April 7, 2025 • 34 mins
Spoiler Alert - do not listen if you haven’t seen the finale of Season 3 yet! But if you’ve watched it or don’t mind knowing how it ends, join Amy and T.J. as they talk about their favorite characters, their reactions to the show’s controversial subject matter and what they think of the dramatic conclusion to the wildly popular series.
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome everybody to Amy and TJ. And I am very.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Excited about this episode because we're gonna talk all things
The White Lotus.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
Season three finale was Sunday night.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
We watched it the next day because yes, nine pm
is passed our bedtime most days, but it did not
disappoint eight weeks.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
We had eight episodes.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
This time around, and each season has been unexpected, at
least in terms of the ending, and you're always trying
to figure out who's gonna die, who's gonna live, who's
gonna walk off into.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
The sunset together.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
So we have a lot to unpack from season three.
It's finale, and you know, it's one of those one
of those series that draws me in. At least I
can speak for myself on this. I'm a huge fan
of Downton Abbey. I'm a big fan of Below Deck.
We both like that show, and it's this introspective look
(00:56):
into what's happening upstairs, what's happening downstairs, the rich and
the privileged versus the people who are working to make
their experience a fun one. It's about the dark side
of vacation, and gosh, it explored so many different themes.
I don't know where to start, but this season was
potentially one of the most controversial. We had themes of incest,
(01:19):
which was difficult, suicide which is always difficult, and yeah,
who done it, Who's bad, who's good, who's evil, who's not.
I did not think the episode. Disappointed and we have
not talked about how we each thought about the finale.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
So TJ, what did you think about I.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
Was disappointed with how far it went. It was too
violent for me. Really, I didn't like that part. I
know it was a part of it. I'm saying I
just got used to something with the show and that
kind of threw me off, and I didn't like it
was violent. It became some bizarre action, very violent sequence
(01:58):
of point blank shooting somebody and then shooting somebody in
the back, and I just I didn't like. Don't get
me wrong, they take their creative license, and I think
it was The show is consistently amazing, but it's not
what I would have gone for or liked. In the end.
It was just too violent for me. This is not
a criticism of the writers. It's just for what I
went along with and what I prefer to see.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Yeah, the shootout scene was a little confusing to me,
just because so many people got in on it. I
was really truly expecting one death, and then the death
you thought that was happening didn't happen.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
It was, but it was for me.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
It was exciting, and I hate to glorify any kind
of violence, but I did appreciate it. I know a
lot of people had lots of questions about the choices
that this season went with, but I enjoyed the final show,
end of story, and my favorite part was the sad
(02:54):
part because I loved the love story.
Speaker 1 (02:56):
Do you know what love story I'm talking about?
Speaker 2 (02:58):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (02:58):
Yeah, they died at the end together. That was the
love story. Ultimately, everybody came around just having him get
some redemption finally in the end and them seemingly on
their way to being finding peace and being happily ever after,
and then they died quite dramatically. I think having them
both die was a I mean crazy that sounds was
a nice touch because we love these characters so much.
(03:20):
We as far as the audience, I know, Rick played
by Walter Goggins's he was a very confusing and conflicted
and even a character you didn't like at times because
of the way he treated her. But you thought he
found his piece and we thought they were going to
be on their way, and to have them go out
like that was I think well done.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
Yeah, I agree. Chelsea Amy played by Amy lou Wood.
It was consistent among everyone I talked with who watched
the show, she was the crowd favorite. I feel like
in each of these seasons, they've got that character that
you love and that you're rooting for. Jennifer Coolidge definitely
stole the show in the other seasons, but I just
felt like amylu Wood and her portrayal of Chelsea and
(04:05):
her love, her absolute love of him was beautiful. I
was really touched by it. I hated that she died,
but I agree. I'm glad that they both went together.
And everyone was waiting for something to happen to the
wealthy family with the Oh my gosh, Parker Posey stole
the show in just how she portrayed this North Carolina, rich,
(04:28):
out of touch woman and then her troubled husband who
was contemplating suicide the entire time. Timothy Rattliff played by
Jason Isaac's but I just thought everyone was expecting something
to happen with that family.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
And they almost went there multiple times.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
I felt like they teased us a little too much
with that family to expect it to actually happen in
the end.
Speaker 3 (04:48):
I don't know. I don't know how it felt about
the whole family situation, the possible suicide, the murder suicide.
I guess it would be he was going to kill
his whole family. That family, they were characters. I like
there was something about the family dynamic that I never got,
never got on board with the entire season, but it
(05:10):
didn't take into the last It wasn't to this last
episode that I felt that they were telling us something.
Everybody was flawed. Everybody was like really really messed up
and putting on in some way. Even Patrick's fortuning his character.
He even got a little lonely or empty looking at
somebody else being happy, like he realized that he was not.
There was nothing to him. Almost everybody just came around.
(05:31):
And the sister going to the monaster, she wants to
be to stay there for a year, but then she
comes back and says, well, you know what, I I'm
just too too much of a princess, Like she had
to come to that realization. The mom and dad of
course messed up. But the I thought the son and
the girl, the young lady it was with Rick, I
thought those two. As this episode was going along, I said,
(05:53):
they're gonna kill these two because these are the only
two people who were kind of innocent in this whole mess,
and they had been impacted by the bad decisions of
people around them and people they loved. I said, they
got to kill these two. I thought the kid was
a corner oh right.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
When they showed him drowning, I absolutely thought he was
going to die. I didn't know how they were going
to handle that. So I thought it was interesting that
he came back, but that gave his father the potential.
Timothy Ratliff, who the entire time was really struggling with
his massive financial loss, that he hadn't told his family
about his potential illegal activity, that he hadn't told his
(06:27):
family about keeping this secret, and worrying that the loss
of wealth, that the loss of reputation. He would rather
not just kill himself, but kill them because he didn't
think they could handle life outside of privilege, that they
could handle life outside of having a reputation that was
above everyone else. So yes, I think by bringing the
(06:49):
sun back. It was a beautiful moment. A light bulb
went off in his head finally, finally that yes, things
might be different, and they might not have the money,
and he might be in prison, but they have each other.
Sounds cheesy, but I did really feel that at the
end in the boat, and it did make me feel
a little warm and fuzzy, even though I know this
is a dark comedy and it was.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
Is that what is characterized as because it was it
was too much dark than comedy for me in the
last episode. I don't know. I just I was the
energy for me was it was an enjoyable thing throughout
and it became violent. Yes, somebody's going to prison. Possibly,
it just became I don't know, I felt that way.
It just became a little too Again. I think they
did the right thing. I think they nail it from
(07:32):
a creative standpoint, But just as me watching, I don't know,
maybe I was hoping for a more a happier ending than.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
Yeah we got yeah. I mean yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
For me, I guess the happy ending was just knowing
that that family, maybe he figured something out, maybe they'll
go on to be better people. But the other thing,
it wasn't surprising to me, I think almost I guessed it.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
I'm pretty sure you did too. Did we talk about
the fact.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
That Rick's nemesis, the man who he thought killed his father,
was in fact his father.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
I felt like they laid that on pretty heavily.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
Well. I thought in the last episode it was confirmed.
I mean, I thought the whole time they were at
the house and he's there confronting the guy and say, yeah,
it's gonna.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
Be a that Yeah, And when he said your dad
wasn't a good guy and your mom lied to you,
like I kind of knew he was talking about himself.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
So I was surprised that that was.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
Completely lost on Rick, completely to the point where he
actually decided to do the thing he had chosen not to,
which was to kill him and set off this whole
chain of events something else that was interesting to me.
So I loved the whole dynamic with the Michelle Monahan
character Jacqueline was her name, Leslie Bibbs character Kate, and
(08:36):
then the friend Carrie Coon, who was amazing playing Lori.
The three women there who were childhood best friends who
then kind of worked through some stuff. I guess while
they were at the resort. I thought it was brilliantly written.
I thought that was where a lot of the comedy
was for me. I know there was some darkness there too,
but I thought it was just on point in so
(08:57):
many ways.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
I absolutely loved it.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
But they were right there when the shots were being fired,
right there when Rick kills his father. I was confused
that they were celebrating at the end, drinking shot like nothing,
like they hadn't just witnessed something incredibly traumatic. That was
a little strange for me. The joyous ending with the
three friends.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
I mean, that could have I didn't think anything of that.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
Really, that's funny.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
That's me is.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
A little odd.
Speaker 3 (09:25):
That was I guess very I mean, I don't know,
I can't cross my mind before this moment, But.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
I loved watching those three women work through regret, jealousy,
bad choices, and still find that love for one another.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
I thought it was beautiful. I loved it.
Speaker 3 (09:46):
Oh yeah, you commented on them plenty plenty.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
And then kry Koone's character Laurie, who goes off and and.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
Puts herself in a very scary position.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
I think for most of the characters in this series,
they pushed it to the limit. And then when something happened,
or the worst case or what they thought would be
the worst case scenario happened. It actually gave them the
perspective they needed to be better, to do better, to
realize that what really is important in life is your
relationships and the love that you have for each other,
(10:15):
not what you're not getting, not what you're losing. Sadly though,
that was lost on Rick, and that's why Rick and
Chelsea perhaps had to go. What do you think about
just the voyeurism? How many people tune into this series
(10:38):
to see rich people, privileged people behave badly, and how
do you think they handled telling the stories of the
people who are the support staff, the people who try
to make these vacations perfect and beautiful for all of
these privileged people.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
I don't know. It's just a good show. I don't
think too much. And again there are critics out there
and people who are cultural observers and write about that stuff.
It just it's just an excellent show. It's just well acted,
and it's so well written. It's sharp, it's clever, it's timely.
It's just no matter what, it's a well done show.
(11:14):
So I feel things and react to things that I see,
But I don't. I'm not examining the show looking for
those nuggets in that moment and to interpret and say
that this is wrong and this is right on. And
so no, I don't view it. I don't see it
as a as voyeurism necessarily. I know it's been talked
about plenty, but I I just enjoy. I enjoy people
(11:38):
in the watching masters of their craft and everybody who
was acting in that show, and everybody put that show together.
It's just you're seeing that should be a stack of
Emmys just sitting there waiting just hand them out to
this entire staff, this entire cast. It's unbelievable.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
I agree.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
I the acting was some of the best I have
ever seen. The writing spot on and I love how
each season they bring in different people unexpectedly to all
be at these resorts.
Speaker 1 (12:06):
And the.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Writing and the character development is I'm imagining like probably
one of the best you could get as an actor
when you get a role like that. Now, the incest
for me, that was if I had to complain about
the show something that I just thought went too far.
I was very uncomfortable with the decision to bring an incest.
(12:33):
I don't know why it was necessary. Maybe it was
just to simply be provocative, but it actually made me
feel physically ill.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
And I don't know.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
I mean, I get that that's part of what art is.
It makes you feel things. They're not always good, sometimes
they're bad, sometimes they're ugly. But I did not enjoy
that for one moment. In fact, I looked away.
Speaker 3 (12:53):
Nobody would, obviously, but it was yes, meant to get
a reaction. I can't remember which producer, but they've been
on the record is saying that that storyline had had
a point, that you get the point of it at
the end of the season. I don't necessarily feel that
and understand how that dynamic between the brothers. What role
(13:15):
it played in me understanding this final episode or the
final couple episodes, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
The only thing that I could gather from that was
hearing from the young son.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
I believe his name is Lachlin right.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
He basically was explaining to his brother that he's a
people pleaser and that he wanted to make him happy,
and he thought that maybe his brother felt left out.
There was a threesome going on. If you haven't seen.
If you haven't seen, you probably aren't listening to this,
so I'm sure people are following along without having to
get two into the weeds about what exactly happened. But
(13:47):
the fact that you could be that much of a
people pleaser that you would do something so a boring
if you thought in the moment it would make someone
else feel good.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
Oh, I didn't think about it that way at all.
I mean, I heard that was an uncomfortable probably the
most uncomfortable conversation of the entire season. But no, I
don't get how it helped me along in the story.
I'm sure I'll no, I'm not gonna look that up.
Actually no, but I'm sure if somebody's trying to figure
(14:15):
that out. But it just it was apparently incest stories
oftentimes has been in plenty of movies and shows where
incest storylines for some reason are incorporated and writers have
their reason for it. I didn't get it on this one.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
I also thought it was interesting that, even as an
actor to get a script, I mentioned how awesome it
must be to get scripts like this because they're so
well written and the characters are so complex and probably
pretty fun to play. But if you're Patrick Schwarzenegger, I
wonder if he gave pause to portraying that I know
that his mother, Marius River, actually, when being interviewed, had
(14:51):
to make a point or felt like she needed to
make a point to say to everyone, you know, obviously
my son isn't anything like his character, which also just
felt weird and strange that that would even have to
be mentioned, because of course he is an actor. But
maybe perhaps the script is so uncomfortable and the theme
is so cringe worthy that she felt like she needed
(15:12):
to just make that extra clear.
Speaker 3 (15:14):
Okay, we don't have to talk about it anymore.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
Yes, we can move on from there. But to me,
that was a tough and then for them to take
on it's not just suicide, but as you pointed out,
murder suicide, that was also a choice that at times
became almost too much for me to watch. I believe
it was maybe the second or third to last episode
(15:38):
where we saw Tim the character the father, actually open
up and it looked as though he did kill his
family and then kill himself, only for all of us
who are watching to realize it was just.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
In his head.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Duke got even involved as well. We talked about this
on the Morning Run. They didn't like it so much.
Either that he did all of that while wearing a
very loud and proud Duke T shirt while this was
all going on, and it was also mentioned, I didn't realize.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
That if you zoomed in now, I'm trying to is it.
I can't remember the name.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
The blender was actually made by a company, and everyone
said that that pr company is now going to go
on a total campaign trying to take that image out
of anyone's heads that somehow their blenders had a poisonous
concoction inside of it that was going to be used
(16:34):
to kill and murder a family. So yes, it's funny
how product placement normally is something you'd want in a series,
not so much necessarily in some.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
Of these scenes.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
What's the name of the blender company?
Speaker 2 (16:45):
I was going to look at up right now, but yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
It's a very very famous I didn't.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
See it and didn't know about it, so I, for
the most part, they shouldn't put a statement out because
for folks who watched it, I didn't see the blender.
So the only reason I'm aware of it now is
because you said, so just leave it alone, folks. If
I could recommend anything to the company, just let it ride.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Let it ride. So I won't even mention it which
one it was.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
Yeah, well just let it ride. But for Duke, this
was the exact point they made in putting out a
statement after that. What was it two episodes ago, maybe
when the whole suicide scene was at the front and
the dad wearing the Duke shirt holds a gun to
his head, Well, that became a meme online and that
was going to forever be used every time you see
(17:29):
that image, he's holding a gun to his head and
it says Duke on it. And sure enough, what happened
when Duke lost in the final four over the weekend
in stunning fashion, those memes were everywhere of showing essentially
what looks like a Duke fan wanting to kill himself,
and that is what Duke was afraid of, and that's
(17:49):
just going to be out there forever.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
Now you mentioned that a couple of weeks ago, You're like, man,
if anything goes wrong with Duke, this is what they're
trying to avoid, and this is what they don't want
to happen.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
What did you think.
Speaker 2 (18:01):
Of the scene and the decision to take the five
million dollars Belinda, who has been there from season one
and season two and was technically well at least promised
Bunny by Jennifer Coolidge's character Tanya before she was killed.
So her now husband or ex husband ends up buying silence,
(18:25):
builing her silence about where he is and what his
role may have been from Belinda and her son was
very very excited about her taking the money.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
What do you think about that choice?
Speaker 3 (18:35):
That the choice? There were two moral moments in this
final episode. That was one of them that to be discussed.
What would you do? This is someone that we've all
come to know as a kind, a warm and a
decent woman who stood by for a long time, stood
by this notion that she would not be bought, that
(18:59):
she could not be bought, that she had principles she
would stand up for. That is a question what would
any of us do at that point? And I think
that was a great question to put before all the viewers.
You'd have that in your own mind, what would you do?
And you look at a woman. You might look at
her and say that's an awful decision, how could you?
But then you have a history with her that you
(19:21):
know she's a good woman. So I think that was
a brilliant. I think that was a marvelous part of
the and one of my favorite parts of this final episode.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
Yeah, so, just for the record, I was glad she
took the money. I wanted her to take the money.
I thought that, and I actually liked how Gary told
her that he felt like Tanya would have wanted her
to have the money. It almost made it gave her
permission that it was okay that she killed.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
But did he kill her?
Speaker 1 (19:45):
He didn't kill her. She fell off the boat.
Speaker 3 (19:47):
Okay, But I thought that was an understanding that the guy,
the husband of Jennifer Coolidge that gave the money in
this last episode, I thought he was wanted for questioning
you said he didn't kill her.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
She fell off the boat after being chased by a
bunch of game out on the boat, on the yacht
that she was on, who were all trying to kill her.
Speaker 1 (20:03):
So she was going to die.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
She ended up in a hilarious fashion as she was
running from people who were trying to kill her.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
She fell off the yacht and died.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
Okay, but is he a good guy or bad guy?
Speaker 2 (20:15):
The husband remains to be seen because it was absolutely
I mean, I took from it that he was with
her for her money.
Speaker 3 (20:23):
No wait, wait, wait wait, but the whole the black
Blenda was the whole point of this was the whole season.
She was saying or accusing this guy. And yes, it
was supposed to be quiet money, so be quiet for what.
Speaker 2 (20:37):
He didn't want to be questioned by police. He doesn't
want anyone to know where he was. He doesn't want
anyone to know. He doesn't want to have to talk
about what happened to Tanya to Jennifer Cooligche's care.
Speaker 3 (20:48):
But she definitely believed that he killed him.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
She absolutely believed it, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
And you know he was behind perhaps the plot. I
think that's what's implied. There was a bunch of game
out on this boat.
Speaker 3 (21:00):
We killed her then, yeah, okay.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
Yeah, I mean her actual death was accidental.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
But if he was the head of the snake, then
he is going to get more time in jail than
the ones who actually killed him.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
He doesn't want to answer any questions. And Belinda's character
knew that.
Speaker 3 (21:14):
But I was sure their boat was going to blow
up at the end. The last two people you see
on the episode are Belinda and her son on a
boat going off essentially into the sunset. Beautiful, beautiful cinematography
at the end, by the way, whoever put that together?
But I I was waiting on that boat to blow.
I just said, Wow, is she really going this is
(21:35):
going to be her happy ending, She's going to go on.
I just knew something was going to happen to them.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
Well, it is a dark comedy, so that was very possible.
Speaker 2 (21:42):
But I will say that I think you're looking for
who gets to write off into the sunset, And I
was very happy that Belinda and her son got to
do just that. And it wasn't about just finding the
romantic connection. It was also about having her own Now
she's got her own purpose. I love when he was like, hey,
what about your guy? I thought you guys were going
to start a spa together. I thought you guys were
(22:03):
gonna have She's like, can I just enjoy this moment
on my own?
Speaker 1 (22:07):
I appreciated that. I thought that was really cool.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
Way who was saying that there?
Speaker 2 (22:11):
Her son was asking her if she wanted to bring
the new boy. The new guy with her, the man
she met in who was another they were going to
start a business together. He was working there at the spa,
at the white load of spa and she kind of
was like, yeah, I think I'm good, Like, let me
just have this moment for myself, doesn't have to be
about a guy or about a relationship.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
Her line was, can I just be rich for five minutes?
There's a line she hit him with. And she was
so quiet, and her personality throughout the show she was
very maybe even timid, but she was certainly kind of
on the quieter end. And to see her exert some
kind of power and confidence at times, I like that
(22:53):
because she hasn't been necessarily my favorite character throughout. She
could find but she just there wasn't a whole lot
there necessarily, like some of the other characters, for her
to come out of that in these last episodes I liked.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
I love that she came out in power that actually
made me feel very happy. I liked how they tied
that one up.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
What did you think about?
Speaker 2 (23:19):
I was trying to find the name of his character,
the guard who was in love with the girl who
ended up shooting our guy in the back unfortunately because
he was being told to kill him kill him, ends
up becoming the head woman's driver in the end and
gets the girl.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
Didn't care about that guy from episode one to episode eight.
Didn't feel anything for him, didn't care, wasn't rooting for him,
wasn't rooting against him. Didn't care if he lived a dad,
don't care, Still don't care if he got the job,
don't care if he wrecked that SUV when they will leave.
I just don't care about that guy.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
Yeah, it's so funny. I felt the same way.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
I think because like you, kind of felt sorry for him,
but he was spineless. He never knew what to do.
He was always wishy, washy. He was always trying to
either please the girl or say he was a Buddhist.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
But I never felt.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
In any way like, yes, I actually wouldn't have cared
if he had died.
Speaker 3 (24:10):
I'm not applauding him getting the gar I'm not happy
for him at the end. He shot a guy in
the back. I'm not gonna respect that if that wasn't
even a confrontation, right, he didn't redeem himself. He shot
a guy in the back because a woman was yelling
at him to do so.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
He does what he's told. Doesn't it seem like that?
Speaker 2 (24:27):
So maybe that's maybe we were supposed to not feel
anything for him, except for maybe even a little bit
of disgust.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
And masterful and the way they write these folks in
He still got what he wanted ultimately, but he didn't
have to be tough. He shot somebody in the back,
right and got the gig. Okay, that's fine, but yeah,
that was a character. I didn't care about him dating
the girl. Didn't care. She was sweet as pie, didn't
care at.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
All, but already manipulating him because she basically let him know,
unless you've got money in, unless you have the job
I want, or you're ambitious in some sort of way,
or i'm confident, I don't want to be with you.
In fact, my mom is having trouble with her back,
and so I don't think I can go on a
date with you tonight.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
Yes, so she was sweet but manipulative.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
I had a nickel every time I heard that excuse.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
But you know what you mentioned, he shot someone in
the back. He didn't just shoot anyone in the back.
He shot Rick in the back. And we all loved Rick.
He was a guy who just couldn't get rid of
his demons. And when you know, there was such a
sweet moment, Oh this sounds silly, and you were like, okay,
here she goes again. But I actually almost started crying
(25:36):
at that scene at breakfast.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
Well, first of all, when.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
She ran, when Chelsea ran to go see Rick, when
she saw that he was okay, that everything was okay,
and that you know, he had done what he needed
to do when he was at peace. And so they
were sitting there at breakfast, and she talked about spending
their life together, and she was always kind of searching
or fishing for him to agree with her or to say, yes,
let's be together. He told yeah, like that's the plan.
(26:02):
And the smile he just said that's the plan, and
this smile that went over her face. You could feel
it like she didn't have to say anything, He didn't
have to say anything else. It was just, Oh, that
was such a powerful moment.
Speaker 3 (26:15):
If that was the moment, I was sure she was
going to die, that was the moment because we've been
waiting on her to get that one thing from him
the entire season, the entire she never got it until
that moment that things were looking too up. That's when
I oh, when she said that, when when he said
that to her.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
We're gonna make it, she said something. I won't get
the exact quote, but like, we're going to be together forever.
I really believe we're going to be together forever. And
he said that's the plan.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Oh and really that Walter, Walter Walton excuse me, Walton
Goggins is his name. He wants to show you know
who he is. But I encourage you all to go
watch anything he's in. He's just a great and he
has a great relationship with HBO that goes back to
several series. But Righteous Jimstone if you haven't seen that one,
(27:02):
and the other is Vice Principles. Those two shows, they're
comedies on HBO previous series he was on. Please please
go watch that and go watch him. He is just incredible.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
So you have introduced me to him. You know, he's
got one of those faces that I always like. Yes,
I knew, but I didn't know his name, and I
really couldn't have told you anything specifically that he was in. So, yes,
we've been watching the VP show and I have been
laughing out loud. But it's pretty cool. Walter Goggins on Instagram.
Speaker 1 (27:34):
I believe you put it out.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
He didn't twelve hours ago, so you certainly let everybody
watch it. There were no spoiler alerts, but he put
a picture of him with Chelsea with Amy Lu's character
on the beach that moment when she saw him, and
he wrote Rick, Rick plus Chelsea with the heaviest of hearts.
(27:57):
To me, ours was a love story. It was only
ever a love story hindered by unresolved childhood trauma. We
all have them, but we can all move past them.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
It's pretty cool. He actually took his character.
Speaker 2 (28:08):
And the theme of at least what he played with
Amy Lou would and made it into a whole beautiful
Instagram post that I would encourage everybody to read because
it's actually really beautiful, talking about how this spoke to
him that even in the depths of our despair, there
is always beauty all around us. We can sit with
our pain and not react, but not be defined by it.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
It's there.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
The love the world is constantly giving in any given moment,
is always there, always waiting for us to see it.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
I thought that was really cool.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
That summed up what it seemed like to me watching
the two of them, And I just love that he
put that out there on Instagram.
Speaker 3 (28:43):
Well, yeah, if you all don't know, he's a cool,
cool talent. Yeah, And he was more intense in this
one than I've seen him before, usually in a comedic role,
but he was I loved. He might have been my
favorite character in the show. Yeah, who was your favorite character?
Speaker 2 (28:57):
So my favorite character, hands down was Chelsea played by
Ammy Lou Amy Lou.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
I thought she was.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
Awesome, probably not a surprise, and I like the guy
that she was in love with on the show, Walter Gogins,
this character Rick and again they were a very dynamic couple.
The what's her name Lori Kuhn Kerry Kuon Kerry Kohon,
who plays Lori. I wasn't as into the you maybe
(29:24):
because you have groups of friends like that, but three women,
the way they are with each other and every time
you're like, oh, that's exactly what we do, and yep,
to go over here and talk about the other one.
Then they swap out and that whole thing. I wasn't
as big a fan of that because it wasn't my lane.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
I was laughing out loud because I don't know what
this is. Ladies who are listening, tell me if this
is true in your life. I can go back from
when I was a kid with my girl cousins.
Speaker 1 (29:50):
There always tends.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
To be a threesome for whatever reason, there is a
triangle of friends. Look at Sabine's friend group right now,
you're love she has a threesome. I can go back
to all these different periods of my life and there
always seems to be a threesome of girls who kind
of band together, and with that always comes some issues.
So I just thought it was really interesting that the
(30:11):
writer that they actually explored that, because that's been a
theme throughout my life and you know.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
Good, bad, ugly, sad.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
But I thought it was really sweet how they brought
it all together and how they realized there was love there. Yes,
there's competition there, yes, sometimes to team up against one
and then those teams switch around over the years. I
just thought it was brilliantly written and it had heart,
but it also had some sharp edges that all of
us can look inward at when you see writing like
that that really reflects life. I just spoke to me, Yes,
(30:41):
I know you weren't as into it that part of
the show, but I really really really liked it.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
But I love those three actresses. I mean love, love
Michelle Monahan. That goes back for the years, and oh
my god, love Michelle monihanue I just love her. And
GiB Leslie.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
Yea Leslie, GiB she'sat.
Speaker 3 (31:00):
She crushes everything she's ever ever in. Just love her.
But it was Kuhn who had the speech. I said,
there were two moments in the show, and Carrie Kuhn
had the other one that I thought was the biggest moment,
her speech at dinner. Yeah, she delivered it brilliantly with
her acting, but the message that was within that I
(31:22):
thought it was great. And ultimately she said, I'm just
happy to be at the table with you all, and
it wasn't a matter of pity or you all are
better than me. She put this story. She really did
weave together their entire lives and their story and their
friendship in a really cool way. Whoever wrote I would
like to know the person who wrote that speech, Like
(31:43):
the single individual who wrote that particular line. I would
like to look up of that particular speech. It was great.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
It moved me like I felt emotional on this final episode,
and I do think they did such a good job
of bringing that all together, like the ups and down
of this threesome on this vacation. I just that, Yes,
that final scene at dinner was so powerful. I loved it.
I'm hoping that Belinda and her son who sailed off
(32:12):
into the sunset, take us to the next White Lotus.
Maybe she creates a White Lotus, or maybe she creates
something that's all her own. But I would continue to
watch her, and I will keep being an avid fan
of the White Lotus for as many seasons as they'll
put out. I'm already feeling a little sad because it
was something that was so exciting to look forward to
(32:34):
for you, Babe, March badness is winding down and the
White Lotus is.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
Done for now.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
But I actually wouldn't mind going back and watching season
one in season two until I wait until what?
Speaker 1 (32:49):
Until I wait? As I wait for season four?
Speaker 3 (32:53):
Has it been announced?
Speaker 1 (32:53):
No, I'm just hoping.
Speaker 3 (32:55):
But it's coming. But yeah, again, another season well done.
But I did like a I'm just a writing fan.
I love good storytelling and good writing, and this was
just to see it at that scale, to see it
at that level is just really really impressive. So most
people listening have already checked it out, But if you haven't,
(33:16):
by all means.
Speaker 1 (33:18):
We've just spoiled everything.
Speaker 3 (33:21):
Maybe we made some people curious, like, oh, I didn't
know all this was going on. Let me check that out.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
There are people who love to read the last page
of a book like you sometimes and know how it's
going to end, and then enjoy the process already knowing
what the outcome is. So that could be one another
way to watch this season. But thank you for listening
to this episode of Amy and DJ Helpe.
Speaker 1 (33:42):
You check out Why.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
Lotus and also please check out the Morning Run, available
Monday through Friday six thirty am Eastern Time. So subscribe
to us and we'll be in your inbox waiting for you.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
Have a good day.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
Intaction Produs the tat
Welcome everybody to Amy and TJ. And I am very.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Excited about this episode because we're gonna talk all things
The White Lotus.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
Season three finale was Sunday night.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
We watched it the next day because yes, nine pm
is passed our bedtime most days, but it did not
disappoint eight weeks.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
We had eight episodes.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
This time around, and each season has been unexpected, at
least in terms of the ending, and you're always trying
to figure out who's gonna die, who's gonna live, who's
gonna walk off into.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
The sunset together.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
So we have a lot to unpack from season three.
It's finale, and you know, it's one of those one
of those series that draws me in. At least I
can speak for myself on this. I'm a huge fan
of Downton Abbey. I'm a big fan of Below Deck.
We both like that show, and it's this introspective look
(00:56):
into what's happening upstairs, what's happening downstairs, the rich and
the privileged versus the people who are working to make
their experience a fun one. It's about the dark side
of vacation, and gosh, it explored so many different themes.
I don't know where to start, but this season was
potentially one of the most controversial. We had themes of incest,
(01:19):
which was difficult, suicide which is always difficult, and yeah,
who done it, Who's bad, who's good, who's evil, who's not.
I did not think the episode. Disappointed and we have
not talked about how we each thought about the finale.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
So TJ, what did you think about I.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
Was disappointed with how far it went. It was too
violent for me. Really, I didn't like that part. I
know it was a part of it. I'm saying I
just got used to something with the show and that
kind of threw me off, and I didn't like it
was violent. It became some bizarre action, very violent sequence
(01:58):
of point blank shooting somebody and then shooting somebody in
the back, and I just I didn't like. Don't get
me wrong, they take their creative license, and I think
it was The show is consistently amazing, but it's not
what I would have gone for or liked. In the end.
It was just too violent for me. This is not
a criticism of the writers. It's just for what I
went along with and what I prefer to see.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Yeah, the shootout scene was a little confusing to me,
just because so many people got in on it. I
was really truly expecting one death, and then the death
you thought that was happening didn't happen.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
It was, but it was for me.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
It was exciting, and I hate to glorify any kind
of violence, but I did appreciate it. I know a
lot of people had lots of questions about the choices
that this season went with, but I enjoyed the final show,
end of story, and my favorite part was the sad
(02:54):
part because I loved the love story.
Speaker 1 (02:56):
Do you know what love story I'm talking about?
Speaker 2 (02:58):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (02:58):
Yeah, they died at the end together. That was the
love story. Ultimately, everybody came around just having him get
some redemption finally in the end and them seemingly on
their way to being finding peace and being happily ever after,
and then they died quite dramatically. I think having them
both die was a I mean crazy that sounds was
a nice touch because we love these characters so much.
(03:20):
We as far as the audience, I know, Rick played
by Walter Goggins's he was a very confusing and conflicted
and even a character you didn't like at times because
of the way he treated her. But you thought he
found his piece and we thought they were going to
be on their way, and to have them go out
like that was I think well done.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
Yeah, I agree. Chelsea Amy played by Amy lou Wood.
It was consistent among everyone I talked with who watched
the show, she was the crowd favorite. I feel like
in each of these seasons, they've got that character that
you love and that you're rooting for. Jennifer Coolidge definitely
stole the show in the other seasons, but I just
felt like amylu Wood and her portrayal of Chelsea and
(04:05):
her love, her absolute love of him was beautiful. I
was really touched by it. I hated that she died,
but I agree. I'm glad that they both went together.
And everyone was waiting for something to happen to the
wealthy family with the Oh my gosh, Parker Posey stole
the show in just how she portrayed this North Carolina, rich,
(04:28):
out of touch woman and then her troubled husband who
was contemplating suicide the entire time. Timothy Rattliff played by
Jason Isaac's but I just thought everyone was expecting something
to happen with that family.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
And they almost went there multiple times.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
I felt like they teased us a little too much
with that family to expect it to actually happen in
the end.
Speaker 3 (04:48):
I don't know. I don't know how it felt about
the whole family situation, the possible suicide, the murder suicide.
I guess it would be he was going to kill
his whole family. That family, they were characters. I like
there was something about the family dynamic that I never got,
never got on board with the entire season, but it
(05:10):
didn't take into the last It wasn't to this last
episode that I felt that they were telling us something.
Everybody was flawed. Everybody was like really really messed up
and putting on in some way. Even Patrick's fortuning his character.
He even got a little lonely or empty looking at
somebody else being happy, like he realized that he was not.
There was nothing to him. Almost everybody just came around.
(05:31):
And the sister going to the monaster, she wants to
be to stay there for a year, but then she
comes back and says, well, you know what, I I'm
just too too much of a princess, Like she had
to come to that realization. The mom and dad of
course messed up. But the I thought the son and
the girl, the young lady it was with Rick, I
thought those two. As this episode was going along, I said,
(05:53):
they're gonna kill these two because these are the only
two people who were kind of innocent in this whole mess,
and they had been impacted by the bad decisions of
people around them and people they loved. I said, they
got to kill these two. I thought the kid was
a corner oh right.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
When they showed him drowning, I absolutely thought he was
going to die. I didn't know how they were going
to handle that. So I thought it was interesting that
he came back, but that gave his father the potential.
Timothy Ratliff, who the entire time was really struggling with
his massive financial loss, that he hadn't told his family
about his potential illegal activity, that he hadn't told his
(06:27):
family about keeping this secret, and worrying that the loss
of wealth, that the loss of reputation. He would rather
not just kill himself, but kill them because he didn't
think they could handle life outside of privilege, that they
could handle life outside of having a reputation that was
above everyone else. So yes, I think by bringing the
(06:49):
sun back. It was a beautiful moment. A light bulb
went off in his head finally, finally that yes, things
might be different, and they might not have the money,
and he might be in prison, but they have each other.
Sounds cheesy, but I did really feel that at the
end in the boat, and it did make me feel
a little warm and fuzzy, even though I know this
is a dark comedy and it was.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
Is that what is characterized as because it was it
was too much dark than comedy for me in the
last episode. I don't know. I just I was the
energy for me was it was an enjoyable thing throughout
and it became violent. Yes, somebody's going to prison. Possibly,
it just became I don't know, I felt that way.
It just became a little too Again. I think they
did the right thing. I think they nail it from
(07:32):
a creative standpoint, But just as me watching, I don't know,
maybe I was hoping for a more a happier ending than.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
Yeah we got yeah. I mean yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
For me, I guess the happy ending was just knowing
that that family, maybe he figured something out, maybe they'll
go on to be better people. But the other thing,
it wasn't surprising to me, I think almost I guessed it.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
I'm pretty sure you did too. Did we talk about
the fact.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
That Rick's nemesis, the man who he thought killed his father,
was in fact his father.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
I felt like they laid that on pretty heavily.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
Well. I thought in the last episode it was confirmed.
I mean, I thought the whole time they were at
the house and he's there confronting the guy and say, yeah,
it's gonna.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
Be a that Yeah, And when he said your dad
wasn't a good guy and your mom lied to you,
like I kind of knew he was talking about himself.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
So I was surprised that that was.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
Completely lost on Rick, completely to the point where he
actually decided to do the thing he had chosen not to,
which was to kill him and set off this whole
chain of events something else that was interesting to me.
So I loved the whole dynamic with the Michelle Monahan
character Jacqueline was her name, Leslie Bibbs character Kate, and
(08:36):
then the friend Carrie Coon, who was amazing playing Lori.
The three women there who were childhood best friends who
then kind of worked through some stuff. I guess while
they were at the resort. I thought it was brilliantly written.
I thought that was where a lot of the comedy
was for me. I know there was some darkness there too,
but I thought it was just on point in so
(08:57):
many ways.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
I absolutely loved it.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
But they were right there when the shots were being fired,
right there when Rick kills his father. I was confused
that they were celebrating at the end, drinking shot like nothing,
like they hadn't just witnessed something incredibly traumatic. That was
a little strange for me. The joyous ending with the
three friends.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
I mean, that could have I didn't think anything of that.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
Really, that's funny.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
That's me is.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
A little odd.
Speaker 3 (09:25):
That was I guess very I mean, I don't know,
I can't cross my mind before this moment, But.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
I loved watching those three women work through regret, jealousy,
bad choices, and still find that love for one another.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
I thought it was beautiful. I loved it.
Speaker 3 (09:46):
Oh yeah, you commented on them plenty plenty.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
And then kry Koone's character Laurie, who goes off and and.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
Puts herself in a very scary position.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
I think for most of the characters in this series,
they pushed it to the limit. And then when something happened,
or the worst case or what they thought would be
the worst case scenario happened. It actually gave them the
perspective they needed to be better, to do better, to
realize that what really is important in life is your
relationships and the love that you have for each other,
(10:15):
not what you're not getting, not what you're losing. Sadly though,
that was lost on Rick, and that's why Rick and
Chelsea perhaps had to go. What do you think about
just the voyeurism? How many people tune into this series
(10:38):
to see rich people, privileged people behave badly, and how
do you think they handled telling the stories of the
people who are the support staff, the people who try
to make these vacations perfect and beautiful for all of
these privileged people.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
I don't know. It's just a good show. I don't
think too much. And again there are critics out there
and people who are cultural observers and write about that stuff.
It just it's just an excellent show. It's just well acted,
and it's so well written. It's sharp, it's clever, it's timely.
It's just no matter what, it's a well done show.
(11:14):
So I feel things and react to things that I see,
But I don't. I'm not examining the show looking for
those nuggets in that moment and to interpret and say
that this is wrong and this is right on. And
so no, I don't view it. I don't see it
as a as voyeurism necessarily. I know it's been talked
about plenty, but I I just enjoy. I enjoy people
(11:38):
in the watching masters of their craft and everybody who
was acting in that show, and everybody put that show together.
It's just you're seeing that should be a stack of
Emmys just sitting there waiting just hand them out to
this entire staff, this entire cast. It's unbelievable.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
I agree.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
I the acting was some of the best I have
ever seen. The writing spot on and I love how
each season they bring in different people unexpectedly to all
be at these resorts.
Speaker 1 (12:06):
And the.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Writing and the character development is I'm imagining like probably
one of the best you could get as an actor
when you get a role like that. Now, the incest
for me, that was if I had to complain about
the show something that I just thought went too far.
I was very uncomfortable with the decision to bring an incest.
(12:33):
I don't know why it was necessary. Maybe it was
just to simply be provocative, but it actually made me
feel physically ill.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
And I don't know.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
I mean, I get that that's part of what art is.
It makes you feel things. They're not always good, sometimes
they're bad, sometimes they're ugly. But I did not enjoy
that for one moment. In fact, I looked away.
Speaker 3 (12:53):
Nobody would, obviously, but it was yes, meant to get
a reaction. I can't remember which producer, but they've been
on the record is saying that that storyline had had
a point, that you get the point of it at
the end of the season. I don't necessarily feel that
and understand how that dynamic between the brothers. What role
(13:15):
it played in me understanding this final episode or the
final couple episodes, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
The only thing that I could gather from that was
hearing from the young son.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
I believe his name is Lachlin right.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
He basically was explaining to his brother that he's a
people pleaser and that he wanted to make him happy,
and he thought that maybe his brother felt left out.
There was a threesome going on. If you haven't seen.
If you haven't seen, you probably aren't listening to this,
so I'm sure people are following along without having to
get two into the weeds about what exactly happened. But
(13:47):
the fact that you could be that much of a
people pleaser that you would do something so a boring
if you thought in the moment it would make someone
else feel good.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
Oh, I didn't think about it that way at all.
I mean, I heard that was an uncomfortable probably the
most uncomfortable conversation of the entire season. But no, I
don't get how it helped me along in the story.
I'm sure I'll no, I'm not gonna look that up.
Actually no, but I'm sure if somebody's trying to figure
(14:15):
that out. But it just it was apparently incest stories
oftentimes has been in plenty of movies and shows where
incest storylines for some reason are incorporated and writers have
their reason for it. I didn't get it on this one.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
I also thought it was interesting that, even as an
actor to get a script, I mentioned how awesome it
must be to get scripts like this because they're so
well written and the characters are so complex and probably
pretty fun to play. But if you're Patrick Schwarzenegger, I
wonder if he gave pause to portraying that I know
that his mother, Marius River, actually, when being interviewed, had
(14:51):
to make a point or felt like she needed to
make a point to say to everyone, you know, obviously
my son isn't anything like his character, which also just
felt weird and strange that that would even have to
be mentioned, because of course he is an actor. But
maybe perhaps the script is so uncomfortable and the theme
is so cringe worthy that she felt like she needed
(15:12):
to just make that extra clear.
Speaker 3 (15:14):
Okay, we don't have to talk about it anymore.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
Yes, we can move on from there. But to me,
that was a tough and then for them to take
on it's not just suicide, but as you pointed out,
murder suicide, that was also a choice that at times
became almost too much for me to watch. I believe
it was maybe the second or third to last episode
(15:38):
where we saw Tim the character the father, actually open
up and it looked as though he did kill his
family and then kill himself, only for all of us
who are watching to realize it was just.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
In his head.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Duke got even involved as well. We talked about this
on the Morning Run. They didn't like it so much.
Either that he did all of that while wearing a
very loud and proud Duke T shirt while this was
all going on, and it was also mentioned, I didn't realize.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
That if you zoomed in now, I'm trying to is it.
I can't remember the name.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
The blender was actually made by a company, and everyone
said that that pr company is now going to go
on a total campaign trying to take that image out
of anyone's heads that somehow their blenders had a poisonous
concoction inside of it that was going to be used
(16:34):
to kill and murder a family. So yes, it's funny
how product placement normally is something you'd want in a series,
not so much necessarily in some.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
Of these scenes.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
What's the name of the blender company?
Speaker 2 (16:45):
I was going to look at up right now, but yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
It's a very very famous I didn't.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
See it and didn't know about it, so I, for
the most part, they shouldn't put a statement out because
for folks who watched it, I didn't see the blender.
So the only reason I'm aware of it now is
because you said, so just leave it alone, folks. If
I could recommend anything to the company, just let it ride.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Let it ride. So I won't even mention it which
one it was.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
Yeah, well just let it ride. But for Duke, this
was the exact point they made in putting out a
statement after that. What was it two episodes ago, maybe
when the whole suicide scene was at the front and
the dad wearing the Duke shirt holds a gun to
his head, Well, that became a meme online and that
was going to forever be used every time you see
(17:29):
that image, he's holding a gun to his head and
it says Duke on it. And sure enough, what happened
when Duke lost in the final four over the weekend
in stunning fashion, those memes were everywhere of showing essentially
what looks like a Duke fan wanting to kill himself,
and that is what Duke was afraid of, and that's
(17:49):
just going to be out there forever.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
Now you mentioned that a couple of weeks ago, You're like, man,
if anything goes wrong with Duke, this is what they're
trying to avoid, and this is what they don't want
to happen.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
What did you think.
Speaker 2 (18:01):
Of the scene and the decision to take the five
million dollars Belinda, who has been there from season one
and season two and was technically well at least promised
Bunny by Jennifer Coolidge's character Tanya before she was killed.
So her now husband or ex husband ends up buying silence,
(18:25):
builing her silence about where he is and what his
role may have been from Belinda and her son was
very very excited about her taking the money.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
What do you think about that choice?
Speaker 3 (18:35):
That the choice? There were two moral moments in this
final episode. That was one of them that to be discussed.
What would you do? This is someone that we've all
come to know as a kind, a warm and a
decent woman who stood by for a long time, stood
by this notion that she would not be bought, that
(18:59):
she could not be bought, that she had principles she
would stand up for. That is a question what would
any of us do at that point? And I think
that was a great question to put before all the viewers.
You'd have that in your own mind, what would you do?
And you look at a woman. You might look at
her and say that's an awful decision, how could you?
But then you have a history with her that you
(19:21):
know she's a good woman. So I think that was
a brilliant. I think that was a marvelous part of
the and one of my favorite parts of this final episode.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
Yeah, so, just for the record, I was glad she
took the money. I wanted her to take the money.
I thought that, and I actually liked how Gary told
her that he felt like Tanya would have wanted her
to have the money. It almost made it gave her
permission that it was okay that she killed.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
But did he kill her?
Speaker 1 (19:45):
He didn't kill her. She fell off the boat.
Speaker 3 (19:47):
Okay, But I thought that was an understanding that the guy,
the husband of Jennifer Coolidge that gave the money in
this last episode, I thought he was wanted for questioning
you said he didn't kill her.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
She fell off the boat after being chased by a
bunch of game out on the boat, on the yacht
that she was on, who were all trying to kill her.
Speaker 1 (20:03):
So she was going to die.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
She ended up in a hilarious fashion as she was
running from people who were trying to kill her.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
She fell off the yacht and died.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
Okay, but is he a good guy or bad guy?
Speaker 2 (20:15):
The husband remains to be seen because it was absolutely
I mean, I took from it that he was with
her for her money.
Speaker 3 (20:23):
No wait, wait, wait wait, but the whole the black
Blenda was the whole point of this was the whole season.
She was saying or accusing this guy. And yes, it
was supposed to be quiet money, so be quiet for what.
Speaker 2 (20:37):
He didn't want to be questioned by police. He doesn't
want anyone to know where he was. He doesn't want
anyone to know. He doesn't want to have to talk
about what happened to Tanya to Jennifer Cooligche's care.
Speaker 3 (20:48):
But she definitely believed that he killed him.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
She absolutely believed it, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
And you know he was behind perhaps the plot. I
think that's what's implied. There was a bunch of game
out on this boat.
Speaker 3 (21:00):
We killed her then, yeah, okay.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
Yeah, I mean her actual death was accidental.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
But if he was the head of the snake, then
he is going to get more time in jail than
the ones who actually killed him.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
He doesn't want to answer any questions. And Belinda's character
knew that.
Speaker 3 (21:14):
But I was sure their boat was going to blow
up at the end. The last two people you see
on the episode are Belinda and her son on a
boat going off essentially into the sunset. Beautiful, beautiful cinematography
at the end, by the way, whoever put that together?
But I I was waiting on that boat to blow.
I just said, Wow, is she really going this is
(21:35):
going to be her happy ending, She's going to go on.
I just knew something was going to happen to them.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
Well, it is a dark comedy, so that was very possible.
Speaker 2 (21:42):
But I will say that I think you're looking for
who gets to write off into the sunset, And I
was very happy that Belinda and her son got to
do just that. And it wasn't about just finding the
romantic connection. It was also about having her own Now
she's got her own purpose. I love when he was like, hey,
what about your guy? I thought you guys were going
to start a spa together. I thought you guys were
(22:03):
gonna have She's like, can I just enjoy this moment
on my own?
Speaker 1 (22:07):
I appreciated that. I thought that was really cool.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
Way who was saying that there?
Speaker 2 (22:11):
Her son was asking her if she wanted to bring
the new boy. The new guy with her, the man
she met in who was another they were going to
start a business together. He was working there at the spa,
at the white load of spa and she kind of
was like, yeah, I think I'm good, Like, let me
just have this moment for myself, doesn't have to be
about a guy or about a relationship.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
Her line was, can I just be rich for five minutes?
There's a line she hit him with. And she was
so quiet, and her personality throughout the show she was
very maybe even timid, but she was certainly kind of
on the quieter end. And to see her exert some
kind of power and confidence at times, I like that
(22:53):
because she hasn't been necessarily my favorite character throughout. She
could find but she just there wasn't a whole lot
there necessarily, like some of the other characters, for her
to come out of that in these last episodes I liked.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
I love that she came out in power that actually
made me feel very happy. I liked how they tied
that one up.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
What did you think about?
Speaker 2 (23:19):
I was trying to find the name of his character,
the guard who was in love with the girl who
ended up shooting our guy in the back unfortunately because
he was being told to kill him kill him, ends
up becoming the head woman's driver in the end and
gets the girl.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
Didn't care about that guy from episode one to episode eight.
Didn't feel anything for him, didn't care, wasn't rooting for him,
wasn't rooting against him. Didn't care if he lived a dad,
don't care, Still don't care if he got the job,
don't care if he wrecked that SUV when they will leave.
I just don't care about that guy.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
Yeah, it's so funny. I felt the same way.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
I think because like you, kind of felt sorry for him,
but he was spineless. He never knew what to do.
He was always wishy, washy. He was always trying to
either please the girl or say he was a Buddhist.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
But I never felt.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
In any way like, yes, I actually wouldn't have cared
if he had died.
Speaker 3 (24:10):
I'm not applauding him getting the gar I'm not happy
for him at the end. He shot a guy in
the back. I'm not gonna respect that if that wasn't
even a confrontation, right, he didn't redeem himself. He shot
a guy in the back because a woman was yelling
at him to do so.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
He does what he's told. Doesn't it seem like that?
Speaker 2 (24:27):
So maybe that's maybe we were supposed to not feel
anything for him, except for maybe even a little bit
of disgust.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
And masterful and the way they write these folks in
He still got what he wanted ultimately, but he didn't
have to be tough. He shot somebody in the back,
right and got the gig. Okay, that's fine, but yeah,
that was a character. I didn't care about him dating
the girl. Didn't care. She was sweet as pie, didn't
care at.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
All, but already manipulating him because she basically let him know,
unless you've got money in, unless you have the job
I want, or you're ambitious in some sort of way,
or i'm confident, I don't want to be with you.
In fact, my mom is having trouble with her back,
and so I don't think I can go on a
date with you tonight.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
Yes, so she was sweet but manipulative.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
I had a nickel every time I heard that excuse.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
But you know what you mentioned, he shot someone in
the back. He didn't just shoot anyone in the back.
He shot Rick in the back. And we all loved Rick.
He was a guy who just couldn't get rid of
his demons. And when you know, there was such a
sweet moment, Oh this sounds silly, and you were like, okay,
here she goes again. But I actually almost started crying
(25:36):
at that scene at breakfast.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
Well, first of all, when.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
She ran, when Chelsea ran to go see Rick, when
she saw that he was okay, that everything was okay,
and that you know, he had done what he needed
to do when he was at peace. And so they
were sitting there at breakfast, and she talked about spending
their life together, and she was always kind of searching
or fishing for him to agree with her or to say, yes,
let's be together. He told yeah, like that's the plan.
(26:02):
And the smile he just said that's the plan, and
this smile that went over her face. You could feel
it like she didn't have to say anything, He didn't
have to say anything else. It was just, Oh, that
was such a powerful moment.
Speaker 3 (26:15):
If that was the moment, I was sure she was
going to die, that was the moment because we've been
waiting on her to get that one thing from him
the entire season, the entire she never got it until
that moment that things were looking too up. That's when
I oh, when she said that, when when he said
that to her.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
We're gonna make it, she said something. I won't get
the exact quote, but like, we're going to be together forever.
I really believe we're going to be together forever. And
he said that's the plan.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Oh and really that Walter, Walter Walton excuse me, Walton
Goggins is his name. He wants to show you know
who he is. But I encourage you all to go
watch anything he's in. He's just a great and he
has a great relationship with HBO that goes back to
several series. But Righteous Jimstone if you haven't seen that one,
(27:02):
and the other is Vice Principles. Those two shows, they're
comedies on HBO previous series he was on. Please please
go watch that and go watch him. He is just incredible.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
So you have introduced me to him. You know, he's
got one of those faces that I always like. Yes,
I knew, but I didn't know his name, and I
really couldn't have told you anything specifically that he was in. So, yes,
we've been watching the VP show and I have been
laughing out loud. But it's pretty cool. Walter Goggins on Instagram.
Speaker 1 (27:34):
I believe you put it out.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
He didn't twelve hours ago, so you certainly let everybody
watch it. There were no spoiler alerts, but he put
a picture of him with Chelsea with Amy Lu's character
on the beach that moment when she saw him, and
he wrote Rick, Rick plus Chelsea with the heaviest of hearts.
(27:57):
To me, ours was a love story. It was only
ever a love story hindered by unresolved childhood trauma. We
all have them, but we can all move past them.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
It's pretty cool. He actually took his character.
Speaker 2 (28:08):
And the theme of at least what he played with
Amy Lou would and made it into a whole beautiful
Instagram post that I would encourage everybody to read because
it's actually really beautiful, talking about how this spoke to
him that even in the depths of our despair, there
is always beauty all around us. We can sit with
our pain and not react, but not be defined by it.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
It's there.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
The love the world is constantly giving in any given moment,
is always there, always waiting for us to see it.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
I thought that was really cool.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
That summed up what it seemed like to me watching
the two of them, And I just love that he
put that out there on Instagram.
Speaker 3 (28:43):
Well, yeah, if you all don't know, he's a cool,
cool talent. Yeah, And he was more intense in this
one than I've seen him before, usually in a comedic role,
but he was I loved. He might have been my
favorite character in the show. Yeah, who was your favorite character?
Speaker 2 (28:57):
So my favorite character, hands down was Chelsea played by
Ammy Lou Amy Lou.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
I thought she was.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
Awesome, probably not a surprise, and I like the guy
that she was in love with on the show, Walter Gogins,
this character Rick and again they were a very dynamic couple.
The what's her name Lori Kuhn Kerry Kuon Kerry Kohon,
who plays Lori. I wasn't as into the you maybe
(29:24):
because you have groups of friends like that, but three women,
the way they are with each other and every time
you're like, oh, that's exactly what we do, and yep,
to go over here and talk about the other one.
Then they swap out and that whole thing. I wasn't
as big a fan of that because it wasn't my lane.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
I was laughing out loud because I don't know what
this is. Ladies who are listening, tell me if this
is true in your life. I can go back from
when I was a kid with my girl cousins.
Speaker 1 (29:50):
There always tends.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
To be a threesome for whatever reason, there is a
triangle of friends. Look at Sabine's friend group right now,
you're love she has a threesome. I can go back
to all these different periods of my life and there
always seems to be a threesome of girls who kind
of band together, and with that always comes some issues.
So I just thought it was really interesting that the
(30:11):
writer that they actually explored that, because that's been a
theme throughout my life and you know.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
Good, bad, ugly, sad.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
But I thought it was really sweet how they brought
it all together and how they realized there was love there. Yes,
there's competition there, yes, sometimes to team up against one
and then those teams switch around over the years. I
just thought it was brilliantly written and it had heart,
but it also had some sharp edges that all of
us can look inward at when you see writing like
that that really reflects life. I just spoke to me, Yes,
(30:41):
I know you weren't as into it that part of
the show, but I really really really liked it.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
But I love those three actresses. I mean love, love
Michelle Monahan. That goes back for the years, and oh
my god, love Michelle monihanue I just love her. And
GiB Leslie.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
Yea Leslie, GiB she'sat.
Speaker 3 (31:00):
She crushes everything she's ever ever in. Just love her.
But it was Kuhn who had the speech. I said,
there were two moments in the show, and Carrie Kuhn
had the other one that I thought was the biggest moment,
her speech at dinner. Yeah, she delivered it brilliantly with
her acting, but the message that was within that I
(31:22):
thought it was great. And ultimately she said, I'm just
happy to be at the table with you all, and
it wasn't a matter of pity or you all are
better than me. She put this story. She really did
weave together their entire lives and their story and their
friendship in a really cool way. Whoever wrote I would
like to know the person who wrote that speech, Like
(31:43):
the single individual who wrote that particular line. I would
like to look up of that particular speech. It was great.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
It moved me like I felt emotional on this final episode,
and I do think they did such a good job
of bringing that all together, like the ups and down
of this threesome on this vacation. I just that, Yes,
that final scene at dinner was so powerful. I loved it.
I'm hoping that Belinda and her son who sailed off
(32:12):
into the sunset, take us to the next White Lotus.
Maybe she creates a White Lotus, or maybe she creates
something that's all her own. But I would continue to
watch her, and I will keep being an avid fan
of the White Lotus for as many seasons as they'll
put out. I'm already feeling a little sad because it
was something that was so exciting to look forward to
(32:34):
for you, Babe, March badness is winding down and the
White Lotus is.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
Done for now.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
But I actually wouldn't mind going back and watching season
one in season two until I wait until what?
Speaker 1 (32:49):
Until I wait? As I wait for season four?
Speaker 3 (32:53):
Has it been announced?
Speaker 1 (32:53):
No, I'm just hoping.
Speaker 3 (32:55):
But it's coming. But yeah, again, another season well done.
But I did like a I'm just a writing fan.
I love good storytelling and good writing, and this was
just to see it at that scale, to see it
at that level is just really really impressive. So most
people listening have already checked it out, But if you haven't,
(33:16):
by all means.
Speaker 1 (33:18):
We've just spoiled everything.
Speaker 3 (33:21):
Maybe we made some people curious, like, oh, I didn't
know all this was going on. Let me check that out.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
There are people who love to read the last page
of a book like you sometimes and know how it's
going to end, and then enjoy the process already knowing
what the outcome is. So that could be one another
way to watch this season. But thank you for listening
to this episode of Amy and DJ Helpe.
Speaker 1 (33:42):
You check out Why.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
Lotus and also please check out the Morning Run, available
Monday through Friday six thirty am Eastern Time. So subscribe
to us and we'll be in your inbox waiting for you.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
Have a good day.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
Intaction Produs the tat
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