September 19, 2023 • 46 mins
Episode 2 of 8
Beth trains her focus on the days immediately following the murder, beginning with recordings of police interrogations of key witnesses. Yolanda Chambers, a 15-year-old girl, places Toforest at the scene of the murder. But Beth finds evidence that Chambers was manipulated by law enforcement officers into fabricating her testimony. Beth brings her findings to lead detective Tony Richardson, who defends his tactics while admitting regrets that cast further doubt on his decision to build a case against Toforest based solely on Chambers’ evershifting word.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Last time on ear witness, I.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Have my mind spirit for Cross told you I have
a pit.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
What appears to be a.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Jumped the comedy police officer shot in the back of
our building. He hit that movie. He has been shot.
Speaker 4 (00:29):
Looks it looks too bad. And then I just heard
one say that's it.
Speaker 5 (00:36):
It's old. We can't do anymore. It's old. We can't
save it.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
He's gone. Tavarra Johnson. I remember he was pushing Adrika's
forward in a wheelchair.
Speaker 6 (00:49):
They came together.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
I had saw too far. I was pushing a Drinka's
in the club.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
I just sat two signs up and I left and
and he was still there.
Speaker 5 (00:59):
Yeah, he was.
Speaker 4 (01:00):
When I left.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
A deputy share working another deputy shares murder. Do you
think that was emotional? Yes, it was very and had
it been my decision the day we caught the people
that did it, let's put them on death throat.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
The murder of Deputy Bill Hardy behind the Crown Sterling
Sweets Hotel was the top news story in Birmingham on
July nineteenth, nineteen ninety five.
Speaker 6 (01:41):
And plays are looking for a cop killer.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
Someone shot forty nine year old William Hardy several times.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
In the year.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Slow start, but investigators are throwing everything they have behind
the caves. The TV news footage shows deputies wearing the
traditional black band over their badges, a gesture that expresses
for a fellow officer.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
We're somber, We're say it, but we know we have
a job to do, and we're determined to do that job.
Speaker 7 (02:08):
This is a very difficult night for William Hardy's family.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
The Hardy home is full of sorrow and pain as
they search for asss to a senseless crime. A week
after the murder, hundreds of people turn out for Deputy
Hardy's funeral.
Speaker 5 (02:25):
Thank you, my brothers, Thank you, my brothers.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Video footage of the funeral shows women in dresses fanning themselves.
It's summer in Alabama, a swampy ninety seven degrees. Someone
actually faints in the heat.
Speaker 8 (02:41):
We are still by that.
Speaker 9 (02:43):
We all have to do what Bill has already done.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
The church is packed, but at least one longtime colleague
of Hardy's isn't at the service.
Speaker 5 (02:55):
I didn't make the family.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
We worked this case so hard, and we were so
determined to get a resolution.
Speaker 5 (03:06):
I was working. I didn't make his.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Feel Tony Richardson is the lead detective on the case.
A prosecutor who used to work with Richardson tells me
he's a thorough investigator, a man who gets the job done.
But this case is different from any other he's worked before.
He's investigating the murder of someone he knows, someone he likes,
(03:32):
someone he worked with for almost two decades.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
When you got a deafor shriff killed over here, it's
high profile and people are expecting things out here, not
only you. You know you emotional. You want to find
the people who did this. You want somebody in customer.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
In the immediate hours after Deputy Hardy's murder, Detective Tony
Richardson and his investigators interviewed Marshal Kelly Cummings, the Keebler
cookie guy who heard the shots and saw someone drive away.
They also interview the front desk clerk at the hotel,
Barry Rushikov, and other people staying at the Crown Sterling
(04:19):
Suites who heard voices in the parking lot followed by gunshots.
No one they talked to says they actually saw the murder.
Just a few witnesses heard the gunshots and then saw
a car pull away. The lead evidence technician who's actually
Tony Richardson's brother, Deputy Charlie Richardson, finds two nine millimeters
(04:41):
shell casings at the scene. A ballistics expert will later
say that both casings came from the same gun, and
that's pretty much all they have to go on. Police
sweep the surrounding area and pull over any vehicle's loosely
matching descriptions from hotel guests, but it doesn't get them
very far.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
Not only do you want somebody in custody. The lieutenant
is telling me, we need to get this done. The
captain is telling the lieutenant, we need to get this done.
The sheriff, you're telling the captain, we need to get
this done.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Nine hours after Hardy is killed, the Sheriff's department announces
a reward for information. The reward amount would eventually grow
to twenty thousand dollars adjusted for inflation, that's about forty
grand today. And once a tip line is announced, the
phone start ringing. One caller says a guy known as
(05:43):
Big Man told him his cousin was involved. Another says
a member of the Disciples gang carried out the murder.
Officers sift through this information trying to decipher what's worth
pursuing and which callers might be pranks, are people just
interested in the rear ward money. Days go by and
they still don't have a suspect. And then Detective Richardson
(06:07):
speaks to a woman named Rosa Hardy, and what she
tells him eclipses every other lead he has.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
And she told me, she says, my daughter knows who
killed Bill.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
I'm Beth Shelburne. This is ear witness chapter two.
Speaker 10 (06:34):
Don't know Diddley, anybody that was not there when I
(07:08):
was there, anybody that was not there when Harry was shot.
Speaker 3 (07:17):
Don't know deadily.
Speaker 5 (07:20):
About this case.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
When I first got the enormous trove of records in
the investigative file, I spent hours and hours just staring
at my computer, overwhelmed by thousands of pages of documents.
Right away I knew I wanted to talk to Tony Richardson,
the lead investigator in Hardy's murder. His name is on
(07:43):
most of the police reports, and it's his voice we
hear on a lot of the interrogation tapes.
Speaker 11 (07:49):
Sorry of Tony vision, Jeff, we got a Shuran service.
Today's data is.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
When I first call him. For an interview. He says
it would be best not to talk with me, but
Richardson keeps talking for twenty five minutes. It seems like
he's got a lot on his mind. Two weeks later,
he agrees to go on the record.
Speaker 6 (08:11):
Listen.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
I've decided I'm going to speak with you concerning your podcast.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Great, I'm really glad to hear that. My producer Mara,
and I meet him in a conference room of a
local library.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Okay, how are you. I'm Beth Tony. This is Maura.
Nice to be too.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
He's dressed casually, jeans, a black sweatshirt, a US Marines
ball cap, and a toothpick he keeps in his mouth
the entire interview.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
Somebody when they hear this, they're going to be questioning
my integrity. You know, is this guy telling the truth for?
Is he just telling the story? So I'll talk to
you to the NSKY.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
When Detective Tony Richardson first gets that tip from Rosa Hardy,
he goes over to the Ford dealership where she works
as a receptionist.
Speaker 5 (09:16):
I was always pretty thorough.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
I wrote everything down, He writes in a report that
Rosa Hardy told an officer that her daughter had information
concerning the crime. The police report reads, Miss Hardy told
us that after she arrived for work at twelve noon
of seven nineteen, she heard a police officer had been killed.
(09:40):
She bought a newspaper and learned the victim was someone
she and her family knew personally. Rosa knew Deputy Hardy
and his wife. They have the same last name, but
they're not related. They were good friends. The report goes
on to say that Rosa's daughter, Yolanda Chambers, called her
at work. Rosa told her that the officer that had
(10:03):
been killed was Bill Hardy. According to Rosa, her daughter
Yolanda responded, Mama, I didn't know it was him, And
then Yolanda went on to say she knew who killed him.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
She says, my daughter knows who killed Bill. Well great will.
She talked to me, I don't know. She kind of reluctant.
She don't want to do it. I'm trying to get
her to do it, and I was just begging her,
you know, let's figure out a way to.
Speaker 5 (10:44):
Get her in. We need her.
Speaker 1 (10:46):
But Rosa isn't sure where Yolanda is.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
I think at the time, Yolanda was a semi runaway
or whatever, but she wasn't there, okay, So we worked
very hard with Mom to get Yolanda in.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
Later that evening, Rosa calls the Sheriff's office and says,
Yolanda is at her apartment, and that's where Richardson picks
her up. He brings Yolanda to Sheriff's headquarters for questioning.
Speaker 11 (11:17):
Charlton, Tony rich and Jeffson Kuint of Shriff's Office. Today's
date is July twenty fourth, nineteen ninety five. The time
it's eleven twenty pm. I'm at the Sheriff's Office headquarters
along with Officer James Branton at the Birmingham Police Department
and Yolanda Michelle Chambers.
Speaker 12 (11:36):
Yolanda is a black female. She's fifteen years of age. Again,
what I want to talk to you about.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Is Yolanda is by herself in a room with detectives
and a tape recorder.
Speaker 12 (11:50):
So I guess the best way for us to proceed
is for you to tell me. First of all, when
you learned that w Hardy had been killed?
Speaker 8 (11:58):
All right, if I'm not mistaken, it was a Friday,
Me and one of my girlfriends, say he named Latanya
me and her and two guys are supposed to hook
cup that night.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Yeah, you know they're older than us. One is twenty one.
They call him Dre. He's in a wheelchair.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
Dre is ur Dregas Ford's nickname, And for some reason
in this interview, Yolanda refers to to Forest as Carlos,
and he has.
Speaker 8 (12:28):
A brother named Carlos, so we you know, we was
supposed to hook up, you know, after they left Teeves.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
To Forest and Ardregas are not related, and to Forest's
nickname has never been Carlos. It's unclear why Yolanda refers
to him this way, but she tells police that Ardregas
called her around two am. He and to Forrest had
left Tea's place and were on their way to pick
her up.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
You know they'd be on time. They call it around
about two or three, you know, be like come on.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Ardregas asks Yolanda to bring along a friend for to Forest.
So after they pick up Yolanda, they all drive to
pick up her friend, Latanya Henderson, who lives a few
minutes away. I want to take a moment to address
the age gap between to Forest, Ardregas and the girls
they're picking up to Forest is twenty two, Ardregas is
(13:24):
twenty one, Latania is sixteen, and Yolanda is fifteen. To
Forest and Ardregas met Yolanda and Latania at a night
club two nights prior to picking them up after teas.
It's likely that the girls lied about their age to
get into the club where they met. But I don't
know if to Forest and Ardregas knew how old they were.
(13:47):
I don't even know if it came up. The age
of consent in Alabama is sixteen. But regardless, guys in
their early twenties picking up teenage girls. It's just problematic.
Speaker 8 (14:01):
Him and Carlos came down and we went all hand
to was in dear park Pe LaTaya.
Speaker 1 (14:07):
Yolanda says that once they get to Latanya's house, it
takes a while for Latanya to get ready.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
Oh yeah, going out and tell you about it.
Speaker 8 (14:15):
For forty minutes to get ready, take our bathroostoll because
she didn't have on no clothes.
Speaker 1 (14:19):
Latania finally sneaks out of her bedroom window to meet them.
Once the girls are in the car, Yolanda says that
something is off and ar Dregas seems nervous.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
You know and all like what's wronging wrong?
Speaker 8 (14:34):
Why we didn't got to get fill the wrong wen't either.
You know, it goes o injur chill out. So you
know we were ruding around. You know, we're telling hill
a man and it is smoked a cop.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
According to Yolanda or Dragas, says, the other guy in
the car with them, to Forrest had smoked a cop.
Speaker 8 (14:59):
You know who got their life playing y'all, got us
in the cartel y'all and did from did a crime.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
Somehow. This revelation that to Forrest and Ardregis were supposedly
just involved in the murder of a police officer doesn't
deter their plans, she says. The four of them drive
off to look for a hotel room.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
We rode around in Hollywood, US. We went to the
Fat Fear.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
Hand, but she says, the Fairfield end was booked solid
and so they head across the street to the Super
eight motel.
Speaker 8 (15:32):
So when we went light cross to the suba eighth ahole,
lot of cops came from knowing sheriffs and everything just
came and I'll you.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Know, and hated everybody to get at the car.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
It's there and the Super eight parking lot that officers
tell the group they're investigating the murder of a deputy
who was shot and killed earlier that night a few
miles away at the Crown Sterling Suitets Hotel. Remember, officers
were on the lookout for cars in the vicinity of
the crime scene, and this is why they pull in
behind the Monte Carlo in the Super eight parking lot.
(16:11):
One of the officers later testifies that he tried to
extract ar Dregis from the car before learning that he's paralyzed.
The officer makes to Forest get out of the car,
put his hands on the trunk while he pats him down,
then looks inside the Monte Carlo with his flashlight. He
finds nothing suspicious and decides to let everyone go except
(16:35):
to Forest because he has a misdemeanor warrant for driving
without a license, so police take to Forest to the
Birmingham City Jail and he bonds out later that afternoon. Meanwhile,
Ardregas's license is expired, so police won't let him drive home,
and he leaves the Monte Carlo in the Super eight
(16:55):
parking lot. He and the girls get a cab to
go home, and Yolanda crashes at a friend's house.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
She says.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
She calls her mom later that morning.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
How god my mom is? Next morning, she say, guess
not as being in big.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
That click, it's the sound of an officer turning the
tape recorder off. We don't know what's being said between
Yolanda and investigators when the tape is stopped, but Yolanda's
first interview isn't over. The tape starts rolling again.
Speaker 8 (17:33):
Okay, go ahead, Yeah, I'll tell my mom a bade
and she can see Landa. You know how the police
house that got killed last night.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
I'm right here.
Speaker 12 (17:42):
Okay, let me stop you again, okay, because I want
to make sure that we get it on the record.
Speaker 6 (17:46):
Now.
Speaker 12 (17:46):
You have already mentioned in your statement that this was
a Friday.
Speaker 8 (17:50):
It was a Tuesday, because that's when they had a
happy hour. It was going on with her Wednesday morning,
round back food.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Yolanda says that Carlos, remember, that's what she's calling to.
Forrest told her the time that he shot Deputy Hardy.
Speaker 8 (18:08):
But if they had worn bout twelve right now, twelve
thirty Carlos.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
And then Yolanda suggests a potential motive. She says deputy
Hardy had arrested to forrest before, and that's why he
supposedly shot him.
Speaker 8 (18:26):
No, because I think we are arrested him a found
before Carlos.
Speaker 12 (18:32):
You go where you're arrested him at.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
I think it has only the way he went to parison.
Speaker 1 (18:42):
An officer turns the tape recorder off for a second time.
When the tape resumes, Yolanda offers a different motive for
Hardy's murder now. She says they killed him after an
attempted robbery, and since Hardy had seen their faces, it
just made sense to kill him.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Got a mouth things former do with kill him.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
In the last minutes of the interview, detectives ask Yolanda
why Ardregis and Carlos had gone to the Crown Sterling Suites,
and she says they wanted to get a room because
they sell drugs. They ask her if she knows anybody
else these guys run with. Yolanda points to the photos
of two other men and a stack that police show her.
(19:32):
You hear Richardson say she has identified Omar Berry and
Quintez Wilson.
Speaker 5 (19:40):
Quinte Is Wilson.
Speaker 12 (19:42):
This guy you look at you know him as what Okay,
that's the photograph of Omar Berry.
Speaker 1 (19:48):
These two other young black men are added to their
list of suspects. This first recorded interview lasts about thirty
five minutes, and right at the end, an officer asks
Yolanda if anyone has made promises to her.
Speaker 5 (20:04):
They promises to you by the statements you just made.
Speaker 6 (20:07):
No.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Vin.
Speaker 1 (20:18):
She answers no. Then we hear her say the only
thing y'all gonna and then there's seven long seconds of silence.
Speaker 12 (20:31):
It's Charlie Richardson. This is going to conclude this interview
at this time eleven PM.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
I listened to this interview over and over again, and
what stands out is that each time officers stop and
then restart the tape, there's a shift in Yolanda's story.
At first, first she says it was a Friday that
she heard about Hardy's murder. Then, after the tape stops
(21:06):
and restarts, Richardson prompts her for the date, and she
corrects herself and says it was a Tuesday night going
into Wednesday. With every restart of the tape, Richardson gets
a story that lines up more and more with the
facts surrounding Hardy's murder, that he was shot on Wednesday
(21:27):
morning behind the Crown Sterling at twelve fifty am. And
then there's the motives. Yolanda provides first that to Forest
killed Hardy because Hardy had arrested him previously. But we
know Hardy had not arrested to Forrest at the time
of his death. Hardy worked in court services. His duties
(21:49):
involved serving subpoenas and directing traffic outside the courthouse. I've
seen zero evidence that Deputy Hardy ever came into contact
with four Worst Johnson. After the tape stops and restarts,
Yolanda gives a second motive that the crime started as
an attempted robbery that ends in Hardy's murder. I asked
(22:13):
Tony Richardson about his approach with Yolanda.
Speaker 3 (22:17):
Yolanda was reluctant. She didn't want to talk, she didn't
want We had to keep better and we had to
pull like polenty, you know, Yolanda, we need this and
sometimes we'd have to be stern, you know, infirm, trying
to shake her. You know, sometime we'd have to be soft,
whatever will work to get this information out of her.
Speaker 1 (22:39):
There are a lot of stops and starts and I
wonder what is going on? Then like the tape stops
and then it restarts. I could do you when you
go off the record with people? I mean, what what
is best practices?
Speaker 5 (22:57):
For best practice? If not is not to go off
the record, that's the best practice.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
I mean, once you cut the tape on, unless the
tape runs out and you changing the tape, you don't
cut it off until you're done. There's no way I
can tell you why the tape stopped, but I will
tell you this. It didn't stop so something sinister could happen.
Speaker 5 (23:23):
I can tell you that.
Speaker 1 (23:27):
What would do you do off the record though?
Speaker 3 (23:30):
I mean somebody could have wanted to go to the bathroom,
or could have just motioned for a break, or or
could have even motioned to say, cut that thing off.
You know, there's no way I can tell you why
(23:51):
it was cut off. I can tell you there's nothing
sinister here. I mean, there's no smoking gun here as
far as doing anything that was not above board. Never
never occurred, never happened, never happened.
Speaker 13 (24:29):
It was early in the morning and I was just
lounging around in my apartment, you know, and I had
my front door was open, and where I was sitting,
I could see out the door and here I see
just cars one Marco.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
In July of nineteen ninety five, to Forrest and his
cousin Antonio Green were living together. But on the morning
of the twenty fifth, Antonio is alone in their apartment
when police cars.
Speaker 5 (24:53):
Pull out over there.
Speaker 13 (24:54):
So I see him pulling up in the front lot
in the bag, and I'm like, oh, what's going on
over here? You know, next thing I know, they're in
my daughter and their acts was to far As Johnson there.
I said, no, no, he's been staying here. But while
he asking me this, they've already came in bought both doors,
so they're already in my house. They're going down the hallway.
(25:14):
So I'm thinking, nah, this must be something serious, you know,
whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
So this guy's telling me what officers say they're looking
for to Forest because they think he might know something
about a.
Speaker 13 (25:24):
Murder something or when they said murder, that really just
threw me all the way to the left, because violent.
He wasn't never violent, you know, rambunks his teenager, young
kid doing what all of us were doing, and far
as a partying and having a good time and all this,
but violence never.
Speaker 6 (25:43):
He was never a violent person.
Speaker 1 (25:45):
As officers walk through Antonio's house, his phone rings. It's
his grandfather and he says police are at his house too.
Antonio hangs up and the phone rings again, ring again.
Speaker 4 (26:00):
I answered it, and it's him.
Speaker 5 (26:01):
It's the Forest.
Speaker 6 (26:02):
I said, hey, man, where you head?
Speaker 4 (26:04):
He said, I'm headed up there now. I said, yeah,
it's folks looking for you airways.
Speaker 13 (26:09):
Yeah, that's what I heard. I don't know what they want,
but I'm finna go and see now. I'm going up
dead house now and see what they want.
Speaker 6 (26:15):
So he did.
Speaker 1 (26:16):
To Forest tells his cousin he has no idea why
police want to talk to him, but he goes to
meet with them at his grandfather's house.
Speaker 13 (26:24):
Father's house and I heard him over the radio say
we got him in custody, and only then would they
lead house.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
Police take to Forest to Sheriff's office headquarters for questioning.
On the morning of July twenty fifth, the day after
they first talked to Yolanda Chambers, Detective Tony Richardson and
his partner Tom Salter asked to Forrest to walk them
through the evening of July eighteenth, the hours leading up
to Deputy Harty's murder.
Speaker 4 (26:55):
I suppose you're doing it five o'clock and even.
Speaker 5 (26:59):
Proud little again well who who.
Speaker 1 (27:03):
To Forrest says that around five pm he was getting
his haircut at a neighborhood spot called gas World Park
gas Station Park, barbershop and nail salon part convenience store. Afterwards,
he met up with his little brother at his mom's
apartment complex.
Speaker 4 (27:21):
He was hanging out outside. I think, yeah, we'd be
outside of ben On the little park or around.
Speaker 3 (27:27):
Walking is something to do?
Speaker 1 (27:30):
Any they to do is try to fire something to do,
trying to find something to do when there's nothing to do.
As to Forrest tells this to police, he has no
way of knowing that he's describing one of his last
few days of freedom.
Speaker 4 (27:49):
So you guys might take you home because you're hungry.
What'd you fix a blown sand?
Speaker 1 (27:56):
Yes, he fries himself a Bolognian cheese sand which play
Sega and listens to the radio.
Speaker 4 (28:05):
See, I think I stayed at home the Draga's game.
I think I stayed there.
Speaker 6 (28:10):
Came be me in.
Speaker 1 (28:13):
He stays there and tell his friend ar dregas Ford
picks him up in his nineteen seventy one black Monte
Carlo to go to Tea's place. While police asked to
Forrest about the night Hearty was killed. Others are out
looking for ar Dregas Ford. They knock on the door
of his mom's house. Here's Joyce Ford.
Speaker 14 (28:34):
Three o'clock that morning.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
I'll stayed at Central Park.
Speaker 14 (28:38):
Somebody knocked on the door and I said who is it?
And they said Jefferson, count of sheriff Man. So I
looked out the window. They were everywhere. I opened the
door and I was kind of nervous, and they said,
is Draga's Ford home?
Speaker 3 (28:54):
I said no.
Speaker 14 (28:56):
Then they said what can we come in? I said,
I don't have anything to have. You welcome to come in,
but do you have a search one? And they said no.
I said, well you can't come in. They said, well,
we have some questions to asks and can you bring
him in when he get home?
Speaker 3 (29:13):
And I told him.
Speaker 14 (29:14):
When he got home, I told him what happened and
he said, yeah, Ma, I'd be glad to go.
Speaker 1 (29:21):
So Joyce drives our Dregas to the Sheriff's office headquarters.
On the morning of July twenty sixth, detectives Richardson and
Salter ask him what he was up to on the
night of the murder. Richardson asks him what time he
picked up to Forrest first time you.
Speaker 6 (29:37):
Saw him tubes it was about ten o'clock at night.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
But team about team once they get to tease or
Dragas says, his beeper is going off all night. It's
Yolanda Chambers.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
She would have been paid, but I want to call her, but.
Speaker 1 (29:54):
He had just met her the previous Sunday at another
nightclub called the Jaguar. In separate interviews, both to Forrest
and Ardregas tell detectives they hung out at teas until
past one am, catching up with old friends like Mama
Cat and Queasy.
Speaker 5 (30:11):
Right there, we were fucking with that girl Mama Kidd,
who were out telling you about Mamma Caedd and Queasy.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
But after they strike out at the club, Ardregas says
he finally calls Yolanda around two thirty AM, so I
call her told I will come get Ardregas says, he
and too Forrest pick up Yolanda and then head to
her friend Latanya's house, and just like Yolanda told police.
(30:37):
He also says that Latanya doesn't come out to meet
them right away. He remembers this clearly because it was
kind of annoying to go wow, to come out.
Speaker 5 (30:47):
Hot at daytime or night.
Speaker 2 (30:49):
You know, ain't got time to be waiting.
Speaker 6 (30:50):
Am Bad.
Speaker 1 (30:52):
Detectives also bring Latanya Henderson in for questioning. She talks
to a female officer without a parent or lawyer present,
and she says the same thing, So, Yolanda, and then picked.
Speaker 8 (31:05):
You up for a round three o'clock My time again
to call on three and third o'clock am in.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
A moment for it.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
All four of them say. They leave Latanya's house and
try to get a room.
Speaker 12 (31:17):
I see when we pulled up at the fair viaam
we went to Fairfield first to put them in a
fair Field.
Speaker 1 (31:27):
Just like Yolanda says. They tell police that the Fairfield
Inn is booked, so they head to the Super eight Motel.
This is where officers stopped them as part of their
sweep of cars across Homewood. At this point, ardregis to forrest. Latania,
and Yolanda have all independently described similar versions of the
(31:50):
night to detectives, with one huge exception. No one in
the car says they know anything about Deputy Hardy Murder
except Yolanda.
Speaker 6 (32:26):
Today David July twenty sixth, nineteen ninety five. At the
time is twelve thirty seven, two.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
Days after her first recorded interview with police, Yolanda Chambers
is back in for questioning. At first, Yolanda tells a
similar story to her first interview that she heard Ardregis
say that to Forrest killed a cop.
Speaker 6 (32:49):
Did you say anything? Is now.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
The tape recorder is turned off. Forty minutes later, they
start recording again.
Speaker 7 (33:02):
Bes Sharton Richard and I'm uh restarting to uh to
take the time as uh twenty minutes to two, and
we took a short break.
Speaker 6 (33:11):
Uh we gonna get started again. You're learned to uh.
During our break time, Uh, we talked something about the
the incident of the for the case.
Speaker 7 (33:26):
Now, I was gonna ask you now what you have
already told me during the times that I have interviewed you,
is that the truth?
Speaker 6 (33:36):
No, it's not the truth. No, did any that you
told me? Did any of that occur?
Speaker 2 (33:44):
Can occur, but it was not nothing that I had occurred. Mkay.
Speaker 7 (33:50):
So are you telling me that you didn't get this
second hand that when this deputy was shot and killed.
Speaker 2 (33:56):
That you were there, M No, I didn't get it.
Shaking hand, how of then I'm an.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
She says she was actually there when Hardy was shot,
and she's about to tell detectives a completely different version
of what happened that night.
Speaker 6 (34:15):
Okay, tell me about that.
Speaker 8 (34:18):
Well, when I told you that they were supposed to
come get me around back, he be given me by
eleventh thirty, they did come and give me.
Speaker 1 (34:28):
As the act for five, Yolanda now says that to
Forrest and Rodregaz came to pick her up around eleven
thirty pm instead of two am.
Speaker 2 (34:39):
You know, path they came and got new women gat
her crying you were you were ready?
Speaker 6 (34:45):
Yuh huh women? You mean brought right out right on
now okay.
Speaker 1 (34:51):
Yolanda says that Latanya hops right into the car instead
of taking a long time to get ready.
Speaker 6 (34:58):
Did you know at the time, y'all we're going?
Speaker 2 (35:01):
Yeah, where were you doing?
Speaker 5 (35:04):
Okay?
Speaker 6 (35:05):
So did y'all go to the crass their?
Speaker 2 (35:07):
Yeah, we went, we went.
Speaker 1 (35:10):
She now says they left Latanya's house and went straight
to the Crown Sterling Suite's hotel.
Speaker 6 (35:17):
And what time do you think you got there?
Speaker 2 (35:19):
A little Astafoya because Draco's drive pad.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
So Yolanda names an arrival time that fits neatly with
Hardy's murder, which was around twelve to fifty am. And
then she says that our Dregas and de Forrest we're
meeting up with some guys at the hotel to do
a drug deal, okay.
Speaker 6 (35:40):
And where did y'all call.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
On the SAD Now on the SAD for the south
right cross from where the bank.
Speaker 1 (35:48):
Is, she says they pull up on the side of
the hotel, across from another car that flashes its lights
at them. Inside that car, Yolanda says she sees three
people and two of them are the guys she previously
identified in photos that police showed her, Omar Barry and
Quintez Wilson. Yolanda says that Omar and Quintez walk over
(36:13):
to Ardregas's car and to Forrest gets out to join them. Yolanda, Latanya,
and Ardregas stay in the car, and Yolanda says this
is when she sees Deputy Bill Hardy walk around the
side of the building. In the final six minutes of
this recording, Yolanda tells a disjointed version of events she says,
(36:36):
Deputy Hardy meets up with this group of men in
the parking lot and they huddle up, then all walk
toward the front entrance of the hotel. She says they're
gone for thirty to forty minutes, when to Forrest, who
she calls Carlos jogs back to the cars, Carlo.
Speaker 2 (36:54):
Jumping for the man who on this gold is cold,
it's cold, got to start, you do now.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Up until this point, Yolanda has not mentioned Hardy's murder.
Speaker 6 (37:05):
Okay, Now, you mentioned to me that you heard what
you thought was three shots.
Speaker 2 (37:09):
But when we heard it, we were like, we know
what it was. We didn't know what was going on.
Speaker 1 (37:14):
This is the first time there's any mention on tape
that Yolanda heard gunshots. She confirms it after Tony Richardson
brings it up.
Speaker 11 (37:24):
So you heard those shots before he ever ran back
to school when they will call in their long period
of time.
Speaker 6 (37:30):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (37:31):
This version of events does not line up with what
Richardson knows about the crime. Hardy was murdered at the
back entrance of the hotel, not the side near the
bank where Yolanda says they were parked, and definitely not
the front of the hotel where she claims this group
of men disappeared with Hardy.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
This is what you're telling me now, this is the
honest for guy truth.
Speaker 6 (37:56):
Okay, why did you tell me from the A I
was scared.
Speaker 8 (38:02):
I didn't know what wasn' I just think I ways
to Okay, I just want to if.
Speaker 2 (38:10):
I knew of about it.
Speaker 8 (38:13):
You know, I didn't wanted to let you know that
I have some information about it, but I don't want
you out to know how they're the age of pass.
Speaker 1 (38:24):
The recorder is turned off yet again for almost an hour.
When the tape starts up again, Sergeant Salter asks the questions, Ms.
Speaker 9 (38:35):
Chambers, we need to clarify something about where y'all were
parked at at the Crown Sterling Suites, and it's my
understanding that y'all drove in to the parking lot to
the back door.
Speaker 6 (38:47):
Is that correct?
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Correct?
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Yolanda now agrees that they were parked at the back
of the hotel where Hardy was shot. There's no discussion
on tape about why this detailed chained changed, and then
her story changes again. She says she didn't just hear
the shots. She says she sees Deputy Hardy falling to
(39:10):
the ground right after he shot.
Speaker 2 (39:14):
I heard the first shot, and then I looked over.
He had already fail. You were falling.
Speaker 9 (39:20):
He was falling when you saw him. Who was standing
in front of him? When you saw him falling?
Speaker 2 (39:25):
It was a little Carlo.
Speaker 4 (39:27):
Did you see a gun.
Speaker 6 (39:29):
At the bad time? You didn't? Did you hear another shot?
Speaker 2 (39:32):
I heard? I heard three shots.
Speaker 4 (39:36):
You heard three shots?
Speaker 6 (39:38):
Okay? Then what happened?
Speaker 2 (39:45):
And then a running who started running all over him?
Speaker 6 (39:51):
Okay?
Speaker 1 (39:52):
Sergeant Salter then prompts her to talk about what she
sees when to Forrest gets back into Ardregus's money.
Speaker 9 (39:59):
Carlo, did he have anything on his hand that you
told me?
Speaker 3 (40:03):
Blood?
Speaker 6 (40:04):
Did you think he was hurt?
Speaker 2 (40:06):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (40:08):
Did you see how he got the blood on his hands?
Speaker 2 (40:10):
No, I've just seen the blood. I don't put it
on me.
Speaker 1 (40:14):
Yolanda chambers statement to police has gone from hearing Ardrega
say his buddy smoked a cop to actually being at
the Crown Sterling Suites wind shots were fired and seeing
blood dripping off to Forrest's hands.
Speaker 5 (40:34):
Did I believe everything Lena told me?
Speaker 6 (40:37):
No?
Speaker 3 (40:37):
Hell no, hell no. But Yolanda told a lot of truth.
Why she was trying to hide it by telling lovels?
Speaker 1 (40:48):
Why do you think she told a lot of truth?
Like what convinced you that some of what she was
telling you was truth and some wasn't?
Speaker 6 (40:56):
You know?
Speaker 3 (40:56):
Police officers through their gnahge investigative skills, history.
Speaker 5 (41:04):
You know, they know how to put things together.
Speaker 3 (41:10):
So I started talking to you, but I already know
in my mind before you ever started talking, what happened,
how it happened.
Speaker 1 (41:49):
After two days of on the record interviews with police,
Yolanda now says that she to Forrest and Ardregis, her
friend Latanya, along with OMR Berry and quint Tess Wilson.
We're all there at the Crown Sterling Suites when Deputy
Hardy was killed. But all five people she places at
(42:09):
the hotel deny being there. The officer who interviews Latanya Henderson,
confronts her with Yolanda's latest story.
Speaker 3 (42:19):
So what she's saying she was there and I was there.
Speaker 4 (42:22):
That's a lie. That's a lie. That's a shame.
Speaker 2 (42:26):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (42:27):
So Yolanda's line, she surely lives, Okay. So y'all never
went to Crown Sterling, y'all, w I went to super eight.
That's it. I don't know Crown stir lives. Okay, is
Crown stirring myself?
Speaker 2 (42:39):
Eight?
Speaker 6 (42:40):
No?
Speaker 2 (42:41):
Well, then I didn't go, and I'm telling truth.
Speaker 1 (42:46):
Police also confront to Forrest with Yolanda's story.
Speaker 5 (42:51):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (42:51):
Everything that I did, I explained it to you exactly.
Everything you sup to the Crown.
Speaker 5 (43:01):
We take a trip down. Yeah, she took a trip
to the Crown up so he did.
Speaker 3 (43:07):
Yes, you did.
Speaker 6 (43:08):
Don't so.
Speaker 5 (43:11):
I didn't go to the ground. I hope you into the.
Speaker 9 (43:13):
Crown ipe crown still sweet, No, sir, I ain't been
to the Crown stairs, and I've been over.
Speaker 4 (43:23):
As un as he got you.
Speaker 1 (43:27):
They interrogate him for over two and a half hours.
No matter what to Forrest says, or how many times
he states plainly that he was not there and does
not know anything about the murder, investigators don't believe him.
Speaker 4 (43:43):
How have I given me some of the information that
you just have a hard time giving me.
Speaker 3 (43:48):
I'll say, I give you everything that I know about
two the night. I don't know anything else.
Speaker 6 (43:55):
I can't make myself chieving it, and I don't know
I told you all that I that's all I know.
Speaker 4 (44:03):
That's see.
Speaker 12 (44:04):
Now, all i'mna do is I'm just getting fucked.
Speaker 4 (44:06):
Is I'm gonna getting I'm money getting fucked. I don't
know who kidding that name.
Speaker 3 (44:10):
I ain't get that man.
Speaker 4 (44:11):
I'll I give you all that I know, Zoe, I
can't give you nothing. I don't think you give us
all that you know. I'm trying to give you all
the information that I know.
Speaker 6 (44:21):
Oh, Murch, I'll give you.
Speaker 4 (44:25):
I don't do anything.
Speaker 2 (44:26):
I'm just a way.
Speaker 3 (44:27):
You know what I'm saying, But you do, You're gonna
make me said I did I did not do it.
I was not deaf.
Speaker 1 (44:39):
From this point on, detectives rely on Yolanda to build
their narrative about the murder. They'll go on to interview
her over and over again, at least twenty five times,
and every time they talk to her, her story will change.
So why did continue to lean on this fifteen year
(45:02):
old girl even though they caught her in so many lives?
Speaker 6 (45:07):
And?
Speaker 1 (45:08):
Who is Yolanda Chambers? That's next time? Ear Witness is
a production of Lava for Good Podcasts in association with
Signal Company Number One. Executive producers are Jason Flamm, Jeff Kempler,
(45:30):
Kevin Wardis, and me Beth Shelburne. The investigative reporting for
this series was done by Me and MARAA McNamara. Producers
are MARAA McNamara, Hannah Bial and Jackie Polly. Kara Kornhaber
is our senior producer. Brit Spangler is our sound designer.
Additional story editing from Marie Sutton, fact check help from
(45:55):
Catherine Newhan, and special thanks to to Forrest Johnson's legal
defense team. You can follow the show on Instagram, TikTok, Facebook,
and Twitter at Lava for Good. To see behind the
scenes content from our investigation, visit Lava for Good dot
com slash ear witness
Last time on ear witness, I.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Have my mind spirit for Cross told you I have
a pit.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
What appears to be a.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Jumped the comedy police officer shot in the back of
our building. He hit that movie. He has been shot.
Speaker 4 (00:29):
Looks it looks too bad. And then I just heard
one say that's it.
Speaker 5 (00:36):
It's old. We can't do anymore. It's old. We can't
save it.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
He's gone. Tavarra Johnson. I remember he was pushing Adrika's
forward in a wheelchair.
Speaker 6 (00:49):
They came together.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
I had saw too far. I was pushing a Drinka's
in the club.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
I just sat two signs up and I left and
and he was still there.
Speaker 5 (00:59):
Yeah, he was.
Speaker 4 (01:00):
When I left.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
A deputy share working another deputy shares murder. Do you
think that was emotional? Yes, it was very and had
it been my decision the day we caught the people
that did it, let's put them on death throat.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
The murder of Deputy Bill Hardy behind the Crown Sterling
Sweets Hotel was the top news story in Birmingham on
July nineteenth, nineteen ninety five.
Speaker 6 (01:41):
And plays are looking for a cop killer.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
Someone shot forty nine year old William Hardy several times.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
In the year.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Slow start, but investigators are throwing everything they have behind
the caves. The TV news footage shows deputies wearing the
traditional black band over their badges, a gesture that expresses
for a fellow officer.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
We're somber, We're say it, but we know we have
a job to do, and we're determined to do that job.
Speaker 7 (02:08):
This is a very difficult night for William Hardy's family.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
The Hardy home is full of sorrow and pain as
they search for asss to a senseless crime. A week
after the murder, hundreds of people turn out for Deputy
Hardy's funeral.
Speaker 5 (02:25):
Thank you, my brothers, Thank you, my brothers.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Video footage of the funeral shows women in dresses fanning themselves.
It's summer in Alabama, a swampy ninety seven degrees. Someone
actually faints in the heat.
Speaker 8 (02:41):
We are still by that.
Speaker 9 (02:43):
We all have to do what Bill has already done.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
The church is packed, but at least one longtime colleague
of Hardy's isn't at the service.
Speaker 5 (02:55):
I didn't make the family.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
We worked this case so hard, and we were so
determined to get a resolution.
Speaker 5 (03:06):
I was working. I didn't make his.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Feel Tony Richardson is the lead detective on the case.
A prosecutor who used to work with Richardson tells me
he's a thorough investigator, a man who gets the job done.
But this case is different from any other he's worked before.
He's investigating the murder of someone he knows, someone he likes,
(03:32):
someone he worked with for almost two decades.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
When you got a deafor shriff killed over here, it's
high profile and people are expecting things out here, not
only you. You know you emotional. You want to find
the people who did this. You want somebody in customer.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
In the immediate hours after Deputy Hardy's murder, Detective Tony
Richardson and his investigators interviewed Marshal Kelly Cummings, the Keebler
cookie guy who heard the shots and saw someone drive away.
They also interview the front desk clerk at the hotel,
Barry Rushikov, and other people staying at the Crown Sterling
(04:19):
Suites who heard voices in the parking lot followed by gunshots.
No one they talked to says they actually saw the murder.
Just a few witnesses heard the gunshots and then saw
a car pull away. The lead evidence technician who's actually
Tony Richardson's brother, Deputy Charlie Richardson, finds two nine millimeters
(04:41):
shell casings at the scene. A ballistics expert will later
say that both casings came from the same gun, and
that's pretty much all they have to go on. Police
sweep the surrounding area and pull over any vehicle's loosely
matching descriptions from hotel guests, but it doesn't get them
very far.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
Not only do you want somebody in custody. The lieutenant
is telling me, we need to get this done. The
captain is telling the lieutenant, we need to get this done.
The sheriff, you're telling the captain, we need to get
this done.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Nine hours after Hardy is killed, the Sheriff's department announces
a reward for information. The reward amount would eventually grow
to twenty thousand dollars adjusted for inflation, that's about forty
grand today. And once a tip line is announced, the
phone start ringing. One caller says a guy known as
(05:43):
Big Man told him his cousin was involved. Another says
a member of the Disciples gang carried out the murder.
Officers sift through this information trying to decipher what's worth
pursuing and which callers might be pranks, are people just
interested in the rear ward money. Days go by and
they still don't have a suspect. And then Detective Richardson
(06:07):
speaks to a woman named Rosa Hardy, and what she
tells him eclipses every other lead he has.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
And she told me, she says, my daughter knows who
killed Bill.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
I'm Beth Shelburne. This is ear witness chapter two.
Speaker 10 (06:34):
Don't know Diddley, anybody that was not there when I
(07:08):
was there, anybody that was not there when Harry was shot.
Speaker 3 (07:17):
Don't know deadily.
Speaker 5 (07:20):
About this case.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
When I first got the enormous trove of records in
the investigative file, I spent hours and hours just staring
at my computer, overwhelmed by thousands of pages of documents.
Right away I knew I wanted to talk to Tony Richardson,
the lead investigator in Hardy's murder. His name is on
(07:43):
most of the police reports, and it's his voice we
hear on a lot of the interrogation tapes.
Speaker 11 (07:49):
Sorry of Tony vision, Jeff, we got a Shuran service.
Today's data is.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
When I first call him. For an interview. He says
it would be best not to talk with me, but
Richardson keeps talking for twenty five minutes. It seems like
he's got a lot on his mind. Two weeks later,
he agrees to go on the record.
Speaker 6 (08:11):
Listen.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
I've decided I'm going to speak with you concerning your podcast.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Great, I'm really glad to hear that. My producer Mara,
and I meet him in a conference room of a
local library.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Okay, how are you. I'm Beth Tony. This is Maura.
Nice to be too.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
He's dressed casually, jeans, a black sweatshirt, a US Marines
ball cap, and a toothpick he keeps in his mouth
the entire interview.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
Somebody when they hear this, they're going to be questioning
my integrity. You know, is this guy telling the truth for?
Is he just telling the story? So I'll talk to
you to the NSKY.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
When Detective Tony Richardson first gets that tip from Rosa Hardy,
he goes over to the Ford dealership where she works
as a receptionist.
Speaker 5 (09:16):
I was always pretty thorough.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
I wrote everything down, He writes in a report that
Rosa Hardy told an officer that her daughter had information
concerning the crime. The police report reads, Miss Hardy told
us that after she arrived for work at twelve noon
of seven nineteen, she heard a police officer had been killed.
(09:40):
She bought a newspaper and learned the victim was someone
she and her family knew personally. Rosa knew Deputy Hardy
and his wife. They have the same last name, but
they're not related. They were good friends. The report goes
on to say that Rosa's daughter, Yolanda Chambers, called her
at work. Rosa told her that the officer that had
(10:03):
been killed was Bill Hardy. According to Rosa, her daughter
Yolanda responded, Mama, I didn't know it was him, And
then Yolanda went on to say she knew who killed him.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
She says, my daughter knows who killed Bill. Well great will.
She talked to me, I don't know. She kind of reluctant.
She don't want to do it. I'm trying to get
her to do it, and I was just begging her,
you know, let's figure out a way to.
Speaker 5 (10:44):
Get her in. We need her.
Speaker 1 (10:46):
But Rosa isn't sure where Yolanda is.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
I think at the time, Yolanda was a semi runaway
or whatever, but she wasn't there, okay, So we worked
very hard with Mom to get Yolanda in.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
Later that evening, Rosa calls the Sheriff's office and says,
Yolanda is at her apartment, and that's where Richardson picks
her up. He brings Yolanda to Sheriff's headquarters for questioning.
Speaker 11 (11:17):
Charlton, Tony rich and Jeffson Kuint of Shriff's Office. Today's
date is July twenty fourth, nineteen ninety five. The time
it's eleven twenty pm. I'm at the Sheriff's Office headquarters
along with Officer James Branton at the Birmingham Police Department
and Yolanda Michelle Chambers.
Speaker 12 (11:36):
Yolanda is a black female. She's fifteen years of age. Again,
what I want to talk to you about.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Is Yolanda is by herself in a room with detectives
and a tape recorder.
Speaker 12 (11:50):
So I guess the best way for us to proceed
is for you to tell me. First of all, when
you learned that w Hardy had been killed?
Speaker 8 (11:58):
All right, if I'm not mistaken, it was a Friday,
Me and one of my girlfriends, say he named Latanya
me and her and two guys are supposed to hook
cup that night.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Yeah, you know they're older than us. One is twenty one.
They call him Dre. He's in a wheelchair.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
Dre is ur Dregas Ford's nickname, And for some reason
in this interview, Yolanda refers to to Forest as Carlos,
and he has.
Speaker 8 (12:28):
A brother named Carlos, so we you know, we was
supposed to hook up, you know, after they left Teeves.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
To Forest and Ardregas are not related, and to Forest's
nickname has never been Carlos. It's unclear why Yolanda refers
to him this way, but she tells police that Ardregas
called her around two am. He and to Forrest had
left Tea's place and were on their way to pick
her up.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
You know they'd be on time. They call it around
about two or three, you know, be like come on.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Ardregas asks Yolanda to bring along a friend for to Forest.
So after they pick up Yolanda, they all drive to
pick up her friend, Latanya Henderson, who lives a few
minutes away. I want to take a moment to address
the age gap between to Forest, Ardregas and the girls
they're picking up to Forest is twenty two, Ardregas is
(13:24):
twenty one, Latania is sixteen, and Yolanda is fifteen. To
Forest and Ardregas met Yolanda and Latania at a night
club two nights prior to picking them up after teas.
It's likely that the girls lied about their age to
get into the club where they met. But I don't
know if to Forest and Ardregas knew how old they were.
(13:47):
I don't even know if it came up. The age
of consent in Alabama is sixteen. But regardless, guys in
their early twenties picking up teenage girls. It's just problematic.
Speaker 8 (14:01):
Him and Carlos came down and we went all hand
to was in dear park Pe LaTaya.
Speaker 1 (14:07):
Yolanda says that once they get to Latanya's house, it
takes a while for Latanya to get ready.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
Oh yeah, going out and tell you about it.
Speaker 8 (14:15):
For forty minutes to get ready, take our bathroostoll because
she didn't have on no clothes.
Speaker 1 (14:19):
Latania finally sneaks out of her bedroom window to meet them.
Once the girls are in the car, Yolanda says that
something is off and ar Dregas seems nervous.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
You know and all like what's wronging wrong?
Speaker 8 (14:34):
Why we didn't got to get fill the wrong wen't either.
You know, it goes o injur chill out. So you
know we were ruding around. You know, we're telling hill
a man and it is smoked a cop.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
According to Yolanda or Dragas, says, the other guy in
the car with them, to Forrest had smoked a cop.
Speaker 8 (14:59):
You know who got their life playing y'all, got us
in the cartel y'all and did from did a crime.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
Somehow. This revelation that to Forrest and Ardregis were supposedly
just involved in the murder of a police officer doesn't
deter their plans, she says. The four of them drive
off to look for a hotel room.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
We rode around in Hollywood, US. We went to the
Fat Fear.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
Hand, but she says, the Fairfield end was booked solid
and so they head across the street to the Super
eight motel.
Speaker 8 (15:32):
So when we went light cross to the suba eighth ahole,
lot of cops came from knowing sheriffs and everything just
came and I'll you.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Know, and hated everybody to get at the car.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
It's there and the Super eight parking lot that officers
tell the group they're investigating the murder of a deputy
who was shot and killed earlier that night a few
miles away at the Crown Sterling Suitets Hotel. Remember, officers
were on the lookout for cars in the vicinity of
the crime scene, and this is why they pull in
behind the Monte Carlo in the Super eight parking lot.
(16:11):
One of the officers later testifies that he tried to
extract ar Dregis from the car before learning that he's paralyzed.
The officer makes to Forest get out of the car,
put his hands on the trunk while he pats him down,
then looks inside the Monte Carlo with his flashlight. He
finds nothing suspicious and decides to let everyone go except
(16:35):
to Forest because he has a misdemeanor warrant for driving
without a license, so police take to Forest to the
Birmingham City Jail and he bonds out later that afternoon. Meanwhile,
Ardregas's license is expired, so police won't let him drive home,
and he leaves the Monte Carlo in the Super eight
(16:55):
parking lot. He and the girls get a cab to
go home, and Yolanda crashes at a friend's house.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
She says.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
She calls her mom later that morning.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
How god my mom is? Next morning, she say, guess
not as being in big.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
That click, it's the sound of an officer turning the
tape recorder off. We don't know what's being said between
Yolanda and investigators when the tape is stopped, but Yolanda's
first interview isn't over. The tape starts rolling again.
Speaker 8 (17:33):
Okay, go ahead, Yeah, I'll tell my mom a bade
and she can see Landa. You know how the police
house that got killed last night.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
I'm right here.
Speaker 12 (17:42):
Okay, let me stop you again, okay, because I want
to make sure that we get it on the record.
Speaker 6 (17:46):
Now.
Speaker 12 (17:46):
You have already mentioned in your statement that this was
a Friday.
Speaker 8 (17:50):
It was a Tuesday, because that's when they had a
happy hour. It was going on with her Wednesday morning,
round back food.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Yolanda says that Carlos, remember, that's what she's calling to.
Forrest told her the time that he shot Deputy Hardy.
Speaker 8 (18:08):
But if they had worn bout twelve right now, twelve
thirty Carlos.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
And then Yolanda suggests a potential motive. She says deputy
Hardy had arrested to forrest before, and that's why he
supposedly shot him.
Speaker 8 (18:26):
No, because I think we are arrested him a found
before Carlos.
Speaker 12 (18:32):
You go where you're arrested him at.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
I think it has only the way he went to parison.
Speaker 1 (18:42):
An officer turns the tape recorder off for a second time.
When the tape resumes, Yolanda offers a different motive for
Hardy's murder now. She says they killed him after an
attempted robbery, and since Hardy had seen their faces, it
just made sense to kill him.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Got a mouth things former do with kill him.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
In the last minutes of the interview, detectives ask Yolanda
why Ardregis and Carlos had gone to the Crown Sterling Suites,
and she says they wanted to get a room because
they sell drugs. They ask her if she knows anybody
else these guys run with. Yolanda points to the photos
of two other men and a stack that police show her.
(19:32):
You hear Richardson say she has identified Omar Berry and
Quintez Wilson.
Speaker 5 (19:40):
Quinte Is Wilson.
Speaker 12 (19:42):
This guy you look at you know him as what Okay,
that's the photograph of Omar Berry.
Speaker 1 (19:48):
These two other young black men are added to their
list of suspects. This first recorded interview lasts about thirty
five minutes, and right at the end, an officer asks
Yolanda if anyone has made promises to her.
Speaker 5 (20:04):
They promises to you by the statements you just made.
Speaker 6 (20:07):
No.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Vin.
Speaker 1 (20:18):
She answers no. Then we hear her say the only
thing y'all gonna and then there's seven long seconds of silence.
Speaker 12 (20:31):
It's Charlie Richardson. This is going to conclude this interview
at this time eleven PM.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
I listened to this interview over and over again, and
what stands out is that each time officers stop and
then restart the tape, there's a shift in Yolanda's story.
At first, first she says it was a Friday that
she heard about Hardy's murder. Then, after the tape stops
(21:06):
and restarts, Richardson prompts her for the date, and she
corrects herself and says it was a Tuesday night going
into Wednesday. With every restart of the tape, Richardson gets
a story that lines up more and more with the
facts surrounding Hardy's murder, that he was shot on Wednesday
(21:27):
morning behind the Crown Sterling at twelve fifty am. And
then there's the motives. Yolanda provides first that to Forest
killed Hardy because Hardy had arrested him previously. But we
know Hardy had not arrested to Forrest at the time
of his death. Hardy worked in court services. His duties
(21:49):
involved serving subpoenas and directing traffic outside the courthouse. I've
seen zero evidence that Deputy Hardy ever came into contact
with four Worst Johnson. After the tape stops and restarts,
Yolanda gives a second motive that the crime started as
an attempted robbery that ends in Hardy's murder. I asked
(22:13):
Tony Richardson about his approach with Yolanda.
Speaker 3 (22:17):
Yolanda was reluctant. She didn't want to talk, she didn't
want We had to keep better and we had to
pull like polenty, you know, Yolanda, we need this and
sometimes we'd have to be stern, you know, infirm, trying
to shake her. You know, sometime we'd have to be soft,
whatever will work to get this information out of her.
Speaker 1 (22:39):
There are a lot of stops and starts and I
wonder what is going on? Then like the tape stops
and then it restarts. I could do you when you
go off the record with people? I mean, what what
is best practices?
Speaker 5 (22:57):
For best practice? If not is not to go off
the record, that's the best practice.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
I mean, once you cut the tape on, unless the
tape runs out and you changing the tape, you don't
cut it off until you're done. There's no way I
can tell you why the tape stopped, but I will
tell you this. It didn't stop so something sinister could happen.
Speaker 5 (23:23):
I can tell you that.
Speaker 1 (23:27):
What would do you do off the record though?
Speaker 3 (23:30):
I mean somebody could have wanted to go to the bathroom,
or could have just motioned for a break, or or
could have even motioned to say, cut that thing off.
You know, there's no way I can tell you why
(23:51):
it was cut off. I can tell you there's nothing
sinister here. I mean, there's no smoking gun here as
far as doing anything that was not above board. Never
never occurred, never happened, never happened.
Speaker 13 (24:29):
It was early in the morning and I was just
lounging around in my apartment, you know, and I had
my front door was open, and where I was sitting,
I could see out the door and here I see
just cars one Marco.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
In July of nineteen ninety five, to Forrest and his
cousin Antonio Green were living together. But on the morning
of the twenty fifth, Antonio is alone in their apartment
when police cars.
Speaker 5 (24:53):
Pull out over there.
Speaker 13 (24:54):
So I see him pulling up in the front lot
in the bag, and I'm like, oh, what's going on
over here? You know, next thing I know, they're in
my daughter and their acts was to far As Johnson there.
I said, no, no, he's been staying here. But while
he asking me this, they've already came in bought both doors,
so they're already in my house. They're going down the hallway.
(25:14):
So I'm thinking, nah, this must be something serious, you know,
whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
So this guy's telling me what officers say they're looking
for to Forest because they think he might know something
about a.
Speaker 13 (25:24):
Murder something or when they said murder, that really just
threw me all the way to the left, because violent.
He wasn't never violent, you know, rambunks his teenager, young
kid doing what all of us were doing, and far
as a partying and having a good time and all this,
but violence never.
Speaker 6 (25:43):
He was never a violent person.
Speaker 1 (25:45):
As officers walk through Antonio's house, his phone rings. It's
his grandfather and he says police are at his house too.
Antonio hangs up and the phone rings again, ring again.
Speaker 4 (26:00):
I answered it, and it's him.
Speaker 5 (26:01):
It's the Forest.
Speaker 6 (26:02):
I said, hey, man, where you head?
Speaker 4 (26:04):
He said, I'm headed up there now. I said, yeah,
it's folks looking for you airways.
Speaker 13 (26:09):
Yeah, that's what I heard. I don't know what they want,
but I'm finna go and see now. I'm going up
dead house now and see what they want.
Speaker 6 (26:15):
So he did.
Speaker 1 (26:16):
To Forest tells his cousin he has no idea why
police want to talk to him, but he goes to
meet with them at his grandfather's house.
Speaker 13 (26:24):
Father's house and I heard him over the radio say
we got him in custody, and only then would they
lead house.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
Police take to Forest to Sheriff's office headquarters for questioning.
On the morning of July twenty fifth, the day after
they first talked to Yolanda Chambers, Detective Tony Richardson and
his partner Tom Salter asked to Forrest to walk them
through the evening of July eighteenth, the hours leading up
to Deputy Harty's murder.
Speaker 4 (26:55):
I suppose you're doing it five o'clock and even.
Speaker 5 (26:59):
Proud little again well who who.
Speaker 1 (27:03):
To Forrest says that around five pm he was getting
his haircut at a neighborhood spot called gas World Park
gas Station Park, barbershop and nail salon part convenience store. Afterwards,
he met up with his little brother at his mom's
apartment complex.
Speaker 4 (27:21):
He was hanging out outside. I think, yeah, we'd be
outside of ben On the little park or around.
Speaker 3 (27:27):
Walking is something to do?
Speaker 1 (27:30):
Any they to do is try to fire something to do,
trying to find something to do when there's nothing to do.
As to Forrest tells this to police, he has no
way of knowing that he's describing one of his last
few days of freedom.
Speaker 4 (27:49):
So you guys might take you home because you're hungry.
What'd you fix a blown sand?
Speaker 1 (27:56):
Yes, he fries himself a Bolognian cheese sand which play
Sega and listens to the radio.
Speaker 4 (28:05):
See, I think I stayed at home the Draga's game.
I think I stayed there.
Speaker 6 (28:10):
Came be me in.
Speaker 1 (28:13):
He stays there and tell his friend ar dregas Ford
picks him up in his nineteen seventy one black Monte
Carlo to go to Tea's place. While police asked to
Forrest about the night Hearty was killed. Others are out
looking for ar Dregas Ford. They knock on the door
of his mom's house. Here's Joyce Ford.
Speaker 14 (28:34):
Three o'clock that morning.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
I'll stayed at Central Park.
Speaker 14 (28:38):
Somebody knocked on the door and I said who is it?
And they said Jefferson, count of sheriff Man. So I
looked out the window. They were everywhere. I opened the
door and I was kind of nervous, and they said,
is Draga's Ford home?
Speaker 3 (28:54):
I said no.
Speaker 14 (28:56):
Then they said what can we come in? I said,
I don't have anything to have. You welcome to come in,
but do you have a search one? And they said no.
I said, well you can't come in. They said, well,
we have some questions to asks and can you bring
him in when he get home?
Speaker 3 (29:13):
And I told him.
Speaker 14 (29:14):
When he got home, I told him what happened and
he said, yeah, Ma, I'd be glad to go.
Speaker 1 (29:21):
So Joyce drives our Dregas to the Sheriff's office headquarters.
On the morning of July twenty sixth, detectives Richardson and
Salter ask him what he was up to on the
night of the murder. Richardson asks him what time he
picked up to Forrest first time you.
Speaker 6 (29:37):
Saw him tubes it was about ten o'clock at night.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
But team about team once they get to tease or
Dragas says, his beeper is going off all night. It's
Yolanda Chambers.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
She would have been paid, but I want to call her, but.
Speaker 1 (29:54):
He had just met her the previous Sunday at another
nightclub called the Jaguar. In separate interviews, both to Forrest
and Ardregas tell detectives they hung out at teas until
past one am, catching up with old friends like Mama
Cat and Queasy.
Speaker 5 (30:11):
Right there, we were fucking with that girl Mama Kidd,
who were out telling you about Mamma Caedd and Queasy.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
But after they strike out at the club, Ardregas says
he finally calls Yolanda around two thirty AM, so I
call her told I will come get Ardregas says, he
and too Forrest pick up Yolanda and then head to
her friend Latanya's house, and just like Yolanda told police.
(30:37):
He also says that Latanya doesn't come out to meet
them right away. He remembers this clearly because it was
kind of annoying to go wow, to come out.
Speaker 5 (30:47):
Hot at daytime or night.
Speaker 2 (30:49):
You know, ain't got time to be waiting.
Speaker 6 (30:50):
Am Bad.
Speaker 1 (30:52):
Detectives also bring Latanya Henderson in for questioning. She talks
to a female officer without a parent or lawyer present,
and she says the same thing, So, Yolanda, and then picked.
Speaker 8 (31:05):
You up for a round three o'clock My time again
to call on three and third o'clock am in.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
A moment for it.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
All four of them say. They leave Latanya's house and
try to get a room.
Speaker 12 (31:17):
I see when we pulled up at the fair viaam
we went to Fairfield first to put them in a
fair Field.
Speaker 1 (31:27):
Just like Yolanda says. They tell police that the Fairfield
Inn is booked, so they head to the Super eight Motel.
This is where officers stopped them as part of their
sweep of cars across Homewood. At this point, ardregis to forrest. Latania,
and Yolanda have all independently described similar versions of the
(31:50):
night to detectives, with one huge exception. No one in
the car says they know anything about Deputy Hardy Murder
except Yolanda.
Speaker 6 (32:26):
Today David July twenty sixth, nineteen ninety five. At the
time is twelve thirty seven, two.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
Days after her first recorded interview with police, Yolanda Chambers
is back in for questioning. At first, Yolanda tells a
similar story to her first interview that she heard Ardregis
say that to Forrest killed a cop.
Speaker 6 (32:49):
Did you say anything? Is now.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
The tape recorder is turned off. Forty minutes later, they
start recording again.
Speaker 7 (33:02):
Bes Sharton Richard and I'm uh restarting to uh to
take the time as uh twenty minutes to two, and
we took a short break.
Speaker 6 (33:11):
Uh we gonna get started again. You're learned to uh.
During our break time, Uh, we talked something about the
the incident of the for the case.
Speaker 7 (33:26):
Now, I was gonna ask you now what you have
already told me during the times that I have interviewed you,
is that the truth?
Speaker 6 (33:36):
No, it's not the truth. No, did any that you
told me? Did any of that occur?
Speaker 2 (33:44):
Can occur, but it was not nothing that I had occurred. Mkay.
Speaker 7 (33:50):
So are you telling me that you didn't get this
second hand that when this deputy was shot and killed.
Speaker 2 (33:56):
That you were there, M No, I didn't get it.
Shaking hand, how of then I'm an.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
She says she was actually there when Hardy was shot,
and she's about to tell detectives a completely different version
of what happened that night.
Speaker 6 (34:15):
Okay, tell me about that.
Speaker 8 (34:18):
Well, when I told you that they were supposed to
come get me around back, he be given me by
eleventh thirty, they did come and give me.
Speaker 1 (34:28):
As the act for five, Yolanda now says that to
Forrest and Rodregaz came to pick her up around eleven
thirty pm instead of two am.
Speaker 2 (34:39):
You know, path they came and got new women gat
her crying you were you were ready?
Speaker 6 (34:45):
Yuh huh women? You mean brought right out right on
now okay.
Speaker 1 (34:51):
Yolanda says that Latanya hops right into the car instead
of taking a long time to get ready.
Speaker 6 (34:58):
Did you know at the time, y'all we're going?
Speaker 2 (35:01):
Yeah, where were you doing?
Speaker 5 (35:04):
Okay?
Speaker 6 (35:05):
So did y'all go to the crass their?
Speaker 2 (35:07):
Yeah, we went, we went.
Speaker 1 (35:10):
She now says they left Latanya's house and went straight
to the Crown Sterling Suite's hotel.
Speaker 6 (35:17):
And what time do you think you got there?
Speaker 2 (35:19):
A little Astafoya because Draco's drive pad.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
So Yolanda names an arrival time that fits neatly with
Hardy's murder, which was around twelve to fifty am. And
then she says that our Dregas and de Forrest we're
meeting up with some guys at the hotel to do
a drug deal, okay.
Speaker 6 (35:40):
And where did y'all call.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
On the SAD Now on the SAD for the south
right cross from where the bank.
Speaker 1 (35:48):
Is, she says they pull up on the side of
the hotel, across from another car that flashes its lights
at them. Inside that car, Yolanda says she sees three
people and two of them are the guys she previously
identified in photos that police showed her, Omar Barry and
Quintez Wilson. Yolanda says that Omar and Quintez walk over
(36:13):
to Ardregas's car and to Forrest gets out to join them. Yolanda, Latanya,
and Ardregas stay in the car, and Yolanda says this
is when she sees Deputy Bill Hardy walk around the
side of the building. In the final six minutes of
this recording, Yolanda tells a disjointed version of events she says,
(36:36):
Deputy Hardy meets up with this group of men in
the parking lot and they huddle up, then all walk
toward the front entrance of the hotel. She says they're
gone for thirty to forty minutes, when to Forrest, who
she calls Carlos jogs back to the cars, Carlo.
Speaker 2 (36:54):
Jumping for the man who on this gold is cold,
it's cold, got to start, you do now.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Up until this point, Yolanda has not mentioned Hardy's murder.
Speaker 6 (37:05):
Okay, Now, you mentioned to me that you heard what
you thought was three shots.
Speaker 2 (37:09):
But when we heard it, we were like, we know
what it was. We didn't know what was going on.
Speaker 1 (37:14):
This is the first time there's any mention on tape
that Yolanda heard gunshots. She confirms it after Tony Richardson
brings it up.
Speaker 11 (37:24):
So you heard those shots before he ever ran back
to school when they will call in their long period
of time.
Speaker 6 (37:30):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (37:31):
This version of events does not line up with what
Richardson knows about the crime. Hardy was murdered at the
back entrance of the hotel, not the side near the
bank where Yolanda says they were parked, and definitely not
the front of the hotel where she claims this group
of men disappeared with Hardy.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
This is what you're telling me now, this is the
honest for guy truth.
Speaker 6 (37:56):
Okay, why did you tell me from the A I
was scared.
Speaker 8 (38:02):
I didn't know what wasn' I just think I ways
to Okay, I just want to if.
Speaker 2 (38:10):
I knew of about it.
Speaker 8 (38:13):
You know, I didn't wanted to let you know that
I have some information about it, but I don't want
you out to know how they're the age of pass.
Speaker 1 (38:24):
The recorder is turned off yet again for almost an hour.
When the tape starts up again, Sergeant Salter asks the questions, Ms.
Speaker 9 (38:35):
Chambers, we need to clarify something about where y'all were
parked at at the Crown Sterling Suites, and it's my
understanding that y'all drove in to the parking lot to
the back door.
Speaker 6 (38:47):
Is that correct?
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Correct?
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Yolanda now agrees that they were parked at the back
of the hotel where Hardy was shot. There's no discussion
on tape about why this detailed chained changed, and then
her story changes again. She says she didn't just hear
the shots. She says she sees Deputy Hardy falling to
(39:10):
the ground right after he shot.
Speaker 2 (39:14):
I heard the first shot, and then I looked over.
He had already fail. You were falling.
Speaker 9 (39:20):
He was falling when you saw him. Who was standing
in front of him? When you saw him falling?
Speaker 2 (39:25):
It was a little Carlo.
Speaker 4 (39:27):
Did you see a gun.
Speaker 6 (39:29):
At the bad time? You didn't? Did you hear another shot?
Speaker 2 (39:32):
I heard? I heard three shots.
Speaker 4 (39:36):
You heard three shots?
Speaker 6 (39:38):
Okay? Then what happened?
Speaker 2 (39:45):
And then a running who started running all over him?
Speaker 6 (39:51):
Okay?
Speaker 1 (39:52):
Sergeant Salter then prompts her to talk about what she
sees when to Forrest gets back into Ardregus's money.
Speaker 9 (39:59):
Carlo, did he have anything on his hand that you
told me?
Speaker 3 (40:03):
Blood?
Speaker 6 (40:04):
Did you think he was hurt?
Speaker 2 (40:06):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (40:08):
Did you see how he got the blood on his hands?
Speaker 2 (40:10):
No, I've just seen the blood. I don't put it
on me.
Speaker 1 (40:14):
Yolanda chambers statement to police has gone from hearing Ardrega
say his buddy smoked a cop to actually being at
the Crown Sterling Suites wind shots were fired and seeing
blood dripping off to Forrest's hands.
Speaker 5 (40:34):
Did I believe everything Lena told me?
Speaker 6 (40:37):
No?
Speaker 3 (40:37):
Hell no, hell no. But Yolanda told a lot of truth.
Why she was trying to hide it by telling lovels?
Speaker 1 (40:48):
Why do you think she told a lot of truth?
Like what convinced you that some of what she was
telling you was truth and some wasn't?
Speaker 6 (40:56):
You know?
Speaker 3 (40:56):
Police officers through their gnahge investigative skills, history.
Speaker 5 (41:04):
You know, they know how to put things together.
Speaker 3 (41:10):
So I started talking to you, but I already know
in my mind before you ever started talking, what happened,
how it happened.
Speaker 1 (41:49):
After two days of on the record interviews with police,
Yolanda now says that she to Forrest and Ardregis, her
friend Latanya, along with OMR Berry and quint Tess Wilson.
We're all there at the Crown Sterling Suites when Deputy
Hardy was killed. But all five people she places at
(42:09):
the hotel deny being there. The officer who interviews Latanya Henderson,
confronts her with Yolanda's latest story.
Speaker 3 (42:19):
So what she's saying she was there and I was there.
Speaker 4 (42:22):
That's a lie. That's a lie. That's a shame.
Speaker 2 (42:26):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (42:27):
So Yolanda's line, she surely lives, Okay. So y'all never
went to Crown Sterling, y'all, w I went to super eight.
That's it. I don't know Crown stir lives. Okay, is
Crown stirring myself?
Speaker 2 (42:39):
Eight?
Speaker 6 (42:40):
No?
Speaker 2 (42:41):
Well, then I didn't go, and I'm telling truth.
Speaker 1 (42:46):
Police also confront to Forrest with Yolanda's story.
Speaker 5 (42:51):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (42:51):
Everything that I did, I explained it to you exactly.
Everything you sup to the Crown.
Speaker 5 (43:01):
We take a trip down. Yeah, she took a trip
to the Crown up so he did.
Speaker 3 (43:07):
Yes, you did.
Speaker 6 (43:08):
Don't so.
Speaker 5 (43:11):
I didn't go to the ground. I hope you into the.
Speaker 9 (43:13):
Crown ipe crown still sweet, No, sir, I ain't been
to the Crown stairs, and I've been over.
Speaker 4 (43:23):
As un as he got you.
Speaker 1 (43:27):
They interrogate him for over two and a half hours.
No matter what to Forrest says, or how many times
he states plainly that he was not there and does
not know anything about the murder, investigators don't believe him.
Speaker 4 (43:43):
How have I given me some of the information that
you just have a hard time giving me.
Speaker 3 (43:48):
I'll say, I give you everything that I know about
two the night. I don't know anything else.
Speaker 6 (43:55):
I can't make myself chieving it, and I don't know
I told you all that I that's all I know.
Speaker 4 (44:03):
That's see.
Speaker 12 (44:04):
Now, all i'mna do is I'm just getting fucked.
Speaker 4 (44:06):
Is I'm gonna getting I'm money getting fucked. I don't
know who kidding that name.
Speaker 3 (44:10):
I ain't get that man.
Speaker 4 (44:11):
I'll I give you all that I know, Zoe, I
can't give you nothing. I don't think you give us
all that you know. I'm trying to give you all
the information that I know.
Speaker 6 (44:21):
Oh, Murch, I'll give you.
Speaker 4 (44:25):
I don't do anything.
Speaker 2 (44:26):
I'm just a way.
Speaker 3 (44:27):
You know what I'm saying, But you do, You're gonna
make me said I did I did not do it.
I was not deaf.
Speaker 1 (44:39):
From this point on, detectives rely on Yolanda to build
their narrative about the murder. They'll go on to interview
her over and over again, at least twenty five times,
and every time they talk to her, her story will change.
So why did continue to lean on this fifteen year
(45:02):
old girl even though they caught her in so many lives?
Speaker 6 (45:07):
And?
Speaker 1 (45:08):
Who is Yolanda Chambers? That's next time? Ear Witness is
a production of Lava for Good Podcasts in association with
Signal Company Number One. Executive producers are Jason Flamm, Jeff Kempler,
(45:30):
Kevin Wardis, and me Beth Shelburne. The investigative reporting for
this series was done by Me and MARAA McNamara. Producers
are MARAA McNamara, Hannah Bial and Jackie Polly. Kara Kornhaber
is our senior producer. Brit Spangler is our sound designer.
Additional story editing from Marie Sutton, fact check help from
(45:55):
Catherine Newhan, and special thanks to to Forrest Johnson's legal
defense team. You can follow the show on Instagram, TikTok, Facebook,
and Twitter at Lava for Good. To see behind the
scenes content from our investigation, visit Lava for Good dot
com slash ear witness
Host
Beth Shelburne
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