S1 – 11: America's Most Haunted House

Haunted as much by legends as it is by ghosts, it's hard to separate fact from fiction at the Myrtles Plantation in St Francisville, Louisiana. Regardless, it lives up to its reputation as one of America's most haunted houses.

Special Guest: Hester Eby  

---

Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Haunted Road, a production of I Heart Radio
and Grimm and Mild from Aaron Minky Listener, Discretion is advised.
In nineteen seventy two, an often cited parapsychology experiment took place.
The experiment, conducted by Toronto parapsychologist Dr A. R. George

(00:24):
Owen and psychologist Dr Joel Whitten, was called the Philip Experiment,
and it sought to create a fictional character, a ghost,
through a deliberate methodology, and in turn communicate with this
ghost through a series of seances. The research team consisted
of Dr Owen's wife, Iris, an industrial designer and his wife,

(00:44):
a heating engineer, an accountant, a bookkeeper, and a sociology student.
The research collective settled on a character named Philip Aylesford,
referred to as Philip throughout the bulk of the experiment.
His fictional history was a smorgeseport of real history and
complete applications per the experiment. Philip was born in England
in sixteen twenty four, served in the military throughout young adulthood,

(01:07):
and was subsequently knighted at sixteen. Philip was serving in
the English Civil War, where the parliamentarians and Royalists went
to war over issues of England's governance and record on
religious freedom. When he met and later became a close
ally for Charles, the second King of Scotland, England and
Ireland until his deposition in sixteen fifty one, and later

(01:28):
king from the sixteen sixty Restoration until his death in
sixteen eighty five. Philip, though never had a chance to
see much of Charles's rule, Having fallen in love with
the romane E girl, she was accused of witchcraft and
burned at the stake. Despondent, Philip died by suicide in
sixteen fifty four. He would have been thirty years old.

(01:49):
The group worked tirelessly to contact their invention, their fictional Philip,
hoping that by sheer belief in him, they could in
effect will the spirit of Philip to exist. These attempts,
at first proved unsuccessful. Dr Owen then changed the experiment conditions,
altering several key environmental variables, dimming the lights, for instance,

(02:11):
to more closely resemble a conventional seance. After dr Owen
made these changes, participants reported phantom breezes, vibrations, vocal echoes,
and a rapping sound whenever questions were posed to Philip.
The table was said to tilt and move about the
room without human contact. Audio, visual and firsthand accounts documented

(02:33):
this phenomena. I've had luck with conducting experiments very close
to this one. If any of you have ever watched
my show Kindred Spirits, you may remember an episode called
Zombie Boy in season five where Adam Burry and I
very much create a spirit, give it a backstory, and
proceed to interact with it. What does any of that
have to do with the historic haunt we're about to discuss,

(02:55):
you ask, Well, we'll get into that at the end
of this podcast, but keep it in the back of
your mind until then. Let's take a little trip to
one of the most haunted states I know, Louisiana, and
explore one of the most haunted locations I know, the
Myrtles Plantation. I'm Amy Brunei, and this is haunted Road

(03:24):
built in the Myrtles Plantation in St. Francisville, is an
outstanding example of a raised cottage plantation house. Particularly noteworthy
is its size. Its front porch extends on seven ft,
it's handsome cast iron vine and great patterned galleries, and
its interior plaster work. St. Francisville, where the plantation is located,

(03:47):
is a charming, pocket book sized town with lavishly restored
Creole style cottages and is situated on the Mississippi River.
Myrtles Plantation hovers just beyond St. Francisville's Historic district up
a long and meandering road. The plantation has manicured grounds
of moss draped oaks and crape myrtles. As for the

(04:07):
main home itself, it's an aged two story cottage just
around a bend in the road beyond the plantation entree gates.
The structure appears delicate, even dainty, with outstretched porches below
and galleries above, all be decked by ocean green shutters
and decorative iron railings. The original home, called Laurel Grove,

(04:29):
seemed destined to be a home of note, as it
was built by Whiskey Rebellion conspirator David Bradford in the
late seventeen nineties. Bradford was born in Cecil, Maryland, in
seventeen sixty two. He was one of five children born
to Irish immigrant parents. He first made a name for
himself in Washington County, Pennsylvania as a successful attorney businessman

(04:51):
and deputy Attorney General for the county. His first attempt
to marry ended only days before his wedding. Nothing is
known about this, but he later met and married Elizabeth
Porter in seventeen eighty five and started a family. The
family had a beautiful home built in Pennsylvania, but had
little time to enjoy it. David was forced to flee

(05:13):
the house in October seventeen ninety four after he became
involved in the infamous Whiskey Rebellion, and legend has it
that President George Washington placed a price on the man's
head for his role in the affair. The Whiskey Rebellion
began in seventeen ninety one in the wake of a
new federal tax on all distilled spirits, including whiskey. The

(05:34):
tax law was intended to cover debt from the Revolutionary War,
but because of the popularity of whiskey, it was easier
to preserve for longer than rummer beer. It was opposed
by many in places like the Western Frontier, where farmers
relied on whiskey as a means of using up surplus
materials as well as a form of currency. The whiskey

(05:55):
tax was hotly resisted. In the summer of seven, a
mob of five hundred men attacked the home of a
tax inspector in Pennsylvania. President Washington rode at the head
of an army to suppress the insurgency with thirteen thousand
militiamen provided by the governors of Virginia, Maryland, New Jersey,

(06:16):
and Pennsylvania. The rebels all went home before the arrival
of the army, and there was no confrontation. Of the
twenty or so arrested, all were acquitted, but it scared
those involved and scattered some of them to the win,
one of whom was our whiskey Dave Bradford. Leaving his
family behind, Bradford fled Pennsylvania. He first spent time in

(06:38):
Pittsburgh before settling near what is now Sat. Francis Phille, Louisiana.
Bradford was no stranger to the area. He had originally
traveled here in seventeen ninety two to try and obtain
a land grant from Spain. When he returned in seventeen
ninety six, he purchased six hundred acres of land and
a year later built a modest, eight room home that

(06:58):
he called Laurel Grove. He lived there alone until seventeen
ninety nine, when he received a pardon for his role
in the Whiskey Rebellion from newly elected President John Adams.
He retrieved his family in Pennsylvania and they settled into
Laurel Grove. When David Bradford died in eighteen o eight,
Elizabeth or Eliza inherited the property. In eighteen seventeen, their daughter,

(07:23):
Sarah Matilda Bradford, married Clark Woodruff, a lawyer who would
become a judge. Woodruff would also eventually take over ownership
of the property from Eliza, but in the meantime managed
the property for the family. Both Woodruff and Bradford enslaved people.
In eighteen twenty, Eliza had twenty four persons in bondage,

(07:43):
Woodruff had five. By eighteen thirty, Woodruff had thirty three
enslaved persons associated with him, while Eliza had ten. According
to author Troy Taylor, Woodruff expanded the holdings of the
plantation and planted about six hundred fifty acres of indigo
and cotton. Together, he and Sarah Matilda had three children, Cornelia,

(08:04):
Gayal James, and Mary Octavia. However, tragedy was on the horizon.
Yellow fever was a threat in New Orleans and South
Louisiana virtually every year during the warmest months. Between eighteen
twenty three and eighteen twenty four, Sarah Bradford Woodruff died
along with two of her children. Yellow fever may have

(08:26):
been the cause. The legend handed down says otherwise, Historians
insist that Sarah Woodruffe and her daughters died in a
yellow fever epidemic. This is hotly contested, and we'll get
more into that shortly. Sarah went first on July twenty three.
Their son James passed almost a year later on July fifteen.

(08:48):
In September eighteen twenty four, daughter Cornelia Gale was the
third Woodroof to die from yellow fever. But they were
not alone, as the epidemic raged through the Louisiana region. Clearly,
the eighteen twenties were probably emotionally challenging for Woodruff, but
not financially. The eighteen thirty census listed property ownership at

(09:09):
four thousand acres and four hundred eighty enslaved people. Woodruff
eventually bought the property from his mother in law, Eliza Bradford.
At this point, Eliza had outlived her husband, her daughter,
and at least two grandchildren. She lived with Woodruff in
the estate until her own death in eighteen thirty In
eighteen thirty four, Woodruff sold Laurel Grove to married couple

(09:32):
Rough and Gray Sterling and marry Catherine Cobb. The Sterlings
were a very wealthy family who owned several plantations on
both sides of the Mississippi River. On January first, Ruff
and Gray Sterling and his wife, Mary Catherine Cobb took
over the house, land and buildings. They enslaved one hundred
seventy three black men, women, and children, ranging an age

(09:55):
from infancy to seventy years old. As prominent members of
the community, they remodeled Laurel Grove to reflect their status.
They enlarged and embellished the house, orchestrated the planting of
a myriad of crape myrtle trees and renamed the plantation
the Myrtles. They added the ornate European chandeliers and elaborate

(10:15):
floral moldings formed of moss and clay plaster. The completed
project nearly doubled the size of David Bradford's original house.
Ruff and Sterling died from tuberculosis in eighteen fifty four,
so Mary assumed the responsibility for the property. Ruff And
Sterling and his wife had nine children. The most notable
daughter for our purposes was Sarah. Their oldest son died

(10:38):
in eighteen fifty four, the year his father passed away.
Her daughter, Sarah Mulford Sterling, had married attorney William Winter
in eighteen fifty two, and Mary Cobb requested Winter's help
in managing the properties. Then came the Civil War. The
Civil War certainly affected the family and the people they enslaved.

(10:58):
Many of the families personal belongings were looted and destroyed
by Federal soldiers, and the wealth that they had accumulated
was ultimately in worthless Confederate currency. To make matters worse
for them, Mary Cobb had been invested heavily in sugar
plantations that had been ravaged by the war. She eventually
lost all of her property. Through her financial challenges, Mary

(11:20):
decided to grant Sarah and William Winter the myrtles for
their personal use. Additionally, William was engaged as the family
agent and attorney. In eighteen sixty seven, the Sterling Winter
family lost the home due to debt after the Civil War,
but Sarah Winter later regained her father's property. It isn't
clear just what happened to put them in the financial

(11:41):
position to retake the home, but it seemed as though
things were improving for the family until in eighteen seventy one,
William Winter was shot and, according to legend, staggered upstairs,
reaching the seventeenth step before expiring. A newspaper accounts hells
Us slightly different story. William was called to his front

(12:03):
door by some person unknown on the night of the
six at about seven and a half o'clock, and as
he appeared at the door of his sitting room, there
being no one in sight, he requested to know who
wished to see him, and at that instant a double
barrel gun was discharged at him, loaded with seven large buckshot,
six of which took effect upon his person, five in

(12:25):
his breast and one through his neck, killing him instantly.
Upon his stand, he fell and expired instantly without uttering
a word. There are a number of theories and rumors
about his death, especially regarding political or economic motivations about
the plantation itself. According to a contemporary newspaper account, Mr

(12:47):
Winter was not known by his most intimate friends, to
have any enemies, or to be involved in any controversies
calculated to create bitter and homicidal passions against him. He
was a gentleman of mild and dignified deportment, calm, prudent,
and temperate in all things, who, whilst not engaged in
professional pursuits, passed his time in the bosom of a

(13:09):
happy family, dispensing a liberal hospitality, and living the life
of a Christian gentleman. The death on the seventeenth step
detail seems to have been a later addition to this legend. Together,
the two widows, mother Mary Cobb Sterling and daughter Sarah
Sterling Winter, lived at the Myrtles until their respective deaths.

(13:30):
Mary died in eighteen eighty and Sarah died in April
of eighteen seventy eight. A Sterling son named Stephen owned
the property until March of eighteen eighty six, when he
either lost it due to gambling or could no longer
manage the debt associated with the property. After this time period,
details of the property became more scarce until the middle

(13:50):
of the twentieth century. By the nineteen fifties, the property
surrounding the house had been divided among the Williams's hairs,
and the house itself was sold to Marjorie Months and
an Oklahoma widow who had been made wealthy by chicken farms.
It was at this point that the ghost stories of
the house began. They started innocently enough, but soon what

(14:10):
may have been real life ghostly occurrences took on a
life of their own. Many of the stories, especially the
details that culminated in the story of a ghost named Chloe,
traced to Marjorie Munson. According to oral tradition, Munson experienced
odd things in the house. Wondering if perhaps the old
mansion might be haunted, She asked around, and that's when

(14:31):
the legend of Chloe got its start. Locals and members
of the Williams family, who owned the house after nine
swap stories about a woman in a green bonnet who
haunted the halls of the Myrtles. The woman in those
accounts was older than Chloe and specifically not characterized as enslaved,
and rumors of an affair didn't exist yet when Munson

(14:53):
heard this account, she soon penned a song about the
ghost of the Myrtles, a woman in a green beret
over the ars have we seen in many reported hauntings.
The story grew and changed. The Myrtles changed hands several
more times, and in the nineteen seventies it was restored
again under the ownership of Arlands and Mr. And Mrs

(15:13):
Robert f. Ward. During this period, the story grew even
larger and evolved to include poison murders and a severed ear.
Up until this point, though, it was largely just a
story that was passed on by word of mouth, and
it received little attention outside of the area. James and
Francis Kiramin bought the Myrtles seemingly on a whim after

(15:35):
passing through the area on a riverboat. That happenstance changed
the course of the Myrtles Haunted history in general, and
specifically impacted the legend of Chloe. Francis Kiramine and her
husband Jim were the first Myrtles owners to turn the
plantation into a business, a bed and breakfast that hosted
a mystery dinner, theater, and offered tours. The Kiramans published

(15:57):
stories of the hauntings well beyond the scope the local community,
and paranormal experts and enthusiasts from all over the country.
Were enthralled. Apparently, the earliest accounts of Chloe to appear
in print appeared in a November nineteen eighty issue of
Life magazine and in Richard Weiner's book Houses of Horror.
Both of them mentioned the poisoned deaths of Sarah, Matilda

(16:19):
and her daughters. Remember those names from the earlier yellow
fever epidemic In the nineteen eighties, National Enquirer dubbed the
site America's most haunted house, and the Appellachian stuck from
the eighties and beyond, the hauntings associated with the property
have snowballed. Additional deaths. Up to six more murders were
added to the list. One of them Louis Sterling, the

(16:42):
oldest son of Ruff and Gray. Sterling, was claimed to
have been stabbed to death in the house over a
gambling debt. However, burial records in St. Francisville state that
he died at the age of twenty three in October
eighteen fifty four from yellow fever. Now, what about the
legend of Chloe. The story says, shortly after Clark Woodruff

(17:03):
married Sarah Bradford in eighteen seventeen, he noticed a teenaged
enslaved girl named Chloe as she went about the property.
Woodruff brought Chloe into the main house to be his concubine,
but Chloe had a bad habit of eavesdropping on the judge.
He caught her with her ear pressed to the door
of the gentleman's parlor while he was engaged in business
one day. As punishment, he had Chloe's left ear cut

(17:26):
off and banished her to the plantation kitchen behind the
big house. After the mutilation, Chloe wore a head wrap
to disguise the wound and a single earring in her
other ear. Banishment didn't please her at all, so the
legend goes, a plan was devised Chloe would bake a
birthday cake for the judge's twin daughters and spike it

(17:47):
with the poisonous leaves of the oleander plant. The cake
would sicken the girls, but Chloe would nurse them back
to health and all would be forgiven. Except again, according
to legend, that didn't happen. The two girls and their
mother ate enough to die from the oleander poison, and
Chloe fled to the quarters for the enslaved, but she

(18:07):
was found out and a local judge ordered her hanged.
After her death, her remains were dumped into the near
by Mississippi River. Due to her violent death and improper burial,
Chloe haunts the Big House and the grounds of the
Myrtles to day. So the story goes. As for the
specter of a woman in a green turban, that very

(18:28):
well may be true, but there's no evidence that she's Chloe.
It comes from a family oral tradition and wasn't meant
for the general public. None the less, she may have
been what prompted the owner, Marjory Munson, to start asking
around in the first place. Francis Myers claimed that she
encountered the ghost in the Green Turban in nineteen eighty seven.
She was asleep in one of the downstairs bedrooms when

(18:50):
she was awakened suddenly by an African American woman wearing
a green turban and a long dress. She was standing
silently beside the bed, holding a metal candlestick in her hand.
She was so real that the candle even gave off
a soft glow. Knowing nothing about ghosts, she was terrified
and pulled the covers over her head and started screaming.
Then she slowly looked out and reached out a hand

(19:13):
to touch the woman who had never moved, and to
her amazement, the apparition vanished. Through research, author Joe Nickel
hasn't found any sources that provide any evidence that the
Chloe tale is true, attributing it, if at all, to legend.
Archives in St. Francisville do nothing to enlighten the situation.

(19:33):
Their holdings have not proven that Chloe existed at all.
Historical sources don't support the existence of Chloe, let alone
the crimes associated with her. The legends usually claimed that
Sarah and her two daughters were poisoned, but Mary Octavia
survived well into adulthood. Finally, Sarah James and Cornelia Woodruff
were not killed by poisoning, but instead succumbed to yellow fever.

(19:57):
So all of that being said, many claimed the legend
of Chloe is just that a legend, but those connected
to the home sometimes say otherwise. William Winter's spirit is
believed to haunt the home since his murder, as is
the spirit of his morning wife, Sarah eternally in black. Allegedly,
the labored footsteps of Winter's ghost can be heard on

(20:18):
the stairs. As I mentioned, legend has it that once
reaching the seventeenth step of the staircase, Winter had climbed
just high enough to die in his beloved's arms. Ever since,
it's been claimed that ghostly footsteps have been heard coming
into the house, walking to the stairs, and then climbing
to the seventeenth step, where they of course come to
an end. There's mention of a Confederate soldier spirit who's polite,

(20:41):
but there's also a rumor that specters from the Union
side have also lingered on the property. There's a story
that during the Civil War, three Union soldiers broke into
the Myrtles with the intent to rob the home. However,
they were allegedly shot to death in the gentleman's parlor,
leaving bloodstains on the floor that refused to be wiped away.
Researchers claim to have discovered no historical record indicating that

(21:04):
any of this happen, and specifically, the story has been
refuted by some descendants. Another spirit attributed to the property
is that of a nineteen twenties caretaker who wanders the grounds,
sometimes telling tourists that the place is closed. During another
attempt to rob the home, this time in nineteen twenty seven,
a caretaker was supposedly murdered, but again according to historians,

(21:26):
as of now, there's no evidence that it happened. The
Myrtles also has a very famous haunted mirror that hangs
in a prominent position. This mirror contains dark shadows that
are said to be the imprinted spirits of the dead
wife and children of Judge Woodruff. Another legendary haunted artifact
on site is the portrait of an anonymous man hanging

(21:47):
in the second floor foyer. His expression is believed to
change right before viewers eyes, and his eyes seem to
follow people as they move through the room. So the
Myrtles as quite a storied fiast of property, no doubt.
It's certain you've seen its share of dark history, tragedy
and death. So it's no wonder it's haunted. But let's
hear some of these stories firsthand from the Myrtles property

(22:09):
Ambassador Hester eb Miss Hester worked at the Myrtles for
decades and even now retired, continues to be their spokesperson,
and she does have some very fascinating stories. After that,
I want to dive a bit into what I think
maybe going on at the Myrtles and how even if
the leadend of Chloe isn't true, and she never existed.

(22:30):
She could still very much be haunting the old plantation
home all right. Now, I am currently joined by Miss

(22:53):
Hester Hester Eby, who is now the property ambassador for
Myrtles Plantation. She was the former director of tours, but
she recently retired, but she's still very much involved in Myrtles.
So thank you for joining me, Miss Hester. Thank you
for asking us. Of course, Now, Myrtles is interesting because
every other location just about on Haunted Road I have

(23:16):
visited in some way, and Myrtles is one of the
few that I have not yet had the pleasure to
pay a visit too. So I'm learning along with all
of the listeners about the property. And you know, the
history is vast, it sounds like. So before we get
into it too deeply, can you just kind of tell

(23:36):
us how you got involved in the property and how
long you've been involved with the property. First of all,
I'd like to invite all of you to come visit us.
It's really an experience. It's easy to talk about, but
once you've been with us and sid the night or
even spent a couple of hours on the grounds taking
a few photographs, or whatever. It's amazing. It's really an

(24:00):
experience that you want to have for yourself. But I
started the Myrtles about twenty some years ago, and like
anyone else looking for a job, I didn't have transportation
at the time, a long time ago. So I called
and the owner at the time was Francis Kermy and
she said, well, come by please and let's talk. And

(24:23):
so I did. And I say that the Myrtles for years.
In fact, I'm still there. But you know, we're known
to be hard, and it's not anything that just started yesterday.
I mean, I'm an old woman. I'm in my sixties now.
So even when I was a child living in Woodville, Mississippi,
if we drove by the Myrtles, it's like, don't point

(24:43):
over there, don't point over there. It's bad luck because
it's haunted. So not just the tale told, it's really true.
Anything from hearing footsteps for no reason, or hearing your
name Carled and thinking that it's a co worker because
it's their voice and they're into what they're doing. But
seventeen ninety six was when it was built to the

(25:05):
states that it is now. Seventeen ninety four's when it
started and a man named General David Bradford thought it
at all. He came from Pennsylvania, built the Myrtles, and
it went on to his son in law and then
from then seventeen uh the Sterlings added all the beauty
that we see today to the Myrtles. I mean, we

(25:27):
have taken a pretty deep dive into the history and
the first half of the episode, and there's just so
much history to it as far as who has been
associated with it over the years, and it sounds like
there's also a lot of stories that kind of have
come from it that may not necessarily actually have happened,
you know, and it's like kind of trying to weave through,

(25:47):
you know, what's historically accurate and what is lore and
things like that. And you said in the beginning about
how important it is to visit it, and I completely
agree with you. You know, it's so interesting because I've
heard stories for so long about the Myrtles, and I
have friends that just feel very attached to it in
a way that it's just a very important place to them.

(26:08):
They go back and visit every year, and it's just
kind of one of those haunts and one of those
places that draw people in. Do you think there was
kind of a bit of that when you started, Did
you feel just kind of compelled to be there in
some way? Well, when I first started, of course, as
I said, it was a job. But then the first
day that I got there, the beauty of it, it's

(26:29):
just overwhelming. It's I walked into the parlors and it
was like I was walking into something out of the
movies that you just didn't know what exists in San
Francis too, Louisiana. So you have an attachment to it.
And the more people visit, and the more you get
to know people, and the more they tell you their

(26:50):
stories about the mysteries of the Myrtles, and you can
relate to it because well, you know, this happened to
a couple of few days ago or whatever. You know,
it's conversation. And when I first started working at the Myrtles,
unlike now, people just didn't believe. They didn't talk about ghosts.
They just didn't believe some of the things that happened

(27:11):
at the Myrtles. And although haunted places as well, I'm
sure actually happened, but I mean, we have proof of it.
It's too many of us that sat at each other
and talk with each other and experience pretty close to
the same things. Yeah. Absolutely, So what was the first
thing that happened to you there that you knew something
was going on at the Myrtles. Well, the very first

(27:34):
thing that happened is when And this was very, very
just the first day that I came. I didn't realize
what was happening at the time, but a few months
later I realized. I came to on the parking lot.
It was the early morning. I didn't see but one car,
and I was looking for the owner at the time,

(27:57):
so I didn't see anyone. And my first thought was,
you know, you got the times mixed up. No one
is here. I came to the front of the house
and the door was a jar a bit, just opened
just slightly, and there was a lady. She was on
the staircase, I mean, just a lady, and she begged
for me to come up. And of course, you know,

(28:18):
I hadn't been there before. I didn't know. I mean,
I wouldn't do that. So I kind of peeped in
and I called and I don't know if I said
hello there or whatever, but no one answered. And what
by the time I looked back up after kind of
peeping my head in and calling. The lady was on
the staircase kind of becking for me to come up.
So anyway, I didn't do that, and I left the

(28:40):
door the way it was, and I was headed back
to the parking lot and Francis Kerman was in a
little garden area, whether a sister and or well is,
and she was doing flowers and she said hey, and
so we got to talking and whatever, and I remember
very well she had on a green movement that's, you know,
a big dress and uh, purple pump, and purple is

(29:04):
my favorite coast. I know this goes plump. And so
we were talking a bit and she said, can you
start work tomorrow? Well, first of all, you don't know
me that well, you hadn't got a resume or anything on.
It kind of puzzled me just a bit, but I
said yes, and she said, oh, you can start doing tours.
I said tours? Was that about? Because I wasn't familiar.

(29:25):
And then she went on and told me. I said,
I know nothing about this house. And she said, oh,
I don't give you the information you need. And so
I started and then it went on and about three weeks. Well,
I guess maybe a month, maybe a little over a
month or so. Maybe. I asked her about the lady
on the staircase. She said, Oh, don't worry about her,

(29:45):
but that lady, I mean, she was a spirit. She
was a lady, and she just begged for me to
come up. She was not an antevelop gown or anything
like that. She had on what looked like maybe a
day dress or something that would have been popular for
the arian. I don't know. It was so quick, but
the lady she was telling me, was a spirit. She existed,

(30:08):
but not in human form. But I mean she was
a lady, becking for me to come up. Yeah. We
hear that a lot, where people will see an apparition
and it just to them looks like a person. And
it makes you wonder how many times we've seen apparitions
in our lives and just didn't realize that they were
a spirit because they do look so solid, exactly exactly.

(30:31):
We have photographs and one of the most famous one
is a lady and she's an antebellum gown, but she's
on the staircase, you know, I mean, she's seeing who's
coming into her home. That's the way I feel. Yeah,
And so who do you think that was? You have
any idea? I don't know, because I wouldn't go as
far back as the eighteen hundreds. The way the lady looks,

(30:55):
I really don't know. We with our cameras now, even
our phone cameras or whatever, we're picking up things so quickly,
you know. It's not like the old photographs used to
be had to wait for her to get developed and
all that. We're picking up things that are actually happening
around us that we're not aware of, right right, I

(31:17):
have no idea of who she was, But as I said,
I don't believe she goes as far back as the
eight hundreds the way she was dressed. On the contrary,
you can tell they're dressed in period costa. We had
a young man not that long ago thought it was
a thrill to have his wife come to a hunting
house to do some surprise that happens all the time.

(31:37):
And she realized she was at the myrtles and it's like, honey,
I don't know if I can stay in the main house,
you know, And so we got ready to move them
to one of our cottages, which people do want to
stay on the grounds, but not actually stay in the
main house because of the age and because of so
many stories. And he went upstairs. She went to the

(31:59):
other room him. He went upstairs to get the rest
of their stuff and their luggage, and he took a while.
But when he came down, he said, oh, you know what,
I met the owner and we, you know, kind of
looked at each other and he said, yeah. He said,
I was lucky enough to meet Mr Winter. And he said,
it's great that all of you dressed in costume. Now

(32:20):
I never dressed in costume, but our cher guys to do,
and it adds to it. People love that. But Mr
Winter owned the home in the eighteen hundreds, and for
someone to tell him that he was Mr Winter and
then someone to be up there in costume, because he said,
you know, he even tipped his top hat to me
when we first started our conversation. But who he talked

(32:43):
to with someone from the past, I don't doubt he
talked to him at all. That's fascinating. Yeah, But when
he went over, you know, to talk to his girlfriend
and let her know that they were all settled for
the night. Uh, she still didn't feel comfortable saying Mr Winter,
he was shot right according to legend, did that actually
happen or oh, yes, it really did happen. He died

(33:06):
on the seventeenth step of the main staircase. And the
story goes that Mr Winterer he had a few things
going on. He had married the sterling's daughter, their only daughter,
and he was from St. Louis. He had left a
lady in St. Louis spoiled the so the writing said.
But in that time he may have even kissed her.

(33:28):
You know, that was considered an automatic engagement. And he
owed a huge gambling debt, and he had a good
chance of becoming governor at the time it was written.
But he had quite a few enemies as well. So
the story goes that someone wrote up following gentleman in
need of an attorney, and Mr Winterer came out of

(33:48):
his gentleman's parlor onto his north porchway to answer the collar.
But when he got to the porch way, whoever it
was on horseback shot him and continued to go, but
the blast blew him back into his home, and he
made it through the parlors trying to reach his wife,
and the seventeenth step is where he died in her

(34:10):
arms as he was calling for her. She was trying
to get him, and this is where you know he
took his last breath. So a lot of times people
hear the footsteps, they hear a lady's cry, and sometimes
the smell of perfume is overwhelming to people that are
in that upstairs sweet where Mr Winter and his wife shared.

(34:32):
So it is said also that a lot of people
will put a ball on the seventeenth step because Mr
Winter didn't like children playing ball in the home. And
I don't know if they did it or not, but
on the seventeenth step, if you place a ball there,
the story goes. And I have not seen it personally happened,
but I've seen it where people have set up their

(34:54):
cameras and you will see that ball come off that
seventeen step and it comes off with a force. It's
just no one kicked it or something right. So, when
I was going through the history, I think that sometimes
people assume every spirit or ghost is from like an
older time period, But the history has just been kind

(35:14):
of constant with the myrtles as far as death's associated
with the poverty who has lived there over the years now,
you having spent so much time there, who do you
think is maybe the most prevalent spirit in the plantation.
I would guess Chloe is, because she loves the idea
of being around people. She seems to be fascinated with jewelry,

(35:38):
and so I do believe out of all the years
that I have been there and out of personal things
that have kind of happened to me, and you just wonder, well,
you know, was this something out of the supernatural or
was it just something that happened, you know that just
does not happen every day. But I think she is.
In fact, I think people see her more than we realize,

(36:01):
because we have a restaurant on the grounds as well,
so everything you need is right there, and we've had
guests just on the back porch and the rockers, you know,
in late evening, and they told us how nice it
is they have everyone, the waitresses in the restaurant in costume.
Who they're seeing, I don't know, because our waitresses are
not in costume. But it was an area where you

(36:24):
would go back and forth from the butler's pantry to
get food prepared for the household. And who they're seeing
is probably people from the past. That's so crazy because
that happens like in Gettysburg a lot too. Or people
will think they're seeing re enactments and then turn around
and no one is there, and you know, they're just
assuming that it's people in costume. Now, I feel like

(36:47):
the Ghost of Chloe, like that is a story too
that I don't know as always properly portrayed. You know,
it sounds like not everyone is convinced that things happen
the way they say they it historically, and that's something
like we're always trying to clear up what have you heard?
What is the story of Chloe according to what you
all think? Well, the story goes that the second owner,

(37:11):
Judge Clark Woodroff, General Bradford's son in law, took on
a mistress that was one of his house servants and
she was caught eavesdropping on some of the family business
and as punishment, she cut off her left earload. Well,
it left her so upset that a few days later
she baked the birthday cake for his oldest daughter, used

(37:34):
the juices some a popular leaf the oleander baked it
in the family's cake, killing the Judges's wife, Sarah, and
two of their children and their three of the ghosts,
along with Chloe the slaves who still lived there. After
Chloe confessed of poisoning, she was killed. And this is
the story that we tell. But I do want to say,

(37:56):
you know, Ki was a nanny of the children, so
she care of them. It's just a personal feeling that
after she was sent to the fields, away from the children,
that she wanted to do something to get back in
the good graces of the family. So this is and
this is in my opinion, that she did the cake,

(38:18):
not thinking that put the lander in a birthday cake,
not thinking that she would kill the children by any means,
or the mother which also died, but that she would
make them ill having to care of them for years.
She could come back in knowing what was already wrong.
There's them back to health and get on the good

(38:39):
graces of everyone again and be invited back into the household.
But it was overdone. Regardless to why the reasons, it
was overdone and they all died. And after Coli confessed
to the poisoning, I believe she confessed taking someone older
or wiser will be able to save the family. Of course,

(38:59):
she is killed, but that is the most popular story,
and a lot of people question that story, but I
do not, because something happened there, and she and the
children are very often seen, and a lot of people
say that she has a knack of showing up. We

(39:20):
have a mirror in the fourier that's very popular. I'm
sure you've heard about it, and they the face of
the children and Chloe show up, without a doubt. I
have seen that and people have said that they took
the picture and it looks like a first children are there,
but then it looks like something larger shape of a
person comes and kind of coverage the children, as if

(39:42):
she's pushing them away. I believe it's Chloe and our
children that were poisoned, but I believe she's still trying
to protect them no matter what. So that's the most
popular story of the Myrtles in my viewpoint, and a
lot of people have the scene the in mirror, the
image of Choe as well as the children, and most

(40:04):
of the time the children first, and this this image
coming as if it's protecting them. A lot of our guests,
and then especially in the old side of the hall,
which would have been the only side that was they're
doing Koe's time. A lot of times they've gotten warm,
pulled their covers back a wake an hour so later
it's only two of them, but yet they're tucked in tightly.

(40:25):
Things like that has happened. We used to have school,
or COVID has now kind of delayed us with everything.
But we're on the National Register of Historical Places, so
a lot of school groups come to visit us, and
I had had a couple of times. Same day, two
kids asked me, are you hungry? And one little girl

(40:47):
asked me, I guess she was. I don't know how
she was. She was in the elementary, but she was
with her mother and there was a group of about
fifteen of them and we were waiting for them to
tap their turn to go into the house. I was
just killing time and talking to him or whatever. And
when I got to the end of the line, she
and her mother were the last people, and she said,

(41:08):
why are you dirty? And I kind of looked down
at myself because it was after lunch, you know, I'm
known to do that, and it looked pretty decent, you know,
I didn't look like I had it filled anything. And
she said, are you hungry? And I realized as she
was talking to me, she was looking to the side
of me, is if someone was behind me, and she

(41:29):
was not talking to me at all, but I was
trying to answer her. And then I said, honey, are
you talking to me? And she said no, and then
she turned around as if she was talking to someone
behind me, and uh. I looked at her mother, and
her mother looked at me kind of smiled or whatever,
because she never want to I don't know how parents feel,

(41:49):
so we never said, oh, she sees a ghost and
their children, so I didn't. I was waiting for the
next step from her parents, and then her mother kind
of winked at me, and I waked my eye back.
And then after they went in, the mother stayed out
and talked to me for a second and she said,
I really think she was talking to someone else behind you.
I said, yeah, I get that feeling too. Yeah. I mean,

(42:12):
that's really the way to handle it. We've always asked
me like how to handle ghosts and children, and I
feel like you guys were doing the exact correct thing.
Was just kind of not make a big deal out
of it, because then that makes them afraid, whereas if
you just kind of act like it's, you know, just
a normal happening. Then they just move on from it
and don't dwell on it. You know, they see things
I believe very often that we do not. I had

(42:34):
a young man with his grandfather and they came on
tour and I was just talking to him or whatever,
and if we have extra time, we listened to a
story that they want to tell. And this gentleman told me.
He said he and his grandson were arriving around on
their property and they do it almost every other evening
on a four wheeler. And when his grandson was younger

(42:55):
and the little boy was about ten at the time,
they were using us. When the little boy was young
or he would tell his grandfather to stop by this
house that used to belong to an old lady that
lived on the property way before he bought it. And
he wouldn't get off before Willow, but he would wave
that Miscedi, and he would do it. You know, he

(43:15):
just do it because he asked him to. We do
all you things to our grandchildren. And so this particular evening,
after he stopped seeing Mercedie and she would wave at
him from the porch, his grandfather stopped by Mercedes house,
you know, gave it a pause and he said, pahpa,
while you stopping, He said, don't you want to wave
that mess? Sadies said, Mercedes not here anymore. She's gonna heaven.

(43:37):
And so after that they never stopped by Mercedes house.
But when he was at the Myrtles, we were talking,
we were in the ladies parlor. He had his attention
to the gentleman's parlor, which is right next door for
some reason, and eventually, you know, he moved a little
bit towards the parlor, moved a little more, and we
knew as if he wanted to go in that room,
and he couldn't wait for us, So I told his

(43:59):
grand aither he could go ahead. So he went in
the room, and he went to the corner. And when
he went to that corner, I knew was the corner
that a lot of kids have said that there's a
little boy playing marbles. And I didn't hear the marbles
on the floor, because sometimes we've heard that it's a
wood floor. But he went in that corner and he
acted if he was talking to someone. So he held

(44:20):
his little hand out and then he closed it and
we kept, you know, we kept talking to each other.
And when he got into the next room, he opened
his little hand to show his papa that he had
a rock, and his papa asked, Hi, where did he
get the rock? Prom he pointed, in there, a child
gave it to him. In there, he said, And then
all of a sudden he stopped talking to us about it,

(44:42):
and he did his little finger over his lips like
you would do when you were saying, you know, be quiet,
And so he did that, and we knew that the
person in there that he was seeing and we could
not was telling him not to talk to us about it.
If they sound like such interactive spirits, you know, the
fact that people see them so strongly and think that

(45:03):
they're just a living human being is so fascinating to me.
Like how often are people having experiences there? Well, when
I was there on a daily basis, it was something
that we could not predict. It would at least a
month would not go by without someone having something happened.
And a lot of times they didn't realize that at

(45:23):
the time. They would send us photographs back saying who
is this? You know, and of course you know you
can't always answer, you can. Yeah, In fact, you never
are sure of an answer, but you can tell them
what this story was told about this area. You know.
But some people I think are attracted to persons from
their past. You know. I think that sometimes people from

(45:45):
their past seemed to kind of connect at the myrtles.
And I could be wrong about that, but I've seen
so many times. We had some guests that came to
visit and they went on a trip that they do
every year. Well, unfortunately one of their friends had passed
on and he was not able to come on this trip.
They sent me a photograph and they said, look at this. Well,

(46:08):
I'm looking at the photographs and I don't know because
everyone seems like, you know, just normal. And I thought
they meant I could see something in the background like
other photographs. Who is this or whatever? But then when
I looked at the two pictures that they sent me,
I saw nothing. And then on the little letter that
they sent me, which I should have read first, I
guess the little note it says that Don is here,

(46:31):
and so then they have a little arrow that they
drew to the man that is done. Well, Don looks
like everyone else to me, but Don is the person
that was no longer with them. That is wild. It
makes me wonder, like, what is it about the myrtles,
Like what's going on there? You know, no, I know,
but it's look not to be and I know you're

(46:53):
not because you're so used to this and you travel
to other places so much, and people are just so
they're not like they used to be. You know. It's
nothing to scare you. It's just I know, it's kind
of unbelievable, but it happens, you know, it just happens.
I mean, I don't know why they're drawn to the myrtles.
I know that we have a lot of past that

(47:15):
involves you know, ghosts and mysteries and whatever, but it
continues to happen. It just rolls on. We've had guests
that have stayed in one room and the ladies they're
overwhelmed with sadness for some reason, so much so that
they're shedding a little tear and they don't know why.
But we are sensitive as women, and a lot of

(47:36):
times too if it involves a child, that really kicks in.
So this particular room, the family Williams Room, there's always
kind of a sadness there and people have said the
children still play in the closet there, and I do
believe it. Yeah, I mean, now you're you're making me
want to visit even more. I always have wanted to visit. Now,

(47:58):
how did everything I knew that IDA didn't really affect
that area in particular, but I know the Myrtles was
housing some evacuees and everything. So how are things bearing
there now? Everything is going as well as can be expected.
And we were lucky in this area, so we were
able to help our neighbors and help our friends. And
the Myrtles still has some guests staying with us because

(48:21):
they're unable to go to their home right now, and
that's a good thing. But in fact, you know, Louisiana,
you've seen it on all of our commercials and it's
really really true. As our Lieutenant governor and our governor says,
we're set of people that look out for each other
and we're strong people and we're not leaving this area
because of hurricane and whatever else because we love where

(48:43):
we are. But to answer you, the Myrtles is still
sheltering people and we'll continue to do it as long
as needed. And that's just the way it is. Well,
Louisiana is one of my absolute favorite places to visit.
I've been really fortunate to see quite a bit of
the state, but I definitely need to at the Myrtles
off at some point very soon. I do really appreciate

(49:04):
you sitting and telling us some great stories, and I
think everyone's interest is very peaked. I'm sure people will
be paying a visit very soon. If they want to
book a day or anything, they just head to the website.
Right are you guys doing tours right now? We are.
We only close for tour of the short period that
you know we're asked to because of COVID, but everything

(49:25):
is as close to normal as we can get it,
and we welcome our guests. Bed and Breakfast still open.
As I said, our restaurant is outstanding and some of
the food that you will only get in the South
is certainly there. But you know, we have tours every
day and of course in the evenings. This is what
really is exciting to me, and I love it because

(49:47):
on Friday and Saturday nights we still do evening tours
and those tours are focused on nothing but ghost stories
and I love that and a lot of times when
our GUIDs start the tours, you'll have someone. It's like
children in a classroom have someone in the back wants
to say something and they will raise their handle and
they have a story to tell, and we take time

(50:09):
for that because it's an our tour and it's it's enjoyable.
I love that you guys are doing that because I mean,
I just feel like the history of the Myrtles is
incredibly important, and then I think sometimes when you add
in ghost stories and legends and mysteries, it just really
gets people interested and you know, they learned so much
as a byproduct with that as well. So I love

(50:31):
what you're all doing there and I can't wait to visit.
So thank you so much for spending some time with me.
I know we went back and forth trying to make
this interview happened. I'm so glad it finally happened, and
I really appreciate it that it happened as well. And
I'm so sorry I missed you on Friday, But you
know what I'm saying. Franceville is a beautiful town anyway,
So you know, we have other plantations as well, so

(50:53):
I mean, we're just in the heart of everything, and
I want you to come and please let me know
when you're coming. It's gonna be being news anyway, probably
everyone will know. But let me know when you're coming
so we can meet each other. I would love that
so thank you so much. I appreciate you taking the time.
All right, thank you, love Blaye bye. The reason I

(51:13):
cited the Philip experiment at the beginning of the podcast
was because, after going through the history and research of
the Myrtles, I was convinced the story of Chloe was
a legend, a story passed down for decades, something we
see all too often in the paranormal. Many times these
bits of misinformation can be truly harmful because they cause

(51:33):
existing spirits to be misidentified or ignored and in turn frustrated.
But as I spoke with Miss Hester and she relaid
the story of Chloe so strongly, it dawned on me
that whether the story of Chloe actually happened, it has
been so long perpetuated one way or another at the
Myrtles and become so incredibly detailed and elaborate that our

(51:55):
creation of Chloe could very well be walking those halls.
The same apply is for every other rumored spirit or
death that took place there. Maybe William didn't make it
to step seventeen and fall dead in that spot. But
in our minds he did. In the minds of the
thousands upon thousands of people who have visited, they all
stared at those steps. They all envisioned this man making

(52:15):
it to step seventeen and collapsing in his love's arms,
And then slowly the footsteps started. Am I saying this
is for sure what's occurring at the Myrtles? Absolutely not.
I have yet to set foot inside. To be honest,
the stories of Chloe could very well be true, just
documentation of it well and purposefully hidden, as we've seen
in so many other tragic instances when researching enslaved people

(52:38):
of that time. Yet, if it is what's happening there,
what does that mean for other hauntings? How do we
determine which are of actual spiritual origin and which are
coming from us? Regardless, as Miss Hester seemed to allude to,
there is something very peculiar and very special happening at
the Myrtles, something that seems very different from any haunting

(53:00):
I've encountered before. Armed with all this information, theory and speculation,
I intend to visit very soon, and I hope you
will too, Haunted Road is a production of I Heart
Radio and Grimm and Mild from Aaron Mankey. The podcast

(53:23):
is written and hosted by Amy Bruney. Executive producers include
Aaron Manky, Alex Williams, and Matt Frederick. The show is
produced by rema Ill Kali and Trevor Young. Taylor Haggerdorn
is the show's researcher. For more podcasts from I heart Radio,
visit the I heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

(53:44):
you get your podcasts.