November 2, 2023 • 45 mins
From the dark side of Malibu, to raising “rich kids,” to the effects of getting canceled…Rob has seen a lot in his storied journey and he’s willing to share it all.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:11):
My guest today is actor, filmmaker and podcast host Rob Low.
You may know him from The West Wing and Saint
Elmo's Fire by the Way iconic show and movie, but
today Rob is the star of Fox's nine one one
Lone Star and host of Literally with Rob Low. This
is just me with Rob Low. Let's get into it. Hi,
(00:36):
So I talk to you. A lot of people commented
on me doing your show, like, isn't it funny the
types of people that come out of the woodwork when
you do different things and then you realize why you
do different things.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Yes, I'm so. I'm so interested to know you did
my podcast Literally and you were great. I had a
great talk with you. What was the reaction on your end?
Speaker 1 (00:58):
The reaction was great. But like I said, from different
people that I don't you know, you're always marketing to
the same audience because they're your audience. And so that's why,
that's why the model of podcasts and doing different types
of things and having different people on yours does really
work because different like random like David Lasher who was
Vinnie from Blossom, was like I listened to you on
(01:19):
Rob Blows. I'm like what, Like it was just so
weird all of it. I was like, oh, and he's like,
I loved what you said. It was so inspirational, and
he I know him, and he's like, I didn't even
know your story, so you know, it hit differently, which
is which is nice, which says a lot about about
you and the combination of us who are in a
similar generation but speaking to some similar people. And then
(01:41):
I'm sure you know different people. But I enjoyed it.
I felt like I know you now. And and I
was in Santa Barbara recently and I felt like, I, yeah,
I know Roblo. I'm in Barbara, I have friends here.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Well it's well, that's I love hearing that, and I
It's It's true, isn't it?
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Like it is always interesting.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
To me when we are out giving interviews or selling.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
A product or movie or TV or whatever.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Who is watching or listening to what? It's endlessly fascinating
to me.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Yeah. I mean, I really do think that if I'm
not a person who likes unsolicited advice or visits, but
if I were that person, and I feel like if
I knocked on your door, you'd be like, hey, come
on in. I feel like we're friends now.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
So I'm already feeling bad that you didn't say, Hey,
I'm in Santa Barbara, let's get coffee.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
I think I message on Instagram, but I don't know
if you got it.
Speaker 3 (02:36):
I forget if, like you know my Instagram.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
I it's like I'm not as good as following the
comments maybe as I should be.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
Yeah, No, I don't believe me. I mean I went
with my daughter. We stayed at Calamy Goes Ranch and
Malibu and then drove for the day.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
What's it like to stay there?
Speaker 1 (02:57):
So Mark Gervitz is a power comedy manager who lives
in Malibi, like deep Malibu. There's Malibu and then there's
like deeper Malibu. And I was going to an event
at his house to see Adam Sandler and a bunch
of people, and I wanted to have a staycation versus
stay in La where you're going to transact and you're
going to be in the business of show and I
didn't want. I wanted to be on a vacation and
(03:17):
feel like I could go to the beach. And Malibu
is different. So we stayed at this place, Kalamigos Ranch,
which is like very ranchy and very malibuish and very
cowboy budhish and rustic and different than most of La
And everybody that I've told that I stayed there was like, oh, yeah, no,
I've never stayed there or I've never been there, and
(03:39):
I was like, what do you mean It's it was shocking. Yeah,
So I loved.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
It when I was a kid, when I was in
junior high that everybody went to summer camp at Kalamigos Ranch. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:50):
Oh, it's been different things.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
It's been a proper ranch and that it's been defunct
and then it's been revitalized.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
But it's I've never stayed there.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
So then we went to your town, and I love
You're in Santa I love that town of Santa Barbara.
I've been to Monacito and we did that, but like
that street in Santa Barbara with all those pianos on,
it was amazing.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
I know, right, they've shut since COVID, they shut down
State Street and it's now like a you know, a plaza,
walking plaza. It's Those are two of my favorite places
in Alibu, and Montecito and Santa Barbara three of my favorite,
I should say.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
Likewise, Okay, so I've done a little bit of reading
about you and I had always peripherally gotten a sense
of you, like I knew you married a makeup artist
or your makeup artist, and I was sadly jealous at
the time, and I was just thinking like, why her
not me? And I didn't even know you, So that
was this good reason why we didn't know each other.
(04:53):
So you got We talked on your podcasts about this
a little bit. But you you started in you were
in Ohio and and then you went to la or
you started in Virginia.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Yeah, I was.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
I was born in Charlottesville, where my dad was had
just graduated from law school, and then they, my mother
and my dad moved to Dayton and that's where I
had my childhood. My proper you know, from six months
old to twelve was in Dayton. So I got a
real Midwestern childhood. And then my mom and dad divorced
(05:26):
and we ended up in directly from Dayton to Point
Doom in Malibu, which was like going to Mars.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Wow, that's a Fred Hayman from Georgio, Beverly Hills. I
planned and organized his wedding and so that was my
first experience at Point Doom.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Point Doom is there's Malibu and then there's Point Doom.
It's a whole different vibe very and my great obsession
is I want to do a movie or miniseries or
book about what life was like in Malibu but on
Point Doom, in particular in the mid to late seventies,
because it was.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
Not wait so hold on, I was staying when you
went down to the left was Paradise Cove And then
to the Point Doom is not in Malibu. It's like
its own thing.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
No, it's a part of Malibu, but it's it's it's
because it's a point Okay, it's it's its own neighborhood.
It's it's you know, it's not on the pch like
everything else is. And uh, it's it's just a weird
I don't know if it's the Indian Shoemash mojo there,
(06:40):
but it's both really exciting and interesting and really dark
and weird all at the same time.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Is are there are there reservations there? No?
Speaker 2 (06:49):
But it's okay, But it's all real shoemash you know,
the original you know, people of the area.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
It's it's very viby in that way. Lots of arrowheads
and history.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
What high school did you go to There.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Was no high school in Malibu then there is now,
and we had to take the bus twenty two miles
to Santa Monica to go to high school.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
So you went to Santa Monica High School. Wow, okay,
so you really But I mean, starting at twelve, you
kind of really are a California boy and you really
never left that sphere, Like you're not that far from
there now. I mean, you're in that vibe too. There's
a Malibu vibe, and I feel like Santa Barbara is
like a Malibu adjacent vibe, having spent that weekend wanting
to go that way versus go the other way into La.
Speaker 3 (07:38):
Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
And again when Malibu when I moved there, it was
not a show business enclave it is now. There was
a time, you know, I would say in the early
eighties when the studio executives and the agents.
Speaker 3 (07:51):
All moved out there.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
But when I grew up there, it's what Santa Barbara
and Montecito were when I moved up here, which is
super rural. People ride their horses down the street. Wow,
not a company town. You get all walks of life
when you like, you know, if I'm coaching Little League
I'm you know, there's the dad's work in every line
(08:16):
of work you could imagine, and they're not all in
show business. So it's it's just I'm attracted to a
little bit of more diversity of thought and of experience.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
And moving your kids to Santa Barbara when they were
at an age where things are more influential. That was
obviously intentional. Is that because of your Midwestern roots, like
you just wanted to feel some version of that.
Speaker 3 (08:43):
Yeah, I wanted. I wanted them to be able to
be outside a lot.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
I wanted I wanted, you know, up here we could
we could go to the beach, maybe take a hike,
go to the zoo, and go to a movie. We
could do that all in one day up here and
in la As, you know, that's you could do one
of them right in a day. And if you're in
(09:07):
Malibu you can really.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
Only do one of them.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
And where's your wife from.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
She's a born and bred valley girl.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
She's a valley girl, Okay.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
And Vally, they're very she is a valley girl, you know, Hollywood.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
She grew up in both areas.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
So you dragged her.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
I dragged her, Oh, I dragged her.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
She dragged her.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Yeah, she was not having it.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
I had a real vision though, of I mean, every
once in a while I have a I have a
vision of what I want to do, not all the time,
but every once in a while, and I really was like,
this is really right for us, and I mean it's
one of the smartest things that we ever did as
a family, was was was move up here both I
mean in terms of our lifestyle, what it did for
(09:53):
our relationships, for our marriage, for our kids, and financially,
As it turns out, more than anything, I've done better
in real estate in Montecito than I've done in my
entertainment career.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
That's what I was. The next question I was gonna
ask is did you invest in? You invest early?
Speaker 3 (10:08):
Yep?
Speaker 2 (10:09):
I did years ago yep, and Monacito became only just
continued to become more attractive.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
And then between.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
People being able to work from home, the rise of Zoom,
the experience of COVID and a big hotel opening up
the Miramar that brought people from all over the world
to see it, and Megan and Harry moving in, all
of those things turned Monacito into another version of the Hamptons,
(10:48):
which it never was.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
You said last time, and I spoke to you that
you don't. I don't think you consider yourself a very
good business person?
Speaker 4 (10:54):
Or do you?
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Or do you?
Speaker 2 (10:56):
It depends. I definitely consider myself a business person, for sure.
Speaker 1 (10:59):
You do, so, okay, yeah, for sure, Like you are
thinking business first, You're marketing your business, You're you have
a chessboard that you're working in your mind.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
I mean, it doesn't supersede my creative but I like
to think that I can get them both to exist
equally within me and neither one is a detriment to
the other.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
And who So when you started making money acting, you
started investing or that was just you buying your personal property,
Like what was your business trajectory it was?
Speaker 2 (11:31):
It was really just buying the personal property, really and
then you know, selling it and you know, doing well
and moving up the ladder, and then selling that and
doing well and then starting to invest in other areas
of real estate, which is really and I got to
give my wife credit.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
She has really been the impetus.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
Behind that, behind the investing in other real estate.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
In real estate period. She's got an.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
Amazing, amazing sniffer for.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
Real estate, the vision of what something could be yes insane.
Speaker 3 (12:08):
Yeah, we're just insane.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
I love that and I've done that personally a lot,
and it was almost unintentional. But during the pandemic, I
flipped three places and I never I was thinking about
you talking about your personal real estate for people who
are thinking about business in different ways. For me, anytime
I go to look at something, I always think about,
even if it's for an investment, if I would live there,
(12:31):
Because if the shit hits the fan and you have
five different pieces on the board, you could sell four
and you'd be willing to live in any of them,
like they all work for you. I like that freedom
of thought where I like that, but if I end
up not liking it, like a place on the water,
maybe I don't know what it's like to live on
the water, but I fantasize about it. I just bought
a place, but I know I could move it or
(12:51):
rent it. I like to be nimble and the pieces
like that.
Speaker 3 (12:54):
Yeah, and for us, the straight investment real estate is
new ish.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
And you know we we we weren't flippers, and I
don't we're not.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
Our homes are our homes and we live in them.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
And but we've just had those those things where people
have said, you know, we'd like to buy it, and
you name the price, and I go, you know what
I'm gonna At the end of the day, I'm still
an actor for hire. I sort of a fiduciary responsibility
to my family to to say yes to this. But
(13:32):
it's not like I'm I ever build any home to.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
Flip it, right, I understand, but your but your wife
is probably thinking of things being somewhat not neutral. But
I think people think about that in design too. You know,
you're not putting like crocodile walls because you never know
what could happen if someone knocks on the door.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
Oh yeah, Willison, for sure.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
And I think it's one of the reasons we have
been able to do what we do is when we
we just found a big, an amazing piece of property.
It's a legacy property, been around since eighteen seventy seven.
And when you have something like that, you have to
build something on it that's equal to the property.
Speaker 3 (14:08):
And if you don't, then you're actually taking money off
the table. So it's a weird thing.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
You're going to spend more, but you're actually making more
than if you you know, you know what I mean
it's like, yes, you got if you've.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
Got to, you got to.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
If you're gonna do it, you're gonna do it.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
Yeah, exactly, you gotta do it right.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Yeah, I live on a house it's seventeen forty three
on a property with an apple orchard, and like I
don't mess around with the original wood in the house
or like I just I you have to honor it.
This is what you're saying. You're honoring. You're not gonna
like spec house it up on eighteen hundred's property. So
(14:54):
you've done well, You've made money and in show business
and in real estate. How do you I know you're
you have and that you wanted to move them there
for them to have this sort of balance and be grounded.
How do you raise rich kids? Because I've talked to
more Cuban about this, I've talked to myself about this
and has it worked and your kids, you know, well
(15:15):
adjusted work for themselves? Like did you do this? Did
you nail it?
Speaker 3 (15:19):
Well?
Speaker 2 (15:19):
First of all, you know it's all relative. Even what
is rich, right is relative? You know, Mark Cuban's got
more money than you.
Speaker 3 (15:27):
I do.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
No, But but even the gay he still doesn't want
really really really asshole spoiled kids. So he's harder for
him because he's flying on a private plane. We're flying
first class. So like at your level, I guess you know, And.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Well, first of all, I think my kids, if you
ask them, they legitimately would not consider themselves.
Speaker 3 (15:52):
Rich.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
Legit, that's not in the ethos, Like they know they
have this trust fund or they know that when I
know people like this, I've worked with people like who
know that when their dad or mom kicks the bucket
or when grandpa kicks the bucket, they're coming into you know,
a lot of money. They and they you know, it's
always out there in their lives. Obviously, that's not my family.
(16:16):
I think that they grew up thinking and having certainly
the experience of being not any different than a lot
of the other kids. Other than you know, maybe the
vacations were nicer, and you know, like you said, maybe
we flew more often. But I tried to give them
(16:39):
a really normal sixtent I could upbringing. I think the
thing that makes it really different is the fame part
of it.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
Oh interesting, okay, right right.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Because you know, you can be worth four billion dollars
and you can walk into a restaurant and nobody knows
who you are, and you can be worth, you know,
four hundred thousand dollars and walk into a restaurant and
it stops dead in its tracks. So it's a funny.
It's a funny thing. So I really think there's the
how do you deal with with money? And then there's
(17:10):
how do you deal with being in a family that
is in the public eye?
Speaker 1 (17:16):
And are you just are you insular you're not out
that much? Or you live in a place where no
one cares? And you know, what's it like when you're
with them in La Do they care? Do they What
is that like in your house? Fame? And is your
wife annoyed by it?
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Well, the thing is the one of the reasons I
consciously moved out of LA was I didn't want my
kids growing up, you know, around paparazzi and and and
and where the currency of the realm is your fame,
(17:50):
and that just is what it is in La There's
no way to skin that cat.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
When I grew up in.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
Malibu, there were there were horses at the hitching posts
at the market. They're gone and they're replaced with paparazzi,
staking people out, which wasn't there. So I tried I
recreated it, and so they just didn't. They'd come home
(18:16):
and go Dad. They'd visit a friend in Melibou.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
Dad. They had a screening room. We watched a movie
there and Jim Carrey came over and they're talking like
they're from you know, Ohio, right, you know, and and that,
and I was like, yeah, that's good. They should be.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
They should you have stars in their eyes like that
and feel that way. And you know, my other my son,
who is the actor, didn't start out that way. He
started out as a a stem cell scientist and went
to Stanford and then came out and decided he wanted
to be an actor and a writer.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
And of course I was that was not a happy
day for me. I was like, I had a molecular
biologist an actor.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
My daughter kind of acts like when she went from
this public school to this private school, she acted like
she was sort of on scholarship. She was like, oh
my god, mom, they give free art supplies and she
was so excited. And I think that's because, you know,
just because I buy things that I want or I
worked hard to get all this, it doesn't mean it's
a free for all, and I have all these rules
(19:23):
that you know, if you really want something, you have
to give something up or you have to work for it.
And it is a discipline, like I do really work
really hard, and I do have to pull on the
reins a lot, and I like that. I think it's
like it feels like a project, Like your kids are
the best possible project. It's you get such a ROI
on the time you invest in them and these kind
(19:44):
of principles, and you can be struggling financially and have
spoiled kids.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
For sure, entitled spoiled. You know, it happens, It can
happen to it can happen to kids anywhere.
Speaker 3 (19:59):
Yeah, really it really absolutely.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
Entitlement is I think the worst, the worst element of it.
But I also think that they take their cues from
their parents. And you know, I work my ass.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
Off and and so yeah, so.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Does Cheryl Oh. I mean she, I mean she literally
this week flew to Washington for her jewelry business, came
home last night, flew to Arizona and came home and
she's out there on the floor selling Neiman Marcus, doing
her thing.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
It's like she's have to do that no, but yeah,
and have you ever like, was there? It's my turn
in your relationship because it's been very much about you
and your career. Was there. It's my turn after her,
you know, helping you raise the kids and all that.
Or it's just always been an ebb and flow.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
It's always been that way. I mean, one of the
reasons I married her was she had this and remains.
She has the strongest work ethic of anybody I've ever known.
And that's saying something because mine is strong. And so
whether it's raising the raising the kids, or starting a
makeup line, or or building the homes that we have,
(21:14):
or the or then she had, she also has from
time to time built for other people.
Speaker 3 (21:20):
She always has always worked, she will always work.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
Interesting and so your work ethic comes from your upbringing
and your family, right.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
Yeah, But part of it I think is listen, I
think part of its genetic because my mom was sort
of very artsy and not really a worker. My dad
is eighty four and still goes into the office, uh
you know, uh practices law. My grandpa, who is very
(21:54):
close to my mom's side, just a eighth grade education,
you know, it became the first millionaire in his city,
you know, so it's it's kind of I think it's
kind of in the DNA a little bit.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Maybe, So you were always working your ass off, like
you're working as hard as you were when you were younger,
Like you were always this way.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
Paper routes, you know, bus boy. I mean, I did
get fired from every job that I had that wasn't
around show business because I'm not really cut out for
the real world, Bethany.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
But but you're cut out for show business, and well,
I guess real estate, you're cut out for non traditional business.
Speaker 3 (22:37):
Yes, I am. I designed first of all. I had
designed my entire life to try to not deal with math.
And you know, listen.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
That I'm really good on the other side of my
brain and I've I've really learned a lot about I
can get by with numbers, obviously, because you have to
if you're going to be in any kind of a business.
But I avoid it. It's not my jam.
Speaker 3 (22:58):
I don't like it. I appreciate people who do.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
I'm very much a creative person with a you know
what It's like people say, do you sing? It's like
I'm an actor who sings, which is very different than
being a singer.
Speaker 3 (23:14):
Who acts or a singer.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
M h. And it's that way that way with business.
I am a storyteller, entertainer, producer, director who also is
in business.
Speaker 1 (23:27):
Right right right when you were partying, how could you
have that same work ethic or you were just partying
and then you would wake up and you would just
be hurting a little bit. You always had the same
work ethic, just exhausted a little stripped.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Exactly when I'm out of you know, dan seteria at
the Hampton's till you know, four o'clock in the morning
and I got to get up to shoot Masquerade, you
just you suck it up and.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Go, yeah, yeah, I gets that.
Speaker 2 (23:54):
You know. Also it's a little bit of like you
emulate your idols, and you know, my idols today are
really really different than they were then.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
But then you know, it.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Was like Jack Nicholson Man, he's out partying on he's
at the Roxy, you know, the shades on at two am,
and then he's on the set of the Witches of
east Wick, Man's Courtside of the Laker Games. It lives
up in Mohuland, and he's got seventeen girlfriends. Man.
Speaker 3 (24:23):
Yeah, like that was what I thought was cool.
Speaker 4 (24:25):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
Yeah, in many ways, I don't. The younger generation. I
worry about them, but not in that way. I think
they're more evolved in wanting to feel good and drinking
macha and asai, and whether it all works or not,
I don't know. But they're aware of like well being
in balance where we were not. But I'm the same
as you. It's a prose play, hurt model, tough.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
Shit one to one Honda, same with my same with
my wife. Same and and you know little and John Ohen,
my my acting son. Uh, you know, he's he's very
open about it. He's also sober, and he was the same.
He was like pros play hurt right, work hard, play hard.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Yeah, but yeah, but now it doesn't have to be
it doesn't have to be so exhausting. It's okay to
feel good. So sobriety is a major, major role in.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
Your career and in our family's life, for sure major.
I wouldn't have anything without it, really what it is is,
I think it would have been just the law of
diminishing returns, and I would have been like the frog
that slowly gets boiled alive in.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
The in the in the in the water.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
As you incrementally you know, can't feel it, and just yeah,
that would have been me with my you know, personal
life and career.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
Like death by a thousand paper cuts. It was just like, yeah,
well that's Was it really hard to quit everything or
was it? Like they're different, They're fifty shades of addiction.
I've taken classes on it. And some people our bingers.
Some people are just always in their life. They call
it a French type alcoholic, and some people really hit rock.
So what was your relationship to substances?
Speaker 2 (26:09):
Mine was, I was kind of a periodic, they would say.
And so you're, you know, you're up at Charlie Sheen's
pool and you got your coronas and you're you're working out.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
At the gym.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
You's being tough, and then you have a couple of
coronas and then the next thing you know, you're you know,
you're you're you're looking for the blow or whatever, maybe
because it's nighttime and you go out to and then
you're chasing girls around and you're it's like you're twenty
you're nineteen, twenty twenty one years old.
Speaker 3 (26:38):
And and that was.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
Sort of the vibe for me, and I just at
a certain point realized that I was never going to
have the life I wanted continuing that. And so when
I was ready, I went to Sierra Tucson and and
it was the best thing I ever did.
Speaker 3 (27:02):
And I actually loved being in rehab. I loved it.
I learned so much. I was always a pleasure to
have in class.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
In school, I was in the front. I'm in the
front row raising my hand. That was always me. And
I was the same in rehab. And I learned a
ton And you know, you know, by the grace of God,
I've never had to slip. I've never had to go back.
I got from the minute I got sober, I've stayed sober.
I was thirty three years ago.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
Because you work your ass off, so you work your
ass But is it is it a struggle now or
it's just is what it is?
Speaker 2 (27:37):
Right, it's in my DNA, it's being you know, having
the ism is a struggle because it's like whack a mole. Yeah,
like every decade there's I realized that it's morphed into
something else that I need to look at and like,
right now, this is going to sound insane, but I
know it's driven from the same thing. It's waking up
(28:00):
at midnight and going, you know what, you need to
go to the kitchen and binge on some hogindaws.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
It's noise. The noise is in a different area. Now.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
Yeah, you know, some people it's gambling. Some people it's sex.
Some people it's uh workaholism. Yeah, some people it's overtraining.
I mean it yeah, never goes away. It just moves
and just hopefully it moves into stuff that's less and
less harmful and easier and easier to deal with.
Speaker 1 (28:30):
Mine is organizing and getting rid of. It's obsessive. It's
it's insane. I mean, it's that that's mine.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
Are you a collector or getting get rid of.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
I'm not a hoarder at all, but I Freud would
have a field day with me walking into this accidental
influencer business and everybody sending me everything, and so there's
a curiosity about it. And also I like to purchase.
I'm a purchaser of certain things that I do collect,
and then I just get overwhelmed by that we really
(29:02):
don't need so much and why is this all here?
And I just wanted to you know, But it's definitely
not a hoarders. I have the most organized, the macular
house you could imagine. But it's just I'm just as
too much in coming out going stuff, you know, Like
that's why I wouldn't be good at really being an
interior designer, because it would be too noisy for me
to have like a J. Dart or candles or art.
(29:24):
Like I don't want like a storage facility of any
shit ever. I want it out. So that's a sickness.
Speaker 3 (29:30):
Yeah, No, it's good. I like it.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
Yeah, it's a good one. It's not. It's like working
at It's good because I could come into your house
and organize it and you'd be so happy.
Speaker 2 (29:37):
It's so funny you say that, because again, one of
the things about my wife that I remember, you know,
and I was actively dating big time and she was
among the people that I was seeing, and she came
over and organized my coffee table, the books on my
coffee table. As long as I live, no one else
(30:00):
done that.
Speaker 1 (30:00):
That's nice.
Speaker 3 (30:01):
No one else's never done that.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
That's hilarious. Well, your marriage is a big part of
your identity too, and you seem to be pretty good
at it. No marriage is perfect, But I'm asking if like,
you've had serious bumps to make us all feel better
about our miserable lives, or have you not?
Speaker 2 (30:19):
And this is one of the reasons why, you know,
to the extent that I ever hesitate to talk about it.
The temptation is that, oh, well, it must be perfect,
and well, sure, anybody can be married for thirty three
years if it's perfect and there aren't any struggles or
you know, and that's not the case.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
I mean, it just isn't, you know.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Every it's it's no different than a long career. If
you are in a long marriage or if you're in
a long career, by definition, you're going to have those
fallow periods because nothing in life remains the same. Nothing nothing, nothing, nothing,
(31:00):
stock market, business relationships, they all have their ups and downs.
And I think the difference is both in careers and marriages,
is how you react when they're down.
Speaker 1 (31:11):
And that's an amazing point.
Speaker 2 (31:12):
And that's the difference. That is literally the difference in
a long career, short career, or a long marriage or
a short marriage is what do you do?
Speaker 3 (31:20):
Do you run? Do you blame? Can you live in acceptance?
Can you change?
Speaker 2 (31:26):
Can the other person change? Can you forgive? Can you
take responsibility all of those things, and a lot of
people can't do any of them.
Speaker 1 (31:35):
It's a great point. And do you lean in and
be like all right, let's let's work this thing through,
or like you.
Speaker 3 (31:40):
Said, we work hard.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
Listen, we do marriage therapy even when we don't quote
unquote need it.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
You want to lock the door so you don't get robbed.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
So yeah, and it's like it's like you too, it's
to you send your car and to get tuned up.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
So true, it's such a that's a great that's such
a that's that's that's really a great note. And so
you've had some serious roadblocks, like you've been canceled in
a time when people didn't even get canceled. And I've
thought about not even since meeting you, I've thought about
that in my life. I don't know why that. I
don't believe that would even be on the board for
(32:17):
cancelation as long like things hit differently back then, and
so it was look bad to me overall. On a
one to ten of like your career being stratospheric, I
envisioned it that your career was stratospheric. You hit a
brick wall and then you were not present for a while,
and then all of a sudden you started to slowly
(32:39):
come back in different types of things. That's how I
perceive it. So how accurate is that.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
I would say that that's pretty accurate. I would say
that there are two things that I think that that
add to it a little more context. One is I
actually think that in many ways, my ill fated appearance
(33:07):
on the Academy Awards.
Speaker 3 (33:10):
Did as much damage.
Speaker 2 (33:12):
I was asked to open the Academy Awards and to
do a song with snow White, and it felt like
a really good idea at.
Speaker 3 (33:23):
The time, and it was a terrible idea.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
It was a badly conceived It was supposed to be silly,
and people hated it. And then I think it Then
post all of that, I got sober, went away to rehab,
got serious with my wife, got married, moved out of LA.
Speaker 3 (33:51):
Started having kids.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
So I was, I mean, I'm sure it was a
sort of a mutual decision in terms of Hollywood and.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
Me, Like I was.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
I look, I spent the eighties dealing work, building my career,
and I spent the nineties building myself.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
Wow. So you so it was the bestest thing that
ever happened to.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
You in ways not in ways, It was the best
thing that ever happened to me, full stop.
Speaker 1 (34:22):
Do you feel like you were so like it was
it was almost like a self fulfilling prophecy to fail.
You feel like you were reckless and like kind of
looking for something you were looking for a while to hit.
Speaker 3 (34:31):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
No, I absolutely remember feeling like, like, you know, it's
it's it's it's the uh, the criminal that that once
wants to be arrested.
Speaker 3 (34:43):
Stop.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
Wow. So so you were you You weren't like, oh fuck,
my career is over because you take that kind of
make that kind of change. Did you have a backup
plan or did you know you have enough control over
who you are and that you're robblow and that you
can come back when you decide, Because most people like
you said, if someone knocks on the door, you're going
to sell your house. If you go away, you could
be obsolete in the entertainment industry.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
I never thought about it in that way.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
And then I because all I was thinking about at
the time when I was getting sober was it's time
for me. I'm getting I'm doing this for me. I'm
not doing it for my career. I'm not doing it
for public consumption. I'm not doing it to stay together
with my then girlfriend Cheryl, who became my wife. I
(35:32):
was doing it for me and it was probably the
first thing that I ever really did just for me ever,
and it was all I could think about. It required
everything and anything else that bubbled up around.
Speaker 3 (35:45):
It, like what about my career? What about it? I
was like, don't care, right well, let the chips fall
where they may. Who knows I'm.
Speaker 1 (35:52):
Doing It's funny. Matthew McConaughey made a similar I don't
know if you read his book green Light, but he
made a similar decision about like I'm not taking these
like shirtless drom coms, and he stood tight. He just
knew there was a moment when he had to do something,
and that was my moment, was leaving the housewives. As
ridiculous as that sounds, it was millions of dollars, and
it was you know, my business manager said, or my
(36:13):
someone said, trees grow high, they don't grow high to
the sky. Take the millions of dollars right now until
you can't get it anymore. And I made a decision
to intervene, and just like this is like I've got
to reinvent and do everything differently now. And it's a
nice feeling. And people have to be in tune and
aware and courageous enough to do that.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
But we'll also to hear to hear the voice inside
of them and honor that. Yes, you have to be
courageous on top of that to do it.
Speaker 1 (36:39):
What age was that at that you that you did
that twenty six That was young to be making those
kind of big boy decisions to be like getting going
and going to rehabit, getting married.
Speaker 3 (36:48):
That was you?
Speaker 1 (36:49):
You peaked early?
Speaker 2 (36:50):
Well, you know, I I had a lot of life.
I had more life experience than the average twenty six
yearl that's for sure. I'd been more, done more, seen more,
learned more. And but yes, looking back on it, it's
younger than any of my kids are now.
Speaker 1 (37:10):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 3 (37:11):
And I look back on it and go, what the hell?
Speaker 1 (37:13):
So, Lauren Michael's once said to me at dinner he
was talking about somebody else on SNL or something. It
wasn't about me, but I just never forget it. He said,
you have to make an exit to be able to
make an entrance.
Speaker 3 (37:25):
It's such a great It's one of my favorite laurenisms.
Speaker 1 (37:28):
The last two questions I have people have given me
one piece of advice, like I don't fix them, I
fix me, or every day we check in once a day.
These things that I sometimes say, oh god, well I
don't do that, Like what is your thing that you
guys do that seems simple to you but would help
other people in relationships?
Speaker 2 (37:50):
Well, there's two things. The number one thing is, let's
hope you've chosen right to begin with.
Speaker 3 (37:58):
Because.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
Really the die is cast with who you choose, because,
as you allude to in the advice, you can't change
another person.
Speaker 3 (38:11):
Changing yourself is hard.
Speaker 2 (38:14):
It's like Cheryl and I are simpotico on so many things, money, politics,
where we want to go on vacations. Uniforms are not
uniforms in schools.
Speaker 3 (38:31):
I mean you name it.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
Not name the list of from the from the banal
to the really intense. And I am going to be
on the exact same page with her all the time.
Now we happen to disagree on something very important to me. Comedy.
Speaker 3 (38:52):
Cheryl Lowe does not understand comedy.
Speaker 1 (38:56):
She doesn't and what do you mean she doesn't understand
common like she does? She not think you were funny
because I know couples that were one person's funny and
the other person doesn't think they're funny. Does she think
you're funny?
Speaker 3 (39:06):
She's smart enough to know that other people think I'm funny. See, yes,
no she doesn't. She's a horrible laugh for me. She's
a black hole.
Speaker 2 (39:17):
Oh in my one man shows, and it's a it's
a running joke amongst our friends and family.
Speaker 3 (39:24):
So like, by the way, for some people, that would
be a barrier to entry.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
One hundred percent. I'm a comedy snob. And would you
think she is? She funny?
Speaker 3 (39:32):
No? See? Wow, here's another thing.
Speaker 2 (39:35):
And I've had I had, I had one girlfriend in particular.
All we did was laugh. It was fucking amazing. But
you know what, it's it's fine, It's it's she would
have been, by the way, a terrible wife and a
terrible life partner, right, you know.
Speaker 3 (39:56):
She just doesn't like Bruce Springsteen and her music.
Speaker 2 (40:00):
I feel like I can feel the pot smoke in
the air when I listen to the music.
Speaker 1 (40:04):
That's my fiance, Paul. It's say, it's like fish and
Grateful Dead. Yeah, and it's funny. But the music, the
music and the comedy those aren't what I call in
a book that I wrote called I Suck at relationships.
So you don't have to fundamental differences. I believe you
can't have fundamental differences by and large, like the things
(40:25):
that were you know, just like you said, the way
you parent money, things like that, like values, core values.
And then the last question is what was your rose
and your thorn of your career?
Speaker 3 (40:37):
Ooh, I think the rose continues to be the rose,
which is I.
Speaker 2 (40:46):
For whatever reason, I have been able to plant my
flag in the comedy world and the drama world, and
I also have not been pigeonholed in that I can
do funny commercials for Direct TV, and I can do
(41:08):
a serious drama in the West End in London, and
I can produce and do a game show.
Speaker 3 (41:16):
I can.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
I kind of get to do whatever. I can write
best selling books, I can. I could kind of do
whatever I think is interesting and that I'm going to
learn from without it bumping people, when people saying what
the hell and people accepting it. So to me, that's
the that's if there's a rose, that's the rose and
(41:38):
the thorn.
Speaker 3 (41:41):
Probably.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
I mean, I'm such an optimist it's hard for me
to even think of what the thorn is, I don't know.
I think the thorn is more systemic, and I think
the thorn is just that the business is so much
harder than it's ever been.
Speaker 3 (41:58):
It's it's it's harder on every level.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
And you work hard because it's just who you are.
You're not necessarily working towards something like you're just always
setting new goals and you just like to work. It's
the journey.
Speaker 3 (42:10):
It's it's for sure the journey.
Speaker 2 (42:12):
I mean, I think the minute you thinking go, ah,
well I've done it, or well i've really I don't.
I never allow myself to I feel exactly the same
as I did at the beginning of my career. Other
than I also will allow myself to look back and
(42:32):
see how far I've come.
Speaker 1 (42:34):
We're the same age. I think you got a second
wind because I got a second wind. Like sometimes you
think maybe it's a little exhausting and I want to
rest a little, and I maybe near done. And I
don't know if that's like self defense or something, you
know what, any self protection. But I've caught a big
wind and it feels good. And I think it's this age.
You know, it's like not a midlife crisis. It's just
like a reinvigoration and really fine tuning, like sharpening the
(42:58):
knife so you don't have to waste time. I'm swimming
with your arms and legs, wasting all this energy. You're
like right hooked in.
Speaker 3 (43:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
The other thing is I don't. I definitely experience and
and and and life has gotten me to a place
where I also really know where I'm valuable and what
my value is.
Speaker 3 (43:20):
I'm not.
Speaker 2 (43:20):
I'm not suffering fools anymore anymore. I really did, and
and I know even though I'm super diverse and what
I'm interested in, I also know my lane, if.
Speaker 3 (43:31):
That makes any sense.
Speaker 2 (43:32):
Yeah, I kind of a counterintuitive, but but but I
really know, like where what moves the needle for me.
Speaker 1 (43:41):
Well that's kind of what I mean. You don't need
to fuck around and waste time, like you know what
you're supposed to do. You'll take chances if you're inspired.
But like it's a quality versus quantity model. Yeah, I
love it. I love meeting you, talking to you and
knowing you and versa. Really, so we're friends now. And
when I'm in Santa Barbara, I'm coming over.
Speaker 2 (44:00):
Yeah, I'll show you. I'll show you the real estate.
I mean we need, yes, you need, as they say,
a footprint over here.
Speaker 1 (44:07):
I think, yes, I do. I love it. My daughter
loves it. So so amazing talking to you. Thank you
for having me on your show, and thank you for
coming online. And give my love to your family.
Speaker 3 (44:17):
I will. And this is great. It was. It was
so fun to be a guest.
Speaker 1 (44:21):
It's different for you.
Speaker 3 (44:23):
Oh my god, it's this is this is the best.
Speaker 1 (44:25):
I mean, you're a good guest. You're a very good guest.
Speaker 3 (44:28):
Oh good. Yeah, I haven't lost it by being a
host for so long.
Speaker 2 (44:32):
Now.
Speaker 1 (44:32):
No, you're a very good host and you're a very
good guest. So that's awesome. Yeah, really good. That's why
I wanted to talk forever. You're just a very good guests.
So thank you for talking to me.
Speaker 3 (44:42):
Thank you. It's great being here.
Speaker 1 (44:44):
I was on Rob Low's podcast and I really liked him.
He's a good talker, he's a good listener. He's evolved,
he is emotionally intelligent, he is a hard worker, he's
very inspirational, and I really really enjoyed doing his podcast.
(45:04):
And I'm honored and humbled that he wanted to do mine,
you know, as a result of that conversation, because I
do think that sometimes people think I'm just some nitwit
reality star, and there are just some times that people
come on and I feel like I'm not worthy. And
it was exciting to have him on, and I thought
he was extraordinary, as good a guest as he as
(45:27):
a host.
My guest today is actor, filmmaker and podcast host Rob Low.
You may know him from The West Wing and Saint
Elmo's Fire by the Way iconic show and movie, but
today Rob is the star of Fox's nine one one
Lone Star and host of Literally with Rob Low. This
is just me with Rob Low. Let's get into it. Hi,
(00:36):
So I talk to you. A lot of people commented
on me doing your show, like, isn't it funny the
types of people that come out of the woodwork when
you do different things and then you realize why you
do different things.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Yes, I'm so. I'm so interested to know you did
my podcast Literally and you were great. I had a
great talk with you. What was the reaction on your end?
Speaker 1 (00:58):
The reaction was great. But like I said, from different
people that I don't you know, you're always marketing to
the same audience because they're your audience. And so that's why,
that's why the model of podcasts and doing different types
of things and having different people on yours does really
work because different like random like David Lasher who was
Vinnie from Blossom, was like I listened to you on
(01:19):
Rob Blows. I'm like what, Like it was just so
weird all of it. I was like, oh, and he's like,
I loved what you said. It was so inspirational, and
he I know him, and he's like, I didn't even
know your story, so you know, it hit differently, which
is which is nice, which says a lot about about
you and the combination of us who are in a
similar generation but speaking to some similar people. And then
(01:41):
I'm sure you know different people. But I enjoyed it.
I felt like I know you now. And and I
was in Santa Barbara recently and I felt like, I, yeah,
I know Roblo. I'm in Barbara, I have friends here.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Well it's well, that's I love hearing that, and I
It's It's true, isn't it?
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Like it is always interesting.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
To me when we are out giving interviews or selling.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
A product or movie or TV or whatever.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Who is watching or listening to what? It's endlessly fascinating
to me.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Yeah. I mean, I really do think that if I'm
not a person who likes unsolicited advice or visits, but
if I were that person, and I feel like if
I knocked on your door, you'd be like, hey, come
on in. I feel like we're friends now.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
So I'm already feeling bad that you didn't say, Hey,
I'm in Santa Barbara, let's get coffee.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
I think I message on Instagram, but I don't know
if you got it.
Speaker 3 (02:36):
I forget if, like you know my Instagram.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
I it's like I'm not as good as following the
comments maybe as I should be.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
Yeah, No, I don't believe me. I mean I went
with my daughter. We stayed at Calamy Goes Ranch and
Malibu and then drove for the day.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
What's it like to stay there?
Speaker 1 (02:57):
So Mark Gervitz is a power comedy manager who lives
in Malibi, like deep Malibu. There's Malibu and then there's
like deeper Malibu. And I was going to an event
at his house to see Adam Sandler and a bunch
of people, and I wanted to have a staycation versus
stay in La where you're going to transact and you're
going to be in the business of show and I
didn't want. I wanted to be on a vacation and
(03:17):
feel like I could go to the beach. And Malibu
is different. So we stayed at this place, Kalamigos Ranch,
which is like very ranchy and very malibuish and very
cowboy budhish and rustic and different than most of La
And everybody that I've told that I stayed there was like, oh, yeah, no,
I've never stayed there or I've never been there, and
(03:39):
I was like, what do you mean It's it was shocking. Yeah,
So I loved.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
It when I was a kid, when I was in
junior high that everybody went to summer camp at Kalamigos Ranch. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:50):
Oh, it's been different things.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
It's been a proper ranch and that it's been defunct
and then it's been revitalized.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
But it's I've never stayed there.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
So then we went to your town, and I love
You're in Santa I love that town of Santa Barbara.
I've been to Monacito and we did that, but like
that street in Santa Barbara with all those pianos on,
it was amazing.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
I know, right, they've shut since COVID, they shut down
State Street and it's now like a you know, a plaza,
walking plaza. It's Those are two of my favorite places
in Alibu, and Montecito and Santa Barbara three of my favorite,
I should say.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
Likewise, Okay, so I've done a little bit of reading
about you and I had always peripherally gotten a sense
of you, like I knew you married a makeup artist
or your makeup artist, and I was sadly jealous at
the time, and I was just thinking like, why her
not me? And I didn't even know you, So that
was this good reason why we didn't know each other.
(04:53):
So you got We talked on your podcasts about this
a little bit. But you you started in you were
in Ohio and and then you went to la or
you started in Virginia.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Yeah, I was.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
I was born in Charlottesville, where my dad was had
just graduated from law school, and then they, my mother
and my dad moved to Dayton and that's where I
had my childhood. My proper you know, from six months
old to twelve was in Dayton. So I got a
real Midwestern childhood. And then my mom and dad divorced
(05:26):
and we ended up in directly from Dayton to Point
Doom in Malibu, which was like going to Mars.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Wow, that's a Fred Hayman from Georgio, Beverly Hills. I
planned and organized his wedding and so that was my
first experience at Point Doom.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Point Doom is there's Malibu and then there's Point Doom.
It's a whole different vibe very and my great obsession
is I want to do a movie or miniseries or
book about what life was like in Malibu but on
Point Doom, in particular in the mid to late seventies,
because it was.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
Not wait so hold on, I was staying when you
went down to the left was Paradise Cove And then
to the Point Doom is not in Malibu. It's like
its own thing.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
No, it's a part of Malibu, but it's it's it's
because it's a point Okay, it's it's its own neighborhood.
It's it's you know, it's not on the pch like
everything else is. And uh, it's it's just a weird
I don't know if it's the Indian Shoemash mojo there,
(06:40):
but it's both really exciting and interesting and really dark
and weird all at the same time.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Is are there are there reservations there? No?
Speaker 2 (06:49):
But it's okay, But it's all real shoemash you know,
the original you know, people of the area.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
It's it's very viby in that way. Lots of arrowheads
and history.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
What high school did you go to There.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Was no high school in Malibu then there is now,
and we had to take the bus twenty two miles
to Santa Monica to go to high school.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
So you went to Santa Monica High School. Wow, okay,
so you really But I mean, starting at twelve, you
kind of really are a California boy and you really
never left that sphere, Like you're not that far from
there now. I mean, you're in that vibe too. There's
a Malibu vibe, and I feel like Santa Barbara is
like a Malibu adjacent vibe, having spent that weekend wanting
to go that way versus go the other way into La.
Speaker 3 (07:38):
Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
And again when Malibu when I moved there, it was
not a show business enclave it is now. There was
a time, you know, I would say in the early
eighties when the studio executives and the agents.
Speaker 3 (07:51):
All moved out there.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
But when I grew up there, it's what Santa Barbara
and Montecito were when I moved up here, which is
super rural. People ride their horses down the street. Wow,
not a company town. You get all walks of life
when you like, you know, if I'm coaching Little League
I'm you know, there's the dad's work in every line
(08:16):
of work you could imagine, and they're not all in
show business. So it's it's just I'm attracted to a
little bit of more diversity of thought and of experience.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
And moving your kids to Santa Barbara when they were
at an age where things are more influential. That was
obviously intentional. Is that because of your Midwestern roots, like
you just wanted to feel some version of that.
Speaker 3 (08:43):
Yeah, I wanted. I wanted them to be able to
be outside a lot.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
I wanted I wanted, you know, up here we could
we could go to the beach, maybe take a hike,
go to the zoo, and go to a movie. We
could do that all in one day up here and
in la As, you know, that's you could do one
of them right in a day. And if you're in
(09:07):
Malibu you can really.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
Only do one of them.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
And where's your wife from.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
She's a born and bred valley girl.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
She's a valley girl, Okay.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
And Vally, they're very she is a valley girl, you know, Hollywood.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
She grew up in both areas.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
So you dragged her.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
I dragged her, Oh, I dragged her.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
She dragged her.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Yeah, she was not having it.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
I had a real vision though, of I mean, every
once in a while I have a I have a
vision of what I want to do, not all the time,
but every once in a while, and I really was like,
this is really right for us, and I mean it's
one of the smartest things that we ever did as
a family, was was was move up here both I
mean in terms of our lifestyle, what it did for
(09:53):
our relationships, for our marriage, for our kids, and financially,
As it turns out, more than anything, I've done better
in real estate in Montecito than I've done in my
entertainment career.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
That's what I was. The next question I was gonna
ask is did you invest in? You invest early?
Speaker 3 (10:08):
Yep?
Speaker 2 (10:09):
I did years ago yep, and Monacito became only just
continued to become more attractive.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
And then between.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
People being able to work from home, the rise of Zoom,
the experience of COVID and a big hotel opening up
the Miramar that brought people from all over the world
to see it, and Megan and Harry moving in, all
of those things turned Monacito into another version of the Hamptons,
(10:48):
which it never was.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
You said last time, and I spoke to you that
you don't. I don't think you consider yourself a very
good business person?
Speaker 4 (10:54):
Or do you?
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Or do you?
Speaker 2 (10:56):
It depends. I definitely consider myself a business person, for sure.
Speaker 1 (10:59):
You do, so, okay, yeah, for sure, Like you are
thinking business first, You're marketing your business, You're you have
a chessboard that you're working in your mind.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
I mean, it doesn't supersede my creative but I like
to think that I can get them both to exist
equally within me and neither one is a detriment to
the other.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
And who So when you started making money acting, you
started investing or that was just you buying your personal property,
Like what was your business trajectory it was?
Speaker 2 (11:31):
It was really just buying the personal property, really and
then you know, selling it and you know, doing well
and moving up the ladder, and then selling that and
doing well and then starting to invest in other areas
of real estate, which is really and I got to
give my wife credit.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
She has really been the impetus.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
Behind that, behind the investing in other real estate.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
In real estate period. She's got an.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
Amazing, amazing sniffer for.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
Real estate, the vision of what something could be yes insane.
Speaker 3 (12:08):
Yeah, we're just insane.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
I love that and I've done that personally a lot,
and it was almost unintentional. But during the pandemic, I
flipped three places and I never I was thinking about
you talking about your personal real estate for people who
are thinking about business in different ways. For me, anytime
I go to look at something, I always think about,
even if it's for an investment, if I would live there,
(12:31):
Because if the shit hits the fan and you have
five different pieces on the board, you could sell four
and you'd be willing to live in any of them,
like they all work for you. I like that freedom
of thought where I like that, but if I end
up not liking it, like a place on the water,
maybe I don't know what it's like to live on
the water, but I fantasize about it. I just bought
a place, but I know I could move it or
(12:51):
rent it. I like to be nimble and the pieces
like that.
Speaker 3 (12:54):
Yeah, and for us, the straight investment real estate is
new ish.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
And you know we we we weren't flippers, and I
don't we're not.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
Our homes are our homes and we live in them.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
And but we've just had those those things where people
have said, you know, we'd like to buy it, and
you name the price, and I go, you know what
I'm gonna At the end of the day, I'm still
an actor for hire. I sort of a fiduciary responsibility
to my family to to say yes to this. But
(13:32):
it's not like I'm I ever build any home to.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
Flip it, right, I understand, but your but your wife
is probably thinking of things being somewhat not neutral. But
I think people think about that in design too. You know,
you're not putting like crocodile walls because you never know
what could happen if someone knocks on the door.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
Oh yeah, Willison, for sure.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
And I think it's one of the reasons we have
been able to do what we do is when we
we just found a big, an amazing piece of property.
It's a legacy property, been around since eighteen seventy seven.
And when you have something like that, you have to
build something on it that's equal to the property.
Speaker 3 (14:08):
And if you don't, then you're actually taking money off
the table. So it's a weird thing.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
You're going to spend more, but you're actually making more
than if you you know, you know what I mean
it's like, yes, you got if you've.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
Got to, you got to.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
If you're gonna do it, you're gonna do it.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
Yeah, exactly, you gotta do it right.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Yeah, I live on a house it's seventeen forty three
on a property with an apple orchard, and like I
don't mess around with the original wood in the house
or like I just I you have to honor it.
This is what you're saying. You're honoring. You're not gonna
like spec house it up on eighteen hundred's property. So
(14:54):
you've done well, You've made money and in show business
and in real estate. How do you I know you're
you have and that you wanted to move them there
for them to have this sort of balance and be grounded.
How do you raise rich kids? Because I've talked to
more Cuban about this, I've talked to myself about this
and has it worked and your kids, you know, well
(15:15):
adjusted work for themselves? Like did you do this? Did
you nail it?
Speaker 3 (15:19):
Well?
Speaker 2 (15:19):
First of all, you know it's all relative. Even what
is rich, right is relative? You know, Mark Cuban's got
more money than you.
Speaker 3 (15:27):
I do.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
No, But but even the gay he still doesn't want
really really really asshole spoiled kids. So he's harder for
him because he's flying on a private plane. We're flying
first class. So like at your level, I guess you know, And.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Well, first of all, I think my kids, if you
ask them, they legitimately would not consider themselves.
Speaker 3 (15:52):
Rich.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
Legit, that's not in the ethos, Like they know they
have this trust fund or they know that when I
know people like this, I've worked with people like who
know that when their dad or mom kicks the bucket
or when grandpa kicks the bucket, they're coming into you know,
a lot of money. They and they you know, it's
always out there in their lives. Obviously, that's not my family.
(16:16):
I think that they grew up thinking and having certainly
the experience of being not any different than a lot
of the other kids. Other than you know, maybe the
vacations were nicer, and you know, like you said, maybe
we flew more often. But I tried to give them
(16:39):
a really normal sixtent I could upbringing. I think the
thing that makes it really different is the fame part
of it.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
Oh interesting, okay, right right.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Because you know, you can be worth four billion dollars
and you can walk into a restaurant and nobody knows
who you are, and you can be worth, you know,
four hundred thousand dollars and walk into a restaurant and
it stops dead in its tracks. So it's a funny.
It's a funny thing. So I really think there's the
how do you deal with with money? And then there's
(17:10):
how do you deal with being in a family that
is in the public eye?
Speaker 1 (17:16):
And are you just are you insular you're not out
that much? Or you live in a place where no
one cares? And you know, what's it like when you're
with them in La Do they care? Do they What
is that like in your house? Fame? And is your
wife annoyed by it?
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Well, the thing is the one of the reasons I
consciously moved out of LA was I didn't want my
kids growing up, you know, around paparazzi and and and
and where the currency of the realm is your fame,
(17:50):
and that just is what it is in La There's
no way to skin that cat.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
When I grew up in.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
Malibu, there were there were horses at the hitching posts
at the market. They're gone and they're replaced with paparazzi,
staking people out, which wasn't there. So I tried I
recreated it, and so they just didn't. They'd come home
(18:16):
and go Dad. They'd visit a friend in Melibou.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
Dad. They had a screening room. We watched a movie
there and Jim Carrey came over and they're talking like
they're from you know, Ohio, right, you know, and and that,
and I was like, yeah, that's good. They should be.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
They should you have stars in their eyes like that
and feel that way. And you know, my other my son,
who is the actor, didn't start out that way. He
started out as a a stem cell scientist and went
to Stanford and then came out and decided he wanted
to be an actor and a writer.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
And of course I was that was not a happy
day for me. I was like, I had a molecular
biologist an actor.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
My daughter kind of acts like when she went from
this public school to this private school, she acted like
she was sort of on scholarship. She was like, oh
my god, mom, they give free art supplies and she
was so excited. And I think that's because, you know,
just because I buy things that I want or I
worked hard to get all this, it doesn't mean it's
a free for all, and I have all these rules
(19:23):
that you know, if you really want something, you have
to give something up or you have to work for it.
And it is a discipline, like I do really work
really hard, and I do have to pull on the
reins a lot, and I like that. I think it's
like it feels like a project, Like your kids are
the best possible project. It's you get such a ROI
on the time you invest in them and these kind
(19:44):
of principles, and you can be struggling financially and have
spoiled kids.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
For sure, entitled spoiled. You know, it happens, It can
happen to it can happen to kids anywhere.
Speaker 3 (19:59):
Yeah, really it really absolutely.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
Entitlement is I think the worst, the worst element of it.
But I also think that they take their cues from
their parents. And you know, I work my ass.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
Off and and so yeah, so.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Does Cheryl Oh. I mean she, I mean she literally
this week flew to Washington for her jewelry business, came
home last night, flew to Arizona and came home and
she's out there on the floor selling Neiman Marcus, doing
her thing.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
It's like she's have to do that no, but yeah,
and have you ever like, was there? It's my turn
in your relationship because it's been very much about you
and your career. Was there. It's my turn after her,
you know, helping you raise the kids and all that.
Or it's just always been an ebb and flow.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
It's always been that way. I mean, one of the
reasons I married her was she had this and remains.
She has the strongest work ethic of anybody I've ever known.
And that's saying something because mine is strong. And so
whether it's raising the raising the kids, or starting a
makeup line, or or building the homes that we have,
(21:14):
or the or then she had, she also has from
time to time built for other people.
Speaker 3 (21:20):
She always has always worked, she will always work.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
Interesting and so your work ethic comes from your upbringing
and your family, right.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
Yeah, But part of it I think is listen, I
think part of its genetic because my mom was sort
of very artsy and not really a worker. My dad
is eighty four and still goes into the office, uh
you know, uh practices law. My grandpa, who is very
(21:54):
close to my mom's side, just a eighth grade education,
you know, it became the first millionaire in his city,
you know, so it's it's kind of I think it's
kind of in the DNA a little bit.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Maybe, So you were always working your ass off, like
you're working as hard as you were when you were younger,
Like you were always this way.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
Paper routes, you know, bus boy. I mean, I did
get fired from every job that I had that wasn't
around show business because I'm not really cut out for
the real world, Bethany.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
But but you're cut out for show business, and well,
I guess real estate, you're cut out for non traditional business.
Speaker 3 (22:37):
Yes, I am. I designed first of all. I had
designed my entire life to try to not deal with math.
And you know, listen.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
That I'm really good on the other side of my
brain and I've I've really learned a lot about I
can get by with numbers, obviously, because you have to
if you're going to be in any kind of a business.
But I avoid it. It's not my jam.
Speaker 3 (22:58):
I don't like it. I appreciate people who do.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
I'm very much a creative person with a you know
what It's like people say, do you sing? It's like
I'm an actor who sings, which is very different than
being a singer.
Speaker 3 (23:14):
Who acts or a singer.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
M h. And it's that way that way with business.
I am a storyteller, entertainer, producer, director who also is
in business.
Speaker 1 (23:27):
Right right right when you were partying, how could you
have that same work ethic or you were just partying
and then you would wake up and you would just
be hurting a little bit. You always had the same
work ethic, just exhausted a little stripped.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Exactly when I'm out of you know, dan seteria at
the Hampton's till you know, four o'clock in the morning
and I got to get up to shoot Masquerade, you
just you suck it up and.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Go, yeah, yeah, I gets that.
Speaker 2 (23:54):
You know. Also it's a little bit of like you
emulate your idols, and you know, my idols today are
really really different than they were then.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
But then you know, it.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Was like Jack Nicholson Man, he's out partying on he's
at the Roxy, you know, the shades on at two am,
and then he's on the set of the Witches of
east Wick, Man's Courtside of the Laker Games. It lives
up in Mohuland, and he's got seventeen girlfriends. Man.
Speaker 3 (24:23):
Yeah, like that was what I thought was cool.
Speaker 4 (24:25):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
Yeah, in many ways, I don't. The younger generation. I
worry about them, but not in that way. I think
they're more evolved in wanting to feel good and drinking
macha and asai, and whether it all works or not,
I don't know. But they're aware of like well being
in balance where we were not. But I'm the same
as you. It's a prose play, hurt model, tough.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
Shit one to one Honda, same with my same with
my wife. Same and and you know little and John Ohen,
my my acting son. Uh, you know, he's he's very
open about it. He's also sober, and he was the same.
He was like pros play hurt right, work hard, play hard.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Yeah, but yeah, but now it doesn't have to be
it doesn't have to be so exhausting. It's okay to
feel good. So sobriety is a major, major role in.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
Your career and in our family's life, for sure major.
I wouldn't have anything without it, really what it is is,
I think it would have been just the law of
diminishing returns, and I would have been like the frog
that slowly gets boiled alive in.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
The in the in the in the water.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
As you incrementally you know, can't feel it, and just yeah,
that would have been me with my you know, personal
life and career.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
Like death by a thousand paper cuts. It was just like, yeah,
well that's Was it really hard to quit everything or
was it? Like they're different, They're fifty shades of addiction.
I've taken classes on it. And some people our bingers.
Some people are just always in their life. They call
it a French type alcoholic, and some people really hit rock.
So what was your relationship to substances?
Speaker 2 (26:09):
Mine was, I was kind of a periodic, they would say.
And so you're, you know, you're up at Charlie Sheen's
pool and you got your coronas and you're you're working out.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
At the gym.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
You's being tough, and then you have a couple of
coronas and then the next thing you know, you're you know,
you're you're you're looking for the blow or whatever, maybe
because it's nighttime and you go out to and then
you're chasing girls around and you're it's like you're twenty
you're nineteen, twenty twenty one years old.
Speaker 3 (26:38):
And and that was.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
Sort of the vibe for me, and I just at
a certain point realized that I was never going to
have the life I wanted continuing that. And so when
I was ready, I went to Sierra Tucson and and
it was the best thing I ever did.
Speaker 3 (27:02):
And I actually loved being in rehab. I loved it.
I learned so much. I was always a pleasure to
have in class.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
In school, I was in the front. I'm in the
front row raising my hand. That was always me. And
I was the same in rehab. And I learned a
ton And you know, you know, by the grace of God,
I've never had to slip. I've never had to go back.
I got from the minute I got sober, I've stayed sober.
I was thirty three years ago.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
Because you work your ass off, so you work your
ass But is it is it a struggle now or
it's just is what it is?
Speaker 2 (27:37):
Right, it's in my DNA, it's being you know, having
the ism is a struggle because it's like whack a mole. Yeah,
like every decade there's I realized that it's morphed into
something else that I need to look at and like,
right now, this is going to sound insane, but I
know it's driven from the same thing. It's waking up
(28:00):
at midnight and going, you know what, you need to
go to the kitchen and binge on some hogindaws.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
It's noise. The noise is in a different area. Now.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
Yeah, you know, some people it's gambling. Some people it's sex.
Some people it's uh workaholism. Yeah, some people it's overtraining.
I mean it yeah, never goes away. It just moves
and just hopefully it moves into stuff that's less and
less harmful and easier and easier to deal with.
Speaker 1 (28:30):
Mine is organizing and getting rid of. It's obsessive. It's
it's insane. I mean, it's that that's mine.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
Are you a collector or getting get rid of.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
I'm not a hoarder at all, but I Freud would
have a field day with me walking into this accidental
influencer business and everybody sending me everything, and so there's
a curiosity about it. And also I like to purchase.
I'm a purchaser of certain things that I do collect,
and then I just get overwhelmed by that we really
(29:02):
don't need so much and why is this all here?
And I just wanted to you know, But it's definitely
not a hoarders. I have the most organized, the macular
house you could imagine. But it's just I'm just as
too much in coming out going stuff, you know, Like
that's why I wouldn't be good at really being an
interior designer, because it would be too noisy for me
to have like a J. Dart or candles or art.
(29:24):
Like I don't want like a storage facility of any
shit ever. I want it out. So that's a sickness.
Speaker 3 (29:30):
Yeah, No, it's good. I like it.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
Yeah, it's a good one. It's not. It's like working
at It's good because I could come into your house
and organize it and you'd be so happy.
Speaker 2 (29:37):
It's so funny you say that, because again, one of
the things about my wife that I remember, you know,
and I was actively dating big time and she was
among the people that I was seeing, and she came
over and organized my coffee table, the books on my
coffee table. As long as I live, no one else
(30:00):
done that.
Speaker 1 (30:00):
That's nice.
Speaker 3 (30:01):
No one else's never done that.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
That's hilarious. Well, your marriage is a big part of
your identity too, and you seem to be pretty good
at it. No marriage is perfect, But I'm asking if like,
you've had serious bumps to make us all feel better
about our miserable lives, or have you not?
Speaker 2 (30:19):
And this is one of the reasons why, you know,
to the extent that I ever hesitate to talk about it.
The temptation is that, oh, well, it must be perfect,
and well, sure, anybody can be married for thirty three
years if it's perfect and there aren't any struggles or
you know, and that's not the case.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
I mean, it just isn't, you know.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Every it's it's no different than a long career. If
you are in a long marriage or if you're in
a long career, by definition, you're going to have those
fallow periods because nothing in life remains the same. Nothing nothing, nothing, nothing,
(31:00):
stock market, business relationships, they all have their ups and downs.
And I think the difference is both in careers and marriages,
is how you react when they're down.
Speaker 1 (31:11):
And that's an amazing point.
Speaker 2 (31:12):
And that's the difference. That is literally the difference in
a long career, short career, or a long marriage or
a short marriage is what do you do?
Speaker 3 (31:20):
Do you run? Do you blame? Can you live in acceptance?
Can you change?
Speaker 2 (31:26):
Can the other person change? Can you forgive? Can you
take responsibility all of those things, and a lot of
people can't do any of them.
Speaker 1 (31:35):
It's a great point. And do you lean in and
be like all right, let's let's work this thing through,
or like you.
Speaker 3 (31:40):
Said, we work hard.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
Listen, we do marriage therapy even when we don't quote
unquote need it.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
You want to lock the door so you don't get robbed.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
So yeah, and it's like it's like you too, it's
to you send your car and to get tuned up.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
So true, it's such a that's a great that's such
a that's that's that's really a great note. And so
you've had some serious roadblocks, like you've been canceled in
a time when people didn't even get canceled. And I've
thought about not even since meeting you, I've thought about
that in my life. I don't know why that. I
don't believe that would even be on the board for
(32:17):
cancelation as long like things hit differently back then, and
so it was look bad to me overall. On a
one to ten of like your career being stratospheric, I
envisioned it that your career was stratospheric. You hit a
brick wall and then you were not present for a while,
and then all of a sudden you started to slowly
(32:39):
come back in different types of things. That's how I
perceive it. So how accurate is that.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
I would say that that's pretty accurate. I would say
that there are two things that I think that that
add to it a little more context. One is I
actually think that in many ways, my ill fated appearance
(33:07):
on the Academy Awards.
Speaker 3 (33:10):
Did as much damage.
Speaker 2 (33:12):
I was asked to open the Academy Awards and to
do a song with snow White, and it felt like
a really good idea at.
Speaker 3 (33:23):
The time, and it was a terrible idea.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
It was a badly conceived It was supposed to be silly,
and people hated it. And then I think it Then
post all of that, I got sober, went away to rehab,
got serious with my wife, got married, moved out of LA.
Speaker 3 (33:51):
Started having kids.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
So I was, I mean, I'm sure it was a
sort of a mutual decision in terms of Hollywood and.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
Me, Like I was.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
I look, I spent the eighties dealing work, building my career,
and I spent the nineties building myself.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
Wow. So you so it was the bestest thing that
ever happened to.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
You in ways not in ways, It was the best
thing that ever happened to me, full stop.
Speaker 1 (34:22):
Do you feel like you were so like it was
it was almost like a self fulfilling prophecy to fail.
You feel like you were reckless and like kind of
looking for something you were looking for a while to hit.
Speaker 3 (34:31):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
No, I absolutely remember feeling like, like, you know, it's
it's it's it's the uh, the criminal that that once
wants to be arrested.
Speaker 3 (34:43):
Stop.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
Wow. So so you were you You weren't like, oh fuck,
my career is over because you take that kind of
make that kind of change. Did you have a backup
plan or did you know you have enough control over
who you are and that you're robblow and that you
can come back when you decide, Because most people like
you said, if someone knocks on the door, you're going
to sell your house. If you go away, you could
be obsolete in the entertainment industry.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
I never thought about it in that way.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
And then I because all I was thinking about at
the time when I was getting sober was it's time
for me. I'm getting I'm doing this for me. I'm
not doing it for my career. I'm not doing it
for public consumption. I'm not doing it to stay together
with my then girlfriend Cheryl, who became my wife. I
(35:32):
was doing it for me and it was probably the
first thing that I ever really did just for me ever,
and it was all I could think about. It required
everything and anything else that bubbled up around.
Speaker 3 (35:45):
It, like what about my career? What about it? I
was like, don't care, right well, let the chips fall
where they may. Who knows I'm.
Speaker 1 (35:52):
Doing It's funny. Matthew McConaughey made a similar I don't
know if you read his book green Light, but he
made a similar decision about like I'm not taking these
like shirtless drom coms, and he stood tight. He just
knew there was a moment when he had to do something,
and that was my moment, was leaving the housewives. As
ridiculous as that sounds, it was millions of dollars, and
it was you know, my business manager said, or my
(36:13):
someone said, trees grow high, they don't grow high to
the sky. Take the millions of dollars right now until
you can't get it anymore. And I made a decision
to intervene, and just like this is like I've got
to reinvent and do everything differently now. And it's a
nice feeling. And people have to be in tune and
aware and courageous enough to do that.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
But we'll also to hear to hear the voice inside
of them and honor that. Yes, you have to be
courageous on top of that to do it.
Speaker 1 (36:39):
What age was that at that you that you did
that twenty six That was young to be making those
kind of big boy decisions to be like getting going
and going to rehabit, getting married.
Speaker 3 (36:48):
That was you?
Speaker 1 (36:49):
You peaked early?
Speaker 2 (36:50):
Well, you know, I I had a lot of life.
I had more life experience than the average twenty six
yearl that's for sure. I'd been more, done more, seen more,
learned more. And but yes, looking back on it, it's
younger than any of my kids are now.
Speaker 1 (37:10):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 3 (37:11):
And I look back on it and go, what the hell?
Speaker 1 (37:13):
So, Lauren Michael's once said to me at dinner he
was talking about somebody else on SNL or something. It
wasn't about me, but I just never forget it. He said,
you have to make an exit to be able to
make an entrance.
Speaker 3 (37:25):
It's such a great It's one of my favorite laurenisms.
Speaker 1 (37:28):
The last two questions I have people have given me
one piece of advice, like I don't fix them, I
fix me, or every day we check in once a day.
These things that I sometimes say, oh god, well I
don't do that, Like what is your thing that you
guys do that seems simple to you but would help
other people in relationships?
Speaker 2 (37:50):
Well, there's two things. The number one thing is, let's
hope you've chosen right to begin with.
Speaker 3 (37:58):
Because.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
Really the die is cast with who you choose, because,
as you allude to in the advice, you can't change
another person.
Speaker 3 (38:11):
Changing yourself is hard.
Speaker 2 (38:14):
It's like Cheryl and I are simpotico on so many things, money, politics,
where we want to go on vacations. Uniforms are not
uniforms in schools.
Speaker 3 (38:31):
I mean you name it.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
Not name the list of from the from the banal
to the really intense. And I am going to be
on the exact same page with her all the time.
Now we happen to disagree on something very important to me. Comedy.
Speaker 3 (38:52):
Cheryl Lowe does not understand comedy.
Speaker 1 (38:56):
She doesn't and what do you mean she doesn't understand
common like she does? She not think you were funny
because I know couples that were one person's funny and
the other person doesn't think they're funny. Does she think
you're funny?
Speaker 3 (39:06):
She's smart enough to know that other people think I'm funny. See, yes,
no she doesn't. She's a horrible laugh for me. She's
a black hole.
Speaker 2 (39:17):
Oh in my one man shows, and it's a it's
a running joke amongst our friends and family.
Speaker 3 (39:24):
So like, by the way, for some people, that would
be a barrier to entry.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
One hundred percent. I'm a comedy snob. And would you
think she is? She funny?
Speaker 3 (39:32):
No? See? Wow, here's another thing.
Speaker 2 (39:35):
And I've had I had, I had one girlfriend in particular.
All we did was laugh. It was fucking amazing. But
you know what, it's it's fine, It's it's she would
have been, by the way, a terrible wife and a
terrible life partner, right, you know.
Speaker 3 (39:56):
She just doesn't like Bruce Springsteen and her music.
Speaker 2 (40:00):
I feel like I can feel the pot smoke in
the air when I listen to the music.
Speaker 1 (40:04):
That's my fiance, Paul. It's say, it's like fish and
Grateful Dead. Yeah, and it's funny. But the music, the
music and the comedy those aren't what I call in
a book that I wrote called I Suck at relationships.
So you don't have to fundamental differences. I believe you
can't have fundamental differences by and large, like the things
(40:25):
that were you know, just like you said, the way
you parent money, things like that, like values, core values.
And then the last question is what was your rose
and your thorn of your career?
Speaker 3 (40:37):
Ooh, I think the rose continues to be the rose,
which is I.
Speaker 2 (40:46):
For whatever reason, I have been able to plant my
flag in the comedy world and the drama world, and
I also have not been pigeonholed in that I can
do funny commercials for Direct TV, and I can do
(41:08):
a serious drama in the West End in London, and
I can produce and do a game show.
Speaker 3 (41:16):
I can.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
I kind of get to do whatever. I can write
best selling books, I can. I could kind of do
whatever I think is interesting and that I'm going to
learn from without it bumping people, when people saying what
the hell and people accepting it. So to me, that's
the that's if there's a rose, that's the rose and
(41:38):
the thorn.
Speaker 3 (41:41):
Probably.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
I mean, I'm such an optimist it's hard for me
to even think of what the thorn is, I don't know.
I think the thorn is more systemic, and I think
the thorn is just that the business is so much
harder than it's ever been.
Speaker 3 (41:58):
It's it's it's harder on every level.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
And you work hard because it's just who you are.
You're not necessarily working towards something like you're just always
setting new goals and you just like to work. It's
the journey.
Speaker 3 (42:10):
It's it's for sure the journey.
Speaker 2 (42:12):
I mean, I think the minute you thinking go, ah,
well I've done it, or well i've really I don't.
I never allow myself to I feel exactly the same
as I did at the beginning of my career. Other
than I also will allow myself to look back and
(42:32):
see how far I've come.
Speaker 1 (42:34):
We're the same age. I think you got a second
wind because I got a second wind. Like sometimes you
think maybe it's a little exhausting and I want to
rest a little, and I maybe near done. And I
don't know if that's like self defense or something, you
know what, any self protection. But I've caught a big
wind and it feels good. And I think it's this age.
You know, it's like not a midlife crisis. It's just
like a reinvigoration and really fine tuning, like sharpening the
(42:58):
knife so you don't have to waste time. I'm swimming
with your arms and legs, wasting all this energy. You're
like right hooked in.
Speaker 3 (43:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
The other thing is I don't. I definitely experience and
and and and life has gotten me to a place
where I also really know where I'm valuable and what
my value is.
Speaker 3 (43:20):
I'm not.
Speaker 2 (43:20):
I'm not suffering fools anymore anymore. I really did, and
and I know even though I'm super diverse and what
I'm interested in, I also know my lane, if.
Speaker 3 (43:31):
That makes any sense.
Speaker 2 (43:32):
Yeah, I kind of a counterintuitive, but but but I
really know, like where what moves the needle for me.
Speaker 1 (43:41):
Well that's kind of what I mean. You don't need
to fuck around and waste time, like you know what
you're supposed to do. You'll take chances if you're inspired.
But like it's a quality versus quantity model. Yeah, I
love it. I love meeting you, talking to you and
knowing you and versa. Really, so we're friends now. And
when I'm in Santa Barbara, I'm coming over.
Speaker 2 (44:00):
Yeah, I'll show you. I'll show you the real estate.
I mean we need, yes, you need, as they say,
a footprint over here.
Speaker 1 (44:07):
I think, yes, I do. I love it. My daughter
loves it. So so amazing talking to you. Thank you
for having me on your show, and thank you for
coming online. And give my love to your family.
Speaker 3 (44:17):
I will. And this is great. It was. It was
so fun to be a guest.
Speaker 1 (44:21):
It's different for you.
Speaker 3 (44:23):
Oh my god, it's this is this is the best.
Speaker 1 (44:25):
I mean, you're a good guest. You're a very good guest.
Speaker 3 (44:28):
Oh good. Yeah, I haven't lost it by being a
host for so long.
Speaker 2 (44:32):
Now.
Speaker 1 (44:32):
No, you're a very good host and you're a very
good guest. So that's awesome. Yeah, really good. That's why
I wanted to talk forever. You're just a very good guests.
So thank you for talking to me.
Speaker 3 (44:42):
Thank you. It's great being here.
Speaker 1 (44:44):
I was on Rob Low's podcast and I really liked him.
He's a good talker, he's a good listener. He's evolved,
he is emotionally intelligent, he is a hard worker, he's
very inspirational, and I really really enjoyed doing his podcast.
(45:04):
And I'm honored and humbled that he wanted to do mine,
you know, as a result of that conversation, because I
do think that sometimes people think I'm just some nitwit
reality star, and there are just some times that people
come on and I feel like I'm not worthy. And
it was exciting to have him on, and I thought
he was extraordinary, as good a guest as he as
(45:27):
a host.
Host
Bethenny Frankel
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