October 18, 2024 • 29 mins
Ever wondered how vaccines work? Nimene finds out by creating a new hip-hop track about Nobel Prize-winning biochemist Kati Kariko. Featuring an interview between neurosurgeon and CNN correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta and an 11 year old named Ilyana.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hey, listeners, Niminy here, host of historical records, get ready
to hear about a historical hero through hip hop although.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Parents and teachers.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
You can download a free activity related to today's episode
by visiting story pirates dot com slash Historical Records and
now onto the show.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
After a few words for the grown ups.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
Tina, but can you hear me up there?
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Excellent? Is the tent air tight? Tina?
Speaker 1 (00:38):
I need you to be one hundred percent sure. Try
for one last big pull.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Hey, oh that looks good.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
Great work, Tina, The tent is airtight on the secret booker.
Now are we sure that both our lovely historians are
out of the tent?
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Out? That's right, Gabe is on vacation. Oh and where
is Lee? She's right behind me?
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Hello, oh okay, we are all accounted for it now, Tina,
are we ready to fill the tent with poisonous gas
to kill the termites that are eating our recording studio?
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Then let it rip, go, go, go.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
A historical.
Speaker 5 (01:30):
You are now listening to historical.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
We're to make history. You got to have struggles to
make history.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
You got to show poised, cannot be quiet loud as
a riot to make history.
Speaker 6 (01:41):
You gotta make some noise.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Hello, listeners, Welcome back to historical records, where history.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Meets hip hop.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
I'm niminy and I'm also very itchy.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
That's because not.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Only do we have termites eating our recording studio, we
also have a rash of ruthless mosquitoes and our sleeping quarters.
So we're really hoping the sulfural fluoride takes care of
it all, right, Tina, you also have fleas. Oh well,
when it rains, it pours bugs.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Apparently, I agree. So many setbacks.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
How is a woman supposed to make a historical record
around here?
Speaker 2 (02:25):
But we can only deal with one thing.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
At a time, and right now we have to get
into today's historical hero, Katie Kyrieko. Lee, let's get into it. Lee,
what'sn't she just standing right here? What in the world
she just walked into the tent, Lee, it's super unsafe
to waltz into an airtight ted currently filly with noxious gas.
(02:50):
And now she's coming back out. Well, at least she's
wearing a hazmat suit.
Speaker 6 (02:55):
Lee, what are you doing?
Speaker 2 (02:56):
I I can't hear you from in.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
I have maat suit.
Speaker 5 (03:01):
I said I left something inside I had to get
it and not to worry. I used to be a
fumigation professional and briefly had my own fumigation business.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
You did well.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
I guess that explains why you have a hazmat suit
that says Lee's got gas.
Speaker 5 (03:17):
Yeah, that was the name of my business. Got less
funny every time I had to say it. That makes
sense anyway. That career is history, now get it. Speaking
of which, shall we dive into today's historical figure. She
helped make the fastest vaccine in history possible, Katie Kiko.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
Yes, I am dying to get into all of that,
but real quick, what was so important that you had
to go back inside the secret underground bunker?
Speaker 5 (03:44):
Oh? I forgot helmets for my new history simulator.
Speaker 1 (03:48):
You have a new history simulator. What happened to the
gooey alien pod?
Speaker 7 (03:53):
Well?
Speaker 5 (03:53):
I heard your feedback, namely that it was gross and
unpleasant to be in, which further record, I disagree with Lee.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
It dripped fair.
Speaker 5 (04:02):
That part was disgusting.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
So what's the new history simulator?
Speaker 2 (04:07):
And please tell me it's non viscous.
Speaker 5 (04:09):
Tina should be pulling it around any second.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
WHOA, The new History simulator is a motorcycle nine dude.
Speaker 5 (04:21):
Thanks Tina Ley.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
This probably goes without saying, but this rad motorcycle is
way better than that glowing, gooey sack we used to
get around in. Also, how did you get your hands
on such.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
A killer hog?
Speaker 5 (04:35):
Well, around the same time I ran a fumigation company,
I got really into restoring vintage motorcycles.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Hop on, jumping on.
Speaker 5 (04:45):
Now, the history Katie Carco has made is pretty recent.
But first I thought we'd go back a touch before
Katie's life to understand Katie's contributions.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
I want to.
Speaker 5 (04:54):
Check out the first vaccines ever made.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
I like it.
Speaker 5 (04:59):
Oh, and heads up that vaccines are pretty complicated, so
I'm not sure how you'll make it into a catchy saw.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
Sounds like I.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
Might have to come up with an analogy.
Speaker 5 (05:08):
Ooh, brilliant, nimone, something simple that can help explain something complicated.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Now hang on tight woah, oh oh wow.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
This is a quaint countryside Sure.
Speaker 5 (05:22):
Is England in seventeen sixty eight.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
So this is about twenty years before America was even
recognized as.
Speaker 5 (05:30):
A country, right exactly. Now follow me into this little
countryside home that's being used as a hospital. Fair warning,
if you thought the alien pod was gross.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Hold on to your.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Lunch ew ewly, what are those people doing with that
infected skin tissue?
Speaker 5 (05:48):
They're introducing it to healthy people.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Excuse me, they're making people sick on purpose. Bingo.
Speaker 5 (05:55):
Both here in England and back in America, everyone was
fighting a disease called smallpox.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
And they're finding the smallpox by making people sick.
Speaker 5 (06:04):
Indeed, they introduced just a little bit of the disease
so that people's bodies can get used to it.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Ah, I see what a wild idea get this?
Speaker 5 (06:13):
In America, this practice was introduced to the colonies by
an enslaved man named Onesimus, who was originally from West Africa.
In Europe, a mother named Lady Mary Wortley Montague popularized
the practice by requesting it for her own children after
seeing it help protect young people in Turkey.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
So lots of different people were working on this same idea.
Speaker 5 (06:34):
Uh huh, precisely. Now follow me to the medical barn.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
Did you just say medical barn?
Speaker 5 (06:42):
Sure did? It'll all make sense in a second.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Lee, Who was that doctor over there?
Speaker 5 (06:49):
That's John Fuster. He's trying to inoculate all of the
farmers and milkmaids. In the English countryside so they don't
get smallpox.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
And who's the guy following him around?
Speaker 5 (07:00):
That's Edward Jenner.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
And what is Edward doing with the cows? Are the
cows sick?
Speaker 5 (07:05):
Edward Jenner is the one who's eventually credited with creating
the first ever vaccine, And yeah, those cows are sick.
They have cowpoks. And it turns out if you get
cowpox before smallpox, it makes the smallpox way less deadly.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
M who knew Edward Jenner? Oh right, I have to
say leeve you were right. Vaccines are complicated.
Speaker 5 (07:29):
They really are.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
But luckily I just thought of the perfect analogy. The
human body.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Is like a house, and when we get sick, that's
like getting termites. The termites are eating the house, so
you gotta use gas. That's the vaccines to get healthy. Again,
not bad. I knew I could use this horrible experience
to my advantage somehow, but I wouldn't say it's.
Speaker 5 (07:51):
The perfect analogy. There's a little more to the science
of vaccines, which we'll find out about when we learn
about Katie Carrico's work.
Speaker 1 (07:59):
Totally, I just can't stop thinking about the termites. Let's
head to Katie's time period I'm sure I'll come.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Up with a better analogy.
Speaker 5 (08:07):
Sounds good. Hang on, tight, Katie, here we come.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Wh Where are we?
Speaker 6 (08:18):
Wait?
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Wait, wait, don't tell me.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
A cracked bell that doesn't ring, a building called Independence Hall,
and a man yelling about sid which is cheese steaks
for sale.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
The best cheese steaks are on this side of the
Schoogl River. She's so hot it'll melt your face. Get
them all, they're dangerous.
Speaker 1 (08:35):
Lee, We're in Philadelphia, you bet we are.
Speaker 2 (08:39):
Do you know what year?
Speaker 1 (08:41):
Judging by that walkman blasting Madonna? That kid playing the
first ever Nintendo system, and that's super cool guy rocking
a flat top haircut, I'm gonna guess we're in nineteen eighty.
Speaker 5 (08:53):
Five, right on the money. At any minute now, something
else pretty rad will arrive in Philly, a Hungarian scientist.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Look, there's Katie Kyriko getting out of a cab. She's
with her husband and her two and a half year old.
That's Susan.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
Oh, Susan is holding a huge stuffed bear.
Speaker 5 (09:15):
He's so cute and so useful.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
WHOA did Katy just take a load of cash out
of Susan's stuff bear?
Speaker 5 (09:23):
Sure did? Because of super restrictive laws and hungry Katy
was not allowed to bring any money into the US,
so she hits them in her daughter's stuffed bear.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Now what is she taken out of the bear?
Speaker 5 (09:34):
Research supplies?
Speaker 2 (09:35):
That is one helpful bear, Lee.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
Katie must be super excited to be in America where
she doesn't have to hide her money and supplies.
Speaker 5 (09:44):
Actually not really. Unlike a lot of her scientist colleagues,
Katie didn't want to move to the US. She only
came because the lab that she worked for lost its funding,
and hungry, the US was her only option.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
So where is Katy headed? Now?
Speaker 5 (09:58):
First things, first, to a.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
Bank, good call.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
Gotta put that cash somewhere a little less sketchy.
Speaker 5 (10:04):
And going into a bank was quite an experience for
Katie because she'd never used a bank before, never had
a credit card. Everything here in Philly is new to her.
That's why she looks like she has a stomach ache.
She was nervous.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
Just imagine the stomach ache that stuffed bare head. Anyway,
where does Katie head after the bank to her new
research job at Temple University.
Speaker 5 (10:28):
Right here in Philadelphia? Hey, let's head to the lab way.
So Katie got to work doing her research. But after
a few years things got a little dicey uh oh,
she got reported to immigration.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Did she have to leave the country.
Speaker 5 (10:46):
No, she was able to stay. But her whole career
she had to fight every step of the way. In
nineteen ninety five she lost funding again. She kept having
to switch universities and eventually she landed at the University
of Pennsylvania.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Oh and this in.
Speaker 5 (11:00):
Twenty thirteen, they threatened to demote her and said she
was a faculty material.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
So she lost her funding again. Yep, why is she
always losing her funding?
Speaker 5 (11:12):
Good question. Katie had a really radical idea about vaccines,
and not everyone believed that her idea would ever work.
You see, every vaccine that has ever been created has
been made one way. They put a weekend or inactivated
germ into our bodies. They used part of the virus
to infect us, a little bit like.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
The cowpox we saw earlier.
Speaker 5 (11:33):
Exactly, if you give someone cowpox, or let's say just
a little bit of smallpox, their body starts to build immunity,
so if they ever get full blown smallpox, their immune
system is prepared and can fight the virus.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
But Katie had a different idea.
Speaker 5 (11:50):
Katie wanted to develop a different type of vaccine entirely,
a vaccine called an mRNA vaccine.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
And how are mRNA vaccines different from traditional ones?
Speaker 5 (12:02):
Okay, so mRNA vaccines actually teach your body cells how
to make a protein and then that protein triggers an
immune response if someone gets infected with the disease. Wow,
the messenger rna. mRNA basically teaches the body how to
make its own medicine. Pretty mind blowing.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Huh and complicated.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
I am seeing now why Matt's Hermite analogy.
Speaker 5 (12:27):
Fell a little short.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
But lee back to Katie. Did she eventually find someone
who believed in her?
Speaker 2 (12:32):
She did.
Speaker 5 (12:33):
Along the way she connected with a man named Drew Weissman,
and they worked side by side through the ups and
downs for decades.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
And did they ever actually create a vaccine?
Speaker 5 (12:43):
Their work was the foundation that helped create the first
ever vaccine for COVID nineteen.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
That was Katie Carrico.
Speaker 5 (12:51):
When COVID happened, everything shut down and we needed a
vaccine fast.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
I remember, life became all about staying home wearing masks
and decided if you were gonna get professional zoom or
just stick with the regular version.
Speaker 5 (13:04):
Now, Normally vaccines take five to ten years to develop,
but because Katie had already been working on mRNA for decades,
she was able to develop a covid vaccine in only
a couple of years.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
So cool.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
So the covid vaccines were the first ever mRNA vaccines.
Speaker 5 (13:22):
They were.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
Indeed, Katie must feel pretty validated.
Speaker 8 (13:26):
Huh.
Speaker 5 (13:27):
Funny story when she got the phone call that she
had won the Nobel Prize.
Speaker 9 (13:32):
Katie Carrico for your contributions to the field of therapeutic
vaccinations through modifying a chemical building block of mRNA.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Do you win a Nobel Prize?
Speaker 1 (13:42):
Lookly, Katie is completely shocked.
Speaker 5 (13:45):
That's because she actually didn't believe them.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
She thought it was a joke.
Speaker 9 (13:49):
No, ma'am, I am completely one hundred percent serious that
you just want the Nobel Prize, and I am as
insistent as a.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Vaccine that you accept the award. Lee, Please tell me
she accepted the award.
Speaker 6 (14:01):
She did.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
It occurs to me that this is all such recent history.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Is Katie still working?
Speaker 3 (14:09):
Yeah?
Speaker 7 (14:09):
She is.
Speaker 5 (14:10):
In twenty twenty three, she returned to Hungary and is
now teaching at a university there, and her daughter, Susan
is all grown up. In fact, she is a two
time Olympic gold medalist in rowing.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Incredible look plea.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Thank you for all this information. I think I have
plenty for the song we're making about Katie.
Speaker 5 (14:30):
But don't you still need an analogy to explain how
vaccines work out?
Speaker 1 (14:35):
I got a one, you did, Yeah, it involves a
bunch of sheep and a wolf. Trust me as perfect,
no doubt.
Speaker 5 (14:44):
Let's head home.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
What?
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Oh no, the Secret Bunker is still tempted. How am
I gonna make today's song without a recording studio?
Speaker 5 (14:57):
What a bummer. I guess you'll have to finish tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
But I have the listeners listening right now.
Speaker 5 (15:03):
Oh sorry, Nimoni.
Speaker 1 (15:05):
You know what, maybe termites intenting wasn't the perfect analogy
for vaccines, but Katie's story is the perfect inspiration for
this day that I'm having. If Katie can overcome all
those obstacles, I can still produce this song. Tina on
the records, Tina, we still have our camping tent and
(15:27):
all that.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
Foam stored in the garage.
Speaker 1 (15:29):
Yes, great, We've got to build a pop up sound boost.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
Listeners, full tape. I just need a second. We're gonna
improvise a little yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Tina looking good, A little tape, a little glue, Okay,
a lot of tape and a lot of glue, Tina,
That's what I'm talking about.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
Boom, And just like that, we have a steat.
Speaker 6 (16:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
They are pop up recording studio musicians. It's time to
make Katie Carrico's life into some music, and of course,
explain vaccines with a perfect analogy.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
Hello world, I'm Katie Carrico. I help develop the in
vitro transcribe messenger RNA for protein therapies, directly leading to
the ninety nine percent effective Pfizer BioNTech coronavirus vaccine. But
in order to understand what the heck I just said,
let me break down some science for you.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
Starting with how vaccines work.
Speaker 3 (16:38):
Think of your body as a field full of sheep
aka white lets sells oppression so clean, and think of
a disease like a wolf's so mean.
Speaker 5 (16:45):
The wolf wants to eat all that.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
She'd bet the scene he come mon men in his
sheet's clothes and from his head to his noos.
Speaker 6 (16:52):
Gotta coat of protein.
Speaker 3 (16:54):
If the sheep gets you, then they get deep teen
the vaccines like the first time the wolf gets seen
little mini wolf who has been we can give a
hint of the wolf. So the sheep gets this thing,
an alarm that can bring if.
Speaker 6 (17:06):
The wolf back again.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
So the sheep know not to let the big wolf tend.
So when the whole world entangled in COVID nineteen ourselves
need vaccines, then they need them with speed, but it
takes many years.
Speaker 6 (17:17):
Just to test.
Speaker 3 (17:18):
Send for Tita and let the keen scientist has a
plan to succeed. That's me Katie cobra Goo, a hero
trying to change the world.
Speaker 6 (17:25):
But she ain't got a WeGo.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
She feels her contributions are ultimately equal to many scientists
in her field.
Speaker 6 (17:32):
Here we go, ok.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
My research my neck wasn't mmr rene.
Speaker 6 (17:57):
That's messenger rival Nuclay ads it. Okay.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
The easiest way you can think about that is as
a teen three D printer.
Speaker 2 (18:05):
The fact it's like match it.
Speaker 3 (18:06):
If it gets fed up protein, it will match it,
making replications at the drop of a hat and sending
them wherever they are needed in the body. Then the
process gets repeated and repeated, and my thumb the covergo
moment of Eureka was when I was in the lab
with my burners and my beakers. I thought, what if
we take that printer and we tweak it, we teach
it only to make the proteins that we feed it.
(18:27):
Why then we could create growth ages of ensigns, empty
bodies made at a rate that was ten times faster
than before. I knew that this would change it at all.
I tried to tell the world, but nobody listen. You
don't call them meet kay Ica, recop and veto trying
to say the courus, but got fatted like Mosito, surviving
adult with fucking perseverance by the kilo, even in the
(18:47):
years when she had zero.
Speaker 6 (18:48):
Wherever we go?
Speaker 3 (19:06):
Okay, thirty years later, I had spent the intervening time
trying to get grants, get published, get some meetings lined
up with power players to make moneys and connections matter.
All I got instead was the motions and rejection letters.
Speaker 5 (19:22):
Sadly they thought my.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
Research was too far away, but I stayed.
Speaker 3 (19:26):
The course continued downe with RNA, ended up at pen
met a scientists a nice man name of true Weissman.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
We drew up a nice plan.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
Finally, through the work, we paid dues and made moves,
had a break free for your tech. But we stayed
through Kate Ruth slow, but always knew one day soon
Team K Drew.
Speaker 5 (19:42):
Would be ready to come and save you.
Speaker 2 (19:44):
Twenty twenty.
Speaker 3 (19:45):
Now the COVID bhoopas some of the two scientists got
the three printers Cu that's his vac scene in history.
Made dinners with my scientists for years that had always
been business like me. Hey, Dica Rico meet, Oh my,
I'm keeper sticking to her science, Zipic. After this, we
hope she'll be no longer in got Grito.
Speaker 5 (20:03):
Now she'll have a name that we know.
Speaker 7 (20:05):
So we go.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
We'll be right back after a few words for the
grown ups. Oh wow, what a song.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
I have to say that mobile recording studio sounds just
a state of the art. Is our permanent set up. Tina,
you're good at what you do.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Coal y'are welcome, Tina. You're right, Tina. The fumigation is done.
Let's pull the tent. Oh brilliant.
Speaker 1 (21:28):
Let's head inside for the interview. First, I'll just punch
in the door code.
Speaker 10 (21:35):
Well, gone back, n Minnie. I am drilled to report
that we are Hermite tree.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
That's great news. Robot voice.
Speaker 10 (21:44):
I had a virus called termite, and I needed a
vaccine called fumigation. That's an analogy.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
That's the analogy I used, but actually disembodied, robot voice.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
I came up with a better analogy.
Speaker 10 (21:57):
Well aren't you special?
Speaker 2 (21:59):
No man to be rude, robot voice.
Speaker 10 (22:02):
I was being sincere.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
Well, this day really turned around, and what extraordinary luck
to be alive when we have these miraculous vaccines home listeners,
I mean, when you really stop and think about it,
how wild is it that we can make medicine that
helps teach our bodies how to fight diseases?
Speaker 2 (22:23):
Incredible?
Speaker 1 (22:24):
I think about it a lot, robot voice, I forgot
you were here.
Speaker 10 (22:29):
I am always here silently judging, calculating, and things are perfect.
And thinking about vaccines.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
Okay, robot, that's enough.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
Thinking about your existence too much gets a little weird. Also,
I got a head off to the zoom room for
the interview.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Oh man, oh man, I can't wait for today's interview.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Our first guest you may have seen him on CNN
reporting the news, doctor Gupta.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
Can you introduce yourself.
Speaker 7 (23:01):
My name is Sandre I'm a doctor. I've been reporting
on the COVID pandemic since the very beginning. I've been
a reporter for twenty years.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
And to interview Sandrey say, hello, Iliana.
Speaker 8 (23:13):
Hi, I'm Eliana. I'm eleven, and I have three pets,
a mouse, a dog, and a leopard gecko.
Speaker 1 (23:19):
Ileana, when you were learning about doctor Kirico, what struck
you the most?
Speaker 8 (23:24):
I think just the simple fact that she was a
girl and hungry with a father that worked at a
butcher shop, and from there she has stemmed into this
scientist who really did the base work for mRNA and
is one of the main reasons we have this vaccine today.
Speaker 7 (23:40):
Yeah, and she didn't give up. There are a lot
of people along the way who told her this wasn't
going to work, and I just think there's something to
be said for believing in your idea, of believing in yourself,
and she's one of those people.
Speaker 8 (23:52):
And also just the fact that she thought gender didn't
have anything to do with it. She was like, oh, no,
it's not my gender. I just this is just how
it works. You get projected a lot. But also I
think if she was a white male that came up
to people and said, I found this thing. You can
program mRNA, we can make a vaccine out of it.
Eventually there would be people lining up at our door.
(24:14):
It wouldn't be as long as a process if she
was a male.
Speaker 7 (24:17):
I think you're probably right. And the thing about science
as well, is that rejecting an idea or not getting
a paper published, people sometimes describe that as failure, but
failure is necessary almost within science. You're not going to
have the best idea right out of the gate. You
have an idea, but then you've got to tweak it
and going through the process of applying for grants and
(24:39):
talking to other scientists around the world allow people to
keep helping you make it better, and you eventually have
a better product.
Speaker 1 (24:45):
So doctor Gupta, let's say someone not me, of course,
it's still a little confused about this whole mRNA business.
Can you explain what mRNA is and how mRNA vaccines work.
Speaker 7 (24:58):
Basically, mRNA is a molecule that tells a cell to
do something, and in this case, you're getting a shot
in your arm of this mRNA vaccine. It's not the virus.
It's basically the instructions for a portion of the virus,
which is that spike protein. Then that protein sits on
the surface of the cells and the body says, WHOA,
(25:20):
what is this unusual protein here? And as a result
of sort of detecting this unusual protein, the body starts
to react activate the immune system. That's essentially turning your
body into a vaccine making machine. In the past, you
give portions of the virus or pathogen for the body
to recognize it and react. Here you're giving the genetic instructions, saying,
(25:42):
make this weird looking thing and then allow yourself to
react to this weird looking thing.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
Eleana, was there anything else you wanted to ask Doctor
Gupta before we wrap up?
Speaker 8 (25:52):
So what do you think is the most important lesson
you've learned from the pandemic? I know mine is definitely
don't take school for granted, because I was like about
school and then I lost it and it was just like, no,
I love school.
Speaker 7 (26:08):
One thing that I've always felt about myself was that
I'm not a really social person, and I kind of
thought of social things as just purely kind of recreational.
And I think when I was not able to be social,
I really missed it. Humans are inherently very social creatures,
and I kind of really felt like I needed the
(26:28):
human connection more than ever. I will never miss the
opportunity to spend quality time with friends again.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
I definitely can relate to that.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
Thank you both for such an awesome conversation.
Speaker 7 (26:40):
Allian, You're delightful to talk to. I appreciate the time,
appreciate the questions, and thank you so much.
Speaker 8 (26:45):
Thank you, Bye bye.
Speaker 2 (26:50):
Listeners.
Speaker 1 (26:50):
Thanks for tuning in and learning about vaccines and the
awesome career of the great Katie Carrico. A big thanks
to today's guests doctor Sanje Gupta and Iliana Remember parents
and teachers. You can download a free activity related to
today's episode by visiting story pirates dot com Slash Historical
(27:12):
Records and also thanks to Lee for letting me borrow
her motorcycle history simulator to run.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Some errands I got up.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
Bring a few things up before I make the next
historical record. Until then, remember to make history, you gotta
make some noise.
Speaker 9 (27:27):
Bue Historical Records is produced in partnership with story Pirate Studios,
Questloves two on five Entertainment, John Glickman and iHeart Podcasts
Executive produced by Emir Questlove Thompson, John Glickman, le Overtree
(27:51):
and Benjamin Saltga Executive produced for iHeart Podcasts by Noel Brown.
Producers for Story Pirate Studios are Isabella Riccio, Sam Bear,
Eric Gerson, Andrew Miller, Lee Overtree, Peter McNerney and niminy Ware.
Producers for two one five are Sean g Brittany Benjamin
and Sarah Zolman. Hosted by niminy Ware. Our head writer
(28:13):
is Duke Doyle. Our historians are Gabe Pacheco and Lee Polus.
Music supervision for two one five by Stroe Elliott. Scoring
and music supervision for Story Pired Studios by Eric Gerson.
Sound designed and mixing by Sam Bear at the Relic
Room in New York City. Song mastering by Josh Hahn.
Theme song by Dan Foster and Eric Gerson and produced
(28:35):
by Eric Gerson. Production coordination by Isabel Aricio. Production management
by Maggie Lee. The line producer for Story Pired Studios
is Glennis Prault. Key r for Story Pired Studios is
provided by Naomi Shaw. Episode artwork by Camilla Franklin. This
episode was written by Duke Doyle. The song Katie Carrico
(28:55):
was written by Dan Foster and produced by Eric Erson.
Special guest doctor Sanjay Kupta and kid interviewer Ileana This
episode features performances by Hannah Corrigan, Peter McNerney, Emily Olcott,
Lee Overtree, and Lee Polas
Hey, listeners, Niminy here, host of historical records, get ready
to hear about a historical hero through hip hop although.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Parents and teachers.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
You can download a free activity related to today's episode
by visiting story pirates dot com slash Historical Records and
now onto the show.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
After a few words for the grown ups.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
Tina, but can you hear me up there?
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Excellent? Is the tent air tight? Tina?
Speaker 1 (00:38):
I need you to be one hundred percent sure. Try
for one last big pull.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Hey, oh that looks good.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
Great work, Tina, The tent is airtight on the secret booker.
Now are we sure that both our lovely historians are
out of the tent?
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Out? That's right, Gabe is on vacation. Oh and where
is Lee? She's right behind me?
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Hello, oh okay, we are all accounted for it now, Tina,
are we ready to fill the tent with poisonous gas
to kill the termites that are eating our recording studio?
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Then let it rip, go, go, go.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
A historical.
Speaker 5 (01:30):
You are now listening to historical.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
We're to make history. You got to have struggles to
make history.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
You got to show poised, cannot be quiet loud as
a riot to make history.
Speaker 6 (01:41):
You gotta make some noise.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Hello, listeners, Welcome back to historical records, where history.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Meets hip hop.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
I'm niminy and I'm also very itchy.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
That's because not.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Only do we have termites eating our recording studio, we
also have a rash of ruthless mosquitoes and our sleeping quarters.
So we're really hoping the sulfural fluoride takes care of
it all, right, Tina, you also have fleas. Oh well,
when it rains, it pours bugs.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Apparently, I agree. So many setbacks.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
How is a woman supposed to make a historical record
around here?
Speaker 2 (02:25):
But we can only deal with one thing.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
At a time, and right now we have to get
into today's historical hero, Katie Kyrieko. Lee, let's get into it. Lee,
what'sn't she just standing right here? What in the world
she just walked into the tent, Lee, it's super unsafe
to waltz into an airtight ted currently filly with noxious gas.
(02:50):
And now she's coming back out. Well, at least she's
wearing a hazmat suit.
Speaker 6 (02:55):
Lee, what are you doing?
Speaker 2 (02:56):
I I can't hear you from in.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
I have maat suit.
Speaker 5 (03:01):
I said I left something inside I had to get
it and not to worry. I used to be a
fumigation professional and briefly had my own fumigation business.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
You did well.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
I guess that explains why you have a hazmat suit
that says Lee's got gas.
Speaker 5 (03:17):
Yeah, that was the name of my business. Got less
funny every time I had to say it. That makes
sense anyway. That career is history, now get it. Speaking
of which, shall we dive into today's historical figure. She
helped make the fastest vaccine in history possible, Katie Kiko.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
Yes, I am dying to get into all of that,
but real quick, what was so important that you had
to go back inside the secret underground bunker?
Speaker 5 (03:44):
Oh? I forgot helmets for my new history simulator.
Speaker 1 (03:48):
You have a new history simulator. What happened to the
gooey alien pod?
Speaker 7 (03:53):
Well?
Speaker 5 (03:53):
I heard your feedback, namely that it was gross and
unpleasant to be in, which further record, I disagree with Lee.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
It dripped fair.
Speaker 5 (04:02):
That part was disgusting.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
So what's the new history simulator?
Speaker 2 (04:07):
And please tell me it's non viscous.
Speaker 5 (04:09):
Tina should be pulling it around any second.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
WHOA, The new History simulator is a motorcycle nine dude.
Speaker 5 (04:21):
Thanks Tina Ley.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
This probably goes without saying, but this rad motorcycle is
way better than that glowing, gooey sack we used to
get around in. Also, how did you get your hands
on such.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
A killer hog?
Speaker 5 (04:35):
Well, around the same time I ran a fumigation company,
I got really into restoring vintage motorcycles.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Hop on, jumping on.
Speaker 5 (04:45):
Now, the history Katie Carco has made is pretty recent.
But first I thought we'd go back a touch before
Katie's life to understand Katie's contributions.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
I want to.
Speaker 5 (04:54):
Check out the first vaccines ever made.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
I like it.
Speaker 5 (04:59):
Oh, and heads up that vaccines are pretty complicated, so
I'm not sure how you'll make it into a catchy saw.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
Sounds like I.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
Might have to come up with an analogy.
Speaker 5 (05:08):
Ooh, brilliant, nimone, something simple that can help explain something complicated.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Now hang on tight woah, oh oh wow.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
This is a quaint countryside Sure.
Speaker 5 (05:22):
Is England in seventeen sixty eight.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
So this is about twenty years before America was even
recognized as.
Speaker 5 (05:30):
A country, right exactly. Now follow me into this little
countryside home that's being used as a hospital. Fair warning,
if you thought the alien pod was gross.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Hold on to your.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Lunch ew ewly, what are those people doing with that
infected skin tissue?
Speaker 5 (05:48):
They're introducing it to healthy people.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Excuse me, they're making people sick on purpose. Bingo.
Speaker 5 (05:55):
Both here in England and back in America, everyone was
fighting a disease called smallpox.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
And they're finding the smallpox by making people sick.
Speaker 5 (06:04):
Indeed, they introduced just a little bit of the disease
so that people's bodies can get used to it.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Ah, I see what a wild idea get this?
Speaker 5 (06:13):
In America, this practice was introduced to the colonies by
an enslaved man named Onesimus, who was originally from West Africa.
In Europe, a mother named Lady Mary Wortley Montague popularized
the practice by requesting it for her own children after
seeing it help protect young people in Turkey.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
So lots of different people were working on this same idea.
Speaker 5 (06:34):
Uh huh, precisely. Now follow me to the medical barn.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
Did you just say medical barn?
Speaker 5 (06:42):
Sure did? It'll all make sense in a second.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Lee, Who was that doctor over there?
Speaker 5 (06:49):
That's John Fuster. He's trying to inoculate all of the
farmers and milkmaids. In the English countryside so they don't
get smallpox.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
And who's the guy following him around?
Speaker 5 (07:00):
That's Edward Jenner.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
And what is Edward doing with the cows? Are the
cows sick?
Speaker 5 (07:05):
Edward Jenner is the one who's eventually credited with creating
the first ever vaccine, And yeah, those cows are sick.
They have cowpoks. And it turns out if you get
cowpox before smallpox, it makes the smallpox way less deadly.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
M who knew Edward Jenner? Oh right, I have to
say leeve you were right. Vaccines are complicated.
Speaker 5 (07:29):
They really are.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
But luckily I just thought of the perfect analogy. The
human body.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Is like a house, and when we get sick, that's
like getting termites. The termites are eating the house, so
you gotta use gas. That's the vaccines to get healthy. Again,
not bad. I knew I could use this horrible experience
to my advantage somehow, but I wouldn't say it's.
Speaker 5 (07:51):
The perfect analogy. There's a little more to the science
of vaccines, which we'll find out about when we learn
about Katie Carrico's work.
Speaker 1 (07:59):
Totally, I just can't stop thinking about the termites. Let's
head to Katie's time period I'm sure I'll come.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Up with a better analogy.
Speaker 5 (08:07):
Sounds good. Hang on, tight, Katie, here we come.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Wh Where are we?
Speaker 6 (08:18):
Wait?
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Wait, wait, don't tell me.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
A cracked bell that doesn't ring, a building called Independence Hall,
and a man yelling about sid which is cheese steaks
for sale.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
The best cheese steaks are on this side of the
Schoogl River. She's so hot it'll melt your face. Get
them all, they're dangerous.
Speaker 1 (08:35):
Lee, We're in Philadelphia, you bet we are.
Speaker 2 (08:39):
Do you know what year?
Speaker 1 (08:41):
Judging by that walkman blasting Madonna? That kid playing the
first ever Nintendo system, and that's super cool guy rocking
a flat top haircut, I'm gonna guess we're in nineteen eighty.
Speaker 5 (08:53):
Five, right on the money. At any minute now, something
else pretty rad will arrive in Philly, a Hungarian scientist.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Look, there's Katie Kyriko getting out of a cab. She's
with her husband and her two and a half year old.
That's Susan.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
Oh, Susan is holding a huge stuffed bear.
Speaker 5 (09:15):
He's so cute and so useful.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
WHOA did Katy just take a load of cash out
of Susan's stuff bear?
Speaker 5 (09:23):
Sure did? Because of super restrictive laws and hungry Katy
was not allowed to bring any money into the US,
so she hits them in her daughter's stuffed bear.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Now what is she taken out of the bear?
Speaker 5 (09:34):
Research supplies?
Speaker 2 (09:35):
That is one helpful bear, Lee.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
Katie must be super excited to be in America where
she doesn't have to hide her money and supplies.
Speaker 5 (09:44):
Actually not really. Unlike a lot of her scientist colleagues,
Katie didn't want to move to the US. She only
came because the lab that she worked for lost its funding,
and hungry, the US was her only option.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
So where is Katy headed? Now?
Speaker 5 (09:58):
First things, first, to a.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
Bank, good call.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
Gotta put that cash somewhere a little less sketchy.
Speaker 5 (10:04):
And going into a bank was quite an experience for
Katie because she'd never used a bank before, never had
a credit card. Everything here in Philly is new to her.
That's why she looks like she has a stomach ache.
She was nervous.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
Just imagine the stomach ache that stuffed bare head. Anyway,
where does Katie head after the bank to her new
research job at Temple University.
Speaker 5 (10:28):
Right here in Philadelphia? Hey, let's head to the lab way.
So Katie got to work doing her research. But after
a few years things got a little dicey uh oh,
she got reported to immigration.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Did she have to leave the country.
Speaker 5 (10:46):
No, she was able to stay. But her whole career
she had to fight every step of the way. In
nineteen ninety five she lost funding again. She kept having
to switch universities and eventually she landed at the University
of Pennsylvania.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Oh and this in.
Speaker 5 (11:00):
Twenty thirteen, they threatened to demote her and said she
was a faculty material.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
So she lost her funding again. Yep, why is she
always losing her funding?
Speaker 5 (11:12):
Good question. Katie had a really radical idea about vaccines,
and not everyone believed that her idea would ever work.
You see, every vaccine that has ever been created has
been made one way. They put a weekend or inactivated
germ into our bodies. They used part of the virus
to infect us, a little bit like.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
The cowpox we saw earlier.
Speaker 5 (11:33):
Exactly, if you give someone cowpox, or let's say just
a little bit of smallpox, their body starts to build immunity,
so if they ever get full blown smallpox, their immune
system is prepared and can fight the virus.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
But Katie had a different idea.
Speaker 5 (11:50):
Katie wanted to develop a different type of vaccine entirely,
a vaccine called an mRNA vaccine.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
And how are mRNA vaccines different from traditional ones?
Speaker 5 (12:02):
Okay, so mRNA vaccines actually teach your body cells how
to make a protein and then that protein triggers an
immune response if someone gets infected with the disease. Wow,
the messenger rna. mRNA basically teaches the body how to
make its own medicine. Pretty mind blowing.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Huh and complicated.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
I am seeing now why Matt's Hermite analogy.
Speaker 5 (12:27):
Fell a little short.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
But lee back to Katie. Did she eventually find someone
who believed in her?
Speaker 2 (12:32):
She did.
Speaker 5 (12:33):
Along the way she connected with a man named Drew Weissman,
and they worked side by side through the ups and
downs for decades.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
And did they ever actually create a vaccine?
Speaker 5 (12:43):
Their work was the foundation that helped create the first
ever vaccine for COVID nineteen.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
That was Katie Carrico.
Speaker 5 (12:51):
When COVID happened, everything shut down and we needed a
vaccine fast.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
I remember, life became all about staying home wearing masks
and decided if you were gonna get professional zoom or
just stick with the regular version.
Speaker 5 (13:04):
Now, Normally vaccines take five to ten years to develop,
but because Katie had already been working on mRNA for decades,
she was able to develop a covid vaccine in only
a couple of years.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
So cool.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
So the covid vaccines were the first ever mRNA vaccines.
Speaker 5 (13:22):
They were.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
Indeed, Katie must feel pretty validated.
Speaker 8 (13:26):
Huh.
Speaker 5 (13:27):
Funny story when she got the phone call that she
had won the Nobel Prize.
Speaker 9 (13:32):
Katie Carrico for your contributions to the field of therapeutic
vaccinations through modifying a chemical building block of mRNA.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Do you win a Nobel Prize?
Speaker 1 (13:42):
Lookly, Katie is completely shocked.
Speaker 5 (13:45):
That's because she actually didn't believe them.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
She thought it was a joke.
Speaker 9 (13:49):
No, ma'am, I am completely one hundred percent serious that
you just want the Nobel Prize, and I am as
insistent as a.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Vaccine that you accept the award. Lee, Please tell me
she accepted the award.
Speaker 6 (14:01):
She did.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
It occurs to me that this is all such recent history.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Is Katie still working?
Speaker 3 (14:09):
Yeah?
Speaker 7 (14:09):
She is.
Speaker 5 (14:10):
In twenty twenty three, she returned to Hungary and is
now teaching at a university there, and her daughter, Susan
is all grown up. In fact, she is a two
time Olympic gold medalist in rowing.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Incredible look plea.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Thank you for all this information. I think I have
plenty for the song we're making about Katie.
Speaker 5 (14:30):
But don't you still need an analogy to explain how
vaccines work out?
Speaker 1 (14:35):
I got a one, you did, Yeah, it involves a
bunch of sheep and a wolf. Trust me as perfect,
no doubt.
Speaker 5 (14:44):
Let's head home.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
What?
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Oh no, the Secret Bunker is still tempted. How am
I gonna make today's song without a recording studio?
Speaker 5 (14:57):
What a bummer. I guess you'll have to finish tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
But I have the listeners listening right now.
Speaker 5 (15:03):
Oh sorry, Nimoni.
Speaker 1 (15:05):
You know what, maybe termites intenting wasn't the perfect analogy
for vaccines, but Katie's story is the perfect inspiration for
this day that I'm having. If Katie can overcome all
those obstacles, I can still produce this song. Tina on
the records, Tina, we still have our camping tent and
(15:27):
all that.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
Foam stored in the garage.
Speaker 1 (15:29):
Yes, great, We've got to build a pop up sound boost.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
Listeners, full tape. I just need a second. We're gonna
improvise a little yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Tina looking good, A little tape, a little glue, Okay,
a lot of tape and a lot of glue, Tina,
That's what I'm talking about.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
Boom, And just like that, we have a steat.
Speaker 6 (16:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
They are pop up recording studio musicians. It's time to
make Katie Carrico's life into some music, and of course,
explain vaccines with a perfect analogy.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
Hello world, I'm Katie Carrico. I help develop the in
vitro transcribe messenger RNA for protein therapies, directly leading to
the ninety nine percent effective Pfizer BioNTech coronavirus vaccine. But
in order to understand what the heck I just said,
let me break down some science for you.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
Starting with how vaccines work.
Speaker 3 (16:38):
Think of your body as a field full of sheep
aka white lets sells oppression so clean, and think of
a disease like a wolf's so mean.
Speaker 5 (16:45):
The wolf wants to eat all that.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
She'd bet the scene he come mon men in his
sheet's clothes and from his head to his noos.
Speaker 6 (16:52):
Gotta coat of protein.
Speaker 3 (16:54):
If the sheep gets you, then they get deep teen
the vaccines like the first time the wolf gets seen
little mini wolf who has been we can give a
hint of the wolf. So the sheep gets this thing,
an alarm that can bring if.
Speaker 6 (17:06):
The wolf back again.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
So the sheep know not to let the big wolf tend.
So when the whole world entangled in COVID nineteen ourselves
need vaccines, then they need them with speed, but it
takes many years.
Speaker 6 (17:17):
Just to test.
Speaker 3 (17:18):
Send for Tita and let the keen scientist has a
plan to succeed. That's me Katie cobra Goo, a hero
trying to change the world.
Speaker 6 (17:25):
But she ain't got a WeGo.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
She feels her contributions are ultimately equal to many scientists
in her field.
Speaker 6 (17:32):
Here we go, ok.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
My research my neck wasn't mmr rene.
Speaker 6 (17:57):
That's messenger rival Nuclay ads it. Okay.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
The easiest way you can think about that is as
a teen three D printer.
Speaker 2 (18:05):
The fact it's like match it.
Speaker 3 (18:06):
If it gets fed up protein, it will match it,
making replications at the drop of a hat and sending
them wherever they are needed in the body. Then the
process gets repeated and repeated, and my thumb the covergo
moment of Eureka was when I was in the lab
with my burners and my beakers. I thought, what if
we take that printer and we tweak it, we teach
it only to make the proteins that we feed it.
(18:27):
Why then we could create growth ages of ensigns, empty
bodies made at a rate that was ten times faster
than before. I knew that this would change it at all.
I tried to tell the world, but nobody listen. You
don't call them meet kay Ica, recop and veto trying
to say the courus, but got fatted like Mosito, surviving
adult with fucking perseverance by the kilo, even in the
(18:47):
years when she had zero.
Speaker 6 (18:48):
Wherever we go?
Speaker 3 (19:06):
Okay, thirty years later, I had spent the intervening time
trying to get grants, get published, get some meetings lined
up with power players to make moneys and connections matter.
All I got instead was the motions and rejection letters.
Speaker 5 (19:22):
Sadly they thought my.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
Research was too far away, but I stayed.
Speaker 3 (19:26):
The course continued downe with RNA, ended up at pen
met a scientists a nice man name of true Weissman.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
We drew up a nice plan.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
Finally, through the work, we paid dues and made moves,
had a break free for your tech. But we stayed
through Kate Ruth slow, but always knew one day soon
Team K Drew.
Speaker 5 (19:42):
Would be ready to come and save you.
Speaker 2 (19:44):
Twenty twenty.
Speaker 3 (19:45):
Now the COVID bhoopas some of the two scientists got
the three printers Cu that's his vac scene in history.
Made dinners with my scientists for years that had always
been business like me. Hey, Dica Rico meet, Oh my,
I'm keeper sticking to her science, Zipic. After this, we
hope she'll be no longer in got Grito.
Speaker 5 (20:03):
Now she'll have a name that we know.
Speaker 7 (20:05):
So we go.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
We'll be right back after a few words for the
grown ups. Oh wow, what a song.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
I have to say that mobile recording studio sounds just
a state of the art. Is our permanent set up. Tina,
you're good at what you do.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Coal y'are welcome, Tina. You're right, Tina. The fumigation is done.
Let's pull the tent. Oh brilliant.
Speaker 1 (21:28):
Let's head inside for the interview. First, I'll just punch
in the door code.
Speaker 10 (21:35):
Well, gone back, n Minnie. I am drilled to report
that we are Hermite tree.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
That's great news. Robot voice.
Speaker 10 (21:44):
I had a virus called termite, and I needed a
vaccine called fumigation. That's an analogy.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
That's the analogy I used, but actually disembodied, robot voice.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
I came up with a better analogy.
Speaker 10 (21:57):
Well aren't you special?
Speaker 2 (21:59):
No man to be rude, robot voice.
Speaker 10 (22:02):
I was being sincere.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
Well, this day really turned around, and what extraordinary luck
to be alive when we have these miraculous vaccines home listeners,
I mean, when you really stop and think about it,
how wild is it that we can make medicine that
helps teach our bodies how to fight diseases?
Speaker 2 (22:23):
Incredible?
Speaker 1 (22:24):
I think about it a lot, robot voice, I forgot
you were here.
Speaker 10 (22:29):
I am always here silently judging, calculating, and things are perfect.
And thinking about vaccines.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
Okay, robot, that's enough.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
Thinking about your existence too much gets a little weird. Also,
I got a head off to the zoom room for
the interview.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Oh man, oh man, I can't wait for today's interview.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Our first guest you may have seen him on CNN
reporting the news, doctor Gupta.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
Can you introduce yourself.
Speaker 7 (23:01):
My name is Sandre I'm a doctor. I've been reporting
on the COVID pandemic since the very beginning. I've been
a reporter for twenty years.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
And to interview Sandrey say, hello, Iliana.
Speaker 8 (23:13):
Hi, I'm Eliana. I'm eleven, and I have three pets,
a mouse, a dog, and a leopard gecko.
Speaker 1 (23:19):
Ileana, when you were learning about doctor Kirico, what struck
you the most?
Speaker 8 (23:24):
I think just the simple fact that she was a
girl and hungry with a father that worked at a
butcher shop, and from there she has stemmed into this
scientist who really did the base work for mRNA and
is one of the main reasons we have this vaccine today.
Speaker 7 (23:40):
Yeah, and she didn't give up. There are a lot
of people along the way who told her this wasn't
going to work, and I just think there's something to
be said for believing in your idea, of believing in yourself,
and she's one of those people.
Speaker 8 (23:52):
And also just the fact that she thought gender didn't
have anything to do with it. She was like, oh, no,
it's not my gender. I just this is just how
it works. You get projected a lot. But also I
think if she was a white male that came up
to people and said, I found this thing. You can
program mRNA, we can make a vaccine out of it.
Eventually there would be people lining up at our door.
(24:14):
It wouldn't be as long as a process if she
was a male.
Speaker 7 (24:17):
I think you're probably right. And the thing about science
as well, is that rejecting an idea or not getting
a paper published, people sometimes describe that as failure, but
failure is necessary almost within science. You're not going to
have the best idea right out of the gate. You
have an idea, but then you've got to tweak it
and going through the process of applying for grants and
(24:39):
talking to other scientists around the world allow people to
keep helping you make it better, and you eventually have
a better product.
Speaker 1 (24:45):
So doctor Gupta, let's say someone not me, of course,
it's still a little confused about this whole mRNA business.
Can you explain what mRNA is and how mRNA vaccines work.
Speaker 7 (24:58):
Basically, mRNA is a molecule that tells a cell to
do something, and in this case, you're getting a shot
in your arm of this mRNA vaccine. It's not the virus.
It's basically the instructions for a portion of the virus,
which is that spike protein. Then that protein sits on
the surface of the cells and the body says, WHOA,
(25:20):
what is this unusual protein here? And as a result
of sort of detecting this unusual protein, the body starts
to react activate the immune system. That's essentially turning your
body into a vaccine making machine. In the past, you
give portions of the virus or pathogen for the body
to recognize it and react. Here you're giving the genetic instructions, saying,
(25:42):
make this weird looking thing and then allow yourself to
react to this weird looking thing.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
Eleana, was there anything else you wanted to ask Doctor
Gupta before we wrap up?
Speaker 8 (25:52):
So what do you think is the most important lesson
you've learned from the pandemic? I know mine is definitely
don't take school for granted, because I was like about
school and then I lost it and it was just like, no,
I love school.
Speaker 7 (26:08):
One thing that I've always felt about myself was that
I'm not a really social person, and I kind of
thought of social things as just purely kind of recreational.
And I think when I was not able to be social,
I really missed it. Humans are inherently very social creatures,
and I kind of really felt like I needed the
(26:28):
human connection more than ever. I will never miss the
opportunity to spend quality time with friends again.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
I definitely can relate to that.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
Thank you both for such an awesome conversation.
Speaker 7 (26:40):
Allian, You're delightful to talk to. I appreciate the time,
appreciate the questions, and thank you so much.
Speaker 8 (26:45):
Thank you, Bye bye.
Speaker 2 (26:50):
Listeners.
Speaker 1 (26:50):
Thanks for tuning in and learning about vaccines and the
awesome career of the great Katie Carrico. A big thanks
to today's guests doctor Sanje Gupta and Iliana Remember parents
and teachers. You can download a free activity related to
today's episode by visiting story pirates dot com Slash Historical
(27:12):
Records and also thanks to Lee for letting me borrow
her motorcycle history simulator to run.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Some errands I got up.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
Bring a few things up before I make the next
historical record. Until then, remember to make history, you gotta
make some noise.
Speaker 9 (27:27):
Bue Historical Records is produced in partnership with story Pirate Studios,
Questloves two on five Entertainment, John Glickman and iHeart Podcasts
Executive produced by Emir Questlove Thompson, John Glickman, le Overtree
(27:51):
and Benjamin Saltga Executive produced for iHeart Podcasts by Noel Brown.
Producers for Story Pirate Studios are Isabella Riccio, Sam Bear,
Eric Gerson, Andrew Miller, Lee Overtree, Peter McNerney and niminy Ware.
Producers for two one five are Sean g Brittany Benjamin
and Sarah Zolman. Hosted by niminy Ware. Our head writer
(28:13):
is Duke Doyle. Our historians are Gabe Pacheco and Lee Polus.
Music supervision for two one five by Stroe Elliott. Scoring
and music supervision for Story Pired Studios by Eric Gerson.
Sound designed and mixing by Sam Bear at the Relic
Room in New York City. Song mastering by Josh Hahn.
Theme song by Dan Foster and Eric Gerson and produced
(28:35):
by Eric Gerson. Production coordination by Isabel Aricio. Production management
by Maggie Lee. The line producer for Story Pired Studios
is Glennis Prault. Key r for Story Pired Studios is
provided by Naomi Shaw. Episode artwork by Camilla Franklin. This
episode was written by Duke Doyle. The song Katie Carrico
(28:55):
was written by Dan Foster and produced by Eric Erson.
Special guest doctor Sanjay Kupta and kid interviewer Ileana This
episode features performances by Hannah Corrigan, Peter McNerney, Emily Olcott,
Lee Overtree, and Lee Polas
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