October 17, 2024 • 36 mins
Gotham FC beat reporter Jenna Tonelli joins Sarah to talk through the BOS Nation unveiling, why there has been less parity in the NWSL this season, and how Gotham’s superteam put the pieces together. Plus, the return of No Dumb Questions AND the Good Game Hall of Fame.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, where old balls,
new balls, steel balls, cold balls is the new One fish,
two fish, redfish, bluefish. Thanks Frankie de la Creta. On
today's show, we'll be talking to NWSL reporter Jennet Tanelli
about the continued outrage over NWSL Boston's big name reveal,
Gotham's Olympic star power, and the growing gap between NWSL clubs.
(00:21):
Plus Game three of the WNBA Finals, more fallout from
Canada's drone Gate, and an update on an important shot.
It's all coming up right after this Welcome back slices.
Here's what you need to know today in WNBA Finals News.
(00:41):
We're recording this Wednesday while I get ready for the
big Women's Sports Foundation gala in New York City. I
will no doubt be watching Game three on my phone
from my seat at the gala, so we'll have plenty
to say about the game, and we'll get you ready
for Game four tomorrow. For now, congrats to the New
York Liberty on their big win Wednesday. How about that
shot and that other play and could you believe that
(01:05):
one moment? Whoof more to come on all that tomorrow
In other WNBA news. Ahead of Game three of the Finals,
Liberty star Brianna Stewart said that her wife Marta, a
retired former pro herself, received a threatening anti gay email
following the Liberty's Game one loss against the Links. Per ESPN,
Stewart reported the incident to the Liberty and the league,
with her wife Marta filing a report with the police.
(01:27):
Here's what Stuart told the ESPN's Malika Andrews.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
You know, sometimes people are taking things a little bit
too far and too out of context, and Martin had gotten.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Homophobic death threats.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
A few other things have happened, But just making sure
that we're doing as much as possible to continue to
aware or make sure that our team and the league
is aware of the situation and continue to keep everybody safe.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
It's all just a reminder that the toxicity experienced by
players this season isn't just reserved for online harassment Elsewhere
in pro hoops news and if yousa call youer and brand,
Stewart's Unrivaled League keeps making headlines. The league and TNT
Sports have entered a multi year media rights partnership, starting
with Unrivaled's inaugural season Live games will air exclusively on
(02:11):
TNT and True TV, and all games will also stream
on Max. TNT will broadcast games on Mondays and Fridays,
and move to True TV on Saturdays. That means more
than forty five primetime regular season matchups will be featured
three nights a week across TNT sports platforms. We are
so here for It. Unrivaled tips off on January seventeen,
(02:32):
twenty twenty five to the NWSL. Fallout continues after the
NWSL Boston team revealed its name Boss Nation in a
marketing campaign centered on the idea of too Many Balls,
including a video that shouted out the Patriots, Red Sox,
Brew and Celtics, and Revolution all men's teams while conspicuously
ignoring the PWHL, Boston Fleet and other women's teams. After
(02:54):
reactions ranging from unimpressed to outraged, the too Many Balls
video has just about disappeared from the Internet, and the
ad agency that was hired for the campaign wiped all
involvement from their Instagram page. Don't worry, we saved a
copy for posterity. The campaign was also condemned for being transphobic,
including by the Seattle Rains Quinn, who is non binary.
The midfielder commented quote feels transphobic Yike's end quote on
(03:18):
the brand rollout video posted on Instagram by the NWSL
and NWSL Boston. It's not clear how it happened, whether
a moderator hit the post or it was the Instagram algorithm,
but that comment from Quinn was no longer visible. Later
in the day, they followed up with quote, love how
my comment was quote unquote hidden by Instagram calling out
transphobia shouldn't be hidden. This doesn't represent the league and
(03:38):
it is such poor messaging end quote. This is sure
to be a case study in marketing and sports business
courses for years to come. The question is whether it'll
be a study of failure or of the ability to
pivot and respond to feedback. It's up to Boss Nation
leadership now dig in or make a change. The team
did issue an apology on Wednesday, saying, in part quote,
(04:00):
we fully acknowledged that the content of the campaign did
not reflect the safe and welcoming environment we strive to
create for all, and we apologize to the LGBTQ plus
community and to the trans community in particular, for the
hurt that we caused. Quote. The team went on to
thank fans for holding them accountable and committed to do
better moving forward. We'll discuss this further later in our
(04:21):
interview with Jenna, also an NWSL news The Off Season,
a reality TV docuseries, dropped a sneak peak trailer this
week ahead of its official release this Friday. You guys,
remember we told you about this. Partly produced by Midge Purse.
We could not be more excited to rot on our
couch watching all six episodes in one sitting. Here's the
premise Heading into the twenty twenty four season, eleven NWSL
(04:43):
players spent two weeks in one house. Take a listen.
But dating is honestly so hard in the soccer world.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
The gays, oh my gosh, there's so much drama.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
The fans love it.
Speaker 4 (04:55):
They'll make like a chart of all like the lesbian connection.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
I'm wondering if there's even a team that doesn't have
a dating couple in it.
Speaker 5 (05:02):
What if they bring it on the field, Like what
if this happens?
Speaker 1 (05:04):
What if that happens. Honestly, everyone's been very professional that
I've seen. That's a lie. I just lied because I forgot. No,
I'm sorry. No, they haven't it has messed up teams,
footy and gay shit. Sign me up and more NWSL
news and you can hear by my tone you can
tell what's happening already another retirement. Angel City defender Merrett
(05:28):
Matthias announced via Instagram that this NWSL season will be
her last as a pro soccer player. Her caption pretty
much summed it up. She wrote, quote I came, I
saw a shit up end quote legend, and that she
did because Matthias has been as staple in the NWSL
as long as it's existed. In fact, she played in
the league's first game ever back in twenty thirteen. She's
(05:50):
got three championships and three NWSL shields on her resume,
and also played for FC Kansas City, Seattle Rain, and
North Carolina Courage. Over the course of her career, played
a big role with the Players Association as well, helping
orchestrate the league's new CBA. In her Instagram post, she
noted that fans can celebrate her career at the club's
last match on October twentieth, when Angel City takes on
(06:11):
the Utah Royals at Bemo Stadium. The game will miss you, Merit,
but we're all looking forward to the post retirement hangs.
Not very many people that are a better hang than
Merritt Matthias. In other soccer news, Canada Soccer has announced
that an interim coaching team will lead the squad for
its upcoming October twenty fifth friendly against Spain, rather than
a traditional singular head coach. This comes after the major
(06:33):
drone spying scandal that was revealed during the Paris Olympics.
Head coach Bev Priestman was suspended and sent home from
the games. Now she remains suspended but on payroll during
this ongoing external Canada Soccer commissioned review into the scandal,
and an addition, has been banned by FIFA from taking
part in any soccer related activities for the next year.
It's time for another edition of No Dumb Questions. Sarah
(07:00):
Reel wrote in to say, I have a dumb question
I should know the answer to since I've been listening
to Spain's teaching since the trifecta, but don't. Why is
the WNBA season scheduled the way it is. It begins
so soon after the close the nc DOUBLEA season, it
seems logical to start a bit later. Give the draft
picks time post March Madness and then have the postseason
go later into the fall. If we overlap a bit
(07:21):
with NHL NBA preseason, who cares? Was it set this
way to keep momentum going from March Madness or is
it just tradition and we're not willing to change. First
of all, Sarah, no dumb questions. It is such a
tight turnaround from the NCAA tourney to the draft to
the preseason, and with expansion, there will continue to be
a desire for more regular season games, making scheduling even tougher.
(07:42):
But ultimately, I think you hit the nail on the
head with the overlap bit. Not only is it tough
for the WNBA to compete with the NFL, the deeper
they go into October and November. Now they've got NHL
NBA College football, college hoops, and it's not just battling
for eyeballs, it's battling for television spots. It's a big
deal for the DOUBLEBA to get prime spots with TV
partners like ESPN and ABC, and that's tough to do
(08:05):
once all those other leagues and sports get going in earnest.
Even with the current schedule and the Olympic break this season.
The WNBA finals games so far have gone up against
Thursday night and Sunday football plus MLB Playoffs for Game three, which,
by the way, I've seen some folks complain about those
games happening smack dab in the middle of NFL Thursday
or Sunday, but ESPN ABC don't have football rights those days,
(08:27):
so that's when they've got airtime and want to put
up a competitive product. It's also worth mentioning that the
league has to schedule round those Olympic and Feeble World
Cup breaks during certain years, which makes it tougher. Expansion
feels inevitable. We already know regular season next year will
be forty four games, but I think they're going to
try to keep it to a mostly summer sport as
best they can for now because of, like I said,
(08:47):
competing eyeballs and competing TV spots. Also, while we're on
the topic of scheduling and the WNBA, Alex has some
actually rare positive news in rescheduling to report.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
So the mnba's Minnesota Timberwolves have rescheduled a preseason game
that was supposed to be played tomorrow, aka the same
night that the Links are hosting Game four of the
WNBA Finals, but the Pimberwolves moved their game to tonight instead.
While this may not seem like a big deal, there
is actually a very long history of WNBA teams getting
bumped from their own venues during the playoffs, either for
(09:23):
MNBA preseason games or for other events. In twenty twenty one,
the Phoenix Mercury were bumped from home court during Round
one of the playoffs because of a Maluma concert. Then
in the semifinals, it was Disney on Ice that bumped
them for their first home game, and it initially looked
like they would get bumped for their second game too,
until the Phoenix Suns and La Lakers agreed to move
their game up. But that was a super last minute
(09:45):
decision that came at the eleventh hour, and honestly, twenty
twenty one wasn't an outlier. There were a few years
there Diana Trozi and co. Played more of their home
playoff games not actually at home, and I get it,
venue scheduling is tough, but you have to out the
Timberwolves for being proactive here and making sure that this
did not become a thing.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
We love it, We love good positive rescheduling news. We
got to take a quick break. When we come back.
It's Jenna Toanelly talking NWSL. She covers the NWSL with
a focus on Gotham FC and the US women's national team,
with bylines and sports illustrated to equalize her esp Nation,
(10:25):
the New York Post and more. She's a diehard Buffalo
Bills fan and she'll take her defense of Candy Corn
with her to the grave. It's Jenna to Nelly, what's up, Jenna.
Speaker 5 (10:35):
Oh my gosh, you nailed it. That's me to a t.
Thank you so much for having me and for that
amazing introduction.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
There is so much to get to today, including the
team that you focus on, Gotham FC, and we're going
to get to it. But boy, did Boss Nation bump
those conversations off the top news stories today. I guess
you could really say they grabbed the women's soccer community
by the balls, Jenna, or god, as a friend said
this morning, their balls deep in feed. So let's go
(11:02):
through this piece by piece in your opinion and also
what you've seen from players and fans. Let's start with
the name. It's an anagram of Bostonian. What do you
think of Boss Nation.
Speaker 5 (11:14):
Yeah, I mean I kind of see where they were
going with the anagram. I kind of like where their
heads at. I love a name that like really reflects
the space and the area and like the history of
the place where a team is. But I think they
missed the mark on the name here. I think Boston
and just New England in general is just a place
(11:34):
that is so rich in history and sports history, and
there was probably a lot more than they could have
pulled on. And I actually saw a couple of people
on Twitter saying they should be like the Boston Coven
or love that which is, and I love the Boston Coven.
I was like, that's.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
Incredible, wicked Boston, Yes, so.
Speaker 5 (11:54):
Good, exactly exactly. So I think they did miss the
mark a little bit on the name, although, as you
alluded to, not the most egregious part of that no
means no.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
I I just don't think it makes a lot of sense.
It sounds more like a supporter group being Nation. It
makes me think of like Hugo Boss. It made a
lot of other people think of girl Boss, which is
not good or Boss Bitch. Also not something people are
really doing these days, and it's not really clever or
creative or fun right, it's just not very interesting. There's
(12:24):
I was exchanging texts with my friends Colley and Joshua
have been on the show together before, and we came
up with lots of funny ones like you know Duncan
FC or how about that Apple's FC? I think josh said,
Masshole United. I mean these are not real, but like,
because they made it so boring, it left us searching
for some fun and I think that's part of the
problem with it. Now. The name alone would have been
(12:44):
a meh if not for the brand rollout that really
pushed people away from the whole launch. First of all,
the website too many balls dot com and the and
the brand video that seemed to have so many issues,
not the least of which was a rature of existing
female teams, both historically and current in the Boston area.
(13:05):
A real emphasis on making everything about men's sports, and
then here we are and you're ready for us, as
if women's sports wasn't already established enough to thrive and
celebrate on its own. And then the transphobic issue that
people came up with, the emphasis on genitalia and the
whole pun being on the things between your legs. What
have you heard and what was your opinion on the
(13:26):
too many balls rollout?
Speaker 5 (13:27):
Yes, well, I mean you definitely covered a lot of it.
I mean I think it just missed the mark on
so many levels. It was extremely exclusionary, you know, with
the language around male, Genitalian. Just centering a women's sports
team around men. It was just very strange, and I
(13:48):
think again it just ignores this history that Boston does this.
I mean, have we had the Boston Breakers previously in
the NWSL, We have you know, professional women's Hockey League
team already, Boston Fleet. I believe they're called in the area.
And it's just it was very disappointing again and it's
also almost similar to the name itself that it just
(14:09):
doesn't quite dip into this rich history and excitement around
women's sports that they could have really keyed into. Because
people are excited for this team. And you know something
I actually I was tweeting through it yesterday, some jokes
and some thoughts, but you know, one of the things
that I put out there was, you know, we as
a you know, a women's soccer community, we hate this
(14:30):
because we care because we want so badly for this
team to do well and to grab fans, you know,
both existing and new fans that are out there to
support this club. You know, Boston has a great history
with women's soccer and women's sports, and this just was
just so disappointing on so many levels. And it's disappointing,
and we're upset because we all care and we want
(14:52):
it to do as best it could be. And I
just don't understand. You know, I get it. You know,
they had a media agency. They came up with something
that they thought would be think in their own post
that I saw, actually your producer Alex put up they
called it wildly provocative, and I guess you could call
it that, and I, you know, I see that they're
trying to get a conversation going, but this was the
(15:13):
wrong conversation. And I'm just surprised that nobody in the
room thought, eh, hey, you know, maybe we should consider
other directions.
Speaker 4 (15:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
I think your point is a good one, because you know,
in established men's leagues when teams that are not ours
trip up, we love it. We are like whoop see,
especially Boston. Boston is such a fun place to hate, right.
Speaker 5 (15:35):
Oh, I'm a New Yorker, so yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
But instead, because in the women's sports world, the rising
tide lifts all boats because we want growth.
Speaker 6 (15:44):
And.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
You know, for Iron just sharpened by having other teams
come and push teams to spend more and invest more
and be more creative and be better. We are as
a whole community rooting for them. We're like Tyra Banks
on America's Next we were rooting for you. We're all
rooting for you. And then when this happens, I think
somebody posted like this is an impressive thing. When the
(16:07):
entire women's sports, women's soccer community can get together and
hate the same thing, it's really bringing us together. But
it's disappointing. Now. We've seen teams double back in the past,
including Racing Louisville, which was going to be Proof Louisville FC,
but pivoted after an underwhelming response. We saw in the
PWHL there were copyrights that were found in trademarks that
were found and unearthed, and then when they got to
(16:28):
the public and weren't well received, they also want a
different direction. So do you think there's a chance that
Boston will rethink this?
Speaker 5 (16:34):
I sure hope. So I think I'm inclined to think yes,
because I've seen them take down a lot of the
videos and the posts, the website and actually the domain
name too many balls dot com is back up for
sale now.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
Available, y'all.
Speaker 7 (16:50):
Yeah, So, so signs point to some sort of reconsideration
of at least the messaging, you know, and again with
the name, it.
Speaker 5 (17:00):
Is just so meh. But there's there's so much time.
They have, months and months that they could take to
just go back to the drying board and redo this
and have additional input in and you know, bring in
some of these former players who you know made say
Tory Houston, Sam UIs, especially sam Us, I mean, you
know New Englander, the US Sisters top New Englander soccer players.
(17:26):
So I think that there's definitely room for improvement, and
I the signs look like they're going to take it
under invisement, and I sure hope they do.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
Sam Ewis tweeted out as a Massachusetts native, I really
want NWSL Boston to succeed. I also want to shout
out p WHL Boston, bean down RFC and go renegades
as existing women's pro sports teams here to support and
eight thirty eight Underscore Carlisle wrote, imagine fumbling the unveiling
of a Boston women's soccer team so badly that you
made Sam Ewis mad, which I think is a very
(17:57):
good point, and I think you're right, Sam call number one. Yes,
Sam should be called number one, and a handful of
other players. I think it's a pretty homogeneous ownershipship group,
a lot of them at backgrounds and men's sports, which
might be why they went this way. I think it's
time to reach out to people in the women's space
who are deeply embedded in women's sports and know that
people will be on your side if you listen and change.
(18:18):
It will be embarrassing, but far less embarrassing than digging
your heels and sticking with this and then having to
redo it a couple of years down the line when
it's already made things so much worse for you. So, okay,
if they stick with this name in this branding, or
even if they change and adjust based on feedback, what
do you think that they can do in the immediate
future to make Boston fans and women's soccer fans in
(18:39):
general feel confident about their leadership and their decision making
going forward. Because Alex and I talked about this yesterday.
The fear here is that if this is the lens
through which you're looking at a naming and branding, what
lens are you looking through for a full team and
operations and future.
Speaker 5 (18:56):
It's a great point. I mean, I think there was
a good start today. They did release an apology, especially
about the messaging of the marketing campaign, so I think
that is always a great start, and they acknowledge that,
you know, it was not the right direction, and especially
with some of the transphobic undertones. So I'm very glad
that that was posted. But I think, you know, women's
sports right now, and especially in the NWSL, is at
(19:17):
such an interesting point where it's still so you know,
it's still growing, and you have the chance to make
a huge impact and help grow this game at a
time where it's growing in leaps and bounds like we've
not seen before, but still tap into that rich history
and people who have been here and can help you
direct that. So it's it's unfortunate that that didn't seem
(19:41):
to happen here, but I hope that they will now
take some of the feedback that they've gotten, go back
have these conversations with the sam Uises of the world
and try to come up with an idea that is
going to bring together, like I was saying before, existing fans,
but also new fans, because I think this marketing campaign,
if I try to take a step back and say, okay,
(20:02):
like what were they thinking, does it maybe somebody who
doesn't really know too much about women's sports in Boston
and they see this campaign and they go, oh, yeah,
you know what, there really are a lot of men's
teams but not a lot of women's teams. Okay, I
get that, you know, I can see where maybe the
line of thinking was, but that but you but it
just so missed the mark on any fan, you know,
(20:26):
being interested in this team. I just would sincerely hope
that they can take a step back and they can
say we hear you were listening, and we're going to
you know, change X y Z. And also I think
it's really important that they you know, that they show
that they do take fan feedback and because these are
the people that are going to come to your games
(20:46):
and they're going to pay for tickets and they are
going to buy your merch and you know, sports is
for the fans. So if you're not listening to the fans,
then you you know you're not gonna have a successful franchise.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
Well, if there's anything Boston can do, it's reach back
into their history, brag about their winning culture. And I
think there's ways to do both things in a way
that also centers centers women. So we look forward to
the second round. You could do it Spas Nation. Absolutely,
Let's get to NWSL broadly, this league is known for parody,
but this season there is a big gap between first
(21:18):
and last. What to what do you attribute that gap?
Speaker 5 (21:21):
Coaching? I really think that we have seen this league
take a big step forward in terms of coaching. It's
if you look at the coaches of the top four teams.
You know Gotham, what one Carlo Samros was able to
do with with Gotham. You know, he coached in Spain,
he coached in England, he came over here and he
really put a unique style on that team. Black Gowandanowsky,
(21:44):
who you know obviously didn't have the best tenure as
a national team manager, but if you look back on
his league management, it's just leaps and bounds ahead of
so many other folks. Uh seb Hines over in Orlando,
I think has done a fantastic job over there as
well Washington Spirit bringing over the former Barcelona coach. So
I really think the difference this year has has been coaching.
(22:06):
If you look at some of the other teams, you know,
Utah Royals had had some turnover and they're coaching. You know,
some other teams had some kind of newer coaches to
the league or you know, I hadn't been around before.
So to me, that's the number one difference between those
top five juggernaut teams is you know, bringing in some
really talented, you know, big resume coaches that have been
(22:29):
able to put their mark on these teams in a
unique way.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
I would even argue, being as biased as I am
from Chicago, that Louren Donaldson, the job that he's done
in Chicago getting them to be a playoff team despite
a number of factors, is impressive. Eight points separate the
number one Orlando Pride and the number four k C Current.
Then there's a ten point drop off to fifth place,
where the North Carolina Courage are. Do you consider that
top four tier the true contenders or are there any
(22:54):
lower seated teams that you could see primed for an upset?
Speaker 5 (22:57):
I mean, the thing, even though the parody has not
been as it has in the past, and the NWSL
it's still a league where anything could happen. I mean,
look at Portland's upset over Orlando, which, to be fair,
Orlando had clinched the shield and you know now they're
going to do a little bit of rotation and look
towards the playoffs. But it is still a league where
anything can happen. And I think your point about Chicago
is actually really important. I was just talking to some
(23:20):
of my colleagues at Sports Illustrated about Chicago specifically because
I've been so impressed with that team. A lot of
people think of that team, They're like, oh, they just
have mouse wantson and a listena or and that's it,
But that is so not true. I think Lauren has
done a fantastic job with that team, and it's been
a team where each individual player has truly stepped up
at different moments when they're needed and has propelled them
(23:41):
to a playoff position. So I wouldn't be surprised to
see a Chicago restoroce or a North Carolina Courage get
an upset those last two playoff spots. Portland Thorne's of
as you're in there right now. I don't see those
two teams upsetting any of the top four, but again
it's it's possible.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
Yeah, last year Gotam one out of the sixth seed,
the whole thing, so right, you just you just never know. Hey,
speaking to Gotham, I want to talk about them because
that's your main beat.
Speaker 5 (24:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:12):
Seven Olympians, six of them gold medalists with Team USA.
How has this Gotham team handled balancing egos and expectations,
keeping everybody happy, getting everyone in the ball, all the
usual super team issues. How have they done that this year?
Speaker 5 (24:26):
Gotham has been a team this year that has relied
extensively on its deep bench. They are playing multiple competitions
regular season. The CONCA calf Women's Championship, they blamed, the
Challenge Cup. They played in the what's it called the
Summer Cup with the finals in October, so I always
(24:46):
get I'm like, oh, it's a Summer Cup, but it's
in October. So I think that they had This has
allowed the team to get a lot of people playing time,
and you've seen a lot of different combinations, especially defensively.
We've seen a lot of different combinations back there with
Emily Sonnet Hearna Davidson, Matane Manny Freeman and just you know,
(25:07):
making sure that everybody is on the same page and
contributing to the team. And something I find very interesting
about Gotham and their style is that they you know,
you when you watch them on the field, They're rotating
positions quite a lot. You'll see Neilie Martin drop back
and you know, in like a defensive position, or you'll
see you know, Tierna Davis and like push up high centrally,
(25:28):
and it's it's just a team that everybody knows not
only their role, but their teammates roles, so they're able
to slot in when needed. And that's also been a
significant boost to Gotham this season, is that they all
understand what they're supposed to be doing and then they
execute on it. I also credit Yayali Ever Bush West
and the general manager and Juan Carlos the coach, to
(25:50):
have created an environment where I think a lot of
these players are really thriving and playing some of their
best soccer. It's it's been incredible to see. I mean
I talk the other day, I put out an article
on my personal substack about Delaney she In. She is
a midfielder who has started all but one game for
Golf of this season and flies completely under the radar,
(26:12):
but she's been integral to that team and to that
midfield So I think just giving everybody opportunities and having
players earn their opportunities and just letting them shine and
be creative on the field. You know this is Roosevelt
has been playing amazing this season, getting a lot of
club minutes, which you know we don't always see for
Rose Emily Sonnet I think has started every shield missed
(26:34):
one game this season because of yellow card accumulation this weekend.
But it's just been incredible to see what this team
has done and it's really worked. And people were skeptical
because with the super team, you never know, but it's
really worked.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
You mentioned a couple of the unsung heroes like Delaney
she and where can people read about them? You've said
you've you've written a bit about them.
Speaker 5 (26:53):
Yeah, so, I recently on my substack Jenna sources linked
to it in my Twitter bio and Instagram bio, I
did an in depth dive on Delaney Shehan. I also
think that Yasmine Ryan has been an incredible player for
Gotham a winger forward. She's got four goals for assists
on the regular season and that's not even going into
(27:13):
the Summer Cup or the CONCACAF tournament. And I did
a piece on her earlier this year in Hudson River Blue,
which is a local New York City website that covers
primarily NYCFC but also Gotham as well. I think she's
been fantastic. And also Neelie Martin midfielder who anybody who
(27:34):
knows me knows. I'm obsessed with the fact that in
the final last year she had to go into goal
because many Hawk got a red card in the dying
minutes and that's just my favorite bit of Gotham lore
these days. But she's also just an incredible midfielder and
her positioning on the field and her ability to connect
passes has just been also crucial, crucial, crucial for Gotham
the season.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
All right, Jennas sources sub stack is where you can
find that, and she links to it in her Twitter bile,
which we'll put in our show notes. Last question, quick
about Gotham clinched the first playoff home game in history.
What does that mean for this team, especially as they're
trying to win back to back championships.
Speaker 5 (28:09):
It means so much. And you know, of course, you
you know, the fans want to see another championship win.
But I think for you know, for me, as somebody
who was a longtime Sky Blue fan started covering the
team then they became Gotham, saw this whole transition from
playing at Rutgers University in New Jersey to playing at
one of the best soccer stadiums in North America. It's
just been incredible to see that growth. And I think
(28:31):
for the players, you know, some of them are newer
to the team, some of them have been there for
a long time. I think Mandy Freeman has been there
since twenty seventeen. I believe she was drafted there, so
has just really you know this, it's just such a
marker of how far this team has come. That in
their entire history, they've never had a home playoff game
and to be able to do that at Red Bull
Arena and have that celebration with the fans and for
(28:54):
the players to have contributed to the growth of this
team is just so important and it just such a
huge mart of how far they've come.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
Yeah, there's been a lot of drama in the NWSL
in recent years, whether it was serious stuff like toxic
coaching or forced ownership overhauls or lawsuits, to just dramatic
changes in revenue and investment and ownership groups and kind
of established some haves or have nots. Gotham is a
great example of a team that was a have not.
It was mocked at times in the past in the
(29:22):
Sky Blue FC years subpar resources and facilities, but they
underwent a hugely successful rebranding ahem, Boss Nation. They got
new leadership last year, they became a championship winning team
on the field. What can other teams in the league
learn from the sky Blue to Gotham transition.
Speaker 5 (29:42):
I think the thing to me that sticks out the
most is that ownership and the investors and the team
and the ownership put their money where their mouth was.
But more than that is that they brought in a
leader like Yayell to put that vision into place. And
I think and I think it takes both things. It
(30:02):
takes money because clearly, as we've seen with the Boss
Nation money, money isn't always going to get to where
you need to be. But I think it's it's the
investment and the trust and bringing in somebody who who cares,
who knows, And it's in every conversation I've ever had
with Yayel, you know, we always talk about, well, these
are the things I didn't have when I was a player,
and so what are the things that I know that
(30:24):
players need to succeed? What do players want? And just
having that lens as a former player to manage this
team I think has been everything. And you know, one
of the things that she said to me was, you know,
players want to be in a place where they're supported
and they can play and be their best sells. Whether
that means they're starting, they're on the bench, their wave, whatever,
it means that they were given the opportunity and they
(30:47):
were given the support that they needed to be at
their best. And I think you really see that with Gotham,
and so I really do credit what Yayelle has been
able to do with this team and the fact that
ownership put their trust and money.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
Yeah, I could not agree more. It is money, of course,
it is investment, but listening to the right people who
tell you where to put that money, how to spend it,
and how to do the things that will matter to
the athletes that make them want to stay, that make
them want to play hard, that make them want to
fight for Your team and your brand is massive, and
it's been really cool to see that happen for the
(31:22):
Gotham side and a lesson for a lot of other teams. Jenna,
thanks so much for the time. We look forward to
hearing more from you as the season wraps up and
the playoffs start.
Speaker 5 (31:31):
Thank you so much for having me. It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (31:35):
We got to pay the bills when we come back.
Let's take a trip down memory lane and spin a
tale about mister Purple Rain. Hey that run. That's next.
Welcome back Slices. With Games three and four of the
WNBA Finals in Minneapolis, it felt like a great time
to add a legendary links story to the hallowed halls
(31:59):
of the Good Game Hall of Fame. Yes, the Good
Game Hall of Fame, where we celebrate women's sports lore,
the kind of legendary stories that we should all know
by heart. The way we can you know immediately picture
Tom Brady Hammered throwing the Lombardi Trophy on a boat
in the Buck Super Bowl Parade, or the way we
can recite Kevin Durant' you the REALVP speech to his mom.
(32:21):
We got some catching up to do in women's sports.
So grab another plaque and find a good place on
the wall because we've got another inductee. Go with me.
Back to twenty eighteen. The Super Bowl was in Minneapolis
and Link's legend and four time WNBA champ Lindsay Whalen,
was showing me around town for an espnW feature. We
went to some of her favorite coffee shops, bars, and hotels,
(32:42):
and at one stop she told me an epic tale
of the entire Links team celebrating their twenty fifteen championship
win with none other than Minnesota Links superfan Prince. Here's
that story I.
Speaker 4 (32:55):
Want to talk about. Twenty fifteen. You win the WNBA championship.
Prince is a huge of the team, comes to your
game and invites you all over to his house.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
It was unbelievable.
Speaker 6 (33:04):
We so we win the championship and it was in
Game five against Indiana. You know, tough series, tough season.
Speaker 1 (33:11):
We win.
Speaker 6 (33:11):
So the confetti's coming down and we're in the locker
room and we got the champagne going and our GM
comes in and he screams out. And after this we're
going to Paisley Park. You know, Prince is doing a
concert for us, so he was on the keyboard right
as I walked in. It's just like one of those
kind of surreal things that I'll never forget. And then
he played well into the night. I think he played
(33:32):
till four or five in the morning. At the end
of the night, he was riding his bike around in
the parking lot. We get our logo on his big
screen behind the stage. Congratuations links twenty fifteen champs.
Speaker 1 (33:42):
I'd like to think that when you.
Speaker 4 (33:44):
Guys won the title, he was sitting on the sidelines
and he said loudly, game louses.
Speaker 5 (33:50):
I'd like to.
Speaker 6 (33:51):
Think that We'll never no I was I was waiting
on the pancakes. Yeah, you know, I was waiting on pancakescakes.
Speaker 1 (33:59):
Rip p. That is a hell of a way to
celebrate a win. Welcome to the Good Game Hall of Fame, Minnesota,
Links and prints. We love that you're listening, but we
want you to get in the game every day too.
So here's our good game play of the day, followed
the off Season's Twitter account. So you're ready to watch
as soon as that six part docuseriies drops tomorrow it's
airing on Twitter, which okay, but we're still going to watch.
(34:23):
We'll link to the account in our show notes, and
we'd always love to hear from you. Hit us up
on email good game at wondermedianetwork dot com, or leave
us a voicemail at eight seven to two two oh
four fifty seventy, and don't forget to subscribe. Rate and
review It's easy slices, watch Friends of the Show, and
certified slices asking the questions we need answered. Rating five
(34:45):
out of five Fresh Delicious Orange Slices. Review. Shout out
to Erica Laiala of Black Rosie Media forgetting Benijelinie Hamilton
to end our debate jump shot or medical shot? In
case you missed it. On Monday show, Mish and I
realized that we both interpreted Benije Lannie Hamilton's interview with
Holly Row differently. Benija said that shot finally kicked in,
(35:07):
and Mesh thought she meant medical shot, while I thought
she meant her jump shot. Erica got to the bottom
of it for us. Here she is asking Benija about
it ahead of Game three.
Speaker 5 (35:16):
I was curious, did you mean your jump shot or
were you referring to a different type of shot both.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
Thanks b You're a real one Erica certified slice. Now
it's your turn slices, rate and review. Thanks for listening,
See you tomorrow. Good Game, Jenna, Good Game prints, Hugh
flu like symptoms. Y'all can't hear it, but me sounds
like shit today. Good Game with Sarah Spain is an
(35:43):
iHeart women's sports production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports
and Entertainment. You can find us on the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Production by
Wonder Media Network, our producers are Alex Azzie and Misha Jones.
Our executive producers are Christina Everett, Jesse Katz, Jenny Kaplan,
and Emily Rudder. Our editors are Emily Rutter, Britney Martinez,
Grace Lynch, and Lindsay Crodowell. Production assistants from Lucy Jones
(36:06):
and I'm Your Host Sarah Spain
Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, where old balls,
new balls, steel balls, cold balls is the new One fish,
two fish, redfish, bluefish. Thanks Frankie de la Creta. On
today's show, we'll be talking to NWSL reporter Jennet Tanelli
about the continued outrage over NWSL Boston's big name reveal,
Gotham's Olympic star power, and the growing gap between NWSL clubs.
(00:21):
Plus Game three of the WNBA Finals, more fallout from
Canada's drone Gate, and an update on an important shot.
It's all coming up right after this Welcome back slices.
Here's what you need to know today in WNBA Finals News.
(00:41):
We're recording this Wednesday while I get ready for the
big Women's Sports Foundation gala in New York City. I
will no doubt be watching Game three on my phone
from my seat at the gala, so we'll have plenty
to say about the game, and we'll get you ready
for Game four tomorrow. For now, congrats to the New
York Liberty on their big win Wednesday. How about that
shot and that other play and could you believe that
(01:05):
one moment? Whoof more to come on all that tomorrow
In other WNBA news. Ahead of Game three of the Finals,
Liberty star Brianna Stewart said that her wife Marta, a
retired former pro herself, received a threatening anti gay email
following the Liberty's Game one loss against the Links. Per ESPN,
Stewart reported the incident to the Liberty and the league,
with her wife Marta filing a report with the police.
(01:27):
Here's what Stuart told the ESPN's Malika Andrews.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
You know, sometimes people are taking things a little bit
too far and too out of context, and Martin had gotten.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Homophobic death threats.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
A few other things have happened, But just making sure
that we're doing as much as possible to continue to
aware or make sure that our team and the league
is aware of the situation and continue to keep everybody safe.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
It's all just a reminder that the toxicity experienced by
players this season isn't just reserved for online harassment Elsewhere
in pro hoops news and if yousa call youer and brand,
Stewart's Unrivaled League keeps making headlines. The league and TNT
Sports have entered a multi year media rights partnership, starting
with Unrivaled's inaugural season Live games will air exclusively on
(02:11):
TNT and True TV, and all games will also stream
on Max. TNT will broadcast games on Mondays and Fridays,
and move to True TV on Saturdays. That means more
than forty five primetime regular season matchups will be featured
three nights a week across TNT sports platforms. We are
so here for It. Unrivaled tips off on January seventeen,
(02:32):
twenty twenty five to the NWSL. Fallout continues after the
NWSL Boston team revealed its name Boss Nation in a
marketing campaign centered on the idea of too Many Balls,
including a video that shouted out the Patriots, Red Sox,
Brew and Celtics, and Revolution all men's teams while conspicuously
ignoring the PWHL, Boston Fleet and other women's teams. After
(02:54):
reactions ranging from unimpressed to outraged, the too Many Balls
video has just about disappeared from the Internet, and the
ad agency that was hired for the campaign wiped all
involvement from their Instagram page. Don't worry, we saved a
copy for posterity. The campaign was also condemned for being transphobic,
including by the Seattle Rains Quinn, who is non binary.
The midfielder commented quote feels transphobic Yike's end quote on
(03:18):
the brand rollout video posted on Instagram by the NWSL
and NWSL Boston. It's not clear how it happened, whether
a moderator hit the post or it was the Instagram algorithm,
but that comment from Quinn was no longer visible. Later
in the day, they followed up with quote, love how
my comment was quote unquote hidden by Instagram calling out
transphobia shouldn't be hidden. This doesn't represent the league and
(03:38):
it is such poor messaging end quote. This is sure
to be a case study in marketing and sports business
courses for years to come. The question is whether it'll
be a study of failure or of the ability to
pivot and respond to feedback. It's up to Boss Nation
leadership now dig in or make a change. The team
did issue an apology on Wednesday, saying, in part quote,
(04:00):
we fully acknowledged that the content of the campaign did
not reflect the safe and welcoming environment we strive to
create for all, and we apologize to the LGBTQ plus
community and to the trans community in particular, for the
hurt that we caused. Quote. The team went on to
thank fans for holding them accountable and committed to do
better moving forward. We'll discuss this further later in our
(04:21):
interview with Jenna, also an NWSL news The Off Season,
a reality TV docuseries, dropped a sneak peak trailer this
week ahead of its official release this Friday. You guys,
remember we told you about this. Partly produced by Midge Purse.
We could not be more excited to rot on our
couch watching all six episodes in one sitting. Here's the
premise Heading into the twenty twenty four season, eleven NWSL
(04:43):
players spent two weeks in one house. Take a listen.
But dating is honestly so hard in the soccer world.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
The gays, oh my gosh, there's so much drama.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
The fans love it.
Speaker 4 (04:55):
They'll make like a chart of all like the lesbian connection.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
I'm wondering if there's even a team that doesn't have
a dating couple in it.
Speaker 5 (05:02):
What if they bring it on the field, Like what
if this happens?
Speaker 1 (05:04):
What if that happens. Honestly, everyone's been very professional that
I've seen. That's a lie. I just lied because I forgot. No,
I'm sorry. No, they haven't it has messed up teams,
footy and gay shit. Sign me up and more NWSL
news and you can hear by my tone you can
tell what's happening already another retirement. Angel City defender Merrett
(05:28):
Matthias announced via Instagram that this NWSL season will be
her last as a pro soccer player. Her caption pretty
much summed it up. She wrote, quote I came, I
saw a shit up end quote legend, and that she
did because Matthias has been as staple in the NWSL
as long as it's existed. In fact, she played in
the league's first game ever back in twenty thirteen. She's
(05:50):
got three championships and three NWSL shields on her resume,
and also played for FC Kansas City, Seattle Rain, and
North Carolina Courage. Over the course of her career, played
a big role with the Players Association as well, helping
orchestrate the league's new CBA. In her Instagram post, she
noted that fans can celebrate her career at the club's
last match on October twentieth, when Angel City takes on
(06:11):
the Utah Royals at Bemo Stadium. The game will miss you, Merit,
but we're all looking forward to the post retirement hangs.
Not very many people that are a better hang than
Merritt Matthias. In other soccer news, Canada Soccer has announced
that an interim coaching team will lead the squad for
its upcoming October twenty fifth friendly against Spain, rather than
a traditional singular head coach. This comes after the major
(06:33):
drone spying scandal that was revealed during the Paris Olympics.
Head coach Bev Priestman was suspended and sent home from
the games. Now she remains suspended but on payroll during
this ongoing external Canada Soccer commissioned review into the scandal,
and an addition, has been banned by FIFA from taking
part in any soccer related activities for the next year.
It's time for another edition of No Dumb Questions. Sarah
(07:00):
Reel wrote in to say, I have a dumb question
I should know the answer to since I've been listening
to Spain's teaching since the trifecta, but don't. Why is
the WNBA season scheduled the way it is. It begins
so soon after the close the nc DOUBLEA season, it
seems logical to start a bit later. Give the draft
picks time post March Madness and then have the postseason
go later into the fall. If we overlap a bit
(07:21):
with NHL NBA preseason, who cares? Was it set this
way to keep momentum going from March Madness or is
it just tradition and we're not willing to change. First
of all, Sarah, no dumb questions. It is such a
tight turnaround from the NCAA tourney to the draft to
the preseason, and with expansion, there will continue to be
a desire for more regular season games, making scheduling even tougher.
(07:42):
But ultimately, I think you hit the nail on the
head with the overlap bit. Not only is it tough
for the WNBA to compete with the NFL, the deeper
they go into October and November. Now they've got NHL
NBA College football, college hoops, and it's not just battling
for eyeballs, it's battling for television spots. It's a big
deal for the DOUBLEBA to get prime spots with TV
partners like ESPN and ABC, and that's tough to do
(08:05):
once all those other leagues and sports get going in earnest.
Even with the current schedule and the Olympic break this season.
The WNBA finals games so far have gone up against
Thursday night and Sunday football plus MLB Playoffs for Game three, which,
by the way, I've seen some folks complain about those
games happening smack dab in the middle of NFL Thursday
or Sunday, but ESPN ABC don't have football rights those days,
(08:27):
so that's when they've got airtime and want to put
up a competitive product. It's also worth mentioning that the
league has to schedule round those Olympic and Feeble World
Cup breaks during certain years, which makes it tougher. Expansion
feels inevitable. We already know regular season next year will
be forty four games, but I think they're going to
try to keep it to a mostly summer sport as
best they can for now because of, like I said,
(08:47):
competing eyeballs and competing TV spots. Also, while we're on
the topic of scheduling and the WNBA, Alex has some
actually rare positive news in rescheduling to report.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
So the mnba's Minnesota Timberwolves have rescheduled a preseason game
that was supposed to be played tomorrow, aka the same
night that the Links are hosting Game four of the
WNBA Finals, but the Pimberwolves moved their game to tonight instead.
While this may not seem like a big deal, there
is actually a very long history of WNBA teams getting
bumped from their own venues during the playoffs, either for
(09:23):
MNBA preseason games or for other events. In twenty twenty one,
the Phoenix Mercury were bumped from home court during Round
one of the playoffs because of a Maluma concert. Then
in the semifinals, it was Disney on Ice that bumped
them for their first home game, and it initially looked
like they would get bumped for their second game too,
until the Phoenix Suns and La Lakers agreed to move
their game up. But that was a super last minute
(09:45):
decision that came at the eleventh hour, and honestly, twenty
twenty one wasn't an outlier. There were a few years
there Diana Trozi and co. Played more of their home
playoff games not actually at home, and I get it,
venue scheduling is tough, but you have to out the
Timberwolves for being proactive here and making sure that this
did not become a thing.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
We love it, We love good positive rescheduling news. We
got to take a quick break. When we come back.
It's Jenna Toanelly talking NWSL. She covers the NWSL with
a focus on Gotham FC and the US women's national team,
with bylines and sports illustrated to equalize her esp Nation,
(10:25):
the New York Post and more. She's a diehard Buffalo
Bills fan and she'll take her defense of Candy Corn
with her to the grave. It's Jenna to Nelly, what's up, Jenna.
Speaker 5 (10:35):
Oh my gosh, you nailed it. That's me to a t.
Thank you so much for having me and for that
amazing introduction.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
There is so much to get to today, including the
team that you focus on, Gotham FC, and we're going
to get to it. But boy, did Boss Nation bump
those conversations off the top news stories today. I guess
you could really say they grabbed the women's soccer community
by the balls, Jenna, or god, as a friend said
this morning, their balls deep in feed. So let's go
(11:02):
through this piece by piece in your opinion and also
what you've seen from players and fans. Let's start with
the name. It's an anagram of Bostonian. What do you
think of Boss Nation.
Speaker 5 (11:14):
Yeah, I mean I kind of see where they were
going with the anagram. I kind of like where their
heads at. I love a name that like really reflects
the space and the area and like the history of
the place where a team is. But I think they
missed the mark on the name here. I think Boston
and just New England in general is just a place
(11:34):
that is so rich in history and sports history, and
there was probably a lot more than they could have
pulled on. And I actually saw a couple of people
on Twitter saying they should be like the Boston Coven
or love that which is, and I love the Boston Coven.
I was like, that's.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
Incredible, wicked Boston, Yes, so.
Speaker 5 (11:54):
Good, exactly exactly. So I think they did miss the
mark a little bit on the name, although, as you
alluded to, not the most egregious part of that no
means no.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
I I just don't think it makes a lot of sense.
It sounds more like a supporter group being Nation. It
makes me think of like Hugo Boss. It made a
lot of other people think of girl Boss, which is
not good or Boss Bitch. Also not something people are
really doing these days, and it's not really clever or
creative or fun right, it's just not very interesting. There's
(12:24):
I was exchanging texts with my friends Colley and Joshua
have been on the show together before, and we came
up with lots of funny ones like you know Duncan
FC or how about that Apple's FC? I think josh said,
Masshole United. I mean these are not real, but like,
because they made it so boring, it left us searching
for some fun and I think that's part of the
problem with it. Now. The name alone would have been
(12:44):
a meh if not for the brand rollout that really
pushed people away from the whole launch. First of all,
the website too many balls dot com and the and
the brand video that seemed to have so many issues,
not the least of which was a rature of existing
female teams, both historically and current in the Boston area.
(13:05):
A real emphasis on making everything about men's sports, and
then here we are and you're ready for us, as
if women's sports wasn't already established enough to thrive and
celebrate on its own. And then the transphobic issue that
people came up with, the emphasis on genitalia and the
whole pun being on the things between your legs. What
have you heard and what was your opinion on the
(13:26):
too many balls rollout?
Speaker 5 (13:27):
Yes, well, I mean you definitely covered a lot of it.
I mean I think it just missed the mark on
so many levels. It was extremely exclusionary, you know, with
the language around male, Genitalian. Just centering a women's sports
team around men. It was just very strange, and I
(13:48):
think again it just ignores this history that Boston does this.
I mean, have we had the Boston Breakers previously in
the NWSL, We have you know, professional women's Hockey League
team already, Boston Fleet. I believe they're called in the area.
And it's just it was very disappointing again and it's
also almost similar to the name itself that it just
(14:09):
doesn't quite dip into this rich history and excitement around
women's sports that they could have really keyed into. Because
people are excited for this team. And you know something
I actually I was tweeting through it yesterday, some jokes
and some thoughts, but you know, one of the things
that I put out there was, you know, we as
a you know, a women's soccer community, we hate this
(14:30):
because we care because we want so badly for this
team to do well and to grab fans, you know,
both existing and new fans that are out there to
support this club. You know, Boston has a great history
with women's soccer and women's sports, and this just was
just so disappointing on so many levels. And it's disappointing,
and we're upset because we all care and we want
(14:52):
it to do as best it could be. And I
just don't understand. You know, I get it. You know,
they had a media agency. They came up with something
that they thought would be think in their own post
that I saw, actually your producer Alex put up they
called it wildly provocative, and I guess you could call
it that, and I, you know, I see that they're
trying to get a conversation going, but this was the
(15:13):
wrong conversation. And I'm just surprised that nobody in the
room thought, eh, hey, you know, maybe we should consider
other directions.
Speaker 4 (15:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
I think your point is a good one, because you know,
in established men's leagues when teams that are not ours
trip up, we love it. We are like whoop see,
especially Boston. Boston is such a fun place to hate, right.
Speaker 5 (15:35):
Oh, I'm a New Yorker, so yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
But instead, because in the women's sports world, the rising
tide lifts all boats because we want growth.
Speaker 6 (15:44):
And.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
You know, for Iron just sharpened by having other teams
come and push teams to spend more and invest more
and be more creative and be better. We are as
a whole community rooting for them. We're like Tyra Banks
on America's Next we were rooting for you. We're all
rooting for you. And then when this happens, I think
somebody posted like this is an impressive thing. When the
(16:07):
entire women's sports, women's soccer community can get together and
hate the same thing, it's really bringing us together. But
it's disappointing. Now. We've seen teams double back in the past,
including Racing Louisville, which was going to be Proof Louisville FC,
but pivoted after an underwhelming response. We saw in the
PWHL there were copyrights that were found in trademarks that
were found and unearthed, and then when they got to
(16:28):
the public and weren't well received, they also want a
different direction. So do you think there's a chance that
Boston will rethink this?
Speaker 5 (16:34):
I sure hope. So I think I'm inclined to think yes,
because I've seen them take down a lot of the
videos and the posts, the website and actually the domain
name too many balls dot com is back up for
sale now.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
Available, y'all.
Speaker 7 (16:50):
Yeah, So, so signs point to some sort of reconsideration
of at least the messaging, you know, and again with
the name, it.
Speaker 5 (17:00):
Is just so meh. But there's there's so much time.
They have, months and months that they could take to
just go back to the drying board and redo this
and have additional input in and you know, bring in
some of these former players who you know made say
Tory Houston, Sam UIs, especially sam Us, I mean, you
know New Englander, the US Sisters top New Englander soccer players.
(17:26):
So I think that there's definitely room for improvement, and
I the signs look like they're going to take it
under invisement, and I sure hope they do.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
Sam Ewis tweeted out as a Massachusetts native, I really
want NWSL Boston to succeed. I also want to shout
out p WHL Boston, bean down RFC and go renegades
as existing women's pro sports teams here to support and
eight thirty eight Underscore Carlisle wrote, imagine fumbling the unveiling
of a Boston women's soccer team so badly that you
made Sam Ewis mad, which I think is a very
(17:57):
good point, and I think you're right, Sam call number one. Yes,
Sam should be called number one, and a handful of
other players. I think it's a pretty homogeneous ownershipship group,
a lot of them at backgrounds and men's sports, which
might be why they went this way. I think it's
time to reach out to people in the women's space
who are deeply embedded in women's sports and know that
people will be on your side if you listen and change.
(18:18):
It will be embarrassing, but far less embarrassing than digging
your heels and sticking with this and then having to
redo it a couple of years down the line when
it's already made things so much worse for you. So, okay,
if they stick with this name in this branding, or
even if they change and adjust based on feedback, what
do you think that they can do in the immediate
future to make Boston fans and women's soccer fans in
(18:39):
general feel confident about their leadership and their decision making
going forward. Because Alex and I talked about this yesterday.
The fear here is that if this is the lens
through which you're looking at a naming and branding, what
lens are you looking through for a full team and
operations and future.
Speaker 5 (18:56):
It's a great point. I mean, I think there was
a good start today. They did release an apology, especially
about the messaging of the marketing campaign, so I think
that is always a great start, and they acknowledge that,
you know, it was not the right direction, and especially
with some of the transphobic undertones. So I'm very glad
that that was posted. But I think, you know, women's
sports right now, and especially in the NWSL, is at
(19:17):
such an interesting point where it's still so you know,
it's still growing, and you have the chance to make
a huge impact and help grow this game at a
time where it's growing in leaps and bounds like we've
not seen before, but still tap into that rich history
and people who have been here and can help you
direct that. So it's it's unfortunate that that didn't seem
(19:41):
to happen here, but I hope that they will now
take some of the feedback that they've gotten, go back
have these conversations with the sam Uises of the world
and try to come up with an idea that is
going to bring together, like I was saying before, existing fans,
but also new fans, because I think this marketing campaign,
if I try to take a step back and say, okay,
(20:02):
like what were they thinking, does it maybe somebody who
doesn't really know too much about women's sports in Boston
and they see this campaign and they go, oh, yeah,
you know what, there really are a lot of men's
teams but not a lot of women's teams. Okay, I
get that, you know, I can see where maybe the
line of thinking was, but that but you but it
just so missed the mark on any fan, you know,
(20:26):
being interested in this team. I just would sincerely hope
that they can take a step back and they can
say we hear you were listening, and we're going to
you know, change X y Z. And also I think
it's really important that they you know, that they show
that they do take fan feedback and because these are
the people that are going to come to your games
(20:46):
and they're going to pay for tickets and they are
going to buy your merch and you know, sports is
for the fans. So if you're not listening to the fans,
then you you know you're not gonna have a successful franchise.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
Well, if there's anything Boston can do, it's reach back
into their history, brag about their winning culture. And I
think there's ways to do both things in a way
that also centers centers women. So we look forward to
the second round. You could do it Spas Nation. Absolutely,
Let's get to NWSL broadly, this league is known for parody,
but this season there is a big gap between first
(21:18):
and last. What to what do you attribute that gap?
Speaker 5 (21:21):
Coaching? I really think that we have seen this league
take a big step forward in terms of coaching. It's
if you look at the coaches of the top four teams.
You know Gotham, what one Carlo Samros was able to
do with with Gotham. You know, he coached in Spain,
he coached in England, he came over here and he
really put a unique style on that team. Black Gowandanowsky,
(21:44):
who you know obviously didn't have the best tenure as
a national team manager, but if you look back on
his league management, it's just leaps and bounds ahead of
so many other folks. Uh seb Hines over in Orlando,
I think has done a fantastic job over there as
well Washington Spirit bringing over the former Barcelona coach. So
I really think the difference this year has has been coaching.
(22:06):
If you look at some of the other teams, you know,
Utah Royals had had some turnover and they're coaching. You know,
some other teams had some kind of newer coaches to
the league or you know, I hadn't been around before.
So to me, that's the number one difference between those
top five juggernaut teams is you know, bringing in some
really talented, you know, big resume coaches that have been
(22:29):
able to put their mark on these teams in a
unique way.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
I would even argue, being as biased as I am
from Chicago, that Louren Donaldson, the job that he's done
in Chicago getting them to be a playoff team despite
a number of factors, is impressive. Eight points separate the
number one Orlando Pride and the number four k C Current.
Then there's a ten point drop off to fifth place,
where the North Carolina Courage are. Do you consider that
top four tier the true contenders or are there any
(22:54):
lower seated teams that you could see primed for an upset?
Speaker 5 (22:57):
I mean, the thing, even though the parody has not
been as it has in the past, and the NWSL
it's still a league where anything could happen. I mean,
look at Portland's upset over Orlando, which, to be fair,
Orlando had clinched the shield and you know now they're
going to do a little bit of rotation and look
towards the playoffs. But it is still a league where
anything can happen. And I think your point about Chicago
is actually really important. I was just talking to some
(23:20):
of my colleagues at Sports Illustrated about Chicago specifically because
I've been so impressed with that team. A lot of
people think of that team, They're like, oh, they just
have mouse wantson and a listena or and that's it,
But that is so not true. I think Lauren has
done a fantastic job with that team, and it's been
a team where each individual player has truly stepped up
at different moments when they're needed and has propelled them
(23:41):
to a playoff position. So I wouldn't be surprised to
see a Chicago restoroce or a North Carolina Courage get
an upset those last two playoff spots. Portland Thorne's of
as you're in there right now. I don't see those
two teams upsetting any of the top four, but again
it's it's possible.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
Yeah, last year Gotam one out of the sixth seed,
the whole thing, so right, you just you just never know. Hey,
speaking to Gotham, I want to talk about them because
that's your main beat.
Speaker 5 (24:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:12):
Seven Olympians, six of them gold medalists with Team USA.
How has this Gotham team handled balancing egos and expectations,
keeping everybody happy, getting everyone in the ball, all the
usual super team issues. How have they done that this year?
Speaker 5 (24:26):
Gotham has been a team this year that has relied
extensively on its deep bench. They are playing multiple competitions
regular season. The CONCA calf Women's Championship, they blamed, the
Challenge Cup. They played in the what's it called the
Summer Cup with the finals in October, so I always
(24:46):
get I'm like, oh, it's a Summer Cup, but it's
in October. So I think that they had This has
allowed the team to get a lot of people playing time,
and you've seen a lot of different combinations, especially defensively.
We've seen a lot of different combinations back there with
Emily Sonnet Hearna Davidson, Matane Manny Freeman and just you know,
(25:07):
making sure that everybody is on the same page and
contributing to the team. And something I find very interesting
about Gotham and their style is that they you know,
you when you watch them on the field, They're rotating
positions quite a lot. You'll see Neilie Martin drop back
and you know, in like a defensive position, or you'll
see you know, Tierna Davis and like push up high centrally,
(25:28):
and it's it's just a team that everybody knows not
only their role, but their teammates roles, so they're able
to slot in when needed. And that's also been a
significant boost to Gotham this season, is that they all
understand what they're supposed to be doing and then they
execute on it. I also credit Yayali Ever Bush West
and the general manager and Juan Carlos the coach, to
(25:50):
have created an environment where I think a lot of
these players are really thriving and playing some of their
best soccer. It's it's been incredible to see. I mean
I talk the other day, I put out an article
on my personal substack about Delaney she In. She is
a midfielder who has started all but one game for
Golf of this season and flies completely under the radar,
(26:12):
but she's been integral to that team and to that
midfield So I think just giving everybody opportunities and having
players earn their opportunities and just letting them shine and
be creative on the field. You know this is Roosevelt
has been playing amazing this season, getting a lot of
club minutes, which you know we don't always see for
Rose Emily Sonnet I think has started every shield missed
(26:34):
one game this season because of yellow card accumulation this weekend.
But it's just been incredible to see what this team
has done and it's really worked. And people were skeptical
because with the super team, you never know, but it's
really worked.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
You mentioned a couple of the unsung heroes like Delaney
she and where can people read about them? You've said
you've you've written a bit about them.
Speaker 5 (26:53):
Yeah, so, I recently on my substack Jenna sources linked
to it in my Twitter bio and Instagram bio, I
did an in depth dive on Delaney Shehan. I also
think that Yasmine Ryan has been an incredible player for
Gotham a winger forward. She's got four goals for assists
on the regular season and that's not even going into
(27:13):
the Summer Cup or the CONCACAF tournament. And I did
a piece on her earlier this year in Hudson River Blue,
which is a local New York City website that covers
primarily NYCFC but also Gotham as well. I think she's
been fantastic. And also Neelie Martin midfielder who anybody who
(27:34):
knows me knows. I'm obsessed with the fact that in
the final last year she had to go into goal
because many Hawk got a red card in the dying
minutes and that's just my favorite bit of Gotham lore
these days. But she's also just an incredible midfielder and
her positioning on the field and her ability to connect
passes has just been also crucial, crucial, crucial for Gotham
the season.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
All right, Jennas sources sub stack is where you can
find that, and she links to it in her Twitter bile,
which we'll put in our show notes. Last question, quick
about Gotham clinched the first playoff home game in history.
What does that mean for this team, especially as they're
trying to win back to back championships.
Speaker 5 (28:09):
It means so much. And you know, of course, you
you know, the fans want to see another championship win.
But I think for you know, for me, as somebody
who was a longtime Sky Blue fan started covering the
team then they became Gotham, saw this whole transition from
playing at Rutgers University in New Jersey to playing at
one of the best soccer stadiums in North America. It's
just been incredible to see that growth. And I think
(28:31):
for the players, you know, some of them are newer
to the team, some of them have been there for
a long time. I think Mandy Freeman has been there
since twenty seventeen. I believe she was drafted there, so
has just really you know this, it's just such a
marker of how far this team has come. That in
their entire history, they've never had a home playoff game
and to be able to do that at Red Bull
Arena and have that celebration with the fans and for
(28:54):
the players to have contributed to the growth of this
team is just so important and it just such a
huge mart of how far they've come.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
Yeah, there's been a lot of drama in the NWSL
in recent years, whether it was serious stuff like toxic
coaching or forced ownership overhauls or lawsuits, to just dramatic
changes in revenue and investment and ownership groups and kind
of established some haves or have nots. Gotham is a
great example of a team that was a have not.
It was mocked at times in the past in the
(29:22):
Sky Blue FC years subpar resources and facilities, but they
underwent a hugely successful rebranding ahem, Boss Nation. They got
new leadership last year, they became a championship winning team
on the field. What can other teams in the league
learn from the sky Blue to Gotham transition.
Speaker 5 (29:42):
I think the thing to me that sticks out the
most is that ownership and the investors and the team
and the ownership put their money where their mouth was.
But more than that is that they brought in a
leader like Yayell to put that vision into place. And
I think and I think it takes both things. It
(30:02):
takes money because clearly, as we've seen with the Boss
Nation money, money isn't always going to get to where
you need to be. But I think it's it's the
investment and the trust and bringing in somebody who who cares,
who knows, And it's in every conversation I've ever had
with Yayel, you know, we always talk about, well, these
are the things I didn't have when I was a player,
and so what are the things that I know that
(30:24):
players need to succeed? What do players want? And just
having that lens as a former player to manage this
team I think has been everything. And you know, one
of the things that she said to me was, you know,
players want to be in a place where they're supported
and they can play and be their best sells. Whether
that means they're starting, they're on the bench, their wave, whatever,
it means that they were given the opportunity and they
(30:47):
were given the support that they needed to be at
their best. And I think you really see that with Gotham,
and so I really do credit what Yayelle has been
able to do with this team and the fact that
ownership put their trust and money.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
Yeah, I could not agree more. It is money, of course,
it is investment, but listening to the right people who
tell you where to put that money, how to spend it,
and how to do the things that will matter to
the athletes that make them want to stay, that make
them want to play hard, that make them want to
fight for Your team and your brand is massive, and
it's been really cool to see that happen for the
(31:22):
Gotham side and a lesson for a lot of other teams. Jenna,
thanks so much for the time. We look forward to
hearing more from you as the season wraps up and
the playoffs start.
Speaker 5 (31:31):
Thank you so much for having me. It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (31:35):
We got to pay the bills when we come back.
Let's take a trip down memory lane and spin a
tale about mister Purple Rain. Hey that run. That's next.
Welcome back Slices. With Games three and four of the
WNBA Finals in Minneapolis, it felt like a great time
to add a legendary links story to the hallowed halls
(31:59):
of the Good Game Hall of Fame. Yes, the Good
Game Hall of Fame, where we celebrate women's sports lore,
the kind of legendary stories that we should all know
by heart. The way we can you know immediately picture
Tom Brady Hammered throwing the Lombardi Trophy on a boat
in the Buck Super Bowl Parade, or the way we
can recite Kevin Durant' you the REALVP speech to his mom.
(32:21):
We got some catching up to do in women's sports.
So grab another plaque and find a good place on
the wall because we've got another inductee. Go with me.
Back to twenty eighteen. The Super Bowl was in Minneapolis
and Link's legend and four time WNBA champ Lindsay Whalen,
was showing me around town for an espnW feature. We
went to some of her favorite coffee shops, bars, and hotels,
(32:42):
and at one stop she told me an epic tale
of the entire Links team celebrating their twenty fifteen championship
win with none other than Minnesota Links superfan Prince. Here's
that story I.
Speaker 4 (32:55):
Want to talk about. Twenty fifteen. You win the WNBA championship.
Prince is a huge of the team, comes to your
game and invites you all over to his house.
Speaker 1 (33:03):
It was unbelievable.
Speaker 6 (33:04):
We so we win the championship and it was in
Game five against Indiana. You know, tough series, tough season.
Speaker 1 (33:11):
We win.
Speaker 6 (33:11):
So the confetti's coming down and we're in the locker
room and we got the champagne going and our GM
comes in and he screams out. And after this we're
going to Paisley Park. You know, Prince is doing a
concert for us, so he was on the keyboard right
as I walked in. It's just like one of those
kind of surreal things that I'll never forget. And then
he played well into the night. I think he played
(33:32):
till four or five in the morning. At the end
of the night, he was riding his bike around in
the parking lot. We get our logo on his big
screen behind the stage. Congratuations links twenty fifteen champs.
Speaker 1 (33:42):
I'd like to think that when you.
Speaker 4 (33:44):
Guys won the title, he was sitting on the sidelines
and he said loudly, game louses.
Speaker 5 (33:50):
I'd like to.
Speaker 6 (33:51):
Think that We'll never no I was I was waiting
on the pancakes. Yeah, you know, I was waiting on pancakescakes.
Speaker 1 (33:59):
Rip p. That is a hell of a way to
celebrate a win. Welcome to the Good Game Hall of Fame, Minnesota,
Links and prints. We love that you're listening, but we
want you to get in the game every day too.
So here's our good game play of the day, followed
the off Season's Twitter account. So you're ready to watch
as soon as that six part docuseriies drops tomorrow it's
airing on Twitter, which okay, but we're still going to watch.
(34:23):
We'll link to the account in our show notes, and
we'd always love to hear from you. Hit us up
on email good game at wondermedianetwork dot com, or leave
us a voicemail at eight seven to two two oh
four fifty seventy, and don't forget to subscribe. Rate and
review It's easy slices, watch Friends of the Show, and
certified slices asking the questions we need answered. Rating five
(34:45):
out of five Fresh Delicious Orange Slices. Review. Shout out
to Erica Laiala of Black Rosie Media forgetting Benijelinie Hamilton
to end our debate jump shot or medical shot? In
case you missed it. On Monday show, Mish and I
realized that we both interpreted Benije Lannie Hamilton's interview with
Holly Row differently. Benija said that shot finally kicked in,
(35:07):
and Mesh thought she meant medical shot, while I thought
she meant her jump shot. Erica got to the bottom
of it for us. Here she is asking Benija about
it ahead of Game three.
Speaker 5 (35:16):
I was curious, did you mean your jump shot or
were you referring to a different type of shot both.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
Thanks b You're a real one Erica certified slice. Now
it's your turn slices, rate and review. Thanks for listening,
See you tomorrow. Good Game, Jenna, Good Game prints, Hugh
flu like symptoms. Y'all can't hear it, but me sounds
like shit today. Good Game with Sarah Spain is an
(35:43):
iHeart women's sports production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports
and Entertainment. You can find us on the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Production by
Wonder Media Network, our producers are Alex Azzie and Misha Jones.
Our executive producers are Christina Everett, Jesse Katz, Jenny Kaplan,
and Emily Rudder. Our editors are Emily Rutter, Britney Martinez,
Grace Lynch, and Lindsay Crodowell. Production assistants from Lucy Jones
(36:06):
and I'm Your Host Sarah Spain
Host
Sarah Spain
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