Christmas Movie Bonanza with Alonso Duralde

On this week’s festive episode of Dear Movies, I Love You, Millie and Casey are joined by film critic, podcaster, and author of ‘Have Yourself a Movie Little Christmas,’ Alonso Duralde. Alonso is a certified Christmas movie expert, and Millie and Casey discuss everything in the genre from Hallmark to Hollywood classics - no yuletide stone goes unturned! 

​Follow, rate, and review Dear Movies, I Love You wherever you get your podcasts. Follow the show on Instagram: @dearmoviesiloveyou.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, Casey, what's going on?

Speaker 2 (00:02):
Oh Millie? It's the Christmas season and it's very thrilling
because we have the King of Christmas, the Christmas Zaddy himself,
film critic, podcaster, author of Have Yourself a Movie, Little Christmas.
Alanza Deeraldi joining us.

Speaker 3 (00:19):
Hello Alanza, Hello Millie, Hello Casey, thanks for having.

Speaker 1 (00:23):
Me, Thanks for being here.

Speaker 2 (00:25):
He's an old friend.

Speaker 3 (00:28):
We go way back.

Speaker 1 (00:29):
You but you particularly, y'all worked together for many years, right, Yes, film.

Speaker 3 (00:35):
He worked on Maximum Film. Case was our You were
the not the original producer, but you came in early
and were there for quite a good chunk of the show. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (00:44):
Yeah, I was there. I was I was there at
the very beginning and uh yeah, back when it was
called Yes and now it's Maximum Film. How long has
it been Maximum Film? Longer than it was?

Speaker 3 (00:57):
Who longer? Yeah, I lose all perspective, Like, you know,
if he recently you know, left because his schedule is
so bananas and we have Kevin Avery now, who's great.
But like I had always had it in my head
that that if he and Ricky Carmona had hosted about
the same number of shows, no, no, no, no no, if he

(01:17):
was there for a long time. Yeah, just you know,
so I have no perspective. I'm just there week in,
week out. So yeah, I like, Casey was there until
I don't know last week, and then Marissa Gamon I
don't know well.

Speaker 1 (01:30):
And fun fact, that's how I actually met you, Casey
for the first time, because I was a guest on
Who Shot You? And I was like, who is this
organized gentleman emailing me all of the requirements and the
text bacs. I was like, this is a flawless production.

Speaker 3 (01:48):
So light midwestern production.

Speaker 2 (01:53):
But it's great to have your hair. Alonso just thrilled.
And this is the first time we've had somebody on
for the whole episode, so this will be where this
is kind of exciting. I'm honored a new realm for
us as well, Millie. I wanted to sort of start
the show off. You know, we did this with our
Halloween episode talking about our favorite Halloween songs. I thought

(02:14):
we should talk about Christmas songs and you said you
had an all timer.

Speaker 1 (02:18):
Well, yes, because I dare I say that, I feel
like there are more. You would probably agree along until
you probably agree to there are more Christmas songs than
there are Halloween songs right, just oh yeah, you know
numbers wise, And I remember talking in the Halloween episode
about how there's a lot of Halloween songs that I

(02:39):
don't like that are actually bad that they get played
over and over, and I'm like, oh, I hate this song.
And obviously with now more of the rotation, there's more
Christmas songs to hate. But mine, I mean, I think
it's just an age thing. But you know, a lot
of my favorite Christmas songs are eighties songs. Eighties and nineties,
so my solute, all time favorite Christmas song. And I

(03:02):
don't know why it makes me cry. Actually I do
know why it makes me cry. But the waitresses Christmas
wrapping nice?

Speaker 2 (03:10):
That was on my list, Millie, Yeah, of.

Speaker 1 (03:12):
Course, how could you know? Yes? And I don't know
what it is about. I think it's towards the end
where she talks about how she's having Christmas by herself,
and then the guy shows up or whomever shows up
at the store and she's like, you forgot Cranberry's too,
And it's that moment where like, oh, she's kinda has
somebody to spend Christmas with after all. That's so cute.

Speaker 3 (03:35):
It's a story song you know. I mean, it takes
you through a whole year, a whole emotional roller coas.

Speaker 1 (03:41):
I know, I know, and I can definitely identify with
somebody who's busy with things and forgets to do things
around the holidays. So I love that. And then of
course I love Last Christmas. I mean I feel like,
are you a demon? If you hate Last Christmas?

Speaker 3 (03:58):
Are you? I don't get, don't get why people get
upset at that one, Like you know, Christmas Shoes, yes,
dump all the hate on it, but last Last Christmas?
And all I want for Christmas is you like, come on,
Sure you might be sick of them, but you don't
hate it.

Speaker 2 (04:10):
A lot of I was just googling. I was like,
what is that shoes song that I like? Playing the
good Will or something?

Speaker 3 (04:18):
Yeah, the Christmas Shoes. God's the worst. And thankfully Patton
Oswalt has delivered the epic takedown of that one with
that it so richly deserves. But oh I hate that
song with a fiery pass.

Speaker 2 (04:30):
Well do you feel like I think with Christmas music?
You know, like know you're saying you like the ones
from the eighties. I do feel like, what's the last?
Like Christmas? Song class. I'll probably ask this with movies too,
what's like the latest song, the most recent song that's
been added to kind of the classic Christmas group, you know,

(04:52):
I mean, but it.

Speaker 3 (04:53):
Depends on who you ask, you know, like some people
will put like some Bouble in there maybe, or some
Josh Grobin. I think the last sort of universally beloved
Christmas jam was probably Kelly Clarkson's Underneath the.

Speaker 2 (05:04):
Tree, Okay, because I was thinking as far back as
Mariah care Yeah, and that like.

Speaker 3 (05:09):
Well that's the last like sort of culture shifting you know,
white Christmas size mammoth hit. But I think the Kelly
Clarkson song has definitely got in there. And see as
Candy Cane Lane seems to be permeating a lot too
in terms of like being used in movies and TV
shows and stuff.

Speaker 1 (05:25):
Sure, sure, sure we all also, do you have favorites?
I'm just curious. I gotta know.

Speaker 3 (05:30):
Oh, I have a ton of favorites. I mean, I'm
a little older than both of you. I was. I
was born in the sixties. I grew up in the seventies.
But for me, like it's the mid century stuff, So
it's the Andy Williams and Elephanzgerald and you know, Frank
Sinatra and Bing Crosby. Like that's really my sweet spot.
But if we're gonna talk about songs that we love
to make us cry, Tracy Thorne from the band Everything

(05:54):
but the Girl put out an album a few years
ago of Christmas stuff and she has a song called
Joy that knocks me flat every time.

Speaker 2 (06:02):
I love it so much. Oh, I have to check
that out.

Speaker 1 (06:04):
Yes, love her. So that's a good one.

Speaker 2 (06:07):
Yeah, Casey, I feel yeah for me. You know, Uh,
River by Joni Mitchell. I really that's like that makes
me And it's kind of you know, it's about someone
living in LA who's from like a winter, a cold place,
a cold place, and so I had a lot of
you know when I was living in La. For I
lived in LA for so long, and you know, I

(06:28):
made me think about those Minnesota winter nights. We also
we used to play the Barbi streisand a Christmas album
constantly around Christmas time.

Speaker 3 (06:38):
And I always one of the great jingle bells.

Speaker 2 (06:42):
It's like the fastest jingle bells.

Speaker 3 (06:43):
No question. Yes. And she's a few years ago she
did it like that. She had a concert special on
Netflix and she's saying it live. I really, lady can
still snap that one out.

Speaker 2 (06:56):
But yeah, and then you know, I this one's hard
for me because the songs on it are so good.
But a Christmas gift for you from Phil Spector, It's
hard for me not to put that album on, even
though he's a horrible murder.

Speaker 3 (07:10):
I don't think we have to let Phil Spector spoil that.
So I think we think of it as it's the
celebration of the Ronettes, yes, and everybody else on that record.
So yeah, he's just a Christmas gift from someone's friend.

Speaker 2 (07:22):
Yes, they may or may not be a murderer, but
those are those are kind of my top song.

Speaker 1 (07:29):
I have a question for both of you then, going
back to sort of the eighties stuff. You know, Uh,
every time I turn on the radio, I usually it
usually hits on. Do you know it's Chris? I'm sorry,
Do they know It's Christmas? Which was the charity song
that was done by all of the eighties superstars? Do not?

Speaker 3 (07:48):
They got It's Loo instead of you.

Speaker 1 (07:53):
Yeah, it's such a powerful botto. But I'm curious as
to whether or not you think that could ever happen again.
Could there ever be like a new version of like
a Christmas song that's being sung by all the new people,
like maybe the Sabrina Carpenters or the Chapel Rohans or whomever.

Speaker 3 (08:14):
I mean, yes, I never say never, Like I think
I think nobody thought that any song was ever going
to challenge why Christmas, and then Mariah Carey came along.
I think it's different now because I think that that
the music stardom is so splintered. Yeah, you know, you
have the younger people who listen to everything they hear
is on TikTok or YouTube, and you have the their

(08:37):
parents who don't know who any of those people are,
you know, And I feel like this is sort of
the end of the of a monoculture moment where like
everybody knew who Stevie Wonder was, and everybody knew who
Bob Dylan was, and everybody knew who Paul Simon was.
But like, yeah, now you'd have like, yeah, Sabrina Carpenter
and Olivia Rodrigo in a room with like Bob Dylan.
You know, no one has come away with everybody in

(09:01):
that room, you know.

Speaker 2 (09:02):
Yeah, I do feel like there's sort of an element
of corniness when it comes to those like big get
together songs, and I feel like people now are so
afraid of being cry don't They.

Speaker 3 (09:13):
Don't want to do the the the what was the
imagine Imagine video? Again?

Speaker 2 (09:20):
I honestly think that that killed any possibility of something
that happening, because.

Speaker 3 (09:24):
It would seem too earnest and try hard exact, and
eventually somebody be like, well, you know, the money never
actually got to the people that was supposed to bob up.

Speaker 2 (09:32):
Yes, yes, I can see it now.

Speaker 1 (09:34):
Okay, that answers my question perfectly.

Speaker 3 (09:36):
Yes, we can't have nice things not anymore. There's a
really good documentary though about the recording of We Are
the World that was on Netflix's here. I don't know
if you saw it. Oh it's great, Like they talked
to everybody, and Sheila e is like, yeah, they invited
me because they wanted Prince to come over, and they
thought that if I was there that he might show up.

(09:57):
And once once I made it clear that he was
not coming, like, they seemed less interested in having me there.
It was like, oh, tell it.

Speaker 1 (10:05):
Good, good sea there. Yeah, Oh my god. The Bruce
Springsteen part and We Are the World makes me laugh
every single time. I just, yeah, I can't even imagine
like all of these Yeah, I just I think you're
right alone. So I just really do feel like it
was probably like a time and place for that stuff
to happen. And now everybody's just kind of in their
own silos and nobody wants to get together. Banana Rama

(10:28):
is never going to hang out with you know, Midge
Er or whatever. So sad but true.

Speaker 3 (10:34):
Yeah, I want Taylor Swift and Banana Rama side by side,
but you know, I don't think we're going to get it.

Speaker 2 (10:39):
Yeah, amazing. Well, we have a very exciting episode coming up.
We I mean, as you can probably guess, we're talking
all things Christmas today, favorite Christmas movies, other things. Is
that right? Yes, that's absolutely right.

Speaker 1 (10:53):
And like Alonso wrote, I would say maybe the definitive
book on Christmas movies. I don't know, maybe that's Oh yeah,
I will say it because I like you and I
don't know.

Speaker 3 (11:02):
Who lack of competition. I think you might be right,
but it's not to say that somebody isn't going to
come along and really, you know, take over it.

Speaker 1 (11:09):
Yeah, well I want to give that award to you anyway,
So it is it is a definitive Christmas movie book
called have Yourself a Movie Little Christmas, and we're going
to dive into it a little bit, talk about it,
and then just talk about sort of you know what
makes holiday movies hit for people, and you know what
is uh. I know that there's a lot of like
genre bending happening too, with sort of newer films being

(11:32):
kind of brought into the Christmas cannon. So we'll probably
talk about that, I'm sure.

Speaker 3 (11:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (11:35):
We have had a few people right in recently asking
us is this a Christmas movie? And we need your guide?

Speaker 1 (11:41):
Yeah, you gotta be. You gotta be the judge. You
have to lay down the gavel.

Speaker 2 (11:45):
So also, Millie is recording in her new house, so
it sounds a little different. Yep.

Speaker 1 (11:50):
Sorry, there is not a lot of soundproofing right now.
So if it's a little weird and echoe, I apologize.
I'll have it fixed by next week.

Speaker 2 (11:56):
I promise, by Christmas.

Speaker 1 (11:58):
By Christmas, my Christmas price and is to like have
my life together. So well, please stay tuned. It's going
to be a lot of fun. You are listening to
dear movies. I love you, dear, and I've got to.

Speaker 2 (12:17):
Love me to check the box.

Speaker 1 (12:29):
All right, folks, you are listening to dear Movies. I
love you. This is a podcast for those who are
in a relationship with movies. My name is Millie.

Speaker 2 (12:37):
To Jerico, I'm Casey O'Brien, and like we said at.

Speaker 1 (12:40):
The top, we have an amazing holiday themed episode. We're
having Alonzo Giraldi here with us the entire time, which
again is a new thing. We've never had a guest
beyond for the entire podcast, but I feel like it's
worth it because we have a lot. There's a lot
of meat on this bone. Would you say, yeah.

Speaker 2 (12:57):
We're metaphorically sitting in Alonzo's lap.

Speaker 3 (13:01):
Well, I hope I'm not ruining it for any other
future potential guests. You know, did you both get a
candy cane? Yes?

Speaker 1 (13:15):
It feels a little weird talking about non Christmas movies
right now, but we do have film diaries technically right.

Speaker 2 (13:23):
Yes, let's open up the film diary.

Speaker 3 (13:27):
Heavy end.

Speaker 2 (13:29):
We're gonna go through the movies that we watched this
past week. Uh, Millie, do you want to start?

Speaker 1 (13:35):
Sure? And Alonzo you're gonna you're gonna weigh into You're
gonna have your film.

Speaker 3 (13:39):
Diary yeah, I'm going to give you a truncated version
because this is a nutty time of year for film
critics who didn't write a Christmas book let alone for
those of us who did.

Speaker 2 (13:47):
There's a there's an ongoing bit on Maximum Film where
we give Alonzo a minute every episode and he lists
off all of the Christmas movies you watched from that
past week, and it's.

Speaker 3 (13:57):
Yeah, still doing that. And then but also so there's
you know, La Film. We're recording this in early December.
Ella film Critics votes at the end of this week,
so all of these films are being thrown to me
at the last possible minute, like, oh, did you watch
this yet? If you looked at this, could you consider this? Yeah? So,
and then just my job as a film critic. So yeah,
it's I've seen a ton I will I will give

(14:18):
you some highlights.

Speaker 2 (14:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (14:20):
Well, having said that, I you know, I do get
screeners too, because I belonged to the Atlanta Film Critic Circle,
And you're right, it is absolutely insane how many screeners.
It's like, in my inbox, I have a folder of
screeners and it's just luck pages upon pages.

Speaker 3 (14:34):
But I, uh, yeah, I think they think if you
don't see the movie, like two weeks before you vote,
you'll forget that you ever saw.

Speaker 1 (14:40):
And everybody, every studio, every distributor thinks that way, and
so you're like, oh, my god, what is going on?
Why are there so many movies being made? But so
I ended up watching one of them, and I think
it's because I was like, Oh, this feels like it.
I had actually never heard of it. I hadn't heard
about it coming out at all. It has it's not
out as of the recording. But I watched the new

(15:01):
Gus Van Sant movie dead Man's Wire with Bill Scarsguard.
Interesting film based on a true story. It was a
like a true crime that happened in the seventies where
I think his name is Tony Kurtz's is. I think
that's the corect the guy who I didn't actually know

(15:24):
about this crime, even though the minute they showed there's
a part of the film where they actually show the
footage of him taking the whatever the loan officers hostage
and pulling him out of the building at gunpoint. And
when I'm the minute I saw the footage, I was like, oh,
I've seen this a million times. I just it just
didn't connect about like what it was. But it's an

(15:45):
interesting film obviously, like kind of topical when you think about,
like you know, Luigi Mangioni and things of that nature.
I think it's really interesting too that al Pacino's in it,
because it does have like shades of Dog Day Afternoon
a little bit. Whether or not Bill Scarscard should have
been this character, I don't know. I love Bill scars

(16:08):
Card and that's saying a lot, so it's like, I
don't know. I've read that people have said he's too
young to have played the guy, but who knows. But
I did like the seventies close and the vibe of it,
and yeah, I mean that. That was pretty much the
only movie I watched this week.

Speaker 2 (16:25):
So people say I look like him Bill Scarsguard, I've
gotten that before, Lucky.

Speaker 3 (16:32):
You specifically as Pennywise.

Speaker 2 (16:35):
Yes, exactly, amazing. Let me I'll go next, and then
our guest will go last. I watched two movies this week.
I watched The Conjuring Last Rites from twenty twenty five.
This was fine. I put this in my letterbox review Millie.
It's kind of like those seasons of vander Pump Rules

(16:56):
where they try to bring in the young people to
kind of replaced the old cast. Yes, exactly. So I
don't know. I don't know if we're going to make
any movies with like the Daughter of the Warrens and
the Fiance of the Fiance of the Daughter of the
Warren's daughter in the future movies. But this was okay.

(17:18):
Patrick Wilson was still looking good, and I know that
was very important to my wife Trish.

Speaker 1 (17:22):
Well, I'm glad.

Speaker 3 (17:23):
Yeah, it was just vera FARMI can still rock in
a frilly color.

Speaker 2 (17:26):
Yes exactly. There were lots of frilly callers. I think
this is supposed to be the last one.

Speaker 1 (17:31):
But well, it's it's fine that you're talking about it
as being okay because we did If everybody remembers Casey's
mom did bless the podcast from the Annabel Doll, so
we don't have the animal doll demon anywhere near us,
and if we wanted to talk about the Conjuring movies,
we can without risk of being possessed.

Speaker 2 (17:52):
So that's great. Yes, exactly. So thank god my mom
came on blessed us and blessed all of our listeners too.
So if you want to be blessed, go back and
listen to that episode. I think it was the K
Pop Demon Hunters episode, that's right, correctly. And then I
watched Star Trek First Contact from nineteen ninety six. I
don't know why I watched this, but it was. I

(18:15):
love Star Trek and but the movies are always like
a little disappointing for me. They're not as good as
the TV show, and this was fine.

Speaker 3 (18:24):
So it reminded Alfrey Woodard.

Speaker 2 (18:26):
Come on, Alfrey Woodard was great in it. Millie. We
talked about Tetsuo the Iron Man and the bad guy
in Star Trek First Contact is the Borg, which I
was like, they had to have taken some from something
from Tetsuo the Iron They're a very similar kind of
costume design in that. Anyways, that's all I watched, Alonso.

Speaker 3 (18:48):
What about you, well, I'd say the highlights of the
last week that are new movies. One is making its
way around. I'm not sure you know it. If it
comes to your city, even if like it's a one
night or at a museum, I would say, try and
check it out. And the other one will be opening soon.
The one that's making its way out now is called

(19:09):
Black News. Terms and Conditions and that's spelled BLKNWS in
all caps. And it started as an installation that Khalil
Joseph did at the Venice Bianale, and it has kind
of turned into sort of an essay documentary about black
history but also autobiography, but also black futurism, and it's

(19:33):
the filmmaker likens it to an album, so it feels
like there's a lot of cuts in it that are
very different, but the overall it all feels like it's
of a piece. It's a movie that is dense with ideas.
I feel like I really need to see it again
just to sort of take in all the stuff. But
I was really thrilled by it as I was watching it,
and thrilled by its grasp and its ambition, and it's

(19:56):
covering a lot of ground and dealing with a lot
of terms of like you know, black images in the
media and storytelling and a lot of things, and it's
hard to describe and so I'm doing a bad job,
but you should really see this film. It's amazing. And
then opening soon in theaters is Paul Feig's The Housemaid
starring Amanda Seyfred and Sydney Sweeney, and the Less You

(20:21):
Know going in the better. I didn't know anything and
there were surprises around every corner. But I will just
say it is a if you liked a simple favor.
You know, Paul Figue knows how to tell this kind
of story of people living seemingly glamorous lives, but there's
a lot going on beneath the surface, and not everything
is as it seems.

Speaker 2 (20:41):
Oh interesting, I did like a simple Favor a lot,
so I want to.

Speaker 1 (20:45):
This isn't based off of the like the nineteen sixty
Korean movie The Housemaker.

Speaker 3 (20:50):
No no, no, it's not, I wish, but it's based
on a novel that apparently was really popular.

Speaker 1 (20:54):
Oh interesting.

Speaker 2 (20:55):
Okay, do you have anything else, Alonzo? Or should we
close up with the film? Oh?

Speaker 3 (21:00):
I mean, you know, I could tell you about Silent
Night Deadly Night five, which I just watched for another podcast.
But I watch it for another podcast. Something y'all can
hear about it?

Speaker 2 (21:08):
That? Wow, we're already up to five, you know. All right, Well,
let's close up the diary. We're moving on to our

(21:29):
main discussion, which is Christmas movies. One thing I wanted
to kind of ask you, Alonzo at the top. You know,
we we've had some listener questions recently about like what
is what does it take for a movie to be
considered a Christmas movie? And I guess for you what

(21:52):
is necessary for you for it to be a considered
a Christmas movie? Like is there a percentage of the
all that needs to be dedicated to it, a certain
amount of screen space dedicated to cover you know, fill
the Christmas ornaments or what not?

Speaker 3 (22:08):
Super doctrinaire on this point, like apart from I will
absolutely die on the Hill of Diehard is a fucking
Christmas movie and let's drop it already. But apart from that,
like you know, I'm open, I'm easy to like. If
you say it is just great, If you say it
isn't for you, fine, whatever, you know. I think you
can take a film like anything from Auntie Mame or

(22:30):
Female Trouble where there's just one scene at Christmas, but
it's a really memorable scene, and so it's a movie
that people wind up coming back to with the holidays,
even if the rest of the movie isn't. You can
even put like Meet Me in Saint Louis in that category.
You know, that's a movie that takes place over the
course of a year. You know, it's as much a
Halloween movie as it is a Christmas movie, except there's
no big Halloween number, you know, which it does have

(22:52):
for Christmas, you know. I think generally speaking, what we
think about when we think about Christmas movies is more
often than not redemption stories. I think ever since a
Christmas Carol, there is this idea that there's something about
the magic of the Christmas season, the togetherness of the
Christmas season, that can force people together, can maybe force

(23:17):
them into either confronting issues of the past that they
haven't dealt with, or confronting whatever it is it's keeping
them from being their best selves and from being the
best member of their family or their community that they
could be, and then figuring out a way through that
so that they can be better about it. I always
say that that Ebenezer Scrooge, George Bailey, and Kevin McAllister

(23:41):
all have the same arc.

Speaker 1 (23:42):
Oh interesting, They're.

Speaker 3 (23:45):
All mad about where they are right now, and then
they are given this glimpse of an alternate life and
it makes them appreciate the people around them. And I
think very often if you don't have some version of that,
then people will question whether or not it's a Christmas movie,
you know, and you can apply that to things like,
you know, James Kahn learns to believe in Santa Claus

(24:05):
in you know, l for Natalie Wood learns to believe
in Santa Claus and Miracle of the emforty like whatever
version of that arc exists. You know, I think there's
there's different ways to do it. But I think it's
also limiting because you can't tell me that, like The
Lion in Winter isn't a Christmas movie. It's all about
this family, this very very dysfunctional family getting together because

(24:26):
it's Christmas, you know. Or Metropolitan, which is shot against
the backdrop of like New York City as this bauble
at Christmas time, or you know Eyes Wide Shut, which
has a outside of the orgy sequence, has a Hallmark
movie level of Holidays stuff in every scene. Like I

(24:46):
just only recently somehow found this, but some guy did
a twelve minute supercut that is every Christmas tree in
iwid Shut. There's that many of them.

Speaker 2 (24:56):
Well minutes, Jesus twelve minutes. There's a lot of tropes
in these Christmas movie so you see over and over again.
Are there any that you're like particularly fond of where
you're like, ah, yes, good or or are there ones
that you're like, I think we can retire this trope.
It's a little tired.

Speaker 3 (25:15):
Yeah, you know again, I think I think in a
good movie they can get away with murder, you know,
and in a bad movie. Maybe in a bad movie
it'll sort of like, oh, you know what, I do
like that part where yet it happens, you know. Like
A thing that I find myself enjoying lately is these
sort of like where people start dancing in a Christmas
movie and not necessarily in a big choreographed way, although
that can be fun too, but just like a family like, oh,

(25:37):
somebody puts a record on and like we're all gonna
like there's a oh God, and I'm blanking the name
of this movie. It's a big ensemble comedy with like
John Leguizamo and uh and and Alfred Molina, you know
the where they all you know, gather. I want to
say it's in Chicago, but you know, like that has

(25:59):
a great moment. This Christmas has this amazing soul train
line moment in the middle of the movie, and then
they actually kind of recreated in the closing credits, but
they're sort of out of character and just it's the
cast doing it because it's fun. So like moments like
that I think are really fun.

Speaker 2 (26:15):
They do that at the end of the Holiday. I
remember with Cameron Diaz and Jack Black and Kate Winsley,
and it's really, uh horrible to watch. It's like very unnatural,
and they're obviously trying to get one of those like
feel good like let's all just dance moments going, and
it doesn't quite work in that one.

Speaker 3 (26:33):
I'm afraid. Yeah, yeah, I mean I think, you know,
people too many people saw Mom and Mia on stage.
We're like, oh, well, if we end with Waterloo, you
know everything we give nothing like the Holidays is the
is the leg Wazama movie. I was thinking, Okay, so yeah,
I just I kind of like that. I do love
a packed house of people movie because I grew up
in a packed house of people, or certainly it became

(26:55):
packed at Christmas time. There was a film last year.
I don't know if I saw it called Christmas even
Miller's point that I'm a huge, huge fan of and
I'm screening it later this month in Los Angeles at
the Alamo, and I really hope that it finds an
audience because it premiered at the twenty twenty four Ken
Film Festival, and then when it opened, I kind of
feel like if didn't quite know what to do with

(27:16):
it because the title makes it sound too hallmarky for
art house audiences, and then the movie itself is probably
too art house for hallmark audiences. So I don't know
that people have discovered it, but I'm hoping they do,
because it's it's it's actually it's the guy who directed
ephis if you saw that this year.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
That is that is the damn movie that has haunted
our gets it brought up incidentally on like every episode
of our show. That's so funny.

Speaker 3 (27:45):
It's one of my it's one of my favorite movies
of twenty twenty five. The guy, the guy who directed
epis shot Chris is even Miller's point, like it's this
whole sort of collective of filmmakers working together, and yeah,
and it's just it's a it's a it's a great movie,
and I hope you will check it out. But there's
so much in it that I recognize, just in terms
of the just the masses of people and all the

(28:07):
all the plates on the table, and just the general
chaos of that kind of thing. Yeah, I think that
there's a lot about Christmas movies that can be, if
not aspirational, will at least sort of fill a gap
that maybe you weren't having, you know. Like I always
say that Hallmark movies exist in this kind of like
pre Bowling alone universe, you know, where everybody's a member

(28:29):
of a quilting bee or a b or some kind
of local thing, you know, and the local the community
is always getting together to like have the Christmas tree
lighting or you know, save the community center or whatever.
And I think that we're so distanced these days, and
we're so ground down by the necessities of you know,
the oligarchical state, that we don't really have time to

(28:51):
like see our friends and family, let alone belong to
groups or organizations, you know. And I think those movies
provide a window and like, ah, yeah, this idea of
the community and the community at large and knowing your
neighbors and hanging out with them and like being involved
in holiday projects with them, that's a real part of
the appeal of this stuff.

Speaker 2 (29:11):
Absolutely, Millie, what what are your what's your relationship to
Christmas movies? Do you like Christmas movies. I don't even know.

Speaker 1 (29:22):
I don't know this about you.

Speaker 2 (29:24):
I don't know I've gotten this far in the podcast.

Speaker 1 (29:27):
Yeah I do. I mean I think, you know. I
was a child of the eighties, and I watched a
lot of TV A lot, a lot, so a lot
of the stuff that was just playing, like, you know,
It's a Wonderful Life and Miracle on three fourth Street,
like all that stuff, Christmas Story certainly, and uh, you know,

(29:48):
so I watched a lot of those, and we'll always
like I will if I'm in front of a TV
and one of those movies is on, I'm watching it,
it's like I just kind of it's like drinking water
at this point. But then also, oh, yeah, I mean
I was in I mean I was a young person
when you know, the first Home Alone came out. I

(30:08):
was probably like, I don't know, probably like twelve or
something when Home Alone came out, and I thought it
was the funnest, funniest movie. Like when I first saw it,
I was like, oh my god, like I love I mean,
I loved Macaulay Culkin from Uncle Buck. And so when
I was like, oh, he's in his own movie with
like all of these hijinks and you know, all of

(30:29):
the brothers and sisters thing always cracks me up too.
But I'm always really really fond of home alone, even
though I know that's an absolute no brainer. But then
also I loved anything I didn't know. This is probably
like veering off the scope of the podcast maybe, but
I loved Christmas specials on TV. I listed this as

(30:52):
part of my You asked me like, uh before we recorded,
like what are some of my favorite Christmas movies? And
I fucking love the like Beavis and butt Head Christmas stuff,
like when they were doing there was this one special
that they did on MTV that is on YouTube by
the way, with the original commercials, so I it's pretty amazing.

(31:14):
But it's basically called Beavis and butt Head Letters to Santa,
and it's just goofy. It's just two of them, like
you know, making fun of celebrities and you know, doing
you know, answering questions. It's like all of the women
are in love with Beavis, who were like writing in
it's really really silly and fun. But like all that stuff,
anytime like something like yeah, like an MTV or like

(31:37):
a Comedy Central or any kind of channel would do
like Christmas specials. I was obsessed with them. So yeah,
I like Christmas entertainment, I guess I should say broadly.
But what about you.

Speaker 2 (31:51):
I love Christmas. I love Christmas movies, Alonza, you kind
of spoke to this, like when you watch any Christmas movie,
or like especially the Hallmark movie Christmas movies, there is
like this sense of community. Everybody is very involved in
a lot of other people's lives outside of their families.
And I think the older I get, the more emotional

(32:13):
these Christmas movies make me. And I think it is
as a result of that, just because you know, I
work remotely, I am kind of isolated, and I sort
of have I have this huge desire for community, and
I don't have anything even close or remotely close to
like what is happening in these Hallmark Christmas movies, and

(32:35):
so it does there's this sense of longing that I
feel when I watch these Christmas movies. Now, so really,
when you said the Christmas specials, the TV specials, I
really love a Muppet Family Christmas, which is this like
TV special that has like every it has like Sesame Street, Muppets,

(32:55):
Fraggle Rock, and it's like all just in this house
in the middle of this winter storm, and it's it's great, and.

Speaker 3 (33:01):
It's it's the it's the Avengers Infinity War of Muffet.
Absolutely no, but I'll tell you that that that you know,
as far back as like the seventies or eighties, when
Danny Peery was writing about It's a Wonderful Life for
the first Cult Movies book, he talked about the fact that,
you know, when all of George Bailey's neighbors come in

(33:21):
at the end to like rescue him, he goes this
is he goes, it lands. You know, it lands hard
given that most of us only know our neighbors when
they come over to ask us to like, you know,
turn it down, you know. And so, yeah, I think
this has been an ongoing thing where more and more
people are not heart don't feel like they're part of
a community, don't feel like they have you know, they

(33:43):
they are spending the holidays with family, with you know,
a lot of people. And so I think these movies
have always kind of presented a certain sense of like,
you know, giving you a taste of that even if
it's not really happening for you. Yeah, you know, I
feel that way about snow. You know, I've never had
a white Christmas in my life, true, because I grew
up in Atlanta, and you know, I lived in Texas,

(34:04):
and I have been living in California for like more
than twenty five years, and so yeah, I associate wintry,
you know, winter weather with Christmas movies more than I
ever do with Christmas.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
Well, you're welcome to come down to Minneapolis, shovel some
snow and get the real experience here.

Speaker 3 (34:23):
I want to take you about it.

Speaker 2 (34:24):
When did when, Alonzo? When did this Christmas? When did
this obsession start with you? With me? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (34:35):
I mean, you know, it's something that's kind of been
in my back It was in my back pocket for
a long time. I've always loved movies. I've always loved Christmas,
and uh, I you know, it was in my early years,
you know, back when there was you know, a media
where I was, you know, writing for newspapers or magazines,
and I would inevitably the Holidays would roll around and
I would be asked to make a list of, oh,

(34:57):
you know Christmas movies that people don't think of as
Christmas movies, or you know Christmas movies that are also
horror movies or whatever it is. And so, you know,
I started kind of having these lists in my head
of like unconventional Christmas movies, ones that don't necessarily fit
the mold. And it wasn't until I met the guy
who would become my book agent at a film festival party.

(35:18):
I said, well, I had this idea about a book
about Christmas movies but all the different kinds, and and he,
you know, really encouraged me and we moved forward with it.
And so that was when when I sort of kind
of put it down on paper. But it just been
always just a thing sort of dancing around in my
head and come the Holidays. As much as yes, I
make it a point to watch It's a Wonderful Life
or you know Scrooge, you know, or one of the

(35:42):
versions of a Christmas Carol, I also like watching Desk
Set with you know, Catherine Hepburn and Spencer Tracy, which
again won Christmas Sequence. But it's a memorable one, you know.
And one of the things that's really changed since writing
the book originally in twenty ten, I mean, the book
that's out now is as a revised and updated edition,
is not only the fact that like streaming has happened,

(36:05):
you know, which was really not a thing back then.
I was working off of DVDs and even vhs cassets
when I was writing the first one. But there's been
a real explosion of interest in Christmas media, and I
think Hallmark is a big engine behind that. But I
think it's also reflecting a thing that people want. You know,

(36:26):
there's a there was maybe one Christmas podcast when I
wrote this book originally, and now there's a ton of them,
and then these are like year round podcasts. They're talking
about this stuff, you know, all through the year. When
the pandemic started and everybody was locked down, Hallmark started
doing these weekend marathons or Christmas movies in April because

(36:48):
they just knew that people really, you know, were hankering
for some coziness. And I think that really clicked with
people as like, oh, yeah, this is a thing I
turned to that makes me feel good. So like Hallmark
now like one so week runs a Christmas movie again,
all through the year. So I think it used to
be a very compartmentalized thing, and now it's become such

(37:09):
a phenomenon that there are people who will very happily
indulge in it. All year round, and even the people
who wait until the holidays, there's so much more to
choose from, and it is so much more present in
the media. I mean, the Christmas movie itself is kind
of an invention of the television era in the first place.
You look back at the forties and fifties, you know,

(37:29):
Christmas in Connecticut and Miracle on thirty four Street. These
movies came out in the middle of the summer. They
were not considered like, oh, yes, people are going to
want to go see these at Christmas time when people
want to see Christmas movies. No, they were just movies
that were out in the world and they happen to
be said at Christmas. But then TV rolls around and
they have to start programming their December with their library
of old movies, and they start showing you know, the

(37:51):
Alisair Sima, Christmas, Carol and It's a Wonderful Life and
all these other kind of films, and then I think
that's what starts making people associate chrismiss movie as a
thing that's going to be part of their Christmas experience,
alongside decorating the house, making cookies, pulling out the wacky sweaters, whatever,
it is that they you do to celebrate Christmas, movies
become part of that at you know again like in

(38:13):
the fifties and sixties, not going all the way back
to as far as these movies have existed.

Speaker 1 (38:19):
Can we take like a little side road, Because I
am so fascinated with the Hallmark Christmas juggernaut that you
just spoke about. I have not seen any of them,
and so I was wondering if you had, like, say,
if you're a complete newbie greenhorn whomever, like I am, like,

(38:39):
give me like some of your faves, Like where should
I start if I want to get on this train?

Speaker 3 (38:44):
Okay?

Speaker 2 (38:46):
Now?

Speaker 3 (38:46):
And this is the Hallmark Christmas movie as we know
it now was kind of started around like twenty fourteen.
Twenty fifteen, there was a there was a Canvas Cameron
Bray movie where she gets sent to a small town
in Alaska to do her medical internship up and falls
in love with the guy whose dad may or may
not be Santa, And that really sort of set in
motion the kind of very rom com centric way that

(39:08):
they do these movies now. So if I were to
pick like three that I think really represent the best
of it comedically, let's see. Okay. So there's there's one
called Crashing through the Snow where a divorce couple who
are still very amicable. The ex wife winds up tagging

(39:29):
along with her husband and their daughters to Christmas with
his new girlfriend at her family's place in Colorado, and
she winds up the wife winds up falling in love
with the new girlfriend's brother, and it's it's really smart
about divided families and about you know, like you know,
how divorce can work, and people being on the same

(39:52):
age about stuff. Also kind of hot for a homework movie,
Like there's a there's a scene where the brother takes
the the ex wife to this like this closed spa
at night where like, you know, there's the steam coming
out of the pools and it's like, okay, I can
see what we're doing here. Yeah. And then like for
the sort of heart tugging, more poignant one, there's one

(40:14):
that I really like call Two Turtle Doves about a
woman who's a neuroscientist whose grandmother dies and leaves her house.
And this is a trope. You get a lot like
I'm leaving in the house and I want you to
do all of these Christmas things we used to do
together before you decide whether or not to sell the house.
So that's all kind of cool, But it's also about
this like missing ornament, and it's also about the neuroscientists

(40:37):
falling in love with the grandmother's lawyer, who is himself
a widow. So they actually talk about grief in this movie,
which is again for Hallmark like that. They usually there's
a lot of dead spouses or relatives. They don't really
get into the sadness that often the melancholy that can
permeate the holiday season when loved ones are no longer there,
you know. So I think that's handled really beautifully and

(40:59):
really Nikki de Looach and Michael Radio the leads, and
they're they give really great performances. So I like that
one a lot. And then I think the best Hallmark
Holiday movie is actually a Hanika movie. It is a
comedy starring Vick Michayliss called Round and Round and it's
kind of a groundhog Day situation where she gets an
enchanted dradl and lives the seventh night of Hanukkah over

(41:21):
and over again until she gets it right. And it's
adorable and really funny and really smart and even even
my husband, Dave wife, who hates Hallmark movies with every
fiber of his being, will acknowledge that round and Round
is pretty terrific.

Speaker 1 (41:37):
Oh my god, how can he hate them when you
when he's with you? I mean, this is crazy, Like
how do you manage that? He?

Speaker 3 (41:46):
Luckily he goes to better okay, so you know, and
during the holidays he understands its work and he just
has to like buck up and deal with it. But yeah,
I I you know, he doesn't look, he doesn't play
like you know, Japanese industrial noise metal around me, and
I don't subject them to Hallmark Christmas movies. And that's
how you make a marriage that in and.

Speaker 2 (42:05):
Of itself sounds like the plot of a Hallmark Christmas
It's so alonza. Do you get this sense within the
Hallmark Christmas movie? You know, fans and that whole culture
are people going back and watching years past. It just
seems like there's such a large volume. Okay, because it

(42:27):
just seems like there's such a large volume of Hallmark movies.
It's almost like sports where it's like you watch this season,
you just have to focus on what's going on right now.

Speaker 3 (42:36):
I would I'm inclined to say yes because on the
Hallmark Plus streaming service, when you go to their Christmas section,
they have it broken down by year, so like if
you want to revisit, say the twenty nineteen Countdown to
Christmas lineup, bam, it's all there. And so I mean

(42:56):
they you know, there's alphabetical listings, there's listening by star,
but there's also the yearly thing. So yeah, I think
absolutely they do go back and enjoy those, and there's
definitely like ones that are favorites. They get talked up
a lot, that come up in online chatter and stuff.
And you know, I'm about to go to Christmas Con
in New Jersey, which is a very big deal where

(43:16):
like all of the hall Stars come and a lot
of the main thing that people go there for it
to like do selfies and autographs from their favorite you know,
stars of these movies. But you know there's also other
there's panels, and there's a cool market and other things
going on as well. I will be selling and signing
copies of my book, so you know from there drop
by the deck the Hallmark Book booth, I'll be there.

Speaker 2 (43:37):
Who are the big hall Stars? Is that the term
did I say that who are the who are kind
of the top ones that people would be excited to
see at Christmas.

Speaker 3 (43:46):
Con Tyler Hines always a huge draw. He you non
Hallmark folks may know him as long Dick Dirk's from
Letter Kenny Got It. But he has definitely I think
risen to the top of the pack there. But like
Andrew Walker, Christopher Palaha, Wes Brown among the men, and

(44:07):
then for the women, I would say like Lacy Shabert,
no question, she is our queen, but like Nikki DeLoach,
Ashley Williams, Bethany Joy Lenz and so like it's a
mix of you remember them from One Tree Hill, but
also like just people who have worked steadily and you
know a lot of them are Canadian because that's where

(44:29):
most of these films are made and to qualify for
like the all the tax breaks you get of shooting
in Canada, like one of the two leads has to
be Canadian, which is why like if it's a lazy
Shubert movie, if it's a you know, like sitcom American
sitcom actress you remember fondly from the nineties, then her
male lead is always going to be Canadian.

Speaker 2 (44:50):
I didn't really interesting.

Speaker 1 (44:52):
Wow, what a world. I gotta get into this thing.

Speaker 3 (44:55):
It's a whole thing time mill. I got into them because, well,
part because just when when Trump went down the escalator
for the first time and like kicked off that nightmare,
I just I needed to stop watching the news so much.
And then also my friend William Bibiani had I was
in a car accident in like late twenty fourteen or fifteen,

(45:16):
I forget when, but he was laid up on the
sofa and so started watching these movies. He was like,
you have to check them out. They are all about
like these women who are obsessed with the business of business, business,
but then they learn to love Christmas.

Speaker 1 (45:30):
Oh my gosh. So is there what would you consider
the most recent Christmas movie that is unequivocally classic, you know,
on par with stuff like Miracle on thirty fourth Street
or you know Charlie Brown Christmas or something like that.

(45:50):
Something that would be you could play it for twenty
four hours in a row and people would be invested.

Speaker 3 (45:58):
Well, that's been a conversation of late. It came up
a couple of years ago when we have the twentieth
anniversary of Elf and Love Actually and people were like,
we haven't really had anything since then that has had
that level of impact. And that's true. But I don't
think it's because the movies aren't as good. I think
it's just that we watch things differently. It's you know, again,

(46:20):
it's the same thing with the we Are of the
World conundrum. You know, I think everybody is so splinter
on what they watch, and there's so many streaming outlets
and so many places to see things that you know,
you don't get the same number of eyeballs on something
at the same time. So even if you have like
Ted Turner deciding yes, we're going to show this movie
for twenty four hours, you know, the way that you

(46:40):
did with a Christmas Story, I don't think that there's
anybody's watching any one channel enough for twenty four hours
to sort of make that happen. So there have been
a lot of terrific movies. I mean Light last year
we had not only Chris's even Miller's point, but also
best Christmas pageant ever, which I thought was quite lovely,
and even the very silly Red one.

Speaker 2 (47:00):
You know.

Speaker 3 (47:00):
I just I think that the way that everything is
so fragmented now, I mean, did you guys see the
David Gordon Green comedy Nutcrackers starring Ben Stiller that premiered
on Hulu last year after premiering at the after being
of the Toronto Film Festival. No, you've probably never heard
of it, you know, And it's just that's what we're
dealing with here. And so I even like the Netflix stuff,

(47:22):
I feel like is just part of this stew of
options and so so yeah, I one could say, yes,
we haven't had a movie since Love Actually an Elephant
two thousand and three, you know that really have have
entered the cannon in that way. But I think it's
just because again, the cannon ain't what it used to
be in terms of anything adding to it because everybody's

(47:45):
diverted in a million directions.

Speaker 2 (47:47):
Yeah, yeah, it seems it seems like there is sort
of a Christmas movies have been a little bit more
relegated to kind of you know, streaming movie. It's not
the big theatric cole release movies.

Speaker 3 (48:03):
There are some, but I think the strategy now is
release them early enough so that they will be on
streaming by actual Christmas. So like last year, for example,
a Best Christmas Pageant ever, you know, was the theatrical
film lines get released it. It came out, but it came
out in like October, just to give it so that

(48:24):
its window would be over in time for it to
be on your home, you know, to be rented on
Amazon or whatever for the actual holiday. Like that's really
the end point now, you know. The Happiest Season was
supposed to be a theatrical release, but then COVID happened,
and so it went to Hulu and did very well there,
but it never really got it its due in theaters.

(48:45):
Noel was going to be a theatrical release, and Disney
was just launching Disney Plus and trying to like sex
that up, and they're like, no, we're just gonna make
it straight to streaming. So I think that streaming, you know,
becomes this factor now that keeps movies from that makes
the theatrical life of a film sort of you know,
a little minor detail that they have to work through

(49:07):
before where the real action is.

Speaker 2 (49:09):
Yeah, the last movie I feel like that I was like, oh,
this is a big Christmas movie, come to theaters with
big stars was Paul Figue's Last Christmas in twenty eighteen.
That sort of felt like for me kind of a
bigger movie.

Speaker 3 (49:23):
But yeah, that's a good example. But I think, you know,
I think if you were making that movie now, like
it would they would have they would have released it
at a you know, September October to make sure that
it was on Peacock, you know, in time, in time
for the Christmas season. This year, there was a really
lovely romantic comedy called The Baltimorons that opened in like
the beginning of September, so that it could now be

(49:46):
on AMC Plus, which is where you can watch it,
or you can rent it from you know, Amazon or
Apple or whatever. But yeah, that's that's the end game now,
is is is being able to watch it from your couch.

Speaker 2 (49:59):
Yeah. Interesting.

Speaker 3 (50:00):
Apparently the only reason Red One got into theaters was
because Dwayne Johnson saw Oppenheimer and Imax was like, hey,
I want my movie to be this, you know, and
so it wound up it was just going to be
a prime video exclusive, but then it got a theatrical
run because you know, he decided it needed one.

Speaker 2 (50:18):
Is that right?

Speaker 3 (50:21):
And you know when I think of Red One, I
think of Oppenheimer.

Speaker 2 (50:24):
Yes, yeah, definitely hand in hand, that's right. Are there
any directors that you feel like could really that are
working now, that could really tackle Christmas movie.

Speaker 3 (50:37):
Well, I would give my back teeth for a Wes
Anderson Christmas Yes, right.

Speaker 1 (50:46):
On.

Speaker 3 (50:46):
I mean, like think about it, even like a Wes
Anderson animated movie, you know, like in the style of
Fantastic Mister Fox. He would I think he would nail
the visual sense of it and the the the just
salt of Christmas so well, and it would fit perfectly
in the kind of worlds that he creates.

Speaker 2 (51:06):
You know. Absolutely. A lot of his movies too, are
like crowded house movies.

Speaker 3 (51:12):
Yes, definitely, you know, so, yeah, I think that is
waiting to happen. Good question. I you know, I think
like a bas Lerman Christmas music would be really something
to be whold totally totally.

Speaker 2 (51:28):
Maybe this is just because I'm watching Blossoms Shanghai on
the Criterion Channel, but I feel like a long Car.

Speaker 3 (51:34):
Wik did had you Oh heck yeah.

Speaker 2 (51:36):
I feel like twenty forty six might have had some
Christmas scene in there, but I feel like he could
do a whole Christmas movie.

Speaker 3 (51:42):
Oh absolutely, Yeah, you know, I think like I would
love to see a Japanese director really do a movie
about how they do Christmas in Japan, because that's its own,
its own thing, Like the just the KFC aspect of
it alone, I find endlessly fascinating about this.

Speaker 2 (52:00):
No.

Speaker 3 (52:02):
So apparently an enterprising KFC manager back in the seventies
started this thing where he basically kind of floated this
white lie that that Americans ate fried chicken every Christmas.
And he started this whole like Kentucky Christmas thing, you know,

(52:23):
like I had a Colonel Sanders that was dressed as
Santa and gave out chicken at some event or whatever,
and it just sort of snowballed from there and now
like it is, this cornerstone of how Japanese people celebrate
Christmas is that they pre they pre order, mind you,
their KFC dinner because like it is, it gets booked up,

(52:44):
and they they it can be really elaborate, where like
you bring home not just the bucket of chicken, but
like a cake and a bottle of champagne, and like
they do plates and toys and ornaments, like I've kind
of been collecting some of those, Like it's it's this
whole thing, and you know it's the country is not
particularly Christian, but they do you know, enjoy other kind

(53:05):
of you know, trappings of Western culture and stuff, and
so somehow KFC Christmas has become this legit phenomenon in Japan.
I would love to see a movie about that.

Speaker 1 (53:15):
Wow, that is fascinating. I had no idea, and I agree,
I would love to see something like that about that.
That's crazy. I So can we talk a little bit
about your book please? Okay, So first of all, you
mentioned that basically, you know, you originally wrote the book
in twenty ten, So what was it What was the

(53:39):
impulse to maybe revisit it and to you know, revise
it and updated, Like what was going through your head
when you're like, oh, I should you know, there's considerably
more Christmas movies that have happened since twenty ten, So
you know, what what do I do? I pick up
this old book that I've written and add to it.
Like how did that process go?

Speaker 3 (53:54):
Well, there's a couple of things. I mean, from the
moment it came out new Christmas movies would come out,
I would think I wish I and so I was
kind of cataloging those in my head. And then not
long after I published the original edition of this, Uh,
TCM did their Christmas book and then a few years

(54:17):
later they did a second edition. I thought, oh, you
can do that. You can do a second edition, you
can update the thing. It really hadn't occurred to me.
And then all but also I had to get the
first book across the finish line of you know, earning
royalties to do that, and so you know it it
all of those things came together. I did manage to

(54:38):
make that happen and so yeah, so I was able
to you know, go back to the drawing board and
be like, hey, I would like to do this, and
the publishers we were down for it.

Speaker 1 (54:48):
Amazing. I love the way that the book is structured
because you kind of have you kind of collect them
by little genres. Right when you were coming up with those,
I mean clear really you had to have you know,
certain there's certain you know, tropes and things that come
up time time again, Like you have an entire chapter
about you know, Scrooge and then Holiday Horror. Was there

(55:13):
other things that you felt like you wanted to like
what is something like a trope or something that you're
like really into that is kind of like I don't
know what if you'd call it a micro genre of
the Christmas movie, but like something that you really like.

Speaker 3 (55:27):
You know. What I was going for was this idea
of whatever kind of movie you like, it does butt
up against Christmas something sure, you know, And so I
wanted to have a thing where, you know, yes, if
you are like a straight up traditional Christmas movie fan,
like those movies are in there, but if you're also
looking for like some different movies to show your children,

(55:48):
or different movies that are in the action genre or
horror or whatever, like, you know, there's something for you.
There is something that will appeal to you that also
fits under this umbrella of Ristmas. And so yeah, so
that just sort of seemed like the best way to
kind of divvy it up that way, so that folks
you are like, Okay, look, here's some comedies, here are
some tearsjerkers, you know, here are some movies that are

(56:10):
absolutely not meant for children, you know, but that deal
with the holidays or whatever. So yeah, I kind of
you know, yeah, there's a million different ways you can
sort of parse these things out or look for recurring
motifs or whatever, but that just seemed like a good
way for people to kind of approach this if they
if they wanted to come at it from a particular
angle rather than just sort of trying to take it

(56:30):
all in.

Speaker 2 (56:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (56:31):
Yeah, well I have to say, I mean my because
my brain is crazy. I went immediately to the chapter
of like the Worst Christmas Mounties of all time, Yes,
because I was like, I have to see this, and
I was blown away. I mean, I you know, of
course I knew about Santa Claus and Santa Claus Conquers
and Martians and all these like classic terrible Christmas movies,

(56:52):
but you had so many that I had never heard of.

Speaker 3 (56:56):
I was.

Speaker 1 (56:56):
I mean, I damn, there like eighty percent of the
movies in that chow. I'm like, I've never even heard
of this, including this one.

Speaker 2 (57:02):
I don't.

Speaker 1 (57:03):
I don't even know if you're prepared to talk about
this at all, but I have to bring it up.
This one stuck out to me. It's a nineteen ninety
six movie starring Hulk Cogan called Sants Out with Muscles YEP,
which is the funniest name for a movie. I don't

(57:23):
know why I take, but it's the poster looks so terrible,
and then you go through it and you're like, Okay,
who's in this movie, you know, Garrett Morrista, Ed Begley,
Junior Hull, cocon and then you're like produced by Jordan Belfort.

Speaker 3 (57:41):
Uh huh The Wolf of.

Speaker 1 (57:45):
So what do you what do you know about this movie?
I feel like I have to watch it.

Speaker 3 (57:50):
Yeah, it's bananas. It is, you know, like the cinematic
career of Hulk Cogan. Really it was all downhill from
already starting in the Valley with you know, no holds barred.
But yeah, he plays like an obnoxious rich guy who
gets conked on the head and comes to believe that
he's Santa and he saves an orphanage that is that

(58:11):
the evil scientist wants to tear down because it's got
these weird crystals under it, like it's it's it feels
like eight year olds hopped up on on Nestley quick
really just like went to town on this script of
young Milicunis is in it, and she's one of the
best things in it, Like she's already got star quality.

(58:32):
But it, Yeah, it is quite terrible.

Speaker 1 (58:34):
It says that it's it was only out for two weeks.

Speaker 3 (58:38):
Yeah, it came and went and again. This is like
after the sort of you know, there was a moment
where like New Line and people like that were trying
to make a whole cogain movies like Suburban Command or whatever,
and this was these are the indie years where it's
it's he's still trying to make this happen. It's just
not happening.

Speaker 1 (58:56):
Wow, well that is rocketing to the top with my
watch list. I've got to watch Santa with Muscles. Is
there anything in the book like that you would recommend
that people check out at all? I mean, I know
there's it's so comprehensive, it's so complete, but like, I
don't know, just something maybe along the lines of a
Saddle with Muscles, like some kind of hidden gem or

(59:17):
oddity that just is kind of super interesting.

Speaker 3 (59:22):
I mean, you know, there's a bunch one of the
ones that you know. The thing about this edition is
not only is it all the movies that came out
in the last fifteen years that I was finally able
to add, but I am constantly learning. I'm constantly being
exposed to films I didn't know about, to older movies.
So like I'm it's not like I'm never walking up

(59:43):
to the table with I know all of them and everything.
You know, it is periodically it's like, oh, this was
completely under my radar. So one of my favorites that
I included this time around that was new to me
was a noir film called Blast of Silence.

Speaker 1 (59:59):
Yes, that's why film recommendation for the week. But anyway, continue.

Speaker 3 (01:00:04):
From the early Yeah, from the early down.

Speaker 2 (01:00:07):
Yeah, that's that's written. That's amazing.

Speaker 3 (01:00:09):
Yeah. No, I'm late to the game on this one.
Like score a Criterion put it out last year, like
it's it's out in the world, but I had just
missed it. And it's this wonderfully bleak and existential noir
film about a hitman who goes to New York at
Christmas time to do a job and encounters a woman
that he, you know, had been had loved years earlier

(01:00:30):
when they were both in an orphanage. Yeah, it's uh.
One of the things that's so cool about it is
the thing that I love about low budget movies in
general is you know, they're very often kind of shooting
gorilla style with no permits or whatever. So if you
really want a sense of like what city streets looked like,
you know, it's what I love about Like early Godar films.
If you want to say, what, like what bars in

(01:00:51):
Paris or movie theaters looked like? You know, this movie
will tell you because there's no set dressing. They just
came and shot in front of the thing and ran off,
you know. So it really gives you that flavor of
nineteen fifty nine Christmas in Manhattan. But also it's so
dark this movie. It has this like Waldo Salt wrote
this narration that Lionel Standard reads, It's all about like

(01:01:13):
you were born into an inky, violet blackness of nothing
and we'll return there one day. You know. I can't
even get it, but it's just like it's so like
and Christmas y, you know, why not?

Speaker 2 (01:01:24):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:01:25):
No, I think one of back when I was programming
at TCM, I think one of my favorite holiday double
features that I got to play is a double feature
of The Silent Partner from nineteen seventy eight and Blast
of Silence that we just talked about. So I was like,
that's a little bleak duo for you.

Speaker 2 (01:01:44):
All right, as we wrap things up here, Millie, what
are some of your favorite you want to go do
so your top three favorite Christmas movies of all time?

Speaker 1 (01:01:54):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (01:01:54):
No, No, particular order.

Speaker 1 (01:01:55):
Oh, no, particular order. You don't want to do a rank.

Speaker 2 (01:01:57):
I don't know. Do you want to do a particular order?

Speaker 1 (01:02:00):
I don't know, do you. I feel like if we
do that, you really have to be you know, you
have to have a you have to have your list
intact and be prepared to defend it for the rest
of time.

Speaker 2 (01:02:12):
Right, yeah, I know. That's why I'm like, I'm afraid.

Speaker 1 (01:02:15):
Well, okay, we won't rake it then, so we don't
have a Reddit post about us or anything. Sure, so
I will say, like my top three, I feel like
I mentioned two of them are ready The Silent Partner
from nineteen seventy eight.

Speaker 2 (01:02:30):
Have to put that.

Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
I just love Christopher Plumber and Santa Claus like committing
crimes that just cracks me up. I will also pick
because this is pure nostalgia for me from childhood, but
also just maybe the most heartwarming, Like if every time
I watch this, I feel so wonderful and amazing but

(01:02:51):
a Charlie Brown Christmas and anytime it comes on TV,
I just go back to that little place, you know
what I mean, And I'm just like it makes me
so happy, so I will always it will always be
in the top three, and then I think my last one.
My last one is is one that I actually mentioned
a couple episodes ago. Is something that I watched again.

(01:03:13):
But All That Heaven Allows from nineteen fifty five, because
those kids are the worst gift givers ever.

Speaker 2 (01:03:23):
I hate her.

Speaker 1 (01:03:24):
I hate her kids. Jane Wyman's kids and All That
Heaven Allows are the fucking worst ever. But the you know,
the general vibe of that movie too, is so wintry
and so you know, I mean like Ron Kirby, the
Snow and the Deer and every I mean, come on,
he's gotta love it.

Speaker 3 (01:03:43):
So I just watched Uh, There's Always Tomorrow, which is
another Douglas certain movie that the subtexts don't have children.

Speaker 2 (01:03:54):
I love, and uh All That Heaven Allows when they
roll that TV in the face is just like kill.

Speaker 1 (01:04:00):
Me, kill me. Oh my god. I wanted to punt
those kids down the street. I was like, just go
to college and never come back. Casey, what about you?

Speaker 2 (01:04:09):
What is your Oh my god, this is hard for me,
you know I do. I have such a soft spot
for a Christmas story because from nineteen eighty three, because
I'm a child of the Midwest, I'm a little blonde
boy with blue eyes. I have two younger brothers, and
I don't know, I just this is a very kind

(01:04:30):
of It feels like a real Midwest Christmas movie, and
I really just have such nostalgic feelings for it. I
also I love Metropolitan from nineteen ninety Wit Stillman's Metropolitan.
I love I love the Christmas movies that are kind
of like party movies too, where it's like people, you know,
you think of winter time as people like staying indoors,

(01:04:52):
but I like the ones where people are going to parties,
hanging out with each other, you know. And I just
think Metropolitan is so great. And then for my third one,
I'll do Ingmar Bergman's Fanny and Alexander their their house,
the Christmas House is so it's just we we try.

(01:05:12):
My wife and I always talking about we're trying to
emulate that the way they decorate for Christmas in that movie,
and we haven't quite gotten there yet, but someday. So
I'll say those are my top three. But Alonzo, what
about what are some of your favorite Christmas?

Speaker 3 (01:05:28):
Hard for me to narrow it down, but I'll see
these are the three that I pretty much watch every
year without veil, so I would say, I mean, it's
a wonderful life. Of course, you know, I'm an American
and I'm not made of stone, as Isaac Msrahi would say.
But that's the movie I grew up on, and it's
a it's a it's a ritual every year that we,
you know, very very often we'll go see it at

(01:05:50):
a theater because in La a lot of people will
screen it. So that's always nice. A desk set, which
I think I mentioned before with Hepburn and Tracy, that's
a movie that we just we always make it a
point to watch. And then I really like the nineteen
seventies Scrooge with Albert Finnie. It's a Leslie Leslie brickis musical.

(01:06:10):
I think it's just one of the best adaptations of
the many that are out there. It turns out of
Christmas Carroll's the most adapted English language work of fiction.
And there's more coming, you know, like both Tye West
and Robert Eggers are apparently working on new ones. So yeah,
I really like Scrooge a lot. Albert Finnie's one of
the people to play young Scrooge and older Scrooge. I

(01:06:33):
like the song.

Speaker 4 (01:06:34):
So yeah, it's we're checking out.

Speaker 2 (01:06:45):
Let's move on to Employees' Picks, where we give recommendations
based off the theme of the episode Millie, why don't
you go first?

Speaker 1 (01:06:53):
Okay, well, I feel like now I should choose a
different pick because we talked about Blast of Silence already,
which I encourage everybody to watch as well. It's such
a gritty, bleak Christmas fun film. I think I'm gonna go.
I mean, this is really obvious, but hey, who gives

(01:07:16):
a shit, right, I'm gonna go Black Christmas from nineteen
seventy four, the original Bob Clark. I rewatched that movie
in the past couple of years, and there is some
legit scary moments in that movie. I anything involving the
closet with things in the closet I was like terrified about.

(01:07:37):
And also I love that woman who plays the what
is she like the house woman, the house mother with
her like drinking problem and hiding her booze and the
toilet and everything. I mean, I just love that. And
I love the outfits. I love Olivia Hussy sweaters, and
I love all of the women in the movie. They're

(01:07:59):
just so fun. And yeah, I mean, it's like Christmas horror.

Speaker 3 (01:08:02):
Film from the director of a Christmas m exactly.

Speaker 1 (01:08:05):
So that'll be my recommendation.

Speaker 2 (01:08:08):
What about you, I am going to you know, I
was gonna recommend eyes Wide Shut because I really feel
like that puts me in the Christmas mood. And I
do think it's like it like the story is a
very you know, a redemptive Christmas story. But I'm gonna
go I'm gonna say this movie that came out in
twenty nineteen called Feast of the Seven Fishes.

Speaker 3 (01:08:29):
Oh good one.

Speaker 2 (01:08:31):
Starring one of my favorite young actors right now, Skyler Gisondo.
It's a good nostalgic Christmas movie. It takes place in
I believe, West Virginia, in this kind of small city there,
and it's this Italian family celebrating the Feast of the
Seven Fishes. And it's just like a really kind of heartwarming,

(01:08:55):
fun movie about family and tradition. And yeah, I really
it really, it really scratched that, you know, Christmas itch.
So that's what that's gonna be my wreck. Feast of
the Seven Fishes, Alonso, do you have a wreck? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:09:11):
I mean you know that that Feast of seven Visius
is one of I think several really cool indies that
we've gotten over the last few years, like you Know,
see you next Christmas and Jentans nineteen eighty five. My
recommendation is going to be a movie called Christmas Again,
and make sure it's the one with the Comma in it,
or you're going to get a dumb Disney Channel movie.
It is. It stars Kentucker oddly as a guy who

(01:09:35):
is working twelve hour shifts selling trees on the streets
of New York City and is clearly, you know, having
a rough time of it. But it's the Christmas season.
There is the possibility of redemption and of you know,
a new love for him around the corner. It is.
It is chilly, and it is understated, but it's really

(01:09:57):
beautiful and a film I just love a whole lot.
And it's screening on Canopy.

Speaker 2 (01:10:02):
Oh good, good, excellent. Well that's all we got. We're
all done here, Alonso, thank you so much for being
on the show today. This was such a delight to get.

Speaker 3 (01:10:13):
To my great pleasure. I adore y'all and I was
so glad you invited me to come on.

Speaker 1 (01:10:18):
Well, and like, also, everybody go out if you haven't
gotten it already, or maybe you have the older version,
the twenty ten version. Get the revised and updated version
of Alonto's book, How of Yourself a Movie? Little Christmas?
And I again, it is the Bible for Christmas movies, honestly,
like you got a you can't. You got so much

(01:10:39):
to watch just by flipping through it. And there's a
lot of stuff in there that I didn't even think about.
So it's an incredible book. Everybody check it out.

Speaker 3 (01:10:48):
Yeah, there's like a hundred titles that weren't in the
first edition, so you this is not just a do over.
You'll be getting a lot more new stuff, even if
you've got the the first go round. And hey, if
you want to buy both of them, I won't say awesome.

Speaker 2 (01:11:02):
If you're a completionist, make sure you get both of them.
And hey, this comes out this episode comes out on
December sixteenth, okay, which means you have plenty of time
to buy this as a Christmas gift for.

Speaker 3 (01:11:12):
People totally, and to start reading it yourself to you
gird yourself for the weeks ahead and for you know,
next year.

Speaker 2 (01:11:20):
That's right, amazing. Well, thank you all for listening. If
you want to write into our show if you need
film advice, if you need a recommendation, need help navigating
a director's filmography, or you need a film gripe resolved.
If you have a film regret, a gripe, or a
consensual film grop, please write into Deer Movies at exactlyrightmedia

(01:11:44):
dot com. You can also send us a voicemail and
just record a voicemail on your phone, make keep it
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exactly rightmedia dot com.

Speaker 1 (01:11:55):
That's right. Please follow us on our socials. We are
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and actually I got to say, if you want to
give us a Christmas present this year, follow our Instagram.
I feel like every time I, every time I force
the issue, people actually follow. So we want you on
our Instagram. That's wherever the most active. And there's a

(01:12:16):
you know, a little tight crew of people on there
talking about the movies and stuff which I love. And
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(01:12:38):
and that is all.

Speaker 2 (01:12:41):
And Lonza, where else can people find you? Because you
are also a podcast fiend said you're recording six different
podcasts today. I don't know if you heard that before?

Speaker 1 (01:12:49):
We Wow, why didn't? So I did not hear that?

Speaker 3 (01:12:53):
It's December, you know, this is my life. You can
hear me on Linoleum Knife, which I have hosted with
my husband Dave wife for fifth teen years now, where
we talk about new movies and also who's turn it
is to do the dishes. I do the aforementioned Maximum
Film on the Maximum Fun Network with Kevin Avery Andrea Clark,
Breakfast All Day with Christy Lemire, who is a great

(01:13:16):
film critic. We do a YouTube show, but you can
also hear it as a podcast. And I'm a regular
contributor to the Deck the Hallmark podcast as well. So yeah,
you can hear me in all those places. I'm at
a Duraldi on Blue Sky, Alonzo dot Duraldi on Instagram
and the easiest person on earth to.

Speaker 2 (01:13:32):
Google perfects Millie, what are we watching this?

Speaker 1 (01:13:38):
Oh boy? Oh boy? So this is the last episode
that we'll have before the holiday break and are so
this next episode will be in twenty twenty six, right.

Speaker 2 (01:13:51):
That's correct. We're going on a two week hiatus. People,
Happy New Year, Happy new It's a wonderful time.

Speaker 1 (01:13:58):
But we'll be back in twenty twenty six with I
guess this is kind of a tradition now because this
is the second year we've done it. We are going
to do our annual dry January episode where we talk
about movies that have something to do with drinking. And
we picked quite a movie about drinking.

Speaker 2 (01:14:18):
Wouldn't you say, Hell yeah, I would say the definitive.
Maybe not the definitive movie, but it's yeah, it's in
the drinking Movie Hall of Fame, I would say. And
that is with Nail and I from nineteen eighty seven.
So you get to hear a lot of fun stuff,
including we actually already recorded this episode, so I know
what's going to happen, but you, I can tease it.

(01:14:39):
You'll get to hear all about my illustrious acting career,
and stay tuned for that.

Speaker 1 (01:14:46):
And I already said in the episode that if he
doesn't post a clip from his reel on our Instagram,
I would walk away from I would quit the podcast.
So he is he is going to post it or else,
so check that out.

Speaker 2 (01:15:01):
I will, I promise. Well. Thank you everybody. Uh, this
was wonderful. Merry Christmas to you all. That's right. Happy holidays,
Happy holidays, every Happy holidays. Ho ho ho.

Speaker 1 (01:15:18):
This has been an exactly right production hosted by me
Millie to Chercho and produced by my co host, Casey O'Brien.

Speaker 2 (01:15:25):
This episode was mixed by Tom Bryfogel. Our associate producer
is Christina Chamberlain, our guest booker is Patrick Cottner, and
our artwork is by Vanessa Lilac.

Speaker 1 (01:15:35):
Our incredible theme music is by the best band in
the entire world, The Softies.

Speaker 2 (01:15:40):
Thank you to our executive producers Karen Kilgareff, Georgia hart Stark,
Daniel Kramer and Millie to Jericho.

Speaker 3 (01:15:46):
We love you. Goodbye.