July 2, 2021 • 30 mins
The multi-talented actress and singer discusses her highly personal EP, You, and the new remix of her track "Can't Help Myself" featuring Poe Leos and Jean Deaux. She also opens up about new music on the horizon, and why she's inspired by the ups and downs of relationships.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Inside the
Studio on iHeart Radio. My name is Jordan Runt Tug,
but enough about me. You were probably first introduced to
my guests today when she played Ali Dawson on the
Disney Channel series Austin and Ali. Since then, her career
a sword across every medium. She started in the hit
Netflix movie The Perfect Date and recently co starred alongside
(00:23):
Robert de Niro in the War with Grandpa. And then,
of course, she's making a name for herself in the
musical world since she's released a pair of EPs, the
first Called Me and the most recent Called You, their
companion pieces, two sides of the same story, a tumultuous relationship.
The music came at a crossroads in her life, yielding
deeply heartfelt, introspective songs like Can't Hold On Forever and
(00:46):
something to Believe In. These days, she's revisiting tracks from
You in exciting new ways. In April, she released a
remix of Honest with You by Alex TBH, and a
new version of her track Can't Help Myself is out now,
featuring a Little Help from Polios and a verse from
Gen Doe Calling from Australia, where she's filming a new movie.
I'm so thrilled to welcome Laura Morana. Oh, Jordan, I
(01:08):
absolute flusher. Thank you for having me so, because first off,
you've had two EPs in the last two years, Me
and and You last fall. What's the relationship between those
two EPs? How did they relate to one another? So
when I was getting ready to release Me, you know,
that started originally from me writing kind of the title
(01:30):
song off that EP, which is called Me talking about
the song at EP, they think you're talking about yourself,
but you know when I started, I feel like the
project really got going from writing that song. Though there
are other songs I wrote before that that definitely had
a place in this Me and You universe. But that's
when I was like, oh love that song. I love
that vibe. And you know, I kind of come from
(01:52):
two labels in a time in my life where I
was going through also a lot of kind of personal changes.
You know, I was going through a breakup, it's kind
of starting to fall in love again as well, and
so you know, from that whole experience came the EP ME.
But as I was writing for Me, it became very
clear that I had more of the story to tell,
(02:13):
and then I've wanted to kind of continue that story
in some way, and I right away sort of thinking
I'd love to release another EP called You, where it
feels like it's the other side of the story. It
feels like there's some songs or kind of sequels to
the other some songs are kind of another again aspect
of the story. You know, My favorite kind of comparison
(02:36):
to show is on the me E P I have
a song called Lye to Me, and on the UP
I have a song called Honest with You. So it's
a little bit from this theme of there's two sides
to every story. There's two you know, it takes two
people in a relationship, and so one person's perspective can
be very different from another person's perspective, can be similar,
(02:59):
can be related it. You know, I wanted to explore
those different ideas and kind of keep the story going.
And I knew that pretty immediately as I was working
on the P you mentioned Honest with You. That's that's
one of my favorite tracks on the new EP, honestly
being the most important thing in a relationship and it's
probably the scariest thing in a relationship. What is the
genesis of that song? Yes, totally, well, exactly that, right.
(03:23):
So it's so funny to me because lie to Me
and Honest with You are about the same person and
about the same situation. But in lie to Me, right,
it's an aspect of let's not get serious, let's just
like have fun in this moment, let's not worry about
the future, let's just be right here right now. Honest
with You is more serious. Honest with you is I
have been hurt before. It's so scary to be vulnerable,
(03:45):
but damn I want to take that next step and
be honest with you. My kind of favorite aspect of
that song is the question and almost the permission that
you're asking of the person of can I be honest
with you? Can can I be honest in this moment?
You know both of are you ready to take that
next step? And also you know again that vulnerability of
are you going to hurt me? Like? Is are we
(04:07):
going to go there? And you know, of course no
one can ever answer that question truly, but when you're
going in the relationship. I don't think anyone goes into
a relationship being like I can't wait to get hurt
or I can't wait to hurt this person. But you know,
it's still when you take that step, it's so scary,
but there comes to be a point where it just
feels like the right thing to do. And so that
(04:28):
was my idea and kind of the genesis of that song.
You know, we Delacey and Edo are my coat writers
of that song. We were in you know, Edo's studio
in like Brooklyn, and we had already written kind of
two other songs, like the two days prior, and so
that song, Delacey and I had been kind of like
(04:49):
gushing and talking about our relationships and all of the
different things, and I was telling her how I was
just trying to see this person and getting really serious,
and she was like, let's let's let's do this. Let's
let's go into that world. And one of my favorite
parts of Honest with You is that demo vocal that
we did in that kind of small studio in Brooklyn
is the vocal in the song. It just was so right,
(05:10):
it was so raw, and it felt like it needed
to be in the final version. It was so instant.
What was the studio in Brooklyn? That's where that's where
I live? Oh, really, I think it was it just
literally in a building that like there wasn't necessarily it
wasn't like a named studio. Was exactly that, which is
kind of my favorite thing. It was like this, um
you know, you just go up, go into a room
(05:32):
and you know, made it and made it a studio
and it was it would just have the best vibe.
I know, Brooklyn is kind of pretty incredible. It was.
It was such a cool time in my life because
I was really starting to feel I was out of
l A for a really long time because I was
filming a movie in Georgia, and then I went to
New York to write, and then I went to Sweden
(05:53):
to write, and it was just like all of these
exciting things happening in my professional life, while also my
personal life was going through its own kind of like
ups and downs and roller coaster h of emotions. So
it was it was such a just a really special
time of my life. For sure. Sounds like the music
was a catharsist in a lot of ways. Oh, I
(06:14):
truly my breakup and my kind of personal journey through
that and then getting into another relationship. I had never
written the songs that I was writing in such a
personal way. It was almost like every kind of song
I'd worked on before that I would go into a
room and it's so weird, Jordan, Right, you go into
a room and you were kind of like, hey, good
(06:36):
to meet you. Here are all my hopes and dreams. Yeah,
you know, it's really intimate and weird. And I have
so many walls up as a person. So it was
always just it was really hard for me to crack
those walls. And though I had some songs that I
was writing before that that started that journey, it wasn't
really until I was going through that time in my
life where I was just like, I need to write
(06:57):
about this and talk about this and just empty all
of the thoughts that are going on in my head
and empty all of the emotions that are going on
in my heart and just lay it on the floor.
And I feel like I wrote the best music that
I ever had before. And it was so exciting. It
was I was obsessed with the songs. I was so happy,
and you know, I was at a label at the time,
(07:19):
and when I ended up not working with that label anymore,
I I was passionate of I have to take these
songs with me and I have to put them out
because they mean the world to me, you know, I
really enjoy Its kind of devetails into another song that
I was one of my favorites from the EP, Can't
Help Myself. I just think the relationship dynamic that you're
(07:39):
describing on that song is I feel like it's something
I haven't really heard before. Can you talk a little
bit more about what's going on in that song for you? Yes, okay.
I love Can't Help Myself, and surely Can't Help Myself
came because I was writing all this moody, emotional music
and I kind of came into the room with this
awesome producer, Johan, who was based in La at the
(08:01):
time but he's Swedish, and I was like, yo, Han,
I just want to write a fun song, Like, let's
just write a fun, fun song that isn't taking itself
too seriously. And so what I love about Can't Help
Myself is that it comes from this place of having fun,
but it is still a little bit of like a
revenge um our, revenge break up hook up song. After
(08:26):
I'm like, it's hard to completely pinpoint what exactly Can't
Help Myself is on a general standpoint, but it's a
specific standpoint. You know. It's about that moment of facing
an X that ended things and realizing that they want
you back and kind of taking advantage of that aspect
and feeling this weird sort of pleasure and satisfaction of
(08:50):
water and yes, and this weird kind of sense of
empowerment of oh you want me back. Okay, well that's interesting.
I'm gonna take a little control and leisure in this moment.
It's it was so so fun to write, and you know,
we didn't necessarily anticipate writing that concept. I think we
(09:11):
started with the track, right We started with kind of
like this, you know, bpm and this a few of
like the differences that we had that we wrote that
chorus melody and it was just right away, just another
second till you're naked. We're like, what is this about?
Like what is where are we going with this? And
I kind of was instantly, for whatever reason, from that lyric,
(09:33):
thinking of I love that it was just another second
till you're naked, till the other person is And what
is the genesis of that? Like what is the where
did that come from? And from that question came this
revenge break up hook up song. I mean, it's it
(09:58):
definitely feels like just the moment when you're back in control. Fully,
that was sort of when I first heard it, that
was what I got from. It was really like, you
are you are, You've moved on, and now you're back
in the driver's seat. I don't know that was my
take off, right, So it's it's that moment of when
you end a relationship. And to be honest, it wasn't
being really really real with you. It wasn't super based
(10:20):
on anything in my personal life. Maybe in some professional
aspects I was taking some inspiration, but definitely not personally.
But it is that moment in any sort of end
of relationship where you feel like you didn't control the
end of that relationship. You weren't the reason why things ended,
and that's really yes, but you've worked on yourself, you've
(10:43):
moved on, and here you are in a moment where
all of a sudden, yes, the dynamic switches and it's
just feeling so good and taking advantage of that feeling.
It's such a great track, and there's a brand new
version of track that is out. I believe the day
this this episode is out for Dring gen Doe. How
did you first link up with her? Yes? Okay, So
(11:05):
I was really excited to do another version of this
song again, kind of continuing my thought of there's two
sides to a story, there's multiple perspectives of a situation.
I wanted to continue this you era EP group of
music with remixes and with other artists putting their spin
on the songs and their spins on the lyric and
(11:27):
the concept and anything they really want to put their
spin on, right. So, you know, I knew that I
wanted to do a different version of this. I knew
that I wanted to have a female on it. All.
My other kind of duet remixes have all been with
other kind of these amazing male artists who were incredible
to work with. But I'm like, I I need some
like female female power in can't help myself. I really
(11:51):
need to make it happen. So John Doe was someone
that I was a fan of her music. I was
kind of talking to my team about whom be a
good partner here, and we came up with some names,
but John Doe, you know, I was like I kept
kind of coming back to her and feeling like, ah,
I feel like she's going to make a great partner
in this, and sure enough we gave her the song.
(12:11):
She was into the song. She wrote this dope verse
and was just like, you know, let's do this, let's
make it happen. And then from the verse that she gave,
we then got in touch with this other kind of
amazing female artist who is diving into producing. Her name's Polio's.
She actually then added some production elements and kind of
(12:34):
reproduced the track with her producing partner Stanley, and so
it had all this like kind of dope female energy
which I feel like made just to me completely kind
of elevated the song into I love the original version
so much, but this version I think I kind of prefer.
It just feels really really good and really just the
(12:55):
flow is amazing. The verse that John Doe added is fantastic.
All the kind of production elements that are new are
really great. So I was so excited by this version.
I mean, it is such a banger. You're right, I mean,
it just it feels It's definitely something when we can
go back out to uh to have you know, dance
parties and clubs and stuff, is something you could definitely
just here there yes, a hundred perscent. I feel that
(13:18):
so hard, and even like when people start coming over
to people's houses again and you have like a little
like pick back house party vibe, I feel like it's
the perfect song to just have on a playlist and
have that vibe. It's just so I love it. I
love it so much. I'm the complete flip side of
that something I love for for completely different reasons. Your
stripped down version of Something to Believe In is just
(13:39):
is gorgeous. And I know you've said that that you
have a special place in your heart for that song.
What is it about that song that that really resonates
with you? Oh man? So that song is the oldest
song on both EPs, both of me and you EP.
I've had that song for ages. I think I read
that song in twenty thirteen or twenty four teen, really
(14:01):
long time ago, right, and just always want to go
back to the song and the original version that we
had and just feel like, I love this song. Doesn't
feel right for me right now, you know, I knew
I always want to kind of to update some aspects
of it, but it didn't feel right for so many
years to kind of put out and then you know,
when I was making the U E P and I
(14:22):
was writing some new music, I was going back to
some older music. I happened to kind of come across
it again. And with everything that happened to not just me,
but to kind of everyone in something to believe in,
weirdly felt so right in the time to put out
for me, and so much of it I resonated with
(14:44):
so deeply, And so I thought that was such a
really special aspect of the song that here I am
listening to a song I wrote literally years ago, and
I've never resonated with more than what seven six years
later when I listened back to it, and so I
was like, Okay, the song needs to be on the EP.
(15:05):
I completely reproduced it, you know, we added some kind
of different aspects, but to be honest, the lyrical content
really stayed the same. I felt so connected to it,
and it just felt very true for the moment that
I was in, and I hope that it was going
to kind of resonate with other people. I'm sure enough.
It feels like I feel like it's actually the song
(15:26):
off my EU EP that has resonated the most of
my fans, which is really special and pretty amazing. Lyrics
of that song are so mature. I mean, it's it
blows my mind to think he was very young when
you wrote that. It almost seems like your life had
to catch up to all the experience in those words,
unlike a hundred percent, like maybe I had. I don't
even know if I was. I think I had maybe
(15:47):
just started dating someone, But I don't think, to be honest,
when we wrote it, that happens so much, Jordan, right.
Sometimes again, this is actually a time before I felt
like I really unlocked my own vulnerability in my writing.
So you kind of go into a room sometimes and
I think I brought another concept in that was like
(16:10):
somewhat similar but not really necessarily true to my life.
I just thought it was kind of a cool lyric
and we kind of built on that and change things
and alter things, turn things upside down and you know,
something to believe and was kind of born. But it
was not something that I necessarily resonated deeply with in
that moment at all, and that that was kind of
(16:30):
very similar to my writing at that point where I
would love the song. I love writing just in general.
I think it's a creative outlet no matter what but
I wasn't really looking deep into myself to unlock anything.
But sure enough, weirdly, weirdly enough, this song is something
that I felt very vulnerably connected to. I know that's
(16:51):
not a phrase, but we'll make it a phrase in
it just was so right you imagined connecting to your
vulnerability as a songwriter. How does one, as specifically in songwriting,
but also just as an artist in general, break through
those walls and reach that place of vulnerability in your art?
Is it just? Is it practice? Is it? You know,
self reflection? Is I guess there's probably no easy answer
(17:13):
to that, But but how did you get to that place?
I think that's a great question, and I think kind
of what you were saying as well, I think it's
it's not that there's not an easy answer. I think
it truly is different for everyone. And so what unlock
that for me was going through a really hard time
in my life, was going through a personal crossroads and
(17:33):
a time where I really had to face a lot
of pain. And I felt like for so many years
I always was writing and always kind of turned to
writing because I just loved it. But in that time,
writing wasn't just something I love to do writing with
something I had to do to get what was going
(17:55):
on inside of me out, you know, And so it
was so therapeutic, it was so necessary for me to do,
and that was it's hard to describe. It was almost
like I had to get vulnerable and and put everything
I was thinking into songs. And by the way, there
were still some songs I wrote from a vulnerability that
were terrible, that were lying not good, but it was
(18:19):
it didn't matter. It was just like the purpose for you,
they got you, Yes, exactly exactly. It was just something
I had to do. It was almost it wasn't something
I was necessarily even super aware of until retrospectively thinking
about it. It was just I need to talk about
what I've been going through and what happened to me
(18:40):
and and all those things. What is your process like?
Is it something that is music, something that you do
every day like people do meditation every day or work
out every day, or is it something that you go
to when you feel inspired? Do you feel that you
(19:00):
have something to say? Yeah, you know, I think it
changes for me. I think, um, whenever I spend weeks
or months doing it every day, I feel so happy
and I enjoy it so thoroughly. Sometimes, however, it's just
like if I full on and kind of filming a
movie or in my acting career, I don't necessarily put
(19:21):
that kind of meditation esque aspect to it because it
just feels like I don't have time. But to that point,
there are times like I was just away filming a
movie and there were just times where I had an
idea and I like quickly left, you know, to my
dressing room or about room or anything, and like grabbed
my I've had or any kind of voice memo situation,
(19:44):
just like quickly saying an idea. But I prefer when
I actually put the time in and have that in
every day because I feel like, not only does that
help me just as an artist, and you are so
much better when you do that and you spend the time,
but I just I actually feel the like personal effects
of that and feel a little bit more at peace.
(20:04):
But it is it's a time consuming aspect, So when
I'm working on something else, I don't spend as much
time as I wish I could, and yet inspiration will
strike and I will follow that. This is probably a
naive question from somebody who has never written a song
in their in their life, and will is never likely
to I use superstitious in any way about writing. Is
there an instrument that you always feel like you need
(20:25):
to use, or a place or a time of day
or anything like that. Oh I love that. No, because
I just you're a well adjusted person. No, not because
of that. I just truly feel like inspiration can kind
of strike anywhere, right, And I'm I've been in so
many different studios at different times, and I do feel
like there are sometimes when I feel like I go
(20:47):
into a session and I'll know a little bit immediately
if it's going to be a good session or not,
or if the song will turn out. Um, and sometimes
I totally down. But I will say I do have
this weird feeling that I don't know, it's hard to
describe that, Like when you write a song by yourself
or with somebody. Okay, I'm gonna describe this so terribly,
But it's not that you're writing the song. It's almost
(21:10):
like you're finding the song. The songs has kind of
been already written. You and your creative partners or you
by yourself are on this journey in this session to
unlock this song. And I feel like looking at it
like that is kind of weird, but it feels very appropriate.
I mean, there have been songs where they could have
(21:31):
been you could have gone in so many other directions
for a song, but every version pointed to and needed
to be you know, this melody, this lyric, this structure,
this production, this track, and it just it's you're working
constantly to find that song. Does that make sense? Absolutely?
There was I don't know if it was a joke
(21:52):
or something that some famous sculptor said when they got
a block of you know, square block of stone in
front of them and and made you know, beautiful horse
sculpture something out of it, and somebody say, how did
you do that? And they said, oh, I chipped away
all the rocks that didn't look like a horse. And
you know it's like, yeah, was there, you know. But
the people like me, it's like what are you talking about?
(22:13):
But to you, the artist, you just you knew what
to get, like move away from, and there it was. Well.
I think there's something really special about that mentality because
it feels it almost in a weird way, takes the
pressure off in one way, right, but it also just
feels I don't know, it sounds like super weird, but
it feels like when you're creating some sort of art.
I guess when you're creating anything, but when you're creating
(22:35):
some sort of art, you you feel it's gonna sound
so intense but weirdly connected with the universe in this
weird way of Okay, how are we creating something that's
going to resonate with people that already, in a weird way,
exists in its own form, and we just have to
kind of find it. I didn't always necessarily look at
(22:56):
that the way, but that, to be honest, it kind
of made sense in my past writing experiences of I
would just sing what was happening in my head, and
everything felt very natural, and I think it was really
coming from a place of just the song exists, and
I'm singing what this song is in its existing form,
(23:16):
even though it's never been app before. Was music your
first love? Was that? What you knew that you know
early on that you wanted to devote your life too.
But I was in such a weird situation of I
was always doing music, but in the entertaining industry understandably so.
And there are rare cases, but most of the time
you can't professionally do music at like five, right the
(23:39):
acting industry, the acting industry is super weird because you
can't professionally act at five. So acting professionally happened for
me first. But music was always what I was kind
of doing before, and to be honest, I just didn't
know how to do it pally. And you know, I
(24:01):
had of my space at like a love it or
twelve and a SoundCloud that I released music, But it
wasn't until I was doing Austinality that I got the
opportunity to do music and acting at the same time
and then pursue music professionally, which was I will always
forever be grateful for. Is it every challenge to balance
(24:22):
the acting in the music or does one inform the
other when you kind of need to let the well
fill for for the performance side, you go to music
and vice versa. You know, I think it is a challenge. Um,
I think there are definitely times when they inform each other,
but there is a level of like there are two
full time jobs, right, so making sure that I am
being consistent and spending the time for each of those
(24:46):
aspects is challenging, right, But I think I look at
it two different ways. I look at it from the
business aspect, and I looked at it from the artist aspect,
and just as an artist in general. I love creating,
and I love creating any sort of aspect, whether that
is something that involves my life and my world, which
is how I view my music, or something that is
(25:08):
involving another world, another person, another story to tell, which
is how I kind of view my acting. So I
feel so fulfilled by both of those aspects of my
life so much and I can't imagine my life without it.
But from a business aspect, right, it is like any
sort of job. You wouldn't take ten months off one
job and only do it two months, So it's it
(25:30):
is a challenge to really dedicate and commit the appropriate
time for each I think what I've started doing in
my life, as much as I can help it is
be in charge of being my own boss a little bit, right.
So for film and television, I have very early stages
but gone into kind of the producing aspect, right So,
(25:52):
I've just finished working on this movie that I was
producing as well, which is amazing, and you kind of
have a little bit more control when you're in the
driver's scene in that way for music, I'm doing things independent.
Not to say that I wouldn't ever do a label
situation again or anything in that matter, but I will
say doing it independently, your your own boss. You're in
(26:15):
charge of your release schedule, which I think for me
is really helpful of I don't have to wait on
releasing music four months and months and months and plan
everything around labels other kind of repertoire or list of
artists that they're putting out or you know, YadA, YadA, YadA.
I can be in charge of my own schedule and
(26:36):
be in charge my own kind of creative plan that
I want to do. So those aspects of being in
charge and being your own boss, I think does make
things a little bit easier, but it is challenging for sure.
I'm sure insane with self motivated for either one of those,
but the two together, yeah, I know, I am. I
(27:00):
think it's also time management, which I am constantly getting
better and is a struggle. But I do feel like
I have always had a weird aspect of time management,
even from a young age, of doing you know, school
at the same time as filming a show. I think
you just had to kind of be like, Okay, this
is the time I can do this project, have to
(27:21):
do it, this is the time. Blah blah blah blah
blah blah. But yeah, I think in some ways right
as a musician, as an artist, you also you do
make your own schedule more than you do as an
actor and actress. So I do feel like it is
a little bit turning off one mentality and turning on
another mentality of Okay, I'm in charge my schedule as
an actor again, going into the producing world, you become
a little bit more in charge of your schedule, but
(27:43):
you're still so dependent on so many other people and
things that you are a little bit like you tell
me where to be and I'll be there, And you
don't do that as an artist. And I kind of
love that you don't do as an artist, but I
know some people who do do both can struggle with
that because it is there is a level of self
motivation that has to be there that is hard to
(28:03):
do in this industry. Oh my god, well you you
excel at both. It has been such a joy and
a delight talking. My last question before I let you go,
what is next for you? What what can fans look
forward to coming down the pike. I know, obviously going
out on the road is probably a little ways off.
You had your digital tour for you, but what else
is coming now? Yes, you know, so I definitely am
starting to look way way outwards, so note, but looking
(28:28):
at going out on the road. So that is definitely
in the cards at one point in the next two years,
but on a sooner kind of path. I'm definitely very
excited to release some more music in this you era world,
and then I'm going to be kind of just taking
a little bit of a hate hiatus to write some
(28:49):
more new music and get ready for another release. You know,
who knows when when I kind of finished the story
I want to tell. So I'm really excited this summer
to just really focus on writing and creating because I
have been in so released format and very much like
remix duet world, which has been amazing. But excited to
(29:11):
work on some new music and tell some more stories.
Let's see, You've got the E P, the u EPs.
There is there a m EP or something on the
horizon or I don't know. I think we'll have to see. Oh,
we can't wait. Look, thank you so much for your
time and your music. It's it's been so great talking you.
Thank you so much, Jordan, You're so lovely. Thank you
so much. We hope you enjoyed this episode of Inside
(29:41):
the Studio, a production of I Heart Radio. For more
episodes of Inside the Studio or other fantastic shows, check
out the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever
you listen to your favorite podcasts. B
Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Inside the
Studio on iHeart Radio. My name is Jordan Runt Tug,
but enough about me. You were probably first introduced to
my guests today when she played Ali Dawson on the
Disney Channel series Austin and Ali. Since then, her career
a sword across every medium. She started in the hit
Netflix movie The Perfect Date and recently co starred alongside
(00:23):
Robert de Niro in the War with Grandpa. And then,
of course, she's making a name for herself in the
musical world since she's released a pair of EPs, the
first Called Me and the most recent Called You, their
companion pieces, two sides of the same story, a tumultuous relationship.
The music came at a crossroads in her life, yielding
deeply heartfelt, introspective songs like Can't Hold On Forever and
(00:46):
something to Believe In. These days, she's revisiting tracks from
You in exciting new ways. In April, she released a
remix of Honest with You by Alex TBH, and a
new version of her track Can't Help Myself is out now,
featuring a Little Help from Polios and a verse from
Gen Doe Calling from Australia, where she's filming a new movie.
I'm so thrilled to welcome Laura Morana. Oh, Jordan, I
(01:08):
absolute flusher. Thank you for having me so, because first off,
you've had two EPs in the last two years, Me
and and You last fall. What's the relationship between those
two EPs? How did they relate to one another? So
when I was getting ready to release Me, you know,
that started originally from me writing kind of the title
(01:30):
song off that EP, which is called Me talking about
the song at EP, they think you're talking about yourself,
but you know when I started, I feel like the
project really got going from writing that song. Though there
are other songs I wrote before that that definitely had
a place in this Me and You universe. But that's
when I was like, oh love that song. I love
that vibe. And you know, I kind of come from
(01:52):
two labels in a time in my life where I
was going through also a lot of kind of personal changes.
You know, I was going through a breakup, it's kind
of starting to fall in love again as well, and
so you know, from that whole experience came the EP ME.
But as I was writing for Me, it became very
clear that I had more of the story to tell,
(02:13):
and then I've wanted to kind of continue that story
in some way, and I right away sort of thinking
I'd love to release another EP called You, where it
feels like it's the other side of the story. It
feels like there's some songs or kind of sequels to
the other some songs are kind of another again aspect
of the story. You know, My favorite kind of comparison
(02:36):
to show is on the me E P I have
a song called Lye to Me, and on the UP
I have a song called Honest with You. So it's
a little bit from this theme of there's two sides
to every story. There's two you know, it takes two
people in a relationship, and so one person's perspective can
be very different from another person's perspective, can be similar,
(02:59):
can be related it. You know, I wanted to explore
those different ideas and kind of keep the story going.
And I knew that pretty immediately as I was working
on the P you mentioned Honest with You. That's that's
one of my favorite tracks on the new EP, honestly
being the most important thing in a relationship and it's
probably the scariest thing in a relationship. What is the
genesis of that song? Yes, totally, well, exactly that, right.
(03:23):
So it's so funny to me because lie to Me
and Honest with You are about the same person and
about the same situation. But in lie to Me, right,
it's an aspect of let's not get serious, let's just
like have fun in this moment, let's not worry about
the future, let's just be right here right now. Honest
with You is more serious. Honest with you is I
have been hurt before. It's so scary to be vulnerable,
(03:45):
but damn I want to take that next step and
be honest with you. My kind of favorite aspect of
that song is the question and almost the permission that
you're asking of the person of can I be honest
with you? Can can I be honest in this moment?
You know both of are you ready to take that
next step? And also you know again that vulnerability of
are you going to hurt me? Like? Is are we
(04:07):
going to go there? And you know, of course no
one can ever answer that question truly, but when you're
going in the relationship. I don't think anyone goes into
a relationship being like I can't wait to get hurt
or I can't wait to hurt this person. But you know,
it's still when you take that step, it's so scary,
but there comes to be a point where it just
feels like the right thing to do. And so that
(04:28):
was my idea and kind of the genesis of that song.
You know, we Delacey and Edo are my coat writers
of that song. We were in you know, Edo's studio
in like Brooklyn, and we had already written kind of
two other songs, like the two days prior, and so
that song, Delacey and I had been kind of like
(04:49):
gushing and talking about our relationships and all of the
different things, and I was telling her how I was
just trying to see this person and getting really serious,
and she was like, let's let's let's do this. Let's
let's go into that world. And one of my favorite
parts of Honest with You is that demo vocal that
we did in that kind of small studio in Brooklyn
is the vocal in the song. It just was so right,
(05:10):
it was so raw, and it felt like it needed
to be in the final version. It was so instant.
What was the studio in Brooklyn? That's where that's where
I live? Oh, really, I think it was it just
literally in a building that like there wasn't necessarily it
wasn't like a named studio. Was exactly that, which is
kind of my favorite thing. It was like this, um
you know, you just go up, go into a room
(05:32):
and you know, made it and made it a studio
and it was it would just have the best vibe.
I know, Brooklyn is kind of pretty incredible. It was.
It was such a cool time in my life because
I was really starting to feel I was out of
l A for a really long time because I was
filming a movie in Georgia, and then I went to
New York to write, and then I went to Sweden
(05:53):
to write, and it was just like all of these
exciting things happening in my professional life, while also my
personal life was going through its own kind of like
ups and downs and roller coaster h of emotions. So
it was it was such a just a really special
time of my life. For sure. Sounds like the music
was a catharsist in a lot of ways. Oh, I
(06:14):
truly my breakup and my kind of personal journey through
that and then getting into another relationship. I had never
written the songs that I was writing in such a
personal way. It was almost like every kind of song
I'd worked on before that I would go into a
room and it's so weird, Jordan, Right, you go into
a room and you were kind of like, hey, good
(06:36):
to meet you. Here are all my hopes and dreams. Yeah,
you know, it's really intimate and weird. And I have
so many walls up as a person. So it was
always just it was really hard for me to crack
those walls. And though I had some songs that I
was writing before that that started that journey, it wasn't
really until I was going through that time in my
life where I was just like, I need to write
(06:57):
about this and talk about this and just empty all
of the thoughts that are going on in my head
and empty all of the emotions that are going on
in my heart and just lay it on the floor.
And I feel like I wrote the best music that
I ever had before. And it was so exciting. It
was I was obsessed with the songs. I was so happy,
and you know, I was at a label at the time,
(07:19):
and when I ended up not working with that label anymore,
I I was passionate of I have to take these
songs with me and I have to put them out
because they mean the world to me, you know, I
really enjoy Its kind of devetails into another song that
I was one of my favorites from the EP, Can't
Help Myself. I just think the relationship dynamic that you're
(07:39):
describing on that song is I feel like it's something
I haven't really heard before. Can you talk a little
bit more about what's going on in that song for you? Yes, okay.
I love Can't Help Myself, and surely Can't Help Myself
came because I was writing all this moody, emotional music
and I kind of came into the room with this
awesome producer, Johan, who was based in La at the
(08:01):
time but he's Swedish, and I was like, yo, Han,
I just want to write a fun song, Like, let's
just write a fun, fun song that isn't taking itself
too seriously. And so what I love about Can't Help
Myself is that it comes from this place of having fun,
but it is still a little bit of like a
revenge um our, revenge break up hook up song. After
(08:26):
I'm like, it's hard to completely pinpoint what exactly Can't
Help Myself is on a general standpoint, but it's a
specific standpoint. You know. It's about that moment of facing
an X that ended things and realizing that they want
you back and kind of taking advantage of that aspect
and feeling this weird sort of pleasure and satisfaction of
(08:50):
water and yes, and this weird kind of sense of
empowerment of oh you want me back. Okay, well that's interesting.
I'm gonna take a little control and leisure in this moment.
It's it was so so fun to write, and you know,
we didn't necessarily anticipate writing that concept. I think we
(09:11):
started with the track, right We started with kind of
like this, you know, bpm and this a few of
like the differences that we had that we wrote that
chorus melody and it was just right away, just another
second till you're naked. We're like, what is this about?
Like what is where are we going with this? And
I kind of was instantly, for whatever reason, from that lyric,
(09:33):
thinking of I love that it was just another second
till you're naked, till the other person is And what
is the genesis of that? Like what is the where
did that come from? And from that question came this
revenge break up hook up song. I mean, it's it
(09:58):
definitely feels like just the moment when you're back in control. Fully,
that was sort of when I first heard it, that
was what I got from. It was really like, you
are you are, You've moved on, and now you're back
in the driver's seat. I don't know that was my
take off, right, So it's it's that moment of when
you end a relationship. And to be honest, it wasn't
being really really real with you. It wasn't super based
(10:20):
on anything in my personal life. Maybe in some professional
aspects I was taking some inspiration, but definitely not personally.
But it is that moment in any sort of end
of relationship where you feel like you didn't control the
end of that relationship. You weren't the reason why things ended,
and that's really yes, but you've worked on yourself, you've
(10:43):
moved on, and here you are in a moment where
all of a sudden, yes, the dynamic switches and it's
just feeling so good and taking advantage of that feeling.
It's such a great track, and there's a brand new
version of track that is out. I believe the day
this this episode is out for Dring gen Doe. How
did you first link up with her? Yes? Okay, So
(11:05):
I was really excited to do another version of this
song again, kind of continuing my thought of there's two
sides to a story, there's multiple perspectives of a situation.
I wanted to continue this you era EP group of
music with remixes and with other artists putting their spin
on the songs and their spins on the lyric and
(11:27):
the concept and anything they really want to put their
spin on, right. So, you know, I knew that I
wanted to do a different version of this. I knew
that I wanted to have a female on it. All.
My other kind of duet remixes have all been with
other kind of these amazing male artists who were incredible
to work with. But I'm like, I I need some
like female female power in can't help myself. I really
(11:51):
need to make it happen. So John Doe was someone
that I was a fan of her music. I was
kind of talking to my team about whom be a
good partner here, and we came up with some names,
but John Doe, you know, I was like I kept
kind of coming back to her and feeling like, ah,
I feel like she's going to make a great partner
in this, and sure enough we gave her the song.
(12:11):
She was into the song. She wrote this dope verse
and was just like, you know, let's do this, let's
make it happen. And then from the verse that she gave,
we then got in touch with this other kind of
amazing female artist who is diving into producing. Her name's Polio's.
She actually then added some production elements and kind of
(12:34):
reproduced the track with her producing partner Stanley, and so
it had all this like kind of dope female energy
which I feel like made just to me completely kind
of elevated the song into I love the original version
so much, but this version I think I kind of prefer.
It just feels really really good and really just the
(12:55):
flow is amazing. The verse that John Doe added is fantastic.
All the kind of production elements that are new are
really great. So I was so excited by this version.
I mean, it is such a banger. You're right, I mean,
it just it feels It's definitely something when we can
go back out to uh to have you know, dance
parties and clubs and stuff, is something you could definitely
just here there yes, a hundred perscent. I feel that
(13:18):
so hard, and even like when people start coming over
to people's houses again and you have like a little
like pick back house party vibe, I feel like it's
the perfect song to just have on a playlist and
have that vibe. It's just so I love it. I
love it so much. I'm the complete flip side of
that something I love for for completely different reasons. Your
stripped down version of Something to Believe In is just
(13:39):
is gorgeous. And I know you've said that that you
have a special place in your heart for that song.
What is it about that song that that really resonates
with you? Oh man? So that song is the oldest
song on both EPs, both of me and you EP.
I've had that song for ages. I think I read
that song in twenty thirteen or twenty four teen, really
(14:01):
long time ago, right, and just always want to go
back to the song and the original version that we
had and just feel like, I love this song. Doesn't
feel right for me right now, you know, I knew
I always want to kind of to update some aspects
of it, but it didn't feel right for so many
years to kind of put out and then you know,
when I was making the U E P and I
(14:22):
was writing some new music, I was going back to
some older music. I happened to kind of come across
it again. And with everything that happened to not just me,
but to kind of everyone in something to believe in,
weirdly felt so right in the time to put out
for me, and so much of it I resonated with
(14:44):
so deeply, And so I thought that was such a
really special aspect of the song that here I am
listening to a song I wrote literally years ago, and
I've never resonated with more than what seven six years
later when I listened back to it, and so I
was like, Okay, the song needs to be on the EP.
(15:05):
I completely reproduced it, you know, we added some kind
of different aspects, but to be honest, the lyrical content
really stayed the same. I felt so connected to it,
and it just felt very true for the moment that
I was in, and I hope that it was going
to kind of resonate with other people. I'm sure enough.
It feels like I feel like it's actually the song
(15:26):
off my EU EP that has resonated the most of
my fans, which is really special and pretty amazing. Lyrics
of that song are so mature. I mean, it's it
blows my mind to think he was very young when
you wrote that. It almost seems like your life had
to catch up to all the experience in those words,
unlike a hundred percent, like maybe I had. I don't
even know if I was. I think I had maybe
(15:47):
just started dating someone, But I don't think, to be honest,
when we wrote it, that happens so much, Jordan, right.
Sometimes again, this is actually a time before I felt
like I really unlocked my own vulnerability in my writing.
So you kind of go into a room sometimes and
I think I brought another concept in that was like
(16:10):
somewhat similar but not really necessarily true to my life.
I just thought it was kind of a cool lyric
and we kind of built on that and change things
and alter things, turn things upside down and you know,
something to believe and was kind of born. But it
was not something that I necessarily resonated deeply with in
that moment at all, and that that was kind of
(16:30):
very similar to my writing at that point where I
would love the song. I love writing just in general.
I think it's a creative outlet no matter what but
I wasn't really looking deep into myself to unlock anything.
But sure enough, weirdly, weirdly enough, this song is something
that I felt very vulnerably connected to. I know that's
(16:51):
not a phrase, but we'll make it a phrase in
it just was so right you imagined connecting to your
vulnerability as a songwriter. How does one, as specifically in songwriting,
but also just as an artist in general, break through
those walls and reach that place of vulnerability in your art?
Is it just? Is it practice? Is it? You know,
self reflection? Is I guess there's probably no easy answer
(17:13):
to that, But but how did you get to that place?
I think that's a great question, and I think kind
of what you were saying as well, I think it's
it's not that there's not an easy answer. I think
it truly is different for everyone. And so what unlock
that for me was going through a really hard time
in my life, was going through a personal crossroads and
(17:33):
a time where I really had to face a lot
of pain. And I felt like for so many years
I always was writing and always kind of turned to
writing because I just loved it. But in that time,
writing wasn't just something I love to do writing with
something I had to do to get what was going
(17:55):
on inside of me out, you know, And so it
was so therapeutic, it was so necessary for me to do,
and that was it's hard to describe. It was almost
like I had to get vulnerable and and put everything
I was thinking into songs. And by the way, there
were still some songs I wrote from a vulnerability that
were terrible, that were lying not good, but it was
(18:19):
it didn't matter. It was just like the purpose for you,
they got you, Yes, exactly exactly. It was just something
I had to do. It was almost it wasn't something
I was necessarily even super aware of until retrospectively thinking
about it. It was just I need to talk about
what I've been going through and what happened to me
(18:40):
and and all those things. What is your process like?
Is it something that is music, something that you do
every day like people do meditation every day or work
out every day, or is it something that you go
to when you feel inspired? Do you feel that you
(19:00):
have something to say? Yeah, you know, I think it
changes for me. I think, um, whenever I spend weeks
or months doing it every day, I feel so happy
and I enjoy it so thoroughly. Sometimes, however, it's just
like if I full on and kind of filming a
movie or in my acting career, I don't necessarily put
(19:21):
that kind of meditation esque aspect to it because it
just feels like I don't have time. But to that point,
there are times like I was just away filming a
movie and there were just times where I had an
idea and I like quickly left, you know, to my
dressing room or about room or anything, and like grabbed
my I've had or any kind of voice memo situation,
(19:44):
just like quickly saying an idea. But I prefer when
I actually put the time in and have that in
every day because I feel like, not only does that
help me just as an artist, and you are so
much better when you do that and you spend the time,
but I just I actually feel the like personal effects
of that and feel a little bit more at peace.
(20:04):
But it is it's a time consuming aspect, So when
I'm working on something else, I don't spend as much
time as I wish I could, and yet inspiration will
strike and I will follow that. This is probably a
naive question from somebody who has never written a song
in their in their life, and will is never likely
to I use superstitious in any way about writing. Is
there an instrument that you always feel like you need
(20:25):
to use, or a place or a time of day
or anything like that. Oh I love that. No, because
I just you're a well adjusted person. No, not because
of that. I just truly feel like inspiration can kind
of strike anywhere, right, And I'm I've been in so
many different studios at different times, and I do feel
like there are sometimes when I feel like I go
(20:47):
into a session and I'll know a little bit immediately
if it's going to be a good session or not,
or if the song will turn out. Um, and sometimes
I totally down. But I will say I do have
this weird feeling that I don't know, it's hard to
describe that, Like when you write a song by yourself
or with somebody. Okay, I'm gonna describe this so terribly,
But it's not that you're writing the song. It's almost
(21:10):
like you're finding the song. The songs has kind of
been already written. You and your creative partners or you
by yourself are on this journey in this session to
unlock this song. And I feel like looking at it
like that is kind of weird, but it feels very appropriate.
I mean, there have been songs where they could have
(21:31):
been you could have gone in so many other directions
for a song, but every version pointed to and needed
to be you know, this melody, this lyric, this structure,
this production, this track, and it just it's you're working
constantly to find that song. Does that make sense? Absolutely?
There was I don't know if it was a joke
(21:52):
or something that some famous sculptor said when they got
a block of you know, square block of stone in
front of them and and made you know, beautiful horse
sculpture something out of it, and somebody say, how did
you do that? And they said, oh, I chipped away
all the rocks that didn't look like a horse. And
you know it's like, yeah, was there, you know. But
the people like me, it's like what are you talking about?
(22:13):
But to you, the artist, you just you knew what
to get, like move away from, and there it was. Well.
I think there's something really special about that mentality because
it feels it almost in a weird way, takes the
pressure off in one way, right, but it also just
feels I don't know, it sounds like super weird, but
it feels like when you're creating some sort of art.
I guess when you're creating anything, but when you're creating
(22:35):
some sort of art, you you feel it's gonna sound
so intense but weirdly connected with the universe in this
weird way of Okay, how are we creating something that's
going to resonate with people that already, in a weird way,
exists in its own form, and we just have to
kind of find it. I didn't always necessarily look at
(22:56):
that the way, but that, to be honest, it kind
of made sense in my past writing experiences of I
would just sing what was happening in my head, and
everything felt very natural, and I think it was really
coming from a place of just the song exists, and
I'm singing what this song is in its existing form,
(23:16):
even though it's never been app before. Was music your
first love? Was that? What you knew that you know
early on that you wanted to devote your life too.
But I was in such a weird situation of I
was always doing music, but in the entertaining industry understandably so.
And there are rare cases, but most of the time
you can't professionally do music at like five, right the
(23:39):
acting industry, the acting industry is super weird because you
can't professionally act at five. So acting professionally happened for
me first. But music was always what I was kind
of doing before, and to be honest, I just didn't
know how to do it pally. And you know, I
(24:01):
had of my space at like a love it or
twelve and a SoundCloud that I released music, But it
wasn't until I was doing Austinality that I got the
opportunity to do music and acting at the same time
and then pursue music professionally, which was I will always
forever be grateful for. Is it every challenge to balance
(24:22):
the acting in the music or does one inform the
other when you kind of need to let the well
fill for for the performance side, you go to music
and vice versa. You know, I think it is a challenge. Um,
I think there are definitely times when they inform each other,
but there is a level of like there are two
full time jobs, right, so making sure that I am
being consistent and spending the time for each of those
(24:46):
aspects is challenging, right, But I think I look at
it two different ways. I look at it from the
business aspect, and I looked at it from the artist aspect,
and just as an artist in general. I love creating,
and I love creating any sort of aspect, whether that
is something that involves my life and my world, which
is how I view my music, or something that is
(25:08):
involving another world, another person, another story to tell, which
is how I kind of view my acting. So I
feel so fulfilled by both of those aspects of my
life so much and I can't imagine my life without it.
But from a business aspect, right, it is like any
sort of job. You wouldn't take ten months off one
job and only do it two months, So it's it
(25:30):
is a challenge to really dedicate and commit the appropriate
time for each I think what I've started doing in
my life, as much as I can help it is
be in charge of being my own boss a little bit, right.
So for film and television, I have very early stages
but gone into kind of the producing aspect, right So,
(25:52):
I've just finished working on this movie that I was
producing as well, which is amazing, and you kind of
have a little bit more control when you're in the
driver's scene in that way for music, I'm doing things independent.
Not to say that I wouldn't ever do a label
situation again or anything in that matter, but I will
say doing it independently, your your own boss. You're in
(26:15):
charge of your release schedule, which I think for me
is really helpful of I don't have to wait on
releasing music four months and months and months and plan
everything around labels other kind of repertoire or list of
artists that they're putting out or you know, YadA, YadA, YadA.
I can be in charge of my own schedule and
(26:36):
be in charge my own kind of creative plan that
I want to do. So those aspects of being in
charge and being your own boss, I think does make
things a little bit easier, but it is challenging for sure.
I'm sure insane with self motivated for either one of those,
but the two together, yeah, I know, I am. I
(27:00):
think it's also time management, which I am constantly getting
better and is a struggle. But I do feel like
I have always had a weird aspect of time management,
even from a young age, of doing you know, school
at the same time as filming a show. I think
you just had to kind of be like, Okay, this
is the time I can do this project, have to
(27:21):
do it, this is the time. Blah blah blah blah
blah blah. But yeah, I think in some ways right
as a musician, as an artist, you also you do
make your own schedule more than you do as an
actor and actress. So I do feel like it is
a little bit turning off one mentality and turning on
another mentality of Okay, I'm in charge my schedule as
an actor again, going into the producing world, you become
a little bit more in charge of your schedule, but
(27:43):
you're still so dependent on so many other people and
things that you are a little bit like you tell
me where to be and I'll be there, And you
don't do that as an artist. And I kind of
love that you don't do as an artist, but I
know some people who do do both can struggle with
that because it is there is a level of self
motivation that has to be there that is hard to
(28:03):
do in this industry. Oh my god, well you you
excel at both. It has been such a joy and
a delight talking. My last question before I let you go,
what is next for you? What what can fans look
forward to coming down the pike. I know, obviously going
out on the road is probably a little ways off.
You had your digital tour for you, but what else
is coming now? Yes, you know, so I definitely am
starting to look way way outwards, so note, but looking
(28:28):
at going out on the road. So that is definitely
in the cards at one point in the next two years,
but on a sooner kind of path. I'm definitely very
excited to release some more music in this you era world,
and then I'm going to be kind of just taking
a little bit of a hate hiatus to write some
(28:49):
more new music and get ready for another release. You know,
who knows when when I kind of finished the story
I want to tell. So I'm really excited this summer
to just really focus on writing and creating because I
have been in so released format and very much like
remix duet world, which has been amazing. But excited to
(29:11):
work on some new music and tell some more stories.
Let's see, You've got the E P, the u EPs.
There is there a m EP or something on the
horizon or I don't know. I think we'll have to see. Oh,
we can't wait. Look, thank you so much for your
time and your music. It's it's been so great talking you.
Thank you so much, Jordan, You're so lovely. Thank you
so much. We hope you enjoyed this episode of Inside
(29:41):
the Studio, a production of I Heart Radio. For more
episodes of Inside the Studio or other fantastic shows, check
out the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever
you listen to your favorite podcasts. B
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