February 8, 2025 • 22 mins
Today’s guest, Ritzy Periwinkle is a UN Speaker, first-generation Mexican American Activist and host of WORD TO YOUR MAMA: the podcast that amplifies diverse voices and celebrates shared experiences. She is also the co-host of THE GET DOWN podcast which covers policy and industry trends in DeFi and Web3, and emerging tech affecting Black, Latin@, and Indigenous communities.
In the second half of the show, we discuss the Day Without Immigrants protests that have erupted around the country and how we can best show up in support of those most in need.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Keep on riding with U says, we continue to broadcast
the balance and defend the discourse from the hip hop
Weekly Studios.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Welcome back to Civic Cipher. I'm your host, Rams's Jah.
Speaker 3 (00:07):
He is Rams's Jah, I am q ward. You are
tuned into Civic Side.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
For Indeed and Marissa A. Strata Rivera, also known as ritzyp.
That's how I know her. She is a un speaker,
first generation Mexican American activist and host of Word to
Ya Mama, the podcast that amplifies the verse, voices and
celebrates shared experiences. She's also the co host of the
get Down podcast, which covers policy and industry trends in
D five, Web three, and emerging tech affecting Black, Latino
and Indigenous communities.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
And she is joining us today for.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
This part of the program where we will be discussing
the protests around the country. To be fair, there was
a lot that we didn't get to the first part
of the show. I suspect the same will be true
the second part of the show. The show is always
too short, but I am really excited to learn and
get some insight into ways that we can be supportive
of a community under duress.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
In this moment and just show up as brothers like
we always do.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
But before we get there, it's time to be aba,
become a better ally Baba.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
And today's Baba comes from USA. Today.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Sunday Nights Grammys proved that music and art are political.
After accepting their Grammy wins, Shakira Chappelle, Ron Lady Gaga,
and Bruno mar spoke out for the trans community, immigrants,
and up and coming artists in the industry. During her
speech after winning Best Latin Pop Album, Shakure Kakira reached
out to her immigrant brothers and sisters. The Colombian singer continued, quote,
(01:27):
you are loved and worth it, and I'll fight with you.
Later in the telecast, Gaga accepted her award with Mars
for the Best Pop Duo Performance, saying simply quote, trans
people are not invisible. They deserve to be lifted up.
Music is love in the second part. You want to
get that from the La Times.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
From the La Times. Dwayne Wade and Gabrielle Union use
their platform at this year's NAACP Image Awards to advocate
for the black LGBTQ community and praise their transgender daughter
Zaiah for her bravery. After accepting the President's Awards Saturday
at the Civic Auditorium, Sadina, the former pro basketball player
and the Truth be Told actor, developed a passionate, rousing speech.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
I'm sorry.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Delivered a passionate, rousing speech that was widely lauded on
social media. Wade began the speech by directly addressing his
daughter and Union Wade's stepdaughter, Zaia, who came out as
trans in twenty twenty. After the NBA star credit at
Zire for making him a better human by being who
she was born to be. Union Wade spoke fervently about
(02:28):
the struggles and rights of the black LGBTQ community. At
some point, we will all realize that our oppressor is
the same and that we have far more in common
than what divides us, and we will be so much
stronger because of it. I'm praying for those days, Am.
(02:48):
My patience has worn thin as I watched the oppressor
continue their movement forward with no resistance. I'm looking to
my left and right and hoping we can figure it
out soon.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Well said, Okay, a day without immigrants, we're going to
be talking about the ice raid protests and yeah, to
hear the stories from these was really tough. As I mentioned,
(03:20):
you know, Q and I, we are able to have
some conversations on the Black Information Network. One of the
things that we when the conversations we had prior to
you know, joining the b I in was letting them
know that, you know, this is who we are. We
(03:40):
we work in the ally ship space and when it
makes sense, we do our best to find ways to
build bridges rather than ways to tear them down and
to become an island unto ourselves. And fortunately the powers
that be were really supportive of that. So we've indeed
had conversations already about this, but this is our first
time having this conversation with someone who can provide a
(04:03):
little bit more direct insight into what it might feel like.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
In those communities. So again, Ritzie, thank you for hanging
out with us.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
I'm going to start us off by sharing a bit
from Newsweek, just to get folks that aren't familiar caught
up to speed.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Again from Newsweek.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Protests have erupted around the country over the past weekend
in response to President Donald Trump's immigration crackdown, which includes
mass deportations and sweeping raids targeting illegal immigrants. The Trump
administration has vowed to conduct the largest mass deportation operation
in US history, targeting the estimated eleven point seven million
people who are in the country without legal status. As
(04:38):
a Trump administration moves forward with its hardline immigration agenda,
immigration advocates across the country are mobilizing to protest and
protect immigrant communities from potential raids and deportations. While immigrant
rights advocates have been hosting workshops and sharing legal advice
on social media with communities about knowing their rights, Locals
have begun organizing protests around the US.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Over the weekend. This would be last weekend.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Of course, ice raids and deportations are expected to continue
under Trump's administration as immigrant communities, local governments, and advocacy
groups brace for the impact of the president's crackdown. Protests
across the country are also expected to continue. Now, before
I let you go, Ritzy, I want to say a
couple of things when it comes to protests. That's kind
of my joint. I like protests. I like to get
(05:23):
outside and get busy. I stay with the bullhorn, I
bring my children out there. It's all I like that energy.
You know what I'm saying. We don't just be in
a student. We'll be outside with it, and when it
gets tense, I'm there on the front lines.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Right.
Speaker 1 (05:37):
The other thing I do want to say too, is
that part of the reason for this, because you know,
we've had people, you know, say things in the comments
on our social media, which I don't read, but you know,
sometimes every so often something we peak through, and there
are a lot of people who will say things like, well, hey,
this is necessary. Hey, there are certain people that need
to do this the right way. Hey, blah blah blah.
And I think that there's certainly nuanced there. But one
(06:00):
of the things that a lot of people don't know,
especially people that don't live in border states, is that
doing things the right way is what everybody wants. Everybody
wants to do things the right way, and oftentimes when
things aren't done the right way according to what you
deem the right way to be is.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
When they don't do it according to that way. There's
a reason for that, And.
Speaker 1 (06:25):
I think that it's really easy to miss that when
you paint everyone with a broad stroke and you lose
sight of their humanity. So when you see these roundups,
when you see these people in the parking, lots of
home depot when you see like I live. I've been
in Mexico one hundred times. I know people who are
from Mexico. My children are Mexican. This is not a
(06:48):
game for Ramses, This is not a game for Q.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
This is real. We actually live here.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
In this And for all those of you around the
country who don't know better, we appreciate you giving us
the opportunity to give you some insight. Don't lose sight
of these people's humanity. They're human beings. They are your
brothers and sisters. They're the same as you. They're homo
sapien sapiens. Okay, right, and the conversation we're about to have,
I think makes that clear. Just like we were talking
about trans people. Say what you will about trans folks,
(07:16):
they are human beings and when you lose sight of
their humanity, it allows hate and fear to creep in,
and that's not the right way to approach this. Okay,
first question, Ritzy, Sorry, I had to get.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
That off it.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Do us a favor, you know, I did my best,
but I'm not well. I got a little bit of Cuban,
you know what I mean. But I live the life
of a black man in the United States of America.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
And so, you know, so I would not profess to speak.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
In such a way that approaches this question, but give
us some insight into how this is being processed in
Latino communities, because it could be what I think, a
lot of concern, but it also could be relief that
you know, let's be there were a lot of Latinos
that voted for this towards this end. But you know,
I know you can't speak for everyone, but just as
(08:07):
an individual portal, give us some insight.
Speaker 4 (08:11):
Yeah, for sure, I can only speak for myself and
for the communities that I'm a part of, and I'm
part of a lot of communities.
Speaker 5 (08:18):
But to see the protest, it was powerful.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
It was beautiful scene because Latinos were not a monolig
and we're not all from Mexico. We're from so many
different countries. So to see the videos and the photos
of different flags, people standing next to each other unity,
it kind of you know, being first gen and my
(08:48):
mom passed away thirty years ago. But for those of
us that are immigrants, ourselves that are first gen, that
all of us have someone that is an immigrant, whether
they're undocumented, or not we know someone, it impacts us
and it packs our community. It lets us know that
you're not like, we're not alone, that people see us right,
(09:08):
and whether you're first gen, fifth gen, it's a reminder
of our history and our roots. I think a lot
of us are just kind of going day by day
trying to be you know, consumers and trying to build businesses.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
But we have to remember this is a.
Speaker 4 (09:24):
Call to action to roll up our sleeves and fight
and advocate for our communities because some of us forget right,
especially those that voted a certain way, because proximity whiteness
is one hell of a drug, so you know. And
I also want to point out that activism can look
differently for different people. Right back in the days I
(09:46):
was on the front lines, I was doing that stuff,
but it can evolve in where your life is at.
And I want people to understand that just because you
weren't out there physically on the streets, you can support
another ways by amplifying this because we're and suppressed on
social media and by media. So I feel like it's
a call to action, it's a show of support, and
(10:08):
it's a beautiful thing. Of course, there's concern, But I
think a lot of people think, like, oh, you know, there,
we've been worried about this. It's just a spotlight on
it now, and it's maybe, you know, accelerateed a little bit.
But the mass deportations and deportations, ice rays and stuff
is every day life for a lot of us in
our community. And I can't speak for everyone, but this
(10:30):
is what I've seen and what I've experienced.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
Typically, when protests involve non white people or the calls
for the process for the protests, I'm sorry. It's something
that involves marginalized communities and standing up for them. We've
seen in news and in mass media. Part of how
Rams and I ended up doing Civic Cipher was that
mainstream media likes to call all protests of that type riots.
(11:01):
They like to paint them as violent and try to
paint those who participate as criminal. What would you say
to those who blindly call all of our protests violent
or riots or try to paint them in that very negative,
intentionally pejorative light.
Speaker 4 (11:21):
I like that you say that, and to really make
the distinction, because historically, marginized communities have had all but
negative representation and media regardless. And then you point this out,
they call them riots when they're peaceful protests, right, So
media changes the narrative and they're out to vilify us,
right because then they can say and it fits into
(11:44):
their narrative of what they're trying to spread, so that
people are like, yeah, you know, and join their cause.
And when they show anything that happens, people don't understand
that it might have been an isolated incident, but that
for the most part, these are you know, peaceful protests,
and sometimes it's not peaceful, and we have to do
certain things like that, right, And that's why it's important
(12:06):
for people on the ground to document so that you know,
we know exactly what happened. And so protests to those
people that say it's anti American and it's violent, protests
are core of American history, right. I mean, if you
look at the First Amendment, I looked it up to
make sure that I wrote it so that I repeated
this specific part of the First Amendment. Peacefully assemble and
(12:31):
to petition government for a redress of grievances. And so
from civil rights to voters' rights to workers' rights, protests
have historically been powerful tools to correct systematic wrongs. Why
are we out on the streets. Why do we have
to resort to that because we tried the appropriate channels
(12:54):
and nothing happened. So yeah, I think it's the most
American thing ever.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
You know, I'm going to share again back in twenty twenty,
and I didn't forget that we're you know, we're in Arizona, Q.
And I were out there on the protests, and you know,
Arizona's there's not a lot of black folks. It's not
like a place like Atlanta, Louisiana. It's not like that.
It's not Jacksonville's. You know, Arizona the population is way
(13:23):
less black folks. But the crowds were enormous and a
lot of those crowds were white folks. A lot of
those crowds were Mexican folks, you know, and everyone showed
up to support us. And so now that things have evolved,
I'm kind of seeing some patterns and far be from
me to not show up when they showed up for us, right,
(13:47):
we saw I saw Ramses this is me. I saw
people that were identified as police, like because you know,
I was in with the organizers, they knew me from
the radiotor like, hey, you stay over here, blah blah blah,
stay away from that side. We think that that group
over there is we think that they're police. They show
up and they just kind of observe, they don't really participate.
(14:08):
Cool later on, I see those same people throwing rocks
or something, breaking glass. No one else is doing that.
Now these people have shown up every time, haven't done anything,
and now they're setting it off.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Now.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Of course I can't confirm that I didn't ask those
people for their badge number or anything like that, but
I strongly suspect because they didn't fit in there and
they look like police officers, that that's what they were.
So I do want to say that there's that component
to it as well. But if we're addressing this head on,
I think it was doctor King that said a riot
(14:43):
is the language of the unheard, and I think that
that is something worth bearing in mind, not that people
need to go.
Speaker 2 (14:50):
Out and riot. I personally, I'm not so mad at riots.
I think every so often you need a good riot do.
Speaker 1 (14:56):
You get things moving along. But that's just ramses, that's
not the show. That's not ritchy.
Speaker 3 (15:00):
But anyway, that's not cute as laughable.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
But but proceed.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
Okay, okay, well, can I bring up one quick point
just to that really quick? I want to know your
thoughts in another administration and another time, I'm down with that.
What do you guys think about what people are saying
is that they're waiting for they're waiting for that for
Marshall to be like, oh, let's put the you know
what do we think about that?
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Yes?
Speaker 3 (15:27):
Well what I what I think is that they call
it riot so that it could be seen by those
who consume media. The way that they give it to
them as negative and like you say, painted as anti American,
paint us as criminals and make us the bad guy
in the story present. At these organized protests, we have
(15:47):
our children there. It is mostly not violent. We can't
say comprehensively there's no violence because we're not everywhere at once,
but we've been to enough of these protests to know
that they're mostly not violent. In cases that they become
that way, that violence is incited and instigated by law enforcement.
The way that they show up for us to protest
(16:09):
is not just prepared for violence, but looking to start it,
Whereas we saw when large groups of white protesters show
up for causes that are actually anti American, that are
flying a flag that we fought a war against and
won on this soil. And the police are very peaceful.
They're to the side, they're out of the way, they
(16:30):
don't have on riot gear, they're not blocking their path,
they're not instigating violence with them. So they find a
way to conveniently make all of the visuals to all
of the optics and all of the narratives paint us
as bad people so they can justify the mistreatment. See,
those people are violence, see that those people are more
prone to violence and criminal activity, and blah blah blah,
(16:51):
so that people who treat us like crap can sleep
at night, so they can have a clear conscience, so
they can point and say, look at those bad people
who are It's like they think there's nothing else that
we're good for.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
Yeah. Right, And because people.
Speaker 3 (17:06):
Have made up their minds ahead of time that we're
that way, they get the point and say, see.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
We told they get the public narrative. If we do
it does devolve into a riot. Yeah, So that's that's
that's one, And.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
It almost never does that. That's the point that I'm
trying to make. These are almost always peaceful protests. They
paint us as violent rioters so they can justify treating
us like crap.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
And or when it does happen that way, it's usually
individual actors who weren't there at the beginning, because you
get clear instructions, Hey, we're here peacefully. You know we've
ben went off for these Like you said, we're here peacefully.
This is what we're gonna do. We're gonna walk this way,
we're gonna go this way. Everyone stay together, make sure
you got a buddy. Whatever, it would be peaceful. And
if something crazy happened, it's somebody that wasn't there at
the beginning, or somebody with us, right, But anyway, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
I know you wanted to jump in.
Speaker 4 (17:52):
No, no, no, I was just gonna say that, Like
everything that you guys said is just there.
Speaker 5 (17:56):
There's people. I believe what you said.
Speaker 4 (17:57):
There's definitely people that want to instigate and evoke so
they can capture those you know, little clickbake moments. They
can get that footage and say like, see this fits
in our narrative, So you know, they are less than
you know that, I think that's the full narrative.
Speaker 5 (18:11):
There are less than.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
How about this to people that say, well, clearly there's
an immigration problem, Clearly something needs to be done, blah
blah blah. In your estimation, what do you think would
be I know, I know this is a lot, especially
for the amount of time that we have left. But
what would you if you had a magic wand what
(18:33):
would you like to see done about immigration to make
sure that everybody is I don't know, better off than
they are today.
Speaker 5 (18:42):
Yeah, that's that definitely is a loaded question.
Speaker 4 (18:44):
I mean because when you think about I don't think
it's a I don't think it's a problem. And I think, really,
maybe it's more of an immigration system problem. Yeah, you know,
I feel like maybe there's not enough streamline humane processes
for people that live and you know, build commun unities
here in a pathway for citizenship maybe right. And when
(19:05):
they say it's a problem, I think immigrants is what
makes this what really makes America great, and they contribute
to the economy and the culture innovation of the United States.
And I wanted to you know, I know that your
show is for our community, but also a lot of allies,
and I want to bring stats. You know, people love stats,
(19:26):
that's something they can look up and so According to
the American Immigration Council data analysts, back in twenty twenty two,
thirty five point one billion dollars in taxes were paid
by undocumented households, by undocumented people, stuff that they're not
going to be able to benefit from.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
But that went into that's such an important thing to
point out, sis yea, that they pay into the GDP,
they contribute and benefit nothing from it. They don't get
social Security, they don't get food steps, they don't get
any of the social things that are constructed into the
use of that. Honey, they don't benefit from it, and
we pretend like they're taking when they're doing jobs nobody
(20:05):
wants for wages no one else would work for. It's
a really it's beyond insulting men. I forgive me for
getting frustrated just at the idea.
Speaker 4 (20:12):
No, yes, I appreciate that, And that's that's the type
of information that we need to spread. That's the you know,
because I think just really quickly, I feel like there's
an awakning a shift and on if you guys feel it,
I see I see our allies out there that are
being like.
Speaker 5 (20:28):
What the government did this to us too?
Speaker 4 (20:30):
Like they're being you know, they're they're starting to realize
things that we've known since the beginning that it's racism,
you know, and and they're seeing how they're also it's
really it's not really left against right, it's really up
against down. I saw someone posts and I was like,
that's exactly it. It's the rich against the poor. So if
we think about these numbers and how they contribute and
they help with you know, public schools, food stamps, healthcare,
(20:53):
all those different things, and and it's just the trying
to villainize, you know, immigrants and fit into that narrative
that they're trying to push criminalize us and stuff like that.
And you know, I don't really have the answers, but
I think it's so complicated.
Speaker 5 (21:10):
It's multi level, and it's nuanced.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
Because are we talking about immigration from a border, the
Canadian border, the Mexican border, what populations? Are we talking
about the white presenting immigrants?
Speaker 5 (21:21):
You know what I mean? I mean it's so many
different things.
Speaker 4 (21:24):
So yeah, it's complicated, but I think maybe at least
having a clear pathway, I think that maybe can help
a lot.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
Yeah, the interesting thing that you pointed out before we go,
there's hundreds of thousands of white immigrants here. Their stories
never make the news, they're never brought up as an issue,
only those that look like us, and we know that
that's intentional.
Speaker 1 (21:44):
Also, I want to make sure that it's stated that
immigrants commit crimes at a lower rate than Americans do,
and it's important to mention that.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Statistic significant market.
Speaker 1 (21:55):
Yeah, so with that in mind, we're going to have
to leave it right there. Once again, I'd like to
thank you RITZP for taking the time to educate us
and enlighten us. Do us a favor any social media
and then really any resource that folks might need to get,
just like twenty seconds or so, any place people can
go and get some resources for more info.
Speaker 4 (22:16):
For sure, I'm retyp across all social media and definitely
go to check out the Center for Human Rights and
Constitutional Law. Shout out to my homegirl Karen and Nondez.
Speaker 5 (22:25):
She's there.
Speaker 4 (22:26):
She definitely should have her on and there's a bunch
of resources on their page Center for Humanrights dot org
and on Word to your Mama, we're collecting all kinds
of vetted community resources and that's at Word to your
Mama dot com slash.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
Community all right, and you can check us out at
Civic Cipher to download both parts of the episode. You
can find me on all social media at Rams's Jah.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
I am Qward on all social media.
Speaker 1 (22:49):
As well, and we are Civic Cipher on all social
media platforms, even though we might be shadow banded.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
But until next week, y'all, All right, y'all, please
Keep on riding with U says, we continue to broadcast
the balance and defend the discourse from the hip hop
Weekly Studios.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Welcome back to Civic Cipher. I'm your host, Rams's Jah.
Speaker 3 (00:07):
He is Rams's Jah, I am q ward. You are
tuned into Civic Side.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
For Indeed and Marissa A. Strata Rivera, also known as ritzyp.
That's how I know her. She is a un speaker,
first generation Mexican American activist and host of Word to
Ya Mama, the podcast that amplifies the verse, voices and
celebrates shared experiences. She's also the co host of the
get Down podcast, which covers policy and industry trends in
D five, Web three, and emerging tech affecting Black, Latino
and Indigenous communities.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
And she is joining us today for.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
This part of the program where we will be discussing
the protests around the country. To be fair, there was
a lot that we didn't get to the first part
of the show. I suspect the same will be true
the second part of the show. The show is always
too short, but I am really excited to learn and
get some insight into ways that we can be supportive
of a community under duress.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
In this moment and just show up as brothers like
we always do.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
But before we get there, it's time to be aba,
become a better ally Baba.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
And today's Baba comes from USA. Today.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Sunday Nights Grammys proved that music and art are political.
After accepting their Grammy wins, Shakira Chappelle, Ron Lady Gaga,
and Bruno mar spoke out for the trans community, immigrants,
and up and coming artists in the industry. During her
speech after winning Best Latin Pop Album, Shakure Kakira reached
out to her immigrant brothers and sisters. The Colombian singer continued, quote,
(01:27):
you are loved and worth it, and I'll fight with you.
Later in the telecast, Gaga accepted her award with Mars
for the Best Pop Duo Performance, saying simply quote, trans
people are not invisible. They deserve to be lifted up.
Music is love in the second part. You want to
get that from the La Times.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
From the La Times. Dwayne Wade and Gabrielle Union use
their platform at this year's NAACP Image Awards to advocate
for the black LGBTQ community and praise their transgender daughter
Zaiah for her bravery. After accepting the President's Awards Saturday
at the Civic Auditorium, Sadina, the former pro basketball player
and the Truth be Told actor, developed a passionate, rousing speech.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
I'm sorry.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Delivered a passionate, rousing speech that was widely lauded on
social media. Wade began the speech by directly addressing his
daughter and Union Wade's stepdaughter, Zaia, who came out as
trans in twenty twenty. After the NBA star credit at
Zire for making him a better human by being who
she was born to be. Union Wade spoke fervently about
(02:28):
the struggles and rights of the black LGBTQ community. At
some point, we will all realize that our oppressor is
the same and that we have far more in common
than what divides us, and we will be so much
stronger because of it. I'm praying for those days, Am.
(02:48):
My patience has worn thin as I watched the oppressor
continue their movement forward with no resistance. I'm looking to
my left and right and hoping we can figure it
out soon.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Well said, Okay, a day without immigrants, we're going to
be talking about the ice raid protests and yeah, to
hear the stories from these was really tough. As I mentioned,
(03:20):
you know, Q and I, we are able to have
some conversations on the Black Information Network. One of the
things that we when the conversations we had prior to
you know, joining the b I in was letting them
know that, you know, this is who we are. We
(03:40):
we work in the ally ship space and when it
makes sense, we do our best to find ways to
build bridges rather than ways to tear them down and
to become an island unto ourselves. And fortunately the powers
that be were really supportive of that. So we've indeed
had conversations already about this, but this is our first
time having this conversation with someone who can provide a
(04:03):
little bit more direct insight into what it might feel like.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
In those communities. So again, Ritzie, thank you for hanging
out with us.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
I'm going to start us off by sharing a bit
from Newsweek, just to get folks that aren't familiar caught
up to speed.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Again from Newsweek.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Protests have erupted around the country over the past weekend
in response to President Donald Trump's immigration crackdown, which includes
mass deportations and sweeping raids targeting illegal immigrants. The Trump
administration has vowed to conduct the largest mass deportation operation
in US history, targeting the estimated eleven point seven million
people who are in the country without legal status. As
(04:38):
a Trump administration moves forward with its hardline immigration agenda,
immigration advocates across the country are mobilizing to protest and
protect immigrant communities from potential raids and deportations. While immigrant
rights advocates have been hosting workshops and sharing legal advice
on social media with communities about knowing their rights, Locals
have begun organizing protests around the US.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Over the weekend. This would be last weekend.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Of course, ice raids and deportations are expected to continue
under Trump's administration as immigrant communities, local governments, and advocacy
groups brace for the impact of the president's crackdown. Protests
across the country are also expected to continue. Now, before
I let you go, Ritzy, I want to say a
couple of things when it comes to protests. That's kind
of my joint. I like protests. I like to get
(05:23):
outside and get busy. I stay with the bullhorn, I
bring my children out there. It's all I like that energy.
You know what I'm saying. We don't just be in
a student. We'll be outside with it, and when it
gets tense, I'm there on the front lines.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Right.
Speaker 1 (05:37):
The other thing I do want to say too, is
that part of the reason for this, because you know,
we've had people, you know, say things in the comments
on our social media, which I don't read, but you know,
sometimes every so often something we peak through, and there
are a lot of people who will say things like, well, hey,
this is necessary. Hey, there are certain people that need
to do this the right way. Hey, blah blah blah.
And I think that there's certainly nuanced there. But one
(06:00):
of the things that a lot of people don't know,
especially people that don't live in border states, is that
doing things the right way is what everybody wants. Everybody
wants to do things the right way, and oftentimes when
things aren't done the right way according to what you
deem the right way to be is.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
When they don't do it according to that way. There's
a reason for that, And.
Speaker 1 (06:25):
I think that it's really easy to miss that when
you paint everyone with a broad stroke and you lose
sight of their humanity. So when you see these roundups,
when you see these people in the parking, lots of
home depot when you see like I live. I've been
in Mexico one hundred times. I know people who are
from Mexico. My children are Mexican. This is not a
(06:48):
game for Ramses, This is not a game for Q.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
This is real. We actually live here.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
In this And for all those of you around the
country who don't know better, we appreciate you giving us
the opportunity to give you some insight. Don't lose sight
of these people's humanity. They're human beings. They are your
brothers and sisters. They're the same as you. They're homo
sapien sapiens. Okay, right, and the conversation we're about to have,
I think makes that clear. Just like we were talking
about trans people. Say what you will about trans folks,
(07:16):
they are human beings and when you lose sight of
their humanity, it allows hate and fear to creep in,
and that's not the right way to approach this. Okay,
first question, Ritzy, Sorry, I had to get.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
That off it.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Do us a favor, you know, I did my best,
but I'm not well. I got a little bit of Cuban,
you know what I mean. But I live the life
of a black man in the United States of America.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
And so, you know, so I would not profess to speak.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
In such a way that approaches this question, but give
us some insight into how this is being processed in
Latino communities, because it could be what I think, a
lot of concern, but it also could be relief that
you know, let's be there were a lot of Latinos
that voted for this towards this end. But you know,
I know you can't speak for everyone, but just as
(08:07):
an individual portal, give us some insight.
Speaker 4 (08:11):
Yeah, for sure, I can only speak for myself and
for the communities that I'm a part of, and I'm
part of a lot of communities.
Speaker 5 (08:18):
But to see the protest, it was powerful.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
It was beautiful scene because Latinos were not a monolig
and we're not all from Mexico. We're from so many
different countries. So to see the videos and the photos
of different flags, people standing next to each other unity,
it kind of you know, being first gen and my
(08:48):
mom passed away thirty years ago. But for those of
us that are immigrants, ourselves that are first gen, that
all of us have someone that is an immigrant, whether
they're undocumented, or not we know someone, it impacts us
and it packs our community. It lets us know that
you're not like, we're not alone, that people see us right,
(09:08):
and whether you're first gen, fifth gen, it's a reminder
of our history and our roots. I think a lot
of us are just kind of going day by day
trying to be you know, consumers and trying to build businesses.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
But we have to remember this is a.
Speaker 4 (09:24):
Call to action to roll up our sleeves and fight
and advocate for our communities because some of us forget right,
especially those that voted a certain way, because proximity whiteness
is one hell of a drug, so you know. And
I also want to point out that activism can look
differently for different people. Right back in the days I
(09:46):
was on the front lines, I was doing that stuff,
but it can evolve in where your life is at.
And I want people to understand that just because you
weren't out there physically on the streets, you can support
another ways by amplifying this because we're and suppressed on
social media and by media. So I feel like it's
a call to action, it's a show of support, and
(10:08):
it's a beautiful thing. Of course, there's concern, But I
think a lot of people think, like, oh, you know, there,
we've been worried about this. It's just a spotlight on
it now, and it's maybe, you know, accelerateed a little bit.
But the mass deportations and deportations, ice rays and stuff
is every day life for a lot of us in
our community. And I can't speak for everyone, but this
(10:30):
is what I've seen and what I've experienced.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
Typically, when protests involve non white people or the calls
for the process for the protests, I'm sorry. It's something
that involves marginalized communities and standing up for them. We've
seen in news and in mass media. Part of how
Rams and I ended up doing Civic Cipher was that
mainstream media likes to call all protests of that type riots.
(11:01):
They like to paint them as violent and try to
paint those who participate as criminal. What would you say
to those who blindly call all of our protests violent
or riots or try to paint them in that very negative,
intentionally pejorative light.
Speaker 4 (11:21):
I like that you say that, and to really make
the distinction, because historically, marginized communities have had all but
negative representation and media regardless. And then you point this out,
they call them riots when they're peaceful protests, right, So
media changes the narrative and they're out to vilify us,
right because then they can say and it fits into
(11:44):
their narrative of what they're trying to spread, so that
people are like, yeah, you know, and join their cause.
And when they show anything that happens, people don't understand
that it might have been an isolated incident, but that
for the most part, these are you know, peaceful protests,
and sometimes it's not peaceful, and we have to do
certain things like that, right, And that's why it's important
(12:06):
for people on the ground to document so that you know,
we know exactly what happened. And so protests to those
people that say it's anti American and it's violent, protests
are core of American history, right. I mean, if you
look at the First Amendment, I looked it up to
make sure that I wrote it so that I repeated
this specific part of the First Amendment. Peacefully assemble and
(12:31):
to petition government for a redress of grievances. And so
from civil rights to voters' rights to workers' rights, protests
have historically been powerful tools to correct systematic wrongs. Why
are we out on the streets. Why do we have
to resort to that because we tried the appropriate channels
(12:54):
and nothing happened. So yeah, I think it's the most
American thing ever.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
You know, I'm going to share again back in twenty twenty,
and I didn't forget that we're you know, we're in Arizona, Q.
And I were out there on the protests, and you know,
Arizona's there's not a lot of black folks. It's not
like a place like Atlanta, Louisiana. It's not like that.
It's not Jacksonville's. You know, Arizona the population is way
(13:23):
less black folks. But the crowds were enormous and a
lot of those crowds were white folks. A lot of
those crowds were Mexican folks, you know, and everyone showed
up to support us. And so now that things have evolved,
I'm kind of seeing some patterns and far be from
me to not show up when they showed up for us, right,
(13:47):
we saw I saw Ramses this is me. I saw
people that were identified as police, like because you know,
I was in with the organizers, they knew me from
the radiotor like, hey, you stay over here, blah blah blah,
stay away from that side. We think that that group
over there is we think that they're police. They show
up and they just kind of observe, they don't really participate.
(14:08):
Cool later on, I see those same people throwing rocks
or something, breaking glass. No one else is doing that.
Now these people have shown up every time, haven't done anything,
and now they're setting it off.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Now.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Of course I can't confirm that I didn't ask those
people for their badge number or anything like that, but
I strongly suspect because they didn't fit in there and
they look like police officers, that that's what they were.
So I do want to say that there's that component
to it as well. But if we're addressing this head on,
I think it was doctor King that said a riot
(14:43):
is the language of the unheard, and I think that
that is something worth bearing in mind, not that people
need to go.
Speaker 2 (14:50):
Out and riot. I personally, I'm not so mad at riots.
I think every so often you need a good riot do.
Speaker 1 (14:56):
You get things moving along. But that's just ramses, that's
not the show. That's not ritchy.
Speaker 3 (15:00):
But anyway, that's not cute as laughable.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
But but proceed.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
Okay, okay, well, can I bring up one quick point
just to that really quick? I want to know your
thoughts in another administration and another time, I'm down with that.
What do you guys think about what people are saying
is that they're waiting for they're waiting for that for
Marshall to be like, oh, let's put the you know
what do we think about that?
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Yes?
Speaker 3 (15:27):
Well what I what I think is that they call
it riot so that it could be seen by those
who consume media. The way that they give it to
them as negative and like you say, painted as anti American,
paint us as criminals and make us the bad guy
in the story present. At these organized protests, we have
(15:47):
our children there. It is mostly not violent. We can't
say comprehensively there's no violence because we're not everywhere at once,
but we've been to enough of these protests to know
that they're mostly not violent. In cases that they become
that way, that violence is incited and instigated by law enforcement.
The way that they show up for us to protest
(16:09):
is not just prepared for violence, but looking to start it,
Whereas we saw when large groups of white protesters show
up for causes that are actually anti American, that are
flying a flag that we fought a war against and
won on this soil. And the police are very peaceful.
They're to the side, they're out of the way, they
(16:30):
don't have on riot gear, they're not blocking their path,
they're not instigating violence with them. So they find a
way to conveniently make all of the visuals to all
of the optics and all of the narratives paint us
as bad people so they can justify the mistreatment. See,
those people are violence, see that those people are more
prone to violence and criminal activity, and blah blah blah,
(16:51):
so that people who treat us like crap can sleep
at night, so they can have a clear conscience, so
they can point and say, look at those bad people
who are It's like they think there's nothing else that
we're good for.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
Yeah. Right, And because people.
Speaker 3 (17:06):
Have made up their minds ahead of time that we're
that way, they get the point and say, see.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
We told they get the public narrative. If we do
it does devolve into a riot. Yeah, So that's that's
that's one, And.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
It almost never does that. That's the point that I'm
trying to make. These are almost always peaceful protests. They
paint us as violent rioters so they can justify treating
us like crap.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
And or when it does happen that way, it's usually
individual actors who weren't there at the beginning, because you
get clear instructions, Hey, we're here peacefully. You know we've
ben went off for these Like you said, we're here peacefully.
This is what we're gonna do. We're gonna walk this way,
we're gonna go this way. Everyone stay together, make sure
you got a buddy. Whatever, it would be peaceful. And
if something crazy happened, it's somebody that wasn't there at
the beginning, or somebody with us, right, But anyway, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
I know you wanted to jump in.
Speaker 4 (17:52):
No, no, no, I was just gonna say that, Like
everything that you guys said is just there.
Speaker 5 (17:56):
There's people. I believe what you said.
Speaker 4 (17:57):
There's definitely people that want to instigate and evoke so
they can capture those you know, little clickbake moments. They
can get that footage and say like, see this fits
in our narrative, So you know, they are less than
you know that, I think that's the full narrative.
Speaker 5 (18:11):
There are less than.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
How about this to people that say, well, clearly there's
an immigration problem, Clearly something needs to be done, blah
blah blah. In your estimation, what do you think would
be I know, I know this is a lot, especially
for the amount of time that we have left. But
what would you if you had a magic wand what
(18:33):
would you like to see done about immigration to make
sure that everybody is I don't know, better off than
they are today.
Speaker 5 (18:42):
Yeah, that's that definitely is a loaded question.
Speaker 4 (18:44):
I mean because when you think about I don't think
it's a I don't think it's a problem. And I think, really,
maybe it's more of an immigration system problem. Yeah, you know,
I feel like maybe there's not enough streamline humane processes
for people that live and you know, build commun unities
here in a pathway for citizenship maybe right. And when
(19:05):
they say it's a problem, I think immigrants is what
makes this what really makes America great, and they contribute
to the economy and the culture innovation of the United States.
And I wanted to you know, I know that your
show is for our community, but also a lot of allies,
and I want to bring stats. You know, people love stats,
(19:26):
that's something they can look up and so According to
the American Immigration Council data analysts, back in twenty twenty two,
thirty five point one billion dollars in taxes were paid
by undocumented households, by undocumented people, stuff that they're not
going to be able to benefit from.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
But that went into that's such an important thing to
point out, sis yea, that they pay into the GDP,
they contribute and benefit nothing from it. They don't get
social Security, they don't get food steps, they don't get
any of the social things that are constructed into the
use of that. Honey, they don't benefit from it, and
we pretend like they're taking when they're doing jobs nobody
(20:05):
wants for wages no one else would work for. It's
a really it's beyond insulting men. I forgive me for
getting frustrated just at the idea.
Speaker 4 (20:12):
No, yes, I appreciate that, And that's that's the type
of information that we need to spread. That's the you know,
because I think just really quickly, I feel like there's
an awakning a shift and on if you guys feel it,
I see I see our allies out there that are
being like.
Speaker 5 (20:28):
What the government did this to us too?
Speaker 4 (20:30):
Like they're being you know, they're they're starting to realize
things that we've known since the beginning that it's racism,
you know, and and they're seeing how they're also it's
really it's not really left against right, it's really up
against down. I saw someone posts and I was like,
that's exactly it. It's the rich against the poor. So if
we think about these numbers and how they contribute and
they help with you know, public schools, food stamps, healthcare,
(20:53):
all those different things, and and it's just the trying
to villainize, you know, immigrants and fit into that narrative
that they're trying to push criminalize us and stuff like that.
And you know, I don't really have the answers, but
I think it's so complicated.
Speaker 5 (21:10):
It's multi level, and it's nuanced.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
Because are we talking about immigration from a border, the
Canadian border, the Mexican border, what populations? Are we talking
about the white presenting immigrants?
Speaker 5 (21:21):
You know what I mean? I mean it's so many
different things.
Speaker 4 (21:24):
So yeah, it's complicated, but I think maybe at least
having a clear pathway, I think that maybe can help
a lot.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
Yeah, the interesting thing that you pointed out before we go,
there's hundreds of thousands of white immigrants here. Their stories
never make the news, they're never brought up as an issue,
only those that look like us, and we know that
that's intentional.
Speaker 1 (21:44):
Also, I want to make sure that it's stated that
immigrants commit crimes at a lower rate than Americans do,
and it's important to mention that.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Statistic significant market.
Speaker 1 (21:55):
Yeah, so with that in mind, we're going to have
to leave it right there. Once again, I'd like to
thank you RITZP for taking the time to educate us
and enlighten us. Do us a favor any social media
and then really any resource that folks might need to get,
just like twenty seconds or so, any place people can
go and get some resources for more info.
Speaker 4 (22:16):
For sure, I'm retyp across all social media and definitely
go to check out the Center for Human Rights and
Constitutional Law. Shout out to my homegirl Karen and Nondez.
Speaker 5 (22:25):
She's there.
Speaker 4 (22:26):
She definitely should have her on and there's a bunch
of resources on their page Center for Humanrights dot org
and on Word to your Mama, we're collecting all kinds
of vetted community resources and that's at Word to your
Mama dot com slash.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
Community all right, and you can check us out at
Civic Cipher to download both parts of the episode. You
can find me on all social media at Rams's Jah.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
I am Qward on all social media.
Speaker 1 (22:49):
As well, and we are Civic Cipher on all social
media platforms, even though we might be shadow banded.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
But until next week, y'all, All right, y'all, please
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