The Cycle of Grief

Whether it's the death of a loved one, the loss of a relationship, or a big life change, we all have to deal with grief at some point in our lives. It's not th same for everyone, and it's never easy. In this episode, the Ellises talk about their recent run in with grief and how they are dealing with it. Dead Ass.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
This may come to a surprise to everyone, but everybody's
gonna die.

Speaker 2 (00:08):
Well, damn, just jump right in. Why don't you.

Speaker 3 (00:13):
Well When they say that grief comes in waves and stages,
I've become far too familiar and acquainted with.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
That in the past few months.

Speaker 4 (00:21):
Dead ass.

Speaker 3 (00:25):
Hey, I'm Kadeen and I'm Devoured and we're the Ellis's.

Speaker 4 (00:29):
You may know us from posting funny videos with our.

Speaker 2 (00:31):
Voys and reading each other publicly as a form of therapy.

Speaker 4 (00:36):
Wait, I make you need therapy most days. Wow.

Speaker 2 (00:39):
Oh, and one more important thing to mention, we're married, Yes.

Speaker 4 (00:42):
Sir, we are.

Speaker 1 (00:43):
We created this podcast to open dialogue about some of
li's most taboo topics.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
Things most folks don't want to talk about.

Speaker 1 (00:50):
Through the lens of a millennial married couple. Dead ass
is a term that we say every day. So when
we say dead ass, we're actually saying facts one hundred,
the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
Were about to take philosoff to our whole new level.

Speaker 2 (01:06):
Dead ass starts right now.

Speaker 1 (01:11):
So storytime, story time, I'm gonna take y'all back to.

Speaker 4 (01:18):
I was.

Speaker 1 (01:22):
Nineteen ninety six. Oh wow, back nineteen ninety six. Yes,
I was in seventh grade.

Speaker 2 (01:27):
Nineteen hundreds.

Speaker 4 (01:29):
As our kids would say, we're ancients, were vintage.

Speaker 1 (01:34):
My Grandpa Titty one of my most favorite people in
the world.

Speaker 4 (01:37):
Man.

Speaker 1 (01:37):
He was married to my Grandma Wa. Shout out to
both of them. Titty t O O t I E
Titty t d. Okay, you said, Grandpa.

Speaker 2 (01:47):
Tittymes that sounds like.

Speaker 3 (01:49):
It does sound like to the Grandpa Titty.

Speaker 1 (01:52):
He was My grandma Wa was I believe, second husband,
and he was the one I grew up with knowing
the most, very rich, just man cool though, but he
you know, he's he was a grandpa. He did with
Grandpa did start with you know what I'm saying, And
I remember he got sick and at that time I
was twelve, and during those times, your parents didn't talk

(02:12):
to you about grief or talk to you about illness
or sickness. It was just like Grandpapa Titty sick and
it is what it is. So we would go see
Grandma Wah Wah, go see my aunt Weezy, my uncle Sam,
and Grandpa Tooty just wasn't there. So one night I'd
had a dream and we can do a whole nother
podcast about these dreams I'd be having. But I had

(02:32):
a dream about my karate teacher one night, and it
was the same dream about me running through the forest
and then I would fall in a hole and then
the hole was like everlasting, and I would feel that
feeling of like falling, and then I would see their
face and I would wake up. I had that dream
about my grandma karate teacher, and he passed like two

(02:53):
days shortly after that, I had the same dream about
Grandpa Tooty. So I woke up in the middle of
the night and I demanded to my parents, I have
to go see Grandpa Titty, and they obliged. They took
me and my brother to go see Grandpa Titty, all
of us.

Speaker 4 (03:08):
I went in the room.

Speaker 1 (03:09):
Brian didn't. And when I saw Grandpa Titty, he was
dying of cancer. At that point, he was down to
like maybe ninety something pounds. He had the tube in
his mouth, the machine was breathing for him, and I
was immediately frightened, like immediately frightened.

Speaker 4 (03:25):
But the next day he passed away. And ever since then.

Speaker 1 (03:31):
Until my grandfather Charles Edward Ela Senior passed, I dealt
with grief.

Speaker 4 (03:37):
Completely different.

Speaker 3 (03:42):
All right, karaoke karaoke time. So there's so many songs
that we could sing about. There are so many songs
in death.

Speaker 4 (03:50):
And what was.

Speaker 1 (03:51):
The song that I first originally said I wanted to
sing in the cover I'll be missing you.

Speaker 4 (03:56):
Yeah, I'll be missing you.

Speaker 3 (03:57):
You know.

Speaker 4 (03:59):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (03:59):
B I g Faith Evans, you know what I'm saying.
But then K was just like, no, we can sing
a different song, and being the clown she is, started
singing the song.

Speaker 4 (04:11):
So I said, you know what, trying.

Speaker 2 (04:12):
To laugh through my sadness, Let's give the people what
they want.

Speaker 4 (04:16):
Boom boom boom boom boom boom.

Speaker 1 (04:19):
Boom boom boom, tell me what you don't and do
what they know where to run, judge me, come figure
and judge me, Come for you, but you don't know
where to judge me.

Speaker 4 (04:37):
Now you can't tell me. Y'all know what he was saying.

Speaker 2 (04:41):
Everybody guds got it.

Speaker 1 (04:42):
And I'm gonna miss everybody out and roll the bone man.

Speaker 4 (04:50):
That's case favorite. Whenever I do the same.

Speaker 1 (04:56):
Shout out to a harmony who pretty much much created
a whole different sound that became one of the most
popular sounds in rapping.

Speaker 2 (05:05):
And they were literally in their own travel. And where
are you now?

Speaker 1 (05:10):
I don't know, still doing tours singing Crossroads because it's
a dope song and it's nobody like it except Twist.
The kind of came in sort of rapping fast like that,
but nobody did it with the harmonizing like thugs bone
thugs in harmony.

Speaker 2 (05:23):
Yeah, shout out to boone thugs and harmony. Where are
y'all at?

Speaker 4 (05:26):
See you at the crossroads? You will be lonely.

Speaker 1 (05:30):
And I'm gonna missmony and I'm gonna miss seremony.

Speaker 2 (05:33):
That must be your favorite part.

Speaker 1 (05:35):
And I'm gonna miss smony.

Speaker 2 (05:38):
What don't miss, though, is these bills.

Speaker 3 (05:40):
So let's go pay these ads and pay some bills,
get into the ads rather, and we're gonna be back
after we take a good break.

Speaker 2 (05:48):
So stick around, y'all.

Speaker 3 (05:53):
I pray that you don't have any dreams of running
through forests and falling and seeing my face or kids,
everybody that we love. That's crazy that you've done. Have
you had those dreams since then?

Speaker 4 (06:06):
To be honest, no, you haven't.

Speaker 1 (06:08):
I haven't, And to be honest, I haven't lost anyone
like that. Who my parents took me to see someone
about the dreams, And what I learned at that time
was that dreams are often manifestations of things that you
think about the most. That's how it was explained to me.
So if you're thinking about something, you've fallen asleep or
have you ever been sleeping or in a realm of sleep,

(06:31):
and then you hear something going on, and then you
wake up and what you hear was on television.

Speaker 3 (06:36):
Yes, like you you fall in with the TV on,
or someone's having a conversation around you. Yes, that kind
of becomes like your dream. Yes, and you think you're dreaming,
but it really was something happening. Right, Yeah, I've been there.

Speaker 1 (06:46):
So how it was explained to me at the time
I was real young was that you know, you were
thinking about these people, you care about these people, and
those thoughts manifest themselves into dreams, and dreams often manifest
themselves into what happens, because we as people tend to
live about our dreams.

Speaker 4 (07:01):
Right.

Speaker 1 (07:01):
So when I asked to see my grandfather, same way
I didn't. I didn't ask to see my karate teacher.
Shout out to Anthony Commander, who died very young at
the early age of thirty two. I believe he had
a heart attack in the stage. But it frightened me.
Frightened me so after that point, and you know, I've

(07:23):
never expressed this to people, but I'll say it now.

Speaker 4 (07:26):
There were three people who are very very.

Speaker 1 (07:29):
Close to me, well four actually four people who are
very very close to me, who because of what I
went through with Grandpa Tooty, when they started to get
older and I noticed that they were starting to decline
in health, I just avoided.

Speaker 4 (07:44):
Going to see them with them, yes, because I.

Speaker 1 (07:47):
Didn't want it to be on my mind and I
think about it, then I have the dream and then
that's the last time I see them, you know.

Speaker 3 (07:53):
So it was almost like protecting yourself from that, protecting
them from possibly dying sooner.

Speaker 1 (08:00):
I thought I was with my Grandma Wah Wah first
and foremost, that she was like my heart you and
I used to go visit her every time we came
back from Hostra, we drove by Farmers Boulevard and we
stopped to see my Grandma wah Wah like she was
one of my favorite people. She listened to my games
on the radio, and as she started to get really,
really sick.

Speaker 4 (08:18):
It was hard for me to go see her.

Speaker 1 (08:19):
Because I was like, man, I don't want her to die.
I was being selfish. I don't want her to die,
so I'm not going to go see her. This way,
i don't think about her and I don't dream, and
I'm not going to be the reason she died.

Speaker 4 (08:29):
Same thing with Pastor Boyd.

Speaker 1 (08:31):
And it all changed really with my Grandpa Charles, and
it was because they lived with my parents. I went
to go see them as much as I could. I
didn't go see them because I was afraid. But then
when Pop went into the hospital he was suffering with COPD,
and my dad called and said, you know, I think

(08:54):
you need to get over here because this may be
the last few times you get a chance to.

Speaker 4 (08:57):
See your pops. So like all I bet.

Speaker 1 (09:01):
I remember that's what we had Jackson, Cairo and Caves
at the time, and we packed up the car. We
dropped them to your parents' house and we went to
go Seapop. I remember going into the hospital and people
from my family had started driving up from Virginia, six
hour eight hour drives just to be able to see Pop,
because he was the patriarch of the family and they

(09:21):
wanted to see him before he was gone. And he
didn't just have COPD, he had heart disease, he had
liver issues, he had diabetes, and he had a coloss
me back, like I said before, it was everything.

Speaker 4 (09:31):
So I think his body was just failing him.

Speaker 1 (09:33):
And my grandmother had just went into a home because
she's suffering from dementia, still suffering from dementia, and I
feel like his will to live and survive had finally
gone because he knew my grandmother was going to be okay.

Speaker 2 (09:44):
Because prior to that, he was her soul.

Speaker 4 (09:47):
Yeah, feel taker.

Speaker 2 (09:48):
I mean, even with everything he was going through.

Speaker 3 (09:49):
I remember just seeing how strong he was man the
fact that he gets up and he still made her
breakfast and still cooked brought her food.

Speaker 2 (09:56):
To her and every day all that.

Speaker 3 (09:58):
And it was also hard because she had her moments
where she had, you know, her episodes dealing with dementia,
and like she didn't even either remember who he was
at the time or she was going back to like
certain times in their life and he was just like
man like.

Speaker 4 (10:11):
And it was a lot to she remembered who he
was always.

Speaker 1 (10:15):
But I don't know what it is about dementia sometimes
they always remember the times that were the most difficult.
So she would wake up and see him and think
that she was in a time where they were going
through something. And I remember my dad being upstairs and
I'm like, you know, comebine. I hear her screaming, and
he would just my fault. My grandfather is funny, right,
My grandfather's funny because my father said he would go

(10:36):
downstairs and just check on Nan and Nanna, you're okay,
And he'd walk by, Pop wouldn't say nothing, and she
be in her room screaming child Charles, and then he'd
be like, Dad, you okay, Dad, okay.

Speaker 4 (10:45):
You didn't say not Dad, You're okay? He look up,
what did you say? Turn? He just turned off his
here and there and was watching the TV.

Speaker 3 (10:55):
I love that, just watching it, watching the TV with
no sound, even if I don't have to hear her.

Speaker 1 (11:00):
So it's funny though, that, like he loved her so
much that he was willing to sit in that. But
what really helped me deal with my grief was when
he was dying, my dad, who is now going to
be the patriarch of the family because his older brother
is suffering from Alzheimer's, like my grand my grandmother. It
was his decision of how we're going to handle pop's care.
And he was on morphine at the time because the

(11:24):
pain was so bad and he was had oxygen on
his nose, and he had said to my dad, Troy,
have mercy.

Speaker 4 (11:32):
I'm tired. Like that's all he said, I'm tired. Have mercy.

Speaker 1 (11:38):
And he was like that, like what do you mean,
Like what do you mean, Like if you spoke to
the doctor, the doctor said they can do this, and
he was just like no, He's like, no, have mercy.

Speaker 4 (11:47):
Please let me go.

Speaker 1 (11:49):
Literally said that to my dad, Troy, let me go,
have mercy, and I knew. I think he knew at
that point that my dad was the one in control
because he was of soundmi body. But they always leave
it up to a family member to make the decision.

Speaker 4 (12:04):
So my dad called his sisters in there.

Speaker 1 (12:06):
They spoke about it, and they had the discussion and
my father was just like, yo, like we can't be
selfish and say we won't pop around for us or
have him laid up in the hospital trying to deal
with all of these things.

Speaker 4 (12:18):
There's no quality of life. So the next part.

Speaker 1 (12:21):
Is like the most poetic part that may help me
deal with grief. After all of the grandkids, great grandkids
came up, he saw its great grandkids, my brother, his
grandson's daughter came up. Like he saw all of the generations,
four generations. He asked my dad to let him go.
My dad agreed to sign an NDR a DNR a DNR,

(12:43):
and the doctor said, once we take the oxygen out,
it's going to be difficult for.

Speaker 4 (12:47):
Him to breathe.

Speaker 1 (12:47):
He may last, you know, a day. It's going to
be a labor but we'll give him more fhiend so
he'll be comfortable. But once he takes the oxygen out,
it's all on him and his lungs aren't strong enough
to support it. And my father said, okay, deal. My
grandfather said, okay, sign the paperwork. They left. My father said,

(13:07):
my grandfather took the oxygen out his nose and by himself,
just took it out like this, looked at my father, smirked,
tears rolled down his eyes like this. He took a
deep breath, laid his head back. He was going in
ten seconds.

Speaker 2 (13:26):
A way to go.

Speaker 1 (13:27):
And that helped me deal with grief because he did
on his own terms. He got a chance to see
his family. He didn't die alone, died with his son there.
But it was such a proud moment. But it reminded

(13:51):
me is that we are in charge of our own destiny,
you know what I'm saying, And it's not up to
someone else to create what I were a final moments
are supposed to be. So it also helped me realize
that I can't ever blame myself, because a lot of
time grief is blame, you know, or guilt.

Speaker 3 (14:09):
It's one of the stages of grief is guilt like
what could have done differently?

Speaker 2 (14:13):
Or what more could I have done?

Speaker 3 (14:15):
You know?

Speaker 1 (14:16):
So, but seeing Pope helped me in ways that I
didn't think because I thought that if I saw him
it would be I would see him in a sad
state and I would remember the bad times and thinking
about Grandpa Tooty. But then after seeing him that day
and my dad and then us coming back. You remember,
it was about six of us in that room after
he passed and we're just making jokes and his body

(14:38):
is still warm. He's over there, and there was like
a family moment with him sitting there. And ever since then,
I've dealt with grief differently.

Speaker 3 (14:45):
Differently, I think, well, at this point, when you guys
hear in real time now, my grandmother passed yesterday, yes
and she got super sick last June, developed a kittie infection,
went septic, and typically with sepsis at her age, she
should not have survived it, especially how severe it was

(15:10):
borderline pneumonia. Like there were just a bunch of things
falling apart at the same time. And my hats off
to my mom, my aunt, Susie who's also a nurse,
my sister, because the three of them really rallied around
each other with their clinical background to be able to
help the doctors and nurses kind of work on a
plan to get Grandma through that because there was a
lot of like juggling medications. You know, she had congestive

(15:30):
heart failure also, you know the kidney issue. Then there's
you know, the fluid building and the lungs and the breathing.
So she literally was kind of like this puzzle that
they were all trying to figure out the best way
to you know, give one medication but then not throw
something else off to require another medication. So in June,
we really thought that was the end, and I think
her feeling as ill as she did. You know, she

(15:53):
called for you know, her children and her grandchildren. It's
like everybody's just like, oh no, we got to go
see her. She's in FaceTime with my aunts.

Speaker 2 (15:59):
There's you know. So all that happened in June. I
made my way down there.

Speaker 3 (16:03):
I remember you saying just go, like off everything and go,
and we drove down my mom and I to see her.
And I mean, my grandmother is a strong woman. Her
mom lived till ninety seven, so I was really thinking
Grandma was gonna make it up into the nineties. I'm like, oh,
that's the life expectancy on that side for sure. But
she pushed past it, and she really had to. It
was an uphill battle for her physically mentally because of

(16:26):
the sepsis.

Speaker 2 (16:27):
Her cognitive functions were all off. She was confused.

Speaker 3 (16:32):
But it was weird the timing when everything happened, because
you think about grief that you can prepare for because
you know someone's going within, there's the sudden grief or
the tragic grief or the tragic loss that's out of
nowhere that she don't expect. So as Grandma was getting better,
over the summer, she still had a little bit of
confusion going into the fall, and my uncle Paul passed

(16:55):
away October fourth in his sleep with a heart attack,
and it almost kind of helped grandma my deal with
the grief of that, because she still had this confusion
of that, like Paul didn't.

Speaker 2 (17:05):
Die, like there's no way, you know.

Speaker 3 (17:07):
But then she would also say, yeah, she was calling
his phone still and she's just like, why didn't Paul
call me today? Because he would call her every day.
So that confusion that she had and also him not
being in the same state as her kind of helped
her deal with the grief of losing her son, because
we definitely thought that was going to throw her over
the edge.

Speaker 1 (17:23):
They said, there's one thing that a mother should never do,
and that's bury their child.

Speaker 2 (17:27):
Their child. Yeah, that's in fact.

Speaker 4 (17:29):
The mother should never have to endure that.

Speaker 2 (17:31):
Nope, nope.

Speaker 3 (17:31):
And I feel like if if that had happened when
she before she even got sick in June, it would
have been a completely different reaction for her losing my uncle.
But you know, the family had to work past that
because again, that was sudden, unexpected. He wasn't ill you know,
to our knowledge, like everything was fine. So by November,
Grandma was back to her old self. She called me
for my birthday. Actually just replayed a voice note that

(17:53):
she left me on my birthday. She would call me
sweet Ka and she's like, sweet Ka, happy birthday. I
know you're probably now with the family, and you know,
so she was back to her normal self in December,
so we were all thinking, okay, we're on the oven up,
and you know, she I think her body just got tired. Yeah,
her body just got tired. She had you know, eight children,

(18:17):
six who were living you know, worked for years and
years and years, didn't have the easiest life back home
in Jamaica. And I just think that her body was tired.
But she was holding on a lot for the family.
So we tend to see that sometimes with older family members,
like you.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
Know, you just want to be there for the family.

Speaker 3 (18:34):
Because I think she also anticipated how great the loss
was going to be for us, you know, her grandchildren,
her children, her great grands So there was that will
to live that she had for a long time, and
she fought. But things took a turn for the worst,
you know, ten days ago or two weeks now at
this point, you know, her doctors pretty much said that

(18:56):
there was nothing more medically that they could do for her.
They couldn't juggle them dedication anymore, her body was refilling
with fluid again, she was in stage three killing kidney failure,
you know.

Speaker 2 (19:06):
The heart heart failure as well.

Speaker 3 (19:09):
So there really just wasn't anything from a medical standpoint
that they could do anymore for her. So that's when
the family decided along with her because at this point
now cognitively again she's in a good space.

Speaker 2 (19:19):
Yah, And she agreed to go on hospice.

Speaker 3 (19:23):
So when I heard hospice, I'm thinking, Okay, well hospice.
Some people are in hospice for months, you know, some
people are in hospice for a couple of days. And
we were just hopeful that she would pull through until again,
at the very end, it's a very like one day's
a good day, the next day is not a good day.
And we got a call on a Sunday that it

(19:44):
wasn't a good day. So Mom and I, you know,
and my mom, I realized that she was she wasn't
in a rush to get down there. And I don't
know if part of it was denial for her just
thinking like no, like, Mom's not going to go now,
or part of it just also being not knowing how
to face it and deal with the fact that you're
losing your mother. So I really tried to give my
mom grace in that moment because my grandmother was asking

(20:06):
for her, but she kept saying, Oh, I'll go.

Speaker 2 (20:08):
Down like next week.

Speaker 3 (20:10):
And I was like, Mom, I don't want Grandma to
not make it. And you say that you were on
your way like with Grandpa, because that exactly happened with
my grandfather. We were living in New York and Brooklyn
at the time, and they said, I think you should
come down, Sharon, and she had a flight like the
day or day after and Grandpa passed, and she was

(20:31):
just like, Dad, you didn't wait for me.

Speaker 2 (20:33):
You didn't wait for me. I was on my way.

Speaker 3 (20:34):
And I was heartbroken for her in that moment because
I'm like, man, she didn't get a chance, you know,
to go down and make peace with it and say
her goodbye.

Speaker 2 (20:41):
So to avoid something like this happening again with her mom.

Speaker 3 (20:46):
In the event that Grandma lives through hospice for months, great,
but if not, I want to make sure that you're
down there to see her. She's asking specifically for you.
She was asking for me, she was asking for my sister.
So we went down to see her and she did
perk up a bit because I just feel like being
in the same space with.

Speaker 2 (21:03):
Her, you know, she was seeing her favorite people.

Speaker 4 (21:06):
You know.

Speaker 2 (21:06):
We had two really good days with her.

Speaker 3 (21:09):
I was able to talk to her, thank her, you know,
for the impact she had in my life for the
past forty years, the impact over the life that we've
had together. Our boys who were fortunate enough to meet
her and know her, Yeah.

Speaker 4 (21:25):
She helped.

Speaker 1 (21:25):
She helped bring them into this life. When she literally
had the boys, she always flew up. She always helped
for weeks she was there.

Speaker 3 (21:35):
She was remember for our home birth with Kaz. She like,
you know, there was nothing like having that maternal support,
you know, from the women around me that I really
needed in that space. She got to come see our
house here in Georgia. So I was just talking to
her about those things, and she was like, okayky, my
little girl that never used to like to eat, you know,

(21:56):
and she's talking about as a kid, yep. And I said,
what's my favorite meal that you would make me? And
she said, oh, you love Oxdale and one of the
last things she said to me, because at this point
I know that I'm essentially saying goodbye to her.

Speaker 1 (22:14):
That's all right, baby, take your time, still very fresh.

Speaker 2 (22:21):
So knowing that.

Speaker 3 (22:28):
I knew that this was going to be my last
time seeing her, in my last conversation with her, and.

Speaker 2 (22:38):
I was like, all right, Grandma, I got.

Speaker 3 (22:39):
To get back to the boys and they have school,
and you know, Devale was holding down the fort for me,
so I said, I have to go. I said, but
I love you, and I thank you for everything, and
just watch over us. And she said, okay, I'm so
proud of you. I'm so proud of you and Deville

(23:03):
and those boys. And I said I love you and
she said I love you too. And that was our
last conversation in person, you know, And of course I called,
you know, face timed her the next couple of days,
just check on her and stuff. You know, have a
screenshot of she and I have FaceTime. Because she would
never put her face in the phone. It was always

(23:25):
like half of the ceiling and like half of her eyes.
So I was on FaceTime with her the last time,
I think was on Monday, and she passed on Wednesday.
And it's crazy because of course you tried to prepare
for it. So I thought that going down to see
her prepares me. And I'm like, oh, I'll be fine.

(23:46):
But you know, when she goes to the least, I
know she's not in pain. And I got to speak
to her, I got to tell everything I want to
tell her. When it actually happens, it's like, nothing can
really prepare you for that. But I do feel like, man,
in my forty years, we lived, yeah together, we lived.

Speaker 4 (24:11):
A good times.

Speaker 3 (24:12):
Yeah, No, we had some good times. She would come
other than when she would come up to New York
for the holidays, you know Mother's Day. There was like
two or three Mother's Day that we drove to Virginia
to meet my friend Tiffany, and we'd have a spa
weekend together. You know. Every time I was on the
bus coming home from high school, I had a heat
to the house. She had cut me a key when

(24:34):
I was taking the bus, and she was like, just
keep the key in case you need to stop in
the house, like it's always here for you.

Speaker 1 (24:40):
You know.

Speaker 2 (24:40):
She was the only one that had McDonald's money for me.

Speaker 3 (24:43):
Back in the day when my parents were like, no,
there's food at home.

Speaker 2 (24:46):
She'd just like pushed the McDonald's money in my hand.

Speaker 1 (24:49):
Grandma always gonna give you McDonald's Monday, because mother's always
gonna ask you got McDonald's money.

Speaker 4 (24:54):
Oh yeah, yeah, because I do.

Speaker 3 (24:56):
Grandma gave me McDonald's money, you know, just everything she said,
take me around the corner to S and D to
go shop for like dresses for church.

Speaker 2 (25:04):
She'd take us to Sabbath School together.

Speaker 3 (25:05):
And we just wanted to be like Tristan and I
just wanted to be in her presence, so we'd go
to Sabbath School with her, come back to the house.
She taught me almost everything I know about cooking, how
to be a great mom, how to be a great wife.
Like it doesn't yet it didn't.

Speaker 2 (25:26):
It didn't die with her, No, it didn't.

Speaker 1 (25:31):
Roots You know, you you will live through Grandma will
live through you.

Speaker 4 (25:36):
Just know that.

Speaker 3 (25:37):
I definitely pray that I can be a fraction you
know of the woman that she was, especially as like
a wife and a grandmother and a and a mom.
You know.

Speaker 1 (25:49):
I remember one of the earliest memories I have going
to your house for Christmas. Of course Grandma was there
and you got me a plate of fool and she
came over.

Speaker 2 (25:59):
Oh yeah, she came home.

Speaker 4 (26:01):
When she snatched the plate of food up, she said.

Speaker 2 (26:04):
No, no, no, that's not how we do think here.

Speaker 4 (26:07):
You don't feed no matter food on a plastic plate,
paper plate.

Speaker 3 (26:11):
I was like my grandma's Christmas and we're doing all disposable.
Ain't nobody washing no more dishes. We've been cooking all day.
And she said, go and get the young man a
plate out of the cupboard, and you get a good food.
And it's forking knife. Because she was always like my
grandfather with the forking knife. But yep, she always made

(26:32):
sure she wants to make sure that was taken care of.

Speaker 2 (26:34):
And she was a real one.

Speaker 3 (26:35):
She used always, you know, even after I had kids
and everything, she used to tell me, take care of yourself,
you know, make sure your husband sees you're looking good
and nice and.

Speaker 2 (26:43):
Picked up back yourself. She would tell me that when
she just she just knew, she knew what it took.

Speaker 4 (26:49):
She did, she didn't know what it took.

Speaker 1 (26:51):
And she was also willing to jump in and be
an active participant in making sure that you were able
to be where you needed to be for the family.
That's why she came up. The baby will be crying
and she will go grab the baby up.

Speaker 3 (27:02):
And remember that, did you ever tell the story at
the time she came and thought it was the baby?

Speaker 2 (27:08):
Yeah, so embarrassing.

Speaker 4 (27:11):
This is actually a funny, very very funny.

Speaker 3 (27:13):
Grandma probably laughed to herself about that while I was
like crawling into a hole and wanted to die.

Speaker 1 (27:20):
So me and Kay, Me and Kay went out one
time and we came back at a very nice time,
and Grandma was staying with us. And at this time
Grandma was staying it back in Jackson's room.

Speaker 2 (27:33):
We're in the apartment.

Speaker 1 (27:34):
We're in the apartment and me and Kay doing what
we do and k then was a little you know,
so she was a little bit louder than normal because
typically when we know that, when we.

Speaker 4 (27:47):
Know that Grandma's there is quiet tom.

Speaker 1 (27:50):
But she was making a little bit noise, and I
think Grandma believed it was the baby. So Grandma busted
in the room as she normally do, and there was
some things going on. Not the funny thing was Kau
then don't even remember Grandma busting in the room. I
busting her eyes. I'm like oh shoo, and kays like
what what what? Grandma closed the door back? Never said

(28:13):
anything like she just closed the door back. Now, y'all
know me, I ain't gonna stop once Grandma closed the door, right,
she had eight.

Speaker 4 (28:20):
Kids and the baby.

Speaker 2 (28:22):
Maybe you had to like nurse the baby or something.

Speaker 4 (28:24):
Yes, that's literally, that's literally what happened.

Speaker 2 (28:28):
If I had some drinks that I wouldn't have been nursing.

Speaker 4 (28:30):
But we had went out and then you just wanted the.

Speaker 2 (28:33):
Baby, wanted the baby, so you were.

Speaker 1 (28:36):
And you grabbed the baby and the baby was sleep
and you were just like, wow, we were doing our things.
But the funny part is the next morning I come out,
and you know, I like to handle things head on,
so I wasn't gonna act like Grandma didn't just see me.

Speaker 4 (28:50):
Asked up. You know what I'm saying. Well, k ass up,
you know what I'm saying. But both of us asked,
So I was like, hey.

Speaker 1 (28:57):
Grandma, she said, you all you know I'm here, but
I'm not here.

Speaker 4 (29:04):
That's all she said. And then she just kept them moving.

Speaker 1 (29:09):
And I respected it because she respected our house and
I probably the same way when Kaz was here and
you and I ended up having an argument. It wasn't
just about those When we were having an argument, we were
going at it. And then, just like with the sex thing,
the next day, I went up to Grandma and I said, Grandma,
no you heard, and she said, be tart, I'm here,

(29:33):
but I'm not here. And I was like, see that's
a grandma Grandma's they don't get involved.

Speaker 4 (29:40):
She never judged me or okay for anything.

Speaker 2 (29:43):
She definitely gave me a talking after though, she said
your a husband.

Speaker 4 (29:46):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (29:47):
I just know he had a point. Since when did
you get on his side? Like when did this?

Speaker 4 (29:54):
Do you remember what the argument was about?

Speaker 2 (29:55):
Don't you remember what it was about?

Speaker 1 (29:57):
The argument was about you you went out with the girl.
There was a time when we had just had cash.
You had went out with the girls because it was
right like after your birthday and I was calling and
I couldn't get you, and you had said you were
going to.

Speaker 4 (30:09):
Call me when you got there.

Speaker 1 (30:11):
So then you you didn't call when you got there,
and then we only had one card at the time.

Speaker 4 (30:15):
Then you came back late.

Speaker 1 (30:16):
I still had to go to work, and then we
were arguing about communication, and then you were saying.

Speaker 4 (30:22):
Like if I don't get out often, and it was
just an argument.

Speaker 1 (30:26):
It was one of those arguments that you know, I want.
I was concerned about where you were. But Grandma was
definitely like one of one, you know, and not not
to shift gears, but it reminds me of my grandmother.

Speaker 2 (30:44):
Like my Nana, like that generation of folks.

Speaker 4 (30:47):
They were different. They understood.

Speaker 1 (30:51):
As you get older, you you understand why things are
the way they are. And my Nana was like live
wire to say the least. But her heart was so huge.
And my grandmother is still alive, but she has dementia bad,

(31:14):
so her mind. She hasn't been with us, so I
say at least ten years now.

Speaker 4 (31:23):
No, it wasn't that bad Pops.

Speaker 1 (31:25):
Pops passed in twenty and nineteen, so I would say
since twenty seventeen she's been kind of like going, so
it's about seven years.

Speaker 2 (31:36):
It's always weird when anyone talks about her.

Speaker 3 (31:38):
And the fact was like Nana was, I'm like, she's
still here and she's still alive, but she is not.

Speaker 4 (31:45):
You know, I still grieve. You know you're talking about
your Grandmother's reminded me my mind.

Speaker 1 (31:51):
And it's funny when you talk about grief and you
say like, I'm dealing with I know how to deal.

Speaker 4 (31:57):
I know how to deal.

Speaker 1 (31:58):
And then you start thinking and and it's like, are
you really dealing that's literally or are you like ignoring
the fact that someone who you've known your whole life
of loving is no longer going to be here?

Speaker 2 (32:10):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (32:10):
I think that was me. When I first got the
news yesterday, it was like, okay, so we knew this
was going to happen. And then it's like the podcast
Cruise in Town. We still got this going on. It's
like making sure my mom is.

Speaker 2 (32:19):
Okay, get busy, the boys are okay, so we just
I just kept it pushing. It was busy. Our room
needed to be clean.

Speaker 3 (32:25):
We unpacked from like a couple of suitcases a lot and.

Speaker 2 (32:29):
He was like, oh, you can clean up.

Speaker 3 (32:30):
I was like, yeah, I just got to keeping busy
because yeah, that's that's actually one of the stages of
grief that we can actually kind of go through it.
For those who feel like grief is just one dimensional
or like you know, there's a certain timeframe to get
through it, or do you feel like everyone deals with
it the same way. I didn't really look at the

(32:53):
stages of grief until my uncle passed unexpectedly in October
and then I have lost like my grandfather on my
mom's side.

Speaker 2 (32:59):
I watched younger.

Speaker 4 (33:02):
Yeah, it was just uncle.

Speaker 1 (33:03):
Uncle Paul was way different because it was like shock,
but definitely with Uncle Paul. I watched you go through
like oh my guy. Then it was almost like denial.
I remember Sakari called that morning and you were like,
Uncle Paul's not responsive, and I remember, like, I'm not
responsive and you was. At first you had you would
vocalize this. You said, oh, you know, he's in the

(33:24):
hospital of the ambulance. They'll probably get him going. You know,
you know Paulie, remember because you know PAULI, PAULI will
be fine. And and then when she called back and
she was like, hey, Uncle Paul is gone. I watched
you go from like shock then to denial like oh
it's not he'll be fine, then to it's settling in,
and then it was immediate.

Speaker 4 (33:44):
He was like anger and guilt. It was guilt and agga.

Speaker 1 (33:47):
And the first thing you said to me was that
he wanted to come down here to see me, and
he wouldn't come down here to see me for the reasons,
you know, and.

Speaker 4 (33:55):
You were mad like you were mad, like I.

Speaker 3 (33:57):
Was rough one for me when I think about it,
You're right, You're definitely right.

Speaker 2 (34:03):
Yeah, there were so.

Speaker 4 (34:04):
Many layers to that it was.

Speaker 3 (34:06):
And there was just like other family issues and tension
that like, at that point made me angry. I felt
like it was something that was like that was avoidable
or correctable rather before his death, and then it actually
kind of forced me and pushed me to then be
very transparent with people I needed to be transparent. I

(34:26):
think his death was like the catalyst for me saying
like no more, Like I'm not doing this anymore with y'all.
So here's how I feel, and at least there's no discrepancy,
there's no wondering. Spoke to who I had to speak to,
and I said my piece and I moved on. And
that was also great for me, like moving into forties,
you know, being able to release a lot of things.

(34:47):
So it's funny how death can also evoke that desire
to change, you know.

Speaker 1 (34:54):
But also I'm glad you brought that up too, because
when we talk about the different types of grief, right,
it says here grief can be caused by the passing
of human life. We all know that, but death of
a relationship. The reason why I bring up the death
of a relationship is because I know the relationships that
were strained in your family. I watched how you even

(35:14):
grieve through that process, the relationships and your family that
were not the same because of certain things. I've watched
that with my family, you know, because certain relationships never
come back. And when you grow up looking at everybody
a certain way. And I say this as an adult now,
as a child, you look at those people and you
think they're all superheroes because they're just adults. And you

(35:36):
become an adult and you realize that and I'm gonna
take a quote from my wife, adults are just babies
who got older. Like they're no different than who you
are as a child. Like if they don't deal with
their trauma, they don't deal with their past issues, they're
the same person. They're just older babies. And when we
watched a lot of those relationships never come back. I

(35:56):
watched you grieve that. You know, like I watched you
griev then watch should be a little bit sad because
you're like, this is not what I thought or how
I thought adults were going to behave and I watched
you grieve that for months. Yeah, And I think that's
important because as your spouse, we're talking about grief, but
we also have to talk about how.

Speaker 4 (36:14):
You deal with someone who's grieving.

Speaker 1 (36:17):
You know, like you say it all the time, like, Babe,
I don't know how you You know, you're delta, And
every time I got to run to Florida or something,
you just say, Okay. It's because I understand that grieving
is a process, not a period of time. I'm not
going to tell you, well, Grandma died two months ago,
so it's time to move on.

Speaker 4 (36:35):
Oh, uncle Paul died.

Speaker 3 (36:37):
No.

Speaker 1 (36:38):
Grieving is understanding that that person is going through a
process of healing, and that process of healing has no timeline.
And if you love someone, you allow them to grieve
on their own terms and you be as supportive as
you can. The last thing you can do with someone
who's grieving is trying to push them out of grieving
because you think it'll help them feel better, you know, like,

(36:58):
and sometimes you do that now, trying to be malicious,
but you're like, I got to help get get out
of this.

Speaker 4 (37:04):
Ye.

Speaker 3 (37:04):
You know, they'll pull them out of bed and yeah,
maybe you just need to go aside for a bid,
take a shower, you know, and.

Speaker 1 (37:10):
Sometimes it sometimes it helped, but but you got to
understand and know that person like that may not be
Let me just jump in his bed with them this time, right,
you know what I'm saying. Let me jump into bed,
let me let me cuddle them a little bit, and
you all right, you want to.

Speaker 4 (37:23):
Sit here quiet? Yeah, it's okay too to say you
want to cry.

Speaker 2 (37:26):
Yeah, you're good for that. Like you want to cry,
I'm like, actually was okay.

Speaker 3 (37:31):
Until you asked if I wanted to cry, and now
I want to cry.

Speaker 1 (37:34):
But to be honest, that crying helps, like that release
of emotion and that release of energy.

Speaker 3 (37:39):
It does lots sadness, it's anger, it's it's so many
things that once that that gets released, I know it
definitely helps me. But even looking at some of the
facts and stats that Triple pulled up, I didn't even
think about grief, not other than human life, Like you said,
death of a relationship, the loss of health or function,
loss of independence, loss of a pet, those are all
things that will force people into the grief, and lots

(38:00):
of people trying to intellectualize grief reference the five stages
of grief.

Speaker 2 (38:06):
That suggests a consecutive in a finite process.

Speaker 3 (38:10):
But when you ask people who are actually experiencing grief,
most of them will say that grief comes in waves,
so it's not linear, it doesn't always end.

Speaker 2 (38:19):
Sometimes it's just it's easier to live with.

Speaker 4 (38:22):
I just thought of something, what's that? Just why you
said that?

Speaker 1 (38:25):
And looking at this right, loss of independence, right, loss
of health and function. One of my biggest moments was
grieving when I transitioned from football to being independent of
being an athlete and realizing that I was no longer
going to be a professional athlete. I was grieving going
through that process, not realizing it, but thinking about this

(38:47):
mother's grief, loss of independence, change of function of the body.
We always talk about postpartum depression as if it's just.

Speaker 4 (38:55):
A hormonal thing.

Speaker 1 (38:56):
But now that I think about it, I could see
how women grieve the fact that I used to be
this person, right, but now I had to grow a
whole person.

Speaker 4 (39:06):
A person came out of me. My body has changed,
My independence is no longer here.

Speaker 3 (39:10):
Oh yeah, your brain is like, now you know what
I'm saying. Your heart is not like this human is
not walking outside of my body.

Speaker 2 (39:16):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (39:17):
When I think about it like that.

Speaker 1 (39:18):
After reading that, it made me realize, like, dang, if
I would have approached postpartum as a grieving period as
I could have been a lot more effective rather than
doing the opposite and say you'll get over it, let's
move on, let's you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 4 (39:31):
Like, when you just said it, I was like, God,
I didn't even think about that.

Speaker 2 (39:33):
That is a really good correlation.

Speaker 3 (39:34):
You know. I've heard women say in other mom forums,
where you know, there's a safe space for us to speak.
I've heard mom say I grieve the old life that
was single, like that didn't have you know, the responsibility
of having to keep a human alive. Or I'm grieving
you know what my body used to look like. Or
I'm grieving the relationship I had with my partner because

(39:55):
now I'm just this.

Speaker 4 (39:56):
Never thought about that.

Speaker 2 (39:58):
Yeah, yeah, that's never though.

Speaker 4 (40:00):
That's to be honest.

Speaker 1 (40:01):
That's why I enjoy doing dead ass podcast with you,
because it's almost like I get revelations while we're in sessions,
while we're potting. It's like boom, you know what I'm
saying like, oh, shoot, you know what I'm saying, like, dang,
it really dang.

Speaker 4 (40:17):
But now that gave me a lot of clarity.

Speaker 1 (40:19):
Hopefully I can use that to help some other people
who you know, some of my friends who are also
having children now, because we pass that point in our life.
But it's also preparing me for the next part, like
when something changes, for example, Jackson going to college, there's
going to be a grieving period for both of us
because he's no.

Speaker 4 (40:35):
Longer living here and I already know.

Speaker 1 (40:39):
Coincidentally, guys, Kay and I went to go look at
an independent school for Cairo and Kaz because Jackson just
got into an independent school, as y'all saw a couple
of weeks ago. We're proud of them. So now we're
sending all four boys to an independent school. And I
watched as she, like all of the different educators were
telling the transition from going to elementary school to.

Speaker 4 (41:02):
Junior high school and high school.

Speaker 1 (41:03):
I watched out all of their eyes, was like, yeah,
and to change and it's like.

Speaker 4 (41:07):
They're going across the street, what is the change? But
now did I see you are.

Speaker 2 (41:12):
A different building. It's like, no, that's significant. It is
significant and their girls and.

Speaker 3 (41:17):
Are significant in the timeline that you have with them,
right much like when you grieve the timeline that you've
had with somebody, like I think of forty years with
my grandmother.

Speaker 2 (41:25):
That's my entire life. Like, yeah, we go way way back.

Speaker 3 (41:29):
You know, topics like death and lass are just hard
to talk about. So when you're experiencing grief, people may
get kind of awkward and uncomfortable around you, and it's
okay to ask for what you need or just seek
support from someone who can relate to what you're going through.
And thank God for our village of people and friends,
family who are just constantly checking in asking what they

(41:49):
can do to help. And really, I think genuinely in
those moments, if you do need help, you know, get
the help that you need. Because I even thought to myself,
I'm like, shoot, once this happened, like I didn't know
how I was going to react, to how I would function,
And I had someone offer one of my friends offers
to come down here and just stay for like two
or three days if they needed help, and I was
just like damn.

Speaker 2 (42:08):
I didn't even think about that, but the offer alone was.

Speaker 3 (42:10):
Just enough to be like damn, thank you for thinking
of how you can show up for me in this space.
Absolute because a lot of times when people have, you know,
lose a family member or loved one, a pet, like
you don't know how to say anything, Like you can't
say anything right right, there's no nothing you can stay
to make them feel better in that moment. But I
think anticipating needs in those moments are definitely helpful ways

(42:32):
to show that you care.

Speaker 2 (42:33):
You know, that's a.

Speaker 1 (42:35):
Question which one of your friends asked if they wanted
you to come Christina. Of course I knew it was Christina. Yeah,
I knew it was Christina. Christina is like her heart
so big and she's she's dope. It's funny because a
man would never ask another man you want me to
come to your house and stay with your families.

Speaker 4 (42:50):
Man, we ain't gonna grieve like that. We're going to
hit you with a quick text like ye yeah, yeah,
yeah yeah.

Speaker 1 (42:57):
If you need something, you know, we can go to
the strip club, get you a body that grieving you
know what.

Speaker 3 (43:02):
Yeah, Christina and even Tiffany was just like times like this,
I wish I could jump in the car like you know,
I'll be on the next flight if you need me,
I'm like, girl, you have a whole family with four
kids and a husband. Like, I don't expect you to
leave your house to come down here to help me,
you know, or just to be with me.

Speaker 2 (43:15):
But these are friends.

Speaker 3 (43:16):
Who I have that will, literally, like you said, show
up how I need. Sometimes I just want you to
come into bed with me and we just lay down together,
I know what.

Speaker 2 (43:23):
Or sometimes I will cry, or sometimes I want to go.

Speaker 3 (43:25):
Out to eat, Like it just depends on I know
what you need time and I love that people can
offer that support as needed. And then crying is coping
lost heartbreak on wanted change his heart and it's okay
to cry because.

Speaker 1 (43:36):
I will at the trap of time. That's why I
had to talk about that with Jackson. And we we
at the gym yesterday. We just got finished during the podcast.
We go to the gym, be working through it. Kay
calls me Grandma's gone. My first response, not realizing he's
paying attention, is like, well you serious, and she's like yeah,
I'm like sorry to hear that, babe, You me and

(43:57):
me want to go down.

Speaker 4 (43:58):
I'm not thinking he's paying attention.

Speaker 1 (44:00):
He's putting shots up and then he comes over to me,
He's just like Grandma's gone. I was like, yeah, it
broke down crying and said, yo, yo, let it out.
You want to leave, you want to go home. He's like, no,
I want to finish. I want to finish. So he
like held it, finished his session twenty minutes. Soon as
he got done, like as soon as it was over,
broke down right there in the gym, taking his sneakers off,

(44:22):
you know his boys. I was there was just like, yo,
Jackson's all right his basketball coach, are you working them
that hard that?

Speaker 4 (44:26):
I'm like, nah, we found out we had to lost
in the family.

Speaker 1 (44:29):
He's like, oh, man, like sorry, but watching Jackson try
to hold it in, and then he was like he
had something to distract him.

Speaker 4 (44:36):
It was basketball.

Speaker 1 (44:37):
But the minute there was no more, I got this
drill and he had to sit down and take them
shoes off.

Speaker 4 (44:42):
And I had to explain to him. I said, yo,
cry cry And.

Speaker 3 (44:46):
He came home and he cried, and I was like,
all right, Budy else. I didn't know that he found
out at the time. Yeah, when you did it, I
thought you told him in the car. So I said
to him when we were talking about practice. After that,
I'm just like, so, how did you get through practice? Bro?

Speaker 2 (44:57):
Like you found out the news about Grandma.

Speaker 3 (44:59):
And at this point he had just asked me to
send him any pictures I have of him and Grandma,
so he had changed the screen savers him and her,
and he was just like, I really think Grandma would.

Speaker 2 (45:08):
Have wanted me to finish. And I was like, that's
exactly it.

Speaker 1 (45:13):
You you legit said the same thing though, because my
birthday is soon, and I was just like, hey, you know,
if Grandma passes around my birthday, you know we can cancel.

Speaker 4 (45:23):
And you was just like, absolutely not. Grandma would not
have wanted me to cancel anything, absolutely not.

Speaker 1 (45:28):
And I was like, I'm not gonna be selfish to
ask you the plan of it, and you was just like, no,
I've already spoke to my family about it.

Speaker 4 (45:33):
And they all agreed to because that's how Grandma was though.

Speaker 1 (45:38):
As Paul, so, yeah, you also said to something last time.

Speaker 4 (45:42):
That was cool. He was like, you know, you wish
you could be there for the meet up.

Speaker 1 (45:47):
Paul's in heaven and he's stilling there and then you know,
you see somebody from the distance and it's like, mommy, yeah,
she's like.

Speaker 3 (45:56):
You know what I'm saying, imagine that so happy and
Grandpa And I know Grandpa's there too, could you imagine that?

Speaker 1 (46:04):
That, to be honest, is probably like the big they
having a great reunion up there.

Speaker 4 (46:07):
They're watching the family.

Speaker 1 (46:09):
And that's why people say it's good to celebrate when
someone leaves us, because they're up there celebrating us too.
They celebrating the fact that they've reached where they want
to go, and you know, you get eternity and you
get peace, and you get to see people you haven't
seen in a minute. So I think it is important
to know that there is a celebration.

Speaker 2 (46:26):
You know, absolutely.

Speaker 3 (46:27):
All Right, y'all, let's touch base really quick on the
stages of grief, just familiar with it. We have eight stages,
so previously they thought it was five, but it looks
like there's eight. So then there's shock, of course, the
immediately following the death of a loved one. It's the
the process of really being difficult to accept the loss, right,
so you're feeling like this is not reality. Out of

(46:48):
touch went through that, yeah, and I I feel like
I'm still kind of floating around there. I think it
becomes more real when you actually get to like a funeral,
a person in the casket, like, that's when it.

Speaker 2 (46:55):
Really sets in.

Speaker 3 (46:57):
Then there's the emotional release, so the awareness of the
enormity of the loss is is realized at this point,
accompanied by intense gangs of grief. And this is a
stage of grieving that an individual sleeps badly and weeps uncontrollably.
So I didn't sleep well last night. That's probably why
I'm so tired. Now you're a busy morning. But yeah,

(47:18):
it's like a restlessness that I feel, so I'm probably
kind of in between one two. Then there's panic, feelings
of mental instability, wandering around aimlessly forgetting things, physical symptoms grief.

Speaker 2 (47:31):
Sorry.

Speaker 3 (47:32):
Guilt is the fourth, and the feelings of guilt about
failures and relationships, ability to change situations to save the decease.

Speaker 1 (47:39):
I want to say this before we continue, because we're
halfway through. If you're listening, ask yourself, are you experiencing
any of these things? Because if you are, it's easy
to identify once you've heard it and say, wow, that
must be what I'm feeling. You know what I'm saying,
And that's why therapy sometimes is important. Or even if
you don't go to therapy, if you have a partner
that you like discussing things with.

Speaker 4 (48:00):
When you say things out loud, sometimes words have power.

Speaker 1 (48:03):
You may not even be able to realize what's going on,
but you say it out loud or you hear someone
say it and it's like aha. So if you're experiencing
any of these feelings right now, just think about something
that may have happened to you. It may not have
been a death, it may have been a change in
a relationship, changing your job, you know, changing your physical
appearance or your ability that you may be grieving. So
while you're listening to these things, think about what you

(48:25):
may be going through if you feel like you're a
little off, and see if you're grieving.

Speaker 2 (48:29):
That's a good tip for sure.

Speaker 3 (48:30):
So sometimes I can't articulate how I feel, but then
I'm looking at it and I'm like, oh, I'm number three, here's.

Speaker 2 (48:37):
Where I am.

Speaker 3 (48:38):
It makes it that much easier to express how you feel,
so others can help you. One thing I will say
about number four guilt. I don't have any of that
with my grandmother. I feel like we live life to
the fullest. I did everything with her that I wanted
to do. I could have spent every single day with
my grandmother and still been just as devastated. Now, Yeah,
like there was nothing more that I feel like, Damn,
I didn't do this with her.

Speaker 2 (48:58):
That with her.

Speaker 3 (48:59):
She came to see our house. She gets to, you know,
stay with us for a couple of weeks. She got
to see all four of my boys. Like, I'm feeling
good about that. Number five hostility and anger, feelings of
anger over the situation, cause of death, and sometimes even
at the decease. Six is the inability to get back
to normal, Difficulty in regaining normality of daily life, difficulty

(49:23):
and concentrating on just day to day activities, and the
grieving person's entire being emotional, physical, and spiritual is focused
on the loss that just occurred. So really hard to
get back into a routine of things. Number seven acceptance
of loss. Life balance slowly returns. There are no set

(49:44):
time frames for healing, but each individual is different.

Speaker 1 (49:46):
Remember that, So don't shame yourself or feel bad. People
around you have moved on and you haven't. Don't ask yourself, Yeah,
what's wrong with me? And like my wife said, right here,
don't shame others. If you moved on, don't look back
and be like, yo, you ain't get over this yet.

Speaker 4 (50:03):
That's unfair. That's unfair.

Speaker 3 (50:05):
And number eight, hope the pains of grief are still present,
but the griefing person is able to find hope for
the future. The individual is able to move forward in
life with good feelings, knowing that we'll always they will
always remember and have memories of that loved one. Yeah,
oh man, I hope this was helpful to anyone you
know who's dealing with grief, who has dealt with it,

(50:28):
who's still dealing with it. I've heard, and I think
the biggest takeaway here is that it's not linear, it's
you know, comes in waves waves. I think acknowledging how
you feel in those moments and being able to find
safe spaces to express it definitely helps with the process.

Speaker 4 (50:44):
And finding support. Like you you should not.

Speaker 1 (50:47):
I wouldn't advise anyone try to deal with grief alone alone. Yeah,
you know, grief is already daunting itself as it is,
but trying to do that alone or in solitude is
just I would I would advise anyone to seek help
us if it's professional, a friend, other family, members.

Speaker 4 (51:05):
But don't do that alone.

Speaker 3 (51:07):
Don't do it alone, y'all, and shout out to my grandmother,
Thelma Cherita Brian, one of the best to ever do it,
my angel now along with my grandpa and yeah, my
Grandma Joseph. And something HiT's different about losing the final grandparent,
like she was my last living grandparent. But I'm so

(51:27):
thankful for the times, and for the wisdom and for
the for everything that they've poured into me. I'm definitely
the woman I am today largely in part to my grandparents.

Speaker 2 (51:40):
All Right, y'all, thank y'all for listening and helping me
through this as well.

Speaker 3 (51:43):
Thank you for all of the love, the support, the prayers,
the d ms, the messages. You know, I see everything,
and I am thankful, thankful.

Speaker 2 (51:52):
All right, let's take a quick break.

Speaker 3 (51:53):
We gather ourselves and we will move into listening letters
after we pay some bills.

Speaker 2 (51:58):
Stick around, y'all.

Speaker 4 (52:09):
All right, guys, we're back.

Speaker 2 (52:10):
All right, listen a time. Let me go first, sure,
go for a baby.

Speaker 4 (52:15):
Let's get money, all right, all right?

Speaker 1 (52:16):
Hey, de Valen kadeen Wusu. I'm thirty years I'm a
thirty year old woman from Canada.

Speaker 4 (52:21):
I like Canada. We just came back from Toronto to
year before that.

Speaker 1 (52:26):
Yes, I've been following you guys on Instagram since the
beginning and love to have witness to your growth.

Speaker 4 (52:31):
Thank you so much. I just turned thirty. I am
single and have no kids.

Speaker 1 (52:35):
I traveled a lot in my twenties, visited ten countries
in county, also lived abroad for a year, and plan
to leave my hometown for good. I don't want to
only focus on finding love and marriage, but I always want.

Speaker 4 (52:44):
To start a family.

Speaker 1 (52:46):
Every conversation with people now is about my singleness, the
fact that I work too much, travel too much, should
be stable, that I will never find a man if
I move to Asia again, et cetera, et cetera. I
am the only one of my family and friend groups
that has had such an experience as abroad, and I
feel like a black sheep in my hometown with the
constant criticism and solicited unsolicited advice. Also, my parents are

(53:07):
not the most supportive because they are waiting on their grandkids.

Speaker 4 (53:11):
What advice would.

Speaker 1 (53:12):
You give a newly thirty year old black woman, career driven,
successful in her field language teacher? As I'm entering this
new era of my life still single? Where should I focus?
How can I turn off the outside constant noise about
the choices I need to make for myself? Also, what
should I look for in a partner if I ever
meet him soon?

Speaker 3 (53:36):
Don't be allowing people to project whatever they want to
project over your life. Them claiming that over you that
you'll never find a man you travel too much. Maybe
they want to travel more, maybe they want a good job.
Maybe they're projecting this on you. I just feel like
once you prepare yourself for the right person, they come along.

(53:58):
It seems like you are so successful in all of
the things that matter to you. Your career, you're successful
in that field, You're well traveled, you know.

Speaker 2 (54:08):
I don't think though.

Speaker 3 (54:08):
I think those are things that when you do find someone,
you're going to meet someone who is looking for a
woman like you, and that kind of energy that you
put out you're going to receive.

Speaker 4 (54:18):
I agree with you partly. I will say this. As we've.

Speaker 1 (54:25):
Traveled through this time of social media, there's been waves. Right,
there was a wave of a lot of women saying
I'm independent, I don't need no man, I can do
things on my own. Na, I don't need no da
da da da da. Now it seems like the wave
has changed to soft life me. I don't want to
live life by myself. I've been doing this for a

(54:46):
long time. And the reason why I bring that up
is because she she said, not that anyone else. She said,
I always want to always wanted to start a family,
So she does. My point is this, don't just focus
on one thing and leave the other and then when
it's all too late now, try to focus on that
one when time has gone by. The reason why I

(55:06):
say that is because of this, the same way women
will say the biological clock is real. I have to
put time limits on how much time I spend with people.
If we're not going to go in this direction, I
have to move on. I agree with you. As a woman,
you have that ability to say that because the biological
clock is real. But here's the facts. Men also agree
that the biological clock is real. And if they're looking

(55:28):
to start a family with someone, the closer you get
to forty, you may not be the prime candidate.

Speaker 4 (55:34):
You see what I'm saying, Because to her.

Speaker 2 (55:36):
Being thirty already is like all right, chop chop.

Speaker 1 (55:38):
Yes, Because let's be honest, Once you get into that
mid thirties era, it's harder to procreate. A woman's body
changes once you get to thirty five to thirty six.
Now you're a geriatric and you're high risk. This is
a scientific that they say. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (55:55):
Og hated the term jeriatic. I don't let anybody call
you Jerry.

Speaker 4 (56:00):
If you were in a jeri astric, I was like.

Speaker 2 (56:03):
You about thirty six.

Speaker 1 (56:04):
But the reason why I say that is because the
same way women women understand that the biological clock is
real to them, men who are looking for partners understand
that as well. So if men are looking for younger
women to procreate and have kids, you can't then say
why are you holding that against me, because that's the
same argument you hold against men when you want to do.

Speaker 4 (56:20):
Things on your time.

Speaker 1 (56:22):
And I say that because if you want to have
a career and you want to have a family, there's
a way to do both. You find time to focus
on both, don't only find time to focus on one,
and then when you don't get what you're looking for
out of that aspect of your life, then be upset
at yourself.

Speaker 3 (56:37):
But I also kind of think it's seasonal two because
it's like, have you ever heard that, Like, for example,
a woman can have it all, just not all at
the same time. Absolutely, and that may be the thing
for her right now. So having it all looked like
in her twenties, traveling, absolute, her career and all that.
Now what you want to focus and shift on assists
And what I'm imploring you to do is now focus
on being deliberate and intentional about what you're looking for,

(57:00):
put yourself in spaces to meet people who are like minded,
and that being like a better chance of it. Because
now since you're shifting the focus, if you were that
hyper focused in your twenties about traveling, your career and
being well versed being a great global citizen, now focus
your energy on finding yourself a man.

Speaker 1 (57:17):
But that was my point, But you know you didn't
initially give her that advice about focusing on that aspect.
It almost seems to some people it's like, well, I'm
a focus on my career and if love happens, it happens.
You do have to also be focused and deliberate about
finding love the same way you found your career. And
that doesn't mean you chase men. It just means you
chase an opportunity to be in spaces where these are

(57:39):
the type of men that I am interested in, and
if one is interested in me at the right time,
then we can make it. Will You know what I'm saying, I,
for one, am not all for chasing anybody. And I
even sell this to my young men. I'm like, why
are you chasing a woman or women in general? You
need to be focused on your career and building yourself up,
but putting yourself in positions where you can meet a

(58:00):
woman who maybe evenly YOK. That's literally what happened to us.
We were young, we were eighteen, but I was focused
on my career. I was also known that if I
go to college and I meet somebody, there's gonna be
women here who are also focused on.

Speaker 4 (58:13):
Their careers, which is funny.

Speaker 1 (58:15):
I was talking to Jackson, right, and Jackson was just like, YO,
make sure you find woman that has stuff going on
for herself.

Speaker 4 (58:24):
Yes, And he was like, what you mean? I was like, Bro,
if you just focus on a woman right who looks
a certain way, h only goal in life is to
be up your ass, right, You're gonna go crazy.

Speaker 1 (58:38):
She's gonna go crazy trying to be up your ass,
and you're gonna go crazy trying to remove her from
your ass because you got other things to do. I said,
what attracted me to your mom was that she had
her own thing going on. And since she had her
own thing going on, I knew she was disciplined, I
knew she was focused. I knew we could build a
life together. So and I say that too. Don't think

(58:59):
that because you accomplished all this stuff, you're going to
intimidate or chase men away. That is not the case.

Speaker 2 (59:04):
That's just not going to be the man for you. Right,
does chase him away?

Speaker 4 (59:07):
Right?

Speaker 3 (59:07):
You want a man that's just like, Okay, yep, my
girl did this. Oh we could do this together because
I'm doing that great. And that's how you build an empire.

Speaker 1 (59:16):
For every man that wants to stay at home wife
to do nothing, there is a man who wants a
wife that can build an empire as well. So don't
think that there's one archetype of man looking for one
archetype of woman. It's not right, like we're all out
here just trying to find who is for us. So, baby,
if you really want that family and you want that career,
find time.

Speaker 4 (59:36):
For both because you can do it. There you go, number.

Speaker 2 (59:40):
Two, number two?

Speaker 3 (59:41):
What up, though, Hikadina de val I just want to
start by saying, I love you guys so much.

Speaker 2 (59:45):
You are truly my inspiration.

Speaker 4 (59:47):
Thank you, just from Detroit.

Speaker 2 (59:49):
Love it. I sort of what up though, Okay, I'm
going to just jump right in.

Speaker 3 (59:53):
My boyfriend and I have been together for ten years
and have a beautiful four year old son. Two months ago,
he decided that he doesn't want to be in a
relationship anymore because he can't get past my flaws.

Speaker 2 (01:00:04):
He doesn't like my weight.

Speaker 3 (01:00:05):
He complains about me gossiping about our business to certain
people that don't need to know everything, which I take
accountability for and have apologized for it. He also feels
like I don't push myself to my full potential. I
have a great job and make great money. I can
understand how important it is to him wanting me to
look good so I can feel good about myself. I

(01:00:27):
started working on the things that he was having an
issue with. I started working out four days a week
and lost fifteen pounds. I started communicating more, and he
feels the same way. He still wants to live in
the same household to co parent our son. He says
he's going to move out eventually, but not right now here.
I was thinking, we're building this life together just to
have it all taken away. I'm going to be honest.

(01:00:49):
I feel like I'm losing my soulmate. How can you
just throw away ten years so easily?

Speaker 2 (01:00:53):
Mind? Jewey broke up five years ago.

Speaker 3 (01:00:55):
He started messing with this girl who was batgit crazy,
and guess what, he came back to me, And here
we are, five years later, going through the same thing.
The only difference is a child is involved. Now, you
guys recently did a podcast on colda having a speech delate,
and we're currently dealing with the same thing. He feels
that if he moves out that our son will be
affected by that and he will not progress or he'll

(01:01:16):
stop progressing.

Speaker 2 (01:01:17):
I'm going to be honest with you. I call bullshit.

Speaker 3 (01:01:20):
My question to you, is am I wrong for wanting
him to move out in order for me to heal
and move on? Do I still continue to do his laundry,
cook food for him, be supportive?

Speaker 4 (01:01:30):
No?

Speaker 3 (01:01:31):
I really don't know what to do. I hope you
guys get my letter and can give me some advice.
Signed a tired woman. All right, baby, you said no,
I'll come.

Speaker 4 (01:01:38):
Because, to be honest, I'm not mad at' either one
of them.

Speaker 2 (01:01:41):
To be honest, this is I mean, se valid points.

Speaker 4 (01:01:44):
This is my thing. Right.

Speaker 1 (01:01:46):
When someone is honest with you and tell you how
they feel about something, you can't be mad or judge them.
He not out here cheating and saying, oh, I love
you baby, I'm gonna be home by ten and then
come home at two am. He's like, nah, I don't
appreciate your weight gain, and I don't appreciate the fact
that you be talking out business to everybody.

Speaker 4 (01:02:04):
He's letting you know what it is.

Speaker 1 (01:02:05):
Now that he lets you know what it is, you
have a choice, and you have to decide what you
want to do.

Speaker 4 (01:02:10):
These things you guys do. I still continue to do
his launch and cook from.

Speaker 1 (01:02:12):
And be supportive if you don't choose to, if you
don't want to, you don't have to.

Speaker 4 (01:02:17):
You're not obligated to, because at.

Speaker 3 (01:02:19):
The point if you're just living like roommates in orders
to co parent. Where I do understand his point of
view is like, Okay, if you're dealing with something that
your son is going through, yes, it may be more
of a detriment to him to remove Dad from the household,
now understand versus both parents working together to help him
get through this. But I agree with you at that point,
you're going to have to kind of draw the line
about where or what this arrangement is going to look

(01:02:39):
like until he decides to move out. So I would
tell you to further have this conversation and just say, hey,
I need to work on myself clearly in this moment,
which she started doing with working out and everything, and
I'm hoping that you're also wanting that for yourself too,
because it's going to be short lived if you're just
doing this for him to him and you're not completely
bought into this for yourself as an INDIVI visual So

(01:03:01):
you can say to him, I've been working on these things.

Speaker 2 (01:03:02):
These are what I want to do.

Speaker 3 (01:03:03):
But in order for me to kind of draw a
boundary instead of line, I'm going to need you to
discuss with me how you can see or how you
see this playing out until I move out, so that
way we know exactly where the lines are being drawn.

Speaker 4 (01:03:16):
I heard them move out.

Speaker 2 (01:03:17):
No, no, no, I'm saying for them to have the conversation
about what the lines and boundaries are going.

Speaker 3 (01:03:21):
To look definitely, because it's going to be it's new.
And if this is the thing where he's looking to
move out and the relationship, then you know some changes
have to be made.

Speaker 1 (01:03:34):
To be honest, I don't understand how he plans on
co parenting, living there and still courting other women. I
don't see how that's going to work. Like you meet
a girl, you have a good time, which you can
to bring her back here. This is my ex girlfriend
living like I don't I don't know what that's going
to look like. That's never been my testimony, so I
don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:03:52):
But or maybe he's not looking to be with other
women right now, he just doesn't want to be with her.
Because she didn't specify if he mentioned wanting to be
with other people.

Speaker 4 (01:03:59):
Right right, We didn't.

Speaker 1 (01:04:00):
We don't have too much context from his backstory, but
and she also did say that they broke up five
years ago.

Speaker 3 (01:04:05):
He started messing with years every five years. Remember the
first five years of our marriage was to and we did.

Speaker 4 (01:04:11):
We did talk about this.

Speaker 1 (01:04:12):
You and I talked about this when you asked when
you tell someone in the beginning what you're looking for right,
and you constantly have those conversations and they don't change.
You break up, then you get back together, they change
for two weeks, and then they go back to being
who they are. It could be a thing where he
doesn't believe that her change will be permanent, you know.
And like you said, if you're trying to do this

(01:04:34):
solely for him is not sustainable. So you're better off
just severing ties now so that you both can find
whatever piece it is that you want. But asking us,
I've said this at the Live show, what you should do,
you know exactly what you should do. You just have
to listen to yourself, as difficult as it may be.
If you don't want to continue to support him and

(01:04:55):
do Lanne do all this other stuff the way you
have been, then don't like. He's trying to draw a
line in a boundary, So you should draw a line
in a boundary. And when you draw that line in
a boundary, you have to stick to it, you know.
I just think it's it's it's unfortunate, you know that
they have to go through this. I love to see
people work things out, especially when children are involved. But
I do say I love his honesty and saying what

(01:05:16):
he doesn't like, you know, because because.

Speaker 3 (01:05:19):
It can be hard to tell somebody like man, I'm
not you know, feeling as attracted to anymore because you
don't look at your best self.

Speaker 2 (01:05:25):
And that goes for a man or a woman.

Speaker 3 (01:05:26):
Absolutely that women write in that just like yo, my
man gave way, he got a big belly, like you
know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (01:05:30):
So it goes both ways.

Speaker 1 (01:05:31):
But I will say this too, I applaud him for
being honest and upfront with her, because a lot of
times we shame men for being honest. But then if
a woman says they don't like what is I need
to leave, We'll applaud that you still tall. I'm no
longer going to shame a man who says he doesn't
want to be in a situation he doesn't want to
be in. Most of the time we tell him what
man up. And when they man up, they end up

(01:05:52):
doing unsavory things within a relationship because it's like I'm
trying to man up and be which I want to be,
but I'm not happy yet, you know. Then they detach
emotion or even worse, they start cheating, or even worse,
they get physical with the women. Because they don't want
to be there and now the only control they have
is you know, control, and I don't want to see that.
So him saying, listen, this is not what I want.

(01:06:12):
I would tell any woman to be like, hey, glad
you told me, and he was honest. Here's the boundaries.
I'm going to find someone who wants to accept me
with the fifteen pound extra because there is a man
out there who will accept you that way, you know
what I'm saying. So he did you a favor? Did
you accept the favors? They thank you very much for
your time, Thank you very much for this baby we have.

(01:06:33):
But life doesn't stop.

Speaker 3 (01:06:34):
Here, right and you're owe it to your son to
be good coherence in a healthy environment.

Speaker 2 (01:06:38):
If it's not healthy, it ain't gonna work.

Speaker 1 (01:06:40):
And sweetheart, real talk, you owe it to yourself to
be healthy. Kadeen and I have been talking about this.
Health has really changed our life in so many ways.
We talked about doing a sex episode because we did
so many episodes complaining about our sex life when we
weren't healthy, not only mentally but also and now we've

(01:07:01):
seen the changes in our sex life because we're healthier,
like we realize that, so we want to talk to
you guys how important it is to remain healthy so
you can enjoy that part of your life too. And
will you at fifteen pounds if you want to get down,
do it for you, be healthy, do it for your child,
don't do it for nobody else, do it for yourself
first and then share it.

Speaker 2 (01:07:21):
There you go, all right, y'all.

Speaker 3 (01:07:22):
If you want to be featured as one of our
listener letters, email us at dead Ass Advice at gmail
dot com.

Speaker 4 (01:07:28):
That's D E A. D A S s A. D
v Ice at gmail dot com.

Speaker 2 (01:07:34):
Moment of Truth time.

Speaker 1 (01:07:36):
My moment of truth is simple understanding that grief is
different for everyone. There's no cutoff point where you have
to start telling people how to grief, and if you're grieving,
give yourself grace, give other people grace, and try to
be as supportive as you can through this process.

Speaker 2 (01:07:51):
That's a great one, babe.

Speaker 3 (01:07:54):
Mine is I think pretty cliche because you hear it
all the time, particularly from people who have recently lost
a loved one, but it's really lean into and cherish
the moments you have with the people you love because
at any moment, anybody can be gone and the one

(01:08:14):
tiny bit of consolation I have in all of this
is the rich memories that I've had with my grandparents.
And I appreciate and applaud my parents for being so
deliberate and intentional about making sure that we were with
our grandparents a lot, and we spent a lot of
time with them. We have so many memories, so many bonds.

(01:08:37):
Grandma's house, Grandpa's house. I mean, the idea and the
thought of it just brings warmth to me to this day.

Speaker 2 (01:08:43):
And I love that our children.

Speaker 3 (01:08:46):
Are getting to experience that with our parents, and they're
building their own relationships and bonds with my parents and
then your parents. You know, Jackson and your dad are
on the phone every day talking to each other. And
now that he's retired and mis about to be retiring,
I have both sets the grandparents down here. So I'm
excited for that. I'm excited for our children to continue

(01:09:06):
to build those bonds. And I just implore you all,
if there's someone that you love, you know, pick up
the phone, make the phone call, make the trip, if
you can, just love on your people while they're here.

Speaker 2 (01:09:15):
Yeah, all right, y'all.

Speaker 3 (01:09:18):
You can find us on Patreon Shout Out to our
Patreon Ganggang, where you can see exclusive dead Ass podcast
content as well as more extended Ellis family footage, and
you can find us on social media dead Ass the Podcast, I'm.

Speaker 1 (01:09:31):
Kadeen, I am and I Am Devow and if you're
listening on Apple Podcasts, be sure to rate, review and subscribe.
And while you're subscribing, make sure you get your copy
of We Over Me, The Counterintuitive Approach to Getting Everything
you want out of your relationship.

Speaker 2 (01:09:44):
Dead Ass y'all.

Speaker 1 (01:09:47):
Cut. Dead Ass is a production of iHeartMedia podcast Network
and it's produced by Donorpina and Triple. Follow the podcast
on social media at dead Ass the Podcast and Never
Miss a Thing

Speaker 3 (01:10:01):
Nam