October 29, 2018 • 45 mins
In this week's episode of "Katie's Crib," Katie sat down for a one-on-one conversation with Dr. Shefali Tsabary, a clinical psychologist and the acclaimed author of "The Conscious Parent." Katie and Dr. Shefali talk about Dr. Shefali's philosophy and what it means to be a conscious parent. They also get into Katie's own experiences as a mom, and what important life lessons parents can learn from their children.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hi, everybody, and welcome to Katie's Crib. This is this
is just a very very very special episode. This is
a special episode. We have one guest and one guest only,
and her name is Dr Safali Sabari and she is
a clinical psychologist who specializes in the integration of Eastern
philosophy and Western psychology. She is the author of three books,
(00:27):
The Conscious Parent, out of Control, and The Awakened Family.
Here's how I came to know her. I got pregnant
on Scandal. I went to Carrie Washington, who, as we know,
is the most incredible actress, mother activist. I mean, the
girl is just incredible. And I said, oh my gosh,
I'm sitting here amongst piles of how to parent books
and I don't know what to do, and I'm very overwhelmed,
(00:48):
and I'm pregnant. And CARRY said, if you're going to
read one book, and only one book, it has to
be The Conscious Parent. And the book blew my mind.
And I am sitting now across from you, staring into
your gorgeous eyes in Great neck Long Island, you guys,
which is literally the town next to where I grew
up in nor Washington. Um, thank you. So much for
(01:10):
being here. Of course it is. It's such an honor
to meet you. I am a super fan. Um. So
this book The Conscious Parent that you guys run, don't walk,
um to read? What is the Conscious Parent? That's? What
is that? The first question you get from everybody. Sure,
And then I get an indignant affirmation from these parents
(01:33):
saying I'm conscious. I'm already conscious. So then we have
to deconstruct what consciousness really means. And I'll just tell
you a little bit about the inspiration behind the Conscious Parent.
You know, having been a meditator for almost fifteen years
before I had a child, I was exposed to the
(01:56):
concept that we have this thing called the ego. And
this ego is a false self, a false persona that
gets created because our intrinsic, innate self was never seen, heard, understood,
or validated by our parents. And all of us had
very unconscious parents, so they pass on this unconsciousness to us,
(02:18):
and because we want to preserve and thrive and survive,
we create this false self called the ego. Now, the
ego is not who we truly are, and we talked
about who we truly are. It's the things we think
we should be which society tells us. Culture tells us,
So we should be beautiful, we should be skinny, we
should be tall, we should be short, whatever it is,
(02:39):
the flavor of the culture's day, whichever culture, whatever, the
the most exalted qualities are. So we grow up thriving
to be that in order to feel validated. And it's
this thirst to fill the inner self that actually propels
most of our life. And we don't realize that we're
(03:01):
doing things because we're hungry, and it's coming from lack
and which is really fair, And so we're not doing
things because it's truly us. We're doing things because we
think we should. And having children is one of them,
getting married is another. All of these prescriptions one after
the other. And so then we have kids, and then
(03:23):
we think we're having kids because the kids wanted to
be saved from wherever hell they were at, but it's
not true. They were fine wherever they were at. We
think we should have kids because we have it on
our checklist, because it's one more thing we think we
should do um and of course we want to have kids,
but I don't know how many of us really deconstruct.
So then consciousness becomes about really becoming aware of who
(03:48):
it is you are and who it is you've been
playing all these roles you've been playing because you really can't.
You cannot raise a con just child unless you, yourself
are conscious. Yeah, this has nothing to do with the child.
This is okay. So the word all has to do
with me. I knew. And the conscious is about you
(04:10):
realizing that you have been playing to your false self,
and you've been raising a false self within you, And
if you don't become conscious of that, you will then
negate and dismiss and eviscerate the true self and the child,
and raise the child to now play to the tune
of your false self. And this is what we do,
We've been doing for generations. Every generation lives false and
(04:33):
raises false and we have a culture of false right right?
How what is the kind of work that a parent
can do to get to be conscious, to consider them?
You know, if if, if, if I'm going to raise
my son to be a conscious being, and I want
to start with me, which is what it sounds like
I have to do? How do I do that? Yeah?
Well it's there's a simple answer and then a complex answer.
(04:56):
The simple answer is understand that every time you react
to your child, it's because of something that the child
has re evoked in you. So it's not the child's
bad behavior, the child's temper, tantrum, or the child triggering you.
It's because you have an in avoid within that gets
awakened and triggered by your child. So it's all you.
(05:19):
So that's the simple answer, Okay, to to know it's
all you, at least start turning the spotlight within. And
then the complex answer is you have to undertake a process.
You have to go through a journey. Right, It's like
going to the gym. Do you go one time or
do you commit to a lifestyle? So it's a lifestyle
of awakening, a lifestyle of self help and deconstruction and
(05:42):
healing your childhood wounds. It's it's a lot of work.
When we talk about making a lifestyle change, like it's
the gym, Like that would include what feels right for you, meditation, therapy, yoga.
I don't know or these the types of things that
we're using. I don't know how much you a god necessarily,
but yoga is a great exercise, yes, and it does
(06:04):
bring you into the ground at present moment. But I
think what you What everybody realizes when they have a
child is that the child lives in the present moment
like no other, and we don't. So there's a huge discrepancy,
there's a huge mismatch, misalignment. So we're always out of
sync with our children. If you know, you know, especially infants,
(06:27):
they're so in the moment, and they don't care that
you have a party, They don't care that they just
vomited on your beautiful dress. They teach you to strip
yourself of all those ego attachments I was talking about.
They teach you be in the moment. Mom Who are
you without that? So let go of your party, let
go of your phone, let go and the outfit, all
(06:50):
your machinations in your mind, and focus on me now here.
And because they're so impetuous, they really make you keep
up with them, meaning moment after moment. So all the
spiritual wisdom that you learned through meditation gets applied in parenting.
So when I mean what I mean by a lifestyle changes,
you begin to see that you're not in tune with
(07:10):
your child. If you're an aware of person, and you
begin to see that you're frustrated with your children, not
because of them. But because of your inability to slow down,
drop your agenda, be in the moment, and have the flow,
you might be having like a totally disproportionate reaction to
something small because because you just read an email that
stressed you the hell out something at work. Then they
(07:30):
throw something on the floor and all of a sudden,
you're so piste exactly and it has you know you
are not there with your kid with exactly what they
just did. Correct When many parents are oblivious to the
fact that they're not present, they just presume it's the
kid and they fix the kid, and they blame the kid,
and they shamed the kid. So my work is all
(07:51):
about toppling that paradigm and making the parent have the
onus to turn the spotlight within. No, what is it
about you? How did you react? Why did you react?
It's nothing to do with your child. It's all about
raising yourself. Oh my god, it's all about raising yourself, guys.
But it's complex, yes, but it's for for me. It
(08:13):
really when I read The Conscious Parent, it really took
in some ways the pressure off, because I all of
a sudden felt less responsibility, like I have to teach
him everything. I know because good Lord, I don't know
a lot of stuff, like when he asks me difficult
questions in the future like what is God? Or why
(08:35):
is this person mean to this person? Or something like
there's going to be a lot of times where I
I don't know the answer. I really don't. And there's
a huge topic in your book about you know, my
son is here to teach me. You know, my son
is here to bring me to another level of consciousness.
My son has been born because he's my greatest teacher
um And so it for me that might truss some
(08:57):
people out. For me, I felt incredibly a weightlifted, like
I didn't have this responsibility to teach him the ABC
is and how to divide and also I mean, please
let them learn that stuff. But like whatever I mean,
I was a terrible math student myself. But because you're
an easy going parent and you were okay with giving
up that control, many people aren't. They want the pedestal
(09:19):
of being superior and being the ones who know, and
they want to fix the kid. It's very hard for
them to turn all that onto them and kind of
fix themselves. So but I hear you. It's it's a
relieving message for me too, And many people who get
it say the same thing. A weight is lifted off
my shoulders. This is the only way to parent, because
it is actually the truth is everything in life is
(09:41):
only about us. Nothing is happening to us against us.
Nobody is here to ruin our lives. It's all about
our ability or inability to handle our in her terrain.
And our children show us that more than anything. I mean,
we become one year olds, if they're one year olds,
we become three year olds and they've become five. Know
we're having temper tantrums because we were never raised in
(10:04):
our wholeness. So the moment we lose, we feel like
we're losing control with our children, like they're pressuring us
too much, or there they're too shy or too withdrawn,
or making us look bad in front of our friends.
That's a huge See, that's where I think I'm going
to fail. Is like, see, I can say all this
and it's wonderful to have a one year old, I'll
(10:24):
be is about to be one. I can put my
phone down. There's nothing is wonderful to me. Is like
if I get one hour that I'm not working and
I know that it's going to be a very present
exchange of an hour, like I'm not going to look
at my You know I have this, but but I'm
speaking from a place where it's not that hard yet.
I know that when he gets older and he is
(10:45):
throwing temper tantrum in public, or he's not behaving how
he should be behaving at whatever thing we're at, that's
really where conscious parenting is going to be challenged and
hopefully utilized and and made stronger because it is an opportunity.
But the problem is, what about everyone else raising my son?
(11:07):
How do you work with families where it's very difficult
to get maybe one person on board, but the spouse
isn't on board, or the nanny. I mean, how do
you fashion like this? Right? So just understand that just
because it's your conscious doesn't mean you're not taking action.
So if your kid is throwing a tantrum, you will
still address it, but in a very different way. First,
(11:29):
you won't be reactive. You won't take it personally. Of course,
in your in your head, your your little mind may
get you know, all upset and your ego. Of course
you care in your mind, but you know better as
a conscious to return to the breath, to not take
it personally, and to help your kids through their big feelings,
because children just have big feelings that they don't know
(11:49):
how to deal with, and they need control. They're feeling
out of control, that's all it is. But we get
so threatened by their need for control, then we upper
control and now we have a power struggle. So that's
one thing, and then dealing with unconscious people around you
is extremely hard. So I have always been misunderstood. People
have always told me that I am a bad parent
(12:10):
because I'm not doing things how they think I need
to do it. Oh, always, because they believe in control
and domination and time outs and I don't believe in
any of that. So I look like a loser parent
in front of them, and my kid is out of control?
Is that real? Like response you would get, like if
your daughter was acting out or something wetting her in
a time out? Completely and so completely I've been judged,
(12:36):
maybe just still a few days ago when I don't react.
My daughter was at a party. The police were called.
His fifteen and a half now, But she handled it.
But she handled it so well. However, all her friends
were vomiting and and my husband got upset like usually
sender you you you you, and all I could see
was her strength, Like this was amazing. I was doing
(12:57):
understand what he was talking about. So it's diametrically opposite
from mainstream and it is lonely. But once you get it,
you can't go back, Like I can't go back to
mainstream ever again. So it doesn't matter to me if
I get disapproved or people's scoff or people laughs. Do
you think it's affected your daughter as far as like
is she good at knowing bound? I mean, I'm selfishly
(13:21):
asking for myself because like I'm like, okay, if I'm
choosing to raise Audie in a conscious parents style, what
type of adult is that going to make? But who
have you seen? Like how does it work? But yeah,
but you can't again focus on the other because they
will they will be raised according to the tune of
their authentic destiny. You are here to usher them to
(13:44):
that destiny with love, with support, with presence, but you're
not invested in how they turn out to be. So
I'm really not invested. So for example, it was my say,
was my daughter, I don't care if care not, I
don't care. It's if I care it's my ego that cares,
because my ego would feel good to know she's secure.
(14:05):
But who's to say if her path is If her
path is secuitous and she first wants to be homeless
in a third world country and then, you know, and
then ends up in jail, I don't know. I'm just
being extreme right now. Who's to say that path doesn't
ultimately make her more mother trees and then mother trees.
I don't know, We don't know, you know. So these
(14:25):
are all projection projections, So we do. We don't, of
course take our kids to drugs, and we don't offer
them alcohol. We definitely teach them the ill effects of
everything and the blessings of living. It's not about being
less a fair It's about having wisdom and the detachment
of your ego in their life. Their life is their life.
(14:48):
So say my daughter had called and she had been vomiting,
then I would look at it as an opportunity to
re educate, to rehall, to reconnect. Everything is an opportunity
to come back to center. So fear is not the
response you see, and fear is the typical response of
the typical parent. I refuse to go into fear now,
do I get scared sometimes? Of course. Do I caution
(15:09):
her all the time, of course, But I won't be
trapped in fear, and her future will certainly not be
my obsession. My future will be my obsession because I
need to fix myself. If I embody consciousness, that's the
best thing I can do for everyone around me. Now,
she chooses to wake up to it, she chooses to
embrace it, or she chooses to experiment in some other way.
(15:31):
I'm here for her on her life path. So this
is the philosophy, you know, the way here spirits ushering spirits.
They just happen to be smaller and less mighty. But
my daughter is more strong than me. Yes, she can
like you're not here to write, and you're here to
usher alongside them and to lovingly and spiritual guide them.
(15:52):
But you're not here to to control their life. And
I don't want her to live a controlled, prescribed life.
I wanted to if mistake filled, unordinary, non traditional, fully experimented,
fully alive, fully well lived life, I don't want to.
I've not given her prescription. I didn't tell her who
(16:14):
to pray to. I didn't give her agard to believe
in I really didn't give her any of that, but
she knows right from wrong because right from wrong doesn't
come from external sources. It comes from a spirit connected
to their own heart. So if your kid is connected
to their own heart, they won't harm anyone else, So
it doesn't We've been fooled to think that all these
external prescriptions create a good self, you know, And what
(16:38):
is a good self? You know? So I've turned everything
on its head and I challenge all prescriptions because I've
seen their futility and I see how people just hold
on to them like a raft in in turbulent waters,
only because we're afraid. We're all afraid, afraid really of
the inevitability of our death. Really, at the end of
the death, we that do you feel? So you behaving
(17:07):
and existing in this fashion alone is enough to influence
the other caretakers around you. I mean, I'm personally asking
me because I have a nanny a husband, so like, yeah, no,
you know what I mean. It's no unfortunately thought shit,
I think this was a huge and continuing to be
a very humbling, humbling experience, Like I think because I'm
(17:28):
also being traveling alongside my husband, who I have chosen
to make a child with. But remember whoever you choose, nanny, husband, mother, father,
if there is contrast, meaning you're a clashing means there's
something for you to learn, and you're learning through contrast.
(17:49):
And most of us in our first four years, because
we were raised devoid of worth, we typically will choose
people of contrast where there's conflict, whether it's back and forth,
where there's argument and let's let's talk about it. We
don't because we haven't yet learned to flow with our
own authentic selves. We're really living false sells. So we're
(18:13):
going to attract lots of people who also are living
in false seals. So we're all going to clash as
we evolve. And I've seen this happen in my own life.
Those people kind of dissipate and then you begin attracting
more synergistic people, more aligning people who you flow with.
But this is the problems number. It's I think it's
after forty, like late forties. Alright, guys, this is really
(18:37):
because you have to evolve. Evolution takes time, so there
has to be a passage of time. You know, I
started meditating at twenty one. It didn't matter. I still
fell into cultural prescriptions and still had to evolve. So
to answer your question, it's not about influencing everyone. This
was my biggest and continues to be my most humbling
(18:58):
experience because I have so many people who learned from me,
but the ones who I want to learn from me
may not. So I can't pick and choose who's ready
for consciousness. I can just only shine with my own light,
and it's annoying as hell, but this is what you
have to Just keep coming back to shine with your
own light. Don't interfere in another's path. Everyone's path is
(19:18):
their own path. They have a right to their own consciousness.
You just stay in your lane, you know. So I
just keep telling myself that because otherwise you keep wanting
everyone else to change. And no one owes you transformation,
no one owes you, no one owes you anything. So
just because I'm talking consciousness doesn't mean people owe me
to be conscious too bad? Yeah, what about in the
(19:41):
same way, like teachers in school, I mean the teachers
look at you like what the hell? Like has that
ever happened? When you're a kid? Like I know you
mentioned this event because she's fifteen and a half. That happened.
But like, have did you notice when she was growing
up and in school, like well, well a lot of
other parents or teachers who all stressed out about grades
(20:01):
or yes, let's talk about this. This is a huge
cultural scripture grades. I mean, I just looked at eight
or nine preschools in Los Angeles and it's like it's
just very already lining up with chores and jobs and
like all this stuff and and and it's interesting because
I'm a little bit more I'm gonna go with the flow,
(20:22):
I think, although no, I super have anxiety. I don't know,
but I but I I don't know, is what A
lot of my answer like, I'm figuring it out, Like
I'm just trying to figure out what feels right to
how to raise a kid. But you're very soon realized
that apparently every parent knows. This is how I was two.
(20:43):
At the age of eight, I took my daughter for
her first ballet class and they said they're going to
put her with the four year old. And I said,
what do you mean? Apparently all the parents knew to
start kids at far. She didn't, like, are you and
I didn't know? So apparently this we'll figure it out
and this time is not the way, but but it's
(21:05):
it's the right thing, let me tell you because but
it was fascinating to me when I came out of
you know, my little wooden boxes at home and home
grown everything, and came out into the real world to see, Oh,
let me try and enroll her in a few classes.
She was way behind the curve by eight, like I
had already disadvantaged my kid, and I wanted to know
how did all the other parents know, because having a meltdown,
(21:30):
I was terrified. I was like, what if I got
crippled my child already? But she's so way behind now,
like she can only do solo activities because all the
group activities she's behind. So she did horse fighting and tennis.
I mean, what did one racket and one horse? One animal?
Because all the group activities she was behind. She was
a four year old. Yeah, I hope she doesn't hear this.
(21:52):
I've just told her she loves horses and loves tennis,
and I've put that into her. But really, she didn't
get into anything else because she was so behind. Please,
but everybody is doing things at three and four. If
you're saying everything is so overscheduled, it's it's really it.
But but here's where I empower parents out of out
of my own legacy of shame that you know, you
(22:13):
don't buy into this, This is an insane culture. Don't
buy into it. Don't buy into it. And the moment
you don't, and you free yourself and extricated, and of
course work on all the insecurities that come up because
you're the odd one out. You realize that, oh, I
don't have to subscribe to all this anxiety and all
this achievement pressure. I want to live my life differently.
(22:34):
So yes, I live my life differently. My daughter may
never go to college, she may never you know, learn
anything dollars exactly, but she'll be but she won't be
anxious as much, she won't be pressured as much. But
most importantly, she will learn to tune into her own
rhythm and find experiences that match to who she is
(22:55):
versus filling up a college application and what looks good
on that. Talk to me about this awesome, that, this
natural consequence, this thing, because I like to see how
conscious parenting again, I think it's I think it's really
wonderful to subscribe to when things are in flow and
(23:15):
you're having a good day, but when ship hits the
fan and you're really dealing with a kid that that
is a let's say a biter, Adam and I always joke,
what if what if our kid in kindergarten is the
biter right, and the teachers like, holy crab albags is
biting everybody? Like, what do you do in that situation? Like?
How do you not? I feel like conflict is the
(23:38):
biggest opportunity to practice conscious parenting, right because that's when
things accelerate very quickly. It's when your ship does come up. Um,
so how what would you do? Like what is a
natural consequence? How do you if you don't believe in
time outs? Are grounding? Or Okay? So let's just let's
just think and create the two paths that people could take.
(24:00):
So the kid is biting, the traditional path and the
non traditional, which I'll call the conscious path. Let's go
with the traditional path. What would the traditional path? Say?
My kid is biting? Therefore he is what would you
call that kid? So say Sean some kids seen by
So Sean is what's the first thing at all the
parents in the class whol thing bad? He's a bad boy, right,
(24:21):
So first, he came up in one second. How horrible
is that? I was like, oh my god, he's the
bad kid. Yes, absolutely, absolutely, he's the bad kid. Correct.
So when Sean starts biting, and Sean is just a
poor little three year old who doesn't know how to
do anything but bite, because that's how he expresses his frustration,
he remembers that he's a primate. You see, all the
other girls have forgotten. He's like, no, I know who
(24:42):
I am. I snell, growl, and I bite. You guys
are pretending to be human. I'm a primate. Okay, so
but but look how we adults will quickly judgment. Of
course we call that kid bad. Now, traditional culture will say,
what do you do to bad people? You must to
bad children, especially punished? Straight right, so straight now we punished.
So what are the techniques of punishing. You have to
(25:04):
take something away, you have to yell, threaten. Okay, So
now that's that's the mainstream paradigm. Okay, it's just so predictable,
it's so linear, and it ends up. Let's imagine how
it ends up. So now you've put Sean in a
time out. He doesn't even remember he's bitten. He's like,
(25:25):
I don't even know what you're talking about. I have
no clue what to do. Instead, nobody's teaching me, No
one's helping me. You're just telling me I'm really bad.
I really don't know what I've done, right, but I
guess I'm bad. So now, what do you think is
going to happen in sean psychology? After this? He's I
think he's bad? Right. Is he getting up the next
day thinking, Wow, I'm the most awesome kid. No, he's
(25:47):
now become sedimented with the psychology that he's not, So
he's not that cool right now. Imagine this continues for
five six months, and imagine the parents are truly isational.
They only no control, only punishment. Do you think it
will stay at just the time out. No, it will
become from time out to a little as whooping to
(26:08):
a little bit isolation. Then the kid is crying. I mean,
I've had clients at the age of two who were
locked up in closets and basements, you know, and they remember.
So Sean will grow up and remember this. So you
can go ahead and spend all that money in therapy
because it's coming right for sure, and you're creating disconnection. Right,
So the very tenets of parenting, which is to create
(26:28):
confidence and comfort and warmth and worth are being eroded
through this linear paradigm. Okay, so that's the traditional So
my work completely debounced it. Like you're not allowed to react.
So the moment there's a trigger, I tell I teach
all parents to pause and watch right and watch because
(26:48):
I show them where they're going to go, watch how
they're dying to label the kid, and they just have
to pause till they come back to neutral. So they're like, please,
can I call my kid bad now? And I'm like nope,
Like you can't talk to your kids till you go
back to neutral. And they're like, but what about now
my kid told me to f off and told me
I was an evil witch. Can I now go my
kid back? Nope? Nope. So we're not allowed to go
(27:11):
down the path of judgment because judgment leads to hierarchy,
leads to superiority, leads to a righteousness, leads to punishment
and violence. So you're not allowed to go down. So
parents like, what do I do? So then you came first,
you pause, and then you come to the other side. Now,
if you're willing and you haven't gone down that train
(27:31):
wreck path. You now say, what is my kid needing?
It's a need? What is the need beneath the behavior?
Who is my kid developmentally? Who is my kids spiritually? Consciously?
Who is my kid emotionally? You begin to seek to
understand the human just like you would want to be
(27:52):
understood if you have a temper tantrum at a lunch
and you monopolize the entire lunch and the next day
all your friends say, you know what, she's an attention seeker.
We need to teach her a lesson. Where are going
to speak to her for six months? Would you like
to be treated like that? No, you want to be understood.
You want to be heard, heard, and validated. So it
is with our children, and they don't have sovereignty because
(28:14):
we are a controlling culture that strips children of sovereignty.
So when they cry, we seek to understand, We seek
to give them words, we soothe them, we let them
be heard, and then if we want to teach them,
we can then do some role playing where we show
them how biting hurts. Doesn't mean you bite them to
(28:35):
hurt them, but you could like playfully show you know
this hurts, and then you can show create empathy and
do it with a dog. That's what I was just thinking.
I would use the dog. I mean, not make the
dog bite, and but I'd say the dog and the dog,
even a dog. That's a good idea. And you and
you can he can practice about the dog. Okay, a dog.
(28:56):
But you use creativity, right, you teach through creativity. But
you can only come to the place of compassion if
you don't make the judgment that he is bad. You
stay in oneness, You stay in compassion. Right the moment
we make judgments, that's it. The train wreck starts, right,
does it? This is brilliant. Does the judgment work if
(29:17):
it's positive? Because see I already see it happening with
my son a lot. My son is. I don't know.
If it's because my husband and I smile a lot,
I don't know, but my son smiles a lot when
he sees people. He if we're in an elevator and
someone's there, he makes it a point to smile at
(29:39):
that person. And um, if I take him to a
baby class, he's gone and he's I would describe him
as social and very jolly in his disposition. Now I
associate with that he is a really good baby. But
I'm already like, oh my god, we're already labeling him
as such, and I want to be sure that on moments,
(30:00):
in times where he's sad, or maybe phases of his
life where he's not social or have separation anxiety, or
we no longer can pass him around to people like
right now we pass mound. He loves it. It's fine,
but that might not always be the case, and then
we I don't want to associate that with oh no,
it's bad. Right, So you're yeah, so you're very aware
that you're already getting attached being jolly and him being
(30:24):
so shilled. Yeah, so we just watch watch how you're
getting attached already, rather than saying that's who he is
right now, very aware that it could flip tomorrow. So
don't set yourself up. You see, this is what we do.
We set ourselves up because we're like, oh my kid,
now you know, it's potty trained, and then in two
(30:45):
days they're not. They've regressed so bad. Yeah, just don't
get invested because that smiling behavior could also be the
makings of a people pleaser, Like, don't be so excited,
you know, we don't know. That's who I am, Chef,
you nail that. And we've only been talking for what
how long? Twenty minutes? So look how we we just
(31:07):
put all these adjectives and it's all our need as
parents to feel good about our emptiness. It's really that
all this projection onto these children, they're just being who
they are and they're going to flip and change tomorrow
and we're like, look my kid, my blood, my DNA,
Look how amazing, Look what I've created. It's because we
(31:29):
are empty inside that we need this. That's why we
cling to our children. That's why we want them to
become something so that we feel good about ourselves. Yeah,
it's horrible, Well, it's just as human nature, I think.
I don't think it's horrible. It's very predictable. It's universal
and we're all doing it and it's our ego that
is doing that. Um, what happens when my child asks
(31:51):
tough questions like is there a God? What are you saying? Yeah,
it's only tough for you because you haven't deconstructed it yourself, right,
Oh no idea? So so you could say, well, some
people say da da da da da, and others say
da da da da da. But I really because I
don't know if if that's what you really believe, just
(32:14):
we'll keep exploring. I don't know. You know, you just
have to say the truth, so you know, I I
had deconstructed already, so I was able to give my
daughter an answer. But you you say it from your truth.
But I do have an issue when parents put onto
their children very rigid belief systems, because I want us
(32:38):
to expose our children to what's out there and maybe
even what we believe in, but allowing for them to
have self expression and self ownership. But we don't. Most
religious people will put on their children their religion, and
again it's another it's another another attachment that you're putting
(32:59):
on them without the discovery of who they would want
to be. Is it ever too late? Let's say someone
has been an unconscious parent for years and years and
years and read your book and they come into it.
I mean, yeah, I was already too late by the
time I became conscious, because I also took time. I
(33:19):
mean you have to really try, you know. I had
to see my ego at play to believe that I
was so unconscious. I couldn't believe I was so unconscious,
so I myself was three or four years late. So
the answer is no, you're you know you're never too late,
and you're always late. So just let just let it go,
just let it whatever, whatever to come into this practice
(33:43):
and you, within yourself and for your family is the perfect.
Every moment is too late and and never too late.
It's just the perfect moment. So stop worrying now, it's
another way to worry right now. Oh, I messed up
for the past fifteen years. No, forget the past fifteen years.
You're here and now let's start aligning now. The moment
is now, and when you can hit the reset button
(34:05):
in every now, that's the best you can do. Don't
look at the past. I mean we all can already cringe.
I'm sure you already in your one year can cringe
at the mistakes you've made and the scowling faces you've
shown your kids, scared your kid. We've all made mistakes.
There is no perfect parent. I was completely unconscious till
my daughter was three or four, and I was a
(34:26):
meditator for twenty years. So please, there is no pedestal here,
there's no hierarchy. It just is everybody's evolution. Whenever they
arrive at it is when they were supposed to arrive
at it. M HM. And your children chose you, you know.
I tell very unconscious parents who then wake up and
they're full of they're full of guilt. I just tell
them your your children chose you to. You know, they
(34:47):
knew how left up you are, so and they still
chose you, so relaxed, like, don't we have many lifetimes,
you know, the many lifetimes. And he's mine, my child
for a reason right now, Like we're really here to
teach each other, so obviously he came to learn from you.
So once you let go of this hierarchy that you
need to do it perfectly and it's about you raising
(35:10):
this child. And turn it around to we are both
raising each other. We both chose each other at some
energetic level to wake each other up. Then the anxiety
goes away. You know, you can look at your kids
when you act crazy and go, well, why did you
choose me? You know you should have known better to
have chosen me as your mom. You know, you can
just play with it. It's just once you have the
(35:31):
right perspective of us all being spirits or energy just
incarnating in this moment, then you just have the right lens,
you know. I know, we got into a little bit
about like grades and getting into the college and you
(35:52):
wanting what's best for your child is what you think
is best for your child. It's not necessarily what's best
fair child. I mean, your child gets to figure out
that for him or her. And guess what, it's not
even what you think is best, fair child, it's what
you've been puppet to you and you're a parent to
what culture says is best fit like college, like he's
(36:12):
a doctor, Like he went to this school or got
these grades, or is a member of this many you know,
or he went to a third world country and build houses.
Whatever is the faith that you want to prescribe to um?
What is this idea of ordinariness? Like what is that?
Because I think I don't know. I mean, you're from India,
I don't I don't know what it's like there. But
(36:33):
I think there really is this concept here and it
wasn't my fly two of of this being special and
you want your kid to be special, which is at
the opposite of ordinary. I don't know. And I think
every kid is unique and we're all unique, But I
don't know whether anyone is really special or not. I
mean it's like right, right, but just unique. I think
(36:53):
that's the thing. And when we can focus on each
person's uniqueness, actually then we will not fit every ear
into the same mold. But we want that kids to
be special, which means better than other kids. Think about
how sick that is really, Oh it's horribized for sure.
So we're so anti children actually when we do what
(37:15):
the social media ship is because it's like everyone and
myself included, like posting all of the first birthday parties,
the first steps, like look at how special but yet
like a lot of it, like it's all the same,
Like it's not. But you see now, it's so beautiful
that our social media exposure, uh lends a light to
(37:35):
our dire, desperate need to be seen. I mean it's
so sad. Oh my god, first birthday party, first piece
of spinach, first boop, first lebon, first tooth pulled out.
I mean, really do I don't. I don't need to
know about your kids, but you have a need to
tell me about your kid because you get something from it.
(37:59):
You comments, and oh my god, we definitely doely. I'm
admitting it right here, right now, like Albi went to
his first dun disappointment this morning, And let me tell
you something that is going to be posted to the
iCloud sharing for the whole fucking family to see. And
it's going to be so special and I'm gonna get
so many texts about how cute Albie is and how
lovely is teeth and what a good mommy. And I'm
going to feel because you're acting as if you're going
(38:22):
through milestones, like you are achieving something exactly. I just
talked about this because his one year birthday. My husband's like,
who cares? Is this one year birthday? Like he's never
we don't have to do this whole thing. But I'm like,
but it's about me. I've done a great job raising
him for a year. So his first year birthday is
my birthday, then you should. You should just be real
(38:43):
and say I have a party for myself. Yeah, And
everybody's like, where's your kid? You're like, I'm my favorite,
Like I'm doing what I wanted to send your kid
out for plated because it's nothing to do with amusing.
He loves this music. He wants to go have a nap,
and just be with his five toys and let him
go and you have the party then, So that's not
pre tend we're doing this so selflessly, Like that's what
(39:03):
is the biggest farce that always such selfless parents, when
it's so clear that we're egomaniacs and so thirsty. So
coming back to the concept of ordinary is we're all
ordinary and we should have no pressure to be anything
but whoever it is we are, which is really we're
just people. We're just some of us are talented in something,
(39:25):
but everyone has something unique. Who cares? Does everyone have
to be on the stage? Is everyone need to be
having accolades and medals? This is our sickness because we
feel so empty inside. Our children don't have that need.
You know, my daughter, I say the story all the time.
She once did an assignment with a tutor and I
(39:45):
paid a hundred dollars and all this big fancy assignment
with all these these poster boards, and after the tutor left,
she began taking pictures and sending it to all her friends.
So here here came my competitiveness, and I was like,
what are you doing? She's like, oh, I'm just sharing.
Look what a great job I did let them all
have the benefit, and I went ballistic. I was like,
(40:07):
did their parents pay hundred dollars? Like, why are we
sharing what I paid for? No? No, no, no, no,
no no. And she's like, Mom, I don't care if
they do well. I was like, and in my head
I knew she was saying really great pearls of wisdom,
but in that moment, my ego was roaring. I was like,
I don't care that you don't care. I care, like
this is about you. I did this for you. And
I saw my venom and my small mind and my competitiveness.
(40:31):
But thankfully my daughter didn't care about what I said either,
and so she just went ahead and sent it to everybody.
And she did it anyway because she truly was divested
of the desire to be the one. See, we want
our children to be the one. But that's a sick mentality,
because the one at the cost of others, right, because
we don't care about other people's children. We just want
(40:52):
Arcid to be the first. And we're sick in that.
And she taught me a lesson and I stopped caring
as much. Now as much I don't care, I've let
it go because I want the higher vision of what's
good for all, and the system is set up in
a skewed way to be competitive. So again, once we
let go of this dire need for us to all
(41:16):
be the best, the most perfect, the most beautiful, we
will realize that we're all one. All our children are important.
There is no need to be the best, because we're
all good at whoever it is we are. So we
as parents need to propagate this because children are good
at that. Children don't need to be the best, the prettiest.
(41:37):
They've learned that from us. So we need to really
re educate our children and ourselves to take away all this,
to take it away and say, no, you don't need
to be the best. You be the best at who
you are. You fight towards your standard, not to the standard,
because the standard is not an objective standard. It's an acculturated, conditioned,
(41:58):
often toxic the god. So you figure out who you
are and just play to you. You play to the
tune of you. It's really there's going to be a
real adventure to folly. That's how I feel, because I
I think this is going to be a real It
already is. It's just very challenging like to just keep
yourself and your expectations and your wants and desires to
(42:22):
be the best, which obviously I was definitely raised with
and not put that on him. It's gonna be like,
and what's great about your book? And it I you
have to see it as an opportunity for the chance
to get to practice over and over, and you have
to ask, what is my mission? My ultimate mission as
a parent is to allow my child's true self to unfold,
(42:46):
whatever that looks like. If you can't decide, and of
course I can hear all your audience, perhaps some of
them saying, oh, well, what if his true self is
an addict? What if it's true self is a criminal. Well,
that's again fear talking and lack and jumping to conclusions.
The true self isn't that doesn't have to be anything
like that. The true self is simply their real self,
(43:08):
not conditioned and produced by you. That's all. It doesn't
mean now we're raising criminals, right. People get so afraid
that unless we micromanage our children, they're going to be criminals.
My child grew up without a religion, My child grew
up without competition, without achievement pressures, and she's a good kid.
She's a just an ordinary good kid, and I don't
(43:28):
expect her to be anything other than that. If she
chooses some other path, it's her choice. It has nothing
to do with me. If I want success, I need
to go get it for myself. If I want fitness,
I need to go get it for myself. If I
want good eating, I eat good for myself and I
model it. And if she chooses, she chooses. You know,
(43:49):
and of course, when they're younger, you have more quote
unquote control, Yeah, because I'm but soon you'll have to,
you know, give and take. There will be a lot
of compromise. This was so amazing. I can't tell you
how mind rocked I am and how excited I am
to have my husband listen to this podcast. And like
(44:14):
everybody I know, are there any closing words or statements
or advice or anything you want to add? If not,
we are chock full of a million gems. But if
there's anything else, but I just I would just end
by saying that every parent needs to decide if they
want to do it the traditional way or be daring
(44:36):
to try a new way, so that we can raise
a new generation of kindred spirits. Who are truly illuminated
for their own sense of divinity, worth and well being.
I want to do that. Thank you so much, Dr
Shefali Safari, Thank you Summer Summin Party. I do
Hi, everybody, and welcome to Katie's Crib. This is this
is just a very very very special episode. This is
a special episode. We have one guest and one guest only,
and her name is Dr Safali Sabari and she is
a clinical psychologist who specializes in the integration of Eastern
philosophy and Western psychology. She is the author of three books,
(00:27):
The Conscious Parent, out of Control, and The Awakened Family.
Here's how I came to know her. I got pregnant
on Scandal. I went to Carrie Washington, who, as we know,
is the most incredible actress, mother activist. I mean, the
girl is just incredible. And I said, oh my gosh,
I'm sitting here amongst piles of how to parent books
and I don't know what to do, and I'm very overwhelmed,
(00:48):
and I'm pregnant. And CARRY said, if you're going to
read one book, and only one book, it has to
be The Conscious Parent. And the book blew my mind.
And I am sitting now across from you, staring into
your gorgeous eyes in Great neck Long Island, you guys,
which is literally the town next to where I grew
up in nor Washington. Um, thank you. So much for
(01:10):
being here. Of course it is. It's such an honor
to meet you. I am a super fan. Um. So
this book The Conscious Parent that you guys run, don't walk,
um to read? What is the Conscious Parent? That's? What
is that? The first question you get from everybody. Sure,
And then I get an indignant affirmation from these parents
(01:33):
saying I'm conscious. I'm already conscious. So then we have
to deconstruct what consciousness really means. And I'll just tell
you a little bit about the inspiration behind the Conscious Parent.
You know, having been a meditator for almost fifteen years
before I had a child, I was exposed to the
(01:56):
concept that we have this thing called the ego. And
this ego is a false self, a false persona that
gets created because our intrinsic, innate self was never seen, heard, understood,
or validated by our parents. And all of us had
very unconscious parents, so they pass on this unconsciousness to us,
(02:18):
and because we want to preserve and thrive and survive,
we create this false self called the ego. Now, the
ego is not who we truly are, and we talked
about who we truly are. It's the things we think
we should be which society tells us. Culture tells us,
So we should be beautiful, we should be skinny, we
should be tall, we should be short, whatever it is,
(02:39):
the flavor of the culture's day, whichever culture, whatever, the
the most exalted qualities are. So we grow up thriving
to be that in order to feel validated. And it's
this thirst to fill the inner self that actually propels
most of our life. And we don't realize that we're
(03:01):
doing things because we're hungry, and it's coming from lack
and which is really fair, And so we're not doing
things because it's truly us. We're doing things because we
think we should. And having children is one of them,
getting married is another. All of these prescriptions one after
the other. And so then we have kids, and then
(03:23):
we think we're having kids because the kids wanted to
be saved from wherever hell they were at, but it's
not true. They were fine wherever they were at. We
think we should have kids because we have it on
our checklist, because it's one more thing we think we
should do um and of course we want to have kids,
but I don't know how many of us really deconstruct.
So then consciousness becomes about really becoming aware of who
(03:48):
it is you are and who it is you've been
playing all these roles you've been playing because you really can't.
You cannot raise a con just child unless you, yourself
are conscious. Yeah, this has nothing to do with the child.
This is okay. So the word all has to do
with me. I knew. And the conscious is about you
(04:10):
realizing that you have been playing to your false self,
and you've been raising a false self within you, And
if you don't become conscious of that, you will then
negate and dismiss and eviscerate the true self and the child,
and raise the child to now play to the tune
of your false self. And this is what we do,
We've been doing for generations. Every generation lives false and
(04:33):
raises false and we have a culture of false right right?
How what is the kind of work that a parent
can do to get to be conscious, to consider them?
You know, if if, if, if I'm going to raise
my son to be a conscious being, and I want
to start with me, which is what it sounds like
I have to do? How do I do that? Yeah?
Well it's there's a simple answer and then a complex answer.
(04:56):
The simple answer is understand that every time you react
to your child, it's because of something that the child
has re evoked in you. So it's not the child's
bad behavior, the child's temper, tantrum, or the child triggering you.
It's because you have an in avoid within that gets
awakened and triggered by your child. So it's all you.
(05:19):
So that's the simple answer, Okay, to to know it's
all you, at least start turning the spotlight within. And
then the complex answer is you have to undertake a process.
You have to go through a journey. Right, It's like
going to the gym. Do you go one time or
do you commit to a lifestyle? So it's a lifestyle
of awakening, a lifestyle of self help and deconstruction and
(05:42):
healing your childhood wounds. It's it's a lot of work.
When we talk about making a lifestyle change, like it's
the gym, Like that would include what feels right for you, meditation, therapy, yoga.
I don't know or these the types of things that
we're using. I don't know how much you a god necessarily,
but yoga is a great exercise, yes, and it does
(06:04):
bring you into the ground at present moment. But I
think what you What everybody realizes when they have a
child is that the child lives in the present moment
like no other, and we don't. So there's a huge discrepancy,
there's a huge mismatch, misalignment. So we're always out of
sync with our children. If you know, you know, especially infants,
(06:27):
they're so in the moment, and they don't care that
you have a party, They don't care that they just
vomited on your beautiful dress. They teach you to strip
yourself of all those ego attachments I was talking about.
They teach you be in the moment. Mom Who are
you without that? So let go of your party, let
go of your phone, let go and the outfit, all
(06:50):
your machinations in your mind, and focus on me now here.
And because they're so impetuous, they really make you keep
up with them, meaning moment after moment. So all the
spiritual wisdom that you learned through meditation gets applied in parenting.
So when I mean what I mean by a lifestyle changes,
you begin to see that you're not in tune with
(07:10):
your child. If you're an aware of person, and you
begin to see that you're frustrated with your children, not
because of them. But because of your inability to slow down,
drop your agenda, be in the moment, and have the flow,
you might be having like a totally disproportionate reaction to
something small because because you just read an email that
stressed you the hell out something at work. Then they
(07:30):
throw something on the floor and all of a sudden,
you're so piste exactly and it has you know you
are not there with your kid with exactly what they
just did. Correct When many parents are oblivious to the
fact that they're not present, they just presume it's the
kid and they fix the kid, and they blame the kid,
and they shamed the kid. So my work is all
(07:51):
about toppling that paradigm and making the parent have the
onus to turn the spotlight within. No, what is it
about you? How did you react? Why did you react?
It's nothing to do with your child. It's all about
raising yourself. Oh my god, it's all about raising yourself, guys.
But it's complex, yes, but it's for for me. It
(08:13):
really when I read The Conscious Parent, it really took
in some ways the pressure off, because I all of
a sudden felt less responsibility, like I have to teach
him everything. I know because good Lord, I don't know
a lot of stuff, like when he asks me difficult
questions in the future like what is God? Or why
(08:35):
is this person mean to this person? Or something like
there's going to be a lot of times where I
I don't know the answer. I really don't. And there's
a huge topic in your book about you know, my
son is here to teach me. You know, my son
is here to bring me to another level of consciousness.
My son has been born because he's my greatest teacher
um And so it for me that might truss some
(08:57):
people out. For me, I felt incredibly a weightlifted, like
I didn't have this responsibility to teach him the ABC
is and how to divide and also I mean, please
let them learn that stuff. But like whatever I mean,
I was a terrible math student myself. But because you're
an easy going parent and you were okay with giving
up that control, many people aren't. They want the pedestal
(09:19):
of being superior and being the ones who know, and
they want to fix the kid. It's very hard for
them to turn all that onto them and kind of
fix themselves. So but I hear you. It's it's a
relieving message for me too, And many people who get
it say the same thing. A weight is lifted off
my shoulders. This is the only way to parent, because
it is actually the truth is everything in life is
(09:41):
only about us. Nothing is happening to us against us.
Nobody is here to ruin our lives. It's all about
our ability or inability to handle our in her terrain.
And our children show us that more than anything. I mean,
we become one year olds, if they're one year olds,
we become three year olds and they've become five. Know
we're having temper tantrums because we were never raised in
(10:04):
our wholeness. So the moment we lose, we feel like
we're losing control with our children, like they're pressuring us
too much, or there they're too shy or too withdrawn,
or making us look bad in front of our friends.
That's a huge See, that's where I think I'm going
to fail. Is like, see, I can say all this
and it's wonderful to have a one year old, I'll
(10:24):
be is about to be one. I can put my
phone down. There's nothing is wonderful to me. Is like
if I get one hour that I'm not working and
I know that it's going to be a very present
exchange of an hour, like I'm not going to look
at my You know I have this, but but I'm
speaking from a place where it's not that hard yet.
I know that when he gets older and he is
(10:45):
throwing temper tantrum in public, or he's not behaving how
he should be behaving at whatever thing we're at, that's
really where conscious parenting is going to be challenged and
hopefully utilized and and made stronger because it is an opportunity.
But the problem is, what about everyone else raising my son?
(11:07):
How do you work with families where it's very difficult
to get maybe one person on board, but the spouse
isn't on board, or the nanny. I mean, how do
you fashion like this? Right? So just understand that just
because it's your conscious doesn't mean you're not taking action.
So if your kid is throwing a tantrum, you will
still address it, but in a very different way. First,
(11:29):
you won't be reactive. You won't take it personally. Of course,
in your in your head, your your little mind may
get you know, all upset and your ego. Of course
you care in your mind, but you know better as
a conscious to return to the breath, to not take
it personally, and to help your kids through their big feelings,
because children just have big feelings that they don't know
(11:49):
how to deal with, and they need control. They're feeling
out of control, that's all it is. But we get
so threatened by their need for control, then we upper
control and now we have a power struggle. So that's
one thing, and then dealing with unconscious people around you
is extremely hard. So I have always been misunderstood. People
have always told me that I am a bad parent
(12:10):
because I'm not doing things how they think I need
to do it. Oh, always, because they believe in control
and domination and time outs and I don't believe in
any of that. So I look like a loser parent
in front of them, and my kid is out of control?
Is that real? Like response you would get, like if
your daughter was acting out or something wetting her in
a time out? Completely and so completely I've been judged,
(12:36):
maybe just still a few days ago when I don't react.
My daughter was at a party. The police were called.
His fifteen and a half now, But she handled it.
But she handled it so well. However, all her friends
were vomiting and and my husband got upset like usually
sender you you you you, and all I could see
was her strength, Like this was amazing. I was doing
(12:57):
understand what he was talking about. So it's diametrically opposite
from mainstream and it is lonely. But once you get it,
you can't go back, Like I can't go back to
mainstream ever again. So it doesn't matter to me if
I get disapproved or people's scoff or people laughs. Do
you think it's affected your daughter as far as like
is she good at knowing bound? I mean, I'm selfishly
(13:21):
asking for myself because like I'm like, okay, if I'm
choosing to raise Audie in a conscious parents style, what
type of adult is that going to make? But who
have you seen? Like how does it work? But yeah,
but you can't again focus on the other because they
will they will be raised according to the tune of
their authentic destiny. You are here to usher them to
(13:44):
that destiny with love, with support, with presence, but you're
not invested in how they turn out to be. So
I'm really not invested. So for example, it was my say,
was my daughter, I don't care if care not, I
don't care. It's if I care it's my ego that cares,
because my ego would feel good to know she's secure.
(14:05):
But who's to say if her path is If her
path is secuitous and she first wants to be homeless
in a third world country and then, you know, and
then ends up in jail, I don't know. I'm just
being extreme right now. Who's to say that path doesn't
ultimately make her more mother trees and then mother trees.
I don't know, We don't know, you know. So these
(14:25):
are all projection projections, So we do. We don't, of
course take our kids to drugs, and we don't offer
them alcohol. We definitely teach them the ill effects of
everything and the blessings of living. It's not about being
less a fair It's about having wisdom and the detachment
of your ego in their life. Their life is their life.
(14:48):
So say my daughter had called and she had been vomiting,
then I would look at it as an opportunity to
re educate, to rehall, to reconnect. Everything is an opportunity
to come back to center. So fear is not the
response you see, and fear is the typical response of
the typical parent. I refuse to go into fear now,
do I get scared sometimes? Of course. Do I caution
(15:09):
her all the time, of course, But I won't be
trapped in fear, and her future will certainly not be
my obsession. My future will be my obsession because I
need to fix myself. If I embody consciousness, that's the
best thing I can do for everyone around me. Now,
she chooses to wake up to it, she chooses to
embrace it, or she chooses to experiment in some other way.
(15:31):
I'm here for her on her life path. So this
is the philosophy, you know, the way here spirits ushering spirits.
They just happen to be smaller and less mighty. But
my daughter is more strong than me. Yes, she can
like you're not here to write, and you're here to
usher alongside them and to lovingly and spiritual guide them.
(15:52):
But you're not here to to control their life. And
I don't want her to live a controlled, prescribed life.
I wanted to if mistake filled, unordinary, non traditional, fully experimented,
fully alive, fully well lived life, I don't want to.
I've not given her prescription. I didn't tell her who
(16:14):
to pray to. I didn't give her agard to believe
in I really didn't give her any of that, but
she knows right from wrong because right from wrong doesn't
come from external sources. It comes from a spirit connected
to their own heart. So if your kid is connected
to their own heart, they won't harm anyone else, So
it doesn't We've been fooled to think that all these
external prescriptions create a good self, you know, And what
(16:38):
is a good self? You know? So I've turned everything
on its head and I challenge all prescriptions because I've
seen their futility and I see how people just hold
on to them like a raft in in turbulent waters,
only because we're afraid. We're all afraid, afraid really of
the inevitability of our death. Really, at the end of
the death, we that do you feel? So you behaving
(17:07):
and existing in this fashion alone is enough to influence
the other caretakers around you. I mean, I'm personally asking
me because I have a nanny a husband, so like, yeah, no,
you know what I mean. It's no unfortunately thought shit,
I think this was a huge and continuing to be
a very humbling, humbling experience, Like I think because I'm
(17:28):
also being traveling alongside my husband, who I have chosen
to make a child with. But remember whoever you choose, nanny, husband, mother, father,
if there is contrast, meaning you're a clashing means there's
something for you to learn, and you're learning through contrast.
(17:49):
And most of us in our first four years, because
we were raised devoid of worth, we typically will choose
people of contrast where there's conflict, whether it's back and forth,
where there's argument and let's let's talk about it. We
don't because we haven't yet learned to flow with our
own authentic selves. We're really living false sells. So we're
(18:13):
going to attract lots of people who also are living
in false seals. So we're all going to clash as
we evolve. And I've seen this happen in my own life.
Those people kind of dissipate and then you begin attracting
more synergistic people, more aligning people who you flow with.
But this is the problems number. It's I think it's
after forty, like late forties. Alright, guys, this is really
(18:37):
because you have to evolve. Evolution takes time, so there
has to be a passage of time. You know, I
started meditating at twenty one. It didn't matter. I still
fell into cultural prescriptions and still had to evolve. So
to answer your question, it's not about influencing everyone. This
was my biggest and continues to be my most humbling
(18:58):
experience because I have so many people who learned from me,
but the ones who I want to learn from me
may not. So I can't pick and choose who's ready
for consciousness. I can just only shine with my own light,
and it's annoying as hell, but this is what you
have to Just keep coming back to shine with your
own light. Don't interfere in another's path. Everyone's path is
(19:18):
their own path. They have a right to their own consciousness.
You just stay in your lane, you know. So I
just keep telling myself that because otherwise you keep wanting
everyone else to change. And no one owes you transformation,
no one owes you, no one owes you anything. So
just because I'm talking consciousness doesn't mean people owe me
to be conscious too bad? Yeah, what about in the
(19:41):
same way, like teachers in school, I mean the teachers
look at you like what the hell? Like has that
ever happened? When you're a kid? Like I know you
mentioned this event because she's fifteen and a half. That happened.
But like, have did you notice when she was growing
up and in school, like well, well a lot of
other parents or teachers who all stressed out about grades
(20:01):
or yes, let's talk about this. This is a huge
cultural scripture grades. I mean, I just looked at eight
or nine preschools in Los Angeles and it's like it's
just very already lining up with chores and jobs and
like all this stuff and and and it's interesting because
I'm a little bit more I'm gonna go with the flow,
(20:22):
I think, although no, I super have anxiety. I don't know,
but I but I I don't know, is what A
lot of my answer like, I'm figuring it out, Like
I'm just trying to figure out what feels right to
how to raise a kid. But you're very soon realized
that apparently every parent knows. This is how I was two.
(20:43):
At the age of eight, I took my daughter for
her first ballet class and they said they're going to
put her with the four year old. And I said,
what do you mean? Apparently all the parents knew to
start kids at far. She didn't, like, are you and
I didn't know? So apparently this we'll figure it out
and this time is not the way, but but it's
(21:05):
it's the right thing, let me tell you because but
it was fascinating to me when I came out of
you know, my little wooden boxes at home and home
grown everything, and came out into the real world to see, Oh,
let me try and enroll her in a few classes.
She was way behind the curve by eight, like I
had already disadvantaged my kid, and I wanted to know
how did all the other parents know, because having a meltdown,
(21:30):
I was terrified. I was like, what if I got
crippled my child already? But she's so way behind now,
like she can only do solo activities because all the
group activities she's behind. So she did horse fighting and tennis.
I mean, what did one racket and one horse? One animal?
Because all the group activities she was behind. She was
a four year old. Yeah, I hope she doesn't hear this.
(21:52):
I've just told her she loves horses and loves tennis,
and I've put that into her. But really, she didn't
get into anything else because she was so behind. Please,
but everybody is doing things at three and four. If
you're saying everything is so overscheduled, it's it's really it.
But but here's where I empower parents out of out
of my own legacy of shame that you know, you
(22:13):
don't buy into this, This is an insane culture. Don't
buy into it. Don't buy into it. And the moment
you don't, and you free yourself and extricated, and of
course work on all the insecurities that come up because
you're the odd one out. You realize that, oh, I
don't have to subscribe to all this anxiety and all
this achievement pressure. I want to live my life differently.
(22:34):
So yes, I live my life differently. My daughter may
never go to college, she may never you know, learn
anything dollars exactly, but she'll be but she won't be
anxious as much, she won't be pressured as much. But
most importantly, she will learn to tune into her own
rhythm and find experiences that match to who she is
(22:55):
versus filling up a college application and what looks good
on that. Talk to me about this awesome, that, this
natural consequence, this thing, because I like to see how
conscious parenting again, I think it's I think it's really
wonderful to subscribe to when things are in flow and
(23:15):
you're having a good day, but when ship hits the
fan and you're really dealing with a kid that that
is a let's say a biter, Adam and I always joke,
what if what if our kid in kindergarten is the
biter right, and the teachers like, holy crab albags is
biting everybody? Like, what do you do in that situation? Like?
How do you not? I feel like conflict is the
(23:38):
biggest opportunity to practice conscious parenting, right because that's when
things accelerate very quickly. It's when your ship does come up. Um,
so how what would you do? Like what is a
natural consequence? How do you if you don't believe in
time outs? Are grounding? Or Okay? So let's just let's
just think and create the two paths that people could take.
(24:00):
So the kid is biting, the traditional path and the
non traditional, which I'll call the conscious path. Let's go
with the traditional path. What would the traditional path? Say?
My kid is biting? Therefore he is what would you
call that kid? So say Sean some kids seen by
So Sean is what's the first thing at all the
parents in the class whol thing bad? He's a bad boy, right,
(24:21):
So first, he came up in one second. How horrible
is that? I was like, oh my god, he's the
bad kid. Yes, absolutely, absolutely, he's the bad kid. Correct.
So when Sean starts biting, and Sean is just a
poor little three year old who doesn't know how to
do anything but bite, because that's how he expresses his frustration,
he remembers that he's a primate. You see, all the
other girls have forgotten. He's like, no, I know who
(24:42):
I am. I snell, growl, and I bite. You guys
are pretending to be human. I'm a primate. Okay, so
but but look how we adults will quickly judgment. Of
course we call that kid bad. Now, traditional culture will say,
what do you do to bad people? You must to
bad children, especially punished? Straight right, so straight now we punished.
So what are the techniques of punishing. You have to
(25:04):
take something away, you have to yell, threaten. Okay, So
now that's that's the mainstream paradigm. Okay, it's just so predictable,
it's so linear, and it ends up. Let's imagine how
it ends up. So now you've put Sean in a
time out. He doesn't even remember he's bitten. He's like,
(25:25):
I don't even know what you're talking about. I have
no clue what to do. Instead, nobody's teaching me, No
one's helping me. You're just telling me I'm really bad.
I really don't know what I've done, right, but I
guess I'm bad. So now, what do you think is
going to happen in sean psychology? After this? He's I
think he's bad? Right. Is he getting up the next
day thinking, Wow, I'm the most awesome kid. No, he's
(25:47):
now become sedimented with the psychology that he's not, So
he's not that cool right now. Imagine this continues for
five six months, and imagine the parents are truly isational.
They only no control, only punishment. Do you think it
will stay at just the time out. No, it will
become from time out to a little as whooping to
(26:08):
a little bit isolation. Then the kid is crying. I mean,
I've had clients at the age of two who were
locked up in closets and basements, you know, and they remember.
So Sean will grow up and remember this. So you
can go ahead and spend all that money in therapy
because it's coming right for sure, and you're creating disconnection. Right,
So the very tenets of parenting, which is to create
(26:28):
confidence and comfort and warmth and worth are being eroded
through this linear paradigm. Okay, so that's the traditional So
my work completely debounced it. Like you're not allowed to react.
So the moment there's a trigger, I tell I teach
all parents to pause and watch right and watch because
(26:48):
I show them where they're going to go, watch how
they're dying to label the kid, and they just have
to pause till they come back to neutral. So they're like, please,
can I call my kid bad now? And I'm like nope,
Like you can't talk to your kids till you go
back to neutral. And they're like, but what about now
my kid told me to f off and told me
I was an evil witch. Can I now go my
kid back? Nope? Nope. So we're not allowed to go
(27:11):
down the path of judgment because judgment leads to hierarchy,
leads to superiority, leads to a righteousness, leads to punishment
and violence. So you're not allowed to go down. So
parents like, what do I do? So then you came first,
you pause, and then you come to the other side. Now,
if you're willing and you haven't gone down that train
(27:31):
wreck path. You now say, what is my kid needing?
It's a need? What is the need beneath the behavior?
Who is my kid developmentally? Who is my kids spiritually? Consciously?
Who is my kid emotionally? You begin to seek to
understand the human just like you would want to be
(27:52):
understood if you have a temper tantrum at a lunch
and you monopolize the entire lunch and the next day
all your friends say, you know what, she's an attention seeker.
We need to teach her a lesson. Where are going
to speak to her for six months? Would you like
to be treated like that? No, you want to be understood.
You want to be heard, heard, and validated. So it
is with our children, and they don't have sovereignty because
(28:14):
we are a controlling culture that strips children of sovereignty.
So when they cry, we seek to understand, We seek
to give them words, we soothe them, we let them
be heard, and then if we want to teach them,
we can then do some role playing where we show
them how biting hurts. Doesn't mean you bite them to
(28:35):
hurt them, but you could like playfully show you know
this hurts, and then you can show create empathy and
do it with a dog. That's what I was just thinking.
I would use the dog. I mean, not make the
dog bite, and but I'd say the dog and the dog,
even a dog. That's a good idea. And you and
you can he can practice about the dog. Okay, a dog.
(28:56):
But you use creativity, right, you teach through creativity. But
you can only come to the place of compassion if
you don't make the judgment that he is bad. You
stay in oneness, You stay in compassion. Right the moment
we make judgments, that's it. The train wreck starts, right,
does it? This is brilliant. Does the judgment work if
(29:17):
it's positive? Because see I already see it happening with
my son a lot. My son is. I don't know.
If it's because my husband and I smile a lot,
I don't know, but my son smiles a lot when
he sees people. He if we're in an elevator and
someone's there, he makes it a point to smile at
(29:39):
that person. And um, if I take him to a
baby class, he's gone and he's I would describe him
as social and very jolly in his disposition. Now I
associate with that he is a really good baby. But
I'm already like, oh my god, we're already labeling him
as such, and I want to be sure that on moments,
(30:00):
in times where he's sad, or maybe phases of his
life where he's not social or have separation anxiety, or
we no longer can pass him around to people like
right now we pass mound. He loves it. It's fine,
but that might not always be the case, and then
we I don't want to associate that with oh no,
it's bad. Right, So you're yeah, so you're very aware
that you're already getting attached being jolly and him being
(30:24):
so shilled. Yeah, so we just watch watch how you're
getting attached already, rather than saying that's who he is
right now, very aware that it could flip tomorrow. So
don't set yourself up. You see, this is what we do.
We set ourselves up because we're like, oh my kid,
now you know, it's potty trained, and then in two
(30:45):
days they're not. They've regressed so bad. Yeah, just don't
get invested because that smiling behavior could also be the
makings of a people pleaser, Like, don't be so excited,
you know, we don't know. That's who I am, Chef,
you nail that. And we've only been talking for what
how long? Twenty minutes? So look how we we just
(31:07):
put all these adjectives and it's all our need as
parents to feel good about our emptiness. It's really that
all this projection onto these children, they're just being who
they are and they're going to flip and change tomorrow
and we're like, look my kid, my blood, my DNA,
Look how amazing, Look what I've created. It's because we
(31:29):
are empty inside that we need this. That's why we
cling to our children. That's why we want them to
become something so that we feel good about ourselves. Yeah,
it's horrible, Well, it's just as human nature, I think.
I don't think it's horrible. It's very predictable. It's universal
and we're all doing it and it's our ego that
is doing that. Um, what happens when my child asks
(31:51):
tough questions like is there a God? What are you saying? Yeah,
it's only tough for you because you haven't deconstructed it yourself, right,
Oh no idea? So so you could say, well, some
people say da da da da da, and others say
da da da da da. But I really because I
don't know if if that's what you really believe, just
(32:14):
we'll keep exploring. I don't know. You know, you just
have to say the truth, so you know, I I
had deconstructed already, so I was able to give my
daughter an answer. But you you say it from your truth.
But I do have an issue when parents put onto
their children very rigid belief systems, because I want us
(32:38):
to expose our children to what's out there and maybe
even what we believe in, but allowing for them to
have self expression and self ownership. But we don't. Most
religious people will put on their children their religion, and
again it's another it's another another attachment that you're putting
(32:59):
on them without the discovery of who they would want
to be. Is it ever too late? Let's say someone
has been an unconscious parent for years and years and
years and read your book and they come into it.
I mean, yeah, I was already too late by the
time I became conscious, because I also took time. I
(33:19):
mean you have to really try, you know. I had
to see my ego at play to believe that I
was so unconscious. I couldn't believe I was so unconscious,
so I myself was three or four years late. So
the answer is no, you're you know you're never too late,
and you're always late. So just let just let it go,
just let it whatever, whatever to come into this practice
(33:43):
and you, within yourself and for your family is the perfect.
Every moment is too late and and never too late.
It's just the perfect moment. So stop worrying now, it's
another way to worry right now. Oh, I messed up
for the past fifteen years. No, forget the past fifteen years.
You're here and now let's start aligning now. The moment
is now, and when you can hit the reset button
(34:05):
in every now, that's the best you can do. Don't
look at the past. I mean we all can already cringe.
I'm sure you already in your one year can cringe
at the mistakes you've made and the scowling faces you've
shown your kids, scared your kid. We've all made mistakes.
There is no perfect parent. I was completely unconscious till
my daughter was three or four, and I was a
(34:26):
meditator for twenty years. So please, there is no pedestal here,
there's no hierarchy. It just is everybody's evolution. Whenever they
arrive at it is when they were supposed to arrive
at it. M HM. And your children chose you, you know.
I tell very unconscious parents who then wake up and
they're full of they're full of guilt. I just tell
them your your children chose you to. You know, they
(34:47):
knew how left up you are, so and they still
chose you, so relaxed, like, don't we have many lifetimes,
you know, the many lifetimes. And he's mine, my child
for a reason right now, Like we're really here to
teach each other, so obviously he came to learn from you.
So once you let go of this hierarchy that you
need to do it perfectly and it's about you raising
(35:10):
this child. And turn it around to we are both
raising each other. We both chose each other at some
energetic level to wake each other up. Then the anxiety
goes away. You know, you can look at your kids
when you act crazy and go, well, why did you
choose me? You know you should have known better to
have chosen me as your mom. You know, you can
just play with it. It's just once you have the
(35:31):
right perspective of us all being spirits or energy just
incarnating in this moment, then you just have the right lens,
you know. I know, we got into a little bit
about like grades and getting into the college and you
(35:52):
wanting what's best for your child is what you think
is best for your child. It's not necessarily what's best
fair child. I mean, your child gets to figure out
that for him or her. And guess what, it's not
even what you think is best, fair child, it's what
you've been puppet to you and you're a parent to
what culture says is best fit like college, like he's
(36:12):
a doctor, Like he went to this school or got
these grades, or is a member of this many you know,
or he went to a third world country and build houses.
Whatever is the faith that you want to prescribe to um?
What is this idea of ordinariness? Like what is that?
Because I think I don't know. I mean, you're from India,
I don't I don't know what it's like there. But
(36:33):
I think there really is this concept here and it
wasn't my fly two of of this being special and
you want your kid to be special, which is at
the opposite of ordinary. I don't know. And I think
every kid is unique and we're all unique, But I
don't know whether anyone is really special or not. I
mean it's like right, right, but just unique. I think
(36:53):
that's the thing. And when we can focus on each
person's uniqueness, actually then we will not fit every ear
into the same mold. But we want that kids to
be special, which means better than other kids. Think about
how sick that is really, Oh it's horribized for sure.
So we're so anti children actually when we do what
(37:15):
the social media ship is because it's like everyone and
myself included, like posting all of the first birthday parties,
the first steps, like look at how special but yet
like a lot of it, like it's all the same,
Like it's not. But you see now, it's so beautiful
that our social media exposure, uh lends a light to
(37:35):
our dire, desperate need to be seen. I mean it's
so sad. Oh my god, first birthday party, first piece
of spinach, first boop, first lebon, first tooth pulled out.
I mean, really do I don't. I don't need to
know about your kids, but you have a need to
tell me about your kid because you get something from it.
(37:59):
You comments, and oh my god, we definitely doely. I'm
admitting it right here, right now, like Albi went to
his first dun disappointment this morning, And let me tell
you something that is going to be posted to the
iCloud sharing for the whole fucking family to see. And
it's going to be so special and I'm gonna get
so many texts about how cute Albie is and how
lovely is teeth and what a good mommy. And I'm
going to feel because you're acting as if you're going
(38:22):
through milestones, like you are achieving something exactly. I just
talked about this because his one year birthday. My husband's like,
who cares? Is this one year birthday? Like he's never
we don't have to do this whole thing. But I'm like,
but it's about me. I've done a great job raising
him for a year. So his first year birthday is
my birthday, then you should. You should just be real
(38:43):
and say I have a party for myself. Yeah, And
everybody's like, where's your kid? You're like, I'm my favorite,
Like I'm doing what I wanted to send your kid
out for plated because it's nothing to do with amusing.
He loves this music. He wants to go have a nap,
and just be with his five toys and let him
go and you have the party then, So that's not
pre tend we're doing this so selflessly, Like that's what
(39:03):
is the biggest farce that always such selfless parents, when
it's so clear that we're egomaniacs and so thirsty. So
coming back to the concept of ordinary is we're all
ordinary and we should have no pressure to be anything
but whoever it is we are, which is really we're
just people. We're just some of us are talented in something,
(39:25):
but everyone has something unique. Who cares? Does everyone have
to be on the stage? Is everyone need to be
having accolades and medals? This is our sickness because we
feel so empty inside. Our children don't have that need.
You know, my daughter, I say the story all the time.
She once did an assignment with a tutor and I
(39:45):
paid a hundred dollars and all this big fancy assignment
with all these these poster boards, and after the tutor left,
she began taking pictures and sending it to all her friends.
So here here came my competitiveness, and I was like,
what are you doing? She's like, oh, I'm just sharing.
Look what a great job I did let them all
have the benefit, and I went ballistic. I was like,
(40:07):
did their parents pay hundred dollars? Like, why are we
sharing what I paid for? No? No, no, no, no,
no no. And she's like, Mom, I don't care if
they do well. I was like, and in my head
I knew she was saying really great pearls of wisdom,
but in that moment, my ego was roaring. I was like,
I don't care that you don't care. I care, like
this is about you. I did this for you. And
I saw my venom and my small mind and my competitiveness.
(40:31):
But thankfully my daughter didn't care about what I said either,
and so she just went ahead and sent it to everybody.
And she did it anyway because she truly was divested
of the desire to be the one. See, we want
our children to be the one. But that's a sick mentality,
because the one at the cost of others, right, because
we don't care about other people's children. We just want
(40:52):
Arcid to be the first. And we're sick in that.
And she taught me a lesson and I stopped caring
as much. Now as much I don't care, I've let
it go because I want the higher vision of what's
good for all, and the system is set up in
a skewed way to be competitive. So again, once we
let go of this dire need for us to all
(41:16):
be the best, the most perfect, the most beautiful, we
will realize that we're all one. All our children are important.
There is no need to be the best, because we're
all good at whoever it is we are. So we
as parents need to propagate this because children are good
at that. Children don't need to be the best, the prettiest.
(41:37):
They've learned that from us. So we need to really
re educate our children and ourselves to take away all this,
to take it away and say, no, you don't need
to be the best. You be the best at who
you are. You fight towards your standard, not to the standard,
because the standard is not an objective standard. It's an acculturated, conditioned,
(41:58):
often toxic the god. So you figure out who you
are and just play to you. You play to the
tune of you. It's really there's going to be a
real adventure to folly. That's how I feel, because I
I think this is going to be a real It
already is. It's just very challenging like to just keep
yourself and your expectations and your wants and desires to
(42:22):
be the best, which obviously I was definitely raised with
and not put that on him. It's gonna be like,
and what's great about your book? And it I you
have to see it as an opportunity for the chance
to get to practice over and over, and you have
to ask, what is my mission? My ultimate mission as
a parent is to allow my child's true self to unfold,
(42:46):
whatever that looks like. If you can't decide, and of
course I can hear all your audience, perhaps some of
them saying, oh, well, what if his true self is
an addict? What if it's true self is a criminal. Well,
that's again fear talking and lack and jumping to conclusions.
The true self isn't that doesn't have to be anything
like that. The true self is simply their real self,
(43:08):
not conditioned and produced by you. That's all. It doesn't
mean now we're raising criminals, right. People get so afraid
that unless we micromanage our children, they're going to be criminals.
My child grew up without a religion, My child grew
up without competition, without achievement pressures, and she's a good kid.
She's a just an ordinary good kid, and I don't
(43:28):
expect her to be anything other than that. If she
chooses some other path, it's her choice. It has nothing
to do with me. If I want success, I need
to go get it for myself. If I want fitness,
I need to go get it for myself. If I
want good eating, I eat good for myself and I
model it. And if she chooses, she chooses. You know,
(43:49):
and of course, when they're younger, you have more quote
unquote control, Yeah, because I'm but soon you'll have to,
you know, give and take. There will be a lot
of compromise. This was so amazing. I can't tell you
how mind rocked I am and how excited I am
to have my husband listen to this podcast. And like
(44:14):
everybody I know, are there any closing words or statements
or advice or anything you want to add? If not,
we are chock full of a million gems. But if
there's anything else, but I just I would just end
by saying that every parent needs to decide if they
want to do it the traditional way or be daring
(44:36):
to try a new way, so that we can raise
a new generation of kindred spirits. Who are truly illuminated
for their own sense of divinity, worth and well being.
I want to do that. Thank you so much, Dr
Shefali Safari, Thank you Summer Summin Party. I do
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