July 5, 2025 • 22 mins
Today’s guest is Amy Owen—a Civil Rights Attorney that has worked major civil rights cases alongside Ben Crump. She is known for working alongside professional athletes, celebrities, and other high-profile individuals. Find her online as Pineapple lawyer.
In the second half of the show, we discuss the capacity of Trump to deport citizens of the United States, and the president’s new immigration facility in Florida known as ‘Alligator Alcatraz.”
Support the show: https://www.patreon.com/civiccipher?utm_source=search
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Keep on riding with us as we continue to broadcast
the balance and defend the discourse from these hip hop
weekly studios. Welcome back to Civic Cipher. I am still
your host, Rams's Ja.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
He is Ramsy's Jah. I am still q Ward. You
are hopefully still listening to the Civic Cipher.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Yes, and we appreciate that we still got some more
to talk about because we're here to bring you what
you need. So stay tuned because we are going to
be talking about Alligator Alcatraz. It is the nickname that
it's been given. And the President is now again discussing
(00:40):
deporting US citizens. And you know, these are things that
you know, it's our job to learn about and make
sure that you know about it, and so we're going
to be doing that. And also we're going to be
sharing a little bit of details from the Big Beautiful Bill.
So a lot to stick around for to educate yourselves, Oakland.
But before we get there, it is time to be aba.
(01:03):
Become a better ally Baba and today's Baba. We want
you to check out the Children's Defense Fund. You can
find out more at Children's Defence dot org. I'm going
to read this directly from their website, it says we
work at the intersection of well being in racial justice
for children and youth. We work alongside and amplify the
power of youth and families through advocacy, community organizing, direct service,
(01:25):
and public policy. More than fifty years, our work has
expanded beyond serving children to include young people as they
mature into adulthood. We're training the next generation of leaders
will guide us toward a brighter future where every young
person has the opportunity to thrive. Our history is rooted
in the civil rights and women's movements, and we're carrying the.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
Fight for equity forward.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Our legacy connects our work to the past. We're answering
the call to respond to this moment, dismantle racist policies,
and overcome systemic inequities for our nation's children and youth.
Children's Defense Fund envisions and nation where marginalized children flourish.
Leaders prioritize their well being, and communities will the power
(02:05):
to ensure they thrive. Your support is the driving force
behind our movement, building direct services and policy advocacy that
uplift and amplify young people's voices. Join our community of
change makers and be a part of the movement that's
reshaping the future for generations to come. So again we
want you to check out Children'sdefense dot org. These are
(02:26):
just good people doing good work, especially at a time
when doing good work is more challenging than ever. You
wouldn't think that the Children's Defense Fund an organization that
is trying to help out marginalized children who are at
this specific intersection of certain holes in society, and you know,
(02:53):
historical frameworks would be under attack, but they are and
your support will go a long way right now, So
keep it in mind, all right. So for those that
don't know Q and I, we've had a lot of
conversations behind the scene. This isn't just to show that
we do. We kind of live in this space. Once
(03:14):
upon a time we could kind of dip our toe
into to politics, or we could dip our toe into
really anything, and nowadays it's an all consuming sort of
a thing. And this isn't the first time we've had
the conversation about, you know, what Trump was intending to do,
(03:34):
and to see it all happen and continue to happen.
There's no really, there's really no one we can point
to and say I told you so. All the people
that chose to set home, all the people that I mean,
there's a number of things that we could, you know,
we could raise our fist and yell at a cloud
all we want. But the fact is is that we're here,
(03:56):
and we probably had more foresight than most most people.
And yet and still this is I'll speak for both
of us. I'm sure you'd agree these are still developments
that are deeply unsettling, despite us kind of knowing that
they were coming.
Speaker 3 (04:13):
So I'll start us off.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
I'm gonna share a bit from the Black Information Network,
just giving a little bit of insight into some of
the more recent developments with respect to Donald Trump. Trump
floats deporting US citizens again. President Donald Trump has again
floated the idea of deporting US citizens who commit crimes.
On Tuesday, July first, Trump was touring a migrant detention
(04:37):
center in the Florida, Evergrades when he again claimed that
there are many US citizens who immigrated to this country
and are committing serious crimes. The president suggested that his
next job might be to support to deport these people. Quote,
they're not new to our country, They're old to our country.
Many of them were born in our country. I think
We ought to get them out of here too, if
(05:01):
you want to know the truth, he said, per ABC News.
He goes on to say, so maybe that will be
the next job. Trump's comments come after Assistant Attorney General
Brett Shoemate sent out a memo encouraging US attorneys to
pursue the denaturalization process to advance the administration's policy objectives.
Shoemate suggested that attorneys open cases against individuals who have
(05:24):
engaged in torture, war crimes, human trafficking, and human rights violations.
Many legal experts have said that Trump's proposal to deport
US citizens who commit crimes as on constitutional, citing the
Eighth Amendment prohibiting bull and unusual punishment. The president initially
floated the idea earlier this year, saying he would like
to send horrible criminals Toale Salvador. But we have some
horrible criminals American grown born. Trump told reporters on Air
(05:49):
Force One, noting that he is all for sending them
to prisons and Salvador. His quote continues, I don't know
what the law says on that. On Tuesday, Trump again
acknowledged that he didn't know if it was legal to
deport US citizens convicted of crimes.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
Quote. We'll have to find that out legally.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
I'm just saying if we had the legal right to
do it, I would do it in a heartbeat. I
don't know if we do or not. We're looking at
that right now. Okay, So before I get a little
too deep into these waters here, qu this is something
that you brought to my attention, so you know, why
not jump in and share your thoughts so far?
Speaker 2 (06:28):
You know, Rams, the hardest thing about weighing young on
this topic is that we have to like cover it
like journalists and talk about it like it's just news
and pretend that it's not horrifying personally horrifying. Yeah, Like,
it's because we understand the endgame, right. The conversation started
(06:52):
with illegal criminals in this country that were eating the
cats and dogs and terrorizing our communities. It then shifted
to illegal criminals in general. It then shifted to illegal
people undocumented taking your jobs. It then went to just
(07:19):
immigrants in general. It then went to immigrants during their
citizenship hearings. It then went to citizens that look like
the immigrants we don't like.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
It's then moved to.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
Regular people impersonating law enforcement because law enforcement doesn't have
to wear uniforms, doesn't have to wear badges, doesn't have
to identify themselves, and can wear a mask. So regular
people impersonating those same people who hate the same people
that these people seem to also hate, and abducting them
off the streets. It's now moved to flat out, let's
(07:58):
just look into kicking anybody out that we don't like
or that speaks up against us, or that points out
all of the injustices an illegal, anti constitutional things we do,
all the illegal anti American things that we do. Let's
figure out a way to get them out of here too.
And that people keep not seeing themselves as the potential
(08:22):
victim to these crimes is why people seem to be
keeping such a cool.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
Head about it.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Except a long time ago, I said on one of
these microphones on Tony Coles's airways, on Beyonce's Internet, that
this is how you end up back at slavery, and
personal friends of mine gaslit me and treated me like
(08:49):
I was being ridiculous, But I understood once they see
there's no guardrails, there's no checks and balances, and nobody's
coming to save us. What would make people like this
stop at whatever you thought the furthest extremity would be.
So he says it so casually and understands that there's
(09:12):
no decision he can make that'll lose him his base.
And he's also discovered that not just does his base
blindly support him, but everybody seems to be afraid of him,
Like everyone the people who we always thought would stand
up for us, and at least people who we thought
(09:34):
wouldn't ben the need to someone like him, even if
they weren't benevolent, you know, good kind people who cared
about everybody else.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
I thought they had enough self respect for themselves.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
But you see men whose wives he's insulted, men who
he's called all different types of names, posing and pictures
him with him, with big smiles on their face, proud
of themselves for the evil and disgusting things they're doing
to tens of millions of people. We could talk about
(10:05):
this topic for two hours. We just don't have that
much time. But it's been a stark reality to me
because I saw it coming. I didn't have to wait
for him to get here to know that he would.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
You know, one of the things that I think it's
important to share with our listeners is that we were
both in Arizona during the time when SB ten seventy
was the law of the land, or the purported law
(10:41):
the land. When you know, we have the capacity to
vote no on SB ten seventy. And for those that
you know, want a little bit more clarity on what
that is, you know, you're welcome to go back and
take a look google that and see what it is.
But in short, it was almost like a stop and
(11:03):
frisk sort of a law, but for people who looked.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
Illegal.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
And you know, we both Q and myself, but those
of us that all the people I knew, pushed back
against that just because we saw how slippery is slope
that was. You know, what does illegal look like in
(11:31):
a land that used to be Mexico? Right The people
that live here were here before the United States of
America was here, and people are trying to use this
SB ten seventy to I guess the premise was to
(11:51):
find illegal immigrants and deport them. This was I couldn't
tell you what year, twenty eleven, twenty twelve, somewhere back
in the day, and we could see what that could
turn into. And you know, because there was at the
time stopping frisk in New York. Certainly black folks knew that, hey,
(12:15):
this is that's not cool because it fundamentally changes the
way life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, your relationship
to those things. You know what I mean. If the
police can justifiably pull you over or hem you up
(12:35):
for vibes whatever, you know, reason that they deem appropriate
in the moment, and they can do it consistently, they
can do it with impunity. It makes life a lot
(12:56):
more challenging for people who are already over overly policed,
and who are already considered to be criminal and dangerous
and all that sort of stuff. Right, so we push back,
way back when and then Donald Trump comes along and
(13:18):
kind of more or less introduces similar a similar framework
that makes you know, life and liberty and the pursuit
of happiness very challenging for people who are somehow of
Latin descent perhaps and by extension, the rest of us.
(13:40):
Right now, Q and I would both stand up and
fight for our brothers and sisters, regardless of how they
look or what part of the country their ancestors come from,
because that's our way. But also knowing that slippery slope exists,
it has a tendency to keep keep you up at
(14:00):
night in a different way, you know what I mean,
because instead of worrying about people in your community, you're
worrying about your actual children who are in your home
right And you know, again there's no big eyes in
little US. But you know, when you're talking about people
in your household, it hits different. And just this, this
(14:21):
administration's entire approach to immigration is like they're criminal first,
and they're like human maybe like twenty eighth on the list,
but they're criminal first, you know, their leeches second, non
taxpayers third, you know, on and on and on. And
(14:46):
that is a fundamentally flawed view of immigrants if we're
talking about data, if we're talking about immigrants and mass
you know, we've shared this to stick many times over,
but immigrants are less likely to commit crimes than actual
US citizens are. And that is that that has not
(15:13):
made its way into the.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
Trump sort of.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
The mentality, the MAGA mentality. You know that it's it's
very like I've seen the comments I have seen. It's
it's just so heartbreaking that these people it's almost like
they needed something to be angry about, and this president
gave them something to be angry about, and now that
he sees their anger being directed in the same direction,
(15:42):
he wants to continue to ramp things up so that
he can show them some form of progress. And as
long as they see their anger being taken out on
a community, they're okay with it. Whether or not it
has any material effect on their reality is not something
that they seem to be concerned about. I'm sure in
(16:05):
the furthest recesses of their mind, they're hoping that somehow
all these people being deported is going to fundamentally change
their reality and they're going to make more money and
be able to dat a higher caliber partner and maybe
become a movie star. I'm not sure what these people's
aspirations are with respect to this, but you know, the
(16:25):
reality of the fact is that it's a it's a
waste of taxpayer money. It's it's a wasted effort. The
money would be better spent in reforming the immigration system
so that people can more easily come here legally, because
everybody wants to do that.
Speaker 3 (16:40):
But you know, here we are.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
And the crazy thing about this is that you know,
this train is moving, you know, Q, and I'm going
to tap you in right here. There was some elements
of the Big Beautiful Bill that you and I discussed recently.
That and I think all of this stuff kind of
works together. But you know, people need to know about this.
(17:03):
And before I let you, let you go, que there
are resources if you look for them. There are resources
that you can use in your own communities around the
country to support individuals you feel might be unfairly targeted
by ICE, immigration rates, people getting abducted up the streets,
you know, just please look for them. Please know that
although this is a trying time for all of us,
(17:28):
there are still resources, and there are still people who
love and support you and your play and want to
help out because the only way we get through this
is together.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
Are aq the Big Beautiful Bill. You shared some stuff
with me.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
I thought it was so potent, So help me out.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Oh, you got to be more specific, because that Beautiful Bill,
we don't we don't have enough time to cover it
as in depth or as grossly general as that lead
in was.
Speaker 3 (17:54):
We could. We could spend another twenty five minutes talking.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
About the Big Beautiful Bill and how it's taking away
way you know, social security, healthcare, education for ninety nine
percent of the people that voted for it, that that
elected this administration and gave their support. You know, the
Red States, unfortunately in this country, will be impacted by
(18:17):
these decisions the most. You know, those who have the
least will have even less than they had before.
Speaker 3 (18:26):
And you know, your.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Teachers, your doctors, your nurses, all the people that provide
care for you and your loved ones, your parents, your babies.
You know, some of those jobs don't exist anymore. And
the resources dedicated to those sectors of our society are
being stripped away so that people who already have everything
can have more.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
Rething like, what's more than everything? More eything? I don't
even know what do you say that? You know?
Speaker 2 (18:52):
And we've now again you said this. This train is
already moving, This avalanche has already started. It's already rolling downhill.
You brought up to me, you know before, what this
is leading to?
Speaker 3 (19:06):
Right? What are they doing now?
Speaker 2 (19:07):
The merch that we saw that they're treating like a
theme park in Florida? Yeah, alligators immigrants, Alligator Alcatraz. They
gave it a theme park name. They're selling hats and
t shirts. They're smiling and celebrating at this disgusting thing.
They're not even pretending to not be Nazi like anymore.
Ramses like they're following the playbook to a t, from
(19:30):
the salutes to the concentration camps, because that's what we
need to call it. It's not a theme park where
you go get souvenirs. And they're like making light of it,
cracking jokes. You know, the President maneuvering his hands to
show the type of running pattern that people need to
have as they run from alligators. You have lawmakers saying
(19:52):
that they're going to have forty five million pieces of
food for these alligators. And if you have to try
to figure out why that number, google the Hispanic population
in the United States. The number might tie into what
she said. So all of it is pretty disgusting. Man
(20:14):
taking everything from the least of us, just out of greed,
not out of need.
Speaker 3 (20:21):
They don't need more.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
And they're not even disguising these things they're doing to harmony,
to harm everyone. They're not even disguising them as things
designed to help everyone or anyone point zero zero zero
zero two percent of Americans will benefit from the Big
Beautiful Bill. But seventy seven million Americans thought that that
(20:43):
was a way to go.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
You know, the thing about this that I'm gonna say
this and not I have not vetted this. I don't
know that it's true. But you know, media comes to
us a number of ways, and you know, some information
came our way about people getting transported to other countries
(21:12):
and thrown off of the airplane into the ocean because
they're in the middle of their deportation process. And you know,
I pushed back and I said, hey, you know, if
you can verify any of these stories, please, you know,
let me know if this is something that's happening, because
(21:34):
I need a credible source. But I really worry that
it is. And the only reason I worry that it
is true is because of stories like the one you
just said. You know, people that are like, like the
point is to make it as mean as possible.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
There's no cruelness, and the cruelty is the whole point.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
It's really sad. But again, there's ways to push back
and to insulate your community, So you know, bear that
in mind and educate yourself, find the resources that's going
to do it for us. On today's show, once again,
big shout out to our guest Amy Owen aka Pineapple
Lawyer for joining us. Be sure to follow her on
(22:15):
all social media at Pineapple Lawyer. You can find me
on all social media at rams's jah I.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
Am q Woard on all social media as well, and
you know, do favor hit the website Civic cipher dot
com because.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
We want you to send us any questions you have,
any topics she wants to cover. You can also make
a donation. The show keeps growing with your support, so
please keep supporting. Be sure to follow the show on
all social media at Civic Cipher that's c I v
I C c I p A g e R, particularly
on YouTube. We're growing our YouTube channel and your support
(22:50):
means a lot over there. You can download this in
any previous episode and we'll talk again next week.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
All right, Peace,
Keep on riding with us as we continue to broadcast
the balance and defend the discourse from these hip hop
weekly studios. Welcome back to Civic Cipher. I am still
your host, Rams's Ja.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
He is Ramsy's Jah. I am still q Ward. You
are hopefully still listening to the Civic Cipher.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Yes, and we appreciate that we still got some more
to talk about because we're here to bring you what
you need. So stay tuned because we are going to
be talking about Alligator Alcatraz. It is the nickname that
it's been given. And the President is now again discussing
(00:40):
deporting US citizens. And you know, these are things that
you know, it's our job to learn about and make
sure that you know about it, and so we're going
to be doing that. And also we're going to be
sharing a little bit of details from the Big Beautiful Bill.
So a lot to stick around for to educate yourselves, Oakland.
But before we get there, it is time to be aba.
(01:03):
Become a better ally Baba and today's Baba. We want
you to check out the Children's Defense Fund. You can
find out more at Children's Defence dot org. I'm going
to read this directly from their website, it says we
work at the intersection of well being in racial justice
for children and youth. We work alongside and amplify the
power of youth and families through advocacy, community organizing, direct service,
(01:25):
and public policy. More than fifty years, our work has
expanded beyond serving children to include young people as they
mature into adulthood. We're training the next generation of leaders
will guide us toward a brighter future where every young
person has the opportunity to thrive. Our history is rooted
in the civil rights and women's movements, and we're carrying the.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
Fight for equity forward.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Our legacy connects our work to the past. We're answering
the call to respond to this moment, dismantle racist policies,
and overcome systemic inequities for our nation's children and youth.
Children's Defense Fund envisions and nation where marginalized children flourish.
Leaders prioritize their well being, and communities will the power
(02:05):
to ensure they thrive. Your support is the driving force
behind our movement, building direct services and policy advocacy that
uplift and amplify young people's voices. Join our community of
change makers and be a part of the movement that's
reshaping the future for generations to come. So again we
want you to check out Children'sdefense dot org. These are
(02:26):
just good people doing good work, especially at a time
when doing good work is more challenging than ever. You
wouldn't think that the Children's Defense Fund an organization that
is trying to help out marginalized children who are at
this specific intersection of certain holes in society, and you know,
(02:53):
historical frameworks would be under attack, but they are and
your support will go a long way right now, So
keep it in mind, all right. So for those that
don't know Q and I, we've had a lot of
conversations behind the scene. This isn't just to show that
we do. We kind of live in this space. Once
(03:14):
upon a time we could kind of dip our toe
into to politics, or we could dip our toe into
really anything, and nowadays it's an all consuming sort of
a thing. And this isn't the first time we've had
the conversation about, you know, what Trump was intending to do,
(03:34):
and to see it all happen and continue to happen.
There's no really, there's really no one we can point
to and say I told you so. All the people
that chose to set home, all the people that I mean,
there's a number of things that we could, you know,
we could raise our fist and yell at a cloud
all we want. But the fact is is that we're here,
(03:56):
and we probably had more foresight than most most people.
And yet and still this is I'll speak for both
of us. I'm sure you'd agree these are still developments
that are deeply unsettling, despite us kind of knowing that
they were coming.
Speaker 3 (04:13):
So I'll start us off.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
I'm gonna share a bit from the Black Information Network,
just giving a little bit of insight into some of
the more recent developments with respect to Donald Trump. Trump
floats deporting US citizens again. President Donald Trump has again
floated the idea of deporting US citizens who commit crimes.
On Tuesday, July first, Trump was touring a migrant detention
(04:37):
center in the Florida, Evergrades when he again claimed that
there are many US citizens who immigrated to this country
and are committing serious crimes. The president suggested that his
next job might be to support to deport these people. Quote,
they're not new to our country, They're old to our country.
Many of them were born in our country. I think
We ought to get them out of here too, if
(05:01):
you want to know the truth, he said, per ABC News.
He goes on to say, so maybe that will be
the next job. Trump's comments come after Assistant Attorney General
Brett Shoemate sent out a memo encouraging US attorneys to
pursue the denaturalization process to advance the administration's policy objectives.
Shoemate suggested that attorneys open cases against individuals who have
(05:24):
engaged in torture, war crimes, human trafficking, and human rights violations.
Many legal experts have said that Trump's proposal to deport
US citizens who commit crimes as on constitutional, citing the
Eighth Amendment prohibiting bull and unusual punishment. The president initially
floated the idea earlier this year, saying he would like
to send horrible criminals Toale Salvador. But we have some
horrible criminals American grown born. Trump told reporters on Air
(05:49):
Force One, noting that he is all for sending them
to prisons and Salvador. His quote continues, I don't know
what the law says on that. On Tuesday, Trump again
acknowledged that he didn't know if it was legal to
deport US citizens convicted of crimes.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
Quote. We'll have to find that out legally.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
I'm just saying if we had the legal right to
do it, I would do it in a heartbeat. I
don't know if we do or not. We're looking at
that right now. Okay, So before I get a little
too deep into these waters here, qu this is something
that you brought to my attention, so you know, why
not jump in and share your thoughts so far?
Speaker 2 (06:28):
You know, Rams, the hardest thing about weighing young on
this topic is that we have to like cover it
like journalists and talk about it like it's just news
and pretend that it's not horrifying personally horrifying. Yeah, Like,
it's because we understand the endgame, right. The conversation started
(06:52):
with illegal criminals in this country that were eating the
cats and dogs and terrorizing our communities. It then shifted
to illegal criminals in general. It then shifted to illegal
people undocumented taking your jobs. It then went to just
(07:19):
immigrants in general. It then went to immigrants during their
citizenship hearings. It then went to citizens that look like
the immigrants we don't like.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
It's then moved to.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
Regular people impersonating law enforcement because law enforcement doesn't have
to wear uniforms, doesn't have to wear badges, doesn't have
to identify themselves, and can wear a mask. So regular
people impersonating those same people who hate the same people
that these people seem to also hate, and abducting them
off the streets. It's now moved to flat out, let's
(07:58):
just look into kicking anybody out that we don't like
or that speaks up against us, or that points out
all of the injustices an illegal, anti constitutional things we do,
all the illegal anti American things that we do. Let's
figure out a way to get them out of here too.
And that people keep not seeing themselves as the potential
(08:22):
victim to these crimes is why people seem to be
keeping such a cool.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
Head about it.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Except a long time ago, I said on one of
these microphones on Tony Coles's airways, on Beyonce's Internet, that
this is how you end up back at slavery, and
personal friends of mine gaslit me and treated me like
(08:49):
I was being ridiculous, But I understood once they see
there's no guardrails, there's no checks and balances, and nobody's
coming to save us. What would make people like this
stop at whatever you thought the furthest extremity would be.
So he says it so casually and understands that there's
(09:12):
no decision he can make that'll lose him his base.
And he's also discovered that not just does his base
blindly support him, but everybody seems to be afraid of him,
Like everyone the people who we always thought would stand
up for us, and at least people who we thought
(09:34):
wouldn't ben the need to someone like him, even if
they weren't benevolent, you know, good kind people who cared
about everybody else.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
I thought they had enough self respect for themselves.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
But you see men whose wives he's insulted, men who
he's called all different types of names, posing and pictures
him with him, with big smiles on their face, proud
of themselves for the evil and disgusting things they're doing
to tens of millions of people. We could talk about
(10:05):
this topic for two hours. We just don't have that
much time. But it's been a stark reality to me
because I saw it coming. I didn't have to wait
for him to get here to know that he would.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
You know, one of the things that I think it's
important to share with our listeners is that we were
both in Arizona during the time when SB ten seventy
was the law of the land, or the purported law
(10:41):
the land. When you know, we have the capacity to
vote no on SB ten seventy. And for those that
you know, want a little bit more clarity on what
that is, you know, you're welcome to go back and
take a look google that and see what it is.
But in short, it was almost like a stop and
(11:03):
frisk sort of a law, but for people who looked.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
Illegal.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
And you know, we both Q and myself, but those
of us that all the people I knew, pushed back
against that just because we saw how slippery is slope
that was. You know, what does illegal look like in
(11:31):
a land that used to be Mexico? Right The people
that live here were here before the United States of
America was here, and people are trying to use this
SB ten seventy to I guess the premise was to
(11:51):
find illegal immigrants and deport them. This was I couldn't
tell you what year, twenty eleven, twenty twelve, somewhere back
in the day, and we could see what that could
turn into. And you know, because there was at the
time stopping frisk in New York. Certainly black folks knew that, hey,
(12:15):
this is that's not cool because it fundamentally changes the
way life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, your relationship
to those things. You know what I mean. If the
police can justifiably pull you over or hem you up
(12:35):
for vibes whatever, you know, reason that they deem appropriate
in the moment, and they can do it consistently, they
can do it with impunity. It makes life a lot
(12:56):
more challenging for people who are already over overly policed,
and who are already considered to be criminal and dangerous
and all that sort of stuff. Right, so we push back,
way back when and then Donald Trump comes along and
(13:18):
kind of more or less introduces similar a similar framework
that makes you know, life and liberty and the pursuit
of happiness very challenging for people who are somehow of
Latin descent perhaps and by extension, the rest of us.
(13:40):
Right now, Q and I would both stand up and
fight for our brothers and sisters, regardless of how they
look or what part of the country their ancestors come from,
because that's our way. But also knowing that slippery slope exists,
it has a tendency to keep keep you up at
(14:00):
night in a different way, you know what I mean,
because instead of worrying about people in your community, you're
worrying about your actual children who are in your home
right And you know, again there's no big eyes in
little US. But you know, when you're talking about people
in your household, it hits different. And just this, this
(14:21):
administration's entire approach to immigration is like they're criminal first,
and they're like human maybe like twenty eighth on the list,
but they're criminal first, you know, their leeches second, non
taxpayers third, you know, on and on and on. And
(14:46):
that is a fundamentally flawed view of immigrants if we're
talking about data, if we're talking about immigrants and mass
you know, we've shared this to stick many times over,
but immigrants are less likely to commit crimes than actual
US citizens are. And that is that that has not
(15:13):
made its way into the.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
Trump sort of.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
The mentality, the MAGA mentality. You know that it's it's
very like I've seen the comments I have seen. It's
it's just so heartbreaking that these people it's almost like
they needed something to be angry about, and this president
gave them something to be angry about, and now that
he sees their anger being directed in the same direction,
(15:42):
he wants to continue to ramp things up so that
he can show them some form of progress. And as
long as they see their anger being taken out on
a community, they're okay with it. Whether or not it
has any material effect on their reality is not something
that they seem to be concerned about. I'm sure in
(16:05):
the furthest recesses of their mind, they're hoping that somehow
all these people being deported is going to fundamentally change
their reality and they're going to make more money and
be able to dat a higher caliber partner and maybe
become a movie star. I'm not sure what these people's
aspirations are with respect to this, but you know, the
(16:25):
reality of the fact is that it's a it's a
waste of taxpayer money. It's it's a wasted effort. The
money would be better spent in reforming the immigration system
so that people can more easily come here legally, because
everybody wants to do that.
Speaker 3 (16:40):
But you know, here we are.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
And the crazy thing about this is that you know,
this train is moving, you know, Q, and I'm going
to tap you in right here. There was some elements
of the Big Beautiful Bill that you and I discussed recently.
That and I think all of this stuff kind of
works together. But you know, people need to know about this.
(17:03):
And before I let you, let you go, que there
are resources if you look for them. There are resources
that you can use in your own communities around the
country to support individuals you feel might be unfairly targeted
by ICE, immigration rates, people getting abducted up the streets,
you know, just please look for them. Please know that
although this is a trying time for all of us,
(17:28):
there are still resources, and there are still people who
love and support you and your play and want to
help out because the only way we get through this
is together.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
Are aq the Big Beautiful Bill. You shared some stuff
with me.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
I thought it was so potent, So help me out.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Oh, you got to be more specific, because that Beautiful Bill,
we don't we don't have enough time to cover it
as in depth or as grossly general as that lead
in was.
Speaker 3 (17:54):
We could. We could spend another twenty five minutes talking.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
About the Big Beautiful Bill and how it's taking away
way you know, social security, healthcare, education for ninety nine
percent of the people that voted for it, that that
elected this administration and gave their support. You know, the
Red States, unfortunately in this country, will be impacted by
(18:17):
these decisions the most. You know, those who have the
least will have even less than they had before.
Speaker 3 (18:26):
And you know, your.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Teachers, your doctors, your nurses, all the people that provide
care for you and your loved ones, your parents, your babies.
You know, some of those jobs don't exist anymore. And
the resources dedicated to those sectors of our society are
being stripped away so that people who already have everything
can have more.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
Rething like, what's more than everything? More eything? I don't
even know what do you say that? You know?
Speaker 2 (18:52):
And we've now again you said this. This train is
already moving, This avalanche has already started. It's already rolling downhill.
You brought up to me, you know before, what this
is leading to?
Speaker 3 (19:06):
Right? What are they doing now?
Speaker 2 (19:07):
The merch that we saw that they're treating like a
theme park in Florida? Yeah, alligators immigrants, Alligator Alcatraz. They
gave it a theme park name. They're selling hats and
t shirts. They're smiling and celebrating at this disgusting thing.
They're not even pretending to not be Nazi like anymore.
Ramses like they're following the playbook to a t, from
(19:30):
the salutes to the concentration camps, because that's what we
need to call it. It's not a theme park where
you go get souvenirs. And they're like making light of it,
cracking jokes. You know, the President maneuvering his hands to
show the type of running pattern that people need to
have as they run from alligators. You have lawmakers saying
(19:52):
that they're going to have forty five million pieces of
food for these alligators. And if you have to try
to figure out why that number, google the Hispanic population
in the United States. The number might tie into what
she said. So all of it is pretty disgusting. Man
(20:14):
taking everything from the least of us, just out of greed,
not out of need.
Speaker 3 (20:21):
They don't need more.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
And they're not even disguising these things they're doing to harmony,
to harm everyone. They're not even disguising them as things
designed to help everyone or anyone point zero zero zero
zero two percent of Americans will benefit from the Big
Beautiful Bill. But seventy seven million Americans thought that that
(20:43):
was a way to go.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
You know, the thing about this that I'm gonna say
this and not I have not vetted this. I don't
know that it's true. But you know, media comes to
us a number of ways, and you know, some information
came our way about people getting transported to other countries
(21:12):
and thrown off of the airplane into the ocean because
they're in the middle of their deportation process. And you know,
I pushed back and I said, hey, you know, if
you can verify any of these stories, please, you know,
let me know if this is something that's happening, because
(21:34):
I need a credible source. But I really worry that
it is. And the only reason I worry that it
is true is because of stories like the one you
just said. You know, people that are like, like the
point is to make it as mean as possible.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
There's no cruelness, and the cruelty is the whole point.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
It's really sad. But again, there's ways to push back
and to insulate your community, So you know, bear that
in mind and educate yourself, find the resources that's going
to do it for us. On today's show, once again,
big shout out to our guest Amy Owen aka Pineapple
Lawyer for joining us. Be sure to follow her on
(22:15):
all social media at Pineapple Lawyer. You can find me
on all social media at rams's jah I.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
Am q Woard on all social media as well, and
you know, do favor hit the website Civic cipher dot
com because.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
We want you to send us any questions you have,
any topics she wants to cover. You can also make
a donation. The show keeps growing with your support, so
please keep supporting. Be sure to follow the show on
all social media at Civic Cipher that's c I v
I C c I p A g e R, particularly
on YouTube. We're growing our YouTube channel and your support
(22:50):
means a lot over there. You can download this in
any previous episode and we'll talk again next week.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
All right, Peace,
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