8 - Eight Is Enough Murders

This weeks topic is weird ways to die including cursed movies and the Coronado Mansion Death. Plus a ton of personal anecdotes from K&G and a hometown murder from Mr. Georia Hardstark, Vince Averill.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:19):
And begin here we go here, we are you ready
to talk about murder? Because we are because we were murderers.

Speaker 2 (00:28):
Hey, Hey, everybody, Hey this Tata, guys, Karen and Georgia.
This is my favorite murder.

Speaker 3 (00:36):
That's probably the most uncomfortable part for me is when
we're talking not to each other but to the audience.

Speaker 2 (00:41):
It's very unnatural.

Speaker 1 (00:42):
So we're like introducing something and like, clearly we haven't
rehearsed this at all.

Speaker 3 (00:47):
And have No, we don't have any radio experience. We're
not professionals in that way.

Speaker 1 (00:51):
Hello everyone, Yeah, words like you say a word and
then I say a word, and we'll go back and forth.
My seeing men and yes, exactly say by men in No,
that's how good we are at this. We don't have
any kind of instinct toward what the other person's doing,
and we always guess wrong.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
Yeah, and we talk over each other. It's perfect. There
we are. And yet, and yet we.

Speaker 1 (01:12):
Have a thousand people on the Facebook.

Speaker 3 (01:15):
Group, one thousand you know, this is episode eight. That's
a very high number.

Speaker 2 (01:19):
And none of them are sexist, racist trips.

Speaker 3 (01:21):
Yet I hear Now, I'm not on Facebook brag brag brads,
I know, but from what I hear from Georgia.

Speaker 2 (01:27):
Everyone is the coolest on our Facebook page.

Speaker 1 (01:29):
They're all like, there's all these people that feel like
they've come home and they can finally talk to someone
about murder and like because like their husbands and siblings
and everyone thinks they're fucking weirdos for being in a
murder and then suddenly they found their people.

Speaker 2 (01:43):
God bless you all.

Speaker 1 (01:44):
Someone even said, hey, and anyone in the New York
area want to have a murder meetup, And I'm like,
that's how you get murdered. Don't do that, But that's
very sweet of you.

Speaker 3 (01:52):
Yeah, that's easy to misinterpret in any direction. It can
either be murder everybody or have a murder meetup and
then just murders getting murdered.

Speaker 2 (02:02):
I would just be super clear with the wording in
that meetup.

Speaker 1 (02:04):
I'd also like to say that we have nothing to
do with anyone who gets murdered because of this podcast.

Speaker 2 (02:10):
We deserve the right to not be culpable yep.

Speaker 3 (02:14):
Into perpetuity exactly. Those are two legal words that I know.
That was legal as fuck. It felt pretty great. We
have a We had a murder meet up today lunch
before this recording.

Speaker 2 (02:24):
We both had eggs.

Speaker 1 (02:26):
It's pretty nice, and talked about like about the Simpson Show,
which we're calling the Simpsons.

Speaker 3 (02:31):
The new Simpsons OJ the People versus O. J. Simpson,
and we talked about that extensively.

Speaker 2 (02:36):
I feel like I could talk about it forever.

Speaker 1 (02:38):
I do too.

Speaker 2 (02:38):
I mean, they are killing it. Literally, it's so great.
It's so great.

Speaker 3 (02:43):
And I was telling Georgia that Patton oswaldt everyone's favorite
stand up comedian, is now on Twitter actively praising Sarah
Paulson for her performance as Marshall Clark.

Speaker 2 (02:52):
Nothing makes me happier. Do you think his.

Speaker 1 (02:54):
Wife is a little built, like, get off of my
fucking this is my my murder is my thing, and
you're kind of stepping out my toes right now, like
if she were going.

Speaker 2 (03:02):
To be have a stand up comedian all of a sudden,
I you know what I picture.

Speaker 3 (03:06):
Michelle McNamara is just always in the other room with
her sleeves rolled up, trying to solve crime in real life.

Speaker 2 (03:11):
And that's why she's my hero. She is such a
bad ass. She's like, you can tweet.

Speaker 3 (03:15):
Whatever you want because I'm in the real world.

Speaker 2 (03:18):
That's adorable.

Speaker 1 (03:19):
I'm being a fucking investigative journalist over here.

Speaker 3 (03:22):
Don't talk about your murder show that happened twenty five
years ago, right that people from American Horror Story are
acting out now, Yeah, it's adorable, Okay.

Speaker 1 (03:31):
Is there any little part of your brain that is
like open to the idea that OJ didn't do it?

Speaker 2 (03:36):
No, Okay, just making.

Speaker 3 (03:38):
Sure I understand why people think that and want to
believe it.

Speaker 2 (03:44):
But I don't think that you can.

Speaker 3 (03:46):
Beat your wife up for years and homers and I
think you beat his first wife up too. Yeah, like
you that as a pattern and as a as a
you having explosive anger and violent reactions to things. Plus
we all are starting to learn the concussion elements in football.

Speaker 2 (04:03):
Sure that lots.

Speaker 3 (04:05):
Of football players have these problems that could truly stem
back to like mental issues, rage issues. I don't think
that that just kind of stops at a certain point, Like, yeah,
I don't.

Speaker 2 (04:15):
I don't think that's a controllable thing.

Speaker 1 (04:17):
Or all of those things happen and then just some
stranger comes and kills these two people. That, Yeah, it
doesn't It wouldn't make sense, right, especially with all the evidence.

Speaker 3 (04:26):
There would be blood evidence that would have they I
honestly believe that that defense team that was just going
to town would have found other blood and been like,
what about this guy? Yeah, because that's they were doing.
They were scrambling and they got him off. I mean,
like incredible, it's an it's amazing. So if they if

(04:47):
there was another person, I trust that that dream team
would have been like, here's the person, here's their name,
here's their blood.

Speaker 2 (04:55):
Like that's why we think that. Yeah, that's that's a
very good point.

Speaker 3 (04:58):
Yeah, okay, But also I know there's just bias because
I really love the fact that I lived through it
and now I'm watching it on TV.

Speaker 1 (05:05):
I know, isn't It's funny when they like they'll be
like a dramatic turn and you're like, oh, you're like
wait no, he still gets off, like you know the outcome,
you know the end. Yeah, but yet it's still a
great That's that's the testament to the show is that
it's so good.

Speaker 3 (05:19):
Yeah, and they're telling you the things you don't know
about it, right, which I love.

Speaker 1 (05:22):
Is the only part of it that I am not
into is is O J.

Speaker 2 (05:27):
Simpson? Like what's his name as O J. Simpson?

Speaker 1 (05:30):
Yeah, he doesn't look right, he doesn't. I can't picture
O J. Simpson when I look at him right for
so many reasons. Someone just texted me that they saw
Tracy Morgan when he talked when cup a good and
junior dog.

Speaker 2 (05:43):
Like like Cuba is playing Tracy Morgan? Who's playing oj? Oh? Oh,
you know what I mean? But somewhere in there Tracy
Morgan is well, very few men look like O J. Simpson.

Speaker 1 (05:53):
That would have been a really hard thing to cast.
I think, Yeah, I guess, I just I wish someone
was he was bigger. You know, who should have played it?
Who's that Criminal minds Oh? He used to be on
a soap opera.

Speaker 3 (06:08):
And the reason I know him so well is because
when I worked on the Ellen Degener's talk show, anytime
there'd be somebody would drop out, like if there was
an emergency, they would always call Shamar Moore because he
was an amazing guest. He was usually available because he
was on Criminal Mind, so he's always in town, and
because he was on a soap opera, he had the
crazy high Q rating, so we'd get spikes in our

(06:30):
ratings even though he wasn't like famous famous.

Speaker 2 (06:32):
Yes, just like beloved. Wow.

Speaker 1 (06:34):
Yeah, yeah, I would like to see who was on
that audition list and if Cuba Good Journey just got
picked because for whatever reason, Well, because he is a
good actor. Yes, and like those times where he's in
jail and.

Speaker 3 (06:46):
Like, yeah, there's great he's pathetic moments, but yeah, he
just doesn't look right.

Speaker 1 (06:50):
Yeah, he has this great you feel bad for him
because he clearly doesn't understand what's going on.

Speaker 2 (06:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (06:57):
I like that character he's playing, but it doesn't feel
like Simpson to me.

Speaker 2 (07:01):
Right, well, because there's too much.

Speaker 3 (07:02):
Yeah, he seems bewildered and confused, which might be an
act that like there's a reveal later, right, but it's
I want to see someone that's a little more going
with the story he's being given. Yeah, knowing that he's
he has an out after having.

Speaker 2 (07:19):
Killed two people.

Speaker 1 (07:20):
Yeah, but maybe that's just my agenda. No, I think
that's true. And I feel like that's this week and
The Simpsons, Like we open every episode now with.

Speaker 2 (07:31):
Everyone's watching exactly the idea that you've decided to call
it the Simpsons. It's my favorite thing of all time.
Should we talk about our favorite murder?

Speaker 1 (07:43):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (07:43):
So this week we were doing Strange Ways to Die.

Speaker 1 (07:46):
Yeah, originally we were gonna we just shot out the
idea we weird murder weapons, Yes, and I just like, look,
I like googled that, and it's just like really boring stories,
lots of.

Speaker 3 (07:59):
One of which I'm interested in, like crime is a
Passion where a woman kills a man with the stiletto heel,
where it's like.

Speaker 2 (08:05):
Well, yeah, but that's just crimes of past exactly.

Speaker 1 (08:08):
There was a good one of a guy who is
like clearly grooming a ten year old boy to be
like his just gonna child molast him. Yeah, and the
guy the kid one day was like fuck this and
took a pickle jar and smashed him over the head
with it.

Speaker 2 (08:21):
But then he stabbed him to death.

Speaker 1 (08:22):
So it's not like the pickle jar killed him, right,
you know, it just stopped him for a second. Yeah,
And that's the amount of the story I could, like,
that's the story, so I would have had no story
to tell.

Speaker 3 (08:31):
Well, yeah, there's when it comes down to it. I
was thinking, oh, I bet I could find a serial
killer killed people with like a boat.

Speaker 2 (08:38):
And arrow or something. Right, that's just in the movies.

Speaker 3 (08:40):
But yes, exactly, when you're when you're reverse researching stuff
like that, just stuff comes up. I was also thinking
of hope there's gonna be there's a person I want
to talk about in the future. Who is the Sacramento
vampire killer. Ah right, it's so creepy. But when he
actually killed people, he just killed them with guns exactly.
So it all boils down to boring weapons.

Speaker 1 (09:01):
Listen, if you're a killer out there, you gotta get
a little more creative if you want to make it
onto this show.

Speaker 2 (09:05):
Yeah, I'm how about you do one of those like
in mm hmm. Do you know what I'm talking? I know,
Are you wanting to fire? John?

Speaker 1 (09:13):
No? I always do that when I think I know
the end of a story.

Speaker 3 (09:17):
Yes, John Malkovich makes a gun out of wood so
that he can he gets to the metal detector.

Speaker 2 (09:22):
Na oh, really makes a gun gun? Yeah, that's cool.

Speaker 4 (09:25):
Now.

Speaker 1 (09:25):
I was going to say in in uh one or
he I can't remember, he kills people with the cow
air gun.

Speaker 2 (09:36):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (09:36):
Oh no country, no country for old men, Thank you
the best. That's yeah, something like that someone.

Speaker 2 (09:43):
Needs to not do to us. That movie is so
fucking perfect.

Speaker 1 (09:47):
I've seen that so many times. It's gorgeous, and I
don't like movies gorgeous and the idea that you would use. Yeah,
it's so fucked up. It's so fucked up, and it's
like not necessary because guns, because guns.

Speaker 2 (10:01):
Yeah, all right, do you want me to go first
since you went first? Lost? Sure? But what if we
have the same one? Well, I would be shocked because
here's what I did. Okay.

Speaker 1 (10:10):
Oh wait, So so the topic is now weird ways
people have been killed or died.

Speaker 3 (10:15):
Yes, okay, So here's how I'll just take you down
my thought process murder journey this week. So last week,
when we were talking about OJ Simpson, we start talking
about Dominic Dunn, right.

Speaker 2 (10:26):
Which I fucked up and said you got killed Roc.

Speaker 3 (10:28):
We both did, because I immediately agreed with you. But
here's the thing. So I and we once talked about this.
We were going to have a correction session when we
go through because a bunch of people tweeted us at
us to say, ye, dominiqu Dunn was killed by her
ex boyfriend who was stalking her, but who wasn't killed
by a fan. You are thinking of Rebecca Scheffer from
my sister Sam exactly.

Speaker 2 (10:45):
That's exactly true.

Speaker 3 (10:46):
It's what we were I thought of the exact same thing,
and I was right there with you now, so I
want to look it up to be like, Okay, here's
going to be our correction. Well it turns out that
it was. They were very very similar murders. There were
both actresses. Dominique Dunn was twenty two, Rebecca Schaeffer was
twenty one, both.

Speaker 2 (11:06):
Murdered at their homes.

Speaker 3 (11:08):
Dominique Dunn was murdered by her ex boyfriend who was
stalking her and who she was trying to be like
reasonable with. And she actually the creepy thing to me
about her murder is that she was doing everything she
could to stay safe and there was a guy she
had her friend over watching TV with her when the
ex boyfriend showed up wanting to quote unquote talk to
her and made her come out on the porch. And

(11:30):
so the guy was like waiting inside thinking everything was.

Speaker 2 (11:32):
Fun because they're outside.

Speaker 3 (11:34):
They're outside talking. Then he doesn't see them. Then he
goes out around back to see if they went into
the backyard. Finally comes around front and sees the ex
boyfriend standing over her strength.

Speaker 2 (11:44):
He has strangled her to death.

Speaker 1 (11:45):
How are you how do you know if someone's going
to be like a stalker light.

Speaker 2 (11:50):
Or is it a murderer.

Speaker 3 (11:52):
I mean, I think the lesson more slowly learning is
that like, if you have an abusive boyfriend, you have
to break up with him and not get back together
with him, not like you have to cut him out of.

Speaker 2 (12:00):
Your life completely because that's the mistake.

Speaker 3 (12:05):
I mean not to say that she made a mistake,
but she did get back together with him once and.

Speaker 1 (12:09):
Give them, You give to the ideas and an opening
to be back to think that he's back in your
life and has a way to do it, and he's
just yeah that he can convince you and he doesn't stop,
which is clearly not the woman's fault. No, but we
need to be able to not let them come back
in our lives at all.

Speaker 3 (12:24):
Well, And in both of these cases it's that thing
of women being polite, women thinking they're afraid to be
a bit or they're afraid to make a strong stand.
So in Rebecca Shaeffer's case, it was a stalker been
stalking her for three years and you ended up hiring
a private investigator to find her home address. And so
that was actually after her murder. Between that and the

(12:47):
Teresa Saldonna attack which she didn't die that was the
woman who's the co star of Raging Bull who ended
up getting attacked by her stalker.

Speaker 2 (12:55):
That's both of those. It ended up changing.

Speaker 3 (12:59):
They created the first anti stocking law in California and
in ten ninety, I believe because of those two things.

Speaker 2 (13:05):
Amazing.

Speaker 3 (13:05):
But those two things were totally parallel. They were just
seven years apart, but they were almost exactly the same.
So I was because I was like, we both made
the exact same mistake. That's weird, and so I wanted
to like look into it. And that brought me down
the road. Because Dominique Dune is most famous for being
a part.

Speaker 2 (13:25):
Of Cursed Movies. She poultry guys.

Speaker 3 (13:28):
Yes, she was the teenage sister and Poulter.

Speaker 1 (13:31):
Guys ah when she flips off the fucking construction workers
in her backyard. And I was a kid, I was like,
I want to be like that when I grow up.

Speaker 3 (13:39):
Yes, And both of those girls were very like there
were girls that when you watched them on TV and movies,
you were like I know that girl, yeah, like total
girl next door.

Speaker 2 (13:47):
Yeah. So I went into cursed movies curse movie things.
So that's my thing. That's not what I did. That's badass. Okay.
So Poulster Guys, the trilogy of movies.

Speaker 3 (13:59):
They've had all these deaths and tragedies associated with the movie.

Speaker 2 (14:04):
Love this show.

Speaker 3 (14:04):
So I'm just gonna walk you on through. And then
I have two other ones. Get shorter, they go, no,
I dig it. Let me start with Poltergeist. So Dominic
Dunn was murdered five months after the release of Poulter
Guys one, the original Poulter Guys.

Speaker 2 (14:18):
Okay, and then Poulter Iceed two.

Speaker 3 (14:23):
Julian Beck was the guy that played Caine, that super
creepy preacher, and he died of stomach cancer at age
sixty right after that movie came out. And that was
to eighty three. That was Poltergeist two. I'm eighty three.

Speaker 2 (14:41):
Yeah, how did I watch that? Okay, what do you mean?
Because I just remember I feel like.

Speaker 1 (14:47):
I remember seeing it in the theater, but I must
not have because I was that's.

Speaker 3 (14:49):
Too young for me. Yeah, well there was three of them. Yeah,
I just seen part three where they were in the
apartment building.

Speaker 1 (14:56):
No, maybe we got it on VHS. Oh, okay, okay,
go on.

Speaker 3 (15:00):
Then in nineteen eighty seven, Will Sampson, who played in
Poltergeist who played Taylor, the medicine man, who was the
big silent Indian in One.

Speaker 2 (15:09):
Flo Over the Cucaos. Oh yeah, he's incredible. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (15:12):
He died of sclera scleroderma, which is a generative, uh
chronic degenerative condition that basically he ended up like having
kidney failure and all this stuff.

Speaker 2 (15:24):
So he died and he was only fifty three.

Speaker 1 (15:26):
Man, there's just like so many ways you can die,
like if you if you want to think about it
a lot, there's just there's all these things.

Speaker 2 (15:33):
There's all these things.

Speaker 3 (15:33):
If it's not murdered, then it could be a disease,
it could be some weird gene just clicks on.

Speaker 2 (15:38):
It's not could have it's gonna. Well, here's doesn't really
what it is. We're all taking time, Okay, go on.

Speaker 3 (15:46):
Then the one that got this idea of this movie
is cursed going is Heather or Work because she died
when she was twelve years old. It was nineteen eighty seven,
the same year as will Sampson, and it was before
the release and they some people say before the ending
of the shooting of Poultry Guys three.

Speaker 2 (16:06):
So she was the little girl. But she's like the
main character in Polter Geys.

Speaker 1 (16:09):
She's in the middle of shooting, yeah, locked on, she's
halfway through shooting the third.

Speaker 3 (16:15):
One, yes, I think more than halfway through her but
they some people say they can't get it confirmed that
there's a body double for the rest of the show
because she died and it was they had diagnosed her
as having Chrome's disease, but what she actually really had
was a bowel obstruction, So she got the flu, went
into septic shock and then cardiac arrest. They rush her

(16:38):
to I think it was Cedar Sinai. She died on
the operating table.

Speaker 2 (16:43):
So that's like a simple thing that could have been fixed.

Speaker 3 (16:45):
Yes, and she was just misdiagnosed so's and she's only twelve.
So that's when everyone started freaking out that there's something
wrong with this, like her whole movie is cursed. Then
a guy named Lou Perryman who played a small part
in the first Polster Guys Pugsy, he was in two
thousand and nine. He was murdered by an axe wielding

(17:08):
X con who broke into his apartments.

Speaker 1 (17:10):
My god, just flat out horribly murdered. Why him specifically
or it just happened that way?

Speaker 3 (17:16):
They think it was just somebody trying to rob him,
but he like the guy had an axe and then
just ended up killing it. Or it was because he's
the movie, or it was a curse movie and it
was just a man possessed.

Speaker 2 (17:25):
By a demon. It's crazy, Okay.

Speaker 3 (17:27):
Then Richard Lawson, who played the para parapsychologist Ryan in
the original, I liked him. Yeah, he's and he's been.
When I looked on his Wikipeda page, it just went
on and on. He has been in a million things
and he still is like up until like twenty sixteen,
like release pending, like he's.

Speaker 2 (17:46):
Been in everything.

Speaker 3 (17:47):
Yeah, and he was on He was in a commercial
airline crash where there were fifty one people passengers on
the plane. Twenty seven of them died and he walked away.
So more than half the people on the plane died
and miraculously he walked away. So that kind of is like,
you know, it's you know, say a tragedy associated but

(18:08):
it almost this kind of like, well that freak accident.
It's a freak accident that he didn't die in, So
it's almost like, well, maybe he ended the curse.

Speaker 2 (18:15):
If I were him, I would never leave the house.

Speaker 3 (18:18):
Well, but or would it be that thing where I
survived a fucking plane crash that other people didn't.

Speaker 2 (18:24):
That's true, I'm invincible or whatever.

Speaker 3 (18:26):
That's but also turned out and Joe Beth Williams talked
about this in an interview.

Speaker 2 (18:31):
She did once, but she found out after.

Speaker 3 (18:34):
So you know that huge crazy scene at the end
where they fallen, that they fall into the pool and
there's all the skeletons.

Speaker 2 (18:41):
Those were real human.

Speaker 1 (18:42):
Skeletons that they used, because apparently that a rubber skeleton
remake is more expensive than just using real ones.

Speaker 2 (18:51):
Gave them skeletons and they.

Speaker 3 (18:53):
Probably bought them from prop house or whatever. But a
lot of people think that that has something to do
sure with it.

Speaker 2 (18:59):
But then also.

Speaker 3 (19:02):
They say that the remake that they just came out
with my boyfriend Sam rockwell that they shot it on
a house that had a big field behind it so
they could kind of like recreate all that stuff. And
apparently they couldn't get any of the electronics stuff to
work in this field. They couldn't get they they were

(19:23):
using drones to shoot overhead shots and the drones wouldn't work,
they wouldn't register the field again, I'm getting kills. Yeah,
so there was like there was a thing where there's
all kinds of problems and weird shit going on on
that set.

Speaker 1 (19:36):
Oh my god, I'm gonna throw up right now.

Speaker 2 (19:39):
Well then that brought me around.

Speaker 3 (19:41):
That brought me to a Cracked article, which, if you
don't go on to cracked dot com is crazy the
best website. It gives you listicals, but they're written so hilarious,
and it's like BuzzFeed for smart, funny people.

Speaker 1 (19:54):
Yeah, and it's like the topics I do are just
absolutely incredible, like the ten scariest mysteries that are cannot
be explained, or like oh I love.

Speaker 3 (20:02):
Crafts, or like ten ten YouTube videos that are actually
what they say, they are truly scary and crazy.

Speaker 2 (20:09):
Right.

Speaker 3 (20:09):
Yeah, Cracked is amazing. So that's that led me to
this list, and they had it was like six cursed
movie sets. But I only did because the next one
that that turned me on to was the Exorcist.

Speaker 1 (20:21):
Oh shit, which it makes you know, yeah, like oh,
it makes sense that this is Yeah, it's not like
it's not like my Fair Lady was cursed. It's like
fucked up movies like the Exorcist.

Speaker 2 (20:32):
And this one's crazy. Oh my god, I want to hear.
I don't know this.

Speaker 3 (20:35):
So it's just just was shot in nineteen seventy three
or came out in nineteen seventy three. It's shot the
year before. Okay, I'll just start here. The shooting was
delayed after the set caught fire. So there's a set
of their house. If you've seen the movie. If you
haven't seen the movie, you have to. It's the scariest movie.
It's so seventies and it's so like it's not scary

(20:56):
because things are popping out. Like it gets scary obviously
later when she possessed, but in the beginning it's just
all tone and feel what it's.

Speaker 2 (21:03):
Like lighting, lighting and music and yeah. Tone.

Speaker 3 (21:07):
And when they bring Reagan to the hospital to see
what's wrong with her, there's a part where she's in
like this MRI machine thing that is one of the
scariest things, and it's just medical equipment. There's nothing actually happening,
but it's like, you know, they just did it perfect.

Speaker 1 (21:21):
No, man, they don't need drones to make a fucking
movie cool anymore, right, I mean, so.

Speaker 2 (21:27):
This set caught on fire for no reason.

Speaker 3 (21:30):
The only thing that they can figure out was They
thought maybe a pigeon landed in like the breaker boxes,
like the a electrical box, but other than that, they
couldn't figure out a reason why would catch on fire.
And the only room that didn't burn was Reagan's room,
just where all the possession demonics shit takes place.

Speaker 2 (21:48):
At the end of the movie. I'd quit the movie
at that point.

Speaker 3 (21:50):
It didn't didn't burn. Everything else in the house burned.
That's just insane. So shooting was delayed because of that then,
and I read a couple a couple different versions of
this story, but the one that seemed the most consistent
was that it happened to Ellen Burston. So there's a
scene where when Reagan is totally possessed, she throws her
mother against the wall, and in the movie, she gets

(22:13):
thrown against the wall, falls down, and there's this blood
curdling scream. Well it's because Ellen Burston. The way it happened,
she like broke her spine and the scream is real.

Speaker 2 (22:23):
Oh, I hate.

Speaker 1 (22:24):
I feel like there's like a scene of Jaws too.
I feel like in the seventies and eighties they were like,
let's just use it. We like didn't do that right,
and the person is screaming because they're in pain.

Speaker 3 (22:32):
Exactly, and this is like what better kind of blood
curdling scream as opposed to like somebody standing in his
set recording.

Speaker 2 (22:38):
Yeah, like screaming. It's when they're like, I'll scream of
her spine break.

Speaker 1 (22:42):
And they're like, it's realistic because it's real because it happens.

Speaker 2 (22:45):
God, that's awful.

Speaker 3 (22:46):
And also this was one of the first movies that
ever used subliminal message subliminal recordings.

Speaker 2 (22:52):
That's so awesome.

Speaker 3 (22:53):
Part of the other reason that it's such a freaky
movie is because subliminally they're playing tapes of bees, of
ms of bees buzzing bees and lions growling like before
they eat something.

Speaker 1 (23:05):
So like in your in your like your brain, in
your old brain, you like understand you can.

Speaker 3 (23:10):
Hear these like emergency, emergency, get out. And it's like
in the in their lead up parts.

Speaker 1 (23:15):
I love that it's not even like subliminally like a
baby crying or like subliminally someone getting stabbed. It's like
subliminate shit that way back when when we were fucking animals.

Speaker 3 (23:25):
Yes, we needed to be afraid of run away, run away.

Speaker 2 (23:28):
There's bees.

Speaker 3 (23:28):
Yeah, and Also, there's that part where when Kara sees
his mother coming up out of the side, out of
the sidewalk, out of the subway. It's that part where
she had died and he didn't see her, and he
has all this guilt and he keeps dreaming about her
coming and like crying for her him across the street
or whatever. In that scene. And I've actually watched it

(23:49):
and paused it. They just flick in for half a second,
this horrifying face. No, yeah, and you can look it
up online. It's a great It's like, it looks like
a really white face with dark black circles underneath and
red red in the eyes and red in the mouth.

Speaker 2 (24:06):
It's horrifying, almost a crying right now.

Speaker 3 (24:08):
It's crazy creepy, Okay, So so then let's see. Oh
so the actor who played the director, so the plot
of the movie said, Ellen Verson's an actress and she's
in this movie, and so all the shit starts happening
while she's in this movie, and she just to quit
the movie. Well, the director of the movie is played
by an actor named Jack mcgowran, who died days after

(24:31):
completing his scenes of the Flu and he was fifty
four so just kind of strangely, randomly just dies of
the flu. The woman who plays Kris's mother who is
in that thing of like, she's an eighty nine year
old Greek woman who literally got cast like I think
out of a restaurant, a Greek restaurant or something. She

(24:53):
died of natural causes, like days after Jack mcgowran died. Wow,
within like six days of each other. And they're the
two characters in the movie who die.

Speaker 2 (25:04):
Oh oh, so then.

Speaker 3 (25:10):
Then there's these are the other like tragedies and death.
Linda Blair's grandfather died while shooting. Max bon Sido's brother
died on the first day he started shooting, and he
plays the old priest that comes to Father carras Jason Miller,
who plays Father carras his son was hit and almost
killed by a motorcycle during shooting Jesus Mercedes McCambridge. I

(25:34):
think that's how you pronounce her last name. Did the
voice of the demon when Linda Blair is you know,
possessed In nineteen eighty seven, her son murdered his wife
and children and then killed himself.

Speaker 2 (25:49):
Whoa which is you know?

Speaker 3 (25:52):
Ten fifteen years after all of it, Yeah, still like
it's just the curse thing, whereas like, how many movies
can you say had this many? Likes like a crazy strategy,
some hideous things, yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:03):
And the best.

Speaker 3 (26:05):
At the premiere in Rome, they're at this theater and
across the street is a sixteenth century church and as
the people are filing into the movie premiere, a raam
storm and lightning storm starts going. Everyone's in the theater,
and before the movie starts, they hear this crazy noise outside.

Speaker 2 (26:24):
Lightning had struck the cross on top of this church.

Speaker 3 (26:28):
Now it had been there for four hundred years, and
this eight foot cross falls off the church and into
the plaza across.

Speaker 2 (26:36):
Shit. Yeah, that's not God being like nope.

Speaker 3 (26:39):
Yeah, or the devil being like how dare you?

Speaker 2 (26:42):
Yeah, how do you try to fight me? So that's so.
The last one is Rosemary's Baby.

Speaker 1 (26:46):
Oh I knew it because I was going to say
it sounds like the plot of Rosemary's Baby, which is that, like,
you know, the actor gets stricken with blindness to get
the role.

Speaker 2 (26:55):
Okay, yeah, so yeah, and.

Speaker 3 (26:57):
This is if you look it up, and there's you
can find plenty of because there's a bunch of other
ones and there's a really good one. But it's not
even curse. It's just there's that movie. I think it's
Genghis Khan. I don't remember what the title is, but
it's the John Wayne movie where they ended up they
shot like five miles downwind from where they were testing
a bombs in the desert. So everyone got cancer. Yeah,

(27:20):
every fucking buddy got cancer. And they took dirt from
the set where they shot like on a location, tested it,
and then they took it back and used it in
the studio set, So like.

Speaker 2 (27:33):
Every cancer fucking I love shit like that.

Speaker 3 (27:38):
I mean, you know, it's so terrible. It's just like
the worst mistake anyone's ever.

Speaker 1 (27:42):
Yeah, like that, that is the most toxic dirt. Yeah,
you don't want I thought you were gonna say they
tested it and they found that they found that it
was Nope, they used it. Nope, they brought it back
and used it.

Speaker 2 (27:51):
Yeah geez. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (27:52):
And also the also the the female lead in that
movie was.

Speaker 2 (27:56):
Attacked by a black panther.

Speaker 3 (27:58):
Sure, the real animal, not a political life.

Speaker 1 (28:01):
I figured I figured you would. I figured you wouldn't.
I figured something would be different in that saying yeahh
a real god attacked by panther.

Speaker 3 (28:08):
And now the funniest thing to me was that that
was like this one line thing, like I would like
to know more about.

Speaker 1 (28:13):
This, like where was she? What happened had the black
panther had for breakfast? Like I want to know everything?

Speaker 2 (28:18):
So insane.

Speaker 3 (28:19):
So on Rosemary's Baby, And this is a short one,
but just the man who was the composer died of
a brain clot a year after filming, which is the
same way a character in the movie dies.

Speaker 1 (28:29):
Didn't he die that way in the movie? Yes, Oh,
the composer of.

Speaker 3 (28:34):
The movie, real composer of the movie in real life,
died of a brain clot the way the guy in
the movie died. Sit And then, of course we all
know Roman Polanski, who bought the house from Terry Melcher,
who was a music producer who would not record Charles
Manson's music. And so Charles Manson sent his death hippies

(28:55):
up to murder everybody, thinking he was going to kill
Terry Melcher, and he ended up killing Roman Planky's wife,
Sharon Tate, her unborn baby, and four other people. J. S. Bring,
the famous hairdresser, and Polanski was in London at the time,
so he just by chance missed that.

Speaker 1 (29:12):
I didn't realize that there was a reason they went
to that house.

Speaker 2 (29:16):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (29:17):
I think I thought they just went there because wasn't
it the air to the the what was it the
coffee fortune that lived there soldiers? Oh yeah, I don't.

Speaker 3 (29:27):
I mean it was Roman Polanski's house though, I think, yeah,
I was there, she was.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
But I thought they went there to, like, because it
was rich people. I didn't realize they went there because
Manson was like you and Ewan, this is how he
talks you and.

Speaker 2 (29:38):
Record my music the Man the Mad. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (29:41):
Oh, I didn't know that reason. But then once they
were there there, they didn't care. They were just like,
were killing all these people.

Speaker 1 (29:46):
Right.

Speaker 3 (29:46):
But here's what I find interesting about that is that
that they called the Manson family called that helter Skelter,
that murder spree, which of course was a Beatles song.
And then John in nineteen Nady John Lennon was shot
in front of the Dakota the same apartment building used
is the exterior no of the apartment building for Rosemary's Baby.

Speaker 2 (30:08):
No, the end of my thing.

Speaker 1 (30:10):
I'm just gonna kick my glass of water over right
now because I can't even handle any of this. I'm
just gonna I just want to kick it.

Speaker 3 (30:16):
There's so many good things like that. But that's I mean,
I kind of went way off our theme.

Speaker 2 (30:20):
No, but there was a line.

Speaker 1 (30:21):
There was a it was a linear narrative how that
started with a murder, Yes, that we had talked about
before exactly, So I deemed that okay, thank you good.

Speaker 3 (30:30):
And also it makes me just want to say, we
love it when you tell us if we make mistakes, yeah,
because this conversation can be so dense. Yeah, shit, we're
talking about sometimes that Obviously I definitely make those mistakes
all the time.

Speaker 2 (30:43):
We want to hear it. If you're like, oh wait, no,
that's not.

Speaker 1 (30:45):
Right, and we're only i mean, Karen, I really only
researched the ones we're going to talk about. So if
we're just randomly going off in attengent about something else,
we're not gonna have like be looking it up at
the moment in the moment. Yes, it's called research, and
we're not doing it.

Speaker 2 (30:57):
So we want you to help us.

Speaker 3 (31:00):
And add because once I saw a couple of people
be like I remember very specifically when she was murdering stuff.
So then I was like, oh, yeah, we should tell
that story accurately. That then led me down that path.

Speaker 1 (31:12):
Just don't be mean about it, because we are we
have very fragile self esteems and we will just fall apart,
do you I mean? So, this is the murder of
hold On Rebecca Zachhu the how, the how?

Speaker 2 (31:27):
I'm going to say, what was the spelling? Z a
h Au?

Speaker 3 (31:32):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (31:32):
How Rebecca za how? And it's also called the Coronado
House Murder. Have you heard of this one?

Speaker 2 (31:39):
No? Okay, I'm going to start from the very beginning.
I'm going to start from the house murder.

Speaker 1 (31:43):
Yeah, this one's fucked up, this one, I've I think
I followed it as it was happening.

Speaker 2 (31:48):
Because this is what happens.

Speaker 1 (31:49):
First, the morning of July eleventh, two thousand and one,
six year old Max shack Now's next shack Now, six
years old, takes a fatal fall from the staircase banis
store in his historic San Diego mansion called Spreckel's Beach.

Speaker 2 (32:06):
House in Cornado, California.

Speaker 1 (32:07):
In San Diego, his father is a pharma pharmaceutical CEO
named Jonah shack Now, and the nine one one call
comes in from Jonah's thirty two year old living girlfriend
Rebecca Za How thirty two years old Burmese.

Speaker 2 (32:24):
She's a living she lives there.

Speaker 1 (32:25):
She calls nine to one one to say that Max
was running down the hallway above the lobby like entrance
to the house when he went over the banister. He
suffered spinal cord injuries and head trauma and was in
a coma. Ultimately, he dies ten days later from swelling
in cardiac arrest, and the medical examiner determined that the

(32:46):
cause of death was accidental.

Speaker 2 (32:48):
And there's if you go online, there's actually this.

Speaker 1 (32:50):
Like drawing of how he must have fallen and it's
like it's you know, like a mansion, spiral staircase, fucking
lots of you know, marble and wood, and he went
over the side. Yeah, okay, accidental. Okay, Well here's so,
while he's in a coma, Rebecca goes to pick up

(33:11):
shack Now's brother Adam at the airport, who's there to like,
you know, sit by his nephew's bedside. He flies in
from Memphis, and Adam, who's the CEO's brother, is staying
in the house in the in the back house while
he's there, and that night there was reports of really
loud music coming from the house that night. And while
Jonah the father is supposedly keeping a visual at Max's

(33:35):
bedside with Max's mom, Dina Romano and her sister Nina
Dina and Nina Huh, Adam is staying at the house
and Rebecca is as well.

Speaker 2 (33:47):
Okay, cut to the next morning.

Speaker 1 (33:49):
Yeah, So the next morning, at like six am, six
forty five am, Adam finds Rebecca's body. She's nude, hanging
by her neck from an outdoor back balcony. She her
wrists and ankles are bound, and she has a She's

(34:10):
gagged with a blue long sleeved t shirt wrapped around
her head with the sleeves double knotted and stuffed into
her mouth. There's like a residue on her on her
legs that looks to be like tape residue, and she's bound.
She's hanging by her neck and her let's see it
on the bedroom door where she had jumped out of supposedly,

(34:31):
because here's the thing the coroner ruled as a fucking suicide. Yeah,
that's this is the this is the thing, Like, this
is the murder. I really think that Max it was accidental.
And then this was vengeance. This might have been vengeance
a suicide. And on the on the the bedroom door,

(34:52):
someone had written in black paint. She saved him. You
can save her? Or can you save her? She say him,
can you save her? What does that mean? Nobody knows.
There were four instances of head trauma, but ultimately she
died from hanging, so he deemed it a suicide, and

(35:14):
the addressing the blood on her legs because there was
also blood on her legs. The forensic pathologists identify the
cause as either a menstrual period or a intra uterine device,
which is like the most insulting, but that's also.

Speaker 2 (35:29):
Yeah, I mean, what are the odds? Yeah, right, although.

Speaker 3 (35:35):
You know, if it's a really bad period, you might
just want to kill yourself. Sorry, terrible.

Speaker 1 (35:40):
Yeah, or if you're right, I'm like baffled, right, Yeah,
it's this is a baffling case, which is why I
love it so much.

Speaker 2 (35:45):
And I remember, I remember the kid.

Speaker 1 (35:46):
I remember the news report of the kid falling, and
then two days later this girl, this woman. So doctor
Maurice Godwin, a private forensic consultant, told a reporter that
zah Howe's death had all the airs of our quote
ritualistic killing, and that the suicide had been staged.

Speaker 2 (36:05):
Uh, she's fucking bounding gag.

Speaker 1 (36:07):
In doctor Godwin's opinion, someone had dazed Zaha with a
blow to the head and then tossed her off the balcony.
So and of course, remember I said that they had
heard loud The neighbors had heard loud music coming from
the house that night, so maybe covering up scream screams
which they also the neighbor also heard.

Speaker 2 (36:23):
Oh really yeah.

Speaker 1 (36:25):
So that night, the night that she died, at ten
forty eight PMS, the Howe received a text message from
Nina Romano, the sister of the mother of Max, and
Nina stated that she wanted to stop by the house
and speak with to how about Max's accident and how
didn't reply to that message. The police said that she
checked her voicemail a few hours later and listened to

(36:47):
a message deleted it or it got deleted somehow, and
we have no idea what was on that message.

Speaker 3 (36:53):
So, according of all the things they can do, why
can't they find deleted messages?

Speaker 1 (36:57):
It seems like a simple you can find a deleted email, right.

Speaker 3 (37:01):
This is this, this is like the making of a
murderer thing.

Speaker 2 (37:04):
Yeah, that drives me crazy.

Speaker 1 (37:05):
Okay, which part like why didn't they find out what
was on? And those kids deleted the brother and the
ex boyfriends they lead it.

Speaker 3 (37:11):
Into her voicemail and then deleted stuff, and they're like, oh, well,
I guess it's gone forever where.

Speaker 2 (37:16):
It's like, how is that possible?

Speaker 1 (37:17):
It's impossible, especially if if someone is missing, You're not
gonna everything could be a clue. Why would you know
to find this you're missing loved one unless you know
what's going on and you deleted it on purpose? Right, yeah, totally.
But everyone's not a true crime fanatic like we are
those two. So according to ah, you know, forensic analysis,

(37:38):
the expert he determined a forensic expert, the note what
was written on the door was written by a right
handed mail and based on how high the door was,
the person was probably six feet tall. Rebecca was only
five three five foot three, and Adam, the brother it's
not was the only man in the mansion at the
time of Rebecca's death, And how is the whole is

(37:58):
probably six feet tall?

Speaker 2 (38:00):
Oh shit? You know?

Speaker 1 (38:01):
So according to the Generation Why podcast which they did
this on the subject, he had also spent the night,
you know, in that back house, specifically looking at Asian
bondage porn on his phone, which he is admitted to.

Speaker 2 (38:14):
Oh yeah, and she.

Speaker 1 (38:16):
Was Bermese beautiful by the way she I mean goes
without saying, but gorgeous woman. So here's some stuff from Reddit.
So that is how family is suing over wrongful death.

Speaker 3 (38:30):
Because it's that's the official report, like she committed shed.

Speaker 1 (38:34):
They've tried to reopen it and have them put a
different Uh, both both deaths have they have tried to
get a different cause of death like ruling, Yeah, and
neither of them have. It's happened. Okay, So they're suing
over wrongful death. And so here's some of the stuff
from the lawsuit. The clothes she'd been wearing before being

(38:55):
stripped and killed were never found, oh, which is like
if you're going to kill yourself, and why would strip
naked to kill yourself?

Speaker 2 (39:01):
That's for real?

Speaker 1 (39:02):
And then hang yourself in view of your neighbors, which
there's photos. You can see photos of her body on
the front lawn after this guy Adams supposedly cut her
down before he called nine one one.

Speaker 2 (39:11):
Oh no, why would you fucking do that?

Speaker 3 (39:13):
Also, why would you bind your own legs and arms
before you hang yourself?

Speaker 1 (39:18):
Yeah, well they said that it's been done before. It's
not out of the question. They had a they had
a reenactment to see if that's something they could do,
and technically, yeah, you can do it.

Speaker 2 (39:28):
It can be done.

Speaker 1 (39:29):
They had a woman bind herself, do all of these
things and hang herself. But why the you know, it
doesn't make any fucking sense.

Speaker 3 (39:37):
Only unless she was like into that specific kind of
bondage and this was some kind of like yeah, here's
my thing and now I'm on my way out.

Speaker 1 (39:44):
Well maybe it was I mean, maybe it's like here's
my thing and it was accidental. Maybe she was trying
to set up her ex, her boyfriend or the brother.

Speaker 2 (39:55):
But why would she kill herself.

Speaker 3 (39:57):
Because ultimately she's in question for this child's death, right,
so why would she be suddenly trying to set other
people up for murders?

Speaker 2 (40:05):
Totally? Doesn't she have hideous guilt a six year old die?

Speaker 1 (40:09):
Yeah, and she was she was supposed to be watching
him for sure, so she probably does feel a lot
of kills over it. And it sounds like the mom
and the sister were kind of crazy and like hounding
her about it. Yeah, no, one believed it was an accident.
But then so then you strip down by yourself, so
then you take a handful of pills and you're dead.

Speaker 2 (40:29):
Yeah you know. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (40:31):
And also I feel like she was also a Christian,
which doesn't mean that she wouldn't kill herself, but it
also there's some sort of shame there that you wouldn't
be naked in front of everyone. I feel like there's
kind of a bit of a what's the word, well,
you know, not.

Speaker 2 (40:45):
Being a naked.

Speaker 1 (40:46):
Person, you mean like body sham or like no, just
being demure.

Speaker 3 (40:52):
Oh yes, yeah, yea yeah, okay, So well because then
it makes it about a whole different thing.

Speaker 2 (40:56):
It's perverted all of a sudden.

Speaker 3 (40:57):
Yeah, if you're killing yourself because you're so sorry, yeah,
then you wouldn't be naked and bound in a sexual manner.

Speaker 1 (41:04):
And seems there's so there's floor, there's four blunt force
uh wounds to her head, which they argued on her
way down she hit her head on.

Speaker 2 (41:14):
The wall, which is like in post mortem post no.

Speaker 1 (41:17):
Like right as she's dying, as she's hanging herself, her
body flings into the wall four times and hard enough
to give her blunt force trauma.

Speaker 2 (41:26):
That's not going to happen.

Speaker 1 (41:28):
So the ties that bound her were nautical ties. And Adam,
the brother in the law suit, it says he's referred
to as being a sailor. Oh, this is all from Reddit,
so I didn't read this from directly from the case.
And the ties binding her the same paint from the
message on the door as did her nipples.

Speaker 2 (41:49):
Oh, the black paint. Okay.

Speaker 1 (41:52):
So the other thing is when she if she had
to jump out of the window with her full force,
the bed that.

Speaker 2 (41:58):
She had tied the rope too should have moved.

Speaker 1 (42:03):
Yeah, and it didn't move enough, which means either someone
was sitting on the bed holding it in place, someone
moved the bed back to where it should have been
for some reason.

Speaker 2 (42:14):
If she had actually jumped, it would have been heavier.

Speaker 1 (42:17):
She had mud on her feet, but there were no
footprints on the balcony. Why does she have mud on
her feet? I mean she was outside and the back
house running barefoot, right, but no fucking so someone clearly
picked her up and threw over the side of the
balcony if there was no footprints on the balcony, and
then there was a computer in her room that was

(42:39):
used after three am, which was later than the time
she would have already been dead, and no determination was
ever made as to who accessed it. So a lot
of people are saying that this is like, you know,
a wealthy man. They want to bury this. They don't
want to bring this to trial. The cops are corrupt.
It's a really wealthy neighborhood in San Diego. They determine

(43:01):
that her death is a suicide, and they're like, and
this is now, this is done, and yeah, question and
not only that, but they keep going like when there's
questions about how on earth could this have happened?

Speaker 2 (43:11):
Why would this have happened?

Speaker 1 (43:12):
Instead of saying like, well, we need to look into
that more because that doesn't make any sense as to
a suicide, they like give insane excuses as to like,
you know, well people have have killed themselves that way
in the past, or see like this woman was able
to do it in a recreation, so it must be
how it happened. And you know, no DNA means and
if she was hit over the head, she maybe was

(43:34):
stunted and there's no DNA because there was no fighting
between them. She never there's no defensive wounds because she
was immediately rendered unconscious. Yeah, you know, and then tie
the fuck up.

Speaker 3 (43:45):
Also, how do you bind yourself? So say, let's go
with that. Yeah, she bound herself crazily before she threw
herself over, So then your legs and arms are bound,
and then you still have to jump and get over
the belt. Yeah, whatever that thing is that she went over,
and but then paints a thing. If the paint is
on her yeah, when she's bound in on the ropes

(44:07):
and on her nipples, then she must have done that
after she painted the message. Right, bound painted a message
at five foot three that's up really hot.

Speaker 1 (44:18):
And that's not really a suicide note no that no
one really can understand what it means. So they're saying
that people have have bound themselves like that in the
past when they commit suicide.

Speaker 2 (44:32):
But I gott, I can't remember.

Speaker 3 (44:34):
It's gonna say, first of all, how many Yeah? One,
that's crazy, right, Yeah, one person is probably very interested
in that kind of bondage.

Speaker 1 (44:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (44:44):
Or it was like a sexual thing gone wrong, yeah,
get or.

Speaker 3 (44:47):
Gave them yeah, pleasure or relief something they were connected
in some way.

Speaker 2 (44:52):
Isn't that insane? And that's just that's it. Yeah, And
that was two days after the kid went over the railing.

Speaker 3 (44:58):
Well also the kid over the railing like in just
picturing it in my mind, knowing nothing about the actual setup.
When you're six, how tall are you fooling? And tall
at the most and if I mean so.

Speaker 1 (45:10):
You're not buying it. They say like, well, he must
have tripped. That's that is shady too, and they're saying that.
Later one of the coroners said that he it looked
like he had been not choked, but that someone had
maybe like tried to stifle his his mouth so he
wasn't yelling or something like that. So there could be
total foul play going on there too.

Speaker 3 (45:31):
Yeah, that would That makes the most sense to me,
is like some kind of killing of that child, whether
it was accidental or not or whatever. And then they
come back like ten times harder, Yeah you did this.

Speaker 1 (45:44):
Yeah, So even if that wasn't true that it was accidental,
they still would come back that way and they would
believe it because this is the new young pretty girlfriend
that this kid is living with dies under her fucking
supervision supervision, and so of course they're pissed and gonna
come after her.

Speaker 2 (46:03):
Yes, she's the ultimate villain. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (46:05):
Also she had to go get like in that before
she was murdered. After the kids in the hospital, the
brother comes into town and she's the one that's got
to go pick him up.

Speaker 1 (46:16):
She goes and gets him and then they go have dinner,
which I want to be like, well, who the fuck
is having dinner when this kid's in the hospital. But
then I mean, it's true, who the fuck is having dinner?
I want to know where they had dinner. But I've
been I had a bedside of someone dying, and you're like,
you have to eat, so you all go sit at
this place and have a quiet, uncomfortable, sad dinner. Like
that's that happens. It's not happened. It's not like they

(46:38):
went to fucking Chili's. Like who knows.

Speaker 3 (46:40):
But if you I just think if I was, if there,
I was babysitting a kid, a six year old who
then basically died under my care. I'm not driving to
the airport. Most people won't drive the airport anyway. Yeah, Like,
I'm not driving to the airport. I'm not going out
to dinner, no, like I would probably be on so
many pills, I would be in bed permanently.

Speaker 2 (47:00):
Yeah, me too.

Speaker 1 (47:01):
I mean, you're not wanted at the hospital because the
mother is there and she fucking hates your guts.

Speaker 2 (47:06):
And the family hates your guts.

Speaker 1 (47:08):
Probably anyway, take a fucking cab from the airport. Take
a cab or some other relatives. Oh you know what,
I'm sorry. She her sister was in town at that moment,
and so she had to take her sister to the airport.
Which still take a cab to the fucking airport.

Speaker 2 (47:21):
Why is she running errands for people?

Speaker 3 (47:23):
She must be in like okay, say she's a sociopath
and she killed a child. Yeah, that's the only thing
that makes sense to me to be like, sure, I'll
be there at eight to pick you up.

Speaker 1 (47:32):
Or she's in shock and she's doing everything she can
to be helpful because she just is like, let me
do what I can. Yeah, I guess, so maybe not,
I know.

Speaker 2 (47:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (47:42):
So it's just baffling, and it's really frustrating that nobody
seems to want to test for anything.

Speaker 3 (47:50):
Well, and if it's like pharmaceutical money, that's like she's
the most money all CEO of.

Speaker 1 (47:56):
A pharmaceutical company. That's all of the money in the world.

Speaker 3 (47:59):
That's all the money. And then he's like basically going
around it's a Coronado. Yeah, crazy rich part of San Diego.
So then it's just like those people already know, those.

Speaker 2 (48:10):
People she probably gives to the community to begin with.

Speaker 3 (48:14):
So they're just like, I've had a tragedy. Now she
killed herself. Can we just lay all this to rest. Yeah,
it's probably the storyline, right.

Speaker 1 (48:21):
Yeah, yeah, like no one's going to come back. This
is a tragedy all around. Let's just let it rest.

Speaker 2 (48:27):
And her poor like, is she like a first generation
for me?

Speaker 3 (48:31):
Yeah, so her poor parents are just like, can we
get a little something?

Speaker 2 (48:35):
Yeah, like nope.

Speaker 1 (48:36):
And everyone's saying, you know, the family's saying, that's not
her handwriting. She was not suicidal. Her sister spoke to
her that evening, not suicidal at all. Everyone's saying she
wasn't suicidal.

Speaker 2 (48:48):
Oh that is sinister. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (48:50):
And even her ex husband, who you would think would
hate her because she actually cheated on him with her
new boyfriend, is like trying to figure out what's happened
to her. He's not even like vengeful in any way.
I know, I want to know more about that brother, Like,
what's his deal? Yeah, no, there's no information about what
he does for a living.

Speaker 2 (49:07):
Who he is. He's from I believe Memphis. Yeah, he's
from Memphis.

Speaker 3 (49:12):
And it's kind of like I think we all know
people who have like the type of person who has
an insanely rich older brother. Yeah, it's basically like, well,
now I get to do.

Speaker 2 (49:21):
What I want. Yeah, totally, Maybe he keeps my life.

Speaker 1 (49:24):
He cut her down at six forty eight am and
sent and then sent a text message to his brother
to inform him over the news. I would love to
read that text message. Yeah, your girlfriend's dead.

Speaker 3 (49:35):
Text someone to say your wife is dead or Carl,
you call a minimum if not, drive down to the hospital.

Speaker 2 (49:42):
What the what? Yeah is happening this brother's sinister.

Speaker 1 (49:46):
I'm curious about the dad, the boyfriend, if he had
anything to do with it. Apparently he was sleeping at
the Ronald McDonald house that night because he was, you know,
by his kid's bedside the whole time, needed to sleep
a little bit, which is what the Ronald McDonald house
is for, and so he wasn't even near the house.

Speaker 2 (50:04):
And then the ex wife was also at the hospital.
Her sister was at the house.

Speaker 1 (50:10):
Her the wife ex wife was at the hospital with
the sister. There's you know, the speculation is that they
came over banging on the door to be let in.

Speaker 2 (50:19):
Rebecca wouldn't let them in.

Speaker 1 (50:20):
The message that was deleted might have been from Jonah
saying let them in.

Speaker 2 (50:24):
Oh, that was deleted, right, So if.

Speaker 1 (50:26):
They had that message saying let them in, then they
have proof that the that the women were there. But
there's no proof that they were there. I know, how
fucking crazy.

Speaker 3 (50:35):
Well, there's no proof that they were there, but no
one's looked for proof, right right, Yeah, looked just to
prove a suicide.

Speaker 1 (50:43):
It sounds to me like there's no proof that the
women were involved.

Speaker 2 (50:47):
It just it sounds correct.

Speaker 1 (50:50):
I think that this guy, the brother, is clearly and
it was either was it sexually motivated, it had nothing
to do with Max, and maybe she were buff his
advances and he got angry and killed her man.

Speaker 2 (51:07):
And made it look like it was revenge. There's a
lot of motives there.

Speaker 1 (51:10):
There's a lot of motives there and none of them
are being now. And then you know, it's one of
those things where like in your head it's like, oh,
she was so pretty, and they were rich and blah
blah blah. And then you look at the photos and
this kid is like a sweet little kid. This photo
of this kid Max who dies. Yeah, it's like the
same thing with John Maney. When you're like she was
a beauty you see a these beauty pageant photos and

(51:31):
then you see a photo of her like a normal person.

Speaker 2 (51:32):
You're like, oh, I was such a young person. It
was a baby.

Speaker 1 (51:36):
Well.

Speaker 3 (51:36):
And also when children die, people very justifiably go insane.
It makes sense, like any reaction, the idea that the
cops aren't going look, there's a massive loss here. Yeah,
the reaction off of this loss is understandable.

Speaker 1 (51:52):
Not yes, so I'd not you know, good or anything,
but going crazy.

Speaker 3 (51:58):
It's very clear motive. It's very logical motive.

Speaker 2 (52:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (52:02):
Yeah, and getting and hearing which they hadn't even heard yet.
It was accidental. They hadn't been told that yet because
that wasn't unt help. After he died, that that got ruled.
Those women and everyone else are probably like, this woman
is responsible. How the fuck did this happen? You should
have been watching him. She said she was in the
bathroom when it happened. She's like, you should be able

(52:22):
to leave a six year old alone long enough of
them not to do certain things. They say, like he
tripped over the dog, or he had he was on
his riding a scooter.

Speaker 2 (52:33):
Weird shit.

Speaker 3 (52:34):
You don't buy that either, And just that I know
I'm picturing it inaccurately because I don't know the truth.
And like when you trip and fall, you in your
six you're tripping what at the most two inches? Yeah,
you're you know, catch fucking air and go over the
side of a really totally.

Speaker 1 (52:52):
But if you're a little you know, you're playing around
that you should in the way you shouldn't be, and you're
messing around and you're trying to climb over the railing
even yes, because you do stupid shit. Did you forget
your head caught between the banister the railing?

Speaker 2 (53:08):
And I did? It was the most terrifyed I still
remember it.

Speaker 3 (53:11):
I mean, yeah, but then I go, how long was
she in that bathroom that he's doing so much stuff
like it could have been a minute. But when you're
babysitting it makes me think of Nora. Of course, my
niece it was now nine, but a babysitter sat her
a ton when it was just her and eye and
if you have to get up to go to the bathroom,
you go.

Speaker 2 (53:30):
You put the TV on and hypnotize them and just go.
Stay right there. I'll be your right back down. Touch
you don't even close the bathroom door all the way.

Speaker 1 (53:37):
No way.

Speaker 2 (53:37):
When I maybe SA name my nephew, who's a six.

Speaker 1 (53:39):
Year old boy, very run by just six year old boy,
I'm like, Mike, are you good?

Speaker 2 (53:44):
Yes, you're out there constantly call out them.

Speaker 1 (53:46):
Yeah, but she would, But technically she wasn't babysitting him.
She was living with this person. And I feel like
when you're actually someone's guardian, it's not you're not you know,
you and I are terrified of killing her siblings. Yeah,
like child and don't understand that kids can be left
alone a little bit more than we think they can.

Speaker 2 (54:05):
Oh, that's true.

Speaker 1 (54:06):
So but then again that's not you know, who knows
how long she was living with them?

Speaker 2 (54:10):
So, but was it only the two of them in
the house and her younger sister who was visiting? Oh right, okay,
I know that is.

Speaker 1 (54:20):
Yeah, if you guys want to look up, it's if
you look up the Coronado murder House. This fucking mansion
is so ugly and you can see it's blurred out,
and I'm sure you can find one that's not. But
her body on the lawn, naked, that's not you know
that they took from the fucking helicopters.

Speaker 3 (54:36):
That's an unfortunate porn search that he did that night.
If he's in, how.

Speaker 1 (54:41):
Is that possible that she's found bound and he looked
up not even just bondage porn, Asian Asian bondage porn.

Speaker 2 (54:48):
That's not.

Speaker 1 (54:49):
Yeah, that is quite a that's too many things. Yeah,
be just a simple coincidence, totally. Oh and then who
was on her computer after three am? Right after she's
fuck hanging god damn it. Can you imagine being a
neighbor and waking Evan sing that, oh my god? Fuck?

Speaker 2 (55:06):
But he's the one that cut her down.

Speaker 1 (55:08):
He's found her, so he quote found her, Yeah, in
the morning, six thirty in the morning.

Speaker 2 (55:15):
Then what was time of death? Do you know? No? Like,
was it supposed to be the night before? I think
it was supposed to be the night before?

Speaker 1 (55:21):
But is your first instinct to cut someone down if
they're clearly dead?

Speaker 2 (55:25):
It's to run away and call nine one one.

Speaker 1 (55:26):
It's to call nine one one in a panic, not
run upstairs, get a knife or whatever and cut a
rope down to this person who's you could talent someone's
dead and not dead, yes, then falls to the ground,
especially if she's if you, let's say, he has nothing
to do with it and she's bound your first instant
because this is not a suicide, this is a murder.

Speaker 2 (55:47):
Why would you then cut them down?

Speaker 4 (55:49):
Right?

Speaker 2 (55:49):
Why would you?

Speaker 3 (55:50):
We everybody knows that you don't condamnate to crime.

Speaker 1 (55:53):
See, even if you're not like us who are obsessed
with this shit, you know not to fucking it.

Speaker 2 (55:58):
Gets your thing, it's law and order. One.

Speaker 1 (56:00):
Oh, and then there was also a knife in the
room that supposedly he cut her down, with no fingerprints
on it. Why are there no fucking fingerprints on that?
This is all this very specific stuff I have to say,
is from Reddit, supposedly from the reports of the family
suing the shack Nows for the murder, wrongful death.

Speaker 2 (56:21):
So this could be bullshit.

Speaker 3 (56:24):
Well, what's interesting is like when I when I did
the uh looking up all that stuff on the Alisa Lamb.

Speaker 2 (56:31):
Thing from Cecil Hotel last week, it's most of.

Speaker 3 (56:34):
The information people get ends up being from those wrongful
death cases because that's when they release the information and
you get it in.

Speaker 2 (56:41):
Court records, right, the files are open because.

Speaker 3 (56:44):
When it when it's a regular police case, you can't
get that information.

Speaker 1 (56:51):
And yet, isn't it fucking And this is a thing
that's insane to me. That's nothing to do with any
of this. The fact that nine one one calls are
a public record is slut bananas to me. So you
can't get all this information, but you can hear a
nine one one call just whenever you fucking want.

Speaker 2 (57:07):
Yeah, those should be so private. I can't even stand it.
Those things bumm me out so bad.

Speaker 1 (57:12):
I know you can't stand that. I hate them. I
don't think anyone to do. There's one where a woman
gets killed like on the phone. No, nope, there's a
whole episode of last podcast, Last Podcast on the Left
where they just.

Speaker 2 (57:23):
Do nine one calls. I skip that one. I know.

Speaker 3 (57:26):
I was like, listen to every fucking episode. I like, yeah,
I wait for new episodes, but that one.

Speaker 2 (57:31):
Yeah, that one. I was like.

Speaker 1 (57:32):
I listened with my finger hovering over the stop button
because I was like, I know, and I never finished it.

Speaker 3 (57:38):
Because here's the other a couple times on like twenty
twenty or like Dateline or whatever. The ones that bum
me out the most are those fucking doctors that kill
their wives and call nine one one pretending to be
I said, my why, And it's fake and it's so obvious.
It's like if you've taken one acting yes, you're like, sir,
I'm believing nothing of this right now.

Speaker 1 (57:59):
And they think they're so smart. They think they are
fooling everybody. Know what we should do? I just thought
of how fucking cool this would be. Make it fake
nine one one, Just do praying calls to nine one
one for the entire show and then get a rest,
and then have the knock at the door of us
getting rest.

Speaker 3 (58:13):
No.

Speaker 1 (58:14):
I wondered if, okay, this would be ridiculous, But if
we played, let's say we played we had dustin pick
out ten nine one one calls. Five of them are real,
the person actually had had not killed the person. Five
of them were like later found out that they person
killed the person.

Speaker 2 (58:28):
And then we take a test and we have to guess,
why do we have to do ten? It was so many? Four?

Speaker 1 (58:33):
Okay, how about one of them is fake? Let's do
three Okay.

Speaker 3 (58:38):
I honestly feel like I could do it right now
and pass the test.

Speaker 1 (58:41):
I feel like I'm bartering with you. Okay, three, We'll
just do three and one will be fake, one will
be fake, but then we have a listen, are two real?
Oka will be fake and one will be real.

Speaker 3 (58:51):
I think it's because and I don't know if I've
ever talked about this on this my favorite all time show,
as I survived.

Speaker 1 (58:57):
Oh, I don't want to see Survivors, so let's talk
about this.

Speaker 2 (59:02):
That's okay.

Speaker 3 (59:03):
The reason I love it is because it's all the
because it's instead of being the thing I'm interested in,
Sarah killing all the crazy shit which I want distance
from and no relation to, and no.

Speaker 2 (59:14):
You want to make it just understand. Yeah, and I survived.

Speaker 3 (59:17):
It's people that go through all that shit and are
sitting and most of it's like literally ninety percent women.
The men are always there because they're like, I survived
a hike that went wrong. Yeah, it's like fuck you.
It's always the guy that's like had his own yacht
and there's like I can't when.

Speaker 1 (59:31):
The storm came, Y's going to fucking yeah.

Speaker 2 (59:34):
Then and then there's four women who are like, just
this guy came up behind me.

Speaker 1 (59:38):
Humans are bigger than I Most male humans are bigger
than I am, and it can hurt me in broad daylight.

Speaker 3 (59:43):
And so unfortunately I had a job, right, and then
this man.

Speaker 2 (59:46):
Decided I will die for that. Yep.

Speaker 1 (59:48):
But that's why I don't like it, because do you
know the show cold Came, what's the one with the
two women who uh, god, my memory is awful. Is
it a real show or yeah, it's a real show
where they're they're trying to solve cold CASELD cases? Yeah,
and it's is it relatively new? Yeah, I've never watched it.

Speaker 2 (01:00:08):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:00:08):
It's called cold Justice, Cold Justice, and these these two
badass women.

Speaker 2 (01:00:12):
One is a.

Speaker 1 (01:00:14):
Prosecutor, oh okay, and one is a crimes investigator and
they go to these like fucking tiny towns that have
no money for you know, uh, for detectives and people
to look up what's going on and take and try
to solve a cold case.

Speaker 2 (01:00:29):
That's cool. Oh it's incredible, and it's like so feminist.
I love it because these chicks are bad ass.

Speaker 1 (01:00:33):
So they did they started one called cold Cold uh,
cold Justice, and then but it's like it's only rapes
and sexual assaults. So these women are survived and it's
just so depressing because their interviews like make me hurt.
But you don't have to get an interview from the
person who's dead, so I just yeah, yeah, that's very true.

Speaker 3 (01:00:52):
Well, yeah, it's the I think a key to having
this interest is distance. Yeah, it's too much to be
involved in, like the victims' lives, and that's normally how
I feel. But I Survived is produced so well because
you don't want to watch a person who survived and
can't tell their own story because they're.

Speaker 2 (01:01:11):
Still so fucked up. Yeah, that's that is too much
to take on. We all have enough problems.

Speaker 1 (01:01:15):
It's also nice too, when you're like when you know
that the case has been solved and they've caught the
guy and he's imprisoned because they're still trying to find
the guy who raped them.

Speaker 2 (01:01:25):
That's too much. Yeah, like the stress in their life.

Speaker 3 (01:01:28):
On I Survived, it's all women who most of the
time at the very end, they're like and then I
started the victims Counseling Center. They're all these amazing women
that like take it, turn it around. There's one girl
that was kidnapped when she was sixteen by this crazy
serial killer somehow survived whatever, and she's a cop.

Speaker 2 (01:01:45):
But yeah, it's.

Speaker 3 (01:01:46):
The everything becomes really amazing and inspirational of like how
you can the worst thing in your life can become
like you're basically your destiny.

Speaker 1 (01:01:53):
Does it make you think too, that you're more equipped
to survive something that like that happens to you, because
you're never gonna be like, well everyone dies from this.
You're gonna be like, remember that girl, she fought this
guy and she won and hears how to Oh.

Speaker 2 (01:02:06):
Yeah, and once you know that's a fact, a truth
that can happen.

Speaker 3 (01:02:09):
Yes, And also they all talk about you do whatever
it takes to survive, so if you have to play dead,
if you have to, you know, like they just not justified,
but they are like explain like the things that a
lot of survivors feel guilty about, which is like, you know,
then I got raped for the fourth.

Speaker 2 (01:02:25):
Time, and I did it fight or something?

Speaker 1 (01:02:27):
Right?

Speaker 2 (01:02:28):
No, you don't fight because you would have just slashed
your throats.

Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
Yeah, there's the thing I always like, this is my
big thing. It's like just even if you get stabbed,
don't get in the truck, don't get in the car,
don't go somewhere with the person. That's like the big
thing is like, if you're better off getting shot on
the street and not getting shot and getting in the
car of the person who's trying to like do whatever
you fucking can, even if it's getting stabbed, not get

(01:02:51):
in the car. Yeah, because as soon as you're in
their possession, you're fucked.

Speaker 3 (01:02:55):
Yes, it's a good thing to know in your head, right,
but in this situation comes up who the fuck knows? Yeah,
I'm not gonna It's so crazy because also you go
into shock.

Speaker 2 (01:03:04):
I mean, they're totally well, it's the whole the story where.

Speaker 3 (01:03:06):
You're just kind of like it all is so surreal
that you feel like you're dreaming.

Speaker 2 (01:03:09):
You how could this actually be happening.

Speaker 1 (01:03:11):
Ali has this crazy story that she was just walking
down the street in like Larchmont, which is like a
nice fucking neighborhood during the day.

Speaker 2 (01:03:18):
This car pulls up.

Speaker 1 (01:03:19):
These two like gangster dudes get out with fucking kitchen knives,
big old chess knives and are like, give us your money,
and she takes her purse like a football throws it
in the opposite direction. Like to the side and then
runs back the way she was going, which is like,
that's genius. I thought that you could even do that
while you're getting held up, and like understand that if

(01:03:42):
you throw your purse off to the side, they're going
to go after the purse, not you.

Speaker 2 (01:03:45):
Yes, does she know to do that?

Speaker 1 (01:03:48):
She said, it was just instinct, fucking crept. Well, her
dad was also a crime reporter when she was a kid,
So that's something like that has happened, and she's talking.

Speaker 2 (01:03:57):
About it, He's probably like been like, oh, and by
the boss.

Speaker 3 (01:04:00):
Yeah, now that we're sitting here at breakfast, should she ever, Yeah,
that's amazing.

Speaker 2 (01:04:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:04:05):
The closest that I can even slightly think of like
anything like this that's happened to me is I was
walking down Librea one time and there's a bank that
had a weird like inside parking lot where you drove
in under like a little bank overpass, and then there
was just like an interior parking lot. Crazy Saturday afternoons,
like the bank was closed, and as I was walking

(01:04:26):
by here like hey, excuse me, excuse me, hey, and
there's a guy sitting in like a station wagon. He's like,
pardon me, can I just ask you a quick question?
And I'm walking by and I just started laughing. I
was like no, and I was still walking. He's like, ma'am,
I just need to ask you this question. I'm supposed
to walk in this thing, yes, sir, And then yeah,
I just was like hurried it up.

Speaker 2 (01:04:47):
And then he's like, man, people are so untrusting.

Speaker 3 (01:04:50):
It's like, why the fuck aren't you out here on
the sidewalk if you have such a pressing question?

Speaker 1 (01:04:53):
Yeah, and you saying untrusting means you're clearly untrustworthy.

Speaker 2 (01:04:57):
Why would I trust you? Yes?

Speaker 3 (01:04:59):
Why are you bringing that up at all? And also
what kind of idiot it has to go? I mean,
that's a terrible thing to say, but it was, you know, you.

Speaker 1 (01:05:06):
Know, Wally dangerous because we're bitches and we don't have
to be fucking polite to other people.

Speaker 2 (01:05:10):
Yes, which is like such a gift. That's right.

Speaker 3 (01:05:13):
That's I was raised by a bitch who was like, yeah,
would to a person's face be like, why don't you
get back the fuck up right now?

Speaker 1 (01:05:19):
My mom too, Yeah, my mom got someone copped a
feel at my mom in broad daylight when she was
a kid, and she told me about it when I
was a fucking kid, which probably shouldn't have so, like,
I've always been fucking terrified of strangers. Yeah that happened,
good too, Yeah, great, it happened to me too. I
like a few years ago, I was leaving a bar

(01:05:40):
and some guy kind of seemed like he was following me,
and I was like getting into my car and he
was like hey, hey, and like running towards me, and
I get in my car in front of him and
lock the door and he was like nevermind and like
walked away. And he was like clearly a cree if
he wasn't someone that was like a friend, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:05:55):
Yeah, but like the tone, I'm sure the tone of
visits was like, yes, what do you need?

Speaker 2 (01:06:00):
Yeah? What kind of fun experience? Will this be? Right?

Speaker 3 (01:06:04):
Crazy? Also that that just made me think, sorry, and
now we're doing this.

Speaker 2 (01:06:07):
I love it.

Speaker 3 (01:06:08):
It just made me think of this when I was dumb,
and I think I was probably twenty one or twenty two.
I lived in San Francisco and we all went to
see my friend Malava lived with a band.

Speaker 2 (01:06:18):
It was so hilarious in this Victorian house VanNess. They
were the coolest guys.

Speaker 3 (01:06:24):
They were so nice and it was like a total
like Dave Matthews's style band. And they were playing at
a bar nearby, so we me and her and my
other friend all went to watch the band in this
little bar.

Speaker 2 (01:06:35):
We all got drunk. It was I think it was
the King's Head.

Speaker 1 (01:06:40):
Oh the pub, yes next door is the best sausages
I've ever had in my life.

Speaker 2 (01:06:44):
Really wait, I think that's it.

Speaker 1 (01:06:46):
Yeah, No, that's not Bombard Yeah I think, but I know.

Speaker 3 (01:06:49):
That Kings had this, Okay, So it was like it
just felt like a regular night going out like we
had done Apion times and we were all dancing on
the dance floor and having a great time in this
I came up and he was really cute. He looked
the on first impression, he looked like he had just
gotten out of the army. To me, he was very
clean cut and kind of intense. But he came and

(01:07:09):
started dancing next to me and talking to me.

Speaker 1 (01:07:12):
And it's almost like you your friends are like you
must have friends in comment or something like he knows
who you are.

Speaker 2 (01:07:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:07:17):
And also but it was like the feel of it,
it was like almost like a jam band, like we're
all here yeah, and so he was like hey, blah
blah blah, and I'm like what And he's like, hey,
let's dance together. And I was like yeah, like we
already were.

Speaker 2 (01:07:30):
We all were dancing, Everyone was dancing.

Speaker 3 (01:07:32):
And then he goes, he goes, let's go, let's go
over here, and I go no, And I looked around.
My friends were nowhere near me. I didn't realize it
because I was drunk, but they weren't nearby, and I
was like no. And then he grabbed both of my
hands at the same time by the wrists and he goes,
let's go over here, and was pulling me toward the

(01:07:53):
fucking door. No, and the guy, this guy Dave, who
was the greatest, was the manager of the band and
he also lived in the house with everybody, And out
of nowhere, Dave fucking shows up, grabs the guy by
the shirt and just pulls him away and I got
kicked out by security, Thanks fucking god.

Speaker 1 (01:08:12):
Dave was watching the entire time. Do you know that
happened over the weekend? And Jesse Pop fucking kick this
guy out of a bar?

Speaker 2 (01:08:18):
What?

Speaker 1 (01:08:21):
Yes, sorry, Justin? Is this going way too long? Is
this okay? Okay? There's this fucking guy in a bar.
We get to the drawing room, which is like this
Stuyve bar everyone loves, like the bartender knows us. It's
the best, and I'm getting drinks and the Sky next
to me is like being friendly and I'm being friendly
back because everyone there is a regular. And then he

(01:08:42):
suddenly turns and says something about Vince, my husband. That's rude,
and so I just stopped paying attention to him, and
I think he said something shitty and Vince was like,
god it want to fight him, kind of which Vince
doesn't do. Yeah, And then so Ali and I are
talking to a friend and the Sky, who's like drunk
as fuck, comes over and starts talking to us, and
just Pop walks over and goes, guy bothering you, and

(01:09:02):
I go, yeah, actually he is, and just he goes,
all right, Bob, come on, get leave the ladies alone.

Speaker 2 (01:09:08):
You gotta get out of here.

Speaker 1 (01:09:09):
And the guy was like kind of pissed and like
yelling at him, and then the bartender came over and
kicked him out.

Speaker 2 (01:09:14):
But it was straight up, does guy bothering you? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:09:16):
Okay, are my cheeks read right now? That's my favorite thing.
That is Dustin was there. Yeah, oh my god, you.

Speaker 2 (01:09:26):
Know what, fuck you out.

Speaker 1 (01:09:27):
It's tall guys that take that take care of business. Yeah,
sure guys too, well, yes, exactly, any.

Speaker 3 (01:09:32):
Guys actually, right, fuck you out of guys that step
up pay attention because things like that, especially, it's like
you can't even drinks.

Speaker 1 (01:09:39):
What I was gonna say, it's like you you can't
have two drinks, yeah, because you're inebriated.

Speaker 3 (01:09:45):
And suddenly you're kind of like, yeah, I want to
hang out yeah people and give people a chance. And literally,
like the the my story, the turn happens so quickly, Yeah,
the fnt of my head thinking, you fucking idiot, not
enough time to react, No, no time to react. And
like he had me, I were powered. If that guy
wasn't paying attention, I would have been out the side door.
No one would have seen me go. No, it was

(01:10:07):
the perfect scenario. I wonder if you'd recognize him. He
had to have gone on to fucking be a rapist
at least, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:10:14):
I don't know. I mean, it's not.

Speaker 1 (01:10:16):
Weird that that could be. He could have gone on
to do that and you wouldn't know. Yeah, how you escaped.

Speaker 3 (01:10:22):
That well, also think that later on when we all
got on the bus together, just such a dumb like
part of my life where we're like we lived with
a band, I mean like she did.

Speaker 1 (01:10:32):
But then I was away. Oh it was absorrible. That's
what you do in your twentieth Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:10:35):
But they like they all knew it happened, and I
felt I was ashamed, like it was me, but they
were like, hey, are you okay, and like they were
all kind of checking in where I was like, I
wanted to be a city girl. Yeah, and there's that
problem too, when you want to be a tough city
girl that knows church shit and parties and this.

Speaker 1 (01:10:53):
And that, or you're one of the guys, and then
suddenly this person does this thing to show that you
are just a fucking girl, yeah, who can pretty much
be overpowered by the smallest guy in the group.

Speaker 2 (01:11:02):
Yeah, and you're just kind of a dumb weekly Yeah,
didn't ye know?

Speaker 1 (01:11:05):
It's yeah, I think that we like to be tough
and then someone proves that you're not, or like when
some when you want to be tough and then someone
makes you cry and you're so pissed off at yourself
for crying because it makes you look like a pussy.

Speaker 2 (01:11:17):
Yep, that's so annoying.

Speaker 1 (01:11:19):
Yeah, oh man, Hey, come on, I love how on
this show. We're just so like everything is the worst
and fuck everything, and you got to be on your guard.

Speaker 2 (01:11:30):
Maybe you know, maybe we'll save someone's life.

Speaker 3 (01:11:32):
Yes, exactly. And also just you got to be a survivor.

Speaker 2 (01:11:35):
Yeah the point.

Speaker 1 (01:11:36):
Listen, have a buddy, don't ever be alone at a bar. Yeah,
and may or be drunk alone. Don't leave your drink alone.

Speaker 2 (01:11:42):
Yeah. If you get drunk, which hell, yeah, go for it.

Speaker 3 (01:11:45):
Yeah, but you have to have it maybe even either
one sober friend Yeah, friend that drinks slower than you. Yeah,
we're just someone that's got their eye out.

Speaker 2 (01:11:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:11:53):
And don't leave the bar to go home with someone
and leave your girlfriend behind. Don't fucking let your girlfriend
leave you. I mean, don't be stupid. It's basically I know.
Oh man, he looks so worried right now.

Speaker 2 (01:12:08):
You look like you're solving you know, you know what
it is.

Speaker 3 (01:12:10):
I'm just thinking about the fact that I was a
blackout drunk fifteen years of my life, and for some
reason I'm fine, somehow survived.

Speaker 2 (01:12:18):
I don't know how.

Speaker 1 (01:12:19):
It's the thing that I think happens in every episode
where we're like, how are we not dead?

Speaker 2 (01:12:23):
I know, you know what, We're all okay, we're.

Speaker 1 (01:12:26):
So okay and hopefully, okay, hopefully this podcast will lower
like just on its merit alone will lower our percentage,
like because we've talked about it, so the likelihood of
it happening is less, right?

Speaker 2 (01:12:38):
Is that a thing?

Speaker 3 (01:12:39):
I've heard you say that now eight times because there's
been an eight episodes. It's now like your magic mantra.

Speaker 1 (01:12:45):
It is, if you can imagine something happening, the likelihood
decreases that it'll happen well because you're being Yeah, you're
running scenarios, you're being exactly, you're being smart.

Speaker 2 (01:12:56):
We can listen to Vincent's story.

Speaker 1 (01:12:57):
Oh yeah, okay, so we kind of have the said
has been Vince left me? Has I has had a
murder story that he told me in the very beginning
because he knows that I'm obsessed, even though he's not.
But then he told me this murder story and I
was like, I tried not to react so like I
was in love with it because I didn't want to
think I was so WEIRDO.

Speaker 2 (01:13:14):
But it's really good. It's a good one. Okay, sorry,
Vince Averril, ladies, April April?

Speaker 3 (01:13:21):
Well, did you did I tell you that story that
the DJ asked me how to pronounce He leaned over
and he goes, how do you pronounce the last name?
And I go, It's Avril, And then I sat there
for three seconds and it was like he was about
to say it, and then I leaned over really quick
and asked Matt or whoever was next to me that knew,
And then I'm like.

Speaker 2 (01:13:39):
April, April, April, did you hear?

Speaker 3 (01:13:40):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:13:41):
But then did you hear? When he introduced us? He
was like hard Star.

Speaker 3 (01:13:45):
And that was me the pause in between, I go
hard Shark really fast.

Speaker 2 (01:13:49):
I was sitting directly next to the day Thank you,
You're welcome. Okay, but I almost fucked to Vincent. I
love it, it turned out, Okay.

Speaker 4 (01:13:56):
I grew up a small town outside Detroit, Michigan, and
we had a central park in town. And when I
was like a freshman or sophomore in high school, a
girl who was in my class was abducted out of
the park and ultimately raped and murdered by a guy
who was like a serial killer. Turned out had done
into a number of women. And then a few years later,

(01:14:19):
like the year after I graduated, there were two twelve
year old girls who met these guys like a twenty
to thirty year old in the park and had asked
them to buy them alcohol so they could celebrate their
thirteenth birthdays that were coming up. So the guys told
them to come back and meet him there that night
and they would have the alcohol for them. So when
they these girls snuck out and came back and the

(01:14:43):
guys got them drunk, raped, killed them pretty horrible the stuff,
and then they put the bodies in the river in
the drain. And then shortly thereafter was like the summer
festival that happened every year. And during the festival, which
was a lot of it taking place in Central Park,

(01:15:03):
the girls' bodies were discovered. They came up and uh,
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:15:11):
Jesus, so like all the families are at the festival
and the fucking bodies flowed up in the room.

Speaker 2 (01:15:18):
Yeh.

Speaker 1 (01:15:19):
Then they thought the girls were like runaways until then
I think also, did you see my cat? Like as
soon as Vince's voice came on he ran over. I
was like, well, what the fuck, where's my where are
my treats? Uh?

Speaker 2 (01:15:31):
Yeah, that's a fucked up Oh my god, I know twelve.

Speaker 1 (01:15:35):
Wait no, the girls girls were like, I think thirteen
or fourteen.

Speaker 2 (01:15:39):
No, no, no, they were twelve.

Speaker 1 (01:15:40):
Yeah, you're right, they're still bringing their thirteenth birthday. I
was a I went to rehab when I was thirteen. Like,
they were probably bad kids too.

Speaker 3 (01:15:48):
I know you'd never know it from your wonderful dresses
and thank yous of a wonderful thing, thank you, and
your gorgeous spawwater. You're just served as delicious cucumb like
a fucking rich lady.

Speaker 2 (01:16:01):
Oh there's nothing it.

Speaker 1 (01:16:02):
Oh yeah, yeah, that's fucked up.

Speaker 2 (01:16:09):
That Like those scenarios.

Speaker 1 (01:16:11):
I was in those scenarios, drinking booze with like twenty
something year old stay out of the park and in
a park at night. Oh just the only difference is
I didn't get raped and murdered.

Speaker 2 (01:16:22):
Yeah, come on, Jesus.

Speaker 1 (01:16:24):
Christ, do you want to read a hometown murder or
are you done?

Speaker 2 (01:16:29):
Should we save it for next week?

Speaker 1 (01:16:31):
We maybe we're emotionally I'm wrung out, we're emotionally exhausted.

Speaker 2 (01:16:36):
I love it.

Speaker 1 (01:16:37):
This murder podcast has murdered us.

Speaker 2 (01:16:40):
It's really going to get us to a new place.

Speaker 3 (01:16:42):
Yeah, I totally forgot about that thing that happened to me.

Speaker 1 (01:16:46):
So well, just now, I swear to God, this is
bringing up shit and we're probably gonna need to talk
to therapist about it.

Speaker 2 (01:16:53):
Is there something positive we can talk about? Did you ever?

Speaker 3 (01:16:57):
I just snorted, like's not in my nose, like a
fucking third grader.

Speaker 2 (01:17:02):
No, I love it, you're sick. Okay?

Speaker 3 (01:17:06):
They can go on to other podcasts from the like
all kinds.

Speaker 2 (01:17:10):
Let me Elvis. Do you want to Cookie Cookie? Okay,
that's there, that's a positive.

Speaker 1 (01:17:18):
That's okay, hell miss Cookie Okay, all right, well thanks
for listening you guys. I'm sorry if this is but
please tell us everything. You can email us at my
Favorite Murder at gmail. Please get onto the Facebook page
my Favorite Murder group. It's private so people won't be
able to read your crazy shit that you write, and

(01:17:38):
it's like such a fun fucking group.

Speaker 3 (01:17:40):
And then on Twitter where my Favorite Murder.

Speaker 1 (01:17:42):
Yeah, please follow us, and then go on iTunes and
rate review and subscribe.

Speaker 2 (01:17:47):
Have you been reading our reviews? I haven't. We should
see if we're have any.

Speaker 3 (01:17:49):
I did once and I told a story of how
I fixated on the too bad right and didn't even
pay attention to the hundreds of good ones.

Speaker 2 (01:17:56):
That's that's how life is.

Speaker 1 (01:17:58):
I know we shouldn't do that. It was shameless for
doing that. Yeah, thanks for thanks.

Speaker 2 (01:18:06):
We love you, We love you.