November 27, 2025 • 22 mins
Revolution on the Table: The American Fight for Independence and the Birth of National Identity
Before independence was won on the battlefield, it was declared in the kitchen. From boycotts of British tea to the brewing of “Liberty Tea” made from native herbs, Americans turned everyday meals into acts of protest. Taverns became centers of political debate and rebellion, while dishes prepared with local ingredients came to symbolize freedom and self-reliance, and act traced in early cookbooks.
In this episode, Eva and Maite explore how the American Revolution transformed eating into an expression of resistance and how food helped shape a distinctly American identity. They discuss France’s influence on American Independence, and how Benjamin Franklin and Thomas Jefferson brought French recipes and dining customs home, forever changing the nation’s culinary culture.
This is part 2 of a 3 part series called, How Eating Shapes History!
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
People think French happened first because it is the more
important one. I think the seeds of the French Revolution
actually led to the American Revolution. I mean, it did
lead to the French one, timing wise, but I think
the boiling and the seeds of what was happening in
France twenty years prior to the revolution just because ours
happened first. I think that it was the French influence
(00:22):
and Jefferson and Benjamin and all of them that kept
coming back with those ideas of like, you guys, fucking
nobody likes to be ruled by a king.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
My name is Evel Longoria and I am mate remez
Rajon and welcome to.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
Hungry for History, a podcast that explores our past and
present through food.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
On every episode, we'll talk about the history of some
of our favorite dishes, ingredients, and beverages from our culture.
So make yourself at home.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Ewen Breche, welcome back to the show, everybody. This is
our three parts series of revolutions and food. Now, I
know we're a little out of border because the American
Revolution happened before the French one, very very close in years.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
I mean they were happening ten fifteen years apart.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
But a lot of the seeds to the American Revolution
were planted in France. Like we were sharing so much
information through Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, and so this episode
we're going to take a closer look at the American
Revolution and the direct and indirect role that food played.
(01:32):
But also, you know, the factors that led to the
American Revolution. Hunger was a big one.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Was Hunger was a big one. It wasn't as big
a factor in the in the colonies as it was
in France, but it was definitely, you know, it was
it was a motivator for action, right in colonial leaders
they used the language of hunger to rally support for
the revolution, and so they would say on their path
(02:00):
flits and speeches they would say things like they text
our bread and tea while we starve in our own land.
So they'll say all of this. But the real causes
were taxation and representation. The colonists had no elective representative
in the British Parliament, but they were still being taxed
and they protested. One of the most famous protests is
(02:21):
the Boston Tea Party. Right, so colonists dump tea into
the Boston Harbor and protest of the Tea Act, and
it was this sort of dramatic act of defiance. So
it was against British policies, against British policy exactly. And
so in the colonies activists right or it was women,
(02:43):
you know, primarily who managed households that they started drinking
tea they called liberty tea, tea from local plants instead
of imported black tea. And so they also began using
maple syrup instead of imported sugar or you know, core
meal and state of wheat. And so we see these
sort of small acts of protest in food, and we
(03:07):
also received as reflected in period you know, cookbooks.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
But let's talk about the French influence before the American
Revolution and kind of these ideas that were planted in
our colonies and these ideas that came from you know,
Benjamin Franklin, who was in Paris before Thomas Jefferson. What
was happening philosophically in this moment.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
I'm so glad you asked about that, because that is
a really interesting period in history. So this is the
age of the Enlightenment. But what does that mean? What
do you mean? What does that mean? So it sounds
like a new ay. It sounds new agey to me,
so I know it can't it can't be. It was
this cultural and philosophical movement that began in Europe and
(03:53):
particularly in France and England and Germany, but it really
influenced much of the Western world world. And it was
this movement that started in the late sixteen hundreds and
it ended in the early eighteen hundreds. So it's when
these countries are like, augh, I've had enough. So there
were philosophers right like Voltaire and Dennis Diderou and Jehan Lucke,
(04:16):
and all of these philosophers were challenging the establishment. They
were challenging established religious institutes and political institutes, and they
were calling for freedom of speech. They were calling for
separation of powers, of religious tolerance, of education for all.
They were promoting reason and science and critical thinking over
(04:39):
tradition and superstition and absolute monarchy, right, And so their
writings would inspire the revolution in France certainly, and also
revolutions in America and also in Latin America. Their writings
inspired the War of Independence in Mexico go you know,
(05:01):
from Spain, right, So their writings really really traveled around
the world, and they helped shape many modern ideas about
human rights and justice and equality and the role of state.
So the people like ben Franklin and Thomas Jefferson and
these Founding fathers are like, oh, wait a minute, they
really took these ideas and ran with them.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Even though our president at the time, George Washington, during
the French Revolution, he declared, you know, the Proclamation of neutrality,
there wasn't an influence that America had with these ideas
of liberty, democracy, constitution. And it was said that the
Declaration of Independence specifically, that's what led to France to
(05:47):
write a lot of their rights. Even the fact that
it's called enlightenment in the seventeen hundreds, because to me
it's such a modern term.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
I mean, everything that they were thinking it made so
much sense. They just wanted equality for all.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
Well, why I feel like our founding fathers were so
smart and our political leaders today aren't.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
Like Benjamin Franklin.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Benjamin Franklin was a writer, a scientist, an inventor, a diplomat.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
He was a philosopher.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
Like, look, our founding fathers were flawed for many things,
but they were at heart philosophers and.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
They were brilliant. He founded the American Philosophical Society, He
founded the first library the University of Pennsylvania. They founded universities,
they founded libraries. They were curious about other cultures and
other ideas. I mean Benjamin Franklin invented bifocal lenses. I
mean just he helped people see literally and figuratively. These
(06:44):
guys were smart. Don't go anywhere hungry for history. Will
be right back.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
Let's talk about his time, Benjamin Franklin's time in France,
and particularly his thoughts on food, because he lived in
Paris before Jefferson.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
He lived in Paris just before Jefferson. He was there
seventeen seventy six to seventeen eighty five, and he was
super skilled diplomat, and he won supported the French public,
and he secured military and financial funding from France for
the Revolution, for the American Revolution. But in the years
that he was in France, he really he started seeing
(07:29):
food as a symbol, as a social symbol, and how
through conversations at the table he came to see how
what's on the table was directly tied to politics, and
that food isn't just about nutrition or hospitality, but it
signals class and nationality, and so he admired the elegance
(07:53):
of French food and dining. Not the grand couvert that
we talked about in the French Revolution, but just this
moderation with what's you know with food?
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Yeah, the moderation and food, the seasonal vegetables, the wine
over beer. Like he thought that was so refined and
that everybody did that in comparison, it's so funny in
comparison to the British excess, which is now defined as
American excess, Like our portion sizes are still insane compared
to other countries.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
No, yes, that is true. But but he it's interesting
because they were making these comparisons, right, Okay, the British
are eating this, the front are doing it this way,
we're doing it this way. What could we get? What
could we keep from the British, what could we bring
from France? And how can we transform and create our
own things? So even from these moments, it's like, oh,
(08:44):
let's take a little bit of this and let let's
learn from what people are doing, and let's make it
well with what we have and create something new. So
all of these things are kind of well brewing and another.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
Founding father, who was obviously highly influenced by the French
was Thomas Jepp. He would later become the third President,
but at this point he was causing food trouble, good trouble.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
He was causing good trouble. Yeah. He lived in Paris
seventeen eighty four to seventeen nine, so he left right
before the revolution started. And these were the most memorable
years of his life. Like, he loved everything French, the music,
the architecture of the gardens, everything, the salons, the social life,
(09:27):
the enlightenment thinking, but of course the food. Like he
was just obsessed with the food. He brought back eighty
six crates of supplies, you know, he shipped it back
into Virginia, and he had tablecloths, European cookbooks. He had
a waffle maker, macaroni molds, and parmesan cheese, olive oil,
(09:49):
grapevines and you know, just this idea of bringing grape
finds and saying, oh, one day the US will make
wines to rival those of France. It never happened during
his lifetime, but know it hasn't happened in our lifetime.
Some good wines.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
Let me tell you, Look, I'm a fan, I am.
You are in a big California cab. I'm a big
California cab girl. We can rival some, we can rival some.
But he did try to cultivate these grapes, uh for
wine making at his vineyard in Monticello.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
Yeah, yeah, I mean there were farmers.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
He failed, knowing what we know now about how to
cultivate grapes. It's like not the right soil, not the
right climate. So he also he had Jefferson had a
nineteen year old enslaved chef, James Hemings, and Hemings was
the first American to train as a chef in France,
and James Hemings was a key figure in bringing bringing
(10:50):
that French cuisine to the US and Paris. He cooked
for all the international guests and authors and scientists and aristocrats,
and since slavery was not legally recognized in France, he
was paid. That's awesome and amazing to know that history.
And he ended up applying some of his earnings to
(11:11):
hire a tutor to learn French. And he had the
right to claim freedom in France, but he chose not to.
And he was one of the few enslaved people. Thomas
Jefferson formally freed, but he's credited with popularizing French fries,
French fries, ice cream, and champagne in the US.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
I know, he's such an interesting and also a tragic figure.
His talent should have made him America's first celebrity chef.
In a fair world, his name would stand alongside Escoffier
or Julia Child. Jefferson did eventually free him, but the
system had already stolen most of his chances. He died
at just thirty six years old, and his legacy was
(11:53):
almost forgotten. But that young man, that young nineteen year
old black man in a Paris kitchen, helped shape the
flavors of America such injustice. This contradiction is baked into
America's DNA, and James Heming is part of that contradiction.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
France's influence was obviously substantial because of the Enlightenment ideas.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
That really had a heavy hand.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
Like I said before, the declaration of Independence was like
America's birth announcement, and then the Constitution was its operating manual.
But a lot of this, again was from these seeds
of what was happening in France, literally seeds and the
roots of our nation were really nourished by ideas from
(12:43):
all over the world, but specifically just the big hand
that all of these Enlightenment philosophers had.
Speaker 2 (12:52):
Well, yeah, the Enlightenment philosophers like Dennis Didero in Voltaire
and all of that, but they were inspired by the
Greek philosophers. And so everybody is inspired by something else,
and the Greek philosophers were inspired by engineer East, you know,
traditions and mythology. So the roots of our nation were
(13:13):
shaped by so many ideas from around the world.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Yeah, and I think the main thing they had in
common was they all resented royal control and they were
all motivated to establish a government with checks and balances
to guard against tyranny, which is a lesson we could
learn today.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
So while we're doing this, as while we're doing this, yes,
so they're writing.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
These documents, what are they eating? We know, the most
important drinking drinking good wine. He's drinking good wine. So
Thomas Jeferson may have drafted the Declaration of Independents at
a tavern, the Indian Queen tavern in Philadelphia, and so,
so taverns were these places in the colonies for drinking,
and they were hubs of political discussion, like this is
(14:02):
where people would come together and talk and they would
eat roasted meats and hot meat pies and salt cought
and fried oysters and Yorkshire putting these sort of heavy things,
you know, hardy foods that reflected sort of regional availability,
but also really inspired by the British pop you know food.
(14:24):
And they were drinking ale and cider and rum and punch.
Tea was popular until it was boycotted. So they were
drinking a lot, right, Even Benjamin Franklin, he wrote the
Drinker's Dictionary, and this dictionary described the different states of drunkenness.
So you can kind of say that he's America's first
food and drink writer. Then if he had an Instagram today.
(14:49):
But so once they went to Europe and they came
back and they really encouraged the local production of beer
and wine, and they shared the love of food with
their family and friend. But I love this idea. You know,
we're talking about how they were inspired by so many
different things. Berendaman Franklin spent a lot of time in
London as well, and so he supported this idea of
(15:12):
cultivating local protests as a way of avoiding dependence on
foreign goods, but he appreciated everything else. And when he
was in London he tasted tofu for the first time,
and he wrote a letter. In seventeen seventy, he wrote
a letter to a friend, John bar Trump is his name.
He's a botanist friend in Philadelphia, and he described tofu
as a kind of cheese made from soybeans, which is
(15:36):
called tao fu, and it's a common food in China.
I had a few sent to me from Canton with
this soy and so he said that he liked to
eat it with a little bit of salt. That I
think is so freaking amazing. And so they both him,
both Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, they wrote recipes. The earliest
recipe for vanilla ice cream in the US has written
(15:58):
in Thomas Jefferson's hands. He would I read a lot
about wine and dining. And Benjamin Franklin wrote a recipe
in French, a recipe for suckling pig with sage and
butter roasted suckling ping with sta that's so cool. And
they love to drink. Ben Franklin's cocta is milk punch.
(16:19):
We drank it at Nativo in Highland Park. So cool.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
Well, George Washington became a successful whiskey distiller after his presidency.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
Yeah, that was his job presidency. I know. Wow.
Speaker 1 (16:31):
So sure, after creating the United States, he needed a drink.
Speaker 2 (16:35):
He needed a drink. We've got more after the break,
So don't go anywhere. Everybody knows Might is obsessed with cookbooks.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
And you must have so many cookbooks from the American Revolution,
or at least you know some that are reflected from
this time.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
I do, and I am obsessed. There's one that I
don't have, but it is available online called American Cookery
by Amelia Simmons. And this one is super interesting because
before seventeen ninety six, all of the cookbooks in the
US were imported from England or were reprints of British classics.
Amelia Simmons' cookbook is the first known cookbook written by
(17:20):
an American for Americans. And this cookbook is groundbreaking because
it marks this break from British culinary traditions. And it's
super cool because we see native ingredients like cornmeal, squash,
and molasses. We never see these in European cookbooks. She
includes recipes for turkey with cranberry sauce. This is way
(17:41):
before Thanksgiving was formalized as a hallway way for things
give way before recipes for pumpkin pie. So she's the
first one to use something called parlash, which is a
precursor to baking soda as a leavening agent. It's interesting
how they're starting to use name native ingredients, and a
(18:01):
lot of these native ingredients in the US were ingredients
that had made their way up from Mexico, like tomatoes
and chocolate. We also see African influences with frying, like
recipes for donuts and fritters. Also rice introduced by you know,
to the America's by enslaved Africans, and so we see
(18:24):
using these off cuts of meats, like recipes for feet
and ears that reflect this ingenuity of cooking with limited resources.
So it's a really interesting cookbook because if you take
apart the ingredients, it just says so much.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
Obviously, one of the most recognizable symbols of the US
is the Statue of Liberty. And I was just in
coal Maar, you were there too, right, I was there.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
Oh my gosh, it's such a fut It's like it's
a fairytale the little place.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
It's a fairytale town, Colemar and Strasbourg, which is the
German side.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
A lot of people don't know. So it's the hometown
of the.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Designer of this beautiful symbol of freedom and acceptance. And
so because the sculptor was Ifel, Gustave Eifel, he's the
one that made the statue of Liberty, but the guy
who designed it. So yeah, I was in Colemar and
you know, this copper clad statue, which was a gift
(19:20):
to the United States from the people of France, was
designed by this French sculptor, Frederic Auguste BATHOLDI it's framework
and it was actually built by Gustave Eiffel, who did
the Eiffel Tower.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
But it's crazy that you know this, you know.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Beautiful statue of a Roman goddess of liberty, libert Fast
which is their name, was like built in France and
then shipped over uh to the United States.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
I just thought it was so cool. And then I
thought it was so funny because I saw.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
The statue Liberty everywhere in this little town, Colemar, and I.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
Was like, why is she here?
Speaker 1 (19:58):
They're like, this is the where the designer was born,
and I thought, oh my god, that is so interesting. Also,
I don't interest you saw recently a muralist in France
painted the Statue of Liberty on the side of this
building with her hands over her eyes in protests towards
all the injustices that is happening in the United States.
(20:21):
So there's such a claim to the Statue of Liberty
in France as it was given to us. But you know,
she's a symbol of freedom and democracy.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
And French friendship, international friendship. Yeah, like, where did that go?
It's where did that go?
Speaker 1 (20:35):
And I think we have to remember, you know, the
original promise of the US, and she's obviously the biggest
symbol of that promise.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
She is. Yeah, i'd forgotten that. Her feet they're broken
chains and shackles and symbolized the end of tyranny. And
she's a symbol of k and a welcome for immigrants.
It's like, come on, let's remember this. You have a
quote that you like that Tom Jefferson wrote to James Madison. Yes,
(21:03):
in seventeen eighty seven. He wrote, I hold it that
a little rebellion now and then is a good thing.
The founding fathers talked about liberty and equality, but many
owned enslaved people and supported policies that harmed and displaced
indigenous communities. They often chose profit over people, yet they
also birthed a nation that would change history forever. Next
(21:27):
week we move on to the Mexican Revolution. Gibbie my
mechi Go Mexi Go. So as interesting as all of
this is, Mexico one hundred years later was the first
constitution to put women's rights, indigenous rights, child's labor laws,
and all of these different protections in their constitution. We'll
(21:51):
be talking about that a little bit more next week.
See you guys then.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
Hungary for History is a Hyphenet Media production in partnership
with Iheart'smichael Tura podcast network.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
For more of your favorite shows, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
People think French happened first because it is the more
important one. I think the seeds of the French Revolution
actually led to the American Revolution. I mean, it did
lead to the French one, timing wise, but I think
the boiling and the seeds of what was happening in
France twenty years prior to the revolution just because ours
happened first. I think that it was the French influence
(00:22):
and Jefferson and Benjamin and all of them that kept
coming back with those ideas of like, you guys, fucking
nobody likes to be ruled by a king.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
My name is Evel Longoria and I am mate remez
Rajon and welcome to.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
Hungry for History, a podcast that explores our past and
present through food.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
On every episode, we'll talk about the history of some
of our favorite dishes, ingredients, and beverages from our culture.
So make yourself at home.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Ewen Breche, welcome back to the show, everybody. This is
our three parts series of revolutions and food. Now, I
know we're a little out of border because the American
Revolution happened before the French one, very very close in years.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
I mean they were happening ten fifteen years apart.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
But a lot of the seeds to the American Revolution
were planted in France. Like we were sharing so much
information through Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, and so this episode
we're going to take a closer look at the American
Revolution and the direct and indirect role that food played.
(01:32):
But also, you know, the factors that led to the
American Revolution. Hunger was a big one.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Was Hunger was a big one. It wasn't as big
a factor in the in the colonies as it was
in France, but it was definitely, you know, it was
it was a motivator for action, right in colonial leaders
they used the language of hunger to rally support for
the revolution, and so they would say on their path
(02:00):
flits and speeches they would say things like they text
our bread and tea while we starve in our own land.
So they'll say all of this. But the real causes
were taxation and representation. The colonists had no elective representative
in the British Parliament, but they were still being taxed
and they protested. One of the most famous protests is
(02:21):
the Boston Tea Party. Right, so colonists dump tea into
the Boston Harbor and protest of the Tea Act, and
it was this sort of dramatic act of defiance. So
it was against British policies, against British policy exactly. And
so in the colonies activists right or it was women,
(02:43):
you know, primarily who managed households that they started drinking
tea they called liberty tea, tea from local plants instead
of imported black tea. And so they also began using
maple syrup instead of imported sugar or you know, core
meal and state of wheat. And so we see these
sort of small acts of protest in food, and we
(03:07):
also received as reflected in period you know, cookbooks.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
But let's talk about the French influence before the American
Revolution and kind of these ideas that were planted in
our colonies and these ideas that came from you know,
Benjamin Franklin, who was in Paris before Thomas Jefferson. What
was happening philosophically in this moment.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
I'm so glad you asked about that, because that is
a really interesting period in history. So this is the
age of the Enlightenment. But what does that mean? What
do you mean? What does that mean? So it sounds
like a new ay. It sounds new agey to me,
so I know it can't it can't be. It was
this cultural and philosophical movement that began in Europe and
(03:53):
particularly in France and England and Germany, but it really
influenced much of the Western world world. And it was
this movement that started in the late sixteen hundreds and
it ended in the early eighteen hundreds. So it's when
these countries are like, augh, I've had enough. So there
were philosophers right like Voltaire and Dennis Diderou and Jehan Lucke,
(04:16):
and all of these philosophers were challenging the establishment. They
were challenging established religious institutes and political institutes, and they
were calling for freedom of speech. They were calling for
separation of powers, of religious tolerance, of education for all.
They were promoting reason and science and critical thinking over
(04:39):
tradition and superstition and absolute monarchy, right, And so their
writings would inspire the revolution in France certainly, and also
revolutions in America and also in Latin America. Their writings
inspired the War of Independence in Mexico go you know,
(05:01):
from Spain, right, So their writings really really traveled around
the world, and they helped shape many modern ideas about
human rights and justice and equality and the role of state.
So the people like ben Franklin and Thomas Jefferson and
these Founding fathers are like, oh, wait a minute, they
really took these ideas and ran with them.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Even though our president at the time, George Washington, during
the French Revolution, he declared, you know, the Proclamation of neutrality,
there wasn't an influence that America had with these ideas
of liberty, democracy, constitution. And it was said that the
Declaration of Independence specifically, that's what led to France to
(05:47):
write a lot of their rights. Even the fact that
it's called enlightenment in the seventeen hundreds, because to me
it's such a modern term.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
I mean, everything that they were thinking it made so
much sense. They just wanted equality for all.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
Well, why I feel like our founding fathers were so
smart and our political leaders today aren't.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
Like Benjamin Franklin.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Benjamin Franklin was a writer, a scientist, an inventor, a diplomat.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
He was a philosopher.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
Like, look, our founding fathers were flawed for many things,
but they were at heart philosophers and.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
They were brilliant. He founded the American Philosophical Society, He
founded the first library the University of Pennsylvania. They founded universities,
they founded libraries. They were curious about other cultures and
other ideas. I mean Benjamin Franklin invented bifocal lenses. I
mean just he helped people see literally and figuratively. These
(06:44):
guys were smart. Don't go anywhere hungry for history. Will
be right back.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
Let's talk about his time, Benjamin Franklin's time in France,
and particularly his thoughts on food, because he lived in
Paris before Jefferson.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
He lived in Paris just before Jefferson. He was there
seventeen seventy six to seventeen eighty five, and he was
super skilled diplomat, and he won supported the French public,
and he secured military and financial funding from France for
the Revolution, for the American Revolution. But in the years
that he was in France, he really he started seeing
(07:29):
food as a symbol, as a social symbol, and how
through conversations at the table he came to see how
what's on the table was directly tied to politics, and
that food isn't just about nutrition or hospitality, but it
signals class and nationality, and so he admired the elegance
(07:53):
of French food and dining. Not the grand couvert that
we talked about in the French Revolution, but just this
moderation with what's you know with food?
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Yeah, the moderation and food, the seasonal vegetables, the wine
over beer. Like he thought that was so refined and
that everybody did that in comparison, it's so funny in
comparison to the British excess, which is now defined as
American excess, Like our portion sizes are still insane compared
to other countries.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
No, yes, that is true. But but he it's interesting
because they were making these comparisons, right, Okay, the British
are eating this, the front are doing it this way,
we're doing it this way. What could we get? What
could we keep from the British, what could we bring
from France? And how can we transform and create our
own things? So even from these moments, it's like, oh,
(08:44):
let's take a little bit of this and let let's
learn from what people are doing, and let's make it
well with what we have and create something new. So
all of these things are kind of well brewing and another.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
Founding father, who was obviously highly influenced by the French
was Thomas Jepp. He would later become the third President,
but at this point he was causing food trouble, good trouble.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
He was causing good trouble. Yeah. He lived in Paris
seventeen eighty four to seventeen nine, so he left right
before the revolution started. And these were the most memorable
years of his life. Like, he loved everything French, the music,
the architecture of the gardens, everything, the salons, the social life,
(09:27):
the enlightenment thinking, but of course the food. Like he
was just obsessed with the food. He brought back eighty
six crates of supplies, you know, he shipped it back
into Virginia, and he had tablecloths, European cookbooks. He had
a waffle maker, macaroni molds, and parmesan cheese, olive oil,
(09:49):
grapevines and you know, just this idea of bringing grape
finds and saying, oh, one day the US will make
wines to rival those of France. It never happened during
his lifetime, but know it hasn't happened in our lifetime.
Some good wines.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
Let me tell you, Look, I'm a fan, I am.
You are in a big California cab. I'm a big
California cab girl. We can rival some, we can rival some.
But he did try to cultivate these grapes, uh for
wine making at his vineyard in Monticello.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
Yeah, yeah, I mean there were farmers.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
He failed, knowing what we know now about how to
cultivate grapes. It's like not the right soil, not the
right climate. So he also he had Jefferson had a
nineteen year old enslaved chef, James Hemings, and Hemings was
the first American to train as a chef in France,
and James Hemings was a key figure in bringing bringing
(10:50):
that French cuisine to the US and Paris. He cooked
for all the international guests and authors and scientists and aristocrats,
and since slavery was not legally recognized in France, he
was paid. That's awesome and amazing to know that history.
And he ended up applying some of his earnings to
(11:11):
hire a tutor to learn French. And he had the
right to claim freedom in France, but he chose not to.
And he was one of the few enslaved people. Thomas
Jefferson formally freed, but he's credited with popularizing French fries,
French fries, ice cream, and champagne in the US.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
I know, he's such an interesting and also a tragic figure.
His talent should have made him America's first celebrity chef.
In a fair world, his name would stand alongside Escoffier
or Julia Child. Jefferson did eventually free him, but the
system had already stolen most of his chances. He died
at just thirty six years old, and his legacy was
(11:53):
almost forgotten. But that young man, that young nineteen year
old black man in a Paris kitchen, helped shape the
flavors of America such injustice. This contradiction is baked into
America's DNA, and James Heming is part of that contradiction.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
France's influence was obviously substantial because of the Enlightenment ideas.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
That really had a heavy hand.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
Like I said before, the declaration of Independence was like
America's birth announcement, and then the Constitution was its operating manual.
But a lot of this, again was from these seeds
of what was happening in France, literally seeds and the
roots of our nation were really nourished by ideas from
(12:43):
all over the world, but specifically just the big hand
that all of these Enlightenment philosophers had.
Speaker 2 (12:52):
Well, yeah, the Enlightenment philosophers like Dennis Didero in Voltaire
and all of that, but they were inspired by the
Greek philosophers. And so everybody is inspired by something else,
and the Greek philosophers were inspired by engineer East, you know,
traditions and mythology. So the roots of our nation were
(13:13):
shaped by so many ideas from around the world.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Yeah, and I think the main thing they had in
common was they all resented royal control and they were
all motivated to establish a government with checks and balances
to guard against tyranny, which is a lesson we could
learn today.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
So while we're doing this, as while we're doing this, yes,
so they're writing.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
These documents, what are they eating? We know, the most
important drinking drinking good wine. He's drinking good wine. So
Thomas Jeferson may have drafted the Declaration of Independents at
a tavern, the Indian Queen tavern in Philadelphia, and so,
so taverns were these places in the colonies for drinking,
and they were hubs of political discussion, like this is
(14:02):
where people would come together and talk and they would
eat roasted meats and hot meat pies and salt cought
and fried oysters and Yorkshire putting these sort of heavy things,
you know, hardy foods that reflected sort of regional availability,
but also really inspired by the British pop you know food.
(14:24):
And they were drinking ale and cider and rum and punch.
Tea was popular until it was boycotted. So they were
drinking a lot, right, Even Benjamin Franklin, he wrote the
Drinker's Dictionary, and this dictionary described the different states of drunkenness.
So you can kind of say that he's America's first
food and drink writer. Then if he had an Instagram today.
(14:49):
But so once they went to Europe and they came
back and they really encouraged the local production of beer
and wine, and they shared the love of food with
their family and friend. But I love this idea. You know,
we're talking about how they were inspired by so many
different things. Berendaman Franklin spent a lot of time in
London as well, and so he supported this idea of
(15:12):
cultivating local protests as a way of avoiding dependence on
foreign goods, but he appreciated everything else. And when he
was in London he tasted tofu for the first time,
and he wrote a letter. In seventeen seventy, he wrote
a letter to a friend, John bar Trump is his name.
He's a botanist friend in Philadelphia, and he described tofu
as a kind of cheese made from soybeans, which is
(15:36):
called tao fu, and it's a common food in China.
I had a few sent to me from Canton with
this soy and so he said that he liked to
eat it with a little bit of salt. That I
think is so freaking amazing. And so they both him,
both Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, they wrote recipes. The earliest
recipe for vanilla ice cream in the US has written
(15:58):
in Thomas Jefferson's hands. He would I read a lot
about wine and dining. And Benjamin Franklin wrote a recipe
in French, a recipe for suckling pig with sage and
butter roasted suckling ping with sta that's so cool. And
they love to drink. Ben Franklin's cocta is milk punch.
(16:19):
We drank it at Nativo in Highland Park. So cool.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
Well, George Washington became a successful whiskey distiller after his presidency.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
Yeah, that was his job presidency. I know. Wow.
Speaker 1 (16:31):
So sure, after creating the United States, he needed a drink.
Speaker 2 (16:35):
He needed a drink. We've got more after the break,
So don't go anywhere. Everybody knows Might is obsessed with cookbooks.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
And you must have so many cookbooks from the American Revolution,
or at least you know some that are reflected from
this time.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
I do, and I am obsessed. There's one that I
don't have, but it is available online called American Cookery
by Amelia Simmons. And this one is super interesting because
before seventeen ninety six, all of the cookbooks in the
US were imported from England or were reprints of British classics.
Amelia Simmons' cookbook is the first known cookbook written by
(17:20):
an American for Americans. And this cookbook is groundbreaking because
it marks this break from British culinary traditions. And it's
super cool because we see native ingredients like cornmeal, squash,
and molasses. We never see these in European cookbooks. She
includes recipes for turkey with cranberry sauce. This is way
(17:41):
before Thanksgiving was formalized as a hallway way for things
give way before recipes for pumpkin pie. So she's the
first one to use something called parlash, which is a
precursor to baking soda as a leavening agent. It's interesting
how they're starting to use name native ingredients, and a
(18:01):
lot of these native ingredients in the US were ingredients
that had made their way up from Mexico, like tomatoes
and chocolate. We also see African influences with frying, like
recipes for donuts and fritters. Also rice introduced by you know,
to the America's by enslaved Africans, and so we see
(18:24):
using these off cuts of meats, like recipes for feet
and ears that reflect this ingenuity of cooking with limited resources.
So it's a really interesting cookbook because if you take
apart the ingredients, it just says so much.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
Obviously, one of the most recognizable symbols of the US
is the Statue of Liberty. And I was just in
coal Maar, you were there too, right, I was there.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
Oh my gosh, it's such a fut It's like it's
a fairytale the little place.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
It's a fairytale town, Colemar and Strasbourg, which is the
German side.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
A lot of people don't know. So it's the hometown
of the.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Designer of this beautiful symbol of freedom and acceptance. And
so because the sculptor was Ifel, Gustave Eifel, he's the
one that made the statue of Liberty, but the guy
who designed it. So yeah, I was in Colemar and
you know, this copper clad statue, which was a gift
(19:20):
to the United States from the people of France, was
designed by this French sculptor, Frederic Auguste BATHOLDI it's framework
and it was actually built by Gustave Eiffel, who did
the Eiffel Tower.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
But it's crazy that you know this, you know.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Beautiful statue of a Roman goddess of liberty, libert Fast
which is their name, was like built in France and
then shipped over uh to the United States.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
I just thought it was so cool. And then I
thought it was so funny because I saw.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
The statue Liberty everywhere in this little town, Colemar, and I.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
Was like, why is she here?
Speaker 1 (19:58):
They're like, this is the where the designer was born,
and I thought, oh my god, that is so interesting. Also,
I don't interest you saw recently a muralist in France
painted the Statue of Liberty on the side of this
building with her hands over her eyes in protests towards
all the injustices that is happening in the United States.
(20:21):
So there's such a claim to the Statue of Liberty
in France as it was given to us. But you know,
she's a symbol of freedom and democracy.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
And French friendship, international friendship. Yeah, like, where did that go?
It's where did that go?
Speaker 1 (20:35):
And I think we have to remember, you know, the
original promise of the US, and she's obviously the biggest
symbol of that promise.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
She is. Yeah, i'd forgotten that. Her feet they're broken
chains and shackles and symbolized the end of tyranny. And
she's a symbol of k and a welcome for immigrants.
It's like, come on, let's remember this. You have a
quote that you like that Tom Jefferson wrote to James Madison. Yes,
(21:03):
in seventeen eighty seven. He wrote, I hold it that
a little rebellion now and then is a good thing.
The founding fathers talked about liberty and equality, but many
owned enslaved people and supported policies that harmed and displaced
indigenous communities. They often chose profit over people, yet they
also birthed a nation that would change history forever. Next
(21:27):
week we move on to the Mexican Revolution. Gibbie my
mechi Go Mexi Go. So as interesting as all of
this is, Mexico one hundred years later was the first
constitution to put women's rights, indigenous rights, child's labor laws,
and all of these different protections in their constitution. We'll
(21:51):
be talking about that a little bit more next week.
See you guys then.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
Hungary for History is a Hyphenet Media production in partnership
with Iheart'smichael Tura podcast network.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
For more of your favorite shows, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hosts And Creators
MAITE GOMEZ-REJÓN
Eva Longoria
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Are You A Charlotte?
In 1997, actress Kristin Davis’ life was forever changed when she took on the role of Charlotte York in Sex and the City. As we watched Carrie, Samantha, Miranda and Charlotte navigate relationships in NYC, the show helped push once unacceptable conversation topics out of the shadows and altered the narrative around women and sex. We all saw ourselves in them as they searched for fulfillment in life, sex and friendships. Now, Kristin Davis wants to connect with you, the fans, and share untold stories and all the behind the scenes. Together, with Kristin and special guests, what will begin with Sex and the City will evolve into talks about themes that are still so relevant today. "Are you a Charlotte?" is much more than just rewatching this beloved show, it brings the past and the present together as we talk with heart, humor and of course some optimism.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.