August 16, 2025 • 38 mins
Are you struggling to find time to date? Striking out when it comes to swiping? Fed up with one-and-done dates?
Kelly Bensimon is telling you why a matchmaker is the way to go! From extensive vetting to relationship coaching, Kelleher International is the REAL deal when it comes to matchmaking!
Plus, Kelly goes straight to the source - what should men and women lighten up on when it comes to dating? The expert's answer might surprise you!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
Welcome back to I Do Part two with your celebrity
mentor Kelly ben Simone. Just like you, guys, I'm out
there dating in my I Do Part two era. And
if you're single and dating like me, you know that
sometimes it's hard to meet great eligible men when you
have a busy schedule, and dating apps can be super disappointing.
(00:33):
So I wanted to explore our conversation around professional matchmakers.
The company has been around for over thirty five years
and they've been featured on Good Morning America, The Today Show,
Entertainment Tonight, and more. They are the real deal. Please
welcome Jennifer Will's President, chief Growth Officer with Kella Hurr International. Jennifer,
(00:55):
I'm super excited to talk to you. Kella hur International
came highly recommended by someone associated with this podcast who
had really successful dates. So tell our audience a little
bit about Kelliher International. How long have you been in
business and how did you get involved?
Speaker 2 (01:11):
Okay, well, thanks for the nice lead in. So kelliher
has been around for almost forty years. We're one of
the oldest and largest players in the field. We specialize
in elite or executive matchmaking services, so people who are successful,
but who are ready to be intentional about how they're
(01:33):
approaching finding this next relationship, whether it's the first, the second,
the third, whatever it might be. But they've decided to
prioritize this and focus on it the way they would
any other important aspect of their life. I've been with
the firm since twenty sixteen. I kind of actually fell
into it a little bit. I'm an attorney and have
(01:54):
a finance background, and I had decided to leave my
previous position as in house counsel for a company in
New York and a friend of mine was working here
and invited me in to meet with the founders, which
I did for an entire day, and then they were
stuck with me. After that, I just fell in love
(02:14):
with the business. I fell in love with them. There
are really very few things that you can do in
this world where you're truly transforming people's lives and having
such a meaningful impact on not only their romantic life,
but their overall relationships and happiness in the world.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
So we're going to get into that because you guys
are twofold. But I wanted to address one thing. It's
the embarrassment and the shame some that we're seeing of matchmakers,
and if a matchmaker is I think the matchmaker does
more vetting and it makes you feel better that there
is a third party kind of you know, being a
(02:55):
part of this, especially with someone like you or you're
not only the third party matchmaking, but also you're counseling
your clients, which is great. But tell me about some
of the perks of using a professional matchmaker.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Well, there are a lot of perks to it. There's
the efficiency aspect. Most people that we work with, they
are very strong in their professional situation. They may have
great families already, but they don't have a lot of
time and it's really the one thing that nobody can recreate.
So providing a level of efficiency meaning that when we're
(03:30):
making these introductions, they're targeted. We've essentially gone on coffee
dates with the candidates, so to speak. We've met them,
we've interviewed them, we've background checked, They've had to go
through an extensive diligence period with us, so we know them.
So there's going to be a level of presumptive alignment
(03:51):
on fundamental values. That really is an open issue. If
you meet somebody just out in the world or online,
they're essentially represents to you whatever it is that they
think that you want to hear, whereas we are really
digging into who people are, asking a lot of open
ended questions and trying to understand. There's also the accountability piece.
(04:12):
When you meet somebody in another format, they can just disappear, right.
It's much more difficult to do that with a matchmaker
because we're following along and they're accountable to us and
we're taking feedback, so there's really nowhere to hide then,
and you kind of alluded to this, there's the advocacy piece, right.
(04:34):
We are a trusted advisor in exactly the same way
that a financial advisor or a legal advisor would be.
We're just handling a different aspect of somebody's life. It's
no less important. But we are the advocate, so we
sit between the client and a candidate, and there are
times where we can facilitate something that maybe on the
surface somebody wouldn't say, now that makes sense, But if
(04:56):
we know both parties, we can help make things come
to together that might not happen without that, without that
level of advocacy in there.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
I love advocacy. I really love that, And I also
love that you know the there are these ultra high
net worth individuals who are laser focused on their work,
you know whether and they've been doing this for years
and the thought of dating is super daunting. So when
you are, you know, with your company with Klhart, what
(05:26):
do you get for it? Like? What are you getting?
How many dates? Like? What are we getting?
Speaker 2 (05:32):
So one of the beautiful things about this is it's
highly customizable. We want to craft a membership that addresses
that particular client's need. So for us, we don't cap introductions.
There are a lot of other firms out there that
are you know, pay x and you get this set
number of introductions to us that creates an immediate conflict
(05:56):
of interests. People are saying, do I take this one?
Do I use this chip? Own know, we have to
produce this person. There's no cap on matches with us. Frankly,
every time we introduce somebody, it's either a home run
or it's a learning proposition for both the firm and
the team and the client. So it's another it's another
(06:17):
way of collecting data that's incredibly valuable as we continue
to refine the search.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
That is amazing. I love how you're talking about this,
I mean like literally luring me in data advocacy, authenticity authority.
I'm like, I am like literally right here with you.
So we're talking about the different parts of it, and
I really like the idea that you guys don't say
like if you have, like you know, ten dates, oh
(06:43):
my god, you're eight, Like what's your what's going to
be your plan? I really like that. That's brilliant. By
the way, So coaching. So we've talked about like the
dating part, but like, what about the coaching part? This,
this is the part that I'm super interested in.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
Well, I'm sure anybody who's ever been in a relationship
will tell you that relationships are not linear, and very often,
particularly when we're not first timers, we've been married or
been in a significant relationship before, or been in multiple
significant relationships. We all have patterns, right, and we all
(07:20):
established narratives and beliefs in our head that may or
may not be accurate. And so the purpose of the
coaching is multifold. First of all, it's a way that
we sort of clear the slate from the beginning of
a relationship and say, Okay, what are your real goals here?
What's going to make you happy in this Do you
want to get married again? Do you not want to
(07:41):
get married again? What is the ultimate goal for this
relationship that you're seeking, And then what has been a
challenge for you in the past, and why do you
suppose it's been a challenge. And let's talk about the
people that you've selected for these relationships, why you were
focused on certain attributes and maybe how that played into
(08:01):
the challenges that you subsequently experienced in the relationship. And
then as you go through the process with us. Again,
there's nothing linear about this. So as you're establishing a
relationship with a new partner, they're going to be triggers.
There's something's going to come up that says, oh, that
(08:22):
reminds me of okay, but it's not him. So let's
talk about why that's happening.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
So, speaking of triggers, should people be fully healed from
divorce or loss of a spouse before they associate with
the matchmaker or what are your thoughts on that?
Speaker 2 (08:39):
So I think fully healed is a really interesting term
because I think all of us walk through life not
fully healed. Right, We're all still learning and growing as
we go. So while somebody needs to have you know,
sort of experienced the acute part of that somebody shouldn't
(09:02):
go you know, it's not a direct line, but that's
also part of the coaching. And there are definitely people
that we as we're meeting them and we see that
maybe these emotions are too raw or they're not really
ready to attract or welcome this new partner, we may say,
let's do six months of just coaching before we start
the matching process, so we can really help people prepare
(09:25):
to get there.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
So is there like a check in? Do you check
in like, you know, every couple of weeks after two dates? Like,
what's the kind of what's the check in process?
Speaker 2 (09:33):
And is there one during the matching process? You mean yes,
so every client works directly with a team, and that
team is multiple people, but we do depending on the
scope of the search and the intricacies of the search,
there can be anything from a standing bi weekly call
to a standing weekly call, and many times they're over
(09:53):
zoom because even though it's not the same as in person,
it is better than a phone call.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
You can kind of accountability. Again, you guys are like.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
Really, oh, people have to be linear.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
In relationships and definitely be accountable.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Yeah, people have to be ready to be a partner
to us and to be and have agency in this process.
That's one of the most interesting things about matchmaking. It
is in no way a unilateral effort. We can't do
it without substantial input and participation from the client.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
Wait, I love that you just said that you have
agency in this process. I love that. I mean we're
talking We're not talking about like swiping, We're talking about
real partnership. I mean, this is well. First of all,
you are unbelievably bright and very articulate, and I really
really love the way that you're talking about it. I mean,
(10:49):
you know, if I were working with you, I would
have a definite sense of ease and comfort because you
are definitely at the helm of this. And that's just
like very cool. So what about living in a big city, Like,
what about the people that live in small towns? I'm
from Rockford, Illinois, Like you know, I mean, is it
(11:12):
just folk? Is it in the country? Mouths too?
Speaker 2 (11:14):
Like, Well, it depends on the person, right, So you
have it's really a question of addressable audience. And I
apologize sometimes I make I take all the romance out
of this and I don't intend to.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
No, No, not at all. I just think it's really
I really appreciate that, and I think for ultra high
net worth individuals they really appreciate that because that's how
they're They're constantly strategizing, they're constantly making made decisions, and
I think it's very smart to approach relationships in the
same way. It's the same mindset, it's just a different thing.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
It's just a different thing. And along those lines, when
you talk about where are these people located, there's addressable
audience questions and metrics questions. Right if you're in a
small town and you have a fair specific type of
person that you're looking for, there's a small by definition,
it's just math. There is a smaller number of them
(12:09):
in a small town, there are likely going to be
more of them in a large city. And single people
do tend single. Successful people do tend to be in
larger cities. But that's also part of what we do
before we ever engage with a client is understand what
level of travel or flexibility does their lifestyle allow.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
For so, is this.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Somebody who lives in a small town and has no
intention of leaving or traveling to meet their person. Well,
that presents a level of challenge and that we're very
candid and very upfront. If somebody is not somebody that
we feel we have visibility to success, we won't ask
them to make the investment financial, emotional or otherwise. Right,
(12:52):
we want to not invested. Right.
Speaker 1 (13:04):
So you know, it's interesting because I was I wanted
to ask you, you know, with that. So like work
from home, you know, we have a lot of different
people outside of just like the towns, which is obviously
a challenging like you're saying, just because of the actual
bodies of people, but work from home, like a lot
of people are just like I've been working from home.
I'm on the phone from whatever it is, you know,
(13:25):
seven in the morning until nine o'clock at night. Like
I'm just too tired. Like how do you coerce people
to get to get out off the couch and you
know into into the you know, into the bar or
into the coffee shop. How do you get them there?
Speaker 2 (13:44):
Well, hopefully there's not a lot of coercion necessarily, but
it's that's again.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Sometimes people are like yeah, yeah, yeah, I want a date,
and then they're like no, no, no, I don't.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Well and that's there is a lot that goes into
us deciding to partner with somebody. Yeah, we actually decline
more people than we accept, which from a business standpoint
sounds incredibly bizarre to a lot of people. But this
is an industry where if you just sort of haphazardly
throw it against the wall and see what sticks, you're
(14:14):
not going to be around for forty years. You're not.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
So I want to know, do you, guys, does your
team consider the person that you think that is good
for me? Or do you just listen to what I say?
Like if I say, Jennifer, I want tall, dark and
handsome with a fat bank account, and you're like.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
I've never heard that before.
Speaker 1 (14:38):
I want to get him.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
Find else wants that?
Speaker 1 (14:43):
So like I know, So is it just? Is it
you guys are just like Okay, I'm feeling we're going
through this questionnaire, We're seeing what you guys are doing.
We've listened to what you've had to say. Or do
you guys say, like, you know what, like this other
guy he might be really great. He's not. He's not
dark and handsome, but he he's you know, blonde and viking.
Like you know what I mean? Like, is that do
you guys take those kind of leaps.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
Or we do? Because this is again, this is a partnership, right,
and the basis of any good partnership is trust. Right.
So we're not, by any stretch of the imagination, going
to ignore our client's' preferences, but we are going to
really try to understand before we even engage with anybody. Okay,
what is it about that that makes you want that person?
(15:29):
What is it about tall? Now, you're tall, so that
makes sense, right, But when.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
I don't like too tall? No, no, no, no, I don't
want to.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
A five to two or five three, And she says
to me, he has to be six three, tell me why? Right,
you can walk around a six in shields all day
every day. If you can do it, bless you. But
you know why, what is that? Well, my father was
really tall. It just gives me a sense of safe. Okay,
all right, now I'm starting to get the picture of why.
(15:58):
So maybe this person doesn't have to be as tall,
but they're probably if they're five to ten, they shouldn't
be narrow shouldered and slight, they should probably be so yes,
so we do work through the whys behind what people
are asking for and again you're hiring a company to
be your advocate and to be your partner, the basis
of which is trust. And if we have gone through
(16:20):
the process and we've gotten to know somebody and based
on their personality, their sense of humor, their values, all
the things we say, you don't know what you don't
know right. A girl's got to eat, go to dinner.
What's right. And we've seen so much success through people
stepping outside of their comfort zone and being a little
(16:41):
playful and adventurous and having fun with it.
Speaker 1 (16:44):
So just to give you, like a couple tips about me.
So I am fifty seven years old and I'm from Rockford, Illinois.
So I'm from a small town. I moved to New
York when I was fifteen to start modeling, and I
went to Trinity College in Hartford and Columbia. I started
working in publishing. I went on television. I had two
(17:06):
beautiful I got married to an older gentleman. I have
two beautiful girls. I had to get divorced because I
just needed I told myself that I just needed a
better life for my children. You know, he just and
I always say that he just wasn't the right tool
for the right job. He's an amazing, super creative but
(17:27):
I was looking for I'm from Rockford, Illinois, Like you
don't get more Midwestern than that, and I was looking
for those real Midwestern values, you know, just like my
father and my twin brother. And it's interesting because a
lot of the guys that I meet are like, you
go out of line, You're like a big party girl.
I'm like, I have a very busy professional life, but
(17:51):
I have raised two girls on my own, and you
can't raise girls on your own by being out at night.
It does does not work. The math is not math.
I'm like, well, that's really great for you. But I'm
usually in you know, home by you know, eight eight thirty,
you know, working doing whatever I am doing with them.
And so it's fascinating to hear a lot of people
(18:14):
when they especially when guys meet me originally, they think
that I'm something that I'm not. So, you know, I
also have this one very very big trait where every
single guy literally and I'm not This is not like
an every single guy I date. Every single man that
I have ever dated has had wandering compass. Are cheaters
(18:39):
upon cheaters upon cheaters, and if they're not cheaters. They're
not making sure that I feel safe. So I want
the Brady Bunch for my kids, even though you know
they're older and you know later on they're going to
have children, and I want to have I want to
have a family for them and for their kids. Like,
that's what I want. What are your thoughts, So go.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
Ahead, Jeneral, go So what are the other attributes that
are common in the people that you've been with? And
is there I hate to say it like this, but
there's sometimes that sort of stereotypes or stereotypes for a reason.
There's the Master of the Universe stereotype, where there's a
lot of power and a lot of prestige. And you know,
(19:26):
if if that is the type of person that solely
that you've been attracted to, you know, is there a
correlation between who you've sought out and some of those
behaviors that are obviously not ideal in a relationship, particularly
not one with you.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
I mean, I guess you know, the first you know,
the person that I you know, lean into would be like,
you know, I had a wonderful father figure who was
a provider and he was an you know, he was
amazing well educated and always was a thought provoker, and
I am attracted to those kind of men. But what
(20:03):
happens is that when those kind of men meet me,
I become the concierge. I become or they'll be like, oh,
let's go to that party, and then they're like, you know,
talking to people at the party, and I'm like, is
this are you guys? Are you? Are you doing business
right now? Are you networking? If I'm not networking, please
don't network?
Speaker 2 (20:22):
Right?
Speaker 1 (20:23):
Yeah, So I basically attract users. Let's just call us
beatis Baye Jennifer? Come on? That's that you don't need
more data.
Speaker 2 (20:31):
They're users well, and so this is not a plug.
But that's again one of the things that's helpful when
you're being represented by a matchmaking company is they don't
necessarily know who you are when they decide that they
want to meet you. They it's not unusual for us
to use a pseudonym if somebody is well known, right,
(20:53):
I mean, mister Bally try to like mister Big kind
of but not really. But we really try to get
a gen you wan beat on interest versus oh my god,
she's incredibly connected and she's had this really interesting life
and I see where this could take me? Right, and
(21:14):
you want somebody who their success super successful and have
a lot of their own things going on. You don't
need somebody to be doting on you at two o'clock
on Tuesday. You have enough going on. You want to
partnership somebody who respects who you are, but that's in
no way a driver for why they'd want to meet you.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
And I also think that people seek kindness for weakness.
People are like, oh, she's, you know, friendly and fun
and has a lot of energy, so therefore she's weak.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
How are you with boundaries? Do you have good boundaries?
Do you enforce your boundaries?
Speaker 1 (21:49):
I have personal boundaries for my own self. I guess
I'm I'm just you know, I'm just not watching out
for people. I'm not like, hey, what are you doing
right now? I'm not like checking in on what they're doing.
I'm not like it's nine o'clock, like why haven't you
called me in the past five minutes? I just, you know,
I'm just not like that. So doesn't mean that I
(22:10):
don't have boundaries. It just means I am not you know,
I already raised two girls.
Speaker 2 (22:18):
You don't need to micromanage somebody else.
Speaker 1 (22:20):
No, I want them to be like, hey, you'd agree, yeah,
how beauty, whatever it is, like, I don't want them
to be like you didn't check in on me, therefore
you don't like me, Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
And that's finding somebody whose values and lifestyle and approaches
to a relationship aligned with yours. And those are when
you meet somebody on an app or the friend of
the friend who says, well, you're single, and you're single,
so I'm going to put you guys together because very
often that's the extent of the research they've done is
they know both people are single. Again, That's that's where
(22:54):
having this trusted advisor sitting between you and somebody you're
going to meet to really get a feel for how
many relationships have you been? Tell us about your relationship history,
what happened? Oh there was infidelity, Who's what caused that?
If it was her? Did you have any were you
(23:14):
not present? Were you not paying attention?
Speaker 1 (23:17):
Right?
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Are you doing something? So we actually dig into the past,
not not to shame anybody and not to bring up
bad memories, but to understand again the patterns, the things
that didn't work out, and who is this person and
how do they view and value relationships. Were they the
one who left and this is now their fourth marriage?
(23:39):
Did they leave every time? And why? So?
Speaker 1 (23:42):
I love that because you know, we are there. We're
hearing a lot of people talk about like trauma bonding,
and what you're doing is that you're not trauma bonding.
You're saying this person had has had this situation in
her past, and this person has had this situation in
her past, and these are the lessons that we learned
from that, versus like I had. Like I'll, I mean,
(24:03):
every single time someone's like ask me if I've ever
been cheated on me, I'm like, I, yes, I attract
cheaters and they're like, oh, yeah, me too, And I'm
like no, no, no, no, this is not that moment.
And I'm just like I just could totally turn off.
I'm just like I cannot. If you're asking me a
really you know, super sensitive question that I do not
(24:25):
want to talk about, then please do not try to
turn them on about how someone cheated on you. That's
just doesn't work for me. Yeah, it really really like
sets me off. Yeah. I mean I think that you know,
bringing a professional matchmaker in, you know, in forty five
and widowed divorce. I think that people are real. This
(24:45):
is really really beneficial. Like, what are your thoughts on
on that?
Speaker 2 (24:50):
Obviously I agree because I guess this is what I do.
But also, if you look at the trajectory.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
I concur you're a lawyer.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
I should. But if you look at the trajectory of apps, right,
they came out ten, fifteen years ago, whatever it was,
they've essentially commoditized people and commoditized relationships. Right, there's no
there's no incentive for these companies to get people into relationships.
They lose, they lose the the revenue. Frankly, if they
(25:22):
get you into a relationship, then you're no longer on
the app.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Well, it's also when people hear that ding it's you know,
it's a serotonin like every single it's like serotonin. Serotonin.
That's not serotonin for me, My phone dings on its own.
I don't need any more dinging. What makes me feel
good is that when someone's like, I hope you have
the best day, or says something like I'm really proud
(25:47):
of you. You know you're going to be great, like
those kind of like words of affirmation. That's we're not
talking about love language, but just a kind of consistent
The consistency of you're going to be great today is
just something that's really nice to hear, Like I don't
need like you're hot, You're not like, I just need
someone to be like you got this. Yeah, it just
(26:11):
is like I need the calm, I don't need the serotonin,
like I already have the serotonin.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
Well, that's it's highly gamified, right, everybody is. It's swiping
for the sake of swiping without any intention at all. Right, Right,
And it's funny, So you said what you just said.
So many women who are successful and independent, they want
somebody to come in and say you've got this, and
(26:37):
sometimes to say I've got this. Don't worry about making
the reservation, don't worry about figuring this out. I've got this.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
Right. Oh, like I've ever been handled my oh my god,
I'm like literally, I'm like like a puppy, like I'm
ready ready for duty.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
It's true. And dating as a successful man and dating
as a successful women, they both have their challenges, but
they're different. Right for women, Most women who are highly
successful have gotten that way because they've got it. I
got this, don't worry, I've got it. I can do that,
I can do everything. I've got it all. And so
when they finally are with somebody that allows them to
(27:20):
embrace the part of them that doesn't have to have
it twenty four to seven, it's like, wow, that's amazing.
Somebody else to say, you know, we're all making the
dinner reservations, we're all you know, planning the trip, this, that,
and for someone else to go now, I want you
to sit back and enjoy your fine. Oh this is different, right,
(27:43):
like wait, wait a minute, right. And for men, they're
so they're used to people wanting something from them. Okay,
what does this person want? Right? They're being nice to me,
they want something, right.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
So we're seeing some trends in dating. Can you highlight
some of those that you think should just disappear forever.
Speaker 2 (28:11):
The first one that should disappear is the text based relationship.
It's and we're very very or we try to be
very strict about there's still human nature and we can
wag our fingers all we want, and sometimes people just
don't listen, but we really don't want people engaging in
text communication for an extended period of time. Our expectation
(28:34):
when we connect people is that they actually connect by phone,
not this way, but actually by phone within a day
or two, and they plan a date and if they're
not in the same location, meet by Zoom will help
facilitate who's traveling, where dates people are available. We want
people to get in front of each other.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
So I like to text because I am a writer,
so I'm always you know, I love to say I
love to text, and I also love you know. I
have two daughters who were being raised during that era,
and where I could, I didn't want to be on
the phone, so I did to spend a lot of
time texting, right, And unfortunately I haven't dated that much.
So my texting. If you saw the way I text Jennifer,
(29:18):
you'd be like, are you in the fourth grade, Kelley?
What is going on? Like this guy is not.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
Are you responding with K Yes?
Speaker 1 (29:27):
I'll be like thanks, and they'll be like thanks to what.
I was like, oh sorry, And I do a lot
of emojis and.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Well, so here's the thing. When you don't photos.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
And also I do I send photos because I'm like, oh,
look at that building and they're like why and I
was like, because I wanted you to see, like where
I am, what I'm doing during the day, just kind
of like back to like that you're one of your words, accountability.
I just want them to kind of see where I
am and instead of just being like, you know, thinking
of you, I could be anywhere. Do you know what
I mean? Like here I am. I mean not a
(29:58):
selfie obviously unless I'm looking great, but I.
Speaker 3 (30:03):
Mean if you clients, But when you don't know somebody
really well, the risks of texting are that you people
don't understand everybody's sense of humor out of the gate, right,
So you could say something to somebody.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
And the inflection in your voice is going to tell
them what you mean, but just on the fly text
is they might feel like what does that mean?
Speaker 1 (30:27):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (30:27):
Right? And that can that can actually sideline people as
they're developing the relationship. And you can't get to know
somebody in the same way through the written word or
even through a phone call. If you meet somebody, you're
taking them in with all of your senses. I mean,
I know I have and most women will tell you
they have met ment they smell great. Have you met
(30:50):
the guy who smells great?
Speaker 1 (30:53):
I have met a hero who smells great, And.
Speaker 2 (30:55):
You're like, what is that and you're just there's something
about them that you're drawn to because they're hitting all
of your senses right, or the handsome successful blah blah
blah doesn't smell good. That's a problem. Hard to get
around like that natural sort of doesn't like Okay, So
(31:15):
it's always good to just get in front of people.
So we really are encouraging people meet and you soap,
meet and you soap. Maybe a little dealer in here
and there. It's safe. They may be without a liminum
these days.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
What what dating trend would you keep around?
Speaker 2 (31:36):
Chivalry?
Speaker 3 (31:37):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (31:37):
I love.
Speaker 2 (31:39):
We really do still believe in and that so irrespective
of whether the woman is our client or the man
is our client, we want the gentleman to plan the date.
We expect him to host the date.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Do you also tell your female clients, like, just because
you're a CEO of X, Y and Z doesn't mean
you have to be a CEO of the date.
Speaker 2 (32:01):
A briefcase at the door. Yeah, and it's hard to
do it is I mean, you're you're a successful woman.
I'm sure it's easy to drift into that sort of
high powered business. I know I've done it in the past.
Everybody does it.
Speaker 1 (32:16):
I like to just let people unfold, which is actually
a bad thing. My producers always like ask these questions.
I'm like, I can't ask the question because if I say, like, oh,
how is your how was your last relationship, then it's
like I have to listen to her. I'm like, no, no,
now I am not listening to about an ex.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
No.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
But I'm also not gonna have some guys say to me, like,
you know, what's your value add I'm like, so, now
I'm your value add Like what.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
Well, yeah, those are not appropriate date conversations. I mean,
you should not talk about your former relationships in the
first couple of days, talk about.
Speaker 1 (32:54):
Each other thousand percent. I'm always like, tell me about you,
tell me about things you like.
Speaker 2 (32:59):
Yeah. That's the amazing thing about what we do is
you could probably say something to me and there's genuinely
no way that you could shock me. We have heard everything,
We've talked to all sorts of people. And if you're
going to be successful in this as a company and
as a professional, you just have to be curious, and
(33:20):
you have to lead every conversation without any sense of judgment,
and you just have to enjoy learning about people.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
So I'm genuinely I mean, you can tell after spending
a couple of minutes with me that I am a
very light person. What are the things that you think
that women need to lighten up about?
Speaker 2 (33:37):
The checklist? Wow, there's a big checklist with a lot
of people. And men have it too, don't get me wrong,
but these really long checklists of every single attribute. They
have decided where this person should fall on the graph
of every single attribute. And what you lose in doing
(34:00):
that is playfulness, right, And life is supposed to be enjoyed.
It's plenty hard, plenty of the time. So try to
find pleasure and enjoyment and fund where you can. And
we always say you don't know what you don't know,
And I guarantee every woman and every man has met
(34:23):
somebody at a cocktail party, in the line at Starbucks
wherever it is that you're like, huh, that's kind of
interesting and they're completely out of the box for you.
Speaker 1 (34:33):
You don't know why, right? So what about men? Where
do they need to lighten up?
Speaker 2 (34:37):
On age? I think there's a perception that as women
get older, they are less fun, they are less beautiful,
whatever the case may be. But what we see is
over and over again, people are youthful and beautiful and
(34:58):
engaging in all these things well beyond thirty, right, I
mean they are, and at the end of the day
we see this. I mean, I'm not telling anybody anything new.
That sort of age disparity that men sometimes seek, particularly
as they're just starting to date again, that's typically more
(35:18):
of a face and the reason is that that deeper connectivity.
I mean, just like cultural alignment, movies, music, things like
that that you connect on and can joke around about,
there's usually a gap there if there's too much of
an age gap, and they they may think, now, this
sounds like fun to date somebody who's twenty years younger
(35:42):
or thirty years younger or whatever it is. And then
ultimately they find that they can really and deeply connect
with somebody who's more of a contemporary.
Speaker 1 (35:50):
So, you know, it's interesting because if you had met
me ten years ago, I was still in the thick
of things still, you know, making sure my girls had
the best education, doing you know, being the financial provider
and also the nurture. So I was really really in
the thick of it, and so I still look the same.
I looked exactly the same, but my energy was completely different.
(36:13):
I mean, I had a lightness to me, but not
like I do now.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
Now.
Speaker 1 (36:17):
I'm just like I feel like i'm sixteen again. I'm
so proud of my kids. I love my life, I
love where I am. I'm just a different human. I
still look the same, And I've had a lot of
men say, oh my gosh, like, you're so young at heart.
I'm like young at heart, Like, no, I'm just not
(36:38):
a grump. And by the way, why do I have
to be a grump, Like what are you talking about?
Speaker 2 (36:44):
Well? I also think there's a confidence. There's a confidence
that comes I'm fifty five, so there's a confidence that
comes being so you so thank you. I'll take that
from you. You're a professional. But there is there's a
confidence that comes with maturing, taking care of yourself. Yeah,
(37:06):
and knowing that I'm still a beautiful woman. I'm smart,
I'm independent, I can do it all. The partner is
a nice to have. I don't need somebody. It's a
nice to have. It would be nice to share these things,
but I don't need to look to somebody else to
complete my life and to complete me.
Speaker 1 (37:26):
I love that A partner is nice to have. That
is perfectly well said Jennifer Wells. Thank you so much
for being here today and idpart two. You're amazing.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
It was so much fun. It was.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
It's greater to meet you, wildly intelligent. I need my
dating fun. I was like, oh, that's fun.
Speaker 2 (37:46):
It's supposed to be fun. It's supposed to be fun,
and I think that gets lost in the shuffle sometimes.
Speaker 1 (37:51):
Appreciate you. Thank you so much for being.
Speaker 2 (37:53):
As thank you for inviting me. It was nice to
be you.
Speaker 1 (37:56):
That was such a fascinating conversation on this pod. We
know the dating can feel daunte, but we want you
to know that you have some options. If you're navigating
dating for the first time. In your chapter two, I
need some advice, call us or email us. All the
info is in the show notes. Follow us on socials.
Make sure to rate and review the podcast I Do
Part two and iHeart Radio podcasts. Were falling in love
(38:19):
is the main objective
Welcome back to I Do Part two with your celebrity
mentor Kelly ben Simone. Just like you, guys, I'm out
there dating in my I Do Part two era. And
if you're single and dating like me, you know that
sometimes it's hard to meet great eligible men when you
have a busy schedule, and dating apps can be super disappointing.
(00:33):
So I wanted to explore our conversation around professional matchmakers.
The company has been around for over thirty five years
and they've been featured on Good Morning America, The Today Show,
Entertainment Tonight, and more. They are the real deal. Please
welcome Jennifer Will's President, chief Growth Officer with Kella Hurr International. Jennifer,
(00:55):
I'm super excited to talk to you. Kella hur International
came highly recommended by someone associated with this podcast who
had really successful dates. So tell our audience a little
bit about Kelliher International. How long have you been in
business and how did you get involved?
Speaker 2 (01:11):
Okay, well, thanks for the nice lead in. So kelliher
has been around for almost forty years. We're one of
the oldest and largest players in the field. We specialize
in elite or executive matchmaking services, so people who are successful,
but who are ready to be intentional about how they're
(01:33):
approaching finding this next relationship, whether it's the first, the second,
the third, whatever it might be. But they've decided to
prioritize this and focus on it the way they would
any other important aspect of their life. I've been with
the firm since twenty sixteen. I kind of actually fell
into it a little bit. I'm an attorney and have
(01:54):
a finance background, and I had decided to leave my
previous position as in house counsel for a company in
New York and a friend of mine was working here
and invited me in to meet with the founders, which
I did for an entire day, and then they were
stuck with me. After that, I just fell in love
(02:14):
with the business. I fell in love with them. There
are really very few things that you can do in
this world where you're truly transforming people's lives and having
such a meaningful impact on not only their romantic life,
but their overall relationships and happiness in the world.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
So we're going to get into that because you guys
are twofold. But I wanted to address one thing. It's
the embarrassment and the shame some that we're seeing of matchmakers,
and if a matchmaker is I think the matchmaker does
more vetting and it makes you feel better that there
is a third party kind of you know, being a
(02:55):
part of this, especially with someone like you or you're
not only the third party matchmaking, but also you're counseling
your clients, which is great. But tell me about some
of the perks of using a professional matchmaker.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Well, there are a lot of perks to it. There's
the efficiency aspect. Most people that we work with, they
are very strong in their professional situation. They may have
great families already, but they don't have a lot of
time and it's really the one thing that nobody can recreate.
So providing a level of efficiency meaning that when we're
(03:30):
making these introductions, they're targeted. We've essentially gone on coffee
dates with the candidates, so to speak. We've met them,
we've interviewed them, we've background checked, They've had to go
through an extensive diligence period with us, so we know them.
So there's going to be a level of presumptive alignment
(03:51):
on fundamental values. That really is an open issue. If
you meet somebody just out in the world or online,
they're essentially represents to you whatever it is that they
think that you want to hear, whereas we are really
digging into who people are, asking a lot of open
ended questions and trying to understand. There's also the accountability piece.
(04:12):
When you meet somebody in another format, they can just disappear, right.
It's much more difficult to do that with a matchmaker
because we're following along and they're accountable to us and
we're taking feedback, so there's really nowhere to hide then,
and you kind of alluded to this, there's the advocacy piece, right.
(04:34):
We are a trusted advisor in exactly the same way
that a financial advisor or a legal advisor would be.
We're just handling a different aspect of somebody's life. It's
no less important. But we are the advocate, so we
sit between the client and a candidate, and there are
times where we can facilitate something that maybe on the
surface somebody wouldn't say, now that makes sense, But if
(04:56):
we know both parties, we can help make things come
to together that might not happen without that, without that
level of advocacy in there.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
I love advocacy. I really love that, And I also
love that you know the there are these ultra high
net worth individuals who are laser focused on their work,
you know whether and they've been doing this for years
and the thought of dating is super daunting. So when
you are, you know, with your company with Klhart, what
(05:26):
do you get for it? Like? What are you getting?
How many dates? Like? What are we getting?
Speaker 2 (05:32):
So one of the beautiful things about this is it's
highly customizable. We want to craft a membership that addresses
that particular client's need. So for us, we don't cap introductions.
There are a lot of other firms out there that
are you know, pay x and you get this set
number of introductions to us that creates an immediate conflict
(05:56):
of interests. People are saying, do I take this one?
Do I use this chip? Own know, we have to
produce this person. There's no cap on matches with us. Frankly,
every time we introduce somebody, it's either a home run
or it's a learning proposition for both the firm and
the team and the client. So it's another it's another
(06:17):
way of collecting data that's incredibly valuable as we continue
to refine the search.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
That is amazing. I love how you're talking about this,
I mean like literally luring me in data advocacy, authenticity authority.
I'm like, I am like literally right here with you.
So we're talking about the different parts of it, and
I really like the idea that you guys don't say
like if you have, like you know, ten dates, oh
(06:43):
my god, you're eight, Like what's your what's going to
be your plan? I really like that. That's brilliant. By
the way, So coaching. So we've talked about like the
dating part, but like, what about the coaching part? This,
this is the part that I'm super interested in.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
Well, I'm sure anybody who's ever been in a relationship
will tell you that relationships are not linear, and very often,
particularly when we're not first timers, we've been married or
been in a significant relationship before, or been in multiple
significant relationships. We all have patterns, right, and we all
(07:20):
established narratives and beliefs in our head that may or
may not be accurate. And so the purpose of the
coaching is multifold. First of all, it's a way that
we sort of clear the slate from the beginning of
a relationship and say, Okay, what are your real goals here?
What's going to make you happy in this Do you
want to get married again? Do you not want to
(07:41):
get married again? What is the ultimate goal for this
relationship that you're seeking, And then what has been a
challenge for you in the past, and why do you
suppose it's been a challenge. And let's talk about the
people that you've selected for these relationships, why you were
focused on certain attributes and maybe how that played into
(08:01):
the challenges that you subsequently experienced in the relationship. And
then as you go through the process with us. Again,
there's nothing linear about this. So as you're establishing a
relationship with a new partner, they're going to be triggers.
There's something's going to come up that says, oh, that
(08:22):
reminds me of okay, but it's not him. So let's
talk about why that's happening.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
So, speaking of triggers, should people be fully healed from
divorce or loss of a spouse before they associate with
the matchmaker or what are your thoughts on that?
Speaker 2 (08:39):
So I think fully healed is a really interesting term
because I think all of us walk through life not
fully healed. Right, We're all still learning and growing as
we go. So while somebody needs to have you know,
sort of experienced the acute part of that somebody shouldn't
(09:02):
go you know, it's not a direct line, but that's
also part of the coaching. And there are definitely people
that we as we're meeting them and we see that
maybe these emotions are too raw or they're not really
ready to attract or welcome this new partner, we may say,
let's do six months of just coaching before we start
the matching process, so we can really help people prepare
(09:25):
to get there.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
So is there like a check in? Do you check
in like, you know, every couple of weeks after two dates? Like,
what's the kind of what's the check in process?
Speaker 2 (09:33):
And is there one during the matching process? You mean yes,
so every client works directly with a team, and that
team is multiple people, but we do depending on the
scope of the search and the intricacies of the search,
there can be anything from a standing bi weekly call
to a standing weekly call, and many times they're over
(09:53):
zoom because even though it's not the same as in person,
it is better than a phone call.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
You can kind of accountability. Again, you guys are like.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
Really, oh, people have to be linear.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
In relationships and definitely be accountable.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Yeah, people have to be ready to be a partner
to us and to be and have agency in this process.
That's one of the most interesting things about matchmaking. It
is in no way a unilateral effort. We can't do
it without substantial input and participation from the client.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
Wait, I love that you just said that you have
agency in this process. I love that. I mean we're
talking We're not talking about like swiping, We're talking about
real partnership. I mean, this is well. First of all,
you are unbelievably bright and very articulate, and I really
really love the way that you're talking about it. I mean,
(10:49):
you know, if I were working with you, I would
have a definite sense of ease and comfort because you
are definitely at the helm of this. And that's just
like very cool. So what about living in a big city, Like,
what about the people that live in small towns? I'm
from Rockford, Illinois, Like you know, I mean, is it
(11:12):
just folk? Is it in the country? Mouths too?
Speaker 2 (11:14):
Like, Well, it depends on the person, right, So you
have it's really a question of addressable audience. And I
apologize sometimes I make I take all the romance out
of this and I don't intend to.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
No, No, not at all. I just think it's really
I really appreciate that, and I think for ultra high
net worth individuals they really appreciate that because that's how
they're They're constantly strategizing, they're constantly making made decisions, and
I think it's very smart to approach relationships in the
same way. It's the same mindset, it's just a different thing.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
It's just a different thing. And along those lines, when
you talk about where are these people located, there's addressable
audience questions and metrics questions. Right if you're in a
small town and you have a fair specific type of
person that you're looking for, there's a small by definition,
it's just math. There is a smaller number of them
(12:09):
in a small town, there are likely going to be
more of them in a large city. And single people
do tend single. Successful people do tend to be in
larger cities. But that's also part of what we do
before we ever engage with a client is understand what
level of travel or flexibility does their lifestyle allow.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
For so, is this.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Somebody who lives in a small town and has no
intention of leaving or traveling to meet their person. Well,
that presents a level of challenge and that we're very
candid and very upfront. If somebody is not somebody that
we feel we have visibility to success, we won't ask
them to make the investment financial, emotional or otherwise. Right,
(12:52):
we want to not invested. Right.
Speaker 1 (13:04):
So you know, it's interesting because I was I wanted
to ask you, you know, with that. So like work
from home, you know, we have a lot of different
people outside of just like the towns, which is obviously
a challenging like you're saying, just because of the actual
bodies of people, but work from home, like a lot
of people are just like I've been working from home.
I'm on the phone from whatever it is, you know,
(13:25):
seven in the morning until nine o'clock at night. Like
I'm just too tired. Like how do you coerce people
to get to get out off the couch and you
know into into the you know, into the bar or
into the coffee shop. How do you get them there?
Speaker 2 (13:44):
Well, hopefully there's not a lot of coercion necessarily, but
it's that's again.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Sometimes people are like yeah, yeah, yeah, I want a date,
and then they're like no, no, no, I don't.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Well and that's there is a lot that goes into
us deciding to partner with somebody. Yeah, we actually decline
more people than we accept, which from a business standpoint
sounds incredibly bizarre to a lot of people. But this
is an industry where if you just sort of haphazardly
throw it against the wall and see what sticks, you're
(14:14):
not going to be around for forty years. You're not.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
So I want to know, do you, guys, does your
team consider the person that you think that is good
for me? Or do you just listen to what I say?
Like if I say, Jennifer, I want tall, dark and
handsome with a fat bank account, and you're like.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
I've never heard that before.
Speaker 1 (14:38):
I want to get him.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
Find else wants that?
Speaker 1 (14:43):
So like I know, So is it just? Is it
you guys are just like Okay, I'm feeling we're going
through this questionnaire, We're seeing what you guys are doing.
We've listened to what you've had to say. Or do
you guys say, like, you know what, like this other
guy he might be really great. He's not. He's not
dark and handsome, but he he's you know, blonde and viking.
Like you know what I mean? Like, is that do
you guys take those kind of leaps.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
Or we do? Because this is again, this is a partnership, right,
and the basis of any good partnership is trust. Right.
So we're not, by any stretch of the imagination, going
to ignore our client's' preferences, but we are going to
really try to understand before we even engage with anybody. Okay,
what is it about that that makes you want that person?
(15:29):
What is it about tall? Now, you're tall, so that
makes sense, right, But when.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
I don't like too tall? No, no, no, no, I don't
want to.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
A five to two or five three, And she says
to me, he has to be six three, tell me why? Right,
you can walk around a six in shields all day
every day. If you can do it, bless you. But
you know why, what is that? Well, my father was
really tall. It just gives me a sense of safe. Okay,
all right, now I'm starting to get the picture of why.
(15:58):
So maybe this person doesn't have to be as tall,
but they're probably if they're five to ten, they shouldn't
be narrow shouldered and slight, they should probably be so yes,
so we do work through the whys behind what people
are asking for and again you're hiring a company to
be your advocate and to be your partner, the basis
of which is trust. And if we have gone through
(16:20):
the process and we've gotten to know somebody and based
on their personality, their sense of humor, their values, all
the things we say, you don't know what you don't
know right. A girl's got to eat, go to dinner.
What's right. And we've seen so much success through people
stepping outside of their comfort zone and being a little
(16:41):
playful and adventurous and having fun with it.
Speaker 1 (16:44):
So just to give you, like a couple tips about me.
So I am fifty seven years old and I'm from Rockford, Illinois.
So I'm from a small town. I moved to New
York when I was fifteen to start modeling, and I
went to Trinity College in Hartford and Columbia. I started
working in publishing. I went on television. I had two
(17:06):
beautiful I got married to an older gentleman. I have
two beautiful girls. I had to get divorced because I
just needed I told myself that I just needed a
better life for my children. You know, he just and
I always say that he just wasn't the right tool
for the right job. He's an amazing, super creative but
(17:27):
I was looking for I'm from Rockford, Illinois, Like you
don't get more Midwestern than that, and I was looking
for those real Midwestern values, you know, just like my
father and my twin brother. And it's interesting because a
lot of the guys that I meet are like, you
go out of line, You're like a big party girl.
I'm like, I have a very busy professional life, but
(17:51):
I have raised two girls on my own, and you
can't raise girls on your own by being out at night.
It does does not work. The math is not math.
I'm like, well, that's really great for you. But I'm
usually in you know, home by you know, eight eight thirty,
you know, working doing whatever I am doing with them.
And so it's fascinating to hear a lot of people
(18:14):
when they especially when guys meet me originally, they think
that I'm something that I'm not. So, you know, I
also have this one very very big trait where every
single guy literally and I'm not This is not like
an every single guy I date. Every single man that
I have ever dated has had wandering compass. Are cheaters
(18:39):
upon cheaters upon cheaters, and if they're not cheaters. They're
not making sure that I feel safe. So I want
the Brady Bunch for my kids, even though you know
they're older and you know later on they're going to
have children, and I want to have I want to
have a family for them and for their kids. Like,
that's what I want. What are your thoughts, So go.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
Ahead, Jeneral, go So what are the other attributes that
are common in the people that you've been with? And
is there I hate to say it like this, but
there's sometimes that sort of stereotypes or stereotypes for a reason.
There's the Master of the Universe stereotype, where there's a
lot of power and a lot of prestige. And you know,
(19:26):
if if that is the type of person that solely
that you've been attracted to, you know, is there a
correlation between who you've sought out and some of those
behaviors that are obviously not ideal in a relationship, particularly
not one with you.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
I mean, I guess you know, the first you know,
the person that I you know, lean into would be like,
you know, I had a wonderful father figure who was
a provider and he was an you know, he was
amazing well educated and always was a thought provoker, and
I am attracted to those kind of men. But what
(20:03):
happens is that when those kind of men meet me,
I become the concierge. I become or they'll be like, oh,
let's go to that party, and then they're like, you know,
talking to people at the party, and I'm like, is
this are you guys? Are you? Are you doing business
right now? Are you networking? If I'm not networking, please
don't network?
Speaker 2 (20:22):
Right?
Speaker 1 (20:23):
Yeah, So I basically attract users. Let's just call us
beatis Baye Jennifer? Come on? That's that you don't need
more data.
Speaker 2 (20:31):
They're users well, and so this is not a plug.
But that's again one of the things that's helpful when
you're being represented by a matchmaking company is they don't
necessarily know who you are when they decide that they
want to meet you. They it's not unusual for us
to use a pseudonym if somebody is well known, right,
(20:53):
I mean, mister Bally try to like mister Big kind
of but not really. But we really try to get
a gen you wan beat on interest versus oh my god,
she's incredibly connected and she's had this really interesting life
and I see where this could take me? Right, and
(21:14):
you want somebody who their success super successful and have
a lot of their own things going on. You don't
need somebody to be doting on you at two o'clock
on Tuesday. You have enough going on. You want to
partnership somebody who respects who you are, but that's in
no way a driver for why they'd want to meet you.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
And I also think that people seek kindness for weakness.
People are like, oh, she's, you know, friendly and fun
and has a lot of energy, so therefore she's weak.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
How are you with boundaries? Do you have good boundaries?
Do you enforce your boundaries?
Speaker 1 (21:49):
I have personal boundaries for my own self. I guess
I'm I'm just you know, I'm just not watching out
for people. I'm not like, hey, what are you doing
right now? I'm not like checking in on what they're doing.
I'm not like it's nine o'clock, like why haven't you
called me in the past five minutes? I just, you know,
I'm just not like that. So doesn't mean that I
(22:10):
don't have boundaries. It just means I am not you know,
I already raised two girls.
Speaker 2 (22:18):
You don't need to micromanage somebody else.
Speaker 1 (22:20):
No, I want them to be like, hey, you'd agree, yeah,
how beauty, whatever it is, like, I don't want them
to be like you didn't check in on me, therefore
you don't like me, Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
And that's finding somebody whose values and lifestyle and approaches
to a relationship aligned with yours. And those are when
you meet somebody on an app or the friend of
the friend who says, well, you're single, and you're single,
so I'm going to put you guys together because very
often that's the extent of the research they've done is
they know both people are single. Again, That's that's where
(22:54):
having this trusted advisor sitting between you and somebody you're
going to meet to really get a feel for how
many relationships have you been? Tell us about your relationship history,
what happened? Oh there was infidelity, Who's what caused that?
If it was her? Did you have any were you
(23:14):
not present? Were you not paying attention?
Speaker 1 (23:17):
Right?
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Are you doing something? So we actually dig into the past,
not not to shame anybody and not to bring up
bad memories, but to understand again the patterns, the things
that didn't work out, and who is this person and
how do they view and value relationships. Were they the
one who left and this is now their fourth marriage?
(23:39):
Did they leave every time? And why? So?
Speaker 1 (23:42):
I love that because you know, we are there. We're
hearing a lot of people talk about like trauma bonding,
and what you're doing is that you're not trauma bonding.
You're saying this person had has had this situation in
her past, and this person has had this situation in
her past, and these are the lessons that we learned
from that, versus like I had. Like I'll, I mean,
(24:03):
every single time someone's like ask me if I've ever
been cheated on me, I'm like, I, yes, I attract
cheaters and they're like, oh, yeah, me too, And I'm
like no, no, no, no, this is not that moment.
And I'm just like I just could totally turn off.
I'm just like I cannot. If you're asking me a
really you know, super sensitive question that I do not
(24:25):
want to talk about, then please do not try to
turn them on about how someone cheated on you. That's
just doesn't work for me. Yeah, it really really like
sets me off. Yeah. I mean I think that you know,
bringing a professional matchmaker in, you know, in forty five
and widowed divorce. I think that people are real. This
(24:45):
is really really beneficial. Like, what are your thoughts on
on that?
Speaker 2 (24:50):
Obviously I agree because I guess this is what I do.
But also, if you look at the trajectory.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
I concur you're a lawyer.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
I should. But if you look at the trajectory of apps, right,
they came out ten, fifteen years ago, whatever it was,
they've essentially commoditized people and commoditized relationships. Right, there's no
there's no incentive for these companies to get people into relationships.
They lose, they lose the the revenue. Frankly, if they
(25:22):
get you into a relationship, then you're no longer on
the app.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Well, it's also when people hear that ding it's you know,
it's a serotonin like every single it's like serotonin. Serotonin.
That's not serotonin for me, My phone dings on its own.
I don't need any more dinging. What makes me feel
good is that when someone's like, I hope you have
the best day, or says something like I'm really proud
(25:47):
of you. You know you're going to be great, like
those kind of like words of affirmation. That's we're not
talking about love language, but just a kind of consistent
The consistency of you're going to be great today is
just something that's really nice to hear, Like I don't
need like you're hot, You're not like, I just need
someone to be like you got this. Yeah, it just
(26:11):
is like I need the calm, I don't need the serotonin,
like I already have the serotonin.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
Well, that's it's highly gamified, right, everybody is. It's swiping
for the sake of swiping without any intention at all. Right, Right,
And it's funny, So you said what you just said.
So many women who are successful and independent, they want
somebody to come in and say you've got this, and
(26:37):
sometimes to say I've got this. Don't worry about making
the reservation, don't worry about figuring this out. I've got this.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
Right. Oh, like I've ever been handled my oh my god,
I'm like literally, I'm like like a puppy, like I'm
ready ready for duty.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
It's true. And dating as a successful man and dating
as a successful women, they both have their challenges, but
they're different. Right for women, Most women who are highly
successful have gotten that way because they've got it. I
got this, don't worry, I've got it. I can do that,
I can do everything. I've got it all. And so
when they finally are with somebody that allows them to
(27:20):
embrace the part of them that doesn't have to have
it twenty four to seven, it's like, wow, that's amazing.
Somebody else to say, you know, we're all making the
dinner reservations, we're all you know, planning the trip, this, that,
and for someone else to go now, I want you
to sit back and enjoy your fine. Oh this is different, right,
(27:43):
like wait, wait a minute, right. And for men, they're
so they're used to people wanting something from them. Okay,
what does this person want? Right? They're being nice to me,
they want something, right.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
So we're seeing some trends in dating. Can you highlight
some of those that you think should just disappear forever.
Speaker 2 (28:11):
The first one that should disappear is the text based relationship.
It's and we're very very or we try to be
very strict about there's still human nature and we can
wag our fingers all we want, and sometimes people just
don't listen, but we really don't want people engaging in
text communication for an extended period of time. Our expectation
(28:34):
when we connect people is that they actually connect by phone,
not this way, but actually by phone within a day
or two, and they plan a date and if they're
not in the same location, meet by Zoom will help
facilitate who's traveling, where dates people are available. We want
people to get in front of each other.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
So I like to text because I am a writer,
so I'm always you know, I love to say I
love to text, and I also love you know. I
have two daughters who were being raised during that era,
and where I could, I didn't want to be on
the phone, so I did to spend a lot of
time texting, right, And unfortunately I haven't dated that much.
So my texting. If you saw the way I text Jennifer,
(29:18):
you'd be like, are you in the fourth grade, Kelley?
What is going on? Like this guy is not.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
Are you responding with K Yes?
Speaker 1 (29:27):
I'll be like thanks, and they'll be like thanks to what.
I was like, oh sorry, And I do a lot
of emojis and.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
Well, so here's the thing. When you don't photos.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
And also I do I send photos because I'm like, oh,
look at that building and they're like why and I
was like, because I wanted you to see, like where
I am, what I'm doing during the day, just kind
of like back to like that you're one of your words, accountability.
I just want them to kind of see where I
am and instead of just being like, you know, thinking
of you, I could be anywhere. Do you know what
I mean? Like here I am. I mean not a
(29:58):
selfie obviously unless I'm looking great, but I.
Speaker 3 (30:03):
Mean if you clients, But when you don't know somebody
really well, the risks of texting are that you people
don't understand everybody's sense of humor out of the gate, right,
So you could say something to somebody.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
And the inflection in your voice is going to tell
them what you mean, but just on the fly text
is they might feel like what does that mean?
Speaker 1 (30:27):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (30:27):
Right? And that can that can actually sideline people as
they're developing the relationship. And you can't get to know
somebody in the same way through the written word or
even through a phone call. If you meet somebody, you're
taking them in with all of your senses. I mean,
I know I have and most women will tell you
they have met ment they smell great. Have you met
(30:50):
the guy who smells great?
Speaker 1 (30:53):
I have met a hero who smells great, And.
Speaker 2 (30:55):
You're like, what is that and you're just there's something
about them that you're drawn to because they're hitting all
of your senses right, or the handsome successful blah blah
blah doesn't smell good. That's a problem. Hard to get
around like that natural sort of doesn't like Okay, So
(31:15):
it's always good to just get in front of people.
So we really are encouraging people meet and you soap,
meet and you soap. Maybe a little dealer in here
and there. It's safe. They may be without a liminum
these days.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
What what dating trend would you keep around?
Speaker 2 (31:36):
Chivalry?
Speaker 3 (31:37):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (31:37):
I love.
Speaker 2 (31:39):
We really do still believe in and that so irrespective
of whether the woman is our client or the man
is our client, we want the gentleman to plan the date.
We expect him to host the date.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Do you also tell your female clients, like, just because
you're a CEO of X, Y and Z doesn't mean
you have to be a CEO of the date.
Speaker 2 (32:01):
A briefcase at the door. Yeah, and it's hard to
do it is I mean, you're you're a successful woman.
I'm sure it's easy to drift into that sort of
high powered business. I know I've done it in the past.
Everybody does it.
Speaker 1 (32:16):
I like to just let people unfold, which is actually
a bad thing. My producers always like ask these questions.
I'm like, I can't ask the question because if I say, like, oh,
how is your how was your last relationship, then it's
like I have to listen to her. I'm like, no, no,
now I am not listening to about an ex.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
No.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
But I'm also not gonna have some guys say to me, like,
you know, what's your value add I'm like, so, now
I'm your value add Like what.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
Well, yeah, those are not appropriate date conversations. I mean,
you should not talk about your former relationships in the
first couple of days, talk about.
Speaker 1 (32:54):
Each other thousand percent. I'm always like, tell me about you,
tell me about things you like.
Speaker 2 (32:59):
Yeah. That's the amazing thing about what we do is
you could probably say something to me and there's genuinely
no way that you could shock me. We have heard everything,
We've talked to all sorts of people. And if you're
going to be successful in this as a company and
as a professional, you just have to be curious, and
(33:20):
you have to lead every conversation without any sense of judgment,
and you just have to enjoy learning about people.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
So I'm genuinely I mean, you can tell after spending
a couple of minutes with me that I am a
very light person. What are the things that you think
that women need to lighten up about?
Speaker 2 (33:37):
The checklist? Wow, there's a big checklist with a lot
of people. And men have it too, don't get me wrong,
but these really long checklists of every single attribute. They
have decided where this person should fall on the graph
of every single attribute. And what you lose in doing
(34:00):
that is playfulness, right, And life is supposed to be enjoyed.
It's plenty hard, plenty of the time. So try to
find pleasure and enjoyment and fund where you can. And
we always say you don't know what you don't know,
And I guarantee every woman and every man has met
(34:23):
somebody at a cocktail party, in the line at Starbucks
wherever it is that you're like, huh, that's kind of
interesting and they're completely out of the box for you.
Speaker 1 (34:33):
You don't know why, right? So what about men? Where
do they need to lighten up?
Speaker 2 (34:37):
On age? I think there's a perception that as women
get older, they are less fun, they are less beautiful,
whatever the case may be. But what we see is
over and over again, people are youthful and beautiful and
(34:58):
engaging in all these things well beyond thirty, right, I
mean they are, and at the end of the day
we see this. I mean, I'm not telling anybody anything new.
That sort of age disparity that men sometimes seek, particularly
as they're just starting to date again, that's typically more
(35:18):
of a face and the reason is that that deeper connectivity.
I mean, just like cultural alignment, movies, music, things like
that that you connect on and can joke around about,
there's usually a gap there if there's too much of
an age gap, and they they may think, now, this
sounds like fun to date somebody who's twenty years younger
(35:42):
or thirty years younger or whatever it is. And then
ultimately they find that they can really and deeply connect
with somebody who's more of a contemporary.
Speaker 1 (35:50):
So, you know, it's interesting because if you had met
me ten years ago, I was still in the thick
of things still, you know, making sure my girls had
the best education, doing you know, being the financial provider
and also the nurture. So I was really really in
the thick of it, and so I still look the same.
I looked exactly the same, but my energy was completely different.
(36:13):
I mean, I had a lightness to me, but not
like I do now.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
Now.
Speaker 1 (36:17):
I'm just like I feel like i'm sixteen again. I'm
so proud of my kids. I love my life, I
love where I am. I'm just a different human. I
still look the same, And I've had a lot of
men say, oh my gosh, like, you're so young at heart.
I'm like young at heart, Like, no, I'm just not
(36:38):
a grump. And by the way, why do I have
to be a grump, Like what are you talking about?
Speaker 2 (36:44):
Well? I also think there's a confidence. There's a confidence
that comes I'm fifty five, so there's a confidence that
comes being so you so thank you. I'll take that
from you. You're a professional. But there is there's a
confidence that comes with maturing, taking care of yourself. Yeah,
(37:06):
and knowing that I'm still a beautiful woman. I'm smart,
I'm independent, I can do it all. The partner is
a nice to have. I don't need somebody. It's a
nice to have. It would be nice to share these things,
but I don't need to look to somebody else to
complete my life and to complete me.
Speaker 1 (37:26):
I love that A partner is nice to have. That
is perfectly well said Jennifer Wells. Thank you so much
for being here today and idpart two. You're amazing.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
It was so much fun. It was.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
It's greater to meet you, wildly intelligent. I need my
dating fun. I was like, oh, that's fun.
Speaker 2 (37:46):
It's supposed to be fun. It's supposed to be fun,
and I think that gets lost in the shuffle sometimes.
Speaker 1 (37:51):
Appreciate you. Thank you so much for being.
Speaker 2 (37:53):
As thank you for inviting me. It was nice to
be you.
Speaker 1 (37:56):
That was such a fascinating conversation on this pod. We
know the dating can feel daunte, but we want you
to know that you have some options. If you're navigating
dating for the first time. In your chapter two, I
need some advice, call us or email us. All the
info is in the show notes. Follow us on socials.
Make sure to rate and review the podcast I Do
Part two and iHeart Radio podcasts. Were falling in love
(38:19):
is the main objective
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