432 - Here's My Personality

This week, Georgia covers the murder of Arnold Schuster and Karen covers the deaths of Morris Blankenbaker and Glynn "Gabby" Moore.

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See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:16):
He and welcome my favorite murder. That's Georgia Hartstar, that's
Karen Kilgaratt. And this uncanny presence that you feel in
your head and ears right now is us being together
in this studio.

Speaker 2 (00:32):
That's right, We're in a studio. We're together. All these
things are all brand new.

Speaker 1 (00:37):
Can you handle it?

Speaker 3 (00:38):
It's so creepy for me at least?

Speaker 1 (00:40):
Is it?

Speaker 3 (00:40):
It's weird?

Speaker 1 (00:41):
Right, talk about your feelings, just say stuff off the top.

Speaker 3 (00:43):
I don't know, it's just like feels very official.

Speaker 2 (00:45):
It doesn't feel chill, and I don't put you have
a pants on, Like we're sitting across from each other
at a table.

Speaker 1 (00:51):
Yeah. I think this is what I believe to be
walnut stained soundproofing behind us is also because this is
what all of the podcasters have in their background. Yeah,
oh yeah, it's like we've finally come into the realm
of real podcasters. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:07):
I don't know, it's been so long, like maybe there
were a couple episodes where we were together at one
of our houses, but other than that, like through the pandemic,
we have not been together. And I've just gotten used
to like feeling like no one is watching me because
no one was watching me yep, and now people.

Speaker 1 (01:23):
Are watching I can't take my eyes off you. I'm
staring right down the barrel here. Thank you, thank you.
That's not a compliment, but thank you.

Speaker 3 (01:33):
Don't you hate that with someone's like, oh my god,
your hair and you go thank you, thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
Or not. That's how you take reality and you mold
it to what you need it to be. No, you're like,
oh are you parking here? Thank you? I am.

Speaker 2 (01:50):
What's so weird is having a control room full of
people and Steven's mustache isn't one of them.

Speaker 1 (01:56):
You know what? We might have to reach out to
Stephen and say, great, live your life, get your life.
Could you please shave off your mustage and send it
to us so we can put it up on the wall.
What have we kind of frame portrait of Stephen for
the Yeah, that would be amazing. And he's like and
we make him do it like a it's like an

(02:17):
oil portrait, like he is the president of a bank,
but it's Stephen just kind of touching dials.

Speaker 3 (02:24):
Yeah. I love it and his mustache.

Speaker 1 (02:26):
We missed you, Stephens. You I actually did bring in
a piece of I wouldn't call it true crime. News.
It's more. Sometimes I walk by the old dilapidated haunted
house that is Twitter that I guess they're calling X
that they shouldn't at all, and I just see if

(02:47):
anybody has anything to tell me I was mad about
or needs to correct me.

Speaker 3 (02:51):
You just want to, like, what's the state of the world,
my world right now?

Speaker 1 (02:55):
Anything could be happening anywhere, and I'm certainly not checking.
So I go on there just to like just in case.
And thank god I did this time because there was
a person on Twitter whose name is Andrew Patti.

Speaker 3 (03:11):
Okay, that's a guest.

Speaker 1 (03:13):
Or Pettie or there's you know, probably four other pronunciations
that I could make up. But Andrew tagged me in
this post. And the original post is by someone whose
handle is Cliff ofth Underline Vermont or VT, and they say,
I'd like to inform you the people are stuff in

(03:33):
cash between the Mothman's statues. Ass crack again. So the
Mothman statue, which we've been sent pictures of and you've
seen that, right, that's that silver statue.

Speaker 2 (03:45):
Yeah, based on the Mothman story you covered a million
episodes ago.

Speaker 1 (03:48):
Yes, And I actually like to tell myself they poured
that statue after I told that story. But did we
ever maybe we talked about that the Mothman statue has
cakes for days, and so this is why people are
stuffing cash as look at it like that's what they
want it.

Speaker 2 (04:06):
Why does the Mothman have an a an as b
a crack in it? See a crack large enough to
literally stuff dollar dollar bells into.

Speaker 1 (04:17):
I mean that Mothman. I don't know. I think first
of all, there's a quarter that's very poorly placed in there.
It looks like incredibly rated X.

Speaker 3 (04:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (04:29):
I just thought it was kind of a nice update
for like what's going on in the world, because it
feels like, you know, the Mothman really scared people. The
Mothman foretold of a horrible tragedy on that bridge. Now
the Mothman's being celebrated, now the Mothman's being objectified. It's
good to like laugh at your fears, you know what

(04:50):
I mean, and to like make light and makes it
feel less scary, you know, and then maybe tell your
fears that they're a slot.

Speaker 2 (04:57):
Right, But what if your fear is getting money stuck
in your ass crack and then you're.

Speaker 1 (05:02):
Totally fucked with this situation because there's easily seven dollars
and twenty five cents stuck into the mothman's ass crack.
Do you know there's this.

Speaker 2 (05:09):
Like phenomenon that on like on the web, on Reddit
on curly pasta.

Speaker 3 (05:14):
That's not it scary pasta.

Speaker 1 (05:17):
You're thinking of lunchtime, actually thinking of food, where people
are like, there's this phenomena like getting in the shower,
ghosts must do this because suddenly quarters like get thrown
over at the shower, like onto you.

Speaker 2 (05:28):
Like, that's like a thing that ghosts do is throw
quarters at you or change at you in the shower. Yeah,
except when you lay down and you're sleeping and sweaty
on the couch and all your chain is falling out
of your pocket, it gets stuck to your back and
you get in the shower and it starts coming off
and people are like they think that like ghosts throw
quarters at you.

Speaker 1 (05:47):
Or Jesus, why didn't they go religious with it and
be liked, God gave me seventy five cents for cleaning myself. Really, well,
that is so funny.

Speaker 3 (05:57):
Yeah, it's not.

Speaker 2 (05:58):
There's nobody throwing quarters at you. Wish there was, but
there's not you're sweaty.

Speaker 1 (06:02):
It's too bad that there can't be And this maybe
is what the afterlife is is a book of explanations
of crazy shit that's like actually the most mundane thing
where it's like no, no, you were sleeping in your
own sweat and.

Speaker 2 (06:16):
A handful of change, right, or like, no, you didn't
see a ghost. Actually that like you were being poisoned
a little bit by the gas.

Speaker 1 (06:24):
Yes, you and your family were a group hallucinating that
old lady in the sweater. Oh my god. Yeah. Well
that's kind of how ghost hunters started, where they were
plumbers and they kept going to check the pipes. No way, yeah,
because people would be like, there's a ghost in the basement,
and they'd be like, no, this whole thing is and
then they bring them all down. But then there were
times where they couldn't explain it.

Speaker 2 (06:46):
We're in the ghostly stuff. We like hearing about it.
We're not hardcore believers. Do you think anything paranormal has
actually happened before?

Speaker 1 (06:55):
Can you give me the beginning of that question again?

Speaker 2 (06:58):
Do you think oh JK, like being on the fence
about do Goost exists or not? Does paranormal stuff happen
or not, Like, definitively would you you'd say.

Speaker 1 (07:18):
Yes, only because we could have defined it as like
a floating sheet, right, that's like, oh, it's very specific
how we've told each other what it actually is or
what it means. Meanwhile, like there's things happening in the
ocean that no one knows or could explain, so like

(07:38):
we don't actually fucking know anything.

Speaker 2 (07:40):
Okay, you heard it here first, the ocean is haunted
Karen gilgerretf coming in hot.

Speaker 1 (07:46):
Well, here's my hot take. Ghosts are caused by salts,
and where's the most salt the oce? Show?

Speaker 3 (07:53):
My god?

Speaker 4 (07:54):
Hi?

Speaker 1 (07:54):
Yeah, hot take? Girls, summer get ready for me?

Speaker 2 (07:59):
Yeah, my summer's just going to be hot takes of
me making shit up.

Speaker 1 (08:02):
I mean, let's go back to the pre internet times
where you could just make shit up and no one
would ever know.

Speaker 3 (08:07):
I missed that, and I want it to be real.

Speaker 1 (08:09):
I used to be so smart, so sad it's those
times are over.

Speaker 3 (08:14):
Now, Let's see what else have you got?

Speaker 1 (08:17):
What else is there?

Speaker 2 (08:18):
I watched the movie Shampoo for the first time in
my life, and I figure, I thought you'd make that face.
I thought you'd make that shocked. What the fuck face?

Speaker 1 (08:26):
But how did you feel about it? I loved it.
I couldn't believe I'd never seen it. Vince and I
both were like, that's weird. Somehow we missed that, and
I think I I think I was like, no, no, I've
seen that before. I've seen Hairspray. It's I thought it
was a hairspray. I didn't realize there was another movie
called Chip who were called Hairspray. I've seen saw what
sharp instrument movie? Yeah? What did you? But so what

(08:48):
did you like about?

Speaker 2 (08:49):
Okay Warren Baby, He's this like juggle Juggalo, the Juggalo
barber Jingalo barber.

Speaker 3 (08:58):
Around town La, which I love the scenes from La
seventies La.

Speaker 2 (09:03):
It's like kind of gross, the sexual revolutions going on.
You know what's her face?

Speaker 3 (09:08):
Is the cutest thing on the planet, Julie CHRISTI no,
the other cutest thing on the Goldiehan. Goldiehan is like,
are you kidding me? How is that a real person?

Speaker 1 (09:16):
Right?

Speaker 3 (09:17):
It was scandalous. Yeah, I liked it, but I liked it.

Speaker 1 (09:20):
It was like nothing is going on.

Speaker 2 (09:22):
We're ben cierboth like, nothing is happening, There's no point
of this movie.

Speaker 1 (09:25):
There's no plot, but I can't stop watching it. That's
they used to be able to make movies like that.
So that's hal Ashby, if I'm not mistaken. Hal Ashby
is a director who did Harold and maud Oh and
many other incredible films that you kind of go wait,
I was just transported somewhere.

Speaker 3 (09:42):
Yeah, and it.

Speaker 2 (09:43):
Wrapped up without a good ending, like without a solid
It didn't make me feel good in the end at all.

Speaker 1 (09:49):
Yeah, because look around this dirty town. Yeah, like this
is the way it is here, like all those kind
of like I love the way he just lies. He's
lying to Goldiehan the entire fucking time as he's falling
in love with Julie Christy spoiler alert. It's just but
it's visually like when he gives her that haircut, Oh

(10:11):
my god, that bob, the largest bob that's ever happened.
It's like up and out of her head. Yeah, it's
one of my favors. Like when the first time I
saw it, I was like, all these visuals are feeding me.

Speaker 3 (10:22):
It was great.

Speaker 2 (10:22):
Yeah, it was a very like, oh, let's throw this on.
Maybe it won't be good. I can't stop watching this wait,
it's over.

Speaker 1 (10:29):
That's the ending. So yeah, yeah shampoo. Everyone like, yeah, like,
why did you get me involved if you weren't going
to give me anything? And then directors of the seventies say, ah,
that's what you get. That's how life is, or whatever
I write. There's always a lesson, always a lesson. That's
a good one. What's a I want to see Furiosa
in the theater very badly, but I haven't done it yet.

Speaker 3 (10:51):
Okay, I'll see it at home.

Speaker 1 (10:53):
You'll go ahead and stay home for that. I'll stay
home for most for almost everything. But do you remember
that we saw the last Mad Max in the theater together? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (11:02):
It was so loud, I remember.

Speaker 1 (11:04):
That, hilariously loud, and it was like everyone was on meth.
So it was fast and really disturbing, and it was
one of the first like social things we did, oh
like as friends. So you I think weren't comfortable telling
me I don't like going to the movie. I don't
like going to the movies.

Speaker 2 (11:22):
I didn't think I had to bring ear blows, which
is like that's such a dorky thing to do, you know,
like like pull all earplugs in the.

Speaker 1 (11:29):
Middle of it, especially that one where it was like
knives in your ear totally.

Speaker 2 (11:32):
It's like, well, why did you come to this if
you didn't want you know, full on stabbing in your
ear drums.

Speaker 1 (11:38):
In the cinerama though, Yeah, surround sound and that was
two hundred years ago. Well all right, well from that time,
furiosas arrived, which means we are back recording in the
same room.

Speaker 2 (11:54):
Yeah, it's really nice. It's been a what's it called
a decade? No, I'm doing a circle with my fingers.
I was just like, that's supposed to full circle, full circle.
I couldn't come up with as I was circling my fingers.

Speaker 1 (12:09):
Right because you were thinking about not thinking, not able
to say it right.

Speaker 2 (12:12):
And I'm drinking a can of wine. I brought one
can of wine to drink for this entire.

Speaker 1 (12:17):
Slam it shot on it right now. No, did you
put that in your purse? Like I'm going to take
this and I'm going to bring this with me.

Speaker 3 (12:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (12:26):
Actually no, it's more embarrassing than that. Oh okay, Vince,
you stopped at the liquor store. No worse, Vince got
it for me. I was like, I want one can
of wine, like just for the episode. I don't want more,
I'll drink it, so he got it from me.

Speaker 3 (12:39):
It was warm.

Speaker 2 (12:40):
He got a little cooler, filled it with ice for
the one can, and I drove over here and.

Speaker 3 (12:46):
It was cold by the time I got here.

Speaker 1 (12:48):
And you're still divorcing him. It doesn't make sense. You
imagine someone who doesn't make so thoughtful.

Speaker 2 (12:54):
I was like, I could just put ice in a
cup and pour it, and he's like, no, no, you're
doing this, no watch this. He's the fucking you know
what he got me for my birthday this past weekend.

Speaker 1 (13:04):
What, by the way, can we all stop? Happy birthday,
Georgia Hartsto.

Speaker 3 (13:07):
I feel so old. Thank you.

Speaker 2 (13:10):
There's this company called silver Lake Socialite that does these
incredible like cheeseboards. They're like if you've seen the Grammys
and they have those cheeseboards on all of them.

Speaker 3 (13:18):
She did them all.

Speaker 1 (13:19):
Wait, sorry, do they feature cheeseboards on the Grammy? You
know what they were like on the tables this year?
Oh really?

Speaker 3 (13:26):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (13:26):
They're like nice. Like jay Z was like, this is nice.
So she now does eight fucking caviar board. Oh shit,
you know, so he got me that for my birthday.
And I got was like, I got you this for
your birthday. Told it to me when I'm like, cool,
I'm an invite all my girlfriend's over to have it.
And I was like, wait a minute, you might want
to have done that with me. That's maybe why you
got it.

Speaker 1 (13:47):
Was he like forget it? Yeah? Essential, I mean, how
much caviar can you eat?

Speaker 2 (13:52):
It's just a little thing of caviar and then it's
a bunch of little things that you would eat with
it all over the place.

Speaker 1 (13:56):
Oh good, because I thought the whole thing was care
like cheese on a sharcutery board and that entire thing out.

Speaker 3 (14:03):
It's boring.

Speaker 1 (14:04):
No, was it's a that's a good gift. Okay, let's
do a couple more gift suggestions. Caviar is a good gift.
That sounds so bougie though it's pretty boogie. But that's
what makes it like it's a special occasion. Yeah, because
would you get that normally?

Speaker 4 (14:20):
No?

Speaker 3 (14:20):
Absolutely not caviar.

Speaker 1 (14:21):
Remember we went we went to a caviar restaurant in
Beverly Hills one time, not Beverly Hills, like by the
Beverly Center.

Speaker 3 (14:29):
Yeah, you don't eat caviar.

Speaker 1 (14:31):
Why did we do that because we were trying to
be like, we were trying to celebrate.

Speaker 3 (14:35):
Oh, that's right, we had just yeah, I remember where
I had been, that's right.

Speaker 1 (14:39):
Mm hmm. So it was like, let's be fancy with
these Russians.

Speaker 2 (14:42):
And then it was the most I was like, this
is too expensive and ordered like an egg.

Speaker 1 (14:45):
It was so expensive and so like, its not like
we went to someone's controlling grandma's house. I was kind
of scared the whole time. They knew we weren't supposed
to be there. They could tell yeah, they saw that
the hay in our hair.

Speaker 2 (14:58):
They're like, if you just had to ask at the
market prices, then you don't. You can't afford the market price.

Speaker 1 (15:03):
Well, you know what, we should call them right now
and say, guess what. We're about to tell our listeners
what's going on on our podcast network. So I guess, yeah,
I guess we win whose market price is highest? Now? Bitch? Hey,
who wins the caviat wars? Now got wars? What?

Speaker 2 (15:19):
Okay, we have a podcast network. We're sitting in the
podcast network studio right now, that's right. Should we tell
everyone about a couple things about the podcast network?

Speaker 3 (15:27):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (15:28):
Over on I saw what you did. Milli and Danielle
are back with a double future of Oh there Will
be Blood from two thousand and seven and Georgia's Halloween
costume from two years ago or was it three? The
Royal ten and bombs from two thousand and one?

Speaker 3 (15:44):
Hell yeah?

Speaker 2 (15:45):
And then also Kate Winkler Dawson and Paul Holes cover
a brutal historical murder on Buried Bones. They discussed the
Purrington family murders from eighteen o six in Augusta, Maine, and.

Speaker 1 (15:58):
Then over on I Said No Gifts. This week, Bridger's
guest is actor er fight Master from Schwill and from
Gray's Academy.

Speaker 4 (16:05):
Nope, I was literally like five sentences in that direction,
like I had stopped.

Speaker 1 (16:17):
Looking at the people. Leave that. I have to leave
that in.

Speaker 3 (16:20):
I'm so sorry, please for they were not in Gray's
Academy for real.

Speaker 1 (16:26):
R fight Master, I sincerely apologize. You were actually in
Gray's Anatomy. That's what really happened. It's Crazy Academy Academy.
That's my new TV, new TV show.

Speaker 2 (16:36):
It's a spin off or like, yeah, they're going to
school to become doctors, bad doctors.

Speaker 1 (16:41):
Before they became doctors they had to go to school.

Speaker 3 (16:44):
Frequill prequill like Mike Quill prequill.

Speaker 1 (16:47):
It's a PI. And then hot Dog Summer continues.

Speaker 3 (16:50):
The MFM Merch store now has s SDGM hot Dog
coozies for all your summer beverages. I wish I had
one right now, and we need to get some of
the office. Yeah, we do, and both of the T
shirt styles of the hot Dog have been re stocked.
I have one at home. I just wore it the
other day. I mean, it's a hit shirt. It is,
I believe.

Speaker 1 (17:08):
Aaron Brown, who runs our merch department, said it's one
of our best selling shirts.

Speaker 3 (17:12):
Amazing. So visit exactly rightstore dot com for all that
another merch.

Speaker 1 (17:17):
Do you like hot dogs? I wonder, Yeah, prove it
by wearing a shirt with a hot dog on it.
It's the only way we'll know. Well, I think you're
first this week, right, I'm first?

Speaker 3 (17:33):
Yes, here we go.

Speaker 1 (17:35):
Are you ready to do it in person? I don't
know if I can do this. Can you tell me
a story in person?

Speaker 3 (17:40):
I can try. It might be messy, okay, chaotic?

Speaker 1 (17:43):
Oops it is? Oh I already she broke the microphone.

Speaker 4 (17:48):
I know.

Speaker 1 (17:49):
Alejandro she broke it. It's broken, and everyone's staring at you,
eyes away from me. There, stop turning to the side.
Everything's fine. We had a sound guy that used to
get so mad because anytime anyone goes at an award
show goes up to speak in the microphone, when it's

(18:09):
those ones that are kind of set there, the skinny
like long ones, yesh, people always go up and just
start moving it away. They want to touch it. Yes,
And our sound guy used to always be like, those
are set perfectly for anyone of any height. You do
not have to move. What is that need? And want
to move the micross like here, hold on a second,

(18:30):
I'll do it. I know better here. And it's also
this is more comfortable for me, which is like great,
now you fucked the sound up.

Speaker 2 (18:36):
Yeah, well, and that's why that's why we're talent, and
that's why we're talent with a capital T. Listen, this
has it all great. There's a mob connection in it.
I know you love that. My favorite The story is
from the nineteen fifties and it's one of New York's
most notorious unsolved mysteries that I hadn't heard of before.
It starts with an affable bank robber, and it ends

(18:59):
with a possible mob hit.

Speaker 1 (19:01):
Perfection, My perfect night.

Speaker 2 (19:04):
The main sources I used for this story were articles
from the New York Times, Oh, the Number One, the
and the Daily News, and the rest can be found
in our show notes. Okay, our story begins with a
bank robber named Willie Sutton. Like classic, he sounds familiar, Yeah,
yeah right. Willie is born in Brooklyn in nineteen oh one.

(19:25):
He starts robbing banks in the twenties. He's known as
the Gentleman bank robber.

Speaker 1 (19:30):
Finally, I know because.

Speaker 2 (19:31):
He's so polite, he said to avoid hurting people during
his robberies, and one witness to one of his robberies
says it was like being at the movies, except the
usher was holding a gun. Like right this way, ma'am,
come to your seat.

Speaker 1 (19:48):
So a hand on the small of your back, a nice,
like confident hand on the side on the smaller back.
Just here, we're going this way. Yeah. But then also
just a light poke in the rio.

Speaker 3 (19:58):
Yeah, the hand is a gun. Is actually a gun.

Speaker 1 (20:00):
Hand is a gun. And then the poke in the
rib is the snickers that you got at the kid sessions.

Speaker 2 (20:06):
Yeah, he's going to be a pretty affable guy, and
whenever he does get caught, he's a good sport about it.

Speaker 1 (20:11):
Ah, you got me, you guy, You guys got me,
good one on, good on you. Kind of a thing.
You know. If that's the only thing that make America
great again, meant I would be like, I agree too.
I wish the affability factor was more at play these days. Sure,
and the gentlemanly, kindly violent crime.

Speaker 3 (20:32):
Yeah, with less guns.

Speaker 1 (20:33):
Yeah yeah.

Speaker 3 (20:34):
Maybe.

Speaker 2 (20:36):
Willie's nickname, his bank robber nickname, is the actor because
he and his crew used costumes. It's not a great
name really, honestly, I don't know who made it up.
But they use costumes, so they dress up as a
postal worker, police officer, messengers, or maintenance workers. So someone
came up with the actor, Like, you could have done
better than that.

Speaker 1 (20:53):
Yeah, what about the costumer?

Speaker 3 (20:54):
Yeah right?

Speaker 1 (20:56):
What about that guy I didn't expect to rob me? Right? Right?
That's too long.

Speaker 2 (21:01):
Yeah, But when he's off the clock, Willy is known
for his impeccable style, So he dresses like that when
he's robbing banks, but when he's off the clock, he's like,
fucking suit it up.

Speaker 1 (21:11):
Looks so good. Tails tops.

Speaker 2 (21:13):
Yeah, and he's known for his love of expensive clothes.

Speaker 3 (21:17):
I mean, who wouldn't be.

Speaker 1 (21:18):
So he has to rub banks so he can have
a wonderful words.

Speaker 3 (21:21):
Sure love it.

Speaker 2 (21:22):
In nineteen thirty one, Willy is caught and sentenced to
thirty years in prison, but he escapes a year and
a half later. He had somehow, he had somehow walking
around the yard at the fucking prison found two ladders.
He had happened upon two ladders, as you do in prison.

Speaker 1 (21:41):
He's the only one that found them.

Speaker 2 (21:43):
He took one stack the other one on top, and
clumb out of the fucking prison, just like bugs Bunny
would over like legit bugs Bunny. And at that point
I'm like, okay, then he deserves then, like his sentences,
it's kind of on you, guys.

Speaker 1 (21:58):
He won that, He won that one. He won that one.

Speaker 3 (22:00):
Yeah, Georgia, really quick. Yeah, you said clumb.

Speaker 1 (22:03):
I know that's a joke. That's comedy. Oh, I know
what I said. Leave that in't do it? Okay.

Speaker 2 (22:12):
He's caught again in nineteen thirty four. In nineteen forty one,
he attempts an escape by making an incredibly realistic plastic
sculpture of his head and his hand, and so he
took real hair from the prison barber shop. He like
put it on the head and maybe the hands, I
don't know how harry he was, and he.

Speaker 1 (22:30):
Touched it and every little hair on the finger is
perfectly glued on, right, and they're like, oh, it's human.

Speaker 2 (22:34):
He's sleeping, and then like tucked it into bed so
it looked like he was sleeping and his hand like
his hand was there too.

Speaker 1 (22:39):
Like a little baby hand under his cheek.

Speaker 2 (22:41):
Yeah, it's like a perfect cartoon of like this snoring
per you know. And that attempt is foiled because it's
just so happens that that same night, some other prisoners
were attempting an escape. So they're like locked down and
he's like fuck, But in nineteen forty five he successfully
tunnels his way out this time. That time he's caught
just one day later. Two years after that, February tenth,

(23:04):
nineteen forty seven, and Willy is in the Philadelphia County
prison and one night he and two other prisoners dresses
prison guards. Where did you find this fucking outfit?

Speaker 3 (23:12):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (23:12):
They keep finding shit over the years. It's like they
get they find a belt here, and like part of
this shirt here, maybe even multiples of those they have
at that prison. They have a litter problem because people
are throwing things away. Haggeldy bageldy.

Speaker 3 (23:28):
Oh man, you hate to see it.

Speaker 2 (23:30):
They dress his prison guards and they carry two ladders
across the prison yard. Again they found two ladders and
this is for real. Yes, at one point the prison
searchlights fucking find them, beame down on them in their
prison uniforms and ladders.

Speaker 1 (23:44):
Don't touch me, and Willly just yells out, it's okay.
That's what he yells out.

Speaker 3 (23:49):
And guess what it is okay, And it turns out
it is okay.

Speaker 1 (23:52):
It's okay. Everyone's like, sounds good. You just keep it
up and sounds good.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
You know how prison guards like to take a life
to the wall and scale them.

Speaker 3 (24:02):
We got it, took it cool.

Speaker 2 (24:05):
Then they hijack a milk truck and scudadl and he's
on the lamb for the next three years. So this
one works. I want to tell you really quickly. As
an aside, this is apropos of episode four thirty about
Richard Dad, the artist that you covered. Someone brought the
head and hand sculptures onto Antiques road show.

Speaker 1 (24:27):
Oh my godd had the.

Speaker 2 (24:29):
Like barbershop head in hand, I'm gonna sneak out, Oh
my god, and they brought him to the Antiques road
show at the time. In twenty seventeen, their value to
be worth between.

Speaker 1 (24:39):
You want to guess twenty seven thousand dollars.

Speaker 2 (24:42):
No, it's one of those like, oh my god. But
then it's like it's five hundred. No, it's better than that.
It's it's worth in twenty seventeen between twenty five hundred
and thirty five hundred too low, which.

Speaker 1 (24:53):
Is crazy, Like I want to I should watch this.
How did they get them? I bet their grandpa was
a warden, that's right. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (25:00):
And in twenty twenty one, their value to be worth
now their value to be worth ten thousand to twelve thousand.

Speaker 1 (25:06):
That's more like that. It's yeah. Also what a weird
like will you buy that and put it on your mantle? Yeah?
Or your guest room display, your guest bedroom. It's always
in the guest bedroom.

Speaker 3 (25:18):
Yeah, I believe it.

Speaker 1 (25:20):
You always have guests.

Speaker 2 (25:21):
Willie Sutton is one of those criminals who's pretty much
a household name at this point, so like people love
him because of his reputation for being a nice guy.
He's also kind of a folk hero, and so during
his time on the run at the New York City
Saint Patrick's Day parades, some kids possibly spot him. They
get so excited that they lead the crowd and chanting

(25:41):
his name, which is like, you're fucking harshy, my mellow bro, Like,
if you like him that much, you don't yell his
name and point him out. Yeah, you know, cop, It's
kind of it's kind of like narky.

Speaker 1 (25:52):
Well, but they're that excited that it's like, yes, like
a star is there.

Speaker 2 (25:57):
And so he isn't caught. I don't know if it's
definitely him or not, but that happensn't it, And he's
not caught.

Speaker 1 (26:02):
He pulls a the a Richard. I won't be able
to make the reference, Dad, No, it's just like he's
he's in a parade, and then he ditches them, which
is a Richard thing from the movie The Thing. Forget it.
I don't know. I don't either.

Speaker 3 (26:20):
I want it, shampoo, No, I want to help you.

Speaker 1 (26:24):
I can't. Okay, I'm going to keep on thinking about it, Okay,
igure it out.

Speaker 3 (26:27):
So then in March of nineteen fifty.

Speaker 1 (26:29):
Fugitive, never seen it. That's why I couldn't help you.
I know, I don't know what's wrong with me.

Speaker 3 (26:38):
I know, I know, I know, I know.

Speaker 1 (26:40):
I will please. Will you do?

Speaker 3 (26:41):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (26:42):
You won't regret it? You won't, Okay, it's a I
won't regret it, spending it two hours.

Speaker 1 (26:48):
Jim discern don't you like Tommy Lee Jones? Haven't you
succorded tom? But I don't know how.

Speaker 2 (26:53):
I haven't seen it. I know exactly what we were
talking about. And I bet my dad put it on
and I would leave the fucking room because it looks
so boring.

Speaker 1 (27:00):
It's perfection. It's the opposite of boring.

Speaker 3 (27:02):
Okay, okay, just a dad movie, though you know, no,
I don't know that.

Speaker 1 (27:07):
It starts with a horrifying murder.

Speaker 3 (27:09):
Oh no, okay, I'm there, I'm there, Okay, okay.

Speaker 2 (27:14):
Then in March nineteen fifty, the FBI comes up with
its first ever most Wanted list, and Willy is honest,
Oh yeah, big time. There's just been a bank robbery
in Queen's and the robbers were exceedingly polite, but they
left him when in sixty seven thousand dollars, which in
today's money would be eight hundred thousand, seven hundred and

(27:35):
forty thousand.

Speaker 3 (27:35):
Oh I was close, Yeah you were. The agents are like,
this has to be Willie. I bet this is him.

Speaker 2 (27:42):
They do this thing which is really smart. They circulate
his picture like his most wanted picture in tailor shops
because he's well known for his love of expensive clothing.
Yeah smart, Yeah, So like that's where he'll be. Do
you recognize this man's inseem right? Still got it back.

Speaker 1 (28:01):
In the studio.

Speaker 2 (28:03):
So on February eighteenth, nineteen fifty two, Willie Sutton has
been on the run for two years. He's still Robin Banks.
He starts to feel kind of comfortable, probably because he
has ridden under the flown under, been under the radar
for so long. So he feels comfortable with taking a
New York City subway in broad daylight.

Speaker 3 (28:21):
He's just living his life.

Speaker 2 (28:22):
He gets on a train at Union Square in Manhattan
and rides a couple of stops into Brooklyn.

Speaker 3 (28:27):
And this will be a fatal.

Speaker 1 (28:29):
Error, not for Willy, but for the man who recognizes him. Oh.
Pause for water, pause for dramatic effect. First of all,
I kind of love how this story is. I thought
it was going to be different. It's not, it's not
at all. It's good.

Speaker 2 (28:46):
It's one thing, it's another. So at the stop before Willie's,
a young man named Arnold Schuster gets on the train.
He's a pretty typical, normal twenty four year old guy.
He lives in Borough Park in Brooklyn. And Arnold's father
is a tailor remember that, remember that, Yes, I do,
and clothing salesman, and Arnold works in his shop.

Speaker 3 (29:09):
What guess what he saw when he was there?

Speaker 1 (29:11):
The Willie the flyer, Oh will No, the most wanted flyer.
Just the face.

Speaker 2 (29:18):
Yeah, he's like that, you know, because that's where they
put them.

Speaker 1 (29:21):
Oh my god.

Speaker 2 (29:22):
Arnold is also a huge fan of Detective magazine, and
so he reads every story about gangsters that he can find.
So when he gets on the subway in downtown Brooklyn
and sees a sharply dressed man on a train, he
does a double take.

Speaker 1 (29:34):
He what he does is he shits a brick. You'd
love it. It would just be like.

Speaker 3 (29:42):
Yes, yeah.

Speaker 2 (29:43):
The man that we now know is Willy, notices Arnold
looking at him, he ducks his head. Arnold is pretty
sure this is Willy Sutton. Willy's like fuck, he can like,
tell by the way that brick just got shit. And
so he gets off the train and starts walking, and Arnold,
without even thinking it, starts to follow him.

Speaker 1 (30:01):
It would be hard not to.

Speaker 2 (30:02):
Yeah, so he's tailing him. Willy gets into a car,
but the car won't start, and Arnold watches as he
goes across the street to a gas station and comes
out with a car battery and starts working on the car.

Speaker 3 (30:12):
So maybe he didn't know he was actually being followed.

Speaker 1 (30:15):
Right, So there's nothing you could do about it either way, right, right?
I mean you could run and leave your card. Sorry
did it say how old this kid was that was
following twenty four? Oh? Yeah, he's a youngon.

Speaker 2 (30:27):
So Arnold is like doo doo dooo, keeps walking. He's like, sure,
this is really Sutton. Once he's around the block, he
flags down two police officers and he says, quote, You'll
probably think I'm crazy, but I just saw Willy Sutton.
The cops think this will probably be a wild goose chase.
They're like whatever, but they go.

Speaker 1 (30:44):
To the guy working on the car on the next
block and say, quote, are you Willy Sutton?

Speaker 3 (30:50):
End quote?

Speaker 2 (30:51):
Not surprisingly, Willy the bank Robert known as the Actor,
says he isn't and then his name is Gordon, have
a nice day. He shows them his car registration it's
under the name Charles Gordon.

Speaker 1 (31:02):
And then he shows them a collection of different hats
see see Captain Bowler.

Speaker 2 (31:09):
And so the two beat cops are like, great, that's
enough for us, and keep moving. Yep, they're not going
to stay later or doing paperwork, that's right, you know.

Speaker 1 (31:16):
Well, and also if it is that name on the face,
then it's just like, yeah, we're bothering a guy.

Speaker 2 (31:21):
Yeah, And like there's no other way in the fifties
to like look up someone's identity, right.

Speaker 1 (31:26):
No, I think you had to. It would have had
to have been passed down in your family. They've known
what that person's name was.

Speaker 3 (31:32):
Right, So they go back to the station.

Speaker 2 (31:35):
Arnold, the twenty four year old, watches all of this
from a distance, and when he sees the police leave, he.

Speaker 3 (31:40):
Goes home disappointed. He was like, sure, I was sure
I had this.

Speaker 1 (31:43):
Those two police officers, when they go back to the station,
tell the story to their boss, a detective, who decides
to go follow up himself. He's like, these two guys
aren't very bright, let me just do this on my own.
So he does go back and finds the man still
working on his car. You think he would have left
left after that. He was posted up really trying. He
was like in the Kragan parking lot, really trying.

Speaker 3 (32:05):
To get his He really was.

Speaker 2 (32:07):
And he's like, hey, dude, sorry to bug you, but
can you come back to the station and go over
like who you really are? I need to check and
make sure you're who you really are. So Willy obliges
and at the station he you know, he's affable. Doesn't
take long before he gives up and he says, okay, fellas,
I'm really Sutton, like he's not wasting anyone's time.

Speaker 3 (32:28):
He could have outsmarted them and gotten out of it.

Speaker 1 (32:31):
He also could have like made three different decisions and
gotten away from the totally broken down car. Yeah, weird,
like he kind of wanted to get caught. He's wrapping
it up.

Speaker 3 (32:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (32:41):
So that night at home in Borough Park Arnold, our
guy from the train, here's on the radio that the
famous bank robber Willie Sutton has been apprehended in Brooklyn.
It turns out that for almost three years, Willy had
been living near where He was arrested in a small
apartment on Dean Street, just three blocks from the police precinct.

Speaker 1 (33:01):
Anything is possible in New York City.

Speaker 3 (33:03):
Sure, that's true.

Speaker 1 (33:04):
The killer could be right around the corner. Shit.

Speaker 2 (33:07):
Arnold listens as the two officers that he had pointed out,
fucking Willy Sutton's right there, and they had been like
nope and left. They are mentioned by name and heartily
congratulated like they're the heroes of the day. The police commissioner,
a man named George Monaghan, is beside himself with excitement.
That night at a press conference, he hugs the two

(33:28):
police officers and the detective and gives them all promotions
right on the spot. Wow, and he says there's going
to be a ceremony at City Hall in their honor.

Speaker 1 (33:37):
I mean, Arnold must be furious.

Speaker 2 (33:41):
He was, And that's sets in motion some shit, Okay,
Arnold's a little upset. He wants credit for having recognized
Willy Sutton. And more importantly, in the detective magazines and
in articles about Willy Sutton, there's been a mention of
a reward for information leading to his arrest. Some articles
say it's worth the same seventy grand back then, whoa,

(34:02):
which in today's money, five grand, eight hundred and twenty eight. WHOA,
that's a fucking shit ton of money.

Speaker 1 (34:09):
It's so much money.

Speaker 3 (34:10):
Yeah, so he was like, what the fuck?

Speaker 1 (34:12):
You know?

Speaker 2 (34:13):
I want credit and I want money. So he calls
the police station asking about the reward. He can't get
anyone on the phone, shocking. So then he hires a
lawyer and goes wide with his story. He tells reporters
that he was the one who first noticed Willie, and
he gives his own press conference, telling reporters about how
he recognized really from the FBI flyer that had been
hanging in his father's shop. The police commissioner confirms that

(34:36):
that was you know, it was him who really started
this ball rolling, and so he cancels the celebration for
the police officers, but they still get.

Speaker 1 (34:44):
Their promotion, oh half measure. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (34:48):
So almost immediately after coming forward, Arnold starts getting threatening
letters in the mail because you know that they fucking
interviewed him and put his address down, Yeah, Arnold Schuster
of you know, oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (35:00):
Exactly how they do it, apartment Bright. But also he
turned in a guy who had connections. Yeah, then he
fucked over the cops, which is very bad at a
good point, you know, like it's as bad as fucking
over criminals. Yeah, yeah, who could it be? Right?

Speaker 2 (35:19):
The Shuster family gets a total of twelve letters and
so many threatening phone calls that they changed their phone
number because your another phone number was just in the
public as well, I'm According to some articles at the time,
the NYPD offers Arnold around the clock protection and he declines,
but they still check on the Shuster family home periodically.
The Shuster family will later deny that any protection was

(35:42):
ever offered.

Speaker 1 (35:43):
Also, why would you want protection from the people that
could potentially be the ones threatening? Right, it's wild.

Speaker 2 (35:49):
So in March eighth, nineteen fifty two, less than a
month after Arnold reported seeing Willie, Arnold takes the bus
home to Borrow Park in the evening. After he gets
off the bus Atrett nine, he starts to walk home.

Speaker 3 (36:01):
Then someone comes out from the shadows and shoots him
four times with a thirty eight, just on the street,
killing him.

Speaker 1 (36:09):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (36:09):
Yeah, there's like a photo of it, like a vintage
crime scene photo. He shot once in each eye, oh,
once in the head, and once in the groin.

Speaker 1 (36:18):
Oh yeah, parsenal do that right once in each eyes
too much.

Speaker 2 (36:23):
Well, it turns out that that's a symbol of a
mob hit. Like you witnessed this thing. Oh and you're
in trouble for it.

Speaker 1 (36:30):
Okay, I don't want to tell the mob what to do.
But that's over kill. It's too much, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (36:35):
I mean, and then it's like okay, but then so
then the NYPD launches a massive investigation.

Speaker 2 (36:42):
They interview more than four thousand people. But guess who's
gonna say anything to the cops at this point, you know,
they sent the message, and the message orked.

Speaker 1 (36:50):
Yeah he's not talking.

Speaker 3 (36:52):
Nobody's talking. Yeah, no one's talking.

Speaker 2 (36:54):
There was a potential eyewitness and they were like, nope,
absolutely not.

Speaker 3 (36:58):
I'm not talking. I didn't see anything coming. Shrmanaghan says,
quote more than anything else in my public life, I want.

Speaker 2 (37:04):
To break this case like he was. He said, he
really wanted to break this case. And the story spreads
through the country and ignites a public outrage that like
basically an innocent bystander who tried to do the right
thing gets.

Speaker 3 (37:16):
Murdered, gets murdered for it.

Speaker 1 (37:18):
And also just to say in my always suspicious mind
that the cops could have easily murdered him, made it
look like a mob hit, because those are all the
tell tale signs quote unquote.

Speaker 2 (37:30):
Yeah, that's very true. I'm sure it was embarrassing though too,
that he was killed. I think that, like, it just
looked bad on their reputation too, if they didn't do it.
Let's say, right, people suspect certain of Sutton's friends.

Speaker 3 (37:43):
There's a man named Frederick Tonudo.

Speaker 2 (37:46):
He's a convicted killer who escaped prison with Willie in
nineteen forty seven. To Nudo himself is added to the
FBI's most wanted list, but he is an apprehended. He
eventually dies in the nineteen sixties while still in the lamb.
There's also a legend in mob lore your favorite Oh
Ask Me Anything, that the mafia boss Albert Anastasia ordered

(38:07):
the hit. So this guy, Albert is the head of
what would become the Gambino crime.

Speaker 1 (38:12):
Family, the Gambino crime Family, as I live and breathe exactly.

Speaker 2 (38:17):
The story is that this is the story that Albert
didn't even know Willie Sutton, that he saw the story
on TV and said, quote I can't stand squealers end
quote and sent someone.

Speaker 1 (38:29):
To go kill Arnold, Like no, just like was so
angry at the like, you know, the morals. I guess
you could say of it like being a snitch, being
a snitch. Yeah yeah, he sent someone to go kill
this poor kid. Wow yeah wait sorry, was that a theory?
Or they found out that that is true?

Speaker 3 (38:47):
So that's a theory.

Speaker 2 (38:49):
However, it would be out of character for the mob
to order a hit on someone they had nothing to
do with at all, Like that's not kind of their thing.

Speaker 3 (38:57):
They're seen. Yes, people say. Albert, though, had.

Speaker 2 (39:00):
Become unhinged at this point, and in his memoirs, Lucky
Luciano Yeah hints that this actually did happen, oh, that
he had Albert killed. But in nineteen sixty three, the
first ever Mafia member to break the organization's code of
silence becomes an informant. His name is Joseph Falacci, and

(39:21):
he will to attest that Albert ordered the hit.

Speaker 1 (39:25):
Oh sorry, Leanna's art. Oh she's Squalachi. I was like,
wait a second, Squalachi, I Walachi, wait a second by
La b jeah.

Speaker 3 (39:37):
Yeah, so it's probable.

Speaker 1 (39:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (39:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (39:41):
It also turns out that the seventy thousand dollars reward
that Arnold had been trying to get wasn't even real.
It had been misreported.

Speaker 1 (39:49):
Oh so he's all keyed up about something that he
couldn't have gotten it exactly.

Speaker 2 (39:53):
His family does sue the New York City for failing
to protect their son, and the city settles with them
for forty one thousand dollars, which in today's money would
be two hundred and fifty four hundred and seventy three thousand.

Speaker 1 (40:06):
Oh that's half a million dollars, isn't bad. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (40:09):
So when Willy Sutton hears about the murder, remember fucking
affable bank robber, the actor I do. So he's fucking
sitting in jail because he had gotten caught because of Albert. Right, right,
he's sitting in jail. He hears about the murder. He
is so bummed about it.

Speaker 1 (40:26):
Well, of course he's a gentleman.

Speaker 2 (40:27):
Yeah, he's he can't believe someone got killed for giving
him up in his name.

Speaker 1 (40:31):
Like he's actually so upset about it. He says, quote,
I could have fallen off the bed. This sinks me.

Speaker 3 (40:38):
Oh I know.

Speaker 2 (40:39):
He writes to the Schuster family and offers his condolences.
So this guy, if it was up to him. It
was a fair game. The guy who caught him caught him,
you know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (40:48):
Yes, of course.

Speaker 2 (40:49):
So a real award is offered for information leading to
the arrest of Arnold's killer, and Willy offers to contribute
ten thousand dollars to that reward.

Speaker 1 (40:57):
Come on, I know this guy is a dream bank robber.

Speaker 2 (41:01):
Dream authorities decline his money though, they're like, that might
be inappropriate.

Speaker 1 (41:07):
You know what, No, yeah, we're gonna go No.

Speaker 2 (41:11):
If you want to just give some money to the family, fine, yeah,
but this looks bad. Willy is eventually sent to Attica
Prison in upstate New York with multiple life sentence, but
he's released due to poor health in nineteen sixty nine
where he met Karen and you guys got married.

Speaker 1 (41:26):
Hey wait a say those one year before I was born.
But he multiple life sentences just for robbing banks.

Speaker 3 (41:33):
Yeah, wow, yeah, I think it's pretty serious.

Speaker 1 (41:36):
Well, gun, it's yeah.

Speaker 3 (41:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (41:38):
I should also say that though in the beginning he
is charged with assault, so take all that with a
great assault.

Speaker 3 (41:44):
So he might have hit someone with a gun in
the head at one point.

Speaker 1 (41:48):
Perhaps not always the perfect gentleman, right right, that's how
actors are so Willie sent and dies in Florida in
nineteen eighty, but before that he publishes a book about
his life about Arnold Schuster.

Speaker 3 (42:01):
He writes, quote, throughout.

Speaker 2 (42:03):
My career, I had plotted and planned my jobs to
make sure that I would not have to hurt anybody.
And now after it was over and I was sitting
in jail, a good looking, promising young man had been
killed because of me.

Speaker 1 (42:17):
The laughter of the.

Speaker 2 (42:18):
Gods end quote wow, yeah, and that is the story
of the unsolved murder of Arnold Schuster.

Speaker 1 (42:27):
Amazing story. Thank you, right and will tol Oh, thank you.
I said thank you to something you did. Tricked you.
I've pulled you right in. But here's the thing about
fucking crime. It's like he's sitting there. This is such
a story from the forties and fifties, right, because he's like,
it's the gentleman. We all love him. But it's like, yeah,

(42:49):
but that's exactly what happens when you start fucking around
with crime and.

Speaker 3 (42:53):
God, you can't all control all the circumstances as much
as you want to, and you have a plan and
you're this kind of person, Yeah, it's now out of
your hands.

Speaker 1 (43:03):
Take those morals, get a job at the fucking grocery store.
That's right, and slug it along with everybody else. I
heard Costco is a great place to work. I love
it there. Yeah they're hot dogs, you know. Me and
my sister once and got hot dogs there the last time.
I was No, I didn't tell you that story. I
could have sworn, because we've been so hot dog themed lately.

Speaker 2 (43:23):
Yeah, every time you had a hot dog, I have
to know I should report it.

Speaker 3 (43:26):
I wish you would.

Speaker 1 (43:27):
But we were sitting in the in the parking lot.
Uh wait, I lost it. Something funny happened as we
were both eating these hot dogs. Oh, I found out
my sister does not like relish. After all this time,
I was going to ask you what you would put
everything on? What's the deal? She's ketchup and mustard, which
repelled me and made me go like, have I not
ever looked at you?

Speaker 3 (43:47):
Why are you only mustard?

Speaker 1 (43:49):
Mustard relish? Oh listen that plus ketchup. I'm happy. No,
I'll put fucking any.

Speaker 3 (43:56):
Condiment on a hot dog. That's like a mayor to
be put on a hot dog.

Speaker 1 (44:00):
What hold on, let me think of when you.

Speaker 2 (44:02):
Wouldn't onions, chili, cheese, cheese, pickles.

Speaker 1 (44:09):
Those all sound good, but together I think I'm talking
about mixing. Would you put mayo on.

Speaker 3 (44:14):
A hot I don't put me on anything.

Speaker 1 (44:15):
Fuck no your mayo no so good? If you put
mao on your right into my favorite murder at Gmail.

Speaker 2 (44:23):
Hold on the dirty dog that you get in La
outside of sports arenas and clubs, that they're grilled right
on the fucking flat top there. Hell, yes, I just
let them make it for me because it's made a
certain way. It's everyone. You have to have a dirty dog.
It's a bacon rough hot dog that's like sold in
the streets in La. It's so delicious, fucking incredible, always good.
And they put mayo on it, like I don't. I'll

(44:44):
never say no mayo because they know best what it's
supposed to take, so very true. So I will eat Yes,
so mayo, I'll do mayo.

Speaker 1 (44:50):
And do they put the mayo on it like they
put it on the corn. Yeah, yeah, that's kind of funny.
It's like, well, yeah, this is good, this is like
how this is good? A good one way to eat
this kind of travel food.

Speaker 3 (45:02):
Yeah, you gotta have mayo.

Speaker 1 (45:03):
I fucking can't stand mayo.

Speaker 2 (45:05):
I think it's the most disgusting thing. But I will
eat it on some things.

Speaker 1 (45:09):
I mean it's necessary purely for moisture and many things.

Speaker 2 (45:14):
Right, But and then you have to get dukes too,
if you had Duke's mayo. No, that's like Vince is like,
we're not allowed to have any mayo in the house
with Dukes.

Speaker 1 (45:22):
Is it a Midwestern thing?

Speaker 2 (45:23):
It's a Midwest or East coasty thing. Someone will yell
at us about that.

Speaker 1 (45:27):
Huh, because my mom the rule was no mayo, but
Best Foods never had that. That's someone with the book.
It's like the classic.

Speaker 3 (45:34):
Yeah, miracle Whip.

Speaker 1 (45:38):
You looked so disappointed in me when you said it,
only because my mom was such a hard ass about
Best Foods. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (45:44):
That.

Speaker 1 (45:44):
The first time I had miracle Whip, it was like
someone put a packet of sugar into the mayo. It
was the weirdest like experience.

Speaker 2 (45:52):
Okay, fast Foods is real mayo. Miracle Whip is the
fucking weird ship.

Speaker 1 (45:56):
It's the weird ship. But it's like whatever, it's just
they put a little zinging because it's supposed to be, like,
you know, it's something a little different than mega classier
and man like that first bolooney and cheese sandwich.

Speaker 2 (46:07):
I was like, what is that? Oh, someone loves that.
That's someone's like hangover treat.

Speaker 1 (46:12):
This is We're actually starting a huge fight on the
internet right now. What about you?

Speaker 3 (46:17):
Are you a CP Mayo person?

Speaker 1 (46:22):
Okay, well, great job, thank you. We're definitely going to
turn Okay, I don't know how many degrees they Okay,
We're just gonna have to feel it out. I'm about
to tell you a story that starts on the night
of November twenty second, nineteen seventy five, in Nyakama, Washington.
It's so cold the ground actually has snow on it.

(46:43):
But inside her home, Dianne Blankenbaker, who's in her late twenties,
is warm asleep in bed until sometime around two AM,
when she wakes up to a loud noise outside. She
thinks it's the slam of a car door, doesn't think
much about it. She goes back to sleep. She wakes
up again around five AM, and she realizes that her partner,

(47:04):
thirty two year old Morris Blankenbaker, is not there. So
Morris is a high school coach by day. At night,
he works as a night shift bouncer at a local club.
Doubt there's a day shift bouncer, but you never know
what kind of clubs, so he should have been home
hours ago. It was totally not normal that he wasn't

(47:25):
there in bed, so Diana, of course, is worried. She
checks every room in the house, including her two young
children's bedrooms, but he is nowhere to be found. She thinks, oh,
maybe he was so tired when he got home that
he fell asleep in his car in the driveway or something.
So she goes outside. His car is there. He is
not inside. Now She's getting really worried, so she figures

(47:49):
if his car's here, he's here somewhere. So she starts
to walk around the outside of the house, and as
she turns the corner to walk around the back side
of the house, she finds Morris lying dead in the snow,
so she screams for help, and when investigators arrive on
the scene, they discover that Morris has been murdered, shot

(48:10):
three times, and left to die. So tragically, Morris blanken
Baker won't be the only man in Dian's life to
die during that holiday season in nineteen seventy five, and
he isn't even the only high school coach in Yakima
to be murdered that winter. This is the story of
the strange deaths of Morris blanken Baker and Gabby Moore,

(48:32):
whose murders and their investigations left their small city scandalized.

Speaker 3 (48:36):
Okay, I am here.

Speaker 1 (48:38):
Okay, and here's really why you're here, because the main
source of this story is Anne Rule's book A Fever
in the Heart. And there's other sources, of course, please
check them. They're in our show notes. But of course,
always read Anne Rule's books any chance you get. So
let's go back to the mid sixties when Dian and

(48:59):
Moore urs Blankenbaker first get married. They're a perfect match,
completely in love. They're devoted to one another, and to
the outside world, they seem like a great couple. They're
objectively attractive people. Diane has beautiful jet black hair and
a very pretty face. Morris is handsome, sporty, and Rule

(49:20):
describes him as quote like a young Greek god with
bulging biceps and a washboard stomach that's rippled with muscles.

Speaker 3 (49:26):
Okay, Anne's a little thirsty, and you know.

Speaker 1 (49:29):
A lot of he actually has a very seventies look
like he kind of looks his face is he looks
like a stuntman from a movie or a TV show.
He has kind of like a big face with a
I can't explain it. He's like attractive and also looks
like he can take a car engine apart. Sure, So

(49:51):
it's no surprise that athletics are important to Morris have
been all his life. He was the star athlete in
high school, where he wrestled and played football. He actually
earned a four year athletic scholarship to Washington State University,
and he got offers to play professional football after college,
but instead he decided to settle down in Yakima with

(50:12):
Dean because his lifelong dream was to become a coach.
So in the early seventies, Dian and Morris have two
small children and they're going strong. They both work hard
to make ends meet. Dane works at a local bank
and Morris coaches at a nearby high school and then
does his shifts as the bouncer a late night. So

(50:35):
they seem to have a happy home life and they're
beloved in their community. Morris is the kind of guy that,
like everybody thinks, is their friend, and everybody in Yakima
knows both of them. They say he's kind hearted, cool headed,
two things that would really come in handy in both
of the jobs that he has. Actually, so it makes
sense that in late nineteen seventy three, a man named

(50:57):
Glynn Gabby Moore Gabby is his AKA, would go to
his old friend Morris for help. Gabby and Morris go
way back. They have a special bond because Gabby was
Morris's high school wrestling coach.

Speaker 3 (51:12):
Okay and Rule writes this about it.

Speaker 1 (51:15):
Quote Morris met Gabby for the first time at Washington
Junior High. He viewed him as the hero figure that
most boys see in their coaches. Coaches. Good coaches shape
the lives of their athletes forever after. They're often the
father figure that some boys and girls never had. They
can instill a sense of self worth and inner confidence

(51:37):
that lasts a lifetime. End quote Prince his dad was
a pe teacher in the track coach. Oh you know,
I mean it's really true though.

Speaker 2 (51:46):
Yeah, oh absolutely, I remember my coaches like that believed
in me when I did not deserve believing in.

Speaker 1 (51:51):
Yeah, for sure, Yes, you did deserve it, just because
you were smoking and doing illicit drugs.

Speaker 3 (51:59):
You deserved it more, thank you.

Speaker 1 (52:01):
But you're right, it's that kind of a good coach
is like the best parents, but in a kind of
detached way of like, now, I'm going to teach you
how to take all that and use it in the world.

Speaker 2 (52:11):
Right, because it's not about their feelings as well. Parents
are like, never mind.

Speaker 1 (52:18):
There's a book about it. There's probably a self help
book about it out there.

Speaker 3 (52:20):
I don't need.

Speaker 1 (52:21):
To to coach your way into better parenting, how.

Speaker 3 (52:24):
To detach from your children and fucking coach them.

Speaker 1 (52:27):
And yeah, okay, okay. So Morris revers his old coach.
The entire city of Yakima actually does, because Gabby is
such an excellent coach and has been for years, and
he coaches championship teams, which of course that's the people
love that. So he's a local big shot Gabby. But

(52:47):
then something happens that flips Morris and Gabby's power dynamic completely,
which is in the early nineteen seventies, the two go
on a whitewater rafting trip together. Gabby falls in and
Morris jumps in after him and saves his life. But
basically he was going to drown in the Whitewater rapids,

(53:09):
but Morris is such a strong swimmer and such a
great athlete that he basically rescues him. Wow. So they
already share a strong bond now that you know, besties
for life. So when Gabby reaches out and asks Morris
for help, he's like, of course, whatever you need. Turns
out Gabby and his wife are getting a divorce and
he needs a place to stay until he irons things

(53:32):
out at home. So Morris goes to Dean, explains what's
going on, asks if Gabby can move in. Dian isn't
crazy about the idea because they have two preschool age
children another adult. It seems like it's going to be
like too busy, too hard. Yeah, they got routines, They
got routines. They don't have a ton of money, you know,

(53:53):
like space in their house. Yeah, yeah, exactly, I get it.
Don't take my chair type of stuff. But eventually Dian
does give in and December of nineteen seventy three, Gabby
moves into the blanken Baker home, and not long after,
the relationship between the two men shifts. And this is
because it shifts again in a way because Gabby is

(54:15):
a huge secret alcoholic. Oh no, yeah, he's very good
at hiding it. Diane does not see it at all.
Morris completely catches on and is like all over it,
and Gabby's drinking troubles him because it's totally unlike him.
This is not the man he knows him to be.
And when Gabby was Morris's coach, he didn't touch alcohol.

(54:37):
He preached, you know, sober living and healthy living. So
the fact that Gabby is not only drinking, but drinking
an alarming amount of liquor and then when he does that,
he gets like angry and aggressive all of that, Morris
is like, what the hell is going on? So to
keep the peace, Morris basically is doing everything he can

(54:59):
to keep drinking away from Dane so she just doesn't
have to deal with it, and it kind of works.
Dan doesn't notice anything and thinks everything's fine. A couple
months pass and Gabby not only hasn't reconciled with his wife,
but he basically admits that he's fallen in love with

(55:19):
another woman, and in a twist that Morris never sees
no coming, no, the woman is Dane. No, yes, yes,
and Diane actually falls for Gabby. She thinks hees this
old town legend hero great coach doesn't really know yea.

(55:39):
So here's what Anne Rule writes about this quote. At
first glance, it seemed highly unlikely that Gabby would be
attracted to Diane. He was forty two years old out
nowhere near as handsome as Morris. But Gabby had one
big advantage. He was an unknown quantity to Dane. She
had been with Morris since she was seventy. The very

(56:01):
fact that Gabby was fifteen years older than Dianne may
have drawn her to him. His charisma and ability to
inspire confidence drew her to him, just as he inspired athletes.

Speaker 3 (56:11):
No, don't do it.

Speaker 1 (56:13):
So things between Gabby and Danne moved quickly, as you
would imagine. Less than three months after he Gabby moves
into the blank and Baker home, Deane tells Morris she's
leaving him. Not long after that, June of nineteen seventy four,
after nine years of marriage, Morris and Dianne divorce. Then,
in September of that year, exactly one year after Gabby

(56:36):
first moved in with the Blanket Bakers, Dianna and Gabby
get married. Wow, so as fast as humanly posha Ouch.
I wonder too how this lines up because it's one
of my favorite kind of factoids because I remember it
happening when I was around like seven or eight years old.

(56:56):
Is in and I don't know if it was nationwide
or if it was California or what, but all of
a sudden, everyone's parents got divorced. Yeah, And it was
like one of those things where I wonder if like
it had started to become normalized. She was like, oh,
I can not only stop doing this, but I can
start doing something else, almost immediately. Interesting. It felt like

(57:18):
it was a thing that a lot of people were doing.

Speaker 2 (57:20):
I bet there was some you know, famous couple that
divorced or some law that got changed and suddenly everyone
was divorcing.

Speaker 1 (57:27):
Yeah, I think it. If I'm not mistaken, it was
no fault divorce where it's like, so you could just
do it and be like, you know what, let's call
it and I don't have to necessarily pay you fifty
percent or whatever. I don't know. We'll never know, because
that's not really our specialty here on this podcast.

Speaker 2 (57:43):
I'll never know because no one will ever comment who's
a lawyer a historian and tell us the truth.

Speaker 1 (57:48):
And tell us exactly how right and wrong the theory is.

Speaker 3 (57:51):
Please do so.

Speaker 1 (57:52):
This entire affair becomes the talk of the town as
that's juicy as hell, got so juicy. It's the definition
of scandal. And Morris is the victim of two betrayals,
so of course, the love of his life, Dianne, has
deceived him, and then his best friend and mentor, who
he was currently helping out in a bad situation and

(58:14):
whose life he had already saved.

Speaker 3 (58:16):
Oh.

Speaker 1 (58:18):
Just so, it's like a fuck you in every way,
in every direction, just nasty. And Morris, being the great
guy that everyone loves, he does his best to respect
his wife's decision. He moves out of the house in
a state of total grief. But shortly and shortly into
her new marriage, Diane realizes that she has made a

(58:38):
huge mistake. Oh god, Gabby can't hide his drinking anymore.
I'm sure they got married, they went and had some fun,
and then it was like, oh, on our wedding night,
you're gonna scream or whatever. That's a total guess conjecture,
but it's that kind of thing where it's like, Oh,
you're comfortable together now, and you're free right, that's gonna
get real. And Dianne now sees how scary can be

(59:00):
when he's drunk. She will later say, quote, he loved
you one minute, and the next minute he just kicked
you out of the house, and I was getting a
little bit scared of him. He drank very heavily. Within
a two or three hour period. He would drink a
fifth of burden.

Speaker 3 (59:14):
That's too much.

Speaker 1 (59:15):
That is so much brown liquor. I feel, we're taking
a sip of my canned wine right now, but do
it now? You have to do it.

Speaker 3 (59:23):
So much brown liquor.

Speaker 2 (59:24):
And you know, like it was a seventies so he
wasn't well hydrated or like eating good protein or anything
like that.

Speaker 1 (59:29):
Smoking the entire time. Oh god, yeah, that's so much
brown liquor is always the biggest mistake you make when
you first start drinking. Where it's like I remember being like,
here's my personality. I like, right, Captain Morgan's spice drum
rough on the rocks with like pineapple juice mixed into

(59:51):
it or something like.

Speaker 3 (59:52):
It sounds like already vomit, Yeah, like pre vomit.

Speaker 1 (59:56):
It made it so easy for me to vomit everywhere
and whenever I felt that, Oh god, okay, so.

Speaker 3 (01:00:04):
Order that drink as drunk. Karen said a little bit of.

Speaker 1 (01:00:10):
Nos thom want a little bit of Captain Morgan say
have that.

Speaker 3 (01:00:16):
We don't have that, ma'am.

Speaker 1 (01:00:18):
Do you have any captain? I guess we have, Yeah,
we have, or anybody name.

Speaker 3 (01:00:24):
This is a burger king.

Speaker 1 (01:00:25):
You better get me pietapple juice. Oh my god. The
other day I got the old number seven at McDonald's.
They have orange hicy again. I don't know if that
had packed life at all. All I ever got is
the orange drink. I guess they took it away. It
may have come back sooner than just my experience, but
I didn't know it was back. And I got to

(01:00:46):
have some and it was fucking great too.

Speaker 3 (01:00:48):
Cheeseburger meal.

Speaker 1 (01:00:49):
Yes, how did I know that? Yes? Because we have
lived together for fucking years, our friend, you simply must know.
And yours is a fish in a hot tea discuss,
no joke. A guy went to high school with Order
that one time when we were at meals and I

(01:01:09):
was like, seriously, are you trying to get the shit
beaten out of you? What are you doing? Was discusting ever,
and then you dip the flam fish into the hot tea.
He flakes offt into your tea and becomes like a slush,
a hot slush. Okay, let's focus on the fundamentals. In

(01:01:30):
July of nineteen seventy five, less than a year into
this marriage, Deanne separates from Gabby and she goes and
reconciles with Morris. What does Morris do when she goes
to him and says, I made a mistake.

Speaker 3 (01:01:40):
I love you and I missed you. That's why I
come back home.

Speaker 1 (01:01:43):
Oh no? He forgives her and they plan to remarry.
So Gabby moves into a rented apartment. Basically, it's like
this whole experiment is over and this is insane. Going
back to normal. Gabby goes into a rented apartment and
he basically becomes obsessed with Dan oh no, and with

(01:02:03):
getting her back. Diane will say quote, he would call daily,
stopped by a couple times. He would call me at work,
and then he would call me at home. He even
came out to the bank. He would often say that
he would like to commit suicide in front of me
so that I would be on the fifth floor of Memorial,
which is the psychiatric ward Wow. End quote. So this

(01:02:25):
is a person that's like in a true kind of
end stage alcoholism. Yeah, bad time.

Speaker 3 (01:02:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:02:33):
So now this brings us back to the night of
November twenty second, nineteen seventy five, when Dane finds Morris's
body at the house.

Speaker 3 (01:02:40):
So after all of that, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:02:42):
She finds him dead. And this is just two years
shy of Gabby first moving into the blanken Baker's house.
So at this point, Dean's been separated from Gabby. She's
back with Morris for about four months, and the whole
four months Gabby has just been harassing her constantly. And
Gabby is immediately viewed as a suspect when Morris is found,

(01:03:05):
but there's little evidence at the scene. There are no
witnesses to Morris's murder, and Gabby has a rock solid alibi.
He was actually checked into the hospital at the time
because his blood pressure was extremely high. Oh yeah, that's weird, right,
So around two am on November twenty second, when Morris
is believed to have been killed, when Diane heard this

(01:03:28):
sound that she thought was a car door slamming, records
prove Gabby was actually in the hospital. So still police
wonder if Gabby could have slipped out of the hospital
and then snuck back in after he killed Morris. That's
ruled out because there's various ways to exit the hospital,
but getting back into Gabby's room undetected would have been

(01:03:48):
virtually impossible. The doors are locked after visiting hours. Even
if you made it back to his assigned floor past
the various hospital employees, he would have been having to
sneak by, or the locked doors he would have had
to bypass. His room was literally right in front of
the nurses station. Three nurses were on duty the night

(01:04:08):
Morris was killed. And rule rights quote, unless Gabby Moore
had perfected the art of astral projection, the most viable
suspect in the murder of Morris blanken Baker had just
been eliminated from the list of possible Samen Weird. Yeah,
but Gabby's behavior after Morris's death is suspect, to say
the least. As the blanken Bakers enter the holiday season

(01:04:33):
mourning the loss of their father and their husband, Gabby
is still trying to shoehorn his way back into Dean's life.
Diane's more repulsed by him than ever, of course, and
she's becoming increasingly convinced he had something to do with
Morris's death.

Speaker 2 (01:04:49):
I mean, it's a really great alibi to be in
the hospital, so like, who was doing the dirty work
when you had a great alibi?

Speaker 1 (01:04:54):
There you are, yeah, and here we arrive, because it's
almost like it's two perfect alibi. Oh you at the
room right across from the nurses station, totally, so everyone
had their own time. Amazing. But Gabby is adamant that
he was not involved, and he starts telling everyone around
him he's actually the victim of a stalker and that

(01:05:15):
strange men have been calling him at all hours and
threatening his life and they're harassing his mother too, And
then Gaby reports someone shot out a window at his apartment.
So over the next few weeks, Gabby is so afraid
for his life he plans out his funeral with his daughter,
just in case Jesus. So now it's Christmas Eve and

(01:05:38):
it's been about a month since Morris's death, and Deane
and her children are just trying to get through their
first holiday without him. Meanwhile, Gabby's at his apartment alone
and at some point in that night, just as he feared,
someone breaks into the apartment and shoots Glynn Gabby Moore
to death. What so detectives are stunned. The man who

(01:06:01):
they are convinced was involved, if not like the spearheading
Morris's murder, is dead, so an information obviously he might
have been able to share or admit later on or
confess to all off the table and Gabby's claims that
his life was being threatened now seem credible. Oops, the
detectives must be wondering if up to this point they'd

(01:06:23):
just gotten it all wrong. So as they investigate Gabby's apartment,
they're left with more questions than answers because everything seems
to be in order. There are no signs of a struggle.
Although the body is found lying face down, it is
noticeably not bloody at all, very little blood, so at

(01:06:44):
first they think Gabby might have had a heart attack.
It's plausible giving his recent stay in the hospital for
blood pressure, but that theory is quickly tossed out when
they find a gunshot wound and a small blood stain
near Gabby's shoulder. So of course this adds actually more
mystery because it means Gabby was in fact shot, but

(01:07:05):
the location in size of his wound don't seem to
be particularly deadly, so it doesn't make sense that he
was shot dead like through the shoulder. Then they find
a twenty two caliber bullet casing near Gaby's body, and
that when they run ballistic tests, they eventually determined both
Gabby and Warris's gunshot wounds were caused by the same

(01:07:25):
type of bullet. So for investigators, this leads them to
a new theory, which is that the same man killed
both coaches, but they don't know why. So for weeks
the detectives work the case, they don't get anywhere, and
then two months after Gabby's death, a couple of local
kids are fishing in a Yakima river and they pull

(01:07:46):
out a rusty Colt twenty two pistol. From there, It's like,
were they fishing with magnets? I would love to know
either way? They find an old gun, they turn it in.
The police release this information to the public because they
figure someone out there knows something and they'll just hopefully
come forward and like fill in the gaps, and they do.

(01:08:08):
A young woman that Anne Rule identifies as Loretta Scott
calls in with a tip and she tells detectives she's
the owner of the gun, and she's also the person
who tossed it in the river, but she's not the killer.

Speaker 3 (01:08:20):
Okay, what now?

Speaker 1 (01:08:21):
Yeah, Yakoma was one big question mark at this point. Sure,
but Loretta does know who the killer is. It's her cousin.
So he borrowed the gun twice, once in November and
again on Christmas Eve. So when she learns those dates
perfectly align with both Morris's murder and Gabby's murder or

(01:08:41):
Gabby's death, Loretta got worried that she was hanging on
to a murder weapon, so she panicked and chucked it
into the river literally Maren's exact words, chucked it into the.

Speaker 3 (01:08:52):
River, honey.

Speaker 1 (01:08:55):
And so Loretta tells police her cousin's name is Angelo Pleasant,
but everyone in town knows him as Toughie Toughye that's right,
his name is Toughy Pleasant. Don't fuck correl with Toughy Pleasant.
Oh you think, are you thinking of a little loss
of apsu when you hear that? Nope, fuck around and
then find out he is afterwards. Yeah. In nineteen seventy five,

(01:09:17):
Toughy Pleasant is a twenty two year old college student
from Yakima with an impressive wrestling record, which is how
Morris blanken Baker was described in his heyday. Morris was
about ten years older than Toughy, and just like Morris,
Toughy's wrestling coach was Gabby Moore. Morris Blankenbaker was a

(01:09:38):
great athlete, but Toughy Pleasant is in a league of
his own. Under Gabby's training, Toughy's on track to be
an Olympic level wrestler, and he's actually been competing. He's
competed as far away as Tokyo. Even after Toffy began
to work with new coaches in college, he still idolized Gabby.
It's same thing of like, that's his coach. So, just

(01:10:01):
as it was with Morris, Gabby and Toffy had a
close relationship, and Tuffy held the same reverence and adoration
for his old coach. Needless to say, Tuffy was there
when Gabby went through both his divorces, his descent into alcoholism,
and his depressive spiral, and Tuff you will later say,
quote it was dean, this dean that we were so

(01:10:24):
close that what he felt I felt. If he shed
a tear, I shed a tear. This man, he's just
tore up. He's not himself, he's just bleeding inside. He said,
if you have a problem, you eliminate it, and Morris
was his number one problem. Oh no, end quote. So
Toughy agrees to kill Morris blanken Baker for Gabby while

(01:10:45):
Gabby's hospitalized. He called it right, We're so after eight
and a half years of this same fucking story.

Speaker 3 (01:10:53):
Over and over again, can't get anything by us.

Speaker 1 (01:10:55):
They planned the murder together, these two men, and then
Gabby made the phone call too Toughy from the hospital
to set that plan in motion. And then months later,
to dispel this growing suspicion that Gabby was involved in
Morris's death, Gabby went back to Toughye with another request,
one last favor. He wants Toughy to shoot him. Oh so,

(01:11:20):
Tuffy is an adult man, He's got the Olympics, potentially
the Olympics ahead of him, and yet he's going to
risk it all for his old wrestling coach. Doesn't make
a ton of sense, although good coaches shape the lives
of their athletes forever.

Speaker 3 (01:11:35):
As Annruhl said, young, impressionable.

Speaker 1 (01:11:38):
Right, and clearly tough. He felt indebted to Gabby and
loved him, clearly and Gabby knew that it would be
incredibly difficult for Toughy to say no to him. So
Tuffy agrees to shoot Gabby in the shoulder, and Gabby thinks,
then he'll have like a mindful a minor although painful
injury and ultimately mindful you really think about what matters.

(01:12:04):
So the plan was Toffy shoots Gabby in the shoulder.
He then crawls, wounded and bleeding down the street to
Dian's sister's house. Okay, and then that'll get him off
the hook for being suspected in Morris's murder, and it
will also win him sympathy from Dian's sister and therefore

(01:12:25):
then pulling Dan back into his life. Very alcoholic plan, Yeah,
very familiar to me. So on Christmas Eve, tough he
fires the weapon at Gabby and Gabby is very drunk,
and the theory is that he kind of like stumbled
as the gun went off, so the bullet hits slightly

(01:12:47):
lower than as planned. And and rule rights, I kind
of love this story because it's just like reading you
great parts of an ann.

Speaker 3 (01:12:56):
Rule totally that could be a podcast in its own.

Speaker 1 (01:12:59):
Yeah quote, probably the wound would not have been fatal
except for one peculiarity of a twenty two, It can
spiral inside the body if it hits a bone, and
autopsy would show that this was what happened. The bullet
had changed course after hitting the fourth rib, and it
had penetrated both lungs and heart, resulting in almost instantaneous death.

Speaker 3 (01:13:22):
Holy shit.

Speaker 1 (01:13:23):
So Gaby's body wasn't bloody and first responders thought it
was a heart attack because all of the fatal wounds
and the bleeding were internal. He was just literally torn
up inside.

Speaker 3 (01:13:35):
Oh my god.

Speaker 1 (01:13:37):
So in August of nineteen seventy six, less than three
years after this entire saga began with Gabby moving into
the blanken Baker home, Tuffy's found guilty of murdering Morris
blanken Baker and convicted of manslaughter in the murder of
Gabby Moore. So he still it's like, even though it
was you didn't mean any of that to happen, You're

(01:13:57):
still going to get manslaughter. By the way, Toughy is
a black man, so that probably has a lot to
do with it as well. So he winds up getting
a life sentence for Morris's murder plus twenty years. So
As Anne Rule finishes her book Fever in the Heart,
she says, quote, life does go on, even after the
most horrendous tragedies, even after so much heartbreak. When Gaby

(01:14:21):
Moore fastened his obsessive eye on Dann blanken Baker, his
hell bent manipulations ultimately changed the course of many lives.
Nothing was ever the same again, But people went on
following the news paths that loss and grief cut out
for them, and great one such a good last line.
In the maximum security prison where Tuffy Pleasant is incarcerated,

(01:14:42):
he eventually learns to sew, and in an Los Angeles
Times article from the early nineties, he notes that he's
part of a program that teaches inmates how to quote
soap pockets on fleece outerwear, including ski Parka's swimwear and
products sold in department and specialties doors end.

Speaker 4 (01:15:00):
Quote.

Speaker 1 (01:15:01):
This job pays a minimum wage to the incarcerated workers,
and some of that money going to victim restitution, and
Tuffy is quoted in this article saying, quote, this program
has allowed a lot of US guys a chance to
give something back, not just to families who have suffered
as a result of what we've done, but to our
families as well. This program has given me patience. End quote.

(01:15:26):
Tuffy Pleasant ultimately spends twenty years in prison, and then
he's paroled. What I think is incredible about that quote
is that he is taking so much accountability for his
behavior that he was entirely coerced into participating in.

Speaker 2 (01:15:43):
Yeah, but you make the decisions that you make, you
do for whatever reason.

Speaker 1 (01:15:48):
But if there is any it's like the people who
suffered for what you did because someone told you you
had to played upon, like manipulated. Yes, you totally chose
to do it, But goddamn.

Speaker 2 (01:16:01):
If only everyone could take their fucking step back responsibility.

Speaker 1 (01:16:07):
If only everyone back In Yakima, Diane eventually moves on
from her job at the bank and she becomes a
successful stockbroker. Oh bad us good. She remarries and she
and her new husband leave Yakima for good. Yeah, thank god,
let's go. Yes. And Anne Rule actually meets with Dane

(01:16:28):
while she's writing A Fever in the Heart, and she says, quote,
I saw that she had changed from the vulnerable, shocked
young woman I had watched testify at Tuffy's trial. She
had clearly become a woman in control of her life,
and both of she and Morris's children had grown up
to be happy, well adjusted adults. I did not blame
Deane for demuring when I asked about her feelings after

(01:16:51):
the murders of Morris and Gabby. Those days were all
in the past for her, and whatever regrets she might
have had, she chose to keep private and quote, Wow,
love Anne Rule, and that's the story of the murder
of Morris blanken Baker. I had never ever heard that,
and I was expecting it to be a cold case

(01:17:12):
for the way you started.

Speaker 3 (01:17:14):
Oh really, Yeah, I tricked you. You totally tricked me.
Love it.

Speaker 1 (01:17:18):
That's what we're trying to that's all we're trying to
do here, ladies and gentlemen. Oh my god, that's that's
so tragedy upon tragedy.

Speaker 3 (01:17:27):
Those poor kids, those poor kids.

Speaker 1 (01:17:29):
I truly that last chunk. I was like, oh God, oh,
thank god. Yeah, that's the magic of VM Rule.

Speaker 3 (01:17:35):
Yeah, she's so good.

Speaker 1 (01:17:36):
She knew the story. She knew the story people actually
want to hear. She knows the details you want to hear. Yeah,
rippled muscles in the beginning, everyone is going to be
okay in the end. Thank you.

Speaker 3 (01:17:51):
Good job.

Speaker 1 (01:17:52):
Thank you. All right, let's end on some what do
we call them?

Speaker 3 (01:17:57):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (01:17:57):
Hashtag? What are you even doing right now? Where you guys?

Speaker 3 (01:18:00):
Tell us what you're even doing right now while you're
listening to my favorite murder.

Speaker 1 (01:18:03):
We love the idea of just getting a little picture,
just so little idea of what the hell's going on
out there as.

Speaker 2 (01:18:10):
We do this in here. What kind of listeners do
we have? This is from Instagram from me underscore Butterfly,
underscore girl, and I appreciate this because I've just found
my new hobby. Oh what are you even doing right now?
I'm bopping around a field with a horse named Sue,
checking milkweed for monarch butterfly eggs and caterpillars. Ooh, Crazing

(01:18:32):
butterflies was a COVID lockdown escape for me.

Speaker 1 (01:18:35):
Why did think you do that? You didn't either, Jesus.

Speaker 2 (01:18:39):
I could wander afield far from anyone else. I feel
like this is She's like Nicole Kidman right now, far
from anyone else and find some beauty. As of today,
I have successfully released nearly four hundred.

Speaker 3 (01:18:49):
Monarchs and counting.

Speaker 1 (01:18:51):
Oh my god, congratulations. Cut to the crow that sweeps
in and just eats seven of them as.

Speaker 3 (01:18:58):
That's my fault because I keep feeding the crows in
your neighborhood.

Speaker 1 (01:19:02):
Oh my god, it's not beautiful, very important work.

Speaker 2 (01:19:06):
I've thought about getting a bee high for my backyard,
but I could do moths and butterflies instead.

Speaker 1 (01:19:10):
Do Is there anything that could bite you or staying
you more? Jesus? Okay, here's this one. This is from
Instagram also, and it's Kiss Underscore, my underscore Cartier Underscore
ten twenty one and it says, I'm on my thirty
five minute commute back home and can barely see through
the tears in my eyes. Listening to Karen speak about

(01:19:32):
George Dinning his story of black resilience and courage and
the faces of injustice has touched me deeply. Thank you
in the entire MFM team for showcasing black stories that
are oftentimes forgotten. They help propel me forward and show
that I stand on the shoulders of greatness. Thanks again,
Oh my god, I mean that's beautiful. That's it goes

(01:19:56):
perfectly hand in hand with Lisa Michelle, who said, what
are you even doing right now? Overthinking everything I said
yesterday and we'll say today and possibly tomorrow. Hey me, too.
We have the same hobby. My god, that's crazy. I've
been raising that in my backyard this whole time. Self doubt,

(01:20:17):
cultivate it. It's all kinds of experiences people could be
having while they listen to this podcast. Why don't you
tell us what you're doing? Please? We want to know.

Speaker 3 (01:20:24):
I bet it's something mundane or awesome. Either way.

Speaker 1 (01:20:28):
You contain multitudes.

Speaker 3 (01:20:29):
You do, we do. We're here for it.

Speaker 1 (01:20:31):
That was fun. I'm so excited we're back in the studio.

Speaker 2 (01:20:34):
Me too. I need more comfortable seating though, I like,
wore a cute dress today, we're sitting in chairs and
I just like my feet need to be up up
where on anything.

Speaker 1 (01:20:45):
Where I don't know, Just like you have a dress lone.

Speaker 3 (01:20:48):
I can't sit like a lady for more than an hour.

Speaker 1 (01:20:51):
This is hard. But also, yeah, there's not a good
Maybe we get like plywood that pushes us forward.

Speaker 2 (01:20:59):
Yeah, like we're not Phoebe judge. We can't fucking all
be like professionals and shit.

Speaker 1 (01:21:04):
Yeah stop asking us too. We've been zooming for almost
five years and now now we're back. I'm missing a
lot of cats in here too. There's very little animal hair.
We should bring bags from home and sprinkle it around. Done,
and then oh, should we rollo tape of Frank barking? Oh?

Speaker 3 (01:21:23):
Absolutely, we need that. It's necessary part of this podcast.

Speaker 1 (01:21:26):
Oh and then also stay sexy.

Speaker 3 (01:21:28):
And don't get murdered.

Speaker 5 (01:21:31):
Back Elvis, do you want a cookie?

Speaker 1 (01:21:42):
This has been an exactly right production. Our senior producer
is Alejandra Keck. Our managing producers Hannah Kyle Crichton.

Speaker 3 (01:21:48):
Our editor is Aristotle Acevedo.

Speaker 1 (01:21:51):
This episode was mixed by Leanna Scuillacchi. Our researchers are
Maren mcclashan and Ali Elkin. Email your hometowns to my
Favorite Murder at gmail dot com. The show on Instagram
and Facebook at my Favorite Murder and Twitter at my
favee Murder Boyebye

Speaker 4 (01:22:09):
M