Part 10: Happy Ending

Going meta, the last episode spotlights how this podcast came about, how co-creator Ray Nowosielski and partner Ruth Vaca were drawn into the world of It's a Wonderful Life and how the making of it proved one of the most existential years in their lives.  Listeners meet the Groundhog Day writer and the celebrities of the annual Asner Center charitable table read of Wonderful Life, a search for the perfect sequel commences and a real George Bailey is lost, in this touching conclusion.  SaveGeorgeBailey.com  

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:09):
Ray and Kurt and Ruth thanks again for putting together
this outline for us.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
We had a great discussion about it during our development
team call yesterday. It's April twenty twenty two and we're
inside a pitch meeting as they call it and show biz.

Speaker 3 (00:23):
And every time I have conversations with people about it,
it goes to all kinds of sort of deeper places.

Speaker 2 (00:28):
You're hearing. Ray Novossewski one of the people my Angel
colleagues and I recruited in so many ways to help
create this podcast.

Speaker 3 (00:38):
And I like the fact that people handway that is like,
oh my god, wonderful life, like so not cool, so
played out, so cliche, and it's like, no, no, no, if
you start talking about this movie, you're going to go
to controversial places almost automatic.

Speaker 4 (00:53):
We don't necessarily have a pinpoint, a like exactly what
we're researching for this project.

Speaker 2 (00:59):
And this is Ruth Vodka, a creative and Ray's longtime
business partner. She's also his spouse and mother of their
four year old son, Pablo.

Speaker 4 (01:10):
We know in the sense that there is a large
influence of the film and society and little talents and
a lot of people find them post reflecting every Christmas,
like they watched the movie and they think about where
they came from, and you know, what world are they
living in? Are they living in Bedford Falls? Are they
living in Pottersville? Are they living in none of that?
And that neither world exists where they're at. I mean,

(01:34):
it's just more of an identity of America that we
are researching.

Speaker 2 (01:38):
I'm taking you to a year and a half after
Ray sees this podcast greenlit, as they say, by iHeart,
only weeks before some of you are listening to this,
Ray is at a crossroads of a type by now
you should be familiar with. Over this podcast. Suddenly, Ray
and Ruth are having a rather challenging year financially, leaving

(02:01):
them to wonder about their current lives and question what
to do with their youthful ambitions.

Speaker 5 (02:17):
Hey hey, so what's the word, Kurt?

Speaker 6 (02:19):
I mean, the thing that's so ironic is that this
podcast and I Heeart green lighting it was supposed to
be the thing that would help me finally get to
that next place I was trying to go. And yet
I've never felt more like George Bailey heading to the
bridge than I do right now.

Speaker 7 (02:40):
Buffalo Gals can't you come out tonight?

Speaker 8 (02:42):
Can't you come out tonight?

Speaker 9 (02:44):
Can't you come out tonight?

Speaker 7 (02:46):
Buffalo gals, can't you come out tonight?

Speaker 10 (02:49):
And by thee oh, I love side Jo say.

Speaker 9 (03:07):
Yeah, Christ receive you make me sid Joe.

Speaker 6 (03:25):
Uncle Rocky asked me a few years ago to well
before he was ill, to eulogize him when his time came.
I want to tell you that it's one of the
greatest honors that I've ever experienced to be here speaking
about this man.

Speaker 2 (03:42):
It's twenty thirteen in Pekin, a small town in Illinois.
Ray's uncle, the rock of his family and his community,
has joined us up here earlier than anyone would have liked.
A devoted union leader working for a Caterpillar, and a
tough youth football coach. He rubbed off on his short

(04:04):
and artistic nephew, Ray, who grew up wanting to prove
he could be a real leader and impact his world
just like his beloved uncle.

Speaker 6 (04:15):
I'm not the greatest speaker, but I think a few
days ago it occurred to me one of Uncle Rocky's
favorite things to do was to put me on the
spot and watch me squirm.

Speaker 11 (04:33):
And of course, when he passed away.

Speaker 6 (04:34):
I thought, well, that's all over, and he found a
way to do it one more time in front of everyone.

Speaker 2 (04:41):
He knows raise nervous, but he surprises the large crowd
at this funeral with a rare show of speaking confidence.
For years afterward, family members will say that his uncle
came down angel like and helped him.

Speaker 6 (05:00):
When I was a little kid, my mom introduced me
to her favorite movie, and it became my favorite movie
called It's a Wonderful Life, and it tells the story
of a man who basically stays around the same place
where he was born, and he never achieves any great
wealth or political power, but by choosing to do the

(05:27):
right thing when it counted over and over again, he
made such an impact on the lives of his family.

Speaker 8 (05:34):
His friends, and his community.

Speaker 6 (05:37):
That to imagine a world in which he hadn't existed
would have meant a much different and sadder world for
all of those people. And as hard as it may be,
I'd like to pause for a second and I have
everyone imagine what your life and what you think this
community would have been like had Rocky Duffin never existed.

Speaker 2 (06:09):
I'm taking you to nineteen forty seven inside the Empire
Theater in Peakin. Fifteen year old Betty Hartman watches with
her parents the movie Wonderful Life. During its initial theatrical run.
The family are impoverished and take odd jobs wherever they
can find them. Wonderful Life becomes young Betty's favorite movie.

(06:41):
And now it's nineteen seventy five, inside the living room
of a small house in Peakin. Betty is now an
adult watching her favorite film with her fifteen year old daughter, Valerie.
Wonderful Life sparks something in Valerie, becoming her favorite movie.
Two nineteen ninety six, inside another living room, this one

(07:10):
a firmly middle class ranch house, just built by a
local farmer in Brownsburg, a suburb of Indianapolis, two hundred
miles east of Peakin. And Valerie's fifteen year old son
Ray hosts a party to celebrate the premiere of his
latest short movie, one about Christmas, funded by one of
his uncles.

Speaker 6 (07:32):
Well uncle Jim's real humble here, but he was the
writer of the screenplay that this was based off on it,
and he is the producer.

Speaker 2 (07:41):
Raised talking about his uncle, Valerie's brother, who happens to
be named Jimmy Stewart, but to be clear, not the actor.

Speaker 7 (07:51):
Ray likes old movies, and we've been trying to get
this particular.

Speaker 12 (07:55):
MOVI movie for him quite sometimes.

Speaker 8 (07:58):
I'd like to present that to him.

Speaker 2 (08:04):
As the party wraps up, Ray plays his uncle Jim's gift,
a DVD of Wonderful Life, unlike his mother and grandmother.
At age fifteen, this is around the fifteenth time that
Ray is seeing this movie.

Speaker 13 (08:19):
I want to do something, something important, something Bay some Wharton.

Speaker 11 (08:28):
That's DVD skipping.

Speaker 2 (08:31):
Ray was born in January nineteen eighty one, the same
month Ronald Reagan entered the White House. His parents never
graduated college, but worked hard and were smart and kind.
They got where they were hoping to go, and they
have big hopes for Ray. His mother, Valerie, has passed
the family's favorite movie to him that in a nutshell

(08:55):
is how we angels wanting to see Wonderful Life continue
to offer a way forward for you. Helped Ray become
a co creator of this podcast. Like everything else, though
there's more to it. When Ray is young, he becomes
obsessed with the sliding doors concept and the butterfly effect

(09:17):
of every decision thanks to another movie, a hit one
of his youth nineteen eighty nine's Back to the Future
Part two.

Speaker 7 (09:26):
Prior to this point in time, somewhere in the past,
the timeline stewed.

Speaker 14 (09:30):
Into this tangent, creating an alternate nineteen eighty five.

Speaker 2 (09:35):
He convinces his third grade classmates at his Catholic elementary
school to spend their recess's memorizing lines to Back to
the Future Part one, and then convinces his teachers to
let them put it on as a play at the
end of the school year. Everyone involved loves it so
much that they do it again for part two and three.

(09:58):
In the fourth grade. Four years later, Maggie McClain Ray's
favorite teacher assigns him to look into her favorite President,
Franklin Deleanor Roosevelt, and while doing that, he ends up
getting to know a documentary filmmaker at the local PBS station.

(10:18):
It's then he realizes he wants to make movies about
true stories. At his eighth grade graduation, he promises Maggie
he will take her with him to his first Oscars ceremony.

Speaker 15 (10:32):
I have a question, how did you get so involved
with the movie and made it a big part of
your career in life?

Speaker 2 (10:42):
This is Tom Tenowitch. You heard him in the first
episode the television writer behind Mark and Mindy and much more.
He's being interviewed by Ray but turns the tables on him.

Speaker 3 (10:55):
My little personal anecdote is that I married my high
school sweetheart, which was just a case of young and dumb.
It was not a smart idea, it was there were
a lot of signs that it wasn't going to work.
But right before we got married, everyone who knew me
growing up knew that I wanted to leave Indianapolis and
go off to the cities and be a big shot
and make movies and all this stuff. And she just

(11:19):
put the brakes on it right before we were going
to get married. I was like, you're George baileying me
because she was saying like, I don't think I can
leave Indianapolis. I want to stay near family. And I
was like, and I was very afraid I would end
up never having the chance to, you know, find out
if I if I could do it, you know, and
what other people were like in places that weren't Indianapolis.
And so we got divorced, had no kids, there was

(11:42):
really nothing to split, We had no money. So everything
turned out okay, and I later in New York, met
the love of my life who I now I'm married to,
and I have a childhook and all that.

Speaker 2 (11:51):
So Ray and the love of his life route Mary
in Central Park on Thanksgiving Day twenty seventeen, as the
Macy's Parade is taking place blocks away. Before a small
group of forty a tight budget wedding, each promises they
will never let the other give up on pursuing their dreams,

(12:13):
on becoming who they want to be.

Speaker 3 (12:17):
I can see what George wanted at age twenty one,
and I can see how heartbreaking it would have been
to be trapped and never even get to try and
see if you, you know, if you were actually good,
if you could have made it out there kind of thing.

Speaker 16 (12:29):
You know.

Speaker 2 (12:29):
We're in New York City, several years before their wedding,
and Ruth and Ray return after several years away in
Los Angeles and Austin. It is then that Ray is
given a big opportunity to see his career advance where
they always hoped it would go. He takes a position
with Barbara Copple, the beloved documentary filmmaker who had won

(12:52):
two Oscars, her first when she was only thirty. Frank
Capra was thirty seven when he won his first.

Speaker 17 (13:00):
I'd like to dedicate this film to the people of
the Midwest and the families and the meat packers in Austin, Minnesota,
whose American dream is so precious and so vital.

Speaker 2 (13:13):
This is Barbara accepting her second Oscar, only two years
older than Ray is, in twenty twenty three, and they.

Speaker 17 (13:22):
Went out on strike for their slice of the American
dream and were permanently replaced.

Speaker 2 (13:31):
Working with Barbara, Ray is soon going to film festivals
with movies he has produced, going to award shows with
nominations for Ruth and Ray. Having partnered on their mutual
success and supported each other's goals with optimism for years,
it has all worked out, or so it seems.

Speaker 6 (13:52):
I got to get it out of my system, so
to speak, and New York rents were too damn high.
Ruth and I wanted to have a baby, but Ruth
didn't want want to have our first baby far from
family or you know, like a tiny apartment in New
York City. So that's how I ended up in Bloomington, Indiana,
where we are now, which is kind of ironic that
I willingly chose to come back there to Indiana.

Speaker 11 (14:12):
Here but that's kind of it.

Speaker 6 (14:16):
And I love Tom's description of especially that idea of like, oh,
would my wife really have been better off she'd married
that other guy? Or would I live a better life
if I could just do this? Or is my life wonderful?
Should I have an acceptance for.

Speaker 2 (14:29):
What the actuality is that teacher Ray promised to take
to the Academy Awards with him. Maggie joined us up
here in two thousand and seven. Ray has yet to
attend an the Oscars ceremony.

Speaker 15 (14:45):
And if you're honest, you'll realize that there are things
there that you have to deal with and clean up change.

Speaker 2 (14:54):
Tom Tinowitch again talking this all through with Ray.

Speaker 15 (14:58):
But it's nice to start off a little bit if
you feel the you're on top. But if you have
any humanity in you, you're going to be forced to
look at the other side of it, which is so
special value, you know, And you might find some good things,
but you'll also find some things that are not so good,
And if you're willing to deal with them and change them,

(15:21):
you might not have to have another wonderful life moment.

Speaker 7 (15:33):
Hey, hey, all.

Speaker 11 (15:36):
Right, do you want so you want to go over
this schedule?

Speaker 2 (15:39):
Ray has spent his life pursuing his childhood dream of
making an impact and a living through storytelling. He thought
he'd be a bit further along on that by now.
Although he has managed to publish a book and produce
a number of successful documentary films over his career, He's

(16:00):
forty two years old and it hasn't all gone exactly
as he had hoped. Now it's starting to seem like
this podcast could be his last chance, and time is short.
He's worried, not jumping off the bridge, worried, but still worried.

Speaker 6 (16:16):
The budget, from my heart, was very respectable, but it's
a podcast budget, and as you know, we've essentially done
nine full documentaries here right with trips and real journalism,
a lot of research, two hundred conversations.

Speaker 11 (16:30):
I think it is archival collection.

Speaker 6 (16:32):
And I know we both ended up doing like a
lot of volunteer hours, and your wife.

Speaker 11 (16:37):
Elizabeth cutting these episodes.

Speaker 6 (16:39):
Sorry if I sound like feeling sorry for myself, but
I guess that's a little George Bailey too.

Speaker 2 (16:45):
Upon their relocation to Bloomington, Indiana, and soon amidst a
global pandemic, Ray and Ruth decided to have two babies
the first became Little Pablo. The second was their own
pretty reduction company that would allow them to be independent,
a little like Frank Keepra tried to do with Liberty Films,

(17:07):
and Ruth too, threw herself into trying to make their
company a success, while like so many women, often having
to take the lead on all that was required with
a new young son. Five years in, after feeling like
a growing success, things have suddenly slowed down, the money
becoming unpredictable, and as so many do and struggle appears,

(17:32):
Ruth and Rays started to question each other, their decisions
and themselves.

Speaker 18 (17:39):
So you finally got your what you think is like
your big break? Like, Okay, I've got a green light
that took me no hassle to get. I'm working out
my favorite project, I've got a great team working with me,
and I'm not making enough money.

Speaker 3 (17:54):
To live Yeah well yeah, yeah.

Speaker 11 (17:58):
Yeah, yeah exactly. It's so frustrating.

Speaker 2 (18:01):
Ray has recruited an ally in the documentary world, Kurt Angfer,
to help him get his passion project off the ground. Kurt,
who helped sell this podcast to iHeartMedia, experienced his documentary
film Bowling for Columbine with director Michael Moore become a
nominee at the two thousand and three Academy Awards, it

(18:23):
won the Oscar as Ray watched on TV.

Speaker 6 (18:27):
And then have to like be filling out job applications
or like feverishly searching me just chasing money the whole
myth if I just try to be a good person
and focus on that and focus on doing what I
think I do well, the money will come.

Speaker 11 (18:46):
And that has not at all been the case for.

Speaker 6 (18:49):
A while for a while now, Oh my god, did
I tell you? Like my GMC's engine just stopped working
and the mechanics says minimum five grand to fix it. Anyway,
It's like the whole point I'm moving to Bloomington, like
leaving the New York dream behind, was that, like we
weren't supposed to struggle in a place like Bloomington, Indiana.
And I've only I'm only renting a three bedroom house,

(19:11):
like I don't own anything. And what's really freaking me
out though, Kurt, is that this little financial skid I
can tell is causing Ruth to question if we should
keep doing this. I can feel her starting to let go,
and as the first time in our whole relationship since
I met her.

Speaker 11 (19:29):
I'm feeling her let go of her own dreams.

Speaker 6 (19:32):
You know, we have to make consistent money for Pablo,
and I think that's now after this year.

Speaker 11 (19:38):
It's like, can we do that while still doing this?

Speaker 6 (19:41):
Our whole deal together was you know, the hope, hope
for what we could accomplish together, and I if we
lose that hope, it's going to totally change our relationship.

Speaker 11 (19:52):
That's my fear.

Speaker 6 (19:54):
And so like for the first time, I'm worried about
the future for our whole little family. And that's not
something that I saw coming, even as recently as a
year ago when we landed this deal for my dream
podcast with iHeart.

Speaker 18 (20:07):
And that's the parallel right with George, right, you know,
he's doing everything right, and he still ends up eight
thousand dollars in the whole and hires threatening to have
them arrested. Both the podcast and the film our indictment
of our the actual system that our society functions in,

(20:28):
I think is that you're a victim of this system,
just like George Bailey is, and you're just as.

Speaker 7 (20:33):
Follows as he is.

Speaker 2 (20:34):
Amidst his conversation with Kurt, suddenly Ray realizes that his
life is mirroring some of the darker themes of the
life of his hero George Bailey.

Speaker 6 (20:44):
In the audio, like how many times have I told
the story when I married my high school sweetheart and
then all of a sudden she put the brakes on
me going off to the cities, and you know, seeing
what it was all about, which I'd wanted to do
my whole life.

Speaker 11 (20:59):
And I thought that was getting George Bailead.

Speaker 6 (21:02):
And I've always used George Bailey as a verb, and
I was getting George Bailey.

Speaker 11 (21:07):
But that was just George.

Speaker 6 (21:08):
That was George Bailey in Act one, right, Like really
getting George Bailead is coming to some form of acceptance of,
you know, of letting go of some aspects of that
those youthful, selfish dreams.

Speaker 11 (21:24):
And you think you get to.

Speaker 6 (21:25):
A point by midlife where you're okay and things are
going really well, and then something just comes along and
pulls the rug out from under you and you again
are wondering what has this whole thing been about? And
you know, basically did I fail?

Speaker 18 (21:44):
Well, I mean, you know it's not unreasonable, you too
think that you could make a.

Speaker 7 (21:52):
Living at it.

Speaker 18 (21:53):
I think that this could.

Speaker 8 (21:55):
Be a really good way to deal with a lot
of things.

Speaker 12 (21:58):
That we haven't been able to really deal.

Speaker 18 (21:59):
With in the actual podcast while dealing with the podcast itself.
This should be what the tenth episode is about, the
one we can't seem to figure out.

Speaker 11 (22:11):
So there.

Speaker 5 (22:12):
Yeah, I'm still here.

Speaker 8 (22:13):
Hey, thanks so much for taking a little time.

Speaker 7 (22:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (22:16):
I wasn't looking for anything specific. I thought it might
be good to get a few updates for you and
ask you a few follow up questions. But uh, yeah,
how's your family?

Speaker 7 (22:25):
Hey, family's great.

Speaker 2 (22:27):
A few weeks before some of you are first listening
to this Ray Coles, Men's O case you remember that
real George Bailey and Seneca Foles.

Speaker 7 (22:37):
Just got the news we're going to have another grandchild
in September.

Speaker 8 (22:41):
Wow, congratulations which child is having the grandchild?

Speaker 7 (22:46):
Desiree is going to have her second child. That was
pretty exciting.

Speaker 8 (22:50):
Was Desiree the one I met?

Speaker 4 (22:52):
Oh?

Speaker 7 (22:52):
No, no, I think you met with cal Well.

Speaker 2 (22:56):
Where you go?

Speaker 11 (22:57):
That's fantastic? Another one for Christmas next year?

Speaker 5 (23:01):
Yeah, I hope so yeah, looking forward to it.

Speaker 2 (23:04):
As Ray struggles to figure out his personal problems and
finish this episode, he decides to take a cue from
wonderful life and try focusing outside himself on the problems
of others. He makes a series of phone calls, including
to Menzo, whose vision of an affordable housing project in

(23:25):
Seneca Falls Ray finds so inspiring.

Speaker 7 (23:29):
And we're talking about low modern income meeting income being
about seventy six thousand dollars. So you start to talk
seventy six thousand dollars family, what are they going to
be able to afford there? It's not going to be
a six hundred thousand dollars home. It's going to be
something close to nowadays two one hundred and fifty thousand,

(23:49):
and we need to do those for those families. But
that's not a big ticket item for some of these
bigger developers, and I get it, and that's what we need.
Despite our best efforts, were continue to drive a wedge
between communities and separating the haves and the have nots,
and the distance between the two is getting greater.

Speaker 8 (24:10):
And you're doing a great thing, and a great thing.
We want to help in any way you know we can,
because it really ties into the two key themes of
the show have sort of risen from all these conversations
we've had around wonderful life. And it really is about, uh,
the George Baileys of the world finding a way to
uh get working people and middle class people into homes

(24:32):
in towns where they want to live. And uh and
then also you know, hopelessness and the rise and suicidality
and how we counter the cynicism of you know, the times.

Speaker 7 (24:43):
So right, yeah, and.

Speaker 8 (24:47):
We're as well, you said, the the Bailey Parks line
is like being built, are constructed now or it's already.

Speaker 7 (24:55):
Yeah, I met with the metal fabricator, so it's always
available for people to go there, get a picture Belly
Park entrance. You know.

Speaker 8 (25:03):
It's just a fun you know, yeah, exactly Like yeah,
like I said, you put you put the sign up there,
and the rest kind of takes on. Yeah.

Speaker 7 (25:17):
So I've got a lot to do.

Speaker 11 (25:19):
But the first thing I had.

Speaker 7 (25:21):
To do is get the town on board.

Speaker 5 (25:23):
The town's on.

Speaker 3 (25:23):
Board, they're working toward getting.

Speaker 7 (25:26):
Water and sewer. So from that standpoint, that's that's a
that's a win. I like to think is still the
American dream, the old a piece of real estate, to
have a part in the community and to be a
part of something much bigger than themselves, and that to
me is America. You know, it's not about growing, getting
wealth and becoming affluent. It's about being part of something

(25:49):
that's much bigger than yourself and finding your place in
the community. I mean, we need people that work in factories,
in service jobs, and they're not menial, they're meaningful, and
then they're the ones that we call on to help
in times of crisis or in times of needs. These
are the same people that will man our ambulances and

(26:12):
our fire trucks. And if we don't build that, we're
going to start seeing like our volunteer fire departments, they're
going to fall apart because we can't get volunteers because
the affluent don't want to do that. You know, they
don't participate in those things. That's a shame, because that's American.

Speaker 8 (26:33):
I still love how you talk about this and how
you think about it.

Speaker 11 (26:36):
Thank you, you're doing God's work.

Speaker 8 (26:38):
I really appreciate you putting up with me, and I
appreciate it all right, Yeah.

Speaker 5 (26:44):
Take sure.

Speaker 7 (26:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:46):
After connecting with someone in his universe who is working
on George Bailey's pet issue housing for working people, Ray
begins thinking about how wonderful life itself might continue to
counter that issue that plagued George Bailey and now begins
to plague Ray hopelessness. One person who has done more

(27:09):
than perhaps anyone else in recent years to keep wonderful
life relevant in the eyes of modern audiences and to
direct that toward helping others is Matt Asner, son of
Ed Asner, the actor. Through a friend, Ray and Matt connect.

Speaker 19 (27:25):
My dad played Sanna about twenty times. He did films
where he didn't play Santa, so I would say he
probably did probably thirty Christmas films or holiday inspired films.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
If you're of a certain age, you probably remember ed
from his role as Lou Grant in The Mary Tyler
Moore Show, one of the biggest hits on television in
the early nineteen seventies.

Speaker 14 (27:49):
No, Mary, I haven't had Christmas off in seven years.

Speaker 20 (27:54):
Oh that's terrible.

Speaker 5 (27:56):
Well it's not too bad.

Speaker 14 (27:57):
You get used to It is just like any other
day when you're working a news grow you know what
I mean. No, h you've got to work on Christmas.

Speaker 5 (28:12):
I really grew up on that set.

Speaker 19 (28:14):
It was more of the family atmosphere of that set
that I really remember, and you know, walking onto the
set in the morning with my dad, and I would
be there all day, and I wouldn't necessarily stay at
this set all day and go and run around and
get in trouble on the lot.

Speaker 2 (28:32):
Younger listeners probably no Met's father had bitter from another
Christmas movie, Elf, Buddy, is that you?

Speaker 21 (28:40):
Are you okay?

Speaker 17 (28:42):
Boy?

Speaker 5 (28:42):
Am I glad to see you?

Speaker 2 (28:45):
The klothometer suddenly just drop down to zero. There's just
no Christmas spirit anymore.

Speaker 19 (28:52):
I think ELF has some of that stuff that It's
a Wonderful Life has. I think there's a there's an
interesting thing about Alpha that is either people love it
or hate it, and I think it's a wonderful life
that's similar in that way. I think less people hate
It's a wonderful life.

Speaker 2 (29:08):
Funny footnote ed Asner's Mary Tyler Moore spinoff television show
lou Grant was one of the very first to make
reference to wonderful life.

Speaker 14 (29:18):
Dannon Harf while she was in some great pictures, you
remember the one she was in with Jimmy Stewart.

Speaker 2 (29:24):
It's a wonderful Town.

Speaker 12 (29:25):
A wonderful life.

Speaker 4 (29:26):
I was gonna read it.

Speaker 19 (29:27):
My dad and I would watch, you know, old movies
on TV occasionally It's a Wonderful Life would come on that.

Speaker 5 (29:34):
It just blew my mind. It was it was.

Speaker 19 (29:39):
It was what I wanted in this world. It's what
I want my world to look like. And my father
certainly felt the same way. So we had that bond
and so every holiday we would get together and watch
this film.

Speaker 18 (29:54):
If you want a shock, I think you're a great guy.

Speaker 5 (29:59):
Thank you.

Speaker 19 (30:00):
It's a film that you can watch twenty thousand times
and not get tired of it. It became a warm
blanket for me during the winter. That's why that's why
we started this project of reading it, you know, in
December for the ad Asner Family Center.

Speaker 2 (30:18):
The ed Asner Family Center was created to support what
doctors now call neuro divergent people. They're loved ones and
the community. It has raised a lot of money for
this cause.

Speaker 19 (30:31):
My wife and I together have three sons on the spectrum,
so that's what the catalyst was.

Speaker 5 (30:37):
We wanted to create.

Speaker 19 (30:38):
A place that provided what we were so desperate to
receive when we were bringing up our children, and that's
why we created the ad Asner Family Center. Let's pick
a holiday film and let's do it, you know, let's
do it as a reading. Having Pete Davidson involved in
the first year was I think a set something in

(31:01):
motion that I think has existed for all the years
we've done it.

Speaker 5 (31:06):
Not Pop, Pop, I couldn't.

Speaker 13 (31:09):
I couldn't face being cooped up for the rest of
my life in a shabby little office.

Speaker 5 (31:16):
I'm sorry, Pop, I I didn't mean that remark.

Speaker 13 (31:20):
But this business of Nichols and dimes and spending all
your life trying to figure out how to save three
cents on a length of a pipe, I'd go crazy.
I want to do something big and something important.

Speaker 19 (31:32):
He doesn't say yes to a lot of things, and
he did to this immediately because it was his favorite
film and he watched it every year with his father,
and because of that he did it.

Speaker 2 (31:44):
Pete's father, you may know, was a New York City
firefighter who joined us up here on September eleventh, two
thousand and one.

Speaker 19 (31:53):
We've made, I think, interesting and timely choices with all
of our George Bailey's It's a perfect storm of juice.
I think that they want to play these parts because
they're so they're so wonderful and so iconic. But I
do think they do it because they want to help
the Nasder Family Center.

Speaker 11 (32:11):
You you you said what I mean?

Speaker 12 (32:13):
Why you just said a minute ago that they had
to wait and save their money before they even ought
to think about, you know, a decent home.

Speaker 19 (32:21):
Jason sudeikis a big fan of the film, and we
got him right at the height of ted Lasso.

Speaker 5 (32:27):
You know mania. Wait wait, wait, wait, I mean wait
for what wait?

Speaker 12 (32:32):
Wait until their children grow up and leave them until
they're so old and broken broken down that do you
know how long it takes a working man to say
five thousand dollars? Yeah, if it hadn't been for me,
every being, buddy'd be a lot better off my wife
and my kids and my friends.

Speaker 5 (32:49):
Bluck Millfeller.

Speaker 11 (32:50):
You just go off and hunt somebody else, will you?

Speaker 2 (32:52):
And here's Brendan Fraser, the actor in twenty twenty two.
In one month he'll be nominated for an Oscar one.
He goes on to win.

Speaker 12 (33:02):
I started in this business thirty years ago, and things
they didn't come easily to me. Did you feel, Jimmy
Stewart at all when you were doing the performance? Spirit
it overtakes you. It's like a privilege to speak those
words and those lines, iconic dialogue. It feels good to
sail loud.

Speaker 19 (33:22):
I think most people have an altruistic bone in their body.
I think that's why you know tear jerker movies do
so well. That's why you know it's a wonderful life
does so well. I mean it's we all want to
be that person. We all want to be that person
that helps people, that you know that takes a bullet
for someone. We all want to be that person. But

(33:44):
sometimes we get bogged down in life and in the
hardship of life.

Speaker 22 (33:50):
You shoot pull with some employee in coming bank and
buy the money. What does that get us a discontented,
lazy rebel instead of a thrifty working class He.

Speaker 19 (34:07):
Had always wanted to do Mister Potter. He loved that role,
and he loved Lionel Barrymore and love the way Lionel
Barrymore did. He did it very differently than Lionel Barrymore.
He just really wanted to do the role of mister Potter.
We were actually going to have him read Clarence in
the second year.

Speaker 17 (34:27):
At Asner, the much admired Emmy winning actor has died.

Speaker 19 (34:31):
When you have a father that is so powerful in
terms of the output they put into the world. It's daunting.
It's a daunting thing. It's oh my god, how am
I going to follow?

Speaker 5 (34:46):
Follow that? You know, Like George Bailey, he my father
was my hero. He was my hero.

Speaker 19 (34:52):
He is my hero, and I use him as an
example every day, every day that I live for a
decisions that I make and I look at it that way.
He's the ultimate guide post for me in life. We're
going to forget about. It's a wonderful life at some point.
As a culture, it's going to end up leaving us

(35:13):
at some point.

Speaker 5 (35:15):
I think people more and more.

Speaker 19 (35:17):
Don't gravitate to black and white. The younger generations are
about color and action and effects, and it's you know,
our films have become more about that, so you have
less and less of a patience threshold for black and
white films. Eventually it is going to be Diehard and

(35:37):
Elf and other films that kind of take the banner.

Speaker 2 (35:42):
Ray, You'll remember, is a new father, and Matt's talk
of fathers and sons strikes a chord with him. Ray's
own father is also his hero, a man he admires
precisely because he has never sought the spotlight, but has
always found contentment through consistent, simple acts of kindness and
by appreciating what they call the little things in life.

(36:06):
But much like George Bailey's attempt to explain to his
father why he can't take over the building and loan,
Ray always felt he was built differently than his dad,
that he had to pursue a very different path. Now
raising little Pablo, Ray wonders which path is the one
he should be guiding his own son down?

Speaker 5 (36:29):
It is?

Speaker 2 (36:29):
Then, Ray recalls a movie often described as his father's
generations wonderful life.

Speaker 23 (36:35):
But you never know when you make something that it's
going to you're still going to be talking about it
twenty five years.

Speaker 3 (36:39):
From Is that the one you hear about the most?

Speaker 15 (36:41):
Field Dream?

Speaker 5 (36:41):
I mean, you've been a sad I hear about it
a lot.

Speaker 2 (36:43):
This is Kevin Costner, the actor, talking to Seth Myers,
the comedian.

Speaker 23 (36:48):
Field Dream certainly has been characterized, at least by me
as our generations.

Speaker 5 (36:53):
It's a wonderful life.

Speaker 8 (36:54):
Yeah, it's it's such a lyric film and a beautiful
film and father son stuff that I feel, well, whenever
you can nail that, it does have a timeless quality.

Speaker 5 (37:02):
Yeah, And that's a hard one.

Speaker 23 (37:04):
For us to nail in real life, and I think
it is about things that go and said between people.

Speaker 24 (37:08):
My father's name was John Kinsella. He played in the
minors for a year or two, but nothing ever came
of it. Moved to Brooklyn in thirty five, married mom
in thirty eight. Was already an old man working at
the naval yards when I was born in nineteen fifty two.

Speaker 5 (37:24):
My name's Ray Kinsella.

Speaker 2 (37:26):
Kevin Costner plays an idealistic American baby boomer and named Ray,
a father and every man reaching middle age with regrets,
mostly about his relationship with his greatest generation dad, who
he feels like George Bailey's has died too soon.

Speaker 24 (37:45):
I'm thirty six years old. I love my family, I
love baseball, and I'm about to become a farmer. But
until I heard the voice, I'd never done a crazy
thing in my whole life.

Speaker 2 (37:57):
Through heavenly intervention, Ray is given a second chance and
a new direction at midlife.

Speaker 12 (38:06):
Hey, Dad, you wouldn't have catch.

Speaker 21 (38:16):
I'd like that.

Speaker 11 (38:20):
I admire my dad so much.

Speaker 2 (38:22):
Yet another creative call between Kurt and Ray.

Speaker 11 (38:25):
He was right, he told me from the beginning he
had it nailed.

Speaker 6 (38:28):
He was like all you need to do is find
a steady living and then live below it.

Speaker 11 (38:32):
And my dad never lived to work. He worked to live.
He's a great guy. He still gives me advice to
this day.

Speaker 6 (38:38):
But I see him get so much joy out of
all the little things in daily life. And I would
love to do that if I weren't working around the
clock to make sure we get to still live.

Speaker 11 (38:48):
In this house next month.

Speaker 6 (38:50):
But yeah, I should have followed my dad's advice. I
just wasn't built that way.

Speaker 18 (38:54):
This whole podcast thing that you're kind of coming up
with is it's kind of odd. This might be a
real good way for people to understand why this is
actually important because they're seeing your journey, your journey through
this topic and through understanding why this film is.

Speaker 3 (39:16):
Important to you, what this film's meant.

Speaker 18 (39:17):
To you, why this film has relevance to people today.
And I think a lot of people think that maybe
it doesn't, maybe this film has kind of this pass
the shelf life a little bit. But I think really
this film is even more relevant today.

Speaker 6 (39:33):
The notes I keep hearing from friends that listen to
this are like they keep trying to get me back
to okay, but like what's the point.

Speaker 11 (39:41):
What's the point?

Speaker 6 (39:42):
I don't want to tell people the point, but obviously
in a tenth episode, people have taken a nine episode
journey and now they want to know, all right, where
are you going with all this? You know?

Speaker 8 (39:53):
So yes and that way.

Speaker 18 (39:55):
This actually is possibly a good tenth episode because it
could do a lot heavy lifting. It could summarize well
and point to possible futures and why this film is
important and why we need it.

Speaker 2 (40:11):
Ray remembers another movie that, like Field of Dreams, is
often considered a modern torch bearer, keeping the ethos of
wonderful life alive today in a new way, a movie that,
it occurs to Ray has a personal connection for Ruth
and him.

Speaker 25 (40:29):
And when you're standing in the snow.

Speaker 16 (40:31):
You look like an angel. How are you doing this?

Speaker 5 (40:35):
I told you. I wake up every day.

Speaker 26 (40:39):
Right here, right in Punk Satani, and it's always February two,
and there's nothing I can do about.

Speaker 1 (40:47):
We all remember Andy McDowell in the comedy hit groundhog Day.

Speaker 3 (40:50):
When you look back on your career, Andy, is there
one that stands out more than the others?

Speaker 15 (40:55):
One of those?

Speaker 21 (40:56):
I would say for me, groundhog Day was a perfect movie. Yes, Yes,
it's sort of like a wonderful life and that you
watch this movie and it makes you realize how gorgeous
life is and how to be a good person. There's
a really deep message to it.

Speaker 26 (41:14):
I mean, I'm a kid, I don't understand how banks work.
And here's Jimmy Stewart explaining it to me very clearly.
One version is a community model where everybody's helping everybody,
and the other one is a model of rapacious, selfish capitalism.
And I think I had an opinion about it, if
not before, from that moment on it seemed to align

(41:38):
with the way I looked at the world.

Speaker 2 (41:39):
Ray has reached out for insights to Danny Rubin, the
writer of nineteen ninety three's Groundhog Day. Just before his
big hit, Danny was feeling frustrated with the pace of
achieving his dreams, like Ray is now.

Speaker 26 (41:55):
I had a general feeling that everybody reaches a point
in their life where they're kind of stuck. It might
feel like I'm bigger than the job that I have.
I should be somewhere else in my career, and that
sort of was the starting point for me of that character.
I think when Harold got a hold of it and

(42:17):
worked with Bill Murray on it. He needed to make
a broader leap and kind of establish that Phil was
a very self centered person and have that be something
for him to overcome.

Speaker 15 (42:34):
I'm sorry, what was that again.

Speaker 2 (42:37):
I'm a god, God, I'm a guy.

Speaker 5 (42:41):
I'm not the guy.

Speaker 12 (42:42):
I don't think.

Speaker 2 (42:44):
Phil Connors is an American baby boomer of the yuppie variety,
played by Bill Murray the actor who through cosmic intervention
comes to see a deeper meaning to life.

Speaker 26 (42:58):
I sort of interpret did it as Phil just seeing
himself and everyone else in the world was serving him
and is in relationship to him and his desires. What
transformed for him is he starts to see people outside
of himself. He sees that other people have lives and

(43:24):
also sees that everything that he does influences them, and
that gives him not only a sense of empathy, but
he actually sees a better life for himself. He's happier
because he's not just trying to fulfill his own satisfactions
and goals, but he sees himself in relationship to the community.

Speaker 13 (43:47):
I speak to your friends, thank you.

Speaker 5 (43:51):
How is that for you to man?

Speaker 8 (43:54):
You touch me?

Speaker 12 (43:55):
Thanks?

Speaker 8 (43:55):
There thank you.

Speaker 5 (44:05):
It's nothing, ma'am. I had to tie around the jack.
Just be comfortable, all right, give a minute.

Speaker 2 (44:10):
Uh Ri has a second motive for his conversation with Danny,
a romantic gesture he hopes may remind Ruth of the
wonderful life they are living.

Speaker 11 (44:20):
You've already given me a favor.

Speaker 3 (44:21):
I want to ask a really annoying one.

Speaker 6 (44:23):
Would you stay on for thirty more seconds so I
can just introduce you to my wife.

Speaker 3 (44:26):
She'll just say hi and then we'll get off the zoom.

Speaker 26 (44:29):
Okay, what's your name?

Speaker 12 (44:31):
Ruth?

Speaker 26 (44:32):
Ruth my favorite aunt.

Speaker 3 (44:34):
And when we started dating thirteen years ago, we basically
before we knew we were going to be an item.
We from two different coasts, like watched and we're on
the phone with each other doing Groundhog Day and that's
how that became.

Speaker 11 (44:45):
So if you wouldn't mind, I think.

Speaker 8 (44:47):
She would really like it. Hold in one second place?

Speaker 5 (44:50):
Thank you?

Speaker 26 (44:51):
Yeah, Hey, ruths Oh my god, it's been ages.

Speaker 11 (44:58):
I just didn't want to remember.

Speaker 2 (45:00):
That is Danny.

Speaker 1 (45:02):
Danny Rubin Craig, just you know about our situation.

Speaker 11 (45:06):
Yeah, but I'm not gonna reborn with it.

Speaker 6 (45:09):
But yeah, I told him at the top that we
watch it every year and yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:13):
Like when we were a long distance we would literally
watch it via speaker phone like a ridiculous, so stupid.

Speaker 11 (45:20):
That's so sweet.

Speaker 26 (45:20):
It's like you're looking at the moon at the same time.

Speaker 1 (45:25):
Phil Murray relived his life the same time over and
over again.

Speaker 6 (45:29):
No, we're huge fan.

Speaker 2 (45:31):
That's the movie.

Speaker 3 (45:32):
Yeah, thanks, nice to meet you.

Speaker 26 (45:34):
Nice to meet you both.

Speaker 5 (45:35):
Actually, thanks to.

Speaker 4 (45:38):
Hang in person one day. Let me fan.

Speaker 3 (45:41):
Out please, Danny, thank you very much. I'll let you
know when the podcast is coming out.

Speaker 26 (45:48):
That sounds great. Congratulations on the whole thing. It sounds interesting.

Speaker 6 (45:52):
Yeah, thank you.

Speaker 11 (45:52):
Hopefully we land it, we land that plane.

Speaker 8 (45:55):
Hi, honey, I'm mom.

Speaker 2 (45:58):
Something comes along a few weeks before some of you
are hearing this podcast that makes raised problems begin to
seem self indulgent, lacking perspective. Maybe the best word would
be unimportant.

Speaker 8 (46:16):
So I got a call from the real George Bailey.
You mentioned who's building Bailey Park. I got I got
a call from his assistant. Yeah menso case yep, But
I just got a call from his assistant and he
had a massive heart of attack.

Speaker 21 (46:34):
Oh my god.

Speaker 8 (46:35):
Yeah, Okay, he's alive. He was in critical condition, but
every day he was making it was a stronger chance
that he would end up being okay. And at this
point it's been I think about five days, and so
they're watching him closely, but it looks like he'll be okay.

Speaker 16 (46:53):
Oh my god, oh Manette, it makes.

Speaker 8 (46:56):
Me sick, but you know, it was the first the
first thing I thought of is speaking of like the
importance of every individual, like the reality of whether working
people will actually have the opportunity to have homes in
this town. You know, it's dependent on this guy. And
Seneca Falls is basically going to find out for a

(47:17):
while until he recovers what life is like without their George,
and it's.

Speaker 16 (47:22):
Going to be different. Dad, Oh my god.

Speaker 25 (47:26):
Yeah, and maybe.

Speaker 16 (47:30):
Wow right, he sounds like such a good man, and
you know he can.

Speaker 25 (47:37):
He can be very proud of his life, it sounds like,
and the impact that he's had, and this is it, right,
It's like, you know, we all have the ability to
have impact, and for some of us it might just
be on a few people, right that we could be
mentored or coached or helped in some way along the way,
and in others that could be a bigger impact because

(47:58):
you're able to do bigger things like tell stories, get movies,
get books out there, get you know.

Speaker 16 (48:04):
Podcasts out there.

Speaker 25 (48:05):
And I mean so I think the I mean we
all have impacts in different ways.

Speaker 8 (48:11):
Because on social media, we want to have a hashtag
stay of George Bailey campaign. We're going to try to
encourage people to share stories about the George Baileys in
their lives. Betweet them or whatever, Yeah, and create foster
recognizing your George Bailey.

Speaker 16 (48:28):
And what a great way to get get positivity out there.

Speaker 2 (48:32):
Three weeks later, on Friday, October thirteenth, twenty twenty three,
Menzo is surrounded by his beloved family when he joins
us up here. Those counting on affordable housing in Seneca
Falls will now discover what their world is like without

(48:53):
their George Bailey. Life is all a matter of perspective,
as it was for George Bay and Evince says they
often do force that perspective on Ray, who realizes he
has had a wonderful life no matter what happens with
his finances, no matter what happens with his youthful dreams,

(49:15):
no matter what happens with this podcast, And much like George,
he receives support from his loved ones when he needs
it the most.

Speaker 8 (49:24):
I thought getting George Bailey was essentially being made by
one force or another to sacrifice like your your dreams
that you want in your youth and and sort of settle.
And it's interesting because you know, Mary, hash is a
verb too, and it's essentially being strong enough and good

(49:49):
enough to be the George Bailey, but being made like
the second the second banana, and in her case it's willingly.
But but like with Ruth, it's sort of like we
were both George Bailey's in a way with the big
dreams and that's when we met. We were going to
support those and the having the kid and then the
pandemic and all this stuff definitely had a disjointed effect

(50:13):
on like we went all in on who was the
big moneymaker and what was needed, and that, as usual,
meant that the female out of the partnership, you know,
was doing the full time childcare stuff and I was
earning the dollars. And she comes out of the last
five years in some ways having been married Bailey when
she like, I ain't no Mary.

Speaker 16 (50:37):
You know, we all as we as we are born,
as we grow up, we all have hopes and dreams,
and some of us have those exact hope and dreams
that we were born with realized, right. And then you
have other people who you know, maybe their hopes and

(51:00):
dreams that they realize end up better than what they
ever dreamed, right. And I kind of feel like that's
part of what this story is all about. It's like
George had hopes and dreams, and as much as he
tried to make all those happen at certain periods of time,

(51:25):
life had other plans for him. And I think ultimately
they end up being better plans because, like we all know,
it's the people you're surrounded with, your family, who you love,
who love back. Those are the things that really make
you rich and really make your dreams what they are.

(51:47):
And you know, I just see. And when you have
someone and your ex could never have been this for you, okay,
But when you find that person who is your true partner,
sometimes that means they take a little bit of a

(52:08):
back seat because you're taking the forward seat for all
kinds of reasons. And then sometimes life happens where then
they come up and they take the front seat, right,
And that's what true partnership is so, I think that
and that's what George Bailey has had. He ends up with,
and that's what he found out. He was a rich man,

(52:31):
not because you know, he built big things or went
great places or you know, put his name on from
you know, building a loan or whatever. Right, it was
because he had Mary and their children and this life
surrounded by friends who would do anything for him, because

(52:52):
he was that kind of person and deserved that.

Speaker 8 (52:55):
You know, that involves acceptance because if you never, like
if you refuse to let go of the dreams, are
refused to embrace what the universe has given you, there's
some level of acceptance that seems to be.

Speaker 16 (53:06):
Well acceptance are sometimes I think you may be referring
to or does it feel like to you selling out
or that's what I thought.

Speaker 8 (53:16):
I don't think that anymore. I think you uh, but
there is that question.

Speaker 16 (53:20):
Right, I mean, I think you're you know, you're in
a relationship where you are finally happy and supported and
you have someone that's an equal and you know, and
you've got a beautiful son who is a joy, and
lots of family around you, guys that love you. So yeah, George,
I think you think you did okay, and you're not

(53:42):
done yet. You're not done yet, And wouldn't it be
cool if this particular podcast launched you a little bit
further on and up towards where you want to be.

Speaker 18 (53:57):
Like, to me, the heartest to watch the movie isn't
him on the bridge or in the bar or anything.
That's when he goes into the house after finding out
that Uncle Billy's lost the money and then them tearing
the town apart and not being able to find it,
comes into the house and everyone's all happy and Christmas

(54:18):
and the kids are like, hey, Dad, he's been to
wreath and he's like what read?

Speaker 2 (54:21):
You know, courage again talking with Ray and you know, Mary.

Speaker 18 (54:26):
Knows something's going on, but George, being the guy and
being a non communicative nil, isn't telling her anything, you know,
and he's trying to keep it all inside and thinking
that there's got me a way he can fix it.
That's part of the problem is thinking that you alone

(54:47):
can fix the problem. You know, there wouldn't have been
much of a movie if George would just talk to Mary,
because she's a smart one, you know, George, he's the
fire brand, spark plug. He's being the guy that gets
things going. He's the guy everyone likes. Murry is the
one with like the wheels turning the background, think, Okay,
how gonna make this happen? What are we going to do?

(55:10):
She's just trying to do some short stuff that he
isn't good at, which all this logical planning and thinking
and and investigating, and Mary gets on the phone starts
making calls. You know, she's like, she's like burning down
the phone lines.

Speaker 6 (55:24):
And you know, oh, man, Ruth would have so much
to say on that. What you just said sounds so
much like her and me. She's really been that person
for me, even though she did. It's funny because we're
both we're both like head in the clouds dreamers, but
she's proved herself better at actually focusing in on like

(55:48):
all right, what what what actually needs to happen here
to keep you know, the train on the tracks.

Speaker 1 (55:55):
I just have never stopped believing in our potential and
so I just don't feel like we have hit our
potential yet. And so it frustrates me to know that
we are both capable of living in that dream of
our childhoods and we're not there yet. And yes, this
is good, but this isn't what I wanted.

Speaker 2 (56:15):
We're inside an honest conversation between a married couple, Ray
and Ruth, one of many like this they've been having lately.
After hitting a financial skid. Much like George Bailey on
Christmas Eve nineteen forty five, Ray and Ruth are doubting
themselves and each other.

Speaker 1 (56:36):
I remember this one week after Babo turned one, and
I was so ready to just be in business again,
like working working hard and focusing on something and using
my natural God giving skills whatever those are, and creating
platforms and ideas and whatever. The pandemic hit, and then

(56:57):
suddenly there was economic turmoil, and basically two years of
pandemic really like really really broke my spirit, Like I
just could not. I really really really struggled with being

(57:18):
proud and fulfilled with motherhood and house wifery as I
like to call it, you know, because I actually am
very very good at both, but they do not fulfill
me in the way that these other things do. In
a very simple way, I just felt like I lost

(57:39):
myself and my identity. But I gave you and Bablo everything,
and I'm glad that I gave Bablo everything. But I
was resentful that I had given everything. I remember telling you, like,
how come I have to give up my dreams and
entertainment but you don't. And I remember you telling me
like I deserve it, you know, like I don't know

(58:03):
if you do.

Speaker 27 (58:04):
Essentially well, first of all, we remember back in two
different realities. Often, Oh yeah, for sure, and like what
you just said doesn't sound like anything that I would
ever say, or a sentiment that I believe that, Like
as recently as turning forty a couple of years ago, I.

Speaker 1 (58:20):
Felt like you were so happy.

Speaker 11 (58:24):
I searched my soul.

Speaker 27 (58:25):
I just felt like I like I had gotten everything
that I wanted and if.

Speaker 6 (58:29):
I if I died early, it was okay because I'd
lived this really great life.

Speaker 11 (58:33):
And it hurts me.

Speaker 5 (58:36):
You and I just look at things differently.

Speaker 11 (58:37):
And we always have.

Speaker 27 (58:38):
And you've always got a slightly dark, in my opinion,
darker view of everything.

Speaker 11 (58:42):
And you think that I see things with rose colored glasses.

Speaker 1 (58:45):
Yes, because you were raised in the Land of Oz
and I was raised in Kansas, black and white city.
That's why.

Speaker 2 (58:54):
Ruth Bucker was a child of Mexican immigrants who came
to Chicago. She headed to New York City to turn
herself into a media personality, as she long dreamed when
she met Ray. They've been together for thirteen years. Ray
loved that Ruth was the only person besides himself who
believed he could do it as much as he did.

(59:16):
But Ruth never wanted to be a Mary Hatch, the
unsung hero. She too was a George Bailey with big dreams.

Speaker 1 (59:24):
Like in my head, you know, five years ago, I
imagined ourselves in the present now having a company that
breaked in at least three hundred thousand, just not for
ourselves and net income, but like as you know, like
because that's how much I believe in you Ray, Like
anything that was like Peanuts. I was like, oh, like

(59:45):
me and Ray running doing a company working together, like
watch our world, Like it's just that's why. And then
and then the pandemic happened, and then motherhood happened, and
then depression happened, and all of a sudden, I'm just like,
wait a minute, what's happening?

Speaker 20 (59:59):
You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (01:00:00):
I just I lost focus, I lost sight, I lost everything.
And I feel so bad about that because I felt
like I could have definitely done more, but I just
couldn't you know? I was not capable.

Speaker 16 (01:00:13):
I was not Wow.

Speaker 1 (01:00:14):
But also it's like, why didn't Mary and why didn't
Ray ever fucking notice how bad Ruth and George were doing?
Because you guys were so busy in your bliss. That's why. Yeah,
which is fine and normal and a very normal marriage
issue that happens, but it's most likely caused to women,

(01:00:38):
and women like me. You know, we hear about cases
like me, like she could have been somebody, but she
gave up her life for her successful husband.

Speaker 27 (01:00:47):
So it's like it does bother me that, Like I'll
think back to some time in our past and I
see it very like romantically and sentimentally, And every time
you talk back, you're like, oh, yeah, we didn't even
have like a box spring under the bed at that point.

Speaker 11 (01:01:03):
It was just a mattress on the floor.

Speaker 6 (01:01:05):
I've been like, it's been like I haven't had frills
in fourteen years since.

Speaker 27 (01:01:09):
I met you, and it's just like, well, Jesus, I'm sorry,
I'm such a First.

Speaker 1 (01:01:13):
Of all, the thing is that like you romanticize struggle,
whereas I don't. I get angry at struggle. I do
not like to struggle, like I struggle often, and I
don't want to romanticize it.

Speaker 16 (01:01:26):
After they resolve the day where everybody puts all the
money in the basket and all this kind of stuff,
you know, kind of can move on to his happy ending.

Speaker 2 (01:01:36):
Right Vlorie again, raise mom.

Speaker 16 (01:01:39):
I predict that he realizes based on how Mary Mary
caused the town to come together after making a few
he realized what great networking skills she has, and how
and how level headed he is and what a money
manager says it can make for the coo of the

(01:02:02):
building loan because he's still going to be the dreamer,
you know, well that's just who he is, right.

Speaker 8 (01:02:10):
So that prediction is interesting because my favorite, I've asked
everybody what would you have seen for the sequel? Or
what would you hope happened to George and Mary the
Bedroom falls folks, and wide array of predictions. My favorite
as of now has not found a place in the
podcast yet. I think it was Wendell James in New
York Times, but he pointed out and this is kind
of interesting, like, so, okay, George maybe gets prosecuted for

(01:02:35):
the inability to find that eight thousand dollars, but he's
got a great face and a lot of character references.
He's not going to do any time.

Speaker 11 (01:02:43):
Gets off with.

Speaker 8 (01:02:43):
Probation, but it's pretty sure they're not going to let
him run Banker of Savings Loan ever again. And I
said to myself, that would be the greatest thing that
ever happened to George. The real happy ending would have
been the year after. And he literally that weight comes
off his shoulders because this much as he wants to
sacrifice for the community, he can't do it in that
way anymore. And now his future is unwritten. And who

(01:03:06):
takes over the building and loan. It's not gonna be
Uncle Billy, I say, Mary ends up running that thing by.

Speaker 16 (01:03:14):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, he does it.

Speaker 25 (01:03:16):
And then she's got, you know, the stable income.

Speaker 16 (01:03:20):
So what do you think he goes home to do?
Then if the waits off his shoulders, now he can
he can fly.

Speaker 8 (01:03:28):
Well, I don't know who takes care of the kids.
But of course one option is always in the nineteen
fifties there when he's in his mid forties, he go,
you know, he goes back to college, and he does
get that architect.

Speaker 25 (01:03:39):
Agree, yes and yes, And the first thing he does
is practice on.

Speaker 16 (01:03:47):
His own home mmmmmm right, And it turns out he's
way better at fixing up the Granville Home than Mary.

Speaker 8 (01:03:57):
It turns out they're much better in each other's roles.

Speaker 3 (01:04:00):
In this age of endless sequels and shared universes and franchises,
why has there never been a real serious sequel to
Wonderful Life? And what would your vision for a perfect
Wonderful Life sequel look like?

Speaker 28 (01:04:11):
Well, first of all, why are you asking me about
a sequel?

Speaker 2 (01:04:13):
Ray is talking with Sarah and her sister Perene, granddaughters
of Wonderful Life short story writer Philip van doren Stern,
the holders of control for the most part over a sequel.

Speaker 3 (01:04:25):
Well, because I go chronological, and when I got to
the end, I thought to myself, you look at the future.

Speaker 28 (01:04:30):
I'm honestly, they never thought about a sequel. Our mother
was really hopeful that somebody could take the core ideas
of it and make something really for the twenty first century.
America is very different now, but the message of the
movie is still something you need to hear. Imagining not

(01:04:51):
having been born, imagine not having been given the greatest
gift of life to run that thought experiment in your mind.
I mean, that's extremely powerful idea and that could all
be applied in a very contemporary, urgent setting of our time.
And I don't know if anybody can do that or
not be neat if somebody really created came up with
a way to do it.

Speaker 3 (01:05:12):
I pitched to you, you go Godfather to style with it?

Speaker 5 (01:05:15):
You do you do.

Speaker 3 (01:05:19):
His father's story, him and Uncle Billy, why they created it?

Speaker 11 (01:05:24):
Oh what happened to young Potter?

Speaker 3 (01:05:28):
And then you interweave it with Susu heading to New
York to talk to Uncle Wayne right in the nineteen sixties,
and maybe maybe Violet comes along to help, and then.

Speaker 28 (01:05:38):
You know, well, I submit a treatment.

Speaker 3 (01:05:41):
I actually have a late job interview in between my podcasts.
I'm not able to make my full year's incomes. I'm
always landing like another gal.

Speaker 29 (01:05:51):
You know what it's like to be kind of I mean,
I didn't want to use the word hustle, but there's
a bit of a hustle, right, you know. And it's
a weird thing to be a creative person who's with
the products of your mind. That's what he was doing
and I that's what I'm hearing.

Speaker 3 (01:06:05):
Yeah, no, crazy respect for him, crazy respect for you all.
Thank you it's so nice to have formed a relationship
with you, and I hope it continues in it.

Speaker 28 (01:06:13):
Well, we're really keen to see this podcast, and I
you know, I love your interest in this and your
questions you ask, and it will be avid listeners.

Speaker 3 (01:06:22):
Thank you both. I expect that you're going to be
You're going to really like it. But if that's not
the case, no, you're gonna really like it, So that's
going to be the case.

Speaker 2 (01:06:31):
Look, I know what became of George and Mary and
the rest. Their world is very different from yours because
of the butterfly effect of their existence. There's seemingly small
acts over their lives that rippled through their universe. But
we have rules, and one of them is not to

(01:06:53):
share information from other parts of the multiverse. It's a
free will thing we've had on the way to loophole
that by bringing you the story of the first half
of George's life through the movie Wonderful Life, that was
the part you need to know. For the rest of
the story, well, you'll just have to use your imagination.

Speaker 11 (01:07:17):
I will let you tips a little later.

Speaker 30 (01:07:19):
Give I can show you my favorite.

Speaker 11 (01:07:23):
A little my favorite movie.

Speaker 3 (01:07:25):
Okay, it's a Christmas movie.

Speaker 1 (01:07:29):
This movie like Christmas movie?

Speaker 6 (01:07:34):
Yeah about what's it all about? Yeah?

Speaker 30 (01:07:39):
Well that's what I just spent the last year trying
to figure out.

Speaker 2 (01:07:43):
Pablo is the fourth generation of his family to be
introduced to Wonderful Life, and although he is too young
to understand the movie yet, ray he can't help himself
and tries anyway. As Ruth rolls her eyes, he.

Speaker 30 (01:08:02):
Said, what the susage, Well, if they're worried about him,
because he's he's feeling really sad about himself. He doesn't
think he's he doesn't think he's helped anybody in life.
He doesn't think he matters or anyone cares about him.

Speaker 11 (01:08:20):
He's very sad.

Speaker 12 (01:08:22):
See this whole movie.

Speaker 30 (01:08:23):
He ends up getting to find out that actually he
really helped a whole lot of people in the town,
just by being kind of a nice guy, just doing
what he could when he could.

Speaker 20 (01:08:34):
You know, like if your friend.

Speaker 30 (01:08:37):
Doesn't have a toy and you lend him your toy
and it makes them happy, and doing that with a
whole bunch of people a whole bunch of times in
your life makes you makes a big difference for all
those people that you did those little things for.

Speaker 11 (01:08:55):
And now he's scared at the heights.

Speaker 6 (01:08:59):
Yeah alright, well, I just wanted to show.

Speaker 8 (01:09:02):
You the beginning you got.

Speaker 11 (01:09:05):
We gotta get you to bed. Hey, I know it's
a little for it.

Speaker 30 (01:09:11):
You'll watch it when you're a little older.

Speaker 3 (01:09:15):
You mean all of it.

Speaker 1 (01:09:17):
Yeah, out, Hey, Mommy.

Speaker 20 (01:09:27):
Mommy, God, it's Daddy and Pablo, and we want to
thank you for another day on this planet, and another
day under this the roof of this house, and another

(01:09:49):
day with Mommy and.

Speaker 10 (01:09:51):
Everybody that we love.

Speaker 20 (01:09:52):
And he's got to continue to bless us and protect us.

Speaker 2 (01:09:58):
As for how things will turn out for Ray and Root,
your guess is as good as mine, as a character
from raised childhood obsession Back to the Future put it,
inspired in part by wonderful life.

Speaker 18 (01:10:10):
Your future hasn't been written yet, No, it's had.

Speaker 7 (01:10:15):
Your future is whatever you make it.

Speaker 10 (01:10:17):
Oh make it.

Speaker 11 (01:10:17):
I put one.

Speaker 2 (01:10:19):
Both of you, those of you who have taken this
journey with me. As I said in the first episode,
you live in one of the universes where George Bailey
was never born. So if that bothers you, there's only
one solution. You have to become the George Bailey. Oh

(01:10:42):
I know what you're thinking you're only one person. What
can you do? Never forget each life touches so many
other lives. Each seemingly small act of kindness you do
will end up affecting everyone else on Earth long in
to the future.

Speaker 5 (01:11:01):
You have a lot of value.

Speaker 6 (01:11:09):
This series is dedicated to the memory of Menzo Case.
George Bailey was never born. Visit Savegeorge Bailey dot com
to join the mission. There you'll find links to works
by this episode's participants. Learn more about how to celebrate
George Bailey Day on Saturday, December ninth, and annually the
second Saturday of December hereafter by hosting your own Wonderful

(01:11:31):
Life viewing party. Tell your friends to listen to this show, subscribe, like, comment,
and post about it on social media hashtags Save George Bailey.
Subscribe to our patreon to hear uncut interviews and bonus content.
Podcasts also available on YouTube. iHeartMedia presents a double asterisk
iHeartMedia co production in association with True Stories Created, written

(01:11:55):
and directed by Joseph Kurtanngfer and Renovashwski. Kurt Angfer producer
and supervising editor, Renoviashlsky, producer and journalist Elizabeth Marcus, editor,
Roy Sillings narrator George Bailey. Theme song by Carolyn Sills
Buyer albums soundtrack composed by Zachary Walter by his albums

(01:12:15):
and the original soundtrack to this podcast available wherever you
get your music. Mallory Kenoy, co producer, writer's assistant, archival producer,
in fact checker and co writer for this episode. John
Autry sound engineer, additional editing, sound design and mix. Executive
producers Dave Cassidy, Kurt Angfer, Lindsay Hoffman and Bethann Macaluso

(01:12:37):
for iHeartMedia, John Duffy for Double Asterisk, Ruth Vaka for
True Stories, Raynovashwski for Double Asterisk and True Stories, Elizabeth
Hankoch Associate producer Brandon Lavoy and Ryan Pennington. Consulting producers
Keith Sklar, contract Legal, Peter Yazi Copyright and Fair Use Legal,

(01:12:58):
Mattie Acres archival specialist, Ron Kaddition, Benji Michaels. Publicists Kavyasanthanam
and Marley Weaver. Marketing and promotions. Art and web design
by Aaron Kim. Interns were Kyra Gray, Emma Ramirez, Eva
Stewart and Taia Wilson podcast license for Philip Van doren
Stearns The Greatest Gift provided by the Greatest Gift Corporation.

(01:13:21):
Their attorney is Kevin Koloff. Recorded at David Weber's Airtime
Studios in Bloomington, Indiana. This episode featured, in chronological order,
Lindsay Hoffman, myself, Raynovishlsky, Ruth Vodka, Jimmy Stewart, my uncle,
not the actor, Ed Sharlack, Tom Tenowitch, Kurt Engfer, Hannah Ermei,
Matt Asner, Ed Asner, Pete Davidson, Jason Sudeikis, Brendan Fraser,

(01:13:45):
Danny Rubin, Menzo case Val Stewart, Novashlski, Laura Robinson, Perene
Robinson Geller, and Pablo Anthony Novashwski Voka. The cast of
Wonderful Life and the brief voices, music, and artistry of
Hollywood public persons and news media professionals, including Barbara Copple
via clips used under the still existing legal doctrine of

(01:14:06):
fair use. The Potters are working on that one, though
the iHeart Pitch scene was reconstructed from real audio recorded
during that time and one line of new audio from
Lindsay Hoffman based on an email from Bethann Macaluso. My
phone call with Kurt Angfer was mostly our original conversation
and a little scripted from actual conversations we had previously.
Same with the call with my mom Valerie. Same with

(01:14:28):
the conversation between Ruth and I. Audio of the Asner
Center Wonderful Life Table reads of twenty twenty, twenty one,
and twenty two provided by Matt Asner and the Asner
Center with sign off from the Greatest Gift Corporation, with
thanks to their attorney, Kevin Koloff. My uncle Rocky Duffin's
funeral provided by his widow, Sharon Duffin, my aunt. My
short film premiere party when I was fifteen was shot

(01:14:51):
and provided by my dad, Tony Novosselski. Watching Wonderful Life
with Pablo was the actual raw recording as it happened.
He didn't know I was recording and was not coke.
He's so smart and charming, isn't he? Exciting?

Speaker 5 (01:15:02):
Future for that one.

Speaker 6 (01:15:03):
If you're in Seneca Falls, visit the Wonderful Life Museum,
the Women's Rights National Historical Park, Menzo Cases, Beloved Generations Bank,
Cafe nineteen and Seneca County Habitat for Humanity. If you're
in Brownsburg, Indiana, visit the rain of Vashelsky Museum, sure
to be built any.

Speaker 11 (01:15:20):
Day now right.

Speaker 6 (01:15:21):
If you're in Peak of Illinois, God help you, huh.
Go to Double asteriskmedia dot com to hear our other
limited run podcasts, Who Is Rich Blee After the Uprising
with a bold new season in Saint Louis coming summer
twenty twenty four and Origins Birth of a Pandemic. And
subscribe to True Stories New weekly Everybody Has a Podcast

(01:15:43):
with Ruth and Ray. If you were feeling like you're
on the bridge, please call the AFSP's Suicide and Crisis
Lifeline by dialing nine to eight eight into your phone,
or contact the crisis text line by texting seven four
to one DASH seven four to one. Consider donating to
you are volunteering with AFSP or your local Habitat for Humanity,

(01:16:04):
and make George Bailey proud. We're not affiliated with them though.
Copyright twenty twenty three Double Asterisk Ink by brid