Rewind with Karen & Georgia - Episode 31: Namaste Sexy

It's time to Rewind with Karen & Georgia!

This week, K & G recap Episode 31: Namaste Sexy. Karen dived deep into the world of Lululemon with the Yoga Store Murder and then Georgia told the tale of Tent Girl and the Doe Network. Listen for all-new commentary, case updates and much more!

Whether you've listened a thousand times or you're new to the show, join the conversation as we look back on our old episodes and discuss the life lessons we’ve learned along the way. Head to social media to share your favorite moments from this episode!  

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Now with updated sources and photos: https://www.myfavoritemurder.com/episodes/rewind-with-karen-georgia-episode-31-namaste-sexy

My Favorite Murder is a true crime comedy podcast hosted by Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark. Each week, Karen and Georgia share compelling true crimes and hometown stories from friends and listeners. Since MFM launched in January 2016, Karen and Georgia have shared their lifelong interest in true crime and have covered stories of infamous serial killers like the Night Stalker, mysterious cold cases, captivating cults, incredible survivor stories, and important events from history like the Tulsa race massacre of 1921.

The Exactly Right podcast network provides a platform for bold, creative voices to bring to life provocative, entertaining and relatable stories for audiences everywhere. The Exactly Right roster of podcasts covers a variety of topics, including true crime, comedy, science, pop culture and more. Podcasts on the network include Buried Bones with Kate Winkler Dawson and Paul Holes, That's Messed Up: An SVU Podcast, This Podcast Will Kill You, Bananas and more.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
Last Hello, and welcome to Rewind with Karen and Georgia.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
Because you see, every Wednesday we take the time to
recap our old episodes for you, but we add all
new commentary, we add updates, and we add insights.

Speaker 1 (00:31):
And today we're recapping episodes thirty one, which we named
Noma Stay Sexy. Such a good name, so good.

Speaker 2 (00:38):
So now join us as we take you back to
August twenty fifth, twenty sixteen, and now you can be
a Day one listener just like we are.

Speaker 1 (00:47):
So let's listen to the intro of episode thirty one.

Speaker 2 (00:53):
Well doesn't matter if you're ready, Stephens, as we'd be
right like the real us. It is just be orrating Stephen.
Stephen includes a seven second uh, just me ringing him
before the episode.

Speaker 1 (01:07):
It's like a what's it called when you're hostage and
you're like trying to send a message to the outside world.

Speaker 2 (01:15):
That Stockholm syndrome stock Yeah, that's right, Stephen has really
bad Stockholm scender. Evil. We are starting now my favorite murder.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
Karen, Karen, I'm just gonna your name, Karen Georgia, CA
Daron Georgia.

Speaker 2 (01:33):
We started the podcast. How do you feel so far?
I can't stop. I'm great. How are you so bad?
I don't know if you ever asked me how? I
was like that? How am I do? How are you
really are you? Let's have a moment of vulnerability. I
feel a lot of anxiety about gosh, so many things.

(01:58):
You know that weird Wednesday. We're recording this on Wednesday.
Will we get it up in time? You know? Job stuff?
I drink too much coffee all day? Am I drinking
too much Dike coke to the point where I'm killing myself?
Many do you drink Dike coke? Yeah? Oh, it's only
like twenty three a day. I like that every episode.

Speaker 1 (02:20):
Now you have to admit, like you have to confess
something you do that's because you had smoke.

Speaker 2 (02:24):
Told us you smoked cigarettes last time. I mean, I
very rarely. It's not like I wouldn't call that. It's
not a thing. It's just that's like my secret sneak
away once in a while. I think you're in denial.
I know, what's your big reveal? Oh, what's a good one.
That's a good one. That's a fun one of adult acne. Okay,

(02:44):
that sucks. I can relate to that.

Speaker 1 (02:46):
Yeah, I don't like that.

Speaker 2 (02:49):
That's about it.

Speaker 1 (02:50):
That's all you're willing to know. I mean, my life
is a fucking ope. I have nothing that I hide.

Speaker 2 (02:56):
I feel like that's I think people can it helps
you a lot in to our humanity. Yeah, when we're
just sitting here going, you.

Speaker 1 (03:05):
Know, gross, discussing horrible human this hideousness, and I make
it a podcast, roast it better be a podcast, and
I'll look at it. We're getting a lot of is
very enjoyable and of course feeding the ego. A lot
of people are doing like fan art picture things of us,

(03:27):
which the thing, oh the thing I enjoy the most
is there.

Speaker 2 (03:32):
They always give me a huge nose. I don't think
I have a huge note. Think you don't have a
huge nose. I think I have a pretty button. You
know you have a cute little button nose. I mean,
thank you. I just want you to say, I've noticed.

Speaker 1 (03:46):
I have a large jaw in them, which I actually
have an undersized shaw hence my ends a lie.

Speaker 2 (03:51):
That's right, but thank you, But you know what, but
thank you. We're the most ungrateful assholes of all time.
We have a couple of notes. Can you draw us? Better?
Draw me? Everything?

Speaker 1 (04:04):
I knows lots and if you want to make it
onto Instagram dot com slash my favorite murder, you gotta draws.

Speaker 2 (04:10):
It's true to life. There's some really good ones of us,
really awesome drawing where like you look at it and go,
oh my god, this looks like we have a comic book. Yeah,
which is super cool. So thank you so much. You're
fucking backpedaling so hard right now. I'm embarrassed. Don't be
Go to go to the Instagram and you'll see a
bunch of that. Like we post that show, we post

(04:31):
all of them. We post everything that we see and
find that you guys send us. I love it all.
A lot of people made us new logos that say
the funckword murder Mystery Show, which we really love and appreciate.
That was thank you. That was good times. Yeah. And
also I just wanted to mention on the Twitter page,
we got quote a million shout outs from Sweden, these

(04:56):
guys who have a podcast called the Power Meeting Podcast,
and it's a tweet that said a million shout outs
from Sweden, which I didn't know until I read it
that that's all I've ever wanted in my life. A
millia shout outs from Sweden. Also, Australia loves us. Fuck yeah, Australia.
You renumber five in Australia. That's amazing. That's that's a
big place, right. They must not be about accuracy down there,

(05:18):
because I feel like everything I've ever said about Australia
on this podcast has been deeply wrong. Well, we did
an Australian murder once, so maybe that's why.

Speaker 1 (05:25):
Oh that's right, they like love us for doing that,
because there's some good ones there.

Speaker 2 (05:29):
There are some amazing ones yours. Was it was the
son who washed his clothes before he did anything?

Speaker 1 (05:34):
Yeah, he murdered, he went on a paper route, murdered,
his fucking family, lamed his dad washed his clothes?

Speaker 2 (05:41):
Or was that New Zealand? Fuck no, I think it
was Australia. Watch the numbers plummet. Oh my god, why
did I even bring this up? I don't know I
brought it up. Okay, this is all your Oh. Also,
we got a tweet from Glitter Pizza ninety one God
bless your heart said why not at the end of

(06:02):
every murder, why don't you ring a gong? Which I
read out of context, just read as a random tweet
and it made me laugh very hard. Then I understood.
I saw a bunch of other tweets that said, what's
that noise? What's that creepy spooky noise that we keep hearing?
And it was we got Steven set us up with
these awesome mic stands. Yeah, they look like what you see,

(06:24):
like real radio people yeaking. So we don't have to
like touch our mics and make noise anymore. But what
we did was we touched the mic stands and we
were making the springs because I can't sit still, right?
Is that super loud? That's it? It's perfect. Okay, yeah,
I makes the sound.

Speaker 1 (06:40):
Listen, I have a d D, I think, right, that's
what my psychiatrist tells me. Okay, I can't fucking sit still.
I want to move around, I know, but it's you know,
I'm gonna sacrifice fat for the podcast.

Speaker 2 (06:50):
Well, we really appreciate it. Thank you speak for everybody,
thank you and myself. You have a button nose, thank you,
two eyes made out of coal.

Speaker 1 (06:59):
Oh we also had a We just ended our last
two shirt sales and we are giving half the money
to end the backlog dot org nice.

Speaker 2 (07:07):
How much does that do? I say? Because what if
it's like, that's not What if they're like, well, it
was just a one month says right, we're sending two
grand to end the backlog dot work. It's right good.
I don't know more than they fucking had before.

Speaker 1 (07:20):
I got so freaked out when I posted, like, hey,
we're going to get fifty percent to end the backlog,
because I expected people this is the opposite of what happened.
But I expected people to be like, only fifty percent.
You're just being so you're being so greedy, And then
all these people are like, that's so incredible. I'm like, oh, okay,
like I've just been being hard on myself.

Speaker 2 (07:37):
Yes, I mean, I think it's just weird to be
in this position where you can actually put something out,
have people buy it, and then actually give money. Yeah,
it's like a neat cool thing. But also we've never
done it before, so everything feels wrong and bad and weird.

Speaker 1 (07:52):
Is there anything else that you love right now? Well,
anything going on in the news. We know John Maine's
brothers get.

Speaker 2 (07:57):
Oh did you watch?

Speaker 1 (07:59):
Yes, you and I both looked at each other at
the exact same moment watching that trailer that John Benet
doc You series trailer.

Speaker 2 (08:07):
We have to watch it together. I insist you watch it.

Speaker 1 (08:10):
Can I tell you something what a magazine wants us
to do a recap every night of it?

Speaker 2 (08:15):
That's awesome. I know. The trailer gave me freakin' chills. Okay,
we watched the trailer at work today and I love
the people I work with because they're super into shit
us too. And when it got to the part trailer spoiler,
when it got to the part where they have reconstructed
the Ramsey's house, the room by room recreated down to

(08:39):
the detail of shit, that was like leaning against the wall,
life changing. These people are going these these investigators, these
these very qualified people.

Speaker 1 (08:50):
From all walks of criminal forensicness or criminality, criminality.

Speaker 2 (08:56):
They're going to be able to walk through and talk
about and stage things that happened.

Speaker 1 (09:02):
Do you think they'll come to a conclusion It clearly
in the trailer you can tell that they're going to.
They're like, yeah, there was no this is not an
outside job, motherfuckers.

Speaker 2 (09:11):
I mean that's what they're leading you to believe. That's true.

Speaker 1 (09:15):
And then like oh oh, when they played the when
she hung up the phone and you can hear her
in the background, I still don't hear it.

Speaker 2 (09:23):
Do you have you listened to them? I mean when
they say like they reduced all the.

Speaker 1 (09:26):
Sound, yeah, and they hear her say I'm not talking
to you. Yes, I still don't hear it, do you No?

Speaker 2 (09:33):
But I feel like that's almost like one of those
ghost investigations where they're like, do you hear it? And
then they put the subtitles and you're like, I guess
I hear If you want me to hear it all here, totally,
I'll hear whatever you want. Yeah. My thing was because
everybody at my job, everybody pointed out like the thing
that freaked them out or that they liked the most,
and mine was that when Patsy Ramsey said I love
that child, she did it with her eyes closed.

Speaker 1 (09:55):
That was the creepiest part is both of them being
both of them speaking, was so fucking eerie.

Speaker 2 (10:01):
Yeah, and two camera like basically clearly some lawyers said
you have to go out there and tell these people
you didn't kill your daughter, and you have to make
a statement. And when Patsy Ramsey said I didn't kill
my daughter, and then she closes her eyes and goes,
I love that child, and then they stay closed, like
to me that I just love those Like that means something.
I don't know what if. Also saying that child means

(10:22):
something because it's like she's not saying my daughter Jean Benet. Yeah,
it's like that child. Yeah, I was like that child.

Speaker 1 (10:29):
She can't take take ownership of the Thingmber.

Speaker 2 (10:32):
Did you ever watch the show Lie to Me with
Tim Roth where it was all about the person that
read micro expressions and it was like a whole company.

Speaker 1 (10:39):
No, Oh, I know someone had worked on it that
I dated, So I didn't watch it.

Speaker 2 (10:43):
Oh yeah, because you're mad. No, he was very nice. Oh,
I don't want to step on a set. I just
love that show because that's kind of stuff of like
being able to interpret what people are really doing underneath
how they mask and they.

Speaker 1 (10:55):
Point it out and they're like, would they like pause
it and be like this thing right here and that thing?

Speaker 2 (11:00):
Oh? I love that. Yeah, yeah, you should watch that show.
It's pretty good. I don't know if it's on anything,
but okay, well did you catch up on the night
of We've only got one episode, Loud, I gotta say
you're out.

Speaker 1 (11:12):
Everyone telling me about stuff about it and talking to
other people about it has made me want to watch
it less.

Speaker 2 (11:18):
You're so fucking punk rock Georgia. I swear to god,
you're just like anything mean right now. No, I mean
it in that way of like you're just like you know,
and I don't have to like it. If you like
it, it's a good way to be, I respectful. But I
think that's how I think that's what it is, where
you're like, does everybody like it, then everybody can find Well.

Speaker 1 (11:36):
What everyone's telling me about it, thank you. That actually
means a lot to me.

Speaker 2 (11:40):
But what everyone's telling me about it is like I
don't care about the prison stuff.

Speaker 1 (11:44):
I want the trial stuff. And from what everyone's someone
said to me. Someone was like, and I'm not gonna
take responsibility. I don't remember who said. It was like, listen,
I watched Orange is the New Black. I don't need
to know what's going on in prison, like so the.

Speaker 2 (11:58):
Same, It's totally the same.

Speaker 1 (12:00):
I'm just like, I don't I want to know that
the way that they find out, how the investigation goes,
how the trial goes, stef in prison, I don't care about.

Speaker 2 (12:09):
Right I you know what, I feel the same way
because I find and this is you're gonna this is
gonna blow your mind. I find prison to be really depressing,
So I don't want to know. I fear going there
to hurt you. As a child, I a prisoner, it
was a warden. Yeah, I don't like. I know, it's

(12:30):
living hell. And there are many many people in this
country that are there. Yeah, and that's awful to me.

Speaker 1 (12:34):
Especially people are there that like, oh, it was really
hard for me to watch and get taken in to
get out. Let's call it when you get processed in.

Speaker 2 (12:41):
Yeah, because it's like no one gives a shit about
you and immediately or just trash. Yeah, like the way
you know when you wait.

Speaker 1 (12:49):
And line it a post office and you get to
the next teller and you can tell they've had a
hard day and they fucking hate everything. So you can
smile and be like hi, and they be nice and
so they'll give you a better experience and be happier.

Speaker 2 (12:59):
Yeah, you can't do that in prison. What am I
supposed to do? I didn't learn to be polite for nothing. Oh,
it's like I mean, and it is like we talk
a lot. We talk a big game about like send
them do way for it, because we talk about these
specific stories where people cut off fifteen year old girl's arms, yes,
and leave them to die, and these horrible cases. And

(13:20):
of course you want Larry Singleton to disappear from the planet,
but the reality of a human being in a prison
is a nightmare and like and so I'm not saying
I'm not a hypocriter that I can't rectify those two things.
But it's yeah, watching it. What I love it that
in that show is that they're laying in It's just

(13:42):
really good writing. And I really like to watch good writing.
It may it makes me feel smart. And again I'll
say it for the millionth time, riz Ahmed, I don't.

Speaker 1 (13:52):
Someone made up made that I want his DNA inside me.
A couple of people made someone to Valentine last last week.
I said, you're serious, killer, Valentine. Yeah, yeah, I said,
I want his DNA inside me, the meaning I want
to have his baby because he's so cute that I
want like that, But just didn't sound like that.

Speaker 2 (14:09):
No, it's literally the most not cute kind of discussing thing.
But that's not what you meant.

Speaker 1 (14:14):
Okay, you know what I don't like about I don't
like innocent people in prison that people like Larry Singleton
deserve to be in prison. Good have a fucking horrible time,
but innocent people. Oh my god, that terrifies me.

Speaker 2 (14:25):
It's horrible and it's happens, and we all know what happens,
and it's incredibly stressful. Yeah yeah, all right, but I
like it. It's to me, it's worth the stress. And
there's things that are happening and are exciting. I won't
not try it. It does disappoint me that. I mean,
I don't know what happened. Maybe I'll watch the last episode.
Is that? Okay? Can I do that? Yeah? It's your life?
Jump in, jump out? I don't know. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (14:44):
Can they please bring the family back on ABC? That's
all I ask?

Speaker 2 (14:50):
Is that all you want this Christmas? That's all I
want for Hanka Christmas? All right? I think that's it? Right?
Are you got? I think you need to? Got nothing? Yeah?
Is this? Are we now? Is forty five minutes in?
Basically first this weakay, okay, go and tell me I
am Mine is short too, so take your time.

Speaker 1 (15:08):
Okay, we are back from the intro. Caaren Remember when
podcasts used to just be audio and you care whatever
you want, You could sit whoever you want just.

Speaker 2 (15:19):
Do you like? I think that's really where that saying
came from. As some podcasts in twenty.

Speaker 1 (15:24):
Sixteen, it was a beautiful, glorious time of just being you.
Do you think we would have started a podcast if
we had known that video would have been?

Speaker 2 (15:32):
Was like, I certainly I can get my answer before
I finish the sentence. Fuck, No, are you kidding? A
middle aged TV writer being like, yeah, let me get
in there and make some clips and make some content
for what is it? Jen? Alpha? No? Thanks?

Speaker 1 (15:49):
Yeah, I mean the one positive thing I can think
of about it all is that I'm learning a lot
of new makeup tips and tricks, which I didn't think
I would do so later, like late in life. I
thought about them all down, you.

Speaker 2 (16:01):
Know, but now you're what what are you getting?

Speaker 1 (16:04):
What do you My face is falling and so I
have to like do different things to it.

Speaker 2 (16:10):
What tricks have you learned.

Speaker 1 (16:12):
That how to stop your face looking like it's fucking falling?
What's the trick?

Speaker 2 (16:17):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (16:17):
Bronzer. I think it's a bronzer. I mean, it's also
like some kind of weird eyeshadow thing, you know.

Speaker 2 (16:24):
Just layering layers and layers of makeup that'll do it.

Speaker 1 (16:28):
Yeah, like make shadows if they don't exist essentially. Yeah, No,
it's been a nightmare. Like I not a nightmare.

Speaker 2 (16:34):
It's great.

Speaker 1 (16:35):
I'm lucky, but like I've gotten all my filler dissolved
because like you can see the bumps in the video,
Like I can totally see everything that's wrong now.

Speaker 2 (16:45):
I mean, I feel like we've never been strangers to
our own flaws and uh foibles. And then yeah, it's
just a new way of it's a fun thing and
it's like where podcasting is going. Yeah, just kind of
like the option that you need to give people. But
it definitely is distracting. Yeah, and it distracts the mind.

(17:09):
Ye as we.

Speaker 1 (17:11):
Perform, do you know us though, we you know, we
change along with the times like we are with it.

Speaker 2 (17:17):
That's what we like to do. Right now, this show
is not on video, So I'm wearing just a towel
on my head just for just got out of the bathtub.

Speaker 1 (17:28):
I'm literally wearing a shirt that says bullshit on it
really big and this is what we're doing and that's
it all right. Well, I like how in that we
just did a new intro because there wasn't that much
going on in this intro. Some of our old intros
are just chock full of insanity, but this mostly is

(17:49):
like that we are so stoked to.

Speaker 2 (17:52):
Only be audio. Yeah, and then me loving the Night
Of and you need so much.

Speaker 1 (18:00):
That was a long running discussion or topic of discussion
in this podcast.

Speaker 2 (18:04):
I think it was like a first because I I
remember and tell me if I'm wrong. When we first
talked about the Night Of, we had both watched it, yes,
like unplanned right, So then it was like, oh did
you see it? Was that feeling?

Speaker 1 (18:17):
Yeah? And then I lost interest, but you know, rizam
Ed kept doing it for you.

Speaker 2 (18:22):
Oh, was such a good job.

Speaker 1 (18:24):
It was all right, well, shall we get into your story?
And also like the reason this episode's called Noma stay
sexy absolutely Okay, let's hear Karen's story from this episode
thirty one about the Lulu Lemon murderer, or as I
liked to say back then, not on purpose lou Lamon.

Speaker 2 (18:43):
Here we go, Okay, mine is I wish I had
four months to research this because the first time I
heard of this murder, I thought, oh, who cares? Not

(19:05):
about the people? But that's not my style, Like like,
as we've said a million times, but like Silence of
the Lambs is my ideal murder everything situation. You've got
a weird hero killer that's got an m O and
a and a.

Speaker 1 (19:22):
And a creepiness, yet has always been this crazy way.

Speaker 2 (19:26):
It's not like he's it's not a one off, it's
not a crime of passion, it's not whatever. That's I
find that extreme criminal mind thing fascinating. Okay. So when
I first heard about this crime, I was like, oh,
that's not that's not my thing at all. And then
but it kept coming back, Like you, I would see

(19:47):
it every once in a while looking for other stuff,
and then I finally started looking into it, and it
is so fascinating. All right. So it's the Lululemon murder.
Oh yes, in Bethesda, Maryland. That is fascinating. I didn't
know that. I know. That's definitely not one that I
would have looked into. Okay, I'm excited me too. Things us.

(20:10):
So I first heard of it. I think it was
like a year ago or something. I was doing tig Nataro's.
Tig Nataro has a comedy festival every year called the
Benson Ball in DC, which is where she's from. And
so whoever was driving us to the theater that night,
we drove down the street and we passed to Lululemon.
I don't think it was the one we were driving by,

(20:31):
because the Thirsda I believe is north of Washington, d C.
But he brought it up and told the story love him,
and he basically just said, oh, did you hear about
that really terrible crime that happened at Lululemon. It was
really bad, you know, and it was basically one of
the employees killed another one. And so I was just like,

(20:54):
you know what, I know. Now we're talking yoga pants,
We're talking time of passion, and I'm not interested in
any of this.

Speaker 1 (20:59):
For anyone listening and doesn't know, Lulu Lemon is a
fucking high end kind of When I see girls wearing
yoga pants with Little Lemon, I'm like, Oh, you spent
a lot of money and yoga pants and didn't buy
im a rite aid.

Speaker 2 (21:09):
Yeah, you're better than me. Crazy expensive, like they're almost
it's it's like Louis Vauton of yoga pants, which is
a hilarious paradox of this is yoga.

Speaker 1 (21:21):
Yeah, And they have like the the like logo out
so you can see them.

Speaker 2 (21:26):
Oh hell, yeah, you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (21:27):
Yes, instead of hiding your shame, they put it out there. Right.

Speaker 2 (21:31):
So when I first googled this, a couple of Huffington
Post articles came up, and one that I really liked
is buy a girl name, believe it or not Elizabeth
Licorice and great, that's what she wins. Yeah, and she's amazing.
She's all red and her skin is twisted. Ah no, no,

(21:52):
cancel it, Stephen Mark even mark that concept. Oh okay.
So she wrote an article called Lululemon's cult Cold Sure,
get fit or die trying. So this girl started working
at Lululemon. That's how you pronounce it.

Speaker 1 (22:06):
Right, Lululemon. Yeah, I don't give a fucking shit. Okay,
it sounds right.

Speaker 2 (22:11):
It's how it's spelled, and that's what I assumed. And
then on Luliman, I think it's Luliman, but there's an
extra Lulaman would be there's too many lows, all right,
So I think it's Lemon. Let's call it. Let's not
give a shit, okay, all right, So I think you're right.
I think you're right. It has this girl worked there

(22:32):
and so she's talking about what a creepy like culture
this business has, which is very funny because like when
I worked at the Gap in the nineties and I
only worked there for a year, I really hated it.
But it is this thing where they want you as
a person that's getting paid yeah shit, and mostly working
part time so they don't have to give you full
time benefits all that stuff, but they still want you

(22:54):
to really dig care about it. Yeah, this the culture,
the retail culture, replied, and if you sell this, you'll
get this, and we have to get our numbers up here. Meanwhile,
down Fisher, the owner at the time was making like
billions of dollars. So it's so I can see where
that was in the nineties. It's now, you know, twenty

(23:14):
years later, and they have refined this concept. So it's
like branding and marketing and you know, lifestyle choices and
it's all that. I bet. It's the kind of thing
that they don't call you an employee, they call you
like a team member or whatever the fuck the di master.
So this girl, yeah, this girl worked there and talked
about but she said, Lula alone wants you to know

(23:37):
it's elevating the world from mediocrity to greatness and creating
components for people to live long, healthy and fun lives.
But if you dig deeper, you find about Yeah, you
can't do that in fucking pantcy about a target. No no, no, no,
you have to get really superficial to rise above media.

(23:57):
But if you dig deeper, you'll find you'll learn that
about Landmark Forum. No they don't. Yes, which isn't the
ultra secretive, early cultish educational series which Lululemon employees are
strongly encouraged to attend up. Yes, Now, now I know.
I have a friend who did Landmark Forum and is like,

(24:18):
I believe in it. I think it's great. And I said, yeah,
but isn't it a crazy pyramid scheme where you basically
have to bring people in and you spend thousands of
dollars And he goes, yeah, but I just didn't do that,
Like I got what I wanted and I left, and
I'm like, well, you're you're a strong willed person. But
I think it's one of those things that like it's
like st or anything that just it makes money off
of people kind of going this is the answer to

(24:39):
my life and then trying to get everyone they know
into it, so I see, so sad. So they encourage
their employees to, uh to go to the Landmark Forum,
which is bizarre to me, so bizarre. And before you're
in line for Landmark, you're bombarded with Brian Tracy motivational
CDs and a book club club that culminates with Atlish rugged.

(25:00):
Oh shit, So it's not it's so it's like get
that money and get yours and empowerment, but in this
weird CULTI way, which also it's like, this is your job,
this is your retail job. Yeah yeah, so uh they uh.

(25:22):
She said. All of it made walking into work feel
like she was time traveling to Salem, because with the Lululemon,
Creed and Catechism comes a collective mentality that thrives on
scapegoats and leaves you feeling worthless if you subsist on
anything but spring water and kale. Once another employee sneered
at me from across the floor and said the soda

(25:43):
I happened to be enjoying would wrop me from the
inside out. Eventually, we were all issued reusable acrylic cups
and forbidden to drink anything but water. Oh my god,
stop it so this is I'm I'm just trying to
paint a little bit of a picture. And I really
encourage if you're slightly interested in this to look up
these articles because it's pretty fascinating how many directions that

(26:06):
goes in of yeah, that sounds like a fun read. Yeah, well,
and just the intensity of a retail job.

Speaker 1 (26:14):
This is like, it bums me out so much to
think that what people expect from you when they're not
willing to give you any respect at all or.

Speaker 2 (26:23):
Write, uh every about when you work there, Everything about
you is inventoried and measured in terms of authenticity and integrity,
which sounds reasonable until you realize your yoga mats on
a sweaty, slippery slope, that missing your extra that's this
I'm still reading for the article, uh, missing your extracurricular
kickboxing class, taking too long to pee during your break,

(26:43):
or falling to throw or failing to throw a kitchen party.
And then she says in parentheses, don't ask what in
the fitting room means you're deficient in character and devoid
of morals? What's a kitchen party? I'm gonna ask. We
have to find out, But it's like, I think it's
in you know, secret in house language. Those girls happened

(27:04):
to just be older, sportier versions of seriously cutthroat sorority sisters.
So that's one person's take about what it felt like
to work there. So what's kind of to go along
with that? This company's had a lot of controversy since
they started. It's a Canadian company. They've opened in I think,

(27:24):
well in two thousand and two, to mark the opening
of their second store in Vancouver, they offered a free
outfit to anyone who would stand naked on the street
for thirty seconds.

Speaker 1 (27:33):
Are you fucking how about for people who can't afford
them and are homeless?

Speaker 2 (27:39):
You've fucking assholes? But like, also, so it's a store
that's mostly women's clothing. Yeah, and you're basically trying to
get ladies to stand around naked, so you give them
their one hundred and forty dollars yoga pants, Like so
sad you're asking them to exploit themselves. Yeah, Oh my god,
that same owner. I can't find any his name right now.

(28:00):
He in an interview with the National Post business magazine,
which sounds very Canadian to me, but I'm not sure.
He said he purposely named it Lululemon with lots of
l's because quote, it's funny to watch Japanese people try
to He also wants blogs that breast cancer quote came
into prominence in the nineteen nineties due to all the
cigarette smoking power women who were on the pill and

(28:21):
taking on the stress previously left to men in their.

Speaker 1 (28:24):
Why I'm going to Lulu murder you piece of shit?

Speaker 2 (28:32):
Name is sorry, that guy's name I'm trying to Oh,
that guy's name is Chip Wilson. And of course later
on everybody heard about the uh they in I think
it was twenty eleven, Oh no, sorry, twenty thirteen they
had to recall their line of Luwan yoga pants because

(28:52):
they were sea through. I remember that they were sea through.
I've seen girls gee strings from behind yoga before. And
then that same CEO oh on when he was interviewed
on Bloomberg TV about it, he asked he was asked
what the nature of the pants recall was, he said,
quite frankly, some women's bodies just don't work for it.

(29:13):
It's more about the rubbing through the thighs, how much
pressure there is over a period of time, You fucking nick.
So he's basically saying, if you're not emaciated, you can't
wear our yoga pants, and if you do, it's your fault. Yeah. Yeah,
so he's a superstar. After he said that, of course,
he was asked to step down from being the CEO
because it's you know, at the time it was twenty thirteen.

(29:37):
So so I'm sorry, sir, that it's not nineteen forty
five anymore. You can take that shit elsewhere. In two
thousand and seven, they had a line of clothing called
Vita s c Sea, which the company said was made
from seaweed fiber and according to the tags, they said
it released marine amino acids, minerals, and vitamins into the

(29:58):
skin upon contact with more did it stin? Did it think?
Reducing stress and providing anti inflammatory, antibacterial, hydrating, and detoxifying
benefits bulls? So the New York Times, that's exactly right.
The New York Times commissioned a laboratory tests of a
shirt made from Vita se and there was no significant
difference in mineral levels between the Vita See fabric and

(30:21):
a plane cotton T shirt. In other words, the labs
found no evidence of seaweed in the lemon clothing at
all to do that we're not done. In two thousand
and eight, a mother and daughter found a hidden message
in the shopping bag. Underneath a layer of inspirational quotes
such as friends are more important than money, there was

(30:41):
a second note that said quote some brief or quick
fix instance in well, start over. Some brief or quick
fix incidences when our minds are clear to be creative
are when drunk or stoned, or just after an orga.
What does that mean?

Speaker 1 (31:01):
Okay, so they're promoting being drunker, stand to orgasts.

Speaker 2 (31:04):
Or having an orgasm so that you can be creative.
And this is inside a yoga pants bag. So they
had this. It turned out that they had printed this up.
Initially people saw it and were like, what the fuck
are you doing here? Well, the other the other quotes
were the athletes high is the most long lasting, as
it can last up to six hours, and there's a

(31:24):
little difference between addicts and fanatic athletes. Both are continually
searching for a way to remain in a creative state.
So it was all just weird. They were very pro
drugs and sex. And then a couple of people got
the bags and were like, what's wrong with you? Guys,
this is a yoga pants store. So they took the
bags and just sewed over them with friendship is more

(31:45):
important than money. But all you have to do is
wash the bag a couple of times. And then the
other label came out. Oh I bet those are worth
some money on eBay. It's pretty hilarious. H and also
creepy like you're getting wed messages anyway. Yeah, And they
just the answer back when when that happened was not
an apology. They were basically like, we're about speaking our mind,

(32:06):
We're about living in this, having new ideas and new experiences.
And they basically were like, yeah, we do what we want.
We're trying to inspire people.

Speaker 1 (32:16):
So oh my god, uh so yeah I have yeah,
go on just how you're saying how.

Speaker 2 (32:25):
Yeah, but also but also good for them, but don't
shop there, like I don't. They can do that. It's fine,
you can do that. Like, here's the thing. Yoga is
a practice that's about connecting to yourself and connecting, you know,
having a body mind connection so that you are more
in yourself and calmer, more normal. It's not about spending money, yeah,

(32:50):
not about being better than your sorority sister.

Speaker 1 (32:52):
To get a mantra for transcendental meditation is fucking three grand, Like,
how do you how do they?

Speaker 2 (32:57):
Well, no, that's based on how much money you make.
But I mean, I'm not defending it because it's it
costs money. But what I'm saying is this is a
store that's creating that culture of you will spend money always,
and you will spend money on bullshit because we're gonna
lie straight to your face and say that our clothes
are made of detoxifying seaweed. That's crazy. So anyway, that's

(33:19):
just a little background, right. So the worst thing that
happened to them, of course, was in twenty eleven. On
the morning of March twelfth, an employee entered their store,
BESDA Maryland store, and she actually went in she heard

(33:40):
something inside I think it said, and so she went
and got a guy off the street and said, you
have to go in there and check. I'm supposed to
open the store. And there's weird noises and the guy
walked into like a bloody scene, and it turned out
that Britney Norwood and Jana Murray were lying in the store.
Jana was dead and Britney was tied up bound hands

(34:02):
and feet. Jenna had a rope around her neck and
hammer knife wounds to her head, and she had been
repeatedly struck with a metal stand. Later on, the medical
examiner found out she had three hundred and thirty distinct
wounds on her body. Oh my, how long would that
take to hit someone three hundred and thirty times? And

(34:25):
how much rage? And how personal? That's like ten minutes
of hitting. It's insane, overkilled. Yeah, so they when the
cop touched Brittany, she flinched, and then she tells the
story that the night before they'd closed the shop and
then she'd gone to I'm saying Jana, but I think

(34:45):
it's Jana. Did I say Jana? I think it's Jena.
So she'd gone to Jana and said, I need to
go back in. I forgot something. And when they went
back in, two masked attackers came like stormed into the store,
whoops to storm the store and with guns and attacked them,
and Brittany said, rape them and tied them up and

(35:09):
killed Jana and left her for dead. Had she'd been
hit on all of her Yeah, she had injuries too, okay,
and her pants were slid at the crotch it all
looked very bad. So looked it all looked very bad. Okay,
so sorry, I have to scroll down on my dumb thing.

(35:29):
So of course panics set off because this is apparently
a super high end area, like because that's how those
stores are always in, like really, so people are freaking out,
like there's no violent crime in that area at all. Immediately,
the cops are set up a man hunt. There's one
hundred and fifty thousand dollars reward for anyone with information

(35:52):
leading to an arrest. It's like big and huge, and
they start talking to people around the neighborhood, and they
talk to these employees at the Apple store which was
right next door, and these employees say that, yes, they
heard two women arguing and yelling and some weird thumping
and fighting noises the night before, but they never called

(36:13):
nine one one. How do you They didn't get asked
that question in court, which, of course, because it's like,
ultimately it's not about them and what they did or
didn't do, aside from I'm sure they struggle with it.
Yeah it's hideous, but yeah they didn't. And then somebody
included in one of these articles that I read, it

(36:34):
was this really awesome thing about how when you are
when you have a phone or a computer or something
that distracts you, you are like some percentage I won't
make up and I'll just be honest that I don't
know it, but like a very high percentage less likely
to get involved with anything happening around you. Wow. So
they're in an Apple store, so it's probably like weird noise,

(36:55):
weird noise to go back to playing Yazi with friends
or whatever your phone.

Speaker 1 (37:00):
I don't know if I would, like, how would you
get involved? It just so depends on the situation. If
you you can't expect people to be being you know,
getting murdered. No, if you hear a fight, you're not
like I'm going to go make sure no one's getting murdered.

Speaker 2 (37:13):
No, not at all, and especially in that area. Yeah, No,
it's a weird thing. I'm sure they had never had
any experience like that, and that's not they probably were like,
oh no, those girls are fighting. Toward the end that
totally thought. It's just unfortunate because even just a call
to say maybe you should just go check. I think
it's that thing of like people aren't willing to just

(37:33):
risk being wrong, which is, which is sad or not
being able to read a situation correctly. I mean the
way a couple of these articles talked about it. There
was like extended thumping and fight sounds and oh yeah,
you should have checked that out. At at one point
they heard a woman's scream, Oh please, God help me.

(37:53):
What the okay? No, you should have fucking gone over there.
I guess I buried the lead on. You brought that
up earlier. Oh my god. Go yeah, so crazy, even
if you're not sure, roll the dice, okay. So from
that they realize that these employees only hard two women
the entire time. They don't hear anything about men's voices,

(38:15):
they don't hear anything else, so they're suspicious. Also, there's
this really awesome statistic I found that I know the
exact number. Four according to the Bureau of the Justice
of Statistics. No. No, according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics,
only fifteen percent of homicides are committed by someone who

(38:36):
doesn't know the victim. Fifteen percent. That's crazy. So in
some ways, relax because it's very very except don't, because
your fucking family's going to murder you. It's going to
be your husband with that milkshake. I wonder if that's
the reason why we're so fascinated with stranger murders. What

(38:56):
the cord? Oh, I think, are you hitting it with her? Really? Okay?

Speaker 1 (39:00):
I wonder if that's why we're so fascinated about stranger
murders is because they're so rare.

Speaker 2 (39:04):
Yes, and so they sound like there are a lot
more of them. But in actuality, yeah, everyone talks about
the ones that happened because they're so crazy and weird,
so it seems like they're more likely. That's really interesting. Yeah,
So the cops know this, I mean the cops. The
cops they say that all the time. I'm like twenty
twenty or whatever, where it's like you always look to yeah,
the husband, the wife, the friends, the people that they know.

(39:26):
So one of the big breaks in the case was
that they looked in Jana's car, and Jane's the murder victim.
She's the victim. Okay. So they process her car and
they find Britney Britney's DNA in the car and then

(39:52):
they ask Brittany, have you ever been in Jana's car?
And she said no. That man.

Speaker 1 (39:56):
I love when they fucking trap something like that. Or
if you had just said yes, right, you would not
have been a suspect.

Speaker 2 (40:02):
But they never do because they were in the car,
so they're trying to cover that lie is going to
get them out. Yeah, and yeah, that's that's the greatest.
I love that. So also they realized they had had
all the test processed and Brittany had said that they
were both raped by these masked men, but when the
test came back, they there was no sign of rape

(40:26):
on either of There was no you know, evidence of it. Yeah,
there was all of the normal things that they find
on either of them. Okay. And also her wounds were
few and superficial. Right.

Speaker 1 (40:44):
Yeah, if you're going to hit someone thirty three hundred
something times and the other person just gets a little.

Speaker 2 (40:50):
Yeah, that's crazy about And also because then that's like
there's some crime of passion taking place.

Speaker 1 (40:55):
Yeah, so there is an intended victim here, yes, exactly, Okay.

Speaker 2 (41:00):
And also then they realize for the angles, they start
studying the angles of the of the wounds clearly self
inflicted and she tied herself up. It was all they
start looking back on its stage. Yeah, now there were
in the blood, there were two shoeprints. Jana's shoeprints were
not in the blood, Britney's shoeprints were in the blood,

(41:20):
and a size fourteen men man's shoe one set of
men's shoes were in the blood. So not too like.

Speaker 1 (41:27):
So she grabbed some shoes off the fucking shell. That's
exactly right, the son of a bit.

Speaker 2 (41:31):
And walked around through as if a man was walking through.
What an idiot that she didn't grab both the fucking shoes. Oh,
because it's like the display pair right, Oh my god.
So it's like brilliant and so stupid at the same time. Well,
it's that thing of like you are you can't cover
now a murder. You just can't. You're not as smart

(41:52):
as you think you are. You can't. And also cops
have seen it a million's times, like they know what
they're looking at and what looks weird and what doesn't.
So ultimately they basically get her to start talking, and
it turns out six days after the crime actually happened,

(42:12):
it was the same night of Janea's memorial, they arrest
Britney Norwood for first degree murder, and so basically they
figure out that that day, Brittany had been caught shoplifting
a pair of yoga pants by Jana, and that's what

(42:34):
caused That was the inciting incident. Obviously, much more was
going on for her to get stabbed over three hundred times,
and they said she used five different weapons all found
within the store. Was oh my god. Yeah, And there
was a blood trail that showed how Jana tried to

(42:56):
escape through the back door and she had one hundred
and seven defensive wounds. Oh my god. So the end
they said that that was the most that medical examiner
had ever seen on a victim. Wow. So this was
a crazy and horrible and extended period of time where
this murder happened. Now here's the creepiest part to me

(43:20):
is Britney goes clearly just goes fucking berserk snaps. She
gets caught. Now she's in that, she's out of this system.
She's the worst of the worst. If you're bad for
drinking diet coke on the floor, imagine we're getting caught
shoplifting would be like in that culture at that store. Also,

(43:41):
I don't think it was probably very easy because Britney
was black, and I don't know what the percentages were
of people who were black that worked as a blue lemon.
But I bet that was an element in it. Yeah,
I'm sure that brought there was something that brought to
the table. There was other articles that talk about how
she had stalked her boyfriend. I think she had. She

(44:04):
was definitely maybe a borderline personality, she had definitely had
some issues whatever. But this girl viciously and insanely murders
her coworker and then lays down in blood for hours
and hours until she gets discovered crazy in the same

(44:25):
room as a dead body. I mean, that's the creepy
level of that. Oh and also she went and moved
because when she called Jana back to let her back
into the store, Jana was double parked, so she had
to go get into her car, and she went and
parked it down like a couple blocks away, and that's
how she got They got that DNA hers in there.

(44:46):
So essentially she had ten hours to stage and plan
this this crime and figure it all out. So anyway,
she was invicted in an hour. They tried to say
that she was insane and they were like, no, sorry,

(45:08):
this was insanely premeditated. Yeah, I mean that's bad phrasing.
This was very premeditated and obviously to try to cover
it up. So she knows yes, yes, exactly, and I guess. Oh,
so she was got She got a life sentence and

(45:29):
with no possibility of parole. So it turned out that
the Lulu Lemon murder was much more fascinating than I
could ever imagine it. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:39):
I thought she just like went in there and shot
her like I didn't even know any of the details.

Speaker 2 (45:44):
It was grizzly as hell. Yeah, and just that the element,
like the pressury, sales, sorority sister element of it is
fascinating to me. Somebody. There's a guy that wrote a book.
His name's David Morse and it's called The This is
going to be wrong. I want to say it's called
The Yoga Pants Murder, but that's not going to be right,

(46:05):
the Yoga storre Murder. There you go so close. Oh
are there are there crime scene photos? I'm sure there are,
but but I want to see them without the body,
so I'm not that fucked up. They wanted to show
the crime scene photos when they were trying to pick
the jury, and they the I think was it when
they were trying to pick the jury. I guess that
doesn't really make sense. But they were basically trying to

(46:26):
introduce these photos and like the defense fought it because
they're so awful. Her skull was cracked, her spine was severed. Oh,
I don't want to say that. I mean it's terrible.
I mean you you know she was stabbed over three
hundred times. It's say it's horrifying. Shit. Yeah, so there
you go.

Speaker 1 (46:47):
I mustay, I must I must stay, Karen must stay.
Everybody should we end them on ome?

Speaker 2 (46:55):
Well? Well, fuck, all right.

Speaker 1 (47:04):
That's a gruesome and sad one horrible We're back, Karen.
Do you have any updates?

Speaker 2 (47:10):
No case updates. Basically, it's all status quo. Although we
got to the bottom of kitchen parties, so that was
the thing that we talked about. It was a Lululemon
kind of like Ali Rally's style. Let's all get together,
you know, like some sort of retail bullshit cult thing
that they make up to make it seem interesting, and

(47:31):
then you get people to whatever.

Speaker 1 (47:34):
I don't have to work that day, but like they
still have to come to the fucking no.

Speaker 2 (47:37):
No. This was a different This was almost like a
little bit of a manipulation of the customers. So essentially,
there were these islands near the fitting rooms, and the
employees were expected to just kind of hang out there
and then stage casual conversations like you're in the kitchen
quote unquote and basically talking about yoga. Ants are like,

(48:00):
oh you need that. I can actually recommend you this
great jackie or.

Speaker 1 (48:04):
Me alone, I mean as someone who's done that job before. Yeah,
at Funky Diva and back in nineteen ninety nine. Like
I know how it goes, and I hate it every
minute of doing it, and I hate every minute of
it being done to me.

Speaker 2 (48:18):
Yes, the retail PTSD of like being forced to engage
h when people don't like it and are rude to
you actively right, really sucks. It's like, if you're a
greeter at the Gap this day, I wonder if they
still do greeters. I don't think they do. Yeah, I don't.

Speaker 1 (48:36):
Think so, But I don't think that you better fucking
get said hi to though, Like if you're a secret
shopper for them.

Speaker 2 (48:41):
Oh yeah, like you have to eyes up. Yeah, you
don't have to stand there like we used to have
to literally stand there and be like socks are on
sild in and blah blah blah, like that whole thing
where you're like having this hip interaction with the person
you're about to buy genes from. It's just like, who.

Speaker 1 (48:57):
Can one means help finding anything? Unless it's like a
movie and they're like on a mission to get this
one thing. No one needs help finding anything?

Speaker 2 (49:04):
Can I help you.

Speaker 1 (49:05):
Find anything today?

Speaker 2 (49:06):
No, in this day and age, doesn't the average customer
really know their rights in the way of like they're
going to find you and let you know. It's kind
of help they need. Like no one's shy anymore about
And that's I'm going to say it again, but that's
my big complaint about Sephora. I just want to go
and touch all the eyeshadows and look at all the samples.
I don't want to. I don't want someone to help

(49:28):
me because oftentimes they're like, oh, you need that, well,
then come over here, and I'm like, no, I'm over
I'm over here. I want to be in this area. Yeah,
Like I don't want to be I don't want to
be this Yeah.

Speaker 1 (49:38):
No, totally, that's it. That's a long zen journey that
you want to take when you're there.

Speaker 2 (49:45):
That's right. Hot bath of a sephora anyway. Also, the
old founder or I guess the original founder who's no
longer involved in the business of Lululemon is a man
named Chip Wilson who has just been spouting pretty nasty
rhetoric for years, and so much so that the company
had to come forward and say that his views don't

(50:06):
represent represent company's values. Wow, and that they are committed
to creating an inclusive environment in that company. So hopefully
that's true and hopefully that actual work is getting done.
And also, you know, the information I was looking for
that could have been really cool to like unveil right
now is that they also change their internal practices and

(50:28):
they don't make everything feel like this weird club that
you're trying to get into while you have a retail job,
which was one of the things we talked about of
like what the pressures and what this job must have
felt like to result in this horrifying murder. But still
there's no way to get that information unless we had
a secret employee, which we don't be so cool, we

(50:50):
should have done that. Although they no longer ask their
employees to pursue shoplifters, which is insane that they ever
did that? Never do that. No, I'll never do that. Okay,
Now it's time for Georgia's story about tent Girl and
the Dough Network. Ready for mine?

Speaker 1 (51:12):
Yeah, okay, mine is about the tent Girl and the
dough Network.

Speaker 2 (51:20):
Whoa do you know? That isn't dear No d.

Speaker 1 (51:23):
Oe asn't like Jane Doe. Oh oh, oh like dough
a dough A dead body, a.

Speaker 2 (51:30):
Female dead body. Oh my god? I had to it?
Did it? Did it? All? Right? So?

Speaker 1 (51:36):
On May seventeenth, nineteen sixty eight, a well digger named
Wilbur Riddle was killing time between jobs picking up glass
insulators on a dirt road. It was just outside Lexington, Kentucky,
so he's scavenging.

Speaker 2 (51:52):
Sure, he comes across.

Speaker 1 (51:54):
A large green tarpaulin and that was commonly used by
carnival workers to store the big big top tens in,
and inside he finds the new decomposing body of a
young woman. She appeared to be in her teens, and
she had been dead for months.

Speaker 2 (52:12):
Oh. They couldn't figure out her exact cause of death,
but it was thought that she'd been knocked out with
a blow of the head and then tied up inside
the bag. To slowly suffocate. And the way they knew
this was that her nails were worn down and broken.
Oh no, as if she had been trying to escape nightmare.

Speaker 1 (52:32):
Yes, she couldn't be identified and became known as the
tent Girl.

Speaker 2 (52:38):
Sorry is sixty eight?

Speaker 1 (52:39):
You said, yeah, okay. It became a local legend. And
her grave had a headstone that had they had put
the a sketch of the what the police had sketched
what she might have looked like, and it said tent
Girl found May seventeenth, nineteen sixty eight on US Highway
twenty five North. Died about April, like all these weird

(53:00):
statistics about her, unidentified. So it was a place where
local teens would visit to cause trouble and to scare
each other, and like on Halloween you had a night
you had to go touch the gravestone and run away
and stuff. And so a couple decades later, there's a
teenager who moves into town named Todd Matthews and he

(53:21):
hears about the story of Tent Girl by a girl
he's got a crush on. Nine months later, he and
this girl get married, and it turns out her name
is Lorie Riddle. Her father was Wilbil Riddle who found
tent Girl. Oh so Todd Matthews becomes obsessed with the case,

(53:41):
and for decades he's determined to find out the true
identity of Tent Girl. Todd's two siblings had died at
birth and had really stuck with him, and so he
says that he felt like tent Girl had become his
sibling until he could find her real family.

Speaker 2 (53:59):
Just so fucking sweet, I might cry.

Speaker 1 (54:04):
So when the Internet's created, he saves up enough money
for he works low income jobs, saves up enough money
to buy a computer, and then he trolls chatrooms and
search engines and missing personal listings, searching for details that
match tent Girl. And he creates a website devoted to
finding her identity. And this is before any of like

(54:26):
web sleuthing shit is going on, Like in his mind,
he's just going to email as many people as possible
till he finds out who this missing person is. So
cut to the night January nineteen ninety eight, and Todd
has been online for hours looking at random stuff when
he comes across a classified ad from a woman who's
searching for her missing twenty four year old sister. Barbara

(54:49):
Ann Hackman Taylor. He Todd sees the three words Lexington
nineteen seven sixty seven missing, and he knows it's her immediately.
So in December nineteen sixty seven, twenty four year old
Barbara and Hackman was a mother and a waitress. She
had married young and then mysteriously disappeared, And they thought

(55:11):
it was a teenager originally when they found the body,
but she's actually twenty four, which is just another reason
like why cops like it wouldn't have taken someone amateur
to find this person because you're looking for a teenager.
You're not going to find someone with totally different statistics.

Speaker 2 (55:27):
Right, you know what I mean? Yeah, they won't fall
into that catch, right.

Speaker 1 (55:31):
So Matthew's arrange just to have Tent Girl's body exhumed,
and in April nineteen ninety eight, DNA tests proved that
Barbara and Hackman is tent Girl.

Speaker 2 (55:41):
Wow. I know.

Speaker 1 (55:43):
The family chooses to have Barbara's remains kept in the
original spot with the original headstone. They just added a
little stone underneath with her real name, nicknamed, date of birth,
presumed date of death, and the inscription loving mother, grandmother
and sister.

Speaker 2 (55:59):
Oh she was a grandmother at twenty four.

Speaker 1 (56:02):
No, I think she had her babe, her daughter, and
now she's a grandmother. Yeah, all right, So he died
before tent girl was identified, but Barbara's husband, George Earle Taylor,
never found a missing person's report, and he told Barbara's
family that she had left him for another man. Yeah

(56:24):
all right, so you know how she was fucking found
in a tarpaulin?

Speaker 2 (56:29):
Am I saying that? Right?

Speaker 1 (56:30):
That was commonly used by carnival workers to store big tents.
Guess what George's job was?

Speaker 2 (56:38):
He was an accountant? Was he an accountant? Was he
Did he work at RII Carnil?

Speaker 1 (56:47):
Yes, he was a carnival worker. He died of cancer
in October nineteen eighty seven, and I hope he rots in.

Speaker 2 (56:56):
Good Yeah, good glad? Fuck yourself? Fuck yourself. Uh isn't
that crazy? Like?

Speaker 1 (57:03):
What what a there's nothing size like size fingerprints that
could have like made it more of a like here's
who done it?

Speaker 2 (57:10):
Yeah? I mean did they? Karen, don't question? I won't
did they play? Did they like tie it back to
the carnival he was working on? Did he maybe? No?
I just meant like at the time when they founder,
did they take that tarpulin or whatever it's called evidence
and then go interview some carnival work, right, see what
local carnival is in town? And then it could that

(57:31):
be the third season of True Detective? This story of
like the carnies. Those are great questions. I was just
excited that they put that together. But gosh, I wish
they had done that before he died of cancer. Yeah,
you know, that's a good point. But I mean, yeah, well, shit, okay,
can I do a different story? No kidding? All right?

Speaker 1 (57:48):
So, so the ending of this is pretty amazing that
Todd Matthews goes on to help create the Dough Network,
which I'm obsessed with. It's an online database containing thousands
of profiles for an identified does Jane and John does
and baby does and amateur sluts try to connect unidentified
bodies with missing people.

Speaker 2 (58:08):
Amazing, like people who are.

Speaker 1 (58:10):
Like nurses and fucking janitors and all these crazy people
who like are doing this for free and their free
time just sit there and try to find matching characteristics
to get these people found and get them you know.

Speaker 2 (58:27):
So is it like web sluting where anyone can do it? Yeah?
Enter the information they started, they started regulating it because
I think that a lot of a lot of police
were getting annoyed with all the calls they were going
to like I think it's this person. I think it's
that person.

Speaker 1 (58:41):
So there's like for each each town or each city,
there's there's like a main person that it has to
go through like a crazy vetting process. Now, so I
feel like, I think this missing person is this unidentified body.
They have to like it has to be checked out
by like a bunch of people who have been certified
by the Doughnut work to do that. But yeah, you
can kind of just like look for It's almost like

(59:03):
that game where you what was the memory one? Where
you turn over a face and you turn it back
over and you have to remember what face. It's called
Memory Thank you. So he also co founded nam US.
It's I think it's supposed to be name US, but
there's no E the National Missing and Unidentified Person's System.
And another thing they do is they they they hire
or they people who who who are who draw portraits

(59:27):
and stuff just for free, Like can we'll take a
dead body and sketch out what the face would look like?
Or take a missing person and sketch out what their
face would look like. Now, Oh, they all do it
for free. Wow, it's pretty amazing. Next place where we
give money for the T shirts?

Speaker 2 (59:42):
I don't know. We can discuss it, we can, all right.

Speaker 1 (59:46):
So, as of two thousand and seven, I couldn't find
any more recent statistics. There's approximately forty thousand unidentified human
remains stowed in back rooms of morgues, buried before they're identified,
and buried in unmarked graves across the country. That number
forty thousand. Shit, and that's two thousand and seven. The
National Crime Information Center records nearly ninety thousand missing people

(01:00:09):
at any given time, So forty thousand of those unmarked
unidentified people. You know, there are websites lists seventy successful
identity resolutions that the site has assisted with.

Speaker 2 (01:00:22):
Oh that's nice.

Speaker 1 (01:00:24):
Thirty six had occurred within the first five years, and
tent Girl was the first case to be identified by
use of the internet. Wow, is that incredible. Todd Matthews,
he just like, wasn't obsessive compulsive with this case. And
because of that, so many families have been able to
find out what happened to their loved ones.

Speaker 2 (01:00:44):
And I'm so fascinated with those stories of.

Speaker 1 (01:00:46):
Like she left home one day and you know, we
thought we'd hear from her again, and we didn't, and
we don't know if she's alive or not. She might've
just fucking moved on and hated our dad and you know, right,
but then they find they're like, you know, by the
side of the road, this so with this crazy tattoo
is found and why can't we identify this person? And
so they put all this stuff in the in the

(01:01:07):
thing and it's very cool.

Speaker 2 (01:01:10):
Yeah, tent girl. There's a photo of her. It looks
like a lot like the drawing sad, right, well, yeah,
but it's like the tragedy that something good came out.
I know, it's very cool nice and also is nice
that idea that like, yeah, that's if you have. It's
just so nice for the families like that, that that

(01:01:30):
idea of just not knowing is so tortuous.

Speaker 1 (01:01:33):
Yeah, And I've kind of been wanting to do I've
been thinking a lot lately about like how can I
volunteer my time in some way that we're this true
crime thing we're doing. And I'm like, you know, do
I work for do I go out volunteer for women's
shelter or something like that.

Speaker 2 (01:01:50):
And this is like, I feel like that's what these
people are doing. Is are like for no, they're not
making any money, they have jobs, they don't need them.
They just want to help find their It's just the
really end of these crazy puzzles and piecing these things together.
And they write you if you have that specific ability
of like you can draw, you know, what a picture
of what they last look like or whatever. It's like
everybody pitching in what their specific talent is. Yeah, yeah,

(01:02:13):
that's very cool. I like that.

Speaker 1 (01:02:15):
So maybe I'll maybe I'll do something like that and
I can't draw, and I can look at tattoos and
remember if they were found on dead bodies or not
do it.

Speaker 2 (01:02:24):
I'm really good at that remembering. No. Yeah, nice. So
that was short one, but I thought it was. No,
that was cool. I like that. It like it's good information. Yeah,
that's a good one, totally. Well, I guess that's it. Yeah,
thank you for listening. Thank you so much.

Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
Can you guys if you rate, review and subscribe on iTunes,
that helps us a lot and we appreciate it, and gosh,
it's nice having you guys. Listen in this podcast. So
Elvis is sitting right in front of Steven's face because
Stephen gave him a cookie last time.

Speaker 2 (01:02:58):
I like that. You just said, gosh, gosh, it's nice
you listen, you buddy, g whiz g whizz you will
who's everybody? Thank you?

Speaker 1 (01:03:07):
Thanks?

Speaker 2 (01:03:08):
And you know what, stay sex and don't get more?
Did Elvis do you want to cook? You?

Speaker 1 (01:03:14):
Well?

Speaker 2 (01:03:14):
Cook you? Whoa n We're back, Georgia. Are there updates
for this case?

Speaker 1 (01:03:27):
Yes, there are updates. This is one of those cases.
I love that there is this tragic story and something
beautiful comes out of it because people, because of humans
and humanity and you know, caring about causes that have
nothing to do with you and just personalizing them. So
I love this story and I love Todd Matthews and

(01:03:48):
unfortunately he passed away earlier this year. He was only
fifty three, and his contributions to the cyber detective community
live on through the Dough Network and Name Us. And
there's a article you can check out if you want
on Vice called The Pioneering cyber Detective who Cracked a
thirty year old cold case by Sammy Carmela that I

(01:04:09):
recommend and together, the Dough Network and name Us have
resolved over sixty five thousand missing, unidentified and unclaimed person's
cases amazing, which is incredible. So get involved in that
if you're good at s losing.

Speaker 2 (01:04:22):
I'm not. Yeah, if you're a person that's interested in
true crime, that is an incredible way to actually, you know,
do something constructive with this interest and interact and help
people out. Well.

Speaker 1 (01:04:34):
Yeah, like I when I had a boring desk job
and didn't do anything, I wish I had known about
this instead, I was just blogging. Yeah, so that doesn't
feel as good as like helping find missing people.

Speaker 2 (01:04:44):
You were helping other funky divas in your area.

Speaker 1 (01:04:47):
That's all. That's my fucking goal in life, and my creed,
my creed and my motto.

Speaker 2 (01:04:52):
And here's your other motto is Nama Stay Sexy, which
was the title of this episode.

Speaker 1 (01:04:57):
Yeah, so no more number puns, thank god.

Speaker 2 (01:04:58):
Yeah, that's right.

Speaker 1 (01:05:00):
And so if we're naming this episode today based on
something we said in the episode, would it be trailer spoiler?
Which Karen jokes she's going to spoil the trailer of
the new jam Vrenet Ramsey Dalky series. Don't spoil you
can't even fucking spoil a trailer these.

Speaker 2 (01:05:14):
Days, That's right. And then Georgia said, gosh, it's nice.
That's so funny. Gosh it's nice. Because we were thanking
listeners for listening to the show, and she said, Gosh,
it's nice having you guys listen. Was that sarcastic?

Speaker 1 (01:05:27):
No, I hear my gosh, is definitely something that has,
you know, regularly come out of my mouth? Is that
something whose I don't know. I think it's like quaint
and old, tiny, and I like it, like.

Speaker 2 (01:05:38):
Yeah, it is, it's nice.

Speaker 1 (01:05:40):
I don't care about taking God's name pain, so why
would I? Gosh, it's nice, Gosh, I guess you know what.
It's like a humbled thing. I'm just humbled.

Speaker 2 (01:05:48):
Gosh, golly, golly, gee, golly, gee, whoa. Well, Gosh, guys,
thanks so much for listening. Gosh, I'd pick that title
for the show title because I love but it's nice.

Speaker 1 (01:06:01):
It's nice, and so are you, guys, and Gosh, appreciate
you still.

Speaker 2 (01:06:05):
Gosh, gosh, if I was listening right now, I turn
this off, stay sexy and don't get murdered.

Speaker 1 (01:06:13):
Goodbye by Elvis. Do you want a cookie?