September 5, 2023 • 35 mins
While prosecutors claim that YSL is a dangerous criminal organization, defense attorneys in the YSL trial argue RICO and gang laws are being used too aggressively to target neighborhood problems and young people, turning the justice system upside down in Fulton County and beyond. We go into the courtroom’s holding cell to find out why YSL defendant Lil Rod was screaming, and we unexpectedly become characters in the story of this trial.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
King Slime is a production of iHeart Podcasts and Heirloom Media.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
It's Monday, April third, twenty twenty three, three months into
the Wisoul trial. Jud Gerald Glanville is on the stand
in Courtroom one sea. His brow is furrowed, his steely
eyes peer out over a black COVID mask embroidered with
a white Fulton County seal on one side. The subject
of his intense gaze is a young black woman in
a business suit standing at the clerk's desk.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
All right, Juror Tano four, Good morning, madam, Good morning.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
Just a few weeks earlier, Juror Teno Ford reported for
Jerry Duty.
Speaker 4 (00:38):
Okay, So I'm going to explain what everything that happened
that day on the seventeenth or March.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
Okay, But before then, you recall this court giving you
the ad naugeum admonitions about acceptable behavior.
Speaker 5 (00:51):
About having phones out. Yes, at the moment.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
When we came, didn't I tell you to turn your
phone off?
Speaker 4 (00:57):
It was I'm gonna be truthfully and very honest, when it.
Speaker 5 (01:00):
Was a lot going on. We had just come from.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Different Answer my question first and then you can explain it.
Do you recall us telling you to turn off your
cell phones.
Speaker 5 (01:10):
Yes, sir, in.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
Violation, Juror Teno Fur took out her phone to record
a portion of the trial of one of the most
famous rappers on the planet from the jury pool. Little
did she know just a few weeks later she would
be standing in front of that famous rapper and twelve
of his co defendants, trying to explain her way out
of trouble.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
Okay, so when you was giving the speech, everybody was talking.
Speaker 5 (01:36):
I did take a.
Speaker 4 (01:38):
Video, and then the young lady next to me, she
was like, man, we're not supposed to be recording. Soon
as they said that, I deleted everything right then and there,
maybe an hour went by.
Speaker 5 (01:49):
That's when the officer came up to.
Speaker 4 (01:50):
Me and said somebody had told us that you may
be recording.
Speaker 5 (01:54):
So I showed them the phone.
Speaker 4 (01:56):
They went through my recent deleted photos and seeing the
video that I made. And this is my first time.
That was my first home ever being in court in
my whole entire life. So I wasn't really sure of
anything we couldn't and could not do.
Speaker 5 (02:08):
So I do apologize for day.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
She may never have been in court before that day
in March, but on this day in April, she's getting
a crash course in criminal justice.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
You know, there are varying reasons that we tell that
we punish people in society. Okay, I'm just going to
tell you the reasons are. One just general is retribution,
I for n The second reason that we punish people
is for general deterrence. We don't want other people doing
this kind of same thing. Third reason is specific the deterrence,
I mean, we don't want you doing this again. And
(02:41):
then it's rehabilitation and re entry. So, ma'am, in this
particular situation, you videotaped our proceedings was just a brazen
violation of these particular proceedings. You society, you can just
do what you wanted to do.
Speaker 5 (02:55):
It's not want your phone on what I wanted to do. Well,
you pulled out your.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Phone in videotape our proceedings, and that was in direct
violation of this court, sour. So I'm going to send
you to three days of in jail, and that will
I want to satisfy you contempt.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
I'm Christina League and I'm George Cheaty. This is King Slime.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
The prosecution of Young Thug and YSL.
Speaker 6 (03:38):
Today there was some drama in the corporal good using it.
Speaker 5 (03:41):
Thank you for joining us tonight. I'm Rosstrousser.
Speaker 7 (03:43):
I'm Courtney Briant, a potential juror in the YSL trial,
was arrested accused of recording video during courtroom proceedings.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
You're ten oh four is reportedly released after five hours
in jail, but Judge Glanville's punishment sends a message inside
the courtroom and beyond.
Speaker 6 (03:59):
That's right Russ according that potential jurors out of jail
after several hours. The judge initially sentenced her to three days.
We speak with a legal expert. She says, this judge
is not playing around.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
Glanville is the chief judge of the Fulton County Superior
Court and a retired army general who handled war crimes
in Afghanistan. He has little tolerance for his conduct. And
you don't have to take Juror tenofour's word for it.
Ask Juror sixty four from way back in January. She
took one look at the jury form and skipped out
(04:35):
at lunch, preferring to go on vacation in the Dominican Republic.
Speaker 3 (04:39):
Ordinarily, Madam, I do find you in contempt. But here's
what I'm going to do. Contempt is punishable easily by
a fine of one thousand dollars and or twenty days
in jail. I am not going to find you. In
order for you to satisfy your contempt, I'm going to
commute the twenty days and require you to write a
(05:00):
thirty page paper on the importance of jury service. Here's
the criteria. You'll have to do APA style. You're gonna
have to use at least ten primary sources ten secondary sources.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
In July, Judge Glanville faced another no show juror.
Speaker 5 (05:17):
This is very, very serious.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
It's one of the most important cilic obligations that.
Speaker 5 (05:22):
We can have. I literally forgot. It was not a
malicious ax. It was not that I just decided not
become a.
Speaker 1 (05:31):
Shortdayday and gave her a choice five days of trial
observation for twenty days in jail.
Speaker 5 (05:38):
What do you want to do? How do the five days?
Speaker 2 (05:41):
But it isn't only jurors who have faced Glanville's wrath.
He's threatened the gallery of observers too.
Speaker 3 (05:46):
And if anybody's in the gallery and you can't otherwise
control yourself or otherwise make it if you want to
make any appropriate comments, and you can leave at this
point in time. But if you remain in this courtroom
and make it and make any outbursts, I have.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
You arrested and has held three defense attorneys in contempt.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
You were held in contempt, young man.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Why is self defendant? Miles Farley's lawyer Anastasio's Minettas offered
to pay a two hundred and fifty dollars fee instead
of spending twenty days in jail for being late to
a hearing.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
But I satisfied your contempt by you paying two hundred
and fifty dollars, which you did, and I have that receipt.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
Here, And just like that, Duro ditched court for the
Beach Christian Epiccher's defense attorney, Eric Johnson was ordered to
write an essay for being tardy.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
And seventeen page paper on the importance of professionals in
the legal field and treating ones opponents with civility. Paper
is to be published quality in APA format at least
ten primary and ten secondary sources. Say again, you say again,
mister Jimines.
Speaker 5 (06:50):
Was a good publish You know I have never been voting.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
Okay, all right, okay, but that's another issue that we're
not going to do today.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
But anyways, that voice that popped up with an unwelcome
reality check belongs to defense attorney Surrichata Humenez. He represents
wise held defendant Cordarius Dorsey. He also faces the judges
ire for lateness, but instead of a fine or an essay,
he's told to grab some sandwiches.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
Purchase lines for each of your attorney colleagues in this case.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
On May twelfth, twenty twenty three, Jimenez ventures half mile
away from the Fulton County Courthouse to Magic City, the
Atlanta strip club famous for catering to rappers, basketball stars,
and Hollywood elite, and instead of sandwiches, he opts for
lemon pepper wings. Jimenez documents the ordeal by posting photos
(07:47):
to Instagram, first a selfie in the rain from the
Magic City parking lot showing its front sign depicting the
Atlanta skyline. Then from inside the Darkly Lake Club as
an employee in a red Magic City hit, he packs
aluminum trays into blue branded tote bags. Finally, another selfie
at the courthouse where the conference table becomes a banquet
(08:08):
table for Jimenez. The other attorneys and their huge takeout order.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
Early on in the trial, before his visit to Magic City,
Jimanus agrees to sit down with us at our table,
No wings required.
Speaker 8 (08:23):
Well, i am Soudy Chada Humenis. I'm an attorney. I
do criminal defense. I've been doing criminal defense for I
think about six and a half years now.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Prior to his defense work, Jimenez was a prosecutor at
the District Attorney's office from twenty thirteen to twenty sixteen
under Finnie Willis's predecessor, Paul Howard.
Speaker 8 (08:42):
I like Fannie Willis a lot. I mean, I'm not
a big donor, but you can pull my records. I've
anytime I had a chance, I've donated to her. I'm
believe in what she stands for. Fulton County is a
very difficult place to work at because you're something you're fighting.
You're definitely fighting the defense attorneys, you're fighting the judges
as an ada, and you're fighting your office. And so
you learn how to survive in Fulton County.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
But now, as part of the wisl case, perhaps even
SC's why defense attorneys in Fulton County have historically put
up a fight even as the YSL trial is just beginning.
He seems exhausted. You're not being paid by one of
the labels, right.
Speaker 8 (09:20):
How WI show is getting paid by one of the labels,
and they can steal send some donations that can start
a goalfund me. But no, I took this case as
an appointed case.
Speaker 1 (09:29):
The Judges office estimated that the WISL trial would take
six to nine months. At the WISL trial isn't even
the only reco case on his plate right now.
Speaker 8 (09:38):
At this moment, I have three reco cases that I'm
representing clients on. I am not Bruce Harvey or Brian
Steele or any of these top attorneys that just get
all the mob bosses or whatever you know.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
Both of these attorneys are also linked to the trial
by the way, Bruce Harvey represents Qumarvius Nichols, Ryan Steel
none other than young thug. The defense attorneys themselves have
become a cast of characters, for good or ill. They're
a mix of some of the most seasoned professionals in Atlanta,
like Harvey and Steel, and some of the city's newest
(10:14):
and youngest attorneys. The age gap shows at times.
Speaker 4 (10:18):
I will start by saying that this assertion that I
did not mention the fourth three argument.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
Don't worry about that, okay, because it wouldn't be I'd
have to do it anyway, So I don't even worry
about that, Okay, Okay.
Speaker 5 (10:33):
I was just saying that it's just not true. It's
cap to be honest.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
But that's Justin Hill, the twenty six year old attorney
for Damon Blaylock. Hill's comment using the word cap, a
slang word for lying, went viral in April. But regardless
of age, there's this overarching concern over how exactly justice
will be served in the YSL trial. While the State
of Georgia has leveraged millions of dollars to prosecute a
(10:59):
growing number of cases, the Georgia Defense Council, or GDC,
initially agreed to pay attorneys fifteen thousand dollars. Low Rod's lawyer,
Angela to Williams, realized this pay wouldn't be enough to
keep her solvent through a year long case. She filed
a request for the State of Georgia to raise her pay,
and when that request was denied, here's what she told
(11:21):
the press.
Speaker 9 (11:22):
I'm thinking maybe I need to start an only fan.
Speaker 10 (11:24):
I'm very serious is I might have to do a
only fans because at least I can still support my
client and support me and my family.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
Look in this context, starting on OnlyFans actually makes sense.
Due to the complexities of this case, taking on more
clients just isn't an option.
Speaker 8 (11:42):
I am going to be in this case full time
for the next six to nine months. I cannot take
any other cases and be there in person. I am
taking cases or clients that are not in custody, but
if somebody's in custody, wouldn't be proper for me to
(12:02):
take it because I won't be there for them at
first appearance, I won't be there for them at a
bond hearing, and I let all the clients that right
now are hiring me. Hey, by the way, the case
is going to be delayed because I am on traw
and I expect to be on traw for someone.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
And the economics of this case don't just hit the defense,
they hit the people who the defense will eventually be
trying to sway.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
The wire cell trial began in January twenty twenty three.
It has already beaten records for the longest jury selection
in the state's history. Who in Fulton County will actually
be able to afford taking off work to serve on
the jury. That's the million dollar question. Now that Judge
Glennville has seen over two thousand prospective jurors, hundreds of
(13:05):
hardship exemptions have been filed.
Speaker 8 (13:07):
In this particular case. I cannot think of anybody that
is not going to have a hardship. This is a
hard jip for me. People want to get out of
jury duty. A lot of people that look like you
and me want to get out.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Of jury duty.
Speaker 8 (13:20):
So we end up with jurists that do not look
like our clients. They're not their peers, but as long
as their peers were part of the pool.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
In July twenty twenty three, the process of war Dear,
when prospective jurors get asked a series of questions to
determine whether or not they could be impartial enough to
serve on the trial, finally began.
Speaker 8 (13:40):
The way the indictment reads makes it sound like we
live in the worst city in the world. This is
truly actual Gotham City. How are we talking in the
middle of the city right now without any guards protecting us,
Because that indictment makes it seem like Atlanta is a terrible,
terrible place, and we should not be here. I guarantee
(14:01):
you everybody's going to be terrified.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
At the root of this hardship, according to defense attorneys,
is how Georgia defines a gang. The most memorable explanation
we've heard is from APD gang detective Kimberly Underwood.
Speaker 5 (14:14):
We don't care what you call yourself. You can be
the girl Scouts.
Speaker 7 (14:16):
If you the girl Scouts outside of Walmart and I
come out and you say, are you going to buy
these cookies? And I say, no, man or not today?
And they pull out a gun say you're gonna buy
these cookies. That's criminal gang activity. They don't matter what
your name or your group is. If you do the
crime or the criminal gang activity, we consider you a
criminal street gang.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
And so, even when taking into account all of the
plea deals that the District Attorney's office is negotiated, defense
attorneys like you met ins view this case is prosecutorial overkill.
That is jamming up Fulton County's justice system.
Speaker 8 (14:51):
When somebody admits that something is a gang, who cares
the cops are gonna say it's a gang anyway, They're
going to say it was three or more people, and
the definition of the statute says blah blah blah, and
they meet it because blah blah blah. And if they don't,
then they are a hybrid gang. And if they don't,
then blah blah blah. So who cares. He says it's
a gang, he says, it's a record label. They are
(15:14):
making gangs out of anything. What a true gang is
is what a historical gang would be, the bloods, the
cribs and their hierarchy and there and nothing happens without
somebody giving a go ahead. Right, That's not the case
in this case or many of the gang cases that
are prosecuted in Georgia. They keep saying, well, we don't
have gangs like Chicago we have. They're different here. Well, yeah,
(15:36):
because they're not gangs. They're just a group of kids.
And if they committed a crime, just prove the crime.
Somebody didn't arm robbery, prove the arm robbery. You know
what you get from arm robbery ten to twenty our life.
Who cares? If it's a gang, Just prove your murder.
But you add gang charges to scare people. You add
gang charges to add more time to the back end.
That you shouldn't.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
You can also add gang charges to prosecute people who
have already served time. The indictment charges yet another defendant,
Walter DK Murphy, with being a co founder of YSL,
and therefore violating George's Rico law. It cites crimes from
incidents that took place between twenty twelve and twenty fifteen,
(16:18):
for which Murphy has already spent seven years in prison.
Part of the indictment's case against Murphy is based on
social media an Instagram post but also tattoos. The Instagram
photos cited in the indictment zooms in on the letters
YSL incursive tatted on the right side of Murphy's forehead,
though instead of an S, there's a loopy dollar sign.
(16:41):
Today that tattoo is still visible on Murphy's face, but
he told Atlanta news station WSBTV that his relationship with
YSL has faded after he served his time. God is
ged and focused on what would have been his re
entry into society from prison.
Speaker 6 (16:58):
Since you've been out of prison, have you had any
contact with Young Tug or any other alleged members of YSL.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
No, that didn't matter to Fulton County courts in June
twenty twenty two, after Murphy turned himself in following the
Rico indictment, a judge denied murphy bond. Jimena says that
what Murphy is going through isn't right, and it chosen
a balance of power the justice system where cops, prosecutors
and judges have the upper hand.
Speaker 8 (17:28):
Part of the reason why I want it to be
involved in the case and defend the case is what
I've seen. They're going against young men. Some of them
are men. Some of them are kids who have already
pled and served their time for the crime they did.
And what was their crime? This time taking accountability, taking responsibility,
(17:52):
serving their sentence, and still existing. You have more than
one person who has already done time and the only
thing that they had knew about him was a picture.
What did he do other than go to prison, repay
his debt to society, come back out, get a real job,
be a man. But he still has that tattoo. Those
(18:16):
pictures are still out there. How is that a crime?
Reco says it is. I do believe doing those type
of things? Is this abuse of the of the reco statue? Yes,
it's legal, doesn't mean it's right.
Speaker 5 (18:34):
I mean, it's that terrible here.
Speaker 8 (18:35):
Maybe just step away from the.
Speaker 1 (18:36):
Road a little bit, if we just go back to
the Martin Show.
Speaker 8 (18:38):
We have a truck right here.
Speaker 5 (18:39):
It's big enough.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Do you want to go on the truck outside an
m barbershop, the scene of Donovan Thomas's death in twenty fifteen.
Sean Hoover graciously agrees to host our next conversation about
this trial.
Speaker 11 (18:51):
To play your.
Speaker 12 (18:52):
Own audio booth again, that's.
Speaker 6 (18:54):
One way to look at it.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
Yeah, inside that black ran big Horn pickup truck, we
debate whether it's air conditioning will be too loud. Should
the air be offer it though?
Speaker 11 (19:05):
Probably?
Speaker 5 (19:05):
But if we get to.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Havel Okay, I know with Atlanta, we know this is
a podcast, but even in springtime, Atlanta humidity can feel oppressive.
I guess we need an introduction first, right.
Speaker 13 (19:18):
My name is Sean Hoover. I'm with the Georgia Public
Defender Council. I lead the Gang and Rico Task Unit
for the Public Defenders.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Hoover has been part of George's Public Defender Council since
twenty fifteen. We're meeting him because he was representing one
of the YSL trial defendants.
Speaker 13 (19:33):
Yes, that's correct that defendant mister some Antonio Sumlan took
a plea.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Deal in December twenty twenty two, one month before the
trial officially began. Before he took the plea deal, Someland
was charged with two counts of conspiracy to commit a crime.
One of those crimes was the attempted murder of Yfn Lucci.
Smland was also charged with participating in criminal street gang activity.
The indictment site's three social media posts. One Instagram photo
(20:02):
from twenty seventeen, also featuring Young Thug captured original slime Shit,
a second Instagram post with YSL defendant Shen It's still
well captioned shut up in lacer boots, It's wartime. And
a third social media post from Cleveland Avenue Park where
Antonio someone wears a shirt that says MASA. That acronym
(20:23):
stands for Make America Slime Again, a clothing line founded
by another YSL defendant, Miles Farley, though Farley's attorneys say
that Make America Slime Again has quote nothing to do
with YSL. Explicitly, Hoover says that social media doesn't paid
us complete a picture of gang activity, as the DA's
office would like to believe.
Speaker 13 (20:44):
And the majority of the cases, they're just using YouTube
videos and the Facebook videos to say, Look, they're all
in a gang. And this is how we know they're
in a gang because they're all standing in front of
the apartment complex that they lived in or on the
street that they lived in, and one friend is wrapping,
so all of them are dressed the same and throwing
of hand signs and you know, wearing colors. So now
they're all in a gang. So are there people that
claim YSL or that are from that neighborhood that have
(21:05):
committed a crime before. Yes, But YSL as a whole
is not a gang. And that's the problem that the das.
They know that, but they don't care about that. They're
going to pull everybody under this umbrella that YSL is YSL.
So anyone that's wearing the colors, anyone that has a tattoo,
anyone from the area is tied with every single person
that's committed a crime. That's just like saying, all of
(21:27):
us right now we're professionals in some way. If I
go out and commit a crime, now we're all a
gang because I committed a crime and we're associates and
we're professionals. That's how they're looking at it, But why
sell as a whole.
Speaker 5 (21:38):
They're not a gang.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
As a result of that broad scope, Hoover says that
not all of the yel defendants even know each other.
Speaker 13 (21:46):
When we first started and all the co defendants came
in together, my client, who's in his thirties, we're looking
at the younger ones coming out, and he was like,
I have no idea who he is. I've never seen
this kid in my life.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
It will be up to prosecutors to prove all the
defense are connected. The judge's office estimates this trial will
take six to nine months, but that's only after jury
selection begins in earnest, which could potentially stretch to nearly
a year all on its own, especially with no shows
and cell phones eating up precious time. It will likely
become the longest criminal trial in Georgia's history. District Attorney
(22:22):
Finding Willis doesn't seem phased by the trial's perspective length.
Have an aneurysm when I think about the January had
started in January, I just wonder what you must think
about all of this.
Speaker 9 (22:34):
We have to come to work and do our work,
so the judge controls the way the trial is outlined.
I have probably tried thirty homicides before. Judge Glanville just
happened to be one of the courtrooms that I was
assigned to. He certainly seasoned. Our job is to come
there and present the evidence, and that's what we plan
to do and as long.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
As this takes.
Speaker 9 (22:54):
Justice is not always fast, but we want to do
it in a way that shows dignity to people, not
in that case, in every case, and so we'll be
there as long as it takes.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Fanie Willis is right. Justice is not always swift. That's
especially true for cases as complicated as gang indictments. But
as Georgia ramps up street gang prosecutions to address concerns
about spiking violence, Hoover worries that his own clients outside
the Ysol trial won't see justice for years because of
(23:25):
that effort. Their cases may not be the longest in history,
but that's because the clock doesn't start ticking until they
get a trial.
Speaker 13 (23:33):
Let me tell you exactly what one of my clients
goes through. So let's go with my fourteen year old.
My fourteen year old. The DAS took the case to
a grand jury especially indicted him and got Warrens. He
goes to jail. Now, because the case has been indicted,
we don't get a preliminary hearing, which means we can't
take the case in front of a magistrate judge to
(23:54):
see what type of evidence they actually have so we
can start to fight it then. So the first thing
we do is ask for or a bond. The das
have been taught to put a number of gang charges
on these clients because there's no judge out there that's
going to want to be put in the paper this
says judge dot dot dot gave a gang member a
bond on a case, and now these gang members are
(24:15):
being released. So my fourteen year old stays in prison.
Now fast forward, and this is the most disheartening part.
If he's fourteen when it's started, by the time we
actually finished this case, I guarantee he's going to be
closer to seventeen, eighteen, nineteen years old. For the judicial system,
that's an adult. He's going to transfer from the YDC,
the Youth Detention Center where he is now, to the
(24:37):
Fulton County Detention Center to where people are literally dying
all the time. Him being fourteen to seventeen, we could
have about five different bond hearings, and the question the
judge always asks is, well, what's changed in his circumstances.
The only thing that changes he's now been in here
for another year. And the biggest thing the das always
say is that well, because this is a Rico prosecution,
the investigation is still ongoing, so we don't know when
(24:59):
the trial's actually gone to start. The only reason yl
didn't take that long is because Jeffrey Williams and Sergio
Kitchens were involved. I have kids that have been in
jail literally two three years now that we're still waiting
on trial days, not even hearing days at this point,
we're waiting on trial days. And that's because you throw
that gang on there, no one's going to give them
a bond, and if they do, it's going to be
a bond that's literally two hundred and fifty five hundred thousand.
(25:21):
We're talking about seventeen year old kids that can't afford.
Speaker 2 (25:24):
That nineteen year old were Daelius Ryan's screams didn't just
(25:44):
echo into the courtroom, they reverberated into the homes of
people paying attention to the YSL trial tense moments inside
the courtroom.
Speaker 10 (25:53):
Screaming was heard as Robert Young Thug sat in the courtroom.
Speaker 6 (25:56):
The defendant, Rodealius Ryan, had been escorted out of the courtroom.
Screams from the holding area were heard.
Speaker 8 (26:02):
They take mister Ryan, the young child, I mean he's
a kid. Take him to the back and we can
hear him screaming.
Speaker 14 (26:08):
Officials cleared the courtroom after promotion during the YSL trial.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
The clip was already making the rounds on social media
when Judge Errol Glanville called everyone back into the courtroom
to presume proceedings. A formality to send people home.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
Lady and gentlemen, less we have anything else, I'll go
ahead and excuse for the evening.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
But before Glanville could dismiss, Young Thug's attorney, Brian Steele
pipes up, yeah you may, and suddenly we find ourselves
part of the proceeding.
Speaker 5 (26:36):
Your honor.
Speaker 14 (26:37):
Everybody stands when you come in court room or leave.
Speaker 5 (26:41):
We have respect for you.
Speaker 14 (26:42):
Mister Williams is innocent. We came here to have a
fair trial, and that's what you do. That's why we're
going through this process. It's taking months and that's okay,
because we're talking about something that could end people's lives,
so it's worth it.
Speaker 5 (27:00):
I am not saying this is accurate, but.
Speaker 14 (27:03):
I was told, and there's witnesses here, that they were
alerted to come to your honorable court today because there
was going to be something newsworthy.
Speaker 5 (27:15):
This imedium was.
Speaker 14 (27:16):
Called allegedly by now I'm not saying any of these prosecutors,
but by somebody.
Speaker 5 (27:21):
With their office.
Speaker 14 (27:24):
And if that really happened, that's outrageous. This was an embarrassment.
Thank you, sir.
Speaker 3 (27:33):
And I said, do you, as with anybody, if you
feel that you need to put an emotion for me
to hear and consider, I would invite you to do
so so and I can go ahead and take that up,
Miss Lowe.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
The prosecutor Adrian Love then asked to address the court.
Speaker 10 (27:48):
Just like to say, for the record and for clarity's sake,
that there is no way anyone from our office could
have predicted the events that occurred today to suggests that
it was orchestrated by our office. Would I imply that
we knew that there would be wrongdoing going on and
(28:10):
wanted to capture it on camera somehow, So I categorically
object to the idea that the state has somehow done
some unethical thing and orchestrated an event that only the
defendants knew, and thankfully the Sheriff's department learned what was
happening today.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
I'm sure you've already put it together. But that member
of the media Brian Steele and Adrian Lover talking about
is me. As a crime reporter, I've developed relationships with
all sorts of people in law enforcement. Someone from the
DA's office did call me to tell me to come
to court that day. That person didn't tell me why.
(28:57):
Max Shard alluded to it at the top of the
lab episode. A Fulton County Sheriff's deputy named Morris Kantacai
had been accused of assaulting Ryan earlier in the trial
when his body camera wasn't turned on, and he was
called to testify that day because as a coincidence, he
had been one of the arresting officers and a bust
involving Via Celle defendants years earlier when he was an
(29:20):
APD patrol officer. That testimony was supposed to start right
before Rhdalius. Ryan's screams echoed through the courtroom in response
to all this hullabaloo and talk of a potential staged event,
the Fulton County Sheriff's Office released bodycamp footage of the
Ryan incident just a few days later.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
In the footage, you can see a half dozen Sheriff's
deputies escorting Ryan back into the holding cell area. They
tell him they could smell weed on.
Speaker 3 (29:50):
Him back in the corner of before.
Speaker 12 (29:56):
Multiple people see smell Ronirwan, you're going to be stresser.
Speaker 5 (30:00):
Do you have any on your person?
Speaker 3 (30:01):
You just want to go in the hand over now?
Speaker 5 (30:05):
I can still smell it right here. Answer, that's fine.
Speaker 12 (30:09):
I understand that I'm having a conversation with you before
we go for it, So I need to go ahead
and take your clothes off like.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Ryan protests, but then removes the suit coat and hands
it to one of the deputies. Over the course of
three minutes, he slowly disrobes until he's standing in front
of the deputies and what appears to be two pairs
of boxer shorts. Police tell him he needs to drop
his underwear. He starts to protest again.
Speaker 14 (30:35):
I understand, Nick, are you having to take your clothes off?
Speaker 5 (30:46):
I know you don't want to do this. I don't
want to have to see the navy right now, Honestly,
I don't. I don't get off like this.
Speaker 13 (30:51):
I'll feel good about this, but it's what has to happen,
hiss like.
Speaker 14 (31:01):
I don't can and just just.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
A second, that didn't happen. Instead, As Ryan requests his attorney,
two deputies grab his wrists, two more closing on him
as reinforcements.
Speaker 12 (31:19):
Just a second, don't.
Speaker 5 (31:34):
We're come?
Speaker 2 (31:41):
That's the screen that echoed through the courtroom. The deputies
carry him down the hall to another room, perhaps so
he'll be less disruptive to the outside, but Ryan continues
to scream it's no body can. The deputies hold him,
(32:08):
force his hands behind his back, lower him to the ground,
and cuff him. The deputy wearing the body can behind
the tape, helps keep Ryan's upper body restrained. As others
complete the strip search. Deputies find two bags of weeds
(32:32):
sewn into a second pair of underwear.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
Do I know why the DA's office told me to
show up in court that day? No, they wouldn't tell me,
But after watching the tape, I can tell you one thing.
When the stakes are this high and proceedings are drawn
out this long, when there are a dozen different defendants
in one room, all facing their fate day after day
(33:01):
after day, some already facing life sentences with nothing left
to lose. Emotions run high, tempers run hot, trust is eroded,
and coincidences can easily be confused with conspiracies.
Speaker 2 (33:22):
Next time on King Slime, did you know the lyrical
part of this was going to be a lightning Rocker criticism?
Speaker 9 (33:28):
I guess the better question is did I can what
rap lyrics say about the YSL defendants?
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Fatter one?
Speaker 11 (33:35):
On four sixteen of twenty one, there's a video released
called Ski Ski with lyrics stating, I fucked with slats,
we come to eat rats, I came with some puranas,
I tote an FN or reference to a handgun.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
And what their use in court says about our legal system.
Speaker 15 (33:57):
Look, there has been a very strategic, deliberate plan on
how young black men, young Black America is portrayed in
mass media. That narrative of criminals guilt before innocence has
been a jacket that Black America has worn for a
(34:19):
very long time in its country.
Speaker 1 (34:25):
King Slime is the production of iHeart Podcasts and Heirloom Media.
Speaker 2 (34:30):
It's written and produced by George Cheaty, Christina Lee, and
Tommy Andres.
Speaker 1 (34:34):
Mixing, sound designer and original music by Evan Tyre and
Taylor Chicogne.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
The executive producer and editor is Tommy Andres.
Speaker 1 (34:41):
Fact checking by Kayln lynch Our.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
Theme music is by dun Deal Special.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
Thanks to the Atlanta News outlets, eleven Alive, WSBTV, Atlanta
News First, and Fox five.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
For more shows from iHeart Podcasts, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts
King Slime is a production of iHeart Podcasts and Heirloom Media.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
It's Monday, April third, twenty twenty three, three months into
the Wisoul trial. Jud Gerald Glanville is on the stand
in Courtroom one sea. His brow is furrowed, his steely
eyes peer out over a black COVID mask embroidered with
a white Fulton County seal on one side. The subject
of his intense gaze is a young black woman in
a business suit standing at the clerk's desk.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
All right, Juror Tano four, Good morning, madam, Good morning.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
Just a few weeks earlier, Juror Teno Ford reported for
Jerry Duty.
Speaker 4 (00:38):
Okay, So I'm going to explain what everything that happened
that day on the seventeenth or March.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
Okay, But before then, you recall this court giving you
the ad naugeum admonitions about acceptable behavior.
Speaker 5 (00:51):
About having phones out. Yes, at the moment.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
When we came, didn't I tell you to turn your
phone off?
Speaker 4 (00:57):
It was I'm gonna be truthfully and very honest, when it.
Speaker 5 (01:00):
Was a lot going on. We had just come from.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Different Answer my question first and then you can explain it.
Do you recall us telling you to turn off your
cell phones.
Speaker 5 (01:10):
Yes, sir, in.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
Violation, Juror Teno Fur took out her phone to record
a portion of the trial of one of the most
famous rappers on the planet from the jury pool. Little
did she know just a few weeks later she would
be standing in front of that famous rapper and twelve
of his co defendants, trying to explain her way out
of trouble.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
Okay, so when you was giving the speech, everybody was talking.
Speaker 5 (01:36):
I did take a.
Speaker 4 (01:38):
Video, and then the young lady next to me, she
was like, man, we're not supposed to be recording. Soon
as they said that, I deleted everything right then and there,
maybe an hour went by.
Speaker 5 (01:49):
That's when the officer came up to.
Speaker 4 (01:50):
Me and said somebody had told us that you may
be recording.
Speaker 5 (01:54):
So I showed them the phone.
Speaker 4 (01:56):
They went through my recent deleted photos and seeing the
video that I made. And this is my first time.
That was my first home ever being in court in
my whole entire life. So I wasn't really sure of
anything we couldn't and could not do.
Speaker 5 (02:08):
So I do apologize for day.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
She may never have been in court before that day
in March, but on this day in April, she's getting
a crash course in criminal justice.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
You know, there are varying reasons that we tell that
we punish people in society. Okay, I'm just going to
tell you the reasons are. One just general is retribution,
I for n The second reason that we punish people
is for general deterrence. We don't want other people doing
this kind of same thing. Third reason is specific the deterrence,
I mean, we don't want you doing this again. And
(02:41):
then it's rehabilitation and re entry. So, ma'am, in this
particular situation, you videotaped our proceedings was just a brazen
violation of these particular proceedings. You society, you can just
do what you wanted to do.
Speaker 5 (02:55):
It's not want your phone on what I wanted to do. Well,
you pulled out your.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Phone in videotape our proceedings, and that was in direct
violation of this court, sour. So I'm going to send
you to three days of in jail, and that will
I want to satisfy you contempt.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
I'm Christina League and I'm George Cheaty. This is King Slime.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
The prosecution of Young Thug and YSL.
Speaker 6 (03:38):
Today there was some drama in the corporal good using it.
Speaker 5 (03:41):
Thank you for joining us tonight. I'm Rosstrousser.
Speaker 7 (03:43):
I'm Courtney Briant, a potential juror in the YSL trial,
was arrested accused of recording video during courtroom proceedings.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
You're ten oh four is reportedly released after five hours
in jail, but Judge Glanville's punishment sends a message inside
the courtroom and beyond.
Speaker 6 (03:59):
That's right Russ according that potential jurors out of jail
after several hours. The judge initially sentenced her to three days.
We speak with a legal expert. She says, this judge
is not playing around.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
Glanville is the chief judge of the Fulton County Superior
Court and a retired army general who handled war crimes
in Afghanistan. He has little tolerance for his conduct. And
you don't have to take Juror tenofour's word for it.
Ask Juror sixty four from way back in January. She
took one look at the jury form and skipped out
(04:35):
at lunch, preferring to go on vacation in the Dominican Republic.
Speaker 3 (04:39):
Ordinarily, Madam, I do find you in contempt. But here's
what I'm going to do. Contempt is punishable easily by
a fine of one thousand dollars and or twenty days
in jail. I am not going to find you. In
order for you to satisfy your contempt, I'm going to
commute the twenty days and require you to write a
(05:00):
thirty page paper on the importance of jury service. Here's
the criteria. You'll have to do APA style. You're gonna
have to use at least ten primary sources ten secondary sources.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
In July, Judge Glanville faced another no show juror.
Speaker 5 (05:17):
This is very, very serious.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
It's one of the most important cilic obligations that.
Speaker 5 (05:22):
We can have. I literally forgot. It was not a
malicious ax. It was not that I just decided not
become a.
Speaker 1 (05:31):
Shortdayday and gave her a choice five days of trial
observation for twenty days in jail.
Speaker 5 (05:38):
What do you want to do? How do the five days?
Speaker 2 (05:41):
But it isn't only jurors who have faced Glanville's wrath.
He's threatened the gallery of observers too.
Speaker 3 (05:46):
And if anybody's in the gallery and you can't otherwise
control yourself or otherwise make it if you want to
make any appropriate comments, and you can leave at this
point in time. But if you remain in this courtroom
and make it and make any outbursts, I have.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
You arrested and has held three defense attorneys in contempt.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
You were held in contempt, young man.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Why is self defendant? Miles Farley's lawyer Anastasio's Minettas offered
to pay a two hundred and fifty dollars fee instead
of spending twenty days in jail for being late to
a hearing.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
But I satisfied your contempt by you paying two hundred
and fifty dollars, which you did, and I have that receipt.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
Here, And just like that, Duro ditched court for the
Beach Christian Epiccher's defense attorney, Eric Johnson was ordered to
write an essay for being tardy.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
And seventeen page paper on the importance of professionals in
the legal field and treating ones opponents with civility. Paper
is to be published quality in APA format at least
ten primary and ten secondary sources. Say again, you say again,
mister Jimines.
Speaker 5 (06:50):
Was a good publish You know I have never been voting.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
Okay, all right, okay, but that's another issue that we're
not going to do today.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
But anyways, that voice that popped up with an unwelcome
reality check belongs to defense attorney Surrichata Humenez. He represents
wise held defendant Cordarius Dorsey. He also faces the judges
ire for lateness, but instead of a fine or an essay,
he's told to grab some sandwiches.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
Purchase lines for each of your attorney colleagues in this case.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
On May twelfth, twenty twenty three, Jimenez ventures half mile
away from the Fulton County Courthouse to Magic City, the
Atlanta strip club famous for catering to rappers, basketball stars,
and Hollywood elite, and instead of sandwiches, he opts for
lemon pepper wings. Jimenez documents the ordeal by posting photos
(07:47):
to Instagram, first a selfie in the rain from the
Magic City parking lot showing its front sign depicting the
Atlanta skyline. Then from inside the Darkly Lake Club as
an employee in a red Magic City hit, he packs
aluminum trays into blue branded tote bags. Finally, another selfie
at the courthouse where the conference table becomes a banquet
(08:08):
table for Jimenez. The other attorneys and their huge takeout order.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
Early on in the trial, before his visit to Magic City,
Jimanus agrees to sit down with us at our table,
No wings required.
Speaker 8 (08:23):
Well, i am Soudy Chada Humenis. I'm an attorney. I
do criminal defense. I've been doing criminal defense for I
think about six and a half years now.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Prior to his defense work, Jimenez was a prosecutor at
the District Attorney's office from twenty thirteen to twenty sixteen
under Finnie Willis's predecessor, Paul Howard.
Speaker 8 (08:42):
I like Fannie Willis a lot. I mean, I'm not
a big donor, but you can pull my records. I've
anytime I had a chance, I've donated to her. I'm
believe in what she stands for. Fulton County is a
very difficult place to work at because you're something you're fighting.
You're definitely fighting the defense attorneys, you're fighting the judges
as an ada, and you're fighting your office. And so
you learn how to survive in Fulton County.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
But now, as part of the wisl case, perhaps even
SC's why defense attorneys in Fulton County have historically put
up a fight even as the YSL trial is just beginning.
He seems exhausted. You're not being paid by one of
the labels, right.
Speaker 8 (09:20):
How WI show is getting paid by one of the labels,
and they can steal send some donations that can start
a goalfund me. But no, I took this case as
an appointed case.
Speaker 1 (09:29):
The Judges office estimated that the WISL trial would take
six to nine months. At the WISL trial isn't even
the only reco case on his plate right now.
Speaker 8 (09:38):
At this moment, I have three reco cases that I'm
representing clients on. I am not Bruce Harvey or Brian
Steele or any of these top attorneys that just get
all the mob bosses or whatever you know.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
Both of these attorneys are also linked to the trial
by the way, Bruce Harvey represents Qumarvius Nichols, Ryan Steel
none other than young thug. The defense attorneys themselves have
become a cast of characters, for good or ill. They're
a mix of some of the most seasoned professionals in Atlanta,
like Harvey and Steel, and some of the city's newest
(10:14):
and youngest attorneys. The age gap shows at times.
Speaker 4 (10:18):
I will start by saying that this assertion that I
did not mention the fourth three argument.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
Don't worry about that, okay, because it wouldn't be I'd
have to do it anyway, So I don't even worry
about that, Okay, Okay.
Speaker 5 (10:33):
I was just saying that it's just not true. It's
cap to be honest.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
But that's Justin Hill, the twenty six year old attorney
for Damon Blaylock. Hill's comment using the word cap, a
slang word for lying, went viral in April. But regardless
of age, there's this overarching concern over how exactly justice
will be served in the YSL trial. While the State
of Georgia has leveraged millions of dollars to prosecute a
(10:59):
growing number of cases, the Georgia Defense Council, or GDC,
initially agreed to pay attorneys fifteen thousand dollars. Low Rod's lawyer,
Angela to Williams, realized this pay wouldn't be enough to
keep her solvent through a year long case. She filed
a request for the State of Georgia to raise her pay,
and when that request was denied, here's what she told
(11:21):
the press.
Speaker 9 (11:22):
I'm thinking maybe I need to start an only fan.
Speaker 10 (11:24):
I'm very serious is I might have to do a
only fans because at least I can still support my
client and support me and my family.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
Look in this context, starting on OnlyFans actually makes sense.
Due to the complexities of this case, taking on more
clients just isn't an option.
Speaker 8 (11:42):
I am going to be in this case full time
for the next six to nine months. I cannot take
any other cases and be there in person. I am
taking cases or clients that are not in custody, but
if somebody's in custody, wouldn't be proper for me to
(12:02):
take it because I won't be there for them at
first appearance, I won't be there for them at a
bond hearing, and I let all the clients that right
now are hiring me. Hey, by the way, the case
is going to be delayed because I am on traw
and I expect to be on traw for someone.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
And the economics of this case don't just hit the defense,
they hit the people who the defense will eventually be
trying to sway.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
The wire cell trial began in January twenty twenty three.
It has already beaten records for the longest jury selection
in the state's history. Who in Fulton County will actually
be able to afford taking off work to serve on
the jury. That's the million dollar question. Now that Judge
Glennville has seen over two thousand prospective jurors, hundreds of
(13:05):
hardship exemptions have been filed.
Speaker 8 (13:07):
In this particular case. I cannot think of anybody that
is not going to have a hardship. This is a
hard jip for me. People want to get out of
jury duty. A lot of people that look like you
and me want to get out.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Of jury duty.
Speaker 8 (13:20):
So we end up with jurists that do not look
like our clients. They're not their peers, but as long
as their peers were part of the pool.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
In July twenty twenty three, the process of war Dear,
when prospective jurors get asked a series of questions to
determine whether or not they could be impartial enough to
serve on the trial, finally began.
Speaker 8 (13:40):
The way the indictment reads makes it sound like we
live in the worst city in the world. This is
truly actual Gotham City. How are we talking in the
middle of the city right now without any guards protecting us,
Because that indictment makes it seem like Atlanta is a terrible,
terrible place, and we should not be here. I guarantee
(14:01):
you everybody's going to be terrified.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
At the root of this hardship, according to defense attorneys,
is how Georgia defines a gang. The most memorable explanation
we've heard is from APD gang detective Kimberly Underwood.
Speaker 5 (14:14):
We don't care what you call yourself. You can be
the girl Scouts.
Speaker 7 (14:16):
If you the girl Scouts outside of Walmart and I
come out and you say, are you going to buy
these cookies? And I say, no, man or not today?
And they pull out a gun say you're gonna buy
these cookies. That's criminal gang activity. They don't matter what
your name or your group is. If you do the
crime or the criminal gang activity, we consider you a
criminal street gang.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
And so, even when taking into account all of the
plea deals that the District Attorney's office is negotiated, defense
attorneys like you met ins view this case is prosecutorial overkill.
That is jamming up Fulton County's justice system.
Speaker 8 (14:51):
When somebody admits that something is a gang, who cares
the cops are gonna say it's a gang anyway, They're
going to say it was three or more people, and
the definition of the statute says blah blah blah, and
they meet it because blah blah blah. And if they don't,
then they are a hybrid gang. And if they don't,
then blah blah blah. So who cares. He says it's
a gang, he says, it's a record label. They are
(15:14):
making gangs out of anything. What a true gang is
is what a historical gang would be, the bloods, the
cribs and their hierarchy and there and nothing happens without
somebody giving a go ahead. Right, That's not the case
in this case or many of the gang cases that
are prosecuted in Georgia. They keep saying, well, we don't
have gangs like Chicago we have. They're different here. Well, yeah,
(15:36):
because they're not gangs. They're just a group of kids.
And if they committed a crime, just prove the crime.
Somebody didn't arm robbery, prove the arm robbery. You know
what you get from arm robbery ten to twenty our life.
Who cares? If it's a gang, Just prove your murder.
But you add gang charges to scare people. You add
gang charges to add more time to the back end.
That you shouldn't.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
You can also add gang charges to prosecute people who
have already served time. The indictment charges yet another defendant,
Walter DK Murphy, with being a co founder of YSL,
and therefore violating George's Rico law. It cites crimes from
incidents that took place between twenty twelve and twenty fifteen,
(16:18):
for which Murphy has already spent seven years in prison.
Part of the indictment's case against Murphy is based on
social media an Instagram post but also tattoos. The Instagram
photos cited in the indictment zooms in on the letters
YSL incursive tatted on the right side of Murphy's forehead,
though instead of an S, there's a loopy dollar sign.
(16:41):
Today that tattoo is still visible on Murphy's face, but
he told Atlanta news station WSBTV that his relationship with
YSL has faded after he served his time. God is
ged and focused on what would have been his re
entry into society from prison.
Speaker 6 (16:58):
Since you've been out of prison, have you had any
contact with Young Tug or any other alleged members of YSL.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
No, that didn't matter to Fulton County courts in June
twenty twenty two, after Murphy turned himself in following the
Rico indictment, a judge denied murphy bond. Jimena says that
what Murphy is going through isn't right, and it chosen
a balance of power the justice system where cops, prosecutors
and judges have the upper hand.
Speaker 8 (17:28):
Part of the reason why I want it to be
involved in the case and defend the case is what
I've seen. They're going against young men. Some of them
are men. Some of them are kids who have already
pled and served their time for the crime they did.
And what was their crime? This time taking accountability, taking responsibility,
(17:52):
serving their sentence, and still existing. You have more than
one person who has already done time and the only
thing that they had knew about him was a picture.
What did he do other than go to prison, repay
his debt to society, come back out, get a real job,
be a man. But he still has that tattoo. Those
(18:16):
pictures are still out there. How is that a crime?
Reco says it is. I do believe doing those type
of things? Is this abuse of the of the reco statue? Yes,
it's legal, doesn't mean it's right.
Speaker 5 (18:34):
I mean, it's that terrible here.
Speaker 8 (18:35):
Maybe just step away from the.
Speaker 1 (18:36):
Road a little bit, if we just go back to
the Martin Show.
Speaker 8 (18:38):
We have a truck right here.
Speaker 5 (18:39):
It's big enough.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Do you want to go on the truck outside an
m barbershop, the scene of Donovan Thomas's death in twenty fifteen.
Sean Hoover graciously agrees to host our next conversation about
this trial.
Speaker 11 (18:51):
To play your.
Speaker 12 (18:52):
Own audio booth again, that's.
Speaker 6 (18:54):
One way to look at it.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
Yeah, inside that black ran big Horn pickup truck, we
debate whether it's air conditioning will be too loud. Should
the air be offer it though?
Speaker 11 (19:05):
Probably?
Speaker 5 (19:05):
But if we get to.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Havel Okay, I know with Atlanta, we know this is
a podcast, but even in springtime, Atlanta humidity can feel oppressive.
I guess we need an introduction first, right.
Speaker 13 (19:18):
My name is Sean Hoover. I'm with the Georgia Public
Defender Council. I lead the Gang and Rico Task Unit
for the Public Defenders.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Hoover has been part of George's Public Defender Council since
twenty fifteen. We're meeting him because he was representing one
of the YSL trial defendants.
Speaker 13 (19:33):
Yes, that's correct that defendant mister some Antonio Sumlan took
a plea.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Deal in December twenty twenty two, one month before the
trial officially began. Before he took the plea deal, Someland
was charged with two counts of conspiracy to commit a crime.
One of those crimes was the attempted murder of Yfn Lucci.
Smland was also charged with participating in criminal street gang activity.
The indictment site's three social media posts. One Instagram photo
(20:02):
from twenty seventeen, also featuring Young Thug captured original slime Shit,
a second Instagram post with YSL defendant Shen It's still
well captioned shut up in lacer boots, It's wartime. And
a third social media post from Cleveland Avenue Park where
Antonio someone wears a shirt that says MASA. That acronym
(20:23):
stands for Make America Slime Again, a clothing line founded
by another YSL defendant, Miles Farley, though Farley's attorneys say
that Make America Slime Again has quote nothing to do
with YSL. Explicitly, Hoover says that social media doesn't paid
us complete a picture of gang activity, as the DA's
office would like to believe.
Speaker 13 (20:44):
And the majority of the cases, they're just using YouTube
videos and the Facebook videos to say, Look, they're all
in a gang. And this is how we know they're
in a gang because they're all standing in front of
the apartment complex that they lived in or on the
street that they lived in, and one friend is wrapping,
so all of them are dressed the same and throwing
of hand signs and you know, wearing colors. So now
they're all in a gang. So are there people that
claim YSL or that are from that neighborhood that have
(21:05):
committed a crime before. Yes, But YSL as a whole
is not a gang. And that's the problem that the das.
They know that, but they don't care about that. They're
going to pull everybody under this umbrella that YSL is YSL.
So anyone that's wearing the colors, anyone that has a tattoo,
anyone from the area is tied with every single person
that's committed a crime. That's just like saying, all of
(21:27):
us right now we're professionals in some way. If I
go out and commit a crime, now we're all a
gang because I committed a crime and we're associates and
we're professionals. That's how they're looking at it, But why
sell as a whole.
Speaker 5 (21:38):
They're not a gang.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
As a result of that broad scope, Hoover says that
not all of the yel defendants even know each other.
Speaker 13 (21:46):
When we first started and all the co defendants came
in together, my client, who's in his thirties, we're looking
at the younger ones coming out, and he was like,
I have no idea who he is. I've never seen
this kid in my life.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
It will be up to prosecutors to prove all the
defense are connected. The judge's office estimates this trial will
take six to nine months, but that's only after jury
selection begins in earnest, which could potentially stretch to nearly
a year all on its own, especially with no shows
and cell phones eating up precious time. It will likely
become the longest criminal trial in Georgia's history. District Attorney
(22:22):
Finding Willis doesn't seem phased by the trial's perspective length.
Have an aneurysm when I think about the January had
started in January, I just wonder what you must think
about all of this.
Speaker 9 (22:34):
We have to come to work and do our work,
so the judge controls the way the trial is outlined.
I have probably tried thirty homicides before. Judge Glanville just
happened to be one of the courtrooms that I was
assigned to. He certainly seasoned. Our job is to come
there and present the evidence, and that's what we plan
to do and as long.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
As this takes.
Speaker 9 (22:54):
Justice is not always fast, but we want to do
it in a way that shows dignity to people, not
in that case, in every case, and so we'll be
there as long as it takes.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Fanie Willis is right. Justice is not always swift. That's
especially true for cases as complicated as gang indictments. But
as Georgia ramps up street gang prosecutions to address concerns
about spiking violence, Hoover worries that his own clients outside
the Ysol trial won't see justice for years because of
(23:25):
that effort. Their cases may not be the longest in history,
but that's because the clock doesn't start ticking until they
get a trial.
Speaker 13 (23:33):
Let me tell you exactly what one of my clients
goes through. So let's go with my fourteen year old.
My fourteen year old. The DAS took the case to
a grand jury especially indicted him and got Warrens. He
goes to jail. Now, because the case has been indicted,
we don't get a preliminary hearing, which means we can't
take the case in front of a magistrate judge to
(23:54):
see what type of evidence they actually have so we
can start to fight it then. So the first thing
we do is ask for or a bond. The das
have been taught to put a number of gang charges
on these clients because there's no judge out there that's
going to want to be put in the paper this
says judge dot dot dot gave a gang member a
bond on a case, and now these gang members are
(24:15):
being released. So my fourteen year old stays in prison.
Now fast forward, and this is the most disheartening part.
If he's fourteen when it's started, by the time we
actually finished this case, I guarantee he's going to be
closer to seventeen, eighteen, nineteen years old. For the judicial system,
that's an adult. He's going to transfer from the YDC,
the Youth Detention Center where he is now, to the
(24:37):
Fulton County Detention Center to where people are literally dying
all the time. Him being fourteen to seventeen, we could
have about five different bond hearings, and the question the
judge always asks is, well, what's changed in his circumstances.
The only thing that changes he's now been in here
for another year. And the biggest thing the das always
say is that well, because this is a Rico prosecution,
the investigation is still ongoing, so we don't know when
(24:59):
the trial's actually gone to start. The only reason yl
didn't take that long is because Jeffrey Williams and Sergio
Kitchens were involved. I have kids that have been in
jail literally two three years now that we're still waiting
on trial days, not even hearing days at this point,
we're waiting on trial days. And that's because you throw
that gang on there, no one's going to give them
a bond, and if they do, it's going to be
a bond that's literally two hundred and fifty five hundred thousand.
(25:21):
We're talking about seventeen year old kids that can't afford.
Speaker 2 (25:24):
That nineteen year old were Daelius Ryan's screams didn't just
(25:44):
echo into the courtroom, they reverberated into the homes of
people paying attention to the YSL trial tense moments inside
the courtroom.
Speaker 10 (25:53):
Screaming was heard as Robert Young Thug sat in the courtroom.
Speaker 6 (25:56):
The defendant, Rodealius Ryan, had been escorted out of the courtroom.
Screams from the holding area were heard.
Speaker 8 (26:02):
They take mister Ryan, the young child, I mean he's
a kid. Take him to the back and we can
hear him screaming.
Speaker 14 (26:08):
Officials cleared the courtroom after promotion during the YSL trial.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
The clip was already making the rounds on social media
when Judge Errol Glanville called everyone back into the courtroom
to presume proceedings. A formality to send people home.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
Lady and gentlemen, less we have anything else, I'll go
ahead and excuse for the evening.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
But before Glanville could dismiss, Young Thug's attorney, Brian Steele
pipes up, yeah you may, and suddenly we find ourselves
part of the proceeding.
Speaker 5 (26:36):
Your honor.
Speaker 14 (26:37):
Everybody stands when you come in court room or leave.
Speaker 5 (26:41):
We have respect for you.
Speaker 14 (26:42):
Mister Williams is innocent. We came here to have a
fair trial, and that's what you do. That's why we're
going through this process. It's taking months and that's okay,
because we're talking about something that could end people's lives,
so it's worth it.
Speaker 5 (27:00):
I am not saying this is accurate, but.
Speaker 14 (27:03):
I was told, and there's witnesses here, that they were
alerted to come to your honorable court today because there
was going to be something newsworthy.
Speaker 5 (27:15):
This imedium was.
Speaker 14 (27:16):
Called allegedly by now I'm not saying any of these prosecutors,
but by somebody.
Speaker 5 (27:21):
With their office.
Speaker 14 (27:24):
And if that really happened, that's outrageous. This was an embarrassment.
Thank you, sir.
Speaker 3 (27:33):
And I said, do you, as with anybody, if you
feel that you need to put an emotion for me
to hear and consider, I would invite you to do
so so and I can go ahead and take that up,
Miss Lowe.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
The prosecutor Adrian Love then asked to address the court.
Speaker 10 (27:48):
Just like to say, for the record and for clarity's sake,
that there is no way anyone from our office could
have predicted the events that occurred today to suggests that
it was orchestrated by our office. Would I imply that
we knew that there would be wrongdoing going on and
(28:10):
wanted to capture it on camera somehow, So I categorically
object to the idea that the state has somehow done
some unethical thing and orchestrated an event that only the
defendants knew, and thankfully the Sheriff's department learned what was
happening today.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
I'm sure you've already put it together. But that member
of the media Brian Steele and Adrian Lover talking about
is me. As a crime reporter, I've developed relationships with
all sorts of people in law enforcement. Someone from the
DA's office did call me to tell me to come
to court that day. That person didn't tell me why.
(28:57):
Max Shard alluded to it at the top of the
lab episode. A Fulton County Sheriff's deputy named Morris Kantacai
had been accused of assaulting Ryan earlier in the trial
when his body camera wasn't turned on, and he was
called to testify that day because as a coincidence, he
had been one of the arresting officers and a bust
involving Via Celle defendants years earlier when he was an
(29:20):
APD patrol officer. That testimony was supposed to start right
before Rhdalius. Ryan's screams echoed through the courtroom in response
to all this hullabaloo and talk of a potential staged event,
the Fulton County Sheriff's Office released bodycamp footage of the
Ryan incident just a few days later.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
In the footage, you can see a half dozen Sheriff's
deputies escorting Ryan back into the holding cell area. They
tell him they could smell weed on.
Speaker 3 (29:50):
Him back in the corner of before.
Speaker 12 (29:56):
Multiple people see smell Ronirwan, you're going to be stresser.
Speaker 5 (30:00):
Do you have any on your person?
Speaker 3 (30:01):
You just want to go in the hand over now?
Speaker 5 (30:05):
I can still smell it right here. Answer, that's fine.
Speaker 12 (30:09):
I understand that I'm having a conversation with you before
we go for it, So I need to go ahead
and take your clothes off like.
Speaker 2 (30:15):
Ryan protests, but then removes the suit coat and hands
it to one of the deputies. Over the course of
three minutes, he slowly disrobes until he's standing in front
of the deputies and what appears to be two pairs
of boxer shorts. Police tell him he needs to drop
his underwear. He starts to protest again.
Speaker 14 (30:35):
I understand, Nick, are you having to take your clothes off?
Speaker 5 (30:46):
I know you don't want to do this. I don't
want to have to see the navy right now, Honestly,
I don't. I don't get off like this.
Speaker 13 (30:51):
I'll feel good about this, but it's what has to happen,
hiss like.
Speaker 14 (31:01):
I don't can and just just.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
A second, that didn't happen. Instead, As Ryan requests his attorney,
two deputies grab his wrists, two more closing on him
as reinforcements.
Speaker 12 (31:19):
Just a second, don't.
Speaker 5 (31:34):
We're come?
Speaker 2 (31:41):
That's the screen that echoed through the courtroom. The deputies
carry him down the hall to another room, perhaps so
he'll be less disruptive to the outside, but Ryan continues
to scream it's no body can. The deputies hold him,
(32:08):
force his hands behind his back, lower him to the ground,
and cuff him. The deputy wearing the body can behind
the tape, helps keep Ryan's upper body restrained. As others
complete the strip search. Deputies find two bags of weeds
(32:32):
sewn into a second pair of underwear.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
Do I know why the DA's office told me to
show up in court that day? No, they wouldn't tell me,
But after watching the tape, I can tell you one thing.
When the stakes are this high and proceedings are drawn
out this long, when there are a dozen different defendants
in one room, all facing their fate day after day
(33:01):
after day, some already facing life sentences with nothing left
to lose. Emotions run high, tempers run hot, trust is eroded,
and coincidences can easily be confused with conspiracies.
Speaker 2 (33:22):
Next time on King Slime, did you know the lyrical
part of this was going to be a lightning Rocker criticism?
Speaker 9 (33:28):
I guess the better question is did I can what
rap lyrics say about the YSL defendants?
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Fatter one?
Speaker 11 (33:35):
On four sixteen of twenty one, there's a video released
called Ski Ski with lyrics stating, I fucked with slats,
we come to eat rats, I came with some puranas,
I tote an FN or reference to a handgun.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
And what their use in court says about our legal system.
Speaker 15 (33:57):
Look, there has been a very strategic, deliberate plan on
how young black men, young Black America is portrayed in
mass media. That narrative of criminals guilt before innocence has
been a jacket that Black America has worn for a
(34:19):
very long time in its country.
Speaker 1 (34:25):
King Slime is the production of iHeart Podcasts and Heirloom Media.
Speaker 2 (34:30):
It's written and produced by George Cheaty, Christina Lee, and
Tommy Andres.
Speaker 1 (34:34):
Mixing, sound designer and original music by Evan Tyre and
Taylor Chicogne.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
The executive producer and editor is Tommy Andres.
Speaker 1 (34:41):
Fact checking by Kayln lynch Our.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
Theme music is by dun Deal Special.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
Thanks to the Atlanta News outlets, eleven Alive, WSBTV, Atlanta
News First, and Fox five.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
For more shows from iHeart Podcasts, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts
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