August 6, 2025 • 50 mins
Brad Rowland and Scott Coleman co-host Episode 245 of the Hammer Territory Podcast. Topics include the rumor of Byron Buxton trade interest from the Atlanta Braves, a not-so-great injury update on Joe Jimenez, a sweep loss at the hands of the Milwaukee Brewers, Jurickson Profar's defense, and much more.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Hello everyone, and welcome back to the Hammer Territory podcast.
This episode two four or five. I'm your host, Brad Roland,
coming to you on a Wednesday evening here in early August,
and I'm joined as I always am, by Scott Coleman. Scott.
Our first episode post deadline was a few days ago.
This is number two for us, our follow up and
a lot of stuff talk about that's not necessarily unfil related.
(00:44):
How are you hey?
Speaker 2 (00:45):
That's a win, Brad. These are dark days for the
Atlanta Braves and we will take some like legitimate news
and like a trade rumor that went down to So
there's a lot to talk about. And you know it's funny.
You're a man who spends some time on Twitter and
on Braves Twitter. Do you know how hard it is
to get a consensus on literally anything? So tonight you
(01:10):
do so tonight? I asked out loud. Is this officially
the most disappointing Brave season relative to expectations, hope streams,
on field performance, off field stuff? Is this the most
disappointing Brave season in like forty years? And I didn't
(01:30):
do a poll, but I bet if I've dropped a poll,
it would be like ninety eight percent, yes, and that
is I mean that that's four decades. Man, Like I'm
in my mid thirties. This is far and away the
worst Brave season I have ever watched.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Yeah, I mean there's a probably a deeper dive we
can do on this when it's actually over at the end,
but I think that certainly it's in the running. I
think there are some other candidates that we'd like to
probably ignore right now because it just feels so terrible
in the moment. But I mean, if you go back
to ninety one, I mean, forty years is like a
(02:05):
pretty round number. Thirty five is like the span of
when they were awesome basically and for most of the
last thirty five years, And that's like for a lot
of people, like their entire life. I mean, I don't
know what year you were born, but I think it
was just before ninety one.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Ish, I'm a ninety one baby, So I don't credit for.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
The little must say, literally your entire life. They've been
good basically. They've been a couple of times when they weren't.
But yeah, I mean there's a couple of seasons where
they fell short of expectations, but not quite in the
level of this season, Like if you're certainly doing compared
to like what they were supposed to be, it's not
even close. This is the obvious answer. If you do that,
if that's your calculus. So great things to talk about
(02:46):
in early August, when there's still forty nine games left
in the season after today.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
So I was gonna say, forty nine games. Who is counting?
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Though? Right we are, we are counting, you know what, Scott.
We'll come back to some other stuff about that. But
we got an questions over the last I don't know
thirty six hours about this trade river that you just
mentioned that we'll lead with that tonight because it's a
little change up. We would normally do some other stuff,
but what's not today. There was a report from Dan
(03:14):
Hayes at The Athletic, who I think is a credible
source covers the Twins very well. He reported the Braves
as a team with interest in Byron Buxton, talented outfielder
for the Twins. He later tweeted, in addition to writing
an article, that the Braves were quote one of two
teams who pushed extremely hard end quote for Buxton pre deadline.
(03:37):
Now we'll get back into this in a second. The
big thing with Buxton is that he has a full
no trade clause that apparently he was eager to utilize
exercise whatever word you want to use. Like, he apparently
just has no desire to leave Minnesota at this point.
So it's kind of a non story. But also it's
very interesting and Byron Buxton. You know someone who lives
(04:00):
in Georgia. Fire Buxton is from Georgia. Yeah, he was
a high school number or two overall pick. But like
he has a local connection. I don't know if he
was a Braves fan growing up, but it wouldn't surprise
me if he was. He probably was if you had to,
Just most people live here a brace fans. So interesting story.
He's a really talented, polarizing player. I mean, speaking of
non consensus, I'm sure you saw every take under the
sun over the last two days like I did, about
(04:22):
whether the Braves should have done this or should have
wanted to. And again we understand that Buckston could just
say no, and it's that simple, but it's interesting that
Braves were apparently eager to at least go after him.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
So it's really interesting because Buxton was adamant that he
was not going to waive his no trade clause and
that he wants to stay in Minnesota. That being said,
the Twins are maybe trying to be sold. There's some
talk about that, and Minnesota just did a full on
fire sale and not only did they do a bit
(04:53):
I guess a mini fire sale at the deadline, but
there's belief that the Twins might just completely got this
thing this offseason. They have more pieces they can trade.
Of course, they just traded Carlos Korea. They have some
really good pitchers who they could move and really just
kind of do a fire start to their their rebuild
that they're going to need to do. I mean, it's
(05:14):
a veteran team. Clearly they're not very good this year.
So maybe Buxton comes down off of the I'm not
waving my trade clause because if he looks around and
he's like, Jesus, we're gonna lose one hundred games the
next three years, maybe he doesn't want to spend the
rest of his playing days in that situation. But I
believe he also has a young family and he might
not want to uproot his kids, and no trade clauses
(05:37):
are hard to get in the majors.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
And players value them.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
There's so much more than just the baseball aspect to it,
so we'll see. I guess we should spend a couple
of minutes on Buxton because this was all people were
talking about when this article came out. But I mean
just I mean polarizing, I think is the perfect word
to describe him. Yeah, trade rumors are always interesting in
fan bases, but when the products so about on the field,
(06:01):
it was like, oh, this is a interesting topic that
we haven't had any.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
So Buxton is let's just say this. He's very, very
good when he plays. When he plays, and that's when
he play about it. Big time hitter, one of the
fastest players in baseball by the numbers. We'll come back
to that in a second, but the huge injury history
is the biggest topic with bucks to be on him
just being awesome. I pull the numbers starting after twenty
(06:28):
twenty because it was a shortened season. It makes everybody's
games played look lower because they didn't play a lot
of games in twenty twenty, But he was actually injured
before this too. It did not start in twenty twenty one,
but I pulled the numbers since the COVID season the
first four years post COVID season twenty one through twenty four,
he averaged eighty five games per season, which is a
(06:50):
bench basically half the year. Right this year, he's actually
played eighty five games already, so he's actually on pace
to play more than one hundred this year, maybe as
high as like one twenty. That's not one hundred and
sixty two, but it's a lot more games than he's
been averaging. And look, since he broke out basically in
twenty seventeen, he's still like in the top ten or
(07:10):
fifteen in Major League Baseball in terms of like fangrafts
war among outfielders. Like he's been still that good as
far as you know what it is. But he just
doesn't play. Like, yeah, that's the thing. Everyone understands. He's
really good. He doesn't play.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
And the big question, of course, was if you believe
the reporting, and you said, Dan Hayes very reputable reporter
for the Athletic, but the Braves have three outfielders, at
least in a perfect world, they have three outfielders with
Ronald Coney junior, Michael Harris and Jerckston profar. The real question,
(07:46):
and it's not a big surprise that the Braves and
the Mets and other teams are intrigued by Buxton because
if you get a healthy season out of the guy,
or even a mostly healthy season, he's going to be
one of the better, more productive outfielders in baseball. But
you have those three players, you also have a DH
spot that's opening up, so that opens some possibilities. I
(08:08):
don't believe there were any names mentioned or specifics in
that report on who the Braves might be willing to
part with or you know it's it, but it would
not be surprised. Sometimes when you hear these mid season rumors,
they turn into more fire in the offseason because it
sure sounds like the Braves and the Twins talked and
(08:30):
for all those reasons. There's so many fascinating layers to this,
because the Braves also have not only do they have Acunya,
Harris and Profar, but Acunya is an obvious injury risk.
Buxton is about as much of an injury risk as
there is in Major League Baseball, and Jerks and Profar,
there's some real questions about his defense moving forward and
(08:52):
what it's going to look like in the next two years,
assuming he's with the team, So there was just so
many When this report came down, my head's spun five
minutes of like, well, I get it, but I also
don't get it, and you'd have to move around some
chairs and figure things out. But I guess it's a
good sign at least that Alexanthopolis is willing to really
think outside the box and try to infuse some new
(09:15):
talent into this team, because clearly this year is just
not working.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Yeah, And I mean, if all I told you was
Buckson's numbers, I mean, last five seasons, he has an
eight sixty ops and a one thirty six WORRC plus
plus he can run, he can defend, Like obviously you
want that guy, right.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
And you might be able to keep him a little
healthier if you put him in a corner instead of
center field where he's playing.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
Which presumably would be the case. And we won't go
through all of this, but yeah, I mean, you were right.
They didn't attach any names to the reporting about what
the bridgs we're trying to send. Maybe didn't get that far.
Maybe it got as far as Byron's gonna not approve
the trade, so why are you talking about this? But yeah,
maybe it was Harris that Alex was trying to trader,
would have thought about trading. Maybe it was Profar, maybe
(10:03):
it was neither. And you explore a world in which
you have four outfielders plus the DH spot to operate
in and maybe you have Profar dhhm, you have Runny dhhum, Like,
there's interesting worlds. Even Buckston sometimes he's a good defender,
but just keep healthy to your point. So and then
of course that creates the where is ball when? And
where's Burfy go question? Like we are we're aware of that.
(10:26):
It's it's hard to dissect without knowing what they were
trying to offer, But it's pretty firm. I mean, I
trust this reporting enough to at least take the Braves
had interest in bucks In and vocalize the interest to
the Twins, and I'm intrigued. And you know, obviously this
was without saying even if the Twins are trying to
sell on their team, they were going to just give
(10:48):
bucks in a way like he's on a pretty good contract.
It's like fifteen million a year, and he's much better
than that when he's actually playing. So it would have
taken something, whether it was prospects, whether it was Harris,
whether it was for whatever was going to be. So
maybe we'll never know, but yeah, your point's a great one.
That's probably more doing this now. Is that a lot
(11:09):
of times these like little fireworks, maybe like sparklers become
fireworks as the way maybe I'll put it, like, maybe
they revisit this in the winter and maybe Backplus still
says no, like he's that's well within his rights to
be like, no, thanks, I'm good. But it would be
interesting to see if they were actually to talk about
this up again.
Speaker 2 (11:27):
Yeah, definitely something you just kind of file in the
back of our minds and when we start really thinking
about the off season, maybe this is a sign that, hey,
if a player is talented, the Braves should be in
a situation where they feel like they can move some
pieces around and be unconventional and yeah, maybe they don't
necessarily need an outfielder, but if you could rotate for
(11:48):
outfielders and have a DH and then use Murphy or
Baldwin to acquire other assets or whatever it is they
need to do, as we said here, they have. The
Atlanta Braves have the second best odds at getting the
number one pick in the draft next summer, when you
say that out loud, the next sentence you should say
(12:08):
is that everything is on the table this offseason.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
Yep. And uh. While I understand the urge in some
corners to say, wait, that's why why would we do
one another outfielder, I think we've probably learned at least
maybe you should have learned by now that you do
need depth, like if you haven't watched this Braves team
the last two years and thought that at some point
that depth is important or more important that the Braves
have treated it in recent years, like yeah, you can
(12:32):
have the you have the best starting eight, starting nine,
and five startup guys are gonna get hurt like you need.
And the Brakes that have had zero depth basically at
every spot with then Catcher, they've had no depth for
a couple of years now and they've paid the price
for that, so only show nails to add I thought
it was interesting for sure, and maybe we could do
a dissection if it's becomes back on the table in
(12:53):
the winter, and I'm sure we would dive into it
again as far as like the actual machinations. But I
thought it was an IRA raiser and certainly worthy of
a podcast topic In early August.
Speaker 2 (13:02):
Yeah, absolutely, I mean it was like, oh, man, Byron Buckston,
so many reasons to say yes, so many reasons to
say no, everything from performance to injury risk to contract
to return. It was really interesting. I'm sure you said
it exactly right at the start. Everybody there were opinions
on every side from oh my god, whatever the Twins want,
(13:23):
let's get Byron Buxton too. Are you nuts? Why on
earth would we want to add this guy to the team.
He plays forty five games a year.
Speaker 1 (13:31):
He plays more than that. But it's it's there's been
some seasons where he's played part of our games, so
that's it's. It's man, It's really interesting, it really is.
If you could, if you were trying to pick like
the player in baseball, that might have been like the
most polarizing. It might be bust in because there are
people that get super duper mad about injuries, Like there
(13:52):
are people that want to send Ronald A. Kuna to
Mars right now because he gets hurt every once in
a while. Like you know what I mean, it's.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Well, well, and if you think Acuna gets heard a lot,
I mean that's yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
So anyway, we'll come back to that we need to.
We'll get some more baseball stuff on the field, as
well as some at least one unfortunate injury update and
also another interesting injury update for a starting picture who
might have been this young last year. We'll get into
that more in a second after it. Word from our partners.
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Speaker 1 (15:22):
All right, Scott, there was an unfortunate injury update. I
know our friends Steven and Sean covered a lot of
injury update ground on the most recent episode on this feed.
That was a not random, but like an assortment of
injury updates in one day. For bry Siker was like,
let's talk about all the injuries and here's four or
five updates since then. By the way, listen to that
show of course if you ast anything since then. The
(15:44):
Braves didn't formally announced, but Sni basically announced that Johanmanez
has been shut down from throwing. He was kind of
ramping up trying to get back discomfort in the surgically
prepared knee that he has surgery on back in November.
Not ideal, doesn't seem like we have any more than that,
or then they shut him down. We can go back
(16:07):
into some history with Jimenez, Like I think on the
show we probably said ten times like if he pitches
this year, this is when they were even supposed to
be good this year. If he pitches, it was kind
of a bonus, like the timeline for his recovery was
going to be like late in the season at the
absolute best. So it's not like it's a huge blow
for this year for obvious reasons. But he's a guy
(16:28):
who's signed for next year and honestly is on paper
like the incumbent closer for next year if he's back
and healthy, and of him if he can't get right now,
it's not idea. I'm not saying you poor dirt on
him or anything like that, but cautions the right is
the way to go here. But anytime you hear shut
down for surgical repaired knee, you don't like that. No,
you don't.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
And I think if the Braves were two games up,
maybe it would be handled a little differently. But they're dead,
so I'm in favor. I Ever since it's been talked
about that the Braves might rush some of these pitchers
back from injuries. I have been banging my head against
the desk because it just doesn't make much sense. I
(17:10):
get that you don't necessarily want a pitcher to go
like eighteen months without throwing competitive pitches, but why push Jimenez.
It was a far more serious knee injury than anyone
was expecting. And he's a big boy, you know, like
he's like six five, two hundred and fifty pounds, so
that's a lot of torque that he's putting on that knee.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
So sure, we.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
Would have loved to see Jimenez healthy and firing ninety
eight fastballs in September if he truly felt one hundred percent.
But at this point, give him another couple of months off,
let him rest, let him rehab, keep building up, strengthen
the knee, and then get him on a throwing program
in December and January and kind of see where you're at,
because Jimenez should be, assuming he's healthy, a really big
(17:52):
piece of this bullpen next year.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Yeah, and you know, not to relegate all of it,
but that was a big blow when he They were
not expecting him to be out for as long as
he was. When they want to go clean up the knee.
It was like, oh, this is bad. They got to
surgically repair this. And that was that was a surprise
injury update in November to say, oh, by the way,
he's out eight to twelve months. Was the timeline they
gave us. WHOA, that's the whole season maybe, and it
(18:15):
is the whole season, it seems.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Yeah, it was a huge loss. I mean again, not
that Joe Jimenez would have saved the entire season, but
it was and I think we maybe we even said
in during the spring, like we we should not be
overlooking the loss of Joe Jimenez because you know, it
was a while ago now, but he was legitimately as
good as any reliever in the game last season outside
(18:38):
of like the very elites. So not a small thing,
hopefully with I mean, shoot, he'll have almost eighteen months
to distance himself from that knee. Jimenez also had back
surgery a couple of years ago, so he's had some
legitimate procedures that were done. So you just help crush
your fingers, give him some more time off and let's uh,
you know, ideally he is an eighth or ninth getting
(19:00):
option for this team. Come twenty twenty six.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
He's a very big man. He's paid like a high
leverage reliever, and they need him to be good next year.
I mean that's he's not like high in the priority
list as far as the guys will talk about, but
he is important, like I would say, sneakily so so
uh not great, not great information there to get on. Ah,
what was it a Tuesday that we learned that information?
But we'll come back to that when we need to.
The other thing I sort of alluded to about the
(19:26):
injury update was about Chris Sale. He's actually gonna throw
live batting in practice on Thursday. According to Snit. There's
no like plan after that that's in place. But throing
live VP means you're ramping up like you're trying to pitch.
And you already just kind of stated your opinion on
all of these things. And we've also joked and not
(19:47):
so joked that Chris Sale is the kind of guy
where like they may not be able to keep him
off the mouth. Chris Sale is a maniac in the
best way, as we always say. They also, I did
say Snip would said he would at least probably have
for at least one rehab start before returning. I don't
(20:07):
want Chris Sale to pitch. You just said that. You
just said I think the same thing. You can correct
me if I'm wrong. I don't want Sale to pitch
this year. I also think that he might just pitch
because this is not I mean, look, and this is
a big picture topic too. The Braves have been bad
at telling their own players that they have to not
play or not do things, and I think Sale like
(20:28):
might be like the ultimate example of that, as a
guy who like might just go in and punch them
on if they tried to tell him you can't pitch.
I'm joking, but I'm not so. Yeah, cut some jerseys out.
It seems like he might be pitching, uh in September.
I don't like that, but uh, you know, what are
you gonna do? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (20:43):
I think what is today? August sixth I get it.
And it was just broken ribs. Now, if it was
an elbow, you know, Schmollenbach is twenty five years old
and has a broken bone in his elbow. That is
significantly different pitching please not pitching, right, Yeah, And they're
(21:03):
gonna shut him down as they should. And but with Sale,
I get it. He's a competitor. He wants to go
out there now, I don't. Let's say that Sale is
back in two weeks, three weeks pitching for the Braves.
I don't necessarily want him pitching until Game one sixty two.
If Sale wants to go out there and make three
or four starts just to get his arm and his
(21:24):
body going, as long as there's no warning signs like
a dip in velocity or something like that, I mean,
we're all gonna have to just hold our breath every
time Sale goes out there. But because it was a bone,
I can't imagine there's any risk of reaggravating a broken
rib unless he goes and dives for a baseball again.
So it's not ideal. I think in an ideal world, well,
(21:47):
in an ideal world, Sale would have never known for
that baseball to preserve a complete game shutout. But I
think as long as Sale doesn't have any warning signs
and the doctors are convinced he is one hundred percent
and there won't be any lasting effects. Sure, let's see
make a couple of starts if he wants to, and
then shut him down. Maybe by the third week in September.
And say hey, let's go get him in twenty twenty six.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up, because I should
have said it too. Like it not being an arm
an arm injury or even like a leg plant injury.
It's a very it's not gonna mess with him. You
with it. Obviously you can't pitch the broken rib, but
as long as he's healthy and healed up, there's no
reason that he can't go, So it doesn't make it
a little bit different. It's a great point. Please be
careful with him, I would say. And that goes for everybody.
(22:32):
I mean, we'll get into this in September, but even
guys who have who are healthy as they possibly could be,
I would be super careful with It's a totally like
they're gonna have I mean, honestly, they're gonna have to
have a matt Olsen conversation, Like should Matt Olsen play
every single game this season? I know he has the
consecutive game streak, but should he really play every game
(22:52):
this season? I would ask that question because and look,
he's not been hurt for years and years and years
back found Wood, But like it's hard when you played
every single game for years and years and years and
years and you're not hurt, But like, really, do I
want to see Meddilson play on Setember twenty seventh, I
kind of don't.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
To be honest, I think I don't disagree with you.
I think Matt would fight, like hell.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
I don't keep it. I get it because it's I
get it.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
I think Olson streak is getting up there in like
the top whatever in baseball history for consecutive games play.
That's not a small thing like.
Speaker 1 (23:25):
That, And I think I think he's gonna play. I mean, look,
the Braves, we've made fun of this, and even more
than that, the Braves don't tend to overrule their players,
probably to a fault. I mean Ronnie playing the not
long ago, Ronnie playing when you shouldn't have been playing.
Freddie used to play whenever when he shouldn't be playing.
Like there's there's document evidence of this for a long time.
(23:46):
I don't think they're gonna tell Matt he can't play.
I'm just saying, like that's an that's probably the most
prime example of a guy who's not even hurt. But
it's like, man, really, you're thirty games out, Like, do
we need to be doing this right now, so it's
it's also philosophical, like it's also sad thing with I mean,
every time we bring this up, I don't know about you,
we get fans they're like mad at us. They're not
(24:07):
like grinding through every game the same way, and it's
like we're not rooting for the team to lose in
the same way that some others are. Like there's that
nuance we bring up all the time now too often, maybe,
but like there are some fans that are just like, no,
treat it like every other game. We want the team
to win. Play as hard as you can't, and I
get it. I just think it's like maybe prudent to
not push as hard.
Speaker 2 (24:26):
I don't know, Yeah, just be careful and be smart
over these final two months. Spencer Strider who pitched on
Wednesday Night, Spencer is going to almost certainly get shut
down here at some point, probably in September. But no
need to push him coming off the elbow surgery. I mean,
we talked about Grant Holmes was probably to the end
(24:47):
of his road or nearing it anyway, and then he
gets hurt, which is really unfortunate. So I think we're
gonna see a lot of Joey Wentz, Hurston Waldrip Giddyer
for one, does Eric Fetti like those types are gonna
make a lot of starts to this team down the
stretch because there's just no need for Strider to go
balls to the wall any year where you're gonna be
(25:09):
twenty five games below five hundred.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
Yeah, pitching even more so, for sure. I use a
couple of disi player examples, like like Matt, but pitching
is even more so, like there's just there's mileage on
your arm that you would like to avoid it. Nothing
else and a lost season under key guys. So we'll
leave it there for now. We will get into some
actual on field stuff to end the podcast at a
second couple of losses and in fact they sweep at
home and not great fashion. We'll get into all that
(25:34):
and more scotch after a word from our partners Krats.
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Speaker 1 (26:35):
Go for it, Okay, Scott, Let's wrap this thing up
with a sweep loss at the hands of the Brewers.
The bridge did threaten Tonight within Michael Harris home run
in the ninth on Wednesday to get within one. They
end up losing five to four. Before we tip into
the actual games as predicted by us, I would say
(26:56):
on Sunday, there was nobody at the ballpark, nobody, nobody.
Speaker 2 (27:02):
It was a ghost town. I called it a morgue
on Twitter. I mean people were posting photos. I know
the Braves announced thirty some thousand people at the last
three games, but I mean it might have been like
fifteen thousand people.
Speaker 1 (27:15):
It was.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
It was a empty I have ever seen truest park, man,
it was. And it's sad, and I get it, like
I understand why, especially the way the Braves have restricted
reselling of season tickets, especially, which is a load of uh,
you know, crap. No one's gonna be there and no
one's gonna I mean.
Speaker 1 (27:35):
It's it's sad.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
I wish you watch the Braves right now. And then
the other night I flipped on the Phillies game and
Susans Bank Park is packed and going nuts because Kyleshwarber
home it again. And it's just like the envy right now,
and it's just it's really unfortunate that we're at this situation.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Yeah, and we did. We'd get get into it on Sunday,
won't really get all of it. But it was perfect
storm too, like obviously the lows of the low on
the field weather concerns playing an opponent that is really
good but not a name brand opponent. School started this
week like Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Like it was just all
(28:14):
the signs were there. We saw it coming, and I
know people were confused by this. The attendance number is
announced by any team. This is not just a braced thing.
This is any team. Is a tickets sold slash distributed number.
It is not a people in the building number. Keep
that in mind, so when they say thirty thousand, they're
not lying. That's the number of tickets day've distributed, sees,
(28:37):
ticket holders, all that stuff. But there were not that
many people in the building I can I can guarantee
you that right now for multiple sources. I wasn't there,
but between pictures and people that I know were there,
media folks, other fans, it was. It was not thirty
thousand people. I could probish you that. So it's just
one little thing. It doesn't matter that much. But two
we poked fun at it. But the notion that some
(28:58):
were throwing out there, the deadline that the Braves wanted
to maintain some sort of respectability and get the building
filled by not trading guys like the cleat, that was
never realistic, Like they're gonna draw bet like even this
weekend they're playing the Marlins who are the Marlins? They
will draw better this weekend. It's a weekend people people
like to Uh. I've been at the Battery for plenty
(29:20):
of plenty of bad teams. Like on a weekend, the
Battery will still be popping. That's just it's a it's
a cool thing to do. It's outside. There will have
no trouble drawing on Friday and Saturday and Sunday. They
just won't. I guess anybody now, I won't be packed
in the way. We will be agguest the Dodgers if
they were good, but they will draw fine. It's the
weekday games. We're on a Tuesday night. It's not a
small thing to have to go to the ballpark from
(29:41):
any around Atlanta on a weeknight. And if you don't
want to really go yangling right, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
I've seen people, you know, we were talking about it
and people have said, hey, I am trying to give
my tickets away and nobody wants to go. And someone
even said I was offering tickets and a parking pass
and I could not find someone to.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
Go on Monday night. I'll do that if it's offer.
If I wants to offer me that, I'll go. Most
nights fun.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
There you go. Yeah, And I love baseball like you know,
any level. I'm not a local, but I get it.
Man Like people are frustrated. It's school airfair. If you
want to pay it. If you want to pay for
Scott's airfair.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
He'll come. He'll come to a game.
Speaker 2 (30:20):
If you If anybody has that that private jet, send
it on out. We'll give you a nice little shout
out on the show.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
And we might have. We might have. Honestly, there would
not be surprised if we had a fan that has
like a Wheels OFE connection or something like that. So
somebody that listens to the show that's like a rich
person that's like, hey, Scott, want to go on my plane. Anyway,
That's not where I wanted to start necessarily, but it's
just like it was. It was a looming specter and
they got swept. I mean, we'll talk about it for
a second. I know Steven and Sean talked about the
(30:47):
first game of a sweep on Monday, but Tuesday's loss
was like a pretty twenty twenty five Braves loss. It
was by five runs on a game where they had
plenty of chances. They left. We're team on base like.
It was just like a throw It was like throwback
to like May, when we still had hope and they
would have these nights where they just couldn't get anything
(31:07):
going in big spots. It was like somebody.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
Someone had a note, and I don't have it exactly
in front of me, but I believe with the bases loaded,
the Braves struck out three times in full counts on
pitches that would have been ball four. Tell me that
is not the most twenty twenty four twenty twenty five
Atlanta Brave stat imaginable.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
It was.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
I did not catch a lot of it, Thankfully. I
had planed with my wife much much more fun than
watching that game because I was just scrolling through the
game day box score and it was like, oh my god,
Oh they left.
Speaker 1 (31:41):
The bases loaded.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
Oh they left the bases loaded again. Oh they committed
an air. It was just, I mean, it's it's mind
numbing just how bad this team is sometimes.
Speaker 1 (31:51):
Yeah, the aforementioned Joey Wentz had his worst start as
a Brave. He still wasn't even that badd a couple
of bad moments in that start he did. Actually, I'm
gonna spin this positively for joy Wentz. He has pitched
five times for the Braves. Twenty three and a third
innings is era is like three point one fifth of
like two point five. Like he's actually been good. I
(32:13):
don't know if that's real. He wasn't pretty good on Tuesday,
but he's a small bright spot in the wilderness. I
guess yeah. And to your point earlier, he's gonna pitch it.
I mean, guys that will not be shut down. If
he is able to pitch, he will keep pitching all
the way for sure. And I agree.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
I don't think Wentz is necessarily like a long term fixture,
but if he pitches well for the next two months,
he's gonna make like a million dollars next season. He's
probably worth keeping around and at least, you know, tendering
him maybe a two way contract or I think Wentz
still has minor league options, so you can do a
split deal, whatever it is. I think Wentz has shown
(32:51):
at least enough through five starts that you can keep
him around, and maybe the Braves have figured something out
with Rick Kranitz and the pitching staff. I've tried to
maybe reinvent him a little bit, because clearly what Wentz
was doing before this was just not working out.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
Yeah, maybe, as we've discussed, maybe he's like your eighth
starter next and you do need eight starters, you need
nine ten starters. So I'm no one's saying he's gonna
be one of your best five coming into the season
next year. But if you have guys that are in
your eight, nine ten spots that can actually pitch respectable
major beginnings, that is actually very helpful. So hopefully something
like that a small bright spot. There're thing that happened
(33:29):
that was kind of making the rounds was the jerks
and profar hilariously bad defensive play from Tuesday. I know
you weren't dialed in watching. Did you see the play?
Have you seen the replay of this play?
Speaker 2 (33:40):
I did see it. I know that I understand why
there's so much It was really bad.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
It was bad, man, I mean it was.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
We've seen that play before where a ball is hit
right at an outfielder and they kind of like freeze
and he should have gone backwards at it. It was
like a comical looking play and Profar has been really
bad defensively. But yeah, I mean that is a legitimate
concern for a player who came into the year with questions.
Speaker 1 (34:07):
About his defense. Yeah, I mean it's one player. I
don't really care about one play. It was bad, it
was amusingly bad. But the bigger thing is, and this
is of course an off season topic, but he is
a bad defender. And we kind of we kind of
knew that when we talked about it this this winter
when they signed. It was like, hey, he could probably
play left but it's not like he's a good defender,
(34:28):
and he's not. It's funny because he used to be
a shortstop. Like I'm old enough to remember when he
was a prospect, he was a shortstop and I can't
imagine him playing shortstop. Can you imagine that? I mean, yeah,
I'm sure you've seen this too. At the height of one,
Ozzie was like struggling the absolute most this year. People
were asking asking its pro park up by second base.
It's like, guys, he can't play left field. No, we
(34:48):
can't with he can with second base. He's the age
and he's not. Actually, I'll ask you this. There is
this comparison being made by many people in the last
two days to Horace Hilaire do all. Distinction between Solaire's
defense was I think worse. It looked worse, but people,
(35:08):
I mean some of the advanced numbers are actually similarly
bad for Profar. I don't think for me, we're not
a spot where it's like last winter we were saying
collectively as a body on the show, he Solai cannot
play left field ever again, like no, get him out
of here. Are you fund that we have a Profar
or are we like going in next year like this,
(35:30):
because look, it's the it's the curve regrading on. But
if he's a DH, he's not very good as a DH.
Like you kind of have to mash if if you're
playing DH, if you're playing left field, it's like all right,
whatever hit recently.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
Yeah, you know Profar has a one to fifteen w
RC plus since coming off the suspension, which is good.
Like that's kind of what we expected from him before
we knew he was juicing. I think when when they
signed him this offseason, we're like, you know what last
year career year. I didn't know about the pds, but
like a one fifteen, one to twenty w RC plus
(36:05):
for a position that has been a catastrophic black hole
for years or the braves, that's that seemed reasonable and
you would take it. That's a good hitting left fielder.
It's not gonna get you to the Hall of Fame.
But I think Profar is really one of like three
players that I am super locked into Profar, Michael Harris,
ozsi Alby's these final two months, how do they perform?
(36:27):
How much confidence do they instill? Because I think Profar
is gonna hit enough. But that defense, I don't think
it's Jorge Solaier bad, but it's I mean every it's
not like so Lair where every night it was like,
oh dear God, what an adventure. But it's been bad.
I mean in a month plus, it's I can count
(36:47):
a couple of times on my hand, just off the
top of my head where Profar made a bad play
in left field and ended up giving up a hit
that probably should have been caught.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
Yeah, it's strongly negative out there so far. Maybe he
can improve. He didn't you know, he wasn't played for
I mean, it's his own fault, but he wasn't playing
for a while. Maybe there's some rust if you want
to be kind to him. I know Bracefas don't want
to kind of him, which understand he cost them a
lot so, uh, your point, this is the right one.
We were never some people were. We were never saying
he was definitely going to be what he was last year.
(37:18):
We weren't forecasting regression from that number. And that's kind
of where he is the plate. But if he's an
even if he is a one fifteen WRC plus guy
in left field, if his defense is this bad, you're
not loving it. Like he's not unplayable, but that's not
that's not exciting. If he's a strongly negative defender and
(37:39):
a pretty good hitter, that's not a good that's not
a great player. Like it's better than Verdugo, it's better
than a white spin, but like it's not what you
were hoping for. So hopefully he gets hopefully could just
be okay. Like that's the thing with profar defensively, is
like get him to be below average compared to catastrophic.
That's the gap you're looking for.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
And generally left field is not a defensive position that's
going to absolutely kill you. It can still hurt you, but.
Speaker 1 (38:07):
It's not like stop. Yeah. On Tuesday, I had someone
very angrily arguing with me telling me that they thought
Ozuna was good. Azuna would be better in left field
than Profar, and they were serious, and I was like,
Ozuna can't even run like respectfully, stop, I understand the
point you're trying to make people trying to be hyperbolic
(38:28):
about the defense. It is bad with Profar, it has
been bad. Hopefully it improves. But anyway, that was a
other than Yeah, honestly, that was probably the most memorable
thing that happened on Tuesday was the Profar defensive misque.
It made the rounds tonight's game closer five to four loss.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (38:48):
The first thing, briefly we'll talk about, did you see
the lineup revamp? Like Snith decided to just put the
names in a hat and just kind of jiggle them,
and that the lineup it was. I don't really care
honestly about the linup contruction right now. Season's over, but
I do care about one thing, and that's that Ballwin
(39:08):
didn't play today. I don't like that he did pinch it.
He was actually he made the last out of the game,
but I don't. I don't like ball when not play.
I get that it's an eight game week, so maybe
that's part of this, but weird, just weird all the
way around. Everything was weird.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
Yeah, weird lineup. I kind of laughed when I saw.
I'm like, whatever, who cares.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
Like it doesn't it doesn't matter. It was just one
of those things like you see the lineup card come out,
we're all we all we're all conditioned to do this,
that we're dialed in. When the laud comes out, we
all kind of look at it and it's like if
it's similar, it's kind of a shrug. But just to
say it. A lot of people that may maybe didn't
see the game, it was Elio White leading off, Ozzie
hitting second, and then it was I mean, not just
gonna play. So the rest of it was pretty conventional.
(39:47):
But Profar got moved down as soon it was back
in the lineup tonight. The biggest thing was again Eli
White nausey always one to two. I mean, I understand
you don't really care anymore, but like, what are we doing?
Don't do that?
Speaker 2 (40:01):
Forty nine games of Brian Snitker left Brad forty nine games.
Speaker 1 (40:04):
Oh, that actually reminds me. We've been saying exactly that
about snit Somebody actually like very genuinely asked us, like, hey,
have they announced it? No, Like a lot of us
are assuming Snit is not going to be back. No
one has said anything or even reported it definitively. Now,
the Beat guys have all kind of talked about it
(40:25):
pretty openly, like they're kind of assuming that's going to
be gone. We are assuming that to retirement, to maybe
a consulting role or whatever. But no one has said that.
No one has announced that. That is a key distinction.
I like to be precise. We're not breaking any news.
We are assuming that's not going to be there anymore.
(40:46):
But no one said that. In fact, someone was breaking
someone's like, uh, I think it was our friend at
Capitol Avenue on Twitter was like just wait for the
moment when they announced that's gonna be back next year
and the Twitter reaction to that, that'll go over well.
Speaker 2 (40:57):
Uh, the Internet would actually explode. But you know, Snit
his contract is up at the end of the season.
What do they say about college coaches without a contract?
You know, it's it's it's not apples to apples. But
there's a reason, man, Like, if Snit was coming back,
why would you not already extend him? The season has
(41:17):
been bad? Like if let me say this, Brad, if
the Braves before this year did not renew Snit's contract,
but they won one hundred and three games and went
to the World Series. Okay, you can obviously write up
a new extension, even if it's unconventional for managers to
manage without a contract beyond the current year. But I mean,
there's nothing this season that would lead me to believe
(41:40):
that Snit will be back. Maybe he's in a front
office role. Hell of a career, almost fifty years with
the Braves, it's just remarkable.
Speaker 1 (41:48):
But I mean he's going to be seventy in October
as well. Like, yeah, I we can say this for later,
but I think that it does if you we're not
we've ever been the biggest advocates, nor have we ever
been the biggest set detractors. Is that fair? I think
it is Scott Were. I respect Brian Snicker. I think
he's done a good job and a lot of things
(42:09):
for a long time. I think he has some weaknesses.
He always has, so I've never been like the zelots
that some are. Some people are like, you cannot creditie Brian, Well,
yes I can, and I will, But others are like
he's a buffoon, get him out, And I don't feel
the same way. I don't feel I don't feel that
way either. But when you're expiring contractually, when you'll be seventy,
(42:31):
and when your team does this for this season, it
gives everybody cover across the I mean, if if you
want to be cynical about it all, it gives Alice cover,
It gives ownership cover, It gives Snick cover to say, hey,
it's been a great well. Tip the cap I will.
You know, everyone should be like extremely positive for the
moment Snit retires. Everyone should give Snitt his flowers hopefully.
(42:52):
I know the Braves will. But I'm even fans that
don't like love him as a manager. The guy's been
an organizational lifer. Like it's a pretty easy lay up,
no issues off the field, like any of this stuff.
Like he's it's he's an absolute layup of a guy
to praise when he goes out.
Speaker 2 (43:06):
He won a World Series, dude, Like if you if
fans who who overlook the world, I get to stop
because I'm gonna go on a crazy tangent. Fans who
act like twenty twenty one wasn't all that great, Oh
they just got hot, they weren't that good? Shut up? Like, actually,
shut up, that's the ridiculous thing I've ever heard.
Speaker 1 (43:24):
Agreed, and also yes it was. The playoffs are random,
they are, but okay, they also could have won the
World Series and other seasons when they were actually quote
unquote that good of a team and they didn't, So like,
who cares? It balances out they won the World Series? Okay,
Flash Flight Forever, uh the old Actually, uh my, I
guess he's my friend. I mean we've we've hung out some.
(43:45):
Brian went horse to ESPN co covers the NBA. He
what he says is winning means you never have to
say you're sorry. It's like, hey, that's that's that's that's right. Basically,
that's that's like his version of flash fla Forever. Basically,
if you want to if you won the World Series,
who you won? Yep? Oh one more thing on the
game tonight and we'll get out of here. You mentioned
(44:06):
Strutter before Strutter we think probably won't pitch all the
way to the end. He had his worst start of
the season tonight, by the numbers, four and two thirds,
eleven hits. He got hit really hard tonight, five or
runs like it wasn't like a total catastrophe, but like
he was not good, Like he did not look great today.
He got hit hard. Anything you want to flag about
that or just wanted to say it out loud, like
(44:27):
it didn't look great. He's again he's the only guy
in the rotition that everybody likes right now. But he
wasn't very good today.
Speaker 2 (44:33):
Now, in the last couple of starts for Spencer have
not been very good, I'm wondering if he's starting to
hit a little bit of a wall physically. He of
course barely pitched last year, and then coming all the
way back from the surgery, he's not kidding as much
a swing and miss as he was earlier in the
season either when he was really rolling. So you know,
it's the first week, almost second week of August. I
(44:55):
would pitch Spencer up until Labor Day and then probably
call it quits for the season. He just I don't
need to send him out there, and hopefully he can
be better than this moving forward. But it was really,
I mean he was he was getting hit hard really
from the first inning on.
Speaker 1 (45:08):
Yeah, it was not one of those games where you
give a bunch of soft stuff you get unlucky. Like
we'll point that out when it happens, it was not
that today he got hit hard. All right, well, Scott,
we can get out of here. We alluded to it earlier.
The Race have a five game series against the Marlins
because on Thursday, yes, five games, they're playing a doubleheader
(45:29):
on Saturday. Boy, that'll be a long day at the office.
They did announce probables for a few games today. It's
Carrasco on Oh sorry, sorry, Carlos, I can't help it laugh,
Carlos Grasco on Thursday, Bryce Older on Friday, and Saturday
is still a TVD. It seems like they're gonna be
it's probably gonna be Waldrope we think in one of
(45:52):
those games, but they haven't said that yet, So just
strap in. We'll have at least one more show between
now and announced. That's the plan anyway between now on
the weekend. So what update on who's going to pitch
for the weekend. But the Marlins being like, what nine
to ten games ahead of the Braves is just like unthinkable,
But that's where we are.
Speaker 2 (46:09):
So yeah, and you know what, the Marlins are a
great story out of nowhere. These guys have been one
of the better teams I think only the Brewers actually
have a better record than the Miami Marlins over almost
seven or eight weeks at this point, which is nuts
good on the Marlins, a team that was left for dead,
a team that has like no payroll, and they're winning games.
Speaker 1 (46:29):
And actually, I just love this. The Marlins have a
worse run differential than the Braves do. Of course, of
course that's.
Speaker 2 (46:36):
What happens when you go, oh in ninety six and
one run games like the Bras this year.
Speaker 1 (46:41):
So I didn't mean I was just looking at that,
like I wanted to go see what the Marlins record was,
and then I just thought, oh, they're minus forty eight
the Braves or minus thirty.
Speaker 2 (46:48):
You know, a crazy thing. If the Braves lay down
this weekend. You know, the Marlins are only five games
back of the Mets in the lost column in the
East right now.
Speaker 1 (46:59):
I mean, yeah, six games, five games a lot. Yeah,
because the Mets are two and I think they went
like two to eight in the last ten, like they're
kind of.
Speaker 2 (47:05):
The Mets are bad, like legitimately bad for two months now.
Speaker 1 (47:09):
I can't I can't wait in late September and October
when we're not talking about the Braves, we'll be talking
about we'll be rooting against the Mets in the Phillies
because that's what Braves fans should do. And yeah, I
saw your exchange with I think it was James Shadow
of Mets up our colleague on the network, basically like
(47:29):
offering to trade them records because they were and the
Mets fans are meltdown and I get why they're playing
like crap, and they had been for a while. But
it's like, hey, how about how about the perspectives. The
Braves are currently fifteen games behind the Mets.
Speaker 2 (47:41):
It's funny. It's almost like the two organizations have flipped,
isn't it.
Speaker 1 (47:45):
Like Like I.
Speaker 2 (47:46):
Think when James was on our show in the spring,
he was like, yeah, I would love for the Braves
problems to be the Mets problems. Now, little did we
know the season ahead was around on the corner.
Speaker 1 (47:57):
But we'll switch.
Speaker 2 (47:58):
Yeah, just uh, bad year, but hey maybe as long
as we'll be rooting hard for whoever the Mets, if
the Mets make the playoffs, whoever the Mets draw, whoever
the Phillies draw. Phillies are a good team. I almost
might pick the Phillies to win the World Series or
at least get there from the National League because they
are they're playing pretty well, and they they are built
for October. And this also just feels like and then
(48:18):
we'll move on. But it just feels like the Phillies
are like kind of near the end of their reign
with the ages of some of those players. So we'll see,
he'll be It feels like the playoffs are about is
wide open this year as they have been in a
long time. I wish them, not them with the worst,
to be honest, but I understand.
Speaker 1 (48:35):
What you said there. You're right, You're right, They're they're good.
It's a good team. Okay, Scott, let's get out of
here on this Wednesday evening again. We'll have another show
between now and Sunday, probably with our colleagues Shawn Stephen
on that pod, but please stay to Please subscribe to
Hammer Territory anywhere you find your podcasts. Follows Scott if
you want to on x slash Twitter at Scott Coleman.
(48:57):
Fifty five. Lots of Colts takes these days. We're getting
close on the Indianapolis Colts quarterback battles in full swing
training camp stuff. Scott, fans and football.
Speaker 2 (49:07):
What else do Let's do twenty five minutes on Brad's
Takes on the Atlanta Falcons for twenty to twenty.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
You don't want that, maybe I can talk to my guy,
Aaron Freeman from Locked on Falcons talk to have me
on the podcast. I have lots of Falcons takes. I
just don't want to offer them here. I'm pessimistic as
I always am about the Falcons, but I do love them.
That's my cleanest fan experience. I've never covered them full time.
I'm just a maniac like everybody else with them. It's
(49:37):
just I hate them, but I love them, and it
is what it is, sports and a nutshell. Scott, thanks
for being here. I appreciate it, as always your flexibility
in my recording times. As for Mela, one more time,
please subscribe to Hammer Territory. I know it's not fun
right now to follow the braves, to watch the braves,
to consume the braves, but we're gonna be here the
(49:58):
entire time, no days off, we' off. We'll be covering them.
So subscribe, tell your friends, and we'll see you all
next time.
Hello everyone, and welcome back to the Hammer Territory podcast.
This episode two four or five. I'm your host, Brad Roland,
coming to you on a Wednesday evening here in early August,
and I'm joined as I always am, by Scott Coleman. Scott.
Our first episode post deadline was a few days ago.
This is number two for us, our follow up and
a lot of stuff talk about that's not necessarily unfil related.
(00:44):
How are you hey?
Speaker 2 (00:45):
That's a win, Brad. These are dark days for the
Atlanta Braves and we will take some like legitimate news
and like a trade rumor that went down to So
there's a lot to talk about. And you know it's funny.
You're a man who spends some time on Twitter and
on Braves Twitter. Do you know how hard it is
to get a consensus on literally anything? So tonight you
(01:10):
do so tonight? I asked out loud. Is this officially
the most disappointing Brave season relative to expectations, hope streams,
on field performance, off field stuff? Is this the most
disappointing Brave season in like forty years? And I didn't
(01:30):
do a poll, but I bet if I've dropped a poll,
it would be like ninety eight percent, yes, and that
is I mean that that's four decades. Man, Like I'm
in my mid thirties. This is far and away the
worst Brave season I have ever watched.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Yeah, I mean there's a probably a deeper dive we
can do on this when it's actually over at the end,
but I think that certainly it's in the running. I
think there are some other candidates that we'd like to
probably ignore right now because it just feels so terrible
in the moment. But I mean, if you go back
to ninety one, I mean, forty years is like a
(02:05):
pretty round number. Thirty five is like the span of
when they were awesome basically and for most of the
last thirty five years, And that's like for a lot
of people, like their entire life. I mean, I don't
know what year you were born, but I think it
was just before ninety one.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Ish, I'm a ninety one baby, So I don't credit for.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
The little must say, literally your entire life. They've been
good basically. They've been a couple of times when they weren't.
But yeah, I mean there's a couple of seasons where
they fell short of expectations, but not quite in the
level of this season, Like if you're certainly doing compared
to like what they were supposed to be, it's not
even close. This is the obvious answer. If you do that,
if that's your calculus. So great things to talk about
(02:46):
in early August, when there's still forty nine games left
in the season after today.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
So I was gonna say, forty nine games. Who is counting?
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Though? Right we are, we are counting, you know what, Scott.
We'll come back to some other stuff about that. But
we got an questions over the last I don't know
thirty six hours about this trade river that you just
mentioned that we'll lead with that tonight because it's a
little change up. We would normally do some other stuff,
but what's not today. There was a report from Dan
(03:14):
Hayes at The Athletic, who I think is a credible
source covers the Twins very well. He reported the Braves
as a team with interest in Byron Buxton, talented outfielder
for the Twins. He later tweeted, in addition to writing
an article, that the Braves were quote one of two
teams who pushed extremely hard end quote for Buxton pre deadline.
(03:37):
Now we'll get back into this in a second. The
big thing with Buxton is that he has a full
no trade clause that apparently he was eager to utilize
exercise whatever word you want to use. Like, he apparently
just has no desire to leave Minnesota at this point.
So it's kind of a non story. But also it's
very interesting and Byron Buxton. You know someone who lives
(04:00):
in Georgia. Fire Buxton is from Georgia. Yeah, he was
a high school number or two overall pick. But like
he has a local connection. I don't know if he
was a Braves fan growing up, but it wouldn't surprise
me if he was. He probably was if you had to,
Just most people live here a brace fans. So interesting story.
He's a really talented, polarizing player. I mean, speaking of
non consensus, I'm sure you saw every take under the
sun over the last two days like I did, about
(04:22):
whether the Braves should have done this or should have
wanted to. And again we understand that Buckston could just
say no, and it's that simple, but it's interesting that
Braves were apparently eager to at least go after him.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
So it's really interesting because Buxton was adamant that he
was not going to waive his no trade clause and
that he wants to stay in Minnesota. That being said,
the Twins are maybe trying to be sold. There's some
talk about that, and Minnesota just did a full on
fire sale and not only did they do a bit
(04:53):
I guess a mini fire sale at the deadline, but
there's belief that the Twins might just completely got this
thing this offseason. They have more pieces they can trade.
Of course, they just traded Carlos Korea. They have some
really good pitchers who they could move and really just
kind of do a fire start to their their rebuild
that they're going to need to do. I mean, it's
(05:14):
a veteran team. Clearly they're not very good this year.
So maybe Buxton comes down off of the I'm not
waving my trade clause because if he looks around and
he's like, Jesus, we're gonna lose one hundred games the
next three years, maybe he doesn't want to spend the
rest of his playing days in that situation. But I
believe he also has a young family and he might
not want to uproot his kids, and no trade clauses
(05:37):
are hard to get in the majors.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
And players value them.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
There's so much more than just the baseball aspect to it,
so we'll see. I guess we should spend a couple
of minutes on Buxton because this was all people were
talking about when this article came out. But I mean
just I mean polarizing, I think is the perfect word
to describe him. Yeah, trade rumors are always interesting in
fan bases, but when the products so about on the field,
(06:01):
it was like, oh, this is a interesting topic that
we haven't had any.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
So Buxton is let's just say this. He's very, very
good when he plays. When he plays, and that's when
he play about it. Big time hitter, one of the
fastest players in baseball by the numbers. We'll come back
to that in a second, but the huge injury history
is the biggest topic with bucks to be on him
just being awesome. I pull the numbers starting after twenty
(06:28):
twenty because it was a shortened season. It makes everybody's
games played look lower because they didn't play a lot
of games in twenty twenty, But he was actually injured
before this too. It did not start in twenty twenty one,
but I pulled the numbers since the COVID season the
first four years post COVID season twenty one through twenty four,
he averaged eighty five games per season, which is a
(06:50):
bench basically half the year. Right this year, he's actually
played eighty five games already, so he's actually on pace
to play more than one hundred this year, maybe as
high as like one twenty. That's not one hundred and
sixty two, but it's a lot more games than he's
been averaging. And look, since he broke out basically in
twenty seventeen, he's still like in the top ten or
(07:10):
fifteen in Major League Baseball in terms of like fangrafts
war among outfielders. Like he's been still that good as
far as you know what it is. But he just
doesn't play. Like, yeah, that's the thing. Everyone understands. He's
really good. He doesn't play.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
And the big question, of course, was if you believe
the reporting, and you said, Dan Hayes very reputable reporter
for the Athletic, but the Braves have three outfielders, at
least in a perfect world, they have three outfielders with
Ronald Coney junior, Michael Harris and Jerckston profar. The real question,
(07:46):
and it's not a big surprise that the Braves and
the Mets and other teams are intrigued by Buxton because
if you get a healthy season out of the guy,
or even a mostly healthy season, he's going to be
one of the better, more productive outfielders in baseball. But
you have those three players, you also have a DH
spot that's opening up, so that opens some possibilities. I
(08:08):
don't believe there were any names mentioned or specifics in
that report on who the Braves might be willing to
part with or you know it's it, but it would
not be surprised. Sometimes when you hear these mid season rumors,
they turn into more fire in the offseason because it
sure sounds like the Braves and the Twins talked and
(08:30):
for all those reasons. There's so many fascinating layers to this,
because the Braves also have not only do they have Acunya,
Harris and Profar, but Acunya is an obvious injury risk.
Buxton is about as much of an injury risk as
there is in Major League Baseball, and Jerks and Profar,
there's some real questions about his defense moving forward and
(08:52):
what it's going to look like in the next two years,
assuming he's with the team, So there was just so
many When this report came down, my head's spun five
minutes of like, well, I get it, but I also
don't get it, and you'd have to move around some
chairs and figure things out. But I guess it's a
good sign at least that Alexanthopolis is willing to really
think outside the box and try to infuse some new
(09:15):
talent into this team, because clearly this year is just
not working.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Yeah, And I mean, if all I told you was
Buckson's numbers, I mean, last five seasons, he has an
eight sixty ops and a one thirty six WORRC plus
plus he can run, he can defend, Like obviously you
want that guy, right.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
And you might be able to keep him a little
healthier if you put him in a corner instead of
center field where he's playing.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
Which presumably would be the case. And we won't go
through all of this, but yeah, I mean, you were right.
They didn't attach any names to the reporting about what
the bridgs we're trying to send. Maybe didn't get that far.
Maybe it got as far as Byron's gonna not approve
the trade, so why are you talking about this? But yeah,
maybe it was Harris that Alex was trying to trader,
would have thought about trading. Maybe it was Profar, maybe
(10:03):
it was neither. And you explore a world in which
you have four outfielders plus the DH spot to operate
in and maybe you have Profar dhhm, you have Runny dhhum, Like,
there's interesting worlds. Even Buckston sometimes he's a good defender,
but just keep healthy to your point. So and then
of course that creates the where is ball when? And
where's Burfy go question? Like we are we're aware of that.
(10:26):
It's it's hard to dissect without knowing what they were
trying to offer, But it's pretty firm. I mean, I
trust this reporting enough to at least take the Braves
had interest in bucks In and vocalize the interest to
the Twins, and I'm intrigued. And you know, obviously this
was without saying even if the Twins are trying to
sell on their team, they were going to just give
(10:48):
bucks in a way like he's on a pretty good contract.
It's like fifteen million a year, and he's much better
than that when he's actually playing. So it would have
taken something, whether it was prospects, whether it was Harris,
whether it was for whatever was going to be. So
maybe we'll never know, but yeah, your point's a great one.
That's probably more doing this now. Is that a lot
(11:09):
of times these like little fireworks, maybe like sparklers become
fireworks as the way maybe I'll put it, like, maybe
they revisit this in the winter and maybe Backplus still
says no, like he's that's well within his rights to
be like, no, thanks, I'm good. But it would be
interesting to see if they were actually to talk about
this up again.
Speaker 2 (11:27):
Yeah, definitely something you just kind of file in the
back of our minds and when we start really thinking
about the off season, maybe this is a sign that, hey,
if a player is talented, the Braves should be in
a situation where they feel like they can move some
pieces around and be unconventional and yeah, maybe they don't
necessarily need an outfielder, but if you could rotate for
(11:48):
outfielders and have a DH and then use Murphy or
Baldwin to acquire other assets or whatever it is they
need to do, as we said here, they have. The
Atlanta Braves have the second best odds at getting the
number one pick in the draft next summer, when you
say that out loud, the next sentence you should say
(12:08):
is that everything is on the table this offseason.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
Yep. And uh. While I understand the urge in some
corners to say, wait, that's why why would we do
one another outfielder, I think we've probably learned at least
maybe you should have learned by now that you do
need depth, like if you haven't watched this Braves team
the last two years and thought that at some point
that depth is important or more important that the Braves
have treated it in recent years, like yeah, you can
(12:32):
have the you have the best starting eight, starting nine,
and five startup guys are gonna get hurt like you need.
And the Brakes that have had zero depth basically at
every spot with then Catcher, they've had no depth for
a couple of years now and they've paid the price
for that, so only show nails to add I thought
it was interesting for sure, and maybe we could do
a dissection if it's becomes back on the table in
(12:53):
the winter, and I'm sure we would dive into it
again as far as like the actual machinations. But I
thought it was an IRA raiser and certainly worthy of
a podcast topic In early August.
Speaker 2 (13:02):
Yeah, absolutely, I mean it was like, oh, man, Byron Buckston,
so many reasons to say yes, so many reasons to
say no, everything from performance to injury risk to contract
to return. It was really interesting. I'm sure you said
it exactly right at the start. Everybody there were opinions
on every side from oh my god, whatever the Twins want,
(13:23):
let's get Byron Buxton too. Are you nuts? Why on
earth would we want to add this guy to the team.
He plays forty five games a year.
Speaker 1 (13:31):
He plays more than that. But it's it's there's been
some seasons where he's played part of our games, so
that's it's. It's man, It's really interesting, it really is.
If you could, if you were trying to pick like
the player in baseball, that might have been like the
most polarizing. It might be bust in because there are
people that get super duper mad about injuries, Like there
(13:52):
are people that want to send Ronald A. Kuna to
Mars right now because he gets hurt every once in
a while. Like you know what I mean, it's.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Well, well, and if you think Acuna gets heard a lot,
I mean that's yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
So anyway, we'll come back to that we need to.
We'll get some more baseball stuff on the field, as
well as some at least one unfortunate injury update and
also another interesting injury update for a starting picture who
might have been this young last year. We'll get into
that more in a second after it. Word from our partners.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
AJM on my phone right now in Arena club and
I'm looking at the Emerald slab packs and I see
in the grail a Bobby wit Junior twenty twenty Bowman
Chrome Prospect Auto Gold Refractor card.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
Give me that, Give me your phone. I'm gonna I'm
gonna get you. You got to buy it to me.
I don't have it.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
You know you have to get a slab pack.
Speaker 1 (14:41):
No, I don't have that, And give me your slab pack.
That card's worth you.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
Buy you slab pack, Scott, so I can get the
Bobby Witt Junior Gold Refractor twenty twenty Bowman Chrome Auto
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Speaker 3 (14:51):
Awesome and it's worth a lot.
Speaker 4 (14:52):
It's worth a lot. He's a stud, he's not going down.
Get a grail. Get a grill. I want a grail, Scott,
give me the holy grail.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
You do it to do that?
Speaker 3 (15:00):
You must get yourself a slab pack in Arena Club
or if you want to get it for a friend,
you can do that too. And right now you can
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Speaker 1 (15:22):
All right, Scott, there was an unfortunate injury update. I
know our friends Steven and Sean covered a lot of
injury update ground on the most recent episode on this feed.
That was a not random, but like an assortment of
injury updates in one day. For bry Siker was like,
let's talk about all the injuries and here's four or
five updates since then. By the way, listen to that
show of course if you ast anything since then. The
(15:44):
Braves didn't formally announced, but Sni basically announced that Johanmanez
has been shut down from throwing. He was kind of
ramping up trying to get back discomfort in the surgically
prepared knee that he has surgery on back in November.
Not ideal, doesn't seem like we have any more than that,
or then they shut him down. We can go back
(16:07):
into some history with Jimenez, Like I think on the
show we probably said ten times like if he pitches
this year, this is when they were even supposed to
be good this year. If he pitches, it was kind
of a bonus, like the timeline for his recovery was
going to be like late in the season at the
absolute best. So it's not like it's a huge blow
for this year for obvious reasons. But he's a guy
(16:28):
who's signed for next year and honestly is on paper
like the incumbent closer for next year if he's back
and healthy, and of him if he can't get right now,
it's not idea. I'm not saying you poor dirt on
him or anything like that, but cautions the right is
the way to go here. But anytime you hear shut
down for surgical repaired knee, you don't like that. No,
you don't.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
And I think if the Braves were two games up,
maybe it would be handled a little differently. But they're dead,
so I'm in favor. I Ever since it's been talked
about that the Braves might rush some of these pitchers
back from injuries. I have been banging my head against
the desk because it just doesn't make much sense. I
(17:10):
get that you don't necessarily want a pitcher to go
like eighteen months without throwing competitive pitches, but why push Jimenez.
It was a far more serious knee injury than anyone
was expecting. And he's a big boy, you know, like
he's like six five, two hundred and fifty pounds, so
that's a lot of torque that he's putting on that knee.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
So sure, we.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
Would have loved to see Jimenez healthy and firing ninety
eight fastballs in September if he truly felt one hundred percent.
But at this point, give him another couple of months off,
let him rest, let him rehab, keep building up, strengthen
the knee, and then get him on a throwing program
in December and January and kind of see where you're at,
because Jimenez should be, assuming he's healthy, a really big
(17:52):
piece of this bullpen next year.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Yeah, and you know, not to relegate all of it,
but that was a big blow when he They were
not expecting him to be out for as long as
he was. When they want to go clean up the knee.
It was like, oh, this is bad. They got to
surgically repair this. And that was that was a surprise
injury update in November to say, oh, by the way,
he's out eight to twelve months. Was the timeline they
gave us. WHOA, that's the whole season maybe, and it
(18:15):
is the whole season, it seems.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Yeah, it was a huge loss. I mean again, not
that Joe Jimenez would have saved the entire season, but
it was and I think we maybe we even said
in during the spring, like we we should not be
overlooking the loss of Joe Jimenez because you know, it
was a while ago now, but he was legitimately as
good as any reliever in the game last season outside
(18:38):
of like the very elites. So not a small thing,
hopefully with I mean, shoot, he'll have almost eighteen months
to distance himself from that knee. Jimenez also had back
surgery a couple of years ago, so he's had some
legitimate procedures that were done. So you just help crush
your fingers, give him some more time off and let's uh,
you know, ideally he is an eighth or ninth getting
(19:00):
option for this team. Come twenty twenty six.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
He's a very big man. He's paid like a high
leverage reliever, and they need him to be good next year.
I mean that's he's not like high in the priority
list as far as the guys will talk about, but
he is important, like I would say, sneakily so so
uh not great, not great information there to get on. Ah,
what was it a Tuesday that we learned that information?
But we'll come back to that when we need to.
The other thing I sort of alluded to about the
(19:26):
injury update was about Chris Sale. He's actually gonna throw
live batting in practice on Thursday. According to Snit. There's
no like plan after that that's in place. But throing
live VP means you're ramping up like you're trying to pitch.
And you already just kind of stated your opinion on
all of these things. And we've also joked and not
(19:47):
so joked that Chris Sale is the kind of guy
where like they may not be able to keep him
off the mouth. Chris Sale is a maniac in the
best way, as we always say. They also, I did
say Snip would said he would at least probably have
for at least one rehab start before returning. I don't
(20:07):
want Chris Sale to pitch. You just said that. You
just said I think the same thing. You can correct
me if I'm wrong. I don't want Sale to pitch
this year. I also think that he might just pitch
because this is not I mean, look, and this is
a big picture topic too. The Braves have been bad
at telling their own players that they have to not
play or not do things, and I think Sale like
(20:28):
might be like the ultimate example of that, as a
guy who like might just go in and punch them
on if they tried to tell him you can't pitch.
I'm joking, but I'm not so. Yeah, cut some jerseys out.
It seems like he might be pitching, uh in September.
I don't like that, but uh, you know, what are
you gonna do? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (20:43):
I think what is today? August sixth I get it.
And it was just broken ribs. Now, if it was
an elbow, you know, Schmollenbach is twenty five years old
and has a broken bone in his elbow. That is
significantly different pitching please not pitching, right, Yeah, And they're
(21:03):
gonna shut him down as they should. And but with Sale,
I get it. He's a competitor. He wants to go
out there now, I don't. Let's say that Sale is
back in two weeks, three weeks pitching for the Braves.
I don't necessarily want him pitching until Game one sixty two.
If Sale wants to go out there and make three
or four starts just to get his arm and his
(21:24):
body going, as long as there's no warning signs like
a dip in velocity or something like that, I mean,
we're all gonna have to just hold our breath every
time Sale goes out there. But because it was a bone,
I can't imagine there's any risk of reaggravating a broken
rib unless he goes and dives for a baseball again.
So it's not ideal. I think in an ideal world, well,
(21:47):
in an ideal world, Sale would have never known for
that baseball to preserve a complete game shutout. But I
think as long as Sale doesn't have any warning signs
and the doctors are convinced he is one hundred percent
and there won't be any lasting effects. Sure, let's see
make a couple of starts if he wants to, and
then shut him down. Maybe by the third week in September.
And say hey, let's go get him in twenty twenty six.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up, because I should
have said it too. Like it not being an arm
an arm injury or even like a leg plant injury.
It's a very it's not gonna mess with him. You
with it. Obviously you can't pitch the broken rib, but
as long as he's healthy and healed up, there's no
reason that he can't go, So it doesn't make it
a little bit different. It's a great point. Please be
careful with him, I would say. And that goes for everybody.
(22:32):
I mean, we'll get into this in September, but even
guys who have who are healthy as they possibly could be,
I would be super careful with It's a totally like
they're gonna have I mean, honestly, they're gonna have to
have a matt Olsen conversation, Like should Matt Olsen play
every single game this season? I know he has the
consecutive game streak, but should he really play every game
(22:52):
this season? I would ask that question because and look,
he's not been hurt for years and years and years
back found Wood, But like it's hard when you played
every single game for years and years and years and
years and you're not hurt, But like, really, do I
want to see Meddilson play on Setember twenty seventh, I
kind of don't.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
To be honest, I think I don't disagree with you.
I think Matt would fight, like hell.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
I don't keep it. I get it because it's I
get it.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
I think Olson streak is getting up there in like
the top whatever in baseball history for consecutive games play.
That's not a small thing like.
Speaker 1 (23:25):
That, And I think I think he's gonna play. I mean, look,
the Braves, we've made fun of this, and even more
than that, the Braves don't tend to overrule their players,
probably to a fault. I mean Ronnie playing the not
long ago, Ronnie playing when you shouldn't have been playing.
Freddie used to play whenever when he shouldn't be playing.
Like there's there's document evidence of this for a long time.
(23:46):
I don't think they're gonna tell Matt he can't play.
I'm just saying, like that's an that's probably the most
prime example of a guy who's not even hurt. But
it's like, man, really, you're thirty games out, Like, do
we need to be doing this right now, so it's
it's also philosophical, like it's also sad thing with I mean,
every time we bring this up, I don't know about you,
we get fans they're like mad at us. They're not
(24:07):
like grinding through every game the same way, and it's
like we're not rooting for the team to lose in
the same way that some others are. Like there's that
nuance we bring up all the time now too often, maybe,
but like there are some fans that are just like, no,
treat it like every other game. We want the team
to win. Play as hard as you can't, and I
get it. I just think it's like maybe prudent to
not push as hard.
Speaker 2 (24:26):
I don't know, Yeah, just be careful and be smart
over these final two months. Spencer Strider who pitched on
Wednesday Night, Spencer is going to almost certainly get shut
down here at some point, probably in September. But no
need to push him coming off the elbow surgery. I mean,
we talked about Grant Holmes was probably to the end
(24:47):
of his road or nearing it anyway, and then he
gets hurt, which is really unfortunate. So I think we're
gonna see a lot of Joey Wentz, Hurston Waldrip Giddyer
for one, does Eric Fetti like those types are gonna
make a lot of starts to this team down the
stretch because there's just no need for Strider to go
balls to the wall any year where you're gonna be
(25:09):
twenty five games below five hundred.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
Yeah, pitching even more so, for sure. I use a
couple of disi player examples, like like Matt, but pitching
is even more so, like there's just there's mileage on
your arm that you would like to avoid it. Nothing
else and a lost season under key guys. So we'll
leave it there for now. We will get into some
actual on field stuff to end the podcast at a
second couple of losses and in fact they sweep at
home and not great fashion. We'll get into all that
(25:34):
and more scotch after a word from our partners Krats.
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Speaker 1 (26:35):
Go for it, Okay, Scott, Let's wrap this thing up
with a sweep loss at the hands of the Brewers.
The bridge did threaten Tonight within Michael Harris home run
in the ninth on Wednesday to get within one. They
end up losing five to four. Before we tip into
the actual games as predicted by us, I would say
(26:56):
on Sunday, there was nobody at the ballpark, nobody, nobody.
Speaker 2 (27:02):
It was a ghost town. I called it a morgue
on Twitter. I mean people were posting photos. I know
the Braves announced thirty some thousand people at the last
three games, but I mean it might have been like
fifteen thousand people.
Speaker 1 (27:15):
It was.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
It was a empty I have ever seen truest park, man,
it was. And it's sad, and I get it, like
I understand why, especially the way the Braves have restricted
reselling of season tickets, especially, which is a load of uh,
you know, crap. No one's gonna be there and no
one's gonna I mean.
Speaker 1 (27:35):
It's it's sad.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
I wish you watch the Braves right now. And then
the other night I flipped on the Phillies game and
Susans Bank Park is packed and going nuts because Kyleshwarber
home it again. And it's just like the envy right now,
and it's just it's really unfortunate that we're at this situation.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Yeah, and we did. We'd get get into it on Sunday,
won't really get all of it. But it was perfect
storm too, like obviously the lows of the low on
the field weather concerns playing an opponent that is really
good but not a name brand opponent. School started this
week like Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Like it was just all
(28:14):
the signs were there. We saw it coming, and I
know people were confused by this. The attendance number is
announced by any team. This is not just a braced thing.
This is any team. Is a tickets sold slash distributed number.
It is not a people in the building number. Keep
that in mind, so when they say thirty thousand, they're
not lying. That's the number of tickets day've distributed, sees,
(28:37):
ticket holders, all that stuff. But there were not that
many people in the building I can I can guarantee
you that right now for multiple sources. I wasn't there,
but between pictures and people that I know were there,
media folks, other fans, it was. It was not thirty
thousand people. I could probish you that. So it's just
one little thing. It doesn't matter that much. But two
we poked fun at it. But the notion that some
(28:58):
were throwing out there, the deadline that the Braves wanted
to maintain some sort of respectability and get the building
filled by not trading guys like the cleat, that was
never realistic, Like they're gonna draw bet like even this
weekend they're playing the Marlins who are the Marlins? They
will draw better this weekend. It's a weekend people people
like to Uh. I've been at the Battery for plenty
(29:20):
of plenty of bad teams. Like on a weekend, the
Battery will still be popping. That's just it's a it's
a cool thing to do. It's outside. There will have
no trouble drawing on Friday and Saturday and Sunday. They
just won't. I guess anybody now, I won't be packed
in the way. We will be agguest the Dodgers if
they were good, but they will draw fine. It's the
weekday games. We're on a Tuesday night. It's not a
small thing to have to go to the ballpark from
(29:41):
any around Atlanta on a weeknight. And if you don't
want to really go yangling right, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
I've seen people, you know, we were talking about it
and people have said, hey, I am trying to give
my tickets away and nobody wants to go. And someone
even said I was offering tickets and a parking pass
and I could not find someone to.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
Go on Monday night. I'll do that if it's offer.
If I wants to offer me that, I'll go. Most
nights fun.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
There you go. Yeah, And I love baseball like you know,
any level. I'm not a local, but I get it.
Man Like people are frustrated. It's school airfair. If you
want to pay it. If you want to pay for
Scott's airfair.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
He'll come. He'll come to a game.
Speaker 2 (30:20):
If you If anybody has that that private jet, send
it on out. We'll give you a nice little shout
out on the show.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
And we might have. We might have. Honestly, there would
not be surprised if we had a fan that has
like a Wheels OFE connection or something like that. So
somebody that listens to the show that's like a rich
person that's like, hey, Scott, want to go on my plane. Anyway,
That's not where I wanted to start necessarily, but it's
just like it was. It was a looming specter and
they got swept. I mean, we'll talk about it for
a second. I know Steven and Sean talked about the
(30:47):
first game of a sweep on Monday, but Tuesday's loss
was like a pretty twenty twenty five Braves loss. It
was by five runs on a game where they had
plenty of chances. They left. We're team on base like.
It was just like a throw It was like throwback
to like May, when we still had hope and they
would have these nights where they just couldn't get anything
(31:07):
going in big spots. It was like somebody.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
Someone had a note, and I don't have it exactly
in front of me, but I believe with the bases loaded,
the Braves struck out three times in full counts on
pitches that would have been ball four. Tell me that
is not the most twenty twenty four twenty twenty five
Atlanta Brave stat imaginable.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
It was.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
I did not catch a lot of it, Thankfully. I
had planed with my wife much much more fun than
watching that game because I was just scrolling through the
game day box score and it was like, oh my god,
Oh they left.
Speaker 1 (31:41):
The bases loaded.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
Oh they left the bases loaded again. Oh they committed
an air. It was just, I mean, it's it's mind
numbing just how bad this team is sometimes.
Speaker 1 (31:51):
Yeah, the aforementioned Joey Wentz had his worst start as
a Brave. He still wasn't even that badd a couple
of bad moments in that start he did. Actually, I'm
gonna spin this positively for joy Wentz. He has pitched
five times for the Braves. Twenty three and a third
innings is era is like three point one fifth of
like two point five. Like he's actually been good. I
(32:13):
don't know if that's real. He wasn't pretty good on Tuesday,
but he's a small bright spot in the wilderness. I
guess yeah. And to your point earlier, he's gonna pitch it.
I mean, guys that will not be shut down. If
he is able to pitch, he will keep pitching all
the way for sure. And I agree.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
I don't think Wentz is necessarily like a long term fixture,
but if he pitches well for the next two months,
he's gonna make like a million dollars next season. He's
probably worth keeping around and at least, you know, tendering
him maybe a two way contract or I think Wentz
still has minor league options, so you can do a
split deal, whatever it is. I think Wentz has shown
(32:51):
at least enough through five starts that you can keep
him around, and maybe the Braves have figured something out
with Rick Kranitz and the pitching staff. I've tried to
maybe reinvent him a little bit, because clearly what Wentz
was doing before this was just not working out.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
Yeah, maybe, as we've discussed, maybe he's like your eighth
starter next and you do need eight starters, you need
nine ten starters. So I'm no one's saying he's gonna
be one of your best five coming into the season
next year. But if you have guys that are in
your eight, nine ten spots that can actually pitch respectable
major beginnings, that is actually very helpful. So hopefully something
like that a small bright spot. There're thing that happened
(33:29):
that was kind of making the rounds was the jerks
and profar hilariously bad defensive play from Tuesday. I know
you weren't dialed in watching. Did you see the play?
Have you seen the replay of this play?
Speaker 2 (33:40):
I did see it. I know that I understand why
there's so much It was really bad.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
It was bad, man, I mean it was.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
We've seen that play before where a ball is hit
right at an outfielder and they kind of like freeze
and he should have gone backwards at it. It was
like a comical looking play and Profar has been really
bad defensively. But yeah, I mean that is a legitimate
concern for a player who came into the year with questions.
Speaker 1 (34:07):
About his defense. Yeah, I mean it's one player. I
don't really care about one play. It was bad, it
was amusingly bad. But the bigger thing is, and this
is of course an off season topic, but he is
a bad defender. And we kind of we kind of
knew that when we talked about it this this winter
when they signed. It was like, hey, he could probably
play left but it's not like he's a good defender,
(34:28):
and he's not. It's funny because he used to be
a shortstop. Like I'm old enough to remember when he
was a prospect, he was a shortstop and I can't
imagine him playing shortstop. Can you imagine that? I mean, yeah,
I'm sure you've seen this too. At the height of one,
Ozzie was like struggling the absolute most this year. People
were asking asking its pro park up by second base.
It's like, guys, he can't play left field. No, we
(34:48):
can't with he can with second base. He's the age
and he's not. Actually, I'll ask you this. There is
this comparison being made by many people in the last
two days to Horace Hilaire do all. Distinction between Solaire's
defense was I think worse. It looked worse, but people,
(35:08):
I mean some of the advanced numbers are actually similarly
bad for Profar. I don't think for me, we're not
a spot where it's like last winter we were saying
collectively as a body on the show, he Solai cannot
play left field ever again, like no, get him out
of here. Are you fund that we have a Profar
or are we like going in next year like this,
(35:30):
because look, it's the it's the curve regrading on. But
if he's a DH, he's not very good as a DH.
Like you kind of have to mash if if you're
playing DH, if you're playing left field, it's like all right,
whatever hit recently.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
Yeah, you know Profar has a one to fifteen w
RC plus since coming off the suspension, which is good.
Like that's kind of what we expected from him before
we knew he was juicing. I think when when they
signed him this offseason, we're like, you know what last
year career year. I didn't know about the pds, but
like a one fifteen, one to twenty w RC plus
(36:05):
for a position that has been a catastrophic black hole
for years or the braves, that's that seemed reasonable and
you would take it. That's a good hitting left fielder.
It's not gonna get you to the Hall of Fame.
But I think Profar is really one of like three
players that I am super locked into Profar, Michael Harris,
ozsi Alby's these final two months, how do they perform?
(36:27):
How much confidence do they instill? Because I think Profar
is gonna hit enough. But that defense, I don't think
it's Jorge Solaier bad, but it's I mean every it's
not like so Lair where every night it was like,
oh dear God, what an adventure. But it's been bad.
I mean in a month plus, it's I can count
(36:47):
a couple of times on my hand, just off the
top of my head where Profar made a bad play
in left field and ended up giving up a hit
that probably should have been caught.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
Yeah, it's strongly negative out there so far. Maybe he
can improve. He didn't you know, he wasn't played for
I mean, it's his own fault, but he wasn't playing
for a while. Maybe there's some rust if you want
to be kind to him. I know Bracefas don't want
to kind of him, which understand he cost them a
lot so, uh, your point, this is the right one.
We were never some people were. We were never saying
he was definitely going to be what he was last year.
(37:18):
We weren't forecasting regression from that number. And that's kind
of where he is the plate. But if he's an
even if he is a one fifteen WRC plus guy
in left field, if his defense is this bad, you're
not loving it. Like he's not unplayable, but that's not
that's not exciting. If he's a strongly negative defender and
(37:39):
a pretty good hitter, that's not a good that's not
a great player. Like it's better than Verdugo, it's better
than a white spin, but like it's not what you
were hoping for. So hopefully he gets hopefully could just
be okay. Like that's the thing with profar defensively, is
like get him to be below average compared to catastrophic.
That's the gap you're looking for.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
And generally left field is not a defensive position that's
going to absolutely kill you. It can still hurt you, but.
Speaker 1 (38:07):
It's not like stop. Yeah. On Tuesday, I had someone
very angrily arguing with me telling me that they thought
Ozuna was good. Azuna would be better in left field
than Profar, and they were serious, and I was like,
Ozuna can't even run like respectfully, stop, I understand the
point you're trying to make people trying to be hyperbolic
(38:28):
about the defense. It is bad with Profar, it has
been bad. Hopefully it improves. But anyway, that was a
other than Yeah, honestly, that was probably the most memorable
thing that happened on Tuesday was the Profar defensive misque.
It made the rounds tonight's game closer five to four loss.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (38:48):
The first thing, briefly we'll talk about, did you see
the lineup revamp? Like Snith decided to just put the
names in a hat and just kind of jiggle them,
and that the lineup it was. I don't really care
honestly about the linup contruction right now. Season's over, but
I do care about one thing, and that's that Ballwin
(39:08):
didn't play today. I don't like that he did pinch it.
He was actually he made the last out of the game,
but I don't. I don't like ball when not play.
I get that it's an eight game week, so maybe
that's part of this, but weird, just weird all the
way around. Everything was weird.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
Yeah, weird lineup. I kind of laughed when I saw.
I'm like, whatever, who cares.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
Like it doesn't it doesn't matter. It was just one
of those things like you see the lineup card come out,
we're all we all we're all conditioned to do this,
that we're dialed in. When the laud comes out, we
all kind of look at it and it's like if
it's similar, it's kind of a shrug. But just to
say it. A lot of people that may maybe didn't
see the game, it was Elio White leading off, Ozzie
hitting second, and then it was I mean, not just
gonna play. So the rest of it was pretty conventional.
(39:47):
But Profar got moved down as soon it was back
in the lineup tonight. The biggest thing was again Eli
White nausey always one to two. I mean, I understand
you don't really care anymore, but like, what are we doing?
Don't do that?
Speaker 2 (40:01):
Forty nine games of Brian Snitker left Brad forty nine games.
Speaker 1 (40:04):
Oh, that actually reminds me. We've been saying exactly that
about snit Somebody actually like very genuinely asked us, like, hey,
have they announced it? No, Like a lot of us
are assuming Snit is not going to be back. No
one has said anything or even reported it definitively. Now,
the Beat guys have all kind of talked about it
(40:25):
pretty openly, like they're kind of assuming that's going to
be gone. We are assuming that to retirement, to maybe
a consulting role or whatever. But no one has said that.
No one has announced that. That is a key distinction.
I like to be precise. We're not breaking any news.
We are assuming that's not going to be there anymore.
(40:46):
But no one said that. In fact, someone was breaking
someone's like, uh, I think it was our friend at
Capitol Avenue on Twitter was like just wait for the
moment when they announced that's gonna be back next year
and the Twitter reaction to that, that'll go over well.
Speaker 2 (40:57):
Uh, the Internet would actually explode. But you know, Snit
his contract is up at the end of the season.
What do they say about college coaches without a contract?
You know, it's it's it's not apples to apples. But
there's a reason, man, Like, if Snit was coming back,
why would you not already extend him? The season has
(41:17):
been bad? Like if let me say this, Brad, if
the Braves before this year did not renew Snit's contract,
but they won one hundred and three games and went
to the World Series. Okay, you can obviously write up
a new extension, even if it's unconventional for managers to
manage without a contract beyond the current year. But I mean,
there's nothing this season that would lead me to believe
(41:40):
that Snit will be back. Maybe he's in a front
office role. Hell of a career, almost fifty years with
the Braves, it's just remarkable.
Speaker 1 (41:48):
But I mean he's going to be seventy in October
as well. Like, yeah, I we can say this for later,
but I think that it does if you we're not
we've ever been the biggest advocates, nor have we ever
been the biggest set detractors. Is that fair? I think
it is Scott Were. I respect Brian Snicker. I think
he's done a good job and a lot of things
(42:09):
for a long time. I think he has some weaknesses.
He always has, so I've never been like the zelots
that some are. Some people are like, you cannot creditie Brian, Well,
yes I can, and I will, But others are like
he's a buffoon, get him out, And I don't feel
the same way. I don't feel I don't feel that
way either. But when you're expiring contractually, when you'll be seventy,
(42:31):
and when your team does this for this season, it
gives everybody cover across the I mean, if if you
want to be cynical about it all, it gives Alice cover,
It gives ownership cover, It gives Snick cover to say, hey,
it's been a great well. Tip the cap I will.
You know, everyone should be like extremely positive for the
moment Snit retires. Everyone should give Snitt his flowers hopefully.
(42:52):
I know the Braves will. But I'm even fans that
don't like love him as a manager. The guy's been
an organizational lifer. Like it's a pretty easy lay up,
no issues off the field, like any of this stuff.
Like he's it's he's an absolute layup of a guy
to praise when he goes out.
Speaker 2 (43:06):
He won a World Series, dude, Like if you if
fans who who overlook the world, I get to stop
because I'm gonna go on a crazy tangent. Fans who
act like twenty twenty one wasn't all that great, Oh
they just got hot, they weren't that good? Shut up? Like, actually,
shut up, that's the ridiculous thing I've ever heard.
Speaker 1 (43:24):
Agreed, and also yes it was. The playoffs are random,
they are, but okay, they also could have won the
World Series and other seasons when they were actually quote
unquote that good of a team and they didn't, So like,
who cares? It balances out they won the World Series? Okay,
Flash Flight Forever, uh the old Actually, uh my, I
guess he's my friend. I mean we've we've hung out some.
(43:45):
Brian went horse to ESPN co covers the NBA. He
what he says is winning means you never have to
say you're sorry. It's like, hey, that's that's that's that's right. Basically,
that's that's like his version of flash fla Forever. Basically,
if you want to if you won the World Series,
who you won? Yep? Oh one more thing on the
game tonight and we'll get out of here. You mentioned
(44:06):
Strutter before Strutter we think probably won't pitch all the
way to the end. He had his worst start of
the season tonight, by the numbers, four and two thirds,
eleven hits. He got hit really hard tonight, five or
runs like it wasn't like a total catastrophe, but like
he was not good, Like he did not look great today.
He got hit hard. Anything you want to flag about
that or just wanted to say it out loud, like
(44:27):
it didn't look great. He's again he's the only guy
in the rotition that everybody likes right now. But he
wasn't very good today.
Speaker 2 (44:33):
Now, in the last couple of starts for Spencer have
not been very good, I'm wondering if he's starting to
hit a little bit of a wall physically. He of
course barely pitched last year, and then coming all the
way back from the surgery, he's not kidding as much
a swing and miss as he was earlier in the
season either when he was really rolling. So you know,
it's the first week, almost second week of August. I
(44:55):
would pitch Spencer up until Labor Day and then probably
call it quits for the season. He just I don't
need to send him out there, and hopefully he can
be better than this moving forward. But it was really,
I mean he was he was getting hit hard really
from the first inning on.
Speaker 1 (45:08):
Yeah, it was not one of those games where you
give a bunch of soft stuff you get unlucky. Like
we'll point that out when it happens, it was not
that today he got hit hard. All right, well, Scott,
we can get out of here. We alluded to it earlier.
The Race have a five game series against the Marlins
because on Thursday, yes, five games, they're playing a doubleheader
(45:29):
on Saturday. Boy, that'll be a long day at the office.
They did announce probables for a few games today. It's
Carrasco on Oh sorry, sorry, Carlos, I can't help it laugh,
Carlos Grasco on Thursday, Bryce Older on Friday, and Saturday
is still a TVD. It seems like they're gonna be
it's probably gonna be Waldrope we think in one of
(45:52):
those games, but they haven't said that yet, So just
strap in. We'll have at least one more show between
now and announced. That's the plan anyway between now on
the weekend. So what update on who's going to pitch
for the weekend. But the Marlins being like, what nine
to ten games ahead of the Braves is just like unthinkable,
But that's where we are.
Speaker 2 (46:09):
So yeah, and you know what, the Marlins are a
great story out of nowhere. These guys have been one
of the better teams I think only the Brewers actually
have a better record than the Miami Marlins over almost
seven or eight weeks at this point, which is nuts
good on the Marlins, a team that was left for dead,
a team that has like no payroll, and they're winning games.
Speaker 1 (46:29):
And actually, I just love this. The Marlins have a
worse run differential than the Braves do. Of course, of
course that's.
Speaker 2 (46:36):
What happens when you go, oh in ninety six and
one run games like the Bras this year.
Speaker 1 (46:41):
So I didn't mean I was just looking at that,
like I wanted to go see what the Marlins record was,
and then I just thought, oh, they're minus forty eight
the Braves or minus thirty.
Speaker 2 (46:48):
You know, a crazy thing. If the Braves lay down
this weekend. You know, the Marlins are only five games
back of the Mets in the lost column in the
East right now.
Speaker 1 (46:59):
I mean, yeah, six games, five games a lot. Yeah,
because the Mets are two and I think they went
like two to eight in the last ten, like they're
kind of.
Speaker 2 (47:05):
The Mets are bad, like legitimately bad for two months now.
Speaker 1 (47:09):
I can't I can't wait in late September and October
when we're not talking about the Braves, we'll be talking
about we'll be rooting against the Mets in the Phillies
because that's what Braves fans should do. And yeah, I
saw your exchange with I think it was James Shadow
of Mets up our colleague on the network, basically like
(47:29):
offering to trade them records because they were and the
Mets fans are meltdown and I get why they're playing
like crap, and they had been for a while. But
it's like, hey, how about how about the perspectives. The
Braves are currently fifteen games behind the Mets.
Speaker 2 (47:41):
It's funny. It's almost like the two organizations have flipped,
isn't it.
Speaker 1 (47:45):
Like Like I.
Speaker 2 (47:46):
Think when James was on our show in the spring,
he was like, yeah, I would love for the Braves
problems to be the Mets problems. Now, little did we
know the season ahead was around on the corner.
Speaker 1 (47:57):
But we'll switch.
Speaker 2 (47:58):
Yeah, just uh, bad year, but hey maybe as long
as we'll be rooting hard for whoever the Mets, if
the Mets make the playoffs, whoever the Mets draw, whoever
the Phillies draw. Phillies are a good team. I almost
might pick the Phillies to win the World Series or
at least get there from the National League because they
are they're playing pretty well, and they they are built
for October. And this also just feels like and then
(48:18):
we'll move on. But it just feels like the Phillies
are like kind of near the end of their reign
with the ages of some of those players. So we'll see,
he'll be It feels like the playoffs are about is
wide open this year as they have been in a
long time. I wish them, not them with the worst,
to be honest, but I understand.
Speaker 1 (48:35):
What you said there. You're right, You're right, They're they're good.
It's a good team. Okay, Scott, let's get out of
here on this Wednesday evening again. We'll have another show
between now and Sunday, probably with our colleagues Shawn Stephen
on that pod, but please stay to Please subscribe to
Hammer Territory anywhere you find your podcasts. Follows Scott if
you want to on x slash Twitter at Scott Coleman.
(48:57):
Fifty five. Lots of Colts takes these days. We're getting
close on the Indianapolis Colts quarterback battles in full swing
training camp stuff. Scott, fans and football.
Speaker 2 (49:07):
What else do Let's do twenty five minutes on Brad's
Takes on the Atlanta Falcons for twenty to twenty.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
You don't want that, maybe I can talk to my guy,
Aaron Freeman from Locked on Falcons talk to have me
on the podcast. I have lots of Falcons takes. I
just don't want to offer them here. I'm pessimistic as
I always am about the Falcons, but I do love them.
That's my cleanest fan experience. I've never covered them full time.
I'm just a maniac like everybody else with them. It's
(49:37):
just I hate them, but I love them, and it
is what it is, sports and a nutshell. Scott, thanks
for being here. I appreciate it, as always your flexibility
in my recording times. As for Mela, one more time,
please subscribe to Hammer Territory. I know it's not fun
right now to follow the braves, to watch the braves,
to consume the braves, but we're gonna be here the
(49:58):
entire time, no days off, we' off. We'll be covering them.
So subscribe, tell your friends, and we'll see you all
next time.
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