June 17, 2020 • 38 mins
There's a twist in the murder of Arkansas state senator Linda Collins-Smith. The suspect is facing new charges as details are released of an attempt to hire a hitman to kill the senator's ex-husband.
The body of Collins-Smith was found wrapped in a carpet at the end of her driveway. The remains so mangled that she could not be immediately identified. Who killed Linda Collins-Smith?
Joining Nancy Grace today:
- Ashley Willcott - Judge and trial attorney, Anchor on Court TV
- Dr. Bethany Marshall - Psychoanalyst, Beverly Hills
- Cloyd Steiger - 36 years Seattle Police Department, 22 years Homicide detective, Author of "Seattle's Forgotten Serial Killer-Gary Gene Grant"
- Joseph Scott Morgan - Professor of Forensics Jacksonville State University, Author of "Blood Beneath My Feet"
- Levi Page - Investigative Reporter CrimeOnline
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
How does a gorgeous young state senator end up dead
wrapped in a carpet? Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. I'm
(00:30):
Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being
with us here at Fox Nation and Serious X one eleven.
Take a listen to our friends at TGV eleven. Jordan
Hollington he Randolph County Sheriff's Office responded to the scene
that around five forty five PM and immediately began securing
the crime scene. Deputies, joined by Arkansas State Police's Criminal
(00:53):
Investigation Team. A sea of investigators spotted coming through the
former state senator's property. Neighbors living around the crime scene
chose not to go on camera because they said they're
scared to speak out, but they said, this whole ordeal
is like a mystery. Colin Smith's home located right off
Highway ninety in the Edgewood neighborhood, one that people here
(01:13):
told us off camera is typically quiet. You can see
the vehicles behind the crime scene tape. Neighbors told us
the red truck belongs to the former senator. That's the
vehicle she was spotted driving in about two weeks ago,
and the others. We are told belonged to her father
and son. As investigators arrived, neighbors said those vehicles were
(01:33):
left on the property. The body found outside the home
has since been taken to the state crime lab. The
condition of the body prevented any immediate positive identification. Okay,
that's not good when they can't look at you and
tell make an identification of your body. We are talking
about a gorgeous young Arkansas senator found dead wrapped in
(01:57):
a carpet with me an all star panel judge and
trial lawyer, Court TV anchor Ashley Wilcott. For now, it's psychoan.
Let's joining me out of Beverly Hills. Doctor Bethany Marshall,
Cloyd Steiger thirty six. Here's Seattle PD twenty two of
that in homicide. Author of Seattle's Forgotten serial Killer, Gary
Jane Grant, Professor Forensics Jacksonville State University and author of
(02:19):
Blood Beneath My Feet Death investigator Joseph Scott Morgan. But
to Levi Page Crime online dot Com investigative reporter, I
want to talk about the victim, Linda Collins Smith, stunning
successful Arkansas senator. But let me ask you this, what
(02:41):
was the state of her marriage, she had been divorced. Nancy,
she was married to a judge and had been divorced.
You know what to you, Ashley Walcott, you're a judge
and a trial lawyer, court TV anchor. When you mix
a judge with politics, I mean, what did they talk
about it? Can you imagine? Yeah? Yeah, No you can't
(03:04):
because you're gonna argue. I mean that's what I think.
It's going to end up an argument unless you say
we're not going to discuss at the home, in which
case you have nothing to say to each other. So,
first of all, as you know, when a death occurs,
when a murder, of course, this is such a murder.
They can't even identify her body. You immediately look at
the spouse. But let's talk about in the fact that
they cannot identify Linda Colin Smith's body talking about an
(03:30):
Arkansas senator to Joseph Scott, Morgan death investigator and professor forensics,
what does that tell you right off the bad Joe Scott,
they can't even identify that it's her. Yes, it's near
her home. Yes, she's wrapped in a carpet. I believe
came out of her home. But they can't identify her.
That's not good, Joe Scott. No, it's not Nancy. And
(03:53):
here's the problem. She's been down or deceased long enough
where decomposition has advanced to the point where she's not recognizable.
You can't look at her body and say this is her.
That means that they're going to have to go to
greater scientific links in order to try to get her identified.
(04:13):
In One troubling part to all of this is the
fact where she been. You've got her wrapped in a
carpet and she's found on the property, But where has
she been all of this period of time so that
she could get to this point of advanced decomposition where
they can't identify her. And as as an investigator, that
tells me a lot. That means that somebody had possession
(04:36):
of her, that they had sequestered her or hidding her
away at some point in time, and that that's going
to hiding her, hiding her dead body. And she's see
what I hear that the body was in such a
bad state there could be no visual identification made. I
just assume that somebody used a shotgun and blasted her
(04:56):
face off. But you're thinking it was because of position. Yeah,
that's the first thing that I'm thinking of, that she's
been down that long and and that they can't they
can't identify it. Now, if she was disfigured as a
result of some type of trauma, that's only going to
add another level to this as far as getting her identified.
(05:17):
You know what, Joe Scott Morgan, It's always a treat
to talk to you, because now I get to think
about who would hold her dead body and keep it?
What at the dinner table? What do you do with
a dead body as it decomposes and you keep it
for that long? Now this is Joseph Scott Morgan's theory,
but I mean, we definitely need a shrink to doctor
(05:41):
Bethany Marshall keeping a dead body as it decomposes, And
that's a whole other mindset right there. You know, people
who keep a dead body while it decomposes, I think
fall into one of two categories. One category is that
they're great mostly mentally ill, schizophrenic, something like that, they
(06:04):
have a paranoid delusion, they kill a family member, then
they're too low functioning to dispose of the body. But
I don't suspect that was the case in this particular incident.
The second category is somebody who kills the victim, in
this case the senator, but has not sought in advance
to prepare a dump fight for the body, has not
(06:26):
thought about what they're going to do with the body.
And as we've discussed repeatedly on this show, it takes
an enormous amount of energy to get rid of a
dead body. I mean, some people will cut the body
into pieces, put it into a suitcase, drop it into
the river. But whoever the perpetrator the killer was in
this particular instance, did not think it through to the end.
(06:48):
So those are the two choices you're giving me someone
who's so low functioning they can't figure out how to
get rid of a dead body. Or two? Well, well,
what's the second one? Two? Two? Well, the second one
would be somebody who's angry and murderous enough to kill her,
but they have not a thrill. I got another category
for you. Let me just call it the Ted Bundy category,
(07:12):
where you kill the victim, yea, but then you keep
the body for fun. Remember how he would then continue
to molest the dead body, He would bathe the dead body,
he would apply makeup and do the dead body's hair.
That is not somebody a low functioning, That is not
(07:34):
somebody that hasn't planned. That is a freak. I don't
know what you call him, doctor Bethany. I'm sure some
really long word. Go ahead, hit me with the long word. Well, well,
this would be like the woman that the young woman
that went missing from the coffee kiosk in Seattle and
the killer who took her. Then Samantha Konig, Amantha Konig
(07:57):
Bene her body was frozen. He moved it to him.
Keys is the real keys sewed her eyes shut, put
her up, didn't he get her eyes open, sewed them open,
and pictures of her, applied makeup, braided her hair, took
pictures of her. Yes, that's the third category. There's a
(08:17):
lot of gross apparently, I mean not to tell you
your business. Beverly Hills psychoanalyst. I'm always impressed with that.
But I guess you don't see a whole lot of
bodies with her eyes sewn open out on Rodeo Drive.
So that gives me a whole other category of who
would keep this body? And again this has just got
(08:38):
Morgan's working theory that the body was kept. Crime stories
with Nancy Grace. We are talking about the death the
(09:01):
murder a gorgeous young Arkansas State senator. Take a listen
to our friends at ka ARK four. This is Tyler Thomason.
When the former senator was found outside her Pocahona's home,
authorities say she was unrecognizable. Less than twenty four hours later,
(09:21):
a judge sealed all documents pertaining to the case, and
detectives remained tight lipped about the ongoing investigation. Crime scene
tape covers every corner of Linda Collins Smith's home Wednesday,
outlining the beginning stages of a murder investigation. Police say
a woman was found dead outside the home Tuesday. The
(09:43):
Randolph County Sheriff's Office responded to the scene that around
five forty five pm. Condition of the body prevented any
immediate positive identification. Authorities have stopped short of confirming whether
the victim is the former state senator, but sources say
it was her, indicating that she was found shot to death.
(10:03):
As far as what happened, investigators haven't said much else
and don't plan to anytime soon. Third Judicial District Circuit
Judge Harold Irwin has issued a sealed an order sealing
the documents and statements ordered are obtained by the police
during this investigation. Okay, let me go to you. Cloy Styker,
(10:25):
thirty six years Seattle PD twenty two of that homicide
and author of Seattle's Aregotten serial killer Gary Jane Grant, Cloyd,
why would a judge seal the investigative files? Yeah, you know,
that's a really unusual thing. Usually some high profile case,
which is obviously is but there have to be something
there that is that the prosecutor and the detectives do
(10:48):
not want released right away that they think will happen
their investigation. That's the only reason that would ever happen.
You know. What else is interesting, Cloyd, is that under
Joe Scott Joseph Scott Morgan's theory, the body was kept
for a period of time until it went into advanced decomposition.
But yet it's brought back to the home and wrapped
(11:09):
in a rug when it's found. That's odd. Why do
you what do you make of someone wrapping the body
in a rug, Cloyd Steiger, Well, wrapping a body in
a rug is relatively common because there's there's rugs on
the floor. You just roll the person in it, but
I'm not sure if the body was transported away and
(11:30):
transported back, but that takes a lot of work. It's very,
very difficult to do. And again, why would you bring
it back in the house. So, I mean it's just
they're trying to conceal the body obviously, and wrapping it
in the carpet will actually wrapping in anything will accelerate
the decomposition. And so she's probably a mess with the
(11:52):
open Yeah. And you know another thing Cloyd Steiger with
me thirty six years Seattle, PD twenty two with that homicide.
Another thing we cannot discount is when it's a random killing.
Let's just say some burglar broke in to steal stuff,
they see her, and they shoot her. They don't usually
(12:13):
stick around to conceal the body. Yeah, they don't. Random killings.
You don't even just wrapping the body in a rug.
There would be no reason you don't see that when reason.
The other thing is, first of all, burglars when they
get interrupted run they don't shoot people or kill people that.
You know, a lot of people try to use that
when they're staging has seen it must have been a
(12:33):
burglary interrupted, but that almost never happened, the person runs,
unless the reason for the burglary in the first place
was to kill, a rape or something like that. You're
absolutely right. Random burglars, random killers do not take the time.
They may shoot and go and leave. They're gone, they
want out of there, and they don't take time to
(12:56):
stage the scene. To you, Joseph Scott Morgan, you're the
death an investigator, what does it tell you that she
Senator Linda Collins Smith was wrapped up in a carpet. Well,
I think that, as was pointed out earlier, if I recall,
the carpet originated from within that very residence, and so
(13:17):
that gives us some kind of connection between the perpetrator
or whoever was it wrapped her up and deposited her there.
That means that they were within the interior of that
residence at some point time and grab that carpet wrapped
her body up in it. Another big thing here is
(13:38):
also why would you go to the trouble of wrapping Well,
I think that you want to contain if she's been traumatized,
which obviously she has, you want to contain the blood.
But also does this go to an issue of maybe
like face covering which is something that we see where
people that are intimately involved with an individual, well shoot
(14:01):
an individual or kill an individual, and then covered their
face because literally, and this is more in doctor Bethany's area,
but literally, they can't abide having that person's face in
their field of view because they have an intimate relationship
with them. And we'll see this acted out periodically in
these cases of intimate violence where you know you don't
(14:24):
want to see the person's face that you've just literally slaughtered. Now,
I's thinking about a case where a young woman twenty
one ish accused of murdering her mother put a wicker
trash basket over her mother's head. Wait, wait, we see
(14:45):
it all the time. I don't necessarily understand it, but
I'm with Joe Scott Morgan on this. There's something about
seeing your murder victim's face. You can't stand. What is that,
Doctor Bethany, He's right, this is your promise. Well, it
could either be that you it's a final superficial act
of kindness you want to provide some covering. But I
(15:09):
think most off, I would think the trash can over
the head is you don't want the victim looking at you.
You don't want them to see what you've done, which
I think is often why victims are shot in the
back of the head. It is because the perpetrator wants
not only an element of surprise, but they don't want
(15:31):
that person to know what they're going to do. They
don't want to be seen, even in death. They don't
want recognition on the other person's face. But you know,
in this case, Nancy, she was wrapped in a blanket
under a tarp at the end of her driveway. And
I'm not a death investigator, but I know human behavior,
(15:52):
and somehow it seems that whoever did this to the
senator did at some point decide they were going to
get rid of the body, but they only made it
as far at the end of the driveway. So I
also wonder, you know, who cliff carried a body in
a tarp, you know, wrapped in a rug to the
(16:13):
end of a driveway. Why deposit it there? Most surely
it's going to be found. There was this person trying
to make a hasty getaway and then just thought thought, oh,
screw it, I'm just going to leave her there, and
then they just drove off or did they stage the
body at the end of the driveway because they wanted
everyone to know that they had killed her. I mean
(16:33):
that to me is a very curious part of this
crime scene. Nancy. I gotta say one more thing, and
you know, relative to what Bessanie was just commenting on,
and maybe this is really far afield, but what else
did we put at the end of our driveway, those
of us that live in neighborhoods, And maybe yeah, we
put trash at the end of the driveway. And so
(16:55):
if you continue with that logic, did this individual that
had taking this poor woman's life, did she view her
as something that can just be tossed away just like
a piece of debris, or could it have been to
Cloyd Stiger joining me thirty six years Seattle PD, just
go with me for a moment, because Joe Scott just
(17:15):
gave me an idea. Could the killer have possibly thought
that the body would be picked up by the trash
and disposed of without realizing what it was? Kloyd, maybe
you have much more, much more like well success in
that if you're in a garbage can or a machine
picks it up. But if some person has to pick
(17:35):
that up, they're going to go what the hecks are
wrong with this, and it's going to be much more
heavy than I rolled up a carpet should be. But
Joe Scott and Bethne were both right. I've been to
many scenes where the face was covered or turned on
a murder victim and it ended up being it's either
someone the person knows intimately or someone who kind of
(17:59):
displays a person I know intimately with that victim or
that person represents. And so that's really really common. Haven't
thought of that symbolic transference of hatred and homicidal intent,
that you know the victim or the victimsty placing someone
in your mind that you want to kill. Crime stories
(18:34):
with Nancy Grace, a beautiful young Arkansas Senator Linda Collins
Smith dead, rolled up in a carpet, blanket, tarp and
her body vastly decomposed, then left on the senator's own
property well immediately the investigation starts. Take a listen to
(18:57):
ka r K four Tyler Thomas. Court documents revealed the
former senator was in the process of divorcing her husband,
retired Judge Philip Smith. Hearing in that case was scheduled
later this month, and according to documented testimony the couple
were at odds over money after selling a local hotel
for more than a million dollars. The x lawmaker's former
(19:19):
spokesperson tells us the divorce quote was not pleasant. He
also says Collins Smith remained active on social media, but
appeared to go silent more than a week ago. An
old campaign sign sits just beyond the police tape, marking
a time when constituents looked to Linda for answers. Now
they look elsewhere for answers in her death. The sheriff says,
(19:42):
at state police are leading this homicide investigation. Okay, out
to you Crime online dot Com investigative reporter Levi Page, Levi,
you told me the divorce was over. I didn't know
they were finding over a million dollars sale of a
local hotel, your Craig, Nancy, that was the business she
owned with her Spanky Spanky, Yes, that was the business
(20:04):
that she owned with her. EXE got married right after
she passed away. The divorce was finalized after that. Whoa
wait a minute, wait wait wait, wait, wait stop. Right
after his former wife, the senator the one rolled up
in the blank at the carpet at the end of
(20:25):
the driveway with the traps the Dixie dumpster. Yes, how
soon after that did he remarry immediately? It sounded like
he was with her while the divorce was ongoing, and
then when she died, the divorce obviously is finalized, so
he remarried very quickly. Well, I guess that's one way
of finalizing and divorces for your wife to end up
in a tarpet the end of the driveway. Money money,
(20:48):
you know. Another thing. Whenever I hear of a police
officer or an investigator. We just covered a female cop
I believe in Long Island planning to kill her husband
and her boyfriend's daughter, I think, wait, how did they
suddenly end up on the wrong side of the law.
(21:09):
Floyd Siger, thirty six year SEATTLEPD. Do you think sometimes
that cops, investigators DA's are around criminals so much? I mean,
can you walk through them, even if you're wearing hip mates,
walk through the mud every day and not check sometime
to the living room carpet? I mean, well, yeah, that's
part of it. You know, they see this stuff and
some of them may think I can get away with this.
(21:31):
But also police departments are made up of humans. To
have human emotions just like everybody else, and sometimes those
emotions go haywire and they do stupid stuff like this, Nancy, Nancy,
there's actually robust research that indicates that sociopaths and psychopaths
gravitate towards positions of power. So they want to become cops,
(21:52):
they want to become death investigators. They want to carry
a gun and have handcuffs and all of that. And
that's why there's very sific psych testing that police officers
have to go through before they before they can get
a job within a police department, is to screen out
these kinds of unsavory characters. I have a colleague that
does testing for police departments here in Los Angeles, and
(22:15):
so she does fitness for duty reviews, and she says
that there are a fair number of cadets who come
into her office and will all of a sudden start
talking about guns and how they love guns and they
have a stash of guns and they've been fascinated with
guns since they were little kids. And she will write
a letter to the police department and say, denied, don't
(22:36):
hire this person. Jay Scott just say, you know, you
definitely heard her mentioned death investigators. Okay, so I think
that's pretty much aimed right at You. Eticed that because
I remember and all the years that I prosecuted, I
would come across the cop and I would visualize I
(22:57):
could actually see them committing a murder. There was just
something snaps. And all the years they're devoted to crime
fighting and doing the right thing, they've been around criminals.
I sought a lot with defense attorneys. I'd be trying
to reach a defense attorney about a trial on Monday.
I'm like, where is he. Oh, he's down at Magic City,
(23:18):
this trip club with some of his clients. I'm like, okay,
not judging, but some of his cocaine clients at this
trip club. So my point is, when you start hanging
around with criminals, somehow, at first you're shocked. Then somehow
you become desensitized to it, and then after a while,
(23:39):
maybe to some people, it doesn't seem like such a
bad idea. Ashley, Yeah, I was gonna say, Nancy, I
see it often, unfortunately, and they do become immune to
it because they're absorbed into a world. But it first
is shocking and criminal, and then they're absorbed into a
think of well, this is the norm, this is what
I know of criminal defense attorney who only represents criminals
(24:00):
does become a little bit immune to and it's like,
this is the world I live in, and this is
what it is. It's quote unquote normal. And I do
think the same happens to officers law enforcement. No, it
doesn't mean they become criminal, but it does mean that
they live in an underbelly of a world that's very
different than the rest of us live in. And if
(24:20):
they have any predisposition, or if they have any not
good morals, that's really good English. I know I just used.
But if their morals are not good, then they can
cross that line and become the criminal themselves. And I've
seen it in court with criminal defendants. And another issue
to crime online got com investigate a reporter leave by page.
I mean the husband who rushed down the marriage aisle
(24:43):
as soon as his ex is found dead down with
the trash jumpster at the end of the driveway. He's
a judge or a former judge, and I assume that
police handled him with kid gloves because having been on
the bench. Asked Nancy. He was questioned immediately after Linda
(25:03):
Collins was found murdered that he was not considered a suspect.
You know it's ironic. As a senator, Colin Smith introduced
multiple bills to expand the places where concealed weapons could
be carried, and then ends up dead by gunshot wound.
You know, Joseph's got more guilty? Can I correct something? Yeah?
(25:25):
Jump in So earlier reports said that she was shot,
but in aff the davids that were released, it turned
out that she was not actually shot. She was actually
stabbed that multiple time. Yeah, for some reason, for some reason,
doctor Bethany, A stabbing seems so much more violent than
(25:45):
a shooting. What is that? I mean both ways you
end up dead. Well, stabbing is so intimate. I mean
when you stabbed somebody, you don't just want them dead,
say as a drive by shooting, where you want to
see your victim dropped to the ground. But there's nothing
personal in it other than that. When you use a knife,
(26:05):
it's extremely personal. And also you've gotten close enough if
you're in the victim's home to gain that person's trust.
You have to be close. If there was no sign
of a break in or a home invasion, This person
was in her home, this person knew her, This person
used a knife, and this person had intimate homicidal rage.
(26:29):
I know the husband was ruled out as a suspect,
but I think whoever did this did know her. And
as you know, the preponderance of murders are are committed
by our intimates, not by strangers, because it's in the
context of our most intimate relationships. As we often talk
about that humans experienced envy, rage, jealousy, rejection. And if
(26:51):
you look at her picture, Nancy, she's gorgeous, she's powerful,
she's at the peak of society. She's pasty, legislator, legislation
and bill. So there are a lot of people who
could envy her, admire her, stock her, or want a
piece of her, want to get close to her, want
to be intimate with her. It seems like there's a pool,
(27:13):
endless pool of people who either knew her because she
was powerful in society, or imagine they knew her and
wanted to be up close and personal in some way
Nancy relative to kind of Dovetailing with what Bethany said
regarding the knife trauma and how this is almost a
ripping to shreds of this individual, this gives us an
(27:35):
indication as to what condition the body was in when
a medical examiner does an initial assessment, or the police,
for instance, if that's who it was at the scene,
when they cannot differentiate between a gunshot wound and a
sharp force injury, that gives you an indication that they're
looking at something that's very muddled. It can either be
muddled by severe trauma or it can be muddled by decomposition,
(27:59):
where you have to give the body into a position
where you can examine it in very intense circumstances. They
like back at the problem. Bottom line, they stabbing was
so bad at first they thought it was a gunshot wound.
(28:25):
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, I want you to
listen now. We're talking about the murder of a gorgeous
young state senator. Take a listen to t J. Holmes
on GMA. A shocking mystery that turned heads news of
Arkansas police investigating a cold blooded killing of a former
(28:47):
state senator, Linda Colin Smith, who was found wrapped in
a blanket outside her home on June fourth. Police remained
tight lipped for days, but later they say they found
the suspect friend and former colleague Becky Lynn o'donald, who
was now facing charges of capital murder, abuse of Colin
Smith's body, and tampering with physical evidence. She is sad
(29:09):
that this is hurting her family, but she's angry and
she's strong. Who she met at whoever arrested her in
WHA o'donald is spending a second week in jail, and
her fiance, Tim Logan's claims police have made a huge
and inexplicable error. She has been arrested now for capital
murder and you and Becky don't have any idea why,
(29:35):
none whatsoever. Login says he was the one to break
the news to o'donald. I just told her they found
Linda dead and she collapsed. You are hearing our friends
at GMA, and speaking is the senator's aid, her right
hand fiance. That's who you're here speaking O'Donnell, her right arm,
(30:02):
Rebecca Lynn. O'Donnell had been this close to her for
so long, and now she's arrested for the senator's murderer.
Take a listen again to t J. Holmes. After O'Donnell's arrest,
Colin Smith's family was stunned, releasing a statement saying we
are sickened and upset that someone so close to Linda
(30:24):
would be involved in such a terrible, heartless crime. But
Logins is asking for help to clear his fiance's name,
saying he believes the real killer is still out there.
Has it crossed your mind for a moment, just in
some late night alone, were you questioned, well, maybe Becky
(30:45):
is capable of this. Becky's not capable of this. You
haven't had every question at all. No, I mean either
she is a best actress in the world and a
sociopath and completely fooled me. Well, there's not a chance
she did this, straight out to Levi page Clime online
dot Com investigative reporter Levi, who is Becky O'Donnell? So,
(31:10):
Rebecca Linn O'Donnell is Linda Collins friend and business manager
for her business, and she was the last person to
see Linda Collins alive. She dropped food lunched off at
her home May twenty eight, and security cameras set up
in the home captured her on the security camera and
(31:33):
it also captured her taking down security cameras in the
home as well. Wow. Okay cooy Siger thirty six years
Seattle PD twenty two of that on homicide. Why would
you go into a home and take down the video
recording cameras unless it was for a nefarious reason. Yeah,
in my business, we call that a clue, right. I mean,
(31:55):
it's obviously she didn't want to be paid inside the house.
And you know, I would also look at she was
her business manager. Maybe she was feeling from the business
and got caught and that's what started this whole thing.
I don't know, but that's that's interesting. I hadn't heard
that she was a business manager. And she's a friend
and yeah, me too, Doctor Bethany Marshall, do you remember
(32:19):
Selena up I was just looking at that beautiful, gorgeous
to Hannah Singer who was murdered by her number one
obsessive fan. Yes. Here, Rebecca Lena O'Donnell was all up
in Linda Collins Smith's business. Yes, and now she's charged
with murder. Yeah. So I think what we saw with
(32:39):
the head of the fan club for Selena's and what
we might be seeing with Rebecca Linn O'Donnell is Rebecca
might have been one of these kinds of women who
wanted to be the senator, admired the Senator, wanted to
gain proximity to Linda Collins Smith m put her on
(33:00):
a pedestal, idealized her, but then envied her all at
the same time. And in my field, we feel that
envy is the belief that if you have something good,
I have to destroy it because I don't believe that
you can have something good and I can have something
good and we can collaborate and create something good together.
(33:20):
So people who are envious always want to destroy the
object of their envy. And in this case, O'Donnell may
have has taken it to a murderous pathological level. But Nancy,
we don't think of females as being stalkers in this
kind of way. But it could be that this so
called business manager was putting her tentacles in everywhere, like
(33:41):
hoiz koid Steiger mentioned, Perhaps she was embezzling. Perhaps she
was thinking, Oh, you don't deserve this money after the
sale of this motel. This should be my money. I'm
the one who's done all this work for you. Why
are you benefiting? You shouldn't be in Congress, you shouldn't
be a senator. I should be there. I am the
more beautiful one, I'm the smarter one. So in a
(34:02):
way she has to block the senator out because she
can't stand the senator's success. No one in the inner
circle seems to believe that Becky O'Donnell could murder State
Senator Linda Collins Smith. Take a listen to ABC needs
correspondent Marcy Gonzalez new insight into the connection between a
former Arkansas state senator killed at her home and her
(34:26):
former campaign staff are arrested in connection. It comes as
a shock. Linda Collins Smith was found shot to death
on June fourth. Days later, Rebecca Lynn O'Donnell updated her
Facebook profile picture to this smiling image of them together.
Than Friday, without explanation, police took O'Donnell into custody. The
(34:47):
investigation is presently at a critical juncture and no further
informational way released at this time. ABC News Station KAI
reporting that O'Donnell recently appeared as a corroborating witness and
Colin Smith's divorce case. And we're told the two were
good friends. They were all fighters for the Second Amendment,
and so they would you know, you'd see them at events,
(35:10):
travel together. This weekend, family, friends and colleagues gathered for
Colin Smith's funeral, remembering her as a loving mother and
tough legislator. She was courageous, she was undaunted. I mean
a lot of the behind the scenes things and politics
that was so bad and quite frankly brutal. She would
keep fighting. But I don't understand is motive to leave
(35:32):
ipage Crime online dot Com investigative reporter. What do we
know about potential motive? Well, Nancy, a lot of people
think that money. Then maybe the motive here because Rebecca
Linn O'Donnell managed the business of that hotel where it
was sold as part of the divorce. And also, Nancy,
what we haven't mentioned is you played the audio of
Rebecca O'Donnell's fiance, Tim Logans. He actually was the power
(35:57):
of attorney for the murder victim, Linda Colin Smith. Guys,
when you don't know a horse, look at her track
record for those people. Steel insisting that Rebecca Lenn O'Donnell
aka Becky O'Donnell is innocent. Well, it ain't over yet.
Listen to this. I hope you're sitting down. Here's KLRT
(36:19):
Fox sixteen Mandy Noel. She's accused this morning of trying
to set up a murder from behind bars Rebecca O'Donnell
is in jail, now charged with murdering Linda Collins. On
top of the capital murder charge, Rebecca O'Donnell is now
facing two counts of solicitation to commit capital murder and
tampering with physical evidence. The new charges were filed in
(36:40):
Jackson County's Circuit Court. We're told four inmates say O'Donnell
talked to them about killing Collins's former husband and making
it look like a suicide. Investigators say O'Donnell wanted the
man's current wife to be killed too. Court documents claimed
she offered to pay the inmates in gold and over all.
(37:01):
This is happening from inside the Jackson County jail. Pay
them in gold and silver. You know, I always watched
those commercials on TV about getting gold instead of you know,
having a checking account. Where are you gonna bury it
in the backyard. She's gonna pay these people with gold
and silver. Okay, that's a whole other cannon worm spet
in a nut. I was Judas hyscarian, didn't Judas yes?
(37:25):
Leave page? Now she wants the ex husband and the
wife did yes, Nancy. So this started when she was
behind bars and she was talking to fellow inmate and
allegedly she was devising this plot to have Linda Collins
ex husband Bill Smith, a former judge, killed, and she said,
(37:45):
I want him to be killed, and I want you
to leave a suicide note behind, and I also want
you to kill his current wife to make it look
like a murder suicide. And they, she said, in their
home they have gold and silver worth about thirty grand.
Take that and that would be your reward. Well, you
(38:06):
know what, I guess one dead body was not enough
for her. We wait as justice unfalls. Nancy Grace climbs story,
signing off Goodbye friend,
How does a gorgeous young state senator end up dead
wrapped in a carpet? Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. I'm
(00:30):
Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being
with us here at Fox Nation and Serious X one eleven.
Take a listen to our friends at TGV eleven. Jordan
Hollington he Randolph County Sheriff's Office responded to the scene
that around five forty five PM and immediately began securing
the crime scene. Deputies, joined by Arkansas State Police's Criminal
(00:53):
Investigation Team. A sea of investigators spotted coming through the
former state senator's property. Neighbors living around the crime scene
chose not to go on camera because they said they're
scared to speak out, but they said, this whole ordeal
is like a mystery. Colin Smith's home located right off
Highway ninety in the Edgewood neighborhood, one that people here
(01:13):
told us off camera is typically quiet. You can see
the vehicles behind the crime scene tape. Neighbors told us
the red truck belongs to the former senator. That's the
vehicle she was spotted driving in about two weeks ago,
and the others. We are told belonged to her father
and son. As investigators arrived, neighbors said those vehicles were
(01:33):
left on the property. The body found outside the home
has since been taken to the state crime lab. The
condition of the body prevented any immediate positive identification. Okay,
that's not good when they can't look at you and
tell make an identification of your body. We are talking
about a gorgeous young Arkansas senator found dead wrapped in
(01:57):
a carpet with me an all star panel judge and
trial lawyer, Court TV anchor Ashley Wilcott. For now, it's psychoan.
Let's joining me out of Beverly Hills. Doctor Bethany Marshall,
Cloyd Steiger thirty six. Here's Seattle PD twenty two of
that in homicide. Author of Seattle's Forgotten serial Killer, Gary
Jane Grant, Professor Forensics Jacksonville State University and author of
(02:19):
Blood Beneath My Feet Death investigator Joseph Scott Morgan. But
to Levi Page Crime online dot Com investigative reporter, I
want to talk about the victim, Linda Collins Smith, stunning
successful Arkansas senator. But let me ask you this, what
(02:41):
was the state of her marriage, she had been divorced. Nancy,
she was married to a judge and had been divorced.
You know what to you, Ashley Walcott, you're a judge
and a trial lawyer, court TV anchor. When you mix
a judge with politics, I mean, what did they talk
about it? Can you imagine? Yeah? Yeah, No you can't
(03:04):
because you're gonna argue. I mean that's what I think.
It's going to end up an argument unless you say
we're not going to discuss at the home, in which
case you have nothing to say to each other. So,
first of all, as you know, when a death occurs,
when a murder, of course, this is such a murder.
They can't even identify her body. You immediately look at
the spouse. But let's talk about in the fact that
they cannot identify Linda Colin Smith's body talking about an
(03:30):
Arkansas senator to Joseph Scott, Morgan death investigator and professor forensics,
what does that tell you right off the bad Joe Scott,
they can't even identify that it's her. Yes, it's near
her home. Yes, she's wrapped in a carpet. I believe
came out of her home. But they can't identify her.
That's not good, Joe Scott. No, it's not Nancy. And
(03:53):
here's the problem. She's been down or deceased long enough
where decomposition has advanced to the point where she's not recognizable.
You can't look at her body and say this is her.
That means that they're going to have to go to
greater scientific links in order to try to get her identified.
(04:13):
In One troubling part to all of this is the
fact where she been. You've got her wrapped in a
carpet and she's found on the property, But where has
she been all of this period of time so that
she could get to this point of advanced decomposition where
they can't identify her. And as as an investigator, that
tells me a lot. That means that somebody had possession
(04:36):
of her, that they had sequestered her or hidding her
away at some point in time, and that that's going
to hiding her, hiding her dead body. And she's see
what I hear that the body was in such a
bad state there could be no visual identification made. I
just assume that somebody used a shotgun and blasted her
(04:56):
face off. But you're thinking it was because of position. Yeah,
that's the first thing that I'm thinking of, that she's
been down that long and and that they can't they
can't identify it. Now, if she was disfigured as a
result of some type of trauma, that's only going to
add another level to this as far as getting her identified.
(05:17):
You know what, Joe Scott Morgan, It's always a treat
to talk to you, because now I get to think
about who would hold her dead body and keep it?
What at the dinner table? What do you do with
a dead body as it decomposes and you keep it
for that long? Now this is Joseph Scott Morgan's theory,
but I mean, we definitely need a shrink to doctor
(05:41):
Bethany Marshall keeping a dead body as it decomposes, And
that's a whole other mindset right there. You know, people
who keep a dead body while it decomposes, I think
fall into one of two categories. One category is that
they're great mostly mentally ill, schizophrenic, something like that, they
(06:04):
have a paranoid delusion, they kill a family member, then
they're too low functioning to dispose of the body. But
I don't suspect that was the case in this particular incident.
The second category is somebody who kills the victim, in
this case the senator, but has not sought in advance
to prepare a dump fight for the body, has not
(06:26):
thought about what they're going to do with the body.
And as we've discussed repeatedly on this show, it takes
an enormous amount of energy to get rid of a
dead body. I mean, some people will cut the body
into pieces, put it into a suitcase, drop it into
the river. But whoever the perpetrator the killer was in
this particular instance, did not think it through to the end.
(06:48):
So those are the two choices you're giving me someone
who's so low functioning they can't figure out how to
get rid of a dead body. Or two? Well, well,
what's the second one? Two? Two? Well, the second one
would be somebody who's angry and murderous enough to kill her,
but they have not a thrill. I got another category
for you. Let me just call it the Ted Bundy category,
(07:12):
where you kill the victim, yea, but then you keep
the body for fun. Remember how he would then continue
to molest the dead body, He would bathe the dead body,
he would apply makeup and do the dead body's hair.
That is not somebody a low functioning, That is not
(07:34):
somebody that hasn't planned. That is a freak. I don't
know what you call him, doctor Bethany. I'm sure some
really long word. Go ahead, hit me with the long word. Well, well,
this would be like the woman that the young woman
that went missing from the coffee kiosk in Seattle and
the killer who took her. Then Samantha Konig, Amantha Konig
(07:57):
Bene her body was frozen. He moved it to him.
Keys is the real keys sewed her eyes shut, put
her up, didn't he get her eyes open, sewed them open,
and pictures of her, applied makeup, braided her hair, took
pictures of her. Yes, that's the third category. There's a
(08:17):
lot of gross apparently, I mean not to tell you
your business. Beverly Hills psychoanalyst. I'm always impressed with that.
But I guess you don't see a whole lot of
bodies with her eyes sewn open out on Rodeo Drive.
So that gives me a whole other category of who
would keep this body? And again this has just got
(08:38):
Morgan's working theory that the body was kept. Crime stories
with Nancy Grace. We are talking about the death the
(09:01):
murder a gorgeous young Arkansas State senator. Take a listen
to our friends at ka ARK four. This is Tyler Thomason.
When the former senator was found outside her Pocahona's home,
authorities say she was unrecognizable. Less than twenty four hours later,
(09:21):
a judge sealed all documents pertaining to the case, and
detectives remained tight lipped about the ongoing investigation. Crime scene
tape covers every corner of Linda Collins Smith's home Wednesday,
outlining the beginning stages of a murder investigation. Police say
a woman was found dead outside the home Tuesday. The
(09:43):
Randolph County Sheriff's Office responded to the scene that around
five forty five pm. Condition of the body prevented any
immediate positive identification. Authorities have stopped short of confirming whether
the victim is the former state senator, but sources say
it was her, indicating that she was found shot to death.
(10:03):
As far as what happened, investigators haven't said much else
and don't plan to anytime soon. Third Judicial District Circuit
Judge Harold Irwin has issued a sealed an order sealing
the documents and statements ordered are obtained by the police
during this investigation. Okay, let me go to you. Cloy Styker,
(10:25):
thirty six years Seattle PD twenty two of that homicide
and author of Seattle's Aregotten serial killer Gary Jane Grant, Cloyd,
why would a judge seal the investigative files? Yeah, you know,
that's a really unusual thing. Usually some high profile case,
which is obviously is but there have to be something
there that is that the prosecutor and the detectives do
(10:48):
not want released right away that they think will happen
their investigation. That's the only reason that would ever happen.
You know. What else is interesting, Cloyd, is that under
Joe Scott Joseph Scott Morgan's theory, the body was kept
for a period of time until it went into advanced decomposition.
But yet it's brought back to the home and wrapped
(11:09):
in a rug when it's found. That's odd. Why do
you what do you make of someone wrapping the body
in a rug, Cloyd Steiger, Well, wrapping a body in
a rug is relatively common because there's there's rugs on
the floor. You just roll the person in it, but
I'm not sure if the body was transported away and
(11:30):
transported back, but that takes a lot of work. It's very,
very difficult to do. And again, why would you bring
it back in the house. So, I mean it's just
they're trying to conceal the body obviously, and wrapping it
in the carpet will actually wrapping in anything will accelerate
the decomposition. And so she's probably a mess with the
(11:52):
open Yeah. And you know another thing Cloyd Steiger with
me thirty six years Seattle, PD twenty two with that homicide.
Another thing we cannot discount is when it's a random killing.
Let's just say some burglar broke in to steal stuff,
they see her, and they shoot her. They don't usually
(12:13):
stick around to conceal the body. Yeah, they don't. Random killings.
You don't even just wrapping the body in a rug.
There would be no reason you don't see that when reason.
The other thing is, first of all, burglars when they
get interrupted run they don't shoot people or kill people that.
You know, a lot of people try to use that
when they're staging has seen it must have been a
(12:33):
burglary interrupted, but that almost never happened, the person runs,
unless the reason for the burglary in the first place
was to kill, a rape or something like that. You're
absolutely right. Random burglars, random killers do not take the time.
They may shoot and go and leave. They're gone, they
want out of there, and they don't take time to
(12:56):
stage the scene. To you, Joseph Scott Morgan, you're the
death an investigator, what does it tell you that she
Senator Linda Collins Smith was wrapped up in a carpet. Well,
I think that, as was pointed out earlier, if I recall,
the carpet originated from within that very residence, and so
(13:17):
that gives us some kind of connection between the perpetrator
or whoever was it wrapped her up and deposited her there.
That means that they were within the interior of that
residence at some point time and grab that carpet wrapped
her body up in it. Another big thing here is
(13:38):
also why would you go to the trouble of wrapping Well,
I think that you want to contain if she's been traumatized,
which obviously she has, you want to contain the blood.
But also does this go to an issue of maybe
like face covering which is something that we see where
people that are intimately involved with an individual, well shoot
(14:01):
an individual or kill an individual, and then covered their
face because literally, and this is more in doctor Bethany's area,
but literally, they can't abide having that person's face in
their field of view because they have an intimate relationship
with them. And we'll see this acted out periodically in
these cases of intimate violence where you know you don't
(14:24):
want to see the person's face that you've just literally slaughtered. Now,
I's thinking about a case where a young woman twenty
one ish accused of murdering her mother put a wicker
trash basket over her mother's head. Wait, wait, we see
(14:45):
it all the time. I don't necessarily understand it, but
I'm with Joe Scott Morgan on this. There's something about
seeing your murder victim's face. You can't stand. What is that,
Doctor Bethany, He's right, this is your promise. Well, it
could either be that you it's a final superficial act
of kindness you want to provide some covering. But I
(15:09):
think most off, I would think the trash can over
the head is you don't want the victim looking at you.
You don't want them to see what you've done, which
I think is often why victims are shot in the
back of the head. It is because the perpetrator wants
not only an element of surprise, but they don't want
(15:31):
that person to know what they're going to do. They
don't want to be seen, even in death. They don't
want recognition on the other person's face. But you know,
in this case, Nancy, she was wrapped in a blanket
under a tarp at the end of her driveway. And
I'm not a death investigator, but I know human behavior,
(15:52):
and somehow it seems that whoever did this to the
senator did at some point decide they were going to
get rid of the body, but they only made it
as far at the end of the driveway. So I
also wonder, you know, who cliff carried a body in
a tarp, you know, wrapped in a rug to the
(16:13):
end of a driveway. Why deposit it there? Most surely
it's going to be found. There was this person trying
to make a hasty getaway and then just thought thought, oh,
screw it, I'm just going to leave her there, and
then they just drove off or did they stage the
body at the end of the driveway because they wanted
everyone to know that they had killed her. I mean
(16:33):
that to me is a very curious part of this
crime scene. Nancy. I gotta say one more thing, and
you know, relative to what Bessanie was just commenting on,
and maybe this is really far afield, but what else
did we put at the end of our driveway, those
of us that live in neighborhoods, And maybe yeah, we
put trash at the end of the driveway. And so
(16:55):
if you continue with that logic, did this individual that
had taking this poor woman's life, did she view her
as something that can just be tossed away just like
a piece of debris, or could it have been to
Cloyd Stiger joining me thirty six years Seattle PD, just
go with me for a moment, because Joe Scott just
(17:15):
gave me an idea. Could the killer have possibly thought
that the body would be picked up by the trash
and disposed of without realizing what it was? Kloyd, maybe
you have much more, much more like well success in
that if you're in a garbage can or a machine
picks it up. But if some person has to pick
(17:35):
that up, they're going to go what the hecks are
wrong with this, and it's going to be much more
heavy than I rolled up a carpet should be. But
Joe Scott and Bethne were both right. I've been to
many scenes where the face was covered or turned on
a murder victim and it ended up being it's either
someone the person knows intimately or someone who kind of
(17:59):
displays a person I know intimately with that victim or
that person represents. And so that's really really common. Haven't
thought of that symbolic transference of hatred and homicidal intent,
that you know the victim or the victimsty placing someone
in your mind that you want to kill. Crime stories
(18:34):
with Nancy Grace, a beautiful young Arkansas Senator Linda Collins
Smith dead, rolled up in a carpet, blanket, tarp and
her body vastly decomposed, then left on the senator's own
property well immediately the investigation starts. Take a listen to
(18:57):
ka r K four Tyler Thomas. Court documents revealed the
former senator was in the process of divorcing her husband,
retired Judge Philip Smith. Hearing in that case was scheduled
later this month, and according to documented testimony the couple
were at odds over money after selling a local hotel
for more than a million dollars. The x lawmaker's former
(19:19):
spokesperson tells us the divorce quote was not pleasant. He
also says Collins Smith remained active on social media, but
appeared to go silent more than a week ago. An
old campaign sign sits just beyond the police tape, marking
a time when constituents looked to Linda for answers. Now
they look elsewhere for answers in her death. The sheriff says,
(19:42):
at state police are leading this homicide investigation. Okay, out
to you Crime online dot Com investigative reporter Levi Page, Levi,
you told me the divorce was over. I didn't know
they were finding over a million dollars sale of a
local hotel, your Craig, Nancy, that was the business she
owned with her Spanky Spanky, Yes, that was the business
(20:04):
that she owned with her. EXE got married right after
she passed away. The divorce was finalized after that. Whoa
wait a minute, wait wait wait, wait, wait stop. Right
after his former wife, the senator the one rolled up
in the blank at the carpet at the end of
(20:25):
the driveway with the traps the Dixie dumpster. Yes, how
soon after that did he remarry immediately? It sounded like
he was with her while the divorce was ongoing, and
then when she died, the divorce obviously is finalized, so
he remarried very quickly. Well, I guess that's one way
of finalizing and divorces for your wife to end up
in a tarpet the end of the driveway. Money money,
(20:48):
you know. Another thing. Whenever I hear of a police
officer or an investigator. We just covered a female cop
I believe in Long Island planning to kill her husband
and her boyfriend's daughter, I think, wait, how did they
suddenly end up on the wrong side of the law.
(21:09):
Floyd Siger, thirty six year SEATTLEPD. Do you think sometimes
that cops, investigators DA's are around criminals so much? I mean,
can you walk through them, even if you're wearing hip mates,
walk through the mud every day and not check sometime
to the living room carpet? I mean, well, yeah, that's
part of it. You know, they see this stuff and
some of them may think I can get away with this.
(21:31):
But also police departments are made up of humans. To
have human emotions just like everybody else, and sometimes those
emotions go haywire and they do stupid stuff like this, Nancy, Nancy,
there's actually robust research that indicates that sociopaths and psychopaths
gravitate towards positions of power. So they want to become cops,
(21:52):
they want to become death investigators. They want to carry
a gun and have handcuffs and all of that. And
that's why there's very sific psych testing that police officers
have to go through before they before they can get
a job within a police department, is to screen out
these kinds of unsavory characters. I have a colleague that
does testing for police departments here in Los Angeles, and
(22:15):
so she does fitness for duty reviews, and she says
that there are a fair number of cadets who come
into her office and will all of a sudden start
talking about guns and how they love guns and they
have a stash of guns and they've been fascinated with
guns since they were little kids. And she will write
a letter to the police department and say, denied, don't
(22:36):
hire this person. Jay Scott just say, you know, you
definitely heard her mentioned death investigators. Okay, so I think
that's pretty much aimed right at You. Eticed that because
I remember and all the years that I prosecuted, I
would come across the cop and I would visualize I
(22:57):
could actually see them committing a murder. There was just
something snaps. And all the years they're devoted to crime
fighting and doing the right thing, they've been around criminals.
I sought a lot with defense attorneys. I'd be trying
to reach a defense attorney about a trial on Monday.
I'm like, where is he. Oh, he's down at Magic City,
(23:18):
this trip club with some of his clients. I'm like, okay,
not judging, but some of his cocaine clients at this
trip club. So my point is, when you start hanging
around with criminals, somehow, at first you're shocked. Then somehow
you become desensitized to it, and then after a while,
(23:39):
maybe to some people, it doesn't seem like such a
bad idea. Ashley, Yeah, I was gonna say, Nancy, I
see it often, unfortunately, and they do become immune to
it because they're absorbed into a world. But it first
is shocking and criminal, and then they're absorbed into a
think of well, this is the norm, this is what
I know of criminal defense attorney who only represents criminals
(24:00):
does become a little bit immune to and it's like,
this is the world I live in, and this is
what it is. It's quote unquote normal. And I do
think the same happens to officers law enforcement. No, it
doesn't mean they become criminal, but it does mean that
they live in an underbelly of a world that's very
different than the rest of us live in. And if
(24:20):
they have any predisposition, or if they have any not
good morals, that's really good English. I know I just used.
But if their morals are not good, then they can
cross that line and become the criminal themselves. And I've
seen it in court with criminal defendants. And another issue
to crime online got com investigate a reporter leave by page.
I mean the husband who rushed down the marriage aisle
(24:43):
as soon as his ex is found dead down with
the trash jumpster at the end of the driveway. He's
a judge or a former judge, and I assume that
police handled him with kid gloves because having been on
the bench. Asked Nancy. He was questioned immediately after Linda
(25:03):
Collins was found murdered that he was not considered a suspect.
You know it's ironic. As a senator, Colin Smith introduced
multiple bills to expand the places where concealed weapons could
be carried, and then ends up dead by gunshot wound.
You know, Joseph's got more guilty? Can I correct something? Yeah?
(25:25):
Jump in So earlier reports said that she was shot,
but in aff the davids that were released, it turned
out that she was not actually shot. She was actually
stabbed that multiple time. Yeah, for some reason, for some reason,
doctor Bethany, A stabbing seems so much more violent than
(25:45):
a shooting. What is that? I mean both ways you
end up dead. Well, stabbing is so intimate. I mean
when you stabbed somebody, you don't just want them dead,
say as a drive by shooting, where you want to
see your victim dropped to the ground. But there's nothing
personal in it other than that. When you use a knife,
(26:05):
it's extremely personal. And also you've gotten close enough if
you're in the victim's home to gain that person's trust.
You have to be close. If there was no sign
of a break in or a home invasion, This person
was in her home, this person knew her, This person
used a knife, and this person had intimate homicidal rage.
(26:29):
I know the husband was ruled out as a suspect,
but I think whoever did this did know her. And
as you know, the preponderance of murders are are committed
by our intimates, not by strangers, because it's in the
context of our most intimate relationships. As we often talk
about that humans experienced envy, rage, jealousy, rejection. And if
(26:51):
you look at her picture, Nancy, she's gorgeous, she's powerful,
she's at the peak of society. She's pasty, legislator, legislation
and bill. So there are a lot of people who
could envy her, admire her, stock her, or want a
piece of her, want to get close to her, want
to be intimate with her. It seems like there's a pool,
(27:13):
endless pool of people who either knew her because she
was powerful in society, or imagine they knew her and
wanted to be up close and personal in some way
Nancy relative to kind of Dovetailing with what Bethany said
regarding the knife trauma and how this is almost a
ripping to shreds of this individual, this gives us an
(27:35):
indication as to what condition the body was in when
a medical examiner does an initial assessment, or the police,
for instance, if that's who it was at the scene,
when they cannot differentiate between a gunshot wound and a
sharp force injury, that gives you an indication that they're
looking at something that's very muddled. It can either be
muddled by severe trauma or it can be muddled by decomposition,
(27:59):
where you have to give the body into a position
where you can examine it in very intense circumstances. They
like back at the problem. Bottom line, they stabbing was
so bad at first they thought it was a gunshot wound.
(28:25):
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, I want you to
listen now. We're talking about the murder of a gorgeous
young state senator. Take a listen to t J. Holmes
on GMA. A shocking mystery that turned heads news of
Arkansas police investigating a cold blooded killing of a former
(28:47):
state senator, Linda Colin Smith, who was found wrapped in
a blanket outside her home on June fourth. Police remained
tight lipped for days, but later they say they found
the suspect friend and former colleague Becky Lynn o'donald, who
was now facing charges of capital murder, abuse of Colin
Smith's body, and tampering with physical evidence. She is sad
(29:09):
that this is hurting her family, but she's angry and
she's strong. Who she met at whoever arrested her in
WHA o'donald is spending a second week in jail, and
her fiance, Tim Logan's claims police have made a huge
and inexplicable error. She has been arrested now for capital
murder and you and Becky don't have any idea why,
(29:35):
none whatsoever. Login says he was the one to break
the news to o'donald. I just told her they found
Linda dead and she collapsed. You are hearing our friends
at GMA, and speaking is the senator's aid, her right
hand fiance. That's who you're here speaking O'Donnell, her right arm,
(30:02):
Rebecca Lynn. O'Donnell had been this close to her for
so long, and now she's arrested for the senator's murderer.
Take a listen again to t J. Holmes. After O'Donnell's arrest,
Colin Smith's family was stunned, releasing a statement saying we
are sickened and upset that someone so close to Linda
(30:24):
would be involved in such a terrible, heartless crime. But
Logins is asking for help to clear his fiance's name,
saying he believes the real killer is still out there.
Has it crossed your mind for a moment, just in
some late night alone, were you questioned, well, maybe Becky
(30:45):
is capable of this. Becky's not capable of this. You
haven't had every question at all. No, I mean either
she is a best actress in the world and a
sociopath and completely fooled me. Well, there's not a chance
she did this, straight out to Levi page Clime online
dot Com investigative reporter Levi, who is Becky O'Donnell? So,
(31:10):
Rebecca Linn O'Donnell is Linda Collins friend and business manager
for her business, and she was the last person to
see Linda Collins alive. She dropped food lunched off at
her home May twenty eight, and security cameras set up
in the home captured her on the security camera and
(31:33):
it also captured her taking down security cameras in the
home as well. Wow. Okay cooy Siger thirty six years
Seattle PD twenty two of that on homicide. Why would
you go into a home and take down the video
recording cameras unless it was for a nefarious reason. Yeah,
in my business, we call that a clue, right. I mean,
(31:55):
it's obviously she didn't want to be paid inside the house.
And you know, I would also look at she was
her business manager. Maybe she was feeling from the business
and got caught and that's what started this whole thing.
I don't know, but that's that's interesting. I hadn't heard
that she was a business manager. And she's a friend
and yeah, me too, Doctor Bethany Marshall, do you remember
(32:19):
Selena up I was just looking at that beautiful, gorgeous
to Hannah Singer who was murdered by her number one
obsessive fan. Yes. Here, Rebecca Lena O'Donnell was all up
in Linda Collins Smith's business. Yes, and now she's charged
with murder. Yeah. So I think what we saw with
(32:39):
the head of the fan club for Selena's and what
we might be seeing with Rebecca Linn O'Donnell is Rebecca
might have been one of these kinds of women who
wanted to be the senator, admired the Senator, wanted to
gain proximity to Linda Collins Smith m put her on
(33:00):
a pedestal, idealized her, but then envied her all at
the same time. And in my field, we feel that
envy is the belief that if you have something good,
I have to destroy it because I don't believe that
you can have something good and I can have something
good and we can collaborate and create something good together.
(33:20):
So people who are envious always want to destroy the
object of their envy. And in this case, O'Donnell may
have has taken it to a murderous pathological level. But Nancy,
we don't think of females as being stalkers in this
kind of way. But it could be that this so
called business manager was putting her tentacles in everywhere, like
(33:41):
hoiz koid Steiger mentioned, Perhaps she was embezzling. Perhaps she
was thinking, Oh, you don't deserve this money after the
sale of this motel. This should be my money. I'm
the one who's done all this work for you. Why
are you benefiting? You shouldn't be in Congress, you shouldn't
be a senator. I should be there. I am the
more beautiful one, I'm the smarter one. So in a
(34:02):
way she has to block the senator out because she
can't stand the senator's success. No one in the inner
circle seems to believe that Becky O'Donnell could murder State
Senator Linda Collins Smith. Take a listen to ABC needs
correspondent Marcy Gonzalez new insight into the connection between a
former Arkansas state senator killed at her home and her
(34:26):
former campaign staff are arrested in connection. It comes as
a shock. Linda Collins Smith was found shot to death
on June fourth. Days later, Rebecca Lynn O'Donnell updated her
Facebook profile picture to this smiling image of them together.
Than Friday, without explanation, police took O'Donnell into custody. The
(34:47):
investigation is presently at a critical juncture and no further
informational way released at this time. ABC News Station KAI
reporting that O'Donnell recently appeared as a corroborating witness and
Colin Smith's divorce case. And we're told the two were
good friends. They were all fighters for the Second Amendment,
and so they would you know, you'd see them at events,
(35:10):
travel together. This weekend, family, friends and colleagues gathered for
Colin Smith's funeral, remembering her as a loving mother and
tough legislator. She was courageous, she was undaunted. I mean
a lot of the behind the scenes things and politics
that was so bad and quite frankly brutal. She would
keep fighting. But I don't understand is motive to leave
(35:32):
ipage Crime online dot Com investigative reporter. What do we
know about potential motive? Well, Nancy, a lot of people
think that money. Then maybe the motive here because Rebecca
Linn O'Donnell managed the business of that hotel where it
was sold as part of the divorce. And also, Nancy,
what we haven't mentioned is you played the audio of
Rebecca O'Donnell's fiance, Tim Logans. He actually was the power
(35:57):
of attorney for the murder victim, Linda Colin Smith. Guys,
when you don't know a horse, look at her track
record for those people. Steel insisting that Rebecca Lenn O'Donnell
aka Becky O'Donnell is innocent. Well, it ain't over yet.
Listen to this. I hope you're sitting down. Here's KLRT
(36:19):
Fox sixteen Mandy Noel. She's accused this morning of trying
to set up a murder from behind bars Rebecca O'Donnell
is in jail, now charged with murdering Linda Collins. On
top of the capital murder charge, Rebecca O'Donnell is now
facing two counts of solicitation to commit capital murder and
tampering with physical evidence. The new charges were filed in
(36:40):
Jackson County's Circuit Court. We're told four inmates say O'Donnell
talked to them about killing Collins's former husband and making
it look like a suicide. Investigators say O'Donnell wanted the
man's current wife to be killed too. Court documents claimed
she offered to pay the inmates in gold and over all.
(37:01):
This is happening from inside the Jackson County jail. Pay
them in gold and silver. You know, I always watched
those commercials on TV about getting gold instead of you know,
having a checking account. Where are you gonna bury it
in the backyard. She's gonna pay these people with gold
and silver. Okay, that's a whole other cannon worm spet
in a nut. I was Judas hyscarian, didn't Judas yes?
(37:25):
Leave page? Now she wants the ex husband and the
wife did yes, Nancy. So this started when she was
behind bars and she was talking to fellow inmate and
allegedly she was devising this plot to have Linda Collins
ex husband Bill Smith, a former judge, killed, and she said,
(37:45):
I want him to be killed, and I want you
to leave a suicide note behind, and I also want
you to kill his current wife to make it look
like a murder suicide. And they, she said, in their
home they have gold and silver worth about thirty grand.
Take that and that would be your reward. Well, you
(38:06):
know what, I guess one dead body was not enough
for her. We wait as justice unfalls. Nancy Grace climbs story,
signing off Goodbye friend,
Host
Nancy Grace
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