Shannon Sharpe and Chad “Ochocinco” Johnson join Quentin Richardson to discuss why LeBron left Miami and debate claims that LeBron has “no bag” despite being the NBA’s all-time leading scorer.
39:13 - LeBron needed Heat years to be the GOAT?
1:00:19 - Q-Rich debate the real reason LeBron left Miami
1:09:32 - The Moment D-Wade knew Bron was leaving Heat
1:17:25 - LeBron got treatment in the club?!
1:28:05 - LeBron has no bag?!?!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
No, no, no, no, no, ain't no contention. You got to win
it with him.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Hold on, it can't be contention because he went to
the finals four years in Cleveland, he won one. Yeah,
he's only won one title in LA he's been here
five years. So we can't automatically assume because that's hypothetic.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
We can't. Let's deal with what we know, O Joe.
We've got to deal with what we know.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
And that's what I'm saying because now without those two
extra MVPs regular season, without those two extra finals MVPs, guess.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
Who else you bring into the equation? One?
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Stephan Curry? Because Steph has four yeah kIPS. Steph has
two MVPs and a final MVP. So now let's just say,
for the sake of argument, Lebron has two regular season MVPs,
two finals MVPs. Are we looking at Lebron the same way?
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Yeah we are. No, we're not. He's different. No, now
with Ojo different? So are you?
Speaker 3 (01:00):
His greatness? Solely on m vps and titles.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
But but that's how you get into the goat debate.
It's rings.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Remember rings, No, o Joe, what if we said you
and I both saying you can be great and not
have ring. Charles Barkley was a great player. Carl Malone
was a great player. John Stockton was a great player.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
We can't we can't put We can't put them on
the same stratosphere, on the same pedes as Lebron. But
if Charles, he's in the category of his own with
mild Bryant.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
But what does he have rings? Rings? O cha, I
understand what you're saying.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
But even still, just even even without the rings, dude, dude,
he's he's o joe.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
He would without the rings. He's not in the gold conversation.
Without the rings, he's not in the gold conversation. So
he's out of it. He's out of it. It's not
even a debate. See for me, I don't put anybody.
I don't put. If you look at my top five,
my top five, you have to have at least three
regular season MVPs. That's how I took it three.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
So let me ask you a question.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Yes, he had the scoring title, Yes, but he wasn't
able to win any rings of championships.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
He couldn't be considered. He wasn't.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
He wouldn't even they would know. We don't have any
rings he wouldn't even be in the conversation. How so
how would you put in with no rings? Hold on, oo,
think about this?
Speaker 1 (02:32):
Is it different for football?
Speaker 4 (02:33):
Then?
Speaker 3 (02:34):
No players that are great that have never won a ring?
Does that mean they're not great? They're not in the conversation.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Because as a thing, when you look at quarterbacks, name
a quarterback is Brady Montana.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
It's a manny. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Now when we see and this is what we talk about,
the levels, This is what we're talking about goals, because
you can be great and not and not have rings. You, Kenyon,
I believe that. I believe you can be great and
not have ring. Charles Barkley was a great player. Okay,
Look at how we look at Kevin Durant, look at
(03:13):
Scott excuse me now, I take that back.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
I'm talking about Kevin.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Look at how we looked at Kevin Garnett before and
then after he got that ring.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
You see the difference. Look at how we look a
look at how we look a look.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
At how we looked at Dirt Nubisky before and after
he got the ring. So my argument is, how would
we be able to say lebron is a goat with
just two rings when Kobe has five, when Duncan has five,
when Kareem has five, when Jordan has six, when Magic
(03:50):
has five, and all the guys that I mentioned are Jordan,
Jordan has six, has five regular season MVPs, has three
regular season MVPs with three finals MVPs. So you're right,
But I don't believe without Miami, because here's the thing
we saw. I believe it. I think everybody out there believe.
(04:13):
Had Kevin Durant got not gotten hurt in twenty nineteen
Toronto not.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Beating them, No, absolutely not.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
But you see what can happen. You see what can happen.
One injury change the landscape. You see what happened with
Kevin Durant, with Lebron, Kyrie and Kevin Love got hurt,
changed the whole completion of the.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
Series, didn't it.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
Kevin Durant in Brooklyn, Kyrie gets hurt, James Harder dealing
with a hamstring. You see how things gotta beat. Now,
this is what we know. For Lebron, He's averaged twenty
five points. He's never scored less than twenty five points
in the season since his rookie year. He averages twenty seven,
seven and seven. I believe he goes anywhere else and
(04:55):
still averages twenty seven, seven and seven. But averaging twenty seven,
seven and seven ain't the same as what he did
in Miami. And when he got two more MVPs back
to back, two more finals MVPs back to back, it
changed the way we looked at him.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
But I still I'm telling you, I still think you
your your knowledge of the game of basketball is much
better than I am me as an.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
Outsider watching end.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
I think, regardless of what Lebron tweeted, minus less rings,
minus lest rings, my ass, I have a feeling that
he could have went to any team, any NBA team,
obviously with a supporting cast, an efficient supporting cast, and
done the exact same thing he did. In mind, I know,
I know he could have. I know he could have
because he's that special of a player. He's that special.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
How do we know, because remember, it takes more than
just scoring to win a title.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
A lot of the speaks for himself.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Oo, think about how close they came to losing the title.
They was a Ray Allen backpedal behind the three three,
the greatest shot in NBA history just to survive, right,
So for us to sit here and say, well, he
could have gone anywhere else and won anything. It's really
not that simple, Ohoe, not for a championship. Is it
(06:14):
that simple for him to go somewhere in average twenty seven,
seven and seven or the average thirty like he did
for the Lakers two years ago and like he averaged
twenty nine last year? Sure that he's lebron He the goal.
And I said, what made me put him there is
that when I factored in the regular season MBPS, I
factored in the finals MVPs at three different stops, now
(06:38):
Oho thirty thousand points, ten thousand rebounds, ten thousand assists.
You factor in all the first team All NBAS, you
factor in all the All Star appearances.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
You start factoring all of that.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
This is just not a longevity because there are a
lot of guys that played, not a lot of guys.
I think there are nine guys that played the total
of twenty years or more. But they averaging four points.
He ain't gonna average for He's gonna end up averaging
what is he I don't know if he averaged twenty seven,
but he'll probably be around twenty four to twenty five
points a game. And you're twenty one. Yeah, so it's
(07:13):
not in people. Look, I think the thing is O Joe.
I think what the reason, what what caught people so
far off guard is that this is a totally different
audience ESPN than when I was Undisputed, And if you
watch me on Undisputed, you know that I've criticized some
of the things Lebron has done, be it to play,
some of the things that he said. I think that
(07:35):
people have this perception that all I do is.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
Kate Kate, Kate, Kate, Kate for.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
Lebron, and that's not true. I don't believe any player,
I don't believe any person is beyond reproach. I don't
believe any player or any person is a beyond criticism
because you have being who you are, criticism comes along
with it. If you don't want the criticist, you should
(08:00):
not take the praise. Lebron is great. He's still in
my estimation to go. But I believe it took that
Miami stint to put him on the path. Now, going
back to Cleveland, going to four More, winning an MVP,
going to the Lakers winning another finals MVP, and he's
(08:21):
been dominant.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
He's been great. So they made it seem like I say.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Lebron was a bump man if he ain't go to
and it doesn't have to be mutually exclusive, Ojo, Miami benefited.
Lebron benefited a lot of times we just want to say, no,
you benefited. But I like to think in a relationship,
no matter if if it ended or not, we both
got something out of it.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
I like that. That's just me. Now. Sometimes we're like,
I ain't get nothing out of that. I ain't get nothing.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Okay, I took something maybe if it wasn't not, but
the damn good meal, I got something out of it.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
But that's a good one. Man, that's a good one.
Speaker 3 (09:02):
But I'm telling you, I whole heartly believe he could
have gone anywhere that was he came to the heat
what twenty was it twenty twelve.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Twenty eleven, twenty ten because they ended up losing.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Because think about it, O Joe, think about it now
for me, had he won twenty eleven against the Mavericks,
I don't even think it's I don't even think it's
a debate.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
I don't think it's a debate. A lot of people can't.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Put Lebron in front of Jordan for the simple fact
of twenty eleven. They said, I just can't do it
because I saw guys that were that Jordan would have
scored sixty on Joe. They're not putting JJ Burrew on
Michael Jordan. They're not putting Deshaun Stevenson on Michael Jordan.
And so a lot of people can't get over that
(09:44):
hurdle there, right, But I believe it took all of that.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
To get him to what we see now.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
The finished product that we see now happened because of
twenty eleven.
Speaker 3 (09:54):
Yeah, but the finished product would have been the same
regards to where he was at because of who he is.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
Because of who he is, the finished product.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
You can't tell me, well, if you didn't come to
the Miami Heat, the finished product of what we're what
we're witnessing now wouldn't be who he is.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
It was.
Speaker 4 (10:09):
No.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
But you're saying, but you're saying individually. See I'm not
talking about individually.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
And yes, I still believe as well.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
I'm talking from a team aspect and having MVPs and
championships if he went somewhere else.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
But here's the thing, they've done it.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
But think about Ojo Heath averaged probably looking at he
averaged thirty twenty nine, last year twenty eight, twenty nine,
last year thirty year before they win no titles.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
I have a question. I have a question.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
This is something I don't have in front of me.
He went to the Heat in twenty eleven, right, Yes,
I wish I had the rosses of the other team
to choose from that he could have gone to. And
I guarantee you could put at least five or six
other teams he could have gone to, and they would
have been in the finals with the opportunity to win
a championship, and he had an opportunity to get those
MVP finals. I guarantee you. I just don't have I
(10:57):
don't have the information in front of him right.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
Now, off the top of my head out the I
can remember. I know Miami was one. He ended up
going to Miami. I think the Knicks, but talking to
Rich Paul, Knicks were never really in play, and I
think Chicago.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
Oh yes, yes, and I'm not sure that. I'm not
sure the rosters. But yes, well you had at the time,
you had D Rose, you had Yo Kim Noah, you
have you d Roge Gibson. Yeah, yeah, because that year
he won the m v P. Oh Lebron oh Man,
So you mean to tell me, Jimmy Butler, oh championship championship,
(11:36):
m v P and a ring with the bulls that year? Yes,
come on, but there's no but about it. That's an
m v P championship.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
Trust me.
Speaker 3 (11:47):
And it's not even a hypothetical. I put I put
my life savers on that.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
If it was to happened. I wish, I wish we
could rewind time.
Speaker 3 (11:54):
We can't Prime d Roll, Jimmy Butler, Joe, Kim, Noah
and Lebron.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
You mean it to everything in that window Chip.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
We never know, have we seen, We've seen Ojo, We've
seen things happen just because you have the most talent.
You've seen teams. Look look at the Patriots. Patrick had
the most talent. You remember in two thousand and seven
and the little low Giants barely made the playoffs?
Speaker 1 (12:23):
Got him?
Speaker 2 (12:26):
I mean, who who would have thought the Dallas Mavericks
would have beat the Miami Heat Who would have thought
the Detroit.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
Pistons would have Tooken taken down Shaq and Kobe?
Speaker 5 (12:36):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (12:36):
Yeah, think about that now them boy? That would Ben
Wallace and the boys.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
Huh Ben, she ripped. They were playing some defense. Boy
see and that's and to see Ojo. That's what I say.
You don't know, right, Let's let's deal.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
The only thing I can say for certain looking at
Lebron james career is that penciling man for twenty seven,
seven and seven. Write it in the book, and I'm right,
and I'm right, and I'm writing it in non erasable inc.
You can't erase it. That's what I know. But championships
are a lot harder to come by. People keep talking
about Jordan with Jordan was six for six. Jordan played
(13:14):
fifteen years, so the other nine years he didn't get there, right,
You're right.
Speaker 3 (13:21):
Well, I have a question on the topic of basketball,
on something that I need to gain a little a
little bit more knowledge about.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
Okay, what do the Lakers need.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
Outside of Anthony Davis staying healthy? They need one more
one more star.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
They got to hit some I mean, it's the first
time I think in NBA history through the first eight
games they've made less field goals from the three and
shadow worst percentage in NBA history. They instituted they instituted
a three point line in nineteen seventy nine. That was
a year after you was born. That's when the three
(13:58):
point line Chris Ford made their first three point shot.
So think about that. Go back all the way back.
They've been outscored by seventy four points in the first quarter,
which is the most in NBA history through this amount
of games.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
Wait, score, I've scored by how much seventy four? Hey? Man,
we gotta go to a leak a game? Man? How
much course side seats?
Speaker 2 (14:27):
You ain't somebody always want to go to the You
want to go to the Miami Heat. I mean with
pat Riley with them nineteen with them nineteen fifty five rules.
Speaker 4 (14:36):
Hey, listen, it ain't it ain't. It ain't even bad
as you think it is. Man, people may listen when
you look at the look at the guys that go there,
they have some of their best years in their careers
when they go.
Speaker 1 (14:47):
And look at the guys leave.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
I saw Dwayne Wade leave, I saw Jimmy Butler leave,
I saw Lebron James leave. Now that's three of the
best players that you had in the last fifteen years.
Now tell me what I don't know, Q.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
What you do? Yeah, hold on, holdover let it fish up.
You can chime in after him.
Speaker 4 (15:03):
You we all got family, right, Yeah, sometimes sometimes you
get mad at you to or your uncle or your
cousin or even your mom, boy, your brother or sister.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Right. I like that. I like where you're going. I
ain't leaving them. They they they look, he didn't leave
for good.
Speaker 4 (15:20):
He left one over his auntiehouse, and then he came
back over here and back then uncle house.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
He came back. Okay, you Jimmy, you may Jimmy coming back.
Speaker 4 (15:29):
I didn say Jimmy came back. I was talking about
d Wade when we said that, when we were telling yo, okay,
what about Lebron, Lebron going back to Miami.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
No, I said family. But I'm saying the meal of
fact that family left. If I if I leave a house,
yeah I might when I'm on hard Tame.
Speaker 4 (15:46):
D Wade was a different type of family. Like d
Wade was drafted, home grown there, that's Dade County.
Speaker 1 (15:52):
And he left.
Speaker 4 (15:53):
You can't say the same for Lebron or Jimmy. So
it wasn't that same type of thing you He left
and came back, and they both admitted that it was
some wrongdoings and reasons why they left, and they came
together and pieced up and it's all love.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
Yeah, this is this?
Speaker 2 (16:11):
Ain't us all love? But I see d Wade as
part owner in the Utah Jazz. He's sitting courtse out
of the Utah Jazz. Why is it he sitting courtside
at Miami? It's family not Timeout. Turning out, d Wade
do be sitting courtses oude in Miami. He got a
statue in Miami and Hill. He's a boss, hear you,
and deserved show a smart businessman who deserve it and
(16:31):
deservedly so. But we can't we can't pretend like people
do not aren't fed up with pat Riley and those
arcad waves. Q.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
That's that's not being true.
Speaker 4 (16:41):
You hear it, But it worked. It can't it go
two ways though? You gotta understand it. Some of those
same ways that people being critical of are the reasons
for some of the most brilliant careers that you talk about.
Best version of Lebron James that you know was right
there under those arch Tell me I'm wrong.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
I still like Lebron when he went back to Cleveland.
Speaker 4 (17:03):
No, you asked anybody in the league that Lebron jack
two years back to back. Please please? That was that
was hell on wheels. Boy, you hear me like, please,
you're talking about it. Let's say that both.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Sides okay, that he had his best years and then
what made Lebron leave.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
On the twenty seven game winning street What happened to you?
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
I didn't heard you know what happened, Wade said.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
I heard about cookies being taken away. I don't heard
about all type of stuff.
Speaker 4 (17:44):
But I also heard that some of the same things
that he ran from that he tried to take with
him and bring in bestow on these other organizations when
he went there.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
So it wasn't all bad. You already listen.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
You already know Rich is gonna be there every day
maverage my chief of staff or not?
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Man, excuse me? What's the other one? That Randy? Randy's
gonna be there.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
Have you ever seen Lebron James anywhere without Randy? I
have not, whether it's out in Vegas, whether whatever the
case may be, Randy is gonna be there.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
You passion and let him be there. Oh, he gonna
be there. You won't it.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
He gonna be there. You don't won't him. But you know,
hell on, you already know what you when you sign up.
If you get, if you get Yannis, what you see
what the Yanni's brother is?
Speaker 1 (18:35):
Where you at a time out? Time out?
Speaker 4 (18:37):
Though you just said you already know what you get
when you signed up, right, so you you can't say
that and then say that Lebron came to Miami as
a free agent knowing knowing that the Godfather was the Godfather,
and the Godfather do what the Godfather does that he
always has.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
You signed up for.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
That I did, but not for the be petty and
take some damn cookies away.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I ain't.
Speaker 4 (19:04):
Listen.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
It could have been the head bend, It could have
been anything, but the.
Speaker 4 (19:10):
Cookies is what set it up. But like, this is
what you signed up for when you signed up. I
ain't signed up for this. I signed him to come
down here to get structured. I wanted to play with
d Wade, Chris Bosh and okay, got you two championships
and it showed you how to go on the rest
of the way and be a champion.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
Yeah, we talked.
Speaker 3 (19:29):
We talked about the heat of the old Let's talk
about the new heat. Let's talk about the new heat.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
It doesn't matter, it's still Pat running it. I'm about
to get somebody. Oh yeah, I'm to tell you what
already already know.
Speaker 4 (19:45):
That's what you, that's what you, That's that's what people
always understood and knew. Pat Riley, the Godfather is always
won't move away, how ken And then they win a
championship like he always willing to swing for the de
fences and do what needs to be done.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
But you don't have the draft capital to do it.
What are you gonna do? I think about it. He
couldn't get Kevin Durant, he couldn't get Dame Lillard. So
in order to get with let's just say, for the
sake of argument, Kevin Durant. What do you think if
it's gonna take for him to get Kevin Durant, he
gonna have to give up the hero and bam? Then
what who could he get? Johnnyson?
Speaker 1 (20:20):
I don't think so.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
I told you, I told you who we're going to get.
I told you already told you already, I told I
think a Q. I sat down with Pat pat Riley
and Micky Errison. I then told Robert Horriy I have
told the ice old Joe. I have told Joe already
and I'm telling you. I'm telling you too. I talked
to Pat, I sat down with Micky Errison, and we're
gonna get Joannis, We're gonna get John Moron.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
I'm trying to figure out what are you? But see,
Harryt the thing listen only they're only a.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
Handful of team that have the pieces that they want
assets because they gave up all those assets to get
said players. Q. You know how this thing worked a
lot of time, Like, man, I want to go over there,
and when you get there, they had to they had
to gut it to get you. And so now you
they're in the same situation where you left from. They're
not gonna be able to I don't see how they
(21:06):
get to Kevin Durant in Miami and keep Bam and
Tyler Hero. Oh you're talking about I want Duncan Robinson
and Hotsmill.
Speaker 4 (21:15):
And you'd be surprised what what these deals shake out.
Once these players step out and say that they want.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
To be moved.
Speaker 4 (21:21):
We've seen like guys ain't been like been yielding what
you thought, like when you look at what Rudy Gobert
got in his trade and then the trade he got
four first rounders. Yeah he went what went? What started
happening after he did that? Nobody was getting all of
them first rounders and it was looking how like, how
did Rudy get? You get Rudy fall of this? And
(21:41):
you get such and such fall of that that it
wasn't going the same way. They're not giving as much up,
especially when these teams, like when you get putting that pigeonhole,
like a player come out and say, hey, I want out.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
Want out, Like you done, You're done. They like, we
ain't gotta we ain't gotta be at your back.
Speaker 4 (21:59):
And cup because we're basically helping you at this point
because your dude just said he won't out. So no
matter what happens, you gotta get out or you got
you your situation is blown up. So at that point,
all if they exhausted to a certain point, it'll get bad.
Speaker 6 (22:17):
See I told you all.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
But here's the thing. Why didn't get that bad? Why
didn't get that bad? They could make pull the trigger
for Dame Lillard.
Speaker 4 (22:25):
That question, I mean, I don't know the answer to that.
I thought that I thought that was a done deal
like everybody else, they.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
Didn't want to give up Tyler Hero. I don't.
Speaker 2 (22:32):
I don't see it was a scenario where a team
doesn't get Tyler Hero back as a piece.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
Do you see that scenario?
Speaker 4 (22:42):
You never know, man, You know I didn't see it.
I didn't see. I didn't see a scenario on the
planet where Dallas was trading Luca.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
But look what happened.
Speaker 4 (22:50):
Yeah, so I didn't learn my lesson, like I didn't
see in Shaq get traded.
Speaker 1 (22:55):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (22:55):
MJ left the boys like anything happened in the right
circumstances that do whatever they feel is the best. That's
just how I go. And then they gonna tell you
that's good business. You know what I'm saying. This was
best for the organization. That's why I don't be mad
when players go do what they gotta do.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
I don't see it.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
People been talk been pat Riley supposed had done, had
Kevin Durant when Kevin Durant was a free agent, When
Kevin Durand got traded, when Kevin Durant was a free agent,
and god to state, he didn't go he didn't. Well,
Lebron that was there, so he couldn't go there Okay,
when he became when he goes to the Knicks, I
mean the Nets. Then what no pat Riley, he gets
traded in Phoenix. Still no Miami heat. I mean at
(23:39):
some point time, won't you You didn't give up? Oh,
Joe d Wade says, the first moment he thought Lebron
might leave Miami is when pat Riley.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
Took his cookies. Let's take a listen to what d
Wade had to say.
Speaker 7 (23:53):
That was funny that this was the first moment where
I had an inklean that Lebron may not be back.
One thing you don't do is with Lebron cookies.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
No, no, no, no.
Speaker 7 (24:05):
He was serious, like he loves chocolate chip cookies, like
chocolate chip cookies and ice cream.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
He loves right.
Speaker 7 (24:12):
And so when he gets on the plane, Bron walks
on the plane with a bag of food. One bag
is all cookies and the other bags are what his
chef has prepared for him to eat because he eats
a certain way.
Speaker 1 (24:21):
He don't eat what's on the plane. Yeah, but you know,
he have his cookie.
Speaker 7 (24:24):
So we get on the we get on the We
get on the plane and we play cards at the
front of the plane.
Speaker 1 (24:30):
We play cars.
Speaker 7 (24:31):
And then at some point bron gonna be like, hey,
bring me those cookies. And this one day he was like, hey,
well my cookies at and they had to come up
there and whispering is in and tell them that when
no more cookies on the plane. Yeah, that set back
away from the game. He pushed that table that cars back.
He sat there quiet, doing his head like this. I
was looking at him like.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
He played cards. No more. He's sat there like this, Hey.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
You see you see what that see? Then that cost
pat Riley. See pat Riley's trying to try to show
I run the show. Not looking at.
Speaker 7 (25:09):
That's too much.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
You're doing too much. You don't you mean to tell
you mean to tell me. You trying to prove a point?
So you take the man cookies.
Speaker 3 (25:21):
Hey, you never bother person's Never bother person's flow, all
of them in which way they travel, a routine in
which they like to eat, in which they like to prepare.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
You never do that.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
That has nothing to do with the game of basketball.
I understand trying to set a precedent. I understand control,
you know, but over abusing your power. Come on, now
that you took the man cook it, so hey, I
have a question. Do you think there's a chance you
think that might have been the last strong.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Yes, because there Look, there are some things that Lebron wanted,
like like uh uh Maverick and Randy potentially traveling on
the planes, having access like that he had in Cleveland,
so forth and so on. We know pat Riley limited
that if he didn't nix it all together. Okay, fine, probably,
(26:16):
but here's the thing. You knew that when he came
in there because Lebron team. Lebron's gonna lay out what
he expects. When he went to the Lakers, he told
Magic Randy blah blah blah blah blah blah blah, b
Bill plane gonna travel Da Rich father Da Da Da
Da Mariack Dad. Okay do you want I'm sure when
(26:38):
Tom Brady went to Tampa, I need my guy to
be here. I need him to have to be able
to set up so forth and so on. Okay, you
knew that. You knew that. You get the man there.
It's almost like a recruiting visit. Oh yeah, you're gonna start.
You're gonna start once I get your ass on Cambra.
You're don't sign that letter intent I do what the
hell I want to do?
Speaker 1 (26:59):
Now?
Speaker 2 (26:59):
You can't do that anymore? Could the guys jumping the
portal on your ass? Excuse me?
Speaker 1 (27:03):
Did jump into portolo? You tell O Joe and then
you you you in trouble. But I don't get this
pat Riley. I mean there are some things that he.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
Said about he was telling Phil Jackson and Phil Jackson.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
Uh, he got up like Lebron wanted to.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Stay and then like U for Thanksgiving blah blah blah,
and I just but I can I can see now,
I can see now to do that, that's petty, that's you.
That's you trying to show I run the show.
Speaker 3 (27:31):
Yeah, I mean see, And that's unnecessary because very think
about Lebron staying a few extra years in Miami. How
many more rings do they get?
Speaker 1 (27:41):
Mm hm.
Speaker 3 (27:43):
But you sacrifice that because you want to prove a
point in showing that you're in a position and you
want to over over abuse it. And even now the
stuff with Jimmy Butler. Yeah, I'm not saying Jimmy's right.
I'm not saying Patti's wrong because internally I'm not there.
But there's always an issue where there's a power struggle.
(28:04):
It shouldn't be a power struggle. If you want to
do one thing, everybody the main thing should be the
main thing. If you're part of the Miami Heat, pat
Riley's main goal should want to be winning championships and.
Speaker 1 (28:17):
To do so ojo.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
If cookies were the issue, do you know how many
cookies would be on that damn plane?
Speaker 1 (28:24):
Oh? I got you? Yeah? Do you know? Yeah? What? What?
Speaker 2 (28:29):
Where do you want the cookies from? Are these gourmet
cookies that we need to go to a special shop,
or these regular chips are hard or some type of
chocolate chip that we can.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Buy from a local grocery store.
Speaker 4 (28:41):
Right.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
I just need to know Lebron what it is, because
I promise you there is not a superstar player in
any sport. Let me ask you a question. If Chee
Wayne Tony shows up and says he wants something special,
they're going to have. If he says there's a Japanese
cuisine that I need to have before every game and
I need to make sure when we travel I have it,
(29:04):
I guarantee you they're gonna have it.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
Absolutely. If Patrick mahomes Joe Burrow or.
Speaker 2 (29:09):
If whatever superstar player, if Shape goes to ok see
I don't know what the delicacy is in Oklahoma though
I've only been there once. But I guarantee you if
Shane says I want this on the plane, We're gonna
have that. I mean, lil od me. I said, Mike,
we want to watch the fight. Mike would have it. Mike,
we won't need this on the plane. Mike would get it.
(29:31):
You mean to tell me you took Lebron James cookies
for what?
Speaker 1 (29:38):
Right?
Speaker 2 (29:38):
If the man's if the man, if Lebron's overweight, I see, Hey, bro,
you need to cut back on these. When is Lebron
James not been in shape? We marvel at his body
and you're twenty two. We've done that since he was
gotten to the league as an eighteen year old rookie.
Speaker 1 (29:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
Yeah, there's not a time that Lebron has not been
in shape. Like you said, this was a power trip. Yeah,
you won the.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
Battle, you lost the war. Pat That's unfortunate.
Speaker 6 (30:09):
That's unfortunate.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
Now we don't even have a chance to come out
to East.
Speaker 6 (30:13):
I think we matter of fact, we're still coming out
to the East.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Go ahead, you know you're not. Y'all can't beat Boston,
y'all can't beat Cleveland, y'all what we can't what beat Boston,
Cleveland or the Knicks? Not in a seven game series.
Y'all might win a game, but y'all winning seven games,
y'all win four games.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
I know. I just I just want to get excited.
I just want to get excited. We need we need
two more pieces.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
And you how d Wade explains it. D Wade said
he knew he was upset. Say that man pushed back
from the table and he didn't play cards.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
No mo.
Speaker 6 (30:49):
Yeah, yeah, that's messing.
Speaker 1 (30:52):
Don't mess up a routine.
Speaker 3 (30:53):
Don't mess up a routine that I'm probably thinking about
how long he Lebron been doing that routine of having
those He's on that flight?
Speaker 1 (31:01):
Yes, shit, man, man, let me get up out of here.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
And I mean, I've heard this is d Wade is
not the first person that I've heard Lebron crazy about
chocolate chip cookies, right, And to do that, I thought
that was petty.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
I think it was unnecessary.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
But I think it was pat Riley trying to prove
a point that I run this show and if I
don't want no cookies on this plane, it ain't gonna
be no Dad damn cookies on this plane, and Lebron says,
you know what, You're right, this is your ish.
Speaker 6 (31:32):
Yeah, I take my show on.
Speaker 1 (31:33):
The road, and he did exactly that.
Speaker 2 (31:36):
Shams is predicting that Lebron Lebron's next season the NBA
will be his last, which would be a poetic end
to number twenty three. You're twenty three for number twenty three.
They have the All Star weekend in Los Angeles. So
to me, it's a very storybook if that's the way
it goes. But that's a decision he's got to make.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Real.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
You just watched the man in your twenty twos make
second team All the NBA. If he the mad first team,
I don't think anybody's mad. If you put him in
over Donovan Mitchell, Donovan got in blessed. He averaged twenty four,
eight and eight. He doesn't really have to do the
heavy lifting anymore because of Luca, So he's He and
ar are still there. So now you put him in
(32:17):
the dunker spot, you let him play off the ball,
He's still gonna be in the twenty points. How long
do you think Lebron wants to play? How long is
he going to play.
Speaker 8 (32:29):
I'm always saying he was gonna play ti Bryce Gott
No leaders. So where Bright goes to Arizona next year.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
That'll be your twenty three. So in order for him
to play with Bryce, he's got to be twenty four.
Speaker 8 (32:39):
So I'll give him twenty four twenty five.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Yeah, and if you get twenty four, you got him.
It's like, I ain't worried about nobody getting twenty five years.
Speaker 8 (32:49):
And then if you get the twenty five, we'll get thirty.
Speaker 1 (32:51):
If nobody can hold up, you might keep.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
Because twenty three that will be forty one. Twenty four
that'll be forty two. Twenty five that will be forty three.
That's the same as Tom Brady was when he retired
twenty you.
Speaker 8 (33:07):
Know, twenty five years and one profession.
Speaker 1 (33:10):
That's that's that's legit. That's a low man.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
You're a dark or lawyer, you get that many time,
or you're the day of military exactly.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
So you know, is not only not only to play
that long, but to.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Be dominant that long, to play at that level you.
Speaker 6 (33:26):
Be consistent, it would be one of the best.
Speaker 2 (33:30):
The average twenty four points a game in year twenty two.
There are some guys that didn't average twenty four points
for a career. There are some guys that didn't. Didn't
I mean never had a season in which the average
twenty four. This guy's in year twenty two doing that
right when you look real, when you when you look
at it, look been around the game. Your dad coached
the game. So you've been around basketball all your life.
(33:53):
What do you think is the most impressive thing that
you that what Lebron is doing? Is it the year
twenty two? Is it the ability to go out there
and still give you average twenty four, to go out
there and give you a game where he can give
you thirty average, you know for a week, give you
thirty straight, go get you forty? What do you think
is the most impressive thing at this juncture? We look
(34:17):
all all the twenty one time first Team All NBA
twenty one times all start with So we get all that,
but I'm talking about what you're witnessing now. What do
you think the most impressive thing that you see him?
And you you was with him for four years. You
watched him every single day, come in, get shots up,
run cold tub massage, thing, you saw it all real.
What do you think the most impressive thing that Lebron
(34:38):
is doing currently.
Speaker 8 (34:39):
I always said that the way he take care of
his body, way he pay attention to his treatment and
stay on schedule with that, that that attests to his
longevity and never really been heard or having a major injury.
So just the way his body is held up, like
his skill set is gonna be a skill set.
Speaker 1 (34:55):
He puts the work in.
Speaker 8 (34:56):
You see him putting the work in after games or
after practice. He's always a last one shooting or someone
getting up shots or working on different moves. So the
way what he puts into the game is when he
gets out, and also what he puts into his body
is what he's getting out of his body. So to me,
it's just the longevity of you know, being that consensitive,
no injuries, no major injuries, bouncing back and still being
(35:18):
healthy enough to do what you do and and do
every day.
Speaker 2 (35:24):
You was with him, Lebron got there, so you was
there use with him eleven, twelve, thirteen, fourteen. Did you
have when you was there with him, did you have
any idea that Lebron James would still be playing twelve
years later?
Speaker 8 (35:42):
No, Lie, I did, just because like I tell people
this all the time, bron would really get treatment if
he was in the club, Like he would literally have
something on his knees or something on his back inside
the club.
Speaker 1 (35:52):
So it's like when.
Speaker 8 (35:54):
Somebody's doing that, like that's real dedication to just be
in the club with treatment I or whatever, like the
stem machine where it's like shooting electric or electric electricity
on your knees and stuff like that, just hamstrings, like
lower back. He always got something that's recovery, making his
(36:16):
body recover. So that's the thing is like once you
see that, like that's a different type of dedication, Like
I'm not I have to take my hat off to
that one.
Speaker 2 (36:24):
Johannis has now more first team All NBA selections than
Kevin Durant. Johannis has seven, KD has six. What more
does Yoannis need to do to pass KD all time.
Speaker 1 (36:37):
I don't think it's possible.
Speaker 8 (36:40):
Really, I don't think it's possible, just because I look
at Katie's skill set and like there's nobody gonna be
a skill set as KDS where ball handling, be able
to shoot the ball better get to the spots he's
gonna get to. I don't think there's gonna be another
Greek freak either, But yeah, us in an offensive game,
(37:01):
it's not polishing us like kd's for him to be.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Better than KD. So you just look at aesthetically. I'm
just looking at that.
Speaker 8 (37:08):
When I look at somebody, I say, who's better than
somebody I look at. I put him in a one
on one matchup and see who would dominate that one
on one match up to the game to five, I
think KD would get Jannis five four or five three.
Speaker 1 (37:19):
Maybe I just got him figured just obfously better. Wow,
what happened if Janna gets the ball first? Same thing?
Speaker 8 (37:27):
I think KT still figured out? How way I think
KD gets to stop before? What on what? Giannis is
all downhill? Now we're playing three or four exactly, playing
three or four dribbles downhill?
Speaker 1 (37:40):
Oh you know what I'm saying, you go, you got
to table to rule players play.
Speaker 8 (37:45):
We played one on one three or four dribbles max.
So in that type of sety, I'm not taking Giannis
over KD. I'm not taking too many people over KD
in that type of setting.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
Okay, Joanna's hands five first team All Defensive for first team,
KT has none, KD has does have two finals MVP.
Speaker 1 (38:08):
Janni's has one.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
It's huh no, Johnny's has two regular season m vps.
Speaker 1 (38:17):
KD has one. That's gonna be very that's gonna be
very interesting.
Speaker 8 (38:22):
That's gonna be interesting when their career, he's gonna have
a head of a career like that's that's the thing.
Speaker 1 (38:27):
But it's still you're not better than Katie.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
I think I think, you know what, I think a
lot of that has to do with aesthetically, because we
like guys that can handle the ball, uh shoot flashy.
I mean, there's nothing like really Johnny's game is really
like old school, like you said, you know, just trying
to get down he'll post. I mean he's still I mean,
you know, three point doesn't shoot that well. He ain't
(38:51):
really got no miny Rangers post. It's not great. He's
basically getting downhill, laying the ball up, you filing, or
he's spinning dumped them.
Speaker 1 (39:00):
That's yo, honest.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
It's still hard to stop because he's averaging thirty sixty
percent from the damn floor. So it's still hard to say.
It's just not as it's.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
Just not as pleasing to the eye, is what we
watch KD.
Speaker 6 (39:14):
Do and You're comparing two different players and two different
skill sets all together, and at that point, regardless of
accolades and what they accomplished on their resume, it depends
on It's all on preference at that point.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
Yeah, I see that. I see that.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
It's uh, it's but whose impact, Who's impacted the game more?
Speaker 6 (39:42):
Oh? Ship, that's damn did the same Almost.
Speaker 1 (39:45):
Huh. That's a tough one right there, because let me
ask you this.
Speaker 2 (39:52):
If I take if I take KD out and put
Giannis in there with Clay Stephen Draymonds, do you still
believe they were the NBA Championships.
Speaker 9 (40:10):
Yeah, yeah, I'll think about the score of the aspect,
but yeah, I still get to him because then that
way you take and your dollar doesn't have to guard
Brown by himself.
Speaker 8 (40:20):
Now you got two or three bodies that can guard Brown,
and that's gonna be a little bit different.
Speaker 1 (40:24):
So yeah, I still give it to go to state.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
Now, if I take KD and I put him on
Milwaukee the year they wanted the weird, they wanted to
beat Phoenix, you think they still win the championship with
k D and Joannis out.
Speaker 8 (40:38):
I mean, they barely got past Brooklyn. So Oh yeah,
I think so. I definitely think so, KD. If he
didn't step on that line, Milwaukee don't win that championship.
Speaker 2 (40:53):
That's that's gonna be when it's all said done, That's
gonna be a very interesting conversation. That's gonna be a
very very intr resting conversation I have because they are
so diametrically different hing nothing about one's game reminds you
of the other.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
One is.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
As you said, Rio is one of the most skilled players,
one of the five most skilled players that we've probably
ever seen with this size, being seven foot.
Speaker 1 (41:19):
Tall, being able to handle the ball. He can shoot
the three, he can.
Speaker 2 (41:23):
Got, he got the mini, he got the heavy h
he can fit get to the rim, he can fit
free throws. He's an eighty eight eighty nine percent free throw.
So he's he's as good as skilled. Because guys that side,
they normally play center. They played with him back to
the basket. We ain't see no guys. You and Dirk
could shoot the ball. Dirk was not putting it on
(41:44):
the ball, going between his legs, going between hind his back,
doing what Kd's He just wasn't doing it. I mean,
Dirk had that. Dirk padded that that one leg step back.
Speaker 1 (41:57):
He's shooting it. It's gonna draw rain and skill.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
I don't know if you're ever gonna see a guy
at his size and skilled a kd his ability because
it's just for his ability to shoot the Lebron's responds
to the no bad comments and mind the Game podcast
and shuts up haters. He said, I see it all
the time. I be on social media and be like,
Lebron has no bag. Lebron has no bag. I'm sitting
(42:24):
here with fifty billion points.
Speaker 1 (42:26):
That's it, that's safe. But what else you're gonna say
about that?
Speaker 2 (42:31):
I mean, all these people that got bagged, let me
ask you a question. Of all the people that got bags,
how many of them are gonna have more points than Lebron?
Speaker 1 (42:38):
Nobody? Nobody, nobody. So I'm talking about whoever got the bag, whoever.
Speaker 2 (42:43):
We think has a bag, Kyrie James Harden, Steph Curry,
who else we think got bags?
Speaker 1 (42:50):
Who gonna have that many points? Nobody?
Speaker 4 (42:54):
Hey, listen, I don't think I don't think Michael Jordan
had a bag like that. When you're talking about had
no dolledge, just yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
He wasn't the head of that thing like Kyrie and
Steph Curry.
Speaker 4 (43:05):
Now, but he was he was efficient and getting to
his spots and when he when he raised up the shoot,
it wasn't nothing you can do.
Speaker 1 (43:11):
You just had to hope he missed.
Speaker 5 (43:12):
Yep, but this isn't in that And I'm a I
am a Jordan fan, right, so you know I respect
the greatness of Lebron and the greatness of Kobe, right, Like,
why is it in basketball we gotta tear down one
to to love the other.
Speaker 7 (43:30):
Much?
Speaker 1 (43:30):
That's what That's what debate television has done. Jail, you pick,
when you pick.
Speaker 2 (43:34):
One, you gotta ho I gotta I gotta accentuate my
guy all the while addressing the flaws of your guy,
and in the flaw and addressing the flaw. It looks
like I'm hating, but I'm just pointing out weaknesses in
his game while accentuating the highs of my guy's game.
Speaker 1 (43:52):
Right, But oo is it happening that win in football?
From a quarterback.
Speaker 2 (43:56):
Perspective, Yeah, yes, we like Brady Mahomes. We had Peyton Manning.
Yeah you do you do? That was debate because you
gotta pick a side. The days of like straddling the fifth.
You used to be well, I like them both.
Speaker 1 (44:14):
Now you can't.
Speaker 2 (44:15):
You can't be on TV, you can't be on radio,
you can't be on podcasts because people go to, well, hell,
I could have said.
Speaker 10 (44:22):
That, right, right, yeah, But and I'm not saying nom
damn reels of Peyton and Brady versus Brady or whoever
else the way that you see it on Bron, Like
I see it's like this.
Speaker 5 (44:33):
It's like what Jordan did this this or Lebron didn't
do this as a or vice versa. Right, It's like
on social media, I'm like, why is it? Why is
that such a divide?
Speaker 2 (44:42):
It didn't used to be like that until debate television
came along, Jail, because there was never a situation where
we were debating Bird and Magic like that. We didn't
didn't do it like it is. But here's the thing.
Prior to this, nobody had ever had what Lebron had.
The points, the reb the assists, the All nbas, the
All Stars, the MVPs, the Finals MVPs. So nobody who
(45:06):
was really even close to really have a comparison because
nobody had been a four time Finals MVP.
Speaker 1 (45:13):
One got that.
Speaker 2 (45:14):
Nobody had that many MVP's, so when you started and
see Biggs, we completely removed bigs from the equation. Kareem
got six for MVP's. Ain't didn't nobody talking about Kareem.
Russell got five, Chamberlain got four. But don't nobody talk
about the bigs because man, somebody got to getting them
the ball. The other guys that we talked about, they
could take the ball and do what they need to
do themselves.
Speaker 1 (45:35):
So it's that's where we are now.
Speaker 2 (45:38):
It's only in sports where you could have a comparable
comparison because you don't see it in baseball. Ain't nobody
being compared to Barry Bonds, Nobody being compared to Walter
Johnson or Greg Maddix, all these great It's just and
for whatever reason, it's basketball and football.
Speaker 1 (46:00):
Damn boil Lebron James, he Lebron James. He how many
we get?
Speaker 2 (46:06):
How many more? How many more years you play jail?
You're give him one year, two year, three years? I
think you've done after this year. You think you've done
after you okay, twenty three. You know Brice Brice could
be eligible to come to the NBA. H you know,
(46:29):
if he do that I'm a golden right. If he
can get if you can get both his kids in
there at first.
Speaker 5 (46:35):
Of all, that'd be amazing to you know, to be honest,
but to just see that man play with his son
and have that level of longevity, that consistency, you know,
to keep itself together and still play at the highest
of levels. Yeah, you're not gonna see that again. And
you ain't gonna never see that again. That's his story history.
Speaker 4 (46:55):
You know what you think about you think about today's player,
today's game, Uh, the type of money they making, like
the the the grind that you got to put into that.
I mean, to have that type of longevity, I can't
see it happening again. Guys they record whenever he's done.
However many points he put up, man, it ain't gonna
(47:17):
ain't nobody catching it.
Speaker 2 (47:18):
I don't see these because I don't know if anybody.
Because he's been the one guy that's been able to
play and avoid the big injury. Yeah, everybody's had a knee.
We see guys getting the ki leads and things like that,
jail Lebron James has been able to avoid that injury,
those type of injuries that sidelined him for fifty sixty
games or an entire season.
Speaker 1 (47:41):
Well, let's say to see y'all.
Speaker 5 (47:42):
Y'all notice, offhand we talk about the physical ability and
where to take to put that together, but we know
when we on the other side of the hell mentally
and emotionally, y'all, man, Yeah, you see it coming, you know,
talk yourself in it.
Speaker 2 (47:56):
You hurting body ache and needs hurt ankle bad? Yeah,
just that you and people want to go to the
bathroom jail. Your body hurt, the ankle, the knees hurt
so bad. Like I think I can. I think I
could wait. What time is it? Yeah, I got another
two hours in I could wait.
Speaker 1 (48:13):
I ain't walk barefooting in almost eighteen years, I put,
I don't walk barefoot in you. I hurt too bad?
Speaker 2 (48:22):
I got on hey, I got I walk around with crocs.
Speaker 1 (48:25):
Or sandles in my house. I can't put my hey.
I ate
Speaker 4 (48:38):
M hm
No, no, no, no, no, ain't no contention. You got to win
it with him.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Hold on, it can't be contention because he went to
the finals four years in Cleveland, he won one. Yeah,
he's only won one title in LA he's been here
five years. So we can't automatically assume because that's hypothetic.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
We can't. Let's deal with what we know, O Joe.
We've got to deal with what we know.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
And that's what I'm saying because now without those two
extra MVPs regular season, without those two extra finals MVPs, guess.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
Who else you bring into the equation? One?
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Stephan Curry? Because Steph has four yeah kIPS. Steph has
two MVPs and a final MVP. So now let's just say,
for the sake of argument, Lebron has two regular season MVPs,
two finals MVPs. Are we looking at Lebron the same way?
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Yeah we are. No, we're not. He's different. No, now
with Ojo different? So are you?
Speaker 3 (01:00):
His greatness? Solely on m vps and titles.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
But but that's how you get into the goat debate.
It's rings.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Remember rings, No, o Joe, what if we said you
and I both saying you can be great and not
have ring. Charles Barkley was a great player. Carl Malone
was a great player. John Stockton was a great player.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
We can't we can't put We can't put them on
the same stratosphere, on the same pedes as Lebron. But
if Charles, he's in the category of his own with
mild Bryant.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
But what does he have rings? Rings? O cha, I
understand what you're saying.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
But even still, just even even without the rings, dude, dude,
he's he's o joe.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
He would without the rings. He's not in the gold conversation.
Without the rings, he's not in the gold conversation. So
he's out of it. He's out of it. It's not
even a debate. See for me, I don't put anybody.
I don't put. If you look at my top five,
my top five, you have to have at least three
regular season MVPs. That's how I took it three.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
So let me ask you a question.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Yes, he had the scoring title, Yes, but he wasn't
able to win any rings of championships.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
He couldn't be considered. He wasn't.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
He wouldn't even they would know. We don't have any
rings he wouldn't even be in the conversation. How so
how would you put in with no rings? Hold on, oo,
think about this?
Speaker 1 (02:32):
Is it different for football?
Speaker 4 (02:33):
Then?
Speaker 3 (02:34):
No players that are great that have never won a ring?
Does that mean they're not great? They're not in the conversation.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Because as a thing, when you look at quarterbacks, name
a quarterback is Brady Montana.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
It's a manny. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Now when we see and this is what we talk about,
the levels, This is what we're talking about goals, because
you can be great and not and not have rings. You, Kenyon,
I believe that. I believe you can be great and
not have ring. Charles Barkley was a great player. Okay,
Look at how we look at Kevin Durant, look at
(03:13):
Scott excuse me now, I take that back.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
I'm talking about Kevin.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Look at how we looked at Kevin Garnett before and
then after he got that ring.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
You see the difference. Look at how we look a
look at how we look a look.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
At how we looked at Dirt Nubisky before and after
he got the ring. So my argument is, how would
we be able to say lebron is a goat with
just two rings when Kobe has five, when Duncan has five,
when Kareem has five, when Jordan has six, when Magic
(03:50):
has five, and all the guys that I mentioned are Jordan,
Jordan has six, has five regular season MVPs, has three
regular season MVPs with three finals MVPs. So you're right,
But I don't believe without Miami, because here's the thing
we saw. I believe it. I think everybody out there believe.
(04:13):
Had Kevin Durant got not gotten hurt in twenty nineteen
Toronto not.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Beating them, No, absolutely not.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
But you see what can happen. You see what can happen.
One injury change the landscape. You see what happened with
Kevin Durant, with Lebron, Kyrie and Kevin Love got hurt,
changed the whole completion of the.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
Series, didn't it.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
Kevin Durant in Brooklyn, Kyrie gets hurt, James Harder dealing
with a hamstring. You see how things gotta beat. Now,
this is what we know. For Lebron, He's averaged twenty
five points. He's never scored less than twenty five points
in the season since his rookie year. He averages twenty seven,
seven and seven. I believe he goes anywhere else and
(04:55):
still averages twenty seven, seven and seven. But averaging twenty seven,
seven and seven ain't the same as what he did
in Miami. And when he got two more MVPs back
to back, two more finals MVPs back to back, it
changed the way we looked at him.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
But I still I'm telling you, I still think you
your your knowledge of the game of basketball is much
better than I am me as an.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
Outsider watching end.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
I think, regardless of what Lebron tweeted, minus less rings,
minus lest rings, my ass, I have a feeling that
he could have went to any team, any NBA team,
obviously with a supporting cast, an efficient supporting cast, and
done the exact same thing he did. In mind, I know,
I know he could have. I know he could have
because he's that special of a player. He's that special.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
How do we know, because remember, it takes more than
just scoring to win a title.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
A lot of the speaks for himself.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Oo, think about how close they came to losing the title.
They was a Ray Allen backpedal behind the three three,
the greatest shot in NBA history just to survive, right,
So for us to sit here and say, well, he
could have gone anywhere else and won anything. It's really
not that simple, Ohoe, not for a championship. Is it
(06:14):
that simple for him to go somewhere in average twenty seven,
seven and seven or the average thirty like he did
for the Lakers two years ago and like he averaged
twenty nine last year? Sure that he's lebron He the goal.
And I said, what made me put him there is
that when I factored in the regular season MBPS, I
factored in the finals MVPs at three different stops, now
(06:38):
Oho thirty thousand points, ten thousand rebounds, ten thousand assists.
You factor in all the first team All NBAS, you
factor in all the All Star appearances.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
You start factoring all of that.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
This is just not a longevity because there are a
lot of guys that played, not a lot of guys.
I think there are nine guys that played the total
of twenty years or more. But they averaging four points.
He ain't gonna average for He's gonna end up averaging
what is he I don't know if he averaged twenty seven,
but he'll probably be around twenty four to twenty five
points a game. And you're twenty one. Yeah, so it's
(07:13):
not in people. Look, I think the thing is O Joe.
I think what the reason, what what caught people so
far off guard is that this is a totally different
audience ESPN than when I was Undisputed, And if you
watch me on Undisputed, you know that I've criticized some
of the things Lebron has done, be it to play,
some of the things that he said. I think that
(07:35):
people have this perception that all I do is.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
Kate Kate, Kate, Kate, Kate for.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
Lebron, and that's not true. I don't believe any player,
I don't believe any person is beyond reproach. I don't
believe any player or any person is a beyond criticism
because you have being who you are, criticism comes along
with it. If you don't want the criticist, you should
(08:00):
not take the praise. Lebron is great. He's still in
my estimation to go. But I believe it took that
Miami stint to put him on the path. Now, going
back to Cleveland, going to four More, winning an MVP,
going to the Lakers winning another finals MVP, and he's
(08:21):
been dominant.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
He's been great. So they made it seem like I say.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Lebron was a bump man if he ain't go to
and it doesn't have to be mutually exclusive, Ojo, Miami benefited.
Lebron benefited a lot of times we just want to say, no,
you benefited. But I like to think in a relationship,
no matter if if it ended or not, we both
got something out of it.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
I like that. That's just me. Now. Sometimes we're like,
I ain't get nothing out of that. I ain't get nothing.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Okay, I took something maybe if it wasn't not, but
the damn good meal, I got something out of it.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
But that's a good one. Man, that's a good one.
Speaker 3 (09:02):
But I'm telling you, I whole heartly believe he could
have gone anywhere that was he came to the heat
what twenty was it twenty twelve.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Twenty eleven, twenty ten because they ended up losing.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Because think about it, O Joe, think about it now
for me, had he won twenty eleven against the Mavericks,
I don't even think it's I don't even think it's
a debate.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
I don't think it's a debate. A lot of people can't.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Put Lebron in front of Jordan for the simple fact
of twenty eleven. They said, I just can't do it
because I saw guys that were that Jordan would have
scored sixty on Joe. They're not putting JJ Burrew on
Michael Jordan. They're not putting Deshaun Stevenson on Michael Jordan.
And so a lot of people can't get over that
(09:44):
hurdle there, right, But I believe it took all of that.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
To get him to what we see now.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
The finished product that we see now happened because of
twenty eleven.
Speaker 3 (09:54):
Yeah, but the finished product would have been the same
regards to where he was at because of who he is.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
Because of who he is, the finished product.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
You can't tell me, well, if you didn't come to
the Miami Heat, the finished product of what we're what
we're witnessing now wouldn't be who he is.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
It was.
Speaker 4 (10:09):
No.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
But you're saying, but you're saying individually. See I'm not
talking about individually.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
And yes, I still believe as well.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
I'm talking from a team aspect and having MVPs and
championships if he went somewhere else.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
But here's the thing, they've done it.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
But think about Ojo Heath averaged probably looking at he
averaged thirty twenty nine, last year twenty eight, twenty nine,
last year thirty year before they win no titles.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
I have a question. I have a question.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
This is something I don't have in front of me.
He went to the Heat in twenty eleven, right, Yes,
I wish I had the rosses of the other team
to choose from that he could have gone to. And
I guarantee you could put at least five or six
other teams he could have gone to, and they would
have been in the finals with the opportunity to win
a championship, and he had an opportunity to get those
MVP finals. I guarantee you. I just don't have I
(10:57):
don't have the information in front of him right.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
Now, off the top of my head out the I
can remember. I know Miami was one. He ended up
going to Miami. I think the Knicks, but talking to
Rich Paul, Knicks were never really in play, and I
think Chicago.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
Oh yes, yes, and I'm not sure that. I'm not
sure the rosters. But yes, well you had at the time,
you had D Rose, you had Yo Kim Noah, you
have you d Roge Gibson. Yeah, yeah, because that year
he won the m v P. Oh Lebron oh Man,
So you mean to tell me, Jimmy Butler, oh championship championship,
(11:36):
m v P and a ring with the bulls that year? Yes,
come on, but there's no but about it. That's an
m v P championship.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
Trust me.
Speaker 3 (11:47):
And it's not even a hypothetical. I put I put
my life savers on that.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
If it was to happened. I wish, I wish we
could rewind time.
Speaker 3 (11:54):
We can't Prime d Roll, Jimmy Butler, Joe, Kim, Noah
and Lebron.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
You mean it to everything in that window Chip.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
We never know, have we seen, We've seen Ojo, We've
seen things happen just because you have the most talent.
You've seen teams. Look look at the Patriots. Patrick had
the most talent. You remember in two thousand and seven
and the little low Giants barely made the playoffs?
Speaker 1 (12:23):
Got him?
Speaker 2 (12:26):
I mean, who who would have thought the Dallas Mavericks
would have beat the Miami Heat Who would have thought
the Detroit.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
Pistons would have Tooken taken down Shaq and Kobe?
Speaker 5 (12:36):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (12:36):
Yeah, think about that now them boy? That would Ben
Wallace and the boys.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
Huh Ben, she ripped. They were playing some defense. Boy
see and that's and to see Ojo. That's what I say.
You don't know, right, Let's let's deal.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
The only thing I can say for certain looking at
Lebron james career is that penciling man for twenty seven,
seven and seven. Write it in the book, and I'm right,
and I'm right, and I'm writing it in non erasable inc.
You can't erase it. That's what I know. But championships
are a lot harder to come by. People keep talking
about Jordan with Jordan was six for six. Jordan played
(13:14):
fifteen years, so the other nine years he didn't get there, right,
You're right.
Speaker 3 (13:21):
Well, I have a question on the topic of basketball,
on something that I need to gain a little a
little bit more knowledge about.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
Okay, what do the Lakers need.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
Outside of Anthony Davis staying healthy? They need one more
one more star.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
They got to hit some I mean, it's the first
time I think in NBA history through the first eight
games they've made less field goals from the three and
shadow worst percentage in NBA history. They instituted they instituted
a three point line in nineteen seventy nine. That was
a year after you was born. That's when the three
(13:58):
point line Chris Ford made their first three point shot.
So think about that. Go back all the way back.
They've been outscored by seventy four points in the first quarter,
which is the most in NBA history through this amount
of games.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
Wait, score, I've scored by how much seventy four? Hey? Man,
we gotta go to a leak a game? Man? How
much course side seats?
Speaker 2 (14:27):
You ain't somebody always want to go to the You
want to go to the Miami Heat. I mean with
pat Riley with them nineteen with them nineteen fifty five rules.
Speaker 4 (14:36):
Hey, listen, it ain't it ain't. It ain't even bad
as you think it is. Man, people may listen when
you look at the look at the guys that go there,
they have some of their best years in their careers
when they go.
Speaker 1 (14:47):
And look at the guys leave.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
I saw Dwayne Wade leave, I saw Jimmy Butler leave,
I saw Lebron James leave. Now that's three of the
best players that you had in the last fifteen years.
Now tell me what I don't know, Q.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
What you do? Yeah, hold on, holdover let it fish up.
You can chime in after him.
Speaker 4 (15:03):
You we all got family, right, Yeah, sometimes sometimes you
get mad at you to or your uncle or your
cousin or even your mom, boy, your brother or sister.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Right. I like that. I like where you're going. I
ain't leaving them. They they they look, he didn't leave
for good.
Speaker 4 (15:20):
He left one over his auntiehouse, and then he came
back over here and back then uncle house.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
He came back. Okay, you Jimmy, you may Jimmy coming back.
Speaker 4 (15:29):
I didn say Jimmy came back. I was talking about
d Wade when we said that, when we were telling yo, okay,
what about Lebron, Lebron going back to Miami.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
No, I said family. But I'm saying the meal of
fact that family left. If I if I leave a house,
yeah I might when I'm on hard Tame.
Speaker 4 (15:46):
D Wade was a different type of family. Like d
Wade was drafted, home grown there, that's Dade County.
Speaker 1 (15:52):
And he left.
Speaker 4 (15:53):
You can't say the same for Lebron or Jimmy. So
it wasn't that same type of thing you He left
and came back, and they both admitted that it was
some wrongdoings and reasons why they left, and they came
together and pieced up and it's all love.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
Yeah, this is this?
Speaker 2 (16:11):
Ain't us all love? But I see d Wade as
part owner in the Utah Jazz. He's sitting courtse out
of the Utah Jazz. Why is it he sitting courtside
at Miami? It's family not Timeout. Turning out, d Wade
do be sitting courtses oude in Miami. He got a
statue in Miami and Hill. He's a boss, hear you,
and deserved show a smart businessman who deserve it and
(16:31):
deservedly so. But we can't we can't pretend like people
do not aren't fed up with pat Riley and those
arcad waves. Q.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
That's that's not being true.
Speaker 4 (16:41):
You hear it, But it worked. It can't it go
two ways though? You gotta understand it. Some of those
same ways that people being critical of are the reasons
for some of the most brilliant careers that you talk about.
Best version of Lebron James that you know was right
there under those arch Tell me I'm wrong.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
I still like Lebron when he went back to Cleveland.
Speaker 4 (17:03):
No, you asked anybody in the league that Lebron jack
two years back to back. Please please? That was that
was hell on wheels. Boy, you hear me like, please,
you're talking about it. Let's say that both.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Sides okay, that he had his best years and then
what made Lebron leave.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
On the twenty seven game winning street What happened to you?
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
I didn't heard you know what happened, Wade said.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
I heard about cookies being taken away. I don't heard
about all type of stuff.
Speaker 4 (17:44):
But I also heard that some of the same things
that he ran from that he tried to take with
him and bring in bestow on these other organizations when
he went there.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
So it wasn't all bad. You already listen.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
You already know Rich is gonna be there every day
maverage my chief of staff or not?
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Man, excuse me? What's the other one? That Randy? Randy's
gonna be there.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
Have you ever seen Lebron James anywhere without Randy? I
have not, whether it's out in Vegas, whether whatever the
case may be, Randy is gonna be there.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
You passion and let him be there. Oh, he gonna
be there. You won't it.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
He gonna be there. You don't won't him. But you know,
hell on, you already know what you when you sign up.
If you get, if you get Yannis, what you see
what the Yanni's brother is?
Speaker 1 (18:35):
Where you at a time out? Time out?
Speaker 4 (18:37):
Though you just said you already know what you get
when you signed up, right, so you you can't say
that and then say that Lebron came to Miami as
a free agent knowing knowing that the Godfather was the Godfather,
and the Godfather do what the Godfather does that he
always has.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
You signed up for.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
That I did, but not for the be petty and
take some damn cookies away.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I ain't.
Speaker 4 (19:04):
Listen.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
It could have been the head bend, It could have
been anything, but the.
Speaker 4 (19:10):
Cookies is what set it up. But like, this is
what you signed up for when you signed up. I
ain't signed up for this. I signed him to come
down here to get structured. I wanted to play with
d Wade, Chris Bosh and okay, got you two championships
and it showed you how to go on the rest
of the way and be a champion.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
Yeah, we talked.
Speaker 3 (19:29):
We talked about the heat of the old Let's talk
about the new heat. Let's talk about the new heat.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
It doesn't matter, it's still Pat running it. I'm about
to get somebody. Oh yeah, I'm to tell you what
already already know.
Speaker 4 (19:45):
That's what you, that's what you, That's that's what people
always understood and knew. Pat Riley, the Godfather is always
won't move away, how ken And then they win a
championship like he always willing to swing for the de
fences and do what needs to be done.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
But you don't have the draft capital to do it.
What are you gonna do? I think about it. He
couldn't get Kevin Durant, he couldn't get Dame Lillard. So
in order to get with let's just say, for the
sake of argument, Kevin Durant. What do you think if
it's gonna take for him to get Kevin Durant, he
gonna have to give up the hero and bam? Then
what who could he get? Johnnyson?
Speaker 1 (20:20):
I don't think so.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
I told you, I told you who we're going to get.
I told you already told you already, I told I
think a Q. I sat down with Pat pat Riley
and Micky Errison. I then told Robert Horriy I have
told the ice old Joe. I have told Joe already
and I'm telling you. I'm telling you too. I talked
to Pat, I sat down with Micky Errison, and we're
gonna get Joannis, We're gonna get John Moron.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
I'm trying to figure out what are you? But see,
Harryt the thing listen only they're only a.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
Handful of team that have the pieces that they want
assets because they gave up all those assets to get
said players. Q. You know how this thing worked a
lot of time, Like, man, I want to go over there,
and when you get there, they had to they had
to gut it to get you. And so now you
they're in the same situation where you left from. They're
not gonna be able to I don't see how they
(21:06):
get to Kevin Durant in Miami and keep Bam and
Tyler Hero. Oh you're talking about I want Duncan Robinson
and Hotsmill.
Speaker 4 (21:15):
And you'd be surprised what what these deals shake out.
Once these players step out and say that they want.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
To be moved.
Speaker 4 (21:21):
We've seen like guys ain't been like been yielding what
you thought, like when you look at what Rudy Gobert
got in his trade and then the trade he got
four first rounders. Yeah he went what went? What started
happening after he did that? Nobody was getting all of
them first rounders and it was looking how like, how
did Rudy get? You get Rudy fall of this? And
(21:41):
you get such and such fall of that that it
wasn't going the same way. They're not giving as much up,
especially when these teams, like when you get putting that pigeonhole,
like a player come out and say, hey, I want out.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
Want out, Like you done, You're done. They like, we
ain't gotta we ain't gotta be at your back.
Speaker 4 (21:59):
And cup because we're basically helping you at this point
because your dude just said he won't out. So no
matter what happens, you gotta get out or you got
you your situation is blown up. So at that point,
all if they exhausted to a certain point, it'll get bad.
Speaker 6 (22:17):
See I told you all.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
But here's the thing. Why didn't get that bad? Why
didn't get that bad? They could make pull the trigger
for Dame Lillard.
Speaker 4 (22:25):
That question, I mean, I don't know the answer to that.
I thought that I thought that was a done deal
like everybody else, they.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
Didn't want to give up Tyler Hero. I don't.
Speaker 2 (22:32):
I don't see it was a scenario where a team
doesn't get Tyler Hero back as a piece.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
Do you see that scenario?
Speaker 4 (22:42):
You never know, man, You know I didn't see it.
I didn't see. I didn't see a scenario on the
planet where Dallas was trading Luca.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
But look what happened.
Speaker 4 (22:50):
Yeah, so I didn't learn my lesson, like I didn't
see in Shaq get traded.
Speaker 1 (22:55):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (22:55):
MJ left the boys like anything happened in the right
circumstances that do whatever they feel is the best. That's
just how I go. And then they gonna tell you
that's good business. You know what I'm saying. This was
best for the organization. That's why I don't be mad
when players go do what they gotta do.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
I don't see it.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
People been talk been pat Riley supposed had done, had
Kevin Durant when Kevin Durant was a free agent, When
Kevin Durand got traded, when Kevin Durant was a free agent,
and god to state, he didn't go he didn't. Well,
Lebron that was there, so he couldn't go there Okay,
when he became when he goes to the Knicks, I
mean the Nets. Then what no pat Riley, he gets
traded in Phoenix. Still no Miami heat. I mean at
(23:39):
some point time, won't you You didn't give up? Oh,
Joe d Wade says, the first moment he thought Lebron
might leave Miami is when pat Riley.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
Took his cookies. Let's take a listen to what d
Wade had to say.
Speaker 7 (23:53):
That was funny that this was the first moment where
I had an inklean that Lebron may not be back.
One thing you don't do is with Lebron cookies.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
No, no, no, no.
Speaker 7 (24:05):
He was serious, like he loves chocolate chip cookies, like
chocolate chip cookies and ice cream.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
He loves right.
Speaker 7 (24:12):
And so when he gets on the plane, Bron walks
on the plane with a bag of food. One bag
is all cookies and the other bags are what his
chef has prepared for him to eat because he eats
a certain way.
Speaker 1 (24:21):
He don't eat what's on the plane. Yeah, but you know,
he have his cookie.
Speaker 7 (24:24):
So we get on the we get on the We
get on the plane and we play cards at the
front of the plane.
Speaker 1 (24:30):
We play cars.
Speaker 7 (24:31):
And then at some point bron gonna be like, hey,
bring me those cookies. And this one day he was like, hey,
well my cookies at and they had to come up
there and whispering is in and tell them that when
no more cookies on the plane. Yeah, that set back
away from the game. He pushed that table that cars back.
He sat there quiet, doing his head like this. I
was looking at him like.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
He played cards. No more. He's sat there like this, Hey.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
You see you see what that see? Then that cost
pat Riley. See pat Riley's trying to try to show
I run the show. Not looking at.
Speaker 7 (25:09):
That's too much.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
You're doing too much. You don't you mean to tell
you mean to tell me. You trying to prove a point?
So you take the man cookies.
Speaker 3 (25:21):
Hey, you never bother person's Never bother person's flow, all
of them in which way they travel, a routine in
which they like to eat, in which they like to prepare.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
You never do that.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
That has nothing to do with the game of basketball.
I understand trying to set a precedent. I understand control,
you know, but over abusing your power. Come on, now
that you took the man cook it, so hey, I
have a question. Do you think there's a chance you
think that might have been the last strong.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Yes, because there Look, there are some things that Lebron wanted,
like like uh uh Maverick and Randy potentially traveling on
the planes, having access like that he had in Cleveland,
so forth and so on. We know pat Riley limited
that if he didn't nix it all together. Okay, fine, probably,
(26:16):
but here's the thing. You knew that when he came
in there because Lebron team. Lebron's gonna lay out what
he expects. When he went to the Lakers, he told
Magic Randy blah blah blah blah blah blah blah, b
Bill plane gonna travel Da Rich father Da Da Da
Da Mariack Dad. Okay do you want I'm sure when
(26:38):
Tom Brady went to Tampa, I need my guy to
be here. I need him to have to be able
to set up so forth and so on. Okay, you
knew that. You knew that. You get the man there.
It's almost like a recruiting visit. Oh yeah, you're gonna start.
You're gonna start once I get your ass on Cambra.
You're don't sign that letter intent I do what the
hell I want to do?
Speaker 1 (26:59):
Now?
Speaker 2 (26:59):
You can't do that anymore? Could the guys jumping the
portal on your ass? Excuse me?
Speaker 1 (27:03):
Did jump into portolo? You tell O Joe and then
you you you in trouble. But I don't get this
pat Riley. I mean there are some things that he.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
Said about he was telling Phil Jackson and Phil Jackson.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
Uh, he got up like Lebron wanted to.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Stay and then like U for Thanksgiving blah blah blah,
and I just but I can I can see now,
I can see now to do that, that's petty, that's you.
That's you trying to show I run the show.
Speaker 3 (27:31):
Yeah, I mean see, And that's unnecessary because very think
about Lebron staying a few extra years in Miami. How
many more rings do they get?
Speaker 1 (27:41):
Mm hm.
Speaker 3 (27:43):
But you sacrifice that because you want to prove a
point in showing that you're in a position and you
want to over over abuse it. And even now the
stuff with Jimmy Butler. Yeah, I'm not saying Jimmy's right.
I'm not saying Patti's wrong because internally I'm not there.
But there's always an issue where there's a power struggle.
(28:04):
It shouldn't be a power struggle. If you want to
do one thing, everybody the main thing should be the
main thing. If you're part of the Miami Heat, pat
Riley's main goal should want to be winning championships and.
Speaker 1 (28:17):
To do so ojo.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
If cookies were the issue, do you know how many
cookies would be on that damn plane?
Speaker 1 (28:24):
Oh? I got you? Yeah? Do you know? Yeah? What? What?
Speaker 2 (28:29):
Where do you want the cookies from? Are these gourmet
cookies that we need to go to a special shop,
or these regular chips are hard or some type of
chocolate chip that we can.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Buy from a local grocery store.
Speaker 4 (28:41):
Right.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
I just need to know Lebron what it is, because
I promise you there is not a superstar player in
any sport. Let me ask you a question. If Chee
Wayne Tony shows up and says he wants something special,
they're going to have. If he says there's a Japanese
cuisine that I need to have before every game and
I need to make sure when we travel I have it,
(29:04):
I guarantee you they're gonna have it.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
Absolutely. If Patrick mahomes Joe Burrow or.
Speaker 2 (29:09):
If whatever superstar player, if Shape goes to ok see
I don't know what the delicacy is in Oklahoma though
I've only been there once. But I guarantee you if
Shane says I want this on the plane, We're gonna
have that. I mean, lil od me. I said, Mike,
we want to watch the fight. Mike would have it. Mike,
we won't need this on the plane. Mike would get it.
(29:31):
You mean to tell me you took Lebron James cookies
for what?
Speaker 1 (29:38):
Right?
Speaker 2 (29:38):
If the man's if the man, if Lebron's overweight, I see, Hey, bro,
you need to cut back on these. When is Lebron
James not been in shape? We marvel at his body
and you're twenty two. We've done that since he was
gotten to the league as an eighteen year old rookie.
Speaker 1 (29:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
Yeah, there's not a time that Lebron has not been
in shape. Like you said, this was a power trip. Yeah,
you won the.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
Battle, you lost the war. Pat That's unfortunate.
Speaker 6 (30:09):
That's unfortunate.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
Now we don't even have a chance to come out
to East.
Speaker 6 (30:13):
I think we matter of fact, we're still coming out
to the East.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Go ahead, you know you're not. Y'all can't beat Boston,
y'all can't beat Cleveland, y'all what we can't what beat Boston,
Cleveland or the Knicks? Not in a seven game series.
Y'all might win a game, but y'all winning seven games,
y'all win four games.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
I know. I just I just want to get excited.
I just want to get excited. We need we need
two more pieces.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
And you how d Wade explains it. D Wade said
he knew he was upset. Say that man pushed back
from the table and he didn't play cards.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
No mo.
Speaker 6 (30:49):
Yeah, yeah, that's messing.
Speaker 1 (30:52):
Don't mess up a routine.
Speaker 3 (30:53):
Don't mess up a routine that I'm probably thinking about
how long he Lebron been doing that routine of having
those He's on that flight?
Speaker 1 (31:01):
Yes, shit, man, man, let me get up out of here.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
And I mean, I've heard this is d Wade is
not the first person that I've heard Lebron crazy about
chocolate chip cookies, right, And to do that, I thought
that was petty.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
I think it was unnecessary.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
But I think it was pat Riley trying to prove
a point that I run this show and if I
don't want no cookies on this plane, it ain't gonna
be no Dad damn cookies on this plane, and Lebron says,
you know what, You're right, this is your ish.
Speaker 6 (31:32):
Yeah, I take my show on.
Speaker 1 (31:33):
The road, and he did exactly that.
Speaker 2 (31:36):
Shams is predicting that Lebron Lebron's next season the NBA
will be his last, which would be a poetic end
to number twenty three. You're twenty three for number twenty three.
They have the All Star weekend in Los Angeles. So
to me, it's a very storybook if that's the way
it goes. But that's a decision he's got to make.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Real.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
You just watched the man in your twenty twos make
second team All the NBA. If he the mad first team,
I don't think anybody's mad. If you put him in
over Donovan Mitchell, Donovan got in blessed. He averaged twenty four,
eight and eight. He doesn't really have to do the
heavy lifting anymore because of Luca, So he's He and
ar are still there. So now you put him in
(32:17):
the dunker spot, you let him play off the ball,
He's still gonna be in the twenty points. How long
do you think Lebron wants to play? How long is
he going to play.
Speaker 8 (32:29):
I'm always saying he was gonna play ti Bryce Gott
No leaders. So where Bright goes to Arizona next year.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
That'll be your twenty three. So in order for him
to play with Bryce, he's got to be twenty four.
Speaker 8 (32:39):
So I'll give him twenty four twenty five.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Yeah, and if you get twenty four, you got him.
It's like, I ain't worried about nobody getting twenty five years.
Speaker 8 (32:49):
And then if you get the twenty five, we'll get thirty.
Speaker 1 (32:51):
If nobody can hold up, you might keep.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
Because twenty three that will be forty one. Twenty four
that'll be forty two. Twenty five that will be forty three.
That's the same as Tom Brady was when he retired
twenty you.
Speaker 8 (33:07):
Know, twenty five years and one profession.
Speaker 1 (33:10):
That's that's that's legit. That's a low man.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
You're a dark or lawyer, you get that many time,
or you're the day of military exactly.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
So you know, is not only not only to play
that long, but to.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Be dominant that long, to play at that level you.
Speaker 6 (33:26):
Be consistent, it would be one of the best.
Speaker 2 (33:30):
The average twenty four points a game in year twenty two.
There are some guys that didn't average twenty four points
for a career. There are some guys that didn't. Didn't
I mean never had a season in which the average
twenty four. This guy's in year twenty two doing that
right when you look real, when you when you look
at it, look been around the game. Your dad coached
the game. So you've been around basketball all your life.
(33:53):
What do you think is the most impressive thing that
you that what Lebron is doing? Is it the year
twenty two? Is it the ability to go out there
and still give you average twenty four, to go out
there and give you a game where he can give
you thirty average, you know for a week, give you
thirty straight, go get you forty? What do you think
is the most impressive thing at this juncture? We look
(34:17):
all all the twenty one time first Team All NBA
twenty one times all start with So we get all that,
but I'm talking about what you're witnessing now. What do
you think the most impressive thing that you see him?
And you you was with him for four years. You
watched him every single day, come in, get shots up,
run cold tub massage, thing, you saw it all real.
What do you think the most impressive thing that Lebron
(34:38):
is doing currently.
Speaker 8 (34:39):
I always said that the way he take care of
his body, way he pay attention to his treatment and
stay on schedule with that, that that attests to his
longevity and never really been heard or having a major injury.
So just the way his body is held up, like
his skill set is gonna be a skill set.
Speaker 1 (34:55):
He puts the work in.
Speaker 8 (34:56):
You see him putting the work in after games or
after practice. He's always a last one shooting or someone
getting up shots or working on different moves. So the
way what he puts into the game is when he
gets out, and also what he puts into his body
is what he's getting out of his body. So to me,
it's just the longevity of you know, being that consensitive,
no injuries, no major injuries, bouncing back and still being
(35:18):
healthy enough to do what you do and and do
every day.
Speaker 2 (35:24):
You was with him, Lebron got there, so you was
there use with him eleven, twelve, thirteen, fourteen. Did you
have when you was there with him, did you have
any idea that Lebron James would still be playing twelve
years later?
Speaker 8 (35:42):
No, Lie, I did, just because like I tell people
this all the time, bron would really get treatment if
he was in the club, Like he would literally have
something on his knees or something on his back inside
the club.
Speaker 1 (35:52):
So it's like when.
Speaker 8 (35:54):
Somebody's doing that, like that's real dedication to just be
in the club with treatment I or whatever, like the
stem machine where it's like shooting electric or electric electricity
on your knees and stuff like that, just hamstrings, like
lower back. He always got something that's recovery, making his
(36:16):
body recover. So that's the thing is like once you
see that, like that's a different type of dedication, Like
I'm not I have to take my hat off to
that one.
Speaker 2 (36:24):
Johannis has now more first team All NBA selections than
Kevin Durant. Johannis has seven, KD has six. What more
does Yoannis need to do to pass KD all time.
Speaker 1 (36:37):
I don't think it's possible.
Speaker 8 (36:40):
Really, I don't think it's possible, just because I look
at Katie's skill set and like there's nobody gonna be
a skill set as KDS where ball handling, be able
to shoot the ball better get to the spots he's
gonna get to. I don't think there's gonna be another
Greek freak either, But yeah, us in an offensive game,
(37:01):
it's not polishing us like kd's for him to be.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Better than KD. So you just look at aesthetically. I'm
just looking at that.
Speaker 8 (37:08):
When I look at somebody, I say, who's better than
somebody I look at. I put him in a one
on one matchup and see who would dominate that one
on one match up to the game to five, I
think KD would get Jannis five four or five three.
Speaker 1 (37:19):
Maybe I just got him figured just obfously better. Wow,
what happened if Janna gets the ball first? Same thing?
Speaker 8 (37:27):
I think KT still figured out? How way I think
KD gets to stop before? What on what? Giannis is
all downhill? Now we're playing three or four exactly, playing
three or four dribbles downhill?
Speaker 1 (37:40):
Oh you know what I'm saying, you go, you got
to table to rule players play.
Speaker 8 (37:45):
We played one on one three or four dribbles max.
So in that type of sety, I'm not taking Giannis
over KD. I'm not taking too many people over KD
in that type of setting.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
Okay, Joanna's hands five first team All Defensive for first team,
KT has none, KD has does have two finals MVP.
Speaker 1 (38:08):
Janni's has one.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
It's huh no, Johnny's has two regular season m vps.
Speaker 1 (38:17):
KD has one. That's gonna be very that's gonna be
very interesting.
Speaker 8 (38:22):
That's gonna be interesting when their career, he's gonna have
a head of a career like that's that's the thing.
Speaker 1 (38:27):
But it's still you're not better than Katie.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
I think I think, you know what, I think a
lot of that has to do with aesthetically, because we
like guys that can handle the ball, uh shoot flashy.
I mean, there's nothing like really Johnny's game is really
like old school, like you said, you know, just trying
to get down he'll post. I mean he's still I mean,
you know, three point doesn't shoot that well. He ain't
(38:51):
really got no miny Rangers post. It's not great. He's
basically getting downhill, laying the ball up, you filing, or
he's spinning dumped them.
Speaker 1 (39:00):
That's yo, honest.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
It's still hard to stop because he's averaging thirty sixty
percent from the damn floor. So it's still hard to say.
It's just not as it's.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
Just not as pleasing to the eye, is what we
watch KD.
Speaker 6 (39:14):
Do and You're comparing two different players and two different
skill sets all together, and at that point, regardless of
accolades and what they accomplished on their resume, it depends
on It's all on preference at that point.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
Yeah, I see that. I see that.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
It's uh, it's but whose impact, Who's impacted the game more?
Speaker 6 (39:42):
Oh? Ship, that's damn did the same Almost.
Speaker 1 (39:45):
Huh. That's a tough one right there, because let me
ask you this.
Speaker 2 (39:52):
If I take if I take KD out and put
Giannis in there with Clay Stephen Draymonds, do you still
believe they were the NBA Championships.
Speaker 9 (40:10):
Yeah, yeah, I'll think about the score of the aspect,
but yeah, I still get to him because then that
way you take and your dollar doesn't have to guard
Brown by himself.
Speaker 8 (40:20):
Now you got two or three bodies that can guard Brown,
and that's gonna be a little bit different.
Speaker 1 (40:24):
So yeah, I still give it to go to state.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
Now, if I take KD and I put him on
Milwaukee the year they wanted the weird, they wanted to
beat Phoenix, you think they still win the championship with
k D and Joannis out.
Speaker 8 (40:38):
I mean, they barely got past Brooklyn. So Oh yeah,
I think so. I definitely think so, KD. If he
didn't step on that line, Milwaukee don't win that championship.
Speaker 2 (40:53):
That's that's gonna be when it's all said done, That's
gonna be a very interesting conversation. That's gonna be a
very very intr resting conversation I have because they are
so diametrically different hing nothing about one's game reminds you
of the other.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
One is.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
As you said, Rio is one of the most skilled players,
one of the five most skilled players that we've probably
ever seen with this size, being seven foot.
Speaker 1 (41:19):
Tall, being able to handle the ball. He can shoot
the three, he can.
Speaker 2 (41:23):
Got, he got the mini, he got the heavy h
he can fit get to the rim, he can fit
free throws. He's an eighty eight eighty nine percent free throw.
So he's he's as good as skilled. Because guys that side,
they normally play center. They played with him back to
the basket. We ain't see no guys. You and Dirk
could shoot the ball. Dirk was not putting it on
(41:44):
the ball, going between his legs, going between hind his back,
doing what Kd's He just wasn't doing it. I mean,
Dirk had that. Dirk padded that that one leg step back.
Speaker 1 (41:57):
He's shooting it. It's gonna draw rain and skill.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
I don't know if you're ever gonna see a guy
at his size and skilled a kd his ability because
it's just for his ability to shoot the Lebron's responds
to the no bad comments and mind the Game podcast
and shuts up haters. He said, I see it all
the time. I be on social media and be like,
Lebron has no bag. Lebron has no bag. I'm sitting
(42:24):
here with fifty billion points.
Speaker 1 (42:26):
That's it, that's safe. But what else you're gonna say
about that?
Speaker 2 (42:31):
I mean, all these people that got bagged, let me
ask you a question. Of all the people that got bags,
how many of them are gonna have more points than Lebron?
Speaker 1 (42:38):
Nobody? Nobody, nobody. So I'm talking about whoever got the bag, whoever.
Speaker 2 (42:43):
We think has a bag, Kyrie James Harden, Steph Curry,
who else we think got bags?
Speaker 1 (42:50):
Who gonna have that many points? Nobody?
Speaker 4 (42:54):
Hey, listen, I don't think I don't think Michael Jordan
had a bag like that. When you're talking about had
no dolledge, just yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
He wasn't the head of that thing like Kyrie and
Steph Curry.
Speaker 4 (43:05):
Now, but he was he was efficient and getting to
his spots and when he when he raised up the shoot,
it wasn't nothing you can do.
Speaker 1 (43:11):
You just had to hope he missed.
Speaker 5 (43:12):
Yep, but this isn't in that And I'm a I
am a Jordan fan, right, so you know I respect
the greatness of Lebron and the greatness of Kobe, right, Like,
why is it in basketball we gotta tear down one
to to love the other.
Speaker 7 (43:30):
Much?
Speaker 1 (43:30):
That's what That's what debate television has done. Jail, you pick,
when you pick.
Speaker 2 (43:34):
One, you gotta ho I gotta I gotta accentuate my
guy all the while addressing the flaws of your guy,
and in the flaw and addressing the flaw. It looks
like I'm hating, but I'm just pointing out weaknesses in
his game while accentuating the highs of my guy's game.
Speaker 1 (43:52):
Right, But oo is it happening that win in football?
From a quarterback.
Speaker 2 (43:56):
Perspective, Yeah, yes, we like Brady Mahomes. We had Peyton Manning.
Yeah you do you do? That was debate because you
gotta pick a side. The days of like straddling the fifth.
You used to be well, I like them both.
Speaker 1 (44:14):
Now you can't.
Speaker 2 (44:15):
You can't be on TV, you can't be on radio,
you can't be on podcasts because people go to, well, hell,
I could have said.
Speaker 10 (44:22):
That, right, right, yeah, But and I'm not saying nom
damn reels of Peyton and Brady versus Brady or whoever
else the way that you see it on Bron, Like
I see it's like this.
Speaker 5 (44:33):
It's like what Jordan did this this or Lebron didn't
do this as a or vice versa. Right, It's like
on social media, I'm like, why is it? Why is
that such a divide?
Speaker 2 (44:42):
It didn't used to be like that until debate television
came along, Jail, because there was never a situation where
we were debating Bird and Magic like that. We didn't
didn't do it like it is. But here's the thing.
Prior to this, nobody had ever had what Lebron had.
The points, the reb the assists, the All nbas, the
All Stars, the MVPs, the Finals MVPs. So nobody who
(45:06):
was really even close to really have a comparison because
nobody had been a four time Finals MVP.
Speaker 1 (45:13):
One got that.
Speaker 2 (45:14):
Nobody had that many MVP's, so when you started and
see Biggs, we completely removed bigs from the equation. Kareem
got six for MVP's. Ain't didn't nobody talking about Kareem.
Russell got five, Chamberlain got four. But don't nobody talk
about the bigs because man, somebody got to getting them
the ball. The other guys that we talked about, they
could take the ball and do what they need to
do themselves.
Speaker 1 (45:35):
So it's that's where we are now.
Speaker 2 (45:38):
It's only in sports where you could have a comparable
comparison because you don't see it in baseball. Ain't nobody
being compared to Barry Bonds, Nobody being compared to Walter
Johnson or Greg Maddix, all these great It's just and
for whatever reason, it's basketball and football.
Speaker 1 (46:00):
Damn boil Lebron James, he Lebron James. He how many
we get?
Speaker 2 (46:06):
How many more? How many more years you play jail?
You're give him one year, two year, three years? I
think you've done after this year. You think you've done
after you okay, twenty three. You know Brice Brice could
be eligible to come to the NBA. H you know,
(46:29):
if he do that I'm a golden right. If he
can get if you can get both his kids in
there at first.
Speaker 5 (46:35):
Of all, that'd be amazing to you know, to be honest,
but to just see that man play with his son
and have that level of longevity, that consistency, you know,
to keep itself together and still play at the highest
of levels. Yeah, you're not gonna see that again. And
you ain't gonna never see that again. That's his story history.
Speaker 4 (46:55):
You know what you think about you think about today's player,
today's game, Uh, the type of money they making, like
the the the grind that you got to put into that.
I mean, to have that type of longevity, I can't
see it happening again. Guys they record whenever he's done.
However many points he put up, man, it ain't gonna
(47:17):
ain't nobody catching it.
Speaker 2 (47:18):
I don't see these because I don't know if anybody.
Because he's been the one guy that's been able to
play and avoid the big injury. Yeah, everybody's had a knee.
We see guys getting the ki leads and things like that,
jail Lebron James has been able to avoid that injury,
those type of injuries that sidelined him for fifty sixty
games or an entire season.
Speaker 1 (47:41):
Well, let's say to see y'all.
Speaker 5 (47:42):
Y'all notice, offhand we talk about the physical ability and
where to take to put that together, but we know
when we on the other side of the hell mentally
and emotionally, y'all, man, Yeah, you see it coming, you know,
talk yourself in it.
Speaker 2 (47:56):
You hurting body ache and needs hurt ankle bad? Yeah,
just that you and people want to go to the
bathroom jail. Your body hurt, the ankle, the knees hurt
so bad. Like I think I can. I think I
could wait. What time is it? Yeah, I got another
two hours in I could wait.
Speaker 1 (48:13):
I ain't walk barefooting in almost eighteen years, I put,
I don't walk barefoot in you. I hurt too bad?
Speaker 2 (48:22):
I got on hey, I got I walk around with crocs.
Speaker 1 (48:25):
Or sandles in my house. I can't put my hey.
I ate
Speaker 4 (48:38):
M hm
Host
Shannon Sharpe
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