July 21, 2022 • 25 mins
It is day three of our deep dive into the wild and wonderful world of TikTok and specifically BookTok. Who better to tell us about BookTok than one of our favourite BookTok-ers, herself Mari (aka MyNameIsMarines)? Get ready for all the behind-the-scenes tea from the world of BookTok.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
It is day three of our deep dive into the
wild and wonderful world of TikTok and specifically book talk. Today.
Who better to tell us about book talk then one
of our favorite book talkers. Get ready for all the
behind the scenes t from the world of book talk.
I'm Sarah Wendell, I'm Alicia Ry. Welcome to Love Struck Daily,
(00:21):
where we bring love to your ears every single day.
I'm in love with that. I'm in love with you.
(00:44):
So this is day three of our exploration of book talk,
my favorite week. Now I want to ask you a
quick question. Yeah, go for it. I know you gave
a presentation about some of the data behind what book
talk does to the book industry. Would you be willing
to talk a little a bit about the things you
learned about how book talk is affecting the publishing industry itself,
(01:05):
because the influence is massive. Yeah, for sure. I mean so,
my part of the presentation was not on the numbers.
That was our fantastic publicist over at Harper, one of them,
Sam Fox, who has all the numbers in our head
and is amazing. But she she put together this um
presentation with numbers and it was really interesting to me
(01:25):
to see the boom of books in one that did
not boom before TikTok. Yes, book talk is really amazing.
It sort of revitalizing backlist, which is not something that
publishers really cared about before before TikTok. If you don't
kill it in pre orders in the first week of sales, Kevin,
(01:48):
you was invisible like you are. They're not going to
give you a marketing push there not next time. They're
not going to give you a big budget. They're not
going to give you a book tour. And it is
a little while to me as somebody who who has
a long tail and on my books, I I I
have my books in bookstores for like years after their release,
which is not normal. Like that is not something that
(02:09):
publishers really seek out or or care about until TikTok
came long I think, and then they realize, oh, hey,
people still want to read books even if they're not
coming out next week, even if they're not from some
like hot new debut author. You know, it could be
somebody who's had twenty books since that book came out
that really hit. But TikTok has really, I mean, it
has revitalized an industry that in a lot of ways
(02:34):
was kind of flailing in terms of sales and how
to get books into people's hands, I think, and it
also served as a really good reminder of something that
I have always thought is true that just because the
book is brand new does not mean it's the only
book that matters right now. A book that you haven't
read is a new book. Like when we talk about
coverage of smart bitches, a lot of people are like,
why don't you only talk about new releases? Why don't
(02:55):
you talk more about new releases? There are empty petrillion
books that were just released since I saw did this sentence?
So I can't keep up with all of that, right,
You never know what's going to become popular, And I
think that's one of the things I really love about
this particular social media app. It's not always forward thinking.
Sometimes it is backlist thank you, looking to see what
(03:15):
we already have? Yeah, backlast thinking. I hope that it
revitalizes the backlist for a lot more authors. I agree. Yeah,
I think there's a lot of people who are left
out of the conversation unfortunately, and I hope, I hope
that they can find a place soon. Yes, Well, Today,
to finish up book talk week, we are going to
talk to one of the most popular book talkers whose
(03:37):
recent video was exceptionally good and exited by one Alicia
Rye because it was so great. My name is money
Nous is absolutely brilliant. We cannot wait to talk with her.
Please welcome Marty Well, thank you so much for coming
on the show. Matter you really were so excited to
(03:58):
talk to you and and find out all about what
you do on TikTok. Thank you so much for having me.
I am ready to talk. I have all of the
feelings about TikTok. Because all the feelings great, We're very
excited to hear them. I think that should be the
title of this series, all of the feelings about TikTok,
all the feelings about Yeah, can you tell us a
(04:22):
little bit about your background? What what did you what
do you do when you're not on TikTok? You know,
how did you get into it? I am a lifelong reader,
so I've been, you know, reading since of the womb.
I don't know however early you can go back and
read um. And I've always been really into like creative
(04:44):
endeavor sort of outside of you know, I was the
newspaper kid and the yearbook kid. And and once I
kind of graduated um high school and was in college,
I had this moment where I was like, well, I
don't have any sort of like creative outlets anymore. And
that's when I started and I'm going to age myself
a little bit here, but that's when I started my
personal blog. Uh So, we have a we have one
(05:07):
of the original bloggers ever here. So yes, that's that's
kind of how I found my way to like making
things online. Um and so I've been through every probably
iteration of the online book is space, um so blogs
and good Reads and Tumbler, and I have a YouTube channel,
(05:30):
and I am on book Twitter and now I am
on TikTok. And this is all apart from, like you know,
just what I do in my day job, which is
work in HR. This hasn't always been just my My
hobby is reading and getting to talk to people about
the things that I read and love. So, and what
are your genres of choice? I read incredibly widely, and
(05:51):
I am very like I'm a mood reader. Um So,
I read a little bit of everything. I dabble in
pretty much everything. The only honor that I even, I say,
it's like a note, but I will read a little
bit of it is horror. I don't like to be
scared for fun, but I do love gothic horror. It's
the like Jane Eyre fan girl in me that I
(06:11):
love a good gothic horror. But like in general, horror
is like a pass for me. Um, but everything else like,
I'll try it. I love reading widely. Oh that's wonderful.
What was your TikTok journey? So like when did you
get on the app and how did you find your
way to book talk? Yeah. I have a very similar
story thing to a lot of people my age, and
(06:34):
that was that the pandemic happened, and um, the place
that I was working for sent us to work from home,
and I was working from home for like a couple
of weeks and then was promptly laid off from that job.
We'll be back after this short break. So I found
(07:02):
myself in my apartment without a job, stressed about everything,
and then people were talking a ton about TikTok's I
was like, okay, cool, I have nothing better to do,
and I downloaded the app and I did not resurface
for a while after I downloaded the app, and really
my introduction to TikTok was just like TikTok in general,
(07:23):
I was not getting a ton of like book talk
content at first. I was just you know, the very
like popular TikTok content. Then I started to get book
talk stuff on there, and I was very hesitant to join,
coming from a book tube background, because it can be
a little bit nerve wracking to enter into a community.
(07:43):
But after I was on TikTok for about a year
before I was like made the plunge and started to
upload content, and I was just like, you know what,
I've got all of this book tube content already that
I did like repurpose for TikTok, and like, why don't
I try that? And I just started making content and
(08:03):
I've fell in love with it. I've fallen in love
with like TikTok's version of the book community. So that's
where I am. It's a very different book community. I
found absolutely like you. I've also gone through the pipeline
of blogs and tick Twitter and Instagram. I don't know
if it's the addition of video or what it is,
but it feels like a tighter knit community which is
(08:25):
really nice. Yeah. We we've talked a bit in this
episode in previous episodes about how the algorithm does tend
to favor certain books, certain types of authors, certain content.
I do. I love your content because it is so
heavily focused on making sure that different communities are represented.
(08:47):
Is that what you intended to do when you started
your account or was that just a reaction to what
you were seeing not represented elsewhere? Yeah, it was probably
more my intent because it isn't my first rodeo. Uh
and because TikTok's algorithm is definitely different than YouTube's in
(09:08):
certain ways, but social media spaces in general, like they
all follow a pattern, right, So TikTok's algorithm is not
the only one that we can accuse of like sort
of being racist. And uh, you know, like the the
way the community's favor, especially one's video ones, right, traditional
beauty and like traditional beauty standards and things like that,
(09:30):
that is not exclusive to TikTok um. So I feel
like people who have been in other communities like entering
TikTok will be like, oh this again. And that was
certainly my experience. So I came into it knowing that
I wanted to carry forward some of the work that
I had done on different platforms in terms of um
really challenging people's like ideas of what it means to
(09:51):
quote unquote read diversely, and you know, like how we
critically engage with media and promoting voices that don't often
get moded on in social media spaces. So that was
work I've done before, and I knew that I wanted
to continue. It's so cool to me because I feel
like one thing that book talk does really well is
gets you really excited for books in a way that
(10:13):
like a tweet cannot know. I problished my first book
in two thousand nine, so I've been in this industry
for quite some time. And the challenge initially for us
was to get readers to see our books is something
more than vegetables. Like that was like, you know, like
eat your vegetables, read this book, like you know, you
should do it for this reason, read your diverse people,
broaden your mindset broccoli and yeah, and it was like
(10:38):
it was such a struggle, and I hated that, like
I hated having to feel that way. And and one
thing that I think TikTok does really well is or
in particular like creators such as yourself is is that
it gets you really excited, like you see it as people,
And that I think is invaluable. Is there is there
(10:58):
a book that you'd love to see go ofviral that
you're dying to see go viral because you love it
so much. So there's this book coming out by Alicia Rye.
I have definitely recommended her books on my channels. That's kind.
I was not fishing. I am fishing. I'm fishing. I've
got a big old fishing pole. I am here, Yes,
(11:22):
and every I am here for this book to go viral. No, seriously,
tell me a book that you just made you go,
oh my gosh. I love those books for like books
that I read recently that I really was really impactful
for me. And I would love to see people like
read widely, primarily because I'm not even entirely sure everybody
would like it, but I feel like it would spark conversation. Yes,
(11:43):
Lakewood by making Gettings, which is a story that is
like part sci fi and part horror, but it is
about a woman who her family is in really deep
debt and so she gets an opportunity like a job
offer that seems too good to be drew, but she
needs it. She needs the health insurance, she needs the money,
(12:03):
she needs to help her mom. So she jumps on
the chance to take this job off her. And what
it ends up being is like medical experimentation. So it
is like this like very atmospheric book that is like
part horror that is exploring like the history of medical
experimentation on brown and black folks. And so you're getting
the like her story of experiencing that through kind of
(12:25):
an unreliable narrator because of everything that she is going through,
like we aren't sure what's real, what's not real? And
then it has an open ending, so you like walk
away going what what did I just like read? But
all of all that it sparks in terms of conversation
about what somebody is willing to put another person through
(12:47):
for gain, and like what constitutes humanity and how do
you see other people's humanity? I think is really really interesting.
So that is when I'd love to see viral just
to hear people talk about it. Wow, I will check
that out. That sounds amazing. Book top you know, it
is influencing the publishing industry. It's influencing everything they do
(13:08):
right now, and they're just I think, finally starting to
wake up and realize, oh, yeah, we have to pay
attention here. Do you think it's influencing it for the
better as a consumer of books? The the easiest answer
to me is yes. The base answer to me is yes,
because ultimately I think it is making people excited to
read again, and it is moving books right, people are
(13:31):
excited to read books. It is I think that that
is always, like at the baseline, a good thing, and
I honestly think that any other an therapy sides that
really gets into like the nuance of not only how
is book talk influencing, but how is the publishing industry
reacting to that? Because it is too sided to me,
(13:52):
right like, book talk is not dictating how the publishing
industry reacts to them. We're we're kind of just doing
our community thing and like, you know, talking about books
and liking the books that we like. Uh, And you know,
our sort of field of interaction is with each other,
not necessarily directly what they're going to do in response
to that. So you know, how publishing reacts I think
(14:14):
is part of this equation. But you know, like I
don't know what they're gonna do and and whatnot, So
I think it has there are definitely ways that, you know,
we have to be cautious, I think, and that goes
back to like making sure that we are creating a
community that is welcoming, that is diverse, that promotes voices
that are not sort of like the default of this straight, white,
(14:37):
able bodied, you know, neurotypical in every way that we can.
But that is true for pretty much every community. So
again I don't I just don't think that's just book
talk specific. It's also not your job to manage how
publishing reacts to you. You know, I started, I started
my site in two thousand and five, and sometimes publishing
still doesn't know what to do with me and doesn't
(14:58):
know what to do with the podcast. And publishing is
an industry built on a very antiquated business model. Basically
it works on consignment. And there are a lot of
very young, passionate for people who work in publishing who
are being learned out by an unsustainable workload and unrealistic expectations.
And it's not your job to manage that problem. But
(15:20):
one thing I do see is the number of people
on book talk who struggle saying to publishers, no, you
should actually compensate me for my work because I'm doing
your job. And I am always in favor of having
that conversation because for a very long time I was
expected to provide free promotion for books, and I still
often am expected to provide free promotion for books until
I figured out how to make this my business. And
(15:42):
it's really hard to say that as an individual creator
on a platform that people look down on because it's
young women being enthusiastic about books and knowing that there's many,
many millions of dollars, but you're not going to get
any of them. Yeah. I think Also an important thing
to note is that like a book to talking like that,
it as an emerging market and sort of like hitting
(16:03):
it stride and peak is happening at the same time
where the publishing industry is going through turmoil. Okay, we're
going to take a beat, Go have a sip of water, coffee, wine,
whatever you need. We'll be right back. The publishing industry
(16:26):
is going through turmoil, especially as we saw like the
you know, the exodus of people leaving the industry and um,
you know, just everything that went around the pandemic and
you know how that affected the industry. So a lot
of times I feel like things that are publishing specific
or market specific or around the pandemic just kind of
get tacked onto book talk as an emerging market when
(16:49):
like the they're happening in tandem, but yes they're not,
and they're not necessarily one is not necessarily directly connected
to the other. So I just think it is like
this perfect storm of events that book talking cropped up
at this time. So yes, very much like we we
can only do what we're doing on book talk side
of it, And how publishing kind of reacts for an
(17:11):
industry that is notoriously slow moving is like really interesting
to watch. So what what are your plans for the future,
What do you hope for your account or for yourself
or anything. Um, I am having a ton of fun
on TikTok because it is right now like a hobby
(17:31):
that is fun. I don't know that I have like
many aspirational things. I just want to keep making things
that are bringing me joy and like talking about books,
which is always like how I find myself in these
communities because I like have all of these feelings positive
and negative about like stories, I consume. Um. So yeah,
I just I'm really excited uh to see my channel
(17:53):
keep growing and reaching people and sparking conversation and and
and whatnot. So that's where I am right now, just
kind of like happy to be here. Good, good, excellent,
and where where can people find you? On TikTok or otherwise.
My handle is at my name is Bodinus on TikTok
and also on YouTube it's my name is boddiness, and
(18:13):
also on Twitter it's my name is bodiness, and also
on Instagram. We stand a consistent point. I know I
can never be I I wish I could be that consistent.
Everything's always taken by the time I get there's a
good job, thank you. Um. And then on top of that,
I also have a log in a podcast where it's
looking at media more in general. So we talk about
(18:36):
and we review books and movies and TV shows. Um.
And that is Snark Squad and the podcast is Snark
Squad Pod. And then we're on a bit of a
season break. But I also have the podcast Cooler Than Homework,
in which we are watching every Disney Channel original movie
in order. That's fantastic. Yeah, So that's me. I feel
(19:01):
like I need to send you snacks. That's such an undertaking. Yeah,
I'm sure. I'm sure. The older stuff is interesting, having
your childhood memories challenged by reality. Yeah, that's rough. That's rough.
I don't know if i'd want to do this, but
good for you. We're doing. But thank you so much
for coming on. We really enjoyed this. We hope you
(19:23):
did too, And I'll talk too soon. What catch you
on TikTok? Thanks Alicia. I love doing these conversations with you.
It is the bright spot of my week. It is
the bright spot of my week two, and it is
something that I treasure. But I think we do need
to talk about some changes that are happening. You might
have noticed that Love Struck is going through some changes
(19:44):
in the feed, even though the show will continue to evolve.
Sarah and I have decided to take a step back
from hosting Love Strong and it really pains me to
say that. Yeah, we are most bummed. Yeah we I
mean we love working together. This is Sarah. I have
wanted to work with you on a project for us.
I think as long as that we've been friends. Uh,
(20:06):
this has been a dream to see you every week
reliably to work every day together. Uh and to also
work with our amazing team Abigail Steckler Little Scorpions Studios,
Jen Jacobs are fantastic editor, and Jesse Epstein are amazing,
amazing researcher. What a what a great pool of talent
(20:27):
this was. And and I I hope I'm certain, you
know what, I don't even hope. I'm certain that we
are going to work together again, very very soon, because
I will not have it any other way. It is
so rare to start something like this with so many
different people involved and have it go so smoothly and
be such a highlight every week. Every week we recorded,
(20:48):
I would think, Wow, that was so fun. I cannot
wait for people to hear that episode. And so I
especially want to say thank you to you we're listening
to this episode than thank you for welcoming us into
your day. Thank you for all of the reviews and
the comments and all of the encouragement. The fact that
you would email us and say, hey, I have a
(21:10):
love story and I want to share it with you
means everything. That you made a place for us in
your podcast player, given how many podcasts there are in
the world, is an honor. We are so happy to
have been part of your life for a short time.
We always send each episode of a Love to Go,
So for this Love to Go, Alicia, what have you
(21:30):
learned from this podcast? I have learned so much from
this show that I don't know if I can distill
it all in one thing. But if I try, if
I really really try, I think the thing that I
have learned most from all of our many, many guests,
five days a week for how long, is that love
is truly an active verbs. People tell me that all
(21:52):
the time, and they tell everybody that when you're newly
engaged and you're happy with each other, they go, oh,
just wait, just wait, because because it's gonna you're gonna
be miser world so much work. And that always scared
me a little bit wor I was like, oh my god,
it's gonna be work. It's gonna be work. And what
I've realized that's hot garbage. I agree with that. I
agree with that very much. I I don't think that
there's anything wrong with being happy with a person um
(22:15):
and I think it's quite possible to be happy with
a person for a very long period of time. You
can attest to that, and so what. But the thing
that used to scare me about that is the word work.
And I realized now it's not really work to love someone.
It's quite easy to love someone. What is work is
(22:37):
remaining kind and thoughtful and consider it and and loving
all the active words that you have to keep remembering
to do and remember that you know somebody is coming
from a good place. That is work. That is because
because everything in the world tells you not to, because
it's so easy not to. But of all the people
(22:57):
that we've had on this show, I mean that is
sort of the common denominator in any form of love,
whether it's parental, you know, familial, siblings, romance, is that
you have to keep it active. Yeah, I love as
a choice, love as a choice. Yeah. I have learned,
(23:18):
as cheesy as it is, that love actually really is
all around. Like I don't love that movie a lot,
but it's absolutely true. Love actually, really, truly, no kidding,
is all around, And if you take the time to
find it and look for it and celebrate it, it
is a wonderful antidote to the feeling that everything is
(23:40):
going wrong. As long as there's still love in the world,
everything is going right. Everything, Yeah, I fully agree with that.
Now you can find us in lots of places on
the Internet. We're not going anywhere, We're not leaving the internet.
You can you can pry the Internet out of my hands.
You can always find me. It's Smart Fitches, tra actually books.
My podcast. There is smart podcast Trashy Books. It's five
(24:04):
episodes deep and each week there's something interesting and fun.
And if you enjoy listening to me talk to people,
including episodes with Alicia, there are lots and lots of
places to listen to me talking to a microphone. Absolutely
and I you can find me all over every social media.
You can find me on Instagram at Alicia ry Writes,
on TikTok at the real Alicia Rye, and on Twitter
(24:27):
at Alicia Ride. But I'm not on there much. And
you can also find me on YouTube. I have a
YouTube channel called Quarantine Cuisine, and my fiancay Kay and
I will have a YouTube shortly called The Happy Place,
So you can come find us there where we're just
talking about things that make us happy that might make
you happy to Our researcher is Jesse Epstein, our editor
(24:47):
is Jen Jacobs. We are produced by Abigail Steckler and
Little Scorpion Studios with executive producer Frolic Media. This is
an I Heart Radio podcast. We love you very much,
yes what we do, and we'll still around. We're not
going it, Nope, you can't get rid of us. And
we wish you now, always and forever a very happily
(25:09):
ever after. I'm in love with you. That A would
say to you, God's good to see you should love.
I'm in love with you. I'm in love with you.
It is day three of our deep dive into the
wild and wonderful world of TikTok and specifically book talk. Today.
Who better to tell us about book talk then one
of our favorite book talkers. Get ready for all the
behind the scenes t from the world of book talk.
I'm Sarah Wendell, I'm Alicia Ry. Welcome to Love Struck Daily,
(00:21):
where we bring love to your ears every single day.
I'm in love with that. I'm in love with you.
(00:44):
So this is day three of our exploration of book talk,
my favorite week. Now I want to ask you a
quick question. Yeah, go for it. I know you gave
a presentation about some of the data behind what book
talk does to the book industry. Would you be willing
to talk a little a bit about the things you
learned about how book talk is affecting the publishing industry itself,
(01:05):
because the influence is massive. Yeah, for sure. I mean so,
my part of the presentation was not on the numbers.
That was our fantastic publicist over at Harper, one of them,
Sam Fox, who has all the numbers in our head
and is amazing. But she she put together this um
presentation with numbers and it was really interesting to me
(01:25):
to see the boom of books in one that did
not boom before TikTok. Yes, book talk is really amazing.
It sort of revitalizing backlist, which is not something that
publishers really cared about before before TikTok. If you don't
kill it in pre orders in the first week of sales, Kevin,
(01:48):
you was invisible like you are. They're not going to
give you a marketing push there not next time. They're
not going to give you a big budget. They're not
going to give you a book tour. And it is
a little while to me as somebody who who has
a long tail and on my books, I I I
have my books in bookstores for like years after their release,
which is not normal. Like that is not something that
(02:09):
publishers really seek out or or care about until TikTok
came long I think, and then they realize, oh, hey,
people still want to read books even if they're not
coming out next week, even if they're not from some
like hot new debut author. You know, it could be
somebody who's had twenty books since that book came out
that really hit. But TikTok has really, I mean, it
has revitalized an industry that in a lot of ways
(02:34):
was kind of flailing in terms of sales and how
to get books into people's hands, I think, and it
also served as a really good reminder of something that
I have always thought is true that just because the
book is brand new does not mean it's the only
book that matters right now. A book that you haven't
read is a new book. Like when we talk about
coverage of smart bitches, a lot of people are like,
why don't you only talk about new releases? Why don't
(02:55):
you talk more about new releases? There are empty petrillion
books that were just released since I saw did this sentence?
So I can't keep up with all of that, right,
You never know what's going to become popular, And I
think that's one of the things I really love about
this particular social media app. It's not always forward thinking.
Sometimes it is backlist thank you, looking to see what
(03:15):
we already have? Yeah, backlast thinking. I hope that it
revitalizes the backlist for a lot more authors. I agree. Yeah,
I think there's a lot of people who are left
out of the conversation unfortunately, and I hope, I hope
that they can find a place soon. Yes, Well, Today,
to finish up book talk week, we are going to
talk to one of the most popular book talkers whose
(03:37):
recent video was exceptionally good and exited by one Alicia
Rye because it was so great. My name is money
Nous is absolutely brilliant. We cannot wait to talk with her.
Please welcome Marty Well, thank you so much for coming
on the show. Matter you really were so excited to
(03:58):
talk to you and and find out all about what
you do on TikTok. Thank you so much for having me.
I am ready to talk. I have all of the
feelings about TikTok. Because all the feelings great, We're very
excited to hear them. I think that should be the
title of this series, all of the feelings about TikTok,
all the feelings about Yeah, can you tell us a
(04:22):
little bit about your background? What what did you what
do you do when you're not on TikTok? You know,
how did you get into it? I am a lifelong reader,
so I've been, you know, reading since of the womb.
I don't know however early you can go back and
read um. And I've always been really into like creative
(04:44):
endeavor sort of outside of you know, I was the
newspaper kid and the yearbook kid. And and once I
kind of graduated um high school and was in college,
I had this moment where I was like, well, I
don't have any sort of like creative outlets anymore. And
that's when I started and I'm going to age myself
a little bit here, but that's when I started my
personal blog. Uh So, we have a we have one
(05:07):
of the original bloggers ever here. So yes, that's that's
kind of how I found my way to like making
things online. Um and so I've been through every probably
iteration of the online book is space, um so blogs
and good Reads and Tumbler, and I have a YouTube channel,
(05:30):
and I am on book Twitter and now I am
on TikTok. And this is all apart from, like you know,
just what I do in my day job, which is
work in HR. This hasn't always been just my My
hobby is reading and getting to talk to people about
the things that I read and love. So, and what
are your genres of choice? I read incredibly widely, and
(05:51):
I am very like I'm a mood reader. Um So,
I read a little bit of everything. I dabble in
pretty much everything. The only honor that I even, I say,
it's like a note, but I will read a little
bit of it is horror. I don't like to be
scared for fun, but I do love gothic horror. It's
the like Jane Eyre fan girl in me that I
(06:11):
love a good gothic horror. But like in general, horror
is like a pass for me. Um, but everything else like,
I'll try it. I love reading widely. Oh that's wonderful.
What was your TikTok journey? So like when did you
get on the app and how did you find your
way to book talk? Yeah. I have a very similar
story thing to a lot of people my age, and
(06:34):
that was that the pandemic happened, and um, the place
that I was working for sent us to work from home,
and I was working from home for like a couple
of weeks and then was promptly laid off from that job.
We'll be back after this short break. So I found
(07:02):
myself in my apartment without a job, stressed about everything,
and then people were talking a ton about TikTok's I
was like, okay, cool, I have nothing better to do,
and I downloaded the app and I did not resurface
for a while after I downloaded the app, and really
my introduction to TikTok was just like TikTok in general,
(07:23):
I was not getting a ton of like book talk
content at first. I was just you know, the very
like popular TikTok content. Then I started to get book
talk stuff on there, and I was very hesitant to join,
coming from a book tube background, because it can be
a little bit nerve wracking to enter into a community.
(07:43):
But after I was on TikTok for about a year
before I was like made the plunge and started to
upload content, and I was just like, you know what,
I've got all of this book tube content already that
I did like repurpose for TikTok, and like, why don't
I try that? And I just started making content and
(08:03):
I've fell in love with it. I've fallen in love
with like TikTok's version of the book community. So that's
where I am. It's a very different book community. I
found absolutely like you. I've also gone through the pipeline
of blogs and tick Twitter and Instagram. I don't know
if it's the addition of video or what it is,
but it feels like a tighter knit community which is
(08:25):
really nice. Yeah. We we've talked a bit in this
episode in previous episodes about how the algorithm does tend
to favor certain books, certain types of authors, certain content.
I do. I love your content because it is so
heavily focused on making sure that different communities are represented.
(08:47):
Is that what you intended to do when you started
your account or was that just a reaction to what
you were seeing not represented elsewhere? Yeah, it was probably
more my intent because it isn't my first rodeo. Uh
and because TikTok's algorithm is definitely different than YouTube's in
(09:08):
certain ways, but social media spaces in general, like they
all follow a pattern, right, So TikTok's algorithm is not
the only one that we can accuse of like sort
of being racist. And uh, you know, like the the
way the community's favor, especially one's video ones, right, traditional
beauty and like traditional beauty standards and things like that,
(09:30):
that is not exclusive to TikTok um. So I feel
like people who have been in other communities like entering
TikTok will be like, oh this again. And that was
certainly my experience. So I came into it knowing that
I wanted to carry forward some of the work that
I had done on different platforms in terms of um
really challenging people's like ideas of what it means to
(09:51):
quote unquote read diversely, and you know, like how we
critically engage with media and promoting voices that don't often
get moded on in social media spaces. So that was
work I've done before, and I knew that I wanted
to continue. It's so cool to me because I feel
like one thing that book talk does really well is
gets you really excited for books in a way that
(10:13):
like a tweet cannot know. I problished my first book
in two thousand nine, so I've been in this industry
for quite some time. And the challenge initially for us
was to get readers to see our books is something
more than vegetables. Like that was like, you know, like
eat your vegetables, read this book, like you know, you
should do it for this reason, read your diverse people,
broaden your mindset broccoli and yeah, and it was like
(10:38):
it was such a struggle, and I hated that, like
I hated having to feel that way. And and one
thing that I think TikTok does really well is or
in particular like creators such as yourself is is that
it gets you really excited, like you see it as people,
And that I think is invaluable. Is there is there
(10:58):
a book that you'd love to see go ofviral that
you're dying to see go viral because you love it
so much. So there's this book coming out by Alicia Rye.
I have definitely recommended her books on my channels. That's kind.
I was not fishing. I am fishing. I'm fishing. I've
got a big old fishing pole. I am here, Yes,
(11:22):
and every I am here for this book to go viral. No, seriously,
tell me a book that you just made you go,
oh my gosh. I love those books for like books
that I read recently that I really was really impactful
for me. And I would love to see people like
read widely, primarily because I'm not even entirely sure everybody
would like it, but I feel like it would spark conversation. Yes,
(11:43):
Lakewood by making Gettings, which is a story that is
like part sci fi and part horror, but it is
about a woman who her family is in really deep
debt and so she gets an opportunity like a job
offer that seems too good to be drew, but she
needs it. She needs the health insurance, she needs the money,
(12:03):
she needs to help her mom. So she jumps on
the chance to take this job off her. And what
it ends up being is like medical experimentation. So it
is like this like very atmospheric book that is like
part horror that is exploring like the history of medical
experimentation on brown and black folks. And so you're getting
the like her story of experiencing that through kind of
(12:25):
an unreliable narrator because of everything that she is going through,
like we aren't sure what's real, what's not real? And
then it has an open ending, so you like walk
away going what what did I just like read? But
all of all that it sparks in terms of conversation
about what somebody is willing to put another person through
(12:47):
for gain, and like what constitutes humanity and how do
you see other people's humanity? I think is really really interesting.
So that is when I'd love to see viral just
to hear people talk about it. Wow, I will check
that out. That sounds amazing. Book top you know, it
is influencing the publishing industry. It's influencing everything they do
(13:08):
right now, and they're just I think, finally starting to
wake up and realize, oh, yeah, we have to pay
attention here. Do you think it's influencing it for the
better as a consumer of books? The the easiest answer
to me is yes. The base answer to me is yes,
because ultimately I think it is making people excited to
read again, and it is moving books right, people are
(13:31):
excited to read books. It is I think that that
is always, like at the baseline, a good thing, and
I honestly think that any other an therapy sides that
really gets into like the nuance of not only how
is book talk influencing, but how is the publishing industry
reacting to that? Because it is too sided to me,
(13:52):
right like, book talk is not dictating how the publishing
industry reacts to them. We're we're kind of just doing
our community thing and like, you know, talking about books
and liking the books that we like. Uh, And you know,
our sort of field of interaction is with each other,
not necessarily directly what they're going to do in response
to that. So you know, how publishing reacts I think
(14:14):
is part of this equation. But you know, like I
don't know what they're gonna do and and whatnot, So
I think it has there are definitely ways that, you know,
we have to be cautious, I think, and that goes
back to like making sure that we are creating a
community that is welcoming, that is diverse, that promotes voices
that are not sort of like the default of this straight, white,
(14:37):
able bodied, you know, neurotypical in every way that we can.
But that is true for pretty much every community. So
again I don't I just don't think that's just book
talk specific. It's also not your job to manage how
publishing reacts to you. You know, I started, I started
my site in two thousand and five, and sometimes publishing
still doesn't know what to do with me and doesn't
(14:58):
know what to do with the podcast. And publishing is
an industry built on a very antiquated business model. Basically
it works on consignment. And there are a lot of
very young, passionate for people who work in publishing who
are being learned out by an unsustainable workload and unrealistic expectations.
And it's not your job to manage that problem. But
(15:20):
one thing I do see is the number of people
on book talk who struggle saying to publishers, no, you
should actually compensate me for my work because I'm doing
your job. And I am always in favor of having
that conversation because for a very long time I was
expected to provide free promotion for books, and I still
often am expected to provide free promotion for books until
I figured out how to make this my business. And
(15:42):
it's really hard to say that as an individual creator
on a platform that people look down on because it's
young women being enthusiastic about books and knowing that there's many,
many millions of dollars, but you're not going to get
any of them. Yeah. I think Also an important thing
to note is that like a book to talking like that,
it as an emerging market and sort of like hitting
(16:03):
it stride and peak is happening at the same time
where the publishing industry is going through turmoil. Okay, we're
going to take a beat, Go have a sip of water, coffee, wine,
whatever you need. We'll be right back. The publishing industry
(16:26):
is going through turmoil, especially as we saw like the
you know, the exodus of people leaving the industry and um,
you know, just everything that went around the pandemic and
you know how that affected the industry. So a lot
of times I feel like things that are publishing specific
or market specific or around the pandemic just kind of
get tacked onto book talk as an emerging market when
(16:49):
like the they're happening in tandem, but yes they're not,
and they're not necessarily one is not necessarily directly connected
to the other. So I just think it is like
this perfect storm of events that book talking cropped up
at this time. So yes, very much like we we
can only do what we're doing on book talk side
of it, And how publishing kind of reacts for an
(17:11):
industry that is notoriously slow moving is like really interesting
to watch. So what what are your plans for the future,
What do you hope for your account or for yourself
or anything. Um, I am having a ton of fun
on TikTok because it is right now like a hobby
(17:31):
that is fun. I don't know that I have like
many aspirational things. I just want to keep making things
that are bringing me joy and like talking about books,
which is always like how I find myself in these
communities because I like have all of these feelings positive
and negative about like stories, I consume. Um. So yeah,
I just I'm really excited uh to see my channel
(17:53):
keep growing and reaching people and sparking conversation and and
and whatnot. So that's where I am right now, just
kind of like happy to be here. Good, good, excellent,
and where where can people find you? On TikTok or otherwise.
My handle is at my name is Bodinus on TikTok
and also on YouTube it's my name is boddiness, and
(18:13):
also on Twitter it's my name is bodiness, and also
on Instagram. We stand a consistent point. I know I
can never be I I wish I could be that consistent.
Everything's always taken by the time I get there's a
good job, thank you. Um. And then on top of that,
I also have a log in a podcast where it's
looking at media more in general. So we talk about
(18:36):
and we review books and movies and TV shows. Um.
And that is Snark Squad and the podcast is Snark
Squad Pod. And then we're on a bit of a
season break. But I also have the podcast Cooler Than Homework,
in which we are watching every Disney Channel original movie
in order. That's fantastic. Yeah, So that's me. I feel
(19:01):
like I need to send you snacks. That's such an undertaking. Yeah,
I'm sure. I'm sure. The older stuff is interesting, having
your childhood memories challenged by reality. Yeah, that's rough. That's rough.
I don't know if i'd want to do this, but
good for you. We're doing. But thank you so much
for coming on. We really enjoyed this. We hope you
(19:23):
did too, And I'll talk too soon. What catch you
on TikTok? Thanks Alicia. I love doing these conversations with you.
It is the bright spot of my week. It is
the bright spot of my week two, and it is
something that I treasure. But I think we do need
to talk about some changes that are happening. You might
have noticed that Love Struck is going through some changes
(19:44):
in the feed, even though the show will continue to evolve.
Sarah and I have decided to take a step back
from hosting Love Strong and it really pains me to
say that. Yeah, we are most bummed. Yeah we I
mean we love working together. This is Sarah. I have
wanted to work with you on a project for us.
I think as long as that we've been friends. Uh,
(20:06):
this has been a dream to see you every week
reliably to work every day together. Uh and to also
work with our amazing team Abigail Steckler Little Scorpions Studios,
Jen Jacobs are fantastic editor, and Jesse Epstein are amazing,
amazing researcher. What a what a great pool of talent
(20:27):
this was. And and I I hope I'm certain, you
know what, I don't even hope. I'm certain that we
are going to work together again, very very soon, because
I will not have it any other way. It is
so rare to start something like this with so many
different people involved and have it go so smoothly and
be such a highlight every week. Every week we recorded,
(20:48):
I would think, Wow, that was so fun. I cannot
wait for people to hear that episode. And so I
especially want to say thank you to you we're listening
to this episode than thank you for welcoming us into
your day. Thank you for all of the reviews and
the comments and all of the encouragement. The fact that
you would email us and say, hey, I have a
(21:10):
love story and I want to share it with you
means everything. That you made a place for us in
your podcast player, given how many podcasts there are in
the world, is an honor. We are so happy to
have been part of your life for a short time.
We always send each episode of a Love to Go,
So for this Love to Go, Alicia, what have you
(21:30):
learned from this podcast? I have learned so much from
this show that I don't know if I can distill
it all in one thing. But if I try, if
I really really try, I think the thing that I
have learned most from all of our many, many guests,
five days a week for how long, is that love
is truly an active verbs. People tell me that all
(21:52):
the time, and they tell everybody that when you're newly
engaged and you're happy with each other, they go, oh,
just wait, just wait, because because it's gonna you're gonna
be miser world so much work. And that always scared
me a little bit wor I was like, oh my god,
it's gonna be work. It's gonna be work. And what
I've realized that's hot garbage. I agree with that. I
agree with that very much. I I don't think that
there's anything wrong with being happy with a person um
(22:15):
and I think it's quite possible to be happy with
a person for a very long period of time. You
can attest to that, and so what. But the thing
that used to scare me about that is the word work.
And I realized now it's not really work to love someone.
It's quite easy to love someone. What is work is
(22:37):
remaining kind and thoughtful and consider it and and loving
all the active words that you have to keep remembering
to do and remember that you know somebody is coming
from a good place. That is work. That is because
because everything in the world tells you not to, because
it's so easy not to. But of all the people
(22:57):
that we've had on this show, I mean that is
sort of the common denominator in any form of love,
whether it's parental, you know, familial, siblings, romance, is that
you have to keep it active. Yeah, I love as
a choice, love as a choice. Yeah. I have learned,
(23:18):
as cheesy as it is, that love actually really is
all around. Like I don't love that movie a lot,
but it's absolutely true. Love actually, really, truly, no kidding,
is all around, And if you take the time to
find it and look for it and celebrate it, it
is a wonderful antidote to the feeling that everything is
(23:40):
going wrong. As long as there's still love in the world,
everything is going right. Everything, Yeah, I fully agree with that.
Now you can find us in lots of places on
the Internet. We're not going anywhere, We're not leaving the internet.
You can you can pry the Internet out of my hands.
You can always find me. It's Smart Fitches, tra actually books.
My podcast. There is smart podcast Trashy Books. It's five
(24:04):
episodes deep and each week there's something interesting and fun.
And if you enjoy listening to me talk to people,
including episodes with Alicia, there are lots and lots of
places to listen to me talking to a microphone. Absolutely
and I you can find me all over every social media.
You can find me on Instagram at Alicia ry Writes,
on TikTok at the real Alicia Rye, and on Twitter
(24:27):
at Alicia Ride. But I'm not on there much. And
you can also find me on YouTube. I have a
YouTube channel called Quarantine Cuisine, and my fiancay Kay and
I will have a YouTube shortly called The Happy Place,
So you can come find us there where we're just
talking about things that make us happy that might make
you happy to Our researcher is Jesse Epstein, our editor
(24:47):
is Jen Jacobs. We are produced by Abigail Steckler and
Little Scorpion Studios with executive producer Frolic Media. This is
an I Heart Radio podcast. We love you very much,
yes what we do, and we'll still around. We're not
going it, Nope, you can't get rid of us. And
we wish you now, always and forever a very happily
(25:09):
ever after. I'm in love with you. That A would
say to you, God's good to see you should love.
I'm in love with you. I'm in love with you.
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