March 13, 2024 • 46 mins
Julia Niswender's roommates are gone for the weekend, but then one stops by the apartment on Monday to pick up some things for class.
She heads out without seeing or talking to Julia. The next day the roommate realizes she hasn't seen or talked to Julia in two days. The bedroom door is locked so she calls security at the apartment complex to check on her roommate. The guard shows up with police, and using a master key to open the door, walks into Julia Niswender's room. It appears as if a home invasion has taken place.
Calling out for Julia and getting no reply, the officer walks toward the bathroom door, finding a pair of white latex gloves on the floor in front of the bathroom door. They are twisted and intertwined with each other.
Opening the bathroom door, officers discover Julia's lifeless, nude body, face down submerged in the bathtub filled with water. Her hands are pulled behind her back, her feet are together, and her cell phone is found underneath her body. Niswender's clothes have been cut off, except for a sleeve, and are left on the bathroom floor.
Niswender's room looks like it has been tossed. Clothes are all over the floor of the room, drawers are left open, contents from a plastic organizer drawer have been dumped on the floor, and the contents of Niswender's purse is dumped out onto her bed.
A black-and-white zebra-striped pillowcase is missing from a pillow, her keys to the apartment are missing from a lanyard, and police note that it looks like a home invasion took place, but wrapped Christmas presents, an iPod, computer, and tv are not taken from the room.
The night her body is found, officers note how her mother is pacing back and forth at the police station, while her stepfather seems stoic as he sits in the lobby.
The first of several red flags that led investigators to take a closer look at Jim Turnquist. Looking at Turnquist, the police ask for his laptop, and he complies, they ask for a polygraph, and he complies twice, and passes twice. Investigators consult with the FBI and are encouraged to take a good look at Turnquist. Turnquist is named a Person of Interest, and he is charged, and not in the death of Julia Niswender, but in child pornography.
There are 300,000 pictures on his laptop, 7 of which lead to charges of child porn. At trial, experts testified the 7 photos are in temp folders and could have been pop-up ads, and you can't even tell the age of the people in the pictures.
Turnquist is acquitted of the child porn charges. The murder case of Julia Niswender turns cold.
Joining Nancy Grace Today:
- Kim Turnquist - Julia’s mother, Facebook: Justice for Julia Niswender
- Madison Turnquist - Julia’s younger sister
- Dale Carson – Criminal Defense Attorney (Jacksonville), Former FBI Agent, Former Police Officer, Author: “Arrest-Proof Yourself;” X: @DaleCarsonLaw
- Caryn L. Stark – Psychologist, Renowned TV and Radio Trauma Expert and Consultant; Instagram: carynpsych/FB: Caryn Stark Private Practice
- Jason Jensen – Private Investigator (Jensen Private Investigations), Cold Case Expert (Salt Lake City, UT), and Co-founder: “Cold Case Coalition;” Investigations; X: @JasonJPI, Facebook/Instagram: “Jensen Investigations”
- Joe Scott Morgan – Professor of Forensics: Jacksonville State University, Author, “Blood Beneath My Feet,” and Host: “Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan;” Twitter/X: @JoScottForensic
- Ronnie Dahl (Metro Detroit) Investigative Journalist, Private Investigator and Owner of Ronnie Dahl
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
How does a beautiful young girl end up murdered dead
in her own bathtub, the apple of her family's eye,
and still no justice? As the days pass, as the
week's past, as the months pass, Julia's family wonders.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Why, and so do I. I'm Nancy Grace. This is
Crime Stories.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Thank you for being with us here at Crime Stories
and on Serious XM one eleven. First of all, listen
to this.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
Both of Julia Niewinder's roommates have been gone for the weekend,
and when one of the roommates stops by Monday morning
to pick up some things for class that day, she
hears the alarm going off in Julia Nicewinder's bedroom and
heads out without seeing or talking to her. The next day,
the roommate realizes she hasn't seen or talked to Julia
(01:14):
in two days. Her bedroom door is locked, so she
calls security at the apartment complex to check on her roommate.
The guard shows up with police and using a master
key to open the door, they walk into Julia Nicewinder's room.
It appears as if a home invasion has taken place.
Calling out for Julia and getting no reply, the officer
(01:36):
walks toward the bathroom door. A pair of white latex
gloves are on the floor in front of the bathroom door.
They are twisted and intertwined with each other.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Just as if somebody had been taking them off and
threw them down.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
What happened to Julia? And why still no justice?
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Joining me in all star panel, But first to Julia's mother,
him Turnquist.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Miss Turnquist, thank you for being with us. Thank you,
miss Turnquist.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
It has been horrible and seemingly never ending journey for
you getting justice for Julia.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
I want you to think back to the moment.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
You found out that your girl, just beautiful, young girl,
had been killed.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
What happened?
Speaker 4 (02:28):
Well, I actually found out because she didn't show up
to her work Christmas party. And my one of my
best friends worked with her boss, and they had said
that Julia didn't show up for the Christmas party and
that friends had stopped over at her place and her
car was home, but Julia wasn't home. That one of
(02:51):
the roommates said, yeah, I haven't seen her all day,
she's not you know, So they so they went on
their way. Well, then when my friend called me and said, hey, Kim,
you know, I got a call that no one's seen
Julia and that she didn't show up for work, and
she typically does not just not show up for work.
(03:12):
And I and she said, where are you at? Well,
me and Jennifer, her twin, we were actually playing at
darts on a dart league and she I told her
where I was, and she came and picked us up,
and we kept trying to call Julia on her way
from Monroe to Ipsilanti, which is can be about a
forty five minute drive, and her cell phone was going
(03:34):
right to voicemail. So then we actually called one of
Jennifer's friends who's lived on campus, which was right across
the street from Julia's apartment, and we asked her to
go over there and check on her. So she In
the meantime, the roommate had the security guard and the
cops there, and then Rachel got there and she called
(03:55):
us and said, Kim, I'm given the EMP your phone
number because they want to talk to you. And I'm
like what.
Speaker 5 (04:02):
So me and.
Speaker 4 (04:02):
Jennifer were obviously freaking out, and so then they called
me and they asked me if Julia had any medical issues,
and I said, yes, she has a cardio neurosyncope, which
is something I have and Jennifer has, which causes your
blood pressure to drop it and you could just pass
right out, but then you can come to it after
(04:23):
a few minutes. And he said okay, and I said,
why what's going on? And he goes, he goes, I'll
call you back. Well, they never called us back. We
got up there, and when we got up there, we
seen the EMP but no lights were on, so there
was just a brief moment that we were like, Okay,
the lights aren't on, so nothing's really wrong. But then
there was a security guard standing there and me and
(04:46):
Jennifer just ran right into Julia's apartment and we didn't
see anybody. And her apartment was at the back of
the apartment in the corner, and so when we ran down,
when we ran down the hallway, I went to open
the door, and when we went to stuff in, we
could see that there was stuff on the floor. But
(05:07):
then a cop came out of the bathroom area and
pushed us into the kitchen area, and we said, you know,
what's going on with Julia? You know, we want to
see her that, you know, And of course Jennifer ring
or twin was really freaking out and he said to
us and he said, you can't see her. She's deceased.
And Jennifer just ran out of the apartment. I like,
(05:30):
sell to the floor. I was like punching things. I
was upset. I was freaking out. I'm like, you're you're you're,
you're lying and you know, and he's like no, he goes,
she's deceased, and and I just I lost it. And
then at that moment, because on our way up there,
we had called Jim, which at the time was my husband,
(05:52):
and him and Madison were on their way up there
because you know, we didn't know what was going on
with Julia and no one had heard from her two days,
so we uh so everyone was kind of on their
way up there, and uh when my husband at the
time came into the apartment, uh, he said, what's going
on And the officer goes, well, your daughter is deceased,
(06:13):
and we all just lost it, you know, and and uh,
you know, we had to go out and tell Madison,
who was ten years old at the time, that her
sister was, you know, it was dead, and it was
just it was it was the worst. It was the
worst moment.
Speaker 6 (06:30):
And I.
Speaker 4 (06:33):
It to talk about it even it just it brings
everything right back to that exact moment that like I
in my mind, I I relived that moment all the time,
and you know, and I then I get mad and
angry and and uh, you know, and I just start crying.
And you know, she was Julia was definitely special and
(06:57):
her family meant everything to her. And it was right
before Christmas. Christmas was her favorite holiday. She was so
excited that, you know, she was finally at an age
and had a job that she could buy her family
Christmas presents, you know, and and she she just was
so excited for Christmas. That year, me and me and
(07:19):
Jim had gone out got a real Christmas tree. It
was our first real Christmas tree. And Julia was more
excited than anybody about the real Christmas tree and decorating it.
And we always decorated our Christmas tree, you know, when
all of us could be there and have hot chocolate,
and you know, we had already we had already done
that when she was home the weekend before, so we
(07:43):
got to you know, have that last memory with her.
But it's definitely, uh, it's I yeah, I to talk
about it sometimes just you know is real upsetting, But
I also want to talk about it because I want
to keep her story alive. I don't want anyone to
forget her. I want everyone to know that this case
(08:06):
is still unsolved and it's been eleven years too long,
that we need some answers more for Julia than us,
But I really want justice for Julia. She deserves it.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Guys, you are hearing Julia's mom, Kim Turnquist, and I
want you to know that Kim is battling leukemia on
top of everything else, and she is with us today
to ask for your help in solving her Girls Martyr.
(08:42):
Also with us is Madison Turnquist. This is Julia's little sister, Madison.
Thank you for being with us.
Speaker 7 (08:50):
Dear, thank you for having us today.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Madison, hear your mom, Kim, Stay how awful it is
to retell the story. I feel the same way when
people just out of the blue asked me about my
fiancee murder. I hate that, but yet I will tell
it if I feel like I need to tell it,
or if I have to tell it in some way
(09:16):
to help someone. Can you tell me, Madison, about the
moment you learned your big sister had been killed.
Speaker 7 (09:28):
Can I can replay it exactly how it happened eleven
years ago, So say, as you guys already heard the
first you know, beginning from my mom. But to go
a little back to when she had said that, Jennifer
ran out of the room, Jennifer actually ran to me
(09:48):
in my dad's truck. So at that time, I was
sitting in the truck with my mom's two best friends
when Jennifer had run out to me and she had
run out, she was balling. She hugged me that I
love you.
Speaker 8 (10:03):
And I had no idea what was going on still
at that moment, and she did that, and then she
had walked away. I don't know if she went to
go find my mom or I don't I just I
don't know what had happened in that moment, but she
walked away, and then I've seen my mom and my
dad walking back. So my mom's two friends got out
(10:25):
of the truck and my mom and my dad got
in the truck and it was just I believe it
was like a Toyota style truck at the time. So
my dad just had like that one seat bench with
the driver passenger it and the little seat in the
middle and I was in the little seat in the
middle and right in front of me dashboard. Mom's on
(10:47):
the right of me, my dad's on the left.
Speaker 9 (10:50):
And it was quiet for like the first five minutes
in the truck and now, so back then I didn't know,
but now I know that was them trying to figure
out how they were going to tell me because I
was ten years old and they had to figure out
how they're going to tell me in a way that
I'm going to understand what they're telling me. When I
(11:11):
was two years old, my uncle had committed suicide and
that growing up, that affected me a lot, just because
you know, I want I would. I wanted to know
who my uncle was and never had the chance to.
So when my parents told me, my mom grabbed my
hand and my dad looked at me and said, your
(11:34):
sister is safe.
Speaker 8 (11:35):
With your uncle, Jeff. I didn't cry, I didn't scream.
All I could do was punch my dad's radio. And
that's that's the only reaction that I had because at
ten years old, I know what they're saying to me.
I know what they meant when they said that.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
Now as you are hearing Madison Turnquist, Julia's little sister,
and Kim Turnquist, her mother, describing the moment they find
out their girl, their big sister, has been killed, her
body dumped in her apartment bathtub. Now, this apartment was
(12:33):
an off campus apartment there at Eastern Michigan University. This girl,
Julia scrubbed in sunshine, beautiful, sweet, not some wild party girl,
never had an arrest, never run away from home, so
(12:54):
excited about having her very first Christmas tree and her
very own off campus apartment. Now, how in the hey
does this case go unsolved? In addition to Kim and
Madison joining US an all star panel, first two, Ronnie
(13:15):
Dahl joining US investigative journalists and private investigator, owner of
Doll Investigations.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
Ronnie, what do you make of it when.
Speaker 10 (13:26):
You're a reporter and you get called to these stories?
There are so many questions that you're trying to get covered. Obviously,
it's who, what, when? Where? Eastern Michigan University is about
twenty thousand students, A lot of them are commuter students,
and as you know, this happened off campus, so there
(13:49):
weren't a lot of people on campus at the time.
It was around exam time.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
Oh my goodness, Ronnie Dahl, you're reminding me so much
of the Idaho for Slaves and Moscow, Idaho. Were four
students and an off campus home they rented it. When
I say off campus, I mean right across the street.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
I've been there. You look right at Fraternity Row.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
When I say off campus, it's literally in the shadow
of campus. So it's very very close to campus. And
you said twenty thousand students.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Go ahead, Ronnie, and.
Speaker 10 (14:26):
You know the city. Since this was off campus, it
falls to the jurisdiction of the Ipsilanti Police department. So
it's a smaller police department. I don't even think at
that time they maybe had fifty employees. Half of that's
the police officers. So when the city itself, the population
is about the same as that of the university, right,
(14:49):
so you have to go to the jurisdiction. So Ipsilanti
Police they're handling the investigation, and pretty much from the
beginning they were pretty tight lipped on what was happening
in this case. Sin they have remained that way all
these years later.
Speaker 2 (15:05):
Guys, what do we know about the attack? Take a
listen to Sidney Sumner Crime online dot com.
Speaker 11 (15:13):
Nice Winder's room looks like it has been tossed closer
all over the floor of the room. Drawers are left open.
The contents from a plastic organizer drawer have been dumped
on the floor. The contents of Nice Winter's purse also
dumped out on her bed, and some items are missing too.
A black and white zebra striped pillowcase is missing off
the pillow. Her keys to the apartment are missing from
(15:35):
a lanyard, and police note that it looks like a
home invasion took place, but wrapped Christmas presents and iPod,
computer and TV are not taken from the room.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
So why to Jason Jensen joining us?
Speaker 2 (15:49):
Jason is private investigator, owner of Jensen Private Investigations and
co founder of the Cold Case Coalition. You can find
Jason at Jensenprivate Investigations dot com.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
Jason, thank you for being with us. I want to
absorb what we're just hearing.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
And guys, we're back at ground zero, square one, trying
to solve the murder of this beautiful young co ed
murdered in her off campus apartment. Did you hear that,
Jason and lonlike everything had been dumped on the floor
but what's really missing the keys to the apartment, and
(16:26):
police note that there were unwrapped gifts and iPod, computer
and TV still there.
Speaker 12 (16:31):
Right, It definitely does not sound like it was a
home invasion for a robbery. It sounds like there was
a targeting of Julia herself, which indicates strongly because like
the pillowcases missing and her keys are gone.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
And to me to just got mortgage joining US Professor Forensics,
Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on
Amazon and host of Bodyback with jsm also death investigator.
He has investigated over one thousand death scenes.
Speaker 1 (17:08):
Scott, is it staged?
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Did someone come to kill Julia and they then make
the place look ransacked?
Speaker 13 (17:16):
That's certainly a possibility because you know, if you look
at the inventory of the items that had had been
left behind, there's nothing of significance missing here. Things are there.
But yet you get this idea that someone went through
and rifled the area. And we see this lots of
times with staging cases, so that leads you to this idea.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
I mean, Joe Scott, you've turned on the TV, haven't you.
Every time there is a homicide depicted, that's always staged,
They tear the room.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
Up, They act like someone came in to steal something.
When that's staging. Staging the scene.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Del Carson high profile all you're out of Jacksonville, joining
us and more importantly for my purposes, former FBI and
former beatcop in Miami Dade.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
You can find them at.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
Dell Carsonlaw dot Comdale Staging is normally done by someone
that knows the victim, who is trying to make it
look as if it was a random attack.
Speaker 6 (18:20):
Yeah, but there are a couple of things going on here,
and Joe will back me up on this. You know,
this could be somebody gathering a crophy, or from my perspective,
this is somebody removing items that connect that individual to
that lady.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
It's the missing pillow case to be used as a sack.
Speaker 6 (18:38):
You throw stuff in there in order to get it out,
and that things are missing that no one would expect
to be there. And there's more. When people die in bathtubs,
the mistake of uninitiated law enforcement is to drain the
tub in order to get the victim out. And what
Joe and I can both tell you is that once
you've done that, you've lost a considerable amount of evidence
(19:01):
down the drain. And I've seen this happen on at
least two occasions in my FBI and my police career
in Miami, and so you'll lose that evidence. So that
takes somebody with some sophistications who recognizes that when you
put somebody in the water, you're taking away important evidence. Now,
maybe they didn't get at all, but it's an effort
(19:23):
and it shows some sophistication that's sort of unusual.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
We believe that this occurred in the early early morning hours.
Kim Turquis is Julia's mom. Were there any items of
note missing other than the pillow case, her.
Speaker 4 (19:41):
Keys, which, like we said, on the lanyard, which have
a key to her bedroom, and then we have the
pillow case, and then we have they said that there
was a purple rug missing from the bathroom because the
bathroom that was zebra and a bright purple, and so
(20:05):
they said that the rug was missing. I don't know,
to be honest, I know that when we went to
when we were we're allowed to clean up her go
clean up her apartment, I'll be honest, we didn't pay
much attention to what was still there and what wasn't
because we were all obviously very upset and crying and
(20:27):
it was a really emotional time. But you know, we
do know that one of the plastic drawers is missing too,
but we don't know what it was in it.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
Did she have any valuable jewelry that you know of
that was missing.
Speaker 4 (20:40):
No, her check book was still there, her credit cards, everything,
we're still.
Speaker 13 (20:45):
In her room, Nancy. I think that one of the
questions I would ask is were there any items of
clothing missing as well from the scene that were tied
back to her, because that's that might be inevident. So
the trophy taker names.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
Kim tarquas anything.
Speaker 4 (21:03):
We're not sure what was in that drawer that is missing,
So we're not.
Speaker 1 (21:09):
Sure, Okay, what kind of drawer?
Speaker 6 (21:10):
Was it?
Speaker 4 (21:11):
A ster a light drawer, one of those bigger three
compartments STERI light drawers.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
Oh, like the packable plastic ones. Yeah, Nancy, Yeah, jump in.
Speaker 6 (21:19):
If the drawer is missing, that's an important clue, because
that too, is unusual and it may reflect that the
hand the gloves were taken off, grabbed that put fingerprints
and DNA on it, and then took it with them
when they realized that they didn't have the gloves on
when they were actually doing tossing the apartment.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
Okay, can we talk about something just for a moment.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Who wears gloves to a crime of opportunity? Like you're
watching Julia and you say I'm going to sex attack her,
you break into her place, and you happen to have
gloves with you.
Speaker 6 (21:55):
Yeah, who wears a mask?
Speaker 14 (21:59):
Yes?
Speaker 6 (22:00):
And the reason you wear a mask is see it
can be identified.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
What I'm saying is this wasn't planned out, Joe Scott. No,
I mean it was planned out to bring gloves.
Speaker 13 (22:10):
Yeah, you don't show up randomly with latex gloves. And
to Dale's point, I find it fascinating with this case
that you talk about preparedness when you show up, you
show up with the gloves, and not just that, but
also there's a level of sophistication when you think about
the bathtub in and of itself, Well, what do you
(22:30):
do in the bathtub? Normally in life you get in
the bathtub to get clean. So could this person have
been sophisticated enough in order to facilitate that, or at
least think about facilitating that cleaning her so that none
of his DNA is left behind too.
Speaker 1 (22:46):
Karen L.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
Stark, joining US high profile psychologist for renow on TV
and radio trauma expert. You can find her at Karenstark
dot com. That's Karen with the Sea. Karen, what do
you make of the scene. It was totally ransacked, but
yet nothing of value was taken.
Speaker 5 (23:04):
There is no doubt in my mind, Nancy, that what
Joe and Dale are saying is absolutely correct. I believe
that this is someone who knew he had time, who
planned how he was going to do this, who made
it look like absolutely this was just, you know, a
(23:24):
robbery or a spontaneous break in. And I think it's
really interesting that those draws are missing that I wonder
what kind of trophies he was able to take, because
that reminds me of something that would happen in a
scene like this, where the person who killed her would
(23:45):
want to have things that belonged to her to remember
and relive the scene, which you can be sure happened
over and over again.
Speaker 2 (23:54):
To Ronnie Dahl, joining US investigative journalist and PI Ronnie
Dall Investigation dot Com.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
I understand that.
Speaker 2 (24:02):
The cause of death was asphyxiation and drowning. Detectas noted
originally that she was partially nude in the bathtub in
a very unnatural position.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
What does that mean, Ronnie Dall.
Speaker 10 (24:21):
You know, I can tell you in the beginning of
this case, they did not release that information. It was
it was months and months later before that information came out.
At first, they were saying it didn't appear to be
any trauma to the body, so part of that could
have been part of these investigations. They don't want to
(24:42):
release information in the beginning while they're still trying to
collect the evidence. But you have to remember this is
a small town. Half of the town's population is college students,
so as the investigation goes on, I don't think we
even found a lot of these details out until two fifteen,
and that was when some of this information came out
(25:03):
in an affric David for when they were trying to
arrest the father, Jim Turnquest. So it was a long
time before we found out some of this information.
Speaker 2 (25:14):
Joining me is Kim Turnquist, Julia's mom and her sister,
Madison Turnquist. I'm curious, miss Turnquist, when they say she
your daughter, Julia was in an unnatural position, what do
they mean by that well.
Speaker 4 (25:30):
From what I was told, she was partially nude and
her legs were like slipped up. It was like almost
like your swimming on your stomach and your legs you kind.
Speaker 15 (25:46):
Of laying in a bound position.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
Laying in a bound position. Is that what you're saying?
Speaker 9 (25:52):
Yep, hands behind your back, legs bent up.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
Got it? Got it?
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Yes, an unusual position. Everybody jump in if you have
a thought on this. But to you, just Scott Morgan,
I find it very, very difficult to believe that DNA
cannot be obtained from inside the insides of plastic gloves
or when those bindings were put on her hands, her wrists.
(26:19):
When you tie something, you have to touch it, especially
inside the knots. Where's all that evidence? Has it been
compared for DNA in the system.
Speaker 4 (26:31):
What we were told was that two DNAs were collected
from her, one from the glove, well, one from the
glove that she had blood in that They think that
if that maybe whoever it was, went to try to
shut Julia up or something and she bit down on
her bit down and drew blood from her lips. And
(26:53):
then they said that they found two male DNA on
her inner side. One was inconclusive and the other one
has a supposedly matched anybody in codis That's what we
were told.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Time stories with Nancy Grace, Joscott Morgan, Ronnie Dall.
Speaker 1 (27:23):
Somebody jump in, explain to me about the DNA. Has
the DNA all of.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
It be subjected to the most recent technology DNA comparisons
such as genetic family tree DNA or touch DNA.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
What do we know.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
About the DNA tests done on the DNA found at
the scene, Ronnie Dall, what do you know?
Speaker 10 (27:49):
So that's part of the problem with this case is
even you know, ten eleven years later, you try to
put in for your Freedom of Information Act requests to
try to get some of this information and they're not
releasing it. But so really all we have to go
on is what has been told to the family and
what's coming from a retired detective and what was in
(28:10):
that affidavit for the search warrant And so the DNA
from my understanding was to ask him mentioned you had
the two from two unknown male subjects that they have
not been able to place. Yes, yet, I don't know
how much DNA they do have. I know that all
the evidence is being processed by the Michigan State Police
(28:32):
Crime Lab. But you know they do hold on to
that evidence with the new technology.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
An you said, Ronnie Dall is being processed or it
was processed well, or it was processed.
Speaker 10 (28:45):
The status of where this investigation is today, you don't
get any updates out of the police department.
Speaker 1 (28:52):
Thank you question today.
Speaker 13 (28:54):
One of my questions, Nancy, when you know we're talking
about has been examined. I hope that they still have
retained a significant amount of DNA that can be tested.
You'd mentioned genetic DNA testing just a moment ago. Remember
compared to twenty twelve, this is relatively new technology light
years Yeah, it is. And you know, look, if this
(29:18):
individual is not in CODIS, which there's two categories in CODUS,
you have nones and then you have what's referred to
as the forensic database, that's unknowns that are out there.
So after that, the next leap is either phenotyping if
they're willing to do that, where you can come up
with a physical description of the individual, and or you
(29:39):
then plug it into a genetic database to try to see,
you know, the familial tree.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
You know, I'm not even sure Jo Scott if they
were using mitochondrial DNA matches in twenty twelve. So if
you could even get part of the DNA, you can
make it matched on the mother's side. Yes, you can,
don't necessarily need. You can use like a hair, you
don't need the hair in nucleus. There's been so many
advances since twenty twelve, it's like light ears ahead. What
(30:08):
more do we know about how Julia was found dead?
Speaker 1 (30:12):
Listen to Rachel Benia Crime Online.
Speaker 16 (30:15):
Opening the bathroom door, officers discovered Julia's lifeless, nude body,
face down, submerged in the bathtub filled with water. Her
hands are pulled behind her back, her feet are together,
and her cell phone is found underneath her body. Nice winterers.
Clothes have been cut off except for a sleeve and
are left on the bathroom floor. Police don't find the
instrument used to cut the clothes from her body.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
Okay, I want to circle back to what we're hearing
Joe Scott Morgan. How would her body being submerged in
the bathtub water affect the recovery of DNA.
Speaker 13 (30:47):
Well, there's a flushing that goes on, isn't there, Nancy?
When if there is? Okay, let's just say that you
have topical DNA, you have a deposition of say forgive me,
but semen on the body or if even there's blood,
it can be compromised externally, you know, depended upon how
long she was in the water, if there was any
(31:08):
attempt to clean her in the water. Now, when we
get to this idea of perhaps a rape kit, that's internal,
so hopefully something could be found within there, But it
sounds like they're not having success in that.
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Well, they have to get DNA from somewhere. They got
it from the gloves and her inner thigh.
Speaker 13 (31:27):
Coming out of the glove and on the inner thigh.
Isn't that fascinating considering that she was submerged in water. Nancy,
one more thing about this that is really striking out
of all the cases that I've covered and worked in
my career, do you realize how rare homicidal drowning is
very rare. It's not something that occurs on a regular basis.
(31:48):
And this is a this goes to a degree of
violence that you don't normally see because you know, what
they're talking about is that her tongue is actually lacerated.
That gives you an idea that she was forced or
held beneath the water. She bit her own tongue, is
what they're opining, but and nobody does that. Normally, you
(32:08):
can bite your tongue as you're eating something. But I
think that she was held underwater and she bit her
tongue as a result of this force, and it last
rated her tongue. You've got a lot going on here,
and somebody has really really thought this through.
Speaker 2 (32:21):
To Ronnie Dahl joining US private investigator and investigative reporter, Ronnie,
what can you tell me about potential video of the perp.
Speaker 10 (32:31):
Well, that's one of the first things you do, especially
if you're in a small community near a college campus,
as you're looking for a video. But again twenty twelve,
we don't have the security cameras and the number of
security cameras that are around today. There was a video
from the apartment complex and from my understanding, the around
(32:52):
five point thirty in the morning I believe on December ninth.
The video did show an individual that was standing out
in the parking line near the trash dumpster, which was
close to Julia's apartment. The individual was seeing kind of
frustrated walking back and forth, pacing back and forth, back
and forth, but when police went back to get the video,
(33:16):
they didn't pull it right away and unpertly the video
was recorded over.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
How many times is that going to happen?
Speaker 2 (33:25):
It first came to light in the Chandra Levy case,
where the video in her high rise in DC recorded over,
So we didn't know when she left, what was she wearing,
was she going jogging, was she dressed up? Was she
with anybody? But yet it's still happening. They recorded over
the video. It's been reported there was an individual a
mail pacing back and forth and back and forth near
(33:48):
the trash cans at the apartment. And isn't it true
Kim Turnquist that apparently Julian went out to empty the trash.
Speaker 4 (33:56):
Well, that's what that's what there. That's what we were
told is that that Julia woke up that day, obviously
got ready for school, and made herself some breakfast, because
they did find eggs in her stomach, and then it
appeared that she had taken her garbage out, So they
their theory to us was that they think she took
(34:17):
her garbage out and then she was followed in her apartment,
so that's how the person got got in. There's no
forced entry, but they think that they followed her in
when she went back into her apartment. I do want
to say too, that we did learn that they now
(34:37):
which didn't release to us before, that they think that
the theory is is that Julia was tortured all day long.
That this wasn't just a few hours that they followed
her in in the morning and that person didn't leave
until nighttime, so she had been in her room and
pretty much had been tortured all day.
Speaker 1 (34:58):
Well, where was the roommate in the room? May have
been in and out during that time.
Speaker 4 (35:03):
From what we were told, the one roommate was, but
she didn't hear anything, and the other one wasn't still there.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
That doesn't make sense to me that she was held
and tortured all day long and the roommate was there
and didn't hear or see anything. But yeah, I mean,
nothing is out of consideration right now because it's been
this long and still no answers. Another thing we must
(35:30):
address this.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
Listen to Dave Mack.
Speaker 14 (35:33):
The night julian Ice Winder's body has found. Officer's note
how her mother is pacing back and forth at the
police station while her stepfather seems stoic as he sits
in the lobby, the first of several red flags that
lead investigators to take a closer look at Jim Turnquist.
Looking at Turnquist, the police asked for his laptop. He complies.
They ask for a polygraph. He complies twice and passes twice.
(35:55):
Investigators consult with the FBI and her encourage to take
a good look at Jim Turnquist. Ternquist is named a
person of interest and he's charged not in the death
of Julian nice Winder, but child pornography. There are three
hundred thousand pictures on his laptop, seven of which lead
to charges of child porn. At trial, experts testify the
seven photos are in timp folders and could have been
(36:17):
pop up ads. You can't even tell the age of
the people in the pictures. Turnquist is acquitted of the
child porn charges, but nothing has moved forward on the
murder of Julia Nicewinder.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
To Julia's mom, Kim Turnquist, what do you make of
them them charging your then husband? Isn't it true you
gave him a rock solid alibi for the time during
which Julie was killed.
Speaker 4 (36:43):
Yes, so here's that whole thing? Is so absurd. So
we live in Monroe, which I said earlier is about
forty five minute drives. And let me tell you, yes,
I'm I'm a person who gets up in the middle
of the night all the time. Jim was home with me,
sleeping in the bed with me, got up that same
(37:05):
morning to go to work like he usually does. I
did the same thing. He was home all night long
and all this The story with Jim is just absurd.
I you know, I never I just I couldn't believe
what they were trying to do to him. And I'll
be honest, the firstly detective on the case, he is
(37:27):
the one who has spoken up recently. The other one
is the one who tried to do all this stuff,
who had I hate to say it this way, but
I think she had heard Jim. She just wanted to
solve the case, to put another salt case in her pocket.
This child pornography was absolutely ludicrous to even charge him
(37:51):
with that. I still get very upset with that because
you know, it has affected all of our lie in
different ways, and mainly Gems, because people accused him of
these things, and I think that it's just it's ridiculous.
They wanted to find someone to pin this murder on.
(38:14):
And that's what they did.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
Didn't a friend of Julius state that mister Tarnquist had
made advances.
Speaker 4 (38:21):
On her, you know what. So that's what they said.
But then when you talked to her, she said that
she had never said that, that she would testify to
that if had to. That that was never said. And unfortunately,
during that time, my family was torn apart because the
police were telling my family certain things and making my
(38:45):
family believe that, you know, all these things were going
on and they weren't.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
Guys.
Speaker 2 (38:50):
I want to address what we do know. We know
that the father, mister Tronquist, wi suspected he was a
person of interest. He passed two polygraphs and was found
not guilty by a jury on other charges of child
porn seven photos out of hundreds and hundreds and hundreds
(39:10):
of photos.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
What does that mean.
Speaker 2 (39:12):
I've never had child porn pop up on my computer,
but a jury found him not guilty.
Speaker 1 (39:19):
Now what do we know?
Speaker 2 (39:21):
We know his wife and his daughters gave him an
alibi and that they lived a good distance away from
the crime scene. That said, who killed Julia? I guarantee
you this. I guarantee you that male DNA and those
(39:42):
gloves have been run against the stepdad.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
You agree with that, Joe.
Speaker 13 (39:47):
Scott, Yes, I agreed.
Speaker 1 (39:49):
So I mean, I don't care what he did before.
Speaker 2 (39:52):
I don't care if he was guilty or innocent on
anything before. All I care about is who ca Julia,
Kim Madison? Anybody on this panel? Do you know if
they ran the DNA panel from the crime saint against
the step dad?
Speaker 1 (40:08):
Yes or no?
Speaker 12 (40:09):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (40:09):
Okay? Who's speaking? Is this Madison or Kim Kim? Okay?
If they got a match on that, he would be charged.
Speaker 4 (40:16):
It has totally changed changed our lives. Everyone who you know,
every family member that has been touched by this. You know,
our life is not the same without Julia. Family was
really important to her, and you know, and then as
(40:36):
you heard all the other accusations from twenty fifteen, you
want to talk about, you know, losing a daughter to
a murder and no one being arrested, and then you have,
you know, people trying to accuse at the time your
husband of something that.
Speaker 9 (40:55):
He would never ever do, and you have.
Speaker 4 (40:58):
To deal with all the public when you know, saying
things about you, whispering behind your back. We got we
got death threats. You know, you know your youngest child,
Remember she was ten in twenty twelve, so she was
thirteen in twenty fifteen going to school and dealing with
kids saying things like it had totally changed our whole
(41:23):
lives in so many different ways, and you know that
things will never be the same. I still to this
day will get messages and accusing people of things and
they just people can be cruel and you're trying to
deal with the death of your daughter, and you know,
deal with that. And now the fact that it's eleven
(41:45):
years and it hasn't been solved, and you know, for
a while there under old management at the IFC Police Department,
you know, you weren't getting any cooperation, you weren't getting
getting any communication. And now we are in talks with
the new chief, which we are happy about. He communicates
(42:08):
to us and we really think that with this chief
in place, that we will have a good chance of
getting some assistance, that he won't be afraid to ask
for assistance, and that Julia's case may finally get solved.
So but it is affect. It has changed our lives
in so many ways, so many ways.
Speaker 9 (42:30):
Well, nobody really underd truly understands what it does to
the ten year old that has to grow up, you know, now,
being I'm.
Speaker 17 (42:37):
Twenty one now, nobody.
Speaker 9 (42:40):
Asked me when I was a kid, you know how
I felt, how all of it affected me. Yeah, changed,
It changed.
Speaker 15 (42:48):
My life a lot.
Speaker 8 (42:49):
My sisters.
Speaker 9 (42:51):
I was a little sister, but I was the protector
over my sisters. The last thing that I did with
Julia will spend you know, little sieves weekend.
Speaker 15 (43:00):
With her and you know, build, not build, but create,
you know.
Speaker 9 (43:05):
A heart on her wall made out of you know photos.
Speaker 15 (43:10):
She was my biggest supporter.
Speaker 9 (43:12):
She anytime that I come around is oh my god,
my little sister, my little sister. That she would you know,
introduce me to all her friends. I was like, I
literally felt like a famous person when I was hanging
out with my sister when everything had happened. After she
passed away, I kind of became a support system for
(43:34):
the family because you know, I have a mom who
I have parents that are dealing with the grief of
their child, and then I have my other sister who
is grieving the loss of her twins.
Speaker 15 (43:44):
And so I spent a lot of you know, the
first you.
Speaker 9 (43:49):
Know, six years of Julia's murder being you know, a
support system to my family. It wasn't until I was
sixteen that I went to my parents and said, I
need help. I need to go to counseling. I need
to agree with my sister in the right way. And
I still grieve her. There are so many things now
in my life, being twenty one, that I would want
(44:10):
to have my sister here for.
Speaker 15 (44:12):
I graduated high school.
Speaker 9 (44:14):
When I wanted to drop out because of everything that
I went through with her, with her murder and accuse,
the false accusations on my dad. I was ready to
drop out in the sixth grade. Through I graduated high school.
I started a trade school college two to three months
after I graduated high school. A matter of fact, I
(44:36):
graduated high school four months early compared to everybody else.
Speaker 17 (44:41):
But my sister wasn't here for that, and she should
have been. My sister would have been screaming my name
and cheering for me at my graduation, but I didn't
get any event.
Speaker 9 (44:53):
I now own my own dog training business. She would
be my number one supporter, She would my number one networker.
She would be like, what do you need medicon? I'm
want to tell everybody they got a dog, go to
my sister.
Speaker 15 (45:06):
You got a dog, Go to my sister.
Speaker 9 (45:07):
That would have been hurt.
Speaker 15 (45:09):
She would have been here for it all and I.
Speaker 9 (45:12):
Want her to be But obviously that can't happen.
Speaker 1 (45:15):
I want to move forward. We don't have the video,
we don't have DNA.
Speaker 10 (45:19):
What do we have?
Speaker 2 (45:21):
That's where Jason Jensen comes in, private investigator at Jensen
Private Investigations dot com. Is it true that you have
agreed to cover expenses to retest the DNA sopig can
be done?
Speaker 1 (45:39):
Is this true?
Speaker 12 (45:40):
Yes, it is true, Nancy. I mean what we have
and what we've discussed so far is the fact that
there was SDR DNA ran through codis well, that's the
old technology. You have to really start from scratch again.
In order to in order to do genetic genealogy, you
have to have snipped, so you have to run through
(46:01):
hold genome sequence exactly.
Speaker 2 (46:04):
So now it will be a matter of obtaining the
DNA from LA Law enforcement in order for you to
do the test. If you know or think you know
anything about the murder of this beautiful young girl, call
toll free one eight hundred, Speak Up one eight hundred, seven,
(46:24):
seveny three two five eight seven.
Speaker 1 (46:28):
We wait as justice unfolds. Goodbye friend,
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
How does a beautiful young girl end up murdered dead
in her own bathtub, the apple of her family's eye,
and still no justice? As the days pass, as the
week's past, as the months pass, Julia's family wonders.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Why, and so do I. I'm Nancy Grace. This is
Crime Stories.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Thank you for being with us here at Crime Stories
and on Serious XM one eleven. First of all, listen
to this.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
Both of Julia Niewinder's roommates have been gone for the weekend,
and when one of the roommates stops by Monday morning
to pick up some things for class that day, she
hears the alarm going off in Julia Nicewinder's bedroom and
heads out without seeing or talking to her. The next day,
the roommate realizes she hasn't seen or talked to Julia
(01:14):
in two days. Her bedroom door is locked, so she
calls security at the apartment complex to check on her roommate.
The guard shows up with police and using a master
key to open the door, they walk into Julia Nicewinder's room.
It appears as if a home invasion has taken place.
Calling out for Julia and getting no reply, the officer
(01:36):
walks toward the bathroom door. A pair of white latex
gloves are on the floor in front of the bathroom door.
They are twisted and intertwined with each other.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Just as if somebody had been taking them off and
threw them down.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
What happened to Julia? And why still no justice?
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Joining me in all star panel, But first to Julia's mother,
him Turnquist.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Miss Turnquist, thank you for being with us. Thank you,
miss Turnquist.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
It has been horrible and seemingly never ending journey for
you getting justice for Julia.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
I want you to think back to the moment.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
You found out that your girl, just beautiful, young girl,
had been killed.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
What happened?
Speaker 4 (02:28):
Well, I actually found out because she didn't show up
to her work Christmas party. And my one of my
best friends worked with her boss, and they had said
that Julia didn't show up for the Christmas party and
that friends had stopped over at her place and her
car was home, but Julia wasn't home. That one of
(02:51):
the roommates said, yeah, I haven't seen her all day,
she's not you know, So they so they went on
their way. Well, then when my friend called me and said, hey, Kim,
you know, I got a call that no one's seen
Julia and that she didn't show up for work, and
she typically does not just not show up for work.
(03:12):
And I and she said, where are you at? Well,
me and Jennifer, her twin, we were actually playing at
darts on a dart league and she I told her
where I was, and she came and picked us up,
and we kept trying to call Julia on her way
from Monroe to Ipsilanti, which is can be about a
forty five minute drive, and her cell phone was going
(03:34):
right to voicemail. So then we actually called one of
Jennifer's friends who's lived on campus, which was right across
the street from Julia's apartment, and we asked her to
go over there and check on her. So she In
the meantime, the roommate had the security guard and the
cops there, and then Rachel got there and she called
(03:55):
us and said, Kim, I'm given the EMP your phone
number because they want to talk to you. And I'm
like what.
Speaker 5 (04:02):
So me and.
Speaker 4 (04:02):
Jennifer were obviously freaking out, and so then they called
me and they asked me if Julia had any medical issues,
and I said, yes, she has a cardio neurosyncope, which
is something I have and Jennifer has, which causes your
blood pressure to drop it and you could just pass
right out, but then you can come to it after
(04:23):
a few minutes. And he said okay, and I said,
why what's going on? And he goes, he goes, I'll
call you back. Well, they never called us back. We
got up there, and when we got up there, we
seen the EMP but no lights were on, so there
was just a brief moment that we were like, Okay,
the lights aren't on, so nothing's really wrong. But then
there was a security guard standing there and me and
(04:46):
Jennifer just ran right into Julia's apartment and we didn't
see anybody. And her apartment was at the back of
the apartment in the corner, and so when we ran down,
when we ran down the hallway, I went to open
the door, and when we went to stuff in, we
could see that there was stuff on the floor. But
(05:07):
then a cop came out of the bathroom area and
pushed us into the kitchen area, and we said, you know,
what's going on with Julia? You know, we want to
see her that, you know, And of course Jennifer ring
or twin was really freaking out and he said to
us and he said, you can't see her. She's deceased.
And Jennifer just ran out of the apartment. I like,
(05:30):
sell to the floor. I was like punching things. I
was upset. I was freaking out. I'm like, you're you're you're,
you're lying and you know, and he's like no, he goes,
she's deceased, and and I just I lost it. And
then at that moment, because on our way up there,
we had called Jim, which at the time was my husband,
(05:52):
and him and Madison were on their way up there
because you know, we didn't know what was going on
with Julia and no one had heard from her two days,
so we uh so everyone was kind of on their
way up there, and uh when my husband at the
time came into the apartment, uh, he said, what's going
on And the officer goes, well, your daughter is deceased,
(06:13):
and we all just lost it, you know, and and uh,
you know, we had to go out and tell Madison,
who was ten years old at the time, that her
sister was, you know, it was dead, and it was
just it was it was the worst. It was the
worst moment.
Speaker 6 (06:30):
And I.
Speaker 4 (06:33):
It to talk about it even it just it brings
everything right back to that exact moment that like I
in my mind, I I relived that moment all the time,
and you know, and I then I get mad and
angry and and uh, you know, and I just start crying.
And you know, she was Julia was definitely special and
(06:57):
her family meant everything to her. And it was right
before Christmas. Christmas was her favorite holiday. She was so
excited that, you know, she was finally at an age
and had a job that she could buy her family
Christmas presents, you know, and and she she just was
so excited for Christmas. That year, me and me and
(07:19):
Jim had gone out got a real Christmas tree. It
was our first real Christmas tree. And Julia was more
excited than anybody about the real Christmas tree and decorating it.
And we always decorated our Christmas tree, you know, when
all of us could be there and have hot chocolate,
and you know, we had already we had already done
that when she was home the weekend before, so we
(07:43):
got to you know, have that last memory with her.
But it's definitely, uh, it's I yeah, I to talk
about it sometimes just you know is real upsetting, But
I also want to talk about it because I want
to keep her story alive. I don't want anyone to
forget her. I want everyone to know that this case
(08:06):
is still unsolved and it's been eleven years too long,
that we need some answers more for Julia than us,
But I really want justice for Julia. She deserves it.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Guys, you are hearing Julia's mom, Kim Turnquist, and I
want you to know that Kim is battling leukemia on
top of everything else, and she is with us today
to ask for your help in solving her Girls Martyr.
(08:42):
Also with us is Madison Turnquist. This is Julia's little sister, Madison.
Thank you for being with us.
Speaker 7 (08:50):
Dear, thank you for having us today.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Madison, hear your mom, Kim, Stay how awful it is
to retell the story. I feel the same way when
people just out of the blue asked me about my
fiancee murder. I hate that, but yet I will tell
it if I feel like I need to tell it,
or if I have to tell it in some way
(09:16):
to help someone. Can you tell me, Madison, about the
moment you learned your big sister had been killed.
Speaker 7 (09:28):
Can I can replay it exactly how it happened eleven
years ago, So say, as you guys already heard the
first you know, beginning from my mom. But to go
a little back to when she had said that, Jennifer
ran out of the room, Jennifer actually ran to me
(09:48):
in my dad's truck. So at that time, I was
sitting in the truck with my mom's two best friends
when Jennifer had run out to me and she had
run out, she was balling. She hugged me that I
love you.
Speaker 8 (10:03):
And I had no idea what was going on still
at that moment, and she did that, and then she
had walked away. I don't know if she went to
go find my mom or I don't I just I
don't know what had happened in that moment, but she
walked away, and then I've seen my mom and my
dad walking back. So my mom's two friends got out
(10:25):
of the truck and my mom and my dad got
in the truck and it was just I believe it
was like a Toyota style truck at the time. So
my dad just had like that one seat bench with
the driver passenger it and the little seat in the
middle and I was in the little seat in the
middle and right in front of me dashboard. Mom's on
(10:47):
the right of me, my dad's on the left.
Speaker 9 (10:50):
And it was quiet for like the first five minutes
in the truck and now, so back then I didn't know,
but now I know that was them trying to figure
out how they were going to tell me because I
was ten years old and they had to figure out
how they're going to tell me in a way that
I'm going to understand what they're telling me. When I
(11:11):
was two years old, my uncle had committed suicide and
that growing up, that affected me a lot, just because
you know, I want I would. I wanted to know
who my uncle was and never had the chance to.
So when my parents told me, my mom grabbed my
hand and my dad looked at me and said, your
(11:34):
sister is safe.
Speaker 8 (11:35):
With your uncle, Jeff. I didn't cry, I didn't scream.
All I could do was punch my dad's radio. And
that's that's the only reaction that I had because at
ten years old, I know what they're saying to me.
I know what they meant when they said that.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
Now as you are hearing Madison Turnquist, Julia's little sister,
and Kim Turnquist, her mother, describing the moment they find
out their girl, their big sister, has been killed, her
body dumped in her apartment bathtub. Now, this apartment was
(12:33):
an off campus apartment there at Eastern Michigan University. This girl,
Julia scrubbed in sunshine, beautiful, sweet, not some wild party girl,
never had an arrest, never run away from home, so
(12:54):
excited about having her very first Christmas tree and her
very own off campus apartment. Now, how in the hey
does this case go unsolved? In addition to Kim and
Madison joining US an all star panel, first two, Ronnie
(13:15):
Dahl joining US investigative journalists and private investigator, owner of
Doll Investigations.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
Ronnie, what do you make of it when.
Speaker 10 (13:26):
You're a reporter and you get called to these stories?
There are so many questions that you're trying to get covered. Obviously,
it's who, what, when? Where? Eastern Michigan University is about
twenty thousand students, A lot of them are commuter students,
and as you know, this happened off campus, so there
(13:49):
weren't a lot of people on campus at the time.
It was around exam time.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
Oh my goodness, Ronnie Dahl, you're reminding me so much
of the Idaho for Slaves and Moscow, Idaho. Were four
students and an off campus home they rented it. When
I say off campus, I mean right across the street.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
I've been there. You look right at Fraternity Row.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
When I say off campus, it's literally in the shadow
of campus. So it's very very close to campus. And
you said twenty thousand students.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Go ahead, Ronnie, and.
Speaker 10 (14:26):
You know the city. Since this was off campus, it
falls to the jurisdiction of the Ipsilanti Police department. So
it's a smaller police department. I don't even think at
that time they maybe had fifty employees. Half of that's
the police officers. So when the city itself, the population
is about the same as that of the university, right,
(14:49):
so you have to go to the jurisdiction. So Ipsilanti
Police they're handling the investigation, and pretty much from the
beginning they were pretty tight lipped on what was happening
in this case. Sin they have remained that way all
these years later.
Speaker 2 (15:05):
Guys, what do we know about the attack? Take a
listen to Sidney Sumner Crime online dot com.
Speaker 11 (15:13):
Nice Winder's room looks like it has been tossed closer
all over the floor of the room. Drawers are left open.
The contents from a plastic organizer drawer have been dumped
on the floor. The contents of Nice Winter's purse also
dumped out on her bed, and some items are missing too.
A black and white zebra striped pillowcase is missing off
the pillow. Her keys to the apartment are missing from
(15:35):
a lanyard, and police note that it looks like a
home invasion took place, but wrapped Christmas presents and iPod,
computer and TV are not taken from the room.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
So why to Jason Jensen joining us?
Speaker 2 (15:49):
Jason is private investigator, owner of Jensen Private Investigations and
co founder of the Cold Case Coalition. You can find
Jason at Jensenprivate Investigations dot com.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
Jason, thank you for being with us. I want to
absorb what we're just hearing.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
And guys, we're back at ground zero, square one, trying
to solve the murder of this beautiful young co ed
murdered in her off campus apartment. Did you hear that,
Jason and lonlike everything had been dumped on the floor
but what's really missing the keys to the apartment, and
(16:26):
police note that there were unwrapped gifts and iPod, computer
and TV still there.
Speaker 12 (16:31):
Right, It definitely does not sound like it was a
home invasion for a robbery. It sounds like there was
a targeting of Julia herself, which indicates strongly because like
the pillowcases missing and her keys are gone.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
And to me to just got mortgage joining US Professor Forensics,
Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on
Amazon and host of Bodyback with jsm also death investigator.
He has investigated over one thousand death scenes.
Speaker 1 (17:08):
Scott, is it staged?
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Did someone come to kill Julia and they then make
the place look ransacked?
Speaker 13 (17:16):
That's certainly a possibility because you know, if you look
at the inventory of the items that had had been
left behind, there's nothing of significance missing here. Things are there.
But yet you get this idea that someone went through
and rifled the area. And we see this lots of
times with staging cases, so that leads you to this idea.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
I mean, Joe Scott, you've turned on the TV, haven't you.
Every time there is a homicide depicted, that's always staged,
They tear the room.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
Up, They act like someone came in to steal something.
When that's staging. Staging the scene.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Del Carson high profile all you're out of Jacksonville, joining
us and more importantly for my purposes, former FBI and
former beatcop in Miami Dade.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
You can find them at.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
Dell Carsonlaw dot Comdale Staging is normally done by someone
that knows the victim, who is trying to make it
look as if it was a random attack.
Speaker 6 (18:20):
Yeah, but there are a couple of things going on here,
and Joe will back me up on this. You know,
this could be somebody gathering a crophy, or from my perspective,
this is somebody removing items that connect that individual to
that lady.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
It's the missing pillow case to be used as a sack.
Speaker 6 (18:38):
You throw stuff in there in order to get it out,
and that things are missing that no one would expect
to be there. And there's more. When people die in bathtubs,
the mistake of uninitiated law enforcement is to drain the
tub in order to get the victim out. And what
Joe and I can both tell you is that once
you've done that, you've lost a considerable amount of evidence
(19:01):
down the drain. And I've seen this happen on at
least two occasions in my FBI and my police career
in Miami, and so you'll lose that evidence. So that
takes somebody with some sophistications who recognizes that when you
put somebody in the water, you're taking away important evidence. Now,
maybe they didn't get at all, but it's an effort
(19:23):
and it shows some sophistication that's sort of unusual.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
We believe that this occurred in the early early morning hours.
Kim Turquis is Julia's mom. Were there any items of
note missing other than the pillow case, her.
Speaker 4 (19:41):
Keys, which, like we said, on the lanyard, which have
a key to her bedroom, and then we have the
pillow case, and then we have they said that there
was a purple rug missing from the bathroom because the
bathroom that was zebra and a bright purple, and so
(20:05):
they said that the rug was missing. I don't know,
to be honest, I know that when we went to
when we were we're allowed to clean up her go
clean up her apartment, I'll be honest, we didn't pay
much attention to what was still there and what wasn't
because we were all obviously very upset and crying and
(20:27):
it was a really emotional time. But you know, we
do know that one of the plastic drawers is missing too,
but we don't know what it was in it.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
Did she have any valuable jewelry that you know of
that was missing.
Speaker 4 (20:40):
No, her check book was still there, her credit cards, everything,
we're still.
Speaker 13 (20:45):
In her room, Nancy. I think that one of the
questions I would ask is were there any items of
clothing missing as well from the scene that were tied
back to her, because that's that might be inevident. So
the trophy taker names.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
Kim tarquas anything.
Speaker 4 (21:03):
We're not sure what was in that drawer that is missing,
So we're not.
Speaker 1 (21:09):
Sure, Okay, what kind of drawer?
Speaker 6 (21:10):
Was it?
Speaker 4 (21:11):
A ster a light drawer, one of those bigger three
compartments STERI light drawers.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
Oh, like the packable plastic ones. Yeah, Nancy, Yeah, jump in.
Speaker 6 (21:19):
If the drawer is missing, that's an important clue, because
that too, is unusual and it may reflect that the
hand the gloves were taken off, grabbed that put fingerprints
and DNA on it, and then took it with them
when they realized that they didn't have the gloves on
when they were actually doing tossing the apartment.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
Okay, can we talk about something just for a moment.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Who wears gloves to a crime of opportunity? Like you're
watching Julia and you say I'm going to sex attack her,
you break into her place, and you happen to have
gloves with you.
Speaker 6 (21:55):
Yeah, who wears a mask?
Speaker 14 (21:59):
Yes?
Speaker 6 (22:00):
And the reason you wear a mask is see it
can be identified.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
What I'm saying is this wasn't planned out, Joe Scott. No,
I mean it was planned out to bring gloves.
Speaker 13 (22:10):
Yeah, you don't show up randomly with latex gloves. And
to Dale's point, I find it fascinating with this case
that you talk about preparedness when you show up, you
show up with the gloves, and not just that, but
also there's a level of sophistication when you think about
the bathtub in and of itself, Well, what do you
(22:30):
do in the bathtub? Normally in life you get in
the bathtub to get clean. So could this person have
been sophisticated enough in order to facilitate that, or at
least think about facilitating that cleaning her so that none
of his DNA is left behind too.
Speaker 1 (22:46):
Karen L.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
Stark, joining US high profile psychologist for renow on TV
and radio trauma expert. You can find her at Karenstark
dot com. That's Karen with the Sea. Karen, what do
you make of the scene. It was totally ransacked, but
yet nothing of value was taken.
Speaker 5 (23:04):
There is no doubt in my mind, Nancy, that what
Joe and Dale are saying is absolutely correct. I believe
that this is someone who knew he had time, who
planned how he was going to do this, who made
it look like absolutely this was just, you know, a
(23:24):
robbery or a spontaneous break in. And I think it's
really interesting that those draws are missing that I wonder
what kind of trophies he was able to take, because
that reminds me of something that would happen in a
scene like this, where the person who killed her would
(23:45):
want to have things that belonged to her to remember
and relive the scene, which you can be sure happened
over and over again.
Speaker 2 (23:54):
To Ronnie Dahl, joining US investigative journalist and PI Ronnie
Dall Investigation dot Com.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
I understand that.
Speaker 2 (24:02):
The cause of death was asphyxiation and drowning. Detectas noted
originally that she was partially nude in the bathtub in
a very unnatural position.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
What does that mean, Ronnie Dall.
Speaker 10 (24:21):
You know, I can tell you in the beginning of
this case, they did not release that information. It was
it was months and months later before that information came out.
At first, they were saying it didn't appear to be
any trauma to the body, so part of that could
have been part of these investigations. They don't want to
(24:42):
release information in the beginning while they're still trying to
collect the evidence. But you have to remember this is
a small town. Half of the town's population is college students,
so as the investigation goes on, I don't think we
even found a lot of these details out until two fifteen,
and that was when some of this information came out
(25:03):
in an affric David for when they were trying to
arrest the father, Jim Turnquest. So it was a long
time before we found out some of this information.
Speaker 2 (25:14):
Joining me is Kim Turnquist, Julia's mom and her sister,
Madison Turnquist. I'm curious, miss Turnquist, when they say she
your daughter, Julia was in an unnatural position, what do
they mean by that well.
Speaker 4 (25:30):
From what I was told, she was partially nude and
her legs were like slipped up. It was like almost
like your swimming on your stomach and your legs you kind.
Speaker 15 (25:46):
Of laying in a bound position.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
Laying in a bound position. Is that what you're saying?
Speaker 9 (25:52):
Yep, hands behind your back, legs bent up.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
Got it? Got it?
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Yes, an unusual position. Everybody jump in if you have
a thought on this. But to you, just Scott Morgan,
I find it very, very difficult to believe that DNA
cannot be obtained from inside the insides of plastic gloves
or when those bindings were put on her hands, her wrists.
(26:19):
When you tie something, you have to touch it, especially
inside the knots. Where's all that evidence? Has it been
compared for DNA in the system.
Speaker 4 (26:31):
What we were told was that two DNAs were collected
from her, one from the glove, well, one from the
glove that she had blood in that They think that
if that maybe whoever it was, went to try to
shut Julia up or something and she bit down on
her bit down and drew blood from her lips. And
(26:53):
then they said that they found two male DNA on
her inner side. One was inconclusive and the other one
has a supposedly matched anybody in codis That's what we
were told.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Time stories with Nancy Grace, Joscott Morgan, Ronnie Dall.
Speaker 1 (27:23):
Somebody jump in, explain to me about the DNA. Has
the DNA all of.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
It be subjected to the most recent technology DNA comparisons
such as genetic family tree DNA or touch DNA.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
What do we know.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
About the DNA tests done on the DNA found at
the scene, Ronnie Dall, what do you know?
Speaker 10 (27:49):
So that's part of the problem with this case is
even you know, ten eleven years later, you try to
put in for your Freedom of Information Act requests to
try to get some of this information and they're not
releasing it. But so really all we have to go
on is what has been told to the family and
what's coming from a retired detective and what was in
(28:10):
that affidavit for the search warrant And so the DNA
from my understanding was to ask him mentioned you had
the two from two unknown male subjects that they have
not been able to place. Yes, yet, I don't know
how much DNA they do have. I know that all
the evidence is being processed by the Michigan State Police
(28:32):
Crime Lab. But you know they do hold on to
that evidence with the new technology.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
An you said, Ronnie Dall is being processed or it
was processed well, or it was processed.
Speaker 10 (28:45):
The status of where this investigation is today, you don't
get any updates out of the police department.
Speaker 1 (28:52):
Thank you question today.
Speaker 13 (28:54):
One of my questions, Nancy, when you know we're talking
about has been examined. I hope that they still have
retained a significant amount of DNA that can be tested.
You'd mentioned genetic DNA testing just a moment ago. Remember
compared to twenty twelve, this is relatively new technology light
years Yeah, it is. And you know, look, if this
(29:18):
individual is not in CODIS, which there's two categories in CODUS,
you have nones and then you have what's referred to
as the forensic database, that's unknowns that are out there.
So after that, the next leap is either phenotyping if
they're willing to do that, where you can come up
with a physical description of the individual, and or you
(29:39):
then plug it into a genetic database to try to see,
you know, the familial tree.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
You know, I'm not even sure Jo Scott if they
were using mitochondrial DNA matches in twenty twelve. So if
you could even get part of the DNA, you can
make it matched on the mother's side. Yes, you can,
don't necessarily need. You can use like a hair, you
don't need the hair in nucleus. There's been so many
advances since twenty twelve, it's like light ears ahead. What
(30:08):
more do we know about how Julia was found dead?
Speaker 1 (30:12):
Listen to Rachel Benia Crime Online.
Speaker 16 (30:15):
Opening the bathroom door, officers discovered Julia's lifeless, nude body,
face down, submerged in the bathtub filled with water. Her
hands are pulled behind her back, her feet are together,
and her cell phone is found underneath her body. Nice winterers.
Clothes have been cut off except for a sleeve and
are left on the bathroom floor. Police don't find the
instrument used to cut the clothes from her body.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
Okay, I want to circle back to what we're hearing
Joe Scott Morgan. How would her body being submerged in
the bathtub water affect the recovery of DNA.
Speaker 13 (30:47):
Well, there's a flushing that goes on, isn't there, Nancy?
When if there is? Okay, let's just say that you
have topical DNA, you have a deposition of say forgive me,
but semen on the body or if even there's blood,
it can be compromised externally, you know, depended upon how
long she was in the water, if there was any
(31:08):
attempt to clean her in the water. Now, when we
get to this idea of perhaps a rape kit, that's internal,
so hopefully something could be found within there, But it
sounds like they're not having success in that.
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Well, they have to get DNA from somewhere. They got
it from the gloves and her inner thigh.
Speaker 13 (31:27):
Coming out of the glove and on the inner thigh.
Isn't that fascinating considering that she was submerged in water. Nancy,
one more thing about this that is really striking out
of all the cases that I've covered and worked in
my career, do you realize how rare homicidal drowning is
very rare. It's not something that occurs on a regular basis.
(31:48):
And this is a this goes to a degree of
violence that you don't normally see because you know, what
they're talking about is that her tongue is actually lacerated.
That gives you an idea that she was forced or
held beneath the water. She bit her own tongue, is
what they're opining, but and nobody does that. Normally, you
(32:08):
can bite your tongue as you're eating something. But I
think that she was held underwater and she bit her
tongue as a result of this force, and it last
rated her tongue. You've got a lot going on here,
and somebody has really really thought this through.
Speaker 2 (32:21):
To Ronnie Dahl joining US private investigator and investigative reporter, Ronnie,
what can you tell me about potential video of the perp.
Speaker 10 (32:31):
Well, that's one of the first things you do, especially
if you're in a small community near a college campus,
as you're looking for a video. But again twenty twelve,
we don't have the security cameras and the number of
security cameras that are around today. There was a video
from the apartment complex and from my understanding, the around
(32:52):
five point thirty in the morning I believe on December ninth.
The video did show an individual that was standing out
in the parking line near the trash dumpster, which was
close to Julia's apartment. The individual was seeing kind of
frustrated walking back and forth, pacing back and forth, back
and forth, but when police went back to get the video,
(33:16):
they didn't pull it right away and unpertly the video
was recorded over.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
How many times is that going to happen?
Speaker 2 (33:25):
It first came to light in the Chandra Levy case,
where the video in her high rise in DC recorded over,
So we didn't know when she left, what was she wearing,
was she going jogging, was she dressed up? Was she
with anybody? But yet it's still happening. They recorded over
the video. It's been reported there was an individual a
mail pacing back and forth and back and forth near
(33:48):
the trash cans at the apartment. And isn't it true
Kim Turnquist that apparently Julian went out to empty the trash.
Speaker 4 (33:56):
Well, that's what that's what there. That's what we were
told is that that Julia woke up that day, obviously
got ready for school, and made herself some breakfast, because
they did find eggs in her stomach, and then it
appeared that she had taken her garbage out, So they
their theory to us was that they think she took
(34:17):
her garbage out and then she was followed in her apartment,
so that's how the person got got in. There's no
forced entry, but they think that they followed her in
when she went back into her apartment. I do want
to say too, that we did learn that they now
(34:37):
which didn't release to us before, that they think that
the theory is is that Julia was tortured all day long.
That this wasn't just a few hours that they followed
her in in the morning and that person didn't leave
until nighttime, so she had been in her room and
pretty much had been tortured all day.
Speaker 1 (34:58):
Well, where was the roommate in the room? May have
been in and out during that time.
Speaker 4 (35:03):
From what we were told, the one roommate was, but
she didn't hear anything, and the other one wasn't still there.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
That doesn't make sense to me that she was held
and tortured all day long and the roommate was there
and didn't hear or see anything. But yeah, I mean,
nothing is out of consideration right now because it's been
this long and still no answers. Another thing we must
(35:30):
address this.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
Listen to Dave Mack.
Speaker 14 (35:33):
The night julian Ice Winder's body has found. Officer's note
how her mother is pacing back and forth at the
police station while her stepfather seems stoic as he sits
in the lobby, the first of several red flags that
lead investigators to take a closer look at Jim Turnquist.
Looking at Turnquist, the police asked for his laptop. He complies.
They ask for a polygraph. He complies twice and passes twice.
(35:55):
Investigators consult with the FBI and her encourage to take
a good look at Jim Turnquist. Ternquist is named a
person of interest and he's charged not in the death
of Julian nice Winder, but child pornography. There are three
hundred thousand pictures on his laptop, seven of which lead
to charges of child porn. At trial, experts testify the
seven photos are in timp folders and could have been
(36:17):
pop up ads. You can't even tell the age of
the people in the pictures. Turnquist is acquitted of the
child porn charges, but nothing has moved forward on the
murder of Julia Nicewinder.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
To Julia's mom, Kim Turnquist, what do you make of
them them charging your then husband? Isn't it true you
gave him a rock solid alibi for the time during
which Julie was killed.
Speaker 4 (36:43):
Yes, so here's that whole thing? Is so absurd. So
we live in Monroe, which I said earlier is about
forty five minute drives. And let me tell you, yes,
I'm I'm a person who gets up in the middle
of the night all the time. Jim was home with me,
sleeping in the bed with me, got up that same
(37:05):
morning to go to work like he usually does. I
did the same thing. He was home all night long
and all this The story with Jim is just absurd.
I you know, I never I just I couldn't believe
what they were trying to do to him. And I'll
be honest, the firstly detective on the case, he is
(37:27):
the one who has spoken up recently. The other one
is the one who tried to do all this stuff,
who had I hate to say it this way, but
I think she had heard Jim. She just wanted to
solve the case, to put another salt case in her pocket.
This child pornography was absolutely ludicrous to even charge him
(37:51):
with that. I still get very upset with that because
you know, it has affected all of our lie in
different ways, and mainly Gems, because people accused him of
these things, and I think that it's just it's ridiculous.
They wanted to find someone to pin this murder on.
(38:14):
And that's what they did.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
Didn't a friend of Julius state that mister Tarnquist had
made advances.
Speaker 4 (38:21):
On her, you know what. So that's what they said.
But then when you talked to her, she said that
she had never said that, that she would testify to
that if had to. That that was never said. And unfortunately,
during that time, my family was torn apart because the
police were telling my family certain things and making my
(38:45):
family believe that, you know, all these things were going
on and they weren't.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
Guys.
Speaker 2 (38:50):
I want to address what we do know. We know
that the father, mister Tronquist, wi suspected he was a
person of interest. He passed two polygraphs and was found
not guilty by a jury on other charges of child
porn seven photos out of hundreds and hundreds and hundreds
(39:10):
of photos.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
What does that mean.
Speaker 2 (39:12):
I've never had child porn pop up on my computer,
but a jury found him not guilty.
Speaker 1 (39:19):
Now what do we know?
Speaker 2 (39:21):
We know his wife and his daughters gave him an
alibi and that they lived a good distance away from
the crime scene. That said, who killed Julia? I guarantee
you this. I guarantee you that male DNA and those
(39:42):
gloves have been run against the stepdad.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
You agree with that, Joe.
Speaker 13 (39:47):
Scott, Yes, I agreed.
Speaker 1 (39:49):
So I mean, I don't care what he did before.
Speaker 2 (39:52):
I don't care if he was guilty or innocent on
anything before. All I care about is who ca Julia,
Kim Madison? Anybody on this panel? Do you know if
they ran the DNA panel from the crime saint against
the step dad?
Speaker 1 (40:08):
Yes or no?
Speaker 12 (40:09):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (40:09):
Okay? Who's speaking? Is this Madison or Kim Kim? Okay?
If they got a match on that, he would be charged.
Speaker 4 (40:16):
It has totally changed changed our lives. Everyone who you know,
every family member that has been touched by this. You know,
our life is not the same without Julia. Family was
really important to her, and you know, and then as
(40:36):
you heard all the other accusations from twenty fifteen, you
want to talk about, you know, losing a daughter to
a murder and no one being arrested, and then you have,
you know, people trying to accuse at the time your
husband of something that.
Speaker 9 (40:55):
He would never ever do, and you have.
Speaker 4 (40:58):
To deal with all the public when you know, saying
things about you, whispering behind your back. We got we
got death threats. You know, you know your youngest child,
Remember she was ten in twenty twelve, so she was
thirteen in twenty fifteen going to school and dealing with
kids saying things like it had totally changed our whole
(41:23):
lives in so many different ways, and you know that
things will never be the same. I still to this
day will get messages and accusing people of things and
they just people can be cruel and you're trying to
deal with the death of your daughter, and you know,
deal with that. And now the fact that it's eleven
(41:45):
years and it hasn't been solved, and you know, for
a while there under old management at the IFC Police Department,
you know, you weren't getting any cooperation, you weren't getting
getting any communication. And now we are in talks with
the new chief, which we are happy about. He communicates
(42:08):
to us and we really think that with this chief
in place, that we will have a good chance of
getting some assistance, that he won't be afraid to ask
for assistance, and that Julia's case may finally get solved.
So but it is affect. It has changed our lives
in so many ways, so many ways.
Speaker 9 (42:30):
Well, nobody really underd truly understands what it does to
the ten year old that has to grow up, you know, now,
being I'm.
Speaker 17 (42:37):
Twenty one now, nobody.
Speaker 9 (42:40):
Asked me when I was a kid, you know how
I felt, how all of it affected me. Yeah, changed,
It changed.
Speaker 15 (42:48):
My life a lot.
Speaker 8 (42:49):
My sisters.
Speaker 9 (42:51):
I was a little sister, but I was the protector
over my sisters. The last thing that I did with
Julia will spend you know, little sieves weekend.
Speaker 15 (43:00):
With her and you know, build, not build, but create,
you know.
Speaker 9 (43:05):
A heart on her wall made out of you know photos.
Speaker 15 (43:10):
She was my biggest supporter.
Speaker 9 (43:12):
She anytime that I come around is oh my god,
my little sister, my little sister. That she would you know,
introduce me to all her friends. I was like, I
literally felt like a famous person when I was hanging
out with my sister when everything had happened. After she
passed away, I kind of became a support system for
(43:34):
the family because you know, I have a mom who
I have parents that are dealing with the grief of
their child, and then I have my other sister who
is grieving the loss of her twins.
Speaker 15 (43:44):
And so I spent a lot of you know, the
first you.
Speaker 9 (43:49):
Know, six years of Julia's murder being you know, a
support system to my family. It wasn't until I was
sixteen that I went to my parents and said, I
need help. I need to go to counseling. I need
to agree with my sister in the right way. And
I still grieve her. There are so many things now
in my life, being twenty one, that I would want
(44:10):
to have my sister here for.
Speaker 15 (44:12):
I graduated high school.
Speaker 9 (44:14):
When I wanted to drop out because of everything that
I went through with her, with her murder and accuse,
the false accusations on my dad. I was ready to
drop out in the sixth grade. Through I graduated high school.
I started a trade school college two to three months
after I graduated high school. A matter of fact, I
(44:36):
graduated high school four months early compared to everybody else.
Speaker 17 (44:41):
But my sister wasn't here for that, and she should
have been. My sister would have been screaming my name
and cheering for me at my graduation, but I didn't
get any event.
Speaker 9 (44:53):
I now own my own dog training business. She would
be my number one supporter, She would my number one networker.
She would be like, what do you need medicon? I'm
want to tell everybody they got a dog, go to
my sister.
Speaker 15 (45:06):
You got a dog, Go to my sister.
Speaker 9 (45:07):
That would have been hurt.
Speaker 15 (45:09):
She would have been here for it all and I.
Speaker 9 (45:12):
Want her to be But obviously that can't happen.
Speaker 1 (45:15):
I want to move forward. We don't have the video,
we don't have DNA.
Speaker 10 (45:19):
What do we have?
Speaker 2 (45:21):
That's where Jason Jensen comes in, private investigator at Jensen
Private Investigations dot com. Is it true that you have
agreed to cover expenses to retest the DNA sopig can
be done?
Speaker 1 (45:39):
Is this true?
Speaker 12 (45:40):
Yes, it is true, Nancy. I mean what we have
and what we've discussed so far is the fact that
there was SDR DNA ran through codis well, that's the
old technology. You have to really start from scratch again.
In order to in order to do genetic genealogy, you
have to have snipped, so you have to run through
(46:01):
hold genome sequence exactly.
Speaker 2 (46:04):
So now it will be a matter of obtaining the
DNA from LA Law enforcement in order for you to
do the test. If you know or think you know
anything about the murder of this beautiful young girl, call
toll free one eight hundred, Speak Up one eight hundred, seven,
(46:24):
seveny three two five eight seven.
Speaker 1 (46:28):
We wait as justice unfolds. Goodbye friend,
Host
Nancy Grace
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