January 1, 2024 • 53 mins
Isaac Mizrahi has a lively and truly LOL chat with RuPaul’s Drag Race season six winner, Bianca Del Rio. They discuss how she trolls her friends on social media, the unique way she wants to be buried, the hilarious way she got her drag name and more.
Plus, don’t miss Isaac this January on episode 3 of RuPaul’s Drag Race on MTV!
Follow Hello Isaac on @helloisaacpodcast on Instagram and TikTok, Isaac @imisaacmizrahi on Instagram and TikTok and Bianca Del Rio @thebiancadelrio.
(Recorded on November 16, 2023)
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
So I was using the name marvel Am and a
friend of mine was like, girl, you need to get
a real name.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
She goes, you.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Remind me of my friend Bianca. So I think Bianca
del Rio is the perfect name. I'm like, great, whatever,
She's like, I want you to know that Bianca was
a dear friend of mine and she had passed away,
and you remind me a lot of her.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
I said, Oh, that's lovely. Cut to Isaac.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Eighteen years later, I win Drag Race and I'm at
the airport going through my phone call. Everyone's saying congratulations, congratulations.
And here was that bitch, Nikki Rich, my good friend,
who says to me, congratulations, bitch, I'm glad you won.
By the way, Bianca is not dead. She lives in
Florida and she's pissed.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Eighteen years later, this is.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Hello Isaac, my podcast about the idea of success and
how failure affects it. I'm Isaac Msrahi, and in this
episode I talked to drag queen comedian actor and RuPaul's
Drag Race season six winner, Bianca del Rio.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Hello, Isaac, it's Bianca del Rio and I'm sure that
you're probably really, really busy. That's why you're not taking
my call. But I really need to speak with you soon.
I had a situation at Fire Island.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Call me immediately.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
I need your help.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
Happy New Year. We're kicking off twenty twenty four in
a big way with today's guest, Bianca del Rio. Now,
going into this interview, I'm expecting something very exciting, frankly,
because in advance, I got a notice that Bianca will
(01:36):
be Bianca. She'll be in full drag and full makeup,
and she asked to be referred to as Bianca only.
So the thing about Bianca is I know that there's
a big difference between who she is in dragon out
of drags. So this is going to be fascinating to
see what I can get out of her, what she
(01:58):
doesn't want to talk about, what she feels vulnerable about.
And I'm kind of eager to get started. So joining,
Oh my god, Bianca del Rio, seriously like this is
one of the great moments of my life.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
I mean, this is the most exciting thing to happen
to you. You need to get out more, Isaac. I
must tell.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Her, wait a minute, Well, you're so right, You're so right.
I do need to get out. But honey, you are gorgeous. Well,
it's a lot of very up close, it's a lot
of layers. It's a lot of like, how do you
get that off? It's funny you ask. I have a
makeup remover called the Bianca Remover, and anything with a
coconut oil base can remove all this madness. Because a
lot of my drag queen friends from Drag Race all
(02:41):
have makeup lines, right, I thought, who was gonna buy
makeup from an ugly bitch? So I thought the best
thing to do is if I did a remover, someone
would look at my face and go, well, if it
takes that shit off, it will work for my mescara,
it will work.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
For my eyeliner. So I use anything cocone oil base.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
But I also had this product called the the Bianca Remover,
which is great. It's like a little pad and it
just wipes all of it away, takes away the clown
and you become a man.
Speaker 3 (03:06):
Well wait a second, Like this is a big process
that you go through every day when you work right, Well,
it gets easier and easier, I know, but still, darling.
I've been in a few shows where I have to
wear it a little makeup and certain kind of a
costume or whatever it is, and I find that to
be somehow like constricting. And you know, I switz, I
sweat a lot.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Oh really, you know youadwe body sweater, Darling.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
I'm embarrassed to say I am a full on head
and body sweat.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Interesting, Okay, okay, I am.
Speaker 3 (03:35):
I mean Judy Garland was, remember she did all those monologues, Darling,
or sweat and my hair it just came lower and lower.
You know that? Amazing? Exactly exactly. Well, anyway, tell me
about what that's like, sort of putting on all those
layers and then performing under all of that weight.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
You know, it's crazy. It becomes the norm, it becomes
what you do. And frankly, for me, it's kind of
like the armor. If I didn't have all of it on,
I would feel kind of crazy. Like if I'm not
wearing heels like right now, it is a different feeling.
But if I was on stage in a flat shoe,
which is a big issue in the drag world, and
I refuse to go to orthopedic drag shoes, but if
(04:15):
you're forced to do that, it does throw you off.
Like literally, my body feels different in a corset. My
body feels different when I'm uncomfortable, and maybe that's why
I'm such a bitch, because the packaging makes me really,
really uncomfortable.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Like if I was a white woman in the real world,
i'd be.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
A Karen, But on stage it's called comedys, so basically
I'm used to it.
Speaker 3 (04:34):
Do you know Veronica Web is Veronica Web. You are
a sabulous supermodel and we're very close friends. But I remember,
like in the day when I used to do these
big fashion shows and she'd say to me, Darling, I
will not struggle behind in flats. I will not do
that this time, because you know, I like a flat
I sometimes I.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Like it appropriate for me. My big issue with drag
queens it's not so much the shoe. I mean, I go,
all right, I get it, you might be older, your
feet might be tired. As long as it matches, I'm
not too mad. But the big issue for me is earrings.
Lack of earrings. You've got a big man face, You've
got all this crap on, and you don't have anything
to soften.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Like, nobody's pretty enough to not have on an earring.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
There is no excuse put on an earring and if
you've got a matching bracelet, you're my friend.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
And yet today, Darling, I hope you notice what's happening
in fashion and how all of that is kind of
coming up in size, Like you can go out there now.
It's almost like you can't find giant earrings. You can
only find giant, like draggy kind of earrings. Yes, there,
and jewelry and shoes everybody wants to look now, very
very dragged up.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
You know, Thank you kardash It's really the truth.
Speaker 3 (05:40):
I know. Well, excuse me, thank you, fucking Bianca del Rio, Darling.
Can I do a little history about you? Let's do
a little do it.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
Let's do it.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
Where are you from?
Speaker 1 (05:49):
I'm originally born and raised in New Orleans, Louisiana, So
that that alone is a setup for issues in your life.
Because New Orleans is an amazing place to be from.
It's a party town, a lot of food, it's relaxed,
I should say. And I knew at a certain age,
I knew I got to get the fuck out of
here because I knew it wasn't my place. They're my people,
(06:11):
but it wasn't my place. So I grew up there
left there, then went to New York, and then went
to Los Angeles. And when you become a gay of
a certain age, you moved to Palm Springs. And the
reason I'm in Palm Springs is because it's cheaper than
plastic surgery. You ain't gonta do shit to your face.
You come here, you're young. Compared to the people here,
I'm young.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
It's like Miami for the Julie. Yes, if you were Jewish,
you'd be in Miami totally.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
And with these earrings, I belong in Boca.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
But yes, I've just moved around, and then you find
the place that works for you at that time in
your life.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
Right except Darling, Like, you know, you're in Louisiana and
it's a little town. It's not exactly like a pea town, right,
it was a little great.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
Was born and then I lived in New Orleans, in
the French Quarter where the gays migrate. So I was
there for many, many years.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
But as a little child that spoke to you, like,
how did you discover this whole obsession.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
With with dragon? Well, you know, it's funny. It didn't
start out with drag. It started out with pretty things
on television. I came from a time where I was
watching reruns because I'm not that old, but it reruns
with the Carol Burnett Show. Anything Bob Mackie of course
was glittery and exciting, and I never really thought I
wanted to be a drag queen. It all started with
with costumes, you know, theater and someone saying, hey can
(07:26):
you sew?
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Sure? Hey can you do hair?
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Sure? Can you do makes last always? And then it
ended up kind of look becoming the game. I said
yes to everything, and it just kind of snowballed and evolved.
So drag happened because I kind of had the makings
to do drag.
Speaker 3 (07:42):
And somehow you're like madly talented, you're hilariously funny. That's
an amazing thing. What brought all of that out?
Speaker 2 (07:49):
I think it's.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
Being told no, or being told you're not supposed to
do that. So, for instance, when someone would say that's
not what a boy would do or that's not the
right thing to do, I would go but it's the
first thing I think of, you know, it's what comes
to my mind. So I think being told no quite often,
but yet a couple of people would laugh, or even
the people telling me no, we're laughing, going you're not right,
(08:14):
but you're right. It just kind of evolved from that,
and I think coming from where I was coming from,
I knew, Okay, if they're not getting me, then I
need to go someplace where they will get me. So
that's what kind of shifted my life.
Speaker 3 (08:28):
Did you do drag as a little boy in Louisiana? Oh?
Speaker 1 (08:31):
No, No, I did drag a New Orleans. I did
drag a New Orleans. I think I started I was twenty,
so it was like nineteen ninety six, and it evolved then,
but it was through theater because that's where it was acceptable.
You know, you can be a lady on stage and
ha ha ha ha ha.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
You know. It wasn't the lifestyle I speak.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
And as you mentioned earlier, Louisiana is like a party town. Yeah,
did you go to parties? Did you go to drag parties? Well?
Speaker 2 (08:53):
It was the night life, you know, so imagine.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
I mean, you know what it was like in the
years where there was no social media. You said I'm
going out with my gay friends. I'll meet you at ten.
You had to meet at ten or they thought you died.
There was no phones, so you would go out at
ten pm and you would be out till five am.
And that was the life, you know. And I was
lucky enough amongst all my friends that while I was
(09:16):
out living that life, I was also getting paid because
I was in drag.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
So that kind of turned into my life.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
You know, which was being out, being seen and being
a part of the scene.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
Let's talk a little bit more about that, because I
felt that as a fashion designer that was rather important
to go out constantly. And I was out there darling.
I loved it. And I wasn't exactly in drag. I
was wearing clothes that I would make myself that was
slightly outrageous. That's how I used to get into those
clubs all the time when I was fourteen years old.
Like it performing our high school. We went out and
(09:48):
we dressed ourselves, and I dressed my friends. You use
the word gay, Are you gay? Are you any say?
How do you tell me? No?
Speaker 2 (09:57):
I mean world now?
Speaker 3 (09:59):
Yes, I often, yes, we are. We're in a different world.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
And say I was called a faggot before I ever
suck to dick.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
So I yes, yes, I don't have a wife, I
have no children.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
I'm never on the fence about anything.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
So, yes, this is my world, and I think the
gay thing kind of came secondary to all of it,
which was funny because as a child, you know, you're
called names and you're called gay, which a then was
like what do you mean, I'm gay? Oh my god,
it's a hurtful word. But as an adult it was secondary.
Speaker 3 (10:29):
You know.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
I was a performer, I was an actor. I was
a drag queen. Oh, by the way, I'm gay.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
I was always introduced as a clown before I was
introduced as a gay man, ye see.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
And so like it's extremely nuanced nowadays, yes, right, Like
what you do has gone from what it started as,
which as far as I remember, you know, in the
day with like Bunny yes, and with Flotilla God yes,
Barry Humphreys, you know, like really miss Lipsenka, Yeah, who
was I think one of the great.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Brilliants who has ever ever lirilliant?
Speaker 3 (11:01):
And it used to be a very good friend of mine,
John Eperson. But that was an illusion that was a
man dressed. It was a female illusionists, right, that's what
drag was. And now it's so nuanced, you know, and
you can't go, oh, well, i'm gay or she's this
or there, that, or the pronouns or whatever it is.
Talk about that, darling, talk a little about this.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
It's completely different from when I came up.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
I mean, as you said, before, all of us were female.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
I say, female delusionists was the packaging to get away
with murder. But I think we all knew where we
stood now at the time. When I was starting out,
there were groups of queens. They were the clown queens.
They were the dance and queens. And then there were
the trans showgirls who were the goddesses of the time.
You know, in New York is someone like Candace Caane,
(11:48):
you would go, oh my god, just.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
E most person a man, popopular, etc.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
The maglist.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
And I never said to myself I'm in that league,
nor did I say I want to be that. I
was called a clown by those people early on, which
I think was the catalyst for me just to go, okay,
this is my lane. Where now drag is for everyone?
And I often say, yes, drag is for everyone. You
can do whatever you want. That doesn't mean you belong
on a stage. It's like a pretty person.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
Being an actor. Girl, girl, let's talk to Ryan Murphy. Girl.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
So in the end, it was a different route for me.
So I kind of stayed in my lane. And so
now to see that there are no lanes and there
is no discussion about who can do water, who can't
do what. It's for everyone and everyone's everybody lovely.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
But it wasn't that way for us.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
I mean, in my day, the gays didn't even like
the drag queens. You know, in New Orleans, you were
looked down upon if you were a drag queen, and
you also weren't allowed in certain bars.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
In New Orleans.
Speaker 1 (12:47):
There were a couple of bars that if you went
in drag you would be escorted out, which is completely crazy.
And now I can pass those bars, and then the
first people to say, girl, can I get a selfie?
Speaker 2 (12:57):
I'm like, woof the times have changed.
Speaker 3 (12:59):
Well now I talk about this a lot because our past.
I think you're significantly younger than eighty forty eight. I'm
not forty eight.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
Look, I'm not you.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
Look I'm trying. I'm trying. But I often look back
on my personal history and I'm not boohooing, but I'm
going It wasn't so easy being totalated and being bullied,
et cetera. Et cetera. But I wouldn't trade it because
it made me something, It made me an artist.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
Agreed, Agreed. That is what I tell everyone.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
I mean, I get so sick of the woe is
me bullshit and some queen saying my life was so horrible,
and I found my voice and dragged shut the fuck up.
Speaker 3 (13:37):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
The thing is it doesn't resonate with me because the
last thing I want is someone to go, oh my god,
she's had such a hard life.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
Let's go see her show. That's the worst.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
Way, now, the worst worst, Like, let's.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Go see poor little Isaac's collection because the world hated him.
Speaker 3 (13:53):
Ow, it's exactly.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
So I often say, look, what my life is is
my life. And maybe because of social media, maybe because
of reality shows and all of that madness where you
have to have this story that tongues on everybody's heart strings.
That was never part of my drag persona. As you
were saying, you know, everybody has, I guess say, their armor,
their shield, their character they're presenting. So it was never
a part of it. So I get grossed out when
(14:18):
I have to hear it.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
I just it's just my.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
Thing, one thing that's making me very happy these days
is that people who are transitioning, people who are finding
their identity, are less scared to do totally. That's making
me very very happy, I will say, because you remember
in the day when people would come out on TV
or they would talk about how they were transitioning, and
there were always tears and fear and dread, of course,
(14:44):
because in those days it was just so difficult. But
what I like so much now is that there is like, hooray,
I'm actually finding who I am and a few tiers
of few tears.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
So I think that's a different route, you know.
Speaker 1 (14:56):
I think what society has done, it's just made it
seem that okay.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Originally, if you were in drag.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
Someone would say you wanted to be a woman, and
I'm like, no, that's not what I wanted to do.
So I never dismiss anyone's trans story or trans journey.
That is a different ball of wax. Now, sometimes drag
is involved because the evolution of drag in their life
maybe led.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Them to these options and choices.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
That was never my thing, So I always had to
be clear with people and say no, I enjoy being
a male, a gay male who happens to wear heels
and all of this. But when this comes off, I'm myself,
whereas other people they find their identity or find their
way or searching for their identity. So I often say,
I like to clarify that what they experience is nothing
(15:37):
that I've experienced. So I never want to dismiss it
or think.
Speaker 3 (15:41):
No, you cannot, you must not, you must not. I
have to say, you began the whole thing by talking
about how only you are and what a clown, et cetera.
And by the way people use the word clown and
different ways, I think you use it in a very
very loving way. But let me just say one thing, like,
I don't know where you get the idea that you're ugly? Well,
is that, like seriously like a self reflection or what
(16:02):
is that? Is that? Like I'm going to say it
before you.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
So I think as I sit here in a way
and I go, it's based in truth.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
And you also realized, like there is a world.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
Now there is a drag approach that some of these
girls the goal is to appear feminine or soft or
as we said earlier, a Kardashian you know where you're
just in this flat hair, And that was never my route.
So I was labeled a clown, and I'm already aware
of it. So I keep that in my back pocket
because there's no denial here. I know what I am.
(16:33):
So I think that's just basically me saying it as
you said before anyone else does, because I don't want
people to think that I'm like some insane bitch living
in Palm Springs. Who's normal, Desmond, who's thinking remember my
past when I was young and pretty?
Speaker 2 (16:45):
No, this is it.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
It is warpaint, it is a costume. It is exaggerated,
and I'm not trying to fool anyone.
Speaker 3 (16:53):
You know, it's funny because I didn't get this from
whenever I've seen you on television or in performance. I
didn't get the intense kind of Joan Crawford.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Yeah, you see, that's a compliment. Oh that's a compliment, Darling.
Oh yes, Now are we talking real Joan Crawford. Are
we talking Fade Dunaway moment?
Speaker 3 (17:10):
We're talking Fade Dundaway or Joan doing Joan when she
got old lady, when she was trying to be Joan
Brawford starting, by the way, tell me who Bianca is?
This Bianca like a pastiche is she apart Joe Cruft?
What does she do?
Speaker 2 (17:23):
You're gonna tackle at this.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
So I was doing theater many many years ago, and
I was doing a show called Cycle Beach Party Charles Bush.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
I love that, Yeah, And there was.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
A role that I was playing, marvel Anne, who was
the bitch on the beach, and I was then offered
to come and perform at the drag bar. So I
was using the name marvel Anne and a friend of
mine was like, girl, you need to get a real name.
I'm like, well, I don't really have a name. I
don't know, I don't know what talme of. She goes, well,
you remind me of my friend Bianca. So I think
Bianca del Rio is the perfect name. I'm like, great, whatever.
(17:55):
So it was put on the middle day rag and
it said Bianca del Rio and she's like, well, I
want you to know that Bianca was a dear friend
of mine and she had passed away, and you remind
me a.
Speaker 2 (18:04):
Lot of her. I said, oh, that's love. Cut to Isaac.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
Eighteen years later, I went drag race and I'm at
the airport going through my phone, a flip phone, because
that's how long Aero it was, and it's everyone's saying congratulations, congratulations,
And here was that bitch, Nikki Rich, my good friend
who says to me, congratulations, bitch, I'm glad you won.
By the way, Bianca is not dead. She lives in
Florida and she's pissed.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Eighteen years later. That is great, eighteen years of the making.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
God.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
So I'm like, that is that really? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (18:38):
So that is like the long honey.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Can you imagine the hate mail she gets?
Speaker 3 (18:43):
God starling when you take it all off? Right?
Speaker 2 (18:54):
Yeah again, Roy?
Speaker 3 (18:56):
Yes, person? Right? And Roy lives a regular life. Roy
goes to the super I don't mean to me, you know,
objectifying here. I just want to know, like, does Roy
wear a light beat when he goes out?
Speaker 2 (19:07):
No? No, no, no, no, no.
Speaker 3 (19:09):
Tell me everything. I want to know who this person? No.
Speaker 1 (19:11):
I for me, I think when it takes so much
to plot and plan this, and like you know, I
sew so I make my own costumes and do all
of that kind of fanfare for myself, do my own
wigs and all of that packaging that I think I
get worn out when I'm out of it, where I'm
just like, man, I'm good, I'm always in black. On occasion,
I'll throw on a little something you get it that
you just go. It's just easier as my uniform. And
(19:34):
I don't try to draw that type of attention to myself,
obviously when you go to a gay brunch in Palm
Springs Mary Redoomed. But it's not something look at me,
look at me. It's a pretty normal life. And I
don't know if it stems from Okay, I'm a human being,
or the fact that I'm just lazy, you know, I
get exhausted in this world, or it requires so much
(19:55):
maintenance that outside of it, I'm like, I'm good.
Speaker 3 (19:58):
I feel very similarly. I have a small house in Bridgehampton.
I refer to it as a show compared to like
those other places you go, and it's like, oh my god, like,
what person broke the law to make this much money
to it for right? And I have this fabulous friend,
Kitty Hawk. She's so funny and gorgeous and she's a
very important, like sort of interior designer, and she came
over to visit me in the shack and my husband
(20:19):
was there and she's like, are you straight man? Like,
what the hell is this? You know, it's so funny.
It's like people don't understand, Darling. When I am not
doing that. When I am not either designing something or
performing or whatever the hell i'm doing producing something, I
am a wreck. I can barely get out of my chair.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
And also like, for instance, I live out in Palm Springs,
but I live outside of the Palm Springs itself, and
many of my friends are like, oh, you live a
suburban life. I go, honey, I know where the gays
and fanfare is if I made it. And I think
after living in New York and living in Los Angeles,
you know where it is when you want it. But
sometimes going to bed at nine pm is a lovely thing.
Speaker 3 (20:58):
Oh yes, yes, are you with are I did give
a husband? Come on? Do you this is beautiful a
long term thing?
Speaker 2 (21:10):
Or is it about two and a half years, which
is a long time for me?
Speaker 3 (21:13):
Like are you a top or about him?
Speaker 2 (21:15):
I own to you have different what I'll meet you
in the.
Speaker 3 (21:19):
Bathroom in twenty minutes, Darling.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
I'm sorry. I don't fuck people with a shack.
Speaker 3 (21:24):
No.
Speaker 1 (21:24):
The crazy thing is that most jack queens are most
drag queens.
Speaker 3 (21:29):
Are I know, I know, it's really true. It's all
in the tuck, doll in the tuck.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
And you always tell people you know where I put mine.
I take a string tied on my deck, pull it
out my back and stick it under my wig.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
And that's what gives me height.
Speaker 3 (21:42):
Right, That's what gives it the volume. That's what gives
your hair such a volume lift. I've seen you out
of Dragon and I've seen the incredible difference between Roy
and Bianca, And what I want to know is, what
do you want the people to know about Bianca? What
do you want the people to know about Roy? And
what don't you want them to know?
Speaker 1 (22:01):
Oh but Beyonnes, it's just trying to remind people that
you have to find humor and everything, and that I
don't take myself seriously. And we've gotten to this point,
I think because of social media, where everything is so
matter of fact and everyone else is too quick to say.
You can't say this, you can't say fuck you. I
can say whatever I want, and you can also say
(22:21):
I don't like it. That doesn't mean that I change
my ways or try to adapt for you. And I
think out of drag is to realize that this is
not my identity, this is my job, and I take
it very seriously when it comes to being professionals, showing
up and delivering. And I like work, so I do
enjoy being on the road and touring and doing shows.
But it's not my identity. So I don't live and
(22:43):
breathe this. And I know that there's an expiration date
on this, you know. So I don't lose myself and
that fantasy, nor do I think that I'm fancy or
better than anybody else. It's just like, hey, this is
my monkey suit, this is my job.
Speaker 3 (22:56):
It makes sense to me, and anything you would have
said makes sense to me, you know. But I did
this fantastic kind of in depth interview with Murray Hill.
You know that.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Oh yeah, I love Murray.
Speaker 3 (23:05):
I love Murray. I love him.
Speaker 2 (23:07):
He's the best.
Speaker 3 (23:08):
And I was kind of a little scared because, you know,
I don't know if Murray has a different identity, Like
Murray wakes up and that's who that person is. And
he constructed all of that. And I was so inspired
by that, I have to tell you, because I thought like, well,
what if I get bored of Isaac soon, I could
just do that. I could create a whole new move
(23:29):
somewhere and become like, you know, some crazy right, and
yes when I ask you about that, and you make
a lot of sense. But again today you don't really know.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
No, No, Murray.
Speaker 1 (23:40):
Murray and I we had met years ago in New
York City and then we had worked together and I
was in the same boat. I didn't know where we
stood professionally, because you know, as drag queens.
Speaker 2 (23:50):
I guess it's for me.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
It was my norm, you know, being around drag queens
and knowing how to work with you know, chaotic gay
men in a wig. But there was you know, Murray
who was a drag king, which was all new to
me and I had never really worked and we had
the best time doing a benefit show together, and then
we stayed in touch obviously through the years, and then
this past year we were able to do a show
for Hulu together where Murray was the host and I
(24:14):
was a judge and dinner and we had the best
time needed the with Neil Patrick, Neil, Miss Neil.
Speaker 3 (24:22):
Who's a heart. I do love Ben I love him switch,
Oh my god. All of that cast. Wasn't Bend de
la Creme on that Benda la Creme was.
Speaker 1 (24:30):
On Jins Monsoon was on. I mean, all the girls,
all the girls we know.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Well, speaking of Benda la Creme, we did a podcast
a few months ago and he, at the end of
the thing he said, you know, I want to just
do this till I die. I want to be a
drag queen till I die. And yet you said this
is an expiration day.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
I read an expiration I mean, I guess it's mainly
because starting out in New Orleans and then working in
New York and doing bars every night, and then getting
to do drag race, and then getting.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
To travel the world.
Speaker 1 (24:58):
You go, all right, this has been a lovely progression
thirty years in the making. But in the end of it,
you also have to be realistic with yourself because it
requires so much that I often think performing sure, I
may perform in drag questionable. So that's what I mean
by that is to not think this is it and
I can only live off of it.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
No, we'll see.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
I mean I've done stuff out of drag as well.
Obviously this is still enjoyable. But when it's not, I
don't plan to beat a dead horse. I don't want
to be propped up.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
So so Lady Bunny will be nowhere in the picture
to be what you're saying. No, no, I'm sorry, I'm sorry.
We're going to get to that at about one second.
But I want to talk about you for a minute.
What was your big was your big break? Drag race?
Was that?
Speaker 1 (25:42):
Well, I think you roll through life right, and you
don't really know. I often say I don't know what
I want, but I know what I don't want. So
you experience something and you think to myself, Yeah, of course, yes,
I would love to be rich, I would love to
be famous. But what I learned early on was that, yeah,
that's a pipe dream and that's here.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
But work is what matters, whatever the work is.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
So I was slepping around doing drag, bingo to alcoholics
at three in the afternoon.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Oh, then you were doing every possible show there was.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
You're doing a show on a Wednesday night at one
am for people that hate to do. And then I
went to New York and I was working at a
Broadway costume house. Costumes and fanfare were always my fat,
my passion, I say. So that was just being in
that world and then I thought, you know what, I
don't want to do drag anymore. This is two thousand
and five, I'm thinking, you know what, I could wrap
this up. And then I went and saw some horrible
drag queens in New York and I thought, oh god,
(26:29):
this is what they're delivering.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
Oh, I can't give up now, So I started.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
I started working then in New York, and the balance
was day job eight thirty to five and then doing
shows in the middle of the night. And that was
my routine for quite a while, and I thought, okay,
I could wrap this up at forty.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
I'm thinking forty. I had a good run.
Speaker 1 (26:49):
The struggle was kind of crazy, just trying to keep
the schedule. You're like, what am I really doing? Like
this is not fulfilling as much as I want it
to be. And then the opportunity for Drag Race came along,
and I had seen some of my friends that were
not that talented have success on the show, so.
Speaker 2 (27:03):
I thought, let me, let me try this out.
Speaker 1 (27:06):
So I auditioned, and I told one person I auditioned,
I got it in two weeks. I had to be there,
and then it just kind of snowballed from there. Not
knowing what the bigger picture was, I just kind of thought,
I'll go and let's see what this exposure is. But
I think all of the bad gigs, all of those
drunk people at Bingo at three pm, kind of prepared
me for what was to come, which in the end
(27:28):
was still the same game, which is to work and
to ride the wave of what it is and realize
that's what it's about. It's not sitting back and eating
bond bonds. It's the hustle of creating and still going
and as long as you're enjoying it, it's important. So
it was kind of like opportunity hitting and then wow,
you're out into the world and just ran with it,
which was ten years ago now, but.
Speaker 3 (27:49):
Now it's like ten solid years of success, right, Well,
what this.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Is the years of working? You measured the success based
on what is success?
Speaker 2 (27:57):
You know, is it your.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
Opinion of what you've done that you're proud of, or
the reviews and the accolades. I mean, I've been able
to pay my rent, I was able to buy a house,
you know, that kind of stuff I got. That's a
beautiful thing that's for me. That's still great. But also
I'm still enjoying it, which I think is crazy. You
have moments when you pinch yourself and you go what
the fuck am I doing here?
Speaker 3 (28:17):
Like?
Speaker 1 (28:17):
How am I talking to you? It's like all of
the craziness that kind of comes with it. But I
think all of the insanity before drag Race is what
made me appreciate what I have now.
Speaker 3 (28:27):
Right, what a great answer. On this podcast sometimes I
talk about like failures and setbacks because I always think, like,
that's what you learn from.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
You know, without a doubt, if you don't have a
bad show, how do you know you have a good one?
Speaker 3 (28:40):
Oh my god?
Speaker 1 (28:41):
For me, I'm on the road and you're doing one
hundred and twenty nine shows, and do you think every
one of them went successfully?
Speaker 2 (28:46):
Hell?
Speaker 3 (28:47):
No.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
But when you're there and you're in the moment, I
think to myself, Okay, this is going downhill, but you
just keep plowing through it and in the end you
can sit back and go, girl, that was a shit show.
But now you've got material for the next three weeks
talking about that show. I know.
Speaker 3 (29:01):
And you know, what's funny, no matter how shitty you
think the show is, like somehow like it goes over
completely a funny thing, and then you see a tape
of it and you go, that was a shitty show.
That's really fucking good, Like I've noticed that. Have you
noticed that?
Speaker 2 (29:15):
Without a doubt. I think it's also your own level
of what you think is right or wrong. And it's
good to have standards when it comes to my work.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
I do.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
Obviously in real life I don't, But when it comes
to work, I think, all right, you have your own standard,
and to you, I have an assistant who hates me,
doesn't think I'm funny, doesn't think I'm pretty, and would
never lie to me about that.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
So that's not like my See, we all need one.
We all need one. So I say, you know, well
that was shit.
Speaker 1 (29:42):
He'll go yeah, or yeah I could have been better
or whatever, and you go okay. Then I'm not completely
crazy because sometimes if you add, oh it was great,
it was amazing, and you go, m didn't feel it.
But I often think as a drag queen, I go ooh,
got away with murder, dodge that bullet. So I think
self awareness as I'm dressed like this, awareness is important
and I try to keep that in my head.
Speaker 3 (30:03):
And the thing about you as a performer, I'm sure,
I'm sure you're like obsessively collecting jokes. I'm obsessively jotting
down things like any good person who tells jokes. But
I think a lot occurs to you in the moment.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
Is that true without a doubt? Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
I think what was funny is that in the beginning,
as I was saying doing a bingo for drunk.
Speaker 2 (30:25):
People, here are a group of people that are alcoholics.
Speaker 1 (30:28):
So if you're drinking at three pm at a bar,
you've got an issue. And I don't mean that you
can't drink at three pm, but you've chosen to go
out to have that cocktail in broad daylight consistently every Thursday,
Friday and Saturday when I'm there, and I'm there with
the job of having to do bingo. Now, if you're
an alcoholic, the last thing you want is a drag
queen with a.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
Microphone calling out bingo numbers.
Speaker 1 (30:50):
But this is the mix, so in it you had
to deal with what's in front of you. And then
when I got to New York and people started calling
me a because I never thought of it that way.
I was just dodging bullets and making money that I thought, Oh,
as a comedian, you're supposed to have rehearsed material or
written jokes or a complete thing and I did that
(31:12):
for a minute, but I found that my joy came
from people and interacting and that's where I became more
fearless and it was easier to keep that fresh and
to keep that as part of my technique, so to speak.
So I've gone back to that now as a real
adult and realize, oh, that's what I do.
Speaker 3 (31:31):
That's the sacred thing. That's the sacred thing, right, because
like you said a lot, you're gonna be very prepared,
I think as a performer, like, unless you're prepared, you
just won't sleep the wing right, because do you get
stage fright?
Speaker 2 (31:44):
No?
Speaker 1 (31:45):
I get antsy, but I don't get stage fright. You
know what's crazy is that being backstage and overthinking is
where my brain just goes crazy. So you know, I pace,
I get into the zone, my brain starts thinking, all right,
this is what I have in front of me now,
and then when you go out there, all bets are
off because you don't know what's going to happen.
Speaker 3 (32:03):
And what about Because you were talking earlier that as Roy,
you sometimes used to perform.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
Or dom I'm not picking, I'll do anything.
Speaker 3 (32:11):
Does Roy get more stage fright than Bianca? Something? Because
you don't have the armor.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
You know, It's crazy. It's that adrenaline you get on stage.
I think I've gotten so used to being Bianca that
it's hard sometimes if I'm doing something where I'm not
Bianca to not use the mannerisms or the tone or
the voice.
Speaker 3 (32:27):
Got it.
Speaker 2 (32:28):
So I do have to think about it a little more.
I have to be a little more.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
Prepared, Darling, I'm embarrassed. I watch so much Dragra. Oh
you do, I am so oh queen. I watch literally,
like Philippine, you watch all the Franks. I watch it.
I do, I do so much. I really like it,
(32:52):
and some of those challenges it's so cringey, like when
they're trying to be spontaneous and they're trying and then
there's you you know, well it's like, what is that?
What is that spark? Darling.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
Well, it's a different setup.
Speaker 1 (33:05):
Also, like I said, we did the show ten years
ago and the season before me was jinx Monsoon, So we.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
Were a different beasts.
Speaker 1 (33:12):
Back then and it was a different vibe. And now
you have queens that grew up with the show that
are doing drag because of the show where all of
us kind of had a life and work ethic and
schlupped in those bars and found out who we were,
had time to develop who we were, and then went
on the show. So that's a different game. And that's
not to say, oh, you have to be old. I
(33:33):
mean Jinks Monsoon. Her first time around was twenty three,
I think twenty five. Yeah, but she's just one of
those well that's what you know, Well, you know she's
she looks forty eight. But yes, she's brilliantly talented, but
also was well developed in what she was doing, which
I think now it's kind of like, Ooh, I want
to be famous, Ooh I want to wear a wig.
Speaker 2 (33:51):
I know a lot of musical theater.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
Actors who started doing drag because of drag Race and
have gone on the show and tampered in it. But
it's a different world or me than it was for them.
Speaker 3 (34:01):
It's so fascinating to me because it's not to say
that Jan or something who has a very big musical
theater background like you, you know, like me. Right, she's
a great performer, just in a completely, utterly totally.
Speaker 1 (34:16):
You yeah, completely, And what I think people are concerned with,
or maybe the younger queens in general, or what the
show has become now is that everyone feels that they
need to be all one type, or to be liked
by everyone, or to do the acceptable thing.
Speaker 2 (34:30):
And I don't live in that world.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
So the chaos and the madness on social media or
people's opinions doesn't affect me because like other people that
like me like me. But I'm not gonna tone it down.
I'm not gonna soften my makeup. I'm not gonna not curse.
That's just who I am.
Speaker 3 (34:45):
Well wait a minute, you say that. Do you ever
get nervous about you? That make you a little scared?
Does it get you into trouble?
Speaker 2 (34:51):
Well, I think it depends on who you ask.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
You can look at something and someone will say, well
I think this, I think that, or you shouldn't say this,
or you should say that. That's just the world we live.
But the people that don't like you are never going
to like you anyway. But thanks to social media, you
just see it. Whereas normally back in the day, someone
would have to walk up to you and say, Isaac,
your collection with shit and I wrote in the newspaper
and this is what it is.
Speaker 2 (35:13):
That's when you dealt with it. Now it's kind of like.
Speaker 1 (35:15):
Somebody who just doesn't like your face is going to
say I think this, I think that.
Speaker 2 (35:19):
And you're like, what the fuck is that?
Speaker 1 (35:21):
I don't live my life by some phantom faggot online.
Speaker 3 (35:24):
I want to talk about this because I have a
whole bunch of questions about how you perceive social media.
You have what like a million two million followers on Instagram.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
Well, for me, it's a business. You know, I have
a Instagram for Bianca. It's not my real life. I
think the most personal you'll get on there is is
my dogs. I don't live my life or going look
how I live. Some things you need to keep to yourself.
But for me, it's a business. You know, I'm out
there promoting. I have a show going, I'm about to
go on the road. This is what it's about. But
I don't live in the phone. If I'm at an airport,
(35:57):
I've got ample time to tweet. That's when it happens.
Speaker 2 (35:59):
I don't.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
I don't spend my day going, oh, I've got to
post this or ooh I've got a no.
Speaker 3 (36:04):
Right and that's it. Right, Like, you don't go on
there and express yourself and go like I think about
this political thing, and I think about that thing in
that world because you can't.
Speaker 1 (36:14):
Win, and the crazy thing with it is is just
the idea. Nothing gets solved in the comment section, so
you have to find some sense of balance. When someone says, oh,
you should say this and you should say that, well sure,
but also there's a group of people that are going
shut the fuck up, drag queen.
Speaker 2 (36:28):
You don't know anything about what's going on.
Speaker 1 (36:30):
So it's a slippery slope because often you'll say, as
you know, Leonardo DiCaprio, you should speak up about this,
and then when he talks, you're like, what are you now?
You know you live in a different world. So it
is tricky. It is tricky. I do have opinions, I
do have beliefs, but I don't use my platform to
discuss all of this madness in the world.
Speaker 2 (36:48):
It's never ending.
Speaker 3 (36:49):
And now if someone trolls and they say, shit, it's
too honey. I love problem, except I know you do.
But at first, did you always was there a moment
when you went like, oh my god, this person is
coming for you would never see.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
Because it's not real life, Isaac.
Speaker 1 (37:03):
I mean, you know it's not real life, but so
so so for me honestly, as I said, three PM alcoholics,
drag BINGO.
Speaker 2 (37:12):
Nothing scares me.
Speaker 1 (37:13):
Like, let's be real here, So some little bitch is
gonna say, oh I think this about you?
Speaker 2 (37:19):
Who the fuck cares?
Speaker 3 (37:21):
Darling. It took me a minute to get over, like
the people online going, you know, shut your mouth, we
don't want to hear from you. Really come back to
like blah blah.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
Oh really they came for you.
Speaker 3 (37:32):
Oh yes, of course. But I have turned a corner now,
I'm like you Now, I'm like, bring it on, bring
them on a little You have to know a little
teeny bit.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
You have to also look at it and realize that
it's nothing they would ever say to your fucking face. Ever,
so what's the point of even engaging with them? Now,
On occasion, I've had a drink and I will troll back.
This is my ultimate favorite thing I like to do, Isaac.
I like to troll people that are friends of mine
because as a drag, queen, trolley or being a cunt
to one another is a form of affection. You know,
(38:03):
I have many of my friends that are rotted, hateful individuals,
from Coco Peru to Lady Bunny, who all we do
is say scathing things about each other. But my thing
I like to do is sometimes when I have a moment,
I will wake up, let's say about six am, and
I will get online on Twitter, and I will just
say the most rotted things about people that are friends
(38:23):
of mine, and I will just hit them, like six
or seven of them, or they write some heartfelt speech
about I'm living my best life and it's important for me,
and you're just like, okay, that's my tweet. Okay, Like
who the fuck cares I do about ten of them?
And then I turn off my phone and then I
wait till about ten o'clock, eleven o'clock at night, Palm springs.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
I'm in bed. I open the phone and.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
I cackle at the responses because everybody's fighting with each
other about some stupid shit I said about a friend
of mine, and the people like, you can't say that
about her, and I'm.
Speaker 3 (38:54):
Like, it is, but think about it.
Speaker 1 (38:56):
If the bitch I'm talking about doesn't have a problem
with it.
Speaker 2 (38:59):
Who the fuck are you to tell me?
Speaker 3 (39:01):
I can't say that, right of course, But Darling, this
is like some kind of ironic art and season you're
talking about. Forget like social media that is like I want,
I like, I want to subscribe to that. Darling. While
we're here on the subject, do let's talk about how
you think social media has changed Jag.
Speaker 1 (39:23):
I think with everything there's good and bad. It's like, yes,
it's introduced me to a larger audience. It's got a
bunch of people that are aware of what I'm doing
and what I'm doing. You know, back in the day,
you would have a flyer about where you were and
where you were performing.
Speaker 3 (39:38):
Ah, God, I remembered them. I saved everything the flyers.
Speaker 1 (39:42):
And then you also were like featured in the Gay Rag,
you know, the magazine. You were excited if you were
on the cover, you were elated if you were in
the back on a casual night out.
Speaker 3 (39:51):
Homo Estra's all of it out.
Speaker 1 (39:53):
So all of that was the way to communicate to
the people that were there. And as I said, with
no phones, you would meet your friend. It was a
night out. You had a good time. So that was
lovely back then. So is it easier now?
Speaker 2 (40:05):
Yes, I can.
Speaker 1 (40:06):
Post about where I'm gonna be and then you sell
tickets and then people show up, so there is a
perk to it. As we said before, the noise from
useless fucking people is annoying if you wrap yourself up
into it, and people say, now, oh, everyone's so hostile,
everyone's so this, and I don't think that's the case.
I think people have been assholes since the beginning of time.
I just think now they have a platform to talk,
(40:27):
so we hear more of it, so it's up to
you to kind of filter it out.
Speaker 3 (40:32):
I'm not even talking about that anymore. I'm talking about
like in the day, you would go see Lipsinca who
like lip synced in such an incredible like she didn't
do split now to choreography, No, no, no, she stood
there and her face from the one hundred and fiftieth
fucking row in the back. You saw that motherfucking face, Okay.
Speaker 2 (40:50):
And she knew everywhere.
Speaker 3 (40:51):
So there's that and it was like art. But it
was also like like yeah, SaaS like the changes and
it was a script and she wrote it. But now
you have a whole world people looking at drag and
you have Sugar and Spice, who actually I love I
was rooting for Sugar and Spice, but you know they
are some social queens like those are something without dag
(41:11):
queens and I don't mind them for a minute, but
you know there are some out there.
Speaker 2 (41:15):
Who I do no truth, No, I see what you're
getting out.
Speaker 1 (41:18):
The style of drag is completely different, and I think
that everybody is trying to be accepted.
Speaker 2 (41:24):
And I had someone say not to me.
Speaker 1 (41:26):
But one of the quotes was that Bianca's not a
real drag queen because she doesn't lip sync, and I
had to think about that. Oh, I thought, well, let's
break it down. It's some stupid bitch who watches drag Race.
Speaker 2 (41:40):
Now listen.
Speaker 1 (41:41):
I love drag Race. It's amazing platform and it worked
lovely for me. Did I lip sync on the show? No,
because what's the purpose of the show.
Speaker 2 (41:49):
Don't lip sync?
Speaker 1 (41:50):
You only had to live when you were bad? So
what the fuck are we discussing? Do I take that
time to talk to someone and say, uh, this is
who I am and this is what it's about.
Speaker 2 (42:00):
You go, No, I do this? You do that?
Speaker 1 (42:03):
I marvel at people that can jump from the top
of the ceiling and fall into a split.
Speaker 2 (42:08):
Can I do that? Hell?
Speaker 3 (42:09):
No?
Speaker 1 (42:09):
Do I think it's impressive? Yes for fifteen minutes, Yes,
do a show for an hour? Entertain me? Give me
more than that.
Speaker 3 (42:17):
No, you're not right, But even more than that, there
are those queens out there who are amazing at social
like they are really good at pictures. And then you're
right like some persons cannot and.
Speaker 1 (42:29):
Some people do benefit from the editing, you know, the
editing can make you a lot more interesting than you are.
But in person, I prefer an act. I prefer a show.
I'm not so much a spectacle. I'm not mad at it,
but I want something with substance.
Speaker 3 (42:52):
Let's talk about something else for like a minute, sure,
and that would be Lady Bunny. Is she a mentor?
Is she a mentor? What is she? Know?
Speaker 1 (42:59):
What's it's crazy is that she was someone that I
had met when I was about twenty in New Orleans.
And remember no social media, no YouTube, so you had
to see their shows. And I marvel at the Sherry Vines,
the Lady Bunny, the Coca Perus, the Jackie Beats, Marla
Jeane Berman that are still performing in the old school way.
These were queens that traveled and I always was so
(43:21):
impressed that, oh my god, people in another town knew
who you were, and you get to go and do
your show there and the gays come and see you,
Like I marveled at that type of fame at that time.
I thought, Wow, they know your name and you're good.
And the fact that all of the people I just
named are still doing it says a lot about their talent.
Are they batshit crazy? Absolutely? Do they want to shoot
(43:43):
me because I did Drag Race?
Speaker 2 (43:45):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (43:45):
Do they want to kill me because I have more
money than they do. Yes, And that's what friendship is.
But all of them I admired in a way, not
so much as a mentor. I don't idolize Bunny for
obvious reasons, but I do know her. I think she's
brilliant at what she does, and to work with her
is like literally working with a tornado, and I live
(44:06):
for it. And we've had some amazing moments, some not
some amazing moments.
Speaker 3 (44:11):
I mean, I have to tell you something like when
you talk because I really want to talk about this
for a second, also known as John Ingall. Oh, yes,
And the thing is like that is like one thing
about drag that I miss just a little bit. I
think you were able to take that into a modern
thing where you just say the most offensive thing in
(44:34):
the entire world, literally she looks at the news and
she goes, what is the most horrible, wretched thing I
can think of to say? And then she says it
on instantly, And like today's standards of drag, you kind
of gotta be a little bit more careful, at least
from the Bunny perspective, cause Bunny just says it.
Speaker 1 (44:51):
But Bunny just says you do too. But Bunny gives
zero fucks and I.
Speaker 3 (44:55):
Think zero zero, and you give like one fuck. Maybe.
Speaker 1 (44:58):
I mean, I mean, I'm a where like there's things
that I would say in a show that I wouldn't
say online because you know what's lacking in the world.
Speaker 2 (45:05):
Context.
Speaker 1 (45:06):
Context doesn't exist anymore. So let's say you've got a phone,
you're at a show. You just take a clip and
let's say you get the punchline. There's no setup, there's
no explaining what we were doing the whole night. Someone
puts it online and then goes defend yourself and you think, well,
what the fuck? Look at the Kathy Griffin situation. Here
was all of this mann is And my thing is
(45:27):
never apologize because what I said in that moment, in
this game.
Speaker 2 (45:31):
Of my show is my show.
Speaker 1 (45:33):
So if you take it out of context, It's impossible,
and I'm not going to try to explain it to
someone else who obviously doesn't like you and already is
out to get you, you know, the cancel side of
it all. So therefore it's very awkward because the context
doesn't exist. You know, Bunny, what she presents online is
a rarity because you've got poop jokes and then you've
got politics, which is crazy. Yes, you just don't know
(45:56):
what you're gonna get with her, So that's a different
vibe than me. So I just think that what I
put out there is what I put out there. You
can like it, you can dislike it, but context is
what makes it makes sense.
Speaker 3 (46:06):
You know, if Kathy Griffin or like Michelle Wolf were
a man, they would be Seinfeld, you know what I mean.
Like there would be absolutely something. But then I think
to myself, like, why am I not a drag? I
would be a.
Speaker 2 (46:18):
Huge Let's do it.
Speaker 3 (46:20):
Let's put on a wig and some makeup. I swear
to you, Queen, I would be such a great drag. Yeah,
you got the making. I don't know why you got
the making. I do, yes, I do. I keep thinking
if only I had a wig, and then I could
really say what's on my fucking.
Speaker 1 (46:35):
I'll get you a good wig and you can do it. Yes,
let's do it. Let's make me right.
Speaker 3 (46:39):
I have one final question for you. I am obsessed
with obituaries. Oh god, right, do you have a sense
of what your obituary will say when you finally actually
drop dead and you're not the living dead for the.
Speaker 1 (46:51):
Rest you know what's interesting? Oh my god, this fell
out of my ear as soon as you said that.
So this is all a sign.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
Let's just see.
Speaker 1 (46:58):
I haven't really thought about it. I am one of
those people. I just recently got all of my stuff.
Speaker 2 (47:04):
I got it all in order. I got all my
stuff in order.
Speaker 1 (47:06):
I now know who's getting what and what's happening. But
I do want to be buried with all my drag.
I want my drag to go with me in a
tomb so that in about one hundred years they can go, oh,
a queen lived here, you know, like like two uncommon
or as we say, I mean, too damn common. I
would like to have all of my shit with you,
because I don't think anybody deserves it. It's my stuff
(47:27):
and I should be able to take it with me
into the afterlife. But I just hope that people go,
you know, the bitch had fun and didn't take it
too serious. And I think that's that's the important thing here.
It's like, look, we're all gonna die, so like, why
be so fucking serious about everything?
Speaker 2 (47:43):
Well?
Speaker 3 (47:43):
What makes you so fatalistic? Darling? What makes you that way?
Is there something about you that's well? I am dead
inside already, right of course we all are, But like,
what makes you so fatalistic? I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (47:58):
I think it's just setting because a lot of this
isn't reality that I just kind of go, yeah, it's
gonna happen.
Speaker 3 (48:05):
And fearless. What makes you all? Right? That's it? We're
no you. But is there something you dread or something
that makes you afraid? Like do you wake up at
three o'clock in the morning? Arden?
Speaker 2 (48:14):
But stupid shit? See that shit?
Speaker 1 (48:16):
You know, like oh did I comb that wig? Oh
did I cut the threads hanging off of a costume?
That makes me crazy? Those type of things make me nuts.
But the bigger picture, I can't worry about that shit.
A flight is delayed, What am I.
Speaker 3 (48:26):
Going to paying a mortgage? You're not working?
Speaker 2 (48:28):
The mortgage.
Speaker 1 (48:29):
Yeah, like, you know, I don't live extravagantly, so I
know I can cover that. Like if it all ended tomorrow,
not death, but just the game of it.
Speaker 2 (48:37):
I go, all right, I'll be all right. I mean,
I might be.
Speaker 1 (48:40):
Miss Havisham walking around the house in old wigs thinking
about my past life, but you accept.
Speaker 2 (48:45):
That this is what it is. You can't live in
that crazy world.
Speaker 3 (48:48):
No, you really can't. Okay, So what do you want
to promote on this podcast?
Speaker 1 (48:51):
Oh? Well, I'm promoting that I am going on the road.
So starting in February of twenty twenty four, I'm starting
my new tour of a new show.
Speaker 2 (48:58):
Called Dead Inside. It's my comedy tour.
Speaker 1 (49:01):
We just announced sixty dates in Canada in the USA
and I'll be out till May, and then obviously we'll
be going to the UK, We'll be going to Australia.
Speaker 2 (49:08):
Be going to Asia.
Speaker 1 (49:09):
This is my sixth world tour and I'm looking forward
to I'll be on the road till twenty twenty five.
So for all ticket information and all that matters, you
can go to Thebianca del Rio dot com social media.
Speaker 3 (49:21):
Wait a minute, who watches your dog?
Speaker 1 (49:23):
Well, you have enemy stucksitter in Los Angeles, who's been
the best, and she takes them and she gives me
the updates, like they pooped today, we had breakfast, another
beautiful morning. She's one of those people. So I've been
very blessed to have her. But my dog is eighteen
years old. So honestly when I got him, well, I
had two. I just recently lost one. But after all
these years, I didn't think this was going to be
(49:45):
my life. So they've been with me from New York
to Los Angeles to here. So it's kind of that
thing where I'm like, I'm grateful that they've been there,
and it's so hard when you lose them because they've
just been literally eighteen years of your life. Luckily, I
have somebody who loves them as much as I do,
which is.
Speaker 3 (50:00):
That's very lucky. Yes, very lucky. Okay, well, you are
a dream boat. I love you. I love you, love
you art. Thank you so much. We'll sing you soon.
Speaker 2 (50:08):
Thank you for chatting boom.
Speaker 3 (50:17):
Oh my goddess, I am exhausted. That was like the
most fun I've had since I went to drunken drag
bingo in you know, nineteen ninety two or something, you know.
I didn't know what to expect from that interview, but
immediately it was just fun and there were some incredibly
illuminating moments. And I really hope that everyone got the
(50:40):
joy that I got from that interview, because I think
it's something that is so needed in the world right now.
We need this kind of humor, we need this kind
of freedom and this kind of expression. And that's what's
so great about drag queens. Man. They really do, for
the most part, express themselves and know more than Bianca
(51:01):
del Rio. Anyway, I hope you got that, and I
hope you catch me on episode three of RuPaul's Drag Race,
coming out this January on MTV. Darlings, you do not
want to miss it. You do not want to miss
this season. All I can say is, having been there
in person with those queens, it's a really fun, exciting
(51:23):
cast and it's going to be a fun exciting season.
Trust a queen, trust me, darlings. If you enjoyed this episode,
do me a favor and tell someone, Tell a friend,
tell your mother, tell your cousin, tell everyone you know. Okay,
and be sure to rate the show. I love rating stuff.
(51:46):
Go on and rate and review the show on Apple
Podcasts so more people can hear about it. It makes
such a gigantic difference and like it takes a second,
so go on and do it. And if you want
more fun content videos and posts of all kinds, follow
the show on Instagram and TikTok at Hello Isaac podcast
(52:09):
and by the way, check me out on Instagram and
TikTok at I Am Isaac Msrahi. This is Isaac Misrahi,
Thank you, I love you, and I never thought I'd
say this, but goodbye Isaac. Hello Isaac is produced by
Imagine Audio Awfully Nice and I AM Entertainment for iHeartMedia.
(52:33):
The series is hosted by Me Isaac Msrahi. Hello Isaac
is produced by Robin Gelfenbein. The senior producers are Jesse
Burton and John Assanti, and is executive produced by Ron Howard,
Brian Grazer, Caral Welker, and Nathan Kloke at Imagine Audio.
Production management from Katie Hodges, Sound design and mixing by
(52:55):
Cedric Wilson. Original music composed by Ben Waltz. A special
thanks to me, Bill Phelps and Sarah Katanac at I
AM Entertainment m
So I was using the name marvel Am and a
friend of mine was like, girl, you need to get
a real name.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
She goes, you.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Remind me of my friend Bianca. So I think Bianca
del Rio is the perfect name. I'm like, great, whatever,
She's like, I want you to know that Bianca was
a dear friend of mine and she had passed away,
and you remind me a lot of her.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
I said, Oh, that's lovely. Cut to Isaac.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Eighteen years later, I win Drag Race and I'm at
the airport going through my phone call. Everyone's saying congratulations, congratulations.
And here was that bitch, Nikki Rich, my good friend,
who says to me, congratulations, bitch, I'm glad you won.
By the way, Bianca is not dead. She lives in
Florida and she's pissed.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Eighteen years later, this is.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Hello Isaac, my podcast about the idea of success and
how failure affects it. I'm Isaac Msrahi, and in this
episode I talked to drag queen comedian actor and RuPaul's
Drag Race season six winner, Bianca del Rio.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Hello, Isaac, it's Bianca del Rio and I'm sure that
you're probably really, really busy. That's why you're not taking
my call. But I really need to speak with you soon.
I had a situation at Fire Island.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Call me immediately.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
I need your help.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
Happy New Year. We're kicking off twenty twenty four in
a big way with today's guest, Bianca del Rio. Now,
going into this interview, I'm expecting something very exciting, frankly,
because in advance, I got a notice that Bianca will
(01:36):
be Bianca. She'll be in full drag and full makeup,
and she asked to be referred to as Bianca only.
So the thing about Bianca is I know that there's
a big difference between who she is in dragon out
of drags. So this is going to be fascinating to
see what I can get out of her, what she
(01:58):
doesn't want to talk about, what she feels vulnerable about.
And I'm kind of eager to get started. So joining,
Oh my god, Bianca del Rio, seriously like this is
one of the great moments of my life.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
I mean, this is the most exciting thing to happen
to you. You need to get out more, Isaac. I
must tell.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Her, wait a minute, Well, you're so right, You're so right.
I do need to get out. But honey, you are gorgeous. Well,
it's a lot of very up close, it's a lot
of layers. It's a lot of like, how do you
get that off? It's funny you ask. I have a
makeup remover called the Bianca Remover, and anything with a
coconut oil base can remove all this madness. Because a
lot of my drag queen friends from Drag Race all
(02:41):
have makeup lines, right, I thought, who was gonna buy
makeup from an ugly bitch? So I thought the best
thing to do is if I did a remover, someone
would look at my face and go, well, if it
takes that shit off, it will work for my mescara,
it will work.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
For my eyeliner. So I use anything cocone oil base.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
But I also had this product called the the Bianca Remover,
which is great. It's like a little pad and it
just wipes all of it away, takes away the clown
and you become a man.
Speaker 3 (03:06):
Well wait a second, Like this is a big process
that you go through every day when you work right, Well,
it gets easier and easier, I know, but still, darling.
I've been in a few shows where I have to
wear it a little makeup and certain kind of a
costume or whatever it is, and I find that to
be somehow like constricting. And you know, I switz, I
sweat a lot.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Oh really, you know youadwe body sweater, Darling.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
I'm embarrassed to say I am a full on head
and body sweat.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Interesting, Okay, okay, I am.
Speaker 3 (03:35):
I mean Judy Garland was, remember she did all those monologues, Darling,
or sweat and my hair it just came lower and lower.
You know that? Amazing? Exactly exactly. Well, anyway, tell me
about what that's like, sort of putting on all those
layers and then performing under all of that weight.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
You know, it's crazy. It becomes the norm, it becomes
what you do. And frankly, for me, it's kind of
like the armor. If I didn't have all of it on,
I would feel kind of crazy. Like if I'm not
wearing heels like right now, it is a different feeling.
But if I was on stage in a flat shoe,
which is a big issue in the drag world, and
I refuse to go to orthopedic drag shoes, but if
(04:15):
you're forced to do that, it does throw you off.
Like literally, my body feels different in a corset. My
body feels different when I'm uncomfortable, and maybe that's why
I'm such a bitch, because the packaging makes me really,
really uncomfortable.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Like if I was a white woman in the real world,
i'd be.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
A Karen, But on stage it's called comedys, so basically
I'm used to it.
Speaker 3 (04:34):
Do you know Veronica Web is Veronica Web. You are
a sabulous supermodel and we're very close friends. But I remember,
like in the day when I used to do these
big fashion shows and she'd say to me, Darling, I
will not struggle behind in flats. I will not do
that this time, because you know, I like a flat
I sometimes I.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Like it appropriate for me. My big issue with drag
queens it's not so much the shoe. I mean, I go,
all right, I get it, you might be older, your
feet might be tired. As long as it matches, I'm
not too mad. But the big issue for me is earrings.
Lack of earrings. You've got a big man face, You've
got all this crap on, and you don't have anything
to soften.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Like, nobody's pretty enough to not have on an earring.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
There is no excuse put on an earring and if
you've got a matching bracelet, you're my friend.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
And yet today, Darling, I hope you notice what's happening
in fashion and how all of that is kind of
coming up in size, Like you can go out there now.
It's almost like you can't find giant earrings. You can
only find giant, like draggy kind of earrings. Yes, there,
and jewelry and shoes everybody wants to look now, very
very dragged up.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
You know, Thank you kardash It's really the truth.
Speaker 3 (05:40):
I know. Well, excuse me, thank you, fucking Bianca del Rio, Darling.
Can I do a little history about you? Let's do
a little do it.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
Let's do it.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
Where are you from?
Speaker 1 (05:49):
I'm originally born and raised in New Orleans, Louisiana, So
that that alone is a setup for issues in your life.
Because New Orleans is an amazing place to be from.
It's a party town, a lot of food, it's relaxed,
I should say. And I knew at a certain age,
I knew I got to get the fuck out of
here because I knew it wasn't my place. They're my people,
(06:11):
but it wasn't my place. So I grew up there
left there, then went to New York, and then went
to Los Angeles. And when you become a gay of
a certain age, you moved to Palm Springs. And the
reason I'm in Palm Springs is because it's cheaper than
plastic surgery. You ain't gonta do shit to your face.
You come here, you're young. Compared to the people here,
I'm young.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
It's like Miami for the Julie. Yes, if you were Jewish,
you'd be in Miami totally.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
And with these earrings, I belong in Boca.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
But yes, I've just moved around, and then you find
the place that works for you at that time in
your life.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
Right except Darling, Like, you know, you're in Louisiana and
it's a little town. It's not exactly like a pea town, right,
it was a little great.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
Was born and then I lived in New Orleans, in
the French Quarter where the gays migrate. So I was
there for many, many years.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
But as a little child that spoke to you, like,
how did you discover this whole obsession.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
With with dragon? Well, you know, it's funny. It didn't
start out with drag. It started out with pretty things
on television. I came from a time where I was
watching reruns because I'm not that old, but it reruns
with the Carol Burnett Show. Anything Bob Mackie of course
was glittery and exciting, and I never really thought I
wanted to be a drag queen. It all started with
with costumes, you know, theater and someone saying, hey can
(07:26):
you sew?
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Sure? Hey can you do hair?
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Sure? Can you do makes last always? And then it
ended up kind of look becoming the game. I said
yes to everything, and it just kind of snowballed and evolved.
So drag happened because I kind of had the makings
to do drag.
Speaker 3 (07:42):
And somehow you're like madly talented, you're hilariously funny. That's
an amazing thing. What brought all of that out?
Speaker 2 (07:49):
I think it's.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
Being told no, or being told you're not supposed to
do that. So, for instance, when someone would say that's
not what a boy would do or that's not the
right thing to do, I would go but it's the
first thing I think of, you know, it's what comes
to my mind. So I think being told no quite often,
but yet a couple of people would laugh, or even
the people telling me no, we're laughing, going you're not right,
(08:14):
but you're right. It just kind of evolved from that,
and I think coming from where I was coming from,
I knew, Okay, if they're not getting me, then I
need to go someplace where they will get me. So
that's what kind of shifted my life.
Speaker 3 (08:28):
Did you do drag as a little boy in Louisiana? Oh?
Speaker 1 (08:31):
No, No, I did drag a New Orleans. I did
drag a New Orleans. I think I started I was twenty,
so it was like nineteen ninety six, and it evolved then,
but it was through theater because that's where it was acceptable.
You know, you can be a lady on stage and
ha ha ha ha ha.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
You know. It wasn't the lifestyle I speak.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
And as you mentioned earlier, Louisiana is like a party town. Yeah,
did you go to parties? Did you go to drag parties? Well?
Speaker 2 (08:53):
It was the night life, you know, so imagine.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
I mean, you know what it was like in the
years where there was no social media. You said I'm
going out with my gay friends. I'll meet you at ten.
You had to meet at ten or they thought you died.
There was no phones, so you would go out at
ten pm and you would be out till five am.
And that was the life, you know. And I was
lucky enough amongst all my friends that while I was
(09:16):
out living that life, I was also getting paid because
I was in drag.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
So that kind of turned into my life.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
You know, which was being out, being seen and being
a part of the scene.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
Let's talk a little bit more about that, because I
felt that as a fashion designer that was rather important
to go out constantly. And I was out there darling.
I loved it. And I wasn't exactly in drag. I
was wearing clothes that I would make myself that was
slightly outrageous. That's how I used to get into those
clubs all the time when I was fourteen years old.
Like it performing our high school. We went out and
(09:48):
we dressed ourselves, and I dressed my friends. You use
the word gay, Are you gay? Are you any say?
How do you tell me? No?
Speaker 2 (09:57):
I mean world now?
Speaker 3 (09:59):
Yes, I often, yes, we are. We're in a different world.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
And say I was called a faggot before I ever
suck to dick.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
So I yes, yes, I don't have a wife, I
have no children.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
I'm never on the fence about anything.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
So, yes, this is my world, and I think the
gay thing kind of came secondary to all of it,
which was funny because as a child, you know, you're
called names and you're called gay, which a then was
like what do you mean, I'm gay? Oh my god,
it's a hurtful word. But as an adult it was secondary.
Speaker 3 (10:29):
You know.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
I was a performer, I was an actor. I was
a drag queen. Oh, by the way, I'm gay.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
I was always introduced as a clown before I was
introduced as a gay man, ye see.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
And so like it's extremely nuanced nowadays, yes, right, Like
what you do has gone from what it started as,
which as far as I remember, you know, in the
day with like Bunny yes, and with Flotilla God yes,
Barry Humphreys, you know, like really miss Lipsenka, Yeah, who
was I think one of the great.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Brilliants who has ever ever lirilliant?
Speaker 3 (11:01):
And it used to be a very good friend of mine,
John Eperson. But that was an illusion that was a
man dressed. It was a female illusionists, right, that's what
drag was. And now it's so nuanced, you know, and
you can't go, oh, well, i'm gay or she's this
or there, that, or the pronouns or whatever it is.
Talk about that, darling, talk a little about this.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
It's completely different from when I came up.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
I mean, as you said, before, all of us were female.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
I say, female delusionists was the packaging to get away
with murder. But I think we all knew where we
stood now at the time. When I was starting out,
there were groups of queens. They were the clown queens.
They were the dance and queens. And then there were
the trans showgirls who were the goddesses of the time.
You know, in New York is someone like Candace Caane,
(11:48):
you would go, oh my god, just.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
E most person a man, popopular, etc.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
The maglist.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
And I never said to myself I'm in that league,
nor did I say I want to be that. I
was called a clown by those people early on, which
I think was the catalyst for me just to go, okay,
this is my lane. Where now drag is for everyone?
And I often say, yes, drag is for everyone. You
can do whatever you want. That doesn't mean you belong
on a stage. It's like a pretty person.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
Being an actor. Girl, girl, let's talk to Ryan Murphy. Girl.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
So in the end, it was a different route for me.
So I kind of stayed in my lane. And so
now to see that there are no lanes and there
is no discussion about who can do water, who can't
do what. It's for everyone and everyone's everybody lovely.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
But it wasn't that way for us.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
I mean, in my day, the gays didn't even like
the drag queens. You know, in New Orleans, you were
looked down upon if you were a drag queen, and
you also weren't allowed in certain bars.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
In New Orleans.
Speaker 1 (12:47):
There were a couple of bars that if you went
in drag you would be escorted out, which is completely crazy.
And now I can pass those bars, and then the
first people to say, girl, can I get a selfie?
Speaker 2 (12:57):
I'm like, woof the times have changed.
Speaker 3 (12:59):
Well now I talk about this a lot because our past.
I think you're significantly younger than eighty forty eight. I'm
not forty eight.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
Look, I'm not you.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
Look I'm trying. I'm trying. But I often look back
on my personal history and I'm not boohooing, but I'm
going It wasn't so easy being totalated and being bullied,
et cetera. Et cetera. But I wouldn't trade it because
it made me something, It made me an artist.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
Agreed, Agreed. That is what I tell everyone.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
I mean, I get so sick of the woe is
me bullshit and some queen saying my life was so horrible,
and I found my voice and dragged shut the fuck up.
Speaker 3 (13:37):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
The thing is it doesn't resonate with me because the
last thing I want is someone to go, oh my god,
she's had such a hard life.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
Let's go see her show. That's the worst.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
Way, now, the worst worst, Like, let's.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Go see poor little Isaac's collection because the world hated him.
Speaker 3 (13:53):
Ow, it's exactly.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
So I often say, look, what my life is is
my life. And maybe because of social media, maybe because
of reality shows and all of that madness where you
have to have this story that tongues on everybody's heart strings.
That was never part of my drag persona. As you
were saying, you know, everybody has, I guess say, their armor,
their shield, their character they're presenting. So it was never
a part of it. So I get grossed out when
(14:18):
I have to hear it.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
I just it's just my.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
Thing, one thing that's making me very happy these days
is that people who are transitioning, people who are finding
their identity, are less scared to do totally. That's making
me very very happy, I will say, because you remember
in the day when people would come out on TV
or they would talk about how they were transitioning, and
there were always tears and fear and dread, of course,
(14:44):
because in those days it was just so difficult. But
what I like so much now is that there is like, hooray,
I'm actually finding who I am and a few tiers
of few tears.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
So I think that's a different route, you know.
Speaker 1 (14:56):
I think what society has done, it's just made it
seem that okay.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Originally, if you were in drag.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
Someone would say you wanted to be a woman, and
I'm like, no, that's not what I wanted to do.
So I never dismiss anyone's trans story or trans journey.
That is a different ball of wax. Now, sometimes drag
is involved because the evolution of drag in their life
maybe led.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Them to these options and choices.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
That was never my thing, So I always had to
be clear with people and say no, I enjoy being
a male, a gay male who happens to wear heels
and all of this. But when this comes off, I'm myself,
whereas other people they find their identity or find their
way or searching for their identity. So I often say,
I like to clarify that what they experience is nothing
(15:37):
that I've experienced. So I never want to dismiss it
or think.
Speaker 3 (15:41):
No, you cannot, you must not, you must not. I
have to say, you began the whole thing by talking
about how only you are and what a clown, et cetera.
And by the way people use the word clown and
different ways, I think you use it in a very
very loving way. But let me just say one thing, like,
I don't know where you get the idea that you're ugly? Well,
is that, like seriously like a self reflection or what
(16:02):
is that? Is that? Like I'm going to say it
before you.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
So I think as I sit here in a way
and I go, it's based in truth.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
And you also realized, like there is a world.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
Now there is a drag approach that some of these
girls the goal is to appear feminine or soft or
as we said earlier, a Kardashian you know where you're
just in this flat hair, And that was never my route.
So I was labeled a clown, and I'm already aware
of it. So I keep that in my back pocket
because there's no denial here. I know what I am.
(16:33):
So I think that's just basically me saying it as
you said before anyone else does, because I don't want
people to think that I'm like some insane bitch living
in Palm Springs. Who's normal, Desmond, who's thinking remember my
past when I was young and pretty?
Speaker 2 (16:45):
No, this is it.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
It is warpaint, it is a costume. It is exaggerated,
and I'm not trying to fool anyone.
Speaker 3 (16:53):
You know, it's funny because I didn't get this from
whenever I've seen you on television or in performance. I
didn't get the intense kind of Joan Crawford.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Yeah, you see, that's a compliment. Oh that's a compliment, Darling.
Oh yes, Now are we talking real Joan Crawford. Are
we talking Fade Dunaway moment?
Speaker 3 (17:10):
We're talking Fade Dundaway or Joan doing Joan when she
got old lady, when she was trying to be Joan
Brawford starting, by the way, tell me who Bianca is?
This Bianca like a pastiche is she apart Joe Cruft?
What does she do?
Speaker 2 (17:23):
You're gonna tackle at this.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
So I was doing theater many many years ago, and
I was doing a show called Cycle Beach Party Charles Bush.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
I love that, Yeah, And there was.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
A role that I was playing, marvel Anne, who was
the bitch on the beach, and I was then offered
to come and perform at the drag bar. So I
was using the name marvel Anne and a friend of
mine was like, girl, you need to get a real name.
I'm like, well, I don't really have a name. I
don't know, I don't know what talme of. She goes, well,
you remind me of my friend Bianca. So I think
Bianca del Rio is the perfect name. I'm like, great, whatever.
(17:55):
So it was put on the middle day rag and
it said Bianca del Rio and she's like, well, I
want you to know that Bianca was a dear friend
of mine and she had passed away, and you remind
me a.
Speaker 2 (18:04):
Lot of her. I said, oh, that's love. Cut to Isaac.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
Eighteen years later, I went drag race and I'm at
the airport going through my phone, a flip phone, because
that's how long Aero it was, and it's everyone's saying congratulations, congratulations,
And here was that bitch, Nikki Rich, my good friend
who says to me, congratulations, bitch, I'm glad you won.
By the way, Bianca is not dead. She lives in
Florida and she's pissed.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Eighteen years later. That is great, eighteen years of the making.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
God.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
So I'm like, that is that really? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (18:38):
So that is like the long honey.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Can you imagine the hate mail she gets?
Speaker 3 (18:43):
God starling when you take it all off? Right?
Speaker 2 (18:54):
Yeah again, Roy?
Speaker 3 (18:56):
Yes, person? Right? And Roy lives a regular life. Roy
goes to the super I don't mean to me, you know,
objectifying here. I just want to know, like, does Roy
wear a light beat when he goes out?
Speaker 2 (19:07):
No? No, no, no, no, no.
Speaker 3 (19:09):
Tell me everything. I want to know who this person? No.
Speaker 1 (19:11):
I for me, I think when it takes so much
to plot and plan this, and like you know, I
sew so I make my own costumes and do all
of that kind of fanfare for myself, do my own
wigs and all of that packaging that I think I
get worn out when I'm out of it, where I'm
just like, man, I'm good, I'm always in black. On occasion,
I'll throw on a little something you get it that
you just go. It's just easier as my uniform. And
(19:34):
I don't try to draw that type of attention to myself,
obviously when you go to a gay brunch in Palm
Springs Mary Redoomed. But it's not something look at me,
look at me. It's a pretty normal life. And I
don't know if it stems from Okay, I'm a human being,
or the fact that I'm just lazy, you know, I
get exhausted in this world, or it requires so much
(19:55):
maintenance that outside of it, I'm like, I'm good.
Speaker 3 (19:58):
I feel very similarly. I have a small house in Bridgehampton.
I refer to it as a show compared to like
those other places you go, and it's like, oh my god, like,
what person broke the law to make this much money
to it for right? And I have this fabulous friend,
Kitty Hawk. She's so funny and gorgeous and she's a
very important, like sort of interior designer, and she came
over to visit me in the shack and my husband
(20:19):
was there and she's like, are you straight man? Like,
what the hell is this? You know, it's so funny.
It's like people don't understand, Darling. When I am not
doing that. When I am not either designing something or
performing or whatever the hell i'm doing producing something, I
am a wreck. I can barely get out of my chair.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
And also like, for instance, I live out in Palm Springs,
but I live outside of the Palm Springs itself, and
many of my friends are like, oh, you live a
suburban life. I go, honey, I know where the gays
and fanfare is if I made it. And I think
after living in New York and living in Los Angeles,
you know where it is when you want it. But
sometimes going to bed at nine pm is a lovely thing.
Speaker 3 (20:58):
Oh yes, yes, are you with are I did give
a husband? Come on? Do you this is beautiful a
long term thing?
Speaker 2 (21:10):
Or is it about two and a half years, which
is a long time for me?
Speaker 3 (21:13):
Like are you a top or about him?
Speaker 2 (21:15):
I own to you have different what I'll meet you
in the.
Speaker 3 (21:19):
Bathroom in twenty minutes, Darling.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
I'm sorry. I don't fuck people with a shack.
Speaker 3 (21:24):
No.
Speaker 1 (21:24):
The crazy thing is that most jack queens are most
drag queens.
Speaker 3 (21:29):
Are I know, I know, it's really true. It's all
in the tuck, doll in the tuck.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
And you always tell people you know where I put mine.
I take a string tied on my deck, pull it
out my back and stick it under my wig.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
And that's what gives me height.
Speaker 3 (21:42):
Right, That's what gives it the volume. That's what gives
your hair such a volume lift. I've seen you out
of Dragon and I've seen the incredible difference between Roy
and Bianca, And what I want to know is, what
do you want the people to know about Bianca? What
do you want the people to know about Roy? And
what don't you want them to know?
Speaker 1 (22:01):
Oh but Beyonnes, it's just trying to remind people that
you have to find humor and everything, and that I
don't take myself seriously. And we've gotten to this point,
I think because of social media, where everything is so
matter of fact and everyone else is too quick to say.
You can't say this, you can't say fuck you. I
can say whatever I want, and you can also say
(22:21):
I don't like it. That doesn't mean that I change
my ways or try to adapt for you. And I
think out of drag is to realize that this is
not my identity, this is my job, and I take
it very seriously when it comes to being professionals, showing
up and delivering. And I like work, so I do
enjoy being on the road and touring and doing shows.
But it's not my identity. So I don't live and
(22:43):
breathe this. And I know that there's an expiration date
on this, you know. So I don't lose myself and
that fantasy, nor do I think that I'm fancy or
better than anybody else. It's just like, hey, this is
my monkey suit, this is my job.
Speaker 3 (22:56):
It makes sense to me, and anything you would have
said makes sense to me, you know. But I did
this fantastic kind of in depth interview with Murray Hill.
You know that.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Oh yeah, I love Murray.
Speaker 3 (23:05):
I love Murray. I love him.
Speaker 2 (23:07):
He's the best.
Speaker 3 (23:08):
And I was kind of a little scared because, you know,
I don't know if Murray has a different identity, Like
Murray wakes up and that's who that person is. And
he constructed all of that. And I was so inspired
by that, I have to tell you, because I thought like, well,
what if I get bored of Isaac soon, I could
just do that. I could create a whole new move
(23:29):
somewhere and become like, you know, some crazy right, and
yes when I ask you about that, and you make
a lot of sense. But again today you don't really know.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
No, No, Murray.
Speaker 1 (23:40):
Murray and I we had met years ago in New
York City and then we had worked together and I
was in the same boat. I didn't know where we
stood professionally, because you know, as drag queens.
Speaker 2 (23:50):
I guess it's for me.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
It was my norm, you know, being around drag queens
and knowing how to work with you know, chaotic gay
men in a wig. But there was you know, Murray
who was a drag king, which was all new to
me and I had never really worked and we had
the best time doing a benefit show together, and then
we stayed in touch obviously through the years, and then
this past year we were able to do a show
for Hulu together where Murray was the host and I
(24:14):
was a judge and dinner and we had the best
time needed the with Neil Patrick, Neil, Miss Neil.
Speaker 3 (24:22):
Who's a heart. I do love Ben I love him switch,
Oh my god. All of that cast. Wasn't Bend de
la Creme on that Benda la Creme was.
Speaker 1 (24:30):
On Jins Monsoon was on. I mean, all the girls,
all the girls we know.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Well, speaking of Benda la Creme, we did a podcast
a few months ago and he, at the end of
the thing he said, you know, I want to just
do this till I die. I want to be a
drag queen till I die. And yet you said this
is an expiration day.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
I read an expiration I mean, I guess it's mainly
because starting out in New Orleans and then working in
New York and doing bars every night, and then getting
to do drag race, and then getting.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
To travel the world.
Speaker 1 (24:58):
You go, all right, this has been a lovely progression
thirty years in the making. But in the end of it,
you also have to be realistic with yourself because it
requires so much that I often think performing sure, I
may perform in drag questionable. So that's what I mean
by that is to not think this is it and
I can only live off of it.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
No, we'll see.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
I mean I've done stuff out of drag as well.
Obviously this is still enjoyable. But when it's not, I
don't plan to beat a dead horse. I don't want
to be propped up.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
So so Lady Bunny will be nowhere in the picture
to be what you're saying. No, no, I'm sorry, I'm sorry.
We're going to get to that at about one second.
But I want to talk about you for a minute.
What was your big was your big break? Drag race?
Was that?
Speaker 1 (25:42):
Well, I think you roll through life right, and you
don't really know. I often say I don't know what
I want, but I know what I don't want. So
you experience something and you think to myself, Yeah, of course, yes,
I would love to be rich, I would love to
be famous. But what I learned early on was that, yeah,
that's a pipe dream and that's here.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
But work is what matters, whatever the work is.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
So I was slepping around doing drag, bingo to alcoholics
at three in the afternoon.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Oh, then you were doing every possible show there was.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
You're doing a show on a Wednesday night at one
am for people that hate to do. And then I
went to New York and I was working at a
Broadway costume house. Costumes and fanfare were always my fat,
my passion, I say. So that was just being in
that world and then I thought, you know what, I
don't want to do drag anymore. This is two thousand
and five, I'm thinking, you know what, I could wrap
this up. And then I went and saw some horrible
drag queens in New York and I thought, oh god,
(26:29):
this is what they're delivering.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
Oh, I can't give up now, So I started.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
I started working then in New York, and the balance
was day job eight thirty to five and then doing
shows in the middle of the night. And that was
my routine for quite a while, and I thought, okay,
I could wrap this up at forty.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
I'm thinking forty. I had a good run.
Speaker 1 (26:49):
The struggle was kind of crazy, just trying to keep
the schedule. You're like, what am I really doing? Like
this is not fulfilling as much as I want it
to be. And then the opportunity for Drag Race came along,
and I had seen some of my friends that were
not that talented have success on the show, so.
Speaker 2 (27:03):
I thought, let me, let me try this out.
Speaker 1 (27:06):
So I auditioned, and I told one person I auditioned,
I got it in two weeks. I had to be there,
and then it just kind of snowballed from there. Not
knowing what the bigger picture was, I just kind of thought,
I'll go and let's see what this exposure is. But
I think all of the bad gigs, all of those
drunk people at Bingo at three pm, kind of prepared
me for what was to come, which in the end
(27:28):
was still the same game, which is to work and
to ride the wave of what it is and realize
that's what it's about. It's not sitting back and eating
bond bonds. It's the hustle of creating and still going
and as long as you're enjoying it, it's important. So
it was kind of like opportunity hitting and then wow,
you're out into the world and just ran with it,
which was ten years ago now, but.
Speaker 3 (27:49):
Now it's like ten solid years of success, right, Well,
what this.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Is the years of working? You measured the success based
on what is success?
Speaker 2 (27:57):
You know, is it your.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
Opinion of what you've done that you're proud of, or
the reviews and the accolades. I mean, I've been able
to pay my rent, I was able to buy a house,
you know, that kind of stuff I got. That's a
beautiful thing that's for me. That's still great. But also
I'm still enjoying it, which I think is crazy. You
have moments when you pinch yourself and you go what
the fuck am I doing here?
Speaker 3 (28:17):
Like?
Speaker 1 (28:17):
How am I talking to you? It's like all of
the craziness that kind of comes with it. But I
think all of the insanity before drag Race is what
made me appreciate what I have now.
Speaker 3 (28:27):
Right, what a great answer. On this podcast sometimes I
talk about like failures and setbacks because I always think, like,
that's what you learn from.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
You know, without a doubt, if you don't have a
bad show, how do you know you have a good one?
Speaker 3 (28:40):
Oh my god?
Speaker 1 (28:41):
For me, I'm on the road and you're doing one
hundred and twenty nine shows, and do you think every
one of them went successfully?
Speaker 2 (28:46):
Hell?
Speaker 3 (28:47):
No.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
But when you're there and you're in the moment, I
think to myself, Okay, this is going downhill, but you
just keep plowing through it and in the end you
can sit back and go, girl, that was a shit show.
But now you've got material for the next three weeks
talking about that show. I know.
Speaker 3 (29:01):
And you know, what's funny, no matter how shitty you
think the show is, like somehow like it goes over
completely a funny thing, and then you see a tape
of it and you go, that was a shitty show.
That's really fucking good, Like I've noticed that. Have you
noticed that?
Speaker 2 (29:15):
Without a doubt. I think it's also your own level
of what you think is right or wrong. And it's
good to have standards when it comes to my work.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
I do.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
Obviously in real life I don't, But when it comes
to work, I think, all right, you have your own standard,
and to you, I have an assistant who hates me,
doesn't think I'm funny, doesn't think I'm pretty, and would
never lie to me about that.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
So that's not like my See, we all need one.
We all need one. So I say, you know, well
that was shit.
Speaker 1 (29:42):
He'll go yeah, or yeah I could have been better
or whatever, and you go okay. Then I'm not completely
crazy because sometimes if you add, oh it was great,
it was amazing, and you go, m didn't feel it.
But I often think as a drag queen, I go ooh,
got away with murder, dodge that bullet. So I think
self awareness as I'm dressed like this, awareness is important
and I try to keep that in my head.
Speaker 3 (30:03):
And the thing about you as a performer, I'm sure,
I'm sure you're like obsessively collecting jokes. I'm obsessively jotting
down things like any good person who tells jokes. But
I think a lot occurs to you in the moment.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
Is that true without a doubt? Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
I think what was funny is that in the beginning,
as I was saying doing a bingo for drunk.
Speaker 2 (30:25):
People, here are a group of people that are alcoholics.
Speaker 1 (30:28):
So if you're drinking at three pm at a bar,
you've got an issue. And I don't mean that you
can't drink at three pm, but you've chosen to go
out to have that cocktail in broad daylight consistently every Thursday,
Friday and Saturday when I'm there, and I'm there with
the job of having to do bingo. Now, if you're
an alcoholic, the last thing you want is a drag
queen with a.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
Microphone calling out bingo numbers.
Speaker 1 (30:50):
But this is the mix, so in it you had
to deal with what's in front of you. And then
when I got to New York and people started calling
me a because I never thought of it that way.
I was just dodging bullets and making money that I thought, Oh,
as a comedian, you're supposed to have rehearsed material or
written jokes or a complete thing and I did that
(31:12):
for a minute, but I found that my joy came
from people and interacting and that's where I became more
fearless and it was easier to keep that fresh and
to keep that as part of my technique, so to speak.
So I've gone back to that now as a real
adult and realize, oh, that's what I do.
Speaker 3 (31:31):
That's the sacred thing. That's the sacred thing, right, because
like you said a lot, you're gonna be very prepared,
I think as a performer, like, unless you're prepared, you
just won't sleep the wing right, because do you get
stage fright?
Speaker 2 (31:44):
No?
Speaker 1 (31:45):
I get antsy, but I don't get stage fright. You
know what's crazy is that being backstage and overthinking is
where my brain just goes crazy. So you know, I pace,
I get into the zone, my brain starts thinking, all right,
this is what I have in front of me now,
and then when you go out there, all bets are
off because you don't know what's going to happen.
Speaker 3 (32:03):
And what about Because you were talking earlier that as Roy,
you sometimes used to perform.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
Or dom I'm not picking, I'll do anything.
Speaker 3 (32:11):
Does Roy get more stage fright than Bianca? Something? Because
you don't have the armor.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
You know, It's crazy. It's that adrenaline you get on stage.
I think I've gotten so used to being Bianca that
it's hard sometimes if I'm doing something where I'm not
Bianca to not use the mannerisms or the tone or
the voice.
Speaker 3 (32:27):
Got it.
Speaker 2 (32:28):
So I do have to think about it a little more.
I have to be a little more.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
Prepared, Darling, I'm embarrassed. I watch so much Dragra. Oh
you do, I am so oh queen. I watch literally,
like Philippine, you watch all the Franks. I watch it.
I do, I do so much. I really like it,
(32:52):
and some of those challenges it's so cringey, like when
they're trying to be spontaneous and they're trying and then
there's you you know, well it's like, what is that?
What is that spark? Darling.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
Well, it's a different setup.
Speaker 1 (33:05):
Also, like I said, we did the show ten years
ago and the season before me was jinx Monsoon, So we.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
Were a different beasts.
Speaker 1 (33:12):
Back then and it was a different vibe. And now
you have queens that grew up with the show that
are doing drag because of the show where all of
us kind of had a life and work ethic and
schlupped in those bars and found out who we were,
had time to develop who we were, and then went
on the show. So that's a different game. And that's
not to say, oh, you have to be old. I
(33:33):
mean Jinks Monsoon. Her first time around was twenty three,
I think twenty five. Yeah, but she's just one of
those well that's what you know, Well, you know she's
she looks forty eight. But yes, she's brilliantly talented, but
also was well developed in what she was doing, which
I think now it's kind of like, Ooh, I want
to be famous, Ooh I want to wear a wig.
Speaker 2 (33:51):
I know a lot of musical theater.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
Actors who started doing drag because of drag Race and
have gone on the show and tampered in it. But
it's a different world or me than it was for them.
Speaker 3 (34:01):
It's so fascinating to me because it's not to say
that Jan or something who has a very big musical
theater background like you, you know, like me. Right, she's
a great performer, just in a completely, utterly totally.
Speaker 1 (34:16):
You yeah, completely, And what I think people are concerned with,
or maybe the younger queens in general, or what the
show has become now is that everyone feels that they
need to be all one type, or to be liked
by everyone, or to do the acceptable thing.
Speaker 2 (34:30):
And I don't live in that world.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
So the chaos and the madness on social media or
people's opinions doesn't affect me because like other people that
like me like me. But I'm not gonna tone it down.
I'm not gonna soften my makeup. I'm not gonna not curse.
That's just who I am.
Speaker 3 (34:45):
Well wait a minute, you say that. Do you ever
get nervous about you? That make you a little scared?
Does it get you into trouble?
Speaker 2 (34:51):
Well, I think it depends on who you ask.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
You can look at something and someone will say, well
I think this, I think that, or you shouldn't say this,
or you should say that. That's just the world we live.
But the people that don't like you are never going
to like you anyway. But thanks to social media, you
just see it. Whereas normally back in the day, someone
would have to walk up to you and say, Isaac,
your collection with shit and I wrote in the newspaper
and this is what it is.
Speaker 2 (35:13):
That's when you dealt with it. Now it's kind of like.
Speaker 1 (35:15):
Somebody who just doesn't like your face is going to
say I think this, I think that.
Speaker 2 (35:19):
And you're like, what the fuck is that?
Speaker 1 (35:21):
I don't live my life by some phantom faggot online.
Speaker 3 (35:24):
I want to talk about this because I have a
whole bunch of questions about how you perceive social media.
You have what like a million two million followers on Instagram.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
Well, for me, it's a business. You know, I have
a Instagram for Bianca. It's not my real life. I
think the most personal you'll get on there is is
my dogs. I don't live my life or going look
how I live. Some things you need to keep to yourself.
But for me, it's a business. You know, I'm out
there promoting. I have a show going, I'm about to
go on the road. This is what it's about. But
I don't live in the phone. If I'm at an airport,
(35:57):
I've got ample time to tweet. That's when it happens.
Speaker 2 (35:59):
I don't.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
I don't spend my day going, oh, I've got to
post this or ooh I've got a no.
Speaker 3 (36:04):
Right and that's it. Right, Like, you don't go on
there and express yourself and go like I think about
this political thing, and I think about that thing in
that world because you can't.
Speaker 1 (36:14):
Win, and the crazy thing with it is is just
the idea. Nothing gets solved in the comment section, so
you have to find some sense of balance. When someone says, oh,
you should say this and you should say that, well sure,
but also there's a group of people that are going
shut the fuck up, drag queen.
Speaker 2 (36:28):
You don't know anything about what's going on.
Speaker 1 (36:30):
So it's a slippery slope because often you'll say, as
you know, Leonardo DiCaprio, you should speak up about this,
and then when he talks, you're like, what are you now?
You know you live in a different world. So it
is tricky. It is tricky. I do have opinions, I
do have beliefs, but I don't use my platform to
discuss all of this madness in the world.
Speaker 2 (36:48):
It's never ending.
Speaker 3 (36:49):
And now if someone trolls and they say, shit, it's
too honey. I love problem, except I know you do.
But at first, did you always was there a moment
when you went like, oh my god, this person is
coming for you would never see.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
Because it's not real life, Isaac.
Speaker 1 (37:03):
I mean, you know it's not real life, but so
so so for me honestly, as I said, three PM alcoholics,
drag BINGO.
Speaker 2 (37:12):
Nothing scares me.
Speaker 1 (37:13):
Like, let's be real here, So some little bitch is
gonna say, oh I think this about you?
Speaker 2 (37:19):
Who the fuck cares?
Speaker 3 (37:21):
Darling. It took me a minute to get over, like
the people online going, you know, shut your mouth, we
don't want to hear from you. Really come back to
like blah blah.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
Oh really they came for you.
Speaker 3 (37:32):
Oh yes, of course. But I have turned a corner now,
I'm like you Now, I'm like, bring it on, bring
them on a little You have to know a little
teeny bit.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
You have to also look at it and realize that
it's nothing they would ever say to your fucking face. Ever,
so what's the point of even engaging with them? Now,
On occasion, I've had a drink and I will troll back.
This is my ultimate favorite thing I like to do, Isaac.
I like to troll people that are friends of mine
because as a drag, queen, trolley or being a cunt
to one another is a form of affection. You know,
(38:03):
I have many of my friends that are rotted, hateful individuals,
from Coco Peru to Lady Bunny, who all we do
is say scathing things about each other. But my thing
I like to do is sometimes when I have a moment,
I will wake up, let's say about six am, and
I will get online on Twitter, and I will just
say the most rotted things about people that are friends
(38:23):
of mine, and I will just hit them, like six
or seven of them, or they write some heartfelt speech
about I'm living my best life and it's important for me,
and you're just like, okay, that's my tweet. Okay, Like
who the fuck cares I do about ten of them?
And then I turn off my phone and then I
wait till about ten o'clock, eleven o'clock at night, Palm springs.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
I'm in bed. I open the phone and.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
I cackle at the responses because everybody's fighting with each
other about some stupid shit I said about a friend
of mine, and the people like, you can't say that
about her, and I'm.
Speaker 3 (38:54):
Like, it is, but think about it.
Speaker 1 (38:56):
If the bitch I'm talking about doesn't have a problem
with it.
Speaker 2 (38:59):
Who the fuck are you to tell me?
Speaker 3 (39:01):
I can't say that, right of course, But Darling, this
is like some kind of ironic art and season you're
talking about. Forget like social media that is like I want,
I like, I want to subscribe to that. Darling. While
we're here on the subject, do let's talk about how
you think social media has changed Jag.
Speaker 1 (39:23):
I think with everything there's good and bad. It's like, yes,
it's introduced me to a larger audience. It's got a
bunch of people that are aware of what I'm doing
and what I'm doing. You know, back in the day,
you would have a flyer about where you were and
where you were performing.
Speaker 3 (39:38):
Ah, God, I remembered them. I saved everything the flyers.
Speaker 1 (39:42):
And then you also were like featured in the Gay Rag,
you know, the magazine. You were excited if you were
on the cover, you were elated if you were in
the back on a casual night out.
Speaker 3 (39:51):
Homo Estra's all of it out.
Speaker 1 (39:53):
So all of that was the way to communicate to
the people that were there. And as I said, with
no phones, you would meet your friend. It was a
night out. You had a good time. So that was
lovely back then. So is it easier now?
Speaker 2 (40:05):
Yes, I can.
Speaker 1 (40:06):
Post about where I'm gonna be and then you sell
tickets and then people show up, so there is a
perk to it. As we said before, the noise from
useless fucking people is annoying if you wrap yourself up
into it, and people say, now, oh, everyone's so hostile,
everyone's so this, and I don't think that's the case.
I think people have been assholes since the beginning of time.
I just think now they have a platform to talk,
(40:27):
so we hear more of it, so it's up to
you to kind of filter it out.
Speaker 3 (40:32):
I'm not even talking about that anymore. I'm talking about
like in the day, you would go see Lipsinca who
like lip synced in such an incredible like she didn't
do split now to choreography, No, no, no, she stood
there and her face from the one hundred and fiftieth
fucking row in the back. You saw that motherfucking face, Okay.
Speaker 2 (40:50):
And she knew everywhere.
Speaker 3 (40:51):
So there's that and it was like art. But it
was also like like yeah, SaaS like the changes and
it was a script and she wrote it. But now
you have a whole world people looking at drag and
you have Sugar and Spice, who actually I love I
was rooting for Sugar and Spice, but you know they
are some social queens like those are something without dag
(41:11):
queens and I don't mind them for a minute, but
you know there are some out there.
Speaker 2 (41:15):
Who I do no truth, No, I see what you're
getting out.
Speaker 1 (41:18):
The style of drag is completely different, and I think
that everybody is trying to be accepted.
Speaker 2 (41:24):
And I had someone say not to me.
Speaker 1 (41:26):
But one of the quotes was that Bianca's not a
real drag queen because she doesn't lip sync, and I
had to think about that. Oh, I thought, well, let's
break it down. It's some stupid bitch who watches drag Race.
Speaker 2 (41:40):
Now listen.
Speaker 1 (41:41):
I love drag Race. It's amazing platform and it worked
lovely for me. Did I lip sync on the show? No,
because what's the purpose of the show.
Speaker 2 (41:49):
Don't lip sync?
Speaker 1 (41:50):
You only had to live when you were bad? So
what the fuck are we discussing? Do I take that
time to talk to someone and say, uh, this is
who I am and this is what it's about.
Speaker 2 (42:00):
You go, No, I do this? You do that?
Speaker 1 (42:03):
I marvel at people that can jump from the top
of the ceiling and fall into a split.
Speaker 2 (42:08):
Can I do that? Hell?
Speaker 3 (42:09):
No?
Speaker 1 (42:09):
Do I think it's impressive? Yes for fifteen minutes, Yes,
do a show for an hour? Entertain me? Give me
more than that.
Speaker 3 (42:17):
No, you're not right, But even more than that, there
are those queens out there who are amazing at social
like they are really good at pictures. And then you're
right like some persons cannot and.
Speaker 1 (42:29):
Some people do benefit from the editing, you know, the
editing can make you a lot more interesting than you are.
But in person, I prefer an act. I prefer a show.
I'm not so much a spectacle. I'm not mad at it,
but I want something with substance.
Speaker 3 (42:52):
Let's talk about something else for like a minute, sure,
and that would be Lady Bunny. Is she a mentor?
Is she a mentor? What is she? Know?
Speaker 1 (42:59):
What's it's crazy is that she was someone that I
had met when I was about twenty in New Orleans.
And remember no social media, no YouTube, so you had
to see their shows. And I marvel at the Sherry Vines,
the Lady Bunny, the Coca Perus, the Jackie Beats, Marla
Jeane Berman that are still performing in the old school way.
These were queens that traveled and I always was so
(43:21):
impressed that, oh my god, people in another town knew
who you were, and you get to go and do
your show there and the gays come and see you,
Like I marveled at that type of fame at that time.
I thought, Wow, they know your name and you're good.
And the fact that all of the people I just
named are still doing it says a lot about their talent.
Are they batshit crazy? Absolutely? Do they want to shoot
(43:43):
me because I did Drag Race?
Speaker 2 (43:45):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (43:45):
Do they want to kill me because I have more
money than they do. Yes, And that's what friendship is.
But all of them I admired in a way, not
so much as a mentor. I don't idolize Bunny for
obvious reasons, but I do know her. I think she's
brilliant at what she does, and to work with her
is like literally working with a tornado, and I live
(44:06):
for it. And we've had some amazing moments, some not
some amazing moments.
Speaker 3 (44:11):
I mean, I have to tell you something like when
you talk because I really want to talk about this
for a second, also known as John Ingall. Oh, yes,
And the thing is like that is like one thing
about drag that I miss just a little bit. I
think you were able to take that into a modern
thing where you just say the most offensive thing in
(44:34):
the entire world, literally she looks at the news and
she goes, what is the most horrible, wretched thing I
can think of to say? And then she says it
on instantly, And like today's standards of drag, you kind
of gotta be a little bit more careful, at least
from the Bunny perspective, cause Bunny just says it.
Speaker 1 (44:51):
But Bunny just says you do too. But Bunny gives
zero fucks and I.
Speaker 3 (44:55):
Think zero zero, and you give like one fuck. Maybe.
Speaker 1 (44:58):
I mean, I mean, I'm a where like there's things
that I would say in a show that I wouldn't
say online because you know what's lacking in the world.
Speaker 2 (45:05):
Context.
Speaker 1 (45:06):
Context doesn't exist anymore. So let's say you've got a phone,
you're at a show. You just take a clip and
let's say you get the punchline. There's no setup, there's
no explaining what we were doing the whole night. Someone
puts it online and then goes defend yourself and you think, well,
what the fuck? Look at the Kathy Griffin situation. Here
was all of this mann is And my thing is
(45:27):
never apologize because what I said in that moment, in
this game.
Speaker 2 (45:31):
Of my show is my show.
Speaker 1 (45:33):
So if you take it out of context, It's impossible,
and I'm not going to try to explain it to
someone else who obviously doesn't like you and already is
out to get you, you know, the cancel side of
it all. So therefore it's very awkward because the context
doesn't exist. You know, Bunny, what she presents online is
a rarity because you've got poop jokes and then you've
got politics, which is crazy. Yes, you just don't know
(45:56):
what you're gonna get with her, So that's a different
vibe than me. So I just think that what I
put out there is what I put out there. You
can like it, you can dislike it, but context is
what makes it makes sense.
Speaker 3 (46:06):
You know, if Kathy Griffin or like Michelle Wolf were
a man, they would be Seinfeld, you know what I mean.
Like there would be absolutely something. But then I think
to myself, like, why am I not a drag? I
would be a.
Speaker 2 (46:18):
Huge Let's do it.
Speaker 3 (46:20):
Let's put on a wig and some makeup. I swear
to you, Queen, I would be such a great drag. Yeah,
you got the making. I don't know why you got
the making. I do, yes, I do. I keep thinking
if only I had a wig, and then I could
really say what's on my fucking.
Speaker 1 (46:35):
I'll get you a good wig and you can do it. Yes,
let's do it. Let's make me right.
Speaker 3 (46:39):
I have one final question for you. I am obsessed
with obituaries. Oh god, right, do you have a sense
of what your obituary will say when you finally actually
drop dead and you're not the living dead for the.
Speaker 1 (46:51):
Rest you know what's interesting? Oh my god, this fell
out of my ear as soon as you said that.
So this is all a sign.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
Let's just see.
Speaker 1 (46:58):
I haven't really thought about it. I am one of
those people. I just recently got all of my stuff.
Speaker 2 (47:04):
I got it all in order. I got all my
stuff in order.
Speaker 1 (47:06):
I now know who's getting what and what's happening. But
I do want to be buried with all my drag.
I want my drag to go with me in a
tomb so that in about one hundred years they can go, oh,
a queen lived here, you know, like like two uncommon
or as we say, I mean, too damn common. I
would like to have all of my shit with you,
because I don't think anybody deserves it. It's my stuff
(47:27):
and I should be able to take it with me
into the afterlife. But I just hope that people go,
you know, the bitch had fun and didn't take it
too serious. And I think that's that's the important thing here.
It's like, look, we're all gonna die, so like, why
be so fucking serious about everything?
Speaker 2 (47:43):
Well?
Speaker 3 (47:43):
What makes you so fatalistic? Darling? What makes you that way?
Is there something about you that's well? I am dead
inside already, right of course we all are, But like,
what makes you so fatalistic? I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (47:58):
I think it's just setting because a lot of this
isn't reality that I just kind of go, yeah, it's
gonna happen.
Speaker 3 (48:05):
And fearless. What makes you all? Right? That's it? We're
no you. But is there something you dread or something
that makes you afraid? Like do you wake up at
three o'clock in the morning? Arden?
Speaker 2 (48:14):
But stupid shit? See that shit?
Speaker 1 (48:16):
You know, like oh did I comb that wig? Oh
did I cut the threads hanging off of a costume?
That makes me crazy? Those type of things make me nuts.
But the bigger picture, I can't worry about that shit.
A flight is delayed, What am I.
Speaker 3 (48:26):
Going to paying a mortgage? You're not working?
Speaker 2 (48:28):
The mortgage.
Speaker 1 (48:29):
Yeah, like, you know, I don't live extravagantly, so I
know I can cover that. Like if it all ended tomorrow,
not death, but just the game of it.
Speaker 2 (48:37):
I go, all right, I'll be all right. I mean,
I might be.
Speaker 1 (48:40):
Miss Havisham walking around the house in old wigs thinking
about my past life, but you accept.
Speaker 2 (48:45):
That this is what it is. You can't live in
that crazy world.
Speaker 3 (48:48):
No, you really can't. Okay, So what do you want
to promote on this podcast?
Speaker 1 (48:51):
Oh? Well, I'm promoting that I am going on the road.
So starting in February of twenty twenty four, I'm starting
my new tour of a new show.
Speaker 2 (48:58):
Called Dead Inside. It's my comedy tour.
Speaker 1 (49:01):
We just announced sixty dates in Canada in the USA
and I'll be out till May, and then obviously we'll
be going to the UK, We'll be going to Australia.
Speaker 2 (49:08):
Be going to Asia.
Speaker 1 (49:09):
This is my sixth world tour and I'm looking forward
to I'll be on the road till twenty twenty five.
So for all ticket information and all that matters, you
can go to Thebianca del Rio dot com social media.
Speaker 3 (49:21):
Wait a minute, who watches your dog?
Speaker 1 (49:23):
Well, you have enemy stucksitter in Los Angeles, who's been
the best, and she takes them and she gives me
the updates, like they pooped today, we had breakfast, another
beautiful morning. She's one of those people. So I've been
very blessed to have her. But my dog is eighteen
years old. So honestly when I got him, well, I
had two. I just recently lost one. But after all
these years, I didn't think this was going to be
(49:45):
my life. So they've been with me from New York
to Los Angeles to here. So it's kind of that
thing where I'm like, I'm grateful that they've been there,
and it's so hard when you lose them because they've
just been literally eighteen years of your life. Luckily, I
have somebody who loves them as much as I do,
which is.
Speaker 3 (50:00):
That's very lucky. Yes, very lucky. Okay, well, you are
a dream boat. I love you. I love you, love
you art. Thank you so much. We'll sing you soon.
Speaker 2 (50:08):
Thank you for chatting boom.
Speaker 3 (50:17):
Oh my goddess, I am exhausted. That was like the
most fun I've had since I went to drunken drag
bingo in you know, nineteen ninety two or something, you know.
I didn't know what to expect from that interview, but
immediately it was just fun and there were some incredibly
illuminating moments. And I really hope that everyone got the
(50:40):
joy that I got from that interview, because I think
it's something that is so needed in the world right now.
We need this kind of humor, we need this kind
of freedom and this kind of expression. And that's what's
so great about drag queens. Man. They really do, for
the most part, express themselves and know more than Bianca
(51:01):
del Rio. Anyway, I hope you got that, and I
hope you catch me on episode three of RuPaul's Drag Race,
coming out this January on MTV. Darlings, you do not
want to miss it. You do not want to miss
this season. All I can say is, having been there
in person with those queens, it's a really fun, exciting
(51:23):
cast and it's going to be a fun exciting season.
Trust a queen, trust me, darlings. If you enjoyed this episode,
do me a favor and tell someone, Tell a friend,
tell your mother, tell your cousin, tell everyone you know. Okay,
and be sure to rate the show. I love rating stuff.
(51:46):
Go on and rate and review the show on Apple
Podcasts so more people can hear about it. It makes
such a gigantic difference and like it takes a second,
so go on and do it. And if you want
more fun content videos and posts of all kinds, follow
the show on Instagram and TikTok at Hello Isaac podcast
(52:09):
and by the way, check me out on Instagram and
TikTok at I Am Isaac Msrahi. This is Isaac Misrahi,
Thank you, I love you, and I never thought I'd
say this, but goodbye Isaac. Hello Isaac is produced by
Imagine Audio Awfully Nice and I AM Entertainment for iHeartMedia.
(52:33):
The series is hosted by Me Isaac Msrahi. Hello Isaac
is produced by Robin Gelfenbein. The senior producers are Jesse
Burton and John Assanti, and is executive produced by Ron Howard,
Brian Grazer, Caral Welker, and Nathan Kloke at Imagine Audio.
Production management from Katie Hodges, Sound design and mixing by
(52:55):
Cedric Wilson. Original music composed by Ben Waltz. A special
thanks to me, Bill Phelps and Sarah Katanac at I
AM Entertainment m
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