August 25, 2025 • 38 mins
In this week’s episode of the Granger Smith Podcast, Granger sits down with Kirk Cameron for a wide-ranging conversation on family, faith, and the life of the church.
They share about family rhythms, Sunday dinners, and the importance of fellowship before moving into deeper discussions about worship, what church gatherings are meant to be, and how Christians can stay rooted in a culture that often feels hostile to their faith.
Granger and Kirk also talk about the blessings of cultural Christianity and make an important distinction: cultural Christianity isn’t the same as being a “lukewarm Christian.” Rather, it points to the benefit of living in a society shaped by Christian values, even while rejecting the idea of half-hearted faith.
Later in the episode, they respond to an email about a headline out of China describing a “pregnancy robot” being developed with an artificial womb. They ask what this technology might mean for families, infertility, and most importantly, God’s design for life.
It’s an episode filled with personal stories, church history, and honest reflection on how faith speaks into the modern world.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
As if technology couldn't get crazier with AI robotics whatnot.
Now we're hearing that the in development right now is
a robot and this is not fake news. This is
this is in development a robot that could actually carry
a baby in a womb from feed us to birth.
(00:23):
We had to unpack this. We'll do that right now.
You were like full Tennessee. Now, like you got the
shirt on, you got the classic white brick in the
background that is like a Nashville house has white brick
(00:46):
on it.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Yeah. Yeah, it's it's kind of it's kind of everywhere,
and we're really liking it. The beard's coming in nice
and full, no patchy spots. I don't know. I don't
know if it's if if it's the Hattie Bee's chicken,
or if it's the whiskey. But it's all coming in
nice and full. Now.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
I was gonna ask if you had Loveless biscuits for
breakfast this morning, that would that would complete it.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Have you been in Loveless cafe yet?
Speaker 2 (01:11):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (01:12):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Oh yeah, that's that's great. Over there, there's so many
good places. I mean, I want to get fat moved
to the South.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
Yeah, so right. I used to live in Nashville. Yeah, yeah,
you do you have a Do you have a fire pit?
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Like?
Speaker 1 (01:27):
Will we get to see some cur with the Bible
around the fire pit one of these days?
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Of course. I mean, you know, I didn't learn how
to how to burn my trash until I came to
the South. We can't do that in California, but here,
you know, Uh, it's all it's how it's how we
keep warm in the winter. We uh, we do have
a fire pit, and and I love sitting around it.
(01:54):
I love when my family comes over for Sunday night dinners.
We're so fortunate, Grange. We moved from California when all
of our children became adults and moved out of the house,
and they went to all these different states. Well a
couple of them were in Tennessee, and my wife and
I didn't want to be, you know, away from our kids,
so we moved to Tennessee. And then all of the
other kids felt like they were really missing out. And
(02:16):
so now all of them are here and we have
Sunday night family dinners every week. So we're so thankful,
we're so blessed. We love it.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
That is amazing. Sunday night dinners. Yeah. When I was
on tour, that was something I just couldn't do. So yeah,
having that, having that camaraderie, that that that family dynamic,
using Sunday the rest days, it's a wonderful thing. Yeah,
I'm happy for you.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
Well, thank you.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
And as we're recording this, Lord Willing, I think I'm
going to see you in a month or so Amber
is going to come out there. We're going to be
on your show.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
Right, soah, I can't.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
Your neck in person. You know something I don't know
about you is I don't know the story of you
being locked out of the library. What is the deal
with that? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (03:07):
So well this was maybe three Christmases ago. I wrote
a children's book about the fruit of the Spirit, love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness,
self control. And I wanted to read it in public
libraries like a story hour for children. And there were
others who were already doing this, like drag queens, and
(03:31):
I was denied by over fifty woke libraries that previously
held drag queen story hours for children. So if you
want to be a dude in a beard with a
dress and read inappropriate stuff you can. You can go
to a lot of these libraries, but if you want
to be a Christian and talk about faith, hope and love,
it's a hard no. I went to some friends at
(03:53):
Fox News and other places, and I think it was
after one or two of them had sort of allowed
me to tell the story that these libraries reversed course
sent a link to an invitation to come back to
their library. But they told us already that they weren't interested,
that nobody would show up. They didn't want my messaging,
(04:16):
was their words. But when we did show up, we
were greeted by three thousand parents and grandparents at the
very first library in downtown Indianapolis. In fact, they said
it was the largest event that they had had since
the opening of the library one hundred years ago, and
that this was really indicative of a wide spread movement
(04:38):
of parents who were disgusted by the values that are
being forced down their throats and in their communities, particularly
big cities, and they want to get back to the
values that lead to their children's blessing and protection. Well,
that spread. We went to DC, Los Angeles, Seattle, San Francisco,
and all these places. I wrote a couple more books,
and then that eventually turned into hundreds and hundre of
(05:00):
libraries being adopted by people at the grassroots level and
doing the same thing. Then we turned it into a
national day called See You at the Library, which it
involved hundreds of libraries, tens of thousands of people in
all fifty states. And this last weekend we went from
being locked out of libraries to being invited by the
Trump administration and the Department of Education to the largest
(05:23):
library in the world, the Library of Congress, the ultimate
library to tell our children about the truth about faith,
about courage, and about patriotism. And we actually had an
absolutely amazing time. And the pictures speak for themselves. This
(05:47):
was families gathering across the country to sing songs of
praise and patriotism, to pray, and to read stories of
virtue to children. This is what happens when the family
of faith doesn't back down.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
It's incredible. So if you send me some of those pictures,
we'd love to put them up as you're talking so
other people could see that. Yeah, I'm so curious, and
you know, obviously I kind of know the answer, but
what is it? At the very beginning, you have this
book on the fruits of the spirit. What could people
be against that? What reason could you go against speaking
(06:24):
that logical?
Speaker 2 (06:25):
It's not that rational. I don't think they even read
the book. I even offered to send them free copies
of the book. They weren't interested. They I don't think
they even ever read them. If they had, they would
realize that the overt messages towards Christ or God are
not even in the story itself. Their references to Scripture
in the very back of the book for the family activities.
So the book itself wouldn't be offensive to them on
(06:48):
the face of it, But it's I think more what
the author represents. So it's me. It's a white, heterosexual
Christian male who wants to go into the public square
and advance a different narrative than the Purple Hair Platoon.
(07:08):
The Rainbow Mafia wants to indoctrinate the little children. And
so instead of being truly inclusive and diverse with messaging,
these extreme library leaders basically just you know, they're the
gatekeepers and they say no to guys like you and me.
Speaker 1 (07:32):
You don't know this yet. We have an email that
ant man who you cannot see on camera here, he's
got an email already, don't read it yet. This is
gonna be great. Yeah, that's gonna be great. I can't
wait to get considering where this is going. Yeah, you're right,
you're right. There is not logic in that. It's more
so the messenger. And you are an ambassador for Christ.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
And so those that hate him will hate his messengers. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Yeah. And and I don't, I don't. I don't blame
them for sort of you know, turning their nose up
at me, particularly if I represent the very things that
are the antithesis to what they want to demonstrate. But
they have to remember this. This was not leftist, communist,
socialist ideas that gave them the constitutional right to have
(08:25):
freedom of speech and freedom of their religion, even if
it's secular humanism. It was a Christian nation with Christian
founding principles coming out of the scriptures that actually produce
these types of rights and these types of governments, where
it's representative government for the people, by the people. And
when you play by those rules, then guys like me
(08:49):
do get to show up. In fact, it's it's it's illegal,
it's against the constitution, it's and it's the most distasteful
kind because it violates religious liberty, which, of course, they
don't want to live in a country it does that.
If they did, you know, many of us would buy
a one way ticket for them to China or to
North Korea and they could live in places like that.
But they want to be here standing on Christian values
(09:11):
and American principles while undermining the republic and true religion itself.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Yeah, that's fascinating. Calling you narrow minded right when they
can't open their mind enough to have you speak about
the fruits of the spirit.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
That's right. And calling themselves so inclusive that they just
can't tolerate a guy like me really reveals the absurdity
of the argument. All of us want to filter out
bad stuff, and so it really just comes down to
not whether or not you discriminate against ideas, It's just
(09:48):
what ideas do you want to discriminate against? Right, I mean,
not all ideas are good, clearly we know that, and
they think so, and I think so. But I believe
that the choice ought not to be between the left
or the right. There are some who would would want
to force us to make that choice. I think the
real choice is between up or down, and we either
(10:10):
go up to the values and principles of heaven that
are that are manifest in the laws that we find
in the Constitution and the values that undermine them, or
we go down back to socialism, communism, fascism, dictatorship, whatever
(10:33):
the whatever, the form of government that is essentially, you know,
you bow down to the king, to the dictator, to
the samurai, to the showgun, to the prince, to the king,
and they are above the law. We are then their
their their subjects. But we don't have subjects in America.
(10:54):
We are citizens. Citizens literally means co kings. This is
a government where the sovereign in America is we the people.
We are the leaders. The government is not our leaders.
They are our representatives and they're there to represent the
leaders who is you and me, moms and dads, and
then we need to hold them accountable.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
And this is why I like congregationalism for in our
church polity. You know, that's different, that's a different topic.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
That's yeah, that's a whole different topics. But that's super
interesting too.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
So, Kirk, did any of this influence your move to
Tennessee from your beautiful home state of California?
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Not not primarily. I mean I could, I could, I
could make a story out of that, but but no,
it was primarily we want to be near our children.
I don't want. I mean, we're family people. We had
six kids and now we've got a granddaughter. I don't
I don't want to be living a thousand or fifteen
hundred miles away from our kids. We want to be
doing what we're doing now, which is be together. So
(11:58):
I don't want to see all the good people abandoned
California and a banker in New York, although many Californians
and New Yorkers are here in Tennessee. I want to
see us make a strategic retreat to a place like
this where we can learn how to build community around
faith and moral courage, and then go back to those
places and see if we can't spark revival in the
(12:20):
hearts and minds of Californias and see her turn around again.
You know she she has an amazing history of Christians.
I mean, you think of all of the cities there.
We've got all the Saints and the Angels, Los Angeles
City of the Angels, Santa Barbara, San Jose, San Miguel,
these are all sat Saints and father Sarah and others
(12:40):
who you know blaze the Oregon Trail and made it
back there the Whitman's there's amazing history, but we have
lost it, and we've lost it on our watch, and
our children are going to pay the price. So let's
turn it around.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
I love California and many people listening right now are
from Afformula. There are so many people that feel abandoned
because they are the silent majority there, and so yeah,
it's you know, it's some of my favorite in New York.
You can say the same thing about New York. They
you get, you get kind of pigeonholed because of the cities.
(13:16):
But but there are so many people there that just
don't align with the views of the people in the
city there.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Yeah, that's true. And and when when when we've gone
to those those libraries and people feel like they can
show up, they say thank you for coming, because people
think we don't want to see you here anymore. But
that's not true. That that's the voice that goes out
for the rest of us are are shaking our heads,
but we're being silenced here and they're afraid of the blowback.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
But when.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
You know, now you go to these places and people
are coming out of the woodwork. There is a new
courage that that is infectious. And I'm really excited to
see that. And and and it couldn't come at a
better time.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Love that. Man, Maybe maybe we should get maybe we
should go read it in a library. Man, it's a
good idea.
Speaker 3 (14:04):
You want to read some of these emails at the library.
Speaker 1 (14:07):
You got emails from the labe.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Yeah, I'm curious you you sparked my interest in this
in this letter.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
We're going to do that. I love by the way,
I love your show, the new show, Kirk Cameron Show. Yeah,
oh thank you. You feel like you. I feel like
you've kind of hit a stride with this show. Do
you feel like that? Well? Thanks? Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
You know, it's kind of like running running a five k.
I can't run a marathon, so I can't speak to that,
but but it's like running a five k, Like the
first mile is the hardest, right then you kind of
all of a sudden, you're like you kick in the stomach,
ache's gone, and now you're cruising. So we started the
Kirk Cameron Show just a couple of months ago, and
I think we've done like forty five episodes, and it's
what I love about it is we couldn't figure out
(14:51):
what types of content to provide because I wanted to
do like morning devotions with people over a couple of
coffee at sunrise, and we actually do that every Monday
Monday morning. But then we come back in on Wednesdays
and my son's always got some wild, bizarre, dangerous conversation
that I normally wouldn't have on television because it's about
(15:12):
you know, the transgender movement, or it's about AI girlfriends,
and it's about pastors and pornography. And so we decided,
let's just have an unfiltered Wednesday dangerous conversation with a
twenty one year old son. And then Fridays is a
(15:32):
weekly wrap up of politics and pop culture. So what
in the world happened at Chip and Joanna Gaines? And
why why did you know Elon Musk wrote John Trump?
And then what's going on with the Putin Zelenski Trump
meeting in Alaska? And how do we filter that through
a biblical lens and actually do something about it, not
(15:54):
just gossip and complain about it.
Speaker 1 (16:01):
If you're trying to get a gift for someone that
you think has everything. How about a special video message
from me. It's easy to do. Go to cameo dot
com slash granger Smith and you put in the prompt
what you want me to say. I get that message
on my phone. I'll say happy birthday, happy anniversary, whatever
personalized message you want me to say to whoever you
want me to say it to. I send it to
you and you give it to them. It's pretty cool.
(16:23):
Go to cameo dot com slash granger Smith. Your son
is brilliant, by the way too, it's easy to listen to.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
He's going to get don't say that out loud. He's
going to get a big head. I'm not. I won't
tell him.
Speaker 1 (16:38):
You said that he does he do all the research
for these things.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Yeah, he does. He does all of this. And today
we actually recorded an episode today. It's going to come
out on Wednesday, and it's uh, it's all about tomorrow. Yeah,
it's all about.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
This is ering later.
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Sorry I dated you there. Actually just filmed an episode
where he wants to talk about what is true worship
and why are we doing it? And it really came
down to his being fed up with churches that have
(17:17):
this section in the service where people seem to just
have a sort of an emotional religious performance it appears,
or get some spiritual goosebumps and enjoy a feeling. And
he's wondering, is that what the scriptures say worship is
all about? It's it's music and singing and you know,
(17:39):
falling down on your knees and crying. What is worship
after all? And did Jesus ever do it? And if so,
what does it look like? And so it was kind
of a kind of a look into false religion versus
true religion, I'm sorry, false worship versus true worship. And
it was really interesting.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
That is so fascinating, such a great topic that we
need to keep at the forefront right now because I
think because it's first of all, the idea that music
is the only worship is a foreign thought and very modern.
That work. You've got, you got your church service, and
part of it is worship, and that's the music part,
(18:19):
which is totally false. It's never that's just fascinating stuff.
And and then the idea is that if there is
there is, if there's any kind of performance going on,
which is also a very modern idea, where there's there
would be people performing. Then that means that the majority
of the people are consuming. They're just consuming, they're just
(18:40):
kind of absorbing it, and they have no no contribution
to the worship at all, which is another very strange thing.
You could not explain this to people two hundred years ago.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
Right, Yeah, it's it's it's so it's so different. One
of the one of the questions that he asked me
and I thought was really interesting, is is he's you know,
I know a lot of friends who you know, they
they dress up, they put on their best jeans and
boots and and you know, a tight fitting shirt that
shows off their their biceps and their their newest tattoo,
(19:11):
and they they show up, they're looking forward to being
with their friends. They can't wait for lunch afterward, and
they want to have a really good spiritual massage from
the music, and they're hoping the pastor tell some really
good jokes and some funny stories. And he said, I
wonder if you took all those things away, if if
if my friends would still want to go to church,
(19:32):
Like if you told them we're not going to go
to lunch afterward, and everyone just needs to wear the
same thing, like like everyone's just going to be in
like khakis and a blue shirt everybody, so like there's
no impressing anybody with your wardrobe. And we're going to
take away all of the music. We're just going to
preach the word. We're going to have communion and renew
our covenant vows, maybe a baptism and a testimony, and
(19:56):
maybe we're going to sing three hymns and then after word,
you got to go home for at least three or
four hours, you know, if you want to get together
with your family at night and have dinner whatever. But
the church experience is going to be stripped down to that.
I wonder how many people would still go, And I
was like, that's the church I'm looking for. I mean, please,
somebody start a church like that, because because I'm not
(20:19):
personally I love friends, but I'm not going to church
for that. I want to encounter God through his word
and through the institutions of baptism and the Lord's Supper
and testimony and right and like and and and the
hymns so rich that it makes me think about Christ
(20:42):
and what He's done and the greatness of God. More
than you know, my heart cry for God to hold
my heart.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
So long ago, two thousand years ago ish, justin Martyr,
you remember him in church history, he writes, he writes
a book, I think it's called the Apology, and he
lays out what church is. And this is like in
one forty five AD, you know, early second century, and
(21:13):
he writes, on the day called Sunday, which first of all,
they were worshiping on Sunday right there, all the way
back to the Apostles. On a day called Sunday, we
gather from the cities and the towns and the country,
and the president, which is what they call for the pastor,
stands up and exhorts everyone according to the writings of
(21:36):
the prophets or the letters of the Apostles, and so
he's basically expositing scripture and applying it to their lives,
praying that then the bread and the wine are passed
out and an offering is taken for those that are
a need at the time. And it just describes like
(21:57):
exactly what you just said. And people have been doing
that for two thousan nears.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Man, you gotta, I gotta go look that up. Justin Martyr,
and you said the Apology.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
I think it's called the first apology.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
I got to read that.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Yeah, that's and there's an excerpt from that that it's
exactly what they do for church. It's our earliest history
of what church looks like. And that's exactly what you
just described. It hasn't changed at all.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
Well, that's really interesting, and I think I think the realific,
you know, because we can argue in debate about oh,
well it should be this, well we have a secret
sensitive church for well, we have a you know, I
mean all those different things, you know, the style of
music in the in the the the order of worship
and all that, all that kind of stuff. But I
I I would really love to see just what happens
if you were to do that again. Yeah, I really
(22:42):
think it's I think that's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Yeah, we were. We were actually talking earlier today that
church which is you know, actually as the gathering of people.
It is for the gathering of Christians so that the
body could be built up and God could be glorified
through that gathering, which is all all worship. And so
(23:04):
if if we look at church is more of an
outreach like a revival tent where we're trying to bring
people in, which bringing people to church is great, is
a great thing, but it's not the first priority. The
first priority must be the gathering of the Saints, the Christians,
the believers that come together to be built up, mutually edified.
(23:25):
They can grow in the Lord be have scripture spoken
and applied and illustrated to them. That it has to
be that. Otherwise where are Christians going to go? Yeah,
we're not going to grow if it's every single week,
is just an outreach deal.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
Yeah, you know, I'm in the media business, and so
I'm always thinking about producing movies and TV shows or
even with a podcast like this. You know, you have
you have, you have marketing officers and people, and you're
trying to grow your customer base and expand your social
media influence or i mean your sociald media influence. When
(24:01):
all of that starts to resonate with what I'm also
seeing at churches, I think something's wrong When it feels
like the order of worship or there is a run
of show or a playlist of songs and sermons and
elements that's perfectly timed to get one or two or
(24:24):
three services through in order to expand our customer base
and then increase revenue. Tides year over year. Wow, it
just starts to really make me feel very, very uncomfortable.
So I'm just really looking for that which is true
(24:46):
and real and really going to build up my faith,
not like the stuff that we so often see, I think,
particularly in the South. I love the South. I love
cultural Christianity. I want my culture to be marked by Christianity,
not by paganism, not by evil. I want it to
be a culture that is derived from Christianity, just not
what my son calls Instagram Christianity. He's like, unfortunately, that's
(25:09):
a lot of what I see Instagram Christianity. And I
think that just sort of says it. You know, it's
about that picture and that moment and how I look,
and you know, all all of that. So I'm encouraged
that there is a young generation who is searching and
longing for authenticity and fidelity to what Scripture says we
(25:35):
ought to be doing as christ follow.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Amen. Wow, that's fascinating, right. I mean to say I
love cultural Christianity, it's because it's seen in such a
negative light. In fact, I've actually painted it in a
negative light most of the time. But he's right, you know,
we should love to live in a culture that's based
on Christian WORLDVIEP. But what we're not saying is you
(26:00):
should be a lukewarm cultural Christian. Right, there's two different
things here, So we should love the culture of Christians
and and push against people that are mild Christians.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Yeah, could I just double click on that for a second.
I think it's really really interesting. We were talking today
about about true worship versus false worship. Think of the Pharisees.
I hadn't thought about that this until just this this second,
when when you mentioned it. But they were cultural Jews, right,
I mean they had they had you know, we talk
(26:34):
abou cultural Christianity is I could say it's fake it
shall They had cultural Judaism to where I mean, it
had all all of the packaging and the wrapping. But
Jesus came down the hardest on them and said, look,
the outside of the cup is sparkling clean. You got
these robes and prayers and all this stuff, but the
(26:54):
inside is full of dead men's bones. And he didn't
just say just clean the inside of the cup, that's
all that matters. He said, clean the inside of the
cup first, then the outside will become clean as well.
And I think that's the kind of cultural judaism or
back in that day, which yeah, I mean Jerusalem didn't
(27:15):
last long, you know, another forty years, and it was
it was destroyed. But I think that we have in
the New Testament, the New Covenant order, have the opportunity
to bring about cultural Christianity that is the result of
an overflow of the inside of the cup being clean,
because the heart is overhauled by the Gospel spilling over
(27:39):
and cleaning the outside of culture, which is family, which
is government, which is the arts, which is education, which
is all of these things. And that is that is
the true hope of our our pilgrim forefathers and fore mothers.
And I think the answer to Jesus's prayer word, mayor
(28:00):
Kingdom come, and you will be done on earth as
it is in heaven, not just in our hearts, so
we can get out of the earth and to heaven,
but so that we can heavinize the earth to the
power of the Gospel flowing from the inside to the outside.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
This is so helpful, This is so helpful. I I
heavenize the earth. We should say we want cultural Christianity,
but we need to go about it. The right way. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
that's tremendous. Okay, and man, do you want to give
us this this email?
Speaker 2 (28:32):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (28:33):
This is like Kirk's the perfect guy. Yeah yeah, I
think so too.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
Then it's a snarky email coming.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Yes, it is very snarky, but it's not to me
nor you. It's not to either one of us, So
don't worry about that.
Speaker 3 (28:45):
Yeah, you're neither one of your Are there are pointed
at in the snarky ism here? It says Hey Granger,
So if it is to anybody, I guess it'd be
to you. But I just saw this wild story out
of China about scientists working on a pregnancy robot that
could actually carry a baby to term. Supposedly, it has
an artificial womb with nutrients pumped in and everything. Made
(29:08):
me wonder what you think.
Speaker 1 (29:09):
About stuff like this.
Speaker 3 (29:10):
Is there a situation where something like this could be
a good thing, like helping with infertility or premies. Honestly,
it just feels like society might be pushing too far
with AI and tech, and I'd love to hear your
take on it. Thanks, Jeremy. Have either one of you
heard about this yet?
Speaker 1 (29:27):
No? I have not.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
A robot womb. What could possibly go wrong?
Speaker 1 (29:36):
Nothing?
Speaker 3 (29:36):
It's been perfected, Kirk, It's been perfected.
Speaker 1 (29:38):
Come on, did you look this up? Did you fit?
Did you fact check this at all? Yes? I did? Okay,
here's what we do know.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
A prototype timeline is already in the works, expected by
I believe the fall of twenty twenty six. A prototype.
How it works. The artificial wound contains synthetic ambiotic fluid,
and the fetus received nutrients and oxygen and through it
to much like an umbilical cord. The cost projection they
already have that from estimated at about one hundred thousand
(30:08):
yen or in the United States just under fourteen thousand dollars.
So this could be appealing to some surrogacy because that
right there already runs between like one hundred and two
hundred thousand dollars here in the United States.
Speaker 1 (30:24):
The motivation.
Speaker 3 (30:26):
Yeah, seen as a potential solution to infertility, reducing physical
and emotional burdens on women and addressing demographic challenges such
as declining birth rates. So yeah, there's some validity behind this.
They say that multiple reputable news outlets reported that a
Chinese company named Kiwa Technology has unveiled plans for a
(30:49):
pregnancy robot.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
Kirk, you have four adopted children? Is that right? Yes,
that's right? This? What is this? What does this mean
for for our worldview? Do you think? Well?
Speaker 2 (31:08):
First of all, I don't hit the panic panic button
with stuff like this, because I remember that when they
when they, when technology had gotten to the point, uh,
and evil had gotten to the point where the hearts
and minds of men were only evil continually and uh
and they and they built a great, big tower called Babbel.
(31:29):
God had no problem frustrating their plans, scattering them and
starting over. So if you want to talk about the
great reset, you know, uh, Klaus Schwab ought to be
shaking in his boots about a bigger, great reset that
could you know, swallow him up in the deluge. So
I don't hit the panic button because I know that
(31:50):
the blessed controller of all things is behind the curtain,
and he's working all things together for good for those
who love him and are called according to his purpose.
So that's my that's my framework there. I say, Okay,
what do I think about robotic wounds? Well, you know, look,
I wouldn't be surprised if that robotic womb actually started
(32:12):
with a robotic wife and you could just pregnate her.
You know, they work that out. I mean, I've seen
robots that are already walking around with AI and and
flesh like you know, substances on the body and with
I mean there's one hundred percent of that stuff's all
coming down the shoot. And then who needs a wife anymore?
(32:33):
Who needs a husband anymore? You know, she'll do everything
you want. She never says no, and she'll make the
baby with the green eyes and the curly hair that
you want, and it'll be cheaper than adoption or IVF
or whatever. So I think all that's gonna be possible
at the end of the day. Do I trust that
that's going to be a good thing. Well, we could
say that it's a good thing, and that's how you
get it to kind of go through with tax dollars
(32:54):
and stuff. But we have a terrible track record. I mean,
I mean, look look what we do with opioids, and
look what we do with uh ai and other technology. Now,
we don't have the moral maturity to keep up with
what God has allowed us to discover technologically. And if
(33:15):
if we don't stop being retarded morally and spiritually, we're
going to kill ourselves and God will, I believe, will
let us do it. So with regard to to all
of these things, I don't know where it's going to go.
I don't I don't have a crystal ball. But God,
God knows the past, the present, of the future, and
he will use it for the good of those who
(33:36):
love him. But it's sure, is it sure? Is fascinating?
And I think at the end of the day it
will come down to people having to make the decision
that it'll come down to what does it even mean
to be human? I mean, we've already gotten to the
point what does it mean to be a man? And
and and and the elites in the academic circles can't
(33:57):
seem to even answer the question what does it mean
to be a woman? I think it's going to get
to what does it mean to be a human? And
and and it's going to ultimately come down to either
we're made in the image of God or we're just
a bunch of chemical reactions and electrical impulses. And if
(34:22):
that's all we are, then what's wrong with transhumanism and
robotic wounds? Maybe just an improvement on the on the
on the evolutionary design. But if we're made in the
image of God, then our first priority must be to
honor our creator and ask him how we ought to
be making babies.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
Which the Bible's is very detailed on. Many times the
Bible will bring up a womb or in the design
and a mother's relationship to the womb. In fact, Abraham
and Sarah couldn't have a baby, and in their in faithfulness,
they tried to go to not a robotic womb, but they.
Speaker 3 (35:04):
Right and would they not have though if this were available? Yeah, hey,
this is you know, this is the this is the
answer to God's plan for our family.
Speaker 1 (35:14):
This robot right.
Speaker 2 (35:15):
Here, and I mean that's the that's the that's the
challenge with things like I v F.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
Right.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
I have family members who have children today through IVF,
and we also know the the tragedy and the heartbreak
that is the downside of IVF. All these little embryos
that are being flushed away that could be people, and
(35:45):
we're saying that they're embryos, just like little embryos that
are in a womb that get aboarded. And so it's
this kind of technology presents great moral dilemmas. And we
need to pick up our game morally and our ability
to reason biblically.
Speaker 1 (36:05):
And what's the story of your your four children adopted?
Are there different stories?
Speaker 2 (36:11):
Well, they each have their own different story that they're
all We adopted them all about a year apart, and
from all different places here in the US. And our kids.
We have two boys and three girls, and now they
all live here in Tennessee. Some of them are married,
some of them are not. We have a granddaughter, and
so we're kind of like the Brady Budge, except without
(36:35):
Alice and and and the Butcher and Sam the Butcher.
Speaker 1 (36:42):
I love it. Man. Well, we are going to see
you Lord Willing very soon. Amber. Ye, Amber has a.
Speaker 2 (36:48):
Book excited for you for you to come out. Thank you,
and let's make sure we go you have lunch, dinner
or something.
Speaker 1 (36:54):
Yeah. Absolutely, well, brother, it's good to see you. You look
good in that Tennessee T shirt. You look good in
front of that white brick.
Speaker 3 (37:01):
The beard man, The beard's growing in.
Speaker 1 (37:03):
Little Beard's growing in nicely. We'll see you by a
camp fire very soon.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
That sounds great. And thanks again for all your encouragement,
and please keep up the good work. We need thoughtful, educated,
good communicators of biblical truths that are family focused and
God honoring like you, So please don't stop doing what
you're doing.
Speaker 1 (37:27):
Well, brother, I think the same thing about you. You're
such an encouragement to me and so many so thank
you as well. All right, God bless you, guys, appreciate
your brother, God bless you. Thank you so much for
hanging out with me on this episode of the Grangersmith Podcast.
I appreciate you being here. If you're listening right now,
go ahead and rate today's podcast. It helps more folks
find the show. And if you're tuning in on the
(37:47):
iHeartRadio app, you could actually set this podcast as one
of your presets, which is cool that way. I'm just
one tap away. If you're watching on YouTube, don't forget
to hit like and subscribe so you don't miss any
new episodes. And if you got a question you want
answered right here on the show, just email me podcast
at grangersmith dot com. I'd love to hear from you.
Thanks again for being here. We'll see you next time,
ye ye
As if technology couldn't get crazier with AI robotics whatnot.
Now we're hearing that the in development right now is
a robot and this is not fake news. This is
this is in development a robot that could actually carry
a baby in a womb from feed us to birth.
(00:23):
We had to unpack this. We'll do that right now.
You were like full Tennessee. Now, like you got the
shirt on, you got the classic white brick in the
background that is like a Nashville house has white brick
(00:46):
on it.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Yeah. Yeah, it's it's kind of it's kind of everywhere,
and we're really liking it. The beard's coming in nice
and full, no patchy spots. I don't know. I don't
know if it's if if it's the Hattie Bee's chicken,
or if it's the whiskey. But it's all coming in
nice and full. Now.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
I was gonna ask if you had Loveless biscuits for
breakfast this morning, that would that would complete it.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Have you been in Loveless cafe yet?
Speaker 2 (01:11):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (01:12):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Oh yeah, that's that's great. Over there, there's so many
good places. I mean, I want to get fat moved
to the South.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
Yeah, so right. I used to live in Nashville. Yeah, yeah,
you do you have a Do you have a fire pit?
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Like?
Speaker 1 (01:27):
Will we get to see some cur with the Bible
around the fire pit one of these days?
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Of course. I mean, you know, I didn't learn how
to how to burn my trash until I came to
the South. We can't do that in California, but here,
you know, Uh, it's all it's how it's how we
keep warm in the winter. We uh, we do have
a fire pit, and and I love sitting around it.
(01:54):
I love when my family comes over for Sunday night dinners.
We're so fortunate, Grange. We moved from California when all
of our children became adults and moved out of the house,
and they went to all these different states. Well a
couple of them were in Tennessee, and my wife and
I didn't want to be, you know, away from our kids,
so we moved to Tennessee. And then all of the
other kids felt like they were really missing out. And
(02:16):
so now all of them are here and we have
Sunday night family dinners every week. So we're so thankful,
we're so blessed. We love it.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
That is amazing. Sunday night dinners. Yeah. When I was
on tour, that was something I just couldn't do. So yeah,
having that, having that camaraderie, that that that family dynamic,
using Sunday the rest days, it's a wonderful thing. Yeah,
I'm happy for you.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
Well, thank you.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
And as we're recording this, Lord Willing, I think I'm
going to see you in a month or so Amber
is going to come out there. We're going to be
on your show.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
Right, soah, I can't.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
Your neck in person. You know something I don't know
about you is I don't know the story of you
being locked out of the library. What is the deal
with that? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (03:07):
So well this was maybe three Christmases ago. I wrote
a children's book about the fruit of the Spirit, love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness,
self control. And I wanted to read it in public
libraries like a story hour for children. And there were
others who were already doing this, like drag queens, and
(03:31):
I was denied by over fifty woke libraries that previously
held drag queen story hours for children. So if you
want to be a dude in a beard with a
dress and read inappropriate stuff you can. You can go
to a lot of these libraries, but if you want
to be a Christian and talk about faith, hope and love,
it's a hard no. I went to some friends at
(03:53):
Fox News and other places, and I think it was
after one or two of them had sort of allowed
me to tell the story that these libraries reversed course
sent a link to an invitation to come back to
their library. But they told us already that they weren't interested,
that nobody would show up. They didn't want my messaging,
(04:16):
was their words. But when we did show up, we
were greeted by three thousand parents and grandparents at the
very first library in downtown Indianapolis. In fact, they said
it was the largest event that they had had since
the opening of the library one hundred years ago, and
that this was really indicative of a wide spread movement
(04:38):
of parents who were disgusted by the values that are
being forced down their throats and in their communities, particularly
big cities, and they want to get back to the
values that lead to their children's blessing and protection. Well,
that spread. We went to DC, Los Angeles, Seattle, San Francisco,
and all these places. I wrote a couple more books,
and then that eventually turned into hundreds and hundre of
(05:00):
libraries being adopted by people at the grassroots level and
doing the same thing. Then we turned it into a
national day called See You at the Library, which it
involved hundreds of libraries, tens of thousands of people in
all fifty states. And this last weekend we went from
being locked out of libraries to being invited by the
Trump administration and the Department of Education to the largest
(05:23):
library in the world, the Library of Congress, the ultimate
library to tell our children about the truth about faith,
about courage, and about patriotism. And we actually had an
absolutely amazing time. And the pictures speak for themselves. This
(05:47):
was families gathering across the country to sing songs of
praise and patriotism, to pray, and to read stories of
virtue to children. This is what happens when the family
of faith doesn't back down.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
It's incredible. So if you send me some of those pictures,
we'd love to put them up as you're talking so
other people could see that. Yeah, I'm so curious, and
you know, obviously I kind of know the answer, but
what is it? At the very beginning, you have this
book on the fruits of the spirit. What could people
be against that? What reason could you go against speaking
(06:24):
that logical?
Speaker 2 (06:25):
It's not that rational. I don't think they even read
the book. I even offered to send them free copies
of the book. They weren't interested. They I don't think
they even ever read them. If they had, they would
realize that the overt messages towards Christ or God are
not even in the story itself. Their references to Scripture
in the very back of the book for the family activities.
So the book itself wouldn't be offensive to them on
(06:48):
the face of it, But it's I think more what
the author represents. So it's me. It's a white, heterosexual
Christian male who wants to go into the public square
and advance a different narrative than the Purple Hair Platoon.
(07:08):
The Rainbow Mafia wants to indoctrinate the little children. And
so instead of being truly inclusive and diverse with messaging,
these extreme library leaders basically just you know, they're the
gatekeepers and they say no to guys like you and me.
Speaker 1 (07:32):
You don't know this yet. We have an email that
ant man who you cannot see on camera here, he's
got an email already, don't read it yet. This is
gonna be great. Yeah, that's gonna be great. I can't
wait to get considering where this is going. Yeah, you're right,
you're right. There is not logic in that. It's more
so the messenger. And you are an ambassador for Christ.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
And so those that hate him will hate his messengers. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Yeah. And and I don't, I don't. I don't blame
them for sort of you know, turning their nose up
at me, particularly if I represent the very things that
are the antithesis to what they want to demonstrate. But
they have to remember this. This was not leftist, communist,
socialist ideas that gave them the constitutional right to have
(08:25):
freedom of speech and freedom of their religion, even if
it's secular humanism. It was a Christian nation with Christian
founding principles coming out of the scriptures that actually produce
these types of rights and these types of governments, where
it's representative government for the people, by the people. And
when you play by those rules, then guys like me
(08:49):
do get to show up. In fact, it's it's it's illegal,
it's against the constitution, it's and it's the most distasteful
kind because it violates religious liberty, which, of course, they
don't want to live in a country it does that.
If they did, you know, many of us would buy
a one way ticket for them to China or to
North Korea and they could live in places like that.
But they want to be here standing on Christian values
(09:11):
and American principles while undermining the republic and true religion itself.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Yeah, that's fascinating. Calling you narrow minded right when they
can't open their mind enough to have you speak about
the fruits of the spirit.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
That's right. And calling themselves so inclusive that they just
can't tolerate a guy like me really reveals the absurdity
of the argument. All of us want to filter out
bad stuff, and so it really just comes down to
not whether or not you discriminate against ideas, It's just
(09:48):
what ideas do you want to discriminate against? Right, I mean,
not all ideas are good, clearly we know that, and
they think so, and I think so. But I believe
that the choice ought not to be between the left
or the right. There are some who would would want
to force us to make that choice. I think the
real choice is between up or down, and we either
(10:10):
go up to the values and principles of heaven that
are that are manifest in the laws that we find
in the Constitution and the values that undermine them, or
we go down back to socialism, communism, fascism, dictatorship, whatever
(10:33):
the whatever, the form of government that is essentially, you know,
you bow down to the king, to the dictator, to
the samurai, to the showgun, to the prince, to the king,
and they are above the law. We are then their
their their subjects. But we don't have subjects in America.
(10:54):
We are citizens. Citizens literally means co kings. This is
a government where the sovereign in America is we the people.
We are the leaders. The government is not our leaders.
They are our representatives and they're there to represent the
leaders who is you and me, moms and dads, and
then we need to hold them accountable.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
And this is why I like congregationalism for in our
church polity. You know, that's different, that's a different topic.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
That's yeah, that's a whole different topics. But that's super
interesting too.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
So, Kirk, did any of this influence your move to
Tennessee from your beautiful home state of California?
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Not not primarily. I mean I could, I could, I
could make a story out of that, but but no,
it was primarily we want to be near our children.
I don't want. I mean, we're family people. We had
six kids and now we've got a granddaughter. I don't
I don't want to be living a thousand or fifteen
hundred miles away from our kids. We want to be
doing what we're doing now, which is be together. So
(11:58):
I don't want to see all the good people abandoned
California and a banker in New York, although many Californians
and New Yorkers are here in Tennessee. I want to
see us make a strategic retreat to a place like
this where we can learn how to build community around
faith and moral courage, and then go back to those
places and see if we can't spark revival in the
(12:20):
hearts and minds of Californias and see her turn around again.
You know she she has an amazing history of Christians.
I mean, you think of all of the cities there.
We've got all the Saints and the Angels, Los Angeles
City of the Angels, Santa Barbara, San Jose, San Miguel,
these are all sat Saints and father Sarah and others
(12:40):
who you know blaze the Oregon Trail and made it
back there the Whitman's there's amazing history, but we have
lost it, and we've lost it on our watch, and
our children are going to pay the price. So let's
turn it around.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
I love California and many people listening right now are
from Afformula. There are so many people that feel abandoned
because they are the silent majority there, and so yeah,
it's you know, it's some of my favorite in New York.
You can say the same thing about New York. They
you get, you get kind of pigeonholed because of the cities.
(13:16):
But but there are so many people there that just
don't align with the views of the people in the
city there.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Yeah, that's true. And and when when when we've gone
to those those libraries and people feel like they can
show up, they say thank you for coming, because people
think we don't want to see you here anymore. But
that's not true. That that's the voice that goes out
for the rest of us are are shaking our heads,
but we're being silenced here and they're afraid of the blowback.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
But when.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
You know, now you go to these places and people
are coming out of the woodwork. There is a new
courage that that is infectious. And I'm really excited to
see that. And and and it couldn't come at a
better time.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Love that. Man, Maybe maybe we should get maybe we
should go read it in a library. Man, it's a
good idea.
Speaker 3 (14:04):
You want to read some of these emails at the library.
Speaker 1 (14:07):
You got emails from the labe.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Yeah, I'm curious you you sparked my interest in this
in this letter.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
We're going to do that. I love by the way,
I love your show, the new show, Kirk Cameron Show. Yeah,
oh thank you. You feel like you. I feel like
you've kind of hit a stride with this show. Do
you feel like that? Well? Thanks? Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
You know, it's kind of like running running a five k.
I can't run a marathon, so I can't speak to that,
but but it's like running a five k, Like the
first mile is the hardest, right then you kind of
all of a sudden, you're like you kick in the stomach,
ache's gone, and now you're cruising. So we started the
Kirk Cameron Show just a couple of months ago, and
I think we've done like forty five episodes, and it's
what I love about it is we couldn't figure out
(14:51):
what types of content to provide because I wanted to
do like morning devotions with people over a couple of
coffee at sunrise, and we actually do that every Monday
Monday morning. But then we come back in on Wednesdays
and my son's always got some wild, bizarre, dangerous conversation
that I normally wouldn't have on television because it's about
(15:12):
you know, the transgender movement, or it's about AI girlfriends,
and it's about pastors and pornography. And so we decided,
let's just have an unfiltered Wednesday dangerous conversation with a
twenty one year old son. And then Fridays is a
(15:32):
weekly wrap up of politics and pop culture. So what
in the world happened at Chip and Joanna Gaines? And
why why did you know Elon Musk wrote John Trump?
And then what's going on with the Putin Zelenski Trump
meeting in Alaska? And how do we filter that through
a biblical lens and actually do something about it, not
(15:54):
just gossip and complain about it.
Speaker 1 (16:01):
If you're trying to get a gift for someone that
you think has everything. How about a special video message
from me. It's easy to do. Go to cameo dot
com slash granger Smith and you put in the prompt
what you want me to say. I get that message
on my phone. I'll say happy birthday, happy anniversary, whatever
personalized message you want me to say to whoever you
want me to say it to. I send it to
you and you give it to them. It's pretty cool.
(16:23):
Go to cameo dot com slash granger Smith. Your son
is brilliant, by the way too, it's easy to listen to.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
He's going to get don't say that out loud. He's
going to get a big head. I'm not. I won't
tell him.
Speaker 1 (16:38):
You said that he does he do all the research
for these things.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Yeah, he does. He does all of this. And today
we actually recorded an episode today. It's going to come
out on Wednesday, and it's uh, it's all about tomorrow. Yeah,
it's all about.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
This is ering later.
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Sorry I dated you there. Actually just filmed an episode
where he wants to talk about what is true worship
and why are we doing it? And it really came
down to his being fed up with churches that have
(17:17):
this section in the service where people seem to just
have a sort of an emotional religious performance it appears,
or get some spiritual goosebumps and enjoy a feeling. And
he's wondering, is that what the scriptures say worship is
all about? It's it's music and singing and you know,
(17:39):
falling down on your knees and crying. What is worship
after all? And did Jesus ever do it? And if so,
what does it look like? And so it was kind
of a kind of a look into false religion versus
true religion, I'm sorry, false worship versus true worship. And
it was really interesting.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
That is so fascinating, such a great topic that we
need to keep at the forefront right now because I
think because it's first of all, the idea that music
is the only worship is a foreign thought and very modern.
That work. You've got, you got your church service, and
part of it is worship, and that's the music part,
(18:19):
which is totally false. It's never that's just fascinating stuff.
And and then the idea is that if there is
there is, if there's any kind of performance going on,
which is also a very modern idea, where there's there
would be people performing. Then that means that the majority
of the people are consuming. They're just consuming, they're just
(18:40):
kind of absorbing it, and they have no no contribution
to the worship at all, which is another very strange thing.
You could not explain this to people two hundred years ago.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
Right, Yeah, it's it's it's so it's so different. One
of the one of the questions that he asked me
and I thought was really interesting, is is he's you know,
I know a lot of friends who you know, they
they dress up, they put on their best jeans and
boots and and you know, a tight fitting shirt that
shows off their their biceps and their their newest tattoo,
(19:11):
and they they show up, they're looking forward to being
with their friends. They can't wait for lunch afterward, and
they want to have a really good spiritual massage from
the music, and they're hoping the pastor tell some really
good jokes and some funny stories. And he said, I
wonder if you took all those things away, if if
if my friends would still want to go to church,
(19:32):
Like if you told them we're not going to go
to lunch afterward, and everyone just needs to wear the
same thing, like like everyone's just going to be in
like khakis and a blue shirt everybody, so like there's
no impressing anybody with your wardrobe. And we're going to
take away all of the music. We're just going to
preach the word. We're going to have communion and renew
our covenant vows, maybe a baptism and a testimony, and
(19:56):
maybe we're going to sing three hymns and then after word,
you got to go home for at least three or
four hours, you know, if you want to get together
with your family at night and have dinner whatever. But
the church experience is going to be stripped down to that.
I wonder how many people would still go, And I
was like, that's the church I'm looking for. I mean, please,
somebody start a church like that, because because I'm not
(20:19):
personally I love friends, but I'm not going to church
for that. I want to encounter God through his word
and through the institutions of baptism and the Lord's Supper
and testimony and right and like and and and the
hymns so rich that it makes me think about Christ
(20:42):
and what He's done and the greatness of God. More
than you know, my heart cry for God to hold
my heart.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
So long ago, two thousand years ago ish, justin Martyr,
you remember him in church history, he writes, he writes
a book, I think it's called the Apology, and he
lays out what church is. And this is like in
one forty five AD, you know, early second century, and
(21:13):
he writes, on the day called Sunday, which first of all,
they were worshiping on Sunday right there, all the way
back to the Apostles. On a day called Sunday, we
gather from the cities and the towns and the country,
and the president, which is what they call for the pastor,
stands up and exhorts everyone according to the writings of
(21:36):
the prophets or the letters of the Apostles, and so
he's basically expositing scripture and applying it to their lives,
praying that then the bread and the wine are passed
out and an offering is taken for those that are
a need at the time. And it just describes like
(21:57):
exactly what you just said. And people have been doing
that for two thousan nears.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Man, you gotta, I gotta go look that up. Justin Martyr,
and you said the Apology.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
I think it's called the first apology.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
I got to read that.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Yeah, that's and there's an excerpt from that that it's
exactly what they do for church. It's our earliest history
of what church looks like. And that's exactly what you
just described. It hasn't changed at all.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
Well, that's really interesting, and I think I think the realific,
you know, because we can argue in debate about oh,
well it should be this, well we have a secret
sensitive church for well, we have a you know, I
mean all those different things, you know, the style of
music in the in the the the order of worship
and all that, all that kind of stuff. But I
I I would really love to see just what happens
if you were to do that again. Yeah, I really
(22:42):
think it's I think that's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Yeah, we were. We were actually talking earlier today that
church which is you know, actually as the gathering of people.
It is for the gathering of Christians so that the
body could be built up and God could be glorified
through that gathering, which is all all worship. And so
(23:04):
if if we look at church is more of an
outreach like a revival tent where we're trying to bring
people in, which bringing people to church is great, is
a great thing, but it's not the first priority. The
first priority must be the gathering of the Saints, the Christians,
the believers that come together to be built up, mutually edified.
(23:25):
They can grow in the Lord be have scripture spoken
and applied and illustrated to them. That it has to
be that. Otherwise where are Christians going to go? Yeah,
we're not going to grow if it's every single week,
is just an outreach deal.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
Yeah, you know, I'm in the media business, and so
I'm always thinking about producing movies and TV shows or
even with a podcast like this. You know, you have
you have, you have marketing officers and people, and you're
trying to grow your customer base and expand your social
media influence or i mean your sociald media influence. When
(24:01):
all of that starts to resonate with what I'm also
seeing at churches, I think something's wrong When it feels
like the order of worship or there is a run
of show or a playlist of songs and sermons and
elements that's perfectly timed to get one or two or
(24:24):
three services through in order to expand our customer base
and then increase revenue. Tides year over year. Wow, it
just starts to really make me feel very, very uncomfortable.
So I'm just really looking for that which is true
(24:46):
and real and really going to build up my faith,
not like the stuff that we so often see, I think,
particularly in the South. I love the South. I love
cultural Christianity. I want my culture to be marked by Christianity,
not by paganism, not by evil. I want it to
be a culture that is derived from Christianity, just not
what my son calls Instagram Christianity. He's like, unfortunately, that's
(25:09):
a lot of what I see Instagram Christianity. And I
think that just sort of says it. You know, it's
about that picture and that moment and how I look,
and you know, all all of that. So I'm encouraged
that there is a young generation who is searching and
longing for authenticity and fidelity to what Scripture says we
(25:35):
ought to be doing as christ follow.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Amen. Wow, that's fascinating, right. I mean to say I
love cultural Christianity, it's because it's seen in such a
negative light. In fact, I've actually painted it in a
negative light most of the time. But he's right, you know,
we should love to live in a culture that's based
on Christian WORLDVIEP. But what we're not saying is you
(26:00):
should be a lukewarm cultural Christian. Right, there's two different
things here, So we should love the culture of Christians
and and push against people that are mild Christians.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Yeah, could I just double click on that for a second.
I think it's really really interesting. We were talking today
about about true worship versus false worship. Think of the Pharisees.
I hadn't thought about that this until just this this second,
when when you mentioned it. But they were cultural Jews, right,
I mean they had they had you know, we talk
(26:34):
abou cultural Christianity is I could say it's fake it
shall They had cultural Judaism to where I mean, it
had all all of the packaging and the wrapping. But
Jesus came down the hardest on them and said, look,
the outside of the cup is sparkling clean. You got
these robes and prayers and all this stuff, but the
(26:54):
inside is full of dead men's bones. And he didn't
just say just clean the inside of the cup, that's
all that matters. He said, clean the inside of the
cup first, then the outside will become clean as well.
And I think that's the kind of cultural judaism or
back in that day, which yeah, I mean Jerusalem didn't
(27:15):
last long, you know, another forty years, and it was
it was destroyed. But I think that we have in
the New Testament, the New Covenant order, have the opportunity
to bring about cultural Christianity that is the result of
an overflow of the inside of the cup being clean,
because the heart is overhauled by the Gospel spilling over
(27:39):
and cleaning the outside of culture, which is family, which
is government, which is the arts, which is education, which
is all of these things. And that is that is
the true hope of our our pilgrim forefathers and fore mothers.
And I think the answer to Jesus's prayer word, mayor
(28:00):
Kingdom come, and you will be done on earth as
it is in heaven, not just in our hearts, so
we can get out of the earth and to heaven,
but so that we can heavinize the earth to the
power of the Gospel flowing from the inside to the outside.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
This is so helpful, This is so helpful. I I
heavenize the earth. We should say we want cultural Christianity,
but we need to go about it. The right way. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
that's tremendous. Okay, and man, do you want to give
us this this email?
Speaker 2 (28:32):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (28:33):
This is like Kirk's the perfect guy. Yeah yeah, I
think so too.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
Then it's a snarky email coming.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Yes, it is very snarky, but it's not to me
nor you. It's not to either one of us, So
don't worry about that.
Speaker 3 (28:45):
Yeah, you're neither one of your Are there are pointed
at in the snarky ism here? It says Hey Granger,
So if it is to anybody, I guess it'd be
to you. But I just saw this wild story out
of China about scientists working on a pregnancy robot that
could actually carry a baby to term. Supposedly, it has
an artificial womb with nutrients pumped in and everything. Made
(29:08):
me wonder what you think.
Speaker 1 (29:09):
About stuff like this.
Speaker 3 (29:10):
Is there a situation where something like this could be
a good thing, like helping with infertility or premies. Honestly,
it just feels like society might be pushing too far
with AI and tech, and I'd love to hear your
take on it. Thanks, Jeremy. Have either one of you
heard about this yet?
Speaker 1 (29:27):
No? I have not.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
A robot womb. What could possibly go wrong?
Speaker 1 (29:36):
Nothing?
Speaker 3 (29:36):
It's been perfected, Kirk, It's been perfected.
Speaker 1 (29:38):
Come on, did you look this up? Did you fit?
Did you fact check this at all? Yes? I did? Okay,
here's what we do know.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
A prototype timeline is already in the works, expected by
I believe the fall of twenty twenty six. A prototype.
How it works. The artificial wound contains synthetic ambiotic fluid,
and the fetus received nutrients and oxygen and through it
to much like an umbilical cord. The cost projection they
already have that from estimated at about one hundred thousand
(30:08):
yen or in the United States just under fourteen thousand dollars.
So this could be appealing to some surrogacy because that
right there already runs between like one hundred and two
hundred thousand dollars here in the United States.
Speaker 1 (30:24):
The motivation.
Speaker 3 (30:26):
Yeah, seen as a potential solution to infertility, reducing physical
and emotional burdens on women and addressing demographic challenges such
as declining birth rates. So yeah, there's some validity behind this.
They say that multiple reputable news outlets reported that a
Chinese company named Kiwa Technology has unveiled plans for a
(30:49):
pregnancy robot.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
Kirk, you have four adopted children? Is that right? Yes,
that's right? This? What is this? What does this mean
for for our worldview? Do you think? Well?
Speaker 2 (31:08):
First of all, I don't hit the panic panic button
with stuff like this, because I remember that when they
when they, when technology had gotten to the point, uh,
and evil had gotten to the point where the hearts
and minds of men were only evil continually and uh
and they and they built a great, big tower called Babbel.
(31:29):
God had no problem frustrating their plans, scattering them and
starting over. So if you want to talk about the
great reset, you know, uh, Klaus Schwab ought to be
shaking in his boots about a bigger, great reset that
could you know, swallow him up in the deluge. So
I don't hit the panic button because I know that
(31:50):
the blessed controller of all things is behind the curtain,
and he's working all things together for good for those
who love him and are called according to his purpose.
So that's my that's my framework there. I say, Okay,
what do I think about robotic wounds? Well, you know, look,
I wouldn't be surprised if that robotic womb actually started
(32:12):
with a robotic wife and you could just pregnate her.
You know, they work that out. I mean, I've seen
robots that are already walking around with AI and and
flesh like you know, substances on the body and with
I mean there's one hundred percent of that stuff's all
coming down the shoot. And then who needs a wife anymore?
(32:33):
Who needs a husband anymore? You know, she'll do everything
you want. She never says no, and she'll make the
baby with the green eyes and the curly hair that
you want, and it'll be cheaper than adoption or IVF
or whatever. So I think all that's gonna be possible
at the end of the day. Do I trust that
that's going to be a good thing. Well, we could
say that it's a good thing, and that's how you
get it to kind of go through with tax dollars
(32:54):
and stuff. But we have a terrible track record. I mean,
I mean, look look what we do with opioids, and
look what we do with uh ai and other technology. Now,
we don't have the moral maturity to keep up with
what God has allowed us to discover technologically. And if
(33:15):
if we don't stop being retarded morally and spiritually, we're
going to kill ourselves and God will, I believe, will
let us do it. So with regard to to all
of these things, I don't know where it's going to go.
I don't I don't have a crystal ball. But God,
God knows the past, the present, of the future, and
he will use it for the good of those who
(33:36):
love him. But it's sure, is it sure? Is fascinating?
And I think at the end of the day it
will come down to people having to make the decision
that it'll come down to what does it even mean
to be human? I mean, we've already gotten to the
point what does it mean to be a man? And
and and and the elites in the academic circles can't
(33:57):
seem to even answer the question what does it mean
to be a woman? I think it's going to get
to what does it mean to be a human? And
and and it's going to ultimately come down to either
we're made in the image of God or we're just
a bunch of chemical reactions and electrical impulses. And if
(34:22):
that's all we are, then what's wrong with transhumanism and
robotic wounds? Maybe just an improvement on the on the
on the evolutionary design. But if we're made in the
image of God, then our first priority must be to
honor our creator and ask him how we ought to
be making babies.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
Which the Bible's is very detailed on. Many times the
Bible will bring up a womb or in the design
and a mother's relationship to the womb. In fact, Abraham
and Sarah couldn't have a baby, and in their in faithfulness,
they tried to go to not a robotic womb, but they.
Speaker 3 (35:04):
Right and would they not have though if this were available? Yeah, hey,
this is you know, this is the this is the
answer to God's plan for our family.
Speaker 1 (35:14):
This robot right.
Speaker 2 (35:15):
Here, and I mean that's the that's the that's the
challenge with things like I v F.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
Right.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
I have family members who have children today through IVF,
and we also know the the tragedy and the heartbreak
that is the downside of IVF. All these little embryos
that are being flushed away that could be people, and
(35:45):
we're saying that they're embryos, just like little embryos that
are in a womb that get aboarded. And so it's
this kind of technology presents great moral dilemmas. And we
need to pick up our game morally and our ability
to reason biblically.
Speaker 1 (36:05):
And what's the story of your your four children adopted?
Are there different stories?
Speaker 2 (36:11):
Well, they each have their own different story that they're
all We adopted them all about a year apart, and
from all different places here in the US. And our kids.
We have two boys and three girls, and now they
all live here in Tennessee. Some of them are married,
some of them are not. We have a granddaughter, and
so we're kind of like the Brady Budge, except without
(36:35):
Alice and and and the Butcher and Sam the Butcher.
Speaker 1 (36:42):
I love it. Man. Well, we are going to see
you Lord Willing very soon. Amber. Ye, Amber has a.
Speaker 2 (36:48):
Book excited for you for you to come out. Thank you,
and let's make sure we go you have lunch, dinner
or something.
Speaker 1 (36:54):
Yeah. Absolutely, well, brother, it's good to see you. You look
good in that Tennessee T shirt. You look good in
front of that white brick.
Speaker 3 (37:01):
The beard man, The beard's growing in.
Speaker 1 (37:03):
Little Beard's growing in nicely. We'll see you by a
camp fire very soon.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
That sounds great. And thanks again for all your encouragement,
and please keep up the good work. We need thoughtful, educated,
good communicators of biblical truths that are family focused and
God honoring like you, So please don't stop doing what
you're doing.
Speaker 1 (37:27):
Well, brother, I think the same thing about you. You're
such an encouragement to me and so many so thank
you as well. All right, God bless you, guys, appreciate
your brother, God bless you. Thank you so much for
hanging out with me on this episode of the Grangersmith Podcast.
I appreciate you being here. If you're listening right now,
go ahead and rate today's podcast. It helps more folks
find the show. And if you're tuning in on the
(37:47):
iHeartRadio app, you could actually set this podcast as one
of your presets, which is cool that way. I'm just
one tap away. If you're watching on YouTube, don't forget
to hit like and subscribe so you don't miss any
new episodes. And if you got a question you want
answered right here on the show, just email me podcast
at grangersmith dot com. I'd love to hear from you.
Thanks again for being here. We'll see you next time,
ye ye
Host
Granger Smith
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