KJ Live - Matt Barnes

NBA Champion and All The Smoke Podcast Co-Host Matt Barnes is in the building and chops it up with KJ about the Lakers early season woes, Celtics drama, and whether he thinks today’s league is soft. KJ and Matt also do a deep dive into how Matt balances parenting and coaching his twin boys, and how he carved his niche in the sports media space. #allball #fsr

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is kJ Live with Chris Johnson, and Chris is
having conversations with influencers in the sports world and entertainment
in a strain. Now here's Chris Johnson. You are now
tuned in to kJ Live. I'm your host, Chris Johnson,

(00:24):
today's guest on the show. Played in the NBA fifteen seasons,
winning a NBA Championship as a member of the Golden
State Warriors in two thousand seventeen. Since retiring, this former
u C. L. A. Bruin has carved a night's niche
in the sports media space, covering the NBA for ESPN
and as co host of the award winning podcast All

(00:45):
the Smoke. Please welcome Matt Barnes to kJ live. What's up, man,
and Chris? What are you going to speak with that
serious intro voice the whole conversation? Yeah, you know that's
my sick voice. You know I had to give him
that song. Well, you know, you gotta keep the listener
as soon as they if they hear a weird old voice,
they're gonna be I'm out, man. You gave them what

(01:05):
they're looking for. Man, you're you're already on my hand man,
And like we go back and forth with the light
skinning thing all the time, bro, And that's something that
I'm og light skin and I get it all the time.
The other day, Clay Thompson deep book Ye that light skin,
light skin, light skin. What did you make of that
little nothing beef or whatever you want another? I like it,

(01:28):
and I haven't seen that out of Clay. You know,
ironically enough, we had just interviewed play the week before,
so maybe you know some of all the smoke rubbed
off on them, But you know, I love it. You know,
Devin Booker is one of the top two guards in
the NBA. Clay has a Hall of Fame career, and
you know he's trying to come back from two tough
injuries to kind of get back in that top two
guarden conversation. So I mean, I think I think it's dope.

(01:50):
You know, two really good teams that should probably see
each other, you know, late in the season in the playoffs.
And when you played in the league, Matt you you know,
you were tough, you were hard nosed, developed the reputation
as a guy that didn't take no ship. Um, do
you think today's NBA versus the time that you played
in the league. Do you think it's soft now or
how would you characterize I think it's just different. I

(02:12):
think it's different. Um, I wouldn't say soft, it's just
it's it's transitioned into a different direction. Uh, it's more
about scoring and scoring and scoring and highlights. Um. But
at the same time, that's the same thing that continues
to make the game grow. You know. I broke it
down to someone too. You know, I miss when you
played or how it used to be or how used
to be before. And I'm just like you know, this

(02:34):
is a culture of headline reading and quick edits so
when you see highlights, you want to see step shooting
from damn near half. You want to see someone dunk,
and you want to see more excitement. So the old
you know, the days of the defensive games. You know,
I think we're gone. And although I was, I was
a defensive type player, I don't mind it. There's something

(02:55):
to be said too, uh, for the culture that we
live in and the way people respond to certain styles
from our athletes. We see it in all sports, right,
Baseball you have celebrations now dudes are just going crazy
and bat flipping. Football you have the situation where you
can't touch the quarterback. Things are really light rough in
the pastors called nearly every single play and then basketball, right,

(03:15):
you have the situation, the hands off and all that.
Do you think that the entertainmentization of professional sports is
the move do you do? You mean, do you feel
like because there's a lot of purest out there, Man,
I get it. I mean, I just don't want it
to affect the quality of the game. Like I don't
you know, we were talking about us on ESPN the

(03:37):
other day, Like the Memphis Grizzlies are the new age
of what the NBA is heading towards. They dance on
the court, they celebrate, but they also play hard and
good basketball, you know what I mean. So if I
don't mind with this, because we always have to adapt
that no matter how pure we are, you know, the
game's going to go the direction it's gonna go, and
it's always gonna be a youth movement pushing it. So,
you know, being someone who coaches thirteen year olds and

(03:58):
and has kids and just understand that this is a
TikTok dancing era, I see that's where the game is going.
So that, like I said, I don't mind it as
long as just that, you know, I don't want to
see the competitive you know, I think the competitiveness is
a little it's taking a few steps back because everyone's
friends now, you know what I mean, We we knew people.
But when it didn't matter. You know how close you

(04:19):
and I are when the both of us when the
ball went up, we could fight during the game and
then have a drink after, you know what I mean.
So it's just like, I don't want to see the
competitors and the quality of the game take a step back. Um,
But I don't mind what this new age is bringing. No.
I love it. I love today's NBA. I love the
skill set, and I love the way that that that
they're allowed to get off. You know, I thought I

(04:40):
was gonna hate it all the dribbling a couple of
years ago. If you would have talked to me, I'd
have been like, oh man, too many five dribble step
back compos Now I'm kind of like I like that stuff.
I like it. But at the same time, you don't
see that from the really good teams, you know what
I mean. And it's you know, they the recipe to
win hasn't changed, you know, you gotta play defense, you
gotta play hard, you gotta move the ball. So they're
are the guys that have the ability now to really

(05:02):
dance with it, But you don't see the really good
teams doing it too often. What did you make of
the Draymond Green Jordan Pool situation. I know you guys
were up there to do some stuff and it happened
around the same time we got there the day after
it happened. Um. I think the bigger issue is that
it was leaked. Um. We really haven't heard if, if,
if whoever leaked it. You know, I want to see
that person's face. I want to see their name. I

(05:24):
want to make sure they're black ball because that was wrong.
But at the same time, you know, the incident just
it's it's unfortunate. But you know, as well as I do.
With you know, your dad being in the NBA and
you having your running in college and professional basketball, fights happen.
Fights happen. Um. You know, I just don't think it
Jordan Pool is expecting that type of energy. Um. But again,

(05:44):
fights happen. Um. You know, will the relationship ever be
the same? Who knows? Will this mess the team up
by any means? Absolutely not, And I think a lot
of people were trying to say, oh, this is this
and that, and Draymond needs to go and Jordan's shouldn't play.
At the end of the day, both these guys are professional. Um,
you know, Draymond has been a part of a dynasty.
Jordan Pool is next in line, and you know that

(06:08):
foundation is too solid for a fight to let although
it was it was a punch that not even a fight,
a punch that was seen around the world that that
the foundation of that team is too sturdy, from the
top to the coaches to the players. Let anything like that,
you know, come back and bite him in the ass
down the road. So um, you know you don't want
to see it, but you have to understand that in
competitive sports that happens. Yeah, it does, especially on the

(06:31):
pro level. I you know, I had mixed feelings about
it because in one hand, it's kind of like my
first thought was like, you know, what did Jordan Poole
say to kind of do Draymond like that? But then
it was like, man, Draymond didn't really have to respond
that way. As I've gotten older, Matt and I'm sure
you have to you reflect on decisions we make and
how and Draymond talked about in this podcast. Now you

(06:51):
know he's he's how his effects everyone. George's got to
deal with it, caring about the next man. And that's
what I like to see and hear from people. And
I think that's something that we kind of grew up
not really caring about just empathizing with that. There was
no empathy. Bad but you don't there's no empathy. Yeah,
I've put myself for your shoes and I don't care.
But now you see more empathy. And I think as

(07:11):
a sports culture as a whole, that's that's a better
way to kind of start dealing with stuff. Um Man,
everybody out here in l A. He's talking about Westbrook
and the Lakers. Man, I gotta get your take on
what's happening with the Lakers and and how can they
fix that situation or can it be fixed? Marks? It's unfortunate,
you know, with with Russ being a Brewing brother, and
I've always been a fan of him, whether I'm playing

(07:32):
against him or watching him. The way he approaches the game,
I love um but that particular style just has an
aged well, um, you know, he's not the the arguably
be he's been the most athletic point we've ever seen
in the history of the game, and he's just not
there anymore. So it was, you know, to me, I
was thinking, you know, what's that in the next evolution

(07:54):
of his game? You know, how do you start to
change speeds and and use more of your mind than
your your body? You know, as we get older in
the in the league particularly, That's what it really becomes about. Um,
because I still think he has a lot of game left,
but I just don't think he was a very good
fit for this team to begin with, because he's best
with the ball in his hands. And on the flip side,
you have Lebron James who's going to be the number

(08:16):
one score in top ten and assists, so you want
the ball in his hands. Um, can it be fixed?
Who's the blame? I don't know if he could be fixed. Um.
I really empathize with what Russ from a standpoint of
this is home for him, you know what I mean.
And it looks like all the noise has taken the
joy out of the game for him, you know, because

(08:37):
he's always been one of the most mentally strong players
we've ever seen. Nothing's ever bothered Russ. But I can
definitely tell that l A noise is bothered Russ because
there's so much of it. They've attacked his family, the
disrespect on the on and we can get to this
later on. You know, the the media outlets that the
sports channels like crossing the line, like not criticizing game,

(08:58):
but you know, disrespect think the person. And I'm never
with that. Um. You know, I'm not someone that thinks,
you know, send him home. I'm going to send him
home and I try to find a trade and try
to find a trade for him, you know what I mean.
And we talked about this the other day with Rachel
on on on all the smoke. It's just like, you know,
if if they can wait till June, you know, Russ

(09:21):
is gonna come off the books, they have a max
slot and they can completely flip the face of this
team for the first time because they're gonna finally have
some flexibility, um, and keep their draft picks that have
they have them for down the road or do you
make a move during the season. I never understood why
the Buddy Healed and Miles Turner trade didn't get because
I think that would help the Lakers shooting, and Miles

(09:41):
Turner is an active big, a real big. They can
block this who has led the league in shot blocks before.
I'm not sure why that one has been held up
to me. I think that's been the best look if
there are going to be a trade. But it's just
a shitty situation. The Lakers are and I always tell
people because I played for both teams, but there's nothing

(10:02):
like being the Laker. I would give a funk if
they're the worst team in the NBA that hasn't won
a game, or they're on the verse to a championship
that the magnifying glass year underneath is is great and
it could be horrible. And for this instance, so um,
I don't know if he could be fixed. Um. I'm
always wishing for the best for Rust and I always
want to see Lebron do well. But this is again
a poorly constructed roster, and I just with puzzle pieces

(10:25):
that I don't think necessarily fit, which brings me to
my next question. If the roster is everyone knows it
is poorly constructed, right, no shooters this and that last
year you had like eight guys they signed that were
will pastor Prime didn't really contribute. So why is it
that Russell gets the brunt of the criticism versus say

(10:45):
Rob Polinka, who built the frenchise or who you know?
Who you know? Who? Who is who's really making the decisions?
You know what I mean that that's my questions who's
really making the calls? You know, because I don't really
know and you know, you know you you hear there's
a lot of influence over there, um, so who is
making the decisions? But absolutely right, you know, like Lebron

(11:06):
is best through his entire career when you put shooting
around him playing and simple, like when you put shooting
around and playing simple, you know, I think you hear that.
You know, even DeMar said in the interviews, DeMar thought
he was coming here. You know, DeMar could have been
that kind of fit. But though you you give up
the last of you know, obviously to get a d
they had to give away all those young pieces and

(11:28):
all those young pieces outside the ball being hurt. But
even when he plays, all those guys are flourishing man
looking great. But when they've ever got to that level,
because they wouldn't have been able to have the ball
in their hands this much on the Lebron James type team.
And then the second time around, when you go get Russ,
you give up Kuzma who's having a great year. You
go up KCP who hit big shots in the in
the finals. For you, you don't resign Caruso, who was

(11:50):
a fucking spark plug that who everyone loves. Everyone loved him. Um,
so you know decisions have been made. I'm not sure
who's made them. Um, but Russ is definitely not the problem.
Like we're losing, we're owing for because rusting you play
last night, you still lost. So it's just like Russ
is the scapegoat. Russ is one of one of the problems.

(12:11):
But it's not not saying it's that seem same problem.
I'm saying it's he's not playing well, so that's kind
of a problem. But who knows, man, it's it's a
big mess and I don't know who's going to get
blamed or who's involved. But so you know, fingers have
to be pointed. Again, it's a laker, So you're just
you're not expecting stuff like this, I mean that owing
four do At what stage do you start to question

(12:33):
or pointing something to blame it? Lebron and question Lebrons
leadership is it I mean, do you do that? You
you can? You know you can because I mean it's
his you know, it's his team. You know, so it's
not necessarily that he's per se doing anything wrong. But
we have to understand, like this is your twenty and
be getting his motor started. We know it's it's definitely

(12:53):
a marathon for him, not a sprint. Um. But again,
you gotta put pieces around him, especially older in his
as they could really do something. And then you know
eight has been playing well, which is a which is
a good thing that hasn't translated into win. But outside
of eighty, you gotta put pieces around Lebron that fit,
and when you don't, it can get ugly, no question.

(13:14):
We've seen it early this season on the other side
of the down the hallway, the Clippers starting out to
believe too. And two they look decent this year. Do
you think the Clippers if Kauai is healthy, PG stays healthy,
do you think they have enough to win the champion? Absolutely?
I think health aside, this is probably the deepest team
in the league. Um. You know, obviously they're really monitoring

(13:37):
Kauai's load. Is that a good mover. Is that you're
okay with that. I'm fine with that. Kind of always
been a load guy, you know what I mean. And
he still produces when when when the time is right.
So I think I've been a big fan of what
Tyler has been as a head coach. You know, we
didn't really know if in Cleveland wasn't Lebron, but this,
this is clearly Eilu having these guys buy into what

(14:02):
he's telling them, you know, being stars in their roles.
They've done a great job of that, you know, the
last two years with you know, no quite all last
year PG for thirty games, they made the playoffs with
no star, which is no no star, you know what
it means. So you get your two guys back, you
get a hungry John Wall who's been impressive um his
ability to still get downhill and score and get to

(14:24):
the foul line. I think, along with Golden State, to me,
those are the two best teams in the Western Conference.
Golden State Clippers. And I'm not even saying this from
because I think both these teams, not to cut you off,
know that it's a marathon, not a spending their goals
to be playing in June They may not be the
top two seeds in the Western Conference, but I think
they're the two best teams in the Western Conference. Who

(14:46):
do you like the East? I like Milwaukee. I really
like Boston, but I don't think Boston. Boston is gonna
be a good team all year. Um, but I don't
think they make noise in the playoffs unless Robert Williams
is healthy. He's big, big athletic, does everything you need
from a big in today's game. So they definitely need

(15:06):
Robert Williams. Um. You know, the the jury is going
to be out on Brooklyn until they prove it, you know.
With k D and KAUAI think they're young. I like them.
I like them. I have to see more. You know,
none of the guys on the team have necessarily won,
you know what I mean. You gotta and knowing how
to win and and and winning and closing games to

(15:28):
win and then when it gets later in the you know,
end of the season and playoffs, like experience is the
best teacher when it comes out. But I like their
young roster, and and and and went Donovan Mitchell Donov
mitchells a hooper and and Daris Garland's coming into his
own being the first time All Star last year. So
Devin the young boy from usc um Evin Mobile, you know.

(15:49):
I mean they got a good core of Jared Allen,
so I like what they have. I think they're more
of a mid pack. I think they're around that five
six area in in in the Eastern Conference. But they
could peak at some point to get hot and be
like a third seed for a while. But I think
they're more of the middle of the pack when it
comes to the Eastern Conference. Yeah, I mean it's four
or five games into the season, so it's a lot

(16:10):
of basketball. As a pro somebody that spent fifteen years
in the league. You you know the deal like us
as fans, and you know the peanut gallery. It's like
we're losing put people pulling out their hair. Yeah, it's
it's I think the NBA goes in a couple runs
at the beginning of the season. You know, guys are active. Uh,
it dies off after Thanksgiving until Christmas. Those Christmas Day
games are always popping and then it's gonna die off

(16:31):
in January. Um, going to the All Star break, you know,
guys are gonna be laying better to to make the
All Star team and then after the All Star break,
to me is when the season really gets going. You know,
you got anywhere from twenty to thirty games left, and
it's go time. You know, you gotta understand who's going
to be there with those rotations, are with the chemistry
with those guys are and get ready to tighten down

(16:53):
your lineups going into the playoffs. Do you, and having
explained that, is there times during the season where you
turn it on as a pro more than other times?
Or does are you just one way where you just
one was just always energy, you know what I mean.
But it's just there's a lot that goes into it.
Um you know, like it's just a lot that goes
into it. So I was always someone who played hard,

(17:14):
but just I think the overall energy of the basketball
is just because it's such a long season, long season,
you know what I mean, So to be the whole
entire time for some of these stars, although they play hard,
it's just tough, you know. So you know, I think
there's a few spots for basketball. And that's not to
say in those downtimes I said, you're even get back
to get good basketball. But I think just the overall

(17:35):
product is the best in those times, I said, yeah,
facts switching gears to the A. You youth basketball level.
You're heavily involved in the development of your Your two sons,
Isaian Carter, their their high level for their age group,
and you know you've kind of been on the grind.
Describe yourself or describe the type of basketball parent that

(17:57):
you are. I am a dad that when you're in
between those lines, play hard, period, no matter what that's
you know, you can't control everything, but you're you're the
two things or your attitude and your energy. And I
was someone whose attitude was this, So I want my
kid's attitude to be more consistent, um, but in their

(18:18):
energy always up. UM. As far as skill development, I
was never really a dad that was going to push
my kids, you know, um, because I think too often
parents make it a job too early. Parents try to
vicariously live through their children. Um. You know, they missed
on their glory day, So my kids gotta be it.
And every parent thinks their child's going to the NBA.

(18:38):
So it's just that there's a lot that goes in there.
That that's the toxic side of the bat one of
the toxic sides of AU basketball. But I never pushed
them just because, like again, I wanted them to want
to find the love and the passion to do it,
because I'm not gonna be able to push them all
the way through. So I'm not gonna start pushing them
early on, like they have to want that, because that's

(18:59):
if they wanted. It's the only chance they have even
having a chance to make it, is they gotta wanted. Um,
you know, they've been around the game a lot. You know,
they were in the locker rooms with Code. They're in
the locker rooms with CP and Blake. They were in
the on the plane with Katie and Steph and Clay
for the finals, and in the you know, in the

(19:20):
locker room with those guys. So they they're they're basketball.
I Q has always been high, but like most kids,
they like to play video games. So they were always
good at a younger age because their i Q was
so high. But then as they started getting older and
other kids are working out and they're not working out,
other kids started catching them. You know. So as a coach,
you know, one starting in one isn't you know, And
it's not to say that the second one that's not

(19:42):
starting couldn't start He's just they have to work on
their games. So I think that kind of they started
father that they they say, you know, they started wanting
to work out more. Was I surprised him for their
tenth birthday with the workout from Kobe. We drove, We
drove out to Orange County. He put them through hell.
One of them was crying at the end. It was
funny as a motherfucker. But that I remember when we
went in there because me and Cope talked the night

(20:03):
before just about what this like, What do they like,
what do they like to do? What's their games like?
And we were talking and when we got in there,
he's like, where you guys want to go to school?
And in Unison? So we're going to U C. L
A and clubs like not to play basketball, And they're
like the fuck. They're like, you know, your dad said
all you want to do is play video games. He's like,
do you guys, do you guys work on your games?

(20:24):
And they look at each other. No. He's like, all right,
well you guys can go there because you're gonna be smart,
but you're not gonna play basketball. And I kind of
like sucked him up a little bit and he put
them through a tough workout and it kind of to
me it turned the lightbulb on, but it wasn't all
the way on. So, you know, over the next their
thirteen now, so over the next maybe a year, they
would you know, have days where they it was just me,

(20:45):
and they would have days that they want to do it.
We'll go out and you know, go go out in
the backyard and shoot and get a good work out in.
But it wasn't consistent. So I still wasn't going to
push them. But then as they continue to get older
and they see their friends getting better, they're like, okay, Dad,
we're ready to start working out. So that probably happened
at about they'll be fourteen in November, so that probably
happened maybe a year ago that they wanted to start

(21:06):
getting serious. So I found Chris Johnson and and just
hoop and he, to me, he's one of the best
trainers of explaining the game to these kids I've ever
seen um and I can just see their game improve
so much. I mean, the one thing they can do
is shoot the ball, which which is needed, but they
shoot the ship out of the ball, which I love.
So to me, they have a high i Q. They
naturally shoot the ball. So now to me is where

(21:29):
now we can learn the skill, because you can always
learn the skill, but shooting is something you have to have,
and to me, the i Q is something that's very important.
So they have those two things and now they're just
adding the skill to it, um, which is great. So
it's it's good. It's it's a fun journey to watch
now because they want it. It's not about me, but
obviously you know now that they want it, I'm going
to give them every opportunity and resource to have. You know,

(21:50):
they also trained in boxing, so you know they're starting
to get their cardio right in their hands right because
you know they're going to get pushed as light skinned,
curly hair boys like we did. And our hands are
always ready, but they're not gonna grow up like we
grew up. So I got to make sure that you know,
their hands are ready and and and overall just a
good cardio work. So you know, now the journey starts
and it's um, it's dope. Like I said, it's it's

(22:12):
really joyful being able to see your kids fall in
love with something and then you start seeing their improvement.
You know what I mean, and I'm giving them the
the the ins and outs and the integral sides of
the game. So we'll have to see what happens. But
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at Fox sports
Radio dot com and within the I Heart Radio app

(22:33):
search f s R to listen live. There's nothing better
than seeing your child discover their passion and then you know,
go after it and chase it without you having to
tell them or wake them up in the morning, like
they're getting up before you and just already at it.
I know, we remember what Will man, Yeah, the journey
when he was you know, when it was to when

(22:53):
the whole organ stuff was coming about, and kind of
how nervous as a father you were and what that
was like, you know what I mean, Like that's a dream,
Like I hope it. You know, I'm in your shoes
one day when it comes to that and and just
kind of get to experience that because I like, I'm
loving it. At thirteen, I couldn't imagine, like, Okay, they've
always want to go do you see oh ship? You
see this an opportunity now, like, yeah, let's go get
this ship. Hey, hey, yea. One of the things that

(23:17):
an obstacle for the young athletes today is sort of
this social media versus reality situation, right because you know,
you see something on social media, you might think a
guy because the video has a million hits and you
you're automatically think this guy is legit. Um they make you.
Social media sometimes make you feel lesser than what you
truly are. I mean, there's a lot of self esteem issues.
How do you protect your kids or school your kids

(23:41):
on how to handle social media. I know they're active,
they have a podcast, so how do you handle that?
Bar just talk to them, you know, And I waited, um,
you know, they just started getting excuse me active on
the social platforms maybe about right before they turn twelve,
because I just knew what kind of dangerous negative area

(24:02):
that is. You know, it's it's beneficial if if it's
used right, and there are people that use it the
right way. But you know, we just live in a
generation of just negativity and hate, which is which is crazy.
You don't want, Yeah, you don't want that at a
young age. For like you said, those kids, you know,
or some adults you know, justify their their their their
value by likes and comments, you know, So I just
want them to understand that it it really is almost

(24:23):
two different worlds. Enjoy it, but enjoy it like a
video game, like you gotta come back to life, You
gotta do your homework, You still gotta go to bed
at nine thirty, Like there's real life ship going on,
Like you still gotta work on your game. But just
understand that people are going to come for you, um,
you know, especially because you first of all, because you
know you're my kids. Um. Second, because you know you're

(24:46):
pretty decent in basketball. And third is because you know
we're talking about business in life around here, you know
what I mean. So they have a successful podcast and
they're starting to do other ship outside of just being
you know, student athletes. So there's gonna be some there's
gonna be love to with that and negativity that comes
with that. So just really just trying to spoon feed
them real life game because real life is happening to

(25:06):
them now. And the earlier you get the real life game,
you know, the shell shock of it all, it's like
the better you're gonna be off just prepared, yeah yeah,
and now and speaking them as young businessmen and you know,
they have a social media presence. And are you thinking
about N I L and are you going to have
them balance both? Yes, I'm definitely gonna have them balanced both.
I haven't really thought about n I L because at
the end of the day, that's just gonna. It's far away.

(25:28):
But you know, it's just a new thing that we
have to think about. It just gonna. It's you know,
if if they do everything they're supposed to do, in
I L will be an option for them, you know
what I mean. So we can't shortcut the process. We
have to understand that. You know, that's the goal, but
that's not the only goal, you know, are you know
the goal is to get to college. You know, if
you get to college at a higher school, most likely
you're gonna you know that N I L stuff willcome.

(25:49):
But you know, if their goal is to make it
like that, this is great. But let's remember why we're
here and and and you know, keep our foot on
the gas. So um, I think it's cool. Uh, you know,
I wish we had it. I remember being on campus
and you know, I had a cool little car in
an apartment. But you know, maybe fifteen hundred on a
good day when you know when I would when I
would be blessed, But I couldn't imagine having a couple

(26:11):
of hundred thousand in Westwood because we might not have
made it out. You know, we would have fun, well
we talked about this. With more money, more problems, man,
we would have fun. But like you you think about
you know, there's NBA guys the first handful of years
or even vets that blow their money, you know what
I mean. So you're imagine you're getting these seventeen year
old kids, eighteen old kids, um all this money, and

(26:32):
you know when you go to these major programs, you're
the man on campus. You know, you go to these
big programs like at U c l A. We would
you know, we were the ship, you know what I mean.
So to having all this money and you're making more
money than the coach sometimes and to me, I'm just
gonna want like our kids gonna lose the hunger? Can
they stay focused? Can they you know, stacking bricks like
we're gonna like our Bordek says, are they going to
continue to stack bricks? Because they are having not only

(26:55):
success and recognition, but now money at a young age.
So that's the most good part though, that keeping that motivation,
that hunger because when you because the reason you're doing
it is to be paid to be able to take
care of people and have resources to be able to
enjoy your life. So once you achieve that, how do
you keep the hunger? I mean advice to you to

(27:15):
these young because a lot of high school athletes or
listen to this will remember why you're being paid, Like
I don't think you can never forget that. Then that
goes for you know, this level of sports and and
and even in the league, like you can if there's
so many pitfalls now and social media is such a
prevalent thing in society that you get, like I said,
you get caught up and think that that's real life sometimes,

(27:37):
so you know, look at that like a video game.
But remember like you're getting these people are looking at
you and loving you and hating on you, and you're
getting this bread because you're doing something well. So you
have to continue to do that well and elevate and
keep pushing yourself because if you don't, if you stay stagnant,
all that ship disappear and they don't care about you.
Do you think the game is in a better place?

(28:00):
College basketball. You think it's in a better place than
we played because and abandoned, fought for what these kids
have now are one of our o G So okay,
So my point and when I asked you this is
do you think that the game is in a good
spot as far as doing right by the college athlete?
I mean, I think NILS is a great idea. But
at the same time, the n C Double A is
not the one giving up this money. You know, they're

(28:22):
the most corrupt organization, one of the most corrupt organizations
out there, you know, So all those kids are getting
money that has nothing to do with the n C
Double A giving it to them, you know. So I
don't know if I would say the game isn't a
good spot because you know, these days, college is almost
frowned upon, like, oh, you gotta go to college. You're
not that nice, right, you know what I mean? We

(28:42):
had a black I mean, I wouldn't trade college for nothing.
You know, I was in that four. If I could
have stayed longer, I would have. You know, I had
a great time in college. But now if you stay
to your junior senior year, like they're like, oh, do
you have enough game? And then there's so many other
avenues now. You know, I'm working for o T. You know,
that's an avenue now where kids to go, you know,
if they don't want to go to college, there there's
other avenues. So I wouldn't say it's in a better place.

(29:06):
I mean, I think it's fine, But I think the
competition back when we played was really because no matter
how good you were, normally you stayed at least three
or four years, you know, so it just it was consistent.
You would see guys grow right in front of you,
and teams would be better because they had more chemistry.
Guys weren't just in and out, one and done. So, Um,

(29:27):
you know to me that everyone's goal is to get
to the league, so if they can, you know, mainstream.
And I'm not mad at it, but I really personally
enjoy college. Absolutely did. The time is our life? You
mean you did too? You had a really good time.
Do we have to read that up right now? It's
well documented how much fun I had in college. I
wouldn't trade it for the world. Um, let's talk a

(29:49):
little bit about what you're doing now. Just you know,
you've carved out this role in media where you're doing well,
are all over the place. I see you all over
the place and have a major league pod. How did
you start setting yourself up for the career after the
game doing while you were pro or in college? Is
this something that you started talk to me about when

(30:09):
you started to want to go down that route? I wanted,
you know, I started thinking about transition. I played to
lot of thirty seven. I started thinking about transitioning at
about thirty two. You know, just like, Okay, who knows
how much longer to be playing? Um, you know, let
me start investing in aligning myself with brands that you know,
I like. So when I'm done, hopefully this is moving. Bro.
The media came out of nowhere. I had no plans

(30:31):
and do a media zero, you know, because I just
there was as an athlete. There's a huge disconnect between uh,
media and and and athletes and and and it's almost
like and it don't overthink this reference, but it's like,
you know, street people talking to two cops, like they
just we didn't like to talk to them. We talked.
There's a few they were cool that you would talk to,
but you never really wanted to have to because you

(30:53):
just there's always so many angles and and and you
know narratives that that that that can be spun so
media and ever once thought about I'm gonna get out
and do this. I'm gonna get out and never Um.
But luckily a friend of mine is just like, hey,
you know you, you're always so well spoken in your interviews.
You should try it. I was like, I want to
learn how to produce and direct and be behind the camera.
I don't want to be around it. I just don't

(31:13):
want to be in front of it. Luckily I listened,
and um, it was cool. I'm just like obvious, just
shoot the ship and what do you like about it?
I just like that it wasn't the point of view
and and and don't take me wrong, because there are
guys that haven't played they have a good point of view.
But I just like that I was able to give
like a in the locker room point of view on

(31:36):
the court point of view suspended from a game a
real game, lose the money point of view, you know
what I mean? Like I can give you that. And
I think that's what fans appreciate because they really want
to know, like what is it really like? You know,
so you no matter how good Stephen A. Smith Is
or you can name another one. They can't really give you,
like what it's really like. They can explain what they

(31:56):
think it's like, but they can't give you what it's like.
So I knew that I can carve out lane that way. Um.
I was getting positive feedback. And I think what really
helped me, Chris was just staying me, like, you need
you know me. I've always been me, Like every room
I walking on me. I'm not saying you do I
need to be today Da da dah, like I'm always me.
And I think that unapologetic realness um that I played

(32:17):
with translated into this space in a different way. Um.
So it just kind of took off. You know, I
started doing Fox in ESPN and then ESPN locked me
in to a multi year deal and I just signed
my second multi year deal with them. Um. But it's
just been cool man and and and from there, obviously
the podcast came. You know, Jack was in a similar

(32:39):
he didn't know what he you know, I knew what
I wanted to do, but he didn't really know where
he was at with it and what was next. And
he didn't know that you know, speaking could you know
be as lucrative as has been, and you know, we're
both getting the same feedback. One day, we're at my
house in the Bay, um medicating and you know, I
was just like, you've got to do something together, um

(33:02):
in this talking space because we're both really talking real
ship and he's like, I'm down. It's like, what do
you want to do. I was like, let's do a podcast.
He's like, what's the podcast? Like, I don't know, but
I know we could cuss and we can smoke and
we can drink, like we could really be us because
you know, at Disney is ESPN and then Foxes. You know,
he kind of have to walk that corporate line. But
you know, I just from the pot the few podcasts

(33:22):
I've seen, people are just really loose being themselves. So um,
he left me with the business side. He's like, you know,
I'm in, so if you get lined up, just let
me know. So I just started grinding, you know, lightning
in the bottle. A friend of a friend introduced me
to someone the showtime. I pitched them in the idea,
just pitched them no sizzle, no real, no no deck,
no nothing. I just told him what I wanted, which

(33:44):
was just a relaxed, comfortable setting, like a man cave,
you know, like you've been over to the house and
you know you've been lost in the sauce and just
having cameras on something like that, you know what I mean,
not like, hey, what did you think? Like we're kicking back,
you know, you're talking it, I'm talking, we're watching the
game and then and that kind I felt like that
because we have around the world, there's so many great
conversations in those settings without cameras, whether you're professional or not,

(34:07):
they're just great conversation. So that's what I wanted to
bring to this world. And you know when I kept
telling people like, yeah, we're going to change the podcast, right,
there's so many podcasts. How can you change the game.
And we came in and we did that, you know,
in our first year. We want Sports Podcast of the
Year and I just keep you know, I really think
we set them. Although we were the first, I think
we set the bar in this space. Um and I

(34:30):
literally we just started season four and I told our team,
you know, coming into the season, like I feel like
we were still the barometer. But I feel like there's
people in the same room as us now. So we
gotta elevate. We gotta go to the next level, you know.
So now we're gonna you know, we did Clay Thompson
on his boat after practice, driving back to Tiberan, you know,
on the water rather vibes, you know, the vibes. And

(34:57):
and Clay doesn't talk to nobody, you know what I mean,
play the shoes off, feed out dog on the couch,
and you know, talking about he had a little dying
bag and just wanted to play rock band and the
police and pollment suck it up, you know what I mean.
And then man, we just had Will Smith on Monday.
Well yeah, and Will was so first we had to
go see his movie Emancipation, which was incredible. Uh. Then

(35:19):
we went interviewed the man and he laughed, he cried,
he talked ship, he was vulnerable, he was real, he
was transparent and it was just such a dope interview.
So what is it about y'all man that allows you
guys to get that transparent, that realness out of your guests.
You guys get so much good. I think it's the
environment that we create, you know what I mean. Like

(35:40):
if you come up to the set, like it's not stiff,
it's you know, we're smoking, there's food, we're drinking, we're laughing,
we're having a good time. Like we just we want
our our guests to feel comfortable enough to have a
good time, you know what I mean, and a little
green or you know, some wine or you know, your
your your choice of beverage. You know, everyone kind of
just exhales little bit. And then again what I mentioned

(36:01):
a second ago is just our realness, you know, I mean,
Jack and I are going to be ourselves regardless. So
you know, you should know coming into our set, we're
not trying to find no clickbait and we're not trying
to give people a platform to you know, sabotaze themselves
like we really want again a good kickback conversation. I
always take, you know, pride and humanizing our guests, you know,

(36:21):
because we're fortunate enough because I played, I get a
chance to see the other side of these people and
our fans don't. So how can I show our fans
the other side of our guests? So that's kind of
my approach every time I go into it, and and
we've done a good job at that. When you run
into sort of the I won't say controversy, but it's
sort of like a little hiccup with that. He made

(36:43):
Doka situation earlier in the Celtics where you said something
about it, you came out. I mean, what happened was
you know, I came out initially saying that, you know,
although it's not you know, adultery is not right, it's common,
not only in you know, professional front offices, but the world.

(37:03):
It happens. It's a normal thing. So again, I'm not
condoning it, I'm not justifying it, and I'm definitely not
criticizing it because I've committed it, you know what I mean.
So you know, all my mistakes are very well documented.
So I was just trying to say, it's just like
where I was coming from. Was the only reason I
even spoke on it was because Robert Sarver the Phoenix
sun Ship, he got a one year suspension. So when

(37:24):
I heard that Emai got a one year suspension for
like what allegedly was going on, I'm just like, how
the fund is that fair? So that's why I came
out to his defense initially, Um I posted it, someone
close to the situation kind of told me it was
a little bit more and then someone close to the
situation told me it was a little bit more. So
I'm like, oh, Ship, let me backpedal a little bit.

(37:48):
And I'm not about you know, I'm not That's what
I'm seeing that I'm not a backpedaler. Um, you know,
So backpedal then and just apologize it. But you know
what's funny was I got a lot of love, it
also a lot of hate. Oh now you're not supporting
our brother. Now you're this is and that, and you
need to tell us and this kind of stuff. And
it's just like I feel like too often in media
when people misspeak, it's just ship goes on instead of

(38:11):
being like, no, you know, maybe I was wrong. I
didn't have all the facts. You know, we gotta let this.
I think the one mistake I said is I think
something like it's a hundred times worse. Maybe that like
threw people off, like, oh, but you know from what
I heard, it was just it was a lot deeper. Um.
You know. Then then then then meets the eye and
and still a little bit deeper than actually come to light,

(38:32):
you know what I mean. So again, it's not I
just felt like from the direction I took and it
was only because I didn't feel like from what the
world the information we had at the time that email Judoka,
we're hearing, you know, an affair and what roberts Are
did were on the same level because they both initially
got the same suspension. So again, once I kind of
heard a little bit more, I was just like, all right,

(38:53):
let me just back up off this because you know,
this is no fun for no one. And again I'm
not judging in one because I've committed adultery, you know.
So it's just like, let me just back up out
this space and and and and let the information come
out as it will. Yeah, I was dope that you
fell on your sword. I thought, you know, again the
part of the evolution to Matt Barnes, you know, you're
just gonna come out on it and then move forward.

(39:13):
And that's what that's what I respect about you. Um,
the Robert Sarver situation, do you feel like the league
did the right thing by making him have to sell
his team? And was it too little? Is it too little?
Too late? Give me some thought. No, it's not too
I mean because at the end it's not the league's fault,
you know, I mean, we have the Sterling situation. You know,
in the playoffs with Golden State. You know, we're trying

(39:35):
to be the young Hungry if people remember, we were
the last team to beat Golden State before they went
on that dynasty run. So we're dealing with a young
Hungry on the rise Golden State Warriors team and are
idiot owner gets caught you know on tape that was
doing ye that, Yeah, that's why it dropped during the playoffs.
We're actually making a show about it. They're filming right
now called The Sterling Affairs coming out on f X six. There.

(39:57):
It's dope and it's sick document this whole space. Um,
but the Starver situation again and when the when the
Sterling ship hit, I'm like, he's not it was. It
wasn't a big deal to me from a standpoint of
you know, racism is still alive. But I faced real
racism in my life, you know, with my high school
nearly being burned down and a green light being put

(40:19):
on my head and I had to move because they
were trying to kill me. So I faced like real
life racism. So when you hear older white men you know,
talk talk disrespectful talk racism, just like you know, fuck you.
But they're not the only one to think like that,
and they're just the only ones dumb enough to get caught.
So in this situation is the same thing I've just
Starver's just always been an arrogant asshole to me, you know,

(40:41):
just always arrogant, thinks he's the smartest guy in the room,
always needs to be a center, to be the center
of attention. I just never really funk with that. So
I didn't have any racial incidence with him, because he
probably knew not to play that around me. Um. I
did have an incident with him, and I said it
on the Sharp podcast not too long ago, but we
had a him out there one time after I had left,

(41:01):
and I was going back and forth with like a
young teenage kid and his dad. But it was like
a fundly like talk trash back and forth. There wasn't
no disrespect, no hate. And we're at the free throw
line and I hear someone say, stop sucking talking to
my fans, or don't fucking talk to my fans. So
who is talking? I turned around. It was him in
the corner with his wife, and I looked at it.
I'll come smack the ship out of you in front

(41:22):
of your wife say something else like tightened up real quick,
and I just ran back down the court and he
told on me and I got fined. How much you
get for talking to the owner like that? But the
owner was but the owner talking to me like so,
how did they vet that out? What was the investigation?
It was me? It was It wasn't even an investigation
to me. How can the owner cussing me and I

(41:43):
cussed back and get fined? That's wild? Crazy? Um so again,
never had no racism ship with him personally, just asshole
didn't like him, and which is who cares? You can
still be an owner with that. But then you know,
our brother, Earl Watson had his running with Sarvereign and
the ship. The Earl told me, I'm just like really
like really that was crazy. I never really talked about it,

(42:04):
but I kind of set behind the scenes knowing what
that dude was. Wild wild. He's luckily he hasn't got
sucked up. Honestly, violence is never, but but sometimes it is.
I mean, that's my famous quote, but sometimes it is.
They put that meme on whenever I twitted, they put
your so I mean again, we really you don't want

(42:27):
to see it ever go that far in our older
ages now, but I'm not younger age. We're okay with that, um.
But you just knew there was a matter of time.
You hear Earl's incident, and you hear other incidents, it's
only a matter of time before you know, people are
just going to start being like, Okay, hey, this is
who this guy is, and all to cover up him
and his wife tried to do was bullshit. You know,
some people might lie, but that many people aren't lying,

(42:49):
you know what I mean. So again, you can't blame
the NBA for having people like this. There's still more
in the NBA, can I guarantee it? There's still more,
and not only than the NBA and MLB and foot
Old and probably even more. Um. But again, when it when, when,
when it finally showed itself, you have to be stern
and you have to know pun intenda. You have to,

(43:09):
you know, make a stance that there's no room in
our game. There's really no room in the world, but
particularly professional sports for racism. So you know, I initially
thought that the fine and the one you're suspension was bullshit,
But you know, I knew that people are gonna start
speaking enough like me. They were saying, you know, this
is bullshit. And you know, the bigger guys start speaking.

(43:31):
When le Broun and then starts speaking, that's when ship happens,
you know what I mean. And then sponsors start pulling out,
that's when ship happened. So, you know, luckily, he you know, thankfully,
he made the decision that he should sell the team.
So you know, so he made a mistake, and he's
made several mistakes, but at the same time, he's you know,
it's don't feel bad for him for people like, oh,
this is not enough. He's you know, he's thirty ner

(43:52):
of that team. So that team sells for a couple
of billion. He's, you know, he's he's gonna eat. Fox
Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in the nation.
Catch all of our shows at Fox sports Radio dot
com and within the I Heart Radio app. Search f
s R to listen live. But I think that one
of the bigger things, like racism is definitely issue pro sports.
But I think misogyny is a huge, huge epidemic in

(44:16):
pro sports. We see Daniel Snyder, the owner of the
Washington Commanders, now coming out of under fire, Jerry Jones
and wishing weeks on the NFL side of things has
been under fire. Um do you do you think that
the misogynistic sort of foundation that pro sports is where
they act that way or actively, you think that's ever

(44:36):
gonna change? And how can it change? I do, because
I mean it's it's probably been going on for a
long time and never spoken on, and now now at
least a conversation. And remember back in the day when
we wanted we'd legalized, it was a long way, but
then they started talking about it. It was deep and
the next thing you know, it's here. You know. So
when things are finally that that we know and not
again and not only in professional sports, but just these

(44:58):
boardrooms around the world, when it starts getting talked about,
it's coming. You know. That means I think more change
is on the way. Will we be able to see
it in our lifetime, I'm not sure, but it's definitely
changing now because it's just a more righteous country or
we try to be, you know, just a more wrong
is wrong. Finally in some cases we're getting here. Yeah,

(45:21):
So to me, it's starting to change. So um, and
I say the same thing with the racism you know
what I mean. I think there's just a certain standard
of these seventy plus old you know, oil billionaires, are
real estate billionaires that are team owners, and that's just
kind of the life they've lived. A nigger will slip
out here and there, nigger this nigger, you know, and
that's just kind of the way. That's the way they

(45:41):
talk normally privately, but sometimes it's slipping out. But I think,
you know, once they you know, pass on from our
game and in in just everyone's game in general. I
think these next you know, new wave of CEOs and
owners are just understanding more of what our culture is about.
And that's not to say that some young racist is
gonna slip in, but I think overall, look that people

(46:02):
just starting to understand. Man, there's just we're all here together,
and uh, you know, black and brown people have been
called minority for so long, but we're actually the majority now.
You know, they try to use the word minority to
keep us in our place, but we're really the mind. Uh,
we're really the majority. So just kind of having to
understand how the world is now. I think, you know, eventually,
to answer your question, I think eventually it will change

(46:23):
and it is changing. I just don't know how soon
we'll see it. Why do you think more hasn't been
done to get Britney Grinder out of jail? Oh man,
it's unfortunate. Me my girl actually talking about it last night.
I mean, that's it's bad man, because cartridge, when you
think about it, it's a cartridge. It's not even actual flower.
There's no like real weed being found. But I think
it's timing. I think time, you know, Chris, every timing

(46:43):
is everything. And I think she got caught in the
middle of a war with Ukraine, UH and Russia, and
then you know, the the United States giving Ukraine money. Oh,
when we have one of your NBA female stars or
w give me w n b A stars over here,
you know we're gonna make an example. Unfortunately, I think
they're trying to make an example out of her. Um.
You know she just heard her bail denied the other day. Um. Yeah,

(47:08):
She's like, I got a nine year sentence. So I
think I'm praying that, you know, the president and someone
can really make something happen. But I think this might
be a situation where I don't think that she They
say something like she's close to eight years left because
you know, time served. Yeah, but I think that she's
and I hope I'm wrong on a couple of different levels,
but I think she's gonna probably do a couple of

(47:29):
years and then they're gonna freer. That's crazy because honestly, man,
I really feel like this is unfair because if this
was a male professional athlete, any one, right, this would
not happen. Right, it would have been swift. You know,
calls would have been made, Folks would have been on red,
you know, that bad phone talking to Putin and then
that dude's out of here. So but Brittany now has

(47:50):
to pay the price right for the timing of everything.
And I appreciate the people that is using their platforms
to try to try to whatever. You know, and it's
using your platform if you look at it, although it's
it's it's it's a it's a it's a gesture. And
we do love and and and we we hope she's
safe and and and sending love out to our family
doesn't really it doesn't really do anything, which is which

(48:11):
is messed up. I wish there was more tangible things
that that people can do to to really help. But
you know, right now, we're kind of at the mercy
of their their judicial system and and and their president
and how they see holding her fit, which is unbelievable.
So yeah, Man, I just definitely pray for her, pray
for her family, her loved ones, and you know, she's

(48:32):
just an example. There's a lot of people around the
world that are in similar situations. You know, she's just
happens to have some fame and money behind her name,
so that's why it's it's so front and center, not
that it doesn't deserve to be, but there's a lot
of people in similar situations. So it's just like it
just kind of just shows how crazy this world can be. Man,
I have a story from my time overseas. Um and

(48:53):
Risk I took doing something similar as pretty Grinder. I
was in Malaysia Man playing in the Damn Asian champion
Ship in two thousand and one. Uh, you know, I
got Stas Boseman out there with me. We're playing against Jr.
And Sam got in the final. But you know, I
needed some weed. I need to smoke that week, and
you know here in Malaysia, Kuala Lumplu or whole in
other country. So I ended up going to find it

(49:14):
and everything like that, right, So I find it out
there and freaking Malaysia, which you could have gotten in jail.
First of all. So I'm smoking in my hotel room
with stays in the hotel and stays and in the
bathroom or in Damad in my bedroom, so just toweling
the door must have been playing really well at the time.
Thirty six or better didn't matter. I was feeling investable, right,

(49:36):
So look, we got all this, we got all this
stuff in Malaysia. We win the championship. I take you'll
beat him? We beat him? Would you get six? Eight
and eight in the final? Sham God was guarding me. Uh,
you know, he was just guarding sham guys. He was
you know, he was doing all the defensive stuff and
he's just letting me just get off. So that was beautiful.
So I ended up taking the stuff back to Qatar.

(49:59):
Now you know, that's like, it's worse than taking some
stuff back to real bro. But just to show you
why where my mindset was and how people just you know,
I read a lot of comments on Twitter about how
could she even think to do something like that? Trust me,
when you're at a certain status at a certain place
in this in basketball, and you're overseas and you gotta
feel like you need something to make your body, your bone,

(50:19):
something that you have used for a while that help
you play well. Okay, yeah, your mental state. Come on,
my mental state, bro, I'm risking all that for that.
I think about that story. I've never told that story
to anyone, but I think about that when I've been
thinking about that since Brittany, Like, damn, thank god that

(50:39):
I made it out, because if I would have got
busted with that, bro, it would have been it would
have been bad. Yeah. I was, you know, I was.
I was taking those chances on vacation. Yeah. I didn't
even need it to play or anything like that. I
just felt like I needed it, Like if I'm gonna
go on vacation with this thing, I'm going over the
water is like I need it, you know what I mean.
It just is what it is because to me, you know,
I'm not a big drinker. I definitely don't pop pills.
It's just what I feel, like, Mike, Mike, I said,

(51:01):
it is. That's my medicine. And and the fact that
for a cartridge, she may have to spend years in
jail is is and we definitely not condone smuggling marijuana,
not over international waters, something that the crime definitely doesn't
match the punishment by any means, nor it doesn't. Man
One more thing for your brother before you go, I

(51:22):
just want you to give some advice. You've just your
second act, if you will, from business to media coaching.
How did you or how do you stay locked in
and how did you have the vision to kind of,
you know, know, where you wanted to go with your
career active basketball. I didn't, like I said, I invested

(51:44):
because I thought, you know, I was going to be
a cannabis owner and I just thought I would have
a few other businesses. Um, but you're still gonna do cannaby. Yeah,
I'm still in it. I'm just not as heavy anymore
because like media is kind of so that kind of
works for itself. Um. The media stuff is really media
and content creation that have been number one. And Chris,
I just say, it's it's it's cool, it's it's it's

(52:05):
I love doing it, you know what I mean? Like that,
I got the luckiest, luckiest job in the world to
play you know, professional basketball for fifteen years and get
paid for it and now you know, I get to
still talk about it and create and create content around it,
and that that ship is fun and you know, for
to be ESPN and Showtime and NBC Bay Area because

(52:26):
I worked for the Kings and Baller Vision, because I'm
working for the Clippers, that the bombership he's doing. I'm
doing color commentary for Ote, you know what I mean.
So all these people, you know, want to pay me
to talk about basketball, and it's it's good pay, you
know what I mean. So it's just like ship, it's
a lot it's it's you know, I don't like that
I have to travel a lot um. I'm missing time

(52:47):
with my kids. But at the same time, it's just
like you know, used to just like you kind of
have to strike. Why the iron is hot. The iron
is hot right now more doors continue to open, man.
So I just you know, I continue to stay real
and authentic in me know, and be transparent. I funked
up on the Odoka thing. I apologize you know a
lot about but a lot of people respected that. The

(53:08):
people who needed to respected their respected, you know, which
means which continues to make me okay, like he is
really So it's just like, continue to be me, continue
to be gracious, continue to be thankful. You know, we
were talking about the other day. I was at Better
Paint and said, with a guy named Ron Everley's name
goes by Boss, he's Kevin Hart's trainer's my training and

(53:28):
uh we did his little penicipit his crib and that
he was telling a story to a bunch of guys
in the circle. Then when he met me in two
thousand seventeen, after I won a championship at a big
old house on Dohini for the summer, and this is
my first time I'd always seen him, so I hit
him up and I was like, I want you to
train me and probably can play. You know, another year
two I decided to retire, but he was telling a story,
how I guess. One day we were working out, and

(53:49):
the one thing I told him is just like shake
hands would be cool with everyone because you never know
who is who, you know what I mean, like and
especially I tried to do that because I think there
was such a misconception that I was a thug or
bad guy or dumb or any of that kind of ship.
So I just I go out of my way to
be cool. With people, and you never know where that's

(54:09):
going to lead you. It could lead you nowhere, it
could lead you everywhere. And it's it's led me to
a lot of different places now because you know, I
played a long time in the n b A. I
went to U C. L A and and and and
and I'm you know, I'm touchable from you know, So
I just I like to be out and about and
and in in good rooms and communicate with people and

(54:31):
and see, if you know, friendships or business come from it.
And you know, that's kind of been my recipe. Um.
And then you know, obviously when you get these opportunities,
you got to continue to grind, you know, kick these
doors in. You know what I mean. It's I got ESPN,
so I gotta study the whole league. And then I
got the King, so I gotta study the Kings. Then
I gotta study the Clippers, and now I gotta learn
all these little young O t E kids. So the

(54:52):
twins are go. My twins are gonna school me on
that because I don't have time to watch them, and
now I'm getting paid to do it, so I need
to know it. So it's just like you know, it's
still work but it's fun work and it's you know,
it could be a lot worse type ship. So and
that's why I just continue to grind and hopefully I
motivate people from a standpoint of I was a journeyman
role player, you know what I mean. Like you see

(55:13):
guys that move into media that that that have these
kind of careers are like all stars or Hall of
Famers and all that ship. And I'm not so to me,
I think that shows other guys it's more attainable. Like literally,
anybody could do it. You just gotta be good at it.
You gotta know how to you know, work your rooms
and talk your ship and shake your hands and you
know anything, it's possible. Man. So I just want to
continue to motivate and elevate myself and elevate everything that

(55:36):
I touch and see where it goes. Man, you're doing
the hell of a job, brother, Keep doing what you're doing.
We love the show, Love you on ESPM man, and
we're looking out for the Isaiah Carter business of basketball.
They're coming, ladies and gentlemen. Matt Barnes