February 20, 2025 • 52 mins
Actress Ari Graynor joins Chelsea to discuss the Menendez brothers and the evolution of their sentencing, why she can handle a snake but not a spider, and using dreams as part of her artistic process. Then: A girlfriend of 2 years wants to live solo while her boyfriend is ready to move in together. A co-worker crush gets second-guessed. And a devoted mom is crushed when she finds out her mother-in-law read her journal.
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Executive Producer Catherine Law
Edited & Engineered by Brad Dickert
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hi, Catherine. Hi Chelsea, Hi.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Where are you at right now?
Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're all over well, I've it's been a rough run
of things.
Speaker 3 (00:08):
I am dying.
Speaker 4 (00:10):
I'm sick.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
I just came from Sun Valley where I shot my
birthday video. I seem to have picked up a cold
on top of the infection that I have in my shoulders.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
So I believe I'm dying.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
But I have been dying now for like three or
four years, and I feel like fighting it really hard.
So we went to Sun Valley meet a bunch of
my girlfriends to shoot my birthday video.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Was quite a production. There was a lot of moving parts.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
I had my friends Reggie and Lola christ in Sun
Valley set up the whole thing and organize it. And
it involved a lot of things, a lot of mountains,
a lot of bikinis, a lot of skiing, and the
sun came out just in time.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Oh beautiful. That's all you can hope for on your birthday.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Well, my birthday's coming up. Tuesday is my birthday. Everyone,
February twenty fifth, I turned fifty years old. I'm midlife joy.
That's what we're calling it. Chelsea Joy Handler is experienced
midlife joy. My new book.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
I'll have what she's having my seventh book. My seventh
book is coming out on February twenty fifth.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
I mean, I'm pretty pumped.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
About turning fifty. I'm not going to pretend that I'm
upset about it, because I'm not.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
I'm so happy for you. This is going to be
the decade of your life. I foresee it. I see it.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
Thank you, I thank you. I appreciate that. But even
though I am dying, I feel amazing.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
I'm so pleased.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
I'm fighting this infection in my arm from my shoulder thing,
and that's going away.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Hopefully.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
I get my pick line out February twenty fourth, the
day before my birthday.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
Great time me. I've had one drink in four weeks.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
I had a beer the other night when we got
to sun Jali, just to celebrating attitude. Then I announced
my European tour, which is going to take place May
in June. I'm going to like thirteen sixteen cities in Europe,
from like Oslo, Recuvic to Oslo and Portugal, Lisbon, all
these places.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
So that's pretty excited.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
And yes, I know Lisbon is the capital of Portugal
and Portugal isn't part of Lisbon, but I said it
in the wrong order, so that's really exciting. And my
Netflix special, which we just showed a clip of yesterday,
is coming out March twenty fifth, and I've just parted
rays with Dog. Doug was met in Sun Valley by
my bell, who flew home with him while I flew
back to Whistler because I'm having a birthday party, a
pre birthday party here before I leave for New York
(02:21):
to promote my book.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
It's probably not suitable for children like Dog.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
No, my book is probably not suitable for our children,
or adults for that matter.
Speaker 3 (02:29):
Our guest today stars in Winning Time, Missus America, and
most recently Monsters. She played Leslie Abramson in the Lyle
and Eric Menenda story. Please welcome actress, Ari Grainer.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Hi, juju Hi, it's a jew festival. How are you?
Speaker 4 (02:50):
It's a Jew bez. I'm great.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
How are you wecome to the podcast? Ari Grainer.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
I'm so happy to be on here and see you.
I met a good jollyon years ago.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
Where did we meet? Refresh my memory? Please?
Speaker 4 (03:05):
It was probably seventeen to eighteen years at Jenny and
Jason Oh.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
Oh my god, two hot messes, the hot two of
the hottest messes.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
And actually that's not fair to Jason.
Speaker 3 (03:18):
Jenny's really the hot mess of the two, even though
Jason is also a high missed them.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Do you guys not see each other anymore?
Speaker 5 (03:25):
Are you?
Speaker 4 (03:26):
Where are you? You're in New York, right, I'm in
New York. I'm in upstate New York.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
Now, Oh yes, you just bought your first big girl house.
Speaker 4 (03:33):
I got a big girl house like six months before
the pandemic. I bought like a house built in eighteen
oh three with sixty two acres and a barn built
in seventeen ninety six. And it's it's crazy. It's been
like a hole. It's almost amazing.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Just in time to go back to that, just to
go back to that century.
Speaker 4 (03:54):
That's right, everyone needs to step back into eighteen oh three.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Well, congratulations on that.
Speaker 4 (04:00):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Isn't it nice to be a female homeowner?
Speaker 4 (04:04):
It truly, truly is. I mean, it was a wild
thing doing it right before the pandemic. And I was
dating somebody at the time, but he hadn't seen the place,
and then we broke up, and then it was pandemic
and me and my dog were just like, great, now
we'll just face our existential crisis out on the land
and in this new house. And it was a pretty wild.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
I think it's really powerful when you are a single
woman and are able to buy property.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
It shouldn't really be.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
As I was reading her notes, it is something that
you were talking about, because I thought it was a
great point about how long ago it was. It wasn't
that long ago where we had to get man's permission
to even have our name on a deed or to
cot they had to coast side a card to co
vouch for us to get I mean.
Speaker 4 (04:51):
What like the seventies, Like it was not that long ago.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
What a nightmare? That sounds like.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
I really hope we're not headed back in that direction,
even though all fingers are pointing in that direction.
Speaker 4 (05:03):
I know it's a scary time for sure, but yeah,
I mean it's felt like the power of that, like
it was a huge internal sense of power of not
only buying the place, but then being here alone and
having a space where it's like, you know, we have
all these like images of like the Marlborough Man or
(05:24):
like men alone in the woods and doing their thing,
but we don't only have that for women. And then
when I was here and I was out on the
land and doing my thing and being in solitude and
being like, this is my place. This is a powerful I.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
Like out on the land.
Speaker 2 (05:41):
Yeah, do you have like stuff like animals out on
the property.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
No. I mean there's like the wild animals, you know,
so there's the occasional bear sighting. There's like some random
weasel kind of creatures and muskrats by the pond, and
deer and fox and you know, it's like all of that.
But I don't have chickens yet.
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Eventually, have you ever seen any of those black black
king snakes up there in upstate New York?
Speaker 4 (06:07):
Not a black king snake, I don't think, But there
are snakes. We called the big one Matild. We said
bulgeoue metild. I don't know why she got named Matild.
But there are these like enormous garden stakes. And one
got in the house. But I wasn't home and my
parents were here. My mom sent me this picture of
like a snake like this big that had I guess,
(06:30):
crawled through like the stone walls and was in the
living room and she had to take it out. And
I was very glad I wasn't home well.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
So I do used to date this guy who had
a house in upstate New York and he had this
and there was this guy that lived in one of
the properties around him, and he knew I have I
have like a phobia of snakes, and they have all
those black, thick king snakes up in upstate New York.
And he told us he once opened up his cellar
turned on lights, and I mean it was pitch black
(06:58):
and all you saw were all these little sets of
white eyes, and that there were dot and it dozens,
dozens and king snakes resting on top of each other.
Speaker 4 (07:10):
No.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
I was like, that is like a scene for my
worst nightmare movie.
Speaker 4 (07:14):
Yeah. Yeah, Luckily, like the snakes are not the issue
for me. It's rodentia is the problem. And so when
I first moved here and and there was the first
couple of mouse sightings, I was like, I just have
to move. I'll have to sell it. I'm I'm out run,
I'm leaving a house I can never go inside ever again,
So burn it down.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
What is rodentia exactly? Isn't that an an of rodentne rat.
Speaker 4 (07:40):
It's like if I see like a mouse, I completely
lose my shit, and I've gotten better, like the big
like I could be alone for like months at a
time and figure out how to make that be okay.
But if there was a mouse or a dead mouse
in the house, I was like, this is something I
can't deal with. This is this is like the true
conference of my abilities. But snakes, like, I'm okay, that's funny.
Speaker 3 (08:04):
I think people either have it about it's usually snakes
or spiders, and then it's usual spiders, Like I can
deal if I see a mouse, I'm not excited, but
I'm not going to lose it.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
Like if I saw a snake.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
Even in the wilderness, I have an issue with them
being there.
Speaker 6 (08:18):
I'm okay with snakes, yeah, Spiders, Yeah that holds up.
Speaker 4 (08:21):
Fighters okay too. It's like it's something about the way
the mouse moves. And I think I also have like
a traumatic experience with a hamster in my youth and
I never quite got over.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
It didn't involve Richard Gears, but you know that's why
he had to move to Spain. He's actually he's on
the right track. He got the fuck out of here.
I was like, wait, that story, it's so funny. When
you hear rumors like that for so many years and
so many years that you know.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
That rumor that career struck a Gerbil off his ass.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
But it's like, how can you be a person that
goes around and those rumors are like, there's no recourse.
You just have to sit there and take it. You
just have to sit there because it's so ludical. Is
it could be completely made up or it could be
completely true. We'll never know, and maybe he doesn't.
Speaker 4 (09:05):
Remember, maybe maybe he was in a black ari.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
I was so first, I'm so impressed with your acting.
I think you're such a gifted and talented actress, as
do many others obviously, and I saw you in it
was at missus America, right, you were amazing in that.
And then most recently you were in Monsters, The Menandez
Brother's Story playing Leslie Stall their attorney, which sorry, sorry, sorry.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
Leslie Abra, but Leslie Stall is great too. I'd love
to play her an attorney too. I think she was
on sixty minutes perfect Leslie Stall.
Speaker 1 (09:41):
Leslie tight curls.
Speaker 4 (09:43):
Yeah, it's the same.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
I am so eager to hear about your thoughts about
the Menendaz Brothers and like what you think, I mean, are.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
They evolving right now?
Speaker 1 (09:52):
Well now, because Kim.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
Kardashian is trying to get them out of jail, and
I think she's success She's succeeding.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
Well she was, I mean, you know now, look, I
mean I've been I was like embroiled for a year
and playing their defensive journeys. So obviously I was coming
at it from, you know, a very specific point of view.
I strongly believe it's time for them to be out
of jail. And Kim and all the gen zers who
(10:18):
found the Menendez trial on YouTube when it came in
twenty twenty one and then sort of started this movement
like on TikTok with them, and then the DA who
just who didn't get reelected, was like, get them out
of there. And now I just hope they don't get
stuck in another round of political maneuvering, because it's time
(10:40):
and it feels like the sentiment is like it's time
to look at this. And then this new DA keeps
pushing their trial date and I think it just got
moved again until March. It was supposed to be January thirtieth,
but they've been in for thirty five years. You know,
they both got college degrees, they have been helping hospice
(11:03):
with older inmates, they started a green space program. They've
never had another incident, and you know, I think just
if that trial happened now, I think it would be
looked at in a different kind of way than it
was by them.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
So you're like on their side, right you?
Speaker 4 (11:21):
Is that? What?
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Yeah? I am?
Speaker 3 (11:22):
You believe you believe because there's there's a lot of
back and forth about whether or not they were abused
to the degree that they claimed they were, and whether
or not this punishment is justified or if it's just
a sentencing. And because I came away from watching that,
I mean, I think I watched the real documentary and
(11:44):
then I watched your series, and I came away just
more confused than ever. I wasn't convinced that they were
as abused as they said they were. And then I
was like, God, if this, if these were two girls,
I wouldn't hesitate to believe them, you know, And I
had to think about why I didn't believe them, because
I was like, well, I just but and then I've
never been you know, I've never had that kind of
(12:06):
manipulation in my life where somebody was manipulating, Like if
if somebody did treat you that way and you were
you did turn into a grown man who could defend
yourself that you wouldn't because you're so brainwashed and you're
so there's such a power dynamic there. So talk to
me a little bit about what you learned about that,
because I'm so curious as from an insider's perspective.
Speaker 4 (12:29):
Yeah, I mean that was kind of at the crux
of the first trial, which was that basically the original
trial was a hung dury and it came down basically
along gender lines because the men didn't believe that boys
could be sexually abused, and culturally people didn't believe that,
which is absurd, you know. And I think that the
(12:53):
psychological impact, which is you know what leslie over the
course of that trial and the six years that she
was working with them, was trying to get people to
understand the psychology of abuse and of trauma, and and
you know, people being like, well, why didn't they just leave?
And it's like when you've been not only like horrifically
(13:14):
sexual abused, but also essentially brainwashed, the culture of control
within that house or in an abusive relationship you don't
realize you you can or how, or when people are
constantly threatening your life, you know. And even now, we
still don't really have like a correct recourse for victims
(13:38):
of abuse, who have tried to get away, who have
tried to divorce, who have tried to have restraining orders.
I'm not I'm not in any way condoning killing people
by anyway, but that's not what I'm here to do.
Speaker 3 (13:54):
A spouse's retaliation in the form of murder.
Speaker 4 (14:00):
Yeah, yeah, It's not something I'm signing up for, but
it is a part of the justice system that I
think is four women, four children of when you were
in a position in your life is on the line.
Does that mean that you should then be in prison
for the rest of your life because it was the
only way that you could survive. To me, I would
(14:23):
say not, but you know that's just me.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
So what about the fact that was it Lyle that
was on the who was talking to his girlfriend after
the fact and admitted to lying about the sexual abuse.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
What about that component of information.
Speaker 4 (14:35):
Well, here's what I feel about that, which is like, also,
they did so much research on the show, So stuff
that was in there was correct. I never read the
book that she wrote. I was sort of like, I'm
staying on my defense track. But psychologically, there's something that
I can understand about that of like when you have
(14:56):
revealed your deepest, most unspeakable secret. I mean, first of all,
there is nothing more unspeakable than sexual abuse, especially when
you've come from a family where you are told your
entire life what you must never do is speak of something,
and then to share that, to reveal that, I think
(15:17):
there's like an automatic reaction to then want to protect
and defend and close up. I mean I even feel
that way, and I'm like therapized up the wazoo. But
when I have like a very vulnerable moment, there still
is the reaction afterwards to want to try to like
take it back or make a joke or do what
(15:38):
you know, there's a kind of a natural response to that.
And so in a way I understand where here's this
young man who's just revealed the most painful things and
the bravado of being like, I didn't you know, it
wasn't real. I don't remember what was said or what
was actually said, but I understand the emotional response to
(16:00):
want to close up, take it back, defend after revealing
something so unbelievably painful.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
Heart Yeah, because right after.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
The murders day, I think the biggest thing that was,
you know, they went on the shopping sprees, they spent
all this money.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
They were acting just.
Speaker 4 (16:15):
So they were dumb kids. I mean, right, they were
also dumb kids. But I also feel like I did
so much research about Leslie and I just think she's incredible,
and I guess for me, it's like to believe that
also they were not abused, means essentially that you think
(16:36):
she made that story up. And from all of my
research about her, like people had opinions about her, she
was a real firecracker and not everybody liked her, but
nobody ever called in to question her integrity ever with
any of her clients throughout her career about having to
(16:58):
make up stories of their life, like she's not a snake.
She's so brilliant. It's like she's too smart to have
to make up something like that on their behalf. In
my personal belief and defense of her.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
And did you have a lot of interaction with her?
Speaker 4 (17:13):
With Leslie now, sadly I've not talked to her.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
What are some other like surprising things that you learned
about her and doing the research.
Speaker 4 (17:22):
Well, one thing that I think is really fun is
that Joan Didion and John Gregory Dunn, who's Dominic Dunn's brother,
were like her best friends. And so I feel like
when you find out that Joan Didion is her best friend,
you're like, well, she's definitely no snooze, you know, Like
that's it that like tells you about a person you know,
(17:44):
and she you know, she went to law school in
the late sixties as a single mother and drove a
yellow Corvette, and she came from Queen's and her grandmother
was a labor organizer and organizing and fighting against the man,
(18:04):
and they were like a family that fought and you know.
And then her there was like a her father basically
like completely her parents were divorced, but then her father
completely disappeared from her life. They thought that he had
moved to Florida to have another family, and it turned
out that he was living like a couple blocks away,
(18:27):
and she didn't speak to him for thirty four years.
Oh and then during the trial, during the first trial,
she reconnected with her father, adopted a baby, and her
mother died like all during the first trial, which is
crazy to think about.
Speaker 3 (18:46):
Wow, it's amazing to think about people's lives, certain people's lives,
like you know, the backstory going to law school in
the sixties as a woman, just that alone, right, I
wonder what that was like in a yellow Corvette. I
wonder what kind of car Leslie Stall was driving at
that time.
Speaker 4 (19:01):
I know, let's get Leslie Stall on the phone.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Early cars.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
I reel like and when you go in, like when
you're playing such a character, because you want I mean,
I don't know, I'm not really an actor actor, So
when you're playing a character, you don't want to impersonate them, right,
You don't want to make a caricature.
Speaker 1 (19:19):
You want to do your version of them.
Speaker 4 (19:22):
Is that correct? Yes? Yes, I mean I definitely didn't. Yeah,
you don't want to do an impersonation. But also like
the juicyness of the opportunity of playing a real person,
being like I want to try to honor and get
down this person's essence and also you know, the rhythm
(19:43):
of how she spoke and where her voice was and
how she moves and all that stuff. But yeah, I
mean that was like the terror of working on it.
Myself and then showing up and you know, because I don't, like,
I don't work with a coach or anything. I do
this sort of like unconscious dream work that is its
(20:04):
own thing. But like I'd never heard myself do it
out loud basically until I showed up on set. I
mean I did it in the audition, but you know, auditions,
you're just kind of starting that process where you watch
like a couple videos and you know, I had listened
to her audio book, but yeah, I was so scared
(20:26):
because I was like, I don't know, am I doing
this right? I mean I sort of felt that way
throughout the whole shoot, Like we were still shooting episode eight,
and I remember saying to Ian Brennan, who is one
of the co creators of the show, and he was
also directing, and I just remember sort of standing there
and being like, do you think I'm good? And he
(20:47):
was like, what do you mean? The scene was good?
And I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, but I mean like,
do you think I'm good as Leslie? And he was like,
what are you talking about? Like you are Leslie? What
do you mean? And I was like, okay, this finess, man.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
How did you not you didn't what does the voice
or the accent? I mean, I mean on your own.
Speaker 4 (21:04):
Like I did kind of, but it's sort of like
I would hear it. I mean, and I was just watching.
I was watching everything with her. She wrote a book
and she also did the audio books, so I would
listen to that all the time. I would fall asleep
to her voice said policy to the book. And you know,
(21:25):
like there were days on set when I did it,
but especially in the very beginning, I had one day
of shooting and then I had I think three weeks
off or a month, and you know, those are the
dark days of the soul, when it's the interstitial time
where you're like, what have I done? Am I going
(21:46):
to be fired? Am I doing this right? And I
think because you do, like everybody kind of has their
own way of doing it, Like some people are watching
everything and trying to get it perfectly, Like there's some
videos from the trial that I wanted it to be
as close to the thing as possible. But then sometimes
(22:08):
people play real people, but they just are like, I'm
doing completely doing my own version of it, and they're
both right, you know, but it's just like a matter
of if it works within the context of the thing.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
But okay, go back to what you were saying. You
do some dream sequence. What did you just mentioned earlier
before that.
Speaker 4 (22:29):
Yeah, so there's this creative dream work I do, and
it sort of is about tapping into your unconscious as
a way of tapping into your creative source, like this
idea that sort of every character comes to you for
(22:49):
a reason and at this time, and it's like, what
are you able to explore sort of through this character
of this work. So some times you use an actual
dream and you sort of walk through the dream in
your mind. It's very it's very hard to describe, but
it's really powerful. And I sort of used the episode
(23:11):
five where me and Cooper Katchi plays Eric Menandez where
it's a one shot, one seen conversation with us in prison,
and sort of used that and walked through that, and
a lot of really interesting things came up for me
in that about anger, about like confronting and owning my
(23:33):
own anger. Because Leslie was somebody who is like very
in touch with her anger and would define herself as
a as a fighter, like a fighting type, and I'm
less of a fighting type, Like I have a lot
of anger, but it's not. You know, I think for
women it's hard to own anger. It's hard to know
(23:53):
or for me, for me just speaking for myself, where
it's it's there. But I think tapping into that and
owning that and holding that and that was such a
big part of I think where she was coming from
an episode five of like the anger of what they
had gone through and what there was parents like that
that was not what parenting was, and so there was
(24:14):
you know, it's it's a it's a deep way of
getting in touch with something without it being like, what's
my objective in the scene, you know, it's like a
deep right, right, I'm doing a great job. I think
I'm doing a very good job describing well.
Speaker 3 (24:29):
I mean, I've never heard about this before, so it's
my introduction. So that's okay. I don't have to fully understand.
I just wanted to get a sense of what you
were talking about. As soon as you said dream work,
I'm like, we're gonna need to go back to that
for a second. Yeah, Okay, We're going to take a
break and we'll be right back with Ari Grainer.
Speaker 6 (24:49):
And we're back with are you ready to give some advice?
Speaker 3 (24:53):
All r are you ready to give some at least
some of the Are you ready to give some legal advice?
Speaker 4 (24:57):
Because legal advice the most all advised dating advice. I
cannot way medical.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
You know we do a lot of that here.
Speaker 4 (25:04):
Oh I mean medical too, Yeah, no, I got it.
Speaker 6 (25:07):
Well, this it's so funny how sometimes things will come
up earlier in the episode that we then have questions about.
So our first question is a write in. It comes
from Wendy. Wendy says, Dear Chelsea, I am a woman
in the United States. I feel extremely unsafe with the
current administration. I'm a feminist and activist and have become
much more active since the DABS decision. I even host
(25:28):
a podcast about deconstructing patriarchy and living life on your
own terms. However, I feel compelled to move out of
this soon to be a shithole. My friend says, like
James Baldwin, I will regret leaving to better myself while
leaving everyone else behind.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
I disagree. At what point did people start leaving Germany.
Speaker 6 (25:47):
I can still do all feminist and activist interests while
living overseas. I can fly back and do keynotes, host
my podcast, and write my substack and talk on social media.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Do you think I'll regret moving out, Wendy.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
I would say, go for it.
Speaker 3 (26:01):
I personally, if you are not comfortable with what's happening,
you go, and if you have the means to go. Absolutely.
I think a lot of people are having these thoughts,
and I think you have to do what's right for
your sanity.
Speaker 4 (26:15):
Yeah, I agree with that. I agree with that, And
I don't know. I mean, it's so hard to know
of like all the specifics of what you're who you're leaving,
but it's also people. You still hold those people in
your life, you know, and there's there's other life to
be had, there's other experiences to be had, there's other
(26:36):
places to live, and I think, like fine, listening to
that voice is important. I mean, these are questions I
ask myself. Do I don't know, do you ask yourself
those questions?
Speaker 3 (26:46):
Jo Oh, absolutely, I'm thinking about it all the time.
I'm always thinking about it. I just watched Lee last night,
that Kate Winslet movie that. Yeah, it takes place during
World War Two and like the Rise of Hitler, her
whole life was happening during the Rise of Hitler.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
And she talks to the movie like the character.
Speaker 3 (27:03):
It happened so slowly, yet it happened so quickly, like
they watched it, but it didn't seem real. It seemed
like a dream. It seemed surreal, and then it was real.
And then you had to exist within that. And it's like,
how do you exist when Hitler's trying to take over
Europe and he's the most powerful man in Europe? And
she talks about living a life under that, like within that,
(27:25):
living a life and then choosing, And then she became
a war photographer because she had to do her part.
She felt so compelled to do her part. And whatever
your part is, you can still do that without being
in this country.
Speaker 1 (27:37):
I believe that. I don't think you have to be
here to fight.
Speaker 3 (27:40):
And I totally understand wanting to get out of here,
and I would say, if that's your inclination, go for it.
Speaker 1 (27:44):
You can.
Speaker 3 (27:44):
Of course, you're not gonna you know, the people in
your life or in your life, they're not going anywhere, but.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
You might be.
Speaker 3 (27:50):
And you know, if that's your decision, absolutely I totally
get it.
Speaker 4 (27:54):
I think you should go. Wendy, Yeah, I agree.
Speaker 6 (27:57):
I find myself wanting to sort of like bury my
head in the sand a little bit, and like, this
is not what Wendy's doing.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
She's like, I'm going to keep up the good fight.
Speaker 6 (28:04):
But if you need to remove yourself from the physical
location in order to like keep your stamina to keep
doing that, it's probably the right choice.
Speaker 4 (28:11):
Well, And fighting can look like a lot of different ways,
or resistance can look like a lot of different ways,
Like it's it doesn't just have to be what we
think of of, like fighting in a traditional sense, like
that can also be stepping outside of the norm or
what you think you're supposed to do and showing a
resistance about what feels right to you. Yeah, go, Wendy go.
(28:33):
Maybe I'll be following you.
Speaker 6 (28:35):
Yeah, And Wendy, send us the name of your podcast.
We'll put it in the show notes so people can
check it out. Our first color is Bree. Bree says
Dear Chelsea. I'm thirty five, and I've been in a
series of monogamous relationships since i was eighteen. I left
a tenure relationship with a great man who I still
adore as a friend, then fucked around and found myself
in a relationship with a raging alcoholic, then somehow ended
(28:57):
up in a relationship with a man. Child put myself
through the ringer and have been in therapy for two
and a half years to find out a lot about
myself as well as what I want in a partner.
A year and a half ago, I told my therapist
about all the qualities I wanted in a man, and boom,
I met him that night and can now finally say
I'm in a loving and healthy relationship with someone I
truly see a future with.
Speaker 2 (29:18):
He's a little.
Speaker 6 (29:19):
Older than me and has been ready to move in
together for a couple months. But here's a thing. I
love living alone and I'm having a very hard time
thinking about leaving my apartment and living with someone else again.
Help a sister out, how do I handle this?
Speaker 7 (29:33):
Bri?
Speaker 3 (29:33):
Hibri Hibri, Wow, Bri, I totally I feel you.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
This is our special guest today, Ari Grainer, Hi, I
feel you.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
And is there any way you can keep your apartment
while you move in with him?
Speaker 7 (29:50):
I mean I could, but it's so expensive where I live,
and like that would be The dream is to keep
my apartment, for sure, but I don't know how I
would work that financially.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
It is the only thing.
Speaker 4 (30:00):
Are you guys in the same city, so we're like.
Speaker 7 (30:03):
Forty five minutes apart, which I love because it's like
space and we both live by the ocean, so it's perfect.
But it's just like, yeah, so we're forty five minutes apart,
but the commute doesn't really bug us or anything.
Speaker 3 (30:15):
I honestly, I'm going to just say that I would
stay where you are. Thankes surprise here, I know, But
I would just say, any distance you can have with
you someone you love, you met this great guy, it
sounds perfect for you, and it sounds like you manifested
it like very quickly, and if you're really into and
(30:37):
you dig your alone time, I really would be hesitant
to give that up.
Speaker 4 (30:41):
I had to say my partner now that I've been
with for four and a half years, I live in
upstate New York and he lives in Seattle half the
time because he has a sixteen year old And I
don't know, after like a lot of relationships of like
serial monogamy, living with peoplelah blah blah, sometimes I think
it's harder to be with somebody all of the time
(31:04):
than it is to be away from each other sometimes,
and I don't know, I think it can look a
lot of different ways where you can have like a beautiful, full, intimate,
committed relationship and not have to live together all of
the time.
Speaker 8 (31:21):
Yeah, totally, I fully agree with you.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
Yeah, forty five minutes away is nothing like that is nothing.
I mean, I've been in so many long distance relationships
and they work great because there's not an overdose of
the person in my life. I want to miss someone,
you know, that's what makes me keep coming back. So
and you seem like that same type if you're saying that.
Speaker 4 (31:44):
Yeah, but you're saying it's too hard the financials of
holding onto this relationship, this apartment, now that's.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
So hard or no, I we can keep our living
situation as is. And that's the thing.
Speaker 7 (31:57):
I never want to live with someone just because it's
financially smart like that. I've done that and it's not
the right way to approach things. But yeah, I can
keep my spot now for as long as I want.
He can keep his spot. It's more just the he
wants to live together, and I'm like, I'm not ready.
Speaker 4 (32:13):
Can you can? Do you have the kind of work
life where you can go stay with him for you know,
like a week on, a week off kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (32:24):
Yeah, totally, totally. I work from home so it's easy.
Speaker 7 (32:27):
And my therapist she had mentioned doing like a trial run.
But even that, I'm like, I know I'm gonna want
to go home.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
Yeah, I know, I'm gonna want my space.
Speaker 3 (32:39):
Have you talked to him about it, like about your hesitancy?
Speaker 1 (32:43):
Yeah, he knows everything. He actually knows.
Speaker 7 (32:45):
I was asking you guys for advice too, and he
was like, good, get her advice, and I was like,
not agree with what you want.
Speaker 1 (32:51):
But I just think you have to.
Speaker 3 (32:52):
As women, we really have to listen to ourselves. And
sometimes we get swept away in an emotion and a
feeling and we make a decision and based on what
someone else wants for our relationship. And of course he
wants to live with you. Of course he wants to
see you every morning when you wake up. But if
that's not the type of person you are, and I
think this is more and more true for women everywhere.
You're going to end up presenting that, you're going to
(33:14):
end up feeling crowded, and you may sabotage the relationship,
not definitely, but possibly. So why even risk it if
you have a good thing going forty five minutes is nothing.
Speaker 4 (33:24):
And it's so chic to live apart, and it's like
both places can feel like a version of home, and
like having alone time is important, Like I feel like
that has been like the key pillar of my life
and healthy relationships has been like how much time I
need alone and reckoning with that because for so long
(33:45):
it felt like there was something wrong with me for
requiring the amount of alone time I need it And
it has nothing to do with the relationship or bearing
on any anything except that, like it's important autonomy. Alone
time is good and your relationship can flourish within that.
Speaker 3 (34:06):
So and then you can just spit it be like
this is how committed I am to you.
Speaker 1 (34:10):
I'm going to keep my apartment.
Speaker 3 (34:12):
Because I believe we're going to go like for the
long haul, and I want us, I want us to
be successful, and I think that's going to be part
of our success.
Speaker 6 (34:21):
Yeah, okay, I love the idea that our head of
like even if it's a few days on and a
few days off, or a week on and a week off,
like do it part time, but it doesn't have to
be like let's try it for six months.
Speaker 4 (34:31):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, especially forty five minutes away, you know,
and it's like a week. Yeah, like going there for
a week, then I have a couple of days, then
he can come there if he can, Like I don't know,
I've found that that's worked very well for me. And
now this feels like our home together, but also what
(34:54):
I can do how I feel, or like what I
can do for myself when I'm alone in my you know,
my week off. Well he's back. It's like I need
that time.
Speaker 8 (35:05):
Yeah, yeah, same.
Speaker 7 (35:06):
It's like a recharge for sure, and like a reset
and recenter and the whole thing.
Speaker 4 (35:09):
For sure.
Speaker 8 (35:10):
I completely agree.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
So I guess my question is, though, is like what
if it becomes a deal.
Speaker 8 (35:14):
Breaker and then I have to choose between the two?
Speaker 1 (35:17):
Do you think it will become a deal breaker?
Speaker 8 (35:19):
I think so in the future.
Speaker 4 (35:21):
Yeah, how long have you guys been together. We're coming
up on two years. Well, also, I feel like in
two years, who knows how you'll feel or how he feels, right,
you know, like in this moment, especially if maybe it's
you commit to different chunks of time together. So it's
thinking about doing like a week together and then three
(35:42):
days apart, and that like maybe there's a way to
structure some of that time, so you both know how
you are committed to spending big chunks of time together
while also having that time apart, and then you know
your feelings might change in a few years.
Speaker 3 (35:58):
Or commit to doing a month together and then teach
yourselves both a lesson because I'm sure by the end
of it you both want fucking three days off.
Speaker 1 (36:06):
Like you know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (36:09):
You can be like, sure, let's try. I'll come live
with you for one month straight and then let's discuss it.
Let's regroup and see how we both liked that, you know,
like experimentally.
Speaker 1 (36:18):
Yeah, I would definitely trust your gut.
Speaker 6 (36:21):
And if he does, make it a deal breaker, call
in and do a MINISOD for couples.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
Counseling and we'll do couples counseling.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Love that idea fun?
Speaker 4 (36:27):
Perfect, right?
Speaker 2 (36:29):
Thanks?
Speaker 4 (36:29):
Okay, bye ba bye.
Speaker 1 (36:31):
I think.
Speaker 4 (36:33):
By the way, do you watch couples Therapy?
Speaker 1 (36:35):
I love it? I love it.
Speaker 3 (36:37):
I love watching therapy. It's the best me to or
not is such a good therapist? Yeah, I really's good.
Speaker 4 (36:46):
She is.
Speaker 3 (36:47):
Whenever they talk, whenever we see her personal life, I'm like, no, no,
I don't I don't want to see anything about her
personal life, like she's such a good therapist. I just
want to keep her in that little bubble, you know
what I mean, totally. Yeah, I don't want to know
that you have a son.
Speaker 1 (36:59):
I don't. I'm not interested she has.
Speaker 4 (37:01):
A son, I think so, I think she has a.
Speaker 2 (37:04):
Silars Yeah, don't.
Speaker 4 (37:08):
Well.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
Our next question comes from Catherine.
Speaker 6 (37:10):
I think she needs a little bit of like a
confidence boost here, so she says, Dear Chelsea, I went
through a bit of a hard time a few years ago,
and just this year started dating again.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
It's been a rollercoaster, for sure.
Speaker 6 (37:22):
I've had some people I've been interested in, dated, slept with,
but nothing's panned out. My workplace shares a building with
another company. I've had negative experiences in the past dating
coworkers and have a strict no coworkers policy for myself.
When I first started the job, I noticed a good
looking guy at the other company, but never had reason
to interact. He introduced himself to me when there was
(37:42):
a random fire in the building, and then a couple
months later, a weird accident led to him talking to
me again. We've chatted a few times since. Recently, he's
intentionally brought himself into my orbit, and I'm pretty sure
he's also interested. My issue is that even though we
don't work together, we share an open workspace.
Speaker 2 (37:59):
Second ish you.
Speaker 6 (38:00):
A different colleague of mine has proven to be a
bit of a gross person when it comes to at
work relations. Because my work crush and this colleague associate,
I can't help but worry that my crush shares the
same kind of locker room talk as this colleague. I
pride myself on my reputation at work, so everything in
me is screaming not to pursue it. But I don't
want to write off my first real crush in four years.
(38:21):
Should I give him a chance despite my colleague's bro talk?
Speaker 4 (38:24):
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
And this is also Catherine.
Speaker 1 (38:29):
So afterine what they're doing? What is all of this nonsense?
This is all noise? Get after it.
Speaker 8 (38:38):
This is this is the noisiest thing.
Speaker 3 (38:41):
I now will turn the fucking volume down and get
down to the basics. You are attracted to someone who
is attracted to you just because he has so. I
have a news flash for you, Like guys you're gonna
date are gonna have asshole friends, period.
Speaker 8 (38:56):
Friends. I don't even I've been talking to exactly.
Speaker 3 (38:58):
You don't even know if all of this is like supposition.
You're not even sure what's happening, and you're built, you're
making like eighty different blocks for you to get to
this person that may or may not even be true.
Speaker 4 (39:11):
You can also tell him, I mean you can also like,
this is what I love about getting like dating when
you're older is like you can also say the things
early on where I feel like, when you're young, you're
so afraid of saying a wrong thing that is like
gonna make somebody run. And then I feel like when
you get older, you're like, let me just say all
the things so like, and then you can decide what
(39:32):
you want to do, and I'll decide what I want
to do. And you can also be like I'm worried
about this, you know, or like here's a concern of
mine and just talking it through and who knows what
he'll say about it?
Speaker 1 (39:43):
And moreover, what makes you think that they are our friends?
Speaker 8 (39:46):
I kind of am not wired for workplace flirtations anymore.
No shit, I've definitely bumbled through those a little bit.
Speaker 5 (39:52):
I And anytime I was like, okay, you know, I
can work it in there, he's just like so dead
pan like about what's going on in our company. And
then I'm just like, Okay, well now it's not the
time for this kind of thing. And then just the
way that he speaks about my colleagues is kind of
what's hinting that there's really maybe not the best interaction there.
(40:13):
It's kind of just a we work in the same environment.
I'm going to keep the peace kind of thing. But
I also have to be very careful what I say
about that, because again I don't know him very well,
so maybe he's going to say what I've been saying
back to these people.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
Oh my god, oh my god, we have to ex
give you. You have to put your head in a
shampoo bowl and wash all of this garbage out. You
are just running around in circles in your head. You
like this guy, he likes you. Forget everything else you do.
Not even work together. First of all, I'm not against
that either workplace romance. It's like where adults supposed to meet,
they work together. That's where happened for me.
Speaker 1 (40:47):
So that's silly. That's a silly rule.
Speaker 3 (40:49):
And like all these rules you have are just kind
of like you have to work very hard at stripping
away all of this noise, and that's going to be
a practice for you, but you can do it.
Speaker 6 (40:58):
I think you should just go ask him out, because
he's made it clear you don't want to like let
it go too long, and then he's like feeling like he's.
Speaker 1 (41:04):
Send him send him an email. Go just listen. It
seems to like to me that you're being very flirtatious.
Speaker 3 (41:09):
If you want to ask me on a date, let
me know and I can respond very straightforward.
Speaker 8 (41:14):
I go to work on that, yeah.
Speaker 4 (41:17):
Or just be like, do you want to get a
drink after work or something?
Speaker 8 (41:21):
I finished work at eleven, He's done a five point
thirty like pm PM.
Speaker 3 (41:26):
Okay, Well, would you be comfortable writing an email like that?
I mean, I know you wouldn't be, but would you
do it?
Speaker 5 (41:31):
I'm definitely better like writing than I asked initially. I'm
better at interacting with people with words using like email,
and then I can once because he hasn't really had
a chance to see my personality yet, because I've been
so like, I have this professional face I have to
put on, so I haven't really been able to show
my funny side or like the actual me side, which
(41:52):
is and all.
Speaker 1 (41:53):
The voices in your head. You haven't been able to
show him that either.
Speaker 8 (41:55):
I know they're just there. You know, they never take
a vacation.
Speaker 3 (41:59):
Well, I think you should send him an email and
just put it out there.
Speaker 1 (42:02):
Put it out there.
Speaker 3 (42:03):
You're going to get the response that you want, and
then you can start dealing with all of these other
issues that you're creating or let them fall away as
you start to get to know him, and then you
can get to know if he's like that or if
he's like your friend. I'm still confused as to why
you think that. I don't think you really answered that question,
Like why do you think this guy that you have
a crush on is friends with your work colleague?
Speaker 8 (42:26):
Because they all they've all mentioned him before in some context.
Speaker 5 (42:30):
They're having these interactions that aren't work related. So I
just I kind of just have to assume that maybe
there's a friendly interaction outside of the workplace as well,
because I don't a.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
Lot of assumptions, a lot of assumptions.
Speaker 4 (42:42):
I think it's like go see like see each other outside,
see what the because also you might not even it's
like him, You might not even like him, you know,
or he might be the love of your life. You
don't know, but you got to get out of that
office to know.
Speaker 3 (42:55):
Yeah, listen, you have one life to live one okay,
so make it fucking count and work in your best interest.
No one is going to find love for you. You
have to find it for you.
Speaker 8 (43:06):
Well, they're trying, they're trying. They're failing, but they're trying.
Who's day, my friends, they're invested in my love life.
Speaker 1 (43:13):
That's great. I'm glad they're invested.
Speaker 3 (43:15):
But you can't rely on other people to find you
have the person here. So just don't you need to
go and send that email and I need you to
report back to us also, of course, let us know
what happens.
Speaker 8 (43:26):
Okay, Well, absolutely, thank you.
Speaker 4 (43:28):
Very Also, congrats on having a crush. A crush is
so fun.
Speaker 8 (43:31):
At the beginning, not now.
Speaker 3 (43:33):
Yeah, well you could extend, but you can extend the crush,
I mean, the flirtation can keep going and going and
going until you go out, and even then, it's just
so fun, you know, flirting back and forth, especially over email,
that's my favorite.
Speaker 5 (43:46):
Yeah, I just wish it wasn't in a public space
that people.
Speaker 1 (43:50):
Yeah, well, you wish a lot of things.
Speaker 4 (43:52):
I know I do.
Speaker 1 (43:53):
Yeah, Okay, all right, keep ust posted.
Speaker 4 (43:57):
Bye bye.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
They're going to get married and have lots of.
Speaker 2 (44:01):
Of course they are.
Speaker 4 (44:02):
Of course, I really want to find out what happens.
Speaker 6 (44:05):
We will definitely check back in with her in a
couple of weeks and see what happened.
Speaker 2 (44:08):
What was her name, Catherine?
Speaker 6 (44:10):
She's a Katherine Elizabeth, just like oh and spelled all
the right ways. Well, we have one more question, but
we could take our little break and then come back.
Speaker 2 (44:17):
It's a gesy one.
Speaker 3 (44:18):
Okay, we'll be right back with Ari Greener. We're back
to we have one more question.
Speaker 1 (44:27):
We have one more caller question.
Speaker 4 (44:29):
Yes, this is so fun.
Speaker 1 (44:31):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (44:32):
It's the dream, especially when it's real. It's like sometimes
we get some questions and I'm like, what the fuck
are they asking me that for? Like, you know, but
some questions. I love interpersonal affairs. I love like breaking
up or getting the finding a crush. That was one
of my favorite topics. Like that will be.
Speaker 4 (44:51):
What to do about a crush?
Speaker 2 (44:53):
More crush questions?
Speaker 4 (44:54):
Yes, my favorite.
Speaker 6 (44:56):
Well, this question comes from Sarah Dear Chelsea. About a
year ago, my husband and I went away for a
few nights. My mother in law stayed at our house
to watch our small children sleeping in our bed to
stay close to the baby. When I returned, I noticed
that my journal, which I keep in my nightstand, had
obviously been tampered with. The strap was in a different
(45:17):
place than usual, my worksheets from therapy were not where
I left them, etc. It was totally shaken. My husband
handled it and addressed it with my mother in law.
She denied reading it and said she didn't touch it.
I had postpartum depression with my second child as well
as a recent rocky patch with my husband where I
relied heavily on my journal to process.
Speaker 8 (45:36):
Oh.
Speaker 6 (45:36):
It makes me sick to my stomach to think of
my mother in law reading my most intimate thoughts I
used to enjoy looking back on previous years and memories
I've written about. Every year, I write a letter to
my children on their birthday. I never knew if I
was going to give these to them, but it was
my most intimate thoughts about motherhood and reflecting on each
year with them. These letters were for me alone and
possibly one day my children. It makes me very upset
(45:59):
thinking she read something that was supposed to be between
me and my daughters. I've come to terms with her denial,
and I don't believe I will ever fully know the truth.
How do I continue to use journaling as part of
my toolbox and staying regulated and well. I wrote in
this journal every day for four years, and since that event,
I haven't been able to pick it up again. I
really loved this part of my day and it helped
(46:20):
my mental health in a big way. It doesn't feel
like a safe place anymore. Looking back on past years
now makes me angry thinking of her reading those thoughts.
I tried to buy a brand new journal and start fresh,
but I still have a mental block and can't move forward.
Is there any way I can get past this and
start using this coping skill that helped me through some
dark times?
Speaker 2 (46:38):
Sarah?
Speaker 3 (46:40):
Yeah, absolutely. First of all, you have to start journaling again.
This is not your issue. This is your mother in
law's issue. She opened your book. You cannot control her.
She opened your journal. She invaded your privacy, so it
is up to you to take your power back. I
can guarantee you she's not going to do it again
after she she's been called out. But you have to
get a new journal and just start practicing this is
(47:03):
something that is giving you such relief and such comfort
that you can go to this place and write in
your journal each night and write this beautiful letter to
your daughters each year on their birthdays.
Speaker 1 (47:12):
That is such a beautiful thing to even hear.
Speaker 3 (47:15):
Like, You've got to keep going and do not let
someone else's misstep create your own misstep. You know, you
keep going and do whatever you need to do, and
if it doesn't feel right the first couple times, keep
doing it.
Speaker 1 (47:31):
Just keep writing into your journal until you get back
to your safe space.
Speaker 9 (47:34):
What do you think, Ari, Yeah, I mean, there's nothing
more like that. That kind of writing has also been
transformative for me. And you can't give that away to her.
Speaker 4 (47:47):
You can't give that power to her or to That's
a that is something to reclaim for yourself. Absolutely, it's
a beautiful, beautiful practice. I totally get what a hard
marbal invasion that is and how hard that is, but
I feel like it's it's like when you'll fall off
a horse. Like when somebody falls off a horse and
(48:07):
they're like, I just have to get back up there
so that I'm not afraid to ever do it again.
It's like even if the writing in the beginning is
like I hate this, this feels wrong. I don't want
to do this, like just writing the honesty through it
to get to the upper side, because that's for you. You
got to keep that.
Speaker 1 (48:27):
Yeah, girl, don't let your mother in law take you down.
Speaker 6 (48:29):
And I wonder too, if there's like a way to
upend it and like create a different ritual around it,
like doing it at a different time of day than
you used to it, doing it in a different place
like maybe used to write in bed, go to a
cozy chair, like really changing your ritual around it. Maybe
it's like saging your journal, like do something that creates
a different energy around it. And then yes, like start
with where you're at, like I'm angry that this happened.
(48:52):
I'm upset that this happened.
Speaker 3 (48:53):
But you just also you have to realize you're holding
onto these emotions that are not your fault. These are
hurt These are her issues, not your issues. She was
being nosy, she had no boundaries. That doesn't change who
you are. You're choosing to allow her to disrupt this
connection you had with yourself, and that's on you.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
You have to choose to move forward.
Speaker 3 (49:16):
And you have to choose to be like, I'm bigger
than this and I'm going to get past this. And yes,
I understand you're upset, but don't let her take your
power away.
Speaker 4 (49:24):
I also wonder if there's a way of like writing
a letter to her that you have no intention of
ever giving, but just of a reprocessing of saying all
the things out loud about you know, out loud via
writing about how that made you feel like that, just
to get that out, just to keep working through that too,
(49:46):
to sort of anything that's left over in the mind
of like you made me never want to do this again.
My trust is gone, you know, whatever that is that
you'll never ever give to her, but just as a
way of also get that part of your feeling out.
Speaker 2 (50:01):
Of your brain and then put that letter in your
journal and she'll read it.
Speaker 3 (50:07):
Thank you, Ari Grainer, Thank you so much for being
here today.
Speaker 1 (50:11):
What a delight.
Speaker 4 (50:12):
Thank you so much for having me. This was like
such a joy. I love you and I'm like just
so happy I got to be here. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (50:19):
I hope I see you soon.
Speaker 4 (50:21):
You too. Okay, you're back at Jenny and Jason's. Okay,
bye you guys.
Speaker 1 (50:24):
Bye byeks. Do do do do do.
Speaker 3 (50:28):
Do drum roll, Catherine, please, Chelsea Handler Abroad. Abroad is
my European tour, which I just announced yesterday. Tickets go
on sale tomorrow or today or there's a pre sale
code Chelsea. So I'm coming to obviously find.
Speaker 1 (50:47):
A husband abroad.
Speaker 3 (50:48):
I need to get the health out of this fucking country.
And it's not as easy as you think. So I'm
coming to Rekuvic, I'm coming to Dublin. I'm coming to
the UK, coming to Brussels, Paris, Belfast in May and June.
I'm coming to Oslo, Stockholm, to Copenhagen, Manchester, London, Glasgow,
(51:10):
New Zurich, Vienna. I've never ever been to Vienna, Berlin,
Barcelona and Lisbon.
Speaker 1 (51:17):
I'm coming abroad is abroad that.
Speaker 2 (51:20):
Sounds like fun. I'm gonna go see you abroad.
Speaker 3 (51:22):
I I know I want to go see me abroad
and there all be there, All be okay, all Upcoming
Vegas dates March twenty first, April eighteenth, July fifth, August thirtieth,
November one and twenty ninth at the Cosmopolitan of Las Vegas.
Speaker 1 (51:39):
My book tour. I'll have what she's having.
Speaker 3 (51:40):
Means I am doing book events only book events Northvale,
New Jersey, on February twenty fourth, February twenty fifth at
the ninety second Street Y, February twenty sixth, Brookline Booksmith,
February twenty seventh, Cincinnati, Ohio, February twenty eighth at the
h Foundation in Chicago, and Barnes and Noble at The
Girl in Los Angeles on March first, and then Seattle,
(52:03):
Washington on March third, Elliott.
Speaker 1 (52:05):
Bay and I'll see you guys all there.
Speaker 6 (52:08):
If you'd like advice from Chelsea, shoot us an email
at Dear Chelsea podcast at gmail dot com and be
sure to include your phone number. Dear Chelsea is edited
and engineered by Brad Dickert executive producer Catherine Law and
be sure to check out our March at Chelseahandler dot
com
Hi, Catherine. Hi Chelsea, Hi.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Where are you at right now?
Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're all over well, I've it's been a rough run
of things.
Speaker 3 (00:08):
I am dying.
Speaker 4 (00:10):
I'm sick.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
I just came from Sun Valley where I shot my
birthday video. I seem to have picked up a cold
on top of the infection that I have in my shoulders.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
So I believe I'm dying.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
But I have been dying now for like three or
four years, and I feel like fighting it really hard.
So we went to Sun Valley meet a bunch of
my girlfriends to shoot my birthday video.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Was quite a production. There was a lot of moving parts.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
I had my friends Reggie and Lola christ in Sun
Valley set up the whole thing and organize it. And
it involved a lot of things, a lot of mountains,
a lot of bikinis, a lot of skiing, and the
sun came out just in time.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Oh beautiful. That's all you can hope for on your birthday.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Well, my birthday's coming up. Tuesday is my birthday. Everyone,
February twenty fifth, I turned fifty years old. I'm midlife joy.
That's what we're calling it. Chelsea Joy Handler is experienced
midlife joy. My new book.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
I'll have what she's having my seventh book. My seventh
book is coming out on February twenty fifth.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
I mean, I'm pretty pumped.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
About turning fifty. I'm not going to pretend that I'm
upset about it, because I'm not.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
I'm so happy for you. This is going to be
the decade of your life. I foresee it. I see it.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
Thank you, I thank you. I appreciate that. But even
though I am dying, I feel amazing.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
I'm so pleased.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
I'm fighting this infection in my arm from my shoulder thing,
and that's going away.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Hopefully.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
I get my pick line out February twenty fourth, the
day before my birthday.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
Great time me. I've had one drink in four weeks.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
I had a beer the other night when we got
to sun Jali, just to celebrating attitude. Then I announced
my European tour, which is going to take place May
in June. I'm going to like thirteen sixteen cities in Europe,
from like Oslo, Recuvic to Oslo and Portugal, Lisbon, all
these places.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
So that's pretty excited.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
And yes, I know Lisbon is the capital of Portugal
and Portugal isn't part of Lisbon, but I said it
in the wrong order, so that's really exciting. And my
Netflix special, which we just showed a clip of yesterday,
is coming out March twenty fifth, and I've just parted
rays with Dog. Doug was met in Sun Valley by
my bell, who flew home with him while I flew
back to Whistler because I'm having a birthday party, a
pre birthday party here before I leave for New York
(02:21):
to promote my book.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
It's probably not suitable for children like Dog.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
No, my book is probably not suitable for our children,
or adults for that matter.
Speaker 3 (02:29):
Our guest today stars in Winning Time, Missus America, and
most recently Monsters. She played Leslie Abramson in the Lyle
and Eric Menenda story. Please welcome actress, Ari Grainer.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Hi, juju Hi, it's a jew festival. How are you?
Speaker 4 (02:50):
It's a Jew bez. I'm great.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
How are you wecome to the podcast? Ari Grainer.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
I'm so happy to be on here and see you.
I met a good jollyon years ago.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
Where did we meet? Refresh my memory? Please?
Speaker 4 (03:05):
It was probably seventeen to eighteen years at Jenny and
Jason Oh.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
Oh my god, two hot messes, the hot two of
the hottest messes.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
And actually that's not fair to Jason.
Speaker 3 (03:18):
Jenny's really the hot mess of the two, even though
Jason is also a high missed them.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Do you guys not see each other anymore?
Speaker 5 (03:25):
Are you?
Speaker 4 (03:26):
Where are you? You're in New York, right, I'm in
New York. I'm in upstate New York.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
Now, Oh yes, you just bought your first big girl house.
Speaker 4 (03:33):
I got a big girl house like six months before
the pandemic. I bought like a house built in eighteen
oh three with sixty two acres and a barn built
in seventeen ninety six. And it's it's crazy. It's been
like a hole. It's almost amazing.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Just in time to go back to that, just to
go back to that century.
Speaker 4 (03:54):
That's right, everyone needs to step back into eighteen oh three.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Well, congratulations on that.
Speaker 4 (04:00):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Isn't it nice to be a female homeowner?
Speaker 4 (04:04):
It truly, truly is. I mean, it was a wild
thing doing it right before the pandemic. And I was
dating somebody at the time, but he hadn't seen the place,
and then we broke up, and then it was pandemic
and me and my dog were just like, great, now
we'll just face our existential crisis out on the land
and in this new house. And it was a pretty wild.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
I think it's really powerful when you are a single
woman and are able to buy property.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
It shouldn't really be.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
As I was reading her notes, it is something that
you were talking about, because I thought it was a
great point about how long ago it was. It wasn't
that long ago where we had to get man's permission
to even have our name on a deed or to
cot they had to coast side a card to co
vouch for us to get I mean.
Speaker 4 (04:51):
What like the seventies, Like it was not that long ago.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
What a nightmare? That sounds like.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
I really hope we're not headed back in that direction,
even though all fingers are pointing in that direction.
Speaker 4 (05:03):
I know it's a scary time for sure, but yeah,
I mean it's felt like the power of that, like
it was a huge internal sense of power of not
only buying the place, but then being here alone and
having a space where it's like, you know, we have
all these like images of like the Marlborough Man or
(05:24):
like men alone in the woods and doing their thing,
but we don't only have that for women. And then
when I was here and I was out on the
land and doing my thing and being in solitude and
being like, this is my place. This is a powerful I.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
Like out on the land.
Speaker 2 (05:41):
Yeah, do you have like stuff like animals out on
the property.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
No. I mean there's like the wild animals, you know,
so there's the occasional bear sighting. There's like some random
weasel kind of creatures and muskrats by the pond, and
deer and fox and you know, it's like all of that.
But I don't have chickens yet.
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Eventually, have you ever seen any of those black black
king snakes up there in upstate New York?
Speaker 4 (06:07):
Not a black king snake, I don't think, But there
are snakes. We called the big one Matild. We said
bulgeoue metild. I don't know why she got named Matild.
But there are these like enormous garden stakes. And one
got in the house. But I wasn't home and my
parents were here. My mom sent me this picture of
like a snake like this big that had I guess,
(06:30):
crawled through like the stone walls and was in the
living room and she had to take it out. And
I was very glad I wasn't home well.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
So I do used to date this guy who had
a house in upstate New York and he had this
and there was this guy that lived in one of
the properties around him, and he knew I have I
have like a phobia of snakes, and they have all
those black, thick king snakes up in upstate New York.
And he told us he once opened up his cellar
turned on lights, and I mean it was pitch black
(06:58):
and all you saw were all these little sets of
white eyes, and that there were dot and it dozens,
dozens and king snakes resting on top of each other.
Speaker 4 (07:10):
No.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
I was like, that is like a scene for my
worst nightmare movie.
Speaker 4 (07:14):
Yeah. Yeah, Luckily, like the snakes are not the issue
for me. It's rodentia is the problem. And so when
I first moved here and and there was the first
couple of mouse sightings, I was like, I just have
to move. I'll have to sell it. I'm I'm out run,
I'm leaving a house I can never go inside ever again,
So burn it down.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
What is rodentia exactly? Isn't that an an of rodentne rat.
Speaker 4 (07:40):
It's like if I see like a mouse, I completely
lose my shit, and I've gotten better, like the big
like I could be alone for like months at a
time and figure out how to make that be okay.
But if there was a mouse or a dead mouse
in the house, I was like, this is something I
can't deal with. This is this is like the true
conference of my abilities. But snakes, like, I'm okay, that's funny.
Speaker 3 (08:04):
I think people either have it about it's usually snakes
or spiders, and then it's usual spiders, Like I can
deal if I see a mouse, I'm not excited, but
I'm not going to lose it.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
Like if I saw a snake.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
Even in the wilderness, I have an issue with them
being there.
Speaker 6 (08:18):
I'm okay with snakes, yeah, Spiders, Yeah that holds up.
Speaker 4 (08:21):
Fighters okay too. It's like it's something about the way
the mouse moves. And I think I also have like
a traumatic experience with a hamster in my youth and
I never quite got over.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
It didn't involve Richard Gears, but you know that's why
he had to move to Spain. He's actually he's on
the right track. He got the fuck out of here.
I was like, wait, that story, it's so funny. When
you hear rumors like that for so many years and
so many years that you know.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
That rumor that career struck a Gerbil off his ass.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
But it's like, how can you be a person that
goes around and those rumors are like, there's no recourse.
You just have to sit there and take it. You
just have to sit there because it's so ludical. Is
it could be completely made up or it could be
completely true. We'll never know, and maybe he doesn't.
Speaker 4 (09:05):
Remember, maybe maybe he was in a black ari.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
I was so first, I'm so impressed with your acting.
I think you're such a gifted and talented actress, as
do many others obviously, and I saw you in it
was at missus America, right, you were amazing in that.
And then most recently you were in Monsters, The Menandez
Brother's Story playing Leslie Stall their attorney, which sorry, sorry, sorry.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
Leslie Abra, but Leslie Stall is great too. I'd love
to play her an attorney too. I think she was
on sixty minutes perfect Leslie Stall.
Speaker 1 (09:41):
Leslie tight curls.
Speaker 4 (09:43):
Yeah, it's the same.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
I am so eager to hear about your thoughts about
the Menendaz Brothers and like what you think, I mean, are.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
They evolving right now?
Speaker 1 (09:52):
Well now, because Kim.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
Kardashian is trying to get them out of jail, and
I think she's success She's succeeding.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
Well she was, I mean, you know now, look, I
mean I've been I was like embroiled for a year
and playing their defensive journeys. So obviously I was coming
at it from, you know, a very specific point of view.
I strongly believe it's time for them to be out
of jail. And Kim and all the gen zers who
(10:18):
found the Menendez trial on YouTube when it came in
twenty twenty one and then sort of started this movement
like on TikTok with them, and then the DA who
just who didn't get reelected, was like, get them out
of there. And now I just hope they don't get
stuck in another round of political maneuvering, because it's time
(10:40):
and it feels like the sentiment is like it's time
to look at this. And then this new DA keeps
pushing their trial date and I think it just got
moved again until March. It was supposed to be January thirtieth,
but they've been in for thirty five years. You know,
they both got college degrees, they have been helping hospice
(11:03):
with older inmates, they started a green space program. They've
never had another incident, and you know, I think just
if that trial happened now, I think it would be
looked at in a different kind of way than it
was by them.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
So you're like on their side, right you?
Speaker 4 (11:21):
Is that? What?
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Yeah? I am?
Speaker 3 (11:22):
You believe you believe because there's there's a lot of
back and forth about whether or not they were abused
to the degree that they claimed they were, and whether
or not this punishment is justified or if it's just
a sentencing. And because I came away from watching that,
I mean, I think I watched the real documentary and
(11:44):
then I watched your series, and I came away just
more confused than ever. I wasn't convinced that they were
as abused as they said they were. And then I
was like, God, if this, if these were two girls,
I wouldn't hesitate to believe them, you know, And I
had to think about why I didn't believe them, because
I was like, well, I just but and then I've
never been you know, I've never had that kind of
(12:06):
manipulation in my life where somebody was manipulating, Like if
if somebody did treat you that way and you were
you did turn into a grown man who could defend
yourself that you wouldn't because you're so brainwashed and you're
so there's such a power dynamic there. So talk to
me a little bit about what you learned about that,
because I'm so curious as from an insider's perspective.
Speaker 4 (12:29):
Yeah, I mean that was kind of at the crux
of the first trial, which was that basically the original
trial was a hung dury and it came down basically
along gender lines because the men didn't believe that boys
could be sexually abused, and culturally people didn't believe that,
which is absurd, you know. And I think that the
(12:53):
psychological impact, which is you know what leslie over the
course of that trial and the six years that she
was working with them, was trying to get people to
understand the psychology of abuse and of trauma, and and
you know, people being like, well, why didn't they just leave?
And it's like when you've been not only like horrifically
(13:14):
sexual abused, but also essentially brainwashed, the culture of control
within that house or in an abusive relationship you don't
realize you you can or how, or when people are
constantly threatening your life, you know. And even now, we
still don't really have like a correct recourse for victims
(13:38):
of abuse, who have tried to get away, who have
tried to divorce, who have tried to have restraining orders.
I'm not I'm not in any way condoning killing people
by anyway, but that's not what I'm here to do.
Speaker 3 (13:54):
A spouse's retaliation in the form of murder.
Speaker 4 (14:00):
Yeah, yeah, It's not something I'm signing up for, but
it is a part of the justice system that I
think is four women, four children of when you were
in a position in your life is on the line.
Does that mean that you should then be in prison
for the rest of your life because it was the
only way that you could survive. To me, I would
(14:23):
say not, but you know that's just me.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
So what about the fact that was it Lyle that
was on the who was talking to his girlfriend after
the fact and admitted to lying about the sexual abuse.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
What about that component of information.
Speaker 4 (14:35):
Well, here's what I feel about that, which is like, also,
they did so much research on the show, So stuff
that was in there was correct. I never read the
book that she wrote. I was sort of like, I'm
staying on my defense track. But psychologically, there's something that
I can understand about that of like when you have
(14:56):
revealed your deepest, most unspeakable secret. I mean, first of all,
there is nothing more unspeakable than sexual abuse, especially when
you've come from a family where you are told your
entire life what you must never do is speak of something,
and then to share that, to reveal that, I think
(15:17):
there's like an automatic reaction to then want to protect
and defend and close up. I mean I even feel
that way, and I'm like therapized up the wazoo. But
when I have like a very vulnerable moment, there still
is the reaction afterwards to want to try to like
take it back or make a joke or do what
(15:38):
you know, there's a kind of a natural response to that.
And so in a way I understand where here's this
young man who's just revealed the most painful things and
the bravado of being like, I didn't you know, it
wasn't real. I don't remember what was said or what
was actually said, but I understand the emotional response to
(16:00):
want to close up, take it back, defend after revealing
something so unbelievably painful.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
Heart Yeah, because right after.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
The murders day, I think the biggest thing that was,
you know, they went on the shopping sprees, they spent
all this money.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
They were acting just.
Speaker 4 (16:15):
So they were dumb kids. I mean, right, they were
also dumb kids. But I also feel like I did
so much research about Leslie and I just think she's incredible,
and I guess for me, it's like to believe that
also they were not abused, means essentially that you think
(16:36):
she made that story up. And from all of my
research about her, like people had opinions about her, she
was a real firecracker and not everybody liked her, but
nobody ever called in to question her integrity ever with
any of her clients throughout her career about having to
(16:58):
make up stories of their life, like she's not a snake.
She's so brilliant. It's like she's too smart to have
to make up something like that on their behalf. In
my personal belief and defense of her.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
And did you have a lot of interaction with her?
Speaker 4 (17:13):
With Leslie now, sadly I've not talked to her.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
What are some other like surprising things that you learned
about her and doing the research.
Speaker 4 (17:22):
Well, one thing that I think is really fun is
that Joan Didion and John Gregory Dunn, who's Dominic Dunn's brother,
were like her best friends. And so I feel like
when you find out that Joan Didion is her best friend,
you're like, well, she's definitely no snooze, you know, Like
that's it that like tells you about a person you know,
(17:44):
and she you know, she went to law school in
the late sixties as a single mother and drove a
yellow Corvette, and she came from Queen's and her grandmother
was a labor organizer and organizing and fighting against the man,
(18:04):
and they were like a family that fought and you know.
And then her there was like a her father basically
like completely her parents were divorced, but then her father
completely disappeared from her life. They thought that he had
moved to Florida to have another family, and it turned
out that he was living like a couple blocks away,
(18:27):
and she didn't speak to him for thirty four years.
Oh and then during the trial, during the first trial,
she reconnected with her father, adopted a baby, and her
mother died like all during the first trial, which is
crazy to think about.
Speaker 3 (18:46):
Wow, it's amazing to think about people's lives, certain people's lives,
like you know, the backstory going to law school in
the sixties as a woman, just that alone, right, I
wonder what that was like in a yellow Corvette. I
wonder what kind of car Leslie Stall was driving at
that time.
Speaker 4 (19:01):
I know, let's get Leslie Stall on the phone.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Early cars.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
I reel like and when you go in, like when
you're playing such a character, because you want I mean,
I don't know, I'm not really an actor actor, So
when you're playing a character, you don't want to impersonate them, right,
You don't want to make a caricature.
Speaker 1 (19:19):
You want to do your version of them.
Speaker 4 (19:22):
Is that correct? Yes? Yes, I mean I definitely didn't. Yeah,
you don't want to do an impersonation. But also like
the juicyness of the opportunity of playing a real person,
being like I want to try to honor and get
down this person's essence and also you know, the rhythm
(19:43):
of how she spoke and where her voice was and
how she moves and all that stuff. But yeah, I
mean that was like the terror of working on it.
Myself and then showing up and you know, because I don't, like,
I don't work with a coach or anything. I do
this sort of like unconscious dream work that is its
(20:04):
own thing. But like I'd never heard myself do it
out loud basically until I showed up on set. I
mean I did it in the audition, but you know, auditions,
you're just kind of starting that process where you watch
like a couple videos and you know, I had listened
to her audio book, but yeah, I was so scared
(20:26):
because I was like, I don't know, am I doing
this right? I mean I sort of felt that way
throughout the whole shoot, Like we were still shooting episode eight,
and I remember saying to Ian Brennan, who is one
of the co creators of the show, and he was
also directing, and I just remember sort of standing there
and being like, do you think I'm good? And he
(20:47):
was like, what do you mean? The scene was good?
And I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, but I mean like,
do you think I'm good as Leslie? And he was like,
what are you talking about? Like you are Leslie? What
do you mean? And I was like, okay, this finess, man.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
How did you not you didn't what does the voice
or the accent? I mean, I mean on your own.
Speaker 4 (21:04):
Like I did kind of, but it's sort of like
I would hear it. I mean, and I was just watching.
I was watching everything with her. She wrote a book
and she also did the audio books, so I would
listen to that all the time. I would fall asleep
to her voice said policy to the book. And you know,
(21:25):
like there were days on set when I did it,
but especially in the very beginning, I had one day
of shooting and then I had I think three weeks
off or a month, and you know, those are the
dark days of the soul, when it's the interstitial time
where you're like, what have I done? Am I going
(21:46):
to be fired? Am I doing this right? And I
think because you do, like everybody kind of has their
own way of doing it, Like some people are watching
everything and trying to get it perfectly, Like there's some
videos from the trial that I wanted it to be
as close to the thing as possible. But then sometimes
(22:08):
people play real people, but they just are like, I'm
doing completely doing my own version of it, and they're
both right, you know, but it's just like a matter
of if it works within the context of the thing.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
But okay, go back to what you were saying. You
do some dream sequence. What did you just mentioned earlier
before that.
Speaker 4 (22:29):
Yeah, so there's this creative dream work I do, and
it sort of is about tapping into your unconscious as
a way of tapping into your creative source, like this
idea that sort of every character comes to you for
(22:49):
a reason and at this time, and it's like, what
are you able to explore sort of through this character
of this work. So some times you use an actual
dream and you sort of walk through the dream in
your mind. It's very it's very hard to describe, but
it's really powerful. And I sort of used the episode
(23:11):
five where me and Cooper Katchi plays Eric Menandez where
it's a one shot, one seen conversation with us in prison,
and sort of used that and walked through that, and
a lot of really interesting things came up for me
in that about anger, about like confronting and owning my
(23:33):
own anger. Because Leslie was somebody who is like very
in touch with her anger and would define herself as
a as a fighter, like a fighting type, and I'm
less of a fighting type, Like I have a lot
of anger, but it's not. You know, I think for
women it's hard to own anger. It's hard to know
(23:53):
or for me, for me just speaking for myself, where
it's it's there. But I think tapping into that and
owning that and holding that and that was such a
big part of I think where she was coming from
an episode five of like the anger of what they
had gone through and what there was parents like that
that was not what parenting was, and so there was
(24:14):
you know, it's it's a it's a deep way of
getting in touch with something without it being like, what's
my objective in the scene, you know, it's like a
deep right, right, I'm doing a great job. I think
I'm doing a very good job describing well.
Speaker 3 (24:29):
I mean, I've never heard about this before, so it's
my introduction. So that's okay. I don't have to fully understand.
I just wanted to get a sense of what you
were talking about. As soon as you said dream work,
I'm like, we're gonna need to go back to that
for a second. Yeah, Okay, We're going to take a
break and we'll be right back with Ari Grainer.
Speaker 6 (24:49):
And we're back with are you ready to give some advice?
Speaker 3 (24:53):
All r are you ready to give some at least
some of the Are you ready to give some legal advice?
Speaker 4 (24:57):
Because legal advice the most all advised dating advice. I
cannot way medical.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
You know we do a lot of that here.
Speaker 4 (25:04):
Oh I mean medical too, Yeah, no, I got it.
Speaker 6 (25:07):
Well, this it's so funny how sometimes things will come
up earlier in the episode that we then have questions about.
So our first question is a write in. It comes
from Wendy. Wendy says, Dear Chelsea, I am a woman
in the United States. I feel extremely unsafe with the
current administration. I'm a feminist and activist and have become
much more active since the DABS decision. I even host
(25:28):
a podcast about deconstructing patriarchy and living life on your
own terms. However, I feel compelled to move out of
this soon to be a shithole. My friend says, like
James Baldwin, I will regret leaving to better myself while
leaving everyone else behind.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
I disagree. At what point did people start leaving Germany.
Speaker 6 (25:47):
I can still do all feminist and activist interests while
living overseas. I can fly back and do keynotes, host
my podcast, and write my substack and talk on social media.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Do you think I'll regret moving out, Wendy.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
I would say, go for it.
Speaker 3 (26:01):
I personally, if you are not comfortable with what's happening,
you go, and if you have the means to go. Absolutely.
I think a lot of people are having these thoughts,
and I think you have to do what's right for
your sanity.
Speaker 4 (26:15):
Yeah, I agree with that. I agree with that, And
I don't know. I mean, it's so hard to know
of like all the specifics of what you're who you're leaving,
but it's also people. You still hold those people in
your life, you know, and there's there's other life to
be had, there's other experiences to be had, there's other
(26:36):
places to live, and I think, like fine, listening to
that voice is important. I mean, these are questions I
ask myself. Do I don't know, do you ask yourself
those questions?
Speaker 3 (26:46):
Jo Oh, absolutely, I'm thinking about it all the time.
I'm always thinking about it. I just watched Lee last night,
that Kate Winslet movie that. Yeah, it takes place during
World War Two and like the Rise of Hitler, her
whole life was happening during the Rise of Hitler.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
And she talks to the movie like the character.
Speaker 3 (27:03):
It happened so slowly, yet it happened so quickly, like
they watched it, but it didn't seem real. It seemed
like a dream. It seemed surreal, and then it was real.
And then you had to exist within that. And it's like,
how do you exist when Hitler's trying to take over
Europe and he's the most powerful man in Europe? And
she talks about living a life under that, like within that,
(27:25):
living a life and then choosing, And then she became
a war photographer because she had to do her part.
She felt so compelled to do her part. And whatever
your part is, you can still do that without being
in this country.
Speaker 1 (27:37):
I believe that. I don't think you have to be
here to fight.
Speaker 3 (27:40):
And I totally understand wanting to get out of here,
and I would say, if that's your inclination, go for it.
Speaker 1 (27:44):
You can.
Speaker 3 (27:44):
Of course, you're not gonna you know, the people in
your life or in your life, they're not going anywhere, but.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
You might be.
Speaker 3 (27:50):
And you know, if that's your decision, absolutely I totally
get it.
Speaker 4 (27:54):
I think you should go. Wendy, Yeah, I agree.
Speaker 6 (27:57):
I find myself wanting to sort of like bury my
head in the sand a little bit, and like, this
is not what Wendy's doing.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
She's like, I'm going to keep up the good fight.
Speaker 6 (28:04):
But if you need to remove yourself from the physical
location in order to like keep your stamina to keep
doing that, it's probably the right choice.
Speaker 4 (28:11):
Well, And fighting can look like a lot of different ways,
or resistance can look like a lot of different ways,
Like it's it doesn't just have to be what we
think of of, like fighting in a traditional sense, like
that can also be stepping outside of the norm or
what you think you're supposed to do and showing a
resistance about what feels right to you. Yeah, go, Wendy go.
(28:33):
Maybe I'll be following you.
Speaker 6 (28:35):
Yeah, And Wendy, send us the name of your podcast.
We'll put it in the show notes so people can
check it out. Our first color is Bree. Bree says
Dear Chelsea. I'm thirty five, and I've been in a
series of monogamous relationships since i was eighteen. I left
a tenure relationship with a great man who I still
adore as a friend, then fucked around and found myself
in a relationship with a raging alcoholic, then somehow ended
(28:57):
up in a relationship with a man. Child put myself
through the ringer and have been in therapy for two
and a half years to find out a lot about
myself as well as what I want in a partner.
A year and a half ago, I told my therapist
about all the qualities I wanted in a man, and boom,
I met him that night and can now finally say
I'm in a loving and healthy relationship with someone I
truly see a future with.
Speaker 2 (29:18):
He's a little.
Speaker 6 (29:19):
Older than me and has been ready to move in
together for a couple months. But here's a thing. I
love living alone and I'm having a very hard time
thinking about leaving my apartment and living with someone else again.
Help a sister out, how do I handle this?
Speaker 7 (29:33):
Bri?
Speaker 3 (29:33):
Hibri Hibri, Wow, Bri, I totally I feel you.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
This is our special guest today, Ari Grainer, Hi, I
feel you.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
And is there any way you can keep your apartment
while you move in with him?
Speaker 7 (29:50):
I mean I could, but it's so expensive where I live,
and like that would be The dream is to keep
my apartment, for sure, but I don't know how I
would work that financially.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
It is the only thing.
Speaker 4 (30:00):
Are you guys in the same city, so we're like.
Speaker 7 (30:03):
Forty five minutes apart, which I love because it's like
space and we both live by the ocean, so it's perfect.
But it's just like, yeah, so we're forty five minutes apart,
but the commute doesn't really bug us or anything.
Speaker 3 (30:15):
I honestly, I'm going to just say that I would
stay where you are. Thankes surprise here, I know, But
I would just say, any distance you can have with
you someone you love, you met this great guy, it
sounds perfect for you, and it sounds like you manifested
it like very quickly, and if you're really into and
(30:37):
you dig your alone time, I really would be hesitant
to give that up.
Speaker 4 (30:41):
I had to say my partner now that I've been
with for four and a half years, I live in
upstate New York and he lives in Seattle half the
time because he has a sixteen year old And I
don't know, after like a lot of relationships of like
serial monogamy, living with peoplelah blah blah, sometimes I think
it's harder to be with somebody all of the time
(31:04):
than it is to be away from each other sometimes,
and I don't know, I think it can look a
lot of different ways where you can have like a beautiful, full, intimate,
committed relationship and not have to live together all of
the time.
Speaker 8 (31:21):
Yeah, totally, I fully agree with you.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
Yeah, forty five minutes away is nothing like that is nothing.
I mean, I've been in so many long distance relationships
and they work great because there's not an overdose of
the person in my life. I want to miss someone,
you know, that's what makes me keep coming back. So
and you seem like that same type if you're saying that.
Speaker 4 (31:44):
Yeah, but you're saying it's too hard the financials of
holding onto this relationship, this apartment, now that's.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
So hard or no, I we can keep our living
situation as is. And that's the thing.
Speaker 7 (31:57):
I never want to live with someone just because it's
financially smart like that. I've done that and it's not
the right way to approach things. But yeah, I can
keep my spot now for as long as I want.
He can keep his spot. It's more just the he
wants to live together, and I'm like, I'm not ready.
Speaker 4 (32:13):
Can you can? Do you have the kind of work
life where you can go stay with him for you know,
like a week on, a week off kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (32:24):
Yeah, totally, totally. I work from home so it's easy.
Speaker 7 (32:27):
And my therapist she had mentioned doing like a trial run.
But even that, I'm like, I know I'm gonna want
to go home.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
Yeah, I know, I'm gonna want my space.
Speaker 3 (32:39):
Have you talked to him about it, like about your hesitancy?
Speaker 1 (32:43):
Yeah, he knows everything. He actually knows.
Speaker 7 (32:45):
I was asking you guys for advice too, and he
was like, good, get her advice, and I was like,
not agree with what you want.
Speaker 1 (32:51):
But I just think you have to.
Speaker 3 (32:52):
As women, we really have to listen to ourselves. And
sometimes we get swept away in an emotion and a
feeling and we make a decision and based on what
someone else wants for our relationship. And of course he
wants to live with you. Of course he wants to
see you every morning when you wake up. But if
that's not the type of person you are, and I
think this is more and more true for women everywhere.
You're going to end up presenting that, you're going to
(33:14):
end up feeling crowded, and you may sabotage the relationship,
not definitely, but possibly. So why even risk it if
you have a good thing going forty five minutes is nothing.
Speaker 4 (33:24):
And it's so chic to live apart, and it's like
both places can feel like a version of home, and
like having alone time is important, Like I feel like
that has been like the key pillar of my life
and healthy relationships has been like how much time I
need alone and reckoning with that because for so long
(33:45):
it felt like there was something wrong with me for
requiring the amount of alone time I need it And
it has nothing to do with the relationship or bearing
on any anything except that, like it's important autonomy. Alone
time is good and your relationship can flourish within that.
Speaker 3 (34:06):
So and then you can just spit it be like
this is how committed I am to you.
Speaker 1 (34:10):
I'm going to keep my apartment.
Speaker 3 (34:12):
Because I believe we're going to go like for the
long haul, and I want us, I want us to
be successful, and I think that's going to be part
of our success.
Speaker 6 (34:21):
Yeah, okay, I love the idea that our head of
like even if it's a few days on and a
few days off, or a week on and a week off,
like do it part time, but it doesn't have to
be like let's try it for six months.
Speaker 4 (34:31):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, especially forty five minutes away, you know,
and it's like a week. Yeah, like going there for
a week, then I have a couple of days, then
he can come there if he can, Like I don't know,
I've found that that's worked very well for me. And
now this feels like our home together, but also what
(34:54):
I can do how I feel, or like what I
can do for myself when I'm alone in my you know,
my week off. Well he's back. It's like I need
that time.
Speaker 8 (35:05):
Yeah, yeah, same.
Speaker 7 (35:06):
It's like a recharge for sure, and like a reset
and recenter and the whole thing.
Speaker 4 (35:09):
For sure.
Speaker 8 (35:10):
I completely agree.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
So I guess my question is, though, is like what
if it becomes a deal.
Speaker 8 (35:14):
Breaker and then I have to choose between the two?
Speaker 1 (35:17):
Do you think it will become a deal breaker?
Speaker 8 (35:19):
I think so in the future.
Speaker 4 (35:21):
Yeah, how long have you guys been together. We're coming
up on two years. Well, also, I feel like in
two years, who knows how you'll feel or how he feels, right,
you know, like in this moment, especially if maybe it's
you commit to different chunks of time together. So it's
thinking about doing like a week together and then three
(35:42):
days apart, and that like maybe there's a way to
structure some of that time, so you both know how
you are committed to spending big chunks of time together
while also having that time apart, and then you know
your feelings might change in a few years.
Speaker 3 (35:58):
Or commit to doing a month together and then teach
yourselves both a lesson because I'm sure by the end
of it you both want fucking three days off.
Speaker 1 (36:06):
Like you know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (36:09):
You can be like, sure, let's try. I'll come live
with you for one month straight and then let's discuss it.
Let's regroup and see how we both liked that, you know,
like experimentally.
Speaker 1 (36:18):
Yeah, I would definitely trust your gut.
Speaker 6 (36:21):
And if he does, make it a deal breaker, call
in and do a MINISOD for couples.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
Counseling and we'll do couples counseling.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
Love that idea fun?
Speaker 4 (36:27):
Perfect, right?
Speaker 2 (36:29):
Thanks?
Speaker 4 (36:29):
Okay, bye ba bye.
Speaker 1 (36:31):
I think.
Speaker 4 (36:33):
By the way, do you watch couples Therapy?
Speaker 1 (36:35):
I love it? I love it.
Speaker 3 (36:37):
I love watching therapy. It's the best me to or
not is such a good therapist? Yeah, I really's good.
Speaker 4 (36:46):
She is.
Speaker 3 (36:47):
Whenever they talk, whenever we see her personal life, I'm like, no, no,
I don't I don't want to see anything about her
personal life, like she's such a good therapist. I just
want to keep her in that little bubble, you know
what I mean, totally. Yeah, I don't want to know
that you have a son.
Speaker 1 (36:59):
I don't. I'm not interested she has.
Speaker 4 (37:01):
A son, I think so, I think she has a.
Speaker 2 (37:04):
Silars Yeah, don't.
Speaker 4 (37:08):
Well.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
Our next question comes from Catherine.
Speaker 6 (37:10):
I think she needs a little bit of like a
confidence boost here, so she says, Dear Chelsea, I went
through a bit of a hard time a few years ago,
and just this year started dating again.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
It's been a rollercoaster, for sure.
Speaker 6 (37:22):
I've had some people I've been interested in, dated, slept with,
but nothing's panned out. My workplace shares a building with
another company. I've had negative experiences in the past dating
coworkers and have a strict no coworkers policy for myself.
When I first started the job, I noticed a good
looking guy at the other company, but never had reason
to interact. He introduced himself to me when there was
(37:42):
a random fire in the building, and then a couple
months later, a weird accident led to him talking to
me again. We've chatted a few times since. Recently, he's
intentionally brought himself into my orbit, and I'm pretty sure
he's also interested. My issue is that even though we
don't work together, we share an open workspace.
Speaker 2 (37:59):
Second ish you.
Speaker 6 (38:00):
A different colleague of mine has proven to be a
bit of a gross person when it comes to at
work relations. Because my work crush and this colleague associate,
I can't help but worry that my crush shares the
same kind of locker room talk as this colleague. I
pride myself on my reputation at work, so everything in
me is screaming not to pursue it. But I don't
want to write off my first real crush in four years.
(38:21):
Should I give him a chance despite my colleague's bro talk?
Speaker 4 (38:24):
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
And this is also Catherine.
Speaker 1 (38:29):
So afterine what they're doing? What is all of this nonsense?
This is all noise? Get after it.
Speaker 8 (38:38):
This is this is the noisiest thing.
Speaker 3 (38:41):
I now will turn the fucking volume down and get
down to the basics. You are attracted to someone who
is attracted to you just because he has so. I
have a news flash for you, Like guys you're gonna
date are gonna have asshole friends, period.
Speaker 8 (38:56):
Friends. I don't even I've been talking to exactly.
Speaker 3 (38:58):
You don't even know if all of this is like supposition.
You're not even sure what's happening, and you're built, you're
making like eighty different blocks for you to get to
this person that may or may not even be true.
Speaker 4 (39:11):
You can also tell him, I mean you can also like,
this is what I love about getting like dating when
you're older is like you can also say the things
early on where I feel like, when you're young, you're
so afraid of saying a wrong thing that is like
gonna make somebody run. And then I feel like when
you get older, you're like, let me just say all
the things so like, and then you can decide what
(39:32):
you want to do, and I'll decide what I want
to do. And you can also be like I'm worried
about this, you know, or like here's a concern of
mine and just talking it through and who knows what
he'll say about it?
Speaker 1 (39:43):
And moreover, what makes you think that they are our friends?
Speaker 8 (39:46):
I kind of am not wired for workplace flirtations anymore.
No shit, I've definitely bumbled through those a little bit.
Speaker 5 (39:52):
I And anytime I was like, okay, you know, I
can work it in there, he's just like so dead
pan like about what's going on in our company. And
then I'm just like, Okay, well now it's not the
time for this kind of thing. And then just the
way that he speaks about my colleagues is kind of
what's hinting that there's really maybe not the best interaction there.
(40:13):
It's kind of just a we work in the same environment.
I'm going to keep the peace kind of thing. But
I also have to be very careful what I say
about that, because again I don't know him very well,
so maybe he's going to say what I've been saying
back to these people.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
Oh my god, oh my god, we have to ex
give you. You have to put your head in a
shampoo bowl and wash all of this garbage out. You
are just running around in circles in your head. You
like this guy, he likes you. Forget everything else you do.
Not even work together. First of all, I'm not against
that either workplace romance. It's like where adults supposed to meet,
they work together. That's where happened for me.
Speaker 1 (40:47):
So that's silly. That's a silly rule.
Speaker 3 (40:49):
And like all these rules you have are just kind
of like you have to work very hard at stripping
away all of this noise, and that's going to be
a practice for you, but you can do it.
Speaker 6 (40:58):
I think you should just go ask him out, because
he's made it clear you don't want to like let
it go too long, and then he's like feeling like he's.
Speaker 1 (41:04):
Send him send him an email. Go just listen. It
seems to like to me that you're being very flirtatious.
Speaker 3 (41:09):
If you want to ask me on a date, let
me know and I can respond very straightforward.
Speaker 8 (41:14):
I go to work on that, yeah.
Speaker 4 (41:17):
Or just be like, do you want to get a
drink after work or something?
Speaker 8 (41:21):
I finished work at eleven, He's done a five point
thirty like pm PM.
Speaker 3 (41:26):
Okay, Well, would you be comfortable writing an email like that?
I mean, I know you wouldn't be, but would you
do it?
Speaker 5 (41:31):
I'm definitely better like writing than I asked initially. I'm
better at interacting with people with words using like email,
and then I can once because he hasn't really had
a chance to see my personality yet, because I've been
so like, I have this professional face I have to
put on, so I haven't really been able to show
my funny side or like the actual me side, which
(41:52):
is and all.
Speaker 1 (41:53):
The voices in your head. You haven't been able to
show him that either.
Speaker 8 (41:55):
I know they're just there. You know, they never take
a vacation.
Speaker 3 (41:59):
Well, I think you should send him an email and
just put it out there.
Speaker 1 (42:02):
Put it out there.
Speaker 3 (42:03):
You're going to get the response that you want, and
then you can start dealing with all of these other
issues that you're creating or let them fall away as
you start to get to know him, and then you
can get to know if he's like that or if
he's like your friend. I'm still confused as to why
you think that. I don't think you really answered that question,
Like why do you think this guy that you have
a crush on is friends with your work colleague?
Speaker 8 (42:26):
Because they all they've all mentioned him before in some context.
Speaker 5 (42:30):
They're having these interactions that aren't work related. So I
just I kind of just have to assume that maybe
there's a friendly interaction outside of the workplace as well,
because I don't a.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
Lot of assumptions, a lot of assumptions.
Speaker 4 (42:42):
I think it's like go see like see each other outside,
see what the because also you might not even it's
like him, You might not even like him, you know,
or he might be the love of your life. You
don't know, but you got to get out of that
office to know.
Speaker 3 (42:55):
Yeah, listen, you have one life to live one okay,
so make it fucking count and work in your best interest.
No one is going to find love for you. You
have to find it for you.
Speaker 8 (43:06):
Well, they're trying, they're trying. They're failing, but they're trying.
Who's day, my friends, they're invested in my love life.
Speaker 1 (43:13):
That's great. I'm glad they're invested.
Speaker 3 (43:15):
But you can't rely on other people to find you
have the person here. So just don't you need to
go and send that email and I need you to
report back to us also, of course, let us know
what happens.
Speaker 8 (43:26):
Okay, Well, absolutely, thank you.
Speaker 4 (43:28):
Very Also, congrats on having a crush. A crush is
so fun.
Speaker 8 (43:31):
At the beginning, not now.
Speaker 3 (43:33):
Yeah, well you could extend, but you can extend the crush,
I mean, the flirtation can keep going and going and
going until you go out, and even then, it's just
so fun, you know, flirting back and forth, especially over email,
that's my favorite.
Speaker 5 (43:46):
Yeah, I just wish it wasn't in a public space
that people.
Speaker 1 (43:50):
Yeah, well, you wish a lot of things.
Speaker 4 (43:52):
I know I do.
Speaker 1 (43:53):
Yeah, Okay, all right, keep ust posted.
Speaker 4 (43:57):
Bye bye.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
They're going to get married and have lots of.
Speaker 2 (44:01):
Of course they are.
Speaker 4 (44:02):
Of course, I really want to find out what happens.
Speaker 6 (44:05):
We will definitely check back in with her in a
couple of weeks and see what happened.
Speaker 2 (44:08):
What was her name, Catherine?
Speaker 6 (44:10):
She's a Katherine Elizabeth, just like oh and spelled all
the right ways. Well, we have one more question, but
we could take our little break and then come back.
Speaker 2 (44:17):
It's a gesy one.
Speaker 3 (44:18):
Okay, we'll be right back with Ari Greener. We're back
to we have one more question.
Speaker 1 (44:27):
We have one more caller question.
Speaker 4 (44:29):
Yes, this is so fun.
Speaker 1 (44:31):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (44:32):
It's the dream, especially when it's real. It's like sometimes
we get some questions and I'm like, what the fuck
are they asking me that for? Like, you know, but
some questions. I love interpersonal affairs. I love like breaking
up or getting the finding a crush. That was one
of my favorite topics. Like that will be.
Speaker 4 (44:51):
What to do about a crush?
Speaker 2 (44:53):
More crush questions?
Speaker 4 (44:54):
Yes, my favorite.
Speaker 6 (44:56):
Well, this question comes from Sarah Dear Chelsea. About a
year ago, my husband and I went away for a
few nights. My mother in law stayed at our house
to watch our small children sleeping in our bed to
stay close to the baby. When I returned, I noticed
that my journal, which I keep in my nightstand, had
obviously been tampered with. The strap was in a different
(45:17):
place than usual, my worksheets from therapy were not where
I left them, etc. It was totally shaken. My husband
handled it and addressed it with my mother in law.
She denied reading it and said she didn't touch it.
I had postpartum depression with my second child as well
as a recent rocky patch with my husband where I
relied heavily on my journal to process.
Speaker 8 (45:36):
Oh.
Speaker 6 (45:36):
It makes me sick to my stomach to think of
my mother in law reading my most intimate thoughts I
used to enjoy looking back on previous years and memories
I've written about. Every year, I write a letter to
my children on their birthday. I never knew if I
was going to give these to them, but it was
my most intimate thoughts about motherhood and reflecting on each
year with them. These letters were for me alone and
possibly one day my children. It makes me very upset
(45:59):
thinking she read something that was supposed to be between
me and my daughters. I've come to terms with her denial,
and I don't believe I will ever fully know the truth.
How do I continue to use journaling as part of
my toolbox and staying regulated and well. I wrote in
this journal every day for four years, and since that event,
I haven't been able to pick it up again. I
really loved this part of my day and it helped
(46:20):
my mental health in a big way. It doesn't feel
like a safe place anymore. Looking back on past years
now makes me angry thinking of her reading those thoughts.
I tried to buy a brand new journal and start fresh,
but I still have a mental block and can't move forward.
Is there any way I can get past this and
start using this coping skill that helped me through some
dark times?
Speaker 2 (46:38):
Sarah?
Speaker 3 (46:40):
Yeah, absolutely. First of all, you have to start journaling again.
This is not your issue. This is your mother in
law's issue. She opened your book. You cannot control her.
She opened your journal. She invaded your privacy, so it
is up to you to take your power back. I
can guarantee you she's not going to do it again
after she she's been called out. But you have to
get a new journal and just start practicing this is
(47:03):
something that is giving you such relief and such comfort
that you can go to this place and write in
your journal each night and write this beautiful letter to
your daughters each year on their birthdays.
Speaker 1 (47:12):
That is such a beautiful thing to even hear.
Speaker 3 (47:15):
Like, You've got to keep going and do not let
someone else's misstep create your own misstep. You know, you
keep going and do whatever you need to do, and
if it doesn't feel right the first couple times, keep
doing it.
Speaker 1 (47:31):
Just keep writing into your journal until you get back
to your safe space.
Speaker 9 (47:34):
What do you think, Ari, Yeah, I mean, there's nothing
more like that. That kind of writing has also been
transformative for me. And you can't give that away to her.
Speaker 4 (47:47):
You can't give that power to her or to That's
a that is something to reclaim for yourself. Absolutely, it's
a beautiful, beautiful practice. I totally get what a hard
marbal invasion that is and how hard that is, but
I feel like it's it's like when you'll fall off
a horse. Like when somebody falls off a horse and
(48:07):
they're like, I just have to get back up there
so that I'm not afraid to ever do it again.
It's like even if the writing in the beginning is
like I hate this, this feels wrong. I don't want
to do this, like just writing the honesty through it
to get to the upper side, because that's for you. You
got to keep that.
Speaker 1 (48:27):
Yeah, girl, don't let your mother in law take you down.
Speaker 6 (48:29):
And I wonder too, if there's like a way to
upend it and like create a different ritual around it,
like doing it at a different time of day than
you used to it, doing it in a different place
like maybe used to write in bed, go to a
cozy chair, like really changing your ritual around it. Maybe
it's like saging your journal, like do something that creates
a different energy around it. And then yes, like start
with where you're at, like I'm angry that this happened.
(48:52):
I'm upset that this happened.
Speaker 3 (48:53):
But you just also you have to realize you're holding
onto these emotions that are not your fault. These are
hurt These are her issues, not your issues. She was
being nosy, she had no boundaries. That doesn't change who
you are. You're choosing to allow her to disrupt this
connection you had with yourself, and that's on you.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
You have to choose to move forward.
Speaker 3 (49:16):
And you have to choose to be like, I'm bigger
than this and I'm going to get past this. And yes,
I understand you're upset, but don't let her take your
power away.
Speaker 4 (49:24):
I also wonder if there's a way of like writing
a letter to her that you have no intention of
ever giving, but just of a reprocessing of saying all
the things out loud about you know, out loud via
writing about how that made you feel like that, just
to get that out, just to keep working through that too,
(49:46):
to sort of anything that's left over in the mind
of like you made me never want to do this again.
My trust is gone, you know, whatever that is that
you'll never ever give to her, but just as a
way of also get that part of your feeling out.
Speaker 2 (50:01):
Of your brain and then put that letter in your
journal and she'll read it.
Speaker 3 (50:07):
Thank you, Ari Grainer, Thank you so much for being
here today.
Speaker 1 (50:11):
What a delight.
Speaker 4 (50:12):
Thank you so much for having me. This was like
such a joy. I love you and I'm like just
so happy I got to be here. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (50:19):
I hope I see you soon.
Speaker 4 (50:21):
You too. Okay, you're back at Jenny and Jason's. Okay,
bye you guys.
Speaker 1 (50:24):
Bye byeks. Do do do do do.
Speaker 3 (50:28):
Do drum roll, Catherine, please, Chelsea Handler Abroad. Abroad is
my European tour, which I just announced yesterday. Tickets go
on sale tomorrow or today or there's a pre sale
code Chelsea. So I'm coming to obviously find.
Speaker 1 (50:47):
A husband abroad.
Speaker 3 (50:48):
I need to get the health out of this fucking country.
And it's not as easy as you think. So I'm
coming to Rekuvic, I'm coming to Dublin. I'm coming to
the UK, coming to Brussels, Paris, Belfast in May and June.
I'm coming to Oslo, Stockholm, to Copenhagen, Manchester, London, Glasgow,
(51:10):
New Zurich, Vienna. I've never ever been to Vienna, Berlin,
Barcelona and Lisbon.
Speaker 1 (51:17):
I'm coming abroad is abroad that.
Speaker 2 (51:20):
Sounds like fun. I'm gonna go see you abroad.
Speaker 3 (51:22):
I I know I want to go see me abroad
and there all be there, All be okay, all Upcoming
Vegas dates March twenty first, April eighteenth, July fifth, August thirtieth,
November one and twenty ninth at the Cosmopolitan of Las Vegas.
Speaker 1 (51:39):
My book tour. I'll have what she's having.
Speaker 3 (51:40):
Means I am doing book events only book events Northvale,
New Jersey, on February twenty fourth, February twenty fifth at
the ninety second Street Y, February twenty sixth, Brookline Booksmith,
February twenty seventh, Cincinnati, Ohio, February twenty eighth at the
h Foundation in Chicago, and Barnes and Noble at The
Girl in Los Angeles on March first, and then Seattle,
(52:03):
Washington on March third, Elliott.
Speaker 1 (52:05):
Bay and I'll see you guys all there.
Speaker 6 (52:08):
If you'd like advice from Chelsea, shoot us an email
at Dear Chelsea podcast at gmail dot com and be
sure to include your phone number. Dear Chelsea is edited
and engineered by Brad Dickert executive producer Catherine Law and
be sure to check out our March at Chelseahandler dot
com
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