May 29, 2025 • 17 mins
What does it take to lead with empathy, awareness, and intention? In this insightful episode of Culture Raises US, Damien Hooper-Campbell breaks down the core principles of inclusive leadership and why they matter more than ever in today’s evolving workplace.
Drawing from personal experiences and professional expertise, Damien shares how empathy, honest feedback, and emotional intelligence can transform team dynamics and organizational culture. This conversation explores the role of self-awareness, the responsibility of leaders to educate themselves on unconscious bias, and the ongoing work of creating inclusive spaces where everyone can thrive.
Whether you're leading a team or redefining leadership within yourself, this episode offers practical wisdom and a powerful reminder that inclusion is not a checkbox—it’s a commitment.
Memorable Sound Bites:
“Everybody doesn’t win.”
“Empathy is important because…”
“You’d have a lot of listening.”
Chapters:
00:00 – The Essence of Inclusive Leadership
03:00 – Empathy in Leadership
06:04 – Feedback and Growth
11:57 – Creating an Inclusive Workplace
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
My guy, Damien Hooper Campbell is a friend of the
show for sure, who's also a leader in the impact
diversity leadership development space and just in general is a
great mind for everyone out here. You know, we spoke
the other day and you talked about where your true
passion kind of lied, and that was within this notion
(00:25):
of inclusive leadership. Give me some context. What does inclusive
leadership mean to you personally and professionally.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Well, first and foremost, thank you for that nice intro,
my brother, and thank you for having me for this conversation.
You know, personally, what if you really break it down,
inclusive leadership is nothing more than being thoughtful. It is
being thoughtful about every interaction you have and being thoughtful
(00:58):
about the people who might be on the fringe. You know,
oftentimes when folks are creating products and they want to
get to the total addressable market, they say, well, if
we can create this for the fringe user, then we
can capture everybody else. And people are very thoughtful in
that way. So personally, you know, it can be something
(01:20):
as simple as if we if we dial it back
to you know, when we were kids and playing kickball.
For those of us who were able to do. So,
you know, think about being the last person to get
selected for a squad and what that felt like. And
think about being on the outside of a circle when
you come to the playground and what that felt like. Right.
(01:42):
That is at the end of the day, imagine if
when we were kids, if we had the eq to say, Dang,
I don't want so and so to feel this way
just because of their size or their weight. I don't
want so and so to feel this way just because
they're the new kid at school. So I'm gonna go
out of my way to be thoughtful and pick them last,
even though everybody else might have.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Right.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
So that's like personally, if I bring it back to
some of the earliest memories, that's what it would be.
And you just carry that same mindset at its very
basic level forward to being a grown individual as we are.
And then professionally, it's the same thing. It is everything
(02:24):
from how you design products, it's how you design workplace
experiences and policies. It's as simple aster as if you're
going to have you've got a global company and you're
thinking about having an all hands or a meeting and
you say that you're inclusive of all, well, are you
just going to do one that is during a time
(02:45):
that is US based, or are you going to maybe
do two, not send a recorder to the folks an
apac and any media, but actually put in the effort
to do too, and think about enabling live transcription and
translation so that people can you know, be involved in
the conversation. So it spans across everything. But leading inclusively
(03:08):
is one of the most basic human characteristics and skill
sets that I think we typically have but also need
to continue to work at develop.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
It, you know, listening to you give the example the
childhood examples like literally took me back, like I literally
was back as a child, and thinking to those moments,
right because as many I was on both sides of
that right at times I was the one that wasn't
picked and then at times I was the one that
(03:38):
was the first pick. You know, the times when I
wasn't first picked it was because of the height or
what have you, or whatever issues other people might have
had with bringing me into the mix. But that's a
whole nother conversation. But in that d and I'm not
I'm not going against your thought process. I love because
how you made a very clear picture for me once
you broke it down with that example. But in that example,
(03:59):
I also think about, wait a minute, on the other
end of it, think about all the things that I
then did to make sure that I was presented in
a way that next time I wasn't the last one picked,
or I wasn't the one you know, thought about last
when bringing into the mix. Is there something there where
where you also are helping to build a level of
(04:22):
and I don't want to call it confidence or reassurance,
but you know, I do think we also live in
a society today where like, oh, everybody wins, you know
this first place, but then there's also nineteenth place and
we're gonna give you award too. So I feel like
there's a little bit of that in that in this
as well.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
No, yeah, I mean sure, but but no, everybody doesn't win.
And I actually think an important part of inclusive leadership,
especially as you start talking about us in a professional capacity,
but even personally, as being honest. The inclusive part about it.
(05:00):
It is not just being honest with folks about you
didn't win, you're not going to win, but and here's why, right,
So it's it's being clear and direct but also giving
the why for it, but it really is and having
the EQ to understand is a person ready to hear
that information? Have you asked that for permission to deliver
(05:21):
that information? And are you delivering it? If you're If
you happen to be a direct person and you love
honest feedback, that's great for you, but as a leader,
that may not be the way that every single person
likes to digest. And so having EQ and then you
know Danny Meyer, the great restaurant tour and creator of
(05:44):
shape Shack and eleven Madison and all things, talks about
enlightened hospitality. It's not just the knowing that there's a need,
but it's also taking the action to push that forward.
So yes, really what you hit on is and you
hit on it from even your own example of having
been on both sides of the trade right as a child,
(06:04):
being on the side where you weren't picked helps you
to understand what that feels like. And you know you
don't want anybody else feeling like that because that was
a horrible feeling as a kid. You could still feel
it now, you know what I'm saying, And so what
are you doing today in the form of EQ in
the form of giving people honest and direct feedback, but
(06:25):
delivering it in a way that lands for them and
at a time that lands for them, because no, everybody
doesn't win. The worst thing you could do, and it's
not directly exclusive, but it will prevent people from advancing
is not give people the feedback at some time and
in some way. Right, an inclusive leader thinks about that.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
I want to come back to that point, but I
want to touch on something that you were hitting on,
and I think it's this notion of empathy that you
were talking, right, And you obviously talk about empathy a lot.
We've had those conversations and why is it's so essential
though to leadership? And do you have an example of
when somebody really led with this empathy first and it
had a lasting impact on either you or their respective team.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
Yeah, I'm going to think on the example because you know,
this is the classic case of you have so many
and then and then they blank. So but empathy is
important because you know, and look, there's a difference between
sympathy and empathy, right, And what you talked about to
me is empathy with empathy being you really can understand
(07:33):
what that person went through because you had that experience
empathy being you may have compassion for that individual even
if you've never actually been through it. Right, I find
and I'll give you the primary example. I find that
when I used to go through the line at you know,
a grocery store, and you know, you're checking out, cashier says, hey,
(07:53):
do you want to donate to breast cancer? Do you
want to donate to this or whatever cause? Sometimes, if
I was, you know, in the mood, I say sure,
or other times I'm like, no, no, I'm good, I
do stuff elsewhere. The moment you lose somebody to breast cancer,
the moment you lose someone to whatever kind of illness,
or God forbid, the moment you go through one of
(08:14):
those experiences unfortunately but make it through. Fortunately. I guarantee
your disposition towards that cashier and magnating a dollar five
ten dollars is very different at the end of the day. Right.
And so you know, let me give you an example
of empathy and action that doesn't come from a leader
(08:35):
that I necessarily know, and it might not be what
most people define as a leader. There is a picture
that I have that sometimes I use in presentations just
to help people to understand, like this thing is in
rocket science. And if you can imagine this picture aster,
it's about five five kids dressed in suits. They have
(08:56):
on kind of these black you know suits, and they
have on white shirt it's in a black top. And
then in the middle of them is one kid and
he just has on a white shirt and he's got
on a red tie. Right, these kids can't be any
older than ten to twelve years old. And the story
(09:16):
goes that they all go to the same private school
somewhere in the world, and the one in the middle
with the red tie, for whatever reason, couldn't celebrate Halloween,
and so he couldn't wear a costume. And his boys
got together and said, what can we do to be
(09:37):
inclusive of this individual, And so they would wear blazers
to private school anyway. So they all dressed in their blazers,
got some black slacks, wore whatever ties they had, and
let him come to school regularly, got a red tie
and just took his blazer off so that they looked
like secret service standing around the President of the United
(10:01):
and collectively made Halloween for him while still respecting is
religious norms, right and traditions and allowed him to come
as he was while still being involved in the moment.
And so that's one of the ones that sticks out
to me because again they saw the need, they understood it,
(10:22):
whether it was sympathy or empathy depending on their experiences,
and then they took action and led in a way
to be inclusive of another individual.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
And they took action by meeting him in the situation
where they were.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
That's right, that's right, Which gets to your point. Do
you just hear your earlier point about about people needing
to change sometimes? And yes, we all need to morph
and develop. We can't everybody can't just come as they are,
like some of the stuff, we need to leave it all.
But yes, they met that young man right where he was.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
You talked about earlier, and I said, I was going
to come back to it. The notion of feedback and
providing feedback, and you know, and a lot of these
environments that that we've frequented and excelled in and have
grown in, you know, a lot of feedback at times
is used not necessarily for the true development of the individual,
(11:20):
but more so as a reason to hinder or hold
back or put in a box. Which it let me
tell you some these the yearly reviews and all that, Like,
sometimes I cringe at how those tools are used, how
those tools are used and not from a true development standpoint,
So how do you ensure that you create an environment?
(11:41):
And it sounds like it comes back to the person,
the individual of making sure that when you're providing feedback
it's done in a way where we're truly trying to
help to enhance and grow rather than deter break down control.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
This is so there's a there's a structural piece to
this and a cultural piece. By structural I mean processes, policies, right,
and things that are set up that need to be
inclusive in the way they're designed. And by cultural, I
mean even if you have all those policies and structures
(12:18):
and processes, well, if you don't have the mindset, if
you don't understand why as a human being it's important
to do things a certain way, then the structural stuff
alone won't matter. So from a process standpoint one, you've
got to be involved in it, right, So if you're
going to be a real influencer, you have to be
involved in it as a leader in the places. And
(12:40):
I can't say that I've done this perfectly. Heck, I'm
still learning how to get better at this. But as
a leader, as we think about, you know, policies around feedback, etc.
One of the main things you want to do is
make sure that it's objective in nature that you're getting
rid of. Oh, I really like this person, or this
person reminds me of myself. There's nothing wrong with those things,
(13:00):
but that ain't got nothing to do with wether or
not the person has actually done the job well. And
if you take it even a step behind AST, you
have to make sure that when you are setting goals
and targets for individuals that you're being really clear about
what does success look like. I've been at places and
heard of places where what it means to get from
(13:20):
level A to level A plus two is different depending
on what part of the world you're in, depending on
what function. But it's not written out anywhere and becomes
super subjective. And that's where some of these things. If
I don't like you, or if you push back on
me and I don't like that, but I happen to
be your manager, that's where astor people start to use
(13:42):
some of these processes to hinder folks instead of advancing them.
And then culturally, you have to educate people. You've got
to educate people on what happens to our behaviors unconsciously.
You got to educate people on how without even knowing,
they may be saying and doing things that are hindering folks.
(14:03):
And then you've got to make it really personal for them.
And I think that there are ways to do that
that are experiential. Some of that is through storytelling, but
the combination of both structural and cultural things when it
comes to feedback, talent management processes, etc. It's those things
that make them a lot more objective and help you
start to see more equitable and equal outcomes on the
(14:26):
other side of that when you do that.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
Yeah, so let's imagine a workplace that's truly built on
inclusive leadership. What would it look, sound and feel like.
Speaker 2 (14:37):
It'd probably be super annoying because everybody would be trying
to make sure, well, Aster, did you've been quiet today?
Did you have anything to say? And Amy and Jerica
at least you know what I mean. Like, to a
certain extent, you want people to all have an inclusive mindset,
(15:00):
but it becomes hard. I've had times in my career
where people have said you're too inclusive. You just need
to make a damn decision and be on with it.
And I received that right, And so it's an art
and a science and its iterative. But I would say
if we did have the utopia of inclusive leadership as
a cultural norm in an organization, it would look very
(15:23):
different for every single organization. The thing that would be
pervasive is you'd have a lot of listening, you'd have
a lot of question asking, and your culture would be
set up such that it can change. Meaning a lot
of places are set up with values. Great, we're an
(15:44):
inclusive organization. But what that means is is that as
the macro economic and socioeconomic kind of environment changes, and
your talent pool changes, as generations in the workplace change,
how inclusion shows up maybe very different today than it
was ten years ago. And you'd be in organizations that
(16:06):
have learned to exercise that muscle of how do we
take a post check on what does inclusion mean this
year versus what it means next year versus last year? Right?
And so you find people less locked into this is
the only way we behave and more in tune with
(16:30):
We're always going to be checking in on what inclusion
means and what our people need, and to the extent
that we can, we're going to try to serve the
largest market of individuals, both internally but also outside. When
we think about customers.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
Man, listen, like I started this by saying, you know,
you're one of the great minds, and I truly enjoy
having conversations with you and just hearing your point of
view and looking forward to share more. But even in
this one, today learned once again something new being around you,
which is always a blessing when your circle is able
to teach you something, even after years of building. So
(17:08):
for that, I thank you and look forward to having
me back to share some more gems.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
Bro, thank you, brother, I look forward to being back.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
Yes, sir, till Mom, Thank you jam sharing us.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Sure will, I sure will, all right, all right, Regie
My guy, Damien Hooper Campbell is a friend of the
show for sure, who's also a leader in the impact
diversity leadership development space and just in general is a
great mind for everyone out here. You know, we spoke
the other day and you talked about where your true
passion kind of lied, and that was within this notion
(00:25):
of inclusive leadership. Give me some context. What does inclusive
leadership mean to you personally and professionally.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Well, first and foremost, thank you for that nice intro,
my brother, and thank you for having me for this conversation.
You know, personally, what if you really break it down,
inclusive leadership is nothing more than being thoughtful. It is
being thoughtful about every interaction you have and being thoughtful
(00:58):
about the people who might be on the fringe. You know,
oftentimes when folks are creating products and they want to
get to the total addressable market, they say, well, if
we can create this for the fringe user, then we
can capture everybody else. And people are very thoughtful in
that way. So personally, you know, it can be something
(01:20):
as simple as if we if we dial it back
to you know, when we were kids and playing kickball.
For those of us who were able to do. So,
you know, think about being the last person to get
selected for a squad and what that felt like. And
think about being on the outside of a circle when
you come to the playground and what that felt like. Right.
(01:42):
That is at the end of the day, imagine if
when we were kids, if we had the eq to say, Dang,
I don't want so and so to feel this way
just because of their size or their weight. I don't
want so and so to feel this way just because
they're the new kid at school. So I'm gonna go
out of my way to be thoughtful and pick them last,
even though everybody else might have.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Right.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
So that's like personally, if I bring it back to
some of the earliest memories, that's what it would be.
And you just carry that same mindset at its very
basic level forward to being a grown individual as we are.
And then professionally, it's the same thing. It is everything
(02:24):
from how you design products, it's how you design workplace
experiences and policies. It's as simple aster as if you're
going to have you've got a global company and you're
thinking about having an all hands or a meeting and
you say that you're inclusive of all, well, are you
just going to do one that is during a time
(02:45):
that is US based, or are you going to maybe
do two, not send a recorder to the folks an
apac and any media, but actually put in the effort
to do too, and think about enabling live transcription and
translation so that people can you know, be involved in
the conversation. So it spans across everything. But leading inclusively
(03:08):
is one of the most basic human characteristics and skill
sets that I think we typically have but also need
to continue to work at develop.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
It, you know, listening to you give the example the
childhood examples like literally took me back, like I literally
was back as a child, and thinking to those moments,
right because as many I was on both sides of
that right at times I was the one that wasn't
picked and then at times I was the one that
(03:38):
was the first pick. You know, the times when I
wasn't first picked it was because of the height or
what have you, or whatever issues other people might have
had with bringing me into the mix. But that's a
whole nother conversation. But in that d and I'm not
I'm not going against your thought process. I love because
how you made a very clear picture for me once
you broke it down with that example. But in that example,
(03:59):
I also think about, wait a minute, on the other
end of it, think about all the things that I
then did to make sure that I was presented in
a way that next time I wasn't the last one picked,
or I wasn't the one you know, thought about last
when bringing into the mix. Is there something there where
where you also are helping to build a level of
(04:22):
and I don't want to call it confidence or reassurance,
but you know, I do think we also live in
a society today where like, oh, everybody wins, you know
this first place, but then there's also nineteenth place and
we're gonna give you award too. So I feel like
there's a little bit of that in that in this
as well.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
No, yeah, I mean sure, but but no, everybody doesn't win.
And I actually think an important part of inclusive leadership,
especially as you start talking about us in a professional capacity,
but even personally, as being honest. The inclusive part about it.
(05:00):
It is not just being honest with folks about you
didn't win, you're not going to win, but and here's why, right,
So it's it's being clear and direct but also giving
the why for it, but it really is and having
the EQ to understand is a person ready to hear
that information? Have you asked that for permission to deliver
(05:21):
that information? And are you delivering it? If you're If
you happen to be a direct person and you love
honest feedback, that's great for you, but as a leader,
that may not be the way that every single person
likes to digest. And so having EQ and then you
know Danny Meyer, the great restaurant tour and creator of
(05:44):
shape Shack and eleven Madison and all things, talks about
enlightened hospitality. It's not just the knowing that there's a need,
but it's also taking the action to push that forward.
So yes, really what you hit on is and you
hit on it from even your own example of having
been on both sides of the trade right as a child,
(06:04):
being on the side where you weren't picked helps you
to understand what that feels like. And you know you
don't want anybody else feeling like that because that was
a horrible feeling as a kid. You could still feel
it now, you know what I'm saying, And so what
are you doing today in the form of EQ in
the form of giving people honest and direct feedback, but
(06:25):
delivering it in a way that lands for them and
at a time that lands for them, because no, everybody
doesn't win. The worst thing you could do, and it's
not directly exclusive, but it will prevent people from advancing
is not give people the feedback at some time and
in some way. Right, an inclusive leader thinks about that.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
I want to come back to that point, but I
want to touch on something that you were hitting on,
and I think it's this notion of empathy that you
were talking, right, And you obviously talk about empathy a lot.
We've had those conversations and why is it's so essential
though to leadership? And do you have an example of
when somebody really led with this empathy first and it
had a lasting impact on either you or their respective team.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
Yeah, I'm going to think on the example because you know,
this is the classic case of you have so many
and then and then they blank. So but empathy is
important because you know, and look, there's a difference between
sympathy and empathy, right, And what you talked about to
me is empathy with empathy being you really can understand
(07:33):
what that person went through because you had that experience
empathy being you may have compassion for that individual even
if you've never actually been through it. Right, I find
and I'll give you the primary example. I find that
when I used to go through the line at you know,
a grocery store, and you know, you're checking out, cashier says, hey,
(07:53):
do you want to donate to breast cancer? Do you
want to donate to this or whatever cause? Sometimes, if
I was, you know, in the mood, I say sure,
or other times I'm like, no, no, I'm good, I
do stuff elsewhere. The moment you lose somebody to breast cancer,
the moment you lose someone to whatever kind of illness,
or God forbid, the moment you go through one of
(08:14):
those experiences unfortunately but make it through. Fortunately. I guarantee
your disposition towards that cashier and magnating a dollar five
ten dollars is very different at the end of the day. Right.
And so you know, let me give you an example
of empathy and action that doesn't come from a leader
(08:35):
that I necessarily know, and it might not be what
most people define as a leader. There is a picture
that I have that sometimes I use in presentations just
to help people to understand, like this thing is in
rocket science. And if you can imagine this picture aster,
it's about five five kids dressed in suits. They have
(08:56):
on kind of these black you know suits, and they
have on white shirt it's in a black top. And
then in the middle of them is one kid and
he just has on a white shirt and he's got
on a red tie. Right, these kids can't be any
older than ten to twelve years old. And the story
(09:16):
goes that they all go to the same private school
somewhere in the world, and the one in the middle
with the red tie, for whatever reason, couldn't celebrate Halloween,
and so he couldn't wear a costume. And his boys
got together and said, what can we do to be
(09:37):
inclusive of this individual, And so they would wear blazers
to private school anyway. So they all dressed in their blazers,
got some black slacks, wore whatever ties they had, and
let him come to school regularly, got a red tie
and just took his blazer off so that they looked
like secret service standing around the President of the United
(10:01):
and collectively made Halloween for him while still respecting is
religious norms, right and traditions and allowed him to come
as he was while still being involved in the moment.
And so that's one of the ones that sticks out
to me because again they saw the need, they understood it,
(10:22):
whether it was sympathy or empathy depending on their experiences,
and then they took action and led in a way
to be inclusive of another individual.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
And they took action by meeting him in the situation
where they were.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
That's right, that's right, Which gets to your point. Do
you just hear your earlier point about about people needing
to change sometimes? And yes, we all need to morph
and develop. We can't everybody can't just come as they are,
like some of the stuff, we need to leave it all.
But yes, they met that young man right where he was.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
You talked about earlier, and I said, I was going
to come back to it. The notion of feedback and
providing feedback, and you know, and a lot of these
environments that that we've frequented and excelled in and have
grown in, you know, a lot of feedback at times
is used not necessarily for the true development of the individual,
(11:20):
but more so as a reason to hinder or hold
back or put in a box. Which it let me
tell you some these the yearly reviews and all that, Like,
sometimes I cringe at how those tools are used, how
those tools are used and not from a true development standpoint,
So how do you ensure that you create an environment?
(11:41):
And it sounds like it comes back to the person,
the individual of making sure that when you're providing feedback
it's done in a way where we're truly trying to
help to enhance and grow rather than deter break down control.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
This is so there's a there's a structural piece to
this and a cultural piece. By structural I mean processes, policies, right,
and things that are set up that need to be
inclusive in the way they're designed. And by cultural, I
mean even if you have all those policies and structures
(12:18):
and processes, well, if you don't have the mindset, if
you don't understand why as a human being it's important
to do things a certain way, then the structural stuff
alone won't matter. So from a process standpoint one, you've
got to be involved in it, right, So if you're
going to be a real influencer, you have to be
involved in it as a leader in the places. And
(12:40):
I can't say that I've done this perfectly. Heck, I'm
still learning how to get better at this. But as
a leader, as we think about, you know, policies around feedback, etc.
One of the main things you want to do is
make sure that it's objective in nature that you're getting
rid of. Oh, I really like this person, or this
person reminds me of myself. There's nothing wrong with those things,
(13:00):
but that ain't got nothing to do with wether or
not the person has actually done the job well. And
if you take it even a step behind AST, you
have to make sure that when you are setting goals
and targets for individuals that you're being really clear about
what does success look like. I've been at places and
heard of places where what it means to get from
(13:20):
level A to level A plus two is different depending
on what part of the world you're in, depending on
what function. But it's not written out anywhere and becomes
super subjective. And that's where some of these things. If
I don't like you, or if you push back on
me and I don't like that, but I happen to
be your manager, that's where astor people start to use
(13:42):
some of these processes to hinder folks instead of advancing them.
And then culturally, you have to educate people. You've got
to educate people on what happens to our behaviors unconsciously.
You got to educate people on how without even knowing,
they may be saying and doing things that are hindering folks.
(14:03):
And then you've got to make it really personal for them.
And I think that there are ways to do that
that are experiential. Some of that is through storytelling, but
the combination of both structural and cultural things when it
comes to feedback, talent management processes, etc. It's those things
that make them a lot more objective and help you
start to see more equitable and equal outcomes on the
(14:26):
other side of that when you do that.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
Yeah, so let's imagine a workplace that's truly built on
inclusive leadership. What would it look, sound and feel like.
Speaker 2 (14:37):
It'd probably be super annoying because everybody would be trying
to make sure, well, Aster, did you've been quiet today?
Did you have anything to say? And Amy and Jerica
at least you know what I mean. Like, to a
certain extent, you want people to all have an inclusive mindset,
(15:00):
but it becomes hard. I've had times in my career
where people have said you're too inclusive. You just need
to make a damn decision and be on with it.
And I received that right, And so it's an art
and a science and its iterative. But I would say
if we did have the utopia of inclusive leadership as
a cultural norm in an organization, it would look very
(15:23):
different for every single organization. The thing that would be
pervasive is you'd have a lot of listening, you'd have
a lot of question asking, and your culture would be
set up such that it can change. Meaning a lot
of places are set up with values. Great, we're an
(15:44):
inclusive organization. But what that means is is that as
the macro economic and socioeconomic kind of environment changes, and
your talent pool changes, as generations in the workplace change,
how inclusion shows up maybe very different today than it
was ten years ago. And you'd be in organizations that
(16:06):
have learned to exercise that muscle of how do we
take a post check on what does inclusion mean this
year versus what it means next year versus last year? Right?
And so you find people less locked into this is
the only way we behave and more in tune with
(16:30):
We're always going to be checking in on what inclusion
means and what our people need, and to the extent
that we can, we're going to try to serve the
largest market of individuals, both internally but also outside. When
we think about customers.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
Man, listen, like I started this by saying, you know,
you're one of the great minds, and I truly enjoy
having conversations with you and just hearing your point of
view and looking forward to share more. But even in
this one, today learned once again something new being around you,
which is always a blessing when your circle is able
to teach you something, even after years of building. So
(17:08):
for that, I thank you and look forward to having
me back to share some more gems.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
Bro, thank you, brother, I look forward to being back.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
Yes, sir, till Mom, Thank you jam sharing us.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Sure will, I sure will, all right, all right, Regie
Host
Astor Chamber
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