November 19, 2024 • 44 mins
MSNBC’s The Weekend host Symone Sanders stops by to discuss the blind spots emerging in VP Harris's strategy. Run For Something’s Amanda Litman talks about how to build a strong Democratic Party.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,
where we discussed the top political headlines with some of
today's best minds, and Hikeim Jeffries will lead the Democrats
in Congress once again.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
We have such a great show for you today.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
MSNBC's The Weekend host Simone Sanders stops by to talk
to me about what the Democrats can do differently and
what they're doing right and what they're doing wrong.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
It's a fun conversation.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Then we will talk to Run for Something's Amanda Lippman
about all of these small victories that you may not
have heard of.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
But first the news.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
So Molly, every once in a while we get a
new word in the lexicon that you just go that
one's going to stick around for a while. And yesterday
I learned the term brologarchy. What are you seeing here
with the brolagarchy.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Brologarchy is a word for oligarchy. But because all of
these people, unsurprising are divorced.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Men, it's the bloarchy.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Some of them are not divorced yet, perhaps they won't be,
but perhaps they will be.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
It's a really good article in the Guardian about how
to survive the Brologarchy Twenty Lessons for the Post truth World.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
We should say it's by Carol Cadwell Oder.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
The point is it's a really smart piece and it's
quite funny, and.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
It also she was sued. You'll remembered she has been.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
Victimized by some of these big conglomerates and she's really
smart and you should definitely read this piece in the Guardian.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Mike, I know many times we're talking to people that
are thinking about where they might move because they're afraid
of mister Trump's fascist tendencies. There's an Italian village try
to entice people. What do you see it here?
Speaker 1 (01:46):
First of all, no one should move. Everything is going
to be fine. This will be a very annoying four years,
but we'll get through it. That's what I need to
say first. Also, we find this adorable, which is why
we put it in here. Many communities around the world
have been and wondering what to make.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
Of Donald Trump's reelection.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
A village on the Italian island of Sardinia, where my
mother and her third husband went for their honeymoon, is
looking at this as a potential opportunity. They have said
that they will you can move into these dilapidated houses.
You can buy them for just over one euro, and
then you can renovate them.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
It's launched a.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Website for would be expats more cheap homes. And look,
this is because as much as the Trumpers want you
to think, I did not just clip the website and
I'm not just browsing houses now. I just want to
point out, but as much as the Trumpers would like
you to think that there are too many people in
this world, there actually a lot of these countries are
(02:45):
really having trouble finding people to live in them, despite
how lovely they are. And so I just want you
to feel a little better and to know that if
worst comes to worse, we can always live in dilapidated
homes in Italy for one dollar.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Well, I'm going to keep that in my back pocket.
I guess me too. Let's talk some brighter news here.
We previously had a judge John from North Carolina, Justice
Alison Riggs, and a very interesting thing happened. This is
a crucial race that will determine who controls the Supreme
Court North Carolina, and she is pulled ahead by twenty
(03:20):
four votes as of Sunday night. As they try to
keep the Supreme Court majority there. So this is heading
for a recount and she's going to need the fundraise
on this. What are you seeing?
Speaker 1 (03:29):
So I think the lesson here is don't ever say
that your vote doesn't matter, right, Don't ever say that,
because in fact, your vote absolutely does matter. And this
is a great example of that. The North Carolina Supreme
Court could come down to twenty four votes right now,
she is leading Justice Riggs by twenty four votes. It's
(03:51):
so close that it's going to recount. But it's really
important to realize, Like as much as all of this
feels very frustrating and feels very crazy, every vote matters.
Every single vote matters, every door knock, every you know,
all the stuff that people do to get out the vote,
it all matters. And you know, if Justice Riggs wins,
(04:14):
they won't be able to, you know, enact partisan jerrymandering
in the state. I actually don't know what's happening in
North Carolina right now at the state level.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
Well, they turn very blue, right.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Keeping this seat will keep the balance of power and
prevent the Republicans, the Purple State Republicans, from enacting crazy, destructive,
discriminatory legislation. And that is why every single vote matters,
not even just in North Carolina.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
Somalie, I'm going to shock you here two of my
least favorite congress people, Representive Nancy Mason, Representative MPG, are
targeting Presentative Sarah McBride, one of the newest members of Congress,
who is our first openly transgender person in Congress. What
do you see?
Speaker 1 (04:56):
So this is a really good example of why small
dollar donations are poisoning the Republican Party.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
Marjorie Taylor Green, who's.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
Become a sort of icon of MAGA really destructive mega policy.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
I think this was started by Nancy Mace.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Nancy Mayce has really is like constantly auditioning to be
a mini MTG, so she wanted to make a law
saying that this new congresswoman couldn't use the ladies bathroom.
By the way, first of all, this is ridiculous theater, right,
this is what this is theater. This is MAGA trying
to raise money, trying to get their base excited, and
(05:34):
targeting a transperson. So I'm not that surprised. It's really disturbing.
It's also just like so stupid, like this is not
what the federal government is for and.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Voters hate this. That's the other thing is normal voters
hate this.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
They don't want to punish a member of Congress for
what bathroom she uses. So anyway, but you know, Nancy
Mace is hoping to get attention from the MAGA world,
to get on show, to get on Fox News, to
get Trump to pay attention to her, and that's what
this is. Simone Sanders is the host of MSNBC's The Weekend.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
Welcome to Fast Politics.
Speaker 4 (06:21):
Simone, happy to be here.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
I wanted you on.
Speaker 1 (06:25):
The podcast right away because when the post twenty twenty
four circular firing squad started, you were one of the
few people who seemed to me to be trying to
figure out actually what happened, as opposed to just blaming people.
Speaker 5 (06:43):
Yeah. Well, first of all, I appreciate you molling. I'm
a fan, longtime listener, not a first time callergy. Not yes,
exactly going, but yeah, look I think that, and I mean,
you know, to be there, I had a little The
blame I did have was for people to continue to
go out there and talk about, you know, what they
feel like would have happened, if you know, other things
would have happened, like for me specifically, that was Speaker
(07:05):
murder Pelosi, but like in general, I think that and
perhaps it's the former you know, strategist in me, but
when campaigns happen and you lose, particularly in the way
that Democrats across the board lost in twenty twenty, and
let's just be very clear, it was still close, right,
but you know, you can't say for months it's the
consequential election and then not win the consequential election and
(07:28):
then not you know, do some introspection. So I feel
like that that's really important because there's an election next
year in Virginia for governor's race, and then there are
midterm elections and then there'll be another presidential So you
can't just move forward and say uh no, no one
needs to talk about it, just got to go forward and.
Speaker 4 (07:46):
Get the things done.
Speaker 5 (07:47):
No, you actually have to say, okay, well what happened here,
and let's ask the voters.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
Yes, I think that's totally right.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
I think your point that you can't say it's the
most consequential election of our lifetime and then be like mah, right.
But there were also Democrats overperformed in some places, right,
or they had this not overperformed because they the winds,
the anti partisan winds were strong, but anti incumbent wins
were very strong. But there were certain places where Democrats
(08:15):
were able to keep a Senate seat and lose the
presidential which split ticket voting is something that in highly
partisan times we don't usually have.
Speaker 5 (08:24):
Yeah, but I mean, like to that point, for months
we had heard, oh, people do not split their tickets.
And it's like, why were people saying that? Did they
ask any any of the voters? And I mean, given
what had happened in the midterm election and also in between,
I'm thinking about the ballot measures in Kansas, the ballot
(08:44):
measures in Ohio.
Speaker 4 (08:46):
Right, there are not enough I'm from Nebraska, baby, ain't.
Speaker 5 (08:49):
Enough enough Democrats in Kansas to have codified the reproductive
freedom measures, right, So that meant Republicans voted for it.
In Ohio, again, not enough Democrats in the state. Maybe
to get it done, people who identify as independent or
Republicans had to have voted for it. And so we
had indications frankly earlier on that people were willing to
(09:10):
split their tickets to vote for this.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
Thing over here and then vote for a.
Speaker 5 (09:14):
Candidate that perhaps not even perhaps that in many respects
in some of the Republican candidates, not all of them,
but Republican candidates whom, by way of their votes or
the policies that they instituted, whether they be a governor,
an attorney general right or a state legislative member or
member of Congress, by something that they did as a
(09:36):
function of their job, created the situation to where the
voters had to go and make their voices heard at
the ballot box in terms of the ballot measure. But
I think one of the lessons that we know right
now coming out of this twenty twenty four election is
that the voters have not always connected the people to
the ballot measures. In some places they did, but in
some places they didn't. They're very clear about these ballot
(09:58):
measures and what they believe their rights and whatnot should be,
but they are not as clear about making a connection
between the people on.
Speaker 4 (10:07):
The ballot i e.
Speaker 5 (10:08):
The elected officials and that ballot measure. So that to me,
it says, Okay, there's work to do there. But I mean,
like that's something that you weren't going to hear in
the nuance. In the aftermath, some people were just like ah,
too woke and I'm like, please, where what are we doing?
Speaker 1 (10:22):
Yeah, And it did feel like a lot of people
were just using this election to confirm their priors.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Yes, yes I do.
Speaker 5 (10:29):
And the well when when we say people, when I
say yes I do, I feel like some of the
pundent people and some of the strategists, Yeah, they're using
the election results in the aftermaths without asking any questions
to say, see, I told you these you know, progressive
WoT issues weren't going to get it done. And it's
frustrating to me as someone who again spent a long
(10:50):
time as strategists, but you know, for the last couple
of years, has been reporting on this from the seat
of the anchor chair and going out there talking to voters.
That's not what Democratic candidates and Democratic aligned candidates ran
on and talked about. They didn't talk about quote unquote
culture war issues. The Republican candidates ran on the culture
(11:12):
war issues.
Speaker 4 (11:13):
And so to diagnose the.
Speaker 5 (11:15):
Issue as ah, these Democrats believed in this stuff over
here it's not popular is like woefully missing the mark,
and I think it's lazy.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
Well, the thing that I was struck by, which I
think is pretty interesting, it's like we have these candidates
like here we are doing a post op with policy
like going, well, you know this policy was a loser,
of that policy was a winner.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
But Trump didn't run on policy.
Speaker 4 (11:42):
Thank you, Molly, Molly. Where is the policy?
Speaker 5 (11:44):
I was at a dinner yesterday as we had this
conversation and someone with whom I respect very much was
saying to me, you know, the media didn't talk enough
about I blame the media. And I was like, do
you really and they're like, yes, I blame the media.
I said, Okay, tell me why. They said, the media
and talk enough about Trump's policy. They just talked about
the fear and that's why people were crying the day
(12:06):
after election day who were not happy about the result.
And I said, okay, let me just back up and
say that for people who are scared, I understand their fear,
and maybe the tears were just about like, damn it,
I'm not trying to join the resistance again, and I'm
not trying to go back to you know, legislation by
you know, tweet or whatever we're calling them now.
Speaker 4 (12:26):
So maybe that's some of that I said, But also,
what was the policy? I said, what was the policy?
Is the policy?
Speaker 5 (12:31):
Tariffs, because I know a lot of media folks and
the media apparatus had talked about the tariffs.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
I was like, I don't even think he understands tariffs.
Speaker 5 (12:39):
Yeah, I said, so, you know, to say that the
people didn't talk about the policy, the reality is there
wasn't a policy, and we talked about that.
Speaker 4 (12:49):
But I do think it's important to know.
Speaker 5 (12:51):
One of the things again is we talk about, like, well,
what happened, and then what does this mean for the
party that's now out of power, the Democratic Party apparatus.
I think that one of the things is an acknowledgment
that the conversations are taking places in many different spaces nowadays.
I continue to maintain that television is important because when
something happens in the world, you do not go to
(13:13):
your favorite podcast to figure out what the freak just happened.
You turn on the TV. So, but it is not
the only place. And I think that because it's not
the only place. In the fractured media environment that we
live in, people's understanding of what is and is not
happening is very or or what the facts are frankly,
are not the same across the board. The baselines are
(13:35):
very different. And so depending on how someone consumes the
news or if they like to consume the news at all,
and maybe their news consumption is literally on Instagram, which
is for a lot of people.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
Yeah, it is, which is retally scary.
Speaker 5 (13:50):
I don't believe that everybody that voted for Donald Trump
right that they voted for all of these things.
Speaker 4 (13:55):
I don't think that everyone was actually aware.
Speaker 5 (13:57):
I think there are different levels of voters and different
levels of understanding that people didn't didn't have that that
doesn't resolve them from what it is.
Speaker 4 (14:04):
About to go down.
Speaker 5 (14:05):
I think that that acknowledgement is really important, and also
the acknowledgment that there are also millions of people that
stayed home, and then why did they stay home? I
think that those people deserve the treatment and the diners
that folks that voted for Donald Trump got in twenty sixteen.
Speaker 4 (14:19):
I want people to go to the black barbershops and at.
Speaker 5 (14:21):
Rural places in North Carolina and in some of the
more rural areas of Atlanta and asked some of these
working class black and brown people why they did not vote.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
Yeah, why do you think they didn't vote?
Speaker 5 (14:35):
I've asked some people, and I've gotten a range of answers.
Some fosts have said that they and this is what
I had heard prior to the election, and it's consistent
with what I've heard after, that they didn't think that
they're vote mattered, right Jesus, that they didn't think that
they're vote mattered. Some people said that it's not going
to make a difference where they live. Other people said
that they were just sped up, they were tired, and
(14:56):
some other people said, well, you know, nobody came and
talked to me. And then there were some people that
did participate in the election, and I know some people
that left the top of the ticket blank. I've also
talked to some voters that did check that box for
Donald Trump. So there's a range of things. But with
people are saying that they don't believe that their vote matters,
that they don't think it's going to make a difference,
(15:17):
that nobody came and spoke to them.
Speaker 4 (15:19):
To me, that says that.
Speaker 5 (15:21):
There is work to do there, that those are gettable
voters to me, and the Democrats need to figure out
what they can do to go back and talk to
those people who previously had come out for them and
pass elections and then decided not to participate this time,
like people really feeling like they don't have they don't
have the power.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
It's something that was very prevalent in this election.
Speaker 5 (15:44):
But I would just know when I said this after
the vice presidential debate, I was quite I think critical harsh,
some would say in my analysis of the debate between
Senator now vice president like jd Vance and Governor Wallas
And you know, I'm just kind of like, because y'all
the are y'all talking to actual people, because actual people
who want are not convinced that they're going to participate
(16:06):
in this election. I said that, I said, actual like
base Democratic votes need to be persuaded too. And the
idea that like people were just going to come out
and vote because they understood the threat of Trump right
or reproductive rights or just because there was a black
woman at the top of the ticket was woefully like,
I just think not smart, And I want to know
why some of the strategies and people made those decisions
(16:27):
and thought that people would just come out and vote,
Like when did when do people think that people of
color only need to be persuaded with white people at
the top of the Democratic ticket, Because if that's the
case I got a bridge, I want to sell you
off the coast of Florida, right where hurricanes happened.
Speaker 4 (16:39):
Right then, Yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Want to talk about this because I was also this decision.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
We're going to have competing dinner party stories.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
I would at a dinner party with a lot of
political people, very smart and days were talking about how
Democrats lost, and I said, well, you know, it does
seem like when you look at these numbers, that the
base didn't turn out. And everyone was like, and I said,
you know, maybe perhaps, and I offered a few possible
explanations for why. You know, the two million people who
(17:09):
could have had her win the popular you know, the
twenty twenty turnout would have won this election. Right, So
Biden's twenty twenty turnout would have won this election. And
Biden's twenty twenty turnout includes some parts of the Democratic
base who clearly did not come out. And I said, well,
you know, instead of trying to convert voters, which is
clearly kind of a losing game, because she went around
(17:31):
with Liz Cheney, who was very brave, but at the
end of the day, the Democratic base is not for
Liz Cheney. Right, That's the neocons, and that's a pretty
small group. And I said, you know, perhaps maybe taking
care of the base and some of their concerns when
it comes to any number of things that may not
have been.
Speaker 2 (17:48):
Addressed, would be useful. And everyone just looked at me baffled.
Speaker 5 (17:53):
Really same alling, that's because you talk to actual people.
And so because you talk to actual people, you are
sometimes what you say seems foreign to people that are
only talking to people that go on TV and folks
that you know, haven't been to the Costco and lord
knows how long and Instagart and Amazon Fresh all their groceries.
Speaker 4 (18:12):
The reality is you are correct. Now, let me just
say this.
Speaker 5 (18:15):
When the vice president was doing the tour with former
congress Woman Cheney, someone that I used to work with
called me and they were like, are you watching this
right now? And I said, oh, let me time to
TV on. So I've turned the TV and I'm like, yes, yes, yes,
and they're like, what do you think. I said, well,
I actually don't have a problem with this. Frankly, I
think it's right. I think it's a good bit. I
think it's good lair. I think that people would love
if the Vice president also did this for base voters.
(18:39):
Like what people saw and you know, as someone again
who who'll spent a lot of time in my former
life within the Democratic Party apparatus working campaigns, you cannot
go into communities and broadcast on television like what people
saw and gleaned from all of this is that, Oh,
look at the vice president and the campaign and Democrats,
(19:00):
because really what it is they say Democrats and they
just Democrats just to catch off for all of them.
Look at them taking questions and talking to Republican white
people that I mean.
Speaker 2 (19:10):
That's because that's what it looks like.
Speaker 5 (19:13):
She took She went around the country Molly and took
question She did a very few town halls, and when
she did do them that the campaign orchestrated themselves. It
was she was sitting there with the Liz Cheney and
then took questions from white voters and battleground states and
never did that for based Democratic voters. The campaign went
into Philadelphia, did a did a barbershop talk and then
(19:34):
didn't bring the press, Like what is going on? They
recorded it for themselves, edited it and put it out
where nobody watched it.
Speaker 2 (19:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
What another thing that I want to talk to you
about with this election. Was one of the things that
I noticed is that this White House, the Biden White House,
did this thing where they became intentionally boring in order
to avoid coverage. It made sense in the beginning, right,
but then at some point they like, why.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Is no one covering us?
Speaker 1 (20:02):
And it was too late, and so all of a
sudden they were like, no, no, we did all this
good stuff and none of you covered it. And I
think that at the end of the day, like all
Donald Trump does is PR right, he is out there
doing pr PR, PR PR. Is he lying, for sure,
but PR PR PR. And then we had the Harris
(20:22):
campaign and they were as tight as the Biden White House,
and they did so few interviews and they did so
little of this and so little of that. And Trump
was out there and again he didn't need to be
on cable news, right, he could just be on podcasts,
but he was out there for hours and hours and
hours on every fucking thing, and really, really, really, I
think helped him, and it.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
Was too late for her in some ways.
Speaker 5 (20:46):
Well, I guess two things. One, and you know, folk
out there may have forgotten. I used to work at
the Biden White House, right, I was there for the
first year.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Sorry, I don't mean to criticize you, but.
Speaker 5 (20:55):
Some of the criticism is absolutely warranted because the president
did not prioritize the importance of Again, as we just
talked about, like people, when something happens in the world,
people still turn on the television, Like the TV is
still important. It's not the only place, but it is
still a place that is very, very, very important. I
think the president's team did not prioritize the importance of
putting him on television and putting him out there right like.
(21:17):
He did not do a lot of interviews, not with
traditional media and not with the non traditional media apparatus.
I think that that is a function of it. But
I do think that the media apparatus they did cover
what the administration was doing. I think the real problem
is is how the administration talked about it from the beginning,
all the way once they achieved things, all the way
(21:38):
through like the election, and the reality is is that
again and this is why I talk about people that
don't go to Costco haven't been to the Costco in
a minute of its card at groceries. From the very
beginning when I was at the White House, they were
talking about transitory inflation. I remember coming out of a
meeting and you know, when I worked at the White House,
I was I would, you know, my team would write
the talking points for the Vice President and when we
(21:59):
go and brief heart. I remember going into a briefing
and meeting and noting that, you know, giving the Vice
president what the administration language is, and then that our
suggestion is is that we don't use the term transitory inflation.
From our perspective, for you, ma'am, we don't think you
need to even talk about transitory inflation because what is that?
Speaker 4 (22:15):
But also I personally think it's needed people. But also
it's not true. The inflation wasn't transitory.
Speaker 5 (22:20):
It was real, but they didn't know that because they
weren't going to the grocery store. So part of it
is is that the way that it was things were
being talked about were just flying in the face of
what people were experiencing.
Speaker 4 (22:33):
It is absolutely true.
Speaker 5 (22:35):
And if you look at you, I mean the president,
as we had this conversations at the G twenty and
when I talk to my former counterparts in other countries,
you know, the former the spokespeople, well, now some of
them are still the spokespeople, but the current spokespeople I'm
former in other countries and the diplomats and whatnot. People
particularly in Europe, wish to have America's recovery because it
(22:56):
did recover the fastest out of all the G twenty
countries COVID from inflation, Like America's not dealing with what.
Speaker 4 (23:02):
Some of the other countries are are are still reeling from.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Yeah, because we have immigrants.
Speaker 4 (23:07):
Well, come on, Molly, now it's something we didn't help
the situation. Yeah, in the Europe.
Speaker 5 (23:13):
So I say that to say that, like when the
President and others and people within the administration would say
the you know, wager growth is up and the you know,
the fastest, the best GDP record GDP growth and the
fastest recovery. All of that is true okay on paper,
but like, what does record GDP growth mean for someone
in north Omaha, Nebraska who's still working two jobs and
(23:34):
struggling to you know, pay a bills like when the
rent is too damn high and so On one hand,
I think that it was too there was too much
of a focus on the administration getting credit for the
real work that has been done right the Internet that
has been laid across the communities, the record, infrastructure projects,
all of that is great. Yes, yes, and when the record,
when the history books recorded, Joe Biden is going to
(23:56):
be one of the greatest American presidents because what is
mine stration has done is remarkable.
Speaker 4 (24:02):
However, the rent.
Speaker 5 (24:03):
Too damn high, the housing is unattainable, and grow the
bacon is nine dollars, So like, can we talk about
doing some about the nine dollar bacon? What about the housing?
Even though the administration was doing those was they were
working on those things. The appraisals, right, the discriminatory appraisal process,
they were working on all of that, but they were
not talking about it. So the Vice president's campaign pops
up and she's like, well, you know, we're gonna take
(24:24):
on price gouging. And I think that that's like that
that is more of an answer to what the American
people were dealing with right now. She talks about her
housing plan. However, maybe one of the one of the
things the takeaways is maybe how she talked about it
did not resonate as much and needed more of a
populus twist. And so instead of like price gouging, it's
like the companies are taking advantage of you. They raised
(24:46):
the prices during COVID. Okay, COVID's over and the price
is still up. It's like, yes, dam you right down,
they're greedy. But that's not how it was put forward.
But I would just say that you cannot This is
a long way be saying. In elections, you have to
make a decision. And as you said earlier, you were like,
you know, I don't know if these were turnable voters
in terms of these you know, the who are the
who was the list Chandey voters that was going to
(25:07):
vote for Colin Harris. You have to make a decision
in the campaigns, especially when a finite amount of time.
Speaker 4 (25:12):
Do you want to be right or do you want
to win? Do you want people to see your perspective.
Speaker 5 (25:16):
Do you want to win them over to that old
the economy is actually better than what you think it is.
Speaker 4 (25:20):
Or do you want to win?
Speaker 5 (25:21):
And if you want to win, you need to meet
the voter where they are, understand where the voter is,
and earn their vote. And I think for far too
long the calculus was if we just tell people they
just we just got to explain it more bid.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
Nomics, what the hell is that?
Speaker 3 (25:35):
I said.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
I was like, leave, what is bionomics? They can't explain it?
Reagan nomics rom Reagan didn't name his stuff. Okay, he
didn't do that. The press coin the term after the fact.
Speaker 5 (25:49):
So also, when people say, oh, they don't like the economy,
I don't believe that they don't like Joe Biden's policies,
because Joe Biden's economic policies are good.
Speaker 4 (25:56):
Write thirty five dollars cap on insulin.
Speaker 5 (25:58):
Job creation, like, we're making stuff in America now, literally
infrastructure we can manufacture in this back in America. However,
what people associated with Bidenomics is inflation and all this
other stuff that don't got none to do with Joe
Biden did because they wanted to put a fancy term
on the Democrats.
Speaker 4 (26:12):
Just stop putting termo things. Just say what the hell
it is that you're doing.
Speaker 1 (26:15):
Yeah, yep, yep, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you,
thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
I love you and I appreciate you. Thank you.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
Molly.
Speaker 4 (26:23):
I just I can't, I just really can't.
Speaker 5 (26:24):
So you know, I wish, you know, I wish a
Democratic Party apparrett as well, and they soul search it.
Speaker 4 (26:31):
But I guess I would.
Speaker 5 (26:32):
Just say in closing that what I am watching for
is just, you know, how Democrats respond to this moment,
the reality that they are now living in, or if
you're a Democrat on Capitol Hill where the President, the Presidency,
the Senate, and the House, all the Republicans have it all,
and they are emboldened, they feel emboldened like they can't
play politics as usual. The Democrats can't like, please give
(26:54):
people something. People don't want Democrats to be against against
against im that's going to get them elected. But they
do have to have some a strategy and plan and
then what are they going to do about the party
going forward? There's an election in twenty twenty five in Virginia,
midterm elections around the corner. Who are they gonna pick
for a DNC chair? How are Democrats really going to
take their stories to the next level?
Speaker 4 (27:14):
And are they going to.
Speaker 5 (27:14):
Tuck their tail between their legs and retreat and then
try to be you know, continue they keep talking about
the tent not big enough. It is a goddamn circus. Okay,
I don't know how much bigger than tent, but don't
probably right aside could get. But you know, we just
gonna have to wait and see my thank you.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
Thank you. You are the greatest. Thank you.
Speaker 4 (27:33):
I appreciate you.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
Amanda Liman is the co founder of Room for Something.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
Welcome back to Fast Politics, Amandalipman.
Speaker 4 (27:43):
Always happy to chat.
Speaker 3 (27:44):
Mollie.
Speaker 1 (27:45):
You are on maternity leave, but you are doing this
for me because you are awesome.
Speaker 4 (27:51):
We'll hope the baby keeps sleeping all the chat.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Yes, and that is the most important thing, is that
you are awesome and that you are one of the
people who keeps me from despairing. So the reason why
I reached out to you was because I was reading
Rebecca Traster's excellent piece about what resistance two point zero.
(28:14):
I know Jesse doesn't only go when I say resistance
but for lack of a better word, might look like,
and you gave her probably the one piece of data
that made me not want to die.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
So discuss.
Speaker 6 (28:28):
Yeah, you know, I was really not sure what this
would look like. When we were doing all of our
scenario planning for Run for Something, which, as your listeners,
probably no recruits and supports young leaders running for local
office all across the country. We were like, maybe people
want to run, or maybe everyone will be so demoralized
and so defeated, they will want to hide into a
cocoon and do nothing but watch trashy television and read
(28:50):
romance novels until this is all of our What I
have been so pleasantly surprised by and so impact thrilled
by is that in just the two weeks since election day,
likely by the end of today, on Tuesday we're recording this,
ten thousand people will have raised their hands to say
they want to run for local office at some point
in the future, which, for a point of comparison, in
all of twenty seventeen we had fifteen thousand people sign up.
(29:12):
Two weeks since election day, we're already two thirds of
the way there.
Speaker 1 (29:15):
Sort of give me an example of someone, or just
a sort of more vague example of someone who has
reached out to you.
Speaker 6 (29:22):
You know, I have heard through my different social media platforms,
because even on maternity leave, I am just scrolling through it.
People are really fed up with democratic leadership. They really
personally understand, and I think very clear i'dn strategically understand
that moving forward, the state legislatures, city council, school boards
are going to be really important places of power. Both
(29:45):
to protect people, to mitigate harm, to ensure that the
worst things Trump can do, if we have power to
stop them, we can, and also to advance democratic policies.
You know, I think about where we are in New York.
It actually really really really matters to have good democratic
leadership here that can really get shit done, can build housing,
(30:06):
can make it a place people can afford to stay,
both because New Yorkers deserve that, but also because if
we don't, we're going to lose more population then we
gain over the next couple of years and ultimately lose
electoral College votes in twenty After twenty.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
Thirty exactly, Like, there's a lot of despair and a
lot of people saying, wow, it's like twenty sixteen but worse.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
But it's not. And I want you to talk about why.
Speaker 6 (30:30):
You know, I think, unlike in twenty sixteen, we are
not building a plane. While we fly the plane. There
is already so much infrastructure that exists from run for something.
You know, having been around for eight years and having
all of these resources available for people who want to run,
we've refined this program really well. We know how to
do this at this point. No Indivisible, which didn't really
get started until a couple weeks post election day. They
(30:52):
are off to the races. They know what they're doing.
Our local leaders, especially the politicians and local leaders who
have come up in the last eight years and those
who ran for office in twenty seventeen, eighteen, nineteen twenty,
you know, they know exactly what they're able to do
to stand up against Trump, to move things forward. And
I think we are smarter, better, more strategic, and less
(31:15):
willing to waste our time on stuff that doesn't matter.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
Yes, less willing to waste our time on stuff that
doesn't matter. Let's talk about that, because I just wrote
about that this week, and it is like, I think
one of the things I really love us all to
be focusing on.
Speaker 2 (31:31):
Can you explain to us a little bit about that?
Speaker 6 (31:34):
Yeah, you know, I think we've learned a lot in
the last eight years about what is a good use
of our time and what isn't Like picking and choosing
these scandals to get outraged by. You know, some of
that it's hard to know in the moment, but really
focusing our fire on the things that will really harm people,
and understanding that some protests can be really meaningful but
(31:55):
not everything needs to be taken to the streets and
they actually have to, you know, use that strategically. Thinking
about you know, I look back on twenty sixteen. We
used to call it like social justice socialites meeting, like
the fun fancy clothes and the branded T shirts and
the merch you know, was that bad? No? Was it
the most strategic use of people's time and money?
Speaker 4 (32:17):
Probably not?
Speaker 6 (32:18):
And the final thing I think I would say is like, really,
as we start to look ahead for what the future
of the Democratic Party in particular looks like, are we
doing things that build power? Are we doing things that last?
Are we doing things that sustain your rear? Because that's
one many ways how our Republican Party.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Got here right right, right, right exactly.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
And I think that's a really really important point. Will
you just tell our listeners some of the run for something,
people who started in twenty sixteen who are now occupying
the political space.
Speaker 4 (32:50):
I would be delighted too.
Speaker 6 (32:51):
So, you know, I think about Mallory McMorrow out in Michigan,
who we worked with her in her twenty eighteen rac
estate senator there, who has an incredible future and has
shown what fighting sort of like insane Republican rhetoric looks
like Zelner Myiri here in New York, who's running for
mayor in twenty twenty five, who could be a real
powerful force against Eric Adams. I think about Anna Escamani
(33:12):
down in Florida, who flipped a seat red to blue
back in twenty eighteen, has held it ever since then
in the state House. Even this year, she won a
couple precincts in her district that Trump also won outside Orlando.
Is going to be an incredible fighter in the Florida
State legislature.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
But those are all great examples. And Mallard mcmarrow.
Speaker 1 (33:31):
So here's a woman who went into state legislature, which
is not like being a senator, but she actually was
able to sort of permeate the news bubble and become
a national presence.
Speaker 2 (33:44):
Can you talk about that?
Speaker 6 (33:46):
Yeah, So back in twenty twenty two feels like a
lifetime ago.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Right, ten thousand years ago?
Speaker 6 (33:54):
Yes, a Republican state senator in Michigan sent a fundraising
email to their list, cauling Mallory mcmore a Gloomer. Mallory
took to the State Senate floor and gave a speech
that very clearly called that out for the bullshit. That
it was talked about what it meant to be like
a mom like her, what it means to stand up
(34:15):
against hate, what it means to fight for kids, which
she has been doing. You know, she called I'm a
straight white Christian, married suburban mom, she said each and
ended up raising ultimately millions of dollars or Democrats across
the country and in Michigan to help build power there.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
Right, And that was just an example of like at
the state legislature, stuff happens that if Democrats are not there,
Democrats cannot push back against it.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
Right, That's right.
Speaker 6 (34:45):
And I think it's proof of the kind of leadership
that really makes a difference right now, which is not
letting them get away with insulting their opponents, with insulting
their constituents with the kind of ridiculous language that we
know the Republicans like to use and throw with the
Democrats and that often will roll over and take without
a fight.
Speaker 1 (35:03):
Yeah, I think that's really important. Now I want you
to talk about I'm going to do something really mean
to you. One of the things that there's been a
lot of talk about is what Democrats should do differently.
And I have really tried to steer away from that
because I don't really know.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
But I'm wondering if you are.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
Like actually on the ground and you're talking to candidates
and you're so I'm hoping you could actually give us
a sort of more.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
You know, it can be anything you want.
Speaker 5 (35:40):
You know.
Speaker 6 (35:40):
I think it's worth noting we don't know what we
know yet. We're not going to know until the voter
fil comes back. Exit polls are notoriously wrong, and I've
been done counting all the votes yet in places like
you know, North Carolina, they're still races.
Speaker 4 (35:52):
They're too close to call. California, they're not done yet.
So blank at caveat.
Speaker 6 (35:56):
We don't know anything, and it's worth not over learning
things from this election. It was a chant election in
light of a global anti incumbency wave, in light of inflation.
You know, I think President Biden had a tough time
selling his record, the fact that he couldn't do and
didn't do a ton of interviews over his first term,
the extent why people didn't really know what he had
done looking forward. I think the Democratic Party, and in
(36:18):
particular I'm really striving me crazy. When people talk about
the Democratic Party, is if it's all unified actors. So
in particular, the democratic funding ecosystem needs to think more
long term about what we are building. We need to
build communications infrastructure that includes media, that includes influencers, that includes,
you know, thinking about the messengers that we have on
the ground. We need to build organizing infrastructure that exists
(36:40):
year over year. And we need to think long term
about the kind of leaders we want this party to
have moving forward, and we need to do it in
all fifties states. I cannot tell you how many times
when I was trying to raise money for run for
something really over the last eight years, and I would
get asked by funders, well, we like what you do,
we think it's important, but why do you do it
outside of the presidential battlegrounds? Like I don't care what
(37:01):
happens in New York or Idaho or Oklahoma or California.
And we have seen now.
Speaker 2 (37:07):
That is insane, by the way.
Speaker 6 (37:09):
I know, politically and practically, that is stupid.
Speaker 4 (37:13):
It is very, very stupid.
Speaker 6 (37:14):
It is really really important to have dread democratic leadership
everywhere and to show Democrats fighting everywhere. So I hope
that moving forward in particular, and I think this is
a money and resource allocation problem. They're people who have
the ideas to do it, they just don't have the
resources to do it. To build year round infrastructure, especially
around communications and organizing, and to ensure that our messengers
(37:35):
reflect the people we want to reach, that we've got
more working class candidates, more candidates who are renters, more
candidates who have dealt with the housing market more recently,
more candidates who are part of the Sandwich generation who
are experiencing you know, aging parents and young kids. All
of that will make us better at connecting with the
voters we need to reach.
Speaker 2 (37:53):
Yeah, it's a really good point.
Speaker 1 (37:55):
I want you to just explain to our listeners why
it's actually like as bad as this feels right now
to a lot of us, and it really feels bad.
Speaker 2 (38:05):
I have to be honest.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
I'm hoping you could talk to us about, like why
you think there are possible bright spots here.
Speaker 6 (38:12):
You know, I think my bright spot right now is
that Trump's shtick doesn't work for anyone else. We saw
this in the Republican presidential primary. Ron De Santis falls
flat on his face.
Speaker 3 (38:24):
You know.
Speaker 6 (38:25):
JD Vance might be vice president, but his approval ratings
starting the campaign like people hate him, even republic hate him.
The Republican bench is all crazy people and people who
are like have no charisma and are loathable. So if
we can get through the four next four years, and
I don't know, we'll see I hope. So I think
(38:47):
so if we can get through the next.
Speaker 4 (38:49):
Four years, they are beatable.
Speaker 6 (38:51):
We can win in the midterms, which we will still have. Midterms.
Elections are not rocked with the federal government. They're run
by states and cities and counties and municipalities. Is a
centralized system. We will have more elections if we can
get through this, which many people won't. It will be
sad and it will be hard, it will be soul crushing.
But they are beatable. The Republican Party outside of Trump
(39:12):
is not that popular. And even like you look at
the down ballot voting, the fact that there is such
a thing as a Trump Baldwin or a Trump sluckin,
or a Trump any of the down ballot candidates in
North Carolina.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
A Trump diego right.
Speaker 6 (39:28):
Yeah, the Republican Party down ballot did not do as
well as it should have given how much Trump went by.
So I think that is my sort of political bright spot.
The other bright spot I see is that we are
further along when it comes to colding state and local
offices than we were the last time Trump was in office.
So hopefully we will be able to do a little
(39:48):
more good in some of these places.
Speaker 1 (39:51):
Yeah. I think that's a really really really good, important
and salient point. And also more importantly, just we have
to hold on right now to the good and to
really be able to see that there is brightness here
and that there are reasons not to despair, because autocrats
(40:15):
really want you to despair.
Speaker 3 (40:17):
They do.
Speaker 6 (40:17):
And you know, even the last you know, two weeks
ago in this election, there were bright spots. We helped
a young woman, Emma Curtis in Lexington, Kentucky, become the
first transperson elected to a city council seat in the
entire state. She'd beat an incumbent in this race, showing
that people like her and across the country deserve to
be in positions of power. We flipped state ledge seats,
(40:40):
rumbers on thing alone, flip state ledge seats in Kentucky
and Iowa and North Carolina and Washington State. It was
it was a bad night. I don't want to pretend
like toxic positivity or it was bad, But there are
spots across the country where we show that our candidates
and our values can win out, and we just got
to take our cues from those leaders and keep giving
them the resources they need.
Speaker 1 (40:58):
It's a really good point. You are getting so many
more people than you were before. So what do you think,
I mean, what does that mean?
Speaker 5 (41:07):
Now?
Speaker 6 (41:07):
I think that means that there is an incredible appetite
for taking power back. There is a desire a demand
for the services that run for something provides, which I
am so glad we exist last time around, because it's
part of the reason we created this organization, because in
twenty sixteen, if you wanted to run, there was nowhere
you could go right after election day.
Speaker 4 (41:26):
Now there is.
Speaker 6 (41:27):
We are here and we're able to help them. So
I am hopeful that in twenty twenty five and the
tens of thousands of local elections that we're going to have,
and in statewides in New Jersey and Virginia, and even
in big municipal elections like here in New York, that
we're going to be able to elect really good people,
and that in twenty twenty six we're going to have
an incredible midterm cycle because Republicans are not going to
(41:49):
be able to deliver on many of the promises they've made,
and the ones that they are are going to really
hurt people. So I am glad to see a surgeon
candidate signing up and I really, really really believe that
run for something and the rest of the broader ecosystem
will be there to help them get across the finish line.
Speaker 2 (42:06):
So important.
Speaker 1 (42:07):
Thank you, thank you, thank you, Amanda Littman, no problem anytime.
Speaker 2 (42:11):
Miy no, no moment, see.
Speaker 3 (42:16):
Cannon Molly drama, drama, drama is happening with this Matt
Gates nomination for AG So much going on? What are
you seeing here?
Speaker 1 (42:26):
Trump has put up a bunch of nominees for confirmation
for cabinet positions.
Speaker 3 (42:32):
I'll tell you what happens. Every time I think of
all his nominations, the Adams Family theme comes in my head.
You know, they're crazy and they're kooky.
Speaker 2 (42:39):
So some are worse than others.
Speaker 1 (42:41):
Ones like Marco Rubio, we might not totally agree on,
but are not beyond the pale. But one of them
that's quite scary is Matt Gates for Attorneys General. Being
Attorney general is really as you know, it's a big job.
Speaker 2 (42:57):
You lead the DOJ. You have all of these people,
you know, And.
Speaker 1 (43:01):
Remember bat Gates was waiting on an ethics investigation that
was about to be released. So now it looks like
that ethics investigation is probably going to leak. The attorney
for two of the women is really furious and out there.
The women are on television. There are more women. The
stories involved paying for sex, trying to get drugs, underage girls,
(43:25):
crossing state lines again, paying for sex. Don't I want
to reiterate, we don't know that, but we know that
there were venmo payments to women.
Speaker 2 (43:33):
He then later had relations to this, so we.
Speaker 3 (43:35):
Also learned that pay Pal payments came from his son Nester, Right.
Speaker 1 (43:40):
So the point is there's clearly a lot of stuff here,
and this is a job that's all about using the
law in a good way to help people. So we'll
see what happens. May this may go to confirmation. Trump
may try to do it as a Reese's appointment. It
may die in the next three months, because remember, as
much as Trump is about to have a lot of power,
(44:02):
he doesn't have it yet. That's it for this episode
of Fast Politics. Tune in every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and
Saturday to hear the best minds and politics make sense
of all this chaos. If you enjoy this podcast, please
send it to a friend and keep the conversation going.
Speaker 2 (44:25):
Thanks for listening.
Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,
where we discussed the top political headlines with some of
today's best minds, and Hikeim Jeffries will lead the Democrats
in Congress once again.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
We have such a great show for you today.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
MSNBC's The Weekend host Simone Sanders stops by to talk
to me about what the Democrats can do differently and
what they're doing right and what they're doing wrong.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
It's a fun conversation.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Then we will talk to Run for Something's Amanda Lippman
about all of these small victories that you may not
have heard of.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
But first the news.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
So Molly, every once in a while we get a
new word in the lexicon that you just go that
one's going to stick around for a while. And yesterday
I learned the term brologarchy. What are you seeing here
with the brolagarchy.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Brologarchy is a word for oligarchy. But because all of
these people, unsurprising are divorced.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Men, it's the bloarchy.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Some of them are not divorced yet, perhaps they won't be,
but perhaps they will be.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
It's a really good article in the Guardian about how
to survive the Brologarchy Twenty Lessons for the Post truth World.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
We should say it's by Carol Cadwell Oder.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
The point is it's a really smart piece and it's
quite funny, and.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
It also she was sued. You'll remembered she has been.
Speaker 1 (01:28):
Victimized by some of these big conglomerates and she's really
smart and you should definitely read this piece in the Guardian.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Mike, I know many times we're talking to people that
are thinking about where they might move because they're afraid
of mister Trump's fascist tendencies. There's an Italian village try
to entice people. What do you see it here?
Speaker 1 (01:46):
First of all, no one should move. Everything is going
to be fine. This will be a very annoying four years,
but we'll get through it. That's what I need to
say first. Also, we find this adorable, which is why
we put it in here. Many communities around the world
have been and wondering what to make.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
Of Donald Trump's reelection.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
A village on the Italian island of Sardinia, where my
mother and her third husband went for their honeymoon, is
looking at this as a potential opportunity. They have said
that they will you can move into these dilapidated houses.
You can buy them for just over one euro, and
then you can renovate them.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
It's launched a.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Website for would be expats more cheap homes. And look,
this is because as much as the Trumpers want you
to think, I did not just clip the website and
I'm not just browsing houses now. I just want to
point out, but as much as the Trumpers would like
you to think that there are too many people in
this world, there actually a lot of these countries are
(02:45):
really having trouble finding people to live in them, despite
how lovely they are. And so I just want you
to feel a little better and to know that if
worst comes to worse, we can always live in dilapidated
homes in Italy for one dollar.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Well, I'm going to keep that in my back pocket.
I guess me too. Let's talk some brighter news here.
We previously had a judge John from North Carolina, Justice
Alison Riggs, and a very interesting thing happened. This is
a crucial race that will determine who controls the Supreme
Court North Carolina, and she is pulled ahead by twenty
(03:20):
four votes as of Sunday night. As they try to
keep the Supreme Court majority there. So this is heading
for a recount and she's going to need the fundraise
on this. What are you seeing?
Speaker 1 (03:29):
So I think the lesson here is don't ever say
that your vote doesn't matter, right, Don't ever say that,
because in fact, your vote absolutely does matter. And this
is a great example of that. The North Carolina Supreme
Court could come down to twenty four votes right now,
she is leading Justice Riggs by twenty four votes. It's
(03:51):
so close that it's going to recount. But it's really
important to realize, Like as much as all of this
feels very frustrating and feels very crazy, every vote matters.
Every single vote matters, every door knock, every you know,
all the stuff that people do to get out the vote,
it all matters. And you know, if Justice Riggs wins,
(04:14):
they won't be able to, you know, enact partisan jerrymandering
in the state. I actually don't know what's happening in
North Carolina right now at the state level.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
Well, they turn very blue, right.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Keeping this seat will keep the balance of power and
prevent the Republicans, the Purple State Republicans, from enacting crazy, destructive,
discriminatory legislation. And that is why every single vote matters,
not even just in North Carolina.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
Somalie, I'm going to shock you here two of my
least favorite congress people, Representive Nancy Mason, Representative MPG, are
targeting Presentative Sarah McBride, one of the newest members of Congress,
who is our first openly transgender person in Congress. What
do you see?
Speaker 1 (04:56):
So this is a really good example of why small
dollar donations are poisoning the Republican Party.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
Marjorie Taylor Green, who's.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
Become a sort of icon of MAGA really destructive mega policy.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
I think this was started by Nancy Mace.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Nancy Mayce has really is like constantly auditioning to be
a mini MTG, so she wanted to make a law
saying that this new congresswoman couldn't use the ladies bathroom.
By the way, first of all, this is ridiculous theater, right,
this is what this is theater. This is MAGA trying
to raise money, trying to get their base excited, and
(05:34):
targeting a transperson. So I'm not that surprised. It's really disturbing.
It's also just like so stupid, like this is not
what the federal government is for and.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Voters hate this. That's the other thing is normal voters
hate this.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
They don't want to punish a member of Congress for
what bathroom she uses. So anyway, but you know, Nancy
Mace is hoping to get attention from the MAGA world,
to get on show, to get on Fox News, to
get Trump to pay attention to her, and that's what
this is. Simone Sanders is the host of MSNBC's The Weekend.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
Welcome to Fast Politics.
Speaker 4 (06:21):
Simone, happy to be here.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
I wanted you on.
Speaker 1 (06:25):
The podcast right away because when the post twenty twenty
four circular firing squad started, you were one of the
few people who seemed to me to be trying to
figure out actually what happened, as opposed to just blaming people.
Speaker 5 (06:43):
Yeah. Well, first of all, I appreciate you molling. I'm
a fan, longtime listener, not a first time callergy. Not yes,
exactly going, but yeah, look I think that, and I mean,
you know, to be there, I had a little The
blame I did have was for people to continue to
go out there and talk about, you know, what they
feel like would have happened, if you know, other things
would have happened, like for me specifically, that was Speaker
(07:05):
murder Pelosi, but like in general, I think that and
perhaps it's the former you know, strategist in me, but
when campaigns happen and you lose, particularly in the way
that Democrats across the board lost in twenty twenty, and
let's just be very clear, it was still close, right,
but you know, you can't say for months it's the
consequential election and then not win the consequential election and
(07:28):
then not you know, do some introspection. So I feel
like that that's really important because there's an election next
year in Virginia for governor's race, and then there are
midterm elections and then there'll be another presidential So you
can't just move forward and say uh no, no one
needs to talk about it, just got to go forward and.
Speaker 4 (07:46):
Get the things done.
Speaker 5 (07:47):
No, you actually have to say, okay, well what happened here,
and let's ask the voters.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
Yes, I think that's totally right.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
I think your point that you can't say it's the
most consequential election of our lifetime and then be like mah, right.
But there were also Democrats overperformed in some places, right,
or they had this not overperformed because they the winds,
the anti partisan winds were strong, but anti incumbent wins
were very strong. But there were certain places where Democrats
(08:15):
were able to keep a Senate seat and lose the
presidential which split ticket voting is something that in highly
partisan times we don't usually have.
Speaker 5 (08:24):
Yeah, but I mean, like to that point, for months
we had heard, oh, people do not split their tickets.
And it's like, why were people saying that? Did they
ask any any of the voters? And I mean, given
what had happened in the midterm election and also in between,
I'm thinking about the ballot measures in Kansas, the ballot
(08:44):
measures in Ohio.
Speaker 4 (08:46):
Right, there are not enough I'm from Nebraska, baby, ain't.
Speaker 5 (08:49):
Enough enough Democrats in Kansas to have codified the reproductive
freedom measures, right, So that meant Republicans voted for it.
In Ohio, again, not enough Democrats in the state. Maybe
to get it done, people who identify as independent or
Republicans had to have voted for it. And so we
had indications frankly earlier on that people were willing to
(09:10):
split their tickets to vote for this.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
Thing over here and then vote for a.
Speaker 5 (09:14):
Candidate that perhaps not even perhaps that in many respects
in some of the Republican candidates, not all of them,
but Republican candidates whom, by way of their votes or
the policies that they instituted, whether they be a governor,
an attorney general right or a state legislative member or
member of Congress, by something that they did as a
(09:36):
function of their job, created the situation to where the
voters had to go and make their voices heard at
the ballot box in terms of the ballot measure. But
I think one of the lessons that we know right
now coming out of this twenty twenty four election is
that the voters have not always connected the people to
the ballot measures. In some places they did, but in
some places they didn't. They're very clear about these ballot
(09:58):
measures and what they believe their rights and whatnot should be,
but they are not as clear about making a connection
between the people on.
Speaker 4 (10:07):
The ballot i e.
Speaker 5 (10:08):
The elected officials and that ballot measure. So that to me,
it says, Okay, there's work to do there. But I mean,
like that's something that you weren't going to hear in
the nuance. In the aftermath, some people were just like ah,
too woke and I'm like, please, where what are we doing?
Speaker 1 (10:22):
Yeah, And it did feel like a lot of people
were just using this election to confirm their priors.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Yes, yes I do.
Speaker 5 (10:29):
And the well when when we say people, when I
say yes I do, I feel like some of the
pundent people and some of the strategists, Yeah, they're using
the election results in the aftermaths without asking any questions
to say, see, I told you these you know, progressive
WoT issues weren't going to get it done. And it's
frustrating to me as someone who again spent a long
(10:50):
time as strategists, but you know, for the last couple
of years, has been reporting on this from the seat
of the anchor chair and going out there talking to voters.
That's not what Democratic candidates and Democratic aligned candidates ran
on and talked about. They didn't talk about quote unquote
culture war issues. The Republican candidates ran on the culture
(11:12):
war issues.
Speaker 4 (11:13):
And so to diagnose the.
Speaker 5 (11:15):
Issue as ah, these Democrats believed in this stuff over
here it's not popular is like woefully missing the mark,
and I think it's lazy.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
Well, the thing that I was struck by, which I
think is pretty interesting, it's like we have these candidates
like here we are doing a post op with policy
like going, well, you know this policy was a loser,
of that policy was a winner.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
But Trump didn't run on policy.
Speaker 4 (11:42):
Thank you, Molly, Molly. Where is the policy?
Speaker 5 (11:44):
I was at a dinner yesterday as we had this
conversation and someone with whom I respect very much was
saying to me, you know, the media didn't talk enough
about I blame the media. And I was like, do
you really and they're like, yes, I blame the media.
I said, Okay, tell me why. They said, the media
and talk enough about Trump's policy. They just talked about
the fear and that's why people were crying the day
(12:06):
after election day who were not happy about the result.
And I said, okay, let me just back up and
say that for people who are scared, I understand their fear,
and maybe the tears were just about like, damn it,
I'm not trying to join the resistance again, and I'm
not trying to go back to you know, legislation by
you know, tweet or whatever we're calling them now.
Speaker 4 (12:26):
So maybe that's some of that I said, But also,
what was the policy? I said, what was the policy?
Is the policy?
Speaker 5 (12:31):
Tariffs, because I know a lot of media folks and
the media apparatus had talked about the tariffs.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
I was like, I don't even think he understands tariffs.
Speaker 5 (12:39):
Yeah, I said, so, you know, to say that the
people didn't talk about the policy, the reality is there
wasn't a policy, and we talked about that.
Speaker 4 (12:49):
But I do think it's important to know.
Speaker 5 (12:51):
One of the things again is we talk about, like, well,
what happened, and then what does this mean for the
party that's now out of power, the Democratic Party apparatus.
I think that one of the things is an acknowledgment
that the conversations are taking places in many different spaces nowadays.
I continue to maintain that television is important because when
something happens in the world, you do not go to
(13:13):
your favorite podcast to figure out what the freak just happened.
You turn on the TV. So, but it is not
the only place. And I think that because it's not
the only place. In the fractured media environment that we
live in, people's understanding of what is and is not
happening is very or or what the facts are frankly,
are not the same across the board. The baselines are
(13:35):
very different. And so depending on how someone consumes the
news or if they like to consume the news at all,
and maybe their news consumption is literally on Instagram, which
is for a lot of people.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
Yeah, it is, which is retally scary.
Speaker 5 (13:50):
I don't believe that everybody that voted for Donald Trump
right that they voted for all of these things.
Speaker 4 (13:55):
I don't think that everyone was actually aware.
Speaker 5 (13:57):
I think there are different levels of voters and different
levels of understanding that people didn't didn't have that that
doesn't resolve them from what it is.
Speaker 4 (14:04):
About to go down.
Speaker 5 (14:05):
I think that that acknowledgement is really important, and also
the acknowledgment that there are also millions of people that
stayed home, and then why did they stay home? I
think that those people deserve the treatment and the diners
that folks that voted for Donald Trump got in twenty sixteen.
Speaker 4 (14:19):
I want people to go to the black barbershops and at.
Speaker 5 (14:21):
Rural places in North Carolina and in some of the
more rural areas of Atlanta and asked some of these
working class black and brown people why they did not vote.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
Yeah, why do you think they didn't vote?
Speaker 5 (14:35):
I've asked some people, and I've gotten a range of answers.
Some fosts have said that they and this is what
I had heard prior to the election, and it's consistent
with what I've heard after, that they didn't think that
they're vote mattered, right Jesus, that they didn't think that
they're vote mattered. Some people said that it's not going
to make a difference where they live. Other people said
that they were just sped up, they were tired, and
(14:56):
some other people said, well, you know, nobody came and
talked to me. And then there were some people that
did participate in the election, and I know some people
that left the top of the ticket blank. I've also
talked to some voters that did check that box for
Donald Trump. So there's a range of things. But with
people are saying that they don't believe that their vote matters,
that they don't think it's going to make a difference,
(15:17):
that nobody came and spoke to them.
Speaker 4 (15:19):
To me, that says that.
Speaker 5 (15:21):
There is work to do there, that those are gettable
voters to me, and the Democrats need to figure out
what they can do to go back and talk to
those people who previously had come out for them and
pass elections and then decided not to participate this time,
like people really feeling like they don't have they don't
have the power.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
It's something that was very prevalent in this election.
Speaker 5 (15:44):
But I would just know when I said this after
the vice presidential debate, I was quite I think critical harsh,
some would say in my analysis of the debate between
Senator now vice president like jd Vance and Governor Wallas
And you know, I'm just kind of like, because y'all
the are y'all talking to actual people, because actual people
who want are not convinced that they're going to participate
(16:06):
in this election. I said that, I said, actual like
base Democratic votes need to be persuaded too. And the
idea that like people were just going to come out
and vote because they understood the threat of Trump right
or reproductive rights or just because there was a black
woman at the top of the ticket was woefully like,
I just think not smart, And I want to know
why some of the strategies and people made those decisions
(16:27):
and thought that people would just come out and vote,
Like when did when do people think that people of
color only need to be persuaded with white people at
the top of the Democratic ticket, Because if that's the
case I got a bridge, I want to sell you
off the coast of Florida, right where hurricanes happened.
Speaker 4 (16:39):
Right then, Yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Want to talk about this because I was also this decision.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
We're going to have competing dinner party stories.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
I would at a dinner party with a lot of
political people, very smart and days were talking about how
Democrats lost, and I said, well, you know, it does
seem like when you look at these numbers, that the
base didn't turn out. And everyone was like, and I said,
you know, maybe perhaps, and I offered a few possible
explanations for why. You know, the two million people who
(17:09):
could have had her win the popular you know, the
twenty twenty turnout would have won this election. Right, So
Biden's twenty twenty turnout would have won this election. And
Biden's twenty twenty turnout includes some parts of the Democratic
base who clearly did not come out. And I said, well,
you know, instead of trying to convert voters, which is
clearly kind of a losing game, because she went around
(17:31):
with Liz Cheney, who was very brave, but at the
end of the day, the Democratic base is not for
Liz Cheney. Right, That's the neocons, and that's a pretty
small group. And I said, you know, perhaps maybe taking
care of the base and some of their concerns when
it comes to any number of things that may not
have been.
Speaker 2 (17:48):
Addressed, would be useful. And everyone just looked at me baffled.
Speaker 5 (17:53):
Really same alling, that's because you talk to actual people.
And so because you talk to actual people, you are
sometimes what you say seems foreign to people that are
only talking to people that go on TV and folks
that you know, haven't been to the Costco and lord
knows how long and Instagart and Amazon Fresh all their groceries.
Speaker 4 (18:12):
The reality is you are correct. Now, let me just
say this.
Speaker 5 (18:15):
When the vice president was doing the tour with former
congress Woman Cheney, someone that I used to work with
called me and they were like, are you watching this
right now? And I said, oh, let me time to
TV on. So I've turned the TV and I'm like, yes, yes, yes,
and they're like, what do you think. I said, well,
I actually don't have a problem with this. Frankly, I
think it's right. I think it's a good bit. I
think it's good lair. I think that people would love
if the Vice president also did this for base voters.
(18:39):
Like what people saw and you know, as someone again
who who'll spent a lot of time in my former
life within the Democratic Party apparatus working campaigns, you cannot
go into communities and broadcast on television like what people
saw and gleaned from all of this is that, Oh,
look at the vice president and the campaign and Democrats,
(19:00):
because really what it is they say Democrats and they
just Democrats just to catch off for all of them.
Look at them taking questions and talking to Republican white
people that I mean.
Speaker 2 (19:10):
That's because that's what it looks like.
Speaker 5 (19:13):
She took She went around the country Molly and took
question She did a very few town halls, and when
she did do them that the campaign orchestrated themselves. It
was she was sitting there with the Liz Cheney and
then took questions from white voters and battleground states and
never did that for based Democratic voters. The campaign went
into Philadelphia, did a did a barbershop talk and then
(19:34):
didn't bring the press, Like what is going on? They
recorded it for themselves, edited it and put it out
where nobody watched it.
Speaker 2 (19:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
What another thing that I want to talk to you
about with this election. Was one of the things that
I noticed is that this White House, the Biden White House,
did this thing where they became intentionally boring in order
to avoid coverage. It made sense in the beginning, right,
but then at some point they like, why.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Is no one covering us?
Speaker 1 (20:02):
And it was too late, and so all of a
sudden they were like, no, no, we did all this
good stuff and none of you covered it. And I
think that at the end of the day, like all
Donald Trump does is PR right, he is out there
doing pr PR, PR PR. Is he lying, for sure,
but PR PR PR. And then we had the Harris
(20:22):
campaign and they were as tight as the Biden White House,
and they did so few interviews and they did so
little of this and so little of that. And Trump
was out there and again he didn't need to be
on cable news, right, he could just be on podcasts,
but he was out there for hours and hours and
hours on every fucking thing, and really, really, really, I
think helped him, and it.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
Was too late for her in some ways.
Speaker 5 (20:46):
Well, I guess two things. One, and you know, folk
out there may have forgotten. I used to work at
the Biden White House, right, I was there for the
first year.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Sorry, I don't mean to criticize you, but.
Speaker 5 (20:55):
Some of the criticism is absolutely warranted because the president
did not prioritize the importance of Again, as we just
talked about, like people, when something happens in the world,
people still turn on the television, Like the TV is
still important. It's not the only place, but it is
still a place that is very, very, very important. I
think the president's team did not prioritize the importance of
putting him on television and putting him out there right like.
(21:17):
He did not do a lot of interviews, not with
traditional media and not with the non traditional media apparatus.
I think that that is a function of it. But
I do think that the media apparatus they did cover
what the administration was doing. I think the real problem
is is how the administration talked about it from the beginning,
all the way once they achieved things, all the way
(21:38):
through like the election, and the reality is is that
again and this is why I talk about people that
don't go to Costco haven't been to the Costco in
a minute of its card at groceries. From the very
beginning when I was at the White House, they were
talking about transitory inflation. I remember coming out of a
meeting and you know, when I worked at the White House,
I was I would, you know, my team would write
the talking points for the Vice President and when we
(21:59):
go and brief heart. I remember going into a briefing
and meeting and noting that, you know, giving the Vice
president what the administration language is, and then that our
suggestion is is that we don't use the term transitory inflation.
From our perspective, for you, ma'am, we don't think you
need to even talk about transitory inflation because what is that?
Speaker 4 (22:15):
But also I personally think it's needed people. But also
it's not true. The inflation wasn't transitory.
Speaker 5 (22:20):
It was real, but they didn't know that because they
weren't going to the grocery store. So part of it
is is that the way that it was things were
being talked about were just flying in the face of
what people were experiencing.
Speaker 4 (22:33):
It is absolutely true.
Speaker 5 (22:35):
And if you look at you, I mean the president,
as we had this conversations at the G twenty and
when I talk to my former counterparts in other countries,
you know, the former the spokespeople, well, now some of
them are still the spokespeople, but the current spokespeople I'm
former in other countries and the diplomats and whatnot. People
particularly in Europe, wish to have America's recovery because it
(22:56):
did recover the fastest out of all the G twenty
countries COVID from inflation, Like America's not dealing with what.
Speaker 4 (23:02):
Some of the other countries are are are still reeling from.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Yeah, because we have immigrants.
Speaker 4 (23:07):
Well, come on, Molly, now it's something we didn't help
the situation. Yeah, in the Europe.
Speaker 5 (23:13):
So I say that to say that, like when the
President and others and people within the administration would say
the you know, wager growth is up and the you know,
the fastest, the best GDP record GDP growth and the
fastest recovery. All of that is true okay on paper,
but like, what does record GDP growth mean for someone
in north Omaha, Nebraska who's still working two jobs and
(23:34):
struggling to you know, pay a bills like when the
rent is too damn high and so On one hand,
I think that it was too there was too much
of a focus on the administration getting credit for the
real work that has been done right the Internet that
has been laid across the communities, the record, infrastructure projects,
all of that is great. Yes, yes, and when the record,
when the history books recorded, Joe Biden is going to
(23:56):
be one of the greatest American presidents because what is
mine stration has done is remarkable.
Speaker 4 (24:02):
However, the rent.
Speaker 5 (24:03):
Too damn high, the housing is unattainable, and grow the
bacon is nine dollars, So like, can we talk about
doing some about the nine dollar bacon? What about the housing?
Even though the administration was doing those was they were
working on those things. The appraisals, right, the discriminatory appraisal process,
they were working on all of that, but they were
not talking about it. So the Vice president's campaign pops
up and she's like, well, you know, we're gonna take
(24:24):
on price gouging. And I think that that's like that
that is more of an answer to what the American
people were dealing with right now. She talks about her
housing plan. However, maybe one of the one of the
things the takeaways is maybe how she talked about it
did not resonate as much and needed more of a
populus twist. And so instead of like price gouging, it's
like the companies are taking advantage of you. They raised
(24:46):
the prices during COVID. Okay, COVID's over and the price
is still up. It's like, yes, dam you right down,
they're greedy. But that's not how it was put forward.
But I would just say that you cannot This is
a long way be saying. In elections, you have to
make a decision. And as you said earlier, you were like,
you know, I don't know if these were turnable voters
in terms of these you know, the who are the
who was the list Chandey voters that was going to
(25:07):
vote for Colin Harris. You have to make a decision
in the campaigns, especially when a finite amount of time.
Speaker 4 (25:12):
Do you want to be right or do you want
to win? Do you want people to see your perspective.
Speaker 5 (25:16):
Do you want to win them over to that old
the economy is actually better than what you think it is.
Speaker 4 (25:20):
Or do you want to win?
Speaker 5 (25:21):
And if you want to win, you need to meet
the voter where they are, understand where the voter is,
and earn their vote. And I think for far too
long the calculus was if we just tell people they
just we just got to explain it more bid.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
Nomics, what the hell is that?
Speaker 3 (25:35):
I said.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
I was like, leave, what is bionomics? They can't explain it?
Reagan nomics rom Reagan didn't name his stuff. Okay, he
didn't do that. The press coin the term after the fact.
Speaker 5 (25:49):
So also, when people say, oh, they don't like the economy,
I don't believe that they don't like Joe Biden's policies,
because Joe Biden's economic policies are good.
Speaker 4 (25:56):
Write thirty five dollars cap on insulin.
Speaker 5 (25:58):
Job creation, like, we're making stuff in America now, literally
infrastructure we can manufacture in this back in America. However,
what people associated with Bidenomics is inflation and all this
other stuff that don't got none to do with Joe
Biden did because they wanted to put a fancy term
on the Democrats.
Speaker 4 (26:12):
Just stop putting termo things. Just say what the hell
it is that you're doing.
Speaker 1 (26:15):
Yeah, yep, yep, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you,
thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
I love you and I appreciate you. Thank you.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
Molly.
Speaker 4 (26:23):
I just I can't, I just really can't.
Speaker 5 (26:24):
So you know, I wish, you know, I wish a
Democratic Party apparrett as well, and they soul search it.
Speaker 4 (26:31):
But I guess I would.
Speaker 5 (26:32):
Just say in closing that what I am watching for
is just, you know, how Democrats respond to this moment,
the reality that they are now living in, or if
you're a Democrat on Capitol Hill where the President, the Presidency,
the Senate, and the House, all the Republicans have it all,
and they are emboldened, they feel emboldened like they can't
play politics as usual. The Democrats can't like, please give
(26:54):
people something. People don't want Democrats to be against against
against im that's going to get them elected. But they
do have to have some a strategy and plan and
then what are they going to do about the party
going forward? There's an election in twenty twenty five in Virginia,
midterm elections around the corner. Who are they gonna pick
for a DNC chair? How are Democrats really going to
take their stories to the next level?
Speaker 4 (27:14):
And are they going to.
Speaker 5 (27:14):
Tuck their tail between their legs and retreat and then
try to be you know, continue they keep talking about
the tent not big enough. It is a goddamn circus. Okay,
I don't know how much bigger than tent, but don't
probably right aside could get. But you know, we just
gonna have to wait and see my thank you.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
Thank you. You are the greatest. Thank you.
Speaker 4 (27:33):
I appreciate you.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
Amanda Liman is the co founder of Room for Something.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
Welcome back to Fast Politics, Amandalipman.
Speaker 4 (27:43):
Always happy to chat.
Speaker 3 (27:44):
Mollie.
Speaker 1 (27:45):
You are on maternity leave, but you are doing this
for me because you are awesome.
Speaker 4 (27:51):
We'll hope the baby keeps sleeping all the chat.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Yes, and that is the most important thing, is that
you are awesome and that you are one of the
people who keeps me from despairing. So the reason why
I reached out to you was because I was reading
Rebecca Traster's excellent piece about what resistance two point zero.
(28:14):
I know Jesse doesn't only go when I say resistance
but for lack of a better word, might look like,
and you gave her probably the one piece of data
that made me not want to die.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
So discuss.
Speaker 6 (28:28):
Yeah, you know, I was really not sure what this
would look like. When we were doing all of our
scenario planning for Run for Something, which, as your listeners,
probably no recruits and supports young leaders running for local
office all across the country. We were like, maybe people
want to run, or maybe everyone will be so demoralized
and so defeated, they will want to hide into a
cocoon and do nothing but watch trashy television and read
(28:50):
romance novels until this is all of our What I
have been so pleasantly surprised by and so impact thrilled
by is that in just the two weeks since election day,
likely by the end of today, on Tuesday we're recording this,
ten thousand people will have raised their hands to say
they want to run for local office at some point
in the future, which, for a point of comparison, in
all of twenty seventeen we had fifteen thousand people sign up.
(29:12):
Two weeks since election day, we're already two thirds of
the way there.
Speaker 1 (29:15):
Sort of give me an example of someone, or just
a sort of more vague example of someone who has
reached out to you.
Speaker 6 (29:22):
You know, I have heard through my different social media platforms,
because even on maternity leave, I am just scrolling through it.
People are really fed up with democratic leadership. They really
personally understand, and I think very clear i'dn strategically understand
that moving forward, the state legislatures, city council, school boards
are going to be really important places of power. Both
(29:45):
to protect people, to mitigate harm, to ensure that the
worst things Trump can do, if we have power to
stop them, we can, and also to advance democratic policies.
You know, I think about where we are in New York.
It actually really really really matters to have good democratic
leadership here that can really get shit done, can build housing,
(30:06):
can make it a place people can afford to stay,
both because New Yorkers deserve that, but also because if
we don't, we're going to lose more population then we
gain over the next couple of years and ultimately lose
electoral College votes in twenty After twenty.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
Thirty exactly, Like, there's a lot of despair and a
lot of people saying, wow, it's like twenty sixteen but worse.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
But it's not. And I want you to talk about why.
Speaker 6 (30:30):
You know, I think, unlike in twenty sixteen, we are
not building a plane. While we fly the plane. There
is already so much infrastructure that exists from run for something.
You know, having been around for eight years and having
all of these resources available for people who want to run,
we've refined this program really well. We know how to
do this at this point. No Indivisible, which didn't really
get started until a couple weeks post election day. They
(30:52):
are off to the races. They know what they're doing.
Our local leaders, especially the politicians and local leaders who
have come up in the last eight years and those
who ran for office in twenty seventeen, eighteen, nineteen twenty,
you know, they know exactly what they're able to do
to stand up against Trump, to move things forward. And
I think we are smarter, better, more strategic, and less
(31:15):
willing to waste our time on stuff that doesn't matter.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
Yes, less willing to waste our time on stuff that
doesn't matter. Let's talk about that, because I just wrote
about that this week, and it is like, I think
one of the things I really love us all to
be focusing on.
Speaker 2 (31:31):
Can you explain to us a little bit about that?
Speaker 6 (31:34):
Yeah, you know, I think we've learned a lot in
the last eight years about what is a good use
of our time and what isn't Like picking and choosing
these scandals to get outraged by. You know, some of
that it's hard to know in the moment, but really
focusing our fire on the things that will really harm people,
and understanding that some protests can be really meaningful but
(31:55):
not everything needs to be taken to the streets and
they actually have to, you know, use that strategically. Thinking
about you know, I look back on twenty sixteen. We
used to call it like social justice socialites meeting, like
the fun fancy clothes and the branded T shirts and
the merch you know, was that bad? No? Was it
the most strategic use of people's time and money?
Speaker 4 (32:17):
Probably not?
Speaker 6 (32:18):
And the final thing I think I would say is like, really,
as we start to look ahead for what the future
of the Democratic Party in particular looks like, are we
doing things that build power? Are we doing things that last?
Are we doing things that sustain your rear? Because that's
one many ways how our Republican Party.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Got here right right, right, right exactly.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
And I think that's a really really important point. Will
you just tell our listeners some of the run for something,
people who started in twenty sixteen who are now occupying
the political space.
Speaker 4 (32:50):
I would be delighted too.
Speaker 6 (32:51):
So, you know, I think about Mallory McMorrow out in Michigan,
who we worked with her in her twenty eighteen rac
estate senator there, who has an incredible future and has
shown what fighting sort of like insane Republican rhetoric looks
like Zelner Myiri here in New York, who's running for
mayor in twenty twenty five, who could be a real
powerful force against Eric Adams. I think about Anna Escamani
(33:12):
down in Florida, who flipped a seat red to blue
back in twenty eighteen, has held it ever since then
in the state House. Even this year, she won a
couple precincts in her district that Trump also won outside Orlando.
Is going to be an incredible fighter in the Florida
State legislature.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
But those are all great examples. And Mallard mcmarrow.
Speaker 1 (33:31):
So here's a woman who went into state legislature, which
is not like being a senator, but she actually was
able to sort of permeate the news bubble and become
a national presence.
Speaker 2 (33:44):
Can you talk about that?
Speaker 6 (33:46):
Yeah, So back in twenty twenty two feels like a
lifetime ago.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Right, ten thousand years ago?
Speaker 6 (33:54):
Yes, a Republican state senator in Michigan sent a fundraising
email to their list, cauling Mallory mcmore a Gloomer. Mallory
took to the State Senate floor and gave a speech
that very clearly called that out for the bullshit. That
it was talked about what it meant to be like
a mom like her, what it means to stand up
(34:15):
against hate, what it means to fight for kids, which
she has been doing. You know, she called I'm a
straight white Christian, married suburban mom, she said each and
ended up raising ultimately millions of dollars or Democrats across
the country and in Michigan to help build power there.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
Right, And that was just an example of like at
the state legislature, stuff happens that if Democrats are not there,
Democrats cannot push back against it.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
Right, That's right.
Speaker 6 (34:45):
And I think it's proof of the kind of leadership
that really makes a difference right now, which is not
letting them get away with insulting their opponents, with insulting
their constituents with the kind of ridiculous language that we
know the Republicans like to use and throw with the
Democrats and that often will roll over and take without
a fight.
Speaker 1 (35:03):
Yeah, I think that's really important. Now I want you
to talk about I'm going to do something really mean
to you. One of the things that there's been a
lot of talk about is what Democrats should do differently.
And I have really tried to steer away from that
because I don't really know.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
But I'm wondering if you are.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
Like actually on the ground and you're talking to candidates
and you're so I'm hoping you could actually give us
a sort of more.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
You know, it can be anything you want.
Speaker 5 (35:40):
You know.
Speaker 6 (35:40):
I think it's worth noting we don't know what we
know yet. We're not going to know until the voter
fil comes back. Exit polls are notoriously wrong, and I've
been done counting all the votes yet in places like
you know, North Carolina, they're still races.
Speaker 4 (35:52):
They're too close to call. California, they're not done yet.
So blank at caveat.
Speaker 6 (35:56):
We don't know anything, and it's worth not over learning
things from this election. It was a chant election in
light of a global anti incumbency wave, in light of inflation.
You know, I think President Biden had a tough time
selling his record, the fact that he couldn't do and
didn't do a ton of interviews over his first term,
the extent why people didn't really know what he had
done looking forward. I think the Democratic Party, and in
(36:18):
particular I'm really striving me crazy. When people talk about
the Democratic Party, is if it's all unified actors. So
in particular, the democratic funding ecosystem needs to think more
long term about what we are building. We need to
build communications infrastructure that includes media, that includes influencers, that includes,
you know, thinking about the messengers that we have on
the ground. We need to build organizing infrastructure that exists
(36:40):
year over year. And we need to think long term
about the kind of leaders we want this party to
have moving forward, and we need to do it in
all fifties states. I cannot tell you how many times
when I was trying to raise money for run for
something really over the last eight years, and I would
get asked by funders, well, we like what you do,
we think it's important, but why do you do it
outside of the presidential battlegrounds? Like I don't care what
(37:01):
happens in New York or Idaho or Oklahoma or California.
And we have seen now.
Speaker 2 (37:07):
That is insane, by the way.
Speaker 6 (37:09):
I know, politically and practically, that is stupid.
Speaker 4 (37:13):
It is very, very stupid.
Speaker 6 (37:14):
It is really really important to have dread democratic leadership
everywhere and to show Democrats fighting everywhere. So I hope
that moving forward in particular, and I think this is
a money and resource allocation problem. They're people who have
the ideas to do it, they just don't have the
resources to do it. To build year round infrastructure, especially
around communications and organizing, and to ensure that our messengers
(37:35):
reflect the people we want to reach, that we've got
more working class candidates, more candidates who are renters, more
candidates who have dealt with the housing market more recently,
more candidates who are part of the Sandwich generation who
are experiencing you know, aging parents and young kids. All
of that will make us better at connecting with the
voters we need to reach.
Speaker 2 (37:53):
Yeah, it's a really good point.
Speaker 1 (37:55):
I want you to just explain to our listeners why
it's actually like as bad as this feels right now
to a lot of us, and it really feels bad.
Speaker 2 (38:05):
I have to be honest.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
I'm hoping you could talk to us about, like why
you think there are possible bright spots here.
Speaker 6 (38:12):
You know, I think my bright spot right now is
that Trump's shtick doesn't work for anyone else. We saw
this in the Republican presidential primary. Ron De Santis falls
flat on his face.
Speaker 3 (38:24):
You know.
Speaker 6 (38:25):
JD Vance might be vice president, but his approval ratings
starting the campaign like people hate him, even republic hate him.
The Republican bench is all crazy people and people who
are like have no charisma and are loathable. So if
we can get through the four next four years, and
I don't know, we'll see I hope. So I think
(38:47):
so if we can get through the next.
Speaker 4 (38:49):
Four years, they are beatable.
Speaker 6 (38:51):
We can win in the midterms, which we will still have. Midterms.
Elections are not rocked with the federal government. They're run
by states and cities and counties and municipalities. Is a
centralized system. We will have more elections if we can
get through this, which many people won't. It will be
sad and it will be hard, it will be soul crushing.
But they are beatable. The Republican Party outside of Trump
(39:12):
is not that popular. And even like you look at
the down ballot voting, the fact that there is such
a thing as a Trump Baldwin or a Trump sluckin,
or a Trump any of the down ballot candidates in
North Carolina.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
A Trump diego right.
Speaker 6 (39:28):
Yeah, the Republican Party down ballot did not do as
well as it should have given how much Trump went by.
So I think that is my sort of political bright spot.
The other bright spot I see is that we are
further along when it comes to colding state and local
offices than we were the last time Trump was in office.
So hopefully we will be able to do a little
(39:48):
more good in some of these places.
Speaker 1 (39:51):
Yeah. I think that's a really really really good, important
and salient point. And also more importantly, just we have
to hold on right now to the good and to
really be able to see that there is brightness here
and that there are reasons not to despair, because autocrats
(40:15):
really want you to despair.
Speaker 3 (40:17):
They do.
Speaker 6 (40:17):
And you know, even the last you know, two weeks
ago in this election, there were bright spots. We helped
a young woman, Emma Curtis in Lexington, Kentucky, become the
first transperson elected to a city council seat in the
entire state. She'd beat an incumbent in this race, showing
that people like her and across the country deserve to
be in positions of power. We flipped state ledge seats,
(40:40):
rumbers on thing alone, flip state ledge seats in Kentucky
and Iowa and North Carolina and Washington State. It was
it was a bad night. I don't want to pretend
like toxic positivity or it was bad, But there are
spots across the country where we show that our candidates
and our values can win out, and we just got
to take our cues from those leaders and keep giving
them the resources they need.
Speaker 1 (40:58):
It's a really good point. You are getting so many
more people than you were before. So what do you think,
I mean, what does that mean?
Speaker 5 (41:07):
Now?
Speaker 6 (41:07):
I think that means that there is an incredible appetite
for taking power back. There is a desire a demand
for the services that run for something provides, which I
am so glad we exist last time around, because it's
part of the reason we created this organization, because in
twenty sixteen, if you wanted to run, there was nowhere
you could go right after election day.
Speaker 4 (41:26):
Now there is.
Speaker 6 (41:27):
We are here and we're able to help them. So
I am hopeful that in twenty twenty five and the
tens of thousands of local elections that we're going to have,
and in statewides in New Jersey and Virginia, and even
in big municipal elections like here in New York, that
we're going to be able to elect really good people,
and that in twenty twenty six we're going to have
an incredible midterm cycle because Republicans are not going to
(41:49):
be able to deliver on many of the promises they've made,
and the ones that they are are going to really
hurt people. So I am glad to see a surgeon
candidate signing up and I really, really really believe that
run for something and the rest of the broader ecosystem
will be there to help them get across the finish line.
Speaker 2 (42:06):
So important.
Speaker 1 (42:07):
Thank you, thank you, thank you, Amanda Littman, no problem anytime.
Speaker 2 (42:11):
Miy no, no moment, see.
Speaker 3 (42:16):
Cannon Molly drama, drama, drama is happening with this Matt
Gates nomination for AG So much going on? What are
you seeing here?
Speaker 1 (42:26):
Trump has put up a bunch of nominees for confirmation
for cabinet positions.
Speaker 3 (42:32):
I'll tell you what happens. Every time I think of
all his nominations, the Adams Family theme comes in my head.
You know, they're crazy and they're kooky.
Speaker 2 (42:39):
So some are worse than others.
Speaker 1 (42:41):
Ones like Marco Rubio, we might not totally agree on,
but are not beyond the pale. But one of them
that's quite scary is Matt Gates for Attorneys General. Being
Attorney general is really as you know, it's a big job.
Speaker 2 (42:57):
You lead the DOJ. You have all of these people,
you know, And.
Speaker 1 (43:01):
Remember bat Gates was waiting on an ethics investigation that
was about to be released. So now it looks like
that ethics investigation is probably going to leak. The attorney
for two of the women is really furious and out there.
The women are on television. There are more women. The
stories involved paying for sex, trying to get drugs, underage girls,
(43:25):
crossing state lines again, paying for sex. Don't I want
to reiterate, we don't know that, but we know that
there were venmo payments to women.
Speaker 2 (43:33):
He then later had relations to this, so we.
Speaker 3 (43:35):
Also learned that pay Pal payments came from his son Nester, Right.
Speaker 1 (43:40):
So the point is there's clearly a lot of stuff here,
and this is a job that's all about using the
law in a good way to help people. So we'll
see what happens. May this may go to confirmation. Trump
may try to do it as a Reese's appointment. It
may die in the next three months, because remember, as
much as Trump is about to have a lot of power,
(44:02):
he doesn't have it yet. That's it for this episode
of Fast Politics. Tune in every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and
Saturday to hear the best minds and politics make sense
of all this chaos. If you enjoy this podcast, please
send it to a friend and keep the conversation going.
Speaker 2 (44:25):
Thanks for listening.
Host
Molly Jong-Fast
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