June 25, 2025 • 31 mins
Grammy-winning singer-songwriter and breast cancer survivor Melissa Etheridge joins Sarah for a deeply personal conversation about the power of resilience and reinvention. Melissa talks about how a women's soccer team helped her get discovered, why she had to re-record her very first album, and how her cancer battle transformed her approach to life and advocacy. Beyond the diagnosis, she shares her ongoing passion for empowering women — including her vocal support of women’s sports, from championing equal pay to performing at key moments in the rise of women's soccer. This episode is a tribute to living boldly, loving deeply, and refusing to be defined by a diagnosis.
-
Leave us a voicemail at 872-204-5070 or send us a note at goodgame@wondermedianetwork.com
-
Follow Sarah on social! Bluesky: @sarahspain.com Instagram: @Spain2323
-
Follow producer Misha Jones! Bluesky: @mishthejrnalist.bsky.social Instagram: @mishthejrnalist
- Follow producer Alex Azzi! Bluesky: @byalexazzi.bsky.social
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
This show was independently created by iHeartMedia. Novarda's Pharmaceuticals Corp.
Is the exclusive advertising partner. It is intended for informational
and educational purposes only and is not intended as medical advice.
Please speak with your healthcare professional before making any treatment decisions.
Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, where we're taking
you beyond breast Cancer. It's Wednesday, June twenty fifth, and
(00:22):
on today's show, we'll be skipping the need to know
and getting right into my fantastic and fun interview with
the very badass Melissa Ethridge. It's the latest installment of
our new series Life Beyond Living Beyond Labels, a powerful
podcast campaign brought to you by Iheartwomen's Sports. Our guest
today is Grammy winning singer, songwriter and breast cancer survivor
Melissa Ethridge. She joins me to reflect on her public
(00:44):
cancer battle, how it transformed her approach to life and advocacy,
and how music became a healing force during her recovery.
Beyond the diagnosis, she shares her ongoing passion for empowering women,
including her vocal support of women's soccer and her anthem
performance at the NWSI Championship last season, plus my total
lack of surprise learning that a women's sports team was
(01:05):
behind her rise to fame. This episode is a tribute
to living boldly, loving deeply, and refusing to be defined
by a diagnosis. Our Life Beyond series showcases the extraordinary
resilience and strength of successful women, diving deep into their lives,
highlighting their personal journey's passions and the ways in which
they're living beyond the labels they've been given by others.
(01:26):
My conversation with Melissa is coming up right after this,
Joining us now. She's a two time Grammy Award winner
and fifteen time nominee and Academy Award winner for Best
Original Song Again and lesbian rights activist, a mother, an author,
and a cancer survivor. She's got a star on the
(01:48):
Hollywood Walk of Fame. She crushed the national anthem at
the NWSL Championship game last year, and she recently paid
a visit to the secret Boston pup, the Lazy Nut tavern.
It's Melissa Athrage.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Hi, Melissa, Hello, Hello, Hello, how are you?
Speaker 1 (02:02):
I'm good, but I'm jealous you've been to the Lazy Nut.
I have only seen photos and videos. I've not gotten
the chance to go yet.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
It's an adventure, it really is.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
Did they make you drink milort?
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Well, you know what, I was working, so I wasn't drinking,
So okay, I know I watched them drink.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Yes, I could have taken credit for that. A bunch
of those scals came to Chicago and Wrigley for the
Red Stars game at Wrigley Field, and I introduced him
to the magical world of milort and they brought it
back to the Lazy Nut. So next time, when you're
not working, well, we'll make you do it. Let's talk
about your sports ties. Because I was so excited to
learn as I was researching for this that not only
(02:41):
are you a huge sports fan, but sports actually played
a big role in your big break as a musician.
So tell me about Verme's Bar in Pasadena and how
a friend from your women's soccer team actually was part
of the reason you got discovered.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Yes, it's crazy in Los Angeles. You just don't ever
know how it's going to happen. So I had moved
there in nineteen eighty two from Kansas. I grew up
in Leavenworth, Kansas, and I'd done a lot of playing,
and I got to LA and realized that there was
(03:15):
another ten million people trying to do what I was doing.
I wasn't unique, and nobody was paying for anybody to play.
Everybody was. You would buy your own tickets and you
would get like a gig once a month. And I
was like, well, I'm going to starve if I try
to do this. So I went to a women's bar
because I'm a lesbian, and I went to a women's
(03:37):
bar and saw that they had a piano in the corner,
and I asked if they had music, and they said, no,
that's from the steakhouse that used to be here. But hey,
do you want to do something? And so I started
playing in Long Beach for about five nights a week.
Then when that started to fizzle out, there was a
gal who said, hey, there's a bar in Pasadena. It's
(03:58):
called Verni. He's a horrible name of a bar, but
it was named after mouse. Long story, and I went
there and they they took me in and I would
play like three nights there and two nights in Long Beach,
and it was just this perfect thing. And on Sundays,
the girls from the soccer team, I think it cal
(04:18):
Tech would come in after they had a game and
they would play, and they were big fans and there
was always a big table and they were great tippers
and you know, they were wonderful. And one day they said,
do you have a cassette? And I had made this
silly demo and they said, because one of our coach's
(04:39):
husband is a music manager and that you know, and
you just you you take whatever anybody said. You're like, yes, okay,
this is fine. So I gave him a tape and
then the the wife came down and she loved it.
She had a great night and she went back and
she was like, look, you got to see this girl.
And he's like, I don't want to say, I don't
want to I don't want to go. So she finally
(04:59):
got him to come down. He loved it. He signed
me and he was my manager for thirty years. So, yes,
soccer everything. I just I'm very grateful for those women,
and yes, played a big part in my career.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
I'm not surprised to learn that a team of women
are the ones who sought out how to lift up
and help you rise. Along with their fun and enjoyment
of you. It wasn't just about that. It was about
let's help her now that we really enjoy I love that.
There's another really great lesson in how your first album
came together, kind of a surprising one from what we
often hear about the music industry. Your first attempt at
(05:38):
an album was actually rejected by Island Records because it
was too polished. We normally hear about artists that want
to be themselves and they make them more polished. But
instead they said, nope, we don't like that, we like
too you were, so you stripped it down to just
you and the music, and that first album gets nominated
for a Grammy. Were you surprised that they wanted you
to be more gritty, less polished.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
No, I was, and I hadn't. I had no idea
what I should do. I'd never made a record. I
barely made a demo, and I was playing solo in
this bar. And Chris Blackwell, who was the owner, he
was just the guy who ran Island Records. This is
back in the eighties, seventies and eighties, early nineties. There
(06:23):
were actually guys who loved music that would go find
it and sign it, and they were always looking for
new stuff, and Chris loved what he saw. He saw
me playing by myself, just in like jeans and a
T shirt in the corner. He loved it. He heard
like four songs that was all, and he says, I
(06:43):
want you on my label, and he flew off to
Jamaica wherever he went to, and I didn't see him
until I turned it, so I didn't know what to do.
I got a producer and this guy was from northern
California and he had done the way music was being
done back then was very synthesizers were starting and it
(07:07):
was very like produced and I didn't know how to do.
So we sort of The guy kind of popped up
my songs and I turned it in and Chris Blackwell
actually said, well I hate this, and I was like,
there you go. There was my chance, and I blew it.
But myself and the other two guys in the band
with me that I had put together, we were like, Okay,
(07:29):
what he wants is what he saw in the bar.
He saw a girl alone. So we went in and
in four days totally recorded the first album, just did
like three songs a day, boom boom boom, and mixed
it and then bang, here it is. He loved it,
and it's still to this day one of people's favorite albums.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
It's interesting how much you can be swayed by not
knowing what's expected and just being like, Okay, I guess
this is what you do when you make an album.
It's like when I first went to ESPN and for
my first TV gigs and got my hair and makeup done,
I looked like a fifty five year old New Jersey
reeltur and I was like, well, I guess this is
what I look like with a lot of makeup. Like
I just didn't have any idea that I could say
(08:11):
I don't really like that, or I don't think that's me.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
That's the thing about women helping women, And here were
you and I in these places that had formerly been
all men. I didn't know what to do. I didn't
know how to behave. I didn't know anything, and you're
just looking around trying to figure it out, and then
you fall on your face a couple of times and go, oh, okay,
this is what.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
I'm Okay, now I get it.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
Yeah, yeah, and now, And that's why we like to
help women. It's like, look, let me help you do
this because it's a rough road on your own.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
Yeah, you put out three albums before you came out
publicly as a lesbian at ninety three, and your first
album after coming out was your big breakthrough hit. Yes,
I am two mainstream, big radio hits come to my
window and I'm the only one. Can you make a
direct line between being publicly your full self and the
success that followed.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Well, yeah, I believe. I believe that what you put
out in the world comes back to you. So being
that open and honest people I think really related to it.
But this is nineteen ninety three, this is long before
social media, the internet was jazz starting, so that wouldn't
play a big part. This was me coming out and
(09:25):
slowly every little place, every town I played, every little
local newspaper would do an interview. It wasn't like I
came out and the whole world knew I was gay.
Little by little, they and I would find that people
would want to do articles and long articles with me
and give me much space. So actually the publicity that
(09:48):
I got coming out really helped bring this album to
the forefront. It took a while, this album for a
long time. It come to my window, had held the
record for being on the charts for the longest time.
It never I don't even think it ever broke the
top ten, but it was on the charts because it
just took that.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
It was like waves of people learning about it.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Yes, it is slowly, slowly. And the gay part was
a talking point and I ended up talking about being
gay for about five years just that's all I could
talk about.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
Yeah, I mean, it's a hook when you need to
separate yourself from the pack, and that's a scary hook
in ninety three when you're not sure how people will respond.
But to your point, it allows people to tell a
story beyond here's a song. See if you like it, it's
here's a song, and here's the woman behind it that
has a story to tell. Did it feel different to
you either writing that album or promoting that album. Did
(10:44):
you consider how people would receive your music through the
lens of your sexuality or the lyrics you were writing,
or the stories you were telling it anyway?
Speaker 2 (10:52):
Yeah, there was, of course, you know, the unknown. I'd
never there really had never been someone that came out
and didn't put out an album and like that, and
so I didn't know. I had no idea and I
would perform and what would end up happening is the
first section of people were just gazed, just losing their minds,
(11:15):
you know, and then the rest yeah, right, And it
was and I found that they were gathering they other
than the little bars they had in towns. There was
no place that everyone gathered at once, and it was
a It was very emotional to actually see that in
the audience and see people being themselves. But then also
(11:35):
to see straight people going oh, those are gay people,
you know, and and everyone kind of going, oh, well,
this is well, we like the same music. And that
that was very empowering to me saying, Okay, you know,
I've got both going on here. I'm not going to
just serve one or the other. And I've always kept
my well in the beginning, I don't now it's not
(11:57):
a big deal now to do gender specific, but back
then I was very just let it be they them,
and you guys just you know, take it however you want.
But it was it was scary, but it was great.
It was great.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
I think it's not a surprise when you see communities
rally around someone that speaks for and to them, particularly
the queer community. Women like in spaces where you often
feel like you're allowed to come, but it's not for you.
It's you get tired of that, and sometimes trying to
explain to men what it feels like to watch women
(12:35):
play professional sports, what it feels like to see women
be fully embodied and empowered and badass. It's just a
different experience for me than watching your favorite guy play
like You're getting a lot out of that. You want
to be him. You idolize them. He's awesome, he's richie's famous,
he's really successful, he's good at dunking great. It feels different.
You have a million examples of power and earnest and
(12:57):
authentic self in men across every space, and for women,
feels like there's just not as many places to watch
that unapologetically, and so I feel like music too. It
it feels different to feel spoken to and included and
pointed out, as opposed to just a part of it.
You know, one of the reasons you wanted to have
you on was to talk about your breast cancer diagnosis
(13:19):
and your reaction to that, because I do think the
community of people who have been through this speak to
each other in a way that feels really powerful of
like I've been there, I understand and it changed me.
So in two thousand and four, you were diagnosed. You know,
I just met with a friend a few weeks ago
who told me that she remembered her mammogram, and she
remembered the beginning of the follow up appointment that they
(13:40):
asked her to come to. But she still, years later,
can't recall anything that she was told. That day. After
she was told you have breast cancer. She went home
in a blur. She had to finish work, she had
to take calls and meetings, and then her husband got
home and said, how was your day, and she said,
not great. Actually she doesn't remember any of that. So
can you take me back to the moment that you
heard those words and got the news and your reaction
(14:02):
to it.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
It was a very slow I remember it in slow
motion because it was it started. I was in Canada,
I was on tour, and I had sort of I've
come to a point in my life where I'd gotten
my first divorce, my first relationship fell apart, I had
(14:26):
two kids. I was super stressed. The music industry was changing.
It was all There was no more singer songwriters or
rock and roll I didn't know what I was going
to do. I was I was unhappy. I had that
just stressed, unhappy life. And I remember looking up to
(14:48):
the heavens and saying, what what what do you want
from me? What do I do? What do I do now?
And that next morning, I woke up and was showering
and I found lump and was like, well, that's not
what I was talking about.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
Yeah, don't hand me something else more problems.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
And I found it and I remember touching it and
wondering why the world did I feel this yesterday? You know,
because it was it was big, and I I remember going,
wait a minute, this could this Because my father had cancer.
He died of cancer. My aunt, my grandmother was everywhere
in my family, and I slowly I came home the
(15:32):
next day. I was flying home anyway, and I had
like a few days off before I was supposed to
go to Boston actually, and I went to my doctor
and was like, I found this, and she's like, I'm
afraid I might know what this is. Sent me to
the radiologist the next day, knowing that I only had
(15:53):
so much time, and the radiologist was the was the
one who had helped with my children you know, did
the sonograms and the kids and stuff, so I knew her.
And she biopsy did, which was it was so dense
that she couldn't pull the thing out. She got to
(16:14):
literally put her foot up and out of me in bloods.
It's really a horrible experience. But she at that time,
because she was a friend, she said, look, I'm not
supposed to do this, but you know, I look at
these all day and I know what this is, and
I just want you to know that you're going to
be fine. And she goes, and this is the worst
(16:35):
that can happen to you, and she unbuttoned her blouse
and showed me her double mistectomy. I had no idea
that she had that. And she goes, this is the worst,
but you're not even there, you know, and you will
be fine. And just starting with that, just going okay,
whatever this journey is, I'm going to be fine. And
(16:56):
then I walked through it and it was. It was
indeed the most incredible thing that ever happened to me,
because I changed my life. I changed the stress. I
no longer let stress run my life that was going
to kill me. And I changed in my food habits,
my exercise just my state of mind. I used a
(17:18):
lot of cannabis that helped me. Here in California, we
have that. It was very medicinal and it really changed
me as a person, and I am now twenty one
years cancer free.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
We got to take a quick break. When we come back.
The rest of my conversation with Melissa Ethridge, I want
to talk about the two thousand and five Grammy Awards.
You were performing with Josh Stone. You sang a tribute
to Janis Joplin and you were bald. What were the
(17:52):
emotions heading into that performance and why did you choose
to be bald instead of wearing a wig.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Well, it's funny. My surgeon who took the lumps out
and took I had three separate surgeries to get everything out,
get the margins clear. It was in the left nodes,
but they were able to get it before it got
all the way in there. And and this doctor said,
so you're gonna need chemo. You're gonna need lots of
(18:19):
chemo dose dents. Uh. And so you're gonna be bald,
So you're gonna need a wig because no one wants
to see a bald rock star. This is what she
said to me. And I was like, what this just did?
I was like scary and weird. And then I when
I knew I was going to be toward the end
of the Treatments, when I knew I was going to
(18:39):
be on the on the Grammys, I asked my friends.
I was like, what do you think should I be bald?
I also had a stylist get me kind of a
handkerchief as swayed. I had that I was maybe gonna
wear that, and everything on my head made me so
hot because I was getting hot flashes because they chemo
(19:00):
puts you into menopause and and I was like, I
just I can't. I'm just I'm just gonna go bald.
And I remember telling the lighting director and every said,
I said, I'm going to be bald. So I don't
know if that changes how you're going to do anything.
And I just didn't want anybody to make fun of me.
(19:20):
And right before I went on my guitar player, he said,
he goes, Melissa, you don't know what you're about to do,
do you? And I said, I don't know what you mean,
and he goes, well, just watch And I went out.
And I still get a little choked up because the
audience was so warm and loving and they just just
(19:42):
received it so well and it was one of the
greatest moments of my life.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
Yeah, it actually inspired a song by India I Ree
I Am not my Heart No, Yeah, I love pretty powerful.
Speaker 2 (19:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:56):
You know, one of my best friends, unfortunately, was recently
diagnosed with multiple my law and she is going to
undergo a stem cell transplant in a couple months, and
she's going to lose her hair. And we were talking
the other day about if she wants to wear a
wig that looks like her, or wear a wig that's
like totally wacky and fun, or just go bald. And
she said the same thing about how she's already hot
all the time, and so she's a little worried about
(20:17):
this wedding. Do you have advice for her or for
others who are scared about that particular moment where everybody
will know that you're going through something. It will be
written all over your face and your hair.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
Yeah, it's okay. It's okay for everyone to know that.
It's okay for people to know that you're at a
point in your life where you're changing and you're working
on it, and you're working on health, and it's nothing
to be sad about. You are doing what you need
to do. And part of that weird shame about our
(20:50):
hair and what we look like is a part of
the problem of why we're sick. So time to let
that go. Time to know that we look gorgeous without
our hair or not. And I love it because sometimes
I see people bald women and I'm like, could be
a choice? Could be? You know, because I'm telling you,
(21:12):
losing my hair felt amazing. One. I love people rubbing
my head. That was really really I would get massages
and I'm just like, just rub my head. And I
would actually recommend just once in every woman's life to
shave her head, whether she's sick or not, but just
to shave her head because there's a lot of energy
(21:34):
and hair and you let it go and it's really
a great experience. And someday I'll go back to really
short hair. I'm looking forward to that.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
You've always written very personal song, songs about issues that
matter to you, songs about your life. Did your cancer
battle make it into your music?
Speaker 2 (21:52):
Oh yeah. The first album I made after that was
called The Awakening because it's less about being sick, because
that was just the symptom of the change that I
needed to make in my own spirit, in my own life.
And it's more about waking up to oh this, I'm
(22:15):
in charge of me. I can't. I got to be
okay first before I help anybody else. And so many
women we take care of everybody else. We want everyone
to be happy and then we'll be happy. And that's
a You keep doing that and you will get sick
because that's not how we're made. We're made to make
sure we are good, we are well, and that's the
(22:38):
only way we can help anybody else.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
Actually, Yeah, what's been the hardest part for you over
the course of the decades that you've been in the
public eye and had a voice and an agency of
standing up for things even when society might not be ready,
or maybe when the loudest voices might be trying to
shout you down. What's been the toughest part for you?
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Well, the toughest thing was probably just five years ago
when I lost my son to an opioid overdose, because
that's like, that just knocks you down and you don't
there's so much guilt and shame involved in that as
a parent that that can really really be hard, and
(23:20):
it was, and it was during the pandemic, so it
was a very very strange time. And what I've done
to help with that is to start the Etherage Foundation,
which is at the forefront now of providing funds for
research into plant medicine, into psychedelics and how they can
(23:43):
help and help with our emotional systems that lead to
pain relief and opioids within heroin and then fentanyl and death.
And so it's trying to change that. And there's a
lot of misinformation and a lot of people saying different things,
(24:04):
but I have a deep belief that as an alternative
to opioids, in helping with addiction, opioid use, disorder, all
these things, plat medicine can it really has a lot
of answers.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Yeah, I was really skeptical about it, to be honest
with you, and I think because it was so often
associated with folks who were presenting it in this sort
of hippie dippy cult like way. And when I listen
to doctors talk about the appropriate usage of it and
how it sort of takes the topography of your brain
that you've created over the years to help hide away
(24:39):
trauma or go around something instead of through it and
dealing with it. How it levels that out and you're
forced to go through the things that your body has
tried to protect you from, and that's the only way
to actually integrate them into the rest of your memory
and learning and get through them, process them, and move
past them. As soon as that was explained to me,
it made such sense, and having read a lot of
(25:01):
books of late for the book that I wrote, I
started to be much less judgmental about the things I
didn't understand, particularly when they were presented to me in
sort of a logical and thoughtful way as opposed to like,
come to my tent in the woods and I'll show
you the magic of ayahuasca. Right, But I love what
I love you said, because you know, Robin Roberts always says,
make your mess your message. It's easier said than done.
(25:24):
But if you can find a way to turn the
deepest of pain into something proactive where it feels like
you're making a change and helping at least something came
from it and you're not just just held down by
it hurts, and you are also choosing to make something
of it. And that's really powerful that you decided to
do that. I want to close our conversation with something fun.
(25:47):
So it's a speed round, a speed round for you
because there are too many questions and too little time.
What's the most nervous you've ever been for a performance?
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Singing the national anthem at the Old series Game seven
two thousand one, two thousand and one. I believe giants angels?
Speaker 1 (26:12):
Okay. Dream collaborator for an album or a live show
or a song.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
Wow, I've got a lot of my dreams have come true.
I did sing with Bruce Springsteen. I've sung with a
lot of people. Dream collab that kind of always changes.
I mean, it was always Barbara Streis him for a
long time, but I know she's never gonna sing with me,
so that took you know, But now it'd be like,
it'd be fun to do something like with Chapel Roone.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
I knew you were going to say that. I knew it.
I knew it.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
She's fun. That would be too much people's heads would
explain exactly.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
I'd like to see you doing Pink Pony Club. I'd
like to see it. I was at a show last
night actually in the lead singer said, at this point,
I have lived out all of my dreams and dreams
I never had. At this point, I'm just stealing other
people's dreams, like things he had never imagined he could do.
He was doing so now he figured they must be
somebody else's that he stole. Who's the musician who's talent
(27:08):
you're most envious of? Alive or dead?
Speaker 2 (27:10):
Peter Gabriel made some music in the eighties and the
nineties that I really wished I was that sort of
it was. It was when tech and music was meeting,
and he did it so well, and he wrote in
Your Eyes, which I think is the greatest song ever,
and I'm always jealous. I always go, God, I wish
I've written that song.
Speaker 1 (27:30):
Yeah, it was like tech plus mysticism. Somehow he made it.
He made it mesh in a way that like felt right, Yeah,
what's the thing you've gotten to do in your career
that still feels like a pinch me. I can't believe
that happened.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
Moment well, singing with Bruce Springsteen, Yeah, yeah, that was
like bench main. I didn't want it to end. I
listened to it and I can still hear my heart
beat as I'm introducing him, you know, telling everyone, oh
my God, I get to sing with Springstein, that's probably one.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Yeah. What about the goal or accomplishment you're working toward
now in life, career or otherwise.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
Oh, now, it's about longevity. Now, it's about you know,
when you when you reach your goals, when you when
your dreams come true, you realize that it was never
the dream, it was never the thing and getting the
thing or doing the thing, it was the journey to
the thing is the most fun, absolutely, And I've done
enough that I know that for sure. So now I'm like, oh,
(28:31):
let me put these dreams out in front of me,
let me put this goal. But let me take my time,
you know, let me take my time going through the process,
because I know when I get there, I'm going to
want something else. It's gonna because it's about the dream.
It's about keep moving. So my goal is to be
(28:52):
in older older and older older age and still performing
and rocking and making music and writing about my life
and talking to you know, wonderful young women like you
and just doing that. That's my that's the goal. Now.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
It's wild how many very successful people have the same
message about what it feels like on the other side
of success or the thing they always wanted, and it's
impossible to impart that to people who are just getting started.
You can never explain to them that the process of
getting there is the thing too, because they're so hungry
to prove to themselves and to others that they've made
(29:32):
it or they've done it. There's a great song Hosier
and Brandy Carlisle Damage Gets Done, that I think like
hits it perfectly. There's this line about the it's the
comforts that make us feel numb, and he writes about
we'd go out with no way to get home, we'd
sleep on someone's floor and wake up feeling like a millionaire.
And you do remember, looking back now at your twenties,
(29:53):
when you were broke, you weren't sure if you were
ever going to make it at anything. You and your
friends were sort of like, who are we what are
we going to do? We're going to pay rent? And
now when you're successful and rich later, you look back,
you're like, man, that was fun.
Speaker 2 (30:06):
Fun at the wanting, the desire, the someday that yeah,
And so I try to keep that as much as
I can.
Speaker 1 (30:15):
It's hard in the moment when you're like, nobody, I
really do need to pay rent, but it is. You
can romanticize it later when it all works out.
Speaker 2 (30:23):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (30:24):
All right, last question for you, since this is living beyond,
if you look at Melissa Ethriche beyond breast cancer, you'll find.
Speaker 2 (30:31):
What, Oh, a woman having a great time in this
life right now, just loving every moment, every moment. Yeah,
I love that. Thank you so much, Thank you, Sarah anytime.
Speaker 1 (30:54):
Good Game with Sarah Spain is an iHeart women's sports
production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. Good
find us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
you get your podcasts. Production by Wonder Media Network, our
producers are Alex Azzie and Misha Jones. Our executive producers
are Christina Everett, Jesse Katz, Jenny Kaplan, and Emily Rutterer.
(31:14):
Our editors are Emily Rutter, Britney Martinez, Grace Lynch, and
Gianna Palmer. Our associate producer is Lucy Jones and I'm
your host Sarah Spain
This show was independently created by iHeartMedia. Novarda's Pharmaceuticals Corp.
Is the exclusive advertising partner. It is intended for informational
and educational purposes only and is not intended as medical advice.
Please speak with your healthcare professional before making any treatment decisions.
Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, where we're taking
you beyond breast Cancer. It's Wednesday, June twenty fifth, and
(00:22):
on today's show, we'll be skipping the need to know
and getting right into my fantastic and fun interview with
the very badass Melissa Ethridge. It's the latest installment of
our new series Life Beyond Living Beyond Labels, a powerful
podcast campaign brought to you by Iheartwomen's Sports. Our guest
today is Grammy winning singer, songwriter and breast cancer survivor
Melissa Ethridge. She joins me to reflect on her public
(00:44):
cancer battle, how it transformed her approach to life and advocacy,
and how music became a healing force during her recovery.
Beyond the diagnosis, she shares her ongoing passion for empowering women,
including her vocal support of women's soccer and her anthem
performance at the NWSI Championship last season, plus my total
lack of surprise learning that a women's sports team was
(01:05):
behind her rise to fame. This episode is a tribute
to living boldly, loving deeply, and refusing to be defined
by a diagnosis. Our Life Beyond series showcases the extraordinary
resilience and strength of successful women, diving deep into their lives,
highlighting their personal journey's passions and the ways in which
they're living beyond the labels they've been given by others.
(01:26):
My conversation with Melissa is coming up right after this,
Joining us now. She's a two time Grammy Award winner
and fifteen time nominee and Academy Award winner for Best
Original Song Again and lesbian rights activist, a mother, an author,
and a cancer survivor. She's got a star on the
(01:48):
Hollywood Walk of Fame. She crushed the national anthem at
the NWSL Championship game last year, and she recently paid
a visit to the secret Boston pup, the Lazy Nut tavern.
It's Melissa Athrage.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Hi, Melissa, Hello, Hello, Hello, how are you?
Speaker 1 (02:02):
I'm good, but I'm jealous you've been to the Lazy Nut.
I have only seen photos and videos. I've not gotten
the chance to go yet.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
It's an adventure, it really is.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
Did they make you drink milort?
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Well, you know what, I was working, so I wasn't drinking,
So okay, I know I watched them drink.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Yes, I could have taken credit for that. A bunch
of those scals came to Chicago and Wrigley for the
Red Stars game at Wrigley Field, and I introduced him
to the magical world of milort and they brought it
back to the Lazy Nut. So next time, when you're
not working, well, we'll make you do it. Let's talk
about your sports ties. Because I was so excited to
learn as I was researching for this that not only
(02:41):
are you a huge sports fan, but sports actually played
a big role in your big break as a musician.
So tell me about Verme's Bar in Pasadena and how
a friend from your women's soccer team actually was part
of the reason you got discovered.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Yes, it's crazy in Los Angeles. You just don't ever
know how it's going to happen. So I had moved
there in nineteen eighty two from Kansas. I grew up
in Leavenworth, Kansas, and I'd done a lot of playing,
and I got to LA and realized that there was
(03:15):
another ten million people trying to do what I was doing.
I wasn't unique, and nobody was paying for anybody to play.
Everybody was. You would buy your own tickets and you
would get like a gig once a month. And I
was like, well, I'm going to starve if I try
to do this. So I went to a women's bar
because I'm a lesbian, and I went to a women's
(03:37):
bar and saw that they had a piano in the corner,
and I asked if they had music, and they said, no,
that's from the steakhouse that used to be here. But hey,
do you want to do something? And so I started
playing in Long Beach for about five nights a week.
Then when that started to fizzle out, there was a
gal who said, hey, there's a bar in Pasadena. It's
(03:58):
called Verni. He's a horrible name of a bar, but
it was named after mouse. Long story, and I went
there and they they took me in and I would
play like three nights there and two nights in Long Beach,
and it was just this perfect thing. And on Sundays,
the girls from the soccer team, I think it cal
(04:18):
Tech would come in after they had a game and
they would play, and they were big fans and there
was always a big table and they were great tippers
and you know, they were wonderful. And one day they said,
do you have a cassette? And I had made this
silly demo and they said, because one of our coach's
(04:39):
husband is a music manager and that you know, and
you just you you take whatever anybody said. You're like, yes, okay,
this is fine. So I gave him a tape and
then the the wife came down and she loved it.
She had a great night and she went back and
she was like, look, you got to see this girl.
And he's like, I don't want to say, I don't
want to I don't want to go. So she finally
(04:59):
got him to come down. He loved it. He signed
me and he was my manager for thirty years. So, yes,
soccer everything. I just I'm very grateful for those women,
and yes, played a big part in my career.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
I'm not surprised to learn that a team of women
are the ones who sought out how to lift up
and help you rise. Along with their fun and enjoyment
of you. It wasn't just about that. It was about
let's help her now that we really enjoy I love that.
There's another really great lesson in how your first album
came together, kind of a surprising one from what we
often hear about the music industry. Your first attempt at
(05:38):
an album was actually rejected by Island Records because it
was too polished. We normally hear about artists that want
to be themselves and they make them more polished. But
instead they said, nope, we don't like that, we like
too you were, so you stripped it down to just
you and the music, and that first album gets nominated
for a Grammy. Were you surprised that they wanted you
to be more gritty, less polished.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
No, I was, and I hadn't. I had no idea
what I should do. I'd never made a record. I
barely made a demo, and I was playing solo in
this bar. And Chris Blackwell, who was the owner, he
was just the guy who ran Island Records. This is
back in the eighties, seventies and eighties, early nineties. There
(06:23):
were actually guys who loved music that would go find
it and sign it, and they were always looking for
new stuff, and Chris loved what he saw. He saw
me playing by myself, just in like jeans and a
T shirt in the corner. He loved it. He heard
like four songs that was all, and he says, I
(06:43):
want you on my label, and he flew off to
Jamaica wherever he went to, and I didn't see him
until I turned it, so I didn't know what to do.
I got a producer and this guy was from northern
California and he had done the way music was being
done back then was very synthesizers were starting and it
(07:07):
was very like produced and I didn't know how to do.
So we sort of The guy kind of popped up
my songs and I turned it in and Chris Blackwell
actually said, well I hate this, and I was like,
there you go. There was my chance, and I blew it.
But myself and the other two guys in the band
with me that I had put together, we were like, Okay,
(07:29):
what he wants is what he saw in the bar.
He saw a girl alone. So we went in and
in four days totally recorded the first album, just did
like three songs a day, boom boom boom, and mixed
it and then bang, here it is. He loved it,
and it's still to this day one of people's favorite albums.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
It's interesting how much you can be swayed by not
knowing what's expected and just being like, Okay, I guess
this is what you do when you make an album.
It's like when I first went to ESPN and for
my first TV gigs and got my hair and makeup done,
I looked like a fifty five year old New Jersey
reeltur and I was like, well, I guess this is
what I look like with a lot of makeup. Like
I just didn't have any idea that I could say
(08:11):
I don't really like that, or I don't think that's me.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
That's the thing about women helping women, And here were
you and I in these places that had formerly been
all men. I didn't know what to do. I didn't
know how to behave. I didn't know anything, and you're
just looking around trying to figure it out, and then
you fall on your face a couple of times and go, oh, okay,
this is what.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
I'm Okay, now I get it.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
Yeah, yeah, and now, And that's why we like to
help women. It's like, look, let me help you do
this because it's a rough road on your own.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
Yeah, you put out three albums before you came out
publicly as a lesbian at ninety three, and your first
album after coming out was your big breakthrough hit. Yes,
I am two mainstream, big radio hits come to my
window and I'm the only one. Can you make a
direct line between being publicly your full self and the
success that followed.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Well, yeah, I believe. I believe that what you put
out in the world comes back to you. So being
that open and honest people I think really related to it.
But this is nineteen ninety three, this is long before
social media, the internet was jazz starting, so that wouldn't
play a big part. This was me coming out and
(09:25):
slowly every little place, every town I played, every little
local newspaper would do an interview. It wasn't like I
came out and the whole world knew I was gay.
Little by little, they and I would find that people
would want to do articles and long articles with me
and give me much space. So actually the publicity that
(09:48):
I got coming out really helped bring this album to
the forefront. It took a while, this album for a
long time. It come to my window, had held the
record for being on the charts for the longest time.
It never I don't even think it ever broke the
top ten, but it was on the charts because it
just took that.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
It was like waves of people learning about it.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Yes, it is slowly, slowly. And the gay part was
a talking point and I ended up talking about being
gay for about five years just that's all I could
talk about.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
Yeah, I mean, it's a hook when you need to
separate yourself from the pack, and that's a scary hook
in ninety three when you're not sure how people will respond.
But to your point, it allows people to tell a
story beyond here's a song. See if you like it, it's
here's a song, and here's the woman behind it that
has a story to tell. Did it feel different to
you either writing that album or promoting that album. Did
(10:44):
you consider how people would receive your music through the
lens of your sexuality or the lyrics you were writing,
or the stories you were telling it anyway?
Speaker 2 (10:52):
Yeah, there was, of course, you know, the unknown. I'd
never there really had never been someone that came out
and didn't put out an album and like that, and
so I didn't know. I had no idea and I
would perform and what would end up happening is the
first section of people were just gazed, just losing their minds,
(11:15):
you know, and then the rest yeah, right, And it
was and I found that they were gathering they other
than the little bars they had in towns. There was
no place that everyone gathered at once, and it was
a It was very emotional to actually see that in
the audience and see people being themselves. But then also
(11:35):
to see straight people going oh, those are gay people,
you know, and and everyone kind of going, oh, well,
this is well, we like the same music. And that
that was very empowering to me saying, Okay, you know,
I've got both going on here. I'm not going to
just serve one or the other. And I've always kept
my well in the beginning, I don't now it's not
(11:57):
a big deal now to do gender specific, but back
then I was very just let it be they them,
and you guys just you know, take it however you want.
But it was it was scary, but it was great.
It was great.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
I think it's not a surprise when you see communities
rally around someone that speaks for and to them, particularly
the queer community. Women like in spaces where you often
feel like you're allowed to come, but it's not for you.
It's you get tired of that, and sometimes trying to
explain to men what it feels like to watch women
(12:35):
play professional sports, what it feels like to see women
be fully embodied and empowered and badass. It's just a
different experience for me than watching your favorite guy play
like You're getting a lot out of that. You want
to be him. You idolize them. He's awesome, he's richie's famous,
he's really successful, he's good at dunking great. It feels different.
You have a million examples of power and earnest and
(12:57):
authentic self in men across every space, and for women,
feels like there's just not as many places to watch
that unapologetically, and so I feel like music too. It
it feels different to feel spoken to and included and
pointed out, as opposed to just a part of it.
You know, one of the reasons you wanted to have
you on was to talk about your breast cancer diagnosis
(13:19):
and your reaction to that, because I do think the
community of people who have been through this speak to
each other in a way that feels really powerful of
like I've been there, I understand and it changed me.
So in two thousand and four, you were diagnosed. You know,
I just met with a friend a few weeks ago
who told me that she remembered her mammogram, and she
remembered the beginning of the follow up appointment that they
(13:40):
asked her to come to. But she still, years later,
can't recall anything that she was told. That day. After
she was told you have breast cancer. She went home
in a blur. She had to finish work, she had
to take calls and meetings, and then her husband got
home and said, how was your day, and she said,
not great. Actually she doesn't remember any of that. So
can you take me back to the moment that you
heard those words and got the news and your reaction
(14:02):
to it.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
It was a very slow I remember it in slow
motion because it was it started. I was in Canada,
I was on tour, and I had sort of I've
come to a point in my life where I'd gotten
my first divorce, my first relationship fell apart, I had
(14:26):
two kids. I was super stressed. The music industry was changing.
It was all There was no more singer songwriters or
rock and roll I didn't know what I was going
to do. I was I was unhappy. I had that
just stressed, unhappy life. And I remember looking up to
(14:48):
the heavens and saying, what what what do you want
from me? What do I do? What do I do now?
And that next morning, I woke up and was showering
and I found lump and was like, well, that's not
what I was talking about.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
Yeah, don't hand me something else more problems.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
And I found it and I remember touching it and
wondering why the world did I feel this yesterday? You know,
because it was it was big, and I I remember going,
wait a minute, this could this Because my father had cancer.
He died of cancer. My aunt, my grandmother was everywhere
in my family, and I slowly I came home the
(15:32):
next day. I was flying home anyway, and I had
like a few days off before I was supposed to
go to Boston actually, and I went to my doctor
and was like, I found this, and she's like, I'm
afraid I might know what this is. Sent me to
the radiologist the next day, knowing that I only had
(15:53):
so much time, and the radiologist was the was the
one who had helped with my children you know, did
the sonograms and the kids and stuff, so I knew her.
And she biopsy did, which was it was so dense
that she couldn't pull the thing out. She got to
(16:14):
literally put her foot up and out of me in bloods.
It's really a horrible experience. But she at that time,
because she was a friend, she said, look, I'm not
supposed to do this, but you know, I look at
these all day and I know what this is, and
I just want you to know that you're going to
be fine. And she goes, and this is the worst
(16:35):
that can happen to you, and she unbuttoned her blouse
and showed me her double mistectomy. I had no idea
that she had that. And she goes, this is the worst,
but you're not even there, you know, and you will
be fine. And just starting with that, just going okay,
whatever this journey is, I'm going to be fine. And
(16:56):
then I walked through it and it was. It was
indeed the most incredible thing that ever happened to me,
because I changed my life. I changed the stress. I
no longer let stress run my life that was going
to kill me. And I changed in my food habits,
my exercise just my state of mind. I used a
(17:18):
lot of cannabis that helped me. Here in California, we
have that. It was very medicinal and it really changed
me as a person, and I am now twenty one
years cancer free.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
We got to take a quick break. When we come back.
The rest of my conversation with Melissa Ethridge, I want
to talk about the two thousand and five Grammy Awards.
You were performing with Josh Stone. You sang a tribute
to Janis Joplin and you were bald. What were the
(17:52):
emotions heading into that performance and why did you choose
to be bald instead of wearing a wig.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Well, it's funny. My surgeon who took the lumps out
and took I had three separate surgeries to get everything out,
get the margins clear. It was in the left nodes,
but they were able to get it before it got
all the way in there. And and this doctor said,
so you're gonna need chemo. You're gonna need lots of
(18:19):
chemo dose dents. Uh. And so you're gonna be bald,
So you're gonna need a wig because no one wants
to see a bald rock star. This is what she
said to me. And I was like, what this just did?
I was like scary and weird. And then I when
I knew I was going to be toward the end
of the Treatments, when I knew I was going to
(18:39):
be on the on the Grammys, I asked my friends.
I was like, what do you think should I be bald?
I also had a stylist get me kind of a
handkerchief as swayed. I had that I was maybe gonna
wear that, and everything on my head made me so
hot because I was getting hot flashes because they chemo
(19:00):
puts you into menopause and and I was like, I
just I can't. I'm just I'm just gonna go bald.
And I remember telling the lighting director and every said,
I said, I'm going to be bald. So I don't
know if that changes how you're going to do anything.
And I just didn't want anybody to make fun of me.
(19:20):
And right before I went on my guitar player, he said,
he goes, Melissa, you don't know what you're about to do,
do you? And I said, I don't know what you mean,
and he goes, well, just watch And I went out.
And I still get a little choked up because the
audience was so warm and loving and they just just
(19:42):
received it so well and it was one of the
greatest moments of my life.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
Yeah, it actually inspired a song by India I Ree
I Am not my Heart No, Yeah, I love pretty powerful.
Speaker 2 (19:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:56):
You know, one of my best friends, unfortunately, was recently
diagnosed with multiple my law and she is going to
undergo a stem cell transplant in a couple months, and
she's going to lose her hair. And we were talking
the other day about if she wants to wear a
wig that looks like her, or wear a wig that's
like totally wacky and fun, or just go bald. And
she said the same thing about how she's already hot
all the time, and so she's a little worried about
(20:17):
this wedding. Do you have advice for her or for
others who are scared about that particular moment where everybody
will know that you're going through something. It will be
written all over your face and your hair.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
Yeah, it's okay. It's okay for everyone to know that.
It's okay for people to know that you're at a
point in your life where you're changing and you're working
on it, and you're working on health, and it's nothing
to be sad about. You are doing what you need
to do. And part of that weird shame about our
(20:50):
hair and what we look like is a part of
the problem of why we're sick. So time to let
that go. Time to know that we look gorgeous without
our hair or not. And I love it because sometimes
I see people bald women and I'm like, could be
a choice? Could be? You know, because I'm telling you,
(21:12):
losing my hair felt amazing. One. I love people rubbing
my head. That was really really I would get massages
and I'm just like, just rub my head. And I
would actually recommend just once in every woman's life to
shave her head, whether she's sick or not, but just
to shave her head because there's a lot of energy
(21:34):
and hair and you let it go and it's really
a great experience. And someday I'll go back to really
short hair. I'm looking forward to that.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
You've always written very personal song, songs about issues that
matter to you, songs about your life. Did your cancer
battle make it into your music?
Speaker 2 (21:52):
Oh yeah. The first album I made after that was
called The Awakening because it's less about being sick, because
that was just the symptom of the change that I
needed to make in my own spirit, in my own life.
And it's more about waking up to oh this, I'm
(22:15):
in charge of me. I can't. I got to be
okay first before I help anybody else. And so many
women we take care of everybody else. We want everyone
to be happy and then we'll be happy. And that's
a You keep doing that and you will get sick
because that's not how we're made. We're made to make
sure we are good, we are well, and that's the
(22:38):
only way we can help anybody else.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
Actually, Yeah, what's been the hardest part for you over
the course of the decades that you've been in the
public eye and had a voice and an agency of
standing up for things even when society might not be ready,
or maybe when the loudest voices might be trying to
shout you down. What's been the toughest part for you?
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Well, the toughest thing was probably just five years ago
when I lost my son to an opioid overdose, because
that's like, that just knocks you down and you don't
there's so much guilt and shame involved in that as
a parent that that can really really be hard, and
(23:20):
it was, and it was during the pandemic, so it
was a very very strange time. And what I've done
to help with that is to start the Etherage Foundation,
which is at the forefront now of providing funds for
research into plant medicine, into psychedelics and how they can
(23:43):
help and help with our emotional systems that lead to
pain relief and opioids within heroin and then fentanyl and death.
And so it's trying to change that. And there's a
lot of misinformation and a lot of people saying different things,
(24:04):
but I have a deep belief that as an alternative
to opioids, in helping with addiction, opioid use, disorder, all
these things, plat medicine can it really has a lot
of answers.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Yeah, I was really skeptical about it, to be honest
with you, and I think because it was so often
associated with folks who were presenting it in this sort
of hippie dippy cult like way. And when I listen
to doctors talk about the appropriate usage of it and
how it sort of takes the topography of your brain
that you've created over the years to help hide away
(24:39):
trauma or go around something instead of through it and
dealing with it. How it levels that out and you're
forced to go through the things that your body has
tried to protect you from, and that's the only way
to actually integrate them into the rest of your memory
and learning and get through them, process them, and move
past them. As soon as that was explained to me,
it made such sense, and having read a lot of
(25:01):
books of late for the book that I wrote, I
started to be much less judgmental about the things I
didn't understand, particularly when they were presented to me in
sort of a logical and thoughtful way as opposed to like,
come to my tent in the woods and I'll show
you the magic of ayahuasca. Right, But I love what
I love you said, because you know, Robin Roberts always says,
make your mess your message. It's easier said than done.
(25:24):
But if you can find a way to turn the
deepest of pain into something proactive where it feels like
you're making a change and helping at least something came
from it and you're not just just held down by
it hurts, and you are also choosing to make something
of it. And that's really powerful that you decided to
do that. I want to close our conversation with something fun.
(25:47):
So it's a speed round, a speed round for you
because there are too many questions and too little time.
What's the most nervous you've ever been for a performance?
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Singing the national anthem at the Old series Game seven
two thousand one, two thousand and one. I believe giants angels?
Speaker 1 (26:12):
Okay. Dream collaborator for an album or a live show
or a song.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
Wow, I've got a lot of my dreams have come true.
I did sing with Bruce Springsteen. I've sung with a
lot of people. Dream collab that kind of always changes.
I mean, it was always Barbara Streis him for a
long time, but I know she's never gonna sing with me,
so that took you know, But now it'd be like,
it'd be fun to do something like with Chapel Roone.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
I knew you were going to say that. I knew it.
I knew it.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
She's fun. That would be too much people's heads would
explain exactly.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
I'd like to see you doing Pink Pony Club. I'd
like to see it. I was at a show last
night actually in the lead singer said, at this point,
I have lived out all of my dreams and dreams
I never had. At this point, I'm just stealing other
people's dreams, like things he had never imagined he could do.
He was doing so now he figured they must be
somebody else's that he stole. Who's the musician who's talent
(27:08):
you're most envious of? Alive or dead?
Speaker 2 (27:10):
Peter Gabriel made some music in the eighties and the
nineties that I really wished I was that sort of
it was. It was when tech and music was meeting,
and he did it so well, and he wrote in
Your Eyes, which I think is the greatest song ever,
and I'm always jealous. I always go, God, I wish
I've written that song.
Speaker 1 (27:30):
Yeah, it was like tech plus mysticism. Somehow he made it.
He made it mesh in a way that like felt right, Yeah,
what's the thing you've gotten to do in your career
that still feels like a pinch me. I can't believe
that happened.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
Moment well, singing with Bruce Springsteen, Yeah, yeah, that was
like bench main. I didn't want it to end. I
listened to it and I can still hear my heart
beat as I'm introducing him, you know, telling everyone, oh
my God, I get to sing with Springstein, that's probably one.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Yeah. What about the goal or accomplishment you're working toward
now in life, career or otherwise.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
Oh, now, it's about longevity. Now, it's about you know,
when you when you reach your goals, when you when
your dreams come true, you realize that it was never
the dream, it was never the thing and getting the
thing or doing the thing, it was the journey to
the thing is the most fun, absolutely, And I've done
enough that I know that for sure. So now I'm like, oh,
(28:31):
let me put these dreams out in front of me,
let me put this goal. But let me take my time,
you know, let me take my time going through the process,
because I know when I get there, I'm going to
want something else. It's gonna because it's about the dream.
It's about keep moving. So my goal is to be
(28:52):
in older older and older older age and still performing
and rocking and making music and writing about my life
and talking to you know, wonderful young women like you
and just doing that. That's my that's the goal. Now.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
It's wild how many very successful people have the same
message about what it feels like on the other side
of success or the thing they always wanted, and it's
impossible to impart that to people who are just getting started.
You can never explain to them that the process of
getting there is the thing too, because they're so hungry
to prove to themselves and to others that they've made
(29:32):
it or they've done it. There's a great song Hosier
and Brandy Carlisle Damage Gets Done, that I think like
hits it perfectly. There's this line about the it's the
comforts that make us feel numb, and he writes about
we'd go out with no way to get home, we'd
sleep on someone's floor and wake up feeling like a millionaire.
And you do remember, looking back now at your twenties,
(29:53):
when you were broke, you weren't sure if you were
ever going to make it at anything. You and your
friends were sort of like, who are we what are
we going to do? We're going to pay rent? And
now when you're successful and rich later, you look back,
you're like, man, that was fun.
Speaker 2 (30:06):
Fun at the wanting, the desire, the someday that yeah,
And so I try to keep that as much as
I can.
Speaker 1 (30:15):
It's hard in the moment when you're like, nobody, I
really do need to pay rent, but it is. You
can romanticize it later when it all works out.
Speaker 2 (30:23):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (30:24):
All right, last question for you, since this is living beyond,
if you look at Melissa Ethriche beyond breast cancer, you'll find.
Speaker 2 (30:31):
What, Oh, a woman having a great time in this
life right now, just loving every moment, every moment. Yeah,
I love that. Thank you so much, Thank you, Sarah anytime.
Speaker 1 (30:54):
Good Game with Sarah Spain is an iHeart women's sports
production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. Good
find us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
you get your podcasts. Production by Wonder Media Network, our
producers are Alex Azzie and Misha Jones. Our executive producers
are Christina Everett, Jesse Katz, Jenny Kaplan, and Emily Rutterer.
(31:14):
Our editors are Emily Rutter, Britney Martinez, Grace Lynch, and
Gianna Palmer. Our associate producer is Lucy Jones and I'm
your host Sarah Spain
Host
Sarah Spain
Popular Podcasts
Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club
Welcome to Bookmarked by Reese’s Book Club — the podcast where great stories, bold women, and irresistible conversations collide! Hosted by award-winning journalist Danielle Robay, each week new episodes balance thoughtful literary insight with the fervor of buzzy book trends, pop culture and more. Bookmarked brings together celebrities, tastemakers, influencers and authors from Reese's Book Club and beyond to share stories that transcend the page. Pull up a chair. You’re not just listening — you’re part of the conversation.
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com