:15):
Yeah, And so I'm saying you were senior, but you
would still fight. She would still yes, Like we talked
a lot about challenge. I never grew up with people
who fought in a healthy way. I grew up with
people who fought and they got mad and then they left,
or they got mad and then they got silent, or
they got mad and they fill in the blank. But
it was never healthy anger. And it's so interesting because

(23:37):
when I see my kids fight, I want to go
just make up, just make up, just make up. And
I've realized that I need to adjust. I need to adjust.
I need to say, you know what you're gonna fight,
so fight well, right, like, what do you really mean?
What really hurt? How do you how could you make it.

Speaker 2 (23:58):
Up to her that there's not pun in expressing yourself
or that there's not punishment in I think what I'm
hearing you say, which I think is really an interesting thing,
is that there is going to be friction throughout a
long sort of existing deep relationship or friendship, and it's

(24:20):
it's how are you in those moments and who are you?
And do you have grace? Also, I think sometimes when
the when you can see that the other person is
doing something that might be hurtful or this or that,
but having grace because you've been through that so you
understand that and that you can then you know, find forgiveness.

(24:43):
I think that that's a really yeah, that is a
really beautiful dynamic and an interesting growth thing.

Speaker 1 (25:03):
Forgiveness is really hard. I think forgiveness is really really,
really really hard, and I think that it's the true forgiveness.
I think that you can say I forgive you, and
sometimes actually just saying it will get you there. But
I think true, like deep forgiveness is really hard to
get to. And I think that and I think that
it brings up actually something Camilla was starting to talk

(25:24):
to you about, and I said, stop, don't ask her
the question.

Speaker 3 (25:27):
My first question for you is when you look at
Teddy's your experience with Teddy, do you see it in
two parts or right now? To you?

Speaker 2 (25:34):
Is it one long journey? It's one long journey. Interesting, Okay,
that's to me what's so incredible and really an anomaly
of this show there is I don't think there is
very very few shows where an actor or a creator

(25:57):
has the opportunity to follow through on a life journey,
especially now if you look at television, you know there
are seven episodes, ten episodes, limited series, three years of
a series. But that's only ten episodes. I mean in

(26:18):
my experience of television, and when I was first starting,
there was usually like twenty four episodes. But to get
to a twenty four episode for several years also was
an anomaly. So to have a show that has gone
on for twenty two years and you know it's fluctuated
between twenty four episodes twenty six to you know, eighteen

(26:41):
to whatever that is, but you're still telling the story
over a period of that amount of time. So for me,
like Teddy's life was still continuous even when she wasn't
present on the show. Yeah, you know, she having a
full life in Germany, right, so that that very much

(27:03):
exists for me. Was I off on my own playing Teddy?

Speaker 3 (27:07):
No, but I have a but when you're in that
character you did monogue exactly, I didn't take you. This
is the other thing that we talked about, because did
it take any convincing to say yes to come back?
Because there's like a little bit of Sage Camilla that'd
be like, you know what, you lost me.

Speaker 2 (27:29):
As I love that part of you.

Speaker 3 (27:34):
But by the way, that's not the right thing to do.
That's like a very immature thing. Like you know, but
when you say sage, is that like Sagittarius or like Sage.

Speaker 2 (27:44):
No likesarious, like we're stubborn.

Speaker 1 (27:50):
But just so I'm clear, you're you're saying, you're saying
that when Kim got the phone call saying hey, please,
we need you back here at Seattle whatever it was
called it, that's yes, you are saying that you're imagining
a world in which she was like, sorry, you already
lost me. Yes, okay, so what did you actually do, Kim?

Speaker 2 (28:12):
It's again, I think I've been I've been doing this,
I mean sort of since I was thirteen, I mean
even before that, but I don't consider that sort of
like child actors. That was a totally different thing. And
I think, you know, it's like I can recognize an

(28:33):
amazing gift when it's there. Yeah, And that's not to
say that I've made all the right but in that moment,
I'm like, yes, thank you very much, I'll be there,
tell me what time. Yes, it was it was a
for me, it was a no brainer. And that's also
what I'm talking about in sort of like maturity and

(28:54):
like the amazing thing of like getting years under your
belt because as it's myralessun you're tired, right, because maybe
before i'd be like, I think I'm so this sort
And I'm not saying that that's what you're you know, no,
I know I'm but what I am saying is is
the immature thing to do, like to have the reaction
of like I've felt that way.

Speaker 1 (29:15):
I understand what you're saying. When I left Grace, I
was a little bit like let's flip a table. I
flip a table. If someone all of a sudden turned around,
like the next season was like, hey, just kidding, can
you come back?

Speaker 2 (29:23):
I'd be like, no, Yeah, I think it's like that's
a human reaction to have. And I was just wondering
if there's always I think we always want to feel wanted.
I mean, that's just that is just ay hold on.

Speaker 1 (29:36):
But also I think that I'm not just blowing smoke here.
I really do think this is perhaps I just want
to imagine might have also been at play, was that
when you came to the show, you are I'm really
not just saying, it's like you're such a phenomenal actor
and you bring so much to everything you do. You
you have had and so many different storylines that went

(29:59):
just they were just beautiful stories. And then there was
this sort of moment where you know, when Scott Foley's
character passed, there was like this heaviness and there was
this like and you had become It wasn't like a
binary relationship, but it was just such an a committed
and important relationship. So then when you left after it,

(30:21):
it wasn't so much like you got sent off. It
was like that thing kind of like that story closed
in such a sad way, But then when you came back,
it was like you had never been gone, So it
was just sort of like this this this picking up
of another thread, like there wasn't. It was almost like
who could have who could have ever known it was

(30:43):
gonna gone for twenty two plus years, but like it wasn't.
It wasn't a thing. There wasn't a There wasn't like
this big departure moment or something.

Speaker 2 (30:51):
But that also is the beauty of our show. It's
almost like the old school theater company where people you
come and go and there's there's actors who have the
highlighted role at that whatever that play is, and then
you know, then there's another they use another actor and

(31:13):
and it's it's being malleable in that moment of when
you're when it's your moment story thing, and trying to
take the ego out of it and really being then
supportive as the ensemble player. And I think that that also, look,

(31:35):
I think ego is a really an amazing thing. It
We need it when we especially as an actor, when
you've got to walk in that room and you've got
to you know, a million auditions, and then there's ego
that gets in your way. Yeah, And I think that
that's where it's really having to do self checking of
when is it when is that ego standing in the way,

(31:59):
because maybe you'r you know, the sixth banana in the
back of during a E O R E ER scene.
It doesn't matter. It's it's what are you doing in
that moment, you know, and if if you I don't know,
I just think it's really important. And I think especially now,
there's just so many things in flux and uh, just

(32:23):
globally right, So it's it's uh, it's it's taking those
moments that we get to create and and really using
and I don't know, for me, there's a huge gratitude
of it because you also you know the journey, the
life journey of actors. It's just sort of this like

(32:46):
ebb and flow and so when when you're when you're flowing,
you better get on that surfboard. Man. It's just sort
of I've been both.

Speaker 1 (32:55):
By the way, when you said six banana in the back,
I have been. I've I've I've played. So I guess
what I'm saying is I've been human, but I've played
with being in the sixth row and being like having
done my sense memory exercise before we started having bring
props to work, even though they had them there, Like,

(33:15):
I've been so deep in it, and then I've had
moments where I was like playing Candy Crush, like but
underneath the table, like so present, and then sometimes not,
and I've actually I'm as much as I'm hard on
myself for the moments that I paid Candy Crush, because
that's not what you're supposed to do at work. I'm like, well, okay,
I did that because I was being human, And now
I know I actually know what I what feels right,

(33:37):
what the balance is because because it is so particular
to you, I was trying to tea up the moment,
Camilla that you and I were both in tears rewatching
the episode.

Speaker 3 (33:47):
It was the episode that you left in and you
had this scene with Owen and he comes in and oh, yes, yeah, yeah,
you got to say cute. But I feel like you
say something that's like yeah, like packs a punch for
our ABC show at whatever time it was on. And
so we just rewatched that episode and I hadn't seen

(34:08):
in one billion years, and your acting is so phenomenal.

Speaker 1 (34:14):
I texted Kim after I saw it, Oh you did
you did?

Speaker 4 (34:17):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (34:17):
I did, Yes, I'll look at my text, I said,
oh my god, we just we did rewatch.

Speaker 2 (34:22):
Titled flight. Oh wait, it's it's the it's the the
Plan episode.

Speaker 1 (34:28):
Yes, because you there's all this life happening in the
woods on the plane crush, but then there's all this
life happening at the hospital and he comes in and
he wants you to go and.

Speaker 2 (34:37):
Aspires you yes, and you and you have to like
your best friend and then come back in.

Speaker 1 (34:44):
Yes, but it's almost like you forgive him, and it's like,
for me, what that's what I think I was trying
to get to is that for me, what I was
imagining was that you were so hurt by him in
this moment, and then you go and somehow this transformative,
almost incredibly graceful forgiveness happens where you come back and
you're able to do exactly what we were talking about,
which is say, friend, I know that you're doing.

Speaker 2 (35:06):
Give me girls clubs. Yeah, it was the writing of that.
I was going to say, the writing that's again Shondaland
it's just incredible. They have this there, the capability of
of doing our fked up moments and our hero moments simultaneously, right,
and they are so aligned in life, those those those
those things are so aligned. And what I love one

(35:30):
of the many things. But what I love is that
the show highlights that. And I think that's why our
fans lean into it still after this many years, because uh,
you know, hopefully we do have our highlight moments and
our you know, our fallen moments. And I think that

(35:51):
that's a really it's like a it's a beautiful it's
a beautiful thing to get to play. It's a beautiful
thing to watch, and it's a beautiful thing to experience
as an actor because it reminds you. Also, it's a
it's a very it's a it's the humanity of it.

Speaker 1 (36:19):
Oh man, it's so good.

Speaker 3 (36:20):
I when I was watching it too, I remember thinking like,
of course they bought her back. Yeah, Like it was
like the story was not finished. Sometimes we have these
exits on our show that feel like, Okay, I get
it that that feels like right, like goodbye, But that exit,
I was like, oh no, like there.

Speaker 2 (36:38):
Was more, for there was so much more.

Speaker 3 (36:41):
How much of filming that scene since it was going
to be the last episode and you didn't know you
were coming back, was Kim and then how much of
that was Teddy.

Speaker 1 (36:50):
God, I just have to interrupt. Do you remember the
table read for the last episode.

Speaker 2 (36:54):
Was I like, I could I not get it out?
I think I blocked it out.

Speaker 1 (36:56):
Well, because I'm sure you did. I mean, I want
my Now. Do you remember we were in the car,
We were right off the commissary, Remember when we just
sometimes in the big room and sometimes right off the commissary.
And I don't think, really I remember people not even
really knowing what was gonna happen, and so we were
and we just got those scripts and I don't think
any of us knew how it was all gonna go,
and it was just like waterworks. You know that scene?

Speaker 2 (37:20):
Do you remember that scene in the O r Uh
where Teddy has to go and see him. He's it's
almost like a morgue, right, and she yells at the
nurse who's in there to get out? Oh I remember,
you know, As an actor, it's like, you know, you
sort of need that moment to kind of like get

(37:41):
into this heavy dude. And bor Scott Foley was like
under this sheet and he just he had to hold
his breath. Oh no, And there's this whole moment where
if I have to fold back like, I sit down,
I take off my screen. Kim, I would not be
able to do this, though I would, we would not

(38:03):
be able to do it.

Speaker 4 (38:04):
When I got my scrub cap, I like fold back
the sheet slowly and it's he's full on and I
am like tears or sting, and he at the end
of it, he's like, oh my god, Kim Raver, He's like,
could you cry Cracker, He goes, I can't hold my bro.

Speaker 2 (38:20):
I don't even remember what he said, being it was
just it was such a moment. I mean, we had
so many moments where I was not supposed to be
Like there was another scene. It is one of the
funniest bloopers where he's because you know his character was
and there is nothing funny about any of this, right,
but you know his his character was like lying on

(38:48):
the bed and he had all you know, he was
really sick and he was like really like at the end, right,
and I had his water and like a strong just
it was really late at night on a Friday night.
We were shooting really long hours and you guys, I
got the giggles. Oh no, it's terrifying. It's terrifying, really

(39:09):
is I don't know if people understand, but it's like
the place where you are absolutely not. And it was
like Friday at everything, and everyone is like whole grade
is counting on you not bing it up, and like
because everyone wants to go home and the more. And

(39:30):
he was like camera, it's Friday night. And I was like,
I know, I'm sorry. I mean, I just it was
like tears were streaming down my face because I couldn't
stop laughing. Yeah, there's been a couple of those.

Speaker 1 (39:41):
Oh yeah, I can tell you that. I mean, just
along those lines that my last episode. Yeah, it was
very hard to be Arizona.

Speaker 2 (39:50):
Yeah, what was that like for you?

Speaker 1 (39:53):
I was just so sad. Yeah, I was just overtaken
by sad. I was sad.

Speaker 2 (39:58):
I was confused.

Speaker 1 (39:59):
I was I wanted, I wanted to do whatever I
thought was like I whatever going with Grace looked like
I wanted. I wanted to I wanted to go with
Grace at the same time that I was so sad
and confused, and so it was. I think I remember

(40:22):
it being very hard to show up as my character
because I also felt such a great responsibility to her.
I felt like such a great responsibility to have her
be like the very best Arizona she ever was, because
I knew it was going to be the last.

Speaker 2 (40:39):
Do you guys feel attached like I feel vary it.
Do you feel attached to your characters, especially because it's
different than doing a play and then you say goodbye
or whatever it's it's it's such a long so you
feel attached to them. I definitely do.

Speaker 3 (40:53):
But one thing I've gotten really good at is in
the early days when people were like, I hate Joe Wilson,
I'd like, no, could not be Bro's fits on the street.
You know, It's like and now that's when I was
first on the show, And then I am so attached
to her and I'm so okay with people not liking her,

(41:15):
and so that feels very freeing. Actually, So I feel
like I have a healthy, healthy attachment. How do you
How do you feel like you got to that place
being on the show for five hundred years? Yeah, and
understanding that a lot of our storylines. Well, the truth
thing is when you're on the show for that long,
your character is going to fuck up. They're going to
do stuff that the audience hates, and you're gonna get

(41:37):
people with very strong opinions and and and we've talked
about how you end up having to be sort of
like your number one fan right for your own character.
So whatever she does, if she does something up that
the audience don't like, I'm still rooting for whatever she's doing,
you know. And so I think it came from do

(41:57):
you okay if you read stuff online and it's like Teddy,
do you have that like feeling?

Speaker 2 (42:04):
I mean, look, I have I have a rule from
theater days where I just I really try not to
read anything. Ye don't read the reviews, don't and why
don't read reviews? But once in a while on Instagram
it's like someone's munting. Yeah, I mean, and it's interesting
because I do feel like I also have that distance
now from it because playing so long. And I think also,

(42:28):
I think it's you know, it's I love hearing from
the fans of why they're angry at ted especially how
about when Teddy was cheat, had that terrible cheat. I mean,
I was upset with Teddy, right, But that also is
so fascinating to me, And that is what is an
interesting character. I mean, a do gooder all the time, okay,

(42:50):
but not as interesting, not as interesting to play, not
as interesting to watch. But again, I think what's cool
about the show is the moments where the character is
falling from grace and people are really upset, and I
think that that's actually a good thing. So now I
try to lean into it. And when I read it,
what was that number one moment for you? Was it
that of people being upset with There have been more

(43:12):
than one. No, I think that that was the that
was people were really upset, really angry. And you know
what I think. I was like, yes, I agree with you,
I agree with you and so but I but it's
having enough trust in the writers that I mean, like,

(43:33):
first I have to ask myself, well, what is what
is what is my role facilitating? What does it need
to facilitate? Not whether I like what she's doing or
not doing right. I've gotten to the place, I think
where maybe that's not the most important thing. Again, like
where are you fitting in in the community of telling
the stories? And how is that? How? What do what

(43:54):
does the story need to be to facilitate that?

Speaker 4 (43:57):
Now?

Speaker 2 (43:57):
Am I human and you know you we want people
to root for you, Yes, I do, I do it,
But also I found it really for me. Then that's
that's the interesting journey. That's the storytelling. That's the thing
of like, okay, well, how do we dig her out
of this hole? How does you know what I mean?
How does she earn back trust and forgiveness? And does

(44:20):
that Can that help someone out there who's going through
the exact same thing, who when they're watching it, feel
really in an awful, terrible place because they made a
terrible mistake and are also trying to navigate their way
back into a better relationship, a better understanding of who
they are. And so yeah, when I when you see it,

(44:43):
you're like, oh no, please, you know, I don't want
to see it. But then I try to think of, like, okay, well,
what stories can can we tell that will then be
interesting and relatable and juicy and deep and and you know,
full what would be a good full meal to tell now?

(45:07):
And that is something that this show does a really
good job of, is not. I feel that all the
characters don't have to play the same note and that
used to be And I don't know whether you guys
feel this way in sort of like years ago, And
maybe it's because these women roles are much more dynamic

(45:28):
and diverse and richer, and they're not just a girlfriend
or like they are much more just fuller and well
written characters and not when I say before, I'm not
talking about our show. I'm talking about like in the.

Speaker 3 (45:46):
Day you're talking about I know, I knew that you
weren't saying that because Shanda, I feel like as one
of the guys spearheaded yes, women being so I mean,
like the fact that Meredith Gray, you know, and the
whole like that's slow storyline and like yeah last season
when she gets called a slut, you know, and she's like,
I hadn't seen that on TV yet. No, Cam, we're

(46:07):
gonna stop you right there, because we're gonna make this
a very special two parter.

Speaker 1 (46:12):
Because it's too good.

Speaker 3 (46:13):
Sometimes when it's this nice, you have to do it
twice exactly right, So tune in Wednesday for part two.

Speaker 2 (46:21):
Jess, let's call it the end of this episode. Of
this episode,
Advertise With Us

Hosts And Creators

Jessica Capshaw

Jessica Capshaw

Camilla Luddington

Camilla Luddington

Popular Podcasts

CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist

CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist

It’s 1996 in rural North Carolina, and an oddball crew makes history when they pull off America’s third largest cash heist. But it’s all downhill from there. Join host Johnny Knoxville as he unspools a wild and woolly tale about a group of regular ‘ol folks who risked it all for a chance at a better life. CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist answers the question: what would you do with 17.3 million dollars? The answer includes diamond rings, mansions, velvet Elvis paintings, plus a run for the border, murder-for-hire-plots, and FBI busts.

Crime Junkie

Crime Junkie

Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.

Stuff You Should Know

Stuff You Should Know

If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.

Music, radio and podcasts, all free. Listen online or download the iHeart App.

Connect

© 2025 iHeartMedia, Inc.