June 21, 2022 • 61 mins
Dawn breaks for the “Battle of the Experts.” In San Antonio, St. Mary’s team rookie Mariela Encinas prays for success at the Red Mass, the 13th-century Catholic ceremony that traditionally offers a blessing to the legal community for the upcoming court year. In South Dakota, the team gets stoked up on pasta and smoothies. Coach Rose makes it simple for her team, telling them “Blood makes the grass grow." Then, the judges call the trials to order, and it is on.
Learn more about the schools, programs and special guests:
St. Mary's University Law School
University of South Dakota Knudson School of Law
Drexel University Thomas R. Kline School of Law
Up Against the Mob with Elie Honig
Follow us on Twitter @ClassActionPod and Instagram @ClassActionPod
Visit our show page for transcripts and more details about the series at ClassActionPod.com
Follow host Katie Phang on Twitter @KatiePhang and Instagram @KatiePhang.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Class Action is a production of I Heart Radio and
Sound Argument. I went to Catholic school my whole life.
It's meaningful in this in the sense that I told
Sister Grace a few days ago that I wasn't quite
sure why God brought me to St. Mary's. And this
year has been very special in the sense that not
(00:22):
only mock trial has showed me that that's why I'm here,
because of this team, this aj and and Coach Goss.
They're all so phenomenal at what they do. But I
definitely think it was God's way of bringing me back
to my religion. Hi him, Mariolencinis. So I'm helping with
the flowers. We just set up the masks, I set
up the candles, volunteer stuff. The judges will get robed
(00:45):
and be ready, so we's kind of preparing last minute things.
This morning I was at work and I had to
finish up numbering all the banners to make sure that
they were already and just the finishing touches. That's about it.
So the Red Mass is an ancient tradition that started
back in in Paris, and it basically marks the beginning
(01:07):
of the academic and the judicial year and it's a
way for us to pray for the administration of justice
that's going to occur in this next judicial year. Red
Mass at St. Mary's is a huge deal. You're gonna
get your banner, You're going to process in. Are you
a representative candle part Catholic Lawyer's Guild of San Antonio, St.
(01:33):
Mary's University law Alumni, standic Law roses in Memoriam. So
everybody in the league organization's the different courts in San
Antonio and in Bear County, they all come in with
a banner, and so like the San Antonio Bar, San
Antonio Chapter of the Federal Bar, San Antonio Young Lawyers Association,
(01:55):
San Antonio's Mexican Bar Association, each league organization has their
own representatives. And that's been pretty neat to see how
excited they are for Red Mass. We asked one of
our deans to hold the mace in the beginning and
she was like, I've always wanted to do it, Like
I'm so excited. Yeah, right now Red Mass that's started
(02:36):
and the procession of the banners is happening. Clarity Prescient
(03:00):
A Mangler Marion Us, Sister Grace, thank you for making
a special this celebration of the Mass, as we pray
to the Holy Spirit to make of all of us,
all of us servant leaders. The purpose of this red
(03:24):
mass is clear enough. It invokes God's guidance and the
strength during the court term to come. We're wearing at
the liturgical red signifies the willingness to defend the truth
inspired by the Holy Spirit and for the nation. Although
(03:46):
human law may hopefully preserve us from anarchy, it is
not enough to wind up our country's wounds. And we
know it, and not only the country, the state we're seeing.
(04:15):
Just a few weeks after the start of the fall semester,
the first big national trial competition, the Battle of the Experts,
is about to get under way. I'm Katie Fang. This
is class action the Battle of the Experts episode four,
(04:39):
with the COVID nineteen Delta variants sweeping through college campuses.
This will be a virtual competition. A quick summary the cases,
let's say, very similar to the murder depicted in the
movie Goodfellas. This case file is the prosecution of the
Joe Pesci character for all intents and purposes. So the
(05:01):
fact pattern in this mob case, Billy Cafilero, the made
member of the Mafia is beaten in a Pennsylvania bar
and then later stabbed to death and buried. Prosecutors accused
Joe Pesci, I mean Tommy Santa Suso, of murder in
the first degree. I am a huge mob movie mob
(05:22):
TV show fan. My name is Phil pascuarelo Um, the
tournament director for the Battle of the Experts. On the
other side of the case, we've got the bartender who
was in the bar that night and heard the insult,
and we've got a mafia expert who's gonna say this
murder just doesn't really add up as it relates to
the rules of the mafia. Doesn't seem like the government
(05:43):
story makes a whole lot of sense. It's the first
tournament of the season. I wanted my school in this
tournament to be opening day. I am really excited to
be at the coaches meeting with all the coaches and
say welcome to the two thousand two season. All the
directors and coach and the students are junkies for this.
They love this stuff. These are the sixteen teams, in
(06:04):
no particular order. Baylor Law School, Quinnipiac Law, Chicago, kant Law, Peace,
American Nova, Southeastern South Carolina, St. Mary's Temple, South Dakota,
U c l A, U C Berkeley, Stetson Pacific, McGeorge, Cumberland,
(06:28):
and University of Eilamo Chicago. John Marshall, why are you
looking at what? Oh? I was saying? Were you asking me?
I don't know she was? That was everybody. St. Mary's
mock trial team is wide awake, overcaffeinated. In fact, they're
(06:50):
hunkered down at a hotel in San Antonio and are
operating on fairy little sleep. Coach Jason Goss fills them
in on what happened at the tournament's coaches meeting last night.
Here's the whole power pair. So this is power payer
every round except for the first round. The first round
was a challenge round, which we actually didn't get challenged,
(07:11):
which you know what that means. They're scared of me.
I'm just kidding, need to do it. Nobody wanted, So
we ended up being just the last one is left
that nobody challenged. And so that's that's cool. You know,
that's cool because you had like the U c l
As in the world and everybody else U c l A, Temple, Baylor,
(07:35):
those are the perennial mock trial powerhouses. St. Mary's ranks
near the middle of the pack, but this is a
new season and upsets can happen. Trout Team captain Andy
Viskara and Jasmine ole Gaen are the team's top guns.
There's a lot going on today and we didn't have
backdrops aust here and Cole and mad the other like
(07:57):
brands making you to this. Jasmine's like freaking out, man,
I need you to get into defense mode that you
did last night. For No. Andy, I'm here for you
because you're doing the most right now. Okay, which one
is it? Why is no one answering my question? No,
it's right here. Any one oh six? My team is
(08:17):
one of six outstanding. We started. They send me a script.
Want to make sure I use this s correct? The
judge is already logged in and waiting. I'm I'm really
supposed to say hi everyone. We're waiting on a few
people just started defense yet from the defense Good morning her?
(08:39):
Were you waiting on us? Yes, we are both here.
We're ready to proceed. Round one. St. Mary's University versus
the University of Illinois Chicago. Everyone's here. If we just
see the message and get started it. My name is
(09:03):
let's call lady to be Thomas Santa Suso. My name
is Judge Mark Alman. Good morning, your honor. My name
is Anna Rosen Alasco, and today I'm here with my
co counsul. Good morning, your honor. I am Carol for
Bolli and we are representing the prosecution. Okay, good morning,
your honor. My name is Andy Vascara, and I, along
(09:25):
with my co counsel and Miss Jasmine O Gene, represent
the defendant, Mr Thomas Santa Suso in today's proceedings. Defending
Annie homicides suspect is the top of the game in
criminal law. It'll take years for Andy and Jasmine to
get enough experience to take on this kind of legal
work in the real world, but you've got to start somewhere,
and why not in mock trial. Andy comes out swinging
(09:50):
in the pre trial, making sure the rights of Tommy
Santa Suso are not trampled by an overzealous prosecutor. Yes,
we previously stipulated that no nick names will be used
to describe any of the parties today, So no nicknames
like Tommy two Guns, Santa Suso or Crazy Tommy Trials,
Like you're on fire, everything around you's on fire. People
(10:12):
are throwing fire at you, but our coaches teaches how
to like put those out. And lastly, our motion would
be to exclude Mr Santa Suso's criminal record in today's proceedings.
As they are past acts or wronks, then it should
be excluded in today's proceedings. So like something's coming at you,
you like move, that's coming at you, move, but it's
(10:34):
all happening at the same time. Let a grant the
motion of limiting uh if you can let the proper
product if you get into that. And isnt that no
mentioned in his power involvement? Yes, sah. So you kind
of feel like you're in the matrix and it's really
really cool once you get in it. At first, when
they throw you in there, you're like, I'm gonna die.
Everything is lit up and I'm going to burn here.
(10:57):
And then you kind of get taught how to put
up the flights, which is cool. Some people were like, ah,
that sounds amazing, idrying to learn about. Other people were like,
I'd like to be the administrative branch of this team
that like just watches you people, and I was like,
got it, that's great. It's not for everyone, all right,
it doesn't matter if you're in a game or the map.
(11:19):
Yeah it does. During the six minute opening by the prosecution,
jasmintal Game is taking notes and trying to get her
mind right. First thing in the morning, I always your
prayer in the morning. I recently just lost a friend,
best friend actually, and it was a really hard year
(11:39):
for me, and I just really like relied on my
faith this past year. It's been difficult in school. Like
my friend he actually asked me, he was like, do
you ever have doubts of your your faith and stuff?
And I was like, no, Like I have no doubts
because some of the things that have happened to me,
like when you're at the lowest, you're like, there's no
coming up from this, absolutely not, and God is just
(12:02):
They're like I've thought a lot about my faith recently too,
because I don't want to just like be praying and
saying the same things. I've been also trying to be
more like real every time I pray and really be
thoughtful about what I'm saying, not just say the same
thank you for this, thank you for that like I
always do, like I'm trying to be more, like I'm
thankful that I'm doing my dream job that I've always wanted.
(12:26):
Like things like that, Yes, your honor, maybe proceed. Some
things are too good to be true. And today the
Commonwealth has brought before you something that looks like a present.
But after today's case, we will unwrap that box and
(12:48):
remove the nice little bow on the top, and you
will see that that box is not a case. It's
Nick Patrick, a liar, a drug dealer, and her. It's
a Tuesday afternoon on Pietro Lane, And as you're walking
down the road, the smell of spaghetti is lingering it
(13:08):
in the air. And as you enter the first restaurant,
you're right, Tommy greets you, and Tommy walks you over
to the booth. He takes your order, and he goes
to the kitchen. He wants to make sure the chefs
are following his mother's Sicilian recipes. Tommy a few years
ago opened his dream authentic Italian restaurant, Santa Suso's. But
(13:34):
Santa Suso's it's more than just a restaurant. You also
hear from mac Ledesma, Mr La Desma is an expert
in organized crime. He knows the way the mafia thinks.
He knows the way the mafia works, and he can
walk you through how a few insults, a few jokes,
that's not a reason it kills somebody. But money, drugs,
(14:00):
that's more than enough that all will link to Mr Patrick.
Today you will see that the forensics, the fingerprints, the
d n A, and how it only links to one person,
Mr Patrick, the common weelfare's the burden to prove beyond
a reasonable doubt that Mr Santa Suso killed Mr Cafilero,
(14:25):
and they will not meet this burden. Today. We will
ask that you return the only just verdict there is
and find Mr Santa Suso not guilty. And right on cue,
the prosecution calls Nick Patrick, it's star witness, to the
stand for his direct examination. Witnesses on direct are nearly
(14:47):
always played by students of the same team. This Nick
Patrick is about to break the code of silence and
read out, Tommy Santa Suso, what did us at Billy
of the outside to go out of smoke? We went outside,
We walked up by the alley, We turned the corner
and then there was Tommy right, Harry fark Bliss. What
(15:10):
did the defendant do? Then he started being a hiss
outability punching him, thrun him into the ground, kicking him.
At one point you got on top of him and
then grabbed his head and was smashing it into the ground.
Billy was leading real bad And did you agree to
help him get rid of the body? Well, yeah, what
(15:32):
was I supposed to do? Getting people to flip is
really the name of the game when it comes to
the mob. That is how you're gonna make your big cases.
I got pretty good at it. My name is Elijnig.
I spent fourteen years as a prosecutor. Yes, they literally
swear a blood oath when they become members of the
BOB and they swear to omerta, which is the Italian
(15:53):
word for silence. That said, they will flip if you
charge them with the murder and they're looking at life
behind bars. They'll if they've had a falling out with
the family, if they've been here's a term shelved, the
meaning sort of suspended without pay, they'll flip. If they
have a beef going with somebody else, another term, they're
a dispute. They will flip. So the biggest and best
cases I made were based on cooperation, on flipping people
(16:16):
and getting them to break through that code of silence,
that code of loyalty. So the mob presence looms large
at these cases and it really can either help or
hurt the prosecution or the defense. It's yours, your Patrick.
How old are your kids? Excuse me, your kids? They're
(16:38):
still young, yes, and they've grown up in this world
of yeah, I love you too, Yes, your honor. This
line of questioning, if we may be heard outside the
presence of the jury. Sure, I normally don't back down
from an objection, which is half the game and trial,
(17:00):
Like you cannot be rattled. B Are you meditative because
you know your client's going to jail, Do it and
let them worry about it if they're going to object
or not, Like, just punch it. This line of questioning
is relevant as Mr Patrick has a big deal to
testify for the Commonwealth in today's case. Now, part of
that deal is that he and his family get witnessed protection,
(17:21):
they get relocated to a new place to start their
life far away from the mafia. The relevance of this
line of questioning is testing Mr Patrick's motive to testify
on the stand today and as such as testing his
bias and his credibility which is always relevant. Um, is
it true that Mr Pratfick's doing act saw and his
family he is, But I still wouldn't understand the age
(17:45):
of his children having anything to deal with this or
anything along that line, Your Honor, I can respond if
if you need me to, Yes, Your Honor, at the
point of the age of his children is just to
show that Mr Patrick still has young children and they've
grown up up in the world of the mafia. So
part of this deal is that his young children no
longer have to grow up in the world of the mafia.
(18:06):
And it goes to his deal today to testify for
the Commonwealth in exchange for that witness protection for him
and his family. Again, Your Honor, a ghost through his
motive to testify on the stand, to his bias as
a witness and his credibility which is always relevant. Man,
Your Honor, Jesus Scratch broke an overall objection. The Commonwealth
(18:27):
in their cooperation agreement with you, offered you and your
family witness protection. If I at that prect now I
want to talk to you about June eleven. Now, you
exited the bar with Billy Cafirero that night, right, Yes,
And you went out into the valley, yes, both me
(18:48):
and Billy. And you loaded Mr Cafaliro's body into the
trunk of your car. Correct, it was your car and
not Mr Santa Susso's where Billy's bloody body was Correct,
it was wrapped. But yes, So part of your cooperation
agreement with the Commonwealth is not that you were an
accomplice to the murder of Billy Cathiro. Is that your
(19:08):
testimony today? No, that's right, and as an accomplice, you
would agree with me that you were hard. It is
not enough to be learned jurists and skill practitioners. Your
people need understanding and love. The wounds and the suffering
(19:31):
is deep. What then, does this demand of you? And
returned to the biblical vision of justice, Shaw's showed the
people in society that there is another way to serve.
(19:56):
Your commitment to God's justice makes demands on you. It
is not enough to be incorrupt, to go to your
people with clean hands. Those guns mostly oh stretched will
be right back after the break. While the St. Mary's
(20:19):
team is scoring points, with the judges up north, the
squad from the University of South Dakota is getting hyped
getting here. I'm glad you're president awake. Did you have
your nap this morning? I'm sure you did. Okay, these
are law students, not football players. Do we need to
make sure that here's the deal? As of ten thirty,
(20:44):
the moment you speak to another competitor, you can no
longer talk to me until the round is concluded. For
coach Laura Rose, the battle of the experts is the
first chance to finally get her team into the wind column.
Her school is ranked dead last among all of the
tournament's competitors. What I expect to happen this morning for
(21:04):
them to see a very intelligent, very well compared, and
well coached Berkeley team. I think that the evidentiary arguments
are going to be on point. If Bailey stays calm
and remembers that she does actually know what she's talking about,
will be fine. You've got this, Bailey. Stand firm on
your knowledge, right, stand firm on your preparation. Don't worry
about the individual components of it. Right now, you know
(21:26):
how to flow with this. Stressing yourself out and gonna
do you any favors. You're a monster. Get in there
and destroy people, guys. Blood makes the grassgrow, Like I'm
not kidding, it's it's it's time. You'll put in the work.
You're ready for it. Everything else is just gravy at
this point, it's just complete nerves and jitters. For me,
at least, I'm Bailey more of it. And I am
(21:49):
a third year law student. Justin I are arguing first today,
and I think that we're so ready, We've got our
case prepared. But these past couple of days it's been
like just the most anticipation I think I've ever felt
in law school. Round one, South Dakota versus you see Berkeley.
(22:14):
All right, everybody's here. We just received the message. It started.
Let's call the case of Commonwealth of Pennsylvania versus Thomas
Santa SUSO. All right, and the bench counsel, would you
like to make appearances for the record. Yes, good morning,
your honor. My name is Bailey Moore back along with
my co counsel just in trying to name is Justin
(22:35):
Peter right, co counsel for the defense. All right, thank you,
UML now here, these children, I swear I don't know
if you're more nervous. This is the first group of
students to be trained in the quote Laura Rose system,
and they've been taught to be more assertive in pre
trial motions, to not give away any advantage. Become a
(23:00):
walth has six to address. So first, your honor, we
asked that all witnesses be constructively sworn in in sequestered
per rule six O three. Suppose acounts a little gay
with that, barely say no, come on, or we were
under the impression that all witnesses will be present for
the testimony of other witnesses, especially for the experts there,
(23:21):
good girl, Um, your honor, it's stipulated to that all
witnesses will be present for other witnesses testimony, So we
ask that they all be present. So therefore we disagree
to see questration. They've already thrown them. They've already thrown them.
Burn of proof. Well, it's called proof beyond a reasonable doubt.
(23:42):
And there are three things today that the Commonwealth must
prove to you all beyond a reasonable doubt. First, they
must prove to you that William Cafiro is dead. Over
the next two hours, the South Dakota team does their
level best to stick to the evidence and to avoid
the strionics usually associated with defense attorneys. Second, they must
(24:05):
prove to you that Thomas Santa Suso was the one
who killed William Cafirero. And lastly, they must prove that
Thomas Santa Suso acted with the intent to kill William Cafirero.
As I just said, this is a case about opportunity,
obvious misses, and desired outcomes. And in order to show that,
today the Commonwealth is going to present you with two witnesses.
(24:28):
You're going to meet Sergeant Rosh. You see, Sergeant Rosh
is the over eager yet misguided investigator, and then you'll
meet their star witness a cross examination. Come on, justin, Yes,
your Ms Patrick, you just testified on direct examination that
(24:52):
Tommy Santa Suso was boosting trucks after boos and cars Ridge. Yeah, yeah,
that's true. I did. I think most people can have
like a voice in the courtroom. They're just gonna kind
of find what that is. I would say, I'm pretty direct.
I would like I don't get very flowery, like I
(25:12):
know Rose like she likes the fairy tale style themes,
for something and that's not me. It would sound goofy.
If I was talking about snow White and the Seven Dwarves,
people would be like, what's wrong with this guy? This
wasn't the first time you've attested to this. No, I
think I said the same thing in the preliminary hearing.
(25:34):
That's what I knew. That sounds right to be honest
with you, and yo, yes, for sure. He just destroyed
her credibility completely and totally. And now he gets into
his planned questioning that was as smooth it South Dakota
is up against a team with a much different style,
(25:56):
more outgoing, more theatrical. At the heart of his murder
was membership money. Oh you're on paper still first membership
And see her looking down. She's gotten notes somewhere. Billy
Capierro made a mockery of the defense. The stage is
(26:18):
like a defense witness, so you'll hear from today. They
are kept close given excuse me, favors, all in the
hopes of producing loyalty to the battalitius. This theater stuff
that you see leaking in it gets attention, but it's
not litigating. It's not being a lawyer. I just heard
(26:41):
some criticism in your voice about the theatricality that seems
to be. It sounds like maybe more infused these days
in terms of the mock trial competitions. I teach my
students that trial is theater. I teach my students that
at jurors and even judges are looking for some level
(27:04):
of having their attention captured through the theatrics of what
that trial is and what the facts are, etcetera. Am
I wrong in that regard? No, I don't think. I
don't think it's wrong to say that we steal from
the art form of theater all the time. As trial ers.
You have to in order to present, in order to
know when to use the softer tone of your voice
(27:27):
to really in an opening statement, get the members of
the jury to have that moment where all of a
sudden their empathy is engaged and they're listening to you
at a different level. I teach all of those tricks too.
But what I come back to at the end of
the day is juries want that theater. But juries are
roving bands of twelve year old girls. And what I
mean by that is they will spot the fake person
like that, and when they spot the fake person, they're
(27:48):
done with you. It doesn't matter how compelling you are,
it doesn't matter how great of an order you are.
If they think that you're fake and full of it,
they're not going to reward you at the end of
the day because they're gonna feel lied to. But it's
not about making them into an actor. It's about teaching
them the tricks from acting and teaching them the tricks
from theater in order to do the presentation in the
most authentic way that they can't because at the end
(28:11):
of the day, that's what juries end up rewarding. But
you and I both know anybody could be an advocate,
but not everybody could be a trial lawyer. Are you
thinking about how they're gonna end up as lawyers and whatnot?
They're going to be competitive trial lawyers and really be
able to make a mark that way. I am much
more concerned with building competitive lawyers than I am with
building competitive trial teamers. You get four competitions if you're lucky, right,
(28:33):
you get four times to compete at an at a
mock trial competition in law school, maybe six if you
really push it at some schools. Right, if you do
three a year, you have the rest of your professional
career that you're going to go out and be representing people,
And so I'm much more concerned with making good attorneys.
(28:57):
Coming back and say, Antonio, the pace of the trial
is heating up. So let me get this straight. You
heard the defendants say in three separate statements that he
was going to kill Billy. Correct. Correct. The rookie Mariana
and Sinas is thrown into the fire as a witness,
(29:20):
and in another room, her teammates are listening, ready to
bail her out. So as we sit here today, you
have absolutely no idea about anything time he did after
he left the bar. Correct, Yeah, you agree, it's possible
he never left at all. I mean it could be possible. Yes,
(29:42):
I saw him leave the bar with his wife. So
and you didn't him again that night, No, I didn't,
because the only way you would know if he hadn't
come back that night is if he had physically re
entered the bamboo lounge. Correct. Yes, And when I have
really took was closing up. I was able to see
a little bit outside, and that was the extent to
(30:05):
what I could see outside. So as we sit here today,
you have absolutely no idea about anything I did. Actually,
left the botter. Correct. Yeah, objection, your honor, asked and answered, Boss,
we have no further questions, your honor. When the experts
(30:27):
are called, the trial moves into open warfare, with lawyers
trying to crush the credibility of the other side's witness. Hello,
my name is Macdesma. This Macladesma is portrayed by St.
Mary's Cold Dobula. Business has been hired eighteen times before
to do this. Correct. Yes, so set out of the
(30:50):
eighteen times that your business has been hired to consult,
it's been hired by monsters. Correct, It's been hired violent
monsters and their defense counsel. You did not speak with Nickpatrick. No,
Now you believe nick statements to the police were truthful? Correct,
(31:10):
I'm sorry, I'm so sorry. So you believe the objection,
your honor, I mean, very sustained. Sometimes all of this
high speed action results in a misfire objection, Your honor,
your objection, Yes, your honor, objection to the commonwealth saying
(31:33):
that my client got an attorney. What's your objection? My
objection is withdraw. Okay, But the mark of a sharp
attorney is a quick recovery. Let's talk about your investigation
(31:54):
on Billy's murder. You collected evidence in this case, yes,
and one of the evidence that you collected was the
interview of Mr Patrick the written report, Yes, the interpe
Mr Patrick. But we don't have that audio of the
(32:14):
interview today. No, we don't have it because your police
department lost it. Yeah, I'm not sure. As the trial
heads to break, Andy Viskora, the team captain, checks in
with her co counsel, Dude, I forgot the last look,
(32:34):
I know, I know. Was it that bad? Yeah, you
don't go off screen. I mean, it's not that bad.
The cross was good, But like, are you confident in yourself?
Like you knew that you walked over stop for like
two minutes to ask one question. I know, I just
couldn't remember my question. It's okay. If you don't remember
ended on that, it's okay. Like you clearly were going
(32:58):
off screen. No, you didn't fail. It was a good
it was a good yes, I'm sure, But don't but
be confident in yourself, like you know what you're I
know you could not remember. Just take a breath and
just like take a moment, like you're okay, everything's okay,
Like it was a really good. Cross. You got it.
(33:19):
We got everything we needed. It's fine. Let you down.
Know you didn't let me down. You can't dwell on
it for too long because we have a job to do.
And it's like you can't sit there and feel sorry
for yourself, like just keep going, like you have to
(33:41):
keep going and you have to remember that, like confidence
is half of the game jazz, because you're not being
you don't believe in yourself, and like I can't do
it for you. Like sometimes like you like get down
and you like let it like go into you, and
then you're like and you hesitate and the next question
is the right question? It like you know this stuff,
and I'm just like, like you got it? Yeah, I
(34:05):
like just hit it like you sarcasm, Like all of
your questions or your questions, but like your tone of
voice and how you're asking them are going to convey
more than what you're actually saying. We all got confidence issues.
We all got confidence issues. Are you ready for this? Lead? Direct? Yeah? Okay,
(34:28):
put the fund down. You're not crying, You're fine, lawyers,
don't cry. Let's go. I need you to hype up.
We got this, Okay, we got everything. This is the
easy parts practice. Yes, let's go. Okay, is our our
(34:48):
teeth back? Get all the attorneys to screen your honor
council members of the jury. Earlier today, my co AC
Council Bailey MOOREVAC told us this case we come down
(35:08):
to an opportunity obvious mrs and the desired outcome. The
teams are ready for closing arguments, and the pressure is
on to impress the judges one last time in South Dakota.
That job falls to Justin and now the Commonwealth comes
before us today and asks you to give them their
(35:31):
desired outcome, an outcome that they haven't quite earned. Then
we also heard from the defenses expert, Mr Macladsma, the
DESMA who spent years in the FBI has investigated many
many organized criminals, pointed out a few things that didn't
(35:54):
make sense. The few things that didn't make sense, like
the circumstances and suspects that were never investigated. Let's talk
about some of those circumstances. The first one being you
can't get the technology to the timing of the death.
There we go, there we go, Justin, there's my boy.
(36:15):
The extremely close to the timing of the release from
the guy for the potential violations of the markets are
the sanction killing and sanctional killing is when the blessing
in San Antonio, It's Andy's turn to close out the case. Yes,
can we proceed? Some things are too good to be true,
(36:41):
but the commonwealth things. They have their slam dunk conviction.
Why does anything else matter. It matters because they have
the wrong guy. It matters because the real killer is
sitting in the wrong chair. It matters because in the
United States of America, no one is above the law
and no one is beneath it either. It means that
(37:01):
no matter who you are, president, priest, prostitute, or even
former mafia member, the law protects you until the CommonWell
until the state can prove otherwise. Mr Patrick thinks that
because he delivered this perfect present of a case to
you today, no one will look too hard at him.
(37:23):
Pay attention to the red flashing lights pulsing in front
of you. There is more evidence in this case that
Nick Patrick, Council, you've run out of time. Yes, your honor,
you revolved in this case. Yes, you remembers to the
jury the defense that I could have cut it. I
(37:50):
couldn't cut it perfect close it was, it wasn't perfect.
After the end of the round, the presiding judge and
the jurors tally up their points. They mark a range
of scores for the quality of the openings and the closings,
(38:11):
as well as the effectiveness of the direct and cross examinations.
Judges could just drop an acknowledgement in the chat or
give me a shout and let me know when their
ballot has been submitted. I can confirm with the back
office that it has been received. How do you feel.
I feel good. There are parts of it that could
(38:32):
have been smoother. There are parts of it where they
could have argued a little bit more, but they used
their time judiciously. They pointed out the things that they
needed to point out. I would have liked just to
point out the impeachments that we got in the clothes
a little bit more. But I think he attacked the
credibility of the witnesses just by in particular, since he
had that moment our comments. Let's just prepare judges, let's
just go in alphabetical order. As for the defense, I
(38:53):
would say that the cadence of the closing made difficult
to follow what was and what was not important within
your arguments. That's happen. Like I said before I pitched up, Yeah,
there was a total voice critique just it's gonna be
so bad. Both teams did well, but I would caution
the prosecution to be less theatrical, and for the defense,
(39:14):
I would say pick your energy up a little bit more,
especially if you get stuck at a point. It seemed
like at some points both sides may have been doing
some reading um, which is okay uh in my view,
because you don't have to memorize every single factor case
in order to be yes you boss, I could find
(39:41):
use my power one. Yeah, I was trying to find
it's happen. But it wasn't a terrible cloth. It wasn't
a terrible clothes justin you did exactly what you need
to do. You walk them through the element. You walked
them through where they didn't have proof. You did exactly
what I would have What did you do you handle
(40:01):
It's that should have been a time was Yeah, but
we're going up against the world's first boring over the
ashole like non existent real world team. Yeah, like that guy,
exactly what did you get? Zoby Michelot my name or
a Quarterbacky, you handled that around, or really did, but
(40:26):
you yeah, shaken off, shake off the shake off the
bad vife freaks. I'm telling you can handle that. The
fact that that closure was as scripted as he was
and was as reading as much as he was. I'm
not meaning this as any kind of insult to Berkeley,
because that's a way that they can choose to coach.
But this stuff drives me nuts. I can't stand preplanned
(40:49):
gestures where it's been clear that they've been told what
mark to hit with it, and they were clearly reading
both their opening and their closing, and they're opening was
long as hell. It was like ten minutes long. It
was ridiculous. Your theory is way better on the State case.
That's the stuff that we discarded about a month ago.
Now at this point was was what they went with.
You guys are better prepared. You just have to stay focused.
(41:12):
In San Antonio, the mood is tense as they wait
for comments. This WiFi better start working before I throw
a hand trump. Hey, you guys, I'm gonna keep my
comments as short as possible, no matter how much I
love the sun of own voice, because I know you
all are probably hungry because I am. But in all seriously, guys, lookers,
(41:34):
and you'll even I would have pulled with all the
emotions lily today, I would have been shouted out of
the pegroom. Um, you are going to find a request
emotion and limited. You better make superiod matters. You better
make sure he's not completely st everyone's time and you
might lay your emotion your threat. You have to be
(41:55):
able to adjust. And um, I mean, let's be honest,
the running out of time card is that to our
west was concerned for me or back? I'm gonna sort
of piggyback on that comment. To me, this felt pretty
sloppy for a trial at this level. Um, going over time,
not listening to the rulings on motions and objections, not
(42:16):
having a backup plan if you lose on a particular
line of questioning, and just sort of like dropping it.
And I just feel like at this level, you know,
you gotta look at the scoresheet and you got to
see what we're evaluating you on. This is an overall
performance kind of a competition, overall performance kind of sporesheet.
There's no part on the sporesheet for me to give
you bonus points for making motions eliminate and objections that
(42:39):
didn't advance your case in the end, you thought we
were sloppy. How are we slopping? I don't know. I
thought you did good. Maybe it was me away cross Oky,
I'm really sorry about the running out of time. Yeah,
(43:00):
it's fine. No, it's not fine. Down, I'm sorry. Oh.
After one long day of competition, the St. Mary's team,
despite the harsh comments from the judges, beat the University
of Illinois Chicago. They lost their next trial to Chicago Kent.
The team piles into Andy's car trying to clear their heads. Sander,
(43:25):
and why do you have a keens and dress? Because
my sister had her, Keen said recently, and I've been
trying to get this to the right cleaners, but I've
been forgetting because I'm running around like a crazy person. Christen,
I wonder what judge was that complained. It was like
our main judge, no vote. I't talk about that anymore.
(43:47):
I'm They're like, I'm gonna be pissed if this one
guy carried his wolves, Like is that a joke? Like? Yeah,
he was good. He was also reading. Everyone needs to
calm down. It's hard breaking first, so hard for this
and we still got two rounds. I mean we we
(44:07):
got your rounds right, Like today's rounds were like they're okay,
definitely could do better tomorrow. It's like, and your opening
was so good. Like I'm just like, I don't know,
we do need to hit it harder. I just don't
know how else I'm gonna cut my frosted brow. I'm
only gonna like, I'm gonna make it tight like that guy.
Maybe you just need to be like was there finger prints? No? Alright? Cool?
(44:30):
Next on the night there because I keep going just
like I'm gonna just cut out the investigation block to
the rest of the box. You're right, we know what
we need to do. It's gonna be good. ALP, my
kids never do my trial. What do you do? More
(44:58):
from Class Action after the break. South Dakota is also
one and one. They lost to UC Berkeley, but coach
Rose doesn't tell her team it scores during the tournament.
We spilled the beans to Bailey after the competition. I
(45:20):
haven't even seen the scorecards. So did they beat us
in both of those rounds? Sorry? But yeah they did?
You're kidding. Oh that is such a bummer and kind
of funny that they won, I remember, but acting that
came from it, it just seemed fake. And then there
was a lot of smiling at which I didn't understand
(45:41):
because it was, you know, a murder trial. I remember
being shocked during it and just being like, what are
we going up against? Right now? I think they were polished.
I'll give them that, like they knew their facts, they
knew the fact pattern. It was polished. You could tell
they had prepared, but they didn't prepare in the way
that South Dakota had prepared. So it shocks me that
day won. But then they rallied and beat the highly
(46:04):
ranked University of South Carolina team. You didn't include a
lot of the evidence that corroborates the Nickpatrick's story, right,
because you didn't include the defendant cell phone record, No
I did not. You didn't include anything about the autopsy report,
No I didn't. Did that feel better? Ibody, feel a
little better now, right? So good? SHARE's the difference. You
(46:30):
feel better this afternoon because you chased down the tracks
when they left them chased down trackable. You guys were
nervous about that because the time this morning. Don't worry
about that tomorrow, you know, your arguments, you know your positioned,
you know where you're going to go. You'll handled that,
and you ate the puppies without embarrassing them so badly
that they felt like they were shamed. That closing, sir, Hot,
(46:52):
damn Hot, damn Brandon, you did that first part of
the clothes in like nine minutes. Just so you know,
y'all are great. I'm super duper proud of today. You
should be super duper proud of today. You, sir that witnessed.
Would it refresh your recollection if I pointed your right
to it? And then she took forever and you're like,
I'll live for you. I think Bill, Yes, Like Holliday
(47:16):
along twice on Sunday, everybody had moments of real advocacy
brilliance today. So I called my parents between rounds. So
right after I argued they've gotten very invested in this.
They obviously, you know, know about the case, so they
know that it was a murder trial. And then I
made the joke to Rose yesterday. I was like, well,
(47:38):
I want to send my parents a link, but I
don't think they know how to change their name on Zoom,
so I'm gonna have to teach them how to do that.
So my wife looks at it as a student organization,
and she does not understand why there's a podcast following
us for our student organization. She doesn't understand why there's
a camera set up for a student organization. She doesn't
(48:00):
understand why we have to compete in competitions for a
student organization. She just compares it to like the nursing
club and undergrad. She's like, I was in whatever club
and undergrad and we never had to do any of that.
Why are you doing all this takes up so much time.
You don't need to be doing that. Breathe the home rest.
(48:21):
We're gonna try our case tomorrow. We're gonna handler ship.
We're gonna do the same thing all over again. Okay, breathing,
go fourth, do good things. Any questions you need to
ask me, I don't know yet. It'll it'll be a
while before they they announced that as soon as I
have the pairing, you'll have the pairing. He looks to
the trunk. They count one, two, three, The trunk pops open,
(48:43):
and the spotlight of the trunk shines on the victim
of this case, Mr William Cafierrell, sprawled out bruised, swollen
lamp and using what little life he has left to
plead for help. Day two was a letdown for South Dakota.
(49:04):
They lost a battle against Cumberland again news to Bailey.
After the round, Justin and I went into one of
the study rooms at school and he goes, God, that
was brutal, and I was like, Bill and Brandon just
slammed them and it was impeaching, it was correcting them
on the record, it was all of this stuff, and yeah, wow,
(49:31):
that's all I have to say. And then exhaustion creeped
in and they lost a top ranked Baylor Luck in
the next rounds. Everybody but Luck, everybody. You know. It
was just tears because you put in so much work,
you have your school's name behind you representing them, so
(49:52):
it's almost worse than a sports loss. And it was
worse because there were definitely rounds that we should not
have lost that we did lose, and that doesn't necessarily
happen in sports. So that was very, very, very tough,
and to just kind of feel like we didn't do
(50:13):
enough for like we've disappointed you know, usd or and
you know and I know that that is not the case.
There's just stuff you can't control, but you do take
it personally, and I definitely did. We're gonna have to
know who we go against because we're gonna have to
email them. Jasmine wants to know who we're going to
go against, and I'm like, I just rather not know
because it doesn't matter if we're going to prosecution or
(50:34):
defense first. Oh well, yeah, I want to know that too.
But Jasmine's out here like trying to scout people. I
don't know anything except you ceiling in Baylor. But still
at St. Mary's, the unforced errors continue for Jason Goss's team.
He and his wife Maritza can only watch and shake
their heads. Didn't it weird? So Andy got and he
(50:56):
got a ten, a nine and a six on our
closing It every every round ten and nine in a six.
Every round she has had somebody give her a six.
What did Jasmine get on her opening? She got an eight,
a five and a nine in the five the same
(51:16):
person who gave Andy a six. So that is a
judge that just did not like us from the beginning.
From the beginning, head coach A. J. Blito de Luna
has been following the tournament all weekend. So what do
you think is going on? I don't know. I don't know.
(51:37):
I think that they're rattled from the beginning. You know,
I shouldn't trust us. Yeah, so they're bad so and
that's going to affect the jury, that's right. Yeah. I
just don't understand that though, because we don't practice that way.
So why are they Why is this happening? Now? We'll
(52:03):
be right back. After the break. St. Mary's is trounced
by Temple University and completely run out of gas against
Pace University in New York. The St. Mary's team piles
into a car and heads to Frida, a restaurant owned
by Andy's parents. Well, you might want to sit on
(52:23):
the other side to the Cutch Dour and hutch gosins
in here, and then a j can have a seat
if you want to do our servant dream. Oh yes, yeah,
can I get him tamer? That actually sounds really good?
What are you getting? I think overall, I'm proud of us.
(52:45):
I think if we don't break because substantially, substantively we
were there, but also like we gave it our all
and we have to learn from our procedural mistakes next time.
And it's Okay, this is our you know, this is
the very fun I think I luck looked out. I
was really stressing playing Nickpatrick just this whole weekend, and
(53:07):
luckily in both teams where we played I played mckpatrick,
they didn't go hard nearly as hard as I feel
like we were across and so I feel like they
really prepared me for what was to come. So yeah,
I mean that was my take from today. I can
read a little easier for now. No one hands happy
that made it through another day. Um, it's a very
(53:30):
tired one to recover, but we did so much work
for two months, very very late nights. I want to
advance even know it's going to be exhausting next day,
so we could say, you know, it was more worth it.
But at the same time, even if we don't break,
it was a great experience for my first outing for
(53:51):
law school. A j stops by just in time to
hear the announcement about which teams will move on. It's
called making the break. Hi, how are you well? How
are you than you? Can I get an old fashioned
please have you right? Thank you? Everyone recording in trump ran,
(54:15):
Welcome every one to the two thousands to one battle.
Of the experts worst. So I'm really pleased to announced
in the first time becausiding and judge Outstanding Presenting jog
World goes to Jason Golin. It's a nice picture to
picture held me. I'm gonna start with our number one seed.
(54:39):
Um to look my way down to the number four seat.
Uh the fourteen as a dance and did see there one? Uh?
This team was the only team to finish for in
twelve year rounds undefeated one. So they were iuted number one.
(55:01):
Hat you only undefeated team, our disfecting champion slave every
final team or second team returning to the playoffs from
second trade hereof made it in playoffs. This year's getting
(55:21):
their teeth in the recipe in differentially Tis T three
ways eight Imparson baid congratulations data. So it happens just
like that. So we keep going. You pick up your
chin and we fight another day. You all have I
(55:44):
mean you could see it, right, you're wearing it. You're
wearing your feelings on your sleeves. Right, you could see it.
This is something that you can use a strength. You
were not beaten this weekend. It was on forced errors.
So the question is how do you take this feeling
(56:04):
and turn it into strength. How do you take this
feeling and say, no, we're not going to do that again.
We're better than that. Our coaches believe in us. We
are better than that. How can we do this differently
next time? We believe in you, and you're going to
represent us in Best in Texas, the four of you
and Mariella, you're going to be an advocate. So all
(56:28):
four of you, you're gonna be a team. You're gonna
be an advocate, and you're gonna show what we already know.
I'm I saw them that we didn't break into the semis.
It's okay, okay, this is Andy's mom and dad. Anything
(56:53):
in life another you go to see her, Oh yeah,
is baby. This is what they do on this But yeah,
it's impressive to know, and it's impressive what you can do.
It's awesome the whole experience. In surprise, they were like
(57:14):
a composer really is a professional men and the yes,
we are like that when you yeah, I mean it's
kind of disappointing in the sense that I did have
a lot to prove. Yeah, look at them next time.
(57:36):
But hopefully I can eat now. So I'm gonna go Okay,
our people are crying for quality of love in law,
(57:56):
in the exercise of your powerful profession, and the trial
season real and mock is underway. Prosecutors, defense attorneys, and
judges from around the country are struggling with the weighty
issues surrounding the administration of justice. The red mass dates
(58:17):
back to the Magna Carta and the advent of jury trials.
Our system is not perfect, but hopefully these young attorneys
can make a bit of difference. Inspire them with your integrity.
Give them what any man or woman can claim from
the law, but give them even more more for your
(58:44):
salvation and theirs. Give them yourselves. Act toward them as
God has act toward you. Who knows you just might
transformed Texas into the Kingdom of God, the Father, the Son,
(59:05):
and the Holy Spirit. Glorifying the Lord by your lives,
Thanks be to God. I always remind them, I'm like,
(59:29):
this is what it's gonna be, guys, this is it you.
At least you have the community of being on the
team with people who have similar experiences. You will be
the only one. Every place that I have ever practiced,
I have been the only one on the defense side.
DeAndre Bell also with nineteen ranks on the prosecution side
(59:50):
from Team in City as Stillard be a Myrn and
finally we had a perfect scoring attorney on the defense side, Dillard.
That's next time on Class Action. Class Action is a
(01:00:13):
production of I Heart Radio and Sound Argument Created, produced, written,
and edited by Kevin Huffman and Lisa Gray. Additional story
production by Jennifer Swan, Kristen Cabrera, Jason Foster, and Wendy Nardi.
Executive producers are Taylor Chacogne and Katrina Norvelle. Sound design,
(01:00:36):
editing and mixing by Evan Tire and Taylor Chacogne. This
episode had additional field production by Kristen Cabrera, Paul Ebson,
Alfredo de la Garza, and Malia Lukomski. For more podcasts
from I Heart Radio, visit the i Heart Radio app,
Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your favorite shows.
Class Action is a production of I Heart Radio and
Sound Argument. I went to Catholic school my whole life.
It's meaningful in this in the sense that I told
Sister Grace a few days ago that I wasn't quite
sure why God brought me to St. Mary's. And this
year has been very special in the sense that not
(00:22):
only mock trial has showed me that that's why I'm here,
because of this team, this aj and and Coach Goss.
They're all so phenomenal at what they do. But I
definitely think it was God's way of bringing me back
to my religion. Hi him, Mariolencinis. So I'm helping with
the flowers. We just set up the masks, I set
up the candles, volunteer stuff. The judges will get robed
(00:45):
and be ready, so we's kind of preparing last minute things.
This morning I was at work and I had to
finish up numbering all the banners to make sure that
they were already and just the finishing touches. That's about it.
So the Red Mass is an ancient tradition that started
back in in Paris, and it basically marks the beginning
(01:07):
of the academic and the judicial year and it's a
way for us to pray for the administration of justice
that's going to occur in this next judicial year. Red
Mass at St. Mary's is a huge deal. You're gonna
get your banner, You're going to process in. Are you
a representative candle part Catholic Lawyer's Guild of San Antonio, St.
(01:33):
Mary's University law Alumni, standic Law roses in Memoriam. So
everybody in the league organization's the different courts in San
Antonio and in Bear County, they all come in with
a banner, and so like the San Antonio Bar, San
Antonio Chapter of the Federal Bar, San Antonio Young Lawyers Association,
(01:55):
San Antonio's Mexican Bar Association, each league organization has their
own representatives. And that's been pretty neat to see how
excited they are for Red Mass. We asked one of
our deans to hold the mace in the beginning and
she was like, I've always wanted to do it, Like
I'm so excited. Yeah, right now Red Mass that's started
(02:36):
and the procession of the banners is happening. Clarity Prescient
(03:00):
A Mangler Marion Us, Sister Grace, thank you for making
a special this celebration of the Mass, as we pray
to the Holy Spirit to make of all of us,
all of us servant leaders. The purpose of this red
(03:24):
mass is clear enough. It invokes God's guidance and the
strength during the court term to come. We're wearing at
the liturgical red signifies the willingness to defend the truth
inspired by the Holy Spirit and for the nation. Although
(03:46):
human law may hopefully preserve us from anarchy, it is
not enough to wind up our country's wounds. And we
know it, and not only the country, the state we're seeing.
(04:15):
Just a few weeks after the start of the fall semester,
the first big national trial competition, the Battle of the Experts,
is about to get under way. I'm Katie Fang. This
is class action the Battle of the Experts episode four,
(04:39):
with the COVID nineteen Delta variants sweeping through college campuses.
This will be a virtual competition. A quick summary the cases,
let's say, very similar to the murder depicted in the
movie Goodfellas. This case file is the prosecution of the
Joe Pesci character for all intents and purposes. So the
(05:01):
fact pattern in this mob case, Billy Cafilero, the made
member of the Mafia is beaten in a Pennsylvania bar
and then later stabbed to death and buried. Prosecutors accused
Joe Pesci, I mean Tommy Santa Suso, of murder in
the first degree. I am a huge mob movie mob
(05:22):
TV show fan. My name is Phil pascuarelo Um, the
tournament director for the Battle of the Experts. On the
other side of the case, we've got the bartender who
was in the bar that night and heard the insult,
and we've got a mafia expert who's gonna say this
murder just doesn't really add up as it relates to
the rules of the mafia. Doesn't seem like the government
(05:43):
story makes a whole lot of sense. It's the first
tournament of the season. I wanted my school in this
tournament to be opening day. I am really excited to
be at the coaches meeting with all the coaches and
say welcome to the two thousand two season. All the
directors and coach and the students are junkies for this.
They love this stuff. These are the sixteen teams, in
(06:04):
no particular order. Baylor Law School, Quinnipiac Law, Chicago, kant Law, Peace,
American Nova, Southeastern South Carolina, St. Mary's Temple, South Dakota,
U c l A, U C Berkeley, Stetson Pacific, McGeorge, Cumberland,
(06:28):
and University of Eilamo Chicago. John Marshall, why are you
looking at what? Oh? I was saying? Were you asking me?
I don't know she was? That was everybody. St. Mary's
mock trial team is wide awake, overcaffeinated. In fact, they're
(06:50):
hunkered down at a hotel in San Antonio and are
operating on fairy little sleep. Coach Jason Goss fills them
in on what happened at the tournament's coaches meeting last night.
Here's the whole power pair. So this is power payer
every round except for the first round. The first round
was a challenge round, which we actually didn't get challenged,
(07:11):
which you know what that means. They're scared of me.
I'm just kidding, need to do it. Nobody wanted, So
we ended up being just the last one is left
that nobody challenged. And so that's that's cool. You know,
that's cool because you had like the U c l
As in the world and everybody else U c l A, Temple, Baylor,
(07:35):
those are the perennial mock trial powerhouses. St. Mary's ranks
near the middle of the pack, but this is a
new season and upsets can happen. Trout Team captain Andy
Viskara and Jasmine ole Gaen are the team's top guns.
There's a lot going on today and we didn't have
backdrops aust here and Cole and mad the other like
(07:57):
brands making you to this. Jasmine's like freaking out, man,
I need you to get into defense mode that you
did last night. For No. Andy, I'm here for you
because you're doing the most right now. Okay, which one
is it? Why is no one answering my question? No,
it's right here. Any one oh six? My team is
(08:17):
one of six outstanding. We started. They send me a script.
Want to make sure I use this s correct? The
judge is already logged in and waiting. I'm I'm really
supposed to say hi everyone. We're waiting on a few
people just started defense yet from the defense Good morning her?
(08:39):
Were you waiting on us? Yes, we are both here.
We're ready to proceed. Round one. St. Mary's University versus
the University of Illinois Chicago. Everyone's here. If we just
see the message and get started it. My name is
(09:03):
let's call lady to be Thomas Santa Suso. My name
is Judge Mark Alman. Good morning, your honor. My name
is Anna Rosen Alasco, and today I'm here with my
co counsul. Good morning, your honor. I am Carol for
Bolli and we are representing the prosecution. Okay, good morning,
your honor. My name is Andy Vascara, and I, along
(09:25):
with my co counsel and Miss Jasmine O Gene, represent
the defendant, Mr Thomas Santa Suso in today's proceedings. Defending
Annie homicides suspect is the top of the game in
criminal law. It'll take years for Andy and Jasmine to
get enough experience to take on this kind of legal
work in the real world, but you've got to start somewhere,
and why not in mock trial. Andy comes out swinging
(09:50):
in the pre trial, making sure the rights of Tommy
Santa Suso are not trampled by an overzealous prosecutor. Yes,
we previously stipulated that no nick names will be used
to describe any of the parties today, So no nicknames
like Tommy two Guns, Santa Suso or Crazy Tommy Trials,
Like you're on fire, everything around you's on fire. People
(10:12):
are throwing fire at you, but our coaches teaches how
to like put those out. And lastly, our motion would
be to exclude Mr Santa Suso's criminal record in today's proceedings.
As they are past acts or wronks, then it should
be excluded in today's proceedings. So like something's coming at you,
you like move, that's coming at you, move, but it's
(10:34):
all happening at the same time. Let a grant the
motion of limiting uh if you can let the proper
product if you get into that. And isnt that no
mentioned in his power involvement? Yes, sah. So you kind
of feel like you're in the matrix and it's really
really cool once you get in it. At first, when
they throw you in there, you're like, I'm gonna die.
Everything is lit up and I'm going to burn here.
(10:57):
And then you kind of get taught how to put
up the flights, which is cool. Some people were like, ah,
that sounds amazing, idrying to learn about. Other people were like,
I'd like to be the administrative branch of this team
that like just watches you people, and I was like,
got it, that's great. It's not for everyone, all right,
it doesn't matter if you're in a game or the map.
(11:19):
Yeah it does. During the six minute opening by the prosecution,
jasmintal Game is taking notes and trying to get her
mind right. First thing in the morning, I always your
prayer in the morning. I recently just lost a friend,
best friend actually, and it was a really hard year
(11:39):
for me, and I just really like relied on my
faith this past year. It's been difficult in school. Like
my friend he actually asked me, he was like, do
you ever have doubts of your your faith and stuff?
And I was like, no, Like I have no doubts
because some of the things that have happened to me,
like when you're at the lowest, you're like, there's no
coming up from this, absolutely not, and God is just
(12:02):
They're like I've thought a lot about my faith recently too,
because I don't want to just like be praying and
saying the same things. I've been also trying to be
more like real every time I pray and really be
thoughtful about what I'm saying, not just say the same
thank you for this, thank you for that like I
always do, like I'm trying to be more, like I'm
thankful that I'm doing my dream job that I've always wanted.
(12:26):
Like things like that, Yes, your honor, maybe proceed. Some
things are too good to be true. And today the
Commonwealth has brought before you something that looks like a present.
But after today's case, we will unwrap that box and
(12:48):
remove the nice little bow on the top, and you
will see that that box is not a case. It's
Nick Patrick, a liar, a drug dealer, and her. It's
a Tuesday afternoon on Pietro Lane, And as you're walking
down the road, the smell of spaghetti is lingering it
(13:08):
in the air. And as you enter the first restaurant,
you're right, Tommy greets you, and Tommy walks you over
to the booth. He takes your order, and he goes
to the kitchen. He wants to make sure the chefs
are following his mother's Sicilian recipes. Tommy a few years
ago opened his dream authentic Italian restaurant, Santa Suso's. But
(13:34):
Santa Suso's it's more than just a restaurant. You also
hear from mac Ledesma, Mr La Desma is an expert
in organized crime. He knows the way the mafia thinks.
He knows the way the mafia works, and he can
walk you through how a few insults, a few jokes,
that's not a reason it kills somebody. But money, drugs,
(14:00):
that's more than enough that all will link to Mr Patrick.
Today you will see that the forensics, the fingerprints, the
d n A, and how it only links to one person,
Mr Patrick, the common weelfare's the burden to prove beyond
a reasonable doubt that Mr Santa Suso killed Mr Cafilero,
(14:25):
and they will not meet this burden. Today. We will
ask that you return the only just verdict there is
and find Mr Santa Suso not guilty. And right on cue,
the prosecution calls Nick Patrick, it's star witness, to the
stand for his direct examination. Witnesses on direct are nearly
(14:47):
always played by students of the same team. This Nick
Patrick is about to break the code of silence and
read out, Tommy Santa Suso, what did us at Billy
of the outside to go out of smoke? We went outside,
We walked up by the alley, We turned the corner
and then there was Tommy right, Harry fark Bliss. What
(15:10):
did the defendant do? Then he started being a hiss
outability punching him, thrun him into the ground, kicking him.
At one point you got on top of him and
then grabbed his head and was smashing it into the ground.
Billy was leading real bad And did you agree to
help him get rid of the body? Well, yeah, what
(15:32):
was I supposed to do? Getting people to flip is
really the name of the game when it comes to
the mob. That is how you're gonna make your big cases.
I got pretty good at it. My name is Elijnig.
I spent fourteen years as a prosecutor. Yes, they literally
swear a blood oath when they become members of the
BOB and they swear to omerta, which is the Italian
(15:53):
word for silence. That said, they will flip if you
charge them with the murder and they're looking at life
behind bars. They'll if they've had a falling out with
the family, if they've been here's a term shelved, the
meaning sort of suspended without pay, they'll flip. If they
have a beef going with somebody else, another term, they're
a dispute. They will flip. So the biggest and best
cases I made were based on cooperation, on flipping people
(16:16):
and getting them to break through that code of silence,
that code of loyalty. So the mob presence looms large
at these cases and it really can either help or
hurt the prosecution or the defense. It's yours, your Patrick.
How old are your kids? Excuse me, your kids? They're
(16:38):
still young, yes, and they've grown up in this world
of yeah, I love you too, Yes, your honor. This
line of questioning, if we may be heard outside the
presence of the jury. Sure, I normally don't back down
from an objection, which is half the game and trial,
(17:00):
Like you cannot be rattled. B Are you meditative because
you know your client's going to jail, Do it and
let them worry about it if they're going to object
or not, Like, just punch it. This line of questioning
is relevant as Mr Patrick has a big deal to
testify for the Commonwealth in today's case. Now, part of
that deal is that he and his family get witnessed protection,
(17:21):
they get relocated to a new place to start their
life far away from the mafia. The relevance of this
line of questioning is testing Mr Patrick's motive to testify
on the stand today and as such as testing his
bias and his credibility which is always relevant. Um, is
it true that Mr Pratfick's doing act saw and his
family he is, But I still wouldn't understand the age
(17:45):
of his children having anything to deal with this or
anything along that line, Your Honor, I can respond if
if you need me to, Yes, Your Honor, at the
point of the age of his children is just to
show that Mr Patrick still has young children and they've
grown up up in the world of the mafia. So
part of this deal is that his young children no
longer have to grow up in the world of the mafia.
(18:06):
And it goes to his deal today to testify for
the Commonwealth in exchange for that witness protection for him
and his family. Again, Your Honor, a ghost through his
motive to testify on the stand, to his bias as
a witness and his credibility which is always relevant. Man,
Your Honor, Jesus Scratch broke an overall objection. The Commonwealth
(18:27):
in their cooperation agreement with you, offered you and your
family witness protection. If I at that prect now I
want to talk to you about June eleven. Now, you
exited the bar with Billy Cafirero that night, right, Yes,
And you went out into the valley, yes, both me
(18:48):
and Billy. And you loaded Mr Cafaliro's body into the
trunk of your car. Correct, it was your car and
not Mr Santa Susso's where Billy's bloody body was Correct,
it was wrapped. But yes, So part of your cooperation
agreement with the Commonwealth is not that you were an
accomplice to the murder of Billy Cathiro. Is that your
(19:08):
testimony today? No, that's right, and as an accomplice, you
would agree with me that you were hard. It is
not enough to be learned jurists and skill practitioners. Your
people need understanding and love. The wounds and the suffering
(19:31):
is deep. What then, does this demand of you? And
returned to the biblical vision of justice, Shaw's showed the
people in society that there is another way to serve.
(19:56):
Your commitment to God's justice makes demands on you. It
is not enough to be incorrupt, to go to your
people with clean hands. Those guns mostly oh stretched will
be right back after the break. While the St. Mary's
(20:19):
team is scoring points, with the judges up north, the
squad from the University of South Dakota is getting hyped
getting here. I'm glad you're president awake. Did you have
your nap this morning? I'm sure you did. Okay, these
are law students, not football players. Do we need to
make sure that here's the deal? As of ten thirty,
(20:44):
the moment you speak to another competitor, you can no
longer talk to me until the round is concluded. For
coach Laura Rose, the battle of the experts is the
first chance to finally get her team into the wind column.
Her school is ranked dead last among all of the
tournament's competitors. What I expect to happen this morning for
(21:04):
them to see a very intelligent, very well compared, and
well coached Berkeley team. I think that the evidentiary arguments
are going to be on point. If Bailey stays calm
and remembers that she does actually know what she's talking about,
will be fine. You've got this, Bailey. Stand firm on
your knowledge, right, stand firm on your preparation. Don't worry
about the individual components of it. Right now, you know
(21:26):
how to flow with this. Stressing yourself out and gonna
do you any favors. You're a monster. Get in there
and destroy people, guys. Blood makes the grassgrow, Like I'm
not kidding, it's it's it's time. You'll put in the work.
You're ready for it. Everything else is just gravy at
this point, it's just complete nerves and jitters. For me,
at least, I'm Bailey more of it. And I am
(21:49):
a third year law student. Justin I are arguing first today,
and I think that we're so ready, We've got our
case prepared. But these past couple of days it's been
like just the most anticipation I think I've ever felt
in law school. Round one, South Dakota versus you see Berkeley.
(22:14):
All right, everybody's here. We just received the message. It started.
Let's call the case of Commonwealth of Pennsylvania versus Thomas
Santa SUSO. All right, and the bench counsel, would you
like to make appearances for the record. Yes, good morning,
your honor. My name is Bailey Moore back along with
my co counsel just in trying to name is Justin
(22:35):
Peter right, co counsel for the defense. All right, thank you,
UML now here, these children, I swear I don't know
if you're more nervous. This is the first group of
students to be trained in the quote Laura Rose system,
and they've been taught to be more assertive in pre
trial motions, to not give away any advantage. Become a
(23:00):
walth has six to address. So first, your honor, we
asked that all witnesses be constructively sworn in in sequestered
per rule six O three. Suppose acounts a little gay
with that, barely say no, come on, or we were
under the impression that all witnesses will be present for
the testimony of other witnesses, especially for the experts there,
(23:21):
good girl, Um, your honor, it's stipulated to that all
witnesses will be present for other witnesses testimony, So we
ask that they all be present. So therefore we disagree
to see questration. They've already thrown them. They've already thrown them.
Burn of proof. Well, it's called proof beyond a reasonable doubt.
(23:42):
And there are three things today that the Commonwealth must
prove to you all beyond a reasonable doubt. First, they
must prove to you that William Cafiro is dead. Over
the next two hours, the South Dakota team does their
level best to stick to the evidence and to avoid
the strionics usually associated with defense attorneys. Second, they must
(24:05):
prove to you that Thomas Santa Suso was the one
who killed William Cafirero. And lastly, they must prove that
Thomas Santa Suso acted with the intent to kill William Cafirero.
As I just said, this is a case about opportunity,
obvious misses, and desired outcomes. And in order to show that,
today the Commonwealth is going to present you with two witnesses.
(24:28):
You're going to meet Sergeant Rosh. You see, Sergeant Rosh
is the over eager yet misguided investigator, and then you'll
meet their star witness a cross examination. Come on, justin, Yes,
your Ms Patrick, you just testified on direct examination that
(24:52):
Tommy Santa Suso was boosting trucks after boos and cars Ridge. Yeah, yeah,
that's true. I did. I think most people can have
like a voice in the courtroom. They're just gonna kind
of find what that is. I would say, I'm pretty direct.
I would like I don't get very flowery, like I
(25:12):
know Rose like she likes the fairy tale style themes,
for something and that's not me. It would sound goofy.
If I was talking about snow White and the Seven Dwarves,
people would be like, what's wrong with this guy? This
wasn't the first time you've attested to this. No, I
think I said the same thing in the preliminary hearing.
(25:34):
That's what I knew. That sounds right to be honest
with you, and yo, yes, for sure. He just destroyed
her credibility completely and totally. And now he gets into
his planned questioning that was as smooth it South Dakota
is up against a team with a much different style,
(25:56):
more outgoing, more theatrical. At the heart of his murder
was membership money. Oh you're on paper still first membership
And see her looking down. She's gotten notes somewhere. Billy
Capierro made a mockery of the defense. The stage is
(26:18):
like a defense witness, so you'll hear from today. They
are kept close given excuse me, favors, all in the
hopes of producing loyalty to the battalitius. This theater stuff
that you see leaking in it gets attention, but it's
not litigating. It's not being a lawyer. I just heard
(26:41):
some criticism in your voice about the theatricality that seems
to be. It sounds like maybe more infused these days
in terms of the mock trial competitions. I teach my
students that trial is theater. I teach my students that
at jurors and even judges are looking for some level
(27:04):
of having their attention captured through the theatrics of what
that trial is and what the facts are, etcetera. Am
I wrong in that regard? No, I don't think. I
don't think it's wrong to say that we steal from
the art form of theater all the time. As trial ers.
You have to in order to present, in order to
know when to use the softer tone of your voice
(27:27):
to really in an opening statement, get the members of
the jury to have that moment where all of a
sudden their empathy is engaged and they're listening to you
at a different level. I teach all of those tricks too.
But what I come back to at the end of
the day is juries want that theater. But juries are
roving bands of twelve year old girls. And what I
mean by that is they will spot the fake person
like that, and when they spot the fake person, they're
(27:48):
done with you. It doesn't matter how compelling you are,
it doesn't matter how great of an order you are.
If they think that you're fake and full of it,
they're not going to reward you at the end of
the day because they're gonna feel lied to. But it's
not about making them into an actor. It's about teaching
them the tricks from acting and teaching them the tricks
from theater in order to do the presentation in the
most authentic way that they can't because at the end
(28:11):
of the day, that's what juries end up rewarding. But
you and I both know anybody could be an advocate,
but not everybody could be a trial lawyer. Are you
thinking about how they're gonna end up as lawyers and whatnot?
They're going to be competitive trial lawyers and really be
able to make a mark that way. I am much
more concerned with building competitive lawyers than I am with
building competitive trial teamers. You get four competitions if you're lucky, right,
(28:33):
you get four times to compete at an at a
mock trial competition in law school, maybe six if you
really push it at some schools. Right, if you do
three a year, you have the rest of your professional
career that you're going to go out and be representing people,
And so I'm much more concerned with making good attorneys.
(28:57):
Coming back and say, Antonio, the pace of the trial
is heating up. So let me get this straight. You
heard the defendants say in three separate statements that he
was going to kill Billy. Correct. Correct. The rookie Mariana
and Sinas is thrown into the fire as a witness,
(29:20):
and in another room, her teammates are listening, ready to
bail her out. So as we sit here today, you
have absolutely no idea about anything time he did after
he left the bar. Correct, Yeah, you agree, it's possible
he never left at all. I mean it could be possible. Yes,
(29:42):
I saw him leave the bar with his wife. So
and you didn't him again that night, No, I didn't,
because the only way you would know if he hadn't
come back that night is if he had physically re
entered the bamboo lounge. Correct. Yes, And when I have
really took was closing up. I was able to see
a little bit outside, and that was the extent to
(30:05):
what I could see outside. So as we sit here today,
you have absolutely no idea about anything I did. Actually,
left the botter. Correct. Yeah, objection, your honor, asked and answered, Boss,
we have no further questions, your honor. When the experts
(30:27):
are called, the trial moves into open warfare, with lawyers
trying to crush the credibility of the other side's witness. Hello,
my name is Macdesma. This Macladesma is portrayed by St.
Mary's Cold Dobula. Business has been hired eighteen times before
to do this. Correct. Yes, so set out of the
(30:50):
eighteen times that your business has been hired to consult,
it's been hired by monsters. Correct, It's been hired violent
monsters and their defense counsel. You did not speak with Nickpatrick. No,
Now you believe nick statements to the police were truthful? Correct,
(31:10):
I'm sorry, I'm so sorry. So you believe the objection,
your honor, I mean, very sustained. Sometimes all of this
high speed action results in a misfire objection, Your honor,
your objection, Yes, your honor, objection to the commonwealth saying
(31:33):
that my client got an attorney. What's your objection? My
objection is withdraw. Okay, But the mark of a sharp
attorney is a quick recovery. Let's talk about your investigation
(31:54):
on Billy's murder. You collected evidence in this case, yes,
and one of the evidence that you collected was the
interview of Mr Patrick the written report, Yes, the interpe
Mr Patrick. But we don't have that audio of the
(32:14):
interview today. No, we don't have it because your police
department lost it. Yeah, I'm not sure. As the trial
heads to break, Andy Viskora, the team captain, checks in
with her co counsel, Dude, I forgot the last look,
(32:34):
I know, I know. Was it that bad? Yeah, you
don't go off screen. I mean, it's not that bad.
The cross was good, But like, are you confident in yourself?
Like you knew that you walked over stop for like
two minutes to ask one question. I know, I just
couldn't remember my question. It's okay. If you don't remember
ended on that, it's okay. Like you clearly were going
(32:58):
off screen. No, you didn't fail. It was a good
it was a good yes, I'm sure, But don't but
be confident in yourself, like you know what you're I
know you could not remember. Just take a breath and
just like take a moment, like you're okay, everything's okay,
Like it was a really good. Cross. You got it.
(33:19):
We got everything we needed. It's fine. Let you down.
Know you didn't let me down. You can't dwell on
it for too long because we have a job to do.
And it's like you can't sit there and feel sorry
for yourself, like just keep going, like you have to
(33:41):
keep going and you have to remember that, like confidence
is half of the game jazz, because you're not being
you don't believe in yourself, and like I can't do
it for you. Like sometimes like you like get down
and you like let it like go into you, and
then you're like and you hesitate and the next question
is the right question? It like you know this stuff,
and I'm just like, like you got it? Yeah, I
(34:05):
like just hit it like you sarcasm, Like all of
your questions or your questions, but like your tone of
voice and how you're asking them are going to convey
more than what you're actually saying. We all got confidence issues.
We all got confidence issues. Are you ready for this? Lead? Direct? Yeah? Okay,
(34:28):
put the fund down. You're not crying, You're fine, lawyers,
don't cry. Let's go. I need you to hype up.
We got this, Okay, we got everything. This is the
easy parts practice. Yes, let's go. Okay, is our our
(34:48):
teeth back? Get all the attorneys to screen your honor
council members of the jury. Earlier today, my co AC
Council Bailey MOOREVAC told us this case we come down
(35:08):
to an opportunity obvious mrs and the desired outcome. The
teams are ready for closing arguments, and the pressure is
on to impress the judges one last time in South Dakota.
That job falls to Justin and now the Commonwealth comes
before us today and asks you to give them their
(35:31):
desired outcome, an outcome that they haven't quite earned. Then
we also heard from the defenses expert, Mr Macladsma, the
DESMA who spent years in the FBI has investigated many
many organized criminals, pointed out a few things that didn't
(35:54):
make sense. The few things that didn't make sense, like
the circumstances and suspects that were never investigated. Let's talk
about some of those circumstances. The first one being you
can't get the technology to the timing of the death.
There we go, there we go, Justin, there's my boy.
(36:15):
The extremely close to the timing of the release from
the guy for the potential violations of the markets are
the sanction killing and sanctional killing is when the blessing
in San Antonio, It's Andy's turn to close out the case. Yes,
can we proceed? Some things are too good to be true,
(36:41):
but the commonwealth things. They have their slam dunk conviction.
Why does anything else matter. It matters because they have
the wrong guy. It matters because the real killer is
sitting in the wrong chair. It matters because in the
United States of America, no one is above the law
and no one is beneath it either. It means that
(37:01):
no matter who you are, president, priest, prostitute, or even
former mafia member, the law protects you until the CommonWell
until the state can prove otherwise. Mr Patrick thinks that
because he delivered this perfect present of a case to
you today, no one will look too hard at him.
(37:23):
Pay attention to the red flashing lights pulsing in front
of you. There is more evidence in this case that
Nick Patrick, Council, you've run out of time. Yes, your honor,
you revolved in this case. Yes, you remembers to the
jury the defense that I could have cut it. I
(37:50):
couldn't cut it perfect close it was, it wasn't perfect.
After the end of the round, the presiding judge and
the jurors tally up their points. They mark a range
of scores for the quality of the openings and the closings,
(38:11):
as well as the effectiveness of the direct and cross examinations.
Judges could just drop an acknowledgement in the chat or
give me a shout and let me know when their
ballot has been submitted. I can confirm with the back
office that it has been received. How do you feel.
I feel good. There are parts of it that could
(38:32):
have been smoother. There are parts of it where they
could have argued a little bit more, but they used
their time judiciously. They pointed out the things that they
needed to point out. I would have liked just to
point out the impeachments that we got in the clothes
a little bit more. But I think he attacked the
credibility of the witnesses just by in particular, since he
had that moment our comments. Let's just prepare judges, let's
just go in alphabetical order. As for the defense, I
(38:53):
would say that the cadence of the closing made difficult
to follow what was and what was not important within
your arguments. That's happen. Like I said before I pitched up, Yeah,
there was a total voice critique just it's gonna be
so bad. Both teams did well, but I would caution
the prosecution to be less theatrical, and for the defense,
(39:14):
I would say pick your energy up a little bit more,
especially if you get stuck at a point. It seemed
like at some points both sides may have been doing
some reading um, which is okay uh in my view,
because you don't have to memorize every single factor case
in order to be yes you boss, I could find
(39:41):
use my power one. Yeah, I was trying to find
it's happen. But it wasn't a terrible cloth. It wasn't
a terrible clothes justin you did exactly what you need
to do. You walk them through the element. You walked
them through where they didn't have proof. You did exactly
what I would have What did you do you handle
(40:01):
It's that should have been a time was Yeah, but
we're going up against the world's first boring over the
ashole like non existent real world team. Yeah, like that guy,
exactly what did you get? Zoby Michelot my name or
a Quarterbacky, you handled that around, or really did, but
(40:26):
you yeah, shaken off, shake off the shake off the
bad vife freaks. I'm telling you can handle that. The
fact that that closure was as scripted as he was
and was as reading as much as he was. I'm
not meaning this as any kind of insult to Berkeley,
because that's a way that they can choose to coach.
But this stuff drives me nuts. I can't stand preplanned
(40:49):
gestures where it's been clear that they've been told what
mark to hit with it, and they were clearly reading
both their opening and their closing, and they're opening was
long as hell. It was like ten minutes long. It
was ridiculous. Your theory is way better on the State case.
That's the stuff that we discarded about a month ago.
Now at this point was was what they went with.
You guys are better prepared. You just have to stay focused.
(41:12):
In San Antonio, the mood is tense as they wait
for comments. This WiFi better start working before I throw
a hand trump. Hey, you guys, I'm gonna keep my
comments as short as possible, no matter how much I
love the sun of own voice, because I know you
all are probably hungry because I am. But in all seriously, guys, lookers,
(41:34):
and you'll even I would have pulled with all the
emotions lily today, I would have been shouted out of
the pegroom. Um, you are going to find a request
emotion and limited. You better make superiod matters. You better
make sure he's not completely st everyone's time and you
might lay your emotion your threat. You have to be
(41:55):
able to adjust. And um, I mean, let's be honest,
the running out of time card is that to our
west was concerned for me or back? I'm gonna sort
of piggyback on that comment. To me, this felt pretty
sloppy for a trial at this level. Um, going over time,
not listening to the rulings on motions and objections, not
(42:16):
having a backup plan if you lose on a particular
line of questioning, and just sort of like dropping it.
And I just feel like at this level, you know,
you gotta look at the scoresheet and you got to
see what we're evaluating you on. This is an overall
performance kind of a competition, overall performance kind of sporesheet.
There's no part on the sporesheet for me to give
you bonus points for making motions eliminate and objections that
(42:39):
didn't advance your case in the end, you thought we
were sloppy. How are we slopping? I don't know. I
thought you did good. Maybe it was me away cross Oky,
I'm really sorry about the running out of time. Yeah,
(43:00):
it's fine. No, it's not fine. Down, I'm sorry. Oh.
After one long day of competition, the St. Mary's team,
despite the harsh comments from the judges, beat the University
of Illinois Chicago. They lost their next trial to Chicago Kent.
The team piles into Andy's car trying to clear their heads. Sander,
(43:25):
and why do you have a keens and dress? Because
my sister had her, Keen said recently, and I've been
trying to get this to the right cleaners, but I've
been forgetting because I'm running around like a crazy person. Christen,
I wonder what judge was that complained. It was like
our main judge, no vote. I't talk about that anymore.
(43:47):
I'm They're like, I'm gonna be pissed if this one
guy carried his wolves, Like is that a joke? Like? Yeah,
he was good. He was also reading. Everyone needs to
calm down. It's hard breaking first, so hard for this
and we still got two rounds. I mean we we
(44:07):
got your rounds right, Like today's rounds were like they're okay,
definitely could do better tomorrow. It's like, and your opening
was so good. Like I'm just like, I don't know,
we do need to hit it harder. I just don't
know how else I'm gonna cut my frosted brow. I'm
only gonna like, I'm gonna make it tight like that guy.
Maybe you just need to be like was there finger prints? No? Alright? Cool?
(44:30):
Next on the night there because I keep going just
like I'm gonna just cut out the investigation block to
the rest of the box. You're right, we know what
we need to do. It's gonna be good. ALP, my
kids never do my trial. What do you do? More
(44:58):
from Class Action after the break. South Dakota is also
one and one. They lost to UC Berkeley, but coach
Rose doesn't tell her team it scores during the tournament.
We spilled the beans to Bailey after the competition. I
(45:20):
haven't even seen the scorecards. So did they beat us
in both of those rounds? Sorry? But yeah they did?
You're kidding. Oh that is such a bummer and kind
of funny that they won, I remember, but acting that
came from it, it just seemed fake. And then there
was a lot of smiling at which I didn't understand
(45:41):
because it was, you know, a murder trial. I remember
being shocked during it and just being like, what are
we going up against? Right now? I think they were polished.
I'll give them that, like they knew their facts, they
knew the fact pattern. It was polished. You could tell
they had prepared, but they didn't prepare in the way
that South Dakota had prepared. So it shocks me that
day won. But then they rallied and beat the highly
(46:04):
ranked University of South Carolina team. You didn't include a
lot of the evidence that corroborates the Nickpatrick's story, right,
because you didn't include the defendant cell phone record, No
I did not. You didn't include anything about the autopsy report,
No I didn't. Did that feel better? Ibody, feel a
little better now, right? So good? SHARE's the difference. You
(46:30):
feel better this afternoon because you chased down the tracks
when they left them chased down trackable. You guys were
nervous about that because the time this morning. Don't worry
about that tomorrow, you know, your arguments, you know your positioned,
you know where you're going to go. You'll handled that,
and you ate the puppies without embarrassing them so badly
that they felt like they were shamed. That closing, sir, Hot,
(46:52):
damn Hot, damn Brandon, you did that first part of
the clothes in like nine minutes. Just so you know,
y'all are great. I'm super duper proud of today. You
should be super duper proud of today. You, sir that witnessed.
Would it refresh your recollection if I pointed your right
to it? And then she took forever and you're like,
I'll live for you. I think Bill, Yes, Like Holliday
(47:16):
along twice on Sunday, everybody had moments of real advocacy
brilliance today. So I called my parents between rounds. So
right after I argued they've gotten very invested in this.
They obviously, you know, know about the case, so they
know that it was a murder trial. And then I
made the joke to Rose yesterday. I was like, well,
(47:38):
I want to send my parents a link, but I
don't think they know how to change their name on Zoom,
so I'm gonna have to teach them how to do that.
So my wife looks at it as a student organization,
and she does not understand why there's a podcast following
us for our student organization. She doesn't understand why there's
a camera set up for a student organization. She doesn't
(48:00):
understand why we have to compete in competitions for a
student organization. She just compares it to like the nursing
club and undergrad. She's like, I was in whatever club
and undergrad and we never had to do any of that.
Why are you doing all this takes up so much time.
You don't need to be doing that. Breathe the home rest.
(48:21):
We're gonna try our case tomorrow. We're gonna handler ship.
We're gonna do the same thing all over again. Okay, breathing,
go fourth, do good things. Any questions you need to
ask me, I don't know yet. It'll it'll be a
while before they they announced that as soon as I
have the pairing, you'll have the pairing. He looks to
the trunk. They count one, two, three, The trunk pops open,
(48:43):
and the spotlight of the trunk shines on the victim
of this case, Mr William Cafierrell, sprawled out bruised, swollen
lamp and using what little life he has left to
plead for help. Day two was a letdown for South Dakota.
(49:04):
They lost a battle against Cumberland again news to Bailey.
After the round, Justin and I went into one of
the study rooms at school and he goes, God, that
was brutal, and I was like, Bill and Brandon just
slammed them and it was impeaching, it was correcting them
on the record, it was all of this stuff, and yeah, wow,
(49:31):
that's all I have to say. And then exhaustion creeped
in and they lost a top ranked Baylor Luck in
the next rounds. Everybody but Luck, everybody. You know. It
was just tears because you put in so much work,
you have your school's name behind you representing them, so
(49:52):
it's almost worse than a sports loss. And it was
worse because there were definitely rounds that we should not
have lost that we did lose, and that doesn't necessarily
happen in sports. So that was very, very, very tough,
and to just kind of feel like we didn't do
(50:13):
enough for like we've disappointed you know, usd or and
you know and I know that that is not the case.
There's just stuff you can't control, but you do take
it personally, and I definitely did. We're gonna have to
know who we go against because we're gonna have to
email them. Jasmine wants to know who we're going to
go against, and I'm like, I just rather not know
because it doesn't matter if we're going to prosecution or
(50:34):
defense first. Oh well, yeah, I want to know that too.
But Jasmine's out here like trying to scout people. I
don't know anything except you ceiling in Baylor. But still
at St. Mary's, the unforced errors continue for Jason Goss's team.
He and his wife Maritza can only watch and shake
their heads. Didn't it weird? So Andy got and he
(50:56):
got a ten, a nine and a six on our
closing It every every round ten and nine in a six.
Every round she has had somebody give her a six.
What did Jasmine get on her opening? She got an eight,
a five and a nine in the five the same
(51:16):
person who gave Andy a six. So that is a
judge that just did not like us from the beginning.
From the beginning, head coach A. J. Blito de Luna
has been following the tournament all weekend. So what do
you think is going on? I don't know. I don't know.
(51:37):
I think that they're rattled from the beginning. You know,
I shouldn't trust us. Yeah, so they're bad so and
that's going to affect the jury, that's right. Yeah. I
just don't understand that though, because we don't practice that way.
So why are they Why is this happening? Now? We'll
(52:03):
be right back. After the break. St. Mary's is trounced
by Temple University and completely run out of gas against
Pace University in New York. The St. Mary's team piles
into a car and heads to Frida, a restaurant owned
by Andy's parents. Well, you might want to sit on
(52:23):
the other side to the Cutch Dour and hutch gosins
in here, and then a j can have a seat
if you want to do our servant dream. Oh yes, yeah,
can I get him tamer? That actually sounds really good?
What are you getting? I think overall, I'm proud of us.
(52:45):
I think if we don't break because substantially, substantively we
were there, but also like we gave it our all
and we have to learn from our procedural mistakes next time.
And it's Okay, this is our you know, this is
the very fun I think I luck looked out. I
was really stressing playing Nickpatrick just this whole weekend, and
(53:07):
luckily in both teams where we played I played mckpatrick,
they didn't go hard nearly as hard as I feel
like we were across and so I feel like they
really prepared me for what was to come. So yeah,
I mean that was my take from today. I can
read a little easier for now. No one hands happy
that made it through another day. Um, it's a very
(53:30):
tired one to recover, but we did so much work
for two months, very very late nights. I want to
advance even know it's going to be exhausting next day,
so we could say, you know, it was more worth it.
But at the same time, even if we don't break,
it was a great experience for my first outing for
(53:51):
law school. A j stops by just in time to
hear the announcement about which teams will move on. It's
called making the break. Hi, how are you well? How
are you than you? Can I get an old fashioned
please have you right? Thank you? Everyone recording in trump ran,
(54:15):
Welcome every one to the two thousands to one battle.
Of the experts worst. So I'm really pleased to announced
in the first time becausiding and judge Outstanding Presenting jog
World goes to Jason Golin. It's a nice picture to
picture held me. I'm gonna start with our number one seed.
(54:39):
Um to look my way down to the number four seat.
Uh the fourteen as a dance and did see there one? Uh?
This team was the only team to finish for in
twelve year rounds undefeated one. So they were iuted number one.
(55:01):
Hat you only undefeated team, our disfecting champion slave every
final team or second team returning to the playoffs from
second trade hereof made it in playoffs. This year's getting
(55:21):
their teeth in the recipe in differentially Tis T three
ways eight Imparson baid congratulations data. So it happens just
like that. So we keep going. You pick up your
chin and we fight another day. You all have I
(55:44):
mean you could see it, right, you're wearing it. You're
wearing your feelings on your sleeves. Right, you could see it.
This is something that you can use a strength. You
were not beaten this weekend. It was on forced errors.
So the question is how do you take this feeling
(56:04):
and turn it into strength. How do you take this
feeling and say, no, we're not going to do that again.
We're better than that. Our coaches believe in us. We
are better than that. How can we do this differently
next time? We believe in you, and you're going to
represent us in Best in Texas, the four of you
and Mariella, you're going to be an advocate. So all
(56:28):
four of you, you're gonna be a team. You're gonna
be an advocate, and you're gonna show what we already know.
I'm I saw them that we didn't break into the semis.
It's okay, okay, this is Andy's mom and dad. Anything
(56:53):
in life another you go to see her, Oh yeah,
is baby. This is what they do on this But yeah,
it's impressive to know, and it's impressive what you can do.
It's awesome the whole experience. In surprise, they were like
(57:14):
a composer really is a professional men and the yes,
we are like that when you yeah, I mean it's
kind of disappointing in the sense that I did have
a lot to prove. Yeah, look at them next time.
(57:36):
But hopefully I can eat now. So I'm gonna go Okay,
our people are crying for quality of love in law,
(57:56):
in the exercise of your powerful profession, and the trial
season real and mock is underway. Prosecutors, defense attorneys, and
judges from around the country are struggling with the weighty
issues surrounding the administration of justice. The red mass dates
(58:17):
back to the Magna Carta and the advent of jury trials.
Our system is not perfect, but hopefully these young attorneys
can make a bit of difference. Inspire them with your integrity.
Give them what any man or woman can claim from
the law, but give them even more more for your
(58:44):
salvation and theirs. Give them yourselves. Act toward them as
God has act toward you. Who knows you just might
transformed Texas into the Kingdom of God, the Father, the Son,
(59:05):
and the Holy Spirit. Glorifying the Lord by your lives,
Thanks be to God. I always remind them, I'm like,
(59:29):
this is what it's gonna be, guys, this is it you.
At least you have the community of being on the
team with people who have similar experiences. You will be
the only one. Every place that I have ever practiced,
I have been the only one on the defense side.
DeAndre Bell also with nineteen ranks on the prosecution side
(59:50):
from Team in City as Stillard be a Myrn and
finally we had a perfect scoring attorney on the defense side, Dillard.
That's next time on Class Action. Class Action is a
(01:00:13):
production of I Heart Radio and Sound Argument Created, produced, written,
and edited by Kevin Huffman and Lisa Gray. Additional story
production by Jennifer Swan, Kristen Cabrera, Jason Foster, and Wendy Nardi.
Executive producers are Taylor Chacogne and Katrina Norvelle. Sound design,
(01:00:36):
editing and mixing by Evan Tire and Taylor Chacogne. This
episode had additional field production by Kristen Cabrera, Paul Ebson,
Alfredo de la Garza, and Malia Lukomski. For more podcasts
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