Into the Woods and Weed Wackers (Barbara Alyn Woods as Deb Scott) • EP105 - Drama Queens

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
First of all, you don't know me. We all about
that high school drama, Girl Drama, Girl, all about them
high school queens. We'll take you for a ride in
our comic girl sharing for the drama Queens up Girl Fashion,
but you'll tough, girl. You could sit with us. Girl Drama,
Queen's Drama, Queen's Drama, Queen's Drama, Drama, Queen's Drama, Queens. Hey, Hey, Hey,

(00:28):
welcome back. Episode five, All That You Can't Leave Behind.
Air date October twenty first, two thousand. A lot of
interesting stuff happened in this episode. I'm exhaust lots of
dramatic Peyton. It really was between the basketball and the
and the Peyton like dealing with her intense pain about

(00:50):
her mother, and we find out so much about Whitey
in this episode. Lucas wanted to change his last name.
I mean, there was a lot of moving forward with
storylines here. So this episode is when Lucas asked Keith
to play with him in the annual father son basketball game,
which I just love. And Dan humiliates Nathan and kind

(01:11):
of himself on the court. It's pain himself, really himself
more than anyone. Yeah, and really big deal that we
should talk about, which is that Peyton marks the anniversary
of her mother's death. And this is the famous running
of the Red Lights episode. My favorite part of filming
this episode, and no one knows this, is that during

(01:34):
all that stuff on the bridge with Chad and with Whitey,
there was an old man whose backyard butted up to
the bridge and he hated that we were there and
he wanted no part of us there and he would
just stand in his backyard and would wait for us
to yell action, and then he'd start a weed whacker

(01:57):
and he would just stand there. He stand there with
the weed whacker going. And I remember just standing the
hours with the sun bearing down on us, and we're
trying to like make nightfall, and this guy is like
wait for it, wait for it action or so we

(02:18):
sent to what do you want to go? Tell him?
Some people over to him and he would threaten them
with the weed whacker like it was a sword. Um. Yeah,
So I love that ground telling him the kind of
scene that you're trying to film about, like a young
woman getting advice from a grandfatherly figure. Epic. We were

(02:39):
being messy. I mean, there's nothing fun about a film
production coming into your neighborhood, you know, like you can't
just run your errands and they're making noise and there's
riff raff looking in your backyard. What if you're trying
to bury body? Yeah. Yeah. It's also so interesting to
me though that people who want to take a stand
like that, and I'm going to I'm going to go

(03:00):
ahead and just be honest. You're being very kind to
said Pat old Man, because it's like, dude, we're just
doing our jobs and you're I get it, you don't
like that we're here. But also, you guys are up
on the bridge. You weren't actually even on his street.
You were like a full story above where he lived.
And and it's so bringing in money for the town. Yeah,

(03:21):
bringing in money for the town, also creating jobs. I
will never forget similar situation when when I was working
in Illinois and there was this guy who refused to
get off his porch, just wouldn't move, and he had
been really nasty to a couple of the pas on
the show, and I was like, well, let me go
talk to him, like, hey, he's also annoyed that we're like,
you know, sending over these twenty two year old kids.

(03:42):
To chat with him. He's an older gentleman, and I
walked over and I just said, hey, sir, I just
I'm I'm the one in the scene tonight and I
want to see you know, what's going on? And and
can I is there any information I can give you
that maybe someone else hasn't given to you. And he goes,
I didn't sign off on this, and I didn't okay
you to shoot the front of my house. And I said, well,
we pulled a permit for the whole street, and that's

(04:02):
something we do with the city and it's something our
location department manages, so it is legal. And just so
you know, we're you know, all the way at the
other end of the block. We can't really even see
your house. But you know in the shop you look
could you want to be an actor? Yeah? You kind
of look like a creepy ghost, just like silhouetted in
these lights at the back of the shot, and it's

(04:22):
a little unnerving to people. And you know, it would
be cool if you wouldn't mind, since we did work
with the city, if you could just not be on
the porch and do us a favor because we've got
two hundred people out here shooting in the middle of
the night and it's cold, and he goes, well, I
want five hundred dollars then, and that's when I was like,
I'm gonna Sophie is going to be right back, and
someone else is going to come talk to you for

(04:43):
five minutes. And I just went sir, to put that
in perspective. R P A s make five hundred bucks
a week. So if you think that you who is
standing here on the porch of a four million dollar
town home in the wealthiest part of Chicago, Oh my god,
in a suit, by the way, and like a really
nice jacket. And I was like, if you think we're
going to give you five hundred dollars when that is

(05:04):
money that could go to one of the kids who
can't afford a warm enough jacket on our set, you're
out of your mind. And then he started screaming, and
I was like, well, this has been really fun and
see LA really relevant. Well, it just got all of
this in our show. But man, oh man, our show
definitely didn't shoot in fancy pants neighborhoods. I think like
Brooks House and Nathan's house were in nice neighborhoods, but

(05:26):
everything else is in downtown Wilmington's, which is pretty I mean,
it's very diverse, and it's certainly not anything you know,
high falutin their older homes from like the twenties and thirties.
Over with is not a fancy town. That's part of
why it's so charming and so special and overall everyone
seemed happy. Everyone seemed happy. But it just goes to

(05:47):
show that it definitely was a film town because the
honeymoon had worn off. They were like, we've had movies
film in here for twenty years. Had John Travolta here
you get out? Oh my? You are you crying on
the bridge? Lord? Okay, well let's move on to some
storyline stuff. So so we have just um, we have okay,

(06:12):
Lucas confronting Haley and and the is it the first
time we see the golf course on the roof or
do we see that in the last episode. I feel
like we saw in the pilot, right, Oh, in the pilot,
that's right, But Lucas and Karen it gets bigger every
time that we see it. It was like they had
fun building that one out with the Christmas lights, and
I know, I wish we'd gotten to be up there more.

(06:33):
It was so fun up there. I don't know why
they didn't continue to have us do a lot of
work up there, because it was such a good, unique set.
I hadn't I haven't seen that in TV. And it's
not like bogies could come up and throw weed whackers
at you. It was a safe space. You weren't gonna
get chased around with lawn equipment coming after you with

(06:53):
a training here. God, I don't remember when that went away, either,
but because I do remember in later seasons filming up
on that roof, and there wasn't a mini golf course,
and I remember some of us who never got to
film on it. We're really sad when it left. But
I can't remember when that was. Yeah, I mean I
went up there to throw water balloons with you in

(07:13):
season five six, and there wasn't there wasn't a golf
course up there. I wonder we got cheated. That's what happened.
We got cheated, damn it. Oh yeah, we got cheated.
It's so weird watching this back all these years later,
because this is the one like character beat that my son,

(07:34):
who's never seen the show ever, like, this is the
thing that Gus knows he's like Peyton Sawyer sits in
her car and she cries and she runs red lights.
And my son knows that about the character and and
you know he's eleven. That's just you know, what is
visible to someone who hasn't necessarily sat down to watch
the show. And I think this is the beginning of

(07:56):
where I just I got really uncomfortable on the show
because Hayton became this like garbage bag for horrible things happening, right,
but then never ever went to therapy, never like really
got help. And so it starts with like her mom dying,
and then she's assaulted, and then there are other you know,

(08:18):
Ellie dies and there's all these like very traumatic things
happening to a child. And for me, over the years,
a lot of people have come up, whether it's at
like conventions or just on the street, and they said,
I was going through this horrible thing and your character
helped me process it. And I'm like I want to
feel responsible for that, and like, great, yes, I'm so

(08:40):
glad that our TV show could help you through it.
But also I wish we had modeled a better response.
I wish we had modeled like actually getting help because
You don't just get better on your own. You don't
just kiss a boy and wake up the next day
and it's all fixed, you know, like there's it's it's
long term trauma. And so I don't know, I hope

(09:01):
the television now, you know, is doing a better job
of like making that acceptable, making it the norm. Peyton
absolutely should have been in a therapist office. Absolutely, and
and he'll I hear you on that. It's like, it's
really emotional for all of us when people say you
represented X and it helped me process why, Like that

(09:24):
is a that's an enormous responsibility that we don't take
lightly and it and it can be kind of confusing
to carry because on the one hand, you're like, I'm
I'm honored to have helped you shoulder that, and on
the other you're like, I don't know if we did
this well enough. But I will say, you know, in
two thousand three, we weren't having conversations like we are

(09:45):
now about mental health. And I think even the fact
that the unsaid, you know, the the generally unrepresented, the
quote unquote bad or negative was even being given air
time that someone's suffering, that it struck me watching you
play that those scenes and how beautifully you did, and

(10:07):
like I just wanted to hug that little girl, like
you just look like such a sweet baby, just crying
in that car, and like it broke my heart because
you made it so clear that this kid was in
the ocean of grief. And that's what grief is. It's
so big, it can feel unending, and it comes in waves.

(10:30):
And I felt for you so much, And then, like
the camp counsel, a part of my brain was like,
oh no, we modeled running red lights for kids, and
when just yeah, and when the three of us were
watching Guys and this feels really important to highlight for
all of you at home, we were all kind of

(10:50):
taken aback because what you don't see, obviously in a
show that's edited and made to make you have a yeah,
you don't see that on every one of those side
streets there were cop cars, barricades, lockups, p a s.
Like we shut the streets down so that you could
drive on an empty road through red lights. And it

(11:18):
wasn't really, yeah it hurts, don't do this at home. Yeah,
And you weren't actually wildly running red lights. That was
all set up and it kind of hit us like,
oh God, looking back, you go, well, what does that mean?
God forbid? We ever encouraged, you know, someone to do that?

(11:40):
God forbid? Like I said a couple episodes ago, I
encouraged people to get naked and back seats. Please don't
do it. There's me having to make a joke because
I'm feeling very emotional and uncomfortable. Ready, just what am
I responsible for? But you hit the nail on the head,
Hillary with saying that because you have to have characters,
have to have laws, they have to have deep moments.

(12:03):
And you know, that's what people loved about the show
is that they were just feeling their feelings and going
through it. But the fact that we didn't model um
taking care of your mental health, of Peyton sitting down
with the therapist and somebody walking her through that grief,
and the idea for me of my daughter being that
age and feeling so much grief that she would put

(12:25):
her life in that kind of danger to just like
I'm that I'm for clumped. I can I don't know
how to process this, but you know it's yeah, it's
heavy for a teen show. I mean it started off
about like basketball, you know, and so I think also
part of the reason I have since then portrayed myself

(12:50):
as such a goober when I'm being Hillary Burton is
because Peyton Sawyer was so dark and and so so
anguished and sad that I felt like I had to overcompensate,
just in real life and in doing interviews even now,
I'm always the first person to be like, Okay, this

(13:11):
feels like a lot, let's let's get this um, because
I was scared if that, like you said, Sophia, that
ocean of grief. UM, I certainly have lost people in
real life. I know the people I was thinking about
when uh, when we filmed these things and and yeah,

(13:32):
there it's heavy. We also talked about when we watched
the episode back, how Craig Scheffer dealt with this very
same thing of doing a risky behavior in a production.
UM in the program. How old we were we in
middle school when that came out. We were young, I think,
so we were really young. I didn't even see it

(13:52):
until years. I mean, it was like an old movie.
Oh it's beautiful, well about a high school football team, right,
And I just remember being all over the news. The
news was saturated with it because in the movie. These
boys had laid down on the road as like it's

(14:17):
like a dare or something, and some kids emulated that
and we're killed in real life. And I remember thinking
about it, like when we were doing the running the
red light thing, just like God, like this is I
wish I'd talked to Craig about it. Oh yeah, well

(14:37):
they didn't have the placards back then that would come
up before the show. You know, this this episode is
triggering deals with trauma. You know, please don't emulate the
things of characters. Blah blah blah what all that stuff
that comes up now. We weren't doing that back then,
So yeah, you're right to be nervous. I think the
program might have been one of the reasons that shows
started to say we did this with stunt drivers and

(14:59):
on closed set. Those placards came up because you know,
people used to see something and go oh, they just
went out and did that. Now we have a lot
more transparency behind how productions work and and even to
the point of the conversation, there's more transparency behind and
around mental health around I mean the fact that we

(15:21):
can even speak about trauma now. We weren't doing that
twenty years ago it was very brown, paper bag, bottom shelf,
and and I'm so relieved that we live in a
time and in a moment where people are being met
where they are and where vulnerability UM is understood to
be a strength. Thank you, Burnet Brown. But not that

(15:43):
you're listening. But if you are, we love you. You
know what I love is that is that Peyton did
get um therapy of sorts by talking with Whitey so
much in this episode. And that that grandfatherly figure that
again we said, you know, wow, could never happen. You
can never have an older male coach spending any time

(16:03):
alone with the young female student. It would just be
wildly inappropriate UM. And in most cases it is. But
I think with the we're on a show and it's
all romanticized, the chemistry is loving. Yes, you know the
way he talks, I think it's because white he's talking
about Camilla. Yeah, it's very sat the creep factor that

(16:27):
might exist in other productions. Whitey so dearly loves his
wife and misses her in the same way Peyton misses
her mother. UM. And how grandfatherly figure, like a male
figure who is positive in her life, I think was
also really important it all unmoored. She is though she

(16:49):
doesn't have a mom, she doesn't have a dad, she
doesn't have a grandma or a grandpa or anybody. She's
got to go to the high school basketball coach like
this dude, she doesn't know it. Without saying any of that,
it speaks volumes yeah, and and it. It was such
a beautiful, I think choice in the story arc of

(17:10):
the episode to have Whitey stand in for her dad,
you know. And and in a way it felt at
least as a viewer like Peyton probably hadn't been able
to really process the loss of her mom with her father,
but being able to be with Whitey, who had also
lost his wife, they could share in it. And sometimes

(17:33):
it is a little easier to be more vulnerable with
someone who's not quite as close to you. Um and
and him being that that fatherly figure in the episode.
There there's so much of this kind of mirroring of
father figures in this one with you, with Craig, you know,

(17:57):
with with Keith, for Lucas, I mean him saying, Lucas
having this question about whether or not he's going to
change his name because of what it represents, because of
Dan Scott and Keith reminds Lucas that it's his name too,
and that it's a thing they share and and that
family can be who you choose. I mean, it's so beautiful.
And so you get those two kind of being the

(18:18):
best of it, and then you get Dan Scott being
absolute like just piggish worst oh, I mean him on
the different kind of mental problem, you know, like the
grief and the anguish or one thing. And then that
you know that that ego, the ego and the and

(18:39):
the obsession with the Glory Days can really be so toxic.
Like you get great masculinity and whitey and in Keith
and you get true toxic masculinity. And Dan Scott to
the two of Paul and Barbara in that scene where
he's talking about the Glory Days was probably one of

(19:00):
my favorite scenes of the episode because you see why
she loved him. He's fun. You can see why she
will hate him, Like it's a microcosm of the whole
show that one scene. And it's also like kind of
foreshadows all the problems that the Scott boys have in

(19:21):
their future relationships. I mean, that moment, the foreshadowing when
she and Barbara played it so beautifully because she didn't
freak out. You just see it land and she takes
a half a breath and says, better than I mean,
I don't remember the exact line, but essentially better than now,
better than knowing me, knowing your son, and you just

(19:42):
go and you said it was different after that pause,
good different pause? Oh god, honestly your partners Apparently I
slammed doors every door in es Oh my god. Yeah,

(20:08):
no I would. I would leave the room and probably
never go back. I don't know that I could handle that. See,
everyone assumes I'd scream and yell because Brooke Davis was
a good yeller. She could sell it. She could throw
a thing really well. I just get really quiet. And
the more quiet I get, the more trouble you're in. Yeah,
says okay, I'm just gonna go for a walk. There

(20:32):
will be poison in your coffee. And that's such a
wake up with no eyebrows, so that you did it
to yourself. It's such a good mom tool, by the way. Yeah,
the quieter I get, the more Maria is like, what
what mom? Mom? What? Guys? Can we just love on

(20:55):
deb just more? I love her? Yeah? Such a boss
being a boss and a batty dep Scott, I think
is the only mom who also wore juicy coutour track
suits and fancy lure like we did girls. When she
comes on in this episode, in that red juicy outfit,

(21:15):
we all started screaming, we're bringing them back. I mean,
I'm not. I'm not opposed to it. I love you
have to wear them and the spaghetti strap tank top underneath. Yeah, um,
well should we we have? We have an exciting guest today. Um,

(21:35):
we can talk to us a lot more about that
juicy track suit? Might get in. Where's Barbara Allen Woods? Barbara?
Dat d Barbara? Can you hear me? At beautiful? You're

(22:07):
so beautiful? You don't age? Holy SMI Hi gorgeous? Hi,
Hi miss you? Are you calling us from a trailer?
Are you on set today? What's going on? Where are you? No?
I knew this was going to happen. Hi, love you

(22:27):
so much. Um. Okay, so this is the first day
ever I think that I've sent my daughter off to
work alone. Um, she's working. I'm not working today because
of you, guys, Thank you so much. Um. No, I'm
not working today. While I'm working, I'm doing this this

(22:48):
wait where are you guys? What are you working on?
So I'm in Toronto with Ali and we're working on
a show together. Tell us everything about the show. We'll
get back on a WRO. I want to know what's going. Okay,
So Hillary, you know this about us, So maybe you
all do, but you know, our family's way into like horror,
the horror genre, horror anything, and um, this opportunity came

(23:12):
up for Ali to do this show Chucky, Yes, the puppet,
the doll Chucky, and it's you know about his origin
story and um, and she plays the mean girl, which
she's never done and she was the thrilled to do.
And then when she was cast, the producers came to
me and said, you know, hey, you know we need
the mean mom and do you want to play her mom?

(23:35):
And so yeah, we've been in Toronto since March and
we're doing a show together that is such a dream game.
And I'm playing the mayor, which is so full circle.
Dev should have always been the mayor. Yes, why did
that not happen? So we're having a great time. Oh

(23:56):
my god, I just believe he is old enough to
be working because one of my favorite favorite memories of
Barbara on the show. Was in my last season, and
I knew that I was cutting out, and Barbara asked
me to drive her to a doctor's appointment while she
was pregnant with Olivia, to get her amnio done, and

(24:17):
so they like did the whole scan of the belly,
and like, I mean, you were so intrigued, you were
so into it. I wanted to questions a lot of questions.
It was so special. I felt really honored that you
asked me to like drive you and it was such
a cool thing because I had never seen a doctor's appointment.

(24:38):
I didn't ask you to drive me. I wanted you
to be there with me, and it was bonding. It
was bonding for us. It was a really special experience.
And so then when I got pregnant, like six months later,
I don't know, I called like some Barbara message. I
was like, hey, I have a friend who's having a

(24:59):
doctor and you were, well, you can tell your friends. Yeah, yeah,
it was. It wasn't slick, but it was just such
a special It was such a special memory. And so
to see all of your girls taking over all of
television is just insane. It's so cool. They're the new
generation Yeah, they are. They are who you guys were

(25:22):
during One Tree Hill. And that's why I feel like
this is such great timing for me, because you know,
they're going through a lot of the things that I've
been listening to your so proud of all of you.
Proud and I love the podcast and I'm learning even
more about you guys and the fact that you went
through so much and that you were all the picture

(25:43):
of confidence. Never once did I ever realize you were
having any self doubt at all, even for a second.
And that makes me sad in a way because I
feel like if I could go back, I would have
my doors were always open, but I would have said
to all of you, please come to me. You know
I've been around for a while, Please come to me.
But you didn't seem like you needed any advice. Yeah.

(26:05):
I mean that's just sort of our makeup individually as people.
We were, you know, we really wanted to have it
all together and we didn't want anybody to know that
we were struggling. And maybe different girls would have, but
I know each of us individually where we were all
a little stubborn in our own ways and probably just
didn't want to. I just didn't want to admit that
we didn't know what to do. But your door was

(26:26):
always opened. Barbara. I mean, you were the mom that
none of us had down there in that environment. You,
I mean, my god, you helped me put my cat down.
I remember you came over that day and you were
there with me when I had to put my cat down,
and I was like, who do I want with me?
And I remembered it was just so clear, I need,
I need mom, I need Barbara, and you you were

(26:48):
that for us in every way. So no, please don't
think that we didn't come to you for any reason,
that we didn't feel comfortable with you. It was totally
just us needing to I don't know, like we were
taking care of it. We were adults, we were totally
grand And now I see my daughters being adults, but
there your age, and I know they must be going

(27:09):
through that same, you know, growing up experience of being
alone for the first time. And you know, I have
a and Gossip Girl. Emily is doing Gossip Girl. Crazy?
Is that so insane? Circle? So she's doing the first
season and I compare it to the first season of
One Tree Hill. I mean, it's pretty crazy. How life

(27:30):
comes around. You know. Do you feel like it's different
for these kids now than it was for us, you know,
eighteen years ago. No, I don't think it's different. Um,
in terms of just growing up in general, I don't
think it's different. But first of all, she's on HBO
and so you know that can be a little scary.
When she booked the job, she was seventeen, and she

(27:52):
thought it was like HBO. Yeah, HBO can be a
little scary. You know, it's gossip Girl, so it's gonna
be a lot of you know. Yeah, but she was seventeen.
She said, oh, no problem, because they can't have me
do anything anyway. Well, then it had quarantine happened and
the show got pushed, and so when she started working, Okay, UM,

(28:17):
that's hard to figure out what your boundaries are going
to be and what I want to allow you know,
out there in the public in terms of your body
or what situations you want to put yourself in as
an actress. And and it's different for everyone, but it's
hard to figure that stuff out when you're young, young woman.
And I've told her stories about you guys, and you're
you know, your questions and don't be don't ever be

(28:39):
afraid to question. And you know, I'm glad that she
has me to turn to, but it's also gives me
the responsibility of giving her the correct advice, you know.
So yeah, it's some. It's tough for young women. You
have always done that for people, though, and it strikes
all of us, you know, I mean we we we
were saying on our last recording that we're basically just

(29:01):
the Barbara Allen Woods fan club because all we're doing
is vawning over you in these episodes. And we I
think it struck all of us in our own way
that we know you to be that woman in life,
but we forgot because none of us remembers two thousand three.
My god, we forgot what you were doing on screen
and the way that you play Debb. It just feels

(29:24):
clear that you brought yourself and your barbed heart to
her because she's so wise, and she holds lines for
people and does it with tenderness, and and you challenge
people to be better and and I don't know you're
able to do so much with her, and we we're

(29:44):
just we're obsessed with you. Thank you for that. And
I say all of that in season one, and then
she sort of had a downward spiral. It was such
a crazy arc, so fun, so fun. Well we want
to talk, so let's talk a little bit about how
First of all, how you got the role of deb
Was it just a random audition? Was it? Did you

(30:06):
know what I mean? Like, how did that come about?
And then also once you were into the part and
you had to be okay. So she's the breadwinner, she's
clearly feminist and um in charge of so much in
her life and her family's life, and yet balancing this
egomaniacal husband who's a giant man child, and you've got

(30:26):
a teenage boy and you're like holding everyone's emotions and
trying to manage so much. I mean, what was that like?
Just tell us about this experience of becoming okay. So,
I don't even know if I've ever shared this story,
but um, I was Emily was one. So I have
three girls, Um, Emily's the middle, and she was one.

(30:47):
I was still nursing her. I was working on a
show called American Dreams, and and I had a nice
little recurring role. It was perfect because I wanted to
be a mom. This was my lifelong dream. I mean,
I had audition when it came to my career, but
being mom was number one by far, and so I
was recurring on It was perfect, perfect blend of being
a mom. And I was still nursing. And when I nurse, man,

(31:10):
I mean, you guys have seen me. It was not
a pretty sight. I mean like it's like, don't you
ask well, like cover of Jugs magazine, you know, like,
oh my god. So I'm nursing and I refused to
pump because I think that was my excuse to never

(31:31):
be away from the baby. So I would have someone
bring the baby to the set and everything. So it
was it was a lot of work and the last
thing I wanted was a full time gig. But then
this audition came up for One Tree hill Um and
I turned. I said, I don't have time. I'm working
and I don't have time. And then I started reading
it over lunch and fell in love with this beautifully

(31:52):
written monologue for this character and I couldn't let it go.
And it was just, you know, with the captain director
being put on tape because the show was already airing
and they were going to bring in this character for
this small arc. There's no way I could travel. You know,
I'm gonna do it. I'm just gonna go and do it.
And I just couldn't get Dub out of my mind.
I had not even seen the entire script. I just

(32:14):
knew that it was beautifully written, this character. And then
I heard that I was in the mix, which means
being considered. Then I heard that they were going local
for the role. Oh interested, I was pissed. I said,
I told my agent that I'm going to find a
relative who lives near North Carolina and I'm going to

(32:37):
be a local. And she said, you can't. You know
you can't. I said, no, I'm doing it. I'm going
to do that. And I found a cousin who I
had never met, raised them my address and said this
is where I'm local. I was within. I think it's
two fifty miles or something. I don't know, something crazy,
but I you know, I had the address, and they

(32:57):
set up a meeting with Paul on the weekend and
it's just me and I came in. I read it
and it was instant connection. And so they hired me
as a guest star local. Oh my god. My couple
episodes and um, the Finn Cannons. You remember that. Of
course they were amazing and they helped me out. I

(33:18):
think they put me up even though I was a
local um. Anybody who doesn't know, the finn Cannons were
our local casting directors who were basically situated right there
at the studio. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and so yeah, I
mean the rest is history. Then you know, they ended
up keeping the character around. But yeah, so I I
love telling actors this story because you know, if you

(33:39):
if you know something and instinctually you're thinking this is
your thing, just go for it and do what you
need to do. So yeah, that's what happened. And then
they ended up making her a regular. It's so cool
to me how you know, dev is clearly a confident woman.
But then there's also this really sexy element between her
and Dan in this episode, because it would be so

(34:01):
easy to show like a combative thing, like he's so
loathsome that for his wife to come in and be
affectionate with him, but also hold him accountable. It's just
a really nice duality that not everybody could have pulled off. Barbara,
like you handled that, yeah, you know, you see, like

(34:24):
I said, the spiral of not only depth but their relationship,
I think she does figure out who he truly is.
But um, you know, also the you know, the parallel
of the way Nathan treats his girls. Um, you know,
there's so many parallels in this show, and I maybe
I'm only seeing them for the first time watching the

(34:45):
show now. Um, but I think some of that had
to do with Paul and I just getting along really
well too. I mean, it was easy for me to
bring that warmth because I really liked Paul Um and
he made me la and I think Dan made Doub
laugh and they had history, and um, you know, he

(35:06):
was loving. That was the thing I was wondering at
one point we were watching and I said, why did
she marry this guy? But you know, when you see
him being tender with with Debb in the moment about
basketball and then it goes south. But you know you
could see a little a little hint of that and
he's cute, that's that. Yeah. I'm not even sure I

(35:29):
knew how cute he was then. I mean, I know
he was always good looking, but I'm watching an outgoing
you're cute. He was the diet cokeman. Come on, Oh
my god, you know what struck me joy when you
asked that question. It kind of lit up for me.
In that scene before he ruins it and you know,

(35:52):
says it was different, but when he's talking about his
athleticism and giving us the window into why it matters
so much to Dan, and he talks about what it
felt like and how you know everything would be quiet
and it was just the court and he says, I
wish you could have seen it. Something in my brain

(36:12):
was like ding ding ding, and it it reminded me
of in the last episode when you go to see
Karen at the cafe and you say, I know that's
your story, but it doesn't have to be ours. I
feel like Deb existed in this pocket right after Dan's
kind of glory days, but also some of the harm
he did. And there's a tenderness between Deb and Dan

(36:34):
that no one else has with him, and and you
claim it, but you do it really gently, and it
allows for this romance and it allows for you to
find him funny. And and then when you kind of
throw the gauntlet down, you do it embodied as Deb
in this way that is so firm, but it's gentle,

(36:55):
and it's it's like some real acrobatics, and I wonder
if maybe that slight difference in timing just gave her
a different experience with him that everybody else had. Did
they tell you what Deb's backstory was? Yeah? No, No,
I don't know. I think I made up a backstory,
and I think Paul and I talked about it. You know,

(37:17):
it's great working with him because we were all always
talking about things like that. But I don't even know
to this day if I really know the math of
where Karen stopped and where deb took over. I don't
know if it was an overlap. I don't know if
she was a rebound. I'm not even sure about that. Um.
I mean there was something that Karen found attractive in
him too, and um, she even seems a lot more

(37:40):
level headed and intelligent than Debb. So what is it
with intelligent women who fall into men like this? Um?
Isn't that the true? Yeah? I should not be throwing
stones and on a glass house, well Payton with Nathan.
We're all watching saying, you know, why, why get out

(38:02):
of there? You know quick, right? And you know who
knows the heart wants what the heart wants? And well
it's also I guess I'm realizing too that Dan Dan
has never been in this situation with Lucas. That whole
thing is a new threat for him. So maybe this
is like a part of him that's coming out that
nobody's really seen a lot of before because he's never

(38:22):
been in this scenario before. Um Am, I crazy. I
feel like I was told that Dead came from money,
and so she was so much more powerful and her
family was more powerful than Dan, and it was her
family the bankrolled the dealership. Did that end up like
becoming Yes, I think that was part of it. I

(38:42):
think you're right, because I'm watching this like girlfriends in charge, Like, yes,
her daddy is like the boss. So Dan married Dead
for money, not even for money, but the allure of
like being with a made girl, you know, like Dan,
I and see how that would put him in his
place because you present yourself like a girl who knows

(39:05):
exactly who she is and always has And I'm sure
freshman year in college that was foxy. And and maybe
the antip this is to who Karen was at the time,
you know, you know, um yeah, and which makes her
back to her spiral even more interesting that she started
out as strong as she was, and even I forgot

(39:27):
you know that many seasons later watching it now, keep
pointing to the television because this is where I was
watching it. Yeah, I had forgotten how strong she was,
Like what happened to you? And you know even later
on she I'm not supposed to talk about later on?
Am I? Well we want? Yeah, we'll just we'll have

(39:48):
you back later on and talking? What was your relationship
with James? Like playing his mom he was seventeen. I
instantly loved him. He was just a sweetheart. And what
I really and I tell this story a lot too,
what I loved about James is he was not afraid
to ask questions. Um, he was new, and you know,

(40:10):
he wasn't even that new by the time I was
working with him. He had already done the pilot in
a few episodes, but if anything came up, he had questions.
And look at him now, you know it was all
about learning. Um, you know, camera work, Why are we
doing this? Why are you putting that light there? He
was always asking questions and came to work so prepared
and was so respectful and even sometimes had a hard

(40:33):
time joking around with me because he was so respectful,
and I was like his mom, you know, and you
know he had to talk to me like his mom,
and he was so sweet. Yeah, he was seventeen, right,
and a little seventeen. And I remember, I love the
story because when he's so tall and when I hugged him,

(40:54):
and sometimes I'm a touchy person and I would touch
his chest like my baby, you know, my baby be
And the network gave me a note called my agent
said we want her to stop touching his chest. It's
because it just seems a little bit too close for
a mom, like, god, I have my son and a

(41:16):
headlock at all times. Oh yeah, just like for deb
to be touching like his chest, Like, oh my god,
I'm so sorry if I crossed a line. But man,
all that makes me think of whoever at the network
gave that note. I go, were you never hugged as
a child? Are you okay to remember they must only
touch men in a sexual way. They recast the guy

(41:38):
that played My Dad's season one because they were like,
you two were too flirty, and I was like, what
I mean? Okay, But so that was something that was
really on their radar. I guess, yeah, I guess maybe
because they were all inviting us. That's probably exactly well.

(41:58):
I didn't see what you do, what exists, you know
what I mean? Yes, I was afraid to go near
him after that. You know, I don't want to go
too close. That's terrible. What a terrible thing for an actor.
You want to be so free and be able to
just be an explore and touch and big, tangentle and you.

(42:20):
But you were such a you were such a mom
behind the scenes as well. And I love, love, love
that you always had your girls in the trailer. Your
girls were in the hair naked trailer from the time
they were toddlers, which is probably why they're so good
at what they do now, because that's why why they
wanted to do what they do now. And I don't
know if that's good or bad, but that's you know,

(42:42):
this is fun. I want to do this. They've worked
with so many of us on other projects, too, Like
I worked with Emily on Secret Life of bees Um,
which one which one of the girls did the movie
with Chad Emily, Emily did, Emily did. Ali just did
a movie with with Austin Oh cool, right at the

(43:04):
end of Quarantine they worked together. I never worked with Austin,
so I got to know him during that movie. Um,
Cheryl Lee. Cheryl Lee played Emily's grandmother. Weird full Circle
and Cherylene were just like the entire time, and He's like,
do you mind? Can I get to know her too?
You know, we were just like the entire time. Yeah,

(43:27):
I was trying to think Ali worked with Jackson what, Yeah,
like three years on a show they were. Ali was
recorring regular and so we saw his family all the time. Um.
Peter Kowalski was Natalie's DP on A on a Marvel show.

(43:47):
I mean we've had so clostovers. Yeah, I remember Emily
coming well, I remember Natalie coming in the trailer and
with the first you know, she would just come in
with her giant brown eyes and her freckles and they're
cute little blonde hair, and she would just smile at
you with this beautiful, beaming smile on her face was
like a sunflower. It was just like the sun, the sunlight.

(44:07):
I just loved looking at her face looking up at us.
And then Emily would come in with her ular. I
loved it. I was like, are you mine coming with me?
It was so fun for us to barbara that that energy,
because you're right, we you know, we were all out

(44:30):
there and we were little kids who thought we were
supposed to be grown ups. And when you would come
in with the kids and we'd all be in the
trailer in the mornings, it really felt like family. It
felt like home, like to be sitting, you know, having
Jojo do hair and holding one of your kids in
our laps and chatting. It was like it was the

(44:50):
most kind of Yeah, it was the most wholesome, like safe.
There was such a it was such a gift to
have your family on set a way with you so truly. Um,
you know, when I watched the show, it brings back
so many memories of doing the show. It was such
a happy time in my life. You know, hopefully the
best is yet to come, who knows, but that decade,

(45:12):
I mean, it was just the happiest time, possibly the happiest.
And it was because I was on a show I loved,
with people I love and character I loved, and then
also having my little kids living on the beach, Rightful Beach.
There's nothing better than Rightsful Beach. It was just happy.
I felt like I must have done something good. Sound

(45:35):
of music, Yes, somewhere in my wicked childhood. I must
have done something good. Yeah, um, bringing back the musical
as I watched your podcast, um, and we watched Sound
of Music. During the hurricane when we all had to
hunker it down in hotel rooms, we watched Sound of
Music over and over and that's all we did. We
watched Son of Music. Maria's school is doing that. That's

(45:57):
their next place music. No, I'm like, can I can
I take the role of Maria away from high school student?
Could I? If you need a baroness, let us love it?
Is she going to be in Barbara? You would be
such a good baroness. She's gonna audition? Who does she
want to be? She doesn't know yet. We're going to

(46:19):
watch the movie and see, I mean she's she. It's
a school wide production, so they are going to have,
you know, all through high school through kindergarten. So I
guess she's ten? Is does that make her she's too
old for Gretel Luisa? She's too young for Luisais Luisa
she's the one that sticks the frog on the chair?
I think yes. Everyone Holmes like, what so feels like

(46:43):
you guys in your musical talk, you want to know
what's funny is. I'm like, yeah, we did sound of
Music when I was in high school, and I did
props everything. I love props. They're still my very favorite
thing to do. Hey, where did you hang out in Wilmington?

(47:04):
Because you were out at the beach predominantly, right, Yeah,
we stayed at the beach the entire time. We ended up.
When we looked like we were going to be around
for a while, we bought a house in Landfall, which
is also the beach. But um, the first few years
we were renting a house on the beach. You know,
our owned I think it was like a month or something. Crazy.

(47:25):
I mean, I mean that's cheap for being um and
you know that's that was like our backyard. You know,
the kids could just run out and run through those
the brush and the white sand and it was just
it was heaven, you know, it was you couldn't ask
for more. Do you have advice for young women? I
mean you must, because you you have raised three young

(47:46):
women in this industry, and for young artists that are
up and coming, or you know, even girls who are
successful in this business. You know, what, what are some
things that you've experienced and that you feel like, oh man,
I wish I had known this when I was starting out.
Well that's what you saw us fall into. I don't know.
I mean I do wish that I had had someone,
you know, I wish I had had some you know,

(48:08):
some sort of mentor. I guess I had to figure
it out myself. But um, you know, it's just so
important to keep I don't know if you could tell
a kid this, keep your head on straight, but you know,
to have a solid family, you know, to have a
life other than this passion that you have to celebrate
every holiday no matter what. You know, keep the things

(48:30):
that are you know, important and things that are tangible,
things that um, you can rely on, you know, make
sure that you stay close with your family no matter what. UM,
your close friends. UM. Just it's just so that it's
not the only important thing in your life. And that's
what I've you know, what I've done with my kids

(48:51):
is just always you know, no matter how passionate you
feel about your career, there are other things too, and
so that when it doesn't go your way, used to
have these other things. I mean that sounds pretty basic
and cliche, but it's not always easy. You know, when
when you're driven, when you just want something so badly,
that's all you can see. You can't see straight. Well,

(49:12):
I think, especially in a business where what you do
can be mistaken for who you are. When you're a performer,
you are embodying someone, but it's not you. And it's
so important I think for artists to understand that there's
who you are and there's what you do right exactly.

(49:36):
And it's hard in this business, I think, especially when
you're young, to separate those things. And you know, if
you're the tiny yeah, and if you're the kind of
young girl, if you were where we were scared to
admit there were things we didn't know because we thought
we'd get in trouble. You know. Yeah, it's it's important. Yeah,

(49:56):
I wish we'd all been better at crawling into your
into your more and just cuddle. I wish. I wish
it's good advice for any profession though, I mean, having
your touchstones that exist outside of yeah exactly. But I know,
like you know, you and I are friends on social media.
I think are we Facebook friends? To um? I feel

(50:16):
like I've seen you go back to your high school
and we've talked about like your hometown, what was like,
what was your high school experience? Who were you at sixteen,
seventeen years old? I was like everything I was. I
think I, at the end, you know, most likely to
you guys are doing. I think I was most likely

(50:38):
to do everything, like some stupid award that I got
at the end of the year. And I was, you know,
a cheerleader and student consul and theater and tennis and
I mean I would just try to squeeze in as
much as I possibly could. Um. And it was a
great experience. And you know, my kids don't go to school,
and sometimes I don't to use the word regret, but

(51:01):
I wonder, you know, what their experience would have betten.
I mean, they're they're experiencing other things that are amazing,
but sometimes I get a little sad that they're not
experiencing the high school experience, the college experience. Um, but
that's who I was. I was one tree Hill. Yeah
you were, Yeah, you were. You were like a mix

(51:21):
of all the characters. You were Peyton. But then you
were doing theater in Chicago, right, how did you get
involved in that? I entered the Miss teen Illinois padget
Yes she did? Or aware of these pictures? I need
these photos. I have them, and I won the talent portion,

(51:48):
and one of the judges was um, an agent in Chicago,
and so I signed with her and I started doing
you know, commercials and little roles and a lot of
theater in Cargo and stayed there for a while, and
then I UM. I went to Northern Illinois, but I
would still audition in Chicago. I would go back. I
wanted to go to a college where I could still

(52:10):
audition in the big city, and so I did that
for a while, and then I moved out to l A.
And the theater scene is so good there and all
the improv. Did you get into any of that stuff
I did? Second City? You're so cool. That's why you
were so good to this day. And I was wondering,
joy if you feel the same, because well, all of you,
all of you infuse comedy and too thinks, and that's

(52:31):
why I love that. I love taking any role and
just trying to find the comedy in it or the
lightness of it and so people can relate to it.
And you know, I'm watching deb At the beginning, she
wasn't she was pretty heavy. You know, there wasn't a
whole lot of comedy and hopefully after I got to
know the writers a little bit more, they thought, you know,
we can maybe make her a little goefier and she's gay.

(52:54):
You got there and and I liked it so much more.
Did you ask for that? Did you have asked them
to proper to give you comedy? I think I just
told them how much I loved it. Positive reinforcement. You know,
if something came in with a little bit of comedy,
I would say, oh I love this, love this, love this.
I didn't you know. I wasn't a complainer. I complained

(53:16):
about my wardrobe a lot, and it wasn't it wasn't
It wasn't appreciated that I ever had anything negative to say.
But I wasn't letting up on that wardrobe. Like my
pleadd tan pants that you know, at the time, you
guys were all wearing like those low rides. They were

(53:37):
so cute at the time, was like, you know, like Mom,
Taylor like yes, and here we are watching the episode
and I'm like, where are the top of our pants?
They owe us eight inches of fabric, so cute. Though
you guys could pull it off so cute, they really did.

(53:58):
They treated parents on TV very differently. Than than they
do now. There was kind of this like unsexy, let's
dump you down. And you had had Nathan when you
were like eighteen years old, so you were a young mom.
You're playing like years old, which is younger than we
are now, you know. So the idea of like like

(54:21):
if someone put me in tan slacks, I'd be mortified.
It was. It was very beige. Um. You know, I
spent my entire adult life being on y A projects
when I'm not a y A and I just feel
this responsibility. I don't want kids to fast forward through
the adult roles, you know, like through the adult scenes.

(54:41):
I want them to find the adults just as interesting.
And you don't want to be the stereotypical parent of boring.
It's boring. Yeah, And I want flaws and I want
you know, I mention and and where does this idea
that moms are somehow sterile when I come from like
you're a hot mom, I'm into it. You're all hot moms.

(55:05):
Oh my god, Sophia and the three hot moms. That's
this episode. Like, but like, I I appreciate knowing that
you don't have to lose yourself or your romance or
your fire or your humor, because you're right. Back then,

(55:26):
they kind of wanted these parents to just be these
you know, tent poles of advice and then they'd like
scuttle off the side. And you really, you rested your
humanity and and and your femininity back from those khaki pants. Also,
I think the show needed a Karen, you know, Karen Row,

(55:49):
not a Karen but um, but there was already a
Karen Row. I mean, let's let's find something out, you know,
let's let's let's flow her up a bit, deb And
you know, eventually they figured it out. You know, you
didn't need to parents like that. Uma and I loved
her at the beginning, but I loved her a lot

(56:11):
more later on. What was your favorite We can talk
about stuff coming up. What was your favorite favorite? Deb Shenanigan.
I loved all of the War of the Roses. Um
with Dan, I loved all Um. That was by far
my favorite. UM. Karen and I, Moira and I had
a night on the billboard on top of the billboard.

(56:32):
Oh that's yes, painting a mustache on Dan. And thatman
Cats suit, Oh my god, that was I think it
was a juicy suit. Yeah, that's what we're going to
send out this year's rap gifts for the podcast Just Juicy.

(56:54):
We'll hunt him down on eBay. I have them all
of mine. Oh have green wine black, the wine white,
and my girls are sealing them all the time. But
remember the show the store Oliver, Yes, Yes, okay, this
is store in Wilmington's. Yes. And this is what I did.
I would shop there. I would put things on hold,

(57:16):
and I told them when our wardrobe person would come
in shopping for characters, to push them in her face,
in their face, in her face, and say that Barbara
was in here and these are the things she really loves.
That's genus and sorry. But surely she started picking up
a few things and and I remember being told, you've

(57:36):
got to let you know, You've got to let the
whole wardrobe thing go. But unfortunately that is high level thinking. Basically,
it starts with wardrobe. In your look and your hair.
I mean basically, people are watching, that's what they see. Um.
Did you have hair wars too? Did you have words
over your hair? The style? We all had hair wars.
That's hair wars. That's the name of our memoir. I

(58:01):
always have hair wars. I am actually pretty happy to
hear that you guys had them too, because I had
a lot of them. When it came from that the
we were always told it came from the network, but
we questioned everything. Now. I think there was maybe one
or two people in particular that just had an idea
of what they wanted women to look like or girls

(58:22):
to look like or whatever. Yeah. I also put my
hair up a couple of times, and that was next
pretty quick. Um, you feel like I recalled there being
an episode if I'm remembering correctly, where you had your
hair in a ponytail and a hot tub and you
looked great, dangerous. I'm saying, I they you look great

(58:44):
with your hair up. That was with Antoine, which is
my favorite storyline. So I guess my dog is like
barfing on the rug and my child grew and I'm
just like, this is what being a working mom is about.
How to do this? You just smile and you power through.
That's what I love to do. So yeah, No, Antoine

(59:07):
and deb was my favorite chunk of time on the
show because I thought it was the right amount of
naughty but also like really endearing because you two were
cute together. You're still cute together and his that was
the comedy was right there. Man, you guys just so good.
So he's so good and his bark is so much

(59:28):
worse than his bite. She wait, girl, like yeah, it
would be kind of nervous. I had one dress that
they rigged because he had to undo my dress in
front and so they had to rig it up. So
they because it was in the script, you know, and

(59:49):
um I was showing up how it works. He's like, oh,
you know, okay, that's fine, just like what happened to
the Antoine. I know, like we so respect fowl. And
I was I think three weeks after having Ali. Um
I was in the pool with my hair up and
nursing and topless. Oh my god, barbe and you're a

(01:00:15):
superwoman covering like this with Antoine. And he was so sweet,
and I was afraid I was going to get like
I'm sorry, this is like I was lactating in the
I was gonna get milk in the pool. But he's
a dance so he got it. He was so sweet,

(01:00:35):
you know, and then he was hugging me and he's
like I got you. I got your girl, Like no
one's going to see anything. And he was so I
love him so much. Right after I gave birth to George,
I did a movie with Antoine. It was like, I
don't know, two months later and I was at that
point where like the baby's not sleeping and I also
have to be on set and I'm losing my mind,
and Antoine would come over to my apartment and just

(01:00:57):
rock my baby, like he knows how to do one
arm in a way that like the child falls asleep. Like, yeah,
he's got good dad energy, he's a good dad. Yeah,
he's so antoinees. Like I remember I was dealing with
like boy drama, and I remember calling him and he
would set on the phone with me for like two
hours and just talk me through it and here's what

(01:01:17):
you do and here's what you said. Well what happened,
and like my little therapist, I love him. You got
to kiss all the Cube boys on the show, because
you also ended up kissing Craig at some point, right,
I was hoping for two seconds, I thought maybe we
were going to end up together. And and I did
know that you had a crushed on him Joy, and
I didn't know that. I didn't know. I didn't think

(01:01:39):
you ever told me. Maybe you did, but I don't
think you did. I just probably I was just fawning
over him all the time, like staring long and across
the room. I was hoping. I was hoping that it
never happened. Um. But we get some of these like
deep thought questions that we are supposed to answer, but
I want to know some of yours. Um. One of
them was like, if you have a friend coming to town,

(01:02:01):
what experience in Wilmington's would you tell them, Like, you
cannot miss this intoshin Oh, we're still there. So right
before quarantine, Um, there was a convention there. I don't
remember if we were all we were all there together,
I don't I don't remember, but it was in Raleigh,

(01:02:22):
I think. But anyway, I went to Wilmington and I
spent my birthday in Wilmington's and everybody took me out
to Indoshing and it's so good. It's still good, it's
still amazing. But you know, obviously the beach, the beach
is like no other. I mean, there's just something special
about going to the beach, going to Riceful Beach and
hanging East Coast Beach is so warm, so much, so great.

(01:02:45):
And you know, all of my best friends are still there.
I accumulated best friends and kept them to this day. Um,
we're in Toronto, we're driving back. We're actually gonna stop
in um in Wilmington on the way back. Yeah, and
so we're just going to where are you guys? Like?
L I L? I wait? How long are you going
to be in Toronto? We're here till mid August. I

(01:03:09):
get there in October. Do you do cassing in the night?
Just so close? Okay, I have a great place I'm staying.
I should tell you about it. This is why our
club remains, because we have spirewebbed from Willington all across
North America and even further. Um, that's right, sweet, Okay,

(01:03:32):
So the girls are taking over television. You and Olivia
are working on a show right now. What what do
you think is the reason? With all this new content
out there, people are still drawn to the show. You know,
it's funny. I'm watching it now for the first time
with Ali, who's thirteen, and she said, just last night,

(01:03:57):
she said, I miss shows a people just talk to
each other. It's a relationship show and there are no
you know, special effects or big car chases or you know,
she said, I just like watching these people talk to
each other and wow, that's a thirteen year old and

(01:04:20):
she and I said, you know, you don't have to
watch this, she said, no, I'm last night. When I
went to bed, I could hear that she was watching
it in her bedroom as she was going to sleep,
And then made me feel so good. Little does she
know what I do later on in the episode, and
there's binging binge watching now, So it's not like she's
gonna have to wait three years to see. She's gonna
come downstairs the breakfast one morning and you'll know. Yeah. Um,

(01:04:45):
it's just character driven, you know. And that's what drew
me to the show to begin at the beginning. It's just,
you know, it's just all about the characters and you know,
just so all of them so well round it. And
I don't know, it's hard to find show like that
these days. It really is. We need to write one, Yeah,
Barbara together again. Listen Christmas movie in Louisiana And we

(01:05:09):
had to the last second, We had to like get
somebody to come play the superintendent of all the schools,
and they were trying to cast local and I was like,
I ain't gonna happen. Ain't gonna happen, and they're like, well, fine,
who do you have Hillary. It's like, I've got Barbara
Allen Woods. And she shows up and within thirty seconds
of being there, every member of the crew is in

(01:05:31):
love with her. Willie Garson is following her around like
a puppy, eating out of the palm of her hand,
and they're like, where did you find her? Because it
was really this like one dimensional character on paper, and
Barbara came in and made her warm and funny and
so likable and like the hero of the movie. And

(01:05:51):
everyone was just like, please, please, let's write a whole
movie where she's here the whole time. And it was
an almost which is always extra special because we all
get super giddy and you know, like he barely make
it through. It was fun. You have that special thing
that I think Sharon Lawrence also has Barbara, where you
walk into a room and it's like, I love Sharon too,

(01:06:14):
and you you you don't walk, you like float, you
like glide into the room and everyone stops, and the
energy in the room shifts and suddenly you just notice
everybody's kind of at you know, it's true. You, you
and Sharon Lawrence have that and it's really amazing to
watch what happened. I love her. You know, we know

(01:06:34):
each other because of One Tree Hill and we never
even worked together, but we have run into each other
and so we really bond over the show even though
we never worked together. And she's amazing. Yeah. Should we
do most likely to girls? Yeah, Barbara, you're ready for
this to Yeah, please do it with that. It can

(01:06:54):
be a real life cast member of ours or a character. Okay,
let's do it. So curious. Yeah, listen for getting advanced here,
Kiss and tell most likely to Kiss and Tell. All right,

(01:07:17):
this is a dangerous one. I mean I never kissed
anybody on the show. Nobody wanted to kiss me, so
it probably would have been me had anyone kissed me.
Damn it. I wasn't provided that opportunity. I would have
told everybody. Um, yeah, kiss and tell. You know you
know who kiss and told in real life, ladies? One

(01:07:42):
Very Corbin in that bar downtown Charlie Brown's. I can
tell you a few Barry Corbin stories. Yes, he's a
kiss and tell. Well, he's just yeah, I mean he
went forward a few times. Let me just say, how

(01:08:04):
could he not? But you know, we're being public, and
I felt a little bit under the table, you know,
just like checking it out to see if I was interested,
but you know, in a respectful way. I was just
crazing the back of your hand, just like would you
like to hold my hand? A little footstee? Okay, yeah,
he's how did you This is actually a good a

(01:08:26):
good segue into this question, because, um, I think this
happens a lot, especially right now in this modern age.
A lot of young women are not sure how to
handle if they're being hit on by somebody that maybe
they just don't want to go out with or whatever,
and it becomes a really scary and like, oh, I'm
be I'm at work and and I feel and then
it becomes an hr thing. But I think there is
an onus on women to just be able to to

(01:08:48):
say like, oh, I'm so flattered, thank you, but no,
and then of course if it continues, it becomes a
different issue. But how did how do you handle that?
As you know, I've put the fear of God in
all of my kids, you know, because that because of
all the situations I've been in, and I would never
want any of those things to happen to them. And
I think they have no trouble saying no. I mean
they just walk away. So cool to see a kid

(01:09:12):
say no. And how do you say no to uh
when you're like, like when you're getting hit up, Hey,
he's checking it out? Is this? Is this an interesting thing?
Like how do you do that where you maintain the
friendship in the relationship in a working environment, but you know,
still put your boundary up. I don't know. I think
it's just more acceptable these days to say no. I

(01:09:33):
don't think that the hitting is going on. Hitting on
is going on as often as it used to. Let's
hope it's not. I have a feeling they say no
even when people aren't hitting on them, because they're just
so afraid they are, you know, I think that they
turn them away, like what are you doing? Would you
like some coffee? Get you know, go away? Yeah, it's

(01:09:55):
your coffee elsewhere. So yeah, you that was my predicament
in the past. You know, I don't want to be
on this person's bad side, this person I'm gonna be
working with for the next six months. I don't want
them to hate me or take it out on me
in any way. So that was like the struggle I
always went through, but I just don't see it as

(01:10:15):
much these days, thank god, you know. I just it's
also part of the dance of men and women is
you know, somebody making an advance to see, like, hey,
are you interested, and then the other person says yes
or no, and that's just that's the dance. That's what
we do. Yeah. Yeah, I would have kissed and told though,
like who would have put out oh deab Yeah, I

(01:10:38):
mean it's obvious. Yeah, And you know what, I did
want to say something because I thought about this because
I was so respect the fact that you guys were
able to say no. What you're young, and you know
some of you were, you know, relatively new, but you
had no problem saying no, and you you had integrity
and you protected your characters. And I think because of that,
my character got more interesting because I think somebody, when

(01:11:00):
they were trying to like spice up the show a
little bit, they're like, oh, these girls, you know, they
won't do it. Like I'm like, I'll do it. You
need someone, Yeah, I'll do gratuitous sex. Yeah. You know,
I don't know, you know, like I never volunteered, but
I think they saw that maybe I was game. You know,
so I had kids, so they know you were putting

(01:11:21):
out that. Yeah, like I don't know, you know, it's
like fourth choice, you know, they would have rather had
it be you. It was more age appropriate though, because
think about it as like real women, we come into
our sexuality not at eighteen, not at it is something
that like in your thirties, you are jamming, you know,

(01:11:42):
And so it made more sense for Did to be
the leader there. And it was also I think that
when sex is funny, it's less offensive. And I always
tried to incorporate like these scenes that sometimes many times
crossed the line. If they're funny, they're more acceptable somehow, Yeah,

(01:12:03):
less threatening. Yeah, yeah, that's a good way. From now on,
every time I have to do a sex scene, I'm
going to take that note make it funny, and I'm
gonna make it funny. Make it funny. There'll be a
director at some point who's just like, who told you
this funny sex? All right? So I did you have

(01:12:24):
any kiss and tell candidates? Oh? Man? I mean I
feel like Brooke Davis was a bit of a kiss
and teller, but I but I also feel like it
was very too try to be cool, you know, who
were yours? Oh? Um, well, Barry, I think is a great?
Is actually a really great? I think yeah, Um, you know,

(01:12:45):
my first instinct I was like, is it broke? But
actually I don't think it's broke at all. I think
she's much more of it's all bravado with Brooke. Yeah,
she holds a lot close to her heart, a lot
of private moments. Um, yeah, Antoine, Antoine is definitely he

(01:13:06):
tells a lot. You know what's so funny? Joy I
actually had a thought about that, that kind of Brit
Davis Bravado based on our conversation from last week when
I was watching Uh you do that scene in the
Poncho with James and Hilary. We were like, God, it's
so sweet and he's kind of flirting and and you're

(01:13:26):
just like really hard to read and you can tell
that she's flattered but also wants to hold it in.
And I was like, man, see, Joey actually knew how
to be chill around boys. And then there's me who's
supposed to be like, you know, the hit cheerleader and
like she's really into dudes. And I just watched myself
like really overacting because I'm like, is this how people

(01:13:47):
do it. This is how people do it. They make
like really big faces and stuff and they're like and
I just was like, oh god, yeah, you've been doing something, man,
and you were you were chilled. We learned so much
about Brooke because of that, because she she didn't I
think that was the doubling down that she would do

(01:14:08):
instead of retreating, which is what Haley did. She just
retreated within herself and Brooke was like, I don't know
what I'm doing, so I'm just gonna throw everything out
there and you know, try and get it right. You know.
It's just a different way of handling handling the same emotions.
That's so funny. I love it, Barbara. It makes me
so happy and confident to know that your daughters are

(01:14:32):
the next generation of of leaders and role models for
young girls out there because I know how you raised
your girls. We know how you are and you you
did it right. You know, they're beautiful and smart and
strong and confident in a way that I wish we'd been.
You were. You absolutely were all of those adjectives. I

(01:14:56):
looked up to you guys so much as the adult
on the show. I looked up to you guys. I
really did um you were and you are now such
amazing role models to my girls and we all follow
everything you do. And it's just you know, I'm just
you know, as the mom on One Tree Hill. I'm
so proud of all three of you for you. Thanks.

(01:15:18):
We have to get back to Wrightsville Beach like soon. Yeah, yeah,
for sure, to see you in person. And I want
to see baby. I want to see all your babies
and oh my god, they no, they're not babies anymore.
But I want to see everybody. Need a reunion. We do.
Maybe when you get home from Toronto, before I go
to Toronto, we'll steal Hillary from the East Coast and
we'll still do it sleep oversh my god, that's it.

(01:15:45):
We have to Joy. Joy always wanted to have tea parties.
She's like, what do you want to do, So we'll
do a tea party down. I still do tea parties.
We love you so much. Back spirals, you're coming back.
I want to come back for the with I want
to come back with Antoine. I'll talk about it. We'll

(01:16:09):
see what we're going to do it. Yes, I love
that idea. Love you, Thanks for having Thank you. Thanks
to the gals. I will bye by Wow. I love
her guys. Barbara Allan Woods. She brings me energy, everything, everything,

(01:16:36):
And you know, Barbara really does remind me that we
get to own it all. We get to own our
professionalism and our intellect and are funny and are silly
and are sexy. And she's such an incredible example just
by being that you can be so fully embodied. I mean,
what a role model. Yeah, and I agree that she.

(01:17:02):
I'm so scared of this industry for my kids because
I had such a wonky experience with it, and Barbara
did the opposite. Barbara was like, we're not going to
be scared. We're going to own it, you know. And
and has kept her girls really safe. I mean, Barbara
committed to being on set with all three of her
girls like at the same time. She's a superhuman. I

(01:17:24):
don't know how she did it, um, but they're just
you can tell their dad is an assistant director. They
know how to show up and they know what's up. Yeah,
it's it's it's the I mean, it does make me scared.
Maria is It is actually a really good little actress, um,
and she's got good instincts and but she does theater

(01:17:47):
right now, because to me, theater is a team sport.
But you know, film for kids can is really as
so many of you know. It doesn't take a genius
to take a look around and see all the kids
that have gone off the rails because they up in
this business. But Barbara has Um managed to do an
amazing job with her girls. They're all such good, solid
people and smart and stick up for themselves and they're

(01:18:09):
professional and it gives me hope. It's pretty cool. Hey,
welcome back. Okay, we have some listener questions. Okay from Brianna.
In episode five, on the anniversary of Peyton's mom's death,

(01:18:29):
why does Brook seems so unaware of their best friends?
And I just feel like she had no idea what
day it was. So I'm hoping you guys will talk
about it and when you get to that episode, hopefully
it was a production error. I just feel like Brooke
is so much better than that, and you know, how
did she not realize about this important day for her
best friend? So talk tell us about that, you know,

(01:18:51):
to listen, listen, listen. We have to also keep in
mind this was two thousand three, right, so this is
like pre spook reminders. This is pre iPhone with Google
calendar and things like that. Liked, we were still using
paper calendars on our walls. You weren't going to write
that out in your school planner, you know, like, it's

(01:19:13):
not It was just a different time. And I think
remembering things like that are much easier now. Um, yeah,
we have constant reminders now. But also, I don't know
that the writers when we started the show understood the
depth of our character's chemistry. You know, that we really

(01:19:35):
were a love story. Yeah, they didn't for sure, And
I do think that. First of all, thank you for that,
because as soon as Joy read this question, I wanted
to barrow from It was always a thing that upset me. Well,
I didn't come here, we did. That's true. Baby is sick,

(01:19:56):
oh man, But no, it's very true. But I think, um,
this is really indicative. When you guys have heard us
talk about the ways that we went to bat for
our characters and fought for them to be more wholly
represented and complete young women and women, this is exactly it.

(01:20:16):
We were really still five episodes in, although you know,
Peyton had this incredible storyline about grief that I think
was the most adult thing we had done on the
show so far, we were still kind of being treated
as these secondary characters. It was two boys. They were
the stars. It was about basketball, and we were the girls,

(01:20:38):
and we'd be used where they needed us, and especially
with Brook, you know, because I was added in an
episode one, they were like captain of the cheer squad, like, well,
she's that stereotype. And and these were the kinds of
things that we would bring to the table over and
over and over again and say it wouldn't be like this,

(01:20:59):
girls wouldn't miss this, we would never ignore this. And
you know, Wolf, it was brutal at times. And also,
let's be honest to hear like, well, well this is
not really the point of the episode, and it's like,
oh okay, well, but it was like it was a
fight all you know, the whole time, because like when

(01:21:19):
Brooke got beat up and Peyton's like, oh you throw
on the stairs. You know, like there's certain things that
you can only fight so many fights, especially when you're
you know, it's season one and you're brand new, and
there are things that's a really good point. There are
things that are required for us as performers to suspend

(01:21:39):
disbelief to service the story, like when that happened to
Brooke and Peyton had to go, Oh my god, honey,
like what a horrible fall you took, Because if you'd known,
then we wouldn't have had the drama of the episode.
If Brooke had been there for Peyton in the way
that I would think she would have been, Peyton wouldn't
have been alone for the whole episode crying in her

(01:22:00):
are so sometimes it somewhere to go, but you know,
I mean, every gives your character somewhere to go. So
it was it worked in that way. Well, the redemption
so much sweeter, you know, like then when Brooks shows up,
you know, it just the yeah, the redemption. But it
would have been so nice to see you guys connect

(01:22:20):
in that way in real life when things ever went south,
we were all hugging and kissing, you know. I mean,
I will say, because this is now the second time
I've thought of it Um in reference to this, because
because this is about grief and so much of you know,

(01:22:42):
so many of the big moments in this episode happened
on the Quad. I'll never forget Um shooting at school
one day on the Quad, and it was a day
my grandfather died and Hillary, you were the person like you.
I got the call from my mom and you just
like I didn't know I was falling but until I
realized you'd caught me. And like we went through that

(01:23:06):
stuff in that school, like in those places together all
of us, Like our real grief are real loss, like
you lost people. I mean we lost when you were
the first person I saw. You know, we were so
blessed to be there for each other in in life

(01:23:26):
and that is something I cherish that we got it
right behind the time when we didn't get it right
all of the times. Um, you know on camera, Yeah,
it's it's nice when you feel like it's real. And
I think that's why the audience wants to know, like, ah,

(01:23:47):
how could this be? But um, the real stuff was real.
So if if you were feeling like, oh, this relationship
deserved more, just know that it did exist, just like
off camera. Um. Yeah. And that kind of leads into
the next question that we have um with Mackenzie wants

(01:24:08):
to know if I kept any of the albums that
Peyton had in her room and like, maybe this is
a tough subject because no, Um, when I left the show,
it was kind of unceremonious. I after the fact somebody
snuck me Ellie's leather jacket our costume or knew that

(01:24:28):
that was something that would mean a lot to me
and it was never gonna be seen again, and so
she passed it like through a secret channel of people
to get to me. Um, but the only things I
have from the show are things that so stole when
the show ended and mailed to me. She was like,
I have a box that was even Peyton never came back.

(01:24:50):
The real life relationship behind the lens is what you
guys hoped it would be, you know, like, yes, my
best friend stole my stuff. I mean, I remember that
was so hard. You know, you even referenced Brooks wedding
like joy and I were like, this feels weird, but
you gotta you gotta like do it. And and I

(01:25:13):
think there was obviously there was such a saving grace
for us in in getting to have the safety of
of Brooke and Haley after all those years. But oh man,
I mean this is a fast forward. But I remember
the end of the show, when we were filming the
Tree Hill movie and when we built Peyton's room, and
you know, the bookshelves, the records. It had all been
in storage. That's something that the audience may not know

(01:25:36):
to like guys, they keep everything in boxes and it's cataloged,
and like they break the sets down and they literally
pack up buildings in storage containers and yeah, like that,
it's all somewhere. And I walked into you know, Peyton's
room with the records, and I just starting and I
was like, this is really weird. I'm feeling very emotional.

(01:25:57):
I grew up in this room on television and also
in real life. Um, but yeah, it was a trip
and that that was kind of when when we were
like getting into the last two weeks, I just started
stealing stuff to people. I was like, I'm gonna take this,
you know, because I was like I was like, I know,
these things are just gonna go like in a storage

(01:26:19):
container and no one's ever going to see them again.
And I don't like that. I'm too sentimental. I feel
like a lot of our stuff got sold in auctions
and things like that. So if anybody has like my
old clothes, like, I'll buy him back. I'm not weird
stuff back. I kind of like that. Yeah, Joy, we
have a question from Carla, she wants to know that

(01:26:42):
cracker Jack bracelet from Hayley's first tutorin SI with Nathan,
did you need to keep it? So I'm going to
ruin I'm going to burst the bubble, like I don't
want to ruin fantasy with them. I'm like, there's a
story here. No, it's not a real want to make
something else. It's actually so non exciting. The prop department

(01:27:03):
had like a giant plastic bag full of these bracelets,
and there wasn't so there wasn't just one. It was
like plastic bag. He would give them out to like
extras and people who were like, oh I want one,
I on one. So the actual original one that he
put on my wrist just went right back into a
plastic bag. So somebody out there has the actual original one,

(01:27:23):
but there's no way we would ever know which one.
Did you get to keep any Yeah? I have one, Yes,
yes I do, but it was just a random one
from a plastic bag, you know. So the sentiment is
nice to though, because like now every girl who has
one is looking at her wrist like this could be
the way. Yeah, oh I love that. Wait wait, and

(01:27:51):
and Carla has a sort of part two of her question,
which I don't think I know the answer to about
you either. Joy. Were you ever a tutor in high school? No,
you didn't. You didn't tear horrible in school? No did
you really? I would have said that you were like
the straight a girl. No, No, I was. I was

(01:28:11):
bess at best. If I ever got an a was
like throw her a party. I mean, no, I just
don't know. I don't learn well in classroom environments. Now.
Whenever I was on set and I had a personal teacher,
and I would fly through my curriculum and I would
do really really well because I had one on one
and somebody that could work with my My brain learns

(01:28:33):
um and processes information in a way that's just not
conducive with the public school um system. In the classroom environment,
I asked a lot of questions because my brain kind
of works. Were like, it's not enough for me to
just know what the answer is. I need to know
why that's the answer, and I need so that I
can understand. Don't don't just tell me that if I

(01:28:55):
put the toast in and I click it down, it's
going to heat it. Why is it heating it? How
does that work? I need to understand, and teachers don't
have time for that. So I could never just learn
the answer and then copy it down. My memory wouldn't
hold things like that, So I did pretty badly in school.
To be honest, do you guys have a weird short
term memory thing? I'm doing TV for as long as

(01:29:17):
we did, because whoa. I've realized that when you get
trained to learn ten pages of dialogue a day and
then forget it and learn ten more the next day. Man,
sometimes I'm like, what happened? There's a story, it was
my birthday. Start start the story, and if someone gets

(01:29:37):
four lines in then it's exactly like the reaction you
had watching the scene on the bridge. I'm like, oh,
I know this dialog, I know this, I remember. I
remember every word of the scene with Lucas. It was
the weirdest feeling to watch that scene back and be like,
oh my god, was it maybe my audition seat. There's

(01:29:57):
no way that scene was written when I auditioned. I
don't know why. It's just it's like stapled to my brain.
I know every single one of those words. I could
do that same tomorrow. It's just because you had to
do it over a weed whacker and over and over. Yeah,
you know what it was, the trauma of the weed whacker.

(01:30:18):
It just cemented it. Yeah. Um, so though you, you
were different because you can read a book and remember
what was in the book and have intelligent conversations about
it long after you've you've read it. I remember this
about you. I can't. I mean, I can process information. Yeah,

(01:30:41):
but you like you remember? That's really kind. I so
this is this can be a conundrum. This is really
good for me as an advocate. I can rattle off
social science data till I'm blue in the face. But
when I tell you, I do not know my mother's
cell phone number, I don't know. I know the first

(01:31:02):
three digits, but I don't. I don't know it. I
just don't. There are basic things I cannot remember. But
I can tell you a quote from some Dutch report
on gender pay parody from I don't know why I'm
like this, And sometimes I look at people I love
and I'm like, I'm so sorry, thank you for loving me. Um,

(01:31:24):
I don't know. I don't know what that is. Okay,
So we have a huge episode next week. What's next week?
It's episode six. Every night is another story. Oh that's
a good party. I think it's the party, wait, the
beach house party. It might be the fancy house party,

(01:31:45):
like dresses and suits, the one where I had to
rip Chad's shirt off. I don't remember any of this
red solo cups. Yeah it was. It was a tough one, man.
I have no idea. I guess you guys all guess
we're all good old find out next week. We have
a question. Alright, So you guys have to watch the
episode because we're watching the episode. Um, and in the meantime,

(01:32:10):
tell all your friends because we're having a great time here.
We love it, And thank you guys for your questions.
These are so just lovely and thoughtful and sentimental and
they mean a lot. So if you are feeling some
overwhelming feelings like Peyton in this episode, there is no
shame in asking for help. The National Suicide Prevention Lifeline

(01:32:33):
is one eight hundred two seven three eight to five five.
Help is there. There are people that love you and
care about you, and so we want you to to
stay healthy. Hey, thanks for listening. Don't forget to leave
us a review. You can also follow us on Instagram
at drama queens o t h or email us at

(01:32:56):
Drama Queens at I heart radio dot com. See you
next time. We are all about that high school drama Girl,
Drama Girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take
you for a ride in our comic Girl Cheering for
the right Drama Queens Dreelise my girl, up girl fashion,
but your tough girl, you could sit with us Girl

(01:33:17):
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Into the Woods and Weed Wackers (Barbara Alyn Woods as Deb Scott) • EP105

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Into the Woods and Weed Wackers (Barbara Alyn Woods as Deb Scott) • EP105