September 4, 2025 • 10 mins
Avani Desai is the CEO of Schellman, the largest specialized CPA firm focusing on cybersecurity assessments for major companies like Walmart, Meta, and OpenAI. In this episode of CEOs You Should Know, she discusses the firm's role in building trust through third-party cybersecurity evaluations, the increasing importance of data privacy, and the evolving landscape of AI technologies. Avani emphasizes the shift towards integrating security and privacy in the design phase and shares insights on the future of AI, encouraging a proactive approach to emerging technologies. Their conversation also touches on how AI can streamline administrative tasks, allowing professionals to focus on their core responsibilities.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hi, I'm Bob Pittman. While Math and Magic is on break,
we're sharing with you CEOs you should know who visit
at iHeartRadio stations across America. If you're a business junkie
like I am, I think you'll enjoy hearing some personal
stories from successful CEOs. Today's conversation is hosted by morning
show host Ryan Gorman, and I'll be back with a
new season of Mathemagic soon.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Joining me in studio Right now, I have Omni Desi,
CEO of Shelman. You can learn more at Shellman dot com.
That's scch e l l m a N dot com. Omny,
thank you so much for coming on the show. Really
appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
It's great to be here, Ryan.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
And let me start with an overview of what exactly
your company does.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
So Shellman is actually the largest specialized CPA firm that
just focuses on cybersecurity assessments. So we started in two
thousand and two. So for the last twenty three years
we have just been helping companies build trust with their
customers and we do that through third party cybersecurity assessments.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
All right, so when you do a cybersecurity assessment, what
exactly does that entail.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Yeah, so we actually end up going to the client
or virtually now and we make sure that we test
the controls that are there. So we look at their technology,
we look at their people, we look at their processes,
and what we're trying to do is we're making sure
that when you give these companies data or you ask
them to do a third party business process, that they're
following everything that they should and making sure that your
(01:25):
data is secure and private, so you can feel comfortable
using third parties instead of using all of your internal resources.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
And it says on your website that your company is
trusted by the world's leading companies I mean open Ai, Walmart, Meta,
So you are dealing with the biggest of the big
companies out there.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
Yeah, we are the who's who of technology. So most
of our clients do fall into the technology space because
you got to think about it, they carry most of
the data that we use day to day. You have
to make sure that you feel comfortable as a consumer
or as a business that they're doing the right things
with your data and it's safe and secure.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Has your company in the work you do, has it
grown in recent years because data privacy security online like
those have become such major issues in recent years.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Yeah, it's definitely been a rocket ship. You know, there's
good things that happen. You know, when there's emerging technology
like IoT and blockchain and crypto and AI, we see
an increase. And also when bad things happen. When you
see an increase in cyber attacks or breaches, those are
the two things that are going to cause consumers and
consumers are getting a lot more mature than they were
twenty years ago. But those are the two things that
(02:37):
will say, well, I want to make sure that there's
an independent organization that comes in and provides us an
independent assessment. So yeah, good and bad, we see an increase.
But the other thing that you're going to see an
increase is when people start offshoring or outsourcing their data.
And that's what happens when you use a third party
or when there's just a lot more data that's out there.
(02:58):
And you see that the last five seven.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Years, you're a leading voice on all these kinds of
again major issues that are so relevant to all of
us today. You know, we're not in your position. We
don't see what you see and know what you know
when it comes to the security and privacy landscape. What
are some things you can tell us about where it's
at right now and some of the things that you
(03:20):
and these companies are working on to improve it.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Yeah, the first thing I would say is, don't be scared.
I hear a lot of things about AI that are
out there. We can't be scared of it. And you
can't be scared of any emerging technology because they're coming
right But what you can do is you make sure
that they're safe, responsible and reliable. So I'm a big
believer in you can't you know, you can't mandate how
the technology is going to be, But what you can
(03:45):
do is you can make sure that the way people
use it is responsible. So that's what I would say
out there, and I would tell, you know, our clients
the same thing. You know, we are the first organization
that can certify against responsible AI. It's called ISO forty
two thousand and one, and we were able to, you know,
certify some of the biggest names like AWS and mincast
out there. So it's coming, but you just have to
(04:07):
make sure that organizations are doing the right thing with
your data. And that's our job. That's why we're there
to make sure that we're building trust with the consumer
and the customers.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Do you find that these companies generally when you go
in that they have the right setup in place, or
more often than not, are you having to go in
and saying, hey, you need to fix this or fix that.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
Yeah, a little bit of both. But what I have
started realizing in the last several years, and this wasn't
when I started my career twenty five years ago. In
the last several years, organizations know that they have an
obligation to do the right thing to the cut consumer,
and it's not something that's an afterthought. That is a
big shift. Before people would want to get to market
(04:50):
as quickly as possible, so they kind of put security
and privacy on the back burner. But now they're putting
security in privacy right with the developers. So when the
developers are developing something, they say, security and privacy should
be part of it, should be part of the design.
And that's a good shift that we need to see,
especially in the US.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Let's talk about you for a moment. You've been featured
in in Forbes and the Wall Street Journal. What is
that like as you're working your way up and also
you mentioned, you know, you've been doing this for twenty
five years. That's like pre iPhone to AI.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
That's right. When I started, cybersecurity wasn't even a word.
And so yeah, I've seen the entire feels like an era, right,
you know, I say it was the end of a decade,
but you know, start of this new age of you know,
cybersecurity that's out there. It's really exciting. My kids asked
me often. I have three kids, and they ask me
often like how is it to be on you know,
the Wall Street Journal or you know, And I say,
(05:46):
I feel like I'm in my own video game every
day because when I wake up, one it's a lot
of fun with what I do, and two I get
to learn. You know, technology outpaces humans, Yeah, and it
continues to do that. So for me to stay up
to pace, and for my team to stay up to pace,
we've got to learn every day. And the way even AI,
you know, a year and a half or two years
(06:06):
ago is when chat GPT came out, right, So generative
AI has really only been around for a few years.
And now we're talking about agentics AI. What are we
gonna talk about in another year or we're gonna talk
about humanoid robots, right.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Right, and hope I need to help around the house,
so do I.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
And so it's fun. It's a lot of fun. And
being in my position and working with the best of
the best companies, I really get a lot of amazing
insights that I don't think an average person gets.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
And you're seeing the cutting edge of all of it.
And like you mentioned, you know, chat GPT bursts onto
the scene and now we're able to do ridiculous things
like I don't know if you can see that that
trophy right there. But we won a Show of the
Year and and so we had our producer James He
he made a song through AI and I kid you not,
(06:55):
it sounds like a Jason Allen deanside. I mean it's crazy.
So you know, that's just what we're seeing. Now, what
do we have to look forward to? Because you said
not to be afraid of it? Like, how much more
is still to come?
Speaker 3 (07:07):
I think we've just scratched the surface the surface, right.
I don't think AI is going to take the jobs
that were there. I actually say artificial intelligence should be
called assistant intelligence. Really, it's there to assist you. I
mean it's called copilot for a reason, right, And what
it's supposed to do is it's supposed to take away
the mundane and maybe just make you more efficient. I
(07:31):
hope that's what you've started seeing and I've started seeing
that as well. In five ten years, is it going
to take some jobs, Yes, it is, But are we
going to have new jobs? One hundred percent. When the
Internet came, everyone said, oh, researchers were going to go away,
but actually the number of researchers doubled. Right, There's going
to be these new roles that we've never seen. There
(07:51):
was never a drone operator ten years ago. There was
never a YouTube creator fifteen years ago. So we're going
to start seeing these new types of jobs like AI
prompt engineering and AI security. But what we're going to
have to do is you can't stay obsolete. You're going
to have to be agile and you're gonna have to
reskill yourself. And if you don't want to do that,
then I think you're in trouble. But if you do
(08:12):
want to do that, I think you're gonna have a
lot of opportunity in the future.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
More on CEOs you should know. After this quick break,
let's get back to more CEOs. You should know.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
We're joined by Avni Deci, CEO of Shellman, which you
can learn more about at shellman dot com. It's interesting
as you were talking about how we might be able
to work with AI moving forward. There are a lot
of people who have seen the plate that they have
at work become more and more filled up over the years.
(08:49):
So they're in their position and just they have so
many more jobs that they have to deal with on
a daily basis, and I think for a lot of
people that could be something that would be very excited
making all of that extra work that they've gained over
the years, a lot of times for no extra pay,
and making it all more efficient.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
One hundred percent. I mean taking away some of that
administrative stuff is really and going back to the core
of what you really enjoy doing. So my husband's a physician,
and his core is making sure that patients, mothers and
babies is what he does, have the best care. But
thirty percent of his work is dictation and writing notes
and stuff. AI can take that away and actually allow
(09:30):
him to be a better physician. Same thing for me.
You know, we do audit work, so much of what
we do is documentation, and ticking and tying and making
sure memos are right. But now I can go back
to making sure the capital markets feel really secure about
what they're investing in because third party auditors like us
are spending a lot more time on the actual act
of the business right, And that, to me is the
(09:52):
most exciting thing that's going to be out there is AI.
Can you take all this stuff that I've been doing
more with less? Now? Can I do what I'm really
passionate about in the core of what I enjoy doing,
and you're paying me to do and allow someone else
to or something else to, you know, take over the rest?
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Yeah, And like for me, you know, all these questions
I've asked so far, all AI generated, so you know, big,
big help there, big help there. I'd need to sign
CEO of Shellman. You can learn more again at shellman
dot com. That's s c H E L L M
A N dot com. I'd be really fascinating conversation. Thanks
(10:31):
so much for coming in.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
Thanks Ryan, it was great.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
I'm Bob Pittman. Thanks for listening to CEOs. You should
know we'll see you next time.
Hi, I'm Bob Pittman. While Math and Magic is on break,
we're sharing with you CEOs you should know who visit
at iHeartRadio stations across America. If you're a business junkie
like I am, I think you'll enjoy hearing some personal
stories from successful CEOs. Today's conversation is hosted by morning
show host Ryan Gorman, and I'll be back with a
new season of Mathemagic soon.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Joining me in studio Right now, I have Omni Desi,
CEO of Shelman. You can learn more at Shellman dot com.
That's scch e l l m a N dot com. Omny,
thank you so much for coming on the show. Really
appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
It's great to be here, Ryan.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
And let me start with an overview of what exactly
your company does.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
So Shellman is actually the largest specialized CPA firm that
just focuses on cybersecurity assessments. So we started in two
thousand and two. So for the last twenty three years
we have just been helping companies build trust with their
customers and we do that through third party cybersecurity assessments.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
All right, so when you do a cybersecurity assessment, what
exactly does that entail.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Yeah, so we actually end up going to the client
or virtually now and we make sure that we test
the controls that are there. So we look at their technology,
we look at their people, we look at their processes,
and what we're trying to do is we're making sure
that when you give these companies data or you ask
them to do a third party business process, that they're
following everything that they should and making sure that your
(01:25):
data is secure and private, so you can feel comfortable
using third parties instead of using all of your internal resources.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
And it says on your website that your company is
trusted by the world's leading companies I mean open Ai, Walmart, Meta,
So you are dealing with the biggest of the big
companies out there.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
Yeah, we are the who's who of technology. So most
of our clients do fall into the technology space because
you got to think about it, they carry most of
the data that we use day to day. You have
to make sure that you feel comfortable as a consumer
or as a business that they're doing the right things
with your data and it's safe and secure.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Has your company in the work you do, has it
grown in recent years because data privacy security online like
those have become such major issues in recent years.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Yeah, it's definitely been a rocket ship. You know, there's
good things that happen. You know, when there's emerging technology
like IoT and blockchain and crypto and AI, we see
an increase. And also when bad things happen. When you
see an increase in cyber attacks or breaches, those are
the two things that are going to cause consumers and
consumers are getting a lot more mature than they were
twenty years ago. But those are the two things that
(02:37):
will say, well, I want to make sure that there's
an independent organization that comes in and provides us an
independent assessment. So yeah, good and bad, we see an increase.
But the other thing that you're going to see an
increase is when people start offshoring or outsourcing their data.
And that's what happens when you use a third party
or when there's just a lot more data that's out there.
(02:58):
And you see that the last five seven.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Years, you're a leading voice on all these kinds of
again major issues that are so relevant to all of
us today. You know, we're not in your position. We
don't see what you see and know what you know
when it comes to the security and privacy landscape. What
are some things you can tell us about where it's
at right now and some of the things that you
(03:20):
and these companies are working on to improve it.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Yeah, the first thing I would say is, don't be scared.
I hear a lot of things about AI that are
out there. We can't be scared of it. And you
can't be scared of any emerging technology because they're coming
right But what you can do is you make sure
that they're safe, responsible and reliable. So I'm a big
believer in you can't you know, you can't mandate how
the technology is going to be, But what you can
(03:45):
do is you can make sure that the way people
use it is responsible. So that's what I would say
out there, and I would tell, you know, our clients
the same thing. You know, we are the first organization
that can certify against responsible AI. It's called ISO forty
two thousand and one, and we were able to, you know,
certify some of the biggest names like AWS and mincast
out there. So it's coming, but you just have to
(04:07):
make sure that organizations are doing the right thing with
your data. And that's our job. That's why we're there
to make sure that we're building trust with the consumer
and the customers.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Do you find that these companies generally when you go
in that they have the right setup in place, or
more often than not, are you having to go in
and saying, hey, you need to fix this or fix that.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
Yeah, a little bit of both. But what I have
started realizing in the last several years, and this wasn't
when I started my career twenty five years ago. In
the last several years, organizations know that they have an
obligation to do the right thing to the cut consumer,
and it's not something that's an afterthought. That is a
big shift. Before people would want to get to market
(04:50):
as quickly as possible, so they kind of put security
and privacy on the back burner. But now they're putting
security in privacy right with the developers. So when the
developers are developing something, they say, security and privacy should
be part of it, should be part of the design.
And that's a good shift that we need to see,
especially in the US.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Let's talk about you for a moment. You've been featured
in in Forbes and the Wall Street Journal. What is
that like as you're working your way up and also
you mentioned, you know, you've been doing this for twenty
five years. That's like pre iPhone to AI.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
That's right. When I started, cybersecurity wasn't even a word.
And so yeah, I've seen the entire feels like an era, right,
you know, I say it was the end of a decade,
but you know, start of this new age of you know,
cybersecurity that's out there. It's really exciting. My kids asked
me often. I have three kids, and they ask me
often like how is it to be on you know,
the Wall Street Journal or you know, And I say,
(05:46):
I feel like I'm in my own video game every
day because when I wake up, one it's a lot
of fun with what I do, and two I get
to learn. You know, technology outpaces humans, Yeah, and it
continues to do that. So for me to stay up
to pace, and for my team to stay up to pace,
we've got to learn every day. And the way even AI,
you know, a year and a half or two years
(06:06):
ago is when chat GPT came out, right, So generative
AI has really only been around for a few years.
And now we're talking about agentics AI. What are we
gonna talk about in another year or we're gonna talk
about humanoid robots, right.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Right, and hope I need to help around the house,
so do I.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
And so it's fun. It's a lot of fun. And
being in my position and working with the best of
the best companies, I really get a lot of amazing
insights that I don't think an average person gets.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
And you're seeing the cutting edge of all of it.
And like you mentioned, you know, chat GPT bursts onto
the scene and now we're able to do ridiculous things
like I don't know if you can see that that
trophy right there. But we won a Show of the
Year and and so we had our producer James He
he made a song through AI and I kid you not,
(06:55):
it sounds like a Jason Allen deanside. I mean it's crazy.
So you know, that's just what we're seeing. Now, what
do we have to look forward to? Because you said
not to be afraid of it? Like, how much more
is still to come?
Speaker 3 (07:07):
I think we've just scratched the surface the surface, right.
I don't think AI is going to take the jobs
that were there. I actually say artificial intelligence should be
called assistant intelligence. Really, it's there to assist you. I
mean it's called copilot for a reason, right, And what
it's supposed to do is it's supposed to take away
the mundane and maybe just make you more efficient. I
(07:31):
hope that's what you've started seeing and I've started seeing
that as well. In five ten years, is it going
to take some jobs, Yes, it is, But are we
going to have new jobs? One hundred percent. When the
Internet came, everyone said, oh, researchers were going to go away,
but actually the number of researchers doubled. Right, There's going
to be these new roles that we've never seen. There
(07:51):
was never a drone operator ten years ago. There was
never a YouTube creator fifteen years ago. So we're going
to start seeing these new types of jobs like AI
prompt engineering and AI security. But what we're going to
have to do is you can't stay obsolete. You're going
to have to be agile and you're gonna have to
reskill yourself. And if you don't want to do that,
then I think you're in trouble. But if you do
(08:12):
want to do that, I think you're gonna have a
lot of opportunity in the future.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
More on CEOs you should know. After this quick break,
let's get back to more CEOs. You should know.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
We're joined by Avni Deci, CEO of Shellman, which you
can learn more about at shellman dot com. It's interesting
as you were talking about how we might be able
to work with AI moving forward. There are a lot
of people who have seen the plate that they have
at work become more and more filled up over the years.
(08:49):
So they're in their position and just they have so
many more jobs that they have to deal with on
a daily basis, and I think for a lot of
people that could be something that would be very excited
making all of that extra work that they've gained over
the years, a lot of times for no extra pay,
and making it all more efficient.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
One hundred percent. I mean taking away some of that
administrative stuff is really and going back to the core
of what you really enjoy doing. So my husband's a physician,
and his core is making sure that patients, mothers and
babies is what he does, have the best care. But
thirty percent of his work is dictation and writing notes
and stuff. AI can take that away and actually allow
(09:30):
him to be a better physician. Same thing for me.
You know, we do audit work, so much of what
we do is documentation, and ticking and tying and making
sure memos are right. But now I can go back
to making sure the capital markets feel really secure about
what they're investing in because third party auditors like us
are spending a lot more time on the actual act
of the business right, And that, to me is the
(09:52):
most exciting thing that's going to be out there is AI.
Can you take all this stuff that I've been doing
more with less? Now? Can I do what I'm really
passionate about in the core of what I enjoy doing,
and you're paying me to do and allow someone else
to or something else to, you know, take over the rest?
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Yeah, And like for me, you know, all these questions
I've asked so far, all AI generated, so you know, big,
big help there, big help there. I'd need to sign
CEO of Shellman. You can learn more again at shellman
dot com. That's s c H E L L M
A N dot com. I'd be really fascinating conversation. Thanks
(10:31):
so much for coming in.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
Thanks Ryan, it was great.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
I'm Bob Pittman. Thanks for listening to CEOs. You should
know we'll see you next time.
Host
Bob Pittman
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