"You Can't Tell Me Anything" (w/ Trixie Mattel)

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Look man, oh I see you? Why? Why? Oh? Look
over there? How is that culture? Yes? Goodness, ding dong?
Should we share the bts? Yeah, whatever you want to share,
like high comedy. That just happened. That's sort of like
Bowen forgot to run his audio and he did the

(00:21):
whole accounts on and everything we said. The words ding
dong felt like a gag from the Dick Van Dyke
Show or something. So it felt like one Division. Oh,
that felt like one Division. Are you watching? Yes? How
you welcome to the stage? One division? Dision? Okay, we
don't know who that is that voice from beyond We'll
get don't know. Yeah, no one reads the titles before

(00:43):
they listen. No one. Kristen Stewart, tell me what you
thought about one Division. Supposedly, Um, all of the reviews
that are coming in are saying nothing happens in the
first two episodes. It's all set up, And I'm like,
I get that, but I also right, but I also
love the fact that you have Elizabeth Olson turning in
with a really good performance. She's so good. Martha may Martha,

(01:05):
Mama Mama like that the Mama, Mama, Mama. I didn't
seem that either. But you know what we both saw
in love was Ingrid goes West, Anger goes West. She's
so fucking, so fucking good and also she's so talented,
and I said to you, you should pitch her to
host SNL because I bet she would turn it. Well,
you you bet your ass. While Katherine Han and Tiana
Paris were on screen with Elizabeth, I was like, let

(01:28):
me text someone at work right now and be like
you guys got to reach out to Elizabeth. And when
Boon Yang text, it gets sent. All right, here's the deal. Um,
she actually is really fucking good, and Catherine Han is
perfect every time. When has she not been perfect? I
can't tell you. I cannot tell you. I ever since Steps,

(01:49):
ever since Stepbrothers, ever since Anchorman. She like, you know,
you know that the scenior Anchorman where Christina Apple get
like nails her first time anchoring solo and they cut
to like the women in the Office. She Kathernan is
on the side being like you yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
you win the pointing. Also that performance is so good
and she killed it in and of course Stepbrothers we love,

(02:11):
but you know shook me. No, I actually didn't watch
I love Dick sorry Amazon, um, but you know what
shook me so hard like an earthquake. You know how
an earthquake shakes you often. This shook me almost equally so.
So when Revolutionary Road came out, I was sitting for like,
you know this like bracing drama. And then there was

(02:31):
Catherine Hans serving up suburban domesticity. The repression was real
but still funny and charming. And then she has like
a crying scene at the end where RelA, which we love,
she can legitimately do it all and just to see
her step into this, like because I thought Elizabeth Wilson
was doing like fifties scom of it all well, and
then she comes in and was so that like sort

(02:53):
of ethel and I love Lucy sporting character woman that
it just sorry, I love Lucy that she just rocked
in that she can do everything everything. I feel like
we've talked about this and this is true, like Boomer
leanings on the show coming at you, But like I
do feel sad for the youth today, like they haven't
seen it or who who just aren't like guided towards that,

(03:14):
like the algorithm never like surfaces that stuff up to
them anyway. Who cares well. This is what we'll say
to our very gen z crowd. Please seek out. I
love Lucy, you will love this great show. It's got
this woman, fabulous woman. It's got a woman. That's all
you need to know. It's got a woman. Okay, speaking
of women, Um, we got a fucking hell of a

(03:36):
woman on the show today. This is actually Bow And
our guest doesn't know this, or I would be hard
pressed to believe that if they come on in a
second and be like, no, I knew that they were
telling the truth. This is not our first interview with
the guests, our first interview. This is not our first interview.
And you barely remember too when we were working at Vulture,
what was that thing that the room you booked in
in like the East Village? Was that app called oh,

(03:58):
I booked a breather. We booked a breather for our
interview with Trixie Mattel, who the night prior had been
crowned the winner of All Stars three. And got on
and did a twenty minute interview on the phone with
Trixie Mattel, and we were like sort of skittering tittering
around the room, all nervous because it was like, see
congrat like we were truly supplicans, supplicants and we were

(04:22):
simply suppling, so we were we were literally So I
just remembered that the other day. It feels like another
lifetime ago. But I mean, this is a guess that
I think probably was aspirational the entire time we've been
doing the podcast, and then we thought, well, we can't
ask because she'll never say yes. Cackle the cackle. Why
do you think people are always like, um, I feel like, girl,

(04:44):
you're just everywhere right now. I'm like, because they say
yes to everything because it's easy. It's going along with
Trickie Mattel, not hard to get the next special. Um,
but wait, so before we sort of bring the guests in,
uh no one knows who it is yet bowing at home,
they to hear about the credits. I don't know why
they can go through like the weird sort of like

(05:05):
behind the curtain stuff of like, let's not bringing our
guests yet. I feel like we can experiment with the
form going forward, and I think Trixie is like pushing
us to that better place, Like don't you think the
readers know who the guest is? When they tap on
the damn episode. I just want to put that out there.
I like the pump in the circumstance. And in keeping
with the pump in the circumstance, let me say this

(05:26):
truly disgusting, offensive list of credits and this and and
I'm gonna do it because this is psychati. I love
ship like this. By the way, I know people are
supposed to be like, well, I'm embarrassed. I love it.
Let me know. I know you love it. I know
you love it. And it makes me a combination of
proud and matt to say that tricks even tell who
has the Guinness Record for world's skinniest human woman in

(05:49):
North America, because after competing on season seven of RuPaul's
Drag Race, went on to as probably the audience well
in those win Drag Race All Stars three. But that's
only a small part of the story, Bowen Yang. As
you know, and we talked last night after a rewatch
of moving parts the Netflix documentary starring Trixie mattell Um,
that it's so rare that like we have like, yes,

(06:13):
this drag Race contestant, that's a successful drag Race contestant,
But then what they've done outside the show so dwarfs
that I mean incredible singer, songwriter, comedian and drag icon.
I have to tell you. After giving Barbara the album
that was released last year a few more spins, I
went online. I was like, I wonder if this is
on vinyl. It is on vinyl tomorrow. The other albums,

(06:36):
Two Birds and One Stone, you can stream them on
Spotify or you can order the goddamn vinyl like I did.
I'm so excited. And don't forget the Moving Parts soundtrack,
which has songs that are exclusive to the documentary. And
as they say in the community, say that you might
also know or not know that our guest is actually
a New York Times best selling author along with Katia,

(06:56):
their comedy partner, Trixie and Katya's Guide to Modern Womanhood
is Avilable Now. You might also know them from the
Trixie and Katia Show from Viceland, the web series and
the podcast The Balls in the Beautiful also with Katia
Zama Lokova. Like we mentioned that the Netflix documentary Moving
Parts earlier, she's also the CEO of Trixie Cosmetics and
host this season of The Pit Stop on The Driver's

(07:20):
YouTube channel, and he happens to be gay. He happens
to be gay. Oh, there's the last. The most recent
episode of the pit Stop was really interesting. Yeah, because
there was We don't really have to get into it.
I love She's such a messy bitch. I really love it.
But the way she was like dragging. We'll talk about it. Everyone.

(07:42):
Welcome into your ears tricks. God, I am so privileged.
I just love you both so much. We like he
gotta stop, it's so far. I just love listening to
you both. I love all your povs. I think you
are equal parts critical of things in culture, and you
equal parts try to see it all different ways. I
just love you both. And Bowen, I have to say,

(08:03):
your voice is just like it's so chocolate and like
I don't know something. No, it's so relis do you
really are becoming a sex icon? And people have been
noticing sort of around the world that you're a sex
icon and it's really wonderful to see. Thank you. But
you're you're both very, very attractive. And something about Bowen's

(08:24):
boy because Matt usually hit the hysterics, the highs and
lows they're singing, and then it'll be silent and Bowen
will come in like blah blah blah blah blah blah,
and it's like, I just want to take a shower.
In that that sounds. I would say that Bowen is
the Trixie and I might be the Katia. The beauty
of Trixie and CONTI is that any duo can sort
of like trade off the identities. That's my opinion. That's well, yes, totally.

(08:48):
It's sort of like a reverse because I'm sort of
the straight man in that relationship and she's the whack
of do even though she looks normal and I look beautiful, gorgeous, gorgeous,
but she's just hard to pin down because her po
VM most things is very like logical. And then sometimes
she'll peek. You'll she'll she'll lift the veil a little
bit on a life experience and you're like, wow, yeah, yeah,

(09:13):
the inside is right. There's one episode where I was like,
did you ever have a pet that died? And she goes,
I had a lizard that I burnt, And You're like
what what? What? Oh my god? Wait, do you have
you have I ever had a pet that died? No?
They all live forever. No. I mean, I'm a real country,

(09:36):
so our pets are here for a good time, not
a long time. You know. It's like like like checkers,
back legs stop working, but the bet is so far away,
like get the gun. I'm sorry, it is very that.
I know that's awful, but that's what country people do
with their pets. I'm sorry. This is actually a question
I often think, like with the whole putting pets down
of it all, not that not that I'm like, not

(09:58):
that I understand the reality, which is, let's take it
out back. That is very country. But the thing is,
like I've seen people like let their animals live on
well beyond their years and the dog will literally be
dragging its hind legs up the stairs and I'm like, girl,
this is not an existence. Oh I have my boyfriend's
mom has a dog that is named below Love that
literally lives as like a muffin in a basket, like

(10:19):
under a blanket, like a newborn. Like do you guys
want to see it? Okay, well, everyone look quick and
then we'll put it back in a cage for three
like it's just trying to live in the dark like this,
And I'm like, I mean, it's a good quality of life.
I guess if you're a dog that you're fine with that. Like, yeah,
there is just like um an immediate acceptance that you
have to like lock into when like if I'm a

(10:41):
pet owner and my my dog's hind legs stop working,
I in order to not do anything about it, I
would have to uh cope within it within two milliseconds
in me like, yeah, I mean it's okay, it's fine,
it's fine. Let her crawl up the stairs with two
front lines. She loves it. She's doing yoga. No, she
does this all the time. Yeah, she's in constant pain.

(11:03):
She does this all the time because that's what she does. Yeah,
she does that because she doesn't have another choice. It's
not like fucking sometimes he drinks a Miller light while
watching Jeopardy. It's not like a hobby like che To them,
it's like, I don't have a pet, because I'm always
mystified in Los Angeles because the number of people who
have don't. It's the most selfish people alive, but they
only pets. And I'm like, you are the personality type

(11:26):
that needs to take on something to take care of
I really doubt it. I can barely get I can
barely get myself to the restroom. Sometimes, I'm not gonna
walk a dog down this star. Are you kidding me?
Walking the commitment of I'm going to pick up this
ship for the rest of my life. Absolutely not. I
will never have a dog in the country. Just let
your dog go. It comes back hours later, It went

(11:47):
to the bathroom ten times. It probably killed and fed
itslf like something like, it's the city animal that you
want to talk ball and change Jesus Christ. It's literally
a lump a rope that's attached to you. Having a
pet in those cities acts as a counterweight to like
the egomania that people live with every day. Yeah, and

(12:08):
I also I'm a lifelong vegetarians. This isn't about me
not liking animals. I almost feel like I love animals
so much. I'm not gonna get an animal that has
to live fifteen years in my apartment. Yeah, you know,
it's not the vibe. It's barely quality of life, Like, yeah,
you would wish that. See And then I feel bad though,
because like another another. What they say the other side

(12:28):
of the coin is that if you are someone that
is able to care for an animal that needs a home,
I I hosted the show called Hot Dog on HBO Max,
and like we did one episode which was all rescue dogs,
and it was just like I had to read all
these all this copy that was like so many dogs
are suffering, and it was just like I'm holding the dog,
like and I'm thinking to myself, like at the time,

(12:50):
I had a boyfriend who had a dog, and I
was like, I have a fully Like I have full
capability to take care of one of these animals and
they need me. Like I convinced myself in the copy
that I was like, I must do this because they
live sometimes really short, horrible existences and then they just
die and it makes me so sad. Like it really
tugged at my heartstrings. And so I was like, you know,

(13:12):
should I do this because I'm able to? And then
I was like no, because that's not going to make
the dog happier. I'm like, I don't know, it's a
whole it's a whole thing. I mean, I don't know.
I wouldn't get an animal right now. Well, you travel
all the time. That's another thing. Yeah, But that's the
other thing. If I got an animal, even it was small,
I'd have to take it on a tour bus and
then I'm putting a whole band and everyone out being like,

(13:34):
there's a dog here, but no, you can't bring your
girlfriend on the tour, you know. I don't know. I'm
a little too selfish for all that. There's plants on
my patio that literally looks like cigarette ashes that I
think all alive. I see my boyfriend like once a week.
I'm like, this is a huge commitment, Like, yeah, I'm
just I got stuff going on. I got I got,
I got you know, what do you call it? Burners

(13:55):
and the thing? I got things to fire. I have
a question for Tricks because I feel like you can
really um educate me and Matt on this. We're new
to ninety day Nation, We're new to ninety day Fiance.
So am I a little bit? So? Am I a
little bit? Okay? Are we all on the same relatively
like same early like outset timeline on what are you

(14:17):
watching right now? Tricks? So? I watched season one and
two probably two years ago, and then this during Quarantine
the last probably a couple of months. I'm I'm up through.
I'm in the middle of seven now of Straight Up.
So the last season was really good, it was like
Fernanda and like, um, what was her name? I have

(14:39):
I've only seen season four, sorry, Nicole, Nicole and as
in oh Nicole and as in forever crazy crazy. What
I love about the show is this, my boyfriend watches
all of the the Housewives, every reality show. My boyfriend
is like the connoisseur, the Salt Bay of reality show. Okay,
he loves reality TV so much that I always make
fun of him because I'm like, you found me the

(15:00):
Reality TV Trophy, and then he's like salt band reality
TV and I'm always like, you know, rewatching Clue with
for the eightieth time, like your your shows are dumb,
and then now I'm watching this, which is absolutely lower
than the Low than the Low. But what I love
about it is it's unpredictable but formulae. It's always like
a Doughey white guy, like a seventeen year old Ukrainian girl,

(15:24):
or it's like a middle aged mom with two kids
and like an eighteen year old fitness personal trainer from Brazil,
and they're always like, oh, this is real. And what
I like about it is it is a little inspiring
because it is I would do anything for love because
these people truly believe it. They believe it, whether or
not you believe it's right. These people think that they

(15:44):
are making worthy sacrifices for real love, and that part
of it's kind of inspiring. I mean, I've cried watching
that show earnestly. I have a feeling that I will
get there too, because I was watching it last night
and within ten fifteen minutes and watching it, I texted
Bone and I was like, because I watched all the
Ship too, Like I watch all the Housewives everything, and
then I watched this and I'm like, oh, this is
a new level of bat Ship because I started where

(16:07):
Bowen asked me to start, which was before the ninety
Days season two, which is unfair because I got my
seasons mixed up and I've only seen one in three
but two I'm watching now with you, so I'm on
the same track, all right. So so basically, like it's
it's what I love about it is it's a constant
heightened It's like I have never been able to make
a relationship work because um, well actually I've had three divorces,

(16:29):
I'm twenty two. Um, I also am pregnant, and it's
been really hard to get from place to place with
my one leg. It's just like constant, like every scene
is a new heighten of insanity. And that's when I
met John, He's a criminal from England. It's like it's constant.
It's constantly raising the stakes to where I'm on this
couch like like thinking like maybe I shouldn't smoke anymore

(16:53):
because I can't picture, like what's real? What's fake? Like
my reality blurs watching it. Oh that's I eat the marijuana, Gunny,
and I literally like lay like a coffin viewing like
a viewing of the body, like angled toward the TV,
like to the TV like it's real. And what's great
about it is you guys obviously watched two and three.
I mean, what's her name in Mohammed was the first

(17:15):
time the gun really went off with crazy Michelle. Yeah,
but yes, her and Mohammed. I got a cameo from her.
I'm on my birthday the first day at the at
the wedding when he's like because in my culture, I
will not kiss her like what he you like? And
sometimes it's like my boyfriend was offended by this because

(17:36):
I said, people eat self awareness. If you are a four,
get a four. If there's an eight coming into the
equation saying I love your toast, put up the like
there should be some red flags here, okay, Like there's
a reason why I'm not with Ben Affleck okay, and
there's a you have to live in live in your means,
is it for you? No, he's not it for me

(17:57):
at all. I just hold it because like that's like
to somebody. A lot of people think it's really hot. Yeah, okay.
And I told my boyfriend like we're a good match
because I think we're like equally ugly or hot to people.
And he's like, I think my boyfriend wanted to hear
like your its head and I'm so lucky, and I'm like, okay, look,
that's the toxic thinking that puts these people in these situations.

(18:20):
If you're fifty with a bunch of kids, living in Baraboo, Wisconsin,
and like a seventeen year old Ukrainian Instagram model says,
she loves you, give me a fucking boy like yeah,
and also that, but but you have to you gauge
immediately and tell me what you think about this bow
and like when you once you see from the other
so ordinarily they'll open on one of their perspectives at

(18:41):
least this is how before the ninety days is mind you,
I haven't seen much Ninity I fiance, but like we'll
spend a lot of time with like Angela, and like
we'll get her perspective and about how she's talking to Michael,
who lives in Nigeria. So Angela is like a trumper
who's fifty two from the middle of the country, and
she is showing you picked her that she's received from Michael,
who's her Nigerian fiance, our boyfriend, that she's see him.

(19:05):
Yes she is, because remember she brought all that Trump
memorabilia for Michael to wear and he was so excited. Okay,
So basically then you get to find you Find two episodes,
three episodes later, you meet Michael actually in the perspective
of he's giving A a a talking head and then he says,
I'm excited to meet Angela, and they show the pictures
that he's received from her, and they look nothing like her,

(19:29):
and so I'm like, they these people can't see themselves.
They can't understand why. Like, so I guess that's my
thing is it's like whenever I'm talking to someone online
or like back in the day, it feels like a
hundred years ago. When I used to date online, I
would always be cognizant of the fact that, like, am
I showing pictures that when I show up, they're going
to recognize as the same person I'm showing because there's

(19:51):
it's one thing to think like I look good in this,
and it's another thing to think, this is a good
picture of me exactly because also when you're online dating whatever,
you have to go this is the best picture of
this person. I'm seeing them in their best lighting. I'm
seeing them probably five or more pounds ago, probably five
or more years ago. Like that's the truth. And so

(20:14):
I also just think, I'm with Matt, you have a responsibility.
And one of my first UH tours, I had this
whole stand up section about like people need you aren't
doing yourself favors by sending an eight. If you're a six,
send your six pictures, not doing yourself a favor at all.
You're go under give him like one of these, give
them like the give them like the forest, whatever, or

(20:35):
I give him like something, and then reveal like revenge body,
you know what I mean. It's a real culture. Number
seventy you gotta give him the forest, got to give
him the And I say that as someone who was
very asymmetrical sides my face me as well, me as well, Um,
but this is but this is my thing though, Like
isn't We're saying all this as if it's like unique

(20:58):
to these people who are warden, who are like completely
whose realities are very distorted. But it's like, but this
is just I mean, there's a couple of things happening
here where there's like one um uh like it's being
it's it's being like filmed, and we're seeing it as
the viewer and we get to like examine that, examine
that like from an outside perspective too. It's like, oh,

(21:20):
this is just a more pronounced version of what everyone does,
which is like, let me like the show, let me
show like, let me project all these feelings onto this
person that I've ever met a b let me um,
let me show like the pictures of me that are
like completely completely enhanced bogus exactly, so I feel like

(21:41):
they're there. We can relate to these people in some way.
But what I think you're right, because this show wouldn't
be effective if it was look at the monkeys in
the cage we can't relate to. Like, I just watched
the season where I'm Jay, this guy from Jamaica, he
three days after the wedding to this girl cheats on
her and she's like, I don't know what I'm gonna do.
And I'm like, this isn't unique to because you're a

(22:03):
straight people feel about cheating and give me a break.
But like he cheated, it's over crazy, um, but like um,
on FISA was it season four? Like a woman who
likes money who like you hate on Fista for being crazy,
but also that guy lied to her about how much

(22:24):
money he had exactly and then that woman and on
Fisa exists is a figure in America, figure in American society. Not,
it's not even specific to it's not even specific to
like immigrants totally. Nicole Buyer says that she she's obsessed
with the show. And Nicole Buyer says, a part of
me is convinced that it's anti immigrant Propagain, it's not not.

(22:45):
But it also doesn't make the Americans look smart. Ever, no, no, no, no,
it is equal opportunity. Um, it branks on everybody. There's
one there's one couple that I'm watching now on Before
the ninety Days and I'm I'm forgetting. But it's it's
this he goes to I believe Eve Brazil and Paul
It and Paul and Carini. Oh my god, no, no,

(23:06):
it's not not pun creany, although the poun cranny stuff
is dark because he keeps asking her to get pregnancy
tests and it's like really crazy. He don't speak this thing.
They do not take the same language at all. He
makes no effort to learn Portuguese. She's trying to learn English,
but he it's crazy. Sorry, keep going. So it's it's
it's wild but comedy Portuguese is bradgi PG, you're lying.

(23:33):
I'm not kidding, bra bradge PG. Sorry, I'll let you
sorry about this is This is all I want to say,
and that we can go back to Brad and talk
about it for an hour and a half. Um. But
my thing on this other couple is that he gets
there and he's like, I'm in love with her and
she doesn't show up for Oh, it's the one Marissa
is her name or Michelle or something, but it takes

(23:56):
her three hours to show up for their first date
and he's like, there and waiting and waiting, waiting. He's like,
I'm gonna this is the worst day of my life.
And then she shows up and of course he's in
love with her and obsessed. Um but no, no, it's
not even them I'm talking about. It's another one. But
the girl says, I don't like him, he doesn't like
his pictures. I'm not into it, but I want a
better life. And I have to say, watching it and

(24:18):
seeing where she comes from and seeing what her reality is,
I don't not get it, you know what I mean.
Like if I'm it's like I'm going to get an
opportunity to go to America, and it's like a legit
thing because this guy is legitimately a love with me,
and like, this is an opportunity for me. I don't
begrudge her that, by the way, I do some of
these In some of these new episodes, America is in

(24:38):
real time of burning building. It's like, and people are
still like, I gotta get there. I think I'm gonna
like it. Here is wars and sucking fires. And I
will say this too. It makes me think critically about
marriage because on TV we only see marriage for love,
and when you think of marriage is honestly more of
a business partnership between two people. People get married for

(25:00):
all different reasons if it mutually improves the quality of
the life. Maybe he just wants a hot girl and
maybe she just wants to get out of the fucking
USSR or some ship. If you both win, who are
we to be critical of? Why exactly married? That's the thing.
The more I watch it, the freak show aspect fell away,
and the more I'm like, these two people are trying
to find something that works for both of them, whatever

(25:21):
it is, and they understand marriage to be functional because
in other countries some of these people, marriage is a
little more like it's arranged, or the one where the
guy had to go to the Philippines or whatever and
pay her dowry, had to go buy two cows to
give her her parents. Like, for us to be critical
of these people's relationships is to be critical of each
society's view on marriage. And they're not congruent in any way. Ever. No,

(25:47):
that's on period, and that's on period. But it's funny,
like true truly. Twenty minutes after watching it, I was like,
oh my god, these people are insane, And then it
slowly did become No, they're lonely and they want partnership
and what's so bad about that? And they're there, this
is the way where they can find it exactly. Just
you wait until the tell alls, which are like the reunions.

(26:07):
It feels it's it's even more impactful than like The
Avengers to me, or any crossover event, because it's like
it's like all of these people, all these people who
you are only following in their separate little like stories,
come together and they interact with each other and you're like,
what the fuck right? Fixing actually, because it's a better
crossover event than Gold It's fears and then at the

(26:31):
end someone snaps their finger and half of them disintegrate. No. Um,
it's very fierce because they will have different opinions. The couples,
like this one girl was like, yeah on feces, all
women like money on faces upfront about it, and you
guys grill her for it at least she's sayings or
then they're like, um, like that one guy who was like,

(26:51):
how came you? You never say thank you for all
the things I do for the baby, and the other
guys like I watched the season and the whole time
I couldn't stop thinking, that's your wife and baby, why
do you need her to say thank you? Like, I
think it's more validating because these are first time reality
celebrities who have had to deal with comments and you know,
people who have never been on TV before. They're in
the comments, they're reading, they're responding, Yeah, they're those people.

(27:12):
They learn a lot because they're ultimately in a room
for the first time with the only people who can
say that they've been through that exactly. Drag Race is
the only reality TV I've seen really besides this, So
it's been a good like parlay. This is my first
reality show to like indulge in. And I feel like
you would love Loves, you would love the House because
and now that you've now that you've broken the seal
in ninety day, like you can watch anything. Yeah, And

(27:33):
I know some of the girls, so like I did.
I went to um Lisa vander Pump's house. She's super nice,
and she was super super nice and it was for
a thing, and I kind of did have to float
that I knew more about her than I But then
I was like, to be honest with you, I don't
really watch it, which I think she found kind of refreshing. Yeah,

(27:54):
my boyfriend is like the slum dog millionaire like Encyclopedia
of Housewives. Yeah, that's why I find it intimidating is
because how I've seen some of Salt Lake City because
that was new. But I'm like, how am I supposed
to start this show? Twelve seasons in? Easier than you think.
It's easier than you think. You can actually kind of
jump in anywhere you want and like get on the
interstate and just like from any point just getting I

(28:16):
will say I used to be like my boyfriend at
my boyfriend's house, like whatever, hanging out, and I'd be like,
you're crazy, that show is so stupid and like months
in our relationship and be like what did she say
to her? Yeah exactly, or like like slowly invested. You know,
it's just about absorption over the long term. When I
watch these shows, it's like I'm just gonna put this
is how I do it with ninety Days two. It's

(28:37):
like I just put it on and it's not osmosis
and guess and yeah, yeah, yes, and but um, anyway,
I think you should. I think you can watch anything
that were we to say that I was just gonna
suggest to you how I got into it, which is all.
This is all. I did. Just watch the season of
Real Housewives of New York when Brett when Bethany returns. Yeah,

(28:58):
so Bethany is in the beginning, and then she leaves
for three or four seasons to go try to start
a reality a talk show of her own rather and
do her own spinoffs, and then she comes back to
New York. And that's where I started. And from there
I kind of just picked and did whatever I wanted.
But that was the way I started, and I am
here today the woman I am. Yeah, David has been
giving me a little bit of a crash course and
some of the most iconic grallery television. Like during Lockdown,

(29:20):
we watched Flavor of Love. I've never seen it Flavor Well,
there's a there's a purity, there's a purity to that.
And I watched I Love New York and I watched
The Simple Life, which I loved. David. David was watching
Top Model, which I watched a few seasons of that
with him, and I just couldn't believe I've never seen it,
like these women are being asked to walk in a

(29:41):
line and say easy Breezy Beautiful cover group and they
can't do it. You drag Race there like today you're
gonna have to start your mom on funding and then
like we have to do so much to win drag Race.
That surprises me that you had never seen any of that,
like like and to Pure, Too Pure, which which we love,

(30:02):
But you had went on drag Race after being a
fan of drag Race, or was just because you had
done drag for so long or both. Every track queen
who is not on Drag Race says they don't watch it,
but they do, and they say they wouldn't do it,
but they would. Of course I would never do that show,
but yes you would, and so watch That was really
the only reality show I had ever seen, which I

(30:23):
think is like why I sort of excelled at it
a little bit because I didn't have I didn't know
what I was doing, Like I was just fine. You
didn't have the filter of I have to be a
certain way, right, exactly right. It was like my first
time with cameras around. I don't know how TVs worked
or anything, which is great about reality because that's how
you get authentic people. To be authentic, is like you

(30:44):
get people from Baraboo, Wisconsin, who have a life from
the Philippines. You know, you don't get more real than that.
How was that pre interview? Because they watched it at
the pit stop. Because I watched, I was like, this
is like immediately tense from the jump. I don't believe
that for a second. I bet I bet they both
knew what was happening. It was fine. I think the

(31:05):
editing made it seem a little bit like, um, it
was a little bit like Bethany Alma Rossa or something. Yeah,
I knew that the whole time. I was I literally
just watched earlier today and I was like, no, they're
saying that, but the five is good and that was good.
But she made me laugh because she obviously she watched
me review Canada's Drag Race, which my job is to

(31:25):
not ship talk but tell about everything I don't like
about anything. And then it's like she's the guest and
she was so nice. But also for I will say,
I'm glad she had the balls to like when she
was like I'd never seen your season and I get
your famous I was like, that is so funny. Yeah,
she cracked my ship up. I thought she was great. Also, people.
I guess thought that we were having sexual tension, were

(31:47):
you only you can tell us. I didn't think we were.
But as I need to be hit over the head
with like flirting, I never know what's happening, like you know,
like a wine mom will have, like if you're waiting
for a sign, this is it on the kitchen. That's
what I need. I need like that big of a sign.
And I'm like, oh, oh well, let me get my
pants off, you know, like I need to know what's

(32:08):
going Yeah, exactly. I feel like the thing too with
like like you on the pit stop and like this
is the way that that I know, I know that
I felt anyway, Boen, probably you agree, But like when
we were doing the Vulture recaps and like whenever we
were doing like an episode of a podcast about drag
race that is also entertainment. So if I go up
there and I'm like, I think all the queens are amazing,
And first of all, it's brave that they're going up there,

(32:30):
especially today when we think it's accepting a nationwide to
be gay on television, but actually it's really hard. It's like, no, bitch,
Like I'm actually gonna say if I don't, Like, I know,
I'm not a drag queen, and like something you said
in the documentary is it's like it doesn't make people
an expert on drag no matter what they think. It
makes them an expert of being a fan of the
television show. And I do think I am a huge

(32:50):
fan of the television show, so I can say that, Like,
I think Denali is a fucking great performer, and her
outfits looked whack to me, like on this last episode
of the show, like that's and me, as a fan
of the show who has an opinion on the competition,
should be able to say that. But the discourse around
drag Race is so heated and crazy and people are

(33:11):
so invested. It gets me in my head talking about
the show because of the way people it's like stand
culture is pop stars and drag Race, you know what
I mean. Well, and they're really intense and they are
fiercely defensive of like, yeah, the great thing about Drag
Race is probably one of the only shows where multiple
people can feel totally different ways about runways, looks queens

(33:34):
based on anything anything, Like I love Olivia so much
she could just do okay that week, and I'm like Olivia,
Oh my god, Like I just love who I love.
So you're getting your head talking about it too, because
I'm I'm in a couple of group threads and everyone
hates Olivia, and I'm like, I actually think Olivia was good,
like you know what I mean. And and then like

(33:54):
the way it was established in our group that was
like we keep calling you to a queen the Jester,
we just keep on your dress and like, wow, Jester flops.
But then in this last episode, I was like, oh,
the Jester kind of like down from there, and I
never hope back to either because like, especially with I
mean like the fundamentals of drag I will be like
that wig is rotted, that wis too flat for your

(34:17):
body shape, your six four, that's a flat wig. Why
don't you have a shape on Why are you showing
those shoulders? And if you're gonna show those shoulders, why
don't you put makeup on them? And it's like people
think it's so personal, but I'm like, we're critiquing drag.
It's fun. And with Drag Race, there is like a
tiered commentary sort of hierarchy to it where it's like
the reason people watch, like you know, Raj and Raven

(34:39):
like talk about looks, and the reason people watch like
you host pit Stop is because it's like, oh, you
guys have been through this crazy crucible that is the show,
and so you like people want to hear your input
because it's it's different than what me whatever, what anyone
says on some any random group chat. You know what
I mean, right, And it doesn't mean more more qualify,
But like I've done it multiple times, lost and one

(35:02):
plus Christmas plus celebrity drag race, So like, I think
I have a bit of an idea of what that
how much heat is really on these people, and I
think I'm forgiving in that way, like if you pull
a ship runway or like I mean sometimes it's just like, yeah,
that's garbage. You're I'm not saying you're garbage, but that sucks.
And I've worn a lot of garbage drag race, are

(35:23):
you kidding? So, like, we've all done it, We've all
had bomb runways, like terrible runways, except not all of us.
Some people like violets of the world, there's people who haven't.
I know, it's that's kind of frustrating to but then
also the violets of the world did that have bomb
runways every single time? Incredible, incredible, incredible usually have flop performances,
and she had some fucking fulop just like like talk

(35:44):
about American's Next Top Model not being able to read.
That's one Season seven acting challenge, like where it was
like it was like, you guys, we talked about that
all the time. Which, by the way, back to rescue animals,
Tempest is your rescues animals all the time. Tempest, She's
such a time But I love Tempest story. I talked

(36:04):
to her probably once a month. We're very close, and
I called her recently because she's where she rescues dogs
and exotic exotic birds. Like I talked to her recently
and she's like, I'm just kind of down because my
two can got murdered by my rescue dog. And I'm like,
Tempest is like at home with an emu and a
two can just vibing. Isn't that crazy? Yeah? But it

(36:29):
really fucking love Tempest. She had one. She has one
of the most memorable entrances. Squirted at that baby and
then can I tell you this is just this is
just a little like ego stroke but like sent me
the nicest message I have ever received. Tempests sent me
like like one of the sweetest DM I'm sorry this

(36:50):
sounds so obnoxious, but she was like I just wanted
to say hi, and blah blah blah blah. I was like, Temps,
Oh my god, I love you. Literally, I'll freak out
over any drag creen that's ever been on the show.
And if Julia Roberts walks down the street, I'm like, no,
that's that's that's not true. But one time I did
run into Jennifer Garner on the street while I was
singing for the ride the tour bus I used to
work for. I was singing Megan Trainer lips are moving

(37:11):
for a tour bus and Jennifer Garner walked by me
and was like what And I didn't care at all,
But then I'll see, like, fucking um, I feel like
the Magnolia Crawford. Literally, Magnolia Crawford. I would get on
my knees and stock cock. I swear to god, Magnolia
Crawford gag. Like, but Jennifer Garner, I don't really care,
Like these queens are everything to me, Like guess what
I'm saying, Like we could invite like fucking whoever on

(37:33):
the show, but like, we didn't reach out to you
because we assume you'd say no, She's the most famous
person in the world. It's sixtys are so busy. I
love doing pods and um it's one of the only
things they don't have to get in drag Force. So
I always say, yeah the bald in the Beautiful, which
you people can subscribe to me and Contie every week.
You two are truly like on a radio host level,

(37:55):
just morning show. I just the it's just so quick
and sharp. I'm like, wow, next week. Next week is
our on like COVID Portoviy Artist Special, So I'm very excited.
Boiler alert. I'm not sure I'm allowed to say this,

(38:16):
but Violet Chop she's going to be on the pit stop.
Want to talk about critiquing drag You want to talk
about somebody who hates everything? Yeah. I was like crying,
laughing because I'm like, what do you think of this look?
And She's like, it's not a look. I'm not even
going to critique. God. I fell into one of those
wormholes recently, which was like the top one best around

(38:39):
my looks have all time, and it's like miss Mojo serious.
First of all, we have to say Miss Mojo gave
it up for Ms Mojo. Wait, what do we go on?
What are we just watching? It was like Miss Mojo
Top ten iconic Glee Characters. It's like number three, Mr
Shoe And it's always a white women who reads the copy.

(38:59):
And and Trixie worked her pussy ciss like, yeah, good
forget when she's dragged the house down, absolutely boots. When
when she slaid, yeah, grab a bucket and a mop
with that gradass pussy Trixie's how. I don't know the
ethnicity of Miss Mojo, but though the voice makes me laugh,
and the idea that that channel exists and we all

(39:22):
referred to it at some points, Mojo is culture and
that's actually a real culture. Number one hundred and six,
Miss Mojo, she is. Miss Mojo is an icon and
Miss Mojo was getting a Kennedy Center Honors if I
have anything to say about it. Miss Mojo was actually
originally the cast of She was originally the host of
Drag Race, Miss Mojo's Drag Miss Mojo needs to come

(39:46):
on as a guest judge. We need to finally see
her face totally Wait, but what I was saying was
like it was like a top one hundred best looks,
and like, of course the number one was you already
know it was when Violet came back for the She's
A for the Season A finale and the crown was
in her head. I was like, you can never no

(40:06):
one could ever touch this, and like so many of
her looks, like the iconic fucking cinching of that waste,
like yeah, the guest judge that was so good. We
had her on the pod and she was go listen
to it because she was talking about um, how much
she hates kids and drag, which is so fierce because
I say it uncanceled Violets like a child in a wig.

(40:28):
Give me a fucking break with Volet kids. And then
she was talking about um, like when Violet does like
corporate gigs and they're like, well, how about you are
a little less sexy, or like how Violet will literally
tell these corporate people, I'm gonna do what I'm gonna
do and you can record it while it happens or not,
but I'm not changing it. And Violet has like so
much conviction about like I didn't start doing drag to

(40:50):
have anybody tell me anything, which I just she's like
my idol in that way. People really think she's kind
of an ice cold bitch, but it's just because she's
really unflinching about, like I start doing dragged to answer
to any of you. I love her, she inspires me. Yeah,
you have to admire someone who like will never ever
ever um get on the back heel with like some

(41:12):
beta cuck energy. It's like, oh, you will always always
always driving. Yeah whatever. She is a little bit like
she's she's a little bit frosty though. Like one time
I saw her on tour and I was like like
backstage with her and I was like, I really liked
your number and she's like thanks, and I was like,
I just love the outfit to everything you've been doing
has been so great. It's like pause and I'm like

(41:33):
staring and she's like, I liked that one picture of you.
Like trying to get her to stay one nice thing.
She was like a picture of you. Yeah. She was
like exhausted, She's like, oh fine, I liked that one
picture of you so funny. Oh my god, Okay, so
I think it might be time to ask the question
bo oh yeah, oh my God, I can't believe we

(41:53):
haven't asked. We've just been carried away by conversation. But
it is time because this is what we do on
the podcast. We asked everyone except Margaret Show because we
got too nervous. What was the culture Trixie Mattee that
made you say culture was for you? Probably probably Buffy
the Vampire Slayer, Okay, just because it was horror and

(42:16):
camp in comedy and very moving. Um, it just made
me think about like what something on TV could make
me feel and think about like the world and like
what was possible, And it just changed a lot for me.
I think, I don't know why. I probably just because
I saw when I was a teenager and I was like, oh,
this is like and I didn't think about what that

(42:37):
show is and think about how hard it would have
been to pitch in the room. This is based off
a show that a movie that flopped, like what that
was that was up there for me? And probably the
Rocky Horror Picture Show. I know that's kind of tired,
but um, seeing somebody vibrate between genders and gender expressions
and using it for power was like, Oh, there's something there,

(42:59):
you know. I mean, yeah, I will just come right
out and say that Buffy has been tough for me
because se of the guys who have dumped me, our
Buffy heads are are are David boy And I'm just like,

(43:20):
I have a hard time watching because I think of
I think of all these men. That's so weird. You
constantly date Buffy stands. They happen to be Buffy stands,
and I'm like, what is okay? So do colonize her?
They all look completely different. The demographics, there's no like
common demographics except that they're they're gay men or who
attracted to gay men. And it's like, wait a minute,

(43:41):
you all love Buffy and you've broken my heart. This
is crazy. There's got to be something they've driven a
steak through your heart, even they have, it's just, um,
I feel like people talk about like the Sopranos change television.
I think Buffy is a little under celebrated for that.
And you have to think like Buffy was doing, if
we want to talk drama acting, they were doing what
every dramatic show could do, Like they were going that

(44:03):
deep and they were adding fight sequences like Hollywood level
special effects every week. Yeah, c g. I she was
turning it out too for seven years, learning almost scripts
like every week, Like what, it's amazing she doesn't have
an Emmy, And then I was just talking about this
um like scream like the fact that Nev Campbell doesn't

(44:26):
have like oscars on oscars. For that, I'm like, because
you know, for women especially, you have to play a
certain sort of Oh, this is the role you take
when you want an award, because if there's anything spooky
or anything funny, we don't respect it, you know what
I mean. Well, we talk all the time about how
like there's no world where it's untrue that Rachel McAdams

(44:48):
is deserving of an Oscar for me and girls. I mean,
she created a character that will live on forever and
fucking nailed it and made the movie by doing what
she did, I could say, likewise, Alicia Silverstone and clueless,
there was really no one else who could have done
it like that. And I think it the seems to
be said for Buffy the Vampire Slider with the Emmys.
It's just they still do it now. They're sort of
coming around, but it's really more the sort of prestige

(45:10):
cable networks that can get fantasy stuff nominated, like Game
of Thrones, but something on the c W is just
never really going to break through or the w B
at that time because the genre things scared them away. Meanwhile,
like Sarah Michelle Geller was doing an iconic performance that
has stood the test of time, and it feels like
at that time they couldn't see it. Whether it was
the genre of it all, whether it was she was young,

(45:31):
whether it was whatever the whether it was she was beautiful,
it was based on a flap like I don't know
what it was, but it feels like they didn't take
it seriously. And if you look at the quality of
the work truly, the range, the depths, the way she
played that all, like every part of that show was
super natural of course, but like human life relatable all
the time, and it just wasn't celebrated enough. And I

(45:53):
think about that sometimes, but stuff like that gives me hope,
Like when I hear I always talk about like a
Jane Jet pitched I Love rock and Roll to Twine
three record labels and Neil said, no, it's not a hit,
No one won't like it. Yeah, Wow, Like I love
Roman Michelle one of my favorite movies. Lisa Kudo wrote
that ten years before, and then after doing Friends and
getting famous, she took it to the market again and

(46:13):
it got bought. Like some things are just timing related
or it's just like not fair. But like RuPaul has
thirty five Emmys and Sarah Michelle Gellar doesn't have one
for Buffy, and I love Drek Grace. I think we're important.
It's important, like redistribute the wealth of awards. Take one
of RuPaul's Emmy's and give it to don't even change

(46:34):
the name play, give one to Charisma carp Hello. I
literally feel though, like with the Emmy's and ship like that,
Like once you win one for a certain role, I
think you should be you should move on, like you've
won an Emmy for the party, move on. But because
I feel like it's boring, and I fucking love Julia
Louie Dreyfuss, Like, don't get me wrong, I think she

(46:54):
does deserve to win every time she gets nominated, but
when um, she now every single year in wins and
wins and wins and wins. The same thing was like
Brian Cranston for breaking bad, like we know already, let's
like move on and celebrate something else. I always feel
like that when something wins for one role every single year,
or when one show wins every award in a year
like this year, Whips Creek Like, you can't tell me

(47:16):
that it was the only comedy deserving of the awards.
It's just breaking bad. Was to serve so Bob trying
to get me to watch that for forever, and I
was like, it's just like a bald white guy with math,
Like I got that at home, you know what I mean.
But then when I watched it, I was like, this
is amazing. I can't belave that show. How they made

(47:36):
the first season feels so high stakes, and you go,
where could they go from here? This was crazy? Forget it.
And by the end of it, like him, I mean,
it was sobbing, sobbing, I mean crazy. That's how I
also felt about Um, I don't know. I've rewatched a
lot of trash during this year, and I rewatched True
Blood again and I was like, Cant and I were
both rewatching it. We're both rewatching it, and every time

(47:57):
I watch it and finish it, I'm still not sure
I like it, but I watched it. It's true. It's
mostly I don't want to say trash that's not fair.
Why don't you just say it, well, no, it's it's
just pulpy, it's just like, yes, it just it just
you you have such a recency bias with that show,
like you only all that Maunters is what you just
saw like ten minutes ago. Because I think True Blood,

(48:20):
I think it's one of the best shows that's been
on in the past couple of decades. I honestly think
it's like it literally Trisy walked away. But when you disagree, yes,
it's like okay, but here thinks The Chilling Adventures of
Sabrina is one of the best shows. It's not. And
you're an first of all, it's that's not true. But

(48:41):
this is why I think it's good, because it was
supposed to be pulpe and camp and it really was,
like even when it was horrible, it was horrible with purpose.
They got like the finest New York stage actors to
come beyond this trash show, like Routina Wesley. You cannot
tell me that unbelievable. And also like they got like

(49:06):
Everan Rachel would like coming in for a minute. Fucking
Denis Hair. Deniso Hair deserved an oscar for playing for
playing his role on that show when not an Emmy, unbelievable,
an oscar, he doesn't for a TV show. Yes, yes, yes, okay, yes,
I I stand by what I said, but like truly

(49:27):
shocking television that you're like, what, But that was the
point and that was what it was supposed to be
and it delivered on that the whole time. Yes, it
got shitty towards the end, but so does everything else.
Don't tell me. In Gray's Anatomy's a d F season
that like True Blood wasn't good after it fucking did
it six seasons and was like we're out. It was good,

(49:47):
And honestly, I had never the way that they used
like being a vampire or like he v to talk
about things like h a v and race and and
you know, God hates fangs, like come on, like the
way that they creatively all that happened. I did like it.
I've watched it in my life through twice, so I
can't have hated it. No. Season two and three are
really good, like this annual of it all a girl

(50:12):
and fucking Jason Stackhouse could snap my throat. Oh my god. Yeah,
we talked about him. We talked about a racist I
just popped out like, yeah, he's what happened? We were
like what happened to him? It is one of those
shows kind of like Looking, where the main character was
the least likable looking. I mean Looking was like what
was the main character where he's like, am I a

(50:32):
top or a bottom? I'm like, how do you not
know that? He's literally that was my problem with that
bo When did you watch Looking? I never watched. Well,
you're it's fine, it's fine, Yeah, it's fine. And my
problem with it that was exactly when you're saying, it's
like you're third. You're in the show, quote unquote thirty
years old, you look like Jonathan Groff, you live in
San Francisco, have for years. You're a successful person with

(50:56):
friends that go out. You go out all the time,
and you haven't figured out like what lube is? Girl.
That's the thing. I didn't buy it, you know what
I mean? And I thought like if they if they
made that character, that I would buy that because like
I was one of those gay men who didn't know
how to have sex, Like I I get it, Like
still sometimes yeah, I'm still like arment no, but like

(51:21):
it's just kidding everyone. I really know how to fuck
um um but no um but um anyway, Uh, that's
I didn't buy that show for that reason. I was like,
Jonathan Groff has written thousands of dicks, I know it,
um and probably even tried it out topping once or twice. Yeah.

(51:44):
And I will say back to True Blood to what
made that show work is And when I was in
school for musical theater, they talked about acting realistically in
unrealistic circumstances, and in True Blood they committed to these
unrealistic They played everything like it was really. The acting
in that show is so good. It's phenomenal, phenomenal. It

(52:06):
is girl Jessica, that bitch makes me cry every two episodes,
the Queen and Queen Pam or your Girl Pam Chris Stratton,
so good, folks. That is just rattling this off. Was
a huge fan. Well those are our guests today. I'm
just kidding, Oh my god, but no, they were. I

(52:28):
mean the way that Pam starts as like a bit
and then the more you learn her backstory, like being
with the mother of a brothel, You're like, oh, that's
would make someone a bit like that. You know, she
was trying to do a vampire before her time. Really,
they all have edges. I didn't mean to come in
here and talk about True Blood, but no we did.
I have to ask you, tricky, what are you What

(52:49):
are you playing these days? What video games are you playing?
Are you playing? I'm a little bit on a hiatus.
I completed Pokemon sword um during Christmas and New York
Christmas and Thanksgiving bread um, and then uh, I'm playing
Cyberpunk seven right now, um, which is really good. I
love it. Everybody's complaining that it's so buggy. I'm like,

(53:10):
so is Skyrim, so is Fallout. So we're all these
big games that I get that. I understand that, like
any big budget open world game like this, is bound
is bound to run into stuff. What what I think
bumps a lot of people is that it had been
hyped up over the course of like eight years, eighties
seven years. It was eighty seven years, truly eighty seven years,

(53:33):
and then um it just the release date kept getting pushed.
So it feels that so now, like the narrative is
everyone's like we got jilted or we were you know,
conned out of this like gameplay experience, and now we
have to wait for all these patches and um now
there's all this like new stuff coming out where like
the demo they released was like, um not an actual

(53:54):
demo was just footage or whatever. Like there's all this
like shitty stuff now that like makes um CD project
rad what of that company is that made? On the
witcher is like not a great whatever? I like. I mean,
I I'm playing it on a rather like high powered
gaming PC, so I know that I don't have the
same problems as a lot of people because I don't
because it's on consoles. Yeah yeah on PC. I know

(54:15):
on PlayStation was literally unplayable for me. It's been a
really beautiful game. Um. And the storytelling is good, the
animation is good. The imagining of the United States in
seven is good. I like it. It's not as bad
as what's the take on the US Then I'm curious.
I don't play it. It's this high tech city in California, um,

(54:37):
and it's called Night City and everything is run by
like mega corporate Like the government is just like mega corporations, right, yeah,
the mega corporations is basically the government. The police are
kind of corrupt. Everything is like basically drugs and sex
being sold everything is about drugs and sex and technology,
which I mean, I can see it. And then there's

(54:58):
been some comments that some of the advertising featured in
the game is transphobic, um, which I mean. It really
depends on how you viewed, I guess, but I find
the experience to be pretty good so far. I've just
been dedicating a little less time to play video games
because I really will sit here for hours. I know
it's it's scary. It's scary, and I'm a big day
by daylight girl, so I'll still play that a few
times that we're cute. Wait, okay, started to such topics

(55:19):
so quickly, but we have not talked you and I
the three of us about Michelle branch in the way
that I would like you to talk about Michelle branch
specifically tricks, because that's that's how you and I started.
That's how you and I started talking to each other. Right,
Like I think, like I like this article on the right,
like this interview I did came out where I was

(55:41):
just like one of my earliest influences was The Spirit
Room by Michelle branch Or. The interview asked me, what's
the culture that made you say cultures for you was
like Leanders every day and that's what you said. I
was like on that day, I was like today, it's
today when I think like the other day, I thought, Wow,
The Spirit Room by Michelle Branch is such a formative
album for me. I know every single lyric to that. Remember,
I'm like, I am gagging at what is happening right now.

(56:02):
Trixie just pulled out her acoustic guitar. That happen Like,
I like literally learned to get hard of that music. Like, yes,
I can see she really good. She really was to

(56:27):
thank you, Oh god, you want to Also, I'll never
not like cry to goodbye to you. Oh my god,
it's so over. Yes, she really that that like man
years old Billie Eilish eat your heart out. Yeah, that

(56:48):
whole moment was a good moment like her like the
same time, it's like I don't like her, but Avril Levine,
Vanessa Carlton, like it was very singer songwriter moment. Yeah,
And that's when I started playing guitar and everyone you know,
guitar is a very male dominated instrument. It's very phallic,
it's very aggro, it's aggressive, it's jazzing on it. It
comes up your crotch. Right. The guitar has a long

(57:10):
penis like top. It's actually a real culture number. The
guitar peniss like top. So when I started playing guitar,
it's like, no gig, I know, like three gig guys
with play guitar. And I'm always like, why was I
I'm such a fag. Why was I into guitar? And
it's like because I was thirteen when I started. This
was a time of Avlavie Michelle Branch Cheryl grow on

(57:30):
the radio. Women with guitars were such a thing, so
I thought it as like subversive, like women holding this
power with this thing interesting tricks. Are you really watching
you play, whether it's guitar or auto harp, I'm like,
it's really beautiful. I'm sorry, let me just say this,
because it's like you look blissed out completely. You look

(57:53):
so serene when you play. It's it's so nice. I
just I just had to say that they're so good.
Do you You're so good? Like no, but like you
really are. Like I'm telling you, I don't just buy
I mean your your fucking album is going to go
in my vinyl collection. Like I truly loved it, Like
I I and I really I want to say, like,

(58:16):
I loved your first two albums, but this last album
I really love and it's almost I hope you take
this as a compliment. It's almost giving me like Weezer.
Are you kidding? That's like a huge compliment. Yeah, it
really was giving me Weezer. I was really really enjoying it.
And I love them all. I love gold, I love
Jesse Jesse, I obviously love Malabo, I love I love
the cover Stranger. That's really good. And like, I don't know,

(58:39):
I just I hear. Do you love Casey Musgraves? Obviously
you do. Of course, I hear so much of her
in it, you guys have done. She's a fan, she's
a friend, she's a reader. I don't know. Can you
imagine if we found out she listened to this podcast,
I would die. You guys call him a reader, And
when somebody's a fan of me in real life, I
call him a friend of the pod, which makes no sense.

(59:00):
She's a friend of the pot even before I had
a pot of and she's a friend of the pod.
But I just thank you. I will say I'm very
lucky because people come out of the woodwork and they're like, basically,
I get this response a lot, which I find very flattering.
People like, Hey, I actually finally listened to your music
and it's actually good, which isn't what you guys are saying.

(59:20):
But that's what you guys are saying. But it's like
people mean that they don't expect it to be good,
and then they're like, oh, this is nice. I appreciate that,
because you know, I love Weezer, and my all time
favorite band is Fountains of Wayne Verius. Fountains of Wayne.
Oh my God, rest in pirest in peace. By the way,

(59:41):
I cried not to be gay, but I cried. Our
good friend is Rachel Bluman. Um. I couldn't imagine I
met him. I met Adam once in a pitch meeting
for something, and I just was like, I know, this
is a serious professional meeting. I have to tell you,
like Fountains like you guys changed the way I thought
about songwriting period forever. And he was just like, oh,
thank you, okay, because to him, it's like twenty years

(01:00:02):
always like oh that band, thanks, And I'm like, oh
my god, I needn't understand the way Adam Schlesinger writes music.
But um, what a funny, talented guy, so talented. But
with Barbara, I was just like, well, I've done the
country and folk thing, especially living in California, was like,
I want to do something really bright and sunshiny in
California and listening to like the Go Goes and Weezer

(01:00:22):
and just like, I don't know that album is so
fun to make. It's so good, so good. Thank you.
You guys are extremely sweet for saying that. I mean,
I feel like it was such a weird little risk
when I started playing guitar and stuff and drag, but
it it had such a better effect than I thought.
I thought, like doing comedy people, we're gonna feels like
I'm gonna do comedy and then you gonna have to
deal with the song I'm gonna sing later, okay, And

(01:00:44):
it was The response was very like, surprisingly, very positive always,
which has been so nice. Do you think it's that people,
even like gay audiences who like love drag race, they
just have like a preconceived idea of what drag music
is going to be, obviously, because it's like, you know,
you think it's gonna be like cunt cunt pussy. I'm
from New York and I walk the walls, and you know,

(01:01:06):
like which we do going to be love that we
love it. I mean when I think that Baby's a
harrabin a deserve Best Pop Vocal Performance for Jungle Kitty,
But I mean, and that's just nothing, that nothing matters,
which doesn't um. I will say, we when we roll
out albums like this year, we have multiple, multiple records

(01:01:27):
coming out. It's the first time I've said it. We
have multiple records coming out, and when we roll out,
when we roll out records, we get together and we
we I hate to say it. This isn't to throw
anybody under the bus. We have to swim upstream with
people's opinion of what somebody in a wig could do
with music, yeah, or with anything. This is what it
is with anything you um, you train an audience to

(01:01:51):
get used to seeing you a certain way. And what
if it means and for and for drag race contestants specifically,
it means like I either go the way of and
and they're not like it's not like a mutually exclusive choice,
but it's like I either go the way of like
do of doing what is like already in the matrix
of like what the outcomes are outside of the show
or I do something, but you you even talk about

(01:02:13):
this in moving parts though You're just like I want
to like do my whole like Emmy Lou Harris, Loretto,
Loretta Lemn Dolly Parton thing. But like people there are
people are not used to seeing a drag queen do
this on stage the way that I would like to
do it. Yeah, Like I will say, like the first
time I pulled out a guitar and started putting it
in the stand up every night it was like hour

(01:02:34):
long stand up show. I was in p Town doing
a whole summer fifty five shows and every night people
be like, oh, the show was funny. I didn't even
know you play guitar. I love this here you play
and every night it was like, oh, well, there's a
world for this. And then when I started playing the harp,
it was moments where I was just like, I am
here in a wig for these people who want they
came to like I don't know if they came to
see Gotta Got Got, but like I'm going to stay
up here and play an appealition focustrument like it's a

(01:02:57):
little wild but character so well, because like it's Dolly
Parton calls that immediately and also honesty is you can
never doubt that. So like, that's what kind of music
came naturally to me. So I can't pull off a
purse first because I don't listen to that kind of stuff.
But then if you, like I think of people like
Blondie or the B fifty two is where it's like

(01:03:18):
these people are wearing wigs and wearing instruments, they just
don't call it drag. And then every top star has
wigs and lashes on like them. I love them and
they and they all do like an acoustic phase. Can
I ask you a question from Moving Parts? Because yes,
Matt and I rewatched last night. Thank you guys very much.
Of course everyone should watch it. It's really great. And

(01:03:39):
I feel like Netflix is tough because the algorithm just
kind of decides for everyone what they're gonna watch. Like,
so if you missed it, if you missed it when
it came out, you should check it out. It's really
really good. We looked out when it came out. We
were trending on the YouTube like the we were under
trending and critically acclaimed or whatever for like a month
and a half so it really got a lot of exposure.
We loved out there. There's a partner where you go

(01:04:01):
to a viewing party at some bar to watch the
premier of All Stars three yes, the talentship portion, and
then it cuts to you seeing moving parts. Um, and
then I can't tell. I can't because I was expecting
like some reaction from you after the fact, But it
looks it seemed like were you uncomfortable because was that

(01:04:22):
like was that was that what you're speaking to right now?
Where you're just like, I'm noticing that the audience is
um a little confused or disengaged by the idea of
seeing a drag queen like with an auto harp playing
this song. Yeah, I guess I'm always aware that I'm
probably the only one doing that thing. So like, even
with this tour grown up, We're here, I'm traveling with
the band, and I'm like, well, I'm probably the only

(01:04:42):
person who's ever only drag Queen has done this on
a scale, so it's always a little bit of a risk.
But I guess with moving parts on All Stars, I
knew I wouldn't win with that talent, but I also
knew this is probably the only time I'll get to
do something like this on TV and I'm playing thirty
eight strings. I'll never get eliminated for this, Like a
out show, you won't get eliminated. And I guess it

(01:05:03):
was a little vulnerable, like I don't know. It was
a slow rollout to introduce people who know me from
and comedy. It was a weird time to roll out
that there's also music and try to get those people
to do to listen to both. And it's been really nice.
I mean, on my shows, it's weird because some people
are just there because they like drag Race. Some people
are there because they've only seen on and they don't
even watch. Some people are only there because they only

(01:05:25):
know my records. So whatever reason they calm, I try
to put something in for that, you know, because like
grown Up has like fifteen costumes, five wigs, so if
you're there for looks, there's looks, you know. Um. But
it was always vulnerable. But I like playing my heart
when I can. I love playing my guitar too. I
just never thought, you know, I grew up playing guitar
because I wanted to play music. I never would have

(01:05:47):
thought it would ever be playing it and drag like,
of course not, you know, it's just it's so it's
great to see like you doing what you truly love,
because I think that this is just something I gauge.
And you said to talk about this a little bit
in the documentary too, which is you love drag Race,

(01:06:08):
and like, I'm sure that you um like appreciate the
experience of having been on it and everything it's afforded you,
but it seems like you don't love being a contestant
on the show, you know what I mean, Because it's
like it's it's I always feel like drag Race can
make it seem to someone that's watching it like, oh,
this is measuring how someone is as a drag queen,

(01:06:28):
and the best drag queen will win the show, when
that's really not true. Like being good at drag race
is a skill in and of itself, and to be
someone that walks into drag Race and kills drag Race
and wins means in no way that like you are
the quote unquote best drag queen. These are all incredible queens.
So does that kind of come into your mind when
you're on the show, watching yourself on the show, and

(01:06:50):
watching people watch the show, well, I'm not a very
good competitor, and competition brings out the best in a
lot of people. I wouldn't say it necessarily brings out
the best in me. And then I think I'm really
good at dragging the real world, like the business side
of it and and the uniqueness of it, like the
marketing of it. Um. I love selling ship, I love

(01:07:10):
writing ship, and so I guess for me, competing on
drag race has never been like where I do the best.
I mean, I one, of course, I'm proud of it,
especially at All Stars. I'm like, I'm I stand by
every runway and every performance. Um, I did a wonderful job,
but like I would never want to do it again.
I'm I'm just not. Have you guys ever been on
a reality style competition thing? It's really I was one

(01:07:32):
who wants to be a million I wish doesn't really count.
And I hope I've hosted a I host this reality
competition show obviously too. I kind of see you haven't
competed as a dog yet. No, I haven't competed as
a dog, but watch this space. Um No, but it's
kind of interesting to like see how the sausage gets
made and these are these really are people, thank you. Um,

(01:07:54):
but it really is interesting because like they really are
real people. And then when the judging happens, it's really
lee what it is like. There's no like producing that
goes into like the judging of it all. And that's
why I'm always like, oh, this is so interesting because
as the host, I kind of was walking to the back,
and I assume producers would come back and be like, Okay,
so for the narrative, this person needs to win and

(01:08:14):
that you have to be really hard on this person
and the judging and that would be kind of guided
that way. But at least on our show, that wasn't
the way it was, and I would imagine that's actually
not the way it is on drag Race because um,
sometimes the critiques are so like what that it has
to be their real critique, you know what I mean? Yeah,
And and the critiques in real life are they take
hours for six for the for the three top and

(01:08:36):
three bottom to it takes hours and you see ten
minutes of it maybe, and it's so nuanced because everything's
also taste. Michelle could love it, Ross could hate it,
two different opinions. And I love judges I love everyone.
It's four people behind the table. They're not smarting near
better than me, And I'm such an asshole. Even on
Drag Race in front of Rue Paul, who's flawless. I'm like,

(01:08:58):
I mean, you're pretty, but mama, yeah, hello, yeah, And
you can't really tell me anything. And I think that's
why you've been on. Even in season seven and I
went home fourth. I remember sitting in the van being like, Okay,
well they just told me I wasn't a next drag Superstar,
but they don't really have control over that idea. Like

(01:09:20):
I was talking to Violet about this recently and Violet
was like, it's crazy to see everything you've done and bought.
It's such a wonderful person. But she goes, it's crazy
because I didn't see it for you at all. Like, thanks, Violet,
thank you so much. But it gets to me you
can't let those experiences really define you because those reality
shows are so hard to win. Drag Race is so

(01:09:44):
hard to win, especially the all stars format, because it's
like a rude Goldberg machine. Don't do too good, but
don't do too bad. You kind of have to do
what I did and like not eliminate anyone and not
ever be in the bottom, like that's how to win that.
I have not been on a reality competition show myself, either,

(01:10:04):
but I to like draw a really like jan Kee
parallel analog whatever. Like hearing you talk about drag Race
just kind of reminds me of SNL and this in
the way that it's like people who even audition for
ESNL and who don't get it are like, are incredible,

(01:10:25):
and meanwhile I'm over here being like it's it's and
it's like what you're saying, It's like, I am a
fine comedian, fine comedian, fine writer. I happen to be
decently good at us Like on SNL, I'm my skill
is being on that show, and it just so happens
to be that outside of the show, I'm like doing
all these different things where I'm like humbled every fucking

(01:10:47):
moment where I'm like I go onto the set of
this like TV show and I'm like, oh, I don't
know what the hell I'm doing. It's like, you know,
I think it's so valuable for anyone to have like
multiple environments where they are being challenged in different ways
so that they can be like, oh wait, I'm not
deriving all my value and that is so true. It's
like I know that. I mean, I'm just gonna acknowledge it.

(01:11:09):
I know that I get a lot of opportunities other
drag queens do not get and we'll never get. I know.
I'm lucky enough to be the first drag queen to
do so many things, and it's like a lot of
that is not drag race related. So like I'm lucky
to be at a place where people love me from
drag race, but they really like me because of the
music or the YouTube or whatever. So now it's nice
because my worth doesn't hinge on what I did on

(01:11:31):
a TV show years ago exactly. And isn't it nice
that you do these live shows and you look in
the crowd and you tricks he don't necessarily know what
they're here, like how they know you? You know. It's
like if I don't even mention drag race and shows,
because I feel like you already saw that, like you
came from more, you know. And I don't claim to
be the best singer, the best dancer, the prettiest that anything,

(01:11:53):
but I just try to do things that like, well,
this is what I do, and I know other people
can't do it, So I'm going to do that more. Yeah,
you know, like when Bowen said, like when you see
you during your thing, there's obviously so much joy in it.
I always like a true hack for anyone that wants
to do anything is if you are having fun and
you love what you do truly, everyone else will have

(01:12:14):
fun and probably like what you do. Like it's really
it's just you just have to. It's truly a trick.
But once I think I read it in Amy Poehler's book, Um,
it was just like she said something like that's the trick.
If you are having fun, other people will have fun.
It does not have to be perfect, it does not
have to be the best and keep you yes. And

(01:12:35):
people out there that are like determined to critique because
that's who they are and what they are in the
way that they go about life is to um, be
very critical and that's how they file things in their brain.
That's fine. That is not most people, and that it
is probably not the people that are coming to see you.
I will say to you like, um, I mean, we
could talk about this forever, but you owe it when

(01:12:57):
it comes to listening to the voices, you owe it.
The people who love what you do to not pay
attention to the people who don't love what you do.
That is huge. That's a very only job. Because I've
talked like I know, I represent like mediocrity to a
lot of people. There are a lot of people who
are like that sense of humor does nothing for me,

(01:13:20):
or that music does nothing for me. But that has
nothing to do with drug. Queens are so confident because,
like I mean, as tricksy, it's like, you can't tell
me anything. You can't tell me anything you got. I
could be bombing, it could be like Mama, that was
a serve, you know, but with drag. Of course we
watch for the beads and the sequence in the wigs,

(01:13:41):
but we're really watching because it's inspiring to watch someone
believe it and I believe it. You know what I mean,
Before you sell it, you gotta buy it yourself. Okay.
I'd rather be delusional than depressed. Completely completely, I'd rather
be delusional than depressed. Put it on my gravestone. Quantity.
It's like it's like uh circuit gaze with clock fans

(01:14:03):
and I'm walking on the stage with an Appalachian harp,
like Mama, this is about to be it. I'm about
to shut it down, but the secret live. But I
also knew when I started playing guitar and drag or
stuff like that, I knew I had to commit a
hundred million for it to sell because you can't go
out there, gunshine what you're doing. That's what good can

(01:14:23):
me all the I mean, I was just thinking about
this too. It's like comedians, like you're really being paid
for bravery, and the best comedians are fucking fearless. You
go to watch someone be fearless, which is why it's
so uncomfortable, and someone's trying to stand up and they're scared.
I know every time I've had a bad show, I'm
like that that audience I wake up the next day.

(01:14:45):
I was later like it was me. Yeah, I went
into that. You know what I can always tell like
like it's it's it's because now we've been doing it
for so long, and I feel like I've been doing
it for so long that there was a period in
like I can, like towards the last couple of years
of living in New York, like and when I first
came to l A where I feel like I could
walk out onto a stage and not even think about

(01:15:07):
it and just go and have a good time or whatever.
But sometimes, like every every so often, they'll be a
period where I'm about to get on stage, and in
the minute before or in the thirty seconds before, I'll
start to have this let's just forgive me, but the
inner saboteur will come in and I'll just be like, oh, no,
like is this gonna happen there right now? And I

(01:15:28):
that's a fight or flight moment. It's like I can
listen to this voice for even one second more about
someone that's in the audience, are people that aren't there
or whatever, or like maybe I for a second was
running my ship and I I stumbled over it even
in my head. Whatever it is in that moment, but
it's truly defining. I feel like that minute before you
get on stage where it's like, oh, what do I

(01:15:48):
do with this? Because it will dictate how the next
ten minutes goes, or the next thirty minutes goes, or
the next hour and a half goes, depending on what
show you're doing. And so it's so it but I
so can distill it to myself. You know what it is? True?
It is, it always is, and that's why at the
end of the day you can blame whoever. But usually
in the clear light of day, you're like, I let

(01:16:11):
that audience down, I let the no laugh dictate that
what the show is going to be like in the
first two minutes, I flumble, flummed, like flubbed and never recovered.
It's really always you. And that's where you realize like, oh, well,
if it's me, I trust myself, so I'm gonna be fine.
It kind of goes both ways. I don't know. I
feel like we're talking about decades ago when we used
to be live performers. I think it will stand up

(01:16:33):
all the time, And I'm like, am I do my
credits transfer? Am I gonna have to go like relearn?
I don't remember my show. I don't remember my five
minutes at my fifteen minutes, said, I don't remember any
of them. I think nobody's credits are transferring once, right?
Are we gonna all have to like go learn stand
up again? I think so, because I'm even watching these brave,
brave people who it's in the summer at least would

(01:16:55):
do outdoor park shows like standa friends in New York
would do out of park shows it's like god less,
I can never do that, like God bless you. And
then some some people even like like I think Comedy
Central even recorded some mount or sets and they're now
posting them on Instagram of like comedians we love and
who are proven quantities, known quantities as far as like
their comedy, their voice, who are like playing to these

(01:17:16):
rooms quote unquote that are like patios and where the
audience members are like like nervous to laugh and you
see it kind of funk with them and like wait
a minute, we are all we are all like for
better for worse, like kind of flattened to the same,
all being like it's like a new like a new computer,
new phone. A little bit we all got that, like

(01:17:38):
it's weird. We're all gonna have to rely on instincts
and bravery because we don't remember the material. We haven't
had life experience for a year to make the material.
Like we can't we can't go into the world and
talk about COVID. We can't know. No, it won't what
we won't. Here's the thing. It's gonna be great because
remember as much as the performers are going to be
in their head and have to find it. These audiences

(01:17:59):
that come back are going to be so happy to
watch something like that, and the audiences are are going
to have the back of the performers, and the performers
are going to be ready to go. I really feel
confident that just the energy of the live audiences when
they come back, because I've been thinking about this a lot,
and I just thought, like, not only am I missing performing,
I'm also missing going out and seeing things like yes,

(01:18:22):
of course I miss like little social things Like I
was thinking this morning, like I want to go on
a date, you know what I mean, Like I want
to dress up, like go to a restaurant and like
decide there if I want to suck the guy, you
know what I mean? Like I I don't. I don't
know how to date and do go about even little
social things now because you have to have like someone
over your house, you go there or whatever. And with performing,
it's the same thing. I'm getting so used to quote

(01:18:43):
unquote a show being I go on like a Zoom
show that Joe Kimbooster is hosting, and we shoot the
ship for six minutes about whatever. That's not material, you
know what I mean. That's not like a rehearse comedy bit.
But then I thought more about it, and I was like,
you know what, what I miss most of all is
just going out and being a art of something that's
that's live and electric, and listening to live music and

(01:19:05):
watching live comedy. And I'm gonna be so happy to
be there when it's all done that I'm actually less
concerned about performing when I go back because i can
feel myself in the audience and I'm ready to give
you know what I mean, like because I miss that.
I miss it so desperately. It's it's I think I
can speak for all three of us when I say
it's a life force. Yeah, and staying busy the way
you guys have, or like if we're being vulnerable, this

(01:19:28):
has been probably one of the most I know, we're
not supposed to say it, but like, besides, touring is
probably one of the most financially viable years. I've been
home the most to make the most content. I mean
Netflix and my YouTube channel and the pot I've content
every day of the week, and so like, in that sense,
it's been enriching and it's gonna be people like you
and me. If you don't use it, you lose it

(01:19:48):
and those limbs will atrophy and fall off. So some
of these drag fans and comedians who are sitting home,
they are going to come back and not have it.
They are because they haven't been stretching. Like you also,
can't you run and then go back to marathon running
and just expect your body to work. You know, you're
leg going to fall off. Girl. You hate to break

(01:20:10):
it to you. Your legs are going to be falling off.
And it's nice for you guys. Between the pod and
S and L and all this stuff, you can at
least stretch those muscles in a way that's like maybe
insulated but still using them, still keeping You know, for sure,
if SNL wasn't happening, bone would be dead. I can agree.
I can co sign because and every Saturday it's the

(01:20:31):
dress rehearsal audience. It's the dress rehearsal audience that comes in,
and I'm just like, oh my god, like we're like
one of the only places open and existing that they
can go see that, yeah, that they can go, Like,
I I am so fucking lucky to do this. And
then but I was gonna say, like there are some
comedians who like just will have the gift no matter

(01:20:52):
what I mean. Maybe this is an a fair example
because she she works at SNL. But I was watching
like a Zoom stand up show, like back in like April.
Roll no, no, not back in April, back in um
like July UM. And it was anadres and and she
was on this Zoom show and she's just like reading
jokes that she's written, and she was just kind of
reading one. She was with her dog in her living room,
but she's just reading these jokes and she's just like,
I'm okay, here's something. Um. I was going through old

(01:21:15):
journal entries the other day, but I'm trying to read
less books written by white authors, and I was like, oh,
you stupid. She was texting me before because she's finally
watching for the first time ever. She watched the movie
Second Act with JL, and we were like a live
texting because she knows that I'm me and of course
I'm in I'm gonna be an authority on Second Act
by JL. But which is I'm saying it like it's

(01:21:36):
a book that Jlo wrote, It was a film she
was in. But she's the best. Um. Listen. We could
literally keep talking for hours on and but we I
think we should move on to I don't think so honey,
because I know, I know this is gonna be a
lie because chatter boxes as I've never when they're long.
As a listener, I listened to the whole thing so well,
I'm already like thinking, you need to come back often

(01:21:58):
because we are any of the time of our lives,
and this has been a blo I know anybody who's
a listener of this show dreams to be on this show. Anybody,
even performers like they all want to do it. This
is I guess the time bone where we do? I

(01:22:20):
don't think, so, honey, would you say, so what is?
What is? I don't think so honey. I'm so happy
you asked, and I'll tell you now that you did.
I don't think, so honey. Is a sixty second segment? Oh,
I know what it is. And so in the sixty
seconds we rant, which is like a sort of like
an accelerated, elevated way of speaking about a topic in

(01:22:41):
pop culture, which is um popular culture culture that a
lot of people enjoy and can experience and can consume.
Really it's about consumption at the end of the day,
and we can get into whether or not that's healthy
or not, how good that is, but that it's about consumption,
the capitalists, you know, sort of regime that we live under.
We could talk about it, not now but later, um
and in that say, seconds, we talked about something in

(01:23:02):
pop culture, rants against it, and it's because we don't
like it, that's why rant. Otherwise it will be rave,
which is the opposite of front um. So this being
I don't think so, honey, usually sort of volleyed around one, two, three,
and I usually go first, and I am prepared to
do that because I have a thing, okay, interesting, Well,
then I have the timer ready to go. This is Rodgers.

(01:23:25):
I don't think so, honey. His time starts now. I
don't think so, honey. Quote twists end quote on the
national anthem. Okay, so today is the inauguration and Lady
Gaga is harm in the national anthem. We've probably already
seen her do it, because I'm imagining this happens in
the morning, but she has announced prior to singing it
that she's doing it with a quote unquote twist. I

(01:23:45):
don't think so, honey. I don't think this is a
song that needs a twist. It's not like Willow by
Taylor Swift that needs like a speaky like cold Soup
Goblin Ghost remix of them. This song does not need
a twist. This song was written by MS for Into
Scott Key Honey, and the key is the key. It
should be sang in key. We need to be singing
this song in the correct way. The only way I

(01:24:08):
will say you can make a twist on it is
if you sing it like when Houston extra good. Other
than that, the last time we saw the National Anthem
song with a twist, it was Fergie and while it
was gay culture, it was bad. And I don't know
if it's better to have that version of I don't
of the National Anthem or not. I'm gonna say probably yes,
but that should be the last twist on the anthem.
They're done now, Lady Gaga, no sing it normal. I

(01:24:30):
don't think so. Honey, whoa girl energy? You should storm
the capitol, says that baby. Can I just say from
someone who was there, did I see you climbing in
the window? It was not. It was not as bad
on the ground as it was on TV. I saw
somebody climbing in the window and cheating. I was like
I sort of like did my over the shoulder gas,

(01:24:50):
like I was actually pretending to be like, um, there
was a lot of promising young women that were storming
the capital, and I was when you and you were
the one who put a pink wig on the flagpole
because you were representing the barbs. Yes, I was actually
so it was people are getting confused. It wasn't just
like the proud boys that were storming. It was the
proud Boys and the bars and I was sort of
the leader of the Yeah, and I was. And I

(01:25:14):
was also chancing hey, Mike Pens, but it was more
like this, hang Mike pain. Um. But anyway, Yeah, the
lady gu guys apparently doing a twist on the national anthem.
Can't wait to find out what that is. I hope
it's something simple. I hope it's like a nail reveal
or something like low productions, just like nail are a twist. Yeah,

(01:25:37):
I hope it's nothing. I hope she like parts her hair.
I'm also so scared for her to be there, like,
I don't want anyone there. Here's a twist on the
national anthem. Don't sing it? You know you wanted a twist. Um,
but but I just feel like we don't. It's going
to she's gonna and then seeing it from the floor,

(01:25:58):
she's even gonna get a yeah, yeah. I want the
twist to be the Lady Gaga things that from her
home from a secure location, Okay, because I don't need
her and the sucking inauguration. I don't need Kamala Harris
at the inauguration. I don't need Joe Biden at the inauguration.
Why we're not doing like a remote zoom thing is
unbelievable to me. It's not like we're not going to

(01:26:19):
be intimidated by terrorists like you should be. I'm that
home intimidated by terrorists. They're out here promising to come.
And I honestly hope that this comes out. This this
episode will come out on Inauguration Day, which yes, I
can confirm. My building emailed me a week ago, said
on January twenty, we're gonna be testing the alarm systems.
It will be sudden and loud. I was like, Hi,

(01:26:39):
can we move this to any other day? Do you
think that, like we could just take one alarming factor
away from this day test the alarm system Like I'm
gonna be watching the inauguration and panicking because it's the
alarm is just screaming at me, like why that day regardless,
I digress. I just can't believe we're having it. Changed
the alarmed like rain on me or something, you know,
like the dound check, but changed the material. Yeah for sure.

(01:27:02):
I'm just like, I just don't know why we have
to do it on that day. But they didn't get
back to my email. Um, but anyway, I just I
don't I'm kind of dumbfounded that we're having the inauguration.
I hope that this comes out on the day of
the inauguration and it's a non factor because it went
well and safely, but it's it's it's jarring to me.
And the last thing I needed to hear was that
Gaga is gonna be there, because of course we need
also do the twist without saying there's a twist. It's

(01:27:23):
like when people wear revealed, that's obvious. We know there's
something under there. When you walk the runway looking like Voldemort,
I know that you're taking that off. Of course. That
is the great myth about the reveal is like that
the reveals are going to be good because it's a
real you want to reveal. You want to know why
Sasha Vlors reveal worked so well because it was an
incredible lip sync and because it went with the performance,

(01:27:45):
and because you didn't see it coming. Yes, give me
something I have no ideas coming. Yeah, but then you
could even have said that you could. I mean it
all like heightened to that point though, that's it was
part of the narrative, yes, yeah, or like Catia doing
the Bang reveal, never saw it coming. It's weird, but
like when you walk out there in a hefty bag

(01:28:07):
like this and like, I wonder if that's coming off,
like anyway, twists on the national anthem, I don't think so, honey. Um,
I was gonna say that Goga's posting of the twist
of telegraphing the twist is saying like working on something fun,
can't wait to announce. Oh, it's like Demi Vato being

(01:28:27):
like our nation is in such disgrace, I'm going to
the studio, yeah, I or like influencers when they're like
secret project and it's them in a picture they took
six months ago. It's not even related anyway. The girls
are trying their best and speaking of trying their best,
and I'm going to say ultimately probably really slang and succeeding.

(01:28:49):
This is who is? Who is? I just think one
of the I think bon Yang is one of the
most important people in the culture. And I think that
and I stand and I recently was in reviewed and
I say, I was asked about Owen Yang and I
cried no from who I frequently shed shed tears about you.
Come on, was it a ch angela to cry? Did

(01:29:10):
you like cheat out to the camera and like, did
you like make a moment? Sorry, I'm getting emotional. Yes,
love that love it, which is my way of starting
dropping in what in the moment of moving parts were
in Catia caused Trixie like one of the best comedicy
writers like ever. I'm just like, I was like, that's
that's that's I'm catty in that moment to you and
Matt's Trixie where I'm always like gassing my sister up

(01:29:31):
and I'm like, you're I'm like, you're incredible anyway, Well,
I love you right back. Girl. Done it again constantly.
We love to do that monologue, but with negatives like hey, flop,
you have again ing the bar for all of us
constantly raising the bar for the circus, the circus and

(01:29:53):
doing it foolish and you wait, is that Wait? Is
is it hay clown? Hay clown clown? Okay, you have
done it again, constantly raising the bar for the circus.
I'd say, I'm surprised, but I know who you are,

(01:30:14):
personal cat, and I get stuck in these rattles where
we see the same thing over and over again, and
right now it's Hey over and over again. Yeah, we
just talked about this on the last weeks episode. We've
been saying flop for weeks. Yeah, flop. We are obsessed
with flop. For a while, we were stuck in like
we would be in a room together silently, ten minutes
to go by, and she'd be like, Stacy, did Frederica
ever mentioned a Jame gum or a Jamie gum, which

(01:30:37):
is from Silence of the Lamps. Yes, that's me and
bowing with them for months we were doing I'm gonna
have to pass on that one, which is the front
Gun interview about like rather singers, good writer, good performer,
young producer, young producer and Sissy's baby. You just get
stuck in these like story loops. Yeah, so David David.

(01:31:00):
It was watching Um Housewives and one of the trailers
ended with someone going, I wouldn't be surprised if we
never saw an East Richards again, And I was stuck
saying that for weeks weeks, I'll be taking the trash show,
like I wouldn't be surprised if we never sawed East
Richards again. Also another one is Bowen and I love um.
On Real Housewives, they said, um, beast, I'm done talking

(01:31:23):
to you, you beast, beast, and then she it's pure evil,
pure evil, pure evil. I'm telling you, Trixie, you would
love Housewives because you love you love the existence of
the woman, the desperate woman just micro performances within like

(01:31:45):
within two words like that's just you love the observation
of the woman who was a laugh away from a tear,
and that is every single woman who was ever on
Real Housewives, and that's why we need to watch it.
We get stuck saying, m pretty much. I would let
Gema know that Gemma is a fat hunt. We get
that is a good one. UM in which anything New

(01:32:05):
York says, look at the material is pretty up there
to look at the material. Oh my god, New York Yeah,
you're a dreamer. Dream at your sleep, don't you sell good?
You know what we got? We got stuck on? Um, hey,
break a leg? What did you say said? Break a leg?
I'm not gonna I'm gonna get the part. That's what

(01:32:27):
I'm gonna do. Yes, Okay, Oh, I know those one
liners from shows I've never seen. I'm not gonna break
it like, I'm gonna get the part. That's what I'm
gonna do. I'm gonna get the part. Assen on pause,
but I'm play. Yes, So the one that really doesn't
get the first fucking night. Yes. Also, Hoops is this

(01:32:52):
Hoops is a whore, Her mom's, her grandma's. The biggest
horror I've ever seen in my entire life. There will
never be anyone like New York on reality TV in
that same context. Oh my god, she invented it. I
submit Monique as host of Charm School. Um, the who
jumped out and then it jumped you exhibited hore like behavior.

(01:33:16):
The whore jumped out and then it jump back in.
But it jumped out. And when you when you do clownary,
the clown comes back to. Yes, it's it's important material.
She won an Academy Award deserved it. Also, I've only said,
like David was watching Housewives and I got stuck saying,

(01:33:37):
m uh, is it about Tom? It's about Tom? Does that?
I don't even know the show? So then things will
get stuck and like, why is that clinging to my brain?
It has that effect on you. Lisa Arena is the
gift that keeps on giving. But she has been for decades,
but she recently had a line on Housewives, which was
at a reunion. She goes, you liked the tweet, and

(01:33:57):
in liking the tweet, it says everything. Every It says
everything everything, or at least I had that one really good.
At least he goes, Oh, you're angry. You're so angry.
You are so crazy, so crazy, you get it? Who
told you that? Who told you that angry? It's so

(01:34:28):
kind ofcending, like, oh, you're angry. Both of them, both
of them knew it was the last scene they would
have on the show together, and they're both soap actresses
that were beat to hell sitting on that couch looking
at each other half cross legged, knowing it was both
their last scenes of the of the season, and they

(01:34:50):
were serving it. I don't know. You gotta get into it.
Um listen, this is Bowen Yang's. I don't think so, honey.
He claims to have a topic and gonna see Bowen.
Yeah you're I don't think so, honey. Time starts now.
I don't think so, honey. The relationship between gum health
and preventing dementia? Did you guys know about this? Cola

(01:35:11):
Scola told me? Or was it Joe Firestone? Someone told
me that you have to floss within twelve hours every
single day, or once you get older, you're going to
not remember anything that you form dementia plaques. I don't
know if this is real. I haven't actually verified the science,
but I believe it when I hear my friends tell
me you have to flostery el soo, you're gonna get Alzheimer's.

(01:35:32):
I have a family history. I don't think so many
this relationship because I don't want I feel like I'm
being sort of conned in a way into flossing and
into maintaining my dental health. But no, I will do
anything in my power to prevent Alzheimer's from hitting me.
I'm not gonna Bells Gray. I'm not gonna become my grandmother.
I'm so sorry to say. It's tragic and cheap and

(01:35:54):
cheap passed. So um, I don't think so many. This
new relationship that I have to sort of, this new
element of upkeep that I have to incorporate into my life,
I don't think so honey, this um potentially bogus relationship
medically that I have to now abide. That's one minute.
I'm interested to hear about this as someone with several
grandparents who passed away of better. Yeah, apparently, but honestly,

(01:36:19):
keep it in the teeth, like, just keep the string
in the teeth full time, because gums they bleed, girl,
And that's the thing. But once you get into it,
once you get into a habit of flossing, they stopped leading.
They don't bleed you. Alright, Well, I guess I gotta
break it in. Alzheimer's isn't funny? However, is something funny
about forgetting really essential ship in your life? I know

(01:36:41):
this's awful, but in the movie Still Alice, when she
couldn't find the bathroom in her own home and pistol pants,
I was laughing so hard. I know that that's awful,
but like I cried a lot in that movie. But
peeing your pants in your own house because you can't
find your own bathroom is it is funny? Well, the
reason you left is because if you're gonna feel cry
and when you're gonna do that's the thing. Is like,

(01:37:03):
I'm I'm already a dripping wet pisces if I'm trying.
If I want to find the humor in something that's
that's sad, let me because I guarantee you trust me.
I feel very sad about it on the inside. And
that's almost why I'm laughing, because if you don't laugh,
you'll cry, And that's where that comes from. But that
being sun to the bathroom with my pants and I
don't have Alzheimer's, so like yeah, and so what excuse

(01:37:25):
do you have? I drink whiskey, not a one, because
sometimes I have fireball whiskey with pizza. You might as
well be still Alice after that girl, Come on diet
literally wait wait, bow and I wanted to tell you
I've been making my own food at home and I
don't think cooking my meat right and I feel like
I'm shipping like Bow and Yang. It's horrible. Excuse me,

(01:37:46):
how are you you're on the record that your ships
are bad. But how are you cooking your meat? Girl?
I'll cook it and then I'll just like cast iron
skill it or something. Do you think I don't have
a cat? Are you? Leg Hottie with the chicken in
the microwave? That's also iconic. The editing on that show

(01:38:06):
is showed so shady. Every time Hottie blinks and they
do the bike ring wing ring wing, like shaping another one.
Beyonce bit you look like Luther vand Van Dross bit
you like Luther Van Dross. Yeah, I might be a
bitch to at least it don't go around to everyone's Yeah,
so good, Hotti Hotti mental institution by a straight jacket

(01:38:31):
that said that it's Goldie. It's gold Goldie's gold. Yes,
mental institution busing a straight jacket. So that show is incredible,
Oh my god, so good. And then um, who's the
one a pumpkin who spits in her face? It's like
a pumpkin. Do I hate her? No? Does she still
need a facelift? Yes? Like she invented reality television? She did. Also, wait,

(01:39:01):
I just want to throw I just want to say
before we move on to trickxies. I don't think so, honey.
One of the most iconic from Real Housewives of Atlanta
is who gon check me Boo? Who go check me boo?
You need to get checked? Who don't check me boo?
And then the neck role that went into it. I'm
just like say was she made some mistakes and got
got kicked off the franchise, but she was forever Okay,

(01:39:22):
So huge moment in So far Out. It's Trixie Mattels.
I don't think so honey. Times do you have something prepared?
By the way, I do these alone in my house
all the time, and I say, I don't think so honey.
While it happens, we love that, Okay, okay, and this
is tricky, I don't think so honey. Her time starts now. Okay,
this is a little bit tired. But I follow a
lot of doll collecting websites and sometimes I'll go ton

(01:39:45):
they'll be selling dolls, and every time they post dolls
on Facebook, they put trigger warning because some people are
afraid of dolls. If we've arrived at a place where
you can't scroll past some naked Barbie dolls being sold
in a lot, you maybe shouldn't have a computer be
on the internet. With that, and with that, the way
that Barbie has become a scapegoat for people's issues and

(01:40:07):
people's problems. Let me tell you, Before Barbie, women were
only allowed to play with barbe baby dolls, women were
allowed to mention the moms. And then Barbie came along,
and you could imagine to be single, have a house,
a car, have jobs, be beautiful. And the only reason
Barbie gets scapegoated as like the landing point people's in
securities is because America makes women hate their bodies. Barbie

(01:40:27):
is a toy that's so popular, everyone has one, and
so just because there's a been diagram doesn't mean that
Barbie's at the fault of all of that. Barbie changed
the lives for women forever, forever and what and there
we go. And that's one minute. I any un any
anti Barbie culture I'm hesitant about because I feel that
it wasn't her fault and putting the blame on her

(01:40:49):
is anti feminist things. It's very first thought. It's very
first thought. And that was like a Malcolm Gladwell essay trick,
state like you synthesizing those two things, well, thank you.
I feel very strongly about I've read my free time,
I read a lot of nonfiction books about Barbie, and
I couldn't be more passionate about it. Barbie is she's
a scientist, she's a lifeguard, she's a teacher. She's a model,

(01:41:11):
she's stunning, she's a legend, she's an icon, she has
a point, she is the moment. She's a woman who
gets it. She's a woman, she's she's bisexual, she's a friend.
I'm crying. She's a mother, she's a driver, she's a
police officer. Until she came along, and they were basically,

(01:41:31):
you can pretend to be a mom and that's it, right, Yeah,
And then the reason she got to popular is because
people are like a dog with boobs, I can't have that.
But the greater fear than that is raising a daughter
who wasn't attractive. So parents were like, well, maybe if
I buy this, my daughter will have a meal ticket
because she'll have a husband. So it's a very dark past.
But the heavy lifting that Barbie did for the development

(01:41:53):
of like equality and women and the way that can,
at least in the last ten years, she gets everything
loaded on top of her is crazy. It's crazy. I mean,
like people lose their minds even at like the like
the differently figured the more realistically figured or or proportional
Barbie like the dolls. Like everyone had a conniption, And
I was like, but is it really do we do

(01:42:14):
we actually care that much? Or do we hate that
idea so much that like we are going to shoot
on this on Twitter for like a whole day. I yeah,
how many g i jo's do see with beer bellies? Bitch?
Not right? Yeah? Yeah exactly, but one and I were
talking because Ben de la Cram, who we fucking love
is like featured prominently in in your documentary as well.
We were talking like him eliminating himself on All Stars

(01:42:38):
was the most was the most iconic thing he ever
could have done, and the most dragged thing he ever
could have done. Like I'm flipping around this lipstick it's
my own name in this shitty white out, and I'm
leaving and gonna pretend like it's an emotional moment and
stomp out of here after like killing it in the
way that this competition exists. Right now, I have checked
ten on every box and now I'm gonna see myself

(01:43:01):
out and even the way Ru reacted. I knew that
Rule loved it, Like I've I felt like Rue must
have loved it, or at least I hope that Rule
loved it. But the thing is like I felt like
that was drag on top of drag, which made it
so iconic and amazing to me. Yeah, I mean, what's
more punk rock than exiting a drag competition on your

(01:43:24):
own terms? It's it was hunger games like the berries,
like I'm gonna kill myself like it was that. Yeah,
it was that you and you even made you even
made the observation in the documentary or like after that happened,
you were like me, Ben wants us to be the Olympics.
But it's like it's a it's a TV shows Like
Ben didn't want to wear a crown that represented also

(01:43:46):
reality TV, and it's like, you really should leave then
if you don't want to carry that title, if you
don't think it's ethical, you'll be happy, you know. By
the way, by the way, everybody's like, no man, no bitch.
I was like, but because because I'd love to wear
the crowd, me and Angela were like finally, it's like
we were thrilled. Angel were like everything, I think I'm

(01:44:09):
gonna like it. Yes, Like like Kennedy ran backstage like
she was not the father. She angela like what like this?
And I was not the father. I was just thrilled.
I was like, right, right, right, it was nice. I definitely,
I mean I unofficially owe her about a hundred thousand dollars.

(01:44:29):
So thank you, Ben to the There's a moment in
the documentary I think I keep talking about the docs. Sorry,
but when it's it's the premiere. It's the premiere party
for All Stars three, and then you and Ben and
Kenny your back stage um, and you're talking about Katya um.
And then Ben's like, yeah, I mean like sometimes I
get I get asked questions or like people were asking

(01:44:49):
you about conton You're like, I don't know how to answer.
Then Ben was like, yeah, I get asked questions too.
And then you cut her off. You're like, why do
you dress like this? And then immediately Ben picks up
and it's like yeah right, and it's a mental issue,
and like you guys have such a genuine line. I'm
like so funny and like I feel so like fly
on the wall for like watching this interaction, even happened.
I was just like, this is great. I wish for

(01:45:10):
both of you to someday. I'm sure you've done it
if you can, somebody be in a drag dressing room.
That is where the show is. It is people who
respect each other being fucking mean to each other is
so funny. I guess that's That's one more thing I
want to ask, is like, so yes, like the way
that the fans get heated about it at the show
and the results of the show, etcetera. It's it's very

(01:45:32):
high stakes. I wonder like amongst the cast when when
the results are kind of happening, like you know, the
Morgan McMichaels of it all, and like you know, like
the the eliminations are tough from the very beginning. Is
it actually dramatic and thick between you guys or are
you guys kind of like performing mixture of both? Uh? Well,
you have to. It's a little bit Stockholm syndrome because

(01:45:54):
it is real, especially on all stars level, because we
all want this, we're all stars, were all professionals. But
is Stockholm syndrome because when you've been there a week
with no phone and no outside contact, you this is
your bubble and this is the real world. It feels
real reality TV. When you're doing well, it does feel real.
So certain things feel more emotional. When somebody's eliminated, it

(01:46:14):
does feel like they're dying. It does. It feels like
you're never going to see them again. You know, it's
not true. Especially. What makes me laugh though, is when
drag Races like two episodes in and everyone's been there
two days and like, we've been here the whole competition.
I'm like, you've been three days. Like chel love her
to death. We're like three days into drag Race and

(01:46:34):
she's like, I miss my cat. I'm like cheating like
four days. She was just like I'm exhausted. I love her. Yeah,
she was a true, true true. Let's dedicate this episode
to the incomparable cheat debate. If you stay ready, you
ain't got to get ready the most like, so good,

(01:46:57):
very good, Well, I love you. Guys. May go down
to history as our longest episode, and I probably could
have done it for two more hours. They could please
come back literally open invitation whenever you want, like this
is truly truly fine. Well, thank you, I really appreciate it,
and um, I know you guys, have a lot of
similar listeners. But if anybody wants to hear bald in
the Beautiful, we love making it our covid Ore covid Special,

(01:47:19):
part of Artist Special comes out this week, so get
into it. Check it out, check it out, into Yes
and by makeup, Come by makeup stream Barbara read the book,
do all that. But um, I just love you guys.
This has been such an honor. We love you back,
and we got to say, oh my lord and um listen,
the way we sort of wrap up every episode is

(01:47:41):
famously with the song before we sing it, I want
to ask you a question. Did you want you did
watch Promising Young Woman? Did? So? Next week we're going
to talk about Promising Young Woman. But there's a scene
in it where bo Burnham knows all the words to
Paris Hilton Stars are Blind? And I just want to
ask a question before we leave. Do you think straight
men know the words to Paris Hilton Stars are Blind?
I don't even think a lot of game that know it. No,

(01:48:02):
and don't make this another plot. No, but and this
is gonna this is gonna draftly carry into our conversation
next week when we'll discussed the film. But for now,
even though the guys can make it nice and naughty,

(01:48:22):
be got at and stollen body. Let's see what do
you love? King may be I'm perfect for you. Do
you listen to the rest of that song? Watch promising
young woman available to rent. Bye Bye,

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Bowen Yang

Matt Rogers

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