Our guest, Yannick Gill is a human rights attorney based in Washington D.C. Yannick worked in Congress with 2 progressive members of the House of Representatives. He is Senior Counsel with Human Rights First, and an accomplished human rights advocate defending marginalized people across the United States and abroad.
In the first half of the show, we cover the impacts of Trump’s executive orders on Black and Brown communities. We discuss the attacks of DEI programs in the private and public sector. We also cover the destruction of USAID and the Department of Education.
Support the show: https://www.patreon.com/civiccipher?utm_source=search
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Broadcasting from the Hip Hop Weekly Studios. I'd like to
welcome you to another episode of Civic Cipher, where our
mission is to foster allyship empathy and understanding. I am
your host, ramses.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Jaw, he is Rams' joh, I am q Ward. You
are tuned into Civic Cypher, Yes you.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
Are, and we appreciate that because we are trying to
do some good work at a time that is challenging
for people who want to do good book. But today
we feel fortified and we feel alike it is the
best time to redouble our efforts because we are going
to be talking with someone who has earned our respect,
(00:36):
someone that has been in the media space with us before.
We've been able to have conversations with him before, and
we're happy to introduce him to you, our listener. He
goes by the name of Yannick Gill. He's a human
rights lawyer based in Washington, d C. He's worked in
Congress with two progressive members of the House of Representatives.
He is an accomplished human rights advocate defending marginalized people
(00:58):
across the United States and abroad. And today we are
going to be discussing Donald Trump's first one hundred days
in office. So welcome to the show, Yanick.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Glad to be here with you both.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Yeah, yeah, man, we appreciate it. Man, I know you're
a busy guy and you're taking the time out to
kind of help us make heads or tails of the
goings on. The political goings on out there in DC
really means.
Speaker 3 (01:21):
A lot to us.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
We're also going to be discussing, you know, the attacks
on DEI, which is something that we cover quite a
bit on this show. But you know, this is an
ongoing conversation. We have a way Black History fact and
Baba that I really want you to stick around for.
I'm really excited about both of those if we can
(01:45):
get to them, because I anticipate us having a really
important conversation today with Yanick. But we have so much
for you to stick around for, so please be sure
to hang out and learn as we learn. But before
we get to the learning, let's celebrate. As always. Now
is the time for some Ebony excellence, shall we?
Speaker 3 (02:05):
Yeah? I think we shall.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
So today's Abny excellence. This comes from WSBTV two andre
three thousand and big Boy. We're on the ballot for
the very first time. The only real question is whether
or not they would go into the Hall of Fame together.
On Sunday Night Live on American Idol, it was announced
that Atlanta's own hip hop legends, Outcast, will be headed
to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in Cleveland, Ohio.
(02:28):
They will join seven other performers who will be inducted
into the performer category. Bad Company, Chubby Checker, Joe Crocker,
Cyndi Lauper, Soundgarden, and The White Stripes all will join
Outcast and receiving their award November eighth and the Peacock
Theater in Los Angeles. Andre three thousand and Big Boy
aka Outcast teamed up way back in the early nineteen
nineties when they were high school students in Atlanta. Did
(02:49):
two release their first album in nineteen ninety four. The
duo have won six Grammys for their work over the years,
peaking with their highly acclaimed speaker Box Slash the Love
Below album, which was released in two thousand three. Both
Andre and Big Boy have produced a handful of solo
albums since two thousand and seven, but they did team up,
team back up and toured briefly in twenty fourteen. The
two men have appeared in several films and TV shows
(03:11):
over the years, and their legend only continues to grow.
And I don't know if you have heard any of
Q's and my other takes for folks that kind of
grew up listening to us, you'll know that, at least
(03:31):
I have said on many occasions then I've never had
any pushback from Q that Outcast is the best hip
hop group of all time. And we can have that conversation.
We might have to have it another day, but a day,
it might be another day. But yeah, that includes n
w A you know I am from counting, but that
it includes in w A Wu Tang, you know, ghetto boys,
(03:52):
you know, you name it. Outcast the best group of
all time. To see them get their just do and
be inducted into the rock Hole rock and Roll Hall
of Fame is so shout out to Outcast, all right,
mister Yannick Gil do us a favor. So again, we
have had conversations with you on the Black Information Network,
and you always bring a sense of clarity to the
(04:18):
massive amount of political stories, headlines goings on that you know,
the lay person, ourselves included because we're not political strategists.
We haven't worked with Congress folks. You know, we kind
of cover the news, but for folks that aren't as
(04:39):
familiar with your work like we are, talk a little
bit about your background and sort of what qualifies you
to help us make heads or tails of Trump's first
one hundred days in office.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Absolutely, and again, I'm really happy to be here with
you all. I describe myself in a simple way. I'm
a town of immigrants, I'm a Florida man, I'm a
black man. But I'm also a lawyer. And I've also
had the privilege of advising members of Congress on how
to navigate different issues that impact everyday folks. And no
(05:13):
matter what level of education you have, no matter what
job title you have, some of those core principles that
I began with is really how I analyze the law,
how I navigate these issues, and how I approach this
new challenge that we're all in, whether you want to
or not. And in my new role as Senior counsel
(05:33):
with Human Rights First, I'm able to do it all.
Human Rights First is an amazing organization where we have
a unique view of providing both litigation advocacy both here
meaning the United States and abroad, and these first one
hundred days, I've shown us that the strike of the pen,
(05:55):
the change of a tariff, the impact of any of
these laws don't stop with our borders, does stop with
any race, gender, any orientation. It's impacting all of us.
So above all these things, I say I'm an advocate
because that's where all of us need to be right now.
In twenty twenty five, you.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
Talked about the stroke of a pen, tariffs, the kind
of muzzle velocity executive order, disruption of seemingly every marginalized community,
not just like you said in our Borders, but across
the world. The first hundred days man the executive orders
(06:35):
and their impact on our communities. Specifically from your purview,
what does that look like, what does that feel like?
And should we feel as kind of helpless and hopeless
as we do.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
So the feeling is valid. As a millennial, I get
tired of hearing the word unprecedented, but in this case
it's very very true. Donald Trump has signed an unprecedented
and historic. Infamous is how our kids will probably learn
about it in a few years. But one hundred and
forty two executive orders in the first one hundred days,
(07:14):
he has moved at a neck breaking pace, impacting every sector.
So whether or not you're really into politics in one
way or another, you felt it. This has been issues
of immigration, asylum, human rights that I work on on
a day to day basis. It's been issues tied to
student loans, which many of us can relate to issues
(07:37):
tied to the climate, policing and the like. But your
question tied to how it's impacting us disproportionately, meaning black
and brown communities, is key. Within his first day in office,
President Donald Trump assigned several executive orders, and what it
did is it placed us in a situation of KAO
(08:00):
and fair that is still reverberating across the country. Namely,
he tried to insinuate the immigration that is the foundation
of our culture, the foundation of the United States, whether
it be forced as it has been for the descendants
of chattel slavery, or willing economic immigration, or most recently
(08:23):
asylum seekers. He tried to paint this as an invasion
and as you set executive orders to try and circumnavigate
some of the barriers that exist, some of those checks
and balances that we all learned about with the bill
on Capitol Hill and is now pushing forward to attack
(08:44):
our constitutional rights, namely basic fundamental human rights like the
ability to protest, the ability to congregate. All of these
things have been challenged by a plethora of again one
hundred and forty two executive orders, many of which are
(09:06):
actively being challenged in the courts as we speak. You see,
the president trump playbook is something that we saw in
Trump One, where he throws something flagrantly illegal at the
wall to see if it sticks. Many groups like human
(09:27):
rights first turn around and seue, and in most cases
we were able to win and uphold some of our
constitutional fundamental rights. But in the interim is where the
pain comes to black and brown communities. For example, when
we have situations where US citizens are now being questioned
(09:49):
of their citizenship, are being placed into immigration proceedings. We know,
just taking a step out of his technicalities, that some
of these economics disparities that exist hit black and brown
folks the worst. So while you may be listening to
this and think, wow, that's crazy. If I got arrested,
what would I do? You might have access to bail money,
(10:12):
might have access to a cell phone, You may have
some way to get out, But if you don't have
that money, that liquid bread on hand. What happens to
you that question is not just a legal fact pattern,
but it's what people are experiencing now on a day
to day basis under Trump's America because of this onslaught
of executive orders that he's unleashed.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
Yeah, you know, one of the things that I have
discovered because I was really interested in this last election
and how it was the case that we as a
country were able to re elect someone that we said
no to, especially when compared to Kamala Harris, who we
(10:56):
felt was We're not the only ones that felt that
way objectively, was the most qualified, you know, candidate whoever
ran for president in the history of the country. She
had worked in all three branches of the government. She
was just exceptionally qualified. Served as a vice president. Of course,
how were we able to get back there? And I
learned that, you know, as you mentioned, Donald Trump is
(11:20):
kind of cutting through protocol, the constitution, you know, the rules.
I learned that a huge amount of his voter base
absolutely does not care that he breaks the rules, does
not care that he has no fidelity to the constitution.
That's what they want. They want him to be their
(11:42):
guy and to protect their interests. And these are the
people in Middle America, the reliably read states that feel
overlooked and you know, and they're never going to give
up on Donald Trump. It's just they feel afraid. They
feel they feel disenfranchised, and they feel that and they've
(12:02):
gotten to the point where they feel like they've been
discriminated against. You know, we had a conversation recently Q
and I about you know, white evangelicals and how they
are reliably you know, Trump Trump's voter base, you know
what I mean. And when you think of Donald Trump
and you think of evangelicals, it's not their morals that
they're voting on, and you would think that rather it's
(12:25):
what are they afraid of? What do they think is
happening to them? And they feel like they as human
beings and their faith is under attack. But I want
to shift gears here a bit. You know, we going
into this last election, a lot of people were discussing
the potential of Project twenty twenty five. It's Trump's Project
(12:45):
twenty twenty five. He's going to implement Project twenty twenty five.
And of course Trump famously pushed back. I think I've
never heard Project twenty twenty five. I've heard there's some
good things, but we have Agenda forty seven. That's what
we want to do for people that are why this
playbook where for people that are seeing Donald Trump fire
people from key government predition, positions that are typically nonpartisan
(13:07):
and installing loyalists. That was kind of one of the
big things from Project twenty twenty five to all the
other things that really mirror the either the spirit or
the actual language of Project twenty twenty five. How closely
do you feel that the first hundred days of Donald
Trump's administration reflect what the thrust of Project twenty twenty five.
Speaker 3 (13:30):
You know, it's funny that you say changing gears, because
the keyword in what I heard was afraid, which was
woven in to Project twenty twenty five. The foundation of
the plan was to hit all components of our society
from every angle so that it was truly impossible to
(13:50):
respond in a succinct, meaningful, and most importantly strategic way.
So when we're looking at things from Project twenty twenty five,
what jumps out to me are some of the most
scary things that was talked about. Let's think about birthright citizenship,
the Fourteenth Amendment and shrine list that anyone born on
(14:12):
this soil would have access to citizenship in this country.
This is something that again has a history tied to us,
tied to black people, tied to the indigenous folks of
this land. And in twenty twenty five, ignoring our constitution,
(14:32):
ignoring years of precedent that the Court has analyzed over centuries,
he challenged this but for a lawsuit. But for a
lawsuit from similarly situated human rights organizations, it would have
changed that. Chaos is one of the many components brought
(14:54):
up in Pretentick twenty twenty five, whether it be leaving
the Paris Agreement, attacking the World Health Organization. Brother There
isn't enough time to go through the thick destructive points
within it. But let's be clear that is by design.
(15:15):
They wanted to make it to where the women's orgs,
women's rights organizations versus the climate justice folks versus the
civil rights folks versus the human rights folks, and immigrant
justice folks were so scattered, were so concerned with these
egregious attacks against our fundamental rights, that we didn't have
(15:35):
time to strategize and fight back in a strategic way,
in the way that they had been plotting and planning
for four years, ruminating after what was still an embarrassing loss,
which is why it took come so long to acknowledge
that he had loss. So the playbook is there, and
(15:56):
while we've seen components of it within these first one
hundred days, that is already throwing our country into a chaos.
Don't be fooled, it's only beginning. We are less than
halfway through the year in what is supposed to be
supposed to be Because, as I'm sure you all heard,
(16:17):
our current president has ironically discussed the third term it
is just a scary time. Doesn't really articulate the complexities
both legally, socially culturally that we are up against right now.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
You know, it is so refreshing to hear someone else
say afraid and scared. We are not typically comfortable with
those feelings, and a lot of times our brothers and
our sisters don't want to acknowledge them. I think we
saw that during COVID nineteen. Right the the reason I
(17:01):
think our people were so prone to buying into conspiracy
theories was it was just fear and instead of saying
I'm afraid to get the vaccine because I don't understand.
We say we're going to get computer chips implanted in
us in the vaccine, and the vaccine causes a list
of things that should have sounded ridiculous, but again, no
(17:23):
one wanted to acknowledge fear, so we explained it away
with some things that just normally wouldn't have made sense
to us personally. I've been having to deal with friends
and colleagues, I'll flatly say, gaslighting me for being so
upset at what I'm witnessing. And we use the words
black and brown. In my world, that is a very
(17:46):
very literal thing. My children are black, African American and
Mexican Hispanic Latin mixed in a border state, and that
what we've seen happen with regards to immigration, with ice
and raids and communication from the Department of Education or
(18:09):
the school board or the GOP and the state that
we live in where they are lockstep with the administration
and the president. When you have to go get your
first grader and your kindergartener from school because there might
be an ice ray, trust me, that is an actual
scary thing. So thank you for acknowledging that This is
not just unprecedented, but in some cases terrifying watching someone
(18:34):
completely ignore and disregard our constitution. One of the things
that stood out to me that I was really caught
off guard by was the private sector's preemptive bending of
the need with regards to DEI. I knew that there
were places that depended on federal funding that kind of
(18:54):
didn't have a choice. They had to just fall in line.
But watching these massively successful companies, in multi multi, multi
billion dollar corporations preemptively kissed the ring and ben and
knee was shocking for me. Maybe it shouldn't have been,
but it was. How has that resonated in the position
(19:18):
that you're in or from your purview.
Speaker 3 (19:22):
It has made collaboration that much more tricky within the
nonprofit space. Just as a man, it's made shopping that
much more difficult, sure way, and I have to consider
as a pedestrian where I'm shopping, how I'm getting just
(19:44):
basic goods. Because our power lives with our dollar, so
let's be clear when it comes to companies protecting their
bottom line. I am less shocked. And that may be
the skeptic of me, It may be just an analysis
of us history and the history of capitalism across the world.
(20:08):
Where I have been grappling and still am grappling with
just the impact is the attack on diversity, equity inclusion
programs within our federal government, within our schools, because so
many people that I know in love have been hurt
(20:34):
by what has been a surgical attack on communities that
don't reflect how the Trump administration wants America to look.
These DEI programs have nothing, nothing to do with the
(20:55):
way that is discussed in twenty twenty five. And it
breaks my heart that when I hear the word DEI,
I feel compelled to provide an explanatory comma to punctuate
it with, oh, but this is what it means in
this context, because the definition is within the name diversity, equity,
(21:16):
and inclusion, but no different than woke, no different than
equality or equity. The powers that be have attempted, Hey,
you know what, I'll give flowers where they do. They
have taken the words that we use to articulate justice, power, freedom,
(21:41):
equality and rebranded it in a way that has folks
confused about what's really going on. So when it comes
to the way that DEI has been attacked, I am
still grappling with it. And in this case, it's not
just fear of what's to happen next, it's anger because
it's surgical. You all can think again, I grew up
(22:04):
in Florida. I'm in DC now, but not having been
to y'all's border communities, I could take a while guess
and say, you've seen a black postal worker. Why? Because
black folks have disproportionally represented the federal workforce for decades,
for decades, and by attacking diversity, equity inclusion in this
(22:28):
new form and fashion, they're attacking black communities. They're making
it to where you have less access to upward mobility
than you would have without access to federal jobs, and
while simultaneously attacking diversity acuity inclusion programs to get access
to a higher education. Again, I give pause thinking about
(22:55):
how it is that we're supposed to approach this because
of such a complex on our human rights.
Speaker 1 (23:03):
You know something about you know what you're saying. We
found this out recently, that federal jobs. And it was
after the Civil rights movement when all the laws were
passed and it kind of helped make the country more fair.
But federal jobs, the federal workforce was the one place
(23:25):
in the country where black folks could get jobs without
the private sector discrimination. And so that allowed a lot
of black people to access the middle class, a lot
of brown people to access the middle class. And you know,
to be fair, the middle classes is shrinking, of course,
but you know, the legacy middle class, you know from
(23:48):
you know, the we'll call it the mid sixties to today.
You know, a lot of the black folks that were
able to access that was through federal, federal programs and
federal jobs.
Speaker 3 (24:00):
That is what I mean to say.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
So, yeah, these these attacks on diversity, equity, and inclusion,
because Q does like when we say the whole title,
so that people understand that as concepts they are not wrong, bad,
inconsistent with our human nature. But when you it's easier
to politicize it by calling a DEI. But the attacks
(24:23):
have have definitely been attacks that we felt, particularly so
in marginalized communities. I have just kind of like maybe
a minute or so here, maybe a minute and a half,
but I'd like to get your thoughts on the destruction
of us AID and the Department of Education and and
and all those other sort of ancillary Well, I guess
(24:46):
they're not ancillary things, but the additional elements that that
we don't talk about as as often as we probably
should on this show.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
And you know, with a minute, I'll keep it very direct,
keep it very simple. It's very easy to other what's
happening to our Latino brothers and sisters if you have
interactive with them, maybe you're in a state where the
diasporas and is present. Is very easy to look at
all the international issues and say, what does that have
(25:14):
to do with me and mins right here? But when
it comes to USAID, when it comes to the Department
of Education, it's forcing you to remember that what happens
to our brothers and our sisters, both here and abroad,
will ultimately impact US. USAID is one of the primary
(25:35):
sources for vaccinations across the world in many parts of
the world, and what we don't recognize is that by
simply stripping away access to life saving vaccinations, it's not
only impacting a country that you may not have heard
of or don't have any interest in going to. It's
impacting any and everyone that goes onto a plane there
(25:58):
and here and ultimately ends up walking around. That's how
globalized society works. That's how communical communicable diseases work, and
it's not something that stops by you staying in your
community in twenty twenty five. If I want it to
be on the opposite side of the world tomorrow, I
(26:20):
can book a flight, hop on a plane and go.
And most of us rust assured that the standards around
health care and interconnection, it's going to be comparable, it's
going to be safe. And that has lots to do
with diplomacy that USA has done. On the snap of finger.
Trump has destroyed this. He has destroyed our our ability
(26:42):
to gain ectual education, access to Ada regulated care for
our children at schools. It's so much more than what
happens on the day to day to our Latino brothers
and sisters, because these issues definitely impact all of us
Broadcasting from the Hip Hop Weekly Studios. I'd like to
welcome you to another episode of Civic Cipher, where our
mission is to foster allyship empathy and understanding. I am
your host, ramses.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Jaw, he is Rams' joh, I am q Ward. You
are tuned into Civic Cypher, Yes you.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
Are, and we appreciate that because we are trying to
do some good work at a time that is challenging
for people who want to do good book. But today
we feel fortified and we feel alike it is the
best time to redouble our efforts because we are going
to be talking with someone who has earned our respect,
(00:36):
someone that has been in the media space with us before.
We've been able to have conversations with him before, and
we're happy to introduce him to you, our listener. He
goes by the name of Yannick Gill. He's a human
rights lawyer based in Washington, d C. He's worked in
Congress with two progressive members of the House of Representatives.
He is an accomplished human rights advocate defending marginalized people
(00:58):
across the United States and abroad. And today we are
going to be discussing Donald Trump's first one hundred days
in office. So welcome to the show, Yanick.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Glad to be here with you both.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Yeah, yeah, man, we appreciate it. Man, I know you're
a busy guy and you're taking the time out to
kind of help us make heads or tails of the
goings on. The political goings on out there in DC
really means.
Speaker 3 (01:21):
A lot to us.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
We're also going to be discussing, you know, the attacks
on DEI, which is something that we cover quite a
bit on this show. But you know, this is an
ongoing conversation. We have a way Black History fact and
Baba that I really want you to stick around for.
I'm really excited about both of those if we can
(01:45):
get to them, because I anticipate us having a really
important conversation today with Yanick. But we have so much
for you to stick around for, so please be sure
to hang out and learn as we learn. But before
we get to the learning, let's celebrate. As always. Now
is the time for some Ebony excellence, shall we?
Speaker 3 (02:05):
Yeah? I think we shall.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
So today's Abny excellence. This comes from WSBTV two andre
three thousand and big Boy. We're on the ballot for
the very first time. The only real question is whether
or not they would go into the Hall of Fame together.
On Sunday Night Live on American Idol, it was announced
that Atlanta's own hip hop legends, Outcast, will be headed
to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in Cleveland, Ohio.
(02:28):
They will join seven other performers who will be inducted
into the performer category. Bad Company, Chubby Checker, Joe Crocker,
Cyndi Lauper, Soundgarden, and The White Stripes all will join
Outcast and receiving their award November eighth and the Peacock
Theater in Los Angeles. Andre three thousand and Big Boy
aka Outcast teamed up way back in the early nineteen
nineties when they were high school students in Atlanta. Did
(02:49):
two release their first album in nineteen ninety four. The
duo have won six Grammys for their work over the years,
peaking with their highly acclaimed speaker Box Slash the Love
Below album, which was released in two thousand three. Both
Andre and Big Boy have produced a handful of solo
albums since two thousand and seven, but they did team up,
team back up and toured briefly in twenty fourteen. The
two men have appeared in several films and TV shows
(03:11):
over the years, and their legend only continues to grow.
And I don't know if you have heard any of
Q's and my other takes for folks that kind of
grew up listening to us, you'll know that, at least
(03:31):
I have said on many occasions then I've never had
any pushback from Q that Outcast is the best hip
hop group of all time. And we can have that conversation.
We might have to have it another day, but a day,
it might be another day. But yeah, that includes n
w A you know I am from counting, but that
it includes in w A Wu Tang, you know, ghetto boys,
(03:52):
you know, you name it. Outcast the best group of
all time. To see them get their just do and
be inducted into the rock Hole rock and Roll Hall
of Fame is so shout out to Outcast, all right,
mister Yannick Gil do us a favor. So again, we
have had conversations with you on the Black Information Network,
and you always bring a sense of clarity to the
(04:18):
massive amount of political stories, headlines goings on that you know,
the lay person, ourselves included because we're not political strategists.
We haven't worked with Congress folks. You know, we kind
of cover the news, but for folks that aren't as
(04:39):
familiar with your work like we are, talk a little
bit about your background and sort of what qualifies you
to help us make heads or tails of Trump's first
one hundred days in office.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Absolutely, and again, I'm really happy to be here with
you all. I describe myself in a simple way. I'm
a town of immigrants, I'm a Florida man, I'm a
black man. But I'm also a lawyer. And I've also
had the privilege of advising members of Congress on how
to navigate different issues that impact everyday folks. And no
(05:13):
matter what level of education you have, no matter what
job title you have, some of those core principles that
I began with is really how I analyze the law,
how I navigate these issues, and how I approach this
new challenge that we're all in, whether you want to
or not. And in my new role as Senior counsel
(05:33):
with Human Rights First, I'm able to do it all.
Human Rights First is an amazing organization where we have
a unique view of providing both litigation advocacy both here
meaning the United States and abroad, and these first one
hundred days, I've shown us that the strike of the pen,
(05:55):
the change of a tariff, the impact of any of
these laws don't stop with our borders, does stop with
any race, gender, any orientation. It's impacting all of us.
So above all these things, I say I'm an advocate
because that's where all of us need to be right now.
In twenty twenty five, you.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
Talked about the stroke of a pen, tariffs, the kind
of muzzle velocity executive order, disruption of seemingly every marginalized community,
not just like you said in our Borders, but across
the world. The first hundred days man the executive orders
(06:35):
and their impact on our communities. Specifically from your purview,
what does that look like, what does that feel like?
And should we feel as kind of helpless and hopeless
as we do.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
So the feeling is valid. As a millennial, I get
tired of hearing the word unprecedented, but in this case
it's very very true. Donald Trump has signed an unprecedented
and historic. Infamous is how our kids will probably learn
about it in a few years. But one hundred and
forty two executive orders in the first one hundred days,
(07:14):
he has moved at a neck breaking pace, impacting every sector.
So whether or not you're really into politics in one
way or another, you felt it. This has been issues
of immigration, asylum, human rights that I work on on
a day to day basis. It's been issues tied to
student loans, which many of us can relate to issues
(07:37):
tied to the climate, policing and the like. But your
question tied to how it's impacting us disproportionately, meaning black
and brown communities, is key. Within his first day in office,
President Donald Trump assigned several executive orders, and what it
did is it placed us in a situation of KAO
(08:00):
and fair that is still reverberating across the country. Namely,
he tried to insinuate the immigration that is the foundation
of our culture, the foundation of the United States, whether
it be forced as it has been for the descendants
of chattel slavery, or willing economic immigration, or most recently
(08:23):
asylum seekers. He tried to paint this as an invasion
and as you set executive orders to try and circumnavigate
some of the barriers that exist, some of those checks
and balances that we all learned about with the bill
on Capitol Hill and is now pushing forward to attack
(08:44):
our constitutional rights, namely basic fundamental human rights like the
ability to protest, the ability to congregate. All of these
things have been challenged by a plethora of again one
hundred and forty two executive orders, many of which are
(09:06):
actively being challenged in the courts as we speak. You see,
the president trump playbook is something that we saw in
Trump One, where he throws something flagrantly illegal at the
wall to see if it sticks. Many groups like human
(09:27):
rights first turn around and seue, and in most cases
we were able to win and uphold some of our
constitutional fundamental rights. But in the interim is where the
pain comes to black and brown communities. For example, when
we have situations where US citizens are now being questioned
(09:49):
of their citizenship, are being placed into immigration proceedings. We know,
just taking a step out of his technicalities, that some
of these economics disparities that exist hit black and brown
folks the worst. So while you may be listening to
this and think, wow, that's crazy. If I got arrested,
what would I do? You might have access to bail money,
(10:12):
might have access to a cell phone, You may have
some way to get out, But if you don't have
that money, that liquid bread on hand. What happens to
you that question is not just a legal fact pattern,
but it's what people are experiencing now on a day
to day basis under Trump's America because of this onslaught
of executive orders that he's unleashed.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
Yeah, you know, one of the things that I have
discovered because I was really interested in this last election
and how it was the case that we as a
country were able to re elect someone that we said
no to, especially when compared to Kamala Harris, who we
(10:56):
felt was We're not the only ones that felt that
way objectively, was the most qualified, you know, candidate whoever
ran for president in the history of the country. She
had worked in all three branches of the government. She
was just exceptionally qualified. Served as a vice president. Of course,
how were we able to get back there? And I
learned that, you know, as you mentioned, Donald Trump is
(11:20):
kind of cutting through protocol, the constitution, you know, the rules.
I learned that a huge amount of his voter base
absolutely does not care that he breaks the rules, does
not care that he has no fidelity to the constitution.
That's what they want. They want him to be their
(11:42):
guy and to protect their interests. And these are the
people in Middle America, the reliably read states that feel
overlooked and you know, and they're never going to give
up on Donald Trump. It's just they feel afraid. They
feel they feel disenfranchised, and they feel that and they've
(12:02):
gotten to the point where they feel like they've been
discriminated against. You know, we had a conversation recently Q
and I about you know, white evangelicals and how they
are reliably you know, Trump Trump's voter base, you know
what I mean. And when you think of Donald Trump
and you think of evangelicals, it's not their morals that
they're voting on, and you would think that rather it's
(12:25):
what are they afraid of? What do they think is
happening to them? And they feel like they as human
beings and their faith is under attack. But I want
to shift gears here a bit. You know, we going
into this last election, a lot of people were discussing
the potential of Project twenty twenty five. It's Trump's Project
(12:45):
twenty twenty five. He's going to implement Project twenty twenty five.
And of course Trump famously pushed back. I think I've
never heard Project twenty twenty five. I've heard there's some
good things, but we have Agenda forty seven. That's what
we want to do for people that are why this
playbook where for people that are seeing Donald Trump fire
people from key government predition, positions that are typically nonpartisan
(13:07):
and installing loyalists. That was kind of one of the
big things from Project twenty twenty five to all the
other things that really mirror the either the spirit or
the actual language of Project twenty twenty five. How closely
do you feel that the first hundred days of Donald
Trump's administration reflect what the thrust of Project twenty twenty five.
Speaker 3 (13:30):
You know, it's funny that you say changing gears, because
the keyword in what I heard was afraid, which was
woven in to Project twenty twenty five. The foundation of
the plan was to hit all components of our society
from every angle so that it was truly impossible to
(13:50):
respond in a succinct, meaningful, and most importantly strategic way.
So when we're looking at things from Project twenty twenty five,
what jumps out to me are some of the most
scary things that was talked about. Let's think about birthright citizenship,
the Fourteenth Amendment and shrine list that anyone born on
(14:12):
this soil would have access to citizenship in this country.
This is something that again has a history tied to us,
tied to black people, tied to the indigenous folks of
this land. And in twenty twenty five, ignoring our constitution,
(14:32):
ignoring years of precedent that the Court has analyzed over centuries,
he challenged this but for a lawsuit. But for a
lawsuit from similarly situated human rights organizations, it would have
changed that. Chaos is one of the many components brought
(14:54):
up in Pretentick twenty twenty five, whether it be leaving
the Paris Agreement, attacking the World Health Organization. Brother There
isn't enough time to go through the thick destructive points
within it. But let's be clear that is by design.
(15:15):
They wanted to make it to where the women's orgs,
women's rights organizations versus the climate justice folks versus the
civil rights folks versus the human rights folks, and immigrant
justice folks were so scattered, were so concerned with these
egregious attacks against our fundamental rights, that we didn't have
(15:35):
time to strategize and fight back in a strategic way,
in the way that they had been plotting and planning
for four years, ruminating after what was still an embarrassing loss,
which is why it took come so long to acknowledge
that he had loss. So the playbook is there, and
(15:56):
while we've seen components of it within these first one
hundred days, that is already throwing our country into a chaos.
Don't be fooled, it's only beginning. We are less than
halfway through the year in what is supposed to be
supposed to be Because, as I'm sure you all heard,
(16:17):
our current president has ironically discussed the third term it
is just a scary time. Doesn't really articulate the complexities
both legally, socially culturally that we are up against right now.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
You know, it is so refreshing to hear someone else
say afraid and scared. We are not typically comfortable with
those feelings, and a lot of times our brothers and
our sisters don't want to acknowledge them. I think we
saw that during COVID nineteen. Right the the reason I
(17:01):
think our people were so prone to buying into conspiracy
theories was it was just fear and instead of saying
I'm afraid to get the vaccine because I don't understand.
We say we're going to get computer chips implanted in
us in the vaccine, and the vaccine causes a list
of things that should have sounded ridiculous, but again, no
(17:23):
one wanted to acknowledge fear, so we explained it away
with some things that just normally wouldn't have made sense
to us personally. I've been having to deal with friends
and colleagues, I'll flatly say, gaslighting me for being so
upset at what I'm witnessing. And we use the words
black and brown. In my world, that is a very
(17:46):
very literal thing. My children are black, African American and
Mexican Hispanic Latin mixed in a border state, and that
what we've seen happen with regards to immigration, with ice
and raids and communication from the Department of Education or
(18:09):
the school board or the GOP and the state that
we live in where they are lockstep with the administration
and the president. When you have to go get your
first grader and your kindergartener from school because there might
be an ice ray, trust me, that is an actual
scary thing. So thank you for acknowledging that This is
not just unprecedented, but in some cases terrifying watching someone
(18:34):
completely ignore and disregard our constitution. One of the things
that stood out to me that I was really caught
off guard by was the private sector's preemptive bending of
the need with regards to DEI. I knew that there
were places that depended on federal funding that kind of
(18:54):
didn't have a choice. They had to just fall in line.
But watching these massively successful companies, in multi multi, multi
billion dollar corporations preemptively kissed the ring and ben and
knee was shocking for me. Maybe it shouldn't have been,
but it was. How has that resonated in the position
(19:18):
that you're in or from your purview.
Speaker 3 (19:22):
It has made collaboration that much more tricky within the
nonprofit space. Just as a man, it's made shopping that
much more difficult, sure way, and I have to consider
as a pedestrian where I'm shopping, how I'm getting just
(19:44):
basic goods. Because our power lives with our dollar, so
let's be clear when it comes to companies protecting their
bottom line. I am less shocked. And that may be
the skeptic of me, It may be just an analysis
of us history and the history of capitalism across the world.
(20:08):
Where I have been grappling and still am grappling with
just the impact is the attack on diversity, equity inclusion
programs within our federal government, within our schools, because so
many people that I know in love have been hurt
(20:34):
by what has been a surgical attack on communities that
don't reflect how the Trump administration wants America to look.
These DEI programs have nothing, nothing to do with the
(20:55):
way that is discussed in twenty twenty five. And it
breaks my heart that when I hear the word DEI,
I feel compelled to provide an explanatory comma to punctuate
it with, oh, but this is what it means in
this context, because the definition is within the name diversity, equity,
(21:16):
and inclusion, but no different than woke, no different than
equality or equity. The powers that be have attempted, Hey,
you know what, I'll give flowers where they do. They
have taken the words that we use to articulate justice, power, freedom,
(21:41):
equality and rebranded it in a way that has folks
confused about what's really going on. So when it comes
to the way that DEI has been attacked, I am
still grappling with it. And in this case, it's not
just fear of what's to happen next, it's anger because
it's surgical. You all can think again, I grew up
(22:04):
in Florida. I'm in DC now, but not having been
to y'all's border communities, I could take a while guess
and say, you've seen a black postal worker. Why? Because
black folks have disproportionally represented the federal workforce for decades,
for decades, and by attacking diversity, equity inclusion in this
(22:28):
new form and fashion, they're attacking black communities. They're making
it to where you have less access to upward mobility
than you would have without access to federal jobs, and
while simultaneously attacking diversity acuity inclusion programs to get access
to a higher education. Again, I give pause thinking about
(22:55):
how it is that we're supposed to approach this because
of such a complex on our human rights.
Speaker 1 (23:03):
You know something about you know what you're saying. We
found this out recently, that federal jobs. And it was
after the Civil rights movement when all the laws were
passed and it kind of helped make the country more fair.
But federal jobs, the federal workforce was the one place
(23:25):
in the country where black folks could get jobs without
the private sector discrimination. And so that allowed a lot
of black people to access the middle class, a lot
of brown people to access the middle class. And you know,
to be fair, the middle classes is shrinking, of course,
but you know, the legacy middle class, you know from
(23:48):
you know, the we'll call it the mid sixties to today.
You know, a lot of the black folks that were
able to access that was through federal, federal programs and
federal jobs.
Speaker 3 (24:00):
That is what I mean to say.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
So, yeah, these these attacks on diversity, equity, and inclusion,
because Q does like when we say the whole title,
so that people understand that as concepts they are not wrong, bad,
inconsistent with our human nature. But when you it's easier
to politicize it by calling a DEI. But the attacks
(24:23):
have have definitely been attacks that we felt, particularly so
in marginalized communities. I have just kind of like maybe
a minute or so here, maybe a minute and a half,
but I'd like to get your thoughts on the destruction
of us AID and the Department of Education and and
and all those other sort of ancillary Well, I guess
(24:46):
they're not ancillary things, but the additional elements that that
we don't talk about as as often as we probably
should on this show.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
And you know, with a minute, I'll keep it very direct,
keep it very simple. It's very easy to other what's
happening to our Latino brothers and sisters if you have
interactive with them, maybe you're in a state where the
diasporas and is present. Is very easy to look at
all the international issues and say, what does that have
(25:14):
to do with me and mins right here? But when
it comes to USAID, when it comes to the Department
of Education, it's forcing you to remember that what happens
to our brothers and our sisters, both here and abroad,
will ultimately impact US. USAID is one of the primary
(25:35):
sources for vaccinations across the world in many parts of
the world, and what we don't recognize is that by
simply stripping away access to life saving vaccinations, it's not
only impacting a country that you may not have heard
of or don't have any interest in going to. It's
impacting any and everyone that goes onto a plane there
(25:58):
and here and ultimately ends up walking around. That's how
globalized society works. That's how communical communicable diseases work, and
it's not something that stops by you staying in your
community in twenty twenty five. If I want it to
be on the opposite side of the world tomorrow, I
(26:20):
can book a flight, hop on a plane and go.
And most of us rust assured that the standards around
health care and interconnection, it's going to be comparable, it's
going to be safe. And that has lots to do
with diplomacy that USA has done. On the snap of finger.
Trump has destroyed this. He has destroyed our our ability
(26:42):
to gain ectual education, access to Ada regulated care for
our children at schools. It's so much more than what
happens on the day to day to our Latino brothers
and sisters, because these issues definitely impact all of us
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