On today’s MKD, we discuss a new documentary that suggests Jim Morrison is still alive, the Boeing astronauts return from space, the firing of Trooper Michael Proctor, a man with a nail in his head who murdered his girlfriend, and a woman who won't tell her family about her terminal illness.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Mother Knows Dad starring Nicole and Jemmy and Maria qk Hi.
Everyone welcome The Mother Knows Death. On this episode, we
are going to be talking about more celebrity death conspiracy theories,
(00:28):
the astronauts that were stranded in space finally coming home,
a man who lived with his dead girlfriend for twenty days,
and not telling your family when you have a terminal illness.
We also have a lot more to discuss on today's episode,
So let's start off with this newest celebrity death conspiracy theory.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
All right, So basically this new docu series drafted on Apple,
where these people are saying they believe that Jim Morrison
of The Doors is alive even though we believe that
he died back in nineteen seventy one.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
So is this something that is new because I know
that forever there's been conspiracy theories of him and Elvis
and whoever else like still being alive. There's been parodies
in movies. Do you remember I think it was like
death that Becomes Her. They were, you know, like all
those people had taken that potion and there was like
(01:21):
this party afterwards, and Elvis was there, and you know,
like things like that, like fun things and movies, just
acting like these people are still alive. So I mean,
there was definitely shadiness when he died, so I could
understand why people this is exactly why conspiracy theories happened,
because things aren't done according to protocol, right, Yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
When he died. He was only twenty seven when he died,
and it was just after they finished recording an album
and he was notably dealing with severe drug problems at
the time. But basically he was found dead in a bathtub.
They didn't do an autopsy, and then he got buried
in pairs, which I thought was really weird. But I
don't really know all that much about his life and
(02:04):
maybe if he wanted to be buried there or whatever,
but it all seemed to go down pretty quickly. But
it is unusual, in my opinion, it's unusual that they
wouldn't do an autopsy, especially on such a high profile person.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
So was his girlfriend at the time. I don't really
know a ton about this. Was his girlfriend at the
time from France.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
No, I don't think she was. I think that she
was American and they met in the United States. Okay,
so well, regardless they they were there, and I've seen
a couple different things that she was They were a
longtime girlfriend and boyfriend, so there might have been a
thing that he was considered to be common law with her,
(02:48):
which may give her some rights as far.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
As where he's buried. And maybe, I mean, one possibility
is that they just loved that city and that is
where she would thought he would want to be buried.
But I just have a lot of questions about how
it all went down. So I guess the first shady
thing is is that he died and they didn't alert
(03:11):
anybody or the media, Like nobody knew for six days,
and he was already buried by the time the public
found out, so his family and friends were very surprised
to hear about it. And I feel like her story
changed a lot about what happened that night.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
And she was a drug addict too, and I think
I think she ended up overdosing not long after him, So.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
Regardless, her story changed a lot. And then obviously when
people are on drugs are drinking and stuff, the whole
story is going to change. But I guess it did
come out to be true years later that the scene
was not initially what investigators suspected, so they came up
to the house and found him in the bathtub dead.
(03:55):
But then later when they did some investigation, witnesses came
forward and said that it actually, this is the newest
allegation that it appears that he had an overdose in
a nightclub that night, and he had been found in
the nightclub bathroom, bent over the toilet, unresponsive, and the
(04:15):
people that had sold him the drugs that night had
taken him back to the house and put him in
the bathtub. Now, the shady thing that comes out of
that is that these two people who were selling the
drugs at the club were these high profile drug dealers
that sold to celebrities, and they were called aristocrats or whatever.
(04:36):
They're really high profile people, and they were trying to
cover it up. And the very interesting thing is that
there's allegations that one of these drug dealers was having
an affair with Jim Morrison's girlfriend.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
I mean, it's totally possible that this happened. It was
also the seventies, so just like it's the seventies, you're
in a different country. They have different forensic protocols when
it comes to finding a dead person.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
I do clearly know standards whatsoever, because this easily could
have been figured out. And I guess you know, we
could say this with all sorts of celebrity deaths, that
normal protocols aren't aren't followed, and look what happens. Like
so in a normal situation, you would one hundred percent
do an autopsy. In this case because the guys twenty
(05:25):
seven drugs were involved. There's just multiple reasons why you
would do an autopsy in this case. The girlfriend said
she found them, like okay, okay, Like why don't we
do the autopsy and figure out what really happened because
we're not listening to people's stories because I don't know.
There's just been a history of people lying about what
actually happened forever. So that's why autopsies are done. So
(05:48):
the very first thing that we could notice with just
an external exam in a situation like that is if
his body was indeed moved after he died, so that
could have been something that was done without even cutting
his body open. Is to be able to tell that.
And the way that we could tell that is, so
let's say, for example, the story that we're hearing is
true that he did in fact die at the nightclub, so,
(06:11):
which is which is also interesting because of what the
witnesses said. So they went in the bathroom and they
found them slumped over the toilet for an unknown amount
of time. And this person that found him had said
that he was unresponsive, he was already dead, and he
had foam coming out of his mouth and his nose.
And this is what is expected to be seen in
(06:32):
a person who has had an opioid overdose because it
depresses the respiratory centers in the brain and it causes
pulmonary edema, which is fluid in the lungs. So when
people are taking their last breaths, that little bit of
air mixed with that fluid creates a foam and it
froths out through the nose and at autopsy you would
(06:53):
see that in the long tissue as well as in
the trachea. But so this is important that this guy
saw this. But when you die, all of the blood
leaves your circulatory system and it starts going to the
dependent areas based upon gravity. So, for example, when we
do autopsies on people who die in the hospital, when
(07:13):
you die laying in bed, when the blood starts leaving
your circulatory system, it goes to the lowest point, which
would be the entire back of your body, and that's
what we see usually in hospital autopsies. But if he died,
for example, in the bathroom at this club, and was
bent over the toilet, so let's say he was kneeling
next to it like you would be if you were vomiting,
(07:33):
then you would expect to see this blood pulling. This
is also called lividity or live re mortis. You would
see this in the front of his body wherever he
was leaning over, so you would see it in his
face and his belly. So even if those guys picked
him up and moved him back to the house and
put him in the bathtub, you would still expect to
(07:54):
see the live re mortis on the front of his body,
which to any death investigator you would be like HM's
that he has lividity on the front of his body
when he was found in the bathtub on his back.
So do you understand like that that to me would
be really unusual. I guess the girlfriend said that he
had blood coming out of his nose in his mouth.
(08:16):
And another way that you could explain that is that
when a body starts decomposing, the bacteria start breaking down
the organs, and this fluid could come The organs essentially
start to liquefy and they could come out of the mouth,
especially when the bodies move. So sometimes if we find
a body there's nothing there and then you move the
(08:36):
body just to bring the body to the morgan, this
fluid comes out of their mouth and nose, and it's
not really blood. It's like a brownish fluid. It's called purge,
but some people mistake it to look like blood. So
that's another indication that he was moved, and also that
he was decomposing for some time before authorities were called
to the house. So this is exactly why autopsies need
(08:59):
to be done, because you just can't especially with people
that are on drugs, you can't trust them.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Wait, I have a side note question. So this new
show came out this week with Amanda Seifred on Peacock.
It's she's like a cop in Kensington in Philly and
she deals with like all the drug addicts on K
and A and everything. But on the first episode of
the show, all these women are showing up dead and
then they're saying the medical examiner is just like, oh,
(09:26):
they just odeed, so we're not doing autopsies. Is that
standard that they would find an ode person on the
street and does not assume.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
No they And that was actually interesting to me as
a student because I remember one time and we had
so many drug cases and this was when it wasn't
even super crazy like it is now in Philly, but
we would do We had an autopsy on this one
guy who was like my age. He was in his
young twenties and he odd in the basement of his
house and his parents found him dead, and it was
(09:57):
I just was upset about it because I was like,
this is terrible for parents to find their kids. And
the mom said, you know, he's had problems his whole
life and this and that. So my first question, because
this is when I was a student still, I was
kind of like, all right, well, he has injection marks
in his arm, he has this long standing history of
overdosing and being on drugs, Like he was found in
all the classic ways you would see from an overdose death,
(10:19):
Like why are we doing this autopsy right now? And
that's just what happens. They're all done because you don't
really know, you just want to confirm it. Toxicology will
confirm it. And this is another thing too, like you
have a guy that overdosed and you didn't even do toxicology.
They actually came out and said with Jim Morrison that
(10:40):
his cause of death was or his manner of death
was natural. And they said that maybe he had a
heart attack. Yes, they didn't even say that. The speculation
of him overdosing actually didn't even come up until fans
back in the US were just like, Yeah, this guy
had like a drug problem and he probably over.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
And how is a twenty seven year old that's seemingly
healthy just gonna have a heart attack and die.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
Well, that could happen, so don't you don't mind.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
But I'm saying it's not usual, and they're therefore in
autopos It absolutely is not usual. And especially listen when anybody,
like if you had a twenty seven year old that
was it, that went to the hospital and then got
diagnosed with a heart condition, maybe a congenital heart condition
that was unknown or something, and they died, it might
not be indicative to do an autopsy when you find
(11:30):
a twenty seven year old dead in a bathtub, like
it's you do an autopsy, You just do, especially when
they have a history of drugs, especially when they're freaking
Jim Morrison, Like, the whole thing's crazy. But I mean, listen,
I don't even know what happened in the seventies in
this country, let alone. But I do know.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Because we've covered a lot of celebrity death dissections that
happened during this time period, and I do know that
they had the ability to see all of these things
that I'm talking about right now. They had toxicology, They
had the ability to use a knife and cut him
open and look at his lungs, look at them under
the microscope, and they would easily been able to rest
all of this. But maybe, I mean, maybe they were
(12:10):
afraid of the media getting crazy and they just wanted
to get him in the ground and move on. But
I always think it's suspicious when people are very quick
to get someone in the ground.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
Yeah. Well, this is kind of adding to why this
docuseries has come out and is really controversial, because they're
basically alluding to the fact that because of how suspicious
his death was and how quickly he was buried in everything,
that they think he might have faked his death, and
that he's this man named Frank that's currently living in Syracuse,
New York. So I don't know how this filmmaker came
(12:44):
to this conclusion or ended up finding this person named Frank.
They did interview this man, I will say. Looking at
pictures of him and a young Jim Morrison, they do
look very similar. But again, this could be solved with
a simple DNA test. So I don't know why there's.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
Alla And his brother is in the documentary as well,
I believe, so that again very very simple for them
to figure that out. And also I mean in theory,
if he was buried in Paris, he's his body's still there,
like if you really if if you really wanted to know,
and the brother is the legal next to kin, I mean,
(13:21):
it just exzoom him and find out. Exzoom the body
and see if it's him. I mean, this could just
be close. What's the why is it like this? What
is there so many questions about it's I feel like
it's an easy fix.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Well, I feel like it's an easy answer. I was
looking online and it doesn't seem like the reviews of
the docuseries are that great and saying it's very long
and drawn out and not really giving definitive answers, so
kind of what's the point. But I yeah, I think
if you just look at the pictures of these people
next to each other, you could say that. But everybody
has doppelgangers, so you can't just say that this man
(13:56):
is is Jim Morrison. And maybe he is, but like,
just get the DNA test.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
One of the questions that I did have about this, though,
is to see who the beneficiary was. Because I did,
I couldn't really get a clear answer. It seems like
she could have been, like I said, because they were
saying that they were common law because he did he
had money, right, And I mean, come on, if this
woman was having an affair with the guy that sold
(14:22):
him drugs, I mean, it is quite possible that it
was just a bad batch or whatever he just did
too much, because that happens often. But it's a little
shady that the guy who gave you the drugs that
killed you was actually having an affair with his girlfriend.
Like it's just yeah, but what would be the point
of inheriting it if she ended up over overdosing not
(14:43):
that long after him. Well, she didn't know she was
going to She didn't know she was going to die.
And furthermore, like if she had any involvement with his death,
she probably if she if it was truly accidental, she
might have felt terrible about it. And I mean, anyway,
if you do heroin, the chances of you still doing
it are just going to be greater, and especially if
(15:05):
you have a big loss. So I'm not necessarily saying
that it was intentional, but it's also just kind of
like it just deems an investigation at the very least.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
So I'm sure most of our listeners know about this too.
But Jim Morrison's in this like unofficial club called the
twenty seven Club, which is these people that were young
and at the peak of their career that ended up
dying when they were twenty seven years old. So in
addition to Jim Morrison, there's Jimmy Hendrix, Kurt Cobain, and
Janis Joplin. They all died when they were I think
Keith Ledger too. Oh maybe he thought I thought he
(15:39):
was a little older, but maybe not.
Speaker 1 (15:40):
I'm not trying.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
Aren't they all drug related deaths? Yeah, every single person
that's in this club. So I think that's really interesting
culturally that you reach this point and then you're just like,
I don't know. I was talking to Ricky about this
recently because I really love the Doors music. I know
you're not the biggest fan of the era of music,
but I really love their songs, and I was saying
(16:02):
how I was surprised that the band put up with
him because he seemed like such a fucking miss with
the way he gave me.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Why they put up with him because he was the
band Nobody can even can name one of the other
members unless you're like a superfan.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
No, I know that. So it's like it kind of
sucks because you're faced with this person that's such a problem,
but he's the face of your band, Like, yeah, they
could have kicked him out and got another singer, but
it wouldn't have been the same never goes over, Well, no,
it never would, and it's you know it happened with
Nirvana to like the singers die and then your whole
band's over.
Speaker 1 (16:34):
I do see though, like I know that the same
thing happened with Kirk Cobain, that he was just kind
of over the band and the fame and all of it.
And I can see a time where people, especially like
if this was totally he totally could have faked his
own death for sure, the way that this went down.
But I could see you just wanting to be like,
(16:55):
you know what, like I'm just going to fall off
the face of the earth and act like I died
and I'm just gonna another identity. One of the things
I think I saw from the clip of the documentary
was saying that his Social Security number was still active.
But you know, from other stories here, I was gonna
say that I was going to say, like, I'm pretty
sure that we just learned that there's like hundreds of
(17:16):
thousands of Social Security numbers that are still active. Like
if he died in Paris and nobody really ever reported
it to the United States, then there's a possibility that
just that's all it is, and unless like someone's physically
collecting off of that money and then they should easily
be able to trace that as well. So whatever it's
(17:39):
it is interesting. Are you gonna watch it?
Speaker 2 (17:42):
I don't know, because I watched a couple of people
reviewing it that said it was like really hard to
get through because it was just a lot of nonsense interviews.
Because at first I was really interested. But it's three
hours long, it's three one hour long episodes. I so,
how did this get on Apple?
Speaker 1 (17:57):
If it's on Apple TV, can this just be like
some guy who made this low budget or someone actually
had to put money into this, because I thought that
the trailer was a little like weird. It just looks
like someone made it in their basement or something.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
He could have made it beforehand, and then after it
was made, sold it to Apple to distribute. They don't
always have to be involved in the beginning. But I
guess my final thoughts are, let's say it is Frank
person in Syracuse really is Jim Mars and he did
fake his death. Just leave him alone. He clearly did
it for a reason and he wanted to start over.
(18:32):
Just let him be and let him live the rest
of his life. He's old.
Speaker 1 (18:37):
Just tell him to do one more concert like or something.
I don't All right, let's talk about these astronauts because
this is super interesting.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
Oh my god. So last summer we reported that these
two astronauts had gone up on this Boeing Starliner capsule.
Their trip was only supposed to be eight days, but
of course the capsule had technical difficulties, so NASA decided
they were going to hold them at the International Space
Station and send the capsule back empty, just so there
wasn't any risk of their life. But it has taken
(19:07):
nine months to get them home. But finally on Tuesday night,
after SpaceX went up, they retrieved them and they're back
on Earth.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
This is so cool to me from a medical perspective
because a couple years ago we went to the Kennedy
Space Center NASA in Florida and we were able to
have this breakfast with an astronaut thing, and it was
so cool and we were able to ask them questions
and I just I guess I never really thought about
it up until then, about what happens to you when
(19:38):
you go up in space. But you have to think
about it that there's no gravity, so you're you know,
the human body is made and designed to live on
Earth and with our environment. So there's a lot of
different things that happen with these people when they come
back to Earth because they think about this, like if
you're floating for a while, you're just you're not staying
(20:00):
on the ground. You almost lose your ability to walk,
Your muscles waste away your bone density lessons because you're
not using them to keep yourself on the ground and
to keep yourself upright. And so when these people come back,
even if you're only there for a few weeks, when
you come back, you have to go through this whole
(20:21):
intensive physical therapy thing to get back to walking normal,
which is why they were taking them out on stretchers essentially,
because those people would fall right to the ground. And
it's crazy to think that you're in your sixties or
something and you would have to relearn how to walk again.
But it's the same thing. Think about when you ride
(20:42):
a bike. It's very simple. If you know how to
ride a bike, you just get on it. But before
you know how to ride a bike, it's just like
you have to learn how to use your muscles in
a certain way to keep the bike up right in
order from falling down. And it's kind of just like
what babies have to do when they start walking. So
you have to do that again as an astronaut, which
is it's kind of cool to think about that. That's
(21:06):
they're dealing with all these medical issues on top of god,
the psychological issues. I can't even imagine.
Speaker 2 (21:13):
No, I mean, it must have been really terrified. I
feel like in some regard they have to be prepared
that their trip is not going to be the length
it's intended to be, and there could be issues, of course,
but going from eight days to nine months is extremely long. So,
like you're saying, now, they have to enter this forty
five day rehab program to get basically learn how to
walk again and just make sure they're okay to just
(21:36):
going back to being normal people. It's nuts.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
There's also so many other things that happen to the body.
There could be like cardiovascular effects. And it's another interesting
thing too, is with gravity. So when you're standing on
the ground, your fluid is in your body is equally
distributed from your head to your toes, but when you
have no gravity, it all kind of goes up towards
your head. So most astronauts that go up into space
(22:03):
have problems with this and they get what's called spaceflight
associated neuroocular syndrome, which is they get a lot of
swelling around their eyes, but they can get changes in
the pressure in their head. I imagine they get terrible headaches,
they're not able to see well. So that's also something
that you know as soon as you come back to Earth,
(22:23):
it's like all the fluid goes back down, so then
the people might experience dizziness. And it's just like a
wild thing to even think about that and experience because
there's not many humans in the world that experience these
medical symptoms.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
No, it is really cool. And did you see when
their capsule landed in the ocean there is like all
these dolphins surrounding it checking it out.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
Listen that video like looks.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Fake to me? Did you see it?
Speaker 1 (22:52):
Like they No, you need to watch it because you're
just like, this is like it has to be AI
enhanced or something like it just doesn't even look real.
And maybe it's just because the situation is just unusual,
but you're looking at it and you're like, what's happening
here right now?
Speaker 2 (23:10):
Like maybe you're just a space truther.
Speaker 1 (23:12):
So I don't realize I'm becoming a space truther, honestly,
Like the more and more I think about it, and
I started really thinking about it when I really did
a deep dive into the chap Equittic situation. That was
a couple years ago. When I went there and I
was like so intrigued with the Ted Kennedy chap Equittic thing.
I wrote up a celebrity death dissection or a well,
(23:34):
I guess it would be considered a high profile death
disseection in the Gross Room about it and that that
happened like a day or two before they announced the
man walked on the moon and he was supposed to
run for president. It's just like the whole thing was
so weird. And then I'm thinking, like, this is just
the videos are really terrible and you look at it
and you're like, oh god, this is kind of doesn't
(23:58):
look like what they told this it was.
Speaker 2 (24:01):
There's a really funny movie that came out last year
called fly Me to the Moon with Scarlett Johansson and
Channing Tatum and they are making like the movie set
for the moon landing, and it's just like this whole
like does it look exactly like the moon landing? Like, yeah,
you should watch it because it's pretty funny about like
the jokes about it and up being top secret evidence,
and yeah, you should definitely watch it. It's pretty Just.
Speaker 1 (24:23):
Watch the video of this if it's the like, I've
just seen it a couple of times and it's just
like it's just bizarre.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
This episode is brought to you by the Gross Room. Guys.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
The Gross Room is on sale for only twenty dollars
for the whole entire year, So that's for three hundred
and sixty five days of what I call gross gross
pathology means looking at pathology with the naked eye, but
gross also implies that it is definitely a little gory,
way too gory for Instagram for sure. We have so
(25:01):
many cases. I am actually thinking that we might do
a celebrity death disseection on Jim Morrison at this point
because we need to like do a deeper dive into
that story. And it's odd that we haven't covered that yet,
but I think that that might be a good story
to do. But this week we're starting we were working
on a two part Ruby Frank one which is really
really interesting. Next week we are going to be working
(25:25):
on a case of mistaken identity, unless, of course, I
tell you guys all the time, there's any breaking celebrity desks,
then we'll definitely do that first. We have just so
many different cases. We have the Karen Reid trial with
John O'Keeffe and we're going to be talking about that
in our next story. Actually, So that's a really interesting
two part to section that you guys might want to
(25:45):
read Yeah, head over to the growth room dot com
now to sign up. Okay, So, speaking of the John
O'Keeffe and Karen Reid situation, last night, word came out
that the trooper that was associated with this case has
finally been let go.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Well, he was the lead investigator, so like he was
more than just a cop involved in the sidelines. He
was a major player.
Speaker 1 (26:12):
And I just don't understand, like this whatever happened, accident, murder,
whatever you want to call it, happened in January of
twenty twenty two, and it took almost three whole years
to finally let this guy go.
Speaker 2 (26:25):
Yeah, I mean I don't even think so this trooper
Michael Proctor. Oh my god. So there. I don't know
if historically you know this, but in the Salem witch
trials there was a person killed named John Proctor, and
then with the victim's name, well I'm wondering if they
are related since it's in the same area, but with
the victim's name being John O'Keeffe and his name being
(26:47):
Michael Proctor, Like, my brain just has a really hard
time with this. But anyway, after Karen Reid's mistrial a
couple of months ago, trooper Michael Proctor had been suspended
without pay while they did an investigation because during her
trial all these really inappropriate text messages popped up where
he was calling her a whack job. He said he
hoped she killed herself. There was even, you know, this
(27:10):
part where he said he was looking through her phone
and he hadn't come across any nude shit. So obviously
that's concerning when it's a police officer and made investigating
a possible homicide. But I don't know, it seems like
he had all this other misconduct and the Massachusetts State
Police decided to suspend him and do an investigation, and
after their investigation, they decided to officially fire him.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
So isn't it interesting that a couple weeks ago the
federal government, who was also investigating this investigation, had said
that they closed their investigation, and now this comes out
a couple weeks later. Do you think that their investigation
had anything to do with his final determination that they
were going to get rid of him.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
I mean, yeah, I would say so, because I think
that they do these investigations and then they present all
their findings to a board and it just takes a
couple of weeks to go over everything and make a determination.
So they're saying, you know, well, another major problem he
had was that he didn't disclose his connection to people
involved in this case, which obviously is a major conflict
(28:13):
of interest. So I think with all these other things combined,
they're just like.
Speaker 1 (28:17):
Which is important to note, because he was apparently friends
with the people where this guy's body was found on
the lawn, if you remember, and we just thought it
was weird in general that you find a dead body
on someone's lawn and you don't even go into the
house and search it to see what was happening. Like
(28:38):
that to me was one of the biggest screw ups
in the case. But of course you wouldn't search it
because you're friends with the people, right. This is why,
this is why there's questions with these cases because of
the way they're handled improperly.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
So this is what the trialdboard is saying. They found
him guilty of violating four department policies, which included sending
the inappropriate text messages about Karen Reid, sharing sensitive information
about her case with people outside law enforcement, creating an
image of being biased against her, and then drinking while
on duty. And connection to an unrelated cold case.
Speaker 1 (29:11):
Yeah, which is exactly what she's being accused. All of
his drinking and driving. And you know that whole culture
of that whole group of friends is just like that, right.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
I was just gonna say that they all seemed like
they had issues with drinking. I mean, they definitely shouldn't
have been She one hundred percent, regardless of what you think,
should not have been drinking and driving. Like I feel like,
I mean, nobody should be no, but I feel like
a lot in this case. This case is extremely controversial
because you're like teamed police department or team Karen Reid.
(29:41):
And I think a lot of Karen Reid supporters are
also not acknowledging that she was still doing something bad.
It doesn't mean she murdered him, but she still shouldn't
have been drinking and driving. Now it's important to acknowledge.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
So I got I got a direct message from one
of our listeners a few days ago, and she sends
me a link to this next case we're going to
talk about, and said that she was friends with these people.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
So, oh my god.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
And I wrote her back and I was like, wait,
you like actually know these people and she's like, yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
All right. So this guy at Milwaukee calls the cops
and says his girlfriend's dead, and when they get there,
she's obviously been dead for a while, and this scene
has clearly been staged. So he admitted that he found
her twenty days earlier, but said because he's from another country,
he didn't know the laws here about reporting a dead body.
Speaker 1 (30:35):
I love that the investigators because he's from Turkey. So
the investigators were like, well, how would you report this
in Turkey if you live there, Like it's like, come on,
that's the biggest bullshit answer, Like Turkey has accountability for
you killing people as well, Like you can't just you know, like,
good try though, dude.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
Yeah, but he said he went this is what he
is saying. He said he went out to go run
an errand for an hour, and when he came back,
the girlfriend was just covered in blood. He didn't know
what happened, and then he fainted and slept next to
her dead body for twenty days because he didn't know
what to do, and at one point he considered taking
his life, so he tried to do that with a
nail gun. They did find a nail in his head.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
Yeah, so that's true that all they actually found the
nail in his head that was going into his brain
at the hospital, they had to remove it. So this
is an interesting side note talking about the cases that
we have in the gross room. If you just go
in there and search nail gun, you're going to see
many cases where people not only intentionally put a nail
(31:39):
gun in their head to try to kill themselves, but
also accidental cases. And you wouldn't believe how many times
it actually happens when people go to the hospital and
have to get a nail removed out of their head.
But the imaging is just crazy that you could see
it going right through the person's brain. So in this case,
it was obviously like this is what you're going to do.
(32:00):
You find this person there and twenty days dead is
really disgusting. So she was probably really decomposed. And on
top of that, you do the autops scene, it's just like, oh, well,
how did she die exactly because we've found twelve knife
wounds sharp force wounds in her body that severed multiple organs,
(32:20):
and her cause of death was a massive bleed.
Speaker 2 (32:23):
Like, what's your story now, dude, Well, he still denied
killing her. But he admitted he did move her body,
and they're alleging that he only finally called about it
because the landlord was going to be coming into the
apartment to inspect it because they were getting evicted.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
So when they did the investigation, of course they were
able to find So they found surveillance of him going
to a store and buying lots of cleaning supplies. There
was evidence that the scene was there was a lot
of blood there, and there was evidence that someone tried
to clean it up. Then they found surveillance footage of
him buying an algun, which was the day after she
(33:01):
had died. So, yeah, you're cook, dude, And I can't
believe that someone that listens to our show knows these people. No,
I really just like, could you imagine just knowing a couple,
even knowing that their relationship may be tumultuous or whatever,
and just hearing this, especially hearing someone that you know
(33:23):
gets killed as bad, but knowing that he was like
laying along her dead body for twenty days, And I
just think like with a stabbing death, especially all that
blood would just smell so terrible after twenty days and
just be like matted into the carpet. I just it's
just so, it's just so weird.
Speaker 2 (33:42):
Right, No, it's just very disturbing.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
Okay, So I was reading this deer Abby. I love
the deer Abby's even though they're not technically news stories,
but they are because they were.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
In the news this week.
Speaker 1 (33:54):
But this woman was saying that she had a terminal
illness and she didn't know what to do about it.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
Well, not that well, she didn't know what to do
about it, but she was also asking for advice because
she doesn't want to tell her family about it. So
how do you feel about that? Well, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
I think that her reasoning is just she said since
she was thirteen she was dealing with suicidal thoughts and
depression and self harm. And it's weird how it was
mentioned that she said that she's dealing with an illness
that can kill her, Like what does that even mean exactly?
Speaker 2 (34:29):
Like is it a terminal illness or is it so?
Or is she just suicidal?
Speaker 1 (34:33):
I don't know. But she doesn't want to tell her child,
her children and kids, and I don't know. I think
that most people, like from a mom's perspective, I feel
like if I told my kids, right, now that I
was going to be dying next year. It would like
ruin their life for the next year, but right, and
(34:56):
I just wouldn't want to put that on them. But
also the best I guess you would say of knowing
that you're going to die is that, like you can
tell your family and talk to your family every single
day till that time about everything with your life and
just like things that a lot of people don't get
when one of their loved ones just drops dead. So
(35:18):
I understand, like you don't want to upset your husband
and child, but your your husband and children also love you,
and they would probably want to support you and help you,
Like before you die, be like be happy in your life.
So when you finally do shut your eyes for the
last time, like you know what I mean, that you
(35:41):
feel like you were loved and you weren't dealing with
all that by yourself.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
Well, I just think there's elements to consider with this case.
She said she had something that could kill her, Like
I think having a definitive terminal illness is something that's
a little different because if you're dealing with something that
you know you're gonna die from, I don't know, I
struggle with it. I understand, but in the same breath,
(36:06):
I think it's a little selfish because you're not giving
your family the time to process your loss, even though
it is your illness and you should deal with it
however you see fit, but you don't want them thinking
that you were suffering and they weren't doing enough to help,
and then they have to live with that guilt the
rest of their life. I just think it's really interesting, though.
(36:27):
I think Abby had said you should tell them. I do.
Speaker 1 (36:31):
I do understand where she's coming from, though.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
I understand not telling the kids right away, because, like
you said, you don't want to ruin their life. But
the husband, I feel like you should definitely be telling
because also if you are getting sick like the like
Abby said, he's going to notice that you are changing
and visibly dying well, And.
Speaker 1 (36:52):
The same could be said about kids. A lot of
times you think that, like, oh, kids, you know that's
I even say that with you sometimes because sometimes you'll
be talking about an adult matter and one of the
kids will say like, what did you mean, and you're
just quick to say like, oh, nothing, don't worry about it,
and I'm like, no, they can understand if you talk
to them in a certain way. They could understand a
lot more than we think they could understand, and they
(37:15):
should be privy to some conversations as well as far
as that likes.
Speaker 2 (37:21):
Kids are very very.
Speaker 1 (37:22):
Intuitive to know when something's off in the house, whether
you know what I mean, and like, I think it's
respectful to them to talk to them about it, you know.
Speaker 2 (37:32):
And I don't think you necessarily have to give them
every detail and be like I'm dying, but you could
prepare them for it by being like, I'm sick. Yeah,
you know, you don't have to be like I might
drop dead tomorrow, so get used to your time with me.
But I don't know. I definitely think it's important to
confide in family because also why would you want to
(37:53):
suffer through something like that alone.
Speaker 1 (37:55):
Yeah, I'm not sure.
Speaker 2 (37:56):
There's a show called The Big Sea that came out
probably if fifteen years ago with Laura Lennie, and it's
the same concept. I mean, it's hard.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
It's hard to say because you and I have never
been in that situation, and until then it's like you
just don't. It's the same thing with a lot of
these stories that we talk about. It's just like you
just don't really know like how you would react until
you were in that particular situation.
Speaker 2 (38:20):
Yeah, for sure. All right, let's move on to questions
of the Day. Every Friday at that at mother nos
Death Instagram account, you guys get head to our story
and ask us whatever question you want. First, have you
done an autopsy on someone with more than the normal
amount of organs?
Speaker 1 (38:35):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (38:35):
I have.
Speaker 1 (38:37):
In any case when you do, like somebody an autopsy
on somebody that has a kidney transplant, It's it's a
very interesting fact that most people don't know that when
you get a kidney transplant, they leave the old kidney
in there. So I've done autopsies on people with three
and four kidneys. Also, you could get accessory organs, like
an accessory spleen. Sometimes you could get multiple of those,
(39:00):
So in cases like that yet, for sure, I've had
that happen.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
Okay too. What motivated you to start educating the public
with your website and YouTube?
Speaker 1 (39:09):
I guess it first started with doing autopsies at the hospital,
and we had this conference every week which was called
the Gross Conference, where we would present organs from autopsy
and surgical pathology to medical residents. Medical students, surgeons attending physicians.
They would come down to the Morgan we would talk
(39:30):
about all of the interesting cases for the week, which
was super cool because not only were we helping and
educating them about the patients they were actually taking care of,
but we were also really able to explain what we
were looking at from our perspective, which is always helpful
for doctors to just be very integrated in how we
(39:53):
diagnose things. And that conference stopped happening, and that was
like a huge missing piece of my life because I
really enjoyed doing that. So then I decided that I
was going to make a blog and just start writing
about the interesting cases that I was seeing. But it
was just like I was just doing it, and I
(40:13):
was writing every single day, like all this stuff because
Maria was older at that point and she didn't need
like mom attention as much as like an eight year old.
She knew when to go take a shower and stuff
like I didn't have to be like, you know what
I mean, Like, she was kind of self functioning as
a teenager at that point. So I had time on
my hands, and I was done college at that point,
(40:35):
so I would come home and write for a couple
hours and it was really it was really awesome, but
like no, I just would think, like, how is anybody
going to see my blog? And then my husband had
suggested to me, I guess he was my boyfriend at
the time, and he had suggested to me, like, hey,
why don't you take these pictures and then just write
(40:56):
these things for Instagram, but just make them shorter like
Instagram post. And then Maria was you know, like I said,
she was a teenager, she was eighteen at the time,
and she helped me set up the Instagram account because
I didn't, like, I'm a boomer, right, so I don't
know how to I don't know how to use social media.
And it kind of just went from there, like it
(41:19):
picked up right away, like very fast after being on there.
And then I just kept doing the same thing that
I had been doing for years, just in a shorter format.
Speaker 2 (41:29):
All right, last, what's your best parenting advice?
Speaker 1 (41:34):
I guess just I guess I would say the best
thing is just to have like an open relationship with
your kids so they don't feel like they have to
like hide stuff from you. I don't know, like what
I mean, what do you think I think that was
good with Like whenever Maria was having some kind of
like difficult situations that she would always like come to
(41:57):
me and just tell me about it, because I guess
the biggest things for kids to understand is like you
might be having a hard time or you might be
in trouble, but you might upset me too, but like ultimately,
like I'll always love you, so like I could help
you more than anybody else could help you, So just
(42:18):
don't be afraid to tell me something like.
Speaker 2 (42:22):
I think you had a really good balance with me,
in particular with our situation of being like a good
mixture of my friend and my mom, because sometimes it
goes one way or the other. You know, where people
are like all parent and they have like no casual
relationship with their kid where they don't feel comfortable going
to them, or you have the parents that are one
(42:43):
hundred percent your friend, and then your kids are like
getting into trouble because you're just letting them do whatever
they want. But I think you figured out a really
good balance that and I did always feel comfortable telling
you everything. I mean, I still have like diarrhea of
the mouth when I talk to you about yeah exactly,
but it's it's it's.
Speaker 1 (43:01):
Better to be that way than to be hidden because then,
I mean, now you're older, but with kids, little kids
and teenagers especially, like it's it's like the most crucial
thing ever, because that's when they can really get into
trouble with major things that will affect the rest of
their life.
Speaker 2 (43:19):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
I mean, I want my kids to feel comfortable calling
me and saying, I'm at a party and people started
doing things here that I'm not comfortable with and I
want to come home, you know, like things like that,
because normally a parent might freak out about that and
just be like, why are you hanging out with people
that do drugs and like, and you're just like, no,
(43:41):
I want you to call me at three in the
morning and I will call whatever, And like, honestly, my
kids don't want to ever leave the house, So I
don't even know if that's ever going to be a situation,
but I you know, you never know, and I just
I always want that to be a thing that they
feel like they could come to me whenever they're in trouble.
Speaker 2 (44:00):
Well, thank god I succeeded at being a good big
sister and got them hooked on the sims, Yeah, exactly,
they'll never go out, all right. Well, thank you guys
so much. Please leave us a five star written review
on Apple and if you have a story for us,
please submit it to stories at Mothernosdeath dot com or
(44:20):
send us a message on Instagram say yeah, thank.
Speaker 1 (44:26):
You for listening to Mother Nos Death. As a reminder,
my training is as a pathologists assistant. I have a
master's level education and specialize in anatomy and pathology education.
I am not a doctor and I have not diagnosed
or treated anyone dead or alive without the assistance of
a licensed medical doctor. This show, my website, and social
(44:50):
media accounts are designed to educate and inform people based
on my experience working in pathology, so they can make
healthier decisions regarding their life and well being. Always remember
that science is changing every day and the opinions expressed
in this episode are based on my knowledge of those
subjects at the time of publication. If you are having
(45:12):
a medical problem, have a medical question, or having a
medical emergency, please contact your physician or visit an urgent
care center, emergency room.
Speaker 2 (45:23):
Or hospital.
Speaker 1 (45:24):
Please rate, review, and subscribe to Mother Knows Death on Apple, Spotify, YouTube,
or anywhere you get podcasts.
Speaker 2 (45:32):
Thanks
Mother Knows Dad starring Nicole and Jemmy and Maria qk Hi.
Everyone welcome The Mother Knows Death. On this episode, we
are going to be talking about more celebrity death conspiracy theories,
(00:28):
the astronauts that were stranded in space finally coming home,
a man who lived with his dead girlfriend for twenty days,
and not telling your family when you have a terminal illness.
We also have a lot more to discuss on today's episode,
So let's start off with this newest celebrity death conspiracy theory.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
All right, So basically this new docu series drafted on Apple,
where these people are saying they believe that Jim Morrison
of The Doors is alive even though we believe that
he died back in nineteen seventy one.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
So is this something that is new because I know
that forever there's been conspiracy theories of him and Elvis
and whoever else like still being alive. There's been parodies
in movies. Do you remember I think it was like
death that Becomes Her. They were, you know, like all
those people had taken that potion and there was like
(01:21):
this party afterwards, and Elvis was there, and you know,
like things like that, like fun things and movies, just
acting like these people are still alive. So I mean,
there was definitely shadiness when he died, so I could
understand why people this is exactly why conspiracy theories happened,
because things aren't done according to protocol, right, Yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
When he died. He was only twenty seven when he died,
and it was just after they finished recording an album
and he was notably dealing with severe drug problems at
the time. But basically he was found dead in a bathtub.
They didn't do an autopsy, and then he got buried
in pairs, which I thought was really weird. But I
don't really know all that much about his life and
(02:04):
maybe if he wanted to be buried there or whatever,
but it all seemed to go down pretty quickly. But
it is unusual, in my opinion, it's unusual that they
wouldn't do an autopsy, especially on such a high profile person.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
So was his girlfriend at the time. I don't really
know a ton about this. Was his girlfriend at the
time from France.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
No, I don't think she was. I think that she
was American and they met in the United States. Okay,
so well, regardless they they were there, and I've seen
a couple different things that she was They were a
longtime girlfriend and boyfriend, so there might have been a
thing that he was considered to be common law with her,
(02:48):
which may give her some rights as far.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
As where he's buried. And maybe, I mean, one possibility
is that they just loved that city and that is
where she would thought he would want to be buried.
But I just have a lot of questions about how
it all went down. So I guess the first shady
thing is is that he died and they didn't alert
(03:11):
anybody or the media, Like nobody knew for six days,
and he was already buried by the time the public
found out, so his family and friends were very surprised
to hear about it. And I feel like her story
changed a lot about what happened that night.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
And she was a drug addict too, and I think
I think she ended up overdosing not long after him, So.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
Regardless, her story changed a lot. And then obviously when
people are on drugs are drinking and stuff, the whole
story is going to change. But I guess it did
come out to be true years later that the scene
was not initially what investigators suspected, so they came up
to the house and found him in the bathtub dead.
(03:55):
But then later when they did some investigation, witnesses came
forward and said that it actually, this is the newest
allegation that it appears that he had an overdose in
a nightclub that night, and he had been found in
the nightclub bathroom, bent over the toilet, unresponsive, and the
(04:15):
people that had sold him the drugs that night had
taken him back to the house and put him in
the bathtub. Now, the shady thing that comes out of
that is that these two people who were selling the
drugs at the club were these high profile drug dealers
that sold to celebrities, and they were called aristocrats or whatever.
(04:36):
They're really high profile people, and they were trying to
cover it up. And the very interesting thing is that
there's allegations that one of these drug dealers was having
an affair with Jim Morrison's girlfriend.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
I mean, it's totally possible that this happened. It was
also the seventies, so just like it's the seventies, you're
in a different country. They have different forensic protocols when
it comes to finding a dead person.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
I do clearly know standards whatsoever, because this easily could
have been figured out. And I guess you know, we
could say this with all sorts of celebrity deaths, that
normal protocols aren't aren't followed, and look what happens. Like
so in a normal situation, you would one hundred percent
do an autopsy. In this case because the guys twenty
(05:25):
seven drugs were involved. There's just multiple reasons why you
would do an autopsy in this case. The girlfriend said
she found them, like okay, okay, Like why don't we
do the autopsy and figure out what really happened because
we're not listening to people's stories because I don't know.
There's just been a history of people lying about what
actually happened forever. So that's why autopsies are done. So
(05:48):
the very first thing that we could notice with just
an external exam in a situation like that is if
his body was indeed moved after he died, so that
could have been something that was done without even cutting
his body open. Is to be able to tell that.
And the way that we could tell that is, so
let's say, for example, the story that we're hearing is
true that he did in fact die at the nightclub, so,
(06:11):
which is which is also interesting because of what the
witnesses said. So they went in the bathroom and they
found them slumped over the toilet for an unknown amount
of time. And this person that found him had said
that he was unresponsive, he was already dead, and he
had foam coming out of his mouth and his nose.
And this is what is expected to be seen in
(06:32):
a person who has had an opioid overdose because it
depresses the respiratory centers in the brain and it causes
pulmonary edema, which is fluid in the lungs. So when
people are taking their last breaths, that little bit of
air mixed with that fluid creates a foam and it
froths out through the nose and at autopsy you would
(06:53):
see that in the long tissue as well as in
the trachea. But so this is important that this guy
saw this. But when you die, all of the blood
leaves your circulatory system and it starts going to the
dependent areas based upon gravity. So, for example, when we
do autopsies on people who die in the hospital, when
(07:13):
you die laying in bed, when the blood starts leaving
your circulatory system, it goes to the lowest point, which
would be the entire back of your body, and that's
what we see usually in hospital autopsies. But if he died,
for example, in the bathroom at this club, and was
bent over the toilet, so let's say he was kneeling
next to it like you would be if you were vomiting,
(07:33):
then you would expect to see this blood pulling. This
is also called lividity or live re mortis. You would
see this in the front of his body wherever he
was leaning over, so you would see it in his
face and his belly. So even if those guys picked
him up and moved him back to the house and
put him in the bathtub, you would still expect to
(07:54):
see the live re mortis on the front of his body,
which to any death investigator you would be like HM's
that he has lividity on the front of his body
when he was found in the bathtub on his back.
So do you understand like that that to me would
be really unusual. I guess the girlfriend said that he
had blood coming out of his nose in his mouth.
(08:16):
And another way that you could explain that is that
when a body starts decomposing, the bacteria start breaking down
the organs, and this fluid could come The organs essentially
start to liquefy and they could come out of the mouth,
especially when the bodies move. So sometimes if we find
a body there's nothing there and then you move the
(08:36):
body just to bring the body to the morgan, this
fluid comes out of their mouth and nose, and it's
not really blood. It's like a brownish fluid. It's called purge,
but some people mistake it to look like blood. So
that's another indication that he was moved, and also that
he was decomposing for some time before authorities were called
to the house. So this is exactly why autopsies need
(08:59):
to be done, because you just can't especially with people
that are on drugs, you can't trust them.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Wait, I have a side note question. So this new
show came out this week with Amanda Seifred on Peacock.
It's she's like a cop in Kensington in Philly and
she deals with like all the drug addicts on K
and A and everything. But on the first episode of
the show, all these women are showing up dead and
then they're saying the medical examiner is just like, oh,
(09:26):
they just odeed, so we're not doing autopsies. Is that
standard that they would find an ode person on the
street and does not assume.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
No they And that was actually interesting to me as
a student because I remember one time and we had
so many drug cases and this was when it wasn't
even super crazy like it is now in Philly, but
we would do We had an autopsy on this one
guy who was like my age. He was in his
young twenties and he odd in the basement of his
house and his parents found him dead, and it was
(09:57):
I just was upset about it because I was like,
this is terrible for parents to find their kids. And
the mom said, you know, he's had problems his whole
life and this and that. So my first question, because
this is when I was a student still, I was
kind of like, all right, well, he has injection marks
in his arm, he has this long standing history of
overdosing and being on drugs, Like he was found in
all the classic ways you would see from an overdose death,
(10:19):
Like why are we doing this autopsy right now? And
that's just what happens. They're all done because you don't
really know, you just want to confirm it. Toxicology will
confirm it. And this is another thing too, like you
have a guy that overdosed and you didn't even do toxicology.
They actually came out and said with Jim Morrison that
(10:40):
his cause of death was or his manner of death
was natural. And they said that maybe he had a
heart attack. Yes, they didn't even say that. The speculation
of him overdosing actually didn't even come up until fans
back in the US were just like, Yeah, this guy
had like a drug problem and he probably over.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
And how is a twenty seven year old that's seemingly
healthy just gonna have a heart attack and die.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
Well, that could happen, so don't you don't mind.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
But I'm saying it's not usual, and they're therefore in
autopos It absolutely is not usual. And especially listen when anybody,
like if you had a twenty seven year old that
was it, that went to the hospital and then got
diagnosed with a heart condition, maybe a congenital heart condition
that was unknown or something, and they died, it might
not be indicative to do an autopsy when you find
(11:30):
a twenty seven year old dead in a bathtub, like
it's you do an autopsy, You just do, especially when
they have a history of drugs, especially when they're freaking
Jim Morrison, Like, the whole thing's crazy. But I mean, listen,
I don't even know what happened in the seventies in
this country, let alone. But I do know.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Because we've covered a lot of celebrity death dissections that
happened during this time period, and I do know that
they had the ability to see all of these things
that I'm talking about right now. They had toxicology, They
had the ability to use a knife and cut him
open and look at his lungs, look at them under
the microscope, and they would easily been able to rest
all of this. But maybe, I mean, maybe they were
(12:10):
afraid of the media getting crazy and they just wanted
to get him in the ground and move on. But
I always think it's suspicious when people are very quick
to get someone in the ground.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
Yeah. Well, this is kind of adding to why this
docuseries has come out and is really controversial, because they're
basically alluding to the fact that because of how suspicious
his death was and how quickly he was buried in everything,
that they think he might have faked his death, and
that he's this man named Frank that's currently living in Syracuse,
New York. So I don't know how this filmmaker came
(12:44):
to this conclusion or ended up finding this person named Frank.
They did interview this man, I will say. Looking at
pictures of him and a young Jim Morrison, they do
look very similar. But again, this could be solved with
a simple DNA test. So I don't know why there's.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
Alla And his brother is in the documentary as well,
I believe, so that again very very simple for them
to figure that out. And also I mean in theory,
if he was buried in Paris, he's his body's still there,
like if you really if if you really wanted to know,
and the brother is the legal next to kin, I mean,
(13:21):
it just exzoom him and find out. Exzoom the body
and see if it's him. I mean, this could just
be close. What's the why is it like this? What
is there so many questions about it's I feel like
it's an easy fix.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Well, I feel like it's an easy answer. I was
looking online and it doesn't seem like the reviews of
the docuseries are that great and saying it's very long
and drawn out and not really giving definitive answers, so
kind of what's the point. But I yeah, I think
if you just look at the pictures of these people
next to each other, you could say that. But everybody
has doppelgangers, so you can't just say that this man
(13:56):
is is Jim Morrison. And maybe he is, but like,
just get the DNA test.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
One of the questions that I did have about this, though,
is to see who the beneficiary was. Because I did,
I couldn't really get a clear answer. It seems like
she could have been, like I said, because they were
saying that they were common law because he did he
had money, right, And I mean, come on, if this
woman was having an affair with the guy that sold
(14:22):
him drugs, I mean, it is quite possible that it
was just a bad batch or whatever he just did
too much, because that happens often. But it's a little
shady that the guy who gave you the drugs that
killed you was actually having an affair with his girlfriend.
Like it's just yeah, but what would be the point
of inheriting it if she ended up over overdosing not
(14:43):
that long after him. Well, she didn't know she was
going to She didn't know she was going to die.
And furthermore, like if she had any involvement with his death,
she probably if she if it was truly accidental, she
might have felt terrible about it. And I mean, anyway,
if you do heroin, the chances of you still doing
it are just going to be greater, and especially if
(15:05):
you have a big loss. So I'm not necessarily saying
that it was intentional, but it's also just kind of
like it just deems an investigation at the very least.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
So I'm sure most of our listeners know about this too.
But Jim Morrison's in this like unofficial club called the
twenty seven Club, which is these people that were young
and at the peak of their career that ended up
dying when they were twenty seven years old. So in
addition to Jim Morrison, there's Jimmy Hendrix, Kurt Cobain, and
Janis Joplin. They all died when they were I think
Keith Ledger too. Oh maybe he thought I thought he
(15:39):
was a little older, but maybe not.
Speaker 1 (15:40):
I'm not trying.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
Aren't they all drug related deaths? Yeah, every single person
that's in this club. So I think that's really interesting
culturally that you reach this point and then you're just like,
I don't know. I was talking to Ricky about this
recently because I really love the Doors music. I know
you're not the biggest fan of the era of music,
but I really love their songs, and I was saying
(16:02):
how I was surprised that the band put up with
him because he seemed like such a fucking miss with
the way he gave me.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Why they put up with him because he was the
band Nobody can even can name one of the other
members unless you're like a superfan.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
No, I know that. So it's like it kind of
sucks because you're faced with this person that's such a problem,
but he's the face of your band, Like, yeah, they
could have kicked him out and got another singer, but
it wouldn't have been the same never goes over, Well, no,
it never would, and it's you know it happened with
Nirvana to like the singers die and then your whole
band's over.
Speaker 1 (16:34):
I do see though, like I know that the same
thing happened with Kirk Cobain, that he was just kind
of over the band and the fame and all of it.
And I can see a time where people, especially like
if this was totally he totally could have faked his
own death for sure, the way that this went down.
But I could see you just wanting to be like,
(16:55):
you know what, like I'm just going to fall off
the face of the earth and act like I died
and I'm just gonna another identity. One of the things
I think I saw from the clip of the documentary
was saying that his Social Security number was still active.
But you know, from other stories here, I was gonna
say that I was going to say, like, I'm pretty
sure that we just learned that there's like hundreds of
(17:16):
thousands of Social Security numbers that are still active. Like
if he died in Paris and nobody really ever reported
it to the United States, then there's a possibility that
just that's all it is, and unless like someone's physically
collecting off of that money and then they should easily
be able to trace that as well. So whatever it's
(17:39):
it is interesting. Are you gonna watch it?
Speaker 2 (17:42):
I don't know, because I watched a couple of people
reviewing it that said it was like really hard to
get through because it was just a lot of nonsense interviews.
Because at first I was really interested. But it's three
hours long, it's three one hour long episodes. I so,
how did this get on Apple?
Speaker 1 (17:57):
If it's on Apple TV, can this just be like
some guy who made this low budget or someone actually
had to put money into this, because I thought that
the trailer was a little like weird. It just looks
like someone made it in their basement or something.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
He could have made it beforehand, and then after it
was made, sold it to Apple to distribute. They don't
always have to be involved in the beginning. But I
guess my final thoughts are, let's say it is Frank
person in Syracuse really is Jim Mars and he did
fake his death. Just leave him alone. He clearly did
it for a reason and he wanted to start over.
(18:32):
Just let him be and let him live the rest
of his life. He's old.
Speaker 1 (18:37):
Just tell him to do one more concert like or something.
I don't All right, let's talk about these astronauts because
this is super interesting.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
Oh my god. So last summer we reported that these
two astronauts had gone up on this Boeing Starliner capsule.
Their trip was only supposed to be eight days, but
of course the capsule had technical difficulties, so NASA decided
they were going to hold them at the International Space
Station and send the capsule back empty, just so there
wasn't any risk of their life. But it has taken
(19:07):
nine months to get them home. But finally on Tuesday night,
after SpaceX went up, they retrieved them and they're back
on Earth.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
This is so cool to me from a medical perspective
because a couple years ago we went to the Kennedy
Space Center NASA in Florida and we were able to
have this breakfast with an astronaut thing, and it was
so cool and we were able to ask them questions
and I just I guess I never really thought about
it up until then, about what happens to you when
(19:38):
you go up in space. But you have to think
about it that there's no gravity, so you're you know,
the human body is made and designed to live on
Earth and with our environment. So there's a lot of
different things that happen with these people when they come
back to Earth because they think about this, like if
you're floating for a while, you're just you're not staying
(20:00):
on the ground. You almost lose your ability to walk,
Your muscles waste away your bone density lessons because you're
not using them to keep yourself on the ground and
to keep yourself upright. And so when these people come back,
even if you're only there for a few weeks, when
you come back, you have to go through this whole
(20:21):
intensive physical therapy thing to get back to walking normal,
which is why they were taking them out on stretchers essentially,
because those people would fall right to the ground. And
it's crazy to think that you're in your sixties or
something and you would have to relearn how to walk again.
But it's the same thing. Think about when you ride
(20:42):
a bike. It's very simple. If you know how to
ride a bike, you just get on it. But before
you know how to ride a bike, it's just like
you have to learn how to use your muscles in
a certain way to keep the bike up right in
order from falling down. And it's kind of just like
what babies have to do when they start walking. So
you have to do that again as an astronaut, which
is it's kind of cool to think about that. That's
(21:06):
they're dealing with all these medical issues on top of god,
the psychological issues. I can't even imagine.
Speaker 2 (21:13):
No, I mean, it must have been really terrified. I
feel like in some regard they have to be prepared
that their trip is not going to be the length
it's intended to be, and there could be issues, of course,
but going from eight days to nine months is extremely long. So,
like you're saying, now, they have to enter this forty
five day rehab program to get basically learn how to
walk again and just make sure they're okay to just
(21:36):
going back to being normal people. It's nuts.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
There's also so many other things that happen to the body.
There could be like cardiovascular effects. And it's another interesting
thing too, is with gravity. So when you're standing on
the ground, your fluid is in your body is equally
distributed from your head to your toes, but when you
have no gravity, it all kind of goes up towards
your head. So most astronauts that go up into space
(22:03):
have problems with this and they get what's called spaceflight
associated neuroocular syndrome, which is they get a lot of
swelling around their eyes, but they can get changes in
the pressure in their head. I imagine they get terrible headaches,
they're not able to see well. So that's also something
that you know as soon as you come back to Earth,
(22:23):
it's like all the fluid goes back down, so then
the people might experience dizziness. And it's just like a
wild thing to even think about that and experience because
there's not many humans in the world that experience these
medical symptoms.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
No, it is really cool. And did you see when
their capsule landed in the ocean there is like all
these dolphins surrounding it checking it out.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
Listen that video like looks.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Fake to me? Did you see it?
Speaker 1 (22:52):
Like they No, you need to watch it because you're
just like, this is like it has to be AI
enhanced or something like it just doesn't even look real.
And maybe it's just because the situation is just unusual,
but you're looking at it and you're like, what's happening
here right now?
Speaker 2 (23:10):
Like maybe you're just a space truther.
Speaker 1 (23:12):
So I don't realize I'm becoming a space truther, honestly,
Like the more and more I think about it, and
I started really thinking about it when I really did
a deep dive into the chap Equittic situation. That was
a couple years ago. When I went there and I
was like so intrigued with the Ted Kennedy chap Equittic thing.
I wrote up a celebrity death dissection or a well,
(23:34):
I guess it would be considered a high profile death
disseection in the Gross Room about it and that that
happened like a day or two before they announced the
man walked on the moon and he was supposed to
run for president. It's just like the whole thing was
so weird. And then I'm thinking, like, this is just
the videos are really terrible and you look at it
and you're like, oh god, this is kind of doesn't
(23:58):
look like what they told this it was.
Speaker 2 (24:01):
There's a really funny movie that came out last year
called fly Me to the Moon with Scarlett Johansson and
Channing Tatum and they are making like the movie set
for the moon landing, and it's just like this whole
like does it look exactly like the moon landing? Like, yeah,
you should watch it because it's pretty funny about like
the jokes about it and up being top secret evidence,
and yeah, you should definitely watch it. It's pretty Just.
Speaker 1 (24:23):
Watch the video of this if it's the like, I've
just seen it a couple of times and it's just
like it's just bizarre.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
This episode is brought to you by the Gross Room. Guys.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
The Gross Room is on sale for only twenty dollars
for the whole entire year, So that's for three hundred
and sixty five days of what I call gross gross
pathology means looking at pathology with the naked eye, but
gross also implies that it is definitely a little gory,
way too gory for Instagram for sure. We have so
(25:01):
many cases. I am actually thinking that we might do
a celebrity death disseection on Jim Morrison at this point
because we need to like do a deeper dive into
that story. And it's odd that we haven't covered that yet,
but I think that that might be a good story
to do. But this week we're starting we were working
on a two part Ruby Frank one which is really
really interesting. Next week we are going to be working
(25:25):
on a case of mistaken identity, unless, of course, I
tell you guys all the time, there's any breaking celebrity desks,
then we'll definitely do that first. We have just so
many different cases. We have the Karen Reid trial with
John O'Keeffe and we're going to be talking about that
in our next story. Actually, So that's a really interesting
two part to section that you guys might want to
(25:45):
read Yeah, head over to the growth room dot com
now to sign up. Okay, So, speaking of the John
O'Keeffe and Karen Reid situation, last night, word came out
that the trooper that was associated with this case has
finally been let go.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Well, he was the lead investigator, so like he was
more than just a cop involved in the sidelines. He
was a major player.
Speaker 1 (26:12):
And I just don't understand, like this whatever happened, accident, murder,
whatever you want to call it, happened in January of
twenty twenty two, and it took almost three whole years
to finally let this guy go.
Speaker 2 (26:25):
Yeah, I mean I don't even think so this trooper
Michael Proctor. Oh my god. So there. I don't know
if historically you know this, but in the Salem witch
trials there was a person killed named John Proctor, and
then with the victim's name, well I'm wondering if they
are related since it's in the same area, but with
the victim's name being John O'Keeffe and his name being
(26:47):
Michael Proctor, Like, my brain just has a really hard
time with this. But anyway, after Karen Reid's mistrial a
couple of months ago, trooper Michael Proctor had been suspended
without pay while they did an investigation because during her
trial all these really inappropriate text messages popped up where
he was calling her a whack job. He said he
hoped she killed herself. There was even, you know, this
(27:10):
part where he said he was looking through her phone
and he hadn't come across any nude shit. So obviously
that's concerning when it's a police officer and made investigating
a possible homicide. But I don't know, it seems like
he had all this other misconduct and the Massachusetts State
Police decided to suspend him and do an investigation, and
after their investigation, they decided to officially fire him.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
So isn't it interesting that a couple weeks ago the
federal government, who was also investigating this investigation, had said
that they closed their investigation, and now this comes out
a couple weeks later. Do you think that their investigation
had anything to do with his final determination that they
were going to get rid of him.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
I mean, yeah, I would say so, because I think
that they do these investigations and then they present all
their findings to a board and it just takes a
couple of weeks to go over everything and make a determination.
So they're saying, you know, well, another major problem he
had was that he didn't disclose his connection to people
involved in this case, which obviously is a major conflict
(28:13):
of interest. So I think with all these other things combined,
they're just like.
Speaker 1 (28:17):
Which is important to note, because he was apparently friends
with the people where this guy's body was found on
the lawn, if you remember, and we just thought it
was weird in general that you find a dead body
on someone's lawn and you don't even go into the
house and search it to see what was happening. Like
(28:38):
that to me was one of the biggest screw ups
in the case. But of course you wouldn't search it
because you're friends with the people, right. This is why,
this is why there's questions with these cases because of
the way they're handled improperly.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
So this is what the trialdboard is saying. They found
him guilty of violating four department policies, which included sending
the inappropriate text messages about Karen Reid, sharing sensitive information
about her case with people outside law enforcement, creating an
image of being biased against her, and then drinking while
on duty. And connection to an unrelated cold case.
Speaker 1 (29:11):
Yeah, which is exactly what she's being accused. All of
his drinking and driving. And you know that whole culture
of that whole group of friends is just like that, right.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
I was just gonna say that they all seemed like
they had issues with drinking. I mean, they definitely shouldn't
have been She one hundred percent, regardless of what you think,
should not have been drinking and driving. Like I feel like,
I mean, nobody should be no, but I feel like
a lot in this case. This case is extremely controversial
because you're like teamed police department or team Karen Reid.
(29:41):
And I think a lot of Karen Reid supporters are
also not acknowledging that she was still doing something bad.
It doesn't mean she murdered him, but she still shouldn't
have been drinking and driving. Now it's important to acknowledge.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
So I got I got a direct message from one
of our listeners a few days ago, and she sends
me a link to this next case we're going to
talk about, and said that she was friends with these people.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
So, oh my god.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
And I wrote her back and I was like, wait,
you like actually know these people and she's like, yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
All right. So this guy at Milwaukee calls the cops
and says his girlfriend's dead, and when they get there,
she's obviously been dead for a while, and this scene
has clearly been staged. So he admitted that he found
her twenty days earlier, but said because he's from another country,
he didn't know the laws here about reporting a dead body.
Speaker 1 (30:35):
I love that the investigators because he's from Turkey. So
the investigators were like, well, how would you report this
in Turkey if you live there, Like it's like, come on,
that's the biggest bullshit answer, Like Turkey has accountability for
you killing people as well, Like you can't just you know, like,
good try though, dude.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
Yeah, but he said he went this is what he
is saying. He said he went out to go run
an errand for an hour, and when he came back,
the girlfriend was just covered in blood. He didn't know
what happened, and then he fainted and slept next to
her dead body for twenty days because he didn't know
what to do, and at one point he considered taking
his life, so he tried to do that with a
nail gun. They did find a nail in his head.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
Yeah, so that's true that all they actually found the
nail in his head that was going into his brain
at the hospital, they had to remove it. So this
is an interesting side note talking about the cases that
we have in the gross room. If you just go
in there and search nail gun, you're going to see
many cases where people not only intentionally put a nail
(31:39):
gun in their head to try to kill themselves, but
also accidental cases. And you wouldn't believe how many times
it actually happens when people go to the hospital and
have to get a nail removed out of their head.
But the imaging is just crazy that you could see
it going right through the person's brain. So in this case,
it was obviously like this is what you're going to do.
(32:00):
You find this person there and twenty days dead is
really disgusting. So she was probably really decomposed. And on
top of that, you do the autops scene, it's just like, oh, well,
how did she die exactly because we've found twelve knife
wounds sharp force wounds in her body that severed multiple organs,
(32:20):
and her cause of death was a massive bleed.
Speaker 2 (32:23):
Like, what's your story now, dude, Well, he still denied
killing her. But he admitted he did move her body,
and they're alleging that he only finally called about it
because the landlord was going to be coming into the
apartment to inspect it because they were getting evicted.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
So when they did the investigation, of course they were
able to find So they found surveillance of him going
to a store and buying lots of cleaning supplies. There
was evidence that the scene was there was a lot
of blood there, and there was evidence that someone tried
to clean it up. Then they found surveillance footage of
him buying an algun, which was the day after she
(33:01):
had died. So, yeah, you're cook, dude, And I can't
believe that someone that listens to our show knows these people. No,
I really just like, could you imagine just knowing a couple,
even knowing that their relationship may be tumultuous or whatever,
and just hearing this, especially hearing someone that you know
(33:23):
gets killed as bad, but knowing that he was like
laying along her dead body for twenty days, And I
just think like with a stabbing death, especially all that
blood would just smell so terrible after twenty days and
just be like matted into the carpet. I just it's
just so, it's just so weird.
Speaker 2 (33:42):
Right, No, it's just very disturbing.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
Okay, So I was reading this deer Abby. I love
the deer Abby's even though they're not technically news stories,
but they are because they were.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
In the news this week.
Speaker 1 (33:54):
But this woman was saying that she had a terminal
illness and she didn't know what to do about it.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
Well, not that well, she didn't know what to do
about it, but she was also asking for advice because
she doesn't want to tell her family about it. So
how do you feel about that? Well, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
I think that her reasoning is just she said since
she was thirteen she was dealing with suicidal thoughts and
depression and self harm. And it's weird how it was
mentioned that she said that she's dealing with an illness
that can kill her, Like what does that even mean exactly?
Speaker 2 (34:29):
Like is it a terminal illness or is it so?
Or is she just suicidal?
Speaker 1 (34:33):
I don't know. But she doesn't want to tell her child,
her children and kids, and I don't know. I think
that most people, like from a mom's perspective, I feel
like if I told my kids, right, now that I
was going to be dying next year. It would like
ruin their life for the next year, but right, and
(34:56):
I just wouldn't want to put that on them. But
also the best I guess you would say of knowing
that you're going to die is that, like you can
tell your family and talk to your family every single
day till that time about everything with your life and
just like things that a lot of people don't get
when one of their loved ones just drops dead. So
(35:18):
I understand, like you don't want to upset your husband
and child, but your your husband and children also love you,
and they would probably want to support you and help you,
Like before you die, be like be happy in your life.
So when you finally do shut your eyes for the
last time, like you know what I mean, that you
(35:41):
feel like you were loved and you weren't dealing with
all that by yourself.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
Well, I just think there's elements to consider with this case.
She said she had something that could kill her, Like
I think having a definitive terminal illness is something that's
a little different because if you're dealing with something that
you know you're gonna die from, I don't know, I
struggle with it. I understand, but in the same breath,
(36:06):
I think it's a little selfish because you're not giving
your family the time to process your loss, even though
it is your illness and you should deal with it
however you see fit, but you don't want them thinking
that you were suffering and they weren't doing enough to help,
and then they have to live with that guilt the
rest of their life. I just think it's really interesting, though.
(36:27):
I think Abby had said you should tell them. I do.
Speaker 1 (36:31):
I do understand where she's coming from, though.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
I understand not telling the kids right away, because, like
you said, you don't want to ruin their life. But
the husband, I feel like you should definitely be telling
because also if you are getting sick like the like
Abby said, he's going to notice that you are changing
and visibly dying well, And.
Speaker 1 (36:52):
The same could be said about kids. A lot of
times you think that, like, oh, kids, you know that's
I even say that with you sometimes because sometimes you'll
be talking about an adult matter and one of the
kids will say like, what did you mean, and you're
just quick to say like, oh, nothing, don't worry about it,
and I'm like, no, they can understand if you talk
to them in a certain way. They could understand a
lot more than we think they could understand, and they
(37:15):
should be privy to some conversations as well as far
as that likes.
Speaker 2 (37:21):
Kids are very very.
Speaker 1 (37:22):
Intuitive to know when something's off in the house, whether
you know what I mean, and like, I think it's
respectful to them to talk to them about it, you know.
Speaker 2 (37:32):
And I don't think you necessarily have to give them
every detail and be like I'm dying, but you could
prepare them for it by being like, I'm sick. Yeah,
you know, you don't have to be like I might
drop dead tomorrow, so get used to your time with me.
But I don't know. I definitely think it's important to
confide in family because also why would you want to
(37:53):
suffer through something like that alone.
Speaker 1 (37:55):
Yeah, I'm not sure.
Speaker 2 (37:56):
There's a show called The Big Sea that came out
probably if fifteen years ago with Laura Lennie, and it's
the same concept. I mean, it's hard.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
It's hard to say because you and I have never
been in that situation, and until then it's like you
just don't. It's the same thing with a lot of
these stories that we talk about. It's just like you
just don't really know like how you would react until
you were in that particular situation.
Speaker 2 (38:20):
Yeah, for sure. All right, let's move on to questions
of the Day. Every Friday at that at mother nos
Death Instagram account, you guys get head to our story
and ask us whatever question you want. First, have you
done an autopsy on someone with more than the normal
amount of organs?
Speaker 1 (38:35):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (38:35):
I have.
Speaker 1 (38:37):
In any case when you do, like somebody an autopsy
on somebody that has a kidney transplant, It's it's a
very interesting fact that most people don't know that when
you get a kidney transplant, they leave the old kidney
in there. So I've done autopsies on people with three
and four kidneys. Also, you could get accessory organs, like
an accessory spleen. Sometimes you could get multiple of those,
(39:00):
So in cases like that yet, for sure, I've had
that happen.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
Okay too. What motivated you to start educating the public
with your website and YouTube?
Speaker 1 (39:09):
I guess it first started with doing autopsies at the hospital,
and we had this conference every week which was called
the Gross Conference, where we would present organs from autopsy
and surgical pathology to medical residents. Medical students, surgeons attending physicians.
They would come down to the Morgan we would talk
(39:30):
about all of the interesting cases for the week, which
was super cool because not only were we helping and
educating them about the patients they were actually taking care of,
but we were also really able to explain what we
were looking at from our perspective, which is always helpful
for doctors to just be very integrated in how we
(39:53):
diagnose things. And that conference stopped happening, and that was
like a huge missing piece of my life because I
really enjoyed doing that. So then I decided that I
was going to make a blog and just start writing
about the interesting cases that I was seeing. But it
was just like I was just doing it, and I
(40:13):
was writing every single day, like all this stuff because
Maria was older at that point and she didn't need
like mom attention as much as like an eight year old.
She knew when to go take a shower and stuff
like I didn't have to be like, you know what
I mean, Like, she was kind of self functioning as
a teenager at that point. So I had time on
my hands, and I was done college at that point,
(40:35):
so I would come home and write for a couple
hours and it was really it was really awesome, but
like no, I just would think, like, how is anybody
going to see my blog? And then my husband had
suggested to me, I guess he was my boyfriend at
the time, and he had suggested to me, like, hey,
why don't you take these pictures and then just write
(40:56):
these things for Instagram, but just make them shorter like
Instagram post. And then Maria was you know, like I said,
she was a teenager, she was eighteen at the time,
and she helped me set up the Instagram account because
I didn't, like, I'm a boomer, right, so I don't
know how to I don't know how to use social media.
And it kind of just went from there, like it
(41:19):
picked up right away, like very fast after being on there.
And then I just kept doing the same thing that
I had been doing for years, just in a shorter format.
Speaker 2 (41:29):
All right, last, what's your best parenting advice?
Speaker 1 (41:34):
I guess just I guess I would say the best
thing is just to have like an open relationship with
your kids so they don't feel like they have to
like hide stuff from you. I don't know, like what
I mean, what do you think I think that was
good with Like whenever Maria was having some kind of
like difficult situations that she would always like come to
(41:57):
me and just tell me about it, because I guess
the biggest things for kids to understand is like you
might be having a hard time or you might be
in trouble, but you might upset me too, but like ultimately,
like I'll always love you, so like I could help
you more than anybody else could help you, So just
(42:18):
don't be afraid to tell me something like.
Speaker 2 (42:22):
I think you had a really good balance with me,
in particular with our situation of being like a good
mixture of my friend and my mom, because sometimes it
goes one way or the other. You know, where people
are like all parent and they have like no casual
relationship with their kid where they don't feel comfortable going
to them, or you have the parents that are one
(42:43):
hundred percent your friend, and then your kids are like
getting into trouble because you're just letting them do whatever
they want. But I think you figured out a really
good balance that and I did always feel comfortable telling
you everything. I mean, I still have like diarrhea of
the mouth when I talk to you about yeah exactly,
but it's it's it's.
Speaker 1 (43:01):
Better to be that way than to be hidden because then,
I mean, now you're older, but with kids, little kids
and teenagers especially, like it's it's like the most crucial
thing ever, because that's when they can really get into
trouble with major things that will affect the rest of
their life.
Speaker 2 (43:19):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
I mean, I want my kids to feel comfortable calling
me and saying, I'm at a party and people started
doing things here that I'm not comfortable with and I
want to come home, you know, like things like that,
because normally a parent might freak out about that and
just be like, why are you hanging out with people
that do drugs and like, and you're just like, no,
(43:41):
I want you to call me at three in the
morning and I will call whatever, And like, honestly, my
kids don't want to ever leave the house, So I
don't even know if that's ever going to be a situation,
but I you know, you never know, and I just
I always want that to be a thing that they
feel like they could come to me whenever they're in trouble.
Speaker 2 (44:00):
Well, thank god I succeeded at being a good big
sister and got them hooked on the sims, Yeah, exactly,
they'll never go out, all right. Well, thank you guys
so much. Please leave us a five star written review
on Apple and if you have a story for us,
please submit it to stories at Mothernosdeath dot com or
(44:20):
send us a message on Instagram say yeah, thank.
Speaker 1 (44:26):
You for listening to Mother Nos Death. As a reminder,
my training is as a pathologists assistant. I have a
master's level education and specialize in anatomy and pathology education.
I am not a doctor and I have not diagnosed
or treated anyone dead or alive without the assistance of
a licensed medical doctor. This show, my website, and social
(44:50):
media accounts are designed to educate and inform people based
on my experience working in pathology, so they can make
healthier decisions regarding their life and well being. Always remember
that science is changing every day and the opinions expressed
in this episode are based on my knowledge of those
subjects at the time of publication. If you are having
(45:12):
a medical problem, have a medical question, or having a
medical emergency, please contact your physician or visit an urgent
care center, emergency room.
Speaker 2 (45:23):
Or hospital.
Speaker 1 (45:24):
Please rate, review, and subscribe to Mother Knows Death on Apple, Spotify, YouTube,
or anywhere you get podcasts.
Speaker 2 (45:32):
Thanks
Hosts And Creators
Nicole Angemi
Maria Q. Kane
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