July 31, 2024 • 61 mins
The final session of Family Therapy focuses on forgiveness and personal growth. Each family member reflects on the impact of therapy and their hopes for the future. The conversation explores the power of positive thinking, focusing on accomplishments, and letting go of past mistakes. It emphasizes the importance of self-belief and recognizing one's own greatness. The session ends with the family members sharing their final thoughts and expressing gratitude for the healing journey they have been on.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Commitment is inherent in any genuinely loving relationship. Anyone who
is truly concerned for the spiritual growth of another knows
consciously or instinctively that he or she can significantly foster
that growth through a relationship of constancy. M Scott heck
(00:30):
Welcome back to Family Therapy. I'm your host, Elliott, Connie,
and for the last time this season, what's been better
since you listened to the previous episode? In fact, I
want to ask you what has been better since you
listened to this whole season. It is my greatest hope
that listening to this season and this family and these
(00:53):
questions through this process has made a difference in your life.
I want you to spend some time reflecting on what
those differences been. This week's episode highlights the final session
with Freddie, Jay and David. The conversation highlights the power
of forgiveness and the impact it can have on personal
growth and relationships. Each family member shared their thoughts on
(01:17):
how the process of therapy impacted them over the last
few months. They all agree there is more work to
be done and know that healing is not finite and
it doesn't look the same for everyone. The commitment vulnerability
and bravery of this family were absolutely inspiring. Jay, Now
(01:39):
that we're all here and this was at one time
something that would have been hard to imagine. What do
you hope is the outcome of a conversation like this?
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Are you sure or not?
Speaker 3 (01:51):
Pus my on a firing squad with at a blind
fon Freddy?
Speaker 4 (01:59):
What do I would like the outcome to be?
Speaker 5 (02:02):
I guess it's the same every time, just a better
understanding of ourselves and a better understanding of each other
and learning how we can help one another.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Okay, all right, David, Freddie, what about you?
Speaker 2 (02:16):
Guys?
Speaker 1 (02:17):
Like, what do you what do you hope is the
outcome of it?
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Well, personally, I hope that we can have a better
insight on the things that we want to achieve in
life together and separately.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
David, what about you? What do you what do you
hope we get achieved today?
Speaker 6 (02:34):
I mean, I think I'm pretty much on the same
page as everybody else, you know, a little bit more
insight understanding, you know, certain things that's going on. I
always look forward to the sessions, always walk away like
you know, that was a good session and a broader
(02:54):
mind shift of a little bit more than what it's
going on right now. So I'm ready to dive in
see what's going on.
Speaker 1 (03:01):
So, I mean, I think the first question I have
is all three of you have made progress in this
process that blows me away to be honest with you. Now,
let's imagine this is the last time we ever speak,
(03:22):
like after today, we can never speak again. What progress
do you hope do each of you hope will continue
to happen in spite of no longer being allowed to
speak to me ever, which isn't the case, by the way,
but let's pretend for a moment you cannot call me
ever and I cannot call you. What progress do you
(03:43):
each hope you will continue to make even though we
can no longer speak.
Speaker 6 (03:48):
I think staying the course and continue, you know, with
the communication part. I think over the last couple of months,
communication has been a little better than it has than
it was before.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Uh h.
Speaker 6 (04:06):
I feel like, you know, still with some work in progress,
but me personally, you know, taking on a.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Little bit more than usual, maybe you know, focusing on
what I really want.
Speaker 6 (04:23):
To do a little bit more is uh. I think
that's what I want to I feel like that's what
I'm gonna continue to keep doing after I walk away
from this?
Speaker 1 (04:35):
How would how would how would Freddie and Jay know
that you've continued doing those things? Like what would be
assigned to Jay specifically, but even Freddie? How would they
notice that continuing communication has continued to improve, You've continued
on this path, Like what would they notice that would
tell them, you know what, David is continued on that path?
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Well, I don't know about fucks.
Speaker 6 (05:03):
I don't know, man, Like you know, Jay's probably around
me the molds and.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 6 (05:10):
I just feel like, you know, probably through like conversations
or actions or just you know. That's why that I
think that's what she'd be able to see. But I
don't know like that that I can't like, yes, I
want people to notice or whatever, but if they don't, like,
(05:31):
I'm still gonna keep pushing, like you know what I'm saying.
So I don't know where that's gonna come from, you know,
but when it when it is, when it's when it's
out there. Though I do I do hear it from
Jay like I do hear it, like if she sees
it or if I say something, I do hear it, like,
good job, keep doing it.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
Yeah, but what are those things as you keep pushing?
You use the phrase like I'm gonna keep pushing. How
would you she know that you're continuing to push? What
would she see that would say, you know what, I
know he's not doing this just for me, and I
know he's not doing it just so that I noticed,
but I couldn't help but notice X, Y or Z
thing that is evidence that he is continuing to push himself.
(06:15):
Like how would she notice that?
Speaker 6 (06:17):
Well, well, one of the things that I'm really just
been diving in on. You know, she would definitely hear,
like because even now, you know, jumping in and out
of car, I got certain radio stations on, like listening
to certain stuff and you know, certain conversations on the
phone that's changing, or me on the laptop and something
(06:39):
else is open, you know what.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
I'm saying, So like their.
Speaker 6 (06:43):
Behavior is changing and the language and conversations are changing
because of what I'm focused on right now. So I
think that's how Jay would know, because she's gonna see like, yo,
like he love the Buckeyes, he love it nine ers old,
but like he talked about this twenty four to seven,
(07:06):
Like you know, he's locked in on it, So I
think that's I think those would be definitely some of
the telltale signs of how she would recognize that that
things are changing.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
Thank you, David. And how about Freddy and Jay? How
would you notice that you were continuing the progress that
you've made through this process.
Speaker 5 (07:28):
I guess that I would be continually trying to focus
on creating more positive.
Speaker 4 (07:35):
Habits in my life, so focusing on the good stuff.
Speaker 5 (07:40):
And you know, when people ask me how I'm doing,
I have something positive to say, and I'm actively trying
to see joy.
Speaker 4 (07:55):
In the day to day.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
In the life.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
So trying to.
Speaker 5 (08:07):
Just try to, you know, just try to focus on
the things that are really you know, small but still exceptional.
Speaker 4 (08:15):
And I think that's what I would do.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
How do you think David would notice that you were
doing that? Jake? What would be a sign to David,
someone who says he's close enough to you that he
would see it, Like, what would be a clue to
him that you were doing these things?
Speaker 4 (08:31):
Maybe I would be more engaged in small talk.
Speaker 5 (08:36):
I really don't like small talk, but probably because we,
you know, see each other every day, talk to each
other every day, sometimes we can kind of get lost
in that, So I think, you know, just sharing with
him a little bit more about the you know, the
good things that are going on and just expressing, you know,
(08:58):
the things that I noticed that that I'm doing or
that he's doing, and just bringing those things up in
conversation or sharing with him ways that I am focusing
on positive things. I think like things like that as
far as like exercising. If I hopefully when I start
(09:21):
more actively exercising, he'll see that, he'll probably just see
me smile a little bit more and just share that
happiness with him.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Do you think he likes that when you smile and
share the happiness with.
Speaker 4 (09:38):
Yeah, everybody does.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
Everybody? Okay, cool? Thank you, Jay and Freddie?
Speaker 2 (09:47):
What about you?
Speaker 1 (09:47):
How would you know that you were continuing the progress
that you've made through this process?
Speaker 3 (09:53):
Each and every day you expect things that of a
person and you just take it for granted and you
lose focus on it about saying that, how thankful for
you are? You know what I'm saying of like just
coming home to a nice hot meal. You know, you
take those things for granted. When you take things for granted,
you forget to give the appreciation back for someone you know,
sitting there with a hostile because I feel like my
(10:15):
life has excelled in a place where I never expected
for it to be, you know, my friends, with my family.
I still have a lot of setbacks in my life,
but I don't I don't like let it weigh me down,
you know what I mean. I don't try to like
I don't well and that little pity potty, you know
what I mean, saying well, better, it's gonna get better.
(10:37):
So I make the little initiative to increase the forth
to improve, you know what I mean. So I really
want things to be better. It seemed like one one
week it seems like it's going well, and then then
that everything just seemed like.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
This caves in.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
I'm like, oh, how mercy, you know what I mean.
We got hit rock bottom, you know, you know, to
get back on thread. So I'd be like, yo, lord,
you know, do your thing, man. Put put the spirit
into some chokers man, you know, because like I don't
think i'll be here. I don't be here that long.
Like like it's funny because, uh, when my mother was alive,
(11:16):
she's gonna have you, oh, massage your feet all the time.
And I used to, you know, I used to do
it because she her feet used to have the you know,
tingling and all that. I massage your feet all the time, right,
So one time she asked me a massage, and figureuse,
I wanted to go outside. I want to go do something.
I only know exactly what it was. But I didn't
do it right. So when I came home, she was
(11:36):
at the hospital and she died the next day. No
only thing I regret that I did massage your feet
that night. I still hold that. I still hold that, uh,
that that feeling aside. I mean, like, dang, why you
didn't do that?
Speaker 5 (11:53):
Man?
Speaker 7 (11:53):
You know?
Speaker 3 (11:54):
And it just I don't even know what made me
think about that, but I can feel the thrills running
through my body, Like, hey, Dad, can I.
Speaker 4 (12:01):
Ask you a question.
Speaker 5 (12:02):
Do you think your mother is looking down on you
and saying, dang, I wish you would have massaged my
feet that night, Or do you think she's looking down
on you and saying, Wow, I'm so proud of him
and how far he's come.
Speaker 3 (12:16):
Mm hmm, Well, I think she's extremely proud of me
that too. And I don't think jee thinking bemembering about
her feet, you know what I mean? That you hold personally, uh, yourself.
That's kind of like be agging at you, you know
what I mean. But I think she didn't even think
(12:37):
about no feet.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
You know, on that.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
That's funny because I think Jay Jay is highlighting something,
and Jay, I'm starting to wonder if maybe you should
be a psychotherapist at some point. She's highlighting something that
I want to I want to mention all three of you,
Like Freddie, you are one of the most incredible men
(13:03):
I've ever met. And what makes me say that is
there have been times in your life when you did
not make the right decisions for your family, and here
you are this entire time that I've known you. It's
(13:26):
all been so about I want to reconnect with my
kids and my family, and you have followed through on
that up to an including participating in this conversation and
conversations like this and getting clean and contacting your kids
(13:48):
and the way that you have It's one of the
most admirable things I've ever known. And I think what
Jay is pointing out is if you continue to focus
on the one thing you regret, like not rubbing your
mother's feet that day, instead of noticing all of the
(14:13):
wonderful traits about you that leads to a negative place.
So my question for you, and by the way, I'm
going to ask each of you a similar question, But
what do you think would happened to your life? Freddie
if you spend more time noticing all of the things
that are evidence that you're a wonderful human instead of
(14:36):
mistakes and problems and flaws.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
Jesus Christ. Wow, if I can eliminate all those things
and just go through life each and every day without
those uh barriers or things that would create chaos in
(15:05):
my life. But that's it's not it's not a real
concept because like I don't I don't dwell on the
fact that, uh I didn't do that. But at the
same time, I say to myself, like like Jay said,
she's uh, she's so proud of me as on my accomplishments. Uh,
(15:30):
it's not something.
Speaker 7 (15:30):
That that's wish I had done it, you know what
I mean, I would have felt I don't know if
it made me feel uh bad about not doing it
in the sense where it made a difference, you know, in.
Speaker 3 (15:44):
Her life of my life because because like I said
to it Ja, I don't even think she even remember
I didn't even do a fee, you know what I mean.
But uh, it's just the fact that I think, Uh,
like you said, some things in life you just you
hold on too. You know, no need, no reason to
hold on to that.
Speaker 1 (16:03):
So you know, so Freddy in it Throughout the course
of a normal day, do you spend more time thinking?
And I have no idea to answer this question. I'm
just I want to check in on something more time
thinking about mistakes you've made or the accomplishments you've achieved.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Oh of course, Uh. I think about the better achievements
in my life and the things that I can't improve on.
I don't dwell on the things that that I made
mistakes off. I can't. I can't change them with change
them at all, you know what I mean. I could
try to better and make it, make a better situation
out of today, I don't. I don't live in the past.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
That you know. I don't.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
I did what I've done in it and I got
to live with it. But I don't let it eat
me up inside. You know what I mean. I'm trying
to well out, you know what I mean. I advanced
so far, so I ain't gonna let those things keep me,
hold of me, hold me, hold me, hold of me,
because I've never succeeded. I never I've never accompissed anything
(17:10):
in life. If I keep doing on the things that
I mean.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
I think that's true. Ready, how do you do that?
How do you manage to realize? Like I just got
to focus on on these things, like, how do you
how do you manage to do that?
Speaker 3 (17:25):
Well, it's it's kind of simple, you know what I mean?
Because like, uh, at one time in my life, I
thought I never reached twenty five, you know what I mean?
When I uh, that was the age of twenty five. Uh,
I thought that was astounding of accomplishment because like the
way my life was going, I ain't the thing I
(17:45):
was going to establish that age. Now I'm like, I'm
gonna be sixty five in a minute, you know what
I mean.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
So I don't.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
I don't done that almost you know, double that already.
So now, like they said the ladies at the end
of the tunnel, you know, I don't see it as
at the end no more. You know what I'm saying.
It's right there, it is in my grass, what I mean. So, uh,
(18:14):
if when I went up tomorrow, God's willing, and I
got a plan on doing a few things, and you know,
you know, I'm hoping that this why my presence would
put a joyful smaller people's faces.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
You know what I mean, right, David? I would ask
a similar question to you. You are also one of
the most incredible people I've ever met. I consider it
to be such a privilege to have gotten to know you.
The things that you have done in your life. If
you look at some of the things just from a
(18:52):
likelihood standpoint, like if I met you your fresh your
first day of school, your freshman year in high school,
the chances you would have achieved all of the things
you achieved were literally zero, but yet you achieved them anyway.
What happens to your life when you remember that you've
literally been like a superhero at certain points in your life.
(19:15):
I don't know that you think about that often enough,
And I find myself wondering when David remembers he's damn
near a literal living superhero. What happens to David's life
and the way he views himself? What do you think
about that, David?
Speaker 6 (19:32):
No, I do think about that, Like you know, I
think I think about it more now is because the
way I'm shifting to mind shift that I'm having because
I know, like you know, when times in the past
and sometimes you could go on to pass and build
from it because it was a good space. Past don't
always got to be negative things, right, So there's been
(19:54):
times when you know, back up against the wall or
somebody say you couldn't do something, or something seemed that
it was impossible of obtaining, and you know, and you
got to think back, what made you grab it? Because
you got there and what did you do? So what
would happen? Was it more disciplined on this way, was
(20:16):
it more concentration on this or you know, whatever it was,
it got you to that point. And then now like
you could take some of that, some of those same
type of techniques and apply.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
It to other other things, you know, and and it
would help.
Speaker 6 (20:34):
And it helps, and it does because like I'm grabbing
some of them techniques and pushing it towards other things.
Is just you know, now you got to push them.
You got to push them techniques around your entire life
now because it's not just you when it was in
the past. So that's that's the challenging part. How can
(20:57):
I fit this into everything.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
You know.
Speaker 6 (21:00):
That's why I said, you know, the better version of
David the more you know, the staying positive every day,
even when it's if it's a hiccup, you know, you
gotta rebound. Like I said before, you know, one of
the things my coaches always said is don't worry about
the last play. Concentrate on the next one. You know,
(21:21):
we can review that play when the game is over.
It right, and and that makes sense, So you can't
worry about the stuff that just happened, right, because it's
gonna mess up everything else that's in front of you.
Everything else is gonna mess it up. Like one negative thing.
One negative thing can be very bad, and it can,
(21:41):
you know, probably destroy your day.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
But let's let's think about it. What what what? What
was it?
Speaker 6 (21:49):
And all the positive other things that can happen, you know,
by just rebounding and putting that one to the side
and maybe revisiting it a later day when you're when
you're in a better mind state, then you can handle
that negative thing a little bit better and it's not
as bad as it was when it hits you Monday
and you're looking at it on Thursday.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
If it can wait that long or later on in
the day. But I feel like, you know, with a positive.
Speaker 6 (22:13):
Outlook, in a positive mind, you can accomplish the things
that you think are impossible because it has been done.
Especially for me, it has been done, so I know
it could be done again.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
What happens to your life as you continue to remember
that day, Because I really mean what I said, I
think you're an incredible man, and I would say I
think there were times when you forgot that. So what
happened to your life when you remember, like, I'm pretty
good at doing impossible things, like I'm pretty good at
(22:55):
being an absolute incredible human and accomplishing incredible thing. What
happens to your life when you're in that space, David?
Speaker 6 (23:05):
I mean, when you're in this, when you're it's just
a it's just a whole aura, a feeling of accomplishment,
no matter what it is, it's just it's just a
different feeling.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
It's a good feeling.
Speaker 6 (23:25):
It's a natural high and it's a good feeling. I'm
being honest with you, it is absolutely and you know,
and people me, I want that feeling a lot, and
people want that feeling, you know what I'm saying, So
you know, and it's not something that you're just gonna
(23:47):
just like it's take hard work to get to that
level of feeling, that level that that level whatever it
is that you're on that you are trying to get to.
Everybody path is differ for everybody. Thing is different, but
that level that feeling, who, yeah, it tastes good.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
And and and the thing David like, having that feeling
interesting doesn't make life any easier. Like, it's not like
life stop throwing curveballs at you or anything, but it
just seems that you're able to handle them better. Is
that Is that right?
Speaker 2 (24:27):
You think?
Speaker 6 (24:28):
Yeah, because a lot of times when you get to
that when whatever, like it's sometimes and most of the time, right,
if it's something and you get to the top of
it or whatever, right, you're gonna have some challenges. You're
gonna have some outsiders. You're gonna have this right, but
you're gonna you're gonna bail it, Like you said, you're
gonna beil and handle it differently because you know what
(24:51):
it took to get there. So you knew what it
took to get there. You're gonna bail and handle it.
You're gonna be able, your skin gonna be a little tougher.
Your mind gonna be.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
You know, you're gonna be.
Speaker 6 (25:02):
To handle whatever is coming out. You're gonna keep on
going because you want to be up there. You want
to be at that space within yourself. That's where you
want to be at because that's your space. That's how you.
You know, you focus at that space, you maneuver at
that space. That's a better version of you at that space,
and you can handle a lot of things at that space.
(25:23):
Not saying that everything is peaches and cream like an
apple pie, but when it's not like that, because you're
already in that mindset and that thinking, you're able to
handle it.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Thank you, David. We'll be right back with more family therapy.
And Jay, you were an incredible woman, And I don't
know if I've ever met a woman quite like you before.
Like we've been meeting now for all these weeks, and
(25:56):
it seems like every time we met, I learned something
new that was amazing about you that you didn't tell
me previously. Like I learned about your military experience. I
learned about your multiple degrees and the programs that you
graduated from. I learned about your investment properties and your
dreams and your wishes, and I admire like that is
(26:19):
just an inspiration to me when I hear it. And
I don't think I've ever met a person who more
than you needed to look in the mirror and see greatness.
How how do you think would make a difference in
your life if you learned? And again, Jay, and having
said that, I'm not saying you're perfect, as I'm not
(26:41):
saying anyone is perfect, But what different would it make
in your life? You just developed the habit to just
see greatness when you looked at yourself, when you like
analyzed yourself instead of flaws, problems, blah blah blah.
Speaker 5 (26:57):
I think I would create the life that I truly
want and believe that I can do it. I have
achieved a lot of things, but I haven't absolutely I
haven't achieved mastering myself yet, and I don't.
Speaker 4 (27:14):
I don't know if anyone.
Speaker 5 (27:15):
Ever really truly fully masters themselves. But I do think
I could be better at it. I think that there
are things that I want that, to be honest, like,
I'm afraid to do them.
Speaker 3 (27:33):
I don't be at you are afraid to do it?
How can you be afraid to do something you got
so far in life already, because.
Speaker 4 (27:42):
So there's the moves that I make. Are they're ris scared.
Speaker 5 (27:47):
Yeah, Like I don't want to work at my job.
I know I could shift gears and find something that
I enjoy, but I'm scared, so I don't do it.
But if I focused more on what I could do,
then then I would do those things, versus just saying, well,
(28:10):
this is what I got, so it's safe.
Speaker 4 (28:12):
So let me keep it. I really don't enjoy spending
forty hours a week staring at a computer. I feel
like that is such a waste of my energy and
my time.
Speaker 5 (28:27):
But the income is solid and I need it. So
there's like those more personal choices, like I can make
a business still happen because it's external, you know, it's
more of an external thing. But when it comes to
the lifestyle that I truly want, I don't.
Speaker 4 (28:51):
I don't know that.
Speaker 5 (28:54):
I mean, I've taken steps, but I don't know that
I've taken as many steps.
Speaker 4 (28:58):
As I could to true achieved that lifestyle.
Speaker 5 (29:03):
But if I focused on the good stuff, and if
I focused on what I could do with the confidence
of you've done so much already, then I would make
different moves.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
You know.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
And it's interesting that you say that, Jay, because you
have accomplished so much, and I don't think you've given
yourself credit right to the to the degree to which
you've accomplished. It's almost like you just kind of like,
ho hum it. And I'm like, wait a minute, that's
(29:38):
not a whole hum accomplishment Like that that thing, that
that degree you got, or that that achievement you had
in the military, or that business thing that you achieved,
or or even the level of jobs you got. Those
aren't whole hum accomplishments. And it's like you've done all
these great things but given yourself very little credit for them.
(29:59):
And I I just wonder what happens when Jay starts
giving herself credit for her brilliance, for her magic, for
her strength, for her fortitude resilience, Like what happens when
you start truly giving yourself credit for who you are?
Speaker 4 (30:15):
Yeah? I would I want unstick myself. I wouldn't. I
wouldn't feel stuck.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
And I'm not telling you you know tomorrow I want
you to quit your job because like, who knows, I
don't know what you would do.
Speaker 4 (30:28):
No, I'll make decisions like that.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
Yeah, but what would you what would be the first thing, Jay,
What do you think would be the first like even
micro step you might take when you start realizing, like
I'm going to give myself credit for the amazing person
that I am and the amazing things that I've achieved.
Speaker 5 (30:50):
Yeah, I mean it would. Part of it would be
looking for a different job. Part of it would be
that part of it would be instead of focus on
what I can't what I used to do physically, I
would just be like, Okay, let me, I'm gonna go
for this walk. I'm gonna go for this. Like I
saw somebody running the other day and I was like, damn, I.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Used to run.
Speaker 4 (31:13):
I used to do that, you know what I mean.
So I would probably, you know, be like, well, man,
maybe I can't do.
Speaker 5 (31:23):
Forty push ups in two minutes anymore, but I could
do ten.
Speaker 4 (31:26):
You know what I mean, Like, so let me do that.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
You know.
Speaker 5 (31:28):
I would just focus on what I could do and
do it instead of just knocking it off like it's
not as good as what I used to do. So
I ain't even gonna you know what I mean, Like
I would, I would just do what I can until
I get to the point of where I want to
be Jay.
Speaker 1 (31:44):
I love that. H I love that Jay. Now Jay,
perhaps me personally getting to know you, I've learned a
lot about you and some of your accomplishments. But I'm
I can't, I can't lie. I do have a favorite
accomplishment of yours. My favorite accomplishment of yours is the
(32:07):
way you have forgiven your father. I don't know if
I told you that was my favorite, but I think
I've told you that I admired it. To me, I
think that's the one thing that speaks the most to
who you are. I just want you to say, like,
how did you do that? And what does it mean
to you to see the way your father is doing
(32:30):
things now? What does it mean to you to see
the way Freddie is doing things now?
Speaker 4 (32:33):
I just, I guess I just focused on I just
allow him to be who he was.
Speaker 5 (32:42):
Without the expectations of who I wanted him to be.
Speaker 1 (32:47):
But how did you do that? How did you shift
your focus from what I was angry with him about
or what I was missing within him? How did you
shift your focus to I'm going to allow him to
be who he is without having any exces Like, how
did you do that?
Speaker 4 (33:02):
Well?
Speaker 5 (33:02):
I don't know that I ever really held a lot
of anger towards him.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
So how did you do that?
Speaker 5 (33:11):
Because I realized that he dealt with addiction, and I
don't see.
Speaker 4 (33:18):
Addiction as a flaw. I see it more as a disease.
Speaker 5 (33:25):
And I felt like if I was, if I was sick,
I wouldn't want someone to hold that against me.
Speaker 6 (33:31):
So I just I don't know.
Speaker 5 (33:35):
I just I just said, you know, if this is
his challenge, then that's his challenge, you know, and it's
hope hopefully one day he would overcome, and he did,
so I just I just didn't hold it against him.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
So going back to the theme of like, I'm not
sure Jay gives herself credit for things. Do you ever
realize how how rare that is and what a gift
that is that you've given to Freddy can say.
Speaker 5 (34:05):
Give a much stop, But I do think it is
a gift, I agree, not just to him, but to
myself as well.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
And not just to him, and not just to yourself,
but like to your kids and to David. And you
know what I mean, like because you did this, your
kids have a relationship with their grandfather because you did this,
Like have you ever sat back and realized that that
was such a massive gift and probably played a role
in saving.
Speaker 3 (34:36):
His life absolutely, because like when the whole world don't
believe in you and you just got one person that
still does, that's all you need, you know what I mean,
You could you could cipher off for that and restore
your life.
Speaker 2 (34:51):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (34:52):
I don't think anybody like uh I ever thought that
I was wont to get out of the round that
I was, you know what I mean. And every time
I talked to Daylan, she gave me that. That's that's
such encouragement. That gives me the strength.
Speaker 4 (35:07):
You know what.
Speaker 3 (35:07):
It's like they say some people got the foresight, got
that special eye. They could see all the goodness in
you and not all the bad and the evil in you.
And the person she could look at somebody and she
can see all the goodness that's inside the person and
not she or even the outside the person, you know
(35:29):
what I mean. So, uh, that's the gift I think
she really has that she not aware of it. Like
you said, most people don't get themselves the credit that
they are doing, you know what I mean, Because you
are a brief person. You have achieved and I'm very
proud of you know, some don't believe the other day
I was I was telling one of my coworkers. I
(35:51):
was like, he was talking about he got a little
son and he's like when five years old. He was
talking about the first baby steps and all that kind
of stuff. I was telling her, like, aw some them out.
She went to Africa and talked about how to read
and you know, things like that.
Speaker 4 (36:07):
And then I teach kids how to read.
Speaker 5 (36:09):
But I did start an organization that that collected books
and sent them to libraries in Africa.
Speaker 6 (36:17):
That's that's that's but that's what dads do, though, That's
what dad do. You gotta let them be great.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
My father used to do the same thing.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
You just proved my point.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
I know, I know I did.
Speaker 1 (36:33):
I had no idea that Jay had started an organization
that sent books the African libraries. Some kids had access
to books. Every time I talk to this woman, I
learned something new about something that she has achieved. But Freddy,
you said something a second ago that was really important.
(36:56):
You said that when you're in a difficult situation, when
you have that one person that believes in you, you
can like siphon off that I think is what you said.
Have you ever have you ever told Jay that she
was that one person that you always knew was looking
at you in a positive way like him? Have you
ever let her know that and let her know what
(37:16):
that meant to you?
Speaker 3 (37:19):
Actually, I don't. I don't believe I have, But this
is a great opportunity to do so. And I believe
that my whole life. You know, everybody uh needs that
that that's certain individual or have have that certain individual
in their corner where no matter what they've done in life,
(37:41):
they still believe in you know what I mean? And Jay,
you have been that person for me, you know what
I mean. Besides, she's been a treminous woman for me,
Like like I'm I'm not too good with women, like
my my track record with like relationships, it's not that
not that well, but different as made me more of
(38:03):
a man than I've ever been, you know what I mean.
She encouraged me just like Jay Lous. You know what
I'm saying. She gives me that in the strength that
and I think I don't have she gives to me,
you know what I mean. And you got two or
three women like that in your life, You're going with
you the world.
Speaker 8 (38:21):
Man.
Speaker 5 (38:22):
Yeah, she's dope.
Speaker 2 (38:24):
One thing I'm happy and I really enjoyed seeing.
Speaker 6 (38:29):
I love family. I come from a large family. I'm
close to a lot of my family, and you know,
I don't have my dad here, my mom's is gone.
I like Pops from day one. He's been my guy,
straight up. Ain't nothing changed about me. Ain't nothing. I've
been the same cat since I met Possible. And I'm
(38:52):
happy that Jalen got a relationship with him, Like I'm
being honest with me, him had serious talks. We can
laugh together, we can have great conversations and stuff, and
I like that. And I love the way he is
with my boys. Because my kids, I got.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
Three, two of them haven't met my dad.
Speaker 6 (39:12):
So I love the relationship that he is that he
has with is in easy and you know, and what
was And when I look at him and I look
at my pops, a lot of the same similarities, hard
lives came over that you know, became great people, you
know what I'm saying, and kept moving forward.
Speaker 2 (39:34):
So I understand him, and uh, and I get it right.
And it ain't.
Speaker 6 (39:40):
Easy and I let and I done told him that though.
But that's one thing I like, and I and and
and I and I see that, and I let him
take their own course. I don't push it in our
implore on that to be able to still have a
relationship because and and it's good.
Speaker 2 (39:53):
It's a good thing.
Speaker 6 (39:54):
And I look back and I see it, and you know,
I just wanted to say that because it is too
And Pops.
Speaker 2 (40:00):
I just wanted to give you a clue. It was like,
you're my guy, right. I don't know if I ever
told you that, But.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
It's such a powerful thing that Jay did that facilitated
all these other changes. Such a powerful thing that and Freddie,
I'm so glad that you would even voice that because
now she gets to hear it like I. Actually I
contributed to how he transformed his life. That's a real,
real powerful thing.
Speaker 5 (40:30):
It's really interesting to hear both of their perspectives on that,
because I actually never really thought about it too much.
Speaker 4 (40:36):
But I guess the beauty of.
Speaker 5 (40:38):
It is that when you don't I guess, when you
don't hold on to resentment and anger, you're opening the
door for blessings that you don't even realize you're opening
the door for damn.
Speaker 1 (40:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (40:50):
So I'm happy that you know, I was able to
do that because it is so many people that just
they're so angry, They're so angry about what could have been,
what should have been, Why isn't it this way or
why it has to be that way? And at the
end of the day, if you can have someone in
your life, you know, if they're not toxic towards you,
(41:14):
but they but they may not be exactly what you
want them to be, but the relationship can allow certain
things to manifest that even if it's not specifically for you,
it can be a blessing for other people around you.
And I think that is a really good example of it.
Speaker 1 (41:33):
To that point, Jay, I agree with every word you
just said, and I want to add one more thing.
Your father said one of your abilities is you can
see goodness in people even when they're doing evil things.
I think is what Freddie said. What do you think
about him saying you have that trait? You have that ability.
Speaker 4 (41:57):
I actually realize that as a trait that I have.
I'm good.
Speaker 5 (42:03):
I mean, I'm happy he noticed it too, But I
really do try to.
Speaker 4 (42:09):
Let people be who they are.
Speaker 5 (42:11):
My challenge, my personal challenge with that is creating the
boundaries around myself so that any negative traits don't have
a negative impact on me. But for the most part,
and I think I get that from my mother.
Speaker 4 (42:27):
She just she's the type of person.
Speaker 5 (42:29):
She just gonna let you be who you are, like
whoever you are, you know, rock out, And I guess
I get.
Speaker 4 (42:36):
It from her.
Speaker 5 (42:37):
And I think it is a good trait to have.
But you also have to be careful with that trait.
You know, there's there's things that people can bring to
the table that might not be good for you. So
I think I have a better balance at that than
she does.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
But yeah, I do.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
I do realize that that's a pretty incredible trait to have.
Speaker 4 (42:59):
Jack, Yeah, I'm pretty awesome.
Speaker 1 (43:08):
No, don't you?
Speaker 3 (43:09):
Did it?
Speaker 1 (43:11):
Like I kind of want you looking in the mirror
every day and be like, yeah, I'm pretty awesome. I
want you to give you.
Speaker 2 (43:17):
You should you are awesome.
Speaker 1 (43:19):
Yes, I want you to give that same grace that
you so eloquently gave to others, including your father, to yourselfself.
What if you use that superhero treat on you?
Speaker 5 (43:36):
Yeah, David tells me all the time, it's so hard
on myself, But he's right, and you're right.
Speaker 2 (43:43):
She's very hard on herself. Jay is like she got it.
Speaker 6 (43:51):
She and I see it sometimes and I don't hear
her speak to me, and sometimes like I don't say nothing.
I let her bring it out of herself because how
awesome she is and how smart she is is just
some things with my skill set that I see and
I'm like, yo, she gotta bring it out herself. I
can't say it, like you know what I'm saying. And
(44:12):
she's very tough on herself, Like she's very very tough,
and it's nothing wrong with being tough on yourself, but
sometimes I feel like, yo, you're being a little bit
too hard on yourself, like for real, like yo, that's fly,
Like yeah, take them like I told you. I said
this to my sister, right, I said this, right, And
(44:33):
I have said this before to people out on train
or whatever, and somebody does said this to me. You
gotta employ yourself for the small accomplishments and small goals
and the baby steps.
Speaker 2 (44:43):
Give yourself that high five, like hell yeah, like and
I say that like yes, like sometimes I get myself
to high five. I don't care.
Speaker 6 (44:52):
I don't need it to be exactly hitting on all cylinders.
But it was a small accomplishment so it can hit
on all cylinders. So you high five yourself and keep moving,
and keep moving, keep moving.
Speaker 1 (45:03):
I love the idea of all of you celebrating, like
giving yourselves high fives, because for each of you it's different,
but I have a similar experience with all of you.
Jay's a bit more extreme because every time I talk
to those women, I learned something new about something great
she does. But all three of you I have that
(45:26):
same experience. Like I don't know that these people give
themselves enough credit for just how how wonderful the things
that they have done are, including participating in this project, like, Freddie,
have you have you thought about like this? These are
the kind of things I think about, Freddie? Have you
(45:47):
thought about how many how many men are going to
watch you as an example of how to fix wrongs
that they've done in their path? Have you thought about that, Freddy?
How many men will be inspired, not all to be
like you know what if that guy could contact his son,
(46:08):
if that guy could reconnect with his dark man, I
can do it too. Have you thought about that?
Speaker 2 (46:12):
Freddy?
Speaker 3 (46:14):
Noah, absolutely haven't uh like this? This this program has
done uh great insight on my own life. You know
what I mean. I feel that most most black men
don't do there, you know what I mean, out of
it's out of the round, you know what I mean.
We were strong, we dominate, were gonna we could handle it,
(46:36):
you know what I mean. All of us need you know,
a therapeutical program, you know, so so we could dig
deep within and with and without, you know what I mean.
So if you you don't do that in your life,
you're gonna be stagnated.
Speaker 8 (46:51):
You're always gonna be like bewildered you, You're always gonna
be hurting.
Speaker 3 (46:54):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (46:55):
You gott you can, you can.
Speaker 8 (46:57):
You gotta dig and find yourself man, and like and
some things like through this this process, I didn't know
about that insight to encourage Its almost like it's a
it's a way way off your chest, you might say,
off your shoulders, you know what I mean. This just
to know those those little details, you know what I mean,
(47:20):
that's amount of encouragement.
Speaker 9 (47:22):
Some people will never be able to achieve by being
watch you, you know what I mean, and not just
getting the time out to say, well let me try therapy.
Speaker 6 (47:35):
Yeah, I think the stronger you become, right, and the
and the more that you're trying to go down that
path of greatness and mind shift, the more you do
need to talk to somebody because that's when more, that's
when a lot of the challenge is gonna come.
Speaker 1 (47:51):
I think that's absolutely true. And David, what about you?
Have you thought about the like the impact you're gonna
have on people as they watch a man be vulnerable
and like reclaim his strength and his confidence. I admire
you so much, David for the way you are pursuing
(48:11):
your confidence and your strength and the father you are
for your boys. Do you have you thought about the
way you're going to be inspiring men to stay connected
to their families.
Speaker 2 (48:26):
I think so.
Speaker 6 (48:27):
I think the one thing that Pop said is like,
you know, and and it's definitely true, Like you know,
especially in our community, Like you know, guys where I'm from,
the way I was brought up, and you know, the
things out and reach on the sports level are sometimes
(48:48):
misperceived to be vulnerable sometimes. Right, doesn't mean that you're
a punk or you're weak of anything like that, Right,
just that you're a man, right, you bleed, you human?
Right that you can't be a tough guy all the time, right,
You know what I'm saying. You can't be hard all
the time. You know, especially if you got children too, right,
because one thing like yeah big bad.
Speaker 2 (49:10):
This and this and that.
Speaker 6 (49:11):
But I still gotta be I still gotta show some
softness to my kids. And that's not a bad way
because you gotta have them, you gotta you gotta let
them be able to adjust. You can't be angry all
the time, can't live like that way. No, you gotta
you gotta be happy. So I think it's gonna some
(49:31):
of the things that already that are already accomplished in
the impact that some people know. And I saw what
it had on their lives. Some of the people I
talk to on an everyday basis or a client, I
mean meet and I can impact them with that little
bit here, having somebody here and go and hear these
sessions and see, Yeah, I think it's.
Speaker 2 (49:53):
Gonna take it to another level.
Speaker 6 (49:56):
Maybe the right person hear it and reach out, and
you know, maybe they need a person they need to
talk to. Because I got a lot of people I
know and I know they got stuff going on. They
need to talk to somebody. Because now my conversation is different.
I'm hitting them with some of your questions, like you know,
trying to get you know, like I'm in sales, so
(50:16):
you know, open ended questions.
Speaker 2 (50:18):
So I know that.
Speaker 6 (50:20):
So I know, right, trying to get like you know,
because I feel like to teach one, each one, each one,
teach on whatever which way you go, right, I can't
hold all the information for myself. So if I feel
like if I care about that person and I you know,
and it's what I'm talking about my like my crew,
and I look at him like a brother or something like.
Speaker 2 (50:39):
That, Yeah, I yo, what's up man? What's going on?
Speaker 1 (50:43):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (50:44):
Right, maybe he need to hear me vent or talk,
or maybe he got some something for me, or maybe
I got something for him. Though, but I think more
of that needs to happen. And it wasn't happening a lot,
and where are you know. Some of it is wrinkle
down and we're building our ways out of it.
Speaker 2 (51:02):
But you know, I think we need more of that.
Speaker 1 (51:05):
Stay tuned for my final thoughts after this. Well, I
just have one more suggestion I'm going to make to
you all, and that is to keep noticing greatness within
(51:25):
yourselves and each other. Now having said that, I think
the most appropriate way to wrap all of this up
is to give each of you a final word to say.
I think you guys are are far more important in
this process. You guys are the stars. This is a
process about you. So I'm going to just take a
(51:47):
step back and let you guys say the final words
of this series. So I'll start with Jay, what are
the final words you'd like to share?
Speaker 5 (51:56):
I think I'll first to say thank you to you
for guiding student process.
Speaker 4 (52:01):
I appreciate you.
Speaker 5 (52:03):
I know there was a time where I was like,
I don't know if I'm feeling this, but you kind
of made sure that you kind of took the time
to explain things and I was able to see the
bigger picture.
Speaker 4 (52:16):
So thank you for that.
Speaker 5 (52:18):
Thank you to my father, thank you to David for
going through this process with me. I've definitely learned a
lot about the two of you, and I'm thankful to
have you in my life. And I think you're both
very amazing individuals, amazing men, and I'm really thankful.
Speaker 4 (52:34):
For you too.
Speaker 5 (52:36):
And I'll just say that, you know, for the people
who are listening, like it is okay to not be okay,
and no matter what you've achieved, no matter what you've accomplished,
that doesn't.
Speaker 4 (52:50):
Guarantee that your mental health is being cared for. It.
Speaker 5 (52:54):
You can get all the degrees you want, you can
be in the military.
Speaker 4 (52:58):
You could do all whatever.
Speaker 5 (53:00):
You could be a CEO with Fortune five hundred company,
and you still need to take the time to care
for yourself. And what that care looks like is not
what people always put out there. You know, maybe it
is therapy, maybe it is something else, but you have
to take care of yourself because you're You're the only
self that you have and you're not gonna get another one,
(53:21):
so you might as well, you know, might as well,
you know, hung you down and really ask yourself what
do you need and be you know, be truthful with yourself.
Like whoever's going to judge, let them judge. But at
the end of the day, if you can be a
better version of yourself, then you should try to achieve,
you know.
Speaker 4 (53:41):
Strive for that.
Speaker 5 (53:42):
I think there's so many challenges, but I have a
special place in my heart for veterans, and I know,
like that transition from being in the military to becoming
a civilian can be really difficult, but you know, here's
the opportunity for you to not have beings so structured
(54:03):
and defined for you, and you get to define the
life that you want for you and and get to
move towards that. So I just want to get my
veterans a shout out and and just say, you know,
you got this.
Speaker 4 (54:15):
You can. You can make the life that you want.
And especially oh in the moms, you know you're gonna lose.
Speaker 5 (54:21):
You might lose yourself, you really might, but you can
always find yourself again. And and God is so good,
So even when you forgot who you.
Speaker 2 (54:32):
Are, he hasn't.
Speaker 4 (54:34):
So just just remember that, and you know, just keep
pushing forward.
Speaker 1 (54:39):
Jay, Thank you.
Speaker 4 (54:45):
The world.
Speaker 1 (54:46):
You know, Freddie? What about you? How would you? What
final words would you like to leave? Leave people with?
Speaker 3 (54:55):
Is the thing you've been losing all your life? You
gotta get put yourself off the ground. Don't you realize
you you're winning because you're still pushing you know.
Speaker 2 (55:04):
What I mean?
Speaker 3 (55:04):
You're still pushing that little in you're not pushing. Well,
let's keep pushing that a little Michae who in You're
gonna get there? You don't get there.
Speaker 1 (55:14):
I love that, you know. I think sometimes we get
fully wrapped up in winning is a measurement of the outcome.
But Freddie, what you just said, I wholehearted to believe
you're winning just because you're still pushing like you're winning
because you're in the game. The outcome is in the
measurement of winning or not. The fact that you're still
(55:37):
in the game pushing is the is the measurement, right, David,
What are your final thoughts after going through this?
Speaker 2 (55:44):
I really enjoyed is these uh this journey.
Speaker 6 (55:49):
Out of all the sessions I've probably done had in
my life, this is probably this is the best.
Speaker 2 (55:54):
One I've had.
Speaker 6 (55:55):
Learned a lot, learned some things about Jay which was
all so thank you for having us do this. And
you know, I'm hoping that and I know it will
help some people that's listening. That's gonna take some good
things out of this. Keep the faith, right, whoever you
(56:17):
higher power is, you know, reach out. The pain is
definitely gonna be over. Is only a temporary thing, all right.
Speaker 2 (56:25):
You know?
Speaker 6 (56:26):
I read my book during this journey and one thing
my God David said is like listen to pain. I
look forward to it because it makes most people quick.
But when you push through it, it's a good thing.
On the other side, and that's one thing. Like you know,
I think that I got out of this because it's
been a lot of pain though, but I'm seeing the
good on the other side, and I hope some people
(56:47):
see that too, And that's it.
Speaker 2 (56:49):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (56:50):
I love it, you know, all three of you. I
think that is the best way to end this. So
all I'm going to say is thank you.
Speaker 3 (56:58):
I thank all you guys.
Speaker 4 (57:00):
Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2 (57:03):
I love you.
Speaker 5 (57:04):
I love you too, love you too, too too.
Speaker 1 (57:18):
I think my greatest thought as I think back on
working with this families about this season, is what a
tremendous honor it was to be in a position where
I could meet and help this family. I've been doing
a lot of therapy for a lot of years. I've
been practicing for over fifteen years, nearly twenty, and there
(57:39):
have been times in my clinical work where I just
wish the world could see how impactful therapy could be,
in the hopes that if people could see how impactful
therapy could be, they'd be much more likely to seek therapy,
address their mental health issues and address the issues going
on in their own families. I never thought that I
(58:00):
would be in a position to be able to do that,
and that doesn't happen without a family as courageous and
vulnerable and authentic and real and loving as this family. Now,
I say loving because you've got to love someone in
order to stick to the process. And when it was hard,
(58:22):
when it was difficult, when it was challenging, this family
loved each other enough that they stuck to the process.
Now I don't know long term what's going to happen
with this family, like I don't know anything could happen,
but I do know the small window they gave us
into their life has changed my life and potentially changed
(58:43):
the lives of millions of people listening. So the biggest
thing I want to say to this family is thank you.
I'm so grateful to have been in this position, and
I can't wait to hear how things transpire within this family.
And I can't wait to see the ripple effect that
participating in this season will make for all of the
(59:04):
many listeners. Once again, it's important to ask yourself different
questions while you're on your healing journey. So with each episode,
we like to end with a question that keeps you
thinking and growing and processing so that you yourself improve
your own mental health and unleash your inner superhero. This week,
I want you to ask yourself, who is the person
(59:26):
in your life that you admire most, What traits do
they possess that cause you to admire them? And if
those traits began to show up in a bigger way
in your life, how would you notice it. Thank you
for listening. Major announcement. We have a bonus episode coming
next week where you're going to be listening to me
(59:47):
give you some guided questions. It'll be like you receiving
therapy while you're sitting in your home, listening on your phone,
listening in your car. It's going to be a great episode,
so stay tuned. This is not just a podcast that
I want you to consume and be entertained by. I
actually want you to be inspired. I want you to
(01:00:08):
be impacted by this, and in fact, we can't help
but be impacted by the content we consume. So what
I would like for you to do is come on
this healing journey with us. Come on this journey of
change rediscovery with us. And the way to do that
is to just pay attention to the things going on
in your life. As a consequence of listening to this podcast.
(01:00:31):
Pay attention to things in your life shifting in a
more desirable way. Pay attention to your desirable outcome becoming
your reality. Pay attention to evidence of your success, your resilience,
and your strength. And let us know in the comments
what you're noticing in your life as a result of
listening to this podcast and as a result of paying
attention to these things. I would love to hear from
(01:00:54):
you about your healing journey, your family and your feedback.
Leave a review, send a DM and next with me
on socials at Elliott Speaks, and you can also send
me a text message to nine seven two four two
six two six four zero. Family Therapy is a production
of iHeartRadio and The Black Effect podcast Network. Special thanks
to our assistant Glendale Sefe. It's produced by Jack Queish
(01:01:16):
Thomas and the executive producer Dolly S. S Bisham. For more
podcasts from The Black Effects, visit the iHeartRadio app or
wherever you listen to your favorite shows. The content presented
on the Family Therapy podcast serves solely for educational and
informational purposes. It should not be considered a replacement for
personalized medical or mental health guidance and does not constitute
(01:01:36):
a provider patient relationship. It is advisable to consult with
your healthcare provider or health team, or any specific concerns
or questions you may have.
Commitment is inherent in any genuinely loving relationship. Anyone who
is truly concerned for the spiritual growth of another knows
consciously or instinctively that he or she can significantly foster
that growth through a relationship of constancy. M Scott heck
(00:30):
Welcome back to Family Therapy. I'm your host, Elliott, Connie,
and for the last time this season, what's been better
since you listened to the previous episode? In fact, I
want to ask you what has been better since you
listened to this whole season. It is my greatest hope
that listening to this season and this family and these
(00:53):
questions through this process has made a difference in your life.
I want you to spend some time reflecting on what
those differences been. This week's episode highlights the final session
with Freddie, Jay and David. The conversation highlights the power
of forgiveness and the impact it can have on personal
growth and relationships. Each family member shared their thoughts on
(01:17):
how the process of therapy impacted them over the last
few months. They all agree there is more work to
be done and know that healing is not finite and
it doesn't look the same for everyone. The commitment vulnerability
and bravery of this family were absolutely inspiring. Jay, Now
(01:39):
that we're all here and this was at one time
something that would have been hard to imagine. What do
you hope is the outcome of a conversation like this?
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Are you sure or not?
Speaker 3 (01:51):
Pus my on a firing squad with at a blind
fon Freddy?
Speaker 4 (01:59):
What do I would like the outcome to be?
Speaker 5 (02:02):
I guess it's the same every time, just a better
understanding of ourselves and a better understanding of each other
and learning how we can help one another.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Okay, all right, David, Freddie, what about you?
Speaker 2 (02:16):
Guys?
Speaker 1 (02:17):
Like, what do you what do you hope is the
outcome of it?
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Well, personally, I hope that we can have a better
insight on the things that we want to achieve in
life together and separately.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
David, what about you? What do you what do you
hope we get achieved today?
Speaker 6 (02:34):
I mean, I think I'm pretty much on the same
page as everybody else, you know, a little bit more
insight understanding, you know, certain things that's going on. I
always look forward to the sessions, always walk away like
you know, that was a good session and a broader
(02:54):
mind shift of a little bit more than what it's
going on right now. So I'm ready to dive in
see what's going on.
Speaker 1 (03:01):
So, I mean, I think the first question I have
is all three of you have made progress in this
process that blows me away to be honest with you. Now,
let's imagine this is the last time we ever speak,
(03:22):
like after today, we can never speak again. What progress
do you hope do each of you hope will continue
to happen in spite of no longer being allowed to
speak to me ever, which isn't the case, by the way,
but let's pretend for a moment you cannot call me
ever and I cannot call you. What progress do you
(03:43):
each hope you will continue to make even though we
can no longer speak.
Speaker 6 (03:48):
I think staying the course and continue, you know, with
the communication part. I think over the last couple of months,
communication has been a little better than it has than
it was before.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Uh h.
Speaker 6 (04:06):
I feel like, you know, still with some work in progress,
but me personally, you know, taking on a.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Little bit more than usual, maybe you know, focusing on
what I really want.
Speaker 6 (04:23):
To do a little bit more is uh. I think
that's what I want to I feel like that's what
I'm gonna continue to keep doing after I walk away
from this?
Speaker 1 (04:35):
How would how would how would Freddie and Jay know
that you've continued doing those things? Like what would be
assigned to Jay specifically, but even Freddie? How would they
notice that continuing communication has continued to improve, You've continued
on this path, Like what would they notice that would
tell them, you know what, David is continued on that path?
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Well, I don't know about fucks.
Speaker 6 (05:03):
I don't know, man, Like you know, Jay's probably around
me the molds and.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 6 (05:10):
I just feel like, you know, probably through like conversations
or actions or just you know. That's why that I
think that's what she'd be able to see. But I
don't know like that that I can't like, yes, I
want people to notice or whatever, but if they don't, like,
(05:31):
I'm still gonna keep pushing, like you know what I'm saying.
So I don't know where that's gonna come from, you know,
but when it when it is, when it's when it's
out there. Though I do I do hear it from
Jay like I do hear it, like if she sees
it or if I say something, I do hear it, like,
good job, keep doing it.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
Yeah, but what are those things as you keep pushing?
You use the phrase like I'm gonna keep pushing. How
would you she know that you're continuing to push? What
would she see that would say, you know what, I
know he's not doing this just for me, and I
know he's not doing it just so that I noticed,
but I couldn't help but notice X, Y or Z
thing that is evidence that he is continuing to push himself.
(06:15):
Like how would she notice that?
Speaker 6 (06:17):
Well, well, one of the things that I'm really just
been diving in on. You know, she would definitely hear,
like because even now, you know, jumping in and out
of car, I got certain radio stations on, like listening
to certain stuff and you know, certain conversations on the
phone that's changing, or me on the laptop and something
(06:39):
else is open, you know what.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
I'm saying, So like their.
Speaker 6 (06:43):
Behavior is changing and the language and conversations are changing
because of what I'm focused on right now. So I
think that's how Jay would know, because she's gonna see like, yo,
like he love the Buckeyes, he love it nine ers old,
but like he talked about this twenty four to seven,
(07:06):
Like you know, he's locked in on it, So I
think that's I think those would be definitely some of
the telltale signs of how she would recognize that that
things are changing.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
Thank you, David. And how about Freddy and Jay? How
would you notice that you were continuing the progress that
you've made through this process.
Speaker 5 (07:28):
I guess that I would be continually trying to focus
on creating more positive.
Speaker 4 (07:35):
Habits in my life, so focusing on the good stuff.
Speaker 5 (07:40):
And you know, when people ask me how I'm doing,
I have something positive to say, and I'm actively trying
to see joy.
Speaker 4 (07:55):
In the day to day.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
In the life.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
So trying to.
Speaker 5 (08:07):
Just try to, you know, just try to focus on
the things that are really you know, small but still exceptional.
Speaker 4 (08:15):
And I think that's what I would do.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
How do you think David would notice that you were
doing that? Jake? What would be a sign to David,
someone who says he's close enough to you that he
would see it, Like, what would be a clue to
him that you were doing these things?
Speaker 4 (08:31):
Maybe I would be more engaged in small talk.
Speaker 5 (08:36):
I really don't like small talk, but probably because we,
you know, see each other every day, talk to each
other every day, sometimes we can kind of get lost
in that, So I think, you know, just sharing with
him a little bit more about the you know, the
good things that are going on and just expressing, you know,
(08:58):
the things that I noticed that that I'm doing or
that he's doing, and just bringing those things up in
conversation or sharing with him ways that I am focusing
on positive things. I think like things like that as
far as like exercising. If I hopefully when I start
(09:21):
more actively exercising, he'll see that, he'll probably just see
me smile a little bit more and just share that
happiness with him.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Do you think he likes that when you smile and
share the happiness with.
Speaker 4 (09:38):
Yeah, everybody does.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
Everybody? Okay, cool? Thank you, Jay and Freddie?
Speaker 2 (09:47):
What about you?
Speaker 1 (09:47):
How would you know that you were continuing the progress
that you've made through this process?
Speaker 3 (09:53):
Each and every day you expect things that of a
person and you just take it for granted and you
lose focus on it about saying that, how thankful for
you are? You know what I'm saying of like just
coming home to a nice hot meal. You know, you
take those things for granted. When you take things for granted,
you forget to give the appreciation back for someone you know,
sitting there with a hostile because I feel like my
(10:15):
life has excelled in a place where I never expected
for it to be, you know, my friends, with my family.
I still have a lot of setbacks in my life,
but I don't I don't like let it weigh me down,
you know what I mean. I don't try to like
I don't well and that little pity potty, you know
what I mean, saying well, better, it's gonna get better.
(10:37):
So I make the little initiative to increase the forth
to improve, you know what I mean. So I really
want things to be better. It seemed like one one
week it seems like it's going well, and then then
that everything just seemed like.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
This caves in.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
I'm like, oh, how mercy, you know what I mean.
We got hit rock bottom, you know, you know, to
get back on thread. So I'd be like, yo, lord,
you know, do your thing, man. Put put the spirit
into some chokers man, you know, because like I don't
think i'll be here. I don't be here that long.
Like like it's funny because, uh, when my mother was alive,
(11:16):
she's gonna have you, oh, massage your feet all the time.
And I used to, you know, I used to do
it because she her feet used to have the you know,
tingling and all that. I massage your feet all the time, right,
So one time she asked me a massage, and figureuse,
I wanted to go outside. I want to go do something.
I only know exactly what it was. But I didn't
do it right. So when I came home, she was
(11:36):
at the hospital and she died the next day. No
only thing I regret that I did massage your feet
that night. I still hold that. I still hold that, uh,
that that feeling aside. I mean, like, dang, why you
didn't do that?
Speaker 5 (11:53):
Man?
Speaker 7 (11:53):
You know?
Speaker 3 (11:54):
And it just I don't even know what made me
think about that, but I can feel the thrills running
through my body, Like, hey, Dad, can I.
Speaker 4 (12:01):
Ask you a question.
Speaker 5 (12:02):
Do you think your mother is looking down on you
and saying, dang, I wish you would have massaged my
feet that night, Or do you think she's looking down
on you and saying, Wow, I'm so proud of him
and how far he's come.
Speaker 3 (12:16):
Mm hmm, Well, I think she's extremely proud of me
that too. And I don't think jee thinking bemembering about
her feet, you know what I mean? That you hold personally, uh, yourself.
That's kind of like be agging at you, you know
what I mean. But I think she didn't even think
(12:37):
about no feet.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
You know, on that.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
That's funny because I think Jay Jay is highlighting something,
and Jay, I'm starting to wonder if maybe you should
be a psychotherapist at some point. She's highlighting something that
I want to I want to mention all three of you,
Like Freddie, you are one of the most incredible men
(13:03):
I've ever met. And what makes me say that is
there have been times in your life when you did
not make the right decisions for your family, and here
you are this entire time that I've known you. It's
(13:26):
all been so about I want to reconnect with my
kids and my family, and you have followed through on
that up to an including participating in this conversation and
conversations like this and getting clean and contacting your kids
(13:48):
and the way that you have It's one of the
most admirable things I've ever known. And I think what
Jay is pointing out is if you continue to focus
on the one thing you regret, like not rubbing your
mother's feet that day, instead of noticing all of the
(14:13):
wonderful traits about you that leads to a negative place.
So my question for you, and by the way, I'm
going to ask each of you a similar question, But
what do you think would happened to your life? Freddie
if you spend more time noticing all of the things
that are evidence that you're a wonderful human instead of
(14:36):
mistakes and problems and flaws.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
Jesus Christ. Wow, if I can eliminate all those things
and just go through life each and every day without
those uh barriers or things that would create chaos in
(15:05):
my life. But that's it's not it's not a real
concept because like I don't I don't dwell on the
fact that, uh I didn't do that. But at the
same time, I say to myself, like like Jay said,
she's uh, she's so proud of me as on my accomplishments. Uh,
(15:30):
it's not something.
Speaker 7 (15:30):
That that's wish I had done it, you know what
I mean, I would have felt I don't know if
it made me feel uh bad about not doing it
in the sense where it made a difference, you know, in.
Speaker 3 (15:44):
Her life of my life because because like I said
to it Ja, I don't even think she even remember
I didn't even do a fee, you know what I mean.
But uh, it's just the fact that I think, Uh,
like you said, some things in life you just you
hold on too. You know, no need, no reason to
hold on to that.
Speaker 1 (16:03):
So you know, so Freddy in it Throughout the course
of a normal day, do you spend more time thinking?
And I have no idea to answer this question. I'm
just I want to check in on something more time
thinking about mistakes you've made or the accomplishments you've achieved.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Oh of course, Uh. I think about the better achievements
in my life and the things that I can't improve on.
I don't dwell on the things that that I made
mistakes off. I can't. I can't change them with change
them at all, you know what I mean. I could
try to better and make it, make a better situation
out of today, I don't. I don't live in the past.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
That you know. I don't.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
I did what I've done in it and I got
to live with it. But I don't let it eat
me up inside. You know what I mean. I'm trying
to well out, you know what I mean. I advanced
so far, so I ain't gonna let those things keep me,
hold of me, hold me, hold me, hold of me,
because I've never succeeded. I never I've never accompissed anything
(17:10):
in life. If I keep doing on the things that
I mean.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
I think that's true. Ready, how do you do that?
How do you manage to realize? Like I just got
to focus on on these things, like, how do you
how do you manage to do that?
Speaker 3 (17:25):
Well, it's it's kind of simple, you know what I mean?
Because like, uh, at one time in my life, I
thought I never reached twenty five, you know what I mean?
When I uh, that was the age of twenty five. Uh,
I thought that was astounding of accomplishment because like the
way my life was going, I ain't the thing I
(17:45):
was going to establish that age. Now I'm like, I'm
gonna be sixty five in a minute, you know what
I mean.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
So I don't.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
I don't done that almost you know, double that already.
So now, like they said the ladies at the end
of the tunnel, you know, I don't see it as
at the end no more. You know what I'm saying.
It's right there, it is in my grass, what I mean. So, uh,
(18:14):
if when I went up tomorrow, God's willing, and I
got a plan on doing a few things, and you know,
you know, I'm hoping that this why my presence would
put a joyful smaller people's faces.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
You know what I mean, right, David? I would ask
a similar question to you. You are also one of
the most incredible people I've ever met. I consider it
to be such a privilege to have gotten to know you.
The things that you have done in your life. If
you look at some of the things just from a
(18:52):
likelihood standpoint, like if I met you your fresh your
first day of school, your freshman year in high school,
the chances you would have achieved all of the things
you achieved were literally zero, but yet you achieved them anyway.
What happens to your life when you remember that you've
literally been like a superhero at certain points in your life.
(19:15):
I don't know that you think about that often enough,
And I find myself wondering when David remembers he's damn
near a literal living superhero. What happens to David's life
and the way he views himself? What do you think
about that, David?
Speaker 6 (19:32):
No, I do think about that, Like you know, I
think I think about it more now is because the
way I'm shifting to mind shift that I'm having because
I know, like you know, when times in the past
and sometimes you could go on to pass and build
from it because it was a good space. Past don't
always got to be negative things, right, So there's been
(19:54):
times when you know, back up against the wall or
somebody say you couldn't do something, or something seemed that
it was impossible of obtaining, and you know, and you
got to think back, what made you grab it? Because
you got there and what did you do? So what
would happen? Was it more disciplined on this way, was
(20:16):
it more concentration on this or you know, whatever it was,
it got you to that point. And then now like
you could take some of that, some of those same
type of techniques and apply.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
It to other other things, you know, and and it
would help.
Speaker 6 (20:34):
And it helps, and it does because like I'm grabbing
some of them techniques and pushing it towards other things.
Is just you know, now you got to push them.
You got to push them techniques around your entire life
now because it's not just you when it was in
the past. So that's that's the challenging part. How can
(20:57):
I fit this into everything.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
You know.
Speaker 6 (21:00):
That's why I said, you know, the better version of
David the more you know, the staying positive every day,
even when it's if it's a hiccup, you know, you
gotta rebound. Like I said before, you know, one of
the things my coaches always said is don't worry about
the last play. Concentrate on the next one. You know,
(21:21):
we can review that play when the game is over.
It right, and and that makes sense, So you can't
worry about the stuff that just happened, right, because it's
gonna mess up everything else that's in front of you.
Everything else is gonna mess it up. Like one negative thing.
One negative thing can be very bad, and it can,
(21:41):
you know, probably destroy your day.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
But let's let's think about it. What what what? What
was it?
Speaker 6 (21:49):
And all the positive other things that can happen, you know,
by just rebounding and putting that one to the side
and maybe revisiting it a later day when you're when
you're in a better mind state, then you can handle
that negative thing a little bit better and it's not
as bad as it was when it hits you Monday
and you're looking at it on Thursday.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
If it can wait that long or later on in
the day. But I feel like, you know, with a positive.
Speaker 6 (22:13):
Outlook, in a positive mind, you can accomplish the things
that you think are impossible because it has been done.
Especially for me, it has been done, so I know
it could be done again.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
What happens to your life as you continue to remember
that day, Because I really mean what I said, I
think you're an incredible man, and I would say I
think there were times when you forgot that. So what
happened to your life when you remember, like, I'm pretty
good at doing impossible things, like I'm pretty good at
(22:55):
being an absolute incredible human and accomplishing incredible thing. What
happens to your life when you're in that space, David?
Speaker 6 (23:05):
I mean, when you're in this, when you're it's just
a it's just a whole aura, a feeling of accomplishment,
no matter what it is, it's just it's just a
different feeling.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
It's a good feeling.
Speaker 6 (23:25):
It's a natural high and it's a good feeling. I'm
being honest with you, it is absolutely and you know,
and people me, I want that feeling a lot, and
people want that feeling, you know what I'm saying, So
you know, and it's not something that you're just gonna
(23:47):
just like it's take hard work to get to that
level of feeling, that level that that level whatever it
is that you're on that you are trying to get to.
Everybody path is differ for everybody. Thing is different, but
that level that feeling, who, yeah, it tastes good.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
And and and the thing David like, having that feeling
interesting doesn't make life any easier. Like, it's not like
life stop throwing curveballs at you or anything, but it
just seems that you're able to handle them better. Is
that Is that right?
Speaker 2 (24:27):
You think?
Speaker 6 (24:28):
Yeah, because a lot of times when you get to
that when whatever, like it's sometimes and most of the time, right,
if it's something and you get to the top of
it or whatever, right, you're gonna have some challenges. You're
gonna have some outsiders. You're gonna have this right, but
you're gonna you're gonna bail it, Like you said, you're
gonna beil and handle it differently because you know what
(24:51):
it took to get there. So you knew what it
took to get there. You're gonna bail and handle it.
You're gonna be able, your skin gonna be a little tougher.
Your mind gonna be.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
You know, you're gonna be.
Speaker 6 (25:02):
To handle whatever is coming out. You're gonna keep on
going because you want to be up there. You want
to be at that space within yourself. That's where you
want to be at because that's your space. That's how you.
You know, you focus at that space, you maneuver at
that space. That's a better version of you at that space,
and you can handle a lot of things at that space.
(25:23):
Not saying that everything is peaches and cream like an
apple pie, but when it's not like that, because you're
already in that mindset and that thinking, you're able to
handle it.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Thank you, David. We'll be right back with more family therapy.
And Jay, you were an incredible woman, And I don't
know if I've ever met a woman quite like you before.
Like we've been meeting now for all these weeks, and
(25:56):
it seems like every time we met, I learned something
new that was amazing about you that you didn't tell
me previously. Like I learned about your military experience. I
learned about your multiple degrees and the programs that you
graduated from. I learned about your investment properties and your
dreams and your wishes, and I admire like that is
(26:19):
just an inspiration to me when I hear it. And
I don't think I've ever met a person who more
than you needed to look in the mirror and see greatness.
How how do you think would make a difference in
your life if you learned? And again, Jay, and having
said that, I'm not saying you're perfect, as I'm not
(26:41):
saying anyone is perfect, But what different would it make
in your life? You just developed the habit to just
see greatness when you looked at yourself, when you like
analyzed yourself instead of flaws, problems, blah blah blah.
Speaker 5 (26:57):
I think I would create the life that I truly
want and believe that I can do it. I have
achieved a lot of things, but I haven't absolutely I
haven't achieved mastering myself yet, and I don't.
Speaker 4 (27:14):
I don't know if anyone.
Speaker 5 (27:15):
Ever really truly fully masters themselves. But I do think
I could be better at it. I think that there
are things that I want that, to be honest, like,
I'm afraid to do them.
Speaker 3 (27:33):
I don't be at you are afraid to do it?
How can you be afraid to do something you got
so far in life already, because.
Speaker 4 (27:42):
So there's the moves that I make. Are they're ris scared.
Speaker 5 (27:47):
Yeah, Like I don't want to work at my job.
I know I could shift gears and find something that
I enjoy, but I'm scared, so I don't do it.
But if I focused more on what I could do,
then then I would do those things, versus just saying, well,
(28:10):
this is what I got, so it's safe.
Speaker 4 (28:12):
So let me keep it. I really don't enjoy spending
forty hours a week staring at a computer. I feel
like that is such a waste of my energy and
my time.
Speaker 5 (28:27):
But the income is solid and I need it. So
there's like those more personal choices, like I can make
a business still happen because it's external, you know, it's
more of an external thing. But when it comes to
the lifestyle that I truly want, I don't.
Speaker 4 (28:51):
I don't know that.
Speaker 5 (28:54):
I mean, I've taken steps, but I don't know that
I've taken as many steps.
Speaker 4 (28:58):
As I could to true achieved that lifestyle.
Speaker 5 (29:03):
But if I focused on the good stuff, and if
I focused on what I could do with the confidence
of you've done so much already, then I would make
different moves.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
You know.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
And it's interesting that you say that, Jay, because you
have accomplished so much, and I don't think you've given
yourself credit right to the to the degree to which
you've accomplished. It's almost like you just kind of like,
ho hum it. And I'm like, wait a minute, that's
(29:38):
not a whole hum accomplishment Like that that thing, that
that degree you got, or that that achievement you had
in the military, or that business thing that you achieved,
or or even the level of jobs you got. Those
aren't whole hum accomplishments. And it's like you've done all
these great things but given yourself very little credit for them.
(29:59):
And I I just wonder what happens when Jay starts
giving herself credit for her brilliance, for her magic, for
her strength, for her fortitude resilience, Like what happens when
you start truly giving yourself credit for who you are?
Speaker 4 (30:15):
Yeah? I would I want unstick myself. I wouldn't. I
wouldn't feel stuck.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
And I'm not telling you you know tomorrow I want
you to quit your job because like, who knows, I
don't know what you would do.
Speaker 4 (30:28):
No, I'll make decisions like that.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
Yeah, but what would you what would be the first thing, Jay,
What do you think would be the first like even
micro step you might take when you start realizing, like
I'm going to give myself credit for the amazing person
that I am and the amazing things that I've achieved.
Speaker 5 (30:50):
Yeah, I mean it would. Part of it would be
looking for a different job. Part of it would be
that part of it would be instead of focus on
what I can't what I used to do physically, I
would just be like, Okay, let me, I'm gonna go
for this walk. I'm gonna go for this. Like I
saw somebody running the other day and I was like, damn, I.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Used to run.
Speaker 4 (31:13):
I used to do that, you know what I mean.
So I would probably, you know, be like, well, man,
maybe I can't do.
Speaker 5 (31:23):
Forty push ups in two minutes anymore, but I could
do ten.
Speaker 4 (31:26):
You know what I mean, Like, so let me do that.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
You know.
Speaker 5 (31:28):
I would just focus on what I could do and
do it instead of just knocking it off like it's
not as good as what I used to do. So
I ain't even gonna you know what I mean, Like
I would, I would just do what I can until
I get to the point of where I want to
be Jay.
Speaker 1 (31:44):
I love that. H I love that Jay. Now Jay,
perhaps me personally getting to know you, I've learned a
lot about you and some of your accomplishments. But I'm
I can't, I can't lie. I do have a favorite
accomplishment of yours. My favorite accomplishment of yours is the
(32:07):
way you have forgiven your father. I don't know if
I told you that was my favorite, but I think
I've told you that I admired it. To me, I
think that's the one thing that speaks the most to
who you are. I just want you to say, like,
how did you do that? And what does it mean
to you to see the way your father is doing
(32:30):
things now? What does it mean to you to see
the way Freddie is doing things now?
Speaker 4 (32:33):
I just, I guess I just focused on I just
allow him to be who he was.
Speaker 5 (32:42):
Without the expectations of who I wanted him to be.
Speaker 1 (32:47):
But how did you do that? How did you shift
your focus from what I was angry with him about
or what I was missing within him? How did you
shift your focus to I'm going to allow him to
be who he is without having any exces Like, how
did you do that?
Speaker 4 (33:02):
Well?
Speaker 5 (33:02):
I don't know that I ever really held a lot
of anger towards him.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
So how did you do that?
Speaker 5 (33:11):
Because I realized that he dealt with addiction, and I
don't see.
Speaker 4 (33:18):
Addiction as a flaw. I see it more as a disease.
Speaker 5 (33:25):
And I felt like if I was, if I was sick,
I wouldn't want someone to hold that against me.
Speaker 6 (33:31):
So I just I don't know.
Speaker 5 (33:35):
I just I just said, you know, if this is
his challenge, then that's his challenge, you know, and it's
hope hopefully one day he would overcome, and he did,
so I just I just didn't hold it against him.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
So going back to the theme of like, I'm not
sure Jay gives herself credit for things. Do you ever
realize how how rare that is and what a gift
that is that you've given to Freddy can say.
Speaker 5 (34:05):
Give a much stop, But I do think it is
a gift, I agree, not just to him, but to
myself as well.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
And not just to him, and not just to yourself,
but like to your kids and to David. And you
know what I mean, like because you did this, your
kids have a relationship with their grandfather because you did this,
Like have you ever sat back and realized that that
was such a massive gift and probably played a role
in saving.
Speaker 3 (34:36):
His life absolutely, because like when the whole world don't
believe in you and you just got one person that
still does, that's all you need, you know what I mean,
You could you could cipher off for that and restore
your life.
Speaker 2 (34:51):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (34:52):
I don't think anybody like uh I ever thought that
I was wont to get out of the round that
I was, you know what I mean. And every time
I talked to Daylan, she gave me that. That's that's
such encouragement. That gives me the strength.
Speaker 4 (35:07):
You know what.
Speaker 3 (35:07):
It's like they say some people got the foresight, got
that special eye. They could see all the goodness in
you and not all the bad and the evil in you.
And the person she could look at somebody and she
can see all the goodness that's inside the person and
not she or even the outside the person, you know
(35:29):
what I mean. So, uh, that's the gift I think
she really has that she not aware of it. Like
you said, most people don't get themselves the credit that
they are doing, you know what I mean, Because you
are a brief person. You have achieved and I'm very
proud of you know, some don't believe the other day
I was I was telling one of my coworkers. I
(35:51):
was like, he was talking about he got a little
son and he's like when five years old. He was
talking about the first baby steps and all that kind
of stuff. I was telling her, like, aw some them out.
She went to Africa and talked about how to read
and you know, things like that.
Speaker 4 (36:07):
And then I teach kids how to read.
Speaker 5 (36:09):
But I did start an organization that that collected books
and sent them to libraries in Africa.
Speaker 6 (36:17):
That's that's that's but that's what dads do, though, That's
what dad do. You gotta let them be great.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
My father used to do the same thing.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
You just proved my point.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
I know, I know I did.
Speaker 1 (36:33):
I had no idea that Jay had started an organization
that sent books the African libraries. Some kids had access
to books. Every time I talk to this woman, I
learned something new about something that she has achieved. But Freddy,
you said something a second ago that was really important.
(36:56):
You said that when you're in a difficult situation, when
you have that one person that believes in you, you
can like siphon off that I think is what you said.
Have you ever have you ever told Jay that she
was that one person that you always knew was looking
at you in a positive way like him? Have you
ever let her know that and let her know what
(37:16):
that meant to you?
Speaker 3 (37:19):
Actually, I don't. I don't believe I have, But this
is a great opportunity to do so. And I believe
that my whole life. You know, everybody uh needs that
that that's certain individual or have have that certain individual
in their corner where no matter what they've done in life,
(37:41):
they still believe in you know what I mean? And Jay,
you have been that person for me, you know what
I mean. Besides, she's been a treminous woman for me,
Like like I'm I'm not too good with women, like
my my track record with like relationships, it's not that
not that well, but different as made me more of
(38:03):
a man than I've ever been, you know what I mean.
She encouraged me just like Jay Lous. You know what
I'm saying. She gives me that in the strength that
and I think I don't have she gives to me,
you know what I mean. And you got two or
three women like that in your life, You're going with
you the world.
Speaker 8 (38:21):
Man.
Speaker 5 (38:22):
Yeah, she's dope.
Speaker 2 (38:24):
One thing I'm happy and I really enjoyed seeing.
Speaker 6 (38:29):
I love family. I come from a large family. I'm
close to a lot of my family, and you know,
I don't have my dad here, my mom's is gone.
I like Pops from day one. He's been my guy,
straight up. Ain't nothing changed about me. Ain't nothing. I've
been the same cat since I met Possible. And I'm
(38:52):
happy that Jalen got a relationship with him, Like I'm
being honest with me, him had serious talks. We can
laugh together, we can have great conversations and stuff, and
I like that. And I love the way he is
with my boys. Because my kids, I got.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
Three, two of them haven't met my dad.
Speaker 6 (39:12):
So I love the relationship that he is that he
has with is in easy and you know, and what
was And when I look at him and I look
at my pops, a lot of the same similarities, hard
lives came over that you know, became great people, you
know what I'm saying, and kept moving forward.
Speaker 2 (39:34):
So I understand him, and uh, and I get it right.
And it ain't.
Speaker 6 (39:40):
Easy and I let and I done told him that though.
But that's one thing I like, and I and and
and I and I see that, and I let him
take their own course. I don't push it in our
implore on that to be able to still have a
relationship because and and it's good.
Speaker 2 (39:53):
It's a good thing.
Speaker 6 (39:54):
And I look back and I see it, and you know,
I just wanted to say that because it is too
And Pops.
Speaker 2 (40:00):
I just wanted to give you a clue. It was like,
you're my guy, right. I don't know if I ever
told you that, But.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
It's such a powerful thing that Jay did that facilitated
all these other changes. Such a powerful thing that and Freddie,
I'm so glad that you would even voice that because
now she gets to hear it like I. Actually I
contributed to how he transformed his life. That's a real,
real powerful thing.
Speaker 5 (40:30):
It's really interesting to hear both of their perspectives on that,
because I actually never really thought about it too much.
Speaker 4 (40:36):
But I guess the beauty of.
Speaker 5 (40:38):
It is that when you don't I guess, when you
don't hold on to resentment and anger, you're opening the
door for blessings that you don't even realize you're opening
the door for damn.
Speaker 1 (40:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (40:50):
So I'm happy that you know, I was able to
do that because it is so many people that just
they're so angry, They're so angry about what could have been,
what should have been, Why isn't it this way or
why it has to be that way? And at the
end of the day, if you can have someone in
your life, you know, if they're not toxic towards you,
(41:14):
but they but they may not be exactly what you
want them to be, but the relationship can allow certain
things to manifest that even if it's not specifically for you,
it can be a blessing for other people around you.
And I think that is a really good example of it.
Speaker 1 (41:33):
To that point, Jay, I agree with every word you
just said, and I want to add one more thing.
Your father said one of your abilities is you can
see goodness in people even when they're doing evil things.
I think is what Freddie said. What do you think
about him saying you have that trait? You have that ability.
Speaker 4 (41:57):
I actually realize that as a trait that I have.
I'm good.
Speaker 5 (42:03):
I mean, I'm happy he noticed it too, But I
really do try to.
Speaker 4 (42:09):
Let people be who they are.
Speaker 5 (42:11):
My challenge, my personal challenge with that is creating the
boundaries around myself so that any negative traits don't have
a negative impact on me. But for the most part,
and I think I get that from my mother.
Speaker 4 (42:27):
She just she's the type of person.
Speaker 5 (42:29):
She just gonna let you be who you are, like
whoever you are, you know, rock out, And I guess
I get.
Speaker 4 (42:36):
It from her.
Speaker 5 (42:37):
And I think it is a good trait to have.
But you also have to be careful with that trait.
You know, there's there's things that people can bring to
the table that might not be good for you. So
I think I have a better balance at that than
she does.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
But yeah, I do.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
I do realize that that's a pretty incredible trait to have.
Speaker 4 (42:59):
Jack, Yeah, I'm pretty awesome.
Speaker 1 (43:08):
No, don't you?
Speaker 3 (43:09):
Did it?
Speaker 1 (43:11):
Like I kind of want you looking in the mirror
every day and be like, yeah, I'm pretty awesome. I
want you to give you.
Speaker 2 (43:17):
You should you are awesome.
Speaker 1 (43:19):
Yes, I want you to give that same grace that
you so eloquently gave to others, including your father, to yourselfself.
What if you use that superhero treat on you?
Speaker 5 (43:36):
Yeah, David tells me all the time, it's so hard
on myself, But he's right, and you're right.
Speaker 2 (43:43):
She's very hard on herself. Jay is like she got it.
Speaker 6 (43:51):
She and I see it sometimes and I don't hear
her speak to me, and sometimes like I don't say nothing.
I let her bring it out of herself because how
awesome she is and how smart she is is just
some things with my skill set that I see and
I'm like, yo, she gotta bring it out herself. I
can't say it, like you know what I'm saying. And
(44:12):
she's very tough on herself, Like she's very very tough,
and it's nothing wrong with being tough on yourself, but
sometimes I feel like, yo, you're being a little bit
too hard on yourself, like for real, like yo, that's fly,
Like yeah, take them like I told you. I said
this to my sister, right, I said this, right, And
(44:33):
I have said this before to people out on train
or whatever, and somebody does said this to me. You
gotta employ yourself for the small accomplishments and small goals
and the baby steps.
Speaker 2 (44:43):
Give yourself that high five, like hell yeah, like and
I say that like yes, like sometimes I get myself
to high five. I don't care.
Speaker 6 (44:52):
I don't need it to be exactly hitting on all cylinders.
But it was a small accomplishment so it can hit
on all cylinders. So you high five yourself and keep moving,
and keep moving, keep moving.
Speaker 1 (45:03):
I love the idea of all of you celebrating, like
giving yourselves high fives, because for each of you it's different,
but I have a similar experience with all of you.
Jay's a bit more extreme because every time I talk
to those women, I learned something new about something great
she does. But all three of you I have that
(45:26):
same experience. Like I don't know that these people give
themselves enough credit for just how how wonderful the things
that they have done are, including participating in this project, like, Freddie,
have you have you thought about like this? These are
the kind of things I think about, Freddie? Have you
(45:47):
thought about how many how many men are going to
watch you as an example of how to fix wrongs
that they've done in their path? Have you thought about that, Freddy?
How many men will be inspired, not all to be
like you know what if that guy could contact his son,
(46:08):
if that guy could reconnect with his dark man, I
can do it too. Have you thought about that?
Speaker 2 (46:12):
Freddy?
Speaker 3 (46:14):
Noah, absolutely haven't uh like this? This this program has
done uh great insight on my own life. You know
what I mean. I feel that most most black men
don't do there, you know what I mean, out of
it's out of the round, you know what I mean.
We were strong, we dominate, were gonna we could handle it,
(46:36):
you know what I mean. All of us need you know,
a therapeutical program, you know, so so we could dig
deep within and with and without, you know what I mean.
So if you you don't do that in your life,
you're gonna be stagnated.
Speaker 8 (46:51):
You're always gonna be like bewildered you, You're always gonna
be hurting.
Speaker 3 (46:54):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (46:55):
You gott you can, you can.
Speaker 8 (46:57):
You gotta dig and find yourself man, and like and
some things like through this this process, I didn't know
about that insight to encourage Its almost like it's a
it's a way way off your chest, you might say,
off your shoulders, you know what I mean. This just
to know those those little details, you know what I mean,
(47:20):
that's amount of encouragement.
Speaker 9 (47:22):
Some people will never be able to achieve by being
watch you, you know what I mean, and not just
getting the time out to say, well let me try therapy.
Speaker 6 (47:35):
Yeah, I think the stronger you become, right, and the
and the more that you're trying to go down that
path of greatness and mind shift, the more you do
need to talk to somebody because that's when more, that's
when a lot of the challenge is gonna come.
Speaker 1 (47:51):
I think that's absolutely true. And David, what about you?
Have you thought about the like the impact you're gonna
have on people as they watch a man be vulnerable
and like reclaim his strength and his confidence. I admire
you so much, David for the way you are pursuing
(48:11):
your confidence and your strength and the father you are
for your boys. Do you have you thought about the
way you're going to be inspiring men to stay connected
to their families.
Speaker 2 (48:26):
I think so.
Speaker 6 (48:27):
I think the one thing that Pop said is like,
you know, and and it's definitely true, Like you know,
especially in our community, Like you know, guys where I'm from,
the way I was brought up, and you know, the
things out and reach on the sports level are sometimes
(48:48):
misperceived to be vulnerable sometimes. Right, doesn't mean that you're
a punk or you're weak of anything like that, Right,
just that you're a man, right, you bleed, you human?
Right that you can't be a tough guy all the time, right,
You know what I'm saying. You can't be hard all
the time. You know, especially if you got children too, right,
because one thing like yeah big bad.
Speaker 2 (49:10):
This and this and that.
Speaker 6 (49:11):
But I still gotta be I still gotta show some
softness to my kids. And that's not a bad way
because you gotta have them, you gotta you gotta let
them be able to adjust. You can't be angry all
the time, can't live like that way. No, you gotta
you gotta be happy. So I think it's gonna some
(49:31):
of the things that already that are already accomplished in
the impact that some people know. And I saw what
it had on their lives. Some of the people I
talk to on an everyday basis or a client, I
mean meet and I can impact them with that little
bit here, having somebody here and go and hear these
sessions and see, Yeah, I think it's.
Speaker 2 (49:53):
Gonna take it to another level.
Speaker 6 (49:56):
Maybe the right person hear it and reach out, and
you know, maybe they need a person they need to
talk to. Because I got a lot of people I
know and I know they got stuff going on. They
need to talk to somebody. Because now my conversation is different.
I'm hitting them with some of your questions, like you know,
trying to get you know, like I'm in sales, so
(50:16):
you know, open ended questions.
Speaker 2 (50:18):
So I know that.
Speaker 6 (50:20):
So I know, right, trying to get like you know,
because I feel like to teach one, each one, each one,
teach on whatever which way you go, right, I can't
hold all the information for myself. So if I feel
like if I care about that person and I you know,
and it's what I'm talking about my like my crew,
and I look at him like a brother or something like.
Speaker 2 (50:39):
That, Yeah, I yo, what's up man? What's going on?
Speaker 1 (50:43):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (50:44):
Right, maybe he need to hear me vent or talk,
or maybe he got some something for me, or maybe
I got something for him. Though, but I think more
of that needs to happen. And it wasn't happening a lot,
and where are you know. Some of it is wrinkle
down and we're building our ways out of it.
Speaker 2 (51:02):
But you know, I think we need more of that.
Speaker 1 (51:05):
Stay tuned for my final thoughts after this. Well, I
just have one more suggestion I'm going to make to
you all, and that is to keep noticing greatness within
(51:25):
yourselves and each other. Now having said that, I think
the most appropriate way to wrap all of this up
is to give each of you a final word to say.
I think you guys are are far more important in
this process. You guys are the stars. This is a
process about you. So I'm going to just take a
(51:47):
step back and let you guys say the final words
of this series. So I'll start with Jay, what are
the final words you'd like to share?
Speaker 5 (51:56):
I think I'll first to say thank you to you
for guiding student process.
Speaker 4 (52:01):
I appreciate you.
Speaker 5 (52:03):
I know there was a time where I was like,
I don't know if I'm feeling this, but you kind
of made sure that you kind of took the time
to explain things and I was able to see the
bigger picture.
Speaker 4 (52:16):
So thank you for that.
Speaker 5 (52:18):
Thank you to my father, thank you to David for
going through this process with me. I've definitely learned a
lot about the two of you, and I'm thankful to
have you in my life. And I think you're both
very amazing individuals, amazing men, and I'm really thankful.
Speaker 4 (52:34):
For you too.
Speaker 5 (52:36):
And I'll just say that, you know, for the people
who are listening, like it is okay to not be okay,
and no matter what you've achieved, no matter what you've accomplished,
that doesn't.
Speaker 4 (52:50):
Guarantee that your mental health is being cared for. It.
Speaker 5 (52:54):
You can get all the degrees you want, you can
be in the military.
Speaker 4 (52:58):
You could do all whatever.
Speaker 5 (53:00):
You could be a CEO with Fortune five hundred company,
and you still need to take the time to care
for yourself. And what that care looks like is not
what people always put out there. You know, maybe it
is therapy, maybe it is something else, but you have
to take care of yourself because you're You're the only
self that you have and you're not gonna get another one,
(53:21):
so you might as well, you know, might as well,
you know, hung you down and really ask yourself what
do you need and be you know, be truthful with yourself.
Like whoever's going to judge, let them judge. But at
the end of the day, if you can be a
better version of yourself, then you should try to achieve,
you know.
Speaker 4 (53:41):
Strive for that.
Speaker 5 (53:42):
I think there's so many challenges, but I have a
special place in my heart for veterans, and I know,
like that transition from being in the military to becoming
a civilian can be really difficult, but you know, here's
the opportunity for you to not have beings so structured
(54:03):
and defined for you, and you get to define the
life that you want for you and and get to
move towards that. So I just want to get my
veterans a shout out and and just say, you know,
you got this.
Speaker 4 (54:15):
You can. You can make the life that you want.
And especially oh in the moms, you know you're gonna lose.
Speaker 5 (54:21):
You might lose yourself, you really might, but you can
always find yourself again. And and God is so good,
So even when you forgot who you.
Speaker 2 (54:32):
Are, he hasn't.
Speaker 4 (54:34):
So just just remember that, and you know, just keep
pushing forward.
Speaker 1 (54:39):
Jay, Thank you.
Speaker 4 (54:45):
The world.
Speaker 1 (54:46):
You know, Freddie? What about you? How would you? What
final words would you like to leave? Leave people with?
Speaker 3 (54:55):
Is the thing you've been losing all your life? You
gotta get put yourself off the ground. Don't you realize
you you're winning because you're still pushing you know.
Speaker 2 (55:04):
What I mean?
Speaker 3 (55:04):
You're still pushing that little in you're not pushing. Well,
let's keep pushing that a little Michae who in You're
gonna get there? You don't get there.
Speaker 1 (55:14):
I love that, you know. I think sometimes we get
fully wrapped up in winning is a measurement of the outcome.
But Freddie, what you just said, I wholehearted to believe
you're winning just because you're still pushing like you're winning
because you're in the game. The outcome is in the
measurement of winning or not. The fact that you're still
(55:37):
in the game pushing is the is the measurement, right, David,
What are your final thoughts after going through this?
Speaker 2 (55:44):
I really enjoyed is these uh this journey.
Speaker 6 (55:49):
Out of all the sessions I've probably done had in
my life, this is probably this is the best.
Speaker 2 (55:54):
One I've had.
Speaker 6 (55:55):
Learned a lot, learned some things about Jay which was
all so thank you for having us do this. And
you know, I'm hoping that and I know it will
help some people that's listening. That's gonna take some good
things out of this. Keep the faith, right, whoever you
(56:17):
higher power is, you know, reach out. The pain is
definitely gonna be over. Is only a temporary thing, all right.
Speaker 2 (56:25):
You know?
Speaker 6 (56:26):
I read my book during this journey and one thing
my God David said is like listen to pain. I
look forward to it because it makes most people quick.
But when you push through it, it's a good thing.
On the other side, and that's one thing. Like you know,
I think that I got out of this because it's
been a lot of pain though, but I'm seeing the
good on the other side, and I hope some people
(56:47):
see that too, And that's it.
Speaker 2 (56:49):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (56:50):
I love it, you know, all three of you. I
think that is the best way to end this. So
all I'm going to say is thank you.
Speaker 3 (56:58):
I thank all you guys.
Speaker 4 (57:00):
Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2 (57:03):
I love you.
Speaker 5 (57:04):
I love you too, love you too, too too.
Speaker 1 (57:18):
I think my greatest thought as I think back on
working with this families about this season, is what a
tremendous honor it was to be in a position where
I could meet and help this family. I've been doing
a lot of therapy for a lot of years. I've
been practicing for over fifteen years, nearly twenty, and there
(57:39):
have been times in my clinical work where I just
wish the world could see how impactful therapy could be,
in the hopes that if people could see how impactful
therapy could be, they'd be much more likely to seek therapy,
address their mental health issues and address the issues going
on in their own families. I never thought that I
(58:00):
would be in a position to be able to do that,
and that doesn't happen without a family as courageous and
vulnerable and authentic and real and loving as this family. Now,
I say loving because you've got to love someone in
order to stick to the process. And when it was hard,
(58:22):
when it was difficult, when it was challenging, this family
loved each other enough that they stuck to the process.
Now I don't know long term what's going to happen
with this family, like I don't know anything could happen,
but I do know the small window they gave us
into their life has changed my life and potentially changed
(58:43):
the lives of millions of people listening. So the biggest
thing I want to say to this family is thank you.
I'm so grateful to have been in this position, and
I can't wait to hear how things transpire within this family.
And I can't wait to see the ripple effect that
participating in this season will make for all of the
(59:04):
many listeners. Once again, it's important to ask yourself different
questions while you're on your healing journey. So with each episode,
we like to end with a question that keeps you
thinking and growing and processing so that you yourself improve
your own mental health and unleash your inner superhero. This week,
I want you to ask yourself, who is the person
(59:26):
in your life that you admire most, What traits do
they possess that cause you to admire them? And if
those traits began to show up in a bigger way
in your life, how would you notice it. Thank you
for listening. Major announcement. We have a bonus episode coming
next week where you're going to be listening to me
(59:47):
give you some guided questions. It'll be like you receiving
therapy while you're sitting in your home, listening on your phone,
listening in your car. It's going to be a great episode,
so stay tuned. This is not just a podcast that
I want you to consume and be entertained by. I
actually want you to be inspired. I want you to
(01:00:08):
be impacted by this, and in fact, we can't help
but be impacted by the content we consume. So what
I would like for you to do is come on
this healing journey with us. Come on this journey of
change rediscovery with us. And the way to do that
is to just pay attention to the things going on
in your life. As a consequence of listening to this podcast.
(01:00:31):
Pay attention to things in your life shifting in a
more desirable way. Pay attention to your desirable outcome becoming
your reality. Pay attention to evidence of your success, your resilience,
and your strength. And let us know in the comments
what you're noticing in your life as a result of
listening to this podcast and as a result of paying
attention to these things. I would love to hear from
(01:00:54):
you about your healing journey, your family and your feedback.
Leave a review, send a DM and next with me
on socials at Elliott Speaks, and you can also send
me a text message to nine seven two four two
six two six four zero. Family Therapy is a production
of iHeartRadio and The Black Effect podcast Network. Special thanks
to our assistant Glendale Sefe. It's produced by Jack Queish
(01:01:16):
Thomas and the executive producer Dolly S. S Bisham. For more
podcasts from The Black Effects, visit the iHeartRadio app or
wherever you listen to your favorite shows. The content presented
on the Family Therapy podcast serves solely for educational and
informational purposes. It should not be considered a replacement for
personalized medical or mental health guidance and does not constitute
(01:01:36):
a provider patient relationship. It is advisable to consult with
your healthcare provider or health team, or any specific concerns
or questions you may have.
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