October 11, 2025 • 48 mins
MSNBC’s Ali Vitali examines all the chaos in Congress as the government shutdown drags on.
Then Bolts Magazine’s Daniel Nichanian details key local races and their implications for Democrats’ chances in the midterms.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,
where we discussed the top political headlines with some of
today's best minds. And a new Pew research study says
seven and ten Americans say Donald Trump is trying to
exert more power than his predecessors trying he is. We
have such a great show for you today. MSNBC's own
(00:23):
Ali Batali stops by to talk about all the fuckery
in Congress as the United States government continues to be
shut down. Then we'll talk to both Magazine's Daniel Nickanyon
about local races and their implication on DEM's chances in
the midterms.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
But first, the stories the media is missing.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
So Molly, we kind of knew that one of the
implications of the government shutting down is that Russ Bott
would get in there and start messing around, getting rid
of some things. And now Trump's just narrating it for
everybody and talking about it like it's his dream.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
Yeah, you know, I still think that this is like
a lot of threats and bluster. I mean, they may
do it, but a lot of this is illegal, a
lot of this is unpopular, and Trump likes to be popular,
even though he's not very popular. You know, he likes
to be popular with his base, and a lot of
his base gets social services. They already doge the whole
federal government. So I'm going to be a little bit
(01:24):
suspicious about this. I mean Trump has already said he's
not going to back pay federal workers.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
They're never going to be able to do that.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
And then you know, here he is will be cutting
some very popular democratic programs that aren't popular with Republicans. Spoiler,
you cut them all already, Like you know, look elon
cut cancer research for children that's popular with everyone, right, like,
oh no, we have to let those kids get cancer.
But you know, this is the Empoundment Control Act, another
(01:52):
anti corruption legislation passed after Richard Nixon, who Donald Trump
dreams of being like, but is actual much worse then.
So I would say, there is a bipartisan twenty nineteen
law the mandates that federal workers are eligible for back pay.
So he would be bringing the law not the first
(02:12):
time this administration has broken the law, but probably going
to get him in some problems. So we'll see what happens.
But I again, Trump is really into threats, like that's
kind of what he has going for him.
Speaker 4 (02:24):
This is real passion.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:27):
So I think this has been a little uncovered in
the media because it's not as easy for people to get.
But I'm particularly alarmed at how much Trump is going
in on this Antifa thing. He held a press conference
yesterday with literally the clown show of clown shows about Antifa,
including Andy Neo and Jack Pasobiec. At one point, Jack
(02:50):
Pisobiac delivered this one. This is my favorite in a
long time. Antifa has been around in various iterations for
almost one hundred years, in some instances going back to
the Weimar Republican Germany, Mali. For the listeners who don't
know what was Antifa fighting against when they did that.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Don't tell me Anti, wait, just just give me a hint. Anti.
What's the fat for?
Speaker 1 (03:13):
This?
Speaker 4 (03:13):
Is this guy Hitler?
Speaker 3 (03:15):
You know, if we go to do some bad things
kind of that had this whole Nazi thing going.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (03:22):
But the more disturbing thing, yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
Is this order that he issued that Ken Klippenstein has
covered a bunch of NSPM seven where they're basically saying
that they're going to declare leftists domestic terrorists and.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Right like all democrats, yes.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
And like while everybody's looking over at James Comy and
Tiss James, who have great lawyers who are going to
defend them against the most incompetent person to ever prosecute
a case in the history of the world. We're seeing that.
This is really the other hand that I think we
should be watching a little bit more because it's a
very scary escalation.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Yeah. No, Look, I mean they're doing a lot of
bad stuff, and they're flooding the zone with bad stuff.
And you know, one of the groups that it said
was a terrorist organization was Act Blue, Okay, and Indivisible.
Those are like indivisibles, like you know, the group that
organizes marches on Washington and Act Blue is the machinery
(04:20):
for donations to candidates, Like it's the same as wind Red.
So if you're going to take down Act Blue, then
you should take down Win red to do because they're
the same. Look, this is going to get hairy, but
what's really important is that you don't give up, and
that you know that, like, if people are coordinated and
push back, then this will the democracy survives, and if
(04:42):
people give up and get cynical, then it doesn't.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
That sounds about right.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Luckily, Trump has put his best and brightest who messes
up every legal filing they do on this case.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Yeah, I mean the good news is most these layers
are bad. That I did think Mark Aalized had a
really good point the other day, which is, if you
are working in this administration in any capacity, you should
quit because there are no grown ups in the room
and like you're just helping the mechanics of authoritarianism at
this point.
Speaker 4 (05:13):
I think that's a great point.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
So as well, there was another press conference since we
last taped one. RFK Junior.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
I think what's important about those live cabinet meetings, besides
the fact that they're so embarrassing and so stupid, is
that you really see how much time Trump spends messaging.
I do think, like, you know, when Democrats take back power,
they're going to have to do that too, because this
is you know, the only way to get people to care,
(05:41):
The only way to get your message across, especially in
a mainstream media that's so depleted, is by doing stuff like.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
This, Yeah, and saying really insane stuff that we all discussed,
like the tile and all that the baby took when
was circumcised.
Speaker 4 (05:56):
Is how we got autism.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
Well, things are not going amazing here.
Speaker 3 (06:01):
So I always come back to did this statement come
from him or the worm?
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Right? I mean, technically the worm is Dad, so.
Speaker 3 (06:09):
I'm starting to believe that he's a bad narrator of
his own health.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
Right.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
So basically they're trying to figure out something that causes
autism so that they can sell supplements. One of the
best moments was that RFK Junior said something to the
effect what did he say? He said, like, this is
what I believe to be true. That let me get
somebody to prove it. That was yet Trump. We want
(06:35):
no mercury in the vaccine. We want no aluminum. There's none.
So it's nice that they don't want it because it
doesn't happen. But you know, I think we are definitely
in the process of losing some you know, this administration
is going to mess up vaccines now, whether that means
they're going to make them more expensive, they're going to
make it so insurance doesn't cover them. You know, we're
(06:55):
probably going to lose our statuses like being immune.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
To me because of the measles outbreaks in this country.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
It's going great in South Carolina right now.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
Yeah, and measles that's one of the later ones. Wait
till you start having polio come back way, you start
having some of these diseases. So it's not good, not good.
This stuff is really the stuff that makes me despair.
Speaker 3 (07:20):
Yeah, whereas our next subject is just one of the many,
many stupid things that they do where they just don't
care about anything.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
And well they're just lying.
Speaker 4 (07:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
So the White Houses claim that there's a more than
one thousand percent rise and assaults on ICE agents, but
there's actually data for this that it says you'll be
shocked to hear this, that these people are lying.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
Yeah, I mean, I think when you get your news
from Bennie Johnson, that's how you get here, right, when
you get Bennie Johnson telling you that you know they're
eating the dogs. These are the eating the dogs people.
So Customs ICE officials have claimed since June that assaults
on their own officers have climbed sharply, okay, more than
(08:00):
a thousand percent. Again, the videos I've seen have not
been people beating a pvice. The videos I've seen have
been ice abducting elderly women and children and going through windows.
And I saw an ice age and shoot a minister
right a priest, I said, pepper ball with a pepperball
(08:22):
a close range. I have not seen any you know,
if a lot of bad stuff is happening to them,
they are, it's happening not in front of video cameras.
And it's interesting because this group really likes to videotape stuff,
so I'm surprised we're not saying more of that.
Speaker 3 (08:36):
Yeah, I think, like you know, it always is this
thing of like when history always shows that when military
forces use force on people, they fight back. And I
actually have shocked how team we've been in doing so
so far. I think that it's been very strategic and
good so far that you don't see people doing really
really stupid things. They're being very strategic and helping their
(08:58):
neighbors when they're rounding them up needlessly in very thoughtful ways.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
I think it's been good.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
I think there's been a lot of really good kind
of pushback. I think that they've dressed up like furries,
they played crazy music, they made it seem what it is,
which is this incredibly peaceful protest, and that the people
who are sort of coming after them are really just
(09:24):
doing it to make a case for their own pushback.
Speaker 4 (09:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:34):
Ali Vittali is a host of MSNBC's Way Too Early
Welcome to Politics, Ali Vittally so happy to be back.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
Yes, we will make our haters waiters at the table
of success as we should be.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Quote our mayor who is on his way out, Eric Adams.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
Yeah, and that is all.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
We will talk about New York City poics because nobody cares.
That was always our rule was that nobody cared. Now
I actually think people care a little bit, but.
Speaker 5 (10:06):
I deeply care. We too, really loves a mayoral segment.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
Yes, well, I'm all right. I want to talk first
about your interview with Mike Johnson, because Republicans electeds tend
not to go on MSNBC, with very few exceptions. Democrats
tend not to go on Fox, though sometimes they do,
and it makes Trump really mad. I'm thinking about Mark
Kelly when he went on Fox and Trump isn't a
(10:31):
judge live dad. Uh yeah, But so talk us through
how you got Mike Johnson on.
Speaker 5 (10:37):
Well, first of all, I'm someone who thinks that we
should be talking to people everywhere, and so I.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Also he's the leader of the House. I mean, I
mean very well.
Speaker 5 (10:48):
I know that I've been at NBC for a long time.
Now we are MSNBC. You know, I've been the MSc
concurrently at once, right, ms Noway, ms now in like
a mon Yeah, it's not yet. Okay, it's like the
impending ms NOW And that's miss now, as I've been
telling people, miss now. But it reminds me of the
Green M and M like fascinat anyway. Yeah, So here's
(11:10):
what I think. Republicans run Washington right now. That means
that we need to be talking to Republicans. I've always
been someone who talks to Republicans. You need to know
what's going on on all sides done Congress, it's what's
going on and to cover Congress right So I was
actually so thrilled that Speaker said yes to doing this
interview and that we were able to do it together
because I've covered him for so long. And I think
(11:32):
what it says to me is that if we didn't
think that this was going to be a long shutdown before,
which I think most of us understood that this was
going to stretch, on the fact that he wanted to
broaden his audience to me, said that that was acknowledging
how long we were going to be in this and
that Republicans at least were thinking about the fact that
they needed to try to message to new audiences against
(11:53):
the backdrop of polling that I asked him about that
showed that at that point, a few days into the shutdown,
the Washington Post had a poll that showed forty seven
percent of Americans were blaming Republicans and Trump more than
they were blaming Democrats. They were only getting thirty percent
of Americans blaming them. It's still substantial, but notable as
they're trying to figure out like who wins a shutdown,
(12:13):
which no one actually wins, someone just like loses slightly less.
But I thought that it was notable and important and
it sort of leaves us where we are right now,
which is technically on day ten, but really ensuring that
we're going to be at at least a fourteen day
shutdown because the Senate went home Thursday night and they're
not coming back until Tuesday.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Mike Johnson, so one of the things he did, which
is super interesting, is he sent everyone home before the shutdown,
and that was to make sure that they couldn't do
or revise cr That was to say it's in the Senate.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
The CR we passed is the CR that will be
the CR if you're going to pass it, otherwise you
should down the government. Is that smart?
Speaker 5 (12:58):
I think it's smart until you get to this point. Right,
smart if you're in this posture for a week and
you're just trying to apply leverage, and especially leading up
to that shutdown deadline, right, it was smart to send
the House home because the Senate then felt, Okay, well,
if we don't pass this, then we're going into a shutdown.
But Democrats at that point in the Senate had already
baked into their calculus that they were prepared to shut
(13:21):
the government down because they thought they had found the
right issue to fight on. That's also why we're still
in this because both sides is seeing that their bases
are happy with the way that they're conducting themselves right now.
I think the interesting thing that's happening on the House
Republican side and why Johnson's position of keeping the House
out is now becoming a little problematic for him two reasons.
(13:44):
The first is members are feeling like it looks bad
for them to be kept out of Washington at a
time that there's a crisis that's real. It's something about
on a conference call this week, like members are like,
I don't know, we should come back. There's other stuff
we could be working on. Maybe it's not just the
shutdo right. The second piece of it, too, is that
in the background of this is the Epstein discharge petition
(14:08):
and the fact that Johnson is now saying, well, we're
out of session, so I can't swear in this congresswoman
elect from Arizona. Heame's ADALIEA. Grihalva. The thing is you
can be in a performer session and swear in any
human fact.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
He's swore in two members, two Republican members during a
proformer session recent.
Speaker 5 (14:27):
Line exactly right, and his explanation for that was like, well,
their families were here, and initially we were supposed to
be in session that day, but like if you look
at the House planning calendar, like they've also been supposed
to be in session now and the Speaker can change
that and he has, but like there's nothing that actually
prohibits him from swearing her in. So that pressure is
(14:48):
mounting in the background as well.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
I want to talk about this discharge petition because it's
like it looks really bad for Republicans. So just explain
to us how a discharge petition becomes in anything, because
this is going to die in the Senate.
Speaker 5 (15:02):
It's going to die in the Senate, but it still
forces the issue and potentially forces the vote in the House,
and that puts Republicans in a really sticky position of
having to decide, Okay, are we going to vote for
transparency on an issue that we have said there should
be transparency on all along, or are we going to
buck the or are we going to stay in line
(15:23):
with the White House and not vote for transparency on
this because the President no longer wants to see all
of the files released for whatever reason. We've had this.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
Take your part, it's it's a mystery.
Speaker 5 (15:34):
And for folks who are like not nerds about congressional procedure,
a discharge petition is something that members have to do
in bipartisan fashion, or they can do it in partisan fashion,
but the numbers are so slim in the margins that
you need members of both parties to sign on to
stuff like this. It's basically a way to make an
end run around leadership. If you've got something you want
(15:55):
to vote on, but leadership doesn't want to bring it
to the floor, you have to get to two hundred
and eighteen votes and then pack a lot of patients
because there's a lot of time that's baked into waiting
in this process. Eventually you can force a vote on
the thing that leadership doesn't want on the floor, and
that's probably what's going to happen at some point in
the next few weeks. And like for people who are like, Okay,
(16:15):
well what happens Quinnatalie Tabrahalva is the two hundred and
eighteen signature, It's like she hits to eighteen. I think
they have to wait seven legislative days, five or seven
legislative days. And then once someone comes to the floor
and says, okay, I'm ready to like presco on the
discharge petition, leadership then only has two days to figure
out what they're going to do with it. So like
by bringing the house back, Johnson would start the clock.
(16:37):
And that's also automatic.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
This is so bad and also so stupid. Now we
need to talk about Wolf Blitzer's favorite Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Green.
And this is not a criticism of Wolf because I
love Wolf. Name a more iconic icon than Wolf Blitzer
what is happening. I think it's important to remember that
no one in Washington, DC ever does anything that is
(17:02):
like because I'm a good person. Yeah, so let's game
this out. There's a theory of the case that is,
she wanted to run for Senate and Georgia Trump told her,
Now the polling was bad, God knows why. I mean,
still like she is, she was very maga. After that happened.
She decided that perhaps now some of Trump's incredibly terrible
(17:24):
policies are not her policies, and now she's like trying
to represent her constituents.
Speaker 5 (17:30):
Perhaps, I actually think this is the most mega thing
that any maga has ever.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
Yes us, Why.
Speaker 5 (17:39):
So Trump is notoriously not a partisan like Trump just
wants what he wants based on what's politically expedient or
personally expedient. Yes, and so makes him money or makes
him money. I would argue that's in the personal expediency category.
Speaker 6 (17:58):
Correct.
Speaker 5 (17:58):
So he is not someone who has ever been a
conservative ideologue or a neo con or this or like,
you can't anytually box him in. And so Marjorie Taylor
Green coming out and reading the Political tea leaves on
this and saying oh yeah, okay, almost eight and ten
Americans wants us to do something on the ACA. And oh,
(18:19):
by the way, my kid is telling me that this
is going to cost him too much money. It's actually
like so maga to say, I'm an outsider to the
party of outsiders, and I don't have one political ideological
box that I have to fit in. So I'm going
to say, yeah, this makes sense, and I think it's
also a smart way if you layer the statewide aspirations
(18:41):
lens over it to say, how do I break myself
out of this maga box that in Georgia especially has
shown it has a ceiling to how much support I'm
ever going to get? Do I think that that will work?
I don't know how short a memory do voters have
and how willing are they to let politicians evolved typically
not very right, but stranger things have happened, like Marjorie
(19:05):
Taylor Green becoming Wolf Glitzer's favorite Congress parce.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
It is so interesting because I think part of what
this moment is is people feel so I mean, maybe
you don't, but like a lot of people who do
in this business feel so terrible. We've just seen so
much cowardice out of politicians so much craven opportunism that
when anything seems like it might not be that it's
(19:31):
kind of incredible.
Speaker 5 (19:32):
I think that's right, and I also think that that
fits well into us going into weeks two and three
of this shutdown, because I think both parties right now
are pretty insulated by the DC thinking of, well, I'm
winning on this, where I can win on this, where
I can force the issue here. And I think that
that c Spin moment with Mike Johnson having the woman
(19:54):
call and say, I'm a Republican. My husband is active duty,
my kids have medical needs that aren't going to ge
met if my husband doesn't get his paycheck on October fifteenth,
and she said, I'm embarrassed of my party. But I
also think that there are Democrats who are feeling the pain.
When I talk to Democratic blockmakers, they hear from them
all the time, and I think those people don't actually,
(20:15):
can I swear on this podcast, oh yes, you don't
give a club about it Democrats or winning or for
public They would just like to be able to get
their health care, get their veterans' benefits, get the appointments
that they need, have their constituent service is done, like
that's the shit that they care about, and they don't
care that like Mike Johnson is blaming Democrats, or that
(20:37):
Schumer says that this is good for us, which was
not the best line and has given Republicans a whole
new round of fire.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
I think like the fundamental truth of like you are
a public servant to serve the public is something we've
gotten really far removed from.
Speaker 5 (20:56):
At the same time, again, I understand because source upon
source upon source has explained to me from the Democratic
point of view that they recognize that there is an
infliction of pain right now, but they also feel that
so much pain has already been inflicted when they did
things the quote unquote traditional way, and that they're past
that point and they have to try something they.
Speaker 1 (21:19):
Could not have not done this, like if those guys
wanted to keep their leadership jobs. Like I talked to
Democrats all the time, it was over, like there was
no like they were done, Like they had.
Speaker 5 (21:32):
Not enough per piece right where it's like, yes, the
larger issue of healthcare is so imperative and important for
people voters not not here, who work in Congress. And
at the same time, there's also that background knowledge that
like leadership positions hinge on reading this situation correctly.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
I want to talk about like the authoritarian pushback, the
pushback to authoritarianism, because like, while this administration is super
incompetent and like that will probably be the thing that
keeps American democracy going, it is also doing things that
are shocking, Like what's happening in Chicago is what I'm
(22:12):
thinking of.
Speaker 5 (22:13):
I disagree with you on their incompetence. I I'll tell
you why, because I covered the whole first Trump term.
I was a White House reporter for the first two
years for NBC, and it felt at that time that
there were a lot of people in government who didn't
really understand how government worked. They didn't understand where the
levers of power were, how to pull them, what order
to do it in. I feel that in this second
(22:35):
term of the Trump administration, they know how to exercise
those levers of power now, and they are actually doing so,
and they're doing so without being encumbered by the traditional
norms of Washington. They are unafraid of doing things that
cause people.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
To clutch their pearls or no, they don't give a
fuck yeah, or are or are illegal.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
More importantly, things that are illegal.
Speaker 5 (23:00):
Willing, willing to test it all in court, willing to
try what true combination can I try between Illinois and Texas. Okay,
the Texas ones can go, but the Illinois ones get
held up. All right, that's still two hundred Texas troop.
That's still troops on the ground. We got it there, right,
Like they're willing to test that. I do think that
they run the risk of being too brazen when it
(23:20):
comes to saying federal workers who are furloughed will not
get their back pay.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
I mean that.
Speaker 5 (23:28):
Nineteen to close the loophole and ensure that they could.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Yes, yes, it's not popular, it's not legal, and it's
not happening.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
So that was like so to.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
I mean, they're gonna win a court. But the other
thing with Trump is actually I still think they're incompetent,
but I see what you're saying, and they're definitely more
confident than they ever were. But the other thing that
I think is really important is that this crew is
so overplaying its hand, like they're behaving like we're in
(23:58):
you know, Turkey. You know that they're ard on when
it's like last year we had a normal government, and
I think that that shock is probably ultimately also what
saves this. But like I just the stuff that they're doing,
Like you see, the polling is terrible on this.
Speaker 5 (24:16):
And we'll see, right, Like they have always had consistent
issues that worked for Trump, and it was always immigration,
Like I remember immigration get into like economy election period
where he didn't know if he was winning. It would
be coverage of a caravan on Fox or over indexing
again on crime, and so the fact that you're going all.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
Remember how ye I'm a caravan, right, a caravan, And.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
I was like, where did they find those guys? Are
they bringing them?
Speaker 6 (24:44):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (24:44):
Gone?
Speaker 6 (24:45):
Right?
Speaker 5 (24:45):
But like that was the thing. So it makes sense
why they would lead with the things that have always
worked for them, right, And so now there's a question
of are they over indexing on that? And I think
in my anecdotal conversations with Trump supporter people who have
voted for him three times, they have said to me
kind of questioning, well, I thought the immigration enforcement was
(25:07):
going to be like violent people or criminals, not like
a person who I've known who works at the diner
two blocks down from my house and has been here
for twenty years, like there is some reluctance about that,
and I don't know if that's going to be enough
ultimately see some kind of massive overhaul in the midterms.
(25:27):
That's like the first place that we look for, like
an actual national litmus test. But it's it's certainly an
operating theory, right, like are you overindexing on people wanting
less government bloat and by doing doge and then kind
of like doing doge on top of doge during a shutdown?
Like are you over indexing on that? I don't, We
(25:48):
don't know the answer yet.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
Right, I mean, I do think like you do, see
Joe Rogan being Joe Rogan being like this is not
fucking cool. The reason that Joe Rogan can do that
and Republicans can't is because Joe Rogan has a constituency
and Republicans don't.
Speaker 5 (26:07):
Yeah, and to the extent that it aligned in twenty
twenty four, it aligned, but you know in the same
way that the barstool guys, you know, Dave Pornoy and Rogan, like,
they are not people whose entry point is politics and
their audience's entry point is not politics. It was a
confluence that was really loose, and so I think the
(26:31):
coalition of twenty twenty four, it might have been just
a for now coalition in the same way frankly that
the Biden twenty twenty coalition was just a for now coalition,
and so testing that always in real Yes, But I.
Speaker 1 (26:44):
Do think the big difference between Biden and Trump is
that Trump got in front of those people and Biden
did not. So even like that coalition, I think in
some ways like those people were more likely Biden people
because they actually found him versus the Trump people where
he found them and was like sneakers, Bitcoin, NFTs.
Speaker 2 (27:03):
I'm offering you start.
Speaker 5 (27:05):
For twenty twenty was I've always looked at it as
you know, people voting based on COVID response. Objectively speaking,
the Trump administration's response was bureaucratic mismanagement, at least for
the first several months, right, And so you know, we
could talk about that at length at a different point.
But I think, you know, if I think about the
(27:27):
last few weeks here in Washington, it seems like nothing
has changed, But I actually think there's one big thing
that has changed. It dawned on me as I was
doing my interview with the Speaker. It's that Democrats, by
holding their votes right now have managed to make this
a conversation that's no longer about if ACA subsidies or
healthcare generally should be up for negotiation. Now it's a
(27:50):
debate over when are they going to do that right,
and that debate still needs to be solved because that's
the only way the government gets open again. But they
incremental a win and a shifting of the Overton window
in Congress, where Mike Johnson two weeks ago was not saying, well,
one hundred percent are gonna have to do a negotiation
on the ACA soon was not saying that they were
(28:11):
like open, but they were not committal. And now they
put themselves in a position where they've had to be
committal at least to sitting at the negotiating table. And
I think we shouldn't sleep on the fact that that
is a dynamic that has changed in Washington, and it's
why Democrats are feeling like they need to continue to
hold this posture until there's some firm agreement on what
that negotiation looks like and when.
Speaker 2 (28:33):
Right, So, will you see a way out of the shutdown?
Speaker 5 (28:36):
I see a way out.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
I just especially because Trump wants those ACA subsidies too well,
because he's I.
Speaker 5 (28:43):
Mean, I asked Johnson that I said, if Trump decides,
in his constant quest for a deal that he wants
to do an ACA deal, are you going to work
against him? And he was like, well, no, but we
can't do it until the government is open, And I
don't know, it really depends on Trump's threshold for PA
and if he decides that the party is losing, because again,
(29:04):
like people can say what they will about him, but
he's always been one of the more adept members of
his party at putting his finger in the wind and
saying which way is it blowing? And am I winning?
Speaker 6 (29:15):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (29:15):
Thank you, thank you, thank you, Ali vatall.
Speaker 5 (29:18):
Hey love so pleasure of you.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
Daniel mccanyan is the editor of Volts magazine. Welcome Too
Fast Politics, Daniel, thank you so much. I feel like
there's a lot of local elections going on and some
of them are good, and some of them are looking
good for Democrats and that makes me happy not to
seem to partisan here.
Speaker 6 (29:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 7 (29:41):
I mean, you know, it's an off your election, so
you would think they're off right now, but there's.
Speaker 6 (29:46):
If anything, it gives us a lot.
Speaker 7 (29:47):
More time to drill down at what's happening at the
local level, at.
Speaker 6 (29:51):
The state level.
Speaker 7 (29:51):
A lot of this stuff gets invisible in the presidential year,
but there's so many interesting tensions, the Stigramin's conflicts happening
in school boards, sheriff phrases, mayor races, and there's just
more room to see them, including on some of the
very stuff that you you care about the federal level
for you know.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
So let's start with the governor's race in New Jersey
because it's an interesting race for a couple reasons. Mikey
Cheryl's information was stolen by the admin. They published it
in the hopes of scaring her. The other guy is,
(30:28):
I don't know what you say about that.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
I just talk us through this race and what it
looks like.
Speaker 6 (30:32):
Well, there's so much to say about it. You know.
Speaker 7 (30:34):
First of all, New New Jersey, the state that has
voted pretty consistently blue at federal elections, has a history
of going Republican at the state level, and Republicans certainly
perform better in every state election, even if they lose.
In a way, it's not surprising that we're talking about
as competitive. One thing that's interesting is that the Republican
nominee has really embraced Trump, and he hadn't when he
(30:56):
first ran for governor. So that's a big deal in
terms of what Trump people be able to if he
does win. Immigration is really a huge issue there. Actually
that is being i think a little underplayed because that's
really something that the Republicans have pushed their promise to
end immediately the protections that the state has at the
state level for immigration enforcement. The lieutenant governor candidate is
(31:18):
a sheriff who has sort of a hardline or record
on immigration. It's not necessarily what they're running on in
terms of like ad or like the awkwardly campaign by
in terms of the kind of thing that's going to
have an immediate impact on Jersey. That that's the kind
of thing that's not getting as much play as it could.
And you know, in terms of where this is going,
the polls still showed Democrats of an advantage, not unlike Virginia,
but there's a lot more sweating it on Democrats. Democrats
(31:43):
have always sweat New Jersey elections because it's always them
sort of tidy even if it's not. But it's still
a question of who turns out in an off your
election Democrats have had the advantage, and.
Speaker 6 (31:55):
Cheryl are still ahead in the pull. So that's where
we are right now.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
She's just a little ahead or a lot.
Speaker 6 (32:00):
Ahead, in between four and ten points.
Speaker 7 (32:03):
Oky to people to decide if pat Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
She did really well in the last debate.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
Can we get Jesse in here to talk about her
debate performance because he is a new Jersey height.
Speaker 3 (32:15):
Drastically improved with much more fearce, just as we've seen
Hakeim and Schumer do in recent weeks. It seems there's
a very big tide turn in democratic politics, especially for.
Speaker 4 (32:26):
The more normy. Dems are getting way more aggressive.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
Yes, excellent, normy Dems getting way more aggressive. It's all
about the vibes.
Speaker 7 (32:36):
Virginia, Well, it's also an example of what what you
what you just said win some sears.
Speaker 1 (32:44):
She seems like a dream candidate. I hope she just
runs and runs and runs and runs.
Speaker 6 (32:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 7 (32:50):
I mean the Republicans they seem to be going back
and forth between thinking they can win Virginia and not.
Speaker 6 (32:55):
And the debate.
Speaker 7 (32:56):
There was also a debate there where Republicans said that
hiring gay people was not a form of discrimination. So
that's the sort of headline, we're getting out of the
governor's rate there. Obviously, it's all happening under the shadow
of the shutdown of DOSEE in the fall. In the
spring in a state where federal workers obviously are very effected,
they would in high numbers. So that's sort of the
(33:18):
context in Virginia, you know, as a quick reminder of
for people, the Democrats winning the governor's race in Virginia
would give them control perhaps of the whole state government,
which they actually haven't had very much in the course
of the last forty fifty years. They've only had it
a couple of years. So there's a lot to do
there for Democrats if they gain control.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
And also more importantly win some Seers is incredible and insane,
and the stuff she says is amazing and cinematic, and
she is like a candidate out of a satire.
Speaker 6 (33:46):
Per running mate Josh S.
Speaker 7 (33:48):
Reid, He's fa facing a Democrat who's a Muslim candidate,
and the taxi is starting to wait. In the past
few days have started to be pretty openly islamophophobicons cases,
So that's also the race to watch.
Speaker 1 (34:02):
Yeah, I'm shocked to hear the Republicans are being openly islamophobic. Shocked,
I tell you shocked. That is not completely the vibe
that they do. So let's talk through Pennsylvania Supreme Court
racist because these are a big one and we just
don't see a lot of information about those.
Speaker 7 (34:20):
Like for the sake of federal politics, national politics, that
might be the most important because we're talking about the
swing state of Pennsylvania. We're talking about the state Supreme
Court that has had a lot to do on election
line in the past few years and we'll probably have
it again in the future. And the basic situation is
a little it's a little complicated, but the basic situation
is Democrats have a five to two majority on this court,
(34:44):
very hard earned for them.
Speaker 6 (34:45):
It was very they want to have to.
Speaker 7 (34:47):
Win a lot of expensive elections a while back in
twenty fifteen and now three Democrats are on the ballot
in what's called a retention election, so voters basically say
yes or no, do we want to retain them, we
find a new opponent. Usually these really do not catch
much fire, much heat. Usually they really use what's called
retention election. But this yeo, Republicans are spending a lot
(35:09):
of money. They're trying to mount a campaign to get
voters to out these three Democrats, which would effectively cut
the five two majority into a too too tigh Then
it gets complicated, but basically what the stake is whether
Democrats keep the majority on the on the court after
November and uh and so you know, for obvious reasons,
that's the major one to watch this fall.
Speaker 2 (35:31):
What else do sheriffs?
Speaker 6 (35:33):
First?
Speaker 2 (35:34):
Where are they up? What do these elections look like,
and what is the tension?
Speaker 7 (35:39):
Sheriff elections are maybe sort of under radar. People might
not entirely know why to care about them. You know,
there's a few reasons they really You run things like
jail conditions, which across the US are radio crisis or
human rights crisis.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
Human rights how quaint?
Speaker 7 (35:55):
Yes, go on, Yeah, there's a catastrophe is happening where
people just are a lot locked in and die within
a day all over the country.
Speaker 2 (36:02):
Yeah, including in New York.
Speaker 7 (36:04):
Including in New York, including in a lot of blue places,
and obviously around the country.
Speaker 6 (36:10):
But the issue that I think people might gravitate.
Speaker 7 (36:13):
Mo most around right now and might make sheriffs a
little more interesting national politics is immigration. Because sheriffs are
really I mean, have been in the past, but are
really right now also stepping up as relays of ICE
as crucial connections of Trump's machine to rest immigrants detain immigrants.
That can mean literally going out in the community and
(36:35):
arresting people. It can also mean giving space to ICE
in the local jails because ICE needs space.
Speaker 6 (36:40):
That's really pretty much what ICE needs.
Speaker 7 (36:42):
And so over Trump one point zero in the twenty tens,
sheriff races really got a lot more attention and a
lot of candidates who said no, we're not gonna collaborate
with ICE were winning elections, especially in a lot of
blue areas that were like this, This stuff isn't usually
being paid attention to. So a lot of blue areas
had sheriffs that were very and that was sort of changing.
(37:02):
So this year there's a few places like that. For instance,
I'll just name one in Bucks County in Pennsylvania, which
is outside Philly. It's actually quite a large suburb. There's
a Republican sheriff who just signed the contract with ICE.
Democrats are against the contract. I mean, that's pretty much
the stake where the sheriffs have do authority to do that.
But Mally, I just want to say what the bigger
(37:23):
story on sheriff this year is that Democrats are not
running in places where they could win.
Speaker 6 (37:28):
They're not running anyone.
Speaker 7 (37:29):
So in Virginia both reported on a bunch of places
where there's just no Democrat running.
Speaker 6 (37:35):
In a swing area.
Speaker 7 (37:36):
So I think that that is also a story where
if you care about these issues, the first step is
whether someone is going to run for the office that
is going to decide them.
Speaker 2 (37:44):
Why not?
Speaker 6 (37:45):
Well, two, I mean two reasons.
Speaker 7 (37:46):
One, sheriff are usually more conservative profession and you usually
people who with law enforcement background runs, so that's not
always necessary. In Virginia, for instance, it is not you
don't have to have alaw enforcement background round for sheriff. Well,
I mean the second is a boring answer, but people
don't pay attention in that place in Virginia, I was
saying when we started to ask questions where we're an
(38:08):
article on Chesapeake, Virginia.
Speaker 6 (38:10):
Which is pretty much a fifty to fifty place at.
Speaker 7 (38:12):
The federal elections, the county party was not there, weren't answers,
It was not on the radar of oh, this sheriff
just ran, just signed an ice contract.
Speaker 6 (38:22):
Is that relevant to whether we should run In fact,
the sheriff the.
Speaker 7 (38:25):
Mecratic Party, I believe, told my colleague wrote the story,
Alex Bernez, that he wasn't aware of the contract. So
that just gives you an idea what's going on and
why we need to pay attention to what's going on
at Scharf's department other offices.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
So let's talk about school boards. It's a little bit
less hot, right because there was so much like COVID
stuff where it was like, they have to go back
to school, we have to you know, stop the teachers' union,
we have to ban books. I mean, I guess Moms
for Liberty is still out.
Speaker 6 (38:51):
There, right, Mum's Little brit is still out there.
Speaker 7 (38:53):
And I think what's relevant this year is that some
school boards that were won by Mom's oliber Day or
Conservative in twenty twenty one at the height of the
COVID attention and the school board I mean also Republicans
were really trying to push this education narrative in twenty
twenty one, in the early year, the first year of Biden.
Some of these school boards are now up for election
or the conservative majorities are up progress.
Speaker 1 (39:14):
Who are you know, are people not happy with their
conservative majorities.
Speaker 7 (39:18):
That's a great question. What we've seen this year actually
is an election that have happened already. Conservatives have tofered
big losses, including in Texas in the spring where Conservatives
lost a lot of seats and school boards that were
up and throughout a lot of school boards in North Texas.
And there's more tests now we're looking at places in Pennsylvania,
Texas again, Colorado. And you know these are school boards
(39:40):
that have done I mean, you know people have seen
the headlines, bands of books, policies around trans students and
you know, supposedly banning DII or critical race theory teachings
and in school So those are the really that the
policies that they put forward.
Speaker 6 (39:55):
And now some some of these majorities are on the
line again.
Speaker 2 (39:58):
Yeah, and that makes sense.
Speaker 1 (39:59):
Are there a lot of Democrats running for these school
board seats? Like what does it look like?
Speaker 6 (40:05):
Well, no, it's really it's really interesting to see that.
Speaker 7 (40:07):
I think one of the stories in twenty twenty one
was that Consertos just sprang up, formed slates, ran together,
really turned out their supporters and won a lot of
places that maybe they wouldn't have won if they had
been opposition or that had been organized opposition. That's really
changed in the past couple of years twenty three to three,
twenty twenty five, where it's been super interesting because these
(40:29):
are not necessary places that spaces where there's like organized
politics on the left or on the center, whatever. The
really depends on the place. As to what we're talking
about right right now, there are slates of candidates where
really running against the conservative agenda for school board parents Democrats. However,
they described themselves in different places which didn't exist a
few years ago.
Speaker 2 (40:50):
I think, yes, okay, that's where I was going.
Speaker 6 (40:52):
Yeah, yeah, I don't think it.
Speaker 1 (40:53):
Did.
Speaker 7 (40:53):
I think this idea like there is a conservative agenda
out there and defeated at the school board level. We
need to form a slate, we need to like run together,
we need to have support, etcetera. That I think is
something that we've seen twenty twenty five, twenty twenty four,
but really were not seeing in twenty twenty one.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
Talk to me about the other sort of anonymous dogcatchers
and garbage collector rather soon I know. Well, that's why
I'm asking you. Are you seeing democratic energy?
Speaker 2 (41:20):
Are you not?
Speaker 6 (41:21):
I talk a.
Speaker 1 (41:22):
Lot to Amanda Littman from run for Something, and she
says her numbers are insane. So like, if those numbers
are insane, you should be seeing them certainly in some
of those.
Speaker 7 (41:34):
I talked about the inverse on sheriffs. I mean, sheriffs
are their own little category. Like I was saying, Virginia,
you mass in headlines that in Virginia. Also, Democrats are
very proud that for the first time in a while,
they're running a candid in every state house district this year,
you know. So we were seeing in terms of like
state House and those offices that are more more straightforwardly partisan,
(41:54):
we're seeing a lot of energy a thing on the
Democratic side. We're also seeing that on oral elections or
city council elections.
Speaker 6 (42:01):
I think.
Speaker 7 (42:02):
So that often is in places where Democrat Republican is
not necessarily the dynamic. But I mean, just a few
days ago, Democrats flipped actually the mayor's office in Fairbanks
in Alaska. Yes, so that's an example.
Speaker 1 (42:16):
I mean, Alaska, I think is super important for any
number of reasons. But I want you to explain what
happened there in Alaska.
Speaker 7 (42:22):
Right, right, So Alaska is one of the states that
hold its elections in October when they can rather remember
one does why not hold election anytime and not but
they hold elections in October, and they had elections for
actually lots of elections, but the one I was watching
was the mayor's race in Fairbanks, which is actually the
second biggest city in Alaska, and there was a conservative
(42:44):
Republican an office there was running for a second term.
But one of the things to know about him is
a few months ago he had he drew a condemnation
for comments that made about natives in Alaska, associating them
with crime, and sort of apologized so that that that
that's the sort of personality we're talking about. And he
(43:05):
lost by roughly ten points to a Democrat in Fairbanks.
I was really paying attention to that, but I saw
in the Alaska media over the past few days that
progressive can Is actually apparently won all sorts of offices
in the region of Fairbanks, including for school board. There's
another example of appairly in near sweep by progressives up
and down the ballot in Fairbanks. And we I mean,
(43:25):
you know, in there's a lot of elections all around
the country in a month, and mean is problem that
wherever anyone is sitting, there is some there's something close,
whether it's for mayor, city council, prosecutor election, judge.
Speaker 4 (43:39):
What.
Speaker 6 (43:39):
There's so much and you know, we're.
Speaker 7 (43:41):
Seeing a lot of energy in places like Seattle, Minneapolis,
there's there's pretty much the entirety of the city government
is on the line. So there's a lot of important
elections happening.
Speaker 2 (43:54):
I think that's so interesting about Alaska being because you know,
they say, so goes Fairbanks, so goes the nation, and.
Speaker 7 (44:05):
Alaska could be at the center of things in twenty
twenty six because there's a Senate race and the governor's race.
But I think some national Democrats are hoping to recruit
Mary Peltola. I think they're hoping to recruit her to
run for Senate. She might run for governor. I mean,
but it's also been the kind of state where Democrats
hope that they can make in roads and we'll see
(44:26):
how they got and not to.
Speaker 1 (44:28):
Yeah, a lot of money been spent in Alaska. Actually
not a lot of money, but a lot of dreams comparatively, Yeah, yeah,
I mean, is there anything else that's coming up that
we just should know about?
Speaker 7 (44:41):
Well, the big elections we haven't talked about to come
to mind. At the state level, really yea, please real home.
The big ones, I mean, the obvious one is Prop
fifty in California, which is the ballot measure that Gavin
Newson push that would respond to Texas and Jerry Mander California.
Speaker 2 (44:58):
The polling on that looks good.
Speaker 7 (45:00):
The polling on that has the Yes leading by about
ten to twenty, maybe more closer to twenty. It was
I think a gamble by a newsim because it was
very young, There wasn't really a precedent for a measure
like this, very unclear what was going to happen, still
so unclear of what we'll see in the month. And
then the other one I want to highlight is one
that really isn't getting a lot of attention is Georgia
(45:20):
has a couple of statewide offices on the ballot for
What's it's energy Commission, It's it's the commission that decides
it's at the state level, a commission that decides electricity prices,
commission that decides renewable energy? Do you use of fossil
fuels in the state. And Democrats haven't won a statewide
office other than federal races. We all know jo Biden one,
(45:41):
we all know that Raphael Warnack and ass Off one.
But at the state level, Democrats have not managed to
make inroads and did they have two opportunities this fall
to defeat Republican incumbents and get on the spoort, which
I think is important in and of itself for the
politics of the board, but also as the kind of
a test to where or where the state's at. It's
very unusual to have Georgia have elections and an off
feel like this.
Speaker 6 (46:01):
Who knows what's going to turn out two votes? Those
are twoe that I think are very interesting to watch.
Speaker 2 (46:05):
Thank you, Taniel.
Speaker 6 (46:07):
I hope you'll come back, of course, whenever no more infectly.
Speaker 2 (46:14):
Jesse Cannon Somali A.
Speaker 3 (46:16):
Federal judges imposed new limits on ice operations in Illinois
since they haven't even been respecting that people are journalists
and they've been basically acting with total lawlessness.
Speaker 4 (46:27):
The footage is just astounding.
Speaker 1 (46:29):
So it is fifty two page ruling Federal District Court.
Jeffrey Cummings says the legal basis for ice tools for
maggy rest blank comhorans that are filled out by officers
in the field. That's not how any it is supposed
to work. By the way, I just want to point out,
like ICE is meant to be immigration customs enforcement, it
(46:50):
was after nine to eleven we did not have This
was like a sort of ad hoc thing put together,
and now it's just become Trump's paramilitary We are operating
so outside of how any of this is supposed to work.
I don't want to say it's wild, it's just illegal,
(47:10):
Like none of this is legal. All of this is
like weird emergency powers from nine to eleven. Real example
of why you need to, like, once an emergency is over,
make sure that all these emergency powers are revoked. This
is like a really great example of how not to
do any of this. We got here by I mean,
(47:33):
there's a really great episode of this show that I
love called five to four, which is this really smart
legal podcast we've had them on here. They talk about
how it's just the way that authoritarians are able to
rise in a country with laws like this is when
(47:54):
they are able to sort of seize on these emergency powers.
Which is why I mean, I know our Supreme Court
is completely in the tank for Trump, but if they
ever did push back on this.
Speaker 2 (48:03):
It would be good.
Speaker 1 (48:05):
That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in
every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday, and Saturday to hear the best
minds and politics make sense of all this chaos. If
you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a friend
and keep the conversation going.
Speaker 2 (48:25):
Thanks for listening.
Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,
where we discussed the top political headlines with some of
today's best minds. And a new Pew research study says
seven and ten Americans say Donald Trump is trying to
exert more power than his predecessors trying he is. We
have such a great show for you today. MSNBC's own
(00:23):
Ali Batali stops by to talk about all the fuckery
in Congress as the United States government continues to be
shut down. Then we'll talk to both Magazine's Daniel Nickanyon
about local races and their implication on DEM's chances in
the midterms.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
But first, the stories the media is missing.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
So Molly, we kind of knew that one of the
implications of the government shutting down is that Russ Bott
would get in there and start messing around, getting rid
of some things. And now Trump's just narrating it for
everybody and talking about it like it's his dream.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
Yeah, you know, I still think that this is like
a lot of threats and bluster. I mean, they may
do it, but a lot of this is illegal, a
lot of this is unpopular, and Trump likes to be popular,
even though he's not very popular. You know, he likes
to be popular with his base, and a lot of
his base gets social services. They already doge the whole
federal government. So I'm going to be a little bit
(01:24):
suspicious about this. I mean Trump has already said he's
not going to back pay federal workers.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
They're never going to be able to do that.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
And then you know, here he is will be cutting
some very popular democratic programs that aren't popular with Republicans. Spoiler,
you cut them all already, Like you know, look elon
cut cancer research for children that's popular with everyone, right, like,
oh no, we have to let those kids get cancer.
But you know, this is the Empoundment Control Act, another
(01:52):
anti corruption legislation passed after Richard Nixon, who Donald Trump
dreams of being like, but is actual much worse then.
So I would say, there is a bipartisan twenty nineteen
law the mandates that federal workers are eligible for back pay.
So he would be bringing the law not the first
(02:12):
time this administration has broken the law, but probably going
to get him in some problems. So we'll see what happens.
But I again, Trump is really into threats, like that's
kind of what he has going for him.
Speaker 4 (02:24):
This is real passion.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:27):
So I think this has been a little uncovered in
the media because it's not as easy for people to get.
But I'm particularly alarmed at how much Trump is going
in on this Antifa thing. He held a press conference
yesterday with literally the clown show of clown shows about Antifa,
including Andy Neo and Jack Pasobiec. At one point, Jack
(02:50):
Pisobiac delivered this one. This is my favorite in a
long time. Antifa has been around in various iterations for
almost one hundred years, in some instances going back to
the Weimar Republican Germany, Mali. For the listeners who don't
know what was Antifa fighting against when they did that.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Don't tell me Anti, wait, just just give me a hint. Anti.
What's the fat for?
Speaker 1 (03:13):
This?
Speaker 4 (03:13):
Is this guy Hitler?
Speaker 3 (03:15):
You know, if we go to do some bad things
kind of that had this whole Nazi thing going.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (03:22):
But the more disturbing thing, yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
Is this order that he issued that Ken Klippenstein has
covered a bunch of NSPM seven where they're basically saying
that they're going to declare leftists domestic terrorists and.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Right like all democrats, yes.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
And like while everybody's looking over at James Comy and
Tiss James, who have great lawyers who are going to
defend them against the most incompetent person to ever prosecute
a case in the history of the world. We're seeing that.
This is really the other hand that I think we
should be watching a little bit more because it's a
very scary escalation.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Yeah. No, Look, I mean they're doing a lot of
bad stuff, and they're flooding the zone with bad stuff.
And you know, one of the groups that it said
was a terrorist organization was Act Blue, Okay, and Indivisible.
Those are like indivisibles, like you know, the group that
organizes marches on Washington and Act Blue is the machinery
(04:20):
for donations to candidates, Like it's the same as wind Red.
So if you're going to take down Act Blue, then
you should take down Win red to do because they're
the same. Look, this is going to get hairy, but
what's really important is that you don't give up, and
that you know that, like, if people are coordinated and
push back, then this will the democracy survives, and if
(04:42):
people give up and get cynical, then it doesn't.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
That sounds about right.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Luckily, Trump has put his best and brightest who messes
up every legal filing they do on this case.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Yeah, I mean the good news is most these layers
are bad. That I did think Mark Aalized had a
really good point the other day, which is, if you
are working in this administration in any capacity, you should
quit because there are no grown ups in the room
and like you're just helping the mechanics of authoritarianism at
this point.
Speaker 4 (05:13):
I think that's a great point.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
So as well, there was another press conference since we
last taped one. RFK Junior.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
I think what's important about those live cabinet meetings, besides
the fact that they're so embarrassing and so stupid, is
that you really see how much time Trump spends messaging.
I do think, like, you know, when Democrats take back power,
they're going to have to do that too, because this
is you know, the only way to get people to care,
(05:41):
The only way to get your message across, especially in
a mainstream media that's so depleted, is by doing stuff like.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
This, Yeah, and saying really insane stuff that we all discussed,
like the tile and all that the baby took when
was circumcised.
Speaker 4 (05:56):
Is how we got autism.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
Well, things are not going amazing here.
Speaker 3 (06:01):
So I always come back to did this statement come
from him or the worm?
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Right? I mean, technically the worm is Dad, so.
Speaker 3 (06:09):
I'm starting to believe that he's a bad narrator of
his own health.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
Right.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
So basically they're trying to figure out something that causes
autism so that they can sell supplements. One of the
best moments was that RFK Junior said something to the
effect what did he say? He said, like, this is
what I believe to be true. That let me get
somebody to prove it. That was yet Trump. We want
(06:35):
no mercury in the vaccine. We want no aluminum. There's none.
So it's nice that they don't want it because it
doesn't happen. But you know, I think we are definitely
in the process of losing some you know, this administration
is going to mess up vaccines now, whether that means
they're going to make them more expensive, they're going to
make it so insurance doesn't cover them. You know, we're
(06:55):
probably going to lose our statuses like being immune.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
To me because of the measles outbreaks in this country.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
It's going great in South Carolina right now.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
Yeah, and measles that's one of the later ones. Wait
till you start having polio come back way, you start
having some of these diseases. So it's not good, not good.
This stuff is really the stuff that makes me despair.
Speaker 3 (07:20):
Yeah, whereas our next subject is just one of the many,
many stupid things that they do where they just don't
care about anything.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
And well they're just lying.
Speaker 4 (07:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
So the White Houses claim that there's a more than
one thousand percent rise and assaults on ICE agents, but
there's actually data for this that it says you'll be
shocked to hear this, that these people are lying.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
Yeah, I mean, I think when you get your news
from Bennie Johnson, that's how you get here, right, when
you get Bennie Johnson telling you that you know they're
eating the dogs. These are the eating the dogs people.
So Customs ICE officials have claimed since June that assaults
on their own officers have climbed sharply, okay, more than
(08:00):
a thousand percent. Again, the videos I've seen have not
been people beating a pvice. The videos I've seen have
been ice abducting elderly women and children and going through windows.
And I saw an ice age and shoot a minister
right a priest, I said, pepper ball with a pepperball
(08:22):
a close range. I have not seen any you know,
if a lot of bad stuff is happening to them,
they are, it's happening not in front of video cameras.
And it's interesting because this group really likes to videotape stuff,
so I'm surprised we're not saying more of that.
Speaker 3 (08:36):
Yeah, I think, like you know, it always is this
thing of like when history always shows that when military
forces use force on people, they fight back. And I
actually have shocked how team we've been in doing so
so far. I think that it's been very strategic and
good so far that you don't see people doing really
really stupid things. They're being very strategic and helping their
(08:58):
neighbors when they're rounding them up needlessly in very thoughtful ways.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
I think it's been good.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
I think there's been a lot of really good kind
of pushback. I think that they've dressed up like furries,
they played crazy music, they made it seem what it is,
which is this incredibly peaceful protest, and that the people
who are sort of coming after them are really just
(09:24):
doing it to make a case for their own pushback.
Speaker 4 (09:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:34):
Ali Vittali is a host of MSNBC's Way Too Early
Welcome to Politics, Ali Vittally so happy to be back.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
Yes, we will make our haters waiters at the table
of success as we should be.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Quote our mayor who is on his way out, Eric Adams.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
Yeah, and that is all.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
We will talk about New York City poics because nobody cares.
That was always our rule was that nobody cared. Now
I actually think people care a little bit, but.
Speaker 5 (10:06):
I deeply care. We too, really loves a mayoral segment.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
Yes, well, I'm all right. I want to talk first
about your interview with Mike Johnson, because Republicans electeds tend
not to go on MSNBC, with very few exceptions. Democrats
tend not to go on Fox, though sometimes they do,
and it makes Trump really mad. I'm thinking about Mark
Kelly when he went on Fox and Trump isn't a
(10:31):
judge live dad. Uh yeah, But so talk us through
how you got Mike Johnson on.
Speaker 5 (10:37):
Well, first of all, I'm someone who thinks that we
should be talking to people everywhere, and so I.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Also he's the leader of the House. I mean, I
mean very well.
Speaker 5 (10:48):
I know that I've been at NBC for a long time.
Now we are MSNBC. You know, I've been the MSc
concurrently at once, right, ms Noway, ms now in like
a mon Yeah, it's not yet. Okay, it's like the
impending ms NOW And that's miss now, as I've been
telling people, miss now. But it reminds me of the
Green M and M like fascinat anyway. Yeah, So here's
(11:10):
what I think. Republicans run Washington right now. That means
that we need to be talking to Republicans. I've always
been someone who talks to Republicans. You need to know
what's going on on all sides done Congress, it's what's
going on and to cover Congress right So I was
actually so thrilled that Speaker said yes to doing this
interview and that we were able to do it together
because I've covered him for so long. And I think
(11:32):
what it says to me is that if we didn't
think that this was going to be a long shutdown before,
which I think most of us understood that this was
going to stretch, on the fact that he wanted to
broaden his audience to me, said that that was acknowledging
how long we were going to be in this and
that Republicans at least were thinking about the fact that
they needed to try to message to new audiences against
(11:53):
the backdrop of polling that I asked him about that
showed that at that point, a few days into the shutdown,
the Washington Post had a poll that showed forty seven
percent of Americans were blaming Republicans and Trump more than
they were blaming Democrats. They were only getting thirty percent
of Americans blaming them. It's still substantial, but notable as
they're trying to figure out like who wins a shutdown,
(12:13):
which no one actually wins, someone just like loses slightly less.
But I thought that it was notable and important and
it sort of leaves us where we are right now,
which is technically on day ten, but really ensuring that
we're going to be at at least a fourteen day
shutdown because the Senate went home Thursday night and they're
not coming back until Tuesday.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Mike Johnson, so one of the things he did, which
is super interesting, is he sent everyone home before the shutdown,
and that was to make sure that they couldn't do
or revise cr That was to say it's in the Senate.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
The CR we passed is the CR that will be
the CR if you're going to pass it, otherwise you
should down the government. Is that smart?
Speaker 5 (12:58):
I think it's smart until you get to this point. Right,
smart if you're in this posture for a week and
you're just trying to apply leverage, and especially leading up
to that shutdown deadline, right, it was smart to send
the House home because the Senate then felt, Okay, well,
if we don't pass this, then we're going into a shutdown.
But Democrats at that point in the Senate had already
baked into their calculus that they were prepared to shut
(13:21):
the government down because they thought they had found the
right issue to fight on. That's also why we're still
in this because both sides is seeing that their bases
are happy with the way that they're conducting themselves right now.
I think the interesting thing that's happening on the House
Republican side and why Johnson's position of keeping the House
out is now becoming a little problematic for him two reasons.
(13:44):
The first is members are feeling like it looks bad
for them to be kept out of Washington at a
time that there's a crisis that's real. It's something about
on a conference call this week, like members are like,
I don't know, we should come back. There's other stuff
we could be working on. Maybe it's not just the
shutdo right. The second piece of it, too, is that
in the background of this is the Epstein discharge petition
(14:08):
and the fact that Johnson is now saying, well, we're
out of session, so I can't swear in this congresswoman
elect from Arizona. Heame's ADALIEA. Grihalva. The thing is you
can be in a performer session and swear in any
human fact.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
He's swore in two members, two Republican members during a
proformer session recent.
Speaker 5 (14:27):
Line exactly right, and his explanation for that was like, well,
their families were here, and initially we were supposed to
be in session that day, but like if you look
at the House planning calendar, like they've also been supposed
to be in session now and the Speaker can change
that and he has, but like there's nothing that actually
prohibits him from swearing her in. So that pressure is
(14:48):
mounting in the background as well.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
I want to talk about this discharge petition because it's
like it looks really bad for Republicans. So just explain
to us how a discharge petition becomes in anything, because
this is going to die in the Senate.
Speaker 5 (15:02):
It's going to die in the Senate, but it still
forces the issue and potentially forces the vote in the House,
and that puts Republicans in a really sticky position of
having to decide, Okay, are we going to vote for
transparency on an issue that we have said there should
be transparency on all along, or are we going to
buck the or are we going to stay in line
(15:23):
with the White House and not vote for transparency on
this because the President no longer wants to see all
of the files released for whatever reason. We've had this.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
Take your part, it's it's a mystery.
Speaker 5 (15:34):
And for folks who are like not nerds about congressional procedure,
a discharge petition is something that members have to do
in bipartisan fashion, or they can do it in partisan fashion,
but the numbers are so slim in the margins that
you need members of both parties to sign on to
stuff like this. It's basically a way to make an
end run around leadership. If you've got something you want
(15:55):
to vote on, but leadership doesn't want to bring it
to the floor, you have to get to two hundred
and eighteen votes and then pack a lot of patients
because there's a lot of time that's baked into waiting
in this process. Eventually you can force a vote on
the thing that leadership doesn't want on the floor, and
that's probably what's going to happen at some point in
the next few weeks. And like for people who are like, Okay,
(16:15):
well what happens Quinnatalie Tabrahalva is the two hundred and
eighteen signature, It's like she hits to eighteen. I think
they have to wait seven legislative days, five or seven
legislative days. And then once someone comes to the floor
and says, okay, I'm ready to like presco on the
discharge petition, leadership then only has two days to figure
out what they're going to do with it. So like
by bringing the house back, Johnson would start the clock.
(16:37):
And that's also automatic.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
This is so bad and also so stupid. Now we
need to talk about Wolf Blitzer's favorite Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Green.
And this is not a criticism of Wolf because I
love Wolf. Name a more iconic icon than Wolf Blitzer
what is happening. I think it's important to remember that
no one in Washington, DC ever does anything that is
(17:02):
like because I'm a good person. Yeah, so let's game
this out. There's a theory of the case that is,
she wanted to run for Senate and Georgia Trump told her,
Now the polling was bad, God knows why. I mean,
still like she is, she was very maga. After that happened.
She decided that perhaps now some of Trump's incredibly terrible
(17:24):
policies are not her policies, and now she's like trying
to represent her constituents.
Speaker 5 (17:30):
Perhaps, I actually think this is the most mega thing
that any maga has ever.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
Yes us, Why.
Speaker 5 (17:39):
So Trump is notoriously not a partisan like Trump just
wants what he wants based on what's politically expedient or
personally expedient. Yes, and so makes him money or makes
him money. I would argue that's in the personal expediency category.
Speaker 6 (17:58):
Correct.
Speaker 5 (17:58):
So he is not someone who has ever been a
conservative ideologue or a neo con or this or like,
you can't anytually box him in. And so Marjorie Taylor
Green coming out and reading the Political tea leaves on
this and saying oh yeah, okay, almost eight and ten
Americans wants us to do something on the ACA. And oh,
(18:19):
by the way, my kid is telling me that this
is going to cost him too much money. It's actually
like so maga to say, I'm an outsider to the
party of outsiders, and I don't have one political ideological
box that I have to fit in. So I'm going
to say, yeah, this makes sense, and I think it's
also a smart way if you layer the statewide aspirations
(18:41):
lens over it to say, how do I break myself
out of this maga box that in Georgia especially has
shown it has a ceiling to how much support I'm
ever going to get? Do I think that that will work?
I don't know how short a memory do voters have
and how willing are they to let politicians evolved typically
not very right, but stranger things have happened, like Marjorie
(19:05):
Taylor Green becoming Wolf Glitzer's favorite Congress parce.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
It is so interesting because I think part of what
this moment is is people feel so I mean, maybe
you don't, but like a lot of people who do
in this business feel so terrible. We've just seen so
much cowardice out of politicians so much craven opportunism that
when anything seems like it might not be that it's
(19:31):
kind of incredible.
Speaker 5 (19:32):
I think that's right, and I also think that that
fits well into us going into weeks two and three
of this shutdown, because I think both parties right now
are pretty insulated by the DC thinking of, well, I'm
winning on this, where I can win on this, where
I can force the issue here. And I think that
that c Spin moment with Mike Johnson having the woman
(19:54):
call and say, I'm a Republican. My husband is active duty,
my kids have medical needs that aren't going to ge
met if my husband doesn't get his paycheck on October fifteenth,
and she said, I'm embarrassed of my party. But I
also think that there are Democrats who are feeling the pain.
When I talk to Democratic blockmakers, they hear from them
all the time, and I think those people don't actually,
(20:15):
can I swear on this podcast, oh yes, you don't
give a club about it Democrats or winning or for
public They would just like to be able to get
their health care, get their veterans' benefits, get the appointments
that they need, have their constituent service is done, like
that's the shit that they care about, and they don't
care that like Mike Johnson is blaming Democrats, or that
(20:37):
Schumer says that this is good for us, which was
not the best line and has given Republicans a whole
new round of fire.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
I think like the fundamental truth of like you are
a public servant to serve the public is something we've
gotten really far removed from.
Speaker 5 (20:56):
At the same time, again, I understand because source upon
source upon source has explained to me from the Democratic
point of view that they recognize that there is an
infliction of pain right now, but they also feel that
so much pain has already been inflicted when they did
things the quote unquote traditional way, and that they're past
that point and they have to try something they.
Speaker 1 (21:19):
Could not have not done this, like if those guys
wanted to keep their leadership jobs. Like I talked to
Democrats all the time, it was over, like there was
no like they were done, Like they had.
Speaker 5 (21:32):
Not enough per piece right where it's like, yes, the
larger issue of healthcare is so imperative and important for
people voters not not here, who work in Congress. And
at the same time, there's also that background knowledge that
like leadership positions hinge on reading this situation correctly.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
I want to talk about like the authoritarian pushback, the
pushback to authoritarianism, because like, while this administration is super
incompetent and like that will probably be the thing that
keeps American democracy going, it is also doing things that
are shocking, Like what's happening in Chicago is what I'm
(22:12):
thinking of.
Speaker 5 (22:13):
I disagree with you on their incompetence. I I'll tell
you why, because I covered the whole first Trump term.
I was a White House reporter for the first two
years for NBC, and it felt at that time that
there were a lot of people in government who didn't
really understand how government worked. They didn't understand where the
levers of power were, how to pull them, what order
to do it in. I feel that in this second
(22:35):
term of the Trump administration, they know how to exercise
those levers of power now, and they are actually doing so,
and they're doing so without being encumbered by the traditional
norms of Washington. They are unafraid of doing things that
cause people.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
To clutch their pearls or no, they don't give a
fuck yeah, or are or are illegal.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
More importantly, things that are illegal.
Speaker 5 (23:00):
Willing, willing to test it all in court, willing to
try what true combination can I try between Illinois and Texas. Okay,
the Texas ones can go, but the Illinois ones get
held up. All right, that's still two hundred Texas troop.
That's still troops on the ground. We got it there, right,
Like they're willing to test that. I do think that
they run the risk of being too brazen when it
(23:20):
comes to saying federal workers who are furloughed will not
get their back pay.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
I mean that.
Speaker 5 (23:28):
Nineteen to close the loophole and ensure that they could.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Yes, yes, it's not popular, it's not legal, and it's
not happening.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
So that was like so to.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
I mean, they're gonna win a court. But the other
thing with Trump is actually I still think they're incompetent,
but I see what you're saying, and they're definitely more
confident than they ever were. But the other thing that
I think is really important is that this crew is
so overplaying its hand, like they're behaving like we're in
(23:58):
you know, Turkey. You know that they're ard on when
it's like last year we had a normal government, and
I think that that shock is probably ultimately also what
saves this. But like I just the stuff that they're doing,
Like you see, the polling is terrible on this.
Speaker 5 (24:16):
And we'll see, right, Like they have always had consistent
issues that worked for Trump, and it was always immigration,
Like I remember immigration get into like economy election period
where he didn't know if he was winning. It would
be coverage of a caravan on Fox or over indexing
again on crime, and so the fact that you're going all.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
Remember how ye I'm a caravan, right, a caravan, And.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
I was like, where did they find those guys? Are
they bringing them?
Speaker 6 (24:44):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (24:44):
Gone?
Speaker 6 (24:45):
Right?
Speaker 5 (24:45):
But like that was the thing. So it makes sense
why they would lead with the things that have always
worked for them, right, And so now there's a question
of are they over indexing on that? And I think
in my anecdotal conversations with Trump supporter people who have
voted for him three times, they have said to me
kind of questioning, well, I thought the immigration enforcement was
(25:07):
going to be like violent people or criminals, not like
a person who I've known who works at the diner
two blocks down from my house and has been here
for twenty years, like there is some reluctance about that,
and I don't know if that's going to be enough
ultimately see some kind of massive overhaul in the midterms.
(25:27):
That's like the first place that we look for, like
an actual national litmus test. But it's it's certainly an
operating theory, right, like are you overindexing on people wanting
less government bloat and by doing doge and then kind
of like doing doge on top of doge during a shutdown?
Like are you over indexing on that? I don't, We
(25:48):
don't know the answer yet.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
Right, I mean, I do think like you do, see
Joe Rogan being Joe Rogan being like this is not
fucking cool. The reason that Joe Rogan can do that
and Republicans can't is because Joe Rogan has a constituency
and Republicans don't.
Speaker 5 (26:07):
Yeah, and to the extent that it aligned in twenty
twenty four, it aligned, but you know in the same
way that the barstool guys, you know, Dave Pornoy and Rogan, like,
they are not people whose entry point is politics and
their audience's entry point is not politics. It was a
confluence that was really loose, and so I think the
(26:31):
coalition of twenty twenty four, it might have been just
a for now coalition in the same way frankly that
the Biden twenty twenty coalition was just a for now coalition,
and so testing that always in real Yes, But I.
Speaker 1 (26:44):
Do think the big difference between Biden and Trump is
that Trump got in front of those people and Biden
did not. So even like that coalition, I think in
some ways like those people were more likely Biden people
because they actually found him versus the Trump people where
he found them and was like sneakers, Bitcoin, NFTs.
Speaker 2 (27:03):
I'm offering you start.
Speaker 5 (27:05):
For twenty twenty was I've always looked at it as
you know, people voting based on COVID response. Objectively speaking,
the Trump administration's response was bureaucratic mismanagement, at least for
the first several months, right, And so you know, we
could talk about that at length at a different point.
But I think, you know, if I think about the
(27:27):
last few weeks here in Washington, it seems like nothing
has changed, But I actually think there's one big thing
that has changed. It dawned on me as I was
doing my interview with the Speaker. It's that Democrats, by
holding their votes right now have managed to make this
a conversation that's no longer about if ACA subsidies or
healthcare generally should be up for negotiation. Now it's a
(27:50):
debate over when are they going to do that right,
and that debate still needs to be solved because that's
the only way the government gets open again. But they
incremental a win and a shifting of the Overton window
in Congress, where Mike Johnson two weeks ago was not saying, well,
one hundred percent are gonna have to do a negotiation
on the ACA soon was not saying that they were
(28:11):
like open, but they were not committal. And now they
put themselves in a position where they've had to be
committal at least to sitting at the negotiating table. And
I think we shouldn't sleep on the fact that that
is a dynamic that has changed in Washington, and it's
why Democrats are feeling like they need to continue to
hold this posture until there's some firm agreement on what
that negotiation looks like and when.
Speaker 2 (28:33):
Right, So, will you see a way out of the shutdown?
Speaker 5 (28:36):
I see a way out.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
I just especially because Trump wants those ACA subsidies too well,
because he's I.
Speaker 5 (28:43):
Mean, I asked Johnson that I said, if Trump decides,
in his constant quest for a deal that he wants
to do an ACA deal, are you going to work
against him? And he was like, well, no, but we
can't do it until the government is open, And I
don't know, it really depends on Trump's threshold for PA
and if he decides that the party is losing, because again,
(29:04):
like people can say what they will about him, but
he's always been one of the more adept members of
his party at putting his finger in the wind and
saying which way is it blowing? And am I winning?
Speaker 6 (29:15):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (29:15):
Thank you, thank you, thank you, Ali vatall.
Speaker 5 (29:18):
Hey love so pleasure of you.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
Daniel mccanyan is the editor of Volts magazine. Welcome Too
Fast Politics, Daniel, thank you so much. I feel like
there's a lot of local elections going on and some
of them are good, and some of them are looking
good for Democrats and that makes me happy not to
seem to partisan here.
Speaker 6 (29:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 7 (29:41):
I mean, you know, it's an off your election, so
you would think they're off right now, but there's.
Speaker 6 (29:46):
If anything, it gives us a lot.
Speaker 7 (29:47):
More time to drill down at what's happening at the
local level, at.
Speaker 6 (29:51):
The state level.
Speaker 7 (29:51):
A lot of this stuff gets invisible in the presidential year,
but there's so many interesting tensions, the Stigramin's conflicts happening
in school boards, sheriff phrases, mayor races, and there's just
more room to see them, including on some of the
very stuff that you you care about the federal level
for you know.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
So let's start with the governor's race in New Jersey
because it's an interesting race for a couple reasons. Mikey
Cheryl's information was stolen by the admin. They published it
in the hopes of scaring her. The other guy is,
(30:28):
I don't know what you say about that.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
I just talk us through this race and what it
looks like.
Speaker 6 (30:32):
Well, there's so much to say about it. You know.
Speaker 7 (30:34):
First of all, New New Jersey, the state that has
voted pretty consistently blue at federal elections, has a history
of going Republican at the state level, and Republicans certainly
perform better in every state election, even if they lose.
In a way, it's not surprising that we're talking about
as competitive. One thing that's interesting is that the Republican
nominee has really embraced Trump, and he hadn't when he
(30:56):
first ran for governor. So that's a big deal in
terms of what Trump people be able to if he
does win. Immigration is really a huge issue there. Actually
that is being i think a little underplayed because that's
really something that the Republicans have pushed their promise to
end immediately the protections that the state has at the
state level for immigration enforcement. The lieutenant governor candidate is
(31:18):
a sheriff who has sort of a hardline or record
on immigration. It's not necessarily what they're running on in
terms of like ad or like the awkwardly campaign by
in terms of the kind of thing that's going to
have an immediate impact on Jersey. That that's the kind
of thing that's not getting as much play as it could.
And you know, in terms of where this is going,
the polls still showed Democrats of an advantage, not unlike Virginia,
but there's a lot more sweating it on Democrats. Democrats
(31:43):
have always sweat New Jersey elections because it's always them
sort of tidy even if it's not. But it's still
a question of who turns out in an off your
election Democrats have had the advantage, and.
Speaker 6 (31:55):
Cheryl are still ahead in the pull. So that's where
we are right now.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
She's just a little ahead or a lot.
Speaker 6 (32:00):
Ahead, in between four and ten points.
Speaker 7 (32:03):
Oky to people to decide if pat Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
She did really well in the last debate.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
Can we get Jesse in here to talk about her
debate performance because he is a new Jersey height.
Speaker 3 (32:15):
Drastically improved with much more fearce, just as we've seen
Hakeim and Schumer do in recent weeks. It seems there's
a very big tide turn in democratic politics, especially for.
Speaker 4 (32:26):
The more normy. Dems are getting way more aggressive.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
Yes, excellent, normy Dems getting way more aggressive. It's all
about the vibes.
Speaker 7 (32:36):
Virginia, Well, it's also an example of what what you
what you just said win some sears.
Speaker 1 (32:44):
She seems like a dream candidate. I hope she just
runs and runs and runs and runs.
Speaker 6 (32:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 7 (32:50):
I mean the Republicans they seem to be going back
and forth between thinking they can win Virginia and not.
Speaker 6 (32:55):
And the debate.
Speaker 7 (32:56):
There was also a debate there where Republicans said that
hiring gay people was not a form of discrimination. So
that's the sort of headline, we're getting out of the
governor's rate there. Obviously, it's all happening under the shadow
of the shutdown of DOSEE in the fall. In the
spring in a state where federal workers obviously are very effected,
they would in high numbers. So that's sort of the
(33:18):
context in Virginia, you know, as a quick reminder of
for people, the Democrats winning the governor's race in Virginia
would give them control perhaps of the whole state government,
which they actually haven't had very much in the course
of the last forty fifty years. They've only had it
a couple of years. So there's a lot to do
there for Democrats if they gain control.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
And also more importantly win some Seers is incredible and insane,
and the stuff she says is amazing and cinematic, and
she is like a candidate out of a satire.
Speaker 6 (33:46):
Per running mate Josh S.
Speaker 7 (33:48):
Reid, He's fa facing a Democrat who's a Muslim candidate,
and the taxi is starting to wait. In the past
few days have started to be pretty openly islamophophobicons cases,
So that's also the race to watch.
Speaker 1 (34:02):
Yeah, I'm shocked to hear the Republicans are being openly islamophobic. Shocked,
I tell you shocked. That is not completely the vibe
that they do. So let's talk through Pennsylvania Supreme Court
racist because these are a big one and we just
don't see a lot of information about those.
Speaker 7 (34:20):
Like for the sake of federal politics, national politics, that
might be the most important because we're talking about the
swing state of Pennsylvania. We're talking about the state Supreme
Court that has had a lot to do on election
line in the past few years and we'll probably have
it again in the future. And the basic situation is
a little it's a little complicated, but the basic situation
is Democrats have a five to two majority on this court,
(34:44):
very hard earned for them.
Speaker 6 (34:45):
It was very they want to have to.
Speaker 7 (34:47):
Win a lot of expensive elections a while back in
twenty fifteen and now three Democrats are on the ballot
in what's called a retention election, so voters basically say
yes or no, do we want to retain them, we
find a new opponent. Usually these really do not catch
much fire, much heat. Usually they really use what's called
retention election. But this yeo, Republicans are spending a lot
(35:09):
of money. They're trying to mount a campaign to get
voters to out these three Democrats, which would effectively cut
the five two majority into a too too tigh Then
it gets complicated, but basically what the stake is whether
Democrats keep the majority on the on the court after
November and uh and so you know, for obvious reasons,
that's the major one to watch this fall.
Speaker 2 (35:31):
What else do sheriffs?
Speaker 6 (35:33):
First?
Speaker 2 (35:34):
Where are they up? What do these elections look like,
and what is the tension?
Speaker 7 (35:39):
Sheriff elections are maybe sort of under radar. People might
not entirely know why to care about them. You know,
there's a few reasons they really You run things like
jail conditions, which across the US are radio crisis or
human rights crisis.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
Human rights how quaint?
Speaker 7 (35:55):
Yes, go on, Yeah, there's a catastrophe is happening where
people just are a lot locked in and die within
a day all over the country.
Speaker 2 (36:02):
Yeah, including in New York.
Speaker 7 (36:04):
Including in New York, including in a lot of blue places,
and obviously around the country.
Speaker 6 (36:10):
But the issue that I think people might gravitate.
Speaker 7 (36:13):
Mo most around right now and might make sheriffs a
little more interesting national politics is immigration. Because sheriffs are
really I mean, have been in the past, but are
really right now also stepping up as relays of ICE
as crucial connections of Trump's machine to rest immigrants detain immigrants.
That can mean literally going out in the community and
(36:35):
arresting people. It can also mean giving space to ICE
in the local jails because ICE needs space.
Speaker 6 (36:40):
That's really pretty much what ICE needs.
Speaker 7 (36:42):
And so over Trump one point zero in the twenty tens,
sheriff races really got a lot more attention and a
lot of candidates who said no, we're not gonna collaborate
with ICE were winning elections, especially in a lot of
blue areas that were like this, This stuff isn't usually
being paid attention to. So a lot of blue areas
had sheriffs that were very and that was sort of changing.
(37:02):
So this year there's a few places like that. For instance,
I'll just name one in Bucks County in Pennsylvania, which
is outside Philly. It's actually quite a large suburb. There's
a Republican sheriff who just signed the contract with ICE.
Democrats are against the contract. I mean, that's pretty much
the stake where the sheriffs have do authority to do that.
But Mally, I just want to say what the bigger
(37:23):
story on sheriff this year is that Democrats are not
running in places where they could win.
Speaker 6 (37:28):
They're not running anyone.
Speaker 7 (37:29):
So in Virginia both reported on a bunch of places
where there's just no Democrat running.
Speaker 6 (37:35):
In a swing area.
Speaker 7 (37:36):
So I think that that is also a story where
if you care about these issues, the first step is
whether someone is going to run for the office that
is going to decide them.
Speaker 2 (37:44):
Why not?
Speaker 6 (37:45):
Well, two, I mean two reasons.
Speaker 7 (37:46):
One, sheriff are usually more conservative profession and you usually
people who with law enforcement background runs, so that's not
always necessary. In Virginia, for instance, it is not you
don't have to have alaw enforcement background round for sheriff. Well,
I mean the second is a boring answer, but people
don't pay attention in that place in Virginia, I was
saying when we started to ask questions where we're an
(38:08):
article on Chesapeake, Virginia.
Speaker 6 (38:10):
Which is pretty much a fifty to fifty place at.
Speaker 7 (38:12):
The federal elections, the county party was not there, weren't answers,
It was not on the radar of oh, this sheriff
just ran, just signed an ice contract.
Speaker 6 (38:22):
Is that relevant to whether we should run In fact,
the sheriff the.
Speaker 7 (38:25):
Mecratic Party, I believe, told my colleague wrote the story,
Alex Bernez, that he wasn't aware of the contract. So
that just gives you an idea what's going on and
why we need to pay attention to what's going on
at Scharf's department other offices.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
So let's talk about school boards. It's a little bit
less hot, right because there was so much like COVID
stuff where it was like, they have to go back
to school, we have to you know, stop the teachers' union,
we have to ban books. I mean, I guess Moms
for Liberty is still out.
Speaker 6 (38:51):
There, right, Mum's Little brit is still out there.
Speaker 7 (38:53):
And I think what's relevant this year is that some
school boards that were won by Mom's oliber Day or
Conservative in twenty twenty one at the height of the
COVID attention and the school board I mean also Republicans
were really trying to push this education narrative in twenty
twenty one, in the early year, the first year of Biden.
Some of these school boards are now up for election
or the conservative majorities are up progress.
Speaker 1 (39:14):
Who are you know, are people not happy with their
conservative majorities.
Speaker 7 (39:18):
That's a great question. What we've seen this year actually
is an election that have happened already. Conservatives have tofered
big losses, including in Texas in the spring where Conservatives
lost a lot of seats and school boards that were
up and throughout a lot of school boards in North Texas.
And there's more tests now we're looking at places in Pennsylvania,
Texas again, Colorado. And you know these are school boards
(39:40):
that have done I mean, you know people have seen
the headlines, bands of books, policies around trans students and
you know, supposedly banning DII or critical race theory teachings
and in school So those are the really that the
policies that they put forward.
Speaker 6 (39:55):
And now some some of these majorities are on the
line again.
Speaker 2 (39:58):
Yeah, and that makes sense.
Speaker 1 (39:59):
Are there a lot of Democrats running for these school
board seats? Like what does it look like?
Speaker 6 (40:05):
Well, no, it's really it's really interesting to see that.
Speaker 7 (40:07):
I think one of the stories in twenty twenty one
was that Consertos just sprang up, formed slates, ran together,
really turned out their supporters and won a lot of
places that maybe they wouldn't have won if they had
been opposition or that had been organized opposition. That's really
changed in the past couple of years twenty three to three,
twenty twenty five, where it's been super interesting because these
(40:29):
are not necessary places that spaces where there's like organized
politics on the left or on the center, whatever. The
really depends on the place. As to what we're talking
about right right now, there are slates of candidates where
really running against the conservative agenda for school board parents Democrats. However,
they described themselves in different places which didn't exist a
few years ago.
Speaker 2 (40:50):
I think, yes, okay, that's where I was going.
Speaker 6 (40:52):
Yeah, yeah, I don't think it.
Speaker 1 (40:53):
Did.
Speaker 7 (40:53):
I think this idea like there is a conservative agenda
out there and defeated at the school board level. We
need to form a slate, we need to like run together,
we need to have support, etcetera. That I think is
something that we've seen twenty twenty five, twenty twenty four,
but really were not seeing in twenty twenty one.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
Talk to me about the other sort of anonymous dogcatchers
and garbage collector rather soon I know. Well, that's why
I'm asking you. Are you seeing democratic energy?
Speaker 2 (41:20):
Are you not?
Speaker 6 (41:21):
I talk a.
Speaker 1 (41:22):
Lot to Amanda Littman from run for Something, and she
says her numbers are insane. So like, if those numbers
are insane, you should be seeing them certainly in some
of those.
Speaker 7 (41:34):
I talked about the inverse on sheriffs. I mean, sheriffs
are their own little category. Like I was saying, Virginia,
you mass in headlines that in Virginia. Also, Democrats are
very proud that for the first time in a while,
they're running a candid in every state house district this year,
you know. So we were seeing in terms of like
state House and those offices that are more more straightforwardly partisan,
(41:54):
we're seeing a lot of energy a thing on the
Democratic side. We're also seeing that on oral elections or
city council elections.
Speaker 6 (42:01):
I think.
Speaker 7 (42:02):
So that often is in places where Democrat Republican is
not necessarily the dynamic. But I mean, just a few
days ago, Democrats flipped actually the mayor's office in Fairbanks
in Alaska. Yes, so that's an example.
Speaker 1 (42:16):
I mean, Alaska, I think is super important for any
number of reasons. But I want you to explain what
happened there in Alaska.
Speaker 7 (42:22):
Right, right, So Alaska is one of the states that
hold its elections in October when they can rather remember
one does why not hold election anytime and not but
they hold elections in October, and they had elections for
actually lots of elections, but the one I was watching
was the mayor's race in Fairbanks, which is actually the
second biggest city in Alaska, and there was a conservative
(42:44):
Republican an office there was running for a second term.
But one of the things to know about him is
a few months ago he had he drew a condemnation
for comments that made about natives in Alaska, associating them
with crime, and sort of apologized so that that that
that's the sort of personality we're talking about. And he
(43:05):
lost by roughly ten points to a Democrat in Fairbanks.
I was really paying attention to that, but I saw
in the Alaska media over the past few days that
progressive can Is actually apparently won all sorts of offices
in the region of Fairbanks, including for school board. There's
another example of appairly in near sweep by progressives up
and down the ballot in Fairbanks. And we I mean,
(43:25):
you know, in there's a lot of elections all around
the country in a month, and mean is problem that
wherever anyone is sitting, there is some there's something close,
whether it's for mayor, city council, prosecutor election, judge.
Speaker 4 (43:39):
What.
Speaker 6 (43:39):
There's so much and you know, we're.
Speaker 7 (43:41):
Seeing a lot of energy in places like Seattle, Minneapolis,
there's there's pretty much the entirety of the city government
is on the line. So there's a lot of important
elections happening.
Speaker 2 (43:54):
I think that's so interesting about Alaska being because you know,
they say, so goes Fairbanks, so goes the nation, and.
Speaker 7 (44:05):
Alaska could be at the center of things in twenty
twenty six because there's a Senate race and the governor's race.
But I think some national Democrats are hoping to recruit
Mary Peltola. I think they're hoping to recruit her to
run for Senate. She might run for governor. I mean,
but it's also been the kind of state where Democrats
hope that they can make in roads and we'll see
(44:26):
how they got and not to.
Speaker 1 (44:28):
Yeah, a lot of money been spent in Alaska. Actually
not a lot of money, but a lot of dreams comparatively, Yeah, yeah,
I mean, is there anything else that's coming up that
we just should know about?
Speaker 7 (44:41):
Well, the big elections we haven't talked about to come
to mind. At the state level, really yea, please real home.
The big ones, I mean, the obvious one is Prop
fifty in California, which is the ballot measure that Gavin
Newson push that would respond to Texas and Jerry Mander California.
Speaker 2 (44:58):
The polling on that looks good.
Speaker 7 (45:00):
The polling on that has the Yes leading by about
ten to twenty, maybe more closer to twenty. It was
I think a gamble by a newsim because it was
very young, There wasn't really a precedent for a measure
like this, very unclear what was going to happen, still
so unclear of what we'll see in the month. And
then the other one I want to highlight is one
that really isn't getting a lot of attention is Georgia
(45:20):
has a couple of statewide offices on the ballot for
What's it's energy Commission, It's it's the commission that decides
it's at the state level, a commission that decides electricity prices,
commission that decides renewable energy? Do you use of fossil
fuels in the state. And Democrats haven't won a statewide
office other than federal races. We all know jo Biden one,
(45:41):
we all know that Raphael Warnack and ass Off one.
But at the state level, Democrats have not managed to
make inroads and did they have two opportunities this fall
to defeat Republican incumbents and get on the spoort, which
I think is important in and of itself for the
politics of the board, but also as the kind of
a test to where or where the state's at. It's
very unusual to have Georgia have elections and an off
feel like this.
Speaker 6 (46:01):
Who knows what's going to turn out two votes? Those
are twoe that I think are very interesting to watch.
Speaker 2 (46:05):
Thank you, Taniel.
Speaker 6 (46:07):
I hope you'll come back, of course, whenever no more infectly.
Speaker 2 (46:14):
Jesse Cannon Somali A.
Speaker 3 (46:16):
Federal judges imposed new limits on ice operations in Illinois
since they haven't even been respecting that people are journalists
and they've been basically acting with total lawlessness.
Speaker 4 (46:27):
The footage is just astounding.
Speaker 1 (46:29):
So it is fifty two page ruling Federal District Court.
Jeffrey Cummings says the legal basis for ice tools for
maggy rest blank comhorans that are filled out by officers
in the field. That's not how any it is supposed
to work. By the way, I just want to point out,
like ICE is meant to be immigration customs enforcement, it
(46:50):
was after nine to eleven we did not have This
was like a sort of ad hoc thing put together,
and now it's just become Trump's paramilitary We are operating
so outside of how any of this is supposed to work.
I don't want to say it's wild, it's just illegal,
(47:10):
Like none of this is legal. All of this is
like weird emergency powers from nine to eleven. Real example
of why you need to, like, once an emergency is over,
make sure that all these emergency powers are revoked. This
is like a really great example of how not to
do any of this. We got here by I mean,
(47:33):
there's a really great episode of this show that I
love called five to four, which is this really smart
legal podcast we've had them on here. They talk about
how it's just the way that authoritarians are able to
rise in a country with laws like this is when
(47:54):
they are able to sort of seize on these emergency powers.
Which is why I mean, I know our Supreme Court
is completely in the tank for Trump, but if they
ever did push back on this.
Speaker 2 (48:03):
It would be good.
Speaker 1 (48:05):
That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in
every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday, and Saturday to hear the best
minds and politics make sense of all this chaos. If
you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a friend
and keep the conversation going.
Speaker 2 (48:25):
Thanks for listening.
Host
Molly Jong-Fast
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