Episode 379 w/ Big Daddy Kane

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
And this is Drinks Chants, motherfucking podcast.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
Man, he's a legends every queens rapper.

Speaker 1 (00:17):
He ain't agreed as your boy in.

Speaker 2 (00:18):
O R E.

Speaker 3 (00:19):
He's a Miami hip hop pioneer.

Speaker 2 (00:21):
What up?

Speaker 3 (00:21):
It's d J E f N.

Speaker 4 (00:23):
Together they drink it up with some of the biggest players,
you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (00:26):
And the most professional, unprofessional podcast and your number one
source for drunks.

Speaker 3 (00:32):
Drink Chants, mother post every day is New Year's cust.
It's time for drink Champs. Drink up, motherfuck mother?

Speaker 1 (00:44):
Would it good? Be? Its your boy in O R E?

Speaker 2 (00:47):
What up?

Speaker 1 (00:48):
His DJ E f N and this drink Champs. When
me and e f N started this show, we said
we want to always give this platform to icons, and
we talk about to legends and were talking about right
now we have an icon in the building. This man.

(01:09):
I just heard mister Lee say, you know he had
a flat top. Not only I had a flat top
because of this man. My eyes is bushy to this
day because of this man. I cat scratches. They was
calling it, and they was like, it's can scratches, motherfuckers.
This man has been influential, Like I'm listening to his music,
and I can smell the jellous driving by my hood.

(01:32):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 3 (01:33):
The Volk wagons.

Speaker 1 (01:33):
The Volk wagons was be big back then, with the
with the vanilla. You know, the trees, the trees sense
you know what I'm talking about in the car, Like,
oh my god, this man is so influential. He got
a documentary. Everyone is participating in the documentary. Everyone is
there giving him his flowers. And we had him on before,
but we are giving him We got our ship together,

(01:56):
so we are giving him the real flowers and we're
going talk about him. Pop fifty. We go about everything.
In case you don't know what we told about. We
told about the one that owner I called it impeccable, motherfucker.
So kay yo, let's let's start it with the hip
hop fifty. Yeah, some people are so happy about the

(02:18):
Hip Hop fifty. Some people are bitter, some.

Speaker 3 (02:20):
People are amongst the community.

Speaker 1 (02:23):
What do you think discrepancies came from, in particular the
Yankee Stadium.

Speaker 3 (02:28):
Nah, we've been hearing different. Well, there's there's.

Speaker 5 (02:30):
People saying that the timeline is off, it's not exactly fifty,
that that could be disputed. And then there's people saying
that they feel the hip hop fifty is being like
a corporate takeover, where it's being over monetized and appropriated
is the word that was used with specialized specific people
saying that.

Speaker 2 (02:47):
I mean, you know, if it's giving flowers and paying
homage and putting money into artists pockets, right, I don't
see that.

Speaker 6 (02:55):
Being a major problem, absolutely, you know.

Speaker 2 (02:59):
But as far as the timeline thing, I think that
the issue comes from other people that.

Speaker 6 (03:07):
Like basically did something for hip hop.

Speaker 2 (03:11):
You know, there there are other people that did things
in hip hop before, say what Hollywood. They are the
people that you know, did things before HERK, like you know,
DJ Hollywood, Eddie Cheaber. You know, these guys was rapping
before seventy three. You know, you had DJ's like Grand

(03:33):
Master Flowers, Pete, DJ Jones, DJ Plumber, Disco King Mario
that was djaying before Cool HERK.

Speaker 6 (03:43):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (03:46):
But in nineteen seventy three.

Speaker 6 (03:52):
HERK took all these elements.

Speaker 2 (03:55):
MCing is only one element, DJing is only one elementineteen
seventy three, Kirk took all these elements am seeing DJ
and be boys because he had the Nigga Twins dancing
Doug in them.

Speaker 1 (04:10):
You know you heard about the Nigga Twins the other day. Yeah, yeah,
I was trying to Peter Rosberg. Can you pronounce their name?
Peter Boseburg?

Speaker 2 (04:16):
He's like no, well, but yeah, you know, HERK took
all of these elements and combined them into one. And
that's what hip hop is. Hip Hop is not just
him seeing. Hip hop is not just DJing. Hip Hop
is all these elements. And Herk is the one that combined.
He is the one. He's Thanos. He got all the

(04:38):
infinity stones, you understand me. So yeah, I give her
credit for inventing hip hop in nineteen seventy three.

Speaker 3 (04:45):
And that's it. Cedric huh what is it? Yeah? And
his sister has something to do with it too, right.

Speaker 6 (04:54):
I believe she's the one to throw the party.

Speaker 2 (04:55):
Yeah right. But I mean as far as combining the elements,
you know, to create what we call hip hop, I
credit her for that.

Speaker 3 (05:06):
You know, that was the culmination of it, and that
sparks from there.

Speaker 2 (05:09):
Yeah. I mean, you know, these people that can debate me,
and I can respect that because I was only five
years old and set, you know, But I mean basing
it on what was done because you know, like Hollywood
and Eddieg, but they parties was for adults. You couldn't
break dance in their parties and they couldn't pass the

(05:29):
mic because they're paid DJs.

Speaker 6 (05:31):
It's not their party.

Speaker 2 (05:32):
They're getting paid like fifteen hundred two stacks to dj,
So that's what.

Speaker 6 (05:35):
They're doing a job, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (05:38):
Her created an atmosphere what other MC's can get on
the mic.

Speaker 6 (05:42):
B boys could break dance.

Speaker 2 (05:43):
Without getting kicked out the club for kicking people.

Speaker 6 (05:45):
In their sin and shit like that. You know what
I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (05:47):
To be sorry, I cut you a but I was
having a conversation and certain people were saying that DJ
Hollywood wasn't considered hip hop. I don't understand that. What
do they mean because he was considered a disco DJ.

Speaker 6 (05:58):
Yeah, they were saying that.

Speaker 2 (05:59):
But I mean, at the same time, you got to
understand the word hip hop was invented like when like
seventy seven. Yeah, you know, so, I mean, it wasn't
even called hip hop in seventy three. I mean, you know,
I mean, I think that's just a way to just
you know, really hate on Wood, to hate on Hollywood,
you know, but I mean still in all though, it's
like he was the first MC, FIRSTC. So I mean

(06:22):
when I say MC, I'm not talking about you know
what last Poets, Gil Scott Heron did that. I call
that spoken word. Okay, do you agree with me?

Speaker 6 (06:31):
Do you agreement?

Speaker 2 (06:32):
Agreement? When I say Gil Scott Hearing, last poets, Well,
they did the spoken words.

Speaker 7 (06:36):
Okay, I'm just always boiling upon each other this spoken word.

Speaker 2 (06:41):
Good workman on a second, pick me Martham did here
comes the judge. Now that would that's what I would
consider rapping, right, But that's in the studio over a band.
You see what I'm saying. What Hollywood was doing was
rhyming over a breakbeat, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 6 (06:57):
And that's what we do in hip hop.

Speaker 3 (06:58):
Right, and that's considered MC.

Speaker 2 (07:00):
Yeah okay, well, I mean you know, but also like
what what cochlar Rock was doing, like you know that
that's just doing the announcing stuff, you know, such.

Speaker 3 (07:08):
Such and such building Yeah yeah, okay, okay, that's.

Speaker 6 (07:11):
Them seeing as well. Okay, but I'm talking about rhyming.

Speaker 2 (07:14):
I'm talking about right now with Hollywood.

Speaker 1 (07:15):
I'm talking I don't want to go saying with my honey.

Speaker 2 (07:19):
Bun when merse around was actually a rhyme that that
he bit from Isaac Hayes song good Love, Oh Yeah,
and from the Black Moses album in nineteen seventy one.
Out of this, Bonafide was solidifoie, it's not forgot. I
know that the punchline was on Its not how good
I do it baby? Is how I do it good? Yeah,

(07:42):
bona Fide qualified knock on wood, it's not how good
I do with baby? Gus that why do with good? Yeah?

Speaker 6 (07:49):
That's from Isaac Hayes song.

Speaker 2 (07:51):
That's the first thing that he said over the mic
in nineteen seventy one.

Speaker 1 (07:54):
Was that really one of your highlights of seeing Snoop
bring out Hollywood?

Speaker 2 (07:58):
Yeah? Okay, I was, honestly because it's like, I feel
like Hollywood never gets the credit that he deserves. You know.
And as we celebrate fifty years of hip hop, we
got to acknowledge Cool Herk, we got to acknowledge Cokele Rock,
We got to acknowledge DJ Hollywood, Eddie Sheeba, we got
to acknowledge the disco twins from Queens. You know, we

(08:18):
really need to. We got to acknowledge, Shah Rock, Funky Four,
the Cold Crush Brothers, and most definitely Melly Mel, grand
Master Flash in the Furious five. I think Melli Yeah,
I think.

Speaker 5 (08:32):
We all have to understand that there's probably a lot
of people that we don't even know about him that
were a big part of the creation of hip hop.

Speaker 2 (08:38):
Well, it's like I always refer to when I talk
about Hollywood and Melly Mel. I call Hollywood Ray Charles,
and I called Melle Mel Sam Cook, you know, because
I think that what Hollywood created.

Speaker 6 (08:51):
Mel perfected Wow.

Speaker 2 (08:53):
From nineteen seventy seven all the way up till around
like twenty thirteen when the drill music and stuff to
come in. I think anybody that MC was following Mellie
Mel blueprint Wow. He was the first lyricist, and he's
the one responsible for making the MC important.

Speaker 6 (09:12):
Thank you, because.

Speaker 2 (09:14):
You know, when when when hip hop began with hert
it was about the DJ. You know, it was about her,
not the Herculeoids. It was about Flash, not the three
m c's. You know, it was always about the DJ
that was the most important person. Until Melly Mel started
spitting real lyrics and made people say, YEA, what the
hell did he just say hold on, yo?

Speaker 6 (09:35):
He just And that's when the MC became important.

Speaker 2 (09:38):
He's the one that built the platform that's created for
us because.

Speaker 1 (09:41):
If you look at Eric, Eric b name comes first.

Speaker 2 (09:45):
Yes, that was the thing, like that DJ Jasey, Jeffery
Fresh Prince.

Speaker 3 (09:50):
Let's make some noise for that.

Speaker 1 (09:55):
So the verses, how did you like doing the verses
as a person who's you know, you've actually survived it.

Speaker 6 (10:08):
I love doing it? Like that was my dream come true?

Speaker 1 (10:14):
Really?

Speaker 6 (10:15):
Yeah, man, I mean you know, like back when.

Speaker 2 (10:20):
Uh, when KRS came out with the bridges over, Yeah,
the way he timed it, the way he timed it
with down by Law. I'm like, this is a battle
of limc. He's a battle of lim ce that that
knows the art of combat. I would love to go

(10:41):
up against him. But that was my dude though, you
know what I'm saying. I mean, Carr is one, that's
that's him. Him and Miss Melody helped me move out
of my parents' crip, you know, like Chris is Chris.
Chris was my dude always, you know, yeah, but.

Speaker 1 (10:54):
I always would think I always immediately when I heard
that you were battling Chris. I immediately thought, what happened
with Kine and rock Him? I mean, obviously you and
Chris lived up to expectations, did everything, but everyone was
kind of leaning towards the Kine and rock Him. Has
that beening you like? Your whole like legacy, your whole

(11:16):
career is.

Speaker 2 (11:16):
Like I mean, people always wanted us to batter right
about it. I mean that's how this whole thing came
information Swiss called and said I need you and write
it to a versus Wow. And I said, well, look,
talk to the other guy if you can make it happen.

(11:38):
I'm in called him the other guy if you know,
I don't I don't mean that disrespectful way. I don't
mean any disrespectful way. Just like I said, talk to
the other guy and see if you can make it happen.
But if you can't, you want, Chris, would you entertain
me and KRS?

Speaker 3 (11:56):
So this was your idea?

Speaker 6 (11:58):
And he said, yeah, WHOA.

Speaker 2 (12:00):
So he went through it and tried to make it
happen and you know, couldn't.

Speaker 6 (12:04):
Lock it down.

Speaker 2 (12:06):
And then he, you know, he was like, yeah, I
don't think I'm okay.

Speaker 6 (12:11):
So then what about me and KRS?

Speaker 1 (12:12):
Wow?

Speaker 2 (12:13):
And then Swiss says, what about you in LL And
I said, you know, versus is really song for song,
not you know, battling rhymes.

Speaker 6 (12:25):
This song for songs. So Ela mop the goddamn floor
with me.

Speaker 2 (12:28):
Like his catalog is too big, you know, but for
the sake of hip hop crazy? Yeah, I was like, well,
for the sake of hip hop?

Speaker 6 (12:34):
Fuck? Did I do it? But I mean he's gonna
mop the floor with me?

Speaker 2 (12:37):
This dude. You know, his longevity is crazy. You know
his his albums.

Speaker 6 (12:41):
You know. I'm like, but I do it.

Speaker 2 (12:43):
And Swiss says, okay, but do you think the people
want to see you in l or you and rock Kim?
I said, me and rock Kim without a doubt. He's like,
and That's what I'm talking about, Kane. So I'm like,
all right. So we left it alone and then we
entertained it with Trella because this was before they emerged. Yes, right,
and Charlie Mack was trying to put that together and

(13:05):
Charlie Yeah, shout out to Matt.

Speaker 6 (13:08):
He couldn't make it happen.

Speaker 3 (13:10):
Well you and Rob?

Speaker 2 (13:11):
Yeah, with me and Rob, he tried to make it happen.
He couldn't make it happen either. And then here's the
funniest thing. They called me and said that this lockdown,
me and Rob gonna do it. It was supposed to
have been the night that Barrington Levy and super Cat
did it.

Speaker 6 (13:28):
Okay, that's in that we were supposed to do it.

Speaker 2 (13:30):
They called me and said it's lockdown, right, and I
said okay. They said, but Roz using Jesse Jeff, so
we want you to use Kick Capri. Okay, So I
called Kick Capri and said, yo, they want you to
do this versus thing. Caprice said, I don't want to,
you know you my man, Rob, my man. I'd rather

(13:51):
stay neutral. So I was like, I can respect that.
I called Charlie mac Back. I was like, yeah, Kick
Caprice said he'll do it. He's in. I mean, I
knew this ship wasn't gonna happen. You know what happened.
So I'm like, yeah, yeah, he's in. And then they
caught me the next day and said, year, now we

(14:13):
can't make the thing with him happened. You're still down
to do it with KRS. I was like yeah, yeah, absolutely.
It was like okay, then need to be you and
krest on that day and I was like, well, I
can't do it, you know, this weekend coming up, because
I'm laying in.

Speaker 6 (14:27):
Bed with COVID right now. Wow yeah, I'm like.

Speaker 2 (14:30):
So they switched it to the following weekend and they
got Baron to Levy to do it that week because
I was I was, I was sick. Wow. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (14:36):
If Biz would have been alive for that versus which song,
you would have broke him out as a surprise.

Speaker 6 (14:41):
Guest, Oh, just run with Biz, Just run with Biz?

Speaker 2 (14:44):
Okay, yeah, but I mean I would I know that
he would have wanted to at least do the hook
or just a friend, you know.

Speaker 6 (14:50):
But I was taking no crowd singer.

Speaker 1 (14:56):
You wrote justin friends?

Speaker 6 (14:58):
No no, no, no, no no no.

Speaker 3 (15:00):
Did you get to watch the dog? I did not
get He's in a right did you? Did you see, because.

Speaker 1 (15:10):
Like business, Mark was one of these people that I
all the think would be around hip hop forever. Did
you see like the demise of the breakdown of Biz
or no?

Speaker 6 (15:21):
No, yeah, I didn't see what point. It's like.

Speaker 2 (15:25):
Biz had lost a lot of weight from a diet
and he was looking good, right, feeling good, looking, energetic,
you know. But but from my understanding, because of him
being so in shape he wasn't taking his diabetes medicine,
you know.

Speaker 1 (15:45):
Yeah, yeah, man, God bless man, this diabetes thing is
running rapping in our neighborhood.

Speaker 2 (15:50):
Man. Yeah, man, I'm.

Speaker 1 (15:51):
Drinking motherfucker ghost race. Kill a coffee? What is this called?

Speaker 6 (15:54):
Kill coffee?

Speaker 1 (15:55):
Killer coffie? Was drinking coast face? Is it a starbus? Couples?
Had no cups in my grip? So I just did that, you.

Speaker 2 (16:01):
Know what I mean?

Speaker 3 (16:01):
Kill a gup goddamn coffee?

Speaker 5 (16:03):
What was the track? I watched the document of the
BIZ one? What was the track that he asked you
to write and you said no f first and then
after that you learned your lesson?

Speaker 6 (16:10):
Just a frind It was just a friend, Yeah yeah,
just a wrint.

Speaker 2 (16:15):
I tell you one.

Speaker 1 (16:16):
Okay, okay, So how does this happen this this session?

Speaker 6 (16:22):
No, Marty Moore on dis session had nothing to do.

Speaker 3 (16:25):
He just asked him.

Speaker 6 (16:26):
He just went, well, it wasn't Bizz that asked me.

Speaker 2 (16:30):
It was it was actually cool v okay that asked me,
and me and Biz was was beefing with each other
at the time. Wow.

Speaker 3 (16:38):
It doesn't say that in the documentary though.

Speaker 6 (16:40):
Ye yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (16:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (16:42):
We were like, well I was mad at him.

Speaker 3 (16:43):
See what you got mad that you didn't do it?

Speaker 2 (16:45):
That's oh yeah, yeah, absolutely, Doc, absolutely, but I mean
but now, I honestly it was for me being mad
upset with him because we had like there was a
lawsuit going on and Biz dropped out of it, and
I was upset about that. When V asked me to
write it, I was like, nah, but damn, I wish
I would have though.

Speaker 3 (17:06):
That was big record.

Speaker 5 (17:07):
Yeah, oh yeahh and nobody believed at first when he
was talking about the record, how it was going to be,
he was going to sing on.

Speaker 2 (17:13):
It, You're The craziest thing is like the day that
Biz found the beat, it's the same day that he
gave me the beat for at No. Half Stepping. I
went to Cool V Crib and half Step yeah set
up absolute to Cool V. Yeah. I went to COOLV
Crib and Bizz had a bag of records still, so
I'm going. I'm like, he's like some records Biz board,

(17:35):
I'm going through them playing, I'm playing. Then I heard
the emotions blind owy. I'm like, oh, this is sick.
So V looped it up in the mixer, you know,
sample in the mixer. He looped up there and I
started writing to it. But it's Biz. Next thing, you know,
Biz calls the crib.

Speaker 3 (17:50):
Ain't no half stepping.

Speaker 2 (17:51):
I'm I'm writing.

Speaker 6 (17:53):
Yeah, I'm not.

Speaker 2 (17:55):
I guess I was writing the rhymes I can't remember,
but I'm writing to it. Then BIZ called a crib.
I founded. I found it. I finally found it you
talking about. He was like, the big I got it.
You know, you got what I need, Like he found
Freddy Scott, you got what I need. And he was like,

(18:19):
you know, like, yeah, I'm telling you this ship gonna
go platinum.

Speaker 6 (18:22):
I guarantee you, right.

Speaker 2 (18:23):
And I'm like, so, well, since you're so happy about that,
you probably don't really care about this Blind Alley record,
right because that was his record, his record. Yeah, you
probably don't care about this blind either. You can have
that ship, my man. Yeah that.

Speaker 1 (18:48):
Oh my god, my god, oh my god, holy moly,
walcome moly, man, you a motherfucker legend. Oh my brother.
I had so much fun going through your de soccra
fhe man. Go, but let's talk about the documentary, man,
this documentary.

Speaker 3 (19:06):
I love you getting your.

Speaker 1 (19:07):
Flowers, man, I love something.

Speaker 3 (19:09):
He shared the clip.

Speaker 1 (19:10):
Yes, I love you giving your flowers man, because you
want of the smoothest people on earth. Let's make some
noise and you always cool, calm and collective. But you
know hip hop owes you you know what I mean? Uh?
We all o you you know what I'm saying, Like
what you have brung to the game, Like I said,

(19:32):
even down from the flattops to the to the to
the the three because my eyebrows.

Speaker 3 (19:36):
Are sucked up right now.

Speaker 2 (19:37):
Game.

Speaker 1 (19:38):
You know what I'm saying. Because I was like this,
You know what I'm saying. Did you know how influential
you was? Was this something that you thought out or
this was just you was being who exactly who you are.

Speaker 2 (19:47):
I was just being me, but I mean, you know,
like uh just looking around seeing what was going on.
I was like wow, you know okay, but I mean
I felt like it was a beautiful thing because it's
like I wasn't influencing anybody, do nothing negative? Right, you know?
So right?

Speaker 3 (20:03):
And it was scoop really a barbera yeah?

Speaker 2 (20:07):
Really? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (20:08):
How does how does this work?

Speaker 2 (20:09):
You?

Speaker 1 (20:09):
You told him you put your clubs down and start dancing?

Speaker 3 (20:13):
How does this work?

Speaker 2 (20:14):
Nah? There was a club called Latin Quarters. You can
not on ninety sixth Street. That was the older school one. Yeah,
like you know, I would go there with Biz and
whatnot to hang out in the mid eighties and school
was with this dance group called the IOU Dances, and
they would dance before the artists performed. They would do

(20:36):
a dance ro team before the artists come on, sage
you perform, and you know sometimes by the bar me
school and ladies that manages Mop. Yeah, he was with
IOU as well. So three of us we were by
the bar, just you know, having drinks and I was like, yeah,
you know, Biz getting me a record deal when I
come out, Man, I.

Speaker 6 (20:54):
Love for you to dance for me.

Speaker 2 (20:56):
And then when I finally made a record, I went
back to school and was like yo, you ready, wow,
And yeah that's how we made it happen.

Speaker 1 (21:01):
And so so BIZ was technically on before y'all.

Speaker 5 (21:04):
Yeah, yeah, I'm telling you watched this dark We don't
know this history like not to make people know how
influential and how much BIZ had.

Speaker 3 (21:13):
To do with a lot of things.

Speaker 1 (21:14):
Why did you and Biz link up?

Speaker 2 (21:16):
There was this kid from Long Island that used to
always tell me about this dude Bis Marcky. He knew
why there's for some reason, I think now the dude
was from Central Island. He's from Central Island, dude named Wayne.
He was dating my cousin and he used to always
tell me about biz Marcky. And finally one day he like, Yo,
my man, biz Markey, I'll tell you about here. And
now we squirrelled rat more. Right now, I'll be beatbox

(21:38):
now he was doing the beat for numbers. Wow, I'm
like here over there right now. I'm like, all right,
take me over there and let me meet him. So
we get in the mall. We're walking up to him.
I'm like, all right, so listen, I'm asking your man
for a battle. And after I bust his ass, I
don't want to hear about this, you know, yeah, I'll
squid mall. So I asked Biz for a battle. We battled,

(22:01):
and after the battle, he was like, Yo, you dope man,
You dope man. He said, Yo, I'll be doing a
lot of shows and like all them Bronx Long Island.
You should get down with me, man, like we can
make some money, and I guarantee you one day I'm
gonna get you a record deal.

Speaker 1 (22:17):
Ruse because back then, like back then, like a lot
of people, we didn't have Twitter, like you know what
I mean, Like they didn't have Twitter. So how did
you hear about Biz back then?

Speaker 2 (22:27):
Like? Okay, he was always telling me about this dude,
biz Markie, who said this dude named Wayne.

Speaker 1 (22:35):
From s right.

Speaker 2 (22:35):
Okay, Well, he was always telling me about this dude
biz Markie, like you know, like I could have just
battled somebody, you know, you know, tore them out the frame, yo,
But you got to hear my man Biz, So you know,
I was sick ahead about this dude man, you know.
But then you know, we finally got the meet. We battled,
and after the battle we became friends. He asked me

(22:58):
to get down with him, and now I was doing
something never did because I mean I would go to
block parties and battle people on the mic. And you
were right in these rhymes. This wasn't coming off freestyle,
wasn't no. I wasn't doing off the dome. These was
written freestyle. I was just off the I mean, I
don't do that. I don't really do it off the
dome thing, only like in battles, Like if I see
some raggedy shit, you got on. You know, I'll come
up with something, you know, but everyone but I mean,

(23:25):
but you know, but you know it's really you know,
written freestyles. But it was like we went at it
and whatnot, and you know, he was like, yo, you dope,
and you know he wanted me to get down with him.
But now I'm doing something I've never done before because
I had, you know, never performed, only battled. Now I'm
on stage doing shows for these dudes, Mike and Dave
and all of them wrongs Long Island. You know, he

(23:47):
got me actually performing on stage. I never did nothing
like that before.

Speaker 1 (23:50):
Damn, damn, that's crazy, man. Let's play.

Speaker 5 (23:56):
And then and I don't want to get the whole
doc because I think people need to watch the documentaries.
You watch, I'm assuming so you feel it's fully accurate
the way everything's.

Speaker 2 (24:03):
Depicted, right, Yeah, from from what I saw, Yeah.

Speaker 5 (24:06):
The part about you getting in with Marley by coming
and and then he didn't want to open the door
for you.

Speaker 2 (24:13):
Yeah, what happened was, uh, this spent the night at
my crib and then that morning we went to record
store on No Ocean Avenue and he bought the African
Life he had center be the boom Bats. He bought
that and he was like, uh, yo, come ride with

(24:35):
me into the city. I got to get to see
a record by the Steve Miller band. He was going
to rock, rock and soul, No downtown, down stairs records, downstairs,
You're going to downstairs. And I'm like, yo, I got
a test today, man, I can't skip school. So I
went to school. When I took my test, I left
like half day and went straight to Marley Crib when
I got there. No, no, no, this was in the story. Okay,

(24:59):
I wasn't got so I went down to Queensbridge days
you know. No, I'm just saying I was before my
time and cut it out, man. But yeah, I went
to Marley Crib and you know, he like opened the
door with the chain on and it's like, you know,
what's up. I'm like, you know, Kane b friend, you know.

(25:23):
But he was talking to me like he didn't know me,
you know, and I'm like, uh, you know I was here.
He's like, bis ain't here. I was like, well, you know,
I took the train all the way from Brooklyn. He
told me to meet her because he told me doing
nobody beats the Biz song b is ain't here money.
I don't know what to tell you. I was like,
all right, no doubt. I was like, well, here these
are the rhymes he's supposed to say today. Just give
him to him. And he was like you you you right,

(25:46):
bi ship. I was like, I wrote that, you know.
He was like I go and I said a little
bit and then nobody beats the biz thing. He was like,
you rhyme too. I was like yeah, he said, let
me hear something. Then I spent a rhyme and he
took the chain off. I was like, yo, come in here,
would work on problem.

Speaker 3 (26:05):
That's amazing, Holy shit.

Speaker 2 (26:08):
Because at that time, Marlly was like the go to producer. Correct, Yeah,
he was getting to be that. Like Marley was not
only to go to producer. Marlly was the dude that
reshaped hip hop in the mid to late eighties because
when hip hop became a music genre, what was happening

(26:31):
under the Sylvia Robinson umbrella was hip hop artists going
in the studio recording with bands.

Speaker 6 (26:39):
Yeah you should know your ship.

Speaker 1 (26:41):
Your sugar.

Speaker 2 (26:41):
Yeah yeah.

Speaker 1 (26:42):
I had to have to have to get back yeah yeah, yeah,
I was.

Speaker 2 (26:46):
She was like she was taking nick flashing them Funky Four,
Treacherous three. They're going and recording with bands they're not
doing with cool Heirk created. You know what I said, No, no, no,
not programming. I mean they're not doing it to a
break beat. You know, they're rhyming to a band. Then
the run DMC era comes when that's when they start
doing the programming beats with Larry Smith, Rick Rubin and

(27:08):
them casts.

Speaker 6 (27:09):
You know, Davy DMX.

Speaker 2 (27:11):
You know they're using Len drums, DMX drum machines and
keyboards and sim sim sounds. You know, Marley is the
one that you know took the sp and brought back
what Hirk was doing. You're rhyming over the break beat.
It's just that a DJ not playing it, a producers sampling.

Speaker 4 (27:29):
Itine you're saying it, Yeah, it's the actual break beat
that Curtis Blast Damn Bodder and.

Speaker 2 (27:38):
All these casts was was cutting up. It's the actual
break beat and Marlly is sampling it. So you're doing
exactly what he was doing. You're doing exactly what hip
hop was made, how it was bringing those breaks and
Mary Mary the dude that brought it back, so you know, yeah,
he is definitely uh in a mad in this here culture,

(28:02):
you know, because of what he did with sampling.

Speaker 3 (28:05):
Yeah, so was was it back then?

Speaker 1 (28:14):
Because like nowadays, when people sample music, they actually, uh
most of the time, a lot of the times, it's
one hundred percent of these these publishers claimed the rights.
Was it like that back then when you were sampling
his music? Was it?

Speaker 2 (28:30):
The first time I had a problem with it was
the very when I when I went to Marley Crib
that day.

Speaker 6 (28:36):
Huh, nobody be abiz.

Speaker 2 (28:41):
He made a beat off of Staple Singers I'll Take
You Here, And that's when I recorded the song I'll
Take You Here.

Speaker 6 (28:47):
It's on my first album.

Speaker 2 (28:49):
But uh, fly Tie wanted to put it out and
Prints owned the Staples Singers publishing and he wasn't digging
hip hoped in so he wouldn't clear it. Prince Prince
ain't clear ship well, I mean in the beginning. He
changed his mind later on before.

Speaker 3 (29:07):
The Chapster As was out. Yes, lose enough after.

Speaker 2 (29:15):
That, But I mean, in all, honestly, I'm glad because
I think that had I'll Take You There came out
as a cane debut, I never would have been successful.

Speaker 1 (29:23):
Was he talking about Squid Moore on that record as well.

Speaker 2 (29:25):
No, no, no, I'll take you there is talking about going
into an imagine every place where everything is beautiful, and
you know it's like, you know, you get a pass
on that one because that was an album cut.

Speaker 1 (29:38):
You should know we're gonna be here. All I remember
I remember hearing alb Square Moore and this is this
is this's a's a website right now that's dedicated to
all memories of Alby Square More. And I remember me
me being from Queen's and there was some fla shit

(29:59):
going on in Brooke. It was called Dental Gold and
it was the only place in like New York City
that had it. And it was well, y'all would call
it grills in the side, so it was frames, it
was frames, and they went to Ivy Square. He had
to get it. Only an IVY script one was dental Gold.
And what I try to tell you is it looked

(30:20):
like it came from the dentist, Like this wasn't like caps.
This was like but it was so flopped. But to
get the IV squib more, you gotta go to a
goddamn danger zone.

Speaker 2 (30:29):
Like oh yeah, yeah, shout out the whole dog tig
slop Miami, you know, big Shop, Big Neil. Yeah, into
the record, Yeah yeah yeah, all them Brooklyn Grimys dad,
you know yeah yeah, make you believe we can leave
them more naked. Man, you went back home sneakless, colds

(30:51):
all that ship.

Speaker 1 (30:52):
Your ship was crazy, Like do you recognize Brooklyn?

Speaker 2 (30:55):
Still it's completely different, completely completely different. Like I went
back to my old block to show my son I got.
I have a ten year old when he was almost younger.
I took him to my old block because there's like
a big mural of me on the water, and I
was showing you this is the building I was raised in,
you know right there, you know, see a second floor
right here. I was like, yeah, I used to come

(31:16):
down here and do the data. While I'm telling him
the story, white lady comes out of the building with
a little ass dog and the dog runs up my
leg and I'm like, but this didn't happen. He's like,
this is na I it was just bug. You know.

Speaker 6 (31:34):
I'm telling him how I grew up, you know, how
good it.

Speaker 2 (31:37):
Was, And then all of a sudden, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah,
so it's a lot different now. It's at no.

Speaker 1 (31:43):
I mean, do you think it changed for the better.
I think it changed for the better.

Speaker 2 (31:48):
I think that it changed for the better. But I
think that a lot of the history was erased. You know,
I think that a lot of history was erased as
far as.

Speaker 3 (32:00):
Hip hop as well.

Speaker 6 (32:02):
Well, I thought you were talking about the neighborhood.

Speaker 3 (32:04):
Yeah, be a period, Yeah, I mean, does that involve
hip hop?

Speaker 2 (32:07):
I mean, you know, it's like, I can't take him
and say this the movie theater that I used to
go in and have to tuck my pants and my
socks because rats be running across the floor, and I
don't want none to run up my pants.

Speaker 6 (32:21):
Like that's gone, you know what I'm saying. I can't.

Speaker 2 (32:23):
I can't say, you know, just to Roy Rogers, you know,
with cats got stuck up at because you could you
could rob more Forlton Street and cut.

Speaker 6 (32:31):
Through and come out on flat Bush after.

Speaker 2 (32:33):
I can't. I can't show him none of that, Stuffy.
It's all gone, like all those memories is gone. I'm shure,
and your neighborhood is yeah, no, I.

Speaker 3 (32:41):
Mean all over all over.

Speaker 1 (32:42):
But I just never thought, you know what was shocking
to me. I thought the last two barrels that they
would actually fix up what's Brooklyn and the Bronx and
then when the when the what was it the nets?

Speaker 3 (32:54):
As soon as the.

Speaker 1 (32:55):
Nets kind of came, I believe it's the Barclays, right
as soon as the kind of came to the Barclays,
seeing that they put the whole fools around, and I
was like, once they put a whole fool white people coming,
I was like, yeah, you know what I'm saying. So
I was just like I didn't think, but now, could
you not? I went to Dumbo to the Soho House, and
I kid you not, because it's coming right off the

(33:16):
Brooklyn Bridge, you know, like coming from like you know,
the Manhattan side. And I used to I used to
go there and like used to know, like as soon
as you got over that bridge, you're in Brooklyn.

Speaker 3 (33:26):
It's not Manhattan no more.

Speaker 1 (33:28):
And now it's like you go over there and you're like,
I'm still mad, like because you like, am I still bad?

Speaker 3 (33:35):
They puting the trick over me.

Speaker 6 (33:37):
Like the little boats and ship.

Speaker 1 (33:39):
It's crazy, but I understood. And and how about the community,
because I remember that was a big thing about being
in Brooklyn, like was it was. It was a lot
of community, and you think that's gone because of the
whole hools.

Speaker 6 (33:55):
When you say community, what do you mean, like.

Speaker 1 (33:57):
You know, like the project people used to be there
together like you, I mean like as opposed to that
now it's.

Speaker 6 (34:02):
Like, nah, I think that's because I mean.

Speaker 2 (34:08):
Just uh during the Rock the Bells thing, because I
have Rock to Bells and I had uh Lincoln Center,
you know, all in New York, but pretty much a
week apart. So I was like, well, I'm just gonna
stay in New York, good time. And I got an
Airbnb and Bushwick Wow. And when I arrived at the Airbnb,
Bushwick made it known like not nigga, you're still in

(34:30):
the hush, don't don't get it twisted.

Speaker 8 (34:32):
Perto Ricans was the Puerto Ricans. Yeah, so oh man, yo.

Speaker 1 (34:43):
I mean.

Speaker 3 (34:45):
I mean hip hop?

Speaker 1 (34:46):
Man, did you have a like I noticed a cliche
type of question, but do you ever think that hip
hop will make it this far?

Speaker 6 (34:50):
Absolutely?

Speaker 2 (34:51):
You absolutely, absolutely, because you got to you got to understand.
I mean, like like I love psychedelic rock, right like
Jimmy Hendrix, Janice Chopplin, I love that type of stuff,
you know, so as a rock fan to hear like
you know, like how it was about Chuck Berry doing

(35:12):
the dunk walk across stage, or Elvis presently gyrating his hips.
How offensive that was to clean cut America. And they
said that, you know, it's raunchy music. It's not gonna last.
It's just a fad. And this is what they said
about rock and roll. But it was so rebellious for
the young counter, for the youth to like really show

(35:33):
out and like and like, now you've got Alan Freed
taking it in gymnasiums because theaters don't want it, so
he taking it in gymnasiums, and the young cast is
coming out, you know, a by the thousands, the pack
of gymnasium just to hear rock and roll.

Speaker 6 (35:47):
Right, you know, this is what's going on.

Speaker 2 (35:49):
Then all of a sudden, with the war start, you
got rock artists making anti war songs, so they're using
their voice, you know, to speak against war. Hip hop
was following the same thing, you know what I'm saying.
So when they said that it's just a fair it
ain't real music, I knew. I'm like, it's gonna be
just as big or even bigger than rock and roll.

Speaker 1 (36:12):
You know what's so beautiful about what's going on right now?
Is you see Yankee Stadium sold out, You see Nives
and Wu Tang sold out, you see fifty cent and
Busting Robs sold out, you see all of you see
Rock the Bells sold out, You see all of these
festivals with these older people that sold out. An elder
statesman rather tional art. And I've been saying this for

(36:35):
a long time. This is the reason why we invented
drink chances, because we wanted to give our elder statesms,
people that have been around, you know, seasons, they flowers.

Speaker 3 (36:44):
And then when you see this, it's like damn.

Speaker 1 (36:46):
When you like I said this the other day, Like
when you want someone to cook Thanksgiving dinner, you don't
want that eighteen year old girl that just you just met.
You don't want that twenty two year old girl. She
don't know how to smothered the chickens. She don't know
how to make the candy ams bounce the way they're
supposed to be shaking. She don't know how to do
the stuffing.

Speaker 3 (37:07):
She don't know how to cook corn bread. And heart
of this cook corn bread. You gotta have experience.

Speaker 1 (37:14):
So when they come to days Giving dinner, you don't
want that new young hobouy no.

Speaker 6 (37:19):
I agree.

Speaker 7 (37:20):
You want Papa helping us, you understand, and that's what
life is.

Speaker 1 (37:29):
Your young women, snappists, you'll be over here talk about
the O G no motherfucker.

Speaker 3 (37:34):
With seasoned what seasons?

Speaker 1 (37:37):
Then we're out here, man looking looking like he ready
to pip right now. I love when Bussey said that,
he said, we gotta look the part, man. And that's
one thing about you. Man. You've been sharp since the eighties.
You ain't never had a day off.

Speaker 2 (37:54):
Man, appreciate you come. I will say this though, man,
when it comes to people like myself and even your errors,
you know, I mean, I feel like we're cemented and
we have a solid fan base that's going to love
and respect us like you know Charlie Wilson fans, you know,

(38:16):
Ronald Eisley fans. But we do need to connect with
the youth so that they can gain state power and
they learn how to be artists. I don't think that
we should leave them alone or look at it in
a way of like, ha, I'm packing shows you not.
I think that we need to work with them, you

(38:36):
know what I'm saying, and try to help them because
it's like we're not gonna be here forever. Our music will,
but we not. So when we're gone, what's going to
be left. If they don't know what they're doing. They
can evaporate hip hop canny vaporate. So we got to
give them the Jews. We got to teach them and
educate them and try to uplift them. And I think

(38:56):
that that's something important for us to do as the
you know, the older generation, you know, to teach the
youth like, yo, this is how you perform. You know,
you don't need the vocals playing to an instrumental. You
know what I'm saying. Don't just stand there once by
their stage left and stage right, it's even front of
the stage, shake a motherfucker hand when you're looking at
you and stuff like that. You know, we have to
give them game, you know, we have. We need to

(39:17):
do that because they are the future. But they're not
going to be the future much longer. If if if
they can't sell our shows or sell streams up whatever.

Speaker 5 (39:27):
You know, you got to make sure the history continues
to be told so it's not lost.

Speaker 1 (39:31):
I mean a lot of them know better e FM,
because you know why they know better. They wear Jordan's
They don't want Kyrie. I heard you say, but that's
not true. That is true, that's not that's not knowing
history because you wear no no. What I'm trying to
say is when you sit down, they'll talk. They'll sit
there and talk about a Michael Jordan game. You are
wearing these Jordan's because Jordan's scored this amount. So if
you know that amount, why don't you know about when

(39:52):
Biggie Small's did this one about when.

Speaker 3 (39:54):
Kid doesn't know who cool work is. Right, that's what
they wear.

Speaker 6 (39:58):
In the Jordan.

Speaker 3 (39:59):
That might not be their fault, it's our fault in
the city generation. I believe that there was a fine time.
Like I didn't grow up on corel work. I was
too young.

Speaker 5 (40:07):
There was the music that I was listening to that
was telling you, and I was like, hold up a second,
I need to know this these people that I'm listening to.

Speaker 1 (40:13):
But you being in DJs, but you'll be in a
DJ and you being loyal to the culture, you win
and you search schoolhurd correct.

Speaker 3 (40:19):
Absolutely, Yeah, that's that's that's what we before the inn.
At times I was literally digging in the.

Speaker 2 (40:23):
That's the problem though, you know what I'm saying nobody,
like like, nobody searches anything no more. Nobody studies nothing
no more. They just google shit, you know.

Speaker 3 (40:31):
But we're not giving reasons either.

Speaker 5 (40:33):
I feel like like now hip hop fifty Like you said,
the positive side is younger younger kids might be like.

Speaker 3 (40:38):
Yo, this is wild. Look at these packed stadiums. What
is this all about?

Speaker 5 (40:42):
And they might start to gravitate to certain artists they
wouldn't have normally gravitate it to, and then learn about
the history indirectly, like a drink champs. They might learn
indirectly by the entertainment of it, say oh, these people
are wilding out, and then oh, wait, I'm learning something now.

Speaker 6 (40:57):
I let me tell you something.

Speaker 2 (40:58):
Man, the BET Awards, I was sitting in my seat,
the recent one one to just passed. I was sitting
in my seat patiently waiting to see all the young
cats perform. I wanted to see what type of energy
they bring in. And then especially since you know, you
have people like myself, m see like Red Man, Bust
Uncle Luke. You know what well, I mean, Buster's still

(41:20):
doing his thing. You know what I'm saying, He's still going.
But I mean, but you know, you you got all
these I mean, it's like for them to look at
and see. Okay, okay, right, So I wanted to see
what they were going to do on stage, and the
Migos and Lola Brook they did not let me down. Wow.
I thought that Lola and the Migos gave amazing performances.

Speaker 6 (41:43):
That's the type of ship I like to see.

Speaker 1 (41:44):
And it was the first time seeing the Migos together
in a long time.

Speaker 6 (41:47):
Yeah yeah, yeah exactly.

Speaker 2 (41:50):
But with even with that being a factor when it's
time to get it on, yeah, yeah, man, it looked
beautiful and like to see lower Brook like, you know,
actually really spitting and then jumping back and dancing with
her dances and ship.

Speaker 3 (42:07):
She was not playing with it.

Speaker 6 (42:08):
Yeah yeah, she.

Speaker 3 (42:11):
Was go ahead.

Speaker 1 (42:15):
Brooklyn energy right from Brooklyn.

Speaker 6 (42:16):
Right.

Speaker 1 (42:19):
Yeah, you could never take a Brooklyn dude out of
be in Brooklyn.

Speaker 6 (42:26):
Man.

Speaker 1 (42:28):
Specialist, But let's let's smoke about that for a second,
because special gave us a different perspective on it. He
was like that he felt like that I dont know,
we spoke about it earlier, but he felt like that
the hip hop fifty is more for corporations, it's not
really for us. And I disagree, but I let him vent.

(42:51):
Like you just said you said earlier. He was like,
as long as you know the artist is getting paid
and this is something that we want to do. I
don't think that Yankee Stadium was commercialized. I think Yanks
it was still in.

Speaker 2 (43:01):
But it was because I mean, his his house, Okay,
Mally mal cold Crush, all the pioneers, right, they went
on like twelfth Noon. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (43:17):
I was thinking they should have been the headliners.

Speaker 6 (43:19):
All no, no, no, no, no, not the headline.

Speaker 2 (43:22):
Yeah, they should have like fit them in like in between,
like you know, oh what kind.

Speaker 1 (43:26):
Of look at the flyer wrong? When they were at
the bottom, I was looking at it as if it
was the top.

Speaker 6 (43:30):
Of the black you know, the pie.

Speaker 2 (43:31):
And then it's like you say, I understand that they
don't have hit records, and the ones that did have
hit records in the early eighties, a younger generation are
not aware of that. I get that. Still, in all,
if we really celebrating hip fifty years of hip hop, right,
then respect those that created the platform for it to

(43:54):
get here, right, you know, I mean, you know Russell Simmons,
Tyrone Williams, are Andre Harel, they did a great job.
You know, jay Z, Shook, Knight, Puffy, so many of
us did a great job. You know what I'm saying
as keeping it going and all that there. But I
do respect those that helped create this platform, you know,

(44:15):
sugar Hill Gang, Grand Master Flash, in the Furious Five,
Cold Cush Brothers, make it where they can be seen.
That's why that meant so much to me. For Snoop
to bring out Hollywood, that meant the world.

Speaker 1 (44:27):
I believe that was Russell Simmons pulling those strings too.

Speaker 2 (44:29):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (44:31):
Oh man, and let me so, let me ask you
why we're on this subject, and especially while we're in
the South, A lot of people like one of the
first things that we heard, especially living in Miami, was
Uncle LUTH's voice. Uncle Luke was like, he felt like,
I don't I don't believe he said the South. I
believe he said Florida. He said Florida. But there's a

(44:52):
different regions like the West. I'm here and there because
now I'm seeing Jermaine Duprie saying the same thing, and
it bugged me out a little bit because I seen
Jermaine Duprie happy backstage like he was. He was back there,
he was filming himself, and then when he went back
home to Atlanta, he was He's basically like, uh, you know,
that was a New York thing, and New York doesn't
really recognize Atlanta. That's what Jabani the preset, and then

(45:15):
Luke pretty much said the same thing, but he uh,
I did de fight it with Florida.

Speaker 2 (45:20):
Correct.

Speaker 1 (45:21):
When you hear things like that, what do you think?

Speaker 3 (45:23):
What does come.

Speaker 6 (45:25):
Like that? Don't it identify?

Speaker 2 (45:28):
This sound?

Speaker 5 (45:29):
Wasn't enough representation of the whole country in terms of well,
like I mean the regions.

Speaker 2 (45:34):
Yeah, I mean it probably wasn't. I mean, it's too
many goddamn artists, man, you know, for one night, you
know what I mean, it's too many artists, man.

Speaker 6 (45:42):
I mean it probably wasn't.

Speaker 2 (45:44):
But I mean, to me, that's only reason enough to
do a hip hop fiftyth in Atlanta, you know, yeahs right, Yeah,
you get on outcast together, you know the brat you know, so,
I mean, you know, even bring out what's what's my
man name? I think he was like the first Southern

(46:05):
was Sha.

Speaker 3 (46:05):
D y D.

Speaker 2 (46:08):
Yeah. Yeah, Uncle Luke called me bring them all out,
se Lo Green, Goodie, Marb you know, like boys with
your crew. Yeah, yeah, bring them out, Daddy, Trina, bring
them all out, you know.

Speaker 1 (46:19):
Because Trina was on the show, and so it was
Florider and t I Florid was on. Yeah, I seemed
Publar getting me bring out floor Rider. Really yeah, it
was something. I don't know if he's Yankee Stadium.

Speaker 2 (46:32):
But it was.

Speaker 1 (46:32):
He was there that during that fifty about week.

Speaker 2 (46:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (46:35):
See with this, with with what m seeing became.

Speaker 2 (46:40):
Thanks to Mellie mel was a way of ghetto expression, right,
and there's more ghettos than New York. You know when
we heard straight out of Compton and what n w
A was talking about, you know, we got an expanse
of what the streets was like in l A. You know,

(47:06):
when the Ghetto Boys came out, we had a chance
to experience what the streets was like Houston and what
do you call that is Southwest.

Speaker 3 (47:15):
In the wars right in the wards.

Speaker 2 (47:17):
Yeah yeah, I mean like the region is that those
that would that be considered Southwest, Now this is the
South is so okay, but yeah, you got to experience that,
you know, I mean even even with eminem because not
only well oh yeah, not only is that Detroit hood,

(47:42):
but it's not our hood.

Speaker 6 (47:45):
Yeah, no, he talking trailer parks.

Speaker 2 (47:48):
I'm saying, so you you get to hear by the
white hood. You know what I'm saying. I mean, I'm
other than Roseanne. I don't know nothing about no trailer parks.

Speaker 6 (47:57):

Speaker 2 (47:58):
Eminem gave gave us like what it was like in
his hood growing up. You know what I'm saying. So
it's like it's the way what ghetto expression can be. Man.
It's beautiful man, you know so, I mean it's it's
out there in all types of different regions man. You know. So,
I mean, you don't have to just end the Yankee Stadium,
but you're still young and shit. Throw something in Atlanta,
throw something in Detroit, throw something in la you know.

Speaker 1 (48:19):
That was one of the things that I noticed about
your documentary, sorry bounced around, was that you had Eminem
in the documentary. For those that haven't seen the trailer yet,
and you know, this is one of them unicorn guys, right,
this is a guy like no one could get Eminem, right.
Was it hard for you to reach Eminem or this
was something that you know, because I know he's a
real hip hop fan.

Speaker 2 (48:39):
So showed love. When we reached out he said yeah, wow,
when well, no, let me not say that, but but
he showed love. He showed love and he made it
will let me let me, let me see, let me
word it this way. He made it where we wouldn't

(49:01):
have no problems, and you know it was okay with
you know, using his likeness in order, Like he showed
love and showed up with a with a Big Daddy
Gang show on to do the interview.

Speaker 1 (49:11):
Wow, goddamn.

Speaker 2 (49:12):
And the craziest thing is he told me stuff about
myself that I never even thought about, you know, because
I mean you as an MC, you're writing, yes, but
it's like you're not sitting there thinking like you know,
I gotta add something that does this, I gotta add something.
You just writing what comes to mind. So that's what

(49:34):
I'm doing. And he pointed out stuff that I did,
and I'm sitting there listening and talking and when I'm
the whole time looking at him, but in my mind,
I'm like, real, I did that. Now I'm sitting there
and then like you know, we finished, I had to
like go back and listen to records from the mid
eighties early eighties, like now they had to be someone
that did this before me, Like damn, Like I never

(49:55):
thought about that. Like, yeah, he said some deep stuff, man,
he said some real deep stuff. He's a suitor of
the game for sure.

Speaker 3 (50:01):
I love that fact.

Speaker 1 (50:02):
I love the fact that when it comes to the ogs,
like he always you know what I mean. I mean,
didn't he accept the award.

Speaker 3 (50:08):
And he listed off, Yeah, mad people almost, But him.

Speaker 1 (50:12):
And Melly Mail were at it, like you can't call
Mellie mill as they relax.

Speaker 2 (50:19):
Me and Mel.

Speaker 6 (50:20):
Me and Mel actually did talk. See.

Speaker 2 (50:24):
The thing that a lot of people don't understand is like,
I have a perspective on hip hop because of the
way I understood it first time I heard hip hop
was seventy seven. I have a perspective, you know, from
what I learned from that point. Whenever it was that

(50:44):
you heard it, whenever it was that you heard it.
His perspectives that we all have, right, Melly Mel has
a perspective from the origin. Okay, and a lot of
those cats feel that when it went to record, hip
hop was ruined at that point. The purest form of

(51:05):
hip hop was ruined as soon as it went to record,
When it became an official music genre.

Speaker 3 (51:11):
Became a business. Yeah, okay, yeah, that gang. I would
assume that was the first time they felt that way.

Speaker 2 (51:19):
It's possible, but I mean it's like, well, I would
assume maybe a year so later, because it's like now
you're seeing the effects. You're seeing what's happening to what
y'all created and what y'all been doing. Now it's going
a different direction and how it's being driven. So it's
like you have to understand his bitterness, you know, because
it's it's not about hate.

Speaker 6 (51:41):
It's about, you know, what happened.

Speaker 3 (51:43):
To his baby, right, you can't dismiss that.

Speaker 2 (51:46):
You know her cast as well, you know a lot
of them, you know, so it's what happened to their baby,
you know. So I mean it's like I respect their anger,
but at the same time, you know, I try to,
you know, in a you know, diplomatic wage, just build
with the brother and say listen, man, it ain't work,
you know, just you know, you know.

Speaker 1 (52:06):
Yeah, because at one point I felt like Melly Mill
had a problem with everybody he does.

Speaker 2 (52:11):
Mel cursed my ass out one night, Bell's jumped up
over me, kicked the fucking Ottoman. Was like motherfucker. You
wasn't there. He was a baby when it ship started.
You wasn't he was. I ain't gonna bring it up, man.

Speaker 1 (52:34):
But so it's not just a couple of us, it's everyone.

Speaker 2 (52:38):
Yeah. Yeah, if you relax, be like, all right, yeah,
I mean, that's just mal, that's just mel Man. I mean,
but I mean it's like, the bottom line is just man,
you know, rather he right or wrong. I feel like myself, you, Eminem,
and so many others wouldn't have been here or wouldn't

(53:01):
have been gifted at this if it wasn't for Mail.

Speaker 5 (53:03):
Right, you know, let me ask you, in the same
vein of all this, what do you think? What's your
perspective on the state of MC today.

Speaker 2 (53:18):
I think that there are a lot of dope mcs
out there. You just have to find them, right you know.
I think that there's a lot of dope mcs out there,
you just have to find them right now because of
what radio does right now. Because of what radio does,
they focus on a certain kind of music, you know,

(53:43):
and because of that, that's what's put to the forefront,
and that's all you think about. So you're not thinking about,
you know, who's lyrical and then the other thing. And
I'm gonna say this to all my lyrical MC's, with
the exception of Lady London, She's not included.

Speaker 6 (54:03):
Here's why.

Speaker 2 (54:05):
As a lyrical MC, I think that it's very important
for you to look the part as well look fly
so that people if they're not paying attention to what
they say, what you say, they're paying attention to how
you look and then they gravitate, gravitate to the lyrics,
you know. But there are a lot of lyrical mcs,

(54:29):
you just have to find them. But at this point
in time, what's more important really is like you know,
a catchy tune, you know, and.

Speaker 5 (54:37):
I'll you said, the look, but also the production, because
you'll have an incredible lyrically you know, lyrical MC that
doesn't pick good production to put.

Speaker 3 (54:48):
Those lyrics too.

Speaker 2 (54:49):
Well, it's not he don't pick good production, is that
he doesn't pick commercial productions. Most lyrical MC is like
bone BAP and that's not what's really selling or what's
playing on the radio, you know. But you do have
lyrical mcs that you know, rhyme over the uh that

(55:10):
modern style production.

Speaker 6 (55:11):
Like J Cole.

Speaker 1 (55:13):
Government documentary as well.

Speaker 2 (55:14):
He kills Kendrick J. Cole is my favorite MC of
this era. Shout out to Conway the Machine. I love
him to death. Billy Butcher.

Speaker 1 (55:24):
Yeah, on the flag stables out there.

Speaker 2 (55:27):
J Cole, J Cole, Oh man, like he's a problem
to me.

Speaker 3 (55:32):
Cole and Kendrick, they're they're tied to me.

Speaker 2 (55:34):
I love Kendrick. But you got to understand Cole said,
no Cosby shipped.

Speaker 6 (55:42):
But if they're sleeping on me, fuck them.

Speaker 1 (55:52):
I didn't even catch that.

Speaker 3 (55:54):
No Cosh but sleeping on them.

Speaker 2 (55:59):
But if they sleeping on me, there's a lot. I
don't believe that right there?

Speaker 3 (56:04):
Where do you say that that?

Speaker 2 (56:11):
However, y'all want to come back to this, Yeah, yeah, no, no,
no for Jake Paul. Now, while we're on this subject matter,

(56:31):
as I said, I'm speaking about everyone except Lady London.
The reason why I say that is because Lady London
she does look the part. She stay fly from head
to toe, you know what I'm saying. And her bars
are ridiculous, ridiculous, you know.

Speaker 6 (56:50):
And not only.

Speaker 2 (56:51):
That she she don't be half naked, not say anything
negative about the women that do. I'm just saying that,
you know, she don't rely on that you rely on
her beauty and her lyrics, mainly her lyrics, you know.
And Lady London, m she said, I go on a

(57:12):
date just for a date. Just I let that sit
there for them, catch up, take.

Speaker 3 (57:18):
Your time.

Speaker 2 (57:26):
For Lady London.

Speaker 1 (57:33):
That was woman.

Speaker 2 (57:35):
Didn't get that. Somebody please explain matter of fact, let
me explain that that that that don't understand. I go
on a date just for a date, just date, just
as a rolex. Yes, that's a kind of rolex. So
she's saying, yeah, I go on a date just just

(57:57):
for for a dude to buy me a Rolex. Don't
play with that girl, quick time, let's do it.

Speaker 1 (58:10):
Okay, Oh yeah, yeah, well ka, big daddy king my brother.
Let me just tell you something. Our show is about
giving people their flowers. Were always wanted to have this
show to, you know, to to to to salute our ogs,
the people that made this life possible for us to
live the life that we live. And we want to

(58:30):
give you, face to face your flowers. Said, It's like
a Grammy because it comes from your own people and.

Speaker 2 (58:43):
We have you back.

Speaker 1 (58:44):
Yes, yeah yeah. And by the way, he always drinks
so exclusive ship drink some Exclusive ship let me just
tell you something, young whipper snappers. He is og to
the per talking about anything about him, his motherfucking impeccable.

Speaker 3 (59:03):
Goddamn. Let's go one.

Speaker 1 (59:05):
All right, we're gonna you wanna splain them, Thomas.

Speaker 5 (59:07):
Yeah, We're gonna give you two choices. If you pick one,
nobody's drinking. This is a drinking game, by the way. Okay,
so if you pick one, nobody's drinking. If you say
both or neither, we all drink.

Speaker 3 (59:22):
I mean he could do whatever.

Speaker 2 (59:22):
He yeah, he can, we don't.

Speaker 1 (59:25):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's okay, you can do it.

Speaker 2 (59:27):
Now what what what? What's the answer if someone has.

Speaker 5 (59:31):
If I'm saying, we're gonna give you two choices, if
you pick one, that said, would we just go on
to the next one. If you say both, like you say,
well that I'm picking both or I'm picking neither of them,
then we're drinking.

Speaker 3 (59:42):
Cool all right?

Speaker 9 (59:46):
No, no, no, why yeah, yeah, le's keep it with the wine.
That's right, Okay, Tupac or d m X. It's your
mind and you can explain it. You don't have takes place.
It's all up to you.

Speaker 2 (01:00:03):
If if we talking artists, Tupac, if we're talking lyricists X.

Speaker 3 (01:00:12):
That sounds like a drink to me. Sounds like both
sounds like.

Speaker 1 (01:00:17):
Again, all right, I like this one Primo or Lars pro.

Speaker 2 (01:00:24):
Mm hmmm. I would have to say I would have
I would I would have to say I would have
to say Primo okay. I would have to say Primo.

Speaker 3 (01:00:41):
Okay, kick Apri or DJ Scratch.

Speaker 6 (01:00:44):
You ain't putting me in that ship.

Speaker 3 (01:00:46):
That's a good.

Speaker 2 (01:00:47):
That's a good. I'll say like this said Rock a Party,
Kick Apri, DJ Battle Scratch.

Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
That sounds like a drink to me, because that was
the big debate that night.

Speaker 2 (01:01:06):
Uh, the verses, right, Yeah, I kind of take blame
for that, man, Okay, let's just play.

Speaker 1 (01:01:13):
I can see your face.

Speaker 2 (01:01:16):
No, because like when I told you earlier, he didn't
want to do it, okay, but then when when they
got cares to do it, he got he agreed to
do it with KRS got. So then when Charlie Max said, Yo,
we want you to use DJ Scratch, I said, okay, fine,
and then I called Scratch and I was like, yo,

(01:01:39):
his as you know, but I didn't know that. You
know that, you know, they had a little something going
on and you know, and you know when when Scratch
went the sucker DJ, and I was like, I was like, no,
hold no, just like you know, yeah, I came with

(01:01:59):
bars right and I spit some some simple ship, you know,
hoping that Chris was going to, you know, bite off
of it, you'll come but but he didn't. But I mean,
even with what I had locked and loaded, I wasn't
gonna call him no sucker and see nothing that degrading.
You know what I'm saying. That's my brother. It's like

(01:02:20):
I would spit some battle rounds, but I'm not going
to do. I love him, you know what I'm saying.
And you know I didn't know. I love k Caprice,
so I don't want you don't call him a sucker DJ.

Speaker 6 (01:02:29):
A gentleman's yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
I mean I didn't take it that way. Asked me
watching it, I'll be watching it. I really did take
it as a DJ type type of thing. But when
Caprite didn't indulged back.

Speaker 3 (01:02:41):
That's what I was like, Oh, maybe this wasn't right.

Speaker 2 (01:02:44):
I mean it was like, you know, it was like
at that moment when scratched, I said, you know what,
I forgot you the funk I was talking to I'm like,
this is what the ship stra he was he was
going scratch. This was just me being being upset with Caprie.
You know, so now you can do it. Okay, answer

(01:03:05):
you know, but but you know, but I forgot who
I was dealing with. That was that was about fault
man poo. I'm sorry, brother, I'm sorry, brother.

Speaker 3 (01:03:14):
Okay, care ras one or rock.

Speaker 2 (01:03:16):
Him hm hmm. Once again, it's it depends. It's like.

Speaker 3 (01:03:28):
You're gonna get a lot of it.

Speaker 2 (01:03:32):
On a song.

Speaker 6 (01:03:33):
Rock him in the battle Karres.

Speaker 1 (01:03:36):
Okay, this sounds like.

Speaker 2 (01:03:43):
Why are you all in our.

Speaker 5 (01:03:46):
I was trying to avoid I get the next? Okay,
good one, by the way, all right, Guru or big
l rest in pieces of both.

Speaker 2 (01:03:59):
I don't want to I don't. I mean these brothers
and they're not here no more, I don't. I don't
want to do that one.

Speaker 1 (01:04:04):
Yes, we're gonna drink for that, so we're drinking. That
sounds like bo you one the next word because didn't
mister C bring Biggie to your career?

Speaker 2 (01:04:15):
No?

Speaker 6 (01:04:15):
No, no, okay, mister C.

Speaker 2 (01:04:18):
Let me hear them. Okay, like he he did the
thing in his house with Biggie Ryman over the blind
alley beat that I just have stepping let me hear it.

Speaker 6 (01:04:27):
Oh wow, yeah, Like she used to be like, yo,
you don't hear it.

Speaker 2 (01:04:31):
I'm like because she thought that we sounded similar, and
I'm like, I don't really. Yeah, I'm like, I don't
hear it. Big I could see it. I didn't see
it though, Oh I could no, no, no, But eventually
I did, like I think with partying bullshit came out
and I was like even then, I was telling see,
I don't see it.

Speaker 3 (01:04:49):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (01:04:49):
Then the One More Chance remix came out and I called, see, yeah,
I see it.

Speaker 1 (01:04:56):
I'm like, okay, quests or day I soul.

Speaker 2 (01:05:06):
Pour up. That's a that's a tough one, man, because
you know, like Mace is my dude, like my brother.
But I probably I probably listened to more and then
what you call it. Dave was such a dope MC too.
Dave was such a dope see, but I don't know
make it. I probably listened to more tribe records. I

(01:05:28):
probably listened to more tribe records.

Speaker 1 (01:05:29):
And bigger Dave try day I saw because they you know,
recently got their master's back. Is that something that you
you have your masters as well?

Speaker 6 (01:05:38):
I'm in the process now.

Speaker 1 (01:05:39):
Okay, yeah, that's what all of the Oh Jesus is saying.
I'm glad the next.

Speaker 5 (01:05:44):
One DJ Hollywood or Cool Hirk. I'm kind of already well, I.

Speaker 2 (01:05:51):
Mean, naturally, I would have to pick Hollywood because I'm
an MC, like I would expect the DJ would pick herk.
I'm an MC, so I mean, you know, I feel like,
you know, he birthed me, you know what I mean.

Speaker 6 (01:06:02):
So I would they have to pick Hollywood just for
that reason.

Speaker 5 (01:06:04):
Right right next one, Latifa Queen Latifa drink. Oh and
we need both of them on drinks. Yeah, we've been
asking for years. Yeah, okay, Molly mal or Pete Rock.

Speaker 2 (01:06:29):
I would have to go with Mally for the simple
fact that there would be no Pete Rock. Primo Large
Professor just blazed, none of them. It wasn't for mallypet
that's who you know, brought that sample. Like I think
Curtis Blow is the first person to use a sample,
but it's just percussions from a Troublefunk record. The person

(01:06:52):
that really made sample and the way of hip hop
production is Marley. So I gotta go with Mally.

Speaker 3 (01:06:58):
God damn it. Latin quarters are the fever Latin quarters.

Speaker 2 (01:07:03):
I was so young for the fever, ok like yeah,
like right now, like south from the Fever. Yeah, even
be like, yo, man, I need you to do this
here show for me by I got like ten grand
come on and this is me, Sally sal came and
this me Salid. Y'all fucking twelve, man, I wasn't. I
don't owe you nothing, man, I'm fucking twelve years old,

(01:07:24):
so man, don't. But I love Salve Man. I love
Salve Man as matter of fact. Man, It's like, you know,
if I'm correct, I believe that's the first hip hop club, right.

Speaker 3 (01:07:37):
No, the fever, the fever, Oh I'm not. I'm not
sureing that.

Speaker 2 (01:07:39):
Fever's like what seventy eight seventy seven, because fever's before
Halem World, right, yeah, I don't know. I figure it out.

Speaker 3 (01:07:47):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:07:48):
If I'm right, then sal you deserve this right right,
right right?

Speaker 1 (01:07:54):
Okay?

Speaker 6 (01:07:55):
Sam Cook? Oh right, y'alls, Sam Cook.

Speaker 2 (01:08:00):
You know I think Ray Charles, you know, yeah, I
think he's the first one to take gospel chords and
sing love music over it.

Speaker 6 (01:08:09):
But Sam Cook perfected it.

Speaker 2 (01:08:13):
He put a much more sexier voice to it, and
perfected the way it was done, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:08:18):
Yeah, Okay, run DMC or a p M d.

Speaker 2 (01:08:28):
M hmm.

Speaker 3 (01:08:36):
Yeah, Lord Fess or.

Speaker 2 (01:08:38):
Oc Well, I would say, Lord Finess. I think that
Lord Finess is a great levers system, great livers system,
and and also he's responsible for a lot of other

(01:09:03):
people having careers.

Speaker 1 (01:09:05):
Absolutely flat top or gumby.

Speaker 2 (01:09:12):
You fucking serious, he's got war man. I mean as
much as I love my my Man Bobby Man, come on,
man who flat top rules?

Speaker 5 (01:09:26):
And Jimmy Hendrix or Santana, I.

Speaker 2 (01:09:35):
Love Santana man, but I gotta go with Jimmy just
for the simple fact of, like, you know, the blues
stuff that he did, the way he would make his
rock guitar talk on a blues song, right, I don't know.

Speaker 5 (01:09:53):
That's what I think somebody told us here on Drink Sham.
I think so taught himself. It was Jeordie Clinton that
told us that.

Speaker 1 (01:10:03):
Master Ace or Special ad.

Speaker 2 (01:10:09):
Ace is juice crew man that.

Speaker 1 (01:10:13):
Says it all okay, fat Joe or Rick Ross.

Speaker 6 (01:10:26):
It's like.

Speaker 2 (01:10:31):
I I I kind of want to lean towards Rick
Ross and see the dark skin chubby dude. But you know, Joe,
my dude, man, Joe, my dude. That's that's always showed
me love man, Joe, Joe, Joe, my dude. Man.

Speaker 1 (01:10:49):
Okay, so we're gonna let that one sly ice Cube
or Scarface.

Speaker 2 (01:10:58):
That's a hard one there, man, real hard and that
that's a good one. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that.

Speaker 6 (01:11:05):
Actually would have been a great verses.

Speaker 2 (01:11:07):
Yeah yeah, that would have been a great verse That's
that's that's a hard one.

Speaker 6 (01:11:11):
I don't know, I don't.

Speaker 2 (01:11:13):
I don't know both because it's it's like, you know,
Scarface I think is the better storyteller. But oh man,
I don't know. Man, I don't that one. I don't know.
I don't know. I mean because like Cube c got
some joints man, Anywright movies, well they ain't got nothing

(01:11:34):
to do with hip hop.

Speaker 3 (01:11:36):
Let's just try and help you out.

Speaker 6 (01:11:39):
I mean, I mean yeah, I mean, I don't back
to n W a Q.

Speaker 2 (01:11:44):
It's just yeah, Cube man, Like like I remember when
I heard a Bitch is a Bitch from that song alone,
I was like, this is is gonna be a problem,
you know. Yeah, so we say both, Yeah, I guess
Lola Brook or Lady London.

Speaker 6 (01:12:03):
Lady London.

Speaker 2 (01:12:04):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (01:12:05):
Video music Box or your.

Speaker 2 (01:12:07):
TV matter of fact, come back ask me that question again.
Load of Brook or Lady lo Okay, Okay, I mean no, listen,
Lola Brook. I'm gonna be honest with you. I really
would love to link up with her and work with
her because what I saw at the BET Awards, I'm
a fan. Yeah, she goes all out, but Lady London,

(01:12:28):
like I would love to actually be in a studio
with male artists. When Lady London walk in, I got
a funny feeling that I'm gonna see something I've seen
before me And like back when I used to DJ
for Shante, I used to see Shante come in dressing
rooms and mail artists turn around to avoid smoke. No

(01:12:52):
establish male artists that had hit records will turn their
back to avoid their make an eye contact with rock
Sanne Shante scared to death for a little sixteen year
old girl.

Speaker 5 (01:13:01):
Wow, yeah, we can't let it go. And notice he
said when he's the DJ for Shant, Yes, I caught that.
I cut that. I cut that. That was hard.

Speaker 3 (01:13:09):
Okay. Video music Box or your TV.

Speaker 6 (01:13:12):
Raps, video music box, Hideo music Box.

Speaker 1 (01:13:17):
Big up to Ralph mc dames, mob Deep or Mop.

Speaker 2 (01:13:25):
I mean I love both, but you know, Mop, that's
that Brooklyn ship, Man, that's that Brooklyn ship. It ain't
ain't nothing like heying, you know, slap and dance, scream,
they fucking lungs out on the song. Man. Ain't nothing
like that energy. Yeah, that energy is just something else

(01:13:47):
we need.

Speaker 3 (01:13:47):
Mop on here too. Scoop a scrap mm hmm.

Speaker 2 (01:13:54):
Those my brothers. Man, drink that, yeah, drink you mean
school band scrash? What what you said? I said, I
said school you know he's no, he said school or scrap.
I said, you mean school band scrap. I look at
them as one man, all together.

Speaker 3 (01:14:13):
This because of my shirt. Bro oh yeah, all in
the same game.

Speaker 2 (01:14:22):
I mean, I'm gonna say both man, because they both
served a beautiful.

Speaker 5 (01:14:26):
Cause it was a great movement man, guy Michael or Prince.

Speaker 2 (01:14:38):
It's like it's multi talented. As as as as Prince was.
I don't I don't think that you know, we're ever
going to see another artist like Michael Jackson.

Speaker 1 (01:14:58):
Man, you said Mike was Prince in the verses.

Speaker 2 (01:15:02):
In the verses, yeah, okay, versus where on.

Speaker 1 (01:15:06):
Stage and Kingston.

Speaker 2 (01:15:10):
No, no Mike in the versus. I mean because you
you you got to understand Prince play numerous instruments. Prince
vocal range was ridiculous, you know, ridiculous, you know. So,

(01:15:33):
I mean, and he can and he could, and he
could and he could, he could dance, but he couldn't
dance like Mike.

Speaker 6 (01:15:39):
He can't dance like Mike.

Speaker 2 (01:15:41):
Mike is but Mike is that the better performer though
Mike is the better performer, you know, So.

Speaker 6 (01:15:52):
In the versus it's hard to say.

Speaker 2 (01:15:54):
Because if if, if, if Prince is strategic, he could
get the edge. But if he's not, Michael, Michael tell
him apart. But I mean overall, just it's like it's like,
I don't think I think that Michael Jackson is the
biggest artist ever.

Speaker 6 (01:16:11):
I don't think we're gonna ever see another Michael jack
Michael Jackson.

Speaker 2 (01:16:14):
No, I had the opportunity, but it was just so
many people crowded around, and I just was like, I'm good, Prince. Yes,
I haven't met Prince.

Speaker 3 (01:16:25):
Where was y'all at We.

Speaker 2 (01:16:26):
Was in Warner Brothers in more Austin office.

Speaker 3 (01:16:30):
Was he purple?

Speaker 6 (01:16:32):
Was he?

Speaker 2 (01:16:33):
No? I'm correct, I think he has some white shit on.
He has some white shit or but he was, you know,
sitting down at more Austin.

Speaker 3 (01:16:42):
Deaths, you know, hyper dedicated.

Speaker 2 (01:16:47):
He was like Michael Nah, he was like, you know,
how may I help you out today? Like acting like
he was more Awston. He was playing around and act
like he was more Awson.

Speaker 3 (01:16:59):
You like this Prince?

Speaker 2 (01:17:00):
I know you are. Yeah. I was like atually I
was like like Shot, you know you like, oh Ship,
this is Prince.

Speaker 3 (01:17:07):
You know Prince had a deep voice. Yeah yeah, yeah,
really that's the truth. So I say, you sound like
Michael Jackson.

Speaker 2 (01:17:14):
Prince.

Speaker 5 (01:17:16):
I thought he Mike was the same Prince. Imagine we
would have had both of them still around to this day.

Speaker 6 (01:17:22):
I would love to see that. That would have been crazy.

Speaker 1 (01:17:26):
We did w A, n w A or public Enemy.

Speaker 2 (01:17:34):
I'm not playing with Shot. I mean, this ain't my thing,
you know, honestly, I don't you know, I'm I'm I'm
like uncomfortable with putting artists against each other.

Speaker 6 (01:17:46):
That's something I never raised.

Speaker 2 (01:17:48):
I know we're playing, I know we're playing, but I
mean that's just something I just ain't really.

Speaker 1 (01:17:53):
This one, this one and did I'm gonna get up
out of here digital or analog?

Speaker 2 (01:17:58):
Analog? Analog? Right? I mean, it's so like the capabilities
are endless with digital. But that feel of analog, man,
that that's feel that his. I mean, just just the
the tape alone create a hum noise that fills up
the track, you know what I mean.

Speaker 6 (01:18:18):
It's just just.

Speaker 3 (01:18:20):
It records the energy.

Speaker 4 (01:18:21):
In the room.

Speaker 2 (01:18:21):
Yeah, sure you right.

Speaker 1 (01:18:23):
Yeah, So this last one, say the movie one. I
think the movie one's fair for him? You do it
New Jack City or Juice?

Speaker 2 (01:18:32):
Mm hm hm hmm. That's interesting. Oh man, you know
what I think I might say. I think I might
say Juice. I think I might say Juice. I mean

(01:18:56):
my reason is because, uh, Juice felt real New York. Right.
You know, I didn't know any drug dealers that act
like Nino in the eighties. Like all the drug dealers
I knew in the eighties, they didn't act like my

(01:19:18):
Wesley played the Nino character, right right?

Speaker 5 (01:19:21):
Jack said, Yeah, and you got a song on the
Juice soundtrack. That's an amazing song.

Speaker 2 (01:19:28):
I do.

Speaker 6 (01:19:28):
It's an amazing song. Thank you, thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:19:31):
Last one, and then we're gonna go back to the interview.
Loyalty or respect?

Speaker 6 (01:19:38):
Loyalty or respect? Can I get them both? Of course?

Speaker 3 (01:19:42):
That's that's the time we'recording ring your klecoffee.

Speaker 1 (01:19:46):
Yeah yeah, I'm drinking killer. That's the time where we
always say we should say both. You know what I mean,
because I think one.

Speaker 3 (01:19:54):
Goes hand to hand. You think that absolutely.

Speaker 1 (01:19:57):
So let me ask you because this is something I
always wanted to know when I first, you know, came
in and to knowledge with the five percent Nation. One
of the things that they said it was a stop
for law. You cannot do, you cannot have was yellow, right, yes,
And the biz mark says, daddy can't my mic my

(01:20:20):
mellow you know on the.

Speaker 3 (01:20:21):
Mike, because you know you yellow.

Speaker 1 (01:20:23):
I always wanted to act.

Speaker 2 (01:20:29):
Like wait a.

Speaker 1 (01:20:30):
Minute, always want to like wait a minute.

Speaker 6 (01:20:37):
I mean, you know, nobody take this serious.

Speaker 2 (01:20:40):
I mean he was just making something round with mellow,
make around with mellow. You know.

Speaker 3 (01:20:48):
So no one never said hey, hey, god.

Speaker 10 (01:20:51):
No no, because that's workin ye pork the coloring like
the cars too.

Speaker 2 (01:21:01):
Now, the guards was pissed at me about the Madonna book,
but never about the jell O Ship book.

Speaker 3 (01:21:07):
When you was finger popping.

Speaker 1 (01:21:12):
Immed.

Speaker 3 (01:21:17):
You know, you know what's crazy. That was a different time.
Must have been a crazy time.

Speaker 1 (01:21:23):
But but did you only see backlash from the guards
or what from everybody?

Speaker 2 (01:21:29):
From everybody, you know, but I mean but yeah, yeah, yeah,
but I mean like there was like a lot of guards. Hey, yo,
god man, you need to we need to have a bill, man,
I need to don't know the science behind that, man,
you know, you know, but I mean, you know, I
mean at that point in time, man, you know those

(01:21:50):
that really understand, you know, the culture Islam. You know,
you know that there are white Muslims you know does
not approve and they don't he probably wouldn't, but they
don't identify as white, nor the black ones identify as black.

(01:22:10):
They all identify as Muslim, right, you know, so you know,
with that understanding understood, I mean, you know, I'm not gonna,
you know, be against Madonna because or anybody because they're white.

Speaker 1 (01:22:26):
You know, It's true, like once she went game, she
still remains. Man. Yes, so I know we covering this

(01:22:50):
the last time. But that Nam Campbell photo shoot? What
was that for Calvin Klein?

Speaker 3 (01:22:56):
What was that?

Speaker 6 (01:22:57):
The Madonna book?

Speaker 1 (01:22:58):
The same thing? Okay, okay, you was you was outside, man,
You was outside?

Speaker 3 (01:23:03):
Man, I ain't gonna lie, brother, Yes, great, yes, yes,
because nah, this I don't know.

Speaker 6 (01:23:11):
There's a cartoon.

Speaker 2 (01:23:13):
There's a cartoon where someone like redid the photo with
the characters from the cartoon. I don't know what cartoon
it is, but that's why I was like, yeah, I'm
like I need that on the T shirt.

Speaker 6 (01:23:24):
But it is a known cartoon.

Speaker 2 (01:23:26):
But they did it like with the one in the
water with me, Naomi and Madonna.

Speaker 6 (01:23:31):
But I was like, oh, I need that on the T.

Speaker 1 (01:23:32):
Shirt because you know, like again, you faved a way
for like, you know, these big hip records, these big
moments in hip hop, right, because I remember it seemed
like there was nothing bigger than Big Daddy came, like

(01:23:54):
I remember like my whole childhood, like like I said,
my flat top was and correct like I was, you know,
I was trying to get my flat top right. I
was trying to get and and then I remember there
was one point I believe it was like when I
Get the Job Done record came out and people was like, man,
we lost Kane, like Caine is transcended hip hops into

(01:24:17):
this whole nother world like they was like that. I
believe it was using commercial at the time. Was that
something that you received the backlash for, like I know
we spoke.

Speaker 2 (01:24:26):
About the absolutely oh yeah, a whole lot of it,
A whole lot of it.

Speaker 3 (01:24:32):
The record wasn't the video.

Speaker 2 (01:24:34):
I think the record okay, But I mean there was
several songs, you know.

Speaker 6 (01:24:39):
But let me ask you this in hip hop.

Speaker 2 (01:24:45):
Today, right, I'm ready, how many songs do you hear
that sound commercial? Yes? How many songs do you hear
that have singing on them? Right? And how many songs

(01:25:05):
do you hear on the radio that sound like boom back?
Not a lot? See me as a student of hip hop,
one thing I've always understood is that hip hop music
musically has no origin. Grandmaster Cas said it best. I

(01:25:32):
didn't invent anything. It reinvented everything. Musically, it has no
origin because what herk was doing was taking other people
music and bringing the breakbeat part playing that other people music,
and that's what rappers rhyme to. That's what beat boys
danced so right. Even though Human beat Box when they

(01:26:00):
started out, they was doing beatboxing to break from records.
There was other people music and those records were what
impeached to President by Royal c. Soul song soul music,

(01:26:21):
not hip hop soul music. Good Times by Chic Disco
Rocket James Brown, Funk, Rocket in the Pocket by Saron
Techno or Electronic or whichever one you want to use.

(01:26:44):
Big Beat by Billy Squire, rock and roll, you see
what I'm saying. Nautilists by Bob James Jazz. So all
of those elements always been a part of hip hop.
And that's all I was doing, was incorporating elements that
already been a part of hip hop. Right you know?

Speaker 1 (01:27:06):
Do you think that because like, like you said, like
it's so many hooks, like if you look at job RULs,
so many things that do you think that was the
invention of like people thinking that this is the way
to go at the commercial route? Matter fact, let me
rephrase that question. Was that more of a record label
thing or was that a cane thing when you were

(01:27:26):
saying let me let me go down?

Speaker 6 (01:27:28):
That was a cane thing.

Speaker 2 (01:27:29):
When I was doing it, I wanted to explore different
things and try to open the mind frame of my
fan base, you know, to see a bigger picture. That's
what I was really trying to do. I just was
a little too early with it, right you know. Had
I waited till like nineteen ninety four, and it did

(01:27:52):
it on Bad Boy Records, I would have been a
bad mon I mean Puff sort of vision Puff, you know,
you know, like like I love and respect Puff for that.
Like he's like clearly he must have told Big like no, no,
go ahead, kick all your gangster ship, but do it
on this beat right here, right you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (01:28:15):
That's what's the crazy thing about him is Big. If
you look at all of his lyrics, it's as hard
as but he, like, like you said, Puff kind of
like puts soft beats under it and you kind of
like don't see it.

Speaker 2 (01:28:26):
Well, I mean, I mean I'm not even gonna call
it soft beasts because I mean ship we used to know,
I mean we should lose get me out, We used
to lose our mind in the club when Juicy Fruit
came on. But you can't call it a soft song
because there's that Ship used to bang in the club
Juicy Fruit, you know, banging the club.

Speaker 3 (01:28:45):
And your era too.

Speaker 5 (01:28:46):
On the other side, you had Hammer pushing that envelope
of of going commercial and catching a lot of fleck
as well.

Speaker 6 (01:28:53):
But I mean he was a commercial artist.

Speaker 2 (01:28:55):
But I mean I don't see what I honestly don't
see what the problem is. Like, I don't have a
problem with Hammer music. I didn't have a problem with
Fresh Prince music. I mean because it was hip hop
from a commercial standpoint. You know, everything don't need to
be thubbed out. We got artists like Okay, for example,

(01:29:19):
what if Will Smith would have put out some gangster
stuff in the eighties and and some some some real
live street dudes would have tried them, it would have
been you know what I'm saying. You know, you know,
it's like, you know, he he did what was right

(01:29:39):
for him, and the bars was right, like like lyrically
he was spitting.

Speaker 6 (01:29:44):
I thought it was dope.

Speaker 2 (01:29:46):
It was commercial, but it was dope, and he was
coming from a different perspective. I don't see what the
problem was, you know, but I mean, you know, it's like,
you know, you know, people just love to find something
wrong with everything everything.

Speaker 1 (01:29:58):
How about Buella likes how you feel about him?

Speaker 2 (01:30:01):
Same thing with Aillis. I don't think that you know
that the music was bad. You know what I'm saying.
I don't have a problem with him making commercial hip hop.
You know, I think that some of the things that
he said in interviews was bad. You know, it's like
like you know.

Speaker 3 (01:30:21):
The discrepancies where he was from.

Speaker 2 (01:30:25):
Yeah, all types of stuff, and he invented the yep
yep and all this other stuff, and it was like,
you know, just just just just be this successful hip
hop artists, you know, just winning in the commercial market.
Just be him. You know, I think that that would
have worked so much better for him. You know, it's

(01:30:48):
just the backlash I think got the better of him,
because I mean, you look at like Eminem, he never
tried to be black. He never tried to be black,
and he talking hood ship but it's his hood trailer park,
you know what I'm saying. But even though there was
a lot of people that you know, wanted to hate

(01:31:10):
on him.

Speaker 3 (01:31:12):
You couldn't because he was himself.

Speaker 2 (01:31:14):
Yeah, because it's like there's there's nothing that's back in
what you're saying, because he's not trying to be black.
In fact, he's employing a whole bunch of black people,
you know, on the label and working for the label,
you know what I'm saying. So it's like, you know,
it's like he didn't go through it when the lights

(01:31:36):
went through.

Speaker 1 (01:31:37):
And he was lyrically respected through underground.

Speaker 6 (01:31:39):
Oh yeah, Well that played the heavy part too. He
paid his dues.

Speaker 5 (01:31:44):
I forgot the outside, Yeah, the outside.

Speaker 2 (01:31:48):
You I mean, being nice as fuck on the mic too,
and play heavy a major part too.

Speaker 5 (01:31:53):
But it boils down to authenticities what you're saying, Like,
I think that's one.

Speaker 3 (01:31:56):
Of the pillars of hip hop that is important.

Speaker 5 (01:31:59):
Like if you're truly authentically who you are, that'll shine
through and get you through a lot.

Speaker 1 (01:32:03):
But what's the last one?

Speaker 3 (01:32:05):
They group?

Speaker 6 (01:32:05):
I thought today was called ever Last.

Speaker 3 (01:32:06):
Year of Pain?

Speaker 2 (01:32:08):
Ever Last.

Speaker 5 (01:32:08):
He was down with Ryme Syndicate with Iced ty in
them right and then and then he did House of Pain.

Speaker 1 (01:32:13):
I we think it insane. Clown Posse is authentic to
what they do and to where they're from.

Speaker 2 (01:32:17):
Yeah, for real, even even Beastie Boys, absolutely, you know,
because these is punk rockers turned hip hop, And I
mean it's like their songs are more punk rock vibe, right,
you know, I mean the way the way they spitting
and stuff, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:32:36):
So, I mean and coming out of a and they
got to Brooklyn, but.

Speaker 5 (01:32:40):
Coming out of an era where punk rock and hip
hop were kind of together.

Speaker 2 (01:32:43):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely, like seventy seven, seventy seventy seven to
seventy nine was really like where punk rock and hip
hop came into the forefront.

Speaker 1 (01:32:58):
That just walked this way.

Speaker 6 (01:33:00):
That's for now.

Speaker 2 (01:33:01):
I'm talking like Deborah Harry, the Ramones.

Speaker 3 (01:33:06):
Almost Queens.

Speaker 2 (01:33:07):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, like like they like,
you know, like that whole punk because what was happening
was like you had people like Fab five Freddy He's
going to the white parties, Russell Simmons, Yeah the time. Yeah,
but they're they're hanging out at CBGB's for the punk

(01:33:29):
rock parties. And then they're taking all these hi punk
broadcasts uptown to Harlem World for a hip hop party.
So it's like this their mission because they.

Speaker 3 (01:33:39):
The spikes come from right, the spikes.

Speaker 2 (01:33:43):
I don't know, Okay, I mean it's a possibility a lot.
I mean, but then again, you know, that could have
just been some I don't know, that could have been
some brock ship. I don't know, I don't know.

Speaker 5 (01:33:51):
I think it came the disco. Yeah who told us that.
I think we heard We've heard different things. I know
Africa been botting. All them were the first adopters of that.

Speaker 2 (01:33:59):
Look, yeah, yeah, that's who you need to ask, like
Van Barda or Mail or flash. We definitely need Yes, yes,
if y'all bring mail, I want to come back.

Speaker 6 (01:34:10):
I just want to sit over there.

Speaker 3 (01:34:15):
It would be amazing to have melly mellow.

Speaker 2 (01:34:17):
Yeah, I'm a I'm ana be in that corner, just
like like Derek d ditt.

Speaker 6 (01:34:22):
I tell them why you man?

Speaker 1 (01:34:25):
Man? Yeah, So let's talk about set it off?

Speaker 2 (01:34:35):
Man?

Speaker 3 (01:34:36):
How did how did that session?

Speaker 1 (01:34:38):
How did that?

Speaker 3 (01:34:38):
How did how did that record come about?

Speaker 2 (01:34:41):
Set it off? Me and Biz went to Mark forty
five King Crib Yeah, and he played this beat that
he had for Biz and Biz didn't like it. So

(01:35:03):
I told Mark. I was like, yo, if if it's
okay with you, I use it, and he said, yeah,
you can have it.

Speaker 6 (01:35:13):
I said, but can it go a little faster?

Speaker 2 (01:35:14):
So he, you know, he tried to speed up a
little bit and I was like, no, no, no, I
meant faster, like if it's thirty three, can you play
it on forty five?

Speaker 6 (01:35:22):
And he said, funny you say that.

Speaker 2 (01:35:25):
He took the disc out and loaded up another disc
and this disc it was playing. He was like, that's
the actual speed, he said. I slowed it down for
Biz because I know he don't like fast beasts. But
this is the actual speed. I was like, I take it,
and then he told me, yeah, I already submitted it
for a public Enemy remix. I can't remember whether it

(01:35:49):
was Bring the Noise or not a Living base Head,
but he had submitted it for a public Enemy remix,
so he told me I couldn't have it, so, you know,
BIZ stayed on top of him until finally, I don't
know whether they turned it down. I don't know if
def Jam turned it down or whether the case may
be with Bit stayed on top of him until I
could get.

Speaker 3 (01:36:06):
It on your behalf. Bit stay on top of him, Yeah,
that's good.

Speaker 2 (01:36:09):
Stayed on top of Mark forty five until I can
get the beat and then Busy you know, like call
me yeah. And then he gave me the beat, and
when I was sitting there, I'm like, I'm like, I
don't really want to rhyme over that. I think we
should say that for the hook. And then I put
this James Brown shit in the you know, yeah, I

(01:36:33):
put that in there, and then yeah, and that's how
we did it. And it was like I had something
in mind already because it was like I had heard
sex Machine from James Brown, and I'm listening like, you
know we're gonna do it moving grooving.

Speaker 6 (01:36:49):
Can I count it off?

Speaker 2 (01:36:49):
Can I? I'm like, I need something like that where
like the energy is there before the bea drop. I
got to figure out a way to do it hip
hop wise. And I was like, yeah, you know what,
just start the rhyme off acappella and didn't let the
bee come in.

Speaker 6 (01:37:02):
So that's why the letter rope get bold. I just
caun't let that and.

Speaker 2 (01:37:05):
Want to build down up. Then I just thought, you know,
I was trying to like do what James did with
Sex Machine.

Speaker 3 (01:37:12):
Makes no noise that I got there. Let's go to
warm it up?

Speaker 6 (01:37:16):
Can warm it up?

Speaker 3 (01:37:18):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:37:20):
Warm it up? Biz once again? Man Coov called me
one day. Kov called me on the phone. Kov is
biz DJ for those that don't know. He called me
on the phone one day and he was like, Yo,
I got this joint for you. This shit crazy and

(01:37:41):
it's perfect for you. I'm like, okay, what's happening. He
was like, Nah, it's one of them up tempo joints.
BIZ was going to use it. But and before you
could say anything else, you hear bus in the background.
It so goddamn fast. V was like, but yo, I

(01:38:03):
need you do me a favor. I need you to
write this here ship for me with my BAM. So
he asked me to write this verse for him, and
you know then you know they gave me the beat.
But yeah, yeah, yeah, that's that's another joint that came
from BIZ just like a step crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:38:17):
You know what's crazy?

Speaker 1 (01:38:18):
And I'm jumping off subject but still on subject a
little bit, you know, I hear you you saying this
so much, like why was BIZ so much of a
respect at MC and like you you blatantly like wrote
his rhymes and like he had help, but no one
looks at Biz like a person that wasn't an MC.
Like everyone looks at him like a respectable person. But

(01:38:42):
nowadays if someone was to get help on that pen
that they don't, they don't look at him like a
real MC.

Speaker 2 (01:38:49):
Because it's like when it comes to MC, and you know,
you have lyricists and you have party rockers. Uh you know,
I'm a lyricist, Rock him is a lyricist, Kress g
rap you know lyricists. Then you know you got party rockers, Biz,

(01:39:13):
Dougie Fresh, Busy Bee, you know, DJ Hollywood, Right, So
it's like with cats like that. If someone right there rhymes,
you don't trip on that because it's like their job
is to rock the party and when they come they
do their job. With us. We're lyricists. Our job is

(01:39:36):
to be lyricists. Someone else right now, ship then we
ain't really lyricists, right, you know, real talk.

Speaker 5 (01:39:45):
I want to get shout out bov for and he
has a show with rock san Chante.

Speaker 1 (01:39:48):
That's why roll that's right, check it out up. I
wanted to invite me up, write us on.

Speaker 2 (01:39:54):
Let's go to r A w row.

Speaker 3 (01:40:00):
No conners back then.

Speaker 6 (01:40:01):
Right, They had nothing to do with that. Cut it out.

Speaker 2 (01:40:08):
Now.

Speaker 6 (01:40:10):
What happened was we had just rhyming with bizz out.

Speaker 2 (01:40:13):
Damn.

Speaker 1 (01:40:13):
That's my next question, man, stop doing my interview.

Speaker 2 (01:40:18):
I was so happy to have that song out. Unfortunately,
everybody thought it was Biz's song. It's playing on the radio,
but it's like biz Ram's first and then I come on,
so they thought it was Biz's song. So I got
a new song out yet and stilled though I'm sitting
at home, broke me and school, gotta walk fifteen blocks
to the store. Steal missus for missus missus Paul's fish

(01:40:42):
sticks Kansas shrimp.

Speaker 3 (01:40:44):
Wow here, how old are you at this time? More
or less nineteen?

Speaker 2 (01:40:48):
I think nineteen Yeah, but I got a record out
and I'm broke, not making no money because nobody's booking
me for no shuts right because biz song. So I'm
damn near crying to fly Tirl like yo mill, come
on man to put another song out with just me,
tires like Yore's Life and the songs like then finally,
at some point, Tied just got tired of me asking him,
and he just.

Speaker 1 (01:41:07):
So people know, fly tis the person that own records Colture.

Speaker 2 (01:41:11):
Yeah. Tie finally got tired of me asking him, and
he was like, yeah, all right, go ahead, do a song.
So Mally made a beat and I wrote the rhymes
the raw. And then this girl I was dating at
the time, she was like, why are you always going
on to Molly Malhouse. Won't you spend time with me?

(01:41:31):
I got records you can look through my records of
and she pulled these records out and she had the
first thing I saw was the soundtrack The Black Cason,
and I'm like, that was my movie, right, yeah, yeah,
that was my movie. I'm like, all right, I stay
so I stayed, I'm looking through the records playing ship
and the first thing I heard was that that sounded

(01:41:53):
funky was pays the cost to be the boss. I
heard that, I'm like, oh, oh, I gotta use this. But
then I'm playing more, and then I heard this song
i'ma feel Good and I heard these horns bo bo,
and I'm like, oh, that would work on the beat
that Marley made, you know. So I'm like, yeah, me

(01:42:18):
grad this. And then the next morning I did try
to do what Biz always do, like before he go
to Marley Cribb. He would always stop it downstairs records.
That was you know, his you know routine. So I
did it and I stopped by there and my man
j C that worked in there. Jac was like, yo,
we just got these James Brown imports in and he

(01:42:39):
played them for me. I forgot what the first one was,
and he played the other one. It was called cross
the Tracks kiddn't play. Ended up using it, I think
from my way, I think that's the name of the song.
But anyway, then he played the third one and that
was the catch catch catch. I'm like, yes, I'll take that,

(01:43:02):
So I took it, went to Marley crib and was like, yo,
the song we were somebody. I want to do it,
but not with your beat. We need to use this.
Marlly SPADs the funk out. He lost it. Nah, noah,
we need to But then when I played this ship Mally,
that ship hot. So he I went to go with

(01:43:24):
some pizza and he looped it up. But when I
came back, he looped up the first two bars. I
was like, nah, six bars in there's an offbeat sneer.
We're like, boom, indumped the tape. I'm like, yo, we
need that. He mad as a motherfucker because now because
now he got to re sample it. And then after

(01:43:47):
he sampled it, dumping the tape again.

Speaker 3 (01:43:49):
This is pre digital verybody. Yeah, yes, sampled.

Speaker 6 (01:43:55):
Up again. And then you know he did that and.

Speaker 2 (01:44:01):
This is rocking, and I'm like, all right, put this
horn part in. He sampled it, you know, the he
stopped it. He like, Yo, that shit sound like some
public Enemy stuff. Man, we ain't trying to sound like them.
Them niggas want to be Juice Crew. I'm like, Marley,

(01:44:22):
this shit gonna drive the record right here. This is
the thing right here that's driving the record. That horn
right there is gonna make the world of difference, I
promise you.

Speaker 6 (01:44:31):
And then you know, he sampled.

Speaker 2 (01:44:33):
It in there and put it in there, and then
I was like, yo, can we get an eight or
eight on the one the boom? And then Marley said
watch this, watch this boom boom. He was like ah,
I'm like hell yeah and yeah. Then I went in
there and spent the vocals and the rest was his.

Speaker 1 (01:44:54):
God damn.

Speaker 2 (01:44:55):
Because the reason that's the reason why I start the
song off saying here I am l A W is
because I felt like, finally, here I am because I'm
a lot to you, not I was broken ship man.
Were just rhyme with a bit? Just rhyme with Biz?

Speaker 1 (01:45:10):
That's my next question, And let me ask you because
this has been like a lifelong debate for me. I'm
listening to just rhyming with Biz. Were y'all really rhyming
in the park or.

Speaker 3 (01:45:23):
That was in the studio?

Speaker 2 (01:45:24):
That?

Speaker 6 (01:45:26):
Okay, yeah, it was me Biz and freaking frack because
as I.

Speaker 1 (01:45:29):
Listened to it now, it still sounds like because the
rumor was that you did it in the park, and
like that was like.

Speaker 2 (01:45:34):
A no now because what it was was like the
studio Mic and Mally normally have with the little screen
thing in front of it.

Speaker 6 (01:45:43):
We was passing it around.

Speaker 3 (01:45:44):
Okay, that's the reason why I said it.

Speaker 2 (01:45:46):
It sounds like it was just me Biz and freaking
Frack from South Side Queens, the two girls from South
Side Queens, you know, the female rappers. You know, we
just was rhyming after I did a song song is
called something and Funky. It's it's also on the same
twelve inch that was the actual song, but then we
just rhymed. Afterwards Marley played the freestyle and people was

(01:46:08):
requesting that more than the actual song. Wow, it so
flying time, you know, put it on the twelve inch.

Speaker 3 (01:46:15):
Wow.

Speaker 6 (01:46:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:46:15):
Yeah, So let's let's take it a young gifted.

Speaker 2 (01:46:17):
In Black, Young Gifted in Black. I did a radio
promo with Marley Maul called Raw Attitude. It was me
and Antoinette because Antoinette had a song called I Got

(01:46:38):
Attitude and I had Raw So we did this radio
promo called Royal Attitude for for for bls and that's all.
It was just radio promo. But then Marley took the
beat and gave it to Shan. But you know, it
was like I didn't actually produce this one, this one.

(01:47:01):
Like I just gave Marley the sample and he put
it together and he just gave it to Sham, but
he didn't ask me, can Shan have it? So I
was like, yo, you owe me a beat tomorrow tomorrow.
I'm like, yo, you owe me a beat.

Speaker 6 (01:47:15):
Man.

Speaker 2 (01:47:15):
I'm not I didn't tell you to get the Shan
but no, honesty, I didn't really want it, you know
what I mean. But I mean I was like, you
owe me a beat. So Marley played this beat one day.
I was like, yo, I checked this joint out I
got for Shan and he played the ship and I'm

(01:47:38):
like that's just mean, and he, you know, stopped and
took it out. I took the fucking fire floppy disk
and hid that ship in like his R and B stash.
Real talk that guy. I made it in another stash.
And then you know, when the time came, it was like, yo,

(01:47:59):
you owe me a beat. I need something from you.
He was like, I he started, you got ready placed
some stuff. I was like, no, no, no, I already know
what I want. And I went right back to that
stash and pulled that disc out and I was like,
I want that. And when he popped it in and
so it was y'all been looking for this here ship, yo.
You know it's supposed to be for sharing. I was like, well,

(01:48:20):
you gave share my ship, and that's how that's how
I ended up with that beat, because the beat was
really for sharing.

Speaker 5 (01:48:27):
I said that with vinyl I couldn't afford, I would
stash it in another section of the violin come back
to it when.

Speaker 6 (01:48:32):
I exactly did you you know, you know.

Speaker 5 (01:48:35):
For the joints that you found samples and co produced,
did you get the credit?

Speaker 1 (01:48:39):
No?

Speaker 6 (01:48:40):
No, and let me let me let me just clear
that up.

Speaker 2 (01:48:44):
So there's no uh hate or any way that anybody
can try to, you know, kick dirt on Marley name
with the joint I'm talking about that I gave Mally
a beat and he put it together now with like

(01:49:04):
raw and Ain't a Half Stepping. These are songs that
I put together and Marley just did it on the
drum machine. But these are songs that I put together,
So I feel like I produced these songs. Get the credit, no,
but these are songs that I feel I produce. Now,

(01:49:25):
there have been many artists that brought beasts to Marley,
gave him the record, and then Marley put it together.
You bring someone a record, that's what we call in
the streets a good fine, a good fine fine. Yeah, yeah,
that's that's Craig digging terms. That's a good fine. So
that's a good fine. But if you give the record

(01:49:47):
of Marley and he you know, sample this part, sample
that part, put a kick snare to it, whatever, you know,
high hats on tambourines, whatever, he's producing the song.

Speaker 6 (01:49:57):
You just found a dope break record. That's all you did.

Speaker 2 (01:50:01):
But like songs like Raw ain't a half step and
these are joints.

Speaker 6 (01:50:09):
That you know, I pretty much did all.

Speaker 3 (01:50:11):
The structureing and you give it a black one.

Speaker 2 (01:50:14):
That's Molly Young gives him black is all Marley. Lean
on Me is all Molly you know, yeah, yeah, that's
all Mally. I'll take you there all Marley. Okay, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:50:25):
How about the Wrath of.

Speaker 6 (01:50:27):
K Rafter Kane. That would be mek.

Speaker 2 (01:50:29):
Yeah, that was that was a funny session to Marley
was pissed, but he didn't. He didn't.

Speaker 6 (01:50:40):
He was like, it's too far, it's too fast. Let
me slow it down.

Speaker 2 (01:50:43):
I'm like nah, I'm like nah, I ain't never go
this fast. I'm like, I never went this fast, Like
I need to take it to the next level. And
he was like, yo, only people gonna like this ship
is Puerto Ricans and break dances. I like it because

(01:51:09):
with Raffa Kine, it's like it had to be switched
around because the beat goes boom.

Speaker 6 (01:51:17):
We got get got got boom boom.

Speaker 2 (01:51:20):
Gat, So we had to catch the second part boom
get boom gat and make that first to make the
first part boom but gat gat make that second, so
it would be like boom gat boom gat boom but
got gatt. But they had to be switched around, you know,
not get that part, then get that part and then

(01:51:41):
switch play that one you know this first and then
that's you know what I'm saying. I had them to
do that, you know. But once again, you're that was
something that you know, our structured as well, because the
reason for that was because fly Tire couldn't get them
to release set it off as the second single. He
was trying to get Warner Brothers to put out at
that office a second single. They wouldn't do it. They

(01:52:02):
wanted to go and I'll take you there because now
since I was on Warner Brothers. Prince was willing to
clear the sample, so they wanted to go with that.

Speaker 6 (01:52:12):
Fly time. I couldn't get you set up.

Speaker 2 (01:52:13):
So since I knew that there was nothing I could do,
and I couldn't even convince them to do set it
off as the B side, I'm like, well, let's set up.
They was like one of us was like, no, just
in case we do a third single, we rather hold off.
So I just said fuck it. Then I just went
in the studio. I did a new song, which was
rafa king.

Speaker 3 (01:52:31):
But what made you pick that song to come out
to the Apollo with.

Speaker 2 (01:52:38):
They told me that they record mostly everything, and they
was like, you know, we record most of them. We
got a studio upstairs, so like when people be on stage,
we normally record, you know stuff, So we have a
whole lot of shows, concerts record the audio recorded.

Speaker 6 (01:52:53):
I'm like, okay, I want to I want to do that.

Speaker 2 (01:52:56):
Did you hear them?

Speaker 1 (01:52:57):
Did you hear it?

Speaker 6 (01:52:57):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:52:58):
Yeah, yeah, No, I don't gotta hit a ground. I
can hear my asthmetic ass you listen like that was
the first time I realized. I'm like, yeah, you gotta
get your breathing right.

Speaker 3 (01:53:12):
But that's how you know you're perfected.

Speaker 1 (01:53:13):
This none of us hear that, Oh we hears you
tearing that ship down and the crowd going crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:53:18):
But next time we listen to Rath, I'm shouting like
motherfucking dopad on it, you know what I'm saying on.

Speaker 3 (01:53:26):
The way here, and that it sounds so dope.

Speaker 1 (01:53:31):
I love I loved shows back then when you have
to buy hard tickets and things like that, do you
do you miss days like that? Hell yeah, because like
right now, like these people can like buy like online
not even show show up to your curency.

Speaker 2 (01:53:46):
Well, I mean it's not really the days of the tickets,
it's the days of.

Speaker 6 (01:53:51):
The appreciation.

Speaker 2 (01:53:53):
Uh.

Speaker 6 (01:53:54):
It's like.

Speaker 2 (01:53:57):
Nowadays, you know, you come on stage, if there's ten
thousand people in the audience, you're probably looking at seven
thousand cell phones.

Speaker 3 (01:54:09):
Oh yeah, I hate that they're like this.

Speaker 2 (01:54:11):
Yeah yeah, you know, it's like nobody's really enjoying.

Speaker 5 (01:54:17):
Appreciating the experience anymore. Yeah, it's something they're trying to
capture for later.

Speaker 3 (01:54:22):
Which yeah, yeah, that's that's kind of crazy. But you know,
let me just.

Speaker 1 (01:54:26):
Tell you how powerful your your stage presence is the
other day, you know, obviously I'm studying, you know, for
the interview, but I'm also just looking at on the
internet and I'm looking at your stage show, right, and
then I just go randomly and I'm looking at money
bags yo, and money bags Yo, Damn your same routine.

(01:54:50):
Like damn, they're like, you know, jumping around and I'm
looking and I'm like, he probably don't even know, you know,
like like his stage presence, like where he actually got
that from, like having dances interacting with them, And I
was just sitting there like damn, like that this form
of hip hop is still in, It's just in a
different thing.

Speaker 6 (01:55:10):
I gotta I gotta look him up now for me.

Speaker 2 (01:55:13):
But I would, honestly if that's what you saw, and
I would love to meet that brother. I would love
to like really just sit and build with him about,
you know, performance, just to tell him some of the
things that I've heard.

Speaker 1 (01:55:24):
But you know what's crazy. I used to go to
the road with Oconnelly. Ocannella used to stop and he
used to do like these girls with bananas and that
he had he had his version of scoop and scratch
no no, no death serious because he had put in your
mouth so he had to make that one song stretched
you understand I'm saying soul. And then I was sitting
there and I'd be like and he'd be like, man,

(01:55:45):
I got this stage presidence from Kine And I'd be like,
did you did you know like a lot of people
like Bay State stage presidence on how entertainment he was
on and you are on stage.

Speaker 2 (01:55:58):
No, I didn't know that.

Speaker 6 (01:56:00):
I mean, I think it's beautiful.

Speaker 2 (01:56:03):
You know. I remember when me and you had the
conversation in London about performing down again, you know, But
I mean it's like I think it's I think I
think it's a blessing because.

Speaker 6 (01:56:18):
That's something that's been important to me.

Speaker 2 (01:56:20):
You know. I saw Bizz perform and do what he
do and I was like, yo, he's rocking the crowds.
But it's like I didn't want to do the funny stuff,
you know. I'm like, Okay, what's my niche? What's it
gonna be? And I learned my niche from Dougie Fresh.
It was like doug came to see my show and

(01:56:42):
he was like, no, I'm gonna watch it from the crowd,
And he watched it from the crowd and we came
backstage It's like everybody's like, yo, you tore that ship down, Yo,
you bodied it or you just say body then, but
whatever the word slang was in like eighty seven, you know,
He's like, yo, this and that.

Speaker 3 (01:56:57):
What did dog say?

Speaker 2 (01:56:58):
Dog? Well, you know in his fucking high pitch boys,
you know, why are.

Speaker 1 (01:57:03):
You Everyone's telling dogs like man?

Speaker 2 (01:57:20):
And I mean I'm like looking at him, like, oh,
you fucking old school hater. But then he goes, yo,
what you're doing, won't you come back to the crib,
let's be So we go back to his crib and
he popping these videos Earth Winning Fire, Michael Jackson, Pink Floyd,

(01:57:46):
and he's showing me this stuff and he's like, yo,
you see what they're doing. He's like, this is what
I learned from Because everybody else is studying Run DMC
and Flashing the Furious five and Odini, I'm studying what's
never been done in hip hop before and introducing it
for the first time.

Speaker 6 (01:58:06):
Wow, And I'm like m hm.

Speaker 2 (01:58:09):
So that next morning I woke up, went straight to
Tower Video and bought VHS's of James Brown, Barry White,
and Marvin K and started studying those. I mean, fine,
like like like fine, fine to like yeah everything you

(01:58:32):
know from Barry White taking his pocket square, wiping his
sweat out us on his face.

Speaker 1 (01:58:36):
Where do you get that routine when you dropped the
mic and then you pick it back up?

Speaker 3 (01:58:42):
What is it with the.

Speaker 2 (01:58:44):
Drop drop ship make it? Look?

Speaker 3 (01:58:47):
What did you get?

Speaker 1 (01:58:48):
Because like, I know what's coming, Like it's like a magician,
like you know the trick is coming, but I still
get caught.

Speaker 3 (01:58:56):
I'm looking like he's.

Speaker 1 (01:58:56):
Gonna do it, He's gonna do it, and you're still
not still.

Speaker 2 (01:58:58):
Amazed, Like well, you know, that was something we used
to do before internet days, so okay, nobody really knew,
you know, but then once you know, it became you know,
like you know, I started trending so crazy. I just
stopped doing it in the show. But yeah, we used
to do that a lot back then. This is like
early two thousands, you know, before you know, Internet was

(01:59:21):
real crazy, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (01:59:22):
But how did you come up with that? Like did
you the mike actually drop out of that?

Speaker 2 (01:59:26):
No? No, no, no, no, no, I was it was like
it was a rhyme that I wrote and uh, matter
of fact, now I ain't gonna put dude, on blast.

Speaker 6 (01:59:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:59:41):
Somebody had told me that you know that that that
the rhyme, that I could have spit something harder, you know,
and I was just like, you know, like yeah, motherfucker,
and I started staying it on stage and it was
coming off on stage, you know, and then I was like,

(02:00:02):
I got an idea, this one. I got an idea.

Speaker 1 (02:00:04):
So I just you talking to this one person in
your mind. You're saying, you talking to this one person.

Speaker 6 (02:00:09):
Like like now. It was like, you know, like day
day day.

Speaker 2 (02:00:11):
They told me the rhyme was hard enough, and I
started sage's killing them. And then I'm like, you know
what I got said the idea. So I just then
I added those bars in the front of the round,
those those in the front where I dropped the mic,
and then I started to ride, you know, and it
started killing every night.

Speaker 6 (02:00:27):
It was just something I just came up with.

Speaker 1 (02:00:29):
Goddamn it. We have we have comedians on here all
the time. Before and then we'll come back to this,
uh lean on me and we'll come back to that.
But we have comedians on here all the time. Comedians
say that had they had these material uh that they
that they made back then, now they might not be

(02:00:51):
successful comedians. Is there any lyrics that you think though
from back then that you can.

Speaker 3 (02:00:56):
That wouldn't survive survive nowadays?

Speaker 2 (02:01:00):
Did you think, yeah, what's the work's going to mine?
I'll take you there? I mean I think that the
song was you know, what I was talking about was,
you know, a beautiful spiritual message. But I don't now,

(02:01:24):
I don't think it would have stood. I don't think
it stood the test of time. Okay, lyrically, I don't
think it stood the testa time.

Speaker 3 (02:01:29):
You don't think it aged?

Speaker 2 (02:01:30):
Well, nah, no, I'll take you there. Definitely be one
of those songs I don't think. Yeah, yeah, definitely, I'll
take you there.

Speaker 3 (02:01:40):
How about this one? You're ready for one?

Speaker 1 (02:01:43):
Ready you take them eight to eighty?

Speaker 2 (02:01:48):
Yeah? Yeah, yeah, like right now, Yeah, I just said
that ship this year I had register.

Speaker 6 (02:02:01):
Ebody moving neighborhood.

Speaker 2 (02:02:05):
Yeah yeah, that would have went you know.

Speaker 1 (02:02:06):
That's yeah, that was the that was the same.

Speaker 6 (02:02:12):
But yeah now yeah yeah that ship.

Speaker 1 (02:02:15):
Well also a great a great song with nicest move
peppering ain't easy. That's still like around like people still
say it, say it.

Speaker 3 (02:02:25):
How did that record come about?

Speaker 6 (02:02:27):
Just one night in the studio.

Speaker 2 (02:02:31):
I forgot what we was recording that day, but Nice
and Smooth came through and we just decided, let's do
a song. Wow and did that? No? I did that?

Speaker 1 (02:02:42):
Okay, Wow, that's right. I forgot you.

Speaker 2 (02:02:44):
Well I did it and had to beat rocking.

Speaker 6 (02:02:51):
And then Prince Paul he was there too.

Speaker 2 (02:02:54):
He said, yo, let me put some drums up under it,
and he put the Mary Mary drums up on of
it and then basically kicked me out the control room
and took over the whole goddamn over fucking session.

Speaker 6 (02:03:10):
Here what you have up him?

Speaker 2 (02:03:20):
I'm a rap artist.

Speaker 3 (02:03:22):
Are you the cops that.

Speaker 5 (02:03:28):
We might have talked about it last time you were here,
But let's refresher Hollywood Burn Burn, Hollywood Burn with a
Public Enemy and ice Cube talk about that record.

Speaker 2 (02:03:39):
Well, I mean when I got the call from Chuck,
I was like ecstatic, you know, because I mean a
big Public Enemy fan. And you know, he sat there
and broke it down while he was envisioned, and I
thought it was a dope concept. I'm like, yeah, I
see it, I see it.

Speaker 6 (02:03:58):
I love it.

Speaker 2 (02:03:59):
And then at the end then he adds on, yeah,
ice Cube gonna be on the tool and I'm.

Speaker 3 (02:04:04):
Like, oh, you didn't know that.

Speaker 6 (02:04:05):
No, no, no, no.

Speaker 2 (02:04:07):
He ain't telling me that the end of the conversation, right,
He told me that at the end of the conversation.
So I was like, you know, yeah, So, I mean
I really wanted to like really come through because Chuck
was somebody that I really admired, looked up to because
of what he represented in hip hop. Right, you know,

(02:04:27):
the type of figure he is, you know, He's someone
that I've always admired, respected and looked up to. So
I was like, I'm honored to be on a song
with you, right, you know, and I wanted to be right.

Speaker 1 (02:04:39):
So you wrote your verse before knowing ice Cube was
on there?

Speaker 2 (02:04:42):
No, no, no, no no, he told me at the end
of the conversation, so I knew he was going to
be on it.

Speaker 5 (02:04:47):
And Chuck told us that that song is what kind
of ushered you know, qes leaving n w A and
working with the Bomb Squad and was a part of
that whole like transition.

Speaker 2 (02:04:59):
I didn't know that.

Speaker 6 (02:05:00):
Okay, beautiful, Speaking.

Speaker 1 (02:05:01):
Of that, do you do you write your rhymes different
when you know someone else is on the record or
is it?

Speaker 2 (02:05:06):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (02:05:07):
Okay, yeah, Okay, if I if I know.

Speaker 2 (02:05:13):
That someone like real lyrical on a joint.

Speaker 6 (02:05:17):
Matter of fact, I tell you a funny story.

Speaker 1 (02:05:19):
Let's go.

Speaker 6 (02:05:22):
I did a song with Game Game. Uh.

Speaker 2 (02:05:27):
I can't remember the name of the song, and I
know the chorus is like KRS spits like you know,
the game spit like the Daddy can't spit. I can't
remember the name of the song. But anyway, when we
did it. Now, I had did a song with with
KRS called it was a tony touches Me KRS and

(02:05:51):
g RAT, I think so. But yeah, we me, KRS
and Givat we did a song and me and he wrapped.
We came in there on our ship and KRS came
in there, you know, as the teacher, right, and we
just did a show together, and you know, he was

(02:06:14):
in his teacher mode, you know, you know, so this
night at the studio, I'm like, okay, me Game, KRS.
You know, okay, Los.

Speaker 1 (02:06:28):
Angeles in l A oh wow, Yeah, I just Lucky
Man Game in Heavy.

Speaker 2 (02:06:33):
And Heavy d rest in Pieces just did the show
the House of Blues, Wow, and they all asked us
to come through the game you know, his.

Speaker 3 (02:06:40):
People, his game session.

Speaker 1 (02:06:42):
He invites his game You Cares and Heavy d Heavy.

Speaker 2 (02:06:46):
He invited me and KRS and Dougie Fresh game like
Doug beatboxes at the end History History didn't that's history.

Speaker 3 (02:06:55):
That's a dope track.

Speaker 2 (02:06:57):
Wow. So you know, in my mind frame, I'm like,
you know, ship, I'd have been drinking half drunk. I'm like,
but I got some old ship. I got some old
ship that a tear them apart. I ain't even trapping.

(02:07:18):
And I get there and then kr Rest goes in
there and Rhyme's first, and I forgot what he said
something about about remember that song Chicken Noodle Soup. That's
how your head gonna look on the back of your coop.

Speaker 6 (02:07:37):
And he was he was sitting on.

Speaker 2 (02:07:40):
Yeah, he said something about about something about some about
something about pussy you eat around the bush, and then yeah,
it was it was like and then like I just
got up and I grabbed my wife and I'm like,
you know, going there and make me a cup of coffee.

(02:08:01):
You know, I need some coffee. I gotta wake the
funk up. And she was like, what's wrong, what's wrong?
The teacher's not here, Blastmaster. I was like, the teacher's
not like Chris ain't playing shipped to get Yeah, for real, that's.

Speaker 1 (02:08:27):
The one time you have to be righteous.

Speaker 2 (02:08:30):
No, well, no, I never. I didn't write anything. I
was about to say some old ship. I never. You know,
he ain't playing Oh god, damn kings around. I can't
remember the lad.

Speaker 1 (02:08:46):
He's about.

Speaker 5 (02:08:49):
You do you think in terms of like the way
that hip hop the trajectory, people are saying that it's
become a commodity for industry and the cultural aspect, which
is graffiti, the dancing and the break dancers of B
boys and be girls, the dj mcs has been dissected,
taking apart.

Speaker 3 (02:09:10):
Do you feel that that's true or not true?

Speaker 2 (02:09:12):
Yeah? But I mean you know what you expect, man,
I mean, I mean that happened with rock and roll,
that happened with jazz.

Speaker 5 (02:09:21):
You know, you don't think it's avoidable for hip hop,
that it can come back.

Speaker 2 (02:09:25):
To what it was not not unless we take control
of hip hop. And when I say we, I don't
mean the artists. I mean y'all motherfuckers, you know, and
and uh like the Kevin Lyles and you know those
type of cats you know say like Okay, look I
want this. But I also want this, you know, I

(02:09:49):
want to talk about this, but I also want to
talk about.

Speaker 6 (02:09:51):
That, right, you know, And it's like.

Speaker 2 (02:09:57):
Showcasing the lyrical artists, showcasing showcasing the conscious artists, you know,
and making it where you know, everybody guess that same
equal type of play. Because I mean, you got to
think about it. You know, conscious hip hop was the
forefront back then. N w A didn't really get no

(02:10:21):
radio play. Luke didn't get no radio play. Ghetto boys
g Rapped didn't getting no radio play, you know, because
of the violence or the sexual content that was mentioned
in the lyrics.

Speaker 6 (02:10:38):
You know, conscious hip hop was the forefront.

Speaker 2 (02:10:43):
But they still went platinum, double platinum, you know what
I'm saying because people love them.

Speaker 3 (02:10:50):
Who are you talking about? No, no, no, We're just talking
about culturally.

Speaker 5 (02:10:55):
Like remember we talked about what specially about the industry
making hip hop and rap music specifically the commodity and
the culture dissected into.

Speaker 6 (02:11:04):
But I mean, you know, it's you got to understand.

Speaker 2 (02:11:06):
It's like, you know, from a business aspect, it's all
about what's going to generate money, and that's the only
thing they going to think about. Corporation is only going
to think about what's going to generate money, and once
something becomes commercial, what happens is quality goes out and
quantity comes in. Right, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (02:11:28):
Well, what's different I think for what you're saying and
for hip hop specifically with the elements, is that the
music was the first thing that they were easily able
to make money off of. But the other elements found
their way in terms of the art figuring out ways
to make money. Now, breakdances going into the Olympics, they
figured out to make money, and those elements internationally are

(02:11:51):
just as big as the music itself.

Speaker 6 (02:11:53):
Yeah, so it's.

Speaker 3 (02:11:55):
Just maybe maybe hip hop could be different.

Speaker 6 (02:11:58):
Well, I mean it's like.

Speaker 2 (02:12:04):
Graffiti found its way into art, right, not elevating as
hip hop? Right, Right, they found its way into art,
break dancing found its way into the Olympics, right, you know,
not elevating as hip hop. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (02:12:24):
I said it earlier.

Speaker 1 (02:12:25):
I think I said this, they brung Big to your crib,
But it was the rumor that Jazzo brong jay Z
to your crib.

Speaker 2 (02:12:32):
No, no, no, okay, Shirt Kings and queens.

Speaker 3 (02:12:38):
Yea queens, we always something.

Speaker 1 (02:12:42):
Bug around Queens Brome give it up because because the
rumor was that you were supposed to sign jay Z.
At one point it was that just a room. Can
you straighten that out?

Speaker 2 (02:12:59):
No, no, no, What it was was Shirt Kings asked me
to do a mixtape with Jazz, which.

Speaker 6 (02:13:13):
I came.

Speaker 2 (02:13:15):
I met with them, and then Jazz said, can my
man rhyme on the tape? I say cool. So we
did the mixtape, me Jazz and jay Z and then
on a ride back home, Nike from the Shirt King says, Yo, really,
we wanted you to do this because we're trying to
get Jazz a new deal and we was wondering if

(02:13:37):
you'd be willing to work with him to get a
new deal, okay, And I was like, honestly, I kind
of liked the light skinned motherfucker better. It's impossible I
could work with him. And then that's how me and
jay Z got connected.

Speaker 1 (02:13:55):
Oh, because you didn't know Jazz, I thought y'all was
like from the same neighborhood as No.

Speaker 2 (02:13:59):
Jazz was somebody that ship back then. Jazz was somebody
I was like extremely jealous of. Jazz was the hottest
unsigned artist in Brooklyn, Like no Jazz was so popular
in Brooklyn. Like I had battled a lot of people.
My name was buzzing, but it wasn't like Jazz. It

(02:14:19):
was like it was like fat boys in Houdini Jazz.
Oh big Gotty knew you know what I'm saying, Like yeah,
you know, so it was like, yeah, he was like popular,
like a like a signed artist my battle and I
always wanted to battle this dude but could never find him.

(02:14:41):
I even went to Marcy and battled some other dude
because Jazz wasn't around. But I mean, yeah, I was like,
you know, like I want to battle. So when they
said that about it, you know, it's like I got
records out and stuff. But I mean it was like
I'm thinking in that mind frame, you know. But then

(02:15:01):
when they said this, it was like yeah, I mean
it was great, you know, meeting Jazz and he did
that fast rapping ship that night. You know, the first
time I heard that ship, you know, and I was like, Yo,
dude is dope. You know, I'm like, but yo, that
that other dude. He just reminded me of me with
his slick ass tongue. I like to work with the
light skin dude. And then that was jay Z and

(02:15:22):
then we started working together.

Speaker 1 (02:15:24):
I want to touch on something you said earlier, because
you said a mixtape. When you say a mixtape, I
want these people to understand what you mean meant by
a mixtape when you said.

Speaker 2 (02:15:32):
Well what with the French Gordon had the tape with
a bunch of songs on it, but he had a
freestyle on it. You know, it's like you know song yeah, yeah, right,
and it was a freestyle with me Jazz and jay Z. Wow.
That was on you know tape with a whole bunch
of other artists, you know, music mixed together. But anyway, though,

(02:15:52):
you know I started working with jay Z. I started
taking him in the studio and recording songs on him
and trying to get him signed.

Speaker 6 (02:16:00):
And you know, we we went to many different labels.

Speaker 1 (02:16:04):
I need you to lay in one label that eight
Day Heart Outs. Who did he bring the front on?

Speaker 6 (02:16:09):
Jay Z Giant Records?

Speaker 1 (02:16:11):
They go Deaf Jam.

Speaker 2 (02:16:15):
Jamad Giant Records, Death Jam, Warner.

Speaker 6 (02:16:18):
Brothers, Warner Brothers, You're fucked up when I'm on.

Speaker 3 (02:16:24):
Wild Wow.

Speaker 2 (02:16:26):
But yeah yeah they turned it down. Yeah, But I
mean and then like when I when I went on
the road with Patty LaBelle. I. I saw that Patty
was doing outfit changes. Like I'm sitting here talking, I'm like, Yo,
they have the same ship, Patty. Patty didn't have red
on just a minute. Yeah yeah, that's about the third

(02:16:50):
time I'm sitting there. So now I'm paying attention. So
when her tour ended and I went back on my tour,
I'm like, I called jay Z and I called Positive Care.
I'm like, yeah, I need you to come on the
road with me.

Speaker 6 (02:17:02):
I'm gonna bring you out out in the.

Speaker 2 (02:17:04):
Year year I can.

Speaker 1 (02:17:07):
I got him? Man, what your man got to do
with me?

Speaker 5 (02:17:11):
K holy that that famous recording, that's what jay Z
comes out, No, Biggie comes out also, right, jay Z
comes out shy oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:17:21):
In Madison Garden I think it was the ninety three
I believe. Yeah big it asked mister C can he
come to the show with the Garden and and say, yo,
can I come? And can I bring Tupac because Park
was in New York and you know, see he asked me,

(02:17:43):
and I was like, yeah, yeah, absolutely, yeah, bring him
on throat so big, but pop through and at the
end of the.

Speaker 1 (02:17:51):
Show, that's your show, show, Okay, that's right, the famous biggie.

Speaker 6 (02:17:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (02:17:57):
Yeah, totally forgot that down here on vinyl tape.

Speaker 3 (02:18:01):
Masters pressed it up and I got it on vinyl.

Speaker 2 (02:18:04):
Oh. But I was a super fest, I believe, nineteen
ninety three, and you know, near the near the end
of the show, I brought them all up on stage,
Big Pie, uh shah, heem yeah he was there to yea,
yeah shah. He was on tour with me, like his label,
his label, his label sent them. He was there too, No, No.

Speaker 3 (02:18:26):
Was because not Jaz's not on one of the recordings.

Speaker 6 (02:18:29):
No, he's not on that, not on that one.

Speaker 3 (02:18:31):
Maybe he's on that vinyl, just on something else.

Speaker 2 (02:18:33):
Jay Jay, I think you're talking about my birthday party
in ninety one.

Speaker 6 (02:18:37):
Okay, that's probably what you're talking about.

Speaker 2 (02:18:39):
But yeah, with that one, it was just me, Shaheim,
Big Jay and School School. Yeah, and in Fat Joe
was there too, right, yeah, yeah, because other night with yeah,
because Joe was called supposed to go next. Joe's supposed
to go next, and then they were on the side

(02:19:00):
of the stage. Let me know, you got five minutes
left and I still hadn't done half stepping off woman up.
Oh god, Yeah, So I couldn't let Joe on, and
I had to, like I can't, man, you know that? Yeah,
and now because I mean it's like, you know, I
know that feeling because like you know, I was where

(02:19:20):
Joe was.

Speaker 6 (02:19:21):
I was there like a year before.

Speaker 2 (02:19:23):
You know what I'm saying with Bobby Brown, you know,
brought me on and let me rob you know, So,
I mean I really wanted to bring Joe on, but
we we only had five minutes left and I still
hadn't done half stepping off.

Speaker 1 (02:19:34):
Woman up, did you ever think that Tupac and Big
they camarbority they had at that time whatever end up
where they was at, especially that night, did you see
like you know what I.

Speaker 2 (02:19:45):
Mean successfully or return into the essence what you mean?

Speaker 1 (02:19:50):
I meant like you know that having beat because at
the time you look at that, you look at they look.

Speaker 2 (02:19:57):
Like no, no, these standing next to each otherl you know,
puff and weed and you know and yeah, and you.

Speaker 1 (02:20:07):
Just said Big Bung Tupac that you just said that,
So you didn't even invite Poky Big and Big Bung Tupac.

Speaker 6 (02:20:15):
Yeah exactly, that's crazy.

Speaker 1 (02:20:18):
And you and you you saw the the chemistry you
saw that they.

Speaker 2 (02:20:21):
Were they was cool they were. They're like like they
looked like you know, like I saw them, like, you know,
probably doing a whole bunch of songs together and all
types of ship. The way they looked at night. Yeah,
I saw an amazing chemistry.

Speaker 1 (02:20:36):
So what did you think when when when when this
beef did transfer?

Speaker 3 (02:20:41):
Did you liken this guy, this can't.

Speaker 2 (02:20:43):
Be I mean it really hurt, man, because you know
it's like I I saw the ll coumo d beef
and then they would be in front of each other,
shaking hands, laughing. Yeah, you know, say some sarcastic shit
back and forth to one another, but it was all.

Speaker 3 (02:21:05):
Love, almost like a sport.

Speaker 2 (02:21:06):
Yeah. I've seen, you know, with Shannon care Rests in
the same room, and you know it wasn't you know,
no drama, you know what I'm saying. And then like
to understand that like you know, cold crush, fantastic five,
like these dudes battling for a thousand dollars, you know

(02:21:32):
what I'm saying, and the thousand dollars go to the
winner the other motherfuckers broke and then a thousand dollars
how you split that against six members? You know, and
it's like you know, like that's what hip hop is
to me, that right there where you know, six dudes

(02:21:54):
can battle another six dudes to spit, I mean to
split one thousand dollars right and then go home satisfied.
And look at that at wob Loss, it's like we
need to write some new ship and that's the end
of it. You know, to see that this can escalate
into something like that, you know, it was just sad
to see. Man, it was sad to see.

Speaker 1 (02:22:17):
How was it traveling to l A at that time
for for you? Like you know, I mean I remember
somewhere around that period we had no choice, like when
we flaned into la like the record labels had security
around us, like we had no choice. How was it
for you after that time period?

Speaker 2 (02:22:35):
No problems? I mean, you know that ship. Nobody was
looking at me like that like I never had no issue.
I mean, I think that was more or less a
bad boy death crew against crew. You know.

Speaker 6 (02:22:56):
Now there was summer y'all that.

Speaker 2 (02:23:00):
You know, it shipped me a trinkle down on because
it's like, okay, you you know, I think there was
some ship with NAS and you know, you know, with
your affiliation with nods.

Speaker 6 (02:23:14):
Yeah, you know, what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (02:23:15):
You know, so it could, you know, but with me,
it was like I wasn't affiliated with none of that ship.

Speaker 1 (02:23:22):
Didn't Eric be try to sign you to death Row
East at one point?

Speaker 2 (02:23:25):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (02:23:25):
Okay, how did that? What happened with that?

Speaker 6 (02:23:30):
He called.

Speaker 2 (02:23:32):
And said, Yo, still trying to you know, build a
death Row East man, and you know, I think it
might be a good look for you. And you know,
he ready to cut a check. Yeah, you're willing to
meet with him? I'm like yeah. So I went out there.
You know, we had a meeting and then he was like, Yo,

(02:23:56):
we're going to Vegas tomorrow. You on the roll yet?
So I went to Vegas with them for a tyson
fight and then you know we out there. No, not
the one that Pop got, This was the one right
before it. No, no, no, no, no, no, this one
before before that one. But we went and then you know,

(02:24:19):
Sugar was talking about working with death Row artists. I'm
like yeah, And then part came over and he was like,
you know, like, yo, I love the work we cane
and he was like, well, Ship, let's stop talking about it.
Let's make it happen. So we leave Vegas and we
just got there. We leave Vegas and go back to

(02:24:40):
take a flight back to l A that night and
go to Death Row to the studios to do the deal.
No to to record to record. Okay, So me and
Park went in the studio and did a song together.
And then the them, the little dudes, Yeah.

Speaker 6 (02:25:03):
They came as soon as we got it.

Speaker 2 (02:25:04):
They came up the park talking about you old Lauren,
He'll dish you mob deep dishoe that, this and that,
and so then Park went in the studio and started
writing some ship about I think it might have been that.

Speaker 6 (02:25:15):
I think it was. Yeah, he started he started writing
that ship.

Speaker 2 (02:25:23):
While he was in there writing that ship, I I
wrote a song for Hammer. Hamm was on death for
I wrote a song for Hammer. And then then they
was like yo, Sugar, Sugar, ready to meet with you.
And we sat and we had a meeting, and like

(02:25:46):
when I walked in, these two big ass rock willers
came around.

Speaker 4 (02:25:50):
The dogs there they come running around, sniffing around me
and stuff, you know, and then Sugar, you know, he
comes out the back, sits down with a cigar, sits
a cigar down and does this, and both the dogs
ran and sat down next to him.

Speaker 6 (02:26:08):
So I'm like, okay, this one of the meetings.

Speaker 5 (02:26:14):
You know, I don't I never my picture.

Speaker 6 (02:26:21):
And then we talked and.

Speaker 2 (02:26:26):
Uh he said, well what you want and you know,
keep in mind, you know this is back then, you know.
So I'm like and I'm not. I'm not sure where
his head is at and how relevant he see me?
So the play is safe. I'm like, well, listen, man,
why don't we just do a one album deal with
a one year option, right and you know, say like

(02:26:54):
a four hundred thousand advents. He's like, that's an odd number,
while you just simply say five hundred thousand, Like, well
the five hundred thousand of this, and man, you big
daddy came, Man, I can't see myself, you know, signing
you for less than a million. I got to give

(02:27:15):
you a million.

Speaker 1 (02:27:15):
Wow.

Speaker 6 (02:27:16):
He because you're already a household name.

Speaker 2 (02:27:18):
That's why.

Speaker 6 (02:27:20):
And then he said something that was so appealing.

Speaker 2 (02:27:24):
He said, because you see Pop, you know, Pop became
a household name. Snoop became a household name. And that's
what I be trying to tell the Dog Pound. They
got to, you know, make themselves a house household name,
but they didn't want to identify, you know, as individuals.
They just want to keep scro dog pound and that's
why the motherfucker's only sold two million, and I'm like,

(02:27:47):
two million is low number. I'm like, my man, you
know that was appealing to me. He said that, but
then he was like, well, yo, look, I don't know
how you doing financially, but you know, if you want,
you know, I can, you know, you know probably, you know,
you know, just just get your hundred k in the morning.
That's when I knew was tign to go. I was like,

(02:28:09):
you're just gonna give me a hundred thousand.

Speaker 3 (02:28:12):
Nah, I don't know contract I owe.

Speaker 2 (02:28:15):
Someone a hundred thousand with no agreement. I was like,
I'll let you know tomorrow. And then I went and
switched my flight to like a six a m joint,
got the fuck up out of La hit Eric and
was like, you know, yeah, nah, I'm good man. I'm
gonna chill man. But it wasn't that like physical respect,

(02:28:41):
no showed mad love. It was just that didel Yeah.
It's like, that's not I don't you know what I'm saying.
It's like, you're to me, that's like the start of debt.
And it just wasn't a good I didn't feel it.

Speaker 1 (02:28:54):
It's almost like the guy checking into jail and the
fires a box of new Ports on his on his bed.
I'm like, where the fuck did this come from? Like
you know that like this ain't free. There's something to
be paid back. Taking that exactly exactly.

Speaker 3 (02:29:10):
I understand you. Yeah, so what was the beef for you? A?

Speaker 1 (02:29:15):
Shan?

Speaker 2 (02:29:17):
The beef?

Speaker 6 (02:29:19):
Honestly, I don't know what it was.

Speaker 2 (02:29:25):
I guess when I got down, you know, well, I
mean a quote according to Shan, it was like he
said that that's what that's what they thing was like,
you know, you're the new member.

Speaker 6 (02:29:37):
You gotta pay dues, Yeah, you gotta pay dues.

Speaker 2 (02:29:41):
Wow. But you know it's like when I got down
with Biz, it wasn't that type of thing, you know
what I'm saying. It wasn't like you know, like you know,
saying like ship or asking me to carry his bags
and ship like that. You know. So when I got
down and like you know, Shan kept referring to me
as the you know, I just felt like, okay, dude

(02:30:03):
got something against me. And you know, you know, I
try to, you know, just just keep my distance. But
I remember one time, and I think it was in Virginia.
Showed Fat Boys and Salt and Pepper, and you know,
he was doing a little he was getting real extra

(02:30:26):
with it, and you know, I said something to Biz
about it, and you know, Biz told me to chill
what I'm doing. So I just, you know, I just
try to keep my distance. You know. It's like all right,
you know, And I was like, all, let me just
stay away from dude, you know, you know, And that's
the way I just tried to handle it. But then

(02:30:47):
we eventually got cool, you know, like it was me
and him. We was living on the same block and
g Rapp was living in the condo right behind Highborhood.

Speaker 3 (02:30:59):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:31:00):
Yeah, so we ended up getting cool. And I'm in
his condo, he and my condo. You know that type
of thing, you know. Yeah, like you know, yeah, I
mean I love sham Man. I love Shaping. It's like,
you know, once I got to know him, I know that, Okay, Yeah, he.

Speaker 3 (02:31:17):
Just the personality.

Speaker 2 (02:31:18):
Yeah, he just like to argue and you know, you
know that's his thing, you know. Yeah, and you know, yeah,
I love sham So.

Speaker 1 (02:31:28):
Is the symphony the greatest hip hop posse cut.

Speaker 3 (02:31:31):
Of all time.

Speaker 6 (02:31:34):
I think so, I think so.

Speaker 2 (02:31:36):
I mean, uh, the only reason I say that is because.

Speaker 6 (02:31:45):
When I think of like my favorites, what is your favorite?

Speaker 1 (02:31:49):
Like head banger, Okay, so that's the Vegas head banger.

Speaker 2 (02:32:00):
With depth guard though, right banger saying what's the jay
Z joint? You mean him and her? Is that name
of it? You meant him and her? Yeah, Like, when
I think about it, it's like the reason why we'll
go with the symphony is because I think that everybody

(02:32:21):
on there spit fire.

Speaker 3 (02:32:22):
Yes, I believe.

Speaker 2 (02:32:23):
So, you know, I think there's a lot of great
posse joint. What's what's the nods joint?

Speaker 4 (02:32:28):
Live the barbecue, But that's more of an extra P joint.

Speaker 1 (02:32:34):
That's but that's a puzzy cuts. But you said the
nas joint. I want to give it.

Speaker 2 (02:32:38):
I mean, I mean, I mean, oh yeah, no no.

Speaker 5 (02:32:40):
But he's saying, like, it's how a lot of people
discovered that you're absolutely right, is a good cut? Yeah, yes, yeah, there's.

Speaker 2 (02:32:56):
A lot of them. But it's like, man.

Speaker 3 (02:33:00):
From scenario scenario, I think scenario.

Speaker 1 (02:33:03):
Scenarios number two. I think scenario's number one, Scenarios number two.

Speaker 2 (02:33:08):
See I see with me It's like I would probably
go symphony headbangers, and then you meet him and her.

Speaker 3 (02:33:23):
I forget what that one is.

Speaker 2 (02:33:25):
That's jay Z, bleak beans and what was the girl name?

Speaker 3 (02:33:29):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (02:33:31):
Okay?

Speaker 3 (02:33:32):
I yeah, yeah, I don't know. I wouldn't put that
up there.

Speaker 1 (02:33:34):
Yeah, I don't got that up there. I got reservrat
dogs with jay Z and locks and beans in them.
I got that up there. More reservoir dogs.

Speaker 2 (02:33:43):
I love that.

Speaker 3 (02:33:44):
You me, I got Shatcha.

Speaker 5 (02:33:46):
Yeah, I would even I know, I know this is
not it wouldn't be considered a positive because they're a group,
but they are individuals.

Speaker 3 (02:33:54):
It's protecting neck. No, I can't put that as a
post come looking back at it now as their individuals
as hell.

Speaker 1 (02:34:03):
You know, I didn't realize how out of line I
was by rhyming on the symphony until I've seen Tyler
Qually the other day. He did it, and I wanted
to call him and say, don't you.

Speaker 3 (02:34:11):
Ever do that again?

Speaker 2 (02:34:14):
No, No, I think that Tyler lib versus Dopey.

Speaker 1 (02:34:20):
None of us can. None of us can recreate that moment.
Got that record alone, all of us lead a symphony alone.

Speaker 2 (02:34:26):
No, no, no, But I think I Honestly, I thought
that it was just great to just see that type
of vibe, you know, because I mean it's like, you know,
you got to think from a musician standpoint, right, you know,
it's like there's a lot of stuff that you look
at his classics, but like tell the truth, man, you

(02:34:51):
like say say say Michael Jackson, Paul McCartney. You wouldn't
have been mad at print doing Paul McCartney focus with
you at all. You know what I'm saying. It's like,
you know, it's it's like, you know, sometimes it's just
something it's just a little a little different. You know,

(02:35:11):
it's the original and that's a variation of it, you know.

Speaker 6 (02:35:16):
But yeah, it's it's good to just you know, think.

Speaker 2 (02:35:19):
Out the box and try something different sometimes. Man.

Speaker 3 (02:35:22):
So you my bad fad changing up.

Speaker 1 (02:35:26):
But you recently just performed the queens Bridge Yeah, and
you how was that?

Speaker 2 (02:35:32):
I mean it was it was like I had g
Wrap come into Lincoln Center. That was dope, And he's
told me that he had a show in Queen's Bridge.

Speaker 3 (02:35:40):
He brong you out. I thought you brung him out.

Speaker 2 (02:35:41):
No, no, no, it was wrapped folks show. And he told
me he had to join Queen's Bridge, and I was
like when I'm like, well, I'm here in New York.
I mean, I'm like, you need me, and he was
like hell yeah, I'm like all right, cool. And I
was like, we'll shoot me your email and I'll I'll
send you an instrumental of the symphony because he said
he said he only had a version, you know, Josh

(02:36:03):
edited version just for his verse. Oh, so I was like,
I'll send you a version, you know, for both of us, okay,
And then he was like you know, and I was like,
I was like, you need me to do something else.
He was like yeah yeah. I was like all right, well,
I'll send you the symphony joint and I sent woman
up and then you know, I came, you know, rock
with him.

Speaker 1 (02:36:23):
God damn, I don't know.

Speaker 3 (02:36:28):
I think the tragedy. And he said that he came to.

Speaker 1 (02:36:30):
See you, I believe, and when you was in Queensborgs
or something like that, or he came to see you perform.
But so they didn't announce your name, no, no, oh,
well he was a surprise.

Speaker 2 (02:36:39):
Yeah. I was a surprised guest because this was g
rap show, you know, I mean, it's like, you know,
she rapped that man that that may be my favorite
MC man. I mean, he's someone that I've always loved
and he's always been so inspirational to me. Man. I mean,
I can remember numerous nights, you know, back in the eighties,
like you know, I called his brother up on the

(02:37:01):
phone late at night and right and I'm like, you know, like, yo,
check this out. I got this joint the best, So yes,
I guess, yes, the best. Your fast. You know.

Speaker 6 (02:37:09):
He's like, oh, that's fired.

Speaker 2 (02:37:11):
Then two nights later, Gi called me back and he's like, yo,
I got just from the joint, checked this out, the
creature feature capture rough to teach. He like it was like,
you know, he was like that dude that always kept
me on my toes man, I mean, and just a
hell of an m C. And I mean, and the
crazy thing is like we got down with the Juice Crew,

(02:37:32):
damn near at the same time. Like he got down
like maybe like six months before me or some shit
like that, right, you know, because Polo had this dude
Frost and he got locked up, and then Polo you know,
brought on g in and then Biz brought me in.
But this all happened in eighty six.

Speaker 1 (02:37:53):
Wow. You know, so let me ask you if Master,
if you have a show with Master Ace, Craig g
g rap and you all on the same show, who
performed symphony? Do y'all do it together or do y'all
do it separate?

Speaker 2 (02:38:10):
Or no? We would definitely do it together, okay on
the show and whoever's I mean, I guess whoever's going last?
I would think it would make bad sense. Okay, who
was going to last? Okay?

Speaker 1 (02:38:20):
Yeah, be selfish? Is somebody to come out and just
do that first?

Speaker 3 (02:38:22):
Right?

Speaker 6 (02:38:23):
I mean I don't think that we would do that.

Speaker 2 (02:38:25):
I think that you know, we would, you know, get
together collectively, you know, figure out Okay, yeah, how we're
gonna work the symphony in right?

Speaker 3 (02:38:32):
Definitely? Let me ask you.

Speaker 1 (02:38:34):
Right, everyone has love for mister See everyone knows and
you know, from from.

Speaker 3 (02:38:41):
You the biggie to all of this.

Speaker 1 (02:38:43):
And then it was at one point it was like
this controversy that he was going through. What did you
think of that when you heard, you know, like like
he was living an alternative lifestyle.

Speaker 2 (02:38:54):
I mean, that's that's that's that's his life. I mean,
you know, it's a brother I've known since high school.
You know, I've known this brother since high school and
he helped me down through thinking things. That's beautiful, you know.
So I've always loved and respected mister C. And whatever

(02:39:17):
he going through, I personally feel like I'm going through
it too. So I mean, anything I can do to
help or be in his corner, I'm willing to do.
You know. I love mister C like a brother, you know.

Speaker 1 (02:39:34):
So what's what's left for Caina doing this game? Man?

Speaker 2 (02:39:38):
I think, you know, honestly, I wanted I want to,
you know, do some more movies, and I really I
really want to, you know, connect with with some young artists.

Speaker 6 (02:39:51):
I would really like to like that. I like that
with some young artists, you know.

Speaker 2 (02:39:56):
You know. Yeah, yeah, I mean I just certain artists
I just see and I'm like, I see something special.
Like Lady London. I think she's special. I think Lola
Brook is special, a special. You know, certain artists I
just feel like they just special. You know. Even even

(02:40:21):
Conway the Machine, there's something special about him. But I
don't know if he's really channeling into it. I think
I see it, but I see something very Yeah. We
did a song. I did a song for for Buster oh.

Speaker 1 (02:40:37):
Yes, it's like three generations I saw and everything R.

Speaker 2 (02:40:41):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:40:43):
Yeah hip hop man like coming off fifty years. I
know we spoke about it earlier. I know we spoke about,
you know, the cliches of it being this far. But
now with this AI thing, you you are you are
you are you? With AI.

Speaker 6 (02:41:00):
Another no, no, I am not. And he's the.

Speaker 2 (02:41:10):
Really shit about that AI comes into effect. Right.

Speaker 6 (02:41:17):
I don't think it's going to affect me. I'm a performer.

Speaker 2 (02:41:23):
I have a set fan base where I haven't had
a hit record in like thirty years. Right, It's not
going to affect me Big Daddy Kane fans that want
to see me, hear me. I think that what's gearing

(02:41:46):
up for the future is that because right now with
the younger generation, it ain't like how I said, you know,
if we got a ten thousand, see the seven thousand
of them got their phones out. With the younger generation,
they're in a ten thousd I see the ten thousands
of them got their phones out, so they already watching
the ship or filming the show instead of really focusing

(02:42:07):
on it. It's a phone thing, right, We got AI
and we have holograms. Right, we got a bunch of
young artists there's not really really performing on stage, right,
So what's going to happen is there's going to be

(02:42:29):
digital artists. They're going to create holograms of of uh
this perfect looking artist.

Speaker 1 (02:42:38):
Oh you didn't see they had one. They had like
an artist and no, no, no, no, no, Drake, shut the
fuck up. No, no, I'm talking about There was a
real artist that was an AI artist. He was signed
the Universal and then he said nigga and then he
dropped them. Y'all know what I'm talking about. Yeah, he
said like he was he was.

Speaker 2 (02:42:57):
That's what's getting ready to happen where you you what's
going to happen is they're going to create holograms.

Speaker 6 (02:43:03):
And with the AI thing, it'd be like, you know what, would.

Speaker 2 (02:43:07):
This artiste give them some blonde dreads, make a bunch
of tattoos, muscle bound and you know what makes his
voice sound like Michael Jackson, No, I ain't hurt Michael Jackson,
spitting bars make his voice sound like Michael Jackson. And
concerts will be downloaded to your phone right where you
don't even have to go because you ain't fucking looking anyway,

(02:43:29):
This younger generation ain't looking anyway.

Speaker 6 (02:43:31):
They just got their phone up the whole show.

Speaker 2 (02:43:33):
So wouldn't it make more sense for them to just
be able to buy the concert and just right there
because the.

Speaker 1 (02:43:40):
Streaming selling selling tickets today. Concert where you don't even
get to see them, What do you mean you don't
get to see them? You don't get you know, it's
all your owing audio only. That's some crazy shit.

Speaker 3 (02:43:50):
It's hard. It just makes some noise for them discovering
the trick.

Speaker 1 (02:43:55):
Think about that, they're going there to hear it. Okay,
you lost me then yeah, they go to the car sirt,
but they don't get to see her.

Speaker 3 (02:44:04):
That's what I'm saying. They don't get to see them, and.

Speaker 1 (02:44:06):
But they get to hear it's it's audio tickets, yeah, said.

Speaker 5 (02:44:10):
Wild because the concert to me is everything is visual.

Speaker 1 (02:44:14):
Yeah that turns me off. Like when I go on stage.
Seldomly go on stage, but I go on stage and
everyone's just like this, I'm looking like motherfucker, I'm right here.

Speaker 5 (02:44:23):
Yeah, that's the point to see your favorite artists on
stage live like moment.

Speaker 2 (02:44:28):
All right, But I mean with this younger generation need
to understand that it's going to affect them down the line.
And I don't mean far down the line. No, it's
all happening. It's happening very fast. And I would hate
to see that happen to the younger generation where they're
replaced by digital images and digital voices. I want to

(02:44:51):
see them when be successful, you know, make money, be
able to feed their family, you know, and you know,
have you know, successful careers.

Speaker 3 (02:45:00):
That was part of the sack strike right now, that
big sag strike.

Speaker 4 (02:45:03):
It's about all of that. Yeah, that's part of it.

Speaker 5 (02:45:06):
Yeah, the digital, the facial stuff, and they just want
you to be a voice actor and then they're gonna
take your whole image and.

Speaker 3 (02:45:12):
You different things, different ways that they'll apply it.

Speaker 1 (02:45:15):
And you ran into something too, like the sign language interpreter.

Speaker 3 (02:45:22):
You remember what fake one.

Speaker 2 (02:45:23):
No no, no, no, no.

Speaker 6 (02:45:25):
He was a real interpreter.

Speaker 2 (02:45:28):
What happened was, uh, like I've seen like people that
do sign and you know, they're standing there, you know,
doing what they do. So when I came on stage,
I'm performing, and then I looked to the side of the
stage and I stupid like this, you know, and he's like,

(02:45:50):
I didn't know that he was an interpreting. Oh yeah,
I thought that he was somebody came out on that
crowd just making gestures.

Speaker 6 (02:45:58):
I don't speak sign. I mean, I don't really, I don't,
you know.

Speaker 2 (02:46:01):
So when I saw him, because of his energy, because
he's jumping, so I'm thinking that he's just someone just
came out there just having any moment, Like I'm big
that he can't hype man. So I pushed him to
the side and then I went and started performing. Now look,
he was back out there again, and I pushed his

(02:46:22):
ass to the side again, and then I went. And
then when when we finished the song, my DJ was like, yo, yo,
he you know, he told me who he was. And
then I walked up the dude and I was like, yo,
I'm sorry, man, I didn't know.

Speaker 6 (02:46:39):
Poly you know.

Speaker 2 (02:46:40):
I apologized, and then and then I held his hand
up and told the crowds, you know, like listen, you know,
I'm glad he here. I say. I said something like
because even if you can't hear me, I want you
to enjoy the show. So thank you brother, you know,
and and left it like that. And then he finished

(02:47:01):
finished what he was doing. But I didn't know.

Speaker 1 (02:47:03):
I didn't know that was that was like a first
like controversy on the internet, like like you know, like
I mean probably yeah, you know what I'm saying, Like
like in this new version of.

Speaker 6 (02:47:14):
Me, you know, everybody wanted to cancel you, you know
for something.

Speaker 2 (02:47:18):
It's like it's like everybody looking for some ship to
be bitter about.

Speaker 1 (02:47:23):
You know, was that something abnormal to you or you
you adapted to it because you know, back back in
the days, the room was about you, but you it.

Speaker 3 (02:47:29):
Wouldn't come to you.

Speaker 1 (02:47:30):
You didn't have especially you didn't have an Instagram, Like,
so was that something like that was that was different
for you?

Speaker 2 (02:47:36):
When when when you I mean, I ain't really give
a ship, man, I mean, because it was like it
was the type of thing where you know, I know,
I didn't do nothing wrong, and once I understood who
he was, I apologized to him, and.

Speaker 1 (02:47:50):
You did on your Instagram as well.

Speaker 6 (02:47:52):
Yeah, man, I mean it was like you know, people.

Speaker 2 (02:47:57):
Even had they well you you didn't uh apologize to
the death community.

Speaker 6 (02:48:06):
I ain't doing it to the death community.

Speaker 2 (02:48:08):
I pushed him the guy, and I apologize them. That's
who I would the apology to, you know, plain and simple,
you know, and I mean you know, because it's like
I didn't understan, I didn't know what was going on, but.

Speaker 6 (02:48:20):
Once I found out what was going on, corrected to
me quickly.

Speaker 2 (02:48:23):
You know, because yeah, because of Yes, if you can't
hear the show and he's there to help you understand, yes,
I need him, like I would love for someone like
him to be at every goddamn show, you know. I
see the importance and I respect that. You know.

Speaker 1 (02:48:39):
Yeah, you think people are too sensitive nowadays?

Speaker 2 (02:48:42):
Well yeah, well yeah, like we so sensitive that you
can be on someone's side, agree with what they're saying,
but just if you word it in a way that
don't sound like they'll get mad at you all the time.

(02:49:02):
That's why it's for me, it's it's just so much
easier to just ship what we call the fuck up.
I'll just be quiet and go ahead, go ahead?

Speaker 1 (02:49:13):
Was you know? Because we're pushing this documentary. What made
you want to come together and push this documentary?

Speaker 2 (02:49:23):
The documentary is called Paragraphs I manifest Para, and what
it's about is the lyricism in hip hop and the
importance of it, Uh, songwriting.

Speaker 6 (02:49:40):
What made you write this song? What was the inspiration?

Speaker 2 (02:49:44):
Things of that nature, Because the documentary is really for
the younger generation. I want the younger generation to understand
the importance of lyricists. We can't lose that, you know,
because yes, because it is a law thing in it.
And I want them to really understand that. And hopefully,

(02:50:06):
you know, by hearing from the pioneers, hearing from some
of the younger generation, even hearing from some of the
battle rappers, I'm thinking, I'm hoping that it would be
something that can trigger something in the younger generation be like,
you know, nah, I want to, you know, have some bars.
I want to, you know, because I want, like I said,

(02:50:27):
I want to I want to see these young cats win.
I want to see them succeed. I want to see
them keep hip hop, you know going. You know, I'm
I'm I'm fifty four years old, my dude. You know,
I'm not gonna be here forever. You know. You know,
Rock I'm not gonna be here forever. G rap not
gonna be here forever. You know, Nas, you know, jay Z,

(02:50:49):
They're not you know.

Speaker 5 (02:50:50):
Yeah, And what hip hop does best is reflect and
report what's going on. And how can it do that
if it has no lyrics? Right, if you can't articulate it. Yeah, yeah,
you're right, you're right, you're right.

Speaker 2 (02:51:09):
You know. It's like, you know, there's so many dimensions
of hip hop and there's so many different things, like
some people just want to party.

Speaker 4 (02:51:15):
Right, right, which is a part of it. It's a balance. Yeah,
But I mean, I just think that when you are lyrical,
it can help with your longevity. I just believe that
because there's so many artists that drop party songs and
then a year, lady, they're forgotten because a new party

(02:51:39):
song came out, because it's like all of that was
just part of a trend. But there's lyricists that said
something that's stuck to your soul, and these artists had
longevity because it's something that you said that they probably
repeat daily yearly, right.

Speaker 5 (02:52:00):
And and the idea of a lot of us learned
vocabulary off of lyricists, off of MC's I was never
good in book studying, but lyrical artists made me want
to I don't know that word, what does that word mean?

Speaker 3 (02:52:16):
I want to understand this rhyme.

Speaker 2 (02:52:17):
That's how I graduated high school. We'll talk. That's how
I graduated high school looking up no no no. I
was failing in Social studies. And I was in great Math,
great and science, great English, my guidance counselor. He was pointing,

(02:52:38):
and I had and this is now, this is me,
my guidance counselor. My mother. We're talking, and I said,
why do we need eight credits in social studies? We
need seven in English, foreign maths, foreign science, but we
need eight and social studies why, I said, I'll tell

(02:52:58):
you why. Because social studies is that part in school
that teaches us all the great stuff that white people
did for us. That's what you learn in American History,
That's what you learn in Global studies. And that's why

(02:53:21):
it's important for us to have all these courses. But
after I've learned American history and global studies, how does
that help me in the future?

Speaker 6 (02:53:31):
What job does that lay out for me?

Speaker 2 (02:53:33):
What I'm learning in math can lay out a job
for me, What I'm learning in English can lay out
a job for me. What I'm learning in science can
lay out a job for me. What the hell am
I learning in social studies? That's going to lay out
a job for me? Not a goddamn thing unless I
want to be a teacher. You know, my mother did
this that was her, I want to slap the shit

(02:53:56):
out you, but you know, we in front of people's
so I'm not going to you know, And my guidance
counselor he said, I understand. And he looked out for
me because you know, I don't know. You know, back then,
you know, you get a credit for government or law,

(02:54:17):
not both. You had to cover credit for Black history
or Puerto Rican studies, not both. I got credits for
both because he was looking out for me, because he
felt that I was a good student. Pusce I said, ry,
I'm on the loud speaker in the morning, official period
or shit like that, you know. So he was looking
out for me, you know. But still I didn't have

(02:54:40):
enough credits to make that eight. So yeah, I was
close to failer. And then Mellie mel says on Beach
Street Breakdown, deca outreach, Hiroshima, Vietnam, Lennogram Ewujima, now Korea,
the Philippines, devastating depths by the killing machines. And I
was like, I'd never be a dope m c if

(02:55:02):
I don't know what the funk he talking about. And
I damn sure don't know right now. And I went
back to my guidance counsel. There I take American ship
that I pose. I took it, not because I wanted
to learn American history, not because I wanted to learn
global studies. But I felt like if I learned this ship,
I build a rhyme like Melloy mel Yeah, what's on?

Speaker 9 (02:55:27):
What's on?

Speaker 1 (02:55:28):
Daddy kinge Ryder? Like if for a promoter of books?

Speaker 2 (02:55:30):
You what? What?

Speaker 1 (02:55:31):
What is that?

Speaker 2 (02:55:32):
You?

Speaker 3 (02:55:33):
The essentials that that that that you need to do
this show.

Speaker 2 (02:55:38):
Or the Judy Show, like the Rider. I didn't know
the Judy Show. I need a microphone. But after the show, yeah,
you know, you know, you know some sweet you know,
some nice grapes, you know, and.

Speaker 3 (02:55:51):
Who do you prefer? Camus opus one?

Speaker 6 (02:55:54):
You're gonna do this again?

Speaker 2 (02:55:56):
Yeah? I like that we did this, you know, you
know me and you nah. Well, I mean, like I
explained to you before, I mean with Camus, you know,
it's the Yeah, if you can still find a twenty
nineteen Camus amazing, the twenty twenty, you know, but the
twenty nineteen amazing.

Speaker 6 (02:56:16):
But right now I'm pretty much on CAD.

Speaker 2 (02:56:21):
That's all Howell Mountain, like c A d K. It's
a Howell Mountain. It's like a younger version of plumb Jack.

Speaker 3 (02:56:32):
Okay.

Speaker 6 (02:56:34):
Yeah, so if you don't want to spend all.

Speaker 2 (02:56:36):
That money in a plumb jack, like yeah, the cad
Cad I think it's like maybe like about about one
hundred and twenty dollars a bottle by n But that's
that's a that's a good cab, an amazing cab.

Speaker 6 (02:56:49):
Or like a nice barolo. What barolo?

Speaker 2 (02:56:53):
Italian? No Italian? No, no, no, we had one. Well
he's at the joint, the last one. The next bottle whel.

Speaker 1 (02:57:01):
Okay, okay, okay, okay, because I got something that you
put me on your ship?

Speaker 2 (02:57:04):
Yeah yeah, yeah you got Do you get the caymans on?

Speaker 3 (02:57:06):
I got the Cayman I believe at the bottom of
that boy.

Speaker 2 (02:57:09):
That boy you bought everything but the bottle order. The
bottle order.

Speaker 3 (02:57:15):
Yeah yeah, that was a barolo.

Speaker 6 (02:57:18):
Okay, yeah, but yeah, it's Italian grape.

Speaker 2 (02:57:21):
But it's it's a nice medium bodied okay, red, but
I mean it's it's it's it's real smooth. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:57:27):
So so if promoters they got to book you, it's
always it's always a red.

Speaker 3 (02:57:32):
What else is on your rider?

Speaker 2 (02:57:33):
That's like a little crazy, like no no, no, no,
I I don't got no white m and ms and
no crazy ship like.

Speaker 1 (02:57:38):
No green and m and ms. Okay, you got to
stop that HNT.

Speaker 3 (02:57:46):
Listen and yellow and yellow skittles, So.

Speaker 1 (02:57:50):
You got you got nothing like uh like just just
just just the red skin off the apple. You don't
got nothing like that.

Speaker 2 (02:57:57):
No one ain't nothing crazy on the ride, right.

Speaker 7 (02:58:00):
Gone, body ain't got nothing to writer, He ain't got jolly.
Has Kane ever had a stylist?

Speaker 2 (02:58:13):
Oh yeah, for a.

Speaker 6 (02:58:20):
Brief moment, a brief moment.

Speaker 2 (02:58:21):
It's like, you know, I'm wanting them dudes to like
going out the box. And you know sometimes you know stylists,
you know, they might want to tone you down. But
it's like it's there's certain controversies I like, I enjoy.
So it's like if I wear something that's a little

(02:58:42):
over the edge, there's a reason. There's a method to
my madness. It's like, I got this on. It looked
a little crazy, but it's like, wash your mouth. It

(02:59:04):
looks a little crazy. But the reason I'm wearing this
is so that the guys will clown it and the
women will me you get it.

Speaker 6 (02:59:21):
So it's a method to the madness, you know what
I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (02:59:23):
And it's like the women defending me, they see it,
they like hmm. But it's not until the guy clowns
me that they go public. Oh no, you didn't. You
ain't gonna look their goodness here, you don't know. See

(02:59:44):
that's when that's when they go public and they go
rentid you know what I'm saying, you know, like like
like like Beyonce's beehive saying that type of thing. But
it's like, you know, you got to get them there,
you know what I'm saying. So it's stuff that I
do on purpose, intentionally, you.

Speaker 1 (02:59:59):
Know him a Donna book? Was that a stylist who
gave the speedos?

Speaker 6 (03:00:04):
I can't stand you.

Speaker 3 (03:00:09):
He wants.

Speaker 2 (03:00:14):
No. I've been sitting there patiently waiting for normal bullshit.

Speaker 6 (03:00:18):
I'm like, God, damn, we've been here for a long time.

Speaker 2 (03:00:22):
None of his bullshit, you know, I've been waiting.

Speaker 1 (03:00:28):
Oh my, I'm gonna be honest, man, i'ma be honest
and let me let me say this for you know,
all the young ins. And I know I've been fatiguing
to young people, you know, all night, but I want
to say something. You know, I'm honored to call you
my o G. I'm honored to you know, following your footsteps.
I'm honored to honor you. I'm honored to show you

(03:00:51):
how much you mean to the rap game, Show you
how much you mean to us, show you how much
you mean to the culture. This is a blessing, man,
to tell you to your face. You know what I'm
saying to face man, the man out of eye? Man,
what you mean?

Speaker 2 (03:01:03):
You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (03:01:03):
And it means everything to us. Man, we all in
the group chat. Everyone here, we're all and if you
can see how we were all excited, like like we
all were all in a group chat. I'm like, I'm
seriously looking at my barber, like you think I can
get away with it? Like you know what I'm saying,
Like right now, you think I can get away with it,
I said myself. But see I know myself. I gonna
go back like that. I'm gonna have Cornell West on

(03:01:24):
my ears.

Speaker 3 (03:01:24):

Speaker 1 (03:01:26):
I'm gonna have motherfucker buck Weed did all that on
my joint, so already hurt my lesson. But I just
want you to know, man, you are really an icon.
You are really a legend. Something that Buster Rohm said,
you know what I mean when he won his BET Awards.
He said, our icons, our legends, gotta look the part.
And let me just tell you something. You always looked apart.
I've never seen you for I've always seen you smooth.

(03:01:47):
I've never seen you hate on nobody. I never seen
you talk bad about nobody. I always see you with
the greatest, most phenomenal energy, and I just want to
give it back to you.

Speaker 3 (03:01:55):
Always, just the case the case.

Speaker 1 (03:01:59):
If you don't know, I'll just sitting there follow you
on Instagram. I'm like, yo, you know, the show has
got bigger. And I said, man, I gotta get his
brother his flowers the proper way, not to say, read
and give you your flowers before the proper way. But
the show has gotten grew so much bigger, so I read,
We're gonna do it again. We're gonna do it again.
This is your platform. If you want to promote pink
toenails anytime. If you want to promote fucking coffee.

Speaker 3 (03:02:22):
Cups, what is this ship? What is this coasters? If
you want to we don't give a fuck. This is
your platform.

Speaker 1 (03:02:27):
You can come on here anytime you want motherfucker is everyone,
put your hands together, stand up if you can't for
motherfucker big day.

Speaker 2 (03:02:39):
Man.

Speaker 1 (03:02:40):
Thank you so much, my brother.

Speaker 5 (03:02:42):
Drink Champs is a drink Champs LLC production in association
with Interval Presents. Hosts and executive producers n O r
E and dj e f N from Interval Presents executive
producers Alan Coy and Jake Kleinberg. Listen to Drink Champs
on Apple Podcast, Amazon Music, Spotify, or wherever you get

(03:03:03):
your podcasts. Thanks for joining us for another episode of
drink Champs, hosted by Yours Truly, dj e f N
and n O r E. Please make sure to follow
us on all our socials That's at drink Champs across
all platforms, at the Real noriagon ig at Noriega on Twitter,
mine is at Who's Crazy on ig at dj e

(03:03:24):
f N on Twitter, and most importantly, stay up to
date with the latest releases, news and merch by going
to drink Champs dot com

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Episode 379 w/ Big Daddy Kane