Rewind with Karen & Georgia - 65: Pre-Milked Cereal - My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Last, Hello, and welcome to Rewind with Karen and Georgia.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Every Wednesday, we recap our old shows with all new
commentary and updates and insights. You are welcome.

Speaker 1 (00:24):
Today we're recapping episodes sixty five, which we named pre
Milked Cereal, which makes total sense. In a minute, we.

Speaker 2 (00:30):
Swear, yeah, we're going to explain everything. This episode came
out on April twentieth, twenty seventeen.

Speaker 1 (00:35):
For twenty bro. All right, let's listen to the intro
of the episode sixty five. Should we podcast?

Speaker 2 (00:46):
Are these the new mics? Yes, that's podcast.

Speaker 1 (00:54):
Okay, let's podcast so early in the day. The podcast
in this podcast? Feel like we should do it at night?

Speaker 2 (01:00):
Yes, this is definitely a nocturnal podcast.

Speaker 1 (01:03):
Yeah, like with lights off.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
Should we shut some stuff down? Maybe make it spooky?
Should we? Should you get your central system to shut
it all? Oh?

Speaker 1 (01:13):
You know the clapper the entire.

Speaker 2 (01:16):
Because I'm rich.

Speaker 1 (01:18):
Oh nothing happened?

Speaker 2 (01:21):
Oh hi, Yes, this is my favorite murder.

Speaker 1 (01:25):
That's Karen Kilgara and.

Speaker 2 (01:27):
That's Georgia hard Stark. We're here to talk to you
about true crime. Are you ready?

Speaker 1 (01:30):
Are you ready for this? We haven't planned any of
this conversation.

Speaker 2 (01:34):
No, not at all, although it did have a kind
of a lilting, choreographed quality. That's just how we naturally
are with each other. That's just us.

Speaker 1 (01:43):
That's us. We don't write anything down, we don't prepare
in any way.

Speaker 2 (01:47):
We're just like the TV show This is us, that's us,
same exact thing. No, I'm sure it's great though, speaking
of TV. Oh it's a good segue. Yeah, we wrote
that we were heard. Oh it just turns out. Oh
that's weird.

Speaker 1 (02:05):
I just got real TV again after like moving in
and being like we don't need TV, let's just we'll
just do Reroku and blah blah blah, and all these
things didn't work. No, and I was like, I just
want to turn like a food show on while I
stuff at tamali into my mouth in the middle of
the day.

Speaker 2 (02:21):
Yeah, Like I don't want to have.

Speaker 1 (02:22):
To beat boop up and find the thing and then
like watch the thing. Yeah, you just want to watch
h TV for five minutes.

Speaker 2 (02:29):
You want to dive into the stream of TV that's
already happening, as opposed to hunt out specific because I
find when I go hunt out specific things, I don't
like it when I find like it makes me go, oh,
I don't actually like this.

Speaker 1 (02:44):
Like my food gets cold well, because I can't eat
in silence. I have this problem with that.

Speaker 2 (02:49):
Hut me too.

Speaker 1 (02:50):
So yeah, it's like you're scrolling like fine, I can
watch an episode of or like five minutes of Friends
while I fucking eat this Tomali again. The I mean,
let's be honest. I mean cereal for lunch was Tamali?

Speaker 2 (03:01):
The choice you made like this will impress people, No, because.

Speaker 1 (03:04):
They're frozen Tomali's from Trader Joe's, those ones that are
like that, they just heat up and put salsa on
and then I'm like they're half cold.

Speaker 2 (03:11):
The way you just said that made it sound like
you're like, fine, I'll admit it, I'm eating Cereal. I
want you to think I'm sitting here eating Tamali's.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
Home made Tomali's. Okay, fine, it's not made cereal, you
know like I like to do. But you made it yourself, right, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:25):
It's not that prepackaged, pre milked cereal, gross pre milk,
pre milked I said it.

Speaker 1 (03:31):
What was it? Like powdered milk and you pour water
into it and it's like cereal, And I bet the
army has that.

Speaker 2 (03:37):
Yeah, I bet they do. So it's like there's powdered
milk and then there's cereal, and then there's a little
capsule of water and then you break it and there's
like a fucking like shitty spoon attached to the whole thing.
It's part of the thing. You break, you freaking thing.
Stephen trademark. That Wait, that just reminds me so Guy,
our friend Guy Brandam, how to pass over cedar Satyr Satyr?

Speaker 1 (04:00):
Fuck?

Speaker 2 (04:00):
I do it wrong every time?

Speaker 1 (04:02):
What if he just had a pass ever cedar tree
in his house.

Speaker 2 (04:05):
I that's how I remembered it that way. I thought
Sator because Satyr's like the animal, like the you know,
a guy with goat legs. Really Sata s a t
y r. You know they play the weird Heart anyhow,
it doesn't matter.

Speaker 1 (04:22):
Wait, oh, I brant him Ssata. How is it?

Speaker 2 (04:24):
He? It was, of course lovely, he writes. Basically like
a whole play. Everyone at the table has parts and
you have to like follow along and you say the prayers.
But then there's other things and we play games. It's
hilarious and really fun. But at one point I he
served Quail he served quail and I was eating it

(04:46):
and then I flicked out the tiniest wishbone and then
I did the I was sitting next to guy named Matt,
who was super cool, who's a writer that I now know,
and so we snapped the wishbone and I f one.
I got my wish man.

Speaker 1 (05:02):
I haven't had a wish one since I was a kid,
probably at a satyr, But like, that makes me so excited.

Speaker 2 (05:08):
It's not funny. And it was a tiny one because
it was from a quail, so it was like it
flicked out and then I was like, hold on a second,
I think I just found a wishbone.

Speaker 1 (05:16):
It was like that the email from fucking animal rights
activists and Karen, you know, the wishbone was part of
this animal's life and happiness.

Speaker 2 (05:24):
That's right now, it's part of my happiness because it's
going to bring me my wish. Give it. What was
your wish?

Speaker 1 (05:29):
Tell us?

Speaker 2 (05:30):
We won't tell anyone because then it won't come true. Right,
that's not a thing. Just eternal love, that's all.

Speaker 1 (05:37):
Now, it's not going to come true.

Speaker 2 (05:38):
Well, did you drunk me?

Speaker 1 (05:41):
Did you eat a filter fish?

Speaker 2 (05:43):
No? That's my favorite. Uh it wasn't served. He did
so every year he does a different theme. It's not
standard traditional Jewish food. So it was Syrian food. Oh wow.
It was a series of dishes that one more delicious
than the next.

Speaker 1 (06:00):
A series of Syrian food.

Speaker 2 (06:01):
A series of seris, series.

Speaker 1 (06:04):
Of Syrian serving. No, forget it, no, you had it.
I like, well, there's Syrian Jews. I mean that's cool.

Speaker 2 (06:12):
Are there? Yeah, tell me about them.

Speaker 1 (06:14):
I have never met them, but I'm sure they're there.

Speaker 2 (06:17):
I bet they are.

Speaker 1 (06:18):
Okay, that's amazing television. Yeah, and speaking of you need
you really quickly plug the Guy Brenham TV show that
you're on. Oh, that's talking about TV and Guy Brenham.
It's so funny. And that and again, what a great segue.
I mean, thanks for remembering your line yet to what
we're actually talking about. It's all scripted. If we never
actually the segues are great, but they never talk about Yeah,

(06:40):
they just lead us away from topics.

Speaker 2 (06:43):
That's why people hate this podcast. I am on a
television show called talk show. The game show. Guy Branham
is the host. He's also our legal representative, but he
is also a talk show host on a game show
on True TV Networks. So it's Wednesday night, it's at
ten o'clock. Two episodes have already played. Tomorrow night will

(07:04):
be the third episode?

Speaker 1 (07:05):
Is that Friday night?

Speaker 2 (07:06):
Or Wednesday night? Wednesday night? Oh shoot, so last night?
So next week?

Speaker 1 (07:11):
Whatever? Had I'm sure that they're playing it. I've seen
it constantly. They're playing it over and over.

Speaker 2 (07:16):
Yeah, I bet they repeat it. But but I wish
this was earlier because I think this they're like now,
it's all they're watching the ratings to see if they're
gonna pick it up please everyone Wednesday such alarm clocks.
I guess I'll tweet about it. But anyway, anyway, so TV.

Speaker 1 (07:34):
I got TV finally, and then I watched the which
means I get all access to fucking ID and you know,
Dateline all this shit, and everyone's like, did you watch
Casey like three part Casey Anthony thing right? And so
I was like, all right, this is my job. I'm
gonna do this.

Speaker 2 (07:50):
Can I just say I saw those tweets and questions
and hey, watch this and whatever, and I purposely don't
watch anything about Casey Anthony. I don't like that. I
don't find anything in that story.

Speaker 1 (08:03):
I was just gonna say that we really just don't
get a shit about her.

Speaker 2 (08:06):
I don't want to know. I don't want to know.
It's because I hate that story so much.

Speaker 1 (08:12):
Me too, And I was gonna say I just fucking
couldn't watch it, like I know, it's like my job
and I should watch it and talk about it. I
was just like, fuck this con man. She just sucks
so hard.

Speaker 2 (08:22):
But I don't understand why she is. This the glamorization
of female criminals in that way where it's like, so
she's a young, hot girl that has a child that
went to a party and maybe killed her child, But like,
are we reporting about her more than other people because
she's like a skinny white girl that was like at

(08:45):
a party. Is it the same thing as that other
girl that killed her boyfriend?

Speaker 1 (08:49):
That I think they get lumped together a lot. I
think what it is is the coldheartedness in which like
it just she's such a deep, deep narcissist, uh huh that.

Speaker 2 (09:01):
It's hard to watch.

Speaker 1 (09:03):
Like her jails tell you know, conversations with her parents
where you know, when she first gets arrested is like me, me, me,
me me, not my daughter's dead. There's nothing about like
my baby is dead. It's like, I can't believe this
is happening to me, and this isn't fair. I mean,
it's just like her poor parents have to come to

(09:23):
the realization that they raised a piece of shit narcissist
who killed what could have been a nut piece of
shit narcissists or grandchild, and now they like have to
stick with her. It's almost like this thing of this
is all we have left is to stick with this kid,
the one who sucked.

Speaker 2 (09:41):
I can't tell if it's because I haven't had enough
diet coke today, but I feel nauseous right now talking
about her like she that it makes me nostals because
there's other cold hearted bitches in the world, but this
is like saying, let's pay more attention to her because
she weighs ninety seven pounds. I just hate the Nancy
grace of at all for this particular story. And it's

(10:03):
the same one with the other one, where I was
always like, why, yes, why are we talking about her?
And it's the same thing. It's this kind of like
can you believe this hot bitch is this much of
a cunts? Basically, can you believe he knew? Yes, who
fucking knew. There's so many different types of counts out there.

Speaker 1 (10:23):
Yeah, it's like, can you believe not hot bitches are funny? Yes,
because that's what they fucking needed to do. Yeah, that's
the standard.

Speaker 2 (10:30):
Actually, yeah, that's that's the most common is we're not hot.
That's why we're funny.

Speaker 1 (10:37):
We didn't grow up.

Speaker 2 (10:38):
I'm not talking to you. I meant that for I
didn't mean that in an accusatory way.

Speaker 1 (10:42):
You should see some photos of music kid, because you
ain't wrong. Oh my god, I got a perm and imbraces.

Speaker 2 (10:50):
Anyways, Yeah, so Casey Anthony, No, thanks, stupid idiot. Awful.
It's just sad and then awful. There's nothing in there
that I go, oh this is fascinating. Yeah, I just
go this is a tragedy.

Speaker 1 (11:06):
Yeah, yeah, it's ugly rough. I wrote shit down. Do
you have any what do you want to Oh?

Speaker 2 (11:12):
I do? Well? This is I wanted to read you
because I read this this morning on Twitter. Uh this said, Uh,
there's a I guess a website called last and it
basically is all the stuff around La Las. Oh I
love Las. Yeah, they do it in all different cities. Yeah,
surely it's owned by Rupert Murdoch or someone like that.

(11:34):
But it brings me my local news. And the headline
this morning was dead body found in car parked in
Filipino Town. And let me just this is a short
thing I will read you. A body was discovered inside
a vehicle parked in the middle of the street along
the three hundred blocks of Westlake Avenues. That stopped. That's
that's well. Turns out they people found it at two

(11:57):
ten in the morning. The body of a male Haspan
like in his thirties was found in the back seat
of a black Hyundai. It had an uber sticker. It's
believed to have been towed to that location that it
was discovered at, not driven toad there. A spokesman woman
for the LAPD said told a lash.

Speaker 1 (12:17):
My mouth is just I'm not being quiet. My mouth
has just dropped open.

Speaker 2 (12:20):
It's crazy that the department cannot confirm these claims. That
detectives and the corner are continuing their investigation of the case.
So basically this is what probably they got the scoop
on the scene, but no one's going to confirm.

Speaker 1 (12:34):
Or never going to hear about it again. That's what's
so crazy about these things.

Speaker 2 (12:37):
That you hear about I And then there's just a
couple tweets of the pictures of the car sitting there
with the cops all around it. Oh my, but the idea,
it's so scary. I've been taking Uber over and over
for the past couple of weeks. My first thought is
that he's a driver, right right, Yes, me too. Yeah,

(12:58):
and someone put him in the back seat after killing him.

Speaker 1 (13:00):
Oh my dad's about to start driving Uber, so that
ain't happening anymore. Oh, yo, you he used to be
a taxi driver in like North Hollywood, Marty was, yeah,
and like down the street from where he was like
parked waiting late at night to get his next call.

Speaker 2 (13:17):
Some dude, some.

Speaker 1 (13:18):
Cab driver got shot in the back of the head
from the back of the seat and he's like quitting. Yeah,
So now he's seeing you becoming Uber driver, and it's like, fuck, dude,
either gonna have a really great story stories to tell,
or you're going to be parked in the middle of
fucking Filipino town.

Speaker 2 (13:33):
Well who knows, I mean, like, who knows. I want
to hear about this story so bad, that's so crazy.
I thought, that's a that's Banana's like, what I want
the story? Yeah, the bo oh I have a podcast
recommendation corner. So this podcast called The Vanished, which obviously

(13:54):
talks about people who vanished. It's like a true crime podcast.
I mean, let me explain this to you. No, I
needed a little bit of an underline, don't worry.

Speaker 1 (14:04):
So they have this one episode. Oh, I forgot what
number it is, but it's the episode, uh called the
Mimi Lewis Story. Mimi, Oh no, what number is a
staven No, it's called the Memi Lewis Story. And it's
really incredible because it's not about it's about this girl,
Mimi Lewis, who vanished she was fourteen, but it's the

(14:26):
whole episode is a conversation with this woman named Sandy
Roberts who runs this nonprofit called Halo's Investigation where they
try to find missing teens and they're like their mission
is to stop getting the label runaway put on teens
and juveniles who to disappear.

Speaker 2 (14:46):
Yeah, and it's.

Speaker 1 (14:47):
It's a really good episode, especially for parents, like of
teenagers and young kids, about what like how this happens,
what happens, how they're lured the internet and they're they're saying.
She's saying, let's stop saying that they're runaways and let's
start saying that they were lured away, which is like
suddenly makes you care so much more, Yes, because it's

(15:09):
this like automatic thing of when you're like, oh, she
ran away, then she deserves whatever happened to her. Yeah,
but it's like, no, if someone manipulated her and you know,
you know that kind of thing, and she was having
a hard time at home and you know, and was
lured away, and there's like a bunch of stuff about
sex trafficking and what that means, which is I mean,
it's a really good episode.

Speaker 2 (15:30):
Wow, that's very cool. Yeah, it kind of moved me
a lot. And that's Vanished, Vanished, the Vanished, it's the
Mimi Lewis episode. Cool. Yeah, Oh, my sister sent me. So,
my sister is a big creeper on the Facebook page.
She likes to go in there and look around silently
and secretly, and then she'll text me things that she

(15:51):
sees and likes on there, and this is like vetting
it for you exactly. And so this one was the
day after the Milwaukee show and she sent me a
text that said this made me tear up a little
look at the amazing community you guys created, and and
then it said, uh, went to see the MFM last

(16:12):
went to see MFM last night in Milwaukee. My friend
and I went to get dinner beforehand, and it was
like Murderino's descended on Milwaukee. It was the best ever. Basically,
everyone we passed, I would whisper, shoot, I would whisper
to my friend, they're totally hair for the show. Definitely
a Murderino. When we were at bars before and after,

(16:32):
you slowly watched groups growing larger and larger as separate
groups would realize that we are all were Murderinos and
joined together. Why can't that that be the normal bar scene.
That would be a dream. Thank you Karen and Georgia
and all. I think it cuts off at the bottom
it says. I think it says all Murderinos everywhere. But

(16:54):
I love that so much because actually, we didn't create
this community. You guys have created it for yourselves, and
it's we're just up here kind of like reading these
stories and recording these podcasts, But you guys are the
boots on the ground that are like every time we
have a VIP meet and greet after a show, people
will tell us I met dumb in line. Now I'm

(17:16):
hanging out with that girl, like it's the cutest thing
in the world.

Speaker 1 (17:19):
I think that's what the live shows have done probably
the most for us is make us like, actually, see
all of these people who are like the shows are
so positive, and I'm always like, people are like, I'm
scared to go alone. It's like, no, You're gonna meet
one hundred fucking cool people that are your friends. It's
just such a cool thing, and I'm it's not. And
it's not like they all get together because of our podcast.

(17:41):
They get together over their love of true crime, which
we all feel so in the dark about because you're
not supposed to talk about it.

Speaker 2 (17:48):
And then it's people I think who aren't really the
types of people like it's like somebody like me, who
I'm not gonna be the kind of person's like, hey,
what are you interested in? I'm always like arms crossed,
And I think when people they have it's a you know,
I just a second ago said it's so cute, and
that's the worst. I hate that word. I don't know
why I used it, because what it really is is

(18:08):
a very empowering cool, Like it's almost like skipping over.
It's almost like a weird tinder for friends where you
don't have you go, oh, I know this person already. Yeah,
I don't have to like make excuses or pretend I
don't like a thing. I like, yeah, I already have
this thing in common. And then we go from there,
which is very cool, and it's just to us. It's

(18:32):
just a it's thrilling to be able to be a
part of this thing that you guys are doing.

Speaker 1 (18:37):
Definitely, this is listen. We didn't know this would be
a thing.

Speaker 2 (18:42):
Hey, listen, Hey, listen, listen, listen and learn, listen and
kind of learn. We didn't know, and we fucking love it.
And we're so so proud of you, bless We're proud
of you.

Speaker 1 (18:56):
We're grateful, we're proud of.

Speaker 2 (18:57):
You for going to shows and getting into the mix.

Speaker 1 (19:00):
Yeah, thank you for supporting us. Hey, is it birthday corner? Oh?

Speaker 2 (19:08):
It is birthday corner? Is it birthday corner, Stevens, that's right,
it's Stephen's birthday corner.

Speaker 1 (19:12):
Stephen's birthday corner.

Speaker 2 (19:14):
Hi, it was I thought you were gonna give it
a good high. Hi. Say Hi birthday.

Speaker 1 (19:23):
Boy, It's like we're at TGI Fridays and he knows
that someone's about to come singing, and we're all just like, oh,
it's gonna.

Speaker 2 (19:29):
Come, so worst feeling, or you're waiting for that sombrera
to get thrown down. And we're done that to someone
whose birthday it wasn't.

Speaker 3 (19:35):
Oh shit, you that's twisted.

Speaker 2 (19:38):
Can I tell it? Well, I won't tell it now
because we're trying to give a birthday greeting. But one
time people did that and they were talking about me
before I came back from the bathroom and I thought
they were talking shit about me, and I started crying
and then they were like and then I just sat
down at the table like full pouting, and everything got
super uncomfortable, and then it was like happy and when

(19:58):
I realized.

Speaker 1 (19:59):
What it actually doing the nice that's like, so shows
you what your brain does. That's incorrect.

Speaker 2 (20:04):
Yeah, when you're in a bad situation, it was already about.

Speaker 1 (20:08):
And it's like okay, anyway.

Speaker 2 (20:09):
Anyways, it's about Stephen, it's about you. Here's one second,
here's the thing in the card. Yeah, it's a big things.
You're just presenting Stephen with his birthday gift from us.
It's organic and we're making you open it on on camera.

Speaker 3 (20:23):
So much pressure on camera.

Speaker 2 (20:25):
There's so much pressure to like this.

Speaker 3 (20:26):
I can do it with one hand. Okay, good, there's
cat on the tape. It's great, perfect part of the present.

Speaker 2 (20:34):
They wanted to add something, that's what they Oh I
didn't add. That's all they could afford.

Speaker 3 (20:39):
It, says California six Woods.

Speaker 2 (20:41):
Mall. No, don't give them a shout out.

Speaker 1 (20:44):
We paid for this.

Speaker 3 (20:45):
I'll cut that out.

Speaker 1 (20:46):
I'll cut that.

Speaker 3 (20:46):
Out, Stevens. It's organic whiskey. That's so cool. Oh my gosh,
my favorite.

Speaker 1 (20:52):
Okay, open the card though, and it cards the important
and whiskey my favorite with.

Speaker 2 (20:57):
Organic whisky, my favorite. It's vegan, gluten free whiskey with
a bear on the front.

Speaker 1 (21:01):
It's also non alcoholic. We hop about that. We're worried
about you. It's just this is an intervention.

Speaker 3 (21:07):
Yeah, oh my gosh. Should read it. Yeah, oh okay,
we want dear Stephen, thank you so much for everything.
We've donated three hundred dollars, oh my gosh, to Santy
Door in your name, because you know you love the kiddies.
Happy birthday, Karen and Georgia. Oh thank you.

Speaker 1 (21:22):
Santa Door is a really great catch. Not I don't
want to call it shelter y rescue, cat rescue down
close in our neighborhood.

Speaker 3 (21:30):
Yeah, it's oh my god, but you love Yeah, yeah,
I've done done work with them before. Yeah, the Christy
Keith has been on my podcast, The per Cres This
is so amazing. Yeah, it's like, because I've seen that
you can do that, you can like basically like, yeah,
sponsor a cat, Oh my god, thank you.

Speaker 1 (21:44):
So well, we just get it to them and said
this is for Stephen Ray Morris. I like that.

Speaker 2 (21:50):
That Actually, the feel of all of that really turned
into a look what we did for you.

Speaker 1 (21:54):
I know, look at how good we are?

Speaker 2 (21:56):
Can I say that?

Speaker 1 (21:56):
Vince was like pushing hard for like the past month
or like what do I Stephen? And he just kept saying,
what about a house Kimo, No, he can wear on
the house.

Speaker 2 (22:04):
He just capt and I was like, what the fuck
are why are you fucking pushing for this? It's like,
I don't know, I can just see Stephen enjoying a
house como and I was like, he has a roommate.

Speaker 3 (22:13):
Just lounging around. Yeah, I mean, I mean this is great.
First second you were it was like pull out a cat,
just like you're sending cat.

Speaker 1 (22:22):
We got you a a cat. You can take that
where we take three hundred dollars back and then buy
a cat. And I got a cat? What are they
called mill? Mill?

Speaker 3 (22:32):
This is much better? Oh my gosh, thank you so much.

Speaker 2 (22:35):
Happy day.

Speaker 3 (22:37):
Yeah, thirtyth yeah, the Big three. Oh I wanted people
to think I was twenty, but.

Speaker 1 (22:43):
We're fired. Okay, oh yeah, we don't have anyone over
thirty in our Oh.

Speaker 2 (22:47):
No, it's agism. We totally support it. Stephen, What are
you going to in your next thirty years? Let's hear
a short term goal? I lets say a long term goal.
Let's hop how are you going to reposition yourself for
the next thirty.

Speaker 3 (23:03):
Like, oh, I want to invest in real estate. I
feel like that's smart.

Speaker 2 (23:09):
It is.

Speaker 1 (23:10):
It's like what would we say, I want to eat
a million things.

Speaker 3 (23:14):
Have have more donut companies make donuts of my face. Yes,
that's smart, and then have like a cat ranch. Maybe
just open up.

Speaker 2 (23:21):
This sounds amazing. Really huge cats, like horse sized cats. Cool,
it's all man coons, like the biggest cats you've ever
seen children riding cats.

Speaker 3 (23:30):
I think that's I mean, that feels like giving back,
you know.

Speaker 1 (23:33):
Yes, smart, Yeah, these are all positive things. What's one
insane stupid thing you're going to do?

Speaker 3 (23:39):
I mean the one like because I kind of feel
like I'm doing what I love for a living now
and I feel really lucky to feel that way. But
there's always like that one insane thing that you're like,
oh if I had this, Like I've always wanted to
learn how to fly an airplane. Oh, one thing that
like I feel like when you can afford the gas
money because like renting, like learning how to fly isn't

(24:00):
that expensive, but renting the buying the gas is the expensive.

Speaker 1 (24:03):
That's interesting.

Speaker 3 (24:04):
And I've always wanted to like learn how to fly plane.

Speaker 2 (24:06):
Stephen, here's okay, now we're going to make a solid plan.
You do that, You take the next how long does
it take? Eighteen months? Learned to fly planes? And then
we get.

Speaker 1 (24:17):
A private plane.

Speaker 2 (24:18):
I knew you were going there, right, Yeah, and we
go Internacio now.

Speaker 3 (24:22):
Yeah, flyover in National Yeah.

Speaker 1 (24:27):
We're going to and Karen and I are on the
wings the whole time.

Speaker 2 (24:32):
We Amelia Hair Air Heart the fuck out of this tour.

Speaker 1 (24:35):
I means we die.

Speaker 3 (24:36):
Yeah island yep it ended.

Speaker 2 (24:39):
Oh yeah, they're pretty sure.

Speaker 1 (24:40):
They found off an island they found Yeah.

Speaker 2 (24:45):
Sorry, Oh no, no, no. The birthday Amelia air hurts like
died of starvation? Turney is your bad news birthday? Yep,
it turns out Amelia Earhart is dead.

Speaker 1 (24:55):
Can I just say too that growing up, yeah, Santa
is not real? Oh ship careful. The thirties thirties are
your best. The twenties. You couldn't fucking pay me view
my twenties again.

Speaker 3 (25:04):
No, I'm stoked to be thirty. Yeah, I'm really excited.

Speaker 2 (25:06):
Good twenties are a disaster, right, But thirties. I would
say this about your thirties thirties because you're out of
your twenties. You think now, I know, now, I get it.
Just remember that you do not know, and that once
you're in the position of that then you can kind
of like be flexible. But my big mistake in my
thirties is like, ugh, I'm so much smarter now, and
I think that made me even stupider.

Speaker 1 (25:27):
Mine was that I have to grow up now and
I'm like, and you don't have to like people who
are like I'm thirty two and I'm going to marry
my boyfriend and I'm like, don't fucking do that.

Speaker 2 (25:36):
You don't even you're thirty two, Like.

Speaker 1 (25:38):
Just don't don't take anything like relationships and jobs and
whatever situation you're in as seriously as you think you're
supposed to win. You're in your thirties, like you can
wait till your later thirties, which I'm about to be
to do that. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (25:52):
Nice, Yeah, thank you, Steven.

Speaker 2 (25:53):
Oh my gosh, And now you give us advice.

Speaker 3 (25:57):
Well, the carriage thing was kind of in the real
estate that.

Speaker 2 (26:01):
You're right realist.

Speaker 1 (26:02):
That was like I was kind of hinting that you
two idiots who don't spend your money. Well, should have
you read her friend? Steven?

Speaker 2 (26:11):
Well done.

Speaker 1 (26:12):
We're glad you're here.

Speaker 2 (26:13):
Yeah, We're very glad we have you here.

Speaker 3 (26:15):
Yeah, thank you.

Speaker 2 (26:16):
And soon you'll be paid for your work, can't. Someone
we were getting interviewed for something and someone was like,
can I just ask do you pay Steven? Like almost
like you put him through so much shit, do you
at least pay him? And I'm like, yeah, people, they're
very concerned that we're that we really are mean to you, Yeah,
which is not true. So there's three hundred dollars in

(26:37):
charity to prove we're not dick.

Speaker 1 (26:39):
Oh no, it okay, good. You had a sister. You
know what it's like to be treated like shit. We all,
all three of us know what it's like to be
treated like a sister, like a sibling.

Speaker 2 (26:53):
Anyways, that's right. That's why we treat at will what
however we want, coming from a victims stance. Now, I
do have a correction this corner. Okay. We talked about
it a little bit in both Indianapolis, Milwaukee, and Chicago,
but I am everyone forced to say to the nation

(27:13):
and the world.

Speaker 1 (27:14):
I forgot about it. Everyone's holding their breath.

Speaker 2 (27:17):
Marry Hill. Everyone knows Cherry Hill's in New Jersey. Everyone
knows that, every single person on this planet.

Speaker 1 (27:23):
I don't.

Speaker 2 (27:24):
I certainly didn't, and neither do the producers of City Confidential,
because they really led me to believe that Cherry Hill
was in Pennsylvania.

Speaker 1 (27:33):
Hello everyone, because I just love this where it's like,
so you did your murder a week ago before the
live show aired, Yeah, and it was about.

Speaker 2 (27:42):
Fred Newlanders, right, the running Rabbi.

Speaker 1 (27:45):
Yeah, and I thought maybe you were like I did
it once on accident, but you thought it was there.
I didn't know.

Speaker 2 (27:52):
Yeah. Now, the problem with it really is that I
feel like some other part of my brain did know that,
Like the first indoor mall was in New Jersey. That
just makes good sense. I guess who the fuck? No
context clues. No, No, you're right, I mean I don't.
I'll just write down whatever and then say whatever.

Speaker 1 (28:11):
Middle of Pennsylvania, like middle of nowhere, not near Pittsburgh
has to be so boring that they're like put them
all here because everyone's so bored. All they do is
like clouds trouble. Let's give them a place to.

Speaker 2 (28:22):
Go, get them, give them a nice indoor mall.

Speaker 1 (28:25):
Give them the all Like New Jersey's kind of fine.
They have like cool, weird shit to do, don't they.

Speaker 2 (28:30):
I don't know. I don't either. I clearly don't know
anything about any What I said to people when we
were on tour was in California. You can't just go
to another state real fast, which is how they were
making it sound. In the city conveinential, Like the daughter
lived in Philly and so she like drove into Cherry Hill.
So like that just led me to believe you can't

(28:52):
just drive in. If you're in LA and you want
to drive in from Nevada, that's going to take a while.
I mean, it just doesn't make sense to someone that
lives on this part of the planet.

Speaker 1 (29:04):
You know what, fuck it, fuck it all? Who fucking cares?

Speaker 2 (29:08):
Fuck it all?

Speaker 1 (29:08):
Fuck it up?

Speaker 2 (29:10):
That's the that's the tagline. Why am I the one
singing now? Because it's fun? You got to do it,
and also you can do it. You try to act
like you can't and you can't. Okay, I just did it.
You're right, I did it. Where are we now?

Speaker 1 (29:25):
Should we talk about the theme of this podcast?

Speaker 2 (29:28):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (29:29):
Murder?

Speaker 2 (29:30):
Oh, not singing? And we're back. Are you surprised that
we used to have like nine topics at the top
of every show, because I am that's so many corners?

Speaker 1 (29:46):
Yeah, but it's set a precedent. So now and we
don't have more than like three, I feel like we're
not giving everything we have, right, Yeah, So, like, what's
the happy medium? Six and a half?

Speaker 2 (29:57):
Having never started this podcast, don't say that, Karen?

Speaker 1 (30:01):
How about it? Really? It has taken me a long
time to get used to recording this podcast during the day,
but I still feel like, this is a it's dark
out let's record. Yeah, but I guess not that we're
in the studio where it's always dark out inside.

Speaker 2 (30:14):
Yes, it's okay, it's always nighttime in here. It is.

Speaker 1 (30:17):
And you walk out, You're like, how it's still fucking
light out.

Speaker 2 (30:20):
When you go outside and it's full sun and over
ninety degrees right, it's like leaving a party at five am.

Speaker 1 (30:25):
Ooh oh god. Yeah, that was the worst.

Speaker 2 (30:28):
This is my way of introducing white drugs into the
current recording schedule.

Speaker 1 (30:33):
We're never having started. We're doing fucking white drugs and
fucking pre milk. Cereal now in twenty twenty five, in
today's America exists, it's real. We were like, what's the word.

Speaker 2 (30:45):
Uh visionaries?

Speaker 1 (30:46):
Yeah? Yeah. In twenty seventeen, we're like, why is in
this a thing? And kell Ogg was like, guess what.
Twenty twenty two, they launched instables single sort of cereal
bowls containing dry cereal plus powdered milk, which I've never
had powdered milk before. Of you.

Speaker 2 (31:00):
I had it at camp and it's not pleasant.

Speaker 1 (31:04):
It's not milk.

Speaker 2 (31:04):
It's like, if you are from a dairy based community,
like I was dairy proud. Our creamries are are our
bread and butter literally, and powdered milk doesn't taste right. Well,
it's kind of taste. It tastes a little bit like creamer.
It's a little chalky, kind of powdery.

Speaker 1 (31:23):
It's abomination.

Speaker 2 (31:25):
But then like some people grew up on it where
it's like more convenient, it's cheaper whatever. So and also
once you get that sugar cereal in there, you're fine.

Speaker 1 (31:33):
It's like powdered coffee or you're like, I know that
this is not fresh frud fucking fresh ground beans, but
I want coffee right now. Yes, And so I will
live with this.

Speaker 2 (31:41):
I will take the caffeine hit any way. You serve
it up to me.

Speaker 1 (31:45):
Right and in a couple of days, I fucking like it.
I find myself liking it.

Speaker 2 (31:49):
And it's cheap.

Speaker 1 (31:50):
I prefer it. Yes, I want that spoon sound and
the bug.

Speaker 2 (31:53):
What I think is funny is like, is this for
people who go camping or something? Who because basically, when
you're eating cereal, asl cool J said, milk, yeah, cereal,
I mean you don't you don't mess with the most basic,
beautiful recipe of regular milk.

Speaker 1 (32:10):
Cerea sounds like a government cheese situation.

Speaker 2 (32:12):
Yeah, I think it might be a are.

Speaker 1 (32:14):
You camping the what's that trail that everyone loves?

Speaker 2 (32:17):
The Oregon Trails, cit the Northwest, the Appalachian Trail, all that.

Speaker 1 (32:23):
There's all those ones. If you're hiking them, you need
powdered fucking milk.

Speaker 2 (32:27):
I mean, no judgment. You can powder your milk all
you want or whatever, or not have it.

Speaker 1 (32:32):
Argue with us about it.

Speaker 2 (32:33):
Let's debate this thing. Let's get it going anyway. Congratulations
on inventing powdered milk cereals.

Speaker 1 (32:41):
Yeah, congratulations us.

Speaker 2 (32:43):
Yes, finally, also very cute that we're talking about basically
going all the listeners are getting together and creating their
murdering no subsets, communities, you know whatever, the groups and
being able to like reflect on that basically if it's
a little over a year old. Yeah, so we're really
seeing the kind of effects of this is actually a

(33:04):
thing that they're doing by themselves.

Speaker 1 (33:06):
Totally, Like they're realizing that there are other people that
they can count on who are into the same things
and don't think they're weird, or do think they're weird.

Speaker 2 (33:12):
But like that about like the weirdness. Yeah, they would
never speak at work and suddenly they go, oh my god,
are you serious? Right? You know what I know?

Speaker 1 (33:20):
Yeah, we've just had ten years of that now and
it's been fucking incredible.

Speaker 2 (33:24):
It's so cool.

Speaker 1 (33:25):
One of the best, absolute best parts of this podcast
is like how many people have like come together through it.

Speaker 2 (33:31):
Yeah, watching a community build itself around bullshit you and
your friends say, yeah, once a week is quite an experience.

Speaker 1 (33:40):
And we get all the credit and we get.

Speaker 2 (33:43):
A bunch of money. And I got to move out
of my dark, little, weird fucking house and into a
beautiful mid century dream home.

Speaker 1 (33:50):
That's right. I always think I was still renting at
this point the pod loft, it hadn't all blown up yet,
and I was like, oh my god, I have a
dishwasher like that was That was a game changer.

Speaker 2 (34:01):
And high ceilings in that second apartment.

Speaker 1 (34:03):
Fucking ceilings in the podloft department. In a hot tub
and a hot tub with a cat wasn't my hot tub.
It was a community hot tub. But I am not
picky when it comes to hot tubs.

Speaker 2 (34:11):
You made it your own hot tubs. You were out
there with your goddamn night pudding in the world.

Speaker 1 (34:15):
You know. It was so great though, because our balcony
overlooked the pool, so I could be like, is anyone
in there? Before I went down because a fucking awkward
thing of like you start walking towards the jacuzie someone's
in there, they see you. You can't turn around and
walk the other way.

Speaker 2 (34:27):
You just lock eyes and then get in as you're
staring in like hot soupy water, let's make humans soup together?
So what are you watching on Netflix?

Speaker 1 (34:37):
Just there's no way, no So I could peek out
the window. If someone was in there by the time
I got down there, I would just be so disappointed.
But usually it was like.

Speaker 2 (34:46):
Then you're like looking up and you're like, where are
the security cameras? Okay? Checking this area?

Speaker 1 (34:51):
Like you just usin some laps. Yeah, I'd like to do.

Speaker 2 (34:53):
It's a freezing cold pool. I'm just gonna jump in there.

Speaker 1 (34:57):
All right. Well, should we get into your store this one?
How do you feel about this one today?

Speaker 2 (35:03):
Just seeing it? Well, first of all, I just saw
TikTok where they were talking about's been like fifteen years
and Ronnie Chasin's murder has not been solved. Holy shit,
there's lots of theories. The person who basically did all
of the work on Ronnie Chasin's murder, which was a
mystery when it happened and continues to be till this day,

(35:25):
as a Hollywood reporter reporter from the time named Gary Baum.
And so it was basically him putting this story together,
going down to the records hall, all the stuff which
I will talk about next episode, that put it all together.
And when I was covering the story, I was watching
a TV show called Hollywood and Crime, which was a
play on Hollywood and Vine and really so it's just

(35:48):
like Hollywood based murders. And so I watched the episode
of that and just kind of like took notes like
I used to do with I Survived of like how
does this story go? But it turns out and they
didn't adit. Gary Baum on the show. It was like
the one person that brought this to everybody and knows
all these ans.

Speaker 1 (36:05):
I mean, it taught us so much about like up top,
here's what you do. Yeah, I don't won't talk about it,
but I think I'm glad it happened because I am
to give it an opportunity.

Speaker 2 (36:13):
But it was also back in the day. It's just
funny going back on these shows where it's like having
to like reapproach these huge mistakes. Right then we're very
public mistakes where it's like, oh, it's horrible and this
is all bad. And also then you get that sense
of the haters standing right outside the door ready to hate.

Speaker 1 (36:32):
Exactly like you got to watch your back because you're
watching it too.

Speaker 2 (36:35):
So that's everything that's about to happen. Is this is
about to happen in this story.

Speaker 1 (36:40):
All right, So let's get into Karen's story about Ronnie Chasin.
Do you want to go first? You go first?

Speaker 2 (36:50):
Stephen birthday?

Speaker 3 (36:52):
Karen goes first?

Speaker 2 (36:53):
Is it me? All right? Steve? It's your birthday. You
got to pick whoever you want to go seven, it's
your birthday. Okay, Well tonight today, this afternoon, I'm going
to do the murder of Hollywood super publicist Ronnie Chason.
Do you know this one?

Speaker 1 (37:13):
Is it a she?

Speaker 2 (37:14):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (37:15):
I think I don't know anything about it. Okay, take
me there.

Speaker 2 (37:19):
I'm taking you back to twenty ten. Where were you
in twenty ten? Where did you live?

Speaker 1 (37:24):
I was thirty?

Speaker 2 (37:26):
What? Yeah, yeah, dude, I'm liking this.

Speaker 1 (37:31):
I was thirty, I was living in a studio apartment
in Hollywood.

Speaker 2 (37:34):
Hhmm, it's really cute.

Speaker 1 (37:36):
It was like eight hundred dollars a month, which is
the most hilarious thing I've ever heard.

Speaker 2 (37:40):
I thought you said I was really cute. I was
really cute.

Speaker 1 (37:44):
Yeah, that's it. Go ahead. I had a shitty desk
job that I fucking hated, and I had no idea
that my life would be what it is today, And
I'm so glad I didn't, because then it wouldn't have happened.

Speaker 2 (37:54):
Did you wish and wish and hope that you would
not work at a desk anymore? Oh? My god, because
I have to tell you when I had two different
jobs in my early twenties that both brought me such intense,
soul sucking sorrow.

Speaker 1 (38:10):
That was my life until I was thirty. Yeah, that,
and I thought it would be that forever.

Speaker 2 (38:14):
But I feel like, when you're going through that, you
think this, because I feel is bad about it, that
means it's going to happen forever. But actually, yeah, if
you feel that bad about it, it means it won't
continue on.

Speaker 1 (38:25):
Well, in my opinion, I fucking hustled my ass off
and to grasp anything that wouldn't get me there, wun't
keep me there, and that turned into a blog. A
blog yeap. I like used to think, like maybe if
I just get married and have a baby, I can
have some time off. Like that's how bad it was.
I was just like, yeah, get me out of here.

(38:46):
I'll have a baby. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (38:48):
I mean they do solve that problem. They but babies
will get you out of the office, that's for sure. Yeah,
and sometimes keep you from ever returning.

Speaker 1 (38:56):
Let me make this about me or I didn't you asked?

Speaker 2 (39:00):
I did ask you. I want to know because it
was it's weird to think. So it was seven years ago,
so Stephen, you were twenty three? What were you doing?

Speaker 1 (39:10):
What were you doing?

Speaker 2 (39:10):
Stephen?

Speaker 3 (39:11):
I was just about to go to grad school in London.

Speaker 2 (39:15):
It's better than one.

Speaker 3 (39:19):
I dropped out immediately, so that was.

Speaker 2 (39:21):
Great, Okay, London.

Speaker 1 (39:25):
Karen doesn't know where Cherry Hill.

Speaker 2 (39:27):
There's no language. I get offended by anyone that leaves
the country or gets an education. It really piles me off.
Me too, me myself. If it was seven years ago,
were you where was Karen? I was, God? I was
You're married? No, I you know where I was. I

(39:50):
was in New York. I had just left my ex.
I was like, I can't do this, and I bailed
and went to New York. And I was in New York.
This this is when I got into podcasts. Because I
was in New York. I knew about three people in
the entire city. I had a job, luckily, and I
would just come home. I would work all week and

(40:12):
then I would come home and on the weekends, I
would sit at this weird little chopping block table in
the kitchen. I would smoke out the window. Don't smoke,
it's bad for you. And I would listen to Dave
Anthony and Greg Baron's podcast Walking the Room, Oh My God,
and they would fight and blather and like it was
the funniest thing. It was just like and it was
just like being in the room with them. So it

(40:34):
was a weird way. That's why when people freak out
and go like I can't believe I'm meeaning you. You
don't understand, and I always grab them and I'm like,
I do understand. It's like everybody goes through awful things
and needs that kind of like companionship, and that's it
got me through kind of One of the hardest times
of my adult life was pretending that I was having

(40:55):
conversation with Dave Anthony and Greg Barret.

Speaker 1 (40:57):
My whole studio apartment was painted while I listened to
podcasts on a like huge iPod.

Speaker 2 (41:03):
Yeah, but like someone had given me one of those big,
thick blocky ones. Yes, all right, guys, we got it,
We understand. So who got killed? Okay, Now I take
you back to November sixteenth of that year in Hollywood.
So one of Hollywood's most powerful and beloved publicists, Ronnie Chasin,

(41:26):
has just left the premiere party for the movie Burlesque
the Christina aguilera share joint Burless at the w Hotel.
Ronnie's the publicist for there last night.

Speaker 1 (41:39):
We were there yesterday.

Speaker 2 (41:40):
Yeah, that's right. Oh, this one's really forcing over and over.
So she was the publicist for the movie's producer, Donald DeLine.
She was also the publicist for the lighting designer Peggy
Eisenhower and for the composer Diane Warren, who'd written a
song for this movie. She worked the room, and she
was now driving home down Sunset Boulevard. It was twelve

(42:02):
twenty eight am when Ronnie's Mercedes came to a stop
at the left turn lane and the intersection of Wittier
and Sunset. So if you've never been to La before,
most people know about the Sunset Strip, which is like
the most famous part of Sunset Boulevard. It starts the
Sunset Strip starts at Crescent Heights and it goes all
the way down a little bit past Doheeny, and basically

(42:25):
along that strip you've got the Chateau Marmont Hotel, You've
got the Comedy Store, you've got the Viper Room, you've
got the Whiskey and you've got the Roxy used to
be Tower Records. Just there, book Soup is there. There's
a little a very tony she she chunk called the
Sunset Plaza that has restaurants and like the Armani Store,

(42:46):
fancy shopping, fancy eating, and it's basically the it takes
you right into Beverly Hills. So once you get past
that part, the Sunset Plaza portion basically takes a turn
and then suddenly there's trees and there's big tall green
hedges that are blocking off humongous mansions that they don't

(43:08):
want you to look at, and it becomes like this
gorgeous Green Drive, and a little further down on that
drive you've got the Beverly Hills Hotel that costs eight
thousand dollars a night to stay there. Serious, did you
know that? How much does it cost? One thousand dollars
a night?

Speaker 1 (43:25):
Did you say one thousand dollars a night at.

Speaker 2 (43:28):
The Beverly Hills Hotel?

Speaker 1 (43:29):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (43:29):
Fucking kidding. Yeah, I was clicking to see how far
down Sunset it was, and when you click on it,
that hilarious Google thing happens where it's as if you're
trying to book yourself there and it's like over it,
it's like, I think it's ten ninety eight a night. Yeah,
because it's like you know the Polo Club, it's like
the famous much money. Yeah, they only want rich people there,

(43:51):
Fuck you, but foor people that's saved up whenever, no
go say somewhere else. But anyway, what I'm saying is
this is the end of sense of bolevarcu is, if
you keep on driving, you end up at the beach. Basically,
you drive past bel Air, which is the richest regist
u sayle and then ultimately the beach. And that's a

(44:13):
sharp contrast to where Sunset Boulevard's boulevard starts, which is
on basically Olivera Street downtown thirteen miles away. It has
i would say near the majority of Los Angeles has
forty seven thousand homeless people. So the two ends of

(44:34):
this street couldn't be more different. And when you get
into Beverly Hills, the weirdest thing about this. Anybody that
lives in Los Angeles knows, like, you don't go into
Beverly Hills if you don't have a reason to go there,
especially at night. It's empty basically, so it's like she's
driving on sunset at twelve thirty eight at night. There's

(44:57):
no cars on the road. There's certainly no pedestrian ever.

Speaker 1 (45:01):
It's a big, wide street and it's empty.

Speaker 2 (45:03):
It's pristine, perfect, not a drop of litter anywhere, and
it's completely empty. So most people, because because La and
Hollywood is an industry town, most people are in bed
at that time. All those rich people that live behind
those hedges work their asses off and get up at
five in the morning. So it's always, you know, like

(45:25):
lights out at ten o'clock over on that side of town,
unless your job is Premier Parties, which was Ronnie chasin's
job that keeps you out a little bit later. So
by twenty ten, Ronnie Jason's clients had netted around one
hundred and fifty Oscar nominations, Oh my god, seven of
them had won Best Picture, including a three peat between

(45:47):
two thousand and eight and twenty ten. So she represented
people that either worked on or made No Country for
Old Men, slum Dog Millionaire, and the hurt Locker.

Speaker 1 (45:56):
Wow. But tell us what a publicist does exactly just
the people listening, but myself as well.

Speaker 2 (46:02):
Okay, so you're a publicist is the person that make
sure that the press and the media know about their clients'
successes or career at the time. So like for her,
like for publicists, or like around Oscar time or award
season is like the busiest time because that's when they

(46:23):
want everybody to be on talk shows. They want everybody
to be interviewed for newspapers and magazines and stuff, and they.

Speaker 1 (46:30):
Reach out to you.

Speaker 2 (46:31):
Publicists reach out to them exactly, so they're basically they
would call and say, you know, my client, Steven has
this amazing podcast called the per Cast that everyone's talking
about these days, and you've got to get him before
he goes big, so let's get some placement here, here,
and here. And they basically are like a like an

(46:53):
amazing stage mom where they talk about you like you
are going to be the next thing. And because everything
in la is about you don't want the current hot thing,
you want the next big thing. So that's the publicist
deal in the world of that. Then they also just
deal in the day to day of actually booking people
on talk shows. And like all the stories of from

(47:15):
my experience of working on talk shows is when something
bad happens, like say someone cancels or flakes, say your
show has to go down because like the electricity went
off or something, the people you don't want to have
to deal with are the publicists because they're the people
that come in and act on behalf of celebrities, and
they're the bad guy. So a celebrity will never be

(47:36):
the one that's like, I don't want to do your show.
A publicist will be the one that's like, they can't
do it for this reason, this reason, but we can
do it here. And because I know you're disappointed, I
can also get you this person. So they're just a
master politician. They are a they're a cheerleader and they
hustle twenty four to seven. It's an insanely hard job.

(47:58):
I would never want to do it, and it's a
certain type of person that can do it. Yeah, because
you really do have to no way. I mean you
you're on the phone all the time and you have
to like you have to like play the game the hardest,
I think, because you are really like a salesperson but
for people, and so it's sometimes it's that I mean

(48:19):
you've seen you can watch it in movies. There's all
kinds of movies about insider Hollywood stuff. But like there
are those times where publicists can make a star because
it's like you just by a series of happenstance. It's
like something will happen on a production and say somebody drops,
somebody breaks their leg and they drop out and then

(48:41):
they have to get replaced. Well, those that person like
a team comes together and then starts pitching and fixing
and what I mean, I'm this is a completely made
up scenario. I don't know what the actual technical thing is.
But a publicist is the kind of person that can
come in and sell you on some on an unknown
and actually make some one's career. Yeah, and then they

(49:02):
do that more often than like a direct you know,
it's always like a director discovered me or whatever, and
it's usually like a publicist or a casting director. Also,
they're women who like believe in people and watch people
and like vouch for people.

Speaker 1 (49:17):
And if someone owes them a favor, they could be like, well,
put this person in your movies, my client exactly.

Speaker 2 (49:22):
Okay, it's all about favors and what if something happens,
then you owe them a favor or they owe you
a favor, so then you get.

Speaker 1 (49:31):
Or they're reliable. They always bring me the right people,
and yes, it is the person I call first.

Speaker 2 (49:35):
And in TV that's what it all is like when
you start to learn and I barely know that side
because that's the booking side, which I never had to
deal with and I wouldn't have been able to because
I can't organize anything, and they're the most organized people
in the world. But that's all they do all day
is have those conversations where it's like, well, since you
owe us the one from that, now we want this

(49:56):
person on the day that their show comes out. It's
all like it's crazy politics, it's amazing. So she was
friends with a woman named Lily Zanik, and she has
a second name in there, and I didn't write it down,
and then I couldn't find it. It's something xanic, and
I don't know if that means that she was married
to its hyphenated. It was hyphenated, so maybe it's just

(50:19):
important to her that her original name was in there,
but I didn't write it down anyhow. This woman was
friends with Ronnie Chasin and she was also a producer
who won Best Picture with her husband, Richard Zanik. They
made Driving Miss Daisy Wow, and Lily Zank was quoted
as saying the Driving Miss Daisy campaign was all Ronnie,

(50:41):
and that's why I thanked her twice at the Oscars. Wow.

Speaker 1 (50:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (50:45):
So it's just that kind of like the people in
the business know who makes the engine go basically, and
a lot of times it's publicist. So Ronnie Chasin was
born Veronica Cohen in Kingston, New York in nineteen forty six.
She grew up in the Bronx. She moved to la
to be an actor, and she changed her last name
so that she had the same name as the famous
restaurant Chasin's. Oh Wow, Yeah, Smart Yes, it's super smart

(51:08):
because it's like Chasin's is like an insider celebrity restaurant. Yeah,
you just are like, oh, yeah, you better get a
chasin in here. She was on Guiding Light, she was
on the Patti Duke Show. She's gorgeous, like just she
looked like every other blonde actress in the sixties or seventies.
I should I'm not actually sure. I'm sure she would

(51:30):
hate me saying exactly when she was at that at
that age. But basically, eventually she transitions into pr and
she builds this huge career and she's just a hustler
and she's everyone said she was just She was known
for being brassy and unapologetically pushy. She just didn't give
a shit, and she was also really honest, so she
would tell people to their face like uh, she said. Oh.

(51:58):
She had a friend named Kathy Berlin who is New
York publicist, and Kathy Berlin said, I used to say
that Ronnie got half her piece's placed because she would
people would just say enough already, like they would just
she would just wear them down. So she's also known
as being real. People adored her. Obviously, people like to

(52:18):
talk about people being big assholes in this business. But
in my opinion, especially for women, you can't be that
big of an asshole. And yet by you have you know,
people have to love you, and you have to have loyalty.

Speaker 1 (52:31):
There's to be some charm thrown in there.

Speaker 2 (52:33):
There's got to be. Yeah, you've got to build loyalty
to be as successful as this woman was. And there's
a story that someone told because someone who really loved her,
who said she got a lot of flack because she
used to always take a doggie bag home, no matter
what fancy dinner she was at, no matter what fancy restaurant,
everybody being trying to be Hollywood, She'd always take her

(52:55):
food home in a doggie bag, and so people would
like whisper, oh she cheap, or oh she whatever. And
what she actually did was she would take her food,
her leftovers to her mom's house so her mom could
eat the fancy food that she was eating and like,
and she would share the like Hollywood night with her
mom is not lovely.

Speaker 1 (53:15):
I know it's really hard for me to learn that
you can't take half your food home at meetings.

Speaker 2 (53:21):
I mean you can, no, you can't, Like.

Speaker 1 (53:24):
I'm so bad at wasting food that like I no,
I'm done. I could eat that at home the in
my underpants.

Speaker 2 (53:31):
Yeah, but I have to say this, my dad told
me this a long time ago. My dad told me
this when I was like seven, where I was like, really,
thanks for this amazing advice. But he was like, don't
salt your food before you taste it, right, And it
was that whole story of there was like somebody lost
a job because it's it shows that like you need
to be able to try things and decide how they
are as they are. Don't just decide you need to

(53:52):
salt it. You're assuming thing. That's right. Hey, seven year old,
thanks dad, that's really helpful. You'll always get by kid.
So that's I was just going to say, that's That's
a similar thing where there could be somebody that you
eat with that watches you take your food home because
you want to keep it, and goes she's a smart,
frugal customer that doesn't give a shit who's watching her.

(54:15):
Those are always the stories in Holly Hollywood anyways, people
going not going along with the flow and being like
I want my fucking doggy bag full of girlled cheese
or whatever. Anyhow, let's get back to Biz. So we're
now it's a long, hard night of work for Ronnie chasing.
She pulls up at this intersection in Beverly Hills between

(54:37):
Sunset and Whittier. No other cars, as we've said, no
pedestrians in that situation. It's not unheard of for a
Hollywood big wig to just go ahead and take a
left on a red. It's there, it's their neighborhood. They
do what they want anyway, and take they take forever
and no one's going to see it. No one's going
to see it. But Ronnie didn't do that. She waited

(54:59):
for the green, and that's when she was ambushed by
a lone gunman. He approached the passenger side of her
car and he shot her four times through the window.

Speaker 1 (55:10):
Holy shit.

Speaker 2 (55:12):
She was hit twice in the chest, once in her
upper right arm, and once through her right shoulder. That
bullet went into her heart and it was that shot
that was believed to have killed her. Her car then
took the left and drove down Whittier South and glided
a quarter of a mile down that windy street until

(55:32):
it hit a light pole and crashed and set off
the passenger air bags and was basically a car accident.
A couple of minutes later a car a couple passing
in a car spotted the accident and it pulled over,
saw what happened, called nine one one, but people had
already called because they heard gunshots in Beverly Hills, so

(55:53):
everybody was calling the Beverly Hills police. Ronnie Chasm was
rushed to Cedar's sign A hospital and she was pronounced
dead at one twelve am. So most people assumed when
they heard about this it was either a carjacking or
someone had taken out a hit on her, because it's
such a weird the idea in just to give you

(56:16):
a sense, I got most of this information from an
article that Guy gary Baum, not Guy Brandham. Gary Baum
wrote for the Hollywood Reporter. And when he wrote this article,
it was twenty sixteen. And in the article he said,
there have been no homicides in Beverly Hills since twenty eleven.

(56:38):
What so in that five years, zero homagies in Beverly
Hill sane?

Speaker 1 (56:45):
Yeah, I think someone ran to kill his wife.

Speaker 2 (56:48):
I mean there had been the five years previous, there
had been five homicides, two of them had been that
exact thing. Domestic abuse mess to homicides, and those were solved,
and then there were two other ones that were solved,
and one was the shooting death of Mark Ruffalo's brother,

(57:10):
which I'd never heard of. Mark Ruffalo was a Mark
Ruffalo's had a brother, I believe his name was Scott,
and he was a hairdresser and he lived in Beverly
Hills and he was shot to death in his house.
What the fuckuck? And they never solved it.

Speaker 1 (57:25):
Who shot it?

Speaker 2 (57:26):
They don't know, I know, right. So anyway, that's like
it for Beverly Hills. Now we talk about fucking you know,
Filipino Town, the thing we were just talking about earlierhere,
it's like, how many homicides are there in a month,
much less in years and years and ten years, they'd
had five, yeah, and then there was this. So it's

(57:49):
insane anyway, which is the reason the movie Beverly Hills
Cop worked so well, because truly, nothing bad happens there.
It's the home of all the rich people.

Speaker 1 (57:59):
Everyone watch it.

Speaker 2 (58:00):
It's such a good movie. It holds up, it holds
up so well. Okay, sorry, so I lost my place.
So also just know this. Ronnie Chasin's estate was worth
six point one million dollars at the time of her day.

Speaker 1 (58:13):
Holy shit.

Speaker 2 (58:14):
Yeah, so she was doing very well for herself. She
was also single, no kids. She's you know, like a
working lady. So three weeks after the night of the shooting,
the Beverly Hills Police Department holds a press conference and
states that the case has been closed. The suspect was

(58:35):
an ex con named Harold Smith, who had served time
twice for robbery, once in nineteen ninety eight for a
purse snatching where when the woman resisted, he broke her jaw.
And that happened on Doheny Boulevard, which was about a
quarter of a mile east of where Ronnie Chasin had
been shot sit And so this is how they found

(59:00):
owned Harold Smith, a neighbor of his. So he lived
in this place called the Harvey Apartments, which is on
Santa Monica Boulevard. Just it's actually just north of Santa
Monica Boulevard, kind of behind Paramount over there. It's basically
Santa Monica and Western, which is a great not a
great neighborhood. So, and this apartment building was not good

(59:24):
at all. It was mostly it was a lot of
drug addicts and just people who were just getting by.
It was, it was, it was bad news. So a
neighbor of Harold Smith's calls in a tip to America's
Most Wanted, saying that he had shown up. Harold Smith

(59:44):
had shown up at this neighbor's apartment ninety minutes after
the killing in Beverly Hills, asking if anything had been
reported on TV, and then saying that he needed to
go back to Beverly Hills because he had left his
bike there. Oh no, And then the neighbor said he
saw the report of Ronnie Chasin's murder on the news
and he knew he put it all together right. So

(01:00:07):
at five point thirty pm on December first, after Beverly
Hills police get this tip, they go out to question
Harold Smith. They find him in the lobby of the
Harvey apartments, and when they identify themselves to him as police,
Harold pulls a thirty eight out of his pocket and
shoots himself in the head.

Speaker 1 (01:00:26):
Shut the fuck.

Speaker 2 (01:00:26):
How did I not fucking know this part? I know,
it's crazy, I've never heard this part. I knew about
this shooting at me too, but I've never heard this part.

Speaker 1 (01:00:34):
Oh my god.

Speaker 2 (01:00:35):
Okay, So this neighbor that had called in the tip,
he uh he had been keeping some boxes for Harold
Smith because Harold had been evicted from the Harvey apartment
six days before, and that's why Harold came back to

(01:00:56):
that guy's house that night.

Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
Some of his.

Speaker 2 (01:00:59):
Stuff was there. So the police find this out or
know this, and go up to the neighbor's house and
start looking through Harold Smith's stuff that's in the neighbor's apartment,
and there they find four spent shellcasings among Smith's belongings,

(01:01:20):
and they test those against the ballistics and then Ronnie
Chase murder. They're a match. The police announced they have
their guy and the case is closed. They took such
a confident position at this press conference that even though

(01:01:41):
they had not looked into her bank statements, they had
not looked onto a hard drive of her computer, they
had not checked herself on records. They eventually got to
that the following March, but at the time they made
that announcement, they had not looked into almost anything in
her life and the fact that she A lot of
people make note of the fact that she had an

(01:02:02):
estate with no heirs worth six point one million dollars
and a family. You know, she sorry, so I'll just
finish this. The the following July, Beverly Hills Police issued
a news release stating that it completed the exhaustive investigation
and without a doubt, it's the conclusion of robbery homicide

(01:02:24):
detectives that the sole perpetrator of this heinous crime was
Harold Martin Smith. So last year, the Beverly Hills Police
finally released the files on this case, and they were
partially redacted, so you couldn't read everything in them. But
this reporter that wrote for a Hollywood Reporter read the

(01:02:46):
ballistics report and it actually the ballistics report actually says
that although the two guns in this case have similar characteristics,
they're not they're too insignificant for identification. So actually, the
ballistics course report does not confirm that he was their
guy at all. The files also revealed that the police

(01:03:09):
did not dust for fingerprints on the right side of
the car, which was where the shots were fired from.
No fingerprints dusted over there. They also never released the
security camera footage from the neighborhood.

Speaker 1 (01:03:23):
Yeah, the night everyone has security cameras.

Speaker 2 (01:03:26):
It's fucking Beverly Hills and a man named T. T.
Williams Junior, who was a retired LAPD homicide detective who
he gets called to testify about police procedure a lot.
He was stated as saying this about the lack of
video footage memorializing Smith near the crime. He said, quote,

(01:03:48):
there has to be some security cameras in that neighborhood
that would have caught him. I mean, Beverly Hills, Give
me a break. You've got a black man supposedly on
a bike in the middle of the night. He'd be
stopped fifteen. He would have stood out like a sore thumb. Seriously,
and not surprisingly, they never released the footage from the

(01:04:08):
lobby of the Harvey apartments the night of Harold Smith's suicide,
And they had security cameras in that lobby, So that
whole moment where the cops identify themselves, that's all on camera.
No one's ever seen that footage. Also, of note, the

(01:04:30):
gun that Harold Smith pulled out of his pocket and
shot himself to death with was later determined to have
been reported stolen three years earlier by a retired LAPD
officer from his home in Santa Clarita. Oh, just a little,

(01:04:50):
a bit of a question mark. There guns get stole
all the time, then they go on the black market.
Anyone can have them. Yes, okay, But the fact that
it wasn't a cops gun, a retired policeman's gun, isn't
I think, isn't good totally, isn't.

Speaker 1 (01:05:05):
It's the oh I said, oh exactly that of oh,
I can connect those which I'm not going to say.

Speaker 2 (01:05:12):
But well, I mean that's all it just so I'll
end with this, which I think is very interesting. It's
a quote from a man named stan Kephart who's a
former police chief in Arizona, and he also serves as
an expert witness in cases involving law enforcement operational standards.
And he said this, it's not what you think about
a suspect, it's what you can prove. And it appears

(01:05:35):
that there is room for doubt that Harold Smith is
the perpetrator in this case.

Speaker 1 (01:05:40):
Holy shit.

Speaker 2 (01:05:41):
They didn't really prove factually that he was the supertrator.
They just basically said he was unclosed the case and
he's dead, he can't defend himself.

Speaker 1 (01:05:52):
Wow. It's so interesting when you hear like, well he
had this and he did this that night and this
thing happened, and he's been this in the past, and
you're like, yeah, okay, he's obviously he obviously did it
the end, But you don't think about the like the
deep the deep evidence, or the basic things like finger
printing that side of the car, or the obvious things

(01:06:15):
like security cameras. You just hear these blanket statements and
you're like, duh.

Speaker 2 (01:06:21):
But well, you go, that's easy, Like that's an easy
You tell me that a black x Con is shot somebody.
Oh this, here's the other thing. Her purse was still
in the car. It's a product bag. It was on
the passenger seat. So he so they're saying that he
shot into this car four times and didn't take anything.

(01:06:45):
There was nothing taken from the car, so he just
it's not a smash and grab. It's not his style.
It's not his mo which we do know can escalate,
but in this case, he didn't even steal anything. So
now he's gone straight to murder. So basically he's not
even a it's not robbery anymore.

Speaker 1 (01:07:04):
It just doesn't make sense for someone to do that
there either, because you can't blend blend in with the
rest of the city. You can't go hide in someone's backyard. No,
you're just you're like, uh waiting, what do they call it?
Duck as sitting duck.

Speaker 2 (01:07:21):
Well. Also, so that actually takes a part a bunch
of things, because they figured out that that neighbor who
said that he put it all together because he knew
that it was Ronnie Chasin's murder. Her name wasn't released
until the next morning, so there was no way he
could have known that during that conversation. Also, if it

(01:07:44):
was ninety minutes after the shooting took place, how did
he get back to those apartments that fast? That's true,
especially if he left his bike, right, So what did
he leave his bike and jump on a night bus
from Beverly Hills into Hollywood?

Speaker 1 (01:07:58):
And in that case, then they should have had the
bus driver testify.

Speaker 2 (01:08:01):
Right or like that or that would have been in
the report. If someone had seen him coming, that would
have all been added to the argument that it was him.

Speaker 1 (01:08:10):
You're right.

Speaker 2 (01:08:11):
Also, there were and I mean this is like, this
isn't even speculation, it's just like kind of random facts,
but there were family members in her family that in
her she had rewritten a new will in two thousand
and six, but they couldn't find that will, so they
went off of her nineteen ninety four will, and in
that will she gave the majority of her estate to

(01:08:34):
one of her nieces. Oh no, and she had another
niece that in the will it said, I knowingly and
what being aware of the implications of this might cause
leave you ten dollars ninety four.

Speaker 1 (01:08:51):
I mean maybe she was a drug addict then and
sucked and then ninety six. They're like, all right, I
just don't understand. How don't you have to file a
will like a lawyer?

Speaker 2 (01:09:02):
No. In fact, I watched this thing Joey bay It
was whatever, maybe headline news whatever. Joe Joey Bayheart was
the host of it. It was just a YouTube video.
But this woman on it said, you actually can write
on a napkin, this is my last will and testament.
It doesn't have to be filed anywhere. If you sign
it and you are of sound mind, it's legal.

Speaker 1 (01:09:22):
That seems so absurd because it's like it's just then
someone can pick it up out of you're fucking sock drawer,
light it on fire, and there's no will, and I'm
the next to ken you know what I mean? You
would think you wanted to get you'd want to get
it notarized and give it to someone.

Speaker 2 (01:09:40):
Well you should keep it in a safe place.

Speaker 1 (01:09:42):
Yeah, definitely, but.

Speaker 2 (01:09:43):
You but it's just the legality of it. It doesn't
need a lawyer's anything. This is what this woman on
this thing said. Yeah, that it doesn't need any it
doesn't need a notary or anything.

Speaker 1 (01:09:54):
Yeah, I'm such such a It's like it's that thing
of like, well, if you can get away with it,
then congratulations, there's no no one will look into it
with what what are you talking about with burning someone's
will or like, oh, getting rid of the two thousand
and six will.

Speaker 2 (01:10:10):
Right then, yes, that's exactly ratulations. Well yeah, but that
I mean that's why you keep things in you know,
something like a will, you would keep in a what
do you call that a safe safety deposit box?

Speaker 1 (01:10:22):
Yeah, but what if she goes.

Speaker 2 (01:10:23):
Into Yeah, yeah, totally when you don't give out those keys. Yeah,
I've never had a safety deposit box, but I will
only have one key when I do.

Speaker 1 (01:10:31):
I have a po box. And it's very exciting. It's
like you feel like a grown up.

Speaker 2 (01:10:37):
Uh. Anyway, I think that's a fascinating one because I saw, Oh,
there's a show called Demons in the City of Angels Come,
which is which it's hilarious that it's like specific only
to Los Angeles. But this that's what caught my attention
because it started and I watched it, going, oh, I
do want to know how this turned out, because I

(01:10:57):
remember hearing about it and then hearing nothing, and basically
it's just them going we kind of don't buy it.

Speaker 1 (01:11:05):
And isn't it interesting that you and I who remember
this happening and it kind of being you know, if
you know it's in your industry the mind, like we
had never heard about it again, Like it's almost like, yeah,
we got like they got the guy really low key,
not maybe not letting a lot of reporters into the
press conference. Does that make sense? Yeah, you know what

(01:11:26):
I mean, It's interesting that we never heard anything more
about it.

Speaker 2 (01:11:30):
She had a bunch of friends in this article.

Speaker 1 (01:11:32):
It was.

Speaker 2 (01:11:32):
It made me sad because I feel it's like, you
know this type of woman, you know, you know this
late Oh yeah, it's like she's smart and sharp and
like pushy enough to make to be the top of
in the top of the business and such a hard business.
They all her friends say if it was her friend
that died in a suspicious way, she wouldn't rest until

(01:11:54):
she found out what really happened, and she wouldn't take
no for an answer, and she wouldn't. So that's it's
really sad because I think it's that thing of like
there's a lot of people going I wish I could
do something, I wish I knew something.

Speaker 1 (01:12:04):
Or maybe they're right, and am I supposed to do something?
Even if I think the cops are right, Like what
do I do?

Speaker 2 (01:12:10):
You know? It's just so it's just too convenient, like
to find who the fuck keeps four spent shellcasings in
their like bye, in their boxes in their shitty apart.

Speaker 1 (01:12:21):
You didn't check them into the La River as you
were walking home in ninety minutes.

Speaker 2 (01:12:24):
But you leave your bike at the scene of the sure,
like sure none of it. Also, how do you get
how do you get back across town at night? You
can't get anywhere in ninety minutes in Los.

Speaker 1 (01:12:34):
Angeles, No, not even in a fucking car, I mean
the traffic anyway. That's great. That was really interesting. I
never followed up on that.

Speaker 2 (01:12:44):
Hopefully we'll hear more about it soon. They're trying to
make They were trying to make a documentary about it,
but yeah, they were having a lot of problems.

Speaker 1 (01:12:54):
Well, it's funny because we're having a theme today. Oh really,
Los Angeles.

Speaker 2 (01:13:02):
What did the LAPD do? Question mark? Really? Racial issues?

Speaker 1 (01:13:09):
What happened? Tampering, et cetera. Wow, But first FTP, Sorry, this.

Speaker 2 (01:13:17):
Is where the commercial will go.

Speaker 1 (01:13:22):
Okay, we are back Karen. Any updates?

Speaker 2 (01:13:25):
Well, I guess the update and I in the next
episode you'll hear. The next rewind episode, we'll talk about
the Gary Baum misattribution. And I explained it there, but
it was essentially me cutting and pasting Wikipedia, you know,
writing down, googling this, watching that TV show that then

(01:13:45):
the one direct quote from Gary Baum was the only attribution,
when in fact, the entire layout of the story was
because of his investigative journalism. Right, And so it's great
because this basically opened my eyes to like the only
reason we were able to tell stories. And I think
I said this on the next episode, so we'll go
over all of it. But it's like, we can only

(01:14:06):
do this because of true crime journalists and investigative journalists.

Speaker 1 (01:14:09):
That's like what we're doing is we're gabbing about the
things we watch that other people created about the true
crime story exactly. So now when you listen, and I
think from this moment on, we enter the story and
then we say.

Speaker 2 (01:14:21):
Like some of the sources, some of the verses.

Speaker 1 (01:14:24):
We name our sources every time, and we did that
here and there like throughout our stories before, but we
never specifically did that and put in the show notes, right,
So that's just so.

Speaker 2 (01:14:33):
Important, and there was no one else to copy that
did it that way, So we were just kind of
doing it the way it was done, which is not
an excuse, and clearly the credit needs to go to
Gary Baum, so I think it now has after these
you know, eight years. But to talk about Ronnie Chason's murder,
there are no true updates on the case, but Gary Baum,

(01:14:54):
the journalist continues to call attention to it and the
patterns and law enforcement that basically he talks about profiling
and killing black suspects in cases like these. So, following
the George Floyd protests in twenty twenty one, the Beverly
Hills Police Department was sued for disproportionately arresting black pedestrians
the previous year okay, So because of that, the police

(01:15:17):
chief at the time, a woman named Sandras Bagnoley. She
retired after facing a series of lawsuits about that, including
allegations of racist remarks, and the city of Beverly Hills
had to pay out millions. So once Bagnoli's replacement, a
man named Mark Stainbrook, joined the squad or was promoted
to that job, was installed. In December of twenty twenty one,

(01:15:40):
journalist Gary Baum called for him to reopen the murder
of Ronnie Chasin for the sake of justice, essentially, like
you can't let this just go unsolved, which is incredible
just years and years later, And he also called out
the silence in Hollywood itself, in the entertainment industry. They
had the opportunity to cause a ruckus and get some

(01:16:02):
answers in this murder, and nobody said a word, which
is super weird and very true. But I do think
that that was a time where, like we are now
used to like voting with your wallet and saying something
in social media and whatever, where it's like that was
the kind of thing where, especially the entertainment industry, no
one sticks their neck out for fucking anybody unless they're

(01:16:24):
going to be guaranteed that they're going to make money
or be protected or whatever it is. But if you're
going to be the first one to stand up and
be some sort of whistleblower, guaranteed you're by yourself. That's
how this business kind of works. So it doesn't surprise
me that people didn't stand up and go, I demand
this thing. Also, I think a lot of people were like,

(01:16:44):
how did that happen? Who would have done it? Is
it somebody on the inside? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:16:49):
Yeah, what do you think it is? Do you think
it's just a.

Speaker 2 (01:16:53):
To me, it seems like such a specific hit, and
that to me where it happened on sunset if I'm
not mistaken, Beverly Hills Hotel, yep. Yeah, And it's just
a weird It's like they would have had to have
known that was a good spot. Yeah, because no one's there.

Speaker 1 (01:17:09):
No one's there.

Speaker 2 (01:17:09):
It's like unless it's five to seven, Yeah, it's nine
to eleven or five to seven. That's a place that's
mostly residential totally, so it would be a perfect place.

Speaker 1 (01:17:20):
It's super dark, it's a huge intersection, so like someone
walking their dog across the street wouldn't actually see anything,
because it's such a big street.

Speaker 2 (01:17:28):
Yeah, and it's Beverly Hills, so it's real quiet, and
it's everybody's there's high hedges. It's not like people are
looking out their window at you. It just to me
felt like very inside in that way where it's like
it wasn't like a carjacking on Hollywood Boulevard where it's like,
holy shit, this crazy thing. It's like over as yeah, crazy.
That's just a theory, okay, Okay, So let's get into

(01:17:50):
Georgia story now about the murder of my Trees Richardson.

Speaker 1 (01:17:59):
So this is what I wanted to do for a while,
but it's scary to tackle because it's kind of big,
it's and it's every time I go back to look
into it, it's just like it's a lot. Okay. This
is the story of my Rise Richardson. To know this one,

(01:18:20):
you probably won't, I tell you. So seven pm, around
seven pm on the night of September seventeenth, two thousand
and nine, twenty four year old my Rise Richardson pulls
her Hontasivik into the parking lot of Jeffreys, which is
a fancy pants restaurant on the Pacific Coast Highway. Do
you know what I'm talking about. It's one of those
like Jeffreys. It's like super fancy fans, like on the coast,

(01:18:45):
like on the coast in Malibu.

Speaker 2 (01:18:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:18:46):
Yeah, it's very like it's spelled Jeffrey, not Jeffrey, you
know what I mean. While she's there, from the valet
to ordering her food, interacting with other patrons, her behavior
is erratic and bizarre, but she wasn't threatening in anyway.
When the bill came for eighty nine fifty one, matries

(01:19:10):
couldn't pay, so when she was confronted by staff, she
announced that she had come to avenge Michael Jackson's death.

Speaker 2 (01:19:17):
Oh no, I know.

Speaker 1 (01:19:19):
Management decides to call the police and they say, we
have a guest here who was refusing to pay her bill,
and we think she may She sounds really crazy, she
may be on drugs or something. But my Trees Richardson
wasn't on drugs. She's a twenty four year old, smart
and beautiful African American woman from South la She had
graduated from California State University, Fullerton with a Bachelor of

(01:19:44):
Arts in psychology the year before, and at the time
she worked as an administrative assistant at a freight company,
but she wanted to work with children, and at the
time she volunteered as a mentor for at risk children
and worked with kids at a cheerleading camp. So it's
not really known why she was in Malibu, though, which

(01:20:04):
was forty miles from her home. They think maybe she
was visiting the campus of Pepperdine, which is right by Jeffreys.
You know to look at the campus. But just sorry.

Speaker 2 (01:20:15):
Side note, I told my mom when I was a
junior in high school that I wanted to go to
Pepperdine because my friend Jen Mason's older sister Becky went there.
And my mother laughed in my face and said, who's
going to pay for that? Yeah, because Pepperdine is insanely
expensive volleyball college on the beach. Basically, it's tony, it's

(01:20:37):
for the rich. It's for rich people.

Speaker 1 (01:20:40):
As is Jeoffrey's. Which is how you build an eighty
nine dollars dinner for one person.

Speaker 2 (01:20:47):
I could do that at applebe I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:20:49):
Let's be honest.

Speaker 2 (01:20:51):
I had a sixty dollars lunch today with Vince, so
let's be let's be realistic here. I swear to God
sometimes when I start, when I get a pretzel as
a as a appetizer, I could just eat nine pretzels,
do it? Okay? Cheese sauce, well, I mean that's crucial. Yeah,
I'm not gonna eat them dry?

Speaker 1 (01:21:12):
What do I like?

Speaker 2 (01:21:12):
Big and soft? And then have like a thing of
that cheese sauce?

Speaker 1 (01:21:15):
Am I a monster mustard? I hate when they try
to get created mustard? Okay. I hate when they try
to be like this stupid aoli or whatever. No, no, no,
and then oh like a it's a mustard that's got
spicy honey in it.

Speaker 2 (01:21:31):
No, no, just give me cheese sauce like they serve
it apple.

Speaker 1 (01:21:35):
Oh we want, we want, anyone wants cheese soup, but
we can't, and we know it because a polite society
says it's not okay unless you're in like Wisconsin.

Speaker 2 (01:21:44):
Right, So give me a bread to dip it in
it and be okay final pretended to dip Fine.

Speaker 1 (01:21:49):
Fine. It's the same thing with onion soup, Like I
just want to eat bread and cheese with a spoon.

Speaker 2 (01:21:54):
But fine, you can put a little broth underneath it
whatever if you need me to be that fine, Okay, Sorry,
that was a real left turn cheerleading camp.

Speaker 1 (01:22:05):
So they don't know why she was there, but it
seems that she was suffering at the time of a
previously undiagnosed manic episode, which is also evidenced by her
her Facebook posts recently, which were incoherent and rambling. She
said things like there are signs everywhere, small little with

(01:22:26):
a smiley face, and then another said I just want
to sleep, lole, But you know me and my crazy ideas,
Let's see where they take me smiley face. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:22:35):
So it's like, did she not know she was manic?

Speaker 1 (01:22:39):
From what I can tell, No, and her mom, I
think they were all very surprised by it, by the
fact that this is They think that's what happened for sure,
but nobody knew what was going to happen.

Speaker 2 (01:22:50):
Yeah, it seems like it was undiagnosed and unknown. I'm
sorry to ask this, but when when was this? Two
thousand and nine? Oh wow?

Speaker 1 (01:22:56):
Yeah, No, no one listens in the of what year
it is, you know what I mean, It's hard to focus.

Speaker 2 (01:23:03):
Yeah, I like get to the story. Yeah, I settled down.
I'm still thinking of stuff I say in my story,
my thing.

Speaker 1 (01:23:09):
Two thousand and nine. Where were you two thousand? You
were near twenty ten? Oh my god, this is like,
it's like we picked a theme for this episode.

Speaker 2 (01:23:17):
It's so true. We didn't that weird chunk of time.

Speaker 1 (01:23:19):
We're just like, it's like our periods are sync, but
our murders are sanc instead.

Speaker 2 (01:23:24):
It's all coming together in the red tent.

Speaker 1 (01:23:27):
Stevens.

Speaker 2 (01:23:27):
Yeah, Steven's writing this one down because he's.

Speaker 1 (01:23:29):
Flushing so far. He's sister period Sisters, Sisters signs. Three
nights after that last post, she wrote, she's at Jeoffrey's
going through this shit. Three LA PD deputies arrive. They
call Matries's it's my Trees, I believe, not Matries My

(01:23:53):
Teresa's great grandmother, who offers to pay the bill, but
she would have had a fact and image of her
credit card, which she wasn't able to do because who
the fuck has a fucking fax.

Speaker 2 (01:24:02):
Machine in two thousand and nine?

Speaker 1 (01:24:04):
Don't you hate that? Yeah, so they were like, nope, sorry, grandma, sorry,
great grandma, you can't do this. They search her car
and they find a very small amount of marijuana, as
well as bottles of vodka and tequila and half a
case of beer. But they gave her a field sopriety
test and she passed. Okay, So I'm sorry that the

(01:24:26):
officers could have placed Matrise in My Trees in an
involuntary psychiatric hold based on her odd behavior, but they
said that would required a lot of paperwork and a
trip to the hospital, so instead they arrested her on
charges of suspicion of not paying for the meal and
possession of less than one ounce of marijuana, and they

(01:24:47):
took her to Lost Hills Police Department. I know upon
her arrest, her phone, perse and money are locked in
her car and the car is towed to a towyard.

Speaker 2 (01:24:56):
What why you're gonna need that after?

Speaker 1 (01:25:00):
Well, Lost Hills Police Department again, fancy pants police department
and a fancy pants part of Malibu, like really nice area.
It's the same station where mel Gibson was taken after
being pulled over for drunk driving and yelling anti Semitic slurs.
Same station, but they let.

Speaker 2 (01:25:22):
Him keep his purse.

Speaker 1 (01:25:23):
Well, well, they escorted him from Lost Hills to his
toad car. That because they treat famous and rich people,
which is what their neighborhood is.

Speaker 2 (01:25:33):
And white people.

Speaker 1 (01:25:34):
Remember in The Big Lebowski stay out of my beach community.
He throws a mug big Lebowski's face. It's like that, Yeah, yeah,
and stay out of my beach community.

Speaker 3 (01:25:45):
It's just like that.

Speaker 1 (01:25:46):
Unfortunately, my Trees didn't receive the same treatment as a
famous asshole.

Speaker 2 (01:25:52):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:25:52):
My Trees's mother called the Lost Hills station around ten pm.
And all of these phone calls you can hear on YouTube,
and I fucking listen to them. Oh no, she's asking
if they're going to book her and release her that night,
and saying it's dark and she doesn't have a car
and I don't want her wandering. And she's like, I'll
come pick her up right now, but if you keep
her over night, that's fine. I'll get her in the morning.

(01:26:12):
I just want to know you're not going to release her.
And this woman is you know, she's clearly upset, but
she's just like, I don't know what's happening. I'll deal
with it. She's a together woman. Yeah, she's the mother
said she's not from that area, and I would hate
to wake up to a morning report saying girl lost
somewhere and her head chopped off. But the deputy assured

(01:26:34):
my Teresa's mother not to worry. I can't breathe, hold on, Okay,
But yet, at twelve thirty in the morning, my Terce,
with only the clothes on her back and without a purse, money,
or her phone, was released into the darkness and cold
of the Santa Monica Mountains. Why which you and I like,

(01:26:56):
let's let's set the stage again from Beverly Hills to
Santa Monica Mountain in Malibu. It is fucking remote. It's
huge houses on a lot of land that butt up
against the Santa Monica Mountains, which are not pretty hiking trails,
their fucking wilderness.

Speaker 2 (01:27:12):
Yeah, it scrub brush, it's there's no there's nothing commercial
around there.

Speaker 1 (01:27:17):
Because well that's what they said too, is nothing was
open at that point. All businesses are closed. They close
it like six.

Speaker 2 (01:27:22):
Yes, and there's it's like even the businesses that are
there really few and far between. It's not like shopping
up and get Yeah, you have to basically be down
in the city of Malibu. Yeah, to be close to anything.

Speaker 1 (01:27:34):
And the Santa Monica Mountain is where all the mountain
lions live and it's really rocky and hilly. I went
to Jewish camp there and it was totally wilderness. I
mean it was not cute.

Speaker 2 (01:27:46):
Yes, it's not the city.

Speaker 1 (01:27:49):
No, it's really not. And this is a city girl
who had never been out in the wilderness like this.
So all businesses are closed. Public transportation doesn't really exist
out there. You know, they have like bus to the
shopping center and back, but not you know, real transportation.
And she's eleven miles from her car at the Malibu towyard.
The walk would have taken her up and down hills

(01:28:10):
through a tunnel along the shoulder of a highway, winding
through the mountains, which I fucking have driven there, and
you get carsick just from driving. It's a crazy mountain.

Speaker 2 (01:28:19):
Also, i'll tell you this from my research. Eleven miles
just so you know, it's thirteen miles from Beverly Hills
to downtown Los Angeles. So she would have had to
walk slightly less than that long all the way down
Sunset far. That's ridiculous.

Speaker 1 (01:28:36):
That's a day's walk. So when her mom calls it
next morning, she finds out that my trees had been released.
And I listened to the fucking mess the call, and
it's they're blowing the officers, blowing her off, and she's like,
how long do I have to wait to file a
missing re person's report? And he's like, well, wait a

(01:28:58):
couple hours and then call us back, like they're very
being being very casual, and she's like, she doesn't know
the area, she didn't have anything on her, what the
hell's going on? And they were very flippant about it
and were like, let me try to track things down,
call me in a couple hours, which is like, can
you imagine waiting for your child for a couple hours.

(01:29:19):
And then and then she said, you know, she's another area,
and she's in a depressive state, so she probably had
some clue, you know, that something was triggering.

Speaker 2 (01:29:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:29:30):
So at five point thirty that morning, a homeowner in
Cold Canyon, which is right next to the actual Santa
Monica Mountain Canyon, called Lost Hills to say that there
was a prowler walking around. He told the dispatcher that
the prowler had been sitting kind of sprawled out on
these wooden steps in the back of the house, but
had disappeared into the surrounding wilderness, and other neighbors said

(01:29:51):
that they heard and saw my trees either leaving or
attempting to enter the man's home and that they heard
loud scre as in a vacant home around the time
that she went missing. But they searched the area and
didn't find anything. And later they searched the area, they
called the police. I don't know if they came. That

(01:30:12):
was the last time my Trees was seen alive. She
disappeared into the Santa Monica Mountains and for five months
the Lost Hills. So she disappeared super crazy wilderness gone
with only her clothes that she had on t shirt, jeans, sneakers.
So for five months, Lost Hills insisted that there was

(01:30:35):
no surveillance tape of the police station because they wanted
to see this, you know, like what happened, when did
she leave?

Speaker 2 (01:30:41):
What state was she in?

Speaker 1 (01:30:42):
But they miraculously found the tape five months later, sitting
on a desk. According to My Teresa's mother, the tape
shows her daughter in an obvious psycholog obvious psychological distress
inside the intake toe. So she clutchs quote, she clutches
at the mash screening and is rocking side to side
like a small child, says a cousin of hers. But

(01:31:05):
a spokesperson for the department said about releasing her. She
exhibited no signs of mental illness or intoxication. She was fine.
She's an adult, Okay, but you don't let them go
without a fucking wall of her cell phone.

Speaker 2 (01:31:21):
Yeah, none of this makes sense, Like, it doesn't add up.
Is she an adult then?

Speaker 1 (01:31:26):
Then?

Speaker 2 (01:31:26):
What's like? Then? Why are you treating her? Why would
you lock her purse away? Yeah? And not answer questions
to her parents?

Speaker 1 (01:31:36):
Okay, don't worry. It gets worse, Okay, I like it
always does. So the station flog shows that my Rise
made four phone calls to her grandmother, but AT and
T phone records don't reflect those calls for whatever reason.
So the surveillance tape also shows a deputy leaving the
station right after my Rise was released, like leaving towards

(01:31:57):
where she was going.

Speaker 2 (01:31:59):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:32:00):
But the deputy maintained that he wasn't at the station
before the tapes were released. He said he wasn't there
that night. Then when he was caught in his lie,
he stated, the night this nonsense happened, I was one
of the guys that kept away from this, minding my
own business, which is like what that insinuates that something
was going on that you kept out of yes.

Speaker 2 (01:32:21):
Well, also, it's your job to be at the police
station and take care of the people that are at
the police station. That's not nonsense, right, that's your job
of a person's in distress. This isn't This is a
person that is in mental distress.

Speaker 1 (01:32:38):
Well, the nonsense could have been, you know, the actions
police took when she got there, whatever happened to her there,
if anything happened or there. I'm speculating, So that's the
nonsense he could have been talking about, you know what
I mean.

Speaker 2 (01:32:56):
So three, it wasn't hell.

Speaker 1 (01:32:57):
Three months later, January twenty ten, that Angelis County Sheriff's
Department conducted so three months later, conducts one of the
largest scale searches in the history of the department. Over
three hundred volunteers trained in search and rescue participate in
the eighteen square mile search of the area of Malibu
Canyon and the hills of Malibu Creek State Park. They

(01:33:18):
find racially and sexually offensive graffiti on the walls of
a culvert in the canyon. That graffiti was freshly painted,
and the paint cans, brushes, and other potential evidence was
left at the scene, and matrise wasn't found. Finally, almost
a year after she disappeared from the station. In August
twenty ten, park rangers who were looking to see if

(01:33:39):
marijuana growers had returned to Dark Canyon, they stumble on
my Teresa's naked, mummified body. She was in a very
secluded creek bed in Malibu Canyon, with the clothes she
was wearing the night she disappeared, scattered around.

Speaker 2 (01:33:54):
Oh so they had been taken off. Yeah, or she
took them off.

Speaker 1 (01:33:59):
Here's the most fucked up thing. Okay, okay. Deputies, by
a protocol, should have waited for the coroner to arrive
so that my Teresa's remains could be photographed, the site
inspected for clues, and the crime scene established. Instead, against
orders by the coroner, who later said that he quote
was very clear with officials, the deputies bagged Richardson's remains

(01:34:22):
and airlifted them by helicopter. WHOA before the coroner could
even get there. WHOA, this is okay? The corner said
that he could not think of another case in which
police agency had moved entire skeletal remains without corner's approval.
To prove this point. Months later, my Teresa's mother so
I can. So this is proof my Teresa how badly

(01:34:45):
it was done. My Teresa's mother was visiting the site
where her body, where her daughter's body was found, and
found a fingerbone that belonged to my Teres left behind
in the dessert, in the dessert, in the dirt. Oh
my god, I think there's an article that they're with
her and they find that that's insane, finds in the

(01:35:05):
spot oh look, and digs out of fucking fingerbone that
have been left behind because the proper people.

Speaker 2 (01:35:11):
Didn't did They eventually prove it really was hers?

Speaker 1 (01:35:13):
Yeah, it was her for sure. And there have also
been small toebones, finger and verted bray found left behind,
and also the bones from her neck. There's bones from
her neck, foot, in hand missing from her body, her remains,
So what.

Speaker 2 (01:35:32):
Yeah the fuck?

Speaker 1 (01:35:33):
This is such a crazy case because I followed it
step by step, So her leaving, I was like what happened?
And everyone was like what could have happened to her?
And then you see the surveillance video and you're like, oh,
that's some shady shit. Then they find her body and
then the bones are fucked. It's just like it just
keeps getting worse. So the disturbance made it so that

(01:35:55):
the corner was enabled to determine how she died, right, I.

Speaker 2 (01:35:59):
Think that would be the idea, right.

Speaker 1 (01:36:01):
And the genes belt and black bra that were discovered
a few free from her body, they were found, but
they were not tested for signs of foul play and
were buried along with her, so they weren't tested for
any DNA, any you know, ripping or anything that would
have uh huh.

Speaker 2 (01:36:21):
This is like that thing. It's it just reminds me
of like it where you don't know what things you
need to be in place until you realize they're not
in place. So it's like once a corner tells people
don't move that body and the police airlift the body away,
shouldn't then those police be frozen in no longer they're

(01:36:44):
no longer active duty in this case because they're clearly
hiding something like there should be protocol for the corner
to then go to some other police chief.

Speaker 1 (01:36:55):
Yeah, and this is where so this article I was
gonna that got a lot of them from. It's a
Newsweek article by Alexander Nazaryan who this article is really
great because he talks a lot about the LAPD corruption
and why this could have taken place, and they're like
rampant racism that was going on at the time to
a point where you know, the second in command is

(01:37:18):
going to prison for fifteen years because of corruption. So
it's incredibly corrupt. There's like, you know, rampant anti anti
rampant racism, and so he tells I don't talk about
it a lot in this, but he tells background of
why this is so obvious and you know, could have

(01:37:38):
happened this way.

Speaker 2 (01:37:40):
When you and I think most people that are into
true crime watched the the ESPN thirty by thirty of g. Simpson. Yeah,
that part of the Daryl Gates era of the LAPD
was so shocking and eye opening to me. And it

(01:38:02):
going all the way back to the riots in the sixties.
It's just so crazy how long this has been a
humongous problem in Los Angeles. That is never that it
hasn't been solved or even released addressed.

Speaker 1 (01:38:17):
Yeah, no, for sure, and it's it's not not happening anymore,
you know, it's.

Speaker 2 (01:38:23):
It hasn't changed at all.

Speaker 1 (01:38:24):
No, No, it's just hidden better. And you know, we've
we've put a band aid over some of the things
to make it look less horrifying, but it's still there.

Speaker 2 (01:38:36):
Well. And also it's just the it's the rationalism, the
justification of using the violence and the crime that happens
in the day to day to then justify any behavior
on the part. I mean, it's just it sucks. I
have plenty, I have a bunch of people who are
police people in my family. I'm not anti police. I'm

(01:38:59):
it's down to the person. So though, especially in this
day and age, it's down to the person because there's
because it's just such a it's like such a closed
you know, like it's a frat basically.

Speaker 1 (01:39:12):
Well, yeah, and in La and I'm sure a lot
of other cities specifically, the cards are stacked against you
if you're not white and you don't have money, yes,
and you're you know, the cards are stacked against you.
You don't start at zero sum, yeah at all. Yeah,
And I yeah, I don't you know, I don't want

(01:39:33):
to forget that as someone who lives here and knows
that I'm fucking privileged as shit to be where I'm at.

Speaker 2 (01:39:41):
Well, and also just we don't have to think about
totally how bad it could be. I mean, this is
like this is like saying you can't be mentally ill
or you will just be almost literally thrown to the wolves. Right,
it's insanity. And what did happen to at that police station? Yeah,
then it opens up that whole door.

Speaker 1 (01:40:00):
The mental illness thing is incredible because it's like you
should have taken her and admitted her for psychiatric treatment
because she was mentally unstable and unsound to make her
own decisions. And not only did you not do that
and keep her in prison or keep her in jail
until her mother could come or someone could come, you
let her out without money, without a jacket, without any

(01:40:25):
You knew she wasn't going to get anywhere. It's not
like she could have hitchhiked or she didn't hitchhike, and
that's what happened.

Speaker 2 (01:40:30):
But they're still culpable, right well yeah, also, what's the
if you know? See, that's the thing is this isn't
just a random person that they don't know and like, well,
too bad for you, and you're an adult. There's someone
contacting you, telling you what the situation is, telling you
there are concerns, and you still do the thing against
that person's wishes. Yeah, that's what makes leads me to

(01:40:51):
believe something else was taking place, because why would you hide,
why would you say we just let her go and
she left and it's not our problem. It's an adult
that it makes that feels like COVERABP.

Speaker 1 (01:41:02):
Well, it's so crazy. The mom specifically was like, she
doesn't know the area, and I don't want her to
get killed. Yeah, but what's so frustrating to me listening
to the tape of her mother calling is like this
feeling of nobody. Like I think a lot about when
you call the cops and they don't help you, what
do you You can't call the cops again? On like that's

(01:41:22):
your last Yes, that's your last. That's supposed to be
the last option is you call the cops and they
help you. Yeah, but it's so sad to be like
the moment the minute they told her to wait two
hours and she hung up the phone, I picture her
in her house and her family having to wait two hours.

Speaker 2 (01:41:41):
Yeah, that's insane.

Speaker 1 (01:41:43):
Yeah, and she's not a runaway, you know, you let
you guys let her out, And the minute they're like
oh shit, they're then they're culpable and they're open for Well.

Speaker 2 (01:41:53):
Also, it doesn't make sense because it's like, oh, if
you're going to treat this person like, oh there, look,
she went to a restaurant, she ate eighty dollars worth
of and she couldn't pay for it, and we arrested her. Okay,
got it.

Speaker 1 (01:42:03):
Yeah, all of.

Speaker 2 (01:42:04):
That makes sense to me. Yeah, you're it is illegal
to do that thing, and they're but there, then you
learn there are extenuating circumstances and it so clearly it
wasn't that big of a crime to you if you
just released her the next list y, so you didn't there,
this isn't you're not holding her for uh robbery or

(01:42:25):
what would that be. You're not holding her that's not stealing.

Speaker 1 (01:42:28):
Well, when I when I was a teenage you no,
like in seventh grade and got caught stealing, you know,
they give you a ticket, like the ticket you like
cop would yeah, and you move on.

Speaker 2 (01:42:39):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:42:40):
Yeah, it's like, well, why didn't that just happen? Well,
it's because they've then searched her car and found.

Speaker 2 (01:42:48):
You know, but then they're not holding her for drugs.

Speaker 1 (01:42:50):
They're not because she took sobriety test and she passed.

Speaker 2 (01:42:54):
Yeah, fuck, it doesn't. It's just like you can't. You
can't justify the police action in this because nothing is
adding up to this is a criminal and so we
treated her like a criminal. It's like, may you know
this is a person, This is say, a criminal who

(01:43:15):
ate eighty dollars worth of food that she couldn't pay
for in a manic episode, and then people do way
crazier shit.

Speaker 1 (01:43:22):
Well, yeah, we've talked about a Lisa Lamb and how
that could have been how she got in the water tank,
which you know, if you compare these two cases, it's like, yeah,
you do crazy shit when you're going through a manic episode. Yes,
But also the lost I feel like you're talking about
we're talking about a police department or a police Yeah,

(01:43:42):
a police department Lost Hills that deals mostly with rich
white people upset about something. They don't know how to
deal with something like this and so they I don't know, Yeah, yeah,
so that I think that makes a big difference. It's
not like it was, you know, the Hollywood police department,
which also wouldn't have been as big of a deal

(01:44:04):
because if they let her out in Hollywood, she'd have
fucking places to go.

Speaker 2 (01:44:07):
Well, and also I would think that they would be
much more used to dealing with people with mental illness.
The Hollywood police apartment, Like there's that one on Wilcox
that's just like never not hopping total day and night.
There's somebody pulling in or pulling out of that because
that's my that's my sneak up to get out of
Hollywood and go home.

Speaker 1 (01:44:23):
Don't tell anyone the sneaks Wilcox.

Speaker 2 (01:44:25):
That's my sneake at Wilcox. Man, that's like that's the
North South Fountain. Yeah, but totally. But I mean, like
you're right, it's like it's almost like a privileged police
department because they don't have that much happening there.

Speaker 1 (01:44:38):
So they don't have experience with these sorts of things.

Speaker 2 (01:44:40):
And when they do, it's like some crazily rich, drunk
white woman or say Scenes who's like fuck you, or
mel Gibson who or I think didn't. Also, they pull
over Reese Withtherspin and she said, do you know who
I am?

Speaker 1 (01:44:53):
Is that I met?

Speaker 2 (01:44:54):
Right, I'm pretty sure that happened in Malibu anyway. Whatever.
That's that kind of thing of like everyone's kind of
living up to this certain so it's suddenly like, oh,
there's a black girl that ate ate food she couldn't
pay for. So now we're going to treat her like
the criminal she is. Well, okay, but then that means
you would that that would mean process her in a

(01:45:15):
criminal way that keeps her safe, and that the thing
of the mom going, please don't let her go.

Speaker 3 (01:45:22):
That's just.

Speaker 2 (01:45:26):
We have to get plumbers. So my beautiful new house
it's now having plumbing problems. Is everybody?

Speaker 1 (01:45:35):
They don't know, But I hope that's not a ghost.
It's just plumbing problem.

Speaker 2 (01:45:40):
It just suddenly starts like like it's about to overflow
with like fucking with racial tension.

Speaker 1 (01:45:48):
All right, yes, all of that is correct. They find
her body, all these bunds are missing, they can't determine
how she died, and then her shit's not tested for
foul play. Okay, Then there's no explanation given for why

(01:46:10):
investigators were never able to find her Vans sneakers or
her T shirt that she was rang when she disappeared.
Her jeans, bell and black bra were there, which is
like you could be like, well, animals came and got them,
but it's like why would they pick a pair of
shoes and a T shirt and not all this other stuff?

(01:46:30):
And her body wasn't messed with it's not right.

Speaker 2 (01:46:35):
Also, that makes me think of I did those stories
about the deaths on Mount Hood. I mean it was
no Crater Lake, the Crater Lake stories that I did
in Portland, and one of them there was a guy
that they found his body like years later, and it
was a skeleton sitting in jeans. Like, jeans don't just
come off. It's not that animals can't take your jeans off.

Speaker 1 (01:47:00):
Right, right, Yes, animals can't take your jeans off, is
what Steven's writing down right now, I can tell.

Speaker 2 (01:47:09):
Think about what he's sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, We need
like a booth to.

Speaker 1 (01:47:12):
Put him in where we can't see him.

Speaker 2 (01:47:13):
But also going back to the elsa lamp thing, she
took her clothes off too, right, that's the thing that
happens to manic people.

Speaker 1 (01:47:22):
Yeah, and you know, I think another thing people don't
understand is how fucking cold it gets in the I
know La is like warm all the time, but in
the mountains in La and especially in Malibu by the
ocean right next to the ocean.

Speaker 2 (01:47:33):
Really fucking cold. It's cold.

Speaker 1 (01:47:34):
So maybe she was having hypothermia, which is a thing
that they take their clothes off, But then why wouldn't
they have found the rest of them, you know, traced
her the trail she took and found the other stuff. Okay.
My Teresa's parents have maintained that their daughter should never
have been released on her own by the Sheriff's department.

(01:47:56):
They filed several lawsuits against the Los Angeles County Sheriff's
Department for releasing her from jail, even though they claimed
she was experiencing severe bipolar disorder at the time. In
twenty eleven, they won a civil lawsuit against the county. However,
two reports by the Office of Independent Review found the
LAPD not culpable from my Teresa's death, deeming it was

(01:48:20):
not it was not a homicide and there was no
foul play.

Speaker 2 (01:48:25):
Then why did they airlift the fucking body against the
corner's wishes?

Speaker 1 (01:48:28):
And the coroner couldn't say how she died? So how
can you definite, definitively say it was a homice it
was not a homicide?

Speaker 2 (01:48:34):
Yeah, because, yeah, you don't gave that report.

Speaker 1 (01:48:36):
Yeah, well you don't have the neck buns to test
to see if she was choked to death because you
fucking left them behind.

Speaker 2 (01:48:41):
Yeah, it's months later. Yeah, the body has been out
there for months. Yeah. Sorry, yeah, no, so I'm yelling
at you. You're the one that told me the story.

Speaker 1 (01:48:54):
And they also clear They were also cleared of any
wrongdoing in to how it handled the discovery of her remains,
so they were like, and also, it's fine, okay.

Speaker 2 (01:49:08):
Ron's great.

Speaker 1 (01:49:10):
Rhonda Hampton, who's the woman that Alexander Nazarian from the
Newsweek article it like kind of goes around with and
interviews her. She was a psychologist at one time in
an office where my Teresa had interned, so she's really
devoted to finding answers. She's just this really awesome woman.
She filed a dozen complaints about the various deputies involved

(01:49:31):
in my Teresa's case. Nine of these were registered with
the Internal Criminal Investigations Bureau. But they are treating them
as instead of instead of let's see, they're treating them
as service complaints, not matters of potential criminality, which is
like they're just belittling them, you know, or yeah, minimizing them.

(01:49:52):
On December thirty of twenty sixteen, which is recently results
of the criminal investigation into the handling of my Teresa's case,
concluded that there was insufficient evidence to support criminal prosecution
of anyone involved in the handling of the case, and
either way the statute of limitations for concealment or tampering
of evidence like the surveillance tapes had passed.

Speaker 2 (01:50:17):
Wow the end, I mean that sucks.

Speaker 1 (01:50:25):
Yeah, that's just straight up fittastic and I mean poc man.
So that was a theme of the day of sucktastic shit.

Speaker 2 (01:50:38):
It's almost well, it's like rich police departments getting caught
doing what they want and yeah, covering it.

Speaker 1 (01:50:49):
And not getting any kind of and not getting in
trouble for it.

Speaker 2 (01:50:56):
Yeah, that's the thing about opening the door to prosecuting
police then opens the door. I understand that, thinking that
it opens this door to like anybody. But yeah, it's
like it goes deeper and deeper and you know, but
still it has to get solved because there are such

(01:51:17):
It's like it's the most natural thing in the world,
the exploitation of power. It's like you give a man
a gun and say you have the legal right to
use this on whoever you want, you know, to your discretion.
Is so much power for one person to have a
man or woman or whoever they're just people.

Speaker 1 (01:51:37):
They're people like you and me that just are now
police like they're not. They're my neighbor, they're like any
old dude, they're your fucking ex boyfriend girlfriend, they're not.

Speaker 2 (01:51:48):
And they are also people who are being traumatized by
what they see in the streets every day or like.

Speaker 1 (01:51:54):
What's it called when you just stop caring about it?

Speaker 2 (01:51:58):
Apathy? Yeah, yeah, so but there's like real things going on.
Did you ever watch Southland? It was such a good show. No,
such a good show. My good friend Sean Hattisy was
one of the stars and he was the best. But
there was a character on it that used to take
a ton of pills because he had like an on

(01:52:18):
the job injury, but he didn't want he couldn't go
out on disability, so he was just in tons of
pain all the time and then just taking tons and
tons of like pain killers, and it just is like
it was just the most fascinating, Like it's there's a
why behind all of this and needs to get analyzed
and it needs to get fixed. And that's like part

(01:52:39):
of it is that where it's just like you're going
out there, you're in pain, you're you deal with the
worst society has to offer every single day as your job,
and you have.

Speaker 1 (01:52:48):
To make split second decisions on what's gonna happen to
who and why? Yeah, and you you have to stand
behind those or else you're gonna look weak and your
whole department's gonna look weak.

Speaker 2 (01:52:59):
Yeah, and you can't. Yeah, it's just it's it's it's rough.
I do have a good piece of news. If we could,
we could actually finish this on like an up tickle,
which is kind of interesting because again on the LAist,
I saw an article this morning that the LAPD is

(01:53:22):
revising their use of force policy with an eye toward
de escalation.

Speaker 1 (01:53:28):
Oh my god, I love that.

Speaker 2 (01:53:30):
Can you fucking believe that?

Speaker 1 (01:53:31):
Shit? That's that's the word that needs to be in place,
constantly escalation. You can do that, so it said.

Speaker 2 (01:53:40):
On Tuesday, the Los Angeles Police Commission approved a revised
And I'm trying to read this article and someone calling me,
who was it? I almost I almost picked it up.
I have to text somebody now. Now I have to
wait till they stop calling me so I can go
back to my thing. So who calls anybody? I mean, okay, okay,

(01:54:05):
we'll come back in here On Tuesday, the Los Angeles
please don't.

Speaker 1 (01:54:10):
Don't you dare that's real.

Speaker 2 (01:54:13):
I was bragging about getting calls. On Tuesday, the Los
Angeles Police Commission approved a revised use of force policy
that favors de escalation over use of deadly force. The
new policy requires officers to try and de escalate situations
using non lethal force whenever possible before firing their guns.
That's a huge step somewhere.

Speaker 1 (01:54:34):
It always blows my mind when, yeah, it always blows
my mind when someone a cop shoots to kill someone
when you could have just shot them in the shoulder
or in the knee or anywhere, you don't have to
shoot them in the head like on those feelis Boulevard
near where we live, Like not a few months ago,
some guy I don't know what he was doing, but

(01:54:54):
cops shot him right in the fucking head. Yeah, and
it's like if you thought he was he was burglarizing someone,
he definitely didn't have a weapon, just shoot him in
the fucking me, man.

Speaker 2 (01:55:05):
Yeah. There just needs to be more tools, yea more options.
I think it's it's becoming such a like all or nothing. Yeah,
I mean, who knows, I don't know I'm just saying
from what I read and these reports and the fact
that you know these videos that go up where it's
like the cop that just there was a jay walker.
Did you see that? No, it's just another one. It's

(01:55:28):
a video that during all the other horrible things that
are happening, people are going, can we please retweet this
and make this a story too, because it's a guy
that's jaywalking. The cop comes and just fucking cole cox
him and gets him on the ground and just starts
beating the ship.

Speaker 1 (01:55:41):
Sha jaywalking.

Speaker 2 (01:55:42):
It's that stuff where it's just like that stuff has
to stop.

Speaker 1 (01:55:47):
And that's that one guy who was a fucking piece
of shit. You know, it's not like that. Unfortunately, he
represents the entirety of his you know, the tired of
his But it's probably this fuckinghole and maybe his partner's like, Jesus,
I've been warning them that this guy's insane or whatever.

Speaker 2 (01:56:04):
I mean, Yeah, it's just it's awful. I know. Okay,
we're back. Do you have updates on this story.

Speaker 1 (01:56:14):
Joe, which I do so. I mean I've just followed
this one. I always every couple months, I'll look it
up on Reddit to see if there's anything new going on.
In twenty nineteen, facing pressure from doctor Ronda Hampton and
the family, then La County Sheriff Alex Villanueva ordered a
new review of my Teresa's case. Villanueva told ABC Eyewitness
News that the case was reviewed from top to bottom

(01:56:36):
by a team of LASD detectives. Their findings were that
the death remains unresolved, so those aren't really findings without
new information. They still don't know the actual cause of death.
They have since added a department wide policy that ensures
orestes are told they can voluntarily remain at the jail
and till morning hours. I just think of her being

(01:56:59):
really least in such a state, in such a place
with no resources, and that just breaks my fucking heart.

Speaker 2 (01:57:06):
It's horrible. It's just like you're left to yourself.

Speaker 1 (01:57:09):
Yeah. My Teresa's mother, Latist Richardson, wrote a book called
My Rice, A Mother's Journey From Despair to Desire, about
my terries and her own struggles with mental health. She
says this was cathartic. My Teresa's father, Michael Richardson, told
ABC people say, hey, you got to move on. You
never move on, but you carry On. There's no statute

(01:57:29):
of limitations on murder, and all of those who loved
my Teres Richardson hope someone will come forward to finally
solve the mystery of her death. And her family settled
a wrongful death lawsuit against the County of Los Angeles
and the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department in September twenty eleven.
As part of the settlement, the county and the LASD
denied any wrongdoing or liability. There's still twenty five thousand

(01:57:54):
dollars in reward money for information on my Teresa's case
being offered by the cities of Malibu and Calabasas. Any
tips can be submitted through LA crimestoppers dot org. And
our friends over at Pushkin produced a really incredible podcast
called Lost Hills, a podcast that investigates the dark side
of Malibu, which you wouldn't think there is any, but turns.

Speaker 2 (01:58:17):
Out, of course there is a lot.

Speaker 1 (01:58:19):
Yeah. Season four covers my Teres Richardson and is hosted
by journalists Dana Goodyear. So I highly recommend Lost Hills.

Speaker 2 (01:58:26):
Yeah, that's a great podcast. Okay, so we're going to
wrap this episode up. So here's the wrap up originally,
here you.

Speaker 1 (01:58:33):
Go, can I I'll tell you a thing that's funny.
So Vince sent me this article today that this this
why this ex wife of her her husband's dying of cancer.
It's not funny. And he's like a couple of days

(01:58:55):
away from dying. He's kind of out of it, and
she wanted him to die with a be thought in
his head. So she told him that Trump had been impeached.
I almost started crying.

Speaker 2 (01:59:05):
When I heard that, because it's not sweet. And he
believed it and he was like, Okay, I'm so glad
to hear that.

Speaker 3 (01:59:12):
And then he died.

Speaker 2 (01:59:15):
Can you really?

Speaker 1 (01:59:17):
It's so touching, but it's also so awful.

Speaker 2 (01:59:20):
It's it's where we're at, hey, man, it is where
we're at making the best of it by talking about murder.

Speaker 1 (01:59:27):
We're doing it. Happy birthday, Stephen, Happy birthday, Stephen.

Speaker 2 (01:59:32):
Please do something about police corruption as soon as you
can in your thirties, Steven, did you please? You have
one job?

Speaker 1 (01:59:40):
Stop police corruption?

Speaker 2 (01:59:42):
Please? Can we please?

Speaker 1 (01:59:47):
Okay, we're back.

Speaker 2 (01:59:48):
So this episode was originally titled, as we discussed, pre
milked Cereal.

Speaker 1 (01:59:52):
If we were naming it today, would we call it
Happy Birthday? Stephen. Probably not.

Speaker 2 (01:59:57):
I mean not today, not today, Steven, not today's money,
but not with my kids, not in my backyard.

Speaker 1 (02:00:04):
But maybe we would call it the.

Speaker 2 (02:00:05):
Tiniest Wishbone, which was me referencing Passover Satyr with Guy
Branham and breaking a little wishbone.

Speaker 1 (02:00:14):
Where do you think the Matt guy is now who
lost to you? I think he's okay. You think he's
still suffering.

Speaker 2 (02:00:20):
I think it's Matt Boehmer, star of Stage and screens.

Speaker 1 (02:00:23):
You think he saw the success of this podcast just
blow up and he's like, oh man, my podcast would
have been if I had gotten the Tiniest wishbone.

Speaker 2 (02:00:31):
He's like, she wished for a podcast and it came true,
so did I.

Speaker 1 (02:00:35):
Or we could call it You'll always get by kid,
which I said, that's right. Trying to think about what
Jim would have said, what home Jim would have said
back in the day to a little Karen.

Speaker 2 (02:00:44):
What he said back in the day was don't solve
food with salt, food before you eat it. It's so
my dad to be like, yeah, I'm seven. He's screaming,
never seven years old, and he's like, you know, the
CEO do this and that or like never turn your
back on the sea. Where it's just like, I.

Speaker 1 (02:01:01):
Gotta have a lot of lessons to teach you, but
I'm gonna teach them all at seven so you'll remember them.

Speaker 2 (02:01:05):
So you'll just remember how to behave when you're at
those big business dinners.

Speaker 1 (02:01:10):
And now do you assault your food out of just
fucking spite?

Speaker 2 (02:01:13):
Think of it every fucking time, because sometimes you know,
when you get scramblegs, you're like, I know for a
fact these need salt.

Speaker 1 (02:01:19):
No, they need salty scramble they make them and maybe
French fries or like you're.

Speaker 2 (02:01:23):
Safe with it. But if it's gonna be people, it's
almost like my dad was saying, hey, there's ways people
can judge you which you would never get right, And
that's what it's like, Oh no, I'm that person, Oh
just for assaulting my food.

Speaker 1 (02:01:37):
Where it's like that's not a great lesson.

Speaker 2 (02:01:40):
There's also I have a PO box and it's very exciting.

Speaker 1 (02:01:45):
That's because you said you don't have a safety deposit
box and I didn't either, but you do have a
po po box yeah, which feels pretty fucking fancy.

Speaker 2 (02:01:55):
I mean it always has.

Speaker 1 (02:01:57):
All right, Well, thanks for listening to this episode of
Red We're gonna let us in twenty seventeen, and Elvis
say goodbye, who better? Thanks for listening, you guys. You're
fucking gorgeous people with beautiful souls and hearts.

Speaker 2 (02:02:14):
Thank you so much, and stay sexy.

Speaker 1 (02:02:16):
And don't get murdered.

Speaker 2 (02:02:19):
Bye bye.

Speaker 1 (02:02:20):
Oh Elvis, Elvis, do you cut this part where we're
just talking and he doesn't come sometimes? Elvis, you want
to cook key? Oh, come on, Elvis, you want to
cook key. Oh he's just a dick about it now,
he won't. He waited till he got to the mic.

(02:02:40):
Elvis want to cook He?

Speaker 2 (02:02:43):
Yeah, all right, there it is. Cookie.

Speaker 1 (02:02:47):
Good boy. Me Me go to sleep, Stay sleeping

All Episodes

Rewind with Karen & Georgia - 65: Pre-Milked Cereal

Episode Transcript

Hosts And Creators

Georgia Hardstark

Karen Kilgariff

Popular Podcasts

On Purpose with Jay Shetty

Stuff You Should Know

Dateline NBC

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Rewind with Karen & Georgia - 65: Pre-Milked Cereal