August 13, 2025 • 38 mins
In this episode, Diosa and Mala review plastic surgery trends, Instagram face, and even Mar-A-Lago face. From A-list celebs to influencers, elective cosmetic surgery is more available than ever before. Together, Diosa and Mala discuss beauty standards, surgeries gone wrong, and the pressure to age "gracefully."
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Already yo, ohlola, look amorees, I'm Theosa.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
And I'm Mala and today I'm thinking about getting some filler.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
No, girl, don't do it. Why don't do it? I mean,
do you, but also don't do.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
It because it's going to ruin my face?
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Right it could?
Speaker 2 (00:20):
It could?
Speaker 1 (00:21):
It quite often does not always, but sometimes.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Yeah, it's a hot topic. It's very trendy, been trendy.
But I think there's a lot of risks and complications
and migrations and bad things that can happen if not
done correctly with the right doctor.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
Yes, I think about the upkeep because there was a
time in my early twenties where I really wanted to
get my boobs done and then I thought, damn well,
I'd have to do it like every ten years because
you have to change them. Yeah, do I want to
do that for the rest of my life? Right? Probably not?
And so I didn't do it. Now. Don't get me wrong.
(00:58):
There are times I still think about it, Okay, but
I think probably I will probably not do it.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
I feel like that's one of those things where like
it feels like, once I get this procedure done, I'm
going to feel so much better. I'm gonna be happier,
I'm gonna love myself more. I'm gonna love the way
of looking close. I think about that too with teeth,
with people getting their teeth done so young. Yeah, and
(01:25):
then it's like you're gonna go in and have to
get new veneers put on again every ten years for
the rest of your life. It's such a lifelong commitment
to elective surgery.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
Yes, yeah, because it's elective, right, it's not reconstructive. And
I think in today's episode we want to dive into
the why why do we feel the pressure to change
these things? And just because we can, does it mean
we should?
Speaker 2 (01:49):
That's I think really the foundation of today's episode. It's
like the ultimate practice of free will, you know, changing
the way that you look surgically semi permanently. You can,
but should you? And this reminds me of a story
of my mom who was also considering like a cosmetic procedure.
(02:11):
So my mom has a like a second cousin, a
great cousin, I guess you would say, who is a
plastic surgeon in Guadalahada. And he's like in his late eighties,
early nineties, and one time he came to visit, and
she has always complained about like the size of her smile.
So she asked him if he thought that it would
(02:31):
be possible to widen her smile by just like cutting
a little bit on each side of her mouth to
like make her smile bigger. And he said to her, well,
technically I could. However, your lips are not made out
of skin, They're made out of membrane. So to complete
the look, I would have to take membrane from your anus,
(02:52):
which is the only other place on the body where
like you can find membrane, and then take the membrane
from your anus and add it to your lips. And
then my mom said, oh, well, then I'll really be
talking out of my ass, and she decided not to
do it. She decided not to go for it. It
just wasn't a great option after all. And I think
that that for me also was this example of like
(03:13):
it might sound like a good idea, but what is
the nitty gritty, What is the actuality? What does it
actually take to achieve that cosmetic look? You know visa
v surgery?
Speaker 1 (03:23):
Yeah, and you know, there is so much content on
the internet dedicated now to documenting the plastic surgery process
for either transparency or just straight up sharing. Right, But
before we dive into that, we want to do a
quick historical review on when humans started getting plastic surgery,
(03:43):
from ancient times, older times to current day.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
And I didn't realize that cosmetic surgery has been taking
place for centuries. Actually, it's not just something that started
in the eighties, you know, with celebrities seeds, you know,
like our modern culture by quite a bit.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Yeah, And the first known plastic surgery, which was a
precursor of the nose job, was actually in fourteen sixty AD,
which is wild. And you know, also we're talking about
modern plastic surgery in today's episode. But there have also
been different ways that women in particular have used different
beauty procedures or like body morphing, if you will, from
(04:27):
like tying their feet to like wearing really really tight corsets.
Plastic surgery is not the only way I think women
have tried to change their bodies.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Body modification in general, whether it be surgical or like
you said, using tools like corsets and fajas.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
For example, Yes, we love a faha.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
We do love a faha, and fa haas also have
other benefits not just for like tightening the waiste, but
after childbirth. Yeah, there's a lot of cultures, and I
know this is true for a lot of Latin American
cultures where you know, fahja after you give birth, so
that your guts go back into place and it holds
everything in and it helps you to get your shape back.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
Yes. Yeah, And there's so many different uses of fajas,
of elective surgery, of cosmetic surgery. And actually it was
in nineteen thirty to the nineteen forties where the American
Society of Plastic Surgeons was founded, and originally plastic surgery
was used for reconstruction for burn victims, for injury victims
(05:30):
of war, and it was during that time that there
was also the first experimentation with breast augmentation. So it
goes back. Don't go anywhere, locomotives, We'll.
Speaker 2 (05:41):
Be right back, and we're back with more of our episode. Now.
So many different places that cosmetic surgery has gone, I mean,
from the rhinoplasty to the BBL. I mean, people can
completely change their entire face, their entire body. And over
(06:04):
the years there have been examples, especially of celebrities, people
in the public eye who have seemingly completely transformed the
way that they look, and some of them all at once,
like Heidi Montag famously, or some over a period of time,
with a little bit here, a little bit there.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
Yeah, And I think the little bit here, a little
bit there is always the type that gets the most praise, right.
I think of like a Jennifer Lopez allegedly allegedly nothing
on the record that she's ever had done, but I
can imagine someone as resourced as her and who looks
as fantastic as she does. Hate or no, hate has
gotten a little jug here and there where it's super gradual,
where nobody really notices. Famously, there are a couple actresses
(06:45):
in mind that I was thinking of when we were
prepping for this episode, notably because I remember being a
young girl and hearing that they had quote bad work done,
that their faces were completely changed by the type of
work that they did, and that it affected them being
able to get work because then they were quote unrecognizable.
(07:05):
And one of those women is Meg Ryan rom Com
Queen Famously and You've got Male Sleepless in Seattle had
a very i would say, prolific career in the eighties
and nineties as like the lead protagonist in some of
our favorite rom coms. And then once she got a facelift.
I remember it was talked about in the tabloids in
(07:27):
the media like it was a bad facelift, she ruined
her face. And I would say also, someone that for
me always stuck out in my mind was Jennifer Gray
who starred as Baby in Dirty Dancing opposite Patrick Swayze.
And she had a beautiful face, and she had a
(07:47):
very particular shape of her nose. It was very unique
to her, definitely a unique beautiful face, and she got
a nose job. Assumedly this was an insecurity for her.
It was probably pointed out to her by casting directors.
She got a nose job and then quote ruined her
face because she was unrecognizable and nobody wanted to cast her.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
And it's so strange because on the one hand, those actresses,
like you said, were probably getting negative feedback about their faces,
and then once they underwent surgery, the negative feedback continued. Yeah,
you can't make anyone happy. On the flip side, you
have someone like Barbara streisand who forever people have asked
her why she didn't get a nose job, Why not
(08:32):
change your nose, because I think Barbara and Jennifer Gray
actually had a very similar look.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Yeah. I also would say, like Sarah Jessica Parker, yes,
has a very unique, very beautiful nose and has never
changed it, even though casting directors have told her like,
you should probably get a nose job.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
Yeah, it's like sabotage. Yeah, it's sabotage because in those
very same people, once the nose job is done, now
they don't want to cast you. Of course, it's awful.
And I think for Barbara Streisand in particular as a singer,
as a vocalist, to change her nose would would change
her singing, you know, and the way that she sounds
when she's singing. So I love Barbara Streisand for and
(09:10):
it's crazy to say, like, oh I love her for
taking a stand and not changing her nose. Yeah, but
and just being herself. Yeah, but in the industry that
she's in and that we're in, sometimes like that's that's
like an act of resistance.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Yeah, I mean, and I think, like to kind of
go further, obviously we're talking about white women and who
have gone through these very public transformations and because also
having very public careers. It also raises the question like
the pressures that maybe Latina actresses and women of color
black women feel, the pressure also to look a certain way,
(09:48):
to maintain a certain type of beauty standard, and just
the eurocentrism of it all right, the hierarchy of like
the skin of skin, color, colorism that exists no matter
like if you are a woman of color or black woman,
having a smaller nose, having the straight hair, and how
that can all play into either casting or that pressure
to look a certain way and to conform to a
(10:10):
beauty standard that is may may not even be of
like your own culture or standard for your own family. Even.
Speaker 2 (10:17):
Yeah, absolutely, I've seen some talk of like ethnic nose jobs, yes,
so that they're not giving you like a button nose,
but a nose that's more in alignment with your cultural
background and the natural ethnic features that you might already have.
Somebody that people talk about is having a very subtle
ethnic nose job is Beyonce Yes. And you know, people,
especially on TikTok, will point out the before and afters
(10:39):
from when she was very very young to the current day.
And I see people say like, oh, I miss Beyonce's
old nose, but it's not super obvious in interface. I
think she got a very very very subtle RHINOPLASTI done interesting. Yeah,
and there's others other women of color on TV. Julie Chen,
news anchor who had a pretty extreme I don't know
(11:02):
what exactly she did to her face, but when you
look at the before and afters, she is another one
who looks basically unrecognizable.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
And also Julie Chen has been public about public now
talking about the plastic surgery she's had, especially the plastic
surgery she had when she was only twenty five years old.
She had a double lid procedure to quote help her
career after her agents suggested it and her boss said
her eyes made her look quote disinterested and quote too Chinese.
(11:31):
She says, I got some blowback within my own family
before I had it. I had a sister who thought
it was denying my heritage and she thought it was ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Yeah, I mean, and so that's an example of someone
who is not only changing their face for like job opportunities,
but job opportunities that are like maybe being denied or
gate kept because of white supremacy and white supremacist beauty
standards specifically.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
Yeah, And I think.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
That's an important piece for all of this is I
don't know that people are necessarily getting plastic surgery to
look more like their ethnic group, right. I think quite
often it's the opposite, is to look less like the
people that they come from.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
Yeah. And then there's like this amalgamation, right, It's like
bigger lips, right, smaller nose, more prominent cheekbones, maybe an
eye lift, and so it's an amalgamation of different cultures
and beauty on one faced where you may not even
look like the ethnic background that you actually are.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
Yeah. This also brings into play like accusations of basically
cosmetic blackfishing, especially for people like the Kardashians. Yes, and
that's a topic that's been out there for a while now,
especially with like Kylie Jenner and Chloe Kardashian and Kim
Kardashian and the bbls and the lip filler and the
(12:56):
way that they do their hair and the type of
glam that they're putting on and the men that they date, Like,
the whole thing is a very odd blackfishing, white supremacist
approach to body modification.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
Yeah, And I think it's also really interesting when there's
photos I've seen of Chloe Kardashian and I've literally thought
to myself, is that gottle G screaming? And it's not.
It's Chloe Kardashian.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
You know what, they do kind of have a similar look.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
Now that you say that, I mean in gottle G assumedly,
I don't know. It looks like she's had a little
judged here and there right on her face. And so
I'm like, yeah, I can see the Instagram face of
it all right, looking everyone looking the same.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
In some ways, like a filter.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
Yeah. And I think, you know, we're starting with these
broader examples or quote like bigger people, celebrities, folks that
are more resourced. But I think now more than ever,
plastic surgery and cosmetic procedures are more accessible. And now
we see influencers, Now we see reality TV stars, I quote,
(14:00):
regular people having access and now looking like celebrities almost
or just looking like not your average girl anymore.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Yes, the girl the girl next door look is no more.
It's gone. But I think we go in and out
of it. Yes, And it's that ever changing goalposts. The
goalpost is always moving.
Speaker 1 (14:20):
Yeah, we're seeing it, we're living in real time. It's flipping.
It was the curvy, big booty girl, right, the BBL girl,
and now it's the skinny girl.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
It's back to like nineties heroin chic. Yes, yeah, and
it's it's it's also really tragic to see, like on
the way over here, in doing a little bit more
research on this, looking at tiktoks of women posting about
how they regret their BBL, and that's a very common.
There's very common types of content where it's follow me
(14:51):
on my BBL journey, follow me in maintaining my BBL.
I regret my BBL, you know. And it seems to
be this y very like common pattern of doing it,
liking it for a little bit, and then regretting it
and how do I fix it? How do I undo it? So,
for example, there is this one TikTok influencer that I
(15:12):
have followed for some time, gorgeous girl Jayleen Oh hey
that and she is a total baddie, known for her
gorgeous face, for her body, and she does meet and
greets and she does content, and she's a beauty queen.
She's known for being beautiful. Last year in twenty twenty four,
she was on the podcast circuit and she went on
(15:33):
Laplatica to talk about a botched plastic surgery that she
got in Ukraine and how as a result of this
surgery she developed Bell's palsy in her face. And Bell's
palsy is a type of facial paralysis and it can
be like semi permanent, it can go away eventually, but
(15:54):
you know, it changes the way your face looks because
you're like nerves are not working anymore. And which she
explained is that as a result of trying to get
a nose job in Ukraine, a nerve was cut in
the wrong way and that created Bell's palsy in her face.
So this girl who was already known for being gorgeous,
already famous for being gorgeous, already had millions of followers
(16:15):
across her platforms, for whatever reason, felt like she needed
to be more beautiful, like she wasn't beautiful enough, and
as a result, she developed this condition which impacted her beauty.
And it's just this vicious cycle that you hate to see.
And this is not somebody who is in movies or
on TV shows, but she is still viewed by millions
and millions of people on our phones.
Speaker 1 (16:38):
I think what makes plastic surgery elective procedure very different
from let's say the nineties or even the early two
thousands is how often we're seeing our own selves and
how that can make us so self conscious. Right, normally
we would take photos, right or back in the day,
right with our digital cameras, we would take photos. Now
we have access to like the selfies, right, we're making videos,
(17:02):
We're making videos of ourselves or even like we come
out in people's videos, right, and so there's this constant
bombardment of your own face that I don't know we're
supposed to really see that often. You know, It's like
there was there was a time where you could like
look at yourself in the mirror. Right before the invention
of technology, you looked at yourself in the mirror and
(17:23):
you saw your face, right, And then now that has
evolved over time with technology, with the phones, with cameras,
now with video, and so there's just constant access to
just examine everything on your face, good or bad. And
so I can see it goes back to what we
were saying at the top of the conversation, where getting
this procedure may not actually make you happy, right, You
(17:46):
may not actually feel you may feel more quote beautiful temporarily,
but was it ever really about that?
Speaker 2 (17:54):
Yeah? And I think it's something really important to note
is that the cameras, the lenses, I mean a lens
can do so much to distort the image that it's capturing. Lenses, lights,
like a camera camera versus a phone camera, and different
types of cameras, Like, you're gonna look different in every
(18:15):
single image because every single camera is like working differently,
and so you never truly know what you look like
if you are looking at yourself through the eyes of
a lens. And there are so many different types of
lenses and even mirrors, right, Like, you know, in some
mirrors you look tall and slender, and in other mirrors
you feel like you look shorter, you know. And there
(18:37):
are good mirrors and bad mirrors, and we can notice this.
So when we see our reflections, are we ever seeing
an accurate reflection of what we actually look like?
Speaker 1 (18:47):
Right? It's like the fun house in our pocket is
how it feels. It is. Every waking moment you can
get a different image of yourself, a different angle of yourself.
There are moments where I have like a and open
my camera and I'm like, oof, who I do not
need to see myself from that angle, right, And then
of course there's the more pos Yes, I put makeup
(19:09):
on and I feel beautiful today, so I'm going to
take a photo. Of course that's going to look like
the best version of myself. You know, That's what I'm
putting out there, and so I can see, like why
we're in this cycle. I feel so grateful to be
at this age where we have that in between of
growing up outside of the internet right before the social
media is what it is today. But I think of
(19:30):
someone like my niece growing up with social media, and
you know, she's constantly at Sephora. She's sixteen years old.
I don't blame her. I don't blame her. And she
doesn't wear a lot of makeup, but like that is
already in her zeitgeist of the brands and the beauty products,
and she knows like what's popular right now, and so
that's very much a part of her experience as an
(19:51):
adolescent girl.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
Yeah, like middle schoolers having a ten step skincare routine
and they're using collagen and Higler on a acid and
all kinds of things that they're like young skin just
does not need.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
No little baby faces. They have all the collagen.
Speaker 2 (20:06):
They have all of the collagen. But and that's a
really fascinating trend too, is like young girls really dedicating
time and whatever their allowance is to like really extensive
skincare routines. So it's starting really really young.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
Don't go anywhere, lookamotives.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
We'll be right back, and we're back with more of
our episode.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
On the other side of social media influencers, We've talked
about the celebrities, the reality TV stars, the influencers. Then
we have Republican lawmakers who very visibly have filler and treatments.
This has also been called the Mara Lago face, which
I think is really interesting and that I want us
to spend a little time on. Is like the plastic
(20:55):
surgery and the gender norms that are specific being reinforced
by some of the Republican lawmakers and folks in the
Trumpet administration.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
Yeah, like, why do we have politicians looking like straight
ig batties? Why?
Speaker 1 (21:11):
So?
Speaker 2 (21:11):
There was a really funny TV segment where comedian Amber
Ruffin is looking at before and after pictures of Republican
women and their cosmetic surgeries. It's a segment called Have
I Got News for You on CNN. It's hosted by
Roy Woods Junior. And the way that Amber Ruffin is
reacting to these before and after pictures for Republicans is like,
(21:33):
why are we having these like reality TV experiences with
our elected officials? Yeah, because of cosmetic surgery. And what's
so funny about the segment is a we can make
fun of these women because I think that politically they
are grotesque, and they are grotesque because of the laws
that they are passing, because of the violence that they
(21:53):
are enacting on our communities and on marginalized peoples. So
I don't feel bad for laughing at their face, honestly,
but they're also grotesque because of what they've done to
their faces. They are essentially taking their i think, what's
considered to be feminine features and doing it to a
(22:14):
degree that is almost cartoonish.
Speaker 1 (22:17):
Yeah, we're thinking the long blow dried like big hair, right,
false eyelashes, lots of mascara, filler in the cheeks, filler
in the lips, and it is presenting this type of
maga beauty. And then in turn, you see MEGA supporters
also looking that way as well. And I've seen on
(22:40):
TikTok some white maga women saying like, it's never been
hotter to be a conservative. It's the liberals. Progressives wish
they could look like us, literally.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
But these looks are like. But also these be okay
because at the same time, the high glam, I think
is also coming from a left liberal place.
Speaker 1 (23:02):
Absolutely, the lux.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
The glam, the hyper feminine beauty aesthetics are not only
coming from like a left liberal place, but I also
think are coming from kind of like a subculture like
exotic dancers, you know, strippers, drag queens, drag queens, sex workers.
There are also there's there's conversation on TikTok as well
(23:26):
about how a lot of the hyper hyper feminine cosmetic
procedures were really popularized and perfected by transgender women right
undergoing different types of gender affirming cosmetic procedures. So for
that all of that to now trickle into Republican like
beauty standards, it's all black mirror stuff.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
Christine Nome, the Secretary of Homeland Security, had her teeth redone.
A Republican strategist told The New York Times that she
meaning Christy Nome is showing Trump that she works well
in front of the camera, that she has that star
power he wants on stage with him, while fitting into
the mode of women in the Trump universe. And she
did get elected or appointed, appointed and confirmed into the
(24:12):
Secretary of Homeland Security position. And as we know, she's
been in loss that she was in Los Angeles and
she was like pretending to film a reality TV show.
She was in the city of Huntington Park terrorizing families
with a camera crew.
Speaker 2 (24:26):
Yeah, and a full beat.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
And a full beat, and so there is it's like,
it is that deep. Actually, like actually, let's go there,
Let's have this conversation of how they're also the horrible.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
People, Yeah, at the exact same time. And it's remembering
that Donald Trump comes from a reality TV background. Yeah,
he literally was a reality TV star with The Apprentice
and like many many seasons, And so he has an
eye for what is gonna what's gonna play on TV,
what's gonna play on screen, what's entered hating, what's glitzy,
(25:01):
what's glamorous. So the White House is now the set
of a reality TV show in a lot of ways.
And lawmakers and Republican women are really behaving and presenting
in ways that are not that different from your average
reality TV star. You know someone on Love Island, someone
on Ninety Day Fiance who after the first season, they
(25:23):
see themselves on TV and then they show up to
the reunion looking completely different because now, oh I'm on screen,
Now let me get some work done.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
Yeah. And I think it goes back to we can
see that transformation on air on TV from regular looking
people turning into quote, celebrities at least visibly right to
the eye. We see that transformation documented throughout the seasons.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
I think we can take this entire conversation and apply
it directly to us to look at thought our radio
and the fact that we have been recording video of
our studio sessions for TikTok for YouTube for socials, which
has not always been part of our podcasting experience and
actually is one of the reasons why I have always
(26:10):
loved podcasting, because in the beginning, there wasn't that external
pressure to record ourselves on video. While we were recording
our episodes, it was way more about what are we
talking about, the storytelling, the content, the theme, the topic,
and now we're in this place where to promote the
(26:32):
show to connect with our audience, video is very much
essential because we're on video forward platforms. But what does
that end up meaning for us? We feel like we
need to have a look. I feel like I need
to have lashes on and makeup, and my hair needs
to be done and my nails need to be done
because video really lives forever, and people might not go
(26:54):
into our Apple podcast or Spotify feed and leave disparaging
comments there, but on video content they absolutely will. And
that's something that I think, I know I want to avoid,
and it feels like really important to be glam and
beautiful on video.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
On the podcast, Yeah, I definitely feel a different pressure
and a different awareness of myself that I did not
have when we would come into the studio, whether that
was at Aspasio or early on of our network seasons,
because yeah, I do always try to show up with
like a beat face and a cute look, but now
(27:34):
it's like, do I have to look at the camera?
And then when I'm watching clips of myself, I'm looking
at my face a lot. Oh, I shouldn't have made
that facial expression, but actually it's just so natural to
me because I'm talking and I'm in conversation, and before
I didn't have to worry about those things. But now
I am nitpicking myself in a way that I did
not before being on video and being on camera, and
(27:57):
so there is this added layer. I think of women
in particular that are on camera, that are working in media,
that we have to maintain a certain look and in turn,
like it's just a lot of labor and also expense.
It's an a funny fence, like, of course I love
to get my nails and lashes done. I'm doing that regardless,
(28:17):
but now there's the added pressure of doing it for
the studio time and work for work, right when we
didn't have to worry about that before.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Yeah, it's a lot, it's a lot. And in fact,
this specifically came up at a panel that we attended
at gold Diggers for podcasters for audio professionals, and the
entire topic was about transitioning to video and podcasting on video,
and that was literally a point that was brought up,
was the sort of gender economic beauty gap when it
(28:48):
comes to podcasters who are women and who are now
podcasting on video, How it's expensive, how there's added labor,
it's an added step we need to shop for outfits.
We need to have our lab is done and our
makeup done, and then but we're also critiquing it and
commenting on it, you know, but also participating in it.
(29:08):
And it's I mean, it's this cycle.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
It's this never ending loop where I can now see
why someone who is on an even bigger platform, like
say a reality TV show, is then looking at their
face and thinking, oh, I'm going to change that next
now that I have some money, I'm going to go
and get my nose jub or I'm going to go
get something done right. And so I can definitely see
(29:33):
how easy it is to fall into that trap at
a micro scale. At the scale that we're at, I'm
feeling it. I can only imagine when you have hundreds
of thousands of people following you and dissecting every single
thing that you do.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Yes, it's not only like a desire for perfection, but
an expectation that you present perfection or else.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
Yeah, because it's also there's this double standard of quote,
aging gracefully, right, Oh, no one is aging gracefully anymore.
Nobody is. Everybody's getting their work done and everybody looks
the same. But then we still want women to age
gracefully in a beautiful way. I And the person that
comes to mind is one of the most beautiful, gorgeous
(30:17):
women in the world, which is Sema Hayek. And everyone
talks about how she looks so good. She's in her fifties,
she her body, her everything, her skin. The woman is
so well resourced. First of all, she's not only does
she have her own money and her own career, she's
also married to a very wealthy man. And so it's
this expectation. I feel that even as Latinas, it's like
(30:39):
the Latinas like age better right allegedly, And I think
that I'm like, well, would we be as nice to
Selma if she wasn't getting work done but also didn't
look as good, you know? And so it is like
you have to age gracefully and quote naturally, but do
it right, make sure it's still beautiful because if not,
(31:01):
like we should probably get some work done. Don't you
have the money?
Speaker 2 (31:04):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (31:05):
And so it's fixed yourself, like you have all the money,
Like why don't you fix it?
Speaker 2 (31:09):
Why don't you look better? If you're rich, you should
look better than the way that you do now.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
Yeah, And I think that there has been this argument
that's been made, especially in the wave of like choice feminism,
that well, actually it is feminist to change anything on
you because it's your body and you have the right
to do that. And while I respect that argument, I
think the deeper question is, but why what is the pressure?
(31:35):
Where is that voice coming from that's telling you, like,
you have to change this thing? Is it yours? Is
it a parent, is it a partner's is it society?
Is it a cultural expectation that women look a certain way?
Is that where it's coming from, Because of course, like
especially women should have the right to choose what they do,
(31:56):
but also how like, is it actually white supremacist, patriarchal
beauty standard that you're trying to conform into.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
Yeah, it's the illusion of choice in a lot of ways.
And we sort of talked about this on our Reproductive
Choice episode where women are getting blamed for not having
children and for the low birth rate in the country,
as if it's like a moral failing and it's coming
(32:26):
from a negative place of personal choice. But what we
broke down in that episode is that with all of
the economic and social factors at play, it is almost
impossible for a lot of people to have children and
raise a family in the way that maybe we used
to be able to in the eighties and nineties. And
I think today when we think about things like job opportunities,
(32:47):
when we think about social pressure, the amount of cameras
that we're on at any given time, and even the
way people treat you when you are thinner or more
attractive versus when you're heavier or considered conventionally less attractive,
then it can be really enticing to change the way
you look to fit the current beauty standard, to have
(33:11):
better access to job opportunities, or opportunities for love and relationships,
or just to be treated better in everyday life. And
people do treat you differently depending on how you look
or your weight or what have you. It's it's a
real thing, and so I also want to acknowledge that.
I mean, we're very beautiful, you know, and so it's
(33:33):
like easy. I had a situation once where I years ago,
I made a comment like, oh, I would never, you know,
get plastic surgery. I wouldn't mess with my face. And
the person I was talking to said, well, it's easy
for you to say that because you're pretty, you know,
and so you don't. You don't have to, you know,
not everybody who gets plastic surgery is like ugly. But
(33:56):
I think that's a factor too, is like, if we're
already sort of meeting the beauty standard or a part
of the beauty standard, the pressure might not be as
severe as somebody else.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
Absolutely, absolutely, And of course that is definitely something to
consider when there. I mean, I'm thinking of even in
places in Latin America where it is legal, like on
job listings to list attractive, you have to be an
attractive woman to work here. Like, it's not even you
have to be an attractive woman to work here, it's
just a job qualification attractive. And there are women in
(34:31):
some countries in Latin America that will get specific elective
cosmetic procedures done to meet the beauty standards so they
can get jobs, right, And so that is of course
a factor here. And we're not even diving into the
cosmetic procedures in Latin America and how that is that
is one hundred percent its own podcast episode. But I
(34:53):
think here more what we're examining and what we've been
talking about, is the evolution and access to pla sick
surgery cosmetic surgery and how it may be actually messing
with our psyche seeing ourselves so often on camera, having
so much access to also what other people do with
their bodies, you know. And I like am all for
(35:14):
like the name of transparency and accountability, especially with folks
with big accounts who then start like selling I'm gonna
use like a booty boot camp for example. Right, we
see influencers do that and it's like, oh, but she
got work done, which is fine, but like say that too, yeah,
you know. And so it's just I feel all wrapped
up in this conversation of plastic surgery meet social media
(35:39):
and how it just all connects.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Yeah, it is all. It's all connected, all connected, it's
all connected. But no, it really really is. And it's
not only women, I think even like I think of
two men in the public eye to actors Zac Efron
and Mickey Rourke, and poor zac Efron, something bad happened
to his face and it messed up his job big time.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
And yeah, he got into an accident.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
He got into an accident, that's it, and it messed
up his job big time. And so he looks very
different differently than he did when he was a young boy.
On High School Musical, and I think he's somebody who
is still very handsome even with the changes to his face.
But the negative attention that he's received, you know, as
he has been acting more and acting in roles that
(36:28):
are very different from that like teeny bopper place that
he was in, and the scrutiny that he's received, and
I really feel for him. And there was an interview
that he did on some show where he talked about
how he didn't eat bread for like ten years, you know,
and I think in that interview, you see how it
like hits him, like Wow, that's so sad for me,
(36:49):
Like how sad for him, you know. And then I
think also of Mickey Rourke, who he had a ton
of cosmetic surgery done and he had filler and facelifts
and all kinds of things, and as an older man,
it just looks it looks odd on him, you know.
So I think, you know, it's it's something that can
touch a lot of different people in a lot of
(37:09):
different ways for different reasons. And I think for our listeners,
I just want us all to love ourselves and to
remember that the only true like reflection of who you
are and what you look like, I think, is the
way the people we love see us. You know, it's
not the mirror, it's not the camera, it's not the screen.
It's really like the eyes of people who truly see
(37:30):
us and who care for us and who love us.
And I think that if those people think we're beautiful,
then we must be beautiful.
Speaker 1 (37:37):
That's a really beautiful note to end on. So thank
you so much. Look I'm on is for listening to
another episode of Loka Thought a Radio. Let us know
what you think of this one. To me, this feels
like an og Loka Thought episode. We just we laid
out some stuff for the canon for the Loka Thought
a canon.
Speaker 2 (37:53):
For the archive.
Speaker 1 (37:54):
For the archive. All right, Look I'm on is. We'll
catch you next time, bets see it. Thus, look at
a Radio is executive produced by Viosa Fem and Mala Munios.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
Stephanie Franco is our producer.
Speaker 1 (38:07):
Story editing by Me viosa.
Speaker 2 (38:09):
Creative direction by Me Mala.
Speaker 1 (38:11):
Look At a Radio is a part of iHeartRadio's Michael
Tura podcast network.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
You can listen to look at Radio on the iHeartRadio
app or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 1 (38:20):
Leave us a review, and share with your prima or
share with your homegirl.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
And thank you to our local mores, to our listeners
for tuning in each and every week.
Speaker 1 (38:28):
Besitos Loca Lui
Already yo, ohlola, look amorees, I'm Theosa.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
And I'm Mala and today I'm thinking about getting some filler.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
No, girl, don't do it. Why don't do it? I mean,
do you, but also don't do.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
It because it's going to ruin my face?
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Right it could?
Speaker 2 (00:20):
It could?
Speaker 1 (00:21):
It quite often does not always, but sometimes.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Yeah, it's a hot topic. It's very trendy, been trendy.
But I think there's a lot of risks and complications
and migrations and bad things that can happen if not
done correctly with the right doctor.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
Yes, I think about the upkeep because there was a
time in my early twenties where I really wanted to
get my boobs done and then I thought, damn well,
I'd have to do it like every ten years because
you have to change them. Yeah, do I want to
do that for the rest of my life? Right? Probably not?
And so I didn't do it. Now. Don't get me wrong.
(00:58):
There are times I still think about it, Okay, but
I think probably I will probably not do it.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
I feel like that's one of those things where like
it feels like, once I get this procedure done, I'm
going to feel so much better. I'm gonna be happier,
I'm gonna love myself more. I'm gonna love the way
of looking close. I think about that too with teeth,
with people getting their teeth done so young. Yeah, and
(01:25):
then it's like you're gonna go in and have to
get new veneers put on again every ten years for
the rest of your life. It's such a lifelong commitment
to elective surgery.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
Yes, yeah, because it's elective, right, it's not reconstructive. And
I think in today's episode we want to dive into
the why why do we feel the pressure to change
these things? And just because we can, does it mean
we should?
Speaker 2 (01:49):
That's I think really the foundation of today's episode. It's
like the ultimate practice of free will, you know, changing
the way that you look surgically semi permanently. You can,
but should you? And this reminds me of a story
of my mom who was also considering like a cosmetic procedure.
(02:11):
So my mom has a like a second cousin, a
great cousin, I guess you would say, who is a
plastic surgeon in Guadalahada. And he's like in his late eighties,
early nineties, and one time he came to visit, and
she has always complained about like the size of her smile.
So she asked him if he thought that it would
(02:31):
be possible to widen her smile by just like cutting
a little bit on each side of her mouth to
like make her smile bigger. And he said to her, well,
technically I could. However, your lips are not made out
of skin, They're made out of membrane. So to complete
the look, I would have to take membrane from your anus,
(02:52):
which is the only other place on the body where
like you can find membrane, and then take the membrane
from your anus and add it to your lips. And
then my mom said, oh, well, then I'll really be
talking out of my ass, and she decided not to
do it. She decided not to go for it. It
just wasn't a great option after all. And I think
that that for me also was this example of like
(03:13):
it might sound like a good idea, but what is
the nitty gritty, What is the actuality? What does it
actually take to achieve that cosmetic look? You know visa
v surgery?
Speaker 1 (03:23):
Yeah, and you know, there is so much content on
the internet dedicated now to documenting the plastic surgery process
for either transparency or just straight up sharing. Right, But
before we dive into that, we want to do a
quick historical review on when humans started getting plastic surgery,
(03:43):
from ancient times, older times to current day.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
And I didn't realize that cosmetic surgery has been taking
place for centuries. Actually, it's not just something that started
in the eighties, you know, with celebrities seeds, you know,
like our modern culture by quite a bit.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Yeah, And the first known plastic surgery, which was a
precursor of the nose job, was actually in fourteen sixty AD,
which is wild. And you know, also we're talking about
modern plastic surgery in today's episode. But there have also
been different ways that women in particular have used different
beauty procedures or like body morphing, if you will, from
(04:27):
like tying their feet to like wearing really really tight corsets.
Plastic surgery is not the only way I think women
have tried to change their bodies.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Body modification in general, whether it be surgical or like
you said, using tools like corsets and fajas.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
For example, Yes, we love a faha.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
We do love a faha, and fa haas also have
other benefits not just for like tightening the waiste, but
after childbirth. Yeah, there's a lot of cultures, and I
know this is true for a lot of Latin American
cultures where you know, fahja after you give birth, so
that your guts go back into place and it holds
everything in and it helps you to get your shape back.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
Yes. Yeah, And there's so many different uses of fajas,
of elective surgery, of cosmetic surgery. And actually it was
in nineteen thirty to the nineteen forties where the American
Society of Plastic Surgeons was founded, and originally plastic surgery
was used for reconstruction for burn victims, for injury victims
(05:30):
of war, and it was during that time that there
was also the first experimentation with breast augmentation. So it
goes back. Don't go anywhere, locomotives, We'll.
Speaker 2 (05:41):
Be right back, and we're back with more of our episode. Now.
So many different places that cosmetic surgery has gone, I mean,
from the rhinoplasty to the BBL. I mean, people can
completely change their entire face, their entire body. And over
(06:04):
the years there have been examples, especially of celebrities, people
in the public eye who have seemingly completely transformed the
way that they look, and some of them all at once,
like Heidi Montag famously, or some over a period of time,
with a little bit here, a little bit there.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
Yeah, And I think the little bit here, a little
bit there is always the type that gets the most praise, right.
I think of like a Jennifer Lopez allegedly allegedly nothing
on the record that she's ever had done, but I
can imagine someone as resourced as her and who looks
as fantastic as she does. Hate or no, hate has
gotten a little jug here and there where it's super gradual,
where nobody really notices. Famously, there are a couple actresses
(06:45):
in mind that I was thinking of when we were
prepping for this episode, notably because I remember being a
young girl and hearing that they had quote bad work done,
that their faces were completely changed by the type of
work that they did, and that it affected them being
able to get work because then they were quote unrecognizable.
(07:05):
And one of those women is Meg Ryan rom Com
Queen Famously and You've got Male Sleepless in Seattle had
a very i would say, prolific career in the eighties
and nineties as like the lead protagonist in some of
our favorite rom coms. And then once she got a facelift.
I remember it was talked about in the tabloids in
(07:27):
the media like it was a bad facelift, she ruined
her face. And I would say also, someone that for
me always stuck out in my mind was Jennifer Gray
who starred as Baby in Dirty Dancing opposite Patrick Swayze.
And she had a beautiful face, and she had a
(07:47):
very particular shape of her nose. It was very unique
to her, definitely a unique beautiful face, and she got
a nose job. Assumedly this was an insecurity for her.
It was probably pointed out to her by casting directors.
She got a nose job and then quote ruined her
face because she was unrecognizable and nobody wanted to cast her.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
And it's so strange because on the one hand, those actresses,
like you said, were probably getting negative feedback about their faces,
and then once they underwent surgery, the negative feedback continued. Yeah,
you can't make anyone happy. On the flip side, you
have someone like Barbara streisand who forever people have asked
her why she didn't get a nose job, Why not
(08:32):
change your nose, because I think Barbara and Jennifer Gray
actually had a very similar look.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Yeah. I also would say, like Sarah Jessica Parker, yes,
has a very unique, very beautiful nose and has never
changed it, even though casting directors have told her like,
you should probably get a nose job.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
Yeah, it's like sabotage. Yeah, it's sabotage because in those
very same people, once the nose job is done, now
they don't want to cast you. Of course, it's awful.
And I think for Barbara Streisand in particular as a singer,
as a vocalist, to change her nose would would change
her singing, you know, and the way that she sounds
when she's singing. So I love Barbara Streisand for and
(09:10):
it's crazy to say, like, oh I love her for
taking a stand and not changing her nose. Yeah, but
and just being herself. Yeah, but in the industry that
she's in and that we're in, sometimes like that's that's
like an act of resistance.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Yeah, I mean, and I think, like to kind of
go further, obviously we're talking about white women and who
have gone through these very public transformations and because also
having very public careers. It also raises the question like
the pressures that maybe Latina actresses and women of color
black women feel, the pressure also to look a certain way,
(09:48):
to maintain a certain type of beauty standard, and just
the eurocentrism of it all right, the hierarchy of like
the skin of skin, color, colorism that exists no matter
like if you are a woman of color or black woman,
having a smaller nose, having the straight hair, and how
that can all play into either casting or that pressure
to look a certain way and to conform to a
(10:10):
beauty standard that is may may not even be of
like your own culture or standard for your own family. Even.
Speaker 2 (10:17):
Yeah, absolutely, I've seen some talk of like ethnic nose jobs, yes,
so that they're not giving you like a button nose,
but a nose that's more in alignment with your cultural
background and the natural ethnic features that you might already have.
Somebody that people talk about is having a very subtle
ethnic nose job is Beyonce Yes. And you know, people,
especially on TikTok, will point out the before and afters
(10:39):
from when she was very very young to the current day.
And I see people say like, oh, I miss Beyonce's
old nose, but it's not super obvious in interface. I
think she got a very very very subtle RHINOPLASTI done interesting. Yeah,
and there's others other women of color on TV. Julie Chen,
news anchor who had a pretty extreme I don't know
(11:02):
what exactly she did to her face, but when you
look at the before and afters, she is another one
who looks basically unrecognizable.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
And also Julie Chen has been public about public now
talking about the plastic surgery she's had, especially the plastic
surgery she had when she was only twenty five years old.
She had a double lid procedure to quote help her
career after her agents suggested it and her boss said
her eyes made her look quote disinterested and quote too Chinese.
(11:31):
She says, I got some blowback within my own family
before I had it. I had a sister who thought
it was denying my heritage and she thought it was ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Yeah, I mean, and so that's an example of someone
who is not only changing their face for like job opportunities,
but job opportunities that are like maybe being denied or
gate kept because of white supremacy and white supremacist beauty
standards specifically.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
Yeah, And I think.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
That's an important piece for all of this is I
don't know that people are necessarily getting plastic surgery to
look more like their ethnic group, right. I think quite
often it's the opposite, is to look less like the
people that they come from.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
Yeah. And then there's like this amalgamation, right, It's like
bigger lips, right, smaller nose, more prominent cheekbones, maybe an
eye lift, and so it's an amalgamation of different cultures
and beauty on one faced where you may not even
look like the ethnic background that you actually are.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
Yeah. This also brings into play like accusations of basically
cosmetic blackfishing, especially for people like the Kardashians. Yes, and
that's a topic that's been out there for a while now,
especially with like Kylie Jenner and Chloe Kardashian and Kim
Kardashian and the bbls and the lip filler and the
(12:56):
way that they do their hair and the type of
glam that they're putting on and the men that they date, Like,
the whole thing is a very odd blackfishing, white supremacist
approach to body modification.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
Yeah, And I think it's also really interesting when there's
photos I've seen of Chloe Kardashian and I've literally thought
to myself, is that gottle G screaming? And it's not.
It's Chloe Kardashian.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
You know what, they do kind of have a similar look.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
Now that you say that, I mean in gottle G assumedly,
I don't know. It looks like she's had a little
judged here and there right on her face. And so
I'm like, yeah, I can see the Instagram face of
it all right, looking everyone looking the same.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
In some ways, like a filter.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
Yeah. And I think, you know, we're starting with these
broader examples or quote like bigger people, celebrities, folks that
are more resourced. But I think now more than ever,
plastic surgery and cosmetic procedures are more accessible. And now
we see influencers, Now we see reality TV stars, I quote,
(14:00):
regular people having access and now looking like celebrities almost
or just looking like not your average girl anymore.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Yes, the girl the girl next door look is no more.
It's gone. But I think we go in and out
of it. Yes, And it's that ever changing goalposts. The
goalpost is always moving.
Speaker 1 (14:20):
Yeah, we're seeing it, we're living in real time. It's flipping.
It was the curvy, big booty girl, right, the BBL girl,
and now it's the skinny girl.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
It's back to like nineties heroin chic. Yes, yeah, and
it's it's it's also really tragic to see, like on
the way over here, in doing a little bit more
research on this, looking at tiktoks of women posting about
how they regret their BBL, and that's a very common.
There's very common types of content where it's follow me
(14:51):
on my BBL journey, follow me in maintaining my BBL.
I regret my BBL, you know. And it seems to
be this y very like common pattern of doing it,
liking it for a little bit, and then regretting it
and how do I fix it? How do I undo it? So,
for example, there is this one TikTok influencer that I
(15:12):
have followed for some time, gorgeous girl Jayleen Oh hey
that and she is a total baddie, known for her
gorgeous face, for her body, and she does meet and
greets and she does content, and she's a beauty queen.
She's known for being beautiful. Last year in twenty twenty four,
she was on the podcast circuit and she went on
(15:33):
Laplatica to talk about a botched plastic surgery that she
got in Ukraine and how as a result of this
surgery she developed Bell's palsy in her face. And Bell's
palsy is a type of facial paralysis and it can
be like semi permanent, it can go away eventually, but
(15:54):
you know, it changes the way your face looks because
you're like nerves are not working anymore. And which she
explained is that as a result of trying to get
a nose job in Ukraine, a nerve was cut in
the wrong way and that created Bell's palsy in her face.
So this girl who was already known for being gorgeous,
already famous for being gorgeous, already had millions of followers
(16:15):
across her platforms, for whatever reason, felt like she needed
to be more beautiful, like she wasn't beautiful enough, and
as a result, she developed this condition which impacted her beauty.
And it's just this vicious cycle that you hate to see.
And this is not somebody who is in movies or
on TV shows, but she is still viewed by millions
and millions of people on our phones.
Speaker 1 (16:38):
I think what makes plastic surgery elective procedure very different
from let's say the nineties or even the early two
thousands is how often we're seeing our own selves and
how that can make us so self conscious. Right, normally
we would take photos, right or back in the day,
right with our digital cameras, we would take photos. Now
we have access to like the selfies, right, we're making videos,
(17:02):
We're making videos of ourselves or even like we come
out in people's videos, right, and so there's this constant
bombardment of your own face that I don't know we're
supposed to really see that often. You know, It's like
there was there was a time where you could like
look at yourself in the mirror. Right before the invention
of technology, you looked at yourself in the mirror and
(17:23):
you saw your face, right, And then now that has
evolved over time with technology, with the phones, with cameras,
now with video, and so there's just constant access to
just examine everything on your face, good or bad. And
so I can see it goes back to what we
were saying at the top of the conversation, where getting
this procedure may not actually make you happy, right, You
(17:46):
may not actually feel you may feel more quote beautiful temporarily,
but was it ever really about that?
Speaker 2 (17:54):
Yeah? And I think it's something really important to note
is that the cameras, the lenses, I mean a lens
can do so much to distort the image that it's capturing. Lenses, lights,
like a camera camera versus a phone camera, and different
types of cameras, Like, you're gonna look different in every
(18:15):
single image because every single camera is like working differently,
and so you never truly know what you look like
if you are looking at yourself through the eyes of
a lens. And there are so many different types of
lenses and even mirrors, right, Like, you know, in some
mirrors you look tall and slender, and in other mirrors
you feel like you look shorter, you know. And there
(18:37):
are good mirrors and bad mirrors, and we can notice this.
So when we see our reflections, are we ever seeing
an accurate reflection of what we actually look like?
Speaker 1 (18:47):
Right? It's like the fun house in our pocket is
how it feels. It is. Every waking moment you can
get a different image of yourself, a different angle of yourself.
There are moments where I have like a and open
my camera and I'm like, oof, who I do not
need to see myself from that angle, right, And then
of course there's the more pos Yes, I put makeup
(19:09):
on and I feel beautiful today, so I'm going to
take a photo. Of course that's going to look like
the best version of myself. You know, That's what I'm
putting out there, and so I can see, like why
we're in this cycle. I feel so grateful to be
at this age where we have that in between of
growing up outside of the internet right before the social
media is what it is today. But I think of
(19:30):
someone like my niece growing up with social media, and
you know, she's constantly at Sephora. She's sixteen years old.
I don't blame her. I don't blame her. And she
doesn't wear a lot of makeup, but like that is
already in her zeitgeist of the brands and the beauty products,
and she knows like what's popular right now, and so
that's very much a part of her experience as an
(19:51):
adolescent girl.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
Yeah, like middle schoolers having a ten step skincare routine
and they're using collagen and Higler on a acid and
all kinds of things that they're like young skin just
does not need.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
No little baby faces. They have all the collagen.
Speaker 2 (20:06):
They have all of the collagen. But and that's a
really fascinating trend too, is like young girls really dedicating
time and whatever their allowance is to like really extensive
skincare routines. So it's starting really really young.
Speaker 1 (20:23):
Don't go anywhere, lookamotives.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
We'll be right back, and we're back with more of
our episode.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
On the other side of social media influencers, We've talked
about the celebrities, the reality TV stars, the influencers. Then
we have Republican lawmakers who very visibly have filler and treatments.
This has also been called the Mara Lago face, which
I think is really interesting and that I want us
to spend a little time on. Is like the plastic
(20:55):
surgery and the gender norms that are specific being reinforced
by some of the Republican lawmakers and folks in the
Trumpet administration.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
Yeah, like, why do we have politicians looking like straight
ig batties? Why?
Speaker 1 (21:11):
So?
Speaker 2 (21:11):
There was a really funny TV segment where comedian Amber
Ruffin is looking at before and after pictures of Republican
women and their cosmetic surgeries. It's a segment called Have
I Got News for You on CNN. It's hosted by
Roy Woods Junior. And the way that Amber Ruffin is
reacting to these before and after pictures for Republicans is like,
(21:33):
why are we having these like reality TV experiences with
our elected officials? Yeah, because of cosmetic surgery. And what's
so funny about the segment is a we can make
fun of these women because I think that politically they
are grotesque, and they are grotesque because of the laws
that they are passing, because of the violence that they
(21:53):
are enacting on our communities and on marginalized peoples. So
I don't feel bad for laughing at their face, honestly,
but they're also grotesque because of what they've done to
their faces. They are essentially taking their i think, what's
considered to be feminine features and doing it to a
(22:14):
degree that is almost cartoonish.
Speaker 1 (22:17):
Yeah, we're thinking the long blow dried like big hair, right,
false eyelashes, lots of mascara, filler in the cheeks, filler
in the lips, and it is presenting this type of
maga beauty. And then in turn, you see MEGA supporters
also looking that way as well. And I've seen on
(22:40):
TikTok some white maga women saying like, it's never been
hotter to be a conservative. It's the liberals. Progressives wish
they could look like us, literally.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
But these looks are like. But also these be okay
because at the same time, the high glam, I think
is also coming from a left liberal place.
Speaker 1 (23:02):
Absolutely, the lux.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
The glam, the hyper feminine beauty aesthetics are not only
coming from like a left liberal place, but I also
think are coming from kind of like a subculture like
exotic dancers, you know, strippers, drag queens, drag queens, sex workers.
There are also there's there's conversation on TikTok as well
(23:26):
about how a lot of the hyper hyper feminine cosmetic
procedures were really popularized and perfected by transgender women right
undergoing different types of gender affirming cosmetic procedures. So for
that all of that to now trickle into Republican like
beauty standards, it's all black mirror stuff.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
Christine Nome, the Secretary of Homeland Security, had her teeth redone.
A Republican strategist told The New York Times that she
meaning Christy Nome is showing Trump that she works well
in front of the camera, that she has that star
power he wants on stage with him, while fitting into
the mode of women in the Trump universe. And she
did get elected or appointed, appointed and confirmed into the
(24:12):
Secretary of Homeland Security position. And as we know, she's
been in loss that she was in Los Angeles and
she was like pretending to film a reality TV show.
She was in the city of Huntington Park terrorizing families
with a camera crew.
Speaker 2 (24:26):
Yeah, and a full beat.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
And a full beat, and so there is it's like,
it is that deep. Actually, like actually, let's go there,
Let's have this conversation of how they're also the horrible.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
People, Yeah, at the exact same time. And it's remembering
that Donald Trump comes from a reality TV background. Yeah,
he literally was a reality TV star with The Apprentice
and like many many seasons, And so he has an
eye for what is gonna what's gonna play on TV,
what's gonna play on screen, what's entered hating, what's glitzy,
(25:01):
what's glamorous. So the White House is now the set
of a reality TV show in a lot of ways.
And lawmakers and Republican women are really behaving and presenting
in ways that are not that different from your average
reality TV star. You know someone on Love Island, someone
on Ninety Day Fiance who after the first season, they
(25:23):
see themselves on TV and then they show up to
the reunion looking completely different because now, oh I'm on screen,
Now let me get some work done.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
Yeah. And I think it goes back to we can
see that transformation on air on TV from regular looking
people turning into quote, celebrities at least visibly right to
the eye. We see that transformation documented throughout the seasons.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
I think we can take this entire conversation and apply
it directly to us to look at thought our radio
and the fact that we have been recording video of
our studio sessions for TikTok for YouTube for socials, which
has not always been part of our podcasting experience and
actually is one of the reasons why I have always
(26:10):
loved podcasting, because in the beginning, there wasn't that external
pressure to record ourselves on video. While we were recording
our episodes, it was way more about what are we
talking about, the storytelling, the content, the theme, the topic,
and now we're in this place where to promote the
(26:32):
show to connect with our audience, video is very much
essential because we're on video forward platforms. But what does
that end up meaning for us? We feel like we
need to have a look. I feel like I need
to have lashes on and makeup, and my hair needs
to be done and my nails need to be done
because video really lives forever, and people might not go
(26:54):
into our Apple podcast or Spotify feed and leave disparaging
comments there, but on video content they absolutely will. And
that's something that I think, I know I want to avoid,
and it feels like really important to be glam and
beautiful on video.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
On the podcast, Yeah, I definitely feel a different pressure
and a different awareness of myself that I did not
have when we would come into the studio, whether that
was at Aspasio or early on of our network seasons,
because yeah, I do always try to show up with
like a beat face and a cute look, but now
(27:34):
it's like, do I have to look at the camera?
And then when I'm watching clips of myself, I'm looking
at my face a lot. Oh, I shouldn't have made
that facial expression, but actually it's just so natural to
me because I'm talking and I'm in conversation, and before
I didn't have to worry about those things. But now
I am nitpicking myself in a way that I did
not before being on video and being on camera, and
(27:57):
so there is this added layer. I think of women
in particular that are on camera, that are working in media,
that we have to maintain a certain look and in turn,
like it's just a lot of labor and also expense.
It's an a funny fence, like, of course I love
to get my nails and lashes done. I'm doing that regardless,
(28:17):
but now there's the added pressure of doing it for
the studio time and work for work, right when we
didn't have to worry about that before.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Yeah, it's a lot, it's a lot. And in fact,
this specifically came up at a panel that we attended
at gold Diggers for podcasters for audio professionals, and the
entire topic was about transitioning to video and podcasting on video,
and that was literally a point that was brought up,
was the sort of gender economic beauty gap when it
(28:48):
comes to podcasters who are women and who are now
podcasting on video, How it's expensive, how there's added labor,
it's an added step we need to shop for outfits.
We need to have our lab is done and our
makeup done, and then but we're also critiquing it and
commenting on it, you know, but also participating in it.
(29:08):
And it's I mean, it's this cycle.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
It's this never ending loop where I can now see
why someone who is on an even bigger platform, like
say a reality TV show, is then looking at their
face and thinking, oh, I'm going to change that next
now that I have some money, I'm going to go
and get my nose jub or I'm going to go
get something done right. And so I can definitely see
(29:33):
how easy it is to fall into that trap at
a micro scale. At the scale that we're at, I'm
feeling it. I can only imagine when you have hundreds
of thousands of people following you and dissecting every single
thing that you do.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Yes, it's not only like a desire for perfection, but
an expectation that you present perfection or else.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
Yeah, because it's also there's this double standard of quote,
aging gracefully, right, Oh, no one is aging gracefully anymore.
Nobody is. Everybody's getting their work done and everybody looks
the same. But then we still want women to age
gracefully in a beautiful way. I And the person that
comes to mind is one of the most beautiful, gorgeous
(30:17):
women in the world, which is Sema Hayek. And everyone
talks about how she looks so good. She's in her fifties,
she her body, her everything, her skin. The woman is
so well resourced. First of all, she's not only does
she have her own money and her own career, she's
also married to a very wealthy man. And so it's
this expectation. I feel that even as Latinas, it's like
(30:39):
the Latinas like age better right allegedly, And I think
that I'm like, well, would we be as nice to
Selma if she wasn't getting work done but also didn't
look as good, you know? And so it is like
you have to age gracefully and quote naturally, but do
it right, make sure it's still beautiful because if not,
(31:01):
like we should probably get some work done. Don't you
have the money?
Speaker 2 (31:04):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (31:05):
And so it's fixed yourself, like you have all the money,
Like why don't you fix it?
Speaker 2 (31:09):
Why don't you look better? If you're rich, you should
look better than the way that you do now.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
Yeah, And I think that there has been this argument
that's been made, especially in the wave of like choice feminism,
that well, actually it is feminist to change anything on
you because it's your body and you have the right
to do that. And while I respect that argument, I
think the deeper question is, but why what is the pressure?
(31:35):
Where is that voice coming from that's telling you, like,
you have to change this thing? Is it yours? Is
it a parent, is it a partner's is it society?
Is it a cultural expectation that women look a certain way?
Is that where it's coming from, Because of course, like
especially women should have the right to choose what they do,
(31:56):
but also how like, is it actually white supremacist, patriarchal
beauty standard that you're trying to conform into.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
Yeah, it's the illusion of choice in a lot of ways.
And we sort of talked about this on our Reproductive
Choice episode where women are getting blamed for not having
children and for the low birth rate in the country,
as if it's like a moral failing and it's coming
(32:26):
from a negative place of personal choice. But what we
broke down in that episode is that with all of
the economic and social factors at play, it is almost
impossible for a lot of people to have children and
raise a family in the way that maybe we used
to be able to in the eighties and nineties. And
I think today when we think about things like job opportunities,
(32:47):
when we think about social pressure, the amount of cameras
that we're on at any given time, and even the
way people treat you when you are thinner or more
attractive versus when you're heavier or considered conventionally less attractive,
then it can be really enticing to change the way
you look to fit the current beauty standard, to have
(33:11):
better access to job opportunities, or opportunities for love and relationships,
or just to be treated better in everyday life. And
people do treat you differently depending on how you look
or your weight or what have you. It's it's a
real thing, and so I also want to acknowledge that.
I mean, we're very beautiful, you know, and so it's
(33:33):
like easy. I had a situation once where I years ago,
I made a comment like, oh, I would never, you know,
get plastic surgery. I wouldn't mess with my face. And
the person I was talking to said, well, it's easy
for you to say that because you're pretty, you know,
and so you don't. You don't have to, you know,
not everybody who gets plastic surgery is like ugly. But
(33:56):
I think that's a factor too, is like, if we're
already sort of meeting the beauty standard or a part
of the beauty standard, the pressure might not be as
severe as somebody else.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
Absolutely, absolutely, And of course that is definitely something to
consider when there. I mean, I'm thinking of even in
places in Latin America where it is legal, like on
job listings to list attractive, you have to be an
attractive woman to work here. Like, it's not even you
have to be an attractive woman to work here, it's
just a job qualification attractive. And there are women in
(34:31):
some countries in Latin America that will get specific elective
cosmetic procedures done to meet the beauty standards so they
can get jobs, right, And so that is of course
a factor here. And we're not even diving into the
cosmetic procedures in Latin America and how that is that
is one hundred percent its own podcast episode. But I
(34:53):
think here more what we're examining and what we've been
talking about, is the evolution and access to pla sick
surgery cosmetic surgery and how it may be actually messing
with our psyche seeing ourselves so often on camera, having
so much access to also what other people do with
their bodies, you know. And I like am all for
(35:14):
like the name of transparency and accountability, especially with folks
with big accounts who then start like selling I'm gonna
use like a booty boot camp for example. Right, we
see influencers do that and it's like, oh, but she
got work done, which is fine, but like say that too, yeah,
you know. And so it's just I feel all wrapped
up in this conversation of plastic surgery meet social media
(35:39):
and how it just all connects.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Yeah, it is all. It's all connected, all connected, it's
all connected. But no, it really really is. And it's
not only women, I think even like I think of
two men in the public eye to actors Zac Efron
and Mickey Rourke, and poor zac Efron, something bad happened
to his face and it messed up his job big time.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
And yeah, he got into an accident.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
He got into an accident, that's it, and it messed
up his job big time. And so he looks very
different differently than he did when he was a young boy.
On High School Musical, and I think he's somebody who
is still very handsome even with the changes to his face.
But the negative attention that he's received, you know, as
he has been acting more and acting in roles that
(36:28):
are very different from that like teeny bopper place that
he was in, and the scrutiny that he's received, and
I really feel for him. And there was an interview
that he did on some show where he talked about
how he didn't eat bread for like ten years, you know,
and I think in that interview, you see how it
like hits him, like Wow, that's so sad for me,
(36:49):
Like how sad for him, you know. And then I
think also of Mickey Rourke, who he had a ton
of cosmetic surgery done and he had filler and facelifts
and all kinds of things, and as an older man,
it just looks it looks odd on him, you know.
So I think, you know, it's it's something that can
touch a lot of different people in a lot of
(37:09):
different ways for different reasons. And I think for our listeners,
I just want us all to love ourselves and to
remember that the only true like reflection of who you
are and what you look like, I think, is the
way the people we love see us. You know, it's
not the mirror, it's not the camera, it's not the screen.
It's really like the eyes of people who truly see
(37:30):
us and who care for us and who love us.
And I think that if those people think we're beautiful,
then we must be beautiful.
Speaker 1 (37:37):
That's a really beautiful note to end on. So thank
you so much. Look I'm on is for listening to
another episode of Loka Thought a Radio. Let us know
what you think of this one. To me, this feels
like an og Loka Thought episode. We just we laid
out some stuff for the canon for the Loka Thought
a canon.
Speaker 2 (37:53):
For the archive.
Speaker 1 (37:54):
For the archive. All right, Look I'm on is. We'll
catch you next time, bets see it. Thus, look at
a Radio is executive produced by Viosa Fem and Mala Munios.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
Stephanie Franco is our producer.
Speaker 1 (38:07):
Story editing by Me viosa.
Speaker 2 (38:09):
Creative direction by Me Mala.
Speaker 1 (38:11):
Look At a Radio is a part of iHeartRadio's Michael
Tura podcast network.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
You can listen to look at Radio on the iHeartRadio
app or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 1 (38:20):
Leave us a review, and share with your prima or
share with your homegirl.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
And thank you to our local mores, to our listeners
for tuning in each and every week.
Speaker 1 (38:28):
Besitos Loca Lui
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