September 4, 2018 • 41 mins
Join us, dear listener, on a journey into the dream life of Lenny Kravitz, who sits with our host Joe Levy and opines on his 30-something years as a rock and roll icon and hitmaker. Lenny breaks down the serpentine process of making his brand new album “Raise Vibration” (BMG Records), his unorthodox songwriting methods and his take on the state of the world. Special thanks to Lenny, BMG Records, Johnny Cash (you’ll see why) and the whole crew. Follow Inside the Studio on iHeartRadio, or subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts.
Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
I Heart Radio Presents Inside the Studio, I'm your host,
Joe Leavi. This time around, I got a chance to
sit down with Lenny Kravitz, who, just from the way
he dresses, is one of our ultimate rock stars. Sometimes
that's a reason people love him. Sometimes it's a reason
(00:22):
people make fun of him. When we sat down and
he opened up about his dreams, an encounter with Johnny
Cash he had at Rick Ruben's house, and the trouble
he had getting started on his new record for his
vibration if you want to talk the man now. The
(00:47):
backstory of most Lenny Kravitz albums is a rock and
roll fantasy. Lenny rented a chateau in France to work
in or he was living in his vintage Airstream trailer
on the beach in the Bahamas, and he was recording
in the studio that he'd built for himself in an
island paradise. But making this latest album was a little different,
(01:08):
at least in the lead up. After ten albums going
back almost thirty years to Let Love Rule in nine,
as well as a handful of acting roles in Precious,
The Hunger Games, and the TV series star Kravitz wasn't
exactly sure where he was or maybe who he was musically.
You know, his course early on had been charted by
(01:29):
the music of the sixties and the seventies that he
grew up loving. Born in nineteen sixty four, Lenny Kravitz
seems to have entered the world wearing bell bottoms in
a fringed buckskin vest and has really never taken them off.
But he's also a musical pollymath, and he plays nearly
all the instruments on his album, and he's always shuffled
style seventies, Philly soul, misty mountain hop, rock, stompers, roots, reggae,
(01:54):
supersaturated beatles, melody like he was a Vegas dealer at
a blackjack to able early on. His style was firmly
rooted between nineteen sixty seven the Summer of Love, in
seventy seven the Summer of Punk, and he used a
recording method is vintaged as the clothes he wore. But
(02:14):
by the time he was covering the Guess Who's American
Woman in nineteen nine for the soundtrack to Austin Powers
The Spy Who Shagged Me Well, he'd embraced modern technology
on singles like Flyaway. He was a decade or so
into his career, and he'd already racked up enough songs
for the Greatest Hits package, full of the sort of
inescapable hits that Bachman Turner Overdrive or the guests who
(02:38):
put on the radio in the nineteen seventies. That's not
really the version of the seventies he was aiming for,
But who cares. It ain't over till it's over stand
By my woman, great songs, are you going to Go
My Way? And always on the run, completely different kind
of great songs, and sometimes as a listener that's really
(03:01):
all that matters. But leading up to Raise Vibration, his
latest and eleventh album, Kravitz was getting pressure to work
with outside producers and come up with a sound that
was more contemporary. Although he's recorded with Jay Z as
far back as his two thousand and four album Baptism,
and he worked with a Vicci on a remix of
super Love from his eleven album Black and White, America,
(03:24):
contemporary has never exactly been Lenny Kravitz's lane, and so
he found himself, if not at the crossroads and a
kind of artistic traffic jam, stuck because I can play
many different styles, and I like so many different genres
(03:47):
of music. I wasn't really clear on where it was.
I wanted to go. I can go here, I can
go there, I can go here, and I was thinking
too much. But it was good because I've never really
done that. So it was really good because what it
led to was me letting go of every thought that
(04:08):
I had and just stopping. And when I did that
and I got quiet, I began to wake up in
the middle of the night with songs in my head,
and that, to me, is the most beautiful way because
it takes me my thought process, my ego, whatever is there,
takes it out of it and it's just pure channeling.
(04:31):
And I dream tunes all the time, but I've never
dreamt a whole album. So when when you say you
dreamt this whole album, it was coming to you one
song at a time, but one song at a time.
And I would wake up and put the melody that
I'm hearing on in my head on a on a recorder,
(04:52):
or I grabbed the guitar in the bedroom and put
the chords down and hum whatever the melody is, or
recite whatever words it is that I was hearing and
then you would studio and work on the track, work
on it for a week, work on it for two weeks,
with you know whatever, however long it took me to
put things together, because I'm playing all the instruments and
I'm doing all the orchestrations and and so forth. So
(05:14):
everything is happening one at a time, and then that
song would sort of get finished, and then here comes
another one. Dreaming tunes and then waking up and recording them.
(05:37):
You know, if you were writing a novel about a
rock star and you came up with a character like
Lenny Kravitz, it would be a pretty hard sell. You'd
probably get a stern talking to from your editor along
the lines of, well, this is fascinating, and the parts
about dating the Brazilian supermodel and Tom Cruise's ex wife,
those are definitely a lot of fun, but it's really
not very believable. Could you come up with something a
(05:59):
little more real a stick, because Kravitz is life and
accomplishments defy most of the way we understand the world works,
and sometimes the laws of space and time. Some details
chosen more or less at random. He was born in
New York City to a black mother and a white father.
His mom, Roxy Roger, was an actress. His dad, Si Kravitz,
(06:21):
was a former Green Beret who, after serving in the
Korean War, became a TV producer with a sideline as
a jazz promoter and a music producer. Lenny Kravitz grew
up with artists and musicians in and out of his house,
including Duke Gallington and Miles Davis. At age six, he
saw James Brown at the Apollo, and around the same
time he saw the Jackson five at Madison Square Garden.
(06:42):
Photos from this era show a young Lenny with a
peace sign painted on his forehead like a third eye
in our rock and roll novel, we'd call that foreshadowing.
By age ten, he was living in Los Angeles because
his mom had gotten cast on the sitcom The Jefferson's
Playing Half with a New a racial couple Apart, Kravitz
has said was modeled to some degree on her own life.
(07:05):
During this time, Lenny joined the California Boys Choir and
performed classical music, sometimes with the Metropolitan Opera, but by
the time he was a teenager, he was deep into
rock and roll. In attending Beverly Hills High School, although
he really wouldn't become friends with the other guitar obsessed
by racial kid in his class, Saul Hudson, until later
(07:26):
when Saul was known as Slash and playing with guns
and roses. At twenty three, in Kravitz got married in
Las Vegas to Lisa Bonet, then par laying her role
in the number one television show in America, The Cosby
Show in her own series A Different World. Their daughter, Zoe,
(07:47):
was born a year later. During this time, Lenny was
recording his music on his own, and after being rejected
by labels for not sounding black enough for white enough,
he was signed in ninety nine by virgin The story
goes that he played five minutes of his music and
the A and R person he was meeting with left
the room came back with another executive who promptly declared
(08:08):
that Kravitz was Prince meets John Lennon and signed him.
Kravitz's debut, let Love Rule, came out that same year,
and it established the blueprint he follow Over the next decade.
He recorded almost everything himself and borrowed from the heroes
(08:28):
of the nineteen sixties and seventies without apology, creating a
world where John Lennon and Jimi Hendrix were locked arm
in arm with Bob Marley and the Commodores. Critics didn't
give him much slack when it came to his retro
look and sound, but other artists and audiences were more accepting.
When Let Love Rule came out, Prince phoned Kravitz out
(08:50):
of the blue to connect, and Kravitz found himself opening
for Tom Petty, David Bowie, and Bob Dylan, who brought
him on stage at one point to sing Maggie's Farm.
I was scared shitless, Kravitz remembered earlier this year, I
didn't know the words in Kravitz hit number two with
(09:10):
the soulful breakup ballot. It Ain't over till It's over
from Mama, said, a second album charged by the dissolution
of his marriage by with Kravitz writing high on the
title track from his third album, a zip line rocker
called are You Going to Go My Way? The opening
act on his European tour was none other than Robert Plant,
(09:33):
who dubbed Lenny Kravitz the new King of cock Rock.
By the way Kravitz says, he and guitarist Craig Ross
came up with are you going to go My Way?
In five minutes at the end of a recording session
while someone else was waiting to get into the studio. Anyway,
you see what I mean about our rock and roll
(09:53):
novel not seeming particularly realistic. And we have not even
gotten to the part about his homes in the Bahamas
and ill or the Manhattan apartment he sold for reported
fifteen million dollars, or his engagement to Victoria's secret model
Adriana Lima, or the statue of Miles Davis he has
in his Paris home, which is a four story town
house originally built to be the U S Embassy. Or
(10:15):
the bit about him being a distant cousin of NBC
weather man Oul Broker, or the half of a joint
that he smoked with Mick Jagger and kept as a
talisman for about a year until he ran out of
weed and smoked the rest of it. Honestly, we've barely
scratched the surface of all the ways in which Lenny
Kravitz is some sort of platonic ideal of a rock star. Kravitz,
(10:38):
who rose to fame in the early nineties era of
grunge and gangster rap was ridiculed for just this, and
it's worth asking why. Yeah, he borrowed wholesale from the
music of the past with a clear love of led Zeppelin,
and he went on stage looking like he was in costume.
But then again, so did Jack White of the White Stripes.
(10:59):
In the eight eighties and early nineties, is Kravitz was
weaving the music of his childhood into his own albums.
Rappers were building their sounds around samples of George Clinton
Zapp or Stevie Wonder, and Kravitz may or may not
have been thinking about just this when he took a
public Enemy instrumental itself made from a James Brown sample,
added some synthesizers, and turned it into Madonna's Justify My Love.
(11:24):
Oh yeah, I understand grunge. Gangster rapped the White Stripes.
They're a little more inventive. They have a little more
to tell us about the world than Lenny Kravitz escapism.
But I can't remember the last time rock and roll
pop music didn't include escapism. And as for Lenny Kravitz
(11:45):
being dedicated to vintage sounds, listen to what goes around
comes around from Mama said today, and it sounds like
a model for Farrell Williams. My pockets now, my money
(12:06):
is gone, my face and no thanks thanks. Cravitz is
still playing around with the music of the past. It's
Enough from Raised Vibration is a protest song laced with
conspiracy theory undertones, and it uses a Curtis Mayfield groove face.
(12:39):
Because of this face and one of the most interesting
songs on the new album, Johnny Cash starts off with
some Ernie Eisley guitar. Cravitz talk with me about his
(13:00):
encounter with Johnny and June Carter Cash at Rick Rubin's house,
and about his phone calls with Prince and Bill Clinton,
and about the album he has waiting in the wings,
which has guest appearances from George Clinton, James Brown, saxophonist
Maceo Parker and other greats. So let's join Lenny Kravitz
in his dream world. Well, Lenny Kravitz, welcome to the
(13:25):
inside the studio. Thank you. One of the first tracks
that we heard from this new album was Low And
it's interesting that the video for that you did with
John Baptiste, famed fashion photographer, great video director, someone you've
worked with in the past, and it begins it's just
a dark room with you on the drums. And I
(13:47):
was interested by that because that's sometimes how the recording
process starts for you think that that's very good. I
didn't think of that. I was in past, and he
wanted to hear the album M so I invited him
over to here the record, and when Low came on,
he kept saying, play that again, playing it again, play
(14:09):
it again. And I had no idea that he'd want
to make a video because he doesn't really make videos
that much anymore. It's very special when he does. But
he kept listening to it, and there's a lot of
orchestration on Low. There's you know, there's two guitars, there's base,
there's mini mooved based, there's drums, there's percussion all over
the place. There's an orchestra, there's horn arrangements. But he
(14:31):
kept focusing on the drumbeat and it pulled him in
and he just started riffing on this idea. It's like,
you should do a video, and I just want to
see you on the drums, black room, black clothes, black drums,
and just have it be really sparse and empty and elegant,
(14:55):
and forget any storyline and sets and location, very stripped
down and it worked. I mean, I love it. It
is one of those videos that changes how you hear
things a little bit, but it does. But no, but
that was one of his points. He said that when
the video was edited and he watched it it comments
people were giving him where that they heard the music differently. Yeah,
(15:19):
suddenly it sounds as stripped down as that video looks exactly.
It's you know, the power of sight, right of an image.
So let's stick with this just for one more second,
because it's not just you in this video alone in
this room against the dark setting. There's one other person. Yes,
and she's a great drummer that just graduated from Berkeley
(15:40):
School of Music named Jazz. And I met her through
a friend of mine who is from the Bahamas, who
lives in the Bahamas, who's going to Berkeley School of
Music and knew her and he had shown me footage
of her playing at one point, and when Jamatis and
I were in my kitchen in Paris talking about the video,
we are comming with this idea that'd be really cool
(16:01):
to have a female energy in the video, and that
she would appear and disappear and appear and it becomes
this sort of conversation. I guess it is a conversation.
It also struck me, I mean, it felt like this
moment of gender fluidity because she's sometimes articulating the vocals
(16:23):
where she's singing is she's yeah, she's doing what I'm
doing exactly. There's no difference between you and her. Is
part of what part of the message of the same clothes,
and but she's beautiful and she's just an amazing drummer,
and um, yeah, it came out really good. Every element
was right right. I want to stick with the videos
just for another second, because it's enough. Another one of
(16:47):
the early tracks from this record that we heard. The
video comes with a content warning. You're about to see
some very graphic images because there's a lot of news
footage in this video. This is a pro test song
with what sounded to me like almost a Curtis Mayfield
kind of groove Curtis Mayfield vibe to it. Tell me
(17:07):
about this that song. It's enough. Actually, I recorded that
song twice in the process. When I first recorded it,
it came out very punk. Really, it's almost like a
Ramans track. I don't like to hear that I still
have it and I will release it at some point,
(17:27):
like B side of something or just let it out
because it's really cool. But I played it for my
daughter when she came out of the Bahamas, and she's like,
mm hmmm, I don't know. No, not not about the
because she loves the Ramones, but she just thought that
it wasn't right for that song or for me. I
(17:49):
don't know, and she just said, I don't know. I
just she said, I just it should be a little
more like this or like that. And so I didn't
think much about it after that, and then I really
started thinking of about it. I was like mm hmm.
And then the idea came in again, one of these dreams,
and I completely recut the tune. But the point was,
(18:11):
and when you recuted, did you build it around the groove?
I builded around the groove that's on the record that
you hear. But what's interesting in what works better than
it did before, which I understand what she was saying,
was that I took it down. I pulled it in.
I made it very sparse and funky. But when I'm
singing the lyrics, they're very quiet, they're smooth. There's space
(18:32):
between each sentence, and therefore you hear the message stronger
than when I was giving it to you yelling. So
that's what it was. Let's talk about the message of
this song. I mean, there are a lot of things
that war comes up. Pharmaceutical companies pushing their wares on
(18:52):
us comes up in this song. At one point you
mentioned chem trails in the sky. There are a lot
of different things that you go through, all with the
idea that it's enough. You reference that saying attributed to
Jimi Hendrix, when the power of love overcomes the love
of power, then we'll know peace. That's that's referenced in
the Yeah have a sent This that's someone says the
same thing. I know, looking at the video, all the
(19:14):
things that we see as we see that, you can
change that video every week exactly. I haven't seen it
since it came out, but I'm sure it's like already.
Like I mean, there's things that are obviously still happening,
but again, you could refeed that thing. And and that's
what I want to ask you, is this you reacting
to the news of the day. Are we so inundated
with it? Is that the feeling it's enough or it's
(19:37):
enough of what's going on. It's enough of that. It's
enough of all that stuff, the negativity, the destruction of
ourselves and our planet, how we treat each other. It's
a shame. It really is a shame we're living in.
We've always been living in. That's where I want to
use challenging times. There's always issues, but we're getting to
a point now where it's about to blow. Feels like
(20:00):
things are on fin you know, it's about to blow.
Will we can we turn around? You know? Will we
raise our consciousness, raise our vibration and really realize what's important?
And when you have governments that are operating on greed
and power, money and corporations, and it's a lot, man.
(20:23):
You know. One thing that struck me was you see
some footage of the neo Nazi march in Charlottesville, Virginia
in this video, and I flashed on a song from
a few years ago, the title track of your album
Black and White. Yeah, blackline America, Yeah, Black and White America,
where you're talking about maybe we've reached a point where
(20:43):
the future has come around and we've found that we
finally have common ground. And now it's a number of
years later, and it doesn't feel that way so much,
and really interesting how it just did a back flip,
you know, and a lot of that is obviously a
reaction to that it was moving forward, and there's a
(21:06):
lot of people that feel that enough of this and
it does amaze me how backwards we've gone. It's really
surreal and a trip. You're someone who born in the sixties,
came of age in the seventies, and had interracial parents,
so which is certainly something that comes up in that
(21:27):
song in Black and White America. You actually talk about
your parents falling in love getting married. Absolutely, I mean
they had the inspiration for that song as well as
I mean, obviously the history of in our nation. But
but at the point that they fell in love and
got married in the sixties, being in danger, just walking
down exactly, they dealt with a lot of issues and
(21:48):
hate and and then it's just ironic that my mom
ends up on a television show, you know, you know,
historic sitcom The Jefferson's where she played basically, I mean,
she didn't play herself, but the character Helen Willis was
essentially her married black woman married to a white man
in New York City. Yeah, so we've been carrying this
(22:09):
torch right, you know, you know, as someone who's about
the same age as you are, we've seen these reactionary forces.
We've lived through this before because the whatever progress was
made in the sixties or seventies perhaps was set back
or slowed down by Reagan's America. What's you're feeling about
(22:29):
where we're at now? I mean, we're going to get
to the title of the record, the title track and
the record ray's vibration in just a second. You've already
brought it up. But are you part of the resistance?
Do you feel that way as a musician, as an artist?
You know, when there's a march, do you want to
get out on the street that I do? Yeah, But
I'm all about love. So it doesn't matter who, what country, where,
(22:54):
who this president, that president, this Prime minister, this king,
this whoever. If they're not operating from a place of
love and concern for the people, then I'm not down
with that. And that's all over the world. We can
talk about this country, this president, this thing. It's everywhere,
(23:17):
it's everywhere, and it just seems that we're losing our
minds more and more each year. He's getting more ridiculous,
and I don't understand it as people were living in
this time where the technology and the social media has
really done a number on us, where we should be
(23:39):
paying attention to our lives, ourselves and what's really going on.
We're absorbed in the media and where absorbed with our narcissism,
and we're absorbed with just being in this other reality.
And when you're saying you were absorbed in the media,
I just want people to know your holding up your
(24:00):
your hand as though though you're looking into your phone,
so you're you're really talking about being lost in our screens. Absolutely,
and you know that's part of the plan. But we've
got to get our heads out of wherever they may
be and they look at ourselves and what's going on.
All right, Hold up, what do you mean that's part
of the plan? What do you I don't think it's
(24:22):
just I think there's some design to all this. I mean,
I think they like us to be in there. You
think there's like look over here, look over here. You
think there's almost an organized whether it's intention or not,
an organized culture of distraction. There's there's a lot of that. Yeah,
who benefits from that? Those folks, very small group of folks. No,
(24:47):
but it's like you know, I mean, you can get
into all the conspiracy stuff. Well, I mean, you got
a song where you mentioned the Chemp trail, so I
gotta ask you, are you into that stuff? I mean,
I'm fascinated by a lot of this stuff. There's so
many questions and we don't have all the answers. No,
but there's a lot of things going on that needs
some explaining. Whether we'll ever get the answers or not,
(25:09):
I don't know. But at the end of the day,
with all this going on, to get back to I
choose to remain optimistic, and I choose to choose the
path of love, and that's the way I was raised.
I can't really help it. I mean, this is something
you've been talking about. We're gonna celebrate the thirtieth anniversary
and let love rule next year. So this is something
you've been going on about for thirty years. I can't
(25:30):
believe it's thirty years coming man. Wow. Yeah, I mean
from let level to raise vibration. That's bad. They're kind
of book ends. It's the same message, just said in
a different way, and time has changed things. But what's
interesting is forget even my records. We won't even reference
my record, a record by Marvin Gaye. What's going on?
It sounds like it was written yesterday. I had it
(25:52):
on recently, as it's like we're right there. It doesn't
just sound like it was written yesterday to do a
certain itstand. It sounds like it could have been recorded
yesterday as well, because we've we've returned to some of
those sounds. And I want to ask you something. Do
you ever feel like you didn't get a fair shake
your music? You took a little bit of stick about
being a revivalist, right, being interested into things you were
(26:15):
interested in retro that was a very big word. Yeah,
And at the same time, late eighties in the world
of hip hop, if you go back to an old
record and sample it, just take the music manipulated, which
one could say you might do by loving old records
and writing new songs the way that you were. But
if you go back to old music and sample it,
(26:36):
you're celebrated. But if you're Lenny Kravitz, you're retro good.
You know, it all comes around. It's like I've always
been original and written my own music. When I had
my influences. No, man, I'm trying to get you angry.
You are Love Rule, but no more than I mean,
look at the Stones, you look at Zeppelin. I mean,
we could go deep into that talking about other artists
(26:58):
who drew very direct into ration from their sources even
more than I did, you know what I mean. But
any musician, it's all the things that you grew up on,
all the education you've had mixed up together and in
a stew and it comes out. You bring it out
your own way, you know. But still, I want to
tell you somebody who heard those records coming out at
the time, that that retro idea did shape and color
(27:20):
the way that I interacted with them. So when I
go back to Let Love Rule right now and I
hear Mr. Cab Driver, here's the song that when I
heard it almost thirty years ago, I was like, oh, yeah,
you know, the bass is out front, this guy Revolver,
he loves Revolver. And you know what, Now I hear
it and I think, oh, yeah, the bass is out front,
there's some choppy guitar behind dirty mind, this guy loves Prince.
(27:41):
But that's not the way I heard it at the time,
right right, It is true though, Right, that was a
crucial record for you What Dirty Mind? Absolutely big one,
big one for me. Yeah. Yeah, and that record let
Love Rule I've heard you talk about this came out
and you get a phone call from Prince, right I did.
He called me after heard the record and wanted to
(28:01):
meet me, and I met him. Was in l A
at the time. I met him at some sound stage
I forget where it was, somewhere maybe in burb banger
And that started our relationship and we were friends up,
you know, from then to the end. When you got
a call from Prince back then, did the phone just
rang and you heard a voice and it was like, yeah,
it's Prince you know, and it's like I never got
the number from It was kind of like when Bill
(28:23):
Clinton called me. It was like I was like, how
did you get my number? Let me just put it
was kind of like when Bill Clinton. Well it's by
the way, Bill Clinton, I understand where he could get
the number. That's what I'm saying, but I thought to
say it. The first time he called, I was like hello, um,
but yeah, Prince called me, and yeah, it was really
(28:47):
beautiful that he was supportive and basically saying like, Okay,
we're brothers, that's meet up. Yeah, he was. I mean
in high school, listening to that Dirty Mind record was
so much for me. Yeah, I used to listen to
in high school and I had to jump up when
head came on to turn it down so my mom
wouldn't hear the lyrics the track right. Amazing? Yeah, do
(29:11):
you do the same thing now for other artists who
you might hear a kinstry, Like when you hear a
Greta Van Fleet or a Curtis Harden who's opening for
you on tour. Here's somebody else who draws on music
that you've drawn on. Do you pick up the phone
and tell them, Hey, man, I know where you're coming from.
I know some of what's going to happen. Not so much,
but like in certain cases, I'll invite people to come
play with me, and they'll come and do some gigs
(29:33):
with us and open up with me. Curtis and I
became friendly on the tour. He did a bunch of
dates in Europe with me. Gary Clark Jr. And for
other people, that is a very soulful and stylish grouping. Yeah, yeah,
Gary is amazing. He blessed us and was special guests
for several shows. Um, it's great to hear music that
(29:55):
is organic, people are actually playing instruments. I did. We've
got to Raise Gracia raised vibration. You brought up the
idea of the title track from this record, We've got
to Raise our vibration raising. You mentioned Jesus, you mentioned Gandhi,
(30:17):
you mentioned dr king in the song. Tell me a
little bit about the song. It's about going to that
level and raising our vibration and acting on peace non violence.
And it ends as you heard the end of the record.
It ends with these Native American singers and drummers chanting
at the end, which makes even more powerful. Where did
(30:40):
that come from? Was that music that you saw people performing.
I've always been into that, and actually my great grandmother
was full blood Cherokee on my mom's side of the family.
I have a friend, Chris Summer, who I made a
record on in ninety eight, seven or eight called Street Ferry.
(31:01):
It's really cool I made at the same time I
made five, I made Creeze record in my record in
a compass point in NASA at the same time. She
grew up on a reservation. She's been the one who's
really educated me on on that music. And so I
was in l A and I was speaking to her
and I said, I hear this sound for this song,
(31:25):
and she found the players and for me and I
flew them over. And the first intention was to put
them on the song in the middle of the song,
while in the break it was so pure on its
own that anytime they did it in the track, it's
almost like you've changed channels, like you're you're in a
different song entirely that moment. So instead of putting them
(31:47):
in the track, I waited till the end of the
song and then fade them in at the end and
the chat for a while coda and added message, Yeah
it was so it was really beautiful. Yeah, And the
track is as far as it just starts with a
guitar and a vocal for like a while before the
drums kicking. Yeah. You talked a little bit about letting
(32:09):
love rule, you know, the idea that that you've carried
forth as a program throughout your work. And I want
to ask you about this song, Johnny Cash, which isn't
necessarily about not not you know, one way, but it's
about something that happened. It's about a feeling Johnny Cash
(32:30):
left me with. In one way of describing this song
is about wanting to find someone who looks at you
or treat you the way June Carter treated Johnny right. Well, basically,
I was singing to somebody that I was having a
very deep break up, and I'm telling them in this
song how I need them. I wish it wasn't going
(32:52):
to hand, and I'm asking for their comfort. So shoot
me writing this song. I wake up with this song
in my head, and I go to the studio and
I'm just laying on the thunder Roads and I'm playing
the chords and I'm singing the melody. I didn't have
any words, but the only words that were coming out
(33:12):
of my mouth it was holding me like Johnny Cash,
which is the first line of the hook. And I'm
sitting there singing this hold me like Johnny and I'm
thinking to myself, what am I talk? What hold me
like Johnny Cash? What does that mean? And so as
the words kept sort of streaming out of me and
(33:33):
I wrote more words, I realized I was like, oh,
this is serious. So basically, the day my mother died,
I was in the hospital. It was in Los Angeles
at the time, and I knew she had maybe just
a few days left. But I was in the hospital
all day on this particular day, and I took a
(33:54):
break to go home to shower and get some food,
and I was going to go back. At the time,
I was living at Rick Ruben's house in l A.
I lived with Rick for several years. That was my
spot in l A. He gave me a little wing
of the house and very sweet And at that particular time,
Johnny Cash was making the Acoustic record, so he was
(34:17):
living at the house as well. So I drove from
the hospital. I get to the house, I get the
phone call that my mom had passed. I was shocked
because I didn't know what was gonna happen like that,
and I want to be there, and I'm standing at
the bottom of the stairs and I'm sure I looked
shocked and out of it, and Johnny and June were
(34:40):
coming down the stairs to go out, and I'm sure
Johnny could see that something was wrong with me, so
he said, Lenny, Hey, what's what's going on? How are you?
And I said, my mom just died. And the two
of them came down the stairs and just grabbed me
(35:01):
and held me really tightly and consoled me. They were
comforting me, They were telling me all of these things
and saying very beautiful, supportive things. It was a really human,
beautiful moment because we weren't close like that. We were
living in the same house. Hi, good morning, how are
you good afternoon? Nice to see you. We never got
(35:22):
into like a real deep conversation because we were always
coming and going and having things to do. But they
took ten minutes whatever it was and just sat there
with me. And so the chorus says, told me, like
Johnny Cash when I lost my mother, whisper in my ear,
just like June Carter, and now I fight these tears
(35:42):
that I hid. Just hold me tight for the rest
of my life. So obviously, the last time I was
comforted on a level like that was the time that
Johnny Cash and June Carter held me when my mom died.
And that feeling is what I was looking for from
(36:02):
this person, and that was the way to tell the story.
And it's also quite surreal that the moment that my
mother dies, there's nobody around, there's nobody in my family.
I'm by myself and the only people that are there
our Johnny Cash and June Carter. That's surreal, right, so
(36:22):
and and and they had such a powerful connection. The
two of them were one, you know, and you see
that when people are that close. I mean they when
one passed the next one, it wasn't too far behind,
but they were one. It was beautiful to see. And
they were just beautiful people. And I I had that moment.
(36:44):
They were there at a very crucial moment and did
what they felt they should do, and it was the
exact thing that I needed. Yeah, I want to circle
back to the genesis point of this record. We were
talking about before you knew what direction to go in,
(37:05):
or you would open yourself up to going in whatever
direction you would. I know you've talked a little bit
about hearing from other people that you should, well maybe
work with this producer, that producer. What were people wanting
out of They want you to be quote unquote relevant contemporary.
But what's that sound like? Being in fashion to what's
(37:25):
going on? That would mean I guess me adopting you know,
like whatever is on the radio. So first, I mean,
so making some sort of pop dance or trap record,
what like yea perhaps right? Yeah, which could be an
interesting challenge, just as an artic collaboration. It's not a
record that I would make. I'm going to make what
(37:49):
I make. But there were lots of opinions, and so
that was part of the confusion. But it was, as
I said, it was an interesting process. It's interesting. It
could be interesting to try to just do it to
see what happens, you know, and I did, you did,
I actually did with a few folks, just to be open,
(38:13):
open to the process. Yeah, because people are saying, you know,
you gotta drop your ego. And it was never about ego.
It was about this is how I work. When a
painter is painting is painting, nobody says, well, why don't
you get a few other people involved here and let
them throw some colors on there. And there aren't a
lot of people like you who were making their records
(38:35):
essentially by themselves. I mean most people, whether they're in
a band making rock music or whether they're making pop
music or working in a team of collaborators. And there
aren't a lot of people in the music business who
have the artistic freedom to say, well, I'd like to
do it the way I'd like to do it. Well,
I always had from day one. I had creative control,
that was in my contract from day one. But people
(38:57):
were just saying, and you make it so hard on yourself.
You do everything, Why don't you just do this make
it easier? And so I tried it, and I actually
did some really cool things with one group of guys.
If you're not able to say who they were, can
you tell us what the vibe was, what the sound was.
It's hard to say what it was, which is different.
(39:18):
But I made some really good friends from these two
particular people, and I'm sure we're gonna put out some
of that stuff because it was cool. But it wasn't
what this record should be. It's something else. But I
knew I had a record to make and statements to
make and sounds to make that weren't that okay. So
so far we've heard about this collaboration and uh, a
(39:42):
punky Ramoncy version of It's enough. So what else is
in the vault? Lanning? If we got thirty years of
stuff in the vault? What's in there? I'm not sure.
One day I'll go through it and see what's there
for me. I'm always looking forward the next records, not
in the eight percent done. So I'm my head's in
that thing now? Is this the record I've heard about
(40:04):
a little about where you've collaborated with different people across
the years and put these recordings together. It's a very funky, greasy, raw,
very raw. Who else? Who else is involved in these
fus far George Clinton, Alan Tussa God rest his soul,
Kenny Barrel, legendary jazz guitarist, Bill Summers who was the
(40:27):
percussionist for Herbie Hancock and the head Hunters, Fred Wesley,
trombonist for James Brown and others. Maceio Parker, saxophonist for
James Brown, Big Black the percussionist too. I don't know
if you ever saw soul power from the Muhammad Ali
he's the discussionist. Did that that big solo in the
middle of the concert. Yeah, there's some very cool eclectic
(40:49):
You're in a different world with each one of these
people's missing. How do we get this out of you?
I have a little mixing to do, I have maybe
a vocal to do, and I have a few more collaborations.
All right, I'm innsseling vacation. You gotta get this done. Wenny,
Thank you for being thank you for having me. Inside
(41:10):
the Studio is an I Heart Radio original podcast created
by Chris Peterson. This episode was written and hosted by
me Joe Leavy. Our executive producer is Sandy Smallens for audiation,
and our mixer is Matt Noble. We'd like to give
a big thanks to Lenny Kravitz and BMG Records, and
you can follow Inside the Studio on I heart Radio
(41:32):
or subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts.
I Heart Radio Presents Inside the Studio, I'm your host,
Joe Leavi. This time around, I got a chance to
sit down with Lenny Kravitz, who, just from the way
he dresses, is one of our ultimate rock stars. Sometimes
that's a reason people love him. Sometimes it's a reason
(00:22):
people make fun of him. When we sat down and
he opened up about his dreams, an encounter with Johnny
Cash he had at Rick Ruben's house, and the trouble
he had getting started on his new record for his
vibration if you want to talk the man now. The
(00:47):
backstory of most Lenny Kravitz albums is a rock and
roll fantasy. Lenny rented a chateau in France to work
in or he was living in his vintage Airstream trailer
on the beach in the Bahamas, and he was recording
in the studio that he'd built for himself in an
island paradise. But making this latest album was a little different,
(01:08):
at least in the lead up. After ten albums going
back almost thirty years to Let Love Rule in nine,
as well as a handful of acting roles in Precious,
The Hunger Games, and the TV series star Kravitz wasn't
exactly sure where he was or maybe who he was musically.
You know, his course early on had been charted by
(01:29):
the music of the sixties and the seventies that he
grew up loving. Born in nineteen sixty four, Lenny Kravitz
seems to have entered the world wearing bell bottoms in
a fringed buckskin vest and has really never taken them off.
But he's also a musical pollymath, and he plays nearly
all the instruments on his album, and he's always shuffled
style seventies, Philly soul, misty mountain hop, rock, stompers, roots, reggae,
(01:54):
supersaturated beatles, melody like he was a Vegas dealer at
a blackjack to able early on. His style was firmly
rooted between nineteen sixty seven the Summer of Love, in
seventy seven the Summer of Punk, and he used a
recording method is vintaged as the clothes he wore. But
(02:14):
by the time he was covering the Guess Who's American
Woman in nineteen nine for the soundtrack to Austin Powers
The Spy Who Shagged Me Well, he'd embraced modern technology
on singles like Flyaway. He was a decade or so
into his career, and he'd already racked up enough songs
for the Greatest Hits package, full of the sort of
inescapable hits that Bachman Turner Overdrive or the guests who
(02:38):
put on the radio in the nineteen seventies. That's not
really the version of the seventies he was aiming for,
But who cares. It ain't over till it's over stand
By my woman, great songs, are you going to Go
My Way? And always on the run, completely different kind
of great songs, and sometimes as a listener that's really
(03:01):
all that matters. But leading up to Raise Vibration, his
latest and eleventh album, Kravitz was getting pressure to work
with outside producers and come up with a sound that
was more contemporary. Although he's recorded with Jay Z as
far back as his two thousand and four album Baptism,
and he worked with a Vicci on a remix of
super Love from his eleven album Black and White, America,
(03:24):
contemporary has never exactly been Lenny Kravitz's lane, and so
he found himself, if not at the crossroads and a
kind of artistic traffic jam, stuck because I can play
many different styles, and I like so many different genres
(03:47):
of music. I wasn't really clear on where it was.
I wanted to go. I can go here, I can
go there, I can go here, and I was thinking
too much. But it was good because I've never really
done that. So it was really good because what it
led to was me letting go of every thought that
(04:08):
I had and just stopping. And when I did that
and I got quiet, I began to wake up in
the middle of the night with songs in my head,
and that, to me, is the most beautiful way because
it takes me my thought process, my ego, whatever is there,
takes it out of it and it's just pure channeling.
(04:31):
And I dream tunes all the time, but I've never
dreamt a whole album. So when when you say you
dreamt this whole album, it was coming to you one
song at a time, but one song at a time.
And I would wake up and put the melody that
I'm hearing on in my head on a on a recorder,
(04:52):
or I grabbed the guitar in the bedroom and put
the chords down and hum whatever the melody is, or
recite whatever words it is that I was hearing and
then you would studio and work on the track, work
on it for a week, work on it for two weeks,
with you know whatever, however long it took me to
put things together, because I'm playing all the instruments and
I'm doing all the orchestrations and and so forth. So
(05:14):
everything is happening one at a time, and then that
song would sort of get finished, and then here comes
another one. Dreaming tunes and then waking up and recording them.
(05:37):
You know, if you were writing a novel about a
rock star and you came up with a character like
Lenny Kravitz, it would be a pretty hard sell. You'd
probably get a stern talking to from your editor along
the lines of, well, this is fascinating, and the parts
about dating the Brazilian supermodel and Tom Cruise's ex wife,
those are definitely a lot of fun, but it's really
not very believable. Could you come up with something a
(05:59):
little more real a stick, because Kravitz is life and
accomplishments defy most of the way we understand the world works,
and sometimes the laws of space and time. Some details
chosen more or less at random. He was born in
New York City to a black mother and a white father.
His mom, Roxy Roger, was an actress. His dad, Si Kravitz,
(06:21):
was a former Green Beret who, after serving in the
Korean War, became a TV producer with a sideline as
a jazz promoter and a music producer. Lenny Kravitz grew
up with artists and musicians in and out of his house,
including Duke Gallington and Miles Davis. At age six, he
saw James Brown at the Apollo, and around the same
time he saw the Jackson five at Madison Square Garden.
(06:42):
Photos from this era show a young Lenny with a
peace sign painted on his forehead like a third eye
in our rock and roll novel, we'd call that foreshadowing.
By age ten, he was living in Los Angeles because
his mom had gotten cast on the sitcom The Jefferson's
Playing Half with a New a racial couple Apart, Kravitz
has said was modeled to some degree on her own life.
(07:05):
During this time, Lenny joined the California Boys Choir and
performed classical music, sometimes with the Metropolitan Opera, but by
the time he was a teenager, he was deep into
rock and roll. In attending Beverly Hills High School, although
he really wouldn't become friends with the other guitar obsessed
by racial kid in his class, Saul Hudson, until later
(07:26):
when Saul was known as Slash and playing with guns
and roses. At twenty three, in Kravitz got married in
Las Vegas to Lisa Bonet, then par laying her role
in the number one television show in America, The Cosby
Show in her own series A Different World. Their daughter, Zoe,
(07:47):
was born a year later. During this time, Lenny was
recording his music on his own, and after being rejected
by labels for not sounding black enough for white enough,
he was signed in ninety nine by virgin The story
goes that he played five minutes of his music and
the A and R person he was meeting with left
the room came back with another executive who promptly declared
(08:08):
that Kravitz was Prince meets John Lennon and signed him.
Kravitz's debut, let Love Rule, came out that same year,
and it established the blueprint he follow Over the next decade.
He recorded almost everything himself and borrowed from the heroes
(08:28):
of the nineteen sixties and seventies without apology, creating a
world where John Lennon and Jimi Hendrix were locked arm
in arm with Bob Marley and the Commodores. Critics didn't
give him much slack when it came to his retro
look and sound, but other artists and audiences were more accepting.
When Let Love Rule came out, Prince phoned Kravitz out
(08:50):
of the blue to connect, and Kravitz found himself opening
for Tom Petty, David Bowie, and Bob Dylan, who brought
him on stage at one point to sing Maggie's Farm.
I was scared shitless, Kravitz remembered earlier this year, I
didn't know the words in Kravitz hit number two with
(09:10):
the soulful breakup ballot. It Ain't over till It's over
from Mama, said, a second album charged by the dissolution
of his marriage by with Kravitz writing high on the
title track from his third album, a zip line rocker
called are You Going to Go My Way? The opening
act on his European tour was none other than Robert Plant,
(09:33):
who dubbed Lenny Kravitz the new King of cock Rock.
By the way Kravitz says, he and guitarist Craig Ross
came up with are you going to go My Way?
In five minutes at the end of a recording session
while someone else was waiting to get into the studio. Anyway,
you see what I mean about our rock and roll
(09:53):
novel not seeming particularly realistic. And we have not even
gotten to the part about his homes in the Bahamas
and ill or the Manhattan apartment he sold for reported
fifteen million dollars, or his engagement to Victoria's secret model
Adriana Lima, or the statue of Miles Davis he has
in his Paris home, which is a four story town
house originally built to be the U S Embassy. Or
(10:15):
the bit about him being a distant cousin of NBC
weather man Oul Broker, or the half of a joint
that he smoked with Mick Jagger and kept as a
talisman for about a year until he ran out of
weed and smoked the rest of it. Honestly, we've barely
scratched the surface of all the ways in which Lenny
Kravitz is some sort of platonic ideal of a rock star. Kravitz,
(10:38):
who rose to fame in the early nineties era of
grunge and gangster rap was ridiculed for just this, and
it's worth asking why. Yeah, he borrowed wholesale from the
music of the past with a clear love of led Zeppelin,
and he went on stage looking like he was in costume.
But then again, so did Jack White of the White Stripes.
(10:59):
In the eight eighties and early nineties, is Kravitz was
weaving the music of his childhood into his own albums.
Rappers were building their sounds around samples of George Clinton
Zapp or Stevie Wonder, and Kravitz may or may not
have been thinking about just this when he took a
public Enemy instrumental itself made from a James Brown sample,
added some synthesizers, and turned it into Madonna's Justify My Love.
(11:24):
Oh yeah, I understand grunge. Gangster rapped the White Stripes.
They're a little more inventive. They have a little more
to tell us about the world than Lenny Kravitz escapism.
But I can't remember the last time rock and roll
pop music didn't include escapism. And as for Lenny Kravitz
(11:45):
being dedicated to vintage sounds, listen to what goes around
comes around from Mama said today, and it sounds like
a model for Farrell Williams. My pockets now, my money
(12:06):
is gone, my face and no thanks thanks. Cravitz is
still playing around with the music of the past. It's
Enough from Raised Vibration is a protest song laced with
conspiracy theory undertones, and it uses a Curtis Mayfield groove face.
(12:39):
Because of this face and one of the most interesting
songs on the new album, Johnny Cash starts off with
some Ernie Eisley guitar. Cravitz talk with me about his
(13:00):
encounter with Johnny and June Carter Cash at Rick Rubin's house,
and about his phone calls with Prince and Bill Clinton,
and about the album he has waiting in the wings,
which has guest appearances from George Clinton, James Brown, saxophonist
Maceo Parker and other greats. So let's join Lenny Kravitz
in his dream world. Well, Lenny Kravitz, welcome to the
(13:25):
inside the studio. Thank you. One of the first tracks
that we heard from this new album was Low And
it's interesting that the video for that you did with
John Baptiste, famed fashion photographer, great video director, someone you've
worked with in the past, and it begins it's just
a dark room with you on the drums. And I
(13:47):
was interested by that because that's sometimes how the recording
process starts for you think that that's very good. I
didn't think of that. I was in past, and he
wanted to hear the album M so I invited him
over to here the record, and when Low came on,
he kept saying, play that again, playing it again, play
(14:09):
it again. And I had no idea that he'd want
to make a video because he doesn't really make videos
that much anymore. It's very special when he does. But
he kept listening to it, and there's a lot of
orchestration on Low. There's you know, there's two guitars, there's base,
there's mini mooved based, there's drums, there's percussion all over
the place. There's an orchestra, there's horn arrangements. But he
(14:31):
kept focusing on the drumbeat and it pulled him in
and he just started riffing on this idea. It's like,
you should do a video, and I just want to
see you on the drums, black room, black clothes, black drums,
and just have it be really sparse and empty and elegant,
(14:55):
and forget any storyline and sets and location, very stripped
down and it worked. I mean, I love it. It
is one of those videos that changes how you hear
things a little bit, but it does. But no, but
that was one of his points. He said that when
the video was edited and he watched it it comments
people were giving him where that they heard the music differently. Yeah,
(15:19):
suddenly it sounds as stripped down as that video looks exactly.
It's you know, the power of sight, right of an image.
So let's stick with this just for one more second,
because it's not just you in this video alone in
this room against the dark setting. There's one other person. Yes,
and she's a great drummer that just graduated from Berkeley
(15:40):
School of Music named Jazz. And I met her through
a friend of mine who is from the Bahamas, who
lives in the Bahamas, who's going to Berkeley School of
Music and knew her and he had shown me footage
of her playing at one point, and when Jamatis and
I were in my kitchen in Paris talking about the video,
we are comming with this idea that'd be really cool
(16:01):
to have a female energy in the video, and that
she would appear and disappear and appear and it becomes
this sort of conversation. I guess it is a conversation.
It also struck me, I mean, it felt like this
moment of gender fluidity because she's sometimes articulating the vocals
(16:23):
where she's singing is she's yeah, she's doing what I'm
doing exactly. There's no difference between you and her. Is
part of what part of the message of the same clothes,
and but she's beautiful and she's just an amazing drummer,
and um, yeah, it came out really good. Every element
was right right. I want to stick with the videos
just for another second, because it's enough. Another one of
(16:47):
the early tracks from this record that we heard. The
video comes with a content warning. You're about to see
some very graphic images because there's a lot of news
footage in this video. This is a pro test song
with what sounded to me like almost a Curtis Mayfield
kind of groove Curtis Mayfield vibe to it. Tell me
(17:07):
about this that song. It's enough. Actually, I recorded that
song twice in the process. When I first recorded it,
it came out very punk. Really, it's almost like a
Ramans track. I don't like to hear that I still
have it and I will release it at some point,
(17:27):
like B side of something or just let it out
because it's really cool. But I played it for my
daughter when she came out of the Bahamas, and she's like,
mm hmmm, I don't know. No, not not about the
because she loves the Ramones, but she just thought that
it wasn't right for that song or for me. I
(17:49):
don't know, and she just said, I don't know. I
just she said, I just it should be a little
more like this or like that. And so I didn't
think much about it after that, and then I really
started thinking of about it. I was like mm hmm.
And then the idea came in again, one of these dreams,
and I completely recut the tune. But the point was,
(18:11):
and when you recuted, did you build it around the groove?
I builded around the groove that's on the record that
you hear. But what's interesting in what works better than
it did before, which I understand what she was saying,
was that I took it down. I pulled it in.
I made it very sparse and funky. But when I'm
singing the lyrics, they're very quiet, they're smooth. There's space
(18:32):
between each sentence, and therefore you hear the message stronger
than when I was giving it to you yelling. So
that's what it was. Let's talk about the message of
this song. I mean, there are a lot of things
that war comes up. Pharmaceutical companies pushing their wares on
(18:52):
us comes up in this song. At one point you
mentioned chem trails in the sky. There are a lot
of different things that you go through, all with the
idea that it's enough. You reference that saying attributed to
Jimi Hendrix, when the power of love overcomes the love
of power, then we'll know peace. That's that's referenced in
the Yeah have a sent This that's someone says the
same thing. I know, looking at the video, all the
(19:14):
things that we see as we see that, you can
change that video every week exactly. I haven't seen it
since it came out, but I'm sure it's like already.
Like I mean, there's things that are obviously still happening,
but again, you could refeed that thing. And and that's
what I want to ask you, is this you reacting
to the news of the day. Are we so inundated
with it? Is that the feeling it's enough or it's
(19:37):
enough of what's going on. It's enough of that. It's
enough of all that stuff, the negativity, the destruction of
ourselves and our planet, how we treat each other. It's
a shame. It really is a shame we're living in.
We've always been living in. That's where I want to
use challenging times. There's always issues, but we're getting to
a point now where it's about to blow. Feels like
(20:00):
things are on fin you know, it's about to blow.
Will we can we turn around? You know? Will we
raise our consciousness, raise our vibration and really realize what's important?
And when you have governments that are operating on greed
and power, money and corporations, and it's a lot, man.
(20:23):
You know. One thing that struck me was you see
some footage of the neo Nazi march in Charlottesville, Virginia
in this video, and I flashed on a song from
a few years ago, the title track of your album
Black and White. Yeah, blackline America, Yeah, Black and White America,
where you're talking about maybe we've reached a point where
(20:43):
the future has come around and we've found that we
finally have common ground. And now it's a number of
years later, and it doesn't feel that way so much,
and really interesting how it just did a back flip,
you know, and a lot of that is obviously a
reaction to that it was moving forward, and there's a
(21:06):
lot of people that feel that enough of this and
it does amaze me how backwards we've gone. It's really
surreal and a trip. You're someone who born in the sixties,
came of age in the seventies, and had interracial parents,
so which is certainly something that comes up in that
(21:27):
song in Black and White America. You actually talk about
your parents falling in love getting married. Absolutely, I mean
they had the inspiration for that song as well as
I mean, obviously the history of in our nation. But
but at the point that they fell in love and
got married in the sixties, being in danger, just walking
down exactly, they dealt with a lot of issues and
(21:48):
hate and and then it's just ironic that my mom
ends up on a television show, you know, you know,
historic sitcom The Jefferson's where she played basically, I mean,
she didn't play herself, but the character Helen Willis was
essentially her married black woman married to a white man
in New York City. Yeah, so we've been carrying this
(22:09):
torch right, you know, you know, as someone who's about
the same age as you are, we've seen these reactionary forces.
We've lived through this before because the whatever progress was
made in the sixties or seventies perhaps was set back
or slowed down by Reagan's America. What's you're feeling about
(22:29):
where we're at now? I mean, we're going to get
to the title of the record, the title track and
the record ray's vibration in just a second. You've already
brought it up. But are you part of the resistance?
Do you feel that way as a musician, as an artist?
You know, when there's a march, do you want to
get out on the street that I do? Yeah, But
I'm all about love. So it doesn't matter who, what country, where,
(22:54):
who this president, that president, this Prime minister, this king,
this whoever. If they're not operating from a place of
love and concern for the people, then I'm not down
with that. And that's all over the world. We can
talk about this country, this president, this thing. It's everywhere,
(23:17):
it's everywhere, and it just seems that we're losing our
minds more and more each year. He's getting more ridiculous,
and I don't understand it as people were living in
this time where the technology and the social media has
really done a number on us, where we should be
(23:39):
paying attention to our lives, ourselves and what's really going on.
We're absorbed in the media and where absorbed with our narcissism,
and we're absorbed with just being in this other reality.
And when you're saying you were absorbed in the media,
I just want people to know your holding up your
(24:00):
your hand as though though you're looking into your phone,
so you're you're really talking about being lost in our screens. Absolutely,
and you know that's part of the plan. But we've
got to get our heads out of wherever they may
be and they look at ourselves and what's going on.
All right, Hold up, what do you mean that's part
of the plan? What do you I don't think it's
(24:22):
just I think there's some design to all this. I mean,
I think they like us to be in there. You
think there's like look over here, look over here. You
think there's almost an organized whether it's intention or not,
an organized culture of distraction. There's there's a lot of that. Yeah,
who benefits from that? Those folks, very small group of folks. No,
(24:47):
but it's like you know, I mean, you can get
into all the conspiracy stuff. Well, I mean, you got
a song where you mentioned the Chemp trail, so I
gotta ask you, are you into that stuff? I mean,
I'm fascinated by a lot of this stuff. There's so
many questions and we don't have all the answers. No,
but there's a lot of things going on that needs
some explaining. Whether we'll ever get the answers or not,
(25:09):
I don't know. But at the end of the day,
with all this going on, to get back to I
choose to remain optimistic, and I choose to choose the
path of love, and that's the way I was raised.
I can't really help it. I mean, this is something
you've been talking about. We're gonna celebrate the thirtieth anniversary
and let love rule next year. So this is something
you've been going on about for thirty years. I can't
(25:30):
believe it's thirty years coming man. Wow. Yeah, I mean
from let level to raise vibration. That's bad. They're kind
of book ends. It's the same message, just said in
a different way, and time has changed things. But what's
interesting is forget even my records. We won't even reference
my record, a record by Marvin Gaye. What's going on?
It sounds like it was written yesterday. I had it
(25:52):
on recently, as it's like we're right there. It doesn't
just sound like it was written yesterday to do a
certain itstand. It sounds like it could have been recorded
yesterday as well, because we've we've returned to some of
those sounds. And I want to ask you something. Do
you ever feel like you didn't get a fair shake
your music? You took a little bit of stick about
being a revivalist, right, being interested into things you were
(26:15):
interested in retro that was a very big word. Yeah,
And at the same time, late eighties in the world
of hip hop, if you go back to an old
record and sample it, just take the music manipulated, which
one could say you might do by loving old records
and writing new songs the way that you were. But
if you go back to old music and sample it,
(26:36):
you're celebrated. But if you're Lenny Kravitz, you're retro good.
You know, it all comes around. It's like I've always
been original and written my own music. When I had
my influences. No, man, I'm trying to get you angry.
You are Love Rule, but no more than I mean,
look at the Stones, you look at Zeppelin. I mean,
we could go deep into that talking about other artists
(26:58):
who drew very direct into ration from their sources even
more than I did, you know what I mean. But
any musician, it's all the things that you grew up on,
all the education you've had mixed up together and in
a stew and it comes out. You bring it out
your own way, you know. But still, I want to
tell you somebody who heard those records coming out at
the time, that that retro idea did shape and color
(27:20):
the way that I interacted with them. So when I
go back to Let Love Rule right now and I
hear Mr. Cab Driver, here's the song that when I
heard it almost thirty years ago, I was like, oh, yeah,
you know, the bass is out front, this guy Revolver,
he loves Revolver. And you know what, Now I hear
it and I think, oh, yeah, the bass is out front,
there's some choppy guitar behind dirty mind, this guy loves Prince.
(27:41):
But that's not the way I heard it at the time,
right right, It is true though, Right, that was a
crucial record for you What Dirty Mind? Absolutely big one,
big one for me. Yeah. Yeah, and that record let
Love Rule I've heard you talk about this came out
and you get a phone call from Prince, right I did.
He called me after heard the record and wanted to
(28:01):
meet me, and I met him. Was in l A
at the time. I met him at some sound stage
I forget where it was, somewhere maybe in burb banger
And that started our relationship and we were friends up,
you know, from then to the end. When you got
a call from Prince back then, did the phone just
rang and you heard a voice and it was like, yeah,
it's Prince you know, and it's like I never got
the number from It was kind of like when Bill
(28:23):
Clinton called me. It was like I was like, how
did you get my number? Let me just put it
was kind of like when Bill Clinton. Well it's by
the way, Bill Clinton, I understand where he could get
the number. That's what I'm saying, but I thought to
say it. The first time he called, I was like hello, um,
but yeah, Prince called me, and yeah, it was really
(28:47):
beautiful that he was supportive and basically saying like, Okay,
we're brothers, that's meet up. Yeah, he was. I mean
in high school, listening to that Dirty Mind record was
so much for me. Yeah, I used to listen to
in high school and I had to jump up when
head came on to turn it down so my mom
wouldn't hear the lyrics the track right. Amazing? Yeah, do
(29:11):
you do the same thing now for other artists who
you might hear a kinstry, Like when you hear a
Greta Van Fleet or a Curtis Harden who's opening for
you on tour. Here's somebody else who draws on music
that you've drawn on. Do you pick up the phone
and tell them, Hey, man, I know where you're coming from.
I know some of what's going to happen. Not so much,
but like in certain cases, I'll invite people to come
play with me, and they'll come and do some gigs
(29:33):
with us and open up with me. Curtis and I
became friendly on the tour. He did a bunch of
dates in Europe with me. Gary Clark Jr. And for
other people, that is a very soulful and stylish grouping. Yeah, yeah,
Gary is amazing. He blessed us and was special guests
for several shows. Um, it's great to hear music that
(29:55):
is organic, people are actually playing instruments. I did. We've
got to Raise Gracia raised vibration. You brought up the
idea of the title track from this record, We've got
to Raise our vibration raising. You mentioned Jesus, you mentioned Gandhi,
(30:17):
you mentioned dr king in the song. Tell me a
little bit about the song. It's about going to that
level and raising our vibration and acting on peace non violence.
And it ends as you heard the end of the record.
It ends with these Native American singers and drummers chanting
at the end, which makes even more powerful. Where did
(30:40):
that come from? Was that music that you saw people performing.
I've always been into that, and actually my great grandmother
was full blood Cherokee on my mom's side of the family.
I have a friend, Chris Summer, who I made a
record on in ninety eight, seven or eight called Street Ferry.
(31:01):
It's really cool I made at the same time I
made five, I made Creeze record in my record in
a compass point in NASA at the same time. She
grew up on a reservation. She's been the one who's
really educated me on on that music. And so I
was in l A and I was speaking to her
and I said, I hear this sound for this song,
(31:25):
and she found the players and for me and I
flew them over. And the first intention was to put
them on the song in the middle of the song,
while in the break it was so pure on its
own that anytime they did it in the track, it's
almost like you've changed channels, like you're you're in a
different song entirely that moment. So instead of putting them
(31:47):
in the track, I waited till the end of the
song and then fade them in at the end and
the chat for a while coda and added message, Yeah
it was so it was really beautiful. Yeah, And the
track is as far as it just starts with a
guitar and a vocal for like a while before the
drums kicking. Yeah. You talked a little bit about letting
(32:09):
love rule, you know, the idea that that you've carried
forth as a program throughout your work. And I want
to ask you about this song, Johnny Cash, which isn't
necessarily about not not you know, one way, but it's
about something that happened. It's about a feeling Johnny Cash
(32:30):
left me with. In one way of describing this song
is about wanting to find someone who looks at you
or treat you the way June Carter treated Johnny right. Well, basically,
I was singing to somebody that I was having a
very deep break up, and I'm telling them in this
song how I need them. I wish it wasn't going
(32:52):
to hand, and I'm asking for their comfort. So shoot
me writing this song. I wake up with this song
in my head, and I go to the studio and
I'm just laying on the thunder Roads and I'm playing
the chords and I'm singing the melody. I didn't have
any words, but the only words that were coming out
(33:12):
of my mouth it was holding me like Johnny Cash,
which is the first line of the hook. And I'm
sitting there singing this hold me like Johnny and I'm
thinking to myself, what am I talk? What hold me
like Johnny Cash? What does that mean? And so as
the words kept sort of streaming out of me and
(33:33):
I wrote more words, I realized I was like, oh,
this is serious. So basically, the day my mother died,
I was in the hospital. It was in Los Angeles
at the time, and I knew she had maybe just
a few days left. But I was in the hospital
all day on this particular day, and I took a
(33:54):
break to go home to shower and get some food,
and I was going to go back. At the time,
I was living at Rick Ruben's house in l A.
I lived with Rick for several years. That was my
spot in l A. He gave me a little wing
of the house and very sweet And at that particular time,
Johnny Cash was making the Acoustic record, so he was
(34:17):
living at the house as well. So I drove from
the hospital. I get to the house, I get the
phone call that my mom had passed. I was shocked
because I didn't know what was gonna happen like that,
and I want to be there, and I'm standing at
the bottom of the stairs and I'm sure I looked
shocked and out of it, and Johnny and June were
(34:40):
coming down the stairs to go out, and I'm sure
Johnny could see that something was wrong with me, so
he said, Lenny, Hey, what's what's going on? How are you?
And I said, my mom just died. And the two
of them came down the stairs and just grabbed me
(35:01):
and held me really tightly and consoled me. They were
comforting me, They were telling me all of these things
and saying very beautiful, supportive things. It was a really human,
beautiful moment because we weren't close like that. We were
living in the same house. Hi, good morning, how are
you good afternoon? Nice to see you. We never got
(35:22):
into like a real deep conversation because we were always
coming and going and having things to do. But they
took ten minutes whatever it was and just sat there
with me. And so the chorus says, told me, like
Johnny Cash when I lost my mother, whisper in my ear,
just like June Carter, and now I fight these tears
(35:42):
that I hid. Just hold me tight for the rest
of my life. So obviously, the last time I was
comforted on a level like that was the time that
Johnny Cash and June Carter held me when my mom died.
And that feeling is what I was looking for from
(36:02):
this person, and that was the way to tell the story.
And it's also quite surreal that the moment that my
mother dies, there's nobody around, there's nobody in my family.
I'm by myself and the only people that are there
our Johnny Cash and June Carter. That's surreal, right, so
(36:22):
and and and they had such a powerful connection. The
two of them were one, you know, and you see
that when people are that close. I mean they when
one passed the next one, it wasn't too far behind,
but they were one. It was beautiful to see. And
they were just beautiful people. And I I had that moment.
(36:44):
They were there at a very crucial moment and did
what they felt they should do, and it was the
exact thing that I needed. Yeah, I want to circle
back to the genesis point of this record. We were
talking about before you knew what direction to go in,
(37:05):
or you would open yourself up to going in whatever
direction you would. I know you've talked a little bit
about hearing from other people that you should, well maybe
work with this producer, that producer. What were people wanting
out of They want you to be quote unquote relevant contemporary.
But what's that sound like? Being in fashion to what's
(37:25):
going on? That would mean I guess me adopting you know,
like whatever is on the radio. So first, I mean,
so making some sort of pop dance or trap record,
what like yea perhaps right? Yeah, which could be an
interesting challenge, just as an artic collaboration. It's not a
record that I would make. I'm going to make what
(37:49):
I make. But there were lots of opinions, and so
that was part of the confusion. But it was, as
I said, it was an interesting process. It's interesting. It
could be interesting to try to just do it to
see what happens, you know, and I did, you did,
I actually did with a few folks, just to be open,
(38:13):
open to the process. Yeah, because people are saying, you know,
you gotta drop your ego. And it was never about ego.
It was about this is how I work. When a
painter is painting is painting, nobody says, well, why don't
you get a few other people involved here and let
them throw some colors on there. And there aren't a
lot of people like you who were making their records
(38:35):
essentially by themselves. I mean most people, whether they're in
a band making rock music or whether they're making pop
music or working in a team of collaborators. And there
aren't a lot of people in the music business who
have the artistic freedom to say, well, I'd like to
do it the way I'd like to do it. Well,
I always had from day one. I had creative control,
that was in my contract from day one. But people
(38:57):
were just saying, and you make it so hard on yourself.
You do everything, Why don't you just do this make
it easier? And so I tried it, and I actually
did some really cool things with one group of guys.
If you're not able to say who they were, can
you tell us what the vibe was, what the sound was.
It's hard to say what it was, which is different.
(39:18):
But I made some really good friends from these two
particular people, and I'm sure we're gonna put out some
of that stuff because it was cool. But it wasn't
what this record should be. It's something else. But I
knew I had a record to make and statements to
make and sounds to make that weren't that okay. So
so far we've heard about this collaboration and uh, a
(39:42):
punky Ramoncy version of It's enough. So what else is
in the vault? Lanning? If we got thirty years of
stuff in the vault? What's in there? I'm not sure.
One day I'll go through it and see what's there
for me. I'm always looking forward the next records, not
in the eight percent done. So I'm my head's in
that thing now? Is this the record I've heard about
(40:04):
a little about where you've collaborated with different people across
the years and put these recordings together. It's a very funky, greasy, raw,
very raw. Who else? Who else is involved in these
fus far George Clinton, Alan Tussa God rest his soul,
Kenny Barrel, legendary jazz guitarist, Bill Summers who was the
(40:27):
percussionist for Herbie Hancock and the head Hunters, Fred Wesley,
trombonist for James Brown and others. Maceio Parker, saxophonist for
James Brown, Big Black the percussionist too. I don't know
if you ever saw soul power from the Muhammad Ali
he's the discussionist. Did that that big solo in the
middle of the concert. Yeah, there's some very cool eclectic
(40:49):
You're in a different world with each one of these
people's missing. How do we get this out of you?
I have a little mixing to do, I have maybe
a vocal to do, and I have a few more collaborations.
All right, I'm innsseling vacation. You gotta get this done. Wenny,
Thank you for being thank you for having me. Inside
(41:10):
the Studio is an I Heart Radio original podcast created
by Chris Peterson. This episode was written and hosted by
me Joe Leavy. Our executive producer is Sandy Smallens for audiation,
and our mixer is Matt Noble. We'd like to give
a big thanks to Lenny Kravitz and BMG Records, and
you can follow Inside the Studio on I heart Radio
(41:32):
or subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts.
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations.
Death, Sex & Money
Anna Sale explores the big questions and hard choices that are often left out of polite conversation.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.