March 23, 2023 • 32 mins
The world's most renowned criminal defense lawyer, Alan Dershowitz, is here to discuss his new book "Get Trump" and the Thinkers learn how to massage the truth by a master. But first, an update on how Dan's Tesla is ALMOST perfect and why bailouts for corporations is capitalism at its best (student loan forgiveness is still socialism run amok).
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
You're listening to The Man Thinkers podcast, a show that
forges a new roadmap for the modern man on how
to best live life. For the record, we are not Nazis.
You were supposed to be here like thirty minutes ago.
When I apologize, normally, I'm very on time. I take
time very so you are punctual. Give you that you
are a punctual. Thank you punctual. I drive a Tesla,
(00:23):
very proud of that. You know you do. I'm jealous.
But the steering wheel popped off, but it's not. It's
not the Tesla's fault. I think I might have grabbed
it to our or something. And so let's back up
for sacon. The steering wheel popped off. What are you
talking about? Yeah, just fell out. It happens. You have
to remember when you own a car, especially one that's
a beast that's made by Elon, you know that there's
(00:43):
gonna be problems. So some cars get flat tires, other cars,
you know, transmission dies. We don't have that because it's
it's electric like this. So sometimes the steering wheel will
pop off and that's okay. Yeah, pop, just the word pop.
It's a very specific world like it made that sound.
So you'll just be driving, maybe even take a turn,
and then all of a sudden just happens. What happens,
The wheel just falls into your lap. Yeah, and then
(01:05):
you're just going At that point, Wow, that seems so
you kind of have to shift your weight around and
just you know, you try to pop it back on.
You just take your foot off the gas. At that point,
you try to roll into the nearest divider or pull softly,
softly crash head on is kind of the way you
get out of that situation. I just have a quick
hospital visit. It's really no big deal. You go to
a good hospital. They're going to take care of you
(01:26):
in about eighteen hours. So that's why I was a
little late. Well I listen. I mean, at the end
of the day, you know, as much as I hate
to admit it, you are my friend and I'm glad
that you are safe, and you know I don't need that,
but thank you. I don't know if you saw this,
but it's been all over the news. Silicon Valley Bank
recently went put okay along with Signature Bank. First Republic
Bank is in trouble. I mean, this has been a
(01:46):
shit show of epic proportions in the banking system. I mean,
over two hundred and ten billion dollars of assets collapsed overnight.
I can't stand hearing yet, because you know, when a
bank fails, I take it personally. I love banks so much.
I have posters of banks on my walk because I
love banks more than I love people. Because it's what
you want to be. It's what people want to aspire
to be. Is not just be a human, but to
(02:07):
be a bank. You know, you look at a bank
and you say, that's where that's where it all happens.
That has more money than I do, so it's better
than me. I don't know what America is coming to.
You know when they say, oh, less banks, you know
more what what do you want to put in another
Whole Foods? You know, get out of here, man. I
want to bank check. I want to bank that's open
four hours a day. Quality produce good quality produce. Well,
the produce a Whole Foods is excellent. I will say
that you have the protoce. And also it's run by
(02:29):
Bezos now and he's made it so much better. He has,
but he's a bit of you know. I respect his billionaireness.
I respect his money. I respect what he's baldness. Big
man is bald. He's just one of the best examples
of a bald guy, you know, and it's sitting you know,
when you're when a big bald walks into a room,
it's you know, talk about big dick energy. I mean,
that's it. That is what a big dick exactly. A
(02:50):
bald man just looks like a large penis, if we're
being honest, a big walking dick. When you're bald, you're
a big walking dick. Well, we just need to be
very scared right now, because that is when you can
make the best financial decisions. Right It's a fight or
flight situation. It just shocks me that there are people
who think they go to the bank to get money
and that there's going to be money there. Why do
(03:10):
you think you know, that's just not how it works. Guys. Guys,
you give your money to the bank and then they
go do things with it. It is now the bank's money.
It is not your money. It's gone. It's gone by
your money. Love, don't expect to get it back. When
people realize this, there might be a huge run on
all the banks. Absolutely, banks should be in a constant
state of being bailed out. I think we should think
of banks like a teenager who receives allowance every week
(03:33):
or every money like this to kind of shore up
some of these holes, to make the public continue to
think that you actually are solvent and have money when
the reality is you don't have ship. Did you have
your personal checking in? It's a it's known for kind
of tech entrepreneurs and whatnot. That doesn't seem like you're
I didn't have my money there, and my money is
sort of tied up in some good, good investments right now.
Man Cooin, of course, really is in a bear market.
(03:54):
It's in a bear market. But that's the time you
need a bear to get a ball. Two bears make
a bull, that's what they female bear and a mail bear,
and that'll make you a bowl and they will birth
a ball. And you know, I have an extensive beanie
babies collection, and that you do? How's that going? You
kind of went down the beatie babies rabbit hole on eBay? Correct?
I did? And I and you know what, you can't
make money without spending you know, six hundred seven hundred
thousand dollars on beanie babies and so hopefully get into it.
(04:17):
That's a lot of money, dam because I'm gonna make
a lot of money. So you don't actually have any
cash deposits anywhere. You just have a house full of
beanie babies and a digital wallet full of mancoin essentially. Sure,
it's not technically a house. It is. Um, it's a
structure that I'm in right now. And you know a
little bit okay, yeah, um squatting, I mean barely squatting.
(04:37):
I'm allowed here. It's it's fine, everything's going to go great,
it's going according to plan. You gotta spend money to
make money, and I'm doing just that. It's like, you know, Biden,
Sleepy Joe, fail out the banks now stop freaking student debt,
Like oh yeah, we're gonna give all this money to
the student, to our students, but not our fucking big bankers.
Like what's wrong with you? Given as a student ever
(04:58):
done anything? Literally, job is to take information from someone else.
They're just takers. I mean, the whole thing's absurd. These
children took out loans when they were basically adults, sixteen,
seventeen years old. I mean they're basically adults. You can't
vote or smokes, basically an adults, Why do I have
to bail you out? Right? When you knew the loan again,
you were sixteen, seventeen years old and someone said just
sign this and this is how you get to take
(05:19):
classes and your education is going to pay for a
good career. And that didn't pan out because they should
have known. College is so stupid, is actually pointless, so pointless,
you know it's so pointless? And would they go to
learn some liberal arts nonsense? They're sitting around eating what
avocado toasts, spending all their money on lot pays, Like
shut up, I mean those are Have you ever had
some of the avocado sets? I really love avocado and
(05:41):
I really like toast, so to me, when you combine
the two, that's the ultimate dish. It's almost like refreshing
right in a way, very flavorful, but it's lights are fantastic.
And the little things they put on the top of
the milk, but like a leaf or something, It's like,
how do they do that? Those barristas, it's really impressed.
They're they're talented people and these people they it's such
a shame they have no money. But because they took
out some stupid loan. Now I should not be the
(06:02):
person to have to say, hey, okay, you messed up,
but in regards to the banks, they did mess up, right,
but we should we we should bail them out? Right? Wait? Wait,
so who do we who do we hate here? So
we okay, so we're saying I'm just kind of I'm
getting tripped up on the logic. So me too. So
we you think we should we Okay, we want to
bail out the banks, but we don't want to bail
(06:23):
out our youth. Is that what we're saying? Well, just students.
Don't say youth because I think that I think we don't.
We don't like students because they're you know, they do
like protests and stuff. We're banks protests. Bail out our corporations.
Don't bail out our youth or our students, as you said, students,
because that's socialism, was exactple. But bailing out banks, they're
not people exactly. It's a corporation. It's good. That's how
(06:43):
it's corporate capitalism. When you bail out a corporation, that's capitalism.
When you bail out a person, that's socialism. I think,
you know, we're we made a really good case here
that banks need to be bailed out, A perpetual patment
of fund for all banks UBI, universal bank income. That's
really that's a genius idea. Have you heard about this?
It reminds me that there's this thing that people want
(07:04):
to be paid every month for doing nothing. Oh you
mean universal basic income. Yes, yeah, that's good because the
bank idea is great. Why promote laziness? I just you
got to give people a purpose. And the purpose in
life is to make money, make as much money as possible,
and then you die, and that's how life is. And
I hope you're putting some of that money into a
bank to keep those healthy. And you know, thinkers, we
have an excellent show for you today, and we have
a guest who knows a thing or two about law
(07:26):
and maybe he can help us instill this type of
policy into our banking system. Mister Alan Dershowitz this year,
you know him. He's a famed lawyer. He represented Trump
journey impeachment trials. He's represented Mike Tyson for a rape charge.
I mean, this guy has protected for a murder charge.
And this guy's a thinker and also a talker. Thinkers, Okay,
(07:47):
we're gonna let this interview is a little bit longer
because he just goes off and it's really interested a
lot to think about, and I got to say, you know,
it was really impressive to listen to and watch such
an old bag of bones just a mile a minute
he could still go. So stick around for that interview.
It's coming up shortly after. Of course, a word from
our sponsors, and guys, just get ready for these sponsors,
(08:08):
because some of these are actually quite really good. And
just so you know, mister Dershwitz will do us some
intro stuff beforehand, like without you here, but right now
I'm going to introduce him and we'll just get right
into it. Okay, just call me Allen, not mister. Okay,
Sorry I got scared. Okay. Our next guest is the
(08:31):
most notable criminal lawyer in the entire world. He has
represented the likes of Jeffrey Epstein, Harvey Weinstein, Julian Massage,
and most notably, former President Donald Trump. His new book,
Get Trump with the Threat to Civil Liberties, due Process,
and our constitutional rule of Law is available now. Please
welcome the very distinguished Alan Dershwists. Alan, thank you so
(08:51):
much for being on Man Thinkers. Oh it's my pleasure
to beyond. I think of myself as not only a
man thinker, but on a good day, I think a
woman too. So oh, interesting, Well, you would typically not
encourage you to do that. The women in my life
think a lot better than the men in my life.
So that's interesting that Dan doesn't have a lot of
women in his life. Alan, so that's probably why he
(09:13):
thinks that. But you and I, you know, we know
some great women. Obviously Dan not as much. But I
think Alan I are on the same page. Dan, You're
a little left out here, that's all right, Alan. You
have a new book entitled Get Trump. Nobody reads books
anymore because they're all being banned for good reason too.
I mean, we got to get rid of some of
these books. They're bad for society. So why should people
read your book? Well, they shouldn't if they want to
(09:33):
get Trump and want to violate the Constitution in order
to do so. The only many people do. Yeah, the
only people who should read my book are people who
care more about civil liberties in constitutional law than they
do about politics. Look, I'm not a Trump supporter. I
maintain I have a constitutional right to vote against them.
For the third time. I voted against him in sixteen,
I voted against him twenty and I want to vote
against them in twenty four. But I don't want some
(09:54):
bureaucrat or some day in New York to decide that
the American public shouldn't have the rights of vote for him.
So the book Get Trump is all about how we
should get Trump through legitimate means of not electing him
to office. But don't distort the constitution and the process,
because today it's Trump and tomorrow it's going to be
some Democrat. Alan, when you were representing him, did he
ever bring up the fact that you didn't vote for him?
(10:16):
Was he annoyed by that? Like every five minutes. The
two issues that came up more than any other in
my conversations for Alan, why don't you vote for me?
And Alan, why don't your people vote for me? And
I keep saying I don't have any people, No, no, no,
I mean the Jews. I was the best president ever
for Jews. I was the best president ever for Israel,
and I would say, miss President, that may be correct,
but Jews are not a single group. We vote on
(10:39):
the right to choose, on gay rights, on a range environment,
the climate range of issues. So you know, no, my
people are not going to vote for you as long
as you take views that are incompatible with the views
of my people. You know, you've said you've defended some
of the worst people in the world, just terrible, terrible,
just scum of the earth. Let me ask you this,
having been around so many scummy people, and again as
(11:02):
their lawyer, not hanging out socially, what is there a
thread there in terms of similarities between this scumbag and
that scumbag? Is there one personality trait that you've noticed
in some of your clients. They all possess a few
First of all, a lot of my clients did things
to get more of what they have unlimited amounts of
and giving up what they have limited amounts of. For example,
(11:23):
Mike Tyson went to jail for having sex with somebody.
I didn't think he raped her myself, I think he
was that, But in any event, with set I get it. Sorry,
I thought I thought you had seen it. And what
did he give for having sex with one additional person?
He ended up losing his youth, spending you know, two
years or so in jail at a time when he
could have been world champion. I've seen that trade among
(11:44):
a lot of my clients. They give up what they
have limited amounts of life. So that's one trait. The
other trait is narcissism. They're too good to get caught.
Oh come on, nobody'll ever catch me. I've been doing
this all my life. I've been getting away with it.
What makes you think they're going to catch me this time? Well,
the answer is if I hadn't caught you this time,
you wouldn't be with me. I only get to represent
people who they caught. So people are very egotistical and
(12:07):
think they can get away with anything I work. Carolyn. Sorry,
somebody came into the house and was just making an
incredible amount of noise. So let's just someone walking into
your house. Is that an intruder? No, they knocked on
the door, my wife and son. Where'd you get those shorts?
Those are cool? Oh my god, you weren't supposed to
see that. What I do when I'm on television, when
(12:27):
I'm away in Miami Beach, Florida, I wear shorts and
then I you know, disguised myself by wearing an ice
jacket and tart. You know, you still go out like that?
Business up top, party down low. Oh. Let me ask
you this during the Trump defense trial. How many times
did you use the phrase that's not illegal, it's just
very bad many times? And I've used that hundreds of
times in my life because as a criminal defense lawyer,
(12:51):
mostly I represent people who did bad things, and my
job is to prove that they didn't cross the line
from bad to unlawful. In your in your new book,
you state that a president or a former president is
not above the law, but neither should he or she
be below the law. I thought that was a really
interesting quote. What did you mean by below the laws?
That you know, how we treat poor people or migrants.
(13:12):
Are they people that you would consider below the law?
What I mean is what's going on literally right now
with the District Attorney of New York trying to indict
Donald Trump for a made up crime. If you target people,
if you say I'm getting after Trump, I'm going to
find some law that gets them that's below the law.
That's not what should happen. It's started with at capone.
They couldn't get al capone from murdering dozens and dozens
(13:33):
of people, so they got them on income tax violation.
And you know Stalin and Barrier, the head of the KGB,
at an interesting conversation back in the thirties and barious
show me the man and I'll find you the crime.
And that's not what we want America to turn into
where people are targeting. It's interesting the Bible gives to
instructions to judges. One, don't take bribes. That's easy. But
(13:54):
that's the second one. The first one is low taker panim,
do not recognize faces. So that's what a blindfold over
the justice statute represents. Don't do justice based on who
people are, but based on what they've done. I would
say if I was you know, and I was a lawyer,
but when I met a client, first thing I say,
you're guilty. You make me sick, And I think that
is a good way to get on just him know
(14:14):
what they're working with. You know, you make me sick.
You're trash. So I meet Mike Tyson and he says
to me, in front of all of his handlers, Gon
King and everybody, he says to me, so do you
think I'm innocent? I said, Mike, I have no idea.
I didn't read the transcript. I wasn't at the trial.
I would just be pandering to you if I said
you're innocent. I'll look at the transcript and I'll make
the best argument I can. He said, all right, enough
of that legal exc What do you think of me
as a person? And I said, Mike looked me in
(14:36):
the eye. He looked me in the eye and I said, Mike,
you're a schmuck. He looked at me. Oh my god.
His handlers almost hit me. What do you mean I'm
a schmuck? I said, you went up to a hotel
room at three o'clock in the morning with a woman
you didn't know and without a new witnesses, and you
allowed yourself to be falsely convicted. You're a schmuck. And
then he turned to the schmuck move and he said,
you know, Ellen has called me a schmuck. I wish
(14:56):
you folks had called me a schmuck before I went
up to that room. Maybe I wouldn't be here. I mean, so, Alan,
is it safe to say to our listeners out there,
just don't go to a hotel room with some woman
you don't know well at three in the morning. I
don't care what the context is, and I don't care
if she's a fox, don't go in that door. Absolutely right,
absolutely right. And here I'll take your call and I'll
tell you what to do and what not to do.
(15:17):
And if you want to go into that room, I
have a couple of witnesses video camera now talking. But
don't do it, Mike Tyson. Make it an orgy, and
that way, no one can claim something happened that didn't
happen because there's many people there. So you say, listen, miss,
I think you're very beautiful. I'd love to enter that
door with you, but you gotta call some of your
friends first, because we are not setup. We got to
get a nice setup going and make a movie. But
(15:39):
is that a lesson alan for our thinkers and our
listeners out there. It's just like, listen, look somebody I
call him a schmuck. They will respect you for it. Well,
they will sometimes respect you for it, and they will
sometimes punch you in the mouth for it. Many punches,
mostly they have been verbal punches. Defending President Trump, I
lost all my old friends on Martha's vineyard. Larry David
(16:00):
I was a disgusting person. That's good though, right, that's
so he's just kind of putting it out there, you know,
kind of like what we were saying of, Hey, you
meet your client, you say you make me sick. So
Larry's just kind of following that that I make him sick,
even though he came from my house for dinner many times,
worked out in my gym, helped it. Oh wow, help
his daughter again into college. But once I said, well,
he's kind of a coastal elite. Yeah, you know, he's
(16:20):
a sick of We mentioned you and Larry had worked
out together. What kind of routines do you guys do together?
We're doing bench press squad full body. What were we
talking about? I used to be his big advisor on
things Jewish. Oh here's a good one. I'm in the house.
This is a name dropper. I'm in the House of
Lords about to make a speech the House of Lords.
I get a phone call from Larry on my cell phone, Alan,
(16:40):
I need you for a minute. It's really upset. I'm
in the House of Lords. No, no, no, just take
a second. Take a second. Is it worse to call
somebody and then they use the male term for a
penis or the female term for a vagina? What's worse? Content? Right?
I can't even say those words. I'm in the house
of words, not at all. I need you because I
have a bit. And somebody called somebody a sea and
somebody called somebody in d what's worse? I said, all right,
(17:02):
you need a ruling here. The C is worse than
the D. So I gave me away. And there was
a famous episode with where he accidentally called someone a count. Yeah, well,
the ants he has a beloved count. There was a typo,
fantastic episode. I love the show. I mean it's great,
and god, it would kill me if he didn't like
me anymore politics at this point. So that's right. I
(17:25):
think we can all agree on your ruling there, Alan
that you know, counts are always worse than dicks. Let's
just be honest about that, in every facet, in every context. Yes,
this is the man thinkers, not cun thinkers. We know
what the body men often think with so exactly, and
many of your clients have done that. Yes, lawyers have
to learn a great many things when I represent people.
I didn't, you know, when I represented Junia Assange, I
(17:46):
didn't know anything about computer technology or how drop boxes
work or anything. You learn it, you are you your case.
And then you quickly forget it. That's that seems a
little worrisome to defend someone who's so steeped in technology
to say, I don't know, I don't know what think
about this true, but hey, what can you do? You
know Julian Sange, since you've spent so much time with
him one on one, let me ask you this because
(18:07):
you know he kind of dated Pamela Anderson for a while,
which really blew me away because I thought she is
way out of his league. So what is it about
Julian that do you think get that attracted such a fuck? Well? No,
first of all, I think a lot of men date
people who are out of their league. I married him
way way way out of my league. And Pamelanders they
don't look too necessarily the shape of your you know,
(18:30):
nose of your ears. They look at I thought you're
gonna say penis. When I was growing up, an initial
term that the girls in my neighborhood you had to
be a gap if they wanted a date had to
be a gap, and if weren't a gap, they wouldn't
date you no matter how good you look, or they
would date you no matter how bad you look. You
had to be a gap. What is a gap? Good
earning potential? And and if you have good earning potential,
(18:53):
you'll get the girl. If you don't, why women women
just like money. That's all they're about is ultimately and
cloud out. And if you're not one of those guys
pulling it in, you got no shot. You could be
an ugly troll. But if you got gep, yep, yep.
I remember once walking down up Forget, friend of mine,
who was not the most attractive guy in the world, was,
let's just say it, yeah, And he was with a beautiful,
(19:13):
beautiful woman and on the street said, I bet you
this guy has an airplane, and of course he did.
For this next question, I just want to state I
hate libraries. You know, they're dirty socialist institutions. They're disgusting.
But your local library in Martha's Vineyards has not invited
(19:34):
you to speak there, and so you're suing them. Can
you tell us about this? Yeah? I used to speak
every year. I was the most popular speaker. This is
a relatively of course, whom they would fill it up.
They would have people outside talk about getting the day
I defended Donald Trump. Suddenly, first we couldn't invite you
because you're too popular and the and we can't deal
with the crowd. So I said, we'll just put limits,
(19:55):
say the first fifty people. No, no, And they made
every excuse and they banned me, and I writing to
assume them because their taxpayer library, that's my money. Imagine
if the library in the South said we're only gonna
have speakers who are pro life, no pro choice speakers,
or only gonna have white speakers, no African American speakers. Right,
little did this library no right that you speaking there
every year was so important to your ego? Right? Like
(20:18):
they didn't know that and they walked into the lions then,
because as soon as they didn't invite you, you said, listen,
I'm the best lawyer in the world. I would have
gotten Jesus Christ off, I'm suing your ass. So who
do you think they're going to get to defend their
side of the case if it ends up going to
drive Oh they have. Boy, here's mostly liberals who would
never defend them if they were banning liberals and only
but you know, I'm a liberal. What people forget about, right,
(20:39):
because I'm you know, one of the most more liberal
people on Martha's vineyard. But I'm not a rattle. I'm
very much anti woke, anti radical, anti hard left, civil libarion,
and that's where I have been all my life, and
we're anti working well. But I think to the thinkers
out there in the listeners, it would be nice for
someone from a legal perspective, like, why is the woke
(21:01):
mob so dangerous to American society? And you're in your mind, Alan,
they're much more dangerous than McCarthyism of awards because McCarthyism,
I got it old people reflecting past values. But woke
is the thing of the future. Do you want to
get that call? Or people who are professor supported and
so it tells us what the world is going to
(21:23):
look like twenty thirty, forty fifty years from now. That's
why it's so dangerous. And what does that world look like?
It looks like brave new world, It looks like nineteen
eighty four. Big brother in this case and Big Sister
are people of the left and shouldn't surprise anybody. The
hard left has always been censorial, Stalin censored, Cuba, you know,
Castro censored. So the hard left has never had tolerance
(21:44):
for free speech. So why be surprised? And do you
where do you see this all going? Alan? Do you
think that wokeism will gain in popularity and strength over
time or do you think it will receive I think
it will gain his strength at universities. I do think
that the Republicans were to put up a reasonable, moderate, centerist, conservative,
anti woke candidate, they could win the next election. They're
(22:06):
not going to win with Trump, and they're not going
to win with somebody who's an extremist. You know. The
other problem we have is we're killing meritocracy in America.
People want to pick people based on marriage. Oh, of
course you do. When when you pick your surgeon, you're
not looking for diversity, You're not looking for inclusion. You're
looking for the best damp surgeon you can get. You know,
it's interesting. My wife and I have big music fans.
We go a lot to symphony orchestras in the opera
(22:27):
and we notice that the number of overt minorities obvious
minorities in orchestras is very, very small, and it's too bad.
It means a lot of these kids don't get a
chance to really play music. But orchestras pick their players
behind the screen. They're not allowed to recognize faces. They
can only recognize musical talent. And you know, that's the
(22:48):
way it should be in medical school, that's the way
it should be in a pilot school, in engineering school.
Maybe not in podcast school. Yeah, with Dan and I
should probably lose our jobs. Yeah, but totally respect. I mean,
and I've recommended that George Louse's job well to get
many times. And honestly I'm the one that actually, I'll
do it again the end of your job because they
wanted to let you go. But anyway, it's a great
(23:09):
time to actually quire you. Yeah, Alan, what do you
think about Rhonda Santis? You know you mentioned the Conservatives
running an anti woke candidate, which Santis has a pretty
anti wo platform. What do you think this is name dropping?
But my wife and I pleased with him and his
wife and one other in Florida in Miami, and both
my wife and I, my wife is slightly to the
left of me. We both liked the DeSantis people as
(23:31):
a couple. They talked about education and climate and environment.
We liked them. We came away saying, wow, this is
a this is a comer. And then he decided was
going to try to become the next Trump, and he
moved to extremes. He became a different person when it
became obvious that he could become the next Trump. I
think there's a good chance he will be the candidate
(23:52):
for the Republican Party and he'll do a very good job.
I think that he has a good chance of beating
Biden if Biden rust I don't think Biden's going to
run by the way and less Trump runs. I think
Biden is happy to be a one term president, but
he feels a responsibility of Trump once because he knows
he can beat Trump. And we've talked a lot about
people you've represented, but now you have had had some
legal issues yourself. But I wanted to I've been doing
(24:14):
nothing but defending myself for the last eight years. Finally, yes,
and so you were recently exonerated on charges from that
whatever Virginia Guffree or whatever, and I just wanted to
say congrats on that. That's amazing. I was curious did
you celebrate. Did you throw a big party. Maybe you
get a little massage or something to you know, rub
it in her face. I'm not a massage type guy,
but we didn't because eight years of turmoil. This is
(24:37):
not a person I ever met and never heard of.
I'm not a flirt. I never touched any woman other
than my wife during the relevant time period. And the
reason that I ended up the way I did was
because I had nothing to hide. I've never had sex
with anybody other than my wife during the relevant time period.
I've never ever done anything so I could fight back.
Others who were accused couldn't fight back. Prince Andrew had
(24:57):
to settle. I like that when you say during the
relevant time period. I like that as little sneaky. Uh.
I feel like good law speak in there. What was
the law speak? You can ask me, you know, whether
I had sex and I was, you know, unmarried twenty
five not relevant fifty years ago. I'm not going to
get into that, but I'm happy to have all of
my records revealed. Let me let me all right, let
(25:17):
me put it this way. Never asd sex with anybody
related to Jeffrey Epstein, never had sex in any way
that was inappropriate, So I can be very only appropriate. Sea. Well,
you know, what do you think is going on? You
know you're getting canceled, say by the library. Are you
there's this whole woke mob after you. Do you think
it's because you were invited to these parties with kids there?
You know? Are they just jealous of those parties. I
(25:38):
wasn't invited to any of those parties. The only time
I was ever on Epstein's island was when he first
bought the island. He invited me and my wife and
my daughter, and nobody was on the island except us,
and so I never went to a party on the island.
I never went to the island when it was the
notorious island. I hope that Epstein. I hope that he
videotaped every moment of his life so that people could
(26:01):
see I didn't do anything wrong. It seems that that's
your recommendation for a lot of things, like, Look, if
you're gonna have sex in a hotel, you're gonna have
sex on get some cameras to film everything. Everything should
be a live podcast your whole life. Other than Big Brother,
that's probably the best brig shard and you can have Well, Alan,
let you knew Epstein personally, so I got to ask you. No,
you don't know the answer to this question, but do
you think he took his own life? Yes? Or no.
(26:21):
I do. I think that he was a man who
loved luxury, and the idea of spending the rest of
his life in a jail cell was probably something he
couldn't accept, So I think he probably did. But I
think he was helped. I think that somebody paid off
the guards to turn off the video and to take
his roommate out, making it possible for him to kill himself.
But I do think he probably killed himself. But you know,
(26:42):
there are now four or five cases of people who
have committed suicide based on being accused in the Me
Too movement. That's why it's so important for the prosecutors
to go after those who make false accusations. Any lawyer
who encouraged a woman to make a false accusation, any
woman who made a false accusation, should be proud and imprisoned. Absolutely.
I've always said this to you, Dan Is, you might
(27:04):
want to consider maybe myself, maybe, because then yeah, would
be the ultimate defense in court, is like, hey, this
guy killed himself, Like clearly he's innocent. You guys drove
him crazy and then he jumped off a ledge, you
know what I mean. I mean, just to fill an
Allen and I'm I've been accused of sexual harassment by
a number anytimes. Many people take that as an admission
of guilts rather than innocent. So interesting, and if you're innocent,
(27:27):
fight back, call me, call another good lawyer, fight back always. Well,
you know you've written a number of books. You've also
you've written a number of op eds. One of those
was about lowering the age of consent to fifteen, and
I thought that was just such a smart idea, because
then you have all these fifteen year olds who could
smoke and drain it exactly, and they would be a
fan of yours. And now you've got all these people
(27:49):
who might buy your books or hey, vote for you.
If you ran for something, is that why you did it?
To get it? No? I did it, you know, twenty
five thirty years ago, And it was a feminist position.
The argument back then was that the age of consent
for sex should be the same as the age of
consent for having an abortion, and many feminists present at
that point of view, as did I. The age of
consent in Europe is much lower, in Canada is much lower.
(28:12):
The United States had the highest age of consent. And
what I don't like is a situation where many, many
people are committing crimes and a lot of seventeen and
sixteen year olds are having sex and prosecutors then have
the discretion. Most of the cases in the South, or
cases were black men eighteen nineteen, we're having sex with
seventeen year old white women, white girls, and they were
the ones who were being prosecuted. So if that was
(28:33):
the reason that outdate, I owed it well before I
ever met Jeffrey Epstein. So I wrote it as part
of my academic career, and I stand by it. It It
was the right thing, then it's the right thing now,
you know. And I think about how fifteen year olds,
if the age of consent was lowered, if they were adults,
they could be contributing to the economy. They're working full
time jobs now. Then they'd really want a party. Then
you can get a heck of a massage on a
(28:54):
party island. That would be a great, great I never
had a massage on an island. Sorry, I'm sarting to
mix up some of these notes. Well, that's just perfect
for the man thinkers, you know, because you're thinking and
you want to get it out there. And this is
the podcast for letting men get out absolutely need to
get my ideas out and to read my getting get Trump. Um,
(29:15):
I would appreciate the title. I'd be interested in hearing
your views if you want to write to me, because
I love hearing from my readers. Where can they reach you? Well,
I'm just my email um uh dirsh at law dot
Harvard dot edu and send me your number. I might
call you back. Who knows, who knows? You might get
a call in the middle of the night from Alan
Dershwitz say don't go into that hotel room at ten
(29:37):
o'clock usually. Well, Alan, thank you so much for being
on man thinkers. We really appreciate your time and enjoy
your questions and your equips and your responses, and keep
doing good things. That was fantastic. I a real hero,
a true hero, a personal hero of mine. Um be
(30:00):
because he's incredibly Jewish and incredibly successful. He is a
true gap. A lot of earning potential, there, a lot
of thinking potential. Here's what I learned. Gray area. Keep
it in the gray area. They can't prove that you're
guilty of anything. I'm wondering already how you can apply
the gray area defense to your sexual harassment person. What
I did wasn't illegal. Maybe not so great, but it
(30:21):
wasn't illegal in the relevant time period. And that's just
And I shouldn't have to defend myself against these cunts. Well, yeah,
last part's tough. I think calling the women counts in
a court of law would be not a great look.
But Alan was saying, it's works. Is that what he said.
I don't think that's what he said something like that. No,
I think he said, we'll listen back. I love I
(30:41):
love that he's going after that library too, you know,
such a small, little nothing, but he said fuck you,
and he's just coming down home exactly I can. And also,
let's just be honest. Libraries are basically just homes for
the homeless. I mean homelessly will just go there all
day and they masturbate to porn on library computers. It's
a joke. Every other country is laughing at us for
library system. I mean, libraries are essentially just masturbation hubs,
(31:04):
homeless masturbation hubs. He was a charming guy. You know
what I loved about him too. He was willing. First
of all, He's willing to call his friend ugly. He
was like I was walking down the street one day
with I like that ass friend, I love I love
that about him. He just shoots great shooter. Just so
he was. This guy was a freak nasty boy. And
if you're saying, hey, young girls should be able to
make decisions for themselves regardless of who's having sex with them,
it's feminism. And also, I'd like to say this because
(31:25):
this is where you see the woke mop right. If
one of our feminist guests came up with that idea,
everyone say, oh, that's a great idea. But because an
old bag of bones, ugly gap, like Alan Dershowitz says
it all of a sudden, it's disgusting and shame on him. No,
they're just jeminism. They're just jealous. They're jealous of that
old ugly gap and his cool shorts. Great shorts. My god,
(31:46):
I did he tell us where I got him? I'm
guessing Tar did n't, But we have his email address
so we could just hit him up. Suit and tie
on the top and target shorts on the bottom. Fucking cool.
I agree. Five stars for the episode. Tell your friends
about man thinkers, get the thoughts out there, start thinking
out loud. Support the podcasts, Buy our supplements follow us
on socials, and as always, thinkers keep thinking.
You're listening to The Man Thinkers podcast, a show that
forges a new roadmap for the modern man on how
to best live life. For the record, we are not Nazis.
You were supposed to be here like thirty minutes ago.
When I apologize, normally, I'm very on time. I take
time very so you are punctual. Give you that you
are a punctual. Thank you punctual. I drive a Tesla,
(00:23):
very proud of that. You know you do. I'm jealous.
But the steering wheel popped off, but it's not. It's
not the Tesla's fault. I think I might have grabbed
it to our or something. And so let's back up
for sacon. The steering wheel popped off. What are you
talking about? Yeah, just fell out. It happens. You have
to remember when you own a car, especially one that's
a beast that's made by Elon, you know that there's
(00:43):
gonna be problems. So some cars get flat tires, other cars,
you know, transmission dies. We don't have that because it's
it's electric like this. So sometimes the steering wheel will
pop off and that's okay. Yeah, pop, just the word pop.
It's a very specific world like it made that sound.
So you'll just be driving, maybe even take a turn,
and then all of a sudden just happens. What happens,
The wheel just falls into your lap. Yeah, and then
(01:05):
you're just going At that point, Wow, that seems so
you kind of have to shift your weight around and
just you know, you try to pop it back on.
You just take your foot off the gas. At that point,
you try to roll into the nearest divider or pull softly,
softly crash head on is kind of the way you
get out of that situation. I just have a quick
hospital visit. It's really no big deal. You go to
a good hospital. They're going to take care of you
(01:26):
in about eighteen hours. So that's why I was a
little late. Well I listen. I mean, at the end
of the day, you know, as much as I hate
to admit it, you are my friend and I'm glad
that you are safe, and you know I don't need that,
but thank you. I don't know if you saw this,
but it's been all over the news. Silicon Valley Bank
recently went put okay along with Signature Bank. First Republic
Bank is in trouble. I mean, this has been a
(01:46):
shit show of epic proportions in the banking system. I mean,
over two hundred and ten billion dollars of assets collapsed overnight.
I can't stand hearing yet, because you know, when a
bank fails, I take it personally. I love banks so much.
I have posters of banks on my walk because I
love banks more than I love people. Because it's what
you want to be. It's what people want to aspire
to be. Is not just be a human, but to
(02:07):
be a bank. You know, you look at a bank
and you say, that's where that's where it all happens.
That has more money than I do, so it's better
than me. I don't know what America is coming to.
You know when they say, oh, less banks, you know
more what what do you want to put in another
Whole Foods? You know, get out of here, man. I
want to bank check. I want to bank that's open
four hours a day. Quality produce good quality produce. Well,
the produce a Whole Foods is excellent. I will say
that you have the protoce. And also it's run by
(02:29):
Bezos now and he's made it so much better. He has,
but he's a bit of you know. I respect his billionaireness.
I respect his money. I respect what he's baldness. Big
man is bald. He's just one of the best examples
of a bald guy, you know, and it's sitting you know,
when you're when a big bald walks into a room,
it's you know, talk about big dick energy. I mean,
that's it. That is what a big dick exactly. A
(02:50):
bald man just looks like a large penis, if we're
being honest, a big walking dick. When you're bald, you're
a big walking dick. Well, we just need to be
very scared right now, because that is when you can
make the best financial decisions. Right It's a fight or
flight situation. It just shocks me that there are people
who think they go to the bank to get money
and that there's going to be money there. Why do
(03:10):
you think you know, that's just not how it works. Guys. Guys,
you give your money to the bank and then they
go do things with it. It is now the bank's money.
It is not your money. It's gone. It's gone by
your money. Love, don't expect to get it back. When
people realize this, there might be a huge run on
all the banks. Absolutely, banks should be in a constant
state of being bailed out. I think we should think
of banks like a teenager who receives allowance every week
(03:33):
or every money like this to kind of shore up
some of these holes, to make the public continue to
think that you actually are solvent and have money when
the reality is you don't have ship. Did you have
your personal checking in? It's a it's known for kind
of tech entrepreneurs and whatnot. That doesn't seem like you're
I didn't have my money there, and my money is
sort of tied up in some good, good investments right now.
Man Cooin, of course, really is in a bear market.
(03:54):
It's in a bear market. But that's the time you
need a bear to get a ball. Two bears make
a bull, that's what they female bear and a mail bear,
and that'll make you a bowl and they will birth
a ball. And you know, I have an extensive beanie
babies collection, and that you do? How's that going? You
kind of went down the beatie babies rabbit hole on eBay? Correct?
I did? And I and you know what, you can't
make money without spending you know, six hundred seven hundred
thousand dollars on beanie babies and so hopefully get into it.
(04:17):
That's a lot of money, dam because I'm gonna make
a lot of money. So you don't actually have any
cash deposits anywhere. You just have a house full of
beanie babies and a digital wallet full of mancoin essentially. Sure,
it's not technically a house. It is. Um, it's a
structure that I'm in right now. And you know a
little bit okay, yeah, um squatting, I mean barely squatting.
(04:37):
I'm allowed here. It's it's fine, everything's going to go great,
it's going according to plan. You gotta spend money to
make money, and I'm doing just that. It's like, you know, Biden,
Sleepy Joe, fail out the banks now stop freaking student debt,
Like oh yeah, we're gonna give all this money to
the student, to our students, but not our fucking big bankers.
Like what's wrong with you? Given as a student ever
(04:58):
done anything? Literally, job is to take information from someone else.
They're just takers. I mean, the whole thing's absurd. These
children took out loans when they were basically adults, sixteen,
seventeen years old. I mean they're basically adults. You can't
vote or smokes, basically an adults, Why do I have
to bail you out? Right? When you knew the loan again,
you were sixteen, seventeen years old and someone said just
sign this and this is how you get to take
(05:19):
classes and your education is going to pay for a
good career. And that didn't pan out because they should
have known. College is so stupid, is actually pointless, so pointless,
you know it's so pointless? And would they go to
learn some liberal arts nonsense? They're sitting around eating what
avocado toasts, spending all their money on lot pays, Like
shut up, I mean those are Have you ever had
some of the avocado sets? I really love avocado and
(05:41):
I really like toast, so to me, when you combine
the two, that's the ultimate dish. It's almost like refreshing
right in a way, very flavorful, but it's lights are fantastic.
And the little things they put on the top of
the milk, but like a leaf or something, It's like,
how do they do that? Those barristas, it's really impressed.
They're they're talented people and these people they it's such
a shame they have no money. But because they took
out some stupid loan. Now I should not be the
(06:02):
person to have to say, hey, okay, you messed up,
but in regards to the banks, they did mess up, right,
but we should we we should bail them out? Right? Wait? Wait,
so who do we who do we hate here? So
we okay, so we're saying I'm just kind of I'm
getting tripped up on the logic. So me too. So
we you think we should we Okay, we want to
bail out the banks, but we don't want to bail
(06:23):
out our youth. Is that what we're saying? Well, just students.
Don't say youth because I think that I think we don't.
We don't like students because they're you know, they do
like protests and stuff. We're banks protests. Bail out our corporations.
Don't bail out our youth or our students, as you said, students,
because that's socialism, was exactple. But bailing out banks, they're
not people exactly. It's a corporation. It's good. That's how
(06:43):
it's corporate capitalism. When you bail out a corporation, that's capitalism.
When you bail out a person, that's socialism. I think,
you know, we're we made a really good case here
that banks need to be bailed out, A perpetual patment
of fund for all banks UBI, universal bank income. That's
really that's a genius idea. Have you heard about this?
It reminds me that there's this thing that people want
(07:04):
to be paid every month for doing nothing. Oh you
mean universal basic income. Yes, yeah, that's good because the
bank idea is great. Why promote laziness? I just you
got to give people a purpose. And the purpose in
life is to make money, make as much money as possible,
and then you die, and that's how life is. And
I hope you're putting some of that money into a
bank to keep those healthy. And you know, thinkers, we
have an excellent show for you today, and we have
a guest who knows a thing or two about law
(07:26):
and maybe he can help us instill this type of
policy into our banking system. Mister Alan Dershowitz this year,
you know him. He's a famed lawyer. He represented Trump
journey impeachment trials. He's represented Mike Tyson for a rape charge.
I mean, this guy has protected for a murder charge.
And this guy's a thinker and also a talker. Thinkers, Okay,
(07:47):
we're gonna let this interview is a little bit longer
because he just goes off and it's really interested a
lot to think about, and I got to say, you know,
it was really impressive to listen to and watch such
an old bag of bones just a mile a minute
he could still go. So stick around for that interview.
It's coming up shortly after. Of course, a word from
our sponsors, and guys, just get ready for these sponsors,
(08:08):
because some of these are actually quite really good. And
just so you know, mister Dershwitz will do us some
intro stuff beforehand, like without you here, but right now
I'm going to introduce him and we'll just get right
into it. Okay, just call me Allen, not mister. Okay,
Sorry I got scared. Okay. Our next guest is the
(08:31):
most notable criminal lawyer in the entire world. He has
represented the likes of Jeffrey Epstein, Harvey Weinstein, Julian Massage,
and most notably, former President Donald Trump. His new book,
Get Trump with the Threat to Civil Liberties, due Process,
and our constitutional rule of Law is available now. Please
welcome the very distinguished Alan Dershwists. Alan, thank you so
(08:51):
much for being on Man Thinkers. Oh it's my pleasure
to beyond. I think of myself as not only a
man thinker, but on a good day, I think a
woman too. So oh, interesting, Well, you would typically not
encourage you to do that. The women in my life
think a lot better than the men in my life.
So that's interesting that Dan doesn't have a lot of
women in his life. Alan, so that's probably why he
(09:13):
thinks that. But you and I, you know, we know
some great women. Obviously Dan not as much. But I
think Alan I are on the same page. Dan, You're
a little left out here, that's all right, Alan. You
have a new book entitled Get Trump. Nobody reads books
anymore because they're all being banned for good reason too.
I mean, we got to get rid of some of
these books. They're bad for society. So why should people
read your book? Well, they shouldn't if they want to
(09:33):
get Trump and want to violate the Constitution in order
to do so. The only many people do. Yeah, the
only people who should read my book are people who
care more about civil liberties in constitutional law than they
do about politics. Look, I'm not a Trump supporter. I
maintain I have a constitutional right to vote against them.
For the third time. I voted against him in sixteen,
I voted against him twenty and I want to vote
against them in twenty four. But I don't want some
(09:54):
bureaucrat or some day in New York to decide that
the American public shouldn't have the rights of vote for him.
So the book Get Trump is all about how we
should get Trump through legitimate means of not electing him
to office. But don't distort the constitution and the process,
because today it's Trump and tomorrow it's going to be
some Democrat. Alan, when you were representing him, did he
ever bring up the fact that you didn't vote for him?
(10:16):
Was he annoyed by that? Like every five minutes. The
two issues that came up more than any other in
my conversations for Alan, why don't you vote for me?
And Alan, why don't your people vote for me? And
I keep saying I don't have any people, No, no, no,
I mean the Jews. I was the best president ever
for Jews. I was the best president ever for Israel,
and I would say, miss President, that may be correct,
but Jews are not a single group. We vote on
(10:39):
the right to choose, on gay rights, on a range environment,
the climate range of issues. So you know, no, my
people are not going to vote for you as long
as you take views that are incompatible with the views
of my people. You know, you've said you've defended some
of the worst people in the world, just terrible, terrible,
just scum of the earth. Let me ask you this,
having been around so many scummy people, and again as
(11:02):
their lawyer, not hanging out socially, what is there a
thread there in terms of similarities between this scumbag and
that scumbag? Is there one personality trait that you've noticed
in some of your clients. They all possess a few
First of all, a lot of my clients did things
to get more of what they have unlimited amounts of
and giving up what they have limited amounts of. For example,
(11:23):
Mike Tyson went to jail for having sex with somebody.
I didn't think he raped her myself, I think he
was that, But in any event, with set I get it. Sorry,
I thought I thought you had seen it. And what
did he give for having sex with one additional person?
He ended up losing his youth, spending you know, two
years or so in jail at a time when he
could have been world champion. I've seen that trade among
(11:44):
a lot of my clients. They give up what they
have limited amounts of life. So that's one trait. The
other trait is narcissism. They're too good to get caught.
Oh come on, nobody'll ever catch me. I've been doing
this all my life. I've been getting away with it.
What makes you think they're going to catch me this time? Well,
the answer is if I hadn't caught you this time,
you wouldn't be with me. I only get to represent
people who they caught. So people are very egotistical and
(12:07):
think they can get away with anything I work. Carolyn. Sorry,
somebody came into the house and was just making an
incredible amount of noise. So let's just someone walking into
your house. Is that an intruder? No, they knocked on
the door, my wife and son. Where'd you get those shorts?
Those are cool? Oh my god, you weren't supposed to
see that. What I do when I'm on television, when
(12:27):
I'm away in Miami Beach, Florida, I wear shorts and
then I you know, disguised myself by wearing an ice
jacket and tart. You know, you still go out like that?
Business up top, party down low. Oh. Let me ask
you this during the Trump defense trial. How many times
did you use the phrase that's not illegal, it's just
very bad many times? And I've used that hundreds of
times in my life because as a criminal defense lawyer,
(12:51):
mostly I represent people who did bad things, and my
job is to prove that they didn't cross the line
from bad to unlawful. In your in your new book,
you state that a president or a former president is
not above the law, but neither should he or she
be below the law. I thought that was a really
interesting quote. What did you mean by below the laws?
That you know, how we treat poor people or migrants.
(13:12):
Are they people that you would consider below the law?
What I mean is what's going on literally right now
with the District Attorney of New York trying to indict
Donald Trump for a made up crime. If you target people,
if you say I'm getting after Trump, I'm going to
find some law that gets them that's below the law.
That's not what should happen. It's started with at capone.
They couldn't get al capone from murdering dozens and dozens
(13:33):
of people, so they got them on income tax violation.
And you know Stalin and Barrier, the head of the KGB,
at an interesting conversation back in the thirties and barious
show me the man and I'll find you the crime.
And that's not what we want America to turn into
where people are targeting. It's interesting the Bible gives to
instructions to judges. One, don't take bribes. That's easy. But
(13:54):
that's the second one. The first one is low taker panim,
do not recognize faces. So that's what a blindfold over
the justice statute represents. Don't do justice based on who
people are, but based on what they've done. I would
say if I was you know, and I was a lawyer,
but when I met a client, first thing I say,
you're guilty. You make me sick, And I think that
is a good way to get on just him know
(14:14):
what they're working with. You know, you make me sick.
You're trash. So I meet Mike Tyson and he says
to me, in front of all of his handlers, Gon
King and everybody, he says to me, so do you
think I'm innocent? I said, Mike, I have no idea.
I didn't read the transcript. I wasn't at the trial.
I would just be pandering to you if I said
you're innocent. I'll look at the transcript and I'll make
the best argument I can. He said, all right, enough
of that legal exc What do you think of me
as a person? And I said, Mike looked me in
(14:36):
the eye. He looked me in the eye and I said, Mike,
you're a schmuck. He looked at me. Oh my god.
His handlers almost hit me. What do you mean I'm
a schmuck? I said, you went up to a hotel
room at three o'clock in the morning with a woman
you didn't know and without a new witnesses, and you
allowed yourself to be falsely convicted. You're a schmuck. And
then he turned to the schmuck move and he said,
you know, Ellen has called me a schmuck. I wish
(14:56):
you folks had called me a schmuck before I went
up to that room. Maybe I wouldn't be here. I mean, so, Alan,
is it safe to say to our listeners out there,
just don't go to a hotel room with some woman
you don't know well at three in the morning. I
don't care what the context is, and I don't care
if she's a fox, don't go in that door. Absolutely right,
absolutely right. And here I'll take your call and I'll
tell you what to do and what not to do.
(15:17):
And if you want to go into that room, I
have a couple of witnesses video camera now talking. But
don't do it, Mike Tyson. Make it an orgy, and
that way, no one can claim something happened that didn't
happen because there's many people there. So you say, listen, miss,
I think you're very beautiful. I'd love to enter that
door with you, but you gotta call some of your
friends first, because we are not setup. We got to
get a nice setup going and make a movie. But
(15:39):
is that a lesson alan for our thinkers and our
listeners out there. It's just like, listen, look somebody I
call him a schmuck. They will respect you for it. Well,
they will sometimes respect you for it, and they will
sometimes punch you in the mouth for it. Many punches,
mostly they have been verbal punches. Defending President Trump, I
lost all my old friends on Martha's vineyard. Larry David
(16:00):
I was a disgusting person. That's good though, right, that's
so he's just kind of putting it out there, you know,
kind of like what we were saying of, Hey, you
meet your client, you say you make me sick. So
Larry's just kind of following that that I make him sick,
even though he came from my house for dinner many times,
worked out in my gym, helped it. Oh wow, help
his daughter again into college. But once I said, well,
he's kind of a coastal elite. Yeah, you know, he's
(16:20):
a sick of We mentioned you and Larry had worked
out together. What kind of routines do you guys do together?
We're doing bench press squad full body. What were we
talking about? I used to be his big advisor on
things Jewish. Oh here's a good one. I'm in the house.
This is a name dropper. I'm in the House of
Lords about to make a speech the House of Lords.
I get a phone call from Larry on my cell phone, Alan,
(16:40):
I need you for a minute. It's really upset. I'm
in the House of Lords. No, no, no, just take
a second. Take a second. Is it worse to call
somebody and then they use the male term for a
penis or the female term for a vagina? What's worse? Content? Right?
I can't even say those words. I'm in the house
of words, not at all. I need you because I
have a bit. And somebody called somebody a sea and
somebody called somebody in d what's worse? I said, all right,
(17:02):
you need a ruling here. The C is worse than
the D. So I gave me away. And there was
a famous episode with where he accidentally called someone a count. Yeah, well,
the ants he has a beloved count. There was a typo,
fantastic episode. I love the show. I mean it's great,
and god, it would kill me if he didn't like
me anymore politics at this point. So that's right. I
(17:25):
think we can all agree on your ruling there, Alan
that you know, counts are always worse than dicks. Let's
just be honest about that, in every facet, in every context. Yes,
this is the man thinkers, not cun thinkers. We know
what the body men often think with so exactly, and
many of your clients have done that. Yes, lawyers have
to learn a great many things when I represent people.
I didn't, you know, when I represented Junia Assange, I
(17:46):
didn't know anything about computer technology or how drop boxes
work or anything. You learn it, you are you your case.
And then you quickly forget it. That's that seems a
little worrisome to defend someone who's so steeped in technology
to say, I don't know, I don't know what think
about this true, but hey, what can you do? You
know Julian Sange, since you've spent so much time with
him one on one, let me ask you this because
(18:07):
you know he kind of dated Pamela Anderson for a while,
which really blew me away because I thought she is
way out of his league. So what is it about
Julian that do you think get that attracted such a fuck? Well? No,
first of all, I think a lot of men date
people who are out of their league. I married him
way way way out of my league. And Pamelanders they
don't look too necessarily the shape of your you know,
(18:30):
nose of your ears. They look at I thought you're
gonna say penis. When I was growing up, an initial
term that the girls in my neighborhood you had to
be a gap if they wanted a date had to
be a gap, and if weren't a gap, they wouldn't
date you no matter how good you look, or they
would date you no matter how bad you look. You
had to be a gap. What is a gap? Good
earning potential? And and if you have good earning potential,
(18:53):
you'll get the girl. If you don't, why women women
just like money. That's all they're about is ultimately and
cloud out. And if you're not one of those guys
pulling it in, you got no shot. You could be
an ugly troll. But if you got gep, yep, yep.
I remember once walking down up Forget, friend of mine,
who was not the most attractive guy in the world, was,
let's just say it, yeah, And he was with a beautiful,
(19:13):
beautiful woman and on the street said, I bet you
this guy has an airplane, and of course he did.
For this next question, I just want to state I
hate libraries. You know, they're dirty socialist institutions. They're disgusting.
But your local library in Martha's Vineyards has not invited
(19:34):
you to speak there, and so you're suing them. Can
you tell us about this? Yeah? I used to speak
every year. I was the most popular speaker. This is
a relatively of course, whom they would fill it up.
They would have people outside talk about getting the day
I defended Donald Trump. Suddenly, first we couldn't invite you
because you're too popular and the and we can't deal
with the crowd. So I said, we'll just put limits,
(19:55):
say the first fifty people. No, no, And they made
every excuse and they banned me, and I writing to
assume them because their taxpayer library, that's my money. Imagine
if the library in the South said we're only gonna
have speakers who are pro life, no pro choice speakers,
or only gonna have white speakers, no African American speakers. Right,
little did this library no right that you speaking there
every year was so important to your ego? Right? Like
(20:18):
they didn't know that and they walked into the lions then,
because as soon as they didn't invite you, you said, listen,
I'm the best lawyer in the world. I would have
gotten Jesus Christ off, I'm suing your ass. So who
do you think they're going to get to defend their
side of the case if it ends up going to
drive Oh they have. Boy, here's mostly liberals who would
never defend them if they were banning liberals and only
but you know, I'm a liberal. What people forget about, right,
(20:39):
because I'm you know, one of the most more liberal
people on Martha's vineyard. But I'm not a rattle. I'm
very much anti woke, anti radical, anti hard left, civil libarion,
and that's where I have been all my life, and
we're anti working well. But I think to the thinkers
out there in the listeners, it would be nice for
someone from a legal perspective, like, why is the woke
(21:01):
mob so dangerous to American society? And you're in your mind, Alan,
they're much more dangerous than McCarthyism of awards because McCarthyism,
I got it old people reflecting past values. But woke
is the thing of the future. Do you want to
get that call? Or people who are professor supported and
so it tells us what the world is going to
(21:23):
look like twenty thirty, forty fifty years from now. That's
why it's so dangerous. And what does that world look like?
It looks like brave new world, It looks like nineteen
eighty four. Big brother in this case and Big Sister
are people of the left and shouldn't surprise anybody. The
hard left has always been censorial, Stalin censored, Cuba, you know,
Castro censored. So the hard left has never had tolerance
(21:44):
for free speech. So why be surprised? And do you
where do you see this all going? Alan? Do you
think that wokeism will gain in popularity and strength over
time or do you think it will receive I think
it will gain his strength at universities. I do think
that the Republicans were to put up a reasonable, moderate, centerist, conservative,
anti woke candidate, they could win the next election. They're
(22:06):
not going to win with Trump, and they're not going
to win with somebody who's an extremist. You know. The
other problem we have is we're killing meritocracy in America.
People want to pick people based on marriage. Oh, of
course you do. When when you pick your surgeon, you're
not looking for diversity, You're not looking for inclusion. You're
looking for the best damp surgeon you can get. You know,
it's interesting. My wife and I have big music fans.
We go a lot to symphony orchestras in the opera
(22:27):
and we notice that the number of overt minorities obvious
minorities in orchestras is very, very small, and it's too bad.
It means a lot of these kids don't get a
chance to really play music. But orchestras pick their players
behind the screen. They're not allowed to recognize faces. They
can only recognize musical talent. And you know, that's the
(22:48):
way it should be in medical school, that's the way
it should be in a pilot school, in engineering school.
Maybe not in podcast school. Yeah, with Dan and I
should probably lose our jobs. Yeah, but totally respect. I mean,
and I've recommended that George Louse's job well to get
many times. And honestly I'm the one that actually, I'll
do it again the end of your job because they
wanted to let you go. But anyway, it's a great
(23:09):
time to actually quire you. Yeah, Alan, what do you
think about Rhonda Santis? You know you mentioned the Conservatives
running an anti woke candidate, which Santis has a pretty
anti wo platform. What do you think this is name dropping?
But my wife and I pleased with him and his
wife and one other in Florida in Miami, and both
my wife and I, my wife is slightly to the
left of me. We both liked the DeSantis people as
(23:31):
a couple. They talked about education and climate and environment.
We liked them. We came away saying, wow, this is
a this is a comer. And then he decided was
going to try to become the next Trump, and he
moved to extremes. He became a different person when it
became obvious that he could become the next Trump. I
think there's a good chance he will be the candidate
(23:52):
for the Republican Party and he'll do a very good job.
I think that he has a good chance of beating
Biden if Biden rust I don't think Biden's going to
run by the way and less Trump runs. I think
Biden is happy to be a one term president, but
he feels a responsibility of Trump once because he knows
he can beat Trump. And we've talked a lot about
people you've represented, but now you have had had some
legal issues yourself. But I wanted to I've been doing
(24:14):
nothing but defending myself for the last eight years. Finally, yes,
and so you were recently exonerated on charges from that
whatever Virginia Guffree or whatever, and I just wanted to
say congrats on that. That's amazing. I was curious did
you celebrate. Did you throw a big party. Maybe you
get a little massage or something to you know, rub
it in her face. I'm not a massage type guy,
but we didn't because eight years of turmoil. This is
(24:37):
not a person I ever met and never heard of.
I'm not a flirt. I never touched any woman other
than my wife during the relevant time period. And the
reason that I ended up the way I did was
because I had nothing to hide. I've never had sex
with anybody other than my wife during the relevant time period.
I've never ever done anything so I could fight back.
Others who were accused couldn't fight back. Prince Andrew had
(24:57):
to settle. I like that when you say during the
relevant time period. I like that as little sneaky. Uh.
I feel like good law speak in there. What was
the law speak? You can ask me, you know, whether
I had sex and I was, you know, unmarried twenty
five not relevant fifty years ago. I'm not going to
get into that, but I'm happy to have all of
my records revealed. Let me let me all right, let
(25:17):
me put it this way. Never asd sex with anybody
related to Jeffrey Epstein, never had sex in any way
that was inappropriate, So I can be very only appropriate. Sea. Well,
you know, what do you think is going on? You
know you're getting canceled, say by the library. Are you
there's this whole woke mob after you. Do you think
it's because you were invited to these parties with kids there?
You know? Are they just jealous of those parties. I
(25:38):
wasn't invited to any of those parties. The only time
I was ever on Epstein's island was when he first
bought the island. He invited me and my wife and
my daughter, and nobody was on the island except us,
and so I never went to a party on the island.
I never went to the island when it was the
notorious island. I hope that Epstein. I hope that he
videotaped every moment of his life so that people could
(26:01):
see I didn't do anything wrong. It seems that that's
your recommendation for a lot of things, like, Look, if
you're gonna have sex in a hotel, you're gonna have
sex on get some cameras to film everything. Everything should
be a live podcast your whole life. Other than Big Brother,
that's probably the best brig shard and you can have Well, Alan,
let you knew Epstein personally, so I got to ask you. No,
you don't know the answer to this question, but do
you think he took his own life? Yes? Or no.
(26:21):
I do. I think that he was a man who
loved luxury, and the idea of spending the rest of
his life in a jail cell was probably something he
couldn't accept, So I think he probably did. But I
think he was helped. I think that somebody paid off
the guards to turn off the video and to take
his roommate out, making it possible for him to kill himself.
But I do think he probably killed himself. But you know,
(26:42):
there are now four or five cases of people who
have committed suicide based on being accused in the Me
Too movement. That's why it's so important for the prosecutors
to go after those who make false accusations. Any lawyer
who encouraged a woman to make a false accusation, any
woman who made a false accusation, should be proud and imprisoned. Absolutely.
I've always said this to you, Dan Is, you might
(27:04):
want to consider maybe myself, maybe, because then yeah, would
be the ultimate defense in court, is like, hey, this
guy killed himself, Like clearly he's innocent. You guys drove
him crazy and then he jumped off a ledge, you
know what I mean. I mean, just to fill an
Allen and I'm I've been accused of sexual harassment by
a number anytimes. Many people take that as an admission
of guilts rather than innocent. So interesting, and if you're innocent,
(27:27):
fight back, call me, call another good lawyer, fight back always. Well,
you know you've written a number of books. You've also
you've written a number of op eds. One of those
was about lowering the age of consent to fifteen, and
I thought that was just such a smart idea, because
then you have all these fifteen year olds who could
smoke and drain it exactly, and they would be a
fan of yours. And now you've got all these people
(27:49):
who might buy your books or hey, vote for you.
If you ran for something, is that why you did it?
To get it? No? I did it, you know, twenty
five thirty years ago, And it was a feminist position.
The argument back then was that the age of consent
for sex should be the same as the age of
consent for having an abortion, and many feminists present at
that point of view, as did I. The age of
consent in Europe is much lower, in Canada is much lower.
(28:12):
The United States had the highest age of consent. And
what I don't like is a situation where many, many
people are committing crimes and a lot of seventeen and
sixteen year olds are having sex and prosecutors then have
the discretion. Most of the cases in the South, or
cases were black men eighteen nineteen, we're having sex with
seventeen year old white women, white girls, and they were
the ones who were being prosecuted. So if that was
(28:33):
the reason that outdate, I owed it well before I
ever met Jeffrey Epstein. So I wrote it as part
of my academic career, and I stand by it. It It
was the right thing, then it's the right thing now,
you know. And I think about how fifteen year olds,
if the age of consent was lowered, if they were adults,
they could be contributing to the economy. They're working full
time jobs now. Then they'd really want a party. Then
you can get a heck of a massage on a
(28:54):
party island. That would be a great, great I never
had a massage on an island. Sorry, I'm sarting to
mix up some of these notes. Well, that's just perfect
for the man thinkers, you know, because you're thinking and
you want to get it out there. And this is
the podcast for letting men get out absolutely need to
get my ideas out and to read my getting get Trump. Um,
(29:15):
I would appreciate the title. I'd be interested in hearing
your views if you want to write to me, because
I love hearing from my readers. Where can they reach you? Well,
I'm just my email um uh dirsh at law dot
Harvard dot edu and send me your number. I might
call you back. Who knows, who knows? You might get
a call in the middle of the night from Alan
Dershwitz say don't go into that hotel room at ten
(29:37):
o'clock usually. Well, Alan, thank you so much for being
on man thinkers. We really appreciate your time and enjoy
your questions and your equips and your responses, and keep
doing good things. That was fantastic. I a real hero,
a true hero, a personal hero of mine. Um be
(30:00):
because he's incredibly Jewish and incredibly successful. He is a
true gap. A lot of earning potential, there, a lot
of thinking potential. Here's what I learned. Gray area. Keep
it in the gray area. They can't prove that you're
guilty of anything. I'm wondering already how you can apply
the gray area defense to your sexual harassment person. What
I did wasn't illegal. Maybe not so great, but it
(30:21):
wasn't illegal in the relevant time period. And that's just
And I shouldn't have to defend myself against these cunts. Well, yeah,
last part's tough. I think calling the women counts in
a court of law would be not a great look.
But Alan was saying, it's works. Is that what he said.
I don't think that's what he said something like that. No,
I think he said, we'll listen back. I love I
(30:41):
love that he's going after that library too, you know,
such a small, little nothing, but he said fuck you,
and he's just coming down home exactly I can. And also,
let's just be honest. Libraries are basically just homes for
the homeless. I mean homelessly will just go there all
day and they masturbate to porn on library computers. It's
a joke. Every other country is laughing at us for
library system. I mean, libraries are essentially just masturbation hubs,
(31:04):
homeless masturbation hubs. He was a charming guy. You know
what I loved about him too. He was willing. First
of all, He's willing to call his friend ugly. He
was like I was walking down the street one day
with I like that ass friend, I love I love
that about him. He just shoots great shooter. Just so
he was. This guy was a freak nasty boy. And
if you're saying, hey, young girls should be able to
make decisions for themselves regardless of who's having sex with them,
it's feminism. And also, I'd like to say this because
(31:25):
this is where you see the woke mop right. If
one of our feminist guests came up with that idea,
everyone say, oh, that's a great idea. But because an
old bag of bones, ugly gap, like Alan Dershowitz says
it all of a sudden, it's disgusting and shame on him. No,
they're just jeminism. They're just jealous. They're jealous of that
old ugly gap and his cool shorts. Great shorts. My god,
(31:46):
I did he tell us where I got him? I'm
guessing Tar did n't, But we have his email address
so we could just hit him up. Suit and tie
on the top and target shorts on the bottom. Fucking cool.
I agree. Five stars for the episode. Tell your friends
about man thinkers, get the thoughts out there, start thinking
out loud. Support the podcasts, Buy our supplements follow us
on socials, and as always, thinkers keep thinking.
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