January 5, 2025 • 25 mins
Join @thebuzzknight for a special CES 2025 episode with Brian Comiskey, the Senior Director, Innovation and Trends & Futurist from the Consumer Technology Association.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Taking a Walk.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
A lot of companies I think have a major appeal
to say, hey, we want to just take the latest
and great technology. But what they must do first is
identify what is the necessity, what is the need of
their audience, their consumer being met. So when thinking about
something like artificial intelligence, that's the first guardrail, right is
what is your use case?
Speaker 1 (00:20):
What is that doing for someone?
Speaker 3 (00:22):
Well? I'm Buzzsnight, the host of the Taking a Walk podcast.
We talk with musicians, we talk with insiders, we talk
with experts in their field. We love talking about the
intersection of music, media, technology and Welcome to the Special
CEES twenty.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
Twenty five Special Tech tick on a Walk. I like
the way that sounds tech ticke out a Walk episode
as we celebrate this week. I'm joined by the Senior
director of Innovation for.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
The Consumer Technology Association, Brian Kamiski.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Hello, Brian, hy buzz, How you doing great? Welcome to
Taking a Walk.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
I wish we were taking a walk in person for it,
but since your schedule this week of CEES is bonkers,
we're in two different places. But we'll intersect on the
floor at some point. Okay, I'm sure we will.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
I think we're going to get that amongst our what
like the twenty thousand steps a day one gets at CS.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Absolutely, yeah, I love it, looking forward to it all.
So what are the key themes for media companies to
observe this year at the CEES twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Yeah, of course, Well, I think it's it's about kind
of reflecting with the overall show theme, which is going
all in right, which is how do you lean into
different technologies to either access a new audience, to improve
your own product, or to honestly improve your operations.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
So I think there's really three key.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Paths that really emerge my mind. One is how are
companies grappling when you know it's going to take about
two minutes this podcast for me to say the word
our official intelligence. But how do companies interact with the
rising and shifting nature of ourtificial intelligence? How do they
really leverage what is the especially on the audio side,
what's the oldest form of content or spoken entertainment in
(02:16):
the world into other forms of intellectual property and what
that means in maybe gaming and video. And lastly, how
do you use it to really start to improve the
audio or the video the actual outputs that you're doing right,
how do you get that high fidelity visual or audio quality?
Speaker 1 (02:33):
Those are the three that really come to mind right away.
So when you think.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Of artificial intelligence, what guard rails do you think media
companies should be thinking about?
Speaker 2 (02:45):
Of course, well, I think with any sort of innovation,
it's all about a balance. I think when we think
about innovation and growth all that we think there's a
few pairs of forces that operate.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
One is you have growth versus value.
Speaker 2 (02:58):
Right, Companies want to grow their product, consumers want the
best value their supply and demand. These ones make sense,
But there's another one, which is innovation versus necessity.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Right.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
A lot of companies I think have a.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
Major appeal to say, hey, we want to just take
the latest and greatest technology. But what they must do
first is identify what is the necessity, What is the
need of their audience, their consumer being met. So when
thinking about something like artificial intelligence, that's the first guardrail, right, is.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
What is your use case? What is that doing for someone?
Speaker 2 (03:29):
And I think a really good example of this is
it goes back to someone that Caines actually said like
one hundred years ago, which is the idea of technology
is supposed to be used to eliminate drudgery so that
we can do what humans do best, which is be creative.
And what better medium then music and media in general, right,
which is how do you use AI and building a
place that is helping build efficiencies, but keeping those guardrails
(03:53):
to protect the talent to really leverage into what is
the stronger.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Components of the industry, which is its people. At the
end of the day.
Speaker 3 (04:00):
I'm so glad you said that, because I think the
human touch is so critical here and sometimes I think
that gets forgotten when companies are really looking at these
balance sheets trying to get them together, and they forget
about the importance of people. But speaking of people and
speaking of radio organizations, how do radio companies build the
(04:26):
spirit of innovation inside their walls in the years ahead?
Speaker 1 (04:31):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (04:31):
Well, I think there's a few paths to that. One
is actually sometimes taking a look inward at your own employees.
You know, I've talked with some other folks in the
media exec space in the past, and they've talked about
competitions for innovation. How do you get your employees even
in terms of thinking about, well, what sort of technology
or what sort of approach can we use to really
(04:53):
improve our operations and looking and leaning into the people
that they already have, and you can create it in
a friendly competitive set where it's all right, we're going
to adopt one of these solutions. Maybe that's you know,
incentivized financially by the way, that's a morale boost inside.
Some of it is also not being afraid of bringing
in that outside expertise on technology and how do you
(05:14):
adopt it. And this is a balancing at that not
just media companies but companies in general are starting to
consider right is as AI, but also all these other
technologies get a little bit more complex, get a little
bit more detailed. There's a lot of data going around,
there's a lot of privacy going concerns to think about
how do you make sure that you have that expertise.
And sometimes you have that internally, sometimes you have that externally.
(05:36):
But when I look at something like radio in particular,
I think that there's a tendency in the industry. And
I'm a long radio fan. I think we've both known this.
I'm from the New England area. Originally I grew up
listening to a lot of independent radio, like ninety two
to one or one seven FNX, which no longer exists.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Rest in peace.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
But I grew up listening to that, and I think
what made that very clear was what made it great
well its radio personalities. They did start to pivot to
use some technologies quite well, I thought, which is when
they went to digital, they went into an online presence,
especially after the loss of the radio station itself. But
this is one of those things where they started trying
to lean in and maybe it was a little too
late in this example, but lean into how do we
(06:17):
use other technologies in general to keep.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
Our product alive?
Speaker 2 (06:22):
Or let's go with one that still exists today, which
is metal Arc Media. That is Dan Lebtard who had
his radio station on ESPN for years talking about sports
metal Arc.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
After the separation of ESPN, they are no longer on radio.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Because they successfully pivoted to video using draft kings of
all people to fund their sponsor. We're talking about a
betting company coming in and saying, hey, media matters. And
they built a podcast in digital empire as well as
a video stream empire on Twitch, which is leaning into
a new generational demographic.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Right.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
So at their peak of ESPN, they were on Twitch, Radio,
TV and to a podcasts. They were using an Omnich
channel approach, which really starts to attract those younger generations.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
So every year at CEES you are able to find
these companies that, you know, maybe surprise people in terms
of the amazing work they're doing or they're preparing to
roll out. Are there a couple of examples this year
that will be surprising to folks in terms of what
(07:27):
companies are showcasing at CEES twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Yeah, Well, I think about especially let's let's say with music,
and you think about all the different ways that audio
goes right, Like you have Victrola be back, you know,
a company from nineteen oh six, how are they developing
their latest turntables which have started to get a little
bit of a comeback in terms of some of the
not just the high fidelity audio, but there is a
(07:51):
for gen Z they are surprisingly like they like to
go to sometimes that tech that maybe is a little
bit older, not just for the novelty, but because it
still has that high power immersive performance. When we think
about audios shift in general, people are looking for immersive experiences.
So a company like Patrola is innovating in that place.
On the turntable side. Another path that I find interesting
(08:13):
is well, what is music used for?
Speaker 1 (08:16):
In general?
Speaker 2 (08:16):
We tend to lean right to entertainment, but right before
you know, I go on stage or I talk to anyone,
I actually usually listen to music as a way to
sort of calm myself down, to train myself. I usually
have like a go to playlist of different things. And
when I tell you the genre is quite ranging, it
is all over the place.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
But there's a company.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
That's going to be that's at SESS called Alphabets, which
I really like. It's a patented solution. It wins one
at CS Innovation Award. It's actually used for athletic performers.
And what it does is it bases on neurofeedback and
individualized music to help recovery and relaxation and focus and flow.
So how are you using music to actually help athletes
(08:58):
in this case perform their very best. So I think
that's the other thing is when we think about music,
when we think about media, we tend to go down.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
This route of content and entertainment.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
And that's a massive, massive market. But I think at
its core, what is the staying power of music really is?
It's not just it taps into a culture, It clearly
taps into something quite primal and instinctual. And so seeing
a company like Alphabets really lean into that, I think
is incredible. And then lastly, I just will say, really quick,
you're going to see companies like iHeartMedia and Serious XM
(09:31):
talk about what their overall strategies look like, whether that's
from a content perspective or they're leaning into talking about well,
what's our new offerings in our strategy and how do
we use technology to enhance that.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
So I produced this other podcast which is called Music
Save Me. It's about the sort of healing power of music.
Linn Hoffman as the host of that podcast. It's sort
of was born out of taking a walk. So can
you speak even in a little bit more detail towards,
(10:02):
you know, maybe the therapeutic aspects of maybe products. You
just alluded to it to a degree with the prep
before going on stage, But are there any offerings that
sort of match what Music Saved Me is about, which
is this you know, real incredible force that music has
to do good and help people.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
Well, as I said, I think that first example really
speaks to this company called alphabet is where they're really
leaning into this idea of well, how do we use
just basically it's focusing and calibrating it to neurofeedback, which
that gets into there's a whole psychology I feel called psychoacoustics,
which is how are you using sound to trigger a
(10:45):
particular emotional response, a typical, a certain physiological response.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
They're working on that, SiriusXM. We'll be talking about that
a lot.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
They have a team called Studio reson I actually serious
ExM will. It has a keynote at CES they're going
to be talking to the host of Crime Junkie, a
true crime podcast. But in addition to that, the Studio
Resonate team will be there and their whole focus is
on this idea of psychoacoustics. How do you get that
sort of space to really use sound and audio cues to.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Evoke a certain type of reaction.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Now there is a focus that they use it for
for advertising and marketing. Certainly, right when we hear the
sound of Netflix go off, right, even just the quick
whole theme music, you don't even need to see the
Netflix logo to know what happens, right, or the taco
bell chime that's the sort of psychology that they're going with.
And then there's a musical component to it as well,
(11:40):
which is all right, it's not just the sound effect book,
what's the musical side of it.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
The other one too, is there.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
Will be companies that we talked about the therapeutic side, but
music also is a really tremendous educational tool.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
I know, you know growing up.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
So both my sisters are teachers, and one is a
Spanish language teacher, and and she follows a tried and
true form which is teaching Spanish language songs because if
you learn a tuned to certain words and not I
was talking about all the fun alphabet song, but if
you learn actual music from the countries, you can actually
learn slang in a context that really helps you into
(12:16):
the future.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
So music has a.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
Therapeutic and educational role. It's really it's what are you
tapping into at the end of the day. And I
think all of us at the end of the day
can think about certain tracks that bring us to the
right emotional state time. And so these companies I've listed, Alphabets,
Miko's this company that's worked on educational side, and even
stereos xm are all finding how do we get that
(12:38):
there from different paths, whether that's a learning robot, a
therapeutic app, or just our content platform as a whole.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
So, your boss, Gary Shapiro, the president of the Consumer
Technology Association, has a new book out, Pivot or Die,
great title. You wrote a chapter in there for the book, Loo,
how do companies sort of jump off the curb and
do what's necessary, get their fears out of the way,
(13:10):
and make the necessary pivot to thrive in today's world?
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Yeah, of course, Well, I think the lot of that
is what I think the first step is when you
think about how to thrive, I think technology is the
pathway to do so, and I think you have to
first examine, well, what is your relationship with technology? And
I think there's really kind of four types of relationships
and technology. I think that there's companies that are enablers,
and these are companies that they are making the building
(13:38):
blocks of a particular technology. They are the ones who
are there making either the hardware or the software platform
that allows it to happen. This is why, for example,
Nvidia is doing so well in our official intelligence. They
make the chips the literal hardware foundation for AI, but
they also make the software.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
That's one relationship. One is called.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Engagers, and these are companies they lean fully in to
technology as their main products, so they oftentimes offer a
software a service.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
The last two might sound close.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
To one another, but I think a lot of companies
will fall into the fourth category could be the third easy.
So the third categories enhancer. So after you go for
enabler or to engage, go to enhancer. These are companies
that use technology. It's not their core product, but they
find a way to leverage their technology that can influence
the whole space itself. And lastly that you have companies
that are what you would call a user, which is
(14:27):
they might use technology, but it's not really their flesh
and blood or to their core, to their identity as
a product. Enhancers are really fascinating to me because these
are companies where they might do one thing, but it
turns out that they have an incredibly good product somewhere else.
So when I think about someone like Chick fil A,
for example, is a really good example of this. They're
(14:50):
very good at chicken sandwiches and in meals, but what
they're also really good about doing is bridging community through
their media platforms. So they're actually launching an app to
bring families get It's not food ordering app, but it's
simply a way to bridge their communities together.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
And that just launched in the last week.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
This is really kind of this example of they went
from being kind of a user where we have really
good technology for making our meals, but then they realize, oh,
we have really good logistics technology because have you ever
really waited in a long line at Pick fil a?
Speaker 3 (15:19):
No?
Speaker 1 (15:20):
And then we have really good ability connect with people.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
So they actually now sell a lot of their logistics
technologies and advise companies on how to improve their retail
footprint or they're telling people how to make apps, and
this is something I think is really important. They've gone
from what you call a user at the end of
the spectrum of people just use technology to enhancing leaning
into this technology idea and raising it.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Chick fil A is a good example of this.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Delta who is keynoting at CS is another great example
of this.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
We think of that as an airline, but really at the.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
End of the day, they've pioneered a lot of the
artificial intelligence that's used to track flight algorithms, assess weather
patterns to avoid delays, as well as creating technology that
that leverages sort of multi virtual reality or something called
parallel reality to allow different customers and passengers to have
a seamless flight experience that's very individualized. That's the type
(16:13):
of technology that they're leaning into adopting, and then can
easily export to others in the field should they want to.
And I think at the end of the day, it's
assess your relationship. Am I just using technology? Or can
I enhance this technology industry by really leaning into what
works for me?
Speaker 1 (16:30):
And I think radio is a good example of this.
Speaker 2 (16:32):
No one has better localized data I think in the
world about customers in general, in terms of they have
these local markets, they know what their users want, their
consumers want in this area that tourra data is invaluable
to things like an AI program. And you can look
to Reddit, who monetize and leverage their AI content quite successfully.
They're at ces and they've gone revenue growth. I would
(16:55):
look at someone where it's radio saying well, what can
we do with our data to maybe actually lean forward
and be engaging with technology rather than AI coming at.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Us and feeling like we're reacting all the time.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
So over the years, the show is really deeply immersed
in the automotive business and specifically even the connected car
when we talk about radio or entertainment, and now, of
course with EV being an important development over the years,
(17:29):
you add that in what can we expect at this
show to see in terms of automotive innovation?
Speaker 1 (17:36):
Yeah, of course, Well, I think you're correct. We lean
into it.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
Arguably, we're the largest mobility show, and I use mobility
very intentionally because it's all it's more than just the auto,
and I think that there's four pathways where you'll see
mobility change. The electric story is still massive, and we'll
see EV makers from across the world, not just the US,
but from Korea, from China, even showcasing where electric cars
(18:00):
are going. But I say electrification very intentionally because we'll
have companies like Brunswick they're showcasing electric boating technology. And
then there's a whole infrastructure component to it that's vitally
important because it's not just about how can we empower
our cars more efficiently, But when you start introducing new
charging technology from exhibitors at the show, like link charging
(18:21):
in LG, you're starting to really think how the.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
Grid is more sustainable.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
There's a sustainability story that's equally important that's occurring under here.
That's one path. The other two are very linked. This
is sensors and self driving. Essentially, how do you are
autonomous vehicles be more correct, actually you would want to
say autonous vehicles because sometimes boating technology, you're boating, you're
not driving or flying in some cases, because there will
(18:48):
be exhibits showcasing autonomous flying vehicles like Invo station. But
you think about it on autonomus vehicles and you think
about sensors, which is how do you get more information
onto your car itself? How does it become essentially a
software divide vehicle or a smart smart device on wheels,
And a lot of that is advanced safety data, more
(19:08):
data referring to just the health of the car in
general in terms of power output. But then there's also
an infotainment story, which is a lot more personalized audio,
a lot more personalized heads up displays, and immersive experiences
in there. That's the second and third pathways combined. The
last one is industrials, and I think that's something that
has really grown in our show over the years, which
(19:29):
is how do you take wattrification, autonomous capabilities, and others
and apply it outside the passenger themselves.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
And now our show, you'll see the show.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
You're seeing companies like Caboda, Oshkosh, Deer, Caterpillar, all these
what I call the big truck companies. The little kidd
of me is so excited walking across the floor. But
how are they making a lot of the industries I've
described that they work in are like mining or heavy industrials.
How do you make those safer and more sustainable? Well,
(19:58):
maybe you take some of the innovation that's occurring in
the automotive that we know and mobility in general and
apply it to your industry. And that's what's clearly happening
on the show.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
For this year. So in closing, as a futurist, do
you size up particular trends at each show that you
then start dissecting as the year progresses to see if
it's truly a trend or just a little bit of
a blip or a fad or a marketing plan or something.
(20:29):
How do you see the future and is there one
or two things that you're going to be sniffing around
for in particular at this year's show?
Speaker 2 (20:37):
Yeah, No, that's God, this is such a good question.
It's a bit of all of the above, right. Some
of it is I yeah, as a futurist that I
think people maybe evokes like I don't know, like Tony
Stark meets Crystal Ball, predictions of what's happening next. Oftentimes
it's a lot of reading, and it's a lot of
just looking and trying to get understan what the show
(21:00):
looks like. But then when you get to the show,
the beauty is as much as I can try to
predict a trend, I'll be surprised. I am surprised every
year by something on the floor. So what I do
is I go back and I do start to parse out.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
Well, what are we seeing?
Speaker 2 (21:12):
And I think one of the big ones is last
year going to the show, every company was like, we're
an AI company.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
We're an AI company.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
Genera of AI and chat GPT have taken off, and
they have, but how do you contextualize that into something larger?
And I think CEUs twenty twenty five and the years
ahead will really reframe AI where it's not just about
generative I it's about a fundamental evolution in terms of
how we relate to tech. There is an old phrase
(21:40):
and I used to do this consulting with the Coastcard,
called digital transformation. It's been around for sixteen years. How
do companies get on the cloud?
Speaker 1 (21:47):
How do they get cyber? How do they get AI?
Speaker 2 (21:49):
I don't think that's an up to date term anymore,
and I think CS is starting to be the proger
of this.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
I would say it's digital coexistence.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
Arguably, when we're doing recordings for a lot of I'm
sure with your podcast you're not just taking a walk
with people in person. You're using zoom, You're using all
these digital mediums. You are probably shopping online. Most people
are working online or in an office, or learning at
school or online. Arguably, our digital lives are getting to
(22:18):
the point where they're at parity with our physical lives.
So how do technologies like AI, cloud and cyber work
to create this sort of ecosystem. That's the first big
one that I'm seeing shape up. I was seeing shape
up ahead of the show, during the show and except
after the other one is how is sustainability changing? And
I think this is in relation to the AI component
(22:40):
as well. AI and data centers take a lot of power,
especially when you think about the emissions that come from
the data center and how much it takes to cool them.
Forty to sixty percent of cooling, AI, cloud, cybersecurity, all
that is coming from data centers that are pretty much
found in Dulles Corridor and DC and Virgil the area.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
They take a lot of power.
Speaker 2 (23:02):
And so how do you rethink sustainability to really focus
on what's called the energy transition? Human society has lived
through two already, and this is the other part about
a futurist. You have to know your history, you have
to know the past. And so the first one was
we went from firewood to coal as humanity. Then we
went from coal to oil and fossil fuels. We're on
the third one now, which is how do we get
(23:22):
from fossil fuels to renewables because we know that there's
emissions coming from fossil fuels and we know data centers
take a lot of them. So we're looking at and
we're seeing on the show for companies that are focusing
on renewables like solar and wind. We're seeing companies that
focus on that cooling issue. So HVAC innovation is more
important than ever, believe it or not. And what does
(23:44):
that mean? An energy transition? And I wouldn't be surprised.
In the year to come, we're already seeing announcements of it.
Nuclear is going to be forefront of a lot of
conversations of how does that which is a high energy
density technology that has zero emissions get involved in this transition.
So those are the two that I'm watching close to
this idea digital coexistence and energy transition. And at the
(24:06):
end of the day, why are they important? Why am
I spending a lot of time talking about them? They're
all interconnected through a variety of technologies. Technologies oftentimes are
not innovating in a vacuum. They're not just breaking through
in one way or the other. As we've talked today,
we've talked about how AI relates the music, how music
relates to data, and we're doing this now between energy
(24:27):
digital coexistence. That's what I look for in parts through,
which is where are these overall narratives in the stories.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
Oh, Brian did a great job making very complex issues digestible.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
For all this. Always excited to be at the big show,
the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas, and thanks for
being on taking a walk.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
Thank you so much, Buzz, it was an absolute pleasure.
Thanks for listening to this episode of the Taking a
Walk podcast.
Speaker 3 (24:58):
Share this and other episodes with you friends, and follow
us so you never miss an episode. Taking a Walk
is available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, and wherever
you get your podcasts.
Taking a Walk.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
A lot of companies I think have a major appeal
to say, hey, we want to just take the latest
and great technology. But what they must do first is
identify what is the necessity, what is the need of
their audience, their consumer being met. So when thinking about
something like artificial intelligence, that's the first guardrail, right is
what is your use case?
Speaker 1 (00:20):
What is that doing for someone?
Speaker 3 (00:22):
Well? I'm Buzzsnight, the host of the Taking a Walk podcast.
We talk with musicians, we talk with insiders, we talk
with experts in their field. We love talking about the
intersection of music, media, technology and Welcome to the Special
CEES twenty.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
Twenty five Special Tech tick on a Walk. I like
the way that sounds tech ticke out a Walk episode
as we celebrate this week. I'm joined by the Senior
director of Innovation for.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
The Consumer Technology Association, Brian Kamiski.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Hello, Brian, hy buzz, How you doing great? Welcome to
Taking a Walk.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
I wish we were taking a walk in person for it,
but since your schedule this week of CEES is bonkers,
we're in two different places. But we'll intersect on the
floor at some point. Okay, I'm sure we will.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
I think we're going to get that amongst our what
like the twenty thousand steps a day one gets at CS.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Absolutely, yeah, I love it, looking forward to it all.
So what are the key themes for media companies to
observe this year at the CEES twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Yeah, of course, Well, I think it's it's about kind
of reflecting with the overall show theme, which is going
all in right, which is how do you lean into
different technologies to either access a new audience, to improve
your own product, or to honestly improve your operations.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
So I think there's really three key.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Paths that really emerge my mind. One is how are
companies grappling when you know it's going to take about
two minutes this podcast for me to say the word
our official intelligence. But how do companies interact with the
rising and shifting nature of ourtificial intelligence? How do they
really leverage what is the especially on the audio side,
what's the oldest form of content or spoken entertainment in
(02:16):
the world into other forms of intellectual property and what
that means in maybe gaming and video. And lastly, how
do you use it to really start to improve the
audio or the video the actual outputs that you're doing right,
how do you get that high fidelity visual or audio quality?
Speaker 1 (02:33):
Those are the three that really come to mind right away.
So when you think.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Of artificial intelligence, what guard rails do you think media
companies should be thinking about?
Speaker 2 (02:45):
Of course, well, I think with any sort of innovation,
it's all about a balance. I think when we think
about innovation and growth all that we think there's a
few pairs of forces that operate.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
One is you have growth versus value.
Speaker 2 (02:58):
Right, Companies want to grow their product, consumers want the
best value their supply and demand. These ones make sense,
But there's another one, which is innovation versus necessity.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Right.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
A lot of companies I think have a.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
Major appeal to say, hey, we want to just take
the latest and greatest technology. But what they must do
first is identify what is the necessity, What is the
need of their audience, their consumer being met. So when
thinking about something like artificial intelligence, that's the first guardrail, right, is.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
What is your use case? What is that doing for someone?
Speaker 2 (03:29):
And I think a really good example of this is
it goes back to someone that Caines actually said like
one hundred years ago, which is the idea of technology
is supposed to be used to eliminate drudgery so that
we can do what humans do best, which is be creative.
And what better medium then music and media in general, right,
which is how do you use AI and building a
place that is helping build efficiencies, but keeping those guardrails
(03:53):
to protect the talent to really leverage into what is
the stronger.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Components of the industry, which is its people. At the
end of the day.
Speaker 3 (04:00):
I'm so glad you said that, because I think the
human touch is so critical here and sometimes I think
that gets forgotten when companies are really looking at these
balance sheets trying to get them together, and they forget
about the importance of people. But speaking of people and
speaking of radio organizations, how do radio companies build the
(04:26):
spirit of innovation inside their walls in the years ahead?
Speaker 1 (04:31):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (04:31):
Well, I think there's a few paths to that. One
is actually sometimes taking a look inward at your own employees.
You know, I've talked with some other folks in the
media exec space in the past, and they've talked about
competitions for innovation. How do you get your employees even
in terms of thinking about, well, what sort of technology
or what sort of approach can we use to really
(04:53):
improve our operations and looking and leaning into the people
that they already have, and you can create it in
a friendly competitive set where it's all right, we're going
to adopt one of these solutions. Maybe that's you know,
incentivized financially by the way, that's a morale boost inside.
Some of it is also not being afraid of bringing
in that outside expertise on technology and how do you
(05:14):
adopt it. And this is a balancing at that not
just media companies but companies in general are starting to
consider right is as AI, but also all these other
technologies get a little bit more complex, get a little
bit more detailed. There's a lot of data going around,
there's a lot of privacy going concerns to think about
how do you make sure that you have that expertise.
And sometimes you have that internally, sometimes you have that externally.
(05:36):
But when I look at something like radio in particular,
I think that there's a tendency in the industry. And
I'm a long radio fan. I think we've both known this.
I'm from the New England area. Originally I grew up
listening to a lot of independent radio, like ninety two
to one or one seven FNX, which no longer exists.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Rest in peace.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
But I grew up listening to that, and I think
what made that very clear was what made it great
well its radio personalities. They did start to pivot to
use some technologies quite well, I thought, which is when
they went to digital, they went into an online presence,
especially after the loss of the radio station itself. But
this is one of those things where they started trying
to lean in and maybe it was a little too
late in this example, but lean into how do we
(06:17):
use other technologies in general to keep.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
Our product alive?
Speaker 2 (06:22):
Or let's go with one that still exists today, which
is metal Arc Media. That is Dan Lebtard who had
his radio station on ESPN for years talking about sports
metal Arc.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
After the separation of ESPN, they are no longer on radio.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Because they successfully pivoted to video using draft kings of
all people to fund their sponsor. We're talking about a
betting company coming in and saying, hey, media matters. And
they built a podcast in digital empire as well as
a video stream empire on Twitch, which is leaning into
a new generational demographic.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Right.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
So at their peak of ESPN, they were on Twitch, Radio,
TV and to a podcasts. They were using an Omnich
channel approach, which really starts to attract those younger generations.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
So every year at CEES you are able to find
these companies that, you know, maybe surprise people in terms
of the amazing work they're doing or they're preparing to
roll out. Are there a couple of examples this year
that will be surprising to folks in terms of what
(07:27):
companies are showcasing at CEES twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Yeah, Well, I think about especially let's let's say with music,
and you think about all the different ways that audio
goes right, Like you have Victrola be back, you know,
a company from nineteen oh six, how are they developing
their latest turntables which have started to get a little
bit of a comeback in terms of some of the
not just the high fidelity audio, but there is a
(07:51):
for gen Z they are surprisingly like they like to
go to sometimes that tech that maybe is a little
bit older, not just for the novelty, but because it
still has that high power immersive performance. When we think
about audios shift in general, people are looking for immersive experiences.
So a company like Patrola is innovating in that place.
On the turntable side. Another path that I find interesting
(08:13):
is well, what is music used for?
Speaker 1 (08:16):
In general?
Speaker 2 (08:16):
We tend to lean right to entertainment, but right before
you know, I go on stage or I talk to anyone,
I actually usually listen to music as a way to
sort of calm myself down, to train myself. I usually
have like a go to playlist of different things. And
when I tell you the genre is quite ranging, it
is all over the place.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
But there's a company.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
That's going to be that's at SESS called Alphabets, which
I really like. It's a patented solution. It wins one
at CS Innovation Award. It's actually used for athletic performers.
And what it does is it bases on neurofeedback and
individualized music to help recovery and relaxation and focus and flow.
So how are you using music to actually help athletes
(08:58):
in this case perform their very best. So I think
that's the other thing is when we think about music,
when we think about media, we tend to go down.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
This route of content and entertainment.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
And that's a massive, massive market. But I think at
its core, what is the staying power of music really is?
It's not just it taps into a culture, It clearly
taps into something quite primal and instinctual. And so seeing
a company like Alphabets really lean into that, I think
is incredible. And then lastly, I just will say, really quick,
you're going to see companies like iHeartMedia and Serious XM
(09:31):
talk about what their overall strategies look like, whether that's
from a content perspective or they're leaning into talking about well,
what's our new offerings in our strategy and how do
we use technology to enhance that.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
So I produced this other podcast which is called Music
Save Me. It's about the sort of healing power of music.
Linn Hoffman as the host of that podcast. It's sort
of was born out of taking a walk. So can
you speak even in a little bit more detail towards,
(10:02):
you know, maybe the therapeutic aspects of maybe products. You
just alluded to it to a degree with the prep
before going on stage, But are there any offerings that
sort of match what Music Saved Me is about, which
is this you know, real incredible force that music has
to do good and help people.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
Well, as I said, I think that first example really
speaks to this company called alphabet is where they're really
leaning into this idea of well, how do we use
just basically it's focusing and calibrating it to neurofeedback, which
that gets into there's a whole psychology I feel called psychoacoustics,
which is how are you using sound to trigger a
(10:45):
particular emotional response, a typical, a certain physiological response.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
They're working on that, SiriusXM. We'll be talking about that
a lot.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
They have a team called Studio reson I actually serious
ExM will. It has a keynote at CES they're going
to be talking to the host of Crime Junkie, a
true crime podcast. But in addition to that, the Studio
Resonate team will be there and their whole focus is
on this idea of psychoacoustics. How do you get that
sort of space to really use sound and audio cues to.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Evoke a certain type of reaction.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Now there is a focus that they use it for
for advertising and marketing. Certainly, right when we hear the
sound of Netflix go off, right, even just the quick
whole theme music, you don't even need to see the
Netflix logo to know what happens, right, or the taco
bell chime that's the sort of psychology that they're going with.
And then there's a musical component to it as well,
(11:40):
which is all right, it's not just the sound effect book,
what's the musical side of it.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
The other one too, is there.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
Will be companies that we talked about the therapeutic side, but
music also is a really tremendous educational tool.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
I know, you know growing up.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
So both my sisters are teachers, and one is a
Spanish language teacher, and and she follows a tried and
true form which is teaching Spanish language songs because if
you learn a tuned to certain words and not I
was talking about all the fun alphabet song, but if
you learn actual music from the countries, you can actually
learn slang in a context that really helps you into
(12:16):
the future.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
So music has a.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
Therapeutic and educational role. It's really it's what are you
tapping into at the end of the day. And I
think all of us at the end of the day
can think about certain tracks that bring us to the
right emotional state time. And so these companies I've listed, Alphabets,
Miko's this company that's worked on educational side, and even
stereos xm are all finding how do we get that
(12:38):
there from different paths, whether that's a learning robot, a
therapeutic app, or just our content platform as a whole.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
So, your boss, Gary Shapiro, the president of the Consumer
Technology Association, has a new book out, Pivot or Die,
great title. You wrote a chapter in there for the book, Loo,
how do companies sort of jump off the curb and
do what's necessary, get their fears out of the way,
(13:10):
and make the necessary pivot to thrive in today's world?
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Yeah, of course, Well, I think the lot of that
is what I think the first step is when you
think about how to thrive, I think technology is the
pathway to do so, and I think you have to
first examine, well, what is your relationship with technology? And
I think there's really kind of four types of relationships
and technology. I think that there's companies that are enablers,
and these are companies that they are making the building
(13:38):
blocks of a particular technology. They are the ones who
are there making either the hardware or the software platform
that allows it to happen. This is why, for example,
Nvidia is doing so well in our official intelligence. They
make the chips the literal hardware foundation for AI, but
they also make the software.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
That's one relationship. One is called.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Engagers, and these are companies they lean fully in to
technology as their main products, so they oftentimes offer a
software a service.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
The last two might sound close.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
To one another, but I think a lot of companies
will fall into the fourth category could be the third easy.
So the third categories enhancer. So after you go for
enabler or to engage, go to enhancer. These are companies
that use technology. It's not their core product, but they
find a way to leverage their technology that can influence
the whole space itself. And lastly that you have companies
that are what you would call a user, which is
(14:27):
they might use technology, but it's not really their flesh
and blood or to their core, to their identity as
a product. Enhancers are really fascinating to me because these
are companies where they might do one thing, but it
turns out that they have an incredibly good product somewhere else.
So when I think about someone like Chick fil A,
for example, is a really good example of this. They're
(14:50):
very good at chicken sandwiches and in meals, but what
they're also really good about doing is bridging community through
their media platforms. So they're actually launching an app to
bring families get It's not food ordering app, but it's
simply a way to bridge their communities together.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
And that just launched in the last week.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
This is really kind of this example of they went
from being kind of a user where we have really
good technology for making our meals, but then they realize, oh,
we have really good logistics technology because have you ever
really waited in a long line at Pick fil a?
Speaker 3 (15:19):
No?
Speaker 1 (15:20):
And then we have really good ability connect with people.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
So they actually now sell a lot of their logistics
technologies and advise companies on how to improve their retail
footprint or they're telling people how to make apps, and
this is something I think is really important. They've gone
from what you call a user at the end of
the spectrum of people just use technology to enhancing leaning
into this technology idea and raising it.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Chick fil A is a good example of this.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Delta who is keynoting at CS is another great example
of this.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
We think of that as an airline, but really at the.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
End of the day, they've pioneered a lot of the
artificial intelligence that's used to track flight algorithms, assess weather
patterns to avoid delays, as well as creating technology that
that leverages sort of multi virtual reality or something called
parallel reality to allow different customers and passengers to have
a seamless flight experience that's very individualized. That's the type
(16:13):
of technology that they're leaning into adopting, and then can
easily export to others in the field should they want to.
And I think at the end of the day, it's
assess your relationship. Am I just using technology? Or can
I enhance this technology industry by really leaning into what
works for me?
Speaker 1 (16:30):
And I think radio is a good example of this.
Speaker 2 (16:32):
No one has better localized data I think in the
world about customers in general, in terms of they have
these local markets, they know what their users want, their
consumers want in this area that tourra data is invaluable
to things like an AI program. And you can look
to Reddit, who monetize and leverage their AI content quite successfully.
They're at ces and they've gone revenue growth. I would
(16:55):
look at someone where it's radio saying well, what can
we do with our data to maybe actually lean forward
and be engaging with technology rather than AI coming at.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Us and feeling like we're reacting all the time.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
So over the years, the show is really deeply immersed
in the automotive business and specifically even the connected car
when we talk about radio or entertainment, and now, of
course with EV being an important development over the years,
(17:29):
you add that in what can we expect at this
show to see in terms of automotive innovation?
Speaker 1 (17:36):
Yeah, of course, Well, I think you're correct. We lean
into it.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
Arguably, we're the largest mobility show, and I use mobility
very intentionally because it's all it's more than just the auto,
and I think that there's four pathways where you'll see
mobility change. The electric story is still massive, and we'll
see EV makers from across the world, not just the US,
but from Korea, from China, even showcasing where electric cars
(18:00):
are going. But I say electrification very intentionally because we'll
have companies like Brunswick they're showcasing electric boating technology. And
then there's a whole infrastructure component to it that's vitally
important because it's not just about how can we empower
our cars more efficiently, But when you start introducing new
charging technology from exhibitors at the show, like link charging
(18:21):
in LG, you're starting to really think how the.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
Grid is more sustainable.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
There's a sustainability story that's equally important that's occurring under here.
That's one path. The other two are very linked. This
is sensors and self driving. Essentially, how do you are
autonomous vehicles be more correct, actually you would want to
say autonous vehicles because sometimes boating technology, you're boating, you're
not driving or flying in some cases, because there will
(18:48):
be exhibits showcasing autonomous flying vehicles like Invo station. But
you think about it on autonomus vehicles and you think
about sensors, which is how do you get more information
onto your car itself? How does it become essentially a
software divide vehicle or a smart smart device on wheels,
And a lot of that is advanced safety data, more
(19:08):
data referring to just the health of the car in
general in terms of power output. But then there's also
an infotainment story, which is a lot more personalized audio,
a lot more personalized heads up displays, and immersive experiences
in there. That's the second and third pathways combined. The
last one is industrials, and I think that's something that
has really grown in our show over the years, which
(19:29):
is how do you take wattrification, autonomous capabilities, and others
and apply it outside the passenger themselves.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
And now our show, you'll see the show.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
You're seeing companies like Caboda, Oshkosh, Deer, Caterpillar, all these
what I call the big truck companies. The little kidd
of me is so excited walking across the floor. But
how are they making a lot of the industries I've
described that they work in are like mining or heavy industrials.
How do you make those safer and more sustainable? Well,
(19:58):
maybe you take some of the innovation that's occurring in
the automotive that we know and mobility in general and
apply it to your industry. And that's what's clearly happening
on the show.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
For this year. So in closing, as a futurist, do
you size up particular trends at each show that you
then start dissecting as the year progresses to see if
it's truly a trend or just a little bit of
a blip or a fad or a marketing plan or something.
(20:29):
How do you see the future and is there one
or two things that you're going to be sniffing around
for in particular at this year's show?
Speaker 2 (20:37):
Yeah, No, that's God, this is such a good question.
It's a bit of all of the above, right. Some
of it is I yeah, as a futurist that I
think people maybe evokes like I don't know, like Tony
Stark meets Crystal Ball, predictions of what's happening next. Oftentimes
it's a lot of reading, and it's a lot of
just looking and trying to get understan what the show
(21:00):
looks like. But then when you get to the show,
the beauty is as much as I can try to
predict a trend, I'll be surprised. I am surprised every
year by something on the floor. So what I do
is I go back and I do start to parse out.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
Well, what are we seeing?
Speaker 2 (21:12):
And I think one of the big ones is last
year going to the show, every company was like, we're
an AI company.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
We're an AI company.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
Genera of AI and chat GPT have taken off, and
they have, but how do you contextualize that into something larger?
And I think CEUs twenty twenty five and the years
ahead will really reframe AI where it's not just about
generative I it's about a fundamental evolution in terms of
how we relate to tech. There is an old phrase
(21:40):
and I used to do this consulting with the Coastcard,
called digital transformation. It's been around for sixteen years. How
do companies get on the cloud?
Speaker 1 (21:47):
How do they get cyber? How do they get AI?
Speaker 2 (21:49):
I don't think that's an up to date term anymore,
and I think CS is starting to be the proger
of this.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
I would say it's digital coexistence.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
Arguably, when we're doing recordings for a lot of I'm
sure with your podcast you're not just taking a walk
with people in person. You're using zoom, You're using all
these digital mediums. You are probably shopping online. Most people
are working online or in an office, or learning at
school or online. Arguably, our digital lives are getting to
(22:18):
the point where they're at parity with our physical lives.
So how do technologies like AI, cloud and cyber work
to create this sort of ecosystem. That's the first big
one that I'm seeing shape up. I was seeing shape
up ahead of the show, during the show and except
after the other one is how is sustainability changing? And
I think this is in relation to the AI component
(22:40):
as well. AI and data centers take a lot of power,
especially when you think about the emissions that come from
the data center and how much it takes to cool them.
Forty to sixty percent of cooling, AI, cloud, cybersecurity, all
that is coming from data centers that are pretty much
found in Dulles Corridor and DC and Virgil the area.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
They take a lot of power.
Speaker 2 (23:02):
And so how do you rethink sustainability to really focus
on what's called the energy transition? Human society has lived
through two already, and this is the other part about
a futurist. You have to know your history, you have
to know the past. And so the first one was
we went from firewood to coal as humanity. Then we
went from coal to oil and fossil fuels. We're on
the third one now, which is how do we get
(23:22):
from fossil fuels to renewables because we know that there's
emissions coming from fossil fuels and we know data centers
take a lot of them. So we're looking at and
we're seeing on the show for companies that are focusing
on renewables like solar and wind. We're seeing companies that
focus on that cooling issue. So HVAC innovation is more
important than ever, believe it or not. And what does
(23:44):
that mean? An energy transition? And I wouldn't be surprised.
In the year to come, we're already seeing announcements of it.
Nuclear is going to be forefront of a lot of
conversations of how does that which is a high energy
density technology that has zero emissions get involved in this transition.
So those are the two that I'm watching close to
this idea digital coexistence and energy transition. And at the
(24:06):
end of the day, why are they important? Why am
I spending a lot of time talking about them? They're
all interconnected through a variety of technologies. Technologies oftentimes are
not innovating in a vacuum. They're not just breaking through
in one way or the other. As we've talked today,
we've talked about how AI relates the music, how music
relates to data, and we're doing this now between energy
(24:27):
digital coexistence. That's what I look for in parts through,
which is where are these overall narratives in the stories.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
Oh, Brian did a great job making very complex issues digestible.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
For all this. Always excited to be at the big show,
the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas, and thanks for
being on taking a walk.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
Thank you so much, Buzz, it was an absolute pleasure.
Thanks for listening to this episode of the Taking a
Walk podcast.
Speaker 3 (24:58):
Share this and other episodes with you friends, and follow
us so you never miss an episode. Taking a Walk
is available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, and wherever
you get your podcasts.
Host
Lynn Hoffman
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