Mark Long

If you love reality TV, you can’t miss our hang out with Mark Long. He’s an OG Road Rules contestant but has gone on to host other shows like MTV Sports and Reality Remix. 

But as a 2-time winner of The Challenge, he’s back to take on The Challenge All Stars. 

Wells finds out what led him to a life in reality TV and what happens in his world when the cameras are off.

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See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
So yeah, it's Master's weekend, and for those of you
that don't know what that is, it's an important weekend
for Dad's All Across America golf tournament in Georgia. Everything's
green there, and that's what I've been doing. I've been
watching that because your boy is starting to trend towards Dad.
I'm not a dad, I'm a dog dad. But like

(00:20):
I always thought of myself was like the cool young
hip hips the radio DJ, going to all the shows,
drinking and smoking and being cool. And now I'm like,
I gotta watch the Masters guys, a tradition unlike any
other or whatever. It's kind of fun speaking of masters.
Do we have one on the show today. Let's get

(00:43):
this thing go and run it. This is the Wells
Cast with Wells, Adams and I Heart Radio podcast. The
show is kind of like a tradition like any other
to be honest with then, you know, no one ever
thought to interview people about their past groundbreaking stuff. Wells.

(01:06):
You truly are a visionary, a trailblazer if you will.
Now this is this is a show that's been done before.
It'll be done again long after I'm gone, which actually
be pretty soon. Considering I'm in uh dad bud Master's mode,
so I'm about three minutes away from the earlier birds
special at the Golden Corral dementia and a smooth transition

(01:30):
into cold, hard death. How's dark whatever? It's been a
year man. You've boys got the vaccine though, so that
ain't gonna kill him. Got the Madern, which I will say,
uh second show. The Madern put me on my ass.
I was being so arrogant to the vaccine. Gods are like, you,

(01:50):
stupid bitch, We shall get you. I got mine at
like ten in the morning. You've been hearing like all
these just kind of horror stories, and I was like,
how do I feel? What's going on? Around ten pm,
So twelve hours after I have the shot, I was like,
I think I'm in the clear, guys. I think that
my amazing immune system is totally gonna just float by
this thing and I am not gonna feel anything. Took

(02:13):
a mellowtone, went in bed, knocked it out, and then
about three in the morning, you boys started getting the fever, dreams,
the flop sweat. Oh, and then I just felt like
hot death for about twelve more hours. But I feel fine,
and you know what's exciting about that? Yet, Yes, like
it was a day of just achiness and it's not

(02:35):
feeling great, but you know that, like meme of Leonardo
DiCaprio walking on the beach being like here we go.
I feel like that now I can walk through the
world like that. I'm still gonna wear a math I'm sumy,
smart and stuff, and I'm still gonna wash my hands
a lot because you should anyway, because you stn't be gross.
But it's like a new world, Oh new world. Super
pumped about today's show. Okay, my guest today is a

(02:56):
guy that's been in reality TV longer than most of
my audience. I feel like has been alive, just some mainstay,
a trailblazer if you will, in the reality TV world.
You know, after doing Worst Cooks with Johnny, I became
this huge challenge fan and now Sarah and I are obsessed.
So having this guy on the show today makes me

(03:17):
really really excited by Also, like I said earlier, I'm
getting up there in the age bracket. And your boy
was in high school in the mid to late nineties. Okay, facts,
and so I was a huge real world road rules
guy and the guy that we have on the show
today was from the first ever road Rules season. But

(03:40):
that's not all he did. Man, literally, this dude has
done everything. He was on Fox Reality's longest running original series,
Reality Remix, which, by the way, how does that show
not exist anymore? With the advent of all these amazing
reality TV shows whatever, He basically interviewed hundreds of reality
stars and reviewed their shows genius. He was the gadget

(04:02):
guru on multiple daytime talk shows, including like the New
Donnie and Marie Show, Soap Talk, and so many more.
He was a lead host for E Entertainment three hour
live morning show called That Morning Show. And of course
it's a two time Challenge winner, which is baller. What
about a year and a half ago, he hopped on
Twitter and he sent out a tweet saying, Hey, Challenge fans,

(04:24):
how do you guys feel about an O G version
of the Challenge, shorter shooting schedule, some of the best
O G personalities? And guess what? That thing went viral.
So my guest today signed a partnership deal with the
production company that led to the MTV slash Paramount Plus
deal and that birth the new concept The Challenge All Stars,

(04:45):
which is now airing on Paramount Plus. If you are
a fan of the Challenge, uh, you better go watch
The Challenge All Stars. So on the Wells Cast today
we have the Godfather. That's right, the one, the only
Mark Long eyes. This is one you do not want
to stick around, all right, welcome back to the Wells Cast.

(05:19):
Very excited to have well, let's just say it, one
of the greats from reality TV on the show. And
as someone who has been on reality TV now for
seven years, I can't imagine doing it for as long
as this guy. Speaking of the word long, Mark Long
on the show. How are you, bro? Yes, as always,
Wells coming in hot and ferocious just for you, my man,

(05:43):
I look young and beautiful, It's true, but I am.
I'm on the wrong end of thirty and Bro. I
remember your season of road Rules back in the mid
nineties and I was a huge fan. I had the
miss on I don't know, maybe a year year ago,
and I was fan blowing out. So having you on
the show is very, very exciting. So thank you for

(06:05):
being here. That is awesome. Yeah, you're you're aging me
right off the bat with my nine road Rules call out. Yeah,
I turned fifty this year. Well, isn't that terrible? I mean,
when you're growing up, fifty is so old when you're
like eighteen. So I'm there, I am there, my friend.
I didn't age you. You aged yourself because you created
the challenge to debate my friend Challenge All Stars, which

(06:30):
is a sweet way of saying the Challenge a a
RP edition, Just so you know, like I need you
to understand, like where I'm coming from. I wasn't a
fan of the Challenge. I was a fan of road
Rules and Real World growing up. I actually auditioned for
Real World funny enough years ago in college and then
that's a And then I wasn't a fan of the
Challenge until I went on Worse Cooks in America celebrity addition,

(06:55):
it's really most term there, and I went up against
a gentleman by then him of Johnny Bananas, and then
I became friends with him. I beat his ass on
the show, which was nice because I found out that
he's some great challenge guy. Since then, my fiance Sarah
and myself have become fucking addicted to the Challenge. This

(07:16):
most recent season is amazing. So right off the bat,
before we get into your iteration of it. Are you
watching the Challenge right now? It's airing on MTV. Of
course we're We're approaching the finals on that series. I'm
a big CT fan, so I'll always root for the
o G. And it's great because I actually I'm super
close with Johnny. He was actually out here for his

(07:37):
birthday and we went we had to come to a dinner,
but I watched you beat his ass on Worst Cooks
in America. So you can always have that that feather
in your cap as you move forward in this reality
realm my friends. So it's yeah, kudos to you. It
was awesome. I'm glad that you said CT, because there's
nothing more that I love than someone who's really good

(07:59):
an interview. I'm new to this whole challenge thing, so
what I'm tweeting or I'm instagramming about how much I
love CT and Big Tea and their dynamic and like
how cute they are, how good both of them are
an interview. People are hitting me back being like Sects
a snake. He's always been like this and you shouldn't
root for him, Like, first of all, I can forever
I want because that's the whole joining the show I

(08:21):
come at it from a different angle of I love
CT because if I was a producer on that show,
I would absolutely cream my pants every time I sat
down with him. That sounded weird, but it's true because
he gives you such good soundbites. And the thing with
your show. The challenge all Stars is that I always

(08:42):
say this about Bachelor in Paradise, it's the reality TV
all Stars from the Bachelor World's everyone who's very very
good at being on camera and doing interviews. And I
imagine that's kind of what this is. This is everyone
who's very very good at being on camera. And I
will go even a step further. So a lot of people,
when they first saw the show kind of come out
in the press, they were like all Stars. Well. They

(09:03):
instantly went to people's resumes, like how many challenges have
they won? And I was like, whoaa, we'll pump the
brakes because this initially started as the O G project.
You know some of those people that you haven't seen
in ten twenty years. That was my goal. So all Stars,
I'm exactly like you. I used the all star termid
the fact that they have an all star personality, They
have an all star reputation within the challenge, they have

(09:25):
an all star moment in the past challenges that has
been epics. So I don't go to the resumes of
win or lose. I go to the resume of who's
gonna show up, who's gonna give us their best personality,
and who's some of the most fan favorites. I mean, Beth, Ruthy,
cyrus Um. Those are some names that everyone grew up
with and can relate to instantly. And then you have

(09:45):
those wild cards thrown in like the tech Money's or
the Sella's or the yes is that people just they
really went off the grid, So it's nice to bring
those people back. I think I've said this before. The
nostalgia of the fact that we grew up with the
audience just like they grew up with us, So there's
kind of an emotional connection. They're not just hey, who's this.

(10:06):
Who's Kyle from the from the UK? That guy looks familiar,
So there's kind of an invested kind of emotional attachment
before the season even starts, because you grew up with
these folks and that was my main goal, and I
think we hit it out of the park and I
couldn't be more happy than the response we've had so far.
It's been amazing. Bar Stool said it was perfect, which
that's high praise from the place that's primarily known as

(10:27):
talking about people so well done. That's what I said.
I said, if we can get bar Stool Sports, who
ships on everyone, they're the realist person out there to
say it's perfect, we did something right. I'm actually going
on with them later today live and uh, they get
it though. They they don't care that people are the
strongest or the most in shape. They love good television.

(10:48):
It's entertaining as hell, and it's fun to see, you know,
someone that's not an Olympic athletes struggle but still be
funny along the way. And I think, you know, Middle
America is not you know, probably out there during the
winters running fifty miles and you know, so it's like,
it's nice to show the average portion of America that
that moms and dad's mothers, fathers can still strap on

(11:10):
the speedo and to go out there and melt some
ice with their ass, you know what I mean. So
it's nice. Going back to the genesis of the Challenge
all Stars, I was reading up on you and I
guess I just assumed that Viacom was like, all right,
we've got this new streaming service, let's just create some
new programming for Paramount Plus. This will be an easy fit.
And then as I dug a little bit deeper, I

(11:33):
saw that the origins came from a tweet that you
had sent out, just like kind of asking the fans
out there what their appetite was for something like this
goes viral boat a bing bought a boom. You're now
an EP on the show. Yeah, I'm executive, I'm a
player coach as they say, EP and competitor. Yeah, I

(11:53):
threw I threw out the tweet in late July, US
Weekly picked it up and it went nuts. And then uh,
some different outlets started reaching out to me. People Magazine,
you know, Yahoo, all the different ones. So I knew
there was a temperament for it. I knew there was
an audience for it. And once I met with Bua
Murray who does the challenges, and we established that partnership deal,

(12:14):
there was really no other place that I wanted to
take it first but MTV and the fact that it
coincided with the release of their partnership with Paramount Plus.
Everything lined up. So when I first pitched it in
late July, to have it shot and airing in April
is pretty you know, the business, it's insane, so it
happened really quick. Um, the talent that I got is

(12:35):
a plus. They're super funny and it's just a fun,
nostalgic show that I've had so many people just like
I just smiled through the whole episode because it's just fun.
It's a fun show. The music is fucking awesome, so
it's a good throwback show. How is it not a
conflict of interest to be a producer but also be
contestant on the show. So when I initially started, my

(12:57):
role was to gather lots of names that were interested.
So I pulled probably eighty names and put together probably
eighty bios. Spoke with eighty you know o g cast
members kind of gave him a speel about you know,
this isn't a challenge. We're gonna be leaving for ten
eleven weeks. That's one of the reasons we can't go
on in the first place. So I said, how would
you feel about a two to three weeks you know,

(13:17):
shooting schedule, and if I can make this happen. Will
you be will you be interested in there? Like everyone
I asked said yeah. So when I got them to
sign on and do the partnership, I got the executive
producer credit right off the bat, just by doing that
pre production work. So once they established that I was
going to be a cast member, I didn't know the format.
I didn't know the games we're gonna play. I actually
didn't even know the host until I showed up on set,

(13:40):
because that's how secretive they pushed it away from me.
So when you watch it, I don't have any kind
of insider trading knowledge. I show up just like everyone else, thinking, well,
there's ice blox, we're probably gonna be melting ice box,
or there's a crane. I guess we're doing stuff high today.
So in terms of a competitive advantage you'll see as
the series goes, I definitely do not have a petitive
advantage in terms of knowing what we do before it happened.

(14:02):
So that kind of how was that worked out? If
I'm in your shoes and I'm creating this thing and
I'm kind of doing all the heavy lifting in terms
of logistics of of you know, the architecture of the show.
Why aren't you hosting? That's like me being like, I
want to do a Bachelor at style show, and then
I create the whole thing, and then I'm like, and
I also want to like go and be like one

(14:23):
of twenty seven dudes and date one ship. Like that
to me, I'd like, no, I want to go be
the host of the show. Well, I wanted to. I
think what MTV did im paramount, which was smart, is
bringing t J over to host kind of was a
bridge to that younger generation and the older generation that
we have in terms of audience. So, you know, having

(14:43):
him be the figurehead of both shows. I think it's
a nice combination that kind of pools from each age
group because he's now known young and old as being
the guy. So would I have hosted it? Of course,
Look I'm an egomaniac. I'm like you. I would have
loved to host it, but I just thought for the
show's sake in terms of the big picture, because I

(15:04):
have a master plan of this whole thing, uh wells,
and it is to do probably eight or nine seasons
of the All Stars and then as a spinoff series,
not like a ten season, but as a spinoff series.
Almost like a super Bowl of Challenges. We have the
older folks versus the newer folks in a super Bowl
of Challenges. So I definitely want to be part of that,

(15:24):
and that is my my framework if I could create
the next five years of this show, So just keep
an eye out for it will be the biggest thing
ever in the Challenge world watching some of the young
bucks who think they own the world having the old
you know, college kid come back and just give them
the biggest wedge year of their life and let them
know who's boss. So I can't wait for that as well.
I'm pump Man, and I think you're right having a

(15:48):
lynchpin like t J in there. It links all the franchises,
I guess together. Can I make one request going forward?
Course as something that annoys me when I watched the Challenge,
t J's chiron or like lower Third always says Handler,
and if I were t J, I'd be like, motherfucker,

(16:08):
I'm the host of the show. Like for everyone out
there that doesn't know television production, Handler is kind of
like the bits that like make sure like you get
out of your trailer and get to sit on time.
I've never understood why he's the handler. Make sure the
copy is right for the cast, right. Yeah, you know what,
I haven't even looked at the title of him on
our show. I wonder if it says handler too. I

(16:28):
bet you it does not. For a while. You should
just say t J labn uh BMX star. It would
just give it. It It would give him that role. So
he's now evolved a handle. I think that's a demotion. Yes,
you think, uh, he should definitely be host. He should be.
It should say t J Labin Face of the Challenge. Yeah,
you know what I mean. He is the through constant
that everyone can expect. And I'll tell you what, when

(16:49):
t J shows up on on set, there's no middle ground.
He's either delivering great news or terrible news, and it's
usually terrible news that involves us doing something ridiculously crazy.
So t J has feared and loved all at the
same time. Logistically filming this thing in just a couple
of weeks, When you say that to me, that means
it was a super ambitious shoot shoot schedule with people

(17:11):
who are not spring chickens. Were you guys just filming
like every single day? Was there fatigue on in that respect?
After doing it looking back, is is there anything that
you would change. I think the shoot time, which was
three weeks, so when you got to set and when
you left, if you stayed the whole time was three weeks,
and I think just from being there and hearing people's

(17:31):
reaction afterwards, it was the perfect amount of time because
it wasn't too short. But they definitely if we would
have went a lot longer, a little longer, people have
started like complaining just because they missed home because their
moms and dads. But we got to Argentina and actually
had the quarantine for seven days, so we were in
our hotel for seven days doing nothing. I didn't you know,

(17:52):
we could see people out the window, But in terms
of physical communication or that conversation, I think when we
got there the first day, everyone we were just like
unleashed cage dogs, like we're running around the house because
we've been cooped up so long. So I don't think
it was definitely it wasn't. It didn't even feel like
a rush schedule. It just felt like a constant schedule,
like we had no true days off. If you weren't

(18:14):
competing or eliminating someone, it was interviews. It was nineties
parties that we threw. It was pajama so like I
went there with the producer had on knowing I just
don't want to compete every day. I told everyone, bring
a nineties outfit, bring some sleep where like, let's do
some stuff, some o G stuff that the fans used
to love. And I'm glad it made the first episode

(18:35):
because it was such a the nineties party was great
and people like the music to match that was perfect.
So it was a long shooting schedule and and and challenging,
but it wasn't impossible, and I think everyone kind of
after the first day just kind of sunk back into
their Okay, well, this is how it's going to be,
and everyone was fine, listen. I think everyone's excited to
see you guys like jump from you know, steel bar

(18:58):
to steel bar on a movie, Semitruck and melt Ice
with your back and all this crazy. But at the
end of the day, I do believe that a lot
of the fans, at least ones from like my Age Demo,
are excited to see old rivalries return. Are people who
are bitter, that were bitter and like the mid nineties

(19:19):
still bitter today. You know what the funny thing about
that was is t J said, the very beginning, your
past will come back to haunt you in some cases.
Episode two, Tris Shell and Katie, who were best friends forever,
have the biggest fight and it was the opposite so
it wasn't even like they had beef. They went the
other way. They went from being best friends too. I'm

(19:42):
not sure there ain't Ben gonna be friends after this show.
I mean, that's how visceral the conversations and the argument's got.
But you'll move ahead a Nissa and Ruthie. You know
they have some problems Nia Maiah and Ruthie, Derek and
Neia Maiah. So yeah, it's fun to have at history
to kind of tap into as you know, looking at

(20:03):
it from a producer hat. And the great thing about
this is we can go back and show those flashbacks
of those shows in those moments, so unlike the show today,
if they have a you know, they have an argument,
they don't sometimes they do, but they don't. They don't
flash back fifteen years which everyone looks different. You know,
it's not high depth. You're like, oh wow, this is
a video videotape, but yes, you will see those rivalries

(20:24):
come back to haunt you. You will see some friendships mended,
but you will also see some that that is definitely
being tested that might not last after the show, which
hey it was maybe it was time and this was
the catalyst that it needed to end. So who knows?
Or it just sets you up perfectly for season two
and more dramaa. I'm no dummy, I'm no dummy. Come on,
when you've watched the challenge, there's a lot talked about

(20:47):
your social game, your physical game, your puzzle skill game.
Obviously they're all important, But what do you think is
the most important as someone who's won the challenge? What
you've wanted twice? Yeah, I want it twice. So I
think when you show up, everyone can be in shape
if they want to be right, I mean, if they
took the time to be in shape. There there, that's
not a mystery. But when you come to those checkpoints

(21:09):
in a final, or those checkpoints in a daily challenge
that require, you know, the math skills that you've got
to do on point that you've got to you know,
think on your feet if you it involves the pentagram
puzzles you put together. It involves just a lot of
stuff that to some people, you can train all day
long for that, but you still don't get it. It

(21:30):
still doesn't click that puzzle. And we have some in
our show where its puzzles or trivia or or objects
putting them together. I think that's almost a stronger asset
to have in your bag than just being physically strong,
because every challenge that I've done and that I've seen,
even with with double agents, there's that X factor of

(21:51):
who can do the puzzle better, or who can do
it the fastest, or which partner can help the other
person do the puzzle fastest, And that plays a huge
role because you know the finals now, aren't hey, guys
start here and run to the top of that mountain.
There's always checkpoints, there's always puzzles, there's a wild card
eating elimination. That's always fun. Um. So I think physical

(22:14):
attributes play about and all the other stuff play about
sevent To be honest, the challenge stands now when I
watch there's like kind of a big focus on picking
on the rookies. There's just this whole kind of like
rite of passage thing and if you know you haven't
been here for a while, then we want to send
you down into the pit as many times as possible

(22:36):
and as often as possible at this show. Obviously that's
can't be done because no one's a rookie. So what
is the thing that people end up like focusing on
in your show? When you watch in the beginning, there's
a lot less to judge on, right, so a lot
of the things are looked at how well you did
in the challenge or we also in our particular situation,

(23:00):
we had to a guy and a girl had to
step up to be captains each day, but if they lost,
if their team lost, they were instantly set in the
elimination for the house and the boat someone in against them.
So we actually granted in the beginning sometimes the the
loser because he had the balls enough to step up.
We granted him, Hey, who would you like to go against?
Like who who do you want? You know? And then
it then it takes almost like not the pressure off

(23:22):
the house, but it almost justifies giving the person that
steps up kind of that that we have your support,
thanks for stepping up. So the funny thing though, is
as you see the series go further and further, the
strategy starts to kick in, and that's when you can
see the line in the sands with Alliances, so that's
not always the case. As we creep along this this

(23:44):
you know, fun train of reality television competition. So as
that five thousand gets closer and as the numbers whittled down,
it shifts from I don't want to say not there,
but fairness kind of leads towards strategy and who's gonna
get me to the end or who do I think
has my back when the time comes. So the very

(24:06):
few first votes might seem a little easier, but as
you go, it's definitely a strategy play. And I think
everyone knows that there's a time in there coming up
where I'm just like, guys, let's be honest, this is
this is strategy, this is alliances. Let's not let's call
out the pink elephant in the room. So everyone knows it,
and we're skilled. We are skilled competition players. Even though

(24:27):
we're a little older, we still know the game. Last
question about the Challenge All Stars just on Paramount Plus.
It started, yeah, a week ago, so everyone goes go
watch it being an EP but then also being a
contest in the show, was everyone really upset that you
were the winner? Uh? Like, I said, every step of

(24:50):
this challenge, I have to earn my way through it,
and you will see it. I do not get an
easy ride. I might not even make the finals because,
like I said, if we were playing tug a war
every day, I would probably have a really, really great
shot at making the finals and winning. But it's not
that type of show. I wanted to be fair and

(25:11):
competitive and as unbiased as possible, and you will see that.
And I mean, hey, that's why you tune in, right
Maybe the Godfather wins, maybe he gets sent home the
episode five, you never know to see if I could
trip you up there, Mark apparently, I see, I see you.
Come on, come on. Last question. You're a big dude.
You're jacked up, kind of like the big gun right

(25:34):
now in the challenge, is is FEESSI? Even though I
feel like he's a little bit of a complainer, but whatever,
I would need to get into that. Who would you
rather go against in a hall brawl? Would you rather
go up against FEESSI or would you rather go up
against CT Just by the way, I think that you
might blow both of them out the water, But who

(25:54):
would you rather well, as I said Serio episode one,
I am six three and one half inches two and
thirty pounds of twisted steel. So I don't care. From
twenty nine those stats ring true to this day. I
think me being a competitive it's not even arrogance, it's
just me being very competitive and competent. I think my

(26:14):
advantage to Fessie is is my age. I mean, I
would come in there and treat him like a son
rather than a counterpart peer. And you know how you
were kind of scared of your dad when you grew up.
I would put that fear of of that daddy daddy
mentality in his mind and listen, he always says, oh,
I played football and this stuff. I played football, to dude,

(26:35):
I know how to lower the boom. I know how
to be a free safety and knock your teeth out.
So FESSI no problem CT. Now? Is it CT is
getting better in shape? Is it better in shape CT
or CT that I've been seeing lately, because he he's
getting in really good shape again. I think so CT
and I would have a battle. But like like Fessie,

(26:57):
you know I've I've played all those type of contact
sports before. It will be a brad I would, I mean,
just because I love CT so much. Would it be
hard to go against, of course, but him and I
are both we can flip that switch just like a
Derek and uh, you know it would be a battle.
But you know, I think I go to and on both.
But that's just me be an arrogant. I actually agree
with you. Yeah. Nanny said something a couple of weeks

(27:19):
ago that I thought was true. She was like, Fess,
he's a guy who would like hire a hit man
to go kill you, or CT would buy the knife
himself and do the work himself. And I was like,
I believe that. Actually, that is an excellent quote. That
is true. I stand by that Nanny tweet man or
that that statement. That's awesome. It's nice to see how
CT is evolved too, because he, you know, in the beginning,

(27:42):
you know, the Boston personality brought him, he was really
aggressive and really combative, and I think that was kind
of a stick. But as he's grown older and he's
now a father, he plays a very strong strategic game now.
Where he used to smother you with his you know,
the threat of his fist, now it's more of a
game play, behind the scenes kind of thing, which I'd
loved to see that evolution of his game. And Fessie, man,

(28:04):
it's you know, I said this the other day, Fessie,
you know everyone can win daily challenges, but until you
win the final, you know, you can't crown yourself the
next greatest thing yet. And I think he'll get there.
Like I'm not a Fessi batcher batcher at all. I mean,
I think he's carved himself out to be the nice villain,
which which is a big role in these shows. I
don't not root for him. I always root for someone

(28:24):
that that's really trying and passionate. I just think he's
got to get that that that one championship notch in
his belt before he starts, you know, trying to claim
that he's the new greatest thing on the Challenge. I agree,
screw the MTV version of the Challenge. Everyone needs to
go watch The Challenge All Stars. It's on Paramount plus,
ghost stream it now, download the app, all that kind

(28:45):
of stuff. Really really excited for this season and and
thank you for bringing more of the Challenge into my life.
It really has brightened these COVID days as of late.
Is there anything that you want to talk about your
show that I haven't asked you about before we pivot
into my part portion of the show. I knew we
had something when they released the trailer and within a
week it had five million plus views. I mean, that's

(29:06):
insane for this type of show where it's come from. Um,
it's a really fun show. And if if you're eighteen
years old or forty nine or fifty two like Beth,
there's an audience for everyone. T J is a great
you know, trigger point lynch pin of that, and it's
a fun, fun show that you can smile throughout the
whole thing, and everyone can put themselves in our shoes

(29:28):
thinking wow, I could probably do that. And some things
are very hard. The final that you'll see is super hard,
just like a regular challenge, but it's fun, it's entertaining. Thursdays,
the new episodes drop on Paramount Plus. It's the first episode.
I couldn't have gotten any better response than I did
from all of the fans and the press outlets alike,
and the Barstool Sports shoutout was great. I mean, the

(29:49):
US Weekly stuff and People Magazine, all of them. So
I'm super excited, my man, and I'm glad you and
your girl have to watch you have to, but don't worry.
It's we didn't have the paramount app but now we do,
so it's it's coming out perfect. Okay. I don't know
if anyone told you about what this show is, but
I'm kind of obsessed with origin stories. I'm more interested
in how people became successful and well known and what

(30:11):
that blueprint was. So we're gonna take a quick break,
and when we come back, we're going to find out
where the hell Mark Long came from and how the
hell he got on this show? Down perfect, Let's do it.
Stick around listening to the Wells cast. All right back

(30:35):
in the Wells cast, very very excited to have the
man the myth of the legend, one of the o
g s from. Like, I feel like a lot of
my audience might not even remember that there was this
show called road Rules where they would take like I
don't know, ten strangers and throw them in a Winnebago
and make them drive around the country like a bunch
of assholes doing a bunch of weird things. But it

(30:57):
was like one of my favorite shows growing up. And
I will say this, I was definitely more Road Rules
than Real World Guy. But that's neither here nor there.
That's where this man came from. You were on the season.
You came along at a time where reality TV was
still in its infancy. I don't know if people really

(31:19):
understood what it was, and they definitely didn't know what
it was going to be. As someone who was a
forefather of what's considered to be amazing entertainment but the
downfall of American society, how do you feel about the
role you played. Oh, I didn't give myself this term

(31:41):
the Godfather. I have cast members from every show across
the board. You know, give me that that phrase of
the Godfather, and I wear that hat proudly. Yeah. I
mean back then, we didn't have a blueprint to go
buy you know what I mean? When I did the
road Rules show, there wasn't a first season even to
look back on and say, oh, this is how it works. Right.
So in terms of being a true, true, original organic

(32:05):
company kind of like an adventure show, it was it.
And there was so many shows like I heard a
rumor that Fear Factor was then spun off of a
road Rules type of theme that they the producers saw
that show and said, wait, we could probably do this,
but on a bigger smaller scale, so to speak. So
lots of shows got spun off from different early reality programs.
And the thing now that the biggest change that I've

(32:28):
noticed is because of social media, everyone is so instantaneously
available to pick on, bully, praise, um, give their highest regards.
So that to me is a little weird because I
even said, our cast member, we never even when we
were filming now, we didn't talk about Instagram followers when

(32:50):
we were down there, or how did your Twitter? Now?
I hope our Twitter numbers go up? We didn't. We
don't care because we didn't come from that generation where
I think a lot of people, you know, even outside
of the MTV Challenge, these guys today that are on
the different reality shows, they're so focused on that and
they know my numbers, my brand. By this, it's like
we we would compete now in All Stars for a

(33:13):
full Razor scooter just as hard as we would for
five dollars. So that's a generational thing. It's a lot
more produced these days, you know, types of reality shows.
But you know, that's one of the things I can
always say that was so special for me is I
didn't have anything to compare it to, so when I
showed up to the mountaintop on Malibu and met these people,

(33:36):
I didn't know what I was going to be getting into.
And it was like the Wild West. I mean, there
was so many things we did that you couldn't do today.
There's an episode where we drove these demolition derby cars
in Indiana and I actually talked the producers into letting
me drive a car in the race and that wasn't
like they would never let me do that today, Like

(33:56):
there's so much insurance there. But the guys like, yeah,
if you don't crash it, you can drive it. I'm like,
I look at the producer, like, come on this, we
have to and there like go for it. So I'm
like I was that wasn't in the script and that
would never happen to day. But it was really the
wild wild West. Um. There was a story we were
in New Orleans. That's when Kit Hoover and I had
our mysterious first kiss our production when a bagel got

(34:19):
broken into and they stole like three boxes of already
shot footage and they actually had to release an article
in the paper and somehow they paid like a three
thousand dollar ransom and the tapes just magically showed back up,
So it might have not even happened if that because
there was like three bat in the boxes of tapes
were probably three cities. So there's so many behind the

(34:41):
scenes stories that that weren't shown. I mean I used
to take the Winnebago and production was already asleep and
like in their hotel. I would take the Winnebago and
just like drive through McDonald's like they didn't know what
we were doing. But you could never do that today.
So it was literally like the wild West back then.
And it's gotten way more structured, way more produced, but
it's produced it a great way. I mean, just how

(35:03):
our show looks compared to how it looked, I mean
with the drone shots and just showing the vastness of
Argentina like it is badass. So I'm I'm not saying
that's a negative thing. I'm just saying back then, there
was really nothing to compare it to period. I agree,
And I think one of the biggest problems that we
find on in the Bachelor World is there's this kind

(35:25):
of like cliche that always gets thrown around, is that
you're not there for the right reasons, which is a
very nice way of saying you're there because you want
Instagram followers so you can go sell diarrhea tea on
your Instagram page. And and so my question was, like,
you're the reason why the Kardashians are a thing, which
isn't fair because you're not. Because the thing that annoys

(35:46):
is about the Kardashians is that like one Instagram post
they make like four million dollars And that was never
a part of your Guys game plan to begin with, right, absolutely,
and the fact that it has evolved to that, and
trust me, I mean, let I'd be lying if I said, hey,
my Instagram and Twitter numbers aren't going up. I mean

(36:07):
they are, but that's you know, I'm not out there
pushing my Instagram or Twitter. It's just a natural thing
that happens now. But those shows like The Kardashians, man
good for good for them. I mean, holy crap, the
evolution of that show and just how long it lasted,
and you know Murray was a big part of that
as well. It's amazing. But you know it's not right
for you because I'm sure even on your show, there's

(36:29):
there's some genuine people showing up thinking, hey, this might
be the one. And there's those, you know, there's a
few bad apples in every bunch that are probably there
to just you know, have those moments where they want
to be seen and they do their freak out moments
or their cries or they're fighting and and that's a
shame too, because you kind of diminish what they're there for.
I'm really good friends with one of your cohorts from
the past, remember Nick Peterson. So Nick was the one

(36:52):
that took the money and didn't split it with the girl.
So I have a charity forgive Kids of the World
that he comes to every year. And people still ask
about that because it was just such a dirty move.
But cut to Johnny Banana is doing that to Sarah,
you know what I mean. So people know what's gonna
make good TV. They know now nowadays like what they
have to do to stand out, which is it's cool

(37:13):
in a way because it's fun parts of it's fun
moments of the shows, but it's also a little more
produced than organic, which is how we used to be
back in the day. I mean, even the first Real
World you could tell they were totally real. I mean,
it wasn't like they came to put on an act.
It was you know, Eric Nice was Eric Nice. You know,
he was the New York kid that was just the
model strug you know, struggling, but you know, just those

(37:33):
stories and having watching that reunion on Paramount Plus is
awesome too. So it's fun to go back to that
vintage I don't want to say old people, but the
vintage reality, the pioneers, so to speak. So it's fun. Man,
It's and I don't know what it is, but people
love nostalgia and I'm right there with them. So I
love it. And there's a reason why Vinyl has come
back and all that kind of stuff. It's because people

(37:55):
love to feel a certain way. Even for me, it
brings up I was in high school when Your Guys
this season was airing, and it it reminds me of
that time, which is great, speaking of high school and stuff.
Where are you from? I was born in Philly. I
grew up in Philly till third grade. My dad was
in the military. My mom was a nurse, so we went.
We bounced around a little bit. I ended up in

(38:17):
a small city in Florida called Satellite Beach, a little
small city right on the beach Um went to University
of Florida. I actually sent in a casting tape for
Los Angeles Real World from University of Florida, and I
was a broadcast production major, so I made a really
kick ass tape. So I'm like, if anything, they're at
least gonna appreciate the time I spent on the tape

(38:38):
because it was like it was cool, like it was real,
like bunch of ship with awesome music and all this stuff.
So I got the call and started going down that
rabbit hole of Real World Los Angeles and I got
down to like a final twelve and there was a
guy on there called His name was Aaron, a blond
guy who was a c p A. And they were like, Mark,
you know, we love your personality, but we think Aaron

(38:59):
is a better real because you know, you have this
broadcast journal as a major and you want to be
in entertainment and he's just an accountant. You know, it's
a little more real to us. And I said that's fine.
So I didn't make that. And then like three months later,
when Puck got kicked out of the house, I got
called to be a roommate change, so I actually flew

(39:19):
out to San Francisco and met with the roommates and
they ended up picking a girl named Joe because the
other the guys were like, well, we had a guy,
you know, we let's try a girl this time. So
but it was a blessing in disguise because two months
after that, I got a call to do the road
Rules Pilot. And I did the road Rules Pilot with
four other people that weren't even on the original cast.

(39:39):
So when the road Rules Pilot got picked up, they
told us in the beginning, we're gonna cast a new
group of people. So I was literally, this is a
true story. I was in Los Angeles on the corner
of Hollywood and Fuller. There's an apartment there, studio, and
my had a home phone. My home phone rang and
it was John Bunium and Mary Mary Elis Peutiam and
John Murray, the heads of Buna Murray. They said, hey,

(40:00):
we wanted to let you know the road Rules Pilot
got picked up. I'm like, awesome, and I'm thinking in
my head in l A, at least I could put
that like on my resume, you know, like road Rules Pilot,
playing myself. And they said, but we had a guy
that was cast to play kind of your personality, but
New York didn't like them, so they just asked if
you you wanted to do it. Yeah, I want to
do it, so and they're like, but you can't tell

(40:20):
like the other cast, you know for the first few
weeks that you did the pilot, because we want them
to be kind of surprised as well. So I ended
up doing the pilot with I mean the show with
four other people that didn't do the pilot, And when
the show came out, I got calls from all those
people that did the pilot like what did you do
to get on the show? Who did you sleep with?
I'm like, dude, give me a break. So that's a

(40:40):
that's a kind of a peel behind the curtain, Like
I everyone was supposed to do Ruad road Rules. It's
just a guy that was playing my personality did something
to piss them off. So I got the call when
you look back at that first season, what's the thing
that you remember the most fondly? When I looked back,
they re aired it the whole season in on MTV

(41:01):
Classic the other day. It was the whole like a
what's it called like? Back to back to back? The
whole thing. It was so it was so vanilla, Like
it was so vanilla that I laughed. I'm like this
was cutting edge back then. I'm like, this was like
what was like the cool thing? Like I guess the
thing I look back on Kit and I, Kit Hoover

(41:22):
and I. We had such a great relationship and such
a comic relief for that show, like we get We
got into so much even the producers rolled their eyes
with I just remember the good times and going everywhere.
I mean we went to thirty six states in three months,
and you know I was on the Today Show as
a Barnum and Bailey clown, like with Matt Lower, who's
not even there anymore. I mean, you name it. We

(41:45):
did it, like I'm saying, rode the race card, did
the skydiving, did the bungee jumping. Did I was one
of seven people that had stood on top of the
President's head on Mount Rushmore. Like we got to do
so much crazy ship that. You know, looking back now,
you appreciate a lot because when I'm twenty one years old,
I'm like, this is cool. This is but like you
don't it doesn't sink in like it does now. So

(42:06):
the fact that, you know, I can say I did
all these crazy things and then to come full circle
with what we're doing now is like that's a reality
pioneers dream is to relive that moment. That was just
so fun and I loved it, and I loved every
second on that show. I love filming on every second
of this show. And it's just it was an amazing time.

(42:26):
Road Rules was you know, it was critically acclaimed. I
mean it was like a show where it wasn't just
people thought, hey, I like the show. It was like
a critically acclaimed reality show of its time. To do
that and to be you know, have four Winnebago it's
like a like a traveling circus and be able to
pull all this off. It was super cool. A lot
of people get their fifteen minutes and aren't able to

(42:48):
do anything with it, and then there are people who
are able to use that forward momentum and really create
something special. I mean, you you did Road Rules and
then I mean like you did like MTV Sports, you
in Fox Realities, you needed reality or remixed. You are
like the gadget guru. You've done a lot of stuff
and then now you're an e P on the challenge

(43:08):
all Stars for all of our listeners out there, what's
one piece of advice that you live by that's helped
you that kind of like create this forward of momentum
throughout your career. You know, wells It's so simple. And
I've said this many times. One of my most favorite
jobs I've ever had was the show on Fox Reality
Reality Remix, I hosted with Kennedy, who's now on Fox News.

(43:29):
It was it was like entertainment Tonight, but it was
for reality shows. I went. I did so many cast visits.
They flew me to China to cover Survivor China. But
I think the biggest takeaway that I've taken from being
a reality start growing up is I never took myself
too seriously. I was always responsible if I had a
call time at ten o'clock. I was sitting out in
the parking lot at nine thirty. And there was so

(43:50):
many people that I tried to get involved in Reality
Remix that's a correspondent to kind of throw them a bone.
These people just dropped the ball left and right, and
I won't even drops but some of the big ones
I think would have really helped launch what they're doing.
Just by being responsible and not being an asshole. So
like like you like you doing your podcast and continuing
and being out there and being responsible. You're set is amazing,

(44:13):
Like you're taking everything you know, it's it's fun, but
you take it seriously. And I know every type of
reality thing, whether that I'm doing All Stars, where I'm
doing a guest spot on you know, a different television show,
or the Gadget Group. I always thought this could be
my last job, so I want to be hit it
out of the park in every way in terms of
being nice to the production, having them say, god, that

(44:36):
guy Mark was awesome to work with, showing up on time,
being prepared. So that sounds very basic, but in the
world of reality TV, some of the cast members that
have the biggest potential just dropped the ball by just
not taking things seriously, and it it pisces me off.
So I was like, I could have had so many people,
so many jobs during that that that series, and it

(44:58):
just it was disheartening to watch. And then now you know,
now they're like, oh, now I want to do this,
and well, you know, great, but you had a chance
to do a lot of that and you just, you know,
I don't know if it was age, but I mean
it's just if you're watching. If you want to be
a reality star, be real. Don't go in with any
altered things of what you think the producers will watch.

(45:19):
Be yourself. You never know who they're going to pick.
And if you are a reality star, you know, be responsible.
Take your job seriously. You know, come prepared, show up
on time, be creative. Like I can tell just by
looking at your set that you're like me and you
take things seriously and you you're good at it, so
they should follow both of us are both of our
our path. Well, So that was my That's kind of

(45:41):
my advice. I always say, it's really hard to get
rid of someone who's really really easy to work with.
That's showing up on time, that's being super nice to everyone.
You should be nice everyone just because you're not. Yeah,
being easy to work with I think is like one
of the most important things on your resume, or it
should be. I think you could go back to every

(46:01):
job I've had an entertainment and not only would they
probably say it was easy to work with their Like dude,
if we asked him to pool cables, he would have
done it because I was that involved and invested in
what we were doing. And why wouldn't you be nice?
You know? I mean, they're giving you an opportunity of
a lifetime. That's why. You know. There was a few
times even on All Stars were a few cast members
just kind of weren't that nice to production. I'm like, dude,

(46:23):
you could be replaced in the snap of a finger.
Just be nice. We're here to do a job. You're
getting paid. It's like, shut up, I'm running out of
time with you before lets you go. You got time
with some rapid fire questions. Oh of course, all right,
here we go rapid fire questions with Mark Long's and
the challenge you All Stars Number one frapizza, topic, sausage,
favorite book. Uh, I'm not a book guy. I'm like,
I'm not like an entertainment magazine guru, all of them.

(46:46):
Who's your first kiss? Oh? Her name was? I forgot her.
Oh her name was like, I don't know, like a
Joe Anne. And I kissed her. I brought her a
gold he like a little balloon like balloon that you
wear on your thing, a gold balloon necklace on the
side of how in elementary school? And I kissed her
so romantic. What was the first concert? Everyone to? First
concert was Hammer with Vanilla Ice opening. You just aide

(47:09):
yourself again? Right there? Oh yeah, baby? First job you
ever had? The first job I ever had was at
Taco bell. I was fifteen years old, and I lied
and said I was sixteen, and I did the drive
through and I would give all my friends free ship.
First car you ever owned, making model Honda Accord still
running today. I'm sure still running, baby. Who would you
call to get you out of jail? Andrew Queller a

(47:31):
buddy of mine. He's he's just he looks like a bouncer.
He looks like a hit man. He just tattoos on
his neck. I call him first. Do you want an Emmy?
Who did you think first in your speech? Oh? I
gotta think moms. I think Moms and Dad. First record
or c D you owned? You want to hear something hilarious?
I think it was Madonna because I remember playing I
remember right, here's another aging. I remember riding down my

(47:53):
street on my bike holding like a jam box playing
Lucky Star. I thought I was cool. Celebrity crush I
mean younger, like who didn't have a crush on Pam Anderson, right,
I mean when she when I was younger and she
was younger, Pam Anderson was my crush. I always like
Carmen Elector too. She was cool early days of both
of them twenty years ago. How would you describe your
high school self? You know how to give out superlatives.

(48:14):
In high school, I got best attitude. I'm like, is
that cool or is that lame? But no, I was.
I always was friends with everyone. I was friends with
the guys on the football team, and I was friends
with the guys in the Rocket club because I just
always I was never the bullying guy. I always want
to me, I like to make everyone in the room
feel cool and feel comfortable. That's always been like a

(48:36):
thing that I've tried to, you know, even to this day,
Like if I see someone getting picked on or getting
you know, I try to like diffuse that as quick
as possible. And last one, you've done a lot. What's
one thing you haven't done in your career that you'd
like to I think the evolution of me is kind
of like yourself. I think I've been in it so
long that I could have like a serious sex m
podcasts of reality all reality and really go back and

(48:59):
and and pull out. The have so many stories, dude,
from Playboy mansion to getting arrested, like, so many stories
that are just haven't been out. I can see that
or I'd love to, you know, kind of host something
on my own base around what I'm doing now, we'll see.
That would be cool. And I mean, the world is
the worster now with with the success of this show,
hopefully we'll do many seasons of this. I feel confident
we will. You know, I'll be coming back to you

(49:20):
in a few years saying remember that super Bowl idea.
It's happening, so we'll see. You should write a book, dude.
Oh yeah, oh yeah, I'd have to get that cleared. Yeah,
a lot of people gotta wait for a couple of
nbas to expire. Yes, exactly. Uh. Mark Long, thank you
so much for being on the Welles cast. You are
an absolute delight to talk to. I totally get it.

(49:41):
It makes total sense to me why you've been doing
this for so long. Everyone out there, The Challenge All
Stars is on Paramount Plus right now, make sure you
go watch it. Where do people follow you to keep
up with your stuff? You can follow me everywhere Twitter,
Instagram at the mark long Easy. Thank you, brother man.
This was so much fun. Thank you Wells. I appreciate you, brother.

(50:01):
Subscribe to Wells cast on I Heart Radio, Apple Podcasts,
or anywhere you get your podcasts. It's the internet line,
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