Meet Al Byrne! U.S Navy Veteran, Author & Co-Founder of Veterans for Medical Cannabis Access™ featuring Bryan Buckley of HVGC™!

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome the Cannabis Talk one oh one featuring Blue with
Joe BRONDEI the world's number one source for everything cannabis.

Speaker 2 (00:07):
Hello, welcome to Cannabis Talk one oh one with Blue
and Joe Brande, the world's number one source for everything cannabis.
Thank you for listening to our podcasts all around the world.
Make sure you check out our website, Cannabis Talk one
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(00:28):
Cannabis Talk one oh one. My brother from Another Mother,
Blue is at the number one Christopher Wrights, and you
could always find me on the gram at Joe Brande
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(00:51):
On the podcast today, this is a very special one
in my opinion for me personally as well. We have
two US military veterans who have dedicated their post military
careers to bring awareness as well as helping veterans and
people of all backgrounds through the power of medical cannabis.
You guys, medicinal cannabis. You know what it is. Besides

(01:12):
me is my good buddy, my brother from another mother,
Brian Buckley, CEO of Helman Valley Growers Company. If you haven't,
just google Brian Buckley, CEO of Helman Valley and Cannabis
talk one on one. Listen to the first interview that
we had with Brian, because still, in my opinion, as
Chris Frankeno walked up here, I go, Chris, you and

(01:34):
I have this special love and respect for Brian because
when I first interviewed you, Brian, that was the most
rawess realist interview. After that you became badass in my
phone and still are badass in my phone. And it's
just your dedication to our country, your dedication to helping

(01:54):
veterans and people in general. It goes without saying I
salute you. I take my hat off to you. Thank
you for joining me today. Brothers Blues out here. It's
a privilege to have you next to us.

Speaker 3 (02:03):
Always great to be here. It's been a hot minute,
but I am fired up about what we got going
on today and talking to mister Alburn.

Speaker 2 (02:09):
Yes, I'm excited to joining us via Zoom is a
US Navy veteran. You guys are both Navy.

Speaker 3 (02:15):
No, you're Marines now, I'm on the Men's Department of
the Navy, the Marine Corps.

Speaker 2 (02:18):
Oh, Al, is he starting this shit already with you? Al?
I cannot believe.

Speaker 4 (02:25):
If he's gonna shot that kind of crap. I'm ready
you and he knows it. Let's go.

Speaker 2 (02:31):
Well, let me give this man the introduction that he
is well deserved, because I tell you right now he
is a US Navy veteran and co founder of Veterans
for Medical Cannabis Access al Berne is here. Al is
a graduate of Notre Dame with a degree in economics,
where he received his Navy commissions. After four years in
the ROTC, he started uh the He was a starting

(02:54):
wing for three years in the Notre Dame rugby team.
You know, I was a prop as well, so so
you know you can you can be a hooker, or
maybe he could be a hooker. One of you guys
can be a hooker and hold on to me anytime.
But he is married, has two children. He's a family man.
His Navy career span twenty four years with duty on
the destroyer, multiple US duty station assignments and tours, and

(03:18):
country Vietnam in three years as a Navy CBE which
I can't wait to hear more about what the cbs are.
The son of a cancer patient. Actually, he saw his
dad helped by medical cannabis in nineteen sixty seven and
since that time, you guys, he's been advocating for cannabis
use for the ill. Al Assol served as an executive director,
board member, and National security of Normal from nineteen eighty

(03:41):
nine to nineteen ninety four. He was an instrumental in
introducing the conversation concerning cannabis use by patients to the
US discourse, you guys, to accomplish effective advacy out also
co founded Patients Out of Time with the mission of
educating US healthcare professionals and the US public about the

(04:01):
therapeutic values of cannabis.

Speaker 4 (04:03):
Now.

Speaker 2 (04:03):
This organization was the first in the world to do
so in accreditation settings, to provide medicine and medical cannabis
education in the public venues, which is just groundbreaking shit
that you've been doing now. And to further his work
out also co founded Veterans for Medical Cannabis Access in
two thousand and seven, the organization responsible for having the

(04:26):
Veterans Health Administrations declare by directive that cannabis was medicine
and shall be treated as such by all VHAS personnel
in July of twenty ten. Ol also is the co
host of Veterans Voices, along running radio podcast program that
interviews vets, their caregivers, their families and friends and you know,
everybody deals with this stuff about the use of cannabis

(04:49):
by veterans that has helped them reduce the and eliminates
addictive VHA prescribed pharmacy products. And of those who don't know,
you know, the vas giving these cats just so much
shit and not really giving them cannabis, thinking oh, what
can we do to help them, they just overload them
with pills. Al was also a member of the Veterans
Action Council, dedicated to providing a quality for all military patients.

(05:13):
Veterans are active duty in their use of cannabis within
the VHA facilities in the US and territories, you guys,
and he just completed a book for Country and Cannabis.
It was published in twenty twenty three. Beautiful picture of
him and his beautiful looking golden retrievers sitting on the
back of a pickup truck right there as he stays

(05:35):
out in good old Northwest Florida. For further information, check
out his website, you guys, Veterans for Medical Marijuana dot org,
or send them an email through their website without further ado,
I have Brian Buckley and Al Burns and the building.
Thank you so much, Al for joining us. You deserve
that long intro because you've been doing this for such

(05:56):
a long time.

Speaker 5 (05:57):
Man.

Speaker 2 (05:57):
Once again, like I saluted Brian to Al, I salute
you and thank you for your service. And let's just
get right to this book out why for Country and Cannabis,
and thank you for doing everything that you do for
so many.

Speaker 4 (06:11):
You're welcome. Well, the title of the book kind of
describes what it is.

Speaker 5 (06:18):
I mean, it's a memoir about, you know, my life,
but as my publisher has written, it's sort of a
one of a kind memoir.

Speaker 4 (06:29):
I didn't really write it to talk about me. I
could have written in another few hundred pages, I suppose,
if I wanted to do that. But it's more about
what I got involved with and the people that I
was with. To me, it was it's a recording of history,

(06:51):
and a history that I didn't think any anybody else
could could put down on paper. A number of people
said that to me, now, you got to put this down,
because you know when you're gone, this will of me
just go away. So I wrote it. I wrote it
for the history book. I wrote it as an educational work.

(07:14):
I do think I put a heck of a lot
of medical cannabis information in the book. I think that
a lot of that information will be brand new even
to doctors and nurses, and I want them to read
it and say, wow, there's mortivis than I ever new.
The politics of it are very informative. I think where

(07:36):
you know, if you think about what you just said
wrote there about patients at a time. We started that
organization up in ninety five. We had our first conference
at the University of Iowa in two thousand and Here's
so the hidden point there. In order to have an
accredited conference, in other words, a conference where the participants

(07:59):
can get continued doing education credits are met for medical doctors,
social workers or whoever. The curriculum, the agenda, and the
speakers and what they're going to speak about has to
pass approval by the national offices of the American Nurses
Association and the American Medical Association. And so we passed

(08:24):
muster and they let us put on the conference and
it was very successful, super successful, But the hidden messages there,
you know, if you look back over all those years,
I don't believe the American Medical Association has ever said
a positive word about medical cannabis. But they let me
and my organization teach it. And that's been a lot

(08:47):
of the part of the politics of the United States
where things go on that really has not much talked
about and should be. And so that's another reason I
wrote the book. The book is all I did was
write down a bunch of stories. Brian will tell you,
I tell stories, That's what I do. When did the

(09:07):
book start? Was eighty nine that you started the book
or is it before that?

Speaker 1 (09:12):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (09:12):
Well, I've been I've been taking notes, if you will,
and keeping records of my own since the get go,
probably back in the middle eighties. But when I finally
got up and said, Okay, I'm going to do this.
By the way, writing a book, it's a hell of
a work. Wow. It took me about eighteen months to

(09:35):
actually write the book and then turn it over to
the publisher, who was very very great in helping me
finish the work up in all kinds of ways. But
that's why I did it. Just it's a history book.
I wanted the people in the book that I mentioned
my name to be remembered. I mean, some of them

(10:00):
I won't remember it really favorable. Others I put down
their name and what they did. Tossey were assholes, Right,
You want to show homage and you wanted to show
who wasn't with it.

Speaker 2 (10:10):
I'm sure it's like, Okay, these are the people that
were with it, just like you guys. You got the
al Burns, you got the Brian Buckleys, who have served,
who have killed hundreds of people literally to protect this
country and have gone through so much that look at
this plant as real medicinal medicine to treat this PTSD
that you guys suffer from and all other veterans suffer

(10:31):
from and say look who's with it and look who's
against it. I like that you're putting people on blasts
like that out.

Speaker 3 (10:37):
Yeah, And I thought was really kind of tremendous. How
when I grabbed the book this weekend and I was
kind of thinking about to one of my friends who
went to law school with Lanceido, and he was saying
one of the problems that Lance had to deal with
with the oj trial was everyone was writing books who
were basically getting testified, and he would have to go
back and read these four hundred page books at nighttime
and then the next day make a decision can they

(10:58):
talk or not. So I get Al's book and I'm like, oh,
maybe it's gonna be a quick hundred pages and you
see the size. Alright, I'm gonna rip through this bad boy.
But I was down the other weekend in San Diego
speaking at the Democratic City or Democrat Convention, and we
had a panel about cannabis and I kept talking about
the education, education, education, and the person leading the panel said,

(11:20):
can you give us an answer without talking about people
need to be educated? And I'm sitting there thinking, well,
that is the major delta that we're having with policy
makers and I was dying laughing and open up Al's
book and you started, I think with what a Marcus
realist quote where it goes, doesn't matter what ten thousand
people think is if they don't know what they're talking about.
And I'm like, that is a blast right at Congress

(11:41):
right there, that they're the ones making all these laws
yet have no idea what the hell they're talking about.
And it was just a blessing for Al to kind
of put his history in this book so we can
continue to educate people and doesn't go get lost into
some vortex when you know, Alice, stop student ways doing it?

Speaker 2 (11:57):
Isn't it too as Brian, you've read this and you
wrote it, it's got to hurt a little bit. Mean,
the proof is in the pudding. Now you've done this.
You've watched your father go through you know, died for
God's sakes with cancer in nineteen sixty seven, and since
that you've been an advocate knowing that cannabis could help.

(12:20):
You know, you're much older than some of us here,
and you've been seeing it longer than us. Yet we
watch it, see it forefront, have the most anecdotal evidence. Brian,
you're up there talking with Congress, you're talking to senators.
They want you to run for a senator, they want
you to do all these things, and you sit there

(12:41):
and you go, but you guys aren't educated. OW. How
frustrating is it when you write a book like that,
going is this going to really help us? Or is
it just going to be another fucking bookweight to hold
other papers down?

Speaker 4 (12:56):
Question? My hope when I wrote it, and now that
has been published, is that they will have some positive
effect on the conversation my whole Uh. I was a
soldier as a professional soldier. I'm not an educator. I
became one, uh, and I had to learn the process

(13:17):
of what sort of education would work best and when.
And it was a lot of stumbles, you know, Uh,
but we figured it out. And so in one sense,
show the fact that it isn't a done deal and
everybody in the world can't get medical cannabis when they
wanted is Yeah, that's frustrating, because they should they should

(13:38):
be able to. Uh. But on the other hand, from
where I started, which was totally ignorance, to where we
are now, I feel pretty good that I had something
to do with that. Uh. Back back in when I
started talking to this talk when Reagan took over and
I was on stolee acking duty UH and I was

(14:00):
telling her my co host, that this was stupid. I
took a lot of shit. I mean, they ran me
out of one command. Literally.

Speaker 2 (14:09):
You think about that. I mean, as you're dealing with
it during Reagan's a run and his regime so to speak.
I mean, his wife went on the biggest fucking anti
UH propaganda speeches, in my opinion, of the best but worse.
This is your brain. This is your brain on drugs
that's stuck in people's heads and you see an egg frying.

(14:31):
I mean, it was a brilliant campaign. I mean, the
campaign is stuck in everyone's head from that era, but
it's like it was propaganda. It's bullshit.

Speaker 3 (14:41):
Yeah, it was just uneducated people going out making these
proclamations when not knowing what the hell they're talking about.
And that's why, again I go back to Al's book.
That was such a perfect opening to the book, and
I think I'll like, you know, we discussed this on
the Veterans Action Council. You know, the frustrations of what
we have to do in terms of getting research done,
and getting research done well, the research has already been

(15:04):
done and protocols have been put out there. And I
was wondering if you could expand a little bit on
your relationship with your buddy Raffi as you would call him.
What he did in Israel to develop treatment protocols in
Czechoslovakia kind of followed up quickly and maybe some of
the frustrations you find that our politicians won't look at
that even though just human beings are human beings.

Speaker 4 (15:25):
Well, Rafi, of course is Professor rafae Ol Mascheum of
Israel Jerusalem University of Jerusalem, a brilliant, brilliant mind and
dedicated in the right way to do the right thing.
That is the thing about Michielum's team, It's a team,
a team effort. Was it finance by the United States?

(15:49):
Their research has not been financed by Israel, financed by US.
And what that Israel science has proven since doctor Michelle
and announced the finding of the compound THHC. I believe
it was in nineteen sixty four and he just passed
away last year. And since that time, in a little

(16:11):
before sixty four, he's been working for the United States
government and medical cannabis. See what it's all about. And
his laboratory in Jerusalem still operates, and he has a
brilliant team and always did. And you know what doctor
Michelam did was for me, for us patients, was he

(16:32):
came to the United States at my invitation three different
times and spoke at our conferences and gave us incredible
credibility as well as advancing our education and making us
aware of the tremendous possibilities this plant had that hadn't

(16:53):
even been really looked at. One of his PhD workers,
who is now passed, showed that if women, mammals, females,
human women did not have endocannabinoid compounds in their breast milk,

(17:16):
their babies would not suckle and would die. Well, that's
pretty astounded. And then you find out that, well, wait
a minute, this endocannabinary system, this is in all living
creatures on earth except insects, and that means all mammals
by birth. If they didn't have this endocannabinant system, they

(17:37):
weren't making these compounds that their pups there, whatever would
their literary would not make it. They'd all die. These
are the kind of things that are common in my mind,
but the United States still doesn't want to promote that.
The fact that in the book, I point out that
the United States knew conclusively in nineteen seventy four because

(18:02):
of research down at the Virginia Commonwealthy University in Richmond,
that cannabis compounds kills cancer cells. They knew that seventy four.
That's a long time ago. And when that study was
completed and showed that result, it was buried gone. The

(18:26):
United States did not want people to know that it
was a cancer kill. Another example, another story, if you will.
The IOM, the Institute of Medicine, was selected in eighty
one to create a study on cannabis is a good batter? Indifferent?
What is it? The IOM is known for its scholarly

(18:50):
approach to everything. It is unbiased about anything exceptar real science.
And they've been that way since their inception, and there
that way today. The IOM came out with a report
and said, cannabis is really good stuff. It should be
uh looked at more closely. It should be used, it
should not be uh should be no way pedal. You know,

(19:11):
the penalties for using a ridiculous et cetera, et cetera.
So the IOM produced that study and gave it to
the boss the drugs are. They produced three hundred copies
of their study. Now think about that. First of all,
that isn't even enough copies to give one to every
Senator and House a representative representative. A couple of hundred

(19:34):
short there. But the point is that they disappeared gone.
Now I won't tell you who, but I know who.
Somebody got one and I was working at normal and
we've reroduced ten thousand of them, got them on level,
their guard in place. So fast fast forward twenty years

(19:56):
of doing it again. The IOM's doing it again. They
interviewed people all over the kind, including me and the
UH and the head uh doctor the PhD in charge
of this stuff, UH, the brilliant, wonderful lady UH. Before
she made her announcement, as the previous IOM committee had done,

(20:16):
she called me up and she said, give me the
background on this first report. And I told her that
I just told you, and she said, okay, here's what
we're going to do there. I'm going to make I'm
going to make this report public to the press, and
then I'm going to submit it to the US government.
And that's exactly what she did. And so these these
are but again, here's your government not providing you, as

(20:39):
a citizen or a medical professional, with the information that
they possessed. And I go on, you want many more
stories I want to hear about lung cancer. I mean,
let me tell you about this. It is important, a
lot of people smoking it. Doctor Donald Taskin was hired
again by the federal government federal money, and he was

(21:01):
the head of the pulmonary Department of the UCLA. He's
also a professor of medicine there. And he conducted the
study over thirty years thousands of patients four categories four
One you smoke cigarettes and cigars. Two you smoke cigarettes,
cigars and cannabis. Three you smoke only cannabis. Four you

(21:26):
smoke nothing. At the end of the thirty years, what
they well, the results were that if you smoke cigars
and cigarettes and cannabis, cigars and cigarettes alone, you're going
to get lung cancer. You're going to get COPD, just
like they say you are believe it. However, of all
the patients over thirty years that smoked only cannabis, they

(21:51):
did not have one patient with lung cancer or COPD,
which was a better result than the patients that smoked nothing.
So the government is still trying to tell you that
cannabis is smokers badfield. It is not. It is actually
an anti carcetogen. It kills cancer cells, just like the

(22:12):
study in nineteen seventy four set and now this has
been repeated. UCLA actually just repeated it again and published
the results in May of twenty and twenty three in
the cop Medical Journal. Same result, and no, it was
different because they took in patients that had COPD and
when those patients got done, I think that was seven years,

(22:36):
the COPD in all of them was gone. The disease
had been cured by smoking cannabis.

Speaker 2 (22:42):
You know what gets me out is when you look
at the government and you talk about all these things
and you realize that the US government holds a patent
on cannabis plant compounds, which is Patent number six six
three zero five oh seven, and you go, wait a minute,
why do they even have that? What are they even
covering up and not wanting to do more research on
when they hold that. It's like, you know, they literally

(23:03):
hold the patent on it, but yet we're not spending
the money to do more research on it. We have
Israel leading the pack we're funding some stuff over there,
they're finding more stuff over there, meaning Israel, and we're
not doing enough in my opinion, when we know that
it works, and the government knows it works, that's why
they have the fucking patent on it.

Speaker 3 (23:20):
Yeah, and you know, a let's kind of break this
down shotgun style what we just discussed over the past
like ten minutes. So, the United States of America financed
doctor Rafael Michulm of Israel to study cannabis to see
if it could work, you know, for postmac stress all
the other things. It came back with positive results, which
probably the United States of America was hoping it wouldn't.
But they understand that it works. So now they go

(23:41):
out and get a patent that they can hold on
to it. Yet they still suppress veterans through NAIDA or
through the VHA or through the DEA. And now I
just want to kind of get your you know, you
touch on that in the book. I mean, I don't
want to give too much of a book away without
people going on to buy. It's a great read. But
why do you think the government is working that way?
When they had something that works, they funded it, Yet

(24:04):
they're still saying no, no, no, and suppressing it. Is
that the pharmaceutical kind of lobby. What were your thoughts?

Speaker 4 (24:11):
I haven't a clue. It makes no sense. And actually
the patent you're talking about is too. One is to
use cannabis as a very potent antioxidant anti cancer, and
the other is it's a neuroprotective. In fact, cannabis is not.
And this is Rachelda. Cannabis is not only a neuroprotecting.

(24:35):
In other words, it protects your nervous system, it also
can regenerate your damaged nervous system. Hence, we have the
example of Barbara Douglas, a federal patient now just ceased
that I work with for thirty years. Barbara had multiple
scrollses and it was deeply affected her physically. She got

(24:59):
put on the legal list out of smoking cannabis. Now.
I showed up at her house about about a couple
of months after she started smoking the cannabis, which was
in a beautiful little town called storm Lake Isle, and
she was in a wheelchair. If she moved it all

(25:20):
out of that wheelchair, she was using a cane. She
was in a considerable pain. I spent the weekend there
at her home. She was very gracious and I left.
I came back about a year later. Just just about
a year later, she met me standing at the front door.

(25:40):
Parked in the yard was a rather large r V.
Now keep in mind MS patients also have a problem
with going blind. Got this r V parked in the
yard and says, I want I want to show you something.
Now when you get in the r V place. I
got in the i V, she started it up, we
took off. She drove down the road, turned the thing around,

(26:03):
came back, parked it in the yard, and walked back
into her house with no assistance at it when I
left that weekend, instead of her sitting in a wheelchair.
A year later, again to show me, show me something.
Thank you, Barbara, she said goodbye to me by leaving
her backyard on Stone Lake on a jet skate. This

(26:28):
is a woman of the year before that couldn't couldn't
get out of a wheelchair. And again that's that's nerve
protection and it actually has that. What doctor Mitchueleman informed
me was that when when you got am asked, the
sheet around your nerve deteriorates, and by using cannabis that
she actually regenerates. Pat protects the nerving and you're not

(26:53):
good to go, but you're a hell of a.

Speaker 2 (26:54):
Lot better off and at least you can get up
and walk. I mean, for goodness sakes out, your stories
are just tremendous. We're gonna take a break real quick,
come right back, and I want to get your opinion
on the current situation with the VA and inequality. We're
going to talk about that with al Byrne. Of course,
sitting right next to me is Brian Buffley. It's Cannabis
Talk one on one. We got the military in the buildings,
folks when we went back after this break.

Speaker 1 (27:16):
Follow d at one Christopher Wright, Follow Joe Grande at
Joe Grunde fifty two. Subscribe to our weekly newsletter on
our website, Cannabis Talk one o one dot com.

Speaker 3 (27:35):
Welcome back to Cannabis Talk one on one number one PC, Canada.

Speaker 2 (27:42):
Cali effects is full and broad spectrum. Have extracted products
contained CBD, CBG and some thirteen hundred other plus elements.
You guys that are naturally derived substances from the hamp
and the plant. Check out their tinksters, their waters, their
topicals or bait collections. Go feel the effects with Cali effects.
Check them out online at califx dot com. We're gotting
Brian Buckley next to me, US marine veteran, former Marine

(28:03):
raider and of course the founder of CEO of HVGC,
and Al Burn is joining us via zoom, US Navy
veteran and co founder of Veterans for Medical Cannabis Access
and the author for Cannabis and Country. The book is
available now, go get yourself a copy. Just during the break,
our very own special Shaggy was over there saying, I

(28:24):
need to give me a copy of that book. Isn't
that the truth over there?

Speaker 4 (28:28):
Connor?

Speaker 2 (28:28):
It's one of those things you just hear and you
want to read these stories now even more in depth.

Speaker 6 (28:34):
No one, no one's really you know, getting this perspective,
and it seems like it's getting pretty censored and suppressed
and certain aspects of our society. So like like I'm like,
I want to tell my mom this, I want to
tell my dad this.

Speaker 3 (28:47):
My sister, my sister works in DC.

Speaker 2 (28:50):
So like when hook your sister up with Brian, not
to hook up like that, but to hook up, and
you know what I mean, His sister is over there
lobbying and you're like doing some big things over there.

Speaker 3 (28:58):
For Oh, I think that's great. I'd love to talk
to her.

Speaker 2 (29:01):
Yeah, yeah, and I think Brian would be actually a
great look for She would probably look at Brian like, Okay,
I'm the villa of the background and everything else. No. Absolutely, yeah,
that's a good idea. But it's true because we're sitting
here going wow, that was a long first break. But Al,
you're so interesting everything you say, and I can go
a story for story with everything and keep listening. But
I want to switch directions a little bit and ask you,

(29:22):
you know, with the current situation with the VA and
the inequality, because we hear so many stories from different
you know, military veterans that come in here, including Brian Buckley,
and when we sit down and talk or we bullshit
on the phone about it, it's just never a good conversation.

Speaker 3 (29:38):
No, you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (29:39):
It's never like, oh, guess what what? The VA got
their shit together now?

Speaker 3 (29:43):
Yeah, you know, And I will say in the VA's defense,
there are some really good people in there who want
to do right by veterans, but again, policies are suppressing them.
I mean, they are a federal agency, but we literally
have two doctors on the uc or vine research team
that we have that left the VA because a couple
of their veterans committed suicide. And they're like, we all say,
behind closed doors, we know cannabis can work, but now

(30:06):
we just need to prove it with American doctors. But
that's why they jumped onto that research because they really
believe it. But again, we know it works, It's been
proven throughout the world it works. Yet we keep suppressing
it and.

Speaker 2 (30:18):
We can't use it with our own military veterans that
served for our countries and that went out there and
did unimaginable things, right that are just like you know,
I've heard stories from you from other guys that are
just literally wiping out just doing your job to keep
us safe here in this country. Oh yeah, it's part
of war that you don't act like, you don't want
to talk about. No, what happens. People die, Yeah, and

(30:40):
people get killed, and it's part of what war is.
Al you've been through it, Brian, you've been through it.
And then when you go through that, there's.

Speaker 3 (30:47):
PTSD absoulutely and if you look at Al's generation, something
we didn't have to deal with. They were drafted a
lot of them. They didn't want to go, they had
to go, and then they come back and they're all suddenly,
you know, leopards in our society where people are calling
them baby killers and all this crazy stuff. So not
only did it deal with what they had to do
in that jungle, but then they come back and have
to deal with that. So you want to talk about

(31:08):
like two X in your PTS with all that stuff.

Speaker 2 (31:10):
And then not only that Al's time with even the
dealing with the Vietnam and that was even more of
a serious era of like the people attacking, you didn't
know when they were coming, when they weren't coming. I
feel like the other wars were more like World War Two.
Even going for the Back you went out, you came
back in, you went out, you came back in. Vietnam
was like the start of the craziest PTSD because you

(31:31):
never really knew what was going to happen at any point.

Speaker 6 (31:33):
You know.

Speaker 3 (31:33):
I think it's a great point. I was actually thinking
about this while reading Al's book, and you look at
it like generations of warfares and what they had to
go through. So there's probably like the Marine Raiders were
the first special Operations Group that started back on World
War Two in the Pacific to do to island hopping campaign,
and there might be, god, there might be ten of
them left. I mean we bring them out to raider
events every year and they're great guys. And we had

(31:55):
this seventy fifth anniversary Iguadacanal and we had a two
star general speak as a guest of honor, and they
were just out there for the anniversary of Guada Canal,
like seventy five years and he picked up sand and
put it in vials to bring back to the raiders
who served on Guadaca doown gives them to him, and
the old raiders are talking this great stories and you know,
they're amazing guys. They want to hear our stories. And

(32:16):
we're like, dude, let's hear what you did. And they
kept talking about this hill that they kept slipping down,
and we're all like, why were you slipping down this hill?
I mean, they just kept bringing this up. They're like, oh,
all the blood, we just couldn't keep our footing. We
just kept slipping. And we're all looking at each other like, dude,
we've been in some like hard fights. I never slipped
down the hill. Cubs, all the blood everywhere, and it
just seems like each generation of warfare are gonna say

(32:39):
it's a weird way of sayings, might be a little
bit cleaner of a war, like more surgical, where you know,
World War One they're jumping in trenches at each other,
and World War Two it's up close and very personal
at times. Vietnam same thing. You know, you have the
IEDs being introduced, some booby traps and you're actually, you know,
I always say to Vietnam guys, I don't think they
understood the war they were fighting in the counterinsurgency where

(33:00):
we were looking at General west Moreland. Take land, kill people.
That's how you win a war. Well, not when you're
fighting kind of terrorist organizations if you want to call
it that. It's about a war of ideas, a war
of people, human terrain. So I think we're a little
bit behind the curve there. And then as each war
kind of progresses, we get more high tech equipment and
we can do things a little bit more exact.

Speaker 2 (33:20):
Drones now we have a tag.

Speaker 3 (33:21):
Yeah, but I mean now's situation and definitely being a
Navy CB, I guarantee this guy was building like a
hut under fire.

Speaker 2 (33:27):
What is a CBE by the way out, It's an abbreviation.

Speaker 4 (33:32):
It stands for Construction Battalion c B. So the icon
of the Navy construction battalions is a bumblebee. And in
the hands of the bee, if you will, there's an
oil can, and there's a wrench, and there's a machine gun.

(33:54):
The cebes are mobile naval Mobile Construction Battalion CBS work
all over the world. Their second job is that of
light infantry. Just like Brian says, most of the construction
they do is in the middle of a bad day,
but they just go out there and they do it
anyway because that's the job. I worked with them for

(34:18):
three years as an officer, and I was impressed with it.
We had the battalions carried about nine hundred men. A
couple of times we had as many as twelve to
fourteen hundred with us, and I was impressed by every
one of them. Their leadership, their middle grade petty officers
and the chief petty officers were to a man, exceptional.

(34:42):
But they paid a hell of a price. By the
second year I was in the CBS, and we had
been deployed twice, once to the Caribbean. And the second time,
we were sitting out the middle of the Indian Ocean
on an island called the Garcia's right on the equator,
and there were fourteen hundred men on the island, men,

(35:08):
no women, No women allowed on the island. But by
that the end of that tour, again no women on
the island. The married men in that battalion, including me,
had a eighty three percent of horse ray. I can
guarantee you these men were not fooling around. They were anything,

(35:29):
but they were working hard at a dangerous job and
a hard place. I'll tell you a story though. I
lived in a what we call like a Vietnam heart.
It's just a flywood shock, really, and four feet up
is flywood, and then you got some screen, and then
you got a tin roof and a fan. We had electricity,
so me and my roommate. At the end of the day,

(35:52):
the day started at four point thirty in the morning.
The end of the day was six o'clock eighteen hundred.
Eighteen hundred was sitting in our bunk, drinking beer and
polishing our brass in our boots for the next day
to go back to work. At four o'clock and my
roommate looks at me and he says, heyah, I smell
a woman. And I had, oh, Red, you've lost it, man.

(36:13):
I know we've been out here a long time. There's
just you know, you know, there's no women here. Red.
And he looked at me again and he says, yeah,
I smell a woman. I said, yeah, okay. So he
got up and he went to the little screen door
we had. He looked out on the little dusty path
that was front in front of our door, which went
to the Officers Club. I mean, this is Sebee's. When

(36:35):
they pull into someplace, they do two things right away.
They build the Enlisted Man's Club and the Officers Club.
They have their own and they stuck it very well.
So yep, walking down this little dead path on the
way to the Officers Club was a female Air Force major.

(36:57):
She was going down the Oak Club and get a
drink and yeah brought in. She was the command pilot
for the once a week starlifted that we got from
the Philippines that brought in our male and our food
and people. And uh so uh she, as far as
I know, was the first female to inhabit Diego Garcia
in the in the seventies, a shod story military. But

(37:21):
he smelled that woman.

Speaker 2 (37:22):
That's awesome.

Speaker 4 (37:23):
Yeah, yards away.

Speaker 3 (37:25):
Was everyone looking their best trying to clean and clean
the dust off. Well, I was laughing like when you're
saying that, because we uh, you know, you got female pilots, right,
So we were in the middle of Afghanistan and we
have our jtach and that's the guy who controls the aircraft,
and they'll check in, you know, they'll be like, oh,
you know dagger two three. You know, we got blah
blah blah blah blah bah whatever on their aircraft. And

(37:45):
next you know, we just had a female like F
fifteen pilot check in and she's like, hey, how you
doing this? Is magenta this and that? And I literally
saw the J tack like pop up his shirt. It's like, hello,
hell are you doing it? I'm like, dude, not get
like he was like flirting with the girl, Like just
keep it professionally, do like iven talk to a girl
like months? You know, it was. It was pretty crazy.
So I'm sure al was probably everyone was wearing their

(38:06):
navy best out there.

Speaker 2 (38:07):
I mean, how do you had it changed tremendously? Right,
because now women are fully active duty compared to when
I was in there, right, I mean and with you
as there in.

Speaker 3 (38:16):
More combat arms. Uh, when women were never allowed in
that kind of transition while I was in, was it.

Speaker 2 (38:23):
Like the beginning when you were in when you were
you were at the beginning of Iraq?

Speaker 3 (38:26):
Right, yeah, and we were you know, probably women didn't
get into the infantry in the Marine Corps until after
I left. They kept trying, and they kept trying. Basically
the Marine Corps like we're only going to let the
first female in the infantry is going to be an officer.
They're like, it's not gonna be enlisted. And what kept
reports out of Quantico kept coming out was with the
rock marches, women are just built different than men. It's

(38:49):
just what we've had to do through history. It was
the load bearing weight was messing up their hips. It
couldn't sustain like we could for the body that machine guns,
and those were like women who wanted to do this.
I mean you're talking about like, I'm sure there's women
that were crowded, like let's go triathletes out of like
naval cat I mean, they were spuds. They would crush
us some physical pete and stuff, but it was just

(39:09):
a weight would get them. But a couple made it.
We had a couple make marine reconnaissance that was straight
up legit. It's a good thing. I think the one
thing the Marine Corps is doing right that gets a
lot of pushback and just kind of what everyone called
the woke world that we're living in. And it was
actually a couple of female congress women who saved the
Marine Corps. The Marine Corps will will not allow women

(39:31):
and men to be in the same platoon during boot camp. Uh,
they're like, listen, you put boys and girls together, they're
gonna do boys and girl things like we're here to
build marines. And I agree with that. The Army's done it,
the Navy's done it. Now you're dealing with a whole
set of issues of maybe recruits are hooking up or
whatever and just dramas it happens. We're not here for
this ship. We're here to build you into a warrior

(39:52):
once you get out of here. Whatever's gonna happen is
gonna happen.

Speaker 2 (39:55):
Our tax dollars needs to build soldiers, not fucking relationship.

Speaker 3 (39:57):
On hundred percent. But yeah, but from als time, my time, Yeah,
it's totally changed.

Speaker 2 (40:01):
And what about today twenty twenty three? Are there women
that will go to anywhere if there's a problem now
as a frontman, like you know, with guns and shooting
and leading the pack like.

Speaker 3 (40:13):
That, I just always say there's a time and place
for everyone. Women I think can do excellent work in
certain three letter agency. Let's put it out that way
that men can't do.

Speaker 2 (40:24):
Next cia Oh, I mean just.

Speaker 3 (40:26):
Like I can't go into a bar and find, like,
I don't know, a drunk Russian and start talking to
him and he says, start giving international secrets. Well, maybe
a woman who might look good goes up there and
is talking to the guy, and the guy might start
spilling some beans because he's trying to show off this guy.

Speaker 2 (40:37):
And that's literally what we have to right.

Speaker 3 (40:41):
Maybe maybe not, I'm just saying, but I mean there's
a time and place. I mean, we had a thing
where they're like, we need to get women in special operations.
I asked the question, why are we running out men?
They're like, well no, and I'm like, so what are
we doing? They're like, well, we might need to put
a ladder in front of a wall or distance, like
you can't degrade the selection process, Like, I don't care
if you had if I as a giraft. If you
can do it, you're in. If you can't, you're out.

(41:02):
And a lot of guys.

Speaker 2 (41:03):
Agree, it doesn't matter what color you are, what species.

Speaker 3 (41:06):
You better be able to pick my ass up and
take me off the battlefield.

Speaker 2 (41:09):
And if you can't do that, then that's.

Speaker 3 (41:11):
It's not for you. And that's where I think they
kept a standard and they've had people try and it
just hasn't worked out.

Speaker 2 (41:16):
Oh, the women couldn't follow the protocol of couldn't I mean,
could a woman say I want to be a marine raid.

Speaker 3 (41:23):
We've had a couple of tried out. I do not
think any of made it. I know they kind of
got wiped out pretty early. So when I heard I'm
gonna be very candid here, you had a couple of
women make army rangers fifteen years ago or something, and
there was a lot of controversy. It was coming out
that they were kind of pushed through. And then when
people ask, hey, we want to do an investigation, we
want to see their training jackets, their training jackets mysteriously disappeared.

(41:47):
So when I heard a couple of women made marine reconnaissance.
I'm like, okay, here we go again. But we talked
to the cadre members. They're like, straight up, they did
everything we wanted them to do their recon Great, you
made it. We've had some women try out for raiders,
just they haven't made it through. But then again that's
on a knock on the womanhood.

Speaker 2 (42:03):
Is there a woman Navy seal?

Speaker 3 (42:04):
I don't think so I do nothing. I don't think
there's any women in special ops. I might not be right,
but again.

Speaker 4 (42:14):
The Navy has not allowed that the units I do.

Speaker 2 (42:21):
Yeah, I mean the movies has it right.

Speaker 3 (42:24):
It was so legit, I mean totally.

Speaker 2 (42:26):
But and then the things that you point out like
that though, Brian, like, I didn't really think of it
that way. But it doesn't matter if these are the requirements,
and you can pass the requirements, and one of them
is carrying a two hundred and fifty pounds man because
with backpack on and this and that, maybe it's two
sixty five or two eighty five, whatever it is. And
if you can't drag that fifty yards, well then you

(42:47):
can't go out there with us because you can't save
us if we need you to save us and everybody
who goes out there with me. We're gonna go kill
everybody we run into. And if we get shot and
we're down, I need you to be able to pick
me up or pick the guy next to you up
and take.

Speaker 4 (43:00):
His ass back.

Speaker 3 (43:01):
That's it.

Speaker 2 (43:02):
I mean, that's a fair game to me as far
as like, hey, what are the requirements.

Speaker 3 (43:06):
These are the records, requirements. You make it. I don't
care how you identify. You make it. You're in. If
you don't, you're out.

Speaker 2 (43:11):
I actually like that when you say it that way,
because I didn't think of it that way. I don't
know what I was thinking, but I mean, as long
as you pass the qualifications, and they don't need to
make them special.

Speaker 4 (43:20):
No.

Speaker 2 (43:20):
I mean, if there's a woman, and I'm sure there's
plenty of women that actually want to do it too,
which is better, worse, creative? Funny? I don't know, it's
not funny, it's just awesome. I mean you look at
these women fighters nowadays, you know, in the UFC, and
you go, wow, I never knew women could fight like that.
I love watching the women fights. I'm watching WNBA Championship
a few weeks ago, Like I love watching women play
sport like that. I love women, and then I think, going,

(43:41):
there's nothing wrong with a women's soldier like that, but
can they compete at the level that is the standard level,
not the men level, the standard level, period, and that's
what it needs to be. I like that. That was
a great answer our current situation with the VA and equality.
How is it going for people out there? What are
you your thoughts as a US Navy veteran and of

(44:02):
course the co founder of Veterans for Medical Cannabis Access,
how is the VA doing.

Speaker 4 (44:09):
Well? You know, the current status is thirteen years old.

Speaker 2 (44:16):
Con changed in thirteen years? Is that what you're saying?

Speaker 4 (44:19):
Yeah? And of course the status sucks because what has
occurred is both good and bad. I address this a
lot in my book, but my partner in crime here
is Air Force veteran Mike Krabbits. You guys might be
interested in. Yeah. Anyway, what we formed together the Veterans

(44:44):
for Medical Cannabis Access, and we did that in two
thousand and seven, and our mission was to allow the
VHA to use cannabis. Guys that go to the VHA
can use cannabis medically. That was our mission and it
was accomplished in July or twenty ten, three years. It
took us, but hey, it was great, and Mike and

(45:07):
I were elated. We still are at some degree on
one side of one side of my side says this
is good, man, because tens of thousands of vets overnight
could use cannabis. Great. On the other hand, tens of
thousands of vets on the same night couldn't use cannabis.
So I call this VHA policy medical treatment by geography.

(45:33):
And what that means is what it implies, is it
depends where the veteran lives. The veteran lives in what
is considered a legal state or territory of the United States.
Legal meaning cannabis is authorized medically or recreationally or both,
then the VET that lives in that state or territory

(45:53):
can go to the VHA say, hey, doc, I use
cannabis for pain and it's helping me in the dark,
sess coll Man. They write it down and life goes on. However,
if the VET lives in a state where it is
not quote legal, say Kansas, the vet, the vet goes
to the A and says, hey, doc, I used cannabis
Japan and he says listen, man, I can't even talk

(46:16):
to you. You have to leave the grounds and you
have to come back here when you're clean. At Canon
medical treatment by geography you can have that.

Speaker 2 (46:28):
I mean, that's just it's just terrible.

Speaker 3 (46:30):
It really is. And we have a gentleman that you know,
pops in on some of our Veteran Action Council calls
a gentleman from Wisconsin and law abiding citizen. He's dealing
with some demons. Cannabis. Seems like it would be a
really good thing for him to take, and he won't
because it's illegal in Wisconsin. So again you have veterans

(46:50):
you know, who could benefit them, yet they can't touch
it because of what al said. You know, medication by
geography basically.

Speaker 2 (46:56):
Would they use the you know, the cb g's in
the case and they use the other you know, uh,
what is the d H you know the delta.

Speaker 3 (47:07):
That's yeah, I mean those are cut out of the
farm bill, so they can use that stuff for sure?
Is as effective? I don't know, I mean we kind
of go back again, like.

Speaker 2 (47:15):
I used the real stuff.

Speaker 3 (47:16):
I don't know, and then like we have the research
that the real stuff works, So I don't know, what
the det doing and.

Speaker 4 (47:22):
The real the real stuff for your audience, just what
I call whole plant cannabis, not individual compounds like Delta nine,
but the whole plan. And doctor michieldam to go back
to him. He labeled the use the use of the
whole plan as opposed to these individual compounds. He called
it the entourage effect. In other words, that the sum

(47:46):
was greater than all the parts. If you will, that'll
say it entourage effect. I want to go back. If
I can't, guys, just for a minute, I made a
couple of notes. You guys blew buy some stuff. Uh.
Brian mentioned research. Hear that all the time, research research,
not enough research, bullshit. Cannabis is the most research plant
in the world, in the world most research plant. The

(48:11):
key word here is world. Now the United States has
another key word that its state department and its whole
attitude uses all the time, and it's called hubris. Hubris
That means that the United States fields its professional class

(48:32):
feels that if the work is not done by US
scientists in the US, it's worthless, which of course is
intellectually absurd. Right now, you have about forty countries four
zero countries in the United States. In the world that

(48:53):
has medical cannabis in its is a country's pharmacopeia forty
of the fourth And then they say, well, drug companies
are against this. I don't know. The fourth largest drunk
company in the world is Mirk, and Mirk distributors cannabis
in those forty countries. Wow, so they're making money, they're

(49:15):
helping out. That's just the thing on the research it
is there, So that argument is completely fantasy. The other
thing I want to point out, I don't mention this
in my bio much, but I spent five years as
a peer counselor for combat veterans, almost all of them Vietnam,

(49:36):
a few from South America, Central America. Almost all were men.
We did have a fair percentage of women, maybe five
to eight percent. They were all nurses, most of them
Army nurses, some Navy. So as a counselor, of course,
we talked us the other councilors that all confer. Well,
here's what we find out that some forty to six

(50:00):
percent of our clients who were in to talk about
their trauma experiences in their military had prior trauma experiences
before They've been gotting the military they had somehow been
trauma talls tick away. It happened to him. So when

(50:20):
they got into the into the service and they get
in some goddamn mesh uh, this is just a reinforcement
of trauma they already had, which they were having Tubo
dealing with. Anyway, Now they got another problem, and so
and and then the other problem for US is Vietnam veterans.
Of course, nobody believed us. Nobody believed us about anything.
You know, they didn't believe we were in a war

(50:41):
that didn't believe Come.

Speaker 2 (50:43):
On, yeah, they can only imagine and killers anyways, there
you go, baby killers, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 (50:50):
Yeah, baby killers. But but the problem was we said,
we said to the docs, which this stuff helps me,
and and they and they didn't. So these that whole generation,
my guys have gone forty years without treatment. We're traumatized already,
they get retraumatized and then they're not treated.

Speaker 2 (51:13):
I mean, I think most people in general, right, And
I mean I say this because of my AA program
of dealing with life, being sober twenty five years, working
with you know, men and sponsoring this like you said,
you did that for five years. I've been sponsoring men
for twenty some years, and I look at everybody who
has an addiction issue, and it's usually because of trauma. Absolutely,

(51:35):
you know what I mean, somer early medication, right, I
mean exactly, so you know, and you look at the
Freudian theory, all trauma stems from childhood issues. And whatever
their issue is is their issue, from daddy issue, mommy issue,
big brother issue, little sister, whatever it is, Uncle Larry
touching you. I mean, shit happens to everyone, and life

(51:56):
just keeps treating people like that. And then of course
a lot of people I had it so fucked up.
I'm just going to go to the military because they'll
loved me there. So I can totally see how what
you're saying there, which makes it even more of a
I didn't even realize that. But normal people who don't
go to the military have tons of fucking problems. I mean,
everyone could use therapy, for God's sakes. But then you

(52:17):
add the problems that you have anecdotally with forty to
sixty percent of your clients that you guys have all
mingled with have had previous issues. I mean, look at
the kid that says, you know what their parent were
Army vet Navy vet, whatever it is. I just want
to serve my country. May not have those traumas ye
as a child, but now does oh for sure. I
mean it's just a dice roll no matter what. Well,

(52:39):
and that's why geted so much issues.

Speaker 3 (52:41):
You know, I think poshmag stress, not like pegople on
the military would have monopolize it. But I think a
lot of people associate poshmac stress with the military, and
it's like it's not a military issue, it's a human
condition exactly. Anyone can suffer from this. And again you're
seeing a viable option like cannabis. I'm sure al doos too.
I got some veteran friends who are doing great with
psychedelics and they're not touching the alcohol anymore, and they're

(53:04):
living in more fulfilled life, a better family life, better
professional life. So it gets again very frustrating when you
have the VA or NIDA or DEA or whomever it is.
They're not like turning every rock possible to see what
can help our men and women who raised their right
hands and said I'll go fight for our country. Why
we're not paying that back to him on the back
end is beyond me. But this is why you got

(53:25):
veterans like myself and now and the other members of
Veteran Nation Council say fuck it, We'll go do it
ourselves and get this stock.

Speaker 2 (53:31):
And you guys are pushing hard. We're gonna take a
break real quick. We're gonna come back Alburn and of
course Brian Buckley here serving our military and helping so
many people out. When we come back, I want to
talk about suicide and the homeless vets that are out there.
What can people do to help? What are your guys' thoughts.
I want you guys to give people the thought of

(53:53):
this is what we can do for them, because you know,
you meet so many people us being even where we're
at in Orange County, you can see the home lists
around here, so many our veterans. What are some tools
that we can be as civilians to help these people?
Give us some educated guesses of what we can do
better to help The Society's Cannabis talk one on one.
We'll be right back.

Speaker 3 (54:13):
After this break.

Speaker 4 (54:15):
Do you want to hear your name counted out live
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leave up the point mail.

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Make sure you like, follow and subscribe to Cannabis Talk
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You know what get now back to the.

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Mark Karnes, Chris Frankeno, Jennifer Erica and Elvis. Thank you
guys all for doing what you're doing for the show.
Brian Buckley Al Burns over here. Of course, Al the
Navy veteran has his brand new book that's out that
we started the whole conversation with which for country and
cannabis take a look at that. But as we've talked

(55:29):
about so many great things. You know, I want to
be educated. And first of all your guys' thoughts on
the suicide and homeless for vets, how it's just so massive, right,
it's not a joke. I remember even sponsoring a guy
in AA that was a military VET and he served
in Vietnam. As an older guy. I'll never forget being
at the Marina clubhouse and I spoke and then afterwards,

(55:53):
because I talked to you outside, old dude, I was like,
oh shit, what does this old man want for me?

Speaker 4 (55:56):
Right?

Speaker 2 (55:57):
And we're talking to would you saw me? I was
like wow? And he was He was a VET from
Vietnam and after he's serve and he was living in
the the wetlands right there Marina del Rey, right, So
who was homeless? And uh, and you know it was
an honor to sponsor this man and to work with

(56:17):
this man. But after one year of sobriety that he celebrated,
he went and thought he had one more running him
and he went into a hotel room and ended up
killing himself. And uh, you know, he started using again.
Until this day, I'll never forget him because on my
whatever year it was birthday, he bought me a chip,
and I was like, you don't buy me a chip.

(56:38):
You're homeless.

Speaker 4 (56:38):
Dog.

Speaker 2 (56:38):
I don't need you to buy me a fucking gift. Dog,
you know what I mean? But oh, I still have
that in my jewelry box at home from him as
one of those like you know, I can't believe this
man bought me this as he served our country and
went through so much, and the things that I heard
from him, Uh, that was you know, one man that
I that I tried to help out. And you know,
my question to you guys is you know he killed himself.

(56:59):
I have are experience with a veteran that I was
literally reading, praying, holding hands with, trying to guide him
through his demons, and you know, it wasn't enough, and
he took his own life. You know, there's so many
others out there that are doing that. What can we
do as civilians? What can we do People that are
listening that are going, wow, we know the rates high,

(57:22):
The numbers don't lie. It's it's not a thing. And
I'm not sitting here trying to get the numbers. I'm
sure you guys have them in your heads. But what
can we do as individuals here? Even in this office, like,
how can we support how can we help these people out?

Speaker 3 (57:36):
Yeah? I mean, aw, what what are your thoughts? I mean,
you know, not to You've got more experience in this
and been through a lot more than what I've been through.

Speaker 2 (57:43):
But I'm seeing a lot more suicide, That's what I'm saying.
I've been around since Vietnam and Keys.

Speaker 3 (57:48):
I think even two al might be interesting. You know,
you saw an uptick in Vietnam veteran suicide rates when
they retired. You know, I was reading things about how
maybe they suppress things because they're busy with work, but
once they retired and they kind of had an idle mind,
those demons kind of came back at him. What are
your thoughts on that?

Speaker 4 (58:07):
Yeah? I agree with your assessment there, Brian. I'll tell
you a story. When I was a COUNSELAW the counciling
agency that I worked for, which was in charliston Ave
was hired by the Federal Bureau of Investigation and me
and another councilor were sent to the FBI headquarters in

(58:29):
DC to work on magic on FBI agents. And here's
why we were there. A lot of FBI agents ex
military I mean a lot. It's a huge percentage. It
makes sense. These guys are patriots, they know how to
use weapons, they've been in tough situations, they think, well, etc. Fright,

(58:51):
So they went to work for the FBI. They got
the military, went to work for the FBI cardagon, and
they did well, and then at the end of their time,
retirement came out. They retired, and within two years they
were shooting themselves, killing themselves dozens, and so they hired
us to find out why. Well, you know, it's sort

(59:15):
of the same answer that when you get out of
the military, you've been in a you've been in in
an emotional place that you'll probably never get into again.
Everybody that you're surrounded by is in the same spot
that you are, and the only way you're going to
get out of it, or get anything good out of

(59:36):
it is to do it together and do it right,
and then you get it. In the civilian world, and
everybody else has a different agenda than you. Everybody's got
a different agenda. If you're a civilian in the military,
you don't have a different agenda. You have a mission
and that's what you do. You do the mission, whatever
your fucking personal agenda is doesn't really matter. Go see

(59:58):
the trampelin. This is that you're I'll go do it,
you know in the world, and it doesn't. So I
think that the problem with the military is the same
with these FBI agents. They left their community, they were
not supported, they were not followed up. Now I had
I had another client. This guy was interesting. He was

(01:00:19):
He was a seaman and UH in Pearl Harbor when
the Jets bomberok place in December seventh. He then served
in Korea and then I served with him in Vietnam.
He was in three wars UH and UH. Part of
his time was as a CIA agent. There's a real
big number of CIA agents who are actually active duty

(01:00:42):
military personnel, usually officers or senior enlisted then and they
just they still have their rank, they still get their
still Marines or they're still in the Air Force, but
they're in the they work for the CIA. This guy
was one of them. And the CIA doesn't have the problem.
The FBI did. And we pointed this out to the FBI.
The CIA never lets an agent go. When when you

(01:01:05):
leave the c I A you will you will be visited,
uh not you know a lot, but you'll be visiting,
there'll be an agent knock on your door and have
to do the guy and say, hey, how you doing,
Let's have a talk. And if that, if that interview
it feels anything right, this guy's having trouble assimilating doing anything.

(01:01:26):
Damn they're alone. Just well, yeah, it's it's a totally
So the FBI, hopefully with our recommendation atop to the
c I A agency. So that's a long story. It's
a story. To answer your question, the answer is, you
have to stay with these people. Just like you're talking shoe,
you're a sponsor. What that means is you're hanging with

(01:01:46):
this guy or this girl. You're going to help them
when they're when they're down, and you do and ask
what the vets need when they go down, and they will.
You got to help them up. They can't do it alone.
They can't. They need their brother their sisters, and they
need the assistance of the civilian community and the understanding. Now,
I'm very happy when in one sense, when I when

(01:02:10):
I was in the military in the sixties and seventies,
the military was considered dead end job, You're a loser.
Now the military is rated number one. If you're a
military veteran, I can do the military. You're respective, same
with first responders e. Mts, firefighters, cops, nurses. These are

(01:02:31):
the people that do the do the gun work, and
that is now respected in our society. What we need
to do now is take that respect and make it
more active. We need to spend more money on veterans.
It's ridiculous that some of these homeless guys, some of
these people that are going to commit suicide while we're
on the show. What they need is they need somebody

(01:02:53):
to be there with them. They need cannabis. Maybe maybe
they're in in Wisconsin and they need cannabis to help,
and then they know that they can they can't get it.
So there's there has to be more of an awareness,
there has to be more flexibility. There have to be
more openness, and a hell a lot less name calling
and just and that would help the situation. But suicide,

(01:03:17):
you know, the VA keeps saying it's twenty two or there. Well,
when they're right, that's still that's still freaking markable. I
don't think that's I don't think that's true at all.
Everybody that I've taught you that knows anything about this
situation says the numbers got to be more like sixty
or seventy of them. I know when I was counseling.

(01:03:37):
I was a counselor. I started counseling in nineteen What
the hell was that seventy nine or something like eighty.
And by that time there had been more Vietnam vets
committed suicide than died in the war. And that was
back then, and now with Vietnam veterans. I don't know

(01:03:57):
if you guys know this, but many of us left.
By the statistics, there shouldn't be something on the order
of one point seven million of us still left alive,
but in fact, there's only about a half a million,
maybe five hundred and fifty thousand of us left alive.
Two reasons suicide and agent orange, so that the effect

(01:04:20):
on individual generations is different. But the overall is these
guys girls need help, and if that means they should
be given a free house for until they get their
shit together or whatever, then good. I work out of Tallahassee.
I deliver food to a place called Veterans Village in Tallahassee, Florida.

(01:04:42):
There's fifty four men and women out there. They're all homeless,
but they were taken off the streets. They were given
a ruling nice apartment. It's a complex, it's a compound.
It's very nice. It's clean. Everybody's got their own bed,
their own bathroom. There are a little apartment to live.
Then they get fed and they get found a jaw

(01:05:03):
and their turnover is really fast because these people that
are helping these des really have their shift together. And Tallahassee,
like a lot of the South, is very open to
helping veterans. And those are the kinds of things I'd
like to see duplicated motion wide.

Speaker 2 (01:05:21):
We need to see that in every big metropolitan city
as well. Yeah in that area that you're oh, man,
that's the first place of our country you're talking about there.

Speaker 3 (01:05:29):
But we'll move on. But you know, now those are
some great points because you know, os Part Special Operations
Command are known as SOCOM, and once a quarter at
least I get a phone call from SOCOM Care Coalition
where they're just like what AL said, They're like, Hey,
what's going on? How are you? What's up? Could be
a five minute talk, could be an hour long talk.
They're just there to check in on us and what

(01:05:49):
we actually instituted for all the raiders and seals and
Green braves. We had a thing called third level Decompression.
And this was started by a guy named Oh my god,
Admiral mccraven, who is famous for known as the three
star general who's in charge of Jaysak, who planned to
have been loaden raid, you know, went well, he got
his fourth star, he took over all so com but

(01:06:11):
he was the saying, he's like, you know, we've got
these great Americans going out and do amazing things, and
by the time we're done with them, they're broken physically,
maybe broken mentally, and they kind of limped through the
rest of their life and suicide and things. We need
to get ahead of this. And he did a study
about when you went to war in you know, Europe
during World War two, or even even Korea versus Vietnam,

(01:06:33):
you know, to get over to Europe, it took about
two weeks to get there on a boat to and from.
So you might be coming back from theater and you
and I just sit into chow hall and I'm kind
of like, man, I saw something kind of crazy, and
You're like, hey, I saw the same thing. Now I
don't feel so isolate. You saw it too. We have
that conversation and it kind of builds from there. Fast
forward to the Vietnam era. You know, they're in maybe

(01:06:54):
a hallacious firefight, and seventy two hours later they're in
a bed with a wife and a screaming kid they
just met, and they're still trying to process what the
heck just happened. And again, maybe they kind of push
those demons down, but they weren't really taught how to
treat or deal with them. She never get rid of them.
You just got to live above them. And that was
a great thing or doing in a socom world. By
we come back from a deployment, we go to a

(01:07:15):
resort for a week, the cops are read in. You
had designated drivers, you got to meet with your physical therapists,
you got to meet with a psych you got to
do everything, even to the point in our active duty
units we had family therapists, psychologists, sports psychologists because they
want to make sure. You know, sometimes I couldn't tell
my wife everything that's going on. She might think I'm
having an affair and it's messing up my family. Like, no,

(01:07:36):
I got something going on, I can't talk to you
about because you don't have clearance. So we talked through
those issues. So I can go down range and be
as volatile as I need to be and put overwhelming
lethality down our enemy. Because I have a happy heart.
Everything's cool back in the rear. Then when I come back,
gives a little readjustment time. Then you get back with
your family and you're good to go. And I'm just
saying to the conventional military, why aren't you guys doing

(01:07:59):
that for them, Because the amount of money you'll save
on the back end from VA disability claims and all
the other pumps and bruises and the mental anguish that
we're going through, it would be you wann't have to
pay out all that money, and you're gonna have these
amazing Americans go on and do some great things for
your country instead of being on the streets and taking
drugs and trying to figure.

Speaker 2 (01:08:17):
Out It seems like everything that you just described right there, Brian,
and even hearing the things out that you said, like
you know, these homes that are out there in Florida
for the veterans, like I'm for that. I've always said
veterans and teachers get fucking treated the worst in our
country for doing so much for our country. Right, Yeah,
those are like the two people that I just I
grouped them together like Doug in my opinion, Joe Lopez's opinion,

(01:08:40):
I look at teachers and veterans like damn man. These
teachers don't get paid enough. These veterans don't get paid
enough for doing what they've done. But as you say that,
with the experience that our government that our country has had,
what you just described should be mandatory when you come out,
just like the CIA does, and hopefully the FBI incorporated that.

(01:09:02):
That was a great story that you said, what they
do on these check ins, I didn't even realize that.
I mean, I believe now even looking at that, every
group needs a quote unquote sponsor that checks in on
them constantly every other week, month, drop in whatever it is,
until in until forever.

Speaker 7 (01:09:21):
Oh yeah, and because there's no ending to this, And Joe,
I'll challenge everyone out there listening, look at the benefits
a member of Congress gets, even they just serve one term,
what they get for the rest of their lives versus
what a veteran.

Speaker 2 (01:09:35):
We're sitting in a fucking suit in a building with
a nice everything. We're a literallysh fruit and everything else.
When they go into the building there.

Speaker 3 (01:09:41):
Maybe just for twenty four months, they might just be
a congress person. They did twenty four they one term
and to get out. Look at what they get paid
for rest of their life. It will blow you away.
And yet we got men and women who went and
fought wars that you sent them to Congress, and yet
you're kind of neglecting them on the back end, but you're.

Speaker 1 (01:09:58):
Taking care of it.

Speaker 2 (01:09:58):
And they'll say, well, they signed up for that, they
know what they're doing exact Yeah, and you signed up
for that too, Oh well I signed up for the
better one. No, we need to take care more people. Yeah,
we need to take care of our people that went
out there and are suffering, and we need to allow
them to use cannabis's medicine. We need to allow them
to have access to everything that you guys have been
describing for more people. And how does that message get

(01:10:22):
to the congressman? How does someone listening going, You guys
are right, What can we do to make this happen?

Speaker 3 (01:10:29):
You need more veterans going to Congress. I mean I
really think that would be an answer. Unfortunately, I think
every not everyone, but people going there probably with the
right mindset. But ultimately you're gonna get corrupted. It's not
people who get you elected.

Speaker 2 (01:10:41):
I'm waiting for you to get corrupted because you've been
going for a while. You keep coming back pretty normal,
Like I see you pitchers and this and that. Well
you come back with stories, Joe, they want me to
do this, they want me to do that.

Speaker 3 (01:10:51):
I'm waiting for you to like, well out, But it's
it's that's the thing. It's like I had a person
bring up that they wanted to have me run for
Congress and they're like, hey, we'll get blank million dollars
behind you and you'll be in. And you're like, oh, okay, cool,
But then you actually think about what do you mean,
Like how many millions of favors do I owe at
that point if people are putting money behind me, And
that's where you're seeing a lot of things, Like you know,

(01:11:11):
I'm just gonna say about like a George Sorows people
talk about him and how much impact he has on
I think Elon must had a great interview on the
Latest Joe Rogan where he talked about the worst thing
to donate to is a presidential race and then it
goes to Senate and in Congress. Because it costs a
lot of money, you don't really get your bang for
your buck. But if you go into the local governments
and start throwing money in there and you start getting

(01:11:32):
DA's elected and things like that, and you want them
to change things that we're seeing in San Francisco, we're
seeing in Los Angeles, that's where you get your big
bang for your buck. But you're making that investment in there.
So again, it's just kind of there's a.

Speaker 2 (01:11:45):
Lot to good and that's a good point.

Speaker 3 (01:11:46):
I like that actually, So there's things to think about there.
And but at the end of the day, I think
veterans we all have this sheep dog mentality. I always
talk about the sheep dog and the wolf. Both are scary,
both are big, both at bangs, both are built of kill.

Speaker 4 (01:12:00):
Well.

Speaker 3 (01:12:00):
The difference between the two is the wolf will try
to kill the flock. The sheep dog will do whatever
has to do to protect the flock. And that's why
I think of men and women when they serve our country,
they're sheep dogs. So ultimately, if we could get more
veterans into Congress, and you're seeing some of them take
on like the Brian mass of the world. You know,
he's a disabled veteran. I think he's a double amputee.
He's co sponsoring and he's a Republican's co sponsoring a

(01:12:21):
lot of cannabis legislation. We need more Republicans like that, please. Yeah,
you got guys. You know, you got Dan Crenshaw who's
working on a lot of psychedelic stuff. It was a
Navy seal. So when you get these vets in there
who've like, hey, I've been there and done that, and
this stuff's working, not the pills that you're jamming down
our throats. I think that can help and hopefully it
gets more relief to what al saying. You know, put

(01:12:42):
them in a home for a year if that's what
they need, because ultimately, too, there needs to be an
interview process. It's just like what you you know, the
Twelve Steps. My buddy who helps me out with my nonprofit,
he's a recovering addict and we one time had a
vet just kind of do a crazy ivan on us
and just take off and one to leave rehab and
I'm getting all upset and he's like, hey, you popped
your cherry and I'm like, what do you mean. He's like,

(01:13:03):
that's what happens. Yeah, He's like, dude, he's like the
third step I think it was. He's like, it's the real,
it's real. It's like, you've got to look at yourself
that every decision in your life you made have got
you to this point. Now you need help, and if
you don't want to help yourself, no one else can
help you. So I think that's the thing where Al's
talking about they had such high rate of turnover because
these bets are like, hey, I just need to take
a knee for a little bit, get a little relief,

(01:13:24):
a little guidance, and I'm out of here. I don't
want to be in some shelter and have people take care.
I mean, I want to go fight my own fight
and do some good. It's the people who take on
that dictum mentality that's where you're going to have a
little problem with oh what was me? All that stuff,
But that you don't find that veterans they're sheep dogs.
They want to go out and do some good.

Speaker 2 (01:13:40):
Well, hopefully we can get some more good set around
this country because what you described in Florida, I would
love to see around the country, which is you know,
apartment styles like that one bedroom, one bath, boom. Here's
a chow hall almost like you know, the dorms in
a college, so to speak. And we should treat our
veterans like that and allow them to have that, and
allow cannabis to be there. And you know, not that

(01:14:03):
we should eliminate the alcohol there, but they should be.
You know, monitor it's a little bit going, hey, guys,
we can have twelve step meetings here as well. We
could have this meeting there, that meeting there, because I
truly believe that our veterans need the help and the cannabis,
the psychedelics, they're all helping and it's proven out there.
It's not like we're just sitting here making it up
like we have a fucking company. Well you do, but
that you know, look at how by my company. No,

(01:14:25):
it's like, okay, HVGC is a company. They're giving all
their profits back to the people exactly. So it's not like,
you know, hey, this is what we're trying to do.
But if you do want to support a company, HVGC
is supporting vets, you guys. I mean, Brian's been doing
it for a long time, and so has Gelato out
there helping the companies do the same thing. Gelatto is

(01:14:45):
a parent helping Brian with this company. And I shout
out to those guys over there because they're so quiet
about what they do that they don't even want the recognition,
and I got to give it to them when it's like, no, Dog,
I gotta say your name sometimes because people don't really
what you're doing to help VET. Yeah, exactly, which is
even funnier and weirder and whatever. Like they're like, I

(01:15:06):
don't say that, I'm not no Gelatto, thank you. A
company like Gelato does more for VET, you guys than
you can ever imagine. And that's a fact. So Al,
we're gonna take off now. Is there anything else that
you want to say and share. I'm sure we could
talk for another hour or so, but I just want
to say Happy Veterans Day to everybody out there, and Al,

(01:15:26):
you are such a blessing to talk to your stories
your book once again. Folks, order it on Amazon today.
It could be delivered for country and cannabis by al
Burn him and his two lovely dogs there. What are
the dog's names, By the way.

Speaker 4 (01:15:39):
Their military and ads. One is called Gallant, you know,
like a gallant ship. And the other one, the female
is I called her Courage. She's a Gola retriever. The
usually have eight or ten or twelve puppies, and she
came in as an only child, so it takes courage
to go along, and so I named it Courage.

Speaker 2 (01:15:57):
Nice beautiful names, beautiful dog. You're a beautiful man. Thank
you so much, Al for joining us again today and
coming on the show. And folks go out there read
the book. As Al's been supporting cannabis. It's his dad
had it back in nineteen sixty seven. He's a believer
in this medicine. He's lost family members, he's lost soldiers,
he's lost friends as well as all of us over

(01:16:18):
here has as well. So you know, like they said,
you want to support it, go to your local government.
Start there, and of course, encourage other veterans to do
the same with Congress, because Brian, I think that was
a key point right there on how we can do that,
encourage the veterans to get up and speak up by it.
Brian is one of those guys that goes out and
does this, So I mean you can see Brian Buckley.
Follow him on Instagram.

Speaker 3 (01:16:39):
At Brian buck Lee zero nine.

Speaker 2 (01:16:41):
There it is, folks, It's Cannabis Talk one on one.
If no one else loves you, we do.

Speaker 1 (01:16:46):
Follow Cannabis Talk one on one on all social media
and Cannabis Talk.

Speaker 4 (01:16:50):
One oh one.

Speaker 1 (01:16:51):
Thank you for listening to Cannabis Talk one on one
with Blue with Joe Brondey, the world's number one source
for everything cannabis.

Speaker 3 (01:16:58):
And make sure you like following. Some bride did Cannabis
Talking one on one now

Speaker 4 (01:17:07):
Mm hmm

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Meet Al Byrne! U.S Navy Veteran, Author & Co-Founder of Veterans for Medical Cannabis Access™ featuring Bryan Buckley of HVGC™!