February 17, 2025 • 48 mins
Kris Bowers hops on the pod to talk The Wild Robot Score, Kendrick's Half Time Performance, working with Kobe Bryant, Bridgerton and more!
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Wake up? Did you time to go to work?
Speaker 2 (00:05):
All right?
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Can we talk about wake up?
Speaker 3 (00:07):
Back in it?
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Get it that?
Speaker 3 (00:09):
Ye wake up?
Speaker 1 (00:11):
I get it that, get it that goal with everyone's
saying that up next, it's not my father. The vocals
are goal that making that hit. It so fucky that
my neighbors a movie the way then that role they
stay in them people. Baby, you know I'm making everybody
upset because we thest we get breast.
Speaker 4 (00:24):
And I know, gonna get bread, Donna get bread, gonna
get breath, gunning get bread, donning get breathe bread?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
What's going on?
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Everybody?
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Should?
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Boy Straw had goofy ak juju your movie guy. And
I'm here with a very special guest today. I'm here
with the composer of The Wild Robot, Chris bauers Man.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
How's it going well?
Speaker 4 (00:46):
Man?
Speaker 3 (00:47):
Thanks for havingpreciate it.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
You have no idea how I'm excited and how excited
I am to talk to you today. Like I can't
even like usually I'm really good at my words. I'm
stumbling right now, bro, Like, first off, you made me
cry like hit like Trevor is my witness, Like you
had me and my daughter crying the first time I
saw this movie.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Oh, she's seven, So.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
I'll be happy to tell you that last year my
daughter had her first two experiences where she watched the
movie and like actually cried.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
The first one was If with Ryan Reynoldson, you know,
John Krasinski, and then the second movie was The Wild Robot.
And if The Wild Robot was released a little earlier,
that would have been her. So, you know, it was
it was great that we got to share that moment,
especially talking about a film that's so targeted towards parents
and you know parents, just parenthood, survival, things of that sort.
(01:45):
And I feel like a movie like that is so
important for like kids and parents to watch because it
allows kids to see that their parents have struggles as
well as like, you know, kids have struggles of just
kind of like figuring out their way in the world and.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
Things like that.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
And me and I talked to Chris quite a few times.
We spent like quite some time in Annissy for the
film Testner, and we talked about just how much the
score and the music just carries like a lot of
the emotional depth of this film. So you talked to
me about just kind of like being approached for this
movie and like, like, what was your thought process when
you got started.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
Yeah, so Natalie Hayden and Mike Noblock from Universal are
the ones that they initially approached me, and they're also
the ones that I think shared my name with Chris
as a possibility to score the film. And they sent
me the book and I remember reading it. My daughter
was like six months old, and so I was reading
it to her largely, and yeah, I just kind of
saw a lot of myself in this experience of Roz,
(02:41):
like me and my wife just you know, this early
journey into parenthood and all that. And then I went
and sat down with Chris Sanders and Jeff Herman and
Chris talked from the very beginning about wanting music to
be this character in the film and how he would
carve out space for music and really needed music to
help tell the story worry in these moments that didn't
have much dialogue or no dialogue at all. And it
(03:05):
really became clear in that first conversation that music needed
to be unashamedly emotional and had to have strong melodies
and themes to convey a lot of these ideas and
moments where words aren't being spoken. That music kind of
has to have melody for people to latch on be
able to latch onto something. And then also because I
(03:25):
was starting so early, it was like two years before
the end of the process. I was starting with like
black and white pencil sketches, and so it was in
the concept dart and so it was really relying on
Chris and his guidance and my own imagination and emotion
to kind of figure out how to get into it.
Speaker 4 (03:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Yeah, man, I'm just saying, like, hearing your story and
like how you were approached to do this movie, it's
honestly just something to behold because you know, I have
a huge affection for creatives in the movie industry, just
like everywhere of people like from La and I found
out like you were born and raised in La borner
rais in La as.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Well Compton, California.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Oh, so I was just telling, Wow, there's like a
lot of kinship like happening right here, you know, especially
like you know, the both of us like being black
men in this industry in the space, Like it makes
me feel just kind of like a sense of pride
where I'm just kind of like this is one of
our own that has so much like emotional depth and
like it's able to articulate what these people want to
like carry this film now before we like fully like
(04:24):
jump into it. Like you know, at the time of
this recording, the super Bowl was yesterday and another La
like a little Compton, a Compton native, like you know,
just put on one of the best performances, in my opinion,
in super Bowl history. Like like what are your opinions
on that when you were watching that as an LA native?
But did you have a sense of pride and you know,
especially as a musician, that must have like really piqued
(04:44):
your interest.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
Yeah, so much pride. I mean not only see Kendrick,
but also the choreographers. Is this woman charm Le Donna
and I went to high school with her really yeah,
like be able to see like what she did as well,
like what the two of them did together. I think
the whole time watching it, I just was like I
can't wait to keep one this over and over again
to like study it. Yeah, he does these things that
are always so layered and nuance is targeted. Yeah, and
(05:08):
like you know, watching again and like recognizing like how
the American flag is kind of you know, the way
that their position is like the fact that Americans like
built on the backs of black people. And then that
moment where like that overhead shot and you see all
the people like laid down in like kind of the
the body outline, Like, yeah, like there's all these all
the symbolism that he's really mindful with using. That's just
(05:31):
really brilliant, Like you know, Sam, yeah, Uncle Salm inspired choice.
Speaker 2 (05:36):
Yeah, when I saw that, I hollered.
Speaker 5 (05:37):
I said, oh, like.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
Even with just kind of like you know, because I
find myself to be not necessarily intellectual, but I'm able
to like pick up on things because I you know,
maybe intellectuals can be considered this, but I like to
label myself as a professional overthinker, overthink everything. Yeah, so
there was like a moment where, you know, Sam Samuel
Jackson as Uncle Sam is saying, like, you know, I
(06:01):
think he's like echoing the narration of what America thinks
it should be at someone who's building America and the
culture of what it is at this.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Person who's kadot. And there's a moment where he says.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
Nah, that's too loud, too brash, like you need to
clean it up. Five seconds later, Humble comes on and
I'm just kind of like, yo, like that, like that symbolism,
that allegory, the metaphor. I'm just like Kendrick is thought
of it all. I just thought of it all, and like,
you know, I don't want to get too far to
like the Drake things or everything like that, you know,
but it's just pretty hilarious where you know, he played
(06:33):
with you know, this Grammy winning song and just like
should I do it?
Speaker 5 (06:37):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (06:40):
You know, obviously Kendrick is going to have himself like
a hell of a year already, like Grammy, super Bowl,
and then he also has a movie coming out with
Trey Stone and Matt Parker.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
Yeah, yeah, get that.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
Right, Trey Parker and Matt Stone. Trey Parker, Matt Stone,
and they're doing like a musical together. He's not going away,
so you know, the thing might have said game over
at the end of that halftime performance, but I think we're.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
Going to see some more like yeah in the quarter.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
Half time exactly. But I want to talk to you
more about just kind of like, you know, the Oscars
are coming up. You're nominated for Best Original Score and
The Wild Road, but I believe it's the most nominated,
you know, animated Film in a while, yeah, best sound,
best uh you know, animated Film obviously, and then Best Score.
But you yourself have been nominated for multiple like Oscars
(07:29):
at this point.
Speaker 5 (07:30):
Crazy.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
I just heard thirty three and I'm just like, which
is great? Like the height of where I'm gonna go?
I'm probably not. I don't know what that is, but
I think it's like fascinating how you know your background
like obviously, like you're a composer. A lot of people
know you for as like a composer, but you know,
you won an Oscar as a director co directing The
(07:56):
Last Repair Shop, which.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
I watched last night, by the way, Oh thanks for watching.
Speaker 1 (07:59):
Fantastic stuff, like really really fantastic, Like I really love that.
You know, you see that title and I think, like, oh,
you know, it's just about the Last Repair Shop again
simpleton talking here. But you know, I love how the
vision and what you were saying was very clear because
you being a musician from Los Angeles, like you could
tell it came from a very personal place of like
(08:20):
kids who like either can't afford like instruments, can't get instruments,
and then like you know, if they do have them,
it's like kind of raggedy, and you know, you told
the story of like not just them getting those things repaired,
but also repairing their lives that are attached to it. Yeah,
and not only did you talk about the kids, but
you also talked about the people who were doing the
repairing itself. How music just kind of connects all of
(08:42):
these things and the instruments are just, for lack of
a better word, instruments, Yeah, to kind of like let
those things out. You talk to me about like getting
nominated as an for an Oscar, winning the Oscar for
that like first time, and just like the experience of
you know, getting swept up in this world.
Speaker 3 (08:58):
Yeah, I mean it's pretty surreal. I definitely the I
feel like with the Lost of Prayer Shop and then
Concertos of Conversation being nominated for those things felt really
amazing because it was like, these stories are very personal
and our attempt, like you were saying, to lift up
people that I haven't really been thought about or sometimes
(09:18):
I overlooked a.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Lot of the people, and that was people of color.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
Yeah, exactly. And for me, even the reason why I
did the Last of Prayer Shop is because when Ben,
my co director, asked me if I had heard about
the repair shop. Not only had I not heard of it,
but I also had never considered as a kid growing
up here in LA that relied on the music rooms,
that relied on the music instruments that were in those rooms.
When I would play them and they were out of
tune or not working and they were sent for repairs
(09:43):
or the piano was like fixed the next day, I
was just like, oh cool, they fixed it, Like okay,
Like now yeah, And like these people were silently and
like in this invisible way really integraled to me becoming
who I am today and like me having this outlet
to release my emotions through music, and so in a
lot of ways, it was like saying thank you to
(10:03):
them and lifting them up in that way and really
demonstrating what they do for this city and so to win.
I just remember my core memory of that night is
like seeing those technicians that have been working those shops
for you know, years, without any sort of recognition on
anywhere near this level, dancing at the Vanity Fair party
next to like Amaztone.
Speaker 5 (10:23):
And like all these other celebrities.
Speaker 3 (10:27):
It was just like such a magical moment.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
So yeah, it's absolutely insane, man, because again like the
fact that like you directed it, you also scored it
as well.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
Yeah, I'm assuming.
Speaker 5 (10:36):
Yeah, well actually I co scored.
Speaker 3 (10:37):
I wrote the end credit sequence of music, but then
I for the rest of the film. I co scored
it with a young composer named Kayte Richardson. It's also
a Southern California native.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Yeah that's incredible.
Speaker 1 (10:47):
Now you weren't obviously you always were. But what I
found very interesting about you, and it's great that you're
nominated for an animated film, you also wanted to be
an animator.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
Yeah that's right. Yeah, talk to me more.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
About that, because I feel like you kind of have
this crawl rhads moment where you could have just went
one way, or you could have went the other way,
and like, you know, maybe you could have been the
next Peak doctor or something.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
It's basically like when I was a kid, my parents,
you know, they're kind of parents that were like, we're
gonna put you in all these extra curriculars and like,
as soon as you have a desire, we're going to
like do everything we can to get you in the
space to be able to express that or explore it.
And they, you know, really couldn't even afford it in
a lot of times, and a lot of it was like,
you know, my grandparents helped pay for like finding places
(11:31):
that they could afford, or like finding a scholarship with
that kind of stuff, and so they when I was
really young, they drove me to music school every weekend
and then also the cartooning school. And then I went
to an art high school out here called LASAK And
my plan was to get in for music and switch
to visual arts because I wanted to be a cartoonist.
But then I that freshman year. I remember my core memories,
(11:55):
Like after freshman year, I had the choice of either
going to this Stanford Jazz Workshop that I'd gotten into
or going to this Santa Monica City College like animation
class that I got into, and I chose the Stanford
Jazz Workshop, And like it was kind of this moment
where I'd never really even looked back at animation in
terms of pursuing it in that way, but it was
(12:16):
that much of a passion.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
For me, Dude, to see that's crazy because you know,
me being in la like, you know, especially in Compton,
like there really wasn't a lot of visible options in
music of that type of thing. Like I remember when
drum Line came out, everybody wanted to be a drummer. Sure,
there's a lot of programs for that, right, But me,
my big thing was basketball, Like basketball was kind of
like my main thing because you know, like in the hood,
(12:38):
like it's like you're either going to make some music
or you're going to like play ball, and so playball
was kind of like my thing because I'm not musically
inclined like you are. But you know, obviously I've always
had this deep love for film, but I didn't know
it at the time, and you know, there's not really
a lot of programs in the schools that I went
to that kind of like put that in front of
me where I could say, like, wow, this is what
I love to do. But I feel like my cross
(12:59):
roads moment came when I was in high school. I
was a captain of the basketball team, but I really
loved this drama class that I was taking so much
so that I took the class like three years out
of four. Because they was like, oh, what elective would
you like it, I said, drama. Each time I got
really close to this drama teacher's name is Philip Miller.
Shout out to Phil and he kind of opened my
(13:19):
eyes to you know, storytelling and like playwriting and screenwriting
and things of that sort.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
We used to sit there and talk about film for hours.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
And I remember it was my senior year and I
was kind of like not falling out of love of basketball,
but just kind of like wrestling with is this something
that I wanted to do? And I remember I got
the lead in Twelve Aged Jurors and it's some straight
out of a movie. I literally we had a basketball
game and we had opening night the same day.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Wow, and I had to choose which one to do.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
You know, we didn't have an understudy for twelve Ang
jurs so I ended up choosing that that was kind
of like the kick that I needed to kind of like,
you know, pursue my love for film, and like it
was like the first door opening where I said, Wow,
there's more for me out there. And people also call
me Troy Bolton for the rest of I always think
about that, But I think it's funny how, you know,
(14:12):
this life works out in a way where you know,
if we have the options kind of in front of
us and we get the power to choose, then I
feel like that's what kind of makes where the people
that we become that much more worth it, right, and
like you're obviously who you're you're meant to be, but like, yeah, yeah,
the thing that like I'm interested in is like having
that background in animation. I know you say you haven't
(14:33):
like drawn in a while, But do you see yourself,
because you know as a director, as a composer, do
you see yourself doing like a visual piece of like
media like a film or something like that that you
would score direct anything like that.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
Yeah, for sure. I mean I definitely think that, Like
it's the two are very linked for me. Like it's
almost like I really feel like everybody has synesthesia like
on some level. Yeah, And for me, it's hard for
me to like really know what I want to write
musically unless I have something I'm looking at. And so
even if I'm writing music that's not to a film,
actually make like a mood board or like pull some
(15:07):
images to like kind of have like a texture that
I'm working with. And so I definitely have a lot
of thoughts about writing music that has a story that
I then go and try to like you know, create
some sort of visual narrative to that thing.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
Yeah, have you watched Intergalactic like then?
Speaker 3 (15:22):
I actually never saw the ki cutting thing.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
Yeah, I think we want to talk about synesthesia.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
Yeah, that one right there, Like I bought the vinyl,
Like I watched it like one hundred times. I think
when it comes to the marriage of music and visuals,
you know that and things like Spider Verse and things
like that, it's those are just so such inspired work
and like I'm so obsessed with it.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
So if you ever get a chance, watch that. It's fantastic.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
So I want to talk about kind of like the
main theme of this movie. Right, we kind of talked
about on the way up here, but I feel that
the main theme of the film is I could use
a boost. Yeah. You kind of hear that throughout a
lot of the film in many different ways when you know,
to reflect the characters how they're feeling moment. But what
I want to know is how exactly did you come
up with the main theme of this because I, you know,
(16:07):
doing some research on you, I know, like you came
to Chris with like a version of it, and like
it wasn't necessarily the one that he was looking for,
is that right? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (16:15):
Yeah exactly. Yeah, Basically, like When I start a film,
I usually like to watch it a few times, and
first I take notes on like what I think themes
will be, and like what moments, like each scene is
kind of speaking to so that I can figure out
how many themes I need to write and all that
kind of stuff. And then at the same time, I'm
looking for a moment that speaks to me on this
(16:37):
visceral level where I just have these emotions that are
so clear that I know how to get to it musically,
just because like that's kind of my relationship with music,
is just expressing how I feel. And so I watched
the movie and like that migration sequence is the moment
where I was like, especially being a dad, as you know,
I just was like, oh man, like the idea of
saying goodbye to my daughter and like all this stuff.
(16:58):
It brought up all these emotions. Yeah, And so the
first time I wrote something, I envisioned dropping her off
of college, and I wrote this piece of music that
made me emotional and I played it for Chris, and
Chris pointed out that it felt too light and it
felt too sweet, and it didn't have the complexity and
the tension of that moment. For roz and bright Bill,
(17:20):
and I remember going back and listening to it and
realizing that the version in my head that I was
I was thinking about of dropping my daughter out of
college was like very positive.
Speaker 2 (17:30):
The version you wanted.
Speaker 5 (17:31):
He's the version I wanted, that positive one.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
But yeah, and also like she was only one at
the time, and like so I hadn't even got to
that point yet where I mean, now she's almost three,
and like she's telling me that she doesn't want me
to do something, and.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
Her grow up a little bit push back, a little bit.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
Exactly pushed back. She has her on autonomy. She has
moments where she's like, I didn't like that you did that,
Like I want, I want you to do it this way.
But at one she wasn't even talking yet, and so
it was very easy for me to kind of stay
in this bubble of like being this perfect parent, like
because or at least like I'm only criticizing myself but
not having her criticize me. And I think realizing that
(18:07):
inevitably I'm going to get to this point where she
has a lot of opinions about who I am and
how I am and how I was as a parent,
how my wife and I were as a parent like
and God forbid getting to a point like ros and
bright Bill where like I've done something that she has
a tough time forgiving me for Like really, I remember
going back and looking at my daughter and envisioning a
(18:27):
version of dropping her off of college where like we're
not saying I love you and like we're not saying goodbye,
like she's walking.
Speaker 5 (18:34):
Yeah, I never want to think about that.
Speaker 3 (18:36):
Yeah, And like being in that moment of like I
don't want to think about this, but then getting to
that place emotionally where I'm starting to like envision that
as a possibility is kind of what unlocked this emotion
that led to the piece of music that's there. And
then once I wrote that, Chris was like, this is
the right emotion, and he actually was like, now can
you write away from picture and just write the music
(18:57):
to let the music kind of develop on it. And
then they decided to kind of animate and edit that
sequence to the music, which was really awesome for him
as a collaborator. Give me that freedom and.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Trust Yeah, I would love to pull up that scene, Greg,
if you could like pull that up that I can
use a boot scene just to like give it a
watch because I feel sure I've watched it, but I
remember the first time watching that scene. I believe it
was a treuvor. You can like like fact check me
on this, but it was like one of the first
scenes they showed at anisy, right, Like they showed the
full like scene, and you know, that's a pivotal point
(19:32):
in the movie. But I usually when I find that
studios show a pivotal point in the movie, there's more
to show. Yeah, And that's that, right, There was the
hook for me, right, you know, just this parent who's
letting go of their child. And I love the way
you described this because it shows that you have to
confront something that you necessarily don't want to think about. Yeah,
And that what I think is the best part about
art is that it makes you like wrestle with things
(19:55):
you don't necessarily think about or don't want to confront.
And so watching that scene was like already special because
you know, being a dad so far away from home
and like I was already in this mode of like
I'm doing this for her, but like I'm kind of
far away from her right now, in a whole different
part of the world. And you watched it together. I
was just like, shit, this is like you said, God forbid.
(20:16):
You know, we're still talking and like she looks at
me in my time as a parent fondly, but you
know we're gonna have moments where it's a hard relationship.
The movie is about a robot that becomes a mother
to a goose. Gooses have ness and what do they
call a parent whose kids leave them empty nesters? And
(20:36):
so I kind of like like made this TikTok of me,
like making this realization to that score. And so the
score is like dramatically playing out my thought process when
I tell you, man, this has been like I think
it made my Spotify rap. I think it made my
Spotify rap for sure. That So my girlfriend hasn't watched
(20:59):
this movie yet, and she's another of three. So when
she heard the will I will you be here when
I get back and the no, she like hadn't seen
the movie broke down. She broke because tuber kids are
in college woes.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
It's like two years out. So she's just kind of like, oh,
the last one, yeah, for sure it is on the
way out. No, mhmm, I'm glad you're going where you belong.
Speaker 4 (21:26):
R I I am.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
The amount of things that come together in this scene. Though.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
The voice acting is pitch perfect, the music is.
Speaker 3 (21:34):
Perfect, the animation it looks, the animation, it's.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
Just this right here, Like I hope for every single
you know, real they show up the oscars, they show
this scene. Ready, I guess I have to be.
Speaker 3 (21:57):
M hmm ye.
Speaker 1 (21:59):
Tell me, please please tell me. Did you like cry
on the keyboard like composing this?
Speaker 3 (22:03):
I at, Yeah, definitely. I always feel like I kind
of have to give myself a real emotional place because
like what's interesting is that I'm not I think kind
of what you said. The reason why I love storytelling
and movies and music is because I find that it's
like a place for me to put my emotions where
like I don't I don't really express my emotions like
outwardly just in my life. But if I'm working on
(22:26):
a movie or like writing music, something else unlocks. It's
almost like this like kind of way to get there.
So it definitely has to be emotional for me to
feel like it's right.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Yeah, yeah, you can sell that, uh, sell your instruments
like with the tears on it, like leave stains. Oh
my gosh, Oh my gosh, that's a nine time Any
(23:04):
winning movie right there.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
All right, cut it off, cut it off, cut it off,
cut it off, cut it off.
Speaker 3 (23:21):
The last show she's like by herself, one with the cliff,
with that feather man.
Speaker 1 (23:25):
It's like it's like a dramatic cut to where it's
like she's alone.
Speaker 3 (23:28):
Yeah the time that is it?
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Like, Like I think it's like kind of a great
balancing act of like doing something that's as big as
this and then shifting to just kind of silence. Right,
you just come down from this emotional hide that this
scene has and then we're realizing this is only half
of the movie, you know, so there's so much more
emotional to like, I just I just love Like again,
(23:54):
we saw this anisy.
Speaker 5 (23:55):
I was like, well, what else is there?
Speaker 1 (24:00):
So seriously, if you guys haven't seen The Wild Robot,
like this is a great scene to kind of like
introduce people to ghet them. On top of that, what
I find interesting is like, so you created this piece
and then everything else just kind of fell out of that.
Speaker 3 (24:11):
Yeah. Like it's basically like the way that I've always
approached composing kind of since I studied, Like my favorite
teachers really encouraged me to have one idea and then
everything kind of is born from that one idea, right,
and so like I'll create these themes and then every
other melody is kind of inspired by that theme in
(24:34):
some sort of way, or like the chord progression and
all that kind of stuff. And so that's the the
reason why I wanted to approach it first, was because
then I essentially stress tested, where I'm like, will this
this theme still work in like some of the most
quiet moments, will this theme work? And like other big moments,
And the big stress test for this one for me was,
(24:54):
you know, I used to watch these movies when I
was a kid. We've talked about with like how music
works and movies, and like I remember being able to
listen to the score outside of the context of the
movie and be able to feel the shape of the
movie just with the music. And then I also remember
moments where a main theme comes back at the very
end of the movie or like it's emotional climactic part
(25:14):
of the movie, and I get these chills.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
About this the one where don't tell me it's I
have everything I need? Yeah, like that one, it's so good,
Oh my gosh, man, when she puts them in his heart. Yeah,
and then you hear it come back and it's somewhat
more heroic sense as well, and so like, you know,
I loved how you know when we first introduced the
(25:39):
theme and like it's full entirety, it's it's more of
a somber, more of a like softer, like parental maternal
version of it. But then you get to this moment
is this heroic kind of like crescendo, and I remember
just being in my seat like, oh my, I'm glad
you mentioned that.
Speaker 4 (25:55):
Man.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
Thanks. Yeah, yeah, I feel like it's you know, when
we tried in that moment and you have that feeling
of like, oh man, this really works, then then it
feels like, okay, that theme is going to be good.
So I kind of have to jump around like that
to see if it matches the arc of the or
if it can like really hold up against the arc
of the whole story. And so yeah, the whole thing
kind of grows from those little melodies.
Speaker 1 (26:15):
Now, you know, going back to like parenthood because that's
the main theme of this movie and being a girl
dad yourself. Like after you've created this movie, you've seen
the reception of it, and maybe like you've got a
little bit emotional yourself kind of seeing the final product
being put together. Yeah, was there a moment where you
kind of was looking at your daughter, who's now what
three should be three and a couple of weeks, you
know what, did you have a moment where you were
(26:36):
looking at your daughter and you working on the film
and you haven't seen your film's now completely like changed,
you know how you view your daughter now?
Speaker 2 (26:44):
Is that?
Speaker 1 (26:44):
Yeah, that's that happens.
Speaker 3 (26:46):
Yeah, definitely. I think that like in the beginning, it
was looking at moments where she's like becoming a bit
more like independent and like self reliant, yeah, and having
a feeling of pride, but also like this kind of
sadness or these bittersweet little moments even in the first
(27:06):
three years of her life where it's like, oh, like
she's doing that by herself now, or she's not saying
that thing anymore, Like you know, these like transitions that
you don't know or gone before they're gone. But also
like I think for me watching her watch the movie
and also like recognize the music, I think it's something
(27:28):
that's really emotional for me because of my own relationship
with music, Like from the time I was a little
kid to have moments where like the other day I
was just on my phone checking a clip for something
and the score came like I could use the boost
came on and she was in the other room with
my mother in law.
Speaker 5 (27:44):
She was like, that is that a watching the Wild Robot.
Speaker 3 (27:47):
She's like, and she knows that that's the melody, and
like I can sing her the melody and she's like,
that's the Wild Robot. Like the fact that she's it's
that clear for her. She already has this like connection
between like a sound and this movie and the fact
that it's it's something I worked on. It's really really amazing.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Yeah, that's got to be crazy because now she gets
to grow up, you know, with a movie that's about
in a way YouTube, you know, you guys can kind
of like, you know, make a direct parallel to the
both of your relationship. And it came at a time
where she's just so young and she can have all
these memories attached to that.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
It's got to be super special.
Speaker 1 (28:20):
Yeah, And I've gotten a taste of that, just a
tiny taste of that, you know, when you know, DreamWorks
asks me to voice do a single line as a
character in the movie Ruby gimm a teenage crack, just
like it was a fun little cameo. Like I remember
a hole sting of screening for Pussing Boots and they
said like, hey, like, you'll be great for this. Like
(28:41):
one character has one line in the movie, and I said, yeah, sure,
why not, And it's just his name is the Jym teacher.
He has one line and it's he's a legend and
he gets hit with the ball. But the thing was, man,
I've milked the ever loving hell out of that, Like
one moment I was like, yeah, man, I'm like one
of the main stars of the movie with Jane Fonda, or.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
Like I'm like right up her lines of Koshy.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
And I remember like I laid it on so thick
that whenever we will see like billboards and things of
that sort. My daughter would see it, and I believe
she was around like she was maybe like six at
the time, and she kept going, Oh, that's the daddy movie.
That's the daddy movie.
Speaker 5 (29:19):
It's my movie.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
It was just a real moment where I was in
bed one morning and she likes to wake up earlier
than I do on the weekend, so she like played
minecraft or whatever, But I remember she goes straight to Netflix,
and it was like right when it dropped the Netflix,
I remember waking up to the sounds of me saying
He's a legend, followed by a ball hitting me over
and over and over again.
Speaker 3 (29:39):
Well she was just playing once.
Speaker 1 (29:41):
Oh it was just laughter, and it was like one
of the sweetest moments. I was like, I'm glad, like
I got to have that with her.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
You know, it's not like.
Speaker 1 (29:52):
Creating a piece of music, but it's like creating something
that we get to share.
Speaker 3 (29:55):
Yeah, and also like show she was so proud and
excited and also just like for her to want to
just have that moment like by yourself to be able
to watch it, that's yeah, man, that's emotional.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
So you're only thirty five, and I heard someone say
that you have the resume of a sixty year old,
So there is so you've done so much in such
a short amount of time. Like I just said, like
this movie just won nine Annies, which is like, oh
my gosh. Yeah, Like, can you pick a moment in
(30:25):
your career that like because out of all these moments,
like you were just like it's hard to imagine, like
you're not getting excited at any of them. If you
pick one moment where you're just kind of like, damn,
like this is what I get to do.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
Yeah, I mean I genuinely feel like every I feel
very blessed and fortunate, though like every year there's kind
of that moment like I can go back to. I mean,
this movie, I feel like it's one of those moments.
The first time I worked with Ava, and like the
different projects I've worked on with her, I think it
felt like those moments like winning the Oscar last year,
(30:58):
also Green Book, like be on stage for the Oscar
that year, like that was my first introduction to this
whole like award circuit campaign stuff, and like you know,
being on that journey with Mahershela and like watching.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Him, you know, him how to play piano.
Speaker 3 (31:13):
I mean, I gave him lessons for it, you know,
yeah piano.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Whatever.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
Interesting because it's funny because it reminded me of like
what you're talking about yourself with being an athlete. Like
the thing I found so fascinating with him is that
our first lesson was just supposed to be like an hour,
and it was I think like two hours plus of
him just playing a scale over and over again, and
I actually had to like physically tell him to stop
when I needed him to like think about to like
(31:44):
do move on to the next exercise, primarily because he
was so focused on just like I'm gonna play this
scale over and over again, like and like you would
mess up and start over again. But it felt like
the only other time I'd seen somebody that dedicated and
focus to like the process before you say it, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
We counted the.
Speaker 1 (32:01):
Yeah, yeah what two three?
Speaker 5 (32:05):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (32:09):
But yeah, I like, you know, like I I was,
I was let's say, like physically challenged skit when I
was younger in terms of like I played sports, was
very bad at it and like and was chubby, Like
it was not you know, but I feel like, you know,
any people I meet that are athletes, like you get
this other type of like mental discipline that I really
(32:32):
didn't develop until later in my life, or I developed
with the piano, but like in terms of physical activity,
like it's amazing to see people apply that to other things.
And so Rehearsal was really able, I think, to apply
his like athletic mental stamina and focus to learning the
piano in like three months of being able to play
these like kind of difficult sections of music. Just with
(32:53):
that attention to detail, it's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
And when we talk about detail, you can't leave out
like Kobe Bryant out that conversation, which worked with him
on mus Right the Showtime documentary, and like as an
La native, I'm sure you as well.
Speaker 2 (33:06):
Like huge Kobe Bryant fan.
Speaker 1 (33:07):
Like you know, I'm very jealous that you got to
see him while he was alive, and you know that
was just kind of like an emotional gut punch when
I found out. I've always wanted to talk to him,
especially after in his post career he was doing things
like basketball what you won the Oscar for and again
worked with John Williams.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
Who will talk about him in a second.
Speaker 1 (33:27):
I know you look up to him as well, but
talk to me about kind of like working with Kobe
on that and kind of like building that relationship and
how that helped your career as a result.
Speaker 3 (33:36):
Yeah, I mean it was huge. So the thing that
was amazing with Muse is that one the only reason
why I was on it is because one of the
producers was a friend of mine from a high school
all star jazz band, and he remembered that I talked
about wanting to be a film composer. And he came
up to me after a show and he was like,
do you want to work on this Kobe documentary? And
I was like, yeah, sure. I figured it's like him
and some other young people like following Kobe. And like
(33:58):
a week later he was like, okay, so can you
come to new and like sit down with Kobe and
meet him? And and he was like, everybody that works
on this project, if you're the composer or the editor
or like cutting a trailer, you have to sit down
with Kobe in his office and talk about your process
and your craft and he kind of assess whether or
not you are as serious about your craft as he
is with basketball.
Speaker 2 (34:17):
He test people like everything, yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
Like and it. But the thing I loved about it, it
was like an easy test because ultimately it's just like okay,
like what like talk about why you love what you
do and then like and then for me, it was
like you gotta tell me to shut up because like
I'm just going to talk about next like hours. Yeah. Like,
over the process of working on that movie, I found that,
like I would send him a cue. He wasn't even
(34:40):
the director but like he I'd send every piece of
music to him and he would always be like, I
think it's great, but like what do you think? Like
you have to work until you think this is amazing.
And there were times where I would be in a
hurry and I'd send him a cue and I just
like check this out, let me know what you think,
and he'd be like like not good enough, Like tell
me like where, like what was the process? Like how
did you arrive here? And so if I wrote him
in an email that was like a page long or
(35:02):
two pages long, he'd be like standing ovation email amazing.
Speaker 5 (35:05):
Like the Lakers.
Speaker 3 (35:11):
He was like that, like like into the process. And
that continued. So I worked with him where I scored
his audio books and like he did these shorts for
ESPN and like all these things, and he would always
I remember sitting, uh listening to the narration being recorded
for one of the audiobooks for Felice or shod like
in the studio, and he was like, so, you know,
the score for this has to be, you know, on
(35:32):
the same level as ET Well Kobe. He was like,
you know, it has to be better than ET And
I was like, oh yeah, and He's like you know,
I'm not kidding with you, right, but I feel like
that was the the what he wanted. Like he he
always equated John Williams to Michael Jordan. He was like,
I used to study Michael, like I study every one
(35:53):
of his moves, Like you need to be able to
tell me why it is that, Like if I ask
you why John Williams of music works, I want you
to be able to break it down for me on
like a very detailed level, why it functions and why
it works. And the fact that he, like you know,
called John on a regular basis to like talk to
him and like learn about his process as a while.
But like my last interaction with him, which makes me emotional,
(36:16):
I wrote a violin concerto in that premiere in twenty twenty,
and I sent him an email inviting him to the show,
and something in me was just like I need to
acknowledge the fact that, like I didn't have a space
other than working for him to write intricate, detailed orchestration
(36:38):
music orchestrational music. Most of the projects I worked on
were like a little smaller and didn't really want that sound.
But he was like, you know, you have to go
for this bigger sound John Williams and all of that,
and so I wrote him this long email that basically
was like, I wouldn't have been prepared for this violin
concerto had I not been working for you for the
last like however many years. And I really owe my
ability to do this to like the space you carved
(36:59):
out for me as a composer. And he was like, oh, man,
like we'll be there, like I can't wait to see
the show, and then like it was like a week
later that he passed, and so it was, yeah, definitely
like a very emotional thing to like feel like I
had this moment to at least like give him that
thank you before before he passed. But at the same time,
(37:19):
it's just really well, but yeah, I definitely wouldn't be
the composer I am, or even be ready for something
like The Wild Robot had I not worked with him
for those years and been in that relationship where like
I was reminded of my own obsession over my craft.
Speaker 1 (37:35):
I'm just gonna let you know, my mind stopped, like
when you describe Kobe and like, you know, just like
his craft and his process and the way he helped
you get there. And I feel like, you know, again,
I'm getting emotional because like again, Kobe is like one
of my one of my idols, is that the way
he approached life. You know a lot of a lot
of times you see athletes and they'll just kind of like,
(37:56):
you know, be an athlete and then the next step
is kind of like analyst or you know, culture. It's
still in the you know, the same world biosphere, right, Yeah.
But the way I think the tragic thing about that
is that he had his hands in so many different
cookie jars, and like not not only just having his
hands like one foot in, one foot out, but he
was like dedicated to being the best at those different things.
Speaker 2 (38:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (38:17):
Right, So it must have been surprising for you to
like hear that that level of focus just wasn't part
of basketball, it was also part of the you know.
Speaker 3 (38:25):
Like storytelling, and that's that's actually what made me want
to become a filmmaker. Like, yeah, I remember he sat
down with an editor, Like when we worked on MEWS.
It was a very familiar process where like there was
you know, first it was at his offices, and it
was like this house everybody worked out of, and I
would go down there on like a weekly basis, sometimes
a couple times a week and just kind of be
updated on what they're working on in the edit and
(38:47):
an immersion in the process that I never experienced as
a composer and kind of haven't really since. And he
would sit down with an editor and the editor would
be like, oh, yeah, I'm approaching this sequence kind of
like you know, Darren Er and Osti kind of thing,
and he like, oh, who's that. He's like, Oh, this
director of Black Swan and The Wrestler. And literally the
next day he would have seen like Four Dinner and
Osci films, and like there was a time he had
(39:08):
a casual conversation about jazz, and literally the next day
he was like, Yeah, I listened to like John Coltrane's
Love Supreme. I watched some of this documentary about him,
My Restaurant's Biography. Like he just was always a sponge
for information. But I remember him getting so swept with
like the idea of becoming a storyteller and like building
these worlds and like studying the history of Disney and
(39:28):
like studying the history of like the Roman Empire to
figure out how to apply that it, like, you know,
project that against this story he was telling, and like
that level of dedication and then seeing it turned into
these successful stories or these stories that had depth to them,
it definitely inspired me to feel like I had the
capability of applying my obsessive learning curiosity to filmmaking into
(39:53):
other areas to try to like develop in that right.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
And I feel like, if I remember this correctly, news
was like highly considered You're coming out party, Like a
lot of people say like, wow, this guy's on the
scene and that's kind of like what took everything off. Yeah,
so wow, fact that Kobe Bryant is like a piece
in that incredible. And then you know him having such
a close relationship with John Williams. I'm sure you're a
fan of John Williams. Yeah, for sure, you know everything.
Have you been able to build a relationship with John
(40:17):
as well? Have you worked?
Speaker 4 (40:19):
No?
Speaker 3 (40:19):
Not built? Like I've only met him a couple of times.
Oddly enough, the first time I met him was because
of Kobe, Like Kobe or brought me to the Hollywood
Bold performance where they did deer Basketball and darted and
then I got to go backstage and like meet John. Uh.
And then there's a Juilliard thing a little bit later
that I went to and met him. So I've had
conversations with him, like very very briefly. But you know,
(40:39):
I think the tough thing is that he's you know,
I think ninety he's just turned ninety three.
Speaker 1 (40:43):
Yeah, he's got his own things going on or whatever.
Plus he's like still busy kind of like doing other
compositions and like he also does the Hollywood Bow performances
every song. I need to go to one of those, right,
It's been a dream and I haven't been able to go,
but I will got to before he like officially officially retires. Yeah,
but I did get like to see him live once
at the red carpet for the Indiana Jones and the
(41:05):
Dial of Deskin.
Speaker 3 (41:06):
Yeah, and I.
Speaker 1 (41:07):
Remember, like, you know, sneaking off to the side as
soon as the movie was over and my friend had
to go use the restaurants. So we're waiting for my
friend and they walked John Williams like out the back.
And you know, I'm never shy about things like this
was like one of the first times when the only
other time, funny enough, was Kobe Bryant when I met
him at Disneyland. Also one time where I was like,
I can't speak but with John like he's he walks
(41:31):
by and I say, like John, like I'm such a
huge fan, Like I stretch out my hand, he shakes
my hand, and I kid you not, I have witnesses
for the like at least thirty minutes after that, my
hand was just like this.
Speaker 5 (41:42):
Yeah, I just like.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
I don't know whether to wash this. I don't want
to do anything else with his hand other than what
it was doing when I shook his hand.
Speaker 2 (41:50):
Yeah, for sure, such a legend such.
Speaker 1 (41:52):
Like obviously, like you know, he scored like funny that
you mentioned Kobe and like has to be as good
as et and yeah, I told you, like one of
my four perfle fims is Eat and Large due to
the score.
Speaker 2 (42:00):
It's just it's classic.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
It's why movies are made. But yeah, so I know
we only got a little bit of time left, so
but I want to I feel like a lot of
people in my comments of this podcast are gonna be
screaming at me if I didn't bring up Bridgerton. So
I just started watching Bridgerton with my girlfriend about like
(42:22):
a couple of weeks ago, and it was this is
before I knew that you scored it. But I remember
like watching it way and we're like in a long
distance relationship, so we're watching, like, you know, on FaceTime,
and I remember it was the episode where they make
the decision for the ruse bro I swear fo god,
I swear. I was looking at my girlfriend on the phone.
(42:45):
I looked back up and was like, holy shit, I'm
locked in, so locked into this show because it was
it was such like a simple like, yeah, we're gonna
pretend to like you know, the tricks people, we are
gonna pretend to be in love. But it's such a
gut check moment for the entire like show for me,
because you know, it sets up the romance, it sets
up the stakes, and then like you know, it also
(43:07):
like speaks to the grandness of love or the beginning
of love. And I realized that that also was one
of the things that kind of like you played in
multiple instances throughout the season, so like you talked to
me about kind of like working on Bridgeton and like
that experience. It's really quickly because I know, like we
got to get out of here.
Speaker 3 (43:23):
Yeah, I feel like that first season especially, I also
really appreciated the fact that it was them deciding to
be in this relationship at the beginning, and so the
whole season was really like trying to figure out how
to make it work and like dealing with each other's
like triggers and like trauma and all that kind of stuff.
And like, to me, especially at the time of my life,
I felt like that's what my now wife and I
(43:44):
were like working through is like, you know, the real
something not like oh, like does she like me or not.
It's more of like like we're already in this but like,
you know, don't talk to me that way. I feel
like that kind of thing is like so real. But yeah,
it's kind of the same thing I was talking about
with I could use a boost. Like that is their
main love theme, and then it just kind of develops
(44:06):
over the course of the seasons as they're trying to
figure out their relationship and kind of goes through the
ups and downs of their their dynamic. But working on
the show was so amazing, primarily because they really wanted
this modern take on classical music. And you know, if
you give credit to Alex potsavas the music supervisor for
the first season, that was responsible with Shanda and Chris
(44:29):
Van Duzin for picking those like covers yeah, and love
covers by the way, Yeah, And like I remember watching
the first episode when they started dropping those covers in
and seeing the thank You next cover and being like,
it's so smart because now I know exactly how these
people feel, because like that song makes me feel, makes
my wife feel certain things, and so I have a
different context for it. But for me on the composing side,
(44:51):
it was like, oh, now I can really look at
like pop music for melodic references or rhythmic references or tempo,
because I feel like a lot of that show is
made music that people want to move to and dance to,
and music from that era isn't something that specifically makes
us want to dance. But I can like write in
that style of that era, but then pull rhythms and
tempos and grooves and melodies from this era in a
(45:14):
way that makes people connect to it a bit deeper.
So it's been fun to do the you know, three
seasons and the Queen Charlotte, and now we're working on
season four and continue to build that sonic universe.
Speaker 2 (45:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (45:23):
The first time I heard like, you know that the
contemporary music being like layered in, I was like.
Speaker 2 (45:28):
What is this?
Speaker 1 (45:28):
What I think it is? Yes, and I heard that
you worked with Alicia Keys All yeah those covers.
Speaker 3 (45:37):
Right, Yeah. For Queen Charlotte, they did an amazing thing
where they had her redo a Woman's Worth, But we
did it with this orchestra that's all women, all women
of color, and so that's like, you know, I think
it's like a sixty piece orchestra. And then they did
a video where they recorded or had them all like
dressed in the Bridgeton costume and all that kind of stuff.
But it was a really beautiful moment and I produced
(45:59):
it and helped them Bobby Gardner, the composer arranger, do
the arrangement, and so it was really amazing to be
a part of facilitating that and definitely give props to
Bobby for doing such an amazing arrangement and and really
amazing for the early to be open for us to
figure out how we wanted to do it and how
we wanted to sound.
Speaker 1 (46:18):
Okay, So final question before we get out of here
is the reason why this show is called like get
wrecked is because like I like to recommend movies like that,
I guess recommend movies and things of that sort you
being a composer, like you know, I want you to
put people on to some like either underrated or some
of your favorite like musical scores for them to kind
of listen to or even like watch the movie that
the scores are a part of.
Speaker 2 (46:38):
Do you have any for us?
Speaker 3 (46:39):
Yeah, it's I mean I think Mika Levi's somebody I'm
a huge fan of, like the Under the Skin score movie,
like really dope, really unique. I mean it's probably that
under the radar anymore, but there will be Blood is
like one that like really is amazing. Also, I feel
like Jerry Goldsmith as a composer just generally somebody that's
(47:00):
like a little older that this generation might not be
his Hiptoo, but you know his score for Alien and
like all the other movies he did in the seventies.
I think you're just iconic. Those would be the ones
that come to mind, all.
Speaker 2 (47:12):
Right for sure.
Speaker 1 (47:12):
And I already told you, like before we started rolling
like rad WIMPs.
Speaker 2 (47:16):
Yeah name dude, check that I.
Speaker 1 (47:18):
Want you to like if you can hit me up,
hit Trevor.
Speaker 3 (47:20):
Trevor, hit me up either way.
Speaker 1 (47:22):
Yeah, I would like to know your opeons on that one,
because like to be honest, like that score when I
first heard it, I kid you not.
Speaker 2 (47:28):
After I watched the movie two days later.
Speaker 1 (47:29):
I went and bought a piano, like teaching myself really
well to like, you know, play it. And to this day,
I can only play that one song, man, but I'm
going to get some piano lesson, like when people come over.
I only have the one trick poty date song from
your name, but that one was like a really big
like impact on me. But so much for talking to
(47:51):
me about this movie and about your dude. Thank you
so much.
Speaker 3 (47:53):
Thank you for having me really appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (47:55):
All right, guys, thank you so much for watching.
Speaker 1 (47:57):
And if you're watching on YouTube or like Spotify, Instagram,
wherever you watch your podcast, I make sure you even
like a comment and just hit the bell to get
notified from my other videos and things of that sort,
so that way you can't say that, oh my god,
where'd your stuff go?
Speaker 2 (48:10):
I'm here.
Speaker 1 (48:11):
Thank you for watching it. Wreck with straw had Goofy.
We'll catch you next time. We'll we talk about the
next movie.
Wake up? Did you time to go to work?
Speaker 2 (00:05):
All right?
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Can we talk about wake up?
Speaker 3 (00:07):
Back in it?
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Get it that?
Speaker 3 (00:09):
Ye wake up?
Speaker 1 (00:11):
I get it that, get it that goal with everyone's
saying that up next, it's not my father. The vocals
are goal that making that hit. It so fucky that
my neighbors a movie the way then that role they
stay in them people. Baby, you know I'm making everybody
upset because we thest we get breast.
Speaker 4 (00:24):
And I know, gonna get bread, Donna get bread, gonna
get breath, gunning get bread, donning get breathe bread?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
What's going on?
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Everybody?
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Should?
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Boy Straw had goofy ak juju your movie guy. And
I'm here with a very special guest today. I'm here
with the composer of The Wild Robot, Chris bauers Man.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
How's it going well?
Speaker 4 (00:46):
Man?
Speaker 3 (00:47):
Thanks for havingpreciate it.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
You have no idea how I'm excited and how excited
I am to talk to you today. Like I can't
even like usually I'm really good at my words. I'm
stumbling right now, bro, Like, first off, you made me
cry like hit like Trevor is my witness, Like you
had me and my daughter crying the first time I
saw this movie.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Oh, she's seven, So.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
I'll be happy to tell you that last year my
daughter had her first two experiences where she watched the
movie and like actually cried.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
The first one was If with Ryan Reynoldson, you know,
John Krasinski, and then the second movie was The Wild Robot.
And if The Wild Robot was released a little earlier,
that would have been her. So, you know, it was
it was great that we got to share that moment,
especially talking about a film that's so targeted towards parents
and you know parents, just parenthood, survival, things of that sort.
(01:45):
And I feel like a movie like that is so
important for like kids and parents to watch because it
allows kids to see that their parents have struggles as
well as like, you know, kids have struggles of just
kind of like figuring out their way in the world and.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
Things like that.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
And me and I talked to Chris quite a few times.
We spent like quite some time in Annissy for the
film Testner, and we talked about just how much the
score and the music just carries like a lot of
the emotional depth of this film. So you talked to
me about just kind of like being approached for this
movie and like, like, what was your thought process when
you got started.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
Yeah, so Natalie Hayden and Mike Noblock from Universal are
the ones that they initially approached me, and they're also
the ones that I think shared my name with Chris
as a possibility to score the film. And they sent
me the book and I remember reading it. My daughter
was like six months old, and so I was reading
it to her largely, and yeah, I just kind of
saw a lot of myself in this experience of Roz,
(02:41):
like me and my wife just you know, this early
journey into parenthood and all that. And then I went
and sat down with Chris Sanders and Jeff Herman and
Chris talked from the very beginning about wanting music to
be this character in the film and how he would
carve out space for music and really needed music to
help tell the story worry in these moments that didn't
have much dialogue or no dialogue at all. And it
(03:05):
really became clear in that first conversation that music needed
to be unashamedly emotional and had to have strong melodies
and themes to convey a lot of these ideas and
moments where words aren't being spoken. That music kind of
has to have melody for people to latch on be
able to latch onto something. And then also because I
(03:25):
was starting so early, it was like two years before
the end of the process. I was starting with like
black and white pencil sketches, and so it was in
the concept dart and so it was really relying on
Chris and his guidance and my own imagination and emotion
to kind of figure out how to get into it.
Speaker 4 (03:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Yeah, man, I'm just saying, like, hearing your story and
like how you were approached to do this movie, it's
honestly just something to behold because you know, I have
a huge affection for creatives in the movie industry, just
like everywhere of people like from La and I found
out like you were born and raised in La borner
rais in La as.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Well Compton, California.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Oh, so I was just telling, Wow, there's like a
lot of kinship like happening right here, you know, especially
like you know, the both of us like being black
men in this industry in the space, Like it makes
me feel just kind of like a sense of pride
where I'm just kind of like this is one of
our own that has so much like emotional depth and
like it's able to articulate what these people want to
like carry this film now before we like fully like
(04:24):
jump into it. Like you know, at the time of
this recording, the super Bowl was yesterday and another La
like a little Compton, a Compton native, like you know,
just put on one of the best performances, in my opinion,
in super Bowl history. Like like what are your opinions
on that when you were watching that as an LA native?
But did you have a sense of pride and you know,
especially as a musician, that must have like really piqued
(04:44):
your interest.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
Yeah, so much pride. I mean not only see Kendrick,
but also the choreographers. Is this woman charm Le Donna
and I went to high school with her really yeah,
like be able to see like what she did as well,
like what the two of them did together. I think
the whole time watching it, I just was like I
can't wait to keep one this over and over again
to like study it. Yeah, he does these things that
are always so layered and nuance is targeted. Yeah, and
(05:08):
like you know, watching again and like recognizing like how
the American flag is kind of you know, the way
that their position is like the fact that Americans like
built on the backs of black people. And then that
moment where like that overhead shot and you see all
the people like laid down in like kind of the
the body outline, Like, yeah, like there's all these all
the symbolism that he's really mindful with using. That's just
(05:31):
really brilliant, Like you know, Sam, yeah, Uncle Salm inspired choice.
Speaker 2 (05:36):
Yeah, when I saw that, I hollered.
Speaker 5 (05:37):
I said, oh, like.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
Even with just kind of like you know, because I
find myself to be not necessarily intellectual, but I'm able
to like pick up on things because I you know,
maybe intellectuals can be considered this, but I like to
label myself as a professional overthinker, overthink everything. Yeah, so
there was like a moment where, you know, Sam Samuel
Jackson as Uncle Sam is saying, like, you know, I
(06:01):
think he's like echoing the narration of what America thinks
it should be at someone who's building America and the
culture of what it is at this.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Person who's kadot. And there's a moment where he says.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
Nah, that's too loud, too brash, like you need to
clean it up. Five seconds later, Humble comes on and
I'm just kind of like, yo, like that, like that symbolism,
that allegory, the metaphor. I'm just like Kendrick is thought
of it all. I just thought of it all, and like,
you know, I don't want to get too far to
like the Drake things or everything like that, you know,
but it's just pretty hilarious where you know, he played
(06:33):
with you know, this Grammy winning song and just like
should I do it?
Speaker 5 (06:37):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (06:40):
You know, obviously Kendrick is going to have himself like
a hell of a year already, like Grammy, super Bowl,
and then he also has a movie coming out with
Trey Stone and Matt Parker.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
Yeah, yeah, get that.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
Right, Trey Parker and Matt Stone. Trey Parker, Matt Stone,
and they're doing like a musical together. He's not going away,
so you know, the thing might have said game over
at the end of that halftime performance, but I think we're.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
Going to see some more like yeah in the quarter.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
Half time exactly. But I want to talk to you
more about just kind of like, you know, the Oscars
are coming up. You're nominated for Best Original Score and
The Wild Road, but I believe it's the most nominated,
you know, animated Film in a while, yeah, best sound,
best uh you know, animated Film obviously, and then Best Score.
But you yourself have been nominated for multiple like Oscars
(07:29):
at this point.
Speaker 5 (07:30):
Crazy.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
I just heard thirty three and I'm just like, which
is great? Like the height of where I'm gonna go?
I'm probably not. I don't know what that is, but
I think it's like fascinating how you know your background
like obviously, like you're a composer. A lot of people
know you for as like a composer, but you know,
you won an Oscar as a director co directing The
(07:56):
Last Repair Shop, which.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
I watched last night, by the way, Oh thanks for watching.
Speaker 1 (07:59):
Fantastic stuff, like really really fantastic, Like I really love that.
You know, you see that title and I think, like, oh,
you know, it's just about the Last Repair Shop again
simpleton talking here. But you know, I love how the
vision and what you were saying was very clear because
you being a musician from Los Angeles, like you could
tell it came from a very personal place of like
(08:20):
kids who like either can't afford like instruments, can't get instruments,
and then like you know, if they do have them,
it's like kind of raggedy, and you know, you told
the story of like not just them getting those things repaired,
but also repairing their lives that are attached to it. Yeah,
and not only did you talk about the kids, but
you also talked about the people who were doing the
repairing itself. How music just kind of connects all of
(08:42):
these things and the instruments are just, for lack of
a better word, instruments, Yeah, to kind of like let
those things out. You talk to me about like getting
nominated as an for an Oscar, winning the Oscar for
that like first time, and just like the experience of
you know, getting swept up in this world.
Speaker 3 (08:58):
Yeah, I mean it's pretty surreal. I definitely the I
feel like with the Lost of Prayer Shop and then
Concertos of Conversation being nominated for those things felt really
amazing because it was like, these stories are very personal
and our attempt, like you were saying, to lift up
people that I haven't really been thought about or sometimes
(09:18):
I overlooked a.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Lot of the people, and that was people of color.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
Yeah, exactly. And for me, even the reason why I
did the Last of Prayer Shop is because when Ben,
my co director, asked me if I had heard about
the repair shop. Not only had I not heard of it,
but I also had never considered as a kid growing
up here in LA that relied on the music rooms,
that relied on the music instruments that were in those rooms.
When I would play them and they were out of
tune or not working and they were sent for repairs
(09:43):
or the piano was like fixed the next day, I
was just like, oh cool, they fixed it, Like okay,
Like now yeah, And like these people were silently and
like in this invisible way really integraled to me becoming
who I am today and like me having this outlet
to release my emotions through music, and so in a
lot of ways, it was like saying thank you to
(10:03):
them and lifting them up in that way and really
demonstrating what they do for this city and so to win.
I just remember my core memory of that night is
like seeing those technicians that have been working those shops
for you know, years, without any sort of recognition on
anywhere near this level, dancing at the Vanity Fair party
next to like Amaztone.
Speaker 5 (10:23):
And like all these other celebrities.
Speaker 3 (10:27):
It was just like such a magical moment.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
So yeah, it's absolutely insane, man, because again like the
fact that like you directed it, you also scored it
as well.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
Yeah, I'm assuming.
Speaker 5 (10:36):
Yeah, well actually I co scored.
Speaker 3 (10:37):
I wrote the end credit sequence of music, but then
I for the rest of the film. I co scored
it with a young composer named Kayte Richardson. It's also
a Southern California native.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Yeah that's incredible.
Speaker 1 (10:47):
Now you weren't obviously you always were. But what I
found very interesting about you, and it's great that you're
nominated for an animated film, you also wanted to be
an animator.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
Yeah that's right. Yeah, talk to me more.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
About that, because I feel like you kind of have
this crawl rhads moment where you could have just went
one way, or you could have went the other way,
and like, you know, maybe you could have been the
next Peak doctor or something.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
It's basically like when I was a kid, my parents,
you know, they're kind of parents that were like, we're
gonna put you in all these extra curriculars and like,
as soon as you have a desire, we're going to
like do everything we can to get you in the
space to be able to express that or explore it.
And they, you know, really couldn't even afford it in
a lot of times, and a lot of it was like,
you know, my grandparents helped pay for like finding places
(11:31):
that they could afford, or like finding a scholarship with
that kind of stuff, and so they when I was
really young, they drove me to music school every weekend
and then also the cartooning school. And then I went
to an art high school out here called LASAK And
my plan was to get in for music and switch
to visual arts because I wanted to be a cartoonist.
But then I that freshman year. I remember my core memories,
(11:55):
Like after freshman year, I had the choice of either
going to this Stanford Jazz Workshop that I'd gotten into
or going to this Santa Monica City College like animation
class that I got into, and I chose the Stanford
Jazz Workshop, And like it was kind of this moment
where I'd never really even looked back at animation in
terms of pursuing it in that way, but it was
(12:16):
that much of a passion.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
For me, Dude, to see that's crazy because you know,
me being in la like, you know, especially in Compton,
like there really wasn't a lot of visible options in
music of that type of thing. Like I remember when
drum Line came out, everybody wanted to be a drummer. Sure,
there's a lot of programs for that, right, But me,
my big thing was basketball, Like basketball was kind of
like my main thing because you know, like in the hood,
(12:38):
like it's like you're either going to make some music
or you're going to like play ball, and so playball
was kind of like my thing because I'm not musically
inclined like you are. But you know, obviously I've always
had this deep love for film, but I didn't know
it at the time, and you know, there's not really
a lot of programs in the schools that I went
to that kind of like put that in front of
me where I could say, like, wow, this is what
I love to do. But I feel like my cross
(12:59):
roads moment came when I was in high school. I
was a captain of the basketball team, but I really
loved this drama class that I was taking so much
so that I took the class like three years out
of four. Because they was like, oh, what elective would
you like it, I said, drama. Each time I got
really close to this drama teacher's name is Philip Miller.
Shout out to Phil and he kind of opened my
(13:19):
eyes to you know, storytelling and like playwriting and screenwriting
and things of that sort.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
We used to sit there and talk about film for hours.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
And I remember it was my senior year and I
was kind of like not falling out of love of basketball,
but just kind of like wrestling with is this something
that I wanted to do? And I remember I got
the lead in Twelve Aged Jurors and it's some straight
out of a movie. I literally we had a basketball
game and we had opening night the same day.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Wow, and I had to choose which one to do.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
You know, we didn't have an understudy for twelve Ang
jurs so I ended up choosing that that was kind
of like the kick that I needed to kind of like,
you know, pursue my love for film, and like it
was like the first door opening where I said, Wow,
there's more for me out there. And people also call
me Troy Bolton for the rest of I always think
about that, But I think it's funny how, you know,
(14:12):
this life works out in a way where you know,
if we have the options kind of in front of
us and we get the power to choose, then I
feel like that's what kind of makes where the people
that we become that much more worth it, right, and
like you're obviously who you're you're meant to be, but like, yeah, yeah,
the thing that like I'm interested in is like having
that background in animation. I know you say you haven't
(14:33):
like drawn in a while, But do you see yourself,
because you know as a director, as a composer, do
you see yourself doing like a visual piece of like
media like a film or something like that that you
would score direct anything like that.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
Yeah, for sure. I mean I definitely think that, Like
it's the two are very linked for me. Like it's
almost like I really feel like everybody has synesthesia like
on some level. Yeah, And for me, it's hard for
me to like really know what I want to write
musically unless I have something I'm looking at. And so
even if I'm writing music that's not to a film,
actually make like a mood board or like pull some
(15:07):
images to like kind of have like a texture that
I'm working with. And so I definitely have a lot
of thoughts about writing music that has a story that
I then go and try to like you know, create
some sort of visual narrative to that thing.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
Yeah, have you watched Intergalactic like then?
Speaker 3 (15:22):
I actually never saw the ki cutting thing.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
Yeah, I think we want to talk about synesthesia.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
Yeah, that one right there, Like I bought the vinyl,
Like I watched it like one hundred times. I think
when it comes to the marriage of music and visuals,
you know that and things like Spider Verse and things
like that, it's those are just so such inspired work
and like I'm so obsessed with it.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
So if you ever get a chance, watch that. It's fantastic.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
So I want to talk about kind of like the
main theme of this movie. Right, we kind of talked
about on the way up here, but I feel that
the main theme of the film is I could use
a boost. Yeah. You kind of hear that throughout a
lot of the film in many different ways when you know,
to reflect the characters how they're feeling moment. But what
I want to know is how exactly did you come
up with the main theme of this because I, you know,
(16:07):
doing some research on you, I know, like you came
to Chris with like a version of it, and like
it wasn't necessarily the one that he was looking for,
is that right? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (16:15):
Yeah exactly. Yeah, Basically, like When I start a film,
I usually like to watch it a few times, and
first I take notes on like what I think themes
will be, and like what moments, like each scene is
kind of speaking to so that I can figure out
how many themes I need to write and all that
kind of stuff. And then at the same time, I'm
looking for a moment that speaks to me on this
(16:37):
visceral level where I just have these emotions that are
so clear that I know how to get to it musically,
just because like that's kind of my relationship with music,
is just expressing how I feel. And so I watched
the movie and like that migration sequence is the moment
where I was like, especially being a dad, as you know,
I just was like, oh man, like the idea of
saying goodbye to my daughter and like all this stuff.
(16:58):
It brought up all these emotions. Yeah, And so the
first time I wrote something, I envisioned dropping her off
of college, and I wrote this piece of music that
made me emotional and I played it for Chris, and
Chris pointed out that it felt too light and it
felt too sweet, and it didn't have the complexity and
the tension of that moment. For roz and bright Bill,
(17:20):
and I remember going back and listening to it and
realizing that the version in my head that I was
I was thinking about of dropping my daughter out of
college was like very positive.
Speaker 2 (17:30):
The version you wanted.
Speaker 5 (17:31):
He's the version I wanted, that positive one.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
But yeah, and also like she was only one at
the time, and like so I hadn't even got to
that point yet where I mean, now she's almost three,
and like she's telling me that she doesn't want me
to do something, and.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
Her grow up a little bit push back, a little bit.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
Exactly pushed back. She has her on autonomy. She has
moments where she's like, I didn't like that you did that,
Like I want, I want you to do it this way.
But at one she wasn't even talking yet, and so
it was very easy for me to kind of stay
in this bubble of like being this perfect parent, like
because or at least like I'm only criticizing myself but
not having her criticize me. And I think realizing that
(18:07):
inevitably I'm going to get to this point where she
has a lot of opinions about who I am and
how I am and how I was as a parent,
how my wife and I were as a parent like
and God forbid getting to a point like ros and
bright Bill where like I've done something that she has
a tough time forgiving me for Like really, I remember
going back and looking at my daughter and envisioning a
(18:27):
version of dropping her off of college where like we're
not saying I love you and like we're not saying goodbye,
like she's walking.
Speaker 5 (18:34):
Yeah, I never want to think about that.
Speaker 3 (18:36):
Yeah, And like being in that moment of like I
don't want to think about this, but then getting to
that place emotionally where I'm starting to like envision that
as a possibility is kind of what unlocked this emotion
that led to the piece of music that's there. And
then once I wrote that, Chris was like, this is
the right emotion, and he actually was like, now can
you write away from picture and just write the music
(18:57):
to let the music kind of develop on it. And
then they decided to kind of animate and edit that
sequence to the music, which was really awesome for him
as a collaborator. Give me that freedom and.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Trust Yeah, I would love to pull up that scene, Greg,
if you could like pull that up that I can
use a boot scene just to like give it a
watch because I feel sure I've watched it, but I
remember the first time watching that scene. I believe it
was a treuvor. You can like like fact check me
on this, but it was like one of the first
scenes they showed at anisy, right, Like they showed the
full like scene, and you know, that's a pivotal point
(19:32):
in the movie. But I usually when I find that
studios show a pivotal point in the movie, there's more
to show. Yeah, And that's that, right, There was the
hook for me, right, you know, just this parent who's
letting go of their child. And I love the way
you described this because it shows that you have to
confront something that you necessarily don't want to think about. Yeah,
And that what I think is the best part about
art is that it makes you like wrestle with things
(19:55):
you don't necessarily think about or don't want to confront.
And so watching that scene was like already special because
you know, being a dad so far away from home
and like I was already in this mode of like
I'm doing this for her, but like I'm kind of
far away from her right now, in a whole different
part of the world. And you watched it together. I
was just like, shit, this is like you said, God forbid.
(20:16):
You know, we're still talking and like she looks at
me in my time as a parent fondly, but you
know we're gonna have moments where it's a hard relationship.
The movie is about a robot that becomes a mother
to a goose. Gooses have ness and what do they
call a parent whose kids leave them empty nesters? And
(20:36):
so I kind of like like made this TikTok of me,
like making this realization to that score. And so the
score is like dramatically playing out my thought process when
I tell you, man, this has been like I think
it made my Spotify rap. I think it made my
Spotify rap for sure. That So my girlfriend hasn't watched
(20:59):
this movie yet, and she's another of three. So when
she heard the will I will you be here when
I get back and the no, she like hadn't seen
the movie broke down. She broke because tuber kids are
in college woes.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
It's like two years out. So she's just kind of like, oh,
the last one, yeah, for sure it is on the
way out. No, mhmm, I'm glad you're going where you belong.
Speaker 4 (21:26):
R I I am.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
The amount of things that come together in this scene. Though.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
The voice acting is pitch perfect, the music is.
Speaker 3 (21:34):
Perfect, the animation it looks, the animation, it's.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
Just this right here, Like I hope for every single
you know, real they show up the oscars, they show
this scene. Ready, I guess I have to be.
Speaker 3 (21:57):
M hmm ye.
Speaker 1 (21:59):
Tell me, please please tell me. Did you like cry
on the keyboard like composing this?
Speaker 3 (22:03):
I at, Yeah, definitely. I always feel like I kind
of have to give myself a real emotional place because
like what's interesting is that I'm not I think kind
of what you said. The reason why I love storytelling
and movies and music is because I find that it's
like a place for me to put my emotions where
like I don't I don't really express my emotions like
outwardly just in my life. But if I'm working on
(22:26):
a movie or like writing music, something else unlocks. It's
almost like this like kind of way to get there.
So it definitely has to be emotional for me to
feel like it's right.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Yeah, yeah, you can sell that, uh, sell your instruments
like with the tears on it, like leave stains. Oh
my gosh, Oh my gosh, that's a nine time Any
(23:04):
winning movie right there.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
All right, cut it off, cut it off, cut it off,
cut it off, cut it off.
Speaker 3 (23:21):
The last show she's like by herself, one with the cliff,
with that feather man.
Speaker 1 (23:25):
It's like it's like a dramatic cut to where it's
like she's alone.
Speaker 3 (23:28):
Yeah the time that is it?
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Like, Like I think it's like kind of a great
balancing act of like doing something that's as big as
this and then shifting to just kind of silence. Right,
you just come down from this emotional hide that this
scene has and then we're realizing this is only half
of the movie, you know, so there's so much more
emotional to like, I just I just love Like again,
(23:54):
we saw this anisy.
Speaker 5 (23:55):
I was like, well, what else is there?
Speaker 1 (24:00):
So seriously, if you guys haven't seen The Wild Robot,
like this is a great scene to kind of like
introduce people to ghet them. On top of that, what
I find interesting is like, so you created this piece
and then everything else just kind of fell out of that.
Speaker 3 (24:11):
Yeah. Like it's basically like the way that I've always
approached composing kind of since I studied, Like my favorite
teachers really encouraged me to have one idea and then
everything kind of is born from that one idea, right,
and so like I'll create these themes and then every
other melody is kind of inspired by that theme in
(24:34):
some sort of way, or like the chord progression and
all that kind of stuff. And so that's the the
reason why I wanted to approach it first, was because
then I essentially stress tested, where I'm like, will this
this theme still work in like some of the most
quiet moments, will this theme work? And like other big moments,
And the big stress test for this one for me was,
(24:54):
you know, I used to watch these movies when I
was a kid. We've talked about with like how music
works and movies, and like I remember being able to
listen to the score outside of the context of the
movie and be able to feel the shape of the
movie just with the music. And then I also remember
moments where a main theme comes back at the very
end of the movie or like it's emotional climactic part
(25:14):
of the movie, and I get these chills.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
About this the one where don't tell me it's I
have everything I need? Yeah, like that one, it's so good,
Oh my gosh, man, when she puts them in his heart. Yeah,
and then you hear it come back and it's somewhat
more heroic sense as well, and so like, you know,
I loved how you know when we first introduced the
(25:39):
theme and like it's full entirety, it's it's more of
a somber, more of a like softer, like parental maternal
version of it. But then you get to this moment
is this heroic kind of like crescendo, and I remember
just being in my seat like, oh my, I'm glad
you mentioned that.
Speaker 4 (25:55):
Man.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
Thanks. Yeah, yeah, I feel like it's you know, when
we tried in that moment and you have that feeling
of like, oh man, this really works, then then it
feels like, okay, that theme is going to be good.
So I kind of have to jump around like that
to see if it matches the arc of the or
if it can like really hold up against the arc
of the whole story. And so yeah, the whole thing
kind of grows from those little melodies.
Speaker 1 (26:15):
Now, you know, going back to like parenthood because that's
the main theme of this movie and being a girl
dad yourself. Like after you've created this movie, you've seen
the reception of it, and maybe like you've got a
little bit emotional yourself kind of seeing the final product
being put together. Yeah, was there a moment where you
kind of was looking at your daughter, who's now what
three should be three and a couple of weeks, you
know what, did you have a moment where you were
(26:36):
looking at your daughter and you working on the film
and you haven't seen your film's now completely like changed,
you know how you view your daughter now?
Speaker 2 (26:44):
Is that?
Speaker 1 (26:44):
Yeah, that's that happens.
Speaker 3 (26:46):
Yeah, definitely. I think that like in the beginning, it
was looking at moments where she's like becoming a bit
more like independent and like self reliant, yeah, and having
a feeling of pride, but also like this kind of
sadness or these bittersweet little moments even in the first
(27:06):
three years of her life where it's like, oh, like
she's doing that by herself now, or she's not saying
that thing anymore, Like you know, these like transitions that
you don't know or gone before they're gone. But also
like I think for me watching her watch the movie
and also like recognize the music, I think it's something
(27:28):
that's really emotional for me because of my own relationship
with music, Like from the time I was a little
kid to have moments where like the other day I
was just on my phone checking a clip for something
and the score came like I could use the boost
came on and she was in the other room with
my mother in law.
Speaker 5 (27:44):
She was like, that is that a watching the Wild Robot.
Speaker 3 (27:47):
She's like, and she knows that that's the melody, and
like I can sing her the melody and she's like,
that's the Wild Robot. Like the fact that she's it's
that clear for her. She already has this like connection
between like a sound and this movie and the fact
that it's it's something I worked on. It's really really amazing.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Yeah, that's got to be crazy because now she gets
to grow up, you know, with a movie that's about
in a way YouTube, you know, you guys can kind
of like, you know, make a direct parallel to the
both of your relationship. And it came at a time
where she's just so young and she can have all
these memories attached to that.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
It's got to be super special.
Speaker 1 (28:20):
Yeah, And I've gotten a taste of that, just a
tiny taste of that, you know, when you know, DreamWorks
asks me to voice do a single line as a
character in the movie Ruby gimm a teenage crack, just
like it was a fun little cameo. Like I remember
a hole sting of screening for Pussing Boots and they
said like, hey, like, you'll be great for this. Like
(28:41):
one character has one line in the movie, and I said, yeah, sure,
why not, And it's just his name is the Jym teacher.
He has one line and it's he's a legend and
he gets hit with the ball. But the thing was, man,
I've milked the ever loving hell out of that, Like
one moment I was like, yeah, man, I'm like one
of the main stars of the movie with Jane Fonda, or.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
Like I'm like right up her lines of Koshy.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
And I remember like I laid it on so thick
that whenever we will see like billboards and things of
that sort. My daughter would see it, and I believe
she was around like she was maybe like six at
the time, and she kept going, Oh, that's the daddy movie.
That's the daddy movie.
Speaker 5 (29:19):
It's my movie.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
It was just a real moment where I was in
bed one morning and she likes to wake up earlier
than I do on the weekend, so she like played
minecraft or whatever, But I remember she goes straight to Netflix,
and it was like right when it dropped the Netflix,
I remember waking up to the sounds of me saying
He's a legend, followed by a ball hitting me over
and over and over again.
Speaker 3 (29:39):
Well she was just playing once.
Speaker 1 (29:41):
Oh it was just laughter, and it was like one
of the sweetest moments. I was like, I'm glad, like
I got to have that with her.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
You know, it's not like.
Speaker 1 (29:52):
Creating a piece of music, but it's like creating something
that we get to share.
Speaker 3 (29:55):
Yeah, and also like show she was so proud and
excited and also just like for her to want to
just have that moment like by yourself to be able
to watch it, that's yeah, man, that's emotional.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
So you're only thirty five, and I heard someone say
that you have the resume of a sixty year old,
So there is so you've done so much in such
a short amount of time. Like I just said, like
this movie just won nine Annies, which is like, oh
my gosh. Yeah, Like, can you pick a moment in
(30:25):
your career that like because out of all these moments,
like you were just like it's hard to imagine, like
you're not getting excited at any of them. If you
pick one moment where you're just kind of like, damn,
like this is what I get to do.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
Yeah, I mean I genuinely feel like every I feel
very blessed and fortunate, though like every year there's kind
of that moment like I can go back to. I mean,
this movie, I feel like it's one of those moments.
The first time I worked with Ava, and like the
different projects I've worked on with her, I think it
felt like those moments like winning the Oscar last year,
(30:58):
also Green Book, like be on stage for the Oscar
that year, like that was my first introduction to this
whole like award circuit campaign stuff, and like you know,
being on that journey with Mahershela and like watching.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Him, you know, him how to play piano.
Speaker 3 (31:13):
I mean, I gave him lessons for it, you know,
yeah piano.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Whatever.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
Interesting because it's funny because it reminded me of like
what you're talking about yourself with being an athlete. Like
the thing I found so fascinating with him is that
our first lesson was just supposed to be like an hour,
and it was I think like two hours plus of
him just playing a scale over and over again, and
I actually had to like physically tell him to stop
when I needed him to like think about to like
(31:44):
do move on to the next exercise, primarily because he
was so focused on just like I'm gonna play this
scale over and over again, like and like you would
mess up and start over again. But it felt like
the only other time I'd seen somebody that dedicated and
focus to like the process before you say it, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
We counted the.
Speaker 1 (32:01):
Yeah, yeah what two three?
Speaker 5 (32:05):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (32:09):
But yeah, I like, you know, like I I was,
I was let's say, like physically challenged skit when I
was younger in terms of like I played sports, was
very bad at it and like and was chubby, Like
it was not you know, but I feel like, you know,
any people I meet that are athletes, like you get
this other type of like mental discipline that I really
(32:32):
didn't develop until later in my life, or I developed
with the piano, but like in terms of physical activity,
like it's amazing to see people apply that to other things.
And so Rehearsal was really able, I think, to apply
his like athletic mental stamina and focus to learning the
piano in like three months of being able to play
these like kind of difficult sections of music. Just with
(32:53):
that attention to detail, it's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
And when we talk about detail, you can't leave out
like Kobe Bryant out that conversation, which worked with him
on mus Right the Showtime documentary, and like as an
La native, I'm sure you as well.
Speaker 2 (33:06):
Like huge Kobe Bryant fan.
Speaker 1 (33:07):
Like you know, I'm very jealous that you got to
see him while he was alive, and you know that
was just kind of like an emotional gut punch when
I found out. I've always wanted to talk to him,
especially after in his post career he was doing things
like basketball what you won the Oscar for and again
worked with John Williams.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
Who will talk about him in a second.
Speaker 1 (33:27):
I know you look up to him as well, but
talk to me about kind of like working with Kobe
on that and kind of like building that relationship and
how that helped your career as a result.
Speaker 3 (33:36):
Yeah, I mean it was huge. So the thing that
was amazing with Muse is that one the only reason
why I was on it is because one of the
producers was a friend of mine from a high school
all star jazz band, and he remembered that I talked
about wanting to be a film composer. And he came
up to me after a show and he was like,
do you want to work on this Kobe documentary? And
I was like, yeah, sure. I figured it's like him
and some other young people like following Kobe. And like
(33:58):
a week later he was like, okay, so can you
come to new and like sit down with Kobe and
meet him? And and he was like, everybody that works
on this project, if you're the composer or the editor
or like cutting a trailer, you have to sit down
with Kobe in his office and talk about your process
and your craft and he kind of assess whether or
not you are as serious about your craft as he
is with basketball.
Speaker 2 (34:17):
He test people like everything, yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
Like and it. But the thing I loved about it, it
was like an easy test because ultimately it's just like okay,
like what like talk about why you love what you
do and then like and then for me, it was
like you gotta tell me to shut up because like
I'm just going to talk about next like hours. Yeah. Like,
over the process of working on that movie, I found that,
like I would send him a cue. He wasn't even
(34:40):
the director but like he I'd send every piece of
music to him and he would always be like, I
think it's great, but like what do you think? Like
you have to work until you think this is amazing.
And there were times where I would be in a
hurry and I'd send him a cue and I just
like check this out, let me know what you think,
and he'd be like like not good enough, Like tell
me like where, like what was the process? Like how
did you arrive here? And so if I wrote him
in an email that was like a page long or
(35:02):
two pages long, he'd be like standing ovation email amazing.
Speaker 5 (35:05):
Like the Lakers.
Speaker 3 (35:11):
He was like that, like like into the process. And
that continued. So I worked with him where I scored
his audio books and like he did these shorts for
ESPN and like all these things, and he would always
I remember sitting, uh listening to the narration being recorded
for one of the audiobooks for Felice or shod like
in the studio, and he was like, so, you know,
the score for this has to be, you know, on
(35:32):
the same level as ET Well Kobe. He was like,
you know, it has to be better than ET And
I was like, oh yeah, and He's like you know,
I'm not kidding with you, right, but I feel like
that was the the what he wanted. Like he he
always equated John Williams to Michael Jordan. He was like,
I used to study Michael, like I study every one
(35:53):
of his moves, Like you need to be able to
tell me why it is that, Like if I ask
you why John Williams of music works, I want you
to be able to break it down for me on
like a very detailed level, why it functions and why
it works. And the fact that he, like you know,
called John on a regular basis to like talk to
him and like learn about his process as a while.
But like my last interaction with him, which makes me emotional,
(36:16):
I wrote a violin concerto in that premiere in twenty twenty,
and I sent him an email inviting him to the show,
and something in me was just like I need to
acknowledge the fact that, like I didn't have a space
other than working for him to write intricate, detailed orchestration
(36:38):
music orchestrational music. Most of the projects I worked on
were like a little smaller and didn't really want that sound.
But he was like, you know, you have to go
for this bigger sound John Williams and all of that,
and so I wrote him this long email that basically
was like, I wouldn't have been prepared for this violin
concerto had I not been working for you for the
last like however many years. And I really owe my
ability to do this to like the space you carved
(36:59):
out for me as a composer. And he was like, oh, man,
like we'll be there, like I can't wait to see
the show, and then like it was like a week
later that he passed, and so it was, yeah, definitely
like a very emotional thing to like feel like I
had this moment to at least like give him that
thank you before before he passed. But at the same time,
(37:19):
it's just really well, but yeah, I definitely wouldn't be
the composer I am, or even be ready for something
like The Wild Robot had I not worked with him
for those years and been in that relationship where like
I was reminded of my own obsession over my craft.
Speaker 1 (37:35):
I'm just gonna let you know, my mind stopped, like
when you describe Kobe and like, you know, just like
his craft and his process and the way he helped
you get there. And I feel like, you know, again,
I'm getting emotional because like again, Kobe is like one
of my one of my idols, is that the way
he approached life. You know a lot of a lot
of times you see athletes and they'll just kind of like,
(37:56):
you know, be an athlete and then the next step
is kind of like analyst or you know, culture. It's
still in the you know, the same world biosphere, right, Yeah.
But the way I think the tragic thing about that
is that he had his hands in so many different
cookie jars, and like not not only just having his
hands like one foot in, one foot out, but he
was like dedicated to being the best at those different things.
Speaker 2 (38:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (38:17):
Right, So it must have been surprising for you to
like hear that that level of focus just wasn't part
of basketball, it was also part of the you know.
Speaker 3 (38:25):
Like storytelling, and that's that's actually what made me want
to become a filmmaker. Like, yeah, I remember he sat
down with an editor, Like when we worked on MEWS.
It was a very familiar process where like there was
you know, first it was at his offices, and it
was like this house everybody worked out of, and I
would go down there on like a weekly basis, sometimes
a couple times a week and just kind of be
updated on what they're working on in the edit and
(38:47):
an immersion in the process that I never experienced as
a composer and kind of haven't really since. And he
would sit down with an editor and the editor would
be like, oh, yeah, I'm approaching this sequence kind of
like you know, Darren Er and Osti kind of thing,
and he like, oh, who's that. He's like, Oh, this
director of Black Swan and The Wrestler. And literally the
next day he would have seen like Four Dinner and
Osci films, and like there was a time he had
(39:08):
a casual conversation about jazz, and literally the next day
he was like, Yeah, I listened to like John Coltrane's
Love Supreme. I watched some of this documentary about him,
My Restaurant's Biography. Like he just was always a sponge
for information. But I remember him getting so swept with
like the idea of becoming a storyteller and like building
these worlds and like studying the history of Disney and
(39:28):
like studying the history of like the Roman Empire to
figure out how to apply that it, like, you know,
project that against this story he was telling, and like
that level of dedication and then seeing it turned into
these successful stories or these stories that had depth to them,
it definitely inspired me to feel like I had the
capability of applying my obsessive learning curiosity to filmmaking into
(39:53):
other areas to try to like develop in that right.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
And I feel like, if I remember this correctly, news
was like highly considered You're coming out party, Like a
lot of people say like, wow, this guy's on the
scene and that's kind of like what took everything off. Yeah,
so wow, fact that Kobe Bryant is like a piece
in that incredible. And then you know him having such
a close relationship with John Williams. I'm sure you're a
fan of John Williams. Yeah, for sure, you know everything.
Have you been able to build a relationship with John
(40:17):
as well? Have you worked?
Speaker 4 (40:19):
No?
Speaker 3 (40:19):
Not built? Like I've only met him a couple of times.
Oddly enough, the first time I met him was because
of Kobe, Like Kobe or brought me to the Hollywood
Bold performance where they did deer Basketball and darted and
then I got to go backstage and like meet John. Uh.
And then there's a Juilliard thing a little bit later
that I went to and met him. So I've had
conversations with him, like very very briefly. But you know,
(40:39):
I think the tough thing is that he's you know,
I think ninety he's just turned ninety three.
Speaker 1 (40:43):
Yeah, he's got his own things going on or whatever.
Plus he's like still busy kind of like doing other
compositions and like he also does the Hollywood Bow performances
every song. I need to go to one of those, right,
It's been a dream and I haven't been able to go,
but I will got to before he like officially officially retires. Yeah,
but I did get like to see him live once
at the red carpet for the Indiana Jones and the
(41:05):
Dial of Deskin.
Speaker 3 (41:06):
Yeah, and I.
Speaker 1 (41:07):
Remember, like, you know, sneaking off to the side as
soon as the movie was over and my friend had
to go use the restaurants. So we're waiting for my
friend and they walked John Williams like out the back.
And you know, I'm never shy about things like this
was like one of the first times when the only
other time, funny enough, was Kobe Bryant when I met
him at Disneyland. Also one time where I was like,
I can't speak but with John like he's he walks
(41:31):
by and I say, like John, like I'm such a
huge fan, Like I stretch out my hand, he shakes
my hand, and I kid you not, I have witnesses
for the like at least thirty minutes after that, my
hand was just like this.
Speaker 5 (41:42):
Yeah, I just like.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
I don't know whether to wash this. I don't want
to do anything else with his hand other than what
it was doing when I shook his hand.
Speaker 2 (41:50):
Yeah, for sure, such a legend such.
Speaker 1 (41:52):
Like obviously, like you know, he scored like funny that
you mentioned Kobe and like has to be as good
as et and yeah, I told you, like one of
my four perfle fims is Eat and Large due to
the score.
Speaker 2 (42:00):
It's just it's classic.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
It's why movies are made. But yeah, so I know
we only got a little bit of time left, so
but I want to I feel like a lot of
people in my comments of this podcast are gonna be
screaming at me if I didn't bring up Bridgerton. So
I just started watching Bridgerton with my girlfriend about like
(42:22):
a couple of weeks ago, and it was this is
before I knew that you scored it. But I remember
like watching it way and we're like in a long
distance relationship, so we're watching, like, you know, on FaceTime,
and I remember it was the episode where they make
the decision for the ruse bro I swear fo god,
I swear. I was looking at my girlfriend on the phone.
(42:45):
I looked back up and was like, holy shit, I'm
locked in, so locked into this show because it was
it was such like a simple like, yeah, we're gonna
pretend to like you know, the tricks people, we are
gonna pretend to be in love. But it's such a
gut check moment for the entire like show for me,
because you know, it sets up the romance, it sets
up the stakes, and then like you know, it also
(43:07):
like speaks to the grandness of love or the beginning
of love. And I realized that that also was one
of the things that kind of like you played in
multiple instances throughout the season, so like you talked to
me about kind of like working on Bridgeton and like
that experience. It's really quickly because I know, like we
got to get out of here.
Speaker 3 (43:23):
Yeah, I feel like that first season especially, I also
really appreciated the fact that it was them deciding to
be in this relationship at the beginning, and so the
whole season was really like trying to figure out how
to make it work and like dealing with each other's
like triggers and like trauma and all that kind of stuff.
And like, to me, especially at the time of my life,
I felt like that's what my now wife and I
(43:44):
were like working through is like, you know, the real
something not like oh, like does she like me or not.
It's more of like like we're already in this but like,
you know, don't talk to me that way. I feel
like that kind of thing is like so real. But yeah,
it's kind of the same thing I was talking about
with I could use a boost. Like that is their
main love theme, and then it just kind of develops
(44:06):
over the course of the seasons as they're trying to
figure out their relationship and kind of goes through the
ups and downs of their their dynamic. But working on
the show was so amazing, primarily because they really wanted
this modern take on classical music. And you know, if
you give credit to Alex potsavas the music supervisor for
the first season, that was responsible with Shanda and Chris
(44:29):
Van Duzin for picking those like covers yeah, and love
covers by the way, Yeah, And like I remember watching
the first episode when they started dropping those covers in
and seeing the thank You next cover and being like,
it's so smart because now I know exactly how these
people feel, because like that song makes me feel, makes
my wife feel certain things, and so I have a
different context for it. But for me on the composing side,
(44:51):
it was like, oh, now I can really look at
like pop music for melodic references or rhythmic references or tempo,
because I feel like a lot of that show is
made music that people want to move to and dance to,
and music from that era isn't something that specifically makes
us want to dance. But I can like write in
that style of that era, but then pull rhythms and
tempos and grooves and melodies from this era in a
(45:14):
way that makes people connect to it a bit deeper.
So it's been fun to do the you know, three
seasons and the Queen Charlotte, and now we're working on
season four and continue to build that sonic universe.
Speaker 2 (45:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (45:23):
The first time I heard like, you know that the
contemporary music being like layered in, I was like.
Speaker 2 (45:28):
What is this?
Speaker 1 (45:28):
What I think it is? Yes, and I heard that
you worked with Alicia Keys All yeah those covers.
Speaker 3 (45:37):
Right, Yeah. For Queen Charlotte, they did an amazing thing
where they had her redo a Woman's Worth, But we
did it with this orchestra that's all women, all women
of color, and so that's like, you know, I think
it's like a sixty piece orchestra. And then they did
a video where they recorded or had them all like
dressed in the Bridgeton costume and all that kind of stuff.
But it was a really beautiful moment and I produced
(45:59):
it and helped them Bobby Gardner, the composer arranger, do
the arrangement, and so it was really amazing to be
a part of facilitating that and definitely give props to
Bobby for doing such an amazing arrangement and and really
amazing for the early to be open for us to
figure out how we wanted to do it and how
we wanted to sound.
Speaker 1 (46:18):
Okay, So final question before we get out of here
is the reason why this show is called like get
wrecked is because like I like to recommend movies like that,
I guess recommend movies and things of that sort you
being a composer, like you know, I want you to
put people on to some like either underrated or some
of your favorite like musical scores for them to kind
of listen to or even like watch the movie that
the scores are a part of.
Speaker 2 (46:38):
Do you have any for us?
Speaker 3 (46:39):
Yeah, it's I mean I think Mika Levi's somebody I'm
a huge fan of, like the Under the Skin score movie,
like really dope, really unique. I mean it's probably that
under the radar anymore, but there will be Blood is
like one that like really is amazing. Also, I feel
like Jerry Goldsmith as a composer just generally somebody that's
(47:00):
like a little older that this generation might not be
his Hiptoo, but you know his score for Alien and
like all the other movies he did in the seventies.
I think you're just iconic. Those would be the ones
that come to mind, all.
Speaker 2 (47:12):
Right for sure.
Speaker 1 (47:12):
And I already told you, like before we started rolling
like rad WIMPs.
Speaker 2 (47:16):
Yeah name dude, check that I.
Speaker 1 (47:18):
Want you to like if you can hit me up,
hit Trevor.
Speaker 3 (47:20):
Trevor, hit me up either way.
Speaker 1 (47:22):
Yeah, I would like to know your opeons on that one,
because like to be honest, like that score when I
first heard it, I kid you not.
Speaker 2 (47:28):
After I watched the movie two days later.
Speaker 1 (47:29):
I went and bought a piano, like teaching myself really
well to like, you know, play it. And to this day,
I can only play that one song, man, but I'm
going to get some piano lesson, like when people come over.
I only have the one trick poty date song from
your name, but that one was like a really big
like impact on me. But so much for talking to
(47:51):
me about this movie and about your dude. Thank you
so much.
Speaker 3 (47:53):
Thank you for having me really appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (47:55):
All right, guys, thank you so much for watching.
Speaker 1 (47:57):
And if you're watching on YouTube or like Spotify, Instagram,
wherever you watch your podcast, I make sure you even
like a comment and just hit the bell to get
notified from my other videos and things of that sort,
so that way you can't say that, oh my god,
where'd your stuff go?
Speaker 2 (48:10):
I'm here.
Speaker 1 (48:11):
Thank you for watching it. Wreck with straw had Goofy.
We'll catch you next time. We'll we talk about the
next movie.
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